# Dessie Noonan



## Chuck Wilson (Mar 19, 2005)

Just heard that he was killed last night in a stabbing. Dessie was an active supporter of anti fascism in Manchester in the 1980's.


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## butchersapron (Mar 19, 2005)

The gangster geez?


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 19, 2005)

butchersapron said:
			
		

> The gangster geez?



Retired  'gangster geez'


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## butchersapron (Mar 19, 2005)

Ok, bit flip. I know what he did. Wasn't mocking that.


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## audiotech (Mar 19, 2005)

xxxxxxxxxxxx


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## cogg (Mar 19, 2005)

Whatever your reasons, and whether or not a photo has been used before, I don't think it is appropriate to post up a photo involving people who were active anti-fascists. Please delete this as soon as possible.

For spelling as usual.


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## Deareg (Mar 19, 2005)

cogg said:
			
		

> Whatever your reasons, and whether or not a photo has been used before, I don't think it is appropriate to post up a photo involving people who were active anti-fascists. Please delete this as soon as possible.
> 
> For spelling as usual.



I know what you are saying, but in this instance you should'nt worry to much as the photo was taken from red watch


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## cogg (Mar 19, 2005)

I know but there's a principle here.


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## Pickman's model (Mar 19, 2005)

cogg said:
			
		

> Whatever your reasons, and whether or not a photo has been used before, I don't think it is appropriate to post up a photo involving people who were active anti-fascists. Please delete this as soon as possible.
> 
> For spelling as usual.


seconded.


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## Nemo (Mar 19, 2005)

Deareg said:
			
		

> I know what you are saying, but in this instance you should'nt worry to much as the photo was taken from red watch



You might want to break the link then, otherwise we could get some of the Nazi loons over here.


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## bluestreak (Mar 19, 2005)

yeah, linking to far right sites, for whatever reason no matter how pure, is seriously frowned upon cos of the trouble it causes the gaffer.


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## Deareg (Mar 19, 2005)

I dont think their is a link


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## Deareg (Mar 19, 2005)

cogg said:
			
		

> I know but there's a principle here.


 Fair enough


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 19, 2005)

Deareg said:
			
		

> I dont think their is a link



the url of the photo is what he's getting at i think


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## Nemo (Mar 19, 2005)

Deareg said:
			
		

> I dont think their is a link



There is a link, the picture is a link.


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## FridgeMagnet (Mar 19, 2005)

Uh, yeah. Linking to a photo on their site can be traced back as easily as one you click on... for reasons that would probably bore you, but trust me on this. I'll break it myself.


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## Joe Reilly (Mar 19, 2005)

Chuck Wilson said:
			
		

> Just heard that he was killed last night in a stabbing. Dessie was an active supporter of anti fascism in Manchester in the 1980's.



A force of nature.


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## Deareg (Mar 19, 2005)

I never knew that, how does it work?


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## bluestreak (Mar 19, 2005)

there is a link.  when you post a picture from a website that creates a link to the website that the owner can trace easily to the site that has leeched the picture.  therefore a link to urban.


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## bluestreak (Mar 19, 2005)

sorry, i got a phone call in the middle of that post!  not just stating the obvious.


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 19, 2005)

bluestreak said:
			
		

> there is a link.  when you post a picture from a website that creates a link to the website that the owner can trace easily to the site that has leeched the picture.  therefore a link to urban.



yeah, nobody likes a picture leech...


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## cogg (Mar 19, 2005)

That's a good technical explanation but really the political argument is more important. Why spread photos of anti-fascists for whatever reason? I'm sure that the original poster never meant it maliciously but that's not the point. Even a photo from 19 years ago can have a bad outcome in the wrong hands.


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## FridgeMagnet (Mar 19, 2005)

Deareg said:
			
		

> I never knew that, how does it work?


Part of the request header for any file gives the referer. Looking through the logs, it's easy to find where people have been hotlinking - and in fact an image is more dangerous than a link, because anyone who views the thread will turn up on the logs, whereas you'd have to click on a link to leave a record.


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## Deareg (Mar 19, 2005)

FridgeMagnet said:
			
		

> Part of the request header for any file gives the referer. Looking through the logs, it's easy to find where people have been hotlinking - and in fact an image is more dangerous than a link, because anyone who views the thread will turn up on the logs, whereas you'd have to click on a link to leave a record.



Thanks to you and Bluestreak for the explanations, and apologies to Cogg for taking the thread off topic


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 20, 2005)

just realised that that macintyre programme on c5 this week is about his brother dominic.


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## editor (Mar 20, 2005)

MC5 said:
			
		

> Dessie Noonan on the 'Manchester Martyrs' march in Longsight, Manchester 1986.


Do not - repeat DO NOT - directly link to that fucking site _ever._


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## geordie (Mar 20, 2005)

*Today's news*

From the Observer

'Untouchable' underworld leader murdered 

Manchester gangster is fatally stabbed days before a TV documentary on his family reaches the screens 

Tony Thompson, crime correspondent
Sunday March 20, 2005
The Observer 

One of Britain's most notorious gangland figures has been murdered just days before a documentary is aired in which he bragged of his 'untouchable' position in the underworld. 
Dessie Noonan was found bleeding from a stab wound close to his home in the Chorlton district of Manchester late on Friday evening. A leading member of a notorious family, Noonan, 46, had a reputation as a gangland enforcer and had been linked to dozens of armed robberies and several murders. 

In a documentary, Gangster, to be broadcast on Tuesday night on Channel Five, he tells investigative journalist Donal MacIntyre that he feels safe as no one would be brave enough to challenge him and his brother. 'No one would dare to touch us anyway. If they did there would be serious fireworks. I've got a bigger army than the police. I've got more guns than the police. We're strong and we've got strong people around us. People know that. If they think they can take one of us out and that's the end of if, then they're silly people, fucking silly people.' 

Later in the film Noonan jokes about being asked to execute MacIntyre but denies police claims that he has been involved in as many as 25 murders. In the film's most chilling moment he responds to the question of how many killings he has truly been responsible for by briefly holding up seven fingers and then collapsing in fits of laughter. 

Although Noonan makes a number of appearances, the documentary principally follows six months in the life of his younger brother, Dominic, who is on trial for kidnap and drugs offences. The film shows how the Noonan family run an alternative system of justice in many of Manchester's communities. 'During the day Manchester is run by the police, during the night it's run by the gangsters,' says Dominic. 

The family rose to notoriety after working as bouncers on the door of the Hacienda nightclub and finding themselves mediating disputes between rival groups of local gangsters. In 1992 Desmond appeared in court charged with the murder of Tony Johnson and shooting another man. He was cleared after several key witnesses failed to attend court. He later served time for threatening the lives of police officers who were due to give evidence against him in a separate case. 

Dessie Noonan had viewed the programme just a few hours before he died. He told MacIntyre: 'That could get me 20 years. I'm fully expecting the police to knock on my door on Wednesday morning.' 

Peter Walsh, author of Gang Wars, which chronicles the rise of Manchester's underworld, said: 'In the Manchester underworld the name of Dessie Noonan strikes fear into the heart of a lot of people. They are not people to be messed with.' 

Underworld sources contacted by The Observer said that Dessie Noonan had recently been accused of ripping off a notorious Salford family to the tune of £250,000 but it is not yet known whether this is connected to his death. After being stabbed, Noonan had used his mobile phone to call his wife and tell her he was dying. An ambulance arrived minutes later but he was pronounced dead on arrival at Manchester Royal Infirmary. 

Manchester is bracing itself for a spectacular send-off. When Dessie's younger brother, Damien, died in a motorcycle accident in August 2003, more than 15,000 joined the proceedings. Large parts of north-west Manchester were closed to traffic during the funeral procession and more than 100 police officers attended to keep order.


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## audiotech (Mar 20, 2005)

editor said:
			
		

> Do not - repeat DO NOT - directly link to that fucking site _ever._



My apologies.


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## Flavour (Mar 20, 2005)

He was killed 5 minutes away from my house...

Mersey Bank is only down the road. Shocking, and there's going to be some bad shit going down over the next few months in Stretford, Chorlton, the Range and Salford.


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## agricola (Mar 21, 2005)

well, i guess it will all kick off in manchester for a bit.  a pity, because in most normal societies the death of someone like Dessie Noonan would be greeted with something approaching glee.


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## hibee (Mar 21, 2005)

Does anyone want to offer an obit of his anti-fascist activities? Because the papers are just concentrating on him as a gangster.


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## Cambazola (Mar 21, 2005)

Flavour said:
			
		

> He was killed 5 minutes away from my house...



Same here.

Anti Fascist - Gangster is an odd combination. Like hibee, I'd be interested to know more.


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 21, 2005)

Cambazola said:
			
		

> Same here.
> 
> Anti Fascist - Gangster is an odd combination. Like hibee, I'd be interested to know more.



Funnily enough 'gangsters' like any one else sometime have political views and I would rather that they be anti fash than pro fash like Joey Owens.  Dessie came from a republican background and was involved in anti fash direct action in Manchester including defending the Manchester marytrs march and the resignation of the BNP organiser from a fledging South Manchester BNP branch. There's no list of single handed activities as it was a 'team effort'. Let us say that the fash in the North West were well aware of his political views and didn't feel able to fully engage in discussion. 

By the way, Jack Spot ,who was one of London's leading gang leaders in the 40s, regularly joined anti BUF activities including Cable Street.


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## rednblack (Mar 21, 2005)

never knew he was an anti fascist,


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## hibee (Mar 21, 2005)

Cheers Chuck. I had read about him in Hann and Tilzey's book but was advised to treat it with caution...


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## marshall (Mar 21, 2005)

rednblack said:
			
		

> never knew he was an anti fascist,



Why the face? Just because he was anti-fascist, doesn't make him a good bloke who didn't deserve to die in the gutter...


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## Whitey77 (Mar 21, 2005)

Chuck Wilson said:
			
		

> Funnily enough 'gangsters' like any one else sometime have political views and I would rather that they be anti fash than pro fash like Joey Owens.  Dessie came from a republican background and was involved in anti fash direct action in Manchester including defending the Manchester marytrs march and the resignation of the BNP organiser from a fledging South Manchester BNP branch. There's no list of single handed activities as it was a 'team effort'. Let us say that the fash in the North West were well aware of his political views and didn't feel able to fully engage in discussion.
> 
> By the way, Jack Spot ,who was one of London's leading gang leaders in the 40s, regularly joined anti BUF activities including Cable Street.



I smell a rat! Does anyone else besides me find it just a tad odd that Noonan has been murdered just a few days before the MacIntyre documentary on C5? He's been involved in heavy stuff for years and not much has ever happened until now. That McIntyre is a complete shit head. See Larry O'Hara's _Notes From the Borderland_ - O'Hara proves he's working with the state as a 'Journo-Cop'. I didn't think Dessie was strongly actively involved, but got involved when ever it was some thing serious or of particular interest to him (eg: Manchester Martyrs). He's done nothing about the fash recently has he?

Can anyone clarify one way or the other?


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## Random (Mar 21, 2005)

Was it the noonans who took a wannabe BNP organiser for a short ride, after which attempts to set up a branch swiftly stopped?  The story I heard placed this in Salford...


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## Whitey77 (Mar 21, 2005)

From a previous post I understand that there are rules about linking to nazi websites so I've cut and pasted a section of a review of No Retreat by Steve Tilzey written by Peter Rushton, who was booted out of the BNP in 2002 for being a Searchlight mole - again, see O'Hara. This is taken from the Stormfront Britain forum where they're talking about Dessie. 



> Hann gives a partly accurate account of the collapse of South Manchester BNP in 1993 after an anti-fascist gang singled out the branch organiser for intimidation. One member of this gang is identified in the book only as Dessie, an anti-fascist from the Eighties who was by now a well-known local face about town. Hann gleefully tells the tale of how Dessie personally threatened the BNP organiser, ordering him to tell AFA everything he knew about the party in the region.
> 
> This gentleman’s full name is Dessie Noonan, recently described by a Manchester journalist as the underworld equivalent of Robocop. He was head doorman at the notorious Konspiracy Club in Fennel Street, Manchester, from November 1989 until police closed it in December 1990. This was the era of 'Madchester', when Salford s white gangs controlled the booming ecstasy and amphetamine trade, while the black gangs of Moss Side and Cheetham Hill dominated the heroin business.
> 
> ...


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## agricola (Mar 21, 2005)

I doubt MacIntyre is anything other than the most prominent of a lazy strain of would-be Roger Cooks.  

Some football hooligans follow Chelsea?  Some West Africans practice a form of advance fee fraud?   Stop the presses, gentlemen 

Noonan was probably killed because someone got wind of his "noone would dare touch us" claim and thought there would never be a more oppurtune time for vengeance for some wrong Noonan or his clan did to them.


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 21, 2005)

Whitey77 said:
			
		

> From a previous post I understand that there are rules about linking to nazi websites so I've cut and pasted a section of a review of No Retreat by Steve Tilzey written by Peter Rushton, who was booted out of the BNP in 2002 for being a Searchlight mole - again, see O'Hara. This is taken from the Stormfront Britain forum where they're talking about Dessie.




Pete Rushton currently with the White Nationalist Party. Most of Rushton's review comes from Walsh's book Gang Wars and the Evening news paper. Another of Walsh's book Guvners deals with Mickey Francis whose door security firm were in a short competitive spell  with the Noonans.


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 21, 2005)

Chuck Wilson said:
			
		

> Another of Walsh's book Guvners deals with Mickey Francis whose door security firm were in a short competitive spell  with the Noonans.



can't find any mention of them in it - the door security phase is dealt with very briskly, though.


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 21, 2005)

bristle-krs said:
			
		

> can't find any mention of them in it - the door security phase is dealt with very briskly, though.



This occured after the book ( Guvners) was published, I think Mickey Francis got some time for it.


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 21, 2005)

it was published in 1997, and goes up to when he was running door crews through loc-19, and the mkm scaffolding company. the last major event is getting set back to strangeways (1995) for doing over some chaps who'd apparently pulled a gun on his bouncers at the canal. he mentions a m.e.n. story that came out whilst he was inside, "...headlined 'the twilight zone', about conflict between different groups on the club doors in manchester" with his name and picture attached, but he doesn't really mention specifically who the other people were.


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 21, 2005)

bristle-krs said:
			
		

> it was published in 1997, and goes up to when he was running door crews through loc-19, and the mkm scaffolding company. the last major event is getting set back to strangeways (1995) for doing over some chaps who'd apparently pulled a gun on his bouncers at the canal. he mentions a m.e.n. story that came out whilst he was inside, "...headlined 'the twilight zone', about conflict between different groups on the club doors in manchester" with his name and picture attached, but he doesn't really mention specifically who the other people were.



I think what happened was that Mickey's boys kicked off in a club to show to the owners that the bouncers couldn't handle the job.There was a story going about for a while that there had been a personal incident between the two but you never quite know what is really what.


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 21, 2005)

tends not to be the sort of thing well-indexed books are written about i guess


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 21, 2005)

bristle-krs said:
			
		

> tends not to be the sort of thing well-indexed books are written about i guess



Very true , actually I had heard before all this that a journalist had approached Dessie with view to a book, but again you never know.


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## Joe Reilly (Mar 21, 2005)

agricola said:
			
		

> I doubt MacIntyre is anything other than the most prominent of a lazy strain of would-be Roger Cooks.
> 
> Some football hooligans follow Chelsea?  Some West Africans practice a form of advance fee fraud?   Stop the presses, gentlemen
> 
> Noonan was probably killed because someone got wind of his "noone would dare touch us" claim and thought there would never be a more oppurtune time for vengeance for some wrong Noonan or his clan did to them.



As it happens the programme in question was made with the Noonans cooperation. The idea that this was 'business' related is also nonsense.


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## Joe Reilly (Mar 21, 2005)

Random said:
			
		

> Was it the noonans who took a wannabe BNP organiser for a short ride, after which attempts to set up a branch swiftly stopped?  The story I heard placed this in Salford...



There never was a a car ride. The would be BNP organiser was invited in for talks, held at his insistence in a public place. It was a prominent member of AFA, D.C. who brought the BNP organiser to the table. Dessie who had a backround role in the collapse of the BNP in Manchester put in an appearance but did not sit in on the meeting. Neither did Hann for that matter, who on the day, offered to hold someone's coat.


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## Demu (Mar 21, 2005)

Flavour said:
			
		

> He was killed 5 minutes away from my house...
> 
> Mersey Bank is only down the road. Shocking, and there's going to be some bad shit going down over the next few months in Stretford, Chorlton, the Range and Salford.



No there isn't.


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## Demu (Mar 21, 2005)

agricola said:
			
		

> well, i guess it will all kick off in manchester for a bit.  a pity, because in most normal societies the death of someone like Dessie Noonan would be greeted with something approaching glee.




You obviously don't know the man.


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## Demu (Mar 21, 2005)

hibee said:
			
		

> Does anyone want to offer an obit of his anti-fascist activities? Because the papers are just concentrating on him as a gangster.



From very early eighties high profile street engagement through to 'canvassing' the BNP when they stood in Newton Heath 2002. 

Roughly 20 years.


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## audiotech (Mar 21, 2005)

In my neck of the woods there were anti-fascists I was active with who had served prison sentences for a variety of reasons, including robbery and violence (not in the same league as Dessie). Some are now dead sadly. They hated with a passion all bullies, which is one reason they were not prepared to tolerate fascists operating in working class communities. I was proud to stand alongside them.


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## Part 2 (Mar 21, 2005)

Welcome to the boards Demu.

I'm interested that someone should join up and start posting on this subject.

It seems you're putting yourself forward as a friend of/associate of/person in the know about Dessie. 

I wonder how you see the family so far as their role in the community, were they a suitable alternative to the police and regular services or is there something better out there. 
Edited to add: Just seen you joined almost a year ago. Obviously a subject close to your heart to make you start posting now.


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## Demu (Mar 21, 2005)

Part2 said:
			
		

> Welcome to the boards Demu.
> 
> I'm interested that someone should join up and start posting on this subject.
> 
> ...



I suggest you watch the programme tomorrow night and draw your own conclusions on the social services provided by the Noonans.

Donal Mackintre on BBC tonight made reference to Dessie Noonan's reputation for physical force confrontation against the NF and BNP with Anti Fascist Action prior to achieving notoriety in gangsterland.

I have commented only to clarify the erroneous guesswork of others who have seen fit to comment following Dessie's untimely death.


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## Part 2 (Mar 21, 2005)

I hardly think the TV is the place to learn anything about such a matter.

Having watched the brief clips on tonights news I'm nor sure I can stomach an hour and a half of laughing about murders and bragging about personal armies either, but I'll tape it and see.


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## Joe Reilly (Mar 22, 2005)

Part2 said:
			
		

> I hardly think the TV is the place to learn anything about such a matter.
> 
> Having watched the brief clips on tonights news I'm nor sure I can stomach an hour and a half of laughing about murders and bragging about personal armies either, but I'll tape it and see.



Your not much of a fan of 'The Sopranos' presumably?


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## Part 2 (Mar 22, 2005)

Good guess. I did try once, couldn't get into it.  

It looks like the program might not get aired this evening, apparently the police are seeking an injunction as they reckon there are statements which might influence a prosecution.


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## Flavour (Mar 22, 2005)

Demu said:
			
		

> I have commented only to clarify the erroneous guesswork of others who have seen fit to comment following Dessie's untimely death.




I don't mean to be rude lad but who the fuck are you, and what's with the cryptic "You are wrong, I'm right but I won't tell you exactly what there is to know" attitude?


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## Demu (Mar 22, 2005)

Flavour said:
			
		

> I don't mean to be rude lad but who the fuck are you, and what's with the cryptic "You are wrong, I'm right but I won't tell you exactly what there is to know" attitude?




What is it you want to know?


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## Part 2 (Mar 22, 2005)

Just heard on the news the police got their injunction. C5 have an appeal going through but won't get a result until 8pm.


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## audiotech (Mar 22, 2005)

10.55 tonite.


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## Hoxtontwat (Mar 23, 2005)

O.K who saw the programme then? and what do you think?


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## Part 2 (Mar 23, 2005)

Ha ha what a load of shite.

edited to add: Two bit plazzy gangsters in cheap suits at their very best. The media have been bigging up the Noonans as some of the most high profile gangsters in the country. I hope there were plenty off young kids watching to see that a life of crime earns you such flash apparel as a wacky tie from Birthdays on Market St. Their celebration night looked worse than the Phoenix club.


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## R.I.C.O. (Mar 23, 2005)

Hoxtontwat said:
			
		

> O.K who saw the programme then? and what do you think?



Terrible programme, but that's not a surprise from Donal MacIntyre, who is one of the most lazy investigative journalists. There was hardly any dialogue, hardly any analysis, and hardly any "investigation", just MacIntyre with his "shaky cam". He was so submissive, and almost went as far as glamourising Noonan and laughing along with his criminal activities. It was like an advertisment, interspersed with Oasis tracks (oh, its sooo Manchester, dahling) and highly cliched. The other lads in Noonan's gang looked so disorganised - I thought that spoke for itself really. Shit like this does'nt have to be glamourised by two-bit "journalists" who have been shown up to be fucknuts from their previous work (Like that programme about being mugged in Brixton).

MacIntyre is a fucknut.


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## veracity (Mar 23, 2005)

That programme absolutely stank on every level. Frankly the idea that Manchester is policed by heart of gold criminals is laughable. And as for the Noonans boasting that they are some sort of master criminals - how do they explain the fact that they have been caught, convicted and imprisoned so many times?


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## Part 2 (Mar 23, 2005)

Another thing you have to remember is that there have been quite a few programmes based around Manchester over the past 10 years or so.  There was the program about the jack the lad scallies in Salford made with CH4 which was exposed as being a set up, the one where Roger Cook set up his pub in Salford and the program BBC were making with Paul Massey where he stabbed someone on camera but the tapes were lost. 

A lot of responsibility needs putting on the companies and idiots like Macintyre who get involved with these gangster vanity projects.


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

anyone know how to contact dominic noonan??he seems like a sound guy,wud love to meet him.  ,damn mancheter is going to come to a stand still with dessie's funeral,gonna be more that was at damians funeral for sure,any ides who actually stabbed him yet,some yardie i heard.


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## Zonk (Mar 23, 2005)

cappsy said:
			
		

> any ides who actually stabbed him yet,some yardie i heard.



Yes I saw that on 'Shitefront' too.


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## Part 2 (Mar 23, 2005)

Nazi website blames black person


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## Zonk (Mar 23, 2005)

Part2 said:
			
		

> Nazi website blames black person



Yes and i imagine a lot of our new friends are popping over from there....


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

oh well i didnt know the man so no loss to me but i suppose a big loss in gangland.what did dessie actually do,apparently he was drinking  in a pub the night he was murdered,n some websites day his body was dumped near where he lived,but i thought he just got shived up near where he lived???


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## Flavour (Mar 23, 2005)

cappsy said:
			
		

> oh well i didnt know the man so no loss to me but i suppose a big loss in gangland.what did dessie actually do,apparently he was drinking  in a pub the night he was murdered,n some websites day his body was dumped near where he lived,but i thought he just got shived up near where he lived???




cappsy: a word or two,

Delve not into pools containting liquids of unknown compound.

Whatever you say, say nothing.


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

jsut asking questions that i want to know that answer to,i am intrigued,that so bad?


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## Flavour (Mar 23, 2005)

yes, considering you're a new poster coming straight into this thread and referring indirectly to the conclusions of the fascists regarding the death of a (criminal) anti-fascist.

If you want to meet dominic noonan, then why don't you move in on mersey bank, it's cheap as fuck, halway between lovely chorlton, lovely didsbury, and the river bank is rife with drug dealing (ive found loads of mad shit on the mersey bank before, not even including the estate where dessie's body was found).

Anyway, i re-iterate.

Say Nothing.


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## Part 2 (Mar 23, 2005)

cappsy,

The questions your asking won't get answered here, and probably not elsewhere. I already heard a few different stories agout the murder and hundreds more about the Noonans but they might be wrong. Even if they weren't who am I to be broadcasting such things.

If you don't know you don't need to know


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

so the flavour,who are you to tell me to say nothing,if i wanna know sumthing i will ask questions,and theres nothing nobody can do,itss hardly an offence,just cus i am new to the forum doesnt mean i am new to the noonans,or what they have done,all i asked was what happened to him,sum1 obvously knows,i asked a simple question,one of my mates is very close to dom noonan i am saure i cud get sum info from him,i jsut wanted to see if neone here had owt to say,are you a a manchester gangsta?


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

your right i guess i dont need to know,but i want to,this has got me interested.i wont ask anymore questions about the noonans then if nonone will be willing ot answer them


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 23, 2005)




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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

where did u get my picture from!!!


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## Flavour (Mar 23, 2005)

Now be a good boy and shut the fuck up, cappsy.


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

shut up about what,and dont swear no need!


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

listel all i  asked was few questions i didnt want to upset anyone,just intrigued,sorry if sumof u got pissed off with me


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## Whitey77 (Mar 23, 2005)

> "listel all i asked was few questions i didnt want to upset anyone,just intrigued,sorry if sumof u got pissed off with me"



If you want to know anything about the Noonans then I suggest you go and ask them to their faces. I'm sure they'll be prepared to talk to you, after all, they spoke to that scum-bag Macintyre didn't they. 

'Flavour' is right - Keep your mouth shut!


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## Flavour (Mar 23, 2005)

well i think you're a fascist, that's all.

what's your opinion of the jews then?


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## cappsy (Mar 23, 2005)

i have no opinions on jews,to be honest i realy dont care whatu think flavour,y wud i be a facist for asking questions,i wil keep my mouth shut about what i wanna know in future on this forum,as u seem not helpful enuf to or nice enuf to jsut say hush talking about stuff u dont know,maybe u did say that bit to subtle for me as i am at work,i am knackerd!!!  gangs seem to interest me u seem like intelligent people and i value your opinions,we should try to get along


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## bouncer_the_dog (Mar 24, 2005)

Well I know little about the noonans but what I saw on the doc. They were awful IMO. I dont care if he was an anti facist it in no way makes up for his criminal behaviour. The world is better off without them. I thought the main focus 'Dessie' was a pathetic idividual, his need to be surrounded by skinhead teenagers struck me as a kind of insecurity that no hardcore gangster should have. I thought it was funny the way they reverted to normal behaviour, eating chips and wearing tracksuits, when he was in the clink. I didnt like the way he swaggered around desperatley trying to show that he was good for the community when in fact he is nothing more than a cancerous boil. Macentyre has always been a shite doc. maker but his hands off approach allowed the Noonans to display themselve as the thugs they are. Frank Castle could sort 'em out good and proper.


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## Larry O'Hara (Mar 24, 2005)

*The Bigger Picture?*

First off, let me say I haven't seen the C5 documentary yet (can't get proper signal!) but I will, soon.

Colleagues who have seen it tell me it is the usual shallow Macintyre stuff, totally uncritical.  Being a Scouser, I can't comment with any detailed knowledge on Manchester gangs, though rest assured Macintyre & this documentary will be covered in the next NFB, with input from me plus others with that detailed local knowledge (www.borderland.co.uk). 

Be that as it may, Macintyre's past output (extensively covered in NFB 3 4 & 5) means it is right to see him as a 'journo-cop' par excellence.  Certainly, he has in the past been on bad terms with Greater Manchester Police, and it seems that this documentary continues that.  This would not make him radical, or anti-police in any fundamental way.  Any more than it makes the BBC who have repeatedly clashed with GMP radical (see Paul Marsh' review of the Walsh book on Manchester gangs in current NFB).  There is an ongoing turf war between Manchester police (in particular) and the Met Police especially.  Lurking in the wings is the spectre of a British FBI--National Police Force, as hinted at in the Serious & Organised Crime Bill, setting up an agency of that name headed by Stephen Lander (ex-head of MI5).  So, if Manchester police can be shown to be incompetent wooden-tops, given the run-around by the Noonans & similar, then the (propaganda) case for a new ever more centralised police force is thereby made.  In that respect, if the programme was as shallow and uncritical as (valued) comrades have assured me it was, then this would only help it serve the purpose I have suggested.

Till then, in the absence of serious counter-evidence, PC Donal Macintyre will continue on his media beat.  I, and others, remain profoundly unimpressed--but would welcome the opportunity to debate these issues in public with PC Macintyre, soon.


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## Danny Ross (Mar 24, 2005)

So, Larry O'Hara, bouncer the dog, cappsy, snuffyzee, Richard White, Part 2 and all the other gobshites, you know it all do you? Having a go at Dessie, now he's dead, is easy but Demu is spot on: you never knew the man and if you had I would have liked to have seen you making your airheaded "judgments" and calling him "pathetic" to his face.

He had more courage in his fingernails than you lot have added up together (ask the fascists!), so give it a rest.

By the way, yes, I am new on here and I am posting because I object to people mocking Dessie Noonan.


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## Flavour (Mar 24, 2005)

you from around my way then i take it Danny? haha

i love mancs. attitude as you like.


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## Part 2 (Mar 24, 2005)

Danny Ross said:
			
		

> So, Larry O'Hara, bouncer the dog, cappsy, snuffyzee, Richard White, Part 2 and all the other gobshites, you know it all do you? Having a go at Dessie, now he's dead, is easy but Demu is spot on: you never knew the man and if you had I would have liked to have seen you making your airheaded "judgments" and calling him "pathetic" to his face.
> 
> He had more courage in his fingernails than you lot have added up together (ask the fascists!), so give it a rest.
> 
> By the way, yes, I am new on here and I am posting because I object to people mocking Dessie Noonan.



Speaking only for myself but maybe you should go back, read the posts properly, stop the assumptions about who knew/knows what and take a more objective look at things. Just because Dessie was an anti-fascist doesn't make him some kind of saint. I don't recall him appearing in any real hard hitting documentary about his anti-fascist beliefs. 

On the other hand he has appeared in a shit program, made by a discredited so called journalist, (possibly being used for that mans own means) in which he boasted about being a gangster and laughing about murders. This coupled with what I know are hardly the makings of a great man. All IMO of course.


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## Larry O'Hara (Mar 24, 2005)

*Hardly accurate*

As Part 2 has said, there are valid questions to be asked about Macintyre, about whom I do know rather a lot.  Given I explicitly stated I didn't know much myself about Manchester gangs, and as such said nothing about Noonan, it is hardly fair to accuse me (& indeed some of the others) of 'having a go' at Noonan now he's dead.  There is though a broader question--is Mr Ross saying that nobody, ever, is allowed to talk about crime or criminals (so-called) whether they are alive or dead, except from a police perspective (Macintyre or News of the World), or in the mainstream media--who have extensively covered the story already?  Or is it that Mr Ross is simply 'on something' that he insults others with so little evidence.  Or are we now, after Noonan has died, to get a cast of thousands who all retrospectively claim to be his bessy mates for some reasons deep in their own psychology? And so on.


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 24, 2005)

bouncer_the_dog said:
			
		

> I thought the main focus 'Dessie' was a pathetic idividual, his need to be surrounded by skinhead teenagers struck me as a kind of insecurity that no hardcore gangster should have.



Before you give us the benefit of your opinion you might get the names right pal, the main focus of the documentary was Dominic not Dessie. And since when did you become an expert on hardcore gangsters and insecurity? Hardly the most relaxing vocation to have is it?


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## bouncer_the_dog (Mar 24, 2005)

Well Ok I got the name wrong. I have also watched all the Sopranos , so I have formulated opinions of gangsters and insecurity. Anyway one less criminal the better. It's also perfectly legal to slag of dead people. They're dead FFS


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## Flavour (Mar 24, 2005)

bouncer_the_dog said:
			
		

> Well Ok I got the name wrong. *I have also watched all the Sopranos* , so I have formulated opinions of gangsters and insecurity. Anyway one less criminal the better. It's also perfectly legal to slag of dead people. They're dead FFS




Who remembers that episode of South Park with George Clooney in it?

GC: Is anyone here a trained doctor?
CHEF: I watched Hospital Room a couple times.
GC: Well for GODS SAKES MAN, why didn't you say so? (Hands Chef surgeons apron)


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## audiotech (Mar 24, 2005)

I didn't realise, as the programme pointed out, that Dominic Noonan was one of the leaders of the prison revolt at Strangeways in the early nineties. A member of 'Prisoners Liberation Army', as he put it. I thought it telling that as he was being filmed, a prison van passed by and Dominic raised his fist and shouted 'free all prisoners now'. He also dealt with drug dealers, child abusers and bullies ruthlessly.


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## enrieb (Mar 24, 2005)

as you may have seen from the documentary domanic noonan is gay. from what ppl who live in the area that i know have told me when dessie noonan wanted to hurt someone bad they would beat the crap out of them and then dominic would rape them. I have heard that the guy who killed dessie was the brother of one of the lads who had been raped. (dismiss this message if you like but thats just what i have been told from ppl who live in the area and know the noonans)


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## butchersapron (Mar 24, 2005)

Oh do fuck off bernie.


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## audiotech (Mar 24, 2005)

enrieb said:
			
		

> as you may have seen from the documentary domanic noonan is gay. from what ppl who live in the area that i know have told me when dessie noonan wanted to hurt someone bad they would beat the crap out of them and then dominic would rape them. I have heard that the guy who killed dessie was the brother of one of the lads who had been raped. (dismiss this message if you like but thats just what i have been told from ppl who live in the area and know the noonans)



Dominic Noonan said on the programme that he was raped and abused over a long period of time by people at a boarding school he attended. He tracked down every one of the abusers and dealt with them.


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## Part 2 (Mar 24, 2005)

MC5 said:
			
		

> Dominic Noonan said on the programme that he was raped and abused over a long period of time by people at a boarding school he attended. He tracked down every one of the abusers and dealt with them.



He also seemed to use this as his explanation for being gay. Not really very insightful.


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## audiotech (Mar 24, 2005)

Part2 said:
			
		

> He also seemed to use this as his explanation for being gay. Not really very insightful.



Considering his experience at the hands of abusers, it's no wonder he's confused about his own sexuality.


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## butchersapron (Mar 24, 2005)

As is bernie - gay=rapist apparrently.


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## Part 2 (Mar 24, 2005)

MC5 said:
			
		

> Considering his experience at the hands of abusers, it's no wonder he's confused about his own sexuality.



How is he confused? He openly admits to being gay.

pissed up comments accordingly edited.


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## audiotech (Mar 24, 2005)

Part2 said:
			
		

> How is he confused? He openly admits to being gay.
> 
> That poor Sidney Cooke, if he hadn't been abused how many kids might not have suffered.



As you pointed out, Dominic Noonan 'seemed to use this as his explanation' (that he had been abused and raped) 'for being gay'.

Sydney Cooke was part of a paedophile ring, that kidnapped children, mostly boys and raped them again and again. The gang then killed them. It is believed about 20 youngsters fell prey to this gang. He was repeatedly released from terms of prison which led directly to the deaths of some of these children.


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## cappsy (Mar 27, 2005)

for one i never disrespected dessie or the noonans i was jsut interested in what they did and them personaly,but i wont bother asking more questions as i just get flamed


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## Chuck Wilson (Mar 30, 2005)

MC5 said:
			
		

> I didn't realise, as the programme pointed out, that Dominic Noonan was one of the leaders of the prison revolt at Strangeways in the early nineties. A member of 'Prisoners Liberation Army', as he put it. I thought it telling that as he was being filmed, a prison van passed by and Dominic raised his fist and shouted 'free all prisoners now'. He also dealt with drug dealers, child abusers and bullies ruthlessly.



I am sure that there was a pamphlet by the RCG which mentioned the PLA years and years ago, most of us thought it hilarious btw.


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## butchersapron (Mar 30, 2005)

They did a whole book on it didn't they?


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## DaveCinzano (Mar 30, 2005)

how does the pla relate to, say, prop? and what happened to prop in the end - frozen out of the debate? will skim through 'prisoners in revolt' again, but i think by the end of that it was still going. definitely remember prop being touched on when we were studying politics at school.


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## Paul Marsh (Mar 30, 2005)

butchersapron said:
			
		

> They did a whole book on it didn't they?



No they did a book on the Strangeways Riot, and it was quite good. 

I seem to remember there was some debate in the late 80s/early 90s about whether the Prisoners Liberation Army ever actually existed. The anarchist Black Cross took the view it was a tabloid invention. 

The reference to it in the Macintyre documentary was certainly the first I can recall from an alleged participant.


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## Demu (Mar 30, 2005)

Paul Marsh said:
			
		

> No they did a book on the Strangeways Riot, and it was quite good.
> 
> I seem to remember there was some debate in the late 80s/early 90s about whether the Prisoners Liberation Army ever actually existed. The anarchist Black Cross took the view it was a tabloid invention.
> 
> The reference to it in the Macintyre documentary was certainly the first I can recall from an alleged participant.




Strangeways 1990, A serious disturbance, by Eric Allison and Nicki Jameson,  covers the emergence of the PLA set up by Domenyk Noonan, who was shipped out of Strangeways 2 weeks before the riot kicked off.

Perhaps you should revisit pages 31 and 32. Hardly the stuff of tabloid invention.

Eric Allison and Dessie Noonan were regular contrbutors to the anti fascist fanzine Red Attitude during the nineties.


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## Deareg (Mar 31, 2005)

Paul Marsh said:
			
		

> No they did a book on the Strangeways Riot, and it was quite good.
> 
> I seem to remember there was some debate in the late 80s/early 90s about whether the Prisoners Liberation Army ever actually existed. The anarchist Black Cross took the view it was a tabloid invention.
> 
> The reference to it in the Macintyre documentary was certainly the first I can recall from an alleged participant.



It did exist, for a while at least, but the new laws brought in after the strangeways riot meant that it was never going to take off, unless you were a lifer or had been lumped up and had nothing to lose, it used to scare the fuck out of the screws for years after whenever anyone wrote pla on a wall


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## Danny Ross (Apr 1, 2005)

Demu knows his stuff and knew the man well. Dessie was one of us– no angel – but hated the cops, hated the imperialist Brits, the racist scum, the anti-trade unionists the Jew baiters and the nazis. An anti-fascist fighter.  Long live Dessie!!!


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## handy1 (Oct 22, 2005)

????


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## treelover (Oct 23, 2005)

blimey, we are keeping some strange company on urban these days


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## treelover (Oct 23, 2005)

hang on, this incident was in March, wtf


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## handy1 (Oct 23, 2005)

treelover said:
			
		

> hang on, this incident was in March, wtf




Sorry,my fault,a drunken bump IYSWIM


                      H


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## Part 2 (Dec 9, 2005)

Sorry to drag this up again but there are a few rumours around work that Domenyk Noonan got 10 years this week, but I've not seen anything in the news.

I thought some of our knowledgable posters might have some news.


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## Herbert Read (Dec 9, 2005)

Joe Reilly said:
			
		

> A force of nature.



a very good egg


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## belboid (Dec 9, 2005)

Part2 said:
			
		

> Sorry to drag this up again but there are a few rumours around work that Domenyk Noonan got 10 years this week, but I've not seen anything in the news.
> 
> I thought some of our knowledgable posters might have some news.


He was. 

http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/men/news/s/189/189969_city_gangster_jailed_for_912_years.html

Going underf the name Lattlay-Fottfoy which is why you might not have spotted it!


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## Part 2 (Dec 9, 2005)

Ta, very interesting.

My boss was under the impression he was up for a different offence.


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## exsalfordlad (Jan 31, 2006)

*Paying my respects (albeit overdue)*

As an ex-Salford/Moston (80s/90s) lad who's waaay out of the loop, I saw the programme last night and would like to offer my condolences to a family that did a lot of good for a lot of people.


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## Blueyonder (Feb 1, 2006)

*Noonana*

The Noonans and their cronies are pond life.Un-educated filth and scum


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