# Coronavirus: music festivals, big gigs, sports events and big gatherings - going ahead and cancelled



## editor (Mar 9, 2020)

SXSW has already been cancelled as has the Ultra music festival in Miami, and there must be a huge shadow over many of the upcoming UK ones.  I suspect that some of the small ones may never come back if they're cancelled this year:

There's an interesting piece in the Guardian: 

*



			'It's a case of holding your nerve': festivals face coronavirus insurance disaster
		
Click to expand...

*


> Many UK music festivals are not insured for communicable diseases, and are nervously waiting to see how far coronavirus spreads
> 
> The postponement of Ultra music festival in Miami and the cancellation of SXSW in Austin came in swift succession last week – the first two major music event casualties of a growing panic over the spread of the coronavirus.
> 
> ...











						'It's a case of holding your nerve': festivals face coronavirus insurance disaster
					

Many UK music festivals are not insured for communicable diseases, and are nervously waiting to see how far coronavirus spreads




					www.theguardian.com


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## editor (Mar 10, 2020)

Postponed: UK's 'The Photography Show' has been postponed due to COVID-19, is still on course for a 2020 show


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## andysays (Mar 10, 2020)

And you will know us by the trail of dead are still on tour - playing in Tufnell Park tonight and St Albans tomorrow


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## souljacker (Mar 10, 2020)

A load of HP conferences and meetings have been canned. Their big annual conference in Croatia has been cancelled but that isn't until July. I think that's daft personally but I've convinced myself that this will all be over by the end of March.


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## killer b (Mar 10, 2020)

I don't think any of the summer festivals are likely to cancel until they're told to tbh. They're pretty much all totally fucked if they don't go ahead, and until the shape of the next few months is a bit clearer, no-one going to voluntarily go bankrupt.


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## editor (Mar 10, 2020)

Interesting list of worldwide cancellations already confirmed. ted 2020 in Vancouver and the French Tomorrowland Music Festival on the casualty list, as is the release of the new James Bond film. 










						All the Live Events, Movie Releases, and Productions Affected by the Coronavirus
					

A long list of broken dreams.




					www.vulture.com


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## editor (Mar 10, 2020)

killer b said:


> I don't think any of the summer festivals are likely to cancel until they're told to tbh. They're pretty much all totally fucked if they don't go ahead, and until the shape of the next few months is a bit clearer, no-one going to voluntarily go bankrupt.


I fear that some will be be fucked anyway, with people reluctant to buy tickets in advance, leaving small festivals with seriously wobbly bank balances.


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## Brainaddict (Mar 10, 2020)

andysays said:


> And you will know us by the trail of dead are still on tour - playing in Tufnell Park tonight and St Albans tomorrow


Make up your own punchline.


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## killer b (Mar 10, 2020)

Bangface is this weekend, I've a load of mates going - reckon it might just squeeze through before the restrictions hit next week...


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## killer b (Mar 10, 2020)

editor said:


> I fear that some will be be fucked anyway, with people reluctant to buy tickets in advance, leaving small festivals with seriously wobbly bank balances.


oh yeah, totally - there's an air of desperation to the sudden flurry of facebook adverts for summer festivals that's currently filling my fb timeline.


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## rutabowa (Mar 10, 2020)

killer b said:


> Bangface is this weekend, I've a load of mates going - reckon it might just squeeze through before the restrictions hit next week...


imagine the comedown from a 3 day rave mixed with actual legitimate paranoia about a killer virus infection, oof.


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## LDC (Mar 10, 2020)

Yup fair few people I know are going to Bangface as a gang. A few have dropped out, but most still going. At the moment anyway, it feels like a lot could change by the weekend though...


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## pesh (Mar 10, 2020)

Bangface is probably harder going on the body than a mild dose of Coronavirus anyway.


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## D'wards (Mar 10, 2020)

No word yet on the Euros or Olympics, but wouldn't be surprised if they get postponed


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## wiskey (Mar 10, 2020)

I had a chat with my friend who's very high up in the planning of Glastonbury about a month ago and she said that they'd already approached PHE then. She seemed more concerned with supplies coming out of China than cancellation ... A lot has clearly happened in the month since and will happen again in the next month ... I'm increasingly doubtful the early summer festivals will go ahead.


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## killer b (Mar 10, 2020)

I was planning on going to this festival in the lakes at the end of the month - it's not really like a typical festival, just a few concerts over a few small venues really... still probably going to be cancelled though I guess. 






						Aerial Festival – Sounds and words in the Lake District
					






					aerialfestival.com


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## phillm (Mar 10, 2020)

Coachella postponed until October over coronavirus fears
					

Concerns continue to affect live music industry, with Madonna, Pearl Jam and Neil Young among those changing plans




					www.theguardian.com


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## pesh (Mar 10, 2020)

if the summer festivals do all get canned i can see a big rise in free parties popping up, especially if its another hot summer, people will be really bored of the virus by then and wanting a party, the police will be overstretched and probably not as keen as usual to charge into a big gathering of dribbling ravers just for the sake of it... should be fun.


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## Fez909 (Mar 10, 2020)

They haven't said CV but it's surely that...


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## skyscraper101 (Mar 10, 2020)

Very precarious times for festivals. Glastonbury must be very nervous.


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## editor (Mar 10, 2020)

skyscraper101 said:


> Very precarious times for festivals. Glastonbury must be very nervous.


I really can't see it going ahead.


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## Fez909 (Mar 10, 2020)

skyscraper101 said:


> Very precarious times for festivals. Glastonbury must be very nervous.


I think Houghton will be very nervous - I don't see how they could survive two cancellations in a row.


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## elbows (Mar 10, 2020)

Most of the talk so far with sports like football have been about having matches behind closed doors.

I dont know how long such a period would even manage to last though, because I can imagine leagues grinding to a complete halt very quickly after any first team players or staff test positive.


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## souljacker (Mar 10, 2020)

elbows said:


> Most of the talk so far with sports like football have been about having matches behind closed doors.
> 
> I dont know how long such a period would even manage to last though, because I can imagine leagues grinding to a complete halt very quickly after any first team players or staff test positive.



The chairman of Notts Forest has it according to the bbc.


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## sihhi (Mar 10, 2020)

elbows said:


> Most of the talk so far with sports like football have been about having matches behind closed doors.
> 
> I dont know how long such a period would even manage to last though, because I can imagine leagues grinding to a complete halt very quickly after any first team players or staff test positive.



France and Spain have started closed doors from tomorrow.


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## 19sixtysix (Mar 10, 2020)

killer b said:


> Bangface is this weekend, I've a load of mates going - reckon it might just squeeze through before the restrictions hit next week...



A pal at work is going. She's slightly concerned she might end up quarantined in Pontin's Southport for more than a weekend


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## Flavour (Mar 10, 2020)

it'll all be cancelled. olympics, euros, premier league. liverpool had better hope they win it mathematically before then, i think they can


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## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 10, 2020)

Almost everyone involved in the sound/staging/lighting crews for touring and festivals are self employed, often at the lower end pretty much living from gig to gig. A lot of people are going to be in deep shit financially over the next few months.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 10, 2020)

This won't just hit big gigs either - loads of venues across Europe are either pulling gigs or being forced to, which is going to make tours financially impractical. Expect to see even small venue shows here in the UK cancelled as well.


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## mr steev (Mar 10, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> This won't just hit big gigs either - loads of venues across Europe are either pulling gigs or being forced to, which is going to make tours financially impractical. Expect to see even small venue shows here in the UK cancelled as well.



One of my friends is a promoter. Her cancellation insurance has gone up from £38 to £300 - which is not affordable as she ony puts on small gigs and doesn't make that much


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## newbie (Mar 10, 2020)

killer b said:


> oh yeah, totally - there's an air of desperation to the sudden flurry of facebook adverts for summer festivals that's currently filling my fb timeline.


my beloved is getting an endless stream of adverts for cruises


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## elbows (Mar 10, 2020)

Flavour said:


> it'll all be cancelled. olympics, euros, premier league. liverpool had better hope they win it mathematically before then, i think they can



I believe Liverpool can win it without kicking another prem league ball if Man City manage to lose tomorrow and on Saturday.


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## Supine (Mar 10, 2020)

Anyone want to buy my rugby tickets for Saturday in Cardiff?

Heard rumours it might get cancelled but looks like we’ll be going.


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## elbows (Mar 11, 2020)

souljacker said:


> The chairman of Notts Forest has it according to the bbc.



And so the effect on the Premier League begins:









						Manchester City match postponed
					

Premier League postpone our match with Manchester City on Wednesday night as precautionary measure




					www.arsenal.com
				






> Our Premier League match with Manchester City on Wednesday night has been postponed.
> 
> Following yesterday’s news that Olympiacos owner Evangelos Marinakis has recently contracted Covid-19, we have been taking medical advice and tracing any individuals who had what the guidelines define as close contact with him at the game 13 days ago.
> 
> ...


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## ddraig (Mar 11, 2020)

Supine said:


> Anyone want to buy my rugby tickets for Saturday in Cardiff?
> 
> Heard rumours it might get cancelled but looks like we’ll be going.


Surely they should postpone??


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## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 11, 2020)

ddraig said:


> Surely they should postpone??


The problem with postponing these things - be it sporting event, festival, whatever - isn’t simply finding a new date. It’s all the supporting equipment, personnel and infrastructure that goes with them. It’s a giant jigsaw puzzle of logistics at the best of times, there just isn’t enough time/kit/people to be able to fit everything in once available dates get reduced.


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## Bahnhof Strasse (Mar 11, 2020)

See Cheltenham has gone ahead, 70 thousand people all mingling in close proximity, around half of them floating back to to Ireland afterwards. Nice way to spread it...


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## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 11, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> See Cheltenham has gone ahead, 70 thousand people all mingling in close proximity, around half of them floating back to to Ireland afterwards. Nice way to spread it...


Yep. Someone is _really_ going to regret making that call IMO.


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## Bahnhof Strasse (Mar 11, 2020)

Former Japanese Health Minister (in charge during Swine Flu) says if COVID-19 not finished by end of April the Olympics will be canned...


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## editor (Mar 11, 2020)

Aand another 








						Coachella postponed until October 2020 due to coronavirus concerns
					

One of the region’s best collections of food and restaurants  won’t happen next month in Indio




					la.eater.com


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## editor (Mar 11, 2020)

Growing list here  Canceled Because of Coronavirus: A Brief List


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## pogofish (Mar 11, 2020)

Looks like our first event is about to be cancelled - been hearing whispers all day. 
It may not be the virus though as whoever scheduled an outdoor party/gig for this time in March when it is still liable to be freezing needs their heid lookit-into! 

And I was expecting the chairperson of one of the big banks today but they cancelled yesterday. The news this morning maybe explains why. 

The Chinese diplomat did turn-up though but it was a different one. Working at their level seems akin to being a drummer in Spinal Tap!


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## Flavour (Mar 11, 2020)

it's like just watching the transparent stupidity of much of the human race day after day, hour after hour. it's really fucking depressing. cheltenham for fuck's sake. the fucking champion's league. idiots.


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## muscovyduck (Mar 11, 2020)

St Patricks Day Parade in Birmingham going ahead, one of the biggest in the world


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## Supine (Mar 11, 2020)

muscovyduck said:


> St Patricks Day Parade in Birmingham going ahead, one of the biggest in the world



They'll all be so pissed the virus wouldn't stand a chance


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## ddraig (Mar 11, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The problem with postponing these things - be it sporting event, festival, whatever - isn’t simply finding a new date. It’s all the supporting equipment, personnel and infrastructure that goes with them. It’s a giant jigsaw puzzle of logistics at the best of times, there just isn’t enough time/kit/people to be able to fit everything in once available dates get reduced.


Totally get that but  thought other matches were getting postponed


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## TopCat (Mar 11, 2020)

How we work rest and play are going to be really affected for decades.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 11, 2020)

Snowbombing 2020 Cancellation Update - Snowbombing
					

Following dicussions with the Austrian authorities, it is with a heavy heart that we have to announce the cancellation of Snowbombing 2020.




					snowbombing.com


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 11, 2020)

muscovyduck said:


> St Patricks Day Parade in Birmingham going ahead, one of the biggest in the world


im glad someones celebrating my birthday


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## phillm (Mar 11, 2020)

Cheletenham Festival today   - oh well one last hurrah and all that- gamblers in the true sense of the wrod.


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## Numbers (Mar 11, 2020)

phillm said:


> Cheletenham Festival today   - oh well one last hurrah and all that- gamblers in the true sense of the wrod.
> 
> View attachment 201328


Should be beaten with a wrod whomever approved it.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 11, 2020)

muscovyduck said:


> St Patricks Day Parade in Birmingham going ahead, one of the biggest in the world


It is as of today yes, but I know not everyone involved in the event support/tech side is particularly happy about this...


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## BigTom (Mar 12, 2020)

NBA season suspended: NBA to suspend season following Wednesday's games | NBA.com

A player tested positive for covid-19. The player had, as a joke, touched all the microphones at a press conference, before he knew he was infected  Plus I think basketball has a crazy schedule where they play games every day or two, so even in a few days, the two teams known to be at risk have played other teams, who have played other teams.

USA has suspended all travel from Europe, except the UK! we can still go there (apparently transfers are blocked as well so mainlanders can't just hop over here to get to the US): Trump halts travel from Europe to US


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## phillm (Mar 12, 2020)

Concert Giants Live Nation and AEG Suspend Tours as Virus Spreads (Published 2020)
					

First South by Southwest was canceled and Coachella got postponed. Now the live-music business is facing billions of dollars in lost income as its two largest promoters shut down shows.




					www.nytimes.com


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## LDC (Mar 12, 2020)

TopCat said:


> How we work rest and play are going to be really affected for decades.



If it's as big as it is looking likely, yes.


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## Miss-Shelf (Mar 12, 2020)

Lp





Numbers said:


> Should be beaten with a wrod whomever approved it.


Hehe


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## elbows (Mar 12, 2020)




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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Mar 12, 2020)

ddraig said:


> Totally get that but  thought other matches were getting postponed



I guess it's easier for football matches etc where they have dedicated facilities on site. A festival or similar that needs setting up specially won't have that.


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## editor (Mar 12, 2020)

It's going to be grim 



> The hardest-hit group in the industry may be the tour managers, soundboard operators, and other venue employees or crew members who rely on tour income and may not be making any salary at all without working on shows. “The biggest concern for someone like myself is that both of the bands I work with are coming out of their slow season,” says Jeff Pereira, the tour manager for Jimmy Eat World and Angels and Airwaves. “You do your best to budget for the time off and then some but weeks of unexpected down time can be a real issue. With so many touring and production people facing the same thing we all end up fighting to get on the few tours that may still be happening or having to look for local work outside of our fields.”











						'Everything Is in Chaos': The Concert Business Stands to Lose Billions From Coronavirus
					

Covid-19 has upended both SXSW and Coachella, but more disruptions are on the way as the live music industry scrambles to change course




					www.rollingstone.com


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## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 12, 2020)

editor said:


> It's going to be grim
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The only hope people have at the moment is that once we come out of this there will be a huge amount of work going as everyone scrambles to reschedule tours and shows. But I'm not that confident the logistics of it all will fit. The touring season is now basically screwed, if it carries on over the summer and all the major festivals go tits up then people are going to end up homeless. And It's not just the freelance crew, there will be entire production/crewing companies that will go to the wall over this.


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## Badgers (Mar 12, 2020)

I have cancelled four events today (400 - 20,000 visitors) and there is no chance of festivals for a couple of months. 

Corporate/Sporting events are a lot easier to reschedule than festivals. There is a massive amount of companies about to go under and a lot of unemployment in the travel/sports/event business. I can reschedule a business event and transfer the tickets. The logistics, artists, finances behind a festival are an organisers nightmare and not one I would relish! There is a lot of goodwill in the events/music/sports biz but that can only carry you so far


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## editor (Mar 12, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The only hope people have at the moment is that once we come out of this there will be a huge amount of work going as everyone scrambles to reschedule tours and shows. But I'm not that confident the logistics of it all will fit. The touring season is now basically screwed, if it carries on over the summer and all the major festivals go tits up then people are going to end up homeless. And It's not just the freelance crew, there will be entire production/crewing companies that will go to the wall over this.


Some venues too, I expect.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 12, 2020)

editor said:


> Some venues too, I expect.


Quite possibly.


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## klang (Mar 12, 2020)

editor said:


> Some venues too, I expect.


I've already had some cancellations at my studio from overseas bands. (A large chunk of my income is from European bands who take some time in London for recording). I dread to think what will happen to me and the studio if bookings dry up completely for a few months.....


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## editor (Mar 12, 2020)

littleseb said:


> I've already had some cancellations at my studio from overseas bands. (A large chunk of my income is from European bands who take some time in London for recording). I dread to think what will happen to me and the studio if bookings dry up completely for a few months.....


It's not like there's any kind of Plan B studios, venues, clubs, bands and bars can adopt. If people can no longer gather, we're fucked.


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## klang (Mar 12, 2020)

editor said:


> It's not like there's any kind of Plan B studios, venues, clubs, bands and bars can adopt. If people can no longer gather, we're fucked.


indeed.
Luckily I have a fair bit of work that doesn't rely on people being physically around lined up. (Mixing Jobs, soundtrack work etc). But that's limited income too. 
A few weeks ago we were still moaning about how little security the music industry provided. Now there is literally none.


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## Fez909 (Mar 12, 2020)

The World Health Organisation has cancelled their upcoming stadium tour









						The Who postpone UK tour over coronavirus concerns
					

The Manchester Arena concert is off - but they've vowed to reschedule




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 12, 2020)

New York City cancels St. Patrick's Day Parade
					

US’s most populous city contemplating other measures




					www.independent.co.uk


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## elbows (Mar 12, 2020)

Three Leicester City players are being tested.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Mar 12, 2020)

Fez909 said:


> The World Health Organisation has cancelled their upcoming stadium tour
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Pete Townshend will have a lot more time to work on his research then.


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## klang (Mar 12, 2020)

superbooth statement:



			https://superbooth.com/files/downloads/Webseite%20Bilder%20und%20Files/2020/Statement%20Corona.pdf


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## elbows (Mar 12, 2020)

littleseb said:


> superbooth statement:
> 
> 
> 
> https://superbooth.com/files/downloads/Webseite%20Bilder%20und%20Files/2020/Statement%20Corona.pdf



Its an old statement now, that position is one many took at the time, but it is sure to be cancelled.


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## klang (Mar 12, 2020)

elbows said:


> Its an old statement now, that position is one many took at the time, but it is sure to be cancelled.


yes sorry realised after posting it was a week old....


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## cybershot (Mar 12, 2020)

Australian GP called off over coronavirus
					

The Australian Grand Prix is called off after teams and drivers forced the hand of Formula 1's bosses over coronavirus concerns.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				












						Uefa to discuss possible Euro 2020 postponement
					

Uefa have called an emergency meeting in which the possibility of postponing Euro 2020 by one year is an option being discussed.




					www.bbc.co.uk


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## clandestino (Mar 12, 2020)

Scotland recommends gatherings of over 500 are banned. So that's all big gigs fucked then, including the Mary Chain at the Barras.

Gatherings of more than 500 people should be cancelled from next week, the Scottish government is advising.

First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said this was to free up emergency services, including police and ambulance crews, to deal with coronavirus.









						Coronavirus: Mass events ban as Scottish virus cases spike
					

Gatherings of more than 500 in Scotland will be cancelled from next week as the UK moves to the delay phase.



					www.bbc.co.uk


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## BigTom (Mar 12, 2020)

‘Fast & Furious 9’ Release Pushed Back a Year Due to Coronavirus
					

“Fast 9” has pushed back its theatrical release date by a year. Universal Studios, the company behind the “Fast & Furious” franchise, made the decision because of the im…




					variety.com
				




Quiet Place 2 is also having its release date pushed back. Expect a lot of films about to come out or go into production will do the same.


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## Fez909 (Mar 12, 2020)

BigTom said:


> ‘Fast & Furious 9’ Release Pushed Back a Year Due to Coronavirus
> 
> 
> “Fast 9” has pushed back its theatrical release date by a year. Universal Studios, the company behind the “Fast & Furious” franchise, made the decision because of the im…
> ...


Yep








						Peter Rabbit 2 film release delayed by four months amid coronavirus fears
					

The sequel becomes the latest major film to have its release pushed back.



					www.bbc.co.uk


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## nogojones (Mar 12, 2020)

clandestino said:


> Scotland recommends gatherings of over 500 are banned. So that's all big gigs fucked then, including the Mary Chain at the Barras.
> 
> Gatherings of more than 500 people should be cancelled from next week, the Scottish government is advising.
> 
> ...


But the big Wales Scotland rugby match still seems to be on


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## Celyn (Mar 12, 2020)

nogojones said:


> But the big Wales Scotland rugby match still seems to be on


Isn't that in Cardiff?


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## BigTom (Mar 12, 2020)

NHL season suspended, this article also says MLS (major league soccer) has suspended the season.









						The NHL has officially suspended its season
					

The NHL has followed the lead of the NBA and the MLS.  It’s now been officially announced that the NHL regular season has been put on...




					www.kelownanow.com
				




Presumably NFL and baseball will do the same though I don't know when their seasons start.


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## nogojones (Mar 12, 2020)

Celyn said:


> Isn't that in Cardiff?


Yeah, but I don't think infection rates are hugely different between Scotland and Wales


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## BigTom (Mar 12, 2020)

BigTom said:


> NHL season suspended, this article also says MLS (major league soccer) has suspended the season.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Major League Baseball suspends spring training, delays start to season: OFFICIAL: MLB is Suspending the Rest of Spring Training, Delaying Regular Season for At Least Two Weeks


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## BigTom (Mar 12, 2020)

Live Nation Planning to Pause Arena Tours Due to Coronavirus
					

Recognizing national concerns over the spread of the coronavirus, Live Nation is instructing its touring shows to prepare to return home. The announcement affects all Live Nation tours, domestically and internationally.




					www.billboard.com
				




Live Nation suspends all touring.


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## rich! (Mar 12, 2020)

Supine said:


> They'll all be so pissed the virus wouldn't stand a chance


60% alcohol is all that's needed. Serious opportunity for every landlord in the city.


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## rich! (Mar 12, 2020)

rich! said:


> 60% alcohol is all that's needed. Serious opportunity for every landlord in the city.


I apologise if this seems flippant to the rest of the thread, btw, appreciate the grief you're all suffering.

as an event organiser I had two weeks of go-no go for an 800 person event in spain last week. I wouldn't wish that on anyone else.

are there any solidarity funds we can pitch into?


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## pesh (Mar 12, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Live Nation Planning to Pause Arena Tours Due to Coronavirus
> 
> 
> Recognizing national concerns over the spread of the coronavirus, Live Nation is instructing its touring shows to prepare to return home. The announcement affects all Live Nation tours, domestically and internationally.
> ...


They also lost £1.8bn off their stock value today apparently.


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## editor (Mar 12, 2020)

This was odd to watch. Just 500 people allowed in the ground. And poor old Lask lost out on their big night out.


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## Marty1 (Mar 12, 2020)

Disneyland shutting down now.









						Disneyland, Disney World To Close Amid Coronavirus Pandemic — HuffPost UK
					

Disney World and Disneyland are closing down as the coronavirus pandemicpersists, Disney officials announced on Thursday.Theme parks at Walt Disney World Resort in Florida and Disneyland Paris Resortwill close after Sunday through the end of the month, according to DisneyParks. Disney Cruise...




					apple.news


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## William of Walworth (Mar 12, 2020)

How relevant is the "How far away is the date of it from now?" factor, for the won't happen/will happen decisions? 

My ony hope (at all, now  ) for Glastonbury still going ahead in late June (  ) is the fact that's it's planned for late June.

Emily has released the big-G line-up today also.
Relevant or not that she's done that??


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## clandestino (Mar 13, 2020)

Mary Chain UK and Europe tour postponed


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## elbows (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Emily has released the big-G line-up today also.
> Relevant or not that she's done that??



Irrelevant, all it means is that like so many gigs in that timeframe, they arent going to give up and cancel 'prematurely'. They dont have any special knowledge about how the outbreak will unfold, the timing of epidemic waves or the state of the country once the first wave has passed.


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## A380 (Mar 13, 2020)




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## BCBlues (Mar 13, 2020)

Birmingham St Patrick's Day celebrations postponed amid coronavirus Birmingham St Patrick's Day celebrations postponed amid coronavirus

Along with Dublin and London.
Not sure if the US ones will be going ahead though


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## Reno (Mar 13, 2020)

SO36, one of the most iconic queer and live music venues of Berlin and once a center of the local punk scene, have been ordered to close by the local government. They've just posted on facebook that if they'll have to close for more than a month then they'll go under if they don't get financial help. They won't be the only ones. I'm really worried what this will do to the cultural life of my city.


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## belboid (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> How relevant is the "How far away is the date of it from now?" factor, for the won't happen/will happen decisions?
> 
> My ony hope (at all, now  ) for Glastonbury still going ahead in late June (  ) is the fact that's it's planned for late June.
> 
> ...


irrelevant.  The outbreak is due to peak in May/June, so plan for End of the Road, might be okay by then.  Any place closing doors now will need to be able to survive three months penniless.


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## belboid (Mar 13, 2020)

Scottish footy off too - Scottish football postponed over coronavirus


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 13, 2020)

Premier League suspended over coronavirus
					

All elite football in England has been suspended until at least 3 April as a result of the global coronavirus pandemic




					www.independent.co.uk


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## editor (Mar 13, 2020)

This is going to really hurt small railways 









						Norfolk steam locomotive gala POSTPONED due to Coronavirus pandemic
					

The North Norfolk Railway has announced that they have taken the decision to postpone the Spring Steam Gala due to the Coronavirus outbreak.




					www.railadvent.co.uk


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## editor (Mar 13, 2020)

Another cancellation.


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## editor (Mar 13, 2020)

Canceled









						Coronavirus: Wales v Scotland Six Nations match called off
					

The Welsh Rugby Union says it is the "only viable option" and in the best interests of fans and players.



					www.bbc.co.uk


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## hash tag (Mar 13, 2020)

editor said:


> View attachment 201538
> 
> Another cancellation.


3 months away


----------



## Supine (Mar 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Canceled
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I got an email at 11:36am confirming it was on. I just sat down on the train to Cardiff to find its cancelled. Fucking amateur hour at the WRU


----------



## editor (Mar 13, 2020)

And another cancellation 









						Coronavirus: English local elections postponed for a year
					

The delay comes as visitor access to Parliament is restricted to reduce the impact of the virus.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

belboid said:


> irrelevant.  The outbreak is due to peak in May/June, so plan for End of the Road, might be okay by then.  Any place closing doors now will need to be able to survive three months penniless.



I do agree, and despite my earlier optimism/scepticism , I now think Glastonbury is *MUCH* more likely to be postponed (but *not* cancelled until 2021, I still don't think).

Still, I'm trying to source the "due to peak in May or June" thing. Did Chris Whitty himself say that?

This Guardian story , dated Thursday 12th March,  says just this :




			
				Press Conference account said:
			
		

> In the UK, the infection is expected to build to a peak in May or June.



then this, in the next paragraph :



> Chris Whitty, the chief medical officer, said that worst-case scenario planning projected that 80% of the country would contract the virus, with a 1% mortality rate. This equates to more than 500,000 deaths.
> 
> Speaking at a sombre press conference in Downing Street, the prime minister said measures to tackle “the worst public health crisis for a generation” could “cause severe disruption” to everyday life for months.



I'm assuming three's more solid and detailed and detailed stuff available about the epidemic/pandemic peaking in May and June in the UK?  (surely sooner, would be my layman's guess  )

But I'm *not *asking the above to "assume" that Glastonbury will go ahead in June after all -- I'm actually beginning to hope now for a September G-week


----------



## pesh (Mar 13, 2020)

Eavis has more chance of finding a cure for the disease than moving the dates of Glastonbury.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth 

As said before I admire your optimistim regarding Glastonbury. 

If Glasto was a football game you have a group of players they are all in one place with excellent facilities. 

If this was an exhibition there would be companies with insurance and marketing teams. 

Glasto is like a super tanker. You can't just turn it around and all will be fine. Global artists, suppliers, police and such. Plus an attendance half the size of Bristol in a field.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Mar 13, 2020)

No news yet, but I'm not hopeful for the Cooper's Hill Cheese Rolling event in May.


----------



## belboid (Mar 13, 2020)

My in-laws' Diamond Wedding Anniversary do is off.

You can imagine how gutted I am about this.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

belboid said:


> My in-laws' Diamond Wedding Anniversary do is off.
> 
> You can imagine how gutted I am about this.


I don't know you or them and am overjoyed about this news. You most be minted.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

Look, it's not like I'm still insisting it will still go ahead in June, I've had to change my mind about that 

So if you're suggesting that they'd be unable to rearrange it until three months later (lateish September, maybe?), I'd question that.

I'm very well aware of the festival's size and logistics, but you can bet your life that they'll be desparate to hold it if all possible, and it's not like all involved haven't got the organisational experience and plenty of it! With big changes to various aspects and acts, sure, but!!

Surely any bans of (or extreme pressure on) mega-gatherings won't last until September??


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

pesh said:


> Eavis has more chance of finding a cure for the disease than moving the dates of Glastonbury.




I disagree -- my (educated  ) guess is that both Eavis's would rather hold it at the 'wrong' date than not at all until June 2021.


----------



## lazythursday (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Look, it's not like I'm still insisting it will still go ahead in June, I've had to change my mind about that
> 
> So if you're suggesting that they'd be unable to rearrange it until three months later (lateish September, maybe?), I'd question that.
> 
> ...


If the peak does end up being June I can't see any restrictions being lifted till say August... which is going to make it too late to organise a decent barn dance at Worthy Farm for September let alone a full scale mega festival.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

I have tickets too William. Not be negative for the sake of it mate. I want to go as well! 

Just that I work in events and know the situation
They might be able to pull of a delay but you need to understand the massive logistics behind this event and be realistic.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

lazythursday said:


> If the peak does end up being June I can't see any restrictions being lifted till say August... which is going to make it too late to organise a decent barn dance at Worthy Farm for September let alone a full scale mega festival.



You think they wouldn't plan for a rearranged fixture any earlier than August?? Seriously doubt it!!


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> You think they wouldn't plan for a rearranged fixture any earlier than August?? Seriously doubt it!!


Are you going to call the artists and their people on this?


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I have tickets too William. Not be negative for the sake of it mate. I want to go as well!
> 
> Just that I work in events and know the situation
> They might be able to pull of a delay but *you need to understand the massive logistics behind this event* and be realistic.



I do *very much* understand all that -- I do work there (on a very small scale, admittedly)

But how about the thought that if postponed, they'd have _additional time_ to re-organise and cope with changes??


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I disagree -- my (educated  ) guess is that both Eavis's would rather hold it at the 'wrong' date than not at all until June 2021.


Want they and you want is not the same as the logistical and planning requirements.


----------



## lazythursday (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> You think they wouldn't plan for a rearranged fixture any earlier than August?? Seriously doubt it!!


How can you make a serious plan for a new date when restrictions are still in place? You can't contract with anyone etc.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> But how about the thought that if postponed, they'd have _additional time_ to re-organise and cope with changes??


That is a thought of course


----------



## pesh (Mar 13, 2020)

you can't magic stages, tents, trackway, plant, gennies and all the rest of it out of thin air though no matter how much time you have, all that stuff will be tied up with other events all summer.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

lazythursday : valid point, but they do know their shit at Pilton. That factor would probably have to alter the _type_ of contract being signed in lots of cases,  but not (necessarily!) the fact that they _could_ be signed


----------



## clicker (Mar 13, 2020)

Saying on any given date that restrictions will start for 4 weeks for example, doesn't mean they'll magically end in 4 weeks.

If restrictions don't show a decrease in numbers contracting the virus, they'll  probably be extended. How can a future date be planned for before the effect of restrictions are seen?

If they do show a decrease in numbers, will a couple of hundred thousand people suddenly think...'oh well that worked, now let's all have a jolly immediately' ?


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

lazythursday said:


> How can you make a serious plan for a new date when restrictions are still in place? You can't contract with anyone etc.


I just called Taylor Swift and she said she will clear her calender on the off chance of an hour in a muddy British field.


----------



## pesh (Mar 13, 2020)

Diana Ross just hung up on me


----------



## gosub (Mar 13, 2020)

lazythursday said:


> If the peak does end up being June I can't see any restrictions being lifted till say August... which is going to make it too late to organise a decent barn dance at Worthy Farm for September let alone a full scale mega festival.



I can't see them moving their equinox party,


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

pesh said:


> Diana Ross just hung up on me


She has forgotten who made her who she is


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

Are Gong and Dreadzone free?


----------



## pesh (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> She has forgotten who made her who she is


she said shes not coming out.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

pesh said:


> you can't magic stages, tents, trackway, plant, gennies and all the rest of it out of thin air though no matter how much time you have, all that stuff will be tied up with other events all summer.



Not "out of thin air". If they can source them for June, then they can source them in September (and with more time to plan, as I said). And all the supply lines are annually fully in place (just put on hold in fallow years like 2018)..

I have zero doubt that those plans have been in place for months for a June event. Even though they're almost certain to be called a halt to now, for June, re-arranging for September will in no way be beyond them if they're determined enough.

The very *size* of Glastonbury and its organisational infrastructure could actually *help* them in that respect!!

TBF though, I'm not completely ruling out their killing it off altogather until June 2021, but right now I'd consider that outcome far less likely.


----------



## clicker (Mar 13, 2020)

Paul McCartney's free.


----------



## belboid (Mar 13, 2020)

pesh said:


> all that stuff will be tied up with other events all summer.


not this summer.

If they planned now for a re-arranged date in late August, they _might _get away with it considering how many other shows will be cancelled, leaving performers with nothing to do.  They would probably need it confirmed to be okay to go ahead a month in advance tho to set everything up.


----------



## pesh (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Are Gong and Dreadzone free?


i think you have to give them one of those 5 litre bottles of cider


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Are Gong and Dreadzone free?



I'm sure they'll make sure to be chatting with them  

And with one or two other bands and acts as well


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I do agree, and despite my earlier optimism/scepticism , I now think Glastonbury is *MUCH* more likely to be postponed (but *not* cancelled until 2021, I still don't think).
> 
> Still, I'm trying to source the "due to peak in May or June" thing. Did Chris Whitty himself say that?
> 
> ...


William, it won’t get moved. Just try and think of the logistics involved. If it’s cancelled that’s it for the year.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

belboid said:


> not this summer.
> 
> If they planned now for a re-arranged date in late August, they _might _get away with it considering how many other shows will be cancelled, leaving performers with nothing to do.  They would probably need it confirmed to be okay to go ahead a month in advance tho to set everything up.



I'd forgotten that point, good one.

I suspect September would be easier than August, but still, we'll see


----------



## belboid (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I just called Taylor Swift and she said she will clear her calend*a*r on the off chance of an hour in a muddy British field.  of major TV coverage in the UK and all around the globe, that helps her sell another million records


cfy


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> William, it won’t get moved. Just try and think of the logistics involved. If it’s cancelled that’s it for the year.


Yup. Not being negative William. These are the facts


----------



## lazythursday (Mar 13, 2020)

William, brace yourself for the fact that there's likely only a 50/50 chance of it going ahead in 2021. Fuck knows what will happen with this virus and how that will play out, let alone the economic consequences.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> William, it won’t get moved. Just try and think of the logistics involved. If it’s cancelled that’s it for the year.



There are counter-arguments, see other posts. It's not like they'd think of reorganising it only to mid July!

I doubt I'll be able to stay away from this subject  , but for now, I've got to dash ...


----------



## belboid (Mar 13, 2020)

in good news corner...


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

lazythursday said:


> William, brace yourself for the fact that there's likely *only a 50/50 chance of it going ahead in 2021*. Fuck knows what will happen with this virus and how that will play out, let alone the economic consequences.



Now that really *is *stupidly over-pessimistic! 

ETA : I'll bet you several   's that 2021 will be nailed on . Might offer odds on later this year too. Possibly!


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> There are counter-arguments


No, there aren’t. I don’t think you really grasp just what’s involved.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Now that really *is *stupidly over-pessimistic!


Realistic


----------



## belboid (Mar 13, 2020)

London Marathon is the latest victim


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

Confirmed: Giro d'Italia 2020 has been postponed
					

The postponement of the entire race follows the earlier cancellation of the opening three stages in Hungary




					www.cyclingweekly.com


----------



## hegley (Mar 13, 2020)

London Marathon just been postponed to October.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

clicker said:


> Saying on any given date that restrictions will start for 4 weeks for example, doesn't mean they'll magically end in 4 weeks.
> 
> If restrictions don't show a decrease in numbers contracting the virus, they'll  probably be extended. How can a future date be planned for before the effect of restrictions are seen?
> 
> If they do show a decrease in numbers, will a couple of hundred thousand people suddenly think...'oh well that worked, now let's all have a jolly immediately' ?




Just seen the above post, but my suggestion (OK speculation!) was September, not 'immediately' after 4 weeks!


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

Re this "Glastronbury actually cancelled as well in 2021!"  malarkey :


Badgers said:


> Realistic



Bets are on for 2021! You will *so* definitely lose on that particular one. I like beer! And cider!


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Just seen thus, but my suggestion (OK speculation!) was September, not 'immediately' after 4 weeks!


Speculation is not great at such times. You have several people who know the events and music/gig business all telling you the same thing. Not because we want to piss on your chips mate, but we are not speculating.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Mar 13, 2020)

hegley said:


> London Marathon just been postponed to October.




Two friends running it, Holly is at peak training, doing 15 to 20 mile runs every week. Laura has done fuck all for the past three weeks and will be very happy with this news...


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Re this "Glastronbury actually cancelled as well in 2021!"  malarkey :
> 
> 
> Bets are on for 2021! You will *so* definitely lose on that particular one. I like beer! And cider!


I will buy you a drink at festivals regardless of this shit as you well know  just don't cling on to false hope  

50/50 is probably about right for Glasto. A lot of other festivals are way lower than that sadly  event organisers and their suppliers rarely have a warchest of money for such things.


----------



## editor (Mar 13, 2020)

I expect every major UK music summer festival to be cancelled this year


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Speculation is not great at such times. You have several people who know the events and music/gig business all telling you the same thing. Not because we want to piss on your chips mate, but we are not speculating.



Any speculation is *mine alone*, 
I wasn't applying that word to other peoples' posts. Maybe I would to the '2021 not happening!' thing maybe  ...but not the rest.

But the particular bit of mine that the Eavises will be desparate to hold the fest if at all possible, has some validity, hence my relevant posts about their organisational/operational/logistics-centred experience for a postponement this year.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Mar 13, 2020)

clandestino said:


> Scotland recommends gatherings of over 500 are banned. So that's all big gigs fucked then, including the Mary Chain at the Barras.
> 
> Gatherings of more than 500 people should be cancelled from next week, the Scottish government is advising.











						Johnson: many more people will lose loved ones to coronavirus
					

Government says up to 10,000 may already be infected as UK moves into ‘delay’ phase




					www.theguardian.com
				






> Announcing Scotland’s decision to ban public gatherings of more than 500 people earlier on Thursday afternoon, Nicola Sturgeon said it was not based on scientific evidence, which suggests it will not have a significant impact on the spread of the virus


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I will buy you a drink at festivals regardless of this shit as you well know  just don't cling on to false hope



 



> 50/50 is probably about right for Glasto.



2020 (Sept)


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

The Ideal Home Show is somehow STILL maintaining they are going ahead. Not a show that appeals to most the U75 crowd but is so big (in the events world) I am amazed they have not cancelled. 

They have Olympia booked for four weeks (build up and show) plue usually 200k + visitors.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 13, 2020)

hegley said:


> London Marathon just been postponed to October.


I’m assuming that I’m not going to be riding  Velo Birmingham in June either


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

I think it's pretty well known by now that in England, all Premier, Championship and Leagues 1 and 2 foottball is off until at least April 3rd and maybe for longer.

In the Six Nations, Wales v Scotland tomorow in Cardiff is also now off, along with the already postponed England/Italy and France/Ireland matches.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> The Ideal Home Show is somehow STILL maintaining they are going ahead. Not a show that appeals to most the U75 crowd but is so big (in the events world) I am amazed they have not cancelled.
> 
> They have Olympia booked for four weeks (build up and show) plue usually 200k + visitors.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I think it's pretty well known by now that in England, all Premier, Championship and Leagues 1 and 2 foottball is off until at least April 3rd and maybe for longer.
> 
> In the Six Nations, Wales v Scotland tomorow in Cardiff is also now off, along with the already postponed England/Italy and France/Ireland matches.


And Glasto?


----------



## Glitter (Mar 13, 2020)

Expecting my marathon to be cancelled/postponed.

Two big gigs (Aerosmith + GNR) and Download coming up too.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 13, 2020)

Badgers said:


> And Glasto?



I was _trying_ to change the subject!


----------



## Badgers (Mar 13, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I was _trying_ to change the subject!


You are doing well


----------



## Indeliblelink (Mar 13, 2020)

.


----------



## ddraig (Mar 13, 2020)

waaaaa waaaaa waaaaa won't someone tell william what he wants to hear so he's alright jack! 
For someone who has attended and worked at so many glastos you really should have more of a clue about the scale and logistics!


----------



## ddraig (Mar 13, 2020)

totally ridiculous they left it til today to cancel the rugby in Cardiff, loads of Scots here already, shambles


----------



## wiskey (Mar 13, 2020)

UK to ban mass gatherings in coronavirus U-turn
					

Measure likely to come into effect next week after sporting bodies and others act unilaterally




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## magneze (Mar 14, 2020)

How to help the electronic music community · News ⟋ RA
					

We've collated some useful resources for those affected by the coronavirus pandemic.




					www.residentadvisor.net


----------



## andysays (Mar 14, 2020)

Japanese PM still saying the Tokyo Olympics will go ahead in July as planned. 

Unbelievable, TBH


----------



## PursuedByBears (Mar 18, 2020)

Glastonbury cancelled/postponed to 2021.


----------



## editor (Mar 18, 2020)

Full statement:


----------



## Voley (Mar 23, 2020)

Heard some talk on the radio about having football matches played behind closed doors in June now/a possibility of ending the season. Some discussion about having a televised game every day to keep people entertained while we're locked down.

Seems optimistic to me I must admit but it would be nice to have something to take our minds off it all, for sure.

I know a few footballers are ill with it already. Fellaini for example.


----------



## May Kasahara (Mar 23, 2020)

Not a big gig by any means, but I received a text the other day saying that the Dean Wareham gig scheduled for April has now been postponed to 28th January next year. Which is remarkably efficient.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 23, 2020)

Olympics gone too
Likely 2021


----------



## Badgers (Mar 23, 2020)

Venue being allocated 









						ExCel London could be used as a hospital to treat coronavirus patients
					

NHS bosses and the military have discussed using the ExCel London centre as a makeshift hospital to deal with the coronavirus outbreak.




					www.cityam.com


----------



## Voley (Mar 23, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Olympics gone too
> Likely 2021


About fucking time too. Made right prats out of themselves delaying this decision imo.

ETA has this been confirmed Badgers ? Can't see out on the bbc etc


----------



## Badgers (Mar 23, 2020)

Voley said:


> About fucking time too. Made right prats out of themselves delaying this decision imo.
> 
> ETA has this been confirmed Badgers ? Can't see out on the bbc etc


https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/2899848001#click=[URL]https://t.co/bNSJvxDhBN[/URL]


----------



## Badgers (Mar 23, 2020)

Not official but we all know it is done


----------



## Voley (Mar 23, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Not official but we all know it is done


Ta.


----------



## brogdale (Apr 3, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> See Cheltenham has gone ahead, 70 thousand people all mingling in close proximity, around half of them floating back to to Ireland afterwards. Nice way to spread it...


Most unsurprising Rona headline so far?
(behind £wall, so no link)


----------



## brogdale (Apr 3, 2020)

Ashton has picked up on this.
No evidences such, but of course the tories would be susceptible to lobbying from this quarter...or any other corporate donors, tbh.


----------



## Shippou-Sensei (Apr 4, 2020)

ok sorta  a reverse is  that   they are new streaming musicals


----------



## TopCat (Apr 4, 2020)

The pzazz will have evaporated.  Most Tory MP's are buy to let landlords. After the agreed three months then evictions like the poll tax days. 
Hopefully we will have learnt lessons from back then. Then will put those lessons into practice.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 12, 2020)

Favour folks. 

Can anyone get me this article from behind the Paywall? 









						ExCeL to charge for shows it can’t host
					

The ExCeL centre in London is continuing to charge corporate clients for events cancelled while it is in use as an emergency hospital. Events organisers forced to pull or postpone conferences due to the coronavirus have been told by the ExCeL that “licence fees”, which cover the use of the venue but




					www.thetimes.co.uk


----------



## Badgers (Apr 12, 2020)

Anyone?


----------



## belboid (Apr 12, 2020)

Here you go:



			
				The Times said:
			
		

> The ExCeL centre in London is continuing to charge corporate clients for events cancelled while it is in use as an emergency hospital.
> 
> Events organisers forced to pull or postpone conferences due to the coronavirus have been told by the ExCeL that “licence fees”, which cover the use of the venue but not extras such as staff, will still be payable. Licence fees can be hundreds of thousands of pounds for a single event.
> 
> ...


----------



## Badgers (Apr 12, 2020)

belboid said:


> Here you go:


Cheers  

Let me know if you need anything from the Sunday Sport.


----------



## editor (Apr 16, 2020)

Download (June 12-14th) has thrown in the towel on this year's festival.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 16, 2020)

editor said:


> Download (June 12-14th) has thrown in the towel on this year's festival.


Should have been done a long time ago


----------



## Numbers (Apr 16, 2020)

Love Supreme officially cancelled y/day.


----------



## editor (Apr 17, 2020)

Bold move



> Reading & Leeds Festival 2020 organisers have reassured fans that the festival is still going ahead despite of the coronavirus outbreak.
> 
> This year’s festivals are due to be held from August 28-30. Stormzy, Liam Gallagher and Rage Against The Machine will headline the main stages across the three days.











						Reading & Leeds Festival 2020 "is going ahead as planned" amid coronavirus outbreak
					

Reading & Leeds Festival 2020 organisers have reassured fans that the festivals are still going ahead despite the coronavirus outbreak




					www.nme.com


----------



## Mation (Apr 17, 2020)

editor said:


> Bold move
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Wow. Seems unlikely. But even if it does actually go ahead, I wonder if people will have any appetite for it by then. 

Perhaps if enough people are freaked out by the idea of going somewhere really crowded, they'll stay away, leaving a small hardcore of people prepared to spend two weeks after the event in imposed isolation!


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 17, 2020)

There still quite a lot of festivals planned for July which are still on.  I can see some sort of relaxing of the lockdown by then but not to the extent of allowing a 10k - 20 k music festival to happen.  Seems incredibly wishful thinking by the organisers to the extent that I wonder whether there is something related to insurance going on.


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 17, 2020)

Mation said:


> Wow. Seems unlikely. But even if it does actually go ahead, I wonder if people will have any appetite for it by then.
> 
> Perhaps if enough people are freaked out by the idea of going somewhere really crowded, they'll stay away, leaving a small hardcore of people prepared to spend two weeks after the event in imposed isolation!



The age demographic of these festivals don't really give a fuck about covid-19.  If it goes ahead it'll be a fully attended as normal.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 17, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> There still quite a lot of festivals planned for July which are still on.  I can see some sort of relaxing of the lockdown by then but not to the extent of allowing a 10k - 20 k music festival to happen.  Seems incredibly wishful thinking by the organisers to the extent that I wonder whether there is something related to insurance going on.


As stated before NO event insurance policy covers cancellation due to COVID-19. 

What may be possible is the venue (field/location) are unwilling to transfer the booking to a later date or following year until government guidelines make it necessary.


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2020)

Oktoberfest falls...









						'Bitter pill': Bavaria cancels Oktoberfest over fears of coronavirus spread
					

Famed German beer festival usually attracts around 6 million visitors a year




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2020)

Notting Hill Carnival must be hanging on by a thread.


----------



## rubbershoes (Apr 22, 2020)

I can only see massive events like that going ahead if there's a vaccine and widespread vaccination.


----------



## klang (Apr 22, 2020)

editor said:


> Notting Hill Carnival must be hanging on by a thread.


Octoberfest being cancelled I can't see NH Carnival going ahead. (Different country, i know, but still...)


----------



## hegley (Apr 22, 2020)

Berlin marathon (27th September) has been cancelled. German government has banned group gatherings of more than 5,000 people until after October 24.


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 22, 2020)

Total guesswork on my behalf but we might (subsequent waves permitting) get gatherings of up to 500 allowed by the end of the summer.  Any more than, forget it I reckon. Then again the a member of the pub trade was on this morning mentioning Christmas.  So if you're not opening the pubs and restaurants I don't see how they can justify any sort of large gathering.

Fuck knows.


----------



## mx wcfc (Apr 22, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Total guesswork on my behalf but we might (subsequent waves permitting) get gatherings of up to 500 allowed by the end of the summer.  Any more than, forget it I reckon. Then again the a member of the pub trade was on this morning mentioning Christmas.  So if you're not opening the pubs and restaurants I don't see how they can justify any sort of large gathering.
> 
> Fuck knows.


I was hoping Something Else might happen - small, outdoors, end of September.  But other festivals rescheduled to September, so they had to cancel.  I was gutted.
I have a ticket for Bearded, but that is a lot bigger.  I'm expecting it just to be rolled forward to next year.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

editor said:


> Notting Hill Carnival must be hanging on by a thread.


No fucking chance that is happening this year 
Know I might seem a misery at the moment but working in hospitality and global events I can't see any way, need or point.

The carnival (pleasing as it maybe) is a massive undertaking for (what will then be a depleted) the emergency services and is always a crush of people and litter.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 22, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Total guesswork on my behalf but we might (subsequent waves permitting) get gatherings of up to 500 allowed by the end of the summer.  Any more than, forget it I reckon. *Then again the a member of the pub trade was on this morning mentioning Christmas.*  So if you're not opening the pubs and restaurants I don't see how they can justify any sort of large gathering.
> 
> .



I've got a couple of my posts from the other day about this. Bear with me while I find them .....
ETA : OK, from the UK Coronavirus lockdown thread :


William of Walworth said:


> I hate to refer to a S*n story , but their front page scream-headline today was *'Pubs could stay closed until Xmas!*'
> A somewhat more measured version of this appears in today's Metro -- their version of the story also gives the source for the shitrag's headline :
> 
> 
> ...



So unsurprisingly, it seems that The S*n were sensationalising/exaggerating it.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I've got a couple of my posts from the other day about this. Bear with me while I find them .....
> ETA : OK, from the UK Coronavirus lockdown thread :


Just spoke to a brewery chap I do some work with and he said they will not be opening any pubs before August for several reasons but mostly fear of harming people, bad PR and potential legal action from staff/customers.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 22, 2020)

Also :



			
				William of Walworth said:
			
		

> I hate to refer to a S*n story , but their front page scream-headline today was *'Pubs could stay closed until Xmas!*'





> And today's story on the British Beer and Pub Association website does not mention when they think pubs will re-open
> (July, as the Metro//Truman Brewery guy suggested, seems possible -- or maybe August).
> 
> 
> ...





William of Walworth said:


> And today's story on the British Beer and Pub Association website does not mention when they think pubs will re-open
> (July, as the Metro//Truman Brewery guy suggested, seems possible -- or maybe August).



So all in all, although "Xmas before pubs re-open!" is a possibility, it's essentially a S*n sensationalisation at this stage. Even the S*n headline said "could" ....


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Also :
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I suspect we will have pubs open this year William  just a fair wait yet.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 22, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Just spoke to a brewery chap I do some work with and he said they will not be opening any pubs before August for several reasons but mostly fear of harming people, bad PR and potential legal action from staff/customers.



August is very plausible, say locals in the trade here (bear in mind we're in Swansea, not London, though). They are also possibly contemplating (maybe?) mid/lateJuly.
I was mainly just trying to kill the "not until Xmas" thing in Teaboy 's post -- that wasn't what the Truman's Brewery chap originally said anyway.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 22, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I suspect we will have pubs open this year William  just a fair wait yet.



See above --- late July, or maybe more likely August, isn't too bad a guess, I'd say -- at least at this stage!


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

Some news: 









						UK firms plan legal action against Hiscox over Covid-19 insurance claims
					

More than 100 pubs and nightclubs join forces over non-payment of pandemic claims




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 22, 2020)

editor said:


> Oktoberfest falls...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


On a much more minor scale, our organising committee have just had to cancel our beer festival (Swansea Bay Beer and Cider Festival). Second biggest in Wales mind! Originally scheduled for August Bank Holiday weekend.
This was _technically_ a slightly premature decision for our event, given that we 'only' have about 90 to 100 beers/25 to 30 ciders available, but the main factor was that the deadline for booking the Brangwyn Hall for our event was the start of this week.
Plus also our beer list organiser (until recently a professional brewer) was already starting to have kittens about supply of the beers of choice


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 22, 2020)

Just come off a conference call of various event industry people. Obviously we're all trying to second guess where things are going to land, but the overriding feeling is that any event with more than 1000 people in one place certainly isn't going to happen this year. Talk of rescheduled festivals in September/October is pure fantasy right now.

The other issue for many venues - even smaller ones - is that of maintenance/safety. Traditionally getting all the certification/testing of various critical systems (trussing, chain motors, high power electrical systems) is done over the summer, when the venues are quiet due to everyone being out in fields for festival season. If none of that work has been done due to closures, lack of personnel etc then nothing can open because the venues will no longer be certified as safe and thus uninsured. We reckon at my venue we're going to need at least a month from getting access back in the building before we can open, and that's assuming we can get inspection work booked because the number of trained people that can do it is limited and they are going to be rushed off their feet.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 22, 2020)

In tems of general pub news, The Morning Advertiser is a good trade journal to follow.

Nothing specific (or even at all!) there about possible reopening dates yet, but it can be an informative source.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

To be honest most pubs are not really in the category of: 


> music festivals, big gigs, sports events and big gatherings


Two large (15k+) events I work on had postponed from March/April 2020 to July/August 2020 respectively. 
Both of these are now postponed (or cancelled if you will) till March/April 2021


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Just come off a conference call of various event industry people. Obviously we're all trying to second guess where things are going to land, but the overriding feeling is that any event with more than 1000 people in one place certainly isn't going to happen this year. Talk of rescheduled festivals in September/October is pure fantasy right now.


Exactly this ^


----------



## ddraig (Apr 22, 2020)

This thread isn't about pubs

2 gigs meant to be going to this week postponed til September but doubtful they will happen then even


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 22, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Just come off a conference call of various event industry people. Obviously we're all trying to second guess where things are going to land, but the overriding feeling is that any event with more than 1000 people in one place certainly isn't going to happen this year. Talk of rescheduled festivals in September/October is pure fantasy right now.
> 
> The other issue for many venues - even smaller ones - is that of maintenance/safety. Traditionally getting all the certification/testing of various critical systems (trussing, chain motors, high power electrical systems) is done over the summer, when the venues are quiet due to everyone being out in fields for festival season. If none of that work has been done due to closures, lack of personnel etc then nothing can open because the venues will no longer be certified as safe and thus uninsured. We reckon at my venue we're going to need at least a month from getting access back in the building before we can open, and that's assuming we can get inspection work booked because the number of trained people that can do it is limited and they are going to be rushed off their feet.



Really informative, thanks. One big "current" tour (Nick Cave) has been pushed right back to April 2021.

With festivals, for ages now I've been losing confidence about even the relatively small Bearded Theory (7,500-ish) happening at their planned new date in mid September.
So apologies to you for insisting a while back that it was still a good possibility -- I really doubt that now  .. and have done for over a fortnight.

But is does seem weird that festivals still scheduled (Reading/Leeds included!) are delaying confirming cancellations -- is that insurance related, or more?


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 22, 2020)

ddraig said:


> This thread isn't about pubs
> 
> 2 gigs meant to be going to this week postponed til September but doubtful they will happen then even



The point being if you won't open a pub with 30 people in it than allowing much larger gatherings would look like an odd decision.


----------



## ddraig (Apr 22, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> The point being if you won't open a pub with 30 people in it than allowing much larger gatherings would look like an odd decision.


Yes of course


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 22, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> But is does seem weird that festivals still scheduled (Reading/Leeds included!) are delaying confirming cancellations -- is that insurance related, or more?


God knows. But they're not going to happen.


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2020)

Selfishly, I live in hope of the (frankly unlikely) possibility of events under 500 people becoming permitted sometime in the not too distant future because that works fabulously for my band and DJ gigs.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 22, 2020)

If smaller (think theatres/academy size places etc) open up before the enormo-domes, expect big name acts to suddenly develop an interest in "intimate", week long residency style gigs. Small bands won't get a look in


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> If smaller (think theatres/academy size places etc) open up before the enormo-domes, expect big name acts to suddenly develop an interest in "intimate", week long residency style gigs. Small bands won't get a look in


Sad to agree with this


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 22, 2020)

editor said:


> Selfishly, I live in hope of the (frankly unlikely) possibility of events under 500 people becoming permitted sometime in the not too distant future because that works fabulously for my band and DJ gigs.



I don't think there is anything wrong with hope tempered with realism.  We need hope now more than ever.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> I don't think there is anything wrong with hope tempered with realism.  We need hope now more than ever.


I need a pint of hope


----------



## pesh (Apr 22, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> If smaller (think theatres/academy size places etc) open up before the enormo-domes, expect big name acts to suddenly develop an interest in "intimate", week long residency style gigs. Small bands won't get a look in


Yeah, I imagine the Stereophonics are keen to get back to infecting their fanbase as soon as possible.


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I need a pint of hope


A night in even the emptiest or most unpleasant pub suddenly seems like the stuff of dreams.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Apr 26, 2020)

Sam Fender/Killers in June now moved to 4th June 2021, which is Frau Bahn’s mum’s 80th, so presume we will have to not head to Highbury. No mention of refunds or re-selling, perhaps in time that may happen..?


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 26, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Sam Fender/Killers in June now moved to 4th June 2021, which is Frau Bahn’s mum’s 80th, so presume we will have to not head to Highbury. *No mention of refunds or re-selling, perhaps in time that may happen..?*



Useful-looking general feature in yesterday's Money Guardian about refunds, etc., for cancelled or postponed events :





			
				Guardian said:
			
		

> *Coronavirus refunds : why fans are raging over ticket policies *
> 
> *With thousands of live events axed or rescheduled, many fans are finding it tricky to get money back*


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Apr 27, 2020)

Ta, it’s Ticketmaster and that article says we can have a refund, nothing in their email or on their website suggests that, but will give it a go...


----------



## BristolEcho (Apr 27, 2020)

I honestly don't see how they can square with club nights running this year. I'd love it to happen safely, but the realist in me says it surely can't? How can they justify 500 people in a tiny pace, utterly twatted, and with dodgy soap free toilets? 

I saw they opened some in Korea so that will be a test.


----------



## pesh (Apr 27, 2020)

Events in November now being cancelled








						Coronavirus: Somerset illuminated carnivals cancelled
					

Parades, including Bridgwater Carnival due to be held in November, are cancelled amid the coronavirus pandemic.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				





> A series of illuminated carnivals in November that attract tens of thousands of visitors to Somerset have been cancelled due to coronavirus.
> 
> The circuit - which includes Bridgwater, the UK's oldest carnival - were called off due to the organiser's concerns over health and safety.
> 
> ...


----------



## Supine (Apr 27, 2020)

Still waiting for We Out Here to cancel. I don't mind holding my ticket till next year though. I certainly can't see any scenario in which it'll happen in August.


----------



## treelover (Apr 27, 2020)

SJM Concerts going to lose a few of his millions.


----------



## Numbers (Apr 27, 2020)

editor said:


> Notting Hill Carnival must be hanging on by a thread.


As much as I absolutely Love Carnival, even if it did go ahead I wouldn’t go.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 27, 2020)

Numbers said:


> As much as I absolutely Love Carnival, even if it did go ahead I wouldn’t go.


Given the location, footfall and total lack of distancing it is probably one of the most dangerous 'potential' events you could attend at this time.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 27, 2020)

More group calls this morning, more depressing outlook all round from the industry. Things are _bad_ 

Will try and do a better summary later today when I’m done with wanting to throw myself off a (metaphorical) cliff.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 27, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> More group calls this morning, more depressing outlook all round from the industry. Things are _bad_


They are very bad. 
Although we might see small 'events' this year people are still scared. 

My events (exhibitions not gigs) are now all moved to 2021 (March earliest) but mixing music/film/theatre venues (who can't just open without notice anyway) with alcohol, traveling, security and other factors is going to be a nightmare on all fronts. It is a shitshow in the making sorry to say


----------



## Looby (Apr 27, 2020)

End Of The Road festival (early September) hasn’t been cancelled yet but I’m assuming it will be. The ticket balance is due in July I think so they’ll have to make a decision before then surely?
I’m happy for them to keep my deposit for next year I guess, I’ll only be paying it again in September when 2021 goes on sale. 
I haven’t had a refund for Taylor Swift at Hyde Park yet, by early May apparently. For that one I’d much rather a reschedule but it’s been cancelled. 
The latest event for me this year is Shiiine On in November but that’s really not going to happen either.

I’d been worrying and planning how to pay for all the festivals and gigs this year and working out my annual leave. That sounds like a nice problem to have right now.


----------



## belboid (Apr 27, 2020)

Lattetude finally thrown in the towel


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 27, 2020)

Boomtown (Wednesday 12th to Sunday 16th August) has so far had no update since March 26th, either on their main site or on their Facebook page

Beautiful Days (following weekend -- Thursday 20th to Sunday 23rd August) cancelled last week, and it's a lot smaller.

Weird how different festivals announce they're gone at wildly different times ....... after all, it's pretty well known that the like;lihood of fests happening in August is pretty damned low by now, so you might as well announce, Event Organisers!


----------



## Badgers (Apr 28, 2020)

__





						No more delays: Postponed Tokyo Olympics to be CANCELLED if coronavirus not under control by 2021, organizing committee head says
					





					www.rt.com


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 28, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Boomtown (Wednesday 12th to Sunday 16th August) has so far had no update since March 26th, either on their main site or on their Facebook page
> 
> Beautiful Days (following weekend -- Thursday 20th to Sunday 23rd August) cancelled last week, and it's a lot smaller.
> 
> Weird how different festivals announce they're gone at wildly different times ....... after all, it's pretty well known that the like;lihood of fests happening in August is pretty damned low by now, so you might as well announce, Event Organisers!



Just looking at some of the other festivals.  Beatherder is in mid-July and has still not cancelled, last update on the website is from mid-march.  Must be heartbreaking (and financially a disaster) for the people who run these things to make these calls but you do wonder why they can't see the obvious.


----------



## mx wcfc (Apr 28, 2020)

Wickham Festival (6-10 August) haven't cancelled yet either.  I can't see any gatherings over 500 people being allowed in August, but I agree with their approach - there is no sense in cancelling until you have to.


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 28, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Wickham Festival (6-10 August) haven't cancelled yet either.  I can't see any gatherings over 500 people being allowed in August, but I agree with their approach - there is no sense in cancelling until you have to.



I guess but there are lots of arrangements people have to make outside of simply turning up for a few days.  It would also be a major change in government policy to actually let us know what their plans are for releasing the lockdown so the likelihood is we won't know what is happening until a few days before it happens.


----------



## belboid (Apr 28, 2020)

Tramlines is still selling tickets for the beginning of August.  I suppose they’re trying to let people get used to the idea of rolling your ticket over till next years do before they actually tell us that’s what they’re doing.


----------



## mx wcfc (Apr 28, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> I guess but there are lots of arrangements people have to make outside of simply turning up for a few days.  It would also be a major change in government policy to actually let us know what their plans are for releasing the lockdown so the likelihood is we won't know what is happening until a few days before it happens.


I suspect that those August festivals that haven't cancelled yet will start cancelling from June.  I agree that there is a hell of a lot of logistics involved, but many festival backstage people/vendors/bands etc won't have much else to do at the moment.  Getting a couple of biggish festies on in August would help a lot of festival crew, I would think 

(all this subject to the covid situation, obv)


----------



## Badgers (Apr 28, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Wickham Festival (6-10 August) haven't cancelled yet either.  I can't see any gatherings over 500 people being allowed in August, but I agree with their approach - there is no sense in cancelling until you have to.


Zero chance it will happen. 

Better to cancel now otherwise they are just stringing ticket holders, suppliers, artists and all other parties along. 

The only thing I can imagine is they are haggling with the venue for new dates so they can announce as a 'postponement' till 2021. They might also be trying to claw some or transferring money back from venue/suppliers.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 28, 2020)

Had confirmation this morning that my venue is officially closed until _at least_ 1st September. Our capacity is merely 450. That should put into perspective a bit any ideas of large gatherings happening anywhere before then. We at least have the advantage of being a teaching facility as well as an arts venue, so it's likely that our initial return to work will be built around classes - these are a lot easier to restrict and control numbers, plus we don't have the financial pressure of having to make them pay in the traditional sense. The conference side of the business is all going online/virtual for the foreseeable future.

Traditional theatres and medium (think academy) sized venues are fucked right now. There's talk of reopening with limited capacity audiences, but that fundamentally breaks the business model - put simply, if a venue isn't full for most shows then they aren't making money.

Even if you ignore the financial impact, there's a huge range of practical issues to deal with based around distancing. Let's say you open a theatre and only sell tickets for every other row and leave a 2 seat gap between individual groups. Fine, you're in line with the guidelines. But how do you get them in and out? How do you control the interval and queues for the toilets? What happens if the fire alarm goes off? The best plan I've been able to come up with for my venue would see us having to start queuing and loading the venue with people well over another hour before we usually do, and you'd have to allow at least twice the time for any intervals. Plus then a staggered release of people at the end. Are people really going to want to come out 2 hours before a show starts to stand in a queue, and then be told they might have to hang around for an hour afterwards?

That all assumes a seated venue. How would it work for a standing show? Marked boxes on the floor? People not being able to crowd down the front? There goes the atmosphere, would people really want to bother?

This is going to take months - even years - to come back from. A lot of companies, theatres and venues are not going to survive. It's utterly horrible.


----------



## kalidarkone (Apr 28, 2020)

BristolEcho said:


> I honestly don't see how they can square with club nights running this year. I'd love it to happen safely, but the realist in me says it surely can't? How can they justify 500 people in a tiny pace, utterly twatted, and with dodgy soap free toilets?
> 
> I saw they opened some in Korea so that will be a test.


Yes I feel the same, would love to party and rave more then anything and need a hug rather badly too. I would not be able to socially distance easily under these circumstances.
All my up coming events have been postponed to July and November but I dont think any of them will be happening.


----------



## phillm (Apr 28, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Wickham Festival (6-10 August) haven't cancelled yet either.  I can't see any gatherings over 500 people being allowed in August, but I agree with their approach - there is no sense in cancelling until you have to.


 
The demographic of Wickham would turn it into a Corona cauldron but on the upside it might get rid of Leo Sayer ....


----------



## Mation (Apr 28, 2020)

Pretty much everything about festivals seems like there will be major obstacles to overcome before they can happen again.

Even if you imagine full PPE for all staff, volunteers and vendors; facemasks for all punters and artists (when backstage); hand sanitiser available freely for all, what do you do about the toilets (and toilet seats)?

What solutions are possible and realistic (not just for the toilets)?


----------



## phillm (Apr 28, 2020)

Mation said:


> Pretty much everything about festivals seems like there will be major obstacles to overcome before they can happen again.
> 
> Even if you imagine full PPE for all staff, volunteers and vendors; facemasks for all punters and artists (when backstage); hand sanitiser available freely for all, what do you do about the toilets (and toilet seats)?
> 
> What solutions are possible and realistic (not just for the toilets)?



Off the top of my head

No over 50s (risk management and liability) or folk with existing risk factors (sorry and that includes me !)​​No indoor tent venues.  Temp checks and questionnaires on entry to festival and arenas.​​Hazmat toilet staff with disinfectant sprays between each customer. Open-air long drops, not boxes​​Take your own food and drink and cups with surcharge.​​Main stages with large areas to socially distance around. Smaller outdoor stages if they can do the same.​​DIY masks compulsory.​​One way systems on walkways.​​No flags. (might as well sneak that one in whilst we can) ​
Most though would be pretty unviable with those restrictions. Festivals sadly lie at the extreme end of what is epidemiologically acceptable whilst the virus is still at large and can cause serious health issues.


----------



## Looby (Apr 28, 2020)

phillm said:


> Off the top of my head
> 
> No over 50s (risk management and liability) or folk with existing risk factors (sorry and that includes me !)​​No indoor tent venues.  Temp checks and questionnaires on entry to festival and arenas.​​Hazmat toilet staff with disinfectant sprays between each customer. Open-air long drops, not boxes​​Take your own food and drink and cups with surcharge.​​Main stages with large areas to socially distance around. Smaller outdoor stages if they can do the same.​​DIY masks compulsory.​​One way systems on walkways.​
> Most though would be pretty unviable with those restrictions. Festivals sadly lie at the extreme end of what is epidemiologically acceptable whilst the virus is still at large and can cause serious health issues.


Even if that was all possible and wouldn’t completely ruin the event, no festival could justify the drain on the huge amount of resources needed to run a festival.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 28, 2020)

Looby said:


> Even if that was all possible and wouldn’t completely ruin the event, no festival could justify the drain on the huge amount of resources needed to run a festival.


Yep. And even if you could find someone to back it financially to get all the required measures into place, think about what the event would be like. It would be utterly awful and quite pointless. 

I can't even begin to think how you'd organise all the backstage tech, it just... wouldn't work.


----------



## spitfire (Apr 28, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Yep. And even if you could find someone to back it financially to get all the required measures into place, think about what the event would be like. It would be utterly awful and quite pointless.
> 
> I can't even begin to think how you'd organise all the backstage tech, it just... wouldn't work.



Imagine the turn around time of the backline guys setting the kit up between bands on a festy stage.

Your turn...your turn...your turn....

1 hour later...


----------



## phillm (Apr 28, 2020)

Looby said:


> Even if that was all possible and wouldn’t completely ruin the event, no festival could justify the drain on the huge amount of resources needed to run a festival.


Exactly - they are pretty much history until we have a vaccine or effective reliable drug combos. Hurry up, scientists.


----------



## phillm (Apr 28, 2020)

spitfire said:


> Imagine the turn around time of the backline guys setting the kit up between bands on a festy stage.
> 
> Your turn...your turn...your turn....
> 
> 1 hour later...



Sound check majoring on  1,1,1,

1. Stay at home
2. Save lives
3. Protect the NHS

Plus they would be a load of tokers with COVID-cough by proxy to scare you as you relaxed in the (hopeful) sun.


----------



## mx wcfc (Apr 29, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Boomtown (Wednesday 12th to Sunday 16th August) has so far had no update since March 26th, either on their main site or on their Facebook page
> 
> Beautiful Days (following weekend -- Thursday 20th to Sunday 23rd August) cancelled last week, and it's a lot smaller.
> 
> Weird how different festivals announce they're gone at wildly different times ....... after all, it's pretty well known that the like;lihood of fests happening in August is pretty damned low by now, so you might as well announce, Event Organisers!


No change on the Boomtown website, but Killdren just posted this on FB.


----------



## belboid (Apr 29, 2020)

I just got an email promoting the Oh Sees in Glasgow - in May!   Everywhere else its November, but not Glasgae


----------



## souljacker (Apr 29, 2020)

phillm said:


> ​No flags. (might as well sneak that one in whilst we can) ​


----------



## kalidarkone (Apr 30, 2020)

belboid said:


> I just got an email promoting the Oh Sees in Glasgow - in May!   Everywhere else its November, but not Glasgae


I was due to see thee oh sees in May in Bristol but has been moved to November-I dont think it will happen then.


----------



## ash (Apr 30, 2020)

Toots at Brixton Academy moved to May 2021. My daughter was going to see my chemical romance at MK and that been moved to June 2021. I think both are overly optimistic


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 30, 2020)

ash said:


> Toots at Brixton Academy moved to May 2021. My daughter was going to see my chemical romance at MK and that been moved to June 2021. *I think both are overly optimistic*



A while back I posted that the Cardiff date for the no-longer-current Nick Cave tour had been moved from this coming Sunday (3rd May) to April 2021, like all his other dates. (We had tickets  ).

I'm half-way (maybe no more than that  ) confident that an April 2021 gig such as Nick Cave will go ahead.
Some bands are even putting their gigs back to this November (etc.) ....


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 30, 2020)

William of Walworth said:
			
		

> Boomtown (Wednesday 12th to Sunday 16th August) has so far had no update since March 26th, either on their main site or on their Facebook page





mx wcfc said:


> No change on the Boomtown website, but Killdren just posted this on FB.




Freak Boutique crew are largely the Convoy Cabaret lot at Bearded. 
That guy called Badgers (not the Urban one  ) is well sound, I know him, he often shows up at Gail's events.
They'll know how to run a  mini-festival, whenever they're able to have it! 

But yes, that very much looks like they know already that Boomtown itself has gone


----------



## mr steev (Apr 30, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Freak Boutique crew are largely the Convoy Cabaret lot at Bearded.
> That guy called Badgers (not the Urban one  ) is well sound, I know him, he often shows up at Gail's events.
> They'll know how to run a  mini-festival, whenever they're able to have it!
> 
> But yes, that very much looks like they know already that Boomtown itself has gone



Boomtown just anounced they are postponing until 2021


----------



## editor (Apr 30, 2020)

mr steev said:


> Boomtown just anounced they are postponing until 2021


No surprise really. I don;t think any major festivals are going to happen this year. Or any sized festival. 



> *No Boomtown Fair for 2020 *​
> In light of the current situation with the global COVID-19 pandemic, Boomtown Fair has announced that it will no longer be proceeding with the 2020 event.  The next instalment of the unique, creative festival will now take place on *11th-15th August 2021*.
> 
> Boomtown was due to return to the Matterley Estate, nr Winchester over 12th -16th August 2020 for it’s twelfth instalment, but much like many other events across the country the event organisers have come to the difficult decision to no longer continue. In their statement released on Thursday 30th April 2020, the event states:
> ...


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 30, 2020)

At this stage and the way things are going I'd be happy with just a few beers with a few mates in someone's garden at some point this summer.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 30, 2020)

William of Walworth said:
			
		

> Freak Boutique crew are largely the Convoy Cabaret lot at Bearded.
> That guy called Badgers (not the Urban one  ) is well sound, I know him, he often shows up at Gail's events.
> They'll know how to run a  mini-festival, whenever they're able to have it!
> 
> *But yes, that very much looks like they know already that Boomtown itself has gone *





mr steev said:


> Boomtown just anounced they are postponing until 2021



I'm not at all surprised, but that's a very new announcement (as in this morning).
Inevitable I suppose 

I had no realistic plan to go anyway, but at one point ages ago I wondered whether to go to Boomtown as a Glastonbury-substitute .... good job I didn't build my hopes up on that one!
A couple of my friends who properly planned to go, and went for tickets  way back, had already given up on it well before today.


----------



## 2hats (Apr 30, 2020)

editor said:


> No surprise really. I don;t think any major festivals are going to happen this year. Or any sized festival.


The latest modelling of lockdown relaxation options suggests the contribution to the reproduction number from festivals and other such public events is _at least_ +0.6. There might be additional contribution from secondary/tertiary effects.

That takes us over the critical value of R=1.0 given that the current effective reproduction number, Re, is around 0.6-0.7. You would have to get Re down to 0.2 or lower to safely countenance such activities.

It is hard to see any such events being permitted (if one "follows the science") until the virus is pretty much eliminated or herd immunity achieved (through vaccination).

So you would be unlikely to see public events this year and quite possibly not next year either.


----------



## editor (Apr 30, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> At this stage and the way things are going I'd be happy with just a few beers with a few mates in someone's garden at some point this summer.


LUXURY!


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Apr 30, 2020)

2hats said:


> The latest modelling of lockdown relaxation options suggests the contribution to the reproduction number from festivals and other such public events is _at least_ +0.6. There might be additional contribution from secondary/tertiary effects.
> 
> That takes us over the critical value of R=1.0 given that the current effective reproduction number, Re, is around 0.6-0.7. You would have to get Re down to 0.2 or lower to safely countenance such activities.
> 
> ...



This is something that occurred to me yesterday when talking about football -  the way that the implication of this is that the various freedoms that people will be pushing for are likely to end up effectively in competition what's available. So it could come down what you allow - pubs v football v concerts v barbecues in the park v being able to go to the beach. It could get very messy very quickly...


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 30, 2020)

2hats said:


> The latest modelling of lockdown relaxation options suggests the contribution to the reproduction number from festivals and other such public events is _at least_ +0.6. There might be additional contribution from secondary/tertiary effects.
> That takes us over the critical value of R=1.0 given that the current effective reproduction number, Re, is around 0.6-0.7. You would have to get Re down to 0.2 or lower to safely countenance such activities.
> 
> It is hard to see any such events being permitted (if one "follows the science") until the virus is pretty much eliminated or herd immunity achieved (through vaccination).
> *So you would be unlikely to see public events this year and quite possibly not next year either.*



I'm honestly taking all of your post on board I promise.
This is the first time I've heard facts and figures so specific as that  , stuff directly to do with transmission rates at festivals and like events, I mean.

But *for the time being* (note emphasis!) I refuse to give up _completely_ on all events for all of 2021.
I'm not wanting to argue with anyone, not least because I do properly appreciate that 2hats is the realistic (and well-informed) one here 

I just want to retain a modest (50-50??) level of hope for next year is all.
For festivaldeb and I, festivals (+ gigs) are pretty much No. 1 of what we live for ... OK _some_ other things too, but it's easier to be realistic intellectually, than it is to overcome being absolutely gutted about all this in real life.

Only a few weeks ago we had a festival season to look forward to.
And I shouldn't have to say this, but yes, I *do *fully fucking realise that it's not "all about me"   and that there are *far* bigger things to worry about (jobs, money, health, whatever) -- we're very lucky in many respects and we keep reminding ourselves of this.
But still!   
Between us (seperately then more recently together), we've been going to festivals and gigs every year since the 1980s  .
I'd much rather be skintish and having fun/loving live music (in 2021!) than saving a  load of cash like I am at the moment.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 30, 2020)

Our Dry April will be over starting tomorrow, mind! 
Relief!!


----------



## Badgers (Apr 30, 2020)

First (20k+) event I have on my schedule now is not till March 2021. Oddly tickets have sold quite well since the postponement was announced. Only £10 a ticket as an expo not a festival so a bit different. 

I still have doubts about it. We may still be looking at limited capacity events in a years time.


----------



## Looby (Apr 30, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> At this stage and the way things are going I'd be happy with just a few beers with a few mates in someone's garden at some point this summer.


Oh that would be so nice. ❤️


----------



## phillm (Apr 30, 2020)

2hats said:


> The latest modelling of lockdown relaxation options suggests the contribution to the reproduction number from festivals and other such public events is _at least_ +0.6. There might be additional contribution from secondary/tertiary effects.
> 
> That takes us over the critical value of R=1.0 given that the current effective reproduction number, Re, is around 0.6-0.7. You would have to get Re down to 0.2 or lower to safely countenance such activities.
> 
> ...


I fear you're right but nobody wants to accept that at the moment. I suppose that applies to all forms of 'mass gatherings' with sleepover festivals being the very end of that spectrum.


----------



## elbows (Apr 30, 2020)

2hats said:


> The latest modelling of lockdown relaxation options suggests the contribution to the reproduction number from festivals and other such public events is _at least_ +0.6. There might be additional contribution from secondary/tertiary effects.



Which study is that? I'm completely out of date in this area so a link would be highly appreciated.


----------



## phillm (Apr 30, 2020)

Time to let the young have their jollies and begin to build up herd immunity for us oldies. And they are welcome to their under 30s festival since we will not be invited. It's always been Emilie's masterplan at Glasto to get rid of the oldies who fest-block and dad dance.  Obviously dad with his nuclear strength immune system gets a free pass. Can see security saying, are you sure you're 29 having just done a Ronald Reagan strength hair dye and then failing the dubstep dance test.
_
How would the 20-30-year-old release rule be enforced? Presumably, it would have to be done in the same way as the lockdown that is currently being administered. In other words,
police officers would have to be given the right to fine or arrest those outside the age band who are caught breaking the age rule.
A release of the young might cause jealousy and rebellion among those a little older than the age group released. Such reaction, particularly among those in their early 30s, would
be human and is to be expected. Efforts would have to be made by politicians and others to explain the logic of the release of the young and to offer hope for the future._



			https://www.andrewoswald.com/docs/newFinalCOVIDpaper-on-releasing-the-young-OswaldPowdthavee2020(1).pdf


----------



## 2hats (Apr 30, 2020)

phillm said:


> Time to let the young have their jollies and begin to build up herd immunity for us oldies. And they are welcome to their under 30s festival since we will not be invited. It's always been Emilie's masterplan at Glasto to get rid of the oldies who fest-block and dad dance.  Obviously dad with his nuclear strength immune system gets a free pass. Can see security saying, are you sure you're 29 having just done a Ronald Reagan strength hair dye and then failing the dubstep dance test.


Shame as it might be to piss on the chips enjoyed by Warwick Business School, but courtesy of our well thought out national housing programme, 30-something% of 20-30 year olds still live with their parents, and some further fraction of those who don't will be living in HMOs (or other close living arrangement) with >30 year olds.


----------



## 2hats (May 1, 2020)

elbows said:


> Which study is that? I'm completely out of date in this area so a link would be highly appreciated.


The original work was from Imperial (reports 9 and 13 in March, I believe).

On Wednesday I noticed Peston had some charts of the estimated contributions to Re of various lockdown release options. But it was only on screen for a brief moment. The source of that information would appear to be further work done by (sorry you are going to have to hold your nose here) the Tony Blair Institute for Global Change. Their (20 April) presentation 'A sustainable exit strategy: Managing uncertainty, minimising harm' suggests public events contribute +0.6 to Re (see slide 4 here).

However the slide Peston, which could be even more recent work (maybe),  suggests a contribution of +1.0 for public events (so even less likely they would be entertained).


Health warning: no sign of any 'working out' from the TBIfGC. None of their authors appear to have worked on the original Imperial reports. On the graphic that they themselves publish they state "Authors’ calculations based on Imperial College", so take that as you will.

AIUI, Imperial are carrying out further modelling on various release scenarios and the consequent implications for the reproduction number in a new report to be released soon.


----------



## Mation (May 1, 2020)

editor said:


> No surprise really. I don;t think any major festivals are going to happen this year. Or any sized festival.


Or next year. 2022 at the earliest, I'd guess. 

E2a: and if I'd read as far as 2hats' postings before posting, I wouldn't have had to guess.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 1, 2020)

Mation said:


> Or next year. 2022 at the earliest, I'd guess.



With no scientific or factual basis whatsoever, I'm *for the time being* refusing to accept this "no festivals until 2022" suggestion.

I'm even, *for the time beng*, insisting that there'll still be _some_ festivals in 2021" as well.
ETA : Above line corrected to make sense 

I have zero grounding for this refusal/insistence ....

Except for the current preservation of my own ultra-residual sanity levels  <   x 10,000 >


----------



## pesh (May 1, 2020)

Don't worry *William, *_Festivals _have *already* restarted in Euro*p*_e _








						European Cities Launch Drive-In Concert Series With Great Success [Video]
					

Cities in Denmark and Lithuania have utilized a loophole in their countries' quarantine restrictions by throwing live concerts set up like a drive-in movie.




					liveforlivemusic.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 1, 2020)

pesh said:


> Don't worry *William, *_Festivals _have *already* restarted in Euro*p*_e _
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If everyone turned up in old bangers you could even have a mosh pit


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 1, 2020)

The more I think about it, the more awesome that idea gets.

Just imagine Slayer on stage with a few hundred cars in front all smashing the fuck out of each other


----------



## pesh (May 1, 2020)

turn up with a juicy FM transmitter and you could take over if the acts shit.


----------



## pesh (May 1, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The more I think about it, the more awesome that idea gets.
> 
> Just imagine Slayer on stage with a few hundred cars in front all smashing the fuck out of each other


'we're doing this for safety reasons'


----------



## clicker (May 1, 2020)

No matter how weird that looks at the moment, I can so see it happening here.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 1, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The more I think about it, the more awesome that idea gets.
> 
> Just imagine Slayer on stage with a few hundred cars in front all smashing the fuck out of each other



Turn the windscreen washer nozzles round and you can ‘gob’ at the punk bands...


----------



## William of Walworth (May 1, 2020)

One designated driver, rest swig from flagons of cider, etc. in the car ... enough cider to make the idea of all crashing out in a cramped car not much of an issue ....

Just for the atmosphere, like


----------



## clicker (May 1, 2020)

Drones delivering lukewarm beer and mini donuts.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 1, 2020)

The Irish Government has just released its phased relaxation of lockdown strategy.
The link to the whole thing is as posted by Boru on the general Coronavirus news and developments thread (not the UK-specific one).
My quote here (below) is just the festivals bit, which is near the end of the summary of the 'road-map' as provided by RTE.
The following is just the paragraph about festivals -- which doesn't seem to include _any_ acknowledgement of how near-to-impossible social distancing can be complied with/enforced at festivals 
Bizarre! 



			
				RTE said:
			
		

> *Phase Five (10th August)*
> Festivals, events and other social and cultural mass gatherings will be allowed take place in accordance with both indoor and outdoor numbers and where social distancing can be complied with



I might (generally) be over-prone to optimism, but the above just can't happen in Ireland when they say, and won't!


----------



## Boru (May 1, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> The Irish Government has just released its phased relaxation of lockdown strategy.
> The link to the whole thing is as posted by Boru on the general Coronavirus news and developments thread (not the UK-specific one).
> My link here is just about the festivals bit, which is near the end of the summary of the 'road-map' as provided by RTE.
> The following is just the paragraph about festivals -- which doesn't seem to include _any_ acknowledgement of how near-to-impossible social distancing can be complied with/enforced at festivals
> ...



Yes, all of that plan depends on virus remaining under control and some of it is very light on specifics. It's very much a roadmap and will be interesting to see how first two phases go.


----------



## editor (May 1, 2020)

pesh said:


> Don't worry *William, *_Festivals _have *already* restarted in Euro*p*_e _
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just when the air was getting cleaner from fewer people driving, up pops a festival encouraging people to drive :/


----------



## treelover (May 2, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I'm honestly taking all of your post on board I promise.
> This is the first time I've heard facts and figures so specific as that  , stuff directly to do with transmission rates at festivals and like events, I mean.
> 
> But *for the time being* (note emphasis!) I refuse to give up _completely_ on all events for all of 2021.
> ...



can you imagine what is like for say a 20 yr old who loves live music, etc. You have had a very very good run.


----------



## klang (May 2, 2020)

20 year olds don't tend to have good taste in music.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 2, 2020)

littleseb said:


> 20 year olds don't tend to have good taste in music.


but we did when we were 20, eh.


----------



## klang (May 2, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> but we did when we were 20, eh.


music was sublime then.


----------



## editor (May 2, 2020)

treelover said:


> can you imagine what is like for say a 20 yr old who loves live music, etc. You have had a very very good run.


20 years olds have an infinitely larger choice of festivals to attend - both in the UK and abroad - so even if they miss out a couple of years, they'll still be able to go to shitloads more festivals that what was on offer in my time. The lucky bleeders.


----------



## A380 (May 3, 2020)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> This is something that occurred to me yesterday when talking about football -  the way that the implication of this is that the various freedoms that people will be pushing for are likely to end up effectively in competition what's available. So it could come down what you allow - pubs v football v concerts v barbecues in the park v being able to go to the beach. It could get very messy very quickly...



You could let people drink in sight of the pitch again and afterwards Showwaddywaddy could come on and do a set whilst everyone ate a piece of undercooked chicken and some cheap coleslaw. Everyone’s happy.


----------



## belboid (May 4, 2020)

Bloodstock has just cancelled.

The only surprising thing there being why they bothered to tell _me _about it.


----------



## i_hate_beckham (May 5, 2020)

Nozstock has been cancelled.


----------



## pesh (May 5, 2020)

Carl Cox and several other struggling DJs in a fantastic example of misreading the room have just tried to crowdfund their tour managers wages. it doesn't seem to be going brilliantly.


----------



## editor (May 5, 2020)

pesh said:


> Carl Cox and several other struggling DJs in a fantastic example of misreading the room have just tried to crowdfund their tour managers wages. it doesn't seem to be going brilliantly.


That is fucking outrageous,. as the guy says: why don't they pay for them themselves?


----------



## Indeliblelink (May 5, 2020)

pesh said:


> Don't worry *William, *_Festivals _have *already* restarted in Euro*p*_e _
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Germany doing drive-in raves.








						The world's first drive-in raves are being held in Germany
					

They're being hosted by Club Index in Schüttorf and World Club Dome in Düsseldorf



					mixmag.net


----------



## pesh (May 5, 2020)

personal climate control and ecstasy together at last


----------



## Teaboy (May 5, 2020)

That looks so shit.


----------



## Sunray (May 5, 2020)

Terrible idea, might as well stick to zoom.

Unless you switch on recirculation, they are all sucking the air from outside, with cars so close together, its the exhaust from aircon of the cars closes to you.  Only takes one....


----------



## editor (May 5, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Terrible idea, might as well stick to zoom.
> 
> Unless you switch on recirculation, they are all sucking the air from outside, with cars so close together, its the exhaust from aircon of the cars closes to you.  Only takes one....


Plus all the added pollution of all those individual cars.


----------



## editor (May 7, 2020)

2020 = no fun 









						Why 2020 'is a write-off' for gigs and festivals
					

A top virologist, bioethicist, and music boss on the impact of Covid-19 on hosting big events.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Teaboy (May 7, 2020)

I've just filled in a questionnaire for a brewery who also run pubs.  It was basically about what things you'd want to see in place to make sure you felt safe going back to pubs (when the government allows it).

One of the things was Plexiglas screens at the bar and that sent a shiver down my spine.  It's weird, I know they are going up everywhere for very good reasons but the thought of one at a bar in a pub just seems wrong.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (May 7, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> One of the things was Plexiglas screens at the bar and that sent a shiver down my spine.  It's weird, I know they are going up everywhere for very good reasons but the thought of one at a bar in a pub just seems wrong.



Yeah agreed. It's because you don't go to a pub just to buy a beer isn't it? If you go to Tesco or your corner shop to buy a few cans and they serve you from behind a screen then who cares, you're just taking your beers and going home. If you go to a pub though you want the atmosphere as well and you're not getting that if everyone is sealed off.


----------



## Badgers (May 7, 2020)

Nice work by Standon Calling:



> To show how much your support means to us, *every 2020 adult weekend ticket holder that rolls over their ticket to 2021 will be entered into a prize draw to win 1 of 20 Adult Weekend Festival tickets for life* or 1 of 50 £50 bar tabs for 2021. You will also receive exclusive access to a virtual edition of Standon Calling this summer and priority access to any smaller Standon Calling hosted events, should the circumstances allow











						- Standon Calling
					






					standon-calling.com


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 7, 2020)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Yeah agreed. It's because you don't go to a pub just to buy a beer isn't it? If you go to Tesco or your corner shop to buy a few cans and they serve you from behind a screen then who cares, you're just taking your beers and going home. If you go to a pub though you want the atmosphere as well and you're not getting that if everyone is sealed off.



Spoons will be OK for this, their app will also be good for it. But a real pub it will be shit.


----------



## Badgers (May 7, 2020)

Carnival officially postponed


----------



## Mation (May 7, 2020)

Indeliblelink said:


> Germany doing drive-in raves.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Autodisco is a brilliant name 

Need roof-rack dancing platforms, though


----------



## William of Walworth (May 7, 2020)

i_hate_beckham said:


> Nozstock has been cancelled.



We were planning on going to that (our rule in normal years is to go to at least one that's new to us).
And our friends in Bristol had already bought tickets.

But our surprise levels that it was cancelled were somewhere around zero ...... 2020 dates were going to be 23-26 July FFS!


----------



## Supine (May 9, 2020)




----------



## editor (May 9, 2020)

More depressing news 



> Supporters of live music fear the UK's scene will collapse without government support.
> 
> The lockdown has left 140,000 performers, agents, promoters and technicians without a steady income since the end of March.
> 
> ...














						Live music circuit 'risks collapse within weeks'
					

Leaders in the grassroots music scene are calling on the government to help venue operators.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## ddraig (May 9, 2020)

Really worried about a few venues in Cardiff


----------



## Supine (May 10, 2020)

Not good news for bars and clubs


----------



## nogojones (May 10, 2020)

ddraig said:


> Really worried about a few venues in Cardiff


Was there any left before the virus?


----------



## nyxx (May 10, 2020)

The green gathering seem to be planning to go ahead for 2020.
Recruiting for spoken word artists as recently as March 28th.
It’s still unconfirmed of course. There are queries from the past couple of days re. ticket refunds - the responses from the organisers account (this is on their Facebook event page) say that they’re waiting for more information before they decide.

I’m bemused.


----------



## Badgers (May 10, 2020)

nyxx said:


> The green gathering seem to be planning to go ahead for 2020.
> Recruiting for spoken word artists as recently as March 28th.
> It’s still unconfirmed of course. There are queries from the past couple of days re. ticket refunds - the responses from the organisers account (this is on their Facebook event page) say that there’s waiting for more information before they decide.
> 
> I’m bemused.


Zero chance


----------



## ddraig (May 10, 2020)

nogojones said:


> Was there any left before the virus?


a couple!


----------



## ddraig (May 10, 2020)

nyxx said:


> The green gathering seem to be planning to go ahead for 2020.
> Recruiting for spoken word artists as recently as March 28th.
> It’s still unconfirmed of course. There are queries from the past couple of days re. ticket refunds - the responses from the organisers account (this is on their Facebook event page) say that they’re waiting for more information before they decide.
> 
> I’m bemused.


chancers


----------



## belboid (May 10, 2020)

ddraig said:


> chancers


or deep green scum who think the virus has as much of a right to life as we do.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 10, 2020)

nyxx said:


> The green gathering seem to be planning to go ahead for 2020.


It's not, they're idiots if they think it is.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 10, 2020)

ddraig said:


> Really worried about venues


Fixed


----------



## Badgers (May 10, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It's not, they're idiots if they think it is.


They are negotiating with the venue for 2021 monies/dates and trying to reorganise suppliers payments/debts.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 10, 2020)

Thing is... 2021 really isn't even a remotely safe bet yet.


----------



## Badgers (May 10, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Thing is... 2021 really isn't even a remotely safe bet yet.


Nope. I have a big (25k) event rescheduled for March 2021. At best it is 50/50 but given the government's failings I am afraid it won't won't happen. If it does not happen in 2021 it will never happen again.


----------



## ddraig (May 10, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Fixed


yes of course all venues
particularly a specific couple near me that were not having an easy time before this
appreciate its going to fuck up a load of venues, if not most of them


----------



## nyxx (May 11, 2020)

ddraig said:


> chancers



yeah for some reason it passed my radar today. I had a scroll back & the update where they’re hopeful of running it in 2020 is from 20 March. That’s the most recent post with any detail to it.
Can’t be bothered figuring out how to copy the text of it across to here. Seems their hopes were based on the dates being at a projected lull in infection rates plus the site being spread out allowing for more distancing.
The former is out of date now of course. The latter sounds implausible.


----------



## Badgers (May 11, 2020)

Not an event I care much about but noteworthy as it *was* likely to be the largest event on the planet this year.


----------



## cybershot (May 12, 2020)

Surprised there's no covid-19 celebrity meltdown thread. Or perhaps Bryan Adams is the first.

I'll put it here now.









						Coronavirus: Bryan Adams attacks China as 'bat eating, virus making' source
					

Canadian pop-rocker conflates various unproven theories about source of disease in expletive-filled rant on Instagram




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 12, 2020)

cybershot said:


> Surprised there's no covid-19 celebrity meltdown thread. Or perhaps Bryan Adams is the first.
> 
> I'll put it here now.
> 
> ...


Vegan. Explains a lot.


----------



## editor (May 12, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Vegan. Explains a lot.


It really doesn't, you know, unless you're some kind of vegan-hating bigot.  There's plenty of meat eaters saying stupid things, every single day. People like Trump, for example, but I don't recall anyone here linking his diet to his stupidity. Maybe you should consider that outlook.


----------



## Badgers (May 12, 2020)

Usually has around 100k visitors plus exhibitors and contractors. Still promoting the 25th of July. 









						Homepage
					

The UK's largest exhibition featuring more than 600 exhibitors across home accessories, interiors, homewares and garden, with expert guests hosting workshops on stage and showcasing a wide array of new products, this year’s show is not to be missed.




					www.idealhomeshow.co.uk


----------



## Buddy Bradley (May 12, 2020)

Anyone ever had any luck getting refunds from 'legitimate' scalper websites like Stubhub? Starting to think my overpriced Faith No More tickets for next month might not be needed.


----------



## Big Bertha (May 12, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Vegan. Explains a lot.


Probably has iron deficiency


----------



## ddraig (May 12, 2020)

Big Bertha said:


> Probably has iron deficiency


grow.the.fuck.up.for.fucks.sake


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 12, 2020)

The Boilerroom in Guildford needs £2500 a week to survive, they did a crowdfunder thing and got £30k straight off the bat, so that's a positive thing. Lovely little venue too, so really hope it survives.


----------



## souljacker (May 12, 2020)

Reading and Leeds have finally cancelled.


----------



## cybershot (May 12, 2020)

Guns n roses finally postponed their European tour which was due to start in 2 weeks! 😂


----------



## wiskey (May 13, 2020)

Dunno why it's doing funny stuff with the link but the article was interesting


----------



## Badgers (May 13, 2020)

Creamfields has finally confirmed the inevitable cancellation/postponement for 2020.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 13, 2020)

Today's Guardian report on the Association of Independent Festival's pessimism

It's not that good an article IMO, but AIF (and various associated festival organisers) see a lot of small/independent festivals going out of business and never happening again  




			
				Rhian Jones said:
			
		

> The Association of Independent Festivals (AIF), which represents 65 festivals in the UK, including Gloucestershire’s 2000trees, London’s Meltdown and Sheffield’s Tramlines, reports 92% of its members saying they face costs that could ruin their businesses as a result of cancelled events, *with the vast majority (98.5%) not covered by insurance for cancellation related to Covid-19.*


----------



## editor (May 13, 2020)

Green Gathering cancelled.


----------



## Sunray (May 13, 2020)

I think everything is cancelled until at least November.  If anything isn't cancelled, they need to get a grip and cancel.

Is going to be a very different festival season next year... I'm fearful for some festivals futures. I don't recommend carrying tickets over till next year.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 13, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Is going to be a very different festival season next year... I'm fearful for some festivals futures. I don't recommend carrying tickets over till next year.


Depends partly on whether it's a big commercial festival or a small independent DIY one like most I go to, but I've carried festival and gig tickets over.  Carrying tickets over will give the small festivals a better chance of being on next year.  I just look at it as money that I spent a couple of months ago, so its gone, but I've got a ticket for next year.  It's nice to be able to afford not to demand a refund, obviously.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Green Gathering cancelled.


As is the Monochrome Set at The Railway next month.


----------



## IC3D (May 13, 2020)

Underground Psytrance festi being mooted by someone I know end of Aug if you weren't disgusted by the genre enough 😉


----------



## Sunray (May 13, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Depends partly on whether it's a big commercial festival or a small independent DIY one like most I go to, but I've carried festival and gig tickets over.  Carrying tickets over will give the small festivals a better chance of being on next year.  I just look at it as money that I spent a couple of months ago, so its gone, but I've got a ticket for next year.  It's nice to be able to afford not to demand a refund, obviously.



I do understand that, but  I feel that even with the ticket money, going bust may happen anyway, lose lose.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 14, 2020)

IC3D said:


> Underground Psytrance festi being mooted by someone I know end of Aug if you weren't disgusted by the genre enough 😉


A bunch of cunts being even bigger cunts.


----------



## editor (May 14, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> As is the Monochrome Set at The Railway next month.


I've got little confidence we'll be playing anywhere this year - and that includes the one US tour already rescheduled for the end of Aug and the Canada/West Coast tour scheduled for the following month. I've always wanted to go to Canada too  😭


----------



## belboid (May 14, 2020)

Green Man off.  

What festies are left now? End of the Road still hasn’t officially gone, must be a couple of others left too.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 14, 2020)

belboid said:


> Green Man off.
> 
> What festies are left now? End of the Road still hasn’t officially gone, must be a couple of others left too.



You can still buy tickets for Bearded Theory - still showing as on in September.  

The Blyth Power Ashes (August Bank Holiday weekend) hasn't cancelled yet either.  It may stand a chance as it's  so small. 

There must be a couple of others.


----------



## mr steev (May 14, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> You can still buy tickets for Bearded Theory - still showing as on in September.



Bearded has already been postponed from next weekend til September. They are holding out until July to make a decision on the September (and next May's!) event.


----------



## Mogden (May 14, 2020)

My mate's festival is still scheduled, Off The Tracks, for the weekend after Bearded. That being the case I've got Bearded then about 2 days to freshen up then off to work his. I think there's a glimmer of hope his might but I'm not so sure about Bearded. The very optimistic July deadline for opening pubs will mark that one as a yes or no I would think.


----------



## IC3D (May 14, 2020)

In July pubs and restaurants are potentially opening in some form. Small out door events seem legit.


----------



## Mogden (May 14, 2020)

IC3D said:


> In July pubs and restaurants are potentially opening in some form. Small out door events seem legit.


Off The Tracks is held at a hotel cum campsite with bar etc so it seems that July + 2 months would seem reasonable. Even a scaled back version with a smaller crowd might, MIGHT, be feasible. I'm not pinning all hopes on it but it's not completely out of the running.


----------



## Teaboy (May 14, 2020)

Beatherder have finally thrown the towel in.

As much I would like to see it I don't believe they'll even allow gatherings up to 500 this summer, let alone more.   Even if you had a massive campsite and properly sorted the food stalls out for social distancing how can you deal with stage areas?  I hope I'm wrong but I just can't see it.


----------



## pinkmonkey (May 14, 2020)

belboid said:


> Green Man off.
> 
> What festies are left now? End of the Road still hasn’t officially gone, must be a couple of others left too.


Field day - yeah I know it's annoyingly hipster, but the Drumsheds are only 15 mins walk from me. I love the venue having seen Chase & Status there in Nov. I'd have gone just to see BICEP.  I just can't see it happening, it's in July. It's not even that big a site, it will get crowded. Thankfully I didn't buy tickets.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 14, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> The Blyth Power Ashes (August Bank Holiday weekend) hasn't cancelled yet either.  It may stand a chance as it's  so small.


It doesn't. It's not happening. Neither is anything else. There are no festivals this year.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 14, 2020)

Is it possible to put someone on ignore for just one particular thread?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 14, 2020)

Well I'm awfully sorry if pointing out the obvious bloody truth is so terrible.


----------



## belboid (May 14, 2020)

And bees is right.... the only reason people haven't cancelled already is because they haven't finished finalising plans to roll everything over till next year yet.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 14, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Well I'm awfully sorry if pointing out the obvious bloody truth is so terrible.


It's not that it's bloody terrible, it's just that some of us quite like the hope that we may get to sit in a field for a few days in September.  You may well be right, but let us dream.  And you post pretty much the same reply to every post.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 14, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> some of us quite like the hope that we may get to sit in a field for a few days in September


Some of us would quite like to hope they and most of their friends still have a career left, so forgive me if I'm a bit tetchy over this shit.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 14, 2020)

If anyone fancies a read of the challenges there are to getting gigs going again and what the future may look like...



			https://www.rockitcargo.com/assets/pdfs/COVID-19.eventsafety.pdf


----------



## mx wcfc (May 14, 2020)

I didn't know you were in the business, my apologies.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 14, 2020)

It's ultra-depressing, but I pretty much gave up on Bearded going ahead (in September) a good few weeks ago 

And I post as one who was _originally_ insisting there was a fair chance Bearded would still happen in September ....  I just can't see *any* prospect of it any more, though.


----------



## Sunray (May 14, 2020)

On a more positive note, festivals appeared from nowhere and are now circuit favourites as they are amazing, looking at you Boomtown.

I'm hopeful we will see new and interesting events rise from the fires of C-19.


----------



## Looby (May 20, 2020)

End Of The Road has now been cancelled for 2020. Some acts including The Pixies have confirmed they’ll play next year. We’ll carry our deposit over.
Sad but expected. The final thing for me to be cancelled is Shiiine On in November. Friends are still holding out hope but I haven’t booked and have spent all my gig/festival money on a puppy.


----------



## frogwoman (May 20, 2020)




----------



## William of Walworth (May 20, 2020)

frogwoman : I'm not in any way into horse racing  or gambling, so I must have missed any news about it, but I was a bit shocked by the above. So I did a rummage ....

Apparantly the resumption of racing (albeit 'behind closed doors', however that works!) was announced at the end of last week.




			
				Guardian said:
			
		

> Greg Wood
> Thur 14 May 2020 19.57 BS
> 
> British racing will resume with an eight-race all-weather card at Newcastle on Monday 1 June if government restrictions to control the spread of coronavirus ease sufficiently to allow the sport to take place behind closed doors, the British Horseracing Authority said on Thursday evening.


----------



## pesh (May 20, 2020)

might have to have a bet on Ascot this year, i'm thinking the Queen, Phil and Princess Michael


----------



## Supine (May 22, 2020)

The rave is back in Germany. I'd be well up for some of this


----------



## BigTom (May 22, 2020)

Well those circles don't look 2m apart, and people aren't staying in them very well. Also the tickets must have cost a bazillion euros if they were going to break even compared to their usual crowd numbers. Plus what happens when someone wants to go to the toilet/bar/somewhere else or leave?


----------



## Supine (May 22, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Well those circles don't look 2m apart, and people aren't staying in them very well. Also the tickets must have cost a bazillion euros if they were going to break even compared to their usual crowd numbers. Plus what happens when someone wants to go to the toilet/bar/somewhere else or leave?



Bah humbug! Distancing is going to move towards 'normal' and this is a step in that direction. This looks perfectly fine to me. I'm not a 2m is the law kind of guy though.


----------



## pesh (May 22, 2020)

Exit Festival in Serbia are apparently going for it in August, amazingly...








						"We are thrilled": Exit Festival to go ahead this summer | IQ Magazine
					

Exit festival could be one of the only major European festivals to press ahead in 2020, after being given the go-ahead by Serbia's PM




					www.iq-mag.net
				





> Organisers of Serbia’s Exit Festival have announced that the festival will take place this year, although “probably not” in its full 55,000-capacity, 40-stage format.
> 
> The 2020 edition of the festival, which marks its 20th anniversary, was confirmed yesterday, when Serbian prime minister Ana Brnabić recommended the event be postponed from its original dates in July to August, rather than cancelled altogether.
> 
> ...


----------



## editor (May 22, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Well those circles don't look 2m apart, and people aren't staying in them very well. Also the tickets must have cost a bazillion euros if they were going to break even compared to their usual crowd numbers. Plus what happens when someone wants to go to the toilet/bar/somewhere else or leave?


I imagine there'd be quite a few bands/crew/etc happy to do it for next to nothing, just to give people some fun. I've got a PA system/decks etc and if someone found a legal way I could put on a party nearby, I'd be happy to do it for cost.


----------



## Mation (May 22, 2020)

Supine said:


> The rave is back in Germany. I'd be well up for some of this



I would need a significantly bigger circle, in addition to 2 metres separation.


----------



## editor (May 22, 2020)

*Here’s What the First Socially Distant Concert in America Looked Like*








I'll pass.









						Here's what the first socially distant concert in America looked like
					

Travis McCready held the first socially distant concert in America last night in Arkansas. See photos and video footage from the event.




					consequenceofsound.net


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 23, 2020)

Well, doesn't that look utterly fucking awful.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (May 23, 2020)

editor said:


> I imagine there'd be quite a few bands/crew/etc happy to do it for next to nothing, just to give people some fun. I've got a PA system/decks etc and if someone found a legal way I could put on a party nearby, I'd be happy to do it for cost.


Quite happy to run 2nd 3rd and 4th stages if it goes ahead.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 23, 2020)

Frau Bahn has Elton John tickets for November for her and her mum, bought in 2018. At the time I said to her mum it’s a bit optimistic to buy two years in advance, every chance she or he could peg it (tact is my middle name). This hasn’t yet been cancelled or postponed, but it will be. If postponed the chances of one of them shuffling off before the gig just gets higher...


----------



## pesh (May 23, 2020)

i'm dill dandin bedder dan i edder dib


----------



## William of Walworth (May 23, 2020)

pesh said:


> i'm dill dandin bedder dan i edder dib



Early Saturday     's??


----------



## pesh (May 23, 2020)

i think he'd just forgotten to put his teeth in tbh


----------



## mr steev (May 23, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Well those circles don't look 2m apart



It's still pushing it, but the social distancing rules in Germany are to be 1.5m apart


----------



## Supine (May 26, 2020)

Going back to that Korean super spreader event. So far 255 have been found to have caught covid from the one night out. 

I’m not going clubbing anytime soon. Not indoors anyway.


----------



## Teaboy (May 26, 2020)

Supine said:


> Going back to that Korean super spreader event. So far 255 have been found to have caught covid from the one night out.
> 
> I’m not going clubbing anytime soon. Not indoors anyway.



Well, it looks like the Cheltenham Festival and that Liverpool match against Madrid didn't fair much better and they were both outside, or at least partially outside.  It seems that any gathering where groups of people are unable to distance and are in proximity with each other for a fair amount of time will be high risk.  Obviously the more enclosed they are the greater the risk.


----------



## editor (May 26, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Well, it looks like the Cheltenham Festival and that Liverpool match against Madrid didn't fair much better and they were both outside, or at least partially outside.  It seems that any gathering where groups of people are unable to distance and are in proximity with each other for a fair amount of time will be high risk.  Obviously the more enclosed they are the greater the risk.


It may have been outside but there would have been a lot of activity in quite tightly enclosed spaces (buying drinks/food/queuing/corporate boxes up etc)...


----------



## BigTom (May 26, 2020)

I'd imagine surface contact transmission at toilets is a big vector, but also people will be having direct physical contact, from handshakes to cheek kisses, with other people whether indoors or outdoors.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 26, 2020)

BigTom said:


> I'd imagine surface contact transmission at toilets is a big vector, but also people will be having direct physical contact, from handshakes to cheek kisses, with other people whether indoors or outdoors.




Except that now they’re saying that surface transmission is low.









						Coronavirus does not spread easily on surfaces, say US experts
					

The revelation could have big implications for schools and the workplace, both of which are grappling with how to return to normality




					www.telegraph.co.uk


----------



## 2hats (May 27, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Except that now they’re saying that surface transmission is low.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Torygraph mis-reporting. CDC haven't changed their analysis. They still state respiratory transmission is the main route and fomite transmission may be possible. They even comment on recent media misinterpretation of their information.


----------



## Supine (May 27, 2020)

German theatre


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 27, 2020)

Supine said:


> German theatre
> 
> View attachment 214958


I’d love to see the business model of shows that can support that...


----------



## Teaboy (May 27, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’d love to see the business model of shows that can support that...



That was my thought straight away.  Either better have a bloody good sponsorship deal in place or be entirely staffed by volunteers including the cast.


----------



## editor (May 27, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’d love to see the business model of shows that can support that...


It'll either be bijou gigs for the elite or - more likely - no gigs at all.

I'd be happy to DJ for nothing just for something to do while this is going on, but the extra staff needed by venues to supervise social distancing means - and the reduction in booze sales -  it's extremely unlikely it would make any sense for them to bother.


----------



## editor (May 28, 2020)

Shambala has cancelled. There's not going to be any festivals this year.

And on a personal note, my two US/Canada tours for Aug/Sept/Oct have also bitten the dust  😭


----------



## klang (May 28, 2020)

editor said:


> Shambala has cancelled. There's not going to be any festivals this year.
> 
> And on a personal note, my two US/Canada tours for Aug/Sept/Oct have also bitten the dust  😭


sorry to hear this.
festival season is usually a lucrative period for me...gigs and royalties etc. no income on this front this year....


----------



## campanula (May 28, 2020)

I had wondered why there was such intense pressure to hold our party in the woods. We normally hold it at the same time as Shambala (although we did a Solstice one last year to put the Norfolk Police and Broads Authority off the scent). My kid's FB accounts have been deluged with pretty much everyone we know, offering  rigs, lighting and so on.  Anyhow, we are all broke so not planning  anything other than acoustic, small gatherings, even if we didn't think the outraged burghers of Norfolk would descend en masse.
Commiserations to festie goers and industry folk here on Urban


----------



## Teaboy (May 28, 2020)

editor said:


> And on a personal note, my two US/Canada tours for Aug/Sept/Oct have also bitten the dust  😭



Sorry to hear that, must be gutting even if you knew it was likely to happen.



campanula said:


> I had wondered why there was such intense pressure to hold our party in the woods. We normally hold it at the same time as Shambala (although we did a Solstice one last year to put the Norfolk Police and Broads Authority off the scent). My kid's FB accounts have been deluged with pretty much everyone we know, offering  rigs, lighting and so on.  Anyhow, we are all broke so not planning  anything other than acoustic, small gatherings, even if we didn't think the outraged burghers of Norfolk would descend en masse.
> Commiserations to festie goers and industry folk here on Urban



I seem to remember you've had some problems with neighbours in the past.  Better make sure you're party is doing things by the book otherwise it'll be blue lights everywhere.  I suppose you could tell the police you all felt a bit deaf so needed to test your hearing.?


----------



## DaveCinzano (May 28, 2020)

Supine said:


> German theatre



That sounds like a punchline


----------



## Badgers (May 28, 2020)

editor said:


> Shambala has cancelled. There's not going to be any festivals this year.
> 
> And on a personal note, my two US/Canada tours for Aug/Sept/Oct have also bitten the dust  😭


All sad but sensible


----------



## William of Walworth (May 29, 2020)

On a *much *more cheerful note, we're having *far* too much prematurely great weather this year 

In a _normal_ fest-year, all this far-too-early  Spring sunshine and hawtness would lead to *ultra-paranoia* about many more mudbathfests from mid June to late August ....    

This time, we could (?) dodge a major Glasto-bullet in 2020 because rain is bound  to return big-style within the next few weeks**
(**Like that other notorious gap-year of 2012     )

</returns to home-and-garden-confined cider   >


----------



## Supine (May 29, 2020)

I just noticed my Norman J gig in Cardiff is still on in September. I really can't see 800 people in the Tramshed at any point this year. 

They're still selling tickets.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 5, 2020)

The new normal - EN
					

Following UFI’s publication of the Global Framework for Reopening Exhibitions and B2B Trade Events post Covid-19 on 20 May, EN has partnered…




					exhibitionnews.uk
				




Costly


----------



## nogojones (Jun 5, 2020)

Supine said:


> I just noticed my Norman J gig in Cardiff is still on in September. I really can't see 800 people in the Tramshed at any point this year.
> 
> They're still selling tickets.


I notice that Balter is still looking to go ahead in September and still collecting cash for part paid tickets.  A bit optimistic.

There was this mind. Only 40 people though..









						The UK's first socially distanced rave has taken place in Nottingham
					

Police were called to the forest party and allowed it to continue



					mixmag.net


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 5, 2020)

Badgers said:


> The new normal - EN
> 
> 
> Following UFI’s publication of the Global Framework for Reopening Exhibitions and B2B Trade Events post Covid-19 on 20 May, EN has partnered…
> ...



As well as all the contents being costly-looking, that article is *ultra*-detailed and complicated, as well as long!  

When you've a bit of time, and for those not too clued-up with exhibitions and events of that kind**, could you do a bit of a bullet-point summary please??

Cheers 

**guess who!


----------



## spitfire (Jun 5, 2020)

Badgers said:


> The new normal - EN
> 
> 
> Following UFI’s publication of the Global Framework for Reopening Exhibitions and B2B Trade Events post Covid-19 on 20 May, EN has partnered…
> ...



Interesting they use the term "physical distancing", I have seen some hospitality industry bods pushing for this term and I think it is better than "social distancing" as it is less anti social.

I go to all of the Food exhibitions at Excel and I can't see how it will work in reality. For the industry types it is a partly a social event and the dropping in and out, catching up with people is part of the attraction (as I'm sure you well know). I've only been in the food business a couple of years but already bump into people I know at exhibitions. Some of the people I know have been in the industry for 20 - 30 years and can;t walk 10 yards without seeing someone they know.

I'm sure we'll adapt but it's going to be tricky.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 10, 2020)

Kaptain of Boomtown


----------



## Badgers (Jun 10, 2020)

Have been sporadically sort of working just to see what the generally feeling is regards large exhibitions in the UK. 

About half the people (mostly EU but some US and Asia) said they would review the global situation in the fourth quarter of this year. The rest said they will not consider business in the UK for the foreseeable future do to the COVID-19 situation and (for some) concerns over Brexit. These Brexit concerns are mostly due to an expectation of the UK economy crashing but also travelling with goods in and out of the UK. 

Not hugely unexpected but depressing to get it confirmed.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 10, 2020)

ddraig said:


> Kaptain of Boomtown




That looks from the intro as if it's going to be pretty interesting -- I'll definitely watch it when I've got 45 minutes to concentrate, this evening.


----------



## sovereignb (Jun 10, 2020)

Supine said:


> German theatre
> 
> View attachment 214958




Generally sad to see this. As someone who works p/t at events, ive been wondering if it will be feasible to open again, especially at non seated venues.


----------



## pesh (Jun 11, 2020)

The Flaming Lips have come up with an idea... would definitely liven up trade shows and conferences.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 18, 2020)

World Travel Market London is (for now) going ahead in November  

Last year it had 51k visitors and 5,000 exhibiting organisations.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 18, 2020)

One outdoor event in August has been given the go ahead 









						8-10 June 2021: London Concours at the Honourable Artillery Company
					

The London Concours at the Honourable Artillery Company is an automotive garden party bringing together over 80 of the finest classic and modern vehicles.




					londonconcours.co.uk
				






> The London Concours, presented by Montres Breguet, has been given formal approval to run on 19-20 August by its venue, meaning it’ll be the UK’s first major automotive event to take place since February.




Unsurprisingly it is an event for the disgustingly wealthy taking place in the City of London  I hope it fucking pours with rain that week!


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 18, 2020)

It'd be interesting to see the average age of attendees to that.  Bet its all blokes as well.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 18, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> It'd be interesting to see the average age of attendees to that.  Bet its all blokes as well.


80% male attendees 
Average age approx 65-70


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 18, 2020)

Badgers said:


> 80% male attendees
> Average age approx 65-70



A good opportunity for the virus that.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jun 18, 2020)

Badgers said:


> World Travel Market London is (for now) going ahead in November
> 
> Last year it had 51k visitors and 5,000 exhibiting organisations.




Optimistic, as;

A: indoors 

B: 90% of the suppliers will have gone bust by November...


----------



## Badgers (Jun 18, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Optimistic, as;
> 
> A: indoors
> 
> B: 90% of the suppliers will have gone bust by November...


Yup, it seems like they are blagging it. A shame for the suppliers and exhibitors/delegates paying out for it. 

Clarion have deep pockets but still...


----------



## editor (Jun 19, 2020)

This is such a shit idea. 









						Plans for UK-wide drive-in gigs announced
					

Socially distanced music and comedy events will take place across the UK, after many cancellations.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 19, 2020)

editor said:


> This is such a shit idea.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It is, but as it’s a potential lifeline to a lot of friends and colleagues I’ll welcome it for now...


----------



## sovereignb (Jun 19, 2020)

editor said:


> This is such a shit idea.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


ugh...


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 19, 2020)

sovereignb said:


> ugh...



Its not all bad.  At how many other Lightening Seeds gigs can you just wind up up your window and stick your own tunes on?


----------



## sovereignb (Jun 19, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Its not all bad.  At how many other Lightening Seeds gigs can you just wind up up your window and stick your own tunes on?



"For this next song, I want you to turn on your full beam"

Great times ahead 🤗


----------



## editor (Jun 19, 2020)

sovereignb said:


> "For this next song, I want you to turn on your full beam"
> 
> Great times ahead 🤗


And if you haven't got a car, fuck off.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 19, 2020)

interesting read
*            Dancing on my own: Berlin clubs struggle to get the party started         *

Capital seeks to reclaim its reputation as a destination for hedonism





__





						Subscribe to read | Financial Times
					

News, analysis and comment from the Financial Times, the worldʼs leading global business publication




					www.ft.com
				




or follow this link

economics aside i like the idea of a half empty club


----------



## editor (Jun 19, 2020)




----------



## editor (Jun 19, 2020)

ska invita said:


> interesting read
> *            Dancing on my own: Berlin clubs struggle to get the party started         *
> 
> Capital seeks to reclaim its reputation as a destination for hedonism
> ...


Trouble is, half empty clubs won't survive for long.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 19, 2020)

editor said:


> Trouble is, half empty clubs won't survive for long.


Clubs, theatres, venues, they're all in exactly the same boat. If they're not full, they're not making a profit. All these "solutions" being put forward are just a novelty, a bit of distraction. Unless we can find a way for us all to live with this disease or find a cure, they're fucked.


----------



## editor (Jun 19, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Clubs, theatres, venues, they're all in exactly the same boat. If they're not full, they're not making a profit. All these "solutions" being put forward are just a novelty, a bit of distraction. Unless we can find a way for us all to live with this disease or find a cure, they're fucked.


Musicians and DJs are at the sharp end too:  as far as venues go, the entire point of our existence is to attract more people and fill a place to capacity. If social distancing means venues have to massively reduce capacity, there goes the reason to spend money on entertainment.


----------



## PursuedByBears (Jun 19, 2020)

editor said:


> This is such a shit idea.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It does look terrible tbf


----------



## Mation (Jun 19, 2020)

editor said:


> And if you haven't got a car, fuck off.


Cycle + 2m x 2m pop-up gazebo?







(And a really high stage?  )


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2020)

Bleak.  I'd rather be in the park with a few socially distanced friends listening to a small Bluetooth speaker than this money making bollocks. And note the zero social distancing in the front. 









						Honk if you like my arias: the summer of drive-in culture
					

With venues locked down, entertainment-starved audiences are getting in gear for a season of opera, comedy shows and movies experienced from your own car seat – but is it an artistic cul de sac?




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## cybershot (Jun 22, 2020)

Been getting tons of e-mails for drive in concerts! 

Another concert scheduled for September I had tickets for has also been cancelled until October 2021 this morning


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 22, 2020)

I know why people are doing them - any port in a storm and all that - but these drive in things really can get in a skip fire imo.


----------



## Voley (Jun 28, 2020)

Hearing a bit of internet chatter saying that the Durdle Door beach fiasco didn't result in another infection spike as expected. People are saying that large outdoor gatherings aren't the breeding grounds for infection that most imagined.

If this is right, I'm more hopeful that stuff will be going ahead in 2021. Worth keeping an eye on Bournemouth/Liverpool to see if the recent gatherings there cause a rise.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jun 28, 2020)

Folk were also talking a lot about the BLM protests too - no spikes from those either.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 28, 2020)

Voley said:


> Hearing a bit of internet chatter saying that the Durdle Door beach fiasco didn't result in another infection spike as expected. People are saying that large outdoor gatherings aren't the breeding grounds for infection that most imagined.
> 
> If this is right, I'm more hopeful that stuff will be going ahead in 2021. Worth keeping an eye on Bournemouth/Liverpool to see if the recent gatherings there cause a rise.



There have been panics/mass tutting outbreaks about this stuff going back to people in parks about a week in with no spikes so this does seem likely.


----------



## elbows (Jun 28, 2020)

The thing about spikes related to particular gatherings is that I think people are looking for the wrong magnitude of spike as a result.

The large wave of infection that we saw at the peak was a result of many generations of transmission. That isnt something thats going to be replicated again as a result of a single gathering, at least not when the number of infections before the gathering was not at a high level. Such gatherings can still play a significant role in increasing transmission eventually, but its best not to think of it as a single event but rather an event that may or may not have an eventual greater consequence, that is based on:

How many infected people attended.
How many then caught it at the event.
How many people those people went on to infect later.

I dont think the data we get to see is often going to show up the single generation of transmission from the event itself. Its more and more likely to show up if those infections go on to lead to many more, because that sort of growth should be notable in ways the actual infections directly from the event may not be.


----------



## 2hats (Jun 28, 2020)

elbows said:


> Such gatherings can still play a significant role in increasing transmission eventually, but its best not to think of it as a single event but rather an event that may or may not have an eventual greater consequence


Precisely. These gatherings likely are simply helping maintain a baseline, a long tail (in, perhaps, a disproportionately less vulnerable cohort) which will increase the chances of a second wave further down the line, possibly in late summer/early autumn, when environmental effects and behaviour patterns change, plus people have become 'bored'/weary/disengaged/sceptical and take their eye off the ball, etc. Perhaps N generations later tending to bring it to the more vulnerable who have, to some degree, been shielding (for example: weather gets colder - everyone spends more time inside).


----------



## elbows (Jun 28, 2020)

2hats said:


> Precisely. These gatherings likely are simply helping maintain a baseline, a long tail (in, perhaps, a disproportionately less vulnerable cohort)



Thats one of the reasons I hope the sewage-based surveillance system is decent. Because younger people are less likely to require hospital treatment and are probably less likely to get tested at all. Although I sometimes note in stories from the USA about case rises that some authorities there make a point of talking about how the age of people ending up in hospital is decreasing. They might be exaggerating this side of things to try to increase compliance, but it would be entirely unsurprising if there are periods where the more socially active younger cohorts are driving transmission largely within their own age group, with some spillover into other cohorts but limited enough that hospital numbers and deaths dont track at the same speed as infections/positive tests.


----------



## 2hats (Jun 28, 2020)

elbows said:


> Thats one of the reasons I hope the sewage-based surveillance system is decent.


Talking of which...

UK sewage plants fear deluge of stale beer

Water and sewage companies are racing to stop millions of pints of stale beer overwhelming the UK’s sewage system and threatening the environment as pubs rush to replace stock before reopening on July 4.



Spoiler: Full article.



UK sewage plants fear deluge of stale beer

Gill Plimmer and Alice Hancock in London JUNE 26 2020, FT

Water and sewage companies are racing to stop millions of pints of stale beer overwhelming the UK’s sewage system and threatening the environment as pubs rush to replace stock before reopening on July 4.

Water companies say that although larger cities such as London have sewage processing facilities that can cope with a huge influx of stale beer, some smaller plants risk being overwhelmed.

About 70m pints of beer have been left on pub premises since the UK entered lockdown in March, according to the British Beer and Pub Association. The beer, which can usually last three to six weeks before going off, needs to be removed from cellars before publicans can bring in new barrels and reopen. But any sudden release into the sewage system could overwhelm the bugs that break down effluent at the treatment plants, water companies said.

If the sewage is released directly into rivers and beaches without treatment, it could cause environmental damage, such as depleted oxygen levels, potentially killing fish and plants.

Trade body Water UK said: “Water companies are as keen as anyone to see pubs open again and have been working around the clock to process thousands of applications from pubs and brewers.

“It’s really important that beer is disposed of in the right way, so it doesn’t damage the environment, marine life and the sewer networks, which is why there are environmental regulations controlling how waste beer is dealt with safely.”

In an effort to encourage pubs to contact them, water companies have agreed to waive the fee they usually charge businesses to release large quantities of waste into the sewers. But pub owners have been holding off, awaiting government guidance on reopening.

So far about 40 per cent of pubs have been in touch with water companies, meaning it could “all be a bit last minute,” said one water industry executive.

Ralph Findlay, chief executive of the pub group Marston’s, said that there had been a “significant delay” in disposing of beer. “It was a frustration at a time when everyone’s minds were turning to opening [that] we hadn’t got the right protocols in place to change over the beer until very late in the day,” he said.

With the prime minister’s announcement on Tuesday that hospitality businesses, including pubs and bars, can reopen from July 4, many are now rushing to prepare their sites.

In order to manage the beer waste, the British Beer and Pub Association has established a website through which pub owners can notify brewers of how much stock they need to dispose of. The brewer continues to own beer up until the point that it is sold to the customer.

The BBPA recommends in its guidance for pubs that points connected to a foul drainage system “would be an ideal disposal point” for waste beer. But it added that permission should also be sought from the local water company before it is thrown away.

The pollution fears come as routine inspections of water quality in rivers and beaches remain suspended by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs because of the coronavirus pandemic. The Drinking Water Inspectorate has also told water companies that they can postpone testing at domestic and commercial properties until the coronavirus emergency has subsided.

Defra said: “The environment secretary has written to the British Beer and Pub Association about the need for safe disposal of waste beer currently held in pub cellars.

“We understand that pubs need to clear their cellars to allow for restocking and we are working across government and with the industry to support their preparations to reopen without causing environmental harm.”


----------



## Badgers (Jun 29, 2020)

Brit Awards (not that I care) moved back from Feb till May 2021


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 29, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Brit Awards (not that I care) moved back from Feb till May 2021


it's only a matter of time till they're shuffled back again and ultimately cancelled.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 29, 2020)

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/cirque-du-soleil-bankruptcy-1.5631354


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 29, 2020)

Pickman's model said:


> it's only a matter of time till they're shuffled back again and ultimately cancelled.



Far from inevitable .....
Could equally easily turn out next year that the organisers of the event-that-I don't-care-about-either , will have been slightly over-cautious (albeit also sensible!) about their timing and planning.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 29, 2020)

2hats said:


> Talking of which...
> UK sewage plants fear deluge of stale beer
> Water and sewage companies are racing to stop millions of pints of stale beer overwhelming the UK’s sewage system and threatening the environment as pubs rush to replace stock before reopening on July 4.
> 
> ...



Good article.
(Post would be more for the pubs re-opening thread though. maybe?)

But the bit about "The beer, which can usually last three to six weeks before going off .... " fails to mention that to a large extent, staleness timing would in the earlier stages have depended so much on exactly _what type_ of beer -- traditional beer  goes off far quicker than pasteurised/chemically treated/non-live beer .....

*Neither* would be good for the sewers though by now, anyway, so general points taken ....


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 30, 2020)

UK swingers' sex festival cancelled over impact of social distancing on orgies
					

The team behind the Aurora Lifestyle Festival admitted that the coronavirus crisis guidelines meant they couldn't give hundreds of punters the experience they were hoping for this weekend




					www.mirror.co.uk


----------



## pesh (Jun 30, 2020)

maybe they could do it online.


----------



## 2hats (Jun 30, 2020)

Am amazed they didn't see that coming.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 30, 2020)

Cirque du Soleil files for bankruptcy  









						Cirque du Soleil files for bankruptcy protection and cuts 3,500 jobs
					

Cirque du Soleil, the producer of a number of Las Vegas acrobatic shows, has filed for bankruptcy protection.




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## Badgers (Jun 30, 2020)

mr steev said:


> One of my friends is a promoter. Her cancellation insurance has gone up from £38 to £300 - which is not affordable as she ony puts on small gigs and doesn't make that much


My insurer for an event supposed to take place in March 2020 (which did not cover C-19 or any associated costs) has just billed £1200 admin fee to move the cover for same event in March 2021  

The policy was £5.2k and now costing us £6.4k for the same cover  



> Trillian: The insurance business is completely screwy now. You know they've reintroduced the death penalty for insurance company directors?
> Arthur: Really? No I didn't. For what offense?
> Trillian: What do you mean, offence?
> Arthur: I see.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 3, 2020)

A big one this 









						Royal Albert Hall could go bust by its 150th anniversary next year without urgent help
					

Exclusive: the world-famous music venue is on the edge due to lack of financial support




					inews.co.uk


----------



## Badgers (Jul 3, 2020)

From this tweet:

 

Makes you wonder if some Tory donors are looking at new prime locations for more luxury flats


----------



## Roadkill (Jul 3, 2020)

Badgers said:


> From this tweet:
> 
> 
> 
> Makes you wonder if some Tory donors are looking at new prime locations for more luxury flats




I think we can be pretty sure they won't let the Albert Hall go under.  Venues that don't cater for the rich and well connected are probably fucked, though, especially in non-Tory-voting areas.


----------



## B.I.G (Jul 3, 2020)

Badgers said:


> A big one this
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The albert hall shouldn’t receive any governement funding. That is what its members are for, otherwise they can give back their seats.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 3, 2020)

B.I.G said:


> The albert hall shouldn’t receive any governement funding. That is what its members are for, otherwise they can give back their seats.


A good example of the dire situation though. If the Albert Hall is struggling then other venues are in serious trouble.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 3, 2020)

Hearing tales of lots of pantomimes being cancelled now. That will kill off a lot of small regional/local theatres, those things often basically pay for/subsidise the rest of the year.


----------



## B.I.G (Jul 3, 2020)

Badgers said:


> A good example of the dire situation though. If the Albert Hall is struggling then other venues are in serious trouble.



Indeed.However, the theatre still exists if the company running it goes under. Someone can buy that theatre and reopen it.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 3, 2020)

B.I.G said:


> Indeed.However, the theatre still exists if the company running it goes under. Someone can buy that theatre and reopen it.


I suspect there will be more theatres/venues up for sale than buyers willing to take them on  Albert Hall is an exception of course because of it's status and tourist pull etc. Likely most of the big West End ones will be okay but there are a LOT of town theatres already running on a shoestring before this shit started.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

Ugh: 





> Helen Page, Group Brand and Marketing Director at Virgin Money, said: “At Virgin Money we are being as innovative as possible during these challenging times, and music is very much at the heart of our new brand direction. We are delighted to play a part in bringing back live music events as we start to emerge from lockdown.













						*Music News* UK’s First Socially-Distanced Live Music Arena To Open On Tyneside
					

The people behind the North East’s largest outdoor music gathering, This is Tomorrow Festival, have confirmed that they will launch an innovative socially distanced outdoor venue this summer.…




					nevolume.co.uk


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 3, 2020)

Loving the little cages / pens.

If you stray too far does a Border Collie round you back in?  _Come by_


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 3, 2020)

editor said:


> Ugh:
> 
> View attachment 220673
> 
> ...


Literally everything live music shouldn’t be.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Literally everything live music shouldn’t be.


I know it will 'provide jobs' for an industry that is royally fucked but this looks like an entirely different industry to me, and not one I want to be part of. Cars-only, pre-paid drinks collected on arrival and then made to consume it all stood in a cage miles from the band and metres away from anyone else.

I'd rather watch a busker in the park. At least I'd feel connected to what music is supposed to be about.


----------



## pesh (Jul 3, 2020)

sponsored by big finance at a time where it will literally die out if not given funding?
fuck it, yes of course it's shit, but if it can get some money out of corporate entities and into the hands of musicians, technicians, crew and suppliers, then bring it the fuck on.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> sponsored by big finance at a time where it will literally die out if not given funding?
> fuck it, yes of course it's shit, but if it can get some money out of corporate entities and into the hands of musicians, technicians, crew and suppliers, then bring it the fuck on.


I'd rather throw a few quid at local artists playing acoustic music in the park/square. Corporate banded, car-only cage rock ain't for me.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> sponsored by big finance at a time where it will literally die out if not given funding?
> fuck it, yes of course it's shit, but if it can get some money out of corporate entities and into the hands of musicians, technicians, crew and suppliers, then bring it the fuck on.


Yeah. Ultimately the industry has no choice but to come up with things like this, and as you say, if it keeps people afloat then so be it. Quite what the appeal is for anyone as punter though, urgh.


----------



## pesh (Jul 3, 2020)

editor said:


> I'd rather throw a few quid at local artists playing acoustic music in the park/square. Corporate banded, car-only cage rock ain't for me.


crack on mate, but if i don't get some work soon, shit or otherwise, i won't have any money to throw at people, local or otherwise


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Yeah. Ultimately the industry has no choice but to come up with things like this, and as you say, if it keeps people afloat then so be it.


I don't think it will through. It'll just be an expensive corporate-branded distraction for the better off and most likely only offer tech support work to the bigger businesses. I don't drive so I'm automatically excluded from these events anyway, so fuck them.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> crack on mate, but if i don't get some work soon, shit or otherwise, i won't have any money to throw at people, local or otherwise


I've got zero work too - and zero prospect of that outlook changing any time soon - but I think I'll be able to spare a quid for a busker if I'm drinking my £1 cans in the park.


----------



## pesh (Jul 3, 2020)

editor said:


> I don't think it will through. It'll just be an expensive corporate-branded distraction for the better off and most likely only offer tech support work to the bigger businesses. I don't drive so I'm automatically excluded from these events anyway, so fuck them.


all the small independent suppliers i know are doing gigs like this at the moment, it's their sole source of income, and it's given some work to a few mates as well. yeah, it's shit, but its all there is right now.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> sponsored by big finance at a time where it will literally die out if not given funding?
> fuck it, yes of course it's shit, but if it can get some money out of corporate entities and into the hands of musicians, technicians, crew and suppliers, then bring it the fuck on.


I can't agree. 
The average artist will not get a look in. 
This is money supporting money and attended by people with money. 
Sanitised wank at best.


----------



## pesh (Jul 3, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I can't agree.
> The average artist will not get a look in.
> This is money supporting money and attended by people with money.
> Sanitised wank at best.


have to wait and see what the lineup is, but i'd be surprised if its nothing but headline acts for 2 months, I very much think 'average artists' will get a look in, i reckon it's all they will be able to afford with the budgets they have to play with, no arguements to the rest of your post. I just see it as a way of a few people getting paid. everything is shit at the moment.


----------



## clicker (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> sponsored by big finance at a time where it will literally die out if not given funding?
> fuck it, yes of course it's shit, but if it can get some money out of corporate entities and into the hands of musicians, technicians, crew and suppliers, then bring it the fuck on.


This really. It looks horrendous but, in the face of the Govt not coming up with desperately needed help for the Arts, what is the alternative? Do nothing until it goes away?
I hope it sells out, workers get paid and similar events organised. It's never going to replace what it is trying to replicate (not that I believe it's remit is replication). I doubt anyone concerned  wants it to.
 It doesn't mean festivals will die out in coming years. It's a temporary stop gap born out of necessity and will suit some people and not others. Like every event, ever, anywhere.
With threat of local lockdowns , it'll be a brave promoter who tries to organise anything even remotely like what we are used to for the foreseeable future.
Personally I don't like huge seated arenas, but back row at the O2 or Wembley can't be anymore distant than this?


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> have to wait and see what the lineup is, but i'd be surprised if its nothing but headline acts for 2 months, I very much think 'average artists' will get a look in, i reckon it's all they will be able to afford with the budgets they have to play with, no arguements to the rest of your post. I just see it as a way of a few people getting paid. everything is shit at the moment.


With vastly diminished crowds and all the increased infrastructure costs, I can't see how smaller bands are going to get invited to this party as the only way to finance an attractive bill would be to hike the ticket price through the roof or ask bands to take a huge cut.  For the bigger bands, that's all juicy, merch-shifting promo, but for smaller bands it's probably worse than not playing.


----------



## B.I.G (Jul 3, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I suspect there will be more theatres/venues up for sale than buyers willing to take them on  Albert Hall is an exception of course because of it's status and tourist pull etc. Likely most of the big West End ones will be okay but there are a LOT of town theatres already running on a shoestring before this shit started.



Hopefully some locals will band together to buy the properties cos the tories for sure won’t be caring.


----------



## pesh (Jul 3, 2020)

editor said:


> With vastly diminished crowds and all the increased infrastructure costs, I can't see how smaller bands are going to get invited to this party as the only way to finance an attractive bill would be to hike the ticket price through the roof or ask bands to take a huge cut.  For the bigger bands, that's all juicy, merch-shifting promo, but for smaller bands it's probably worse than not playing.


I'd expect them to be using the sponsorship money to cover the increased costs and diminished crowds... I doubt it's going to be Coldplay or Adele playing to 500 people a night, but who knows.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> I'd expect them to be using the sponsorship money to cover the increased costs and diminished crowds... I doubt it's going to be Coldplay or Adele playing to 500 people a night, but who knows.


Unless there's a high profile PR-kickback, I can't imagine the sponsorship money will be that much. I regularly get sent press releases from PR companies promoting laughably small donations from their corporate clients so I guess sponsorship can be cheap these days (sometimes I wonder if the PR company costs more than the actual money raised).


----------



## Sue (Jul 3, 2020)

Was talking to a good friend last night who's an actor. She was meant to be in a play at the moment which was obviously cancelled and the type of temping work (reception/clerical stuff) she'd normally do to fill gaps, just isn't there at the moment. She's also having issues claiming UC. All her actor friends are in the same boat, as presumably are all the backstage/front of house theatre staff. 

And who knows when/if theatres'll re-open. It's not going to be anytime soon and given how close together the seats typically are (especially in older theatres) and the percentage of seats they have to fill to break even, it's all looking very bad.


----------



## belboid (Jul 3, 2020)

Sue said:


> Was talking to a good friend last night who's an actor. She was meant to be in a play at the moment which was obviously cancelled and the type of temping work (reception/clerical stuff) she'd normally do to fill gaps, just isn't there at the moment. She's also having issues claiming UC. All her actor friends are in the same boat, as presumably are all the backstage/front of house theatre staff.
> 
> And who knows when/if theatres'll re-open. It's not going to be anytime soon and given how close together the seats typically are (especially in older theatres) and the percentage of seats they have to fill to break even, it's all looking very bad.


My theatre friends all say they have no hope of returning this year.  Apparently sheff theatres are hoping to open for Xmas, but it doesn’t really seem likely.  Most are self employed too, so at least they largely avoided uc, but that won’t be the case for much longer.


----------



## pesh (Jul 3, 2020)

Sue said:


> Was talking to a good friend last night who's an actor. She was meant to be in a play at the moment which was obviously cancelled and the type of temping work (reception/clerical stuff) she'd normally do to fill gaps, just isn't there at the moment. She's also having issues claiming UC. All her actor friends are in the same boat, as presumably are all the backstage/front of house theatre staff.
> 
> And who knows when/if theatres'll re-open. It's not going to be anytime soon and given how close together the seats typically are (especially in older theatres) and the percentage of seats they have to fill to break even, it's all looking very bad.











						Nuffield Southampton Theatres to close permanently, it has been confirmed  | WhatsOnStage
					

A buyer for the venue was not found




					www.whatsonstage.com
				



was gutted to see this yesterday.


----------



## Big Bertha (Jul 3, 2020)

pesh said:


> crack on mate, but if i don't get some work soon, shit or otherwise, i won't have any money to throw at people, local or otherwise


Stand in the park and people will throw money at you.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

Big Bertha said:


> Stand in the park and people will throw money at you.


If you were showcasing your trolling abilities, they'd definitely be throwing things at you, but it wouldn't be money,


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

belboid said:


> My theatre friends all say they have no hope of returning this year.  Apparently sheff theatres are hoping to open for Xmas, but it doesn’t really seem likely.  Most are self employed too, so at least they largely avoided uc, but that won’t be the case for much longer.


All this year's gigs and tours for my band have been cancelled, and I really can't imagine I'll be DJing before Christmas at the earliest (unless some miracle vaccine appears).


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2020)

editor said:


> All this year's gigs and tours for my band have been cancelled, and I really can't imagine I'll be DJing before Christmas at the earliest (unless some miracle vaccine appears).


I'm delighted people are liking my predicament.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 3, 2020)

editor said:


> I'm delighted people are liking my predicament.


A lot of us share said predicament and a solidarity like is not a bad thing old bean.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 3, 2020)




----------



## frogwoman (Jul 4, 2020)

My mate who runs a theatre company suggested the government's response to the theatre crisis (or rather lack of it) is partly political because theatre goers and workers arent exactly known for voting Tory. Has anyone else heard something like this and is there anything to it?


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 4, 2020)

I also dont understand why more money can't be put into online stuff, outdoor performances and even performances indoors in small groups. A lot of theatres have a room for small performances around the size of my kitchen. It's terrible.


----------



## pesh (Jul 4, 2020)

the National does all that tbf


----------



## Sue (Jul 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> My mate who runs a theatre company suggested the government's response to the theatre crisis (or rather lack of it) is partly political because theatre goers and workers arent exactly known for voting Tory. Has anyone else heard something like this and is there anything to it?


My actor friend was saying something similar. I wouldn't say it's necessarily true about theatre goers though.

ETA It actually doesn't make a lot of sense in the long run even if viewed on purely economic grounds. Loads of tourists go to the theatre when they're here and lots of people go to London for the day, for example, catch a show in the West End, go for dinner etc. Given how expensive West End tickets are, they're spending a lot of money overall.


----------



## clicker (Jul 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> I also dont understand why more money can't be put into online stuff, outdoor performances and even performances indoors in small groups. A lot of theatres have a room for small performances around the size of my kitchen. It's terrible.


I think that part of the problem is no matter how many seats are removed to maintain social distancing for the audience, it's nigh on impossible for performers onstage or backstage to do the same.
Also X % of seats need to be sold to make venues viable.
If this is with us for a while maybe the currently large, empty spaces could be temporarily repurposed to bring in some revenue?
It seems crazy that 30 kids will be crammed into secondary school classrooms come September, while empty spaces stay empty.
But thinking about that, local authorities have no money probably to hire space anyway.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 4, 2020)

The government needs to extend the furlough scheme to specific industries that can’t reopen, music venues, theatres, soft play centres and so on. Would be a drop in the ocean to what has already been spent, but without it these places can’t survive and will be gone once the bug’s under control.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 4, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> The government needs to extend the furlough scheme to specific industries that can’t reopen, music venues, theatres, soft play centres and so on. Would be a drop in the ocean to what has already been spent, but without it these places can’t survive and will be gone once the bug’s under control.


They won’t though, because twats will moan at how “unfair” that is.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 4, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> They won’t though, because twats will moan at how “unfair” that is.



Has it even been mooted yet though? If government says stay closed, government must pay. Will write yet another missive to my MP about that, now he's a back bencher he's pretty good at reading the drivel I send him.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 4, 2020)

Lot of folk on social media talking about Cummings dislike of the arts. No source to speak of but it would not surprise me. 

Pubs over the arts


----------



## killer b (Jul 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> My mate who runs a theatre company suggested the government's response to the theatre crisis (or rather lack of it) is partly political because theatre goers and workers arent exactly known for voting Tory. Has anyone else heard something like this and is there anything to it?


Why would theatre goers not vote tory? They're mostly over 50 and middle class - solid tory demographic.


----------



## newbie (Jul 4, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Has it even been mooted yet though?


Every night for weeks on Front Row, R4 7.15.  The minister for the arts has been flatly refusing to appear, but the great and the good are there every edition.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 6, 2020)

A statement from Deborah Kermode, MAC CEO & Artistic Director and… | Midlands Arts Centre
					

The impact of Covid-19 upon the cultural sector has been devastating and undoubtedly will be long-lasting. We have all seen with heavy hearts fellow arts…




					macbirmingham.co.uk
				




MAC Birmingham not opening until 2021


----------



## editor (Jul 6, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> A statement from Deborah Kermode, MAC CEO & Artistic Director and… | Midlands Arts Centre
> 
> 
> The impact of Covid-19 upon the cultural sector has been devastating and undoubtedly will be long-lasting. We have all seen with heavy hearts fellow arts…
> ...


Unless something drastically changes, I don't think I'll be playing any live shows until next year. Maybe I'll get some DJ gigs at Christmas, at best.


----------



## editor (Jul 8, 2020)

I've got zero interest in this myself: Live Nation U.K. and MelodyVR announce virtual reality ‘Live From O2 Academy Brixton’ series


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 8, 2020)

The only tech things I really want to see for live music are Marshall amps and so forth ...... right on the stage in front of me!!


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jul 9, 2020)

So, outdoor gigs/events with small attendance and social distancing can start from Saturday, and there will be some small indoor test events.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 9, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> So, outdoor gigs/events with small attendance and social distancing can start from Saturday, and there will be some small indoor test events.



The BBC story concerning outdoor gigs, etc. raises more questions than it answers!!


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 9, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> So, outdoor gigs/events with small attendance and social distancing can start from Saturday, and there will be some small indoor test events.


Still no idea how these things will be financially viable.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jul 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Still no idea how these things will be financially viable.


I realise this and can't see myself mixing any bands for the foreseeable, but hey, look: another positive announcement from our blond saviours team.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 12, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Frau Bahn has Elton John tickets for November for her and her mum, bought in 2018. At the time I said to her mum it’s a bit optimistic to buy two years in advance, every chance she or he could peg it (tact is my middle name). This hasn’t yet been cancelled or postponed, but it will be. If postponed the chances of one of them shuffling off before the gig just gets higher...



Postponed until autumn 2021...


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 15, 2020)

Every single Live Nation drive in event - both gigs and cinema/sports showings - has just been cancelled.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 15, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Every single Live Nation drive in event - both gigs and cinema/sports showings - has just been cancelled.




Is this Live Nation going bust, or something else?


----------



## spitfire (Jul 15, 2020)

Apparently they are feared of the localised lockdowns. Unpredictable innit.









						Live at the Drive In concert tour cancelled over local lockdown fears
					

SIX the Musical, Gary Numan, The Streets and Dizzee Rascal were due to perform at the event at the University of Bolton Stadium




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk
				




"The Live From The Drive In concert series will no longer proceed as planned this summer. We received huge support from artists, the live music production contractors, our headline sponsor Utilita along with our other partners, and of course you, the fans.

"However the latest developments regarding localised lockdowns mean it has become impossible for us to continue with the series with any confidence.


"We thank everyone for their support and eagerly await a time when we can watch live music together again."


----------



## pesh (Jul 15, 2020)

tl:dr 
Our beancounters said whats the point.


----------



## killer b (Jul 15, 2020)

Presumably with the new outdoor gig rules they could organise things that aren't so weird and shit instead? Or - crucially - someone else could have organised things that are less weird and shit, and people would have gone to them instead of the weird and shit drive in things.


----------



## ska invita (Jul 15, 2020)

Voley said:


> Hearing a bit of internet chatter saying that the Durdle Door beach fiasco didn't result in another infection spike as expected. People are saying that large outdoor gatherings aren't the breeding grounds for infection that most imagined.
> 
> If this is right, I'm more hopeful that stuff will be going ahead in 2021. Worth keeping aye on Bournemouth/Liverpool to see if the recent gatherings there cause a rise.


there was this too








						Black Lives Matter protests have not led to a spike in coronavirus cases, research says
					

'Furthermore, we find no evidence that urban protests reignited Covid-19 case growth during the more than three weeks following protest onset'




					www.independent.co.uk
				











						Black Lives Matter protests have not led to a spike in coronavirus cases, research says
					

Despite warnings from public health officials, new research suggests Black Lives Matter protests across the country have not led to a jump in coronavirus cases.




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 15, 2020)

killer b said:


> Presumably with the new outdoor gig rules they could organise things that aren't so weird and shit instead? Or - crucially - someone else could have organised things that are less weird and shit, and people would have gone to them instead of the weird and shit drive in things.


Rumours in various crew forums are that the issue is at the stage end, not the audience.


----------



## killer b (Jul 15, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Rumours in various crew forums are that the issue is at the stage end, not the audience.


Sure, but I bet what's made those issues suddenly insurmountable is the fact that something much more like a normal outdoor concert is now possible. Why bother carrying on trying to force a square peg into a round hole when an oval peg has just been handed to you?


----------



## Badgers (Jul 15, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Rumours in various crew forums are that the issue is at the stage end, not the audience.


Expect that is the case. 

Saw that the NSTAAF podcast were planning a 'drive in podcast' recording. Had a look at the prices and (from memory) it was nearly £50 for a car with two people. Might have paid that for a band but not for an advertising funded 45 minute podcast recording.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 15, 2020)

killer b said:


> Sure, but I bet what's made those issues suddenly insurmountable is the fact that something much more like a normal outdoor concert is now possible. Why bother carrying on trying to force a square peg into a round hole when an oval peg has just been handed to you?


Possibly, but the problems are apparently around basic stage logistics.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 16, 2020)

Manchester's Deaf Institute and Gorilla music venues are closing
					

The institutions will not reopen as a result of the impact of the coronavirus lockdown




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk
				




Fuck


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 16, 2020)

Welly and Polar Bear close for good 'as firm enters administration'
					

They are two of the city's most popular venues




					www.hulldailymail.co.uk
				




Fuck 2


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 16, 2020)

Town Hall and Symphony Hall announce mass job cuts with half of staff at risk
					

The period of closure in the wake of the unprecedented health crisis has already resulted in huge losses and it is still unclear as to when it may be possible to re-open.




					www.birminghammail.co.uk
				




Fuck 3 

This really ain’t funny anymore.


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Every single Live Nation drive in event - both gigs and cinema/sports showings - has just been cancelled.


Good. Fuck car-centric "gigs."


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Manchester's Deaf Institute and Gorilla music venues are closing
> 
> 
> The institutions will not reopen as a result of the impact of the coronavirus lockdown
> ...


Damn, That is a shame. My band had a show there in May that was cancelled and now I'll never get to play there - and I've always heard good things about the place.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 16, 2020)

editor said:


> Good. Fuck car-centric "gigs."


Less good for my friends who’ve just been told their summer financial lifeline has been taken away.


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Less good for my friends who’ve just been told their summer financial lifeline has been taken away.


But better for the environment. I'm out of a job too, you know. All my gigs have been cancelled but I'll be fucked if that justifies encouraging more cars on the road, more pollution and roads clogged up those lucky enough to own cars being able to drive miles and miles to wildly expensive gigs run by mega-promoters.  They really aren't the solution to anything. Plus they look absolutely fucking shit. 

Better to go and see your local band playing acoustically in the park.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 16, 2020)

editor said:


> But better for the environment. I'm out of a job too, you know. All my gigs have been cancelled but I'll be fucked if that justifies encouraging more cars on the road, more pollution and roads clogged up those lucky enough to own cars being able to drive miles and miles to wildly expensive gigs run by mega-promoters.  They really aren't the solution to anything. Plus they look absolutely fucking shit.
> 
> Better to go and see your local band playing acoustically in the park.


Nobody is likely to claim anything other than drive in gigs would be totally crap. But if putting them on meant people I’m friends with can feed their fucking kids then forgive me for thinking they’d have been worth doing. At this point, fuck the environment, the minuscule additional impact these things would have had is utterly irrelevant.


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Nobody is likely to claim anything other than drive in gigs would be totally crap. But if putting them on meant people I’m friends with can feed their fucking kids then forgive me for thinking they’d have been worth doing. At this point, fuck the environment, the minuscule additional impact these things would have had is utterly irrelevant.


I'm not going to agree with you, so let's leave it.


----------



## Supine (Jul 16, 2020)

Any kind of gigs are important now. The way things were aren't going to happen again anytime soon so some inovative outdoor style options are needed. Just not with cars!

Gutted about gorilla closing. I liked that venue.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Nobody is likely to claim anything other than drive in gigs would be totally crap. But if putting them on meant people I’m friends with can feed their fucking kids then forgive me for thinking they’d have been worth doing. At this point, fuck the environment, the minuscule additional impact these things would have had is utterly irrelevant.



Yep - drive-in movie theaters were already a thing, as is driving to the shops etc. so I don't know why people lose their shit over the prospect of drive-in concerts being a temporary thing that helps people cling to their jobs during a pandemic, don't thousands of people already drive to concerts and festivals? 


A place near me is starting these up soon, capacity limited to 200 cars, that's probably more than a thousand less vehicles than would be in the area for a traditional summertime outdoor concert. I won't be attending, however, as I think the taxi cost would be prohibitive.


----------



## ska invita (Jul 16, 2020)

this is a disaster unfolding
the venues may not necessarily be lost though, no? its the companies managing them. obviously the buildings will be under threat, but hopefully in at least some cases someone else will take them over at some point
?


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Yep - drive-in movie theaters were already a thing, as is driving to the shops etc. so I don't know why people lose their shit over the prospect of drive-in concerts being a temporary thing that helps people cling to their jobs during a pandemic, don't thousands of people already drive to concerts and festivals?
> 
> 
> A place near me is starting these up soon, capacity limited to 200 cars, that's probably more than a thousand less vehicles than would be in the area for a traditional summertime outdoor concert. I won't be attending, however, as I think the taxi cost would be prohibitive.


I'm not "losing my shit," I'm just opposed to the idea of big corporates hosting car-only exclusive events.


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

Supine said:


> Any kind of gigs are important now. The way things were aren't going to happen again anytime soon so some inovative outdoor style options are needed. Just not with cars!


Absolutely.


----------



## pesh (Jul 16, 2020)

editor said:


> All my gigs have been cancelled


Better for the environment


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

pesh said:


> Better for the environment


For the band gigs, we almost always travel by public transport, and I walk to all my DJ gigs, all of which have been cancelled, probably till next year. I currently have zero income and zero prospect of any income any time soon.


Great to see it's all a joke to you.


----------



## Supine (Jul 16, 2020)

Promoters need to find alternate venues. 

Roof top car parks
Tunnels
Marques in fields
Forrests
Disused warehouses

Basically all the places that free parties like but done legal as popup venues.


----------



## Big Bertha (Jul 16, 2020)

Supine said:


> Promoters need to find alternate venues.
> 
> Roof top car parks
> Tunnels
> ...


I think promoters & DJs probably need to find alternative employment for the duration.
Can’t see anything positive for a while tbh


----------



## Supine (Jul 16, 2020)

Big Bertha said:


> I think promoters & DJs probably need to find alternative employment for the duration.
> Can’t see anything positive for a while tbh



Luckily plenty of promoters do it for the love of the scene and don’t expect to earn a living from it. In the styles of music I like anyway.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 16, 2020)

Supine said:


> Luckily plenty of promoters do it for the love of the scene and don’t expect to earn a living from it. In the styles of music I like anyway.


Go tell my mates that they can pay their mortgages and buy food for their children “for the love of it”.

Fucks sake.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 16, 2020)




----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 16, 2020)

editor said:


> For the band gigs, we almost always travel by public transport, and I walk to all my DJ gigs, all of which have been cancelled, probably till next year. I currently have zero income and zero prospect of any income any time soon.
> 
> 
> Great to see it's all a joke to you


It’s not a joke. People are facing ruin. You get this, you understand it. Which is why I can’t get why you’re so against something - that is blatantly a temporary stopgap thing - that might keep various businesses and crew going, so they can be there ready to go when the world gets back to normal.

Who cares if it’s shit? Who cares if it isn’t for everyone? Who cares if it’s for cars? None of that matters right now. People are trying to survive.


----------



## Supine (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Go tell my mates that they can pay their mortgages and buy food for their children “for the love of it”.
> 
> Fucks sake.



Sorry but I didn’t know this was just a thread about you and your mates. I feel terrible for lots and lots of people who have lost income, your mates included. I think I can still comment on the thread title without only addressing that aspect of the current situation though.


----------



## Big Bertha (Jul 16, 2020)

Supine said:


> Luckily plenty of promoters do it for the love of the scene and don’t expect to earn a living from it. In the styles of music I like anyway.


Yeah but I don’t see any opportunities to do anything for the love of it either.

essentially there is no scene at the moment


----------



## mx wcfc (Jul 16, 2020)

I hadn't even heard of this festival, but this just popped up on my social media, courtesy of Vive Le Rock.


RED ROOSTER 2020 IS HAPPENING!
Following the government's statement last Thursday allowing outdoor events, we are absolutely delighted to confirm that Red Rooster Festival 2020 will go ahead Friday 4th – Sunday 6th September 2020.
We are privileged to be set amongst 10,000 acres of stunning parklands and pleasure grounds at our Euston Hall home. This unique setting allows us to be confident we can throw this much-needed party while remaining socially distanced, and we are mak...
See More













						Red Rooster Festival
					

Red Rooster Festival. 12,265 likes · 57 talking about this. Join us at Euston Hall, Suffolk, UK, 2nd - 4th June 2022  Tickets on sale now: https://tinyurl.com/RoostersBack




					www.facebook.com


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Go tell my mates that they can pay their mortgages and buy food for their children “for the love of it”.
> 
> Fucks sake.




Sorry dude, your industry is fucked by this. Mine ain't much better. Soft-play people are also well bollocksed. But your one is really badly hit. And it's a double cunt as it is one we nearly all love, indeed a reason for being for many. I mentioned the other day that of course furlough can't carry on indefinitely but where government mandates businesses can't operate then furlough should continue. I have written to Jeremy Hunt with that suggestion, can't hurt for others to write to their MP's with similar...


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It’s not a joke. People are facing ruin. You get this, you understand it. Which is why I can’t get why you’re so against something - that is blatantly a temporary stopgap thing - that might keep various businesses and crew going, so they can be there ready to go when the world gets back to normal.
> 
> Who cares if it’s shit? Who cares if it isn’t for everyone? Who cares if it’s for cars? None of that matters right now. People are trying to survive.


I'm not even sure why you think these fucking awful polluting drive-in gigs are any kind of massive money spinner for musicians and PA companies anyway. Maybe the big boys would get to fill their pockets, but it's a non starter for smaller bands.

I'd wager that just about everyone involved was being asked to do it on the cheap anyway, just like what's happening around my town.


----------



## Marty1 (Jul 16, 2020)

Big Bertha said:


> Yeah but I don’t see any opportunities to do anything for the love of it either.
> 
> essentially there is no scene at the moment



Not strictly true.









						General Coronavirus (COVID-19) chat
					

This is interesting - the ground is vibrating less due to lockdown.  I bet the moles and earthworms will be happier.  :)   Interesting - and I'd not noticed just how lovely and quiet it is now :cool: There's not often traffic noise where I am but it's totally fucking silent.   Having said that a...




					www.urban75.net


----------



## editor (Jul 16, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Sorry dude, your industry is fucked by this. Mine ain't much better. Soft-play people are also well bollocksed. But your one is really badly hit. And it's a double cunt as it is one we nearly all love, indeed a reason for being for many. I mentioned the other day that of course furlough can't carry on indefinitely but where government mandates businesses can't operate then furlough should continue. I have written to Jeremy Hunt with that suggestion, can't hurt for others to write to their MP's with similar...


Anyone in the entertainment industry on furlough is one of the lucky ones. I can tell you exactly how much I've earned since the middle of March: £620 - that was the government one-off payment. I've earned nothing since and at the moment have zero prospect of any income from any of my jobs for many months.

Luckily, I'm used to living cheap and have savings which I'm working my way through, and there's stuff I should have flogged off ages ago, so I'm doing way better than many of my friends. It's a hugely shit time for musicians and anyone involved in the music/hospitality industry.


----------



## ska invita (Jul 17, 2020)

" From 1 August, there will be a slew of new freedoms, including re-opening indoor performances. " <Johnson


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 17, 2020)

ska invita said:


> " From 1 August, there will be a slew of new freedoms, including re-opening indoor performances. " <Johnson


 
Meaningless without any detail, and I'm assuming Johnson offered none.


----------



## ska invita (Jul 17, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Meaningless without any detail, and I'm assuming Johnson offered none.


yes, it was a teaser. however if indoor performances are allowed Id expect outdoor ones to be too.


----------



## souljacker (Jul 17, 2020)

In all seriousness beesonthewhatnow , some of the skills techies in your business have are transferable to the networking or office av industries which still seem to be plugging on despite the pandemic. If I were in your position, I'd be looking at jobs elsewhere to keep me going until things change. Is that an option?


----------



## ska invita (Jul 17, 2020)

souljacker said:


> In all seriousness beesonthewhatnow , some of the skills techies in your business have are transferable to the networking or office av industries which still seem to be plugging on despite the pandemic. If I were in your position, I'd be looking at jobs elsewhere to keep me going until things change. Is that an option?


my friend who does AV/networking stuff for a uni has basically seen his workload go off the scale as everyone is trying to set up new systems
not sure how transferal sound engineering skills are though tbf, you have to know your particular tech very well


----------



## killer b (Jul 17, 2020)

ska invita said:


> yes, it was a teaser. however if indoor performances are allowed Id expect outdoor ones to be too.


Outdoor ones are allowed already (from this weekend I think?)


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 17, 2020)

souljacker said:


> In all seriousness beesonthewhatnow , some of the skills techies in your business have are transferable to the networking or office av industries which still seem to be plugging on despite the pandemic. If I were in your position, I'd be looking at jobs elsewhere to keep me going until things change. Is that an option?


I’m in a full time role now (just over a year), currently furloughed and back next month. Almost every single colleague is freelance though and fucked...

Problem with the new range of virtual events etc is that they can essentially be operated by a single person. There’s a lot of techs scrabbling for very little work. All the office/install side is being taken care of by those who were already doing it.


----------



## editor (Jul 17, 2020)

So my American tour - which must be starting to hang by a thread after so many cancellations - is now being rescheduled from May 2021 to Sept 2021. I hope I'm still alive to enjoy it!


----------



## ska invita (Jul 17, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Meaningless without any detail, and I'm assuming Johnson offered none.


some detail








						Theatres, music and performance venues can reopen with social distancing in August
					

The government is working on pilots for indoor socially distanced performances in England.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 17, 2020)

Allowing events is one thing, organisers  getting them insured is going to be a whole new headache.


----------



## editor (Jul 17, 2020)

ska invita said:


> some detail
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Not many venues will be able to afford bands/DJs/sound engineers with quarter sized crowds unless they (a) rack the admission price up through the roof or (b) expect everyone to earn a quarter of their usual rate (or less).


----------



## ska invita (Jul 17, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Allowing events is one thing, organisers  getting them insured is going to be a whole new headache.





editor said:


> Not many venues will be able to afford bands/DJs/sound engineers with quarter sized crowds unless they (a) rack the admission price up through the roof or (b) expect everyone to earn a quarter of their usual rate (or less).


i dont disagree

also:








						Fans could return in October - Johnson
					

Spectators could be able to watch sport inside stadiums in England again from October, says Prime Minister Boris Johnson.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




i think this is all wishful thinking...just read barcelona is going back into a 2 week lockdown for example - nonetheless all the signals are that the Tories are going to "allow" things to open probably more than is wise to, partly to justify switching off financial support.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 17, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Allowing events is one thing, organisers  getting them insured is going to be a whole new headache.



There is no insurance against C-19. Some travel companies have got refund or reschedule policies but are funding that themselves, not insuring it. For me the insurer just charged me 30% for moving the policy to new dates. Insurance for venues will be much harder 

Spoke to the boss at ExCel today. They are not opening for any events till October 1st, with staff coming off furlough a month before.

This means already (mostly) once or twice postponed events Aug-Sept will be rescheduled. Up till yesterday there were events selling stands and tickets for August  like Grand Designs Live who were claiming 500 companies plus 90-100k visitors would be attending. Plus the contractors, venue staff, security and others. Fucking farcical

Also this  _Nightingale £3bn _talk is government bollocks as usual  what they have got at ExCel is 10,000sqm of empty space 'on hold' for the government in readiness for a second wave over winter. This is less than 10% of the event space available at the venue.

Also worth noting that ADNEC (the UAE basically) who own ExCel have gifted this to the UK as they did with the space needed to build the Hancock photo opportunity original hospital.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 17, 2020)

Badgers said:


> There is no insurance against C-19. Some travel companies have got refund or reschedule policies but are funding that themselves, not insuring it. For me the insurer just charged me 30% for moving the policy to new dates. Insurance for venues will be much harder
> 
> Spoke to the boss at ExCel today. They are not opening for any events till October 1st, with staff coming off furlough a month before.
> 
> ...



That's nice of the UAE.

And nice to know that should you be on a ventilator in the second wave you can nip in to the Ideal Home Exhibition on your afternoons off...


----------



## Badgers (Jul 17, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> And nice to know that should be on a ventilator in the second wave you can nip in to the Ideal Home Exhibition in your afternoons off...


Every cloud eh?


----------



## Cloo (Jul 18, 2020)

Big Moon gig for 31st October just been postponed to 10 March 2021, but I can't see that happening either unless there is either a viable vaccine or else a sea-change in treatment by the end of this year.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 19, 2020)

Live gigs are back - but social distancing poses problems
					

An Elton John tribute is one of the first acts to perform in front of an audience since lockdown.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## editor (Jul 19, 2020)

It's a strange new reality we're in


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 19, 2020)




----------



## editor (Jul 19, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> View attachment 222880


That is really shit - just as shit as a drive in gig would be.


----------



## Supine (Jul 19, 2020)

Forget crappy cinema and cars. It's all about the rave these days









						Thousands attend illegal rave at RAF Charmy Down near Bath
					

Police say they did not have the resources to halt the event which attracted more than 3,000 people.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## editor (Jul 19, 2020)

Supine said:


> Forget crappy cinema and cars. It's all about the rave these days
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's at the other end of stupid, although I completely get why kids are going out and partying.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 19, 2020)

editor said:


> That's at the other end of stupid, although I completely get why kids are going out and partying.


Had one near me at Letchworth last night in a motorway underpass (according to the feds) which led to closure of the motorway. Needless to say it was closed down pretty quickly.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 19, 2020)

Kinnell, those 'ravers'  can get away with anything ....

'These days' 



But also  ......


----------



## Chilli.s (Jul 19, 2020)

.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 19, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Kinnell, those 'ravers'  can get away with anything ....
> 
> 'These days'
> 
> ...


Why the  ?


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 19, 2020)

ddraig said:


> Why the  ?



They can do what they want, but that was all about me being too old


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 20, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Had one near me at Letchworth last night in a motorway underpass (according to the feds) which led to closure of the motorway. Needless to say it was closed down pretty quickly.




Why close the motorway? We used to do one under the M40 where the Ridgeway path crossed it, never got stopped. Indeed there was a rig called Tunnel Crew who specialised in a certain kind of venue...


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 20, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> View attachment 222880




This is where my car comes in to its own, it has TV screens in the back of the headrests, so just pop in to the back and stick on a DVD of the film you can't see. Piece of piss.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 20, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Why close the motorway? We used to do one under the M40 where the Ridgeway path crossed it, never got stopped. Indeed there was a rig called Tunnel Crew who specialised in a certain kind of venue...


I think it was because a lot of eager ravers were crossing or wondering onto said motorway


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 20, 2020)

Talk of raves/parties/fests very close to motorways, reminds me of getting to the final Exodus festival in 2000!  
(Well before Covid-19 had even been heard of!!!  )

(I've only bothered to link [above] to the general Exodus Wiki page  , but there's *plenty* more online about that one  ).


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jul 20, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Talk of raves/parties/fests very close to motorways, reminds me of getting to the final Exodus festival in 2000!
> (Well before Covid-19 had even been heard of!!!  )
> 
> (I've only bothered to link [above] to the general Exodus Wiki page  , but there's *plenty* more online about that one  ).



Yeah they had their usual rig but limited all the others to 2k max


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 20, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Yeah they had their usual rig but limited all the others to 2k max



Detail that I didn't know about  ....  but whatever,  I managed to get to _several_ different gigs and parties at that event


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 20, 2020)

They seem to have made a better effort here, looks like it could potentially have been somewhere slightly under 100% shit if you were in the first few rows, and there weren't these conditions:



> When parked, guests aren’t to exit their cars unless going to the bathroom. The contactless experience includes concessions and merchandise that are available for online purchase and delivery straight to your car. Of note, the venue is alcohol-free. So there’s no booze on the menu.






Probably would have been 100 times better for anybody watching from behind the fence with a few cans.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 20, 2020)

E2a the exodus one by side of motorway

That was weird that rave
Clearest memory was big blokes punching one of them punching fairground type machines and people with donation buckets in the underpass?


----------



## Badgers (Jul 22, 2020)

MEN breaking: Manchester venues Deaf Institute and Gorilla have been saved from closure. Story to follow.


----------



## killer b (Jul 22, 2020)

Badgers said:


> MEN breaking: Manchester venues Deaf Institute and Gorilla have been saved from closure. Story to follow.


They've been bought by another Manc venue group Tokyo Enterprises (A friend used to work for Tokyo and they seem to be ok)


----------



## killer b (Jul 22, 2020)

...hopefully this means they'll finally get a decent PA for Gorilla.


----------



## Supine (Jul 23, 2020)

Looks like Tramshed in Cardiff is moving along as a late night venue. Good news.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 23, 2020)

Supine said:


> Looks like Tramshed in Cardiff is moving along as a late night venue. Good news.



As long as it's not Craig "premixed" fucking Charles!


----------



## Supine (Jul 23, 2020)

Looks like this year's Six Nations is officially dead. I've been asked if I want a refund or to donate my ticket cost to the WRU! 

At £100 a pop I've obviously asked for my money back.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 23, 2020)

Already posted by Riff in the Bearded Theory thread in Festivals forum.
This very belated but *fully* expected announcement is from today.



Riff said:


> But no surprise, really.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## mx wcfc (Jul 24, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Already posted by Riff in the Bearded Theory thread in Festivals forum.
> This very belated but *fully* expected announcement is from today.


And as posted in the Bearded thread, there are still two festies that I'm hanging onto,  

Mayhem at Micks in late September looks dodgy.  They are discussing things with the council, but it's not far from Leicester.  It all 50/60 something old punks, so maybe best if it doesn't happen, but Eastfield are playing, so if it's on, I'm going.  

The other is August bank Holiday weekend.  More a mates' party,  again, if it's on, I'm doing it.  

Camping is OK.  Outdoor music is OK.  => DIY festivals are OK


----------



## ddraig (Jul 26, 2020)

Vertical concerts?
Book into a hotel


----------



## mx wcfc (Jul 27, 2020)

Not one I've been to, but this popped up on my fb feed just now.


----------



## editor (Jul 27, 2020)

My North American tour has been moved yet again. It had been rescheduled three times to Aug 2020, then May 2021 and then August 2021, but then a few venues got in touch and said they don't think they'd be open then because the US is such an utter clusterfuck of Covid incompetence.

So now it's scheduled for October 2021, if I'm still alive then!


----------



## editor (Jul 27, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Not one I've been to, but this popped up on my fb feed just now.



Good luck to them: 



> *– We will be sending you a simple compulsory online questionnaire that MUST be completed between 31st July and 2nd August. If you have not completed the questionnaire in advance you will not be allowed on site.
> 
> – Social distancing rules will be compulsory throughout the site at all times – please remember to stick to a 2m distance wherever possible from those not in your household or support bubble. *On occasions, a 1m distance is acceptable, but only for short periods of times, or where people are sat back-to-back.
> 
> ...


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 27, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Not one I've been to, but this popped up on my fb feed just now.




That's an event that might? be worth investigating next year, maybe 

ETA : I'm reacting just to the bands and cider aspects, here!

But I've also just seen what editor posted. I understand the rules/restrictions and I wouldn't be annoying and object to their seeing the need to apply them. Safety is paramount at any event, after all.
But I would hope that by summer 2021, it might become safe and possible to relax some? of them, *at least to an extent* .... we can but wait and see.


----------



## spitfire (Jul 27, 2020)

Fucking hell, this sounds_ amazing_. ly awful.

"People were ready to party in the Hamptons, and Goldman Sachs Chief Executive David Solomon, fresh off a great quarter and a multibillion-dollar fine to settle criminal charges in Malaysia, was one of them.

So were parking, security, tech and sound crews, many of whom hadn’t worked for months.

They came together on a field Saturday night for an epic event in any Hamptons season, more so in the time of Covid-19: the first Safe & Sound drive-in concert. A couple of thousand people -- including the Winklevoss twins -- were in attendance, dancing on the grass and the tops of their cars to the Chainsmokers."









						Goldman CEO Opens for Chainsmokers at Hamptons Concert
					

People were ready to party in the Hamptons, and Goldman Sachs Chief Executive David Solomon, fresh off a great quarter and a multibillion-dollar fine to settle criminal charges in Malaysia, was one of them.




					www.bloomberg.com


----------



## editor (Jul 28, 2020)

spitfire said:


> Fucking hell, this sounds_ amazing_. ly awful.
> 
> "People were ready to party in the Hamptons, and Goldman Sachs Chief Executive David Solomon, fresh off a great quarter and a multibillion-dollar fine to settle criminal charges in Malaysia, was one of them.
> 
> ...


Vile ugly wealth and privilege. 



> “Standing up there and watching the sunset, looking out over this huge field of cars and people on their cars, it was absolutely beautiful,” Solomon said Monday in an interview. “The group that put this together did an incredible job in a difficult environment. If we work together and are thoughtful, we can do things that feel more normal and allow us to live with this virus safely.”
> 
> 
> While the musical acts performed, about 350 people hired for the event at Nova’s Ark Project in Water Mill were dealing with conditions on the ground. About 500 cars were parked in spots that cost as much as $25,000, with the top tier including an air-conditioned RV and private bathroom. Crews also cleaned the portable toilets every 10 minutes.
> ...


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 28, 2020)

On a mildly positive note, it looks like we'll now be going to 'A Night at the Abbey' (open-air!) on Friday 28th August.
We've bought tickets anyway.

The bands are very small (Funke though!!  ), the audience numbers (apparantly) limited to 500.
And space around the grounds of Glastonbury Abbey is plentiful -- it's huge.

The Abbey  staff told me on Friday that although bring-your-own-chair  is allowed, a lot of other distancing restrictions will be carefully applied.

We look forward to going to *a* Glastonbury Festival after all!


----------



## spitfire (Jul 28, 2020)

editor said:


> Vile ugly wealth and privilege.



Went well then.









						'Egregious' distancing violations at Chainsmokers charity concert – Cuomo
					

New York governor says event in Hamptons also featuring Goldman Sachs CEO breached Covid-19 rules




					www.theguardian.com
				




I feel for the workers and everyone there just trying to scrape a few quid together and these über privileged dicks put everyone in danger,


----------



## phillm (Jul 28, 2020)

Red Rooster announce details of their COVID policy.





__





						Keeping you safe at Red Rooster Festival
					






					www.redrooster.org.uk


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 29, 2020)

phillm said:


> Red Rooster announce details of their COVID policy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This is presumably quite a small festival.

I read those while all the time thinking about how and whether those rules (or similar) would work for larger events ... 

It's interesting how many rules Red Rooster need to apply, and their details.

I understand why, and they're all logical (the 'moonshine wristband' malarkey was to me a bit  though!  )

They're pretty clearly written (IMO) and the organisers are obviously trying their best to be nice and friendly about everything.

But let's see how other events manage next year!


----------



## phillm (Jul 29, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> This is presumably quite a small festival.
> 
> I read those while all the time thinking about how and whether those rules (or similar) would work for larger events ...
> 
> ...



The owners are VERY rich - Euston Hall is the home of the Dukes of Grafton and one of the festival's founders. So basically you are attending their party on his estate. Probably not to the taste of many here. That said the grounds are stunningly beautiful, the vibe cool and laid back in all respects. I saw Alabama 3 in a brilliant acoustic set a couple of years back and the band seemed happy hanging around with the Duke and his pals afterwards FWIW.









						Henry FitzRoy, 12th Duke of Grafton - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				












						Duke of Grafton uses R&B to restore Euston Hall’s pleasure grounds
					

Red Rooster music festival is among the events aiming to take the Suffolk estate into the 21st century and make it profitable




					www.ft.com


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2020)

Bit of a disaster then



> A gig used to trial safety measures for the return of live music "did not succeed" in providing a blueprint for the industry, according to the manager of the venue that hosted the event.
> 
> Folk rocker Frank Turner played to a socially-distanced audience at London's Clapham Grand on Tuesday.
> 
> ...











						Frank Turner's socially distanced trial gig ‘not a success’
					

A pilot gig at The Clapham Grand was "great" but not a "sustainable" alternative, says the owner.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Supine (Jul 29, 2020)

phillm said:


> The owners are VERY rich - Euston Hall is the home of the Dukes of Grafton and one of the festival's founders.



If I was a rich Duke I'd throw a massive party in my garden too


----------



## editor (Jul 30, 2020)

Just been sent this: 


*Camden Oktoberfest Reveal London's First Post-Lockdown Oktoberfest Celebrations*

Finally there is something on the horizon we can all look forward to in our post lockdown world and it is something very special indeed. Across the first four Saturdays in *October 2020*, the unmissable *Camden Oktoberfest* returns once again to prove itself the most complete, the most considered and the coolest celebration of the famous Bavarian beer festival.

This year will be another perfect pairing of the merry traditions of Oktoberfest with a modern twist featuring cutting edge live brass bands and DJs at *Electric Ballroom*, one of Camden’s leading music venues. The region's largest Oktoberfest will take over this historic venue for *daytime sessions* from *12midday to 6pm* and *evening sessions* from *8pm to 2am* on *Saturdays 3rd, 10th, 17th *and* 24th October*.

*What's more, in light of the current Covid-19 Coronavirus Pandemic, if the event has to be cancelled, all tickets will be automatically refunded.*

Imagine a fully decked out Bavarian beer hall complete with traditional beer tables, Oktoberfest bunting, miles of delicious sausage including authentic German Bratwurst, grilled Black Forest sausage, Currywurst, pretzel alternatives Brotzel plus giant sloshing steins of German beer. Full fancy dress is encouraged so that you can feel right at home at this raucous party and to add an extra dimension to the already sensory tickling delights on offer. To complement the theme, your host waitresses and waiters will be decked out in authentic Dirndl and Lederhosen as they keep your steins filled to the brim.

The mouth watering beers originate from across Germany and are supplied by *Spaten, Löwenbräu & Becks*, so you should expect only the finest Bavarian brews. Other big news for 2020 is that legendary Bratwurst sausage street food trader *Herman Ze German* is the exclusive food partner.

All this will be accompanied by a thigh-slapping soundtrack. Headline act *No Limit Street Band*, who have been hugely impressive in previous years will return to bring their magic to Camden Oktoberfest. The eight piece brass band is made up of some of London's leading street musicians and they will lay down a foot stomping, beer swilling mix of pop, rock, hip hop, R&B, funk and soul covers to keep you entertained. Dancers, competitions and unique challenges keep the energy levels high until the party starting DJs that are *Club De Fromage* switch things up later on.

*Covid-19 Safety* - Most importantly, Camden Oktoberfest have been working closely with Electric Ballroom to develop safety precautions for this series of events to minimise risk to customers and staff. Each Oktoberfest session will operate on a 50% reduced capacity meaning all guests can be seated throughout. Other safety measures include the use of face masks and gloves by staff, Plexiglas shielded bars, bathroom attendants on duty: Hand sanitisers throughout, increased hygiene and cleaning, disposable single use glassware: Ushered one way system throughout, distanced queuing system at bars and apps for additional table service. There will also be an ID scan for track and trace purposes and temperature checks on entry.

As well as a standard entry ticket priced at £10, you can also go the extra mile and reserve a whole beer table for up to eight people in the main hall for just £280 which includes 2 beers for each person. VIP Booths are also on offer on the private balcony for up to eight people and also include two beers per person for £400.

Expect four dates of beer-fuelled, food-filled fun in a venue that will provide a bustling and triumphant atmosphere. Camden Oktoberfest is the authentic celebration of German food and drink culture giving you a perfect excuse for some much needed post-lockdown fun.

*£10 Tickets and more information can be found at; https://www.camdenoktoberfest.com/*

*Press Enquiries*
Chris Halliday | Grounded PR
chris@groundedlondon.com

*Camden Oktoberfest 2020*
At Electric Ballroom
184 Camden High St, Camden Town, London, NW1 8QP
020 7485 9006 | info@camdenoktoberfest.com

*Oktoberfest Sessions*

*Saturday 3rd October*
Daytime: 12midday - 6pm
Evening: 8pm - 2am

*Saturday 10th October*
Daytime: 12midday - 6pm
Evening: 8pm - 2am

*Saturday 17th October*
Daytime: 12midday - 6pm
Evening: 8pm - 2am

*Saturday 24th October*
Daytime: 12midday - 6pm
Evening: 8pm - 2am


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 30, 2020)

Camden Oktoberfest said:
			
		

> *Covid-19 Safety* - Most importantly, Camden Oktoberfest have been working closely with Electric Ballroom to develop safety precautions for this series of events to minimise risk to customers and staff. Each Oktoberfest session will operate on a 50% reduced capacity meaning all guests can be seated throughout. Other safety measures include the use of face masks and gloves by staff, Plexiglas shielded bars, bathroom attendants on duty: Hand sanitisers throughout, increased hygiene and cleaning, disposable single use glassware: Ushered one way system throughout, distanced queuing system at bars and apps for additional table service. There will also be an ID scan for track and trace purposes and temperature checks on entry.



/\  /\ Those safety measures look pretty reasonable and well-thought-out IMO 

</thinking of what might be needed for return of CAMRA festivals next year  >

ETA : In our beerfest circles atm, we're not aware of any non-postponed or non-cancelled beerfests ahead of about February! 
Even then's a tad opitimistic, we were saying ....


----------



## Supine (Jul 30, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> ETA : In our beerfest circles atm, we're not aware of any non-postponed or non-cancelled beerfests ahead of about February!
> Even then's a tad opitimistic, we were saying ....



Might not be Camra but Bristol craft beer festival is on this year


----------



## klang (Jul 30, 2020)

lol even Munich manages without a fucking Oktoberfest this year


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 30, 2020)

Supine said:


> Might not be Camra but Bristol craft beer festival is on this year



Interesting , although the fest isn't that cheap ....

I've heard of this one, but never been.  Good breweries involved.

And that's quite a surprise that it's [possibly/probably] happening, IMO.
I guess the fact that it's going to be open air (?? but 'Harbourside') must make quite a difference


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 30, 2020)

Electric Ballroom says it has 1,500 capacity, so 50% of that would be 750 punters, plus serving staff. etc. drinking beer and talking for 6-hour sessions in an enclosed space, a little over 2 months from now - looks like one to steer clear of, especially since people are highly unlikely to be wearing masks and only taking them off when they want to nibble a pretzel or swig some beer - can't they find a suitable outdoor location?

For some reason the description made me imagine the whole thing staffed and attended by Futurama robots, now there's an event I would definitely go to.


----------



## klang (Jul 30, 2020)

750 in Electric Ballroom still sounds very busy to me....


----------



## pesh (Jul 30, 2020)

will the brass bands be wearing facemasks?


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 30, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Electric Ballroom says it has 1,500 capacity, so 50% of that would be 750 punters, plus serving staff. etc. drinking beer and talking for 6-hour sessions in an enclosed space, a little over 2 months from now - looks like one to steer clear of, especially since people are highly unlikely to be wearing masks and only taking them off when they want to nibble a pretzel or swig some beer - can't they find a suitable outdoor location?
> 
> For some reason the description made me imagine the whole thing staffed and attended by Futurama robots, now there's an event I would definitely go to.





William of Walworth said:


> /\  /\ Those safety measures look pretty reasonable and well-thought-out IMO



Maybe *not *all that good then  

Inevitably, you can't think through everything straight away. We won't be going anyway ......


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 30, 2020)

An 8 piece ensemble armed with covid-cannons as the main entertainment might not be the best idea either


----------



## klang (Jul 30, 2020)

I really can't see this going ahead. Who is gonna take responsibility for punters and (more importantly) staff getting infected? 750 people getting pissed in Electric Ballroom having a knees up Bavarian style in the middle of a highly infectious pandemic? ffs


----------



## klang (Jul 30, 2020)

editor said:


> *Spaten, Löwenbräu & Becks*


Nevermind covid, Becks really is the main reason why this event should not be going ahead.


----------



## klang (Jul 30, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Electric Ballroom says it has 1,500 capacity, so 50% of that would be 750 punters,


thinking about it - 1500 is probably standing unfurnished capacity. Once the beer tables are in capacity would be reduced by at least 40%.
Would be interesting to know what they actually mean by 50%....


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 30, 2020)

littleseb said:


> thinking about it - 1500 is probably standing unfurnished capacity. Once the beer tables are in capacity would be reduced by at least 40%.
> Would be interesting to know what they actually mean by 50%....


If they want it safe, 50 _people_


----------



## klang (Jul 30, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> If they want it safe, 50 _people_


a generous guest list for the brass band.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 30, 2020)

littleseb said:


> Nevermind covid, *Becks really is the main reason why this event should not be going ahead*.



Didn't see that!!! 

Another very good reason why we'd never go, even in a non-pandemic year


----------



## ska invita (Jul 31, 2020)

Whitty: "The ONS data suggests we have reached the limits of what we can do in terms of opening things up in society, he says." <<<i think thats baically the end of that...this is as good as it can get, and it can only go backwards from here on in 
shit


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 31, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Whitty: "The ONS data suggests we have reached the limits of what we can do in terms of opening things up in society, he says." <<<i think thats baically the end of that...this is as good as it can get, and it can only go backwards from here on in
> shit



Aye.  I think if you're employed in any form of performing arts than it might be time to get that CV updated.  Grim news.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 31, 2020)

With luck and care, a few small events may still occur. See my post #605 above, for an example  ......


----------



## Supine (Jul 31, 2020)

Alfresco festival looks like it's going ahead. Good luck to them. 

I've almost been but never made it along.


----------



## Supine (Jul 31, 2020)

This is their plan   

*SAFETY MANIFESTO*


At Alfresco we are committed to maintaining a safe environment for all in attendance.
We have designed our festival site to enable you to socialize safely within your groups of friends, maintain social distancing from others and be alert to the risks of Covid-19, while remaining part of the overall festival atmosphere of Alfresco.

We are one community responsible for each other. For your reassurance, we have listed below the carefully constructed safety measures that we have put in place. In collaboration with our measures, we ask that you please make yourself aware, act in a responsible manner and respect those around you at all times.

Let’s help each other bring music and dancing back into our lives safely.

We are committed to the following Covid-19 safety measures:
We will have a Covid-19 safety specialist on site, who will implement, monitor and constantly seek to improve our systems throughout the event.
We have all the details of the people attending the event through our ticket agency and they are checked as people enter. This will enable us to track and trace efficiently, should we need to.

There will be a well-ordered, staggered arrival system, with 2m of distance between groups at all times.

Our main bar area will have a perspex between the staff and the customers whilst drink is being served and this is operated on a one way queuing system with 2m distancing between customers. Cash is accepted on our bars BUT we have several PDQ machines and openly encourage contactless payments.

All Alfresco staff – cleaners, hosts, management and security are trained on every aspect of our Covid-19 safety operation and their responsibilities in enforcing it. All Alfresco staff will wear adequate PPE at all times and follow all guidance on Covid-19 news and how to travel safely.

We have a huge space over the whole festival site making social distancing very easy to accommodate.

All of the site’s portaloos will be spaced 2m between each with 2m floor markings for anyone waiting. Each portaloo represents an individual cubicle, with individual sinks and disinfectant wipes. There will be a dedicated cleaning team for these.

We have picnic benches and pallet seating areas to accommodate 400 and many also have their own blankets and furniture etc. All benches and furniture will be cleaned between uses.

DJ booths will be cleaned between uses.
Each evening as the outdoor areas close, the picnic tables will be moved into the later marquee tents.

Our Marquees will be at least 65% open sided with the only enclosed areas to assist in the maintaining of music level restrictions.
The Marquees are twice the size that we normally have for this amount of people, enabling large amounts of excess space in each to maintain social distancing.

There will be floor markings spaced correctly in the marquees, giving indications of where people can dance whilst still staying at a safe and social distance.

Signs will be placed throughout the site, reminding people of their responsibilities of social distancing and the washing of hands.
Cleaning and litter picking crews will be in operation for the whole duration, making sure all tables are constantly cleaned and sanitized.
All our campsite pitches will have enough space between them to maintain social distancing measures.

Sanitizer stations will be placed in the campsite facility area and various other locations throughout the site. They will be maintained and stocked 24/7.

Alfresco management will deal with any instances of anti-social behaviour effectively and safely to protect all on site.
Personal face coverings will be available to customers on site

Our priority is to maintain a safe and enjoyable festival atmosphere for all to enjoy.
The Alfresco Team


----------



## ska invita (Jul 31, 2020)

Supine said:


> Alfresco festival looks like it's going ahead. Good luck to them.
> 
> I've almost been but never made it along.


every male dj has a beard there!




__





						Artists – Alfresco Festival
					





					alfrescofestival.co.uk
				






Bearded Theory Praxis


----------



## Supine (Jul 31, 2020)

ska invita said:


> every male dj has a beard there!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 31, 2020)

What's the story with live football?


----------



## ska invita (Aug 1, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> What's the story with live football?


0-0 at half time


(i think we got that they were going to start allowing a few people in - though that was before the brakes were applied today)


----------



## phillm (Aug 3, 2020)

Red Rooster has finally cancelled blaming it on a lack of engagement from Public Health England. 





__





						Red Rooster Festival
					

Red Rooster festival celebrates the best in Cajun, Soul, Rock n Roll, Blues, Roots and Country, in the heart of the Suffolk countryside




					www.redrooster.org.uk


----------



## mx wcfc (Aug 3, 2020)

Blyth Power Ashes was my last hope.  There is camping, there is a gig on the Saturday, there will be people.  Just not the real deal.


----------



## Looby (Aug 3, 2020)

Shiiine On weekender at Butlins still haven’t cancelled and have taken people’s instalment payments today. They’ve built an outdoor stage but that’s no good in a cold November. It was freezing when I went in 2018.
I get that people are desperate to do something this year but even if this was allowed to go ahead it couldn’t be at capacity so there’d have to be cancellations. The atmosphere will be shit and you’ll have up to 8 households sharing chalets. Just get on and tell punters what’s happening!


----------



## William of Walworth (Aug 3, 2020)

We're aware of a mini-festival in Shropshire that _might_ be going ahead in September  -- strict maximum of 500 people, on a large farm..

It's being talked about very low-key on a Facebook page, so out of respect for the organiser (who I know a bit) I won't name it or link to it for now.

Our plan is to get tickets only in the week ahead, because we know the site/area, and we'll need it not to be muddy and rainy (van has been near-stuck there (= needed towing!) in the past  ). 
Also, we need to be sure it really will go ahead.

Hope so -- a number of good bands promised


----------



## William of Walworth (Aug 3, 2020)

We're likely (?) to have a (publicly listed) gig here in Swansea in November 

*The Selecter supported by From The Jam* (= Bruce Foxton, but it'll be a greatest hits show  )

In Swansea's currently largest indoor venue (Brangwyn Hall) with a limited-size audience.

We usually hold our August beer festival there, so we're reasonably confident it'll be safe, with distancing applied  -- Council own the place after all!
We know a couple of the stewards too, so they can give us an idea nearer the time of how things will be organised.

We have tickets now anyway!


----------



## elbows (Aug 3, 2020)

Maltas festival plans are no more:









						Malta festivals cancelled due to rise in Covid-19 cases
					

Escape 2 The Island, Rhythm + Waves, BPM Festival: Malta and Mi Casa Festival won't go ahead.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				






> Escape 2 The Island, Rhythm + Waves, BPM Festival: Malta and Mi Casa Festival have all been called off.
> 
> A statement from each festival says they are all "disappointed" not to be going ahead, after making a decision with the Maltese Tourism Authority.
> 
> Ticket holders, many who were from the UK, will receive a full refund.





> "We didn't have that bad a lockdown, because we're an island we haven't really got as many people coming in," he told Newsbeat last week.
> 
> "We only had lockdown for one month.
> 
> ...


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 3, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> We're aware of a mini-festival in Shropshire that _might_ be going ahead in September  -- strict maximum of 500 people, on a large farm..
> 
> It's being talked about very low-key on a Facebook page, so out of respect for the organiser (who I know a bit) I won't name it or link to it for now.
> 
> ...


It won’t happen.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 3, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> We're likely (?) to have a (publicly listed) gig here in Swansea in November
> 
> *The Selecter supported by From The Jam* (= Bruce Foxton, but it'll be a greatest hits show  )
> 
> ...


It probably won’t happen.


----------



## William of Walworth (Aug 3, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow : I'm far less confident about the September mini-festival than The Selecter gig (November).
But _all_ our information so far is that they will be happening.

If they don't, we'll live, and we'll completely understand any reasons,  but I'm still half-way optimistic for now. We'll see.


----------



## Mation (Aug 4, 2020)

phillm said:


> Red Rooster has finally cancelled blaming it on a lack of engagement from Public Health England.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Why on earth would anyone want to celebrate the deep south of that fucking country??!


----------



## colacubes (Aug 4, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It probably won’t happen.



^^ This. I've just had cancellation through for a gig in November rearranged from June at the Brixton Academy.


----------



## killer b (Aug 4, 2020)

Mation said:


> Why on earth would anyone want to celebrate the deep south of that fucking country??!


They probably like the music I expect. Some of it is great tbf.


----------



## phillm (Aug 4, 2020)

Mation said:


> Why on earth would anyone want to celebrate the deep south of that fucking country??!


This is in no way some sort of dixie redneck racist musical event far from it. Delta Blues comes from there for one ....and the heritage is hugely respected. As I've said before Alabama 3 played there and their name is as 'south' as they come.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 5, 2020)

So in the last 24 hours one of the countries largest and most respected PA companies has had to lay off 50 staff, and one of the larger tourbus companies has laid off most of its staff also, and are saying their buses will have to be sold/returned.

If this carries on there won’t be any gigs next year simply because there won’t be any crew or kit to make them happen. The industry is rapidly heading off a cliff edge.


----------



## spitfire (Aug 5, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> So in the last 24 hours one of the countries largest and most respected PA companies has had to lay off 50 staff, and one of the larger tourbus companies has laid off most of its staff also, and are saying their buses will have to be sold/returned.
> 
> If this carries on there won’t be any gigs next year simply because there won’t be any crew or kit to make them happen. The industry is rapidly heading off a cliff edge.



Ah fuck, which tourbus company?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 5, 2020)

spitfire said:


> Ah fuck, which tourbus company?


Not sure how “public” it all is yet, but one of the larger ones.


----------



## editor (Aug 5, 2020)

There's talk of Glastonbury not happening now until 2022. It's an ongoing shitshow for anyone involved in the music/DJ/PA/promoting/agency business and it's not going to get any better for a very very long time.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 5, 2020)

I don’t think anything can really be considered  as happening until we’ve got through the coming winter, and seen what/if/how any second wave/spike works.

There’s just way too many variables and potential hurdles otherwise. The big elephant in the room is still getting anything insured.


----------



## editor (Aug 5, 2020)

DJs on the mic in the post Covid lockdown era:

"Hey everyone - stop dancing! Don't sing along! Don't come near the DJ booth! Keep away from us! Sit back in your socially distanced seat and chat quietly!"


----------



## ska invita (Aug 5, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> So in the last 24 hours one of the countries largest and most respected PA companies has had to lay off 50 staff, and one of the larger tourbus companies has laid off most of its staff also, and are saying their buses will have to be sold/returned.
> 
> If this carries on there won’t be any gigs next year simply because there won’t be any crew or kit to make them happen. The industry is rapidly heading off a cliff edge.


Heard there is some kind of industry demo action being organised for the 11th August, not sure the details.

I do wonder why there is so little support from the government for this. It's a massive industry. 5 times bigger than the fishing industry, as a friend put it.


----------



## killer b (Aug 5, 2020)

as mentioned on the gigs thread, a mate who runs a couple of small venues here tells me there's a load of arts council support become available for smaller venues to allow them to put on gigs to very small audiences (his venue capacities will be about 30 and about 20 he reckons, down from 150 / 120). Dunno what else there is about, but it's unlikely just small venues being tagetted


----------



## pesh (Aug 5, 2020)

editor said:


> DJs on the mic in the post Covid lockdown era:
> 
> "Hey everyone - stop dancing! Don't sing along! Don't come near the DJ booth! Keep away from us! Sit back in your socially distanced seat and chat quietly!"


Covid was never going to improve DJ banter.


----------



## editor (Aug 5, 2020)

pesh said:


> Covid was never going to improve DJ banter.


I never, ever do any, anyway but some people can't get enough of their own voice.


----------



## pesh (Aug 5, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Heard there is some kind of industry demo action being organised for the 11th August, not sure the details.


There's going to be a few around the country, London one is going to be on the Southbank 









						WeMakeEvents: Red Alert - Day of Action
					

This page is  specifically about the event in London. More information about regional events will be shared on the Facebook event.




					www.eventbrite.co.uk


----------



## Supine (Aug 8, 2020)

Good film about the impact of covid on dj’s









						This new film explores Coronavirus pandemic's impact on global electronic music scene
					

.




					thevinylfactory.com


----------



## editor (Aug 8, 2020)




----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 9, 2020)

editor said:


>



can you play the birdy song?


----------



## William of Walworth (Aug 9, 2020)

editor said:


> *There's talk of Glastonbury not happening now until 2022*. It's an ongoing shitshow for anyone involved in the music/DJ/PA/promoting/agency business and it's not going to get any better for a very very long time.



editor /anyone -- is there a link for that?

A festival friend of ours said (the other day) that they'd seen a story about Michael Eavis (?) being worried that G2021 wouldn't happen, but I've been struggling to find details ....


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 9, 2020)

‘If We Get It, We Chose to Be Here’: Despite Virus, Thousands Converge on Sturgis for Huge Rally
					

Tens of thousands of motorcyclists roared into the western South Dakota community on Friday, lining Main Street from end to end, for the start of the annual Sturgis Motorcycle Rally.




					www.nytimes.com
				




This event sounds great


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 9, 2020)

editor said:


> DJs on the mic in the post Covid lockdown era:
> 
> "Hey everyone - stop dancing! Don't sing along! Don't come near the DJ booth! Keep away from us! Sit back in your socially distanced seat and chat quietly!"



Don't put your hands in the air unless you've sanitised them.


----------



## pesh (Aug 9, 2020)

Lighter Crew!


----------



## Marty1 (Aug 9, 2020)

Supine said:


> Forget crappy cinema and cars. It's all about the rave these days
> 
> 
> 
> ...



‘Too big to stop’ - they should sell t-shirts with that on.

It’s like going back to the late 80’s/early 90’s rave scene.


----------



## Marty1 (Aug 9, 2020)

ddraig said:


> Vertical concerts?
> Book into a hotel




Thats actually superb.

Id hire a room if they had a DJ line up like Carl Cox etc.


----------



## pesh (Aug 9, 2020)




----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 9, 2020)

The Hippodrome says it isn't staging live productions on the main auditorium until Feb 2021 'at the earliest' - Birmingham Updates
					

Today, Birmingham Hippodrome announced that they would not be staging live theatre productions in the main auditorium until February 2021 at the earliest. Read their full statement below: After much discussion and heartache, we are saddened to announce that Birmingham Hippodrome will not be...




					www.birminghamupdates.com


----------



## clicker (Aug 9, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> editor /anyone -- is there a link for that?
> 
> A festival friend of ours said (the other day) that they'd seen a story about Michael Eavis (?) being worried that G2021 wouldn't happen, but I've been struggling to find details ....


I definitely read it somewhere in the last week. Will try and find it. I can't see how they can plan now for next year, not only because they'd struggle to get insurance in current times. Which would cause problems drawing up any contracts.


----------



## platinumsage (Aug 9, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> editor /anyone -- is there a link for that?
> 
> A festival friend of ours said (the other day) that they'd seen a story about Michael Eavis (?) being worried that G2021 wouldn't happen, but I've been struggling to find details ....











						Glastonbury Festival may not return in 2021 - Michael Eavis
					

"We might have to wait for two years maybe"




					www.somersetlive.co.uk


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 10, 2020)

Any festival / events company with any level of professionalism should be considering that no events next summer is a very real possibility.  Will of course cause a real headache with all those tickets rolled over from this year.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 10, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Any festival / events company with any level of professionalism should be considering that no events next summer is a very real possibility.  Will of course cause a real headache with all those tickets rolled over from this year.


Yep.


----------



## Supine (Aug 10, 2020)

I’m hopeful that festivals with open sided tents will be deemed safe and next year will be amazing for festivals. I can be a bit of an optimist though.


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 10, 2020)

Supine said:


> I’m hopeful that festivals with open sided tents will be deemed safe and next year will be amazing for festivals. I can be a bit of an optimist though.



The way I see it is that the picture won't really be any clearer until we are a good way into winter.  By that time though planning (and spending money) will have to have started.  There must be a lot of organisers out there who cannot afford another cancelled summer and may opt to just skip 2021 altogether.


----------



## mx wcfc (Aug 10, 2020)

This popped up on my fb.  Socially distanced camping, with some live acts, but not a festival.   









						Maui Camp | Maui Waui Events
					






					www.mauiwauievents.co.uk
				




I am coming round to the idea of going to the Blyth Power socially distanced camping weekend I posted about.


----------



## editor (Aug 10, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Any festival / events company with any level of professionalism should be considering that no events next summer is a very real possibility.  Will of course cause a real headache with all those tickets rolled over from this year.


My band has had some of this year's UK gigs rescheduled to May 2021. I'm not that optimistic they'll happen. Having all my work taken from me with zero prospect of an end in sight is really beginning to effect my mental health, and I'm normally a chirpy fucker.  I imagine there's many, many others who are worse off than me too.


----------



## William of Walworth (Aug 10, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> *The way I see it is that the picture won't really be any clearer until we are a good way into winter.*  By that time though planning (and spending money) will have to have started.  There must be a lot of organisers out there who cannot afford another cancelled summer and may opt to just skip 2021 altogether.



Bolded bit : definitely true.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 11, 2020)

Anyone on the demos today?


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 11, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> This popped up on my fb.  Socially distanced camping, with some live acts, but not a festival.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Cancelled today, short notice  I think I had some friends going.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 11, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Anyone on the demos today?


None near me. Looked good what I saw earlier.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 11, 2020)

well it doesnt seem to have made any headlines
the theatres got top billing on the news more than once and radio 4 etc were falling overthemselves to talk about it
doesnt bode well to me


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 12, 2020)

ska invita said:


> well it doesnt seem to have made any headlines


 Local news only perhaps, I think, for the Manchester one.



ska invita said:


> the theatres got top billing on the news more than once and radio 4 etc were falling overthemselves to talk about it
> doesnt bode well to me



Plus ca change. No, sadly it doesn't.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 12, 2020)

ska invita said:


> well it doesnt seem to have made any headlines






chainsawjob said:


> Local news only perhaps, I think, for the Manchester one.



Scrub that, reported nationally in various places Venues signal 'red alert' for live events


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 12, 2020)

Was proud of my colleagues and industry yesterday, every protest was a superb advert for them. Brilliantly organised, as you’d expect. Everyone interviewed was consistent with their message, and dozens of them took to social media in a calm and measured way to take on the usual moaning dickheads.

Im not going to hold my breath for it changing anything just yet, but at least people are going down fighting.


----------



## Badgers (Aug 12, 2020)

Events in October and some in November at ExCel cancelling 

#worldbeating


----------



## Johnny Doe (Aug 12, 2020)

editor said:


> DJs on the mic in the post Covid lockdown era:
> 
> "Hey everyone - stop dancing! Don't sing along! Don't come near the DJ booth! Keep away from us! Sit back in your socially distanced seat and chat quietly!"


Fat boy Slim played in Ibiza yesterday as the screens said 'eat, sleep, stay in your seat'


----------



## ska invita (Aug 12, 2020)

Maybe it's a class thing... The theatre people rub shoulders with the key media people...
Then again it's not as if Albert hall and Southbank are squat raves.
I don't know.... I just can't understand why this isn't a bigger story and issue

ETA: then again the theatre lot didn't get that much out of the government


----------



## BigTom (Aug 12, 2020)

Next in line for wtf crazy idea is this:









						Floating cinema experience in boats set to be held in Birmingham
					

Visitors will get free popcorn too, according to promotion material for the exciting event




					www.birminghammail.co.uk
				




I saw somewhere that some US cinemas are offering full screen bookings for $150 + $150 food purchases with up to 30 people, and you choose what film you want to watch, which seems like a better idea than the above.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 12, 2020)

chainsawjob said:


> Scrub that, reported nationally in various places Venues signal 'red alert' for live events


Not headlines though, buried in the back pages


----------



## Sue (Aug 12, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Next in line for wtf crazy idea is this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


We've had had a floating cinema (though not the audience) for quite some time.









						All aboard the Regent’s Canal Floating Cinema
					

This year’s programme of films and art events is unlikely to be watered down




					www.hackneycitizen.co.uk
				




And the hiring a screen in a cinema thing.


----------



## Anju (Aug 12, 2020)

Pretty serious solution to outdoor music events. Must be hugely expensive but if queueing and buying drinks is well managed it could be low risk.


----------



## pesh (Aug 12, 2020)

Someone posted this pic up on a Facebook tech group the other day and immediately caused a big row between various health and safety types who were arguing  wether or not the platforms were safe without a barrier at the back... looks like someone had go buy some scaff


----------



## Espresso (Aug 12, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Anyone on the demos today?


I went. I knew everyone at it. It was kind of nice to see so many people I knew for the first time in a long time. But fairly shit to know why we were all there.


----------



## editor (Aug 12, 2020)

Anju said:


> Pretty serious solution to outdoor music events. Must be hugely expensive but if queueing and buying drinks is well managed it could be low risk.



Low risk. Big prices and low fun.  I'm out.


----------



## Johnny Doe (Aug 12, 2020)

editor said:


> Low risk. Big prices and low fun.  I'm out.



Yeah, likewise. Props to them for trying to do something though


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 12, 2020)

Harry Smiles said:


> Yeah, likewise. Props to them for trying to do something though



It's probably the best attempt I've seen so far and way better than the in-car efforts.  Still, doesn't look great and I can't imagine its economically sustainable but yeah at least they are giving it a go.


----------



## Anju (Aug 12, 2020)

editor said:


> Low risk. Big prices and low fun.  I'm out.



I know what you mean but nothing to stop you throwing the chairs off and using the platform as a dancefloor. Could maybe see a 500 individual dancefloor rave being fun.


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 12, 2020)

Anju said:


> I know what you mean but nothing to stop you throwing the chairs off and using the platform as a dancefloor. Could maybe see a 500 individual dancefloor rave being fun.



tbh I'm at the age now where I quite like a bit of space.  Being packed shoulder to shoulder in a big crowd no longer holds the appeal it used to.  Then again I can't imagine the atmosphere would be anything other than a bit shit at these gigs.  Is what it is though, I guess.


----------



## pesh (Aug 12, 2020)

Espresso said:


> I went. I knew everyone at it. It was kind of nice to see so many people I knew for the first time in a long time. But fairly shit to know why we were all there.


i went, personally i thought i was a fantastic turn out but ultimately a fucking embarrassment, protests aren't ment to make the local area look pretty for a couple of hours after everyone has gone home, they're meant to cause disruption and get noticed. Manchester did everyone proud with their box push through the centre of town earlier in the day though.


----------



## Espresso (Aug 12, 2020)

pesh said:


> i went, personally i thought i was a fantastic turn out but ultimately a fucking embarrassment, protests aren't ment to make the local area look pretty for a couple of hours after everyone has gone home, they're meant to cause disruption and get noticed. Manchester did everyone proud with their box push through the centre of town earlier in the day though.


Yep. Ours was exceedingly well behaved and well lit. Which, I suppose is right for stage crew. 
It was pretty and FB is full of arty shots of it. As you say. Not the point.


----------



## The39thStep (Aug 14, 2020)

The Portuguese Communist Party's 3 day  Avante Festival is taking place September , they expect 30k . Heres a video explaining the measures they are taking :


----------



## editor (Aug 14, 2020)




----------



## phillm (Aug 17, 2020)

The wonderful Sound Lounge in Morden was one of only 16 live music venues that opened last night. 









						Hannah White at The Sound Lounge - one of the first indoor gigs in the UK
					

Hannah White at The Sound Lounge Live Music Returns indoors well not entirely this was only 1 of 16 venues in the country out of 900 legally allowed to open. This venue The Sound Lounge was very lucky as the founders/owners were both musicians and one being a sound engineer, they are also...




					www.foreverbritishcountry.co.uk
				












						The Sound Lounge
					

"The Sound Lounge is good news for London's live music scene...and hope for London's music fans"... 216-220 High Street, SM1 1NU London




					www.facebook.com


----------



## editor (Aug 17, 2020)

phillm said:


> The wonderful Sound Lounge in Morden was one of only 16 live music venues that opened last night.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just 38 people in there. It's great that the band played (no doubt for free) but it's not viable for venues, crew or musicians right now.



> The whole venue perfectly laid out with hand sanitizer everywhere.  Everything marked out, and tables spaced out perfectly.  There were 13 different tables with around 38 customers in the room which is about about a quarter of their capacity of 250.


----------



## Supine (Aug 17, 2020)

Hi, bit of advice please. Is it legal to hire a huge house and have 30 people for a socially distanced party? Venue sleeps 77 so I'd be keeping the place with lots of extra space for safety. Part of me really wants to do this but I don't want to get into trouble or put people at risk.

It is well ventilated, lots of space, lots of outdoors. Etc etc. Dancefloor would be masked only. Not sure what the rules are these days. Anyone got thoughts? Venue owner is up for it.


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 18, 2020)

Supine said:


> Hi, bit of advice please. Is it legal to hire a huge house and have 30 people for a socially distanced party? Venue sleeps 77 so I'd be keeping the place with lots of extra space for safety. Part of me really wants to do this but I don't want to get into trouble or put people at risk.
> 
> It is well ventilated, lots of space, lots of outdoors. Etc etc. Dancefloor would be masked only. Not sure what the rules are these days. Anyone got thoughts? Venue owner is up for it.



The official guidance is that you shouldn't do it:  Coronavirus outbreak FAQs: what you can and can't do

This being said it does go on to say gatherings over 30 people are specifically banned which would imply the previous stuff is guidance rather than specific law.  Its almost certainly against the law if you're planning to do it in an area which has local restrictions and the guidance will likely still differ country to country.

My take is its not advisable but not specifically banned.  I think you'd really want to make sure you knew the attendees and that they were people you trust. If the party was to get a bit out of hand and / or responsible for a small outbreak you'd attract the attention of local press pretty quickly.


----------



## belboid (Aug 18, 2020)

Supine said:


> Hi, bit of advice please. Is it legal to hire a huge house and have 30 people for a socially distanced party? Venue sleeps 77 so I'd be keeping the place with lots of extra space for safety. Part of me really wants to do this but I don't want to get into trouble or put people at risk.
> 
> It is well ventilated, lots of space, lots of outdoors. Etc etc. Dancefloor would be masked only. Not sure what the rules are these days. Anyone got thoughts? Venue owner is up for it.


Yha are renting their places out on a similar basis.  Meant to be for a max of three households, but I don’t really see anyone enforcing that.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 18, 2020)

Supine said:


> Hi, bit of advice please. Is it legal to hire a huge house and have 30 people for a socially distanced party? Venue sleeps 77 so I'd be keeping the place with lots of extra space for safety. Part of me really wants to do this but I don't want to get into trouble or put people at risk.
> 
> It is well ventilated, lots of space, lots of outdoors. Etc etc. Dancefloor would be masked only. Not sure what the rules are these days. Anyone got thoughts? Venue owner is up for it.


Just don’t.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 18, 2020)

News on the grapevine this morning of another large events company gone into liquidation


----------



## ska invita (Aug 18, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> News on the grapevine this morning of another large events company gone into liquidation


can you name please?


----------



## spitfire (Aug 18, 2020)

Matt Snowball have gone under apparently. Friend posted this on FB.

Used them a few times, good guys.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 18, 2020)

editor said:


> Just 38 people in there. It's great that the band played (no doubt for free) but it's not viable for venues, crew or musicians right now.


The Cavendish arms is applying for funding to do tiny attendance streamed gigs as they have invested in equipment to stream their comedy nights and have done so without audience for a while now.
It is not going to be the same though.


spitfire said:


> Matt Snowball have gone under apparently. Friend posted this on FB.
> 
> Used them a few times, good guys.
> 
> View attachment 227041


have they definitely closed or have they just decided to move their storage to a cheaper place until things get better?


----------



## spitfire (Aug 18, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> The Cavendish arms is applying for funding to do tiny attendance streamed gigs as they have invested in equipment to stream their comedy nights and have done so without audience for a while now.
> It is not going to be the same though.
> 
> have they definitely closed or have they just decided to move their storage to a cheaper place until things get better?



My friend says they've gone under, he's a backline tech and there doesn't seem to be anyone disagreeing with him on the post. Its been up for most of the day now so I would have expected a correction if he was wrong.


----------



## pesh (Aug 18, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> News on the grapevine this morning of another large events company gone into liquidation


Blitz? they went down yesterday, or at least the announcments came out yesterday.


----------



## pesh (Aug 18, 2020)

spitfire said:


> Matt Snowball have gone under apparently. Friend posted this on FB.
> 
> Used them a few times, good guys.
> 
> View attachment 227041


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 18, 2020)

Fair enough, just trying to keep my hopes up for the industry (re matt snowball).
I spent most of June and July dismantling DIY Space for london as the landlord decided not to renew our lease because of the virus. He actually did us a favour as if we were still paying rent with no income the government grant would be pretty much gone by now coming straight on the heels of a tense financial period. Now we can regroup and wait for things to improve to start afresh.


----------



## spitfire (Aug 18, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Fair enough, just trying to keep my hopes up for the industry (re matt snowball).
> I spent most of June and July dismantling DIY Space for london as the landlord decided not to renew our lease because of the virus. He actually did us a favour as if we were still paying rent with no income the government grant would be pretty much gone by now coming straight on the heels of a tense financial period. Now we can regroup and wait for things to improve to start afresh.



Their website is still up so its always a possibility.

I'll keep an eye and if he's wrong I'll be sure to post here.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 18, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Fair enough, just trying to keep my hopes up for the industry (re matt snowball).
> I spent most of June and July dismantling DIY Space for london as the landlord decided not to renew our lease because of the virus. He actually did us a favour as if we were still paying rent with no income the government grant would be pretty much gone by now coming straight on the heels of a tense financial period. Now we can regroup and wait for things to improve to start afresh.


Didn't know about DIY Space


----------



## klang (Aug 18, 2020)

me neither. that's a real shame!


----------



## Badgers (Aug 18, 2020)

pesh said:


> Blitz? they went down yesterday, or at least the announcments came out yesterday.


GES own/owned Blitz


----------



## pesh (Aug 18, 2020)

Badgers said:


> GES own/owned Blitz


yep, not profitable? see ya...


----------



## Johnny Doe (Aug 18, 2020)




----------



## DaveCinzano (Aug 19, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Events in October and some in November at ExCel cancelling
> 
> #worldbeating


DSEi already advertising the Twin Towers Twentieth Anniversary blood pageant though









						Welcome
					

DSEI connects governments, national armed forces, industry thought leaders and the entire defence & security supply chain on a global scale.  With a range of valuable opportunities for networking, a platform for business, access to relevant content & live-action demonstrations, the DSEI...




					www.dsei.co.uk


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 19, 2020)

Considering an outdoor gig in Camden on Saturday.

Then there is a  wanker do the following week where they are advertising social distancing but knowing the venue I can't see it being possible (unless there has been work done on it). ETA: Just found out it's happening outside rather than in the venue I thought of, so will probably pop around and see.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 19, 2020)

Harry Smiles said:


> View attachment 227048












						Spain, Italy shut clubs and venues again as COVID-19 cases rise
					

Health ministers from both countries issued the ruling last week.




					www.residentadvisor.net


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 19, 2020)

Organisers apologise after 'absolute scenes' at 'Covid-secure' event
					

Organisers had said guidance given by the Government would be followed but footage was shared online showing that was not the case




					www.hulldailymail.co.uk
				




Slow handclap for everyone involved here


----------



## editor (Aug 19, 2020)

This is going to hurt NYC musicians








						New NY state rule bans ticketed music events at bars: ‘This is devastating'
					

Live music must be 'incidental,' state says, 'not the draw'




					www.syracuse.com


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Aug 20, 2020)

Harry Smiles said:


> View attachment 227048



Only ever heard Dave Clarke mix once, early 90’s on Kiss FM, he sent in a mix and every minute or so he sampled “Dave Clarke” over the music. Have come across him through the years and he’s sound.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 20, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Only ever heard Dave Clarke mix once, early 90’s on Kiss FM, he sent in a mix and every minute or so he sampled “Dave Clarke” over the music. Have come across him through the years and he’s sound.


I can hear it now

"DAVE CLARKE"





















"DAVE CLARKE


----------



## Badgers (Aug 20, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Only ever heard Dave Clarke mix once, early 90’s on Kiss FM, he sent in a mix and every minute or so he sampled “Dave Clarke” over the music. Have come across him through the years and he’s sound.


Loved Dave Clarke in my early techno years. Got to see him live half a dozen or so times and he was excellent. Still have some of the Red series vinyl.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 20, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Loved Dave Clarke in my early techno years. Got to see him live half a dozen or so times and he was excellent. Still have some of the Red series vinyl.











DAVE CLARKE


----------



## platinumsage (Aug 20, 2020)

Was that him I thought it was the broadcasters!


----------



## ska invita (Aug 21, 2020)

did anyone see that article yesterday that predicted 750,000 jobs will be lost in the wider music business? i cant find it now (was in the guardian)

2 million job losses predicted - planned for - by government and bank of england - over a third of those then to come from events world

this is all avoidable


----------



## ska invita (Aug 21, 2020)

ska invita said:


> did anyone see that article yesterday that predicted 750,000 jobs will be lost in the wider music business? i cant find it now (was in the guardian)
> 
> 2 million job losses predicted - planned for - by government and bank of england - over a third of those then to come from events world
> 
> this is all avoidable


i got that slightly wrong 750k jobs in the "Nighttime economy"








						UK nightlife industry facing 'financial armageddon'
					

Night Time Industries Association warned 754,000 jobs at risk because of the Covid-19




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## William of Walworth (Aug 21, 2020)

ska invita said:


> did anyone see that article yesterday that predicted 750,000 jobs will be lost in the wider music business? i cant find it now (was in the guardian)



Been struggling just now (on the Guardian site) to find that story, but will keep looking, and will post it up later if I find it.

ETA : OK, you found it quicker than I managed! 
Good on you, but it's really depressing


----------



## krink (Aug 22, 2020)

Not really been keeping tabs but when did indoor gigs get the nod again? Passed two live pub gigs in town tonight on me shopping walk.


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 22, 2020)

ska invita said:


> I can hear it now
> 
> "DAVE CLARKE"
> 
> ...


<John Peel>The Baron Of Techno


----------



## ddraig (Aug 22, 2020)

In Germany
3 events held in 1 day, different set ups



> The concert study, called Restart-19, was created "to investigate the conditions under which such events can be carried out despite the pandemic", researchers said.
> 
> The first of Saturday's three concerts aimed to simulate an event before the pandemic, with no safety measures in place. The second involved greater hygiene and some social distancing, while the third involved half the numbers and each person standing 1.5m apart.











						Coronavirus: Germany puts on crowded concerts to study risks
					

Scientists are using Saturday's three concerts to explore ways of holding mass indoor events safely.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 22, 2020)

krink said:


> Not really been keeping tabs but when did indoor gigs get the nod again? Passed two live pub gigs in town tonight on me shopping walk.


a couple of weeks ago IIRC, within guidelines and very low attendance I think.


----------



## William of Walworth (Aug 22, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> a couple of weeks ago IIRC, within guidelines and *very low attendance I think*.



Maximum of 500, is my understanding.

As in this following case I believe 

I posted earlier up about this event, but we've bought tickets to be off to the grounds of Glastonbury Abbey next Friday -- huge outdoor space in the grounds of what was once the richest Abbey in England, with a promise of careful control on spacing/distancing, etc. 

Oh yeah , and a few festival-friendly live bands -- the first time for us to see live music *at all* since February


----------



## krink (Aug 23, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Maximum of 500, is my understanding.



These were just pubs so the numbers would be nowhere near 500 but what did concern me was one of the gigs was in a tiny, tight little pub where there's no room to swing a cat on a normal day never mind when half the bar is taken up by the band.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 23, 2020)

krink said:


> These were just pubs so the numbers would be nowhere near 500 but what did concern me was one of the gigs was in a tiny, tight little pub where there's no room to swing a cat on a normal day never mind when half the bar is taken up by the band.


I think indoors might have a lower capacity, my google-fu didn't bring any official advice. I had heard/read about a 25% of capacity sometimes back.

Went to the outdoor camden one yesterday and it was nice to see a live band. 
Not that much social distancing from the people at the front but I stayed on the other side of the road to watch and kept the greetings and socialising to a minimum after they had finished.


----------



## Ground Elder (Aug 25, 2020)

The Drinks Trust are offering one off £250 grants to people who have lost festival work this summer. Haven't read the details, so not sure who is eligible, but hope it may help some here 






						Festival & Events Fund — THE DRINKS TRUST
					






					www.drinkstrust.org.uk


----------



## sojourner (Aug 26, 2020)

Nice one Ground Elder , have put it on my FB.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 1, 2020)

Emily is sounding positive in her latest about Glastonbury's prospects of happening in 2021



			
				Guardian headline said:
			
		

> *Glastonbury festival aiming to return in June, says Emily Eavis*
> *Co-organiser says she hopes event, cancelled this year due to Covid, will not be pushed back to autumn*


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2020)

Hyde Park Winter Wonderland cancelled for 2020 

Not a huge surprise (or one I care for) but a very big event  

This is concerning as they are an event with the depth of staff and budgets beyond most  


> The team looked at reducing the event’s capacity, introducing a digital queuing system and changing the whole way it does ticketing, but it feared the experience would be compromised for visitors. It also had concerns over how it would bring in its authentic European market stalls given current travel restrictions in the UK.











						Winter Wonderland confirms it won’t take place in 2020
					

Hyde Park’s Winter Wonderland Christmas fair has been cancelled in 2020 over safety concerns.



					www.timeout.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 2, 2020)

Yet Birmingham city council have recently announced that the annual German Xmas market will be going ahead


----------



## mx wcfc (Sep 2, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Yet Birmingham city council have recently announced that the annual German Xmas market will be going ahead


So have Winchester Cathedral.  They are just spreading it out a bit.  Locals are unhappy.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 2, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> So have Winchester Cathedral.  They are just spreading it out a bit.  Locals are unhappy.


The overwhelming reaction on FB was along the lines of “oh for fucks sake”. B’ham is on the brink of local lockdowns as it is


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Yet Birmingham city council have recently announced that the annual German Xmas market will be going ahead


Slightly easier to maintain cleaning and distancing (not that people will) there than at the Hyde Park Wintervalfest though.

I have the first big exhibition in March and am setting up an IKEA type one way system round the show
Also have got an app sorted for ticketing, booking talks/seminars and such round the exhibition
There will two sessions (09:00-14:00 then 15:00-20:00) on Friday/Saturday and usual hours (10:00-17:00) on Sunday when it is usually quieter
Am going to have bags made up with mask and hand sanitiser for all visitors
Sanitiser on all stands, features and catering points
Extra security lined up just in case of cunts

All sensible but all expensive!
Am going to try and get some sort of 'Covid Sponsor' but I doubt there are many feeling like splashing cash atm 

Do have the advantage of working with ExCel.
Whilst it is a corporate hellhole they are the best positioned to deal with the issues and deep pockets to fix things.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 2, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Slightly easier to maintain cleaning and distancing (not that people will) there than at the Hyde Park Wintervalfest though.


Errrrr, have you been? It’s a chaotic mass of people at the best of times, I can’t see any way they’ll be able to impose any sort of distancing at all.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Errrrr, have you been? It’s a chaotic mass of people at the best of times, I can’t see any way they’ll be able to impose any sort of distancing at all.


Nope, not been. It is not cheap or easy but it is doable with the right layout, capacity measures and staffing. I know it is tricky but either do it or don't.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 2, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Do have the advantage of working with ExCel.
> Whilst it is a corporate hellhole they are the best positioned to deal with the issues and deep pockets to fix things.




Massive on-site Covid hospital too


----------



## mx wcfc (Sep 2, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Errrrr, have you been? It’s a chaotic mass of people at the best of times, I can’t see any way they’ll be able to impose any sort of distancing at all.


Same thing at Winchester.  They have cancelled the ice skating rink, and want to spread stalls out around the cathedral grounds, but there is no way social distancing can be maintained.  

Bath and others have cancelled too.  Winchester is run by the Cathedral, rather than the local council, so needless to say, money comes first.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Massive on-site Covid hospital too


That is the government line  

There is a 10k sqm space that is on hold and storing all the unused and massively overpriced medical equipment that was never used. Probably about 5% of the venue space.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 2, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Same thing at Winchester.  They have cancelled the ice skating rink, and want to spread stalls out around the cathedral grounds, but there is no way social distancing can be maintained.
> 
> Bath and others have cancelled too.  Winchester is run by the Cathedral, rather than the local council, so needless to say, money comes first.




Jeebus was well in to markets and shit taking place in temples. Have they set up a branch of Wonga near the font too?


----------



## BigTom (Sep 2, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Nope, not been. It is not cheap or easy but it is doable with the right layout, capacity measures and staffing. I know it is tricky but either do it or don't.



Nah. The german market runs down the middle of new street, a pedestrianised street. The only way you could do it would be by making each side of the market one way and having strict controls for every side street that joins it and even then I just can't see it working or being accepted by all the shops on new street. 
It's not like the market is in a square or somewhere where it's the only thing going on, it's slap bang in the middle of a normally busy anyway city centre and takes up at least half the street.
the bit that's in victoria sqaure you could halve the number of stands and make something work but the rest of it, not a chance.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Nah. The german market runs down the middle of new street, a pedestrianised street. The only way you could do it would be by making each side of the market one way and having strict controls for every side street that joins it and even then I just can't see it working or being accepted by all the shops on new street.
> It's not like the market is in a square or somewhere where it's the only thing going on, it's slap bang in the middle of a normally busy anyway city centre and takes up at least half the street.
> the bit that's in victoria sqaure you could halve the number of stands and make something work but the rest of it, not a chance.


So it is a fools errand and should not be on


----------



## BigTom (Sep 2, 2020)

On a slight tangent I'd guess we are going to be in for a slew of those scam winter wonderland type places this year since most (if not all) of the council / professionally run ones won't happen because of the practical and financial impossibilities of social distancing.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2020)

BigTom said:


> On a slight tangent I'd guess we are going to be in for a slew of those scam winter wonderland type places this year since most (if not all) of the council / professionally run ones won't happen because of the practical and financial impossibilities of social distancing.


Lapland?


----------



## mx wcfc (Sep 2, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Jeebus was well in to markets and shit taking place in temples. Have they set up a branch of Wonga near the font too?


No, but you might need a loan to pay the entry fees these days!


----------



## BigTom (Sep 2, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Lapland?



Sounds right, can't remember if that was the one that started the thread on here that gets bumped annually as somewhere or another has some shitty christmas attraction that scams people into attending with false promises of what they'll get.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 11, 2020)

Fielding Trucking has folded. I know most on here won’t know them, but they were one of the major specialist entertainment industry transport companies.

The supply chain for the entire events industry is on a cliff edge.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 11, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Fielding Trucking has folded. I know most on here won’t know them, but they were one of the major specialist entertainment industry transport companies.
> 
> The supply chain for the entire events industry is on a c edge.



This is what this dithering mass of shite that passes for a government is failing to understand, viable businesses that are forced to stop trading will be viable once they are allowed to trade again, in the meantime they need support or else once this shit is over they and the skills they offer will be lost. Targeted furlough, they will probably announce it at the end of October, once >1m have been laid off...


----------



## Mogden (Sep 11, 2020)

Having spoken to a part time musician this week who is friends with musicians for whom it is a full time job and who tour extensively, quite a number of them have expressed that if they never toured again, they'd be okay with that, some even saying they actually never want to do another live show. I think time away from touring has given some of the more mature performers reason to question that aspect of their career. Being on the road umpteen days a year and waking up not knowing what city you're in must be a full on headfuck but a treadmill you can't get off usually. It's an interesting discussion.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 11, 2020)

Mogden said:


> Having spoken to a part time musician this week who is friends with musicians for whom it is a full time job and who tour extensively, quite a number of them have expressed that if they never toured again, they'd be okay with that, some even saying they actually never want to do another live show. I think time away from touring has given some of the more mature performers reason to question that aspect of their career. Being on the road umpteen days a year and waking up not knowing what city you're in must be a full on headfuck but a treadmill you can't get off usually. It's an interesting discussion.


I know of at least 3 long time engineers that have moved into new employment and are unlikely to come back. They’ve had long (15-20 years) careers touring and have discovered the joys of eating meals with their children and actually waking up next to their wives. I’d put money on this becoming more and more widespread the longer this goes on.

Wish for all the festivals and gigs you want next summer, at this rate they’re going to be fucking quiet.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 11, 2020)

Mogden said:


> Having spoken to a part time musician this week who is friends with musicians for whom it is a full time job and who tour extensively, quite a number of them have expressed that if they never toured again, they'd be okay with that, some even saying they actually never want to do another live show. I think time away from touring has given some of the more mature performers reason to question that aspect of their career. Being on the road umpteen days a year and waking up not knowing what city you're in must be a full on headfuck but a treadmill you can't get off usually. It's an interesting discussion.



Sounds similar to those happy to work from home. Presumably your guys can make do comfortably with the income from Spotify or whatever, up-coming bands need to tour.


----------



## Mogden (Sep 11, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Sounds similar to those happy to work from home. Presumably your guys can make do comfortably with the income from Spotify or whatever, up-coming bands need to tour.


Yes the majority seems to be putting out albums and dedicated fans will snap them up. Very different for up and comers like you say. Having said that, will a younger audience be more inclined to pay for a regular ticket for access to an online gig and host their own parties for it as they're more tech hungry?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 11, 2020)

Mogden said:


> Having said that, will a younger audience be more inclined to pay for a regular ticket for access to an online gig and host their own parties for it as they're more tech hungry?



According to my 16 year old; no, will rip it for free somewhere.


----------



## Mogden (Sep 11, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> According to my 16 year old; no, will rip it for free somewhere.


Hmmm so what would incentivise younger music fans to pay up to watch? A combo gig ticket and limited edition t-shirt? Pre gig Zoom party calls with the artist?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 11, 2020)

Mogden said:


> Hmmm so what would incentivise younger music fans to pay up to watch? A combo gig ticket and limited edition t-shirt? Pre gig Zoom party calls with the artist?



Dunno, she likes live music and is will to pay to see it, but she pays for jack on the internet, just nicks it all. She can also screen print so I guess she could rip off any t shirts too..?


----------



## Mogden (Sep 11, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Dunno, she likes live music and is will to pay to see it, but she pays for jack on the internet, just nicks it all. She can also screen print so I guess she could rip off any t shirts too..?


Someone, somewhere will always buck the business plan I guess. It's just finding the new way to approach the whole entertainment industry to maximise profit and provide something worth paying for! I don't think it can die completely.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Sep 12, 2020)

Some of my musician friends/family are okay with the changes and working to be ready for whatever the music scene looks like in the future. Established artists are already releasing new LPs, some to decent sales (although I suspect some of that is fans diligently propping up their favourite independent artist).

The backline is fucked. My friends who work in promotion, rigging, sound, crewing etc are at their wits end. They’ve spent their whole working life in the industry, only a few of them are going to be able to re-skill, some are too old or broke to do that. Those with transferrable skills are facing a saturated market elsewhere.

Hacks and writers that had a reputation and a place to publish are alright, mostly.

The people at the very top will find some way to make it work, not least because they’ll be putting out product to consumers who aren’t especially interested in deep rockanroll culture/experience, so that’s going to be online stuff, drive in stuff etc. Not for me, but it’s part of the music industry and I’m glad it fighting back.

Bedroom estate bedsit music will be alright, it will just keep doing what it’s been doing, racking up the views on YouTube and pushing into the future. There will be block parties, guerrilla raves, clandestine shit going on at AirBnB rentals. I’m curious and watching all that.

Festivals are fucked. They’re going to have to reinvent themselves. And all the bands that truck around the small and mid-level festival circuit are also fucked. I’m as flummoxed as anyone else on this, and I’ve not heard any viable way to make them work. All the suggestions I’ve heard and talked about with others crumble up and blow away as soon as you look at them. Illegal raves and free festivals seems to be the only response here.... Or secret private celebration gatherings.

Scenes like that surrounding The Windmill in recent years are also fucked. Small intense live gigs, month long residencies at mobile club nights, bands that cross pollinate ideas, that live and tour together, set up club events and record in each  other’s bedrooms, that’s all fucked. Some of them are making music and some are trying to develop and expand their creative endeavours (some are writing prose now, some are painting) . The smaller venues that put on these bands are all fucked (there was a huge successful fundraiser for The WIndmill but the landlord swallowed the entirety of what was raised, leaving nothing for the venue). And this is the spawning ground for new talent. These small local independent venues and the scene that springs up around them is where new ideas and new talent springs up, learns how to play, how to tour, how to record, write, play, make. Gigs aren’t just about the music, they're about the culture. I’m so sad and worried about the impact the pandemic will have on all that.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Festivals are fucked.



I unhappily tend to agree with that general point , but with this big caveat :

Faint _outside-chances_ of a safe and reliable vaccine at some point excepted


----------



## 8ball (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I unhappily tend to agree with that general point , but with this big caveat :
> 
> Faint _outside-chances_ of a safe and reliable vaccine at some point excepted



We might get a safe and reliable one that still does not offer more than 40% protection, meaning with the nature of the virus, 100% vaccination rates might still not "make it go away" without significant other measures staying in place for quite a long time.


----------



## 8ball (Sep 14, 2020)

Mogden said:


> Someone, somewhere will always buck the business plan I guess. It's just finding the new way to approach the whole entertainment industry to maximise profit and provide something worth paying for! I don't think it can die completely.



I think it's likely to be pretty much on hold for some time, unfortunately.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I unhappily tend to agree with that general point , but with this big caveat :
> 
> Faint _outside-chances_ of a safe and reliable vaccine at some point excepted





Bless you for your optimism William.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Bless you for your optimism William.



Thanks a lot , but I fear that it's *over-*optimism on my part really 

I do try my best to be realistic too though, so I honestly hope that doing that optimism thing, but as a workable mix with the 'with realism' control, helps people not feel too down about 'all this'


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

8ball said:


> We might get a safe and reliable one that still does not offer more than 40% protection, meaning with the nature of the virus, *100% vaccination rates might still not "make it go away" without significant other measures staying in place for quite a long time.*



I fully agree, and that's a very fair point! 

But!  I also reckon that most people hoping to get to a few more gigs or fests _at some point_, aren't too down about significant other measures.

The more the better of those, I'd personally say, if there's any chance at all that extra measures (on top of a vaccine) would help events happen.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

We were hanging out in Glastonbury town the weekend just over, and most we were chatting with -- largely friends of ours now, or general pub-folks who work as onsite crew at Pilton in whatever local capacity --were *HIGHLY* pessimistic about Glasto 2021 happening next June  

Mind you though , one or two of the pessimists tended to be less  than me about vaccines both in prediction, theory, and practice .....  ... the words 'wrong' and 'mad' and 'lunacy' about anti-vaccination 'theories' were _very_ tempting to use .......  

*BUT!!*

With the aid of cider and the odd toke, surprisingly , I successfully avoided/evaded too many arguments there -- it's G-Town for fucks sake 

And they anyway seemed to lack access to Urban anti-conspiranoia threads


----------



## 8ball (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I fully agree, and that's a very fair point!
> 
> But!  I also reckon that most people hoping to get to a few more gigs or fests _at some point_, aren't too down about significant other measures.
> 
> The more the better of those, I'd personally say, if there's any chance at all that extra measures (on top of a vaccine) would help events happen.



I can’t see any degree of social distancing being viable for festivals in anything like theit current form, unfortunately.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Thanks a lot , but I fear that it's *over-*optimism on my part really
> 
> I do try my best to be realistic too though, so I honestly hope that doing that optimism thing, but as a workable mix with the 'with realism' control, helps people not feel too down about 'all this'




It's all over William.

What are the stations of grief`?

I'm working on acceptance.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

SheilaNaGig : Do you not think a safe and reliable vaccine would make _any difference at all_ to possibilities of future festivals, then?

I sense that you're on the extreme end of pessimism here? 

At least I'm genuinely _attempting_ to temper my (natural) optimim with some realism too.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 14, 2020)

I would guess the timeframe is a bit on the short side for a safe and reliable vaccine for the next festival season unfortunately.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> SheilaNaGig : Do you not think a safe and reliable vaccine would make _any difference at all_ to possibilities of future festivals, then?
> 
> I sense that you're on the extreme end of pessimism here?
> 
> At least I'm genuinely _attempting_ to temper my (natural) optimim with some realism too.


I think we’re a way off a vaccine yet. And when/if one finally comes along the logistics of getting it out there are not trivial. It’s going to take time. Lots of time. It will also require competency and extensive international co-operation from government, which you may have noticed is in rather short supply these days.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 14, 2020)

Basically, I think there will some events next year. Some may call themselves festivals. But they won’t be what you or I know and enjoy as festivals.


----------



## editor (Sep 14, 2020)

Larmer Tree Festival 2021 is cancelled









						Larmer Tree Festival 2021 won't be going ahead, organisers confirm
					

Next year's Larmer Tree festival has been cancelled due to the uncertainty of the coronavirus pandemic, organisers have said.




					www.salisburyjournal.co.uk


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 14, 2020)

More will follow I’m afraid. People just can’t risk the huge sums of money involved with so much uncertainty.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> SheilaNaGig : Do you not think a safe and reliable vaccine would make _any difference at all_ to possibilities of future festivals, then?
> 
> I sense that you're on the extreme end of pessimism here?
> 
> At least I'm genuinely _attempting_ to temper my (natural) optimim with some realism too.



I think a safe and reliable vaccine could make a certain difference, but the logistics for that are very problematic as others have said.

But I remain sceptical about whether or not a viable vaccine is even possible, even before we get to safe and effective.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Basically, I think there will some events next year. Some may call themselves festivals. But they won’t be what you or I know and enjoy as festivals.



Smaller ones could be _somewhat_ more likely for (later?) summer 2021, was my thinking.

The chat about logistics and safety measures can wait until New Year!


----------



## killer b (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Smaller ones could be _somewhat_ more likely for (later?) summer


Is there an echo in here?


----------



## Badgers (Sep 14, 2020)

Smaller ones are a mebbe?


----------



## 8115 (Sep 14, 2020)

Knitting and Stitching Show in October has been cancelled.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I think a safe and reliable vaccine could make a certain difference, but the logistics for that are very problematic as others have said.
> 
> But I remain sceptical about whether or not a viable vaccine is even possible, even before we get to safe and effective.



I'm on a four-pint bet with my (Glastonbury-working -- John Peel Stage) friend that there will/will not be a vaccine. 

We agreed on "By Easter Sunday or Monday 2021" for the payout, one way or t'other! 

I say yes, he says no, and the odds are admittedly very good for him in terms of the deadline, but also, he *really* wants to lose the bet.

For now, I'd say it's not impossible  that he will lose it ...... I go no further

I completely accept anyway that there are all sorts of other organisational/logistical/new safety rule problems and obstacles .

But also, and this is in Glastonbury's favour, there are no more experienced/knowledgeable people in Festivalworld than the Eavises and all their longstanding area-leaders and co-organisers


----------



## Badgers (Sep 14, 2020)

8115 said:


> Knitting and Stitching Show in October has been cancelled.


Been to that one a few times. Felt like cattle the way the old ladies were leering at me and brushing against me


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

killer b said:


> Is there an echo in here?



No --everyone disagrees with me 

That doesn't definitely mean I'm (completely) wrong though. Does it?


----------



## mx wcfc (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Smaller ones could be _somewhat_ more likely for (later?) summer 2021, was my thinking.
> 
> The chat about logistics and safety measures can wait until New Year!


That's my thinking, small DIY  festies like Something Else (late September), and Blyth Power Ashes (August Bank Holiday) could still be on, subject to an innoculation being available.

Please, allow me hope.


----------



## 8115 (Sep 14, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Been to that one a few times. Felt like cattle the way the old ladies were leering at me and brushing against me


I really hope you're joking but I feel like you're kind of not.


----------



## killer b (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> No --everyone disagrees with me
> 
> That doesn't definitely mean I'm (completely) wrong though. Does it?


You've been repeating the same post on this thread - but with the date moved back a few months each time - for 6 months now. 

So has everyone else tbf.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 14, 2020)

8115 said:


> I really hope you're joking but I feel like you're kind of not.


Nope. Am not


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

killer b said:


> You've been repeating the same post on this thread - but with the date moved back a few months each time - for 6 months now.
> 
> So has everyone else tbf.



I've been  *completely* wrong in my time-predictions so far, I have to admit that 

But as mx wcfc said, all we can do is try to retain _some_ hope -- and eventually (?), there *will* be a vaccine, which will at least help..


----------



## 8115 (Sep 14, 2020)

Actually I'm not that sad about the Knitting and Stitching Show, I've only been once but it was really busy and felt quite money-orientated. I was thinking about going again to try and do a couple of workshops but it's a long way and like I said it's really busy.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I'm on a four-pint bet with my (Glastonbury-working -- John Peel Stage) friend that there will/will not be a vaccine.
> 
> We agreed on "By Easter Sunday or Monday 2021" for the payout, one way or t'other!
> 
> ...


I don’t want to break this to you William, but the size of Glastonbury is not going to help it. Quite the opposite.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 14, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> ... eventually (?), there *will* be a vaccine, which will at least help..


unfortunately for us all this sounds about correct


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 14, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I don’t want to break this to you William, but the size of Glastonbury is not going to help it. Quite the opposite.



Very fair point. No-one has said anything yet about reducing the numbers, and they should ....

But! The main problem atm, if they do want/need to reduce numbers, is that almost everyone who"succeeded" in getting a ticket last October has hung on to it -- I found out somewhere that the numbers getting refunds were miniscule.

So yes, you do raise a *proper* problem that (being crew  ) I hadn't thought much about up until now


----------



## Badgers (Sep 15, 2020)

The World Travel Market 09-11th November at ExCel (one of the biggest exhibitions in the UK) has just moved 'online' 

Not a huge surprise given they usually get 50k+ visitors from all over the world. Still a massive hole in the UK events revenue though. 



> After 40 years of you coming to us, WTM London 2020 is coming to you! We are facilitating a *completely virtual event which is taking place on 9-11 November*. The main aim is to help recover and rebuild and shape the travel industry at a time when it needs it the most. The virtual event will focus on restoring and developing business connections, growing your network, your brand and learning how to make your comeback.
> 
> The virtual event will take place *across three days, from 7am-10pm*, to allow access from the different zones across the globe. The live conference sessions and forums will be tackling some of the issues the industry is facing today, as well as speed networking sessions, one-to-one meetings, and virtual networking opportunities. We want to keep the global travel conversation alive and help deliver new connections as well as offering a wide range of online business opportunities.
> 
> We will address the impact the global health pandemic has had on the travel and tourism industry and discuss a road map to recovery, identifying the trends and innovation shaping the future of the industry and show you the path that lies ahead.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 22, 2020)

That is the industry pretty much fucked then


----------



## editor (Sep 22, 2020)

It's not like the arts created much wealth for Britain anyway. Oh wait....



> A survey of 2,000 members of the Musicians’ Union found that 34% “are considering abandoning the industry completely”, because of the financial difficulties they face during the pandemic, as performance opportunities are severely curtailed.
> 
> 
> Almost half have already found work outside their industry, and 70% are unable to do more than a quarter of their usual work. Eighty-seven per cent of musicians covered by furlough and self-employment support schemes say they will face financial hardship when the schemes are due to end in October.
> ...












						Third of British musicians may quit industry amid pandemic
					

Musicians’ Union, whose survey also finds one-third of professional musicians can’t access emergency support, criticises DCMS and Treasury over ‘lack of understanding’




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 22, 2020)

Fuck em, bunch of remoaners


----------



## Badgers (Sep 22, 2020)

If the made up schedule of six months is dragged out then we will have three months or Brexit fallout along with a half arsed lockdown.


----------



## editor (Sep 24, 2020)

Ministry of Sound bloke:


----------



## Badgers (Sep 24, 2020)

The World Economic Forum has been cancelled.


----------



## TopCat (Sep 24, 2020)

editor said:


> Ministry of Sound bloke:
> 
> View attachment 231623


He makes some genuine points but these are much negated by the venue he represents.


----------



## editor (Sep 24, 2020)

TopCat said:


> He makes some genuine points but these are much negated by the venue he represents.


Yep. But it's still ordinary workers at the sharp end. Pubs are also having to lay off loads of staff now because of the 10pm rule...


----------



## Badgers (Sep 24, 2020)

editor said:


> Pubs are also having to lay off loads of staff now because of the 10pm rule...


The 10pm rule is hurting but there is more impact on pubs in regional lockdown areas. 
Great to pay staff two thirds of their salary but if your business is closed then you are paying a third for nothing.


----------



## editor (Sep 24, 2020)

Badgers said:


> The 10pm rule is hurting but there is more impact on pubs in regional lockdown areas.
> Great to pay staff two thirds of their salary but if your business is closed then you are paying a third for nothing.


In Wales they've made it so that they stop serving at 10pm - so if a restaurant/gastropub is trying to get two sittings in one night, it means that they wont have to throw the 9pm eaters into the street before they've finished. That seems more sensible.


----------



## editor (Sep 24, 2020)

Badgers said:


> The 10pm rule is hurting but there is more impact on pubs in regional lockdown areas.
> Great to pay staff two thirds of their salary but if your business is closed then you are paying a third for nothing.


I'm not sure how it's any different. One pub near me has just had to lay off 50% of their staff. No furlough, no staff payments, nowt.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 24, 2020)

editor said:


> I'm not sure how it's any different. One pub near me has just had to lay off 50% of their staff. No furlough, no staff payments, nowt.


Guessing those staff were on zero hours contracts then?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 24, 2020)

So, with his words of “viable” jobs today the chancellor has shown that either he/they still don’t understand the industry or - more likely - that they just don’t give a shit.


----------



## editor (Sep 24, 2020)

Interesting. But a bit odd. 



> On Tuesday (22 September), a new wave of pandemic restrictions was announced in the UK, including the introduction of a 10pm (GMT) curfew. Now, it’s been announced that music venues have permission to stay open past the curfew.
> 
> A government Department for Digital, Culture, Media & Sport spokesperson told _NME_ that “dedicated music venues may conclude after the 10pm curfew as long as a performance starts before 10pm, however outlets, including bars, must be closed by this point.”
> 
> ...












						Music Venue Trust
					

Music Venue Trust is a UK registered charity which acts to protect, secure and improve Grassroots Music Venues.




					musicvenuetrust.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 24, 2020)

editor said:


> Interesting. But a bit odd.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What gigs? There aren’t any


----------



## ddraig (Sep 24, 2020)

Weird!


----------



## killer b (Sep 24, 2020)

There's gigs going on in Preston - all local bands cause there's... limited funds for artist fees, but they're happening. 

A local drum & bass crew are doing 'table raves' too, which I'm a little wary of...


----------



## editor (Sep 24, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> What gigs? There aren’t any


There are some socially distanced gigs going on here and there, like at the Windmill in Brixton.  But none for me


----------



## Mogden (Sep 24, 2020)

We've got a few local bands playing local pubs here in Derby. Even though they're venues I usually frequented pre-covid, I'm not bothering at the moment.


----------



## Mation (Sep 26, 2020)

killer b said:


> There's gigs going on in Preston - all local bands cause there's... limited funds for artist fees, but they're happening.
> 
> A local drum & bass crew are doing 'table raves' too, which I'm a little wary of...


What's a table rave?


----------



## pesh (Sep 26, 2020)

Like a pub quiz that's been hijacked by a free party crew.


----------



## killer b (Sep 26, 2020)

Mation said:


> What's a table rave?


A rave where everyone has to sit down i guess.


----------



## ska invita (Sep 26, 2020)

killer b said:


> A rave where everyone has to sit down i guess.


And the music isn't allowed to be loud so as to discourage shouting and therefore disease transmission.
And it finishes at 10


----------



## killer b (Sep 26, 2020)

Events can go on past 10 apparently, they just can't serve booze


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 26, 2020)

the last act must also have started by 21:59:59


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 26, 2020)

killer b said:


> A rave where everyone has to sit down i guess.





ska invita said:


> And the music isn't allowed to be loud so as to discourage shouting and therefore disease transmission.
> And it finishes at 10



These days that sounds quite appealing


----------



## killer b (Sep 26, 2020)

Yeah, the nights I organise these days (or did organise anyway...) are explicitly sit down affairs with slooooow music. I could probably put one on right now under the new restrictions and it'd be more or less the same as they usually are.


----------



## editor (Sep 26, 2020)

Here's how Brixton looked at around  10.30-11pm last night. I suspect this 10pm close is going to finish off some venues.



































						In photos: the new Friday night in Brixton: all bars closed by 10pm
					

With pubs and restaurants compelled to close at 10pm under new coronavirus health laws, Brixton on a Friday night has become a very strange and sad place. It makes for a depressing sight, with alre…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## TopCat (Sep 26, 2020)

editor said:


> I'm not sure how it's any different. One pub near me has just had to lay off 50% of their staff. No furlough, no staff payments, nowt.


Which pub?


----------



## TopCat (Sep 26, 2020)

editor said:


> Here's how Brixton looked at around  10.30-11pm last night. I suspect this 10pm close is going to finish off some venues.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sad for sure.


----------



## editor (Sep 26, 2020)

TopCat said:


> Which pub?


Come on. I'm not going to name them, but it will be the same in just about every pub/venue.


----------



## killer b (Sep 26, 2020)

If you close every pub in the country for their busiest hours for six months and only offer to pay 1/3 of the missing hours pay for the staff (and the pubs themselves have to make up another 1/3 out of nothing) then yeah. Most places will be getting rid of massive swathes of their staff.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 27, 2020)

Liverpool perhaps a bit naughty there


----------



## Badgers (Oct 1, 2020)

BBC One - BBC London, Evening News, 01/10/2020
					

The latest news, sport and weather from London.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




At least getting some attention nm


----------



## Badgers (Oct 2, 2020)

Assume all have signed this? 









						Petition: Give further financial support to the Events and Hospitality industry
					

Being the first to close and still no clue as to when we can open, this seasonal industry is losing its summer profits that allows them to get through the first quarter of next year.   Even if we are allowed to open in December, 1 months profit won't be enough to keep us open in 2021. We need help




					petition.parliament.uk


----------



## spitfire (Oct 3, 2020)

If anyone is still on Facebook this group is organising something. not sure what yet but it's got quite a large membership.





__





						Facebook Groups
					

Music Venue Trust Activists Group has 38,267 members. IMPORTANT: CHECK THE ANNOUNCEMENTS!!!  In the next 14 days, hundreds of Grassroots Music Venues right across the UK will find out if they will...




					www.facebook.com


----------



## editor (Oct 3, 2020)

spitfire said:


> If anyone is still on Facebook this group is organising something. not sure what yet but it's got quite a large membership.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This was just posted in that group:


1. INDOOR MUSIC PERFORMANCES HAVE BEEN LEGAL SINCE 4TH JULY 2020. The UK is currently in STAGE 4 of the Government's 'COVID-19 5 STAGE ROADMAP TO RECOVERY' which permits indoor performances where 1m social distancing is adhered to.
2) Any performers ARE NOW REQUIRED BY LAW to supply their OWN MICROPHONE, CABLE & INSTRUMENTS (Also items including Plectrums, Drum Sticks, Capo's and Spare Strings) & could also be given a sealable bag to safely contain their Microphone & Cable post performance.
3) I AM NOT CURRENTLY HOSTING ANY KARAOKE'S. AT ANY OF MY EVENTS... absolutely no equipment will be shared whatsoever with the exception of 2 microphone stands and a seat (which will be sanitized during an allocated 10 minute period between Artists)
A maximum of 2 people will be singing (at my events) at any time, distanced 1-2m apart.
4) I continue to liase with and always follow up to date Guidance and Publications from:
▪︎The Office for Product Safety and Standards ▪︎Public Protection | Adult Social Care, Health Integration and Wellbeing Department of Stoke-on-Trent City Council
▪︎UK Government Covid-19 Recovery Strategy (dated Sep 2020)
▪︎Tower Hamlets Council (Advice)
▪︎The Music Producers Guild
5) AT ALL PUBS All customers are required to wear a facemask upon arrival & if travelling to Toilets or a Desinated Smoking Area / Seated at 1m Distance / Track & Trace as is Mandatory
6) I have PLC insurance with Allianz which covers myself & the Public for any injury that occurs on or off site.
7) I am in fact also a Personal Licence Holder with SOTCC. As Per the Licencing Objectives: Due Dilligence and the Protection of the Public are paramount & remain my number 1 priority and I fully ADHERE TO CURRENT LAWS, WHICH I AM FULLY IN COMPLIANCE AND AGREEMENT WITH.
7) All Artists must be situated away at a safe distance from the public (vice versa) & the volume of the performance, won't be at such a level where it is required to shout or even speak loudly.
8) Currently All Licenceable Premises have a MAXIMUM CAPACITY due to the social distancing required to protect the public due to COVID-19, and this must not be exceeded AT ANY TIME. Additionally, all customers must be vacated by 10pm.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 3, 2020)

Actual Christmas concerts are coming to the Royal Albert Hall
					

Christmas carols, Handel’s Messiah and The Nutcracker at Royal Albert Hall for Christmas 2020, under social distancing.



					www.timeout.com
				




*There will be a maximum of 3,000 audience members at any one performance,' the RAH explain, 'in addition to around 100 members of front of house, security and catering staff.*

That is 56.9% capacity

Why are people not able to go to football and other outdoor sports? Why are exhibitions not able to open?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 3, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Actual Christmas concerts are coming to the Royal Albert Hall
> 
> 
> Christmas carols, Handel’s Messiah and The Nutcracker at Royal Albert Hall for Christmas 2020, under social distancing.
> ...


How are they allowed to do that? I've given up trying to follow these rules now.


----------



## pesh (Oct 3, 2020)

would put money on it not happening.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 3, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> How are they allowed to do that? I've given up trying to follow these rules now.


I suspect some of the trustee's are either in the house of Lords or related to said cunts.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 3, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I suspect some of the trustee's are either in the house of Lords or related to said cunts.


or both


----------



## magneze (Oct 3, 2020)

Perhaps the concerts have live grouse shooting now? Football has missed a trick there.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 3, 2020)

Virtual conferencing #worldbeating 









						The Conservative Party virtual conference is not working
					

Viewers struggle to access ‘fireside chat’ on the first day of online gathering




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 3, 2020)

It’s a total mystery why a group of people that have thrown the event tech support industry on the scrap heap would find their event tech not being very reliable.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 3, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It’s a total mystery why a group of people that have thrown the event tech support industry on the scrap heap would find their event tech not being very reliable.


Shocked to the core again and again by how little they understand any industry. They think 'all that stuff just happens' don't they? 

FFS 

Can't even get it right themselves but it is our fault and cross to bear.


----------



## editor (Oct 3, 2020)

How can this be OK but a gig not OK?


----------



## ddraig (Oct 3, 2020)

This gigs with acts starting before 10pm is england only isn't it?


----------



## Badgers (Oct 3, 2020)

editor said:


> How can this be OK but a gig not OK?
> 
> View attachment 232853


Money


----------



## killer b (Oct 3, 2020)

editor said:


> How can this be OK but a gig not OK?
> 
> View attachment 232853


Travel is a necessity in a way that going to concerts isn't I suppose. The mixture of booze, close contact, dancing and singing that tends to go with the most kinds of gig has been shown to increase the chance of transmission considerably too.

There are seated gigs happening right now, mind.


----------



## Supine (Oct 3, 2020)

editor said:


> How can this be OK but a gig not OK?
> 
> View attachment 232853



I wouldn't do that.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 4, 2020)

Cineworld to close UK cinemas...


----------



## ska invita (Oct 4, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Cineworld to close UK cinemas...


"temporarily"


----------



## spitfire (Oct 4, 2020)

spitfire said:


> If anyone is still on Facebook this group is organising something. not sure what yet but it's got quite a large membership.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's a bit of a mess TBH, lots of random posts, no direction, and Fred from Right(wing) Said Fred managed to post up some conspiraloon nonsense under the radar. 

I'll hang in for a while to see if it goes anywhere.


----------



## editor (Oct 5, 2020)

Worth signing: 








						Petition: Let Us Dance – support nightclubs, dance music events and festivals
					

Brixton is famous for its gigs, clubs and live music events, but venues are struggling to cope with the ongoing impact of the coronavirus pandemic, and urgently need government support to survive. …



					www.brixtonbuzz.com
				




Also: 



> The government is facing a legal challenge to its 10pm curfew amid mounting anger in the hospitality industry.
> 
> Jeremy Joseph, owner of the G-A-Y nightclub and pub group, said he would pursue a potential judicial review of the national curfew on hospitality venues if the restriction is not dropped.
> 
> ...



I can't read the rest because it's on a cunty paywall









						G-A-Y nightclub group threatens judicial review of 10pm coronavirus curfew
					

The government is facing a legal challenge to its 10pm curfew amid mounting anger in the hospitality industry.Jeremy Joseph, owner of the G-A-Y nightclub group, said he would pursue a potential judicial review of the national curfew on hospitality venues if the restriction is not dropped. In a lette




					www.thetimes.co.uk


----------



## spitfire (Oct 5, 2020)

editor said:


> Worth signing:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Spoiler: body of text



The government is facing a legal challenge to its 10pm curfew amid mounting anger in the hospitality industry.

Jeremy Joseph, owner of the G-A-Y nightclub and pub group, said he would pursue a potential judicial review of the national curfew on hospitality venues if the restriction is not dropped.

In a letter to Matt Hancock, the health secretary, lawyers acting for the business challenge the logic of what they call an “arbitrary decision” and have hired Sam Karim, QC, of Kings Chambers.

They say they will launch judicial review proceedings if Mr Hancock does not provide a “satisfactory response” by 4pm tomorrow.

The curfew, which forces hospitality venues to shut at 10pm, was introduced in England on September 24 in an attempt to curb resurgent coronavirus infections.



Mr Joseph, 53, said the curfew “makes absolutely no sense”, and added: “It does the opposite of protecting people by pushing them on to the street at the same time. They are going from being safe inside venues with staggered closing times to unsafe on overcrowded streets and overloaded public transport.
“This government has failed to show why the 10pm curfew was put in place and has published no scientific evidence to substantiate its implementation.”
G-A-Y Group runs two bars in London and one in Manchester, and Heaven, the nightclub in Charing Cross, London, known for its long association with the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender scene.
Nightclubs have been closed since the lockdown began in March. Heaven is instead trading as a “bar and live entertainment venue” at reduced capacity to meet government rules, the group said.
Michael Kill, chief executive of the Night Time Industries Association, said the trade body was supporting Mr Joseph’s move. Mr Kill said the curfew had resulted in “thousands of businesses making the difficult decision to close the doors, or make staff redundant”.
Tim Martin, boss of the Wetherspoons pub chain, has called it “utterly stupid”.
More than 1,000 publicans have added to the pressure with an open letter urging the government to “think again over the damaging 10pm curfew, which has seen pubs up and down the country face a business-threatening drop in trade”.
The letter to Rishi Sunak, the chancellor, organised by Campaign for Pubs, says the curfew and mandatory table service had resulted in huge drops in trade.
The group said many pubs are reporting that trade has fallen by up to 70 per cent and that there is “huge anger towards the government and a sense that pubs are being both scapegoated and allowed to close”.
The letter urges Mr Sunak to “support pubs or be responsible for mass closures, job losses and hardship”.
A Treasury spokesman said: “We’ve supported the hospitality sector from the start of the outbreak, protecting millions of jobs through initiatives such as the Eat Out to Help Out scheme, VAT cuts, business rates holidays and cash grants of up to £25,000.
“Our support for business continues to reach millions of firms, and we stand ready to do more as necessary. Businesses can still access our loan schemes, a moratorium of eviction for commercial tenants and the statutory sick pay rebate scheme. The job support scheme is designed to protect jobs in businesses facing lower demand over the winter due to Covid, and is just one form of support on offer to employers during this difficult period.”


----------



## spitfire (Oct 5, 2020)




----------



## elbows (Oct 5, 2020)

I will not support a stance that is based on claims that the businesses involved are Covid secure.

Although closing at 10pm is counterproductive in some ways, these sorts of appeals mention the devastating effect the curfew has had on customer numbers. And that in itself would be expected to be one of the reasons the curfews could actually makes a difference to infection, by reducing footfall in general.

Not that I would mess around with curfews if I were making the decisons, I would have just shut these businesses instead and given all concerned financial support.


----------



## editor (Oct 5, 2020)

elbows said:


> I will not support a stance that is based on claims that the businesses involved are Covid secure.
> 
> Although closing at 10pm is counterproductive in some ways, these sorts of appeals mention the devastating effect the curfew has had on customer numbers. And that in itself would be expected to be one of the reasons the curfews could actually makes a difference to infection, by reducing footfall in general.
> 
> Not that I would mess around with curfews if I were making the decisons, I would have just shut these businesses instead and given all concerned financial support.


The 10pm think is ridiculous. Pubs are as full as they're going to be at that time so everyone goes to the loo with 5 minutes to go and then leaves at the same time. It's the time when I feel the least safe in pubs. Plus everyone just starts drinking earlier and power drinks as soon as the 9.15 bell goes. I fail to see how staggering these times wouldn't improve things overall (given that people really want to go out and venues really need to stay open to survive).


----------



## killer b (Oct 5, 2020)

editor said:


> The 10pm think is ridiculous. Pubs are as full as they're going to be at that time so everyone goes to the loo with 5 minutes to go and then leaves at the same time. It's the time when I feel the least safe in pubs. Plus everyone just starts drinking earlier and power drinks as soon as the 9.15 bell goes.


I've seen a lot of people making these kinds of claims, and a lot of landlords complaining their pubs are dead all night. Which is it?


----------



## editor (Oct 5, 2020)

killer b said:


> I've seen a lot of people making these kinds of claims, and a lot of landlords complaining their pubs are dead all night. Which is it?


It can quite easily be both, depending on:

(a) the pub
(b) the area
(c) the day of the week

I live in Brixton which has a long strip of bars and at 10pm the streets are very busy. I'm sure things might be quite different at the Old Scrotum's Tavern in Little Nowhereville.


----------



## killer b (Oct 5, 2020)

editor said:


> Old Scrotum's Tavern in Little Nowhereville.


nice.


----------



## killer b (Oct 5, 2020)

Anyway, here in_ Little Nowheresville_, it's worked very well at dampening demand for the boozer, and I would be surprised if it's not done the same nationally overall.

I'd also be pretty surprised if the demand at 10pm in Brixton isn't also somewhat reduced from pre-curfew 10pm demand, though it's not something that can be very easily assessed.


----------



## editor (Oct 5, 2020)

killer b said:


> Anyway, here in_ Little Nowheresville_, it's worked very well at dampening demand for the boozer, and I would be surprised if it's not done the same nationally overall.
> 
> I'd also be pretty surprised if the demand at 10pm in Brixton isn't also somewhat reduced from pre-curfew 10pm demand, though it's not something that can be very easily assessed.


Yes, your experiences will most likely be completely different to a well known, London nightlife destination that has a street full of busy bars.

And yes, it's blindingly obvious that "demand at 10pm in Brixton [is] somewhat reduced from pre-curfew 10pm demand," because social distancing has to be respected, and fewer people are allowed in venues. 

However, what I did tell you is that closing time now feels the least safe time in some pubs for me, when _every single person who is in the pub leaves at the same time. _


----------



## elbows (Oct 5, 2020)

Demand is also reduced because some people are sensible enough to take the rules as a sign that those environments are not a great place to be in a pandemic, and decide it isnt worth the hassle.


----------



## killer b (Oct 5, 2020)

editor said:


> Yes, your experiences will most likely be completely different to a well known, London nightlife destination that has a street full of busy bars.
> 
> And yes, it's blindingly obvious that "demand at 10pm in Brixton [is] somewhat reduced from pre-curfew 10pm demand," because social distancing has to be respected, and fewer people are allowed in venues.
> 
> However, what I did tell you is that closing time now feels the least safe time in some pubs for me, when _every single person who is in the pub leaves at the same time. _


So you recommend staggering closing times instead? Who decides which pubs close first?


----------



## editor (Oct 5, 2020)

killer b said:


> So you recommend staggering closing times instead? Who decides which pubs close first?


Could be decided on which pubs are deemed the safest, or rotated, with no one let in to the later pubs after 9pm, for example.

Or just make it the option for pubs to close at 11pm (like in Northern Ireland) or later when a lot of people would have already gone home anyway. 10pm just seems too early for me and just encourages people to go on to house parties - which I've seen plenty of evidence for where I live.



> Britain's hotly-contested 10pm curfew will not curb the spread of coronavirus unless pubs enforce staggered leaving times, a respiratory virologist has warned.
> 
> Dr Julian Tang, from the University of Leicester, urged ministers to consider making pubs, restaurants and bars adopt a rota system where tables leave at different times, to avoid tougher restrictions.
> 
> ...


----------



## editor (Oct 5, 2020)

And from the BBC: 


> *Is there any science behind a 10pm closing time?*
> We're not entirely sure.
> 
> Speaking on the Andrew Marr Show, the University of Edinburgh's Prof Mark Woolhouse, a member of the government's infection modelling team, said "there isn't a proven scientific basis for any of this".
> ...


----------



## elbows (Oct 5, 2020)

Northern Ireland is reasonably likely to impose further restrictions on the hospitality sector.



> The executive's Chief Scientific Advisor, Prof Ian Young, said "other levers are likely to be needed" in addition to NI-wide restrictions on household gatherings.
> 
> In a statement issued on Sunday evening, he said the hospitality sector was the "second most important" for interventions "to reduce adult contacts".
> 
> ...











						Coronavirus: Executive considering 'new interventions' on Covid
					

Health Minister Robin Swann said he did not want a return to a long-term or indefinite lockdown.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 5, 2020)

The pubs need to close completely and the government needs to bail them out


----------



## editor (Oct 5, 2020)

Orang Utan said:


> The pubs need to close completely and the government needs to bail them out


This government are never going to bail out pubs, clubs or live venues.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 5, 2020)

editor said:


> This government are never going to bail out pubs, clubs or live venues.


I know. They are fucked. But that doesn’t change the fact that a full lockdown is necessary


----------



## killer b (Oct 5, 2020)

Orang Utan said:


> a full lockdown is necessary


I'm not sure if it is tbh. If a partial lockdown can bring infection numbers down enough - and there's some indication that it's doing this - then it isn't necessary. Bailouts still needed either way mind.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 6, 2020)

Sunak says people in 'all walks of life' are having to adapt for employment | ITV News
					

He told ITV News the government is "trying to do everything we can to protect as many jobs as possible" but conceded unemployment is "likely to increase". | ITV National News




					www.itv.com


----------



## editor (Oct 6, 2020)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Sunak says people in 'all walks of life' are having to adapt for employment | ITV News
> 
> 
> He told ITV News the government is "trying to do everything we can to protect as many jobs as possible" but conceded unemployment is "likely to increase". | ITV National News
> ...


He's such an arrogant piece of shit. He has no fucking idea what it's like for people who have spent a lifetime learning a craft and then being told to find another job that doesn't fucking exist - unless it's some shitty zero hour, low paid crap that cunts like him have created.


----------



## killer b (Oct 6, 2020)

What are you talking about, he's creating 13,500 jobs as 'career coaches', you could apply for one of those.


----------



## ska invita (Oct 6, 2020)

Id be interested to know the cabinet is being told about the projected length of covid disruption. Obviously this is a matter of speculation but they will be acting on some advice. Is it another year? two years? three? This should be made public


----------



## Badgers (Oct 6, 2020)

editor said:


> Worth signing:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Signed


----------



## Sue (Oct 6, 2020)

editor said:


> He's such an arrogant piece of shit. He has no fucking idea what it's like for people who have spent a lifetime learning a craft and then being told to find another job that doesn't fucking exist - unless it's some shitty zero hour, low paid crap that cunts like him have created.


I've a few friends who're actors. Between acting jobs, they tend to do reception/ temping work. And obviously there's none of that about at the moment either. And in case the Government hasn't noticed, there's not a whole load of any jobs about right now and an increasing number of people looking for work. FFS.


----------



## belboid (Oct 6, 2020)




----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 6, 2020)

Julian Cope as PM???!!1!!1??!


----------



## mx wcfc (Oct 6, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Julian Cope as PM???!!1!!1??!


Bigger budget for archaeology for a start. Time Team back on the Beeb 5 days a week.  Compulsory study of ancient history, stone circles etc in schools.  What's not to like?


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 6, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Id be interested to know the cabinet is being told about the projected length of covid disruption. Obviously this is a matter of speculation but they will be acting on some advice. *Is it another year? two years? three?* This should be made public



Utterly pointless for either the Govt or us to speculate about that question without introducing the word 'vaccine' .... 



Yes I _know_ that 'forecasting' vaccine timetables is utterly speculative too , but until we know more about whether there's going to be an effective vaccine or not, talk of either six months' or three years' more disruption is meaningless IMO .....


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 6, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Bigger budget for archaeology for a start. Time Team back on the Beeb 5 days a week.  Compulsory study of ancient history, stone circles etc in schools.  What's not to like?




I was more thinking of his possible theme tune ahead of the Queen's Speech ......... _*'Out of my Mind on Dope and Speed!!'*_ anyone?


----------



## ska invita (Oct 6, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Utterly pointless for either the Govt or us to speculate about that question without introducing the word 'vaccine' ....
> 
> 
> 
> Yes I _know_ that 'forecasting' vaccine timetables is utterly speculative too , but until we know more about whether there's going to be an effective vaccine or not, talk of either six months' or three years' more disruption is meaningless IMO .....


you are right of course
BJ told us Back to Normal by November, so perhaps better we didnt hear their lies
However a lot of people are taking on debt in order to hang in there....if government superpredictors are telling the cabinet 2022 minimum then people should be told before they lose what little they already have down a debt sinkhole, was my point


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 6, 2020)

ska invita said:


> However a lot of people are taking on debt in order to hang in there....if government superpredictors are telling the cabinet 2022 minimum then people should be told before they lose what little they already have down a debt sinkhole, was my point



Very fair points, those  -- I agree


----------



## mx wcfc (Oct 6, 2020)

editor said:


> This government are never going to bail out pubs, clubs or live venues.


Too many opportunities for their  private equity mates to buy up bust pubs to turn into trendy bars, or convert into flats (or both).


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Oct 7, 2020)

I went to a a gig last night for the first time since the end of February. It was so so good to hear live music but my god! I miss the old days.

Everyone was sat down, table service only. Everyone was starting to reach out for a hug and then stepping back and doing the elbow bump thing. It’s a poor substitute.

As 10:00 approached I expected a hard eviction from the venue but they allowed us all to drift out over the next 15 or 20 minutes so there was no bulge of people on the pavement outside.

Afterwards 6 of us sat around the fire and chatted. Three musicians, talking about how things were and are, what hopes and plans they have. Being in bands is the only thing they’ve ever done, and they were making a decent living from it before all this.

One of them is a hired gun so hasn’t really got another string to his bow so he’s essentially living off his girlfriend and hoping things can develop to the point where his band can play again.

Two of them are writing, one seriously and hoping to carve out a new career as a writer, the other making weird new little projects online and considering becoming an academic of some kind.

I don’t remember ever before hearing jobbing musicians discussing how to get out of gigs and into something else.

But they are also working on new music and so we were also talking about how gigs have changed so much, so the performance will have to change, so the music will be different.

One of them was DJing in Berlin recently and described big “raves” that go in til 5 or 6 in the morning, but with everyone sat at tables and not dancing, just listening. He was making us all laugh with his description of him playing banger after banger and the room all sat down with their arms folded, nodding along.

Agh, you laugh you cry.


----------



## spitfire (Oct 7, 2020)

This is quite a big event on the foodie calendar. I imagine the London Craft Beer Festival won't be far behind.

TASTE OF LONDON 19-22 NOVEMBER IS CANCELLED

Dear Taste fans,
We are incredibly sad to announce that the festive edition of Taste of London at Tobacco Dock, November 2020, is cancelled.
We are proud that our festive edition has become a key moment in everyone's calendars that kicks off the the season in style each year, and we've been trying hard to find a way to proceed with the event in a safe way. But with ongoing restrictions and advice from the UK Government surrounding COVID-19, we just won't be able to put on the festival you know and love. The health and safety of everyone involved and all of you who attend our festivals has to remain our top priority.
Whilst we won't be devouring London's tastiest dishes, sipping winter cocktails and getting into the festive spirit around the Piano Bar with you this November, we are already planning an epic celebration in Regent's Park for June 2021. We can't wait to feast with you next year.
We encourage all our Taste fans to continue to support the hospitality industry where you can (and feel safe to) over the coming months. We will continue to shed a light on great initiatives and offerings from our friends in the restaurant and drinks industry.
If you have any questions (or want to send us a funny festive GIF to cheer us all up), slide into our DMs or email us at queries@tastefestivals.com. 

Team Taste





__





						Festive edition of Taste of London 2020 Update
					

Taste of London 19-22 November will not be taking place




					london.tastefestivals.com


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

spitfire said:


> TASTE OF LONDON 19-22 NOVEMBER IS CANCELLED


Should have been cancelled already in this climate. All other events have been.


----------



## spitfire (Oct 7, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Should have been cancelled already in this climate. All other events have been.



It's usually in the Summer so this is the rescheduled one, I guess they hoped it would all be over by now.

LCBF is the week after, also rescheduled (from August).









						London Craft Beer Festival 2022 - London Craft Beer Festival
					

12th — 13th August 2022. Tobacco Dock, London.




					londoncraftbeerfestival.co.uk
				




Matter of time I'd say.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

spitfire said:


> It's usually in the Summer so this is the rescheduled one, I guess they hoped it would all be over by now.
> 
> LCBF is the week after, also rescheduled (from August).
> 
> ...


100% not happening. 

My main event was due in March 2020 
Delayed initially till July 2020
Moved to March 2021
Now provisionally moved to June 2021

Behind the scenes the venues are cancelling and moving these events. The events are not formally cancelling/rescheduling until they have prepared a plan and worked out their financial exposure. 

Oddly I have had very few punters requesting refunds and tickets are still selling. All this money is held by the ticket agency until after the event (hence why I am unemployed  

80% of the participating companies are not complaining. Some have requested refunds but that can't be done sadly.


----------



## editor (Oct 7, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> As 10:00 approached I expected a hard eviction from the venue but they allowed us all to drift out over the next 15 or 20 minutes so there was no bulge of people on the pavement outside.


That's clearly sensible but very risky for the venue.  In Brixton, at least one venue I know had inspectors rocking up at 10.01 ready to dish out a fine if there was any members of the public still inside.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

Sorry to be a downer ska invita


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

Also worth noting that the event I have moved to June 2021 is at ExCel which is a modern, high ceiling venue with almost unlimited financial support (UAE owned). 

Venues like Tobacco Dock/Olympia/Ally Pally are nice buildings but old and won't be able to cope with the distancing/cleaning/staffing issues as well


----------



## ska invita (Oct 7, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Sorry to be a downer ska invita


I'm sad about your unemployment

I've got a friend hanging on by his finger nails to his job. If the company folds I can't see how he's going to make his mortgage payments. 
He's got loads of experience, but I can't imagine him finding a new job in this time that isn't shit wage
So grim


----------



## spitfire (Oct 7, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Also worth noting that the event I have moved to June 2021 is at ExCel which is a modern, high ceiling venue with almost unlimited financial support (UAE owned).
> 
> Venues like Tobacco Dock/Olympia/Ally Pally are nice buildings but old and won't be able to cope with the distancing/cleaning/staffing issues as well



Aye, most of the foodie stuff like Speciality Fine Food Fair (Olympia) and Farm Show and Deli show (NEC) rescheduled and then cancelled a while back but they're run by big events companies. LCBF are a small operation so were hoping against hope I guess. As you say, it won't be going ahead, Tobacco Dock is cramped enough at normal times.

IFE (at Excel, biggest food show in the UK, possibly Europe, I'm not sure) dodged a bullet as it is biannual so they weren't scheduled for this year anyway.

I bought tickets for IDLES next June and I'm not confident that will go ahead.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

spitfire said:


> I bought tickets for IDLES next June and I'm not confident that will go ahead


My guess is 50/50 for most 2021 events/festivals sadly. The 'big venue' events (Excel/NEC) events will be tricky. The venues will prioritise the biggest money making event's. The smaller events will have to take up the less popular dates. 

I usually only run big events in March-April and September-November.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Oct 7, 2020)

editor said:


> That's clearly sensible but very risky for the venue.  In Brixton, at least one venue I know had inspectors rocking up at 10.01 ready to dish out a fine if there was any members of the public still inside.




I know. And I was surprised. But this place is quite tucked away and all the regulars value it, so everyone was up and ready to leave at 10:00. No persistent lurking. I guess they’re prepared to take the chance.


----------



## Supine (Oct 7, 2020)

First event to test rapid coronavirus test-on-entry system to happen this month
					

Apolo in Barcelona will trial a 1,000 person event




					djmag.com


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Oct 7, 2020)

Supine said:


> First event to test rapid coronavirus test-on-entry system to happen this month
> 
> 
> Apolo in Barcelona will trial a 1,000 person event
> ...




This has to be the future, for gigs/events as well as travel. In Italy they are trialling this on the Rome-Milan air route on 2 flights a day, the test result comes back within 30 minutes, then you are allowed to check in. Germany thinks they have a test that will come back in under 10 minutes. Both the Italian and German ones are 90% accurate, the regular PCR test is 95% accurate. 90% is good enough for me.


edit, World-beating twat Grant Schapps will today outline the UK's plan to possibly reduce quarantine to 5 or 6 days later. Well not a plan, a task force to look in to formulating a plan. Useless shower of cunts.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> World-beating twat Grant Schapps will today outline the UK's plan to possibly reduce quarantine to 5 or 6 days later. Well not a plan, a task force to look in to formulating a plan. Useless shower of cunts.


Seems good timing with cases, hospital admissions and deaths rising.


----------



## souljacker (Oct 7, 2020)

Supine said:


> First event to test rapid coronavirus test-on-entry system to happen this month
> 
> 
> Apolo in Barcelona will trial a 1,000 person event
> ...



Rapid testing has to be the answer to the whole pandemic. I can't see a fully protective vaccine rolled out to everyone coming soon, if at all.


----------



## spitfire (Oct 7, 2020)

Badgers said:


> 100% not happening.
> 
> My main event was due in March 2020
> Delayed initially till July 2020
> ...



I just received an email from LCBF (we attended as a supplier last year) that they are going ahead with social distancing in place. I can't see it myself TBH.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

spitfire said:


> I just received an email from LCBF (we attended as a supplier last year) that they are going ahead with social distancing in place. I can't see it myself TBH.


Would be *staggered* if it does go ahead. Especially given people will be day drinking and the set up in that venue. 

Don't get me wrong. I WANT events happening ASAP but this seems like false hope to me. Also unfair on the suppliers and people who are making plans, outlaying money, booking travel/accommodation etc etc... 

What is happening to the industry is horrid but so is C19. If they (somehow) plough ahead despite the rising cases and deaths then they will be hurting the whole industry longer than the already crippling delays/postponements/cancellations.


----------



## spitfire (Oct 7, 2020)

Badgers said:


> *Would be staggered if it does go ahead. Especially given people will be day drinking and the set up in that venue.
> 
> Don't get me wrong. I WANT events happening ASAP* but this seems like false hope to me. Also unfair on the suppliers and people who are making plans, outlaying money, booking travel/accommodation etc etc...
> 
> What is happening to the industry is horrid but so is C19. If they (somehow) plough ahead despite the rising cases and deaths then they will be hurting the whole industry longer than the already crippling delays/postponements/cancellations.



Me too.

We're not doing it. Even if we had the budget I wouldn't expose myself or my co workers to the risk.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

spitfire said:


> Me too.
> 
> We're not doing it. Even if we had the budget I wouldn't expose myself or my co workers to the risk.


Yeah. Shit innit 

Have spent a lot of time being positive with people/organisations but this is a time to be realistic. Have had to sign a couple of NDAs with venues but can at least tell you honestly the outlook is bleak. 

As for exposure if an event had cases of C-19 or worse deaths associated with it that that is a fucking mess and a half.


----------



## spitfire (Oct 7, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Yeah. Shit innit
> 
> Have spent a lot of time being positive with people/organisations but this is a time to be realistic. Have had to sign a couple of NDAs with venues but can at least tell you honestly the outlook is bleak.
> 
> As for exposure if an event had cases of C-19 or worse deaths associated with it that that is a fucking mess and a half.



It really does suck, I feel for you and all the other people involved. My days on the organising side of events is passed but I had a lot of good times and still have mates who work in clubs, on the road and in hospitality. It's really starting to bite, but I know you don't need me to tell you that.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 7, 2020)

According to some true crime podcasrs I listen to, CrimeCon is going ahead next June. And tickets are on sale now in a 'Covid safe' purchase


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 7, 2020)

Unfortunately someone I knew from uni in the events industry seems to of got into anti mask conspiracy type beliefs


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> According to some true crime podcasrs I listen to, CrimeCon is going ahead next June. And tickets are on sale now in a 'Covid safe' purchase


Next June is possible (50/50 as I said) but I don't think anyone can plan anything more than 'provisionally' till early next year. 

Events can sell tickets. The ticket money will usually (check this though) be held by a ticketing agency until the event has been delivered (to a decent standard). So as a punter you can book if you want and get a refund if the event is moved or cancelled. 

At this time there will be almost no companies paying for involvement/sponsorship and next to impossible to get commitment from speakers and such. 



frogwoman said:


> Unfortunately someone I knew from uni in the events industry seems to of got into anti mask conspiracy type beliefs


Protectionism. Not unsurprising wanting to protect your interests or your company/industry in times like this.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 7, 2020)

Jeez  this is absolutely shit.


----------



## spitfire (Oct 7, 2020)

"Just an amazing thing to witness today; 100’s of musicians performing Mars from Holst’s The Planets at Parliament Square. They performed the first 90 seconds then stood in standstill for a minute after that, to highlight that being a freelance musician IS a viable profession. As if you actually have to confirm this. I’m sure you know how much Arts & Culture & musical events provide to the economy. Massive kudos to Jess Murphy for being the catalyst for this incredible event & to all the fantastic players involved. #letmusiclive #wemakeevents "


----------



## Badgers (Oct 7, 2020)

No doubt some 'high end theatres' and the opera etc will be looked after.


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 7, 2020)

souljacker said:


> Rapid testing has to be the answer to the whole pandemic. I can't see a fully protective vaccine rolled out to everyone coming soon, *if at all*.



Dare I speculate 'bollocks', but *JUST* (and only) to your *'if at all'* point re vaccines? 

My optimism-levels are decreasing a fair bit  concerning any time soon, to emphasise that I do have _some_ realism here.

But!


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 7, 2020)

spitfire : are you actually involved wth the London Craft Beer Festival? Or do you just know people? 

Separately, in CAMRA-world, no (CAMRA-covered) beer festivals are expected to occur _anywhere_ before Easter at the *very *earliest 

Here in Swansea, we're only _mildl_y optimistic(-ish!) that we'll have our Swansea Bay event late next fucking *AUGUST*
(BH weekend  )

And we have to decide by Easter 2021 as well 

Admittedly ours is pretty big -- 100 beers, 45 ciders in 2019. 

But our best mate (a professional brewer, and the fest's beer-orderer   ) is _already_ saying we'll have to reduce the order a fair bit if we even go ahead ......


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## spitfire (Oct 8, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> spitfire : are you actually involved wth the London Craft Beer Festival? Or do you just know people?
> 
> Separately, in CAMRA-world, no (CAMRA-covered) beer festivals are expected to occur _anywhere_ before Easter at the *very *earliest
> 
> ...



Sorry William, meant to reply last night.

Not involved on an organisational level although we did appear there last year and were looking at doing all 5 this year. I know Dan the owner a little bit from that and he's a nice guy. Hopefully he is on top of the risks, this isn't his first rodeo.

I think Badgers is right though.


----------



## killer b (Oct 8, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Protectionism. Not unsurprising wanting to protect your interests or your company/industry in times like this.


Yeah, a couple of bar owners I know are heading down this route - I had a short and only mildly irritable exchange with them on facebook today when one of them shared an article about some lockdown denying scientists that was hosted on a website that also featured lurid anti-Bill Gates conspiracy theories, general anti-vax stuff, Trump boosters, and an entire section of the site dedicated to UFO sightings...


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## Voley (Oct 9, 2020)

Being perfectly honest, I've got tickets to see The Specials in just under a year's time and I wouldn't be at all surprised if that's cancelled. If I don't think it's safe then, I won't be going, either.

I'm hoping travel between here and The Isles of Scilly will be okay next May when I've got a holiday booked. But again, if it doesn't feel right, I'll be cancelling.

Was really fucked off by Sunak hanging the events industry out to dry earlier this week. I can't recall that happening to the finance industry when they ballsed everything up for us that time.


----------



## BigTom (Oct 9, 2020)

Voley said:


> Being perfectly honest, I've got tickets to see The Specials in just under a year's time and I wouldn't be at all surprised if that's cancelled. If I don't think it's safe then, I won't be going, either.
> 
> I'm hoping travel between here and The Isles of Scilly will be okay next May when I've got a holiday booked. But again, if it doesn't feel right, I'll be cancelling.
> 
> Was really fucked off by Sunak hanging the events industry out to dry earlier this week. I can't recall that happening to the finance industry when they ballsed everything up for us that time.



Now, now. That's unfair. The govt. have setup a website to help people find new careers. Suggested my mate, who was a full time DJ and graf artist becomes a cake decorator! 
Sorted.


----------



## Supine (Oct 9, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Now, now. That's unfair. The govt. have setup a website to help people find new careers. Suggested my mate, who was a full time DJ and graf artist becomes a cake decorator!
> Sorted.



TBF that's a good idea. He knows how to mix and he'll be great at writing happy birthday in icing


----------



## Espresso (Oct 9, 2020)

A couple of men I know who have their own business in organising kids' party entertainment and who also do panto every year (as in onstage, generally as the ugly sisters) both went onto that joke of a retraining government site and it helpfully suggested that one of them should work in football and the other should retrain as a chef.

Pardon? Have I missed something? Football and hospitality aren't exactly short of people who are already trained. What those industries are going to be short of is jobs for the ones who already sodding well know how to do it, never mind advising us non viable collateral damage theatrical & events types to retrain for them.


----------



## mr steev (Oct 9, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Now, now. That's unfair. The govt. have setup a website to help people find new careers. Suggested my mate, who was a full time DJ and graf artist becomes a cake decorator!
> Sorted.



We were talking about this last night... It suggested my mate, who works in digital animation, becomes a carpet fitter


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 9, 2020)

I got: actor, copy editor or commissioning editor...


----------



## mr steev (Oct 9, 2020)

Just done it for me and it suggested search & rescue volunteer. Volunteer! How's that going to help with the relocating? 😂


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 9, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> I got: actor, copy editor or commissioning editor...


Exactly the same as me


----------



## pesh (Oct 9, 2020)

BigTom said:


> Now, now. That's unfair. The govt. have setup a website to help people find new careers. Suggested my mate, who was a full time DJ and graf artist becomes a cake decorator!
> Sorted.


I like cake but was told to become a DJ


----------



## Badgers (Oct 12, 2020)




----------



## spitfire (Oct 13, 2020)

Not necessarily the first person I thought would spring to the defence of the road crew but welcome nonetheless. Need some more artists to make a fuss I reckon.









						One Direction star takes up plight of roadies left jobless by coronavirus
					

Niall Horan says touring road crews have been forgotten by government




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## ska invita (Oct 13, 2020)




----------



## spitfire (Oct 13, 2020)

WTF?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 13, 2020)

Fuck. These. Cunts.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 15, 2020)

Developing your Creative Practice: What’s new 2020-21 | Arts Council England
					






					www.artscouncil.org.uk
				




Might be of use to some here?


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 15, 2020)

I might get to do sound for a gig on the 30th, but not holding my breath as we're about to move into tier 2 so by then it might not be allowed anymore.


----------



## editor (Oct 16, 2020)

HOW THE FUCK DO THEY GET £750,000?



> A dance music website and events company that will receive £750,000 as part of the government’s arts support grant scheme has defended its application after the amount was described as “unfathomable”.
> 
> Resident Advisor, an online platform that specialises in electronic music and club culture, released a statement on Wednesday explaining why it had asked for the sum, which was one of the most generous grants announced on Monday.
> 
> ...











						Dance music platform Resident Advisor defends £750,000 government grant
					

Decision process of arts support grants criticised after website awarded ‘unfathomable’ amount




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## editor (Oct 16, 2020)

Meanwhile


----------



## Supine (Oct 16, 2020)

editor said:


> HOW THE FUCK DO THEY GET £750,000?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I saw that and was shocked but then worked out 750k/56 employees = 13k per year. Not that much each.

Having said that it's an online site and they made money from leaching off events with ticket sales so don't approve.


----------



## Mation (Oct 16, 2020)

editor said:


> Meanwhile



How long could you breathe in one of those?


----------



## Sue (Oct 16, 2020)

Likewise with this. Fucking Secret Cinema. 









						Million-pound question: why save Secret Cinema while real cinemas are in ruins? | Marc Burrows
					

As affordable arts venues fight to survive, the exorbitant events company got a huge bailout. And film fans will pay the price




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 16, 2020)

Sue said:


> Likewise with this. Fucking Secret Cinema.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don’t think asking why (or the implied resentment) certain organisations _have_ received money is helpful. We should be focusing on why others haven’t.

Don’t let the divide and conquer tactics win here.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 16, 2020)

Yes, I know a couple of small venues who did get money, on the flip side I think pub who host gigs were  not eligible for this.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 16, 2020)

https://www.stagehand.org.uk/the-covid-19-crew--fund


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 16, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Yes, I know a couple of small venues who did get money, on the flip side I think pub who host gigs were  not eligible for this.


The Brudenell Social Club in Leeds got a handout, which is good news for Leeds punters


----------



## killer b (Oct 16, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Yes, I know a couple of small venues who did get money, on the flip side I think pub who host gigs were  not eligible for this.


A couple of pubs I know that host gigs got some cash - I guess it might depend how seriously they host gigs though, both of these places have dedicated gig rooms with a regular programme of local & national touring bands.


----------



## Sue (Oct 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I don’t think asking why (or the implied resentment) certain organisations _have_ received money is helpful. We should be focusing on why others haven’t.
> 
> Don’t let the divide and conquer tactics win here.


Sure, we shouldn't be fighting over who gets which scraps but arguing there should be more money to go around in the first place. The Secret Cinema thing still pisses me off though (but then it does in general so...)


----------



## Sue (Oct 16, 2020)

A few pubs/venues round here got some cash.








						Local venues welcome ‘vital’ grants from government’s Culture Recovery Fund
					

Arcola Theatre, Hackney Empire and Vortex Jazz Club among those to receive cash in first round of awards




					www.hackneycitizen.co.uk


----------



## spitfire (Oct 16, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Would be *staggered* if it does go ahead. Especially given people will be day drinking and the set up in that venue.
> 
> Don't get me wrong. I WANT events happening ASAP but this seems like false hope to me. Also unfair on the suppliers and people who are making plans, outlaying money, booking travel/accommodation etc etc...
> 
> What is happening to the industry is horrid but so is C19. If they (somehow) plough ahead despite the rising cases and deaths then they will be hurting the whole industry longer than the already crippling delays/postponements/cancellations.





spitfire said:


> Me too.
> 
> We're not doing it. Even if we had the budget I wouldn't expose myself or my co workers to the risk.



It gives me no pleasure to report that the inevitable has happened.









						London Craft Beer Festival 2022 - London Craft Beer Festival
					

12th — 13th August 2022. Tobacco Dock, London.




					londoncraftbeerfestival.co.uk
				




It is with extremely heavy hearts that we announce that we have been forced to postpone this year’s London Craft Beer Festival at Tobacco Dock until 2021.

With the recently announced Tier 2 higher restrictions in London, we cannot proceed with the festival in November and so we’ll be returning to our usual dates in 2021.

We have been working tirelessly, adapting to new rules, shapeshifting into an event that passes the many and constantly changing criteria to get the go-ahead. In September, we held a fantastic festival in Bristol, which only gave us more hope of pulling off an exciting event in London. We are gutted beyond belief to not be able to host you this year.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 16, 2020)

NEC to axe 450 jobs - half its workforce - after Covid hits events
					

The Birmingham NEC Group is to shed 450 jobs after being unable to hold large scale events since March




					www.birminghammail.co.uk
				




NEC group confirms it’s letting half its workforce go


----------



## Badgers (Oct 16, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> NEC to axe 450 jobs - half its workforce - after Covid hits events
> 
> 
> The Birmingham NEC Group is to shed 450 jobs after being unable to hold large scale events since March
> ...


FFS  that is brutal


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 18, 2020)

'We are meant to gather': organisers of global dance festival refuse to cancel – or give refunds
					

Ticket holders are angry that organisers insist the Global Eclipse festival will go ahead in Argentina, despite the government there banning international tourists




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 18, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> 'We are meant to gather': organisers of global dance festival refuse to cancel – or give refunds
> 
> 
> Ticket holders are angry that organisers insist the Global Eclipse festival will go ahead in Argentina, despite the government there banning international tourists
> ...


“This isn’t the community that you would expect a result like this from”

lol, these hippy capitalist cunts are _exactly_ the sort of group you’d expect this from.


----------



## Mation (Oct 18, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> 'We are meant to gather': organisers of global dance festival refuse to cancel – or give refunds
> 
> 
> Ticket holders are angry that organisers insist the Global Eclipse festival will go ahead in Argentina, despite the government there banning international tourists
> ...


I'm torn on that one. They're offering 50% refunds, based on having already paid crew. But it's difficult to see how they mean to go ahead safely if they're not telling anyone how!


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 18, 2020)

Especially because Argentina is getting 3-400 deaths a day at the moment and has banned tourists.


----------



## Mation (Oct 18, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Especially because Argentina is getting 3-400 deaths a day at the moment and has banned tourists.


Just had a look at the website and there is not one word on it about covid, that I could see


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 20, 2020)

Leeds International Film Festival is still going ahead


----------



## Badgers (Oct 20, 2020)

Orang Utan said:


> Leeds International Film Festival is still going ahead


FFS


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 20, 2020)

Badgers said:


> FFS


Well I’m going!


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 20, 2020)

Orang Utan said:


> Well I’m going!


What sort of scale is it? Venues/attendees etc?


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 20, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> What sort of scale is it? Venues/attendees etc?


Socially distanced in largish cinemas. Quite a lot of stuff is being shown online too. Only one venue concerns me as it's very small


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 20, 2020)

Orang Utan said:


> Socially distanced in largish cinemas. Quite a lot of stuff is being shown online too. Only one venue concerns me as it's very small


(I should add that the main venue is the Town Hall, which is massive, but still hard to get tickets for if you’re on your own)


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 21, 2020)

170,000 UK live music jobs lost by end of 2020 | IQ Magazine
					

Over 26,000 full-time and 144,000 FTE jobs will cease to exist before year's end without government help, new research by Live shows.




					www.iq-mag.net


----------



## editor (Oct 21, 2020)

Met Police get rightly slapped down Covid rules in London: Met ditches 'despotic' demand for venues to check ID


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Oct 25, 2020)

The Clapham Grand is open and doing gigs right now, Russell Howard tonight, some bands next week...

Guess with vastly reduced crowds and so on.

edit, yeah;


----------



## editor (Oct 25, 2020)

I went to a gig last night - 60 people max crowd and an actual band playing. It felt good.


----------



## Mation (Oct 25, 2020)

editor said:


> I went to a gig last night - 60 people max crowd and an actual band playing. It felt good.


Seated? Standing? Drinks? Groups?  How did it work?


----------



## editor (Oct 25, 2020)

Mation said:


> Seated? Standing? Drinks? Groups?  How did it work?


It was half in a railway arch so you could sit outside or inside and all drinks were by waiter service, with no standing.

So in theory so long as you kept outside you could mix in groups of up to 6 people, but if you went inside you could only sit with someone from your household. It was odd.


----------



## Mation (Oct 25, 2020)

editor said:


> It was half in a railway arch so you could sit outside or inside and all drinks were by waiter service, with no standing.
> 
> So in theory so long as you kept outside you could mix in groups of up to 6 people, but if you went inside you could only sit with someone from your household. It was odd.


Sounds like it was workable though, which is encouraging.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 25, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> The Clapham Grand is open and doing gigs right now, Russell Howard tonight, some bands next week...
> 
> Guess with vastly reduced crowds and so on.
> 
> ...


Pretty sure they ran a pilot gig a few month back for the governement and the outcome was that following the rules it didn't cover their overheads.
I guess with enough financial support than it can break even.


----------



## editor (Oct 26, 2020)

Here's some pics from Saturday's gig: 






















						In photos: live bands at the Neutral Zone event at Amp Studios, SE15, Sat 24th Oct 2020
					

On Saturday night, we were delighted to watch a  proper live gig at the excellent Amp Studios on the Old Kent Road, with Misty Miller and Dan Cross & The Paingivers playing on the bill.



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 27, 2020)

Intriguing new stuff today in Somerset News from a man called Ben Challis, described as 'general counsel' for Glastonbury Festival.




			
				Somerset News said:
			
		

> Ben Challis, general counsel for Glastonbury Festival, has revealed the current complex situation for the world-famous music event, including booking acts, touring schedules, virus testing measures and providing refunds.
> 
> Speaking on the latest Behind The Noise podcast, he said: "At Glastonbury Festival, we are still looking at June 2021.



... and then he goes into more detail about the complications. Amongst other stuff mainly relating to band-booking (and rebooking!) logistics, he also says this :



			
				Challis in Somerset News said:
			
		

> "We as a festival do look at the vaccine as the solution," he said.
> "However, Melvin Benn, who runs Festival Republic, looked at this idea of minimising risk by having pre-show tests of your audience.
> "You would have to have a negative result pre-show, and then have a temperature check on the gate.
> "So you say everybody has to be tested at home, or on the way down you get tested, it would be a huge logistical thing but its possible, so 99.99 per cent of people there would be covid-free.
> "Is it any less safe than anything else we do in life?"


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 27, 2020)

If I had to bet right now I'd say Glastonbury (or any other major festival) won't happen next year. I hope I'm wrong but we're approaching the cutoff for getting a lot of things into place.


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 27, 2020)

Also , from last week, (22nd October), Somerset News has Michael Eavis discussing (at the Wells Festival of Literature) a bunch of stuff about testing festival attenders.

He adds caveats at the end of the above about how GF might well still not happen -- he's all along been more pessimistic than Emily about next year's prospects ....


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 27, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> If I had to bet right now I'd say Glastonbury (or any other major festival) won't happen next year. I hope I'm wrong but we're approaching the cutoff for getting a lot of things into place.



I tend to agree really (  ), but both the above stories are recent.

Both Mr Challis and Mr Eavis are adding various cautious phrases, correctly so.

But they also want to do the best they can. They're not going to annouce a full cancellation unti they have to, and what it really seems that they're doing is vaccine focussed, or testing focussed, or both.

I'm on a several-pint bet with a (John Peel Stage crewing) mate here in Swansea, about both vaccines *AND* Glastonbury in 2021, he wants me to win , and I think he will win 

But nothing's ruled out yet -- that's why I'm keeping a big eye on it in all still.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 27, 2020)

The timescale for a vaccine saving the 2021 festival simply doesn't work.


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 27, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The timescale for a vaccine saving the 2021 festival simply doesn't work.



You could *very* well be right, and I fear that myself . 

But there've been *hugely* varying predictions, including in science and medical journals, about how soon a safe vaccine might be approved.

The real issue is the logistics and timing of distribution/availability of any vaccines. 

But the desparation of Governments to be able to distribute vaccinations, and all the money that's gone into research and programmes, could (IMO) leave the door still _a bit_ open to surprising us next year, Possibly.

Anyway, both Mr Challis and Mr Eavis were talking as well about testing, not just vaccines .......


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 28, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> The real issue is the logistics and timing of distribution/availability of any vaccines.


It’s more a case of priority. Getting people into a field to listen to some music is - rightly - going to be way down the list when it comes to dishing out a vaccine. Which doesn’t even exist yet.


----------



## eightball (Oct 28, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> 170,000 UK live music jobs lost by end of 2020 | IQ Magazine
> 
> 
> Over 26,000 full-time and 144,000 FTE jobs will cease to exist before year's end without government help, new research by Live shows.
> ...


Bees, I'm trying to find a group/organisation who are helping people in your industry which I can make regular donations to. I've just heard about stagehand.org.uk, do you know if they're good or if not who else?


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 28, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It’s more a case of priority. Getting people into a field to listen to some music is - rightly - going to be way down the list when it comes to dishing out a vaccine. Which doesn’t even exist yet.



At *no point whatsoever* have I argued that festival-goers should be _prioritised_ (over others) for any vaccine! 

Some of my stuff above relates to other thoughts I had about vaccine-prospects more generally -- but that's probably better off in a different thread anyway, tbf  

I mainly brought vaccine stuff up here because Glastonbury people --Challis and Eavis -- raised the thing, and I thought the story might be of interest.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 29, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> At *no point whatsoever* have I argued that festival-goers should be _prioritised_ (over others) for any vaccine!
> 
> Some of my stuff above relates to other thoughts I had about vaccine-prospects more generally -- but that's probably better off in a different thread anyway, tbf
> 
> I mainly brought vaccine stuff up here because Glastonbury people --Challis and Eavis -- raised the thing, and I thought the story might be of interest.


Hate to be a pessimist (again) here guys. Am in discussions with venues who are already looking to postpone/cancel high footfall events in June 2021. 

These include some events that have government 'support for international trade' reasons/backing.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 29, 2020)

eightball said:


> Bees, I'm trying to find a group/organisation who are helping people in your industry which I can make regular donations to. I've just heard about stagehand.org.uk, do you know if they're good or if not who else?


Stagehand is good 





__





						PSA Welfare & Benevolent Fund
					

Raise money, support your friends, give to a cause. Show you care.



					www.justgiving.com


----------



## eightball (Oct 29, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Stagehand is good
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks, I'll get on it and spread the word.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 1, 2020)

And so we roll into 2021...









						Tour Down Under 2021 cancelled due to coronavirus concerns
					

The first WorldTour event of next year has been called off as the global pandemic rumbles on




					www.cyclingweekly.com


----------



## editor (Nov 4, 2020)

Hopeful stuff: 


*Camden Winter Beer Hall is a new socially distanced craft beer and street food festival launching after lockdown 2.0*

*Camden Winter Beer Hall* is here to give you something to look forward to after lockdown with its socially distanced beer festival packed with independent UK craft ales, Bavarian street food, live brass bands and party DJs. Launching on *Friday 4th December* at *Camden*’s *Electric Ballroom* and running until *February 2021*, sessions are available for groups of four, five and six people for just £15 per person from *camdenwinterbeerhall.com*. _Should the current lockdown be extended then tickets for affected shows will be switched to a date of your choice from the remaining 3 month schedule._

For this carefully curated event, the *Electric Ballroom* in the heart of *Camden* will be fully transformed into an escapist beer hall with festive snowy decor and warming winter atmospheres that provide a safe haven from the weather for fulsome food and drinking sessions. For your safety and comfort, there will be sessions each Friday and Saturday evening from 5:30pm - 10pm and a Saturday afternoon session from midday to 4:30pm. _Bookings will be limited to 6 people per group and from the same household._

Each session will come with its own cheery soundtrack from live ‘drum and brass’ crew *No Limit Street Band* who will play a mix of party covers, dance music brass renditions and festive hits to get the good times flowing. DJ collectives such as *Club De Fromage* will also lineup up throughout the season to get your feet tapping and heads bopping.

This boutique event aims to support UK indie brewers in these difficult times so there will be five of the very best serving up a selection of their finest craft ales for your delectation. Expect pale ales, milk stouts and sour fruit beers while hot mulled wine and ciders will also be available to warm you to your core.

To go with the delicious drops will be some awesome eats from *Brat Bros*, who are specialists in a range of gourmet Bratwurst, Weisswurst, Veganwurst and fries. You can also look forward to freshly baked pretzels with sweet mustard sauce, churros with a selection of sweet sauces including peanut and chocolate and much more besides.

*These cosy sessions are designed to offer you a little solace this winter and are sure to sell out, so get your group booked in now. Groups of four, five and six people can book for just £15 per person from camdenwinterbeerhall.com.*

*Should the current lockdown be extended then tickets for affected shows will be switched to a date of your choice from the remaining 3 month schedule. *


----------



## spitfire (Nov 4, 2020)

IFE is so big they only hold it every 2 years so quite a big deal. 









						Welcome
					

IFE sits at the heart of the food & drink community, welcoming retailers, wholesalers & foodservice professionals to source products across the three day event.




					www.ife.co.uk
				






> Dear Mr Fire,
> 
> I hope you are keeping well.
> 
> ...


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 4, 2020)

2021 really isn’t going to be the restart everyone hoped for, is it?


----------



## spitfire (Nov 4, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> 2021 really isn’t going to be the restart everyone hoped for, is it?



Doesn't look like it. Certainly for the mega events.


----------



## Sunray (Nov 4, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> 2021 really isn’t going to be the restart everyone hoped for, is it?



Someone needs to ring all the festivals and tell them 2021 is cancelled.  
There are some gigs for late next year (november) I want to happen but I didn't book because its just a merry go around.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 4, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Someone needs to ring all the festivals and tell them 2021 is cancelled.
> There are some gigs for late next year (november) I want to happen but I didn't book because its just a merry go around.


I’ve got tickets for a theatre show (Penn & Teller) in June. I’m not exactly hopeful.


----------



## Sunray (Nov 4, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’ve got tickets for a theatre show (Penn & Teller) in June. I’m not exactly hopeful.


cool I’d go to that, would be great.  
On topic this


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 8, 2020)

Billy Bragg one of the first I've seen to start moving (already cancelled once) 2021 dates into 2022.


----------



## miss direct (Nov 8, 2020)

New years eve will be even shitter than usual.


----------



## Looby (Nov 8, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Someone needs to ring all the festivals and tell them 2021 is cancelled.
> There are some gigs for late next year (november) I want to happen but I didn't book because its just a merry go around.


I’ve just booked a weekender for November to give me something to look forward to. I’m guessing the two gigs  I’ve got rebooked for spring will be moved/cancelled. Fuck knows if any summer festivals will happen but I am hopeful for EOTR in September, that might just go ahead.


----------



## Sunray (Nov 9, 2020)

I don't think you're alone in this thought.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> View attachment 238034
> 
> Billy Bragg one of the first I've seen to start moving (already cancelled once) 2021 dates into 2022.


 shite 

As mentioned before (possibly in this thread) a lot of spring/summer 'not music' events are being cancelled/postponed in spring/summer 2021. I get the feeling that pushing events/gigs back to 2022 at least lets the venues, organsiers, public/trade, contractors and others plan rather than just hope...


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 9, 2020)

Badgers said:


> shite
> 
> As mentioned before (possibly in this thread) a lot of spring/summer 'not music' events are being cancelled/postponed in spring/summer 2021. I get the feeling that pushing events/gigs back to 2022 at least lets the venues, organsiers, public/trade, contractors and others plan rather than just hope...


We have lots of events booked in at the uni from late Jan, but every single one has been designed as a “hybrid” model, with built in plans to roll back to entirely online if required.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> We have lots of events booked in at the uni from late Jan, but every single one has been designed as a “hybrid” model, with built in plans to roll back to entirely online if required.


Have been in lot of webinars about online events and most people don't consider them a replacement for live events. I want events to return but selling tickets for an event that might go online is hardly the same experience is it?


----------



## Cloo (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> 2021 really isn’t going to be the restart everyone hoped for, is it?


No - but I think people will be planning for more of some of the sorts of outdoor,  distanced events trialled this year so there should be more opportunities. They'll be pricey though, and I don't put good odds on us having a super dry spring and summer two years in a row


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 9, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Have been in lot of webinars about online events and most people don't consider them a replacement for live events. I want events to return but selling tickets for an event that might go online is hardly the same experience is it?


These are all very much of the academic variety, with a few medical ones too. I guess “conference” more than “event”, papers being presented etc, so will work either way, hopefully.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> These are all very much of the academic variety, with a few medical ones too. I guess “conference” more than “event”, papers being presented etc, so will work either way, hopefully.


You are right. 

I am talking more about exhibitions, gigs, festivals and such. 

We did some trials and were getting about 5% engagement compared to a live audience.


----------



## Pickman's model (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> And so we roll into 2021...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


then we'll trundle into twenty-two


----------



## 2hats (Nov 9, 2020)

Pickman's model said:


> then we'll trundle into twenty-two


I don't expect to go to a festival again until 2022.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 9, 2020)

Just to add the companies I spoke to about 'virtual' events wanted tens of thousands to set up and deliver.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 9, 2020)

Badgers said:


> You are right.
> 
> I am talking more about exhibitions, gigs, festivals and such.
> 
> We did some trials and were getting about 5% engagement compared to a live audience.


Yeah, we’ve played with various platforms for exhibition type events and they all without exception suck balls.

Concerts we need to find a solution to as live performance is part of the music students assessed degree work. We’ve got kit now to do HD multi camera streaming with high quality audio, so hopefully that will do for those. We could do paid gigs with the same tech but it’s a case of having to be realistic about what punters are prepared to pay.



Badgers said:


> Just to add the companies I spoke to about 'virtual' events wanted tens of thousands to set up and deliver.


What sort of events? I have access to a nice virtual conference platform developed in house here at the uni if you want a quote


----------



## Cloo (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> These are all very much of the academic variety, with a few medical ones too. I guess “conference” more than “event”, papers being presented etc, so will work either way, hopefully.


I don't think my organisation is planning on any domestic in-person events next year. They're touting their next big international conference in Middle East in Jan 2022, but they have had some in-person events in China already


----------



## klang (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> View attachment 238034
> 
> Billy Bragg one of the first I've seen to start moving (already cancelled once) 2021 dates into 2022.


just about lucky, Aus and NZ.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> What sort of events? I have access to a nice virtual conference platform developed in house here at the uni if you want a quote


Would be interested  

PM on way


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 11, 2020)

2021 Tour de Yorkshire has just cancelled.


----------



## editor (Nov 13, 2020)

Sigh. 









						Brixton’s Windmill music venue in ‘imminent danger of permanent closure’ say the Music Venue Trust
					

The Music Venue Trust (MVT) charity have been in touch with Brixton Buzz to warn that the iconic Windmill venue in Brixton has been listed as one of thirty UK venues marked as being in ‘immin…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## editor (Nov 20, 2020)

The misery never fucking ends 









						UK music industry will halve in size due to Covid, says report
					

Growth of 11% in 2019 predicted to reverse this year with collapse of live sector




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## William of Walworth (Nov 20, 2020)

I initially posted this into the Boomtown thread on the festivals subforum, because the discussion there was becoming quite general.

But I think the festival-relevant part of vaccine  discussions is better off to chat about on this thread -- here we go.
(TLDR?? : Some fests may happen next year IMO    )

====================================================================================================
My cautious!!! level of optimism concerning next year's events is not _just_ based on vaccines  -- although those could/should be hugely important obviously.

I've been following some details about the Oxford/AstraZeneca one for instance, and unlike the recent announcements , they're being sensibly very cautious so far in Oxford, before they announce much  -- further delay on revealing their prelimary stats in today's news, for instance.

They will, though, be able to supply much larger quantities for the UK  than the US ones. Also cheaper, and more easily refridgerated 

As well, there are many *other* ways, beyond vaccines, of applying safety measures for festivals and similar events.

For example,  temperature checks on entry for everyone attending -- maybe beyond entry point as well.

And if there are properly quick/reliable Covid tests actually available by summer, events can insist on people taking them both ahead of the event (and requiring people to show proof of negative when they arrive) *and *upon entry.

Plus all the obvious hygiene measures -- possible even at festivals!
(I suppose the distancing thing is the awkward 'bit' mind  -- see above though!)

Reducing size if events in quite a big way, is something I'd be amazed doesn't happen, Glastonbury and Boomtown very much included.

I actually agree with Sunray , Badgers , bees etc. about a lot of the pessimism, but I'm not sure *+YET+* that any of you, or others, are allowing enough for the _possibility_ of better -- even quicker -- developments overall than expected.

I keep *kicking myself* to stop being over-optimistic, often failing , but the emergence of various vaccine news is making that hard 

Maybe it *MAY* be that people are forgetting**, with vaccines, that the amount of capital(ism  ) and concentrated effort going into not just the research but also logistics and supply chains, is fucking huge! 

**And even the possibility (??  ) that people are _slightly_ underestimating our utterly incompetent Government's determination to get the population vaccinated, and failure levels there may end up being somewhere under 95%


----------



## Badgers (Nov 20, 2020)

I feel like am constantly pissing on your positivity WoW  don't want to but having been in the industry so long I speak to people and venues and such. 

Also am working quite closely with organisations who have a 'lot' to lose. For me and you missing a preferred festival is a lot to lose but by comparison to some of the companies in the event/festival sector it is a small part of their businesses. Spoke to the UKs biggest event supplier yesterday and they have laid off 75% of their staff. 

Spoke to the Institute of Export last week about the vaccines. They said it was almost impossible that Brexit would slow the shipment into this country, but they understand the first roll out will take a few months from approval to completion. That is more with the local logistics and planning/prioritising. 

So it is not a magic wand to sort this and reopen live events sadly 

Without further being a misery to all... 

Festival's are not this government's priority. They will focus more on sports and theatre first. Then make festival organisers and councils jump through endless expensive hoops just to get a licence. Then there is a risk of a spike/wave for the organiser and staff to worry about. 

It is fucking shit.


----------



## colacubes (Nov 20, 2020)

William of Walworth I was mid posting when Badgers posted but your wide eyed optimism is lovely but completely unfounded, and frankly insulting for those who work in the industry. I mean it’s sad some festivals aren’t going to happen but people are losing their actual livelihoods here and your speculation about vaccines and temperature checks is for the birds at this point.


----------



## William of Walworth (Nov 20, 2020)

colacubes : I think that's a little bit too over-critical of some of the points I was trying to make, but please understand as well, that I do my best to understand how tough things are for everyone working -- and not  -- in the events industry today.

My biggest sympathies are for everyone who might lose their job in live music and all live events 

I had no intention to insult anyone, but accept my apologies please, if my post read like that  

I do genuinely think that vaccination prospects for next year are of some relevance on this at least -- that was the more serious part of my post.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 20, 2020)

Cheers WoW  

You know that me and colacubes want festivals too  

Admire your optimism and hope you are right. Just trying to keep people's expectations realistic. Vaccines are important but they are a massive 'logistical' project and festival take a lot of planning. 

If I was trying to get a summer 2021 festival organised now there are already contractors bills and staff to pay before the cost of artists. There is not enough confidence to front the money. Pile Brexit on top of that shit and is a shit state of affairs my friend. 

Festivals will return but I fear 2021 will mostly be a write off despite of any vaccines in the pipeline.


----------



## Sunray (Nov 20, 2020)

Hey, I want to go back to a big crowded sweaty event as much as anyone who enjoys them.


Badgers said:


> Cheers WoW
> 
> You know that me and colacubes want festivals too
> 
> ...



Totally agree.

If you plan for 2022 you might come out the other side, plan for 2021 the risks are massive.    Michael Evis (bit doddery and weird these days) has said if it's Glastonbury isn't on 2021 it'll never be on again. I wrote to them suggesting setting up a crowd funder, I'd give them money.  I helped a few places. They wrote back thanking me for the support.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 20, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Hey, I want to go back to a big crowded sweaty event as much as anyone who enjoys them.
> 
> 
> Totally agree.
> ...


Each festival/show is different. A few have just given up, some have been able to have a 'sabbatical' and others are blowing in the breeze. 

Glasto can probably afford to skip another year more than most/all UK festivals. It does depend on the Eavis family appetite to keep going. 

Equally there are a lot of traders (not just burger vans) who get most their income from the festival/event circuit and that is gone. Also a lot of us event professionals are signing (or have signed) out the industry. 

Again my point is that theatre, sports stadia and corporate gigs will come first. Festivals will come second


----------



## William of Walworth (Nov 21, 2020)

Badgers : Fair caution there, in post 1,023 (and the others).
 I hope at least some of your predictions are wrong, but I completely get why you're saying these things -- your insight makes plenty of sense from a being correctly-cautious POV......

There's a little bit of scope for more hope in terms of small (aka tiny) events for 2021.
Gail Something-Else, of Something-Else fests, has recently changed her mind towards _planning_ to restore as many of her mini-fests as she can next year 

(No links -- Gail's personal FB page above, also her events FB page, are ridiculously busy  )


----------



## mx wcfc (Nov 21, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Again my point is that theatre, sports stadia and corporate gigs will come first. Festivals will come second


How can events like that be approved and not festivals?  I have come around to the view that next year's festivals may be under threat still, but if you can allow an indoor theatre to open for a play, you can allow it to open for a gig.  If you can allow a few thousand people into a football ground, you can allow a few thousand people into a festival.  (yeah ok, on the whole football fans don't tend to camp at the ground all weekend!)

IF (and that's a big IF, I know) a significant proportion of the population (or at least the most at risk people) have been vaccinated by, say, the end of May, why shouldn't festivals be allowed? Maybe the bigger, earlier ones (Bearded and Glasto?) may be impossible, but ffs give me some hope for the smaller, DIY, festivals.


----------



## William of Walworth (Nov 21, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Hey, I want to go back to a big crowded sweaty event as much as anyone who enjoys them.







> If you plan for 2022 you might come out the other side, plan for 2021 the risks are massive.    *Michael Eavis (bit doddery and weird these days) has said if it's Glastonbury isn't on 2021 it'll never be on again*. I wrote to them suggesting setting up a crowd funder, I'd give them money.  I helped a few places. They wrote back thanking me for the support.



I remember that comment from Michael, but wasn't it a good while ago -- round about June?? -- that he said it?

A good way back in this thread, I linked to a couple of stories from the Somerset News, where he, and the man who's Glastonbury Festival's lawyer, were talking a lot more sense. Maybe from October, those articles?
(   -- I can't now find my posts with the links, sorry)

The Glastonbury men were both being pretty cautious and caveat-laden, but they did offer some serious-sounding stuff about how it was _not impossible_ that Glastonbury might return in 2021.

No doubt in quite a different form TBF!


----------



## Badgers (Nov 21, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> How can events like that be approved and not festivals


They are more corporate


----------



## Supine (Nov 21, 2020)

Next year i'd be comfortable going to festivals with less than 1000 people. I've decided. 

Small festivals have no crowds to push through. Lots of space. Larger festivals always have at least some places where social distancing isn't possible. 

I really want to dance in a field again.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 21, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> How can events like that be approved and not festivals?  I have come around to the view that next year's festivals may be under threat still, but if you can allow an indoor theatre to open for a play, you can allow it to open for a gig.  If you can allow a few thousand people into a football ground, you can allow a few thousand people into a festival.  (yeah ok, on the whole football fans don't tend to camp at the ground all weekend!)


Put simply, a venue like a theatre or sports ground can control the movement/arrival/contact of people in a way a festival just can’t.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Nov 21, 2020)

As much as I'd like to go to a festival next year the social distancing control is not achievable as it would be in theatres or stadiums with all seated attendance. 
The other thing is that by end of spring and into summer my most hopeful vaccination programme outcome is that frontline staff (NHS and care) and a portion or possibly most of the vulnerable cohort would have had it; the rest of the population will still be quite a long way away from receiving it.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 21, 2020)

Also remember the vaccine isn’t going to be a magic bullet. There will still have to be a lengthy transition period where it’s true effectiveness can be assessed. Companies may need to rebuild. Confidence has to be restored. Festivals (as we know them) should - if things work - be possible in 2022. Next year? Not so much.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Nov 22, 2020)

Something to mull over with regards to things returning to normal, this week the boss of Qantas has stated that they are working on the premise of not flying to Europe or the US until late 2021 at the earliest. They currently have a bubble with New Zealand and are looking to open bubbles with places such as Korea, but it will be a very long time until we can go back to how things were before.


----------



## 2hats (Nov 22, 2020)

They have been stating that for almost a month now. Also, ferrying brand new 787-9s straight into storage in the desert (Victorville).

Most of their Dreamliner fleet is now parked up there with their A380s.


----------



## Orang Utan (Nov 23, 2020)

I found this very interesting:




__





						plague raves: what where they thinking
					

When Dixon played in Tunisia in August, he was sending out a clear message that the economic interests of high-profile DJs are worth taking…




					businessteshno.medium.com


----------



## spitfire (Nov 23, 2020)

From: https://assets.publishing.service.g...ent_data/file/937529/COVID-19_Winter_Plan.pdf

Link will open a PDF

The Government will also introduce spectator capacity limits for sports stadia, business events and live performances in tiers where these are permitted. These limits will vary depending on whether the event is held indoors or out. At tier 1 these will be 50% capacity or 4,000 outdoors and 1,000 indoors, whichever is lower and at tier 2 these will be 50% capacity or 2,000 outdoors and 1,000 indoors, whichever is lower.

This is a change from before isn't it? I know it won't help events be financially viable but this wasn't allowed previously as far as I remember?


----------



## Teaboy (Nov 23, 2020)

spitfire said:


> From: https://assets.publishing.service.g...ent_data/file/937529/COVID-19_Winter_Plan.pdf
> 
> Link will open a PDF
> 
> ...



Yup, its new.  All tier dependent though.


----------



## spitfire (Nov 23, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Yup, its new.  All tier dependent though.



Thanks, I do remember some events being held in a social distance stylee but none were this big. Hmm...


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 23, 2020)

spitfire said:


> From: https://assets.publishing.service.g...ent_data/file/937529/COVID-19_Winter_Plan.pdf
> 
> Link will open a PDF
> 
> The Government will also introduce spectator capacity limits for sports stadia, business events and live performances in tiers where these are permitted. These limits will vary depending on whether the event is held indoors or out. At tier 1 these will be 50% capacity or 4,000 outdoors and 1,000 indoors, whichever is lower and at tier 2 these will be 50% capacity or 2,000 outdoors and 1,000 indoors, whichever is lower.


Oh god.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 23, 2020)

Can’t wait to see how that’s actually going to work in real venues.


----------



## clicker (Nov 23, 2020)

What happens if , as a venue in tier 1 , a 4000 event is planned and sold. But then the area moves into tier 2 before it takes place? However, either way, too soon and toilets.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 23, 2020)

It’s a simplistic load of bollocks with no reference to actual practicalities of venue layouts, facilities and access.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 23, 2020)

In short - anyone reading this who sees it as a green light for _safe_ gigs is deluded.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 23, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It’s a simplistic load of bollocks with no reference to actual practicalities of venue layouts, facilities and access.


Yup. Again sounds negative but this works for only a few venues/set ups. It will either be taken advantage of and people will get sick. Or places with money will get something and others nothing.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 23, 2020)

An example - I book crew and generally look after a 120 capacity “indie” venue.

So, woohoo, assuming B’ham drops to tier 2 we can open at 50 capacity. For half the bands who play there that will be a record crowd.

But.

The gig room is accessed via a narrow staircase and then down a small corridor. The toilets are accessed off that corridor. It’s a bottle neck when quiet, even with just 50 punters it will be impossible to have any sort of distancing.

So, what to do? Open up and knowingly put people at risk? Or stay closed and risk financial ruin for the venue and the crew?

Answers on a postcard...


----------



## killer b (Nov 23, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> An example - I book crew and generally look after a 120 capacity “indie” venue.
> 
> So, woohoo, assuming B’ham drops to tier 2 we can open at 50 capacity. For half the bands who play there that will be a record crowd.
> 
> ...


They can't sell booze without a meal anyway, so there's probably no point opening


----------



## klang (Nov 23, 2020)

killer b said:


> They can't sell booze without a meal anyway, so there's probably no point opening


a perfect residency for Hot Chip.


----------



## editor (Nov 23, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> An example - I book crew and generally look after a 120 capacity “indie” venue.
> 
> So, woohoo, assuming B’ham drops to tier 2 we can open at 50 capacity. For half the bands who play there that will be a record crowd.
> 
> ...


You can't open it mate. You'd never forgive yourself if that lack of space created a mini-spreader event and someone got seriously ill.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 23, 2020)

editor said:


> You can't open it mate. You'd never forgive yourself if that lack of space created a mini-spreader event and someone got seriously ill.


I know. So I have to ring round all the crew and tell them that light at the end of the tunnel was actually a train.

I hate this government with every fibre of my being.


----------



## platinumsage (Nov 25, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> An example - I book crew and generally look after a 120 capacity “indie” venue.
> 
> So, woohoo, assuming B’ham drops to tier 2 we can open at 50 capacity. For half the bands who play there that will be a record crowd.
> 
> ...



Surely the gig room has another access route - fire escape? You could have a one way system and with only 50 people you could set up toilet queue upstairs.

50 people isn't a lot to manage. Is the ventilation good? That's the main thing.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 25, 2020)

platinumsage said:


> Surely the gig room has another access route - fire escape? You could have a one way system and with only 50 people you could set up toilet queue upstairs.
> 
> 50 people isn't a lot to manage. Is the ventilation good? That's the main thing.


I suspect Bees knows the venue and had explored the options.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 25, 2020)

platinumsage said:


> Surely the gig room has another access route - fire escape? You could have a one way system and with only 50 people you could set up toilet queue upstairs.
> 
> 50 people isn't a lot to manage. Is the ventilation good? That's the main thing.


It’s hard to explain without a drawing of the exact layout, but the route to the toilets crosses the route into the room if that makes any sense. There’s no way of implementing any sort of one way that doesn’t impact on another iyswim.


----------



## editor (Nov 25, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It’s hard to explain without a drawing of the exact layout, but the route to the toilets crosses the route into the room if that makes any sense. There’s no way of implementing any sort of one way that doesn’t impact on another iyswim.


Plus as soon as beer is added to the mix, people start shedding common sense and all gathering around for a chat.


----------



## editor (Nov 26, 2020)

People - and venues - are going to take the piss with this because it's so uselessly vague 









						Substantial meal or a snack with your pint? Brixton heads into confusing Tier 2 Covid-19 restrictions.
					

As expected, London has been classified under the Tier 2 ‘High Alert’ Covid-19 restrictions from Dec 2nd, 2020. Pubs and bars must stay closed unless operating as restaurants, meaning t…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Nov 26, 2020)

editor said:


> People - and venues - are going to take the piss with this because it's so uselessly vague
> 
> 
> 
> ...






> hospitality businesses selling food or drink for consumption on their premises are required to:
> 
> provide table service only, in premises which sell alcohol
> *close between 11pm and 5am (hospitality venues in airports, ports, transport services and motorway service areas are exempt)*
> stop taking orders after 10pm



Buy a £9.99 Ryanair ticket to anywhere, hit the Spoons after security at Stansted, drink as long as you want, then leave the airport. Drink all night for a £9.99 entry fee


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 26, 2020)

Well, back to tier 3 here in B’ham, so that’s another set of venue plans out the window.


----------



## editor (Nov 26, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Well, back to tier 3 here in B’ham, so that’s another set of venue plans out the window.


Sorry to hear that. I'm still totally fucked for DJ/band work and haven't had any work since March this year. It's getting hard to keep the spirits up sometimes.


----------



## editor (Nov 28, 2020)

The Clapham Grand are going for it! Clapham Grand reopens with month of events throughout December – see the full listings here


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Nov 28, 2020)

editor said:


> The Clapham Grand are going for it! Clapham Grand reopens with month of events throughout December – see the full listings here


are the new rules making it "sustainable"?


----------



## killer b (Nov 28, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> are the new rules making it "sustainable"?


more likely the 300 grand arts council grant they were recently awarded tbh


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Nov 28, 2020)

ah yes, that would help.
A bit worried my 2 hours of sound teching booked for the next 2 saturdays will not actually happen despite being in tier 2.


----------



## killer b (Nov 28, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> ah yes, that would help.
> A bit worried my 2 hours of sound teching booked for the next 2 saturdays will not actually happen despite being in tier 2.


I'd say if the venue you're booked at doesn't have an arts council rescue grant, they're going to struggle to make it pay - some might be prepared to subsidise it themselves and do it anyway, but it's not sustainable on the numbers they'll be able to get through the doors alone.


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## Badgers (Nov 29, 2020)

Fuck the fuck off


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 29, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Fuck the fuck off



Oh for fucks sake.


COME ON TURKEYS, CLAP FOR XMAS


----------



## editor (Nov 29, 2020)

killer b said:


> more likely the 300 grand arts council grant they were recently awarded tbh


That won't go very far for a venue of that size that has more or less been closed for eight months. And how the fuck Pop Brixton managed to get nearly a quarter of a million from that same fund is anyone's guess. At least the Grand puts on regular gigs and shows every week.


----------



## pesh (Nov 29, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Fuck the fuck off



We've destroyed the entire UK touring industry, now get over yourselves and do our little pub gig, it'll be great 'exposure'


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Nov 29, 2020)

pesh said:


> We've destroyed the entire UK touring industry, now get over yourselves and do our little pub gig, it'll be great 'exposure'


can't beat XP points for payment.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Nov 30, 2020)

Isle of Man has cancelled the TT for next year


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Nov 30, 2020)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Isle of Man has cancelled the TT for next year


For those who don’t know, that would have been in June. Don’t make any summer plans just yet


----------



## spitfire (Nov 30, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> For those who don’t know, that would have been in June. Don’t make any summer plans just yet



I've watched bits of it on tv a few times but don't know a huge amount about the logistics, they basically take over the whole island as far as I can see? I guess they'd have to make quite an early call if so.


----------



## Supine (Nov 30, 2020)

Isle of man is almost untouched by covid. It's not surprising they want to keep it that way.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 7, 2020)

Nick Cave has cancelled his 2021 tour.



> We are very disappointed to announce that the Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds 2021 UK and European tour can no longer go ahead due to the ongoing situation with Covid-19.
> 
> The complexity and scale of the tour we had planned, combined with the continued uncertainty around the pandemic means that despite the hard work of everyone involved we have not been able to guarantee that the shows can happen.
> 
> ...


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 7, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Nick Cave has cancelled his 2021 tour.


  
I was mainly expecting another (lengthy) postponement, but not a full-on cancellation!!! 

(we had tickets for his rearranged Cardiff gig in April 2021, was originally early May 2020)


----------



## Looby (Dec 7, 2020)

I was expecting the Nick Cave tour to be rescheduled but gutted it’s cancelled.

I wouldn’t have been keen to go to Birmingham in April for the rearranged date if it was going ahead.


----------



## Voley (Dec 8, 2020)

WoW mentioning temperature checks to get access has made me wonder about how effective they are. If you're asymptomatic do you just get waved through to infect everyone?


----------



## gosub (Dec 8, 2020)

Looby said:


> I was expecting the Nick Cave tour to be rescheduled but gutted it’s cancelled.
> 
> I wouldn’t have been keen to go to Birmingham in April for the rearranged date if it was going ahead.



Bollocks Lisbon was going to be one of my make up for 2020 things


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 8, 2020)

Voley said:


> WoW mentioning temperature checks to get access has made me wonder about how effective they are. If you're asymptomatic do you just get waved through to infect everyone?



I get your question definitely --it was a while ago that I mentioned it though.

Having thought about it a bit more now .... 
For festivals, I doubt it would ever be possible or sensible just to do temp checks on their own. They would have to be combined with earlier actual Covid tests, with people being expected to show proof of negative on arrival, and also having an instant test on entry. Presuming those could be available by summer.

All too compl;icated most likely. I'm going through much more pessimistic   mode atm anyway , after the Nick Cave news 

And I'm trying to postpone thoughts about how vaccination might affect stuff for the better .... maybe (if I'm *really* pessimistic!  ), until winter 2021


----------



## Voley (Dec 8, 2020)

Yeah it's an odd one. They are doing it at football matches etc though. Perhaps it's an 'it's better than nothing' sort of measure. At least it's going to pick up symptomatic people.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 8, 2020)

Voley said:


> Yeah it's an odd one. They are doing it at football matches etc though. Perhaps it's an 'it's better than nothing' sort of measure. At least it's going to pick up symptomatic people.



No measure is 100% effective - it's always about degrees of risk. I think a quick but not very accurate measure like that is probably useful if there are low levels of infection generally, not so much if they're high and spreading.


----------



## Voley (Dec 8, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I get your question definitely --it was a while ago that I mentioned it though.
> 
> Having thought about it a bit more now ....
> For festivals, I doubt it would ever be possible or sensible just to do temp checks on their own. They would have to be combined with earlier actual Covid tests, with people being expected to show proof of negative on arrival, and also having an instant test on entry. Presuming those could be available by summer.
> ...


I'm meant to be seeing The Specials in September. I'd say that's unlikely. I mean, there's a chance it might be on, but if I haven't had the jab I doubt I'd consider it safe.

Some of the things that have been allowed to go ahead haven't been a good idea. All that 'Eat out to help out' nonsense. Plainly dangerous at that point. If opening gig venues / packing people into festivals starts happening when there's still high levels if infection I'll be giving it all a wide berth.


----------



## Voley (Dec 8, 2020)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> No measure is 100% effective - it's always about degrees of risk. I think a quick but not very accurate measure like that is probably useful if there are low levels of infection generally, not so much if they're high and spreading.


Yeah,that makes sense.

I had my temperature taken at a football match here in Cornwall where we've escaped high levels of infection. It was a reassuring measure, if nothing else.


----------



## mr steev (Dec 8, 2020)

I think temperature tests at festivals would throw up loads of other problems. Would you just lose your ticket money? What if you have a temp for another reason? Potential to sue the festival? What happens in situations where one person with a temp means the other members of their party also couldn't attend? Would they all have to lose their ticket money too?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 8, 2020)

mr steev said:


> I think temperature tests at festivals would throw up loads of other problems. Would you just lose your ticket money? What if you have a temp for another reason? Potential to sue the festival? What happens in situations where one person with a temp means the other members of their party also couldn't attend? Would they all have to lose their ticket money too?


It’s things like this that mean - short of a miraculous turnaround in infection rates - festivals aren’t going to happen in 2021. The legal/insurance issues put too much risk onto the organisers.


----------



## spitfire (Dec 8, 2020)

Exactly. Too many grey areas, H&S always aims for the lowest common denominator and assumes the worst so I just can’t see anything of any size happening next year.

Who would sign it off? That’s what it ultimately comes down to. Someone has to stake their entire professional life on a “hope for the best” situation. Ain’t gonna happen. Not at scale. 

There might be some really nice little grass roots festies that spring up last minute but that’ll be your lot.


----------



## Badgers (Dec 8, 2020)

mr steev said:


> I think temperature tests at festivals would throw up loads of other problems. Would you just lose your ticket money? What if you have a temp for another reason? Potential to sue the festival? What happens in situations where one person with a temp means the other members of their party also couldn't attend? Would they all have to lose their ticket money too?


Also a lot of festival goers have a 'bit of a sweat on'  so there would likely be a lot of false positives.


----------



## Badgers (Dec 8, 2020)

I have one gig ticket for December 2021 

Despite wanting things to happen in the summer I will not be booking any tickets.


----------



## Mogden (Dec 8, 2020)

Surely some substances people might be inclined to imbibe at festivals might also hike up temperatures. I don't know if that will be just surface temperature or body   

I've put all festival plans on hold until 2022 with plans instead next year to travel a bit if that's possible. Seems much easier for me to plan that than rely on up and down festival news. Plus it gives me an extra year to save more spends so I can go a bit further afield.


----------



## spitfire (Dec 8, 2020)

I was just thinking that. If travel is anyway back to normal and you have the time for qt and all that aim for far away things.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 8, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I have one gig ticket for December 2021
> 
> Despite wanting things to happen in the summer I will not be booking any tickets.


I’ve got one, which would be in a 1300 capacity theatre, seated, in June.

I’m not exactly hopeful it’ll happen though.


----------



## colacubes (Dec 8, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I have one gig ticket for December 2021
> 
> Despite wanting things to happen in the summer I will not be booking any tickets.



I have tickets for Pet Shop Boys at the O2 in May and Glastonbury. I do not expect either will happen next year. I won't book tickets for any bigger gigs for now.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 8, 2020)

Voley said:


> I'm meant to be seeing The Specials in September. I'd say that's unlikely. I mean, there's a chance it might be on, but if I haven't had the jab I doubt I'd consider it safe.
> 
> Some of the things that have been allowed to go ahead haven't been a good idea. All that 'Eat out to help out' nonsense. Plainly dangerous at that point. If opening gig venues / packing people into festivals starts happening when there's still high levels if infection I'll be giving it all a wide berth.



I'd say that's a little bit over pessimistic personally. I mean, just for a bit of perspective that's roughly the same amount of time between now and then as it has been since this all kicked off. And in that time they've managed to design, test and start rolling out the vaccines. I don't see any reason to expect that most people won't be vaccinated by September - that's not some sort of pie in the sky 'everything's fine' viewpoint, I think it's quite realistic. 

Stuff like festivals is different as people would need the certainty to be able to do some serious planning now but UK bands playing regular gigs? That's a lot simpler.


----------



## spitfire (Dec 8, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’ve got one, which would be in a 1300 capacity theatre, seated, in June.
> 
> I’m not exactly hopeful it’ll happen though.



Same. Brixton Academy. June. Not confident at all but it was only a £30 ticket and no travel involved so not the end of the world if it gets cancelled.


----------



## klang (Dec 8, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It’s things like this that mean - short of a miraculous turnaround in infection rates - festivals aren’t going to happen in 2021. The legal/insurance issues put too much risk onto the organisers.


The 2020 season that never was is really starting to bite me financially, mainly in terms of royalties. 
To go another year without will be well tough. 
It's so difficult for so many...


----------



## Badgers (Dec 8, 2020)

Mogden said:


> Surely some substances people might be inclined to imbibe at festivals might also hike up temperatures. I don't know if that will


Dab of speed and a mile trudge to the gates loaded with bags and tents


----------



## Looby (Dec 8, 2020)

I’ve got a gig in August, End Of The Road early September and Shiiine On in November. I’m mildly optimistic for EOTR and Shiiine On but I’m not pinning my hopes on it. We’ll probably rent a house somewhere again at some point if nothing else is happening.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Dec 8, 2020)

Have five sets of tickets for gigs from 2020 that have been rolled over; Total Stone Roses in Guildford in April, Killers/Sam Fender in London in June, My Chemical Romance in Dublin in June, Lollapalooza in Paris in July & Elton John at the O2 in November. Will be fairly surprised if any other than Elton John happens.


----------



## Mogden (Dec 8, 2020)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> I'd say that's a little bit over pessimistic personally. I mean, just for a bit of perspective that's roughly the same amount of time between now and then as it has been since this all kicked off. And in that time they've managed to design, test and start rolling out the vaccines. I don't see any reason to expect that most people won't be vaccinated by September - that's not some sort of pie in the sky 'everything's fine' viewpoint, I think it's quite realistic.
> 
> Stuff like festivals is different as people would need the certainty to be able to do some serious planning now but UK bands playing regular gigs? That's a lot simpler.


Practically speaking it does seem very realistic but will events be able to get insurance at a price they can afford by then? Seems to me there's an enormous black hole of risk associated with having socially close people in a field at least, with very limited cleaning facilities. Some mardy arse is bound to get off their tits, run round hugging everyone, throw up on a couple of people then try suing the festival for ill health after the fact despite it not being the 'rona and self inflicted.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 8, 2020)

Mogden said:


> Practically speaking it does seem very realistic but will events be able to get insurance at a price they can afford by then? Seems to me there's an enormous black hole of risk associated with having socially close people in a field at least, with very limited cleaning facilities. Some mardy arse is bound to get off their tits, run round hugging everyone, throw up on a couple of people then try suing the festival for ill health after the fact despite it not being the 'rona and self inflicted.



Well I was talking about regular gigs - Voley's Specials gig in September - rather than festivals which are obviously a lot more complex to organise. 

That said though is there any precedence for that sort of legal action? Twats are always going 'I'm going to sue' but despite what the Sun thinks I don't think courts are generally busy giving out damages left right and centre. If they were people would be busy suing local pubs now but they're not as far as I can tell.


----------



## Mogden (Dec 8, 2020)

It's not my area of expertise. Badgers and bees will have more knowledge on the subject I would think. I mean we haven't got the vastly litigatious society of the States but at this stage I'd guess anything is possible. I'm just suggesting that it might not be the actual organising people at gigs and festivals but the associated paperwork that kills it next year.


----------



## Badgers (Dec 8, 2020)

I can't see anyone being able to sue the festival. In the same way as your can't sue Tesco if you contracted the virus there.

If a festival/venue/shop has social distancing/mask signs up and sanitiser available then they have covered their backs.

It is almost guaranteed that some people will have the virus and how they/you behave will be what causes the infections. If people are dancing, hot, hugging and singing it is a petri dish of infection. Even if 90% of people are vaccinated then that is hundreds, thousands and in some festivals 10k plus spreading it about.

We have all been to festivals/gigs. There is no change people will be distancing, wearing masks and sanitising is there.


----------



## Mogden (Dec 8, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I can't see anyone being able to sue the festival. In the same way as your can't sue Tesco if you contracted the virus there.
> 
> If a festival/venue/shop has social distancing/mask signs up and sanitiser available then they have covered their backs.
> 
> ...


That's a like in agreement. When best mate Mogden dropped off my birthday flowers and card last weekend I really struggled with the instinct to hug her but she stayed outside and I didn't and I do not enjoy hugging as a rule so no, festivals at least will be a hotbed of germs.


----------



## Voley (Dec 8, 2020)

I hope you're right Monkeygrinder's Organ . I've never seen The Specials!  One of my fav bands ever.

If it doesn't feel right I won't be going though. I'd want a lot of vaccination done and the infection rates down to hardly anything before I'm jumping up and down, inside, and next to a couple of thousand other people. It still seems a way off to me, I must admit, but I hope your more optimistic take is right.

That first gig you go to after this is going to be a _fucking belter_ isn't it? It'll be quite emotional I think.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 8, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I can't see anyone being able to sue the festival. In the same way as your can't sue Tesco if you contracted the virus there.
> 
> If a festival/venue/shop has social distancing/mask signs up and sanitiser available then they have covered their backs.
> 
> ...



Maybe getting a bit more general here but if vaccination levels are at 90% then I think either: 

 - It turns out that the vaccines do provide a level of protection against transmission and you get to the herd immunity threshold whereby the remaining 10% are protected (fingers crossed). 
 - It turns out it doesn't and the virus carries on circulating. The remaining 10% will be particularly vulnerable (although a lot of them will be vaccine denier types so fuck them tbh). But people are going to start going back to normality still. Covid might just become another illness that some people get but people will take their chances. 

What I can't see though is a situation where most people have been vaccinated but carry on with all the current distancing etc to protect that small minority. People won't stand for it. So I think people will go back to gigs etc one way or another given time.


----------



## Badgers (Dec 8, 2020)

When do you think we will achieve 90% vaccination?


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 8, 2020)

Badgers said:


> When do you think we will achieve 90% vaccination?



No idea tbh! There are some actual experts on other threads -it might be that it never gets quite that high due to the number of anti-vaxx dickheads and people with medical conditions who can't have them. I'd hope levels would be getting pretty high by next summer though.


----------



## elbows (Dec 8, 2020)

I dont see the point in talking about 90% vaccination levels at this stage given there currently aren't even any plans to vaccinate people under 50 with no health complications. If/when that is even on the radar then I'll think further about it, but herd immunity doesn't show up in my current thinking at all. Vaccine manufacture isn't trivial either, so I have no real sense of how quickly they will get supplies to vaccinate all the priority groups. After a few months it should become clearer quite how long that will take, and I dont feel the need to rush ahead with my thoughts, there are plenty of variables that aren't clear to me yet.


----------



## magneze (Dec 8, 2020)

Matt Hancock said something about normality resuming by Spring on the radio. So you can take that to mean that there's no chance of normality by Spring.


----------



## Badgers (Dec 8, 2020)

I think that is a fair shout. 

If 10% at Glasto (for example) are not vaccinated then with ticket holders and crew etc that is is likely to be 15-20k people. 

That is less of an issue than the planning and investment needed to set up the festival in terms of bands and infrastructure. Glasto (again as an example) is about 6 months away now. The risk of committing the outlay with the uncertainty is not a small risk. If things do not go to plan then the festivals be unlikely to recover. 

I am all for smaller festivals and those might be more viable. However they are likely to be more of a shoestring budget than the big events. 

Vaccines are starting to roll out which is great. However the recent 'faux lockdown' and upcoming Christmas is likely to mean a big spike in a month ish and likely January and at least part of February are going to see more restrictions  

As ever this post sounds negative but am trying to be realistic to manage expectations.


----------



## Badgers (Dec 8, 2020)

magneze said:


> Matt Hancock said something about normality resuming by Spring on the radio. So you can take that to mean that there's no chance of normality by Spring.


Might as well write everything off till 2025


----------



## 2hats (Dec 8, 2020)

elbows said:


> I dont see the point in talking about 90% vaccination levels at this stage given there currently aren't even any plans to vaccinate people under 50 with no health complications.


Quite. Less than half the population are currently planned to be vaccinated. Then factor in efficacy, longevity. It's about disease immunity, rather than sterilising immunity.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 8, 2020)

Good discussion/comments/insights. I take on board all the realism, and I honestly am thinking about the points raised.

On the faint chance that Glastonbury somehow!! does happen in 2021, it would surely have to reduce itself in size -- somehow! -- but significantly.

Big problems there with so many people holding 2020 tickets and retaining them -- the return/refund rate was very low apparantly.
But size of event is a major issue .....

Another thing I suppose they might? think about is *postponing* the fest until September or so (and still aiming to reduce the size).

Pure speculation the above, obviously, but whatever happens, it would need to be a *much-changed* event, and quite rightly.
That's true even  if there's no Glastonbury untl June 2022.

But despite my current big pessimism, I'd gamble that leaving it until 2022 might be _slightly_ less likely than *some form* of Glastonbury *at some point* happening in 2021. IMO, like 

The only reason I'm contradicting almost all of you on that, is that I'm more optimistic -- for now -- about vaccination than the Urban average, and honestly not _just_ wishfulthinkingly** either.

**Word??


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 8, 2020)

2hats said:


> Quite. Less than half the population are currently planned to be vaccinated. Then factor in efficacy, longevity. It's about disease immunity, rather than sterilising immunity.



The key word above just might? be 'currently' ...

If/when Oxford/AZ becomes approved, *100 million doses *of it have been ordered.
I saw that number confirmed today in today's Graun. And there are plans, apparantly, for AstraZeneca to manufacture it mainly in the UK, so 100m might? not be the final figure either.

(Sorry -- this is off-topic here really -- return this chat to the vaccine thread maybe?)


----------



## mx wcfc (Dec 8, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Another thing I suppose they might? think about is *postponing* the fest until September or so (and still aiming to reuce the size).


It'll be a problem if lots of big festivals postpone to September.  I can see Bearded doing that. If they all do, the crews/vendors etc can't cover them all, and punters can't afford the cost or time off in a single month, and it all becomes unviable.  If Glastonbury and Bearded moved to September, other festivals might throw in the towel.  

Something Else cancelled very early this year, for precisely that reason. 

And, if I remember correctly, Something Else 2019 was a bit grim!  It's not the ideal month for festivals.


----------



## mx wcfc (Dec 8, 2020)

2hats said:


> Quite. Less than half the population are currently planned to be vaccinated. Then factor in efficacy, longevity. It's about disease immunity, rather than sterilising immunity.


Hmmm.  Maybe festivals should have an "over 50s only" rule.  Glastonwick might be OK, as would Something Else.  I'll take that.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 8, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Another thing I suppose they might? think about is *postponing* the fest until September or so


It's really not that simple for them to do that.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 8, 2020)

mx wcfc : I'm going to get back to those points about timing -- I'm not going to rush it.


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## Supine (Dec 8, 2020)

We Out Here is going ahead next year and I'll be turning up if it actually happens. It's all about outdoor socialising in 2021 I reckon. I'm unlikely to spend much time in pubs or sweaty rave basements next year.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 8, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It's really not that simple for them to do that.



I know. I should have emphasised that a decision like that (postponing until September or whenever),  and any decision really, is going to be pretty damned tough for them.
In other words I agree with you.

More generally though, Glastonbury's planning and infrastructure and skill-range/experience as organisers are all formidable, which could reduce _some_ hurdles. Note emphasis -- and same would apply to having to leave it until 2022.


----------



## mx wcfc (Dec 8, 2020)

Supine said:


> We Out Here is going ahead next year and I'll be turning up if it actually happens. It's all about outdoor socialising in 2021 I reckon. I'm unlikely to spend much time in pubs or sweaty rave basements next year.


Damn,  clashes with Green Man.  Not that I've heard of many of the acts at either, tbh.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 8, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> More generally though, Glastonbury's planning and infrastructure and skill-range/experience as organisers are all formidable, which could reduce _some_ hurdles. Note emphasis -- and same would apply to having to leave it until 2022.


Their planning is almost irrelevant, it's the entire rest of the industry that they would need where the problems come.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 8, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Their planning is almost irrelevant, it's the entire rest of the industry that they would need where the problems come.



I take that point about the rest of the industry, and it's a big one. Perhaps I should have left out or changed the word 'planning' 

But surely?, *+if+* some version of Glastonbury happens sooner than people expect (that is before 2022!), then their event-organising infrastructure would leave Glastonbury better able to work out workarounds and changes than most?
(Obviously in collaboration with lots of others)

I clearly need a lot more thinking time though 
So I'd better leave this for now.


----------



## Espresso (Dec 8, 2020)

The bands are one thing. If they've got a few quid behind them they will have been able to sit this out. The people who own the sites or the venues will/might have got grants and been able to put employees on furlough, but the self employed technical people and the riggers and the backstage workers and the light people and the sound engineers and the merchandise sellers and manufacturers and the food vans and the people who rent out portaloos and lights and stages and barriers and the security companies and all sorts of other things that are required to put on big events have all been ignored during this, so lots of those businesses will have gone to the wall.
Or they'll have retrained in cyber.  

Lots of the people affected will come back, but lots of them wont. Either because they are dead or because they have had tragedy in their lives or because they have found a new way of life.

Live events are going to take a very very long time to be recover the damage wrought on them by 2020.


----------



## pesh (Dec 9, 2020)

The hypothetical Glastonbury bollocks starts earlier every year


----------



## clicker (Dec 9, 2020)

Looking at the average age of a Glastonbury audience, plus crew  and most performers, they are way down the list for vaccines. It'd be irresponsible/impossible to try and plan for it to occur pre vaccine.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 9, 2020)

clicker  I  accepted above the possibility of 2022 rather than 2021, and I get ever more pessimistic 

But we simply *don't yet know* how the vaccine timetable is going to pan out ...
I refer you to the *100 million* Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine doses I mentioned earlier (subject to MHRA approval, obvs, but that's expected soonish, and it would be a big shock to everyone in science/medicine if no approval was granted)

And if it's 'irresponsible' for Glastonbury to be planned, have a word with the Eavises.
They've been *provisionally* (note emphasis!) planning the next fest since the latter half of 2019.
And they and their team are experienced/not-stupid enough to be allowing for all possibilities and making big changes, I have no doubt.



pesh said:


> The hypothetical Glastonbury bollocks starts earlier every year



Who's denied it's hypothetical at the moment?

But for people who've been missing Glastonbury badly, who go there, who work there, why the hell shouldn't they be thinking about it?
Yes I know fully well the more pessimistic outlooks .... as does everyone on this thread.

So a bit more politeness than that, and a bit less dismissiveness, would cost nothing.


----------



## clicker (Dec 9, 2020)

Yes William of Walworth , as you bolded, 'we don't know yet'.....and because nobody knows the timetable it's impossible to plan to occur before vaccine, it isn't going to be planned and cancelled at the last minute in 2021. Honest Guv.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 9, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> clicker  I  accepted above the possibility of 2022 rather than 2021, and I get ever more pessimistic
> 
> But we simply *don't yet know* how the vaccine timetable is going to pan out ...
> I refer you to the *100 million* Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine doses I mentioned earlier (subject to MHRA approval, obvs, but that's expected soonish, and it would be a big shock to everyone in science/medicine if no approval was granted)
> ...


I think - and I’m not having a go here, just observing - where you go wrong with all this is seeing Glastonbury as a single event, unconnected from the entire global music industry. The logistics involved for it are fundamentally entwined with international touring schedules and record industry requirements, both from the individual artists and also the technical support companies points of view. It can’t simply go it alone and make decisions about if, how and when it happens, it’s just one part of a highly complicated, year round logistical supply chain.

Right now every venue, arena, tour manager and record industry exec is making plans for what happens when it can all start again. There is going to be a _colossal_ demand when it does, and it’s going to be mind bogglingly complicated to get it all sorted. The priority will be tours, not festivals, because that’s where the money lies.

I know you love it. I know you want it back. Every single person in the industry wants the same, probably even more than you. But - miracles aside - it’s looking less and less likely with every day that passes. I would _love_ to be proved wrong come June.


----------



## klang (Dec 9, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I would _love_ to be proved wrong come June.


baring in mind that June is just over 6 months away, i'd say it's impossible to pull it off.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 9, 2020)

littleseb said:
			
		

> June is just over 6 months away, i'd say it's impossible to pull it off



For now I'd disagree with 'impossible', but in almost all other respects I do agree with beesonthewhatnow 's points just above  

You can't really contradict those -- like others on here, he knows far more about the actual workings of tour planning, the live music industry, etc. which I must try and respect more 

I know a whole lot about Glastonbury, but it's largely site layout and overall infrastructure-based .......


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 9, 2020)

clicker said:


> Yes William of Walworth , as you bolded, 'we don't know yet'.....and because nobody knows the timetable it's impossible to plan to occur before vaccine, it isn't going to be planned and cancelled at the last minute in 2021. Honest Guv.



I agree with you that if they cancel G2021, they'll cancel a lot earlier -- they'd have to. And as I said, I'm getting increasingly pessimistic now 

But I don't (speaking hypothetically!) agree with you that contingency planning for the (very) unexpected is irresponsible.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 15, 2020)

Baxter Dury tour cancelled


----------



## editor (Dec 15, 2020)

All our March 2021 gigs have now been cancelled.


----------



## mx wcfc (Dec 15, 2020)

editor said:


> All our March 2021 gigs have now been cancelled.


Yep, I got an email yesterday. Not surprised.


----------



## editor (Dec 15, 2020)

mx wcfc said:


> Yep, I got an email yesterday. Not surprised.


I'm not hopeful for any gigs until next summer at the earliest, to be honest. Because - foolishly - all my employment eggs are in the entertainment basket - it looks like I'm going to go something like a year and a half without any paid work at all at this rate.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 16, 2020)

wrt Glasto








						Glastonbury 2021: Emily Eavis says 'we're doing everything we can'
					

But "we're a long way from being able to say we're confident 2021 will go ahead," Emily Eavis says.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## mr steev (Dec 16, 2020)

I recieved an email about Shambala earlier. It's the only one I have a glimmer of hope for tbh as it's not until late August. The email was mainly giving another chance at cancelling and getting a refund before tickets for 2021 go on sale. There are also updates to their terms and conditions 



> *SHAMBALA 2021 AND COVID-19*
> 
> Following the cancellation of 2020’s event due to the Covid-19 pandemic, all customers will be bound by the updated terms and conditions for the 2021 Festival. It is expected that in order to adhere to conditions of license and maintain the paramount focus of Kambe Events on customer and crew safety, additional measures in relation to Covid-19 will be in place. The preparation, planning and mitigation of risk will be dynamic. Updates are to be expected, but we draw your attention to the specific and current clauses below.
> 
> ...


----------



## editor (Dec 16, 2020)

Interesting


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Dec 16, 2020)

A glimmer of hope...


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 16, 2020)

ddraig said:


> wrt Glasto
> 
> 
> 
> ...



She's certainly not over-promising anything -- quite rightly not.

But she does confirm that if/when they do cancel Glastonbury 2021, they'll aim to do so a lot earlier than they did last year.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 17, 2020)

editor said:


> Interesting




Has anyone heard any more on this? I had a bit of a look and found this article from the MVT: Viewpoint: Mark Davyd's alternative Christmas message but not a lot more.

I'd love to think this is a goer but maybe there's some wishful thinking going on?


----------



## killer b (Dec 17, 2020)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> I'd love to think this is a goer but maybe there's some wishful thinking going on?


Anyone talking about 'pre-pandemic (audience) numbers' and 'covid secure environment' is indulging in magical thinking, never mind wishful


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 17, 2020)

killer b said:


> Anyone talking about 'pre-pandemic (audience) numbers' and 'covid secure environment' is indulging in magical thinking, never mind wishful



If I had to speculate I think there might be a role for this sort of stuff further down the line - somewhere between the point where vaccination is starting to have an impact and the point where infection levels are genuinely fully under control. At the moment though I think you're right though tbh.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Dec 17, 2020)

Bryan Adams' people living in cloud cuckoo land...


----------



## pesh (Dec 17, 2020)

you know its true.


----------



## Teaboy (Dec 17, 2020)

No chance of any of those happening in the UK.  Might get away with the Nordic ones depending on how much Sweden are giving a shit by then, they seem to fluctuate a bit.


----------



## Voley (Dec 18, 2020)

Paul McCartney on Radio 4 earlier today saying he thought it had been confirmed that Glastonbury wouldn't be happening this year. He was meant to be headlining wasn't he?


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 29, 2020)

Voley said:


> Paul McCartney on Radio 4 earlier today saying he thought it had been confirmed that Glastonbury wouldn't be happening this year. He was meant to be headlining wasn't he?



Yes, and that Radio  4 thing wasn't the only place where Paul McCartney was saying the 'no Glastonbury' thing.

In contrast to that, a few days later, I wondered whether Michael Eavis had been having a rare cider session  (he doesn't drink much generally) when I read this story on 'Glastofestfeed', a rare festival site that I'm not familar with  ....




			
				Glastofestfeed headline said:
			
		

> *Michael Eavis says Glastonbury 2021 is “going to happen –  you wait and see … ”
> The Glastonbury Festival founder sounds more determinedly optimistic than ever!*



But it's based on nothing   This is the Youtube thing they refer to :



ETA : And I've just properly realised how utterly short and flimsy that video was!  -- embarassing 

The Emily Eavis bit at the end of the above 'story' is less optimistic, more realistic :




			
				Glastofestfeed said:
			
		

> Earlier this week Glastonbury co-organiser Emily Eavis told the BBC that they are doing “everything we can” to ensure it takes place next year.
> She said : “The hard part is understanding exactly what we’ll be planning for, and what impact that will have on what we’re able to do. But right now I’m not sure there’s anything we could do that would completely ensure we can welcome 200,000 people to spend six days in some fields in June 2021.”
> Eavis also noted that if the festival could not happen in its traditional form, the organisers will consider inviting artists to perform on the farm for a series of live streams.



Interesting that she specifies '200,000 people' and 'in June'  though ...... not that the ultra-faint possibility of a changed/smaller/even re-dated event makes me any more hopeful at the moment


----------



## Badgers (Jan 4, 2021)

__





						Glastonbury 2021: Emily Eavis denies Mel B's claims of cancellation | Glastonbury festival | The Guardian
					

After the Spice Girl told BBC Radio 5 Live that the festival was off, Eavis said there was ‘no news our end’




					amp.theguardian.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 4, 2021)

Badgers said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I’m stating to get quite fucked off with the Eavis’s at this point. Stop this daft charade and admit what everyone sane already knows.


----------



## Badgers (Jan 4, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’m stating to get quite fucked off with the Eavis’s at this point. Stop this daft charade and admit what everyone sane already knows.


Yup. It is a nonsense stringing people along like this.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jan 4, 2021)

They’re only doing it to wind up WoW...


----------



## Sunray (Jan 6, 2021)

There was talk of testing everyone on entry, but given even the queues would be super speeder spreader events, doesn’t make much sense to me.

They had a gov thing on festivals yesterday, this is what was reported on the guardian








						Music festivals call for new government scheme as sector faces ruin
					

MPs told state-backed insurance could allow festivals to plan summer events with confidence




					www.theguardian.com
				




this is what I’ve been saying could happen.  Glastonbury paid lip service to it last year.  Not wrong about the last sentence though.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jan 6, 2021)

Fuckinell can you imagine trying to test everyone going to Glastonbury. You've travelled all that way, packed into cars and trains and buses, schlepped your shit with you, waited in the heaving rain or hammering sun, get your test and told to go home. So now your pals, your best mate, your lover, who travelled with you in the packed car but isn’t infected enough to show positive, they’re waving at you as they pick up their programmes and go througn the cattle gate and you have to turn around and travel back home.

As if.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 6, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Fuckinell can you imagine trying to test everyone going to Glastonbury. You've travelled all that way, packed into cars and trains and buses, schlepped your shit with you, waited in the heaving rain or hammering sun, get your test and told to go home. So now your pals, your best mate, your lover, who travelled with you in the packed car but isn’t infected enough to show positive, they’re waving at you as they pick up their programmes and go througn the cattle gate and you have to turn around and travel back home.
> 
> As if.


Exactly. The whole thing is a fantasy.


----------



## BristolEcho (Jan 6, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Fuckinell can you imagine trying to test everyone going to Glastonbury. You've travelled all that way, packed into cars and trains and buses, schlepped your shit with you, waited in the heaving rain or hammering sun, get your test and told to go home. So now your pals, your best mate, your lover, who travelled with you in the packed car but isn’t infected enough to show positive, they’re waving at you as they pick up their programmes and go througn the cattle gate and you have to turn around and travel back home.
> 
> As if.



I don't even know why people find it tempting. I'm more into sweaty dark clubs to get my kicks, but can't see them being open really this year and until they are open normally I think I'd probably rather not bother.


----------



## colacubes (Jan 6, 2021)

I've got tickets for Glastonbury and I can say with 99.9% certainty that I won't be going even if it does go ahead this year (which it won't). Just seems way to risky unless they can come up with some magic solution.


----------



## Badgers (Jan 10, 2021)

Not much we don't already know here. I would be surprised if any state supported insurance will be forthcoming 





__





						Festivals, holidays, Euro 2020… will summer's big events still go ahead? | Coronavirus | The Guardian
					

Burgeoning hopes for a normal sporting and cultural calendar are now in question again as infections increase




					amp.theguardian.com


----------



## BristolEcho (Jan 10, 2021)

There is a night listed at Crosica Studios in May which they sent an email around. That place is constantly rammed. Can't see it.


----------



## editor (Jan 10, 2021)

Our April gigs are in the process of being rescheduled. I can't see regular live music gigs happening this side of the summer.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 10, 2021)

BristolEcho said:


> There is a night listed at Crosica Studios in May which they sent an email around. That place is constantly rammed. Can't see it.


Probably more a hope than anything else, they had to lay off all their staff in late august early september and cut costs.


----------



## BristolEcho (Jan 10, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Probably more a hope than anything else, they had to lay off all their staff in late august early september and cut costs.



Sad to hear but not surprised!


----------



## Spandex (Jan 14, 2021)

Anyone for Ghost Festival in Switzerland, Feb. 27-28th? 300 bands on the line-up for the biggest festival the country has never seen.

Ghost Festival Switzerland: The Festival That Will Never Happen To Support Artists


----------



## editor (Jan 14, 2021)

Big London festival ambitiously set for September 









						Mighty Hoopla at Brockwell Park – festival announces new date for September 2021
					

After last year’s event was cancelled due to coronavirus concerns, the organisers have announced that the Mighty Hoopla festival will be returning to Brockwell Park on Saturday 4th September …



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## Sunray (Jan 14, 2021)

Me the optimist is thinking, it's possible but unlikely.
If they can make 2 million vaccines a week, September is 64 million vaccines away from now.
We don't need that many. I think we will be in the final throws or head in hands for reasons nobody can predict.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 14, 2021)

Would love to be wrong but I still don’t think it’s possible. Even with the vaccine rollout there surely has to be a reasonable period of time afterwards where the case numbers have to stay low before large crowds can gather again?


----------



## editor (Jan 14, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Would love to be wrong but I still don’t think it’s possible. Even with the vaccine rollout there surely has to be a reasonable period of time afterwards where the case numbers have to stay low before large crowds can gather again?


I think it's ambitious too. And - heartbreakingly for me - I haven't got much confidence that our twice-postponed USA/Canadian tour in October is going to happen.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 15, 2021)

Just in case people still think I expect Glastonbury or any other festivals (above the really tiny and very late) will happen this summer (2021), you're *wrong*.

For ages, I'm been more and more ultra-pessimistic** about festivals (even though I'm pretty optimistic about vaccines).

**And also pretty fucking depressed   -- we're still writing some event dates into festibaldeb's 2021 kitten calendar, but with between zero and less than zero _real_ expectation about making more than the odd and small one, very late on.

It's beyond miserable


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 15, 2021)

editor said:


> I think it's ambitious too. And - heartbreakingly for me - I haven't got much confidence that our twice-postponed USA/Canadian tour in October is going to happen.


You’ve touched there on another factor for future tours/festivals - unless they’re entirely UK based lineups it’s not just down to our vaccine/covid status but the rest of the world too.


----------



## editor (Jan 16, 2021)

Tiniest glimmers of hope amongst some rather optimistic forecasting 



> Festivals aside, there is hope for smaller gigs returning sooner than later. Recent tests conducted in Germany into the transmission of coronavirus at indoor concerts found that the environment poses a “low-to-very low” risk to attendees of contracting the disease. Another recent study found that the risk of infecting someone in a venue “through aerosol transmission can be almost ruled out”, providing that the venue has a sufficient fresh-air supply and that all attendees are wearing face masks.





> Meanwhile, in the UK, London’s legendary 100 Club is set to pilot a new ventilation system that aims to wipe out 99.99% of dangerous airborne pathogens, such as coronavirus, within buildings. The aim of the trial is “to prove that the integration of this new system into a building’s air conditioning creates an indoor environment that is COVID-secure, allowing audience numbers to return to a pre-pandemic normal for Britain’s 1,100 theatres and thousands of live music venues”.





> “It would be quite profound if it was successful,” Music Venue Trust CEO Mark Davyd told _NME_. “We’re keen that we not only bring back live music, but that we bring it back safely. There are some things to be learned from the pandemic that we are keen to roll out at the Test, Clean, Prevent gigs at The 100 Club. This isn’t just about how we make gigs safe, but also how can we improve the health and safety of gigs anyway? We don’t just want to make it through this pandemic and think, ‘Oh, that’s over’ – we need to be thinking about making it through the next one.”
> 
> He continued: “The modelling that we’ve done with the government suggests that the process would provide an extremely safe event – probably unnecessarily safe – but it’s good to do that to see how we can improve things like air quality and cleanliness.”
> 
> Asked about what real impact this would have for the gig-going public, Davyd replied: “It would be quite dramatic I think. Once we’ve established that we can run events that have a higher level of risk management, then you can go back to government with science to say that you can go back to full capacity. People are catastrophising, saying that nothing will go back to normal until next year. I don’t see that as being the outcome. I think it’s going to require some ingenuity and inventiveness, but it is possible to continue to imagine how we get back.”





> He added: “I’m not as pessimistic about music returning to small venues in people’s local towns and cities as other people are about us getting the whole live music industry back up and running. I’m certain we can put on socially distanced gigs from spring onwards – that’s our position and the government’s position. Can we put on a full capacity gig at The Adelphi in Hull in 2021? I’m going to say yes at this point. I think full capacity with something near normal behaviour will take a little bit longer, but we’re confident it will happen this year.”
> 
> Dr Michael Head is a Senior Research Fellow in Global Health at the University of Southampton. Speaking to _NME,_ he warned that the necessary level of vaccination might not be reached until the end of summer.
> 
> “Before the government starts to open things up, and that’s including gigs and festivals, we would want to see all of the vulnerable people vaccinated; all of groups one to nine,” he said. “We’d also want a large amount of the rest of population vaccinated too before to allow people to mix too freely – whether that be indoors or outdoors.











						When and how could gigs and festivals return in 2021? Industry insiders tell us what to expect
					

Music industry insiders, festival bosses and medical experts have told NME about when fans can hope for the return of live music in the UK, and what will be required




					www.nme.com


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## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 16, 2021)

Ventilation systems ain't cheap though which will be a problem for the smaller venues.


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## killer b (Jan 16, 2021)

That phrase 'covid secure' again. You'd have thought they wouldn't keep on using that after it turned out to be such bollocks last year.


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## klang (Jan 16, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Would love to be wrong but I still don’t think it’s possible. Even with the vaccine rollout there surely has to be a reasonable period of time afterwards where the case numbers have to stay low before large crowds can gather again?


surely for a large festival to happen in the summer pretty much everything would have to be in place now. line up, insurance, logistics, sponsors, crew, h&s Risk assessments etc etc


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## spitfire (Jan 16, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Ventilation systems ain't cheap though which will be a problem for the smaller venues.



Yes and also bulky. They usually require major building works and some sort of plant room when they get complicated.

Obviously not seen the gear they are talking about but sounds more than complex than just fitting an in line filter or such.


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## BristolEcho (Jan 16, 2021)

When you look up the main discriptors of what can spread covid it basically described clubs and other venues. Far from convinced and I definitely cant see it in the skanky places I frequent. Realise I'm pretty pessimistic about this.


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## Badgers (Jan 16, 2021)

littleseb said:


> insurance


For my events no insurer would include covid in the policy.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 16, 2021)

littleseb said:


> surely for a large festival to happen in the summer pretty much everything would have to be in place now. line up, insurance, logistics, sponsors, crew, h&s Risk assessments etc etc


It could still be done. Just. But it’s vanishingly unlikely.


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## SheilaNaGig (Jan 16, 2021)

But the entire industry has been chopped and diced.

So it’s not just about whether venues can be safe or whether enough people have been vaccinated. It’s also about whether the support systems are still in place. I mean, how is John Henry’s doing right now? Can they survive all this? What about Metropolis? How are they doing?

And so many of the nuts and bolts people in the industry are self employed, so a lot of them will be forced to find work elsewhere. True, most will be very keen to get back to the music but some won’t be able to.

So even if we can get back into the gigs and festivals, it’s going to take a while before we know how much of the old world has gone forever, how much can be stitched back together, and what needs to be made from scratch and reinvented.


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## SheilaNaGig (Jan 16, 2021)

And then there’s the whole Brexit bollox bullshit thing to deal with too. Visas and carnets.




As an aside to illustrate the kind of naivety that’s out there...
I heard from a friend that a particular band is saying they won’t bother with carnets, they’ll just ignore that. Friend has been trying to impress on this big name touring band the idiocy of this.


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## klang (Jan 16, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> But the entire industry has been chopped and diced.
> 
> And so many of the nuts and bolts people in the industry are self employed, so a lot of them will be forced to find work elsewhere. True, most will be very keen to get back to the music but some won’t.


it took me years to set up my studio and turn it into a functioning operation. i'm struggling because of corona. once i can't pay the rent anymore and i'll have to shut doors that'll be it. i'd have to find work so won' t have time to work towards a re-opening. i'd have to sell my gear and move on.


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## SheilaNaGig (Jan 16, 2021)

littleseb said:


> it took me years to set up my studio and turn it into a functioning operation. i'm struggling because of corona. once i can't pay the rent anymore and i'll have to shut doors that'll be it. i'd have to find work so won' t have time to work towards a re-opening. i'd have to sell my gear and move on.




I’m seeing /hearing a lot of this.
It’s really shit.
I’m sorry it’s happening to you.


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## klang (Jan 16, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I’m seeing /hearing a lot of this.
> It’s rewlly shit.
> I’m sorry it’s happening to you.


i reckon i can sustain my studio for the time being. there's work lined up i can do on my own or with one other person. i don't fancy working with a sweaty rock band though.
bands will be desperate to record once things get safer. there is a lot of writing going on atm.


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## SheilaNaGig (Jan 16, 2021)

littleseb said:


> i reckon i can sustain my studio for the time being. there's work lined up i can do on my own or with one other person. i don't fancy working with a sweaty rock band though.
> bands will be desperate to record once things get safer. there is a lot of writing going on atm.



This sounds good. I hope you can make it work.

Sweaty bands will need to be more cognisant of their damp exudations in future. A shame, because hugging someone as they come off stage is the only time I don’t mind the sweat.

And yes, my various inboxes are festooned with all sorts of odd and interesting sketches from musicians. I’m very curious and interested to see what comes out of this at the other end. I’m anticipating a glut of new offerings, and no doubt much of it will be step-change excellent.

I do really hope you can keep your studio open littleseb , bands /musicians will need you in the days ahead.


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## William of Walworth (Jan 16, 2021)

littleseb said:
			
		

> surely for a large festival to happen in the summer pretty much everything would have to be in place now. line up, insurance, logistics, sponsors, crew, h&s Risk assessments etc etc





beesonthewhatnow said:


> It could still be done. Just. But it’s vanishingly unlikely.



I'm very pessimistic too, as I said in my earlier post 

But do you reckon that some (more experienced?) festival organisers might (?) be making at least some of those preparations anyway, on the basis of "just in case the event could happen after all" 

I don't mean Glastonbury (a no-no because of size alone), my question's more about smaller events that almost certainly won't really be happening later this year?
I bet some organisers could _for now_ still be preparing for the unexpected?


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## Badgers (Jan 16, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> But do you reckon that some (more experienced?) festival organisers might (?) be making at least some of those preparations anyway, on the basis of "just in case the event could happen after all"


Afraid that a lot are keeping going on hope alone. The largest and best funded events supplier in the UK has now laid off 80% of their workforce as a guide to how it is going 'behind the scenes' in the industry. 

The festival world is much more reliant on volunteers, casual workers and people with passion so that helps a bit. However they generally have smaller paid/salaried core staff numbers. It was already a bloated sector and some festivals were failing before C19. There will still be festivals but I honestly can't see any before 2022 in the UK. 

Some festivals are 'more experienced' but that does not mean they have a war chest of cash or staff and are able to make financial gambles. Ticket monies are not paid until after an event is delivered and insurance companies won't cover C19, so the upfront costs/risks are huge in this climate. 


Am not sure I will return to the industry now  sorry to be miserable (again) but for large footfall events/festivals we need to be realistic.


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## mr steev (Jan 16, 2021)

Bearded theory have postponed until September again, but saying that if it's not safe and social distancing is still in place then it will be postponed until May 22


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## editor (Jan 16, 2021)

littleseb said:


> i reckon i can sustain my studio for the time being. there's work lined up i can do on my own or with one other person. i don't fancy working with a sweaty rock band though.
> bands will be desperate to record once things get safer. there is a lot of writing going on atm.


It's looking more likely that we might end up recording the next album individually.  So I've got to try and figure out how to make that happen with the recording software I'm trying to get my head around and - spit - electronic drums.


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## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 16, 2021)

editor said:


> It's looking more likely that we might end up recording the next album individually.  So I've got to try and figure out how to make that happen with the recording software I'm trying to get my head around and - spit - electronic drums.


what software are you using?


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## William of Walworth (Jan 16, 2021)

mr steev said:


> *Bearded Theory have postponed until September again*, but saying that if it's not safe and social distancing is still in place then it will be postponed until May 22



I was avoiding mentioning that news of their announcement!  

I have very little hope of BT (up there with my favourites!  ) happening at all in 2021 

I know what the organisers are going through, they've been my drinking/gigging/fest pals for not far off twenty years, and have been quite depressed at times themselves 

festivaldeb and I have been to every Bearded since pub-garden days back in 2008.

TBF, they did reduce the size down to 7,500 or thereabouts in 2019 -- it had become over 12,000 before.

mr steev : let's hope we can meet up there with various other Urbans  when it eventually does happen  -- in seventeen months time


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## editor (Jan 16, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> what software are you using?


Adobe Audition - there's a thread here (rather than send this one any further off topic!)


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## Badgers (Jan 18, 2021)




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## elbows (Jan 21, 2021)

No surprise:


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## colacubes (Jan 21, 2021)

Was always going to be the case. If Glastonbury can’t pull it off I think any of the bigger festivals are highly unlikely. There’s maybe a small chance for small/mid size festivals at the latter end of the summer. But it is very small.


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## Voley (Jan 21, 2021)

colacubes said:


> Was always going to be the case. If Glastonbury can’t pull it off I think any of the bigger festivals are highly unlikely. There’s maybe a small chance for small/mid size festivals at the latter end of the summer. But it is very small.


I honestly don't think a big festival would be anything like safe this year, even if they went ahead.

More positively, both of my folks have had their first jabs now so that light at the end of the tunnel just got a big bigger round here.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 21, 2021)

Every other major festival will follow. Plan for 2022.


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## Badgers (Jan 21, 2021)




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## The Octagon (Jan 21, 2021)

Rolling over the deposits for Glasto again, bugger 

2023 then I guess.

At least the farm will have really had time to recover for once.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 21, 2021)

While Glasto will certainly survive until next year, it will be interesting to see if/which big name events don’t make it. I’ve long suspected the financial model of various outfits isn’t quite as robust as you’d imagine.


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## Voley (Jan 21, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> While Glasto will certainly survive until next year, it will be interesting to see if/which big name events don’t make it. I’ve long suspected the financial model of various outfits isn’t quite as robust as you’d imagine.


Yeah, it's a busy old market these days isn't it? I thought it was pretty saturated before all this happened.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 21, 2021)

Voley said:


> Yeah, it's a busy old market these days isn't it? I thought it was pretty saturated before all this happened.


Massively. And there’s been a bit of an “arms race” for overall production levels/spectacle, none of which is cheap.


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## editor (Jan 21, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> While Glasto will certainly survive until next year, it will be interesting to see if/which big name events don’t make it. I’ve long suspected the financial model of various outfits isn’t quite as robust as you’d imagine.


Throw in Brexit on top with the probable vastly increased costs of bands/performers etc coming into the UK and it starts to look even shakier.


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## William of Walworth (Jan 21, 2021)

I'm 100% unsurprised about today's Glastonbury announcement -- I've been expecting it for a good while 

Even before I was told this week by a friend (occasionally Urban too  ) that Chris Tofu of Continental Drifts (and SE Corner) had told him that this 'news' was very imminent.

So timing-wise, I had forewarning, at least it was no shock..

Otherwise, 'No further comment' possible from me right now   .... too depressed and downhearted 

(Moar later to come from me when I can face it   )


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## Bahnhof Strasse (Jan 22, 2021)

Looks like the Tokyo Olympics is cancelled then...

IOC insist games will go ahead


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## zora (Jan 22, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Looks like the Tokyo Olympics is cancelled then...
> 
> IOC insist games will go ahead



What mad nonsense; I like the bloke they quote who basically goes: The IOC is doing a Trump now, and completely ignoring reality.

It also seriously seems to misread the room. Is there anyone on this planet who is desperate for the Olympics to go ahead come hell or high water? Maybe some athletes, idk.

Wouldn't it be more in the Olympic spirit to get, say, vaccinations for all countries sorted, rather than facilitate a ginormous not just superspreading, but also super-global-variant-mixing event? 

(I know they won't actually go ahead, but I couldn't resist the baitey headline).


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## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 22, 2021)

The IOC being a bunch of greedy, corrupt, self serving arseholes is hardly news though.


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## William of Walworth (Jan 22, 2021)

One trouble is that plenty of fans of the Olympics, and even some athletes too, will actively be misled by the IOC insisting the Games will still go ahead


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## editor (Jan 22, 2021)

Well, here's a tease:



> *Music festivals are "still possible" this summer, despite the cancellation of Glastonbury, says the head of the Association of Independent Festivals.*
> Paul Reed said Glastonbury "is a different beast to most festivals and most likely ran out of time due to the size and complexity of the event".
> Smaller events could still happen if the government ensures organisers can access cancellation insurance, he said.












						Festival season 'still possible' despite Glastonbury cancellation
					

Despite Glastonbury's cancellation, smaller festivals could still go ahead, experts say.



					www.bbc.co.uk


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## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 22, 2021)

editor said:


> Well, here's a tease:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


could still happen...
and
...access cancellation insurance 


does not feel me with hope


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## circleline (Jan 24, 2021)

Charity fund-raiser for Musicians Benevolent Fund, among others.  Not sure how helpful or relevant to this thread, but not seen elsewhere on here and seemed short-sighted not to post it..









						Charity version of Pink Floyd's Wish You Were Here airs tonight
					

DeeExpus man organises charity cover of prog classic Wish You Were Here to raise money for musicians and crew




					www.loudersound.com


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## Mr.Bishie (Jan 25, 2021)

Flaming Lips stage unique 'space bubble' concert - BBC News
					

Both the band and their audience were inside individual inflatable bubbles.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




Stranger things have happened...


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## BigTom (Jan 25, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> could still happen...
> and
> ...access cancellation insurance
> 
> ...



Yep. No way that insurance companies are going to provide this and I can't see our tory govt. being the insurer of last resort given how little support they've given to the live event sector that they've killed with lockdown restrictions.


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## Badgers (Jan 27, 2021)

Chelsea Flower Show: Event moved to autumn for first time in history
					

It is the first time the world-famous event will take place in the autumn.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




Can't see this happening. The event is usually packed with a very elderly crowd and lots of it is inside tents. Has a massive build time at great cost to exhibitors and requires a lot of staff.


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## jimbarkanoodle (Jan 27, 2021)

I went to a socially distanced festival in mid September last year (Clockwork Orange), where you had to stay inside an individual roped off section with hay bales, with a maximum of 6 people. It didn't matter if you knew each other or you were from the same household etc, and you were free to walk to the bar and toilets and even change "pods'. Relatively speaking, it was a good day dancing gurned up in a sunny field to Dj's playing tunes, although there was a steady stream of people getting chucked out and lots of brawls between punters and security the more people got fucked and flouted the rules, however vague they were.

Given this second wave has come a few months earlier than the first, I can see these type of events with a few thousand people up and running by the height of summer. Obviously all depends on new variants etc, but with the vaccinations going full pelt, it may not be too much of a crazy thought?


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## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 27, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> I went to a socially distanced festival in mid September last year (Clockwork Orange), where you had to stay inside an individual roped off section with hay bales, with a maximum of 6 people. It didn't matter if you knew each other or you were from the same household etc, and you were free to walk to the bar and toilets and even change "pods'. Relatively speaking, it was a good day dancing gurned up in a sunny field to Dj's playing tunes, although there was a steady stream of people getting chucked out and lots of brawls between punters and security the more people got fucked and flouted the rules, however vague they were.
> 
> Given this second wave has come a few months earlier than the first, I can see these type of events with a few thousand people up and running by the height of summer. Obviously all depends on new variants etc, but with the vaccinations going full pelt, it may not be too much of a crazy thought?


that sound a bit like a middling to super spreader event

I'm on free party group on facebook and whoever admins was complaining about the reports on the hackney squat party that got busted at the week end
selfish pricks


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## jimbarkanoodle (Jan 27, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> that sound a bit like a middling to super spreader event
> 
> I'm on free party group on facebook and whoever admins was complaining about the reports on the hackney squat party that got busted at the week end
> selfish pricks



I was in two minds about going to it, but the covid rates were very low at the time in London and in Hertfordshire where it was held (I haven't got the figures but im sure it was under 20 per 100k people, compared to over 1000 a couple of weeks ago). Back then it being all outdoors with the blessing of the council and authorities made it seem not a huge risk. The event has an older crowd and very active Facebook group and from what I gather there wasn't any kind of spread of infections after the event. Hard to tell for sure, of course.

In regards to Hackney- There's no excuse organising and going to a party in the last month with upto 70k infections reported per day. Its just a massive fuck you to everybody suffering during this awful second wave.


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## editor (Jan 28, 2021)

That's two festivals booked in for Brockwell Park in September 









						Cross The Tracks festival returns to Brockwell Park, Sun 5th Sept 2021
					

Billed as “Brixton’s jazz, funk and soul feast,” the Cross The Tracks festival will be returning to Brockwell Park on Sun 5th Sept 2021 – the day after the Mighty Hoopla fes…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


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## Mation (Jan 29, 2021)

editor said:


> That's two festivals booked in for Brockwell Park in September
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well, their ticket allocation and refund policies sound ok, but I'd like some of what they're having please, on the ridiculous levels of optimism front


----------



## Cloo (Jan 29, 2021)

I think we'll get a lot of 'drive in' type stuff over the summer, but I'm not sure arse-all else is happening events wise this year - or at least it probably shouldn't, much as I'd like it to be otherwise. Too much possibility of disastrous miscalculation.


----------



## Johnny Doe (Jan 30, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> The event has an older crowd and very active Facebook group and from what I gather there wasn't any kind of spread of infections after the event. Hard to tell for sure, of course.


Yeah, that crowd need another night out to stop them posting about getting more gear in all weekend!


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## BigTom (Jan 30, 2021)

US news - Coachella and Stagecoach (a huge country music festival I hadn't heard of), both planned for April, both cancelled: https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/festivals/9518452/coachella-canceled-april-2021

You'd think they would have pulled these already given they were meant to be in April.

edit: was cancelled by the local health authority: California's Coachella music festival canceled for third time
giving the benefit of the doubt, the festival might well have needed this to happen in order to claim insurance, they might not have been able to choose to cancel the event themselves and still get payouts.


----------



## TopCat (Jan 30, 2021)

zora said:


> What mad nonsense; I like the bloke they quote who basically goes: The IOC is doing a Trump now, and completely ignoring reality.
> 
> It also seriously seems to misread the room. Is there anyone on this planet who is desperate for the Olympics to go ahead come hell or high water? Maybe some athletes, idk.
> 
> ...


The Olympic money could always be better spent on something else. Vaccinations vs soon to be redundant stadia and bodies crushed by drugs and over extension.


----------



## klang (Jan 30, 2021)

Cloo said:


> I think we'll get a lot of 'drive in' type stuff over the summer


When I hear drive in I always think of quiffs, marlboros and cadillacs.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 30, 2021)

littleseb said:


> When I hear drive in I always think of quiffs, marlboros and cadillacs.


And also for me, very much evoking the image of Joe Rush's/Julien Temple's 'drive-in' Cinemarmageddon at Glastonbury!


----------



## souljacker (Jan 30, 2021)

Me and a mate have just booked tickets for bicep at the Brixton academy in September. Cross fingers it will happen but I'm not that confident.


----------



## sovereignb (Jan 30, 2021)

souljacker said:


> Me and a mate have just booked tickets for bicep at the Brixton academy in September. Cross fingers it will happen but I'm not that confident.



I work at Brixton Academy sometimes and really miss the place...its been nearly a year. But I honestly wonder how gigs continue (assuming distancing is still needed) if the whole of the downstairs is standing, in an enclosed space? Thats just one technicality. Then again, maybe that's what 02 have been brainstorming on over the last several months.


----------



## Espresso (Jan 30, 2021)

Rebellion is still alleged to be going ahead in August. 
Ten thousand people from all over the world, for four fourteen hour days of sweaty dancing inside in August. Can't see it myself.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 30, 2021)

Espresso said:


> *Rebellion is still alleged to be going ahead in August.*
> Ten thousand people from all over the world, for four fourteen hour days of sweaty dancing inside in August. Can't see it myself.



Just checked the Rebellion site ......

They've even announced early names for the 2021 line-up! 

But I agree -- reality surely dictates** it won't happen ..... unless they assume that almost all of their elderly punk audience are over a certain (vaccinated!) age ...   

*Don't Dictate', etc 

*ETA* : I've never actually been to Blackpool for this, , but moose has, and she and other friends have recommended it ...... I can see me joining other elderlies  for this in some future year!


----------



## hash tag (Jan 31, 2021)

Ride London has gone Covid-19: RideLondon cycling festival cancelled for second year


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 31, 2021)

hash tag said:


> Ride London has gone Covid-19: RideLondon cycling festival cancelled for second year


I have a feeling that will be the final nail in it’s coffin


----------



## BigTom (Jan 31, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I have a feeling that will be the final nail in it’s coffin



Was always popular and presumably quite profitable for the organising company so I would think that even if "RideLondon" goes, someone will be back in 2022 or 2023 to put on a similar event.
I think we'll see a lot of this - an existing event ceases but someone else starts something which is basically the same thing once things are back to normal


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## killer b (Jan 31, 2021)

BigTom said:


> I think we'll see a lot of this - an existing event ceases but someone else starts something which is basically the same thing once things are back to normal


I imagine a lot will be the same things organised by the same people, but without the debts incurred by the multiple cancellations


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## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 31, 2021)

BigTom said:


> Was always popular and presumably quite profitable for the organising company so I would think that even if "RideLondon" goes, someone will be back in 2022 or 2023 to put on a similar event.
> I think we'll see a lot of this - an existing event ceases but someone else starts something which is basically the same thing once things are back to normal


I’m sure I’d read somewhere the finances weren’t great, plus - like any closed road cycling event - it generates a huge amount of whinging from locals, so I’d imagine 2 years away may not help its future much. Hope I’m wrong...


----------



## BigTom (Jan 31, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’m sure I’d read somewhere the finances weren’t great, plus - like any closed road cycling event - it generates a huge amount of whinging from locals, so I’d imagine 2 years away may not help its future much. Hope I’m wrong...



tbh if they are struggling with the financials on an event which was always massively over subscribed then it was never going to last anyway, regardless of coronavirus cancellations.
Whinging from locals put paid to the one run from Birmingham in the end I think (although possibly they couldn't make it profitable enough to be worth doing and that aspect simply didn't help as they were not able to re-use the same route each year). idk whether a gap will make that any harder to manage.


----------



## ska invita (Jan 31, 2021)

FFS - Fox in Lewisham








						The Back to Business Fund
					

The Back to Business Fund offers up to £10,000 in match funding to small and independent businesses through the Pay It Forward London crowdfunding platform.




					payitforward.london.gov.uk


----------



## hash tag (Jan 31, 2021)

Wasn't that one of the first of the firkins?


----------



## spitfire (Jan 31, 2021)

ska invita said:


> FFS - Fox in Lewisham
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I thought all the Firkins had gone. Used to get _absolutely_ twatted on their strong ale at the piano singalong sessions in the Elephant one. Many, many years ago.


----------



## ska invita (Jan 31, 2021)

spitfire said:


> I thought all the Firkins had gone. Used to get _absolutely_ twatted on their strong ale at the piano singalong sessions in the Elephant one. Many, many years ago.


i think this one might be independent but kept the name? - certainly is run in an indie fashion


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Jan 31, 2021)

For an area with not a huge amount of decent boozers and live music, this place desperately needs to stay open. It seems really unfair that pubs have to carry on paying out high costs whilst being sat there closed. You'd hope that if a brewery owned the building they'd give them a rent break.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 31, 2021)

Definitely a good place (ie: there are quite a lot of gigs there which appeal to me) and it's just at the end of the P4 bus route from Brixton.
Their garden is awesome in the summer.


----------



## souljacker (Jan 31, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> For an area with not a huge amount of decent boozers and live music, this place desperately needs to stay open. It seems really unfair that pubs have to carry on paying out high costs whilst being sat there closed. You'd hope that if a brewery owned the building they'd give them a rent break.



It is actually a pisstake that if a pub is forced to close by the govt, a landlord isn't forced to forego rent at the same time.


----------



## Supine (Jan 31, 2021)

Bought a ticket for a small festival at end of July. Hopefully it will happen...


----------



## ddraig (Feb 1, 2021)

Could some festivals still go ahead this year?
					

Glastonbury is already cancelled, but MPs are working on how to support the music festival industry.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## editor (Feb 1, 2021)

The back of Uncut magazine is stuffed full of major band tours, all scheduled from Sept/Oct onwards this year.


----------



## BigMoaner (Feb 1, 2021)

How the Heck are music venues/nightclubs goijg to survive this? Can you imagine sat fabric or ministry etc opening within the next year?


----------



## Mogden (Feb 1, 2021)

editor said:


> The back of Uncut magazine is stuffed full of major band tours, all scheduled from Sept/Oct onwards this year.


I don't see them ahead but I have to say being allowed to carry over holiday to this year will be a boon cos I'm basically going to be listening to music solidly for the last quarter of the year if all goes well.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 1, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> How the Heck are music venues/nightclubs goijg to survive this? Can you imagine sat fabric or ministry etc opening within the next year?


An awful lot won't survive, simple as that


----------



## ddraig (Feb 1, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> How the Heck are music venues/nightclubs goijg to survive this? Can you imagine sat fabric or ministry etc opening within the next year?


in the bbc article I linked to someone says 50% will go under, and that's optimistic


----------



## miss direct (Feb 1, 2021)

I think when restrictions are completely lifted, a lot of people will want nights out. I've not been in a nightclub for maybe a decade, and I'd like to go once things open again. People will have an appetite.


----------



## ddraig (Feb 1, 2021)

miss direct said:


> I think when restrictions are completely lifted, a lot of people will want nights out. I've not been in a nightclub for maybe a decade, and I'd like to go once things open again. People will have an appetite.


Yes of course, this is about festivals and big gigs, which often don't have premises so a lot of costs, work and risks
Will there be an appetite for festivals and big gigs?


----------



## BigMoaner (Feb 1, 2021)

ddraig said:


> in the bbc article I linked to someone says 50% will go under, and that's optimistic


Devestating.


----------



## BigTom (Feb 1, 2021)

miss direct said:


> I think when restrictions are completely lifted, a lot of people will want nights out. I've not been in a nightclub for maybe a decade, and I'd like to go once things open again. People will have an appetite.



The costs of opening a new venue are substantial and takes time.
Somewhere that goes bankrupt will just leave behind the shell of the building and perhaps fittings like the bar itself.
Anything that can be easily removed and sold like the sound system and lighting will be gone.

So anyone looking to open up a new place where something used to be will need money.
They will also need to get a new licence and honestly I have no idea how much time that takes. They may well need to do remedial works if the building has been mothballed for 1-2 years and not maintained. There may be things relating to changes in fire/building/crowd regulations that were grandfathered in to the old venue but need to be changed for it to re-open.

For those venues that make it through, I think you are right, there will be a big pay day once they are allowed to open without social distancing restrictions, but replacing the ones that close is not going to be easy or quick.


----------



## Supine (Feb 1, 2021)

Someone on the radio (I think!) mentioned that the 1918 flu pandemic ushered in the roaring twenties when everyone wanted to go out and party. I like that idea.


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 1, 2021)

BigTom said:


> The costs of opening a new venue are substantial and takes time.
> Somewhere that goes bankrupt will just leave behind the shell of the building and perhaps fittings like the bar itself.
> Anything that can be easily removed and sold like the sound system and lighting will be gone.
> 
> ...


Plus there must be plenty of landlords looking to flog music venues off to property developers.
I agree the cost of opening a "new" venue in a closed one is going to be high, but if the building gets flogged and turned into flats, there's no way back.

many towns won't have anywhere that could be turned into a venue if that happens.  It's grim.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 1, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Plus there must be plenty of landlords looking to flog music venues off to property developers.


This is the single biggest threat. Vultures will be circling a lot of places - prime city centre locations, usually in "trendy" areas, with a chance to buy (relatively) cheap and make a killing.


----------



## BigMoaner (Feb 1, 2021)

editor said:


> The back of Uncut magazine is stuffed full of major band tours, all scheduled from Sept/Oct onwards this year.


nothing to loose i guess - take a punt, if things happen to be good to go, no harm done. if not, just a refund on tickets. 

i forsee events etc going ahead, but socially distanced, rule of 6 etc. sweath dark cramped night clubs/comedy clubs/etc, just can't see how they are going to operate? who wants to rave socially distanced?


----------



## killer b (Feb 1, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> who wants to rave socially distanced?


i'd be fine with that tbh. I like a bit of space around me.


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 1, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> nothing to loose i guess - take a punt, if things happen to be good to go, no harm done. if not, just a refund on tickets.
> 
> i forsee events etc going ahead, but socially distanced, rule of 6 etc. sweath dark cramped night clubs/comedy clubs/etc, just can't see how they are going to operate? who wants to rave socially distanced?


The guy who runs Undercover (indoor punk festival) is a really genuine guy who just wants to put bands on.  He remains, I think, "overly optimistic".  

Undercover 9 has been postponed to October 2021, which, fingers crossed,  might go ahead, but he's still advertising indoor socially distanced gigs in April.  I mean, I hope it works out, but ffs, it's not going to happen, is it? 

See You Down The Front! - Undercover Festival and Events 

if you fancy it.


----------



## BigMoaner (Feb 1, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> The guy who runs Undercover (indoor punk festival) is a really genuine guy who just wants to put bands on.  He remains, I think, "overly optimistic".
> 
> Undercover 9 has been postponed to October 2021, which, fingers crossed,  might go ahead, but he's still advertising indoor socially distanced gigs in April.  I mean, I hope it works out, but ffs, it's not going to happen, is it?
> 
> ...


before virus, after the collapse of my marriage, i was deep in a Great Mid Life Crisis and going raving again to many of my old drum and bass haunts. Ditched drugs and drink in my early 20s but boy the few times i went clubbing before the virus were beautiful, healing, etc. No drugs required. Even went on my own once. Work hard at my half decent job, have my kids half the week, hit the clubs every other weekend. life was looking up. Now going out is Sainsburys. Anyway, first world problems in the context of pandemic.

will check out the link


----------



## editor (Feb 1, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> nothing to loose i guess - take a punt, if things happen to be good to go, no harm done. if not, just a refund on tickets.


If it's anything like our gigs/tours that have been postponed/cancelled, there is absolutely a financial hit. If our US/Canada tour gets postponed for the fourth time, I suspect we'll have to call it off permanently.


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 1, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> before virus, after the collapse of my marriage, i was deep in a Great Mid Life Crisis and going raving again to many of my old drum and bass haunts. Ditched drugs and drink in my early 20s but boy the few times i went clubbing before the virus were beautiful, healing, etc. No drugs required. Even went on my own once. Work hard at my half decent job, have my kids half the week, hit the clubs every other weekend. life was looking up. Now going out is Sainsburys. Anyway, first world problems in the context of pandemic.
> 
> will check out the link


I go (or rather went, pre covid) to gigs and festivals on my own a lot.  My mates just aren't into it and mrs mx doesn't do camping at DIY festies with portaloos, or getting pissed at noisy punk gigs.  Having been in a mid-life crisis for at least 12 years now, going to stuff on my own really doesn't bother me any more.


----------



## BigMoaner (Feb 1, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> I go (or rather went, pre covid) to gigs and festivals on my own a lot.  My mates just aren't into it and mrs mx doesn't do camping at DIY festies with portaloos, or getting pissed at noisy punk gigs.  Having been in a mid-life crisis for at least 12 years now, going to stuff on my own really doesn't bother me any more.


yes, it used to happen back in my 20s as well. if no one else was staying out out, that would definitely no deter me. often met great people/pulled. 

it can mean focusing on the music that much more intensely too.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 1, 2021)

Have gone out plenty of times on my own to clubs too. Ill often get a freebie to Ministry of Sound, but hardly any of my mates like trance and many have settled down, so i go alone. Ill bosh a pill then nip off once the DJ(s) i like have finished at about 3 or 4am.. Better than sitting at home or just going for 'a few drinks' at the pub.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 1, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> The guy who runs Undercover (indoor punk festival) is a really genuine guy who just wants to put bands on.  He remains, I think, "overly optimistic".
> 
> Undercover 9 has been postponed to October 2021, which, fingers crossed,  might go ahead, but he's still advertising indoor socially distanced gigs in April.  I mean, I hope it works out, but ffs, it's not going to happen, is it?
> 
> ...



Abdoujaporove and Roddy Radiation would be my two biggest must-sees in that line-up!  

<think that might be our going-to-Sheffield w/e though ....  >


----------



## miss direct (Feb 1, 2021)

Are any of these people who go out alone female? Just curious. Not sure I'd feel safe, well not if I was drinking.


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 1, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Abdoujaporove and Roddy Radiation would be my two biggest must-sees in that line-up!
> 
> <hink that might be our going-to-Sheffield w/e though ....  >


 I saw Roddy Radiation at Undercover 8, in March 2020, just before lockdown.  Still don't know how I didn't catch Covid there.  I'll pass on him, but, yep to Aboujaparov, who I last saw at SE back at the end of September 2019.  Class act, and a lovely bloke.  

The Undercover guy did some socially distanced gigs between lockdowns.  Eastfield, my favourite band in the whole wide world ever, played.  I could easily have driven there but it just didn't appeal.  I can't see myself going to "socially distanced gigs",  particularly not indoors.


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 1, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Are any of these people who go out alone female? Just curious. Not sure I'd feel safe, well not if I was drinking.


Fair point, well made.  

Easy for blokes to talk about these things as if they were normal, whilst forgetting women might have a completely different perspective.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 1, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Are any of these people who go out alone female? Just curious. Not sure I'd feel safe, well not if I was drinking.



Over my gigging and festival-going years, I have to admit that the number of lone females I've seen are much in the minority 
What mx wcfc said ......

Saying that, females going out with two or three female friends can be more frequently seen, as I recall 

(Depends on what type of gig or fest I suppose, who's playing, how safe the venue or site feels, etc., etc.  )


----------



## Mogden (Feb 1, 2021)

I do gigs alone but then I'm nearly 6ft tall and sturdy as a brick shithouse. I'd do festivals alone in a heartbeat if I could learn to bloody well drive but as it is I usually go with mates and am prone to wandering off to see other mates and urbs.


----------



## Mation (Feb 1, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Are any of these people who go out alone female? Just curious. Not sure I'd feel safe, well not if I was drinking.


I went out alone quite a bit, pre-pandemic. Sometimes just for an after-party; so I'd sleep first and set my alarm for 6 am or something, and go out in daylight. That was mostly because I wasn't doing drugs, though.

Had a bit of hassle a couple of times, but nothing that would stop me going. I'm reasonably tall and strong though, and don't usually feel physically intimidated. None of which means I actually _am_ safe, but I feel it. ADHD probably plays a part in that, too. 

Once, when there was a particularly persistent tosser, I went and found a bouncer. She was very young and very big and had no qualms about throwing him out.


----------



## thismoment (Feb 2, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Are any of these people who go out alone female? Just curious. Not sure I'd feel safe, well not if I was drinking.


When I was 19, at uni but living at home, it seemed like all the friendship groups of people my age where living in halls so I didn’t manage to make friends. I got fed up of waiting to be invited to go out so I went through a short phase of going out by myself. I’d get chatting to a group and have a few drinks but not as many as to be drink.


----------



## Mogden (Feb 2, 2021)

The only bit I find a pain at gigs is the perineum of the performance, that bit between the support act and the main event.  Very very rarely drink at gigs so can't distract myself with the bar queue and I usually do the merch stall on arrival.

Oh I've just remembered, Gig Armada! Also up this way we have Nottingham Gig Buddies where I've met a few new faces and found out just how small the gig going circuit is when I realise who our mutual friends are. Means you're going alone but not there on your own IYSWIM. Plus you don't have to find your drunk mate for the journey home


----------



## Oula (Feb 2, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Are any of these people who go out alone female? Just curious. Not sure I'd feel safe, well not if I was drinking.


I am female and go to gigs on my own. I've never had any hassle at all when on my own. I'll have a drink or two but I wouldn't get pissed.


Mogden said:


> The only bit I find a pain at gigs is the perineum of the performance, that bit between the support act and the main event.


I take a book when I go to gigs on my own and sit at the back with a pint and a book in that gap.


----------



## Mogden (Feb 2, 2021)

Oula said:


> I take a book when I go to goods on my own and site at the back with a pint and a book in that gap.



Good idea.  Once my brain sorts itself out and I can read again I'll give it a try.



Also, it's Solo Armada, not Gig Armada. Members often wear badges so you can spot them without any awkward are you so and so interactions.


----------



## editor (Feb 2, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> I go (or rather went, pre covid) to gigs and festivals on my own a lot.  My mates just aren't into it and mrs mx doesn't do camping at DIY festies with portaloos, or getting pissed at noisy punk gigs.  Having been in a mid-life crisis for at least 12 years now, going to stuff on my own really doesn't bother me any more.


I quite like going out on my own sometimes, although if it's in Brixton I'm almost certainly going to bump into people, but then I don't have the responsibility of having to hang out with them all night!


----------



## gosub (Feb 4, 2021)

Just used my Nick Cave Lisbon refund for Gogol Bordello & Beck in Croatia.  (refunds for EU citzens only) but I'll risk the punt


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 4, 2021)

Le Maitre have just gone into liquidation.

They’re _the_ company that made big stages look cool - pyro, haze, smoke and pretty much any other special FX you can think of. This is a big, big loss to the industry.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 4, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Le Maitre have just gone into liquidation.
> 
> They’re _the_ company that made big stages look cool - pyro, haze, smoke and pretty much any other special FX you can think of. This is a big, big loss to the industry.



I can imagine Boomtown might use them for a lot of their stages. Fucks sake


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

DP


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> nothing to loose i guess - take a punt, if things happen to be good to go, no harm done. if not, just a refund on tickets.
> 
> i forsee events etc going ahead, but socially distanced, rule of 6 etc. sweath dark cramped night clubs/comedy clubs/etc, just can't see how they are going to operate? who wants to rave socially distanced?



This isn’t quite true.

Big tours get planned months and months ahead of time. Lampies are paid to plan the light show, tour managers are paid to be available and not sign on with another band or find another job (especially if it’s someone who’s part of the regular crew and not a hired hand), stage sets (even if it’s just a backdrop) need to be designed, made, and sometimes flight cased with custom made cases, rehearsals happen in studios starting at once a week and building up to twice or three times a week, with techs present and sound engineers involved, merch needs planning and manufacturing. On the admin side tours get advanced way ahead of the first night, with loads of people involved making lists, ticking them off, collating imforation, stitching it all together seamlessly, hotels get books; and then catering companies do their own advancing too. People wonder why tickets are so pricey, it’s because you're not just paying for the two hours a band is on stage, you’re paying for the army on the move for maybe a whole year, certainly many months before the first night, and then the gyroscopic balancing act of keeping the circus on the road.

Even mid sized bands need to do all this to some degree. Even small bands do some version of it.



The trick of making RocknRoll look like a bunch of relaxed wastrels strolling onstage like it’s the most natural thing in the world is a complex and complicated process.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> I go (or rather went, pre covid) to gigs and festivals on my own a lot.  My mates just aren't into it and mrs mx doesn't do camping at DIY festies with portaloos, or getting pissed at noisy punk gigs.  Having been in a mid-life crisis for at least 12 years now, going to stuff on my own really doesn't bother me any more.




I actively enjoy going to gigs and festivals on my own. Even when I was a teenager. People would say “who are you here with?” and it always struck me as a weird question, even though I got asked it every single time. Years later, decades later, when I’d bump into people from back then, they’d always comment “You used to come out in your own” and I realised it was something I’d been known for. I don’t know why it seemed so easy and obvious to me. I had friends I’d go out with and meet up with too, but it was kinda an add on.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Are any of these people who go out alone female? Just curious. Not sure I'd feel safe, well not if I was drinking.




Me! I’ve always done it and still do.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Fair point, well made.
> 
> Easy for blokes to talk about these things as if they were normal, whilst forgetting women might have a completely different perspective.




Sorry for the multi-posting.



Clubs are more tricky than gigs and festivals. In my experience.

I did go to clubs alone, but then I’d meet up with pals there. If I didn’t know people there it was always much more of a gamble in terms of the #metoo bullshit.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

Oula said:


> I am female and go to gigs on my own. I've never had any hassle at all when on my own. I'll have a drink or two but I wouldn't get pissed.
> 
> I take a book when I go to gigs on my own and sit at the back with a pint and a book in that gap.




I’ve done that too. Or New Scientist, which prompts certain types to start a conversation with me, and mostly puts off the tossers.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Le Maitre have just gone into liquidation.
> 
> They’re _the_ company that made big stages look cool - pyro, haze, smoke and pretty much any other special FX you can think of. This is a big, big loss to the industry.



This is like a hole below the waterline...


----------



## editor (Feb 4, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Sorry for the multi-posting.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think gigs are easier on your own because there's a focus and something to look at, and if it's a smaller gig you can always strike up a chat with the band/soundman/merch people whatever. Clubs can be especially tricky if the music is so loud there's no chance of striking up a casual conversation, and it's even harder if you don't like the music!


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 4, 2021)

editor said:


> I think gigs are easier on your own because there's a focus and something to look at, and if it's a smaller gig you can always strike up a chat with the band/soundman/merch people whatever. Clubs can be especially tricky if the music is so loud there's no chance of striking up a casual conversation, and it's even harder if you don't like the music!



All of this is true.

But I have found that, being a woman, striking up a conversation with someone associated with the band would often get me filed as “groupie, predatory slut looking for a hook up with the band, she certainly doesn’t know anything about music because women don’t know about music”.

Tedious, so I default back to waiting for them to approach me.

Or I just barrel up to the band and introduce myself. 


But yeah, gigs are about listening to /watching the show while clubs are about completely different stuff. Sometimes I’ll turn up, watch the room, see the band, and fuck off, without talking to anyone at all. Especially if I’m just wanting to find out what the  band is about.


----------



## Mation (Feb 5, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> All of this is true.
> 
> But I have found that, being a woman, striking up a conversation with someone associated with the band would often get me filed as “groupie, predatory slut looking for a hook up with the band, she certainly doesn’t know anything about music because women don’t know about music”.
> 
> ...


The only times I'd ever go to clubs were for one offs with very particular music and where I'd assume that everyone else was there for the music, too, because it wasn't a general clubbing crowd. I can be very single-minded about dancing. But it wasn't 100% effective at weeding out the tossers, as above.





SheilaNaGig said:


> I actively enjoy going to gigs and festivals on my own. Even when I was a teenager. People would say “who are you here with?” and it always struck me as a weird question, even though I got asked it every single time. Years later, decades later, when I’d bump into people from back then, they’d always comment “You used to come out in your own” and I realised it was something I’d been known for. I don’t know why it seemed so easy and obvious to me. I had friends I’d go out with and meet up with too, but it was kinda an add on.


I didn't fully hit my dancing stride till my 30s, but I've always gone to pubs alone, since I was a teenager. I adore having a leisurely drink, reading and keeping a quarter of an eye on the football. It's a really different thing to going to the pub with friends, which I also love.


----------



## Sunray (Feb 5, 2021)

The only venue I buy a drink is the garage. It’s got more than cans of red stripe or Guinness for £6 which is getting s ridiculous.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 5, 2021)

Sunray said:


> The only venue I buy a drink is the garage. It’s got more than cans of red stripe or Guinness for £6 which is getting s ridiculous.



We know one garage right next to the nice park locally where you can get Henry Weston's Medium Dry Vintage Cider (8.2%)   for about as cheap as the supermarkets  (slightly over £2= a bottle) 

Well, in the absence of gigs and festivals last summer (or this  ) what else can you be doing?


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 5, 2021)

Sunray said:


> The only venue I buy a drink is the garage. It’s got more than cans of red stripe or Guinness for £6 which is getting s ridiculous.




I’ve seen some decent bands at The Garage.


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 5, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I’ve seen some decent bands at The Garage.


Yeh I saw the blaggers there, nice venue
Also saw Gertrude upstairs there, DK if anyone else remembers them


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 5, 2021)

Oh wow, look!
The garage has listings!

I saw this happening or have they just not taken it down ? It doesn’t say cancelled....

The Lovely Eggs are playing....


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 5, 2021)

Although that gig isn’t listed on their own listings page, others are

Wha’gwan??

Are these live-streamed gigs?

Has lockdown been lifted and I didn’t know know??


----------



## editor (Feb 5, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Although that gig isn’t listed on their own listings page, others are
> 
> Wha’gwan??
> 
> ...


Those listings are auto-generated by Songkick who clearly haven't bothered to update them.

I see that they're more or less on the same circuit as us!


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 5, 2021)

Pickman's model said:


> Yeh I saw the blaggers there, nice venue
> Also saw Gertrude upstairs there, DK if anyone else remembers them




I remember Gertrude. My mate N was well into them.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Feb 5, 2021)

editor said:


> Those listings are auto-generated by Songkick who clearly haven't bothered to update them.


----------



## campanula (Feb 5, 2021)

We are planning our annual 'party in the woods' this year (August bank holiday). We moved it up to Midsummer for the last 2 but have fingers crossed for late August. Since it only involves a decent rig and around 200 people, we are just staying optimistic. This year would have been our 9th year so means we will make an extra effort for next year. Obvs, we don't book bands or anything - it is all very DIY and a bit feral. As a bit of a recluse, I usually piss and moan about it but have missed it terribly the last year.


----------



## editor (Feb 5, 2021)

campanula said:


> We are planning our annual 'party in the woods' this year (August bank holiday). We moved it up to Midsummer for the last 2 but have fingers crossed for late August. Since it only involves a decent rig and around 200 people, we are just staying optimistic. This year would have been our 9th year so means we will make an extra effort for next year. Obvs, we don't book bands or anything - it is all very DIY and a bit feral. As a bit of a recluse, I usually piss and moan about it but have missed it terribly the last year.


I really want to do some sort of Bowie fundraising charity gig this year in lieu of the one I had to cancel in January.


----------



## campanula (Feb 5, 2021)

I am hoping there is some allowance made for small, outdoor gigs and events by the later half of summer. Back in the day, I went to many little fairs and shambolic festivals - some of which had only a coupla hundred people. Thinking of the Albion Fairs, Barsham, Hood, Megan,  Eye and the like. Done on tiny budgets, with local bands, workshops, puppet shows and such. Using this DIY, small scale, bottom-up method of organising (not unlike many squat parties), could be a template for a way out of another summer of isolation. For me, it would also be a welcome return to an earlier ethos of working together, sharing equipment, staying small and local...a reminder that festivals were first and foremost about us, dancing in a field, with kids, dogs, music, self-generated pleasures...and not some vast, mega-business involving huge amounts of money, security, transport, admin...and so on. Might just be me, being nostalgic for a remembered past...but I kinda welcome restrictions on numbers, ticket pricing, VIP hierarchies, heliports, and the whole infrastructure of the big-business model of festival going.


----------



## nyxx (Feb 6, 2021)

All of this!




campanula said:


> I am hoping there is some allowance made for small, outdoor gigs and events by the later half of summer. Back in the day, I went to many little fairs and shambolic festivals - some of which had only a coupla hundred people. Thinking of the Albion Fairs, Barsham, Hood, Megan,  Eye and the like. Done on tiny budgets, with local bands, workshops, puppet shows and such. Using this DIY, small scale, bottom-up method of organising (not unlike many squat parties), could be a template for a way out of another summer of isolation. For me, it would also be a welcome return to an earlier ethos of working together, sharing equipment, staying small and local...a reminder that festivals were first and foremost about us, dancing in a field, with kids, dogs, music, self-generated pleasures...and not some vast, mega-business involving huge amounts of money, security, transport, admin...and so on. Might just be me, being nostalgic for a remembered past...but I kinda welcome restrictions on numbers, ticket pricing, VIP hierarchies, heliports, and the whole infrastructure of the big-business model of festival going.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

campanula : *Fully* agreeing with your wish for small DIY-type events to happen later this year, and I'm not _completely_ pessimistic for some minor stuff by about August/September (?)

We know Gail Something Else who (excellently!) organises very small (max 500) events with little bands and a beer/cider/tea  tent -- the biggest names ever seen bands-wise would be an outfit you might at a push see in a tiny fringe tent in the Green Fields at Glastonbury. 
But mostly, the acts she books would  be at or a little above touring-the-pubs level.

She's insisting she''s going to exert every effort to have these happening again in 2020. We'll see!


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 6, 2021)

There’s just way too many “what ifs” yet. Anyone saying they have plans for this summer is very much making a bet.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

However, I think Nozstock, which we and friends would love to go to, are being hugely overly optiomistic here  ..... July FFS!! 

The announcement in the above link came shortly after Glastonbury was officially cancelled I think.

Their event is about 5,000 people.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> There’s just way too many “what ifs” yet. Anyone saying they have plans for this summer is very much making a bet.



She -- Gail -- did only say she'd be making her best efforts, and her events are ultra-tiny. I agree with your caution though, and yes, it is a gamble for sure..


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 6, 2021)

Even “tiny” events won’t be what people want though. Festivals and gigs are all about that closeness, the connections, the shared experience. Having to keep socially distanced from others loses the fundamental part of what makes a live show what it is. It just becomes a group of people standing in a field.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

All we can do is manage expectations big-style, and give one or two small events a try, and see what happens. 

*IF* they happen .....


----------



## Supine (Feb 6, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Even “tiny” events won’t be what people want though. Festivals and gigs are all about that closeness, the connections, the shared experience. Having to keep socially distanced from others loses the fundamental part of what makes a live show what it is. It just becomes a group of people standing in a field.



I strongly suspect that social distancing won't be a big thing for vaccinated festival goers. Looking forward to it


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 6, 2021)

Supine said:


> I strongly suspect that social distancing won't be a big thing for vaccinated festival goers. Looking forward to it


Social distancing isn’t going away any time soon, vaccine or not.


----------



## Supine (Feb 6, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Social distancing isn’t going away any time soon, vaccine or not.



I bet you £50 it is at festivals outdoors. Legal or not


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 6, 2021)

Supine said:


> I bet you £50 it is at festivals outdoors. Legal or not


Which is why they shouldn’t happen.


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## ddraig (Feb 6, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> She -- Gail -- did only say she'd be making her best efforts, and her events are ultra-tiny. I agree with your caution though, and yes, it is a gamble for sure..


No the cat's mother then! "she" is superfluous, try using "they"


----------



## Mation (Feb 6, 2021)

editor said:


> I really want to do some sort of Bowie fundraising charity gig this year in lieu of the one I had to cancel in January.


When this is all sufficiently over, can you put on a great big fuck off Offline, with urbanites as a priority, please? So we can all have a roaring twenties catch-up?


----------



## editor (Feb 6, 2021)

Mation said:


> When this is all sufficiently over, can you put on a great big fuck off Offline, with urbanites as a priority, please? So we can all have a roaring twenties catch-up?


100% definite.


----------



## Mation (Feb 6, 2021)

editor said:


> 100% definite.


Oh my goodness!  That is _excellent _news  💖  🥳


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## editor (Feb 6, 2021)

Well this is a glimmer of hope. The loons will wig out - so they can stay at home at look at YouTube videos from fake doctors - but I have absolutely no problem being tested yo gain access to a big event.



> Primavera Sound has held a non-socially distanced event with rapid testing for attendees on arrival that produced no COVID-19 infections.
> 
> The Barcelona promoter and festival organiser held the small concert last month at the indoor Sala Apolo venue in the city.
> 
> ...












						Primavera's non-socially distanced, rapid test event produces no COVID infections
					

The event took place in December and was carried out safely



					mixmag.net


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

ddraig said:


> No the cat's mother then! "she" is superfluous, try using "they"



Petty. Unnecessary. Etc.  x 3

(We know her really well and we absolutely respect everything she does. Do you even _know_ about her achievements as a sound feminist and well-loved [small] festival organiser? )


----------



## ddraig (Feb 6, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Petty. Unnecessary. Etc.  x 3
> 
> (We know her really well and we absolutely respect everything they do. Do you even _know_ about their achievements as a sound feminist and well-loved [small] festival organiser? )


Another typical poor wiwiam response
Do you what's unnecessary? you referring to them as "she"
aww you know them well done you, yes, yes I do so stick that in your whiney pipe


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

Will you just please!! stop derailing this thread with your *utter* pettiness? 

Your completely random and stupidly gratuitous jibe at my *supposed!* lack of feminist-awareness will almost certainly confuse others on his thread too I suspect.

And no,  none of this 'exchange' is 'all' about me.
It's 100% or more about *YOU* -- just think about that a bit maybe 

PS : also,, do you know _anything_ about Gail and her festival stuff? I doubt it, not that that's important really ..... as isn't all this


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

Oh yes, congratulations!!!, you *have *pissed me off.

As you _very _clearly intended .

Well done -- it's *you* that's making it 'all about me', and as for ever on Urban, you've been _brilliant_ with that on here. -- nice


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

I'm not in the slightest bit important btw, and *neither are you*.

</continues to drink strong beer to fail to cope!  >


----------



## ddraig (Feb 6, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Will you just please!! stop derailing this thread with your *utter* pettiness?
> 
> Your completely random and stupidly gratuitous jibe at my supposed lack of feminist-awareness will almost certainly confuse others on his thread too I suspect.
> 
> ...





William of Walworth said:


> Oh yes, congratulations!!!, you *have *pissed me off.
> 
> As you very clearly intended.
> 
> Well done -- it's *you* that;'s making it 'all about me', and as for ever on Urban, you've been _brilliant_ with that on here. -- nice


Going off on one yet again! Well done on the derail and the usual *MASSIVE *overreaction!
It was a point about not referring to women as "she", why do you take that as a "random and stupidly gratuitous jibe at my supposed lack of feminist-awareness"??
Dramatic much

I already answered your sneering point about know the things they do.
Don't you think it's telling that you accuse someone of derailing whilst making 3, count em *THREE*, whiney posts in a row?  
Try getting a grip and calming down eh, or just mutter whilst nursing your strong beer


----------



## killer b (Feb 6, 2021)

Hang on, why shouldn't William refer to a woman as 'she'?


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 6, 2021)

(Edited away what I just posted)

Leave it, he's not worth it  (suggestion to self  )


----------



## Mation (Feb 6, 2021)

Time for bed, ddraig?


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 7, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Another typical poor wiwiam response
> Do you what's unnecessary? you referring to them as "she"
> aww you know them well done you, yes, yes I do so stick that in your whiney pipe


You really are a pestiferous little skidmark aren't you?


----------



## Johnny Doe (Feb 7, 2021)

Sunray said:


> The only venue I buy a drink is the garage. It’s got more than cans of red stripe or Guinness for £6 which is getting s ridiculous.


It read this thinking you were talking about a 24 hr garage


----------



## sojourner (Feb 7, 2021)

killer b said:


> Hang on, why shouldn't William refer to a woman as 'she'?


This.


----------



## Orang Utan (Feb 7, 2021)

Just got adverstised at by a festival asking for deposits for their even in August


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## strung out (Feb 7, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Going off on one yet again! Well done on the derail and the usual *MASSIVE *overreaction!
> It was a point about not referring to women as "she", why do you take that as a "random and stupidly gratuitous jibe at my supposed lack of feminist-awareness"??
> Dramatic much
> 
> ...


Your weird beef with William is probably the most pathetic thing I've seen on this forum in ages. No idea why he shouldn't refer to a woman as 'she', but you'd do well to just put him on ignore if he winds you up so much, or better still, just refrain from posting at all.


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 7, 2021)

I can't be arsed to chase down why wow shouldn't call a woman she, but it's a rather peculiar thing to attack him for


----------



## Sunray (Feb 7, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> There’s just way too many “what ifs” yet. Anyone saying they have plans for this summer is very much making a bet.



This, lots of us want to have another camping thing again.  I might ask about the availability of the field but you can't predict anything. If she does it without a deposit like last year then I might book it.  I think august.  

But on reflection, I don't think it matters too much about the number of people.  I'm only talking about 50 people but none will be vaccinated.  Potential for lots of people to get sick.


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2021)

Beautiful Days wisely holding back on a decision until April 



> Unlike some of our bigger friends we have a little bit more time before we have to make a decision as to whether we can, or cannot, go ahead this year. We are continuing to discuss and plan for 2021 and will be closely monitoring how things develop over the next few months. A decision will be made at the beginning of April.
> 
> Thank you to everyone who rolled ticket bookings over from 2020. If we’re able to go ahead this year then tickets will go back on sale in April and we will start announcing artists. We very much hope to see you all this Summer
> 
> In the meantime stay safe


----------



## hash tag (Feb 8, 2021)

The saddest yet, HCVS London Brighton run. One of the first things to go into our diary.


----------



## editor (Feb 11, 2021)

Festivals returning to the Netherlands:



> Festivals in the Netherlands have started revealing plans for 2021 editions following the Dutch government announcing it aims to allow festivals from July 1, and will insure events planned after this date that are cancelled due to COVID-19.
> 
> Last month, a cancellation fund of at least €300 million was announced by the Dutch government to allow event organisers to plan for the second half of 2021 with security that they will be covered if the pandemic stops events going ahead for a second year running.





> It covers events that attract a minimum of 3,000 visitors from July 1 through to the end of the year, with Dutch culture minister Ingrid van Engelshoven saying it is not “reasonable” to expect “masses can stand close together on a field” before that time.
> 
> She added: “[This fund] is a dot on the horizon for festival organizers. They can fall back on the guarantee fund in which at least €300m has been reserved. The event industry has long come to a standstill due to Corona. Guarantee is needed to get it back on track.”











						Dutch government plans to allow festivals from July
					

A cancellation insurance fund will cover festivals aiming to take place in the second half of 2021



					www.mixmag.net


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 11, 2021)

The important bit there being that insurance fund... That’s what’s needed here. I’m not going to hold my breath though.


----------



## Sunray (Feb 11, 2021)

The Boomtown organisers together with other festivals were presenting their case some months ago, asking for Gov backed insurance exactly like the one supplied by the Dutch.

Covered here








						Government stalls on insurance scheme for UK music festivals
					

Culture minister claims getting start date for events is first step, but organisers say festival planning is impossible without cover, as offered to the film and TV sector




					www.theguardian.com
				




The Tory Gov is being short-sighted as they always are.  Their own incompetence has got us to this point, yet they don't see it like this.  As far as the government are concerned, what's the point of insuring events when many if not all of them will be cancelled. 
This is a £5 billion industry, generates a lot of foreign tourisim and provides lots of jobs.  Supporting it in some way is an investment for when times are better.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 12, 2021)

A year ago today the Mobile World Congress in Barcelona was cancelled. That was the canary in the coal mine...


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 15, 2021)

This follows on from...


----------



## Mogden (Feb 15, 2021)

Sarah Millican has today shifted her 2021 dates to next year and stand up is one of those things you'd think could be within guidelines, not necessarily safely mind, with a smaller audience.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 15, 2021)

Mogden said:


> Sarah Millican has today shifted her 2021 dates to next year and stand up is one of those things you'd think could be within guidelines, not necessarily safely mind, with a smaller audience.


When had they been scheduled in 2021?


----------



## Mogden (Feb 15, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> When had they been scheduled in 2021?


Pretty early on.  May/June.


----------



## Elpenor (Feb 15, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Stone Roses tribute band gig delayed by 2 years from 2020 to 2022



life echoing art, a wait to rival The Second Coming 

(edited because the quote wasn’t working)


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 16, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> View attachment 254536
> 
> This follows on from...
> 
> ...



*Three!!* postponements may well be a record so far, in the Covid-caused delay stakes?? 

(I speculate -- I have no idea whether any other events have been put off like that any more than twice!!)


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 16, 2021)

Women’s Tour postponed due to uncertainty around the pandemic
					

Organiser Sweetspot is confident the race can happen and has applied for the six-day race to be held in October




					www.cyclingweekly.com
				




Women's Tour cycling event moved from June to October.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 16, 2021)

Reopened festivals and stadiums in England could be used for mass Covid testing
					

Public events could be way of monitoring infection levels after the population is vaccinated




					www.theguardian.com
				




The rapid testing idea being floated again but by government this time. Can't quite imagine the logistics of testing everyone getting into a club would work tbh.


----------



## Elpenor (Feb 16, 2021)

A lot of running races are postponing to 2022, these might involve as an example - use of police to close roads, portaloos, event stewarding, st johns ambulance etc


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 16, 2021)

Elpenor said:


> A lot of running races are postponing to 2022, these might involve as an example - use of police to close roads, portaloos, event stewarding, st johns ambulance etc



Are they? The big closed road type events are mostly still planning on running in autumn from what I've seen. I've only noticed one or two smaller ones being put back to next year at this point.


----------



## Elpenor (Feb 16, 2021)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Are they? The big closed road type events are mostly still planning on running in autumn from what I've seen. I've only noticed one or two smaller ones being put back to next year at this point.



I'm talking club organised races, e.g. The Grizzly, Terminator - these are mainly offroad in Devon and Wiltshire respectively. I don't do big closed road events.


----------



## ddraig (Feb 16, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> *Three!!* postponements may well be a record so far, in the Covid-caused delay stakes??
> 
> (I speculate -- I have no idea whether any other events have been put off like that any more than twice!!)


Think a Warmduscher gig I have tickets for has been moved 3 times, now also in 2022, meh


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 16, 2021)

Elpenor said:


> I'm talking club organised races, e.g. The Grizzly, Terminator - these are mainly offroad in Devon and Wiltshire respectively. I don't do big closed road events.



Fair enough. I've seen one or two being cancelled too and I can see events relying on volunteer organisers can do without the uncertainty. I'd still say races are probably more likely than a lot of other large events to be on though, fingers crossed.


----------



## Elpenor (Feb 16, 2021)

Henley postponed because of pandemic
					

The 2021 Henley Royal Regatta will be postponed until August due to ongoing Covid-19 restrictions.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




Henley Regatta delayed to mid-August, it was due to take place in early July. Will be after the Olympics now.

My gut feeling is they will run it as a closed event at Dorney Lake (which is owned by Eton College), easier to keep crowds out.


----------



## editor (Feb 21, 2021)

Sad times for road crews:



> Road crew for some of the biggest bands in music are being forced into homelessness and turning to food banks to survive during the pandemic.
> 
> Stagehand, the charity for roadies, has given more than 1,000 grants so far and said 13% of those receiving money had needed support from food banks.
> 
> ...


I can relate to this:



> “These people have worked for 30 or 40 years and paid taxes, but because they are technically self-employed many have had no support from the government and are now relying on foodbanks.”











						Bands rally to help as jobless roadies turn to food banks
					

Stage crews laid off as a result of the pandemic are ‘falling through the cracks’ in government aid for the self-employed




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## belboid (Feb 23, 2021)

The Leadmill has sold 3,000 of its week long re-opening events from June 21.  Hawkwind have announced the Hawkfest will be happening at the end of August.  Both fucking mad, if you ask me, though there's no question the leadmill will sell out almost every night I expect.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 23, 2021)

Slam Dunk Festival | Rock, Pop-Punk, Emo & Alternative Music
					

Slam Dunk is a UK Pop-Punk, Emo, Metal, and Alternative Music Festival held in Leeds and Hatifeld. Each year the festival showcases the best in Rock and Alternative Music.




					www.slamdunkfestival.com
				




Just announced September dates.


----------



## mr steev (Feb 23, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> *Three!!* postponements may well be a record so far, in the Covid-caused delay stakes??
> 
> (I speculate -- I have no idea whether any other events have been put off like that any more than twice!!)



Bearded... From May to Sept, then May 21, now Sept 21 

I hope there are not psychological issues when the time comes. A couple of month ago I would've given my right arm to go to a gig or festival, now the thought makes me feel a bit anxious. I can't put my finger on it. It's not a fear of getting sick. I guess it's a form of social anxiety that says more about my mental health and I'm a bit concerned with how that's going to be after a few more months


----------



## Mogden (Feb 23, 2021)

There must be more than a few of us still thinking festivals won't be back until next year at the earliest? Vaccinated doesn't mean can't ever get it, especially with new strains about. Why is everyone so excited all of a sudden when our government have hardly got a glowing reputation for reliability.


----------



## strung out (Feb 23, 2021)

Mogden said:


> There must be more than a few of us still thinking festivals won't be back until next year at the earliest? Vaccinated doesn't mean can't ever get it, especially with new strains about. Why is everyone so excited all of a sudden when our government have hardly got a glowing reputation for reliability.


Vaccines weren't ever supposed to mean that nobody would get it except in the most optimistic of outcomes, but they probably do mean that catching it will only get you as ill as a mild cold, and certainly not hospitalised. I think most people are willing to take that risk in return for getting some kind of normality back.

Obviously this is reliant on the vaccine schedule going as planned and mutations not making them ineffective, but I don't think that a belief in those things are too overly optimistic, and I think it's also reasonable for people to have a bit of hope after the year we've had.


----------



## mojo pixy (Feb 23, 2021)

Just because I was looking up *B*ryan Adams on another thread, I found out he's planning a load of summer shows in the UK. Site says there are some planned for April too, but I reckon that's a tad optimistic.

I know, not really cool enough for Urban, but needs must and all that. And honestly, he puts on a good show. Guaranteed everyone will leave singing


----------



## Mogden (Feb 23, 2021)

strung out said:


> Vaccines weren't ever supposed to mean that nobody would get it except in the most optimistic of outcomes, but they probably do mean that catching it will only get you as ill as a mild cold, and certainly not hospitalised. I think most people are willing to take that risk in return for getting some kind of normality back.
> 
> Obviously this is reliant on the vaccine schedule going as planned and mutations not making them ineffective, but I don't think that a belief in those things are too overly optimistic, and I think it's also reasonable for people to have a bit of hope after the year we've had.


Hope is great, it's getting us through, and I'd like it to be based in truth but I do fear that the average pub going idiot will see vaccines as a complete solution and return to behaviour pre-pandemic and it'll snowball from there.


----------



## strung out (Feb 23, 2021)

Mogden said:


> Hope is great, it's getting us through, and I'd like it to be based in truth but I do fear that the average pub going idiot will see vaccines as a complete solution and return to behaviour pre-pandemic and it'll snowball from there.


Once everyone is vaccinated why shouldn't people return to pre-pandemic behaviour?


----------



## BigTom (Feb 23, 2021)

Mogden said:


> There must be more than a few of us still thinking festivals won't be back until next year at the earliest? Vaccinated doesn't mean can't ever get it, especially with new strains about. Why is everyone so excited all of a sudden when our government have hardly got a glowing reputation for reliability.



Without insurance it's too big a risk to plan anything in any detail until after restrictions are actually lifted.
Any festival takes 6 months to plan properly. Bigger festivals longer than that.
The only way I could see one happening would be if:
1) It's a small festival, probably <1,000 people, maybe 1000-2000 and runs in September.
2) It's on a dedicated event site and has run for quite a few years
3) They can submit exactly the same site plan as has been used in previous years
4) They have a council that want to work to make it happen and can push through a TEN or other event licence in the space of a month or so
5) Their suppliers from previous have not gone bust and are available to deliver.
6) They have most or all of their tickets sold from their postponed/cancelled 2020 event carried over to 2021

If they can do some work beforehand with suppliers so that they could submit their event plan to the council by the end of June, being confident that it will go through, then they can be getting vendors/traders in place in July/August along with finalising details with suppliers in August once the council have confirmed the event licence, they could run in september. Booking acts would likely be the least of their difficulties. 
I think it could be done but the council is the big problem here - they are the ones who could say no and that's a big risk to take.
and previous year's suppliers still being in business... and who is still around to trade etc.. 

I'm not sure I'd want to do it, but I think it could be done in some very limited circumstances.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 23, 2021)

The whole nightclubs and theatres open by end of June, marking the end of the whole thing basically does feel far too soon.


----------



## belboid (Feb 23, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> The whole nightclubs and theatres open by end of June, marking the end of the whole thing basically does feel far too soon.


Just in time for any still locked in students to go completely apeshit and then go back to their parents’ for the summer.   What could possibly go wrong?


----------



## 2hats (Feb 23, 2021)

strung out said:


> Once everyone is vaccinated why shouldn't people return to pre-pandemic behaviour?


Not everyone will be vaccinated (significant numbers of those not out of choice). The varying numbers of vaccinated who develop serious illness, long term complications or die may reach differing conclusions.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Feb 23, 2021)

But
Mystic Boris has promised an orgy for summer solstice


----------



## strung out (Feb 23, 2021)

2hats said:


> Not everyone will be vaccinated (significant numbers of those not out of choice). The varying numbers of vaccinated who develop serious illness, long term complications or die may reach differing conclusions.


So if the mass vaccination of virtually everybody who can be vaccinated (mutations etc. notwithstanding) is not the point at which things can go back to relative normal normality, what is?


----------



## Mogden (Feb 23, 2021)

strung out said:


> So if the mass vaccination of virtually everybody who can be vaccinated (mutations etc. notwithstanding) is not the point at which things can go back to relative normal normality, what is?


It's not just the physical ability to go back to pre-pandemic, it's the mental.  I'm not a lover of close contact.  In fact I've barely realised I'm not hugging people aside from a want to give best mate Mogden a squeeze. If anyone gets close to me when we're "back to normal" I'm quite likely to shout or make a physical gesture. I don't believe we're going back to how it was. As mr steev said further up the thread, psychologically this may have been quite damaging for some. If the government continues its over promise and under deliver attitude it's going to keep stretching those delicate mental rubber bands to breaking point. You don't swear to gift a new Playstation to a kid for Christmas unless you're bloody sure you can do it, not because you think you might get away with an IOU for it on Christmas morning for some time in the next 6 months.


----------



## 2hats (Feb 23, 2021)

strung out said:


> So if the mass vaccination of virtually everybody who can be vaccinated (mutations etc. notwithstanding) is not the point at which things can go back to relative normal normality, what is?


It won't be _virtually_ everybody and it won't be _normal_. The new 'normal' will be different.


----------



## strung out (Feb 23, 2021)

2hats said:


> It won't be _virtually_ everybody and it won't be _normal_. The new 'normal' will be different.


So no festivals, gigs or late nights out once most people have been vaccinated? The point I was responding to was about people placing too much hope in any of that happening at all this year, to which my response was, if not once every adult has been offered the vaccine, then when?


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 23, 2021)

(My post #1,343, previous page) :


William of Walworth said:


> *Three!!* postponements may well be a record so far, in the Covid-caused delay stakes??
> 
> (I speculate -- I have no idea whether any other events have been put off like that any more than twice!!)





mr steev said:


> *Bearded*... From May to Sept, then May 21, now Sept 21
> 
> I hope there are not psychological issues when the time comes. A couple of month ago I would've given my right arm to go to a gig or festival, now the thought makes me feel a bit anxious. I can't put my finger on it. It's not a fear of getting sick. I guess it's a form of social anxiety that says more about my mental health and I'm a bit concerned with how that's going to be after a few more months



Yes, I should have mentioned Bearded when I posted that  'triple cancellation' post originally! 

Slightly re-assuring thought here for you though steev : I wonder whether such a really friendly and laid-back festival like Bearded, which is the opposite of a mega-fest or a stupidly corporate event, might offer positivity for you? Especially near the smaller tents/stages?

As it goes, I remain pretty pessimistic that they'll be able to hold BT at all in September, but *if* (major if!) they're able to, I'm *certain* that the BT organisers, of all people, will issue very confidence-boosting instructions and details, to make sure people both are safe and feel safe when they come.

And -- pure speculation here -- they might? also reduce the size -- it was already shrunk from about 12,000 to 7,500 in 2019,and they could possibly reduce it further (say to 5,000?).



Mogden said:


> There must be more than a few of us still thinking festivals won't be back until next year at the earliest? Vaccinated doesn't mean can't ever get it, especially with new strains about. Why is everyone so excited all of a sudden when our government have hardly got a glowing reputation for reliability.



As I said above, I still share your pessimism about events of Bearded's size happening this year, but I'm starting to feel _slightly_ (and very cautiously!) a bit more optimistic about smaller mini-events that are scheduled for similarly late in the season.

I 100% agree that this Government are utterly shit, but the NHS are not being shit about vaccination.

As for the possibility of new strains defying vaccines, that's by no means certain to happen, any more than it's certain not to.

In any case, there's still an insane amount of intense research continuing into new vaccines and new variants of vaccines that may?? end up more effective against new strains of the virus.

I suppose that's all best off in one of the actual vaccine threads, but for quite a while now, vaccines and the science around them have been one of the very very few things I'm more optimistic** about with this pandemic.

**(even with 2hats sensible warning above taken into account -- post #1,364).


----------



## Supine (Feb 23, 2021)

I've been super careful for a year - basically on lockdown all the way apart from working away from home (at covid friendly workplaces).

When vaccinated I'll feel much safer and able to socialise and I will go to music festivals and have a great time.

They're open air and not mega crowded so I'll feel safe. Its easy to social distance at the kind of festivals I attend. I can't wait!!

I have tickets to two festivals and they are only three weeks apart at end July and mid August. They will probably break me after a year off


----------



## Mogden (Feb 23, 2021)

strung out said:


> So no festivals, gigs or late nights out once most people have been vaccinated? The point I was responding to was about people placing too much hope in any of that happening at all this year, to which my response was, if not once every adult has been offered the vaccine, then when?


Next year.  Realistically. The government would be much better placed to say that and then review in September and cheer everyone up by saying okay we're in a position to offer this earlier than planned. What happens in June when we're in a bounce back to high R numbers because of new variants and the populous say "Sod the lockdown, we're going to the park and each other's gardens to get pissed".


----------



## strung out (Feb 23, 2021)

Mogden said:


> Next year.  Realistically. The government would be much better placed to say that and then review in September and cheer everyone up by saying okay we're in a position to offer this earlier than planned. What happens in June when we're in a bounce back to high R numbers because of new variants and the populous say "Sod the lockdown, we're going to the park and each other's gardens to get pissed".


I'm not saying that none of those worst case scenario events could happen, but the government and everyone else's position on things restarting is predicated on the fact that everybody should have been offered the vaccine and that those vaccines are effective.

While the general public are pretty pro-lockdown at the moment, the government would be crucified if they said despite everything going well, there wouldn't be any live indoor or outdoor events until next year at the earliest.

I also think that the public (gobshites notwithstanding) would be pretty understanding if a mutation rendered plans for a summer restart of live events untenable.


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 23, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> (My post #1,343, previous page) :
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I have tickets for three festivals this year - The Tiddly, mid July then BT and SE in September - So two tiny ones and (medium sized?) Bearded.  I'll probably add a couple between those as and when they come up.  Blyth Power Ashes in August, but I haven't seen anything about that yet.  

I prefer the smaller ones, anyway, and I'm _expecting_ Gail's 50th at the Tiddly  to happen in July.   

My fear for BT and SE in September is that the effect of the schools opening and then half the country going abroad in July and August will be another spike, due to the myriad of new variants they'll all bring back with them, that leads to another lockdown.


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 23, 2021)

I'm getting a hell of a lot of festival ads on my FB suddenly - no surprise - I guess there'll be a lot more announcements soon.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 24, 2021)

Leeds & Reading have just announced they’re going ahead in August


----------



## Mogden (Feb 24, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Leeds & Reading have just announced they’re going ahead in August



Ma Mogden actually messaged me and told me about that. I expressed my doubts.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 24, 2021)

It seems... optimistic. And pretty reckless.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 24, 2021)

im guessing its to sell all their tickets for a good cash boost, then just roll the tickets over to next year when they admit or the powers that be tell them they cannot safely hold the event.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 24, 2021)

There’s dozens of tours been announced over the last 24 hours.

There’s also a lot of techs and crew scratching their heads saying “eh?”


----------



## killer b (Feb 24, 2021)

I dunno, reckon there's a good chance they will be able to hold it safely enough. its a good while into the (theoretical) everything open with no restrictions stage, so short of something going significantly wrong I reckon August events will probably happen. 

I noticed Raw Power is advertising its happening in August too fwiw - and that's an indoor festival


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 24, 2021)

Outdoor, maybe. But there is no amount of money on earth that would get me working an indoor festival this year.


----------



## editor (Feb 24, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> There’s dozens of tours been announced over the last 24 hours.
> 
> There’s also a lot of techs and crew scratching their heads saying “eh?”


With all of our other gigs being cancelled, the first date we have for 2021 is the 18th September. I'm cautiously optimistic.


----------



## 2hats (Feb 24, 2021)

strung out said:


> So no festivals, gigs or late nights out once most people have been vaccinated?


Politicians have ably demonstrated that they will ignore the science when they _think_ it is convenient for them, so your guess is as good as mine. I have no plans to attend any festivals or travel this year.


> The point I was responding to was about people placing too much hope in any of that happening at all this year, to which my response was, if not once every adult has been offered the vaccine, then when?


Offered != first dose in arm != fully vaccinated. Right now no one can be certain what variant will be prevalent later in the year, and what degrees of efficacy any current vaccine will have with respect to that. It will take a timescale measured in years to vaccinate "most people". In this country alone it will take most of this year, at least, and the vaccines haven't even been approved in children yet. It will also take many months to a year, and beyond, to characterise the evolution of the vaccine mediated immune response (and thus necessity of, and implications for, booster strategies), particularly in more vulnerable cohorts.


----------



## Teaboy (Feb 24, 2021)

Whether it will happen or not and regardless of whether it feels right or not I simply cannot picture how we go from May 16th when its considered not safe to be sat inside a cafe or restaurant to June 21st when its a fuck it all - do what you like - extravaganza.

I just can't fathom what that looks like or how it happens.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 24, 2021)

If it does go ahead, maybe its buy your ticket first, find out later that there is no camping allowed, it will be socially distanced in pens, and the volume will be turned down so you arent encouraged to dance, kinda thing. It is Mean Fiddler, after all.


----------



## pesh (Feb 24, 2021)

if Boris says everything is fine again from the 21st of June then I for one am sure that is exactly how it will be.
We will absolutely be at Reading and Leeds over the August bank holiday weekend and definitely not be in lockdown 4.
Theres no reason to doubt his word, he's no idiot.


----------



## IC3D (Feb 24, 2021)

Noisily festival looks a goer, and a few psytrance outdoors out in the sticks woot


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 24, 2021)

If ever there was a reason for extended lockdowns, psytrance is it


----------



## belboid (Feb 24, 2021)

End of the Road has just sold out.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 24, 2021)

belboid said:


> End of the Road has just sold out.


I have this sinking feeling that the entire country is about to do something really, really stupid.


----------



## miss direct (Feb 24, 2021)

Birmingham Pride appears to be on in September.


----------



## souljacker (Feb 24, 2021)

Reading and Leeds have announced that they are going for it.









						Reading and Leeds boss 'very confident' festivals will happen
					

Organisers are "very confident" the events will happen this summer, as lockdown is due to be eased.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




The majority of people who go will have been at school together since March so I don't see why they shouldn't get to go to a festival.


----------



## killer b (Feb 24, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I have this sinking feeling that the entire country is about to do something really, really stupid.


They're just planning on going to a festival aren't they? If it's not going to be relatively safe to go, it'll get cancelled. If it doesn't get cancelled then they're good to go. I'm not really sure what else you can expect from people.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 24, 2021)

Notting Hill Carnival is still on, isn’t it? Hearing odd snippets about social distancing in nightclubs, which of course won’t happen, but Notting Hill is just rammed.


----------



## ska invita (Feb 24, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Notting Hill Carnival is still on, isn’t it? Hearing odd snippets about social distancing in nightclubs, which of course won’t happen, but Notting Hill is just rammed.


TBF Carnival doesnt need to do anything right now in the same way a festival does
A guess but I expect carnival can wait and see for a bit


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 24, 2021)

killer b said:


> They're just planning on going to a festival aren't they? If it's not going to be relatively safe to go, it'll get cancelled. If it doesn't get cancelled then they're good to go. I'm not really sure what else you can expect from people.


It’s not just the festivals though. It feels like the whole country is about to jump off a cliff.


----------



## killer b (Feb 24, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> It’s not just the festivals though. It feels like the whole country is about to jump off a cliff.


If it goes to shit, it'll start going to shit well in advance of crowded pubs and festivals and gigs and nightclubs and all that jazz, in which case it'll all be cancelled anyway. If it doesn't go to shit, then we're good to party I reckon.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Feb 24, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> If it does go ahead, maybe its buy your ticket first, find out later that there is no camping allowed, it will be socially distanced in pens, and the volume will be turned down so you arent encouraged to dance, kinda thing. It is Mean Fiddler, after all.


It's being upgraded to a psytrance silent disco event


----------



## mx wcfc (Feb 24, 2021)

Attila has just announced that Glastonwick is definitely off this year.  I had guessed that would be the case, but it's a shame. It's normally the first weekend of June, so couldn't have happened then, but I guess people were hoping it might get moved to late summer.
He's left the door open for a one night mini fest in September, but I doubt it will happen.  Besides, September is looking pretty full already. 
He has COPD too, which affects his thoughts on risk.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 25, 2021)

I'm astonished by this sudden outburst of planning, it's caught me out! 

But I suppose fest planners will plan whatever, for the reasons killer b said. 

Following Monday's announcements, they probably felt free to flick the on-switch of plans that were in place already.

If organisers perceive even just half-a-chance of their event going ahead then they'll set the wheels in motion.

Advance ticket sale money is key to oiling those wheels anyway, for the bigger bashes particularly  ......... 

Still, the *reality* with all this is very much a case of 'moar later' before we know anything for sure ....


----------



## Badgers (Feb 25, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Advance ticket sale money is key to oiling those wheels anyway, for the bigger bashes particularly .........


The ticket money is held by the ticketing agencies until the event is delivered so the organisers will be borrowing against that. They will get (or already have) some money from the traders at the event but nothing near the contractor, artists and overheads needed. Worst case scenario all the visitors can defer their bookings to 2022 or get a full refund. 

Fingers crossed all is good and by June things are opening up as planned  I fear that a lot of the organisers are already on borrowed time  so further postponements will be realy bad! Also I think festivals will bring a much needed boost to us all


----------



## Looby (Feb 25, 2021)

belboid said:


> End of the Road has just sold out.


It was probably close to sold out anyway, I don’t know anyone who didn’t roll their deposit over to this year. If there’s any festival I’m going to feel fairly safe at, I think it would be EOTR. Fairly small and relaxed and easy to avoid crowded tents and stay outdoors. 
I’ll check what the policy is on cancellations and pay our balance on a credit card and then wait and see. 
I won’t be surprised if something goes wrong  but I hope not, for the survival of the festival more than anything.


----------



## Indeliblelink (Feb 25, 2021)

See Boomtown has sold out. Not surprising really after Boris gave the go ahead but bit gutted, was gonna order some tickets tomorrow. Resale in May and second hand tix still an option I guess.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 25, 2021)

Indeliblelink said:


> See Boomtown has sold out. Not surprising really after Boris gave the go ahead but bit gutted, was gonna order some tickets tomorrow. Resale in May and second hand tix still an option I guess.



They had planned to cut capacity significantly, but still quite surprised it has sold out today! Really glad for them though. It has to be the most breath-taking festival in the U.K after Glastonbury, with a good independent ethos behind it.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 25, 2021)

*Boomtown 2022* is my plan. I liked it lots in 2019, but will have better plans  to reduce the stressyness next time  

Also, 2022 will be my semi-retirement year, a summer of extra-multiple fests to anticipate _two-days-a-week-ness_ from late August 

So I *demand* zero pandemic by then!


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 25, 2021)

The other day, Fishmonkeynan posted this onto the Bearded Theory forum ....



Fishmonkeynan said:


> Strangely enough, the day after posting icame across this bit of evidence from the association of independent festivals to the govt select committee looking into festivals ( worth a look if you’re interested in festivals) which answers the question.. basically it should be held separately and usually is, but some festivals have been dipping into it to keep themselves afloat...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Plenty in there that's worth a look, especially if you're interested in the practicalities of festival-organising, and their prospects.


----------



## Supine (Feb 26, 2021)




----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 26, 2021)

General BBC chat (from Thursday 25th Feb) about which 2021 fests might happen or not. 

Selective choice of examples .....


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Feb 28, 2021)

Some actual sense being spoken by Rebellion Festival.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 28, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Some actual sense being spoken by Rebellion Festival.




That's a really good and clear statement, avoiding any over-commitment and being appropriately cautious.

But also very mildly optimistic, alongside all the essential caveats!! 

I'm impressed 

(ETA link because of page break in thread)


----------



## ddraig (Mar 1, 2021)

Download cancelled for 2021








						Download Festival Will No Longer Be Taking Place In 2021 - Download Festival
					

We can sadly now confirm that Download Festival will no longer be taking place this year, but we have exciting news for 2022




					downloadfestival.co.uk


----------



## Mogden (Mar 1, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Download cancelled for 2021
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sensible I'd say. A shame though cos it brings a lot of trade to this area.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 1, 2021)

Bad news about Download  -- not surprising though really, given its size and date.

But getting Iron Maiden for 2022 is pretty impressive , was that their hoped-for headline for 2021?


----------



## Johnny Doe (Mar 1, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> View attachment 254536
> 
> This follows on from...
> 
> ...


Ian Brown having turned into a CoVID denier isn't going to help them.


----------



## mx wcfc (Mar 1, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> That's a really good and clear statement, avoiding any over-commitment and being appropriately cautious.
> 
> But also very mildly optimistic, alongside all the essential caveats!!
> 
> ...


I've been planning a trip to Rebellion for years - ever since little ms mx left school and the need for a two week summer family holiday in August disappeared.

I won't be going this year though.  The festivals I'm planning on going to are far, far smaller and largely outdoors, which seems a lot safer to me (and I'll have had my second jab by May).  









						See You Down The Front! - Undercover Festival and Events
					

Undercover Festival 10 was an absolute blast and thanks to everyone involved and everyone that came along. Now for UNDERCOVER FESTIVAL ELEVEN! WEEKEND TICKETSAND SPREAD THE COST TICKETS ON SALE NOW BEFORE THEN…A PACKED PROGRAMME[...]



					undercoverfest.com
				



This is indoors in October - that's a long way away, and involves a hotel.  We'll have to see how things go.

But the "socially distanced" gigs the same guy has got lined up in May arenot a good idea in my view.  Don't get me wrong, he's a stalwart of the of the punk scene in this part of the world, but this is pushing it I think.    

I'm still surprised I didn't get covid at the 2020 Undercover in early March 2020, that I really shouldn't have gone to.


----------



## Elpenor (Mar 2, 2021)

Women's rugby world cup (due to be held in Aotearoa) delayed from this Autumn to 2022









						Women's Rugby World Cup in New Zealand to be delayed for a year
					

World Rugby has blamed Covid-19 challenges after talks with the New Zealand government




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## mr steev (Mar 3, 2021)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Oh wow, look!
> The garage has listings!
> 
> I saw this happening or have they just not taken it down ? It doesn’t say cancelled....
> ...



I've got tickets for The Lovely Eggs' Birmingham gig on that tour. I recieved an email this morning telling me it's been postponed again until April 2022. I presume that means that the entire tour has been postponed.


----------



## spitfire (Mar 3, 2021)

That reminds me. The inevitable has happened to IDLES as expected. At least 1 night off in Dry January for me then. 🍻


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 3, 2021)

Budget 2021 : How does it affect entertainment and arts?

(BBC's post-Budget article specifically about live-entertainment-relevant stuff)

Even fests get mentioned! 

Not much in there, but some degree of extra help for the self-employed has surely got to be a modest positive at least .... ??


----------



## kalidarkone (Mar 4, 2021)

mr steev said:


> I've got tickets for The Lovely Eggs' Birmingham gig on that tour. I recieved an email this morning telling me it's been postponed again until April 2022. I presume that means that the entire tour has been postponed.


I think they have rescheduled the half of the tour that falls before June 21st, as I have a ticket to see them in July and that's not rescheduled.....so far.....but not holding my breath.


----------



## kalidarkone (Mar 4, 2021)

I'm trying to find information about the Viagra boys tour as I have a ticket for June 10th this year....but not apparently rescheduled...but will have to be.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 7, 2021)

Fans and artists must have Covid vaccine before attending music festivals, say some organisers
					

Government should insist everyone be jabbed in order to get in, say worried festival directorsCoronavirus – latest updatesSee all our coronavirus coverage




					www.theguardian.com
				




This has certainly caused a stir - and smoked out a few more anti vax dickheads - on the various touring and tech crew groups...


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 8, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Fans and artists must have Covid vaccine before attending music festivals, say some organisers
> 
> 
> Government should insist everyone be jabbed in order to get in, say worried festival directorsCoronavirus – latest updatesSee all our coronavirus coverage
> ...



You beat me to it with posting that link .... it's not a great article overall, but personally, I think that a requirement for vaccine festival-passports would cause me no issues at all ......  
(I suppose it helps that I'm now due to get my first jab this coming Thursday  )

And Ian Brown (and anyone 'thinking' like him) remain complete twats ...


----------



## editor (Mar 8, 2021)

This is great stuff



Link fixed Dutch clubbers hit the dancefloor for study into easing lockdown


----------



## nyxx (Mar 8, 2021)

I wonder how it would work for people with a compromised immune system who can’t take vaccines.

Personally I don’t like it much as it feels like ID cards by the back door, which we spent some time and energy resisting back when they were in the pipeline.

(think there’s a separate thread on vaccine passports already tho?) 



William of Walworth said:


> You beat me to it with posting that link .... it's not a great article overall, but personally, I think that a requirement for vaccine festival-passports would cause me no issues at all .....


----------



## Kevbad the Bad (Mar 8, 2021)

Does anyone know definitively what is happening with indoor gigs, and what the timeline is? We've got tickets for Patti Smith at the Bath Forum on the 28th May. It's already been postponed from last year, but all the websites and twitter feeds are silent about it again this year, implying it is going ahead. But as it is sold out there is no way social distancing will be possible. Is it just me or are all the music venues crap at communication?


----------



## pesh (Mar 8, 2021)

Kevbad the Bad said:


> Does anyone know definitively what is happening with indoor gigs, and what the timeline is? We've got tickets for Patti Smith at the Bath Forum on the 28th May. It's already been postponed from last year, but all the websites and twitter feeds are silent about it again this year, implying it is going ahead. But as it is sold out there is no way social distancing will be possible. Is it just me or are all the music venues crap at communication?


snowballs chance in hell.


----------



## Teaboy (Mar 8, 2021)

Kevbad the Bad said:


> Does anyone know definitively what is happening with indoor gigs, and what the timeline is? We've got tickets for Patti Smith at the Bath Forum on the 28th May. It's already been postponed from last year, but all the websites and twitter feeds are silent about it again this year, implying it is going ahead. But as it is sold out there is no way social distancing will be possible. Is it just me or are all the music venues crap at communication?



As per the government timetable some large events with capacity limited can take place no earlier than 17th May.  Indoor capacity is limited to 1000 persons or 50% capacity.  

So, the event may go ahead but only if they want to at 50% capacity and if the government don't push back the timetable.


----------



## Badgers (Mar 8, 2021)

Kevbad the Bad said:


> Does anyone know definitively what is happening with indoor gigs, and what the timeline is? We've got tickets for Patti Smith at the Bath Forum on the 28th May. It's already been postponed from last year, but all the websites and twitter feeds are silent about it again this year, implying it is going ahead. But as it is sold out there is no way social distancing will be possible. Is it just me or are all the music venues crap at communication?


Nope


----------



## ddraig (Mar 8, 2021)

editor said:


> This is great stuff
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.theguardian.comfa/world/2021/mar/07/dutch-clubbers-dance-study-easing-lockdown-music-event-coronavirus


link borked with "fa" after .com


----------



## Teaboy (Mar 8, 2021)

nyxx said:


> I wonder how it would work for people with a compromised immune system who can’t take vaccines.
> 
> Personally I don’t like it much as it feels like ID cards by the back door, which we spent some time and energy resisting back when they were in the pipeline.
> 
> (think there’s a separate thread on vaccine passports already tho?)



I very much doubt many with a compromised immune system would want to be going to places that may put them at high risk regardless of the entry criteria.


----------



## nyxx (Mar 8, 2021)

That’s a decision for them to make tho. 


Teaboy said:


> I very much doubt many with a compromised immune system would want to be going to places that may put them at high risk regardless of the entry criteria.


----------



## Teaboy (Mar 8, 2021)

nyxx said:


> That’s a decision for them to make tho.



Clearly any system wouldn't be able to breach basic law on discrimination so its a moot point really.  If they went down this line (which I don't think they will) then those who couldn't have the vaccine would have to be exempt.  I can't see how it could happen any other way.


----------



## editor (Mar 8, 2021)

Sold out with six months to go!









						Mighty Hoopla sells out all 25,000 tickets for its Brockwell Park festival in Sept 2021
					

After last year’s event fell victim to Covid-19, a rescheduled Mighty Hoopla festival was announced for 4th Sept 2021, and we posted up details of the  line up here.



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## Sunray (Mar 8, 2021)

nyxx said:


> I wonder how it would work for people with a compromised immune system who can’t take vaccines.
> 
> Personally I don’t like it much as it feels like ID cards by the back door, which we spent some time and energy resisting back when they were in the pipeline.
> 
> (think there’s a separate thread on vaccine passports already tho?)



The logic would be if you can guarantee everyone else is l.oecovid free, the risk would low. But if you have a compromised immune system, would it be sensible to be wandering into a crowded sweaty environment?  

I've been to many European festivals and they all stand apart or sit down. So its actually possible to have a festival with social distancing.  In this country, it's a crazy crush all the time. Possibly not so much.


----------



## miss direct (Mar 8, 2021)

Tramlines in Sheffield appears to be on. Who'd buy a ticket when you don't know who's playing? Tramlines Festival 2021 | Hillsborough Park


----------



## Teaboy (Mar 8, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Tramlines in Sheffield appears to be on. Who'd buy a ticket when you don't know who's playing? Tramlines Festival 2021 | Hillsborough Park



I imagine there are a lot of people out there now who would happily go anywhere and see anyone.  The first half of the summer is defo out anyway so any festival that does go ahead I think will be very popular.


----------



## Espresso (Mar 8, 2021)

I see Blackpool Pride is going to be online again, this year.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 8, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Tramlines in Sheffield appears to be on. Who'd buy a ticket when you don't know who's playing? Tramlines Festival 2021 | Hillsborough Park



It's a *very limited *number of festivals that plan their event with a date so close to Glastonbury weekend :

In _normal_ years, that is! 

But I'd be absolutely amazed anyway, if an event with dates as early as that, went ahead this year ......


----------



## mx wcfc (Mar 8, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> But I'd be absolutely amazed anyway, if an event with dates as early as that, went ahead this year ......


You not going to Gail's do in July?

(fwiw, I'm not sure a big thing like that with unvaccinated "young people", like that is a good idea)


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 8, 2021)

mx wcfc : For this much-compromised 'festival season' (  ), it will be all about the size, and especially the date, of the proposed event.

That Sheffield one that miss direct linked to is late June .... and it looks big! 

Gails's event in July is realy small, and some weeks later ... that being so, we've booked tickets


----------



## mx wcfc (Mar 8, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> mx wcfc : For this much-compromised 'festival season' (  ), it will be all about the size, and especially the date, of the proposed event.
> 
> That Sheffield one that miss direct linked to is late June .... and it looks big!
> 
> Gails's event in July is realy small, and some weeks later ... that being so, we've booked tickets


I think we agree on these things.  I hope to meet you both at the Tiddly

I'll be the middle aged, pissed, part-time punk in an Eastfield t-shirt.  You'll be able to spot me a mile off.  

Oh.


----------



## Orang Utan (Mar 8, 2021)

Are you a festaholic, William of Walworth ?


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 9, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Are you a festaholic, William of Walworth ?



It's *much* easier to stop (or at least reduce!) drinking and rugs , than it is to deal with the lack of festivals last year and this  

Also, Festival-dealers are doing bad business ATM   , so attempting to 'score' an 'event' isn't worth the waste of time for either me or them .. 

(Yet!    )


----------



## Voley (Mar 9, 2021)

Eden Sessions are off.





__





						Eden Sessions 2022 statement and FAQs - Eden Sessions
					

The Eden Sessions series of concerts planned for June and July of 2020 and 2021 did not take place due to the impacts of the pandemic and restrictions on outdoor audiences. We have now rescheduled the following shows to take place in 2022: My Chemical Romance (17 May 2022), Diana Ross (21 June...




					www.edensessions.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 10, 2021)

Rock am Ring/im Park, Hurricane and more called off | IQ Magazine
					

“Given the persistent epidemiological situation”, CTS Eventim’s stable of summer festivals will take another year off in 2021.




					www.iq-mag.net
				




Several large German festivals cancelled for another year.


----------



## Teaboy (Mar 10, 2021)

Given the state of the vaccination program in most EU countries I'd say there should be no chance of any of their festivals happening this year.  No doubt, a few will crack on anyway.


----------



## spitfire (Mar 10, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Rock am Ring/im Park, Hurricane and more called off | IQ Magazine
> 
> 
> “Given the persistent epidemiological situation”, CTS Eventim’s stable of summer festivals will take another year off in 2021.
> ...



I did Park and Ring BITD, they are BIG festivals.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 14, 2021)

Beautiful Days site now showing optimism that BD 2021 will happen .... lateish August.

I've defied my own general pessimism about fests going ahead, even later on this summer, by just buying two tickets and a van ticket, far from cheap but fuckit ....... if it does go ahead, this will be the biggest event we do.

As I said in the Beautiful Days thread, I suspect just having been vaccinated has irrationally swayed my thoughts ....


----------



## Fishmonkeynan (Mar 14, 2021)

Bearded Theory have paused ticket sales pending a decision in early April on whether they're going ahead with their sept date. Presumably thats when they have to start committing to deposits etc There's a lot of different approaches from festivals on the same info. I know some festivals are all guns blazing - but presumeably dont have insurance if they have to cancel/postpone. So if the restrictions get pushed back by a few months, or the guidance that comes in June is unworkable for most festivals, I can see a lot of organisations going under.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 15, 2021)

Field Day, the daytime festival in London, seem keen to recoup back the money they lost not hosting the event last year. The event is just under 6 months away, but if you would like to buy a ticket right now for the event its an eye watering *£90 *(including a ridiculous £10 booking fee). Lets hope this isn't a sign of things to come?


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 16, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> Field Day, the daytime festival in London, seem keen to recoup back the money they lost not hosting the event last year. The event is just under 6 months away, but if you would like to buy a ticket right now for the event its an eye watering *£90 *(including a ridiculous £10 booking fee). Lets hope this isn't a sign of things to come?



Just for the one day? That sort of price (  ) sums up why we aim to go to much smaller fests almost exclusively, even in normal years.

Although we and van have just splashed out on Beautiful Days for August** -- significantly more expensive than above, but at least we'd be on site for four nights ....

**Subject to contract


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 16, 2021)

Just for one day- will likely end by 10pm too. Utter pisstake.

Also looked up a drum and bass thing on bank holiday at Clapham Common, it worked out after fees to be £85 a ticket too. Fuck that. If that how its going to be, im going to be boyoctting plenty of events, i'd rather wait another year to dance again than be blatantly mugged off by ticket prices that are about double than a couple of years ago.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Mar 16, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> Just for one day- will likely end by 10pm too. Utter pisstake.
> 
> Also looked up a drum and bass thing on bank holiday at Clapham Common, it worked out after fees to be £85 a ticket too. Fuck that. If that how its going to be, im going to be boyoctting plenty of events, i'd rather wait another year to dance again than be blatantly mugged off by ticket prices that are about double than a couple of years ago.


Or perhaps view it as the price required to ensure there _are_ events next year...


----------



## Teaboy (Mar 16, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Or perhaps view it as the price required to ensure there _are_ events next year...



Or indeed see it as a new normal and reflective of the cost of staging these events now and the risk involved.


----------



## Voley (Mar 16, 2021)

It's going to be pricey from now on, right enough. Wonder if Glastonbury will stay this side of 300 hundred quid.


----------



## editor (Mar 16, 2021)

Our US tour has been rescheduled for the FIFTH time, with the proposed Oct 2021 dates now taking place in May 2022.


----------



## Mogden (Mar 16, 2021)

Today is that day in the year when I've got the first festival frisson. That memory smell of wood smoke in your nostrils, the feeling of being grubby and thoroughly sun baked, of folding chairs thigh bruises and slow creaks back to the sky from sitting.

I swear I didn't miss it this much last year. I  think I knew there was no chance but this year, it's all still so up in the air.  In the meantime, shopping for more incense, cos I'm nearly out and can't leave it until September, and a long poncho as an optimist purchase, is helping a tiny bit.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 16, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Or indeed see it as a new normal and reflective of the cost of staging these events now and the risk involved.



Considering the events are run by AEG and Live Nation, I expect this will be the new normal. Costs may have gone up a bit, but the loudest voices in their boardroom will be from the investors and shareholders frothing at the mouth for returns and dividends they were cruelly denied in 2020. These companies won't be dropping the prices back to the old levels once the good times return.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 16, 2021)

Voley said:


> It's going to be pricey from now on, right enough. *Wonder if Glastonbury will stay this side of 300 hundred quid*.



I wondered that too for a bit, but a huge proportion of ticketholders who succeeded in buying for G2020 have, we heard, hung on to them --both times that the fest was cancelled/postponed, promises were made that 2020 tickets remain valid for the new date. And it appears that almost everybody who holds a ticket, will re-use it!

Unsurprisingly I think ....

Not sure yet what they'll do about a re-release (of any returned tickets) closer to Glastonbury 2022 dates -- if I read abour that, I've forgotten  -- but there won't be many tickets involved. But would they up the price for those?

All that considered, I reckon that serious Glastonbury price increases that affect _everyone_, would happen for Glastonbury 2023, if they do??


----------



## Voley (Mar 17, 2021)

I idly wondered about End Of The Road this year as it's right at the end of the season so they should've been able to see if other events went off safely. Plus it's reasonably near to me / Pixies are headlining, but it still feels like too much of a risk.

If everyone's had two jabs by then and plenty of time for their immunity to kick in, I'd consider it. Otherwise, people off their nut aren't going to think twice about distancing. And the sort of people clamouring to get back to festivals aren't exactly risk-averse. Moot point as it's sold out anyhow. 

If my Specials gig goes ahead in September I'll be happy. I really want to jump up and down to live music with other people again but only when I think it's safe.


----------



## Mogden (Mar 17, 2021)

I'm booking gig tickets for the end of November when they go on sale this morning. I've not bought any other gig, save for an online one next month,  or festival tickets yet this year.  November seems doable and is my birthday present to myself for this year.


----------



## planetgeli (Mar 20, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Looks like the Tokyo Olympics is cancelled then...
> 
> IOC insist games will go ahead



Not (yet) cancelled but no international travellers (fans)









						No international fans at Tokyo Olympics & Paralympics
					

No international fans will be permitted at the delayed 2020 Tokyo Olympics and Paralympics this summer because of the pandemic.




					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 20, 2021)

Recent but vague news that Emily Eavis has put in an application to Mendip District Council for a Pilton Party style event  -- a "two day concert"

My first ever quote of an Instagram post here! :




			
				Emily Eavis said:
			
		

>




BBC version :




			
				BBC said:
			
		

> Glastonbury Festival site 'may open for concert and camping'
> 
> 
> Organisers are working on plans for a one-off concert and to let people camp on the site this summer.
> ...



I've never been -- not been tempted tbh -- but Pilton Parties generally happen in September, for about 5,000 to 8,000 people.

Can't find any reference for now to any specific date  for this latest thing ... we're committed to other events (allowedness permitting!) for at least two other weekends  in September anyway .... 

I just thought the above might be of a bit of interest though


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 20, 2021)

Its good that they are doing something, but a bit odd they've seen fit to let the cat out of the bag on social media. Might as well keep it for locals (if that isn't already the plan), if it does materialise and tickets go on general sale you'll have every pyramid stage lurking bore this side of Surrey setting their alarms and deluging the website with their 19 devices, to chase the 'Glastonbury experience'.


----------



## editor (Mar 22, 2021)

It's still looking bad for the live music sector



> Moreover, for venues of this size, it’s not just about the UK being open for business. “If you’re looking on our website as a fan, and you’ve got a ticket for a gig in October, you’d probably think: surely I can go to that,” Bownes says. “But that artist is probably due to play arenas across the US in the summer, and then go across Europe. If a few of those dates become unviable, then the tour loses money and they’ll reschedule. The margins are just so small.”
> 
> Rescheduling a big tour is difficult for the artist and venue alike. Bownes’s team has rebooked more than 80 arena shows at least twice, as lockdown rules continue to change. This cascade of changing dates is causing a knock-on effect: the O2 already has as many bookings for 2022 as it would do halfway through a normal year. “We’ve never been this busy, and our venue has never been so empty,” Bownes says.
> 
> This concert pile-up makes it difficult for venues to juggle artists’ and audiences’ requirements, for instance in matching new dates with the same days of the week. “People with weekend tickets might be coming in from out of town, and we don’t want to make it so they can’t come,” she explains. But it is also causing artists themselves a great deal of concern.












						'We won't make enough money to exist': live music sector still highly uncertain
					

With a backlog of gigs and uncertain rules around reopening, bands and venues are worried as UK pandemic wanes




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Badgers (Mar 23, 2021)




----------



## editor (Mar 23, 2021)

Wireless festival tickets on sale now On sale now: tickets for Wireless Festival 2021 at Crystal Palace Park, 10th-12 Sept


----------



## Fishmonkeynan (Mar 27, 2021)

The Select Committee on festivals had the Culture Minsiter in this week - worth a watch





__





						Parliamentlive.tv
					

Digital, Culture, Media and Sport Committee




					parliamentlive.tv
				




They grilled her on why there's no trial events going on in UK just now (like Netherlands or Spain) - didnt get very far. Basic gist is that there'll be trial events in April/May and gudiance for events isnt going to be out until late May/early June at earliest. The committee made the point thats not going to give much notice for festivals to prepare, especially if there are capacity restrictions or testing requirements as part of the guidance, and they've already paid out deposits and non refundable costs. Its going to be a big punt for festivals without covid insurance (which the govt wouldnt back).


----------



## editor (Apr 7, 2021)

WHAT a kind offer






> *Ian McNabb*
> 
> Nice. Musicians haven't earned a penny from live performance in over a year and this lot received £40,000 in culture grants in the last 12 months. Let 'em know what you think if you get a chance. How about you hire the joint for a reception and not pay them - put it down to experience for all involved.


----------



## editor (Apr 7, 2021)




----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 7, 2021)

A whole picnic hamper eh? How fortunate!


----------



## Orang Utan (Apr 7, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> A whole picnic hamper eh? How fortunate!


I bet it is a four pack of Holsten Pils and a bag of Babybels


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 8, 2021)

Glastonbury have been awarded plenty from the same cultural fund, but at least they'll put on an actual event from that in 2022, and pay their acts!


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 8, 2021)

Boomtown got a chunk of cash too, which was very welcomed.


----------



## Espresso (Apr 8, 2021)

Our airshow has been cancelled for the second time.  
It's as if the people wittering on about it on Facebook can't imagine that all of the planes and people required to put it on could possibly have any other demands on their time or that the chances of getting effective tracking and tracing at an outdoor, free event for that many people might be rather difficult/prohibitively expensive to do.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 9, 2021)

Bearded Theory have made their announcement -- to put the Festival back until the late May Bank Holiday weekend 2022.
(It was going to held over the weekend of Thursday 9th to Sunday 12th September 2021, but they had alrerady suspended their ticket sales a while back).

I'm sad  but they've made a sensible statement.

Apologies for small type in this image :


----------



## Mogden (Apr 9, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Beasrded Theory have made their annoincement -- to put the Festival back until the late May Bank Holiday weekend 2022.
> 
> I'm sad  but they've made a sensible statement.
> 
> ...


Mixed feelings. Would love to have been back at Catton but it does make sense to postpone. Also if my mate's festival does go ahead the weekend before it would have been a hell of a couple of weeks as Bearded ain't a short festie. As it is I've got the time booked off and if the Dub Pistols Mucky Weekender does go ahead I might just go to that instead.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 9, 2021)

If a festival of that capacity that was due to be held in September is cancelling, thats a good indication that camping festivals as we know them are not going to be happening this summer, as expected really.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 9, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> If a festival of that capacity that was due to be held in September is cancelling, thats a good indication that camping festivals as we know them are not going to be happening this summer, as expected really.



I'm inclined to agree, with the caveat that significantly smaller events could well still be going ahead later in the summer.

But today, weirdly, just as Bearded's announcement was landing, Beautiful Days (mid-August, and not far off twice the size of Bearded  ) have put a call-out for stewards.
Our good festival-vet mate has applied.

Almost all other fests that we're still half-hoping to get to, are tiny ones though.


----------



## mx wcfc (Apr 9, 2021)

Yeah, I got that email.  Disappointing.

It does open up the possibility of doing this one though





__





						Line Up 2022 - Mucky Weekender Festival
					

The Mucky Weekender 2020 Line Up will be revealed soon... Check back for updates.




					mucky-weekender.co.uk
				




Local for me, but it doesn't look like my sort of thing.  I've heard of a couple of the acts.


----------



## Mogden (Apr 9, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Yeah, I got that email.  Disappointing.
> 
> It does open up the possibility of doing this one though
> 
> ...


It was sited not far from Ma and Pa Mogden and I'd already blagged a lift from Bro Mogden but I reckon I could do the journey to Winchester although I'm still not convinced anything is going ahead and I'm loathed to send messages to those I know in the know asking for percentages of likely go aheads.


----------



## Fishmonkeynan (Apr 9, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> If a festival of that capacity that was due to be held in September is cancelling, thats a good indication that camping festivals as we know them are not going to be happening this summer, as expected really.



I think it’s down to how much of a risk a festival is willing to take. When govt guidance eventually comes out in June, or whenever, it could say that there won’t be many additional restrictions. In which case, it’s a good call for those festivals going full steam ahead. Then again it may say social distancing and reduced capacities. if you’ve already forked out deposits for land, suppliers etc it’s quite a hit to take. Thing is, no one knows which way it’s going to go. Bearded Theory just decided they didn’t want to take what could be a costly punt.


----------



## Mation (Apr 11, 2021)

editor said:


> WHAT a kind offer
> 
> 
> View attachment 262149


This seems like a pretty decent apology.



			http://lamporthall.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Walled-Garden-Announcement.pdf
		





			
				Lamport Hall said:
			
		

> We recently published a social media invitation calling for musicians to play at an upcoming dining event at Lamport Hall as an unpaid showcase opportunity. While it was well-intended, in retrospect we agree that it was misguided and insensitive. With the benefit of hindsight we accept the post was poorly written and insulting to professional and amateur musicians alike and we apologise unreservedly. Our intention was to offer a platform for local musicians who might just be starting out to gain some confidence, but that did not come across in the wording, and we should have realised how upsetting that would be, particularly in the current climate. We also accept that for a ticketed event, musicians should be paid and of a certain standard.
> 
> In a rushed attempt to issue what we felt was a genuine apology, we got the tone wrong and for this too I apologise. We’ve read through your comments and continue to learn valuable lessons from them. We fully understand and regret the distress that this has caused.
> 
> ...



Missing bit n the middle is about their apparent good works. But it was already looooong.


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 13, 2021)

Some news out on what mass spectator sport might look like:









						2,000 Spurs & Man City fans at final
					

Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester City will both have 2,000 fans at Wembley for the EFL Cup final on 25 April.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




The haribo cup is an obvious choice of event but that is a lot of rules and its clearly upset some.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Apr 13, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Some news out on what mass spectator sport might look like:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I think the complaints there are missing the point a bit to be honest. These events are at the experimental stage to a large degree, they're about working out what works. Why would you put highly vulnerable people more at risk until those experiments have been done?


----------



## rubbershoes (Apr 13, 2021)

I've got tickets for my local Altitude festival at the end of July. Planned my outfit too for one day 

All we can do is keep our fingers crossed


----------



## Ground Elder (Apr 14, 2021)

Shambala have cancelled


----------



## Badgers (Apr 16, 2021)

Tickets still being sold for June shows that can't take place as planned
					

Shows by Alicia Keys, Haim and Mrs Brown's Boys won't go ahead as planned this June.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## ska invita (Apr 19, 2021)

This is what a test run looks like 











						Blossoms to play England’s first large music gig of 2021
					

Outdoor event at Sefton Park in May will be studied to test Covid safety at mass gatherings




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Apr 19, 2021)

Rapper AJ Tracey had a couple of gigs this Sunday just gone...
AJ Tracey: Gig organisers fined £10k for Covid rule breach in Manchester


> "It's not gonna be safe for me to come to Bristol. I didn't expect that many people to turn up in Manny and genuinely it's just not OK for me to go ahead."


So you think you're unpopular?
ffs


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 20, 2021)

ska invita said:


> This is what a test run looks like :
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I think a test event like that, with just 5,000 people in an open-air setting, sounds fair enough TBF.

I suppose a lot hangs on how strictly the organisers and those doing the actual tests/surveys, are able to control fan's behaviour ......


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 20, 2021)

Boomtown now cancelled. Hardly surprised, though.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 20, 2021)

Have they pulled Reading & Leeds yet?


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 20, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Have they pulled Reading & Leeds yet?



Don't think so but I imagine it'll only be a matter of time.   The giddy days of the vaccines will save summer are long gone and a gritty reality is kicking in.  

As ever it's Johnson and the stupid shit he says.  Its hard to find anyone that actually truly believe things will be largely back to normal by the June date.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Apr 20, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I suppose a lot hangs on how strictly the organisers and those doing the actual tests/surveys, are able to control fan's behaviour ......



I think that's a big part of the testing. They did a nightclub event in Holland a few weeks ago where they gave different groups of people different instructions (no distancing, strict distancing, keeping in small groups but trying to distance from other groups) and from what I read it was definitely about how people acted as anything else - shockingly it seems people in nightclubs don't social distance well.


----------



## BigMoaner (Apr 20, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I bet it is a four pack of Holsten Pils and a bag of Babybels


Tuc.


----------



## editor (Apr 20, 2021)

New reggae festival City Splash Festival celebrates the influence of reggae music, food and culture in South London – 12 Sept 2021


----------



## ska invita (Apr 20, 2021)

editor said:


> New reggae festival City Splash Festival celebrates the influence of reggae music, food and culture in South London – 12 Sept 2021


yeah my local park! im away to mucky weekend or else would've checked it
im curious to see how these new festival in Beckenham place park shape up
i fear like Brockwell park they will be bad value for money, finish early, and crucially volume levels will be shit = particularly shit for this whre you need all subs blasting
Beckenham Place Park has more distance to neighbouring houses though, and less housing around it in general.


----------



## klang (Apr 20, 2021)

8000 people?!?!


----------



## ska invita (Apr 20, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Don't think so but I imagine it'll only be a matter of time.   The giddy days of the vaccines will save summer are long gone and a gritty reality is kicking in.


What is the new reality as you see it?
Cases continue to fall, but i am guessing its the logistics of "vaccine passports" (or getting a clean test the day before to validate a ticket) thats too hard for big events?


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 20, 2021)

ska invita said:


> yeah my local park! im away to mucky weekend or else would've checked it
> im curious to see how these new festival in Beckenham place park shape up
> i fear like Brockwell park they will be bad value for money, finish early, and crucially volume levels will be shit = particularly shit for this whre you need all subs blasting
> Beckenham Place Park has more distance to neighbouring houses though, and less housing around it in general.



I think it might be ok for sound levels, as i dont think it is often used for one day festivals, so the council/nearby residents wont have had the chance to get their knickers in a twist about hearing a bit of noise before 10pm. The first year festivals use a park tends to be loud, years after that their license normally has harsher noise restrictions.


----------



## ska invita (Apr 20, 2021)

well this explains it - lack of insurance, with government in the frame








						Covid-cautious festival cancellations dampen ‘great British summer’ hopes
					

Promoters cite financial risk of staging events that the government could shut down at short notice




					www.theguardian.com
				





A trickle of festival cancellations is poised to “become a flood”, with more than nine in 10 independent events privately indicating they may not go ahead, senior industry figures have said, after Boomtown festival became the third in a week to cancel.

Boomtown’s announcement on Tuesday morning came days after the arts festival Shambala and the indie rock festival Barn on the Farm announced last week that they would not go ahead. All three cited the financial risk of staging events that could be shut down at a moment’s notice by a reimposition of Covid restrictions.



A statement posted on the Boomtown website on Tuesday said: “Sadly Covid-specific cancellation insurance for events simply does not exist at this point in time. This means anyone putting on an event this year will be doing so without the safety net of insurance to cover them should Covid prevent them from going ahead in any capacity.”

The past week’s cancellations followed those of the Bluedot festival this month and the Download and Belladrum Tartan Heart music festivals in March. Glastonbury, the UK’s biggest summer music festival, announced in January the cancellation of its 2021 event.

Despite promises by government ministers of a “great British summer” of music, event organisers have for weeks been saying many events might not go ahead if the government did not step in to back insurance against the risk of a reimposition of Covid restrictions.

Paul Reed, the chief executive of the Association of Independent Festivals, said a recent poll of his group’s membership had found that 92.5% said they could not go ahead without some form of government-backed insurance or indemnity scheme. AIF represents about 80 festivals, comprising 40% of the UK’s festival calendar.

Organisers were pushing decision dates back as far as they could, in case a change in circumstances made it possible to go ahead with confidence, Reed said.

“I think we’re going to see a wave of cancellations from this point forward … I’m having crisis meetings with festivals,” he said. “We know that more cancellations are coming, unfortunately. There are other festivals that have already made that decision and it’s just about the timing of the announcement.”

As Boomtown announced its cancellation on Tuesday, Live, which represents the live music industry, told Boris Johnson there had been a “complete market failure” to provide festivals with the insurance cover they needed. In a letter to the prime minister, Greg Parmley, the Live chief executive, calls for £400m remaining from the government’s culture recovery fund to be allocated to cover event organisers’ costs if they are forced to cancel on public health grounds.

Similar schemes are in place in Germany, Denmark, Austria, the Netherlands, Belgium and Norway, the letter notes.

Commenting on the letter, Parmley said the trickle of cancellations so far would “become a flood” if a solution to the problem of insuring events was not found. “The prime minister has said he wants this to be a great British summer,” Parmley said. “So do we. But that won’t happen if our world-leading live music events disappear for the second year in a row.”

A spokesperson for the Department for Culture, Media and Sport said: “More than £34m from our unprecedented culture recovery fund has supported festivals including Boomtown, Shambala, Glastonbury and Deer Shed festival. We are aware of the wider concerns about securing indemnity for live events and are exploring what further support we may provide.”


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 20, 2021)

ska invita said:


> What is the new reality as you see it?
> Cases continue to fall, but i am guessing its the logistics of "vaccine passports" (or getting a clean test the day before to validate a ticket) thats too hard for big events?



Its not a new reality as such just the realisation that we're a long way from being through all this.  Pretty much all the modelling predicts a third wave of infections and even Johnson has as good as predicted it.  

What this means for this summer is that it feels too soon.  There just seems so many ifs and buts that in the cold light of day.  Now that the initial enthusiasm about the route map out has waned its clear that any big events still planning on pushing through are taking big risks.  On this thread we have examples of the very steady steps that are being taken to get live sport of events back on, the idea that in a couple of months it will just be a free for all seems utterly fanciful.


----------



## ska invita (Apr 20, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Its not a new reality as such just the realisation that we're a long way from being through all this.  Pretty much all the modelling predicts a third wave of infections and even Johnson has as good as predicted it.
> 
> What this means for this summer is that it feels too soon.  There just seems so many ifs and buts that in the cold light of day.  Now that the initial enthusiasm about the route map out has waned its clear that any big events still planning on pushing through are taking big risks.  On this thread we have examples of the very steady steps that are being taken to get live sport of events back on, the idea that in a couple of months it will just be a free for all seems utterly fanciful.


take your point but i didnt think it was to be a free for all, it looked like passports + pre-entry tests, which is a different matter  i think


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 20, 2021)

I’m just so angry about it all. Months and months ago industry types were telling the government what was needed. Other countries have done it. It could be so different, but we’re stuck with this bunch of cunts in charge.


----------



## ska invita (Apr 20, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’m just so angry about it all. Months and months ago industry types were telling the government what was needed. Other countries have done it. It could be so different, but we’re stuck with this bunch of cunts in charge.


if you can be arsed can you say what should've happened that isnt happening


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 20, 2021)

ska invita said:


> if you can be arsed can you say what should've happened that isnt happening


Government backed cancellation insurance is the main one.

That and competent leadership, but I accept that’s a stretch too far.


----------



## pesh (Apr 20, 2021)

You'd have thought the government would have realised the vacuum left by a total lack of festivals when they're basically / arguably safe to go ahead is going to lead to carnage. last summer some jokers stuck a pair of fucking battery operated PA speakers in a park outside Manchester and pulled in 6000 people.  The used PA gear pages on facebook have been full of wanted and for sale ads for 'suicide rigs' for months, and for the more organised people out there a 10 grand fine is fuck all expense compared to staging a legal event. 

People are clucking for a party and they will happen, everywhere. The OB are going to be playing a game of wack-a-mole all summer.


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 29, 2021)

Beatherder festival has just cancelled.  Same old story about insurance.  I can maybe see a few 500 capacity festivals happening this summer but nothing larger.


----------



## Espresso (Apr 29, 2021)

Tickets went on sale this morning for this.


----------



## Mogden (Apr 29, 2021)

Espresso said:


> Tickets went on sale this morning for this.
> 
> View attachment 265486


That's a bit of a tombola line up!


----------



## BigTom (Apr 29, 2021)

Burning Man cancelled yesterday: Into the Great Unknown, and Beyond


----------



## Badgers (Apr 29, 2021)

Mogden said:


> That's a bit of a tombola line up!


Quite a lot of old vulnerable performers  no doubt they have all had both vaccine shots.


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 29, 2021)

Badgers said:


> Quite a lot of old vulnerable performers  no doubt they have all had both vaccine shots.



The Death Pool 2021 Festival


----------



## Mogden (Apr 29, 2021)

Badgers said:


> Quite a lot of old vulnerable performers  no doubt they have all had both vaccine shots.


I wouldn't be sad to see UB40 go. I've probably told the tale before but me and my festival chums sat at a bench at Bearded Theory for 9 hours one day, swapping out now and again for food, drinks and exercising numb bums, with the plan that at the first note that UB40 struck we'd stand up and leave. We did it


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 30, 2021)

I lasted longer than you for that gig Mogden , but kinnell, it was boring .....


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 30, 2021)

I think Beautiful Days announcement, due next Friday (7th May) will be interesting one way or t'other.

I posted that they were going to confirm (or not!) over in the BD thread on the main festivals subforum a little while ago, that they had announced this 7th May prospect.

The Levellers (on the Beautiful Days site) appeared optimistic that their fest will go ahead, but I remain personally sceptical, given the (usual) size of the event (15,000 or so  ).

They have already started recruiting stewards -- two of our best festie mates have applied,, including one who's a very experienced, now senior, Oxfam team leader at Glastonbury in whatever 'normal times' were.

How big is terms of numbers is that WonderHall malarkey?  .... with that line-up (OK weird, but quite big names!), I'd imagine at least 10.000 or so.

I don't think I've heard of it, is it new?
But like BD, it seems to be set in the grounds of a country house.

Could the setting be relevant in any way?


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 30, 2021)

Grim stuff in Israel tonight, with dozens of people killed in a stampede at some religious festival that was the country's biggest gathering since before the pandemic - it's not a directly COVID-related disaster, but should serve as a reminder that the skills of a lot of people working in crowd control, event planning etc. might have gotten rusty, and a lot of people are no longer used to being in crowds.


----------



## Mogden (Apr 30, 2021)

Y Not is apparently going ahead. 









						Y Not Festival line-up as 2021 event is set to go ahead
					

Organisers have just put out some very exciting news




					www.derbytelegraph.co.uk
				




Given the absolute disasters they've had previously when continuing well after sensible to do so,  that year it flooded and everyone got stuck, I can't say I'm surprised. I actually quite fancy the lineup though so am sticking it on my keeping an eye on this list.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 30, 2021)

Glastonbury to become family-friendly campsite over summer
					

Organisers warned the site will not be a "party venue" with live music and sound systems banned.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




Glasto Family Field has been expanded


----------



## Espresso (Apr 30, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> How big is terms of numbers is that WonderHall malarkey?  .... with that line-up (OK weird, but quite big names!), I'd imagine at least 10.000 or so.
> 
> I don't think I've heard of it, is it new?
> But like BD, it seems to be set in the grounds of a country house.
> ...


It is new. It's a last minute replacement for the Lytham Festival, which is not on again until next year.  Lytham tends to get in the region of something like 70,000 at it, no idea what sorts of numbers they're selling for WonderHall.


----------



## Sunray (Apr 30, 2021)

I'm hopeful for the IoW festival.  
They have taken a risk and moved it to the end of September. It can be quite nice then but it can get cold and rainy then too. 
 Not sure of the demographic for that festival.  It's nice having a lineup I give no shits about, get to use the van and see the Oxfam team again.  Camp for free on the IoW.


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 30, 2021)

Sunray said:


> I'm hopeful for the IoW festival.
> They have taken a risk and moved it to the end of September. It can be quite nice then but it can get cold and rainy then too.
> Not sure of the demographic for that festival.  It's nice having a lineup I give no shits about, get to use the van and see the Oxfam team again.  Camp for free on the IoW.



I think the demographic is quite young.  I've never been but it occupies the same place in my brain as the old V Festivals and the Reading / Leeds weekenders.  That may be unfair.


----------



## Sunray (Apr 30, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> I think the demographic is quite young.  I've never been but it occupies the same place in my brain as the old V Festivals and the Reading / Leeds weekenders.  That may be unfair.



The performers definitely aren't young!  This line up makes me lol!


----------



## Badgers (Apr 30, 2021)

Sunray said:


> They have taken a risk and moved it to the end of September. It can be quite nice then but it can get cold and rainy then too.


Every childhood holiday I had in the summer months it pissed down


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 30, 2021)

Sunray said:


> The performers definitely aren't young!  This line up makes me lol!
> 
> View attachment 265716



Blimey, you're right.  That's wall to wall dad-rock.


----------



## Badgers (May 1, 2021)

Anyone got a link to the Liverpool rave reporter with the munted bloke in the background?


----------



## Supine (May 1, 2021)




----------



## Badgers (May 1, 2021)

The new Captain Tom


----------



## Yossarian (May 3, 2021)

Oktoberfest cancelled again.









						Germany's Oktoberfest canceled again in 2021 due to coronavirus | DW | 03.05.2021
					

Germany's annual Oktoberfest will be canceled for a second year in a row due to the coronavirus pandemic. Bavarian Premier Markus Söder said the decision was made with a "heavy heart."




					www.dw.com


----------



## Mogden (May 3, 2021)

I've been subjected to the snooker at work tonight. How is it The Crucible can cram in umpteen punters, capacity crowd they reported, quite a few with no masks or masks tucked under noses and chins. How does that work then! We can't be out in the fresh air but they can be stuffed in a building elbow to elbow.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 3, 2021)

Mogden said:


> I've been subjected to the snooker at work tonight. How is it The Crucible can cram in umpteen punters, capacity crowd they reported, quite a few with no masks or masks tucked under noses and chins. How does that work then! We can't be out in the fresh air but they can be stuffed in a building elbow to elbow.


It's a test event.  Everyone is tested before and after.  If it goes well, things open up quicker.

But I get your point.


----------



## Mogden (May 3, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> It's a test event.  Everyone is tested before and after.  If it goes well, things open up quicker.
> 
> But I get your point.


I figured it might be but I would have thought some distancing would still apply and given it is being televised they'd have covid marshalls getting people to wear their masks properly.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 3, 2021)

Mogden said:


> I figured it might be but I would have thought some distancing would still apply and given it is being televised they'd have covid marshalls getting people to wear their masks properly.


I watched a bit earlier - there were stewards on the stairs facing the crowd during play - I guess you are always going to have someone whose mask has slipped down off their nose though.  It happened to me in Sainsburys the other day.  Not good I know, but it happens.  In earlier rounds the audience has been split up - I guess the results from testing have been good.


----------



## ddraig (May 3, 2021)

It's mad but fair play to the snooker and those in audience for test
Might well bring indoors gigs back sooner


----------



## William of Walworth (May 3, 2021)

Sunray said:


> The performers definitely aren't young!  This line up makes me lol!
> 
> View attachment 265716



I'd really enjoy _some_ of that lineup -- as an oldie who sort-of rocks without being a dad! 

We'll be playing safer later in September by going to Gail Something Else's main event near the NW Devon coast, max 500-ish people (plus possibly a few more crew, maybe)


----------



## mx wcfc (May 3, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I'd really enjoy _some_ of that lineup -- as an oldie who sort-of rocks without being a dad!
> 
> We'll be playing safer later in September by going to Gail Something Else's main event near the NW Devon coast, max 500-ish people (plus possibly a few more crew, maybe)


The Isle of Wight Festival is 2 hours from me, including the ferry, and I wouldn't go.  I've become a bit of a small festival snob. Big festivals like that terrify me these days.  

I've got my second jab later this week and a van now.  After June, I'm going for it. I have a ticket for Mayhem at Micks (9/10 July) and Gail's at the Tiddly, the week after that.

Three weekends in a row might be too much to go to Kippertronix the week after, but Eastfield are playing, so maybe.

Northern Green Gathering appeals too - Eastfield are playing - but it's a bit of a slog and I need to be comfortable that my new (old) van will make it!  

I'm waiting to see if the Blyth Power Ashes happens August Bank Holiday, before committing to anything else.  Maybe Watchet.    

Mucky Weekender near Winchester, early Sept maybe a no no, as mrs mx has a significant birthday.

But it would be good to meet you and festival debs, at SE by the Sea, or maybe the Tiddly.   I have a feeling we may have been at the same festivals before.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 3, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> But it would be good to meet you and festival debs, at SE by the Sea, or maybe the Tiddly.   I have a feeling we may have been at the same festivals before.



We'll be aiming for both those Gail events!


----------



## BigTom (May 4, 2021)

Mogden said:


> I figured it might be but I would have thought some distancing would still apply and given it is being televised they'd have covid marshalls getting people to wear their masks properly.



No - the point of these events is to test whether / how much social distancing is needed/affects things. The 5,000 person gig in Liverpool this weekend was no social distancing, and I assume the snooker was the same. There will be events with social distancing requirements as well, but you need to do some without if you want to find out how much it matters.


----------



## Mogden (May 4, 2021)

BigTom said:


> No - the point of these events is to test whether / how much social distancing is needed/affects things. The 5,000 person gig in Liverpool this weekend was no social distancing, and I assume the snooker was the same. There will be events with social distancing requirements as well, but you need to do some without if you want to find out how much it matters.


True. I guess with a solid year of social distancing it feels bizarre and jarring to see people sat so close together.


----------



## BigTom (May 4, 2021)

Covid: Packed pilot festival brings the good times back - for one night
					

Blossoms play to 5,000 fans in Liverpool to help gather research for this summer's festival season.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




watch some video from the event in Liverpool on Saturday


----------



## William of Walworth (May 4, 2021)

BigTom said:


> Covid: Packed pilot festival brings the good times back - for one night
> 
> 
> Blossoms play to 5,000 fans in Liverpool to help gather research for this summer's festival season.
> ...



That's a good BBC report IMO, little as I generally like Festival Republic  

But TBF, Melvin Benn does say some half-way sensible stuff here .....




			
				BBC said:
			
		

> Organisers are also calling on the government to provide insurance in case there's another Covid spike and festivals have to be cancelled at short notice, after spending large sums on preparations.
> "The truth is, unless the government provide it, there's real vulnerability for the rest of the summer," Benn said.
> He invited arts minister Caroline Dinenage to see the set-up of the Sefton Park pilot for herself. Speaking on site, she said the insurance idea was "still on the table" and was "with the Treasury", adding: "If we can do it, we'd like to."
> Reading and Leeds, the biggest events left in this summer's calendar, are sold out. Asked whether they could happen without government insurance, Benn shrugged and gave no comment.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 6, 2021)

Rebellion cancelled. Tt's The Big One on the punk calendar.  Never been, wasn't going this year, but it's still a shame.  There is clearly still concern that things are going to blow up again.









						Home
					

Home




					www.rebellionfestivals.com
				




I'm just hoping the small festivals survive - they haven't got the same issues with deposits and up front costs.


----------



## Teaboy (May 7, 2021)

Beautiful days due to announce their line-up this morning.  They seem committed.


----------



## Numbers (May 7, 2021)

Love Supreme cancelled y/day.


----------



## BigTom (May 7, 2021)

UK Games Expo is going ahead at the NEC, 29th July - 1st August.








						#PlayWithConfidence
					

Now in it's 14th year, UK Games Expo (UKGE) is the largest Hobby Games Convention in the UK. A fun event appealing to families as well as the enthusiast.




					www.ukgamesexpo.co.uk
				




23% capacity I saw them say on facebook which will make it impossible for them to break even financially I reckon. the NEC must be giving them massive discounts (I'm assuming hiring the NEC is their main fixed cost, way over the website, advertising etc) and it's just about viable.

All attendees must have a negative laminar flow test from (I think) 24hrs maximum beforhand to enter, all staff will be tested twice over the weekend. Wider aisles to enable social distancing, lots of sanitiser stations and extra cleaning and such like, along with whatever Public Health England are recommending at the time.


----------



## Mogden (May 7, 2021)

There seem to be all manner of minor festies popping up around June and July time.  The Ferocious Dog and Bearded Theory chat Facebook pages are teeming with them. Still not sure how many will actually happen especially as June is now less than a month away.


----------



## josef1878 2.0 (May 8, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Rebellion cancelled. Tt's The Big One on the punk calendar.  Never been, wasn't going this year, but it's still a shame.  There is clearly still concern that things are going to blow up again.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I've been many times, brilliant weekend. Like any good festival the bands are happy to play a small part in it. Rebellion have been up front and honest, they couldn't get insurance.


----------



## ddraig (May 11, 2021)

Trial events in Wales including an Eid event, 500 at Tafwyl in Cardiff castle (May) and 4,000 at footy (June)








						Wales' spectators to join in sport and culture events trial
					

Football, cricket, festivals and theatrical events are among test events welcoming back audiences.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 13, 2021)

Supersonic postponed until next year.









						Supersonic Festival - An important update from Capsule about Supersonic 2021
					

Crafting extraordinary events for adventurous audiences




					supersonicfestival.com


----------



## sojourner (May 13, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Beatherder festival has just cancelled.  Same old story about insurance.  I can maybe see a few 500 capacity festivals happening this summer but nothing larger.


I never even got an email about this! First I knew about it!


----------



## Orang Utan (May 14, 2021)

Just bought my first ticket for a rave:
Próximo at Corsica Studios at Corsica Studios, London ⟋ RA Tickets 🕺🕺🕺🕺


----------



## Teaboy (May 14, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Just bought my first ticket for a rave:
> Próximo at Corsica Studios at Corsica Studios, London ⟋ RA Tickets 🕺🕺🕺🕺



You might not want to read today's news...


----------



## Orang Utan (May 14, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> You might not want to read today's news...


huh?


----------



## fishfinger (May 14, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> huh?


Covid: Indian variant could disrupt 21 June easing, PM says


----------



## Orang Utan (May 14, 2021)

fishfinger said:


> Covid: Indian variant could disrupt 21 June easing, PM says


Ah ok, well if it does get cancelled, never mind, the venue needs the money anyway


----------



## Sunray (May 14, 2021)

I hope to be wrong, but I think the world is too unpredictable for festivals.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 15, 2021)

Sunray said:


> I hope to be wrong, but I think the world is too unpredictable for festivals.



I hope to be wrong about my pessimistic thoughts about this summer's UK festivals too 

So how about :  the world makes it far too unpredictable right now to predict whether or not already-planned UK festivals will happen this summer.

IMO (as 'IMO' *currently* stands, anyway!) there's still a _reasonable possibility_ that _some_ of the smaller UK ones _might_ still go ahead.

And yes, I've lately been reading depressing amounts already, about the big risks posed by the Indian variant, so please don't think I;m being complacent here.

I just think that things about festivals and other like events are far from certain *yet*. For now!


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (May 15, 2021)

Having read the guidance for events yesterday, smaller festivals and events are allowed to happen from Monday, up to a 1000 indoors and 4000 outdoors.
I'm booked to do sound for a small venue for a couple of dates starting next saturday.


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 20, 2021)

Just heard this mentioned on Radio Caroline, it's Glastonbury, but not as we know it.

One day only, no camping, and limited to 50,000 - to include all staff, artists & vendors. 



> A licence for a concert at the Glastonbury festival site in September has been approved, paving the way for a one-day event – entitled Equinox – in lieu of the usual five-day June celebration.
> 
> Mendip district council, which oversees the festival’s Somerset location, approved the licence after consulting with local residents and authorities.
> 
> ...











						Licence approved for one-day Glastonbury event, Equinox, in September
					

Mendip council give green light to 50,000-capacity show to be called Equinox, with no overnight camping




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Sunray (May 24, 2021)

Meanwhile, I'm still waiting for the cancellation of Latitude.   They did very recently update the website but that's an easy job for one over a week or so.
It's 10 weeks away and they want £226 for a ticket.  

This is the lineup








						Artists
					

Artists




					www.latitudefestival.com
				




I don't think COVID is the problem.


----------



## Mation (May 25, 2021)

Didn't know where to put this...

I was just part of the virtual studio audience for a recording of Mock the Week, to be broadcast on Thursday, I think.

Applied for tickets a couple of months ago and got turned down. But then some people must have dropped out or something, as they changed their minds yesterday.

It was via Zoom. I had my video off, but others didn't, and they seemed to have picked 50 of the people who had their cameras on to show throughout. Plus you also have to log in to the BBC's audience recording system, to capture the applause and guffaws.

Has anyone watched comedy programmes with an audience like this? Does it work as a viewer?

From my perspective, I got quite bored, even though lots of it was funny. But then I'm not that fussed about telly - I just wanted to see what it was like.

It was good hearing the rest of the audience, but too tempting to turn my mic off every so often and go and "do something less boring instead," in general Zoom meeting vein.

Are live studio audiences set to return from next month, variant-depending?


----------



## belboid (May 25, 2021)

Mation said:


> Didn't know where to put this...
> 
> I was just part of the virtual studio audience for a recording of Mock the Week, to be broadcast on Thursday, I think.
> 
> ...


I got a ticket for R4 comedy week special, but forgot to go.


----------



## mx wcfc (May 25, 2021)

The festival I had pencilled in for August Bank Holiday, Blyth Power Ashes, isn't happening properly now.  There will be a camping trip to a pub, with acoustic music and the obligatory cricket match, like last year.  It was OK, but not sure it's worth the effort again.  I'll have to have a think, but in the meantime, ever the optimist, I'm on the lookout for another festival that weekend.  Watchet is sold out. Any ideas, anyone?


----------



## mx wcfc (May 25, 2021)

Mation said:


> Are live studio audiences set to return from next month, variant-depending?


Have I Got News For You had a live audience  last week, albeit small and socially distanced.  Maybe it was a test event?


----------



## kalidarkone (May 25, 2021)

Mation said:


> Didn't know where to put this...
> 
> I was just part of the virtual studio audience for a recording of Mock the Week, to be broadcast on Thursday, I think.
> 
> ...


On Have I got news for you last night they had a socially distanced live audience for the first time in ages.

Oh mx wcfc got there first  
I should of read to the end of the thread....


----------



## Orang Utan (May 25, 2021)

kalidarkone said:


> On Have I got news for you last night they had a socially distanced live audience for the first time in ages.


That must have been a repeat


----------



## kalidarkone (May 25, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> That must have been a repeat


I thought you were making a joke because I've just unwittingly repeated what mx wcfc just said.....

But if you weren't- no it wasn't a repeat as the news they were talking about was current and Paul Merton expressed very seriously and a little emotionally how lovely it was to have a live audience and then the camera panned to a masked up very socially distant audience.


----------



## Orang Utan (May 25, 2021)

kalidarkone said:


> I thought you were making a joke because I've just unwittingly repeated what mx wcfc just said.....
> 
> But if you weren't- no it wasn't a repeat as the news they were talking about was current and Paul Merton expressed very seriously and a little emotionally how lovely it was to have a live audience and then the camera panned to a masked up very socially distant audience.


A repeat from Friday!


----------



## Mation (May 25, 2021)

belboid said:


> I got a ticket for R4 comedy week special, but forgot to go.


That's usually me. Amazed I remembered to do it!

Would it have been live or virtual?


kalidarkone said:


> But if you weren't- no it wasn't a repeat as the news they were talking about was current and Paul Merton expressed very seriously and a little emotionally how lovely it was to have a live audience and then the camera panned to a masked up very socially distant audience.


I used to go to R4 comedy quite often, but I think I'd be fretting about ventilation unless they'd specifically addressed it.


----------



## ska invita (May 27, 2021)

Sunray said:


> Meanwhile, I'm still waiting for the cancellation of Latitude.   They did very recently update the website but that's an easy job for one over a week or so.
> It's 10 weeks away and they want £226 for a ticket.
> 
> This is the lineup
> ...


seems to be going ahead, full line up just announced, acts booked etc


----------



## ska invita (May 27, 2021)

ska invita said:


> seems to be going ahead, full line up just announced, acts booked etc


to go ahead full opening a la June 21st date needs to happen. if that date is postponed three weeks it can still happen Id imagine

"
I promised to update you on the line up announcement as soon as possible and that time has come.
As you will have seen from some press reports, the Government’s Event Research Programme (ERP) has been operational for much of this month and has now concluded. I produced one of the shows; The Sefton Park Pilot. It totally confirmed what was missing in my life at the moment: the joy of being in a field with like-minded people enjoying music and life. Unconfirmed reports suggest, that of the 58,000 people that attended pilot/test events, only 15 cases of infections were reported. While I cannot confirm that, I can confirm that to a very large extent, the 6,100 ticket buyers at the Sefton Park show had reported cases proportionate to those numbers despite almost every attendee being under the age profile of being offered vaccines. I believe it was a massive success and demonstrated there is a way to produce festivals in a Covid safe manner.
You may also have just seen our exciting news that we will be running a second pilot show event for them, this time a 10,000 person camping event at Donington Park,  as part of the second phase of the ERP. I see this as confirmation that they believe in the June 21st date just as much as the Prime Minister does and just as much as I do. That’s also why I today have the confidence to talk about our new headline partner, cinch. cinch believes that Latitude can happen this year just as much as I do and to that end I will be releasing the line up tomorrow at 10am. The summer is coming.
Melvin"

Melvin Benn is the director of festival republic


----------



## belboid (May 27, 2021)

Mation said:


> That's usually me. Amazed I remembered to do it!
> 
> Would it have been live or virtual?


virtual, I’m not even sure who would have been on had I made it.  

Apparently I am going to a comedy gig at Leeds town hall tomorrow. I had no idea, but they’ve just mailed me with detailed instructions on my upcoming visit to see Daniel Sloss: HUBRIS.  Dunno if I’ll bother with that either


----------



## Orang Utan (May 27, 2021)

belboid said:


> virtual, I’m not even sure who would have been on had I made it.
> 
> Apparently I am going to a comedy gig at Leeds town hall tomorrow. I had no idea, but they’ve just mailed me with detailed instructions on my upcoming visit to see Daniel Sloss: HUBRIS.  Dunno if I’ll bother with that either


I just got that email - I thought it was a mistake as I don’t remember buying a ticket. Couldn’t get on the website to find out if I actually do have a ticket


----------



## Saul Goodman (May 27, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I just got that email - I thought it was a mistake as I don’t remember buying a ticket. Couldn’t get on the website to find out if I actually do have a ticket


It's a scam. You get there, they ask for your ticket, you look all sheepish and buy a ticket.


----------



## Orang Utan (May 27, 2021)

Saul Goodman said:


> It's a scam. You get there, they ask for your ticket, you look all sheepish and buy a ticket.


Well it’s a shit scam cos I’m not going


----------



## Sunray (May 27, 2021)

ska invita said:


> seems to be going ahead, full line up just announced, acts booked etc


Wow, really didn't expect that.  Summers looking up.


----------



## Orang Utan (May 27, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Well it’s a shit scam cos I’m not going


Just got another email apologising for the mistake lol


----------



## belboid (May 27, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Just got another email apologising for the mistake lol


I haven't!  So I must be going it seems


----------



## BigTom (May 27, 2021)

ska invita said:


> Unconfirmed reports suggest, that of the 58,000 people that attended pilot/test events, only 15 cases of infections were reported. While I cannot confirm that, I can confirm that to a very large extent, the 6,100 ticket buyers at the Sefton Park show had reported cases proportionate to those numbers despite almost every attendee being under the age profile of being offered vaccines. I believe it was a massive success and demonstrated there is a way to produce festivals in a Covid safe manner.



Wow - that's massive news and really opens things up if it's confirmed more broadly, but the Sefton Park gig was about as unsocially distanced and as risky as an outdoor gig can get I think. Big news if that's repeated across indoor venues as well.


----------



## ska invita (May 27, 2021)

Sunray said:


> Wow, really didn't expect that.  Summers looking up.


well....it could still all change and plugged pulled, but Festival Republic seem to be going full steam ahead


----------



## Saul Goodman (May 27, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Just got another email apologising for the mistake lol


They're reading this thread.


----------



## ddraig (May 27, 2021)

Wales live events allowed








						Covid: Live music performances to return in Wales
					

Venues will need to limit groups to a maximum of six people from six households.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Mogden (May 28, 2021)

Good job I've been getting some new lightweight camping gear together. At this rate there's a chance I might get to a festival this year. Blimey! Don't get me wrong, I'm happy about it, just surprised and cautiously optimistic.


----------



## Sunray (May 28, 2021)

ska invita said:


> well....it could still all change and plugged pulled, but Festival Republic seem to be going full steam ahead



Latitude does have a lot of indoor stages, but if they made them all outdoor I think it'd be pretty safe.


----------



## ska invita (May 28, 2021)

Sunray said:


> Latitude does have a lot of indoor stages, but if they made them all outdoor I think it'd be pretty safe.


Front pages of the papers today dont look too positive tbh







...unless Festival Republic have some special relationship going on with government


----------



## elbows (May 28, 2021)

Mouth of the Tyne cancelled:









						Covid: Mouth of the Tyne Festival cancelled amid restrictions uncertainty
					

The Mouth of the Tyne Festival is rescheduled over concerns around the easing of Covid measures.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## elbows (May 29, 2021)

Festivals face 'another lost summer' without government safety net, MPs say
					

Many events can't proceed without government-backed cancellation insurance, a committee of MPs says.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## marshall (May 29, 2021)

Sunray said:


> Latitude does have a lot of indoor stages, but if they made them all outdoor I think it'd be pretty safe.



I've always thought of Latitude as very much an 'outdoorsy' festival tbh, probably because I never spend any time in the Comedy tent - just too crowded - or Cabaret, in fact I can only think of one of the music stages that's in a tent, the BBC Introducing thing, one down from the main one, the Obelisk. The rest are all outdoors aren't they, the one in the woods, the one by the lake, and the previously mentioned Obelisk. 

It's a festival I very much associate with just wandering around outdoors, sitting in the woods (bastard mosquitoes there ), drinks, spiffs, all outdoors, in fact, I go for the setting and the fact that it's only 30 mins away in the car, not so much the music; although this year there's definitely enough on the undercard to interest me, Dry Cleaning, Squid, Shame, Fontaines so definitely keeping an eye on this.

But, no, never thought of Latitude as having that many indoor stages. I think it would be pretty safe, they might limit the attendance figures though, which if I could get a ticket would be great, remind of the early years of the festival - 2006/7 - when it was much smaller.


----------



## elbows (May 29, 2021)

The risk is strongly linked to overall levels of infection in the community at the time. So what successfully passes a trial carried out when there is relatively low viral prevalence can easily end up being deemed too risky if infection levels overall have climbed notably since the period when the trial was carried out.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 1, 2021)

10,000 people to attend Download Festival test event in the UK · News ⟋ RA
					

The three-day pilot will gauge Covid-19 transmission at mass music events.




					ra.co
				




UK rock festival Download will be run as a pilot to test the feasibility of large-scale music events. After announcing its cancellation in March, the three-day festival revealed its return to participate in the UK Government's Event Research Programme (ERP) according to the _BBC_. 10,000 people with negative lateral flow and PCR tests will be allowed to attend without masks or social distancing while researchers from Public Health England monitor possible transmissions.

The festival takes place from June 18th at Donington Park. Previous editions of Download have had more than 100,000 attendees. The event is part of the UK's phased reopening programme. Previous ERP pilots found 15 out of a possible 58,000 people tested positive following trial mass events. ERP research has also deemed mass events to be safe as shopping or eating at a restaurant. Learn more in this report on the prospects for festivals returning in Europe and the UK.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 3, 2021)

Nozstock The Hidden Valley 2021 is postponed - Nozstock The Hidden Valley Festival
					

Dear Nozstockers, We are devastated that we find ourselves in this position once again but unfortunately we must announce the 21st edition of Nozstock The Hidden Valley will be postponed and will now take place between the 21st and 24th July 2022.




					nozstock.com
				




Another one gone.


----------



## quiet guy (Jun 3, 2021)

NASS has pushed their festival back until mid August.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 4, 2021)

elbows said:


> Festivals face 'another lost summer' without government safety net, MPs say
> 
> 
> Many events can't proceed without government-backed cancellation insurance, a committee of MPs says.
> ...



To me, that's one of the most *relevant* stories about festivals this year.

I was also wondering whether the Govt could just postpone 21st June for another few weeks, for example until end of school terms (?)

I'm well behind with Covid UK thread developments though -- major computer problems over the last week


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 4, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Nozstock The Hidden Valley 2021 is postponed - Nozstock The Hidden Valley Festival
> 
> 
> Dear Nozstockers, We are devastated that we find ourselves in this position once again but unfortunately we must announce the 21st edition of Nozstock The Hidden Valley will be postponed and will now take place between the 21st and 24th July 2022.
> ...



We and van were going to go to Nozstock!

But it had sold out ......... will have to be next year, now!!


----------



## miss direct (Jun 4, 2021)

I've applied to be a volunteer at Tramlines. Wonder if it'll go ahead.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 4, 2021)

If things carry on as they are (and the government continues to ignore it) there will be little or nothing till next summer at best.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 4, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I'm well behind with Covid UK thread developments though -- major computer problems over the last week



In short, not good.  Not good at all. 

I wouldn't be digging out festival kit quite yet.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 4, 2021)

We have two (small) fests lined up in July, and two in early August (both small).
The third August one is Beautiful Days -- not small!! 

I'm refusing to even think yet about our two September ones, plus one right at the beginning of October. All small, fortunately.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 4, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> We have two (small) fests lined up in July, and two in early August (both small).
> The third August one is Beautiful Days -- not small!!
> 
> I'm refusing to even think yet about our two September ones, plus one right at the beginning of October. All small, fortunately.


There are two ways to look at this...

1. The new virus variant is getting quite scary and if we want any return to 'normality' then festivals are a big problem. 

2. It has been a tough couple of years for everyone, not least of all the festie fans. It would do us good to get outdoors with some music and free folk. 


I have got one gig booked in December. Am not looking at any festivals.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 4, 2021)

Although small festivals seem to be 'safer' than big festivals the size and space is relevant here. 

You won't get to Beautiful Days with any social distancing. Same as a small festival. The economics do not work sadly.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 4, 2021)

Badgers said:


> Although small festivals seem to be 'safer' than big festivals the size and space is relevant here.
> 
> You won't get to Beautiful Days with any social distancing. Same as a small festival. The economics do not work sadly.



I have tickets for Beautiful Days but never really thought it was actually going to happen.  I did think there would be smaller events such as 500 capacity but now I'm not so sure they'll even happen.


----------



## colacubes (Jun 4, 2021)

I've got an outdoor gig at Crystal Palace booked for August. I am double vaxxed and if I get there and it's too crowded I can fuck it off and walk home  I wouldn't consider an indoor or a big festival right now. I just can't see how Beautiful Days, Reading, Leeds or any others are going to happen given the way things are going. Hope I'm wrong though. The government should have helped the festivals out with insurance.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 4, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> I have tickets for Beautiful Days but never really thought it was actually going to happen.  I did think there would be smaller events such as 500 capacity but now I'm not so sure they'll even happen.


I am not being a misery (again) on this. Just looking at the Covid data and understanding the staffing and build costs of an event.

A small festival will have a PPSM (people per square metre) and that will be a selling point for traders (food/drink) and such. I doubt many can negotiate cheap space to allow social distancing and cover staffing/costs etc.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 4, 2021)

colacubes said:


> The government should have helped the festivals out with insurance.



The fact they didn't was a pretty clear indicator (to me anyway) that they thought there was a low likelihood of them actually happening.  Of course being upfront and honest with the population would have been the right thing to do but it's a complete anathema to them so that was never going to happen.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 4, 2021)

colacubes said:


> The government should have helped the festivals out with insurance.


They voted against free school meals. No chance we are getting financial backing for a big party


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 4, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I was also wondering whether the Govt could just postpone 21st June for another few weeks, for example until end of school terms (?)
> 
> I'


That would take out Mayhem at Micks, Gails at the Tiddly and Kippertronix, all of which I was rather hoping to go to.  
I can see it happening though. I am seething with rage over the government’s failure to stop this new variant.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 8, 2021)

So I'm going with a mate to the England match at Wembley on Sunday.  I've just read this is happening:



			https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57404223
		


I've not had my second jab yet so it will need to be the test option.  I have some NHS rapid antigen tests at home which I assume is the same thing as lateral flow.  What I don't understand is how this relates to proof of a negative test?  Reading the instructions with the tests it says I report the result to a website but nothing about how it proves anything?

They do have qr codes but there is no mentions of apps and again I don't know how that proves anything...

Anyone any thoughts?


----------



## BigTom (Jun 8, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> So I'm going with a mate to the England match at Wembley on Sunday.  I've just read this is happening:
> 
> 
> 
> ...












						Event guide | London | Getting to the stadium | UEFA EURO 2020
					

Europe's football website, UEFA.com, is the official site of UEFA, the Union of European Football Associations, and the governing body of football in Europe. UEFA organises some of the most famous and prestigious football competitions on the European continent including the UEFA Champions...




					www.uefa.com
				




Looks like there's proper guidance there


----------



## josef1878 2.0 (Jun 8, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> So I'm going with a mate to the England match at Wembley on Sunday.  I've just read this is happening:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeh, I couldn't be fucking arsed with all that shite. Watch it at home or at the pub.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 9, 2021)

josef1878 2.0 said:


> Yeh, I couldn't be fucking arsed with all that shite. Watch it at home or at the pub.



Yeah it initially seemed like a ballache but on closer inspection it doesn't seem that big a deal.  Just do a lateral flow test which is a good idea anyway when meeting up with friends.  Report the result of the test online (as you're supposed to do anyway with these tests) then take a screenshot of the negative confirmation.

It does seem to rely completly on honesty in that it is reliant on you telling the truth with regard to the test being negative.  I think the temptation to lie will be quite strong for many if the test comes back positive because it would mean missing the event and possibly losing your money.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 9, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> So I'm going with a mate to the England match at Wembley on Sunday.  I've just read this is happening:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The only difference between a LF Test Centre result and a home test is that people are watching you swab yourself, and you have a second person logging the result including a photo of the result. 

I have had quite a few people faking their swabs sadly.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 9, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Yeah it initially seemed like a ballache but on closer inspection it doesn't seem that big a deal.  Just do a lateral flow test which is a good idea anyway when meeting up with friends.  Report the result of the test online (as you're supposed to do anyway with these tests) then take a screenshot of the negative confirmation.
> 
> It does seem to rely completly on honesty in that it is reliant on you telling the truth with regard to the test being negative.  I think the temptation to lie will be quite strong for many if the test comes back positive because it would mean missing the event and possibly losing your money.


For reference we had a lot of people who needed LF test results for the cup final at Wembley. Home tests were not allowed.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 9, 2021)

Badgers said:


> For reference we had a lot of people who needed LF test results for the cup final at Wembley. Home tests were not allowed.



Thanks but the link posted above does state that home testing is fine.  To be honest its all a bit confusing.  I know its a test event and they got try these things but it just feels like this whole approach will just be overtaken by events, as a lot of things have been during this pandemic.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jun 9, 2021)

Andrew Lloyd Webber 'prepared to be arrested' over theatre reopening
					

The impresario says he will open his new production of Cinderella "come hell or high water".



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




*Andrew Lloyd Webber has said he is determined to open his theatres on 21 June, even if he risks being arrested.*
The impresario's West End production of Cinderella is scheduled to begin previews on 25 June, four days after so-called "freedom day".
"We are going to open, come hell or high water,"




I have just written to my MP demanding 'freedom day' be pushed back a couple of weeks, would urge everyone else to do the same.


----------



## elbows (Jun 9, 2021)

Its easy for Lloyd Webber to make large claims about being prepared to be arrested, but I wonder if more mundane realities such as those involving the venues public liability insurance may have a larger impact on what they can actually do compared to what he finds it easy to threaten to do.


----------



## Orang Utan (Jun 9, 2021)

He should have been arrested years ago for Cats


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 9, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Andrew Lloyd Webber 'prepared to be arrested' over theatre reopening
> 
> 
> The impresario says he will open his new production of Cinderella "come hell or high water".
> ...


The already long list of reasons why he’s a total cunt gets another addition.


----------



## clicker (Jun 9, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The already long list of reasons why he’s a total cunt gets another addition.


I'd guess a large percentage of his cast will be in the age groups where they've one or no vaccine.
Working, dressing and sat backstage in pokey rabbit warrens,  where any idea of social distancing is impossible.
Can't stand him.


----------



## Sunray (Jun 10, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The already long list of reasons why he’s a total cunt gets another addition.



There is no such thing as bad publicity and this is a lot of free press.  You're talking about him and I'm guessing you're not queuing up to go see a musical.


----------



## josef1878 2.0 (Jun 10, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Yeah it initially seemed like a ballache but on closer inspection it doesn't seem that big a deal.  Just do a lateral flow test which is a good idea anyway when meeting up with friends.  Report the result of the test online (as you're supposed to do anyway with these tests) then take a screenshot of the negative confirmation.
> 
> It does seem to rely completly on honesty in that it is reliant on you telling the truth with regard to the test being negative.  I think the temptation to lie will be quite strong for many if the test comes back positive because it would mean missing the event and possibly losing your money.


Tbh I think and hope you'll be quite safe at the game but I couldn't be arsed with it all.


----------



## killer b (Jun 10, 2021)

Sunray said:


> There is no such thing as bad publicity


this isn't even slightly true


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 14, 2021)

Not quite ready to rock … festivals’ return hit by lack of loos and tents
					

A critical shortage of both equipment and crew has left organisers scrambling to prepare for summer events




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 14, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Not quite ready to rock … festivals’ return hit by lack of loos and tents
> 
> 
> A critical shortage of both equipment and crew has left organisers scrambling to prepare for summer events
> ...


This is going to be even worse after todays extra month delay.


----------



## miss direct (Jun 14, 2021)

Any guesses as to the chances of Tramlines going ahead? (24-25th July)


----------



## ska invita (Jun 14, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Any guesses as to the chances of Tramlines going ahead? (24-25th July)


yes go ahead


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 15, 2021)

I haven't yet even started to confront the issue of when or not and whether or not festivals (small) can go ahead .... 

In our still-theoretical plans ......

The first of our two tinies (w/e of Saturday 10th July) is in Powys.

The second of those (w/e of Saturday 17th July) is in Shropshire.


----------



## miss direct (Jun 15, 2021)

ska invita said:


> yes go ahead


Hmm I am not convinced, even though it's after the extended date. Expecting an announcement this week. I'm only volunteering there.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 15, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I haven't yet even started to confront the issue of when or not and whether or not festivals (small) can go ahead ....
> 
> In our still-theoretical plans ......
> 
> ...



Both of these are before the 19th July so even in the unlikely event that restrictions are lifted on the 19th it will be too late to save these two.  That is unless they want to limit the numbers to 30.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jun 15, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I haven't yet even started to confront the issue of when or not and whether or not festivals (small) can go ahead ....
> 
> In our still-theoretical plans ......
> 
> ...





Teaboy said:


> Both of these are before the 19th July so even in the unlikely event that restrictions are lifted on the 19th it will be too late to save these two.  That is unless they want to limit the numbers to 30.


That's "congregating groups of 30 maximum" in a maximum crowd of 4000 as per governement guidelines staff workers and volunteers not included in that cap.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 15, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> That's "congregating groups of 30 maximum" in a maximum crowd of 4000 as per governement guidelines staff workers and volunteers not included in that cap.



Great.  So as long as people don't congregate at stages festivals are fine.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jun 15, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Great.  So as long as people don't congregate at stages festivals are fine.


Only pointing out what is allowed.
What is sensible is not something I would follow the governement guidance on though.
And yes: people social distancing after a few drinks is in the unicorn universe not our one.


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 15, 2021)

What a fucking suprise!
A pilot scheme my friggin arse. 
One rule for them etc.
Andrew Lloyd-Webber ‘surprised’ after PM hints Cinderella may be exempt from lockdown delay


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 15, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I haven't yet even started to confront the issue of when or not and whether or not festivals (small) can go ahead ....
> 
> In our still-theoretical plans ......
> 
> ...


Yep, me too, though my 10 July is in Leicestershire. 

My assumption is that they are off.  I'm gutted.

Haven't heard from either of them yet, though.   I am adding to my plans for August to compensate - I've discovered I qualify for Boom Village, so I've applied for that.  Had to provide proof of address!


----------



## Sunray (Jun 15, 2021)

So I managed to get a spare space working at the Download pilot this week. 
While understandable for this event, all the palava I have to go through to get in isn't workable in the long term.


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 15, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Haven't heard from either of them yet, though.   I am adding to my plans for August to compensate - I've discovered I qualify for Boom Village, so I've applied for that.  Had to provide proof of address!


And all of a sudden, a proper small diy festival I had booked for w/e 10/7 has rescheduled for 13/14 August!  

Proper pleased.  

But with all the festivals concerteenering up into August, there are going to be clashes.  Do I waste my already bought Mayhem at Mick's ticket and fork out £200 to do Boom Village?  or do I still go to Mick's?

(answer - Eastfield are playing Mayhem - if anyone on here desparately wants to go to the stripped down Boomtown, I have registered for a ticket as a local resident - I may be able to help)


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 16, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I haven't yet even started to confront the issue of when or not and whether or not festivals (small) can go ahead ....
> 
> In our still-theoretical plans ......
> *
> ...


I'd be very surprised if people above (saying both of these now wonlt happen) are wrong 

However, we do await Mark Drakeford's statement about Welsh rules and dates for changes to them -- will check when I have time, but the Welsh Government often announce stuff on Fridays..

I've just asked Gail directly on Facebook about her event in Shropshire -- surprisingly, she hasn't said anything yet.


----------



## rubbershoes (Jun 16, 2021)

Luckily the only two mass events I've got booked are in late July. I'm confident they'll  both go ahead


----------



## miss direct (Jun 16, 2021)

I got my volunteer shifts for tramlines and am on the same ones as a friend. Ill be double vaccinated + 10 days and it's obviously all outside, so I feel ok about it. Its also my birthday and the anniversary of losing my Dad. Would be quite nice to have something to do that weekend. Lets see, eh?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 18, 2021)

Let’s hope this all works…


----------



## Numbers (Jun 18, 2021)

Notting Hill Carnival has been pulled for this year too, not surprising - hope it's online again like last year.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 18, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I've just asked Gail directly on Facebook about her event in Shropshire -- surprisingly, she hasn't said anything yet.



Gail wants to go ahead with her mini-fest in Shropshire (weekend of Saturday July 17th). To that end, she's now put out her plans on Facebook.

Lateral Flow tests on arrival, gigs will be seated with tables of six, table service from the pub I think.

A track and trace arrangement -- all people will need to leave their full contact details.

I think this could work prety well. It's a small event, and it looks like Gail's sought some good advice to plan it properly  
She also has plenty of her own fest-organising experience


----------



## spitfire (Jun 18, 2021)

Bigfoot festival is happening this weekend. It's run by the same people who do London Craft Beer Festival and I think they've got round it as it is a "food and drink" event, mainly...decent line up. 4000 cap.






						Bigfoot Festival — 18-20.06.21
					

A new summer festival for 2021. Big on craft beer, delicious food & live music. Set by a beautiful lake, Bigfoot is an epic 3-day festival open to all.




					bigfootfestival.co.uk
				






			https://bigfootfestival.co.uk/info/covid-safety-ticket-policy/
		










						Bigfoot organisers on creating the first festival of the summer: "We've got social distancing built-in"
					

The team behind the UK's first music festival this summer has explained how they narrowly escaped an extension to lockdown restrictions in order to go ahead this weekend.




					www.nme.com


----------



## Sunray (Jun 19, 2021)

At download pilot and it’s been amazing even though I’m not really into this music.
One band asked for a show of hands on double vaccinations, I reckon 60%. You’d have to consider yourself unlucky if you get sick from this.  It’s all outside and the crowd is approaching heard immunity.


----------



## 2hats (Jun 20, 2021)

It's nice to know that the festival are catering for the hearing impaired.

However ~80% of (a self-claimed) 60% isn't anywhere near to herd immunity for delta.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 21, 2021)

William of Walworth said:
			
		

> I haven't yet even started to confront the issue of when or not and whether or not festivals (small) can go ahead ....
> 
> In our still-theoretical plans ......
> 
> * The first of our two tinies (w/e of Saturday 10th July) is in Powys.*


Big Love Festival (Clyro Court/Baskerville Hall, next to Hay-on-Wye, w/e of Saturday 10th July) has now been cancelled
 

I'd been *really* looking forward to this one! 

Still, I _completely_ agree with why the organisers have decided to sack the fest until next July -- I had *no* idea that the restrictions in Wales were being so severely applied .....


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 21, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Gail wants to go ahead with her mini-fest in Shropshire (weekend of Saturday July 17th). To that end, she's now put out her plans on Facebook.
> 
> Lateral Flow tests on arrival, gigs will be seated with tables of six, table service from the pub I think.
> 
> ...


We've decided between us not to go -- festivaldeb is a lot more unhappy about the restrictions than I am, but I respect her reasons.

We'll be going to Something Else by the Sea in Devon in late September anyway


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 21, 2021)

Home - Kendal Calling
					

28 – 31 july 2022 – LOWTHER DEER PARK THE BEAUTIFUL LAKE DISTRICT kendal calling returns to it’s beautiful lake district home for the festival celebration of a lifetime! with over 250 artists across 13 stages, plus brand new areas to discover for 2022, the return of kendal calling promises to be...




					www.kendalcalling.co.uk
				




Kendall Calling gone.


----------



## miss direct (Jun 21, 2021)

I'm expecting an announcement about Tramlines today or in the next few days. If it is cancelled, I will go camping and re-enact a mini festival (with two people)


----------



## Looby (Jun 21, 2021)

Real shame about Kendal. One of the few festivals that welfare had booked for this year too. 

I’m wondering whether End Of The Road happen because of all the variant uncertainty and the issue still of insurance.

I really want to go but I’m not massively optimistic so we’re booking an easily cancelled weekend in Brighton in case it doesn’t happen to take advantage of having a dog sitter already booked.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 21, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Big Love Festival (Clyro Court/Baskerville Hall, next to Hay-on-Wye, w/e of Saturday 10th July) has now been cancelled
> 
> 
> I'd been *really* looking forward to this one!
> ...


Go to Truefest instead, same place
e2a *SOLD OUT*, forgot


----------



## marshall (Jun 21, 2021)

Getting the impression from 'insiders' that Latitude WILL be going ahead, probably a 'test'event given Melvin's connections.


----------



## Sir Belchalot (Jun 21, 2021)

spitfire said:


> Bigfoot festival is happening this weekend. It's run by the same people who do London Craft Beer Festival and I think they've got round it as it is a "food and drink" event, mainly...decent line up. 4000 cap.



Spoke to my daughter at this on Friday who reckoned there wasn't any social distancing, it didn't sound like there was either!


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 21, 2021)

William of Walworth said:
			
		

> Big Love Festival (Clyro Court/Baskerville Hall, next to Hay-on-Wye, w/e of Saturday 10th July) has now been cancelled
> 
> 
> I'd been *really* looking forward to this one!
> ...






			
				ddraig said:
			
		

> Go to Truefest instead, same place
> e2a *SOLD OUT*, forgot



That looked good and interesting, but we're still committed to Beautiful Days the same weekend.

They seem still pretty confident that BD will go ahead .....

</crossed fingers  >


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 21, 2021)

Looby said:


> Real shame about Kendal. One of the few festivals that welfare had booked for this year too.
> 
> *I’m wondering whether End Of The Road happen* because of all the variant uncertainty and the issue still of insurance.
> 
> I really want to go but I’m not massively optimistic so we’re booking an easily cancelled weekend in Brighton in case it doesn’t happen to take advantage of having a dog sitter already booked.


I've been to End of the Road in the past and I really liked it.

Given how late in date it is, I'd be actively surprised if a late September festival like that gets cancelled!

I hope I'm right so that people like Looby can go and enjoy!


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 24, 2021)

Tour of Cambridgeshire postponed to June 2022 - Tour of Cambridgeshire
					

It is with a heavy heart that, despite the Tour of Cambridgeshire team straining every sinew to deliver this year’s event, we have been forced to postpone the event to June 3rd – 5th 2022.




					tourofcambridgeshire.com
				




Tour Of Cambridgeshire cycling event gone.


----------



## spitfire (Jun 24, 2021)

Babyshambala is happening late August. £40 non refundable cancellation tax included. Tickets on sale now.









						Home - Shambino
					






					shambino.org


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 24, 2021)

spitfire said:


> Babyshambala is happening late August. £40 non refundable cancellation tax included. Tickets on sale now.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I suppose that's one way of dealing with the insurance problem.


----------



## rubbershoes (Jun 24, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Tour of Cambridgeshire postponed to June 2022 - Tour of Cambridgeshire
> 
> 
> It is with a heavy heart that, despite the Tour of Cambridgeshire team straining every sinew to deliver this year’s event, we have been forced to postpone the event to June 3rd – 5th 2022.
> ...



Dartmoor Classic happened last weekend. That was a test event. 

They'd cut down on the indoor stuff. Race packs were sent by post rather than being collected on the day. And the goody bags at the end were handed out outside. 

Previously they had to look you up to see  what medal you'd got. The new nifty timing system sent  you a text in the two miles between  the finish line and the base. Bronze for me, of course.


----------



## Sunray (Jun 25, 2021)

spitfire said:


> Babyshambala is happening late August. £40 non refundable cancellation tax included. Tickets on sale now.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looking at numbers are we now deluding ourselves?  Israel is getting infections and starting to wear masks indoors again.

Few of us are going to this, it could well be a £40 donation to the crew of Shambala.



Teaboy said:


> I suppose that's one way of dealing with the insurance problem.



Surprised more didn't do this, most people are happy to take a gamble.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 25, 2021)

Suggests itll be full steam ahead to me:








						Covid event pilots compromised by low uptake of PCR tests, experts say
					

Study found ‘no substantial outbreaks’ but scientists warn lateral flow tests are not as effective as PCR




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## elbows (Jun 25, 2021)

ska invita said:


> Suggests itll be full steam ahead to me:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I already got my complaint in previously that pilot/tests events held at times of low levels of infection wont offer much in the way of clues about their impact during a time with much more virus around. I note that such factors have not really been hushed up now that some test reports are available.









						No major outbreaks found at government mass pilot events
					

However, virus levels were low at the time and about a third of people returned tests afterwards.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				






> At the time, virus levels were low and testing before and after events was also low, making conclusions difficult.



And lets remember the last part of the following if the government turn out to be gung-ho about going back to a version of normal that doesnt involve masks etc.



> Scientists involved in the research said large indoor events could post "a higher potential risk of transmission" because of people being close to each other and poor ventilation.
> 
> But they said "pinch points", where people were crowded together for a time, existed at both indoor and outdoor events.
> 
> They added that face coverings, restrictions on food and drink, testing, ventilation and social distancing could all be used to reduce the risk of transmission.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 25, 2021)

elbows said:


> I already got my complaint in previously that pilot/tests events held at times of low levels of infection wont offer much in the way of clues about their impact during a time with much more virus around. I note that such factors have not really been hushed up now that some test reports are available.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


totally - yet i think they (the gov) will plough on regardless of that in the short term


----------



## ska invita (Jun 25, 2021)




----------



## spitfire (Jun 25, 2021)

Is that Melvin Benn again?


----------



## ska invita (Jun 25, 2021)

spitfire said:


> Is that Melvin Benn again?


Festival Republic guy. Likely yes.


----------



## spitfire (Jun 25, 2021)

ska invita said:


> Festival Republic guy. Likely yes.



A friend of mine who works crew on all the festivals was having a good old rant about him and how he just happens to be getting all the test events.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 25, 2021)

spitfire said:


> A friend of mine who works crew on all the festivals was having a good old rant about him and how he just happens to be getting all the test events.


Yes theyve clearly got their feet under the table. Its a characteristic of this government as to who gets money, who gets contracts, who gets the nod. It's not all corruption.. Resident Advisors pay out for example... But it is arbitrary and often personalised.


----------



## spitfire (Jun 25, 2021)

ska invita said:


> Yes theyve clearly got their feet under the table. Its a characteristic of this government as to who gets money, who gets contacts, who gets the nod. It's not all corruption.. Resident Advisors pay out for example... But it is arbitrary and often personalised.



Absolutely.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 25, 2021)

ska invita said:


> View attachment 275268


is there an easy way to prove you have had two vax shots yet?
ive heard something about an app?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 25, 2021)

ska invita said:


> is there an easy way to prove you have had two vax shots yet?
> ive heard something about an app?


The NHS app.


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 25, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The NHS app.


Yep, the NHS app says if you've had both jabs.  No need for a separate "vaccine passport", harder to forge than the little bit of cardboard you are given.

60,000 at Wembley for football, with 2,500 "VIPs" from all over the world with exemption from quarantine, was it 15,000 at Royal Ascot, football fans breaking all the rules incentral London last weekend, politicians making and breaking the rules however they like,  etc etc.

And the little festie I have lined up for the weekend before the 19 July date, we will all have to sit at tables of six. No dancing, no singalong.  

Most of us will be double jabbed (it's that type of gig). I'd be happy to be tested on arrival, and turn around if it was positive if it let the festival go ahead as normal.    

It's f'king bollox and I've had enough of it.  

(I'll follow the rules as I don't want the organiser or the venue to be crushed by a fine, but it stinks)


----------



## ddraig (Jun 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Yep, the NHS app says if you've had both jabs.  No need for a separate "vaccine passport", harder to forge than the little bit of cardboard you are given.
> 
> 60,000 at Wembley for football, with 2,500 "VIPs" from all over the world with exemption from quarantine, was it 15,000 at Royal Ascot, football fans breaking all the rules incentral London last weekend, politicians making and breaking the rules however they like,  etc etc.
> 
> ...


Where is it on the app? thanks
e2a looks like not on Welsh version


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 25, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Where is it on the app? thanks
> e2a looks like not on Welsh version











						Get your NHS COVID Pass | GOV.WALES
					

How to get the NHS COVID Pass to prove that you are vaccinated against COVID-19.




					gov.wales


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 25, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Where is it on the app? thanks
> e2a looks like not on Welsh version


You are asking me to remember my password, and navigate the app from hell, when pissed on a Friday night?  

I'll have to find my phone first.  

I will see what I can do, but don't expect screen shots!


----------



## ddraig (Jun 25, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Get your NHS COVID Pass | GOV.WALES
> 
> 
> How to get the NHS COVID Pass to prove that you are vaccinated against COVID-19.
> ...


Diolch


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> You are asking me to remember my password, and navigate the app from hell, when pissed on a Friday night?
> 
> I'll have to find my phone first.
> 
> I will see what I can do, but don't expect screen shots!


Hang on, just waiting for the password reset email


----------



## ddraig (Jun 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Hang on, just waiting for the password reset email


no worries it's different and bees has answered so no need ta


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Hang on, just waiting for the password reset email


Hang on just waiting for the securiuty code text...........


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Hang on just waiting for the securiuty code text...........


I swear it's changed.  There was an option that showed my two vacinnes.  It's not there now, but I have a file to download now.


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 25, 2021)

Ireally shouldn't have done that pissed.  I have a QR code, but no idea how to save it.  Hopefully I can find it again.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Ireally shouldn't have done that pissed.  I have a QR code, but no idea how to save it.  Hopefully I can find it again.


Gave me the option to have it emailed


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 25, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Gave me the option to have it emailed


Yeah, I have an email.  Hopefully, I'll be able to retrieve it tomorrow.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 26, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> The NHS app.


seems this is a different app to the test and trace one ive got..downloading it now


----------



## josef1878 2.0 (Jun 27, 2021)

ska invita said:


> is there an easy way to prove you have had two vax shots yet?
> ive heard something about an app?


My GP app


----------



## josef1878 2.0 (Jun 27, 2021)

ska invita said:


> is there an easy way to prove you have had two vax shots yet?
> ive heard something about an app?


It's the My GP app. Easy to do.


----------



## belboid (Jun 28, 2021)

Womad officially cancels due to lack of insurance cover.  Expect green man to do so in the next day or so


----------



## ska invita (Jun 28, 2021)

belboid said:


> Womad officially cancels due to lack of insurance cover.  Expect green man to do so in the next day or so


Weird as government have just said they will lift restrictions on the 19th whatever -


----------



## belboid (Jun 28, 2021)

ska invita said:


> Weird as government have just said they will lift restrictions on the 19th whatever -


Only three days before their gates open so even the 19th would be a bit awkward for set up. And then any delay/restrictions at all afterwards could well completely duck it.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 28, 2021)

belboid said:


> Only three days before their gates open so even the 19th would be a bit awkward for set up. And then any delay/restrictions at all afterwards could well completely duck it.


i understand their nervousness - its a massive gamble for them if they had to cancel at the last minute- but Javid has said "there is no going back" and that lifting restrictions will be "irreversible”.  Sounds pretty unequivocal to me what path the government are on.
Anyhow, as ever, everyone should make their own judgements whats right or wrong, certainly not base their actions on the thinking of Sajid fucking Javid.

This is inexcusable from government really:
“Whilst the prime minister and his colleagues say there will be no restrictions on society at that point, we have been unable to get any confirmation of what the plan is,” the organisers said in a statement. “Nor is there any clarity on how what is being learned from the events research programme might affect the guidance for festivals and how they are required to operate.”

And this must sting:" Latitude and Tramlines festivals – which fall on the same weekend as Womad – were admitted into the government’s (test) programme"


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jun 28, 2021)

The whole situation is a disgraceful farce. Fuck this government.


----------



## belboid (Jun 28, 2021)

ska invita said:


> i understand their nervousness - its a massive gamble for them if they had to cancel at the last minute- but Javid has said "there is no going back" and that lifting restrictions will be "irreversible”.  Sounds pretty unequivocal to me what path the government are on.
> Anyhow, as ever, everyone should make their own judgements whats right or wrong, certainly not base their actions on the thinking of Sajid fucking Javid.
> 
> This is inexcusable from government really:
> ...


I didn’t see tramlines was as well.  Wonder who paid them off for that?


E2a: aah, it’s now owned by Providence Equity Partners L.L.C, that explains it


----------



## Supine (Jun 29, 2021)

Good thread on the recent test event studies and how the results are NOT what has been reported by government or the press…


----------



## BigTom (Jun 29, 2021)

It was pretty obvious the test events were being picked politically but I thought the events themselves would provide some useful data that would help everyone.
I guess they need some way of actively getting people to submit their before/after tests. Before should be easy - no submission, no entry. After will be much harder to do.
Nothing you can do about the prevalance of covid-19 at the time of the events other than to take that into account when considering the results. Continued test events as cases rise should help this, but not if they aren't getting people's test results.


----------



## miss direct (Jun 29, 2021)

What's political about Tramlines being chosen? Complete silence from the organisers - if it is a test event and everyone will need tests etc, they should be informing us of that.


----------



## belboid (Jun 29, 2021)

miss direct said:


> What's political about Tramlines being chosen? Complete silence from the organisers - if it is a test event and everyone will need tests etc, they should be informing us of that.


Their private equity owners are probably mates with Johnson


----------



## miss direct (Jun 29, 2021)

Oh I see. I saw someone posting on Twitter that it was due to being in a Tory area, which is errrr....


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 29, 2021)

miss direct said:


> What's political about Tramlines being chosen? Complete silence from the organisers - if it is a test event and everyone will need tests etc, they should be informing us of that.


As skunk anansie pointed out, everything's political


----------



## miss direct (Jun 29, 2021)

Tramlines is definitely on, confirmed. Either need a negative lateral flow test or 14 days post 2nd jab. I will only be 9 days post so another test. Once inside, no social distancing or masks. Not sure how I feel about that. I'll take a mask anyway I think as not quite sure what my volunteering involves.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 29, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Tramlines is definitely on, confirmed. Either need a negative lateral flow test or 14 days post 2nd jab. I will only be 9 days post so another test. Once inside, no social distancing or masks. Not sure how I feel about that. I'll take a mask anyway I think as not quite sure what my volunteering involves.



I've got tickets to Beautiful days in August.  Like you I'm not really sure how I feel about it now.  When I brought them I kinda assumed it would be cancelled or the general situation would be a lot better.  I hadn't really considered the possibility it might go ahead amid a backdrop of soaring infections and general covid chaos etc.


----------



## l'Otters (Jun 29, 2021)

That’s sort of why I turned down any volunteering at festivals this year. Realised my threshold for not doing any given activity due to the risk level, has been lower than most people’s. So with the possibility that the festival would go ahead in a context I wouldn’t want to go... I got a ticket for a small festival & if I didn’t go to that, I’d lose my ticket money but wouldn’t be letting anyone down.


----------



## Ground Elder (Jul 3, 2021)

Another one cancelled - Green Gathering


----------



## miss direct (Jul 6, 2021)

Ha, this has made me laugh: Richard Ashcroft refuses to play festival that is government test event

Hope Steps replace him.


----------



## souljacker (Jul 6, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Ha, this has made me laugh: Richard Ashcroft refuses to play festival that is government test event
> 
> Hope Steps replace him.


Oh yeah, I remember him. He was relevant once.


----------



## miss direct (Jul 6, 2021)

Supergrass have replaced him


----------



## belboid (Jul 6, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Supergrass have replaced him


Damn, makes me almost want to go


----------



## josef1878 2.0 (Jul 7, 2021)

miss direct said:


> Supergrass have replaced him


Alright 😀


----------



## elbows (Jul 13, 2021)

Lessons from the Netherlands:


----------



## ska invita (Jul 13, 2021)

elbows said:


> Lessons from the Netherlands:



the government policy is to hit 100,000 infections a day, so.........


----------



## mx wcfc (Jul 13, 2021)

Enough negativity.  Who's actually off to festivals this summer, and which ones?  
I'll start............

This weekend - Top secret, small, covid-tested, socially distanced, acoustic music only, but I still can't wait to get out there.  Weather's looking good.  

August 5-8 - Wickham.  Local, going with friends. Not really my scene, but Merry Hell are on. 

August 13-14 - Mayhem at Micks.  2 days of punk rock in a cowshed.  This is the big one.  

August Bank Holiday - Blyth Power "Ashes"/camping trip.  Small, relaxed.  One amplified night on a stage, one night acoustic in the camping field, and a cricket match. Went to this last year (!).  

24-26 September - Something Else by the Sea, to wrap things up for the year.

Plus I've got at least three gigs lined up in between.  

I hope to squeeze another couple of weekends in, depending on other things.  

Touch wood and all that.  

I'll probably reap opprobrium on here, then catch the covid and die.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 13, 2021)

It appears that the Landed Festival, in the grounds of a posh house near Builth Wells (Powys), is pretty likely to be going ahead over the weekend of Saturday 31st July.
They have adapted a few things and are keeping the event small (600 people).

New announcements in Wales due tomorrow (Wednesday 14/7) though, so let's hope that Landed's organisers are not being over-optimistic.

Depending on my friend being able to get tickets from Twickets, we'll be heading for the faboulous line-up (but sold out!) Stone Valley South Festival near Ware, Hertfordshire, weekend of Saturday 14th August -- no signs on their websire of it not happening.

Following weekend, that of Saturday 21st August, festivaldeb, myself and van will be heading for Beautiful Days (Escot Park near Exeter, Devon), whose website (plus FB and Twitter account) have all been consistently  optimistic about the event going ahead.

Also, we're still strongly contemplating another small event the weekend after BD (that of Saturday 7th and Sunday 8th September, Feralfest -- location unclear so far, but their Facebook appears to be full steam ahead with the planning

Booked for the one you mentioned mx wcfc -- Something Else by the Sea, near Woollacombe, Devon, weekend of Saturday 25th September.

And an additional (non-camping!) end of season bash : Sunset on the West, Pontins, Breen Sands near Weston-super-Mare, weekend of Saturday 2nd October. Must buy tickets ASAP! 

Other main event for me is to go and see The Specials at the Ricoh Arena in Coventry, Saturday 11th September. Tickets already sorted, it'll be a big gig which is very much part of Coventry City of Culture 2021!


----------



## nottsgirl (Jul 13, 2021)

I’ve got some gig tickets but it’s a nightmare working out what’s been rescheduled to when so they’ll probably all be half-empty and I’ll only make a couple of them.


----------



## mx wcfc (Jul 13, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Following weekend, that of Saturday 21st August, festivaldeb, myself and van will be heading for Beautiful Days (Escot Park near Exeter, Devon), whose website (plus FB and Twitter account) have all been consistently  optimistic about the event going ahead.
> 
> Also, we're still strongly contemplating another small event the weekend after BD (that of Saturday 7th and Sunday 8th September, Feralfest -- location unclear so far, but their Facebook appears to be full steam ahead with the planning
> 
> And an additional (non-camping!) end of season bash : Sunset on the West, Pontins, Breen Sands near Weston-super-Mare, weekend of Saturday 2nd October. Must buy tickets ASAP!


There's a couple of good festivals w/e of BD, but Eastfield are down south that weekend and I'm going to see them in Brixton and Portsmouth.

Feral is definately one I want to do.  My OH and daughter are talking about us all going to the Lakes that weekend.  I am (shamefully) praying that they discover that the whole country is fully booked! 

Hadn't come across Sunset.  I'll have a look at it.


----------



## Orang Utan (Jul 14, 2021)

none this year - was only really interested in Freerotation. too many festivals are too general, much prefer small and selective


----------



## mx wcfc (Jul 14, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> none this year - was only really interested in Freerotation. too many festivals are too general, much prefer small and selective


Yeah, another vote here for small.

I have a van now, but when I had a car and a tent, the small ones, where you can park next to your tent are so much better.  Went to "Camp Bestival" one year - family thing - daughter might have been 13 and we took a friend of hers.  Car was about half a mile away.  I was a packhorse.  
Not doing that again.  
And, yes, the ones with selective music are so much better than those that try to please too many people.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 14, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> none this year - was only really interested in Freerotation. *too many festivals are too general, much prefer small and selective*


I've got mixed feelings about that -- I love small festivals, and of the few we're heading to this year, all except Beautiful Days are tiny 

But general and larger can so often mean more variety of music too -- the return of (working at) Glastonbury next June** will mean the return of all those choice-of-act dilemmas!   

** </he insists confidently!!  >


----------



## Voley (Jul 14, 2021)

Really think this new variant is going to screw everything up. I'm meant to be going to an indoor gig in September but I really doubt I will be. If it's too dangerous then, I won't care. Some things are much more important,  irrespective of how much I love The Specials. 

I'm currently nursing someone double-jabbed through Covid. If the government prediction of 100,000 infections a day is right, there's going to be a lot of really ill people out there, vaccine or no vaccine. 

Under those circumstances, you wouldn't catch me jumping up and down in a room with thousands of others if you paid me.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 14, 2021)

Voley : I think a lot of your pessimism is justified, but surely at least _some_ of that applies to indoor gigs more than outdoor -- our Specials gig in September is at an outdoor arena in Coventry.

This is a useful/interesting discussion though -- will have to get back to it at the weekend ...

In the meantime, I hope your mum's health gets well onto the improve soon


----------



## Looby (Jul 14, 2021)

Voley said:


> Really think this new variant is going to screw everything up. I'm meant to be going to an indoor gig in September but I really doubt I will be. If it's too dangerous then, I won't care. Some things are much more important,  irrespective of how much I love The Specials.
> 
> I'm currently nursing someone double-jabbed through Covid. If the government prediction of 100,000 infections a day is right, there's going to be a lot of really ill people out there, vaccine or no vaccine.
> 
> Under those circumstances, you wouldn't catch me jumping up and down in a room with thousands of others if you paid me.


I’ve cancelled an indoor gig for August and I was pleasantly surprised when Ticketmaster refunded with no arguments.


----------



## Voley (Jul 14, 2021)

42,000+ infections today. 49 dead.

Going to watch a band really not a priority for me now.


----------



## mr steev (Jul 14, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Enough negativity.  Who's actually off to festivals this summer, and which ones?
> I'll start............



If only. All this years i had planned have cancelled.

I've just seen that Boomtown's Boom Village in mid August has cancelled now too


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jul 14, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Voley : I think a lot of your pessimism is justified, but surely at least _some_ of that applies to indoor gigs *more than *outdoor -- our Specials gig in September is at an outdoor arena in Coventry.
> 
> This is a useful/interesting discussion though -- will have to get back to it at the weekend ...
> 
> In the meantime, I hope your mum's health gets well onto the improve soon


Bolded the important part for you ;-)


----------



## belboid (Jul 16, 2021)

Green Man confirms it is going ahead


----------



## miss direct (Jul 17, 2021)

One week till Tramlines, where I'm volunteering. Looks like I'll be checking tickets (and along with that goes checking covid test results/proof of two vaccinations.) Last night I read about a festival in the Netherlands that resulted in 1,000 cases. 

For some reason I thought I'd be wandering around the periphery, picking up litter. 

Any tips as to how I can stay as safe as possible? I _really_ don't want to get covid.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 17, 2021)

miss direct said:


> One week till Tramlines, where I'm volunteering. Looks like I'll be checking tickets (and along with that goes checking covid test results/proof of two vaccinations.) Last night I read about a festival in the Netherlands that resulted in 1,000 cases.
> 
> For some reason I thought I'd be wandering around the periphery, picking up litter.
> 
> Any tips as to how I can stay as safe as possible? I _really_ don't want to get covid.


Proper masks, double up!


----------



## josef1878 2.0 (Jul 18, 2021)

miss direct said:


> One week till Tramlines, where I'm volunteering. Looks like I'll be checking tickets (and along with that goes checking covid test results/proof of two vaccinations.) Last night I read about a festival in the Netherlands that resulted in 1,000 cases.
> 
> For some reason I thought I'd be wandering around the periphery, picking up litter.
> 
> Any tips as to how I can stay as safe as possible? I _really_ don't want to get covid.


Yeh, give it a miss


----------



## l'Otters (Jul 18, 2021)

I was wondering whether to say can you just bail at this point, tell them your reasons upfront... appreciate you'll have a lot invested in going by now.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 18, 2021)

miss direct said:


> One week till Tramlines, where I'm volunteering. Looks like I'll be checking tickets (and along with that goes checking covid test results/proof of two vaccinations.) Last night I read about a festival in the Netherlands that resulted in 1,000 cases.
> 
> For some reason I thought I'd be wandering around the periphery, picking up litter.
> 
> Any tips as to how I can stay as safe as possible? I _really_ don't want to get covid.


I’d ask for a different shift or not go.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 18, 2021)

miss direct said:


> One week till Tramlines, where I'm volunteering. Looks like I'll be checking tickets (and along with that goes checking covid test results/proof of two vaccinations.) Last night I read about a festival in the Netherlands that resulted in 1,000 cases.
> 
> For some reason I thought I'd be wandering around the periphery, picking up litter.
> 
> Any tips as to how I can stay as safe as possible? I _really_ don't want to get covid.


Don't go


----------



## quiet guy (Jul 18, 2021)

miss direct said:


> One week till Tramlines, where I'm volunteering. Looks like I'll be checking tickets (and along with that goes checking covid test results/proof of two vaccinations.) Last night I read about a festival in the Netherlands that resulted in 1,000 cases.
> 
> For some reason I thought I'd be wandering around the periphery, picking up litter.
> 
> Any tips as to how I can stay as safe as possible? I _really_ don't want to get covid.


I'm stewarding at Latitude with Oxfam and we have been told to wear masks when interacting with people outside of our "work" bubble while on shift. Regular hand washing and sanitiser will also be a big part of my shift plans.


----------



## miss direct (Jul 18, 2021)

If it was just me I would probably back out, but I have a friend coming to stay and we are doing it together. She doesn't seem concerned which I'm surprised by because she has been extremely careful since the pandemic began. Anyway at this stage I am planning to volunteer but if I do feel unsafe or that there's too much contact I will leave.


----------



## retribution (Jul 19, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> none this year - was only really interested in Freerotation. too many festivals are too general, much prefer small and selective


Me too - rolled my ticket over to next year. 🤞


----------



## Badgers (Jul 19, 2021)

Sad for the cast and crew but fuck that cunt 






						Andrew Lloyd Webber cancels opening night of Cinderella due to Covid case | Theatre | The Guardian
					

The composer calls it ‘a devastating decision that will affect the livelihoods of hundreds of people, and disappoint thousands’




					amp.theguardian.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jul 19, 2021)

Badgers said:


> Sad for the cast and crew but fuck that cunt
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, trouble is it won't dent his finances but will fuck over everyone else involved


----------



## editor (Jul 20, 2021)

Beautiful Days is ON!


----------



## kalidarkone (Jul 21, 2021)

Truefest cancelled  which I'm happy about because I had decided I wouldn't go as after 9pm it's all indoors.....and I have a lot going on so suits me. ddraig


----------



## ddraig (Jul 21, 2021)

kalidarkone said:


> Truefest cancelled  which I'm happy about because I had decided I wouldn't go as after 9pm it's all indoors.....and I have a lot going on so suits me. ddraig


Booo! Thanks for tag
Was looking forward to playing but from what i've heard the venue restrictions would have been too much


----------



## BillRiver (Jul 21, 2021)

Info coming out of Australia is worth checking - it seems people are catching Delta (even if double jabbed, even if had covid before) at outdoor events with only fleeting contact, eg going through turnstiles.

Not trying to spread fear, but to encourage informed decision making.


----------



## kalidarkone (Jul 21, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Booo! Thanks for tag
> Was looking forward to playing but from what i've heard the venue restrictions would have been too much


Maybe next year.......
But there's always bob vylan on the 27th....so see you then?


----------



## ddraig (Jul 21, 2021)

kalidarkone said:


> Maybe next year.......
> But there's always bob vylan on the 27th....so see you then?


YES!


----------



## ska invita (Aug 5, 2021)

timing!! now summer is nearly done...








						Covid: Live events to be protected by £750m government-backed insurance scheme
					

Music festivals are among the events in the UK that will be protected if they are forced to cancel.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 6, 2021)

Too little, too late. Like everything else done by this shitheap government.


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 10, 2021)

This could also go on _the companies to avoid when all this is over_ thread  but bloody Seetickets wankers.

I received my beautiful days tickets on Thursday.  All the festival tickets were there but I was missing a car park pass.  There is now only one way of contacting seetickets and that is through an online form on their website which they seemingly ignore.

I can see how the pandemic will have devastated their business but this is just another example of companies hiding behind the shield of covid to justify abandoning any level of customer service.  Cunts were happy enough to take my money.  

I really wish I'd just brought them direct from teh levs now but at the time their website had basically crashed and I didn't want to miss out.  

Its not the fucking up of the order, these things happen.  Its what's happened afterwards.  If you are going to reduce all means of contact down to one way you bloody well better be good at communicating through that one means.  I've sent two messages days ago and no response.  I've now contacted the festival itself who replied in minutes so hopefully that will get the ball rolling.

I will not be buying from seetickets again.


----------



## ddraig (Aug 10, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> This could also go on _the companies to avoid when all this is over_ thread  but bloody Seetickets wankers.
> 
> I received my beautiful days tickets on Thursday.  All the festival tickets were there but I was missing a car park pass.  There is now only one way of contacting seetickets and that is through an online form on their website which they seemingly ignore.
> 
> ...


Tweet them! Good luck


----------



## belboid (Aug 10, 2021)

Head office is on 0843 515 9400

They’ll say they will only respond via the ‘official’ channels but it’s still worth being a pita about it


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 11, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> This could also go on _the companies to avoid when all this is over_ thread  but bloody Seetickets wankers.
> 
> I received my beautiful days tickets on Thursday.  All the festival tickets were there but I was missing a car park pass.  There is now only one way of contacting seetickets and that is through an online form on their website which they seemingly ignore.
> 
> ...



I realise you're all likely to be on tenterhooks awaiting the outcome of this.

Well, despite not receiving the courtesy of a reply to the 3 messages I sent the missing pass randomly turned up in the post today.  Coincidentally the day after I complained directly to the festival, go figure.


----------



## Voley (Aug 18, 2021)

Hearing about lots of positive cases at Boardmasters in Newquay and that was with everyone needing proof of vaccination/lateral flow tests etc. 

Probably unrelated, as we're not yet 2 weeks from Boardmasters, but Newquay now has the highest Covid rates in England.


----------



## Looby (Aug 18, 2021)

Voley said:


> Hearing about lots of positive cases at Boardmasters in Newquay and that was with everyone needing proof of vaccination/lateral flow tests etc.
> 
> Probably unrelated, as we're not yet 2 weeks from Boardmasters, but Newquay now has the highest Covid rates in England.


Shit. 
I saw on Facebook that one of the crew I know is positive. Not sure if she got it there or was already positive.
I’m still feeling ok about EOTR because I can be really careful but so glad I haven’t worked any festivals.


----------



## Voley (Aug 19, 2021)

Looby said:


> Shit.
> I saw on Facebook that one of the crew I know is positive. Not sure if she got it there or was already positive.
> I’m still feeling ok about EOTR because I can be really careful but so glad I haven’t worked any festivals.


We've decided to give The Specials a miss. If people are getting infected at outdoor events it's only going to be worse indoors.


----------



## Looby (Aug 19, 2021)

Voley said:


> We've decided to give The Specials a miss. If people are getting infected at outdoor events it's only going to be worse indoors.


Absolutely. I’ve sold my Sleeper/Bluetones ticket as I just can’t face an indoor gig.


----------



## BillRiver (Aug 19, 2021)

I'm going to this on Sunday.

It's outside. I'll keep my mask on and try to maintain distance as much as possible.

Can't wait to have a dance, though. My first gig, and first chance to dance, since 2019.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

I'm currently working at a smallish to mid-size festival, and can already see how my idea of hanging back and not getting too close to people is probably not really going to pan out as well as I hoped. Hope I haven't made a regrettable decision! It's so good to be back in a field though.

LFTs are all very well, but they really don't guarantee much, and rely on people's honesty when they declare a negative one. Or doing the right thing if pinged. Tbh, everyone I know who's been to a festival either has tales of cases or has been pinged. One friend actually got it after a festival.

I should just go home now! Not going to though 

There's a hell of a lot of cognitive dissonance around this whole thing. I've shifted from thinking I wouldn't go to any events, to deciding to work one, in a very short space of time. It all feels so weird and non-adding-up really.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

Sorry, was still editing mx wcfc!


----------



## Voley (Aug 19, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> There's a hell of a lot of cognitive dissonance around this whole thing. I've shifted from thinking I wouldn't go to any events, to deciding to work one, in a very short space of time. It all feels so weird and non-adding-up really.


I've flipflopped between both points of view too. I was all for going to see The Specials right up to last week.

Just seeing the Newquay rates has changed my mind now though. We've got the worst rates in England just because people want a holiday? It's really not right. I hope the rates in Newquay in a couple of weeks aren't as bad as I expect once the Boardmasters effect kicks in.


----------



## BigTom (Aug 19, 2021)

I was exhibiting at uk games expo a few weeks ago at the NEC.

Indoor and playing board games so lots of handling of game pieces passing between players.

They required a LFTs or double vax proof, masks (bar exemptions and this was well observed with almost everyone masked) and has hand sanitizer everywhere (as did exhibitors).

I'm not aware of any transmissions, no-one i know who went got pinged let alone had a positive test.

Perhaps we just got lucky and slipped in before the new variant got large but I don't feel like there's a big risk to events if there's a decent level of caution applied.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

BigTom said:


> I don't feel like there's a big risk to events if there's a decent level of caution applied


It's the alcohol/drugs factor though with festivals I think.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

We're masked up for a public facing role. Lots of sanitiser, and all outdoors. But distancing is not going to happen as much as I'd like.


----------



## mx wcfc (Aug 19, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> Tbh, everyone I know who's been to a festival either has tales of cases or has been pinged


There’s been one case posted on fb since the tiny festival I went to last weekend. It is a worry.


----------



## spitfire (Aug 19, 2021)

My friends put on a mini festival/rave/party last week and there has been some positive tests since. They did the whole LFT/vaxxed thing beforehand so everyone * should * have been as fine as it is possible to be.

There seems to be an acknowledgement that they knew it was a risk but it was worth it. I hope it was. I didn't go as I can't risk it.


----------



## Looby (Aug 19, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> It's the alcohol/drugs factor though with festivals I think.


Yeah and age. I think older people are more likely to be cautious re distancing. 
Big groups of teens, in tight crowds, sharing drinks and bodily fluids then all crashing back to one tent. 😄

Just been messaging my friend about her 18 year old going to Reading. It seems everyone she knows that went to Boardmasters has come back positive. 
I don’t know how many that is.

I’m really starting to question going to EOTR. 😞


----------



## Supine (Aug 19, 2021)

spitfire said:


> My friends put on a mini festival/rave/party last week and there has been some positive tests since. They did the whole LFT/vaxxed thing beforehand so everyone * should * have been as fine as it is possible to be.
> 
> There seems to be an acknowledgement that they knew it was a risk but it was worth it. I hope it was. I didn't go as I can't risk it.



tbf if all those people had not gone to the party some of them could have still tested positive.


----------



## spitfire (Aug 19, 2021)

Supine said:


> tbf if all those people had not gone to the party some of them could have still tested positive.



True.


----------



## souljacker (Aug 19, 2021)

Looby said:


> Just been messaging my friend about her 18 year old going to Reading.


Case rates in Reading are already above the national average so having 80,000 (possibly) unvaccinated kids running around town is going to be a disaster. And then they all go back to school a week later. I can't even avoid them either as it happens almost literally on my doorstep. I'm going to have to go to the shit pub up the road instead of my favourite in Caversham


----------



## Voley (Aug 19, 2021)

Looby said:


> Just been messaging my friend about her 18 year old going to Reading. It seems everyone she knows that went to Boardmasters has come back positive.
> I don’t know how many that is.
> 
> I’m really starting to question going to EOTR. 😞


It's all anecdotal at the moment but Cornwall Live have been mopping up social media posts about Boardmasters. I wouldn't want to draw any conclusions from people's posts on Twitter tbf but it does sound like even being outdoors right next to a cliff didn't stop the spread!









						Plea to Boardmasters festival-goers as positive test reports flood in
					

There are questions over the reliability of lateral flow tests for such events, or the honesty of some revellers




					www.cornwalllive.com


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

Looby said:


> Yeah and age.


This festival's not too teenage-ey thankfully.


----------



## Looby (Aug 19, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> This festival's not too teenage-ey thankfully.


Where are you?


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

Looby said:


> Where are you?


We Out Here


----------



## Supine (Aug 19, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> We Out Here



see you there (from a distance)


----------



## Supine (Aug 19, 2021)

There were very few covid cases after loolapaloza festival which was good news!


----------



## BillRiver (Aug 19, 2021)

Supine said:


> There were very few covid cases after loolapaloza festival which was good news!
> 
> View attachment 284321



How is that known for sure, though?


----------



## 2hats (Aug 19, 2021)

Supine said:


> There were very few covid cases *reported* after loolapaloza festival which was good news!


FTFY.


----------



## Supine (Aug 19, 2021)

BillRiver said:


> How is that known for sure, though?



I din’t think you can ever say for sure but this women probably has as good an idea as anyone


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

Supine said:


> see you there (from a distance)


Urban meet?


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 19, 2021)

Voley said:


> It's all anecdotal at the moment but Cornwall Live have been mopping up social media posts about Boardmasters. I wouldn't want to draw any conclusions from people's posts on Twitter tbf but it does sound like even being outdoors right next to a cliff didn't stop the spread!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"the honesty of some revellers" possibly has something to do with it; there were some anecdotal reports of people going to the footie final despite having positive tests
the unreliability of LFTs is a given.


----------



## Supine (Aug 19, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> Urban meet?



If i told my mates i was going to meet someone called Chainsaw from the internet I’d never hear the end of it  

at some point im going to wear a yellow tshirt with Get Vaccinated You Cunts on it. Say hi!


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 19, 2021)

Supine said:


> Say hi!


Will do if I spot you


----------



## Voley (Aug 19, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> "the honesty of some revellers" possibly has something to do with it; there were some anecdotal reports of people going to the footie final despite having positive tests
> the unreliability of LFTs is a given.


You don't actually need to do a test to get the message from the NHS, either,  do you? Just order the lateral flow, report it as negative and you get a text from the NHS saying it's all good. 

Also seen some internet chatter saying they went to Boardmasters and weren't asked to show proof,  despite having done the test.


----------



## BigTom (Aug 19, 2021)

Voley said:


> You don't actually need to do a test to get the message from the NHS, either,  do you? Just order the lateral flow, report it as negative and you get a text from the NHS saying it's all good.
> 
> Also seen some internet chatter saying they went to Boardmasters and weren't asked to show proof,  despite having done the test.


Yep, it's entirely self reported.
PCR tests are not, they go to get tested.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 20, 2021)

BigTom said:


> Yep, it's entirely self reported.
> PCR tests are not, they go to get tested.


but you could still fake a pcr sent to you that you need to post back though.


----------



## BigTom (Aug 20, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> but you could still fake a pcr sent to you that you need to post back though.


You'd need to know someone else was negative and have them do the test for you wouldn't you?

If you sent back a swab without a sample, the test will be invalid.

It's there a known way to produce a negative pcr test?


----------



## rubbershoes (Aug 20, 2021)

Our little local festival a couple of weeks ago had only 1500 people and most of them were local. 

There hasn't been a noticeable increase in cases since


----------



## rubbershoes (Aug 20, 2021)

Voley said:


> It's all anecdotal at the moment but Cornwall Live have been mopping up social media posts about Boardmasters. I wouldn't want to draw any conclusions from people's posts on Twitter tbf but it does sound like even being outdoors right next to a cliff didn't stop the spread!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Boardmasters being a teenage snogathon could well be a factor.


----------



## mx wcfc (Aug 20, 2021)

rubbershoes said:


> Boardmasters being a teenage snogathon could well be a factor.


Which is why I worry about the effect Reading and Leeds could have.
I don’t want to deny kids a bit of fun (I’ve been to Reading as a kid as has little ms Mx), but they are potentially super spreader events.


----------



## nottsgirl (Aug 20, 2021)

Looking forward to Dublin Knitting and Stitching Show next year hopefully or the year after.


----------



## Mogden (Aug 20, 2021)

At least one of the musicians at Bloodstock has reported a positive test result today and they've previously had covid.


----------



## nogojones (Aug 21, 2021)

Voley said:


> Hearing about lots of positive cases at Boardmasters in Newquay and that was with everyone needing proof of vaccination/lateral flow tests etc.
> 
> Probably unrelated, as we're not yet 2 weeks from Boardmasters, but Newquay now has the highest Covid rates in England.


Some friends got free tickets to Boardmasters. Ones all fucked up with covid right now and a second is getting a PCR in the morning as she's got some mild symptoms. 

It doesn't bode well for the near future of events


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 21, 2021)

I’m still of the view that anyone going to a festival or large scale event/gig at the moment needs to seriously think twice about it.


----------



## Voley (Aug 21, 2021)

nogojones said:


> Some friends got free tickets to Boardmasters. Ones all fucked up with covid right now and a second is getting a PCR in the morning as she's got some mild symptoms.
> 
> It doesn't bode well for the near future of events


Sorry to hear that.

50+ cases in Swansea linked to Boardmasters now. 









						More than 50 Covid cases linked to music festival - BBC News
					

At least 56 cases in a single health board are confirmed in people who attended the event.




					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Aug 21, 2021)

BigTom said:


> If you sent back a swab without a sample, the test will be invalid.



No it wouldn’t as I have done just that, licked it and posted it and got a negative certificate back. That was following on from getting my sister to rub a lateral flow test behind her ear and that came up as negative too, rather than inconclusive. The whole thing’s a joke.


----------



## Badgers (Aug 21, 2021)

Mass events 'can be conducted safely'
					

Data from the UK government's Covid pilot scheme to test the return of big crowds to venues shows major events "can be conducted safely".




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




It is fine lads


----------



## Supine (Aug 21, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I’m still of the view that anyone going to a festival or large scale event/gig at the moment needs to seriously think twice about it.



I’m at a festival at the moment. No social distancing required. No masks. No queues apart from for coffee. It’s normal here.  It’s ducking brilliant


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 21, 2021)

Supine said:


> I’m at a festival at the moment. No social distancing required. No masks. No queues apart from for coffee. It’s normal here.  It’s ducking brilliant


What sort of capacity?


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 21, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> What sort of capacity?


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 21, 2021)

It's 12,000 or so I think, maybe 15, different reports.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 21, 2021)

Supine said:


> I’m at a festival at the moment. No social distancing required. No masks. No queues apart from for coffee. It’s normal here.  It’s ducking brilliant



Pretty much my experience of the same event Supine


Like this^^^

Predictably my social distancing intentions have not stayed the course. Maybe I should have had a harder think about attending, but...  beesonthewhatnow, but I've done it now...


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 21, 2021)

Christ


----------



## BillRiver (Aug 21, 2021)

Noooooo!

Am gutted.

By email:

Heritage Live - David Rodigan & The Outlook Orchestra - Kenwood House​

Hi there,

*This event has been rescheduled...*

The organisers have been in touch to let us know that the event on 22 August 2021 has been rescheduled and will no longer be taking place on this date.

The following statement has been issued:
_"We’re devastated to announce that we have to postpone our two sold out concerts at Kenwood House this weekend. We’re so sorry to all those who wanted to come and enjoy live music, but we will be rescheduling these shows so please hold on to your tickets.

The inclement weather over the past weeks has caused significant issues which our Health and Safety Advisors have deemed unsafe for the artists, crew and audience. Our team has been working tirelessly to find a solution but due to significant ground movement overnight, the structural engineers have advised that the staging is unsafe, meaning our two sold-out shows this weekend must be postponed and rescheduled.

We are heartbroken about this and we know that this is going to upset so many of you who have travelled from all over. We are devastated too.

Further information about the concerts will be relayed in due course so please keep hold of your tickets. Heritage Live."_

The event organisers are working hard to arrange a new date and as soon as we get any update on this, we'll be in touch to let you know. Your tickets will be valid for this new date.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 21, 2021)

not to piss on anyones chips , but worth being aware, Kenwood is surrounded by multimillionaire mansions and some arsehole complained about the noise from outdoor gigs and Kenwood now has one of the harshest noise limits, strictly imposed by the council. New speaker technology is better at stopping sound leak but a friend i know who has worked a lot of gigs at Kenwood says a lot of people complain about how quiet things are there


----------



## BillRiver (Aug 21, 2021)

ska invita said:


> not to piss on anyones chips , but worth being aware, Kenwood is surrounded by multimillionaire mansions and some arsehole complained about the noise from outdoor gigs and Kenwood now has one of the harshest noise limits, strictly imposed by the council. New speaker technology is better at stopping sound leak but a friend i know who has worked a lot of gigs at Kenwood says a lot of people complain about how quiet things are there



Thanks for the heads up, I did not know that.


----------



## belboid (Aug 23, 2021)

up to almost 5k linked to Boardmasters now









						Boardmasters: 4,700 Covid cases 'may be linked' to Newquay festival
					

The full scale of infections linked to Boardmasters in Newquay will not be known for a "few days".



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Elpenor (Aug 24, 2021)

2 out of 10 people off in my work team with covid as of today. Both young and unlikely to have been double jabbed. One was at boardmasters

Both were in the office on Friday


----------



## Voley (Aug 24, 2021)

belboid said:


> up to almost 5k linked to Boardmasters now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My bosses daughter and her boyfriend both have Covid and are isolating after Boardmasters.

Really can't see Reading/Leeds going well. Similar demographic and, unlike Boardmasters, not on the edge of a very well-ventilated cliff.


----------



## sojourner (Aug 24, 2021)

2 people I know already positive after Beautiful Days, and apparently loads more on the chat rooms. I'm lateral flowing before work and praying.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 24, 2021)

So, festivals during a pandemic were a bad idea, who knew?


----------



## killer b (Aug 24, 2021)

I went to a small festival in a pub briefly on Sunday and it felt quite super-spreadery so we left quite quickly, and the promoter has just posted on facebook that he's tested positive on a lateral flow. Seems to me the evidence is in and we definitely shouldn't be going to gigs...


----------



## quiet guy (Aug 24, 2021)

The two festivals I've been to while volunteering have both had protocols in place for entry and testing while at the festival. So far I've stayed clear of any symptoms and still do LFT's as an additional check.


----------



## elbows (Aug 24, 2021)

killer b said:


> I went to a small festival in a pub briefly on Sunday and it felt quite super-spreadery so we left quite quickly, and the promoter has just posted on facebook that he's tested positive on a lateral flow. Seems to me the evidence is in and we definitely shouldn't be going to gigs...



Yeah in these and some other settings common sense was a perfectly good substitute for formal evidence in this pandemic since the start, even though some were hoping otherwise.

Given my general stance in the pandemic I think I've done quite well not to spend large amounts of time these last two summers moaning at other peoples choices and wishful thinking, and I have sympathy for the need to 'recharge batteries' when it comes to pandemic mental health and summers. Plus I still have some vague sense of what its like to be young. But its not always been easy, and Delta seems to magnify the sense that superspreading is a major element in this pandemic.


----------



## sojourner (Aug 25, 2021)

quiet guy said:


> The two festivals I've been to while volunteering have both had protocols in place for entry and testing while at the festival. So far I've stayed clear of any symptoms and still do LFT's as an additional check.


The weird thing about Beautiful Days was that artists and crew HAD to do either a lat flow onsite before getting the pass, or show your Covid pass. Punters were asked to lat flow but I don't believe were asked to prove anything. Which makes no fucking sense at all.

The 2 people I know who are now positive, btw, had both spent at least an hour in the Bimble Inn. I'd looked in there and thought No Fucking Way - it's a long tent, with one small opening at the opposite end to the stage, and it was rammed. The tent I was performing in had a whole open side to it, and I didn't go into any 'closed' areas.

Another neg lat flow this morning for me anyway.  Am off to Solfest at the weekend. Their Covid requirements might as well not exist, they're so loose. Luckily, you can dance outside for pretty much the entire festival, so I'll be doing that.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 25, 2021)

Yeah, I didn't go inside anything at WOH. I'm thinking I might mask up in a crowd, even outside, at Shambles sojourner. Been LFTesting like mad, before, during and after theses 2 festies. I'm medical grade masked while I'm working.

Thanks for your balanced and generous view elbows It's very hard to reconcile all this and make the right choice in line with one's own acceptable levels of risk. And of course the knock on effect on others you come into contact with.


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 25, 2021)

sojourner said:


> The 2 people I know who are now positive, btw, had both spent at least an hour in the Bimble Inn. I'd looked in there and thought *No Fucking Way* - it's a long tent, with one small opening at the opposite end to the stage, and it was rammed. The tent I was performing in had a whole open side to it, and I didn't go into any 'closed' areas.



Ha ha.  I just wrote exactly the same thing on the BD thread before seeing your post.  That place was a heaving sweaty ming pit full of plague rats.

Me and my friends spent the whole time outdoors apart from occasional visits to the beer tents which were normally not too crowded.  All our lateral flow tests have come back negative so far.


----------



## sojourner (Aug 25, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> Ha ha.  I just wrote exactly the same thing on the BD thread before seeing your post.  That place was a heaving sweaty ming pit full of plague rats.
> 
> Me and my friends spent the whole time outdoors apart from occasional visits to the beer tents which were normally not too crowded.  All our lateral flow tests have come back negative so far.


My mate's band were performing in there on the Saturday, which I was meant to be going to, but by the time I got there, then getting all the stuff sorted/lift to Rebel tent etc meant I missed them. Bloody glad I did now, would have felt right awkward going and then not going IN!  Scary wasn't it?!

I mostly pissed in my bottle in the tent too, which I tend to do anyway, so avoided the worst of the toilet situation.  I actually don't think people were flushing them either. I did flush one when I had to, needing a shit on the Sunday morning like, and the bogs all heaped with other people's faeces.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 25, 2021)

sojourner said:


> My mate's band were performing in there on the Saturday, which I was meant to be going to, but by the time I got there, then getting all the stuff sorted/lift to Rebel tent etc meant I missed them. Bloody glad I did now, would have felt right awkward going and then not going IN!  Scary wasn't it?!
> 
> I mostly pissed in my bottle in the tent too, which I tend to do anyway, so avoided the worst of the toilet situation.  I actually don't think people were flushing them either. I did flush one when I had to, needing a shit on the Sunday morning like, and the bogs all heaped with other people's faeces.


The toilets is a good example of areas people constantly seem to be overlooking when it comes to getting events going again. All you get is talk of open areas, reduced numbers, distancing etc But anyone whose ever run an event knows it’s not the big things that fuck you up, but the small details.

Back when various proposals for getting things going again were doing the rounds I had to point out to people higher up the management chain than me that their plans for re-opening the concert hall at my work simply wouldn’t happen. They’d only looked at the seating plan, diligently worked out the separation requirements and come up with a reduced capacity/layout. What they hadn’t done was pay any thought to how you actually got those people in and out the building, where/how they’d queue, and what would happen if someone in the middle of a row needed to go to the loo mid performance.


----------



## spitfire (Aug 25, 2021)

spitfire said:


> My friends put on a mini festival/rave/party last week and there has been some positive tests since. They did the whole LFT/vaxxed thing beforehand so everyone * should * have been as fine as it is possible to be.
> 
> There seems to be an acknowledgement that they knew it was a risk but it was worth it. I hope it was. I didn't go as I can't risk it.



Luckily seems to have been very few cases after this party. A handful at most. Older crowd but they're quite messy and the main night was in a squash court so would have been very enclosed. Reckon they got lucky.

However, having read the various reports coming through from other events and also realising (like bees) where the pinch points are that I will not be able to avoid I'm binning off going to see IDLES at Brockwell Park next week and the all day rave in Surrey we have tickets for on the next day.

Sucks but I've been in plenty of fields over the years so the risk/benefit analysis isn't working for me.


----------



## Looby (Aug 25, 2021)

I’ve listed my EOTR tickets for sale on Twickets. I’m CEV and got an email this morning about my booster so it’s made me worry. 
I’m also starting a new job and really don’t want to start it with Covid. 
I think I could do it with low risk but I’m already anxious so it just won’t work for us. 
I’m fucking gutted. 😞


----------



## Voley (Aug 25, 2021)

Looby said:


> I’ve listed my EOTR tickets for sale on Twickets. I’m CEV and got an email this morning about my booster so it’s made me worry.
> I’m also starting a new job and really don’t want to start it with Covid.
> I think I could do it with low risk but I’m already anxious so it just won’t work for us.
> I’m fucking gutted. 😞


That was my end conclusion about The Specials Looby. If I'd spent the evening worrying it wouldn't have been any fun.

There'll be another time for all this. I'm happy to wait another year.


----------



## Looby (Aug 25, 2021)

Voley said:


> That was my end conclusion about The Specials Looby. If I'd spent the evening worrying it wouldn't have been any fun.
> 
> There'll be another time for all this. I'm happy to wait another year.


Thanks. I know it’s the right thing to do but I really wanted a bit of normality and a break. 
I really hope we can get our money back then at least we could go camping or something instead.


----------



## t0bytoo (Aug 25, 2021)

sojourner said:


> The weird thing about Beautiful Days was that artists and crew HAD to do either a lat flow onsite before getting the pass, or show your Covid pass. Punters were asked to lat flow but I don't believe were asked to prove anything. Which makes no fucking sense at all.



As a punter, I just waved a piece of paper at someone who was chatting on the phone. Then she tossed a green wristband through the car window. That was the COVID check


----------



## mx wcfc (Aug 25, 2021)

I've jacked in the idea of a mini "camping with music" festival this weekend, and won't be going to Going Feral either now.  I've come through three festivals unscathed so far this year  - it feels like I'm pushing my luck.  

I'm still holding out for a late September festival in Devon though.


----------



## sojourner (Aug 25, 2021)

t0bytoo said:


> As a punter, I just waved a piece of paper at someone who was chatting on the phone. Then she tossed a green wristband through the car window. That was the COVID check


Yup, about what I thought it might be. Fucking pointless.


----------



## sojourner (Aug 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> I'm still holding out for a late September festival in Devon though.


mx wcfc  Errr, if that's Gail's, mate, I'm afraid I've just seen on FB that she's cancelling it.


----------



## Supine (Aug 25, 2021)

My LFT check at WOH was pretty careful. Which is good.


----------



## mx wcfc (Aug 25, 2021)

sojourner said:


> mx wcfc  Errr, if that's Gail's, mate, I'm afraid I've just seen on FB that she's cancelling it.


Oh ffs.  Gutted.  I had a trip to my see my brother in S Devon lined up for a couple of days before SE.  Guess I can still do that.

Were you going to be performing?

Might rethink the other two now.......  I need one more trip.


----------



## sojourner (Aug 25, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> Oh ffs.  Gutted.  I had a trip to my see my brother in S Devon lined up for a couple of days before SE.  Guess I can still do that.
> 
> Were you going to be performing?
> 
> Might rethink the other two now.......  I need one more trip.


Nah, wasn't performing there chuck.


----------



## Supine (Aug 27, 2021)

Hopefully a joke


----------



## Badgers (Aug 27, 2021)

Oh ffs


----------



## Elpenor (Aug 27, 2021)

I think that may have been a spoof from a Reading based social media page


----------



## Badgers (Aug 28, 2021)

Friend just came back from Beautiful Days with Covid ffs


----------



## quiet guy (Aug 28, 2021)

Had heard of a few staff/ volunteers with positive LFT's on the Friday having to leave.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Aug 29, 2021)

There's gonna be carnage following Reading and Leeds.

spitfire, we're binning off the all day rave too, shame but I don't particularly want Covid, may well get it at some point but am fucked if I'm actively going to seek it out.


----------



## Badgers (Aug 29, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> There's gonna be carnage following Reading and Leeds.


Yup 

Hearing of lots of cases from BDs now. The Boardmasters fest in Cornwall led to approx 10% infections. 

The Reading/Leeds festivals are a lot busier and hedonistic than those.


----------



## Looby (Aug 29, 2021)

Badgers said:


> Yup
> 
> Hearing of lots of cases from BDs now. The Boardmasters fest in Cornwall led to approx 10% infections.
> 
> The Reading/Leeds festivals are a lot busier and hedonistic than those.


I’ve worked at Boardmasters and it was carnage. Same age group too. I’d say it was about the same level of hedonism although less busy I think.


----------



## elbows (Aug 29, 2021)

More off-site mixing at Boardmasters?


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 29, 2021)

I was in town in Leeds on Friday and it was heaving - shoppers, revellers, festival goers, sports fans, loads of people dressed up as if they were going to Ascot - pubs full, even outside areas thronged with people yelling at each other, singing and laughing. and that was mid afternoon, before the working day was over. I was glad to escape it all.


----------



## spitfire (Aug 29, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> There's gonna be carnage following Reading and Leeds.
> 
> spitfire, we're binning off the all day rave too, shame but I don't particularly want Covid, may well get it at some point but am fucked if I'm actively going to seek it out.



That’s a shame. Would have been good to meet up for a beer or 3. Right decision though.


----------



## Looby (Aug 29, 2021)

elbows said:


> More off-site mixing at Boardmasters?


Yeah maybe. Certainly lots of crew usually go into town. Lots of the teens tend to stick to the campsite and arena but there’s a huge amount of people with day tickets.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 29, 2021)

Shambino has been easier to socially distance at than We Out Here was. The dancing spaces are bigger and there are fewer people trying to get into them, so you can dance with more space around you. All open air ofc. I haven't danced so much this time though. I've been 'indoors' a couple of times (Chai Wallahs and Sankofas), but CW has big open sides, and Sankofas was sparsely filled and one long open side. I masked up once, but again wasn't as diligent as I'd planned to be, cos I really wasn't that near anyone else.

I'm sure there'll be cases from this, inevitably, but I hope not too many. The demographic is older, not teenagers much, and lots of families, who seem to be being quite careful on the whole.

Negative LTF yesterday.


----------



## Voley (Aug 30, 2021)

Bloody hell. Some discussion now of a new strain of the Delta variant coming out of Boardmasters.









						New Delta strain believed to have emerged among 53,000 revellers at Boardmasters festival
					

Almost 5,000 infections have been linked to the Boardmasters festival in Cornwall, and with half a million music lovers at even larger events over the Bank Holiday, officials fear revellers are being hit by a new strain of the Delta variant




					inews.co.uk


----------



## Supine (Aug 30, 2021)

Voley said:


> Bloody hell. Some discussion now of a new strain of the Delta variant coming out of Boardmasters.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This kind of article annoys me. Sure, at a detailed genetic level a group of cases can be traced to the original spreader. This is not the same as a new strain that people need to be concerned about. It could be implied from this article that the new strain is worse than existing and that isn’t the case - probably 

As an example, here is the delta family tree for the UK. You can see the multitude of minor changes as time moves from left to right. Rather cool genetics stuff


----------



## 2hats (Aug 30, 2021)

Voley said:


> Bloody hell. Some discussion now of a new strain of the Delta variant coming out of Boardmasters.


There are now a large number of variants which are just very small tweaks on delta/B.1.617.2 - as of this moment 28 of them have been classified (at least 9 of those have been found numerous times in the UK). They feature one or two mutations largely in reading frames or non-structural proteins and, so far, haven't demonstrated any significant infectious or pathological function. They are however quite useful for helping understand the dynamics of regional or event spread.


----------



## Athos (Aug 31, 2021)

Anyone else going to End of the Road?


----------



## mihaly (Aug 31, 2021)

Athos said:


> Anyone else going to End of the Road?


Yes. It's not exactly Boardmasters. But where theres a clash on the line-up I'll probably go for the outside stages....


----------



## Sweet FA (Aug 31, 2021)

Nephew 1 went to Boardmasters; came back & infected his whole family - fucked holiday plans etc etc. Nephew 2 recovered then went to Reading; awaiting results now. I saw their dad for 10 minutes in a pub car park on Friday and tested positive yesterday.


----------



## Athos (Aug 31, 2021)

mihaly said:


> Yes. It's not exactly Boardmasters. But where theres a clash on the line-up I'll probably go for the outside stages....


Yeah, me too!  I'm double jabbed, as is the whole group I'm with, but won't take too many risks.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 31, 2021)

Athos said:


> Yeah, me too!  I'm double jabbed, as is the whole group I'm with, but won't take too many risks.


Going _is_ the risk.


----------



## Athos (Aug 31, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Going _is_ the risk.


I guess it's a matter of degree; I'll risk going, but probably not risk spending too long in crowded tents.

To be honest, I'll not sweat it too much, being a double-vaccinated person with no known health issues and not in the age group most likely to suffer serious consequences (I'll keep away from others until I'm sure I'm all clear, after I get back).

Not least of all because it looks like covid is here to stay (like flu), and unless I'm saying I'm going to give up on much of what makes life worth living - gigs, football, pubs,  etc. - I'm going to have to accept some risk sooner or later (albeit there's things I can do to reduce the risk that are short of simply not going).


----------



## Sweet FA (Aug 31, 2021)

I'm double jabbed and so is my wife.



As is my bro in law and his wife, both who've had it over the last 2 weeks.


----------



## chainsawjob (Aug 31, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> Negative LTF yesterday.


And negative today, now that I'm home.


----------



## sojourner (Sep 1, 2021)

chainsawjob said:


> And negative today, now that I'm home.


Yup, 3rd negative today for me after Solfest, after being in what I would say were the most risky situations I've been in for nearly 2 years.


----------



## Voley (Sep 2, 2021)

I really shouldn't have looked at what songs The Specials are playing on their current tour.


----------



## souljacker (Sep 2, 2021)

I know around 10 people who went to reading this year and currently 5 have tested positive and the others are waiting on results.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2021)

souljacker said:


> I know around 10 people who went to reading this year and currently 5 have tested positive and the others are waiting on results.


I only know of two who went. Both positive  which is not ideal as they will miss the first week of college ffs


----------



## t0bytoo (Sep 2, 2021)

Voley said:


> I really shouldn't have looked at what songs The Specials are playing on their current tour.


I'm going to see them tomorrow. The only new song looks like a Freedom Highway cover.


----------



## Voley (Sep 2, 2021)

t0bytoo said:


> I'm going to see them tomorrow. The only new song looks like a Freedom Highway cover.


Yeah it's pretty much all killer no filler. I'll get another chance, I'm sure. Can't risk it with the rates in the South West just now though.


----------



## mx wcfc (Sep 2, 2021)

souljacker said:


> I know around 10 people who went to reading this year and currently 5 have tested positive and the others are waiting on results.


I was meant to be going to work, in Reading, today, but the word is that the town has a big spike cos of the festival, so I'll leave it till I'm back from holiday.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 2, 2021)

Being confined to hospital prevented me going to Beautiful Days, weekend of Saturday 21st August.
That pissed me off at the time. Possibly a bit less pissed off now that I'm hearing concerning stories about infected people.

festivaldeb went (with her friend Yvonne using my ticket!) but they both seem to be fine. I guess a fair proportion of people at festivals won't get infected anyway. That doesn't mean it's worth the risk, but I bet a lot of people who do go, will simply gamble .....

I'll still be going with my mate to The Specials in Coventry, Saturday 11th September -- it's an outdoor gig at the Ricoh Arena though. Will mask up and be careful etc.

That's my only 2021 event though**, by the look of things 

**Now that Gail Something Else's late-September event in Devon has been cancelled, as has the Sunset on the West (Fuelled by Cider) Festival that was going to be at Pontins, Weston-super-Mare, over the first weekend of October. Just as well maybe that the latter was cancelled, given it was an indoor event!


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 2, 2021)

Just remembered though that I'm planning to go to Dreadzone in Swansea as soon as tomorrow!  (Friday 3/9) -- I missed them at Beautiful Days, and decided on Tuesday that I'd mask-up and go and see them .....

Plus three Cardiff gigs planned for late November and December, including Madness, which I really don't want to miss .....


----------



## souljacker (Sep 2, 2021)

mx wcfc said:


> I was meant to be going to work, in Reading, today, but the word is that the town has a big spike cos of the festival, so I'll leave it till I'm back from holiday.


It's not showing in the numbers yet but anecdotally, everyone who went has got it.


----------



## Supine (Sep 2, 2021)

souljacker said:


> It's not showing in the numbers yet but anecdotally, everyone who went has got it.



That is one hell of an anecdote!


----------



## Teaboy (Sep 2, 2021)

One thing that makes Reading festival quite different to most other festivals is it's urban setting.  Most festivals are held in a field in the middle of nowhere, Reading is right in the town.

I lived in Reading for quite a few years and would be amazed at how many festival goers would pop into town to go clothes shopping or go to the cinema or eat at restaurants.  That sort of interaction combined with the age of festival goer at Reading will make for interesting time in the town in the next few weeks.


----------



## chainsawjob (Sep 2, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Being confined to hospital prevented me going to Beautiful Days, weekend of Saturday 21st August.


Sorry to hear this, hope you're feeling better again.


----------



## mx wcfc (Sep 2, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> One thing that makes Reading festival quite different to most other festivals is it's urban setting.  Most festivals are held in a field in the middle of nowhere, Reading is right in the town.
> 
> I lived in Reading for quite a few years and would be amazed at how many festival goers would pop into town to go clothes shopping or go to the cinema or eat at restaurants.  That sort of interaction combined with the age of festival goer at Reading will make for interesting time in the town in the next few weeks.


Lots of people from the town go to the festival too, maybe just for a day, maybe just to see a couple of headliners, not camping necessarily, but still mingling with the festival crowd.


----------



## Elpenor (Sep 2, 2021)

As said plenty of people in Reading go to the festival, and every hotel will have been full of festival goers


----------



## Voley (Sep 2, 2021)

Whats that hotel at the end of the road where all the journalists/bands stay? The Ramada? God I bet that's a mess right now.


----------



## Elpenor (Sep 2, 2021)

That’s the Crowne Plaza I think by the bridge


----------



## Voley (Sep 2, 2021)

Elpenor said:


> That’s the Crowne Plaza I think by the bridge


Ah right, that rings bells. You walk past it to get to the site? Donkeys years since I've been like.


----------



## Elpenor (Sep 2, 2021)

I think so, but I only went once in over 20 years of living in Reading. But used to run along the river in non-festival times. You’d definitely walk past that hotel assuming the main entrance hasn’t changed.


----------



## Teaboy (Sep 2, 2021)

Voley said:


> Ah right, that rings bells. You walk past it to get to the site? Donkeys years since I've been like.



Depends which route you came in from but generally walking from the station you'd walk that way.  I think most of the journos use the Penta Hotel now or at least did before it got turned into a government travel quarantine hotel.


----------



## Johnny Doe (Sep 2, 2021)

Elpenor said:


> That’s the Crowne Plaza I think by the bridge


Yeah, Caversham Bridge. (I stayed there ahead of an exam down that way a decade ot so ago, so I remember the address)


----------



## souljacker (Sep 2, 2021)

It was a Ramada, many years ago. Had the famous three men in a boat pub, known locally as "three Trev's in a cortina"


----------



## Voley (Sep 2, 2021)

Used to be a hotbed of vice and iniquity on festival weekend, or so the Melody Maker/NME gossip columns of the time would have it. 

Young people are quite sensible compared to us though so maybe it's not like that at all any more.  

You wouldn't catch me anywhere near somewhere like that just now anyhow. I'm staying in a Premier Inn in Plymouth tonight,  nowhere near a festival site, and I'm slightly iffy about that tbh.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2021)

Badgers said:


> Friend just came back from Beautiful Days with Covid ffs


Her daughter has it too now so will miss the first day's of school. 

However the son (they all live together) has not tested positive so has been told to return to school 🤔🙄


----------



## what (Sep 2, 2021)

A friends son went to reading in a group of 20. 16 of them now have the plague.


----------



## Teaboy (Sep 2, 2021)

The age of those who attend Reading and presumably Leeds was always going to be a massive factor.  Basically its just teenagers and very early 20's.  Prime plague spreader age.  They simply don't give a fuck about covid and I don't blame them, I'd likely be the same if I was that age.

When I went to to beautiful days a few weeks back it was really easy to see how the different age groups behaved and pretty easy to keep yourself safe.  Just stay away from anyone under the age of 25.  A bit harder at Reading when that's 95% of the attendees.


----------



## quiet guy (Sep 2, 2021)

I'm going to Moseley Folk Festival this weekend. Lots of lovely open air, just hope it doesn't tip it down 🙄


----------



## Skim (Sep 2, 2021)

I was at Reading on Friday. Have done two Covid tests since then and both have been negative so far (will continue testing over next few days).


----------



## magneze (Sep 2, 2021)

Going to the Roundhouse soon. First indoor gig for a while. 😱


----------



## Badgers (Sep 2, 2021)

magneze said:


> Going to the Roundhouse soon. First indoor gig for a while. 😱


It was nice to have known you


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Sep 2, 2021)

quiet guy said:


> I'm going to Moseley Folk Festival this weekend. Lots of lovely open air, just hope it doesn't tip it down 🙄


Forecast is good


----------



## magneze (Sep 2, 2021)

Badgers said:


> It was nice to have known you


Might be empty 😬


----------



## miss direct (Sep 2, 2021)

I was super careful at Tramlines and didn't get anything. Won't be going to any other festivals ever though.


----------



## quiet guy (Sep 2, 2021)

Miss Direct - Did you not enjoy it?
I did a couple of years stewarding it with Oxfam when it was down in Devonshire Green and then a year between it being split between there and The Ponderosa. Had some good laughs with the drunks and festival goers.


----------



## miss direct (Sep 2, 2021)

No, I didn't. Made me realise I really dont like crowds. Used to go clubbing and to concerts and never felt that way but I can't see it changing again.


----------



## Elpenor (Sep 2, 2021)

miss direct said:


> No, I didn't. Made me realise I really dont like crowds. Used to go clubbing and to concerts and never felt that way but I can't see it changing again.


I know what you mean, more so having moved away from the south east. I’m having a few misgivings about going to rugby internationals in the future and doubt I will be going to any concerts.


----------



## chainsawjob (Sep 3, 2021)

There are so many upcoming gigs I keep seeing that I'd like to go to, but it's all indoor venues, smallish ones (the only outstanding tickets I have from the before-times are for a gig at The Waiting Room in London, which I believe's quite an 'intimate' venue). I can't see me going to anything indoors for the forseeable. And yet I'm torn cos I'd like to help keep these small local venues afloat, and worry they'll not survive. My one gig last summer when things re-opened was at a small local venue, and the bands set up on the pavement outside, instead of inside as normal. It was really nice, plenty of space to dance (quiet street, big and open pavement and seating area), and only a handful of people. Not very lucrative for the venue I don't expect. There were more people sat in the park opposite listening with their own cans, than buying drinks from the bar. It wasn't ticketed, probably just local bands playing for free drinks maybe?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 5, 2021)

BB1 and Frau Bahn are off to see Mr Ben and the Bens tonight at the Boileroom in Guildford, it’s a very small venue, a proper plague pit of a place. Will report back on infections…


----------



## belboid (Sep 5, 2021)

Southwell Folk Festival


----------



## klang (Sep 6, 2021)

folk festies are probably the best bet atm.


----------



## quiet guy (Sep 6, 2021)

Just back from Moseley, fantastic festival, fabulous headliners, good food and drink and glorious weather all the way through.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 7, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> BB1 and Frau Bahn are off to see Mr Ben and the Bens tonight at the Boileroom in Guildford, it’s a very small venue, a proper plague pit of a place. Will report back on infections…




So, Boiler Room asked to see Frau Bahn's vaccination status and BB1 needed to upload a negative rapid test to the NHS site, she did not need to actually take the test though, so it seems it was all fairly sloppy, as others have reported elsewhere. Only around 25 people there though, doors and windows open plus an outside space (smoking area) that has been tarted up over the lockdowns. At £7 a ticket split between three bands, not much for Mr Ben to cover the costs of coming down from Lancaster, everyone did buy some merch to try and help out. It's a start and they both reported the headline band was excellent.


----------



## ruffneck23 (Sep 7, 2021)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> So, Boiler Room asked to see Frau Bahn's vaccination status and BB1 needed to upload a negative rapid test to the NHS site, she did not need to actually take the test though, so it seems it was all fairly sloppy, as others have reported elsewhere. Only around 25 people there though, doors and windows open plus an outside space (smoking area) that has been tarted up over the lockdowns. At £7 a ticket split between three bands, not much for Mr Ben to cover the costs of coming down from Lancaster, everyone did buy some merch to try and help out. It's a start and they both reported the headline band was excellent.


I've been to the boiler room and 25 people (on the inside bit) makes it sounds packed


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 12, 2021)

Got an email saying the Feb 2022 Shopping gig that I had a ticket for has now been cancelled, kind of curious about what they're basing that decision on? Can't find anything about it online, but then it doesn't help that they're called fucking Shopping and so they have one of the most ungoogleable names possible.


----------



## Orang Utan (Sep 12, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Got an email saying the Feb 2022 Shopping gig that I had a ticket for has now been cancelled, kind of curious about what they're basing that decision on? Can't find anything about it online, but then it doesn't help that they're called fucking Shopping and so they have one of the most ungoogleable names possible.


looks like they’re going on tour with Idles


----------



## Mation (Sep 20, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Got an email saying the Feb 2022 Shopping gig that I had a ticket for has now been cancelled, kind of curious about what they're basing that decision on? Can't find anything about it online, but then it doesn't help that they're called fucking Shopping and so they have one of the most ungoogleable names possible.


They need to release an album called Search


----------



## Badgers (Oct 3, 2021)

Anyone do the London Marathon today? I am are everyone was / is will be fine


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 3, 2021)

Badgers said:


> Anyone do the London Marathon today? I am are everyone was / is will be fine


----------



## Skim (Oct 3, 2021)

belboid said:


> Southwell Folk Festival
> 
> View attachment 287000


“C’MON, MAKE SOME FUCKING NOISE!”


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 14, 2021)

Has anyone been clubbing yet? I’m going down to that London for a World Unknown at the end of this month. Looking forward to it but also a bit trepidatious


----------



## souljacker (Oct 14, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Has anyone been clubbing yet? I’m going down to that London for a World Unknown at the end of this month. Looking forward to it but also a bit trepidatious



Not clubbing but went to see Bicep at the Brixton Academy and it felt very dangerous. But I didn't get covid and had a marvellous time.


----------



## klang (Oct 14, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Has anyone been clubbing yet? I’m going down to that London for a World Unknown at the end of this month. Looking forward to it but also a bit trepidatious


went to a night at Earth. Didn't feel particularly covid safe, the beer was expensive and the sound was crap and too quiet. Also bumped into someone I didn't want to bump into. Other than that it was marvellous. hth


----------



## DaveCinzano (Oct 14, 2021)

klang said:


> went to a night at Earth. Didn't feel particularly covid safe, the beer was expensive and the sound was crap and too quiet. Also bumped into someone I didn't want to bump into. Other than that it was marvellous. hth


"Still, mustn't grumble" 😁


----------



## Teaboy (Oct 14, 2021)

It occurred to me the other day that with so many festival tickets rolled over again to next year and expected big demand getting hold of a festival ticket for next summer might be hard work.  Unless its for a shit festival of course.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 14, 2021)

souljacker said:


> Not clubbing but went to see Bicep at the Brixton Academy and it felt very dangerous. But I didn't get covid and had a marvellous time.


I think I’ll be ok cos I don’t have the imagination to fear a virus (cos I can’t see it), even though I should. I’m glad though, as otherwise I’d be housebound.
I’m just worried I might get a bit anxious being surrounded by many people. I can get like that if I feel there’s no easy escape.
One of the reasons I stopped going to squat parties was the lack of fire regulations


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 15, 2021)

Teaboy said:


> It occurred to me the other day that with so many festival tickets rolled over again to next year and expected big demand getting hold of a festival ticket for next summer might be hard work.  Unless its for a shit festival of course.


The proportion of people who hold roll-overed** Glastonbury tickets (now valid for G2022) must be *enormous* -- any release of returned tickets will be even more miniscule than usual .....

(**word??  )

We also hold tickets now valid for Bearded Theory next May (one which was cancelled three times!), and ones for at least two or three other fests (musy check! 

What people have said amongst our festival circle suggests we're quite representative! We are all festival-obsessives though


----------



## Mation (Oct 16, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I think I’ll be ok cos I don’t have the imagination to fear a virus (cos I can’t see it), even though I should. I’m glad though, as otherwise I’d be housebound.
> I’m just worried I might get a bit anxious being surrounded by many people. I can get like that if I feel there’s no easy escape.
> One of the reasons I stopped going to squat parties was the lack of fire regulations


I went to a club last weekend. It was massively helpful to my mental health to dance some of the stress of the the past 18 months away, but I did deliberately spend most of the night dancing by the doors to the smoking area. As people were going in and out constantly, and it was immediately off the dancefloor, there was continual fresh air coming in.

There was also more space. I wasn't even vaguely tempted to go near the front, where it was rammed. Seeing how much Chris Liberator enjoys playing is usually bonus medicine on top of the music itself, but that will have to wait. Probably till there's something outdoors.


----------



## Mation (Oct 16, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> roll-overed**
> 
> (**word??  )


Rolled-over


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 16, 2021)

Mation said:


> Rolled-over


roll-overed brimmed my tank with joy though


----------



## Mation (Oct 16, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> roll-overed brimmed my tank with joy though


Aye  (but he asked).


----------



## chainsawjob (Oct 16, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> The proportion of people who hold roll-overed** Glastonbury tickets (now valid for G2022) must be *enormous* -- any release of returned tickets will be even more miniscule than usual .....


Yes, this is my fear, as we were unlucky on the last ticket day. I'm not holding out much hope for resales. I'm increasingly thinking working it would be my preferred option, if we can both find something to do that accommodates having 2 kids to vaguely suprervise (they're old enough now to not need us all the time). The last time I worked Glastonbury was 2004, basically before we had the kids, we've been on tickets ever since then. I've got rolled over tickets for Bearded too, I think that's the only one though. mr csj has one for Boomtown, but I always work that one, and will do next year.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 19, 2021)

__





						No friends, no family, no fun: the bleak reality of music tours today
					





					www.msn.com


----------



## TopCat (Oct 20, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


But work has picked up a bit?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Oct 20, 2021)

TopCat said:


> But work has picked up a bit?


It’s picked up _a lot_, in the corporate world (conferences, live events etc) especially. The demand for hybrid style things using platforms like Zoom, Vmix, OnAir etc means good video/streaming techs can pretty much write their own cheques at the moment. It all feels like it’s still on a knife edge though.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 22, 2021)

Am amazed this is going on  





__





						Home
					






					www.mcmcomiccon.com
				




It is a massive show (approx 100k) and attended by people from all over the country. I have run co-located events and the hotels are rammed. Last one I had 12 people in one (not very big) hotel room (with no ventilation) next to mine. People from other rooms coming and going all night and into the early (4pm iirc) hours to party. 

It is not my sort of thing but a really fun event and the punters go for it 117%. Good times but the timing is really shit.


----------



## Mation (Dec 11, 2021)

Tried to recreate the success of the other month's night out last week; a last chance saloon of dancing before what I imagine will be ages and more of nope.

Regretted it as soon as I got there, as the venue was poorly ventilated, or not enough to make me feel it was sufficiently ventilated, anyway, but I stupidly didn't turn around and go home.

Sort of got away with it. I've been ill this week (in the past couple of days), but have had several negative lateral flows, and a negative PCR (plus two more, earlier PCRs, for which I've not had results yet, but are presumably negative).

I won't be doing it again. There's a party I'd otherwise love to go to around Christmas, but nope.

How's things, event- and cancellation-wise with you all?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 11, 2021)

As I’ve said elsewhere I spent the last two days dealing with multiple event cancellations. Next week was originally incredibly busy with a large number of Xmas themed events on the uni campus, as well as various concerts. There’s now only 3 going ahead, and I’m entirely expecting at least one of those to be canned by the time I get to my desk on Monday morning.

Everything I’m looking after for January and February has plans in place to go fully virtual if needed. I’m expecting a lot of them to do so even if the government doesn’t force the issue, as it seems people are now either a lot more cautious or simply panicking.


----------



## l'Otters (Dec 11, 2021)

Towards the end of last month I got an invite to go see a theatre show with some friends, decided yes because I’d had the booster vaccine early November; so it’s booked for December 18th; big theatre on the south bank. 

I hadn’t done any indoor gigs theatre or pubs since March 2020…

Having checked out what’s happening with omicron etc, I’m now hoping the venue will cancel so I’ll at least get a refund / rollover ticket cos no way does this seem like a sensible option. 

I think even if I went, wearing an ffp3 mask, being surrounded by ppl packed in with no masks on would stress me out & wouldn’t be worth it. 

Bloody painful tho those tickets were relatively expensive!


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Dec 11, 2021)

l'Otters said:


> Towards the end of last month I got an invite to go see a theatre show with some friends, decided yes because I’d had the booster vaccine early November; so it’s booked for December 18th; big theatre on the south bank.
> 
> I hadn’t done any indoor gigs theatre or pubs since March 2020…
> 
> ...


pretty sure masks are mandatory in theatres now


----------



## l'Otters (Dec 11, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> pretty sure masks are mandatory in theatres now


That’s encouraging to hear. 

I wonder what it means in practice? 

They’re mandatory on public transport and in shops but I’ve not been seeing much adherence to that no matter where I’ve been since summer 2020 tbh. But maybe there’s higher cooperation in theatres.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

What sort of music fan returns tickets in a pandemic? 
Don't show up, fine, but don't ask for your money back ffs - don't you want there to be a scene to come back to when it's the right time?
Scratching my head here. Someone please enlighten me. 








						Bands and DJs count the costs as UK fans fail to show up for gigs
					

Artists are having to bump up the guest list to fill venues as growing numbers of ticket-holders drop out




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> What sort of music fan returns tickets in a pandemic?
> Don't show up, fine, but don't ask for your money back ffs - don't you want there to be a scene to come back to when it's the right time?
> Scratching my head here. Someone please enlighten me.
> 
> ...


They’re the sort of music fans more commonly known as “twats”.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> They’re the sort of music fans more commonly known as “twats”.



Or not as rich as you


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> They’re the sort of music fans more commonly known as “twats”.


50% of them, by the looks of it. I've bought ticket for three raves but chickened out at the last minute, though it never occurred to me to get my money back


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Or not as rich as you


you've already bought the ticket though and you're not going to buy any booze or merch.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> you've already bought the ticket though and you're not going to buy any booze or merch.



And that means they no longer need the tenner of however much it is. No one has any idea what has happened to these “twats” in the pandemic.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> And that means they no longer need the tenner of however much it is. No one has any idea what has happened to these “twats” in the pandemic.


they do need it if they're going to continue entertaining us. the money's spent so why try to claw it back? it's no fault of the venue or the bands/djs/promoters.


----------



## Supine (Dec 12, 2021)

I was a no show at one gig. I don’t care if people think i was a twat, i did it for my own safety. Didn’t ask for a refund or expect one.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> they do need it if they're going to continue entertaining us. the money's spent so why try to claw it back? it's no fault of the venue or the bands/djs/promoters.



You misunderstand as usual. The purchaser might need the money more whether to feed themselves or pay the rent.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> You misunderstand as usual. The purchaser might need the money more whether to feed themselves or pay the rent.


But if the show went ahead they magically wouldn’t need it?


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 12, 2021)

Supine said:


> I was a no show at one gig. I don’t care if people think i was a twat, i did it for my own safety. Didn’t ask for a refund or expect one.


Which is perfectly fine.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> But if the show went ahead they magically wouldn’t need it?



They would but presumably wouldn’t be eligible. 

Good condescension from you.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> They would but presumably wouldn’t be eligible.
> 
> Good condescension from you.


Eh? You have the money to spend on tickets or you don’t. You can’t plead poverty once you’ve spent it.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> You misunderstand as usual. The purchaser might need the money more whether to feed themselves or pay the rent.


if they can afford to buy a concert/gig ticket, they'll be flush enough to write off the cost.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> Eh? You have the money to spend on tickets or you don’t. You can’t plead poverty once you’ve spent it.



Because personal circumstances never change? All the people living on the streets must have never bought a ticket for anything in their lives.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> if they can afford to buy a concert/gig ticket, they'll be flush enough to write off the cost.



Again because circumstances never change. 

You lack awareness.


----------



## ska invita (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> What sort of music fan returns tickets in a pandemic?
> Don't show up, fine, but don't ask for your money back ffs - don't you want there to be a scene to come back to when it's the right time?
> Scratching my head here. Someone please enlighten me.
> 
> ...


When I buy tickets I buy at least two, maybe more depending who is going. £20-£30 a ticket is about the price of a good live act.  If something gets rescheduled I'll have my money back thanks.

Me not going doesn't stop someone else from going .

You can't get your money back just because you don't feel like it on the night


----------



## ska invita (Dec 12, 2021)

Last time this happened to me was Dangelo, paid at least £100 for two tickets. Got rescheduled to a date I couldn't make, got refunded. Would rather have gone

How am I a twat?


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Again because circumstances never change.
> 
> You lack awareness.


 People must have known that things might change when they bought the tickets. Sorry but if you can afford to spend £20 on a ticket, you can afford to lose it


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

ska invita said:


> When I buy tickets I buy at least two, maybe more depending who is going. £20-£30 a ticket is about the price of a good live act.  If something gets rescheduled I'll have my money back thanks.
> 
> Me not going doesn't stop someone else from going .
> 
> You can't get your money back just because you don't feel like it on the night


Exactly


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> People must have known that things might change when they bought the tickets. Sorry but if you can afford to spend £20 on a ticket, you can afford to lose it



You lack awareness, try to realise this and do better.

Hopefully you lose all money you ever spend on enjoyment, after all no matter what happens you can afford to lose it.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> You lack awareness, try to realise this and do better.
> 
> Hopefully you lose all money you ever spend on enjoyment, after all no matter what happens you can afford to lose it.


you're not making any sense. these aren't poor people. these are wealthy concert goers


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> you're not making any sense. these aren't poor people. these are wealthy concert goers



No you are not making any sense. People that are "poor" never go to concerts according to you?

You might be a wealthy concert goer, what makes them so? Where is the analysis of their income?


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

If you've got a spare £20-£100 for a ticket, then you've got enough spare money to forego it


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> If you've got a spare £20-£100 for a ticket, then you've got enough spare money to forego it



Be sure to say that to the next person you speak to outside a food bank.


----------



## ska invita (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> If you've got a spare £20-£100 for a ticket, then you've got enough spare money to forego it


why should you forego it again?


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Be sure to say that to the next person you speak to outside a food bank.


They wouldn’t be at a food bank if they’re spending money on going out


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> They wouldn’t be at a food bank if they’re spending money on going out



God you are ignorant. No one using a food bank has prior to their need spent money on going out?

The tories could use that to deny access. “Have you at any point prior spent money on going out?”


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

People who can afford social lives are not strapped for cash


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> People who can afford social lives are not strapped for cash



The poor aren’t allowed to socialise?

Great stuff.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 12, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> The poor aren’t allowed to socialise?
> 
> Great stuff.


Why are you claiming that?


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 12, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Why are you claiming that?



Because you said people that can afford social lives aren’t poor.


----------



## ice-is-forming (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan 

Stop a minute and think


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Because you said people that can afford social lives aren’t poor.


People who can afford to go out to a concert can’t be. Big arena gigs cost around £50, and then you’d have to get there, find somewhere to stay etc. could cos a few hundred


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

ice-is-forming said:


> Orang Utan
> 
> Stop a minute and think


About what?
How there are people who are have a big enough disposable income to go to big concerts and we aren’t supposed to think it selfish of them to try and get their money back instead of help near bankrupt concert venues survive?


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> People who can afford to go out to a concert can’t be. Big arena gigs cost around £50, and then you’d have to get there, find somewhere to stay etc. could cos a few hundred



What else shouldn’t they have to qualify as poor. A car? Sky tv? Heating?


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> What else shouldn’t they have to qualify as poor. A car? Sky tv? Heating?


I’ve no idea where you are coming from with this. I’m not criticising anyone but those with disposable income who are petty enough to try and claw their money back while being aware of how precarious the industry is right now.


----------



## Sue (Dec 13, 2021)

Sometimes people's circumstances have changed. A friend, for example, was on furlough for the duration and has been on reduced hours since. 

When she booked some tickets pre-lockdown, she could afford them at a stretch as a treat. Now she can't and asked for a refund when the gig was rescheduled. She's on just above minimum wage so is not exactly rich.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I’ve no idea where you are coming from with this. I’m not criticising anyone but those with disposable income who are petty enough to try and claw their money back while being aware of how precarious the industry is right now.



Try the post above to understand.

But you won’t get it, which is why you cope so badly in life. 

Night.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Try the post above to understand.
> 
> But you won’t get it, which is why you cope so badly in life.
> 
> Night.


I think you have a problem about something else and are taking out on me as your posts have been so strange. And really fucking presumptuous. You don’t know me, yet you seem to think you know how I’m getting on in life and all sorts of other stuff. So you’re either getting me mixed up with someone else or have jumped to some erroneous conclusions about me. You’re creeping me out tbh. I bid you good night, and trust you not to engage with me any more.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I think you have a problem about something else and are taking out on me as your posts have been so strange. And really fucking presumptuous. You don’t know me, yet you seem to think you know how I’m getting on in life and all sorts of other stuff. So you’re either getting me mixed up with someone else or have jumped to some erroneous conclusions about me. You’re creeping me out tbh. I bid you good night, and trust you not to engage with me any more.



Yet you know how all these concert goers are going in life. 

One hundred percent pure.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan and B.I.G you are both shouting about different demographics, have a glass of tap water and chill out.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

Sue said:


> Sometimes people's circumstances have changed. A friend, for example, was on furlough for the duration and has been on reduced hours since.
> 
> When she booked some tickets pre-lockdown, she could afford them at a stretch as a treat. Now she can't and asked for a refund when the gig was rescheduled. She's on just above minimum wage so is not exactly rich.


Hmm, I’ve worked in London on minimum wages or less, and couldn’t even afford to go the pub let alone concert gigs. To me then, people who did this were wealthy to me. Even after earning more, drinks were out of the question, I just had to do it straight edge. 
From where I was at the time, the concert goers were all middle class or poshos who wouldn’t understand when you told them a gig you were invited to was way out of reach cos it was so dear


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Orang Utan and B.I.G you ae both shouting about different demographics, have a glass of tap water and chill out.


This must be it as I haven’t clue what he’s on about.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> you cope so badly in life.


Why did you say this? It’s a fucked up thing to say to anyone let alone a stranger when you’re a noob on the boards cos you don’t have the knowledge to come to this conclusion.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Orang Utan and B.I.G you are both shouting about different demographics, have a glass of tap water and chill out.



Well they are thinking about the plight of the struggling business owner and I’m thinking about the person that paid for entertainment they can’t receive. Whereas they can’t comprehend anyone paying for entertainment becoming hard up.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Why did you say this? It’s a fucked up thing to say to anyone let alone a stranger when you’re a noob on the boards cos you don’t have the knowledge to come to this conclusion.



Are you coping well in life?


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Well they are thinking about the plight of the struggling business owner and I’m thinking about the person that paid for entertainment they can’t receive. Whereas they can’t comprehend anyone paying for entertainment becoming hard up.


They’re not hard up when they’ve bought a ticket for £50 are they?


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Are you coping well in life?


None of your business. Why are you bringing it up? What’s it got to do with this thread?


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> They’re not hard up when they’ve bought a ticket for £50 are they?



Again. Their circumstances may have changed. It may have been a gift and now they need the money. They may have had the spare money and now they don’t. They may feel they shouldn’t have to pay for something they didn’t receive. 

Examples from others have been provided on this thread.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

It doesn’t matter if they need the money. They’ve already spent it. It’s gone.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> None of your business. Why are you bringing it up? What’s it got to do with this thread?



You are judging others for not doing so well in life they can afford to spare money for things they didn’t receive.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> It doesn’t matter if they need the money. They’ve already spent it. It’s gone.



Except it isn’t and they are entitled to a refund. That is how refunds work.


----------



## Sue (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Hmm, I’ve worked in London on minimum wages or less, and couldn’t even afford to go the pub let alone concert gigs. To me then, people who did this were wealthy to me. Even after earning more, drinks were out of the question, I just had to do it straight edge.
> From where I was at the time, the concert goers were all middle class or poshos who wouldn’t understand when you told them a gig you were invited to was way out of reach cos it was so dear


She's not in London.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> You are judging others for not doing so well in life they can afford to spare money for things they didn’t receive.


You’re doing the judging here. It’s not judgmental to observe that people with money to spend on big nights out are probably doing ok and so I’m surprised to see them demand refunds, instead of just signing it off.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Except it isn’t and they are entitled to a refund. That is how refunds work.


They may be entitled, but that doesn’t mean they have to get a refund. There is a bigger picture to consider


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> You’re doing the judging here. It’s not judgmental to observe that people with money to spend on big nights out are probably doing ok and so I’m surprised to see them demand refunds, instead of just signing it off.



Still don’t have any awareness I see. Work on that and you will do better in life. 

In the meantime the poor will have to do without going out to avoid your judgment.


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> They may be entitled, but that doesn’t mean they have to get a refund. There is a bigger picture to consider



The bigger picture being more important than their ability to eat or pay their bills. Right.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Dec 13, 2021)

oh FFS
quit it now 
will ya


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Still don’t have any awareness I see. Work on that and you will do better in life.
> 
> In the meantime the poor will have to do without going out to avoid your judgment.


Please stop patronising me and making assumptions about my life. I’m only judging the people who can afford to forego the price of a ticket, but who go to the trouble of getting refunds when the bands need that money more


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> The bigger picture being more important than their ability to eat or pay their bills. Right.


I think you need to go to bed as you keep attributing stuff to be that I never said!


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

I’m only judging the rich kids


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I’m only judging the rich kids



Being as you said anyone that can afford concert tickets. 

Your lack of empathy and awareness on show. 

Work on that and greater success in life can be yours.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

B.I.G said:


> Being as you said anyone that can afford concert tickets.
> 
> Your lack of empathy and awareness on show.
> 
> Work on that and greater success in life can be yours.


This is patent nonsense and making shit up about what’s in my head.
Don’t fucking give me advice, you condescending piece of shit.
This is such a weird exchange - you must be on a windup. Deliberately misinterpreting my exasperation at rich entitled cunts as being judgmental of those who aren’t rich entitled cunts.
What a head scratcher. You must have skimmed my posts and come to the wrong conclusion. Slagging the rich off = judging the poor - wtf?


----------



## B.I.G (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> This is patent nonsense and making shit up about what’s in my head.
> Don’t fucking give me advice, you condescending piece of shit.
> This is such a weird exchange - you must be on a windup. Deliberately misinterpreting my exasperation at rich entitled cunts as being judgmental of those who aren’t rich entitled cunts.
> What a head scratcher. You must have skimmed my posts and come to the wrong conclusion. Slagging the rich off = judging the poor - wtf?





Orang Utan said:


> if they can afford to buy a concert/gig ticket, they'll be flush enough to write off the cost.





Orang Utan said:


> People must have known that things might change when they bought the tickets. Sorry but if you can afford to spend £20 on a ticket, you can afford to lose it





Orang Utan said:


> you're not making any sense. these aren't poor people. these are wealthy concert goers





Orang Utan said:


> If you've got a spare £20-£100 for a ticket, then you've got enough spare money to forego it





Orang Utan said:


> They wouldn’t be at a food bank if they’re spending money on going out





Orang Utan said:


> People who can afford social lives are not strapped for cash





Orang Utan said:


> People who can afford to go out to a concert can’t be. Big arena gigs cost around £50, and then you’d have to get there, find somewhere to stay etc. could cos a few hundred





Orang Utan said:


> About what?
> How there are people who are have a big enough disposable income to go to big concerts and we aren’t supposed to think it selfish of them to try and get their money back instead of help near bankrupt concert venues survive?


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

Stop it please. Why are you doing this? It seems deliberate now, deliberately misinterpreting what I said, when I said the opposite, just to wind me up. 

Such a baffling series of posts .


----------



## editor (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> People who can afford social lives are not strapped for cash





Orang Utan said:


> if they can afford to buy a concert/gig ticket, they'll be flush enough to write off the cost.





Orang Utan said:


> People must have known that things might change when they bought the tickets. Sorry but if you can afford to spend £20 on a ticket, you can afford to lose it





Orang Utan said:


> If you've got a spare £20-£100 for a ticket, then you've got enough spare money to forego it



You're suddenly sounding like a full-on Tory here mate and it's not a good look. Or maybe you're lost the ability to explain what you mean for the day.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

It’s totally the opposite to what you’re saying! It’s a Tory thing to do to be grasping back money in that way
I’m defending the bands etc who are not going to be earning a living anymore if we’re not careful. The Tories are happy about this, cos they think ballet dancers should give up and get a job in IT instead.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

I hope this thread reads differently in the morning as there are some huge misunderstandings going on. Night night


----------



## Looby (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I hope this thread reads differently in the morning as there are some huge misunderstandings going on. Night night


Sorry but it doesn’t it makes you look really shitty and judgmental. Obviously B.I.G was being a dick too. 

It’s not just ‘rich kids’ that buy gig tickets skint people do too. Your idea of who is rich seems odd and childish. 
People save up for gigs they really want to go to.
I used to go to Glastonbury when I was on benefits but I’d save all year for my ticket, get money for Christmas etc  
People on really tight budgets prioritise what any spare money goes on so for some it’s gigs and they go without to do that.
Things change for people. They lose jobs, bills going up, rent increases etc etc

Also, it’s actually none of your business how much money gig goers have and whether this means they deserve a refund. 

I bought tickets to a festival and the tickets were rolled over to this year. I’d paid for them out of a lump sum I’d been given.  I wanted to go but after Reading and Boardmasters covid figures I decided I couldn’t risk it until my booster as I’m CEV. 
I wasn’t able to sell my tickets so the festival agreed to roll my ticket over again. 
Was that wrong? Should I have just lost nearly £400? 


I’ve lost out on lots of money this year on gigs and other stuff I couldn’t go to because I’m CEV and according to you that doesn’t matter because I’m rich yeah? I’m not. 

Because I’ve lost that money, I’m far less able to rebook other gigs because I don’t have the cash and I have less money than I did last year or the year before when I booked these things. 
I’m also less keen to because I know they might get cancelled or I could get told to shield again. So I’m not booking stuff I usually would have done.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

I forgot about saving money.


----------



## TopCat (Dec 13, 2021)

Hows the hANGOVER?


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 13, 2021)

The Tories definitely love that whole 'you're either absolutely skint or you're basically stinking rich' thing. It's really useful to them - 'look this person over here has enough money to go to a concert/get a new telly/eat out/whatever shouldn't that be taken away.'


----------



## Ms Ordinary (Dec 13, 2021)

What I took from that article, was that 'no-notice no-shows' can be quite damaging, in terms of lost bar/ merch revenue, and also its shit playing to half-empty venues (for the artist and the audience, though tbf right now there might be audience who aren't unhappy with the extra social distancing)

So if you can afford not to take a refund, by all means do that  but maybe also try & let them know you're not coming, in case they're able to re-allocate your ticket?

Especially with smaller venues where they might actually be able to do that.


----------



## Ms Ordinary (Dec 13, 2021)

Also - this is more relevant to theatre stuff - there's lots of last-minute seat-filling at the moment as people cancel, if you're up for it.


----------



## BigMoaner (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> I’ve no idea where you are coming from with this. I’m not criticising anyone but those with disposable income who are petty enough to try and claw their money back while being aware of how precarious the industry is right now.


how about this.

you buy a ticket to a beloved act.

you forget that a large bill is due. large bill appears in account.

so you're suddenly skint. you then go and get your money back where you can.


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## ska invita (Dec 13, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> how about this.
> 
> you buy a ticket to a beloved act.
> 
> ...


i dont understand this argument

even if i havent got a big bill im not going to give a promoter £100 out of charity, "to keep the scene alive" supposedly.
sorry i need that money for life in general


----------



## BigMoaner (Dec 13, 2021)

ska invita said:


> i dont understand this argument
> 
> even if i havent got a big bill im not going to give a promoter £100 out of charity, "to keep the scene alive" supposedly.
> sorry i need that money for life in general



totally and utterly agree with you.


----------



## ska invita (Dec 13, 2021)

if they are offering refunds for whatever reason they can resell the ticket - i see no ethical problem.
Theres no refunds on events that go ahead as scheduled


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 13, 2021)

ska invita said:


> i dont understand this argument
> 
> even if i havent got a big bill im not going to give a promoter £100 out of charity, "to keep the scene alive" supposedly.
> sorry i need that money for life in general



Yes quite. If you want to donate some money to an act you can do it via Patreon (or even Spotify now) but I don't think buying a ticket comes with a moral responsibility to give them money if they don't keep up their end of the deal.


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## Voley (Dec 13, 2021)

Way things are going right now I'm not entirely confident about The Cure ticket I've just bought that's a whole fucking year away.


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## ska invita (Dec 13, 2021)

The last ticket I bought I paid a bit extra for "insurance" to be able to cancel and get refunded. I went.  

Buying tickets in advance, especially a long way off never fails to result with the day finally coming around and being inconvenient/a hassle! Would much prefer to pay on the door but now often the price goes up a lot for that, plus certain things have limited capacity


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 13, 2021)

Voley said:


> Way things are going right now I'm not entirely confident about The Cure ticket I've just bought that's a whole fucking year away.


I have tickets for Penn & Teller that have been rescheduled to June 2023. 

I reckon there’s still a chance it won’t happen


----------



## l'Otters (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan people have different budgeting priorities. 

I’ve been so skint I was only eating skipped food but I would spend money on gig or theatre tickets. I’ve bought tickets for plenty of events I hitchhiked to. 

The show I’m booked to go to next week, if I don’t go that’s £27 I’ve wasted. I’m not that skint these days but that’s still a significant chunk of money for me & while it didn’t occur to me I’d even be able to get it back, it’s going to hurt if I end up not going. 

I prioritise this kind of thing because actually going to these things will change my life, that’s why I budgeted for it all those years when I was living on fuck all.


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## Numbers (Dec 13, 2021)

Voley said:


> Way things are going right now I'm not entirely confident about The Cure ticket I've just bought that's a whole fucking year away.


<eek> we've got loads booked for next year. (Kurt Elling in Feb, QCBA & Omar in March, Abyssinians in May and George Benson in June).


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## Voley (Dec 13, 2021)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> I have tickets for Penn & Teller that have been rescheduled to June 2023.
> 
> I reckon there’s still a chance it won’t happen


It's mental isn't it? 

I'm not a festival goer any more but I'd be iffy about Glastonbury etc this time around too.

What a weird world we live in.


----------



## Voley (Dec 13, 2021)

Numbers said:


> <eek> we've got loads booked for next year. (Kurt Elling in Feb, QCBA & Omar in March, Abyssinians in May and George Benson in June).


Thing is, you've got to have some stuff to look forward to haven't you? I don't really want to put everything on hold again.


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## belboid (Dec 13, 2021)

I’ve not bothered getting a refund on a couple of things, small shows where the venue/performer might be in trouble losing the money.   Big shows? Fuck that, I’m getting my money back.


----------



## Numbers (Dec 13, 2021)

Voley said:


> Thing is, you've got to have some stuff to look forward to haven't you? I don't really want to put everything on hold again.


Totally agree mate, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.  
3 of the gigs are at the Jazz Cafe and the other at The Royal Albert Hall.


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## Voley (Dec 13, 2021)

Numbers said:


> Totally agree mate, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
> 3 of the gigs are at the Jazz Cafe and the other at The Royal Albert Hall.


I used to love seeing people at The Jazz Café. Gil Scott-Heron played a blinder there one night I went. Not exactly socially distanced though eh? That's sort of its charm really.


----------



## ska invita (Dec 13, 2021)

Voley said:


> I used to love seeing people at The Jazz Café. Gil Scott-Heron played a blinder there one night I went. Not exactly socially distanced though eh? That's sort of its charm really.


its having a really good spell under current magaemnet, some great bookings...the venue i go to most in London
But yeah, too covidy for me


----------



## Voley (Dec 13, 2021)

Anyhow.

Glastonbury 2022 definitely isn't happening. 

You read it here first.

<folds arms>


----------



## Looby (Dec 13, 2021)

ska invita said:


> if they are offering refunds for whatever reason they can resell the ticket - i see no ethical problem.
> Theres no refunds on events that go ahead as scheduled


Actually that’s not true. Ticketmaster have refunded tickets for people with covid, people isolating and in my case because the rules changed and there was no distancing or masks required and I’m CEV.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 13, 2021)

Went to a sold out rammed Little Simz gig n a student union last night!  
Some but hardly any masks


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## Numbers (Dec 13, 2021)

Voley said:


> I used to love seeing people at The Jazz Café. Gil Scott-Heron played a blinder there one night I went. Not exactly socially distanced though eh? That's sort of its charm really.


I love it there, we went to see Jarrod Lawson recently, probably 2 people in the crowd with masks so it felt like it could be a bit Covidy, we stood way back by the bar area on the far side of the venue and it felt better.   

There was no Omicron when we booked the 4 gigs I mentioned.


----------



## Voley (Dec 13, 2021)

Numbers said:


> I love it there, we went to see Jarrod Lawson recently, probably 2 people in the crowd with masks so it felt like it could be a bit Covidy, we stood way back by the bar area on the far side of the venue and it felt better.
> 
> There was no Omicron when we booked the 4 gigs I mentioned.


I lived in Camden for a while so used to go there on a Sunday lunchtime after a wander round the market. A quid to get in. House band, Tomorrow's Warriors on, anyone could sit in. I saw a woman get up and sing God Bless The Child with them once and she totally blew everyone away with her amazing voice. Brilliant thing to watch: a bunch of blokes who'd never met her before; let alone played a song together; but by the end of the song they were all in awe.

I do miss London for stuff like that.


----------



## _Russ_ (Dec 13, 2021)

ddraig said:


> Went to a sold out rammed Little Simz gig n a student union last night!
> Some but hardly any masks


Were you surprised?


----------



## ddraig (Dec 13, 2021)

_Russ_ said:


> Were you surprised?


nope


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

ska invita said:


> i dont understand this argument
> 
> even if i havent got a big bill im not going to give a promoter £100 out of charity, "to keep the scene alive" supposedly.
> sorry i need that money for life in general


Why not? I’ve been doing that for my local cinema while it’s closed for refurbishment. If I can’t make a screening, I only get my money back from the multiplex but not the independent.


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## belboid (Dec 13, 2021)

Residents gig that was meant to be next Feb now pushed back to Feb 2023


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## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

TopCat said:


> Hows the hANGOVER?


Whose? I didn’t have one. It was a school night!


----------



## Looby (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Why not? I’ve been doing that for my local cinema while it’s closed for refurbishment. If I can’t make a screening, I only get my money back from the multiplex but not the independent.


So your argument only applies to small, independent venues then? 
It’s ok that we claim refunds from O2 or agents like See Tickets?


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## Numbers (Dec 13, 2021)

Voley said:


> I lived in Camden for a while so used to go there on a Sunday lunchtime after a wander round the market. A quid to get in. House band, Tomorrow's Warriors on, anyone could sit in. I saw a woman get up and sing God Bless The Child with them once and she totally blew everyone away with her amazing voice. Brilliant thing to watch: a bunch of blokes who'd never met her before; let alone played a song together; but by the end of the song they were all in awe.
> 
> I do miss London for stuff like that.


I lived in Tufnell Park for a bit and used to do similar


----------



## ska invita (Dec 13, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Why not? I’ve been doing that for my local cinema while it’s closed for refurbishment. If I can’t make a screening, I only get my money back from the multiplex but not the independent.



It's up to you who you give your money to as charity, just as it is me. If you want to give charitably to cinemas knock yourself out. 


Voley said:


> I lived in Camden for a while so used to go there on a Sunday lunchtime after a wander round the market. A quid to get in. House band, Tomorrow's Warriors on, anyone could sit in. I saw a woman get up and sing God Bless The Child with them once and she totally blew everyone away with her amazing voice. Brilliant thing to watch: a bunch of blokes who'd never met her before; let alone played a song together; but by the end of the song they were all in awe.
> 
> I do miss London for stuff like that.


Tomorrows Warriors is an amazing incubator for bringing up new talent. Proper grass roots project, run by the bass player from Jazz Jamaica iirc , and his partner (iirc)


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

Looby said:


> So your argument only applies to small, independent venues then?
> It’s ok that we claim refunds from O2 or agents like See Tickets?


Sure - scam the fuck out of them!


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 13, 2021)

ska invita said:


> It's up to you who you give your money to as charity, just as it is me. If you want to give charitably to cinemas knock yourself out.
> 
> Tomorrows Warriors is an amazing incubator for bringing up new talent. Proper grass roots project, run by the bass player from Jazz Jamaica iirc , and his partner (iirc)


A lot of arts venues are charities btw


----------



## Johnny Vodka (Dec 13, 2021)

I had a Jessie Ware gig cancelled last week because one of team Jessie caught covid.  The Streets are cancelling next year's gigs - I was going to see them in Feb.  At this rate, not sure when my first post lockdown gig will be.  I suspect a lot of artists will cancel stuff for this winter/spring, maybe even more likely if they're not from the UK.


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## Mation (Dec 14, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> People must have known that things might change when they bought the tickets. Sorry but if you can afford to spend £20 on a ticket, you can afford to lose it


I can imagine some people impulse buying a ticket they can't really afford in a fuck it, I haven't done anything nice for two years way. But then, when it's cancelled (or postponed, rather), sobering up and thinking, actually, I really should be sensible and pay the rent now...


----------



## pesh (Dec 14, 2021)

i can't honestly imagine anyone risking eviction to go see Mike Skinner in 2022.


----------



## Johnny Doe (Dec 14, 2021)

pesh said:


> i can't honestly imagine anyone risking eviction to go see Mike Skinner in 2022.


Indeed. I suggest that they don't mug themselves


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 14, 2021)




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## belboid (Dec 16, 2021)

Both my next week gigs at the Leadmill have just cancelled.  I'm only surprised it has taken this long.  

They're still selling tickets for an afterparty thing the next night though.


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Dec 16, 2021)

Currently dealing with my last show of the year. In theory we have an orchestra in the hall on Sunday evening but apparently their management are meeting this evening to decide if it’s going ahead or not. Either way, one of my tech team is looking after that one so not my problem


----------



## elbows (Dec 21, 2021)

I've previously had all sorts of reasons to be rude about Lloyd-Webber in this pandemic, but it seems that this time even he has managed to put out a statement that doesnt involve being an idiot and a disgusting threat to public health.









						Omicron: Andrew Lloyd Webber halts Cinderella musical until February
					

The West End musical will return "as soon as this wave is licked", the composer and producer says.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Badgers (Dec 22, 2021)

elbows said:


> I've previously had all sorts of reasons to be rude about Lloyd-Webber in this pandemic, but it seems that this time even he has managed to put out a statement that doesnt involve being an idiot and a disgusting threat to public health.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I heard a lot of the cast have Covid?


----------



## Cerv (Jan 14, 2022)

Mogwai have just postponed their Ally Pally gig next month to May. 
bit of a bugger cos it clashes with Wide Awake festival now. have to decide which to miss


----------



## eightball (Jan 15, 2022)

The Streets gig in Manchester, was postponed, now cancelled ☹


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Jan 15, 2022)

I’m hearing of so many shows being canned at the moment, often right at the last minute. It’s not restrictions, just the sheer number of people testing positive.

I’ve had three events needing to go online this week at work.


----------



## Mogden (Jan 15, 2022)

My Henry Rollins gig next month was full on cancelled. Money back in my account a whisper after the message. And that's just Hank chatting, not lots of sweaty bodies slithering in a mosh pit. I'm gutted cos he's quite mesmerising and a damn fine story teller.


----------



## _Russ_ (Jan 15, 2022)

eightball said:


> The Streets gig in Manchester, was postponed, now cancelled ☹


Dry your eyes mate


----------



## spitfire (Jan 15, 2022)

I’ve got IDLES on Monday. Still on and I’m going. Double jabbed and had COVID before Xmas so I should be ok. Shouldn’t I? 

So did Mlle Fire and if the nipper hasn’t had it already then I’d be amazed. Might have been asymptomatic.


----------



## spitfire (Jan 15, 2022)

COVIDLES


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 17, 2022)

We're still lined up (Xmas present from festivaldeb!) for Mark Chadwick** (Levellers main man!) at the ultra-conspranoid, frequently anti-vaccination-rantimg  town of Glastonbury on Saturday 29th January! 

**Hope no-one saw that pre-edit 

At least I know which nutter-avoiding pubs, etc., to get to, there!


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 17, 2022)

Anyway, to *anyone*  still suggesting that Glastonbury 2022 won't happen, fuck that shit maaan!!!!! 

Happenng, or I'll be seriously depressed  

But in a *very undepressed* way ATM, I'm _actively_ confident that we'll be there. 

The *only* place to be, this coming June.

June this year even!


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 17, 2022)

Just under six months away FFS!!!


----------



## mx wcfc (Jan 17, 2022)

and GlastonWICK just announced as well.  Smaller though.


I am a little concerned about Attila though.  He's dropping the colour coded paper tickets, posted to you in a hand written envelope, and we are getting_ electronic tickets_ instead.  They'll be taking cards at the bar next.  Is nothing sacrosanct?


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 22, 2022)

mx wcfc said:


> and GlastonWICK just announced as well.  Smaller though.
> 
> 
> I am a little concerned about Attila though.  He's dropping the colour coded paper tickets, posted to you in a hand written envelope, and we are getting_ electronic tickets_ instead.  They'll be taking cards at the bar next.  Is nothing sacrosanct?



He just tested positive an hour ago-ish


----------



## mx wcfc (Jan 22, 2022)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> He just tested positive an hour ago-ish


That’s not good with his copd. I’ll pop over to FB.


----------



## Mation (Feb 16, 2022)

Mation said:


> When this is all sufficiently over, can you put on a great big fuck off Offline, with urbanites as a priority, please? So we can all have a roaring twenties catch-up?


Feeling sad that, a year later, this still doesn't seem possible indoors yet, but might it work somewhere outdoors, editor?


----------



## editor (Feb 16, 2022)

Mation said:


> Feeling sad that, a year later, this still doesn't seem possible indoors yet, but might it work somewhere outdoors, editor?


There's nowhere outdoors that I could imagine would work I'm afraid, least not anywhere remotely near me.

I am definitely considering an indoor one later this year though because that's the only way I can see myself having a relatively stress free night where I'm able to raise money for charities.


----------



## Orang Utan (Mar 18, 2022)

I’m supposed to be having a dance tonight at Wire in Leeds as Objek is playing but am having the collywobbles now and may chicken out. Could do with the release though. Haven’t had a dance amongst comrades for over 2 years


----------



## pogofish (Apr 1, 2022)

The opera singers are back in action at work.  The rehearsal room is in full swing, with the windows wide open and I can currently hear somebody murdering In the Sally Garden..!

Normality..!


----------



## muscovyduck (Apr 1, 2022)

Doesn't seem like anyone can get even the tiniest thing off the ground where I live at the moment. Nearly everything gets cancelled last minute


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (Apr 1, 2022)

I’m still planning/setting up tech to allow for remote presenters at every single event I’m involved with at the moment. At almost every event it’s been needed. Still huge numbers of people having to change at the last minute due to being positive.


----------



## killer b (Apr 1, 2022)

Should be less of a problem now everyone is going to just soldier on with a 'cold' instead of testing to see if it's covid.


----------



## elbows (Jun 13, 2022)

Since Lloyd Webber featured in this thread in the past for various wanky and badly timed pandemic stances, I thought I might as well post this here.

I file his pandemic story and stance under 'wanted to have his cake and eat it and suffered the entirely predictable consequences every step of the way'.









						‘A costly mistake’: Andrew Lloyd Webber booed as Cinderella closes in West End
					

Composer penned a letter read out at the final performance, praising ‘superb’ team but prompting criticism from some audience members




					www.theguardian.com
				






> In the letter, the composer praised a “fabulous cast, crew and musicians” and “the superb creative team” and repeated his previous assertion that he had “kept the government’s feet to the flame” during the Covid crisis in which the theatre industry weathered shutdowns, restricted capacities and severe financial difficulties.
> 
> The letter continued: “I keep thinking, if only we had opened three months later we wouldn’t have had to postpone our opening twice because of Covid. If only we hadn’t had to close for a month over Christmas and New Year, once again thanks to Covid. And if only we had had a crumb of help from [the government’s culture recovery fund], I promise you we would have been here for a very long while to come.”


----------



## ska invita (Jun 13, 2022)

elbows said:


> Since Lloyd Webber featured in this thread in the past for various wanky and badly timed pandemic stances, I thought I might as well post this here.
> 
> I file his pandemic story and stance under 'wanted to have his cake and eat it and suffered the entirely predictable consequences every step of the way'.
> 
> ...


Other shows that opened the same time, like the Bob Marley musical, are doing great with bookings into 2023.... Im reading into this that the reason Cinderella closed it's because people don't want to spend so much money to see it


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 14, 2022)

Just so people know (belatedly). *And I'd prefer not to comment/condemn/endorse* any of this at all. Zero emojis from me, for once!

With our Zoom training for us Glastonbury Info Crew the other weekenf (three weeks ago),  there was  talk about self-testing for Covid in advance of crew getting on-site. And mention of 'taking care' generally.

But, apparantly, no proof of negative LF Test result required to get onto site. I re-checked this afterwards on-line, but no.

Either for crew (early entry), or public ticket-holders, (who in general, mainly enter site on Wednesday 23rd June)

And, as far as I could tell from the training, more-or-less *zero* restrictions on-site in general, throughout the festival, for anyone.

Biggest Festival in Europe, city the zize/population of Bath for a week, etc.

Better drink plenty of cider, while not on duty, then!

At least there'll be  a large Field Hospital uphill, and a professionally-run and well-staffed 24-hour Medical Centre as well.

ETA : And plenty of wandering parademics.


----------



## Cerv (Jun 14, 2022)

Please tell me you meant Wed 22nd June?
Nearly shat myself there thinking I’ve fucked my train tickets up.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jun 14, 2022)

William of Walworth 
well, both bearded theory and glastonwick seem to have been fairly good as spreader events so this will just be a version on steroids.
It's ok though, in the words of savid javid: "we're out of the pandemic now it is endemic" _insert a bazillion facepalm emojis here_


----------



## mx wcfc (Jun 14, 2022)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> William of Walworth
> well, both bearded theory and glastonwick seem to have been fairly good as spreader events


Attila has it now. He reckons it was Glastonwick where he got it. It’s buggered his European tour.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jun 14, 2022)

mx wcfc said:


> Attila has it now. He reckons it was Glastonwick where he got it. It’s buggered his European tour.


Oh, I thought he had caught it not long ago already, but maybe I misremember, a couple of friend of mine caught it there too, testing negative as of today so catching up with them on Friday before they go back down under.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 15, 2022)

Cerv said:


> Please tell me you meant Wed 22nd June?
> Nearly shat myself there thinking I’ve fucked my train tickets up.


I've just edited my above post to correct it!! 

Yes, the correct entry date for public ticket-holders first entering *GLastonbury 2022!*, really will  be *Wedfnesday 22nd June!   *


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 15, 2022)

Just seen the above about Attila  

I'd be surprised if he hadn't also had gigs lined up at Glastonbury itself, which no doubt will now be cancelled  .... unless he recovers in time


----------



## Orang Utan (Jun 25, 2022)

in for FreeRotation next month - any Urbanites going?


----------



## kalidarkone (Jun 25, 2022)

Orang Utan said:


> in for FreeRotation next month - any Urbanites going?


Great location.....I'm going there for Truefest in August.


----------



## killer b (Jun 25, 2022)

Orang Utan said:


> in for FreeRotation next month - any Urbanites going?


Sort us out with an invite and I'll come!


----------



## Orang Utan (Jun 26, 2022)

killer b said:


> Sort us out with an invite and I'll come!


it'll be my second, so I think I shall be able to send you one for next year?
I only got in this year by hook and by crook as I missed the short ticket selling window - even getting to that stage is a lottery, even for people who've been going for years or even played!


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## ddraig (Jun 26, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> Great location.....I'm going there for Truefest in August.


Meant to be playing again, waiting for info, see ya there!


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## killer b (Jun 26, 2022)

Orang Utan said:


> it'll be my second, so I think I shall be able to send you one for next year?
> I only got in this year by hook and by crook as I missed the short ticket selling window - even getting to that stage is a lottery, even for people who've been going for years or even played!


I've checked the dates and can't come this year anyway, but defo up for it next time...


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## Orang Utan (Jun 26, 2022)

killer b said:


> I've checked the dates and can't come this year anyway, but defo up for it next time...


Aye, will do - might need reminding though.
This is this year's line up but a lot of them are regulars who play most years:



Spoiler: niche gossip



(btw, in information of interest to probably just you and me I only got in this year cos Paddy from Gnod dropped out - think he was supposed to be playing with Transcendence Orchestra - maybe I should bring my trumpet and offer to join in)


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## Looby (Jul 5, 2022)

Long shot but does anyone have a phone number or any contacts for End Of The Road festival? We can’t go this year because our dog is ill and we’re into week 3 of trying to sort out selling our tickets through their resale agents.
They’re not replying to emails and now we’re really desperate to sort it. It’s actually making me feel really stressed and anxious now.


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## belboid (Jul 5, 2022)

Looby said:


> Long shot but does anyone have a phone number or any contacts for End Of The Road festival? We can’t go this year because our dog is ill and we’re into week 3 of trying to sort out selling our tickets through their resale agents.
> They’re not replying to emails and now we’re really desperate to sort it. It’s actually making me feel really stressed and anxious now.


+44 7817 451112 - tho it is probably the number for an accountant/whoever filed their paperwork


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## Looby (Jul 5, 2022)

belboid said:


> +44 7817 451112 - tho it is probably the number for an accountant/whoever filed their paperwork


Thanks! I’m going to make my husband phone. 😄


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## Looby (Jul 5, 2022)

The Twitter and Facebook DMs might have worked as they’ve just allowed me to list the tickets, finally.


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## beesonthewhatnow (Aug 1, 2022)

For once, a cancellation that isn’t covid. It’s far more ridiculous  









						Georgia's Gun Laws Are Forcing Atlanta's Midtown Music Festival to Cancel This Year
					

The annual event takes place in Piedmont Park, a public space where guns are permitted and a short-term tenant of that property can’t enforce its own ban




					www.rollingstone.com


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