# Shit 'stand up' comedians and their current prolific rise to superstardom.



## Ted Striker (Dec 18, 2011)

It's a thread long time in the coming, though hopefully someone can put me out of my misery and tell me 'it's always been like this' Tom O'Connor/Davidson/Edmunds (Noel), but seriously, has some tax write off been actioned such that anyone with an elaborate knock knock joke can now sell out the Royal Albert Hall?

There's just too many to mention, but the esteemed leader Michael MacIntyre seems to be driving us all to a doomsday scenario to eternal objective destruction through a march to banality. Russell Howard feel free to count yourself as his deputy.

You're all cunts (in the nicest possible way) on here, but I'd be happy to concede all (most) of your wit is Actually Pretty Good if it meant the removal of tongue of anyone that's ever regurgitated a segment of one of their stand up shows for a hackneyed Mock The Week spat.

Has it always been this bad, or is there a secret market force of alignment of planets that have completely removed the requirement for any comedian to be actually funny?

(Apologies for stating the obvious, maybe we can just use this thread to vent?)


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Cheap broadcasting and cheap gigs to put on during a recession? You know when a country knows it is fucked and laughter is the best medicine?


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## Guineveretoo (Dec 18, 2011)

I would add Mickey Flanagan to the list of comedians who made it big for reasons I can't identify.

But I think it has always been this bad!


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> But I think it has always been this bad!



Yup. Just more of it made available via telly.


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## Jon-of-arc (Dec 18, 2011)

I can't understand the appeal of Rob Newman (since he swapped "being funny" for "being political", at least) or Mark Thomas (ever).  Neither are "huge" (although Newman was when I was about 10), but both have had starring TV roles and still make it on radio at least once in a while.


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> I can't understand the appeal of Rob Newman (since he swapped "being funny" for "being political", at least) or Mark Thomas (ever). Neither are "huge" (although Newman was when I was about 10), but both have had starring TV roles and still make it on radio at least once in a while.



I like Mark Thomas


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## Guineveretoo (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Yup. Just more of it made available via telly.


Dunno about that. We used to have some seriously shit comedians on the telly back in my yoof, too!


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## wayward bob (Dec 18, 2011)

mark thomas is teh


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> Dunno about that. We used to have some seriously shit comedians on the telly back in my yoof, too!



What years was this?


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## Jon-of-arc (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> I like Mark Thomas



Too annoyingly "right-on" for my liking. Ends up just being trite. Mediocre comic ability combining lazy "stunt" based humour and obvious targets has helped him carve out his own patronising little niche. IMO.

e2a - the UKs Michael Moore.


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## Spymaster (Dec 18, 2011)

Frankie Boyle. The unfunniest cunt ever to take the stage and by far the biggest dick on MtW.


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## wayward bob (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> Too annoyingly "right-on" for my liking. Ends up just being trite. Mediocre comic ability combining lazy "stunt" based humour and obvious targets has helped him carve out his own patronising little niche. IMO.



he gets stuff done though. real stuff (don't ask me what  i have the memory span of a goldfish). he's a great raconteur, his live shows are really fucking funny, and he's an all round good bloke


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> Too annoyingly "right-on" for my liking. Ends up just being trite. Mediocre comic ability combining lazy "stunt" based humour and obvious targets has helped him carve out his own patronising little niche. IMO.



What is your type of comic? Mark Thomas has a lot of energy and good intentioned mischief. Not dismissing what you say but would never describe him as banal or shit. He is not light entertainment like the usual MMM (Michael MacIntyre Measure) this thread seems to be targeting.


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## MellySingsDoom (Dec 18, 2011)

How about Lee Evans as well?  A Norman Wisdom tribute act minus all the funny.


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> How about Lee Evans as well? A Norman Wisdom tribute act minus all the funny.



Shame this one. I think he is actually _quiet_ funny but ruins it with his physical comedy. Never really going to be my kind of stand up but not as terrible as some say.


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## MellySingsDoom (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Shame this one. I think he is actually _quiet_ funny but ruins it with his physical comedy. Never really going to be my kind of stand up but not as terrible as some say.



Fairy snuff.  You've reminded me of someone who I saw live once in the very early 90's, and whose shtick seemed to consist of such "edgy" stuff as using the word cunt liberally:  Jo Brand.


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## Jon-of-arc (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> What is your type of comic? Mark Thomas has a lot of energy and good intentioned mischief. Not dismissing what you say but would never describe him as banal or shit. He is not light entertainment like the usual MMM (Michael MacIntyre Measure) this thread seems to be targeting.



I like all sorts, really.  I don't have a favourite comedian.  When I have the money, I try and go to see smaller comics at local shows quite often.  You see some dross there, and the occasional real gem.

I wouldn't say he is "shit" - he can tell a joke, and some of them are funny (but I feel the same way about Russell Howard) - I just fail to understand his continued popularity amongst politically "progressive" types.

Just thought I'd widen the parameters of the debate a bit...


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> Fairy snuff. You've reminded me of someone who I saw live once in the very early 90's, and whose shtick seemed to consist of such "edgy" stuff as using the word cunt liberally: Jo Brand.



I meant 'shame' regarding Evans fail rather than your post.

Jo Brand is not a great stand up and a real one trick pony to me.


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## Jon-of-arc (Dec 18, 2011)

wayward bob said:


> he gets stuff done though. real stuff (don't ask me what  i have the memory span of a goldfish). he's a great raconteur, his live shows are really fucking funny, and he's an all round good bloke



Well, I suppose I can't knock him for his activism (stunt tactics aside, which I'm not fond of).  He seems genuinely committed to trying to change society.  But then, even the actions which he isn't being paid for directly as part of a TV show often end up being as much about highlighting Mark Thomas as they are about highlighting a particular issue.

As for the humour, I guess it's swings and roundabouts.  One mans shit is another womans sugar etc.  But I'm personally not fond.  Still listened to his most recent radio show on 4Extra, but it did annoy me far more than it amused.


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

Hard to think of any comic around at the moment who is willing to tackle the mountain of important issues of the day. I can't remember who said it, but comics, like novelists, are in a privileged position of being able to tell the truth. Hard to think of any who take full advantage of that position at the moment. Stewart Lee. And. Um... His former partner Richard Herring too, perhaps.


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## wayward bob (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> ...Still listened to his most recent radio show on 4Extra, but it did annoy me far more than it amused.



i don't think he translates well to radio - his standup shows are more about telling a very long story, that gets you totally engrossed. there are funny bits, but equally there are angry bits and lots of just explaining how stuff works. it's the *whole* that works. and he is just an all-round likeable bloke imho.


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## purves grundy (Dec 18, 2011)

Identifying and critiquing / mocking / snobbishly dismissing unfunny stand-up has been a staple of U75 from way back when, ergo It's Always Been Like This


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## susie12 (Dec 18, 2011)

the ones I'm currently hating are John Bishop and Andy Osho


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> Well, I suppose I can't knock him for his activism (stunt tactics aside, which I'm not fond of). He seems genuinely committed to trying to change society. But then, even the actions which he isn't being paid for directly as part of a TV show often end up being as much about highlighting Mark Thomas as they are about highlighting a particular issue.



I liken Mark Thomas to Billy Bragg. Neither are perfect but they have a fucking go at least and can't be called shit or banal. Both people I would pay money to watch live.

He could much more easily do observational comedy if all he wanted to do was pull a large crowd. Clever, funny, passionate and dedicated chap in my book. Comedians using using the MMM (Michael MacIntyre Measure) of comedy write their material in the living room watching their kids fall over. You have to tip your hat to Mark for these reasons......


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

purves grundy said:


> Identifying and critiquing / mocking / snobbishly dismissing unfunny stand-up has been a staple of U75 from way back when, ergo It's Always Been Like This



Indeed 

Stewart Lee is a good one to like. Funny guy and not playing stadium venues even though he could outsell most of 'The Russells' to quote his own joke 

Comedy is personal taste but I think you can shout 'BANALITY' on many without fear of persecution!


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## wayward bob (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Clever, funny, passionate and dedicated chap in my book.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> Well, I suppose I can't knock him for his activism (stunt tactics aside, which I'm not fond of). He seems genuinely committed to trying to change society. But then, even the actions which he isn't being paid for directly as part of a TV show often end up being as much about highlighting Mark Thomas as they are about highlighting a particular issue.



I don't think he does that any more than is inevitable because he's the one talking. Would it be possible to stand up and talk in front of a camera/audience and not 'highlight' yourself at least as much as he does?


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

susie12 said:


> the ones I'm currently hating are John Bishop and Andy Osho



Andy Osho is a bit hard work.

I find John Bishop mildly amusing. He is like a mild cheddar though. You can't admit to it but find it harmless and unchallenging at times. No way he should be on Live at the Apollo but if I saw him (drunk) at a comedy club doing ten minutes (not a fucking DVD length routine) I would probably not be hating.


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

As ever, money's part of the problem. There is now an enormous market for comedy videos - there was a feature on the radio about it the other day: comics can make around half a million quid just for one video. So there's a formula for success now - appear on tv panel shows to raise your profile, do a tour, film it, sell the film of it. It's a bit of a rush towards the middle, it seems to me.


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

My posts are pretty irrelevant because I still lie in bed at night laughing about Lapland New Forest three years on.

As you were....


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## Captain Hurrah (Dec 18, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> How about Lee Evans as well? A Norman Wisdom tribute act minus all the funny.



He's done a good seagull impression, though.


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## Jon-of-arc (Dec 18, 2011)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> I don't think he does that any more than is inevitable because he's the one talking. Would it be possible to stand up and talk in front of a camera/audience and not 'highlight' yourself at least as much as he does?



http://www.mcdemos.com/

Why does this link directly to his website?


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## Brainaddict (Dec 18, 2011)




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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> http://www.mcdemos.com/
> 
> Why does this link directly to his website?



You mean why has he called the website Mcdemos? I imagine it comes out of when he was working on McDonalds related stuff. I don't see it's very important though - obviously he does a certain amount of self publicity because ultimately it is his job.

Can you name a political comedian who doesn't promote themselves to that degree?


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> http://www.mcdemos.com/
> 
> Why does this link directly to his website?



Because it is a hyperlink.


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## Brainaddict (Dec 18, 2011)




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## miss giggles (Dec 18, 2011)

mmm. Every stand up uses material from their shows for 'Mock the Week', in fact, that's true of every panel show and most interviews with comics too. That's standard practice and has always taken place.
Mock the week is particularly blatant though, with that 'fortune wheel of topics' the comics don't even pretend that they're freestyling.
As for Mark Thomas, you really have to see him live to appreciate how funny he actually is. On TV he's interesting, live, he's a highly skilled comic, with fascinating material.
Michael McIntyre is a bit of a guilty pleasure of mine. He subject matter is bland and rarely strays from the obvious, but I think he's very funny. I think he must just be a naturally funny guy, because his material is basically pants. I can't think of a single line he's ever said that I can remember. But he can make anyone of any age laugh, and is totally innoffensive. I think that's quite a skill, if a little unchallenging to watch.
What does irk me, is this new clan of 'young comics' Russell Howard, Russell Kane, Andy Osho etc... They seem to have been plucked straight out of stage school. They look great on screen, and I can certainly see them on a prime time sitcom, but how on earth are they selling out places like the Hammersmith Apollo? I can understand why agents lap them up but why the public? They are totally unfunny, I don't get it at all, or am I missing something?


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Was trying to avoid posting up videos but if you get 2 Stewart Lee videos I am allowed 1 Doug Stanhope.


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## TopCat (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> My posts are pretty irrelevant because I still lie in bed at night laughing about Lapland New Forest three years on.
> 
> As you were....


I thought the people were unfairly picked on myself. The provided me with a barrel of laughs.


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## Jon-of-arc (Dec 18, 2011)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> You mean why has he called the website Mcdemos? I imagine it comes out of when he was working on McDonalds related stuff. I don't see it's very important though - obviously he does a certain amount of self publicity because ultimately it is his job.
> 
> Can you name a political comedian who doesn't promote themselves to that degree?



I mean why does this site, which was about a campaign Thomas was involved in (something to do with SOCA, I think), but by no means the only player, now redirect to his website?  Just seems like shameless cashing in on his political work.

You're right, it is a minor issue.  I did mention he seems committed.  But it is a legitimate criticism.


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## krtek a houby (Dec 18, 2011)

Parsons. Gahhh!


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

I agree with Miss giggles about Michael Mac. He can make me laugh.


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## editor (Dec 18, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> How about Lee Evans as well? A Norman Wisdom tribute act minus all the funny.


Never liked him much until I saw him in Funnybones which was a fantastic film.


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

miss giggles said:


> I can understand why agents lap them up but why the public? They are totally unfunny, I don't get it at all, or am I missing something?



Entertainment:

Strictly come Dancing
Big Brother
X-Factor
I'm A Celebrity
The Apprentice

Not comedy but a nice 'entertainment' reference


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

editor said:


> Never liked him much until I saw him in Funnybones which was a fantastic film.



He should only be a cameo mind.
I liked him in Fifth Element but he had a minor role.


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## silverfish (Dec 18, 2011)

Spymaster said:


> Frankie Boyle. The unfunniest cunt ever to take the stage and by far the biggest dick on MtW.



I find him the funniest out of the whole bunch


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

Saw Lee Evans in Endgame a few years ago. He's a very good comic actor. As as standup, he's meh, imo.


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## billy_bob (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Was trying to avoid posting up videos but if you get 2 Stewart Lee videos I am allowed 1 Doug Stanhope.




I have no problem at all with the idea that he's going to get some comic mileage out of the idea of hating Jews (we've been known to do it ourselves)....I just got a bit bored wondering when he was going to start.


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## krtek a houby (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> He should only be a cameo mind.
> I liked him in Fifth Element but he had a minor role.


I like him in that film with Nathan thingy and Christopher Walken. It's a bit Laurel & Hardy like, they inherit a house with a mouse, iirc...


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

billy_bob said:


> I have no problem at all with the idea that he's going to get some comic mileage out of the idea of hating Jews (we've been known to do it ourselves)....I just got a bit bored wondering when he was going to start.



You watched the clip or just read the title?


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

krtek a houby said:


> I like him in that film with Nathan thingy and Christopher Walken. It's a bit Laurel & Hardy like, they inherit a house with a mouse, iirc...



Shark VS Octopus?


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## krtek a houby (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Shark VS Octopus?


Not quite...


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

krtek a houby said:


> Not quite...


Shark Vs Squid?


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

krtek a houby said:


> Not quite...



Gotcha


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## Meltingpot (Dec 18, 2011)

Stewart Lee had me over properly with his sketch about Top Gear. Here is part of it;



(Edit; just realised I haven't seen the whole thing).


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## Badgers (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> You watched the clip or just read the title?



?


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## fogbat (Dec 18, 2011)

Kevin Fucking Bridges. That is all.


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## fogbat (Dec 18, 2011)

Wait, no. It's not all. Google Addison Cresswell and marvel at how many televised comedy mediocrities share the same agent.


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## billy_bob (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> You watched the clip or just read the title?





Badgers said:


> ?



Whoah, patience man - some of us are at work!

Yes of course I watched the clip before I commented.  I would have thought it was clear from what I said that I'm not the type to cry 'anti-semitism' at the first assumed opportunity.

I wasn't trying to get into one of those pointless "I don't like it therefore it's objectively not funny " things that invariably break out here, or anywhere on the internet, when comedy is discussed either.  Just offering my own opinion, which is that that really wasn't very funny.


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## MellySingsDoom (Dec 18, 2011)

editor said:


> Never liked him much until I saw him in Funnybones which was a fantastic film.



Really?  OK, will check that one out, then.


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## temper_tantrum (Dec 18, 2011)

Comedy is 'fashionable' atm. Therefore going to stand-up nights is the new going to the cinema, and loads of trendy twats are setting up/running improv groups in their spare time. And comedy DVDs sell well, hence everyone who's ever done an Edinburgh Fringe show brings one out.


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## AverageJoe (Dec 18, 2011)

imho its the hardest thing in the world to be a stand up. Not only are you expected to come up with something funny and new everytime someone sees you, you also have to be abreast of whats going on (to be relevant) but also abreast of history (to have cultural references) and also as thick skinned as fuck to get on the stage in the first place.

I have plenty (well, a couple) of funny friends, but they arent always funny. Sometimes they are utter cunts.

And to get on stage. A musician has it easy - its fair play to steal/borrow/be influenced by your peers, get up on stage, play the same set every night and everyone buys the Tshirt. To be genuinely funny all the time and to find new material every time - well, it just cant be done.

We're lucky that as society has moved on we have the opportunity to watch a lot more comedy than we ever have - both new and old via the channels we have, and there is a space across the broad spectrum, whether you are a U75er or a slack jawed, dead eyed shuffling racist, to find something that you personally find funny.

There's room for Jack Whitehall, Michael Mcintyre, Sarah Millican, Fankie Boyle, Cannon and Ball, Hancock et because the one thing that separates everyone from everyone else, no matter how educated or politically correct you are, is that humour is subjective - you find things funny that others dont, and long may that reign. And anyone who has the guts to get up there and strive to entertain you should be applauded whether you like them or not. As someone once nearly said "I dont agree with your comedy but I will defend to the death your right to strive to sell tickets for it".

Although personally speaking there's not much funnier than someone falling over or a good noisy fart so what the fuck do I know.


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## Cloo (Dec 18, 2011)

Comedy, I guess as it's an area I'm not very up on, does have this alarming habit lately of producing comedians who are doing shows at Wembley without me ever having heard their name until I see the shows advertised.


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## editor (Dec 18, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> Really? OK, will check that one out, then.


It's a superb film, and hugely underrated.



> If you have any interest in humour at all then _Funny Bones_ is steadfast in its exploration of every possible type of funny: funny that's stupid, skilful, angry, delighted, intellectual, insane; funny that's subjective, personal, insightful; funny that plays with body parts and stares at death, defies it; funny that defies life – its losses, its wounds, its despair; stolen, denied, abandoned and rediscovered funny. It's all here.
> 
> And this is the real thing, real funny: not the fey and uncommitted posturing of Pierrots; not the crass, trousers-down laziness of bad slapstick; not the monumental irritation of yet another poorly presented and incomprehensible Shakespearean fool. This is a generous catalogue of skills – old skills, real skills, human skills – the ones that take funny into the place where it troubles and frightens and liberates. Enjoy.
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2009/dec/06/al-kennedy-funny-bones-chelsom


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## ViolentPanda (Dec 18, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> But I think it has always been this bad!



This. For every decent stand-up, there are a dozen who just do variations on other peoples' material or rely on hackneyed bigotted crap to get a laugh.


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## paolo (Dec 18, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> I would add Mickey Flanagan to the list of comedians who made it big for reasons I can't identify.
> 
> But I think it has always been this bad!



I'd disagree.

It's come and gone in waves.

Whilst it's true that the old school "mother-in-law" comics never quite went away, they suffered a rapid decline once alternative comedy started to get a foor hold. They were still out there on the provincial theatre circuit, but almost completely erased from their traditional Saturday Night on BBC1! slots.

There was the illusion of arena comedy becoming a new mainstay, when Newman and Baddiel told their only joke to 12,000 people, and Janet Street Porter said comedy was the new rock and roll, shortly before nothing at all happened again on that scale.

Now we're almost full circle - with Macintyre being top of the mainstream with his bland inoffensive observational mega-tour comedy, complete with a fair few Saturday night on telly outings thanks to the churnathon that's Live at the Apollo, and oooodles of DVD sales.

The exhasperation - how did this happen? - is heard in comedy circles too. People brought up on the modern tradition of working the circuit, doing the small clubs, losing loads of money at Edinburgh etc... are wondering how we've suddenly gone all the way back to the worst of the 70s.


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## xenon (Dec 18, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> Too annoyingly "right-on" for my liking. Ends up just being trite. Mediocre comic ability combining lazy "stunt" based humour and obvious targets has helped him carve out his own patronising little niche. IMO.
> 
> e2a - the UKs Michael Moore.



He's good live. Angry, funny and you learn stuff.

Mind you I think Micky Flanigan's OK too.


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## xenon (Dec 18, 2011)

wayward bob said:


> i don't think he translates well to radio - his standup shows are more about telling a very long story, that gets you totally engrossed. there are funny bits, but equally there are angry bits and lots of just explaining how stuff works. it's the *whole* that works. and he is just an all-round likeable bloke imho.



^ Yeah, this.


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## paolo (Dec 18, 2011)

miss giggles said:


> mmm. Every stand up uses material from their shows for 'Mock the Week', in fact, that's true of every panel show



You mean getting advance sight of the questions?

Not true at all. At the top end, there's HIGNFY which is proper ad-lib. On QI, barring Jimmy Carr (the wuss), no one gets to see the questions in advance. I'd be surprised if Would I Lie to you shows any material to the teams in advance in either.

And to me, it's transparent too - the difference between free flowing banter and Mock the Week set-pieces sticks out a mile.


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

> there's HIGNFY which is proper ad-lib



Really? If so, that's a change. I remember someone talking about how thorough Bob Monkhouse was in that he took himself off with a team of writers as soon as he was given the questions. They used to get to see the qs a few hours before the show, irrc.


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## paolo (Dec 18, 2011)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Really? If so, that's a change. I remember someone talking about how thorough Bob Monkhouse was in that he took himself off with a team of writers as soon as he was given the questions. They used to get to see the qs a few hours before the show, irrc.



The "HIGNFY is all scripted" is a unstoppable pub-story - that sounds like a variant. The host is always scripted, and that's made clear.

Never seen anything to substantiate the claims about anything else being scripted.

(ISTR the caption competition photo is given out 30 mins before - only that).


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

Ok. tbh, that sounds right. It does feel spontaneous. Maybe Monkhouse did a Jimmy Carr and asked for special treatment. I do remember Monkhouse on it and coming out with what sounded like pre-arranged quips.


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## paolo (Dec 18, 2011)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Ok. tbh, that sounds right. It does feel spontaneous. Maybe Monkhouse did a Jimmy Carr and asked for special treatment. I do remember Monkhouse on it and coming out with what sounded like pre-arranged quips.



Maybe he was a one-off exception? Although his general style could make him sound scripted even if he wasn't.

The telling thing generally is how poorly some guests fare. Brooker, for example - who can certainly write - barely had a word left in the edit. (Hislop has a natural advantage in that he's writing topical satire every day anyway, so he'll always have a grab bag of relevant quips. Merton has good weeks and bad weeks, and but has a number of standard Mertonisms that be used for almost any question)


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

I might be misremembering the story. Perhaps it was that Monkhouse turned up with a team of writers and studied the week's news with them before the show. That would lead to some prearranged gags in the hope that some would be usable. I think the point of the story was the team of writers rather than the seeing of the questions. I might be adding that last bit myself.


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## paolo (Dec 18, 2011)

littlebabyjesus said:


> I might be misremembering the story. Perhaps it was that Monkhouse turned up with a team of writers and studied the week's news with them before the show. That would lead to some prearranged gags in the hope that some would be usable. I think the point of the story was the team of writers rather than the seeing of the questions. I might be adding that last bit myself.



Maybe humble-pie eating time for me...

I've googled a bit more, and found a unverifiable rereference to a 1999 interview with Paul Merton, where he apparently says they *do* see the questions in advance. So your story about Monkhouse bringing in writers for a rapid brainstorm could well be right.


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## littlebabyjesus (Dec 18, 2011)

Ha. An Urban first?

'I'm wrong.'

'No, I'm wrong.'


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## Guineveretoo (Dec 18, 2011)

Badgers said:


> What years was this?


1970s

Quite a few of them are listed here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Comedians_(TV_series)


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## miss giggles (Dec 18, 2011)

Can't comment on QI, but it would make sense that they don't see the questions on that, but they certainly do on HINFY. They also give plenty of opportunity for comics to share stories by asking placed questions. If you've ever been to the filming you'll know that it's a really entertaining night out. A lot of the riffing is lost and that's a shame as it is the best bit, but it can go on for ages.
As for interviews, every comic's got his stories tucked up his sleeve. Why on earth would you do all that work and risk a TV spot where you come across as a boring fart? The only comic I've ever heard be open about this was Dara O'Brien, when he said how dissapointed he used to feel watching his hero's being interviewed.
I've been to a few filmings where they've had actors in who obviously didn't understand the convention and looked pretty awkward. I felt quite sorry for them as they were probably not boring at all, just unprepared.


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## N_igma (Dec 18, 2011)

Lee Evans. Just a walking sweat box. Not funny in the slightest.


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## GarfieldLeChat (Dec 18, 2011)

My guess is look at who's producing all the tv shows they are largely all just a few production houses who are prolific and use the same agencies so whoever the angecy has as flavour of the month appears on every show til they
Be milked that cow and on to the next one.

Have you got timing? 

Can you read an autocue?
 Will you give us a percentage? 

Cool here's 101 assorted crap tv 'comedy' panel shows...


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## AverageJoe (Dec 19, 2011)

I know that the people on those "100 best...." TV programs get sent the 3 or 4 clips that they want the person to talk about in advance so that they can "reminisce" about how brilliant they were...


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## Structaural (Dec 19, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Was trying to avoid posting up videos but if you get 2 Stewart Lee videos I am allowed 1 Doug Stanhope.]



Interesting bit here about when he was on Louis CK's show: linky


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## Garek (Dec 19, 2011)

AverageJoe said:


> There's room for Jack Whitehall, Michael Mcintyre, Sarah Millican, Fankie Boyle, Cannon and Ball, Hancock et because the one thing that separates everyone from everyone else, no matter how educated or politically correct you are, is that humour is subjective - you find things funny that others dont, and long may that reign. And anyone who has the guts to get up there and strive to entertain you should be applauded whether you like them or not. As someone once nearly said "I dont agree with your comedy but I will defend to the death your right to strive to sell tickets for it".



Rubbish. It is has become as mass manufactured industry with all that entails.


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## trevhagl (Dec 19, 2011)

wayward bob said:


> mark thomas is teh



one of the few decent ones along with Jerry sadowitz and (ding ding round 12) Frankie Boyle , and aye Stewart Lee and Doug Stanhope are funny. what little clips i've seen by em

anyone know what happened to Emo Phillipps? Did he die?


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## Structaural (Dec 20, 2011)

No, I just check wikipedia, and learnt a new word:

*Emo Philips* is an Americanentertainer and comedian.Much of his standup comedy stems from the use of paraprosdokians and garden path sentences etc..


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## purenarcotic (Dec 20, 2011)

Jon-of-arc said:


> Well, I suppose I can't knock him for his activism (stunt tactics aside, which I'm not fond of). He seems genuinely committed to trying to change society. But then, even the actions which he isn't being paid for directly as part of a TV show often end up being as much about highlighting Mark Thomas as they are about highlighting a particular issue.
> 
> As for the humour, I guess it's swings and roundabouts. One mans shit is another womans sugar etc. But I'm personally not fond. Still listened to his most recent radio show on 4Extra, but it did annoy me far more than it amused.



I think to be fair this applies to most public figures.  Notice how politicians will raise an issue and then say how they personally are going to deal with it, what they personally have done etc etc.  There is a level of expectation by the public I think that if you're going to start discussing an issue and demand change so vehemently, you should probably have some sort of proof to show what you have done to contribute to the fight.  Otherwise it becomes even more preachy and patronising than it potentially already is.  Also I think there's a belief that people like to hold onto singular figures; oh yes, there's Mark, he believes in x y z, I'll listen to what he has to say, maybe I'll go and do something about it. Ultimately a lot of us are quite lazy and we like somebody to have done the research for us, and if there is a strong public figure trust is there, so you're more likely to believe them.

To take a much more personal example, a student at my university was suspended from his position at the SU for getting arrested for banner dropping.  It all became overly political and the student spent a huge amount of time basically, in my eyes, whinging and taking valuable time away from the actual issue at hand.  But his whinging got him a lot of attention, and a lot more people are now on his FB, commenting on articles / legislation / whatever he posts up and the majority consensus is 'thanks mate, we wouldn't have known about it if you hadn't told us.'

Not to deny your point at all that Mark is probably, very narcissistic, you have to be to an extent to be such a public figure I think but to be honest, I don't think it's a bad thing really.  If a few more people find out about something that is very wrong, and they wouldn't have known about it before without hearing from Mark, and they get incensed and they try and do something about it, that has to be a good thing.


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## nuffsaid (Dec 20, 2011)

When Ed Byrne first cast his shadow over my tv he did an observational piece about Alanis Morrisette's 'Ironic' highlighting how much of the irony was merely bad luck and wanting to derive comedy from pointing out what is and what is not ironic. This was observation and not really funny but the really annoying thing was every F**king time I saw him again for next 3 years at least he ran the same F**king material, over and over and over again. Get some new f**king material FFS Ed Byrne...yawwwwnnn. I hated that routine. 

Saw Emo Philips live and he was superb.


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## ChrisFilter (Dec 20, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> I would add Mickey Flanagan to the list of comedians who made it big for reasons I can't identify.
> 
> But I think it has always been this bad!



I love Micky Flanagan. Him just speaking makes me laugh.


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## PlaidDragon (Dec 20, 2011)

i would genuinely pay money to punch Mickey Flanagan in the face.


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## miss giggles (Dec 20, 2011)

PlaidDragon said:


> i would genuinely pay money to punch Mickey Flanagan in the face.




Why does everyone hate Micky Flanagan so much? I don't think he's bad at all.


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## trevhagl (Dec 20, 2011)

anyone got a Flanagan link....not sure if i've seen him before?


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## trevhagl (Dec 20, 2011)

he w


nuffsaid said:


> When Ed Byrne first cast his shadow over my tv he did an observational piece about Alanis Morrisette's 'Ironic' highlighting how much of the irony was merely bad luck and wanting to derive comedy from pointing out what is and what is not ironic. This was observation and not really funny but the really annoying thing was every F**king time I saw him again for next 3 years at least he ran the same F**king material, over and over and over again. Get some new f**king material FFS Ed Byrne...yawwwwnnn. I hated that routine.
> 
> Saw Emo Philips live and he was superb.



he was on telly in the 90s and it was hilarious, proper warped stuff!


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## nuffsaid (Dec 20, 2011)

yeah, because of that I went to see him live, so good.


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## PlaidDragon (Dec 20, 2011)

miss giggles said:


> Why does everyone hate Micky Flanagan so much? I don't think he's bad at all.


I can't put my finger on it. I think it's the way he draws everything out in a monotone, it's like nails down a blackboard.

"Ahhhh looook aaahhhhmmm a Cockerneeeeeeeee, so aaahhhhlll speeeekkk laaaaahk thisss to emphaaasaaaaseee it"


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## ElizabethofYork (Dec 20, 2011)

miss giggles said:


> Can't comment on QI, but it would make sense that they don't see the questions on that, but they certainly do on HINFY. They also give plenty of opportunity for comics to share stories by asking placed questions. If you've ever been to the filming you'll know that it's a really entertaining night out. A lot of the riffing is lost and that's a shame as it is the best bit, but it can go on for ages.
> As for interviews, every comic's got his stories tucked up his sleeve. Why on earth would you do all that work and risk a TV spot where you come across as a boring fart? The only comic I've ever heard be open about this was Dara O'Brien, when he said how dissapointed he used to feel watching his hero's being interviewed.



Well yes ..... comics are just ordinary people putting on an act.  They don't go around being funny at all times.  Just like dancers don't prance down the street and actors don't quote Shakespeare in their everyday lives.


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## ChrisFilter (Dec 20, 2011)

PlaidDragon said:


> I can't put my finger on it. I think it's the way he draws everything out in a monotone, it's like nails down a blackboard.
> 
> "Ahhhh looook aaahhhhmmm a Cockerneeeeeeeee, so aaahhhhlll speeeekkk laaaaahk thisss to emphaaasaaaaseee it"



That's part of his appeal.


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## PlaidDragon (Dec 21, 2011)

ChrisFilter said:


> That's part of his appeal.


Well I hate it. Hate it hate it hate it! *stamps feet*


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## paolo (Dec 21, 2011)

PlaidDragon said:


> I can't put my finger on it. I think it's the way he draws everything out in a monotone, it's like nails down a blackboard.
> 
> "Ahhhh looook aaahhhhmmm a Cockerneeeeeeeee, so aaahhhhlll speeeekkk laaaaahk thisss to emphaaasaaaaseee it"



I'd not remembered him before, so went and watched.

It's a bit pedestrian. Not unfunny, just sooooo slow, for obvious gags. Comfortable comedy. DVD. Comfortable. Apollo. DVD. Tour. You want the tour. DVD. Of the Corn Exchange. Went down Yates! after. Got the DVD of the tour! The TOUR! On teletext, got the TOUR! (Shout the bits in capitals. With an accent. It's funnier.

(Mixed up Lancastrian joy/hatred for 'regional' comedy. Although mostly joy because we did indeed have a "big light" and went on shit holidays)


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## miss giggles (Dec 21, 2011)

ElizabethofYork said:


> Well yes ..... comics are just ordinary people putting on an act. They don't go around being funny at all times. Just like dancers don't prance down the street and actors don't quote Shakespeare in their everyday lives.



Exactly. There are a few sad actors and even sadder comics who do go around doing that, and they really are the most irritating people to be around. And usually the least talented... although my friend is a dancer, and I find her Louie Spence style public prancing highly amusing.


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## CyberRose (Dec 21, 2011)

Badgers said:


> I like Mark Thomas


He used to be funny about 15 years ago when he did things like trying to smuggle ice cream vans into Iraq or fly hot air balloons over Menwith Hill. Now he's just another smug twat caught up in his sense of self importance because his congregation will lap up any Guardian balls he comes out with.

I went to see Reg D Hunter recently and he was ok, but his warm up spent time telling GW Bush jokes! FFS it's 2011, he ain't the President any more and 9/11 was 10 years ago! Get over it it's not funny any more!


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## Dr Dolittle (Dec 21, 2011)

There's only ever been a handful of comedians who I like, and as I've got out of the habit of watching telly (because I prefer the internet these days) my knowledge of contemporary comedy is a bit out of date. But among those I've liked are Marcus Brigstock (the most 'political' one of modern times that I know of), Russell Brand (because he's such a loonie) and Charlie Brooker (both political and a loonie). Michael McIntyre is OK but, as everyone says, very mainstream, very MOTR. (Don't misread that as MOTD).

I used to like Julian Clary, but these days all he ever talks about is how rich he is. He is very much a one-joke comedian, and should be appreciated for his ability to entertain (as well as the cosiness of his predictability) rather than his jokes. I've seen him live twice - the last time being 2003. Jo Brand is still good, especially on Hignify. I like her broad presentation - she has progressed from one-joke comic to doing all sorts of stuff, including serious programmes. Bit too goody-goody these days, though.

I've always wanted to do comedy myself - at those open mike sessions in pubs, but I never get round to writing any stuff. My best jokes are usually spontaneous. But I've done stage work before (amateur).


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## Casually Red (Dec 21, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> How about Lee Evans as well? A Norman Wisdom tribute act minus all the funny.



more irritating than piles with your herpes


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## Casually Red (Dec 21, 2011)

fuck off jo brand as well .

Bernard Manning drag act in reverse .


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## Dr Dolittle (Dec 21, 2011)

Actually the main reason why I've got out of the habit of watching telly is because I haven't got one anymore, only my computer, and you can't browse through the channels on the internet. (If there's a website that enables you to, please let me know, but not if you have to download special software for the price of a month's JSA.)


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## El Sueno (Dec 21, 2011)

I'm sure any 10 year old kid with the merest hint of a personality must look at a cunt like Russell Howard and decide, quite logically, that when they will grow up they'll easily make a decent living out of stand up comedy. His current status as a 'comedian' is fucking baffling, surely one of the most inexplicable rises to fame in the history of light entertainment.


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## Chz (Dec 22, 2011)

Rhod Gilbert. Picking him out only because he's not been mentioned thus far - Russell Howard annoys me far more. Gilbert is in the same bin as MacIntyre in that he doesn't actively irritate me, but I'd struggle to even smile through most of the act. Didn't mind his turn on Buzzcocks, mind you.


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## wayward bob (Dec 22, 2011)

rhod gilbert makes me laugh like a fucking drain. a bit like mark thomas, his live shows are generally telling one long story. taken in short bits they're prolly not split-your sides stuff, but the cumulative effect is brilliant


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## GarfieldLeChat (Dec 22, 2011)

CyberRose said:


> He used to be funny about 15 years ago when he did things like trying to smuggle ice cream vans into Iraq or fly hot air balloons over Menwith Hill. Now he's just another smug twat caught up in his sense of self importance because his congregation will lap up any Guardian balls he comes out with.



Like walking the length of the Israeli Occupation wall type pedestrian from last year or writing about it...

Like still fighting turkey about kurdish human rights

fuck off you fucking slug, you are one of those smug twats lapping up guardian bollocks, hence you coming out with the fashionable bullshit hater nonsense which has no bearing on reality...

you used to be a lefty WTF happened you get old????

cunt...


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## Scaggs (Dec 22, 2011)

There seems to be hudreds of crap 'comedians' around at the moment, most of them on channel 4. Justin Lee Collins, especially, makes me reach for the off switch. He's in court today apparently.



> Television presenter Justin Lee Collins today denied harassing an ex-girlfriend when he appeared in court.
> The Friday Night Project star appeared before magistrates in St Albans, Hertfordshire, over allegations that he caused Anna Larke "fear of violence".
> The 37-year-old, who is appearing in the West End show Rock of Ages, attended the court carrying a Reiss shopping bag, wearing jeans, running trainers and a grey knee-length coat with a checked shirt and tie underneath.



http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...in-lee-collins-denies-harassment-6280489.html

It's nice that they called him a tv presenter and not a comedian.


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## Guineveretoo (Dec 22, 2011)

I honestly didn't realise that Justin Lee Collins regarded himself as a comedian!


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## GarfieldLeChat (Dec 22, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> I honestly didn't realise that Justin Lee Collins regarded himself as a comedian!


why not everyone else regards him as a fucking joke...


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## Sweet FA (Dec 22, 2011)

Dr Dolittle said:


> I've always wanted to do comedy myself - at those open mike sessions in pubs, but I never get round to writing any stuff. My best jokes are usually spontaneous. But I've done stage work before (amateur).





Dr Dolittle said:


> very MOTR. (Don't misread that as MOTD).


Day job etc.


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## Spanky Longhorn (Dec 22, 2011)

ChrisFilter said:


> That's part of his appeal.



Flanagan is funny as fuck, I still chuckle when I think of the being cockney in America routine, "can I come in your ass"


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## miss giggles (Dec 22, 2011)

I like Flannagan, but then I absolutely love Rhod Gilbert...

Currently pissing me off at the moment is Ed Byrne. I read an article he wrote recently, one of those list articles, 'most irritating' I think it was. The whole thing centered around his annoyance with hotels, planes, and taxis, and I just thought, I'd love to be living like you, instead of worrying if there's enough credit on my gas card and whether or not I can afford next weeks train fares...


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## Sweet FA (Dec 22, 2011)

That's 'second album syndrome' isn't it? 1st album's all 'writing tunes in a bedsit with me bezzers', 2nd album's all 'room service is shit and I'm stuck with these cunts'.


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## CyberRose (Dec 23, 2011)

GarfieldLeChat said:


> Like walking the length of the Israeli Occupation wall type pedestrian from last year or writing about it...
> 
> Like still fighting turkey about kurdish human rights
> 
> ...




I'm not doubting his dedication to the various causes he supports, and he appears to be very good at that. But this thread is about comedy and when I first saw his shows he was really funny in an inclusive way that non-political people could relate to. Last time I saw his comedy it seemed to have veered more towards exclusive political 'in jokes' that I didn't find that appealing (as somebody who doesn't read any newspapers, let alone the Guardian)

As for your reaction to somebody who dared to criticise Mark Thomas (wtf?!), if you are Mark Thomas then I apologise wholeheartedly!!


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## wayward bob (Dec 23, 2011)

CyberRose said:


> As for your reaction to somebody who dared to criticise Mark Thomas (wtf?!), if you are Mark Thomas then I apologise wholeheartedly!!



i bet he's reading this thread right now having googled his name. we loves ya mark


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## GarfieldLeChat (Dec 23, 2011)

he does visit the boards... but had a confrontation with some of the poltico lot in P&P and decided not to post again... 

tis not me however...

CR: seriously though... his political jokes haven't changed over the years he still does activism and comedy... perhaps it's you whos changed...  you're certainly far more right wing than you used to be and far less tolerant...


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## CyberRose (Dec 23, 2011)

GarfieldLeChat said:


> he does visit the boards... but had a confrontation with some of the poltico lot in P&P and decided not to post again...
> 
> tis not me however...
> 
> CR: seriously though... his political jokes haven't changed over the years he still does activism and comedy... perhaps it's you whos changed... you're certainly far more right wing than you used to be and far less tolerant...


I'd take most of what I say on U75 with a pinch of salt to be honest! I may appear to be one way or the other but I pretty much only post when I see something I disagree with (which, on this forum, inevitably makes me appear opposed to the "norm" ie to the right).

Altho saying that, I'm pretty sure I've never been considered a "lefty" on these boards so if that's what you thought then I take that as a compliment!

As for MT, I will make an effort to watch some of his more recent stuff cos as I said, I did really enjoy him earlier on in his career (hard core politics is just a bit of a turn off for me, maybe I did get old! I don't actually talk about politics much outside of these forums so I can let a bit of steam off here that I wouldn't in "real life"!!)


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## wayward bob (Dec 23, 2011)

his recent routines have leant more towards the "fat dads" side if that's any encouragement


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## CyberRose (Dec 23, 2011)

Are his shows online anywhere?


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## omnipeta (Dec 24, 2011)

Ross Noble and Jimmy Carr are absolutely shit, I have to mute the TV when they speak or switch channels, they're just plain fucking awful!


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## DJ Squelch (Dec 24, 2011)

Tim Minchin. Funny?
Getting a lot of attention after his song was pulled from the Johnathon Ross show but I can't remember finding him remotely funny on anything he's been on.
IMO the only people who could combine music & comedy to good effect were The Two Ronnies


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## Centurian (Dec 25, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> How about Lee Evans as well? A Norman Wisdom tribute act minus all the funny.



I had a look at Evans when he topped the bill at a charity event (on telly) I couldn't believe how often he said fuck, like some people say y'know all the time. I think he was just trying to carry very weak material by fucking shouting a fucking lot, fuck, fuck, fuck.

For a lot of the working classes this passes as top comedy - see also Roy "The Racist" Brown.


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## binka (Dec 25, 2011)

currently watching michael mcintyre prance around on stage to fairytale of new york with pixie lott. i dont like the way he is always so pleased with himself. mind you its understandable i suppose


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## binka (Dec 25, 2011)

now he's getting a foreigner to say things in his stupid foreign accent. great stuff


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## Cid (Dec 27, 2011)

AverageJoe said:


> imho its the hardest thing in the world to be a stand up. Not only are you expected to come up with something funny and new everytime someone sees you, you also have to be abreast of whats going on (to be relevant) but also abreast of history (to have cultural references) and also as thick skinned as fuck to get on the stage in the first place.



Most comics don't do completely original tours, watch a succession of DVDs and you'll notice repeat gags. From what I can tell the idea is to script yourself a good groundwork, then riff off that where you can or revert to old material if you have to. Also comics have a style they can play off, Bill Bailey with his musical stuff, Moran with a drunken Irish surreal take on observational stuff, Lee with his sort of alt-observation. Michael Macintyre probably reads the Guardian and Hello for his research.



> And to get on stage. A musician has it easy - its fair play to steal/borrow/be influenced by your peers, get up on stage, play the same set every night and everyone buys the Tshirt. To be genuinely funny all the time and to find new material every time - well, it just cant be done.



Musicians aren't expected to come up with new material? 

I don't know where you get the idea that comedians aren't influenced by other comedians either - direct joke copying is an absolute taboo of course, but loads of ideas change hands - try listening to R4's 'the news quiz' followed by 'mock the week' and you'll see what I mean. You'll also see many influences in a wider sense; Stewart Lee and the alt comics etc - no idea who Mcintryre's influences are, but they'll be there. Comics (especially the big ones) test their material extensively too, test runs with smaller audiences, radio and TV quiz programmes etc etc. It's not like a stand-up just writes a vague script, hops on stage and improvises.



> We're lucky that as society has moved on we have the opportunity to watch a lot more comedy than we ever have - both new and old via the channels we have, and there is a space across the broad spectrum, whether you are a U75er or a slack jawed, dead eyed shuffling racist, to find something that you personally find funny.
> 
> There's room for Jack Whitehall, Michael Mcintyre, Sarah Millican, Fankie Boyle, Cannon and Ball, Hancock et because the one thing that separates everyone from everyone else, no matter how educated or politically correct you are, is that humour is subjective - you find things funny that others dont, and long may that reign. And anyone who has the guts to get up there and strive to entertain you should be applauded whether you like them or not. As someone once nearly said "I dont agree with your comedy but I will defend to the death your right to strive to sell tickets for it".
> 
> Although personally speaking there's not much funnier than someone falling over or a good noisy fart so what the fuck do I know.



True enough, although the disproportionate amount of shit rising to the top of the pile is a little annoying.


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## Kid_Eternity (Dec 27, 2011)

Yup I've been to a few 'work in progress' gigs where comedians basically piss about for an hour and half. It can be a bit hit and miss but when it works it can also be better than the big tour gig which are heavily rehearsed...oh yeah only new and upcoming bands have the pressure to release or tour with new material, older/big bands can get away with years of nothing new but sell out tours. Metallica, for instance, could never release new material again but would sell out stadiums across the globe very easily...


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## Cid (Dec 27, 2011)

Well quite, but they had to become Metallica first...


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## Kid_Eternity (Dec 27, 2011)

Yeah in the old days that was true...these days you just need a twunt like Simon Cowell to create it all for you...


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## Cid (Dec 27, 2011)

Provided you're happy singing what you're told to, getting royally shafted for a year then being forgotten.


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## Kid_Eternity (Dec 27, 2011)

Cid said:


> Provided you're happy singing what you're told to, getting royally shafted for a year then being forgotten.



Surprising number of people appear to be very happy with that arrangement sadly...


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