# Manchester United 2012/2013



## imposs1904 (Aug 27, 2012)

There you go.


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## imposs1904 (Sep 2, 2012)

Anybody know why De Gea was on the bench today?


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## Deareg (Sep 2, 2012)

Commentators reckon it was to thwart Saints master plan of putting him under an aireal bombardment.

After watching that big lump they had up front it is probably just as well.


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## agricola (Sep 2, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Commentators reckon it was to thwart Saints master plan of putting him under an aireal bombardment.


 
It is a bit worrying how much the United defence struggles this season against crosses and teams with some kind of aerial threat - you would think that whoever United visit next would have to be absolute nutcases not to try and subject that defence to the same kind of bombardment, especially if they have a forward on their books who is big, strong and good in the air.

Oh.


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## Deareg (Sep 2, 2012)

agricola said:


> It is a bit worrying how much the United defence struggles this season against crosses and teams with some kind of aerial threat - you would think that whoever United visit next would have to be absolute nutcases not to try and subject that defence to the same kind of bombardment, especially if they have a forward on their books who is big, strong and good in the air.
> 
> Oh.


we were very ropey last season as well, I put it down then to so many injuries throughout the whole team, I am hoping now that I was right and once we get a settled defence things will improve, but got to admit I am worried.


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## imposs1904 (Sep 2, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Commentators reckon it was to thwart Saints master plan of putting him under an aireal bombardment.
> 
> After watching that big lump they had up front it is probably just as well.


 
So De Gea should book a weekend break in the Cotswolds for when United play West Ham?


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## Deareg (Sep 2, 2012)

imposs1904 said:


> So De Gea should book a weekend break in the Cotswolds for when United play West Ham?


Don't know when that is but I am hoping that once we get a settled defence he will get proper protection from the other players, but failing that, it certainly sounds like a plan.


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## Joe Reilly (Sep 2, 2012)

Deareg said:


> we were very ropey last season as well, I put it down then to so many injuries throughout the whole team, I am hoping now that I was right and once we get a settled defence things will improve, but got to admit I am worried.


 
I think the long haul flights pre-season may be behind the general sluggishness (RVP apart  who didn't go). Vidic will need a least haf- a- dozen games just to get match fit. Midfield being over-run - again. On today's showing Kagawa will need to beef up (working on it already apparently) a tad - though some lovely touches early on. Personally I'd like to see Jones (energy and muscle) in midfield. Smalling at right back would also improve things defensively, especially in away games. And there's still Rooney to come back. Him and Van Persie promise to be the best pairing the Premiership has seen since Berkamp and Henry.  Not perfect but no need to reach for the tranquilisers just yet.


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## Deareg (Sep 2, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> I think the long haul flights pre-season may be behind the general sluggishness (RVP apart who didn't go). Vidic will need a least haf- a- dozen games just to get match fit. Midfield being over-run - again. On today's showing Kagawa will need to beef up (working on it already apparently) a tad - though some lovely touches early on. Personally I'd like to see Jones (energy and muscle) in midfield. Smalling at right back would also improve things defensively, especially in away games. And there's still Rooney to come back. Him and Van Persie promise to be the best pairing the Premiership has seen since Berkamp and Henry. Not perfect but no need to reach for the tranquilisers just yet.


Agree with all the above except maybe Smalling for right back, I know he has his crazy moments but I think Rafael will end up making that position his own in the way Evra did on the other side, plus I like the balance he gives the team, swinging the ball in, which I think he does far better than Smalling and the fact that he is a RB by trade, I think Smalling plays better at CB as well.


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## Deareg (Sep 3, 2012)




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## gabi (Sep 5, 2012)

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepag...-fattest-dog-weighs-same-as-Wayne-Rooney.html


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## happie chappie (Sep 5, 2012)

Midfield’s been a bit of a problem for some time tbh. Scholes is a welcome return but does paper over the cracks somewhat. I’d have been happy for Berbatov to have been given a chance to play there, before he was shipped out to Fulham. 

Unlike Carrick, rarely gives the ball away cheaply, or loses it in possession, he can beat a player with skill and, more importantly, can score goals. 

Anderson has been a great disappointment as well. In fact the overall goal scoring contribution from Utd’s midfield over the past few years hasn’t been all that great. For example

Carrick - 14 goals in 183 games 
Anderson - 7 goals in 147 games.

Perhaps an unfair comparison but Frank Lampard scored 16 last season alone. Gerrard scored 9.

I know the forwards make up for it but it would be nice to see more of a contribution from midfield.

I’m a big fan of Phil Jones, but I’m not sure he’ll be scoring too many goals.


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## Roger Allknight (Sep 12, 2012)

Rooney as play-maker?


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## big eejit (Sep 15, 2012)

Utd fans living down to their reputation. 

m.guardian.co.uk/ms/p/gnm/op/sDVsvo5NY2mH5iLRAfqL-dQ/view.m?id=15&gid=football/2012/sep/15/manchester-united-liverpool-victim-chants&cat=football


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## Deareg (Sep 15, 2012)

That link doesn't work.


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## Deareg (Sep 15, 2012)

big eejit said:


> Utd fans living down to their reputation.
> 
> m.guardian.co.uk/ms/p/gnm/op/sDVsvo5NY2mH5iLRAfqL-dQ/view.m?id=15&gid=football/2012/sep/15/manchester-united-liverpool-victim-chants&cat=football


That chant has fuckall to do with hillsborough, United fans started singing it after the way you lot conducted yourselves around that little racist cunt Suaraz.


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## Wilf (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> That chant has fuckall to do with hillsborough, United fans started singing it after the way you lot conducted yourselves around that little racist cunt Suaraz.


 Maybe, but it was a pretty stupid week to do that chant, especially as they weren't even playing Liverpool (and, for what it's worth, I'm a Utd fan).


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## goldenecitrone (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> That chant has fuckall to do with hillsborough, United fans started singing it after the way you lot conducted yourselves around that little racist cunt Suaraz.


 
Everton? Cunts.


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## sleaterkinney (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> That chant has fuckall to do with hillsborough, United fans started singing it after the way you lot conducted yourselves around that little racist cunt Suaraz.


if you believe that, you'll believe anything


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## Voley (Sep 16, 2012)

What chant are we talking about here?

ETA: Found the link now.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/sep/15/manchester-united-liverpool-victim-chants


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## Voley (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> That chant has fuckall to do with hillsborough, United fans started singing it after the way you lot conducted yourselves around that little racist cunt Suaraz.


They were singing about Suarez yesterday were they? At a Wigan match? When the biggest news story of the week was about how Liverpool fans weren't responsible for the Hillsborough disaster? Thankfully the management of your club doesn't believe this, even if you do.


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## agricola (Sep 16, 2012)

NVP said:


> They were singing about Suarez yesterday were they? At a Wigan match? When the biggest news story of the week was about how Liverpool fans weren't responsible for the Hillsborough disaster? Thankfully the management of your club doesn't believe this, even if you do.


 
True, however its not that shocking that some of them would sing such things given that they have been _Munich_-ed at nearly every opportunity by many of your lot for the past forty or fifty years.


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## Glitter (Sep 16, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Maybe, but it was a pretty stupid week to do that chant, especially as they weren't even playing Liverpool (and, for what it's worth, I'm a Utd fan).



It's sung every week and has been since the cup game at Anfield. It's no more a Hillsborough song than build a bonfire.


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## Wilf (Sep 16, 2012)

Glitter said:


> It's sung every week and has been since the cup game at Anfield. It's no more a Hillsborough song than build a bonfire.


 ... and given that the words of the chant are close to how Liverpool fans have been portrayed over the years re Hillsborough it's a fucking stupid chant, this of all weeks.  There are plenty of ways of getting stuck into Liverpool about the Suarez thing without using those terms.  It's a hardly a sign that you are keen to express solidarity with the families of the 96.


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## Glitter (Sep 16, 2012)

Wilf said:


> ... and given that the words of the chant are close to how Liverpool fans have been portrayed over the years re Hillsborough it's a fucking stupid chant, this of all weeks.  There are plenty of ways of getting stuck into Liverpool about the Suarez thing without using those terms.  It's a hardly a sign that you are keen to express solidarity with the families of the 96.



It's not just about Suarez tbf. That's was the catalyst. 

There won't be any expression of solidarity for the families during a game at Old Trafford. Or at most games around the country. 

All right thinking people are shocked and disgusted by what happened, everyone knows this. There's the odd bellend who'll sing vile songs about it regardless. But for the most part for football clubs not directly involved it's business as usual during a match. There's a long way to go for Liverpool fans and the families before they get the justice they deserve, this is a nothing story about nothing.


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## Voley (Sep 16, 2012)

Glitter said:


> It's not just about Suarez tbf.


You're right. It's about the perception of Scousers being whingers with a collective persecution complex who should just STFU. Well they didn't and they got a report that shows that they were right not to.


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## TruXta (Sep 16, 2012)

TBH the moment idiot Liverpool fans stop the Munich chants is the moment I'll pile on the criticism about Reds chanting ill-advised shit about "victims". There are moron fans in every stadium around the country. The vast majority of Man United fans greatly respect LFC and their history, and vice versa for LFC fans WRT MU. Doesn't mean that you can't "hate" the club and their players.


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## Wilf (Sep 16, 2012)

TruXta said:


> TBH the moment idiot Liverpool fans stop the Munich chants is the moment I'll pile on the criticism about Reds chanting ill-advised shit about "victims". There are moron fans in every stadium around the country. The vast majority of Man United fans greatly respect LFC and their history, and vice versa for LFC fans WRT MU. Doesn't mean that you can't "hate" the club and their players.


 Not often I agree with Ferguson, but this really would be a good point for _both_ sides to stop all this shit.  Won't hold me breath though.


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## Deareg (Sep 16, 2012)

United and Liverpool fans have been singing songs about each other constantly ever since I started going to OT back in the mid seventies and must have been happening even before that, it is most certainly not a new thing and any fucker trying to say that it has anything to do with Hillsborough is using that disaster to score cheap points, I notice it is the usual suspects.


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## Deareg (Sep 16, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Maybe, but it was a pretty stupid week to do that chant, especially as they weren't even playing Liverpool (and, for what it's worth, I'm a Utd fan).


That is a matter of personal opinion.


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## TruXta (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> That is a matter of personal opinion.


 
And a matter of corporate opinion as proven by Fergie's comments and the recent MUFC press release. Don't be a cunt, for this week at least, is what people are saying. Even if that chant doesn't necessarily and specifically link to Hillsborough, it doesn't take a genius to recognise that it has connotations to that event too.


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## Deareg (Sep 16, 2012)

TruXta said:


> And a matter of corporate opinion as proven by Fergie's comments and the recent MUFC press release. Don't be a cunt, for this week at least, is what people are saying. Even if that chant doesn't necessarily and specifically link to Hillsborough, it doesn't take a genius to recognise that it has connotations to that event too.


 

I disagree, United fans still sing songs about the Busby Babes, about George Best, Cantona and numerous others from the past, we always have, we have always sung songs about LFC, City and Leeds, whether we were playing them or not, to all of a sudden try and link any of this to what happened at Hillsborough is the disgrace, I am not surprised that the suits at OT are taking this line, What the fuck would any of those johnny come latelys know or care about the traditions of United fans? I am a bit disappointed with Fergie, but then again he would have had no choice whether he agrees or not, the suits have decided that this is the line, and everyone connected with the club has to toe it, it is another example of the way these type of cunts are trying to sanatise football.


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## Deareg (Sep 16, 2012)

I have no doubt that the vast majority of United fans will be respectful when we next go to Anfield and for even this one game it would be nice to put rivalries aside in a show of support for the families, it is making my blood boil though at the snidey remarks from certain posters.


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## TruXta (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I disagree, United fans still sing songs about the Busby Babes, about George Best, Cantona and numerous others from the past, we always have, we have always sung songs about LFC, City and Leeds, whether we were playing them or not, to all of a sudden try and link any of this to what happened at Hillsborough is the disgrace, I am not surprised that the suits at OT are taking this line, What the fuck would any of those johnny come latelys know or care about the traditions of United fans? I am a bit disappointed with Fergie, but then again he would have had no choice whether he agrees or not, the suits have decided that this is the line, and everyone connected with the club has to toe it, it is another example of the way these type of cunts are trying to sanatise football.


 
You might disagree, and I've seen lots of other MUFC fans disagree, but again, if masses of both your own and other teams' fans clearly see a link, sheer human decency should dictate you shut these particular chants down.


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## Deareg (Sep 16, 2012)

TruXta said:


> You might disagree, and I've seen lots of other MUFC fans disagree, but again, if masses of both your own and other teams' fans clearly see a link, sheer human decency should dictate you shut these particular chants down.


Which particular chants?


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## TruXta (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Which particular chants?


 
The ones about "always the victim".


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## Wilf (Sep 16, 2012)

TruXta said:


> The ones about "always the victim".


 Yes, the one where United fans are using the same language as the Spectator/Boris Johnson line - 'victim status' wasn't it?


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## Wilf (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I disagree, United fans still sing songs about the Busby Babes, about George Best, Cantona and numerous others from the past, we always have, we have always sung songs about LFC, City and Leeds, whether we were playing them or not, to all of a sudden try and link any of this to what happened at Hillsborough is the disgrace, I am not surprised that the suits at OT are taking this line, What the fuck would any of those johnny come latelys know or care about the traditions of United fans? I am a bit disappointed with Fergie, but then again he would have had no choice whether he agrees or not, the suits have decided that this is the line, and everyone connected with the club has to toe it, it is another example of the way these type of cunts are trying to sanatise football.


 This reallly, really isn't about suits.  It's about whether you want to show a bit of respect - maybe even a bit of _solidarity_ - with people who have been struggling for 23 years.  You can't do that if you are chanting about Liverpool being 'victims'.


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## TruXta (Sep 16, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Yes, the one where United fans are using the same language as the Spectator/Boris Johnson line - 'victim status' wasn't it?


 
The very same.


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## Deareg (Sep 16, 2012)

Wilf said:


> This reallly, really isn't about suits. It's about whether you want to show a bit of respect - maybe even a bit of _solidarity_ - with people who have been struggling for 23 years. You can't do that if you are chanting about Liverpool being 'victims'.


I would hope that United fans do show respect and solidarity with the families, I still take issue though with you and others trying to link that song to Hillsborough.


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## Voley (Sep 16, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I still take issue though with you and others trying to link that song to Hillsborough.


 
Because it's the same mindset that stopped the families being taken seriously for so long. "Scousers have a victim mentality. They're always whinging. They blame everyone else for the disaster when it was their own drunken, ticket-less fans that caused the deaths."

"Always the victim, it's never your fault."

Is it really so difficult to see why the two are linked?


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## revol68 (Sep 16, 2012)

Singing that song just after that report was fucking cuntish, yes technically you could argue that it's a song that's been sang since the Suarez issue and is about things far wider than Hillsborough but singing it the weekend after that report came out is a disgrace, unthinking at best, vile at it's worst.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 16, 2012)

NVP said:


> Because it's the same mindset that stopped the families being taken seriously for so long. "Scousers have a victim mentality. They're always whinging. They blame everyone else for the disaster when it was their own drunken, ticket-less fans that caused the deaths."
> 
> "Always the victim, it's never your fault."
> 
> Is it really so difficult to see why the two are linked?



If you want to dissemble it has to be I suppose


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> United and Liverpool fans have been singing songs about each other constantly ever since I started going to OT back in the mid seventies and must have been happening even before that, it is most certainly not a new thing and any fucker trying to say that it has anything to do with Hillsborough is using that disaster to score cheap points, I notice it is the usual suspects.


 
You don't actually believe this do you? Maybe you are correct and the dicks that were singing it were just totally unaware of the events of the past week, of the massive media coverage reporting the how sections of the political and police establishment had deliberately slandered the victims as part of a cover up of their own roles in the disaster, but that only serves to make them unthinking, insensitive cunts who can't get over petty squabbles and see a bigger picture.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> You don't actually believe this do you? Maybe you are correct and the dicks that were singing it were just totally unaware of the events of the past week, of the massive media coverage reporting the how sections of the political and police establishment had deliberately slandered the victims as part of a cover up of their own roles in the disaster, but that only serves to make them unthinking, insensitive cunts who can't get over petty squabbles and see a bigger picture.


 
I hate knocking other supporters but go to a few fucking games to at least get the feel of how the fans think and feel and have always behaved, we have spent 40 0dd fucking years listening to many Liverpool fans singing songs about Munich and then having one of our players who was the victim of racial abuse further abused by what seemed like the vast majority of Liverpool supporters. The majority of United fans do not sing songs mocking Hillsborough and the majority do not connect that song to it either.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I hate knocking other supporters but go to a few fucking games to at least get the feel of how the fans think and feel and have always behaved, we have spent 40 0dd fucking years listening to many Liverpool fans singing songs about Munich and then having one of our players who was the victim of racial abuse further abused by what seemed like the vast majority of Liverpool supporters. The majority of United fans do not sing songs mocking Hillsborough and the majority do not connect that song to it either.


 
If everyone else, including many United fans and Fergie, could grasp the significance of singing that song in the immediate aftermath of the Hillsborough report why didn't it occur to the idiots who sang it?

You hardly have to be fucking Barthes to cop onto the fact singing "It's never your fault" on the same week the report into the cover up on Hillsborough might imbue it with a bit more significance than usual. So either the people singing it need to engage their brains and look beyond the petty pantomime rivalry for a moment, or they knew how it would come across and need to engage with some very basic human empathy. Ofcourse if they had engaged both their head and their heart they'd have stood in solidarity with Liverpool fans at this time.

Many Liverpool fans shamed themselves in their defence of Suarez's racism, that's not an excuse for United fans to do the same over this issue. Bringing up the fact some cunts still sing about Munich etc is the politics and ethics of the playground, the very same attitude that festers all around northern ireland. There's seemingly always an excuse and justification for cuntish behaviour because of what them other ones did.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> You hardly have to be fucking Barthes to cop onto the fact singing "It's never your fault" on the same week the report into the cover up on Hillsborough might imbue it with a bit more significance than usual. So either the people singing it need to engage their brains and look beyond the petty pantomime rivalry for a moment, or they knew how it would come across and need to engage with some very basic human empathy. Ofcourse if they had engaged both their head and their heart they'd have stood in solidarity with Liverpool fans at this time.


If that song was not connected to the Hillsborough disaster any other time it was sung, why should anyone do so now? It really is a bullshit argument, the song has fuckall to do with Hillsborough, you can argue that rivalries should be put to one side at this time and I would agree with that, but to argue about the meaning behind that song is plain wrong.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> If that song was not connected to the Hillsborough disaster any other time it was sung, why should anyone do so now? It really is a bullshit argument, the song has fuckall to do with Hillsborough, you can argue that rivalries should be put to one side at this time and I would agree with that, but to argue about the meaning behind that song is plain wrong.


 
Because context is everything.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> If that song was not connected to the Hillsborough disaster any other time it was sung, why should anyone do so now? It really is a bullshit argument, the song has fuckall to do with Hillsborough, you can argue that rivalries should be put to one side at this time and I would agree with that, but to argue about the meaning behind that song is plain wrong.


 
Who says it wasn't connected to the Hillsborough disaster at other times?

It's clearly not just about the Suarez thing is it - always the victim, never your fault. So it's about an ongoing negative stereotype that excludes the single most prominent time that they've been accused (very wrongly) of acting like victims? Maybe you genuinely believe that but I don't believe everyone singing it does for a second.

Whatever the background is if you were trying to come up with a Hillsborough related song and push plausible deniability on it's origins to absolute breaking point you really couldn't do it any better.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> If that song was not connected to the Hillsborough disaster any other time it was sung, why should anyone do so now? It really is a bullshit argument, the song has fuckall to do with Hillsborough, you can argue that rivalries should be put to one side at this time and I would agree with that, but to argue about the meaning behind that song is plain wrong.


 
If you can call some some negrito in Uruguay as a term of affection how come you can't do it in England to an opposing player?

Come on you are better than this.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> Because context is everything.


The context then is a personal issue to each individual, if United fans are not in the habit of mocking the disaster and do not connect this song to it then they are going to continue singing it, hopefully not on Sunday though.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> If you can call some some negrito in Uruguay as a term of affection how come you can't do it in England to an opposing player?
> 
> Come on you are better than this.


You were on about context a few posts ago.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> The context then is a personal issue to each individual, if United fans are not in the habit of mocking the disaster and do not connect this song to it then they are going to continue singing it, hopefully not on Sunday though.


 
Context is not a personal issue, it's almost the opposite of it, context is about understanding how your words or actions will appear in any given situation and acting accordingly.

If you can't understand how a song you sing every other week will take on a different tone after the release of the Hillsborough report then you are an idiot.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> You were on about context a few posts ago.


 
that's my point, context is fundamental, your argument is aping that of Liverpool fans who defended Suarez based on literalist idea of language.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> Context is not a personal issue, it's almost the opposite of it, context is about understanding how your words or actions will appear in any given situation.


I am not going to get into a debate about the meaning of context now  but the context of that song is quite clearly about what happened to Evra and the reaction of the club and supporters who heaped further abuse on him.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> that's my point, context is fundamental, your argument is aping that of Liverpool fansm  who defended Suarez based on literalist idea of language.


They defended him because he played for them the context of the term was just a flag of convenience.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> They defended him because he played for them the context of the term was just a flag of convenience.


 
Yes and it looks like you are doing the same because you support the same club as the dicks who engaged in idiotic singing on Saturday afternoon.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> Yes and it looks like you are doing the same because you support the same club as the dicks who engaged in idiotic singing on Saturday afternoon.


No, if a United player had racially abused someone in that manner I would have wanted him kicked to fuck right out of the club, I understand that some times people can lose there temper and say things in the heat of the moment that they would not normally say or even mean.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

You are beginning to sound like that DUP twat McCausland claiming the loyalist band might as well have been marching round in a circle playing the famine song outside a chippy as a catholic church.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

You have lived in Northern Ireland how long and you still aren't schooled in this kind of shit? You learn to read between the lines before you can read here.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> You are beginning to sound like that DUP twat McCausland claiming the loyalist band might as well have been marching round in a circle playing the famine song outside a chippy as a catholic church.


Christ Revol when you miss the mark you do it in spectacular fashion.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> You have lived in Northern Ireland how long and you still aren't schooled in this kind of shit? You learn to read between the lines before you can read here.


I am not sure what you mean with this post?


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

I'm not being rude here but I think it's you who has missed the mark on this one, which is why you find yourself out on a limp from everyone else. You haven't quite went full sleaterkinney yet though.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> I'm not being rude here but I think it's you who has missed the mark on this one, which is why you find yourself out on a limp from everyone else. You haven't quite went full sleaterkinney yet though.


We will have to agree to disagree then but I hope I never end up as bitter and twisted as him.


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I am not sure what you mean with this post?


 
That you should understand how important context is in how language, symbols and actions are interpreted and intended and how something which is not provocative or offensive in one time or place can easily become so in another, and that this is frequently used by wankers to provoke and offend under a thin veil of (im)plausible deniability.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I am not going to get into a debate about the meaning of context now  but the context of that song is quite clearly about what happened to Evra and the reaction of the club and supporters who heaped further abuse on him.


 
No, the context of the song is that Scousers have a victim complex and are unable to accept the consequences of their actions.

To claim that the song was being sub about Suarez/Evra (at home v Wigan) after the events of last week is an interesting view to take.

Let's assume you are wrong - and let's assume it was about Hillsborough - would you condemn those United fans singing it? And if you were at the game and in the Stretford End would have done anything to put a stop to it?


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

revol68 said:


> That you should understand how important context is in how language, symbols and actions are interpreted and intended and how something which is not provocative or offensive in one time or place can easily become so in another, and that this is frequently used by wankers to provoke and offend under a thin veil of (im)plausible deniability.


You are not comparing like with like, that flute band set out to intentionally cause as much offence as possible.


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## agricola (Sep 17, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Let's assume you are wrong - and let's assume it was about Hillsborough - would you condemn those United fans singing it? And if you were at the game and in the Stretford End would have done anything to put a stop to it?


 
Lots of United fans have condemned it, and not that many of them were singing it.  Will there be a similar focus from the Kop when someone starts the Munich thing up again?


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> You are not comparing like with like, that flute band set out to intentionally cause as much offence as possible.


 
The 'always a victim' song is intended to cause offence. Even if it wasn't about Hillsborough (but just happens to look like it is). Fair comparison as far as I can see.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> No, the context of the song is that Scousers have a victim complex and are unable to accept the consequences of their actions.
> 
> To claim that the song was being sub about Suarez/Evra (at home v Wigan) after the events of last week is an interesting view to take.
> 
> Let's assume you are wrong - and let's assume it was about Hillsborough - would you condemn those United fans singing it? And if you were at the game and in the Stretford End would have done anything to put a stop to it?


 
I am sick of repeating myself about this, the fact that we were not playing LFC is irrelevant as any United fan who goes to the games will tell you and I have already explained in previous posts if you care to read back over the thread.

You are quite wrong, the song is about Suaraz and was coined in the wake of his racial abuse of Evra, and then the way the club and many supporters conducted themselves afterwards, including heaping further abuse on the victim of the racism.

I fucking find it offensive that you would even ask me the second question, and what I would do would depend on who I was sat next to and whether I thought there was any point other than calling them cunts for singing it.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> The 'always a victim' song is intended to cause offence. Even if it wasn't about Hillsborough (but just happens to look like it is). Fair comparison as far as I can see.


Bullshit is about all I can say to that.


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## agricola (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Bullshit is about all I can say to that.


 
You are sleaterkinneying now, I am afraid.  Of course its offensive, thats why people sing it.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

agricola said:


> You are sleaterkinneying now, I am afraid. Of course its offensive, thats why people sing it.


When I say not offensive I meant in relation to Hillsborough, any song that United fans sing at Liverpool or any other team is either meant to be offensive or at least to wind them up. fucks sake mate that is the nature of football supporters.


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## agricola (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> When I say not offensive I meant in relation to Hillsborough, any song that United fans sing at Liverpool or any other team is either meant to be offensive or at least to wind them up. fucks sake mate that is the nature of football supporters.


 
Indeed, which is why I think its a bit daft to pretend that that song, sung on that occasion, was not about Hillsborough.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

agricola said:


> Indeed, which is why I think its a bit daft to pretend that that song, sung on that occasion, was not about Hillsborough.[/quote
> 
> Are you saying that it was about Hillsborough on that occasion but not any other?


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## revol68 (Sep 17, 2012)

do you think none of the people singing it on Saturday thought it would be interpreted as being about Hillsborough?

I'd guess some were fully aware of how it would come across and reveled in it, whilst others were just being unthinking dickheads.

Either way there is no justifying it.


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## agricola (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Are you saying that it was about Hillsborough on that occasion but not any other?


 
No, I am saying that it can be about many things - Heysel, Evra/Suarez, their antics whenever they get criticised, Hillsborough - but on that occasion it was probably about Hillsborough.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Sep 17, 2012)

To argue about whether it's 'about' Hillsborough is disingenuous at best IMO. It plays on a view of scousers that has been thrown at them many times over 20 years with direct reference to Hillsborough. No it's not 'about' Hillsborough and maybe it does also relate to Suarez (although it's not 'about' him either is it) but most people understand that's not how songs like that are used. Including a lot of the fans who're singing it I'm sure.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 17, 2012)

agricola said:


> No, I am saying that it can be about many things - Heysel, Evra/Suarez, their antics whenever they get criticised, Hillsborough - but on that occasion it was probably about Hillsborough.


 
Yup - it's the famous Man United 'analysis' of the 'character' of the scouser and probably can be used in reference to any of the above. However anyone singing it on Saturday wasn't thinking about Louis Suarez after the preceding events of the week.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

agricola said:


> No, I am saying that it can be about many things - Heysel, Evra/Suarez, their antics whenever they get criticised, Hillsborough - but on that occasion it was probably about Hillsborough.


Yes it can be many things depending on the mindset of the individual or crowd and if United fans had not been singing this song for a year or more, had not been singing anti LFC songs for at least as long as I have been following them (35 years) or had a habit of singing songs mocking the disaster, then it could reasonably be assumed to be about Hillsborough, but taking those three things into account, I am absolutely certain that that song has never been about Hillsborough, not on Saturday. not ever.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Yup - it's the famous Man United 'analysis' of the 'character' of the scouser and probably can be used in reference to any of the above. However anyone singing it on Saturday wasn't thinking about Louis Suarez after the preceding events of the week.


Have you got a link for this famous analysis?


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## Wilf (Sep 17, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Yup - it's the famous Man United 'analysis' of the 'character' of the scouser and probably can be used in reference to any of the above. However anyone singing it on Saturday wasn't thinking about Louis Suarez after the preceding events of the week.


 Aye. Must admit I'm not that wild about the Utd version of In my Liverpool Home, though it's a bit different.  United fans historically have been no better off than LIverpool fans (hmmm, well, actually, prawn sandwiches and all that...) so it doesn't have that much resonance - it's just an insulting song (and _kinda_ funny ) .  The language of the 'always a victim' thing means it can never be disconnected from Hillsborough.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Have you got a link for this famous analysis?


 
What do mean 'link'?


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> What do mean 'link'?


You said we had a famous analysis for scousers, I was unaware of this, I would be interested in finding out more.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 17, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Aye. Must admit I'm not that wild about the Utd version of In my Liverpool Home, though it's a bit different. United fans historically have been no better off than LIverpool fans (hmmm, well, actually, prawn sandwiches and all that...) so it doesn't have that much resonance - it's just an insulting song (and _kinda_ funny ) . The language of the 'always a victim' thing means it can never be disconnected from Hillsborough.


 
They've always been obsessed with Liverpool, but to be singing about 'victims' and fault after last week is of a different order entirely. Their own messageboards estimate it was thousands (5,000 was one estimate) of them doing it as well.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> You said we had a famous analysis for scousers, I was unaware of this, I would be interested in finding out more.


 
'analysis' was in inverted commas for a reason, but any quick check of what passes for your repotoire of terrace efforts reveals both the obsession and the reactionary nature of the songs.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> 'analysis' was in inverted commas for a reason, but any quick check of what passes for your repotoire of terrace efforts reveals both the obsession and the reactionary nature of the songs.


So basically it is unfounded and means nothing, just like your claim that on Saturday United fans were referring to Hillsborough.


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## Wilf (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg, seriously, what you advise somebody from Liverpool who heard that chant - this week: should they think, 'ah, yes, they are calling us _*victims*_ - but not in the sense that has dominated the news, the big lie there's been for 23 years.  They obviously meant _*some other kind of victim'*_.  That it, is that how you think it would be reasonable for a scouser to react - _*this week*_.


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## belboid (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> So basically it is unfounded and means nothing, just like my claim that on Saturday United fans weren't referring to Hillsborough.


corrected for you


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 17, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Deareg, seriously, what you advise somebody from Liverpool who heard that chant - this week: should they think, 'ah, yes, they are calling us _*victims*_ - but not in the sense that has dominated the news, the big lie there's been for 23 years. They obviously meant _*some other kind of victim'*_. That it, is that how you think it would be reasonable for a scouser to react - _*this week*_.


 
He's had 3 pages to accept a) those chanting it were a disgrace and b) that he got it wrong.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Deareg, seriously, what you advise somebody from Liverpool who heard that chant - this week: should they think, 'ah, yes, they are calling us _*victims*_ - but not in the sense that has dominated the news, the big lie there's been for 23 years. They obviously meant _*some other kind of victim'*_. That it, is that how you think it would be reasonable for a scouser to react - _*this week*_.


Why only this time? Why not every other time? If it was the first time it was sung you would have a point, as a United fan I would have thought that you would have known the origin of the song?


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 17, 2012)

Now onto page 4.

No 'mindest', no songs about self pity, no songs about revelling in victim status, no songs about the reason for seating being introduced, no songs about refusing to take responsibility for actions.

No blame to the lads singing about 'Suarez' on Saturday. Against Wigan. 3 days after the truth about Hillsborough was forced out of the establishment.


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## Wilf (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Why only this time? Why not every other time? If it was the first time it was sung you would have a point, as a United fan I would have thought that you would have known the origin of the song?


 I'm not offended by the song _only_ this time, but _particularly_ this time.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

.


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## Voley (Sep 17, 2012)

Fucks sake Deareg.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

No bollocks NVP, I have been disgusted with United fans in the past, if for one second I thought this song was about the disaster I would be very vocal in condemning it, I know the story behind it and it is not what people are making out.


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## Voley (Sep 17, 2012)

You've had it explained to you, patiently, by us, neutrals and a Man U fan who is every bit as passionate about your club as you are.

You are totally wrong and refusing to acknowledge this makes you worthy of nothing but contempt.


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## belboid (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> if for one second I thought this song was about the disaster I would be very vocal in condemning it, I know the story behind it and it is not what people are making out.


well, try actually thinking for one second


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## Voley (Sep 17, 2012)

Actually that's harsh of me and unnecessary. I know you're not daft, though, Deareg. You really need to think about some of the arguments that have been put your way on this. I don't see many signs that you've even considered them.


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## TruXta (Sep 17, 2012)

Frankly embarrassed for you Deareg. You're a sound bloke normally, have a think here.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

So if United fans stop singing it until after the Liverpool game, would that be ok?


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## Wilf (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> So if United fans stop singing it until after the Liverpool game, would that be ok?


 If you're left posting this kind of stuff, you've given up.


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## Deareg (Sep 17, 2012)

Wilf said:


> If you're left posting this kind of stuff, you've given up.


It is only since saturday that this song has become an issue I am wondering does it go back to being a non issue again, and do me a favour and don't tell me what I have and haven't done, I have followed United for long enough to have some idea about the mentality of the supporters, even if I rarely get to games now  I have never heard United singing songs about the disaster even in the pub before the game, I know it has been done in the past but today it is only a very small minority of shit cunts.


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## friedaweed (Sep 17, 2012)

Defending those cocks on at the Wigan game is quite frankly deplorable no matter how you try and dress it up or build some justifiable context around it. As is singing songs about a group of footballers who died in an aviation accident. It's all wrong, wrong, wrong, and none of it can be defended by anyone who has a modicum of human decency about them.

MUST have embarrassed themselves and the club over this and so has any knobhead who sings about Munich at Saturdays game.

There's some right fucking idiots in both sets of fans. It's as simple as that.


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## Wilf (Sep 17, 2012)

Deareg said:


> It is only since saturday that this song has become an issue I am wondering does it go back to being a non issue again, and do me a favour and don't tell me what I have and haven't done, I have followed United for long enough to have some idea about the mentality of the supporters, even if I rarely get to games now I have never heard United singing songs about the disaster even in the pub before the game, I know it has been done in the past but today it is only a very small minority of shit cunts.


 Just by chance I was just on the Everton thread where, after a bit of huffing and puffing and calling people liars, you were forced to admit they were doing it only a month ago.


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## happie chappie (Sep 17, 2012)

I’ve not sung the “Always the victim” song but I’ve certainly sung the “Murderers” one, as well as “We’ve won it three times” and there’s no doubt in my mind that I was referring to Hysel, not Hillsborough.

By the way Hysel was a disaster the then Liverpool Chairman, John Smith, tried to absolve his fans of any culpability of blaming, amongst others, Londoners and the “National Front”.

After 40-plus years of having to listen to Munich chants I’m not too sure Liverpool fans can claim the moral high ground on this one.

This pretty much sums up my views on the matter:

http://therepublikofmancunia.com/munich-heysel-and-hillsborough/#respond


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## tommers (Sep 18, 2012)

I couldn't finish that blog. This is a grown fucking man.  Jesus.


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## Deareg (Sep 18, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Just by chance I was just on the Everton thread where, after a bit of huffing and puffing and calling people liars, you were forced to admit they were doing it only a month ago.


 
I called one person out (singular)as he has a habit of making false claims about United, the club and the fans, when I got the chance to talk to my brother again he confirmed the song was sung and I was quite willing to admit I was wrong, no huffing and no fucking puffing, the dispute here is the meaning behind the song, not whether it was sung or not or whether all of a sudden the meaning of it has changed.

You and others on here can't even grasp where I am coming from on this forum so I am not surprised that you are totally wrong about what happened at OT on Saturday.

This is hopefully my last post on this topic as, as usual, everyone has taken to either just repeating themselves or completely misrepresenting what is being said.


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## Deareg (Sep 18, 2012)

I didn't read all of that blog but have to say one thing, I do not hate Scousers, red or blue, it is a fucking wind up for me that does go over board sometime but that is all.


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## happie chappie (Sep 18, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I didn't read all of that blog but have to say one thing, I do not hate Scousers, red or blue, it is a fucking wind up for me that does go over board sometime but that is all.


 
It might be a just a wind up for some people, but as someone who was attacked outside The Arkles, and my mate glassed, while being called “Munich cunts” (this was post Hillsborough by the way) I’m not inclined to take such a charitable view.


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## friedaweed (Sep 18, 2012)

This is quite embarrassing now



Deareg said:


> the dispute here is the meaning behind the song, not whether it was sung or not or whether all of a sudden the meaning of it has changed.


 
No that's just part of the discussion and the part that you're presenting to deflect focus from the appalling behaviour of some of your fans on Saturday. The 'dispute' here is also that a faction of your supporters chose to sing that song during the game against Wigan. Their motive for singing that song is fucking obvious to anyone who has half a brain. Whilst the rest of the nation is respectfully acknowledging their shock at the findings of the Hillsborough Independent Panel Report and carrying out formal acts of solidarity with the families of the 96 at grounds up and down the country some of your fans disgraced themselves and your club by singing a song which alludes to the myth that scousers have a persecution complex.

This was done within days of that panels findings proving that there was an orchestrated attempt by the South Yorkshire Police to cover up their wrongdoings at Hillisborough and point the finger at the fans for causing the deaths of their fellow supporters. The survivors of Hillsborough have had to live with that for 23 years. Some of them even took their own lives because of those accusations.

Now excuse me if I'm telling you something that you already know (You should do, the rest of the world knows it now) but if you want to talk about context then let's look at context. The initial Taylor report exonerated the fans from responsibility because it was obvious that the cause of the crush in the pens was due to the police opening the gate that led to the disaster. 'Failure of police control' is what that enquiry concluded. The damage though had already been done via the media, as we have always known but now have solid evidence to prove, and that it was the police themselves who planted a deliberate seed to ensure that widespread public opinion was used to propagate the possibility that the fans were in some way just as responsible as the police for the deaths of the 96. Every Liverpudlian knows that that cloud has hung over our city ever since the disaster took place. We've had it for 23 years. Everywhere I have been in my adult life I have heard that myth resurface years after the lie was first sown by the spin doctors of South Yorkshire Police.

To assist in their concoction of that myth the SYP went to extreme lengths to paint the fans as a drunken mob who caused the disaster. Initially they tried to lie and said that the fans kicked that gate in and surged into the pens causing the crush.They changed the statements of Police officers who criticised the organisational contributions of senior officers who had basically lost control. It was their job to control the event and ensure the public's safety not the fans. They sent traffic cars up and down snake pass looking for empty alcohol containers with video cameras to present them as evidence to discredit the fans as a whole and to cover up the fact that they lost control. They took blood alcohol readings from dead fucking kids in an attempt to hide the fact that they had lost control. They checked the police data base of dead people to try and make it out that they were just 'bad' people that died. They fed false stories to a news agency to deflect blame from themselves and smear the same fans who actually on the day did more for the victims and survivors than most of the police did whilst the disaster unfolded. All of this and more was done to concoct a view that it was the fans 'Fault'.

Some 23 years later and just days after the Panel's report makes public the evidence that proves that a conspiracy to write history was attempted by SYP to deflect responsibility and sway public opinion into believing that it was the fans 'fault'.  Can you not see why a group of people singing "It's never your fault, Always the victim, it's never your fault." Is distasteful and so far removed from basic human compassion that it is actually fucking sick?



Deareg said:


> You and others on here can't even grasp where I am coming from on this forum so I am not surprised that you are totally wrong about what happened at OT on Saturday.


 
You're sounding like a child who has lost an argument mate. I honestly think you need to snap out of this ridiculously defensive mentality if you're actually going to understand what several other posters have taken the time to express to you over this subject. I *can* see where you're coming from and your point of view and it's obvious that several other posters have too. However you're trying to justify something by using an alternative context to the one that the event actually took place in to present an alternative reason for something that everyone bar a few stuckfast Man U die-hards accepts was wrong. In essence you're lumping yourself in with the perpetrators here and I really do feel embarrassed for you. The meaning of the song or the incident that prompted it's origin is a feeble argument to be presenting in this discussion. Everyone knows what the song suggests and everyone knows that it is was linked to Hillsborough on Saturday.



> This is hopefully my last post on this topic as, as usual, everyone has taken to either just repeating themselves or completely misrepresenting what is being said.


 
I think that's probably wise. I think the repetitiveness of peoples comments suggests actually that it's you that's not listening to them and misrepresenting what they have said.



Deareg said:


> it is a fucking wind up for me that does go over board sometime but that is all.


 
and that's exactly what happened on Saturday against Wigan.

It was appalling given the context.

Wouldn't you agree?

Here's a map of the North West just in case you're under the impression Wigan is actually in Liverpool


and here's Louis Suarez in a Wigan shirt


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## Deareg (Sep 18, 2012)

Sorry Frieda, I don't mean to be ignorant and have a lot of time for you as a poster, but I did not and have no intention of reading that post, I glance at the last bit and reckon I know what angle you are coming from and that others have done the same and that I have already answered it.


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## TruXta (Sep 18, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Sorry Frieda, I don't mean to be ignorant and have a lot of time for you as a poster, but I did not and have no intention of reading that post, I glance at the last bit and reckon I know what angle you are coming from and that others have done the same and that I have already answered it.


 
Sorry to say this, but I think you're being wilfully blind here. As Frieda says pretty much everyone has acknowledged the origin and contextual nuances of the chant in question. It's you who's unwilling to see the other side of that contextual coin. Anyway, this is reaching the point of zero return for effort so I'll have no further comment wrt this.


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## tommers (Sep 18, 2012)

I haven't read it, but I'm preeeetttyyy sure I've already answered it.


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## friedaweed (Sep 18, 2012)

tommers said:


> I haven't read it, but I'm preeeetttyyy sure I've already answered it.


It is a bit long I admit but I'm waiting for a washing machine to be delivered

2 fucking hours late now and you know it's going to come as soon as I go and pick the lad up from school


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## Deareg (Sep 18, 2012)

tommers said:


> I haven't read it, but I'm preeeetttyyy sure I've already answered it.


For someone who has been on urban as long as you have you should know that after a while everyone just keeps on repeating the same thing until the bunfight starts, but out of curiosity, did he say anything that has already not been said and answered? or are you just being a fucking wanker?


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## belboid (Sep 18, 2012)

Deareg said:


> are you just being a fucking wanker?


oh the irony


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## Deareg (Sep 18, 2012)

belboid said:


> oh the irony


Oh, the irony!


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## tommers (Sep 18, 2012)

Deareg said:


> For someone who has been on urban as long as you have you should know that after a while everyone just keeps on repeating the same thing until the bunfight starts, but out of curiosity, did he say anything that has already not been said and answered? or are you just being a fucking wanker?


 
I just thought it was funny.  Hence the smilie. 

Bit touchy today mate but no problems - you're getting it from all angles.


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## Wilf (Sep 18, 2012)

TruXta said:


> Sorry to say this, but I think you're being wilfully blind here. As Frieda says pretty much everyone has acknowledged the origin and contextual nuances of the chant in question. It's you who's unwilling to see the other side of that contextual coin. Anyway, this is reaching the point of zero return for effort so I'll have no further comment wrt this.


 Exactly that. Chosing the small bit of context, the bit that can be defended, ignoring the massive context, the obvious one, the hurtful one. Well, it's all to obvious to need repeating.  Bit like turning up at a funeral to tell a family that you hate them, but when called on it, saying 'oh, but the reasons I hate you are nothing to do with _*that'*_.


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## DRINK? (Sep 19, 2012)

Kagawa doesn't run he floats, he doesn't kick it he caresses its, a falling leaf on speed


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## Deareg (Sep 19, 2012)

Nani is having a fucking nightmare.


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## DRINK? (Sep 19, 2012)

frustrating as f, sometimes I hate him and RVP has been as bad, Kagawa has been head and shoulders above everyone on he pitch he must be frustrated as fuck, wish we would start controlling games again


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## Deareg (Sep 19, 2012)

We are lucky not to be behind in this game, great to see Fletcher back though.


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## DRINK? (Sep 19, 2012)

aye, there are flashes of brilliance, some of the football is sublime though all too infrequent, squad is stronger just not sure what the starting 11 should be


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## editor (Sep 19, 2012)

Lucky tonight then.


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## DRINK? (Sep 19, 2012)

lucky, maybe, they made hard work of it without doubt... Galatasaray hit the woodwork twice and de gea made a couple of good saves, both sides had two blatant pens not given, Utd probably deserved to edge it, though if they had scored in the last minute I wouldn't have been surprised or felt they didn't warrant a draw....

Utd are due a performance, hopefully will be on the weekend, though liverpool are due a win, probably lose playing magnifique...


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## Wilf (Sep 22, 2012)

Good idea...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/sep/21/liverpool-manchester-united-suarez-evra
Bit of a high risk strategy though.


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## Deareg (Sep 22, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Good idea...
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/sep/21/liverpool-manchester-united-suarez-evra
> Bit of a high risk strategy though.


I am not sure that it would amount to anything more than a empty gesture and am wondering though thy you think it is high risk?


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## Wilf (Sep 22, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I am not sure that it would amount to anything more than a empty gesture and am wondering though thy you think it is high risk?


 Well it would be a _gesture_ certainly. You think it would be empty, I think it might just have some impact on the atmosphere between the clubs.  Risk would be the reaction of fans on either side who might see the approach of Evra or Suarez as a reason to start one of the 'chants'.


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## Glitter (Sep 22, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Good idea...
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/sep/21/liverpool-manchester-united-suarez-evra
> Bit of a high risk strategy though.



It's a fucking stupid idea.


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## Glitter (Sep 22, 2012)

I reckon we'll get dicked tomorrow btw. Will be a shit game, tense, boring by two currently wank sides.


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## Deareg (Sep 22, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Well it would be a _gesture_ certainly. You think it would be empty, I think it might just have some impact on the atmosphere between the clubs. Risk would be the reaction of fans on either side who might see the approach of Evra or Suarez as a reason to start one of the 'chants'.


 
Unless handshakes or apologies are genuine, or at least not known to be false or forced, then they are empty gestures that fool no-one except those who want to be fooled.
I believe that everybody in that stadium tomorrow will be on their best behaviour, even the fucking idiots who we can normally rely on to let themselves and the two clubs down.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 23, 2012)

No  'Suarez' chant today then?


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## DRINK? (Sep 23, 2012)

So Liverpool fans spent all week demanding respect from MUFC fans, then spend all game booing someone who was racially abused?


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## DRINK? (Sep 23, 2012)

Winning at Anfield feels good. Undeserved? Yes. Lucky? Probably. Rafael/Rio our best players, Evans/Carrick not far off. Avit you scouse rats


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## TruXta (Sep 23, 2012)

12th man wins it for you. As before in this season Liverpool were much the better team on the pitch, but we can't score for love nor money. Impressed by Rio, carried a knock but was still solid.


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## Wilf (Sep 23, 2012)

At least it's not Gary Lineker on MOTD to say 'who knows how significant this result will be come next May'.


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## Deareg (Sep 23, 2012)

United were terrible today, even with 10 men I thought Liverpool were the better team for long periods of the game.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 23, 2012)

Deareg said:


> United were terrible today, even with 10 men I thought Liverpool were the better team for long periods of the game.



Only Halsey and Raphael performed for you today.


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## Glitter (Sep 23, 2012)

Deareg said:


> United were terrible today, even with 10 men I thought Liverpool were the better team for long periods of the game.



Yep.


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## Deareg (Sep 23, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Only Halsey and Raphael performed for you today.


If Suaraz hadn't spent so much throwing himself to the ground and arguing with the ref he might have contributed something to your team, I thought the only real decisions halsley got wrong was giving us the penalty and not booking Suaraz. he was bound to get some wrong, and he can't even be blamed completely for that if players from both teams all over the pitch were cheating.


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## Smokeandsteam (Sep 23, 2012)

Deareg said:


> If Suaraz hadn't spent so much throwing himself to the ground and arguing with the ref he might have contributed something to your team, I thought the only real decisions halsley got wrong was giving us the penalty and not booking Suaraz. he was bound to get some wrong, and he can't even be blamed completely for that if players from both teams all over the pitch were cheating.



Agreed that referees will get some calls wrong. But Halsey gave every borderline decision to United.


----------



## TruXta (Sep 23, 2012)

Deareg said:


> If Suaraz hadn't spent so much throwing himself to the ground and arguing with the ref he might have contributed something to your team, I thought the only real decisions halsley got wrong was giving us the penalty and not booking Suaraz. he was bound to get some wrong, and he can't even be blamed completely for that if players from both teams all over the pitch were cheating.


 
Did you see the analysis on Sky? I think Neville and Redknapp had it right, Suarez should've had a penalty. Definite contact from Evans on Suarez before he gets anything of the ball. FWIW I think after watching it a few more times the Valencia penalty was a tad soft, but overall justified given the rules. OTOH had Halsey been consistent it should never have been a penalty given the above incident.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Sep 23, 2012)

TruXta said:


> OTOH had Halsey been consistent it should never have been a penalty given the above incident.


 
That's a good example of why the whole 'we only want consistency' thing is total nonsense IMO. Setting aside whether the ref made the right decisions, they were totally different situations that have no bearing on each other. He might have been wrong but I can't see he was inconsistent.


----------



## TruXta (Sep 23, 2012)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> they were totally different situations that have no bearing on each other


 Are you on the windup? Or do you not understand what consistency means?


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Sep 23, 2012)

TruXta said:


> Are you on the windup? Or do you not understand what consistency means?


 
Not at all. 'We want consistency' usually means 'they got one so we should to' or something like that. And that's how your post read to me to be honest. It doesn't make sense - you're basically saying that the decision he made on the Suarez claim should inform the Valencia decision, but they were totally different so I can't see any reason why it should.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Sep 24, 2012)

TruXta said:


> Did you see the analysis on Sky? I think Neville and Redknapp had it right, Suarez should've had a penalty. Definite contact from Evans on Suarez before he gets anything of the ball. FWIW I think after watching it a few more times the Valencia penalty was a tad soft, but overall justified given the rules. OTOH had Halsey been consistent it should never have been a penalty given the above incident.


 On Motd both Lawrenson and Ljunberg agreed with Halsey on the key decisions. Valencia was both pushed and had his leg hooked. Suarez got there first - but - Evans got the ball. Also it was never under Suarez's control. As for the sending off - Evans had his eyes on the ball all the time. Shelvey on the other hand went over the top and caught Evans studs up. Evans did not catch Shelvey and also, importantly, there was no evidence of any intent on his part to do so.


----------



## TruXta (Sep 24, 2012)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Not at all. 'We want consistency' usually means 'they got one so we should to' or something like that. And that's how your post read to me to be honest. It doesn't make sense - you're basically saying that the decision he made on the Suarez claim should inform the Valencia decision, but they were totally different so I can't see any reason why it should.


To a degree it does mean that. Consistency has to mean "within the parameters set by the ref within that particular game". Halsey was lenient up until the sending off of Shelvey when he could and should have booked players before that incident. And I do believe that Suarez should have had a penalty, and he probably would have had he not stupidly exaggerated his fall. He was tripped, doesn't matter in the slightest that Evans got the ball later.



Joe Reilly said:


> On Motd both Lawrenson and Ljunberg agreed with Halsey on the key decisions. Valencia was both pushed and had his leg hooked. Suarez got there first - but - Evans got the ball. Also it was never under Suarez's control. As for the sending off - Evans had his eyes on the ball all the time. Shelvey on the other hand went over the top and caught Evans studs up. Evans did not catch Shelvey and also, importantly, there was no evidence of any intent on his part to do so.


 
If anything the opposing reactions of Redknapp and Neville during the game shows that it's nowhere near as clear cut as you're making it out. None of them were the clearest of penalties, but as I've said, if you don't give one there I don't think he you should give the other. As for the Shelvey thing, either both or none go off IMO.

That all aside it was a strange kinda Lancs derby - altho fully in keeping with our respective campaigns so far. Your lot barely shows up but still gets the result, we dominate the game but can't get a result.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Sep 24, 2012)

TruXta said:


> Halsey was lenient up until the sending off of Shelvey when he could and should have booked players before that incident.


 
The standout player he should of course have booked was Shelvey after he hacked down Rafael without sanction.


----------



## TruXta (Sep 24, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> The standout player he should of course have booked was Shelvey after he hacked down Rafael without sanction.


 
No disagreement that that deserved a booking, but that was hardly the only such incident prior to the sending off.


----------



## Deareg (Sep 24, 2012)

TruXta said:


> Did you see the analysis on Sky? I think Neville and Redknapp had it right, Suarez should've had a penalty. Definite contact from Evans on Suarez before he gets anything of the ball. FWIW I think after watching it a few more times the Valencia penalty was a tad soft, but overall justified given the rules. OTOH had Halsey been consistent it should never have been a penalty given the above incident.


I didn't see the aftermatch show, but I have never had any respect for Redknapp as a pundit anyway and am losing it for Neville too, he started off like a breath of fresh air but is fast morphing into the rest of the wankers that they use.
As far as consistency goes, it depends on how you mean it, there is always going to be discrepancy when it comes to making split second decisions, people have been banging on about some kind of uniformity in refereeing as if they were machines or computers for ever, it is never going to happen.
The best we will ever get is honesty which I believe by and large we already have and hopefully the courage to make their own minds up about incidents on an individual basis, which is getting harder and harder for them because of increasing interference and pressure from the authorities and elsewhere.


----------



## TruXta (Sep 24, 2012)

Despite my best efforts I've garnered a very grudging respect for Neville as a pundit. Redknapp is poor, but that goes for pretty much any football pundit.

And by consistency I've never meant that to mean some kind of mechanical uniformity. As I've said it's about setting a bar for a particular game and then sticking with that as far as it can go. As a player you need consistency in terms of what kinds of decisions you can expect from the ref. I thought that much was obvious to anyone who's played the game.


----------



## DRINK? (Sep 26, 2012)

Tunnicliffe's dad put on a 100 quid bet years ago that his son would play for United's first team. Will pocket about 10 grand tonight.


----------



## revol68 (Sep 26, 2012)

Good win that, happy to see Anderson and Fletcher back, the midfield needs a bit of hustle, Anderson offered drive from midfield too.


----------



## Deareg (Sep 26, 2012)

Chelsea away in the next round.


----------



## DRINK? (Sep 26, 2012)

Anderson is so good.....when he wants to be


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 26, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Chelsea away in the next round.


 
Chelsea reserves. Look out for Piazon he looks promising.


----------



## DRINK? (Sep 26, 2012)

It's a reserve team comp.... Utd's reserves tonight, totally different starting 11 from the one that started sun as I recall it...back four at full time wootton, brady ( out of position ) keane, Tunnicliffe ( out of position)


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 26, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> It's a reserve team comp.... Utd's reserves tonight, totally different starting 11 from the one that started sun as I recall it...back four at full time wootton, brady ( out of position ) keane, Tunnicliffe ( out of position)


 
don't quite remember a reserve team comp when you drew city in the semis the other year. You sure its the same cup?


----------



## DRINK? (Sep 26, 2012)

not really comparing apples and apples now is it....

Chelsea do always treat is as a run out for the reserves though...Torres started last night


----------



## Deareg (Sep 26, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> Chelsea reserves. Look out for Piazon he looks promising.


It was united who first started using it as a platform for the youths and reserves back in the 90's.


----------



## gabi (Sep 26, 2012)

Only saw 20 mins or towards the end of the first half. Rooney was running things like Scholes in his pomp. Lovely to see.


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 26, 2012)

Deareg said:


> It was united who first started using it as a platform for the youths and reserves back in the 90's.


 
where great men lead others follow. If Piazon plays he is worth watching as is Marin.


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 26, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> not really comparing apples and apples now is it....
> 
> Chelsea do always treat is as a run out for the reserves though...Torres started last night


 
as did Rooney tonight


----------



## Deareg (Sep 26, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> where great men lead others follow. If Piazon plays he is worth watching as is Marin.


I am looking forward to it myself, Fergie gave debuts to 4 players tonight, I can actually relax and enjoy these ties (most of them) as the performance by the young players is more important than the result.


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 27, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I am looking forward to it myself, Fergie gave debuts to 4 players tonight, I can actually relax and enjoy these ties (most of them) as the performance by the young players is more important than the result.


 
Saw bits of your game but I also watched a bit of Liverpools and I must say their youngsters put their first team especially Downing to shame.


----------



## Glitter (Sep 29, 2012)

Well we're fucking shite. Again!


----------



## revol68 (Sep 29, 2012)

A two man midfield of Scholes and Carrick with two wingers? Spurs aren't fucking Wigan ffs.

Both goals came from breaking right through the midfield and running straight at the defence, make it a 433 and stick someone like Anderson on the hussle. No point having all that attacking talent on the wings and upfront if they can't get the ball or when they lose possession the opposition can bomb straight through.


----------



## Dandred (Sep 29, 2012)

Nice game so far are you enjoying it revol?


----------



## Dandred (Sep 29, 2012)

Glitter said:


> Well we're fucking shite. Again!


 
Yes, you are.


----------



## revol68 (Sep 29, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Nice game so far are you enjoying it revol?


 
I'm watching it if that's what you mean.


----------



## Dandred (Sep 29, 2012)

I imagine that you will have a great comeback in the second half! I'm predicting it right now!


----------



## Glitter (Sep 29, 2012)

Not sure how, mate. No fucking midfield. Again.

Both goals just walked through us.


----------



## revol68 (Sep 29, 2012)

Glitter said:


> Not sure how, mate. No fucking midfield. Again.
> 
> Both goals just walked through us.


 
Can't see it either but if there is one team it could happen against...


----------



## Deareg (Sep 29, 2012)

It was always going to happen sooner or later, we have been getting away with it by the skin of our teeth all season so far, if it was anyone else but Spurs I would have given up on this game by now.


----------



## Deareg (Sep 29, 2012)

Lovely goal!!!


----------



## Deareg (Sep 29, 2012)

bastard.


----------



## Dandred (Sep 29, 2012)

Fantastic gaol by........wait for it.......wait for it........SPURS!!

And then United 2-3 what a game!


----------



## Glitter (Sep 29, 2012)

At least we're playing now!

Gutted I had to shift my ticket - was glad 20 mins ago


----------



## Spymaster (Sep 29, 2012)

Rio's having a shocker.


----------



## Dandred (Sep 29, 2012)

hit the post lol


----------



## Deareg (Sep 29, 2012)

Spymaster said:


> Rio's having a shocker.


Looks like Woy might have wight wegarding the euwoes afte all.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 29, 2012)

Annoyed. Was enjoying listening to this game on BBC London. But they only covered the first half and 5Live are covering the fucking golf


----------



## Glitter (Sep 29, 2012)

Weird, not that arsed about losing after that half. I don't mind the same whdn we show up!

Wonder how it would have gone if we hadn't rolled over for 45 minutes.


----------



## Dandred (Sep 29, 2012)

What a fantastic game!   ​


----------



## revol68 (Sep 29, 2012)

Spymaster said:


> Rio's having a shocker.


 
I don't think that's fair at all, no defender could cope with Bale having a free run from midfield at them, it was the midfield that was missing in the first half.


----------



## Badgers (Sep 29, 2012)

When did Spurs last win at Old Trafford?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Sep 29, 2012)

Badgers said:


> When did Spurs last win at Old Trafford?


 
According to google, 1989


----------



## Badgers (Sep 29, 2012)

Mr.Bishie said:
			
		

> According to google, 1989



Ouch.


----------



## revol68 (Sep 29, 2012)

where's the "Rooney is past it and only rated cos he's english" shite, now?


----------



## Dandred (Sep 29, 2012)

revol68 said:


> where's the "Rooney is past it and only rated cos he's english" shite, now?


 
Was he on the wining team or the whining team?


----------



## Gingerman (Sep 29, 2012)

Badgers said:


> When did Spurs last win at Old Trafford?


 Lineker scored the winner,thats how long ago it was.


----------



## twistedAM (Sep 29, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Was he on the wining team or the whining team?


 
One win and you're getting cocky, but since it's this mob keep on trolling!


----------



## TruXta (Sep 30, 2012)

Gotta say I cheered hard when Spurs got that last goal. Great to see old red nose on the losing side as always.


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 30, 2012)

Spymaster said:


> Rio's having a shocker.


 
Looked totally spent imo . The second goal was like  chariots of fire versus  Usain Bolt.

Great Spurs performance first half good Utd performance second half.

Can't understand  why Ferguson seems to think that Rooney is past it


----------



## revol68 (Sep 30, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> Looked totally spent imo . The second goal was like chariots of fire versus Usain Bolt.
> 
> Great Spurs performance first half good Utd performance second half.
> 
> Can't understand why Ferguson seems to think that Rooney is past it


 
Bale running at anyone like that would make them look fucked.

Funny, on sky they focused on Evans and Rio and how they were often two far apart, but what I think that overlooks is a) the lack of shielding in the midfield and b) the fact United's fullbacks play more as wingers leaving more space for the centre backs to cover.

Also where do you get the notion Fergie thinks Rooney is past it?


----------



## Joe Reilly (Sep 30, 2012)

revol68 said:


> Bale running at anyone like that would make them look fucked.
> 
> Funny, on sky they focused on Evans and Rio and how they were often two far apart, but what I think that overlooks is a) the lack of shielding in the midfield and b) the fact United's fullbacks play more as wingers leaving more space for the centre backs to cover.
> 
> Also where do you get the notion Fergie thinks Rooney is past it?


 
Agree absolutely on the Ferdinand supposed lack of pace - if at 34 with a bad back Ferdinand could still turn and catch Bale - then it is Bale who would be playing in another lower division/league! Indeed the challenge would be to name a single CB that would have caught Bale?

Scholes is still a master craftsman at picking and delivering a pass - but - is never going to get forward _and_ back at the pace required these days. Giggs on the other hand can still sprint but his selection of a pass and delivery is rivalled only by Nani for general uselessness.
The energy muscularity and defensive nous displayed by the Anderson, Fletcher, Cleverly on Wednesday was in marked contrast to the limpness of Carrick Giggs and Scholes yesterday. That is not to say that the former don't have issues too, they have - just different ones.

For all that Utd deserved a draw. There were at least three or four incidents where Utd could have got a pen. Gallas on RVP. Nani pulled down. The hand ball by Sandro. And the bundling over of Kagawa by Walker. But with Foy it was unlikely. (Last year he gave the worst display with Spurs the victims away against the Stoke. Then instead of 2 out 4 pens not given, it was six out of six with a couple of bad off-sides thrown in.)  

On the other hand Utd did not deserve to win at Anfield so are arguably still at least a couple of points up on where they might be. The lethargy of the displays so early in the season I can only put down to the extensive globe-trotting pre-season. Hopefully it will shake itself loose before too long.


----------



## Dandred (Sep 30, 2012)

Funny that Furgie was complaining about not enough injury time!


----------



## Joe Reilly (Oct 1, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Funny that Furgie was complaining about not enough injury time!


 

Why is that funny?


----------



## Dandred (Oct 1, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> Why is that funny?


 
Because at half time he was tapping his watch to get the half ended as soon as possible!


----------



## Joe Reilly (Oct 1, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Because at half time he was tapping his watch to get the half ended as soon as possible!


 
It's far more likely he was drawing attention to latent time-wasting from Spurs even then who incidentally enjoyed just 12 per cent possession 2nd half.


----------



## Dandred (Oct 2, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> It's far more likely he was drawing attention to latent time-wasting from Spurs even then who incidentally enjoyed just 12 per cent possession 2nd half.


 
And still won!


----------



## Wilf (Oct 21, 2012)

Ferguson does a good job of making it all about him and being obeyed over the shirts thing.  Ferdinand is a dick and his reaction that choc ice tweet was (very) stupid. But he's got every right to make a stance over this.  Crude bullying by Ferdinand rather than any kind of stance on racism.  Wonder if what he said about Jason Roberts was a pre-emptive strike to bring Ferdinand into line?  Either way it's a fuck up.


----------



## Wilf (Oct 21, 2012)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/oct/21/rio-ferdinand-kick-it-out-pfa
Ferdinand backed by the PFA for not supporting their own (well, kind of) campaign.


----------



## Deareg (Oct 22, 2012)

Wilf said:


> http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/oct/21/rio-ferdinand-kick-it-out-pfa
> Ferdinand backed by the PFA for not supporting their own (well, kind of) campaign.


 
I am glad Fergie backed down on this.


----------



## Wilf (Oct 22, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I am glad Fergie backed down on this.


 True, though I'm sure he's got it stored away. 'More grudges than lonely high court judges' and all that.


----------



## DRINK? (Oct 31, 2012)

That is a great goal by nani, impressed with Powell, he looks too good to be pissing about in the reserves and coming on in games like this


----------



## Deareg (Oct 31, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> That is a great goal by nani, impressed with Powell, he looks too good to be pissing about in the reserves and coming on in games like this


I wonder is Nani making a statement tonight? It is the best I have seen him play in a long time.


----------



## DRINK? (Nov 1, 2012)

he looked good, though not a good sign Fergie calling him out directly after the game. Thought Anderson was different class, still unfit must be due an injury


----------



## Spymaster (Nov 1, 2012)

The question is, chaps, who was the best player out there last night?

Obviously it's either Hazard or Mata, but I reckon Hazard shaded it.

You?


----------



## Deareg (Nov 1, 2012)

Spymaster said:


> The question is, chaps, who was the best player out there last night?
> 
> Obviously it's either Hazard or Mata, but I reckon Hazard shaded it.
> 
> You?


Anderson or Nani.


----------



## Spymaster (Nov 1, 2012)

Nah.


----------



## Deareg (Nov 1, 2012)

Spymaster said:


> Nah.


It was a brilliant game, and football wise I think it outdid the Gooners/Reading game the previous night, there were a number of contenders for man of the match and Chelsea did finish far stronger and deserved to win in the end but I was delighted with the performance of our younger players though they did look like they were totally worn out before the game ended.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 1, 2012)

Deareg said:


> It was a brilliant game, and football wise I think it outdid the Gooners/Reading game the previous night, there were a number of contenders for man of the match and Chelsea did finish far stronger and deserved to win in the end but I was delighted with the performance of our younger players though they did look like they were totally worn out before the game ended.


 
Most balanced post that i have read on football this week.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Nov 1, 2012)

Deareg said:


> It was a brilliant game, and football wise I think it outdid the Gooners/Reading game the previous night, there were a number of contenders for man of the match and Chelsea did finish far stronger and deserved to win in the end but I was delighted with the performance of our younger players though they did look like they were totally worn out before the game ended.


 
Totally agree. Also enjoyed the previous encounter with Newcastle. I do think Anderson and Fletcher add that something extra bite and energy in midfield lacking with Carrick and co. Anderson was surely 'mom' albeit for 80 mins (3 assists) before being taken off, utterly shagged. Had Nani gone with him Utd might have hung on. Wooton was also impressive up until fatigue kicked in, and he more or less folded. Buttner had a knock apparently, otherwise it would have been interesting to see how he would have coped with both a yellow and Moses in particular 2nd half. Another plus was Chico who looks back to the player - indeed looks a more complete player than the one that broke into the team a couple of years ago. Ultimately, the Mata, Hazard combo had too much for the Keane/Wooton axis in only it's second outing. Still hugely enjoyable for about - 90 mins.


----------



## agricola (Nov 1, 2012)

That game does sort of beg the question as to why Carrick has been used as a centre back this season though - Keane was brilliant, Wooton less so but still decent (and both of them would probably look better if they were partnered with Ferdinand or even Evans).


----------



## Deareg (Nov 3, 2012)

I was starting to think that second goal wasn't going to come for us.


----------



## TruXta (Nov 3, 2012)

Arsenal - 3 attempts on goal, none on target.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 3, 2012)

Thought Arsenal were spineless


----------



## Joe Reilly (Nov 3, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> Thought Arsenal were spineless


 
Your too kind. Had Utd scored 5 (and they should at least have that many) it wouldn't have flattered them.


----------



## Wilf (Nov 5, 2012)

I'm not enough of a football fan to really judge the relative value/strength of the different squads.  However, Utd can have no better than the 3rd strongest squad in the premiership, at best?  Perahps the best forward line, but pretty mixed beyond that. Really is a testament to Ferguson (and Mark Clattenberg ) that they've got to the top.  He's a charmless bully, but that's just what you want when it's time to grind the results out, particularly with the defensive injuries they've had.  Have a feeling they'll get knocked out of the Champs league whenever they come up against anyone good, but till then he'll get the most out of what he's got.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Nov 5, 2012)

Wilf said:


> I'm not enough of a football fan to really judge the relative value/strength of the different squads. However, Utd can have no better than the 3rd strongest squad in the premiership, at best? Perahps the best forward line, but pretty mixed beyond that. Really is a testament to Ferguson (and Mark Clattenberg ) that they've got to the top. He's a charmless bully, but that's just what you want when it's time to grind the results out, particularly with the defensive injuries they've had. Have a feeling they'll get knocked out of the Champs league whenever they come up against anyone good, but till then he'll get the most out of what he's got.


 
Dea Gea, Lindergard,

Rafael, Smalling, Vidic, Ferdinand, Evans, Buttner, Evra, Fabio

Phil Jones, Fletcher, Carrick, Powell, Valencia, Nani, Kagawa, Young, Cleverley, Anderson

Rooney, Hernandez, Wellbeck, Van Persie

Actually in terms of youth/potentia and experience/medals no other squad really compares.

Indeed of all the players in the division the one player that would undoubtedly walk into and demonstrably improve Utd's first 11 is Yaya Toure.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Nov 5, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> Dea Gea, Lindergard,
> 
> Rafael, Smalling, Vidic, Ferdinand, Evans, Buttner, Evra, Fabio
> 
> ...


 
Of city's first team: Hart over De Gea, Zabaleta over Rafael, Clichy over Evra, Silva over Nani/Valencia/Young, Yaya Toure over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley

To put it another way, I'd say only up front have United got demonstrably the best resources of any Premier League club


----------



## Wilf (Nov 5, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> Of city's first team: Hart over De Gea, Zabaleta over Rafael, Clichy over Evra, Silva over Nani/Valencia/Young, Yaya Toure over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley
> 
> To put it another way, I'd say only up front have United got demonstrably the best resources of any Premier League club


 Yep, I'd agree.  A lof the defenders and midfielders are crocked, coming to the end - or at the beginning of their careers.  Evans has become one of the more consistent and Kagawa could be significant.  For the rest, for various reasons, you can never be quite sure what you'll get.


----------



## twistedAM (Nov 5, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> Of city's first team: Hart over De Gea, Zabaleta over Rafael, Clichy over Evra, Silva over Nani/Valencia/Young, Yaya Toure over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley
> 
> To put it another way, I'd say only up front have United got demonstrably the best resources of any Premier League club


 
And Kompany over Ferdinand and Gareth Barry over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley. Yes, yes, he's untrendy and all that but he's been great for three years.
Not so sure about Clichy over Evra/Buttner. I prefer Kolarov even though he can't defend much. Zabaleta is our best left back but he's needed on the right.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 5, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> Of city's first team: Hart over De Gea, Zabaleta over Rafael, Clichy over Evra, Silva over Nani/Valencia/Young, Yaya Toure over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley
> 
> To put it another way, I'd say only up front have United got demonstrably the best resources of any Premier League club


 
anyone over that £23m flop Nani


----------



## Wilf (Nov 5, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> anyone over that £23m flop Nani


 Nani has the most goals, assists in the Premiership... ah, no, he's gone back to being shit


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 5, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Nani has the most goals, assists in the Premiership... ah, no, he's gone back to being shit


 
What Football Manager game have you been playing? I would hazard a guess that Lampard and Rooney probably have the most of current players


----------



## Spymaster (Nov 5, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> I would hazard a guess that Lampard and Rooney probably have the most of current players


 
By some distance.

http://www.free-elements.com/England/ps.html


----------



## Wilf (Nov 5, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> What Football Manager game have you been playing? I would hazard a guess that Lampard and Rooney probably have the most of current players


Football manager - sir, I'm an adult!  I meant last year, when Nani was regularly quoted as that.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Nov 5, 2012)

twistedAM said:


> And Kompany over Ferdinand and Gareth Barry over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley. Yes, yes, he's untrendy and all that but he's been great for three years.
> Not so sure about Clichy over Evra/Buttner. I prefer Kolarov even though he can't defend much. Zabaleta is our best left back but he's needed on the right.


Tbh, I'd take Clichy or Kolarov over both. Evra's not been good for at least a season now, and Buttner looks a total liability. Although I think Kompany's excellent, I'd take Vidic and Ferdinand together over any combination Citeh put out.


----------



## Balbi (Nov 5, 2012)

I'd give Buttner time, I remember Evra's debut against City - absolute horrorshow.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 5, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Football manager - sir, I'm an adult! I meant last year, when Nani was regularly quoted as that.


 
Wasn't even in the top three .He even finished behind Yakubu in assist and goals last year and only one place above Grant Holt.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 5, 2012)

Balbi said:


> I'd give Buttner time, I remember Evra's debut against City - absolute horrorshow.


 
Buttner is the new Ronnie Wallwork


----------



## Wilf (Nov 5, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> Wasn't even in the top three .He even finished behind Yakubu in assist and goals last year and only one place above Grant Holt.


Returns back to Politics and Protest with tail between legs


----------



## Lo Siento. (Nov 5, 2012)

Balbi said:


> I'd give Buttner time, I remember Evra's debut against City - absolute horrorshow.


What was it the scout said? 3rd or 4th left back in the Eredivisie?


----------



## Joe Reilly (Nov 5, 2012)

Balbi said:


> I'd give Buttner time, I remember Evra's debut against City - absolute horrorshow.


 
Buttner's debut on the other hand (goal and assist) got him mom.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Nov 5, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> Of city's first team: Hart over De Gea, Zabaleta over Rafael, Clichy over Evra, Silva over Nani/Valencia/Young, Yaya Toure over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley
> 
> To put it another way, I'd say only up front have United got demonstrably the best resources of any Premier League club


 
Yeah, that's all very interesting and very subjective, but the original challenge related to squad depth not first 11 which is what I addressed.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Nov 5, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> Yeah, that's all very interesting and very subjective, but the original challenge related to squad depth not first 11 which is what I addressed.


Aside from the last sentence.


----------



## DRINK? (Nov 6, 2012)

twistedAM said:


> And Kompany over Ferdinand and Gareth Barry over Carrick/Fletcher/Cleverley. Yes, yes, he's untrendy and all that but he's been great for three years.
> Not so sure about Clichy over Evra/Buttner. I prefer Kolarov even though he can't defend much. Zabaleta is our best left back but he's needed on the right.


 
Gareth Barry is shit, his performance tonight a perfect example....toilet


----------



## Deareg (Nov 7, 2012)

Tonights game is freeview on setanta sports, sorry don't have the channel numbers.


----------



## Deareg (Nov 7, 2012)

Power cut in Braga, both teams off the pitch for now.


----------



## DexterTCN (Nov 7, 2012)

wrong thread


----------



## Deareg (Nov 7, 2012)

DexterTCN said:


> wrong thread


1-1 in Braga by the way.


----------



## DexterTCN (Nov 7, 2012)

Not now


----------



## scooter (Nov 7, 2012)

Cool. Only team on max points - 4 games 4 wins


----------



## Deareg (Nov 7, 2012)

We made hard work of that again.


----------



## DRINK? (Nov 7, 2012)

Utd were pish tonight, no balance, horrible game, still a win is a win and Fergie can tinker all he wants for the remainder of the group, good to see Anderson play 90 minutes


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 10, 2012)

United fans booing during the minutes applause for Petrov... Cue the excuses and justifications...


----------



## Stanley Edwards (Nov 10, 2012)

Hello 

I'm off to watch the second half in the Irish pub.


----------



## Voley (Nov 10, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> United fans booing during the minutes applause for Petrov...


Wtf? Why the hell would anyone do that?


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Nov 10, 2012)

NVP said:


> Wtf? Why the hell would anyone do that?


 
Because plenty of twats buy into the idea that football is all about dumb hostility. It's always been a bit like that where the minutes silence/applause is for something related to one team in particular. That's why they switched to minutes applauses because some of the silences were embarrassing (and often short), whatever the rubbish about celebrating the person it's for or whatever etc.


----------



## Deareg (Nov 10, 2012)

NVP said:


> Wtf? Why the hell would anyone do that?


Fucking morons that's why.


----------



## Voley (Nov 10, 2012)

Yep, that pretty much sums it up.


----------



## Stanley Edwards (Nov 10, 2012)

Oh well. Far better teams give up 2 goal leads to Man U.

The behaviour of your fans was despicable. You should all go say hail Marys at church tomorrow.


----------



## Deareg (Nov 10, 2012)

I really thought we had fucked that right up.


----------



## goldenecitrone (Nov 10, 2012)

Deareg said:


> I really thought we had fucked that right up.


 
I've got to hand it to you lot, kings of the comebacks. Amazing how you keep doing it. We could do with some of your spirit.


----------



## Deareg (Nov 10, 2012)

goldenecitrone said:


> I've got to hand it to you lot, kings of the comebacks. Amazing how you keep doing it. We could do with some of your spirit.


I always feel now that we can find a way back into games, when we scored that first goal I thought we would get a draw but it still amazes me as well.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 14, 2012)

Was impressed with Villas young bargain signings. He is working on a shoe string there.

Anyway here is a rare decent and thoughtful  Guardian article on Man Utds much maligned record signing  http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/nov/13/fulham-dimitar-berbatov-style-adventure


----------



## DRINK? (Nov 14, 2012)

Berbs is a fucking master, it is an utter joy to see him at the centre of a side again, strutting around like he owns the place....gutted he never quite worked out at utd


----------



## revol68 (Nov 14, 2012)

sitting here like a love sick teenager watching youtube compilations for Berba.

Liquid football!


----------



## twistedAM (Nov 14, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> Berbs is a fucking master, it is an utter joy to see him at the centre of a side again, strutting around like he owns the place....gutted he never quite worked out at utd


 
Wasn't he top scorer in the league the last time you won it?


----------



## Deareg (Nov 14, 2012)

twistedAM said:


> Wasn't he top scorer in the league the last time you won it?


Yeah, but I think all his goals came in 3 games.


----------



## twistedAM (Nov 14, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Yeah, but I think all his goals came in 3 games.


 
= 9 points

Actually i think that's what Dzeko has earned up this season already..and he apparently doesn't fit in.


----------



## Deareg (Nov 14, 2012)

twistedAM said:


> = 9 points
> 
> Actually i think that's what Dzeko has earned up this season already..and he apparently doesn't fit in.


He is a fantastic player but it just did not happen for him at OT, a bit like Forlan a few years ago.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Nov 14, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> Berbs is a fucking master, it is an utter joy to see him at the centre of a side again, strutting around like he owns the place....gutted he never quite worked out at utd


 
The clue is in your message: never worked out at OT precisely because he didn't own the place and never would. He can now 'strut around' at Fulham as he did previously at Tottenham because he knows he is once again the 'centre of the side'. Big fishconsiderably smaller pond. The only shame and surprise is that like Forlan Utd didn't get more for him, when he moved on.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 24, 2012)

Last three seasons


----------



## Zapp Brannigan (Nov 24, 2012)

Totally meaningless statistics.  Without analysing games to see if there should be extra time added or not, nonsense.


----------



## Gingerman (Nov 25, 2012)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/nov/24/eric-cantona-20-years-phone-call
20 years ago today....


----------



## bignose1 (Nov 26, 2012)

Gingerman said:


> http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/nov/24/eric-cantona-20-years-phone-call
> 20 years ago today....


see our trip to Paris to interview him for our celebration night last Friday at the Blaize on You Tube...20 years on - Eric meets the fans or @PeteBoyle70


----------



## agricola (Dec 1, 2012)

What on earth is happening?


----------



## JimW (Dec 1, 2012)

It'll finish 10-8 at this rate


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 1, 2012)

Fuck it, forgot this was on ESPN, missed the first six goals!

Tuned in just in time to see one of my FF players be subbed off after 30mins having picked up a yello and conceded three goals


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Dec 1, 2012)

7 goals by half time, mental. Fergie must be doing his nut!


----------



## Deareg (Dec 1, 2012)

Tuned in just in time to see one of my FF players be subbed off after 30mins having picked up a yello and conceded three goals [/quote]
He has been playing like a pub full back for quite a few weeks now, I have lost count of the number of goals we have conceded that have come from the left wing this season.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 1, 2012)

bignose1 said:


> @PeteBoyle70


 
Is he still desperately playing the professional Man United fan?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 1, 2012)

This is going to be a shit second half, isn't it?

(Did you hear that Fate, did you?)


----------



## Deareg (Dec 1, 2012)

That miss is going to take some living down.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 1, 2012)

I honestly don't think it was that bad; he was off-balance, stretching, at speed, just struggled to get his foot round it.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 1, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I honestly don't think it was that bad; he was off-balance, stretching, at speed, just struggled to get his foot round it.


You have convinced me!


----------



## DRINK? (Dec 1, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Tuned in just in time to see one of my FF players be subbed off after 30mins having picked up a yello and conceded three goals


He has been playing like a pub full back for quite a few weeks now, I have lost count of the number of goals we have conceded that have come from the left wing this season.[/quote]

He was immense on Wednesday mom?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 1, 2012)

Was hardly Rosenthal, that's all.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 1, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> He has been playing like a pub full back for quite a few weeks now, I have lost count of the number of goals we have conceded that have come from the left wing this season.


 
He was immense on Wednesday mom?[/quote]
Glad to hear it, I have not even seen the highlights from that game, I think his concentration still lets him down far to often.


----------



## DRINK? (Dec 1, 2012)

Vastly improved this year....arguably my player of the season thus far, still learning mind. Think he was bought off today as utd's lack if height was causing big problems, he wasn't having a worse game than Evans


----------



## Deareg (Dec 1, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> Vastly improved this year....arguably my player of the season thus far, still learning mind. Think he was bought off today as utd's lack if height was causing big problems, he wasn't having a worse game than Evans


I have to disagree with you on both points, I think he has struggled quite a lot this season, it would be interesting to see how many goals we have conceded from that side of the pitch, Evans has actually improved tonight since he got took off, I think Rafeal has a great future with us and I really like him as a player but feel he has struggled a lot this season.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 1, 2012)

Good day for us, 3 points clear.


----------



## barney_pig (Dec 2, 2012)

Bad day for us, Scored three against Man U and still propping up the league.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 2, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> Is he still desperately palying the professional Man United fan?


 
songsmith


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 2, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> songsmith


 
Songs from the bathtub I think they were called. I've known him 20 odd years, he was active in the Militant and, unknown to many, was jailed for non-payment of his poll tax.....


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 2, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> Songs from the bathtub I think they were called. I've known him 20 odd years, he was active in the Militant and, unknown to many, was jailed for non-payment of his poll tax.....


 
last time I saw him he should have been jailed for non payment of his round


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 2, 2012)

The39thStep said:


> last time I saw him he should have been jailed for non payment of his round


 
A far more serious crime if you ask me!


----------



## JimW (Dec 2, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> A far more serious crime if you ask me!


Hanging's too good, etc.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 2, 2012)

Name and shame


----------



## Wilf (Dec 4, 2012)

Thoughts about the citeh game?  Must admit I'm feeling apprehensive with Vidic still out.  Hard to see City not getting a couple.


----------



## DRINK? (Dec 4, 2012)

Not overly confident, Utd aren't great though as per league position the rest aren't setting the world alight, there are significant flaws in both teams though they both keep grinding out results, sooner or later everything will fall into place for one of them and you would assume that team will piss the title As for the weekend there has to be goals though would take a 0-0 now....

Someone was saying the other day that if Utd were to win, by the time Chelsea get back from the world championship or whatever it is Utd could be 16 points clear of them...crazy


----------



## scooter (Dec 9, 2012)

Don't wanna post on the city thread. Why demean ourselves by giving also-rans the limelight?

Nice little away win. 6 points clear. That mad bookie will be paying out by christmas again at this rate


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 9, 2012)

Like he did last year?


----------



## Glitter (Dec 9, 2012)

I was shitting it through most of this.

Nice to see us winning despite the officials best efforts!


----------



## Wilf (Dec 9, 2012)




----------



## DRINK? (Dec 9, 2012)

Carrick was class today and de gea should start week in week out, big win that.


Oh and tevez should have been sent off the kettle neck cunt


----------



## DRINK? (Dec 9, 2012)

Etihad, Anfield, St James Park, Stamford Bridge & Goodison = 12/15 points and tough away trips done before Xmas.


----------



## Apathy (Dec 9, 2012)

enjoyed that game.  football wise it improved loads in second half but i was shitting it!  Big big win for the reds. Get in!


----------



## Joe Reilly (Dec 9, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> Carrick was class today and de gea should start week in week out, big win that.
> 
> 
> Oh and tevez should have been sent off the kettle neck cunt


 
Kompany going off was almost worth a goal. Indeed had he been on, would Nasri have even been in the wall never mind his ten-year old girl's response to the shot. The other question is why they didn't put in an extra man - Hart was like a cat on hot bricks trying to second guess RVP. Guessed wrong. Part of the reason was that Tevez deserted his post to mark Rooney. Goals and assists apart one of the benefits of playing him in the more natural no10 role is the distraction he offers: creating space for others just by being in the vicinity.

In the same vein Jones, fresh on, didn't fill the gap on the edge of the box for City's 2nd. On the other hand Smalling coming on may also have given Utd an extra edge of pace and anticipation at the back.

A tense affair throughout. Rooney's first came as a complete surprise - totally out of the blue - but a superb build up. For the second he was full of authority. Not sure about the penalty shout for Toure on Evra, or the red card for Tevez, and the chalked off goal, was bad, but not a bad as the one against Reading (So much for UTD getting all the decisions).  

Despite the 6 point gap both Vidic and Kagawa will both be welcomed back expecially with CL in mind.


----------



## Wilf (Dec 9, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> Kompany going off was almost worth a goal. Indeed had he been on, would Nasri have even been in the wall never mind his ten-year old girl's response to the shot. The other question is why they didn't put in an extra man - Hart was like a cat on hot bricks trying to second guess RVP. Guessed wrong. Part of the reason was that Tevez deserted his post to mark Rooney. Goals and assists apart one of the benefits of playing him in the more natural no10 role is the distraction he offers: creating space for others just by being in the vicinity.
> 
> In the same vein Jones, fresh on, didn't fill the gap on the edge of the box for City's 2nd. On the other hand Smalling coming on may also have given Utd an extra edge of pace and anticipation at the back.
> 
> ...


 Great stuff.  My level of analysis is more 'ooh, look a goal! Ooh, and another one - are _we_ winning?'


----------



## happie chappie (Dec 9, 2012)

I keep saying it - City aren’t as good a side as they think they are and Mancini certainly isn’t a great manager. A dismal European campaign and 6 points behind a United team which is pretty average at the moment, certainly defensively. 

Mancini’s response to any setback is to get the cheque book out - ffs there’s already talk about who he’s going to sign in January.

The gazillions City have spent over the past few years they should have won the league last year by a country mile, never mind the last kick of the last day of the season.

Mancini’s bought himself a shed load of problems in the dressing room and it’s been reported that he’s not popular with many of the players. 

He would certainly have been out of a job by now if they hadn’t won the league last year, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he was gone by the end of the season, if not before.

BTW – did City narrow the width of the pitch this afternoon? Is there always such a big gap between the touchline and the perimeter.


----------



## happie chappie (Dec 9, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> Carrick was class today and de gea should start week in week out, big win that.


 
Not too sure about Carrick. He does have a tendency to give the ball away a bit too easily, especially if he's under pressure, although his overall game has improved over the past few weeks.

He's better when he's got some more mobile midfielders around him, or when Rooney drops back, but his lack of pace tells sometimes, and an inability to tackle does leave us a bit vulnerable at times.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 9, 2012)

happie chappie said:


> Not too sure about Carrick. He does have a tendency to give the ball away a bit too easily, especially if he's under pressure, although his overall game has improved over the past few weeks.
> 
> He's better when he's got some more mobile midfielders around him, or when Rooney drops back, but his lack of pace tells sometimes, and an inability to tackle does leave us a bit vulnerable at times.


We definitely need a power house type of midfielder, we are so often outplayed in the middle of the park.


----------



## happie chappie (Dec 9, 2012)

Deareg said:


> We definitely need a power house type of midfielder, we are so often outplayed in the middle of the park.


 
Agreed - another Roy Keane would be more than handy. Sadly he's a once-in-generation player.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 10, 2012)




----------



## twistedAM (Dec 10, 2012)

Urgghhh, I have to admit that's a stunning pic.


----------



## Glitter (Dec 10, 2012)

The smoke from the blue flare really makes it. 

Cheers to whoever threw them!


----------



## Ted Striker (Dec 11, 2012)




----------



## gabi (Dec 15, 2012)

Clinical performance this afternoon. Rooney/RVP looks a dream partnership. Can't see City catching us this season on that basis.


----------



## Big Gunz (Dec 20, 2012)

Real Madrid anyone?


----------



## Wilf (Dec 20, 2012)

Big Gunz said:


> Real Madrid anyone?


  
Madrid will be favourites, but even they will be apprehensive about RVP, rooney etc.  Really, really need Vidic playing in that one.


----------



## g force (Dec 20, 2012)

Depends how Utd approach it. If they take the game to Madrid and stretch them at the back they could be in trouble. Teams that have beaten them have tended to sit back in phases and hit on the counter.

If Utd push too much though the midfield could be stuffed. Alonso, Modric, Ozil is quite a trio


----------



## Big Gunz (Dec 20, 2012)

Wilf said:


> Madrid will be favourites, but even they will be apprehensive about rooney


 
Yes those poor prostitutes of Madrid.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 20, 2012)

Big Gunz said:


> Yes those poor prostitutes of Madrid.


At least non of the local black community will have anything to fear.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 20, 2012)

Big Gunz said:


> Yes those poor prostitutes of Madrid.


 
Pot kettle......


----------



## Big Gunz (Dec 20, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> Pot kettle......


 
Oh lighten up grumpy old git!


----------



## DRINK? (Dec 21, 2012)

not a bad draw, I have a feeling Utd will win though if we don't would prefer to go out now than in the later stages, I don't think we are good enough to win it, though as Chelsea showed last year anything is possible and with RVP and Rooney fit, anything is possible...looking forward to it.

Think if Madrid make it in the super cup, their fixtures will be barca, utd, barca, utd which could work in our favour


----------



## Joe Reilly (Dec 23, 2012)

g force said:


> Depends how Utd approach it. If they take the game to Madrid and stretch them at the back they could be in trouble. Teams that have beaten them have tended to sit back in phases and hit on the counter.
> 
> If Utd push too much though the midfield could be stuffed. Alonso, Modric, Ozil is quite a trio


 
Ozil is apparently out of favour as is - Casillas - as is - Mourinho. Plus Ronaldo is off form. Plus the Spanish hate the Portugese. Plus Madrid lost again yesterday. Plus Mourinho has almost conceded the league already. On the down side it's the CL or - nothing.

On another note listened to Alan Green on Radio five live holding forth on Fergie's comments regarding the Williams on RVP incident. Green felt it was a gross 'exageration' to claim that RVP might have been seriously injured. He also tolerated repeated comments from callers saying that the matter had been 'amicably settled between the players' after playing a clip of Williams saying that he not bothered to apologise during the game or even after it, and that Williams was merely clearing the ball when it hit RVP accidentally. Fair enough you might think - except - Williams who is a rather large unit leathered the ball into the back of a prone RVP's head from about a foot away _after_ the whistle had been blown and free kick already awarded for a previous foul. Replays of the incident will I'm sure show Williams looking (which for old pros invaribaly indicates guilt or innocence ('look at his eyes') at VP as he did so. So what part of that was accidental? And what part of that was not dangerous? Remember Manny Pac was knocked cold recently by a punch that travelled about six inches. Oh yeah. And what part of of it did Green witness. Well none of it actually. Hadn't even seen a clip much less the match. Bonkers.

Ps Just seen the interview with Williams. The smirk on its own is worth a ban.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 23, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> Ozil is apparently out of favour as is - Casillas - as is - Mourinho. Plus Ronaldo is off form. Plus the Spanish hate the Portugese. Plus Madrid lost again yesterday. Plus Mourinho has almost conceded the league already. On the down side it's the CL or - nothing.
> 
> On another note listened to Alan Green on Radio five live holding forth on Fergie's comments regarding the Williams on RVP incident. Green felt it was a gross 'exageration' to claim that RVP might have been seriously injured. He also tolerated repeated comments from callers saying that the matter had been 'amicably settled between the players' after playing a clip of Williams saying that he not bothered to apologise during the game or even after it, and that Williams was merely clearing the ball when it hit RVP accidentally. Fair enough you might think - except - Williams who is a rather large unit leathered the ball into the back of a prone RVP's head from about a foot away _after_ the whistle had been blown and free kick already awarded for a previous foul. Replays of the incident will I'm sure show Williams looking (which for old pros invaribaly indicates guilt or innocence ('look at his eyes') at VP as he did so. So what part of that was accidental? And what part of that was not dangerous? Remember Manny Pac was knocked cold recently by a punch that travelled about six inches. Oh Yeah and what part of of it did Green witness. Well none of it actually. Hadn't even seen a clip much less the match. Bonkers.
> Still hadn't managed to see the clip of the incident an hour after the match was over. But still allowed the show to be domnated by


 
It was deliberate but Ferguson made a cunt of himself frankly.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 23, 2012)

Would be good in this thread to see some comments about how well Swansea withstood  MUtd pressure and possessed, pressed and  attacked pretty well themselves at times.

Also Swansea defended solidly when they needed to, which given the 65% MUtd 35% Swansea possession rate was surely impressive.

And I'm not even a Swansea fan meself! My partner is, but I'm able to call Swansea shit at the times when they are (they weren't much cop *at all* against Tottenham last week -- much better today).


----------



## 1927 (Dec 23, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> Ozil is apparently out of favour as is - Casillas - as is - Mourinho. Plus Ronaldo is off form. Plus the Spanish hate the Portugese. Plus Madrid lost again yesterday. Plus Mourinho has almost conceded the league already. On the down side it's the CL or - nothing.
> 
> On another note listened to Alan Green on Radio five live holding forth on Fergie's comments regarding the Williams on RVP incident. Green felt it was a gross 'exageration' to claim that RVP might have been seriously injured. He also tolerated repeated comments from callers saying that the matter had been 'amicably settled between the players' after playing a clip of Williams saying that he not bothered to apologise during the game or even after it, and that Williams was merely clearing the ball when it hit RVP accidentally. Fair enough you might think - except - Williams who is a rather large unit leathered the ball into the back of a prone RVP's head from about a foot away _after_ the whistle had been blown and free kick already awarded for a previous foul. Replays of the incident will I'm sure show Williams looking (which for old pros invaribaly indicates guilt or innocence ('look at his eyes') at VP as he did so. So what part of that was accidental? And what part of that was not dangerous? Remember Manny Pac was knocked cold recently by a punch that travelled about six inches. Oh Yeah and what part of of it did Green witness. Well none of it actually. Hadn't even seen a clip much less the match. Bonkers.


 
You are making a big a dick of yeslef as SirAlex.


----------



## DexterTCN (Dec 23, 2012)

All Fergie did was distract from a couple of poor performances.

The Van Persie incident is awesome, I think it's the first time I've ever seen him lose it.   He was so angry he fell down getting up.


----------



## LiamO (Dec 24, 2012)

anyone got a link to the RVP thing?


e2a... seen it... inconclusive.

yes he does have a look... seems to be at the ball rather than RVP...

and _totally_ slices his clearance. Messi would do well to hit RVP from that angle... with his leg going in an opposite direction.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Dec 24, 2012)

1927 said:


> You are making a big a dick of yeslef as SirAlex.


 
You put your own fat head in the way of ball that would have travelled 50 yards and see how it feels.


----------



## friedaweed (Dec 24, 2012)




----------



## DexterTCN (Dec 24, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> You put your own fat head in the way of ball that would have travelled 50 yards and see how it feels.


That would have hurt like fuck in the back of the head, unexpected....


----------



## wreckhead (Dec 24, 2012)

looking forward to the gif remixes of this


----------



## AverageJoe (Dec 24, 2012)

He didn't fall down. He was tripped by Chico. And Ferguson did the right thing. Find a point in the game that he would say something outrageous and then the media would concentrate on that rather than the fact that United were matched,and on some parts, outplayed by Swansea.
If he genuinely thought that was the worst thing he had seen then hr forgot about Cantona vs Palace fan,Keane vs numerous and every Scholes tackles ever. He knew why he was saying what he was saying. He was protecting his team.


----------



## DRINK? (Dec 24, 2012)

Exactly, say something that everyone will pick up on and destroy all whilst skipping over the fact that utd were very poor. Rooney possibly his worst game in a utd shirt, Valencia what has happened to him, Carrick was class again we would be really fucked if he got injured. Still 4 points clear at chrimbo would have taken that at start of season


----------



## imposs1904 (Dec 24, 2012)

friedaweed said:


>




Looks like he accidentally sliced his clearance. Genuine mistake.


----------



## friedaweed (Dec 24, 2012)

imposs1904 said:


> Looks like he accidentally sliced his clearance. Genuine mistake.


I think so I also think Rudolph calling for his banning should be treated like when a player tries to get another player booked. He should be fined and told to shut the fuck up. RVP was lucky to escape a red for his indecent groping attempt. Reminded me of the Haye v Kitchko fight where it looked like Haye was giving Vlad a blowjob.


----------



## mack (Dec 24, 2012)

imposs1904 said:


> Looks like he accidentally sliced his clearance. Genuine mistake.


 
Attempted murder if Slur Alex has his way, think he's started early on the sherry this year. Fucking retire already


----------



## 1927 (Dec 24, 2012)

Joe Reilly said:


> You put your own fat head in the way of ball that would have travelled 50 yards and see how it feels.


Hardly a rosk of death tho eh?

And more disturbing was the way that RVP gets up and starts on Ashley Williams. he should have walked for that. Its no wonder that players behave the way they do when Siralex defends the indefensible. Manure were held to a draw by a good side and they cant accept it.


----------



## 1927 (Dec 24, 2012)

If you actually look at Siralex's reaction at the time of the incident, there basically wasnt any, didnt even chew a bit quicker on his gum, The whole reaction was spomething dreamt up between then and the fianl whistle. If he doesnt find himslef on an FA charge for this and his comments about the ref then the FA are bent end of!


----------



## 1927 (Dec 24, 2012)

lets put this in context. What Roy keane does above is dangerous, what Ashley Williams did wasnt.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 24, 2012)

LiamO said:


> anyone got a link to the RVP thing?
> 
> 
> e2a... seen it... inconclusive.
> ...


Put your fucking glasses on.


----------



## 1927 (Dec 24, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Put your fucking glasses on.


 
If you wore glasses they'd only have one lens wouldnt they?

Anyome who thinks that siralex has a point on this wants to stop watching sport of admot that they are a manure fan.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 24, 2012)

1927 said:


> If you wore glasses they'd only have one lens wouldnt they?
> 
> Anyome who thinks that siralex has a point on this wants to stop watching sport of admot that they are a manure fan.


Fuckoff, you silly fucker.


----------



## 1927 (Dec 24, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Fuckoff, you silly fucker.


 
so you really believe that RVP could have been killed and AW did it deliberately do you?


----------



## Deareg (Dec 24, 2012)

1927 said:


> so you really believe that RVP could have been killed and AW did it deliberately do you?


No and yes.


----------



## 1927 (Dec 24, 2012)

Deareg said:


> No and yes.


 
So siralex doesnt have a point then, end of, qed.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 24, 2012)

1927 said:


> So siralex doesnt have a point then, end of, qed.


What are you on about?


----------



## 1927 (Dec 24, 2012)

Deareg said:


> What are you on about?


 

well if RVP wasnt in danger of his life, as you have admitted, siralex was being a prick


----------



## Deareg (Dec 24, 2012)

1927 said:


> well if RVP wasnt in danger of his life, as you have admitted, siralex was being a prick


What has any of this got to do with anything that I have posted? I still don't know what you are on about.


----------



## friedaweed (Dec 24, 2012)

All lucky to be alive


----------



## twistedAM (Dec 24, 2012)

First time I've seen that. Ashley Williams didn't look to bothered when  van Persie slipped into his groin area.


----------



## friedaweed (Dec 24, 2012)

Now known as the Van Persie pincer maneuver


----------



## goldenecitrone (Dec 24, 2012)

friedaweed said:


> All lucky to be alive




Don't let fergie see it. He'll think it's a snuff video.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 24, 2012)




----------



## Joe Reilly (Dec 24, 2012)

1927 said:


> Hardly a rosk of death tho eh?
> 
> And more disturbing was the way that RVP gets up and starts on Ashley Williams. he should have walked for that. Its no wonder that players behave the way they do when Siralex defends the indefensible. Manure were held to a draw by a good side and they cant accept it.


 
'A rosk'?


----------



## tommers (Dec 24, 2012)

Hahaha! He misspelled 'risk'!

Brilliant. That's hilarious.


----------



## Ponyutd (Dec 25, 2012)

Breaking news; FA to introduce sponge footballs and safety helmets after van Persie near death experience.
via Twitter


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 25, 2012)

AverageJoe said:


> He didn't fall down. He was tripped by Chico. And Ferguson did the right thing. *Find a point in the game that he would say something outrageous and then the media would concentrate on that rather than the fact that United were matched,and on some parts, outplayed by Swansea.*


 
Spot on, especially the bolded bit.

His claim that Robin van Persie could have been killed was a ridiculous overeggeration too -- but also deliberate as Joe correctly says.



> If he genuinely thought that was the worst thing he had seen *then hr forgot about Cantona vs Palace fan,Keane vs numerous and every Scholes tackles ever*. He knew why he was saying what he was saying. He was protecting his team.


 
Again, all true.


----------



## LiamO (Dec 26, 2012)

Deareg said:


> Put your fucking glasses on.


 
Take your blinkers off


----------



## 1927 (Dec 26, 2012)

BBC Sport said:
			
		

> Man Utd 1-2 Newcastle
> Speaking of the hairdryer, referee Mike Dean is now getting the full repertoire as Sir Alex Ferguson is dishing out a severe rebuking to the referee. And now the fourth official and the linesman get the full attack. That was extraordinary!


 
He's losing the plot!


----------



## Mungy (Dec 26, 2012)

hope thats on MotD tonight


----------



## Deareg (Dec 26, 2012)

Wish to fuck Fergie would sort that defence out.


----------



## not-bono-ever (Dec 26, 2012)

fuckpigs


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 26, 2012)

Your team are a bunch of rotters, and no mistake!


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 26, 2012)

Real Madrid will be shitting themselves against that defence


----------



## skyscraper101 (Dec 26, 2012)

6 points clear lovely.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 26, 2012)

Very early


----------



## big eejit (Dec 26, 2012)

Pathetic bullying of the linesman in today's game by Ferguson. Embarrassing.


----------



## DRINK? (Dec 29, 2012)

Kagawa is amazing


----------



## Joe Reilly (Dec 29, 2012)

DRINK? said:


> Kagawa is amazing


 
Vidic was immense. Exactly what the defence has been missing: first to the ball, dominant in the air - an all round symbol of organisation and defiance.


----------



## Deareg (Dec 29, 2012)

We are still getting over run in midfield far too often.


----------



## DRINK? (Jan 1, 2013)

Robin Van Persie is ridiculous. I genuinely didn't know he was quite this good until he joined United.


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 2, 2013)

https://mobile.twitter.com/BBCSporf/status/286200987113373696/photo/1


----------



## Deareg (Jan 3, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> https://mobile.twitter.com/BBCSporf/status/286200987113373696/photo/1


You took your time.


----------



## DRINK? (Jan 3, 2013)

Deareg said:


> You took your time.


 
he had a big game to watch last night


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 3, 2013)

DRINK? said:


> he had a big game to watch last night


 
Lasted an eternity until they scored


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 4, 2013)

I see Rudolph's making a cock out of himself again..
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20915309



> *Sir Alex Ferguson accuses Tottenham over Zeki Fryers deal*
> Manchester United manager Sir Alex Ferguson has accused Tottenham of "blatant manipulation" over the signing of defender Zeki Fryers and wants the Premier League to investigate the deal.


----------



## chieftain (Jan 5, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> I see Rudolph's making a cock out of himself again..
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20915309



Fergie is a massive hypocrite. It's great to wind him up though!


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

chieftain said:


> Fergie is a massive hypocrite. It's great to wind him up though!


I hear he has lost numerous nights sleep over your trolling him.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

Cracking goal! was just wondering are there any west Ham fans at the game? All I can here are United.


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Deareg said:


> Cracking goal! was just wondering are there any west Ham fans at the game? All I can here are United.


Did you not hear them then when the equalizer went in?


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> Did you not hear them then when the equalizer went in?


Yeah, but not until then.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> Did you not hear them then when the equalizer went in?


And they have gone back to sleep again.


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Deareg said:


> And they have gone back to sleep again.


Maybe Fergie's been boring everyone off to bye byes again with his "It's not fair" tales from the boozy crypt.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> Maybe Fergie's been boring everyone off to bye byes again with his "It's not fair" tales from the boozy crypt.


Fergie is a moaner, it is the rest of the cunts who whine, and that's a fact!


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Deareg said:


> Fergie is a moaner, it is the rest of the cunts who whine, *and that's a fact!*


Is that you Tobyjug I thought you'd left ages ago dude


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> Is that you Tobyjug I thought you'd left ages ago dude


No mate, it's Rafa.


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Deareg said:


> No mate, it's Rafa.


This is no true you speak in sentences you filthy manc scum and almost make sense.

Scholes lucky to still be on the turf


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> This is no true you speak in sentences you filthy manc scum and almost make sense.
> 
> Scholes lucky to still be on the turf


More sense than Rogers at least, "if our players don't get penalties when they dive they will have to start diving" that must be scouse sense!


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Deareg said:


> More sense than Rogers at least, "if our players don't get penalties when they dive they will have to start diving" that must be scouse sense!


BIG FAT YAWN......
Turning out a good game this from the quiet hammers


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Fergies arse is twitchin. Bringin on his little botty boys now


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 5, 2013)

Jeeeeeeesus!


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 5, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> Fergies arse is twitchin. Bringin on his little botty boys now


Did rather well for him!


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Fergie time


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 5, 2013)

They'd barely played 30 seconds!

Valencia had a bit of a rubbish game, as did Kagawa.


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 5, 2013)

Chatty twats


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

Missed the last 20 minutes, had to drive the wife to fuckin bingo.


----------



## tommers (Jan 5, 2013)

Heh, that's cheered me up.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 5, 2013)

Beckham and sons missed the van Persie goal too


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

Midfield lets us down time and time again, two almost unchallenged crosses and two unmarked and unchallenged headers, this is gonna fuckin catch us out sooner or later.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 5, 2013)

Lord Camomile said:


> Beckham and sons missed the van Persie goal too


He is probably still trying to find a bingo hall for posh.


----------



## tommers (Jan 8, 2013)

Karren Brady said:
			
		

> United’s chief executive David Gill told me that he was tired of having the highest prices forced on him at away games.
> 
> That is one reason we chose to make this game one of our ‘making football affordable’ fixtures, with tickets available at £20 for adults and £10 for kids for season-ticket holders of both clubs.'


 
So it seems strange that away tickets for the replay are £45.

Cheers David.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 8, 2013)

tommers said:


> So it seems strange that away tickets for the replay are £45.
> 
> Cheers David.


Contact the club or local news or something, it sounds like he has cocked up somewhere but he has advertised them at £20 so he should honour it.


----------



## tommers (Jan 8, 2013)

Nah, he moaned that Man Utd always pay higher away prices.

So we lowered our price for the first tie to £20 "partly in response."

He decides to charge us £45 for the return.

I imagine it has something to do with your season ticket holders having to automatically buy a ticket but still... bit of a cheek.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 9, 2013)

tommers said:


> Nah, he moaned that Man Utd always pay higher away prices.
> 
> So we lowered our price for the first tie to £20 "partly in response."
> 
> ...


It is cuntish it is also cuntish forcing ST holders to pay for cup games even more so in a recession.


----------



## tommers (Jan 9, 2013)

Deareg said:


> It is cuntish it is also cuntish forcing ST holders to pay for cup games even more so in a recession.


 
How much are your normal prices?  Do they ramp it up for the cup games?


----------



## Deareg (Jan 9, 2013)

tommers said:


> How much are your normal prices? Do they ramp it up for the cup games?


Normal prices vary as at other clubs, my brothers season ticket works out at I think £34 a game, have no idea about away fans anymore, when I used to go regularly up until 89 away fans were charged pretty much the same as United fans, prices only went up when we got to the later stages of cup competitions if I remember correctly, all league games were and I think still the same price at OT.


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 9, 2013)

tommers said:


> So it seems strange that away tickets for the replay are £45.
> 
> Cheers David.


 
Most people from London will be in the home supporters areas anyway


----------



## Deareg (Jan 12, 2013)

A twitter map claiming to show which teams are the most popular around Britain.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/interactive/2013/jan/11/premier-league-team-twitter-map


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 13, 2013)

Pitch at OT looks rough in places


----------



## Deareg (Jan 13, 2013)

I thought we were going to fuck that up in the second half.


----------



## agricola (Jan 13, 2013)

Deareg said:


> I thought we were going to fuck that up in the second half.


 
I think someone robbed your midfield whilst all that smoke was blowing about.


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 13, 2013)

Not the best game to watch as a neutral


----------



## Deareg (Jan 13, 2013)

agricola said:


> I think someone robbed your midfield whilst all that smoke was blowing about.


We went to the dogs in the second half, a lot of our defensive mistakes come following mistakes from midfield putting the defenders under pressure.


----------



## TruXta (Jan 13, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> Not the best game to watch as a neutral


Never is really, can't remember the last time the two teams had a proper entertaining encounter.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jan 14, 2013)

Old Toilet - Full of Rats

http://fcbusiness.co.uk/news/articl...=old+trafford+food+hygiene+concerns+uncovered


----------



## Deareg (Jan 16, 2013)

That was one of the worst penalties I have ever seen.


----------



## Balbi (Jan 16, 2013)




----------



## tommers (Jan 16, 2013)

Deareg said:


> That was one of the worst penalties I have ever seen.


 
Even though we lost I will still have the lingering, beautiful taste of natural justice that was engendered by that wooly haired, pig twat skying it.  Thank you Wayne.


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 16, 2013)

Probably the worst cup tie I have seen


----------



## tommers (Jan 16, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> Probably the worst cup tie I have seen



It was dull wasn't it? Neither side seemed to particularly care as shown by selections.  We ended up with Elliot Lee up front for God's sake.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 17, 2013)

tommers said:


> It was dull wasn't it? Neither side seemed to particularly care as shown by selections. We ended up with Elliot Lee up front for God's sake.


It did feel like a training game or end of season mid table game.


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

Ryan Giggs is something else. If he doesn't get injured he looks like he's good for another season at least.


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 17, 2013)

Deareg said:


> It did feel like a training game or end of season mid table game.


 
Andersons pass that led to the goal was good but he just disappeared after that.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 17, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> Andersons pass that led to the goal was good but he just disappeared after that.


I actually lost interest in watching the game and didn't even notice that! It is a shame that the FA cup has become what it is, I used to love it, it really did have a special buzz that was completely different to any other game.


----------



## tommers (Jan 17, 2013)

Deareg said:


> I actually lost interest in watching the game and didn't even notice that! It is a shame that the FA cup has become what it is, I used to love it, it really did have a special buzz that was completely different to any other game.


 
Yeah, I can understand why BFS put out the team he did but it's sad that priorities have changed that much.


----------



## hammerntongues (Jan 17, 2013)

tommers said:


> Yeah, I can understand why BFS put out the team he did but it's sad that priorities have changed that much.


 
In a few years time will we remember the day we beat bottom placed QPR because we rested some of our players against top placed Man Utd ? We had a second chance last night against a much weakened side , they were there for the taking . Bollocks .


----------



## Deareg (Jan 17, 2013)

I am hearing that Fletcher is out for the rest of the season.


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 20, 2013)

No doubt about it  city must be kicking themselves every game for not signing RVP


----------



## Deareg (Jan 20, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> No doubt about it city must be kicking themselves every game for not signing RVP


I don't think it was for a lack of effort.


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 20, 2013)

Deareg said:


> I don't think it was for a lack of effort.


Not sure on that at all ?


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 20, 2013)

Give man Manchester united their due here,very disciplined against a well organised spurs


----------



## Deareg (Jan 20, 2013)

Can't really argue with goal, that is the best defensive display probably for a couple of seasons.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 20, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> Not sure on that at all ?


Yeah, they tried like fuck but he set his heart on United, for a while I thought that they were going to get him because they offered far higher wages.


----------



## Favelado (Jan 20, 2013)

I am laughing out loud.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 20, 2013)

Favelado said:


> I am laughing out loud.


State the obvious much?


----------



## Favelado (Jan 20, 2013)

Deareg said:


> State the obvious much?


 
That's such a crap little turn of phrase that people do. Besides, stating the obvious is hugely underrated. This also puts the door marked "revenge" ajar for you as you lift your 20th title. The last laugh will be all yours.


----------



## friedaweed (Jan 20, 2013)

Thought manure looked pretty ordinary today. I think without RVP they'd be about 4th this season.
Everton are looking a much better 'team' .


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 20, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> Thought manure looked pretty ordinary today. I think without RVP they'd be about 4th this season.
> Everton are looking a much better 'team' .


 
I think the data says ninth or something. I thought it was a very good away performance by Man Utd until the last minute equaliser.They were more resolute in defending than in any game I have watched. I will give AVB his due ;they persisted and persisted, kept possession  and kept their shape. Draw has to be a fair result.


----------



## agricola (Jan 20, 2013)

It could be worse, at least Real Madrid arent in any kind of form at the moment....


----------



## tommers (Jan 21, 2013)

I presume that old red face will get a disrepute charge like big Sam did after questioning the officials on Wednesday?

Bound to.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Jan 21, 2013)

agricola said:


> It could be worse, at least Real Madrid arent in any kind of form at the moment....


in fairness, Rayo won at La Mestalla too.


----------



## Wilf (Jan 21, 2013)

Certainly looked like a penalty on the (blurry) clip I saw - but I'd accept the decision on the swings and roundabouts principle.  I'd also have taken a 1-1 before kick off.   Just once, _just fucking once_, it would be nice if Ferguson could muster a bit of good grace.  Ah well, suppose that's what makes him Ferguson...


----------



## Joe Reilly (Jan 21, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> I think the data says ninth or something. I thought it was a very good away performance by Man Utd until the last minute equaliser.They were more resolute in defending than in any game I have watched. I will give AVB his due ;they persisted and persisted, kept possession and kept their shape. Draw has to be a fair result.


 
Agree. Despite equaliser, that did indeed look like a team that _could_ lift the title. Vidic/Carrick immense. In too many other games as against less impresssive opposition, though Utd did come away with a win in the end, there remained a sense of fraility, a sense that but for the swasbuckling offensive department, the season would be littered with points dropped, often unnecessarily. Which might explain why, despite Fergie digging out the linesman, he addressed the positives while  demeanour appeared almost serene.


----------



## Deareg (Jan 30, 2013)

A good couple of nights for United.


----------



## Glitter (Apr 22, 2013)

Please please please please please.

Gutted I'm not there tonight!


----------



## The39thStep (Apr 22, 2013)

been a very poor league this season


----------



## Glitter (Apr 22, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> been a very poor league this season



Agreed. Has been for a few years now.

Shaping up to be alright tonight though


----------



## Ponyutd (Apr 22, 2013)




----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2013)

3-0 up already with Van Persie on a hat trick!


----------



## The39thStep (Apr 22, 2013)

Glitter said:


> Agreed. Has been for a few years now.
> 
> Shaping up to be alright tonight though


 
The real test is Europe. Tonight , well it keeps QPR up a week i think.


----------



## TheHoodedClaw (Apr 22, 2013)

Piers Morgan is really hurting on his twitter feed 

https://twitter.com/piersmorgan


----------



## Glitter (Apr 22, 2013)

The39thStep said:


> The real test is Europe. Tonight , well it keeps QPR up a week i think.



We need a midfield for Europe. We haven't had one of those for years 

I'd give my left tit for Yaya Toure frankly.


----------



## peterkro (Apr 22, 2013)

Ponyutd said:


>


Indeed,how the fuck did RVP do that.I bet if he tried another thousand times he'd fail.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2013)

Poor old Ravi Visvesvaraya Prasad (@rvp) must be really pissed off with Twitter tonight


----------



## Glitter (Apr 22, 2013)

Badgers said:


> Poor old Ravi Visvesvaraya Prasad (@rvp) must be really pissed off with Twitter tonight



I *might* have tweeted him once or twice.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2013)

Glitter said:
			
		

> I *might* have tweeted him once or twice.



Reading some of his tweets tonight are hilarious


----------



## TruXta (Apr 22, 2013)

Congratulations.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Apr 22, 2013)

Utd are closing in on our record

http://www.sportingintelligence.com...nited-win-20th-english-title-to-close-220402/


----------



## Badgers (Apr 22, 2013)

Fair play to Utd. Nobody else looked like winning this season. A glorious single for Sir Alex  

Think it is safe to say that RVP has grabbed the golden boot for Suarez too.


----------



## Glitter (Apr 22, 2013)

Woooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!


----------



## agricola (Apr 22, 2013)

Best team, best manager, best striker.  Worthy Champions.


----------



## friedaweed (Apr 22, 2013)

Great night for Everton supporters


----------



## agricola (Apr 22, 2013)




----------



## sleaterkinney (Apr 22, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> Great night for Everton supporters


Their favourite team wins...


----------



## JTG (Apr 22, 2013)

Hats off all


----------



## DexterTCN (Apr 22, 2013)

Congrats to Manu, they didn't have the best team imo but walked it.   Wonder who they'll buy?


----------



## TruXta (Apr 22, 2013)

Suarez.


----------



## JTG (Apr 22, 2013)

DexterTCN said:


> Congrats to Manu, they didn't have the best team imo but walked it. Wonder who they'll buy?


Clearly they did have the best team. That's kind of the point


----------



## DexterTCN (Apr 22, 2013)

JTG said:


> Clearly they did have the best team. That's kind of the point


No, they may have had the best spirit, the best manager, not the best team...._on paper_.   As I said they walked it and deserve it.   What was best about them was not the team on paper, I'm not giving faint praise, they deserve it 100%.


----------



## thriller (Apr 22, 2013)




----------



## The39thStep (Apr 22, 2013)

Well done. united have been the most consistent


----------



## TruXta (Apr 22, 2013)

RVP and their usual grind was the difference. One nil against Stoke away etc. (note: may not be actual result, for illustrative purposes only).


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2013)

Superb achievement for United and one that must surely convince even the deepest cynics that Ferguson is surely the best manager ever produced in Britain.


----------



## JTG (Apr 23, 2013)

TruXta said:


> RVP and their usual grind was the difference. One nil against Stoke away etc. (note: may not be actual result, for illustrative purposes only).


Winning games does help yeah


----------



## DRINK? (Apr 23, 2013)

Best squad I think rather than best team, do think that if Chelsea or city had fergie at the helm then they would have won the League, though not complaing. De Gea has been fantastic as has Carrick, RVP obviously. The defence have impressed me with Smalling, Evans Jones fully interchangeable. Biggest disappointments were Valencia, Young and Nani, really poor season for all bar odd flashes of brilliance..just hope next year Kagawa becomes more central he really is an amazing footballer though not quite sure Utd know how best to play him


----------



## Wilf (Apr 23, 2013)

One day Jose lad, all of this will be yours.


----------



## aylee (Apr 23, 2013)

Congrats to ManUre, and thanks so much for not stamping on our necks after going 3 up in just over half an hour last night.


----------



## friedaweed (Apr 23, 2013)

editor said:


> Superb achievement for United and one that must surely convince even the deepest cynics that Ferguson is surely the best manager ever produced in Britain.


What better than Neil Young
No chance


----------



## agricola (Apr 23, 2013)

friedaweed said:


> What better than Neil Young
> No chance


 
We are all imaginary beings in Neil Young's Chester game of FM 2011.


----------



## friedaweed (Apr 23, 2013)

agricola said:


> We are all imaginary beings in Neil Young's Chester game of FM 2011.


Three consecutive promotions now Surely that's better than anything Rudolph the red nose pensioner's done


----------



## skyscraper101 (Apr 23, 2013)

Ferguson is a legend.

It will be a very long time before anyone like him comes along again.


----------



## Joe Reilly (Apr 24, 2013)

Glitter said:


> We need a midfield for Europe. We haven't had one of those for years
> 
> I'd give my left tit for Yaya Toure frankly.


 
Actually Martinez and Schweinstiger are the types Utd need to thrive in Europe. Both immense last night. Made mincemeat of the tikki taki land of Lilliput. In fact the model for the smaller and nippier players not just in midfield but all over the pitch (Alba, Alves, Mascherano,Perdo, Messi, Ineista,Xavi...)  may have taken a considerable dent.  Dixon drew attention to disparity in size as sides trooped off. Simply put, a good big 'un will always be better than a good little 'un. Barcelona were noticeably weak in the air, at set pieces, in both defence _and_ attack. So it wsn't just that injuries has taken their toll at the back. The other refreshing aspect of the game was that it was allowed to be a physical contest - which football should be - though at the Nou Camp in particular, the slightest contact with a Barca player usually draws a foul. By contrast away from home the 'best team ever' rarely ever win. Take from that what you will. So hopefully the trend to turn football in a non contact sport to accomodate the vertically challenged will have taken a considerable dent as well.


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## thriller (Apr 24, 2013)

Lewendoski (sp) just scored 3 goals against Madrid. So his transfer value has just tripled. bye bye any chance of us signing him


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## scooter (May 19, 2013)

Well that was quite a game - a 5 all thriller. Would have liked to see Scholes score a last minute winner but you can't have everything.

I'm a bit depressed that we won't see Alex Ferguson leading the team out any more but we won the league as a consolation.


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## skyscraper101 (May 19, 2013)

Sounds like quite a game. Two West Brom goals scored in the same minute if the beeb website is to be believed. I'll try and catch the highlights later.


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