# Panasonic GH5, GH5S and G80 cameras - discussion



## alsoknownas (Sep 19, 2016)

GH5 to be released 2017 will have 4K at 60p and.... 10 bit 4:2:2 .  Also a 6K photo mode (similar to the 4K photo mode but burst-only).

Looks well tasty (for video).

Panasonic GH5 Gives Us What We Want: 4K, 60p, 10bit, 4:2:2

Also cousin/sister/brother/replacement to the G7 in the G80 (or G85 - they are doing some weird regional naming variation ) , which has in-body 5-axis stabilisation (no mention of this for the GH5 ).

If I've got any money when this comes out (GH5) I'm sorely tempted.


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## alsoknownas (Sep 20, 2016)

I've got the GH4 but in the medium term I need 2 things to go with it - a) a back-up cam in case of failure on a serious project (I was considering the G7), and b) an external recorder to give me 10 bit video to work with in post.

Now it seems like I could invest the same combined amount in a GH5 and have a similar package.  Any thoughts?


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 20, 2016)

The speed at which Panasonic churn out cameras I'm not sure the logic of waiting for anything specific really applies. I'd just wait until the annoyance of not having a backup or the limitations of current kit outweigh the desire not to spend any more money, then buy.

GH5 does sound a reasonable bet if it's a medium term decision.


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## alsoknownas (Sep 20, 2016)

Thing is the GH series always offers something unique at the pricepoint (GH4 - 4K internal; GH5 10-bit internal).  GH5 will actually be the first ultra-affordable 'broadcast standard' (outdated term, I know) camera (i.e. - 10 bit depth, 4:2:2 subsampling, over 50mbps).

I think the GH series are a bit special.  It's them and the Sony A7s series, and the BlackMagic cameras for video at the moment (at the entry level).


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## alsoknownas (Dec 30, 2016)

First 'purported' GH5 footage spotted in the wild!  Looks really amazing if you can view it at 2160 / 60p .


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## dweller (Dec 30, 2016)

Looks good even at 1080p 
The ice documentary featured is most likely GH5 too.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 30, 2016)

dweller said:


> Looks good even at 1080p
> The ice documentary featured is most likely GH5 too.


Good spot!  Looks likely the full specs will be out next week.  Ice footage looks insanely sharp!  Not really a fan of 60p, but I'm sure it will be good for certain projects (and slo-mo of course).


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## alsoknownas (Jan 3, 2017)

I'm hoping there will be news on this tomorrow .


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## FridgeMagnet (Jan 4, 2017)

http://petapixel.com/2017/01/04/panasonic-finally-unveils-gh5-4k60p-video-5-axis-stabilization/

As it says, improvements on almost all fronts over the GH4, but definitely a camera for video people. TBH though, as long as Panasonic keep releasing decent stills-focused cameras as well, I'm not that fussed if their flagship models are video-focussed, and aspects of the tech do feed through.

Still have not used any of the 4K Photo modes on my GX8 though  at least not for more than "I wonder how this 4K Photo mode works". I should try at some point actually; I don't need more than 4K resolution for the crappy street shots I take, and I do often shoot bursts if anything interesting is happening.


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## alsoknownas (Jan 4, 2017)

Yep, video orientated; very much the way I appreciate it!  You stills folk don't mind if one or two of the hundreds of hybrid bodies are skewed towards video, do you? 

Very pleased with the announced specs.  In body stabilisation is the headline feature of the new stuff.  Also pleased to see 400 mbps bitrate (more hard drive investment required ).  We'll be shooting around 3gb of data per minute! 

Only negative for me is that V Log L remains a paid upgrade.  That seems stingy and unnecessary really.

Basically, if this works as touted (and we'll have to see if cooling works ok, and the codec holds up) then I will almost certainly get it if I can afford to.


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## alsoknownas (Jan 4, 2017)

Wow, seems it might be using H.265 for the higher data-rate stuff.  That's quite a big deal.


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## alsoknownas (Jan 5, 2017)

Everybody *- it's here!*  The GH5 is really here!


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## alsoknownas (Jan 11, 2017)

alsoknownas said:


> Wow, seems it might be using H.265 for the higher data-rate stuff.  That's quite a big deal.


Actually, no H.265 for regular 4K .  Likely to be only for '6K' photo mode and anamorphic.

Anamorphic looks like it's going to be an incredible option on this camera.  More info here:

New information regarding H.265 on the Panasonic GH5 - EOSHD


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## editor (Feb 23, 2017)

Good to see Kai back reviewing stuff.


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## alsoknownas (Feb 23, 2017)

I actually find him quite annoying .  Reminds me a bit of Kevin Turvey, if anyone remembers who he was.


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## alsoknownas (Feb 24, 2017)

I hate to say it, but that really is a terrible review.  Far too much on the (fairly dodgy at times) buffoonery, and far too little information.  Impossible to judge the camera from the footage he shot because much of it is blown out, presumably because he wasn't concentrating properly.
"Oh, Mark Clattenburg - it's all about you!" comes to mind.


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## alsoknownas (Nov 26, 2017)

There are rumours (unfortunately just rumours at the moment) that Panasonic might be about to announce a GH5s version with a reduced pixel count and subsequently better low-light performance .

This will be potentially amazing if it happens, and essentially my number 1 camera wish come true.  I am hoping hard that this materialises.


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## alsoknownas (Nov 27, 2017)

I had previously posted this a year or so ago:


alsoknownas said:


> I really wish Panasonic would make a video-centric version of the GHx camera that ditched most of the stills capacity and biased towards video (low pixel-count basically ).  I'd pay a bit extra for that.


So, yeah - fingers crossed basically.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 4, 2017)

I'd just like to thank the other three contributors to this thread for their companionship in what has been at times a rather solitary acre.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 7, 2017)

Apparently the press are being briefed on this on the 15th, but then there's an embargo until January sometime . Rats.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 15, 2017)

It seems by now that there almost certainly will be a new video-orientated camera out in the new year. Too much smoke for there to be nothing there at all.
Opinions are wildly different about whether it's gonna be a low pixel count, low light 'monster', or simply an improved implementation of the existing sensor, but either way it will offer some sort of upgrade to the iso performance of the camera (which is it's only true weak point imo).

I'm really fascinated to see what kind of performance they are going to offer us. Here's my table of awesomeness:

'Clean' at ISO 800 - This is how I would describe the GH4 that I currently use, in that a properly exposed clip shot at 800 generally looks okay to me, with very little noise to speak of. 1250 works okay too, though with a smattering of noise usually.  1600 is pushing it a bit and often needs noise reduction in post.  I wouldn't go above that personally.  Bear in mind that noise looks worse quicker on video compared to stills (because it dances about drawing attention to itself).
The bad thing about this level of sensitivity is that, although I have never been in a reasonable situation where I could not get a good image, I sometimes find myself having to expose at f1.8, which is not an ideal aperture for shooting groups of people, or even two people having a conversation .

Clean at 1600 - This is how I've found the GH5 the few times I've used it.  Obviously a big improvement, but still not all that impressive when you consider how good the rest of its specification is.

Clean at 3200 - This is the minimum I am expecting from a 'GH5s' (the name, like everything else, hasn't been confirmed yet).  Will that improvement be enough to make me and others pay the increased price (expected to be £500 more than the already £2,000ish GH5)?  Well, in all honesty, yes.  But I hope it's a bit more than just that.

Clean at 6400 - I reckon this would be a sweet spot really .  I imagine this would allow exposure at f2.8 in even challenging situations, which I could happily live with.  It would also make f2.8 zoom lenses a worthwhile proposition, which I'd also like to try out.

Clean at 12800 or above - I'll be surprised if we get up to these (for MFT) dizzying heights! Then I would be considering it a low-light monster .


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## alsoknownas (Dec 16, 2017)

You'll all be sorry you didn't get more excited when this turns out to be the WORLD'S GREATEST CAMERA!!!


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## FridgeMagnet (Dec 17, 2017)

I’m interested in a high ISO camera for MFT but if it means lowering the pixel count, I can’t imagine that Panasonic will move the tech to their stills cameras. I shoot a lot at 3200 with the GX8 and it’s fine (not super clean, clean enough though) but tbh I wouldn’t say no to better dynamic range, more sensitivity etc - even at f1.4 I still don’t get great shutter speeds at night on the street.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 17, 2017)

FridgeMagnet said:


> I’m interested in a high ISO camera for MFT but if it means lowering the pixel count, I can’t imagine that Panasonic will move the tech to their stills cameras. I shoot a lot at 3200 with the GX8 and it’s fine (not super clean, clean enough though) but tbh I wouldn’t say no to better dynamic range, more sensitivity etc - even at f1.4 I still don’t get great shutter speeds at night on the street.


Well I think the point of this is that it will forego any pretence at being a hybrid stills / video camera, and simply deliver what's needed for great video. The trouble with hybrid systems is that they require compromise on both sides. Video needs lower resolution, whereas stills require higher resolution (as a rule).
The idea seems to be that the lineup would be Gh5 - hybrid, G9 - stills biased, Gh5s - video biased.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 26, 2017)

So this is (fairly credibly) supposed to be an image from the touted new system:


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## FridgeMagnet (Dec 27, 2017)

Bit wide innit?


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## alsoknownas (Dec 27, 2017)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Bit wide innit?


Video still.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 27, 2017)

Probably shot anamorphic.

Eta: 2.4:1 is a common aspect ratio for anamorphic, which looks about right.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 29, 2017)

Camera rumoured to shoot 14-bit RAW stills, which I think would be a first for MFT.


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## alsoknownas (Dec 30, 2017)

I'm gonna be bloody pissed off if these rumours turn out to be nothing but hot air (or some kind of firmware update or something) .


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## alsoknownas (Jan 4, 2018)

Teasy little video that is too small to tell much by, but which offers a hint at quite dramatic performance (possibly, maybe) (enable audio) :


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## alsoknownas (Jan 5, 2018)

Unofficial:


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## alsoknownas (Jan 5, 2018)

Lot of rumours now saying it *won't* feature IBIS .  That would be a shame.  Apparently stabilisation reduces the ability to maximise the sensor (all to do with cooling).  Does raise the possibility of RAW video (external) .


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## alsoknownas (Jan 8, 2018)

So today is the day when we should get some official news on this camera.
The latest rumors are around the possibility of the unit using the new starvis sensor manufactured by Sony.
This is a low light sensor using very new tech, which was developed specifically for security cameras!
This would be an unusual development, but the story certainly has got some credibility to it.


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## alsoknownas (Jan 8, 2018)

Lots of credible leaks today (full announcement this evening).

Dual ISO! 

Probably no IBIS


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## alsoknownas (Jan 8, 2018)

Anyone tuning in for the presser at 6pm?


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## alsoknownas (Jan 8, 2018)

Official!


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## Virtual Blue (Jan 8, 2018)

Am I real poor or is that super expensive?


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## alsoknownas (Jan 8, 2018)

Virtual Blue said:


> Am I real poor or is that super expensive?


The thing about this stuff is that it's basically professional gear.  So I'm a freelancer.  I'm not well-off at all at the mo (working towards changing that *fingers crossed smillie*) but I do need to use a chunk of my income to keep my gear up to scratch or I can't work.  Like a taxi driver buying a car, or a chef buying a top-of-the-range oven, I really can't survive without this sort of kit.  For entry-level pro stuff it's actually exceedingly affordable (by comparison).


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## alsoknownas (Jan 9, 2018)

So, I'm delighted about the ISO performance gains, which seem to have exceeded my expectations (3 - 3.5 stops seems to be the consensus).  This will be a real game-changer for my work.
The camera has some mad new STARVIS sensor technology made by Sony, which is what gives it it's 'monster' low-light capabilities. 

The rest of the camera is very GH5-like, which is fine, and to be expected as this is a GH5 variant.  The only dissapointment for me is that there isn't a unique Log gamma that dispenses with the 'Lite' limitations of the V Log L curve.  Perhaps in a future update?  Raw external too please!

The only downside of this is that IBIS has been sacrificed for whatever reason (price? market segmentation? technical issues? - who really knows?).  This is bad news, as it's a feature I was starting to feel very attracted to.  I think I might consider selling my GH4 and getting a GX80 as B-cam.

All-in-all a very exciting release.  Of course I'll be watching reviews and footage with interest, but I'm also gonna start saving my pennies .


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## editor (Jan 9, 2018)

Impressive!


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 21, 2018)

In terms of video, these cameras are about to be blown out of the water by the recently announced Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K. The main downsides are no image stabilisation, the battery life will be shit and c-fast cards are fucking pricey. 
But the rest of the specs are pretty impressive. 

Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera | Blackmagic Design


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## FridgeMagnet (Apr 21, 2018)

That “90s bridge camera” aesthetic will help reduce the number of thefts too.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 21, 2018)

Aye, it looks pretty non-descript, bar the 5” screen on the back.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 22, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> In terms of video, these cameras are about to be blown out of the water by the recently announced Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K. The main downsides are no image stabilisation, the battery life will be shit and c-fast cards are fucking pricey.
> But the rest of the specs are pretty impressive.
> 
> Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera | Blackmagic Design


The new Pocket Camera 4k apparently uses the same sensor as the Gh5S so the comparison of going to be very interesting indeed.

It will (if all goes well in terms of manufacture and distribution - BM have a mixed track record in this regard) be the greatest value video camera of all time, surely? Around a grand, with the highest specs of anything even closely priced (internal RAW!), and with the pro version of Resolve software, itself worth a few hundred quid, thrown in for free! 

The GH5S image quality is superb, but it is let down at the higher ISO's by excessive built-in noise reduction.  Accessing RAW data from that sensor, with Blackmagic's also excellent colour science is going to be killer, that much is for sure.  Even the high-bitrate Prores files should be fairly spectacular.

But, you mention some of the downsides - obviously no IBIS is something both units have in common - but things like terrible battery life, iffy customer support, reliability problems (all speculative at this point, but things that have haunted BM in the past) - are significant problems if you're considering using this unit on a serious or professional project.

I'm interested in the camera, and at that price it could fit into the kit as a B or C cam.  I'll feel more comfortable knowing I have the GH5S (which I haven't yet purchased) to pull out of the bag as a complete and reliable camera package that gets the job done, with perhaps the BMPC4K as a special unit for jobs where I have the time to manage it as a system, and manage the huge files that are likely to flow out of it!

Another fortunate thing about this is that the price of the GH5S is almost certain to drop as a result of the Pocket Cam release.  Also it might (though this is in the realms of wishful thinking) force Panasonic to enable external RAW on one or both of the GH5 variants.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 22, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> and with the pro version of Resolve software, itself worth a few hundred quid, thrown in for free!



That’s definitely a major plus if you haven’t got any editing and/or colouring software. For those that have though it would be more beneficial for Blackmagic to either offer Prores raw, or to share their colour science with other software developers. As it stands it just means having to learn new software and then shoehorning it into your current workflow (if wanting to shoot in raw).


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## alsoknownas (Apr 22, 2018)

Amazing to think that until quite recently Resolve Studio version was priced at $995 (USD), almost as much as the whole price for the new camera + Resolve license!  
Admittedly it has reduced to about a third of that lately, but still..!

AFAIK, you don't need Resolve to use BM CinemaDNG RAW files.  You can do basic manipulation of them directly in Premiere for example, I think.

Resolve is a pretty amazing addition to an post-production setup though - it's unmatched for grading (though yes, learning the node-based workflow is gonna take some time), Fairlight Audio looks awesome, and there are some less-celebrated extras in there too, like noise-reduction (that costs money elsewhere) and a decent-looking particle system.

Actually come to think of it Resolve really is looking more and more like a viable Creative Cloud alternative with each new version.  Hmmm...​


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 24, 2018)

I’ll probably attempt to learn Resolve, although it looks difficult (and surely will take an age to master).
It’s far easier to go the quick route using Colorista (which is why I’m excited about Prores, as compressed Mov files don’t have enough information in them to do properly).
But those file sizes. You can write direct to an external SSD from the BMPC4K but then it’s working out where to put it that doesn’t get in the way. But those C-Fast cards; the 256Gb one will hold about 50 mins of 4K Prores and you don’t get much change from £700. Which is insane money for storage.


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## FridgeMagnet (Apr 24, 2018)

Interesting observation from seeing all the YouTube filmers on Speakers Corner these days (which is basically everyone): it’s pretty much all Panasonic IME. No GH5s that I’ve seen, but G7 to GH4.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 24, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I’ll probably attempt to learn Resolve, although it looks difficult (and surely will take an age to master).
> It’s far easier to go the quick route using Colorista (which is why I’m excited about Prores, as compressed Mov files don’t have enough information in them to do properly).
> But those file sizes. You can write direct to an external SSD from the BMPC4K but then it’s working out where to put it that doesn’t get in the way. But those C-Fast cards; the 256Gb one will hold about 50 mins of 4K Prores and you don’t get much change from £700. Which is insane money for storage.


Yeah, I just use Lumetri Color for grading most things.

Those kinds of considerations are what is going to keep both the GH5S and Pocket 4k as viable products imo.  You're gonna need a V-lock battery (or a sack-load of Canon batteries) to keep it running long enough to be worthwhile.  Then there's the media costs and/or mounting hassle.  It'll still be a great camera, but the GH5S is gonna be far more suited to run-and-gun (not fond of that phrase) and fast turnaround work.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 24, 2018)

Run and Gun is what to strive for. Currently I use a Nikon D7200 with a Saramonic pre-amp underneath (this drains a 9v battery in under an hour anyway providing phantom, so I’m used to battery regimes) to power an NTG-3 (yes, overkill but nothing in the lower leagues touches it) with an iPad controlling the camera via digital director (it makes the Nikon usable in real time) so it’s a massive bulk of kit and a hassle to carry just to produce a massively compressed file you can’t do a great deal with in post. 
So the new BM 4K camera solves a lot of issues, and some of the issues it has I already have as issues (battery charging regimes) but introduces new ones. I looked into loads of solutions to my current predicament and all arrows pointed to me moving away from DSLR for film work as they’re mostly for stills (apart from the ones in the OP).


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## alsoknownas (Apr 24, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Run and Gun is what to strive for. Currently I use a Nikon D7200 with a Saramonic pre-amp underneath...


 Blimey!  That's quite an exotic set-up.  I'm sure you've considered this, but you'd feel fairly liberated with a GH5.  10-bit files, so plenty of headroom in post (though not as much as RAW obviously); Small batteries that last most of the day; Nice user interface, XLR hotshoe unit available (extra cost mind).


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 25, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Blimey!  That's quite an exotic set-up.  I'm sure you've considered this, but you'd feel fairly liberated with a GH5.  10-bit files, so plenty of headroom in post (though not as much as RAW obviously); Small batteries that last most of the day; Nice user interface, XLR hotshoe unit available (extra cost mind).



Yeah. I did my usual trick of investing in gear then discovering afterwards their limitations. The mic is great but the blimp and boom pole are a pain to lug about plus it requires an extra person. One of those Rode ones that mount on the hot shoe would have been more practical.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 25, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Yeah. I did my usual trick of investing in gear then discovering afterwards their limitations. The mic is great but the blimp and boom pole are a pain to lug about plus it requires an extra person. One of those Rode ones that mount on the hot shoe would have been more practical.


I often mount my Rode NTG-2 mic (which is actually a bit longer than the mic you use, though not as good) using a hot shoe adapter like this one:

 
Which works great, though the setup does look a bit goofy. Nothing beats boomed sound though.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 25, 2018)

How are you finding that? I ask because shotgun mics are designed to cancel out surrounding noise (that’s what all those slots on the side are for I think) so ideally you position them above the subject with the mic pointing downwards. If it’s mounted on top of the camera pointing at the subject you’ll pick them up but background noise also.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 25, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> How are you finding that? I ask because shotgun mics are designed to cancel out surrounding noise (that’s what all those slots on the side are for I think) so ideally you position them above the subject with the mic pointing downwards. If it’s mounted on top of the camera pointing at the subject you’ll pick them up but background noise also.


Yeah, it's no substitute for using it boomed, but it's way more directional than the built-in camera mic.  So if I'm wanting to pick up a bit of what's going on in front of the lens, which will likely be used over a music bed, or with an interview over the top of it, then it's a great option.  It wouldn't work for actually recording clean dialogue or anything like that.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 25, 2018)

Dunno if you're aware of it, but this is the official XLR adaptor for the GH5 & GH5S.  Panasonic DMW-XLR1 (approx. £350)





Pretty nifty .  I could do with additional mini-jack ins for my radio mics though .


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 25, 2018)

Looks roughly the same size as my Saramonic one for over three times the price! Does it run from the camera’s battery? Also does the camera come with a mini jack mic in?


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## alsoknownas (Apr 25, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Looks roughly the same size as my Saramonic one for over three times the price! Does it run from the camera’s battery? Also does the camera come with a mini jack mic in?


The pre-amps are probably a step up from the Saramonic I would have thought, which is especially relevant if you're using a pricey mic! Yes, powered (and data transfer) through the hot-shoe I believe.  GH4 / 5 / 5S have stereo mini-jack in, and headphone jack out.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 25, 2018)

I currently use this unit from Beachtek (I imagine it's quite similar to your Saramonic?) :





Has 1 XLR in, 2 x mono mini jacks + 1 stereo mini jack in (you can only output 2 channels at a time).  Covers my needs pretty well at the moment.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 25, 2018)

It’s similar to this and has two xlr ins and a 3.5mm line in. The sound is fine after I worked out I had to drastically lower the camera audio in volume. Before I worked that out I thought it was going to be just a paper weight. Its major downside is it uses a 9v battery up in about an hour.
I’m considering getting the Rode Video Mic Proplus as a more convenient on camera mic though (the new model).


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## alsoknownas (Apr 25, 2018)

Yeah, you have to have the camera's pre-amp as low as possible with all these external setups.  I've been looking at the Pro+ too, but it only offers convenience of size.  You'll get a better sound quality from the mic you already have if you mounted it.

eta - Ah, you did say convenience, so yeah, there's that


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 25, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Yeah, you have to have the camera's pre-amp as low as possible with all these external setups.  I've been looking at the Pro+ too, but it only offers convenience of size.  You'll get a better sound quality from the mic you already have if you mounted it.
> 
> eta - Ah, you did say convenience, so yeah, there's that



The interesting thing about it (I presume you already know if you’ve been looking into it) is that it can capture two tracks (panned to each channel) with one being quieter to get you out of a fix if the main track clips. Which I thought sounded handy.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 25, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> The interesting thing about it (I presume you already know if you’ve been looking into it) is that it can capture two tracks (panned to each channel) with one being quieter to get you out of a fix if the main track clips. Which I thought sounded handy.


Actually no, I hadn't twigged that it can run a safety track.  That is handy.  Mind you I could set that up with my pre-amp for any mic going through it, though I've never done so.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 26, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> I'm sure you've considered this, but you'd feel fairly liberated with a GH5.



I hadn’t, no, but I am now. Image stabilisation is what’s got me interested. I can live without RAW as long as the files aren’t compressed to death.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 26, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I hadn’t, no, but I am now. Image stabilisation is what’s got me interested. I can live without RAW as long as the files aren’t compressed to death.


Yeah, I mean there's no comparison really between using something you have to rig up and molly-coddle and something that's just built to work.  The GH5 is a very pleasant device to use. The 10-bit H.264 is lovely to grade.
I'm gonna have to miss out on IBIS myself (current GH4 user, looking to upgrade to GH5S), but it is a really nice tool to use.  I can hand-hold without micro-judder using the EVF with 3 points of contact, so I'm fairly nifty without IBIS anyhow.  Would be nice as an option though.

eta - I should say 4 points of contact with a chest pad.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 26, 2018)

Well there’s also gimbals but the decent ones will bump up the outlay a fair bit (plus it’s something else to lug about). The Zhiyun Crane II looks pretty decent (and that’s what I was going to get along with the BM camera) but it’d add a further £600 to the budget.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 26, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Well there’s also gimbals but the decent ones will bump up the outlay a fair bit (plus it’s something else to lug about). The Zhiyun Crane II looks pretty decent (and that’s what I was going to get along with the BM camera) but it’d add a further £600 to the budget.


 Ha ha, we must be looking at all the same gear .


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## alsoknownas (Apr 27, 2018)

The EBU report on the GH5S, conducted by Alan Roberts is out today.  These (admittedly brain-frying at times) reports are similar to the BBC white paper reports I found really useful when I was starting out.

The report looks set to stir up a bit of controversy, with people already questioning the methods and conclusions.

My takeaways:

HD on the camera is kickass.  I rarely shoot HD these days, but would be tempted based on how good a rep it is getting on the GH5S.

4K on the GH5 is probably inherently better than on the GH5S (because of super-sampling from the higher res sensor).  However the GH5S probably more than makes up for this with it's superior colour science (that bit's not from the report, just me speculating).

He claims a whopping 14.6 stops of dynamic range in Hybrid Log Gamma .  This is a huge claim, and one of the things that is going to be highly contested.  One thing this, and other recent measurements, have led me to believe, is that dynamic range, which should be quite an empirical value, is actually subject to a fair bit of subjectivity.  There seem to be different ways of measuring it .

He claims that Noise Reduction on the camera *increases* resolution, rather than decreasing it.  This is also an unusual finding.  If true, it might lead to some interesting strategies for low-light shooting (increase NR instead of ISO, anyone?).

If I've interpreted the findings correctly, VLOG-L doesn't come out looking so great compared to the other profiles.

The full report is here:
https://tech.ebu.ch/docs/tech/tech3335_s29.pdf

Useful summary at Newshooter:
Panasonic GH5s EBU Assessment


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 27, 2018)

Also interesting that the GH5S tested to have no Infrared detection.  I've had some quite significant problems with IR pollution on my GH4, particularly indoors, and using vari-ND.


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 27, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> I've been looking at the Pro+ too, but it only offers convenience of size.



It also picks up audio from the back which is good for close up interview situations (if the interviewer is behind the camera) - the NTG-3 disregards sound from the back of the mic as it’s super cardioid rather than bi-directional.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 28, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> It also picks up audio from the back which is good for close up interview situations (if the interviewer is behind the camera) - the NTG-3 disregards sound from the back of the mic as it’s super cardioid rather than bi-directional.


Hmmm... I think your info is a bit out on that one. Rode+ is also super cardiod.

I also doubt that using a bi-directional mic is going to be a viable strategy for video interviews. Positioned on camera is going to be inadequate for the interviewee; positioned halfway between interviewer and interviewee and the mic is gonna be in shot. That's why they're generally used for radio and the like.

I use the rodelink radio mics, which have served me well, but I'm thinking of switching over to a boom buddy system to allow me to boom in as a single operator.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 28, 2018)

Would depend on the lens though? Using one I have wide open at 18mm you’re pretty close to the subject. I might look at radio mics although I’m guessing they’re more indoors than outdoors?


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 28, 2018)

Let me take a guess - Sigma 18-35 f/1.8 ?  If so, then we're in gear-sync again .  Honestly, I wouldn't recommend any camera-mounted setup for interviews.  Ideal mic position is as close as your frame possibly allows really.

I use radio mics both interior and exterior.  They are omni-directional, which may seem undesirable, but they are placed very close to the chest and mouth of the subject in comparison to any background noise that might be going on.  I've gotten consistently good results with them.

As mentioned I might switch to using the shotgun mic on a boom (with the boom buddy support), but that adds stuff to lug, including an extra stand and the boom pole itself.

You might have good creative or aesthetic reasons to shoot your interviews at 18mm, but I'd be a bit concerned that people don't generally look their best at that focal length.   Is that something you've already considered?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 29, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Hmmm... I think your info is a bit out on that one. Rode+ is also super cardiod.



Yeah I made an assumption after watching a YT vid showing audio being captured from the rear (which is probably normal behaviour for a super-cardioid).


alsoknownas said:


> Let me take a guess - Sigma 18-35 f/1.8 ?  If so, then we're in gear-sync again .  Honestly, I wouldn't recommend any camera-mounted setup for interviews.  Ideal mic position is as close as your frame possibly allows really.



No it’s a Nikkor 18-300 DX mount (the lighter of the two iirc).
I didn’t really consider how good the subject looked at 18mm, obviously there’s no chance of bokeh that wide either. It’s just me working within the limitations I have. I think it’s a good idea for me to get radio mics and Sony have a dual one but that’s well in excess of £1k so will happen sometime after the other things I’m upgrading.


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## alsoknownas (Apr 29, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Yeah I made an assumption after watching a YT vid showing audio being captured from the rear (which is probably normal behaviour for a super-cardioid)...


Yeah, super cardiod pick-up pattern has a little rear lobe, but it really is quite tiny.

The RØDELink Filmmaker Kits I use are pretty affordable (around £250 for lapel mic, transmitter, and receiver).  I've got two sets that I've been working to death with no issues.  I find that with lapel-placed mics you have to restore a bit of treble in post.

Focal length for interviews is tricky if you're a solo operator.  Wide angles are not generally very flattering, but if you go to a portrait-type length then you end up too far away from the person you're interviewing, and you both start yelling across the room!  For me, I seem to end up mostly compromising at around 35mm (MFT with Speedbooster (crop 1.6) ≡  56mm FF), if that makes sense.


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 29, 2018)

RØDE Microphones -  RØDELink Filmmaker Kit Digital Wireless System for Filmmakers


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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 29, 2018)

Cheers, I’ll look into that but am I right in assuming I’ll have to somehow deal with two receivers on my camera if I want to use two mics?
As it happens I do have a 35mm prime lens (DX mount) which I’ve been wanting to try for this stuff but haven’t got round to.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 29, 2018)

Actually that’s a daft question as I could have a wired mic.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 29, 2018)

Just trying to think of the most portable setup possible.


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 29, 2018)

Yeah, you could run a wired mic to yourself (perhaps another lapel).
I have two receivers running into the pre-amp box if I'm doing a double interview (I don't record my own side of the conversation usually). This does look a bit cumbersome, but it gets the job done.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 29, 2018)

Everything ends up cumbersome  however nothing more so than a boom in terms of lugging about (plus bodies needed to operate).


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 29, 2018)

How do those lapel mics hold up in the wind? Are there dead cats for them? That’s the one major advantage with the boom / blimp / dead wombat. Wind doesn’t touch it.


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 29, 2018)

They come with a little miniature wind shield - a dead kitten if you will.
They are a very portable solution - that's why I use them in fact. It's a bit of a compromise on audio quality compared to a boomed shotgun mic, but still very good mono dialogue as far as I'm concerned.


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 29, 2018)




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## Magnus McGinty (Apr 29, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> They come with a little miniature wind shield - a dead kitten if you will.
> They are a very portable solution - that's why I use them in fact. It's a bit of a compromise on audio quality compared to a boomed shotgun mic, but still very good mono dialogue as far as I'm concerned.



Well this has been fruitful; you’ve talked me into getting a GH5 and talked me out of getting the videomic pro+ (as what I have already is superior) and into getting the Rode radio mic (which is comparable to the money I was going to waste on the pro+ !).


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 29, 2018)

Sound like pretty sound choices to me. I would urge you to do a bit more research though, don't just take my word for it. You might find that you have different needs / tastes / foibles than me


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 30, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> For me, I seem to end up mostly compromising at around 35mm (MFT with Speedbooster (crop 1.6) ≡  56mm FF), if that makes sense.



Ive seen the Sigma 18-35 1.8 raved about now (with speed booster). Out of curiosity, do you use Canon or Sony mount (or other)? I suppose it depends what lenses you already have or what other camera bodies you’re considering using if there’s no actual differences.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Apr 30, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Sound like pretty sound choices to me. I would urge you to do a bit more research though, don't just take my word for it. You might find that you have different needs / tastes / foibles than me



No it looks pretty good. I’d prefer prores than H.264 and a bigger sensor would be better for arty bokeh but it looks really good apart from that.


----------



## alsoknownas (Apr 30, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Ive seen the Sigma 18-35 1.8 raved about now (with speed booster). Out of curiosity, do you use Canon or Sony mount (or other)? I suppose it depends what lenses you already have or what other camera bodies you’re considering using if there’s no actual differences.


Yeah, it is the classic combo.  I use the Canon mount version.

H.264 is a terrible acquisition codec, you're right.  But I've never really had any codec-related quality issues from the GH4 or GH5 that I've been aware of, so it's a bit of a non-issue really.  It just works really well at the bitrates they implement.  I even tend to transcode to an intermediate codec for editing (CineForm) then master out to finishing codecs from there.  Never had any problems.

There's no problems generating shallow depth of field when required on a MFT sensor.  You need the right glass though.  Either something like the Sigma range we were just mentioning (there's also a 50 - 100mm f/1.8 to compliment the 18 - 35mm) with the SB , or, if you want to keep things native, and therefore lightweight and compact, something super-fast like the Voigtländer range that open up to f/0.95 !


----------



## Magnus McGinty (May 1, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Yeah, it is the classic combo.  I use the Canon mount version.
> 
> H.264 is a terrible acquisition codec, you're right.  But I've never really had any codec-related quality issues from the GH4 or GH5 that I've been aware of, so it's a bit of a non-issue really.  It just works really well at the bitrates they implement.  I even tend to transcode to an intermediate codec for editing (CineForm) then master out to finishing codecs from there.  Never had any problems.
> 
> There's no problems generating shallow depth of field when required on a MFT sensor.  You need the right glass though.  Either something like the Sigma range we were just mentioning (there's also a 50 - 100mm f/1.8 to compliment the 18 - 35mm) with the SB , or, if you want to keep things native, and therefore lightweight and compact, something super-fast like the Voigtländer range that open up to f/0.95 !



I should be able to raise a fair chunk of cash by selling some of my existing kit. I presume shops try to give you as little as possible citing market conditions. I’m sure I’ll get more selling privately through eBay but the last time I used that to sell a small laptop a few years ago the buyer totally tried it on (with PayPal holding the money until it was resolved) and it took months to resolve; which won’t help me upgrading quickly.
Do you have any advice around this or is it as I say above pretty much?


----------



## alsoknownas (May 1, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I should be able to raise a fair chunk of cash by selling some of my existing kit. I presume shops try to give you as little as possible citing market conditions. I’m sure I’ll get more selling privately through eBay but the last time I used that to sell a small laptop a few years ago the buyer totally tried it on (with PayPal holding the money until it was resolved) and it took months to resolve; which won’t help me upgrading quickly.
> Do you have any advice around this or is it as I say above pretty much?


Actually no, as I'm a bit of a hoarder who hasn't really ever sold much on.  That will change soon as my GH4 is gonna have to part-finance my camera upgrade.  Only thing I've been told is that the part exchange deals are a waste of time, and that you're best off selling privately.
There's quite a few experienced sellers in the wider photography forum though I think.


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## Magnus McGinty (May 1, 2018)

Cheers. I assumed as much.


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## Magnus McGinty (May 1, 2018)

I did try to sell a D600 a fair few years ago in some camera shops and they just all gave the ‘its a buyer’s market’ schtick whilst stroking their chins and offering a bag of sweets for it. 
Less hassle though than the private market.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (May 2, 2018)

Any opinion on Veydra lenses? Their aperture isn’t as wide but they’re designed specifically for film rather than photography.


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## alsoknownas (May 3, 2018)

I've never used them, but they look like a good option.
The thing is though, they're at the cheapest end of the cine lens scale (that doesn't mean they're cheap though obviously), which shows up in reported traits like focus breathing, etc.
Secondly, do you really need the benefits of cine lenses? They look good, but your paying for features like common set sizes so film crews can mount them quickly, and other things you might live without.

I'd probably go for the voigts over those, but there's nothing wrong with them.


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## alsoknownas (May 12, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Any opinion on Veydra lenses? Their aperture isn’t as wide but they’re designed specifically for film rather than photography.


Here's a recent screengrab by a guy called Jon Pais you might have come across.  Does a lot of portrait video, and uses the Veydra cine primes a lot on the GH5:


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## Magnus McGinty (May 14, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Here's a recent screengrab by a guy called Jon Pais you might have come across.  Does a lot of portrait video, and uses the Veydra cine primes a lot on the GH5:
> 
> View attachment 135119



That’s pretty good! I reckon I’ll be upgraded to the GH5 by the beginning of June. The money I get from old kit will mainly go towards some kind of lens ... I can’t predict how that’s going to go at all so I’ll probably get a Panasonic 25mm prime at the lower end, or the metabones adapter with Sigma lens at the wishful thinking end of the scale.


----------



## alsoknownas (May 14, 2018)

The native lenses are so convenient for the mft format, and definitely the way to go if you want a compact, lightweight system, but the fly-by-wire focus just kills it for me. I'm old school manual focus all the way, and I need proper responsive focus rings. It's a shame because they are all good lenses, including the 25mm (there are two versions I think - both great at each price point).


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## Magnus McGinty (May 15, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> The native lenses are so convenient for the mft format, and definitely the way to go if you want a compact, lightweight system, but the fly-by-wire focus just kills it for me. I'm old school manual focus all the way, and I need proper responsive focus rings. It's a shame because they are all good lenses, including the 25mm (there are two versions I think - both great at each price point).



I didn’t realise the manual focus was lacking on the native lenses (which I need given the GH5’s autofocus isn’t the best for video). Just panicking that I won’t raise enough funds to upgrade properly so was looking at alternative lenses.


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## alsoknownas (May 15, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I didn’t realise the manual focus was lacking on the native lenses (which I need given the GH5’s autofocus isn’t the best for video). Just panicking that I won’t raise enough funds to upgrade properly so was looking at alternative lenses.


They do have a manual focus ring, but it works in an electronic, rather than mechanical fashion.  It means that the focus responds in a slightly less predictable way.  Some people don't mind it.  I can't stand it.  Maybe go into a shop and give it a go and see what you think.
Some of the Olympus native glass has a clutch mechanism, which disengages the focus-by-wire and lets you switch to fully manual focus .  I haven't tried this yet, but I think it's all the Olly lenses with the 'Pro' designation (and yes, that means they are more expensive ).


----------



## alsoknownas (May 15, 2018)

For clarity - stuff like the Voightlanders and Vedras are native MFT, but have proper mechanical manual focus, rather than focus-by-wire.


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## Magnus McGinty (May 15, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> For clarity - stuff like the Voightlanders and Vedras are native MFT, but have proper mechanical manual focus, rather than focus-by-wire.



These are the ones I want (or ultimately the megabones adapter with those Sigmas) - I’m sure I’ll manage it but I have something I need to film in July which is the pressure. I also want the audio adapter, the Rode wireless mic (although that can wait) and I like the look of the ZACUTO Z-G5C GH5 Cage to hold it all together.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (May 15, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> They do have a manual focus ring, but it works in an electronic, rather than mechanical fashion.  It means that the focus responds in a slightly less predictable way.  Some people don't mind it.  I can't stand it.  Maybe go into a shop and give it a go and see what you think.
> Some of the Olympus native glass has a clutch mechanism, which disengages the focus-by-wire and lets you switch to fully manual focus .  I haven't tried this yet, but I think it's all the Olly lenses with the 'Pro' designation (and yes, that means they are more expensive ).


I don’t mind the focus ring on the PanaLeica 25/1.4 but it is definitely a digital control that imitates a physical one. I mean that’s a good place to put it but I can’t use it without relying on focus peaking - I never get a feel for where I am.


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## Magnus McGinty (May 15, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> For clarity - stuff like the Voightlanders and Vedras are native MFT, but have proper mechanical manual focus, rather than focus-by-wire.



Oh and daft stuff that you never price in like a variable density filter and something to aid white balance on location (or to aid it in post, even).


----------



## editor (May 16, 2018)

Perhaps of interest:


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## Magnus McGinty (May 16, 2018)

The GH5s is undeniably the better of the two especially if you want low light performance. Crucially for me is that it’s a lot more expensive plus doesn’t have IBIS, which I desire.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (May 23, 2018)

Well I’ve bought the Voigtlander (the old model not the mk II) and should have the GH5 in a fortnight. No idea what to do about memory; SDD’s are the cheapest option but will add weight plus where to put it? So looks like I’ll have to get a UH-II card, but they’re pricey as fuck.


----------



## alsoknownas (May 23, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Well I’ve bought the Voigtlander (the old model not the mk II) and should have the GH5 in a fortnight. No idea what to do about memory; SDD’s are the cheapest option but will add weight plus where to put it? So looks like I’ll have to get a UH-II card, but they’re pricey as fuck.


Which Voitlander did you go for? The 25?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (May 23, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Which Voitlander did you go for? The 25?



Aye.


----------



## alsoknownas (Jul 2, 2018)

So, I picked up a GX80 this weekend, which I will use as a b-cam and backup body.  It's small and light, and packs a punch both stills and video-wise.  Also has IBIS, which is handy .


----------



## alsoknownas (Jul 2, 2018)

Also snapped up a Panasonic 25mm f/1.7 to get started with it.  Not a fan of the focus system, but all my other lenses are Canon mount, so I needed something to get up and running with.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jul 2, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Which Voitlander did you go for? The 25?



I’m in dire need of a variable ND filter. Went out with the Voigt in bright sunlight and it was over exposed yet wouldn’t stop down any lower.


----------



## alsoknownas (Jul 2, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I’m in dire need of a variable ND filter. Went out with the Voigt in bright sunlight and it was over exposed yet wouldn’t stop down any lower.


Shooting video on any lens you end up needing a VND at some point.  180° shutter at 25FPS = 1/50 second.  That's quite a long exposure in bright sunlight, or if you want a more open aperture.  ND is a must really.  I use the Tiffen VND, but I'm thinking of getting some fixed ND's too.


----------



## alsoknownas (Jul 24, 2018)

The GX80 is turning out to be a really cool camera to use.  The IBIS is really useful and well implemented.  I think a smaller sensor size seems to suit IBIS better.
I'm often finding myself picking up the GX80 for quick cutaway shots and the like, when the GH4 is sitting all kitted up right next to it, which I did not expect!  Will make a good companion for the GH5S (which is really just missing IBIS).


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Aug 21, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> The GX80 is turning out to be a really cool camera to use.  The IBIS is really useful and well implemented.  I think a smaller sensor size seems to suit IBIS better.
> I'm often finding myself picking up the GX80 for quick cutaway shots and the like, when the GH4 is sitting all kitted up right next to it, which I did not expect!  Will make a good companion for the GH5S (which is really just missing IBIS).



Why not just get the GH5 then?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Aug 21, 2018)

(Something about low light)


----------



## alsoknownas (Aug 22, 2018)

Magnus McGinty said:


> (Something about low light)


----------



## alsoknownas (Sep 5, 2018)

Hmmm... so now Panny are going to announce a full frame camera in around 3 weeks time.  The plot thickens...


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 5, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Hmmm... so now Panny are going to announce a full frame camera in around 3 weeks time.  The plot thickens...


So I’ve heard. I’ve not heard _why_ though. I can see why Nikon and Canon have, but Panasonic has a good niche already that’s not being so cannibalised by Sony and Fuji (as far as I know, maybe I’m wrong and their sales are tanking).

Also, while Nikon/Canon users can use their old lenses with adaptors, you won’t be able to do that with m43 lenses, so it would basically be a whole new system.


----------



## alsoknownas (Sep 5, 2018)

I agree, it's all quite strange, and leading to speculation in a wide number of directions (cinema camera, hybrid, L mount, new mount, etc.).
Not sure what the strategy is. But I'm sure interested to find out.


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## alsoknownas (Sep 5, 2018)

I'd like them to do something that sits close to the EVA-1, almost poking into cinema camera territory.  If it's just a more expensive GH5 with a BIGGER sensor then that will be less appealing.
It's gonna be a difficult spec.  Has to be great to compare favourably to the, already quite special, GH5 and GH5S, but if they push it too far they're gonna piss off a lot of people who laid out seven grand plus for an EVA-1.  Tricky.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 14, 2018)

More assorted rumours coming out: (FT5) The new Panasonic FF camera aims for the big guys: Will compete against the Sony A9, Nikon D850 and top Canon cameras - 43 Rumors

Tbh I find this quite depressing if it’s all true, and with this level of rumour I’d guess that it’s basically true. I don’t want another feckin system and it implies that Panasonic will not be continuing to support m43, at least not with the same vigour. If I’m going to sell my Panasonic kit I’d best do it pretty soon.

Not joking, I’m thinking of getting a digital Leica M body, if I can work out how to get the cash. Obviously they are expensive as fuck but you know they are going to be supported indefinitely and not change lens mounts or anything. I recently got a spare part on my M6 installed for free at the Leica shop and that was made in 1990 iirc.


----------



## alsoknownas (Sep 14, 2018)

FridgeMagnet said:


> More assorted rumours coming out: (FT5) The new Panasonic FF camera aims for the big guys: Will compete against the Sony A9, Nikon D850 and top Canon cameras - 43 Rumors
> 
> Tbh I find this quite depressing if it’s all true, and with this level of rumour I’d guess that it’s basically true. I don’t want another feckin system and it implies that Panasonic will not be continuing to support m43, at least not with the same vigour. If I’m going to sell my Panasonic kit I’d best do it pretty soon.
> 
> Not joking, I’m thinking of getting a digital Leica M body, if I can work out how to get the cash. Obviously they are expensive as fuck but you know they are going to be supported indefinitely and not change lens mounts or anything. I recently got a spare part on my M6 installed for free at the Leica shop and that was made in 1990 iirc.


Yeah, I guess I might be thinking along similar lines if I was more stills orientated.  I do think Panasonic will continue with a two-tier system though.  MFT is not just nifty, it allows them to lead with features.  Superb IBIS, bodies cool enough to allow for 10-bit processing, etc. - all easier to implement with smaller components.

I think full frame will be where they try to cover off their competitors sales to wealthy customers basically - the 'bigger is better' crowd.

Hopefully the big winner will be video.  I'm not so excited for a high mega-pixel monster, but I'm hopeful this will spawn a pro/enthusiast video-centric little brother.   That would be in keeping with both Panny and Sony (who they seem to want to emulate) strategies.


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## alsoknownas (Sep 20, 2018)

Apparently new system is in collaboration with Leica and Sigma.  I'm warming to it.


----------



## alsoknownas (Sep 21, 2018)

Looks like they are going to announce a low-res version too.  This is actually looking quite promising.


----------



## alsoknownas (Sep 21, 2018)

Hopefully gonna get the GH5S soon.  Hoping the FF announcement + BMP4K release will prompt a price drop.  Though there's a big firmware upgrade coming too, so we'll see...


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 21, 2018)

alsoknownas said:


> Apparently new system is in collaboration with Leica and Sigma.  I'm warming to it.


They've worked with Leica in the past but I'm not convinced it means anything more than "this is our premium lens brand". I mean, say, the PanaLeica 25/1.4 - it's a terrific lens but does it have anything in common with the M lenses that Leica are famous for? Not really.


----------



## alsoknownas (Sep 21, 2018)

FridgeMagnet said:


> They've worked with Leica in the past but I'm not convinced it means anything more than "this is our premium lens brand". I mean, say, the PanaLeica 25/1.4 - it's a terrific lens but does it have anything in common with the M lenses that Leica are famous for? Not really.


Yeah, it was the Sigma bit that excited me.  Means they are serious about a range of lenses at various price points (not just a millionaire's toy).

eta - totally agree about the Leica-tagged stuff though.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 25, 2018)

I did another thread now there’s been a formal announcement - Now Panasonic do a full frame mirrorless - Lumix S1(R)


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 26, 2018)

They did announce another m43 lens too though - https://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/panasonic-leica-dg-vario-summilux-10-25mm-lens-announced/ - which looks nice though doubtless not something I will be able to afford. 10-25mm f1.7, with discrete zoom stops rather than continuous, but that’s fine in my book.


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## alsoknownas (Nov 19, 2018)

So I'm probably gonna buy the GH5s this week if all goes as expected.  There's a good price over at Park Cameras at the moment (who I've always found reliable) - £1935 with discount code.  Plus there's a £250 rebate from Panny (yay!  ).

Question is, should I grab that price now, or see if that bloody Black Friday / Cyber Monday thing spawns any lower prices?  
Any advice?


----------



## alsoknownas (Nov 21, 2018)

Jeez, I feel like I just got a pukka deal on that.

Went with the Park offer and bizarrely it was withdrawn online just as I was making the transaction . Luckily helpful shop woman agreed to honour it for me .

I also decided, against my better instincts to do a part exchange on my GH4 - no strap, no eyecup, no box, no body cap - I wasn't expecting much for it.

Walked out with the GH5s having handed over £1605  (+ the old camera body of course). With a further £250 rebate to come.

Reckon that's a pretty decent deal. Couldn't walk out of the store fast enough to be honest .


----------



## alsoknownas (Jan 20, 2019)

Really enjoying using my GH5S so far.  Haven't shot with it all that much yet, but it's been a joy to use thus far.
Coincidentally got booked to do a couple of challenging low-light gigs (including filming the West End Christmas lights from a moving vintage bus - could have done with both IBIS and dual ISO for that one  ), so I was massively pleased to have it over my old GH4 for those.
Overall the image is just richer and more pleasing.  The 10-bit files are a bit of a hassle to deal with in post, but I'm working on improving my workflow with them.  Besides that, it's just a welcome jump up from a camera (GH4) I already really liked using.


----------



## alsoknownas (Jan 20, 2019)

With regards to the 10-bit files - I'm gonna config my internal drives to RAID 0 and see if that makes a difference.  Just have to wait till I can afford another drive .

Which reminds me a bit of a mate who lives on the canal and says that 'boat' stands for BorrOw Another Thousand'.  No pithy way to make it work, but edit seems to end up meaning 'buy another fucking disk' .


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## alsoknownas (Feb 16, 2022)

Lordus Shites the GH6 rumoured specs are tasty:


25 million pixel PLF-less sensor
High resolution shooting of 100 million pixels
5.7K video
Sensor readout up to 300fps
High-speed readout of 120 fps at 4K resolution
Rolling shutter suppression
Computational processing capacity is about double
New intelligent details New 2D noise reduction High-performance 3D-NR (video) Improved AF performance Processing speed is 3 times faster than before DFD performance has evolved
New recording mode 4K120p 4: 2: 0 10bit 300Mbps *4K 60p 4: 2: 2 10bit 800Mbps* / 600Mbps 5.7K 60p 4: 2: 0 10bit 300Mbps C4K 120p 4: 2: 0 10bit 300Mbps C4K 60p 4: 2: 2 10bit 800Mbps / 600Mbps Recording file method supports Apple ProRes in addition to MP4 and MOV 5.7K 30p *Apple ProRes 422 HQ 1.9Gbps*
Card slot: CFexpress TypeB slot, UHSII compatible SD card slot Weight: 739g
Dynamic range boost function: It is possible to shoot a wide dynamic range image at a maximum of 60 fps by synthesizing an overexposed image and an underexposed image in real time. Achieves a dynamic range of up to 13+ stops approaching the full size. The minimum ISO sensitivity is 800, and when using V-log it is 2000, so an ND filter is essential. Image stabilization: Adopts an ultra-high performance gyro sensor and a new algorithm, and has a correction effect equivalent to 7.5 steps. Smooth image stabilization that is ideal for movies. Dark place performance: High-sensitivity noise is much suppressed compared to GH5II while increasing the number of pixels. It can be used normally up to ISO3200. Built-in microphone evolved from 16bit to 24bit. 4 channels can be recorded when using an XLR adapter. Phase-difference AF is not installed, but AF is much better. The AF calculation speed has tripled, the background omission and tracking performance have been greatly improved, and the AF speed has also become considerably faster. There are 315 AF points in the full area. Human, face / pupil, animal + human subject recognition can be used in all AF modes. The focus range can be set with the focus limiter.


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## Magnus McGinty (Feb 16, 2022)

I may upgrade. Still MFT I take it? I wouldn't have minded a Blackmagic 4K as a secondary camera though so I can get into their software and colour space. They must have come down in price. I found the no stabilisation to be a bit of a deal breaker when I went for the GH5 though.


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## alsoknownas (Feb 17, 2022)

IBIS is what I'm after. I might trade in my GH5S now that the GH main bodies (starting with the GH5 mk II) have reasonable low light. 

Thing is I'm getting in the Canon C70 as my A cam soon, so this will now become my B cam / backup system.


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## editor (Feb 17, 2022)

alsoknownas said:


> IBIS is what I'm after. I might trade in my GH5S now that the GH main bodies (starting with the GH5 mk II) have reasonable low light.
> 
> Thing is I'm getting in the Canon C70 as my A cam soon, so this will now become my B cam / backup system.


Olympus is king of IBIS although Panasonic are better at video (that said the new OM-1 seems pretty decent)


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## alsoknownas (Feb 17, 2022)

editor said:


> Olympus is king of IBIS although Panasonic are better at video (that said the new OM-1 seems pretty decent)


True for stills.   Features like I.S. Lock and the rumoured forthcoming smooth IS in the GH6 make Panasonic the go to for video.  Been using I.S. Lock today on a project and it is incredible.

The OM-1 video specs were unfortunately a massive disappointment.  I did have half an eye on it, but the video codecs are hugely underpowered.

Oly has traditionally been a step ahead in IBIS, but I wonder if Panny have caught up in the meantime?  OM-1 (7 stops), GH6 (rumoured - 7.5 stops) - of course performance has to be seen to be evaluated, but Oly used have a pure spec advantage.


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## Magnus McGinty (Feb 17, 2022)

Let’s face it, people buy the GH series for film, not photographs.


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## alsoknownas (Feb 18, 2022)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Let’s face it, people buy the GH series for film, not photographs.


Yeah. They are middling stills cameras, but stellar video cameras.

I think the GH6 will be a success if the rumoured specs are true.

Some will need better AF of course.


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## Magnus McGinty (Feb 19, 2022)

alsoknownas said:


> Yeah. They are middling stills cameras, but stellar video cameras.
> 
> I think the GH6 will be a success if the rumoured specs are true.
> 
> Some will need better AF of course.



I don’t bother with AF. My lenses (Voigtlander) are manual anyway. I use a Shinobi 5 really to pull focus but the 7 would have been better. It’s not helped by the fact that I probably need reading glasses anyway and the Kameleon by Zacuto would probably be perfect but fuck me they’re expensive and need external power…


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## alsoknownas (Feb 19, 2022)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I don’t bother with AF. My lenses (Voigtlander) are manual anyway. I use a Shinobi 5 really to pull focus but the 7 would have been better. It’s not helped by the fact that I probably need reading glasses anyway and the Kameleon by Zacuto would probably be perfect but fuck me they’re expensive and need external power…


Yup, same.  All manual focus.

I'm also reaching for the reading glasses and eyeing up a Zacuto EVF .


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## alsoknownas (Feb 19, 2022)

Looking further at the OM-1, it looks as though it's going to be an excellent stills camera, especially for rugged environments, but I don't think its going to attract any video shooters.

The GH6 is probably going to be the better hybrid option (if you need both stills and video equally), and hands-down better for video.

Would be nice to own both!


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## alsoknownas (Feb 22, 2022)

A bit cringe-worthy at times, but I think this shows the video capabilities pretty well:


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## editor (Feb 22, 2022)

alsoknownas said:


> A bit cringe-worthy at times, but I think this shows the video capabilities pretty well:



That is one cringey video, but it's great to see Micro Four Thirds getting two great new cameras. 

Some tech reviews here 









						Panasonic LUMIX GH6 Lab Test - Rolling Shutter, Dynamic Range, and Latitude | CineD
					

LUMIX GH6 Lab Test - Curious to see how the fares? Find out how it compares in terms of image quality to previous LUMIX MFT cameras




					www.cined.com
				












						Panasonic Lumix DC-GH6 review
					

The Panasonic GH6 is the latest in the company's line of video-focused Micro Four Thirds cameras. It brings a new, 25MP sensor and 10-bit 4K capture at up to 120p. We've put it to the test, both in the studio and out in the field.




					www.dpreview.com
				












						Panasonic Lumix GH6 review: Worth the wait
					

Long-term lovers of the GH-series were a little let down when the GH5 Mk2 arrived instead of an all new model, but that new model is here now!




					www.pocket-lint.com


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## Magnus McGinty (Feb 22, 2022)

Would be interesting to find out what lens/es were used. Looks anamorphic, unless it's just been cropped in that aspect ratio in post.


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## alsoknownas (Feb 22, 2022)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Would be interesting to find out what lens/es were used. Looks anamorphic, unless it's just been cropped in that aspect ratio in post.


No, all spherical lenses.  Some vintage glass in there.  Aspect ratio just for effect.


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## alsoknownas (Feb 22, 2022)

Low light looks pretty crispy too:


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## Magnus McGinty (Mar 22, 2022)

Just read that RAW is coming in a future update albeit recorded externally to a Ninja 5 which pushes the price up a bit.


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