# HIGNFY and Eton



## DrRingDing (May 13, 2012)

What percentage of presenters come from Eton or public school in the last year.,

Fucking scum.


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## DrRingDing (May 13, 2012)

Paul Merton needs his face rearranging.


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

I liked their early records


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

Anyone else find the Obama shooting a basketball in the opening credits racist?


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## Hocus Eye. (May 13, 2012)

DrRingDing said:


> What percentage of presenters come from Eton or public school in the last year.,
> 
> Fucking scum.


It is better that they do that than that they enter politics. It is comedy and takes the mickey out of politicians. They probably get a buzz out of slagging off people from their respective alma mater schools.


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## Maggot (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> Anyone else find the Obama shooting a basketball in the opening credits racist?


How is it racist?


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## Maggot (May 13, 2012)

DrRingDing said:


> What percentage of presenters come from Eton or public school in the last year.,


I really don't give a toss - as long as they're funny.


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## butchersapron (May 13, 2012)

Yes, private school dominance says nothing whatsoever about society.  Ha ha.


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## weepiper (May 13, 2012)

a) wrong forum and b) Paul Merton is the son of a train driver, grew up in a council flat and went to a comp, so save the face-rearranging for Hislop et al.


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## Badgers (May 13, 2012)

DrRingDing said:


> Paul Merton needs his face rearranging.


 
I like him. When we saw HIGNFY being filmed he was great with the audience and as weepiper said he is hardly an old Etonian


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## Mrs Magpie (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> Anyone else find the Obama shooting a basketball in the opening credits racist?


Isn't it just a re-presidented one? I seem to remember it was Bush doing the same thing before.


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## claphamboy (May 13, 2012)

Badgers said:


> I like him. When we saw HIGNFY being filmed he was great with the audience and as weepiper said he is hardly an old Etonian


 
We went to see it being filmed once, I came out with jaw ache from laughing so much.


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## Badgers (May 13, 2012)

claphamboy said:


> We went to see it being filmed once, I came out with jaw ache from laughing so much.


 
Good fun. Just hate the aching legs  in those seats. 

Have you seen QI being filmed? That is ace


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## claphamboy (May 13, 2012)

Badgers said:


> Good fun. Just hate the aching legs  in those seats.
> 
> Have you seen QI being filmed? That is ace


 
No only HIGNFY, even the warm-up comedian had me almost literately PMSL, but I can imagine QI would be bloody good too.


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

Mrs Magpie said:


> Isn't it just a re-presidented one? I seem to remember it was Bush doing the same thing before.


No, Bush threw a dart at a map of the middle east.


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> Anyone else find the Obama shooting a basketball in the opening credits racist?


I thought that was really dodgy. But Obama himself does claim to be a massive basketball fan, so it hasn't just come from nowhere.


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

Wonder who is the richest?  I have a (very) vague memory back in the Deayton days that the 3 permanent ones were paying themselves 10 grand plus for each show.  Mind, Stephen Fry must be up there.


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> Anyone else find the Obama shooting a basketball in the opening credits racist?


I'm pretty sure Obama is quite famously pretty keen on basketball. Wasn't there even a story (possibly untrue) about him getting a court set up in the White House?


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

littlebabyjesus said:


> I thought that was really dodgy. But Obama himself does claim to be a massive basketball fan, so it hasn't just come from nowhere.


MIght be the case, but I dont think they were reading through the hobbies section on his CV when they came up with it


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (May 13, 2012)

Obama made a big thing of being filmed playing basketball with his advisor guy (whose name escapes me now). It was a pretty clear deliberate attempt to promote a particular image. I don't think there's anything racist at all about using that on the titles.

ETA: If you Google 'Obama Basketball' you get a lot of US stories put up today about him playing basketball with George Clooney as part of a fundraiser.

E(again)TA: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reggie_Love This is the guy. I remember lots of stories about how they played every day during his election campaign.


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

Can't deny it's funny when some dodgy politician or sleb thinks they are funny enough to go on the show, only to get ripped to shreds. Just find Hislop so fucking irritating, along with the succession of Alexanders and similar they have to present it.  It serves a function and can be funny, but with the internet the shock value of ripping into the monarchy, politicos and the like isn't the same as it was when it started (early 90s?).


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I'm pretty sure Obama is quite famously pretty keen on basketball. Wasn't there even a story (possibly untrue) about him getting a court set up in the White House?


If thats the case I'd let them off.


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## frogwoman (May 13, 2012)

don't mean to be an arse but wrong forum


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Obama made a big thing of being filmed playing basketball with his advisor guy (whose name escapes me now). It was a pretty clear deliberate attempt to promote a particular image. I don't think there's anything racist at all about using that on the titles.
> 
> ETA: If you Google 'Obama Basketball' you get a lot of US stories put up today about him playing basketball with George Clooney as part of a fundraiser.
> 
> E(again)TA: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reggie_Love This is the guy. I remember lots of stories about how they played every day during his election campaign.


Yeah, I don't think it's the most esoteric of references; kinda like Clinton playing sax I think - one of those hobbies that is pretty well publicised in one way or another.


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## frogwoman (May 13, 2012)

I like Paul Merton though, he is always really funny.


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> don't mean to be an arse but wrong forum


Oh, yes  so it is.


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## Jon-of-arc (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> If thats the case I'd let them off.


 
definitely the case.  And he does have courts on the white house.  Was the tennis court or something.  Apparently he's pretty good.


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> arse


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

> Yeah, I don't think it's the most esoteric of references; kinda like Clinton playing sax


See - music!


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

> Obama began playing as a child. He had a Dr. J poster on his bedroom wall. His nickname was "Barry O'Bomber." He played for for his high school, the Punahou School, which won the 1979 Hawaii state championship.


 
This is clearly the burning issue of the thread.


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## Ranbay (May 13, 2012)

Paul Merton is just fucking amazing. such a quick wit and he's well funny etc


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## Badgers (May 13, 2012)

B0B2oo9 said:
			
		

> Paul Merton is just fucking amazing. such a quick wit and he's well funny etc



So are you x x x


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## butchersapron (May 13, 2012)

Will self is a right cunt mind.


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## Ranbay (May 13, 2012)




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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

B0B2oo9 said:


> Paul Merton is just fucking amazing. such a quick wit and he's well funny etc


Not to be a hater, but I think he's got a bit tired/lazy in recent years. You can see him falling back on old tropes and using particular tricks.

Think Ross Noble is the heir to his seat, though possibly perceived as a bit too silly.


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## Ranbay (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Not to be a hater, but I think he's got a bit tired/lazy in recent years. You can see him falling back on old tropes and using particular tricks.
> 
> Think Ross Noble is the heir to his seat, though possibly perceived as a bit too silly.


 
Considering how long he's been in the game, i think i can get past that, i love all his stuff, from Just a minute to the travel shows.

Ross Noble is just out there, not my cup of tea.


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

B0B2oo9 said:


> Considering how long he's been in the game


For me, this I think is the problem. It's not even really a criticism as such, it's just the wear is beginning to show I think, as it is possibly on the show in general.



B0B2oo9 said:


> Ross Noble is just out there, not my cup of tea.


Nah, that's fair, and it was possibly a lazy association myself, I just remember seeing Noble on HIGNFY and thinking he was doing the sort of thing Merton used to/is known for. Think Noble also has a more serious side so could stick the boot in to the politcos et al the way Merton has in the past.


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## kittyP (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:
			
		

> If thats the case I'd let them off.



Is this a case of handwringing looking for a problem where it isn't?


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

B0B2oo9 said:


> Considering how long he's been in the game, i think i can get past that, i love all his stuff, from Just a minute to the travel shows.
> .


I might be wrong, but I get the impression that PM still really enjoys Just a minute, but with HIGNFY he sometimes looks like he'd rather not be there, especially when the non-comedian guests start trying to be funny.


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## Ranbay (May 13, 2012)

littlebabyjesus said:


> I might be wrong, but I get the impression that PM still really enjoys Just a minute, but with HIGNFY he sometimes looks like he'd rather not be there, especially when the non-comedian guests start trying to be funny.


 
I would agree with this ^


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

Even a tired Paul Merton has more wit than nearly everyone else. Good thing is that he doesn't force it. When he doesn't have anything good to say, he just keeps quiet.


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## Vintage Paw (May 13, 2012)

I miss Angus.

And the tub of lard.


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## Ranbay (May 13, 2012)

Reginald D Hunter is my fave guest,


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

B0B2oo9 said:


> I would agree with this ^


So would I.


littlebabyjesus said:


> Even a tired Paul Merton has more wit than nearly everyone else. Good thing is that he doesn't force it. When he doesn't have anything good to say, he just keeps quiet.


This however I would not. I think my problem is that he does force it sometimes, maybe at least somewhat because he feels he needs to for the show, but that's when I can see him using tricks and tropes. He'll often also latch onto the end of someone else's gag, without really contributing to it, more just repeating it.

But on his day he's still far beyond a lot of the alternatives.


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Will self is a right cunt mind.


Aye. I'm embarrassed to say I used to look forward to his panel/chat show things a dozen year's ago, however much he was a smug look at me type. Nowadays, a tedious... cunt.


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

B0B2oo9 said:


> Reginald D Hunter is my fave guest,


He's very good in that.  at everyone other than Paul Merton, though, for being awkward because there's a black bloke there. Hunter handles it very well.


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## laptop (May 13, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Will self is a right cunt mind.


 
And your problem with him doing his job is?


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## Vintage Paw (May 13, 2012)

Anyone else getting bored of seeing the same 5 faces doing the comedy panel show circuit? It's all awfully closed-off, isn't it? Like a little, exclusive gated community.


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Anyone else getting bored of seeing the same 5 faces doing the comedy panel show circuit? It's all awfully closed-off, isn't it? Like a little, exclusive gated community.


Don't mind if they're good. Far too many mediocrities keep popping up all the time, though.

Lazy producers, I guess, just going with who they know.


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## butchersapron (May 13, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Anyone else getting bored of seeing the same 5 faces doing the comedy panel show circuit? It's all awfully closed-off, isn't it? Like a little, exclusive gated community.


It doesn't matter as long as they're funny. Apparently.


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

I think there are some people who are seen as reliable. And they are, but it is a shame there's not more talent to spread around (well, there probably _is_, they're just not well known enough).


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## Ranbay (May 13, 2012)

littlebabyjesus said:


> He's very good in that.  at everyone other than Paul Merton, though, for being awkward because there's a black bloke there. Hunter handles it very well.


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Not to be a hater, but I think he's got a bit tired/lazy in recent years. You can see him falling back on old tropes and using particular tricks.
> 
> Think Ross Noble is the heir to his seat, though possibly perceived as a bit too silly.


Im a fan of Ross, he's a force of nature, but I notice that on panel shows the hosts squirm a little (especially Stephen Fry on QI), as he goes off on one at the drop of a hat, and it can be hard to get that to fit in to the show format, i.e. keep to the subject.


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

littlebabyjesus said:


> He's very good in that.  at everyone other than Paul Merton, though, for being awkward because there's a black bloke there. Hunter handles it very well.


Yep, absolutely excruciating from the rest of them, inc. Bill Bailey who I like normally.


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## Vintage Paw (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I think there are some people who are seen as reliable. And they are, but it is a shame there's not more talent to spread around (well, there probably _is_, they're just not well known enough).


 
And they're not well known enough because of the inherent gate-keeping in the 'professional' circuit.


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

Yeah, that's probably a fair point. You'd think with the proliferation of so many panel shows these days producers could test out new talent on the smaller shows, then put them on more higher profile stuff if they prove to be good.

Kind of like loaning out a young footballer to get experience


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## kittyP (May 13, 2012)

littlebabyjesus said:
			
		

> Even a tired Paul Merton has more wit than nearly everyone else. Good thing is that he doesn't force it. When he doesn't have anything good to say, he just keeps quiet.



But that's just it.
For a long time, well before the 'tub of lard' episode, part of his schtik has been a quite exasperation with and confusion about the whole thing that occasionally bursts out.


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## butchersapron (May 13, 2012)

I'm sure the couple of grand fee an episode helps.


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## kittyP (May 13, 2012)

Wilf said:
			
		

> Yep, absolutely excruciating from the rest of them, inc. Bill Bailey who I like normally.



I dunno, I think Bill Bailey doesn't totally fit the panel show format like Nobel (even though they are very different).
I don't think he is ever dodge with Hunter, he just doesn't quite fit in over all.
Having said that, I still like him on panel shows.


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## killer b (May 13, 2012)

Maggot said:


> I really don't give a toss - as long as they're funny.


your life appears to be entirely without context.


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## Vintage Paw (May 13, 2012)

Maggot said:


> I really don't give a toss - as long as they're funny.


 
Hitler was funny 

(Perhaps.)


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## spanglechick (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Yeah, that's probably a fair point. You'd think with the proliferation of so many panel shows these days producers could test out new talent on the smaller shows, then put them on more higher profile stuff if they prove to be good.
> 
> Kind of like loaning out a young footballer to get experience


they do it a bit on buzzcocks.  hardly 'no ones' but not the same big circuit names.  mind, i think that's cos the big names don't want to do buzzcocks much anymore.


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

spanglechick said:


> they do it a bit on buzzcocks. hardly 'no ones' but not the same big circuit names. mind, i think that's cos the big names don't want to do buzzcocks much anymore.


I don't want to watch Buzzcocks any more 

Maybe I'll give it another go at some point.


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

Is there just time to mention I _loathe_ Jack Whitehall.


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## Vintage Paw (May 13, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Is there just time to mention I _loathe_ Jack Whitehall.


 
There's always time to mention that.

Amstell was good.


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## Wilf (May 13, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> There's always time to mention that.


In fact he appears prominently on my _'40 Uses for a Little Cosh'_ list.


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## Red Cat (May 13, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Anyone else getting bored of seeing the same 5 faces doing the comedy panel show circuit? It's all awfully closed-off, isn't it? Like a little, exclusive gated community.


 

I can't watch anything like that - it's like getting a chair and sitting in someone's garden and looking through the folding doors while a bunch of very successful mutually admiring people have a dinner party to which you'll NEVER be invited cos you're not funny, or successful, or an Oxbridge graduate, or rich, or a man.


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

kittyP said:


> I dunno, I think Bill Bailey doesn't totally fit the panel show format like Nobel (even though they are very different).
> I don't think he is ever dodge with Hunter, he just doesn't quite fit in over all.
> Having said that, I still like him on panel shows.


Hmmm. I dunno. I like Bill Bailey, but he was awkward. He, and others, used to have awkward moments with black people on Buzzcocks too. It's a bit sad.

Anyway, Reg Hunter was very clever. He sensed the awkwardness and exposed it (while being funny too), particularly with Hislop, who I really cannot stand.


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## DotCommunist (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> Anyone else find the Obama shooting a basketball in the opening credits racist?


 

I thought that, but thought maybe I was being ott. but now you mention it...


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## kittyP (May 13, 2012)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Hmmm. I dunno. I like Bill Bailey, but he was awkward. He, and others, used to have awkward moments with black people on Buzzcocks too. It's a bit sad.
> 
> Anyway, Reg Hunter was very clever. He sensed the awkwardness and exposed it (while being funny too), particularly with Hislop, who I really cannot stand.


 
I will agree to disagree in regards to BB but Hunter makes my tummy feel squiggly


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## frogwoman (May 13, 2012)

Red Cat said:


> I can't watch anything like that - it's like getting a chair and sitting in someone's garden and looking through the folding doors while a bunch of very successful mutually admiring people have a dinner party to which you'll NEVER be invited cos you're not funny, or successful, or an Oxbridge graduate, or rich, or a man.


 
Does anyone else ever find it annoying how famous people all know and have in jokes with each other that only they find funny? Not that other people don't (i know I do) but a lot of my friends are more funnier than most of the comedians on tv, so why don't they get to go on tv? why is it so "competitive" to get into, even if someone really wanted to do this type of work as a job, but yet it isn't really that competitive if you know the right people (ie went to oxford)


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## frogwoman (May 13, 2012)

Also some of the people that have been on Just a Minute (yeah i know) they're not funny at all, they're just there because they're famous, not because of any talent at being funny

with the exception of paul merton and a few others


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> Does anyone else ever find it annoying how famous people all know and have in jokes with each other that only they find funny? Not that other people don't (i know I do) but a lot of my friends are more funnier than most of the comedians on tv, so why don't they get to go on tv? why is it so "competitive" to get into, even if someone really wanted to do this type of work as a job, but yet it isn't really that competitive if you know the right people (ie went to oxford)


The Oxbridge thing is a biggie probably partly because the producers went there too. Also, the ways to get yourself noticed need financing. I'm not sure how most performers finance their Edinburgh fringe shows, but afaik they always lose money, even when they sell out, so there's another barrier right there.


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> Also some of the people that have been on Just a Minute (yeah i know) they're not funny at all, they're just there because they're famous, not because of any talent at being funny
> 
> with the exception of paul merton and a few others


Yes, that annoys me too. The occasional non-comedian does well - the late Clement Freud, for instance - but a lot of them are lame. Tim Rice ffs. And that bloke out of Yes.


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## Vintage Paw (May 13, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> Does anyone else ever find it annoying how famous people all know and have in jokes with each other that only they find funny? Not that other people don't (i know I do) but a lot of my friends are more funnier than most of the comedians on tv, so why don't they get to go on tv? why is it so "competitive" to get into, even if someone really wanted to do this type of work as a job, but yet it isn't really that competitive if you know the right people (ie went to oxford)


 
It's the same mechanism as with probably all 'culture'-specific professions. Same for the art world. Same for film and tv. Same for publishing. Sure, there are ways and means to get your stuff seen if you're not "one of them," but you likely won't make it into the right* circles unless you are good at networking and getting to know the right people. Some might, but that's not how it generally works.

*Where 'right' means those that lead to any sort of high profile success within whatever is considered 'mainstream' and 'successful' at any given time.


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## frogwoman (May 13, 2012)

Well this is the thing it's "competitive", other industries are competitive too but that doesn't mean they're (that) COMPLETELY closed off to someone who doesn't know loads of famous people already - although a lot of them are tbf


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

I hate Just A Minute. It's horrendous. 30 minutes of awkward, convoluted conversation. It's like my own personal nightmare.


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## frogwoman (May 13, 2012)




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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I hate Just A Minute. It's horrendous. 30 minutes of awkward, convoluted conversation. It's like my own personal nightmare.


The awkwardness is essential. Nicholas Parsons is genuinely clueless - he's not putting it on - and that's what makes it work so well, imo.

Still, I'm sorry I haven't a clue is still the best show on radio and has been for decades.


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## butchersapron (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I hate Just A Minute. It's horrendous. 30 minutes of awkward, convoluted conversation. It's like my own personal nightmare.


That's just radio 4 isn't it?


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Still, I'm sorry I haven't a clue is still the best show on radio and has been for decades.


Yes!


butchersapron said:


> That's just radio 4 isn't it?


No!


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## Vintage Paw (May 13, 2012)

When I started my Masters and PhD at uni, we had sessions on how to 'network' efficiently. This isn't in a business course. Or law. Or anything that you might consider having a vaguely worthwhile reason for knowing this. This is in the humanities. English lit, history, and so on. Because it was made very clear to us that unless you know how to network and are prepared to put the time into doing so, you will not become in any way successful in your field. Success being defined ultimately by getting a job at the end of it.

Academia isn't about just being skilled with what you know about your subject. Your subject has to include how to brown-nose and how to appear interested in other people's guff, and how to smarm your way into knowing the right people, being seen in the right places, and so on.

There's an element of that, I would argue, in every single profession. I expect there are countless examples of people at Tesco getting the promotion to shift manager because they were more friendly with the manager than the other person who was going for the job but who was actually more reliable and efficient.

It's just more magnified in things like the arts, because those things are so exclusive to begin with. They rely in part on that gate-keeping function for the audience as well, because once the audience feels like it's 'in on the joke' or 'gets the point of the piece of art' then they feel special and continue to patronise it. So gate-keeping works on all sorts of levels, in that regard.


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## binka (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> Anyone else find the Obama shooting a basketball in the opening credits racist?


as others have said he is relatively well known for liking basketball (in america that is, i wouldnt say it was a particularly well known fact in this country). however with bush it was throwing a dart into a map of the middle east (because he loved starting wars there) did the producers of hignfy think 'oh well he likes basketball that will do'? biting satire. so it is lazy and shit and quite possibly motivated by racism. they could have done something about libya, or economics or letting down the people who voted for him/change but no they went for 'the black man likes his basketball'


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## littlebabyjesus (May 13, 2012)

I agree, binka. Biting satire it is not.


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## Lord Camomile (May 13, 2012)

I think it was more that they didn't want to take as much of a swipe at Obama as they did at Bush. It was probably created when Obama was still the 'cool' president. Hell, it could even be argued that that's what they were commenting on, the 'cool president' image that has been cultivated over the merits of his policies.


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## butchersapron (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I think it was more that they didn't want to take as much of a swipe at Obama as they did at Bush. It was probably created when Obama was still the 'cool' president. Hell, it could even be argued that that's what they were commenting on, the 'cool president' image that has been cultivated over the merits of his policies.


It's because they're BBC liberals.


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I think it was more that they didn't want to take as much of a swipe at Obama as they did at Bush. It was probably created when Obama was still the 'cool' president. Hell, it could even be argued that that's what they were commenting on, the 'cool president' image that has been cultivated over the merits of his policies.


The opening credits have been updated for this season - obamas bit remains the same.


Lord Camomile said:


> His nickname was "Barry O'Bomber."


Uncanny


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## biggus dickus (May 13, 2012)

You could just not watch it....


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

> Maggot said: ↑
> I really don't give a toss - as long as they're funny.





Vintage Paw said:


> Hitler was funny
> 
> (Perhaps.)


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## goldenecitrone (May 13, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Hitler was funny
> 
> (Perhaps.)


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## ska invita (May 13, 2012)

binka said:


> as others have said he is relatively well known for liking basketball (in america that is, i wouldnt say it was a particularly well known fact in this country). however with bush it was throwing a dart into a map of the middle east (because he loved starting wars there) d*id the producers of hignfy think* 'oh well he likes basketball that will do'? biting satire. so it is lazy and shit and quite possibly motivated by racism. they could have done something about libya, or economics or letting down the people who voted for him/change but no they went for 'the black man likes his basketball'


agree 100%. Just to say though, i doubt the credits are done by committee, just one person i imagine. Still, I'm sure someone checks it and passes it.

Also look out for poor taste jokes at the expense of Chinese people on HIGNFY, usually delivered by the guest presenter and read from the autocue - jokes fresh from the 70s. Usually one every couple of episodes it seems. As an aside it seems to me there are no people of Chinese/Asian Other heritage on UK TV... they're pretty much as big a minority as any other in the UK... Gok Wan is the only one I can think, lord elp us

Proportion of UK population 2001 Census
Indian 1,053,411 1.8%
Pakistani 747,285 1.3%
White Irish 691,232 1.2%
Mixed race 677,117 1.2%
Black Caribbean 565,876 1.0%
Black African 485,277 0.8%
Bangladeshi 283,063 0.5%
Chinese 247,403 0.4% + Other Asian (non-Chinese) 247,644 0.4% =  0.8% 
Black (others) 97,585 0.2%


----------



## CNT36 (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> agree 100%. Just to say though, i doubt the credits are done by committee, just one person i imagine. Still, I'm sure someone checks it and passes it.
> 
> Also look out for poor taste jokes at the expense of Chinese people on HIGNFY, usually delivered by the guest presenter and read from the autocue - jokes fresh from the 70s. Usually one every couple of episodes it seems. As an aside it seems to me there are no people of Chinese/Asian Other heritage on UK TV... they're pretty much as big a minority as any other in the UK... Gok Wan is the only one I can think, lord elp us
> 
> ...


He seems to take up well over 0.4% of UK tv schedules single handedly.


----------



## laptop (May 13, 2012)

CNT36 said:


> He seems to take up well over 0.4% of UK tv schedules single handedly.


 
Surely grounds for some sort of collective defamation case?


----------



## CNT36 (May 13, 2012)

Finally a cause to believe in.


----------



## Ranbay (May 13, 2012)




----------



## Captain Hurrah (May 13, 2012)

killer b said:


> your life appears to be entirely without context.


 
One maggot is blind to.  He does give a toss though.  A while ago, without self-awareness, maggot got into a huff about something and implied on another thread that all working class people are thick and nasty and incapable of being clever and witty like middle class people.


----------



## Stigmata (May 13, 2012)

ska invita said:


> agree 100%. Just to say though, i doubt the credits are done by committee, just one person i imagine. Still, I'm sure someone checks it and passes it.
> 
> Also look out for poor taste jokes at the expense of Chinese people on HIGNFY, usually delivered by the guest presenter and read from the autocue - jokes fresh from the 70s. Usually one every couple of episodes it seems. As an aside it seems to me there are no people of Chinese/Asian Other heritage on UK TV... they're pretty much as big a minority as any other in the UK... Gok Wan is the only one I can think, lord elp us


 
And Alexa Chung, not much better


----------



## binka (May 13, 2012)

kevin fong has done a few half decent documentaries for channel four and bbc and his family is from a chinese background


----------



## Cid (May 14, 2012)

binka said:


> as others have said he is relatively well known for liking basketball (in america that is, i wouldnt say it was a particularly well known fact in this country). however with bush it was throwing a dart into a map of the middle east (because he loved starting wars there) did the producers of hignfy think 'oh well he likes basketball that will do'? biting satire. so it is lazy and shit and quite possibly motivated by racism. they could have done something about libya, or economics or letting down the people who voted for him/change but no they went for 'the black man likes his basketball'


 
Given that they changed the intro as soon as they changed the president, that would have been remarkably prescient.


----------



## gosub (May 14, 2012)

first series after Obama bacame President, animation was Obama scores a basket, changed it for the next onwards


----------



## Maggot (May 14, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Yes, private school dominance says nothing whatsoever about society. Ha ha.


In the field of politics, yes - but a quiz show host - does that really matter?


----------



## DrRingDing (May 14, 2012)

Maggot said:


> In the field of politics, yes - but a quiz show host - does that really matter?


 
Yes. HIGNFY especially.


----------



## butchersapron (May 14, 2012)

Maggot said:


> In the field of politics, yes - but a quiz show host - does that really matter?


Yes  it does


----------



## weepiper (May 14, 2012)

Maggot said:


> In the field of politics, yes - but a quiz show host - does that really matter?


 
Of course it does, if the only people you ever see being witty and commanding on telly are posh white boys the message you receive if you are part of the large proportion of the public that is not posh, white or male is 'you can't be witty and commanding because you're not like us, so don't even try to break into this'.


----------



## Maggot (May 14, 2012)

weepiper said:


> Of course it does, if the only people you ever see being witty and commanding on telly are posh white boys the message you receive if you are part of the large proportion of the public that is not posh, white or male is 'you can't be witty and commanding because you're not like us, so don't even try to break into this'.


But there are plenty of good comedians on telly who aren't posh white boys. Paul Merton, Danny Baker and Reginald D Hunter to but a name a few of the regulars on HIGNFY.

And what has being commanding got to do with it?


----------



## weepiper (May 14, 2012)

Maggot said:


> But there are plenty of good comedians on telly who aren't posh white boys. Paul Merton, Danny Baker and Reginald D Hunter to but a name a few of the regulars on HIGNFY.
> 
> And what has being commanding got to do with it?


 
They're guests, not hosts. And I wouldn't call three examples 'plenty'.


----------



## zoooo (May 14, 2012)

Frank Skinner, John Bishop, Jo Brand, Lee Mack, Jack Dee, Rhod Gilbert, Bill Bailey, Miranda Hart, Jeremy Clarkson, Kathy Burke and William Shatner have all hosted HIGNFY (or are about to).

There's a complete list here http://www.comedy.co.uk/guide/tv/hignfy/episodes/43/

Miranda's quite posh, but she's not the 'white male Etonian' you seem to be angered by. The rest of them (and numerous others) seem to disprove your theory somewhat.


----------



## Maggot (May 14, 2012)

weepiper said:


> They're guests, not hosts. And I wouldn't call three examples 'plenty'.


But they are on TV, being witty which is what you were talking about. 

It doesn't need a large number to disprove your thing about 'only posh white boys being witty and commanding on telly'.


----------



## stuff_it (May 14, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Hitler was funny
> 
> (Perhaps.)


I expect everyone laughed at his jokes....


----------



## claphamboy (May 14, 2012)

stuff_it said:


> I expect everyone laughed at his jokes....


 
Have you not seen his youtube clips?

He's even done one about that dog Fenton/Benton chasing deer on Richmond Park, and the one about Griffin & the BNP was funny as fuck.


----------



## frogwoman (May 14, 2012)

claphamboy said:


> Have you not seen his youtube clips?
> 
> He's even done one about that dog Fenton/Benton chasing deer on Richmond Park, and the one about Griffin & the BNP was funny as fuck.


 
i've only seen one of those clips i found funny. ruin of an excellent film, probably one of the greatest films of all time imo.


----------



## claphamboy (May 14, 2012)

Wasn't there a urban75 version too, done by pk, IIRC.


----------



## weepiper (May 14, 2012)

zoooo said:


> Frank Skinner, John Bishop, Jo Brand, Lee Mack, Jack Dee, Rhod Gilbert, Bill Bailey, Miranda Hart, Jeremy Clarkson, Kathy Burke and William Shatner have all hosted HIGNFY (or are about to).
> 
> There's a complete list here http://www.comedy.co.uk/guide/tv/hignfy/episodes/43/
> 
> Miranda's quite posh, but she's not the 'white male Etonian' you seem to be angered by. The rest of them (and numerous others) seem to disprove your theory somewhat.


 
Bill Bailey, Jeremy Clarkson, Miranda Hart all went to private school but fair enough about the rest. There is a definite bias towards privately educated people appearing on television in any presenting role and if you can't see it then you must be not paying attention though


----------



## ymu (May 14, 2012)

weepiper said:


> a) wrong forum and b) Paul Merton is the son of a train driver, grew up in a council flat and went to a comp, so save the face-rearranging for Hislop et al.


Yep. They had a really shit episode a couple of weeks ago, with Nancy Dell'Olio (professional posh flirt), Clarkson and some other bloke who spent the whole show - along with Hislop - with their tongues hanging out whilst Merton just looked disgusted with the lot of them. They should have teamed him up with someone like Rhona Cameron, but nooo, let's have three blokes trying to prove how heterosexual they are. 

It's a tired old show, but Merton is not part of that club.


----------



## Maggot (May 14, 2012)

weepiper said:


> Bill Bailey, Jeremy Clarkson, Miranda Hart all went to private school but fair enough about the rest. There is a definite bias towards privately educated people appearing on television in any presenting role and if you can't see it then you must be not paying attention though


 I can't see it, because I can't tell what sort of school they went to, from their presenting style.


----------



## discokermit (May 14, 2012)

pretty much everyone on telly is a cunt.


----------



## weepiper (May 14, 2012)

Maggot said:


> I can't see it, because I can't tell what sort of school they went to, from their presenting style.


 
Really? _Really? _Clarkson, Hislop? If you say so 

It's not really about being able to tell what sort of school they went to anyway, it's about what that bought for them in terms of networking opportunities/favours/foot in the door chances.


----------



## frogwoman (May 14, 2012)

claphamboy said:


> Wasn't there a urban75 version too, done by pk, IIRC.


 
i hope not. complete waste, ruin of a great film.


----------



## Maggot (May 14, 2012)

weepiper said:


> Really? _Really? _Clarkson, Hislop? If you say so


The only way I know about Hislop's education is cos they keep mentioning it on the show.


----------



## zoooo (May 14, 2012)

Either way, and without wanting to state the bleeding obvious, having been sent to private school doesn't automatically make you 'fucking scum' any more than being working class does.

You may (or may not) have a point about there being a high number of poshos on the telly, but statements like that are silly.


----------



## discokermit (May 14, 2012)

zoooo said:


> Either way, and without wanting to state the bleeding obvious, having been sent to private school doesn't automatically make you 'fucking scum' any more than being working class does.


yes, but they _choose_ to work in television. that makes them fucking scum.


----------



## weltweit (May 14, 2012)

discokermit said:


> yes, but they _choose_ to work in television. that makes them fucking scum.


 
I don't call this - scum ...


----------



## discokermit (May 14, 2012)

i do. he should get a proper job and a haircut. i bet he's unbearable at parties.


----------



## Wilf (May 14, 2012)

imagine pulling up at traffic lights with a gunshot victim in the back. You desperately want the hospital and you see Bill Bailey and ask him where it is.  Be a fucking nightmare, going on about goblins and stuff. In those circumstances you'd want somebody sensible like Lionel Blair or Gary Glitter.


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 14, 2012)

zoooo said:


> Frank Skinner, John Bishop, Jo Brand, Lee Mack, Jack Dee, Rhod Gilbert, Bill Bailey, Miranda Hart, Jeremy Clarkson, Kathy Burke and William Shatner have all hosted HIGNFY (or are about to).
> 
> There's a complete list here http://www.comedy.co.uk/guide/tv/hignfy/episodes/43/





> Episode 7: Scheduled: Fri 25th May 2012 @ 9pm on BBC1
> 
> Star Trek icon William Shatner takes to the Have I Got News For You host's chair. Team captains Ian Hislop and Paul Merton are joined by guest panellists Andy Hamilton and Charlie Brooker.


----------



## discokermit (May 14, 2012)

Wilf said:


> imagine pulling up at traffic lights with a gunshot victim in the back. You desperately want the hospital and you see Bill Bailey and ask him where it is. Be a fucking nightmare, going on about goblins and stuff. In those circumstances you'd want somebody sensible like Lionel Blair or Gary Glitter.


blair would start tap dancing and glitter would keep asking about your kids and if you wanted to be in "his gang" and flashing his nipples.

like i say, cunts.


----------



## Wilf (May 14, 2012)

discokermit said:


> blair would start tap dancing and glitter would keep asking about your kids and if you wanted to be in "his gang" and flashing his nipples.
> 
> like i say, cunts.


Fair enough. Maybe HIGNFY needs to pass to a younger generation, say Joseph Barton or that dog off Britain's got Talent.


----------



## discokermit (May 14, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Fair enough. Maybe HIGNFY needs to pass to a younger generation, say Joseph Barton or that dog off Britain's got Talent.


i'd rather spend an evening with either of them than bill bailey. mind you, i bet that dog is proper up himself now.


----------



## purenarcotic (May 14, 2012)

zoooo said:


> Either way, and without wanting to state the bleeding obvious, having been sent to private school doesn't automatically make you 'fucking scum' any more than being working class does.
> 
> You may (or may not) have a point about there being a high number of poshos on the telly, but statements like that are silly.


 
I don't think anybody has been saying that people who go to private school are scum.   Their point is that there is a pervasive and prevalent 'old boys network' that seems to favour and open more doors for those who went to private schools vs average joe, who may be just as funny, but lack the opportunities private school can afford you.


----------



## youngian (May 14, 2012)

This programme has convinced me that 40 something old Etonians should stick to presenting HIGNFY and playing potential terrorists in Homeland or cops in the Wire.


----------



## killer b (May 14, 2012)

purenarcotic said:


> I don't think anybody has been saying that people who go to private school are scum.


tbf, the OP did. but i think he may have been using hyperbole to make a point.


----------



## DexterTCN (May 15, 2012)

William fucking Shatner!   Excellent.


----------



## tar1984 (May 15, 2012)

claphamboy said:


> Wasn't there a urban75 version too, done by pk, IIRC.


 
I remember being amused by this, but I have no idea what the subject matter was


----------



## killer b (May 15, 2012)

a huge list of urban injokes. it was quite well done, but would be utterly meaningless to anyone who hasn't spent the last 8 years or so posting here...


----------



## tar1984 (May 15, 2012)

killer b said:


> a huge list of urban injokes. it was quite well done, but would be utterly meaningless to anyone who hasn't spent the last 8 years or so posting here...


 
'Hitler banned from urban 75'.  I just looked it up but the creator has removed the video, the dick


----------



## Badgers (May 15, 2012)

tar1984 said:
			
		

> 'Hitler banned from urban 75'.  I just looked it up but the creator has removed the video, the dick



It was fine work


----------



## tar1984 (May 15, 2012)

Badgers said:


> It was fine work


 
It really was.


----------



## biggus dickus (May 15, 2012)

I think it depends on the talent of the host and nothing else. Angus Deayton was good, no idea how posh he is but he's definitely posh. When they have a good host and guests it's good, when they don't it's not
QI is better because Stephen Fry is good at hosting it, sometimes people just don't get it
Paul Merton can be just as annoying as any of the posh people, his jokes have a 50% hit rate at the best of times and you can tell that they have cut him loads because some of his jokes are embarrasingly bad 
It's always been kind of mediocore, but plenty of people watch it...


----------



## George & Bill (May 15, 2012)

binka said:


> as others have said he is relatively well known for liking basketball (in america that is, i wouldnt say it was a particularly well known fact in this country). however with bush it was throwing a dart into a map of the middle east (because he loved starting wars there) did the producers of hignfy think 'oh well he likes basketball that will do'? biting satire. so it is lazy and shit and quite possibly motivated by racism. they could have done something about libya, or economics or letting down the people who voted for him/change but no they went for 'the black man likes his basketball'



I agree with this - it doesn't in fact have to be motivated by racism for it to fit fairly obviously into a racist narrative in a way that ought to be clear to those involved. If Obama had famously eaten fried chicken on TV to illustrate his love of Southern home cooking, could that image's nominal basis in fact justify the obvious de facto racism?


----------



## Maggot (May 16, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> If Obama had famously eaten fried chicken on TV to illustrate his love of Southern home cooking, could that image's nominal basis in fact justify the obvious de facto racism?


 
 Brilliant.

Obvious racism!


----------



## gosub (May 16, 2012)

nope still don't get how an animation of Obama enagaging in basketball, a perfectly repectable sport, is racist. Presumably, Wikipedia is racist too for having :




Obama taking a shot during a game on the White House basketball court, 2009. 

or anyone who reported on his game of one on one with George Clooney last week 


This thread is beyond parody


----------



## Superdupastupor (May 16, 2012)

look at that whitey failing to achieve lift off.


----------



## George & Bill (May 16, 2012)

Maggot said:


> Brilliant.
> 
> Obvious racism!



He is the first black president of the US, and they have chosen to depict him playing basketball.


----------



## gosub (May 16, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> He is the first black president of the US, and they have chosen to depict him playing basketball.


As opposed to Bush jnr, depicted deciding foreign policy by throwing darts at a world map


----------



## George & Bill (May 16, 2012)

gosub said:


> As opposed to Bush jnr, depicted deciding foreign policy by throwing darts at a world map



What's the connection? The point is that he's the first black man to do the job, and they depict him doing something stereotypically black - the researchers behind the animation no doubt have perfectly specific and non-racial motivations, but a large part of the viewing public wont know this, and in their minds such tired stereotypes will be reinforced.


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> He is the first black president of the US, and they have chosen to depict him playing basketball.


So they should have wilfully not portrayed him playing basketball, because he's black? They should have treated him differently, because he's black? Or should Obama not be into such a stereotypically black hobby?

As I said earlier in the thread, it's akin to Clinton playing sax. Both are slightly odd pastimes for presidents, who are normally thought to engage in more stately activities, and are thus obvious sources of material for comedy.

Fucker plays B-Ball, they riffed on that, not much more to it than that really.


----------



## killer b (May 17, 2012)

he probably enjoys eating watermelon too. why didn't they have him eating a big slice of watermelon, and perhaps grinning toothily at the camera? that too wouldn't be racist.

ffs.


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 17, 2012)

Is he _famous _for liking watermelon? Did his own campaign highlight the fact he likes watermelon?

His affection for basketball is a well-known facet of his persona, it's part of the Obama image, so it's really not that perverse to riff on that for comedic effect.

It's discussions like this when I can never tell if someone's trolling or not


----------



## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> So they should have wilfully not portrayed him playing basketball, because he's black? They should have treated him differently, because he's black? Or should Obama not be into such a stereotypically black hobby?
> 
> As I said earlier in the thread, it's akin to Clinton playing sax. Both are slightly odd pastimes for presidents, who are normally thought to engage in more stately activities, and are thus obvious sources of material for comedy.
> 
> Fucker plays B-Ball, they riffed on that, not much more to it than that really.



If he was the first jewish president, and also happened to be known to be filthy rich, would it be unproblematic for him to be depicted lounging in a pile of gold bullion?


----------



## killer b (May 17, 2012)

he isn't famous for liking basketball ffs. he's famous for being the president of the USA. they could have picked a thousand less racially loaded things to go with.


----------



## killer b (May 17, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> It's discussions like this when I can never tell if someone's trolling or not


discussions like this make me wonder whether some people are being some kind of dullard 'devils advocate' wankers, or really are that thick.


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> If he was the first jewish president, and also happened to be known to be filthy rich, would it be unproblematic for him to be depicted lounging in a pile of gold bullion?


Yup, no problem at all.





killer b said:


> he isn't famous for liking basketball ffs. he's famous for being the president of the USA.


Ok, if we really want to play pedantry corner, he famously likes basketball. It is a well known fact about him. It has been used in many photo ops.





killer b said:


> they could have picked a thousand less racially loaded things to go with.


Such as...? And even if they could, why should they?!

You're the real racist for making the connection between him liking basketball and him being black. I didn't even notice.


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 17, 2012)

killer b said:


> discussions like this make me wonder whether some people are being some kind of dullard 'devils advocate' wankers, or really are that thick.


Can't we be both?


----------



## killer b (May 17, 2012)

if you like.


----------



## SLK (May 17, 2012)

weltweit said:


> I don't call this - scum ...




He's maybe not scum. But he's out of order. Him, Al Murray, and another comedian whose name escapes me - were on the bill for a gig. There were about 50 people in the audience. It was expected to have about 400. However it was raining and England were playing some world cup quarter final.

He arrived, saw that his fifth of the entrance fee wasn't enough for him, and refused to do his 25 minutes and went home.

The other main comedian did the same.

To be fair to the promoter, he gave the money back to all those present. Al Murray was outraged and did a free 2 hour gig. But even so.


----------



## goldenecitrone (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> What's the connection? The point is that he's the first black man to do the job, and they depict him doing something stereotypically black.


 
Playing basketball isn't stereotypically black though. It's a worldwide sport.


----------



## Maggot (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> What's the connection? The point is that he's the first black man to do the job, and they depict him doing something stereotypically black - the researchers behind the animation no doubt have perfectly specific and non-racial motivations, but a large part of the viewing public wont know this, and in their minds such tired stereotypes will be reinforced.


 
Oh no!  Wouldn't it be terrible if the great viewing public thought that black people enjoyed playing basketball.


----------



## Orang Utan (May 17, 2012)

So racism isn't bad if you only attribute positive qualities to a stereotype?


----------



## zoooo (May 17, 2012)

I think of basketball as stereotypically American, rather than black. Despite that, I can kind of see both sides of this argument. And despite _that_, it's getting a bit boring now. It's not like you're all going to convince each other and end up agreeing if you discuss it long enough.


----------



## Maggot (May 17, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> So racism isn't bad if you only attribute positive qualities to a stereotype?


Racism is about hatred, so if the qualities are positive, then they're not racist.


----------



## goldenecitrone (May 17, 2012)

zoooo said:


> I think of basketball as stereotypically American, rather than black. Despite that, I can kind of see both sides of this argument. And despite _that_, it's getting a bit boring now. It's not like you're all going to convince each other and end up agreeing if you discuss it long enough.


 
Yep, it's an American sport that's been taken up worldwide and is played by loads of different people. It's like saying cricket is stereotypically white.


----------



## butchersapron (May 17, 2012)

Yeah, they're really good at dancing that lot, natural rhythm. 






			
				Maggot said:
			
		

> Racism is about hatred, so if the qualities are positive, then they're not racist.


----------



## Orang Utan (May 17, 2012)

Maggot said:


> Racism is about hatred, so if the qualities are positive, then they're not racist.


How naive. Positive attributes can reflect and reinforce negative attitudes


----------



## DexterTCN (May 17, 2012)

Fucks sake. He plays the fucking game all the time, he likes it.


----------



## gosub (May 17, 2012)

Not ALL the time. Suggesting that you give a black bloke the top job in the world and all he'll do is play basketball, would be racist.. But I don't think HIGNFY does that.. 
I think moreover this thread plays into the political correctness gone mad hands. People do get genuinely fucked over by racism and it should be tackled. This just belittles the issue


----------



## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

Maggot said:


> Racism is about hatred, so if the qualities are positive, then they're not racist.



Oh dear - with this remark you've really ceased to be someone I can think of it as worthwhile to discuss this with.


----------



## butchersapron (May 17, 2012)

On this basketball thing - it's not consciously and deliberately racist, it could quite easily be seen as a very good example of the sort of unconscious coding that underpins the way social groups organise their prejudices and their worldview that Barthes used to examine so powerfully - and that appear to them (and is imposed on others) as just basic common sense, _people like us - well educated, in good well paying creative jobs - are by definition free of that sort of nasty prejudice._


----------



## Maggot (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> Oh dear - with this remark you've really ceased to be someone I can think of it as worthwhile to disciss this with.


In other words you can't think of a decent response.

How would you define racism then?


----------



## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

People are saying that Obama's famous for being US President, and that he's famous for playing basketball. The former is undeniably true, and the latter may be in some people's eyes. But he's also undeniably extremely famous for being the first black president. Most famous black people, or people of any given colour, are not famous for their colour - but those who are will inevitably draw out and accentuate any racial symbolism that comes near them.


----------



## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

Maggot said:


> In other words you can't think of a decent response.
> 
> How would you define racism then?



Racism is anything that reduces someone to ethnic traits - whether the specific traits are good or bad. Others have pointed this out since you posted your incredibly ignorant remark.


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 17, 2012)

Hate to say it but in this instance I'd agree with slowjoe. Racism isn't just about 'negative' stereotypes, it's about making any sweeping assumptions about someone based on their race.

However, I don't think that's what's happening here. He plays basketball, has done since he was a kid. It has been a major part of his PR that he plays basketball. With all this in mind, I don't think it's out of order for HIGNFY to reference it. Sure, it's glib and superficial, but that's what they're working with. I'm actually honestly unsure what would be the equivalent for Bush - what the hell did he like to do aside from fall off Segways? Golf, I suppose. Would it be racist to portray him playing golf? Or is that an inclusive sport?

Why can't we all just get along?


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> People are saying that Obama's famous for being US President, and that he's famous for playing basketball. The former is undeniably true, and the latter may be in some people's eyes. But he's also undeniably extremely famous for being the first black president. Most famous black people, or people of any given colour, are not famous for their colour - but those who are will inevitably draw out and accentuate any racial symbolism that comes near them.


But the basketball isn't racial symbolism! It's just his hobby! Why do the fact he's black and the fact he likes basketball have to be linked?


----------



## spanglechick (May 17, 2012)

Isn't the point of that sequence the fact that the basketball hoop becomes a halo over his head, referencing the hyperbole in the liberal media re: the impossible hopes for what obama's presidency would mean? The basketball, referencing race, was surely a knowing part of that 'gag'.


----------



## London_Calling (May 17, 2012)

Good shot!

You don't think there are many of these in the leafy, whitey 'burbs'?







Fwiw, it's decent exercise; it's outdoors, a little banter with the sweat, or play with the kids - nice way to spend 30-45 minutes after work.


----------



## joustmaster (May 17, 2012)

the basket ball doesn't say racism to me. it just point out that he is a "cool" type of person, compared to our leaders cringeworthy attempts at social and sporting activities. And that its basketball because he plays a lot, publicly, for attention - and - its a huge american sport.


----------



## London_Calling (May 17, 2012)

gosub said:


> This thread is beyond parody


It's like the Daily Mash version of Urban.

It'd be embarrassing if it wasn't so comically stupid.


----------



## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

London_Calling said:


> It's like the Daily Mash version of Urban.
> 
> It'd be embarrassing if it wasn't so comically stupid.



It's quite possible to be both embarrassing and comically stupid, as your posts sometimes demonstrate.


----------



## frogwoman (May 17, 2012)

Maggot said:


> Racism is about hatred, so if the qualities are positive, then they're not racist.


 
Wrong.


----------



## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> But the basketball isn't racial symbolism! It's just his hobby! Why do the fact he's black and the fact he likes basketball have to be linked?



It's a symbol that may or may not have racial implications, as you can discern from the various responses to this thread. 

But whether the particular symbol is racially charged, or sufficiently charged to make it problematic, isnt the main pont, as I attempted to explain earlier; the point is that if the observation depicted in the animation could be widely interpreted as racial, rather than personal - and the fact that Obama's profile is inextricably linked to his race incases the likelyhood of this - then the image is problematic, by virtue of how it will be read, even if it has a perfectly legitimate origin in an observation of a specific individial.


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## The Boy (May 17, 2012)

Since when did basketball = black?

Honest question.


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## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

The Boy said:


> Since when did basketball = black?
> 
> Honest question.



Do you understand that two things can be connected, or can be constructed as to be suggestive of each other in a particular way, without equalling eachother?


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## joustmaster (May 17, 2012)

The Boy said:


> Since when did basketball = black?
> 
> Honest question.


it does, if you are racist.


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## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

joustmaster said:


> it does, if you are racist.



Lol, that's the same cowardly and lame argument that people use to defend all sorts of dubious imagery - "you're the one who's racist for making the connection, I'm colourblind, me!".


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## London_Calling (May 17, 2012)

The Boy said:


> Since when did basketball = black?
> 
> Honest question.


It depends how provincial you are, esp. how much you really, really think you know about the culture in question when you basically you know nothing excpet what you've seen on the telly.


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## London_Calling (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> It's quite possible to be both embarrassing and comically stupid, as your posts sometimes demonstrate.


Thank you, The Offenderati's USA Basketball Correspondent.


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## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

London_Calling said:


> It depends how provincial you are, esp. how much you really, really think you know about the culture in question when you basically you know nothing excpet what you've seen on the telly.



Er, you do know that we're talking about whether a stereotype exists among the British viewing public, not whether black people actually have a predeliction for baksetball?


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## London_Calling (May 17, 2012)

I'm really not going to engage you. Sorry. Have a happy offence.


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## butchersapron (May 17, 2012)

LOL someone who goes around looking for things not to be offended about.


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## Lord Camomile (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> It's a symbol that may or may not have racial implications, as you can discern from the various responses to this thread.
> 
> But whether the particular symbol is racially charged, or sufficiently charged to make it problematic, isnt the main pont, as I attempted to explain earlier; the point is that if the observation depicted in the animation could be widely interpreted as racial, rather than personal - and the fact that Obama's profile is inextricably linked to his race incases the likelyhood of this - then the image is problematic, by virtue of how it will be read, even if it has a perfectly legitimate origin in an observation of a specific individial.


Perhaps. I might concede _perhaps_. But I still think in this instance the charge grossly outweighs the offence.


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## gosub (May 17, 2012)

London_Calling said:


> It depends how provincial you are, esp. how much you really, really think you know about the culture in question when you basically you know nothing excpet what you've seen on the telly.


 When I played at school (in the provinces) best player in our team was Cantonese


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## The Boy (May 17, 2012)

This thread is pretty special, it has to be said.


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## joustmaster (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> Lol, that's the same cowardly and lame argument that people use to defend all sorts of dubious imagery - "you're the one who's racist for making the connection, I'm colourblind, me!".


i was making fun of you.
any way, i can't be called racist, one of my best friends is black


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## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

As an asside, I haven't noticed anyone being offended. Some people have remarked that an image may inadvertently invoke racial stereotypes. But I realise that for some people, the terrain between offense and indifference is fairly arid.


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## Jon-of-arc (May 17, 2012)

Basketball is well racist.


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## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

joustmaster said:


> i was making fun of you.
> any way, i can't be called racist, one of my best friends is black



you do realise that to make fun of someone, it has to make sense to other people?


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## joustmaster (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> you do realise that to make fun of someone, it has to make sense to other people?


i'm not sure if thats true


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## weltweit (May 17, 2012)

The issue that is uppermost is that Obama misses the hoop, his ball bouncing on both sides of the metalwork before going to the side. I was pretty sure there was an intro where he got the ball in the hoop, but perhaps I am mistaken.


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## gosub (May 17, 2012)

weltweit said:


> The issue that is uppermost is that Obama misses the hoop, his ball bouncing on both sides of the metalwork before going to the side. I was pretty sure there was an intro where he got the ball in the hoop, but perhaps I am mistaken.


First year of his term was scoring a basket


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## butchersapron (May 17, 2012)

gosub said:


> First year of his term was scoring a basket


Which surely proves that the cartoon is _saying something_?


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## Captain Hurrah (May 17, 2012)

London_Calling said:


> It depends how provincial you are, esp. how much you really, really think you know about the culture in question when you basically you know nothing excpet what you've seen on the telly.


 
lol.


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## Jon-of-arc (May 17, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Which surely proves that the cartoon is _saying something_?



And that something is "look at that black bastard.."


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## gosub (May 17, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Which surely proves that the cartoon is _saying something_?


That can do no wrong Obama isn't all he's cracked up to be


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## butchersapron (May 17, 2012)

Jon-of-arc said:


> And that something is "look at that black bastard.."


Is that a statement or a question?

Do you think it says that? I don't. I think it says something about liberal hopes and expectations - hopes and expectations often based on a sort of unconscious racialisation of social life.


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## London_Calling (May 17, 2012)

I fancy a game of darts this lunchtime - does anyone know any fat northerners?


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## butchersapron (May 17, 2012)

gosub said:


> That can do no wrong Obama isn't all he's cracked up to be


So you agree that it does say something? Rather than with those on the thread who say that it says nothing?


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## Orang Utan (May 17, 2012)

London_Calling said:


> Thank you, The Offenderati's USA Basketball Correspondent.


HOUSE!


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## gosub (May 17, 2012)

London_Calling said:


> I fancy a game of darts this lunchtime - does anyone know any fat northerners?


GW Bush plays darts apparently


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## George & Bill (May 17, 2012)

joustmaster said:


> i'm not sure if thats true



Well, if you can gain satisfaction from making fun of people in such a way that no-one except you gets, then great - you must gain a great sense of freedom from that.


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## joustmaster (May 17, 2012)

slowjoe said:


> Well, if you can gain satisfaction from making fun of people in such a way that no-one except you gets, then great - you must gain a great sense of freedom from that.


ffs


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## biggus dickus (May 17, 2012)

basketball is probably the 2nd most popular sport in the world after football


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## DexterTCN (May 17, 2012)

fishing


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## DexterTCN (May 17, 2012)

fishing, poker, watching telly, arguing, football, women's volleyball, basketball

I'd put aussie rules football in there but it's not a sport.


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## weltweit (May 17, 2012)

DexterTCN said:


> I'd put aussie rules football in there but it's not a sport.


Bloody is !!


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## biggus dickus (May 18, 2012)

Fishing is a hobby, poker is a game, arguing is a thing, womens volleyball is only popular when the olympics are on far away so you can watch the bikini volleyball with a hangover


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## Jeff Robinson (May 18, 2012)

The famous upper class warrior Kathy Burke is presenting tonight. I wonder what rough justice she will be subjected to for her anti-werking clarse activities courtesy of Dr Ring Bring and his merry band?


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## butchersapron (May 18, 2012)

Well done Jeff. Well done. No case to answer here at all obviously. No case to be made for the existence of elite dominance of state institutions because Kathy Burke - the liberals simply wonderful w/c fav actor - is on a program. Nothing to see here. Keep laughing. Using _latin_ if possible.


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## Jeff Robinson (May 18, 2012)

Like Paul Merton, she needs her face re-arranging.


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## butchersapron (May 18, 2012)

Odd on how examination your violence is so weak isn't it jeff? Like Polly Toybnee swearing on the bus.


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## binka (May 18, 2012)

i thought it was good tonight. mostly because kathy burke is brilliant and its obvious paul merton likes her so that seemed to make him up his game too.

funny you should mention anti working class jeff because tonight hislop mentioned the completely untrue story of the sun reading mob who attacked the paediatricians house. i bet he knows it isnt true as well.


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## Jeff Robinson (May 18, 2012)

binka said:


> i thought it was good tonight. mostly because kathy burke is brilliant and its obvious paul merton likes her so that seemed to make him up his game too.
> 
> funny you should mention anti working class jeff because tonight hislop mentioned the completely untrue story of the sun reading mob who attacked the paediatricians house. i bet he knows it isnt true as well.


 
A doctor was attacked wasn't he? Not sure there was any evidence that it was the sun wot made them done it though. Hislop is an arse obviously.


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## Jeff Robinson (May 18, 2012)

Just googled it. Happened during the hysterical News of the Screws anti-paedo campaign. I think it's plausable that there was some causal connection between the two.




> Dr Cloete is the latest victim to have been wrongly identified by anti-paedophile campaigners in the wave of protests which have swept the country following the News of the World's campaign to "name and shame" alleged sex offenders.
> 
> Five families who were wrongly identified as harbouring sex offenders were forced to flee their homes in the Paulsgrove estate in Portsmouth as violence flared earlier this month.
> 
> The Sunday tabloid wants the government to introduce a law allowing people access to information on the identities and addresses of paedophiles in their areas.


 
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2000/aug/30/childprotection.society


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## binka (May 18, 2012)

fucking hell jeff are you serious? this must have been mentioned on urban dozens of times. in fact im pretty sure its in another topic today somewhere.



> Just what is the truth? In August 2000, a female paediatrician consultant called Yvette Cloete was indeed labelled a "paedo" after a campaign by the News of the World to name and shame paedophiles in the community.
> 
> The incident took place in Newport, Gwent, not in Portsmouth (where there had been anti-paedophile protests after eight-year-old Sarah Payne was murdered) or London.
> 
> ...


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4719364.stm


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## sleaterkinney (May 18, 2012)

Kathy Burke and the rest of the elite are giving you a false consciousness Jeff.


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## goldenecitrone (May 19, 2012)

Kathy was right though. Ken would be a better mayor and Boris would be a better guest.


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## zoooo (May 19, 2012)

The second part is definitely true.


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## Stigmata (May 21, 2012)

DexterTCN said:


> fishing, poker, watching telly, arguing, football, women's volleyball, basketball
> 
> I'd put aussie rules football in there but it's not a sport.


 
Running. People do that all the time


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## Orang Utan (May 21, 2012)

Running is not a sport unless you are racing


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## imposs1904 (May 21, 2012)

watched it for the first time in years because the divine Kathy Burke was hosting. God, it was dire. They were all phoning it in.


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## Orang Utan (May 21, 2012)

Paul Merton especially. Those faces he pulls...jesus


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## Gingerman (May 25, 2012)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01j9g15
The Shat hosting tonight  and Brooker on the panel.


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## DexterTCN (May 25, 2012)

Great.  I've been watching the old Star Trek on one of the cable channels.


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## T & P (May 25, 2012)

That was good. Charlie Brooker didn't feature as prominently as I'd had thought he would, but then again the Shatner simply stole the limelight


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## Gingerman (May 25, 2012)

The Shat should be charged with theft,stole the show tonight


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## T & P (May 25, 2012)

Surely that hair of his must be dye job. A legend of a bloke, at any rate. I did think they let Jeremy Hunt and Cameron off lightly thought, given revelations this week.


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## DexterTCN (May 25, 2012)

Shatner's bigger than all that politics stuff...I'm a Rocket Man!


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## Nine Bob Note (May 26, 2012)

The man's in his eighties, FFS! As a TNG fan, I'm glad they chose Stewart as a young man - I'm not gonna be bereaved any time soon.


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## susie12 (May 26, 2012)

Loved William Shatner!  Charlie on the other hand has lost his edge and even looks diminished since he embraced marriage and fatherhood.


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## weltweit (May 26, 2012)

susie12 said:


> Loved William Shatner! Charlie on the other hand has lost his edge and even looks diminished since he embraced marriage and fatherhood.


I agree, Shatner was great ......
I never rated Brooker anyhow he contributed little to this episode ...


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