# The woes of USB-C audio on mobile phones - and is the jack coming back?



## editor (Jan 12, 2019)

Interesting piece here: 



> It’s especially frustrating because anyone could have seen this coming. Despite the cries of reporters and industry experts alike, nothing could stop the “ditch the headphone jack” train once Apple did it, and the post-hoc rationalizing has been a little tough to swallow. It would be at least a little understandable if all USB-C headphones worked with all USB-C ports, but that’s not the case.
> 
> One of the biggest issues that companies need to navigate pertains to source and peripheral device compatibility. USB Type-C headphone cables can either be active or passive — or manifest as a dongle adapter. This inconsistency, paired with the fact that Audio Accessory Mode has yet to be universally supported, results in a barrage of compatibility issues. Hence why many users are unable to operate playback controls or use a headset’s integrated microphone.
> 
> Consider OnePlus, a company that ditched the headphone jack despite its own community being vocally against the power play. Although they get the design right, its Type-C Bullets earbuds don’t work on the Google Pixel 3 XL. While this isn’t life-ruining — or even day-ruining — it’s tough to want to buy something if you have even odds of the thing even working at all. Headphone buyers aren’t used to such a problem, because for decades the analog port just worked. It didn’t matter what the brand of source you were using was, the standard was, well, a standard. That’s gone now.





> Ultimately, the USB Type-C headphones endeavor was a half-baked mess of competing standards that led to missed opportunity after missed opportunity. Its untimely demise may be abrupt for some and welcomed by others, but an infant can’t take over for Atlas.




SoundGuys: USB-C audio is dead


----------



## NoXion (Jan 15, 2019)

I hope that this is true and that the good old 3.5mm jack makes a comeback. Fuck Apple and their brain-dead imitators for abandoning a perfectly functional universal standard in favour of this shitshow.


----------



## mauvais (Jan 15, 2019)

> Headphone buyers aren’t used to such a problem, because for decades the analog port just worked. It didn’t matter what the brand of source you were using was, the standard was, well, a standard.


Well, that's not true, as anyone with an inline remote can tell you.


----------



## editor (Jan 20, 2019)

mauvais said:


> Well, that's not true, as anyone with an inline remote can tell you.


The inline remote may not work but I've never had the earphones not play back music and there's never any worrying about this kind of nonsense



> If passive, the headphones rely on the smartphone’s DAC and amp to convert the audio signal from analog to digital. If, however, a pair of headphones is active, then it uses its own DAC and amp system. Therefore creating an external conversion process outside of the phone’s domain and into the headset’s.
> 
> The main perk of doing is that prolonging an analog signal state and bypassing the smartphone’s internal components mitigates distortion from other smartphone signals. Things get a tad more complicated, though, if you’re using active headphones. In this case, your phone needs to support Audio Accessory mode, which many don’t. Unfortunately, it’s not always apparent which models are active and which are passive, resulting in an expedition of trial and error.





> While USB-C earbuds have made headway, the mode’s future popularity may be curtailed. As observed during CES, few companies were investing in USB-C headphones. Admittedly our soles were unable to cover all 2.7 million square feet of the show floor, but the apparent absence of USB-C audioproducts felt deliberate. That paired with rumors of the headphone jack’s return in the anticipated Huawei P30 and Sony Xperia XZ4 smartphones makes opting for USB-C headphones in 2019 a dubious choice.
> 
> One thing is for certain, though: if USB-C headphones cease development, we’ll be left stranded with Bluetooth streaming as our only viable option. Although Bluetooth is fine for casual listening, it can’t outperform wired audio. This leaves us consumers in a bind. Without a dedicated audio port, the future could truly be wireless.



What you need to know about USB-C audio


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

I don't understand what the issue is. This came supplied with my Mi8. 





It's a USB-C to 3.5mm adapter. Similar or better ones can be bought for about 2 quid, so what's the issue?


----------



## editor (Jan 20, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> I don't understand what the issue is. This came supplied with my Mi8.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You think needing extra adaptors and not being able to charge your phone when listening to music is going forward?

Anyway, we've already had this debate.


----------



## Throbbing Angel (Jan 20, 2019)

Sits on fence.
I use 3.5mm and Btooth. Haven't had a phone without a jack yet but probably would go for the adaptor above without too much grumbling about it.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

editor said:


> You think needing extra adaptors and not being able to charge your phone when listening to music is going forward?
> 
> Anyway, we've already had this debate.


Listen and charge.
Baseus USB Type C to 3.5mm Jack Charging Extension Earphone Adapter For Xiaomi Mi 8 6 Huawei P20


----------



## skyscraper101 (Jan 20, 2019)

The world is moving on. Bluetooth headphones are fast becoming the norm these days. I appreciate it bothers a few people but it just seems like advocating for physical keyboards in the age of touchscreen phones.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

skyscraper101 said:


> The world is moving on. Bluetooth headphones are fast becoming the norm these days. I appreciate it bothers a few people but it just seems like advocating for physical keyboards in the age of touchscreen phones.


There's absolutely no reason for anyone to be complaining about it. 
As you say, Bluetooth headphones are the norm these days, but if someone is stuck in their ways and determined to use 3.5mm headphones, they can just spend a couple of quid on an adapter. It's not the end of the world.
editor, did you complain when PCs moved from LPT, RS232 and PS2 ports to USB?
Time progresses and things change. Deal with it.


----------



## Badgers (Jan 20, 2019)

I have been using Bluetooth headphones and connections to other devices for years now. Assumed everyone was 

The wired headphones (cheap and decent) always had problems with the cable/jack and were annoying generally.


----------



## editor (Jan 20, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Listen and charge.
> Baseus USB Type C to 3.5mm Jack Charging Extension Earphone Adapter For Xiaomi Mi 8 6 Huawei P20


Gosh isn't that attractive?


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

editor said:


> Gosh isn't that attractive?


Nice backpedal from "not being able to charge your phone when listening to music"
But there are other ones available. Maybe you'll find an attractive one.


----------



## Throbbing Angel (Jan 20, 2019)

editor said:


> Gosh isn't that attractive?


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

Throbbing Angel said:


>


Innit


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

DP


----------



## souljacker (Jan 20, 2019)

Bluetooth is fucking shit though. And I can never find the bloody adaptor for my iPhone headphones.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

souljacker said:


> Bluetooth is fucking shit though.


Mine isn't.


----------



## souljacker (Jan 20, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Mine isn't.



100% of the time? You're fucking lucky then.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

souljacker said:


> 100% of the time? You're fucking lucky then.


Yeah, I think it's just iPhones that have shitty Bluetooth issues


----------



## souljacker (Jan 20, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Yeah, I think it's just iPhones that have shitty Bluetooth issues



Most of the Bluetooth I do is with my android. It's generally fine, as long as I don't move, which sort of defeats the object.

The very worst performance for Bluetooth audio is the iMac. Unusable.


----------



## editor (Jan 20, 2019)

souljacker said:


> Bluetooth is fucking shit though. And I can never find the bloody adaptor for my iPhone headphones.


You're storing it wrong.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Jan 20, 2019)

Mini jack sockets are not without their issues. Ever since owning my first Walkman they have always ended up going crackly eventually and requiring some attention.


----------



## NoXion (Jan 20, 2019)

skyscraper101 said:


> Mini jack sockets are not without their issues. Ever since owning my first Walkman they have always ended up going crackly eventually and requiring some attention.



I think that's a problem inherent to sockets in general. My current smartphone is rather old and both the USB-C and 3.5mm sockets are dodgy.



Saul Goodman said:


> Yeah, I think it's just iPhones that have shitty Bluetooth issues



Wait, Apple phones use Blutooth? I thought they used some shitty Apple proprietary system instead?


----------



## NoXion (Jan 20, 2019)

skyscraper101 said:


> The world is moving on. Bluetooth headphones are fast becoming the norm these days. I appreciate it bothers a few people but it just seems like advocating for physical keyboards in the age of touchscreen phones.



Touchscreens are a well fucking shit interface, though. The idea that they represent inevitable technological progress rather than a deliberate decision by manufacturers is a load of nonsense.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

NoXion said:


> Wait, Apple phones use Blutooth? I thought they used some shitty Apple proprietary system instead?


Don't go giving them ideas! (Although they'd probably use it as a USP, and fanboys would lap it up)


----------



## NoXion (Jan 20, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Don't go giving them ideas!



It wouldn't be a new idea for Apple! They already do that sort of thing in order to lock-in consumers to their particular brand of hardware, software *and* services. For example, they really don't like the idea of people using third-party repair services:

Apple is using proprietary software to lock MacBook Pros and iMac Pros from third-party repairs


----------



## souljacker (Jan 20, 2019)

NoXion said:


> Wait, Apple phones use Blutooth? I thought they used some shitty Apple proprietary system instead?



They have airdrop for file transfer but talk bluetooth (v4.2 on my iPhone 7) for speakers and whatnot.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 20, 2019)

NoXion said:


> It wouldn't be a new idea for Apple! They already do that sort of thing in order to lock-in consumers to their particular brand of hardware, software *and* services. For example, they really don't like the idea of people using third-party repair services:
> 
> Apple is using proprietary software to lock MacBook Pros and iMac Pros from third-party repairs


Yeah, I've read about their antics. If you replace the screen on your iPhone with a non Apple screen, as soon as you update iOS, the phone will cease to function. Is that even legal? Do their fanboys even care?


----------



## Saul Goodman (Jan 21, 2019)

editor said:


> Gosh isn't that attractive?


Did you manage to find a more attractive version of this thing that doesn't exist?


----------



## cybershot (Jan 25, 2019)

If anything. The future is phones with no ports at all. Two concepts e this week to be launched without a single port.

Meizu made a smartphone without any ports

Vivo's all-glass phone has no ports and a full-screen fingerprint reader


----------



## skyscraper101 (Jan 25, 2019)

cybershot said:


> If anything. The future is phones with no ports at all. Two concepts e this week to be launched without a single port.
> 
> Meizu made a smartphone without any ports
> 
> Vivo's all-glass phone has no ports and a full-screen fingerprint reader



Hmm.. an eSim only device and no front camera. Style over substance.

In theory I've nothing against eSims, but they are totally impractical unless your carrier supports it and you never need to swap out. I use various SIMs depending on which country I'm in and it just wouldn't be practical.


----------



## editor (Jan 25, 2019)

cybershot said:


> If anything. The future is phones with no ports at all. Two concepts e this week to be launched without a single port.
> 
> Meizu made a smartphone without any ports
> 
> Vivo's all-glass phone has no ports and a full-screen fingerprint reader


Happily there's still high end phones coming up with the lovely jack where it should be, given the users the choice of using USB-C headphones, wireless or the traditional jack. Imagine! Putting the consumers first!


----------



## Favelado (Feb 5, 2019)

My Sony WH-1000MX3 headphones use an USB -C charger and i've lost the fucker. Sony's official replacement partner want to charge me 38 euros for the cable which is crazy. I'm confused about whether I can use a different one or not. Sony seems to have various versions and I dont know which one will work.

Can anyone help me?


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 5, 2019)

Favelado said:


> My Sony WH-1000MX3 headphones use an USB -C charger and i've lost the fucker. Sony's official replacement partner want to charge me 38 euros for the cable which is crazy. I'm confused about whether I can use a different one or not. Sony seems to have various versions and I dont know which one will work.
> 
> Can anyone help me?



A standard USB-C charger? You can get cables for a couple of quid on eBay.


----------



## Favelado (Feb 5, 2019)

skyscraper101 said:


> A standard USB-C charger? You can get cables for a couple of quid on eBay.



I don't know if its a standard one or if they are different types. Im a bit lost
The Sony manual says to only use theirs and there are some random internet reports of other ones not working with the headphones.

What do you think?


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 5, 2019)

Favelado said:


> I don't know if its a standard one or if they are different types. Im a bit lost
> The Sony manual says to only use theirs and there are some random internet reports of other ones not working with the headphones.
> 
> What do you think?



I'd take a punt for £2. €38 seems ridiculous but unsurprising of Sony trying to markup something because its 'own brand' - from my brief reading online it seems this may be a 'fast charger' but technically any standard USB-C should be fine. The techradar article seems to suggest so.

Sony WH-1000XM3 Wireless Headphones review | TechRadar


----------



## Favelado (Feb 5, 2019)

Very kind, thank you.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 5, 2019)

Favelado said:


> Very kind, thank you.



Actually, don't buy from that link above (now removed), that was for the old model.

You want USB C not Micro USB  - thats the difference between the MX2 and MX3 models.

Fast Samsung Galaxy S8 / S9+ Plus Type C USB-C Sync Charger Charging Cable 5055401753364 | eBay


----------



## Favelado (Feb 5, 2019)

So we reckon it's bollocks that another brand of USB-C won't work then?

Cheers for the help Sky.


----------



## rubbershoes (Feb 6, 2019)

Favelado said:


> So we reckon it's bollocks that another brand of USB-C won't work then?
> 
> Cheers for the help Sky.



I've bought several ebay USB c cables and they all work fine. If you get one and it's shit it's only cost you a  couple of quid


----------



## mauvais (Feb 6, 2019)

USB and indeed USB-C is a standard, which - as a minimum - means charging should work _as standard_.

You do want a charger of the right current rating (e.g. 2A) or higher. Lower would mean slow or no charging.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Feb 6, 2019)

I'm pro jack.
The things work, you don't need adaptors, and headphones are easy and cheap (or easy and expensive if you like quality).
I use a wired headset for calling when I'm in the office - it's light and comfortable, and I can't find a btooth version that's any good. It never needs charging and I can use it while charging the phone without having to buy an adaptor.
I have 2 btooth headsets but they hardly gets used because you can never guarantee the battery won't die half way through a call - I have 10 calls scheduled for this week, each call expected to last 20 minutes, all one after the other.
I'm staying with wired.

My next phone is likely to be a Samsung Note 9, another phone with a headset.


----------



## editor (Feb 6, 2019)

Don Troooomp said:


> I'm pro jack.
> The things work, you don't need adaptors, and headphones are easy and cheap (or easy and expensive if you like quality).
> I use a wired headset for calling when I'm in the office - it's light and comfortable, and I can't find a btooth version that's any good. It never needs charging and I can use it while charging the phone without having to buy an adaptor.
> I have 2 btooth headsets but they hardly gets used because you can never guarantee the battery won't die half way through a call - I have 10 calls scheduled for this week, each call expected to last 20 minutes, all one after the other.
> ...


The Samsung S10 is expected to come with a headphone jack as to do some of the other current flagship/mid-range phones. Unlimited headphone power!


----------



## dervish (Feb 6, 2019)

I have a headphone jack in my V30 (with it's super-duper quad bit DAC), I use bluetooth headphones though. The sound is perfectly acceptable and I love the convenience of it, not having wires is so nice and easy. They have a three hour battery life and have only run out on my once, at the very end of a three hour coach trip. 

I used to think that the headphone jack was an essential, it's a nice to have now, I would be perfectly happy without it and a usb converter in my bag for the rare occasion I needed it.


----------



## Throbbing Angel (Feb 6, 2019)

Favelado said:


> What do you think?



I think don't go outside with them if it is too cold 
https://www.sony.co.uk/electronics/...tooth-headphones/wh-1000xm3/articles/00206130

They look great btw Sony WH-1000XM3 Review – Easily the best noise-cancelling headphones


----------



## Favelado (Feb 7, 2019)

Thanks for all the replies. I got a Samsung lead for a few euros here in Madrid and it is fine.




Throbbing Angel said:


> I think don't go outside with them if it is too cold
> https://www.sony.co.uk/electronics/...tooth-headphones/wh-1000xm3/articles/00206130
> 
> They look great btw Sony WH-1000XM3 Review – Easily the best noise-cancelling headphones



i haven't had a problem with them yet, although it might not have been below zero when I've worn them. Maybe close a couple of times but no issues. I have a pair of AKGs, which aren't noise cancelling, but still have decent sound in case.

I am not poor in Spanish terms, but my modest salary  and bank account means the Sony headphones are maybe the most expensive thing I own (really). I was doing 14 hour days for three months and bought them myself as a reward. I got the silvery-grey ones. They are fantastic. Good headphones pay for themselves as  i think they genuinely increase the quality of your day to day life. I can study for my DELTA course in a cafe and not be bothered by people around me as much as well, as long as I put one of those sea-sound type things on very quietly.

Within a couple of years I think the technology will just block all ambient sound out completely. At the moment my Sony's cut out about 50% of it.


----------



## NoXion (Feb 7, 2019)

cybershot said:


> If anything. The future is phones with no ports at all. Two concepts e this week to be launched without a single port.
> 
> Meizu made a smartphone without any ports
> 
> Vivo's all-glass phone has no ports and a full-screen fingerprint reader



Ugh. Fuck that noise. What's with this obsession manufacturers have with shifting _everything_ from hardware onto software? Especially since software is much harder to fix, much easier to fuck up (whether by deliberate sabotage or just shitty programming), and shifts the balance of power further away from end-users and towards manufacturers and service providers, in an area where they already have an inherent advantage.

As of right now, I could take my phone to a technician who could easily fix the dodgy ports on my phone. But if I was relying solely on software interfaces and they were to fuck up, then it's much more likely that I would be forced to use "approved" vendors in order to get the problem fixed, at vastly inflated prices.

Of course, that's *exactly* why manufacturers are keen to peddle this kind of software-based chicanery. It makes them more money, it's got nothing to do with actually improving products for the end-user. Don't be fooled.


----------



## mauvais (Feb 7, 2019)

That doesn't make a lot of sense. There's a near miss of an argument in somewhere there about proprietary vs. standardised, but that's about it.

Wireless charging is still hardware, for example. SIM cards were still software just with a hardware component. Forced wireless headphones are largely stupid but you never had the 'balance of power' with a 3.5mm socket, it still broke, and approved vendor or not, it probably stayed broken. Such is modern hardware.


----------



## NoXion (Feb 7, 2019)

mauvais said:


> That doesn't make a lot of sense. There's a near miss of an argument in somewhere there about proprietary vs. standardised, but that's about it.
> 
> Wireless charging is still hardware, for example. SIM cards were still software just with a hardware component. Forced wireless headphones are largely stupid but you never had the 'balance of power' with a 3.5mm socket, it still broke, and approved vendor or not, it probably stayed broken. Such is modern hardware.



You need specific hardware in order for wireless charging to work, and I didn't mention it anyway so I don't even know why you're bringing it up - wireless hardware is not the same thing as shifting functions into software. You can swap out SIM cards - there's your freedom right there, and it's the hardware component that grants you that. A 3.5mm socket can be repaired or replaced, but good luck even getting the problem diagnosed if there's some kind of fuck-up when you're forced to rely solely on Bluetooth or some other wireless data transfer.


----------



## mauvais (Feb 7, 2019)

NoXion said:


> You need specific hardware in order for wireless charging to work, and I didn't mention it anyway so I don't even know why you're bringing it up - wireless hardware is not the same thing as shifting functions into software.


The phones in the post you responded to have got rid of all ports, part of which is wlreless charging.


> You can swap out SIM cards - there's your freedom right there, and it's the hardware component that grants you that.


You can theoretically switch with eSIM, which is a standard, but how that actually manifests itself in practice is yet to be seen. If it worked well then there would be a greater degree of freedom in, say, international roaming. You don't need anything physical to switch deals.


> A 3.5mm socket can be repaired or replaced, but good luck even getting the problem diagnosed if there's some kind of fuck-up when you're forced to rely solely on Bluetooth or some other wireless data transfer.


Bluetooth should be more reliable than a hardware port, and it shouldn't be possible to degrade. That doesn't make it the better option, because 3.5mm has lots of practical user benefits, but hardware sockets on mobile devices are probably the most susceptible to damage, and now that hardware is usually a sealed unit, no easier to fix than any other part.


----------



## editor (Feb 7, 2019)

If I had to have wireless earbuds then this rumoured feature would definitely ease the pain 



> In addition, there is a first picture showing the new Samsung Galaxy Buds wireless headphones in their carry case, which can be charged wirelessly from the Galaxy S10 (Plus).


Samsung Galaxy S10 & Galaxy S10 Plus: Offizielle Bilder (Update)


----------



## dervish (Feb 7, 2019)

editor said:


> If I had to have wireless earbuds then this rumoured feature would definitely ease the pain
> 
> 
> Samsung Galaxy S10 & Galaxy S10 Plus: Offizielle Bilder (Update)



Mine have a lovely little  case that automatically charges them, I have to charge the case about once a fortnight. No pain involved.


----------



## editor (Feb 7, 2019)

dervish said:


> Mine have a lovely little  case that automatically charges them, I have to charge the case about once a fortnight. No pain involved.


Another thing to drag along/forget when you're going off on a trip though.


----------



## dervish (Feb 7, 2019)

Just like a pair of wired headphones.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 7, 2019)

Rubbery ended earbuds. Not for me.


----------



## editor (Feb 7, 2019)

dervish said:


> Just like a pair of wired headphones.


Don't recall having to ever charge them or needing to bring along a special box just to make them work.


----------



## dervish (Feb 7, 2019)

My wireless ones have never got tangled, caught in anything, or started to only work in one ear because the plug got bent.


----------



## editor (Feb 7, 2019)

dervish said:


> My wireless ones have never got tangled, caught in anything, or started to only work in one ear because the plug got bent.


You'll have the slow but inevitable run down of the battery's capacity to look forward to. And then you'll have to by another pair. No wonder the industry is pushing wireless earphones.


----------



## dervish (Feb 7, 2019)

Yep, but I've had them 6 months, they are still going strong, when they die, which I don't think will happen for another 6 months minimum I can stand to spend another £25-£30 for another pair. They still don't get tangled in anything and they are way more convenient to use.


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2019)

dervish said:


> Yep, but I've had them 6 months, they are still going strong, when they die, which I don't think will happen for another 6 months minimum I can stand to spend another £25-£30 for another pair. They still don't get tangled in anything and they are way more convenient to use.


That's capitalism in a nutshell. Hook you in and keep you coming back for more!


----------



## BigTom (Feb 8, 2019)

editor said:


> You'll have the slow but inevitable run down of the battery's capacity to look forward to. And then you'll have to by another pair. No wonder the industry is pushing wireless earphones.



I replaced my wired headphones every year or two because one of the wires has broken or is loose. They are in ear & moulded so i can't open or fix them, like you could with more expensive cans, but i expect you could replace batteries on some wireless headphones, especially cans rather than in ear ones.
I don't think there's a big difference in that respect really.


----------



## dervish (Feb 8, 2019)

editor said:


> That's capitalism in a nutshell. Hook you in and keep you coming back for more!



Nope, if you spend £30 on a pair of headphone expect them not to last for more than a year.
If I spent more on them I would expect them to live longer.


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2019)

dervish said:


> Nope, if you spend £30 on a pair of headphone expect them not to last for more than a year.
> If I spent more on them I would expect them to live longer.


But if you wanted a decent set of wireless (and expensive) earphones, you'd still come across the same problem of a battery that eventually fails and there's a load more electronics that go into wireless earphones than a wired pair. Extra waste, extra power and a never ending 'replace' cycle just to maintain what you've already got. Like I said capitalism in a nutshell.  

And, of course, £30 wireless earphones are almost certainly going to sound worse than a £30 wired set.


----------



## dervish (Feb 8, 2019)

A battery that eventually fails. Plugs that eventually break. All technology has a built in shelf life, whether wired or wireless.

And yes, these don't sound _quite _as good as my £120 B&O headphones, but there really isn't much in it. In fact the only real difference is a slight hiss in between tracks. I like the sound of them, they are enjoyable to listen to and the convenience is well worth it.

And they are a quarter of the price.

ETA: I would happily put them up against any £30 wired headphones. I would say they would easily beat them, two people who have tried them against airpods have preferred them, the price was a consideration in that TBF but the sound is much better than you would expect.


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2019)

dervish said:


> A battery that eventually fails. Plugs that eventually break. All technology has a built in shelf life, whether wired or wireless.
> 
> And yes, these don't sound _quite _as good as my £120 B&O headphones, but there really isn't much in it. In fact the only real difference is a slight hiss in between tracks. I like the sound of them, they are enjoyable to listen to and the convenience is well worth it.
> 
> ...


If you're truly comparing like with like, how on earth could a pair of wireless earphones - that come with the additional expensive of electronics, Bluetooth receiver, battery and a special little charging case (and  potential audio limitations/interference/dropouts)   - possibly be superior to the same set of earphones that are wired?


----------



## dervish (Feb 8, 2019)

They sound better. Technology has a habit of moving on and getting better. 

I'm actually arguing this from a point of having tried both, you seem to have decided that they must be worse because, well, just because and nothing is going to change your mind. Spend the £30, try some and try arguing from a position of experience.


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2019)

dervish said:


> They sound better. Technology has a habit of moving on and getting better.
> 
> I'm actually arguing this from a point of having tried both, you seem to have decided that they must be worse because, well, just because and nothing is going to change your mind. Spend the £30, try some and try arguing from a position of experience.


I'm arguing from a position of logic.


----------



## dervish (Feb 8, 2019)

But zero actual experience.


----------



## cybershot (Feb 8, 2019)

God, not the headphones debate, AGAIN!


----------



## Favelado (Feb 8, 2019)

editor said:


> If you're truly comparing like with like, how on earth could a pair of wireless earphones - that come with the additional expensive of electronics, Bluetooth receiver, battery and a special little charging case (and  potential audio limitations/interference/dropouts)   - possibly be superior to the same set of earphones that are wired?



The gap is getting smaller and smaller all the time ed. What Hi-Fi reviews will attest to that.

eta on a lot of 2018 model Bluetooth wireless headphones the gap is now tiny. Both my AKGs (75 quid) and Sony's (320 quid) sound the same to me when plugged in and are as good as similarly priced wired-only alternatives.


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2019)

dervish said:


> But zero actual experience.


I've tried plenty of wireless earphones as it happens. Some sound good, some sound shit. But as I've argued all along, I'd like the choice of what I use and not be forced into a world of endless recharging and adaptors and that's why phones without a headphone socket are a fucking pain.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Feb 8, 2019)

editor said:


> I've tried plenty of wireless earphones as it happens. Some sound good, some sound shit. But as I've argued all along, I'd like the choice of what I use and not be forced into a world of endless recharging and adaptors and that's why phones without a headphone socket are a fucking pain.


You could use the USB-C to 3.5mm stereo converter that comes free with the phone. Just leave it plugged into your headphones, then it's really no different to having a headphone socket.


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> You could use the USB-C to 3.5mm stereo converter that comes free with the phone. Just leave it plugged into your headphones, then it's really no different to having a headphone socket.


That's nice. But how do I charge my phone if I'm on a long journey?


----------



## Saul Goodman (Feb 8, 2019)

editor said:


> That's nice. But how do I charge my phone if I'm on a long journey?


Bakeey USB Type-C Adapter Charger Audio Cable 2 In 1 Type-C To 3.5mm Jack Headphone Aux Converter
Baseus USB Type C to 3.5mm Jack Charging Extension Earphone Adapter For Xiaomi Mi 8 6 Huawei P20


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Bakeey USB Type-C Adapter Charger Audio Cable 2 In 1 Type-C To 3.5mm Jack Headphone Aux Converter
> Baseus USB Type C to 3.5mm Jack Charging Extension Earphone Adapter For Xiaomi Mi 8 6 Huawei P20


Oh goodie. Another adaptor. And how elegant too!


----------



## Saul Goodman (Feb 8, 2019)

editor said:


> Oh goodie. Another adaptor. And how elegant too!


Is it more ugly than the charger you'd be plugging into the phone?
And you could leave that constantly connected to your charger, and use the discreet one that comes with the phone when you're not charging it.


----------



## Sasaferrato (Feb 11, 2019)

editor said:


> Gosh isn't that attractive?



I recognise and sympathise with your view here...


----------



## Sasaferrato (Feb 11, 2019)

Favelado said:


> So we reckon it's bollocks that another brand of USB-C won't work then?
> 
> Cheers for the help Sky.



I have a Lenovo Yoga Tab 3 Plus 10-Inch Tablet which comes with fast USB C charger (16W). I actually use a standard 10W USB charger, because it is more convenient. It just takes a bit longer to charge. We have a 4 x 2A charger which does our tablets, phones and Kindles.


----------



## Sasaferrato (Feb 11, 2019)

BigTom said:


> I replaced my wired headphones every year or two because one of the wires has broken or is loose. They are in ear & moulded so i can't open or fix them, like you could with more expensive cans, but i expect you could replace batteries on some wireless headphones, especially cans rather than in ear ones.
> I don't think there's a big difference in that respect really.



I sleep with an MP3 player running, headphone life depends on whether I roll over and trap the cable or not. The current set were £8.00 in ASDA, and for audio books are perfectly fine. I used to use Sennheiser CX 200s, but got through two sets in six months, a bit pricey.


----------



## editor (Mar 18, 2019)

Two real-life anecdotes from a recent tour of the US that made me very grateful for the humble earphone jack.

1. Flying over to the West Coast I realised I'd packed my earphones in the hold luggage. But no problem as the airline had surprisingly REALLY good earbuds for just $5. Problem solved.
As for my friend who had also forgotten his earphones but had an iPhone - nothing but silence (or the opportunity to pay over $100 for Bluetooth earphones and then wait for them to charge).

2. The second tour bus's sound system had no Bluetooth but just a jack input. So I ruled as DJ while adapter-less iPhone users rued their choice of handsets. However, after trying about five stores, we finally found a place that sold the required adapter so at least the driver was able to choose music for his long drive home.

Choice really is king, folks. Unless you like silence.


----------



## pesh (Mar 18, 2019)

surely competence is king, but having a jack socket is handy if you're a bit forgetful


----------



## binka (Mar 22, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Bakeey USB Type-C Adapter Charger Audio Cable 2 In 1 Type-C To 3.5mm Jack Headphone Aux Converter
> Baseus USB Type C to 3.5mm Jack Charging Extension Earphone Adapter For Xiaomi Mi 8 6 Huawei P20


I really don't see how this is a better solution than having a headphone jack? In fact I'll stick my neck out here and say having just a USB socket is objectively worse than having a USB and seperate jack


----------



## Saul Goodman (Mar 23, 2019)

binka said:


> I really don't see how this is a better solution than having a headphone jack? In fact I'll stick my neck out here and say having just a USB socket is objectively worse than having a USB and seperate jack


Where did I say it was 'better'? I posted it as a solution for anyone without a headphone socket, not as a better alternative to a headphone socket.


----------



## BristolEcho (Mar 23, 2019)

editor said:


> Two real-life anecdotes from a recent tour of the US that made me very grateful for the humble earphone jack.
> 
> 1. Flying over to the West Coast I realised I'd packed my earphones in the hold luggage. But no problem as the airline had surprisingly REALLY good earbuds for just $5. Problem solved.
> As for my friend who had also forgotten his earphones but had an iPhone - nothing but silence (or the opportunity to pay over $100 for Bluetooth earphones and then wait for them to charge).
> ...



Or you could just remember to keep your headphones in your hand luggage.


----------



## pseudonarcissus (Mar 23, 2019)

editor said:


> As for my friend who had also forgotten his earphones but had an iPhone - nothing but silence
> 
> Choice really is king, folks. Unless you like silence.



Take good book and you’ll be just fine. I love silence.

I’m woried about humanity when the person in the next seat can sit for hours with no other intellectual stimulation than worD search


----------



## emanymton (Mar 23, 2019)

BristolEcho said:


> Or you could just remember to keep your headphones in your hand luggage.


But everyone forgets or losses things sometimes. I left my headphones at home a couple of weeks ago and I just bought a cheap pair for a couple of quid. They are not very good but where ok for a day, and now live in my bag as a spare pair.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Mar 23, 2019)

I didn't actually think I'd use the headphone port on my Nokia 8, as I'm a total covert to wireless phones, but switching cars recently and I'm using it as a stop gap, so glad it's there I guess. Can't wait to stop using it though, it's a faff (in car).


----------



## editor (Mar 23, 2019)

BristolEcho said:


> Or you could just remember to keep your headphones in your hand luggage.


You never forget anything, ever? At least the humble headphone jack meant I wasn't sitting in silence for six hours. Mind you, if I'd had bluetooth earphones they would have run out of battery before the journey was out.


----------



## BristolEcho (Mar 24, 2019)

emanymton said:


> But everyone forgets or losses things sometimes. I left my headphones at home a couple of weeks ago and I just bought a cheap pair for a couple of quid. They are not very good but where ok for a day, and now live in my bag as a spare pair.



I wasn't being entirely serious.

Jokes on me anyway because guess what I forgot to pack for my coach trip today?


----------



## Saul Goodman (Mar 24, 2019)

editor said:


> Two real-life anecdotes from a recent tour of the US that made me very grateful for the humble earphone jack.
> 
> 1. Flying over to the West Coast I realised I'd packed my earphones in the hold luggage. But no problem as the airline had surprisingly REALLY good earbuds for just $5. Problem solved.
> As for my friend who had also forgotten his earphones but had an iPhone - nothing but silence (or the opportunity to pay over $100 for Bluetooth earphones and then wait for them to charge).
> ...


----------



## Don Troooomp (Mar 24, 2019)

I bought the note 9, partially because it solves my problems with Ppt when I'm out and about, but partially because it has a headphone jack.
Lacking the latter would probably have been a deal killer, more so as lonely nights in hotel rooms are slightly less boring with a nice collection of films on my ridiculous 512gb of internal memory and a pair of simple wired headphones to listen on.

Edit - Off topic.
I find aircraft headsets uncomfortable so I bought an adaptor and use a pair of cheap but reasonable wired earbuds. Way better and nothing in weight or size.


----------



## editor (Mar 24, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


>


If you've nothing useful to add, don't act like a prick and post up moronic images.


----------



## editor (Mar 24, 2019)

Don Troooomp said:


> I bought the note 9, partially because it solves my problems with Ppt when I'm out and about, but partially because it has a headphone jack.
> Lacking the latter would probably have been a deal killer, more so as lonely nights in hotel rooms are slightly less boring with a nice collection of films on my ridiculous 512gb of internal memory and a pair of simple wired headphones to listen on.
> 
> Edit - Off topic.
> I find aircraft headsets uncomfortable so I bought an adaptor and use a pair of cheap but reasonable wired earbuds. Way better and nothing in weight or size.


The $5 ones from JetBlue not only came in a pretty case (that I've already repurposed) but sounded good enough to become my back up pair for my bag. 



> Don’t think of it as a case that comes free with $5 earbuds. *Instead, think of it as a $5 small electronics/cable/USB key/dongle/battery organizer that happens to come with some free earbuds.* You’re not going to find a handy little case like this at Best Buy, the Apple Store, or any other electronics shop at that price.








JetBlue's best deal sells for just five bucks - Global Nerdy - Joey deVilla's mobile/tech blog


----------



## Don Troooomp (Mar 24, 2019)

Given they were from a market, JBL is probably a lie, but they work well.
The mobile just gets its supplied headphones


----------



## Saul Goodman (Mar 24, 2019)

editor said:


> If you've nothing useful to add, don't act like a prick and post up moronic images.


It was an attempt to match your moronic anecdotes.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Mar 24, 2019)

What next, every pair of shoes should have a built-in phone, in case you accidentally leave your phone at home?


----------



## editor (Mar 24, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> What next, every pair of shoes should have a built-in phone, in case you accidentally leave your phone at home?


I'm banning you off this thread and issuing a warning, under Rule One of this site: don't be a dick.


----------



## binka (Mar 24, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Where did I say it was 'better'? I posted it as a solution for anyone without a headphone socket, not as a better alternative to a headphone socket.


Earlier in the thread you said you don't see the problem and don't know why anyone would have an issue with it. Excuse me for misinterpreting that as you thinking its a good thing


----------



## Saul Goodman (Mar 24, 2019)

A warning for pointing out the obvious 
Well done you.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Mar 24, 2019)

binka said:


> Earlier in the thread you said you don't see the problem and don't know why anyone would have an issue with it. Excuse me for misinterpreting that as you thinking its a good thing


It's progression. Things progress. Life goes on.


----------



## binka (Mar 24, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> It's progression. Things progress. Life goes on.


So you do think it's better then? Make your mind up


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Mar 24, 2019)

I remember people getting very upset when computers started to lose their floppy drives. It was frustrating for a little bit, but we got over it.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Mar 24, 2019)

binka said:


> So you do think it's better then? Make your mind up


Progression doesn't necessarily mean better, or worse. It means progression.

I wonder if there are people here who cry over their stack of old SD cards, and vilify phone manufacturers for daring to move to a different format.

Things change, if you don't like it, write a strongly worded letter to the manufacturer, and see how far it gets you.


----------



## binka (Mar 24, 2019)

Saul Goodman said:


> Progression doesn't necessarily mean better, or worse. It means progression.
> 
> I wonder if there are people here who cry over their stack of old SD cards, and vilify phone manufacturers for daring to move to a different format.
> 
> Things change, if you don't like it, write a strongly worded letter to the manufacturer, and see how far it gets you.


Progress is an improved or better state than previous. Something can be new without being progress


----------



## editor (Mar 24, 2019)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> I remember people getting very upset when computers started to lose their floppy drives. It was frustrating for a little bit, but we got over it.


But this isn't the same thing is it? Floppy drives were unreliable and had very limited storage, so the advantages of using other storage methods were crystal clear. Now explain to me the amazing advantages of releasing a phone (or a laptop) that doesn't have a earphone socket.


----------



## Baronage-Phase (Mar 24, 2019)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> I remember people getting very upset when computers started to lose their floppy drives. It was frustrating for a little bit, but we got over it.




I hate that new laptops don't have a CD drive.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Mar 24, 2019)

Lupa said:


> I hate that new laptops don't have a CD drive.



I love how skinny my Chromebook is, there's no way you could that with a drive in there. Swings and roundabouts I guess. I can't remember the last time I used a CD.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Mar 24, 2019)

editor said:


> But this isn't the same thing is it? Floppy drives were unreliable and had very limited storage, so the advantages of using other storage methods were crystal clear. Now explain to me the amazing advantages of releasing a phone (or a laptop) that doesn't have a earphone socket.



It didnt seem so cut and dried at the time. Floppy drives were a standard, rewriteable CDs were even more unreliable and Zip and USB drives were expensive. We coped though.

Bluetooth headphones will keep getting cheaper. Mine were 15 quid, sound quality is fine for me and the battery life is epic.

Edit: I'd rather save my ire for built in batteries. Not that I want to carry spares, but so it's a cheap job to swap it in 18 months.


----------



## editor (Mar 24, 2019)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> It didnt seem so cut and dried at the time. Floppy drives were a standard, rewriteable CDs were even more unreliable and Zip and USB drives were expensive. We coped though.
> 
> Bluetooth headphones will keep getting cheaper. Mine were 15 quid, sound quality is fine for me and the battery life is epic.
> 
> Edit: I'd rather save my ire for built in batteries. Not that I want to carry spares, but so it's a cheap job to swap it in 18 months.


I'm all for Bluetooth earphones. But you've yet to come up with a reason why removing an earphone jack offers any advantages at all.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Mar 24, 2019)

editor said:


> I'm all for Bluetooth earphones. But you've yet to come up with a reason why removing an earphone jack offers any advantages at all.



I'll pass on that one as I honestly don't know. I assume it has some design advantages though, just saying that give it a few years and we will wonder why we were so bothered. 

I'm sure they will get the problems with USB buds sorted for those who prefer cables.


----------



## editor (Mar 24, 2019)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> I'll pass on that one as I honestly don't know. I assume it has some design advantages though, just saying that give it a few years and we will wonder why we were so bothered.


That's because the only 'advantage' is about 0.2mm extra slimness, or whatever. Oh, and lots more sales of Bluetooth earphones to replace the perfectly good wired ones and a roaring trade in battery replacement. I'm pretty sure there'll be plenty of wired headphones around in a few years too.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Mar 24, 2019)

editor said:


> That's because the only 'advantage' is about 0.2mm extra slimness, or whatever. Oh, and lots more sales of Bluetooth earphones to replace the perfectly good wired ones and a roaring trade in battery replacement. I'm pretty sure there'll be plenty of wired headphones around in a few years too.



Yeah. The slimness thing is bizarre. As soon as get a phone it in a case as I'm sure most do.

More upsettingly I don't think it's a roaring trade in battery replacement, but just feeding into this cycle of replacing perfectly working phones. 

Not convinced about about the doing it to sell more buds. Maybe some Apple fans will buy theirs, but most android owners aren't going to buy the same brand as their phone. They'll probably get a cheap pair of Toa Tronincs from Amazon...


----------



## fishfinger (Mar 24, 2019)

My new phone (Xiaomi Mi A2 Lite) has a 3.5mm headphone socket


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Mar 24, 2019)

fishfinger said:


> My new phone (Xiaomi Mi A2 Lite) has a 3.5mm headphone socket



My Nokia 8 does as well. I've yet to have one that doesn't, but guess the time will come.


----------



## editor (Mar 24, 2019)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> Yeah. The slimness thing is bizarre. As soon as get a phone it in a case as I'm sure most do.
> 
> More upsettingly I don't think it's a roaring trade in battery replacement, but just feeding into this cycle of replacing perfectly working phones.
> 
> Not convinced about about the doing it to sell more buds. Maybe some Apple fans will buy theirs, but most android owners aren't going to buy the same brand as their phone. They'll probably get a cheap pair of Toa Tronincs from Amazon...


Most likely Bluetooth earphones - and all their additional circuitry and batteries - will just add up to even more electronic shit that gets thrown away unto landfill when the batteries conk out.


----------



## keybored (Mar 25, 2019)

I don't yet own any wireless earphones but for me (and since the days of the Sony Walkman) the most common cause of failure in wired earphones by far has been the wires themselves (stress over time causing the wire to break internally). I'm lucky if I have a set last 2 years so swapping the cause of failure isn't a big deal.


----------



## editor (Mar 25, 2019)

keybored said:


> I don't yet own any wireless earphones but for me (and since the days of the Sony Walkman) the most common cause of failure in wired earphones by far has been the wires themselves (stress over time causing the wire to break internally). I'm lucky if I have a set last 2 years so swapping the cause of failure isn't a big deal.


But having the option for wired earphones as well has to be the best all round solution, no? I wonder how long the battery life of equally used Bluetooth earphones might fare after 2 years.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Mar 25, 2019)

editor said:


> I'm all for Bluetooth earphones. But you've yet to come up with a reason why removing an earphone jack offers any advantages at all.



Bluetooth can be very useful - I have a set, but the things are no use for long term as the ruddy batteries run down half way through what you're doing (sod's law).
The headphone jack is extremely useful, not just for headphones but also for external speakers or stuffing into a hifi if I'm that way inclined.
Easy and quick, and all with standard cables.
Of course bluetooth works, and works well, but removing the socket is a bad idea when that little hole is so popular ..... and so useful..


----------



## Don Troooomp (Apr 30, 2019)

The new Samsung Tab S5 is USB audio - that's a deal killer for me as I use tabs for presentations, but many of my sites have old projectors so I have to connect using VGA and use the 3.5 mm for audio.
No 3.5, no audio, no good.


----------



## kabbes (Apr 30, 2019)

My problem isn’t headphones — I have a fantastic pair of Bluetooth headphones with a 20+ hour battery life — it’s when I want to connect the phone to somebody else’s audio device and they don’t have anything but a jack connector, which is not uncommon.  I have an adapter but I never have it with me, because it’s not the kind of thing you just go around with.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Apr 30, 2019)

kabbes said:


> I have an adapter but I never have it with me, because it’s not the kind of thing you just go around with.



Oops - I always have a mains charger, car charger, wired headphones, a C type card reader/USB OTG, and a VGA/HDMI adaptor.
If I'm working, add a bluetooth keyboard/trackpad, a small speaker, HDMI and VGA leads, and a short mains extension in case I need them.
Pen, pencil, Swiss army knife, a couple of flash drives, and a third flash on a very small C type OTG with all my work backed up on it.

I travel a lot so they're handy, and they've become habit.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Apr 30, 2019)

Almost forgot - If I'm out working, I also carry a microphone, an appropriate cable, and a little TV style mic sign with the appropriate ID on it. It looks fine on camera, but it's just a piece of card I put through my inkjet.
Really handy for interviews.


----------



## kabbes (Apr 30, 2019)

I, on the other hand, prefer not to go everywhere with a backpack of cables and tools.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Apr 30, 2019)

kabbes said:


> I, on the other hand, prefer not to go everywhere with a backpack of cables and tools.



Just a waist wallet in the belt of my trousers. Invisible to all - The other stuff is in my rucksack when I travel for whatever number of days


----------



## souljacker (Apr 30, 2019)

Don Troooomp said:


> Oops - I always have a mains charger, car charger, wired headphones, a C type card reader/USB OTG, and a VGA/HDMI adaptor.
> If I'm working, add a bluetooth keyboard/trackpad, a small speaker, HDMI and VGA leads, and a short mains extension in case I need them.
> Pen, pencil, Swiss army knife, a couple of flash drives, and a third flash on a very small C type OTG with all my work backed up on it.
> 
> I travel a lot so they're handy, and they've become habit.



I travel a lot too and often have various bits of kit in my bag. But never the USB to 3.5mm jack for my pixel or the one for my iphone. Mainly because I have no idea where they are because they are tiny and only necessary 2% of the time. It's just annoying that, in that 2% of time, they are absolutely vital.


----------



## kabbes (Apr 30, 2019)

Incredibly, if I’m round at a friend’s, I don’t tend to have a “waist wallet” (whatever that is) stuffed full of cables with me.  Silly me.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Apr 30, 2019)

I just carry round a spare set of wired earbuds (my old apple ones) for the odd occasion I want to watch a movie on a plane or need to listen to a jack-only source.

Given that I carry a bag around most places, it is the most insignificant of inconveniences compared to the massive convenience of not having wires hanging from my ears and getting caught on bags, clothes, door handles. etc. and getting yanked out of my ear, or even worse, severed entirely (it has happened).


----------



## Don Troooomp (Apr 30, 2019)

kabbes said:


> Incredibly, if I’m round at a friend’s, I don’t tend to have a “waist wallet” (whatever they is) stuffed full of cables with me.  Silly me.



How strange


----------



## editor (May 6, 2019)

Brilliant article.



> AirPods Are a Tragedy
> 
> Apple claims that AirPods are building a “wireless future.” Many people think they're a symbol of disposable wealth. The truth is bleaker.
> AirPods are a product of the past.
> ...





> Kyle Wiens, CEO of iFixit, which does electronics teardowns and sells repair tools and parts, told Motherboard that AirPods are “evil.” According to the headphones review team at Rtings.com, AirPods are "below-average" in terms of sound quality. According to people on every social media platform, AirPods are a display of wealth.
> 
> But more than a pair of headphones, AirPods are an un-erasable product of culture and class. People in working or impoverished economic classes are responsible for the life-threatening, exhaustive, violent work of removing their parts from the ground and assembling them. Meanwhile, people in the global upper class design and purchase AirPods.





> Thus, AirPods strategically glue together an ecosystem of luxury products. They are only so “convenient” because, by eliminating the headphone jack, Apple made the iPhone less user-friendly.
> 
> Destroying the mild nuisance of headphone jacks comes at two costs: One, it locks people into a system of limited, compatible, proprietary products that are inevitably going to die in a few years. And two, it creates a dilemma at the product’s end of life. If you try to recycle AirPods, a worker at a recycling plant will have to engage in the risky and mundane task of separating the glued-in lithium-ion battery from the plastic.





> AirPods were destined to become e-waste from the moment they were manufactured. And AirPods become e-waste after just eighteen months, when the irreplaceable lithium ion battery dies.
> 
> “I would put this in the planned obsolescence category of products, but it’s not really planned obsolescence, it’s planned failure,” Wiens told Motherboard. “When they made these products, they knew they were only gonna last for 18 months. They didn’t put that on the outside of the box, knowing that the battery is not replaceable, and here we are.”



AirPods Are a Tragedy


----------



## pesh (May 6, 2019)

It would be a brilliant article if it were accurate, Apple replace the batteries on Airpods for about $99 / £95 a pair. 
they are still shit obviously.


----------



## editor (May 6, 2019)

pesh said:


> It would be a brilliant article if it were accurate, Apple replace the batteries on Airpods for about $99 / £95 a pair.
> they are still shit obviously.


That's priced so ridiculously high many people will just elect to get a new pair. 

AirPods no longer holding charge? Apple can replace batteries but the fees are exorbitant


----------



## pesh (May 6, 2019)

apple? charging too much for something? say it isn't so.


----------



## Don Troooomp (May 6, 2019)

pesh said:


> apple? charging too much for something? say it isn't so.



Build shit that doesn't charge - then charge a lot so they charge.
Sounds like Apple.


----------



## Chilli.s (May 7, 2019)

Just swatted up on repairing these, fucking impossible is the answer.

Wonder if crapple just replace rather than re-battery? Anyone had a hairpod battery replacement?


----------



## Fez909 (May 8, 2019)

The new Google Pixel 3a has a jack!

Google launches cheaper Pixel 3a smartphones

Looks great, tbh!


----------



## Chilli.s (May 8, 2019)

pesh said:


> It would be a brilliant article if it were accurate, Apple replace the batteries on Airpods for about $99 / £95 a pair.
> they are still shit obviously.



Do they though? I'm thinking not, they just exchange them for a new set for £100. All the other points in the article linked by Editor stand as valid. The pods themselves seem to be a marvel of miniaturization, if someone can afford them.


----------



## pesh (May 8, 2019)

i have no idea. i'd have thought apple would have the abilities to defeat glue but you could well be right. If i really hated sound and i wanted to look like my ears had been up all night doing ketamine i'd probably get a pair, but i don't.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Jun 4, 2019)

Looks like the Note 10 will be short of a jack

Samsung Galaxy Note 10 could still have physical buttons


----------



## editor (Jun 4, 2019)

Don Troooomp said:


> Looks like the Note 10 will be short of a jack
> 
> Samsung Galaxy Note 10 could still have physical buttons


Good job there's still plenty of top notch phones with a jack, mind


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Jun 5, 2019)

Don Troooomp said:


> Looks like the Note 10 will be short of a jack
> 
> Samsung Galaxy Note 10 could still have physical buttons



It's not like there isn't space for one.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Jun 5, 2019)

My Note 9 has a jack and it would have been a deal killer if it was short of one.
The 10 is too early as I generally change phones every three years, but I would really like a jack on whatever comes next.


----------



## kabbes (Jun 5, 2019)

Why on earth do you bother changing phones every three years?  What happens to them to make them useless in that short time?  And what happens to the old ones when you’re done with them?  My god, the waste of this society is just depressing as fuck.


----------



## mauvais (Jun 5, 2019)

I find phones last 2-3 years. The USB port usually fails and the battery life decays significantly. I do mobile dev for a living so that probably doesn't help. Both things could be fixed but by that point technology has moved along enough to justify the upgrade.

Last time, the old phone went to the manufacturer's recycling scheme in exchange for a rebate.


----------



## kabbes (Jun 5, 2019)

What are you doing to that poor USB port in two years??


----------



## mauvais (Jun 5, 2019)

kabbes said:


> What are you doing to that poor USB port in two years??


Using it all the time. The phone's connected for development work as well as charging.

I don't know yet whether USB-C fares any better than its predecessor.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Jun 5, 2019)

I keep having good intentions of making them last 3 plus years. They very rarely do. 

I do think batteries should be way easier to replace though, even if its not by a simple cover like it used to be.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Jun 5, 2019)

mauvais said:


> Using it all the time. The phone's connected for development work as well as charging.
> 
> I don't know yet whether USB-C fares any better than its predecessor.



I see a lot of magnetic solutions available these days to help prevent damage by the constant plugging in and disconnecting of USB cables - I just got one for my VR headset. I wonder why this hasn't been adopted more widely as standard in the phone world?

My macbook air has one thankfully and its a blessing given the amount of times the cable has been yanked suddenly from the charge port. I suppose wireless charging is going to be the future anyway.


----------



## mauvais (Jun 5, 2019)

skyscraper101 said:


> I see a lot of magnetic solutions available these days to help prevent damage by the constant plugging in and disconnecting of USB cables - I just got one for my VR headset. I wonder why this hasn't been adopted more widely as standard in the phone world?
> 
> My macbook air has one thankfully and its a blessing given the amount of times the cable has been yanked suddenly from the charge port. I suppose wireless charging is going to be the future anyway.


I have a wireless charger (in fact, two, a pad at home and a mount in the car) but never use it. It makes everything hot and generally it's less practical than a wire. But it is good to have as a fallback in case of port issues.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Jun 5, 2019)

kabbes said:


> Why on earth do you bother changing phones every three years?  What happens to them to make them useless in that short time?  And what happens to the old ones when you’re done with them?  My god, the waste of this society is just depressing as fuck.



I'm a heavy user and often need up to date features. The last change was done as I needed to use the phone for presentations and my old one wouldn't do it.
The last phone was less than a year old and still in perfect condition but my wife's phone was old.
My youngest got her old one, and she got mine.
No waste as all are still in use.


----------



## Don Troooomp (Jun 5, 2019)

The Window 8 tab I'm using at the moment is also having problems, the battery taking a long time to charge and not lasting very long.
As this is used for work when I'm out and about and charging all the time is impractical, this will have to get changed at some point in the near future.
My problem is Android tabs just don't have the same software and that means translate is a big issue (I have to look at a lot of foreign sites) so I'm hanging on as long as possible.
I don't want Windows 10.


----------



## editor (Feb 9, 2020)

Right, so for various reasons I've ended up with a phone without a jack socket and can say with 100% certainty I was completely right about it being a fucking pain in the arse.

I've gone through two USB adapters and now the one I'm using on a long rail journey has fucked up. So no music for me. Fuck's sake.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Feb 9, 2020)

editor said:


> Right, so for various reasons I've ended up with a phone without a jack socket and can say with 100% certainty I was completely right about it being a fucking pain in the arse.
> 
> I've gone through two USB adapters and now the one I'm using on a long rail journey has fucked up. So no music for me. Fuck's sake.



It's a ball ache, but maybe time to embrace Bluetooth?


----------



## editor (Feb 9, 2020)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> It's a ball ache, but maybe time to embrace Bluetooth?


I've got a pair of Bluetooth headphones but they're not so practical on long tours. I bought a pair of Bluetooth earphones but they sounded shit so sent them back.


----------



## pesh (Feb 9, 2020)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> It's a ball ache, but maybe time to embrace Bluetooth?


He has, probably the time to bring them out with him though.


----------



## Sasaferrato (Feb 9, 2020)

Don Troooomp said:


> The Window 8 tab I'm using at the moment is also having problems, the battery taking a long time to charge and not lasting very long.
> As this is used for work when I'm out and about and charging all the time is impractical, this will have to get changed at some point in the near future.
> My problem is Android tabs just don't have the same software and that means translate is a big issue (I have to look at a lot of foreign sites) so I'm hanging on as long as possible.
> I don't want Windows 10.


We both have Lenovo tablets. Excellent.


----------



## editor (Feb 9, 2020)

Thing is, if I'm going to the pub and want to listen to music on the way, I don't want to chance taking a snazzy pair of Bluetooth earphones, so I guess I'll keep buying adapters until I find one that lasts more than a week. I concede that I'm going to have to buy some wireless ones too at some point.


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 9, 2020)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> It's a ball ache, but maybe time to embrace Bluetooth?


It's not a ball ache at all. Excellent sound quality can be found in many blutooth earphones and headphones for reasonable cost now if you know what to look for and most people's USB adapters last for ever if you really insist on using old fashioned tech.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Feb 9, 2020)

editor said:


> Thing is, if I'm going to the pub and want to listen to music on the way, I don't want to chance taking a snazzy pair of Bluetooth earphones, so I guess I'll keep buying adapters until I find one that lasts more than a week. I concede that I'm going to have to buy some wireless ones too at some point.



Not as cheap as wired, but I use these and think the are pretty good for £16. Although I'm often running, so find not being connected to my phone quite an advantage. 






						Bluetooth Headphones, Wireless Headphones TaoTronics: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics
					

Bluetooth Headphones, Wireless Headphones TaoTronics: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics



					www.amazon.co.uk
				






Spymaster said:


> It's not a ball ache at all. Excellent sound quality can be found in many blutooth earphones and headphones for reasonable cost now if you know what to look for and most people's USB adapters last for ever if you really insist on using old fashioned tech.



Well yes. But clearly the editor does find it so.


----------



## Badgers (Feb 9, 2020)

Portable battery packs are quite cheap these days. Useful too, charge phones, Bluetooth headsets, portable speakers and all sorts.


----------



## Artaxerxes (Feb 9, 2020)

NoXion said:


> Touchscreens are a well fucking shit interface, though. The idea that they represent inevitable technological progress rather than a deliberate decision by manufacturers is a load of nonsense.



The kindle keyboard was an absolute belter of a design and new touchscreen ones are a pile of shite.


----------



## editor (Feb 9, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Portable battery packs are quite cheap these days. Useful too, charge phones, Bluetooth headsets, portable speakers and all sorts.


The future is battery powered/adapter-laden!


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Feb 9, 2020)

editor said:


> The future is battery powered/adapter-laden!



I often find myself going away with a couple of power banks as well as chargers for my 25650 batteries in the ecigs. I'm sure it wasn't meant to be like this.


----------



## cybershot (Feb 9, 2020)

after many trials an tribulations with cheap cables I’ve learned my lesson. Just spend the money on the higher quality stuff because by the time you’ve gone through x amount of shit cables you may as will have bought the real deal.

if you’ve got a bag on you then get something like I have Which I use for my daily 2 hour commutes on trains.  Seriously adds next to nothing weight wise. Inside is AirPods (with case fully charged that’s 24 hours of usage.  defo recommend something along those lines. The cases are small and fit in your pocket easily when not in a bag. There’s plenty of anker/tt/xioami models that are affordable) an anker portable charger, usb c charger, Apple lightning cable and an Apple Watch charger)


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 9, 2020)

In my experience all minijack headphone sockets on every portable device I've owned, have without fail, failed eventually.

Resulting in many months of twisting the connection around in the socket to get a working stereo signal until I give up and upgrade. I really do not miss them.


----------



## editor (Feb 9, 2020)

So what is a decent pair of affordable Bluetooth earphones which are necklace style (I really wouldn't trust myself not to lose the ones that just stick in your ear)? I don't want any weird over the ear hooks or whatever, just something that looks like this, with Android play/stop/volume controls and a half decent battery life and a decent bass response. 







__





						Sony WI-C310 Bluetooth Wireless In-Ear Headphones with Mic/Remote
					

Buy Black Sony WI-C310 Bluetooth Wireless In-Ear Headphones with Mic/Remote from our Headphones range at John Lewis & Partners. Free Delivery on orders over £50.




					www.johnlewis.com


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Feb 9, 2020)

Yeah I've got loads of cheaper older USB cables and they always give up goast fairly quickly.

I've made a bit of an effort to pay more for USB C and they definitely last longer.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Feb 9, 2020)

editor said:


> So what is a decent pair of affordable Bluetooth earphones which are necklace style (I really wouldn't trust myself not to lose the ones that just stick in your ear)? I don't want any weird over the ear hooks or whatever, just something that looks like this, with Android play/stop/volume controls and a half decent battery life and a decent bass response.
> 
> View attachment 198103
> 
> ...



The ones I linked to come with a kit so you can change the hooks that go in the ear (not over it) or take them of completely and different sized buds. Unlikely to fall out with out them if your on public transport or walking to the pub.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 9, 2020)

Personally I couldn't have anything with a cable attaching two earbuds. It would just annoy me, and inevitably get caught on something. Nor would I have anything with one of those rubbery tipped ends which block you entire ear canal - I prefer the safety of a bit of ambient sound, and not to hear myself breathing.


----------



## editor (Feb 9, 2020)

skyscraper101 said:


> Personally I couldn't have anything with a cable attaching two earbuds. It would just annoy me, and inevitably get caught on something. Nor would I have anything with one of those rubbery tipped ends which block you entire ear canal - I prefer the safety of a bit of ambient sound, and not to hear myself breathing.


I can guarantee that I would lose on earbud fairly quickly if they weren't attached. Plus the Apple ones and the clones that are supposed to be quite good look ridiculous to my eyes.


----------



## cybershot (Feb 9, 2020)

Maybe stick to the budget brand we all adore. Pretty sure you can remove the curvey ’wings’ off them. I do mine. I use these In bed. as I know i’d break my AirPods in bed. maybe newer ones available. Plenty of other anker variants on Amazon.






						Anker Wireless Headphones, Upgraded SoundBuds Slim: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics
					

Anker Wireless Headphones, Upgraded SoundBuds Slim: Amazon.co.uk: Electronics



					www.amazon.co.uk


----------



## pesh (Feb 9, 2020)

cybershot said:


> I know i’d break my AirPods in bed.


What are you using as a pillow? An anvil?


----------



## Riklet (Feb 9, 2020)

I still have a Sony flash mp3 player. I refuse to move on...  it plays so much better music quality than my phone (which does have a 3.5mm jack still). It also has about 30 hours' battery life plus... so so good. 

I like bluetooth for external speakers but havent got into it for headphones and I am a bit cautious of it cos of potential security issues and killing battery life generally. But I dont want to be a dinosaur so I'm quite tempted to buy a pair and give em a go.


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 10, 2020)

cybershot said:


> Maybe stick to the budget brand we all adore. Pretty sure you can remove the curvey ’wings’ off them. I do mine. I use these In bed. as I know i’d break my AirPods in bed. maybe newer ones available. Plenty of other anker variants on Amazon.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The best I’ve had are Sennheiser CX6 which are awesome but cost £60. Anker Soundbuds are very good and hard to beat at £25 though. It’s important to get a good fit for bass response so you often need to muck about changing the rubber lugs to get the beat seal for your own ears.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 10, 2020)

You know the most comfortable headphones I ever had were the now sadly discontinued Sony - MDR-W08L 

I guarantee if they were to bring these babies back with added bluetooth, then they can take my cold hard cash on day one.


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 10, 2020)

Most comfortable I've had are Sennheiser MM100. They are bluetooth but also discountinued. The sound is superb too and the band goes round the back of your neck which is handy if you're wearing a hat. Only issue is that the on-ear design leaks sound, so people nearby will hear what you're listening to at louder volumes.


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 10, 2020)

We had a strange incident this weekend. Mrs Spy shouted to me and was freaking out, "there's music coming out of the router". I told her not to be daft because that's impossible and the router doesn't have speakers. "Well come and fucking listen to it then". I went to have a look. The router is on the floor by an armchair and sure enough there was music coming out of it, clear as a bell. Proper spooky stuff. I thought we were both going mad. Closer inspection revealed that a pair of bluetooth headphones had fallen down the side of the armchair, gone underneath it and not disconnected themselves from a laptop.


----------



## cybershot (Feb 12, 2020)

TaoTronics Bluetooth 5.0 wireless earphones for £11.99 delivered (using code/voucher £12 for NP) @ EU NODA CAMP fulfilled by Amazon - hotukdeals
					

If you missed the previous awesome Anker deal about the wireless sports earphones then this could be an even better one! They claim 20 hrs playtime which is mas




					www.hotukdeals.com


----------



## editor (Feb 12, 2020)

cybershot said:


> TaoTronics Bluetooth 5.0 wireless earphones for £11.99 delivered (using code/voucher £12 for NP) @ EU NODA CAMP fulfilled by Amazon - hotukdeals
> 
> 
> If you missed the previous awesome Anker deal about the wireless sports earphones then this could be an even better one! They claim 20 hrs playtime which is mas
> ...


I got to try them and wasn't so keen so got the Anker ones for £23 and they seem pretty good with a decent bass response. I also got two Huawei branded USB-C to earphone jack adapters so let's see how they get on.


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Feb 12, 2020)

cybershot said:


> TaoTronics Bluetooth 5.0 wireless earphones for £11.99 delivered (using code/voucher £12 for NP) @ EU NODA CAMP fulfilled by Amazon - hotukdeals
> 
> 
> If you missed the previous awesome Anker deal about the wireless sports earphones then this could be an even better one! They claim 20 hrs playtime which is mas
> ...



They don't do 20 hours, but they are fantastic for the price.


----------



## kabbes (Feb 12, 2020)

editor said:


> I also got two Huawei branded USB-C to earphone jack adapters so let's see how they get on.


You can only let them access 35% of your ears or they will steal your brain


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 13, 2020)

cybershot said:


> TaoTronics Bluetooth 5.0 wireless earphones for £11.99 delivered (using code/voucher £12 for NP) @ EU NODA CAMP fulfilled by Amazon - hotukdeals
> 
> 
> If you missed the previous awesome Anker deal about the wireless sports earphones then this could be an even better one! They claim 20 hrs playtime which is mas
> ...





UnderAnOpenSky said:


> They don't do 20 hours, but they are fantastic for the price.


I thought I'd check these out. They arrived today and it makes you realise just how good the Ankers are (I've got the Soundbuds Slim and some Spirit Pros). Absolutely no contest for richness of sound and bass response. 

Can't argue for twelve quid though. I'll keep them as back-ups.


----------



## editor (Feb 13, 2020)

kabbes said:


> You can only let them access 35% of your ears or they will steal your brain


Forgive me but I don't get this joke.


----------



## maomao (Feb 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Forgive me but I don't get this joke.


It's a reference to Huawei's involvement in building the UK 5g network.


----------



## editor (Feb 13, 2020)

maomao said:


> It's a reference to Huawei's involvement in building the UK 5g network.


Ah, OK. I think my USB-C adaptor will be OK though.


----------



## kabbes (Feb 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Ah, OK. I think my USB-C adaptor will be OK though.


You and Dominic Raab both.


----------



## editor (Feb 13, 2020)

kabbes said:


> You and Dominic Raab both.


Err, OK. Thanks.


----------



## kabbes (Feb 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Err, OK. Thanks.


Just don’t tell Ian Duncan-Smith or you might have a back bench revolt on your hands


----------



## editor (Feb 13, 2020)

kabbes said:


> Just don’t tell Ian Duncan-Smith or you might have a back bench revolt on your hands


This is a thread about USB-C audio, not shit jokes,


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 13, 2020)

kabbes said:


> Just don’t tell Ian Duncan-Smith or you might have a back bench revolt on your hands


Donald Trump would be "apoplectic".


----------



## King Biscuit Time (Feb 13, 2020)

All getting a bit heated in here innit. I liked the joke kabbes but also I'm cutting the editor some slack because usb-c headphones are a fucking faffy nightmare. I reckon I'm on a replacement adaptor every three weeks or so.


----------



## kabbes (Feb 13, 2020)

Oh yes, I gave up on them as soon as I got a phone without a jack.  I didn’t want to get Bluetooth headphones but once I did, I never looked back.  Now I hate to use headphones with ghastly wires.

There, srs comment for this srs bsnss.


----------



## editor (Feb 13, 2020)

King Biscuit Time said:


> All getting a bit heated in here innit. I liked the joke kabbes but also I'm cutting the editor some slack because usb-c headphones are a fucking faffy nightmare. I reckon I'm on a replacement adaptor every three weeks or so.


I'm glad it's not just me. I've gone through 3 in two months, but I've got refunds on them. Maybe the Huawei ones - which were as cheap as chips - will prove more durable.


----------



## editor (Feb 14, 2020)

So I thought I'd bag those £11 Taotonics ones as an emergency keep in my bag back up and agree that they're not bad for the price. The Anker ones have a much better sound quality but still. £11!


----------



## UnderAnOpenSky (Feb 14, 2020)

editor said:


> So I thought I'd bag those £11 Taotonics ones as an emergency keep in my bag back up and agree that they're not bad for the price. The Anker ones have a much better sound quality but still. £11!



I'm almost tempted by a second pair at the price! 

How much were the Anker ones and are they a similar design?


----------



## Spymaster (Feb 14, 2020)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> How much were the Anker ones and are they a similar design?


About £25 and almost identical in design and interface. The drivers are the difference.

If you're looking to play music (rather than video/audiobooks/phonecalls, etc.,) get the Ankers. The difference is huge. But the Tao's are perfectly acceptable as back-ups.

I'm actually not sure that you can get much better than Anker Soundbuds _for in-ear reproduction_. You can spend much more money for not much improvement in sound. A mate of mine has some Bose gigs and I don't think they're much better. Certainly not £150 better!

Next step up (apparently) is to buy those seperate buds, but I'd lose one of those within a week. It's handy to be able to whip them out of your ears and keep them round your neck occasionally which you can't do with singles. The 30cm wire between the buds, for me, is therefore a bonus rather than a hindrance and it's hardly a major inconvenience. If the single buds came first in tech, we'd be trying to find a way to keep them joined and firms would be selling 30cm cords to keep them together!


----------



## editor (Feb 14, 2020)

UnderAnOpenSky said:


> I'm almost tempted by a second pair at the price!
> 
> How much were the Anker ones and are they a similar design?


I got them for £23. They're similar but a bit smaller in design, although the controls on the Tao ones are more tactile. Sound quality wise, the Ankers are well worth the fairly minimal extra spend. The bass response is very impressive.


----------



## cybershot (Feb 24, 2020)

The silver ones are on offer for a change From it usually bring the black ones. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Soundcore-...Cancelling-Playtime-silver/dp/B07X5WB31T?th=1

wrong thread but  still revelent.


----------

