# Cheating



## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

i have decided  to  come to terms with it  and  face up to the problem

i am frankly  shit  at games


seriously  io have played many a game  but the number of games i have actually completed with out cheating i can list on one hand

unreal tournament (all the single player stuff)
star wars episode 1 pod racer

that's it*

everything else i have cheated on 

and  even with cheats sometimes i can't win   i played tales of phantasia  on my snes emulator  and loved it (even though i was  using  a cheat where i got  extra exp each battle allowing me to level up really quickly)  but there is one level where you had to run across a series of switches in time with another character .... and i couldn't do it... days  i tried to get passed that point  but i still couldn't  it was only untill i downloaded a newer version of the emulator  that  had a slowmo effect  that i managed to get passed that point  (actually i had forgotten about  that point so when i got to that level again i nearly  cried  till i found out about slowmo)

i have no timing    and my reaction time  is  slightly slower than international mail 

this means i rely heavily on cheating to enjoy games

ever since they halcyon days of yore  i have  enjoyed playing  with god mode on i am the iddqd king  it alows me to relax  and not   have  the same level of tension as the easy female in a slasher flick 

some poeple might  think it takes the fun out of the game  but dying  some where around level 1 for the  30th time  isn't something i would  describe as fun

 this leads me to  a sore point

some games don't give you cheats

this is deeply frstrating

today i played mirrors edge...   i never even made it to the end of the first level....   seriously...  

so i look for cheats

there are none

i have got a game  which i can't play 

this is quite annoying...  

another annoyence  is  the GTA series  which  although has some cheats   does not include a god mode  meaning   that  the moment you try to have some fun you die


and seriously  GTA  is  the game  designed to have god mode... nothing is more fun then going around  on a mad rampage   bullets bouncing of of you as you roar with maniacal laughter (i have a trainer for GTA:SA)

but no  your not allowed to have fun

as i discovered  with GTA IV  a game that feels more like a job  than my actual job  


so in short

game developers  please please please  let us have god mode

where not all members of the  golden fingered  elite** some of us have terminal  mouse finger and  mash our  wasd keys in vain hope 

please  won'y you let me see the end credits too?



*actually i may have beaten discworld 2 with out  looking at the walk though but  i can't be certain  same  with grim fandango    and  i only had to look one thing up in monkey island 3
**1337 w00t


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## fen_boy (Feb 26, 2010)

Sounds like Ikaruga is the game for you.


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## fen_boy (Feb 26, 2010)

Dara O'briain did a bit on this for Gameswipe that was quite good. He took the view that he'd payed for the content so he should be able to see it no matter how cackhanded he is.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

i saw that bit.. actually  he didn't go as far as  saying he should  be able to see it  he just pointed out that it was odd  to have a medium that can deny content to buyers


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## Dillinger4 (Feb 26, 2010)

I cheat on almost every game that I play.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

fen_boy said:


> Sounds like Ikaruga is the game for you.



just the image  gives me  shudders of fear...  my useual excpriance of scrolling shhoters is the bullet hell of  trying to play touhou games

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/24/PCByukari140.jpg


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## Epona (Feb 26, 2010)

fen_boy said:


> Dara O'briain did a bit on this for Gameswipe that was quite good. He took the view that he'd payed for the content so he should be able to see it no matter how cackhanded he is.


I was recalling that as I read Shippy's post, very apt.  I have similar problems with games that require any level of manual co-ordination (probably one of the reasons I like the BG/IWD/NWN/DA:O type games so much, they're mostly mouse clicking and have the ability to pause during combat), I don't want or need a game to feel like hard work, and I don't want to miss out on most of the content simply because I'm too cack-handed to get past the boss at the end of the first level.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

it's also not  just the ability to get to the end  it's simply that some games  are just a hell of a lot more fun  if your cheating

today i'm going to get drunk and play saints row 2  with the cheats on... because i can  and  it's fucking fun 

saints row 2 is the game gta should be


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## Idaho (Feb 26, 2010)

Once I input a cheat, it completely kills the game for me. I feel no obsessive need to defeat a game that I have cheated on.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

good for you  you get a gold star  

but  should  other be forced to  comply to this rule


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## fen_boy (Feb 26, 2010)




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## bmd (Feb 26, 2010)

I cheated on Dead Space as the upgrade system was glacially slow and I had got a good way into the game and it began to look like I would have to choose one weapon and upgrade it, with no way of knowing whether it would be shit at the end of it all.

So I used a trainer (it was on PC) and got all the upgrades for every weapon and the suit. It just ruined the game. I could kick everything's arse without having to worry about ammo or damage and the tension went out of the game completely, which is what that game is all about. 

I always knew cheating would make a game lose its edge but that put me off trying it again.


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## DotCommunist (Feb 26, 2010)

Whenever I was getting pwnt in Civ2 I would simply cheat myself a bomber and lay waste to my fuedal era rivals.


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## kyser_soze (Feb 26, 2010)

Don't worry shippy, anything that involves regular use of all 4 shoulder buttons in combination (except driving games) usually fucks me.

It's one of the reasons my fave PS3 game is SuperStardust. It's just move around and shoot. 

That Ikaruga looks like my kinda thing too


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)




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## kyser_soze (Feb 26, 2010)

I think my last 'cheat' was looking up how to solve the St Marco's puzzle thing in Creed 2, via a YouTube walkthrough.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

Bob Marley's Dad said:


> the tension went out of the game completely, which is what that game is all about.



i disagree with this strongly

it might be true for some people  but for me i hate the tension 

for me the game is all about the fun stuff the  cool weapons  the story line  the  great  levels

it's not about dying 20 times on one level   that  just beats all the fucking fun out of the game


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## fen_boy (Feb 26, 2010)

Shippou-Chan said:


>




HAHA that's insane. It all comes down to pattern recognition and memory when it gets that mad.


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## machine cat (Feb 26, 2010)

I will cheat when I'm really stuck, but i end up using them through the rest of the game


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## bmd (Feb 26, 2010)

Shippou-Chan said:


> i disagree with this strongly
> 
> it might be true for some people  but for me i hate the tension
> 
> ...



Yeah I agree that dying repeatedly is no fun but that game's setting is darkness with the occasional bit of lighting so you creep about waiting for the next wave of aliens to fly out of nowhere. It's that kind of tension that the game is about and not having to worry about it cos you know you're invincible just killed the game really.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

do you feel the same about films?  does the knowledge that  they are not going to kill off the main character  kill any tension?

for me  what makes a game good  has very little to do with tension of skill 

and if  it does  mean something to a person... well you don't have to cheat...  or  you can just cheat a bit  

allowing cheating is not the same as forcing every one to cheat


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## FridgeMagnet (Feb 26, 2010)

Cheats are an excuse for shit game design though. Instead of making a game that you makes you want to learn how to play it so you go to the effort - and isn't so stupidly hard that only monomaniacs and/or people with cybernetic implants can do that - oh no, let's let people have infinite lives. Might as well just watch gameplay videos.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 26, 2010)

name your favorite game

did it have cheats?


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## FridgeMagnet (Feb 26, 2010)

Fallout 3 has a non-disabled debug console - but that's a bit different, because you can use it to achieve things that are completely impossible in normal gameplay, visiting areas you can't normally access etc. It's a sandbox mode more than a cheat mode. Haven't used it anyway, as it's a well-designed game that makes you want to play it.


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## revol68 (Feb 26, 2010)

fen_boy said:


> Dara O'briain did a bit on this for Gameswipe that was quite good. He took the view that he'd payed for the content so he should be able to see it no matter how cackhanded he is.



I remember that, was funny because the bit he was stuck on in Gears of War was one of the easiest bits in the game (the first berserker), I later found out he was an Arsenal fan and it all made sense.


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## Sunray (Feb 26, 2010)

I need a cheat for resident evil 5 that lets me skip to the next chapter, at the end of c3-1 it crashes every fucking time....

But no, its soft ice or nothing....


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## FridgeMagnet (Feb 26, 2010)

Just to be clear, I don't give a monkey's whether somebody cheats or not (unless it's in competitive multiplayer, which makes them a cunt - but I don't even care whether somebody buys WoW gear on eBay). But if a game has any pretence at narrative, it should be possible within the game for pretty much anyone to manage to get to the end and not be bored out of their fucking mind doing so.

In fact, even if it hasn't, there should be a proper learning curve - I'm not bothered that Q*Bert gets harder and harder, but if it was impossible to start with, or suddenly reached a point of way-too-hardness, I'd be pissed off.


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (Feb 26, 2010)

I can't do any games, I get bored of dieing before I get good enough not to die. 

I wish there were some super double easy modes (or games) for people like me. I only got a little way into GTA. It looked interesting and said it was a free roaming thing, but it was still basically a game with a plot that I just couldn't get very far in. No helicopters for me. 

Whenever I played 4 player golden-eye (the last game I ever got anywhere with) I always got shot in the head straight away.


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## machine cat (Feb 26, 2010)

Anyone played Ninja Gaiden on the Xbox? Now that's a game crying out for cheats.


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## FridgeMagnet (Feb 26, 2010)

ATOMIC SUPLEX said:


> I can't do any games, I get bored of dieing before I get good enough not to die.
> 
> I wish there were some super double easy modes (or games) for people like me. I only got a little way into GTA. It looked interesting and said it was a free roaming thing, but it was still basically a game with a plot that I just couldn't get very far in. No helicopters for me.
> 
> Whenever I played 4 player golden-eye (the last game I ever got anywhere with) I always got shot in the head straight away.



Well, if the plot just doesn't grab you, not much that difficulty can do about that.

The GTA series is a good example, though, I think. I've owned GTA 1 and 3. GTA 1, I started playing, but the main character was just this anonymous nobody, (this had the piss taken out of it in later episodes iirc), the plot was pretty dull, the controls were frustrating and it was too hard too quickly, so I just said "fuck this I'm not having fun" and stopped playing.

GTA 3 on the other hand has carefully graded difficulty levels and takes you from a complete noob position through to being any good, without boring you too much. It's also got lots of characterisation (if in huge stereotypes but hey) and distinctive missions; the landscape is also enormous and there's lots of stuff to do just wandering around.


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## Idaho (Feb 26, 2010)

Shippou-Chan said:


> good for you  you get a gold star
> 
> but  should  other be forced to  comply to this rule



People can do whatever they like. I don't care that cheats exist. Doesn't bother me in the least. I just don't like using them.


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## jonnyd1978 (Feb 26, 2010)

I think the problem sometimes is that the easy levels are not easy enough! I got stuck on a game last week, Resi Evil shooter on the Wii, couldn't beat a certain boss. So I stopped playing it.Luckily I'd hired it for a week so not spunked £30 on it and it just went back to the shop. I hate how modern games can be so hard! That's why I like the Wii at the moment though. There's lots of fun games that are simple to master such as Mario Kart or the Olympic games. You can also jump in and out of them, it's not a 2-3 hour job getting a bit of a game going.

I'd use a cheat if I was that bothered about finishing a game but I don't think I'd ever be that bothered!


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (Feb 26, 2010)

FridgeMagnet said:


> GTA 3 on the other hand has carefully graded difficulty levels and takes you from a complete noob position through to being any good, without boring you too much. It's also got lots of characterisation (if in huge stereotypes but hey) and distinctive missions; the landscape is also enormous and there's lots of stuff to do just wandering around.



イsてゃt
Is that a PS3 thing? I f so th


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## bmd (Feb 27, 2010)

Shippou-Chan said:


> do you feel the same about films?  does the knowledge that  they are not going to kill off the main character  kill any tension?
> 
> for me  what makes a game good  has very little to do with tension of skill
> 
> ...



I have no problem with people cheating in their own game, I just don't want to use cheats as it ruins the game for me. If the tension in a game comes from whether I'm likely to be killed or not then if I completely remove that likelihood I also remove the tension. I don't have that level of control over a film so it isn't the same for me.


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## FridgeMagnet (Feb 27, 2010)

ATOMIC SUPLEX said:


> イsてゃt
> Is that a PS3 thing? I f so th



PS2


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 27, 2010)

today i'm playing mass effect (it was cheap on steam)

i have used cheats to  give me  really good armour    this allows me  to enjoy the  epic story line    and locations  and not have to worry about quicksaving every  nanosecond ...  i like this


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## kained&able (Feb 27, 2010)

I have had to use the odd walk through for assassins creed 2 and fallout 3 but i don't really regard that as cheating to be honest.

The last game i HAD to cheat on was civ 2/3 i just can't do it on prince(2rd??) level or higher i'm not good enough but the level below was far to easy for me.

Cheats are there for the fun, nothing more satisfying the wasting an hour or so chucking all the cheats onto GTA and causing carnage.


dave


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## Orang Utan (Feb 27, 2010)

i play easy and use walkthroughs - i don't think that is cheating though. i didn't think cheats were available for consoles.


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## wiskey (Feb 27, 2010)

Failing to do a certain bit on Zelda on the wii led me to look at the walkthroughs and stuff on the web but even that didn't help me, I must've spent 2hrs just repeatedly doing the same 10mins of game play and never being able to achieve the stupid thing I was supposed to do which meant the entire rest of the game became pointless.  

I'm not a big gamer and rarely do games which have a narrative like Zelda but that has completely put me off from trying anything similar again. When I googled the bit I was stuck on people seemed to fall into two camps - those who did it without thinking and those for whom it was impossible and it ended their game. 

Bad game building imo.


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## Kid_Eternity (Feb 27, 2010)

Ain't got anything against people who use walkthroughs or cheat in single player games. I agree with FM above about failure of design.

Anyone that does it in online multiplayer is scum and should be executed.


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (Feb 27, 2010)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Well, if the plot just doesn't grab you, not much that difficulty can do about that..



Not the plot, I tire of being dead at the drop of a hat. The learning curves are always for these new fangled uberchildren that they make now.


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (Feb 27, 2010)

FridgeMagnet said:


> GTA 3 on the other hand has carefully graded difficulty levels and takes you from a complete noob position through to being any good, without boring you too much. It's also got lots of characterisation (if in huge stereotypes but hey) and distinctive missions; the landscape is also enormous and there's lots of stuff to do just wandering around.



I was talking about vice city. If thats the same then I shant bother.


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## FridgeMagnet (Feb 27, 2010)

ATOMIC SUPLEX said:


> I was talking about vice city. If thats the same then I shant bother.



I'm actually talking about GTA San Andreas here, rather than GTA III - I'm getting confused. San Andreas is the one after Vice City. When I say GTA 1 I mean, er, the first game in the GTA III series, if you see what I mean. Vice City is the 2nd.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Feb 27, 2010)

although i agree with  the fact that anything  that causes you to die repetativly on level one is a design flaw  i don't think cheating is directly linked

forcing someone to cheat  is  of course a design flaw  but   allowing  cheating   to   give a diffrent type of game play  is a perfectly valid  thing


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (Feb 27, 2010)

FridgeMagnet said:


> I'm actually talking about GTA San Andreas here, rather than GTA III - I'm getting confused. San Andreas is the one after Vice City. When I say GTA 1 I mean, er, the first game in the GTA III series, if you see what I mean. Vice City is the 2nd.



Ah ok right. Ok I might get that one then. My brother took my vice city off me anyway. 
I have the GTA 60s london edition in my cupboard. I bet that looks a bit rusty these days.


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## Cloud (Mar 3, 2010)

I've not played a single player game since doom but cheating is huge in multiplayer except for WoW who actually let you cheat with the use of add-ons, some of them very iffy. Going on my experience of Counter Strike and UT then I suspect there are huge numbers of WoW players cheating far more than using standard add-ons. I know Blizzard don't go out of their way to cancel subscriptions. I reported a bot gold farmer for weeks untill I finally gave up.

I know COD MW2 is full of them.


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## Pingu (Mar 3, 2010)

in single player mode i will use cheats. things like fuckloadsd of resources and money in total war etc.

for me though multiplayer is different. if you cheat then yeah ok you may be enhancing YOUR gaming experience but you are also ruining other peoples. 

I can honestly say I have never cheated in an online game of CSS\COD etc. 

as a clan we have no bunny hopping rule. if you hop - even accidentaly - then you suicide - no quibbles. do it in a match and if its accidentla then you suidice and apologise. do it deliberately and you will be out of the clan.

if you are not good enough then hey tough shit.. thats they way the world works. some people are better than you are at stuff.. deal with it.


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## fogbat (Mar 3, 2010)

drcarnage said:


> Anyone played Ninja Gaiden on the Xbox? Now that's a game crying out for cheats.



God, yes.

I loved the first two levels of that. But didn't carry on playing because I _just couldn't get any further_


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## tarannau (Mar 3, 2010)

There's a fine line between cheating to explore a game and ripping away any sense of achievement and tension from your purchase. Admittedly I play mostly RTS games and I have been known to give myself the odd single player cheat - the odd Death Star suddenly appearing over the battlefield or plenty of resources appearing suddenly - but you quickly become aware of the limitations. You expect to win every game then and it essentially becomes a procession towards victory, a vaguely enjoyable one admittedly, but it lacks tension and any real sense of achievement. It's like a hasty wank to an old porn bookmark rather than a successful wining, dining and bedding mission irl. Well, not in the slightest really, but you get the idea.

And I guess, as a veteran of the Spectrum generation, that I still hark back to the era of frustrating and fiddly games, where a single slip on a platform could send you back hours of 8-bit coloured fun to the start.  Things are a lot better and more forgiving in general now - I'd prefer to keep cheats as a last resort if I could, not that they're not sometimes tempting.


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## kyser_soze (Mar 3, 2010)

Poke 35 47 28 39


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## Boycey (Mar 3, 2010)

i think it's already been hinted at: get a wii.



tarannau said:


> It's like a hasty wank to an old porn bookmark rather than a successful wining, dining and bedding mission irl.


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## Cloud (Mar 7, 2010)

Pingu said:


> I can honestly say I have never cheated in an online game of CSS\COD etc.
> 
> as a clan we have no bunny hopping rule. if you hop - even accidentaly - then you suicide - no quibbles. do it in a match and if its accidentla then you suidice and apologise. do it deliberately and you will be out of the clan.
> 
> if you are not good enough then hey tough shit.. thats they way the world works. some people are better than you are at stuff.. deal with it.



Omg the clan from hell. There's guilds like that a plenty on WoW.

It's sposed to be fun


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## G. Fieendish (Mar 8, 2010)

Shippou-Chan said:


> it's also not  just the ability to get to the end  it's simply that some games  are just a hell of a lot more fun  if your cheating
> 
> today i'm going to get drunk and play saints row 2  with the cheats on... because i can  and  it's fucking fun
> 
> saints row 2 is the game gta should be



I wonder how people will react to Saint's Row 3, which reportedly is due for launch, on the PS3/X Box 360 in the next couple of months...


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 8, 2010)

I didn't like SR2, far prefer GTAIV, but there ya go.

Aaaanyway, on cheating, the first xbox 360 game I played was GTAIV and I didn't cheat for about 1/3 of the game, then I did. Since then, though, the only time I've cheated on anything was on DA:O to get some more money (one big annoyance in games like that is that it can take ages to get enough money to buy the things I want) and in Mass Effect (1) where I used a cheat that lets you equip other species' armour. I didn't *need* to do that cheat, but wanted everyone to look swish in their Colossus X sexiness when I couldn't find it in the shops for the correct species  

If I ever decide to try Fallout3 again, which isn't likely, I'm damn right going to cheat my arse off. I don't want to struggle with 1 bullet left and nowhere to find any more when I don't have to. What a fucking drag.

Shippy, Mass Effect though? Seriously, Once you take control of your team it's a doddle (mostly) on Insanity.


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## bhamgeezer (Mar 8, 2010)

Christ even on hard mode Mirror's edge provides no challenge at all, I mean all you have to do is be slightly more cautious about getting shot. Are you sure gaming is really for you? Have you considered?


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