# House of Bottles



## Mosscha (Jun 20, 2013)

It looks like House of Bottles is in trouble yet again. According to trading standards, they've been using the loft above their shop as a flat, and storing smuggled tobacco there. They've also been selling single cans of cider to street drinkers.

Surely I can't  be the only person on these boards who would be pleased to see them go?

www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/A431C2B4-0A00-4B44-98F4-D64BA0B51729/0/Application_Prem486.pdf


----------



## editor (Jun 20, 2013)

What the hell has this bit of the report got to do with anything?



I like the House Of Bottles and would rather have it there than see it turned into a Lexadon high-yield flat, a Foxton's cash cow or an upmarket pop up feast venue for young foodies.


----------



## mxh (Jun 20, 2013)

editor said:


> What the hell has this bit of the report got to do with anything?


Tesco set-up, nice place for a metro.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 20, 2013)

They probably have conditions on their licence prohibiting the selling of single cans.


----------



## editor (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> They probably have conditions on their licence prohibiting the selling of single cans.


For an off-licence? Are you sure?


----------



## peterkro (Jun 20, 2013)

editor said:


> For an off-licence? Are you sure?


Yes,quite a few offies in Lambeth have notices to that effect.Not sure anyone takes any notice though.Probably condition of licence.


----------



## editor (Jun 20, 2013)

peterkro said:


> Yes,quite a few offies in Lambeth have notices to that effect.Not sure anyone takes any notice though.Probably condition of licence.


You don't want those poor people buying a can with what little they've got.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> It looks like House of Bottles is in trouble yet again. According to trading standards, they've been using the loft above their shop as a flat, and storing smuggled tobacco there. They've also been selling single cans of cider to street drinkers.
> 
> Surely I can't be the only person on these boards who would be pleased to see them go?
> 
> www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/A431C2B4-0A00-4B44-98F4-D64BA0B51729/0/Application_Prem486.pdf


Why would you be pleased to see them go?


----------



## Sirena (Jun 20, 2013)

> Why would you be pleased to see them go?


 
I wouldn't.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 20, 2013)

I hope this comes to nothing. Tony is a really lovely man. He even offered to drive me and my cat to the vets one day when our cab was late showing up. Proper lovely fella.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 20, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Why would you be pleased to see them go?


Everything I read about it makes me think that the owners are dishonest. I went in there once, and it didn't feel friendly.

I like most independent small shops, but not this one.


----------



## Belushi (Jun 20, 2013)

editor said:


> You don't want those poor people buying a can with what little they've got.


 
Apart from the money aspect I often just buy one beer, because thats all I want and if I have more sitting in the fridge I'm liable to drink them.


----------



## tufty79 (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> I went in there once, and it didn't feel friendly.
> 
> I like most independent small shops, but not this one.


i went in there lots, and it felt the opposite


----------



## Sirena (Jun 20, 2013)

I think they are a very useful shop and they fit the street.  In a world filled with multi-million frauds, a shopkeeper like that, trying to make a living, has my support.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Everything I read about it makes me think that the owners are dishonest.


 
What have you read? Apart from the thing you linked to, most of which is years old.


----------



## Kanda (Jun 20, 2013)

Judging by that rap sheet, he's fucked. 

..and probably deserves it if that's the way he runs his business.


----------



## Kanda (Jun 20, 2013)

editor said:


> What the hell has this bit of the report got to do with anything?
> 
> View attachment 33981
> 
> I like the House Of Bottles and would rather have it there than see it turned into a Lexadon high-yield flat, a Foxton's cash cow or an upmarket pop up feast venue for young foodies.


 

The rest of it is pretty damning though. Why just bring that one bit up?


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 20, 2013)

Which bits are damning in your eyes? And are any of the damning bits recent? Looks like trading standards are just adding together a lot of very old innuendo.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> I went in there once, and it didn't feel friendly.


 
You went in there once and that's enough to damn them and start this horrible thread wishing for someone to lose their livelyhood?

I've been a regular customer for a number of years and live very close to the shop. I've always found the people working in there friendly and helpful.


----------



## editor (Jun 20, 2013)

Kanda said:


> The rest of it is pretty damning though. Why just bring that one bit up?


Because that was the bit that struck me as odd. Is that OK with you?


----------



## Kanda (Jun 20, 2013)

editor said:


> Because that was the bit that struck me as odd. Is that OK with you?


 

Yeah, but the rest is pretty bad.. which for me, made me bypass the silly last paragraph...


----------



## Crispy (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Surely I can't be the only person on these boards who would be pleased to see them go?


 
I hope you are.
HoB is an institution and this stinks.

However, that report is pretty damning


----------



## colacubes (Jun 20, 2013)

Crispy said:


> I hope you are.
> HoB is an institution and this stinks.
> 
> However, that report is pretty damning


 
Chances are no one would have noticed this if the OP hadn't posted.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 20, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> You went in there once and that's enough to damn them and start this horrible thread wishing for someone to lose their livelyhood?
> 
> I've been a regular customer for a number of years and live very close to the shop. I've always found the people working in there friendly and helpful.


What are the alternatives - keep going into shops I don't really like? Only start threads about honest shopkeepers?
It was something I thought was interesting, so I started a thread. Feel free to persuade me why it's OK to have a death-trap flat above a shop. Slum landlords deserve nobody's sympathy, in my view.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> What are the alternatives - keep going into shops I don't really like? Only start threads about honest shopkeepers?
> It was something I thought was interesting, so I started a thread. Feel free to persuade me why it's OK to have a death-trap flat above a shop. Slum landlords deserve nobody's sympathy, in my view.


 
Nobody is forcing you to go in there but starting a thread wishing that a well loved member of the community loses his livelihood isn't going to go down well. What did you expect.


----------



## editor (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> What are the alternatives - keep going into shops I don't really like? Only start threads about honest shopkeepers?
> It was something I thought was interesting, so I started a thread. Feel free to persuade me why it's OK to have a death-trap flat above a shop. Slum landlords deserve nobody's sympathy, in my view.


Are you going to start a thread on every business you think is a bit dodgy? If so there's some much bigger targets sitting right on the main drag of Brixton.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 20, 2013)

editor said:


> Are you going to start a thread on every business you think is a bit dodgy? If so there's some much bigger targets sitting right on the main drag of Brixton.


Which ones?


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 20, 2013)

err try tax dodger vodaphone fir a start...

Anyway your out of order. Do us all a favour and keep your poison to yourself.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 20, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> It looks like House of Bottles is in trouble yet again. According to trading standards, they've been using the loft above their shop as a flat, and storing smuggled tobacco there. They've also been selling single cans of cider to street drinkers.
> 
> Surely I can't be the only person on these boards who would be pleased to see them go?
> 
> www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/A431C2B4-0A00-4B44-98F4-D64BA0B51729/0/Application_Prem486.pdf


 
I can't help thinking that the tone of your post has some sort of vested interest, or an attempt on your part to get a job with the daily mail.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 20, 2013)

snowy_again said:


> I can't help thinking that the tone of your post has some sort of vested interest, or an attempt on your part to get a job with the daily mail.


 
Innit.


----------



## nogojones (Jun 20, 2013)

They'll stop us being able to buy single fags soon if we don't make a stand!


----------



## Kanda (Jun 20, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Which bits are damning in your eyes? And are any of the damning bits recent? Looks like trading standards are just adding together a lot of very old innuendo.


 

Doesn't matter if things are recent. Look at licensing law, if you repeatedly offend, you're fucked. They're quite lenient.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 20, 2013)

nogojones said:


> They'll stop us being able to buy single fags soon if we don't make a stand!


 
first they came for the single can buyers....


----------



## nogojones (Jun 20, 2013)

Strips of foil next


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 20, 2013)

snowy_again said:


> I can't help thinking that the tone of your post has some sort of vested interest, or an attempt on your part to get a job with the daily mail.


It's a fair cop. I hold my hands up. You got me.

I broke in, built an illegal flat, planted smuggled tobacco just so that I could open a new Foxtons branch there, and write about it in a reactionary populist tabloid newspaper. Anybody who disagrees with you must be a selfish idiot. How right you are.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 20, 2013)

Basically you dont like house of bottles because you didnt feel the shop was friendly on your single visit to the shop. How many customers do you think HoB has in a day?  What did you want cupcakes and jazz hands?


----------



## Sirena (Jun 20, 2013)




----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 21, 2013)

Is anyone who has actually read the rap sheet interested in specifying a 'damning' offence? Come on Kanda, if you really think the guy should be ruined, why not substantiate? We all know you to be a real person who's posted here a lot. Why do you think a well liked local shopkeeper should be thrown to the wolves?

As for the Mosscha entity...hmmm...it's hidden its profile, its first post was in February. It says 'everything' it reads about House of Bottles smacks of dishonesty. But it doesn't say what it's read. Apart from a highly tendentious trading standards document, which I treat with as much suspicion as anything produced by trading standards' friends in Lambeth Licensing, which is no more truthful or efficient than any other branch of Lambeth council.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> It's a fair cop. I hold my hands up. You got me.
> 
> I broke in, built an illegal flat, planted smuggled tobacco just so that I could open a new Foxtons branch there, and write about it in a reactionary populist tabloid newspaper. Anybody who disagrees with you must be a selfish idiot. How right you are.


 
Well if you didn't selectively edit and highlight bits out of the report, it would have helped your case. The report goes back a number of years and lists some things that had been addressed, somethings which hadn't. Some things that were breaking the law, some things that weren't. It's one side of a case that no doubt has responses. 

Five packets of tobacco (provenance unknown) is hardly 'storing smuggled tobacco'. 'Building an illegal flat' - is some loft space that might have been used for some reason - security to prevent a second break in or could have been a foxtons bachelor pad that had to be accessed by dragging a ladder in the shop - a prime, central location close to transport links?  We don't know do we? You're ramping things up and I'm interested to know why.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 21, 2013)

A licensing hearing will deal with it.

Having seen this kind of partial evidence before, the committee will be able to assess its merits . Ideally.


----------



## Not a Vet (Jun 21, 2013)

Didn't we have a thread recently where someone was enquiring in the Albert what the local area was like as they were buying a flat opposite for their son/daughter? Now there's this thread, rumbled perhaps?


----------



## lighterthief (Jun 21, 2013)

nogojones said:


> They'll stop us being able to buy single fags soon if we don't make a stand!


...and a match.

Used to be an ice cream van sat right outside our (relatively posh) school gates selling single Regal King Size for 10p.
/nostalgia


----------



## RaverDrew (Jun 21, 2013)

editor said:


>


 
This "man" seems awfully familiar to me


----------



## RaverDrew (Jun 21, 2013)

On a serious note though, Tony is an absolute gent, an asset to the community, and imo has been deliberately targeted by police and licensing with an agenda.


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

RaverDrew said:


> On a serious note though, Tony is an absolute gent, an asset to the community, and imo has been deliberately targeted by police and licensing with an agenda.


 
I had a good chat with him tonight. He's aware of this thread and appreciative of the support.


----------



## gabi (Jun 21, 2013)

Tony's an amazing shopkeeper. The shit he must have to deal with, not just from unruly punters but also cowardly undercover coppers. He's always patient and polite with everyone. Fuck this.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

RaverDrew said:


> On a serious note though, Tony is an absolute gent, an asset to the community, and imo has been deliberately targeted by police and licensing with an agenda.


Why? Why would the police, licensing and trading standards all decide to target a shopkeeper for no reason? It seems much more likely that he breaks the law to make a few extra pounds.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

gabi said:


> Tony's an amazing shopkeeper. The shit he must have to deal with, not just from unruly punters but also cowardly undercover coppers. He's always patient and polite with everyone. Fuck this.


I don't know much about police work, but cowardly seems the wrong adjective.


----------



## gabi (Jun 21, 2013)

They are cowards. I remember sitting out the front of the Albert the first time he got busted. Called over a passing copper and discussed what was going on. He told me they sent in plain clothes cops to buy drugs from outside the shop just to get the CCTV pictures. Cowardly. I've seen Tony throw munted people out of his shop before, hes not in on the 'trade'.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

gabi said:


> They are cowards. I remember sitting out the front of the Albert the first time he got busted. Called over a passing copper and discussed what was going on. He told me they sent in plain clothes cops to buy drugs from outside the shop just to get the CCTV pictures. Cowardly. I've seen Tony throw munted people out of his shop before, hes not in on the 'trade'.


What you describe doesn't sound cowardly to me. It sounds like what I'd expect the police to be doing. It would be cowardly to turn a blind eye to a slum landlord selling smuggled tobacco.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha this is nasty shit you're posting here. Would you say it to Tony's face?

He reads these boards, y'know.

Tony is great, as are his staff. He's had to deal with loads of shit, he's been really patient, he's a trooper, he even had his shop focibly closed down for over a month after the CHL raids, even though it was nothing to do with him.

He's been targeted unfairly by Lambeth and the police. Imo it's because they don't like some of the 'rough & ready' characters that hang around outside the shop, but to me that's part of Brixton.


----------



## gabi (Jun 21, 2013)

oh dear

edit: in response to mosscha


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jun 21, 2013)

The single can stuff is fairly recent I think. The new Costcutter near me (opened about a year ago) is not allowed to sell single cans - part of its licence. I was in the newsagents next door to House of Bottles (formerly Patels, which now sells alcohol) one morning a month or so ago and a punter was having a massive row about not being able to buy a single can. The guy behind the counter said they had recently been told by the council they can't sell single cans. It's bullshit if you ask me.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/A431C2B4-0A00-4B44-98F4-D64BA0B51729/0/Application_Prem486.pdf


Fucks sake, most of those 'incidents' are over 6 years old!


----------



## Tankus (Jun 21, 2013)

I buy singles to deliberately ration my intake......... (Type II)..........I don't keep alcohol in the house anymore .....other than a single rare treat.. Capped at 2 per week max....... 

heh....bad enough that I can't even drink it in the park

" I ask that the licence be revoked"

So much bloody vehemence in that , over someone's choice of purchase


----------



## 19sixtysix (Jun 21, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Fucks sake, most of those 'incidents' are over 6 years old!


 
Sound like he needs a good barrister for the hearing. Much of police evidence is easily demolished and ruled inadmissible if you have someone who knows the law. That's why the rich have lawyers.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

19sixtysix said:


> Sound like he needs a good barrister for the hearing. Much of police evidence is easily demolished and ruled inadmissible if you have someone who knows the law. That's why the rich have lawyers.



Would tony have the money for that sort of thing?  If not, I for one would be willing to put some cash forward to help fund it. I suspect I wouldn't be the only one.


----------



## Crispy (Jun 21, 2013)

Ditto. Tell me who to make the cheque out to


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

I'm not a regular user of this shop by any means but on the few occasions I I have used
It, normally buying cigs during or after a visit to the pub next door I have not found the shop
intimidating or unfriendly, in fact I have noticed the shopkeeper is quite firm with people
who appear to have taken too much drink. The single can issue is a nasty example of judgemental 
Thinking, why shouldn't someone buy a single can to drink on the street, isn't this saying someone is 
guilty of anti social behaviour before they actually do it ?


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

Tankus said:


> I buy singles to deliberately ration my intake......... (Type II)..........I don't keep alcohol in the house anymore .....other than a single rare treat.. Capped at 2 per week max.......
> 
> heh....bad enough that I can't even drink it in the park
> 
> ...


 
We can't all just ignore laws that we don't agree with.


----------



## ajdown (Jun 21, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> Thinking, why shouldn't someone buy a single can to drink on the street, isn't this saying someone is guilty of anti social behaviour before they actually do it ?


 
The centre of Brixton is a no street drinking zone, yes?


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

A





ajdown said:


> The centre of Brixton is a no street drinking zone, yes?


Apparently, although you can sit in windrush square and drink alcohol if you pay a premium to sit outside the ritzy.


----------



## nogojones (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> We can't all just ignore laws that we don't agree with.


 

I do. I just try not to get caught doing it.


----------



## Belushi (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> We can't all just ignore laws that we don't agree with.


 
Yeah we can, I've been doing it for years.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

ajdown said:


> The centre of Brixton is a no street drinking zone, yes?


The whole Borough is.

www.lambeth.gov.uk/Services/CommunityLiving/CrimePrevention/KeepingLambethSafe/ControlledDrinkingZones.htm


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> A
> Apparently, although you can sit in windrush square and drink alcohol if you pay a premium to sit outside the ritzy.


You can drink alcohol in Windrush square, just so long as you don't act like a dick. People do it all the time.


----------



## RaverDrew (Jun 21, 2013)

You can drink alcohol on Coldharbour Lane, just so long as you don't act like a dick. People do it all the time.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> You can drink alcohol in Windrush square, just so long as you don't act like a dick. People do it all the time.


I was just responding to the other posters comment about street drinking 


Mosscha said:


> The whole Borough is.


This underlines my point, in my case I wil take a stroll to the off license of an evening
And buy two bottles of Heineken, one I will drink on my way back to the house, the other I will have later
Where is the crime ? Unfortunately some of the newer demographic seem to be of the opinion
that the bottle in my hand is the mark of someone to be wary of going by the look on their faces
And here in a nutshell is the problem because like it or not this isn't the home counties and circumstances mean a g and t on the patio is not always an option.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> I was just responding to the other posters comment about street drinking
> 
> This underlines my point, in my case I wil take a stroll to the off license of an evening
> And buy two bottles of Heineken, one I will drink on my way back to the house, the other I will have later
> ...


You see . . . to me this sounds like you have an alcohol problem.


----------



## Dan U (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> You see . . . to me this sounds like you have an alcohol problem.


 

are you deliberately being a twat?


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

Dan U said:


> are you deliberately being a twat?


No, it's just that I've never in my life thought that it might be a good idea to stroll down the street drinking alcohol. The only people I've ever seen doing that seem to have problems.


----------



## pissflaps (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> No, it's just that I've never in my life thought that it might be a good idea to stroll down the street drinking alcohol. The only people I've ever seen doing that seem to have problems.


 
wac.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Everything I read about it makes me think that the owners are dishonest. I went in there once, and it didn't feel friendly.
> 
> I like most independent small shops, but not this one.


 

I went in there once and it was just like any other offie the land over- what were you expecting


----------



## Crispy (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> No, it's just that I've never in my life thought that it might be a good idea to stroll down the street drinking alcohol. The only people I've ever seen doing that seem to have problems.


I invite you to watch me do it some time. AFAIK, I am problem free.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> You see . . . to me this sounds like you have an alcohol problem.


.... Because I enjoy one Heineken cold straight from the shops fridge at the end of the days toils lmao 

E2a .....don't panic  I do not entertain thoughts of having it away with every iPhone I pass to pay for my next drink while I do this.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> No, it's just that I've never in my life thought that it might be a good idea to stroll down the street drinking alcohol. The only people I've ever seen doing that seem to have problems.


 

oh do me a favour


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> No, it's just that I've never in my life thought that it might be a good idea to stroll down the street drinking alcohol. The only people I've ever seen doing that seem to have problems.


 
Good logic. Drinking in the street is a sign of drinking problems because people who drink in the street have drinking problems.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> .... Because I enjoy one Heineken cold straight from the shops fridge at the end of the days toils lmao
> 
> E2a .....don't panic I do not entertain thoughts of having it away with every iPhone I pass to pay for my next drink while I do this.


It's beer not ice-cream. You can wait ten minutes.

I'm not worried that you'll steel my mobile phone, I'm worried that you'll bump into me. Drunk people do, and it annoys me. Maybe Crispy is different.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Good logic. Drinking in the street is a sign of drinking problems because people who drink in the street have drinking problems.


You don't seem to know what logic means. I'm stating a view not a position of logic.


----------



## pissflaps (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> It's beer not ice-cream. You can wait ten minutes.
> 
> I'm not worried that you'll steel my mobile phone, I'm worried that you'll bump into me. Drunk people do, and it annoys me. Maybe Crispy is different.


 
hows about you shit off back to the home counties you curtain twitching busy body.


----------



## Crispy (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> I'm worried that you'll bump into me. Drunk people do, and it annoys me. Maybe Crispy is different.


Yes, I'm a special person who can walk in a straight line after half a can of lager.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

pissflaps said:


> hows about you shit off back to the home counties you curtain twitching busy body.


How about you stop making lazy prejudiced assumptions.


----------



## Crispy (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> How about you stop making lazy prejudiced assumptions.


Hah!


----------



## DotCommunist (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> How about you stop making lazy prejudiced assumptions.


 

He said with a straight face


----------



## pissflaps (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> How about you stop making lazy prejudiced assumptions.


 
what? like all people walking down the road with a tinny are raging alcoholics? you're out of your fucking depth, sunshine.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

pissflaps said:


> what? like all people walking down the road with a tinny are raging alcoholics? you're out of your fucking depth, sunshine.


That's not what I said at all.


----------



## pissflaps (Jun 21, 2013)




----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> We can't all just ignore laws that we don't agree with.


 


Mosscha said:


> You can drink alcohol in Windrush square, just so long as you don't act like a dick. People do it all the time.


 
So is it ok to break the law or not? Or is it only ok for people to break the law if people behave the way you want them to?

Your either an idiot or a troll.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> So is it ok to break the law or not? Or is it only ok for people to break the law if people behave the way you want them to?
> 
> Your either an idiot or a troll.



...... Or drunk


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha is just sad Tony wont serve him anymore and he has to go to D instead


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> Mosscha is just sad Tony wont serve him anymore and he has to go to D instead


(((( mosscha)))) ....... Give me a tenner and I'll ship some cans in.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> So is it ok to break the law or not? Or is it only ok for people to break the law if people behave the way you want them to?
> 
> Your either an idiot or a troll.


I don't know what you're talking about.

And it's you're not your. And you called me an idiot.


----------



## pissflaps (Jun 21, 2013)

got you there. thread's over.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> I don't know what you're talking about.
> 
> And it's you're not your. And you called me an idiot.


 
Read your own posts, I quoted them for you so it's not hard.

TBH I was being polite when I called you an idiot, I think fuckwit is more fitting. I'll add pedant to the list as well. WELL DONE


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> He's been targeted unfairly by Lambeth and the police. Imo it's because they don't like some of the 'rough & ready' characters that hang around outside the shop, but to me that's part of Brixton.


Not for much longer if this kind of shit continues.


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> We can't all just ignore laws that we don't agree with.


You've never ever broken even the tiniest law then?


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

ajdown said:


> The centre of Brixton is a no street drinking zone, yes?


 
Not sure how far it extends, but it's got fuck all to do with Tony if a customer decides to ignore that restriction. I wonder if they follow people out of Sainsburys and Tesco looking to see if - gasp! - they open the can they've just bought too?


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> The whole Borough is.
> 
> www.lambeth.gov.uk/Services/CommunityLiving/CrimePrevention/KeepingLambethSafe/ControlledDrinkingZones.htm


From that link:


> However a CDZ is not a ban and does not make drinking alcohol in public an offence.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

editor said:


> You've never ever broken even the tiniest law then?


Yeah, I rent out a death trap flat, I smuggle tobacco and alcohol, and I sell chinese porn from the back of my shop.


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Yeah, I rent out a death trap flat, I smuggle tobacco and alcohol, and I sell chinese porn from the back of my shop.


 
*police notified. This kind of criminality must be banished from Coldharbour Lane!

PS got any free samples of the porn?


----------



## ajdown (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> No, it's just that I've never in my life thought that it might be a good idea to stroll down the street drinking alcohol. The only people I've ever seen doing that seem to have problems.


 
Whilst I don't drink alcohol myself (by choice), and I'm not really a fan of "street drinking", I'm not sure what the difference is of someone drinking a can of lager walking along the street v drinking a bottle of Ribena, as long as they're not acting like a twunt, being antisocial and pissing in people's doorways.


----------



## pissflaps (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Yeah, I rent out a death trap flat, I smuggle tobacco and alcohol, and I sell chinese porn from the back of my shop.


 
chinese porn? would it offend you less if it was quality euro-grot?

you really are an irredeemable cunt.


----------



## el-ahrairah (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> LOOK AT ME EVERYBODY!  HEY!  EVERYBODY!  YOU'RE ALL BIG SMELLY POOS!  LOOK AT ME!  OVER HERE!


 
piss off back to your village, no mark.


----------



## Ms Ordinary (Jun 21, 2013)

ajdown said:


> Whilst I don't drink alcohol myself (by choice), and I'm not really a fan of "street drinking", I'm not sure what the difference is of someone drinking a can of lager walking along the street v drinking a bottle of Ribena, *as long as they're not acting like a twunt, being antisocial and pissing in people's doorways*.


 
There has been a noticeable increase in this (general twuntery, street pissing & puddles of vomit) lately, as it happens. Pretty certain it's *not* down to people buying single cans from House of Bottles though.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Ms Ordinary said:


> There has been a noticeable increase in this (general twuntery, street pissing & puddles of vomit) lately, as it happens. Pretty certain it's *not* down to people buying single cans from House of Bottles though.


 
The twunts seem to prefer the house across the road


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

Ms Ordinary said:


> There has been a noticeable increase in this (general twuntery, street pissing & puddles of vomit) lately, as it happens. Pretty certain it's *not* down to people buying single cans from House of Bottles though.


Many of the nu-drinkers to be seen staggering around the streets at night have usually arrived in town _pre-loaded,_ and then continue to top up the alcohol in the bar/club of their choice. I don't seem them all queuing up in Tony's shop ready to buy a single can of K and then hang around on the streets all night.


----------



## Sirena (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Yeah, I rent out a death trap flat, I smuggle tobacco and alcohol, and I sell chinese porn from the back of my shop.


 
tbf I don't think there was any suggestion that the 'flat' was being used or rented, except maybe occasionally by the owner himself.  The padlock and the need for a ladder would seem to argue against that.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

Sirena said:


> tbf I don't think there was any suggestion that the 'flat' was being used or rented, except maybe occasionally by the owner himself. The padlock and the need for a ladder would seem to argue against that.


There was. See page 4. He claimed a friend had been living there and was either getting housing benefit or paying council tax.

Even less ethical than Foxtons, I'd say.


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Even less ethical than Foxtons, I'd say.


You appear to be losing all sense of perspective and common sense.


----------



## TruXta (Jun 21, 2013)

Trollolo!


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

TruXta said:


> I have different point of view to the OP


 
There. Fixed that for you.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 21, 2013)

You know you're in trouble when you're making ajdown look like the voice of reason.


----------



## TruXta (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> There. Fixed that for you.


No, you're a bit of a cunt, and your so-called POV is simply prejudice, ignorance and pettyminded bigotry.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

TruXta said:


> No, you're a bit of a cunt, and your so-called POV is simply prejudice, ignorance and pettyminded bigotry.


My point of view is based on the legal documentation provided by a trading standards officer.


----------



## TruXta (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> My point of view is based on the legal documentation provided by a trading standards officer.


Is your perception of people having a can on the street also based on the legal documentation provided by a trading standards officer, or is that simply due to being a thick cunt?


----------



## Shippou-Sensei (Jun 21, 2013)

i love how one of the problems is selling people too little alcohol.

it's not about the drinking it's about being poor and drinking.


----------



## shygirl (Jun 21, 2013)

They seem to have had it in for Tony since he won that battle against closure a few years ago. I always wondered why, when there was all manner of dodgy things being done by shop proprietors not too far away from HoB. Based on what Mosscha expresses here about alleged wrong-doings by Tony, he must have a hard time dealing with all the corruption and lies we hear about daily in our media. Has he started threads about lying, robbing politicians yet? Nah, didn't think so. Methinks this man has a very nasty little agenda, and is probably part of a campaign to sully Tony's good name.

FUCK OFF


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)

TruXta said:


> Is your perception of people having a can on the street also based on the legal documentation provided by a trading standards officer, or is that simply due to being a thick cunt?


It's based on my lifetime experience of never having had the urge for alcohol so badly that I've wanted to drink it whilst walking somewhere. I feel the same about eating food and making mobile telephone calls, to be honest.

I can't believe that what I think about these small issues in life are so important to you.


----------



## Tankus (Jun 21, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> .... Because I enjoy one Heineken cold straight from the shops fridge at the end of the days toils lmao
> 
> E2a .....don't panic I do not entertain thoughts of having it away with every iPhone I pass to pay for my next drink while I do this.





Mosscha said:


> You see . . . to me this sounds like you have an alcohol problem.


 
Highly unlikely if cuppas beer of choice is heinekin....don't cha think?


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 21, 2013)

Shippou-Sensei said:


> i love how one of the problems is selling people too little alcohol.
> 
> it's not about the drinking it's about being poor and drinking.



Because everybody knows poor people are more likely to cause trouble when they've had a couple

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...t-as-big-as-la-tomatina-in-spain-8648654.html


----------



## Shippou-Sensei (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> It's based on my lifetime experience of never having had the urge for alcohol so badly that I've wanted to drink it whilst walking somewhere. I feel the same about eating food and making mobile telephone calls, to be honest.
> 
> I can't believe that what I think about these small issues in life are so important to you.


 
liberty is not a small issue.  being told what you can and can't do is not a small issue


----------



## TruXta (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> It's based on my lifetime experience of never having had the urge for alcohol so badly that I've wanted to drink it whilst walking somewhere. I feel the same about eating food and making mobile telephone calls, to be honest.
> 
> I can't believe that what I think about these small issues in life are so important to you.


They were clearly important enough for you to choose to come here and spout your ill-informed shit in a public forum.


----------



## Mosscha (Jun 21, 2013)




----------



## Badgers (Jun 21, 2013)

I like Tony. He is pleasant and has a battle to keep some of the more lively locals in order. These claims are pretty flaky and sad.


----------



## Shippou-Sensei (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


>




well he's fine

he got two


----------



## lefteri (Jun 21, 2013)

the trolling on this thread is pathetic - HoB is a good off license running a tricky business to pull off in the centre of brixton - I've always found it to be friendly and it has a decent selection.  Most small offies sell 'smuggled' beers don't they?  That's how they keep the prices lower than the supermarkets.  The license restriction to only sell in packs of 4 is ridiculous, why should the council encourage us to drink more when we only want one can?  And as for renting out the flat, isn't it time the council cracked down on people who sublet their council flat and fuck off to india for the winter?  There's plenty of people doing that around here


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

I've just been in to speak to Tony. He's really pleased that there are so many people behind him. I've asked him to let us know how we can support him and mentioned the offer of a whip towards legal fees, if needed.

As part of my conversation with Tony he let me know that there's *no condition on his license prohibiting him from selling single cans of alcohol.*


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 21, 2013)

I've been digging in the council minutes, looking at House of Bottles' dealings with Lambeth Licensing. Hence the huge paste below from a hearing last December - fascinating reading.

This whole thing seems to me to be part of the Council/Police anti-begging agenda. Some beggars, as soon as they have £2, go and buy a single can. So Lambeth no longer gives out an off-sales licence without a 4 can minimum (and a ban on miniatures). The problem is, what to do about existing off-sales licences which don't have those conditions? They don't have the power to just slap on the conditions willy nilly, that would be illegal and would be overturned by a magistrate. So at licensing hearings the councillors and Trading Standards and Police all get together to lean on the licensee with all manner of spurious nonsense. In this case they tried to smear House of Bottles all over again with the drug dealing stuff from 2009, even though there's been no street dealing near House of Bottles for the last four fucking years.  The message is "we don't like single cans and if you don't want endless grief from us, do what we want." Other long established offies in Brixton have knuckled under and accepted the conditions. But House of Bottles hasn't - they argued they should keep selling singles at December's hearing, at which they applied to sell alcohol after 11 pm. Application denied. 

I've highlighted the bit below about the Afro-Caribbean community wanting to buy single cans to drink in the street. It reminds me of something Blacker Dread told me - he was asked to give the Police some cultural training years ago, when the cops used to regard two or three black males talking on the street as 'suspicious' and 'threatening'. He explained that to Afro-Caribbeans the street is just a meeting place, much like your sitting room. So it seems to me that there's a community need for single can sales. If you want one or two cold beers with your mates, you don't want to buy four at a time. By the time you've finished the first one the other three will be too warm. It's great to pop back to the offy ten yards away for another. Especially if your fridge is at home in Tulse Hill or Croydon, because you can't afford to live in Brixton any more.

Note: street drinking is *not* prohibited in the Lambeth Controlled Drinking Zone. You have to behave, and if you don't a PCSO can pour your booze down the drain. That's it. http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/Services/...eepingLambethSafe/ControlledDrinkingZones.htm

As for the alcoholic beggars who the council want to disappear, how does a four can minimum help them with their addiction? And if the council win and there's nowhere left in Brixton to buy a single can, it will make fuck all difference, it won't make these guys stop drinking, they'll just find the money for four cans somehow.



> *Presentation by the Applicant*​​The applicant’s representative and Mr Anthony Olakunle Fabusina, proprietor were in attendance.​​On opening his presentation, the applicant’s representative explained that Mr Fabusina had not been given sufficient notice of the hearing (8 days instead of 10). Therefore, Mr Fabusina only had limited time to obtain a solicitor. The council also failed to inform Mr Fabusina that Trading Standards had made a representation and he had only obtained this information from the council’s website. ​​The applicant’s representative also queried why the representations pack was not available to the public, as the public had not been given a chance to look at representations submitted by the Police and Trading Standards.​​The Legal Advisor confirmed that representations were not usually disseminated or available on the council’s website. However, agenda packs were sent out to all parties, including persons who had made representations, and were available at the meeting.​​The Chair asked the applicant’s representative whether he wanted to apply for an adjournment but this suggestion was refused.​​The applicant’s representative informed the Sub Committee that:​​
> When the applicant’s shop was closed between 23:00 – 03:00 it was an invitation for street dealers to use the space. However, when the premises were open no street dealing occurred
> Conditions had been placed on Mr Fabusina’s licence that he must prevent drug dealers from entering the premises and he had been provided with photographs of these dealers. When Mr Fabusina had produced the photographs to dealers, he had been threatened, but as a result, they had relocated somewhere else
> He was in receipt of several letters from shop owners that supported the opinion that street dealing around the premises no longer occurred. Therefore, he felt the representations submitted by the Police and Trading Standards were three years out of date
> ...


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 21, 2013)

> In response to questions from Members, the applicant’s representative and Mr Fabusina confirmed that:
> 
> Regarding the incident on 8 September 2012 that resulted in a breach of Mr Fabusina’slicence, (namely the sale of alcohol outside the hours permitted by his premises licence) the applicant’s representative explained that 40% of Mr Fabusina’s products were not alcoholic. In referring to the police’s representation, the applicant’s representative did not believe that the PC Bowles actually saw what products came out of the shop, as they were in bags.
> 
> ...


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 21, 2013)

> Adjournment and Decision
> 
> At 9.00 pm the Sub-Committee withdrew from the meeting together with the legal advisor and clerk to deliberate in private.
> 
> ...


----------



## Crispy (Jun 21, 2013)

*applause*


----------



## Badgers (Jun 21, 2013)

I get the impression that a certain brewery would like the space to expand a certain pub. Doubt that would have any influence on the council but I get a bit paranoid about Lambeth and the growth of big businesses currently going on.


----------



## Crispy (Jun 21, 2013)

Badgers said:


> I get the impression that a certain brewery would like the space to expand a certain pub. Doubt that would have any influence on the council but I get a bit paranoid about Lambeth and the growth of big businesses currently going on.


God. Which side would urban take in such a scenario?!


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Crispy said:


> God. Which side would urban take in such a scenario?!


 
I think you know the answer to that


----------



## Badgers (Jun 21, 2013)

Crispy said:
			
		

> God. Which side would urban take in such a scenario?!



Tricky eh? 

Sad thing for Tony is he has another offy next door to him and almost certainly a Tesco opposite him which will sell booze too  

I hope his business stays. He has been here a long time. The area around him has lots of investment going into what with the new flats and the hotel on its way too.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Anyway looks like that Mosscha scum has done as it's told and toddled off *pats troll on the head*


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

I knew you wouldn't be able to resist, troll.


----------



## shygirl (Jun 21, 2013)

Badgers said:


> I get the impression that a certain brewery would like the space to expand a certain pub. Doubt that would have any influence on the council but I get a bit paranoid about Lambeth and the growth of big businesses currently going on.


 
I had suggested this last time he was facing closure, but was told off for being libellous.


----------



## shygirl (Jun 21, 2013)

Rachel Heywood was, I think, quite supportive of HoB when the police were trying to close it.  Might be worth us emailing her about it.

Btw, I've asked before (on here and in Lambeth Community Police Consultative Group), since when are the police asking business people to police the streets for them?  Why the fucking fuck should Tony have to get rid of dealers from outside his shop?  Was KFC asked to do similarly when they used to hang outside, ditto William Hill on Acre Lane, and all the other shops on Coldharbour Lane?  I doubt it very much.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> We can't all just ignore laws that we don't agree with.


 
True. After all, we're not all politicians.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> I was just responding to the other posters comment about street drinking
> 
> This underlines my point, in my case I wil take a stroll to the off license of an evening
> And buy two bottles of Heineken, one I will drink on my way back to the house, the other I will have later
> ...


 

It's such a fucking ridiculous attitude, too. Check out any German town or city come the end of the working day, you'll see loads of people pouring (pardon the pun!) into the the local newsagent or bottle shop (yes, newsagents often sell beer alongside the Pepsi and Fanta in the drinks fridge!), opening the bottle with the convenient bottle-opener on the counter or wall, and then merrily strolling to the bus stop, S-Bahn or U-Bahn station while supping their cold one.
Do they have mardy fuckers whining about it? No they don't, because having a beer after work, even while on the way back from work or the shops, is seen as totally normal behaviour!


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> You see . . . to me this sounds like you have an alcohol problem.


 
Judgemental, aren't you?
You know what an *actual* alcohol problem is? It's when you can't function without drink and/or obsess about it enough that it affects your life and others.
Now stop talking shit, and maybe you'll stop sounding like a cunt.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 21, 2013)

A new resident of Carlton Clifton Mansions complained to Tony the other day about the noise being made by J****, a high profile street drinker known to many of us. Two days later Tony was told by Lambeth Licensing that an official complaint had been made to them, about someone being rowdy/drunk in front of his shop. He is 99% sure that the complainants are one and the same person.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

DotCommunist said:


> oh do me a favour


 
I'm wondering how old Mosscha is, 'cos back in the '70s and early '80s it was perfectly normal to see people supping in public. It was only with the advent of blaming booze for every social ill from footie hooliganism to domestic abuse that central government started handing down _diktat_, and then when "binge-drinking" became an issue, the stupidly-draconian "no-public-drinking" laws came in. Have they solved any of the issues blamed on public drinking? Have they buggery!


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> You don't seem to know what logic means. I'm stating a view not a position of logic.


 
It would normally be supposed, however fart-like a poster's maunderings, that they contained an internal logic.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

lefteri said:


> the trolling on this thread is pathetic - HoB is a good off license running a tricky business to pull off in the centre of brixton - I've always found it to be friendly and it has a decent selection. Most small offies sell 'smuggled' beers don't they? That's how they keep the prices lower than the supermarkets. The license restriction to only sell in packs of 4 is ridiculous, why should the council encourage us to drink more when we only want one can? And as for renting out the flat, isn't it time the council cracked down on people who sublet their council flat and fuck off to india for the winter? There's plenty of people doing that around here


 
Just been trying to find out more about this single can thing, but all I've been able to find is about retailers *splitting* packs, which means if they're buying cases of 24 single cans, then selling singles is perfectly permissible.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 21, 2013)

ViolentPanda said:


> I'm wondering how old Mosscha is, 'cos back in the '70s and early '80s it was perfectly normal to see people supping in public. It was only with the advent of blaming booze for every social ill from footie hooliganism to domestic abuse that central government started handing down _diktat_, and then when "binge-drinking" became an issue, the stupidly-draconian "no-public-drinking" laws came in. Have they solved any of the issues blamed on public drinking? Have they buggery!


 
Some people are taught by their parents that drinking on the pavement, even in front a pub, is scandalous, only something for yobbos, the great unwashed.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 21, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Some people are taught by their parents that drinking on the pavement ... is something for yobbos, the great unwashed.


 

I got ticked off the other day by my wife for doing exactly this.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Some people are taught by their parents that drinking on the pavement, even in front a pub, is scandalous, only something for yobbos, the great unwashed.


 
Although I suspect it's fine if you're in a park, drinking chilled wine.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 21, 2013)

ViolentPanda said:


> Just been trying to find out more about this single can thing, but all I've been able to find is about retailers *splitting* packs, which means if they're buying cases of 24 single cans, then selling singles is perfectly permissible.


Let us know what you find out! I've been looking into the duty question. It seems that suppliers to the drinks trade can, and do, sell products which are not packaged for the UK market, hence do not have the duty stamp preprinted on the cap. It's legal so long as the supplier pays the duty. The supplier can provide the retailer with a sticker for each bottle to say that the duty has been paid. I don't know if it's illegal for the sticker not to be present when the retailer puts the goods on the shelf. The retailer must show receipts for the goods to Trading Standards if asked. The receipt should state that duty has been paid. TS can of course follow the trail to the supplier and find out whether duty was paid.

It seems that in this case, judging from the rap sheet, TS saw some foreign market bottles with no UK duty stickers on them. They asked for receipts but receipts were not provided. Perhaps they're not kept to hand in the shop. There's nothing on the rap sheet about Tony being given x days to come up with them and failing to do so. Wouldn't there be a grace period before proceedings are taken? It seems a bit strong to say 'you didn't give us the receipts when we made a surprise visit, so your licence should be revoked.'

eta: There's nothing suspicious about selling booze not packaged for the UK market. One of Tony's USPs is that he will source obscure foreign stuff which you'll never see at Tesco. All part of his excellent service. Some of his customers insist on non-UK market stuff. (I think Nigerian Guinness is quite different from English or Irish Guinness?)


----------



## leanderman (Jun 21, 2013)

ViolentPanda said:


> Although I suspect it's fine if you're in a park, drinking chilled wine.


 

especially in the new Brockwell Park playground. Chilling is always an issue though


----------



## lefteri (Jun 21, 2013)

ViolentPanda said:


> Just been trying to find out more about this single can thing, but all I've been able to find is about retailers *splitting* packs, which means if they're buying cases of 24 single cans, then selling singles is perfectly permissible.


 
that new offie on the high street opposite the tube is only allowed to sell beers in 4s or was when I last went in there, I thought it very odd at the time


----------



## el-ahrairah (Jun 21, 2013)

Crispy said:


> *applause*


 
*agreed*


----------



## Corax (Jun 21, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> It's beer not ice-cream. You can wait ten minutes.


Hi.  Only read the first couple of pages so far, but just wanted to stop by quickly to call you a dick. x


----------



## Corax (Jun 21, 2013)

Am I being a bit tin-foil hatty by smelling "reputation management" or "online leverage" or other such commercial snake-oil bullshit about Mosscha's posting?


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Following on from ViolentPanda 's post re german offies. Some of them have tables and benches outside for people to sit and enjoy their beers. Some of the offies even played music for you an all.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

Corax said:


> Am I being a bit tin-foil hatty by smelling "reputation management" or "online leverage" or other such commercial snake-oil bullshit about Mosscha's posting?


 
Perhaps. But to be fair, you were spot-on with the "dick" comment.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 21, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> Following on from ViolentPanda 's post re german offies. Some of them have tables and benches outside for people to sit and enjoy their beers. Some of the offies even played music for you an all.


 
Yup.
I hate to be all Euro-luvvy, but sometimes the continental European states have so much more sensible laws and attitudes to drink than we do.


----------



## Winot (Jun 21, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> Following on from ViolentPanda 's post re german offies. Some of them have tables and benches outside for people to sit and enjoy their beers. Some of the offies even played music for you an all.



You can do that outside Market Row wines on a Friday and Saturday night. He even provides glasses.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Winot said:


> You can do that outside Market Row wines on a Friday and Saturday night. He even provides glasses.



There's no techno tho. Plus German offies don't charge corkage


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 21, 2013)

Also those people who drink there look like utter wankers. Nice wines tho.


----------



## 8ball (Jun 21, 2013)

editor said:


> I like the House Of Bottles and would rather have it there than see it turned into a Lexadon high-yield flat...


 
This is the first time I've seen the term 'high-yield flat'.

Not edifying.


----------



## editor (Jun 21, 2013)

Loads of cops piled into Tony's earlier apparently chasing someone for the heinous crime of smoking weed.


----------



## quimcunx (Jun 21, 2013)

Perhaps there is scope for an FOI request on communications within the council about HoB?


----------



## shygirl (Jun 21, 2013)

editor said:


> Loads of cops piled into Tony's earlier apparently chasing someone for the heinous crime of smoking weed.


 
They're really trying to stitch him up, aren't they?  We need to let the police and the council know that we know what they're up to.  It didn't work last time, hopefully it won't this time. 



quimcunx said:


> Perhaps there is scope for an FOI request on communications within the council about HoB?


 
I like this suggestion, but have no idea as to the answer.


----------



## 8ball (Jun 21, 2013)

shygirl said:


> They're really trying to stitch him up, aren't they? We need to let the police and the council know that we know what they're up to. It didn't work last time, hopefully it won't this time.


 
The cynical part of me thinks the council are very likely well aware of what is going on.


----------



## Corax (Jun 21, 2013)

editor said:


> Loads of cops piled into Tony's earlier apparently chasing someone for the heinous crime of smoking weed.


 
Are Tesco's after the site or something?  

Yeah, I know, tin-foil hattery...


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 22, 2013)

quimcunx said:


> Perhaps there is scope for an FOI request on communications within the council about HoB?


You can find out the published stuff by reading all the attachments to minutes of the licensing sub-committee meetings at which HoB has been on the agenda. That gives a few clues as to what else to ask questions about. I reckon there must be some emails and memos between councillors/the licensing dept/the police licensing unit/Trading Standards/the fire brigade/the border agency. That's not even the complete list of people who have been organised to put pressure on. It must be horrible to be on the receiving end.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 22, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> It must be horrible to be on the receiving end.


 I really feel for Tony. It seems like he's being harassed


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 22, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> A new resident of Carlton Mansions complained to Tony the other day about the noise being made by J****, a high profile street drinker known to many of us. Two days later Tony was told by Lambeth Licensing that an official complaint had been made to them, about someone being rowdy/drunk in front of his shop. He is 99% sure that the complainants are one and the same person.


 
Did you mean Clifton Mansions?


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 22, 2013)

Yes, oops!


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 22, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> I'm not a regular user of this shop by any means but on the few occasions I I have used
> It, normally buying cigs during or after a visit to the pub next door I have not found the shop
> intimidating or unfriendly, in fact I have noticed the shopkeeper is quite firm with people
> who appear to have taken too much drink. The single can issue is a nasty example of judgemental
> ...


 
I have found it to be the same.

I do not find the street drinkers around Brixton to be a problem.

There are several I occasionally chat to. These are often people who have problems and drinking is one of the few ways they have to socialise.

Drinking in pubs is now way to expensive. Years ago a lot of these guys would have been able to use a local pub.

Its why Beehive is an asset to the community. Its the cheapest pub in the area.

I remember when the consultation was going on about the Windrush sq several of us suggested that there be a drinking area set aside. As the Council officer was going on about getting rid of "ne er do wells".


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 22, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Yes, oops!


 
Easy mistake to make. All the Mansions in CHL begin with C.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 22, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> I remember when the consultation was going on about the Windrush sq several of us suggested that there be a drinking area set aside. As the Council officer was going on about getting rid of "ne er do wells".



I'm not surprised by this really, and I wouldn't be surprised if the same applied to councillors as well, I seem to remember Tony Blair, the public face of nu labour for so long, holding forth on his belief that the zero tolerance approach adopted in Singapore was his  ideaL of how cities should be.......


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 22, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> I'm not surprised by this really, and I wouldn't be surprised if the same applied to councillors as well, I seem to remember Tony Blair, the public face of nu labour for so long, holding forth on his belief that the zero tolerance approach adopted in Singapore was his ideaL of how cities should be.......


 
Had a look to see what the Lambeth Labour groups official position is on street drinking.

Found this from 2012




> Rowdy street drinkers and aggressive beggars who intimidate shoppers and residents are being targeted in a new community safety drive by Lambeth Labour Council.
> As part of the new initiative Off-licences are now being encouraged to join a new voluntary scheme to stop selling single cans of cider and beer to stop aggressive drunkenness on the street. The new scheme which is being trialled in Streatham on Mitcham Lane, Greyhound Lane and Gleneagle Road has already seen 25 off-licences sign up to the Responsible Retail Agreement (RRA).
> Lambeth Labour want to go further though and have already seen the councils licensing sub-committee include a ban on single sales as a condition of the licence on a number of local shops.
> Lambeth are also working closely with outreach teams who offer support and advice to street drinkers. The police are also playing a huge role in making Lambeth safer for local residents and visitors by actively enforcing Lambeth’s controlled drinking zone which enables officers to confiscate alcohol and make arrests if needed.
> ...


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 22, 2013)

This bit leaps off the page:


> People shouldn’t be made to feel unsafe going about their daily business, which is why we are taking action.


 The beggar/addict type of street drinker is completely harmless, FFS.  The dangerous ones are the respectable, moneyed young men who get pissed and want a fight at two in the morning. How can we stop these Council *cunts* targeting the wrong people?


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2013)

I heard from several sources that the complaints are starting to rack up from the nu-residents of Clifton Mansions who presumably now want to alter the character of the area to suit their personal tastes.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 22, 2013)

So what are they going to do about the 100 people milling around outside Market House, the Albert and the 414 in the small hours? Should be interesting. I've a good mind to put a letter with my thoughts in every letterbox in the Mansions. 

We're all fucked. CHL is turning into Chelsea at the speed of light.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 22, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> .
> 
> CHL is turning into Chelsea at the speed of light.


 
They can fuck the fucking fuck off.


----------



## EastEnder (Jun 22, 2013)

House of Bottles is ace. Lovely people, excellent service, top notch operation. I am quite prepared to stand up in court and testify to that effect.

Also, I have recently discovered they do this awesome Banana Bread Beer - slightly pricy at 2.19 a bottle, but fucking delicious.


----------



## happyshopper (Jun 22, 2013)

The 4 cans rule is bizarre, whatever it's intention. I first came across it in Llandudno Junction before catching a train. The net effect was that we two cans of lager each, instead of one. It's just a way of discriminating against people who have less money.


----------



## mxh (Jun 22, 2013)

Never set foot in the place but now feel I must.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 22, 2013)

EastEnder said:


> Also, I have recently discovered they do this awesome Banana Bread Beer - slightly pricy at 2.19 a bottle, but fucking delicious.



Love that stuff. There was a youngs pub near uni that did it. Lush!


----------



## shygirl (Jun 22, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> So what are they going to do about the 100 people milling around outside Market House, the Albert and the 414 in the small hours? Should be interesting. I've a good mind to put a letter with my thoughts in every letterbox in the Mansions.
> 
> We're all fucked. CHL is turning into Chelsea at the speed of light.


 
I was thinking about a letter to all the residents too, asking why the fuck they would move to one of the noisiest, liveliest streets in Brixton only to protest about the noise.


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2013)

shygirl said:


> I was thinking about a letter to all the residents too, asking why the fuck they would move to one of the noisiest, liveliest streets in Brixton only to protest about the noise.


They're not going to give a fuck.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 22, 2013)

How about an open letter in the Bugle?


----------



## shygirl (Jun 22, 2013)

I just cycled past 4 young hipsters, all in row, pissing on the wall at the back of Morley's dept store.  I stopped to remonstrate, they didn't even answer, just laughed.  Told 'em to piss off back to where they came from.    Felt like slapping the little fuckers.


----------



## shygirl (Jun 22, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> How about an open letter in the Bugle?


 
Might do that, but am definitely gonna write to Rachel Heywood and Jack Hopkins to ask what arrangements they have in place in address the unruly, anti-social behaviour of well-heeled visitors/newbies in the area.  This and the issue of HoB, of course.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 22, 2013)

And ask them to be humanitarian in their treatment of beggars and to stop demonising them as a threat to public safety.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jun 22, 2013)

shygirl said:


> I just cycled past 4 young hipsters, all in row, pissing on the wall at the back of Morley's dept store.  I stopped to remonstrate, they didn't even answer, just laughed.  Told 'em to piss off back to where they came from.    Felt like slapping the little fuckers.



Maybe something to with the academy gig mentioned earlier in the news and rumours thread..... I have a feeling tonight might be a bit raucous with it being solstice weekend and the super massive full moon on the horizon.


----------



## mxh (Jun 22, 2013)

shygirl said:


> I just cycled past 4 young hipsters, all in row, pissing on the wall at the back of Morley's dept store. I stopped to remonstrate, they didn't even answer, just laughed. Told 'em to piss off back to where they came from.  Felt like slapping the little fuckers.


 
This is my fear for the Bowie mural.


----------



## shygirl (Jun 22, 2013)

Let's hope they wouldn't do that.  Where is it, btw?


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2013)

shygirl said:


> I just cycled past 4 young hipsters, all in row, pissing on the wall at the back of Morley's dept store. I stopped to remonstrate, they didn't even answer, just laughed. Told 'em to piss off back to where they came from.  Felt like slapping the little fuckers.


Last night Eme saw four blokes coming out of the Village, pissing in the bushes across the road and then returning back to the Village.

Nice.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 22, 2013)

editor said:


> Last night Eme saw four blokes coming out of the Village, pissing in the bushes across the road and then returning back to the Village.
> 
> Nice.


 
A lot of the places in the "Village" have licenses to sell alcohol etc. But the same businesses do not have toilet facilities as far as I know.

Its ridiculous situation. The "Village" is turning into a place to eat and drink. If thats is what the owner of market wants they should provide facilities.


----------



## Belushi (Jun 22, 2013)

I was thinking about community today. It’s one of the things Brixton is famous for; something the council are always banging on about, that politicians are always saying we need more of and that people often bemoan the lack of in London. But it strikes me that despite paying lipservice to the ideal it’s something that they can’t wait to jettison. 

The thing about a community is that includes everyone (I grew up in a pit village where people weren’t close because they liked each other, they were close because they didn’t have any bloody choice about it  ) but the council and at least some of the newcomers can’t wait to get rid the bits that don’t suit them. That they aren’t used or maybe find a little threatening; the street drinkers, old blokes playing dominoes in the square, kids playing on the street, grotty shops where they aren’t made to feel welcome etc etc. That really isn’t how communities work, everyone is a part of it however big a pain in the arse they can be, you don't get to pick and choose.


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2013)

The scene last night:


----------



## el-ahrairah (Jun 22, 2013)

wtf is that all about?  why can't the arses leave tony alone ffs.


----------



## equationgirl (Jun 22, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> A lot of the places in the "Village" have licenses to sell alcohol etc. But the same businesses do not have toilet facilities as far as I know.
> 
> Its ridiculous situation. The "Village" is turning into a place to eat and drink. If thats is what the owner of market wants they should provide facilities.


 
I thought it was illegal if toilets weren't provided if you were a cafe or restaurant.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 22, 2013)

el-ahrairah said:


> wtf is that all about? why can't the arses leave tony alone ffs.


 
Could have been when a guy was chased in there, suspected of weed possession. I think he might have been smoking it in the street. He was trying to hide his stash and ran through the stockroom and chucked it in the back yard where it was quickly found. Rotten timing for Tony.  I hope the quantity was just 'personal use' - if not they might accuse Tony of allowing drugs to be stored by dealers, like they did in 2009.

eta. I think the arrest happened around 10.15.


----------



## colacubes (Jun 22, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> This bit leaps off the page:
> *The beggar/addict type of street drinker is completely harmless, FFS.*  The dangerous ones are the respectable, moneyed young men who get pissed and want a fight at two in the morning. How can we stop these Council *cunts* targeting the wrong people?


 
Ok, while I largely agree with this, I don't think you can couch it in quite such simplistic terms. I've actually been assaulted in a random attack by a street drinker in CHL. Not all street drinkers are harmless; not all people with money are wanting to get into a fight. Whilst I agree with a large amount of the sentiment, I don't think this level of generalisation is helpful.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 23, 2013)

equationgirl said:


> I thought it was illegal if toilets weren't provided if you were a cafe or restaurant.


 
Is it? I do not know myself. I am pretty sure the only toilet in Village is the small one at back. Hardly enough when its busy.


----------



## equationgirl (Jun 23, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> Is it? I do not know myself. I am pretty sure the only toilet in Village is the small one at back. Hardly enough when its busy.


 
I might be wrong, admittedly. I'll try and find the legislation I'm thinking about tomorrow.


----------



## quimcunx (Jun 23, 2013)

equationgirl said:


> I might be wrong, admittedly. I'll try and find the legislation I'm thinking about tomorrow.


 

Food courts in shopping centres don't have individual toilets for each restaurant, just the ones in the shopping centre.  There are toilets in Brixton Village.


----------



## kittyP (Jun 23, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:
			
		

> Love that stuff. There was a youngs pub near uni that did it. Lush!



I'm not sure I'd like it but it sounds very intriguing.


----------



## kittyP (Jun 23, 2013)

Belushi said:
			
		

> I was thinking about community today. It’s one of the things Brixton is famous for; something the council are always banging on about, that politicians are always saying we need more of and that people often bemoan the lack of in London. But it strikes me that despite paying lipservice to the ideal it’s something that they can’t wait to jettison.
> 
> The thing about a community is that includes everyone (I grew up in a pit village where people weren’t close because they liked each other, they were close because they didn’t have any bloody choice about it  ) but the council and at least some of the newcomers can’t wait to get rid the bits that don’t suit them. That they aren’t used or maybe find a little threatening; the street drinkers, old blokes playing dominoes in the square, kids playing on the street, grotty shops where they aren’t made to feel welcome etc etc. That really isn’t how communities work, everyone is a part of it however big a pain in the arse they can be, you don't get to pick and choose.



I don't want to bang on but I lived for a long time in Kent. 
I never for all those years of growing up felt comfortable there. 
This is the first time ever that I know my neighbours, all our local shop keepers and people we generally walk past in the street.


----------



## kittyP (Jun 23, 2013)

.


----------



## happyshopper (Jun 23, 2013)

Can you generalise about generalisations?


----------



## Shippou-Sensei (Jun 23, 2013)

generally you can


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 23, 2013)

happyshopper said:


> Can you generalise about generalisations?



Go home happy shopper. You're drunk.


----------



## Ted Striker (Jun 23, 2013)

I'm amazed the council hasn't gone for the open goal and ordered in trading standards wrt trades description act. If they call themselves House of Bottles (plural) you cant expect to be able to run your place contradictory to the title of the premises. 

Rules are rules.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 23, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> A lot of the places in the "Village" have licenses to sell alcohol etc. But the same businesses do not have toilet facilities as far as I know.
> 
> Its ridiculous situation. The "Village" is turning into a place to eat and drink. If thats is what the owner of market wants they should provide facilities.


 

It's a public health handwashing issue.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 24, 2013)

leanderman said:


> It's a public health handwashing issue.


 
I'm imagining "Cholera strikes Brixton Village" headlines now!


----------



## Ol Nick (Jun 24, 2013)

Don't worry, I've heard from a friend in Dalston that it's soon to reopen as Maison de Bouteilles, a radical new way to perceive urban space and our place within the built environment facilitated by 4 bottles of Dragon Stout and a large one of the Nigerian Guinness and some spliff.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 25, 2013)

Belushi said:


> Apart from the money aspect I often just buy one beer, because thats all I want and if I have more sitting in the fridge I'm liable to drink them.


 
I wish you could buy single ciggies for the same reason!


----------



## leanderman (Jun 25, 2013)

Rushy said:


> I wish you could buy single ciggies for the same reason!


 

Just noticed today that packs of 20 are £8-plus. Insane

I could get a nice bottle of wine for that price


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 25, 2013)

Fuck me, I thought it was about half that.  Right, that's it. Anyone on benefits who smokes must be on the fiddle. Lock 'em all up.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 25, 2013)

They cost me twice that because I only ever want 1, buy 10, smoke 5 far too quickly and tear up the rest of the pack in disgust.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 25, 2013)

Smoke bacci. Cheaper and nicer than fags. Lasts longer an all.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 25, 2013)

That would be a problem as you can't really tear up a bag of bacci.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 26, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Fuck me, I thought it was about half that.  Right, that's it. Anyone on benefits who smokes must be on the fiddle. Lock 'em all up.


 
It is unbelievable but true. See here for how much cigarettes have gone up since 1990.


----------



## Dexter Deadwood (Jun 26, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> Smoke bacci. Cheaper and nicer than fags. Lasts longer an all.


 
Vape. It's even cheaper, cleaner and less smelly.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 26, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> It is unbelievable but true. See here for how much cigarettes have gone up since 1990.


 
Interesting. I thought tax as a proportion of price had gone up - but it has actually been relatively stable and has come down since 2001.


----------



## porno thieving gypsy (Jun 26, 2013)

EastEnder said:


> Also, I have recently discovered they do this awesome Banana Bread Beer - slightly pricy at 2.19 a bottle, but fucking delicious.


 
Want!


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 26, 2013)

HoB had an inspection by environmental services yesterday. They haven't been since 2007 but trading standards sent them as part of the licence review. Tony is wondering who to expect next. Lambeth can't have many departments which haven't been yet.


----------



## porno thieving gypsy (Jun 26, 2013)

Anyway despite its alleged occasional deviance from the law I loves the place and Tony is a good man. Hope he's OK.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jun 26, 2013)

He's not OK really.  He needs hugs and reassurance.


----------



## RaverDrew (Jun 26, 2013)

He really doesn't deserve this


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 26, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> HoB had an inspection by environmental services yesterday. They haven't been since 2007 but trading standards sent them as part of the licence review. Tony is wondering who to expect next. Lambeth can't have many departments which haven't been yet.


 
Its funny how when they want the Council are all over someone.

Unlike further up CHL: the "car wash", advertising hoarding with no planning permission that hides fly tipping and car dump that residents have been complaining to Council about for ages. In that case the Council are not interested.


----------



## CH1 (Jun 28, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> Its funny how when they want the Council are all over someone.
> 
> Unlike further up CHL: the "car wash", advertising hoarding with no planning permission that hides fly tipping and car dump that residents have been complaining to Council about for ages. In that case the Council are not interested.


Trading standards seem to like to prosecute, name and shame people trading in "counterfeit goods" (DVDs, East European ciggies, fake designer cothes etc etc.) Maybe that's what it's all about - they thought he was selling smuggled tobacco products - though in fact the evidence is scanty judging from earlier in the thread.
You are quite right "Lambeth Talk" crows about prosecuting Chinese DVD traders and traders like "The Real McCoy" [now in demolition by Lexadon], but do absolutely nothing about planning violations. The car-wash advertising hoardings must be generating significant rental revenue, so the longer Lambeth leaves it the greater the reward for breaking the planning law - an example to us all!


----------



## leanderman (Jun 28, 2013)

Low-hanging fruit. They don't like hassle


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jun 29, 2013)

Badgers said:


> I get the impression that a certain brewery would like the space to expand a certain pub.


The 414, the Albert and the House of Bottles should be knocked in together to create an extensive super Brixton scuz-club which would cater for the diverse social & drinking needs of the local community and form a revolutionary base for the inevitable overthrow of Lambeth Council.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Aug 27, 2013)

Anyone know whether Tony had his licence review yet?


----------



## Thimble Queen (Aug 28, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Anyone know whether Tony had his licence review yet?



He's had the hearing and is appealing the decision to revoke his license....


----------



## kittyP (Aug 28, 2013)

leanderman said:


> Just noticed today that packs of 20 are £8-plus. Insane


 

Not the ones I smoke


----------



## kittyP (Aug 28, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> He's had the hearing and is appealing the decision to revoke his license....


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Aug 28, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> He's had the hearing and is appealing the decision to revoke his license....


fucks sake 



Can we write to support his appeal? Anyone know how the process works?


----------



## Thimble Queen (Aug 28, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> fucks sake
> 
> 
> 
> Can we write to support his appeal? Anyone know how the process works?



Scutta got the names of the ppl but I'm not sure that he's been able to get the email addresses yet...


----------



## shygirl (Aug 28, 2013)

Its political.  Fucking breweries....


----------



## editor (Aug 28, 2013)

shygirl said:


> Its political. Fucking breweries....


 
Any evidence for this?


----------



## shygirl (Aug 28, 2013)

Rumours.  I haven't named any one establishment, btw.


----------



## shygirl (Sep 3, 2013)

Raised this matter at the CPCG this evening, hope the councillors and police will look into it.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Sep 3, 2013)

shygirl said:


> Raised this matter at the CPCG this evening, hope the councillors and police will look into it.


Nice one. Any feedback when you asked the question?

HOB is still open. Presumably T is allowed to continue trading until the appeal is heard?

MrsDarlingsKiss - Did you find out where we send the emails of support to? Lambeth Licensing I guess....


----------



## Thimble Queen (Sep 3, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Nice one. Any feedback when you asked the question?
> 
> HOB is still open. Is T allowed to continue trading until the appeal is heard?
> 
> MrsDarlingsKiss - Did you find out where we send the emails of support to? Lambeth Licensing I guess....



We've been in berlin until yesterday so not had a chance to look any further into it. Scutta has names but no email addresses... I'll poke him for the names and put them up on here


----------



## Thimble Queen (Sep 3, 2013)

The names we were given by tony are esther jones, bernard conmy and aysev ismail 


Brixton Hatter


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Sep 3, 2013)

MrsDarlingsKiss said:


> The names we were given by tony are esther jones, bernard conmy and aysev ismail
> 
> 
> Brixton Hatter


Cheers 

Lambeth email addresses tend to be initialsurname@lambeth.gov.uk so I assume the email addresses are:

ejones@lambeth.gov.uk
bconmy@lambeth.gov.uk
aismail@lambeth.gov.uk

Feel free to fire off your emails people, in support of Tony's licence appeal.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Sep 3, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Cheers
> 
> Lambeth email addresses tend to be initialsurname@lambeth.gov.uk so I assume the email addresses are:
> 
> ...



nice one hatter


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Sep 3, 2013)

We've written to the council. 

I also copied in the general email infoservice@lambeth.gov.uk in case the email addresses are incorrect.



> Dear Lambeth Council and Lambeth Licensing Officials
> 
> I write in support of Tony Fabusina, licensee of the House of Bottles off licence on Coldharbour Lane, who is currently appealing a decision to revoke his licence to trade.
> 
> ...


----------



## shygirl (Sep 4, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Nice one. Any feedback when you asked the question?
> 
> HOB is still open. Presumably T is allowed to continue trading until the appeal is heard?
> 
> MrsDarlingsKiss - Did you find out where we send the emails of support to? Lambeth Licensing I guess....



No feedback, as there was a full agenda.  There should be a report back at the next meeting.  I also wrote to Rachel Heywood and Jack Hopkins last week, they've both just returned from their hols and will reply to me soon.


----------



## Frumious B. (Sep 4, 2013)

Tony's name is spelled wrong in lots of council docs, it's Fabusiwa, not Fabusina.


----------



## Tolpuddle (Sep 4, 2013)

Writing to the council won't achieve anything, they have already made their decision, the next stage is in court where the appeal is heard.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Sep 4, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Tony's name is spelled wrong in lots of council docs, it's Fabusiwa, not Fabusina.


Legal loophole to stay open?!!

Heard back from the council - as the licence has already been revoked, this is now a court matter. He is allowed to continue trading, pending the appeal. To be fair, the guy from the council was helpful in his reply. He said Tony/his legal rep may want customers as witnesses for the appeal hearing. I'll ask next time I'm in there...though that might not be until the weekend. If anyone else sees him this week before me and is interested, please ask


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Sep 4, 2013)

Tolpuddle said:


> Writing to the council won't achieve anything, they have already made their decision, the next stage is in court where the appeal is heard.


cheers - yeah just posted something similar before reading your post!


----------



## Frumious B. (Sep 4, 2013)

Their technique is to use legal bills to coerce people. They make their decision ahead of a hearing, always in line with whatever Trading Standards or the Police recommend. Even if you spend 4 grand on a solicitor to represent you they say 'you've got 5 mins to speak'. The TS and Police are there to answer questions from the committee, but the licensee isn't allowed to question them. It's a charade. The committee know they don't have a case, they know they will lose at appeal, but they force the licensee to appeal it to the magistrates anyway, just to cost him another 4 grand in legal bills. It's all very well for Tesco but an independent off licence can be put out of business.


----------



## editor (Sep 4, 2013)

I'm sure Tony won't mind me saying this, but he's told me that he's really grateful for the support he's got off this site.

Good work, people.


----------



## CH1 (Sep 15, 2013)

I noticed yesterday en route to Lidls that Quick Stop at 14 Acre Lane has a Licensing notice on the lamp-post outside. Searching Lambeth Licensing reveals that they too had a visit from trading standards which looks as though it may have dire consequences: http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...CE901E1A39/0/quickstopapplicationredacted.pdf


----------



## DietCokeGirl (Sep 15, 2013)

My local shop has now got lots of signs all over it saying cans can only be sold in 4s. They're really nice guys and I don't want them to get into any trouble or loose their license, but it's a major pain in the arse as usually only want one, maybe 2. Torn between wanting to give them my trade, and having to shell out for more than I plan to drink (but no doubt will,m if I've brought it...)


----------



## peterkro (Sep 15, 2013)

DietCokeGirl said:


> My local shop has now got lots of signs all over it saying cans can only be sold in 4s. They're really nice guys and I don't want them to get into any trouble or loose their license, but it's a major pain in the arse as usually only want one, maybe 2. Torn between wanting to give them my trade, and having to shell out for more than I plan to drink (but no doubt will,m if I've brought it...)


From what I've seen it doesn't appear to stop them selling ones,twos and threes at all.(this is around Waterloo)


----------



## editor (Sep 15, 2013)

So Tony gets slammed for selling single cans because it encourages street drinking, yet last night Coldharbour Lane was jam packed with clubbers wandering around with cans and bottles in their hands, almost all of which I imagine where purchased elsewhere.

Yeah, that seems really fair.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 15, 2013)

Street drinking by the _wrong sort_.

Only selling in 4s is absurd. I frequently buy only 2 cans and I often see people coming home from work who buy a single can or bottle and take it home. It's not uncommon for that to be strong beer either, a single Dragon Stout say. While I know what the basic point is here, forcing people to buy _more beer_ doesn't really help overall health.


----------



## editor (Sep 15, 2013)

CH1 said:


> I noticed yesterday en route to Lidls that Quick Stop at 14 Acre Lane has a Licensing notice on the lamp-post outside. Searching Lambeth Licensing reveals that they too had a visit from trading standards which looks as though it may have dire consequences: http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...CE901E1A39/0/quickstopapplicationredacted.pdf


Slap down the little people with red tape, but there seems to be no problem if you fancy opening up a swanky restaurant serving up alcohol in Market Row - no need to bother with planning permission!


----------



## Thimble Queen (Sep 15, 2013)

editor said:


> I'm sure Tony won't mind me saying this, but he's told me that he's really grateful for the support he's got off this site.
> 
> Good work, people.



He's said the same to me last night. I really hope that this comes out in Tony's favour, he's a really lovely bloke and doesn't deserve this


----------



## CH1 (Sep 15, 2013)

editor said:


> Slap down the little people with red tape, but there seems to be no problem if you fancy opening up a swanky restaurant serving up alcohol in Market Row - no need to bother with planning permission!


I don't think this is a planning issue. Jack Hopkins the Cabinet Member for Policing Community Safety etc is quite strong on street drinking and betting shops. My guess is that the council are asking their licencing and trading standards officers to be more proactive.
Regarding the House of Bottles case, the same tactic seems was employed (from memory - not going back over the thread). Official visit looking for any possible irregularities. That was why I highlighted this other case - which might even be part of the same "operation" - given the date of the Acre Lane inspection (21st May).


----------



## chavezcat (Sep 16, 2013)

I really think it is crap to target a small business owner (and especially one as lovely as Tony). I don't understand why it isn't the responsibility of the drinker, since they could have bought the alcohol at Sainsbury or at Tescos in Brixton or wherever they may be from earlier in the day. If they are causing a nuisance then that is on them and not whether they bought one can or ten somewhere. I've also seem Tony refuse to serve people and it get quite nasty towards him. 
I was on the tube last weekend at 6pm on a Sunday with 15 guys who were absolute steaming, drinking lager, and making lewd comments etc. Their behaviour is on them, and how much they had to drink, not on wherever they got the cans.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Sep 16, 2013)

Had a chat with Tony at the weekend about this. He's obviously gutted and knows it's totally unjust. He was appreciative of the support of locals. I did offer any help he might need.... He was circumspect about what happens next with court appeal...


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Sep 16, 2013)

As for the single can thing....what's the point in stopping House of Bottles selling single cans, when you can buy single cans mere _footsteps_ away at the 'D' Convenience Store, or Liquor Supply opposite the Dogstar?

Anyone who wants to can respond to Lambeth's current licensing consultation....I told them the single can policy was useless:

Background here:
http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/Services/...htRefreshment/LicensingPolicyConsultation.htm

Survey here: http://www.snapsurveys.com/swh/surveylogin.asp?k=137761744100

Thread here: http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/lambeth-licensing-policy-consultation-and-survey.314980/


----------



## Smick (Sep 16, 2013)

I noticed that the new Sainsbury's on Water Lane / Tulse hill is selling cans of spesh.

I can't see how this is any less contributory to any alleged street drink problem .


----------



## peterkro (Sep 16, 2013)

I think I posted about this before.Nearly all the shops around Waterloo that sell alcohol have those 4 only notices about and yet I see tourists buying one or two cans all the time.It appears to be aimed directly at street drinkers who can be seen hanging about outside and asking likely punters (like me  ) to buy stuff for them.It's not just beer they refuse to sell the strong wines and stuff that people drink,presumably under direction of the police/licensing authorities.


----------



## editor (Sep 16, 2013)

I tweeted about Lambeth's harassment of small businesses and got this response from Kaff: 


> Kaff
> @brixtonbuzz I can sympathise with the apparent harassment that they vindicate on us smaller independents after another notice served!


----------



## Frumious B. (Sep 16, 2013)

Has anyone looked at the Brixton licensing map on the council site? Look at the jagged border on Coldharbour Lane...are House of Bottles, the Albert and the 414 in the 'Core' or the 'Edge'?   http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...-8A80-FE531BECF658/0/BrixtonTowncentremap.pdf


----------



## CH1 (Sep 17, 2013)

Frumious B. said:


> Has anyone looked at the Brixton licensing map on the council site? Look at the jagged border on Coldharbour Lane...are House of Bottles, the Albert and the 414 in the 'Core' or the 'Edge'?   http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...-8A80-FE531BECF658/0/BrixtonTowncentremap.pdf


I reckon the Albert and the 414 and in the Core and the House of Bottles is on the Edge.
Or maybe 414 is on the Edge too. It's weirdly drawn - even the Prince of Wales yard has a little rebate putting it on the edge.
What significance would there be in being on the edge though - seeing as the Dogstar, Market House and Ritzy are all also on the edge? The Effra (Kellet), the Effra Social and Hootanany are all "residential". What effect does that have?
Personally I would have thought that zoning might have an effect on new licensing applications - but English law is based on precedent so any existing licences would have to be determined on the basis of previous decisions.


----------



## leanderman (Oct 26, 2013)

What a nice bloke he is that runs this place, I discovered this week. Stocks Brixton beers and even takes the Brixton pound, making everything from £290 Cristal to £1.30 K cider 10 PC cheaper.


----------



## colacubes (Oct 26, 2013)

Tony is a good sort


----------



## cuppa tee (Oct 26, 2013)

leanderman said:


> Cristal


----------



## leanderman (Oct 26, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


>



Dom Periginon too. But he says he doesn't sell much!


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 30, 2018)

I think Tony’s license is once again under review. I saw a notice on a lamp post on CHL the other day but didn’t take a snap because I was loaded with shopping and assumed I would be able to find more information  somewhere online, but I haven’t been able to.

I popped into House of Bottles to offer my support and ask about what was going on, apparently Tony is away at the moment.

Does anyone know anything else about this?


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 30, 2018)

Found it:

https://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/brl -redacted app form 09.04.18.pdf

It looks like Tony was caught selling a can of Stella at 11.05 one night and then didn’t produce the CCTV footage of that event when asked.


----------



## editor (Apr 30, 2018)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I think Tony’s license is once again under review. I saw a notice on a lamp post on CHL the other day but didn’t take a snap because I was loaded with shopping and assumed I would be able to find more information  somewhere online, but I haven’t been able to.
> 
> I popped into House of Bottles to offer my support and ask about what was going on, apparently Tony is away at the moment.
> 
> Does anyone know anything else about this?


I saw that too. It really fucking pisses me off. There's new bars and venues nearby causing ten times more trouble than Tony's place (I'm looking at you Rum Kitchen) and they're chasing him over a fucking can of Stella.


----------

