# The Barbican estate - what's your verdict?



## editor (May 5, 2011)

Bits of it are getting a wee bit tatty now, and I'm still not sure if I exactly like the thing, but here's a few photos from the 60s development:












http://www.urban75.org/blog/a-spring-strut-through-the-barbican-estate-london/


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

It's got some great architectural theatrics. That lake, the bridges and fountains, the overlapping pedestrian areas, the sawtooth towers. I actually like the finish as well - they cast the concrete smooth and then used hammers to knock it back to reveal the aggregate. Built to last 100s of years, so they say. My boss used to live there and he highly rates the apartments - built to a high spec and very nicely laid out.

But as town planning it's abysmal. Completely isolated and impenetrable from the surrounding streets. The "front" entrance of the arts center opens onto the lakeside, which would be great if you could actually get to the lake from the surrounding streets or the tube station without navigating a maze of ramps and bridges and passages.

Most of the really tatty stuff in your photos isn't part of the Barbican Estate, but is surrounding developments that share the highwalk system of overhead walkways. The estate itself is well maintained, although the paving tiles are notorious for delaminating in cold weather, so they're always being patched up.


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## editor (May 5, 2011)

I like the central part, I don't think the walkways work - it's really difficult to work out how to get some places - and this thing is hideous.


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

I agree. It doesn't even do anything, it's just full of walkway and ramp that go nowhere


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## maldwyn (May 5, 2011)

One of my favorite places - all council estates should be like this 

I think its isolated vibe - particularly at weekends - is about to change with that massive residential tower being built on its north-east corner.

And its library is the best i've been a member of.


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## editor (May 5, 2011)

Crispy said:


> I agree. It doesn't even do anything, it's just full of walkway and ramp that go nowhere


Mind you, I doubt if you'll find a Tandoori House with a more impressive façade anywhere in Britain.


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## FunkyUK (May 5, 2011)

I walk through most of the spots you have photographed daily.  I love the brutalism of The barbican, and can't get enough of it.  The highwalks around the St Alphage House, Podium Pub, and Westminster and Midland Banks have beed earmarked for redevelopment very soon,  so that should alleviate some of the shabbiness.  I think the Crossrail redevelopment at Moorgate may tidy up the area around Moorfields highwalk too.  Which will be nice.  The pointless stairwell that is above Barbican Tandoori that you've photographed is truly abhorrent, and could happily be knocked down in my book.


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## marty21 (May 5, 2011)

I like it, go there fairly regularly , mostly to go to one of the cinemas, have been to the theatre there a few times, and the art galleries which usually have something interesting on. Plus there's the curve gallery which is free and has strange stuff sometimes - like the little birds flying around from last year, at the moment the curve has a games exhibition, which is basically large screens showing bowling games from atari days to xbox - which is very noisy!  Used to get a bit lost there but over the years you do get used to it, and they have improved the entrance area and navigation. It's great at weekends, as you can park nearby for free, and the city is still very quiet at weekends.


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

maldwyn said:


> One of my favorite places - all council estates should be like this


 
Shame it's not a council estate


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## FridgeMagnet (May 5, 2011)

I love it, though some of that is due to it bringing back memories from early childhood when my parents used to drag me around the South Bank, which is a dreamlike environment when you're only small. The confusing layout just adds to that feeling.

I was there a few months ago in really sharp, clear light, and that really exaggerates the edges and makes for amazing photos.


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

marty21 said:


> Used to get a bit lost there but over the years you do get used to it, and they have improved the entrance area and navigation.


 
By repurposing what's supposed to be the backstage and staff/service entrance on Silk Street


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## marty21 (May 5, 2011)

Crispy said:


> By repurposing what's supposed to be the backstage and staff/service entrance on Silk Street



it is a much better entrance now. 

The cafes are a bit meh though - coffee used to be useless, just out of a push button machine - but they have got costa coffee in now who have a franchise there, so that has improved, but the prices are a bit  for food in the cafe by the lake.

I'm there at the weekend, the annual Australian Film Festival is on for the next couple of weeks.


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## editor (May 5, 2011)

Museum of London is ace though.


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

editor said:


> Museum of London is ace though.


 
Very much so. One of the best museums in the city, IMO.


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## fractionMan (May 5, 2011)

Really?  Never been there.


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

fractionMan said:


> Really?  Never been there.


 
Totally worth the visit. It's got roman remains in the basement, well preserved with shops and pavements all laid out. Lots of replicas of 'typical London scenes' throughout history. Loads of information and interesting exhibits. Basically anything that gets found when foundations are dug in the City ends up there.


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## stethoscope (May 5, 2011)

editor said:


> Museum of London is ace though.


 
It is.


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## fractionMan (May 5, 2011)

Oooh.  I must give it a visit then.


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## TruXta (May 5, 2011)

Me gusta, but yeah, isolated. TBH I find the whole area a bit confusing cuz of shite planning.


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## DJWrongspeed (May 5, 2011)

Crispy said:


> But as town planning it's abysmal. Completely isolated and impenetrable from the surrounding streets. The "front" entrance of the arts center opens onto the lakeside, which would be great if you could actually get to the lake from the surrounding streets or the tube station without navigating a maze of ramps and bridges and passages.



Agree here.  It does have it's good points certainly but enormously let down by accessibility.  I've seen people just give up trying to get to where they wanted to go !  Obviously the arts centre was an afterthought but even there the puzzling routes and obstacles to places continues apace: lifts only going to certain floors, walkways leading to nowhere & hidden box offices !  The Pit theatre is one of London's finest once you get there.

Barbican Architecture Tour  hope to go on this soon.


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## maldwyn (May 5, 2011)

Crispy said:


> Shame it's not a council estate



An estate built by the local council for rent counts as a council estate in my book  - I know some of the original 'social' tenants who haven't done the right to buy thing.

Though admittedly these days it's more of a gated community for the wealthy.


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## Badgers (May 5, 2011)

Love it


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

maldwyn said:


> An estate built by the local council for rent counts as a council estate in my book  - I know some of the original 'social' tenants who haven't done the right to buy thing.
> 
> Though admittedly these days it's more of a gated community for the wealthy.



It's got no social housing in it at all (AFAIK) - your acquaintances must live on the adjacent Golden Lane estate. The Barbican was conceived from the start as middle-class housing for City workers.


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## maldwyn (May 5, 2011)

Crispy said:


> It's got no social housing in it at all (AFAIK) - your acquaintances must live on the adjacent Golden Lane estate. The Barbican was conceived from the start as middle-class housing for City workers.


Interesting, I'll ask them but I'm sure they started out as 'social' tenants.

AFAIK, the Golden Lane estate was built by L.B Finsbury - which then merged with L.B. Islington and finally the estate transferred to the City in the late 80's or early 1990(?)


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## editor (May 5, 2011)

fractionMan said:


> Oooh.  I must give it a visit then.


I posted up a feature here: http://www.urban75.org/blog/a-trip-to-the-museum-of-london/


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## kabbes (May 5, 2011)

I agree with everything Crispy has said.

I've been to numerous seminars, meetings and so on at the Barbican and it is surprisingly difficult to find your way to it and around it.  Seems a shame, really.


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## editor (May 5, 2011)

kabbes said:


> I agree with everything Crispy has said.
> 
> I've been to numerous seminars, meetings and so on at the Barbican and it is surprisingly difficult to find your way to it and around it.  Seems a shame, really.


I had a friend who lived there and it took us an eternity to find the place.


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## Sunray (May 5, 2011)

I'd like to live there. 

It still looks quite good, the faded exterior gives it a certain look that I really like, its a pain to navigate but that is part of the charm.  

The attention to detail in the design lives on and you have a centre of culture in practically in your basement.

Its also (by design) a quiet place to live.


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

1 bed flats start at £260/week - 2 beds start at around £450


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## Badgers (May 5, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Love it


 
I did some one for one of the main estate agents who sold and rented properties in the Barbican estates. He said he totally fell in love with the place over time and now lives there himself. Took me round half a dozen flats one day and I really liked it. 

My father in-law worked 'on the tools' in the Barbican for a long while. We have heard many interesting tales about the _Garchey vacuum-powered waste-disposal system_ and other such engineering marvels  

This is a lovely flat but £585k for a 1 bedroom!!


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

Yeah but look at the size of it! Lovely


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## kabbes (May 5, 2011)

Crispy said:


> Yeah but look at the size of it! Lovely


 
755 sq ft for £585k?


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## Badgers (May 5, 2011)

Crispy said:


> Yeah but look at the size of it! Lovely


 
It is and if money was no object and stuff but still....


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## editor (May 5, 2011)

Badgers said:


> This is a lovely flat but £585k for a 1 bedroom!!


I'll take it!

*if I had some money


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

kabbes said:


> 755 sq ft for £585k?


 
I just meant the living room tbf, and yes it's very expensive.


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## stethoscope (May 5, 2011)

I think it still looks great, but a real maze to navigate around - I've spent many an hour wandering around the estate in the past.

I've only been inside a flat on the estate a couple of times when I worked for an organisation and one of the directors owned a flat there - as Sunray says above, I was really struck by how quiet it was.


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## kabbes (May 5, 2011)

editor said:


> I'll take it!
> 
> *if I had some money


 
Dude!

Here is a flat at the foot of Boxhill -- an _insanely _expensive area in its own right in the Surrey Hills.  

It's located in this:







For £595k, you get 1335 sq ft, including a drawing room that would swallow the Barbican flat's whole reception area whole without noticing and a kitchen in one of those beautiful bay windows.

Personally, I'd still view that flat as massively overpriced but by comparison to the Barbican flat, it's a bargain!


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## editor (May 5, 2011)

kabbes said:


> Personally, I'd still view that flat as massively overpriced but by comparison to the Barbican flat, it's a bargain!


I'll take that one as well. 

*wonders how Google ad revenue can be quickly generated.


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## kabbes (May 5, 2011)

Good answer!


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## Badgers (May 5, 2011)

editor said:


> I'll take it!
> 
> *if I had some money


 
I would go back down to The Jam Factory in SE1 and for that money get one of the 2,000sqft duplex apartments


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## Biddlybee (May 5, 2011)

kabbes said:


> Dude!
> 
> Here is a flat at the foot of Boxhill -- an _insanely _expensive area in its own right in the Surrey Hills.


Check out their bedroom *snigger*

You'd have to pay me to move back to Surrey tbf


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## kabbes (May 5, 2011)

diddlybiddly said:


> Check out their bedroom *snigger*


Holy pelmets, martha.


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## A Dashing Blade (May 5, 2011)

I live there. It's f*cking fantastic.



Crispy said:


> . . .  Built to last 100s of years, so they say.  . .  .


300



Crispy said:


> . . . The "front" entrance of the arts center opens onto the lakeside . . .


? Silk Street is the main entrance for the arts center



Crispy said:


> It's got no social housing in it at all (AFAIK) - your acquaintances must live on the adjacent Golden Lane estate. The Barbican was conceived from the start as middle-class housing for City workers.


Correct about it's conception but pretty sure it was originally council (well, Corporation Of London). Certainly there are a (very) few original tenants around + you'll occaisionally see a Corporation short-term let come on the market.



Badgers said:


> . . .  We have heard many interesting tales about the _Garchey vacuum-powered waste-disposal system_ and other such engineering marvels


Have an original kitchen, absolutely superb layout and totally love my Garchey!



kabbes said:


> . . . Personally, I'd still view that flat as massively overpriced but by comparison to the Barbican flat, it's a bargain!


Pound per square foot it's actually on the cheap side for the area, factor in the stupendous build quality (not a stud wall in sight) and it's a bargin.

Lots more info here


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## kittyP (May 5, 2011)

FridgeMagnet said:


> I love it, though some of that is due to it bringing back memories from early childhood when my parents used to drag me around the South Bank, which is a dreamlike environment when you're only small. The confusing layout just adds to that feeling.
> 
> I was there a few months ago in really sharp, clear light, and that really exaggerates the edges and makes for amazing photos.


 
This is me too. 

It is tatty and kinda oppressive but in a really good way


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## maldwyn (May 5, 2011)

A Dashing Blade said:


> I live there...


Dead jealous - Any other illustrious tenants?

Ones that come to mind Arthur Scargill (NUM flat), Tebbit, John Smith had his heart attack there


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## Crispy (May 5, 2011)

A Dashing Blade said:


> I live there. It's f*cking fantastic.
> 
> ? Silk Street is the main entrance for the arts center


Not by the original design intent. The foyer, box office, lifts and staircases all face the lake, which has multiple entrance doors. The Silk Street entrance is sandwiched between the backstage entrances for the two main performance spaces and was never intended to be the main entrance. The City Highwalks were intended to be the main access to the complex - pedestrians weren't expected to arrive via the street.



> Correct about it's conception but pretty sure it was originally council (well, Corporation Of London). Certainly there are a (very) few original tenants around + you'll occaisionally see a Corporation short-term let come on the market.
> 
> Lots more info here


 Excellent info there, thanks


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## Winot (May 5, 2011)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Barbican Architecture Tour  hope to go on this soon.


 
Well worth doing.


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## ska invita (May 5, 2011)

I went there the other weekend for the first time in years, and for the first time really enjoyed it, and got it as a building. Its confusing to get around, but thats quite fun if youve got time to spare, which I did. Even going to the toilets was an adventure - you go through the door and theres a curved passage which eventually leads to a urinal. 

my friend was telling me that lots of the fixtures in the flats are listed (as is the building), so you cant just fit a new kitchen or what not.


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## A Dashing Blade (May 5, 2011)

ska invita said:


> . . .
> my friend was telling me that lots of the fixtures in the flats are listed (as is the building), so you cant just fit a new kitchen or what not.



Yup, it's grade II listed, you can't change the skirting boards without planning permission for example as they are deemed to be integral to the structure.


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## hipipol (May 6, 2011)

LOve the Barbican

You need to walk round the nearby Golden Lane estate, designed by the same peeps to get the view of why it is the way it is











Worked by it for 2 years, loved the walkways from Moorgate


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## lang rabbie (May 7, 2011)

Crispy said:


> I agree. It doesn't even do anything, it's just full of walkway and ramp that go nowhere


 
I think the original plan for all that vaguely Piranesian brickwork above the Barbican Tandoori was that it was going to support a bridge across Aldersgate Steeet.  The west side of the street would also have been rebuilt in Barbican style with walkways through to St Bartholomew the Great.


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## trashpony (May 7, 2011)

I've got a friend who lives there. It's not very pushchair friendly  I do love it though but the rooms are all _tiny_.

fM - the Museum of London also has a book listing deaths in London. It's open to a page in the 16th century (I think) and the causes of death are very interesting. You can kind of work out what the people actually died of (instead of faded away (cancer?), dropped down dead (heart attack) etc)


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## editor (Oct 23, 2020)

Some new photos: 
















						Empty floors, open spaces and unused stairs: a look around a deserted Barbican Centre – in photos - urban75: art, photos, walks
					

Owned, funded and managed by the City of London Corporation, the Barbican Centre performing arts centre was officially opened to the public by Queen Elizabeth II on 3 March 1982, and is renown for its striking brutalist architecture. I paid a visit earlier this week, and it was sad to see that...




					www.urban75.org


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## ElizabethofYork (Oct 23, 2020)

I lived very close to the Barbican when I was a kid.  When the flats first opened, my mum took me and my sister to view one of the show flats.   It was really lovely, but the rent was too high for my parents to be able to afford, so we stayed in our high rise flat on a nearby council estate.


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## stethoscope (Dec 5, 2022)

Was reminded to post some pics of 'The Cottage' in Barbican, after it was mentioned on Robert Elms 'Notes & Queries' earlier in the year. So I decided to take a look - despite the amount of time I've spent around here, I never noticed it over the years.









Some more history here.


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## Magnus McGinty (Dec 5, 2022)

stethoscope said:


> Was reminded to post some pics of 'The Cottage' in Barbican, after it was mentioned on Robert Elms 'Notes & Queries' earlier in the year. So I decided to take a look - despite the amount of time I've spent around here, I never noticed it over the years.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Coincidentally I past this on Friday as we were out for works drinks in Farringdon and wondered what it was! I thought it ought to belong in a theme park or Beamish.


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