# Help me out here if you can, I've been robbed



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

So I applied for a sameday loan because the ESA had totally stalled me. It was refused. OK thought I, I'll just go without. Which I did. But apparently the T&c's I clicked OK to allow them to share my bank details with some third party who have seen fit to take a 'brokers fee' of 70 quid out of my dole! WTF is this shit. So I have spoken to the barclays lady and she says under the CCA I can ask for my money back as the third party has not negotiated a loan at all and its within a 14 day period. I have emailed the scum informing them of my desire to be reunited with my stolen p's.

What do I do if they boy me? How can I escalate the matter? Its only 70 odd quid but I need it


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## fractionMan (Sep 4, 2014)

How is that not theft?  Scumbags.


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## dessiato (Sep 4, 2014)

Do you have a Citizen's Advice centre near you? I know a lot have been closed, but I would expect that they have experience of dealing with this type of situation. Sorry I don't have anything else to suggest.


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## J Ed (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> So I applied for a sameday loan because the ESA had totally stalled me. It was refused. OK thought I, I'll just go without. Which I did. But apparently the T&c's I clicked OK to allow them to share my bank details with some third party who have seen fit to take a 'brokers fee' of 70 quid out of my dole! WTF is this shit. So I have spoken to the barclays lady and she says under the CCA I can ask for my money back as the third party has not negotiated a loan at all and its within a 14 day period. I have emailed the scum informing them of my desire to be reunited with my stolen p's.
> 
> What do I do if they boy me? How can I escalate the matter? Its only 70 odd quid but I need it



How are they taking the money out of your account? Is it by direct debit or by card payment? If it's by direct debit ask the bank for a direct debit indemnity to get your money back. If it's by a card payment then go into a branch or call your bank ASAP and ask them to stop all recurring card payments to this company, tell them that you have spoken with the company, have not received goods or services promised and want to raise the payment as a dispute.


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## J Ed (Sep 4, 2014)

fractionMan said:


> How is that not theft?  Scumbags.



It is theft, these companies do not give a fuck, all of these loan shark companies operate on this sort of basis.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

J Ed said:


> How are they taking the money out of your account? Is it by direct debit or by card payment? If it's by direct debit ask the bank for a direct debit indemnity to get your money back. If it's by a card payment then go into a branch or call your bank ASAP and ask them to stop all recurring card payments to this company, tell them that you have spoken with the company, have not received goods or services promised and want to raise the payment as a dispute.




I've rung them and raised the dispute (my bank, barclays. I know, I know they are evil). I asked if they would be able to fight my corner for me but apparently because there is a clause in the T&C's allowing the loan company to pass my details on too a third party who charge an unasked for brokarage fee for a loan I haven't had, it's technically legal. Even the barclays lady said 'I know its morally wrong but legally this is OK'. The fucking thieves.


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## Blagsta (Sep 4, 2014)

Phone National Debtline. They've been very helpful to me in the past.


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## fractionMan (Sep 4, 2014)

You're right about the direct debit thing.  I've been down the bank before, told them the debit was invalid/not wanted/whatever and they credited the money straight back into my account.

I'm guessing this wasn't a direct debit though.


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## fractionMan (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> I've rung them and raised the dispute (my bank, barclays. I know, I know they are evil). I asked if they would be able to fight my corner for me but apparently because there is a clause in the T&C's allowing the loan company to pass my details on too a third party who charge an unasked for brokarage fee for a loan I haven't had, it's technically legal. Even the barclays lady said 'I know its morally wrong but legally this is OK'. The fucking thieves.



This has to be bollocks.  By the same right they could charge you 1000 pounds brokerage.  They don't though, because they know that would cause a shit storm and people would take them to court.  So instead they charge 70 which makes it almost pointless to go after them via small claims court or whatever.


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## J Ed (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> I've rung them and raised the dispute (my bank, barclays. I know, I know they are evil). I asked if they would be able to fight my corner for me but apparently because there is a clause in the T&C's allowing the loan company to pass my details on too a third party who charge an unasked for brokarage fee for a loan I haven't had, it's technically legal. Even the barclays lady said 'I know its morally wrong but legally this is OK'. The fucking thieves.



To be honest you are probably not going to get your money back I'm afraid, IME very few of these cases are resolved in favour of the customer. Have you got them to stop the recurring card payments yet though? If not you really need to do that ASAP, once these companies have your details they don't tend to stop at taking one payment out and you have to fight to get any more payments back.


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## friedaweed (Sep 4, 2014)

Utter cunts

No advise mate but you have my sympathy. I've been trying to find out why I've got a shiny new betfair casino account registered with and emptied my CC this week myself It seems it could take up to 4 weeks for me. I hope you get that 70 back soon. 

Have you asked the robbers yet?


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## Callie (Sep 4, 2014)

Fucking hell. Kill them. Unbelievable, I have no advice but shitting hell


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> So I applied for a sameday loan because the ESA had totally stalled me. It was refused. OK thought I, I'll just go without. Which I did. But apparently the T&c's I clicked OK to allow them to share my bank details with some third party who have seen fit to take a 'brokers fee' of 70 quid out of my dole! WTF is this shit. So I have spoken to the barclays lady and she says under the CCA I can ask for my money back as the third party has not negotiated a loan at all and its within a 14 day period. I have emailed the scum informing them of my desire to be reunited with my stolen p's.
> 
> What do I do if they boy me? How can I escalate the matter? Its only 70 odd quid but I need it


hammer > kneecaps*

_____
*in some jurisdictions this may be illegal; check with a notary or solicitor


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> So I applied for a sameday loan because the ESA had totally stalled me. It was refused. OK thought I, I'll just go without. Which I did. But apparently the T&c's I clicked OK to allow them to share my bank details with some third party who have seen fit to take a 'brokers fee' of 70 quid out of my dole! WTF is this shit. So I have spoken to the barclays lady and she says under the CCA I can ask for my money back as the third party has not negotiated a loan at all and its within a 14 day period. I have emailed the scum informing them of my desire to be reunited with my stolen p's.
> 
> What do I do if they boy me? How can I escalate the matter? Its only 70 odd quid but I need it



What was the exact wording of the T & Cs that allowed them to share your bank details?  It would be worth scrutinising them to see if they are technically right, or if they are pushing their luck in taking the money. 

If you agreed (albeit unwittingly) to them acting as a broker for this loan, and it was refused, then are you obliged to accept them as a broker in order to apply to this loan company for the loan?  If you aren't, then wouldn't you have unwittingly entered into a contract with this broker for goods and services, and therefore what exactly have they furnished you in terms of goods and services that warrants this fee?


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

I would be contacting trading standards as a matter of urgency too.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> So I applied for a sameday loan because the ESA had totally stalled me. It was refused. OK thought I, I'll just go without. Which I did. But apparently the T&c's I clicked OK to allow them to share my bank details with some third party who have seen fit to take a 'brokers fee' of 70 quid out of my dole! WTF is this shit. So I have spoken to the barclays lady and she says under the CCA I can ask for my money back as the third party has not negotiated a loan at all and its within a 14 day period. I have emailed the scum informing them of my desire to be reunited with my stolen p's.
> 
> What do I do if they boy me? How can I escalate the matter? Its only 70 odd quid but I need it


I think you should name the scum who sold your details and the third party. We can then collectively look for similar examples and what people did/outcomes etc


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## two sheds (Sep 4, 2014)

Write them an e-mail of complaint, and put a lot of text at the bottom about this e-mail being confidential etc etc etc and at the bottom of the boring text have a sentence in 2-point that says if they reply that will authorize you to charge them £100 as a contact fee for every e-mail you write them. 

I'd contact Which and people too. Disgusting behaviour.


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## fractionMan (Sep 4, 2014)

I wouldn't be surprised if this 'third party' was owned by the exact same people.


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## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> I've rung them and raised the dispute (my bank, barclays. I know, I know they are evil). I asked if they would be able to fight my corner for me but apparently because there is a clause in the T&C's allowing the loan company to pass my details on too a third party who charge an unasked for brokarage fee for a loan I haven't had, it's technically legal. Even the barclays lady said 'I know its morally wrong but legally this is OK'. The fucking thieves.


I don't think this is right - that it's legal. Unless it is specified in the T&Cs that you will be paying a broker's fee whether or not the loan is approved, they can't legally charge you. I'm pretty certain you cannot be charged fees that you haven't been told you'll be charged.


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## fractionMan (Sep 4, 2014)

"We will charge you an unspecified amount for a service you didn't ask for and we didn't deliver" doesn't sound legal to me.


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## wiskey (Sep 4, 2014)

I definitely think you should name them... What scum.


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## xenon (Sep 4, 2014)

Scum. Utter filthy robbing scum


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

I found this old thread on a consumer forum which seems to cover the same ground, so this might be useful DotCommunist 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?298967-EZE-Loans-Broker-fee


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## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

btw, bank people are not good at this stuff. Don't take their word for it that it's legal.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

fractionMan said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if this 'third party' was owned by the exact same people.


That's exactly what i'm thinking - and i reckon other people may have done some investigating already...


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

How can a third party have 'brokered' a loan you were refused?  

This is a scam.


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## StoneRoad (Sep 4, 2014)

My symapthies, DotCommunist , that is truly 'orrible - I can't work out how it is legal - you didn't get any *service* from the broker ????
Local newspaper / freebies / TV&Radio (BBC's you&yours have a fraud desk), MP, councillors, who in parliament is dealing with "payday loans*" ( *who are real scum) CAB, any of the money advice sites and anyone else who might give publicity.
Also, escalate the complaint at Barclays into the banking system ("you're not happy with the response")


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

wiskey said:


> I definitely think you should name them... What scum.



I agree.  Then we can start doing some digging to find any useful advice about them.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

Its wizzcash

they passed my details onto myloannow.com

here is the email response to my request for payback



> Thank you for your email.
> 
> I am unable to find an application on the system under your details.
> 
> ...








			
				me said:
			
		

> Your company was forwarded the details of my bank account from Wizzzcash.com. I know it was your company that has taken this fee because I spoke to a barclays accounts person on the telephone and she told me the name of the company that has taken a brokerage fee from me. If you had the werewithal to take my money you should have the appropriate details to pay it back? Do I need to have Barclays pull a record of the transaction in order for your company to refund it?


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## savoloysam (Sep 4, 2014)

fractionMan said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if this 'third party' was owned by the exact same people.



Exactly. Charge for a loan application and then turn it down. Nice little earner for the scumbags.

Hope you get you money back. £70 when you're on benefit is not "just £70" especially when you're having to beg for loans from wankers!


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

Wizzcash have a Twitter account by the way, and they might not like complaints being aired publically at being scumbags.  @wizzcashloans


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## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

You will get it back, DC, if you keep pushing. Sounds to me like they are trying it on and relying on people not pushing.

Fuckers should be in jail.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

I can't see any direct obvious crossover between the two companies/parent companies

The brokers
The loaners


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## savoloysam (Sep 4, 2014)

Do you have a baseball bat spare....

Domain name:
 myloan.co.uk

 Registrant:
 Loan Marketing Limited

 Registrant type:
 UK Public Limited Company, (Company number: 7197002)

 Registrant's address:
 5300 Lakeside
 Cheadle Royal Business Park
 Manchester
 SK8 3GP
 United Kingdom


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

I've had a look for refunds in relation to myloannow, and this page comes up. 

https://myloan-now.co.uk/refund.php?pop=Y

It says you can get the refund by writing with the details to yet another loan company, this time based in Bury.  They must all be owned by the same overall company, as this wouldn't make sense otherwise.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> I've had a look for refunds in relation to myloannow, and this page comes up.
> 
> https://myloan-now.co.uk/refund.php?pop=Y
> 
> It says you can get the refund by writing with the details to yet another loan company, this time based in Bury.  They must all be owned by the same overall company, as this wouldn't make sense otherwise.


They don't seem connected on the surface either...


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

This on mse seems to be the exact same theft.


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> They don't seem connected on the surface either...


http://companycheck.co.uk/director/index


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

savoloysam said:


> Do you have a baseball bat spare....
> 
> Domain name:
> myloan.co.uk
> ...



Interestingly, but perhaps not surprisingly, this company is registered in the Isle of Man.


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

savoloysam said:


> Do you have a baseball bat spare....
> 
> Domain name:
> myloan.co.uk
> ...


doubtless what the loan would have paid for


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## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> This on mse seems to be the exact same theft.


Clear as fucking mud, those t&cs.

This appears to be the relevant bit:



> If You do not enter into a loan offered by lender or financier within the 6 months that we act for You. We will refund the fee less than the £5 brokerage fee provided for by the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Refunds must be requested in writing to avoid repayments being sent to a wrong address.



Are these the same T&Cs you had, DC? If so, it appears that they are saying they will refund you £65 after 6 months. I'd still kick up a stink and try to get all of it asap.

Some right twats on that forum.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

StoneRoad said:


> Also, escalate the complaint at Barclays into the banking system ("you're not happy with the response")



Threaten to contact the ombudsman. That usually gets things moving in a positive direction.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Clear as fucking mud, those t&cs.
> 
> This appears to be the relevant bit:
> 
> ...


Thread ends with people getting money back minus a fiver anyway- some within a few days, some months later.


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> They don't seem connected on the surface either...



I'm no expert on company structures, but it does seem odd that there seems to be a web of different company names involved here.  I suspect its probably very difficult to find out for certain if there are any links between them.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

Even with the refund, these scumbags are just going around legally nicking fivers out of poor peoples accounts.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

And earning interest on the rest of the loot as it sits for six months waiting to be refunded.


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## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> And earning interest on the rest of the loot as it sits for six months waiting to be refunded.


Using the money to loan it out several times at 1000000000s percent pa interest. Taking money from very poor people to lend it out at exorbitant rates to slightly less poor people.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Parasites. The real face of capital.


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> I'm no expert on company structures, but it does seem odd that there seems to be a web of different company names involved here.  I suspect its probably very difficult to find out for certain if there are any links between them.


it doesn't seem in the least bit odd to me, as this is the way they organise this sort of thing. but with http://companycheck.co.uk/ and http://companycheck.co.uk/director/index you should be able to puzzle out the structure. maybe also with a few quid to companies house. and a trip to the library to see http://www.dataresources.co.uk/contents/en-uk/d191_Who_owns_Whom.html


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## Quartz (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> So I applied for a sameday loan because the ESA had totally stalled me. It was refused. OK thought I, I'll just go without. Which I did. But apparently the T&c's I clicked OK to allow them to share my bank details with some third party who have seen fit to take a 'brokers fee' of 70 quid out of my dole! WTF is this shit.



This is a scam and was on the TV recently. A friend was caught out by it. She got her money back.


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## Quartz (Sep 4, 2014)

Specifically, it was on STV on the 26th or 27th of August.


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> it doesn't seem in the least bit odd to me, as this is the way they organise this sort of thing. but with http://companycheck.co.uk/ and http://companycheck.co.uk/director/index you should be able to puzzle out the structure. maybe also with a few quid to companies house. and a trip to the library to see http://www.dataresources.co.uk/contents/en-uk/d191_Who_owns_Whom.html



It could be that they charge the brokerage fee on behalf of another (linked) company, who then loans that money back to the original company who use it as loan capital to lend out, and repays the other company from the receipts from debtors.  Possibly a way to control financial liability by passing money back and forth between various companies.


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> It could be that they charge the brokerage fee on behalf of another (linked) company, who then loans that money back to the original company who use it as loan capital to lend out, and repays the other company from the receipts from debtors.  Possibly a way to control financial liability by passing money back and forth between various companies.


yeh, you're right i think - it's to bamboozle the claimants.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

Quartz said:


> Specifically, it was on STV on the 26th or 27th of August.


Info - not quite the exact same but similar. That's about brokers posing as lenders. Here's CAS on it.


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> yeh, you're right i think - it's to bamboozle the claimants.



It wouldn't be much different to what the large companies do, with various holding companies and other spin-offs, all legal but still confusing to anyone else trying to work out what the hell is going on.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

am just on hold to cancel my card-yet more p's i cannot afford. have shotted all current funds over to mas account so there ain't nothing for the bastards to rob again


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> am just on hold to cancel my card-yet more p's i cannot afford. have shotted all current funds over to mas account so there ain't nothing for the bastards to rob again


this is another reason why you should have a couple of bank a/cs


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## Wilf (Sep 4, 2014)

Sorry DC, nothing constructive to add, just wanted to say this is really shit for you (along with them being exactly the kind of scummy parasites that flourish in IDS Britain).  Ombudsman + maximum publicity seems like the best route.  Don't think I've suggested this _ever_, but even getting your MP involved if they are anything other than the usual sack of supine shit.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

My mam got scammed at a car park recently (the ticket machine refunded half the cash she put in then she got a £100 fine for having the wrong ticket!) and her local MP has taken it on. She is mates with his wife though.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

cunts want a bank statement showing the theivery. Which I can't get till the 11th. Total wankers

if it wasn't for the good heart of people on here  I'd be in proper dire straits right now. Thieving pricks.


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## twentythreedom (Sep 4, 2014)

What utter fucking cunts 

If you're in the shit DC and need a few quid to tide you over, PM me.

I wonder how many people are victims of the same fuckery who get left with no dollar for food etc. Utter, utter shitcuntitude. Good luck DC


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

I can't bend my head around it at all. Someone sets up a company that exploits the predicament of the poor by lending small amounts of cash for large amounts of interest that people will use when desperate. That's cuntery.

But they don't even do that. They drop the promise of quick cash into the pond as bait and then when they get a bite they just TAKE money from someone who is already in a financial hole.

This is cuntery on a different level. The zenith. The summit. They deserve accelerant and a match.


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## twentythreedom (Sep 4, 2014)

How the hell can doing that sort of thing be legal? Boggles the mind.


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## Looby (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> cunts want a bank statement showing the theivery. Which I can't get till the 11th. Total wankers
> 
> if it wasn't for the good heart of people on here  I'd be in proper dire straits right now. Thieving pricks.



Have you got online banking? Or could your bank print off/email a record of the transaction?


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## Looby (Sep 4, 2014)

Maybe the CAB could help.


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## Dovydaitis (Sep 4, 2014)

I have some empty bottles, fuel, rags and some matches just lying around if you can think of a use?


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## BigTom (Sep 4, 2014)

Financial Services Authority?

I would say def. contact your MP about this, they have the power to change the law to make this illegal, even if they probably won't.


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

Dovydaitis said:


> I have some empty bottles, fuel, rags and some matches just lying around if you can think of a use?


if you had some inflammable liquid you could use the bottles to transport it but without that they're useless. smash, brush up and put in bin.


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## Quartz (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> cunts want a bank statement showing the theivery. Which I can't get till the 11th.



Can you not get a mini-statement from a cash machine? Can you go to your local bank and get them to print one off?


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## Treacle Toes (Sep 4, 2014)

Quartz said:


> Can you not get a mini-statement from a cash machine? Can you go to your local bank and get them to print one off?



You can go to a branch and use the account manager machine for statements.


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## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

twentythreedom said:


> What utter fucking cunts
> 
> If you're in the shit DC and need a few quid to tide you over, PM me.
> 
> I wonder how many people are victims of the same fuckery who get left with no dollar for food etc. Utter, utter shitcuntitude. Good luck DC



Me too - if you need a few quid to help out PM me.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

Quartz said:


> Can you not get a mini-statement from a cash machine? Can you go to your local bank and get them to print one off?




the man on the phone said that the transaction won't show till the 11nth because its held in a period untill its confirmed as gone. I don't really get how this is the case, but apparently it is


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## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

one love to all your kind offers of help btw, but another urb has already helped me out. You people are too kind to me. If you need a love poem or a character assassination doing, you know who to call on.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Go and speak with the bank manager and demand a statement. If he refuses tell him you'll contact the ombudsman. I'm not lying when I say the prospect of that will bother him. I would also consider making it a criminal matter. Tell the bank the funds were extracted without your authorisation.


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Go and speak with the bank manager and demand a statement. If he refuses tell him you'll contact the ombudsman. I'm not lying when I say the prospect of that will bother him. I would also consider making it a criminal matter. Tell the bank the funds were extracted without your authorisation.


there are no bank managers any longer


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> one love to all your kind offers of help btw, but another urb has already helped me out. You people are too kind to me. If you need a love poem or a character assassination doing, you know who to call on.


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## Looby (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Go and speak with the bank manager and demand a statement. If he refuses tell him you'll contact the ombudsman. I'm not lying when I say the prospect of that will bother him. I would also consider making it a criminal matter. Tell the bank the funds were extracted without your authorisation.



If the transaction is 'pending' then it won't appear on a statement. 

I find it bizarre that the bank won't reverse it though.


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## Pingu (Sep 4, 2014)




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## Quartz (Sep 4, 2014)

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/

From: http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/consumer/complaints.htm



> *1. get in touch with your bank, insurance company or finance firm*
> It's important that you tell the business you're unhappy with – and give them a chance to look into your problem. Under the rules they have eight weeks to do this.
> 
> We can help by contacting the business for you, and telling them about your complaint.
> ...



There's also this - note the items in bold



> know your payday rights
> Of course, not all lenders are the same. And we see cases where some lenders try their very best to help their customers.
> 
> We also see some things that are simply wrong. For example, we don’t think it’s fair if your lender:
> ...


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## Nancy_Winks (Sep 4, 2014)

Speechless. Utter cunts. Good luck mate x


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> there are no bank managers any longer


Do they operate horizontally with workers' committees etc?


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## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Do they operate horizontally with workers' committees etc?


no, but there are no mainwarings any more in branches.


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## friedaweed (Sep 4, 2014)

Pingu said:


>


We should set 










on this company at least


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## The39thStep (Sep 4, 2014)

savoloysam said:


> Do you have a baseball bat spare....
> 
> Domain name:
> myloan.co.uk
> ...



Thats just up the road from me lol


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## The Boy (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> the man on the phone said that the transaction won't show till the 11nth because its held in a period untill its confirmed as gone. I don't really get how this is the case, but apparently it is



Five days for the cash to make its way to their accounts through BACS?

edit:  what sparklefish  said.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

BACS is same day isn't it?


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## The Boy (Sep 4, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> there are no bank managers any longer



Not in the old fashioned sense, perhaps.  But there is still a Branch Manager who's responsible for the accounts held at the branch and for avoiding getting the bank in the shit with folks like the Ombudsman.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> BACS is same day isn't it?


 
BACS normally takes three days to clear (although I don't know why seeing as it's basically an electronic thing). CHAPS is the same day one iirc.


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 4, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> I can't see any direct obvious crossover between the two companies/parent companies
> 
> The brokers
> The loaners



Loaners:



> Net Worth
> £-370,208


lol


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

If the Ombudsman writes to the bank the bank gets charged for it (about a grand I think  ) which is why they tend to avoid it going down that route. It's a wonderful stick to beat them with.


----------



## The Boy (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> BACS is same day isn't it?



CHAPS, no?

edit:  or what Monkeygrinder's Organ said.   I'll just fuck off now .


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> BACS normally takes three days to clear (although I don't know why seeing as it's basically an electronic thing). CHAPS is the same day one iirc.



This is what I understand too - BACS takes three days, which is why payroll is run a few days before people actually get paid to allow the time for the money to move through the banking system.  It doesn't make sense given everything is electronic these days, but I suppose it is probably tied to the limitations of the various legacy IT systems the banks use.  CHAPS is same day, as is Faster Payments (I don't know if FP is a replacement for CHAPS, or whether it is just another method).


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> BACS normally takes three days to clear (although I don't know why seeing as it's basically an electronic thing). CHAPS is the same day one iirc.


It was something someone from payroll reckoned although it may have been specific to the query I was making I suppose.


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Clear as fucking mud, those t&cs.
> 
> This appears to be the relevant bit:
> 
> ...



Jesus H Christ on rubber fucking crutches. They've bummed me.

I don't suppose taking this to whichever financial regulatory body is currently not doing anything except exist is going to help.


----------



## girasol (Sep 4, 2014)

Write to the bank explaining the situation, OR, most banks have a fraud dpt. these days, I had to contact mine recently (not that they were of any help mind, but my card got cancelled).  

So, contact the fraud dpt (I did it by phone), if you haven't, register your complaint, also do it in writing.  Clearly, you have been a victim of fraud.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> Jesus H Christ on rubber fucking crutches. They've bummed me.
> 
> I don't suppose taking this to whichever financial regulatory body is currently not doing anything except exist is going to help.


Unless you're up for a long fight, looks like you've been bummed a fiver if these are your T&Cs. I'd rule against them just for their crimes against punctuation in that document.


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> Jesus H Christ on rubber fucking crutches. They've bummed me.
> 
> I don't suppose taking this to whichever financial regulatory body is currently not doing anything except exist is going to help.


You've had an unauthorised debit taken from your account in return for no goods or services received. I'd be contacting the fraud team, the ombudsman, trading standards and perhaps the old bill. Give them a headache.


----------



## 8ball (Sep 4, 2014)

Good advice here - I'd just say don't limit yourself to the one route, and when you've got your cash back make sure you get some revenge in too.

I'd say a 4-pronged strategy of CAB, Watchdog, MP and Ombudsman.


----------



## Callie (Sep 4, 2014)

I think if you have the time/energy its worth bringing this 'scam' to the attention of someone? Esther Rantzen? Local MPs? Local newspaper? Any publicity on this has to be bad. I'm sure they're banking on prospective customers not being aware of the £70/£5 rip off so any attention would not be welcome. 

I wonder if the advertising standards agency would be interested as if they are not upfront about charging this fee is hope they can get into shit for it.


----------



## The Boy (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> You've had an unauthorised debit taken from your account in return for no goods or services received. I'd be contacting the fraud team, the ombudsman, trading standards and perhaps the old bill. Give them a headache.



^^^This.  

At least make them work for their fiver.


----------



## Wilf (Sep 4, 2014)

Callie said:


> I think if you have the time/energy its worth bringing this 'scam' to the attention of someone? Esther Rantzen? Local MPs? Local newspaper? Any publicity on this has to be bad. I'm sure they're banking on prospective customers not being aware of the £70/£5 rip off so any attention would not be welcome.
> 
> I wonder if the advertising standards agency would be interested as if they are not upfront about charging this fee is hope they can get into shit for it.


 Yeah, the biggest need is to get this thievery out to the notice of people who might be robbed by it - along with a public campaign to do the maximum damage to these cunts.  Scope for an urban campaign on this.

Unite Community might be one route.


----------



## ruffneck23 (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> So I applied for a sameday loan because the ESA had totally stalled me. It was refused. OK thought I, I'll just go without. Which I did. But apparently the T&c's I clicked OK to allow them to share my bank details with some third party who have seen fit to take a 'brokers fee' of 70 quid out of my dole! WTF is this shit. So I have spoken to the barclays lady and she says under the CCA I can ask for my money back as the third party has not negotiated a loan at all and its within a 14 day period. I have emailed the scum informing them of my desire to be reunited with my stolen p's.
> 
> What do I do if they boy me? How can I escalate the matter? Its only 70 odd quid but I need it




Ive had this , companies charging £70 , and then again and again. I had to cancel my card on more than one occasion,

I didn't get the money back and the bank didn't want to know, in fact i was treated with some derision as it was a payday loan,

All i would do if you can is call them AGAIN and AGAIN , speak to a manager and finally report them to the FSA


----------



## ruffneck23 (Sep 4, 2014)

The Boy said:


> ^^^This.
> 
> At least make them work for their fiver.



The fraud team didn't want to know when it happened to me, just cancelled my card and sent a new one


----------



## ShiftyBagLady (Sep 4, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> Wizzcash have a Twitter account by the way, and they might not like complaints being aired publically at being scumbags.  @wizzcashloans


I vote for a sustained campaign of abuse.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist - if you need a hand on drafting letters of complaint then let me know, as I'd be happy to help.


----------



## Callie (Sep 4, 2014)

wizzcash website said:
			
		

> We are a Direct Lender
> No Fees for Applying
> Quick Approval
> No Early Repayment Fee


at what point did you get he T&Cs regarding the broker fee?

there is nothing obvious on their website to say this will happen, they sneakily avoid mentioning anything about if you decide to not take a loan out with them.

T&Cs at  the bottom of their website sound a bit iffy imo




			
				wizzxash website T&Cs said:
			
		

> 12) Linking to and from our site
> 
> 12.1 Our Site may contain links to websites maintained by third parties. Emergency Cash Limited is not responsible for the content, availability or privacy policies of those sites, and the existence of such links should not be considered an endorsement or recommendation of those sites or of any product or service offered on those sites or of any party that is associated with those sites.


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> DotCommunist - if you need a hand on drafting letters of complaint then let me know, as I'd be happy to help.



appreciated m8s, but I can craft complaint letters that are like ninja assaults.

It's the getting of the people thats the problem, the ephemeral bastards. They've allready denied all knowledge of my existence despite the fact that my bank is telling me they had money out of my account. How does that work? You tapped me up for 70 quid and yet when I ring to ask wtf is happening you have apparently never heard or known me from adam? Shennanigan cunts.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> appreciated m8s, but I can craft complaint letters that are like ninja assaults.
> 
> It's the getting of the people thats the problem, the ephemeral bastards. They've allready denied all knowledge of my existence despite the fact that my bank is telling me they had money out of my account. How does that work? You tapped me up for 70 quid and yet when I ring to ask wtf is happening you have apparently never heard or known me from adam? Shennanigan cunts.



It could be that this loan company have shit IT systems, that only update on a certain cycle so your record isn't showing yet.  This would depend on when you applied for the loan, as it shouldn't take more than 24 hours for a database update to be done. 

Once you have confirmation of the money leaving your account (i.e. when the transaction is processed and shows on your bank records), that will mean the transaction will link back to whatever company took the money.  If they continue to deny the existence of it then it looks very questionable - and quite probably unlawful as their T & Cs say you can apply for a refund minus the £5 the law allows them to keep as a broker.  So insisting the transaction doesn't exist is effectively blocking your rights under the financial sector rules for consumers.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

Callie said:


> at what point did you get he T&Cs regarding the broker fee?


'no fees for applying'. Well that's just an out and out lie, isn't it?


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

Callie said:


> at what point did you get he T&Cs regarding the broker fee?
> 
> there is nothing obvious on their website to say this will happen, they sneakily avoid mentioning anything about if you decide to not take a loan out with them.
> 
> T&Cs at  the bottom of their website sound a bit iffy imo



This is exactly why they should be reported to the relevant ombudsman/regulator - anything about fees and the like should be upfront so consumers know exactly what they are getting into, and not buried in the small print.


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

So if your application is successful this charge is added as well as the mammoth interest rates? Is it subject to interest being added also? It's daylight robbery.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

littlebabyjesus said:


> 'no fees for applying'. Well that's just an out and out lie, isn't it?



From the front page of their site:



> We’re lenders with a conscience. Before approving your loan we’ll carry out a credit check and an affordability check to only approve loans to those who can afford them. You can be as confident as we are that repayments will be made promptly and the loan cleared fast. Unlike other lenders, we don’t see the benefit of squeezing any extra money out of you by prolonging the debt period with minimum repayment options or by tempting you to take out more money than you need.* Nor will we catch you out with technical jargon or hidden costs.* Straightforward, sensible solutions are what we excel at.



My emphasis, but that is a rather interesting statement.


----------



## ruffneck23 (Sep 4, 2014)

its preying on people when they are desperate ( not assuming you are dotty, but I was when i got conned by this.)

Office of fair trading me thinks


----------



## 8ball (Sep 4, 2014)

One thing I forgot - in April the FCA took over regulation of these sharks and are a LOT stricter than the old regime. 

http://www.fca.org.uk/


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

And this is very interesting, from the T & Cs:



> 9.4 Commentary and other materials posted on our site are not intended to amount to advice on which reliance should be placed. We therefore disclaim all liability and responsibility arising from any reliance placed on such materials by any visitor to our site, or by anyone who may be informed of any of its contents.



This appears to imply that anything on the site shouldn't be taken at face value, and the company isn't liable for any reliance placed upon it.  Logically this would include the T & Cs and the blurb on the main front page which says there are no hidden costs.


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

I think trading standards might disagree. It's false advertising.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Sep 4, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> And this is very interesting, from the T & Cs:
> 
> 
> 
> This appears to imply that anything on the site shouldn't be taken at face value, and the company isn't liable for any reliance placed upon it.  Logically this would include the T & Cs and the blurb on the main front page which says there are no hidden costs.


That reads like something you can't actually disclaim. Disclaiming _your own words_? The law doesn't work like that. Fucking chancers.


----------



## cesare (Sep 4, 2014)

The FCA took over regulation of consumer credit in April of this year. At the moment they're consulting over the proposed loan cap but they're also asking for feedback on whether they've got it right in terms of the light they're shining on the payday loans industry and some of the protections they've insisted on so far eg affordability checks, risk warnings and free debt advice.

So they want feedback - or at least that's what Martin Wheatley CEO of the FCA says - and here's a link and contact details where you can be very specific with your feedback including all the details you have about these crooks and what's happened. It's past the response date of 1 September, but do it anyway.

http://www.fca.org.uk/your-fca/documents/consultation-papers/cp14-10-response-form


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

littlebabyjesus said:


> That reads like something you can't actually disclaim. Disclaiming _your own words_? The law doesn't work like that. Fucking chancers.



I know - it sounds like meaningless bollocks, with no chance being accepted in court.  A judge would laugh them out of court for trying this one on.


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

ruffneck23 said:


> its preying on people when they are desperate ( not assuming you are dotty, but I was when i got conned by this.)
> 
> Office of fair trading me thinks




I wouldn't have been on a payday loan site if I wasn't desperate fella!

these people really are scum...

Here is my plan. I wait till I can get the statement that shows that the people who claim never to have heard of me are shown on the paper to have had the money out of my account. Then I re-iterate my desire to be reunited with my coins. Then if they still act the maggot I'll be getting the FSA th CIA and the NKVD on these people. It's only 70 quid which I know is not the wealth of nations, but its my fucking food. It's Tank's food. I just can't afford to let this slide.


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

if I walk down a dark street on a bad area circa 2am and get jumped by a pair of thugs waving little kitchen knives then I can understand that. It isn't fair, it isn't right and those people are scum. But I didn't do any of that, I asked for a loan which was denied and the cunts sold my bank details off to people who have straight up robbed me. I don't ever carry the 70 quid in cash, why would I.


----------



## 8ball (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> It's only 70 quid which I know is not the wealth of nations, but its my fucking food. It's Tank's food. I just can't afford to let this slide.


 
I'll come round and slap you myself if you let it slide!


----------



## Callie (Sep 4, 2014)

I might speak to my friend who works at the Advertising Standards Agency to see if she thinks it worth pursuing via them.


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> I've rung them and raised the dispute (my bank, barclays. I know, I know they are evil). I asked if they would be able to fight my corner for me but apparently because there is a clause in the T&C's allowing the loan company to pass my details on too a third party who charge an unasked for brokarage fee for a loan I haven't had, it's technically legal. Even the barclays lady said 'I know its morally wrong but legally this is OK'. The fucking thieves.


if you have an account with barclays you can pop into a branch and use their self-service account information terminal and print off a statement from that without charge. this will save you waiting for the statement to arrive, which i expect to be about monday. do that today, and proceed without delay.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

Their privacy policy contains some interesting sections, and you can find the whole thing here:

https://www.wizzcash.com/privacy-policy/



> 3.2.5 if we are unable to offer you a loan we will pass your information to other carefully selected loan providers inside or outside the EU who may be able to offer you a suitable alternative being an unsecured loan of a value of no greater than £5,000. They will not use your information for any other marketing purposes without your consent.



This makes clear they _will_ share your information with other loan providers, but the mention of 'outside the EU' interests me as a DP geek.  If they mean outside of the European Economic Area (EEA) then this raises the question of how they are complying with the 8th Data Protection Principle, which governs transfers of personal data outside of the EEA.  There are a number of hoops a data controller must go through to justify transferring personal data outside of the EEA, and they have to retain this as an audit trail.  Might be something to ask them about, as they have a DP Officer who can be contacted at their main customer services e-mail address.



> 3.3 Your data may also be used for other purposes for which you give your specific permission or, in very limited circumstances, when required by law or where permitted under the terms of the Act.



This could be the section that covers the tick box for passing the personal data to a broker.



> 4.2 All information you provide to us is, as far as reasonably practicable, is stored on our secure servers. Any financial information, such as credit/debit card numbers will be encrypted using specific security software. We ask you not to permit anyone to use your name.



I don't understand what they are on about by asking people not to permit anyone to use their name.  It looks like this is a drafting error in the privacy policy they've missed.



> 5.3.2 we will not be responsible for any unauthorised access to confidential information about you on our website.



Simply unenforceable.  Unauthorised access can be the fault of the data subject, such as by sharing passwords, but it can also be the fault of the data controller for sloppy security precautions. 



> 6.2 We may give information about you and how you manage your account to the following:
> ...
> 6.2.2 persons and legal entities which provide a service to us or are acting as our agents, on the understanding that they will keep the information confidential; and
> ...



This makes me wonder whether this broker is deemed to be 'providing a service' to this lender, and therefore this clause would also cover the data sharing?



> *9) Your rights*
> 9.1 You have the right, under section 7 of the Act, to access information held about you. Your right of access can be exercised in accordance with the Act by writing to us at [e-mail address] or Emergency Cash Limited, 7/10 Chandos Street, London, W1G 9DQ. Any subject access request may be subject to a small statutory fee to meet our costs in providing you with details of the information we hold about you.



This is pretty poor in my view.  The rights under s7 are crucial to the operation of the DPA, and data controllers should be as clear as possible as to how a data subject can exercise those rights.  This includes what they need from them in order to process a SAR, such as ID, and what fee they charge.  They mention the statutory fee, and for a normal SAR that is £10, so quite why they don't mention this simple fact here is strange. 

It is also odd to suggest people can make a SAR by e-mail.  It is very, very difficult to be certain that the person e-mailing is who they say they are, so there are security risks of doing it this way.  They may be meaning that if you e-mail they will tell you to put the request in writing, I suppose.


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Is it an online application? Perhaps swamping the system with bogus applications might give them a clue that they're pissing people off.


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Is it an online application? Perhaps swamping the system with bogus applications might give them a clue that they're pissing people off.


they know they're pissing people off, it's their entire business plan. but they reckon on people not being able / bothered enough to take it up.


----------



## sim667 (Sep 4, 2014)

ShiftyBagLady said:


> I vote for a sustained campaign of abuse.



Its been a while since I've abused anyone on twitter.


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

sim667 said:


> Its been a while since I've abused anyone on twitter.


an hour? two? four?


----------



## sim667 (Sep 4, 2014)

I think you should write to them saying that you'll be charging 3468495875585% interest until you get it back.


----------



## ShiftyBagLady (Sep 4, 2014)

sim667 said:


> Its been a while since I've abused anyone on twitter.


I don't know much about twitter but I looked at their twitter feed and I doubt they allow public tweets to be displayed there as it seems to consist of prize promotions and articles reminding parents how expensive school uniforms and family holidays are. The exploitative cunts.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

ShiftyBagLady said:


> I don't know much about twitter but I looked at their twitter feed and I doubt they allow public tweets to be displayed there as it seems to consist of prize promotions and articles reminding parents how expensive school uniforms and family holidays are. The exploitative cunts.



Their twitter feed is infuriating, isn't it.  Full of 'hey, there is a sale on at this shop' encouraging people to take out loans.  

Although there were a few responses to the BBC and Martin Lewis about the cap introduced by the FCA, but I couldn't see the original tweets so maybe they do only allow their tweets to appear.  I'm not too sure how twitter works to be honest!


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 4, 2014)

They even have a bloody youtube account too. 

http://www.youtube.com/user/wizzcash

And they are on LinkedIn.  Clearly they've got a social media officer somewhere who does all this shite.


----------



## Dillinger4 (Sep 4, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> They even have a bloody youtube account too.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/user/wizzcash
> 
> And they are on LinkedIn.  Clearly they've got a social media officer somewhere who does all this shite.



With a company like theirs they are going to need a _lot_ of public relations.


----------



## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

There's nothing to stop anyone _starting _a twitter thing about these scummers. It doesn't need to get posted on their own thing. It just needs to go round to get visible. Short brief headline- why **** are thieves and you _will _have £70 nicked direct from your bank if you contact them - and link to longer thing.


----------



## quimcunx (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> appreciated m8s, but I can craft complaint letters that are like ninja assaults.
> 
> It's the getting of the people thats the problem, the ephemeral bastards. They've allready denied all knowledge of my existence despite the fact that my bank is telling me they had money out of my account. How does that work? You tapped me up for 70 quid and yet when I ring to ask wtf is happening you have apparently never heard or known me from adam? Shennanigan cunts.



Get them to write to you denying all knowledge.  Then show the letter to the bank.


----------



## Quartz (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> Here is my plan. I wait till I can get the statement that shows that the people who claim never to have heard of me are shown on the paper to have had the money out of my account.



But your bank has confirmed that money has been debited, hasn't it? That in itself is proof, isn't it? And with your parlous finances, can you really afford to wait? You need to stomp on these people hard.


----------



## tufty79 (Sep 4, 2014)

Good luck with getting it sorted, dc.


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 4, 2014)

Quartz said:


> But your bank has confirmed that money has been debited, hasn't it? That in itself is proof, isn't it? And with your parlous finances, can you really afford to wait? You need to stomp on these people hard.


http://www.urban75.net/forums/threa...n-ive-been-robbed.327087/page-5#post-13379097


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

Quartz said:


> But your bank has confirmed that money has been debited, hasn't it? That in itself is proof, isn't it? And with your parlous finances, can you really afford to wait? You need to stomp on these people hard.




I've phoned up and had my card cancelled now because I couldn't afford for further robbery to take place. Three to five working days before I get my new one and can get an online statement. Natasha from the company says via email that they will accept a copy of an online statement if it shows me to have been robbed by them. Which it will. Now I've got to wait till next week.


----------



## Callie (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Is it an online application? Perhaps swamping the system with bogus applications might give them a clue that they're pissing people off.


 theyd love that - all those fivers they could lay claim to


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

me said:
			
		

> I have asked you wether you need a physical copy of my statement from Barclays displaying the money taken from my account, could you please clarify wether that is necessary or if you will be able to accept my forwarding of an online statement? Having spoken to Barclays again they re-iterated that it was your company that has taken my money and that under the terms of the CCA I am entitled to have it back. They have told me I can have a statement showing yourselves to be the people who took my money by the 11tnth of this month. I would be grateful if you could forward me an address if I do have to send you a paper copy of the statement showing the unwarranted and unasked for extraction of my money.
> 
> I realise that it is 70 pounds and that might not seem like a lot of money to some but this is my money and I can ill afford to let the matter go.
> 
> I have been taking advice to seek recompense/justice from the FSA and other regulators but I don't see why it is necessary to do so when it may be perfectly possible to resolve the matter amicably, by which I mean I would like the 'brokers fee' you have charged me refunded






			
				thieves said:
			
		

> Thank you for your email.
> 
> 
> An emailed copy will be fine just so we can see how the payment appears on the statement.
> ...




only now I have to wait till I get my new card because I couldn't trust the fuckers to not fuck me over in the interim. So as soon as a new card appears I will have the statement digital (I have also requested a physical copy via the telephone) before I can recoup my losses. Why are people ripping me off when I am poor anyway. The wankers.


----------



## ruffneck23 (Sep 4, 2014)

and they will try you know. I had my bank call me as they tried taking 70 quid out 7 times one morning.

There wasnt 70 quid in there so they couldnt get it, but they are scum


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

ruffneck23 said:


> and they will try you know. I had my bank call me as they tried taking 70 quid out 7 times one morning.
> 
> There wasnt 70 quid in there so they couldnt get it, but they are scum




the theiving pricks.


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Callie said:


> theyd love that - all those fivers they could lay claim to



They've probably automated the system to so they won't be losing money paying someone to make all the relevant phone calls for credit checks etc.


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> only now I have to wait till I get my new card because I couldn't trust the fuckers to not fuck me over in the interim. So as soon as a new card appears I will have the statement digital (I have also requested a physical copy via the telephone) before I can recoup my losses. Why are people ripping me off when I am poor anyway. The wankers.



Ripping you off for nothing too. They haven't done a thing besides perform a credit check and refuse to lend you money.


----------



## 8115 (Sep 4, 2014)

Wizzcash?

They claim to be regulated by the FCA, strong complaint to them would be in order I think.

If you google

"opencompany wizzcash" the first result should be their address and a list of their directors, should you wish to make further complaints 

eta - they all appear to live in the same house, making that list not very useful.


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Ripping you off for nothing too. They haven't done a thing besides perform a credit check and refuse to lend you money.




I've also spent 10 quids worth of credit talking to barclays


----------



## emanymton (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> If the Ombudsman writes to the bank the bank gets charged for it (about a grand I think  ) which is why they tend to avoid it going down that route. It's a wonderful stick to beat them with.


It's £500, so yeah if you want less than that it's in their interests to pay up. The worst that can happen is you end up with the satisfaction of costing them £500, so worth a go.


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> I've also spent 10 quids worth of credit talking to barclays



Try asking the bank to re-fund you - the last time I spent ages on the blower trying to sort L*****s out I got a "contribution" for the cost.


----------



## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> I've also spent 10 quids worth of credit talking to barclays



Bastards.  These people clearly don't know the effect these 'terms and conditions' has on those seeking their 'help'. I'm with the theists. There needs to be a hell.


----------



## moochedit (Sep 4, 2014)

sorry if already posted but...

Wizzcash.com
is a trading style of Emergency Cash Limited

Registered in England No.07527455 Registered Office:
7/10 Chandos Street, London, W1G 9DQ


found on duedil.com  .....

shareholders:

Owned   Value   Detail

Louvre Trustees Ltd
47.01%   79.91 GBP   799,132.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Steven Isaacs
13.64%   23.19 GBP   231,936.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Lisa Lang
10.29%   17.50 GBP   175,000.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Tevalee Lp
7.64%   12.99 GBP   129,884.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Ambrian Investments Limited
5.46%   9.28 GBP   92,774.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary

Richard Jaffee
5.46%   9.28 GBP   92,774.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Daniel Frederick Slutzkin
5.00%   8.50 GBP   85,000.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Darryl Sean Noik
5.00%   8.50 GBP   85,000.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Daniel Tannenbaum
< 1%   0.43 GBP   4,250.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary
Tania Guadalupe
< 1%   0.43 GBP   4,250.00 ×
< 0.01 GBP Ordinary


directors:

Name & Function   Status   Portfolio
[British]
Mr Daniel Frederick Slutzkin
Born 36 years ago: Oct 1977
Director, None
05 Dec 2011 — Present (2 years, 8 months, 30 days)
   Open  

  Open3
  Retired1
  Closed0

Ms Lisa Lang
Born: Unknown
Company Secretary
20 May 2013 — Present (1 year, 3 months, 15 days)
   Open  

  Open1
  Retired0
  Closed0

[British]
Mr Richard Jaffee
Born 54 years ago: Jun 1960
Director, Investment Manager
19 Aug 2013 — Present (1 year, 16 days)
   Open  

  Open1
  Retired11
  Closed0

[British] L
Hilton Ivan Freund
Born 45 years ago: May 1969
Director, Marketing and Commercial Director
03 Mar 2014 — Present (6 months, 1 day)
   Open  

  Open5
  Retired2
  Closed1

[British]
Mr Darryl Sean Noik
Born 48 years ago: Dec 1965
Director, Chartered Accountant
30 Jun 2011 — 30 May 2014 (2 years, 11 months)
   Retired  

  Open5
  Retired32
  Closed1

Mr Daniel Frederick Slutzkin
Born: Unknown
Company Secretary
23 Aug 2012 — 20 May 2013 (8 months, 28 days)
   Retired  

  Open0
  Retired1
  Closed0

[British]
Mr Andrew Paul Gold
Born 36 years ago: Dec 1977
Director, Finance Director
11 Feb 2011 — 24 Aug 2012 (1 year, 6 months, 13 days)
   Retired  

  Open2
  Retired11
  Closed2

[British]
Mr Daniel Lee Harrison
Born 41 years ago: May 1973
Director, Managing Director
11 Feb 2011 — 24 Aug 2012 (1 year, 6 months, 13 days)
   Retired  

  Open4
  Retired4
  Closed0
Mr Robert Paul Isaacs
Born 46 years ago: Sep 1967
Director, Director
11 Feb 2011 — 24 Aug 2012 (1 year, 6 months, 13 days)
   Retired  

  Open6
  Retired7
  Closed1

[British]
Ms Shona Anne Mountford
Born 43 years ago: Oct 1970
Director
11 Feb 2011 — 24 Aug 2012 (1 year, 6 months, 13 days)
   Retired  

  Open4
  Retired3
  Closed0

Mr Ryan Melvyn Smethurst
Born: Unknown
Company Secretary
11 Feb 2011 — 24 Aug 2012 (1 year, 6 months, 13 days)


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Not in that depth! Nice work! 

This way, search engine bots, as a matter of public record.


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## butchersapron (Sep 4, 2014)

It was - covered by links. More people digging the better though.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

I meant details for the bots but yeah, sorry.


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## moochedit (Sep 4, 2014)

edit ( wrong "louvre" company before) 

biggest shareholder:

http://www.gfsc.gg/investment/regul...ef=98303&division=Fiduciary&ItemStatus=Active

Louvre Trustees Limited
GFSC Reference:
98303
Address:
PO Box 39,
St Peters House,
Le Bordage,
St Peter Port,
Guernsey,
GY1 1BR
Record Last Updated:
21 July 2014


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## moochedit (Sep 4, 2014)

...


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## Orang Utan (Sep 4, 2014)

Scumbags.
One of these payday loan companies is called Oakum. Might as well call themselves Workhouse Loans. My sympathy and solidarity DotCommunist. I can stick a small amount of cash in your account should you need it.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 4, 2014)

I recon I have it covered orang, safe tho. Just lingering rage- I mean, you don't honestly expect a hidden line in a loan agreement that isn't even a loan agreement because they boyed you to start with and then they sell your actual bank detail....its to much. I recon i'll have to read the original t&c for my non-loan tomorrow and maybe ring barclays and demand justice. again.


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## 8115 (Sep 4, 2014)

Contact the FCA.

Srsly.


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## 8115 (Sep 4, 2014)

Claim compensation.

http://www.fca.org.uk/


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## ruffneck23 (Sep 4, 2014)

i hope for the best or you DotCommunist  i can also help with some if you're stuck


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## 8115 (Sep 4, 2014)

We should form a small U75 credit union, reckon you couldn't go wrong there.

But seriously if you do want to complain I'll help, coached my mum through a complaint to the FCA which she won.  How did I learn all this?  Reading the letters to the finance section of the Guardian for years.


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## Chilli.s (Sep 4, 2014)

Shocking the lack of regulation of these kind of "lenders". The banks, with their casual approach to withdrawals from their customers accounts, are almost complicit in what is basically fraud.
Good luck DotC.


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## Orang Utan (Sep 4, 2014)

It's all very well being reasonable here, but these people need to be swinging, headless, from lampposts. Practicilaties aside!


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

Swinging from lamp posts sounds a bit too reasonable as well. 

Wasn't it you (it definitely was I think!) that informed me about The Boats?


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## moodygirl86 (Sep 4, 2014)

Bastards! You shouldn't be charged for this legally, because as you say, you didn't even take a loan out. I hope you get your money back ASAP.


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## two sheds (Sep 4, 2014)

Errm I just went to Wizzcash website intending to say that I need a loan and I just wanted to make sure that they didn't charge fees for applying when I see (just under "APR: 993%")


*We are a Direct Lender*
No Fees for Applying
Quick Approval
No Early Repayment Fee
https://www.wizzcash.com/

I'd be tempted to contact the plod tbh it's attempted fraud.

Eta: just under that they say "With a competitive rate of 993% APR we also happen to be one of the cheapest lenders you’ll find -"

That has to be false advertising, too.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

two sheds said:


> I'd be tempted to contact the plod tbh it's attempted fraud.



Ah, well, when a prole does it it's fraud. When a white collar financial company does it it's exploiting loopholes.


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## moodygirl86 (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Ah, well, when a prole does it it's fraud. When a white collar financial company does it it's exploiting loopholes.


Yeah, precisely. If we scammed a company - of any kind, not just financial cowboys - we'd have a lifelong criminal record, named and shamed, massive fine, long prison sentence - in other words, our life wouldn't be worth living. But apparently it's OK to do to individuals.


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## 8115 (Sep 4, 2014)

It's not ok.  They have ballsed up.  Badly.


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## kittyP (Sep 4, 2014)

Dotty, re your card, lots of banks print cards in branch now and you can have them in minutes. 
If you're going to town at all, might be worth popping in to see if they offer that, if you need a card ASAP.


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## moodygirl86 (Sep 4, 2014)

8115 said:


> It's not ok.  They have ballsed up.  Badly.


Yeah, I know, I was being sarcastic. (I appreciate that might not come across over an Internet forum like it would if you heard my voice in person).


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## J Ed (Sep 4, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> I've also spent 10 quids worth of credit talking to barclays



StoneRoad is right, if you contact them again soon then ask them to credit you the money you've spent on the phone with them.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

moodygirl86 said:


> Yeah, precisely. If we scammed a company - of any kind, not just financial cowboys - we'd have a lifelong criminal record, named and shamed, massive fine, long prison sentence - in other words, our life wouldn't be worth living. But apparently it's OK to do to individuals.



I wonder if it could be argued in court that their own ridiculous interest rates should apply to these sums that they illegally withdrew from people's accounts and clung on to?


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

moodygirl86 said:


> Yeah, I know, I was being sarcastic. (I appreciate that might not come across over an Internet forum like it would if you heard my voice in person).



The stock response is:

_Sarcasm detector on the blink? _


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## Wilf (Sep 4, 2014)

Doesn't Dawkins talk about a wasp that lays its eggs in the eye of a caterpillar?  These cunts are on the same level.


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## J Ed (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> I wonder if it could be argued in court that their own ridiculous interest rates should apply to these sums that they illegally withdrew from people's accounts and clung on to?



http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...nder-runs-highcost-loans-company-8656356.html



> A top Conservative Party funder is revealed today as the man behind one of Britain’s biggest high-cost lenders.
> 
> Financier Henry Angest – a friend of the Camerons and a former Tory Treasurer – gave the Conservatives a £5m overdraft facility shortly before the last General Election at an attractive interest rate of just 3.5 per cent.
> 
> The high-cost credit company Mr Angest controls, Everyday Loans, charges members of the public interest at an average 74.8 per cent APR.


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## J Ed (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Go and speak with the bank manager and demand a statement. If he refuses tell him you'll contact the ombudsman. I'm not lying when I say the prospect of that will bother him. I would also consider making it a criminal matter. Tell the bank the funds were extracted without your authorisation.



I don't know of a retail bank which can actually do this, most banks outsource printing and and postage of customer documents. Retail staff are powerless to expedite the process.

If you have online banking then with most banks you can print out PDFs of statements but scum like the company mentioned do not usually accept anything but statements directly from the bank, it's just another way of throwing up a road block.


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## free spirit (Sep 4, 2014)

in case it hasn't been mentioned, consumer law was updated recently, so there's a fair chance that companies who were sailing close to the wind before, will now have illegal terms and conditions if they haven't updated them.

Can't entirely remember if this would apply here or not, but worth checking out.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

J Ed said:


> http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...nder-runs-highcost-loans-company-8656356.html



I really hate these people. I'm not murderous just yet and when I do find out I've got terminal cancer I probably wouldn't want to saddle my son with the grief of me doing something stupid. But fuck me, they really are parasites.


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## J Ed (Sep 4, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> I really hate these people. I'm not murderous just yet and when I do find out I've got terminal cancer I probably wouldn't want to saddle my son with the grief of me doing something stupid. But fuck me, they really are parasites.



They deserve worse than anything that could be inflicted on them by one person.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 4, 2014)

J Ed said:


> They deserve worse than anything that could be inflicted on them by one person.



Aye. I generally argue against propaganda by the deed but by fuck it'd feel a charitable act.


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## two sheds (Sep 5, 2014)

I e-mailed yesterday asking after a short term loan and received the following this morning: 

Hi Arthur,

We are a direct lender and do not charge a fee for applying. First time customers can take a loan out of between £200-£300. To apply, please visit our website www.wizzcash.com.

Kind regards,

Customer Care
Wizzcash.com

Now, that is strictly true because *they* don't charge a fee - their sidekicks do - but I still think that's false advertising.


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## Citizen66 (Sep 5, 2014)

Well if someone 'brokers' the loan they're not a 'direct lender' so they're lying about that too.

Email them back pointing out their error.


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## butchersapron (Sep 5, 2014)

two sheds said:


> I e-mailed yesterday asking after a short term loan and received the following this morning:
> 
> Hi Arthur,
> 
> ...


They sell the details to others (who they may or may not be connected to), who do then thieve. That's the start point of nailing these kind people.


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## laptop (Sep 5, 2014)

I've only skimmed the thread. But I should add a warning about something I came across.

DO NOT give out the long number off your card without thinking very carefully and reading the T&Cs.

Otherwise, you may find you've entered into a "continuous payment authority" agreement. This is very different from a direct debit.

Source: this report on a slimming scam: http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/jun/02/risk-free-online-order-continuous-payment-authority



> ...a worrying number have been told by their banks that nothing can be done to prevent the payments pouring out. "My credit card company says I cannot stop these payments unless NutriBerry Slim agrees," says another reader. "I put a stop on them two days after applying for the trial, but they were still paid two weeks later. I have cancelled my card but the bank tells me that won't help."
> 
> The *ignorance of banking staff* is almost as dismaying as the NutriBerry Slim rip-off. Customers applying for the free trial have, in fact, signed up to a continuous payment authority (CPA) which allows a company to take recurring payments off a credit or debit card.
> 
> However, *customers can cancel* a CPA whenever they want and, although it's best to do this through the company taking the payments, they have the legal right to do it through the card issuer without the company's agreement.



My *emphasis*.


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## savoloysam (Sep 5, 2014)

moochedit said:


> sorry if already posted but...
> 
> Wizzcash.com
> is a trading style of Emergency Cash Limited
> ...



Nice work. I'm sure some of these cunts could be found on linkedin or facebook.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 18, 2014)

So they gave me my money back, minus a fiver and two weeks after I actually needed it 

thieving arseholes


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## DotCommunist (Sep 18, 2014)

The man from barclays said they'd been 'in discussion' with the third party and thats why it was repaid.
I don't know if I believe this but hey. My money is back. Shy by a fiver.


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## Thimble Queen (Sep 18, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> So they gave me my money back, minus a fiver and two weeks after I actually needed it
> 
> thieving arseholes



Glad you got your money back in the end. What a bunch of cunts.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 18, 2014)

poptyping said:


> Glad you got your money back in the end. What a bunch of cunts.




they've basically held my 70 quid in their account, earning money off it, then returned it minus a fiver. 3 weeks later. I don't think I'm being funny to suggest that these people should be fed feet first into a meat grinder. I'm on the fucking sick! the pittance of sick pay from the state. And yet they still saw fit to take my money and not loan me any. Mad mad world


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## Radar (Sep 22, 2014)

This seems to be the only examination of this scam that I've found on the web.  http://www.everything-payday.com/membership-fee-charging-payday-loan-brokers/

It beggers belief that they are allowed to behave like this, and allowed to prey on the most vulnerable too


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## savoloysam (Sep 25, 2014)

Well done dude and urbans.

Hopefully this thread can serve as a lesson for anyone considering an emergency 2000% APR loan.


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## tufty79 (Sep 25, 2014)

A lesson? Warning, yeah. But a lesson? Ffs.


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## savoloysam (Sep 25, 2014)

Lesson, warning whatever


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## tufty79 (Sep 25, 2014)

Yeah, sorry - I'm possibly having an oversensitive day


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## andysays (Sep 25, 2014)

I think "warning" is definitely a better word, and the difference is not just semanticks/pedanticks, but I'm sure savoloysam didn't mean to suggest the connotations which "lesson" would have.


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## tufty79 (Sep 25, 2014)

I know (and apologies to savoloysam for snapping).
I keep having to repeat classes from the 'broke and desperate' school of learning, so a bit prickly about it


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## Manter (Sep 25, 2014)

I'm only halfway through the thread and have to go to a meeting, but how the fuck is this legal?! how can you just randomly take money out of someone's account?


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## tufty79 (Sep 25, 2014)

Manter said:


> how can you just randomly take money out of someone's account?


There's usually a bit after you submit your application that's all flashing 'enter your debit card details so we can give you CASH!!$!'.   Scroll down a little further, and very small print says 'we will also debit x amount within 70 days, and by clicking continue you agree to this', or similar.

After not seeing the small print and giving your info, you'll get the next page usually giving details of guarantor loan companies and 'debt solution' agencies.

If you've given your mobile number, you can also expect about 20 spam texts a day from 'associates' offering loans going through the exact same process, with dodgy URLs, and getting your name wrong. The only mildly amusing thing is that I now know there's a company out there called 'fash loans'

/bitter experience


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## Looby (Sep 25, 2014)

savoloysam said:


> Well done dude and urbans.
> 
> Hopefully this thread can serve as a lesson for anyone considering an emergency 2000% APR loan.



Yeah, that'll teach people for being skint, having shit credit, needing something urgently. 

Fuck you peasants.


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## DotCommunist (Oct 14, 2014)

are you fucking kidding me? nobbled again by some cunts called Myloannow.com

same MO, 67 quid nicked for no reason. I did everything barclays said, I got a new card with new sort code and accnt number. You've just robbed half my rent you shitbags.

I just spoke to barclays overnight bods and they are saying given that its happened before and I have highlighted it before barclays will refund me themselves tomorrow then chase the company.

can you fucking believe this shit. Its not an issue for me now, barclays will recompense me but FFS


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## purves grundy (Oct 14, 2014)

Fuckers


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## kittyP (Oct 14, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> are you fucking kidding me? nobbled again by some cunts called Myloannow.com
> 
> same MO, 67 quid nicked for no reason. I did everything barclays said, I got a new card with new sort code and accnt number. You've just robbed half my rent you shitbags.
> 
> ...



Has this happened without you doing anything this time round?

Not that it matters. Nobody deserves any of this shit!!


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## DotCommunist (Oct 14, 2014)

I changed all my details, I got a new card with new srt code and new acc number. How have they nobbled me AGAIN. I was just fancying be but now I'm pumped with anger


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## DotCommunist (Oct 14, 2014)

kittyP said:


> Has this happened without you doing anything this time round?
> 
> Not that it matters. Nobody deserves any of this shit!!




nah nothing m8, just what barclays told me to do, get a new card and numbers.


somethings fishy here. I'd best go bed and sort it in the morning. Fucking...fucks


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## kittyP (Oct 14, 2014)

Absolute fucking CUNTS!!
I don't have a faith or believe in karma but I do have at least a hope that these people will one day realise what nasty vacuous shits they are.


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## kittyP (Oct 14, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> nah nothing m8, just what barclays told me to do, get a new card and numbers.
> 
> 
> somethings fishy here. I'd best go bed and sort it in the morning. Fucking...fucks



Oh shit I am so sorry honey


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## fishfinger (Oct 14, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> somethings fishy here.



Sounds like it. Sorry to hear this. Hope you manage to get to the bottom of it!


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## farmerbarleymow (Oct 14, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> are you fucking kidding me? nobbled again by some cunts called Myloannow.com
> 
> same MO, 67 quid nicked for no reason. I did everything barclays said, I got a new card with new sort code and accnt number. You've just robbed half my rent you shitbags.
> 
> ...



That sounds shit.  If you've not entered the new account number/card number into another loan site, then it looks as if they've put another charge through the banking system and somehow Barclays have married it up with your new account details, and debited it.  Good to hear that Barclays are refunding you, but I bet you're furious.

If you've not applied for another loan, and the original rip off charge was supposed to be a one-off brokerage fee, then it begs the question whether trying to get the money again is fraud.  Worth pursuing if this is the case - and raise it with the relevant authorities.


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## Callie (Oct 14, 2014)

Fuckers! I spoke to my friend at the advertising standard agency and she said this would definitely by more of a thing for the FCA (financial.....cat?....agency). 

Can you close your current account and go elsewhere? I'm guessing that would be too much aggro and near impossible. 

Report wizzcash to MP/local rag.

Ask Barclays to cancel any weird agreement with wizzcash as has been mentioned.

Talk about wizzcash as much as you can on the internet and keep saying how much of a bunch of thieving shite wizzcash and their associates are.


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## Chilli.s (Oct 14, 2014)

As this second withdrawal from your bank has in no way been authorised by yourself or in payment for anything I would suggest this is fraud. A matter for the police.


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## 8ball (Oct 14, 2014)

Chilli.s said:


> As this second withdrawal from your bank has in no way been authorised by yourself or in payment for anything I would suggest this is fraud. A matter for the police.


 
My previous dealings with banks suggests this is not how they work.


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## J Ed (Oct 14, 2014)

farmerbarleymow said:


> That sounds shit.  If you've not entered the new account number/card number into another loan site, then it looks as if they've put another charge through the banking system and somehow Barclays have married it up with your new account details, and debited it.  Good to hear that Barclays are refunding you, but I bet you're furious.



Yep, they are using the original 'authorisation' on the new card which is rare but not unheard of, no idea how it is legal. DotCommunist since you have already asked the bank to cancel these payments then I would say that you are in a very strong position to claim compensation both for the price of the calls and for the inconvenience that Barclay's have caused you, it may be worth making a formal complaint to them. You can even do it online here



8ball said:


> My previous dealings with banks suggests this is not how they work.



Yep


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## laptop (Oct 29, 2014)

And finally the story hits dead tree: http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/oct/29/payday-loan-brokers-bank-accounts-poor-customers



> Terry Lawson, head of fraud and chargeback operations for RBS and NatWest, said: “We’ve seen large numbers of customers incurring charges they don’t expect when using a payday loan broker since July this year. Customers’ account or debit card details are gathered and sent on to *up to 200 other brokers and lenders* who charge them fees for a loan application.
> 
> “At its height we were seeing up to 640 calls a day on unexpected fees, but we’re pleased to say we’re seeing this decrease on account of the actions we’re taking to help stop these sharp practices.”
> ...
> What shocks many of the victims of payday loan brokers is that the companies are usually authorised by the Financial Conduct Authority. The FCA said it has only recently taken on the job of authorising credit brokers, which was previously handled by the Office of Fair Trading. What is called “interim authorisation” was granted to 5,247 brokers, and only since 1 October has the authority begun assessing applications in detail.


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## Celyn (Oct 29, 2014)

I meant to post that but couldn't recall the name of the thread.      Very nasty business.


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## Cloo (Oct 30, 2014)

Scary to think how many people are probably getting this shit now and how many of them haven't asked for help because they assume nothing can be done.


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## laptop (Nov 3, 2014)

And (finally) some digging into the machinery: http://www.theguardian.com/money/blog/2014/nov/01/payday-loans-ping-tree-lending-broker


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