# Star Wars Episode IX - The Rise of Skywalker - news and gossip



## T & P (Jul 28, 2018)

We do not have a specific thread yet, and this morning's announcement seems perfectly suited to to start one

*Billy Dee Williams (Lando), and the late Carrie Fisher surprise cast announcements for Ep. IX*

Star Wars Episode IX cast announced

Very pleased to see Lando finally feature in the sequel trilogy. And will lap up every yet-unseen footage of Carrie Fisher they are going to use


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## Santino (Jul 28, 2018)

Fucking Richard fucking E fucking Grant fuck.


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## donkyboy (Jul 28, 2018)

watching the last jedi, showed me what a terrible actress fisher was. no screen charisma.


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## TruXta (Jul 28, 2018)

donkyboy said:


> watching the last jedi, showed me what a terrible actress fisher was. no screen charisma.


Just shut up and go away.


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## donkyboy (Jul 28, 2018)

dont get butt hurt


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## TruXta (Jul 28, 2018)

donkyboy said:


> dont get butt hurt


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## SpookyFrank (Jul 28, 2018)

Way to spoilerise the movie JJ, you twat.


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## Nanker Phelge (Jul 28, 2018)

Carrie Fisher can't escape playing Leia even when she's dead and buried...


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## T & P (Jul 28, 2018)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Carrie Fisher can't escape playing Leia even when she's dead and buried...



It is her destiny...


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## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2018)

Santino said:


> Fucking Richard fucking E fucking Grant fuck.


oh thats why he was on some cooking thing the other week then, pimping that. Me walking through to elsewhere
'oh thats richard e grant. I read his bio'
ma: 'He's a bit of a twat isn't he'
'Yeah its not an act though, he really is that posh'

He'll probably be an imperial of some sort


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## Santino (Jul 28, 2018)

DotCommunist said:


> oh thats why he was on some cooking thing the other week then, pimping that. Me walking through to elsewhere
> 'oh thats richard e grant. I read his bio'
> ma: 'He's a bit of a twat isn't he'
> 'Yeah its not an act though, he really is that posh'
> ...


Ideally one of those blink-and-you'll-miss-it roles that British jobbing actors get.


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## T & P (Jul 28, 2018)

Santino said:


> Ideally one of those blink-and-you'll-miss-it roles that British jobbing actors get.


And under heavy make-up or inside a rubber suit so we don't even recognise him. He'd porbably would make a good Tusken Raider.


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## Fez909 (Jul 28, 2018)

SpookyFrank said:


> spoilerise


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## krtek a houby (Jul 29, 2018)

Santino said:


> Ideally one of those blink-and-you'll-miss-it roles that British jobbing actors get.



Aye. Game of Thrones effort, at the worst.

I seem to remember that there was a lot of stories saying that Carrie Fisher would not appear in Ep IX

Carrie Fisher Won’t Appear in ‘Star Wars: Episode IX,’ Lucasfilm Says – Rolling Stone

Oh well. I expect it will be flashbacks or a force ghost kind of thing.


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## krtek a houby (Feb 28, 2019)

Bump and deep sigh

Star Wars 9 Is Already Getting Review Bombed On Rotten Tomatoes


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## SpookyFrank (Mar 1, 2019)

krtek a houby said:


> Bump and deep sigh
> 
> Star Wars 9 Is Already Getting Review Bombed On Rotten Tomatoes



I thought RT had banned all pre-release user reviews since all the MRA dickheads started trashing Captain Marvel.


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## Santino (Apr 12, 2019)

New trailer out.


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## Lazy Llama (Apr 12, 2019)

Edited for the new title.


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## Steel Icarus (Apr 12, 2019)

Santino said:


> New trailer out.


Linky link


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## Santino (Apr 12, 2019)

S☼I said:


> Linky link


Phoney phone


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## Santino (Apr 12, 2019)

It's... not a great title.


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## Steel Icarus (Apr 12, 2019)

Depends on what it means I guess

Have seen trailer. Goosebumps.


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## Lazy Llama (Apr 12, 2019)




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## Steel Icarus (Apr 12, 2019)

I don't even care about plot holes or shitty story or bad acting. Nothing makes me feel like a wide-eyed kid more than Starsy.


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## T & P (Apr 12, 2019)

Seeing Lando back in the MF’s cockpit very nearly brought a tear to my eye, all while watching the trailer on a bus


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## ferrelhadley (Apr 12, 2019)

Rogue One was the only decent film since Return of the Jedi. Others can pay money to watch a dead horse get flogged.


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## Nanker Phelge (Apr 12, 2019)

...and I will


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## moochedit (Apr 12, 2019)

Santino said:


> It's... not a great title.





S☼I said:


> Depends on what it means I guess



So are they suggesting she is a skywalker after all?


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## moochedit (Apr 12, 2019)

moochedit said:


> So are they suggesting she is a skywalker after all?



Actually guess the title could refer to the rise of emo vader!


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## T & P (Apr 12, 2019)

ferrelhadley said:


> Rogue One was the only decent film since Return of the Jedi. Others can pay money to watch a dead horse get flogged.


I’d go as far as claiming it was in fact the best SW film since The Empire Strikes Back, and it sits 3rd on my ‘best SW films’ list. Vastly superior to Eps VII and VIII anyway, and the prequel trilogy of course.

But I welcomed eps VII and VIII flawed as they were, and I look forward to this one even though i’m not expecting much of it.

As the comic shop character from The Simpsons said in an old episode parodying the release of The Phantom Menace, “Worst  Cosmic Wars Ever. I will only see it three more times. Today.”


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## souljacker (Apr 12, 2019)

Sounds like Ming the merciless laughing at the end.


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## Lazy Llama (Apr 12, 2019)

They had Ian McDiarmid appear alone on stage at Celebration after the trailer played. 

He just said “Roll it again” in the Emperor’s voice. 

Wish I could have been there. Awesome.


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## Steel Icarus (Apr 12, 2019)

Lazy Llama said:


> They had Ian McDiarmid appear alone on stage at Celebration after the trailer played.
> 
> He just said “Roll it again” in the Emperor’s voice.
> 
> Wish I could have been there. Awesome.


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## T & P (Apr 12, 2019)

Lazy Llama said:


> They had Ian McDiarmid appear alone on stage at Celebration after the trailer played.
> 
> He just said “Roll it again” in the Emperor’s voice.
> 
> Wish I could have been there. Awesome.


Even though it has never been shown in the films, I don't think there is anything in the canon that dictates Sith lords can't manifest as ghosts like Jedi do, is there? If the Dark Side as powerful as the Light Side in every sense there's no reason why we can't have Dar Side force ghosts as well.


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## Lazy Llama (Apr 12, 2019)

And that McDiarmid bit again because...


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## donkyboy (Apr 12, 2019)

what a shit trailer and looks crap. the joker laugh at the end was comical-and before anyone jumps in-yes I know he voiced the joker.


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## Lazy Llama (Apr 12, 2019)

donkyboy said:


> what a shit trailer and looks crap. the joker laugh at the end was comical-and before anyone jumps in-yes I know he voiced the joker.


The laugh at the end was obviously Ian McDiarmid.
Mark Hamill voiced the Joker.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 12, 2019)

donkyboy said:


> what a shit trailer and looks crap. the joker laugh at the end was comical-and before anyone jumps in-yes I know he voiced the joker.


It’s probably best you stop talking now.


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## donkyboy (Apr 12, 2019)

Lazy Llama said:


> The laugh at the end was obviously Ian McDiarmid.



no it wasn't


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## Santino (Apr 12, 2019)

donkyboy said:


> no it wasn't


Counterpoint: Yes it was


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## T & P (Apr 12, 2019)

Or Snoke somehow coming back even in spiritual form only? Waste of a chief boss-villain otherwise.


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## Balbi (Apr 13, 2019)

Palpatine back?


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## ferrelhadley (Apr 13, 2019)

Am I the only person who heard this and thought of Vincent Price in Thriller?


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## krtek a houby (Apr 15, 2019)

donkyboy said:


> what a shit trailer and looks crap. the joker laugh at the end was comical-and before anyone jumps in-yes I know he voiced the joker.



The virtue signalling is strong with this one.


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## The Octagon (Apr 15, 2019)

Unconvinced from that trailer, seems to lean heavily on nostalgia and fanservice, which is how JJ Abrams made _The Force Awakens_ 'safe', and profitable, but uninteresting.

I'm still annoyed that no-one assumed overall control of the trilogy (in a Kevin-Fiege way) and created a coherent structure / arc throughout, instead they handed it to (at the time) 3 different directors and didn't seem to encourage connections and collaboration across the 3 films.

Missed opportunity IMO, but I'll still go see this one too, hope they give it a decent finish.


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## Nanker Phelge (Apr 16, 2019)

Why is Kylo Ren having his Helmet fixed? Surely getting a new one made would be better.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Apr 16, 2019)

it's so he can remember his failure!

also it looks cool


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## DotCommunist (Apr 16, 2019)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Why is Kylo Ren having his Helmet fixed? Surely getting a new one made would be better.



maybe its the old vader helmet he kept and wanked over. I need to rewatch the trailer now


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## Nanker Phelge (Apr 16, 2019)

Helmet wanker


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## kabbes (Apr 16, 2019)

Shame what was a promising story got so utterly fucked by Rian Johnson but fingers crossed for the finale.


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## Nanker Phelge (Apr 16, 2019)

I think some responsibility needs to land at the feet of Kathleen Kennedy....


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## Nanker Phelge (Apr 16, 2019)

This could probably do with its own thread...not sure how long it will stay up on youtube....


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## AverageJoe (Apr 16, 2019)

I'm probably more excited about The Mandalorian as I am about the last Star Wars.

Boba Fett was always my favourite growing up the the first (second) three.


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## krtek a houby (Apr 18, 2019)

If this is half as good as the magnificent Last Jedi, I'll be well pleased.


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## krtek a houby (Aug 24, 2019)

AverageJoe said:


> I'm probably more excited about The Mandalorian as I am about the last Star Wars.
> 
> Boba Fett was always my favourite growing up the the first (second) three.



Is the Mandalorian actually Boba Fett? Not sure but hell's teeth, this looks good


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## Epona (Aug 24, 2019)

krtek a houby said:


> Is the Mandalorian actually Boba Fett? Not sure but hell's teeth, this looks good




No he isn't Boba Fett.


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## AverageJoe (Aug 24, 2019)

No. Boba Fett is a Mandalorian. That's his race. Mandalorians are bounty hunters. 

This is a different bounty hunter, but is also a Mandalorian.


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## krtek a houby (Aug 24, 2019)

I saw my first Mandalorian in the Holiday Special. That was Boba. I thought that you thought Boba was in this. That's why I was being nice by asking a question I knew the answer to.


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## Indeliblelink (Aug 24, 2019)

Werner Herzog & IG88, quite the combo.


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## T & P (Aug 24, 2019)

krtek a houby said:


> Is the Mandalorian actually Boba Fett? Not sure but hell's teeth, this looks good



I’m glad to see that Dillon wasn’t actually killed by the Predator, but captured and taken to a galaxy far, far away


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## Indeliblelink (Aug 24, 2019)

Disney makes big announcements for Star Wars and Spider-Man fans - CBBC Newsround


> Ewan McGregor is returning to the Star Wars universe and will resume his role as Obi-Wan Kenobi in a new series for Disney plus.
> 
> McGregor, who played Kenobi in three Star Wars prequels from 1999 to 2005, appeared at the end of day one of Disney's expo to reveal the news to fans.
> 
> The scripts are being worked on and filming starts next year, according to Lucasfilm boss Kathleen Kennedy.


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## ruffneck23 (Aug 26, 2019)




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## Steel Icarus (Aug 27, 2019)

Don't care about plot, acting, none of it. It's Star Wars. The trailer gave me goosebumps and I'm going to see it the first night I can.


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## Lazy Llama (Oct 22, 2019)

Final trailer


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## kabbes (Oct 22, 2019)

Well that was oddly uninspiring

Still, the last one had a great trailer but an awful plot so fingers crossed this one goes the other way.


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## T & P (Oct 22, 2019)

It's quite funny they're banging on about the end of a saga when they're already busy writing a new trilogy....


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## souljacker (Oct 22, 2019)

T & P said:


> It's quite funny they're banging on about the end of a saga when they're already busy writing a new trilogy....



Yep. The saga will end but the story lives on forever, in the shops, theme parks, spin offs, computer games and new trilogy.


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## Marty1 (Oct 22, 2019)

krtek a houby said:


> Is the Mandalorian actually Boba Fett? Not sure but hell's teeth, this looks good




Boba Fett is an absolute bad-ass.


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## ruffneck23 (Oct 22, 2019)

ok so this image of the throne room has got me quite excited ( it's from the trailer...)


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## seventh bullet (Oct 22, 2019)

Fluffy horse creatures.


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## Lazy Llama (Oct 22, 2019)

seventh bullet said:


> Fluffy horse creatures.


With tusks!


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## Detroit City (Oct 22, 2019)

cenobyte said:


> mediocre, it looks


there hasn't been a decent installment since episode 4 and 5...all the rest are shit


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## T & P (Oct 22, 2019)

Detroit City said:


> there hasn't been a decent installment since episode 4 and 5...all the rest are shit


Rogue One is pretty good though, far better than everything else that’s come out since the original trilogy,  and the only one that is a true testament to them. I would in fact put it above Return of the Jedi on my list.

It cleverly solved the major plot hole from A New Hope, linked its ending with the beginning of ANH as seamlessly as any prequel has ever managed, and gifted us with the single most satisfying and mind blowing scene in the entire SW franchise- worth the admission price alone.

It also absolutely nailed down the look and feel of the original trilogy, and got the degree of CGI just right. The Scarif space battle was visually stunning and far more realistic and pleasing than all the new films managed- not to mention the soul-destroying prequel trilogy.


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## Santino (Oct 22, 2019)

Got my tickets.


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## Rosemary Jest (Oct 23, 2019)

I quite liked the prequels in all honesty, thought they were better than the new films at least.


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## ruffneck23 (Oct 23, 2019)

booking my ticket for 8.15am on the 19th ( although i said i wouldnt be going to the first day release after the last one  )


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## Virtual Blue (Oct 23, 2019)

booked tickets for me and the boy for 27/12 (not that much of a fan to watch on release date).

If it's like the previous installment, it's gonna be shite.


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## PursuedByBears (Oct 23, 2019)

I'm honestly not sure if I can be bothered to see this one.


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## Virtual Blue (Oct 23, 2019)

PursuedByBears said:


> I'm honestly not sure if I can be bothered to see this one.



i have a feeling that i bought the ticket because of the hype and not content.

i thought i saw the light when i decided not to watch Solo 

This is a Disney bastardisation ffs.


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## emanymton (Oct 23, 2019)

Rosemary Jest said:


> I quite liked the prequels in all honesty, thought they were better than the new films at least.


One thing about the sequel trilogy is  I appreciate the prequals a lot more now.

I have a not exactly original goldilocks theory about Star Wars.

Prequal trilogy - Too much Lucas
Sequel trilogy - Not enough Lucas
Original trilogy - Just enough Lucas


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## souljacker (Oct 23, 2019)

Virtual Blue said:


> i thought i saw the light when i decided not to watch Solo



Lots of bad in that film but it's watchable for Childish Gambino as Lando IMO.


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## T & P (Oct 23, 2019)

It’s kind of the world’s biggest open secret by now, but II’ll slap spoiler tags on anyway. For those interested in discussing the identity of the villain heard in the trailer (possible further spoilers based on speculation possible, obviously):



Spoiler



So how the fuck will they explain Palpatin’s presence? is he a (Dark side of the) Force ghost? Or did his spirit/ conscience get preserved in the Death Star’s reactor module?


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## T & P (Oct 24, 2019)

emanymton said:


> One thing about the sequel trilogy is  I appreciate the prequals a lot more now.
> 
> I have a not exactly original goldilocks theory about Star Wars.
> 
> ...



Good theory indeed.

The one positive about not enough Lucas in the sequel trilogy is that given what certain planet one of the locations in this last film is likely to be, hopefully there will be no fucking 



Spoiler



Ewoks


 to be seen. Because if they are, I'm fucking walking out of the cinema


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## Virtual Blue (Oct 24, 2019)

T & P said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> So how the fuck will they explain Palpatin’s presence? is he a (Dark side of the) Force ghost? Or did his spirit/ conscience get preserved in the Death Star’s reactor module?





Spoiler



most likely a possession, in an Evil Dead kinda way


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## emanymton (Oct 24, 2019)

T & P said:


> Good theory indeed.
> 
> The one positive about not enough Lucas in the sequel trilogy is that given what certain planet one of the locations in this last film is likely to be, hopefully there will be no fucking
> 
> ...


I've never had a probelem with Ewoks myself. But understand why some people do.


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## Steel Icarus (Oct 24, 2019)

I always liked the little shaman Ewok


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## N_igma (Oct 24, 2019)

Got tickets for 19th. I thought I seen somewhere that they’re still filming this? If this turns out to be edited to bits I’ll be seriously pissed off. Trying to shoe horn Carrie Fisher in there using footage from The Force Awakens screams of ‘bad idea’ in my opinion. 

I have a bad feeling we may have peaked with the first film of this trilogy.


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## T & P (Oct 24, 2019)

emanymton said:


> I've never had a probelem with Ewoks myself. But understand why some people do.


Even though they were soppy and annoying, I could have put up with their presence in ROTJ if it’d been limited to light/ comic relief, and even to have played a minor part in the Rebel team’s success in bringing down the shield. Their stealing of the speeder bikes to draw the stormtroopers away from the gate was a perfectly acceptable role.

But a bunch of teddy bears armed with nothing more than sticks and stones defeating in a battle a heavily armed elite Stormtrooper garrison (not just standard Stormtroopers but elite, as per the Emperor’s words) was just beyond preposterous even for a Star Wars film. Suspension of disbelief only stretches that much, and it ruined the second half of that film and brought down my overall rating of it. Just think how much better the film would have been without them in it, or at least a far shorter and more limited role.

if I were a Stormtrooper I would ask to serve in a t shirt and shorts, given that the armour they’re provided with is not only useless against any blaster fire, but doesn’t even protect against three-foot furry creatures throwing pointy sticks at you


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## emanymton (Oct 24, 2019)

T & P said:


> Even though they were soppy and annoying, I could have put up with their presence in ROTJ if it’d been limited to light/ comic relief, and even to have played a minor part in the Rebel team’s success in bringing down the shield. Their stealing of the speeder bikes to draw the stormtroopers away from the gate was a perfectly acceptable role.
> 
> But a bunch of teddy bears armed with nothing more than sticks and stones defeating in a battle a heavily armed elite Stormtrooper garrison (not just standard Stormtroopers but elite, as per the Emperor’s words) was just beyond preposterous even for a Star Wars film. Suspension of disbelief only stretches that much, and it ruined the second half of that film and brought down my overall rating of it. Just think how much better the film would have been without them in it, or at least a far shorter and more limited role.
> 
> if I were a Stormtrooper I would ask to serve in a t shirt and shorts, given that the armour they’re provided with is not only useless against any blaster fire, but doesn’t even protect against three-foot furry creatures throwing pointy sticks at you


But the Ewoks do basically loose the battle.


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## krtek a houby (Oct 30, 2019)

More Mandalorian


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## ruffneck23 (Nov 25, 2019)

Spoiler








First clip


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## InfoBurner (Nov 25, 2019)

Hmm, the kinda dialogue I'm used to, watching endless PJ Masks or Blaze And The Monster Machines.


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## T & P (Nov 25, 2019)

I suspect that phrase will become a meme before long.


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## Santino (Nov 25, 2019)

I genuinely love how useless those bikes would be in most battle situations and simultaneously what great toys they'll make.


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## tommers (Nov 25, 2019)

ruffneck23 said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh god. That looks awful.


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## ruffneck23 (Nov 25, 2019)

tommers said:


> Oh god. That looks awful.


we got to remember we are not 8 , and the film isnt for us , saying that with gritted teeth as im a long time fan


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## Marty1 (Nov 25, 2019)

ruffneck23 said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Looks superb - can’t wait to see it.


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## SpookyFrank (Nov 25, 2019)

Santino said:


> I genuinely love how useless those bikes would be in most battle situations and simultaneously what great toys they'll make.



If the stormtroopers have jetpacks (which can't be that staggering a technology in a world with FTL travel as standard) why do the bikes need to flip them up like that?


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## Marty1 (Nov 25, 2019)

SpookyFrank said:


> If the stormtroopers have jetpacks (which can't be that staggering a technology in a world with FTL travel as standard) why do the bikes need to flip them up like that?





To look cool you fool!


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## T & P (Nov 25, 2019)

Santino said:


> I genuinely love how useless those bikes would be in most battle situations and simultaneously what great toys they'll make.


Sometimes at night if I’m recalling Star Wars films while trying to fall asleep I think of various plots holes that, when you think about it, are pretty bad. An obvious one was the scene in Return of the Jedi when the rebels are trying to overpower the stormtrooper guards outside the bunker, and two jump on the speeder bikes ‘to get help’, so Luke and Leia have to go after them to stop them from raising the alarm.

What, amazing levitating technology but couldn’t fit a radio on the bike (or their personal kit for that matter) so troopers don’t have to physically travel for miles to speak with their garrison in person?


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## SpookyFrank (Nov 25, 2019)

T & P said:


> Sometimes at night if I’m recalling Star Wars films while trying to fall asleep I realise of plots holes that, when you think about it, are pretty bad. An obvious one was the scene in Return of the Jedi when the rebels are trying to overpower the stormtrooper guards outside the bunker, and two jump on the speeder bikes ‘to get help’, so Luke and Leia have to go after them to stop them from raising the alarm.
> 
> What, amazing levitating technology but couldn’t fit a radio on the bike (or their personal kit for that matter) so troopers don’t have to physically travel for miles to speak with their garrison in person?



There is a line of dialogue about 'jamming their comms' or some such. Given that our heroes are also using Imperial bikes, it follows that these must be equipped with the facility to jam the radios of other Imperial personnel, for whatever reason that would be a thing.


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## T & P (Nov 26, 2019)

Not sure if this is official or fan art, but I'm loving this poster...


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## Badgers (Nov 26, 2019)

T & P said:


> Not sure if this is official or fan art, but I'm loving this poster...


That. Is. Epic.


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## Orang Utan (Nov 26, 2019)

Saw a trailer at the cinema last week. There was a smattering of cheers when the words 'the saga will end' came up on the screen.


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## emanymton (Nov 26, 2019)

T & P said:


> Not sure if this is official or fan art, but I'm loving this poster...


Just me?


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## tommers (Nov 26, 2019)

Orang Utan said:


> Saw a trailer at the cinema last week. There was a smattering of cheers when the words 'the saga will end' came up on the screen.


Somebody told me the other day that they've already confirmed there will be another trilogy of trilogies.  Sorry.


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## Reno (Nov 26, 2019)

tommers said:


> Somebody told me the other day that they've already confirmed there will be another trilogy of trilogies.  Sorry.


Rian Johnson has been commissioned to work on a new trilogy, which isn’t connected to the movies in this series in terms of characters or timeline. The failure of Solo rattled them and it was thought the market may be oversaturated with Star Wars films and TV series. Several Star Wars related projects including a planned trilogy by the GoT guys got cancelled. The Rian Johnson one hasn’t been cancelled so far but it also isn’t anywhere near of going into production.


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## emanymton (Nov 28, 2019)

Reno said:


> Rian Johnson has been commissioned to work on a new trilogy, which isn’t connected to the movies in this series in terms of characters or timeline. The failure of Solo rattled them and it was thought the market may be oversaturated with Star Wars films and TV series. Several Star Wars related projects including a planned trilogy by the GoT guys got cancelled. The Rian Johnson one hasn’t been cancelled so far but it also isn’t anywhere near of going into production.


I think the Johnson one is cancelled, they just don't want to look bad by making an announcement  about it. 

The Game of Thrones guys were meant to be doing a trilogy as well, but they looked to have jumped ship to Netflix.


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## Reno (Nov 28, 2019)

emanymton said:


> I think the Johnson one is cancelled, they just don't want to look bad by making an announcement  about it.
> 
> The Game of Thrones guys were meant to be doing a trilogy as well, but they looked to have jumped ship to Netflix.


That’s probably true. I don’t see why he still would want to make it, after the hate he got for The Last Jedi. He’s also just got a smaller, more personal film coming out called Knifes Out which already is a huge critical success, so it may be more rewarding to stick with that.


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## T & P (Dec 18, 2019)

First reviews are out. It sounds like most of us might have guessed the film would pan out to be... imperfect, a lot of fan service, unanswered questions, but ultimately fairly watchable and more enjoyable than The Last Jedi.


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## Cloo (Dec 18, 2019)

Booked tickets for Xmas eve - we're taking gsv's dad with us, as gsv told him 'You took me to the first one,  so I want to take you to the last one'


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## dervish (Dec 18, 2019)

I'm unexpectedly going to see this at 7:15 tonight. A friend at works wife's colleague won some tickets in a competition apparently. Supposedly it's for a special showing, the cinema it's showing in hasn't got it advertised and all we have is a print out with someone else's name on it. As it's well before the embargo I really don't know if we are in for a 9 hour triple bill before the main showing or we get special early access.


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## Reno (Dec 18, 2019)

T & P said:


> First reviews are out. It sounds like most of us might have guessed the film would pan out to be... imperfect, a lot of fan service, unanswered questions, but ultimately fairly watchable and more enjoyable than The Last Jedi.


It’s getting by far the worst reviews of the current trilogy, which is a shame. The Last Jedi was critically very well received, it just got toxic fandom up in arms.


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## 8ball (Dec 18, 2019)

T & P said:


> First reviews are out. It sounds like most of us might have guessed the film would pan out to be... imperfect, a lot of fan service, unanswered questions, but ultimately fairly watchable and more enjoyable than The Last Jedi.



Well, I enjoyed the Last Jedi, so I'll likely go along to this.


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## kabbes (Dec 18, 2019)

Reno said:


> It’s getting by far the worst reviews of the current trilogy, which is a shame. The Last Jedi was critically very well received, it just got toxic fandom up in arms.


I don’t know how or why Last Jedi was well received.  It made no sense in terms of character motivation, lacked any kind of consistency, was a hot mess of pointless subplots that went nowhere and had a third act that totally wrecked what the first two acts had tried to set up.  It’s by far and away the worst Star Wars film.  The prequels were awful but at least they tried to build something coherent.  Last Jedi was an incoherent vomiting out of whatever came to Johnson’s mind that day.  Which also took its toll on the tonal shifts too, it should be noted.

You don’t have to be a “toxic fan” to recognise the obvious failures of Last Jedi


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## T & P (Dec 18, 2019)

Reno said:


> It’s getting by far the worst reviews of the current trilogy, which is a shame. The Last Jedi was critically very well received, it just got toxic fandom up in arms.


I just don't know what to believe when it comes to critics's reviews, and far less so if it involves Star Wars films. I definitely didn't agree with some of the fan hatred towards TLJ, but whereas I rather enjoyed it during my initial viewing of it in glorious giant cinema screen definition, subsequent viewings at home have made it look worse and worse and evidenced some glaring, occasionally embarrasingly bad plot holes and fallacies I cannot gloss over or ignore. Quite how it still has such great aggregate rankings compared to other films in the franchise is a bit strange imo.

Anyways, even if the reviews were appalling I'd still go and see it at least once, of course.

I wish they'd given this film to Gareth Edwards instead of returning to JJ Abrams, the truth be told.


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## FridgeMagnet (Dec 18, 2019)

Reno said:


> It’s getting by far the worst reviews of the current trilogy, which is a shame. The Last Jedi was critically very well received, it just got toxic fandom up in arms.


The concerted campaign of awful people commenting about Star Wars has really made it impossible to make judgements about any of the films now, for me. If it's not horrible fanboys it's people reacting to horrible fanboys. About the only thing I can tell so far is that it is not good for Reylo shippers.


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## Reno (Dec 18, 2019)

Not going getting into an long discussion over this as I don’t care enough. As a Star Wars agnostic, The Last Jedi is the only Star Wars movie apart from Empire which I genuinely liked.


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## ruffneck23 (Dec 18, 2019)

I’ve heard of you liked the force awakens you’ll like this one , but if you liked the last Jedi you won’t like this one , but what does the internet know ? My boss won’t let me come in late so I can go in and see it at 7.30 am , however I’m really tired at the min so may go and have a kip then see if I can get into a midnight showing , then turn up at work tomorrow and fall asleep , that will learn him lol


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## emanymton (Dec 18, 2019)

Reno said:


> Not going getting into an long discussion over this as I don’t care enough. As a Star Wars agnostic, The Last Jedi is the only Star Wars movie apart from Empire which I genuinely liked.


TLJ being the most liked star wars film of non-fans and the least liked for many fans seems to be a bit of a thing. It is a shame that the handful of dickheads who hated it because it had an asian women in it rather than because she was a shit character make it hard to have any kind of decent discussion.


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## SpookyFrank (Dec 18, 2019)

emanymton said:


> TLJ being the most liked star wars film of non-fans and the least liked for many fans seems to be a bit of a thing. It is a shame that the handful of dickheads who hated it because it had an asian women in it rather than because she was a shit character make it hard to have any kind of decent discussion.



I'm a Star Wars fan and I like the Last Jedi because it felt like an actual attempt at storytelling not just a reaminated corpse of former glories like The Force Awakens and every other JJ Abrams movie.


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## kabbes (Dec 18, 2019)

It was a _bad_ attempt at storytelling though.


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## emanymton (Dec 18, 2019)

SpookyFrank said:


> I'm a Star Wars fan and I like the Last Jedi because it felt like an actual attempt at storytelling not just a reaminated corpse of former glories like The Force Awakens and every other JJ Abrams movie.


What Kabbes said.

And note I said many fans, not all.


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## SpookyFrank (Dec 18, 2019)

kabbes said:


> It was a _bad_ attempt at storytelling though.



Perhaps we can shake hands on 'flawed'.


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## kabbes (Dec 18, 2019)

SpookyFrank said:


> Perhaps we can shake hands on 'flawed'.


If by flawed you mean it fundamentally fails to establish any kind of character motivation, fails to allow any character to achieve anything meaningful, fails to establish any character growth and fails to even follow through on its own ideas then sure.


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## FridgeMagnet (Dec 18, 2019)

I've still not seen TLJ and I sort of need to because I'm going to see ROS over Christmas when I go to visit my family.

What gets me is that an awful lot of smart people spend an awful lot of time on analysis of these films, and get cross when they're inconsistent or could have obviously been a lot better, when the process for producing a script and plot absolutely makes them dumb and shows no signs of ever doing otherwise. I have no problem with critique that goes way beyond the actual film - it's great, in fact, to do, I dunno, a feminist critique of TFA, or one analysing references from the original three vs samurai films - but to _expect_ that one should be better and be bitterly disappointed when it isn't, nah.


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## T & P (Dec 18, 2019)

ruffneck23 said:


> I’ve heard of you liked the force awakens you’ll like this one , but if you liked the last Jedi you won’t like this one , but what does the internet know ? My boss won’t let me come in late so I can go in and see it at 7.30 am , however I’m really tired at the min so may go and have a kip then see if I can get into a midnight showing , then turn up at work tomorrow and fall asleep , that will learn him lol





emanymton said:


> TLJ being the most liked star wars film of non-fans and the least liked for many fans seems to be a bit of a thing. It is a shame that the handful of dickheads who hated it because it had an asian women in it rather than because she was a shit character make it hard to have any kind of decent discussion


 The internet has inadvertently enabled misogynists, racists and organised far-right communities to artificially distort public ratings, which sometimes makes platforms such as IMDB pretty unreliable, but if you can factor that in and ignore certain public-voted reviews, I like to speculate most Star Wars fans can be grouped like this:

- People old enough to have been around during the release of the original trilogy have the lowest estimation for the prequel trilogy, with most of them absolutely despising it. This group is also the most critical towards storyline inconsistencies or canon breaches in the latest trilogy and the prequel one.

- Second generation fans (born in the mid 80s to the late 90s) are a bit more receptive to the prequels whilst still dissing them on the whole. 

- Third gen fans born from late 90s onwards have much more favourable views towards the prequel trilogy while naturally being less impressed with the now dated visual effects of the original trilogy. Indeed they don’t hold the original trilogy in anywhere near the reverence we first gen fans do.

But then when it comes to the new trilogy everything breaks down. People seem to love one and dislike the other with no discernible pattern. I for instance keep thinking than most genuine first generation fans, and in particular those who name Empire Strikes Back as their favourite film, would be completely mad not to agree that Rogue One is brilliant and by some margin the best SW film since the original trilogy, but many of my firs gen friends disagree. And there’s zero consensus about episodes VII and VIII as well.


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## T & P (Dec 18, 2019)

kabbes said:


> It was a _bad_ attempt at storytelling though.


The Wacky Races-style slow chase was cringeworthy when you think about it...


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## kabbes (Dec 18, 2019)

TLJ should have finished at the point Kylo and Rey were potentially about to join forces.  It was a natural apex for a second film of a trilogy.  Everything that happened from that moment on was stupid and undid all the interesting work the film had put in.


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## krtek a houby (Dec 19, 2019)

I loved how Luke continued to grapple with his emotions and regrets, following on from ditching his training halfway through Empire. Of course I'll be there for the new release but I don't see how it can top TLJ.


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## Lord Camomile (Dec 19, 2019)

Some nice moments and promising ideas, though don't think they did the most interesting things with most of them. Ultimately it felt like it was still haunted by ghosts of the original trilogy, at times literally.

As always, now I know what to expect I'll watch it again and probably enjoy more for what it is rather than what I hoped it would be.


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (Dec 19, 2019)

I just wish they had actually planned a three film arc. A story doesn't mean anything if you are just making it up as you go along, it needs to be crafted as a whole. Didn't lost teach us that?
The last jedi took in way too many extra characters and pointless side adventures that distracted and bogged down from the main story. I think it could have been ok, but it's a bit of a bloated mess.


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## dervish (Dec 19, 2019)

So the tickets were legit, it was a bit of a weird experience, we had to sit through a badly edited vodafone sponsored video of some interviews and people standing awkwardly in front of a big star war sign, it was a bit pointless but I suppose it paid for it. 
The film itself feels incredibly disney, no one is in any real peril no big emotions, lots of bloodless action sequences. Didn't hate it but it didn't feel special, felt like all the big moments were a bit deja vu, they had all been done before in other films. Not sure I'll bother re-watching it and if I'd paid for the tickets or waited up until midnight to see it I would be a bit annoyed, but it was a decent waste of a couple of hours.


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## Riklet (Dec 19, 2019)

Saw it last night cos im in Portugal.

Not bad, not great. Entertaining rubbish. Glad I saw it. Thoroughly self-referential without much new to say. it's incredibly nicey safey... same as Star Wars always has been though so what were these Reddit creeps expecting.

Def not the best or the worst of the saga and some really good acting at points, imo.


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## T & P (Dec 19, 2019)

Just caught again the last half hour of Revenge of the Sith. Undoubtedly the least bad of the prequels, but still pretty cringeworthy at so many levels...


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## kabbes (Dec 19, 2019)

The prequels have Darth Maul fighting with Qui Gon and Obi Wan at the same time, which is a contender for the best 10-20 minutes in all of Star Wars.  So I forgive them a lot of their sins for that.

They also have an actual story that an actual writer was trying to tell, properly, over three films.  Yes, the story being told was actually a bit bobbins (trade embargoes!).  Yes, the execution was wooden (“I hate sand”).  Yes, it had some dire characters (Jar Jar).  But never did I feel that the storyteller was making it up as he went along and was willing to throw all the plot hooks in the bin just for the pure hell of it.


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## Steel Icarus (Dec 19, 2019)

T & P said:


> Just caught again the last half hour of Revenge of the Sith. Undoubtedly the least bad of the prequels, but still pretty cringeworthy at so many levels...


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## T & P (Dec 19, 2019)

kabbes said:


> The prequels have Darth Maul fighting with Qui Gon and Obi Wan at the same time, which is a contender for the best 10-20 minutes in all of Star Wars.  So I forgive them a lot of their sins for that.
> 
> They also have an actual story that an actual writer was trying to tell, properly, over three films.  Yes, the story being told was actually a bit bobbins (trade embargoes!).  Yes, the execution was wooden (“I hate sand”).  Yes, it had some dire characters (Jar Jar).  But never did I feel that the storyteller was making it up as he went along and was willing to throw all the plot hooks in the bin just for the pure hell of it.



Yes, on that I wholly agree with you. At least they tried to write something original. Compare that with The Force Awakens, which at times seems like a reboot of the original trilogy.


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## Nanker Phelge (Dec 19, 2019)

Stuck working in Northampton across the road from  the cinema. Just blagged a ticket for 7 quid. 8pm.

Here goes....


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## ruffneck23 (Dec 19, 2019)

saw it a few hours ago, been digesting.

I really enjoyed it, came out far happier than I did the last jedi, it's certainly not perfect, and a couple of leaps had to be done, but when it was good it was great, so I can forgive the bits that weren't quite right, I feel if JJ Abrams had done the whole trilogy , things would have jelled more, but all in all , as a fan who saw the first one aged 6 ( or 7 ) It was as good as I could have hoped after this long journey of ups and downs


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## Nanker Phelge (Dec 19, 2019)

I'm happy with that.

Bye bye Star Wars.


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## Lord Camomile (Dec 19, 2019)

One thing I forgot to mention last night (this morning  ), Last Jedi basically undermined most of the major plot threads of Force Awakens, and Rise seems to just then undermine and reverse all the decisions made in Last Jedi.

Makes for a bit of a "what was the point?" mess plot-wise, and plaus out more like a tug of war between two directors than a story. Which is a shame, as I like Rian Johnson's output generally, but certainly feels like they could have done with a figure at the helm of the saga ensuring the major plot beats, like the MCU.


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## N_igma (Dec 19, 2019)

It thought the film was very silly but there was enough feel good moments and action sequences that made it feel worthwhile.


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## Marty1 (Dec 20, 2019)

My brother has just been to see this and he says it’s virtually a remake of Return of the Jedi.

Wtf are Disney playing at?


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## 8ball (Dec 20, 2019)

Marty1 said:


> My brother has just been to see this and he says it’s virtually a remake of Return of the Jedi.
> 
> Wtf are Disney playing at?



Remakes are big, and guaranteed cashola.


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## ruffneck23 (Dec 21, 2019)

Going to watch it again this morning at 9am


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## Reno (Dec 21, 2019)

Marty1 said:


> My brother has just been to see this and he says it’s virtually a remake of Return of the Jedi.
> 
> Wtf are Disney playing at?


What they are playing at is that Star Wars fans want fan service, rather than something original or something which challenges them. I think The Last Jedi was that film. It departed from the formula by making its characters more complex, introducing shades of grey where they’ve previously been black and white and by introducing some unexpected plot turns. Rian Johnson‘s movie had a distinct personality which I think most other Star Wars movies lack. The film was well received with people who aren’t hardcore Star Wars fans but many of the fans hated it. 

After all the online hate for Jedi and after Solo flopped, Disney were shitting themselves. So now they did a course-correct and they went back to pure fan service, they undid a lot of what Johnson introduced, giving fans more of the same to keep this cash cow running.


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## ruffneck23 (Dec 21, 2019)

Well as a fan it worked for me


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## ruffneck23 (Dec 21, 2019)

Just as good the second time


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## Steel Icarus (Dec 21, 2019)

Off tomorrow afternoon to see it. Can't wait.


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## ruffneck23 (Dec 21, 2019)

S☼I said:


> Off tomorrow afternoon to see it. Can't wait.


Really hope you enjoy it


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## weltweit (Dec 21, 2019)

Saw it last night in a distinctly unpacked Vue cinema, sprog loved it.


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## kabbes (Dec 21, 2019)

There were no shades of grey in The Last Jedi.  For a bit, it appeared there were going to be.  Then he wimped out and went back to his “grey” characters being completely black and white.  Kylo Ren in particular was badly let down by the third act, becoming nothing more than a pantomime villain. That’s the major problem with the film — it doesn’t follow through on its own ideas.


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## krtek a houby (Dec 22, 2019)

Tickets booked for tomorrow!


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## emanymton (Dec 22, 2019)

Went to see it this morning.

Better than I expected. There are some huge issues but overall I thought it was OK.


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## Steel Icarus (Dec 22, 2019)

Just seen it. Fucking brilliant. Sometimes it's not the plot (with its terrible problems) or the bad acting (of which there was some) but how a film makes you _feel. _And I was excited, saddened, amused, etc. It felt like The End of something I've loved most of my life, since I was a little kid, while making me feel like a little kid again. I'm all sad and happy


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## blossie33 (Dec 23, 2019)

Went to see it this morning, 10am at Hackney Picture House, nice and cheap, on the very big screen, only about 20 of us and no noisy youngsters 

Very enjoyable, took me a while to reajust to normal life when I got outside


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## krtek a houby (Dec 24, 2019)

That was great. Not as daring as Johnson's vision but still cracking fun. 

And I had to wipe a bit of grit from the eye when 



Spoiler: major spoiler



Han appeared



Also, almost punched the air when 



Spoiler



Chewie finally got his medal. Yay!


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## krtek a houby (Dec 24, 2019)

Oh, ffs!

Disney cuts Star Wars same-sex kiss in Singapore


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## Steel Icarus (Dec 24, 2019)

What, that two second, in the background kiss?  Was hardly Beth and her mate in Brooky was it


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## emanymton (Dec 24, 2019)

krtek a houby said:


> Oh, ffs!
> 
> Disney cuts Star Wars same-sex kiss in Singapore


Which just shows how shallow their commitment to 'exclusivity' is. Almost as though it is really about marketing and making money rather than any kind principles.


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## Cloo (Dec 24, 2019)

It was ok. Kids found it too scary cos they were freaked out by undead Palpatine. I liked they didn't go for an obvious 'Yes, we will rebuild the Jedi' ending,  but a suggestion that there was a new future for The Force without either Jedi or Sith.

I agree that despite the big set pieces it didn't really do anything new with it.


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## tommers (Dec 24, 2019)

As much as I hate to be that person... you might want to spoiler that


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## DarthSydodyas (Dec 25, 2019)

One of the things that bothers me the most about these sequels is the music.  There are numerous themes across the prequels (incl. the originals) but this lot just rehash.  Nothing that memorable.

Story felt mishmashed, lack of any overall arch.  Perhaps they should have left the storytelling itself to Lucas.

Dissapointed.


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## blossie33 (Dec 25, 2019)

Enjoyed it - I'm just easy to please


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## Lord Camomile (Dec 25, 2019)

DarthSydodyas said:


> One of the things that bothers me the most about these sequels is the music.  There are numerous themes across the prequels (incl. the originals) but this lot just rehash.  Nothing that memorable.


A little thing, but I thought similar while watching.


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## krtek a houby (Dec 26, 2019)

emanymton said:


> Which just shows how shallow their commitment to 'exclusivity' is. Almost as though it is really about marketing and making money rather than any kind principles.



Hollywood, eh


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## mwgdrwg (Dec 29, 2019)

I hated it.



Spoiler



The constant fucking bland music.

In the first half of the film the dialogue is just the characters explaining the plot.

"Never underestimate a droid" was so telegraphed and fell so flat I nearly walked out.

Getting rid of Kellie Marie Tran, "Hey trolls, I'm staying here to look for Star Destroyers on a screeen", only to replace her with a new character. Fucking weak kowtowing to internet cunts.

Nobody knows how to get to the Sith planet...only the million or ten people piloting the Star Destroyers.

"Destroy a planet they all care for". Sorry I don't care about it, I've only just seen it mentioned once about 5 minutes ago.

"Rey, I've got something to tell you"....Fucking what?

Shut up threepio.


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## mwgdrwg (Dec 29, 2019)

This trilogy is worse than the prequel trilogy.


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## Epona (Dec 30, 2019)

I thought that it was visually stunning, but the plot was like a sieve and some stuff just seemed a bit far-fetched (compared to previous films in the franchise).

I am quite easily pleased however and didn't hate it, I just thought it could have been better.


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## tommers (Dec 30, 2019)

I had an epiphany about half way through that I was watching bad actors telling an unbelievable children's story.

I've seen every star wars film and that is the first time that's happened. 

I guess my disbelief stopped being suspended. Probably good it happened with only half of the last film to go.


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## Baronage-Phase (Dec 30, 2019)

Going to see this tonight...watched The Last Jedi yesterday and loved it. I don't know why I missed out on getting to see that....
(The Blaskets looked amazing.)

I've booked ticket for tonights show. Looks like so far I'll be on my own!!!


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## SpookyFrank (Dec 30, 2019)

Yep, happy with that. Didn't do anything special and the first act was a mess but all in all it was entertaining nonsense which is all I really wanted.

There weren't as many cheesy cameos and fan service moments as I expected, which was a good thing. The script was free of obvious bum notes and the absence of Carrie Fisher was probably dealt with as well as it could have been.


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## Baronage-Phase (Dec 30, 2019)

Lupa said:


> Going to see this tonight...watched The Last Jedi yesterday and loved it. I don't know why I missed out on getting to see that....
> (The Blaskets looked amazing.)
> 
> I've booked ticket for tonights show. Looks like so far I'll be on my own!!!




That was really enjoyable 
I loved it... 
Every second!!


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## SpookyFrank (Dec 31, 2019)

Could've sworn the woman in the red outfit with the silly helmet was Karen Gillan but apparently it was Keri Russell.


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## Lord Camomile (Dec 31, 2019)

SpookyFrank said:


> Could've sworn the woman in the red outfit with the silly helmet was Karen Gillan but apparently it was Keri Russell.


I thought so too!


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## T & P (Dec 31, 2019)

General slightly off topic question. Recently in one of the various SW threads here we were discussing the books in the SW universe, and one or several people recommended one particular title as the go-to novel for anyone wanting to start reading them.

It could have been around the time when the Rebellion first developed between episodes III & IV. In any case I don’t have much interest at all in the prequel trilogy period. So Rogue One onwards and up to Ep VI. What book would peeps here recommend I start with?


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## kabbes (Mar 31, 2020)

tommers said:


> I had an epiphany about half way through that I was watching bad actors telling an unbelievable children's story.
> 
> I've seen every star wars film and that is the first time that's happened.
> 
> I guess my disbelief stopped being suspended. Probably good it happened with only half of the last film to go.


Finally saw it today — first Star Wars film (okay, along with Solo) that I didn’t see in the cinema.  And this exactly summed up how I felt.

It was just a bad film all round, really.  Poor characters in a silly plot mostly comprising 30 second bursts of cool posturing or nostalgia.  It wasn’t even bad like Last Jedi was bad.  This one was downright _bland._


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## donkyboy (Mar 31, 2020)

what was the guy (forgotten his name) trying to tell rey but didn't get the chance?


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## fishfinger (Mar 31, 2020)

donkyboy said:


> what was the guy (forgotten his name) trying to tell rey but didn't get the chance?


His name is Finn, and he wanted to tell Rey that he was "force sensitive".


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## mwgdrwg (Apr 10, 2020)

Pity J.J. didn't think of putting it in the actual film.


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## donkyboy (Apr 11, 2020)

fishfinger said:


> His name is Finn, and he wanted to tell Rey that he was "force sensitive".




Meh. Sounds like Deus ex machina on part of the writers.


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## blossie33 (Apr 11, 2020)

I thought he just wanted to say he fancied her


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## kabbes (Apr 11, 2020)

This trilogy is one of the worst examples of storytelling by making it up as you go along that I can think of.  There’s no coherence and consequently it’s deeply unsatisfying.  Good storytelling involves laying the seeds of the ending in the early scenes.  In this, it’s all just a bunch of stuff that happens. It should involve character growth that comes about from a carefully constructed series of challenges with failure and learning from that failure.  In this, nobody really learns anything from their actions and character change is the clunky consequence of different directors simply wanting different things from their 2D characters.  Revelations should build towards a satisfying payoff.  In this, there are constant contradictory revelations that are unwound as soon as the next writer needs something different to have happened.  It’s a horrendous mess.

The prequels are objectively awful films but at least it’s the output of a storyteller with a story to tell.  I have a clear vision in my head of what that story was, the narrative beats and what it all led to. What am I going to remember from this sequel trilogy?  Honestly, nothing.


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## Marty1 (Apr 16, 2020)

Watched this the other day - great fun, would watch again and glad that it’s closed the book on the running plot line for something fresh to come.


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## Reno (Apr 27, 2020)

Being a Star Wars agnostic, I finally got round to this last night. I thought this was a steaming pile of shit, the worst type of corporate franchise film-making which allowed itself to have a bunch of angry, entitled fanboys dictate how a film should be made. That's not how to make a good film. 

I liked The Last Jedi, it wasn't perfect but it actually was a proper film with a point of view, some interesting ideas, politics which happen to agree with mine and a strong aesthetic. It's probably the only Star Wars film where characters make choices which surprised me, which I suppose is the problem for the fans. They should have had the courage to take the third film forward from there, instead they did apologetic backpedalling on every interesting idea The Last Jedi introduced. That's all this piss poor excuse for a conclusion achieved, its a staggering bore apart from that and often a rather ugly looking film.

Carrie Fisher's death is the one thing that couldn't be helped but the way they tried to integrate old deleted scenes into this was incredibly awkward and made me quite sad.

I'm out of here now, I just needed to vent.


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## kabbes (Apr 27, 2020)

In the few weeks since I saw it, I’ve only remembered more reasons why it’s terrible


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## Rosemary Jest (Apr 27, 2020)

I watched it at the weekend and it was pretty bad, it just made no sense.

The Mandalorian on the other hand, is ace.


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## Reno (Apr 27, 2020)

Rosemary Jest said:


> The Mandalorian on the other hand, is ace.


It's my favourite thing that has come out of Star Wars


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## krtek a houby (Apr 27, 2020)

Reno said:


> Being a Star Wars agnostic, I finally got round to this last night. I thought this was a steaming pile of shit, the worst type of corporate franchise film-making which allowed itself to have a bunch of angry, entitled fanboys dictate how a film should be made. That's not how to make a good film.
> 
> I liked The Last Jedi, it wasn't perfect but it actually was a proper film with a point of view, some interesting ideas, politics which happen to agree with mine and a strong aesthetic. It's probably the only Star Wars film where characters make choices which surprised me, which I suppose is the problem for the fans. They should have had the courage to take the third film forward from there, instead they did apologetic backpedalling on every interesting idea The Last Jedi introduced. That's all this piss poor excuse for a conclusion achieved, its a staggering bore apart from that and often a rather ugly looking film.
> 
> ...



Am also disappointed they didn't build on the Last Jedi, one of the best films of the franchise. 

It was entertaining enough but easily the weakest of the new batch. Solo is a better film, compared to this.


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## ska invita (Apr 28, 2020)

Reno said:


> Being a Star Wars agnostic, I finally got round to this last night. I thought this was a steaming pile of shit, the worst type of corporate franchise film-making which allowed itself to have a bunch of angry, entitled fanboys dictate how a film should be made.


Dont blame "entitled fanboys" - this seems to be the take film journalists have had all through this mess - from what i can see fans basically disliked all three of them for the most part,  blame the corporate culture of Disney for being incapable of making anything like a trilogy of coherent films. It's a fuck up because its a desperate, artless, rudderless attempt to box tick, cash in, and churn out saleable product by committee. These films should be taught in economics classes not film school. No "fanboy" would've "dictated" this mess. If anything feels dictated by the tastes of fanboys its The Mandalorian.


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## Reno (Apr 28, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Dont blame "entitled fanboys" - this seems to be the take film journalists have had all through this mess - from what i can see fans basically disliked all three of them for the most part,  blame the corporate culture of Disney for being incapable of making anything like a trilogy of coherent films. It's a fuck up because its a desperate, artless, rudderless attempt to box tick, cash in, and churn out saleable product by committee. These films should be taught in economics classes not film school. No "fanboy" would've "dictated" this mess. If anything feels dictated by the tastes of fanboys its The Mandalorian.


Film journalist = "fake news media" right ? I can't be arsed going much into a back and forth as I'm not invested enough in a piece of cinematic garbage like this but you have to be wilfully ignorant to not see The Rise of Skywalker as a result of the fan insanity that met The Last Jedi.  The wisdom that nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans is true. This film doesn't just shit over the previous one, it cuts off its head and fucks its windpipe. It's an open secret that after Solo bombed, Disney and Kathleen Kennedy panicked and ordered much of The Rise of Skywalker to be reshot to please the fanboys who hated The Last Jedi to insure its success. Every previous fan complaint is addressed and made up for and then some.

Odd that you see The Mandalorian as the one with the fan problem. I'm not a Star Wars fan but the tv series is thankfully free of much of what I dislike about the franchise, being closely patterned after a spagetti western. It can be enjoyed even if you've never seen any previous Star Wars product.


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## ska invita (Apr 28, 2020)

Reno said:


> Film journalist = "fake news media" right ? I can't be arsed going too much into a back and forth as I'm not invested enough in a piece of cinematic garbage like this but you have to be wilfully ignorant to not see The Rise of Skywalker as a result of the fan insanity that met The Last Jedi.  The wisdom that nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans is true. This film doesn't just shit over the previous one, it cuts of its head and fucks its windpipe. It's an open secret that after Solo bombed, Disney and Kathleen Kennedy panicked and ordered much of The Rise of Skywalker to be reshot to please the fanboys who hated The Last Jedi to insure its success. Every previous fan complaint is addressed and made up for
> 
> Odd that you see The Mandalorian as the one with the fan problem. I'm not a Star Wars fan but the tv series is thankfully free of much of what i dislike about the franchise, being closely patterned after a spagetti western. It can be enjoyed even if you've never seen any previous Star Wars product.


You've misundestood my post - Madalorian doesnt have a "fan problem", the opposite, Mandalorian is the kind of work that fans always wanted, or wouldve dictated, would they have had a meaningful voice. You said in your posts these new films are shit because "entitled fanboys have dictated it as such", im saying dont blame fans, blame Disney.


Film journalists gave glowing reviews for the first two films, so yeah that is a type of fake news, they're either in the pocket or they're not very good at their job.  ( Critic score of 93% and 91% on Rotten Tomatoes!) Sniped at "fanboys" for criticising too. They seem to have caught up by the time of the third film. There's little meaningful difference between the three new films really, much as the prequels are much of a muchness, wether Phantom Menace is shitter than Clones doesnt really matter . What differences there are are sidenotes, its the worst excessive hypercorporate film making possible, all three of them, kept afloat purely by the budget spend and previous glories. 91%


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## krtek a houby (Apr 28, 2020)

I have been watching Star Wars for over 40 years and while I was disappointed with the prequels, I genuinely liked the new batch. 

I would say that the latest ep is the Return of the Jedi of this lot. Enjoyable but eminently silly.


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## Reno (Apr 28, 2020)

ska invita said:


> You've misundestood my post - Madalorian doesnt have a "fan problem", the opposite, Mandalorian is the kind of work that fans always wanted, or wouldve dictated, would they have had a meaningful voice. You said in your posts these new films are shit because "entitled fanboys have dictated it as such", im saying dont blame fans, blame Disney.
> 
> 
> *Film journalists gave glowing reviews for the first two films, so yeah that is a type of fake news, they're either in the pocket or they're not very good at their job. * ( Critic score of 93% and 91% on Rotten Tomatoes!) Sniped at "fanboys" for criticising too. They seem to have caught up by the time of the third film. There's little meaningful difference between the three new films really, much as the prequels are much of a muchness, wether Phantom Menace is shitter than Clones doesnt really matter . What differences there are are sidenotes, its the worst excessive hypercorporate film making possible, all three of them, kept afloat purely by the budget spend and previous glories. 91%


I liked the first two films, thanks for reminding me to send Disney an invoice.


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## T & P (May 4, 2020)

It has just become ‘free’ to Sky Cinema subscribers so just started my second viewing of the film. I suspect like with the previous two films, the more times I watch it the worse it will get 

As an aside thought, on the surface it seems remarkable that Palpatine has been played by the same actor since the original trilogy, but then Ian McDiarmid was a mere 39 y.o. when he was cast as the Emperor in Return of The Jedi. An unexpected casting given the age difference between the man and the character, though it certainly paid off.


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## kabbes (May 4, 2020)

T & P said:


> It has just become ‘free’ to Sky Cinema subscribers so just started my second viewing of the film. I suspect like with the previous two films, the more times I watch it the worse it will get
> 
> As an aside thought, on the surface it seems remarkable that Palpatine has been played by the same actor since the original trilogy, but then Ian McDiarmid was a mere 39 y.o. when he was cast as the Emperor in Return of The Jedi. An unexpected casting given the age difference between the man and the character, though it certainly paid off.


You poor fool.  Only now, at the end, do you believe.


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## SpookyFrank (May 4, 2020)

Rosemary Jest said:


> I watched it at the weekend and it was pretty bad, it just made no sense.
> 
> The Mandalorian on the other hand, is ace.



Rewatching Mandalorian at the moment. They fucking nailed the aesthetic, and the light-touch world building. People don't stand around explaining the plot to each other, it's all shown. We don't see the main character's face, but we know what he's thinking and feeling because the stories are coherent and properly told.


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## T & P (May 5, 2020)

Second


kabbes said:


> You poor fool.  Only now, at the end, do you believe.


To be fair the first two thirds are fairly watchable and the film carries itself well with a good pace and right amount of action.Though its shortcomings come to roost in full in the conclusion.
A few thoughts about various plot holes and failings imo:



Spoiler



The Sith wayfinder subplot feels a bit silly and a glorified satnav.

Kylo Ren’s ability to not just telepathically connect with Rey but cross over and grab physical objects such as her necklace is an absurd upgrade on all previous Force powers by all other Jedi or Sith lords, And criminally underused by Kylo Ren. All he gets is a bloody necklace.

Through the entire new trilogy the First Order acquires technology orders of magnitude more powerful and advanced than the Empire had managed. Planet sized Death Stars that can destroy entire systems with one shot from another system light years away. Being able to track ships in hyperspace. And finally portable planet-killing death rays that fire from a cannon mounted on Star Destroyers. Presumably without the aid of kyber crystals. The Resistance meanwhile has a pitiful fleet that makes the Rebel Alliance fleet look formidable by comparison.

And yet the mighty Star Destroyers of the First Order are laughably vulnerable to small fire. If memory serves, in the original trilogy there were no Star Destroyers anywhere near blown out by direct fire from the biggest ships in the Rebel fleet, never mind X-wing fighters and other small ships. In ROTJ they manage to disable a super star destroyer which only gets destroyed after drifting and crashing into the Death Star. Yet in this film they explode like fireworks after a moderate attack from small ships, which no matter how many seems akin to destroying a modern battle tank with twenty blokes shooting it with assault rifles. Or fucking arrows, as the case might be. Not to mention the ultra mighty dreadnought in the previous film, which was obliterated with the Star Wars equivalent of a First World War biplane hand dropping bomblets on it from above.


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## kabbes (May 5, 2020)

Oh the plot holes don’t stop there!  It’s fundamentally broken, if you stop and think about it (which the film desperately tries to stop you doing by breathlessly accelerating its way from beginning to end).  For example



Spoiler: Broken at the deepest levels



What’s going on with that Sith planet?  Who is making and piloting these Star destroyers? Do they live there?  On what? Where’s the food and other support systems for tens of not hundreds of thousands of people? Or do they commute?  How? Or the most ridiculous idea of all, is Palpatine able to conjure up complex machinery and adult humans just with his mind?

And what is Palpatine anyway? Is he supposed to have survived the Death Star explosion and floated to this planet?  Or was the prior Palpatine some kind of clone, in which case what was the fucking plan for this one, other than living attached to tubes?

It’s ALL bobbins. The original trilogy has a simple coherent story to tell. This bunch of making it up as you go along (by a guy with, lets face it, a track record of that kind of thing) is just a mess of moments


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (May 5, 2020)

I only got about 45 minutes in before calling it quits. The suddenly Palpatine is back and the wayfinder shite is really jarring. I just got bored. I'm sure I'll catch it all on some wet afternoon. Never been a fan of writing a story as you go, needs to be fully crafted form end to end. Just look how lost battlestar Galactica and . . .well lost ended up.


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## kabbes (May 5, 2020)

Yeah, this plot was go to a place to get a thing to go to a place to get a thing to go to a place to get a thing to go to a place.  There was no time in that for actual storytelling.  Oh look, a character is dead!  Oh no they’re not!  Who cares about that, now we have to rush off somewhere else!  Here’s a new character!  Eh, forget them, let’s go somewhere new now!


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## DexterTCN (May 6, 2020)

I have now watched this. 

It's a kids movie.  Not really for adults.


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## T & P (May 6, 2020)

DexterTCN said:


> I have now watched this.
> 
> It's a kids movie.  Not really for adults.


That has been a constant bone of contention throughout the life of the franchise, hasn't it. George Lucas to this day defends the inclusion of the infamous Jar Jar Binks character by saying Star Wars was always meant to be a family product and targeted to kids as much as grown ups. In a way he is right (though Binks is still complete shite of course). As mentioned upthread the biggest Star War haters are their diehard fans, me included I guess.

However that's not the problem IMO. There are countless child-oriented films that are highly satisfying to adults and well written. The biggest problem of this entire trilogy is the lack of a story arc comprising all three films. It reminds me of that literary exercise game whereby each participant adds a paragraph to a story with no regard to the tale so far, and leaves it to the next player to sort out the mess.


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