# Strike!



## smokedout (Sep 13, 2011)

Thought it was worth having a thread to keep track of official and unofficial strikes, walk outs and worker led direct action, whether large or small.  Ideally not for bickering, but to help promote and support local action.

Here's one to start:



> Workers at a north London council have gone on strike in protest at plans to outsource employees and services.
> 
> Unison said about 400 members at Barnet Council were expected to take part in the one-day walkout. The council said 148 people had not turned up for work.
> 
> ...



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-14886740


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 13, 2011)

The youth workers' strike in oxfordshire (article written by me in this weeks socialist hopefully)

began aug 23rd, they went again this friday and are planning a series of rolling one-day strikes


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 13, 2011)

smokedout said:


> Thought it was worth having a thread to keep track of official and unofficial strikes, walk outs and worker led direct action, whether large or small. Ideally not for bickering, but to help promote and support local action.
> 
> Here's one to start:
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-14886740



i don't call 148 out of 400 a "small number"


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 13, 2011)

Protest against job cuts at northampton university tomorrow


----------



## BigTom (Sep 13, 2011)

Birmingham Unison council workers on strike again on the 21st. GMB, UCATT and Unite are balloting at the moment.. I think if they are succesful we can assume that they will all go on strike in November along with the teachers/PCS/whoever else


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 13, 2011)

NASUWT to start ballotting too apparently.


----------



## TremulousTetra (Sep 13, 2011)

there is a list here


----------



## shagnasty (Sep 13, 2011)

smokedout said:


> Thought it was worth having a thread to keep track of official and unofficial strikes, walk outs and worker led direct action, whether large or small. Ideally not for bickering, but to help promote and support local action.
> 
> Here's one to start:
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-14886740


I live in barnet the problem is unless you use these services you think it don't affect you ,so a strike may well highlight the cuts ,hopefully


----------



## dennisr (Sep 14, 2011)

ResistanceMP3 said:


> there is a list here



Thats just promises - ongoing strikes here: http://www.shopstewards.net


----------



## Yelkcub (Sep 14, 2011)

_"Highways and planning staff are among those taking strike action over the move they claim will put jobs and *quality of services* at risk."_
At Barnet? One of the funniest things I've ever read.


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 14, 2011)

in other words if you think that they're bad now, just wait.


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 14, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> Protest against job cuts at northampton university tomorrow


Good luck, tell me how it went mate


----------



## Santino (Sep 14, 2011)

Unison and the Fire Brigade Union are ballotting.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Sep 14, 2011)

dennisr said:


> Thats just promises - ongoing strikes here: http://www.shopstewards.net



I'm off to a GMB meeting with council management later today, hopefully will we be ballotting - one less promise off that list.

Where's Unite on that list btw?


----------



## marty21 (Sep 14, 2011)

Santino said:


> Unison and the Fire Brigade Union are ballotting.


haven't received my Unison ballot form yet


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Sep 14, 2011)

http://m.guardian.co.uk/politics/20...ers-pension-reforms?cat=politics&type=article


----------



## Santino (Sep 14, 2011)

marty21 said:


> haven't received my Unison ballot form yet


Give them a chance, marty, it was only announced this morning.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Sep 14, 2011)

The TUC votes unanimously for campaign of co-ordinated industrial action over pensions!

General Strike!!!


----------



## dennisr (Sep 14, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> The TUC votes unanimously for campaign of co-ordinated industrial action over pensions!
> 
> General Strike!!!



Its good news - something that can be built on from the bottom even if the top wavers (as some inevitably will...)


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 14, 2011)

YES.


----------



## treelover (Sep 14, 2011)

all the news on union news

http://union-news.co.uk/2011/09/unionnews-reports-live-from-tuc-congress/


----------



## BigTom (Sep 14, 2011)

Prison Officers Association I think will come out as well, illegally because they are not allowed to strike.. in Birmingham at least they are very pissed off about being privatised, and I'm sure would take the opportunity to come out over pensions.. find it hard to extend any solidarity to screws but admire them for doing so and the POA for taking the risk that it is if it does tell its members to wildcat.. oh the horns of a dilemma.


----------



## marty21 (Sep 14, 2011)

Santino said:


> Give them a chance, marty, it was only announced this morning.


I want to vote Yes immediately!


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 14, 2011)

article about youth workers strike here: http://oxfordaylesburysp.wordpress.com/2011/09/13/report-on-youth-workers-strike-in-oxfordshire/


----------



## love detective (Sep 14, 2011)

DAY OF ACTION - NOVEMBER 30!!

14 unions in total


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Sep 14, 2011)

One day? Oh ffs.

Or is that unconfirmed & down to the individual unions involved atm?


----------



## articul8 (Sep 14, 2011)

Critical thing is to link issue of pensions to broader issues of cuts and austerity - and raise issue of alternatives.  Press will portray it as coseted public sector workers out to protect their "gold-plated" pensions (sic).

Should also raise the scandal of what's happened to private pensions.


----------



## DotCommunist (Sep 14, 2011)

frogwoman said:


> Good luck, tell me how it went mate


 
A good show all round. Frowny security man said we could only have 6 people there, but 40 turned up. He was told if he didn't like it we would love him to ring OB. Some SP, some greens, the obligatory megaphone wielding chant starting Unison rep. All the cleaning staff, lots of other ancillary staff and some academics gave up thier lunch hour to support. Someone bod from bbc local news filmed us waving placards so that should make bbc look east

Turnout over on the larger park campus was nearer a hundred staff and students, the two local rags and the local radio turned out to them, and the Vice Chancellor (axeman) was photod walking through the frowny ranks of protesters.

Lots of beeping and support etc at both sites. A decent turnout, all told.

Ballot to consider balloting for strike action is apace.


----------



## Clint Iguana (Sep 14, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> One day? Oh ffs.
> 
> Or is that unconfirmed & down to the individual unions involved atm?



All the unions that get a yes vote will be out for the one day. There will then be strategic action to follow (for instance, action by key workers supported by other members - that type of thing).

if you think the grass roots membership are up for 'everybody out and stay out till the job is done', you are very much mistaken.

Nothing confirmed yet, but it will be a rolling programme. The important thing is to get a good turn out in the ballot and get a strong mandate.


----------



## treelover (Sep 14, 2011)

'DAY OF ACTION - NOVEMBER 30!!

14 unions in total '

Good stuff, but just before Xmas, a lot of members won't like that sadly...


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 14, 2011)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-north-west-wales-14667020
Does anyone know what's happening with this (PT etc?)


----------



## quinny518 (Sep 14, 2011)

UCU pre 1992 Universities Ballot in for strike action, post 1992 alreday have active strike ballot, its looking like FE and HE will be out with the rest...


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 14, 2011)

excellent


----------



## weepiper (Sep 14, 2011)

hearsay at the moment, but I've heard rumblings about a possible postal workers' strike in Edinburgh over unpaid overtime


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 21, 2011)

http://www.basingstokegazette.co.uk...f_take_to_picket_line_over_proposed_job_cuts/


----------



## BigTom (Sep 22, 2011)

Pictures from yesterdays Birmingham council Unison strike

Today, Unison Shropshire council are on strike


----------



## dennisr (Sep 23, 2011)

*Ongoing in Construction*

Construction workers invade Crossrail site
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.157.htm

_21 September “We are Sparks. We are Sparks. We are, We are, We are Sparks” was the chant heard on the Crossrail Farringdon building site as hundreds of electricians, (“and a carpenter!”) staged a mass invasion of the site this morning. Around 300 electricians assembled at Farringdon station for the protest, held an impromptu rally there and marched around the site, led by the banner of the National Shop Stewards Network._

_As well as the above action, an information email from 'Site Worker' this morning said:_

_150 electricians staged a walk-out and blockade of the Tyne Tunnel in Newcastle_
_Protests by electricians also took place in Manchester and Liverpool._
_Last week Grangemouth construction project saw a one-day unofficial walk-out._
_Lyndsey Oil Refinery is set to join the rank and file led action next week._

_The big employers planning to pull out of the JIB are Bailey Building Services, Balfour Beatty Engineering Services, Tommy Clarke, Crown House Technologies, Gratte Brothers, MJN Colston, SES and SPIE Matthew Hall._
_890 dismissal notices were issued by Balfour Beatty Engineering Services last week and new contracts are set to be imposed on December 7th which means some sparks suffer pay cuts of up to 35%._
_The current rate of pay is £16-25 p/hr - the new contracts reduce rates down to £10 p/hr for the majority of the work carried out._

*Electricians Against The World*
A blog dedicated to providing the most accurate and up to date information concerning the attack on the Electrical and Mechanical National working agreements. If you have any news, bits I have missed or parts I have got wrong then please feel free to let me know. Get your missus to sign it, get your mum to sign it, sign it yourself several times and get your dog to sign it http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/13728

http://jibelectrician.blogspot.com/


----------



## dennisr (Sep 23, 2011)

All Ongoing: (all from recent NSSN bulletin)

*Remploy*
Open Meeting 20th September at Unite House to discuss the findings of the Sayce Review on Supported Employment and its implications for Remploy factories and disabled workers. Speakers to include, Len McCluskey, Unite GS, Paul Kenny, GMB GS, Kevin Hepworth, Unite Remploy Consortium Officer, Julie Haynes, Unite Remploy Consortium Rep, Mark Holloway, GMB Remploy Consortium Rep 6.00pm to 8.00pm in Unite House, 128 Theobalds Road, Holborn, WC1X 8TN.

Swansea meeting to defend Remploy workers - Railmens Club, Wind Street Swansea, Wednesday 21st September @ 7.30pm leafleting and petitioning on Saturday in Oxford Street, Swansea City centre (near Marks and Spencer), from 11:30am 17th September

*Fujitsu strikes*
Unite members working for Fujitsu in Crewe and Manchester have voted to take 24 hours strike action starting at 00.01 on Monday 19 September.
Public Rally 08:00 from Fujitsu, Central Park, Northampton Road, Manchester, M40 5BP. Picket lines: http://tinyurl.com/63kbfw4

Hopefully, the victory of PCS members in Fujitsu in DVLA, HM Revenue and Customs, Home Office, Ministry of Defence and Office of National Statistics will prove to be an encouragement http://tinyurl.com/65djdu5

*London FBU*
The London Region of the FBU asks you to support our campaign to prevent privatisation of the LFB training and demanding that the brigade retain and enhance the current training provisions in house. http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/14313

*Redbridge*
Proposed decommissioning of 'Art Psychotherapy Services' in the London Borough of Redbridge by the 'North East London NHS Foundation Trust' (NELFT) and 'NHS Outer North East London' (ONEL).  http://tinyurl.com/6e55epm

 UPDATES
*Wyndeham Impact Dispute*
Unite members in dispute at Wyndeham Impact in Basingstoke - they’ve taken 3 months of weekly action. Messages of Support to Chapel Rep: Stephen Adam at keegan20001@aol.com. Donations to Strike Fund made payable to: “Impact Chapel” and sent c/o Steve Attwill, Regional Officer,Unite, Transport Hse, 15-16 The Avenue, Southampton SO17 1XF
http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/articles/12757/14-09-2011/support-wyndeham-workers

*Centrepoint Housing Workers*
Unite Housing workers members in Centrepoint are in battle with management over changes to terms and condition and pay cuts of up to 30%. They are currently balloting for action but would also welcome support via the petition. http://www.housingworkers.org.uk/


----------



## dennisr (Sep 23, 2011)

*300 Electricians (and one carpenter!) - Occcupying Farringdon Building Site*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&feature=player_embedded&v=jcDHrBBLVmg


----------



## stuff_it (Sep 23, 2011)

dennisr said:


> *300 Electricians (and one carpenter!) - Occcupying Farringdon Building Site*
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&feature=player_embedded&v=jcDHrBBLVmg


That could almost be the start of a joke - I bet the carpenter is getting some ribbing. 

I wish the building site next door would strike.


----------



## dennisr (Sep 23, 2011)

stuff_it said:


> That could almost be the start of a joke - I bet the carpenter is getting some ribbing.



just a little


----------



## dennisr (Oct 3, 2011)

*60 striking printers have been sacked in Basingstoke by Wyndeham Impact who only made £1.5 million profit last year. Described by workers as, "Lying, evil, legalised bastard, gangsters." Text your message of support to Steve Adams UNITE FOC 07884 430305.
*


----------



## articul8 (Oct 4, 2011)

never underestimate a carpenter


----------



## gawkrodger (Oct 4, 2011)

Scotland Yard have been in contact with UNITE the Union to try and stop the sparks protest at Oxford Street tomorrow morning (Wednesday 5th Oct, 6:30am, opposite Selfridges).
 "Met Police have now decided to adopt a harsher approach in fear that Oxford Street may be brought to a standstill during rush-hour tomorrow morning. This will almost certainly bring the issue to a head. These are building workers - not young students." says Site Worker.

I know a bunch of London comrades are going over to support - would be good if others can as well.


----------



## treelover (Oct 5, 2011)

how did this go?


----------



## BigTom (Oct 5, 2011)

treelover said:


> how did this go?


http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=26301

Sounds decent..

In other news, Hospital workers in NI to strike over cuts:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-15172997


----------



## dennisr (Oct 5, 2011)

BigTom said:


> http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=26301
> 
> Sounds decent..
> 
> ...


 
Indeed - a report here: http://www.shopstewards.net/news.166.htm
_*Action is starting to yield results. *__*Pressure grows on Balfour Beatty.  *_
_* Further protests: *All North-West protest: Weds 12 October, 6.30-10am Carrington paper mill, 5 minutes from Carrington village, Greater Manchester._

and plenty else going on :
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.168.htm
*Southampton Unite calls all council workers out on strike 6 october*


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 5, 2011)

prob said too much, wait till further info


----------



## dennisr (Oct 6, 2011)

I like this quote. Gets straight to the point: "Eddie Current (sparks rank & file spokesperson) said to the protest in Oxford Street:" This dispute is not about Polish or Portuguese workers. It is about money grabbing multi-national building firms, trying to drive up their profits by driving down our wages. If they think we're just going to just meekly accept a 35% pay cut and de-skilling of our industry - they can think again""


----------



## DotCommunist (Oct 6, 2011)

Unison members have voted to enter into dispute at the proposed axeing of 70 support staff jobs at Northampton University:

http://www.northamptonchron.co.uk/n...rs_as_university_roles_face_the_axe_1_3120942



> Paul Crofts, Unison representative at The University of Northampton, said: “What we are saying is that we do not agree with the direction that the university is going in.
> “When the consultation was first launched in August, we asked for information such as evidence-based impact assessments and we believe we haven’t been supplied with the information that would make this consultation meaningful.
> “Staff at the university are frustrated about the lack of a proper negotiation from the university.
> “We believe the loss of more than 70 jobs will profoundly affect our members at the university and will impact on the student experience.”
> ...




the battle continues


----------



## BigTom (Oct 6, 2011)

More council strikes:

Southhampton UNISON & UNITE on strike today

Barnet have a second day of strikes on Oct 18th (this is where the council stuck up big posters saying that workers shouldn't strike (or vote yes in the ballot, I forget which)


----------



## butchersapron (Oct 7, 2011)

Looks like a wildcat at ratcliffe power station


----------



## dennisr (Oct 7, 2011)

*likes lots*

It is likely to be echoed throughout the network built through the Lindsey dispute - links built, same tactics.
(which should be a reminder to a few on here how important a careful approach to awkward disputes is - not just at the time but potentially to future events). The significance of this cannot be under estimated.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 7, 2011)

possibly a wildcat @ a local haulage company - don't  want to say too much tho


----------



## DotCommunist (Oct 7, 2011)

Anyone tell me why they are termed wildcat, as in where is the origin of the description? Wikipedo is no help.


----------



## gawkrodger (Oct 7, 2011)

dennisr said:


> *60 striking printers have been sacked in Basingstoke by Wyndeham Impact who only made £1.5 million profit last year. Described by workers as, "Lying, evil, legalised bastard, gangsters." Text your message of support to Steve Adams UNITE FOC 07884 430305.*



Anyone got anymore on this?


----------



## BigTom (Oct 7, 2011)

What each union is doing for 30th November - should probably create a thread for the N30 strikes in the protest forum I guess, but as this isn't really news, just a list of where each union is at / when ballots finish I don't think it deserves its own thread.


----------



## weepiper (Oct 10, 2011)

'Biggest-ever strike vote announced'

Oddly neutral, almost positive tone for a torygraph article


----------



## Mapped (Oct 10, 2011)

Prospect here: Not been balloted yet about the 30th Nov, but we will be. I shall be saying a big fat YES!


----------



## hegley (Oct 10, 2011)

Unison ballot papers are going out this week - should be with everyone by 17th at the very latest.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 10, 2011)

weepiper said:


> 'Biggest-ever strike vote announced'
> 
> Oddly neutral, almost positive tone for a torygraph article



that's a very weird telegraph article.


----------



## weepiper (Oct 10, 2011)

FBU in Scotland are ballotting for the 30th.


----------



## krink (Oct 12, 2011)

Unison have sent me emails and now today a glossy magazine asking me to vote yes for strike actions to defend my pension (which, incidentally, i don't have but I'm still striking)...but no sign of a ballot yet. Anyone know when they're being sent out?


----------



## DotCommunist (Oct 12, 2011)

resident rep has received hers already


----------



## hegley (Oct 12, 2011)

krink said:


> Unison have sent me emails and now today a glossy magazine asking me to vote yes for strike actions to defend my pension (which, incidentally, i don't have but I'm still striking)...but no sign of a ballot yet. Anyone know when they're being sent out?


They were being posted yesterday, but will no doubt be staggered due to volume (and poss 2nd class post) - ballot helpline opens on 17th for those that haven't received papers due to wrong address etc (0845 355 0845).


----------



## krink (Oct 12, 2011)

cheers hegley


----------



## marty21 (Oct 12, 2011)

my branch has voted overwhelmingly to strike  waiting for the ballot form - everybody out!


----------



## butchersapron (Oct 19, 2011)

Unite now to ballot at Balfour Beatty


----------



## Voley (Oct 19, 2011)

I've had my voting papers through from Unison. Voted 'Yes'.


----------



## where to (Oct 19, 2011)

UCATT are ballotting
http://union-news.co.uk/2011/10/ucatt-ballots-for-november-30th-action/
FBU are not
http://union-news.co.uk/2011/10/no-fire-fighters-ballot-for-30th-nov-pensions-strike/

(so no firefighter, tube or rail strike unfortunately)


----------



## machine cat (Oct 19, 2011)

Got mine last week. Spoken to the very few union members here and they're all voting to strike


----------



## baldrick (Oct 19, 2011)

NVP said:


> I've had my voting papers through from Unison. Voted 'Yes'.


same here.


----------



## Mapped (Oct 19, 2011)

Still not had a ballott paper, nor has anyone else in the office. Prospect sort it out!


----------



## weepiper (Oct 22, 2011)

Scottish primary school heads are ballotting


----------



## friedaweed (Oct 22, 2011)

I'm going to strike tonight in a nice warm bath. No one is getting in with me no matter how hard my youngest tries. It is my bath and they are my warm towels on the radiator. _No pasarán_


----------



## Clint Iguana (Oct 22, 2011)

N1 Buoy said:


> Still not had a ballott paper, nor has anyone else in the office. Prospect sort it out!


the prospect ballot is not open yet...

The following unions are either engaged in live ballots at present, or expect to ballot their members shortly:
GMB: Ballot opens 31 October, closes 16 November
PCS: Ballot is live. Committed to November strike
UNITE: Ballot opens 24 October, ends mid November
NUT: Committed to further co-ordinated strikes 
NASUWT: Ballot opens 4 November, ends 17 November
ATL: Committed to further co-ordinated strikes
FDA (Civil Service union): Strike ballot announced
FBU: Making preparations for national strike action (or maybe not reading above post)

ICAC (Welsh teachers): Struck on 5 October & will join 30 November
UCU: Members in Teachers' Pension Scheme will strike again in autumn.
Chartered Society of Physiotherapy: Ballot gets underway at end of October
Prospect (Civil Service union): Ballot opens 24 October, ends 14 November.
NAHT (Head Teachers' union): Ballot opened 29 September, ends 9 November
EIS (Scottish teachers): Ballot opened 26 September, ends 3 November
NIPSA (Northern Ireland): Ballot opened 30 September


----------



## Mapped (Oct 26, 2011)

Got my ballot paper today. Voted yes and it's going in the post at lunch. Everyone I've spoken to here seems to be voting yes too


----------



## marty21 (Oct 26, 2011)

I have sent my yes vote back


----------



## krink (Nov 2, 2011)

cameron tries to avert strikes on pensions
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15549321

will this be the bit where the strike goes ahead and the govt says "well, we tried to be fair" or where the unions sell us out and agree to the improved deal?


----------



## colacubes (Nov 2, 2011)

N1 Buoy said:


> Got my ballot paper today. Voted yes and it's going in the post at lunch. Everyone I've spoken to here seems to be voting yes too



My Unite one only came yesterday for some reason.  Anyway, voted yes and in the post.


----------



## krink (Nov 3, 2011)

Unison results are due today - anyone know what time to expect the announcement? I heard maybe not until 3.00pm.


----------



## machine cat (Nov 3, 2011)

krink said:


> Unison results are due today - anyone know what time to expect the announcement? I heard maybe not until 3.00pm.



I thought the ballot ended today and results due next week?


----------



## krink (Nov 3, 2011)

Yeah i thought it was odd as the ballot only ends today but it was on bbc news earlier that the result is also announced today - either they're quick counters or there's not many to count!!


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Nov 3, 2011)

krink said:


> Yeah i thought it was odd as the ballot only ends today but it was on bbc news earlier that the result is also announced today - either they're quick counters or there's not many to count!!



ERS (who are the scrutineers) count as papers are received. They don't wait until the ballot closes and then start opening envelopes.


----------



## krink (Nov 3, 2011)

learn something new every day, cheers smokeandsteam! i hope it's a good turn out and a clear yes.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Nov 3, 2011)

krink said:


> learn something new every day, cheers smokeandsteam! i hope it's a good turn out and a clear yes.



The turnout is the one I'm looking for too. I can't remember a union ever balloting this many workers (by post) in recent times and I hear Unison's membership records are not what they might be,


----------



## hegley (Nov 3, 2011)

Well the "yes" vote is in.


----------



## hegley (Nov 3, 2011)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15570669
245,358 members voted in favour and 70,253 against ...​


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 3, 2011)

I suppose 30 percent turnout compares favourably with the average election ...


----------



## machine cat (Nov 3, 2011)

hegley said:


> Well the "yes" vote is in.


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 3, 2011)

My pay packet is going to be £100 lighter in January .. 

But then with the pension reforms they want another £500 a year from me - for less at the end.


----------



## krink (Nov 3, 2011)

mine will be 60 quid lighter right before xmas. fuck it, can't let them keep treating me like shit.


----------



## dennisr (Nov 3, 2011)

1 million UNISON members have voted for strike action - announced one day after the government 'blinks first' (its crappy 'new offer' on pensions).

So November 30th is on. All attention must now be on fighting to win the remaining ballots for an overwhelming YES vote. The preparations for the picket lines, rallies and demonstrations for N30 must continue and even be stepped up.


----------



## dennisr (Nov 3, 2011)

In addition:

*Construction electricians Unite-organised national demonstration* in London to defend the JIB agreement and stop 35% cuts in wages - Wednesday Nov 9th - Assemble 11.30am at the Shard project (St Thomas's St, nearest station London Bridge) London protest starts at 7am outside the Pinnacle in Bishopsgate. Unite are organising transport from around the country via vince.passfield@unitetheunion.org, guy.langston@unitetheunion.org or phone 0208 5969966. See reports of this week's protests via
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.182.htm
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.184.htm
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.185.htm

Wed 9th Nov *Student + Education demo* Midday ULU London and *Sparks day of action*

*Unison branch secretary Vik Chechi suspended: Solidarity still needed!*
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.177.htm

*NUJ to ballot BBC employees over service cuts and redundancies*
http://www.nuj.org.uk/innerPagenuj.html?docid=2293

*Barnsley UCU to strike against union victimisation*
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.183.htm

*RMT* today warned that London Underground are on the verge of plunging the Capital’s tube system into the same lethal cocktail of safety cuts and automation that led to nine people being killed on the Washington DC Red Line service just over two years ago:
http://www.rmt.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=151732

*TRADE UNION SUPPORT FOR St Paul's* Please sign & share backed by Mark Serwotka and John Mc Donnell...and pass it on!
http://www.petitiononline.com/tulsx/petition.html

*SUPPORT GROWS FOR SACKED TRADE UNIONIST*
MP John McDonnell has added his backing to sacked trade unionist Abdul Omer Mohsin who is going to an employment tribunal on November 7. Raymie Kiernan: raymiekiernan@gmail.com - 07920 403 766 or Abdul Omer Mohsin: omermohsin2@yahoo.co.uk - 07830 424 395

*Friday 4th Nov Jarrow march for jobs* 3pm Conel College, Tottenham
*Sat 5th Nov Jarrow march for jobs* -12 Noon Embankment http://jarrowmarch11.com

and loads more....


----------



## dennisr (Nov 3, 2011)

*Support Remploy Workers help out with building support. Come out and do a bit of leafleting:*
*Sat 5th Nov*
Hanley Potteries Shopping Centre 09.15am ST1
Derby Westfield shopping Centre London Road 12.45pm DE1
Leicester Haymarket Shopping Centre Kildare Walk 16.15pm LE1

*Sun 6th Nov*
Coventry West Orchard Shopping Centre Smithford Way 10am CV1
Milton Keynes The Centre:MK 29 Silbury Archade14.30pm MK9
Hemel Hempstead OVERNIGHT Macdonalds Hotel

*Mon 7th Nov*
Hemel Hempstead Marlow Shopping Centre 09.15am HP1 1DX
Remploy North London Hermitage Road Crusader Ind Estate 11.45am N4 1LZ 10
Downing Street Westminster


----------



## dennisr (Nov 3, 2011)

*Build up to N30*
*(I will add more as I hear about them - please add events you know about)*

*Thurs 3 Nov* Guildford & West Surrey trades council 7.30pm Launch contact Nick Trier nick@trier.org.uk or Brian Walter brian.walter@arun.gov.uk

*Friday 4th Nov* Kensington & Chelsea trades council leafleting on 5, 12, 19, 25 November contact Dave Welsh davidwelsh83@btinternet.com
Brighton & Hove Women Against the Cuts, Peace Centre 7 - 8.30pm
Unison Pre-Strike Rally All Trade Union Members Welcome, The Great Hall, Hove Town Hall, 5pm

*Tues 8 Nov* Haringey trades council public meeting 7pm Defend jobs, services and pensions contact Keith Flett keith1917@btinternet.com
Ipswich trades council public rally 7pm Organising the N30 strike contact Roger Mackay roger.mackay@ntlworld.com
Sussex + Brighton Unis Staff + Student Stop the Cuts Meeting Fulton 103 Sussex Uni Falmer Campus 6pm

*Wed 9th Nov* Brighton Trade Union Council Strike Planning 8pm King & Queen
Southwark trades council 7pm Strike rally contact Sue Plain sue.plain@southwark.gov.uk

*Thur 10th Nov* Council Reps Meeting, 4pm, Brighton Town Hall
Sheffield Trades Council Strike Together public meeting 6.30pm Ponds Forge Sports
http://sheffieldanticuts.wordpress.com/n30-pensions-dispute/n30-resources-for-activists
Greenwich & Bexley trades council public meeting 5pm Fair pensions for all contact Lynne Chamberlain lynne.windeatt@btinternet.com

*11-13 Nov & 18-20 Nov* Cities of London & Westminster long weekend leafleting actions contact Roger Sutton secretary@clwtc.org

*12 Nov* 'Give Our Youth a Future' demonstration to save children's services in Lambeth. Windrush Sq, Brixton. 1:30 PM

*Tues 15th Nov*. LINCOLN: Mark Serwotka, General Secretary of the Public and Commercial Services Union, will address a meeting of public-sector workers in Lincoln, calling on them to strike together against pension cuts.. Labour Club on Newland in Lincoln from 5.30pm to 7.30pm on Additional speakers will include a representative of the UNISON Lincolnshire Local Government branch and other local trade unionist. 6.30pm Lincoln Labour Club lincolntuc@gmail.com

*Sat 19 Nov* Lambeth TUC will have a stall in Brixton in the morning

*Sun 20th Nov* Hands Off the Ropetackle Centre 2pm Duke Of Wellington Shoreham – All day gig to save the arts centre from cuts.

*Mon 28 Nov* Lambeth TUC will host a rally in the evening – focussed on practical and workplace representatives – at the Town Hall. Lambeth TUC is working closely with the Branch Secretaries of Lambeth UNISON and Lambeth NUT

*Wed 30th Nov* Expected Public Sector Strike Meeting on Pickets from early am and/or 11:45 Victoria Gardens for Mass Demo
London rally 2.15 to 3.15pm on Victoria Embankment SERTUC and London unions will coordinate speakers - There is likely to be a march to join the rally at 2pm - provisional arrangements are assemble in Lincoln's Inn Fields from 12 noon, move off at 1pm to the Rally on the Victoria Embankment
Worthing trades council is organising a major event to take place in central Worthing on 30 Nov worthingtradescouncil@gmail.com
UNISON Area events 12 noon: GLA/Southwark near City Hall; Tower Hamlets Town Hall; Camden; Lambeth in Windrush Square; LAS HQ; Islington on the Green; Hackney Town Hall; Haringey Civic Centre
Greenwich & Bexley trades council aiming for a local rally on the morning of 30 November contact Lynne Chamberlain lynne.windeatt@btinternet.com
Hertfordshire County Association of Trades Councils is organising a march from Hartam Common to County Hall in Hertford contact Brian Ruggles brian.ruggles@hertscc.gov.uk


----------



## hegley (Nov 3, 2011)

dennisr said:


> 1 million UNISON members have voted for strike action ... So November 30th is on.



Let's hope so ... http://www.personneltoday.com/artic...on-strike-ballot-could-be-fatally-flawed.html


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 3, 2011)

I did wonder about its being challenged on technical issues - shades of the GMB ballot ...


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 3, 2011)

hegley said:


> Let's hope so ... http://www.personneltoday.com/artic...on-strike-ballot-could-be-fatally-flawed.html





Is it usual for turnouts on national strike ballots to be that low? Is there a breakdown of the figures available?


----------



## Kippa (Nov 3, 2011)

It is the Labour conference this weekend.  What are the chances of Ed fucking the unions over again and telling them not to strike?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Nov 3, 2011)

frogwoman said:


> Is it usual for turnouts on national strike ballots to be that low? Is there a breakdown of the figures available?



No. As union ballots go it's actually a fairly average turnout. You can guarantee that some members won't have received a ballot paper due to address/workplace changes. Then there will be ballot papers that weren't properly delivered by local authorities/NHS Trusts etc where members have elected to give a workplace address.

In most cases members can't be arsed to vote knowing the result is a foregone conclusion or just put it behind the clock and forget about it.

Prentis and the NEC will actually be quite pleased at the turnout imho.
I'm not sure you mean by breakdown? But normally the result on the website will just list total number of ballot papers issued, numbers voting yes and no and spoils papers. I don't know if the NEC will receive a more detailed analysis.


----------



## machine cat (Nov 3, 2011)

So now we need to start organising the pickets...


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 3, 2011)

Smokeandsteam said:


> No. As union ballots go it's actually a fairly average turnout. You can guarantee that some members won't have received a ballot paper due to address/workplace changes. Then there will be ballot papers that weren't properly delivered by local authorities/NHS Trusts etc where members have elected to give a workplace address.
> 
> In most cases members can't be arsed to vote knowing the result is a foregone conclusion or just put it behind the clock and forget about it.
> 
> ...



Fair enough. I thought it'd be something like that anyway. I meant a breakdown as in who voted in which workplace, because Im a member of Unison but my old workplace wouldn't have been ballotted because it wasn't covered under the national agreement.


----------



## articul8 (Nov 4, 2011)

hegley said:


> Let's hope so ... http://www.personneltoday.com/artic...on-strike-ballot-could-be-fatally-flawed.html


They've been taking thorough legal advice at every stage.  It would be highly vexatious step to go down that route


----------



## marty21 (Nov 4, 2011)

Going on previous experience of public sector strikes - I suspect that certain union members will try and book a day off rather than take the hit of a day's pay being lost  which imo is only slightly less scummy than actually scabbing  - The Employers should refuse all leave for that day - to force such individuals to either take the financial hit or scab - there are plenty of low paid workers who are prepared to sacrifice for the better good - I don't see why those sneaks take the day off - and pretend to be supporting the strike when they blatantly aren't...

rant over


----------



## belboid (Nov 4, 2011)

Kippa said:


> It is the Labour conference this weekend. What are the chances of Ed fucking the unions over again and telling them not to strike?


The other Ed (Balls) was shockingly not entirely shit on Question TIme last night, said it was the Tories (effectively) demanding a strike now. Almost sounded like he would actually support the strike!



articul8 said:


> They've been taking thorough legal advice at every stage. It would be highly vexatious step to go down that route


Sadly, that's hardly likely to stop some twat from Tory-On-Thameshire from launching an objection tho. 

In better news.... Scottish teachers will be out as well! 82% in favour on a 54% turnout


----------



## weepiper (Nov 4, 2011)

I'll be taking the day off work then cos the schools will be shut. bugger, can't really afford to but nonetheless totally support and understand the reasons for the strike.


----------



## Mapped (Nov 4, 2011)

marty21 said:


> Going on previous experience of public sector strikes - I suspect that certain union members will try and book a day off rather than take the hit of a day's pay being lost  which imo is only slightly less scummy than actually scabbing - The Employers should refuse all leave for that day - to force such individuals to either take the financial hit or scab - there are plenty of low paid workers who are prepared to sacrifice for the better good - I don't see why those sneaks take the day off - and pretend to be supporting the strike when they blatantly aren't...
> 
> rant over



Does a leave ban not already happen in most organisations? We're already not allowed to book leave for that day and our unions' votes aren't in yet. Every time I've been on strike in other orgs they've stopped people taking leave unless it's been booked way in advance. This behaviour seems to piss the employers off as well; you are either on strike or you're not.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 4, 2011)

There's an annual leave ban throughout the local authority i work for.


----------



## baldrick (Nov 4, 2011)

here too.  we haven't been able to book leave on the 30th Nov for about a month now.


----------



## nightbreed (Nov 4, 2011)

*Unison strike ballot could be 'fatally flawed'*

Laura Chamberlain 03 November 2011 15:58




*EXCLUSIVE *
*The Unison ballot, in which members voted yes to a strike over public sector pensions, could be "fatally flawed", meaning that employers could put a stop to the planned "day of action" on 30 November.*



*Employment lawyer Chris Mordue explains why he believes the Unison ballot was flawed*

Unison members voted "overwhelmingly" in favour of the strike action in a ballot that closed today over proposed reforms to their pension schemes, with 245,358 public sector workers voting to strike and 70,253 voting against action.
But, according to Chris Mordue, employment partner at law firm Pinsent Masons, public sector employers could challenge the ballot due to errors in the notifications sent to employers.
Mordue claims that the Unison ballot notice said nothing about the aggregated ballot they undertook - where the votes of Unison members from a number of employers are all counted together - but indicated that they would be holding a single employer ballot.
If an employer challenged the ballot on this basis and was successful, members of Unison, the biggest public sector union, would not be able to take part in the strike action at the end of the month, he claimed.
Mordue explained: "Unison has just announced the results of the biggest industrial action ballot ever conducted, but the sheer scale of the ballot could have made it unlawful.
"The ballot notices breach the legal rules on strike ballots and leave the union open to challenge. If successful, this would be a 'showstopper' as far as Unison's participation in the mass day of action planned for 30 November is concerned. The same issue may also invalidate ballots by other unions, such as the GMB and Unite, and prevent them striking too."
A spokesman at Unison said that the ballot was legal and the union had followed all of the legal requirements.
Marc Meryon, head of industrial relations at law firm Eversheds, cast doubt on Mordue's claims.
"Whilst the union has to decide at the outset whether it is aggregating the ballot across different employers it is under no obligation when giving notice to specify whether the ballot is aggregated or not," Meryon argued. "That may only become apparent when the employer is given the result.
"Moreover, even if the ballot is aggregated, the obligation on the union is to provide specified information in relation to the relevant employer and so one would expect the wording to address itself to that employer."
Yesterday, public sector unions said that they were "firmly committed" to continuing preparations for the planned strike action at the end of this month, despite a new offer from the Government on the pension reforms.
The offer included a more generous accrual rate, alongside the protection of pensions for any public service worker within 10 years of their pension age.
However, the TUC's Public Services Liaison Group said that unless progress was made in the negotiations, plans for a "day of action" at the end of this month would go ahead.


bookmark it! diggit! reddit!To top


----------



## marty21 (Nov 4, 2011)

I hope I'm wrong about the leave thing - just heard about a few at my place - in other offices - I hope that bosses enforce the no leave rule -


----------



## machine cat (Nov 4, 2011)

No leave ban at my place afaik, but a couple of people have talked about taking the day off "to do their bit" - by which I suspect they mean go shopping or sit at home watching TV


----------



## dennisr (Nov 7, 2011)

nightbreed said:


> *Unison strike ballot could be 'fatally flawed'*



Attempting to stop the action by legal games will be fatally flawed.


----------



## dennisr (Nov 7, 2011)

*This friday and sat a 48 hour strike by RMT Cleaners : *
* http://www.rmt.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=151798*

*There will be picket lines at depots and many stations along the Virgin West Coast Mainline route.*


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 7, 2011)

it's amazing how stringent these people apply electoral standards- to anyone other than themselves obv


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 7, 2011)

dennisr said:


> Attempting to stop the action by legal games will be fatally flawed.



As it goes there's a few on UNISONs Left who think it could be flawed. Two leading UNISON lefts up here ahve said they're leadership are 'winging it'. I think the Mordue fella is well off beam. But i'm pretty sure he's flying a kite for employers to attack the ballot. Just pointing it out as a concerned citizen of course....


----------



## dennisr (Nov 8, 2011)

NISPSA vote for action: http://www.nipsa.org.uk/Campaigns/P...ns-and-Circulars/Industrial-Action-Ballot-(1)


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 9, 2011)

*Head teachers vote for strike action over pensions*







 Head teachers will be joining their staff in industrial action over pension changes
Thousands of head teachers in England and Wales have voted in favour of strike action over changes to pensions.
Members of the National Association of Head Teachers (NAHT) will now join thousands of other public sector workers on strike on 30 November.
It is the first time the NAHT has taken such action in its 114-year history.
The strike, which is also being supported by teachers and support staff, is likely to see thousands of primary and secondary schools closed.

*Pupils' learning will be disrupted and working parents will be inconvenienced as they make arrangements for childcare on that Wednesday.*

The teaching profession is angered by planned government changes to the teachers' pension scheme (TPS) which, it says, will mean teachers working longer, paying more and receiving less when they retire.

Nice sneaky bit of propaganda by the beeb in the middle ...


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 9, 2011)

http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/ar...ranson-not-stopping-low-pay-of-train-cleaners

Strike on thursday and friday


----------



## dennisr (Nov 9, 2011)

Pretty good turnout as well:

*NAHT Ballot result*

* Ballot result shows overwhelming ‘YES’ vote. The result of the industrial action ballot in England and Wales over pensions is as follows:*

* Total no of votes cast: 13101 (53.6% turnout)*

* Thosevoting ‘Yes’: 9919 (75.8% of valid vote)*

* Those voting ‘No’: 3169 (24.2% of valid vote)*

* Total no of spoiled voting papers: 13*


----------



## colacubes (Nov 9, 2011)

I have now received my 3rd ballot paper   Apparently they've somehow fucked up the papers for our branch. Twice   Apparently the wrong ballots will be discarded but it's getting a bit fucking ridiculous.  I hope it's isolated.  Our branch is only about 20 members but tis slightly worrying.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 9, 2011)

Is there any strike action planned by the BBC?

Oh and Big lolz how they are sneaking in this propaganda, as if it is facts when it's just someone's opinion inserted into the article. I wouldn't expect to read an article on the bbc website saying, "Headteachers are set to take strike action, a sign of the immiseration of the petite bourgeoisie as Marx predicted".  You expect that in a paper or someone's blog but not something with a pretense to neutrality.


----------



## Sophie at large (Nov 11, 2011)

Your not thinking about traveling this month are you? Strikes galore at
spam


----------



## belboid (Nov 11, 2011)

frogwoman said:


> Is there any strike action planned by the BBC?


according to the local rep at a Sheffield pre-strike rally type thing last night (which was very good, 500ish people there, which made up for thee being 10, _ten_, people on the platform) strikes are brewing. Cuts aplenty ahead, especially around local radio (Radio Sheffield will only make 8 hours of a programme a day as opposed to 16 currently if proposed cuts go ahead) which is likely to kick off in the new year


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 14, 2011)

FDA and Prospect (civil service unions) also voted yes to strike 30th November.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 14, 2011)

26 unions supporting strike action - http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...ex.cfm/id/51067898-6F26-4E57-98A7A9D132F83C5C


----------



## where to (Nov 14, 2011)

*Demos and rallies on the 30th...*

*Aberdeen* – 11am, assemble at the St. Nicholas Graveyard, Union Street, AB11 6BH. 12 noon, rally at Castlegate, Castle Street, AB11 5BB.
*Bathgate* – 10am-2pm rally at Fairway Hotel, EH48 1BA.
*Barnsley* – 10am, demonstration in Churchfield road, S70 2JT. 10.30am, rally at YMCA, Blucher Street, S70 1AP.
*Belfast* - noon, four feeder marches assemble at: Central Railway Station, Bridge Street, BT1 3PB; Mater Hospital, Crumlin Road, BT14 7AB; Royal Victoria Hospital, Grosvenor Road, BT12 6BA; City Hospital, Lisburn Rd, Belfast, County Antrim BT9 7ER. They will march to a rally at 1pm at Belfast City Hall, Donegall Square, BT1 5GS.
*Birmingham* - 12.30pm, assemble for march and rally at the National Indoor Arena, King Edwards Road, B1 2AA.
*Bolton* - 11.30am, rally at Victoria Square, BL1 1RU. 12.30pm march to Derby Ward Labour Club, Deane Road, BL3 5AH, for rally at 1pm.
*Bradford* - 11am, rally at Centenary Square, BD1 1HY.
*Brighton* – 11.30am, assemble at Victoria Gardens, BN2 1UG. March to The Level, BN1 4SB, for rally at 1pm.
*Bristol* - 11am, assemble at College Green, BS1 5TA. March to Castle Park, Castle Street, BS1 3XD.
*Cardiff* - noon, assemble at Cathays Park, CF10 3AT, for march to a rally at 1pm at the SWALEC stadium, Sophia Gardens, CF11 9XR.
*Chester* - noon, assemble at Castle Drive, CH1 1SL for march to Guildhall, Watergate Street, CH1 2LA, stopping at the Chester Cross junction, CH1 1PD, at 1pm for a protest.
*Derry* - 1pm, rally at the Peace Bridge over the River Foyle.
*Dumfries *– 10am, rally outside the Council Offices, English street, DG1 2DD. 10.45am, indoor rally at the Cairndale Hotel, English St, DG1 2DF.
*Dundee* – noon, assemble at the west gate of Dudhope Park, DD1 5RE. March to rally in City Square, DD1 3BA for 12.30pm.
*Edinburgh* - 11.30am, assemble outside Usher Hall, Lothian Road, EH1 2EA.
*Falkirk* - noon, St Martha's Hall, Hope Street, FK1 5AT.
*Glasgow* – 12.30pm, march assembles Shuttle Street, G1 1QA. 1.15pm, rally at Barrowlands Ballroom, 244 Gallowgate, G4 0TT.
*Glenrothes* - 10.30am, rally outside Fife House, North Street, KY7 9TB.
*Halifax* - 10am, assemble at Town Hall, Crossley Street, HX1 1UJ.
*Hastings* – 11.30am, assemble at Hastings Pier, 34 White Rock, TN34 1JY, before marching to the Town centre. Rally, to take place after the march, in Robertson Street, TN34 1H; between Debenhams and the Havelock public house.
*Huddersfield* - 10.30am, assemble at St George's Square, HD1 1JA, march around the town centre followed by a rally.
*Hull* – 11am, rally at the Queen’s Gardens, Paragon Street, HU1 3NA.
*Inverness* – 12 noon, short march and rally at Mercure Hotel, Church Street, IV1 1QY.
*Leeds* - noon, rally outside the Art Gallery, The Headrow, LS1 5RG.
*Leicester* – 12.30pm, rally at The Athena, Queen Street, LE1 1QD.
*Liverpool* - 11.30am, assemble at Derby Square L2 9XW. March to 1pm rally outside St George's Hall, St George's Place, L1 1JJ.
*London* - noon, assemble at Lincoln's Inn Fields, WC2A 3PE. March to the Victoria Embankment, WC2N 6NU, for a rally at 2pm.
*Maidstone* – 1pm, rally at County Hall, ME14 1XD.
*Manchester* - 11am, assemble at Liverpool Road, M3 4JR, and march to a rally at 12.30pm in Whitworth Park, Oxford Road, M15 6ER.
*Milton Keynes* – noon, assemble at Campbell Park, MK9 3FZ. Rally at noon outside the Civic Offices, Silbury Boulevard, Milton Keynes, MK9 3EJ.
*Motherwell* - noon, rally at North Lanarkshire council building, Windmillhill Street, ML1 1AB.
*Nottingham* – 12.30pm, rally at The Albert Hall, North Circus Street, NG1 5AA.
*Rotherham* – 10am, assemble at Rotherham Town Hall, Moorgate Street, S60 2RB. 10.30am, march to rally in All Saints Square, S60 1QX.
*Salford* - 11.30am, assemble at Bexley Square to march to rally in Manchester. M3 6BZ.
*Sheffield* - 11am, rally at the Peace Gardens, Pinstone Street,S1 2HH.
*Telford* – 12.30pm, rally at Cordingley Hall, Wellington Road, TF2 8JS.

http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/campaigns/30-november/n30events.cfm


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 14, 2011)

A little story about the Glasgow event. The local Trades Council wanted a limit to 6 speakers (fair enough) but they wanted 3 union reps and 3 STUC bigwigs. They wanted a fucking speakers line up that might not have had 1 single striking worker on it. They then told PCS who was to be our speaker..... These cunts have got some cheek frankly.

Btw, when UNISON, GMB, and UNITE mentioned at Congress House that they were going to ballot Brendan Barbers first words were 'What is your exit strategy'...... This fucker will want to milk it on the 30th of course.....


----------



## BigTom (Nov 16, 2011)

GMB vote 83% yes, 33% turnout

INTO (Irish teachers union) vote yes 87%, 44% turnout

UCATT 83% on 27% turnout

Unite supposed to declare today, NASUWT tomorrow.. then I think that's all the unions, though I've not heard about FBU..
Mostly pretty big mandates for the unions for 30th Nov, though of course being rubbished by the government.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 16, 2011)

Crackin' news!


----------



## baldrick (Nov 16, 2011)

is it weird to be looking forward to a strike?


----------



## Mapped (Nov 16, 2011)

baldrick said:


> is it weird to be looking forward to a strike?



If it is I'm weird. I've not had a good strike for ages


----------



## BigTom (Nov 16, 2011)

Unite delayed until tomorrow, apparently 5 other unions declare tomorrow as well, though aside from NASUWT and maybe FBU I don't know who they are.


----------



## weepiper (Nov 16, 2011)

Nearly a third of MSP's vote to 'strike' on the 30th in solidarity with the unions. SNP get round it by suggesting parliament should sit in a debate condemning the 'misguided' pension plans.


----------



## krink (Nov 17, 2011)

does anyone have the info about if/when an individual employee has to say if they are taking part in the strike?


----------



## krink (Nov 17, 2011)

it's ok found it. individual employees are not required to inform their bosses even if their bosses ask them. the union tells them they are having a strike and the bosses have to assume the union members will be on strike, apparently. where this leaves non-union workers is not clear as people will not work that day even though not in the union at the time.


----------



## krink (Nov 17, 2011)

gmb voted yes i see


----------



## krink (Nov 17, 2011)

this is a nice quick guide to striking and your rights etc

http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/department...n/advice-for-members-taking-strike-action.cfm


----------



## belboid (Nov 17, 2011)

Unite vote 3-1 in favour of sttrike action, 31% turnout.

Over 200 single employer ballots are also taking place, with positive results already in for workers in Mersey Tunnels, Greater Manchester Transport, Glasgow city council, Scottish Water, West Midlands Police Authority, Northern Ireland bus services, Cardiff buses, the British Film Institute, the British Museum and South Yorkshire Police.


----------



## treelover (Nov 17, 2011)

This realy is turning into a (public sector) general strike and this time no students to act as strikebreakers, etc!


----------



## belboid (Nov 17, 2011)

add in the National Association of Probation Officers - 4-1 on 45% turnout.  Only their third ever national strike


----------



## dennisr (Nov 17, 2011)

krink said:


> gmb voted yes i see



Indeed:

_GMB members working in local government, the NHS and the civil service across England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland have voted by more than 4 to 1 in favour of strike action on 30 November to defend their pensions._

_Turnout was 33% across all GMB members balloted in the many thousands of employers across UK. GMB is now conveying the results to these employers and GMB members who were balloted. The full results will be published on GMB website http://www.gmb.org.uk/ in due course._

_Brian Strutton GMB National Secretary for public services said “*GMB members have resoundingly said “Yes” to strike action and “No” to the government’s raid on their pensions.*_


----------



## dennisr (Nov 17, 2011)

belboid said:


> add in the National Association of Probation Officers - 4-1 on 45% turnout. Only their third ever national strike



And even the FDA!

_"In a ballot turnout of 54%, FDA members have voted decisively in favour of industrial action, in the current dispute over the Government's plans to reform public sector pension arrangements, the union said today. 81% of those who voted were in favour of industrial action. The FDA is likely at a meeting tomorrow to call upon its members to take strike action as part of the TUC Day of Action on 30 November."_


----------



## dennisr (Nov 17, 2011)

Key one:

Members of the union Unitewho work in the public sector have voted resoundingly in favour of industrial action to defend their pensions.
Three in four of Unite members who voted have said `yes' to joining the national day of action on November 30.
In Unite's three main aggregate ballots of health, civil serviceand local authority workers, 75 per cent of Unite members voted in favour of action on a turnout of 31 per cent.
*From a Unite press release*

For more info see: http://*www.unitetheunion.org/news__events/latest_news/unite_votes_yes.aspx*


----------



## belboid (Nov 17, 2011)

bit late there, den...


----------



## BigTom (Nov 18, 2011)

PCS HMRC call centre staff vote to strike over privatisation

Not November 30th stuff, but a 70% vote for strike over plans to allow private companies to do call centre work for hmrc.


----------



## weepiper (Nov 18, 2011)

NASUWT vote 82% in favour of a strike on a 40% turnout. 91% in favour of action short of a strike


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 18, 2011)

That's every school in the country out then.


----------



## BigTom (Nov 18, 2011)

Yep, every teaching union except the scab union Voice (who have a no strike policy) and ASCL who didn't ballot.
Even so, every school will be closed. Great news.


----------



## machine cat (Nov 18, 2011)

Details of some events up to and including the 30th: http://falseeconomy.org.uk/nov30/uk/all


----------



## BigTom (Nov 18, 2011)

Since pretty much everyone has declared now, I've started a thread for the 30th November so that this one can return to it's original purpose for detailing other strikes that are going on..

and I bet that this thread gets more discussion about the 30th than the new one


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 18, 2011)

What's voice? Never heard of them.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 18, 2011)

BigTom said:


> Yep, every teaching union except the scab union Voice (who have a no strike policy) and ASCL who didn't ballot.
> Even so, every school will be closed. Great news.



It's weird, I had aways thought that ATL was the scab union. Was i confusing it with ascl?


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 18, 2011)

> We prefer the force of argument rather than the argument of force." At Voice, we believe in the power of negotiation to protect the interests of our members – who never resort to strikes or other forms of industrial action.



well they sound shit


----------



## BigTom (Nov 18, 2011)

well, ATL don't usually strike - last time was the 60s or 70s, which is why it was such a surprise that they went on strike on 30th June.
Voice however, as DC has shown, have a no strike policy. They will not strike, ever.
They come in for some abuse for this
It's a proper joke really. They claim to have 35,000 members, and the general secretary gets offended when you call them scabs & is seemingly unable to understand the point of a strike (claiming it's to gain publicity).
tossers one and all. who the fuck joins a union that won't strike under any circumstance? What is the point of that?

e2a: ASCL are the Association of School and College Leaders and they are the only other education union that I know of that didn't ballot for action, but I don't think they are really seen as the no-strike union for heads/deputies to join since the NAHT will be taking it's first strike in history (114 years) on 30th November.


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 18, 2011)

BigTom said:


> well, ATL don't usually strike - last time was the 60s or 70s, which is why it was such a surprise that they went on strike on 30th June.
> Voice however, as DC has shown, have a no strike policy. They will not strike, ever.
> They come in for some abuse for this
> It's a proper joke really. They claim to have 35,000 members, and the general secretary gets offended when you call them scabs & is seemingly unable to understand the point of a strike (claiming it's to gain publicity).
> tossers one and all. who the fuck joins a union that won't strike under any circumstance? What is the point of that?



its a retainer for legal advice/repping should it be needed. So the _individuals  _benefits of unionising but none of the responsibilities.


----------



## BigTom (Nov 18, 2011)

oh yeah, Voice also have advice on their website telling members to cross picket lines, and that they can do extra duties if they are asked. proper scabs, not just unions that will only strike in what they see as extreme circumstances.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 18, 2011)

BigTom said:


> oh yeah, Voice also have advice on their website telling members to cross picket lines, and that they can do extra duties if they are asked. proper scabs, not just unions that will only strike in what they see as extreme circumstances.



Yeah, I was just looking at this:



> “Members should do the work they normally undertake and are contracted to do, as reasonably instructed by their head teacher or line manager, and no more.  This includes support staff, who should continue with their own duties and not cover classes for a teacher who is on strike, unless they are specifically employed as a cover supervisor and are directed to provide cover.



mind you all a bit academic if the headteachers are on strike as well


----------



## Santino (Nov 18, 2011)

To give them their due, Voice do encourage their members to mutter under their breath if they are unhappy with something.


----------



## belboid (Nov 18, 2011)

BigTom said:


> oh yeah, Voice also have advice on their website telling members to cross picket lines, and that they can do extra duties if they are asked. proper scabs, not just unions that will only strike in what they see as extreme circumstances.


is Voice what was the Professional Association of Teachers?

they actually appear to be telling their members _not_ to do any work but there own (ooh, so radical!)

"However, while we do not take or support industrial action, we respect the right of others to do so. Voice members should therefore not do their colleagues’ work except in exceptional circumstances, such as where the safety of children might be jeopardised. "


----------



## Mapped (Nov 18, 2011)

Why are they being so shit? My mum works in a posh girls school and even her union are out on strike on the 30th


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 18, 2011)

god they seem fucking obsessed with strikes.


----------



## belboid (Nov 18, 2011)

They're a tiny union in a 'profession.'  That there are quite a few idiot tories in said profession with the sense of solidarity of a sausage, shouldn't really be a surprise


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 18, 2011)

^^^ They were getting a hefty slagging off on Twitter a few days ago, & rightly fuckin' so!


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 18, 2011)




----------



## weepiper (Nov 22, 2011)

Scottish Secondary Teachers Association vote yes by 80% on a 66% turnout


----------



## weepiper (Nov 24, 2011)

Got an email from the school today:



> *All education establishments in Edinburgh will be closed* to children and young people on Wednesday 30
> November.
> This decision has been taken by the Council because of the planned widespread industrial action by a number of
> public sector trade unions that day.
> ...


----------



## machine cat (Nov 24, 2011)

NUT reps in Halifax schools refusing to tell management how many staff will walk out next week (It's a lot  ).

At my workplace:

Tried to pursued colleagues again to go out but after countering the usual excuses they have decided to "wait for the next one"  Have however seen a lot of union propaganda floating around so I know I'm not the only person trying to get people out. There is also very little communication between unions as people in Unite and Prospect are not aware of the picket


----------



## Pinette (Nov 25, 2011)

My two older primary school grandchildren cannot go to school on Wed but the little one - aged 3 - will go to her nursery school which is attached to the main school.  I simply don't understand this.  It seems rather strange.  I thought it might be a fun day off for all of us. (I know, I know, it's not about 'fun' - but...)  Does anyone have an inkling of why this has happened? Reading the posts above makes me think that the nursery people belong to a different union perhaps.


----------



## Grandma Death (Nov 26, 2011)

Has anyone got a list of the unions striking with the ballot results and turnouts?


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 26, 2011)

Today the government are threatening that if the strike goes ahead the 'fairer' deal offered will be withdrawn. So that'll be the deal already rejected, that you are threatening to take away? 'We'll take back something you already didn't accept'

So clearly not actually aimed at convincing unions but at cosying up to middle england with how big their balls are.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 26, 2011)

Grandma Death said:


> Has anyone got a list of the unions striking with the ballot results and turnouts?



http://www.pcsoel.co.uk/blog/?p=542

Can't find an updated list.


----------



## BigTom (Nov 26, 2011)

Grandma Death said:


> Has anyone got a list of the unions striking with the ballot results and turnouts?



http://birminghamagainstthecuts.wor...ember-strike-day/30th-november-union-ballots/

has 28 unions listed - think there are 30 on strike, the list is missing CWU, as their TV licence people are missing.. no idea which other union is absent


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 26, 2011)

Ta for that.


----------



## extra dry (Nov 26, 2011)

not long to go to the day...wonder how much will be covered in press


----------



## BigTom (Nov 26, 2011)

extra dry said:


> not long to go to the day...wonder how much will be covered in press



loads I reckon.. in birmingham we had BBC Radio 4 recording our public meeting on Thursday,Channel 4 news are following some workers around, Unison have said they've never had this much interest in anything before.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 26, 2011)

The BBC are filming at 3 different locations in Brighton.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 26, 2011)

Grandma Death said:


> Has anyone got a list of the unions striking with the ballot results and turnouts?


This has 26.  http://www.leftfutures.org/2011/11/twenty-five-unions-preparing-to-strike/


----------



## treelover (Nov 27, 2011)

'Unison have said they've never had this much interest in anything before'

'Not suprised this is going to be big, the public can suppport it too...

'On November 30th, show the government that we are all in this together — _against them_ — by taking a flask of hot solidariTEA to people the picket lines. Discover your nearest picket by checking out False Economy, N30 Strike or contacting your local branch of one of the striking unions. And later on in the day, why not join one of the marches listed on False Economy or Right to Work?'


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 27, 2011)

beautiful


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 27, 2011)

I'm off to give out leaflets in a bit


----------



## treelover (Nov 27, 2011)

'These strikes aren't just about pensions - they are about a sustained attack on the Public Sector that the Tories launched as soon as they came into office.

With the help of the media, Public Sector workers have been belittled, demonised and ridiculed. Our teachers, nurses, doctors, passport officials, bin men, even the bloody police.
It's time to make a stand - for pensions, yes, but also for _all _of the public sector.
*30th November - STRIKE.*
...and remember:
Never Cross A Picket Line'

from CIF, it has had 5600 recommends, most i think a post has ever had...


----------



## treelover (Nov 28, 2011)

The MSM seems to be wheeling out all sorts of private sector workers opposed to the strike, arguing on the grounds of ''I have seen my pension reduced so why should they have no cuts to theirs'', classic 'race to the bottom' stuff which the tv interviewers/journalists always seem to not interrogate...


----------



## cantsin (Nov 28, 2011)

really made up my wife/kids  ( tiny ) school has decided at the last minute to come out ( it only took 4 teachers to close it down ) - as a part time admin / non union member ( not her fault tbf , the other two full time admins aren't unionised, and are working weds ) I think the wife may effectively be on a wildcat one, but there's no stopping her...


----------



## trevhagl (Nov 28, 2011)

encouraging stuff, you can only take the piss for so long . Many staff are on a 3 year pay freeze already which is basically the govt stealing about 5% of their wages every year till 2014 , so its a wonder this hasn't happened before now


----------



## Balbi (Nov 28, 2011)

I'm being interviewed by the BBC on Weds morning - they want an angry  young  teacher  to talk about the impact of the proposed changes.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 28, 2011)

Balbi said:


> I'm being interviewed by the BBC on Weds morning - they want an angry  young  teacher  to talk about the impact of the proposed changes.



good, hopefully this will redress the balance a bit!


----------



## Balbi (Nov 28, 2011)

Now, do I try and sell them a paper on air?


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 28, 2011)

Balbi said:


> Now, do I try and sell them a paper on air?



yes.


----------



## Balbi (Nov 28, 2011)

I'd better work up some decent soundbites for them.


----------



## Kaka Tim (Nov 28, 2011)

Government depsreately gobbing off about Union militants.
*One* day strike in response to a massive cuts on workers pensions - ITS RED ROBBO ALL OVER AGAIN!!!

Laughable.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 28, 2011)

Kaka Tim said:


> Government depsreately gobbing off about Union militants.
> *One* day strike in response to a massive cuts on workers pensions - ITS RED ROBBO ALL OVER AGAIN!!!
> 
> Laughable.



I'd like to know how that nobhead Gove managed to go from being a union activist in his younger years to being what he is now - a nobhead (of epically wet-lipped proportions, I might add. The chapped freak ). Does anybody have the unfortunate experience of knowing what he was like in those days? There must be a rational explanation. Mustn't there?


----------



## cantsin (Nov 28, 2011)

UK Uncuts short / sweet summary of n30 :
UKuncut UK Uncut  

Remember when Teachers and Nurses crashed the stock market, wiped out banks, took billions in bonuses and paid no tax? No, me neither#*strike*


----------



## grogwilton (Nov 28, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I'd like to know how that nobhead Gove managed to go from being a union activist in his younger years to being what he is now - a nobhead (of epically wet-lipped proportions, I might add. The chapped freak ). Does anybody have the unfortunate experience of knowing what he was like in those days? There must be a rational explanation. Mustn't there?



He wasn't a union activist. He started work as a journalist somewhere and after about a week after he started coincidentally they had a strike which was quite solid and as a newby he struck to so as not to look bad. If he had that lack of interpersonal skills to scab a week into a new job he wouldn't have made it to being a minister, even in the Tory Party.


----------



## grogwilton (Nov 28, 2011)

Oh and strong support for strike: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15910621


----------



## BigTom (Nov 28, 2011)

Unilever workers vote to strike over closure of final salary pension scheme


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 28, 2011)

We had a planning meeting for the strike just now


----------



## Grandma Death (Nov 29, 2011)

http://www.unitetheunion.org/news__events/latest_news/unilever_told__hands_off_our_p.aspx

First national strike in the private sector over pensions. Kinda blows away the usual cliches about public sector workers being greedy.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 29, 2011)

Balbi said:


> I'd better work up some decent soundbites for them.


"Osborne can cunt off".


----------



## belboid (Nov 29, 2011)

grogwilton said:


> He wasn't a union activist. He started work as a journalist somewhere and after about a week after he started coincidentally they had a strike which was quite solid and as a newby he struck to so as not to look bad. If he had that lack of interpersonal skills to scab a week into a new job he wouldn't have made it to being a minister, even in the Tory Party.


he was still a labour voter at that point, his folks are proper old fashgioned labour people, and he used to go leafletting for them


----------



## malatesta32 (Nov 29, 2011)

cantsin said:


> UK Uncuts short / sweet summary of n30 :
> UKuncut UK Uncut
> 
> Remember when Teachers and Nurses crashed the stock market, wiped out banks, took billions in bonuses and paid no tax? No, me neither#*strike*



i blame the muslamics!


----------



## Spanky Longhorn (Nov 29, 2011)

frogwoman said:


> We had a planning meeting for the strike just now



It used to be that people went to the pub after a meeting like that, now they rush home and post on the internet about it.


----------



## BigTom (Nov 29, 2011)

Spanky Longhorn said:


> It used to be that people went to the pub after a meeting like that, now they rush home and post on the internet about it.


Perhaps she was in the pub, on her phone...


----------



## temper_tantrum (Nov 29, 2011)

Sorry if this has been mentioned already, but (question from a friend): can non-union members strike?
(Yes, I know the best thing to do is to tell them to join the union, but, y'know ...  )


----------



## malatesta32 (Nov 29, 2011)

temper_tantrum said:


> Sorry if this has been mentioned already, but (question from a friend): can non-union members strike?
> (Yes, I know the best thing to do is to tell them to join the union, but, y'know ...  )



calling in sick, go slows, lateness, encouraging absenteeism in others, doing yr job badly - i mean even more than usual.


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 29, 2011)

They can, but they don't receive the legal protection so can be disciplined for it.


----------



## The Black Hand (Nov 29, 2011)

Letter sent for publication to a regional paper today;

As usual the right wing dress up as the spokesman of the 'public' when they try to weaken the support for strike action generally, and the November 30th strike. However, the public speaks with its feet, the greater than 80% participation in the strike on June 30th is likely to be exceeded on November 30th, and the 80% was larger than the number who voted for it. 

Right whingers forget the realities of democracy when having a go at their usual targets, the Trade Unions, and the Labour party. However, do the Tories have ANY legitimacy when they only have 23% of eligible votes backing them in 1 poll on May 6th 2010? They certainly are widely despised with the Liberals hated even more, & the government does not have a mandate for a lot of its programme as it was not public eg. the NHS changes, and an election now would certainly give a different result. 

The right wingers should also remember that if the left and Trade unions are destroyed, then it is the anarchists who are the ones who will gain, as anarchist critique of capitalism becomes more valid. 

So, the pension cuts are portrayed as unaffordable but really these cuts are to make the workers pay even more for the bosses mistakes, they are central to the government’s wider assault on ordinary people. It wants workers to pay for the global crisis of capitalism. 

The reality is that the NUT has calculated that at current prices £46 billion more has been paid into the teachers pension scheme than has ever been taken out, and the government has already looted the NUM pension fund too. The PCS calculates that its average member get approx £4,200 a year, and when you compare this with the Eton Tory boys - Cameron, Osbourne, Johnson etc gold plated pensions of approx  £30K a year then you can see there is vast differences - we are not 'all in the same boat'. 

Workers are right to strike to defend themselves, and workers know that the damage to the economy is small with the greater damage being done by the government cuts. Also, we are all given a day off for the Royal Wedding and nobody bats an _economic eye _at the damage to the economy then, so people know they are being attacked for trying to defend themselves rather than economic reality.

The working class is being attacked on many fronts; the youth and students, workers, unemployed, disabled and the retired, and the only reply is for us to unite and struggle to get the outcomes we all want. The alternative is that if you do not fight you will lose, and potentially we can all win or at least have a better settlement.


----------



## Athos (Nov 29, 2011)

I just went to my daughter's school to explain that she won't be coming in tomorrow, despite the school being kept open (by teachers breaking the strike).  They looked at me like I was talking a different language; just couldn't comprehend what I was saying.


----------



## dennisr (Nov 29, 2011)

‎"Workers in Bangladesh have organised a walk-out tomorrow in solidarity with British strikers. #n30"

Don'task me the details though - I don't know them


----------



## dennisr (Nov 29, 2011)

temper_tantrum said:


> Sorry if this has been mentioned already, but (question from a friend): can non-union members strike?
> (Yes, I know the best thing to do is to tell them to join the union, but, y'know ...  )



You can join a union that is striking (if you have a public sector pension etc) even on the picket line! Keep a copy of the application form which has the date and signature.
You don't have to have a public sector pension to go on strike, just be employed by an employer that has been notified by a union that it intends to call their members on strike and then join that union! Simples.


----------



## Zabo (Nov 29, 2011)

temper_tantrum said:


> Sorry if this has been mentioned already, but (question from a friend): can non-union members strike?
> (Yes, I know the best thing to do is to tell them to join the union, but, y'know ...  )



You don't have to be anything including being employed. Just find yourself a picket line and join in by offering your support to the cause.

It's called solidarity.


----------



## dennisr (Nov 29, 2011)

Zabo said:


> You don't have to be anything including being employed. Just find yourself a picket line and join in by offering your support to the cause.
> 
> It's called solidarity.



and bring a flask of coffee or tea if its early morning if you can - that's called liquid solidarity


----------



## Zabo (Nov 29, 2011)

And don't forget the biscuits!


----------



## dennisr (Nov 29, 2011)

dark choc digestives please


----------



## Zabo (Nov 29, 2011)

Just found this on Yahoo News. Had to do a double take at first.

"Before you decide you're against this strike, ask yourself one simple question.


You'll have trouble dropping off your children at school next Wednesday. If you're taken ill, you may have trouble getting an appointment in hospital. The rubbish might not be collected. The fire service might be disrupted.

Up to two million public sector workers will be out on strike, probably the most widespread industrial action this country has seen since the winter of discontent. At first you'll be angry. Your already stressful day will have been made even more difficult by people you rely on. But before you decide you're against this strike please ask yourself one question: would you care if a banker went on a walkout?

I'll go ahead and presume your answer was no. The very fact that this strike inconveniences you demonstrates the value of the public sector. These are the people who look after us; our children, our property and our streets. Their reward is to be libelled every day in the press for their 'gold-plated pensions'. Their demands for their employer to abide by the terms of their original contract are treated like special interest pleading. Private sector workers are propagandised against them, encouraged to desire public sector impoverishment rather than to fight for their own working conditions to be improved. The classic tactic of divide and rule is alive and well in the British class system.

That's not the case for all those people whose labour accomplishes nothing, apart from the occasional sabotage of the world economy. Executive pay rises ever upwards, regardless of results. The recent Fair Pay Commission report found the top Barclays salary rose 4,899.4% since 1980, compared to a threefold increase in its average wages. Thomas Cook, which is doing so well it is now staring into the abyss, was paying chief executive Manny Fontenla-Novoa £2.27 million last year, including a £1.19 million performance bonus and £338,000 in share options.

What about the government negotiating team, which so reasonably asks public sector workers to accept their "extremely generous" offer? An average public sector worker would need to work for three lifetimes to earn Francis Maude's pension and two for Danny Alexander's. They would have to work 124 years to get a pension equal to what local government secretary Eric Pickles would earn - but only if he quits at the next general election. If he sticks around it would take much longer.

For the rich, this country is a socialist utopia, where losses are nationalised and any criticism of their wealth is brushed off with self-serving arguments about talent-flight. For the poor, it is pure, brutal capitalism, a race to the bottom to attract international capital and satisfy the credit rating agencies.

Banking reform has been kicked into the long grass. The 50p tax rate is discussed every day in hushed, serious tones, as if it were a significant moral failure. A paltry 0.05% on transactions like stocks, bonds, foreign currency and derivatives is met with the argument that it must be implemented multilaterally — but David Cameron makes no effort to negotiate with Asian or US governments. Corporation tax is cut. Employment regulations are weakened in the bosses' favour. The prime minister's only achievement from talks with Angela Merkel is to remove us from the working time directive.

The injustice is so plain, the system so evidently rigged, that the government has used every tool in its arsenal to prevent anyone drawing the obvious conclusions. Its much-publicised move on accrual rates and cost ceilings does nothing to prevent the lowest paid workers, such as part-time nurses, bearing the brunt of the Hutton-proposed reforms. It relies on the Hutton report to show how essential reform is, but the report showed the long-term cost of public sector pensions is falling as a percentage of GDP. Our deficit is not, as the government would have you believe, the result of a bloated public sector. It is, as the IMF itself admits, a product of "revenue losses associated with output losses from the financial crisis". There's no reason to hammer down public sector costs in response. Morally and economically, we shouldn't make those who did nothing to cause the crisis pay for it.

The government argued that union votes for strike action were invalid because of a low turnout (typically around 25%). Of course, no such moral standard applies to MPs themselves, who rarely, if ever, win over 50% of the popular vote in their constituency. The sight of the same MPs who campaigned against AV condemning strike votes on the basis of low turnout has to be one of the most laughably hypocritical spectacles in all of Westminster.

According to a YouGov survey from last weekend, 52% of people oppose the strike while 35% support it. It's a majority, but a relatively slim one given that the full range of political and press propaganda is weighed against public sector workers and their modesty demands. That percentage should increase. The people striking next week are some of the most valuable workers in our society. Their value is not monetary. It is social. They deserve better than a hounding from the press, a libel from the government and our own moral indifference."

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/comment/talking-politics/why-support-pensions-strike-134704522.html


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 29, 2011)

As a rep - to say i'm pissed off with my GMB branch right now is a fuckin' understatement!!


----------



## belboid (Nov 29, 2011)

you should have joined Unite when you had the chance!


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 29, 2011)

I'm not pissed off with the GMB union as a whole, what i'm fuckin' seething about at the moment is my fuckin' branch. If the goods i've requested ain't on our picket before 0730 hrs tomorrow morn, shit will hit the fan! 

Fuckin' nora!!!!!!!


----------



## dennisr (Nov 29, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> I'm not pissed off with the GMB union as a whole, what i'm fuckin' seething about at the moment is my fuckin' branch. If the goods i've requested ain't on our picket before 0730 hrs tomorrow morn, shit will hit the fan!
> 
> Fuckin' nora!!!!!!!



Take it out on any scabs


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 29, 2011)

Zabo said:


> And don't forget the biscuits!


I'm gonna bake some.


----------



## dennisr (Nov 29, 2011)

Blagsta said:


> I'm gonna bake some.


now that's what I call solidarity


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 29, 2011)

dennisr said:


> now that's what I call solidarity


You ain't tasted them!


----------



## krink (Nov 29, 2011)

I feel for you Bish. I'm not even sure our branch of unison knows there is a strike on - they've not been in touch with us that's for sure. I had to get picket details from regional office!


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 29, 2011)

My partner's a Unison rep & has just got back from a pre-strike meet, laiden with leaflets, official picket banners, whistles, stewards tabards, etc.

Oh well, the scabs get it then!


----------



## treelover (Nov 29, 2011)

dennisr said:


> and bring a flask of coffee or tea if its early morning if you can - that's called liquid solidarity



SolidariTEA actually...


----------



## William of Walworth (Nov 29, 2011)

This thread has reminded me to take along some biscs tomorrow morning ...


----------



## wiskey (Nov 29, 2011)

I'm taking biscuits. I am on strike. I've wrested with my conscience enough and I know I should go outside but I'm prepared to go back into work if something big happens. The night shift should be having a walk out at midnight till 0700, I think most of them are willing to work till 0700 tonight but then not come back until midnight tomorrow. Nobody seems to know who will or won't be in work, nobody can tell me who will be doing my job if I'm not but I've got to deal with that (and have a look through the floor-ceiling window in the morning lol).

People are welcome to donate us munchies, smiles or waves 

I hope it doesn't rain!


----------



## temper_tantrum (Nov 29, 2011)

Thanks for the replies, most didn't actually address my question  but Blagsta did


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 29, 2011)

belboid said:


> he was still a labour voter at that point, his folks are proper old fashgioned labour people, and he used to go leafletting for them


fuckin hell when did he become a tory then?


----------



## 8ball (Nov 29, 2011)

My Facebook friend count has just dropped by quite a bit after I announced where I think anyone thinking of scabbing tomorrow can stick it.


----------



## HST (Nov 29, 2011)

London people - if arrested one of these solicitors.
Bindmans 020 7833 4433
Birnberg Pierce 020 7911 0166
Hodge Jones and Allen 07659 111 192


----------



## treelover (Nov 29, 2011)

http://www.bristolanticutsalliance.org.uk/

Think it starts in six minutes, unison staff at BRI in Bristol walking out,

history being made soon and we will all be there...


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 29, 2011)

Right, off to my scratcher, am up in 5 or so hours to get on the picketline early, good luck to all those on picketlines tomorrow....


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)

Aye, good luck all...

its on Sky News...


----------



## colacubes (Nov 30, 2011)

Well I'm sure those who were wavering about striking's decision must have been helped by the 1% paycap announcement today 

Good luck to all tomorrow.


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)

Sparks at Balfours Beaty vote 81.6% for strike action,


----------



## HST (Nov 30, 2011)

Known undercover cops http://www.fitwatch.org.uk/


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)

Its a peaceful strike...


----------



## HST (Nov 30, 2011)

I hope so


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

What's the news with brum tomorrow? I heard the council are trying to charge the unions some stupid amount to march. Is it just going ahead anyway?


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)




----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politi...-prepares-for-today-s-strike-115875-23598580/

Recruitment up in unions


----------



## redsquirrel (Nov 30, 2011)

Good luck to all those striking today.


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 30, 2011)

unison placard have been glued to the sticks. Good day to all, tory scum here we come etc


----------



## Looby (Nov 30, 2011)

Good luck today everyone. 

Someone drove at a picketing colleague on 30/06 so stay safe!!!


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

Good luck out there peeps


----------



## purenarcotic (Nov 30, 2011)

Good luck to everybody today, hope you all have a good one.

Here's hoping lots of uni students come out to support our staff and stand side by side on the picket.


----------



## Barking_Mad (Nov 30, 2011)

Usual BBC reporting. Despite the fact their own poll suggested 61% of people support the strike, all ive heard in the last 24 hours is people disagreeing with it.


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 30, 2011)

Local reporter "on the spot" at 06.45 commenting that there were no pickets at the council offices.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

Striker at the Newcastle Metro aired some good points on BBC Breakfast this morning.  Well done, mate.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

Flags waving outside Lambeth town hall. I waved from the scab bus


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> What's the news with brum tomorrow? I heard the council are trying to charge the unions some stupid amount to march. Is it just going ahead anyway?


Fuck the council, we're marching anyway.


----------



## joustmaster (Nov 30, 2011)

The morning Facebook feed is being won by anti strikers. "Don't thesee people appriciate how fucked the eccobemy is" and "why are these people striking, other than greed"


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

joustmaster said:


> The morning Facebook feed is being won by anti strikers. "Don't thesee people appriciate how fucked the eccobemy is" and "why are these people striking, other than greed"


Facebook is for scabs and Tories.


----------



## stethoscope (Nov 30, 2011)

Solidarity to all striking today, I would be if I weren't laid up in hospital 


(I have pondered trying to get a banner sneaked in and dropped from the ward window!)


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

Early reports say record bacon roll sales in cafes across the UK


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Nov 30, 2011)

Best of luck to all the Urban strikers today - solidarity to one and all


----------



## Zabo (Nov 30, 2011)

Reports from the battle field.

Neutral BBC producers and editors are scurrying around the country trying to find union representatives and agitators with strong scouse accents.

Nineteen schools in the North West have placed life-like cardboard cut outs of Michael Gove outside school entrances. All visitors and scabs have been frightened away while union members make the most of it by enjoying a hot drink and a bacon roll in the local cafe.

PCS Union. From the Crown Prosecution Service branch in Sunlight house,Manchester "98% members of strike with joint support from the FDA".

Good luck brothers and sisters.


----------



## joustmaster (Nov 30, 2011)

joustmaster said:


> The morning Facebook feed is being won by anti strikers. "Don't thesee people appriciate how fucked the eccobemy is" and "why are these people striking, other than greed"


An hour later and facebook is filled with pro strike comments... My conclusion, nice people sleep in.


----------



## Barking_Mad (Nov 30, 2011)

I wonder how many times the lame argument that private sector workers have a smaller pension will raise its head, without it being easily demolished?


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

News from the breweries of Britain is that record levels of ale have been delivered to Britain's pubs


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

joustmaster said:


> The morning Facebook feed is being won by anti strikers. "Don't thesee people appriciate how fucked the eccobemy is" and "why are these people striking, other than greed"



get some better friends. I haven't seen a single anti-strike status yet today and plenty pro ones


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Nov 30, 2011)

joustmaster said:


> An hour later and facebook is filled with pro strike comments... My conclusion, nice people sleep in.



Presumably all the anti-strike people are extra proud of how early they get up and how many hours they need to put in.


----------



## Pickman's model (Nov 30, 2011)

joustmaster said:


> An hour later and facebook is filled with pro strike comments... My conclusion, nice people sleep in.


perhaps you mean 'nice people don't fuck about on facebook'


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

> *BBC News website reader *
> 
> comments on the *BBC story*: Just passed through the picket at the local hospital. All men picketing - yet at least 50% of those on strike are women. Any reason why women are not represented on the picket line?



Any reason?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Striker at the Newcastle Metro aired some good points on BBC Breakfast this morning. Well done, mate.



he was very eloquent and go his good points across very well


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 30, 2011)

I'm researching where the public loos are in central Bristol and regretting the coffee I drank earlier.


----------



## QueenOfGoths (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Striker at the Newcastle Metro aired some good points on BBC Breakfast this morning. Well done, mate.


I heard this too - he spoke really well. Good luck all striking today


----------



## killer b (Nov 30, 2011)

weepiper said:


> get some better friends. I haven't seen a single anti-strike status yet today and plenty pro ones


innit. not a single anti-strike status here too.

roads were like a sunday on the way into work...


----------



## killer b (Nov 30, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Any reason?


kids are all off school too.


----------



## colacubes (Nov 30, 2011)

I've only seen 1 anti-strike status, and then she's only complaining as she's had to take the day off as school is closed.  Other than that solid support


----------



## DownwardDog (Nov 30, 2011)

What's all the "good luck" stuff? You're having a day off work not getting out of a Higgins boat on Omaha beach!


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)

lol at Tory boy....


----------



## Flanflinger (Nov 30, 2011)

Be fucked if I'd want olose a days pay in the run up to christmas just because some union cunt wants to be seen on the telly.

And out wheelie bins have been emptied as normal this morning.


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> And out wheelie bins have been emptied as normal this morning.


hmm, I wonder if thats because their jobs were sold off to the private market - a market which then _stole their fucking pensions_.


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)




----------



## sptme (Nov 30, 2011)

treelover said:


>


where is that? liverpool street?


----------



## temper_tantrum (Nov 30, 2011)

Blagsta said:


> They can, but they don't receive the legal protection so can be disciplined for it.



Sorry to return to this point, but the person who was enquiring asked their employer, who said that non-union workers could strike on the same terms as union members, under section 237(2) of the Trade Union & Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992. I've checked it, and it doesn't say anything about not having legal protection and the potential for disciplinary action 
Can anyone clarify?!


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)

sptme said:


> where is that? liverpool street?


 
Yes, taken earlier today


----------



## _angel_ (Nov 30, 2011)

All the whinging about missing one day of school (publicised way in advance) is funny. Son's school have sprung a training day on me this Friday with three days notice. THAT is an inconvenience.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> Be fucked if I'd want olose a days pay in the run up to christmas just because some union cunt wants to be seen on the telly.
> 
> And out wheelie bins have been emptied as normal this morning.



Be fucked if I can put up with half wits like you to be honest.

No one wants to lose a days pay but if you had even half an ounce of understanding about what the strike is about you would know that we would lose even far more off our pensions. The low paid are still waiing for the £250 that was promised when they froze public sector wages.

Just got back form the picket lines which were the biggest i can remember since the pay strikes in 1989 and a good local rally of 300 before everyone headed into Manchester. Two EDL were told in no uncertain terms after asking if the strike was for Asians that they would be under a passing vehicle if they stayed any longer.

And our bins weren't emptied this morning.


----------



## QueenOfGoths (Nov 30, 2011)

nipsla said:


> I've only seen 1 anti-strike status, and then she's only complaining as she's had to take the day off as school is closed. Other than that solid support


A friend has just commented this on my facebook status

"Whilst I'm certainly not defending bankers & politicians, how many millions have been wiped off the UK economy today because Joe Public, through no fault of his own, has had to stay at home."

Not sure how to respond really, will have a think. Any input gratefully received!


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 30, 2011)

Our bins not emptied either.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> A friend has just commented this on my facebook status
> 
> "Whilst I'm certainly not defending bankers & politicians, how many millions have been wiped off the UK economy today because Joe Public, through no fault of his own, has had to stay at home."
> 
> Not sure how to respond really, will have a think



Explain to him that without trade union campaigning we would not have the NHS, schools, pensions, and the 8 hour day. We _would_ have dangerous working conditions, kids up chimneys, low pay and no rights in the workplace. So whilst it may be inconvenient that this strike is taking place, it is in the long term interests of all of us to support each other when we deem it necessary to take collective action.


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> A friend has just commented this on my facebook status
> 
> "Whilst I'm certainly not defending bankers & politicians, how many millions have been wiped off the UK economy today because Joe Public, through no fault of his own, has had to stay at home."
> 
> Not sure how to respond really, will have a think. Any input gratefully received!


Just point out no one would have to stay home if the government offered a fair settlement to the millions of (mainly) low paid workers who have voted to strike


----------



## QueenOfGoths (Nov 30, 2011)

Thanks ItWillNeverWork and belboid - will put some comments together


----------



## Anudder Oik (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> A friend has just commented this on my facebook status
> 
> "Whilst I'm certainly not defending bankers & politicians, how many millions have been wiped off the UK economy today because Joe Public, through no fault of his own, has had to stay at home."
> 
> Not sure how to respond really, will have a think. Any input gratefully received!



Tell him it's nothing compared to the billions that have been swiped off the UK/world economy, behind people's backs, while they _were_ working.


----------



## treelover (Nov 30, 2011)

BBC reporting numbers of schools, libraries, job centres closed from govt figures without any qualification

Guardian questions accuracy of figures, spin?


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

Does anyone know if the rally at the NIA in Birmingham can be attended by anyone? Or do I need to be in a union/have a ticket? Wouldn't mind seeing some of the speeches.


----------



## QueenOfGoths (Nov 30, 2011)

Went with this as my reply - a bit cack handed but hope it gets the point across.

"I don't know the figures but if the government paid a fair settlement to the millions of, often low paid, workers, who are striking then maybe no one would need to stay at home. And while it may be inconvenient to some for one day, or indeed lose the economy some money for one day, the long term effects of current government policy will, I feel, be worse for many more people. Combined collective action and solidarity with each other for the long term interest is, for me, an important aspect of this days action"


----------



## QueenOfGoths (Nov 30, 2011)

Anudder Oik said:


> Tell him it's nothing compared to the billions that have been swiped off the UK/world economy, behind people's backs, while they _were_ working.


Good one! I may add that if i get a reply


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

Unionist politicians scabbing in the six counties, whereas SF & SDLP have instructed their Assembly members not to go into parliament today in solidarity with the strikers.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> Went with this as my reply - a bit cack handed but hope it gets the point across.
> 
> "I don't know the figures but if the government paid a fair settlement to the millions of, often low paid, workers, who are striking then maybe no one would need to stay at home. And while it may be inconvenient to some for one day, or indeed lose the economy some money for one day, the long term effects of current government policy will, I feel, be worse for many more people. Combined collective action and solidarity with each other for the long term interest is, for me, an important aspect of this days action"



Nice one. Let us know what he says.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> A friend has just commented this on my facebook status
> 
> "Whilst I'm certainly not defending bankers & politicians, how many millions have been wiped off the UK economy today because Joe Public, through no fault of his own, has had to stay at home."
> 
> Not sure how to respond really, will have a think. Any input gratefully received!


Joe Public, if he has any sense, will be behind this action. Joe Public will be on the picket lines, or visiting the picket lines with a smile and a handshake and a box of cakes. Joe Public, through no fault of his own, is paying the price for the bankers' greed. As ever, the Fat Cats are pointing at Joe Public and laughing, saying "Look at those poor saps! They're all in it together".  Well, it's time to show them we _are_ standing together, not bickering among ourselves.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

I've been up at the picket lines with number one daughter, delivering doughnuts.  Will pop out again later to see how things are going.  It's bloody freezing here today.  So all the best to all who are picketing.  Keep warm!


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

Grauniad round up of polls:

• Evening Standard - Do you think Wednesday's strike by public sector workers is justified? Yes 32% No 68%
• BBC - Do you think Wednesday's strike by public sector workers is justified?
Yes 61% No 39%
• Guardian - Do you support the 30 November strikes? Yes 79.3% No 20.7%
• Daily Mail - Do you support the public sector strikes today? Yes 90% No 10%


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

belboid said:


> • Daily Mail - Do you support the public sector strikes today? *Yes 90%* No 10%


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

weepiper said:


>


----------



## geminisnake (Nov 30, 2011)

Blagsta said:


> Our bins not emptied either.



Ours bloody were and I am disgusted at them(still a council service). I was going to say something but wasn't sure I'd remain polite!


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

6000 in Sheffield for the demo, 7000 in Leeds.


----------



## ddraig (Nov 30, 2011)

arrests in Cardiff!


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

Food delivery turned back from Sheffield town hall's GMB picket line. They felt 'uncomfortable' delivering food to non-strikers


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

"Toby Young, who established the West London Free school, said none of the teachers were on strike and the school was open as normal"

A school by cunts, of cunts, for cunts.


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Nov 30, 2011)

Just seen this from Fitwatch:



> URGENT: Riot cops getting tooled up outside Peckham Social Centre. 97 Peckham Rd SE15. Get down there.



What the hell???


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

Cameron claims the strike is 'something of a damp squib' in PMQs. Well, not up here it's not. All schools closed in 23 council areas, for example.

this is from the march in Edinburgh.






edited cos I found a bigger picture.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Nov 30, 2011)

a few pics from rally in brixton - about 300+ people turned up. 93% of schools in Lambeth closed and pickets outside Lambeth Council offices, Lambeth College, schools, the library etc


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

weepiper said:


> Cameron claims the strike is 'something of a damp squib' in PMQs. Well, not up here it's not. All schools closed in 23 council areas, for example.
> 
> this is from the march in Edinburgh.



I can hear the lying wanker liar on the radio now


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

weepiper said:


> Cameron claims the strike is 'something of a damp squib' in PMQs. Well, not up here it's not. All schools closed in 23 council areas, for example.
> 
> this is from the march in Edinburgh.


*Stirling*
Website - Stirling Council
Twitter - @StirlingCouncil

All council-run nurseries, primary and secondary schools closed to pupils. 
 Ensure critical and emergency services available to vulnerable people.
All other council services restricted or suspended.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

> First Minister Alex Salmond spoke with striking workers before crossing the picket line to enter parliament


Wanker.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Wanker.



He was off to speak in favour of the strike at PMQ's though.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> He was off to speak in favour of the strike at PMQ's though.


Which he had to cross a picket line to do.  No excuse.


----------



## Kaka Tim (Nov 30, 2011)

Big turnout in leeds - biggest demo Ive ever seen there.


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

I have reports of a massive turnout at the march in Glasgow too.


----------



## Dovydaitis (Nov 30, 2011)

huge support for all of you on the pickets, I'm not in a union but have sent my support (and food) with my MIL who got the coach this morning to London. The coaches were full


----------



## Dovydaitis (Nov 30, 2011)

on that note, off to the local picket with a flask of tea! not much but least I can do


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Nov 30, 2011)

Oh yeah - I went along to support a picket in Balham - alas, they were hoofing it off to a meeting up in town, but gave 'em my support etc etc.

Just heard from a mate of mine in Tower Hamlets - excellent turn out there for the strike


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Which he had to cross a picket line to do. No excuse.



I'm not sure I get where you're coming from tbh. It wasn't as if he was crossing the line to scab; he went to speak on people's behalf.


----------



## QueenOfGoths (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> Went with this as my reply - a bit cack handed but hope it gets the point across.
> 
> "I don't know the figures but if the government paid a fair settlement to the millions of, often low paid, workers, who are striking then maybe no one would need to stay at home. And while it may be inconvenient to some for one day, or indeed lose the economy some money for one day, the long term effects of current government policy will, I feel, be worse for many more people. Combined collective action and solidarity with each other for the long term interest is, for me, an important aspect of this days action"





QueenOfGoths said:


> A friend has just commented this on my facebook status
> 
> "Whilst I'm certainly not defending bankers & politicians, how many millions have been wiped off the UK economy today because Joe Public, through no fault of his own, has had to stay at home."
> 
> Not sure how to respond really, will have a think. Any input gratefully received!



My lovely, lovely husband also commented 

"Probably as many as were lost from the unexpected bank holiday for the Royal Wedding?"


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

Police say around 8,500 on the Newcastle march according to the Beeb feed.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> A friend has just commented this on my facebook status
> 
> "Whilst I'm certainly not defending bankers & politicians, how many millions have been wiped off the UK economy today because Joe Public, through no fault of his own, has had to stay at home."
> 
> Not sure how to respond really, will have a think. Any input gratefully received!



"About 79 billion, five hundred million pounds less than the day the bankers dicked us, you muppet" seems appropriate.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 30, 2011)

weepiper said:


> Cameron claims the strike is 'something of a damp squib' in PMQs. Well, not up here it's not. All schools closed in 23 council areas, for example.
> 
> this is from the march in Edinburgh.
> 
> ...



Now *that* is a beautiful sight.


----------



## teqniq (Nov 30, 2011)

support to all


----------



## malatesta32 (Nov 30, 2011)

sky news are claiming 2m on strike. some damp squib eh mr dave?


----------



## Yu_Gi_Oh (Nov 30, 2011)

Thinking of you all, fuck Cameron.


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

even the pigs now saying there were TEN thousand people at the Sheffield demo.  Bloody astounding.
http://www.thestar.co.uk/news/busin...kers_demonstrate_in_sheffield_video_1_4018520


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I'm not sure I get where you're coming from tbh. It wasn't as if he was crossing the line to scab; he went to speak on people's behalf.


He crossed a picket line (staff in Holyrood were on strike) and picked up his day's pay.  Even the Greens managed to get this one right:



> Green MSP Patrick Harvie, added: "On a day like today, I don't think it's possible for a political party to be on the right side of the argument and on the wrong side of the picket line."


----------



## Dovydaitis (Nov 30, 2011)

Well said Mr harvie


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 30, 2011)

Fuck vuvuzellas man.


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Nov 30, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> Fuck vuvuzellas man.



Hey man, instant La Monte Young drone album at your fingertips!

(Were they in force on a demo you were on today, DC?)


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> Fuck vuvuzellas man.



Superheroes these days sound just plain shit.


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 30, 2011)

Market square. UCU/Unison picket at my old uni before a sly rest and smoke at a mates before moving on to the speechifying in the town square. What that is a photo of


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 30, 2011)

the bloke from the head teachers union who spoke, spoke too long. He wasn't wrong in what he was saying though. Just went on a bit.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> Be fucked if I'd want olose a days pay in the run up to christmas just because some union cunt wants to be seen on the telly.
> 
> And out wheelie bins have been emptied as normal this morning.



Brighton and Hove won't be taking the money off strikers until Feb 2012...which shows some sort of solidarity.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## DotCommunist (Nov 30, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> Hey man, instant La Monte Young drone album at your fingertips!
> 
> (Were they in force on a demo you were on today, DC?)


 
in the square where there was speeches the blat drone accompanied every good point and pause, drowning out the claps. I looked for the cunts wielding the satanic horn but couldn't see them.


----------



## rekil (Nov 30, 2011)

From the twitter.



			
				South Down Sinn Féin said:
			
		

> Tories out of touch, millions out on strike, Kenny Dalglish's Liverpool stuffing Chelsea on the regular..it must be the 80s?!?


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 30, 2011)

Cracking turnout in Bristol. Very civilised march and rally.
Almost took me back to 1978 or thereabouts and that would probably have been a Sunday.


----------



## Flanflinger (Nov 30, 2011)

QueenOfGoths said:


> My lovely, lovely husband also commented
> 
> "Probably as many as were lost from the unexpected bank holiday for the Royal Wedding?"



It was a public holiday..................there is a difference too.


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

Someone who was on the Glasgow march has just posted a status update that says the STUC are claiming 20,000 were on that. He thinks more.


----------



## Flanflinger (Nov 30, 2011)

malatesta32 said:


> sky news are claiming 2m on strike. some damp squib eh mr dave?



No they're not. The Unions are claiming 2m.


----------



## BigTom (Nov 30, 2011)

crossposted from the other thread:

Went to the university of Birmingham in the morning. loads of security present who were waving cars through and trying to be intimidating, plus 4 senior managers. Lots of students out in support of the lecturers (more students than lecturers actually, though UCU were spread around 5 entrances at least, whereas all the students were at the main gates.

 Birmingham demo was good - Birmingham Mail are saying around 10,000 and it was at least that - took nearly half an hour to walk past, width of one side of a road (2 and a bit car widths).
 Too big for me to really guess a number anyway.

 Couple of more militant groups on the march - IWW with their guillotine - I'll find a picture later - and occupy birmingham.. but only to the extent of more militant chants.

 Having said that, the march happening at all is a bit more militant than usual, as the council tried to charge £10k for the march and the unions refused to pay and said they would march anyway, and did. I don't remember seeing any police at all, just stewards. I imagine there must have been some police around though.

 Didn't go to the rally to listen to Brendan Barber and the like.


----------



## QueenOfGoths (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> It was a public holiday..................there is a difference too.


Oh so business who had to close etc.. didn't lose money that day? And of course the taxpayer didn't contribute any money to the wedding did they?


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> It was a public holiday..................there is a difference too.


yup, one was all about a couple of rich, worthless wankers doing something ordinary and unmemorable, and the other is about millions of workers defending their livelihoods, and our services.  I think I know which is more worthwhile


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> No they're not.


well, they have just said 'millions', so technically you are right, as 2 million is an understimate.

I dont think that was what you meant tho, was it?

(sky poll also running 76-24 in strikers favour at the mo)


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 30, 2011)

Bristol's Daily Fail lite has downplayed the event and posted an amazingly lack-lustre photo - they say 10,000, organisers were giving police estimates of 20,000


----------



## sptme (Nov 30, 2011)

Manchester.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

Just got back from Brighton rally & march. What a fucking fantastic turnout. At a guess i'd say 10-15,000. Far more positive support from the public than negative this time.

My GMB goods turned up before time (thanks B50) & we had far more support on the picket than i thought.

Dead on my feet, time for a beer!

In solidarity


----------



## gentlegreen (Nov 30, 2011)




----------



## trampie (Nov 30, 2011)

BigTom said:


> Lots of students out in support of the lecturers (more students than lecturers actually,


Hmm.


----------



## fractionMan (Nov 30, 2011)

1500 marched in bath


----------



## BigTom (Nov 30, 2011)

trampie said:


> Hmm.



hmm, what? There are 28,000 students at the university, and the lecturers were spread around different gates.. I'm not going to say the turnout from lecturers was good or anything, but I also have no idea how many stayed home but didn't go on the picket line


----------



## extra dry (Nov 30, 2011)

looks like quite a few..


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

what's in Panton House?

'Stormed' by 200 Occupy protestors apparently


----------



## Ground Elder (Nov 30, 2011)

(apologies if this has already been posted) Around 4,000 marched in in Truro


----------



## Guineveretoo (Nov 30, 2011)

Apparently, there were 50,000 at the rally in Central London.


----------



## bi0boy (Nov 30, 2011)

belboid said:


> what's in Panton House?
> 
> 'Stormed' by 200 Occupy protestors apparently



Pizza Express.


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 30, 2011)

Massive demo in Birmingham, biggest for years, at least 10,000 I reckon. Despite the council trying to scupper it!


----------



## malatesta32 (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> No they're not. The Unions are claiming 2m.


http://news.sky.com/home/uk-news/article/16120556


----------



## articul8 (Nov 30, 2011)




----------



## Dovydaitis (Nov 30, 2011)

Thousands out in oxford, brookes university out but oxford university not. The marchers just keep on coming!.


----------



## geminisnake (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Which he had to cross a picket line to do. No excuse.



I'm really torn on this. Yes he shouldn't have crossed the picket line but he is also the only politician that I've seen on the news who has repeatedly shown support for the strikes! Maybe to suit his own agenda but Labour have repeatedly denounced the strikers, cnuts!!


----------



## geminisnake (Nov 30, 2011)

copliker said:


> From the twitter.



They've missed out the iranian embassy being shut and our people being pulled out of Iran but yeah, I thought that earlier


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

geminisnake said:


> I'm really torn on this. Yes he shouldn't have crossed the picket line but he is also the only politician that I've seen on the news who has repeatedly shown support for the strikes! Maybe to suit his own agenda but Labour have repeatedly denounced the strikers, cnuts!!


Yes, he has supported them in words, which the Milliband et al have not done. But he could have - _should_ have - done that outside the parliament and without picking up his day's pay.


----------



## Flanflinger (Nov 30, 2011)

belboid said:


> well, they have just said 'millions', so technically you are right, as 2 million is an understimate.
> 
> I dont think that was what you meant tho, was it?
> 
> (sky poll also running 76-24 in strikers favour at the mo)



It's the unions who are claiming millions and Sky have reported that claim. The fact the country hasn't come to a standstill is testament to the unions bullshit.

And if the poll figures were the other way round  you'd dismiss them.


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> It's the unions who are claiming millions and Sky have reported that claim. The fact the country hasn't come to a standstill is testament to the unions bullshit.
> 
> And if the poll figures were the other way round you'd dismiss them.



Says the person who is dismissing the figures reported by Sky....


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> It's the unions who are claiming millions and Sky have reported that claim. The fact the country hasn't come to a standstill is testament to the unions bullshit.
> 
> And if the poll figures were the other way round you'd dismiss them.



Fuck figures, millions marched. Fact.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 30, 2011)

trampie said:


> Hmm.



What a wanker you are, selectively quoting, and missing out the bit about it being the main gate he was talking about there being more students than lecturers, and that the lecturers were spread out over *five* gates.

Like I said on the other thread. You're trying a bit of "divide and conquer", you boss's nark cunt.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 30, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Just got back from Brighton rally & march. What a fucking fantastic turnout. At a guess i'd say 10-15,000. Far more positive support from the public than negative this time.
> 
> My GMB goods turned up before time (thanks B50) & we had far more support on the picket than i thought.
> 
> ...



Dead on your feet? I thought you were an ex-infantryman, Bish. Not a desk-wallah! 

Now, ten times around the square at shoulder arms. Double-time!!!


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> It's the unions who are claiming millions and Sky have reported that claim. The fact the country hasn't come to a standstill is testament to the unions bullshit.
> 
> And if the poll figures were the other way round you'd dismiss them.



What percentage of schools were closed today?


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:
			
		

> What percentage of schools were closed today?



Dave said 60%


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Dead on your feet? I thought you were an ex-infantryman, Bish. Not a desk-wallah!
> 
> Now, ten times around the square at shoulder arms. Double-time!!!



Sir!


----------



## geminisnake (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Yes, he has supported them in words, which the Milliband et al have not done. But he could have - _should_ have - done that outside the parliament and without picking up his day's pay.



This maybe sheds some light on things. But let's face it danny, you're not going to be happy with very much he does are you?? 
http://www.newsnetscotland.com/inde...doning-parliament-on-strike-day-to-seek-votes


----------



## Badgers (Nov 30, 2011)

Pizza shops are open yeah?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 30, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Sir!



Don't you "sir" me, sunny. I work for a living! Another ten!!


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

I fuckin' hope so Badge!


----------



## ddraig (Nov 30, 2011)

belboid said:


> what's in Panton House?
> 
> 'Stormed' by 200 Occupy protestors apparently


apparently highest paid CEO in uk, head of mining co


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Don't you "sir" me, sunny. I work for a living! Another ten!!



One banana, Two banana, Three?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 30, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> One banana, Two banana, Three?



No bananas for me. 

I remember having that bellowed at me  several times before it sunk in, though.


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

Glasgow.


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

Flanflinger said:


> It's the unions who are claiming millions and Sky have reported that claim.


actually, no.  Look at the headline.  There, without quotes, as a statement of fact, is:  _Millions_ Walk Out.  No qote marks around the word 'millions', which is what they do when they're, y'know, quoting.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 30, 2011)

prob got my picture in the local paper


----------



## malatesta32 (Nov 30, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Dead on your feet? I thought you were an ex-infantryman, Bish. Not a desk-wallah!
> 
> Now, ten times around the square at shoulder arms. Double-time!!!


 blimey, sargeant panda eh?


----------



## malatesta32 (Nov 30, 2011)

we knew 2 million were due to come out so why do people expect the country 'to grind to a halt.' theres a fuckload more of the workforce who aint unionised. 2m is fantastic!


----------



## malatesta32 (Nov 30, 2011)

and typical response from the EDL et al:
http://twitpic.com/7m4cum

http://twitpic.com/7m3bzf

fucking scab bastards.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

Michael *Gove *= "Severe impact" - David *Cameron *= "Damp Squib"

Can't have it both ways.

​


----------



## N_igma (Nov 30, 2011)

Heard some awful shit being bandied about work today about those on strike. I was literally about to lose it a few times!


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

Can I just say, btw - 98% of state-run schools in Scotland were shut. 98*%*! That's pretty amazing.


----------



## Ich bin ein Mod (Nov 30, 2011)

Badgers said:


> Dave said 60%



Although up here it was over 98% of schools closed.


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> He was off to speak in favour of the strike at PMQ's though.



He crossed a picket line he's a scab, end of story. He could have spoken at the rally in Edinburgh, he chose, along with all the other scab SNP MSP's to cross the picketline. Fuck him the fat jambo pie eating cunt.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

geminisnake said:


> This maybe sheds some light on things. But let's face it danny, you're not going to be happy with very much he does are you??
> http://www.newsnetscotland.com/inde...doning-parliament-on-strike-day-to-seek-votes


Well, credit where it's due, at least he _said_ he supported the strikers, unlike Miliband who continues to be careful to neither condemn nor support them.

Still a scab, though.


----------



## ddraig (Nov 30, 2011)

just seen a well known urbanite on the picket line in Swansea on the bbc Wales news! nice one


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

Me today with a mates 6 yr old daughters placard.


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

"It'll be my pension one day"

Is she planning on still living at home when he's retired??!!


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

belboid said:


> "It'll be my pension one day"
> 
> Is she planning on still living at home when he's retired??!!



Given the increasing inability of young people to buy a house and the fact he's near 50, that's entirely possible.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 30, 2011)

just saw a tory councillor on local tv supporting the strike.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> He crossed a picket line he's a scab, end of story. He could have spoken at the rally in Edinburgh, he chose, along with all the other scab SNP MSP's to cross the picketline. Fuck him the fat jambo pie eating cunt.



I think you're speaking crap tbh. He went to Westminster because that is where the centre of tory power is. As for the issue of him 'picking up his days pay'. He's getting paid anyway in his salary so it makes no difference. I don't know much about the SNP so I can only go on Salmonds' actions in this case, and I didn't see it being an issue. I'd rather he did what he did then making some empty political gesture for the cameras. We get too  much of that as it is.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I think you're speaking crap tbh. He went to Westminster because that is where the centre of tory power is.


He crossed a picket line to go into _Holyrood_, where _he_ is the one that's in power.


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I think you're speaking crap tbh. He went to Westminster because that is where the centre of tory power is. As for the issue of him 'picking up his days pay'. He's getting paid anyway in his salary so it makes no difference. I don't know much about the SNP so I can only go on Salmonds' actions in this case, and I didn't see it being an issue. I'd rather he did what he did then making some empty political gesture for the cameras. We get too much of that as it is.



Hmmm, given you have no idea where he was today I reckon the shite is spilling pout of your mouth. He went nowhere near Westmister today. He's the first minister at holyrood, ie the Scottish parliament. What is an 'empty gesture' about not crossing a picketline? He didn't have to cross that picketline to make the rather flabby point he did. He claims he supports the strikers but crosses the picketline to make that point, as coherent as you frankly.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> He crossed a picket line to go into _Holyrood_, where _he_ is the one that's in power.



Fair enough. For some reason I had it in my head that I saw him on PMQ's earlier. Although I was playing Skyrim at the same time so you can understand my lack of proper attention. But the issue here is about whether or not Salmond was right to 'cross the picket line' - which For me misses the point about what a strike is for.

The withdrawal of labour should be to show that Capital (in this case the state) is completely reliant on those who create the wealth. Workers. In this context, a scab is someone who is complicit in maintaining the power of Capital over Labour by aiding the continuation of production during that period of strike. Alex Salmond is not a worker though, he is an elected representative, and as such, his presence in parliament makes no difference to the ability of strikers to affect the change they want. It does not in any way hinder their aims. His support in parliament on the other hand might.


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Fair enough. For some reason I had it in my head that I saw him on PMQ's earlier. Although I was playing Skyrim at the same time so you can understand my lack of proper attention. But the issue here is about whether or not Salmond was right to 'cross the picket line' - which For me misses the point about what a strike is for.
> 
> The withdrawal of labour should be to show that Capital (in this case the state) is completely reliant on those who create the wealth. Workers. In this context, a scab is someone who is complicit in maintaining the power of Capital over Labour by aiding the continuation of production during that period of strike. Alex Salmond is not a worker though, he is an elected representative, and as such, his presence in parliament makes no difference to the ability of strikers to affect the change they want. It does not in any way hinder their aims.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

Fedayn said:


>



I should face palm your attempts at being the hardman striker on the picket-line. Be pragmatic instead of posturing. His 'crossing the picket-line' was no such thing. It's all just 'impressions' that you want him to give. Why? It means fuck all in reality.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I should face palm your attempts at being the hardman striker on the picket-line. Be pragmatic instead of posturing. His 'crossing the picket-line' was no such thing. It's all just 'impressions' that you want him to give. Why? It means fuck all in reality.



What are you going on about? 

You either cross a picket line, or you don't!


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

abstract1 said:


> What are you going on about?
> 
> You either cross a picket line, or you don't!



 The point is. He wasn't replacing a striking worker.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> The point is. He wasn't replacing a striking worker.


He was, however, creating work that a scab did instead of striking workers.  He was undermining the strike he claimed to support.


----------



## Athos (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> The point is. He wasn't replacing a striking worker.


No.  The point is: he's a scab.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

abstract1 said:


> You either cross a picket line, or you don't!


And you don't.  Ever.


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I should face palm your attempts at being the hardman striker on the picket-line. Be pragmatic instead of posturing. His 'crossing the picket-line' was no such thing. It's all just 'impressions' that you want him to give. Why? It means fuck all in reality.



What's this hardman striker straw man you spluttered onto the screen?

 He refused in the Parliament to support the strike by supporting and respecting those picketlines. By doing so he he could have simple spoken to tens of thousands instead of a near half empty parliament. His rhetoric of support would have been far more noteworthy if he'd spoken at the much bigger rally outside parliament. When the strike rally, tens of thousands strong, in Glasgow was shown footage of Salmond crossing the pcketline he was booed. Even the STV journo commented on the level of noise of the boos. So, it's not just me who thinks he's a scab, thousands of others do too. Including hard women dinnerladies....


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> The point is. He wasn't replacing a striking worker.


And the point of a strike is...to shut down a workplace.  By crossing the line - even tho he wasn't himself one of the workers in dispute - he was still going against the demands of the strike.  Even if he did then speak up for those demands.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

Ask yourself why it is that crossing a picket-line is looked down on. It's because of the effect this might have on the ability of the strike to succeed. Alex Salmond does not have that effect when he enters parliament. Especially considering he voiced his support.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> And you don't. Ever.



Quite!


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Ask yourself why it is that crossing a picket-line is looked down on. It's because of the effect this might have on the ability of the strike to succeed. Alex Salmond does not have that effect when he enters parliament. Especially considering he voiced his support.



He's still a scab.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> he voiced his support.


He'd have been more convincing had he done that at the rally in Edinburgh, and refused to cross the picket line.


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Ask yourself why it is that crossing a picket-line is looked down on. It's because of the effect this might have on the ability of the strike to succeed. Alex Salmond does not have that effect when he enters parliament. Especially considering he voiced his support.



The strike at the Scottish parliament was there to stop the parliament doing it's job. Salmond spoke in that parliament, he did his job. Like other SNP MSP's he helped ensure that the strike and picketline at that parliament didn't shut the place down, he is a scab. You are defending a scab.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

belboid said:


> And the point of a strike is...to shut down a workplace.



Exactly. And him going to work did not prevent that happening. 





Fedayn said:


> What's this hardman striker straw man you spluttered onto the screen?



It just appears to me that you are attempting to fulfil a stereo type of a militant from the 70's and apply that to a situation which is completely different. It's all just rhetoric and hot wind. Why give a fuck what Salmond does when it impacts not iota on whether the strike succeeds.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Exactly. And him going to work did not prevent that happening.
> 
> It just appears to me that you are attempting to fulfil a stereo type of a militant from the 70's and apply that to a situation which is completely different. It's all just rhetoric and hot wind. Why give a fuck what Salmond does when it impacts not iota on whether the strike succeeds.



You haven't really thought this through, have you?


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> It just appears to me that you are attempting to fulfil a stereo type of a militant from the 70's and apply that to a situation which is completely different. It's all just rhetoric and hot wind. Why give a fuck what Salmond does when it impacts not iota on whether the strike succeeds.



The strike at the Scottish parliament was to shut down the Scottish parliament, Salmond went in to help keep the Scottish parliament working and open, he's a scab, you defend his right to cross that picketline.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

abstract1 said:


> He's still a scab.



This makes no sense to me. Maybe I'm younger than you, I dunno. I have no memory of the 70's or of the miners' strike, so the 'scab' thing doesn't resonate. I just look at the real-world result of a persons' actions. Salmonds actions do not result in the same things as another person crossing that line would, so I don't think it is right to apply the same moral indignation at what he did.


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Exactly. And him going to work did not prevent that happening.



A genuine idiot. How was his going into work not helping keep that workplace open? How was his going into work and doing his job helping shut that workplace down? Oh fucking dear....


----------



## belboid (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Exactly. And him going to work did not prevent that happening.


he helped the workplace stay open. So he did prevent them shutting it down.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> This makes no sense to me.



Clearly.


----------



## Mr Blob (Nov 30, 2011)

My school was closed to students. Teachers on strike gathered outside gate to hand out leaflets to passer bys and then went to march in Central London. No picket no one classified as scab - just friendly atmosphere as non strikers turned up for work without normal lessons


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Salmonds actions do not result in the same things as another person crossing that line would


Yes it did.  Who cleaned his office, served him in the canteen?  What civil servants did he call upon in order to do his paperwork, make his speech, work in his office, answer the phone?  Those were PCS members he spoke to in the picket line.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

belboid said:


> he helped the workplace stay open. So he did prevent them shutting it down.



It's not a fucking workplace. It's a parliament. It's just not the same.

Anyway, it's not worth continuing this conversation. The levels of irrationality seem crazy to me. All because people want to fantasise they're back in the 70's when real men didn't 'scab'. It's all just bollocks in respect to Salmond and I think you know it deep down. Posturing; meh! Whatever.


----------



## Athos (Nov 30, 2011)

_After God had finished the rattlesnake, the toad, and the vampire, he had some awful substance left with which he made a scab._

_ A scab is a two-legged animal with a corkscrew soul, a water brain, a combination backbone of jelly and glue. _

_Where others have hearts, he carries a tumor of rotten principles._

_ When a scab comes down the street, men turn their backs and angels weep in heaven, and the devil shuts the gates of hell to keep him out._

_ No man (or woman) has a right to scab so long as there is a pool of water to drown his carcass in, or a rope long enough to hang his body with. _

_Judas was a gentleman compared with a scab. For betraying his master, he had character enough to hang himself. A scab has not. _

_ Esau sold his birthright for a mess of pottage. _

_ Judas sold his Savior for thirty pieces of silver. _

_ Benedict Arnold sold his country for a promise of a commision in the british army._

_The scab sells his birthright, country, his wife, his children and his fellowmen for an unfulfilled promise from his employer. _

_ Esau was a traitor to himself; Judas was a traitor to his God; Benedict Arnold was a traitor to his country._

_A scab is a traitor to his God, his country, his family and his class._ 

 Jack London (1876-1916)


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Yes it did. Who cleaned his office, served him in the canteen? What civil servants did he call upon in order to do his paperwork, make his speech, work in his office, answer the phone? Those were PCS members he spoke to in the picket line.



Well then it was the cleaners, cooks, civil servants and secretaries that were scabs. Not him.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> It's not a fucking workplace. It's a parliament. It's just not the same..



Are you suggesting they don't do any work in parliament?


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> It's not a fucking workplace.


It is.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> It is.



I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Well then it was the cleaners, cooks, civil servants and secretaries that were scabs. Not him.


_He_ was the one giving them the work to do.  Same as you would if you crossed a picket line into a shop where staff were striking, or a swimming pool, or school, or anything else.  Buying that book from a scab makes you one.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.


You've listed some of the workers in post 425.  It's a workplace, and those people work there.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Anyway, it's not worth continuing this conversation. The levels of irrationality seem crazy to me. All because people want to fantasise they're back in the 70's when real men didn't 'scab'. It's all just bollocks in respect to Salmond and I think you know it deep down. Posturing; meh! Whatever.



It's got fuck all to do with people fantasising they're back in the 70's  why you're persisting with this is as baffling and irrational to me as the counter argument being presented to you re. scabbing.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> You've listed some of the workers in post 425. It's a workplace, and those people work there.



It's not a workplace for _him_ is what I meant. But I concede your point about him enabling others to break the pick-line.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I concede your point about him enabling others to break the pick-line.


Cheers.  I knew you had sense.  Now we can move on.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

abstract1 said:


> It's got fuck all to do with people fantasising they're back in the 70's  why you're persisting with this is as baffling and irrational to me as the counter argument being presented to you re. scabbing.



I'm hardly 'persisting' in any way. I mentioned it a handful of times because that is how it is coming across. Anyhow, it doesn't matter.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Well then it was the cleaners, cooks, civil servants and secretaries that were scabs. Not him.



You're bonkers 

Is he like the arch angel Gabriel, or some other ethereal being who wafts across pickets lines without anyone noticing, slips in a few hours of hard graft and then wafts out again?

You're making my brain hurt


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Now we can move on.



Phew!!


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> This makes no sense to me. Maybe I'm younger than you, I dunno. I have no memory of the 70's or of the miners' strike, so the 'scab' thing doesn't resonate.



Get ready for a fuck off dose of Cameron then! You arse.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> Phew!!



Phew!


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> But I concede your point about him enabling others to break the pick-line.



And in doing so, breaks the picket line himself.....

hallalujah


----------



## Barking_Mad (Nov 30, 2011)

I hear Jeremy clarkson is at it again. What a nobber.


----------



## weepiper (Nov 30, 2011)

Yes, Fed is just a great big militant picketline hardman, in his furry hat, gloves, and placard written by a 6-year-old girl.


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

Barking_Mad said:


> I hear Jeremy clarkson is at it again. What a nobber.



He loves it - don't give him the attention.


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 30, 2011)

my pics from today, not great quality, all from my phone


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

weepiper said:


> Yes, Fed is just a great big militant picketline hardman, in his furry hat, gloves, and placard written by a 6-year-old girl.



Just saw that myself. Quite cute really (The sign that is, not Fedayn)


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

Just a tiny bit of the demo in Glasgow today. It took near an hour to pass any given point.


----------



## ItWillNeverWork (Nov 30, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> Just a tiny bit of the demo in Glasgow today. It took near an hour to pass any given point.




I count about 8-10 people passing by every second. So about 30,000 people altogether I guess. What were the claims of numbers by the two sides?


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

ItWillNeverWork said:


> I count about 8-10 people passing by every second. So about 30,000 people altogether I guess. What were the claims of numbers by the two sides?



Police claimed 5,000, STUC claimed 25,000.


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 30, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> Just a tiny bit of the demo in Glasgow today. It took near an hour to pass any given point.




Goto 7:00 minutes.....


----------



## machine cat (Nov 30, 2011)

Leeds:

Small picket line outside the main entrance of my office. Everyone walked through  The people in my department avoided me and went in the back (where they were met by another picket ). Tomorrow will be awkward.

Went to the rally and march from Woodhouse Moor which was fucking massive  Estimated 8,000+ easily. Plenty of pickets along the way and University buildings occupied. Best part was half way through when the parents & kids feeder march joined with their home-made banners and placards


----------



## Grandma Death (Nov 30, 2011)

Not sure if this has been posted-if it has apologies. The Daily Mail are running a poll for one day only-asking if people support the strikes. As of a few minutes ago-support was running at 79%. I voted....felt dirty....but Ive done it.



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html


----------



## madzone (Nov 30, 2011)

Grandma Death said:


> Not sure if this has been posted-if it has apologies. The Daily Mail are running a poll for one day only-asking if people support the strikes. As of a few minutes ago-support was running at 79%. I voted....felt dirty....but Ive done it.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html


I can't see it


----------



## Grandma Death (Nov 30, 2011)

Sroll down...right at the bottom...right next to the story about the russian spy


----------



## Andrew Hertford (Nov 30, 2011)

This'll take you straight there:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/polls/poll.html?pollId=1029568

I sometimes vote on their polls when I REALLY don't have anything better to do.


----------



## Grandma Death (Nov 30, 2011)

Whats interesting is Ive not seen any internet campaigns to get people to vote-well least if there has been any I've not seen them.


----------



## madzone (Nov 30, 2011)

Ahh - got it - thanks.

I got into a bit of a debate with 'someone' earlier. I didn't go int uni today depsite the studios and the technical workshops being open. I would have been working in the technical workshops where the technicicans decided not to strike. I don't support their decision as I feel it undermines the rest of the union members who _did_ decide to strike so I didn't go in. I also have a problem crossing a picket line - even if it's not me on strike iyswim. The person i was arguing with says I'm daft because _my_ union wasn't striking. Am I daft? Is my support pointless?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

Andrew Hertford said:


> This'll take you straight there:
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/polls/poll.html?pollId=1029568
> 
> I sometimes vote on their polls when I REALLY don't have anything better to do.



Just about sums you up.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> Goto 7:00 minutes.....


Less of the civil.


----------



## Grandma Death (Nov 30, 2011)

madzone said:


> Ahh - got it - thanks.
> 
> I got into a bit of a debate with 'someone' earlier. I didn't go int uni today depsite the studios and the technical workshops being open. I would have been working in the technical workshops where the technicicans decided not to strike. I don't support their decision as I feel it undermines the rest of the union members who _did_ decide to strike so I didn't go in. I also have a problem crossing a picket line - even if it's not me on strike iyswim. The person i was arguing with says I'm daft because _my_ union wasn't striking. Am I daft? Is my support pointless?



In a nutshell no.


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

madzone said:


> Ahh - got it - thanks.
> 
> I got into a bit of a debate with 'someone' earlier. I didn't go int uni today depsite the studios and the technical workshops being open. I would have been working in the technical workshops where the technicicans decided not to strike. I don't support their decision as I feel it undermines the rest of the union members who _did_ decide to strike so I didn't go in. I also have a problem crossing a picket line - even if it's not me on strike iyswim. The person i was arguing with says I'm daft because _my_ union wasn't striking. Am I daft? Is my support pointless?


No, not pointless.  You took a principled stand, and in my view the correct one.


----------



## Andrew Hertford (Nov 30, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Just about sums you up.


Er, yeah...love you too Mr.Bishie.


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 30, 2011)

Passed this today and thought WTF.   Police 'cordon' apparently.


----------



## madzone (Nov 30, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Passed this today and thought WTF. Police 'cordon' apparently.


There's something strangely Pythonesque about it.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

Far more ridiculous imo


----------



## danny la rouge (Nov 30, 2011)

madzone said:


> There's something strangely Pythonesque about it.


----------



## Divisive Cotton (Nov 30, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Passed this today and thought WTF. Police 'cordon' apparently.



a police cordon protecting what?


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 30, 2011)

The bit I saw, Trafalgar square. That one, presumably Downing Street and Parliament.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

PROPERTY!!!


----------



## abstract1 (Nov 30, 2011)

Divisive Cotton said:


> a police cordon protecting what?



Property.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)




----------



## ddraig (Nov 30, 2011)

that dm poll removed as 84% support strike! 

and that cordon is used for edl 'demonstrations' saw one in Cardiff when the cunts were here


----------



## lopsidedbunny (Nov 30, 2011)

Divisive Cotton said:


> a police cordon protecting what?





quimcunx said:


> Passed this today and thought WTF. Police 'cordon' apparently.


 
Oh that's the beast! I surprise it didn't kick anything off I seen smaller ones in the past but nothing of this size. They were protecting Whitehall,The Mall and Trafalgar Square.


----------



## HST (Nov 30, 2011)

In all my years I've never seen the state so bloody scared of the people.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

PROPERTY!


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

HST said:


> In all my years I've never seen the state so bloody scared of the people.



Nah, not yet...


----------



## HST (Nov 30, 2011)

I know, it's still building but they're already shitting themselves. Never thought I'd live to see this. Warms my heart.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 30, 2011)

Not yet..


----------



## HST (Nov 30, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Not yet..


...but soon


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Nov 30, 2011)

Hello
I am a neewbee to all of this,only found this site a week ago.....about the same time I suddenly decided to have a definate(if poss) political view. I am a nurse and had to think very hard about what to do with this strike,however the autumn statement managed to clarify how I felt and left work this morning 3hrs early so pissed off!!this is a government who wants to encourage people to go out and work??.....I"m finding it very hard to believe when most of my patients get more in benefits than I do working every shift man sends and then gett to pay tax on my SMALL pension and receive no benefits when I retire and if I'm really lucky get to pay tax on what is left ... AGAIN.......I am furious!
Sorry 4 any spelling mistakes,don't have computer,can't afford one,and it's like working with a postage stamp on my mobile.


----------



## killer b (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> most of my patients get more in benefits than I do working every shift man sends


----------



## Brainaddict (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> most of my patients get more in benefits than I do working


I'm glad you're pissed off about what the government is doing, but just to say, the above statement is almost certainly not true. Possibly you've been listening to people who like to make stuff up. In general, one of the reasons governments like to attack benefits is to get people to work for even less (even for free right now), and that means the attacks on benefits will in the long run lower your wage.


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Hello
> I am a neewbee to all of this,only found this site a week ago.....about the same time I suddenly decided to have a definate(if poss) political view. I am a nurse and had to think very hard about what to do with this strike,however the autumn statement managed to clarify how I felt and left work this morning 3hrs early so pissed off!!this is a government who wants to encourage people to go out and work??.....I"m finding it very hard to believe when most of my patients get more in benefits than I do working every shift man sends and then gett to pay tax on my SMALL pension and receive no benefits when I retire and if I'm really lucky get to pay tax on what is left ... AGAIN.......I am furious!
> Sorry 4 any spelling mistakes,don't have computer,can't afford one,and it's like working with a postage stamp on my mobile.



First up, nice one for taking a stand.  I'm a student nurse, I wish more of us took a stand, I was the only student at the university picket line today.  I would say though, don't fall into the "divide and rule" trap in thinking that people on benefits are better off than you and living the life of Reilly.  They're not.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 30, 2011)

madzone said:


> Ahh - got it - thanks.
> 
> I got into a bit of a debate with 'someone' earlier. I didn't go int uni today depsite the studios and the technical workshops being open. I would have been working in the technical workshops where the technicicans decided not to strike. I don't support their decision as I feel it undermines the rest of the union members who _did_ decide to strike so I didn't go in. I also have a problem crossing a picket line - even if it's not me on strike iyswim. The person i was arguing with says I'm daft because _my_ union wasn't striking. Am I daft? Is my support pointless?



not at all, i didnt go in today.


----------



## purenarcotic (Nov 30, 2011)

madzone said:


> Ahh - got it - thanks.
> 
> I got into a bit of a debate with 'someone' earlier. I didn't go int uni today depsite the studios and the technical workshops being open. I would have been working in the technical workshops where the technicicans decided not to strike. I don't support their decision as I feel it undermines the rest of the union members who _did_ decide to strike so I didn't go in. I also have a problem crossing a picket line - even if it's not me on strike iyswim. The person i was arguing with says I'm daft because _my_ union wasn't striking. Am I daft? Is my support pointless?



Not at all; the lecturers from my uni on the picket really appreciated the student presence, I actually think student presence outnumbered those lecturers who had turned up to picket.  They were as upset with students crossing the line as they were with fellow colleagues.


----------



## marty21 (Nov 30, 2011)

View attachment 15025View attachment 15025


----------



## marty21 (Nov 30, 2011)

Pictures from today in London.


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Nov 30, 2011)

Which bit that I said isn't true?.always open to an opinion to think about provided free speach isn't critisised.


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Nov 30, 2011)

Iam still confused as to ur point!??........did I post sumut that some alien took over or did I say I walked out of my job!!!!!


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Which bit that I said isn't true?.always open to an opinion to think about provided free speach isn't critisised.



Why not respond to what has been said to you?


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 30, 2011)

I'm going to take an early punt on troll/banned returner.


----------



## ddraig (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Iam still confused as to ur point!??........did I post sumut that some alien took over or did I say I walked out of my job!!!!!


you said your patients got more on benifits than u got en wages


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Nov 30, 2011)

To marty1...how cute is she in 1st photo!.....good wrk.mate just phoned about her day sounded great,sadly I was wrking nites and also look after my mum who is unwell.


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> To marty1...how cute is she in 1st photo!.....good wrk.mate just phoned about her day sounded great,sadly I was wrking nites and also look after my mum who is unwell.



You gonna respond?


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Nov 30, 2011)

Yep they often doget more in benefits


----------



## ddraig (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Yep they often doget more in benefits


any proof? how do you know?


----------



## ethel (Nov 30, 2011)

i was on a picket line for fda today. tweeted a lot at www.twitter.com/arc_union

A socialist worker guy took my photo and had a chat. he knew mike!


----------



## 8ball (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Yep they often doget more in benefits



Where is this benefits office of which you speak?


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 30, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Yep they often doget more in benefits



How much are you paid and how much do they get in benefits? How many people are dependent on your wage, and how many people are dependent on their benefits, or what services do they have to procure with their benefits for instance for a disability?


----------



## DaveCinzano (Nov 30, 2011)

Anyone posted today's chunkymark report?


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 30, 2011)

Is he trying not to swear again?


----------



## DaveCinzano (Nov 30, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Is he trying not to swear again?



He doesn't last very long


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 1, 2011)

we had to book a different room at the last minute for the rally because it was about ten times bigger than expected.


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 1, 2011)

Romanians know where it's at:

http://www.ziare.com/europa/marea-b...ugetari-in-strada-1136908#adaugare-comentariu Loo kat the highest rated comment.

La noi se inghesuie la promotii etc...si se mai si danseaza PINGuinul....

Sa intelegem ca le convin Epoca Securista Interlopa a Actualei Coaliti care ne mandrim cu ei cum DISTRUG aceasta natie.

Mult a fost putin a mai ramas , eu stiu ca cetateanul Roman TRAIESTE mai PRO_st ca inainte de 89 . Este CONDAmnat la Moarte cu acte normative = Genocid.

Aloooooooooooo Serviciilor care va Tradati acest POPOR si sustineti actuala Coalitie Interlopa TREzitiva - NU veti lua nimic in GROAPA cu voi....

Opriti mafia actualei Coaliti Interlope Securiste de la Distrugerea Romaniei , puteti lua exemplu de la SERVICIILE din Marea Britanie...

Heres a rough translation

Our flock to promotions etc is just leading to a penguin dance. We need to understand that the current mafia "security" coalition is proud to destroy this nation. I was less than the left, but I know that a romanian citizen is living on "pro_street"(??) but is sentenced to death with all these regulations, it's like genocide. Helloooooooo, services that sustain people and which the current coalition has betrayed, wake up - you [i presume he means the coalitio nhere] will not take anything with you in the pit! Stop the current mafia "security" coalition of Romania from destroying the country, you can take an example from workers in the UK!


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 1, 2011)

A pro-scabbing comment is receiving a lot of negative votes as well


----------



## 8ball (Dec 1, 2011)

"Fat fucking bankers' kids!!"


----------



## marty21 (Dec 1, 2011)

DaveCinzano said:


> Anyone posted today's chunkymark report?



his Why I am striking clip is becoming a bit of a hit, 35000 hits last time I looked, he is hilarious whilst also making some very good points.


----------



## catinthehat (Dec 1, 2011)

A good turn out in Dundee where the adjacent shopping mall Overgate decided that anyone who was sporting strike apparel such as high viz stewards jackets and/or armbands would be refused entry - including an obviously pregnant woman who wanted to use the loo - given the rabid expansion of the private sector into 'management' of public space most city center facilities are within these places.  Whilst not a fan of public witchhunts their Facebook page which was all 'come and see santa' 'buy this party frock'  is now all 'disgraceful' and 'shame on you'.


----------



## quimcunx (Dec 1, 2011)

*heads over to the overgate facebook page*

Hm.  you got a link?


----------



## Delroy Booth (Dec 1, 2011)

Sorry for being a bit late to the party, here's an update from huddersfield

http://www.examiner.co.uk/news/loca...s-on-strike-video-and-gallery-86081-29872309/

Huge turnout, biggest demo in my lifetime in sleepy little Huddersfield, very militant and very jovial. No bother at all. Examiner and police both say about 2,000 people, I reckon maybe more close to 3,000, which is beyond what anyone expected. Prior to this the people organizing had liased with the police and said they expected about 500 with 1,000 max, so this turnout pleased everyone. The demo was great, lasted for age, and there was huge support from members of the public. People stood at the sides of the street applauding us and cars beeping their horns! I can't remember a strike this popular before, it makes you wonder why the Labour Party is trying to distance itself from it, because certainly up here backing the strike is a vote-winner, not a vote-loser. Obviously Labour council leader Mehboob Khan knows that, and gave a speech at the conclusion of the rally, just next to Harold Wilson's statue, which was a bit hard to stomach for some when you consider the cuts his administration is passing through.

Majority of the schools were closed, plenty of schoolkids on the demo, job centre had a good picket line and a majority were out but they managed to stay open like most Job centres in the country on a skeleton staff. Lots of picket lines in the town centre, and a really good feel about the whole thing. There was even a rousing chorus of "I'd rather be a picket than a scab" as we passed an office block full of scabbing council workers, which was met with hearty approval by the marchers and general public. Nice to see there's still some militancy kicking around amongst everyday people!

After asking around apparently the turnouts to events today has been excellent, and the sort of surprise we had in Huddersfield with the size of the demo has been repeated all over the place. The Demo in Manchester was massive, so was Sheffield, so was Glasgow. Today will do wonders for the confidence of the movement at-large, and it should send a clear message to the govt that we're not gonna take this lying down!


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 1, 2011)

Royal mail drivers refused to deliver when they saw there was a line. Which was nice.


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 1, 2011)

Blagsta said:


> First up, nice one for taking a stand.  I'm a student nurse, I wish more of us took a stand, I was the only student at the university picket line today.  I would say though, don't fall into the "divide and rule" trap in thinking that people on benefits are better off than you and living the life of Reilly.  They're not.





Blagsta said:


> First up, nice one for taking a stand.  I'm a student nurse, I wish more of us took a stand, I was the only student at the university picket line today.  I would say though, don't fall into the "divide and rule" trap in thinking that people on benefits are better off than you and living the life of Reilly.  They're not.


I Will keep that in mind,however a bitter pill at the moment when their "pay" is I line with inflation and mine most certainly  isn't forthe next few years





ddraig said:


> any proof? how do you know?


Yep I do have proof as spend half my shifts listening to complaints about benefits or helping them fill out the bloody forms!y


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 1, 2011)

the very rich are nicking your pension to pay for their own fiscal fuck up and yet you are moaning about the very poor?


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 1, 2011)

I am saddened to report that resident unison rep was struck down all night by intense leg cramp and is in a foul mood this morning. It was quite cold yesterday morning, and all the standing must have triggered some old peoples problem whereby you cramp up for no reason.

However, a nice turnout all round- have yet to check the hospital pickets and wider picture reports from northampton as a whole.

Just caught that cameron called millibot 'weak, left wing and irresponsible' at PMQ's

2 outta three aint bad...


----------



## teahead (Dec 1, 2011)

Maybe it's already been posted around here but which public sectors are being referred to this morning as getting more than their private sector equivalents?

afail that's true of more senior teachers, some full-time social/health care professionals working in the 'voluntary' sector
afaik that's entirely untrue of doctors, lawyers (e.g. public sector solicitors), independent social workers etc

The general issue about "public sector = better paid" seems like a divide and rule tactic to avoid talking about whether pay for different traces/professions allocated to the public sector are adequately renumerated, or whether there's a concession made in pensions to offset poorer rewards in service.

Didn't the pension entitlement age for some public sector workers used to be lower than for those with private pensions? Or did they just have the option of taking less at 60 than if they retired at 65, like people with private pensions?

And is the gender differentiation on age now at parity between public and private pension providers, in the new proposals?


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Which bit that I said isn't true?.always open to an opinion to think about provided free speach isn't critisised.


Free speech is when even people you disagree with get to have their say.  Nobody here is criticising free speech, they're just disagreeing with your downer on unemployed people.

It's important not to fall into the trap that successive governments have laid by demonising people on benefits.  Demonising those on benefits has a number of effects.

First, it is divide and rule. We resent Them because they are seen to be scrounging and having a nice time off our labour (it diverts us from the fact that the bankers etc are the ones having the really nice time at our expense).

Second, demonising the unemployed helps to make it harder to get out of that ghetto.  Why is that useful to business?  Having a large unemployed pool means that, through the laws of supply and demand, wages can be attacked. Wages can be lower because there is over supply of labour.  (Just like a glut of tomatoes lowers the price of tomatoes).

Thirdly, as well as wages, conditions and security can be attacked.  You'll have noticed the Tories and LibDems saying how making it easier to sack people is "good for business".  That sort of thing is a direct result of demonising the unemployed.  Increasing fear of unemployment (we don't want to be One Of Them) and antipathy towards those on benefits means it it easier to attack conditions and security.

The vast majority of claimants are desperate for work.  Living on benefits is not fun; it is miserable.  Stories attacking disability benefits is just another way of attacking disabled people.  And remember also that there are "acceptable" benefits.  Tax credits are benefits.  These are usually exempt from the disapprobation.


----------



## redsquirrel (Dec 1, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> Royal mail drivers refused to deliver when they saw there was a line. Which was nice.


Excellent,


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

yeah, Royal Mail fairly dependable on for solidarity
never seen them cross a picket i've been on, only had probs with ups and them types
'i can see what you're saying but i'll lose my job mate'


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> I Will keep that in mind,however a bitter pill at the moment when their "pay" is I line with inflation and mine most certainly isn't forthe next few years
> *Yep I do have proof as spend half my shifts listening to complaints about benefits or helping them fill out the bloody forms!*y


so why don't you swap with one of them then? 
if you'll be better off and have more 'free' time, then they can be the unfortunate one with a job


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 1, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Free speech is when even people you disagree with get to have their say.  Nobody here is criticising free speech, they're just disagreeing with your downer on unemployed people.
> 
> It's important not to fall into the trap that successive governments have laid by demonising people on benefits.  Demonising those on benefits has a number of effects.
> 
> ...


Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 1, 2011)

ddraig said:


> so why don't you swap with one of them then?
> if you'll be better off and have more 'free' time, then they can be the unfortunate one with a job


We all think about doing just that a lot of the time


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit


wow!
so it is about 1 person is it? not 'people on benefits getting more than i do in pay' now?
why don't you grass them then? if it is real and you have actual proof

can you see how you projecting your views/experience of one person onto benefit claimants in general is a bit unfair?


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit



Copyright the Daily Mail and Daily Express (all editions ever)


----------



## butchersapron (Dec 1, 2011)

Millions of these cunts ain't there. One next door to me.


----------



## gentlegreen (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all think about doing just that a lot of the time


so why don't you then?
what is it that stops you?


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit


What percentage of people on DLA have a £2000 per week coke habit?

Just as there are those who want to divide public sector workers (like you) from those of us who work in the private sector (like me), by saying you've got a cushy pension at our expense, so the powers-that-be would just love us to think all disabled people are coked-up scroungers. Solidarity means we need to tell the powers-that-be to piss off.


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all think about doing just that a lot of the time


I don't.


----------



## geminisnake (Dec 1, 2011)

I know nothing about cocaine apart from I think it'sillegal, white powder and shite(imo) but wouldn't £2k a week kill you??


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> I don't.


I presume they mean the nurses
do you mean yourself and other nurses cgb1?


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 1, 2011)

ddraig said:


> I presume they mean the nurses


My best mate's a nurse.  I've never heard him talk about his desire to swap lives with a doley.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> My best mate's a nurse. I've never heard him talk about his desire to swap lives with a doley.


oh well he obviously needs the scales lifting from his stupid caring eyes!
he could be living it up, going to clubs and having all the recovery time in the world
it's just soooo easy I don't know why we're not all doing it!


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 1, 2011)

Yep the nurses.......but I guess a lot of the time we are seeing the bad side of the whole DLA thing not the ones who do need it therefor it pisses us off.especially at the moment.


----------



## JimW (Dec 1, 2011)

My brother's a nurse; he's missed out on this cunning scheme to sit around on his arse snorting lines too.


----------



## belboid (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Yep the nurses.......but I guess a lot of the time we are seeing the bad side of the whole DLA thing not the ones who do need it therefor it pisses us off.especially at the moment.


or...you are making up drivel.  And probably not just at the moment


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Yep the nurses.......but I guess a lot of the time we are seeing the bad side of the whole DLA thing not the ones who do need it therefor it pisses us off.especially at the moment.


so is this just one person?
how do you know how much they get? do they really get more than £2000 a week? as obviously you'd need a bit of food and drink to go with the £2k's worth of coke wouldn't you...

maybe you can get a bung from the Sun or Daily Fail for this amazing story
"Sick Snorting Scrounger Scuppers (s)Caring Staff"
A benefit scrounger claiming nearly £3000 A WEEK! isn't even turning up for their hospital appointments leaving poor nurses at a loose end and WASTING EVEN MORE of YOUR TAX MONEY.
the person, not yet named, LIVES A LIFE OF LOUNGING in the day and PARTIES the night away.


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 1, 2011)

We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either



Take this "fact" and the others to the British "Democracy" Forum - they'd love you there.  Really


----------



## belboid (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either


yes dear, and we also all know that there a million completely bullshit stories about people claiming £3000 a week to sit on their arses, bleeding hard working tax payers dry.  Its all part of exactly the same argument as the one that hard working taxpayers are subsidising the gold plated nurses pension.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either


so do you know of someone claiming over £2000 a week or not?
are they a patient of yours or not?


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

ahhhh paragliding, the sport of scroungers!


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 1, 2011)

We know what they get coz we deal with their finances at times or they show you. Usually topped up with some drud dealing of course it would be a bit stupid to think they get 3k a week in just bebefits wouldn't it........but their benefits are more than some full time wages . I don't really care if u believe me or not 2 b frank


----------



## fractionMan (Dec 1, 2011)

Where do I sign up for this 2k in benefits thing?  Sounds great!


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit



Let's assume for a moment what you say is true. how many people does this apply to?


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all think about doing just that a lot of the time


All of you? Sounds like you have a problem with burnout in your team. Do you get clinical supervision? Are you a general nurse or mental health nurse?


----------



## belboid (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> I don't really care if u believe me or not 2 b frank



that's good cos everyone here thinks you're a liar


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We know what they get coz we deal with their finances at times or they show you. Usually topped up with some drud dealing of course it would be a bit stupid to think they get 3k a week in just bebefits wouldn't it........but their benefits are more than some full time wages . I don't really care if u believe me or not 2 b frank


how much is the highest you have seen someone claim then? with your own eyes?
if it so important and such an outrage then surely you'd want to expose it? and prove it?


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Yep the nurses.......but I guess a lot of the time we are seeing the bad side of the whole DLA thing not the ones who do need it therefor it pisses us off.especially at the moment.



If you know someone is claiming DLA fraudulenty, surely you have a duty under the NMC Code of Conduct, to do something about it?


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either


So the system works then.


----------



## marty21 (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit



2k a week for coke, plus the Housing Benefit, Council Tax Benefit, Child Benefit, DWA, JSA - where is the claim form? I want in!


----------



## weepiper (Dec 1, 2011)

Lalala troll... anyway, the Edinburgh Evening News reports that there was an estimated 10,000 on the march, and the council's own estimate is that 12,500 staff were on strike, which is 68% of the whole workforce


----------



## marty21 (Dec 1, 2011)

Newspapers and the Police always underestimate - they said 25000 on the London March, I'm convinced there were way more than that - we were shuffling along, filled up Lincoln's Inn Fields - well the roads and pavements around there - and the procession along the Strand took about 2 pints


----------



## peterkro (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit


If you actually believe this you are a complete fantasist.Anybody with a 2 grand a week coke habit is either/or a very successful dealer,other criminal,I've seen a few well paid people (architects,doctors et al ) keep it up for a short time but they soon wake up in a bare room and realise that losing their job was the least of what they'd lost.


----------



## DaveCinzano (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> ...£2000 a week...





catgirlbullit1 said:


> ...3k a week...



Mein Gott - up 50% in just 22 posts! And we all know where this sort of hyperinflation took Weimar Germany...


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

reckon it will be back?


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 1, 2011)

Unfortunately there are nurses who believe this sort of crap.


----------



## Guineveretoo (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Yep they often doget more in benefits


You said "most" originally, and now it is "often".

I am intrigued as to how you know this, if you are not a troll, how come you get paid so little compared to other nurses, and how come your patients are telling you how much benefits they receive. In many years' experience of the NHS, I have never been asked how much money I make/receive.


----------



## Guineveretoo (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit


How on earth would you know this about your patients? I have no idea if I am feeding a troll, here, but you certainly sound like a Daily Mail reader!


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

madzone said:


> Ahh - got it - thanks.
> 
> I got into a bit of a debate with 'someone' earlier. I didn't go int uni today depsite the studios and the technical workshops being open. I would have been working in the technical workshops where the technicicans decided not to strike. I don't support their decision as I feel it undermines the rest of the union members who _did_ decide to strike so I didn't go in. I also have a problem crossing a picket line - even if it's not me on strike iyswim. The person i was arguing with says I'm daft because _my_ union wasn't striking. Am I daft? Is my support pointless?



Not at all pointless. If more people had the guts not to cross any picket lines, regardless of union membership, the boss class would have a harder time fucking people over than they do.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Passed this today and thought WTF. Police 'cordon' apparently.



Can see those "port-holes" getting paint-bombed in minutes at a less well-organised demo.


----------



## _angel_ (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either


DLA has got nothing to do with ability to work or not. Plenty of people claim DLA to help them GET to work. Why is there so much disinformation about this. Oh yes people like you.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> I Will keep that in mind,however a bitter pill at the moment when their "pay" is I line with inflation and mine most certainly isn't forthe next few years.



The coalition are to blame for that. Benefits were tied to the RPI (retail price index), but the Treasury had a brainwave - why not link benefits to CPI (consumer price index), because that would mean lower increases?
Well, it *would* have meant lower increases if the Treasury and the Chancellor hadn't made such a hamfisted cock-up with the cuts and actually caused inflation to rise, which in turn caused the CPI to rise. 
Don't hate the benefits claimant. Hate the economically-illiterate politicians.



> Yep I do have proof as spend half my shifts listening to complaints about benefits or helping them fill out the bloody forms!y



That doesn't actually *prove* anything, youknow. Filling out a form doesn't mean the person actually has their claim accepted.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Fair enough,but it pisses me off when someone is on full dla because they pretend to be scared to go out of ttheir house and when being given help are constantly AWOL at night clubs,return off their heads and expect other people to pay for their £2000 a week coke habbit



Yeah, because most of us on DLA do that, don't we? 

BTW, if you know people who do this, report them. They're fucking over people like me, with long-term disabilities and illnesses, who *don't* pretend to be ill, *don't* go out clubbing and *don't* have drug habits (except insofar as we have to take prescription drugs to keep us alive).

If you're not prepared to report such people, you've got no right whatsoever to moan about them, because your silence endorses their behaviour.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> Copyright the Daily Mail and Daily Express (all editions ever)


Maximum DLA is £135 a week, and that is at the almost unattainable "high mobility component, high care component" rates, which less than a fifth of DLA claimants qualify for. The degree of disability you have to prove is massive, and agoraphobics don't tend to qualify for mobility component, so catgirlbullit1's "£2000 a week coke habit"_schtick_ has a big hole in it.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> What percentage of people on DLA have a £2000 per week coke habit?



Highest rate of DLA is £135 a week, or about 6.7% of what you'd need to support a £2k a week coke habit.

You'd have to be coining a fuckload of dosh from elsewhere to keep that sort of habit in play.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either



You can't get DLA "coz your back aches". What weird ill-informed world do you live in?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

ddraig said:


> so do you know of someone claiming over £2000 a week or not?
> are they a patient of yours or not?



It's impossible to claim £2k a week in benefits, even including a mahoosive housing benefit claim in with that, and with 10 kids.


----------



## DaveCinzano (Dec 1, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Can see those "port-holes" getting paint-bombed in minutes at a less well-organised demo.



I can see certain types of liquid being decanted or piped under the gap at the bottom at even rowdier get-togethers


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We know what they get coz we deal with their finances at times or they show you. Usually topped up with some drud dealing of course it would be a bit stupid to think they get 3k a week in just bebefits wouldn't it........but their benefits are more than some full time wages . I don't really care if u believe me or not 2 b frank



I'm glad you don't care, because you're talking arrant shite.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

DaveCinzano said:


> I can see certain types of liquid being decanted or piped under the gap at the bottom at even rowdier get-togethers



What a spiffing idea!!


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 1, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> You said "most" originally, and now it is "often".
> 
> I am intrigued as to how you know this, if you are not a troll, how come you get paid so little compared to other nurses, and how come your patients are telling you how much benefits they receive. In many years' experience of the NHS, I have never been asked how much money I make/receive.



It's not that uncommon for nurses to know about patient's finances if they're in for a long stay.  Especially mental health nurses, often we help apply for benefits and help patient's manage budgets.


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 1, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Can see those "port-holes" getting paint-bombed in minutes at a less more well-organised demo.



Cheers - VP's editor.


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 1, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Highest rate of DLA is £135 a week, or about 6.7% of what you'd need to support a £2k a week coke habit.
> 
> You'd have to be coining a fuckload of dosh from elsewhere to keep that sort of habit in play.


I know.  My guess is that the %age I was looking for was 0%.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 1, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> It's impossible to claim £2k a week in benefits, even including a mahoosive housing benefit claim in with that, and with 10 kids.


butbutbut with all those brand new big flatscreen televisions and vouchers they get, it all adds up downt it?


----------



## Serotonin (Dec 1, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> We all know there are people who screw the system...they are the people de-valuing disabled people. The girl nxt to me tried to get DLA, coz her back aches,was refused it,so got a job instead,and she's a bloody nurse. It didn't stop her paragliding either


You do realise that DLA is non means tested and having a job is irrelevant to whether its awarded.

As a nurse Im fucking embarassed by you and for you.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 1, 2011)

Blagsta said:


> Cheers - VP's editor.


----------



## DaveCinzano (Dec 1, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> What a spiffing idea!!



As a parent I think it's important not to spoil a child by getting them new toys when they have hardly played with their old ones.

So in a similar fashion, no water cannons for the police until they've got some use out of their fire retardant boiler suits.


----------



## xenon (Dec 1, 2011)

I know must be troll but seriously. 3K a week in bennefits. 2K a week coke habit?
LOL


----------



## catinthehat (Dec 1, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> *heads over to the overgate facebook page*
> 
> Hm. you got a link?


http://www.facebook.com/dundeeshopping
There you go.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 1, 2011)

I was on local TV for a fraction of a mini-microsecond yesterday, well done to them as spotted it  

I picketted -- just for a couple of hours in my case -- with a fair few harder working reps who were there for longer. We're a big centre, and most driving through were contractors (ie not direct employees) which was not great that they did. But they're on completely different (company based) arrangements and -- it was rumoured -- were earning more to do 'maintenance work' than usual because so many of the regular workforce were out. And of those contractors, probably somewhere around half of them were happy to take leaflets through their car windows. We reckoned that most of those driving through who _were_ grim faced or even hostile, were guilty/pissed off direct employees, or in more cases, managers.

To put the above into context, the estimate from my local floow reps  was that of the directly employed woprkforce, casual contract people included, *well* over three quarters were out -- a few on long-in-advance booked leave, but most losing a day's pay. OK, I saw oen or two people I recognised shopping in town later but they weren't crossing picket lines!,

Whiole the picket was going, it would seem that we managed to persuade a tiny number of actual employees to turn round and go home, we definitely persuaded a delivering lorry driver not to cross the line 

I managed to get to the pub before 11 am (Spoons yay!) before we went along to join the City Centre bound march (festivaldeb is Unison).

To my surprise I saw a local estimate of 5,000 on the march/rally -- my own guess was lower, hope I'm wrong ...

Big general positivity to all those on here and beyond who took any kind of action, or were just supportive in general


----------



## quimcunx (Dec 1, 2011)

catinthehat said:


> http://www.facebook.com/dundeeshopping
> There you go.



Thanks.  Comment made.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 2, 2011)

sooo
have been asked by my manager for my pay number to confirm who didn't come in on Weds 
surely they MUST know and are just getting us to confirm ourselves that we are STRIKERS!


----------



## Guineveretoo (Dec 2, 2011)

ddraig said:


> sooo
> have been asked by my manager for my pay number to confirm who didn't come in on Weds
> surely they MUST know and are just getting us to confirm ourselves that we are STRIKERS!


I am not sure what a "pay number" is, but you do have a duty to tell your manager if you were striking, after which they will deduct a day's pay. So I guess that is what they are doing?


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 2, 2011)

Guineveretoo said:


> I am not sure what a "pay number" is, but you do have a duty to tell your manager if you were striking, after which they will deduct a day's pay. So I guess that is what they are doing?


Employee number on your pay slip, presumably.  Not sure why that's necessary, though.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 2, 2011)

yes i know
just the doing there job for them really
i will let them know at some point, maybe today


----------



## ddraig (Dec 2, 2011)

danny la rouge said:


> Employee number on your pay slip, presumably. Not sure why that's necessary, though.


yes that


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 2, 2011)

http://www.bucksfreepress.co.uk/news/9394044.VIDEO__Hundreds_at_strike_rallies_in_Bucks/?ref=fap


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 2, 2011)

ddraig said:


> yes that


They must know it already, and use it to work out what you're due and who to pay it to every month!


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 2, 2011)

William of Walworth said:


> Big general positivity to all those on here and beyond who took any kind of action, or were just supportive in general



It's probably the only demo i've been on where passers by/shoppers were applauding the marchers


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 2, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> It's probably the only demo i've been on where passers by/shoppers were applauding the marchers


Yeah, this happened in brum too.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 2, 2011)

Amazing what efforts those who didn't strike are making to offer excuses as to why they went to work.For the first time in ages they really are on the defensive.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 2, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Highest rate of DLA is £135 a week, or about 6.7% of what you'd need to support a £2k a week coke habit.



Nah, £125.00pw, and that would be the claimant getting DLA Mobility high rate @ £51.40pw + DLA Care righ rate @ £73.60pw.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 2, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> Nah, £125.00pw, and that would be the claimant getting DLA Mobility high rate @ £51.40pw + DLA Care righ rate @ £73.60pw.



Yep, you're right!  @ self!


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 2, 2011)

wtf, ive just seen this 



ItWillNeverWork said:


> It's not a workplace for _him_ is what I meant. But I concede your point about him enabling others to break the pick-line.



I don't understand how the parliament is not his workplace, when he's an MP. If it's not his workplace then what is his workplace then? And while he may not be on strike and therefore not doing the work of a striking worker, he's helping the parliament to stay open, whereas the aim of the picket line is to shut it down.


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

I know it's the governments fault reay! To go into how I know how much people get takes too bloody long,I can't report DLA fraud as I have confidentiality issues,and it's doctors who end up signing these things.they point I was obviously failing to put across very well was why I was pissed off,why I was striking and that when you see people screwing the system at times like this it makes it doubly annoying,and whoever posted sumut about being disabled shud b annoyed too  as it's taking possible funds away from you
And anyone spending that much clearly has a job!
As 4 the burnout comment u r probably right,the whole ward has it as this job doesn't at times seem valued.
Oh....and I think my supervisor is as pissed off too ,so not much cop there.
I actually love my job believe it or not...................but was looking at a big cloud of red infront of my eyes after that statement and any fucker in my orbit got it..


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

I know it's the governments fault reay! To go into how I know how much people get takes too bloody long,I can't report DLA fraud as I have confidentiality issues,and it's doctors who end up signing these things.they point I was obviously failing to put across very well was why I was pissed off,why I was striking and that when you see people screwing the system at times like this it makes it doubly annoying,and whoever posted sumut about being disabled shud b annoyed too  as it's taking possible funds away from you
And anyone spending that much clearly has a job!
As 4 the burnout comment u r probably right,the whole ward has it as this job doesn't at times seem valued.
Oh....and I think my supervisor is as pissed off too ,so not much cop there.
I actually love my job believe it or not...................but was looking at a big cloud of red infront of my eyes after that statement and any fucker in my orbit got it..


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 3, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> I know it's the governments fault reay! To go into how I know how much people get takes too bloody long,I can't report DLA fraud as I have confidentiality issues...



No, you don't. You're not a priest or a lawyer. You have no legal or moral obligation to cover up for thieves and cheats.



> and it's doctors who end up signing these things.they point I was obviously failing to put across very well was why I was pissed off,why I was striking and that when you see people screwing the system at times like this it makes it doubly annoying,and whoever posted sumut about being disabled shud b annoyed too as it's taking possible funds away from you



Yes, which is why *you* piss me off by using the excuse of "confidentiality issues" to escape reporting the people you claim are ripping off the taxpayer.


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

It's not just the taxpayer tho is it,it's everyone.....r u telling me you go running around outing anyone you know of who is doing it.........and we do do what we can when we think it's gonna have any effect.We get far less in now anyway or it's often short stay as now the bebefit stops after a few weeks and staff can focus on those with a genuine need


----------



## _angel_ (Dec 3, 2011)

Serotonin said:


> You do realise that DLA is non means tested and having a job is irrelevant to whether its awarded.
> 
> As a nurse Im fucking embarassed by you and for you.


I know I already mentioned this, but it does need saying again. DLA is not an out of work benefit.
My friend works as an OT assistant and has seen a lot of her patients who clearly do have a need, having their DLA claims rejected en masse.


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

I never said it was,just that there are people getting it that shudnt,just as there are those that don't and should...


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

If you really believe that there aren't people using this to top-up their income or as a means of not working then I am clearly not the only fool out here.
Anyhow I'm off to meet some other fools,order enough food to feed a small country,go through a few holiday mags and see how many I can book on my massive pension,and if I'm really lucky I may get to drown a few kittens and puppies on my way home


----------



## ddraig (Dec 3, 2011)

no one has said that there aren't people out there taking the piss
you made some outrageous claims that you haven't or won't back up

do you or do you not know of an individual getting over £2000 a week in benefits?

and as others have said, you are looking in the wrong place


----------



## marty21 (Dec 3, 2011)

ddraig said:


> sooo
> have been asked by my manager for my pay number to confirm who didn't come in on Weds
> surely they MUST know and are just getting us to confirm ourselves that we are STRIKERS!


tell the manager to find out the info himself ffs, that's their job


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

You get yourself a few different names and addresses.
It's not rocket-science.
And now ggetting a tad boring explaining what everyone knows goes on,which I guess is my own fault for mentioning it in the first place


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 3, 2011)

it's not rocket science, it's fraud. Which if you've ever engaged in on any scale you'd realise that the time and effort it would take to defraud the dole for the amounts you are talking about is not worth it. There are far greater rewards to be had elsewhere if you want to go to the sort of lengths you are talking about.  You're basically talking out of your backside and regurgitating shite from the newspapers owned by the mates of the people nicking your pension. They've distracted you from your real enemy. The one whose fiscal improprieties affect you personally and society as a whole. Don't be a mug 'everyone knows' is bullshit.


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 3, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> You get yourself a few different names and addresses.


And this is wide-spread, is it?

The problem is that the way you brought it up you seemed to be implying that this was the norm for people receiving benefits.  That most are "at it".  In fact, what you're really saying is that there are some thieving con artists in the world.  We know.  There are also medical professionals who murder people, but you'd be correctly pissed off if I started calling all employees of the NHS "Shiptons".


----------



## ddraig (Dec 3, 2011)

ok then
my last point, why don't you do it?
will you admit it's really not that many people is it?
thanks and still well done for striking


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

I can't even remember how I said to b honest,but I was extreemely angry so am certainly willing to accept that it came across badly and wasn't meant to offend the genuine article.And yep,there r badasses in every walk of life


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

Hehe.......no it's not that many people......but the day of the srike I was more than willing to put a gun to the heads of those that do
Did I say it was hundreds ?...


----------



## catgirlbullit1 (Dec 3, 2011)

i





DotCommunist said:


> it's not rocket science, it's fraud. Which if you've ever engaged in on any scale you'd realise that the time and effort it would take to defraud the dole for the amounts you are talking about is not worth it. There are far greater rewards to be had elsewhere if you want to go to the sort of lengths you are talking about.  You're basically talking out of your backside and regurgitating shite from the newspapers owned by the mates of the people nicking your pension. They've distracted you from your real enemy. The one whose fiscal improprieties affect you personally and society as a whole. Don't be a mug 'everyone knows' is bullshit.


M not spouting shit from papers,in my line of work we see this,I cudnt b arsed to come on here 4 that.


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 3, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> Hehe.......no it's not that many people......but the day of the srike I was more than willing to put a gun to the heads of those that do
> Did I say it was hundreds ?...


Well, would you need a revolver or a semi automatic and several magazines?


----------



## dennisr (Dec 3, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> I was extreemely angry so am certainly willing to accept that it came across badly and wasn't meant to offend the genuine article.



I think you have to be a wee bit more thoughtful and careful who you rant about no matter how - completely understandably - angry you are about what is happening to you and the rest of us. And the rest of us includes the unemployed and the sick and ill. They have faced the sort of demonisation striking workers have faced recently - but for a decade plus - 'scroungers' this and 'spongers' that. Yep, there is always a few selfish tossers - including among the unemployed - among workers - among nurses - in any walk of life.

The biggest problem we face comes from the real parasites - the millionaires and liars running the show - a couple of dickheads on the fiddle don't begin to compare to the organised crime syndicates running the entire show. Our only weopan is our unity - we all have to be careful not to fall for the finger-pointing and scapegoating of the biggest criminals of all - the politicians, bosses, bankers and their hired lie-machine in the press. Its designed to keep folk like you and me under control and missing the real target.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 3, 2011)

_angel_ said:


> [a few pages back]DLA has got nothing to do with ability to work or not. Plenty of people claim DLA to help them GET to work. Why is there so much disinformation about this. Oh yes people like you.



Is catgirlbullit1 a formerly banned returner do you think, perhaps?


----------



## cantsin (Dec 3, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> i
> M not spouting shit from papers,in my line of work we see this,I cudnt b arsed to come on here 4 that.



 can't be arsed to go back and look, so anyone want to tell me how many pages this time wasting 'look at me ' utter fake has been de-railing this thread for ? Fucking cringeworthy .


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 3, 2011)

DaveCinzano said:


> Mein Gott - up 50% in just 22 posts! And we all know where this sort of hyperinflation took Weimar Germany...


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 3, 2011)

Blagsta said:


> If you know someone is claiming DLA fraudulenty, surely you have a duty under the NMC Code of Conduct, to do something about it?


 
'She' (or 'he') would have such a duty sure, if 'she' (or 'he') knew that the NMC Code of Conduct existed, or what it actually fuckin was  ...


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 3, 2011)

Blagsta said:


> Unfortunately there are nurses who believe this sort of crap.



Similarly with low paid bigots in the CS ....


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 3, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> It's impossible to claim £2k a week in benefits, even including a mahoosive housing benefit claim in with that, and with 10 kids.



Yeah but!!!!  

Some bloke down the pub told me what his sister's cat's grandmother had 'read' in the Sun, and some other feller had told the same Anecbloke about some other scrounging git 

So!!!!! Must be all true!!!! After hearing that, I decided today (after my 5th Sat pint  ) to resign from my shite job on Monday!!!

Then I'll be going down cushy street from Monday.

I'm a bit short of rugs right now, after all


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 3, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> You can't get DLA "coz your back aches". What weird ill-informed world do you live in?


 
Trollworld ... 

It's a *hugely* entertaining world to dip your toe into, if you're reading threads like this while pissed


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 3, 2011)

cantsin said:


> can't be arsed to go back and look, so anyone want to tell me how many pages this time wasting 'look at me ' utter fake has been de-railing this thread for ? Fucking cringeworthy .


 
Far too many, and I've definitely been adding to it 

My excuse it that it's Saturday and I'm pissed.

'Hers' is that 'she' hasn't been banned yet.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 4, 2011)

catgirlbullit1 said:


> It's not just the taxpayer tho is it,it's everyone.....r u telling me you go running around outing anyone you know of who is doing it.........



I don't run anywhere. I'm disabled.

Have I "outed" people who I'm absolutely sure are making false claims for disability benefits? Yep, absolutely. Each chancer who pulls a fast one on the DWP makes it harder for the next *genuinely* disabled person to claim successfully. Fuck 'em, and fuck the people who enable them.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 4, 2011)

William of Walworth said:


> Yeah but!!!!
> 
> Some bloke down the pub told me what his sister's cat's grandmother had 'read' in the Sun, and some other feller had told the same Anecbloke about some other scrounging git
> 
> So!!!!! Must be all true!!!! After hearing that, I decided today (after my 5th Sat pint  ) to resign from my shite job on Monday!!!



Someone told me that if you drink too many pints of Brains you start hallucinating. Must be true!



> Then I'll be going down cushy street from Monday.
> 
> I'm a bit short of rugs right now, after all



Spray on some fake tan so you can claim your "free car for all asylum seekers" too, mate!


----------



## phildwyer (Dec 4, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Have I "outed" people who I'm absolutely sure are making false claims for disability benefits? Yep, absolutely.



How can you possibly be "absolutely sure" about something like that?

Are you sure you're not just one of nature's rats?


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 4, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Someone told me that if you drink too many pints of Brains you start hallucinating. Must be true!



Brains = shit quality drugs 

So I'm going back to work tomorroh!!!  after all ...


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 4, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> I don't run anywhere. I'm disabled.
> 
> Have I "outed" people who I'm absolutely sure are making false claims for disability benefits? Yep, absolutely. Each chancer who pulls a fast one on the DWP makes it harder for the next *genuinely* disabled person to claim successfully.
> 
> Fuck 'em,* and fuck the people who enable them*.



The Sun (etc.) very much included, as I'm sure we wouldn't disagree about.


----------



## Satbp (Dec 5, 2011)

Not all of us who are on D.L.A are out to scam and scrounge , or sell drugs on the side nor out to claim as much money as they can get from the goverment and honest workin tax payers who have worked there arses off year in year out in some underpayed job .(Oh and just for the record  i would love to be one of them people if only for a day)I have been claiming middle rate DLA for last 2 years of my life after a psychiatrist diagnosed me with with my mental dissorder,I had to spend a year appealing against it, it was sent to a tribunal where a pannel of 3 judges who unanimously awarded me with this until early 2012.I wonder now what your thoughts are on my post .


----------



## Satbp (Dec 5, 2011)

So here is the rest of my story , this is the 1st time i have posted about this on any forum i dont know why I chose this one Welll that is a lie i do as its so you can see that not all are out for what they can get or for an easy life , as belive you mine is not easy , some would say its not even a life or its one wasted. I agree to a point but when i have nowhere or nobody to turn to only a Dr whom says I should get over it and try move on and obviously does not understand the scars and memories It has left upon me I live in hope that tomorrow will be my last reminder or amnesia blesses itself upon me.
To look at me you would think that there is nothing wrong with me. I have not lost  a limb , no dog that walks beside me, no wheelchair or any other kind of Disability that is visable to the eyes  If you were fortunate to cross my path which would be when nobody is around late at night  or early hours  , you would not see my face  i hide it even then ,i walk with my head down  cap on so i am not seen this is on the rare occasions that when  I do leave the prison  of my own home I think the only thought you would have is i'm in need of a good meal .
  My disability is Mentally .I suffer from Comple Ptsd , no I have not  been in a war torn situation nor have I been in a disaster that involved any other form of Ptsd . I was sexually abused constantly from a family member and his friend as a child from the age of 5 until i was 10 .I was then given back to my mum and dad where for 2 years i was mentally abused, tortured and beaten  by my father , whilst my mum sat back and watched . Following this i was then taken into care and made a section 2 ward of court until the age of 18 where  I spent a few years  going from childrens home to childrens home , until I was fostered out at 14  to a family where the kind dad sought it upon himself to abuse me some more. So i again was moved to another foster parent, until I moved out at 17 , thrown into a world with no support no counciling no help from family as i was disowned for the case that lead to the family member and his friend going to prison.
Two years ago i had to flee from my flat as  i had to testify in court  on behalf of my eldest sister  for the fight to get back her daughter where they had put on the documents my home address  . My eldest sister who stayed with my parents fled from the clutches of my dad ,nearly 3 years ago  leaving her child behind ( my niece is also my sister as a result of my dad ) She did not leave her out of choice as this would of never been an option it was due to the lack of choices she had and knowing that he would not stop until he hunted her down . They have only now taken in last 5 months taken her daughter my sister and niece into care
I spend my days alone scared trying to fight the demons that others put in my head .Too scared to leave my home and walk around in the day as normal people  who live a normal  life ( well what only i can imagine can be as normal a life) To sacred to go to sleep as the nightmares i endure .Nor to try to block out the images that i live with constantly in my head  from flashbacks to anxiety ,lack of concentration ( I started this post 4 hrs ago  maybe more) and  panic attacks ,this is just a few of the things i suffer as a result of my past.
I have been told that I can claim high care component which i should be claiming but I am still yet to fill out the online form as I feel what i have is enough , I do not ask for anything .If i was to ask for something it would be memory loss . The only thing that keeps me alive is that I above everything that i have endured over my lifetime i I actually do believe in god ,So i know what it is like to live hell everyday of my life  live it after this life ( or not i here the athiests cry) i dont want.
If only we could swap lives for 24 hrs .Would you want to ? I know i wouldn't I would not wish mine on anyone .So if i suffered for another to live a normal life then i would not change one thing about it .So yes whilst you are at busting ya ass of at work  these posts i type .WANA TRADE PLACES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 5, 2011)

phildwyer said:


> How can you possibly be "absolutely sure" about something like that?



Observation, listening, talking to the person themselves.



> Are you sure you're not just one of nature's rats?



Interesting that you're the first and only person on this thread to ask that, phil. Projection again?


----------



## treelover (Dec 5, 2011)

@satbp

I think you will find Catbullitgirl is in a minority on here, I imagine your post will be read and understood with sympathy..


----------



## Blagsta (Dec 5, 2011)

I've just sat in a first year nursing lecture about social and economic inequality and the impact on health and life expectancy. Most of my fellow students either didn't care and didn't see what relevance it has to nursing, or actively argued to justify continuing inequality. Catbuttgirl would have fitted right in.


----------



## treelover (Dec 5, 2011)

When I was NUS part of my responsibilities was looking after the well being of the Nursing Students on my campus, 1994, they certainly weren't like that then...


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 5, 2011)

welcome to the boards satbp.


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Dec 5, 2011)

What froggy said, satbp - welcome, and please stick around here


----------



## Satbp (Dec 5, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> What froggy said, satbp - welcome, and please stick around here


Thankyou Mell and Thankyou Froggy also for the welcomes .

I would also like to make a point on why i put the posts i put . There is a well known saying that 95% of people know  Tis the one about never judging a book by its cover .Through this thread i have read of people outing suspected benefit frauds along with so many people (Especially mentally ill sufferers ) to which are constantly judged on the lack of there visible disability , nobody knows what there next door neighbour has gone through , or the guy down the street , or even the girl who is at a club at 2.am out with friends ( would you still judge her if she had been in some tragic life changing situation where she had suffered for the last say 5 years of her life and finally after all that time her friends had finally convinced her to go out , after promising that they would stay by her side throughout the night . Would you then praise this girl for doing this after such a long time or still complain that she is on D.L.A  and out in a club ???? But yes I wonder how many thought yea just another spounger scabbing of hard working  people after my 1st post .

So many people are so quick to judge in this thread and even in this world without even knowing what the person they are judging has been through. I am all for the hardworkin people of this society who strike for shit pay and equallity with a decent wage Especially the public sector where they work all gods given hours for pennies.I support them 110% tis the harsh words of some people and the stereotypical judgemental opinion towards people and there lack of non understanding of " Not all disabilities can been seen with the eye" It takes a heart sometimes to see when the eyes are clouded .


----------



## krink (Dec 5, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> It's probably the only demo i've been on where passers by/shoppers were applauding the marchers



happened in gateshead/newcastle too. we asked them to join the march.


----------



## Serotonin (Dec 6, 2011)

And Bristol- as we marched through Broadmead (shopping centre) people (especially elderly people) stood and applauded. It was awesome.


----------



## Delroy Booth (Dec 6, 2011)

krink said:


> happened in gateshead/newcastle too. we asked them to join the march.



We had a lot of that in Huddersfield. I dont suppose I've ever seen a strike with this much public support!


----------



## krink (Dec 6, 2011)

yep, I think everyone's just fed up with the way everything is at the moment.


----------



## danny la rouge (Dec 6, 2011)

Welcome sabt.  Please don't imagine we're all like catgirl.  We aren't.


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 7, 2011)

more reports from nov 30 including one by me:

http://socialistpartysouthernregion.blogspot.com/2011/12/southern-region-after-november-30.html


----------



## shaun balls (Dec 7, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:
			
		

> Each chancer who pulls a fast one on the DWP makes it harder for the next *genuinely* disabled person to claim successfully.


Here, do you mean generating data of compliance to the criteria set by the state for worthiness for welfare, by 'interrogation' by whatever means – assessment, reporting, polls? Data used by media outlets to work up the narratives you're on about in the benefit uprating thread (Which catgirl maybe out to have a look at)? The common perception feeding back into policy etc.?
A Latvian (unemployment 20%) enters the UK and comes by cash in hand without meeting legal criteria and bypassing contributions taken from formal pay. From the point of view of uncritical 'realism,' this person's actions may undermine local unemployed, 'legit' migrant or native, to earn at a minimum wage rate etc. The wider unemployment situation he managed to flee, relatively, is _prior_ to his cash in hand means of sustaining himself. The wretched life he essentially shares with the unemployed working class in the scenario, their means of sustaining themselves totally mediated and access to those means not guaranteed, is _prior_ to that international unemployment context. The guy potentially adds to a data set, which could be turned on migrants better meeting the dictated criteria, through, basically, divising hatemongering.
Should he be exposed and made to materially suffer a penalty?

I know it's a shite analogy, but I'm interested in what you think.
(As for the angle I'm coming at this from, I don't believe there is such a thing as a working class benefit 'cheat,' that the only meaningful ethical calculation is one between means of subsistance versus risk of penalty for the individual claimant, that the whole machinery of assessment of claimants isn't be be respected, and that there are no uses for ideas like 'laziness' that aren't deeply ideological. And so on, and so on.)

-------------
That aside – I'd hoped to use picketing to make contacts across department and unions, but the split-up arrangement and sectarian undercurrent on the day mean it wasn't going to happen. I've heard of a few people managing to work out general meetings and even strike committees, and wondered if anyone has made (now or in the past) any progress that way? A network that crosses union lines (both inter-union, and union-nonunion) to collectively monitor the situation, follow up any strike repurcussions and allow real engagement. Talking from somewhere where the local formal union branches are stone dead. It'd be a great basis from which to let the strikebreakers know maybe there's redemption waiting in round 2...


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 8, 2011)

shaun balls said:


> Here, do you mean generating data of compliance to the criteria set by the state for worthiness for welfare, by 'interrogation' by whatever means – assessment, reporting, polls? Data used by media outlets to work up the narratives you're on about in the benefit uprating thread (Which catgirl maybe out to have a look at)? The common perception feeding back into policy etc.?



Through all of the above, plus the stark fact that there is targeted selective use of data to *generate* a discourse which contains a "common perception" favourable to the policy preferences of those in power.



> A Latvian (unemployment 20%) enters the UK and comes by cash in hand without meeting legal criteria and bypassing contributions taken from formal pay. From the point of view of uncritical 'realism,' this person's actions may undermine local unemployed, 'legit' migrant or native, to earn at a minimum wage rate etc. The wider unemployment situation he managed to flee, relatively, is _prior_ to his cash in hand means of sustaining himself. The wretched life he essentially shares with the unemployed working class in the scenario, their means of sustaining themselves totally mediated and access to those means not guaranteed, is _prior_ to that international unemployment context. The guy potentially adds to a data set, which could be turned on migrants better meeting the dictated criteria, through, basically, divising hatemongering.
> Should he be exposed and made to materially suffer a penalty?



My opinion? He shouldn't suffer any more penalty than a "native" might for working cash-in-hand, especially if he's from an EU member-state with a reciprocal agreement in place.
Hate-mongering against internal EU migration for employment purposes is pointless while we're part of the EU. What tends to get forgotten in the rush to condemn the in-flow of mostly eastern European workers is that this country has an out-flow to many of those same countries in the form of expatriate settlers.
We also need to examine something that much of the media studiously ignores - the _cui bono?_ in the equation - who benefits from immigration? Often it's the very same class that most loudly condemns immigration.
That's not to say that immigration isn't an issue for the working class, but working-class anti-immigrationism seems, at least to me, to be episodic in nature, arising during times of extreme pressure on the working class environment, and subsiding thereafter. It's reactive to circumstance rather than an ingrained POV for (IMO) many w/c people.



> I know it's a shite analogy, but I'm interested in what you think.
> (As for the angle I'm coming at this from, I don't believe there is such a thing as a working class benefit 'cheat,' that the only meaningful ethical calculation is one between means of subsistance versus risk of penalty for the individual claimant, that the whole machinery of assessment of claimants isn't be be respected, and that there are no uses for ideas like 'laziness' that aren't deeply ideological. And so on, and so on.)



Basic labelling theory, in other words.  Labelling someone a "claimant" or a "thief" assigns the entirety of the discourse on the subject of "claimant" or "thief" to the individual, so if you call me a "claimant", then an observer will make assumptions about me based on the current discourse on claimants. They may conclude that I live in particular circumstances at one of a series of particular locations and that I'm of morally dubious character, based entirely on the label "claimant".



> That aside – I'd hoped to use picketing to make contacts across department and unions, but the split-up arrangement and sectarian undercurrent on the day mean it wasn't going to happen. I've heard of a few people managing to work out general meetings and even strike committees, and wondered if anyone has made (now or in the past) any progress that way? A network that crosses union lines (both inter-union, and union-nonunion) to collectively monitor the situation, follow up any strike repurcussions and allow real engagement. Talking from somewhere where the local formal union branches are stone dead. It'd be a great basis from which to let the strikebreakers know maybe there's redemption waiting in round 2...



There's a lot of inertia, and indeed resistance, within the various TUs to any kind of "general" action outisde of their control, unfortunately.


----------



## ddraig (Dec 8, 2011)

so rather than 'bringing the economy to a standstill' and being a 'blow for uk plc' 

here in Cardiff it was one of the busiest days EVER! at the shops
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/cardif...the-year-for-city-s-retailers-91466-29874898/
little dig at the end at the binmen obviously, typical


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 8, 2011)

I fucking hate all that canting on about "UK PLC". I know that our pols are in thrall to business, and tend to think in instrumental terms, i.e. the sort of directorships they can wrangle post-parliament from the firms they arselick while they're there, but the UK isn't a fucking business, you daft out-of-touch neo-liberal cunts, and treating it as such only harms society.


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 14, 2011)

moar photos from the speechifying in the market square- is that balbi rocking a movember there in the bottom right?


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 14, 2011)

Hats were popular among those more sensitive to cold but several bald pates braved the freezing temperatures without coverage


----------



## Random (Dec 14, 2011)

Is that Danbert Nobacon by the stage there?


----------



## Lo Siento. (Dec 14, 2011)

anyone get the impression that n30 was stronger outside of London?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 14, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> moar photos from the speechifying in the market square- is that balbi rocking a movember there in the bottom right?



Can't be. Doesn't look hungover enough.


----------



## marty21 (Dec 14, 2011)

heard some feedback at a branch meeting last night - someone reported that Management had 'Picket line Monitors' out and about 

and a steward reported that younger workers seemed happy enough to scab - presumably because they aren't that arsed yet about pensions....also several stewards reported seeing members scab - who they had previously defended at disciplinaries


----------



## ddraig (Dec 14, 2011)

fucking scab cunts 
ych a fi!


----------



## DeadRussian (Dec 14, 2011)

at the risk of being a permalurker who occasionally pops up, only to publicise stuff their own stuff, before again going to ground; here's a report from nottingham anarchist federation of the day up here. terrible title, yes.

http://nottsblackarrow.wordpress.com/2011/12/08/you-gotta-fight-for-your-right-to-decent-pensions/


----------



## Balbi (Dec 15, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> View attachment 15388
> 
> moar photos from the speechifying in the market square- is that balbi rocking a movember there in the bottom right?



That's definitely me, striking my 'looking forward to a brighter tomorrow' soviet poster gaze.


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 15, 2011)

Balbi said:


> That's definitely me, striking my 'looking forward to a brighter tomorrow' soviet poster gaze.



Both your tash and my imbibing of weed on a lunchtime break meant I completely didn't even spot you while me bred took photos. Jack fucking frost was out that day, and no mistake. It was icy from 7am till lunchtime then turned that way again around 2-3pm. The cunt


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 15, 2011)

Rumours coming out of the TUC today that Prentis and Barber want to settle on the govts 'new' terms on Monday.


----------



## Balbi (Dec 15, 2011)

Yeah, i've had an email about that this afternoon. NUT not happy.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 15, 2011)

Balbi said:


> Yeah, i've had an email about that this afternoon. NUT not happy.



Seems NUT, NASUWT and PCS  are refusing to support the pair of wankers.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 15, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> Rumours coming out of the TUC today that Prentis and Barber want to settle on the govts 'new' terms on Monday.



More about this please! 

Links etc?


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 15, 2011)

http://electmartin1.blogspot.com/


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 15, 2011)

Thanks for that, very interesting blog, just read it -- albeit quickly 

Good to see that PCS are rated as non compromisers, but scary information overall nonetheless ....


----------



## Termite Man (Dec 16, 2011)

RMT are going to be balloting apparently.

http://www.rmt.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=152222

good luck to them.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 16, 2011)

From the SP

*Today the TUC’s Public Sector Liaison Group (PSLG) met for the first time since the magnificent 30 November public sector strike. Disgracefully, Brendan Barber, general secretary of the TUC, argued that all of the trade unions should sign up to the government’s latest ‘heads of agreement’ on pensions, which would then allow Francis Maude to announce before Christmas that the strike has been settled. This was met with outrage by many of the public sector trade unions present.

 Not one of the central demands of public sector workers has been met. All public sector workers are still being told to work longer, pay more and get less. The teaching unions NUT and NASUWT reported that they had been offered no serious concessions by the government, as did the civil servants’ union PCS, the Fire Brigades Union and representatives of workers in the NHS. In local government the only concession is to delay the attacks on pensions until 2014, provided that local government unions promise to accept the pain without a fight when it comes. Yet Dave Prentis - general secretary for UNISON – the biggest union in health and local government – argued for accepting this rotten deal. Hundreds of thousands of UNISON members who struck on 30 November will not agree.

 November 30 showed the potential power of the working class in Britain. We can force this weak divided government to retreat, but only if the action is stepped up. The leadership of the TUC and UNISON were only forced to support N30 because of the pressure of rank and file trade unionists – now we need to do the same again. At the PSLG PCS demanded that the meeting name the day for the next day of national co-ordinated strike action. In Scotland UNISON delegates have already unanimously proposed 25 January as the day of the next strike. NSSN supporters need to pile on the pressure for the date of the next strike to be set before Christmas, to take place in January.

 We immediately need to:

 · Flood the TUC and UNISON leaderships with letters, resolutions and petitions of protest demanding that they do not sell-out the pensions struggle and immediately set the date for a strike in January in co-ordination with the other public sector unions.

 · Members of all other public sector unions to send letters, resolutions and petitions to their National Executives demanding that they set the date for a strike in January in co-ordination with the other unions.

 · Organise a mass lobby the next meeting of the TUC, which is taking place in early January.
*


----------



## shagnasty (Dec 16, 2011)

This is kind of thinking behind Treelovers thread

[QUOTEI Will keep that in mind,however a bitter pill at the moment when their "pay" is I line with inflation and mine most certainly isn't forthe next few years][/QUOTE]


----------



## dennisr (Dec 16, 2011)

http://www.shopstewards.net/news.219.htm

* NSSN and left union activists calls lobby of TUC Public Services Liaison Group: Demands further action on pensions *
16 December A recall conference of the Public Sector Liaison Group (PSLG), the body that brings together TUC affiliated public sector unions, will be convened on Monday 19th December at 3PM.
At this meeting TUC General Secretary Brendan Barber will attempt to sell Francis Maude's latest pensions offer as the basis for a settlement of the dispute to trade union leaders.
In a bid to head off this damaging out come the NSSN and other left trade union activists are calling for a lobby of the PSLG before it meets. Trade unionists will have the opportunity to voice their opposition to Maude's proposals and demand further action in the New Year.
The NSSN will be demanding:

Reject Maude's latest pensions proposals which will mean all public sector workers having to work longer, pay more, and get less.
No to secret deals by union leaders over the heads of the membership. We demand democratic control of the negotiations.
We demand that the date is set for the next co-ordinated public sector strike early in the New Year. UNISON Scotland has already proposed 25 January as the date of the next strike.
The lobby will begin at 2:00 PM at Congress House, 23-28 Great Russell Street. WC1B 3LS
The NSSN urges all of it's supporters and readers to come down to the lobby and build the pressure for further action in defence of pensions.


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 16, 2011)

> No to secret deals by union leaders over the heads of the membership. We demand democratic control of the negotiations.



Unison saw a lot of new members and hitherto unheard from support over this recent strike. If they spunk the momentum up the wall by caving then what bloody use are they?


----------



## mutley (Dec 16, 2011)

Agree with all of the above. A petition has been launched, this SW page has a link on it to sign it. The spirit of fucking 1926 is clearly alive and well!

http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=27054


----------



## krink (Dec 19, 2011)

> Unions representing town hall employees are on the verge of an agreement and talks involving NHS staff have gone well.
> 
> Read more: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/2011/12/19/union-chiefs-slam-ministers-over-pensions-deal-pressure-115875-23645722/#ixzz1gz4V1uZZ​



what's this about? I've read a few stories on the web and to my tired little brain it looks like a cave-in. I work in the council and if this is the case that unison and gmb are selling out the other public service workers for the sake of some local government pension kick-back then they should be shot.


----------



## fractionMan (Dec 19, 2011)

I can't believe the TUC is telling people to cave in ffs.

Any updates?


----------



## krink (Dec 19, 2011)

I'm a bit busy to read the stories properly but it looks like the government and TUs are going for a divide and conquer approach and it might end up that at least some of us who went on strike will still be getting the shitty deals offered in the first place. So, go on strike for fuck all. this could be very bad news for the union officials as they're going to look like right soft bastards now and the strikers are going to feel they've been played for fools.


----------



## revol68 (Dec 19, 2011)

Aye but atleast they stood up to Jeremy Clarkson.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 19, 2011)

krink said:


> I'm a bit busy to read the stories properly but it looks like the government and TUs are going for a divide and conquer approach and it might end up that at least some of us who went on strike will still be getting the shitty deals offered in the first place. So, go on strike for fuck all. this could be very bad news for the union officials as they're going to look like right soft bastards now and the strikers are going to feel they've been played for fools.



Hopefully there'll be enough grass-roots outrage that local reps will send a "fuck off" message up the chain and/or give a "no" vote on any ballot for acceptance.


----------



## krink (Dec 19, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> Hopefully there'll be enough grass-roots outrage that local reps will send a "fuck off" message up the chain and/or give a "no" vote on any ballot for acceptance.



I really hope so, first time in ages people have been really keen to strike.


----------



## Streathamite (Dec 19, 2011)

nice one!


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 19, 2011)

krink said:


> I really hope so, first time in ages people have been really keen to strike.



And for good reason. To be sold out by the government  is to be expected. To be sold out by your union bigwigs  who're mostly thinking of their future as an MP or in the House of Lords shouldn't be. Fuck careerist Labourite pseudo-leftists like Barber and Prentis. They're cunts in the tradition of that establishment-loving membership-ignoring walking shitlump "Lord" Morris of Cunthaven.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 19, 2011)

krink said:


> what's this about? I've read a few stories on the web and to my tired little brain it looks like a cave-in. I work in the council and if this is the case that unison and gmb are selling out the other public service workers for the sake of some local government pension kick-back then they should be shot.



What it is, is this.....



> "This is the government's final offer. On some issues, such as contribution rates for the low-paid next year, and for people close to retirement, we have made progress," said *Christina McAnea, Unison's head of health.*
> "On others, we always knew this would be a damage-limitation exercise aimed at reducing the worst impacts of the government's pension changes."



In other words UNISON's health sector head telling her memebrs the November strike wasn't about winning anything but just making it a bit less worse.....


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 19, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> What it is, is this.....
> 
> In other words UNISON's health sector head telling her memebrs the November strike wasn't about winning anything but just making it a bit less worse.....



So without a mandate to do so, these miserable curs are tucking their tails between their legs and slinking away from their responsibilities to the members? What a bunch of shitcunts.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Dec 19, 2011)

> *The largest union in the civil service, PCS, today rejected the government's latest attempt to force public servants to pay more and work longer for less in retirement.*



http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...ex.cfm/id/778775D3-D9D3-4354-98416A72D99B6D9F

At least someone's got some bollocks.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 19, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...ex.cfm/id/778775D3-D9D3-4354-98416A72D99B6D9F
> 
> At least someone's got some bollocks.


 
That's my union that is 

Not good news though that they're the only ones who still seem to be holding out -- if the other unions do cave in (officially I mean) then PCS will become marginalised.
MY gf's Unison, she'll be trying to find out ASAP what's happening on the local government side of things.


----------



## Delroy Booth (Dec 19, 2011)

Now Unison's caved, I suppose the other big ones are gonna cave in too. PCS will hold out, at least for a while. The teaching unions may still have work-to-rule or something in the upcoming year. Very disappointing, because I think that there was momentum building. It's noticable too that what little concessions they have made have been aimed at just one sector, health workers, possibly to prevent the Royal College Nursing coming out on future strikes. Classic tory divide and rule.

Of course, even if the health workers can claim to have won some minor victory, in reality the leadership of that union has done immense damage to the whole emerging anti-cuts movement. Now the other unions, the PCS, will be isolated and picked off. The prospect of forming a new political movement that could challenge neo-liberal austerity measure has been dealt a blow. We had optimism a fortnight ago, now what?

And of course, once the tories have hammered the PCS etc, what d'ya think is gonna happen to health workers pensions, and the agreement they've just been told to accept from the leadership? It'll be torn up, because the Tories don't play fair they play to win, and they'll be just as fucked as the rest of us when they actually do get to retire. Of course by then Brendan Barber and UNISON top brass will be done, happily retired with a fat fucking pension, knowing he/they took the easy option.

In such a situation I think you can argue that we need to just break the anti trade union laws and those stewards and other members should act unilaterally. If UNISON members want to strike in solidarity with the remaining unions, they should do so, and we should support them. We should also get people who recognise this fact, and who are prepared to deal with it, elected into the executives of these unions so this can actually happen and not just be chit-chat.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 19, 2011)

I reckon that if the likes of Unison try too hard to stage-manage the dispute into a "we did the best we could" scenario, they'll either shed members like water off a duck's back, or they'll be facing walking a metaphorical plank. People are not quite as likely to fall for the old anodynes as they once were. "keep your head down and you'll be alright" has become meaningless in a lot of workplaces.


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 19, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> So without a mandate to do so, these miserable curs are tucking their tails between their legs and slinking away from their responsibilities to the members? What a bunch of shitcunts.


 
If they are to cave then they're shits of the first water, who have in fact used members goodwill and faith in order to bolster a position they had no intention of holding- but rather a posturing 'we can get the boots if needed' move to give some legitimacy/relevance to themselves. To themselves.

If the matter is not kicked downstairs then unison have sold their members down the fucking river.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 19, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> If they are to cave then they're shits of the first water, who have in fact used members goodwill and faith in order to bolster a position they had no intention of holding- but rather a posturing 'we can get the boots if needed' move to give some legitimacy/relevance to themselves. To themselves.
> 
> If the matter is not kicked downstairs then unison have sold their members down the fucking river.



And will deserve everything their members decide to visit on them, including kickings.


----------



## Riklet (Dec 19, 2011)

God how pathetic and depressing.


----------



## ayatollah (Dec 19, 2011)

The current union boss tossers came up through the ranks during a long period of unprecedentedly low union militancy in the UK , after the 1980's defeats and the following social engineering of Thatcher/Blairism , and in a period when TU membership has fallen to a remarkably low level in many sectors - including the public sector (isn't it only about 30% or so in local government nowadays ? ) So its hardly surprising that the union bosses are mainly terrified of strike action and militancy generally - thinking of their cosy pensions and "after job" sinecure jobs in House of Lords , etc etc. Mind you , the TU bureaucracy were never great overall - even the Left spouting types of yesteryear sold out the 1926 General Strike -- JUST WHEN IT WAS STILL GROWING !

Looks like its going to have to get a LOT WORSE in the "austerity " stakes, and the growth of that old favourite - pressure from below - before the resistance fightback to the austerity rip off is going to get real; "traction". Have us Brits got the bollocks for a fight though ! Gets in the way of good stuff on the telly , and there's always the National Lottery as an individual route out..... hmmmm...


----------



## krink (Dec 19, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> What it is, is this.....



Thanks for the info but that is so depressing


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Dec 19, 2011)

http://libcom.org/blog/i-will-not-b...r&utm_campaign=Feed:+libcom/ZrNn+(libcom.org)


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 19, 2011)

I'm with others in being pretty depressed about this.

PCS are for now still holding out, but I'm not very confident that they'll be able to -- in near isolation! -- for all that long, and the Tories will be using every political and propaganda weapon in their book to paint the PCS (and any other more militant voices) into the 'militant and unreasonable' corner.

(there's a very real danger in some of the erm, more conservative  areas of even the PCS membership, that there'd be a significant vote against militancy in any ballot on further action -- more scope for divide and rule pressures).

Unison and the like, in caving in, will in effect be doing plenty of the Tories' work for them.

I see my former union, Prospect, a amaller CS union than PCS, are making similar caving in noises -- see Paul Noon on TV earlier today -- Prospect were always avery technocratic and strike averse, seeing themselves as an 'association of professionals' rather than a proper union.

Talking of doing plenty of the Toies work for them, the Labour leadership will doubtless be as toothless and voiceless as all along. As will various Guardian pontificators like Toynbee (who's pretty anti-union) and Martin Kettle (who's even worse), aided and abetted by 'objective' BBC bland blah.

And that's before I even start on the full on union bashing, public sector hating 'feather bedded' bollocks from the Maily Telegraph etc.

ETA I know all that sounds a bit defeatist but ...


----------



## Delroy Booth (Dec 19, 2011)

It'd be wrong to call it a defeat, because we didn't really fight it, did we? Where the unison leadership planning this when they were making their members take a day off work only a few weeks ago? No, they were saying it was the beginning of a sustained campaign of action. To settle for a shitty offer only a few weeks later smells like pure cowardice to me, bottling out before the going gets tough because, ultimately, Barber and the rest of the labour aristocracy are in it for themselves.


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 19, 2011)

Bit of good news...

http://electmartin1.blogspot.com/2011/12/nut-pensions-statement-nut-have-not.html

Update: I understand that four education unions refused to sign the deal today but are all 'reserving their position' until talks continue in the New Year - that's NASUWT, UCAC and UCU as well as the NUT.

*NUT PRESS RELEASE:* Teachers’ Pension Scheme - talks to continue in the New Year 

 Commenting on the latest round of Teachers’ Pension Scheme talks, Christine Blower, General Secretary of the National Union of Teachers, the largest teachers’ union said: 

 “Following lengthy discussions today the NUT was not able to sign up to the Government’s headline proposals. There was insufficient progress in terms of the Government’s position that teachers should work longer, pay more and get less.  

 In the NUT we reserved our position due to lack of progress but also the lack of documentation in certain critical areas. 

 “The NUT National Executive will meet in January to take a view on progress in the negotiations and next steps in our campaign.  

 “The Union remains committed to negotiations and will take part in talks in the New Year.


----------



## grogwilton (Dec 20, 2011)

Have spen the past few hours contacting every unison and union rep I know to get them to contact their union regionally and nationally to oppose this deal. at the lobby today the Unison exec said they had opposed the deal and it still needed to be agreed with them, hopefully they can stand up to their leadership. makes me fucking sick, i sacrificed a lot of time and effort, literally a lot of weeknights and my own funds to help my local tuc organise a demo on N30, what is the fucking point in me doing anything for my union and the wider movement with shit like this in charge? in my workplace we have doubled the number of reps and for what? i'm seen as the go to man for union issues, and frankly if I'm asked why unison has caved and what we gained out of going on strike all I'll be able to reply is 'unison are shit, join the GMB/Unite (presuming they haven't also caved) because the union you joined for this is shit!'


----------



## mutley (Dec 20, 2011)

It's not over yet.

Prentis is clearly playing an utterly disgusting role. Serwotka is showing that he's got principles. The rest are vascillating inbetween to varying degrees, cos they can see how shit the deal is but they're cacking their pants about whether they could win more. So far Serwotka has stopped a general collapse, and lots of the union leaders are stressing that they aren't recommending the current deal and are playing hard to get. This buys us time to get people on stewards committees, in union branches etc mobilised to increase the pressure stopping more union leaders collapsing into Prentis's embrace. If we can keep the rot confined to UNISON, then we can still squeeze more out of the tory scum before we have to settle. NUT, NASUWT, PCS, UCU, public sector bits of UNITE is still a lot of people, and there are forces like the BMA just starting to mobilise.
Conclusion:*Serwotka's bought us time, and there's a space in which we can organise - let's use it.*

I'm off bloody work until 4th Jan, but if this is still live I'll be organising a workplace meeting asap when I get back.


----------



## mwgdrwg (Dec 20, 2011)

*cancels Unison membership*

Fucking soft cunts.


----------



## fractionMan (Dec 20, 2011)

depressing stuff


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 20, 2011)

mutley said:


> It's not over yet.
> 
> Prentis is clearly playing an utterly disgusting role. Serwotka is showing that he's got principles. The rest are vascillating inbetween to varying degrees, cos they can see how shit the deal is but they're cacking their pants about whether they could win more. So far Serwotka has stopped a general collapse, and lots of the union leaders are stressing that they aren't recommending the current deal and are playing hard to get. This buys us time to get people on stewards committees, in union branches etc mobilised to increase the pressure stopping more union leaders collapsing into Prentis's embrace. If we can keep the rot confined to UNISON, then we can still squeeze more out of the tory scum before we have to settle. NUT, NASUWT, PCS, UCU, public sector bits of UNITE is still a lot of people, and there are forces like the BMA just starting to mobilise.
> Conclusion:*Serwotka's bought us time, and there's a space in which we can organise - let's use it.*
> ...



I'm not sure that this is exactly where we are at. GMB in the last few minutes have announced that they are reviewing their position on the Heads of Agreement in local government. Unite have signed up in local government but not health. Some of the education unions have one foot outside of the 'in' tent. All union leaderships have the same problem to come - how to convince their members, in a ballot, to accept arrangements that they balloted them on strike action over a few months ago.

Finally, before we settle' on pensions is there any chance of the unions taking up the issues of 710,000 job cuts, pay freezes, watering down of workers rights, mass privatisation, casualisation of work etc etc or are is the 'militant' programme that the correct way forward is another one day protest in March over pensions?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 20, 2011)

grogwilton said:


> Have spen the past few hours contacting every unison and union rep I know to get them to contact their union regionally and nationally to oppose this deal. at the lobby today the Unison exec said they had opposed the deal and it still needed to be agreed with them, hopefully they can stand up to their leadership. makes me fucking sick, i sacrificed a lot of time and effort, literally a lot of weeknights and my own funds to help my local tuc organise a demo on N30, what is the fucking point in me doing anything for my union and the wider movement with shit like this in charge? in my workplace we have doubled the number of reps and for what? i'm seen as the go to man for union issues, and frankly if I'm asked why unison has caved and what we gained out of going on strike all I'll be able to reply is 'unison are shit, join the GMB/Unite (presuming they haven't also caved) because the union you joined for this is shit!'



The position of GMB and Unite is an interesting one.GMB, in local government, seem to have discovered they've signed up to a different deal than the one that is actually on the table. In health they are signed up. Unite appear to think the deal is ok in Local Government but shite in health.

Unison (which represents more public sector workers than the rest of them put together) is awful - but no less hidebound to the Labour Party and sell outs than the rest of them. If your workplace is organised you'd be better staying put and challenging the corrupt leadership imho.


----------



## treelover (Dec 20, 2011)

'So let the world take note of what we have achieved today. To those who thought the union movement was dead and irrelevant - today is your answer. To ministers who thought they could bully - today is your lesson, and your warning. And to millions of working people, throughout the land suffering at the hands of this cruel coalition, close to giving up hope, let today be the day you take heart, take courage and resolve to stand and fight for what is right.”

Dave Prentis, Birmingham Exhibition Centre, November 30th 2011.'

So what changed?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 20, 2011)

treelover said:


> 'So let the world take note of what we have achieved today. To those who thought the union movement was dead and irrelevant - today is your answer. To ministers who thought they could bully - today is your lesson, and your warning. And to millions of working people, throughout the land suffering at the hands of this cruel coalition, close to giving up hope, let today be the day you take heart, take courage and resolve to stand and fight for what is right.”
> 
> Dave Prentis, Birmingham Exhibition Centre, November 30th 2011.'
> 
> So what changed?



Prentis probably schmoozed his friends in Parliament and got reminded there wouldn't be a safe Labour seat for him if he didn't suck the neo-liberal tit.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 20, 2011)

treelover said:


> 'So let the world take note of what we have achieved today. To those who thought the union movement was dead and irrelevant - today is your answer. To ministers who thought they could bully - today is your lesson, and your warning. And to millions of working people, throughout the land suffering at the hands of this cruel coalition, close to giving up hope, let today be the day you take heart, take courage and resolve to stand and fight for what is right.”
> 
> Dave Prentis, Birmingham Exhibition Centre, November 30th 2011.'
> 
> So what changed?



GMB General Secretary Paul Kenny said he was prepared to go to jail as part of a wave of non-violent protests and occupations.
Mr Kenny said: "I want direct action - I'm not talking about violent direct action. If that means I go to jail then I'm prepared to go to jail. I'm not prepared to be a martyr. But when I look at my kids and grandchildren I want to be able to say I did everything I did to protect them and their inheritance."


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 20, 2011)

http://www.unitetheunion.org/news__events/latest_news/unite_response_to_government_s.aspx

Unite national officer for local authorities, Peter Allenson said: ‘Unite is extremely disappointed with the contents of the letter received from Communities Secretary, Eric Pickles, following the statement on public sector pensions by Chief Secretary, Danny Alexander.
As a result of this letter, Unite is currently reviewing its position on the _Principles Document_  agreed with the local government group representing local government employers yesterday (Monday, 19 December).

We await further urgent clarification on the government’s position.’

-ends-

Note to news desks:

For further information, please contact Unite communications officer, Shaun Noble on 07768 693940


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 20, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> http://www.unitetheunion.org/news__events/latest_news/unite_response_to_government_s.aspx
> 
> Unite national officer for local authorities, Peter Allenson said: ‘Unite is extremely disappointed with the contents of the letter received from Communities Secretary, Eric Pickles, following the statement on public sector pensions by Chief Secretary, Danny Alexander.
> As a result of this letter, Unite is currently reviewing its position on the _Principles Document_ agreed with the local government group representing local government employers yesterday (Monday, 19 December).
> ...



They can't even collapse decisively.


----------



## baldrick (Dec 20, 2011)

treelover said:


> 'So let the world take note of what we have achieved today. To those who thought the union movement was dead and irrelevant - today is your answer. To ministers who thought they could bully - today is your lesson, and your warning. And to millions of working people, throughout the land suffering at the hands of this cruel coalition, close to giving up hope, let today be the day you take heart, take courage and resolve to stand and fight for what is right.”
> 
> Dave Prentis, Birmingham Exhibition Centre, November 30th 2011.'
> 
> So what changed?


His principles, presumably.

What a fucking let down.  Two weeks after the biggest strikes in decades my union is caving in.  If I thought it would do any good I'd resign my membership.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Dec 20, 2011)

http://www.urban75.net/forums/threa...-30th-november-uk.284421/page-6#post-10753824

Only just seen this ^^ a glimmer of hope? I fuckin' well hope so.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 20, 2011)

The Govt are probably seeing the differences in micro-nuance/detail between the offers affecting the different sectors as maxing up the divide and rule style pressure.

Some glimmers of hope maybe, in todays news, that it might not work just like that?


----------



## grogwilton (Dec 20, 2011)

Smokeandsteam said:


> The position of GMB and Unite is an interesting one.GMB, in local government, seem to have discovered they've signed up to a different deal than the one that is actually on the table. In health they are signed up. Unite appear to think the deal is ok in Local Government but shite in health.
> 
> Unison (which represents more public sector workers than the rest of them put together) is awful - but no less hidebound to the Labour Party and sell outs than the rest of them. If your workplace is organised you'd be better staying put and challenging the corrupt leadership imho.



I'm not in Unison, I'm in the NUT, but frankly, if I was in Unison i'd apply the pressure until it became clear they've fully sold their membership down the river (after the exec meeting or ballot) and then leave if thats what they did, mass loss of membership (and as a result money) seems to be the only thing they genuinely care about*. I could be convinced differently on the final point were the exec to ballot their membership on the deal, with either no recommendation or a recommendation to reject the deal.

*From every angle agreeing to this deal is madness, not only for the principal and actual campaign and wider union movement, but also for the health of the union itself with the inevitable dissillusion it'll cause among members and activists, particularly those who joined in the run up to NOV 30th. Its a no brainer.


----------



## fractionMan (Dec 20, 2011)

Mr.Bishie said:


> http://www.urban75.net/forums/threa...-30th-november-uk.284421/page-6#post-10753824
> 
> Only just seen this ^^ a glimmer of hope? I fuckin' well hope so.



worth reposting imo UNISON, Unite and GMB withdraw from pensions deal


----------



## abstract1 (Dec 20, 2011)

fractionMan said:


> worth reposting imo UNISON, Unite and GMB withdraw from pensions deal



Good news for now, however, I'm assuming the irony of this comment:

"the unions say they have lost confidence in the negotiations"

isn't lost on people.

Emails were thick and fast amongst local officers, reps and members in our local area this morning - with a prevailing feeling of anger and betrayal, supported by a slow hand clap soundtrack.


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 20, 2011)

Any further word of whether or not those unions involved in the recent High Court action over CPI/RPI pensions indexing, will purue their apparant planned appeal next year?

The case was defeated, but not unanimously by the 3 HC judges. There seems to be very very little online discussion that I can find -- presumably because that particular subject is all too sub-judice for now?


----------



## shaun balls (Dec 21, 2011)

Health sector bullshit heads of agreement document.



			
				Heads of agreement said:
			
		

> *...government have made clear this sets out their final position...*
> *...This includes a commitment to suspend any further industrial action while the final details are resolved...*
> *Career Average... Revaluation with CPI+1.5%... 1/54 Accrual... Year 1 avg employee contribution 9.8%. Protection under £26,557 for one year only*
> etc.


----------



## grogwilton (Dec 21, 2011)

fractionMan said:


> worth reposting imo UNISON, Unite and GMB withdraw from pensions deal



Are they not now back in since Alexander has claimed the letter from Pickels was false?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Dec 21, 2011)

First i heard about it was yesterday - suppose all will be revealed today?


----------



## dennisr (Dec 21, 2011)

grogwilton said:


> Are they not now back in since Alexander has claimed the letter from Pickels was false?



Apparently they have 'lost confidence' as a result - what they only just realised!!

They are now under pressure they have probably never experienced to his extent before - so they will have to be seen to be backing off from the obvious sellout

More importantly - every trade union activist should now be coming along to this organising conference - regardless of the trade union you are a member of:

*PCS Left Unity National Committee*

*DEFEND PENSIONS - ESCALATE ACTION - NAME DAY FOR NATIONAL STRIKE*

*Organising Conference Saturday: Friends Meeting House (opp. Euston Station) 7th January 2012 11am – 4pm*

*Chair: Janice Godrich PCS President Speaker: Mark Serwotka PCS General Secretary*
*(other speakers to be announced)*

November 30th was the biggest show of strength from Britain’s trade unions in living memory. It shook the coalition government and provided a firm foundation for the escalation of industrial action to defeat the unjustified attack on pensions and to challenge the coalition’s pay freeze, cuts and privatisation programme.

At the TUC’s Public Sector Liaison Group Mark Serwotka on behalf of PCS argued the TUC should set the date for a further day of nationally coordinated strike action to bring the government into serious negotiations. Although there was some support for this position the TUC general secretary Brendan Barber argued that all the unions should sign up to a so-called “Heads of Agreement”, this means the core issues, on which we took action, working longer, paying more and getting less, are surrendered, just as the government have wanted. Dave Prentis, the general secretary of Unison, argued for acceptance of this “deal”.

It is almost beyond belief that when the confidence of the movement is at its highest point in decades as a result of November 30th and with an additional 100,000 recruits due to the action such an abject surrender is being considered. Now is the time to set the date, as early as possible in 2012, preferably January, for a further day of nationally coordinated industrial action which can be escalated by bringing even more unions on board including workers, like those in Unilever, fighting to defend private sector pensions.

The PCS Left Unity National Committee invites all activists from all unions to an organising conference on the 7th of January to debate how we can build the campaign to defend our pensions and fight the cuts and prevent any unacceptable “deal” that makes us work longer, pay more and get less.
This will be an organising conference, not just a debating forum. It is intended to arm activists with the issues so they can go back to their workplaces and into their unions in order to build a campaign that will secure justice on pensions.

To cover costs there will be a registration fee of £5 for waged delegates.
*FAIR PENSIONS FOR ALL - STOP THE CUTS - NO PRIVATISATION*

http://www.leftunity.org.uk


----------



## dennisr (Dec 21, 2011)

And apparently the "deal" is back on again...

http://union-news.co.uk/2011/12/breaking-news-gmb-and-unison-say-pensions-deal-is-back-on

feck sake - talk about led by donkeys

(* wonders: "would turkeys voting for... be more appropriate given the season?" *)


----------



## shagnasty (Dec 22, 2011)

A different strike ,London Undergroud taking the union to court came out with peach in arguing whether strike was legal



> In a written argument, Bruce Carr QC, representing LU, told Mr Justice Eder: "In short, [Aslef] included in the balloting constituency a significant majority of its members who could not in due course be called on to take strike action on 26 December 2011 as they were not rostered to work on that day."


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 22, 2011)

dennisr said:


> And apparently the "deal" is back on again...
> 
> http://union-news.co.uk/2011/12/breaking-news-gmb-and-unison-say-pensions-deal-is-back-on
> 
> ...



But this time without Unite?

So at present out is PCS, Unite in local government (but not health?), NIPSA, POA

In/out/too difficult to make our minds up - NUT, NASUWT, UCU

In - Unison, GMB, FDA, Prospect, ATL (but agreements subject to further negotiations and endorsement by executives/members)

Is this right?

UNITY IS STRENGTH


----------



## ddraig (Dec 22, 2011)

latest GMB email seems to suggest some sort of victory for now and that the gov have backed off so no increased contributions for a couple of years at least.
striking works! yay!



			
				gmb said:
			
		

> After months of discussion, GMB and the other main local government trade unions and the LGA on behalf of local government employers have put together a plan for a tightly timetabled series of new negotiations designed, on common principles, to produce a reformed LGPS to be introduced in April 2014. This has been agreed by government without conditions or qualifications.
> 
> *The plan agreed by employers and unions and approved by the Secretary of State removes the requirement for member contribution increases in April 2012*. As a funded scheme worth £165bn, any contribution rise threatened the sustainability of the scheme and the pension savings of four million people in the UK. With three quarters of members earning below £21,000 a year and the vast majority working part time, the LGPS membership is acutely sensitive to cost. Unlike the rest of the public sector, the local government workforce has not had any pay rises in the last few years, even for the lowest paid. In fact many members have had pay cuts.
> 
> ...


"way forward" 

can't find any info for today on the gmb website just yesterday
http://www.gmb.org.uk/newsroom/latest_news/lgps_latest.aspx


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 22, 2011)

Delaying the supposedly-inevitable isn't victory, it's delaying the supposedly-inevitable. Perhaps the unions, rather than (as some are doing) buckling under pressure, should be asking exactly how, if these changes are so very necessary, the government can pull a year or a two year delay out of its' arse at the drop of a hat?
Or would the asking endanger the post-union political career prospects of the likes of Barber and Prentis too much for them to consider such action?


----------



## ddraig (Dec 22, 2011)

yup
too much face saving bollocks going on
and feathering


----------



## mk12 (Dec 22, 2011)

On a related note, I see the Tube Drivers are striking on Boxing Day. Are they deliberately trying to piss the public off?


----------



## DotCommunist (Dec 22, 2011)




----------



## dennisr (Dec 22, 2011)

Don't all get your knickers in a twist - there's lots of presure and they clearly feel it.... come to the Left Unity Confrerence - hassle your "representatives"

7th Jan pensions conference CONFIRMED SPEAKERS INCLUDE: Mark Sertwotka PCS, Roger Bannister Unison NEC member (personal capacity), Kevin Courtney NUT, Mark Campbell UCU and John McDonnell MP


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 22, 2011)

mk12 said:


> On a related note, I see the Tube Drivers are striking on Boxing Day. Are they deliberately trying to piss the public off?



I have to ask - are you actually aware of the transactional basis for strike action?

For example, would there be a point to train drivers striking on a sunday on a line shut down for improvements, or would it be better to *threaten* a strike on a day where it would cause more inconvenience?


----------



## mk12 (Dec 22, 2011)

I understand the tactics behind it, but if it does go ahead do you think they'll get much sympathy from ordinary Londoners? Is that even a consideration in this?


----------



## ddraig (Dec 22, 2011)

mk12 said:


> I understand the tactics behind it, but if it does go ahead do you think they'll get much sympathy from ordinary Londoners? Is that even a consideration in this?


do you think they should not strike incase they upset anyone then?


----------



## dennisr (Dec 22, 2011)

mk12 said:


> I understand the tactics behind it, but if it does go ahead do you think they'll get much sympathy from ordinary Londoners? Is that even a consideration in this?


oh fuck off


----------



## Fedayn (Dec 22, 2011)

mk12 said:


> On a related note, I see the Tube Drivers are striking on Boxing Day. Are they deliberately trying to piss the public off?



Why bother ever striking then?


----------



## smokedout (Dec 22, 2011)

elsewhere



> City of London Corporation Cleaners say:  Occupy Guildhall!
> 
> Friday 23rd December, 6am onwards
> 
> ...




http://london.indymedia.org/articles/11349


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 23, 2011)

mk12 said:


> I understand the tactics behind it, but if it does go ahead do you think they'll get much sympathy from ordinary Londoners? Is that even a consideration in this?



Going on the *actual* amount of sympathy they got last time they struck (compared to what the media claimed they'd get), I think you need to prepare yourself for a surprise.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 23, 2011)

ddraig said:


> do you think they should not strike incase they upset anyone then?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Dec 23, 2011)

Fedayn said:


> Why bother ever striking then?



I'm always quite shocked that people don't *get* that about striking.


----------



## dennisr (Dec 23, 2011)

ViolentPanda said:


> I'm always quite shocked that people don't *get* that about striking.



ex-swappie - its natural the fella gets fuck all understanding...


----------



## dennisr (Dec 23, 2011)

Some facts and figures:
*Why you should reject the pensions deal - the facts for workers across the public sector:*
http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/articles/13377

When Lib Dem minister Danny Alexander put the government's pensions proposals to parliament on 20 December he said clearly that the government had achieved all its "savings goals" and would save tens of billions of pounds. *That money is being stolen from public sector workers' pensions.*
There is no increase in the 'cost ceiling'. This means that even where there have been some small improvements for some workers' accrual rates (the rate per year at which pension benefits are built up) they are being paid for by cuts in the pensions of other workers in the same scheme.
The amount that workers will have to pay into their pensions will still increase for all public sector pension schemes, by an average of 3.2% of salary, phased in over three years. *This means that someone earning £25,000 will have to pay £800 a year more - effectively an immediate £800 per year pay cut! *In health, the leadership of UNISON is claiming it has won a concession because those earning less than £26,000 will not have to pay more into their pensions for one year. However, even this puny concession is being paid for by higher paid public sector workers having to pay more.
The 'offer' ties retirement age to state pension age. This means that anyone born on or after 6 April 1960 but before 6 April 1961 will retire at between 66 and 67 years old. People born after 6 April 1961 will not get to retire until they are 67 or older.
Pensions will be linked to the CPI rather than the RPI inflation index. This will mean that over an average 20-year retirement, pensions will be worth up to 20% less.
In local government the government has agreed to delay implementing these attacks by a year, until 2014, but only on the basis of the unions signing up now to misery a year down the line.
This attack is not about the cost of the schemes, but about the government's attempts to make public sector workers pay for a crisis they didn't create!


----------



## marty21 (Dec 23, 2011)

mk12 said:


> On a related note, I see the Tube Drivers are striking on Boxing Day. Are they deliberately trying to piss the public off?


It's a great day to strike - most people are off work - those that are can get buses - they'd piss more people off if it was a really busy day - Londoners can get buses and trains (?) that day , it won't be impossible to get around - traffic is light - no congestion zone charge


----------



## Streathamite (Dec 23, 2011)

mk12 said:


> I understand the tactics behind it, but if it does go ahead do you think they'll get much sympathy from ordinary Londoners? Is that even a consideration in this?


no, and nor should it be. ALL strikes cause at least a measure of inconvenience to someone, somewhere, or else they are useless. no-one ever got anywhere by being too scared of causing offence


----------



## dennisr (Dec 30, 2011)

*PCS Left Unity National Committee's invitation to the 7th January conference:*

*DEFEND PENSIONS - ESCALATE ACTION*

*NAME DAY FOR NATIONAL STRIKE*

*Organising Conference Saturday: Friends Meeting House (opp. Euston Station) 7th January 2012 11am - 4pm*

*Chair: Janice Godrich PCS President*

*Speakers: 

 Mark Serwotka PCS General Secretary*

*John McDonnell MP*

*Kevin Courtney DGS NUT (personal capacity)*

*Roger Bannister UNISON NEC (personal capacity)*

*Mark Campbell UCU NEC (personal capacity)*

*Zita Holbourne BARAC*

*Kevin Donnelly Unite United Left*

The PCS Left Unity National Committee invites all activists from all unions to an organising conference on the 7th of January to debate how we can build the campaign to defend our pensions and fight the cuts and prevent any unacceptable "deal" that makes us work longer, pay more and get less.
This will be an organising conference, not just a debating forum. It is intended to arm activists with the issues so they can go back to their workplaces and into their unions in order to build a campaign that will secure justice on pensions.
To cover costs there will be a registration fee of £5 for waged delegates.
*FAIR PENSIONS FOR ALL - STOP THE CUTS - NO PRIVATISATION*


----------



## William of Walworth (Dec 31, 2011)

Good posts dennisr, but I continue to be pessimistic I have to say ....


----------



## Fedayn (Jan 5, 2012)

http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...ex.cfm/id/ACC74C37-6B5E-4F0E-A77BE51584CFF9AE

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16431284

UNITE reps in the NHS have knocked back the pre xmas deal..... UNITE meets 11th January, PCS NEC meets next week too, we could be back on picket lines.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 5, 2012)

*Public sector pensions offer rejected by Unite*
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16431284

_"In what will be seen as a significant set-back for the government, Unite reps in the NHS have voted unanimously to reject the Coalition’s latest proposals on pension reform."_

This is important and a good start to the new year 

You don't have to be pessimistic William - Its far from over 

(Ooops - post repeat.... thanks Fed for getting this info out)


----------



## shagnasty (Jan 6, 2012)

I wonder how the doctors will react



> The British Medical Association decided yesterday to ballot its 130,000 doctors and medical students on whether the offer is acceptable and, if not, whether they would be prepared to take action.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 6, 2012)

*Teaching unions reject Govt’s pension proposals*
http://union-news.co.uk/2012/01/teaching-unions-reject-govts-pension-proposals


----------



## dennisr (Jan 6, 2012)

*Ambulance workers vote for action to defend pensions*
NHS ambulanceworkers in the NHS have voted overwhelmingly for industrial action short of strike action in defence of their pensions.
Unison called a seperate ballot for ambulance workers in order that those who would work normally by providing emergency cover during strikes could take part in the campaign to preserve pensions.

*The result was 84% voted in favour (5,233 votes cast: 4,408 in favour, 816 against).*

This opens the way for a work-to-rule by ambulance staff whilst preserving life-saving emergency cover.
The NHSrelies on paramedics and ambulance technicians to treat many patients for minor injuries or to divert them for treatment at non-emergency walk-in centres and so relieve the stress on hospital accident and emergency departments.
The prospect is that during action 'short of strike' action, ambulance staff will work to rule for instance by transporting all patients to hospital, thereby overwhelming accident & emergency centres.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jan 6, 2012)

shagnasty said:


> I wonder how the doctors will react



Interesting.


----------



## krink (Jan 6, 2012)

Unison saying anything yet? I'm in unison so I'll probably be last to know


----------



## articul8 (Jan 7, 2012)

Did you go to the PCS Left unity rally Dennisr?  Didn't see u.  I do worry about UNISON's position - being decided on Tuesday, no?


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 8, 2012)

Thanks for the updates folks. I'd not picked up on em before. Perhaps I'm a bit less pessimistic now


----------



## dennisr (Jan 8, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Did you go to the PCS Left unity rally Dennisr? Didn't see u. I do worry about UNISON's position - being decided on Tuesday, no?



Sorry I missed you fella (I left a bit early in any case - everyday stuff that needed sorting out). Not a bad turnout given the short notice and time of the year - around 500. Yep, the UNISON decision is critical to how the pensions dispute develops and does not look exactly good -  I am no expert but my impression is that, if preasure is applied appropriately, (ie not by some of the more 'out there' demands on both the right and on this conference raised by some of those dafter poseurs - the 'Jeremy's and 'Candy's yesterday) section votes can still be turned. We have seen the North West and the Manchester UNISON blocs seemingly going against their own traditional right-wing supporting position. And that's two big areas so if significent. With the added preasure of he recent UNITE section votes. I guess the union left is having to play their own version of the divide and rule game against the union right at the moment. Lets hope it gets the results we all need. Noticed CPB members at the meeting yesterday which is interesting.

Serwotka's introductory speech:

http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/articles/13439/08-01-2012/mark-serwotka-speaking


----------



## articul8 (Jan 8, 2012)

I could only stay for the opening session - written up here

UNISON leadership definitely in a tight spot - maximum pressure necessary.  CPB has quite a presence in UNISON group execs, no?


----------



## Fedayn (Jan 8, 2012)

dennisr said:


> Noticed CPB members at the meeting yesterday which is interesting.



Not really, the CPB are the main driver in UNITY the CPB led caucus within PCS Left Unity.


----------



## articul8 (Jan 9, 2012)

Hear UNITE LG section has voted not to accept deal - more pressure on UNISON.


----------



## mwgdrwg (Jan 9, 2012)

Can someone please explain to me why UNISON need pressure applied to reject the  Governments offer at all, and why are they not simply backing and supporting their own members?


----------



## BigTom (Jan 9, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Hear UNITE LG section has voted not to accept deal - more pressure on UNISON.



yep:

http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=27143


----------



## BigTom (Jan 9, 2012)

mwgdrwg said:


> Can someone please explain to me why UNISON need pressure applied to reject the Governments offer at all, and why are they not simply backing and supporting their own members?



Cos Dave Prentis, like Brendan Barber, is only interested in getting Labour back in power in 2015.  They don't want them earlier because they are happy to let the tories/lib dems fuck up the economy first, helping labour get a larger majority.  Both, I would think, are expecting peerages in the end.
So they don't want any opposition to be too effective and they want their members to be pissed off at the tories for slashing their pensions, so they'll vote labour and encourage others to in 2015.
(imo obviously)


----------



## Fedayn (Jan 9, 2012)

BigTom said:


> yep:
> 
> http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=27143



yup now on the BBC


> BREAKING NEWS: Leaders of local government workers in Unite reject government's final offer on pensions


----------



## krink (Jan 9, 2012)

BigTom said:


> Cos Dave Prentis, like Brendan Barber, is only interested in getting Labour back in power in 2015. They don't want them earlier because they are happy to let the tories/lib dems fuck up the economy first, helping labour get a larger majority. Both, I would think, are expecting peerages in the end.
> So they don't want any opposition to be too effective and they want their members to be pissed off at the tories for slashing their pensions, so they'll vote labour and encourage others to in 2015.
> (imo obviously)



It's just like all the labour councillors who voted through the cuts and wring their hands as people's lives and services are being wrecked. 'blame the tories not us' even though the labour party would be hacking away if they'd won the last election. It's not just prentis though, i've seen it from unison staff/full-timers at local level. bunch of cunts


----------



## articul8 (Jan 9, 2012)

mwgdrwg said:


> Can someone please explain to me why UNISON need pressure applied to reject the Governments offer at all, and why are they not simply backing and supporting their own members?



V good question.  BigTom has part of it but isn't enough to explain in full.  I think - unlike say PCS - there is a huge gulf and mutual suspicion between the union leadership/officialdom and the activist left.  The leadership thinks the activists are basically a totally unrepresentative group of Trots who don't in any way reflect or speak for the views of ordinary union members, who they think are much more (small c) conservative.  Prentis et al think that prolonged industrial action over anything at all is effectively only going to expose the weakness and non-militancy of their own members - who will drift back to work and lots of workers will end up crossing pickets.   So their job is to protect the reputation and unity of the union from adventurist militants who would drive the union into the ground (like another miners strike).

This uber-pessimism can be seen in their assumption that the teachers etc would all settle, and the "coalition of the willing" fragment leaving UNISON exposed.  Inconviently for them, the other unions have mostly voted to carry on the fight leaving UNISON looking like bottlers.


----------



## BigTom (Jan 9, 2012)

krink said:


> It's just like all the labour councillors who voted through the cuts and wring their hands as people's lives and services are being wrecked. 'blame the tories not us' even though the labour party would be hacking away if they'd won the last election. It's not just prentis though, *i've seen it from unison staff/full-timers at local level. bunch of cunts*



I've got to say that in Birmingham that is not the case - the full timers at the Birmingham branch are all militant, probably more so than their membership, but I've no doubt your impression is true for much of the country.


----------



## krink (Jan 9, 2012)

BigTom said:


> I've got to say that in Birmingham that is not the case - the full timers at the Birmingham branch are all militant, probably more so than their membership, but I've no doubt your impression is true for much of the country.



In my city the council,  LP and the Unison people are all much the same people. I really hope it isn't the same everywhere!


----------



## mwgdrwg (Jan 9, 2012)

Thanks for your replies to my question, very interesting. Let's see what Unison does next.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 9, 2012)

Also: _"Today the branch committee of the enormous Unison local government branch in Birmingham, with over 15,000 members, has unanimously voted to reject the 'heads of agreement' in the pensions dispute!"_


----------



## dennisr (Jan 9, 2012)

Surrey County Unison branch secretary (and member of South East Unison Regional Committee):_ All Unison SE national service group reps pledge to vote against ‘deal’ tomorrow._


----------



## BigTom (Jan 10, 2012)

dennisr said:


> Also: _"Today the branch committee of the enormous Unison local government branch in Birmingham, with over 15,000 members, has unanimously voted to reject the 'heads of agreement' in the pensions dispute!"_



Yep, Birmingham unison LG are pretty militant, and their members are getting hammered in the council cuts, as well as the pensions.  Doesn't suprise me at all that it was unanimous.  Hope that helps push unison to make the right decision.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

‎'West midlands unison local government reject pension deal 10 branches to 5'

Today is the lobby of the UNISON national meeting.(sorry bit late on the notice for that one - but also the TUC lobby):

*Lobby of the Unison Service Group Executives on the pensions' dispute*
Tuesday 10th January 2012 12.30pm
Outside Unison HQ on Euston Road, London.

*Lobby of the TUC general council on the pensions' dispute*
Thursday 12th January 2012 2pm
Outside Congress House, Great Russell Street, London

(I know, I know - but they are all scum - many may well be but they are under a lot of preasure - all still to play for and UNISON onside - even kicking and screaming as the likes of Prentice will be makes the wider struggle easier to esculate - especially for UNISON activists on the ground)


----------



## Fedayn (Jan 10, 2012)

dennisr said:


> *Surrey County Unison branch secretary* (and member of South East Unison Regional Committee):_ All Unison SE national service group reps pledge to vote against ‘deal’ tomorrow._



Is that our mutual friend?


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> Is that our mutual friend?



Yep - probably mate - "PC" from the old days (and back in action after disappearing for a wee while - he's on my fb friends if you like to catch up


----------



## frogwoman (Jan 10, 2012)

If its the PC im thiking of (and it is, as he's in surrey), he is well sound


----------



## Fedayn (Jan 10, 2012)

dennisr said:


> Yep - probably mate - "PC" from the old days (and back in action after disappearing for a wee while - he's on my fb friends if you like to catch up



Aye he's on mines too, just wasn't sure if he was the Surrey Branch Sec.



frogwoman said:


> If its the PC im thiking of (and it is, as he's in surrey), he is well sound



Indeed he is froggie. Dennis, me and him go back many years and some rather fun times....


----------



## articul8 (Jan 10, 2012)

Glenn K reporting on twitter that UNISON exec voterd 24-10 to accept the govts pensions offer in local govt.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Glenn K reporting on twitter that UNISON exec voterd 24-10 to accept the govts pensions offer in local govt.



cunts - that complicates things...


----------



## Fedayn (Jan 10, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Glenn K reporting on twitter that UNISON exec voterd 24-10 to accept the govts pensions offer in local govt.



Fuck sake, utter wankers.


----------



## articul8 (Jan 10, 2012)

Leaves the UNITE local govt workers out on a limb in particular - and drives a coach and horses through the possibility of what was effectively a public-sector wide dispute.


----------



## weepiper (Jan 10, 2012)

bollocks, not good


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> Fuck sake, utter wankers.


 
Indeed - its just fucking exasperating. An insult to donkeys this lot.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Leaves the UNITE local govt workers out on a limb in particular - and drives a coach and horses through the possibility of what was effectively a public-sector wide dispute.



and just at a time when private sector pension attacks were finally being challenged (Unilever etc).... fuckwits


----------



## articul8 (Jan 10, 2012)

I can't believe that any amount of adjustments re accrual rates can amount to something worth settling for.  Does the exec have to make a recommendation for the membership to vote on, or is that it?


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

More from GK on Twitter: _Unison HE sector vote 6-5 to accept heads of agreement. _
_ Health agree to put offer to members in a ballot and will now make a recommendation_

....

_Now is not the time to mourn but organise. We must begin to plan for special conferences to overturn leadership_


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

_"When left called for a recorded vote chair to hold exec members to account chair said no when asked why the democrat said cos I said so!"_

Name and shame the traitors


----------



## marty21 (Jan 10, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Glenn K reporting on twitter that UNISON exec voterd 24-10 to accept the govts pensions offer in local govt.


spineless cunts


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jan 10, 2012)

<holds head in hands>


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jan 10, 2012)

http://www.unison.org.uk/asppresspack/pressrelease_view.asp?id=2563


----------



## krink (Jan 10, 2012)

right so who in local government unions is still fighting? i'll sack unison and join them instead.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 10, 2012)

krink said:


> right so who in local government unions is still fighting? i'll sack unison and join them instead.



the answer is - everybody else* - every other union!. you probably won't be the only one. make sure to take the entire branch with you though! (and if you cannot you have t ostay and force these bastards out - no other option)

*sorry - forgot the other exception - the GMB - I always forget they are a bloody union.... two big exceptions though - they dominate local government organisation :-(


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jan 10, 2012)

Apparently, Unison health members are to be balloted. Why then not ballot the whole membership???


----------



## DotCommunist (Jan 10, 2012)

for fucks sake


----------



## BigTom (Jan 10, 2012)

cunts - will lose loads of members over this. I do wonder what the Birmingham full timers I know are going to do. Can you imagine if they all moved to Unite? 15,000 members... will be sowing some seeds of thought on that one.  But the FTOs won't move unless they have a job at Unite, and they won't get that..


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jan 10, 2012)

We have only two unions affiliated with the local authority who we work for, Unison & GMB. If enough members of each wanted to leave, & join another union, say Unite or PCS, how would it work? How would the latter approach the local authority for affiliation? Has it happened before?


----------



## BigTom (Jan 10, 2012)

Mr.Bishie said:


> We have only two unions affiliated with the local authority who we work for, Unison & GMB. If enough members of each wanted to leave, & join another union, say Unite or PCS, how would it work? How would the latter approach the local authority for affiliation? Has it happened before?



I've just been learning about this for IWW, since we've just been certified, but my memory isn't good, even though it's recent - so someone is bound to correct me.
The employer have to recognise 1 union (if there is one above a certain % of workers).
If there are more unions above that %, then the employer can recognise more than one union if they want, but also restrictions can be placed on what the other unions can do, ie: they might be recognised so their reps can support people on company time, but not be part of pay negotiations.
Given it's the council, I should imagine that if a third union were to get enough members it would be recognised. I don't know how you go about it though.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 11, 2012)

Sparks updates: "150 #sparks at Immingham blockading roads, causing mayhem by all reports." & via NSSN_AntiCuts (Twitter)
 Unite FTO Harry Cowp announces ballot of Balfour Beatty begins today at Blackfriars protest #sparks.


----------



## krink (Jan 11, 2012)

just sent unite an email see if they're organised at my workplace (the council).


----------



## krink (Jan 11, 2012)

dennisr said:


> Sparks updates: "150 #sparks at Immingham blockading roads, causing mayhem by all reports." & via NSSN_AntiCuts (Twitter)
> Unite FTO Harry Cowp announces ballot of Balfour Beatty begins today at Blackfriars protest #sparks.



keep forgetting to post updates from up here on this. members of my group have been supporting this struggle just about from day one and go to every action.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 11, 2012)

krink said:


> just sent unite an email see if they're organised at my workplace (the council).



Still a battle to be had inside UNISON of course - there are too many members to be able to walk away from, much as i understand the sentiment.

http://www.coventrysocialists.co.uk/latestnews_72584.html?mid=576


Here's a bit of recall resolutions:

_"__Wording for special local government conference:

 This Branch requisitions a Special Conference of the Local Government Service Group to consider the policy of the Service Group in relation to the Local Government Pension Scheme.

 Only this wording must be used nothing else no add ons or anything. We need to get branches representing 25% membership. Once we get the conference called we can then submit our position for rejection of the deal and for united action to be taken. For other service groups delete local government and insert name of service group."_


----------



## krink (Jan 11, 2012)

dennisr said:


> Still a battle to be had inside UNISON of course - there are too many members to be able to walk away from, much as i understad the sentiment.



i don't like walking away but what can i do? i'm just one bod in a branch of thousands.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 11, 2012)

krink said:


> keep forgetting to post updates from up here on this. members of my group have been supporting this struggle just about from day one and go to every action.



yes, same - down at blackfriars this morning as usual. the london lot have led the way for the last six months - I am glad that those outside of london have finally taken up the cudgel though - and the actions there are much more a case of self-organised sparks with a few supporters (in london it have become a few sparks with loads of paper sellers on occasion). I know its hard to keep the momentum up but you cannot replace self-activity with outside activists. I don't quite get the tactics used in london sometimes - all good but why not more effort to getting more *in* the sites - in whatever way necessary - going to the pubs and cafes and travel routes - rather than demos standing outside. Outside should supplement - it cannot replace. I guess it reflects the nature of the game in the city - rapid turnaround, short contracts. But still... The north are leading the way now. (Hartlepool, Manchester and Wales today, Grangemouth on the 13th, Aberdeen on the 16th - way to go


----------



## dennisr (Jan 11, 2012)

krink said:


> i don't like walking away but what can i do? i'm just one bod in a branch of thousands.



I'm not judging you mate - like I said - fully understand the reasoning. Is there an effective organised left in your branch you can work with?


----------



## krink (Jan 11, 2012)

dennisr said:


> I'm not judging you mate - like I said - fully understand the reasoning. Is there an effective organised left in your branch you can work with?



no mate never thought you were judging me (stupid internet doesn't do prosody) but the unison branch here is ran by dinosaurs forever hitched to labour party. there is no left that I know of and the union never seems to bother engaging with members to be honest.


----------



## dennisr (Jan 11, 2012)

krink said:


> unison branch here is ran by dinosaurs forever hitched to labour party. there is no left that I know of and the union never seems to bother engaging with members to be honest.



feck em then - unite sound like a better option


----------



## krink (Jan 11, 2012)

dennisr said:


> feck em then - unite sound like a better option


sent an email this morning and just had a nice phone call from the regional office, they have a branch in my workplace.


----------



## krink (Jan 11, 2012)

from one of my pals this morning (sparks):



> Good picket this morning at Hartlepool power station for the Sparks' dispute. Managed to cause a bit of gridlock on a busy roundabout, with the police seemingly disinclined to do much about it for the first 20 mins or so. Could also be on ITV news at some point today, cos they had a cameraman there, and a reporter as well this time.


----------



## ddraig (Jan 11, 2012)

seems like NUNISON are shit in a lot of places
where i work there is no communication anymore at all despite the pensions and other big local issues at the moment. they get their recruitment stall out and post a couple of pics of a banner or 2 on a march claiming great success but no opinion and non fight. i spoke up at a meeting about there being no fight and no communication threatening to leave and got a call at my desk a while later asking me if i was still leaving so they could cancel subs! 
so i have joined gmb and so have a few other colleagues as they at least communicate. more to follow no doubt.


----------



## Guineveretoo (Jan 11, 2012)

All unions are only as good as their local activists/members, so people's experiences are very different. I am a member of the GMB, but never hear anything from them other than the glossy mag, which I tend to ignore.

I am not part of the pensions dispute, though, and i can imagine it is very frustrating not to hear when there is a big campaign/dispute like that going on, and there is no excuse for Unison not keeping its members up to speed with what is going on, and consulting them before making decisions!


----------



## dennisr (Jan 11, 2012)

Guineveretoo said:


> All unions are only as good as their local activists/members, so people's experiences are very different. I am a member of the GMB, but never hear anything from them other than the glossy mag, which I tend to ignore.
> 
> I am not part of the pensions dispute, though, and i can imagine it is very frustrating not to hear when there is a big campaign/dispute like that going on, and there is no excuse for Unison not keeping its members up to speed with what is going on, and consulting them before making decisions!



Agree with your point about unions generally - but it should be added that their decisions went completely against what Unison's local meetings have shown the membership want


----------



## butchersapron (Jan 12, 2012)

Here's how an overview of how things stand today - with potentially important meeting later today.


----------



## frogwoman (Jan 18, 2012)

http://www.usdaw.org.uk/newsevents/news/2012/jan/primarknorthernirelandfaces.aspx fuck me


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 18, 2012)

Mr.Bishie said:


> We have only two unions affiliated with the local authority who we work for, Unison & GMB. If enough members of each wanted to leave, & join another union, say Unite or PCS, how would it work? How would the latter approach the local authority for affiliation? Has it happened before?


 
I pretty sure that PCS don't have any local authority-based presence?? I mean do PCS ever try to get active in local government? Have to say I've never heard of that.

But good luck anyway Mr B -- no doubt others here will know more about your sector than this here 'featherbedded' civil servant


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 18, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Here's how an overview of how things stand today - with potentially important meeting later today.



Very interesting that PCS and Unite have been readmitted to talks, for whatever little that's worth. Thanks for that.

Will bookmark that site, most PCS sources locally here tend to be far less up to date ....


----------



## William of Walworth (Jan 18, 2012)

Serwotka said:
			
		

> Mark Serwotka said: “We welcome the fact that the government has backtracked on its decision to exlcude us and now recognises that unions representing the workers who are affected by its decision have the right to be in talks"
> 
> “We will attend every meeting but for any settlement we will need genuine negotiations on the key issues that brought two million public servants out n strike on 30th November – the proposed contributions rise, the increase in retirement age and the imposed switched in indexation.”



Nothing like repeating the important things ....


----------



## Guineveretoo (Jan 19, 2012)

Mr.Bishie said:


> We have only two unions affiliated with the local authority who we work for, Unison & GMB. If enough members of each wanted to leave, & join another union, say Unite or PCS, how would it work? How would the latter approach the local authority for affiliation? Has it happened before?


PCS are not allowed to organise within local government. This would be in breach of an agreement between unions. Unite, however, already have a presence in local government, although they may not have recognition (which is what I think you mean by "affiliation") in your local authority.

Chances are, I am afraid that, if Unite are not officially recognised by your employer it would be quite difficult to get them to become active. There may be a "recognition agreement" between the employer and Unison/GMB, which would make it very difficult for any other union to get involved. However, it is worth checking, because it is perfectly possible that Unite are also part of a recognition agreement, but simply not very active. In that case, I am sure they would welcome a group of workers seeking to join them, and to make them active.

Contact the regional office of Unite, and ask them, or look in the staff handbook (often on the intranet these days) for a copy of the recognition agreement.


----------



## articul8 (Jan 23, 2012)

After his claim that the LGPS settlement was a "victory for the unions", Cde Newman takes a pop at the left (and confirms much of what was said up the thread):
http://www.socialistunity.com/andrew-fischer-on-trade-unions-wrong-wrong-wrong/


----------



## butchersapron (Jan 23, 2012)

Fellow party member


----------



## articul8 (Jan 23, 2012)

so is Andrew Fisher - it's a broad church


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 6, 2012)

Here's a (new?) daily round up of strikes from around the world - don't know much about it beyond that.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 7, 2012)

> RMT members at Heathrow Express are to strike over the unfair dismissal of a driver and over a campaign of harassment and victimisation against an RMT rep.
> 
> Nearly 80% of members voted to strike in a ballot of drivers over the sacking of Zahid Majid and over 80% for strike action in a ballot of all Heathrow Express staff over the continued victimisation of RMT rep Liaqat Ali. There were even bigger votes in both ballots for action short of a strike.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 8, 2012)

Barnet council workers to strike against privatisation



> On Thursday 9 February, hundreds of Barnet council *UNISON members will go on strike.
> 
> Barnet council workers are fighting Barnet council plans to mass-outsource council services and jobs to the private sector.
> 
> ...


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

*Jet tanker drivers force employers to negotiate*
http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/articles/13716

Following eight days of strike action with another week-long strike called, Jet tanker drivers at Immingham, Stockton and Kingsbury have forced their employer, haulage firm Wincanton, and its client, ConocoPhillips, to commit to talks about securing a long-term future for the workforce.


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

*Stagecoach South Yorkshire strike day 11: Management getting desperate!*
http://www.shopstewards.net/news.245.htm

Over 300 bus drivers in Barnsley and Rotherham, members of Unite, are now on their 11th day of strike action for decent pay. Their £9/hour claim has been met but they are sticking out for back-pay from last year and will not accept a pay freeze for the next year.

Messages of support should be emailed to Barnsley Unite branch secretary Tony Rushforth at: 
a-rushforth@sky.com. Cheques should be made payable to TGWU 9/9 Barnsley and sent to A Rushforth, 45 Tune Street, Wombwell, BarnsleyS73 8PX


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

*UNISON strikers to leave picket lines to help local charity Thursday*
http://www.barnetunison.me.uk/?q=node/768

On Thursday 9 February UNISON members working for Barnet Council will be taking strike action.

A decision has been made that a team of UNISON strikers will leave the pickets lines to donate their labour to the 'Larches Community'- a local Charity in Edgware which provides services for adults with Learning Difficulties. Our members are committed public servants and have this to say

“We have withdrawn our labour from the Council but we have not withdrawn our commitment to our community which is why a team of UNISON strikers is heading off to donate their labour to help out a local charity providing services for adults with learning difficulties in Barnet!”

Reel News: Solid strike by Barnet Council workers following ballot by UNISON:
http://reelnews.co.uk/solid-strike-by-barnet-council-workers-following-ballot-by-unison/

Barnet UNISON members take their 4th day of strike action on Thursday 9 February in response to the One Barnet Project, which seeks to transfer the majority of the staff out of the Council. The total cost of these projects will look to exceed £2 Billion, which is why the Big Private Sector Fat Cats are all lined up to try and win the contracts! Email support to contactus@barnetunison.org.uk


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

PCS national executive committee has just voted unanimously to consult members on rejecting the government's miserable pensions proposals to make us pay more, get less and work longer and to support a campaign of industrial action to win concessions. If there is a positive vote, and we are very confident there will be, and if other unions agree the programme of action we will call a national strike on 28th March. The NUT national executive is also meeting today. We must do all we can to build an alliance that can stop the pensions robbery and today is a significant step in that direction. Check the PCS website later today for full details.

and

NUT joins PCS in launching consultation to build support for ongoing pensions campaign - starting with plan for joint strike action on March 28
http://electmartin1.blogspot.com/2012/02/nut-and-pcs-launch-consultative-surveys.html

http://union-news.co.uk/2012/02/breaking-unite-to-ballot-health-service-members-over-pensions/


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

I know its in the Republic - but hope you can forgive me for using this thread as an excuse for mentioning this ongoing impressive occupation in Cork:

*Support the Vita Cortex Workers*
http://vitacortexworkers.wordpress.com

Former workers at the Vita Cortex plant in Cork are staging a sit-in protest. The company, which manufactures foam packaging, closed its plant on the Kinsale Road before Christmas. Workers, including several people with more than 40 years of service to the company, were let go without redundancy payments. … Since then the 32 staff members have been staging a sit-in at the plant.

The level of community support is something else to see (regular updates on the occuiers facebook page
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Support-the-Vita-Cortex-Workers


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

*RMT secures £500 Olympics payment and protection of living standards for Virgin Rail staff*
http://www.rmt.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=155164

RAIL UNION RMT confirmed today that it has secured a £500 Olympics and Paralympics payment for Virgin Rail staff as part of a package which will also see wages and allowances rise by 4.6% or £950 (whichever is the greater) from April this year and a £500 flat rate payment for all staff covered by collective agreements for additional pressures on services throughout the Olympics period.


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

*Electrical Contractors Annual Awards Dinner - Sparks say "EAT THIS" PROTEST*
Wednesday, 15 February 2012 18:00 until 20:00

London Rank n File Sparks Invitation:
The BESNA 7 are gonna be winning awards, patting themselves on the back and quaffing champagne at their annual awards dinner.
Meanwhile: Our money is cut - Our industry deskilled - Our families suffer. Let them eat BESNA 

Spread the word - lets make this MASSIVE

http://www.eca.co.uk/training-news-and-events/eca-annual-dinner/


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

*VICTIMISATION*
*Len Hockey (UNISON)* Joint Branch Sec and Hospital Porter was to be disciplined by Initial services on 30th Jan in connection with his role as lead rep. At the same time Unison Greater London sent a letter to his members to attack and discredit him. it has now been withdrawn after a solid campaign by branch members

*John Brookes (PCS)* Rep sacked for highlighting job and service cuts on the work programme. http://tinyurl.com/7m6zssn

*Pat Markety (NUT)* Summarily dismissed on the 17th of Jan. NUT members at the school voted to take strike action in Pat's defence. Unfortunately, the ballot was "timed out," and a new indicative ballot is now in progress.

*Alberto Durango (IWW Cleaners and Allied Grades Branch Secretary)* was sacked from his job at the Heron Tower by the contractor Incentive FM Group Ltd.10th Feb protest 5-8pm


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

And further dates for your diaries:

Fri 10th Feb
*Save Remploy Factories* - Lobby outside DWP office Sheffield (Steel City House) 12.30 and then march and rally at Town Hall.

Mon 13th Feb  
*NSSN* Staff "Solidarity with workers in struggle!" 7.30pm Unilever - striking against attacks on their private sector pensions, Remploy - fighting to save their jobs & PCS & NUT - 2 of the unions leading the fight to defend public sector pensions. Sacred Hearts Social Centre corner of Downey St & Regent Rd, Hanley ST1 3BY

Wed 15th Feb  
*Southampton Unite & Unison lobby of the Council* meeting 1.00 p.m - 2.00p.m

Sat. 25 Feb
*Leeds Against the cuts (LATC) with the support of the Trades Council is organising a Demo & Rally* at the Tory local government conference on the 24/25 Feb. Meet 10:00 Rally in City Squire at 12:30. Rally to co-inside with Pickles keynote speech! Contact Kevin Pattison 0113 266 6730 or Leeds TUC.

Wed 29th Feb
*Lambeth SOS Demo at Council meeting* 6pm
Lambeth Town Hall, Brixton

Wed 7 March
6pm *All Together for the NHS campaign* workers and patients join together in Central Hall Westminster for a 6pm 'Save our NHS' rally.

That enough for now I think...


----------



## dennisr (Feb 9, 2012)

... if this was Greece we would be about to go into 2 x 48 hour general strikes... Here's hoping...


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 10, 2012)

We're about to set up our trades council again in bucks


----------



## dennisr (Feb 10, 2012)

UCU agreed today to coincide strike proposals with NUT & PCS for 28 March


----------



## quinny518 (Feb 11, 2012)

UCU post 1992 aka polytechnics will be out again with other teaching TPS pension scheme unions. Provisional date set by NEC 1 march. We need more than one day. Hopefully it well escalate up to 5 days minimum with a rolling programme of action short of a strike, delaying marks, refusal to do research bids, give the 'batemans' in corporate management a head ache and a half. Shane about the USS red brick sell out on industrial action but you can't trust traditional university academic to develop a spine.


----------



## quinny518 (Feb 11, 2012)

dennisr said:


> UCU agreed today to coincide strike proposals with NUT & PCS for 28 March


good stuff heard nothing on union e mail


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 12, 2012)

dennisr said:


> *PCS national executive committee has just voted unanimously to consult members on rejecting the government's miserable pensions proposals to make us pay more, get less and work longer and to support a campaign of industrial action to win concessions.* If there is a positive vote, and we are very confident there will be, and if other unions agree the programme of action we will call a national strike on 28th March. The NUT national executive is also meeting today. We must do all we can to build an alliance that can stop the pensions robbery and today is a significant step in that direction. Check the PCS website later today for full details.


 
Good stuff here, thanks for this update dennis -- which I hadn't yet picked up on .....


----------



## Berkeley (Feb 13, 2012)

Something very encouraging happened last week in the States.  Rick Santorum, (granted, religious zealot) won three States, (Colorado, Missouri, and Minnesota) with almost no money in an election where Romney is awash with money.  Just the fact that a message could get through is encouraging.  If the United States ever reached the point that we could have a national strike and shut the country down a lot of things could happen.  It would seem probably that there would be some rewards for the UK in that too.  We hear that the French have done a pretty good job of keeping government and business in line with their strikes.   Is this true?


----------



## dennisr (Feb 13, 2012)

Berkeley said:


> Something very encouraging happened last week in the States. Rick Santorum, (granted, religious zealot) won three States, (Colorado, Missouri, and Minnesota) with almost no money in an election where Romney is awash with money. Just the fact that a message could get through is encouraging. If the United States ever reached the point that we could have a national strike and shut the country down a lot of things could happen. It would seem probably that there would be some rewards for the UK in that too. We hear that the French have done a pretty good job of keeping government and business in line with their strikes. Is this true?


 
Berkeley - could I ask you to keep you somewhat uninfomed philiosophical american musings off of this thread cheers


----------



## BigTom (Feb 13, 2012)

*Stoke - bin men to vote on *indefinite* strike*

http://www.thisisstaffordshire.co.u...-Stoke-Trent/story-15177774-detail/story.html



> Stoke-on-Trent's waste collectors face having their contracts torn up in council cuts which will see 28 team leaders forced to apply for labouring jobs and take a £90-per-week pay cut. and 24 labouring workers in waste collection will also be forced to drop pay bands at a cost of £45-per-week.
> 
> ...
> 
> ...


----------



## dennisr (Feb 13, 2012)

*Initial cleaners at swanky St Pancras Eurostar terminal strike over poverty pay*

http://www.rmt.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=155312

_RAIL UNION RMT announced today a series of strike actions by cleaners working for Initial on a Network Rail contract who are paid peanuts to clean the swanky first class facilities at the St Pancras Eurostar terminal. The cleaners, who look after the St Pancras facilities served by Eurostar, East Midlands, First Capital Connect and Southeastern High Speed, will strike for 48 hours from 0600 on Thursday 16th February and for a further 48 hours from 0600 on the 1st March._


----------



## Berkeley (Feb 14, 2012)

dennisr said:


> Berkeley - could I ask you to keep you somewhat uninfomed philiosophical american musings off of this thread cheers


----------



## dennisr (Feb 14, 2012)

The construction electricians are protesting outside the electrical employers annual awards dinner tomorrow evening. 5.30pm.
Its an official Unite demo and could be big with a national turnout

Grosvenor House Hotel, Park Lane, London W1K 7TN, nearest tube Marble Arch

Added: 7 day notice today )


----------



## dennisr (Feb 16, 2012)

*RMT - Fantastic support from staff and public as RMT kicks off 48 hour St Pancras Eurostar cleaners*
http://www.rmt.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=155412

"Strike action by Initial cleaners at St Pancras International kicked off at 6am this morning with pickets out in force and rail union RMT reporting fantastic support from the public in the fight against poverty pay. Around seventy pickets and supporters have brought horns, drums and a carnival atmosphere to the London Eurostar terminal."

Guy Smallman's Pics: http://guy-smallman-photos.photoshelter.com/gallery-slideshow/G0000EE3_oNrTeoI/?start

Another report; http://www.shopstewards.net/news.249.htm


----------



## dennisr (Feb 17, 2012)

Feck me - now everybody is at - first Greece - now Portugal:

*General strike announced after biggest workers’ march in 32 years*

http://www.socialistworld.net/doc/5590

Its catching...


----------



## JHE (Feb 17, 2012)

> But, with a general strike now announced for 22 March it is being shown that, as in Greece, the working people will shake the system to its foundations in the fight for an alternative road.


 
A one-day general strike is a protest - nothing more. I don't know how often one-day general strikes happen in Portugal, but in neighbouring Spain there have been many one-day general strikes over the years. Sadly, they are pretty much shrugged off by governments.

Best of luck to the Portuguese workers, but they're not 'shaking the system to its foundations', let alone replacing the system.


----------



## dennisr (Feb 17, 2012)

JHE said:


> A one-day general strike is a protest - nothing more. I don't know how often one-day general strikes happen in Portugal, but in neighbouring Spain there have been many one-day general strikes over the years. Sadly, they are pretty much shrugged off by governments.
> 
> Best of luck to the Portuguese workers, but they're not 'shaking the system to its foundations', let alone replacing the system.


 
Thanks for the advice - I am sure the Portuguese workers would not have worked this out (...through the act of 'doing'...) without your sage like words

(Try and reply to what is said rather than cut and paste contexting to make it look like others have said - straw men don't make effective arguements)


----------



## JHE (Feb 17, 2012)

It's Brit Trots (not Portuguese workers) who need help calming down and recognising reality.


----------



## JHE (Feb 17, 2012)

dennisr said:


> (Try and reply to what is said rather than cut and paste contexting to make it look like others have said - straw men don't make effective arguements)


 
I'm not sure what you're complaining about.  I simply quoted part of the article you linked.


----------



## dennisr (Feb 17, 2012)

JHE said:


> It's Brit Trots (not Portuguese workers) who need help calming down and recognising reality.


ah, the 'voice of reason' stance - that's right you are the only realistic person left on the planet - we bow to your cynical eye - fuck off you poisonous cunt
haven;t you got a muslim to go an talk shite about you twat?


----------



## dennisr (Feb 17, 2012)

*Stagecoach drivers secure pay increase after bitter 4 month dispute*
http://union-news.co.uk/2012/02/stagecoach-drivers-accept-pay-increase-after-bitter-4-month-dispute

_Stagecoach drivers in South Yorkshire have voted overwhelmingly to accept an improved pay offer in their long-running dispute._
_A workplace ballot has been taking place throughout today after a recommendation from the negotiating team._


----------



## chilango (Feb 17, 2012)

Much as a I hate to say it JHE has a point here. There are general strikes and "general strikes". We've had a number of one day general strikes here in Italy. In fact I've "taken part" in some. These have mostly been token affairs confined to one Union federation at a time. When this shifts to all the Feds and become ongoing then things will get interesting.

...but little steps and all that.


----------



## dennisr (Feb 17, 2012)

chilango said:


> ...but little steps and all that.


 
He is stating the obvious for his usual cynical reasons. As you say - small - but very important steps and all that


----------



## chilango (Feb 17, 2012)

Aye. Just worth remembering that a general strike in Europe is often quite a different beast to what one might be in the UK.


----------



## dennisr (Feb 17, 2012)

JHE said:


> I'm not sure what you're complaining about. I simply quoted part of the article you linked.


 
fained innocence - what a surprise...

Here is another bit you could have quoted from those unrealistic "trots"
_"However, the fundamental tasks posed by the new social movements, of opening up the unions on the basis of democratic control from below, unionising the young ’precariat’ and the building of a united movement of workers, youth and the unemployed, remain unsolved."_

My views on the situation in Greece comes from folk on the ground there. My views on the situation in Portugal come from folk on the ground there. My support for Sparks in London is not retrospective.

*Just get to fuck*


----------



## JHE (Feb 17, 2012)

Have a valium


----------



## BigTom (Feb 18, 2012)

*Bootle, Liverpool *workers stage occupation following lock out

http://union-news.co.uk/2012/02/breaking-workers-occupy-packaging-factory-after-lock-out/


----------



## articul8 (Feb 18, 2012)

first lock out in Britain for over 50 years!?


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 18, 2012)

BigTom said:


> *Bootle, Liverpool *workers stage occupation following lock out
> 
> http://union-news.co.uk/2012/02/breaking-workers-occupy-packaging-factory-after-lock-out/


 
Fucking hell, we're back to the days of Lockouts


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 18, 2012)

articul8 said:


> first lock out in Britain for over 50 years!?


 
Don't you remember the very long running  liverpool dockers lockout in the late 90s - don't know what those 'labour history experts' are talking about, unless they're using a very strict definition.

Other news:

*Strike days lost in 2011 ‘highest since Thatcher’*



> More days of work were lost to industrial action in the UK last year than at any time since 1990, official figures have confirmed.
> 
> Data from the Office for National Statistics revealed that almost 1.4 million working days were lost in 2011, up from 365,000 in 2010. There were 184 individual stoppages and around 1.5 million workers took part in some form of industrial action.


----------



## dennisr (Feb 20, 2012)

*Bootle*: Talks are due at 12pm today (look at NSSN website for more info).

Messages of support to: Phil Potter, Unite FOC at MMP, p-potter1@sky.com


----------



## dennisr (Feb 20, 2012)

Four of the six remaining BESNA companies have requested a meeting with Unite


----------



## articul8 (Feb 20, 2012)

Not strictly a strike related question (except part of UNISON's logic for backing down) but has there been any decision from the unions' legal action re RPI/CPI uprating?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 28, 2012)

Tube workers ballot for strike after rejecting £500 Olympic bonus




> The RMT transport union said it had “no option” after failing to reach agreement with London Underground over the extra pay. It described the offer as “totally inadequate”.
> It believes the offer, which would work out at £15 a shift, contains too many strings attached including restricting annual leave during the Olympics.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Feb 28, 2012)

more info on this story here: http://union-news.co.uk/2012/02/tube-drivers-to-ballot-for-olympic-strike/


----------



## nagapie (Feb 28, 2012)

Would be fun if they came out on the next union strike day, 28th March. So far I'm told it will be the NUT, Unite and Unilever.


----------



## weepiper (Feb 28, 2012)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/feb/28/len-mccluskey-unions-london-olympics


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 28, 2012)

PCS are currently balloting their members (incl me  ) re striking on Wednesday 28 March.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

weepiper said:


> http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/feb/28/len-mccluskey-unions-london-olympics


 
Oh god, the Tories are going to have a field day.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

This will derail the whole bloody agenda, just as we were getting steam up on the NHS and Workfare we've now got to go through five rounds of 'Who pays the paymasters' in the House and with the Press.
McCluskey, you fool. The Tories will now get away with some dirty stuff in the next week or two while Ed tries to get the 'Union Stooge' sign that's just been slapped on him. Which will damage the prospects of his members. The bloody fool.

I support unions, and am a union person myself. But even I can see political incompetence in this case


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

Now McCluskey's unpatriotic, and Labour will get tagged the same way. Nightmare


----------



## Orang Utan (Feb 29, 2012)

i would so love it if the olympics got ruined by strikes.


----------



## Orang Utan (Feb 29, 2012)

dp


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

William of Walworth said:


> PCS are currently balloting their members (incl me  ) re striking on Wednesday 28 March.


It's a brilliant interview and absolutely the right thing to say. Makes me delighted to have voted for him.

Anyone actually reading the interview would have great difficulty disagreeing with him either*. He is simply pointing out that it would be wrong to say the Olympics are special and sacrosanct and must not be the focus of any kind of political action. If we want to highlight the appalling effects the cuts are going to have then we should be doing so in a way that gets that message across to as many as possible. And if that means having an Olympic protest, then yay!

If you bother about what the tories are going to say, you'll do nowt and end up with another Tony Blair as Labour leader.



*other than maybe the bit about 'legal' civil disobedience


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

What's the problem? The tories and lib-dems were never going to paint the unions as heroes justified in their fight to protect pensions, NHS, public services etc (that's a generous uncritical reading of what they're doing for now). They've been getting this grief anyway regardless of whatever rhetorical threats they offer. There's no way to offer any sort of resistance (even at this pathetic level) _without_ going through this. And if it emboldens the significant section of the population both opposed to the cuts and not at all bothered by the Olympics then all the better. This really isn't the time for timidity - there's going to be flak coming at you when you try and apply pressure, the trick is no to panic and immediately back off in the face of it, or they've achieved exactly what they set out to by sending it in your direction.


----------



## weepiper (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> Now McCluskey's unpatriotic, and Labour will get tagged the same way. Nightmare


 
Why is it a nightmare? Labour are a bunch of spineless milksops so I don't feel they're much of a loss. The rightwing press and the tories already hate the unions.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

I'm not sure it's the most effective intervention for him to have made this week - why not focus on the NHS bill or the Workfare issues, which could align the union's position with a potentially massive reservoir of public support.  Talking about disrupting the olympics is just grandstanding(!), bound to be quite divisive and not really pressuring Cameron.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

He didn't choose the questions they asked him


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> He didn't choose the questions they asked him


Indeed, it was an emailed in question.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> He didn't choose the questions they asked him


No, and if he was challenged to rule out protesting during the Olympics he'd be right not to.  But he should thrown the emphasis on avoiding strikes back onto Cameron and the government


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I'm not sure it's the most effective intervention for him to have made this week - why not focus on the NHS bill or the Workfare issues, which could align the union's position with a potentially massive reservoir of public support. Talking about disrupting the olympics is just grandstanding(!), bound to be quite divisive and not really pressuring Cameron.


He did as it goes and he related any proposed action during the Olympics to the fight to save the NHS.

Have you read the thing?


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I'm not sure it's the most effective intervention for him to have made this week - why not focus on the NHS bill or the Workfare issues, which could align the union's position with a potentially massive reservoir of public support. Talking about disrupting the olympics is just grandstanding(!), bound to be quite divisive and not really pressuring Cameron.


 
This. And regardless of the email'd question - the last week or two have shown a groundswell of opposition to the govts. policies on the NHS and Workfare, with the quick label tossing of 'trot' 'extremist' and others being laughed off.

Now McCluskey's weighed in, and will drive away the single issue supporters who don't want to be associated with being 'unpatriotic' and all the other things. Like when the SWP turn up and monster some embryonic campaign group and drive everyone away with the kool aid drinking party line, McCluskey just switched a lot of the potential support to either maybes or against.


----------



## treelover (Feb 29, 2012)

bad move, imo, but I am baffled why he hasn't called for a national protest against the health bill, it would be massive..


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> He did as it goes and he related any proposed action during the Olympics to the fight to save the NHS.
> 
> Have you read the thing?


 
Softly softly though. Not shotgun feet.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Nah, now is the time to be shouting, to be heavy handed. Whilst there is still something left to to be shouting about.


----------



## treelover (Feb 29, 2012)

'We have got to make certain that the demonstration being planned by the TUC for March is so big "it rocks the establishment and makes them step back'


Whats this? never heard of it?


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Nah, now is the time to be shouting.


 
Yes, shouting with people - not shouting something which will divide the tenative coming together of some disparate groups of people. Divide and rule is meant to be their tactic, not ours.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> This. And regardless of the email'd question - the last week or two have shown a groundswell of opposition to the govts. policies on the NHS and Workfare, with the quick label tossing of 'trot' 'extremist' and others being laughed off.
> 
> Now McCluskey's weighed in, and will drive away the single issue supporters who don't want to be associated with being 'unpatriotic' and all the other things. Like when the SWP turn up and monster some embryonic campaign group and drive everyone away with the kool aid drinking party line, McCluskey just switched a lot of the potential support to either maybes or against.


If you care about workfare (and polls indicate majority support for all forms) or the NHS then you're not going to be put off by Cameron calling an enemy an enemy. Softly softly and vote labour in 2015 is not enough - it will be too late.


----------



## weepiper (Feb 29, 2012)

treelover said:


> 'We have got to make certain that the demonstration being planned by the TUC for March is so big "it rocks the establishment and makes them step back'
> 
> 
> Whats this? never heard of it?


 
28th of March is the next strike day. I imagine he's talking about another big march?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> Yes, shouting with people - not shouting something which will divide the tenative coming together of some disparate groups of people. Divide and rule is meant to be their tactic, not ours.


Why on earth are you assuming that this will be the result? Why might it not deepen peoples committment to other and the issues under an easily batted away common attack?


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> This. And regardless of the email'd question - the last week or two have shown a groundswell of opposition to the govts. policies on the NHS and Workfare, with the quick label tossing of 'trot' 'extremist' and others being laughed off.


 
sorry, are you trying to say that because a couple of right-wing papers (and a couple of pseudo-lefty prats) have said 'boo, this is all SWP led,' the groundswell of opposition to NHS & workfare policies has ended?  Because it hasn't. More companies are still pulling out of workfare, opposition to the NHS bill is as high as ever.

McLuskeys words will, hopefully, do what they were intended to - galvanise the members of his union (including the new community section), make them believe that they will actually be supported in fighting back, and in taking the action that _could_ actually achieve our goals.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> If you care about workfare (and polls indicate majority support for all forms) or the NHS then you're not going to be put off by Cameron calling an enemy an enemy. Softly softly and vote labour in 2015 is not enough - it will be too late.


 
Not everyone's on a broad spectrum anti-coalition line. Some will be against just the NHS, some just workfare. Most people don't have the time to develop the full opposition. There'd only just been a sustained effective public opinion vocally opposed to government policy. I fear McCluskey's interview just made some of those people sit down and shut up.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> He did as it goes and he related any proposed action during the Olympics to the fight to save the NHS.


 
He should have deflected the Olympics question by saying we've got weeks to save the NHS not months or something.  It wasn't clever to get drawn in this way.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

Why?  (that was to Balbi, but fits for articul8 too)


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> sorry, are you trying to say that because a couple of right-wing papers (and a couple of pseudo-lefty prats) have said 'boo, this is all SWP led,' the groundswell of opposition to NHS & workfare policies has ended? Because it hasn't. More companies are still pulling out of workfare, opposition to the NHS bill is as high as ever.


 
No, I'm saying that the governments answer seemed ridiculous. Mothers, families, grandparents, professionals etc - as trots etc? Hahahaha.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> Not everyone's on a broad spectrum anti-coalition line. Some will be against just the NHS, some just workfare. Most people don't have the time to develop the full opposition. There'd only just been a sustained effective public opinion vocally opposed to government policy. I fear McCluskey's interview just made some of those people sit down and shut up.


But how and why? I really do not see why you're assuming this will inevitably be the case. I  can see you think it, but beyond saying that the tories and tory papers will attack labour (?) and the unions (as they will anyway) i can't see any real reasons for your believing this.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> He should have deflected the Olympics question by saying we've got weeks to save the NHS not months or something. It wasn't clever to get drawn in this way.


Damn right, lets have politicians style weasel answers - we most certainly don't want to inflame the situation in any way.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

Unite represent 28,000 bus workers in London, who are in dispute over extra payments for the extra work they'll do in the Olympics - they're not getting the measly offer that the tube & train workers are getting.  It would have been an utter disgrace, an abject failure to represent his members if McLuskey had said that the Olympics were sacrosanct and couldn't be affected in any way.

And, batting away a question like that would have made him look like just another slimy politician, a tosser who wouldn't say what he thinks, and would still have led to, essentially,  the same headlines - "What wont Leftie Len Tell Us About His Evil Olympics Plans?


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> No, I'm saying that the governments answer seemed ridiculous. Mothers, families, grandparents, professionals etc - as trots etc? Hahahaha.


aah, fair do's, sorry. But then, surely, you see that this will just be dismissed in a similar way? Most people wont care about how the lying press portray one persons comments


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Damn right, lets have politicians style weasel answers - we most certainly don't want to inflame the situation in any way.


You don't give your enemy what they want - Cameron loves this, perfect opp to bang on about unions being unpatriotic anti-British wreckers etc.etc.  He should have focused his anwers on what would make the Cameron squirm not squirm with pleasure.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> aah, fair do's, sorry. But then, surely, you see that this will just be dismissed in a similar way? Most people wont care about how the lying press portray one persons comments


 
It's the fact that person's seen as a signficant figure for the unions. Up until now it's been attack to government, and it's effective. Now McCluskey's stated something which won't play well, I expect, with the general public.

And butchers - I just predict it. Public support's easy to lose, especially with big bold statements about disruption etc. There's still not a lot of love for unions out there.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> You don't give your enemy what they want - Cameron loves this, perfect opp to bang on about unions being unpatriotic anti-British wreckers etc.etc. He should have focused his anwers on what would make the Cameron squirm not squirm with pleasure.


 
Time which could have been spent on the policies, will now be spent on this punch and judy show.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> Unite represent 28,000 bus workers in London, who are in dispute over extra payments for the extra work they'll do in the Olympics - they're not getting the measly offer that the tube & train workers are getting. It would have been an utter disgrace, an abject failure to represent his members if McLuskey had said that the Olympics were sacrosanct and couldn't be affected in any way.
> 
> And, batting away a question like that would have made him look like just another slimy politician, a tosser who wouldn't say what he thinks, and would still have led to, essentially, the same headlines - "What wont Leftie Len Tell Us About His Evil Olympics Plans?


 
Agree it would've been wrong to rule out action during the olympics - but the critical thing is not allowing yourself to be led down a path your enemies want you to take.  That's not being a slimy politician, it's about having some political nouse.


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 29, 2012)

hang on - why are people saying the olympics wouldn't/shouldn't be affected? there is going to be one of the biggest police presences in the country for the olympics. they are going to be used as an excuse to bring in more and more authoritarian practices/legislation as a "natural" state of affairs. damn right there should be strikes during the olympics, because many of the people who will be employed during that time will be among the most exploited. so many people didn't want them anyway. it's like saying that strikes shouldn't affect the royal wedding because lots of people liked and enjoyed it on television, FFS. I seem to remember that the writers' strike in America affected the production of some of the best loved shows and films but i'm assuming most people on here would have supported that?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> You don't give your enemy what they want - Cameron loves this, perfect opp to bang on about unions being unpatriotic anti-British wreckers etc.etc. He should have focused his anwers on what would make the Cameron squirm not squirm with pleasure.


_Whatever_ he said would have been spun as that. So instead, concentrate on not being directed how to answer by fear of a nasty tory saying that you're a bad man. His answers were largely irrelevant to the tory and tory media responses. To argue as you have is to capitulate to their agenda. Fear of looking like you give a shit about the NHS, pensions, public services is not a strength


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Agree it would've been wrong to rule out action during the olympics - but the critical thing is not allowing yourself to be led down a path your enemies want you to take. That's not being a slimy politician, it's about having some political nouse.


It's _nous_. And if you think he didn't mean to make the question of aggressive union action during the olympics a public issue then you don't know what it means.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

I'm not advocating being fearful about protesting - I'm saying direct your answers to where the Tories are most vulnerable, which right now isn't the Olympics (it's a different question if we were talking about an interview in June).


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Agree it would've been wrong to rule out action during the olympics - but the critical thing is not allowing yourself to be led down a path your enemies want you to take. That's not being a slimy politician, it's about having some political nouse.


 
if they don't start going down a more militant path we're going to be left with nothing.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

If you read the article, he actually talks about 'actions', alongside his talk about legal civil disobedience, and 'UKUncut style' campaigns. It doesn't, for one second, mean actually disrupting the Games, it will be protests - of the kind banned during the Chinese games - that gain worldwide media attention and embarrass the British government a little.

No one will actually be put off anti-government campaigns by this, the only ones making any noise will be the noes who support the bloody government anyway.  And, dont forget, about half the country couldn't give a flying ferrets fuck about the Olympics anyway. 

The boys played a blinder.


----------



## 8ball (Feb 29, 2012)

There should be as many protests during the Olympics as possible.  The louder and more disruptive the better.  They can shove their corporate jamboree up their fucking arse.


----------



## DotCommunist (Feb 29, 2012)

I don't think the country is as in the vinegars about the Olympics as TV and press makes out tbf.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

U75 is not remotely representative of the general public consciousness on the Olympics.  Most people will see it as on balance a good thing even if they object to certain aspects like VIP lanes and excessive policing.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> If you care about workfare (and polls indicate majority support for all forms) or the NHS then you're not going to be put off by Cameron calling an enemy an enemy. Softly softly and vote labour in 2015 is not enough - it will be too late.


 
Cameron calling us the enemy is a badge of fucking honour, the soapy Tory cunt.


----------



## revol68 (Feb 29, 2012)

no one gives a fuck about the Olympics and that's despite the BBC pimping it to fuck at every opportunity.

it's nice to see articul8 articulating his spineless Labour Party credentials though.


----------



## marty21 (Feb 29, 2012)

I like the Olympics - but I think it would be insane for the Unions and other protestors to not use it as a strike/protest weapon. There's a lot of indignant twitter chat about it, 'outrageous that the unions are threatening the Olympics...blah blah blah'  There seems to be a move towards a Chinese style clamp down of civil rights during the Olympics - which were unacceptable to many in Britain at the time - but now strangely seem, perfectly acceptable to many


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> U75 is not remotely representative of the general public consciousness on the Olympics. Most people will see it as on balance a good thing even if they object to certain aspects like VIP lanes and excessive policing.


who said it was? People may see it as good 'on balance', but lots and lots and lots of people dont particularly care, so Len's comments wont have any effect on them

(oh, and I'll just point out that I do actually like them, and will be annoyed if I cant delayed on my way to the womens hammer qualifying, but, fuck it, there are more important things)


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> Not everyone's on a broad spectrum anti-coalition line. Some will be against just the NHS, some just workfare. Most people don't have the time to develop the full opposition.


 
TBF, I reckon you're selling "most" people short. If even a staid old Tory like my dad can connect the dots (as he has), then I reckon you could be in for a surprise. People appearing to be "getting" the whole picture because unless they're thoroughly-insulated from the outside world, they're NHS users, and will know at least one person on benefits who they don't believe is a scrounger who should be compelled to work, IYSWIM.



> There'd only just been a sustained effective public opinion vocally opposed to government policy. I fear McCluskey's interview just made some of those people sit down and shut up.


 
I don't think McCluskey's interview is either that divisive, or that (even with the media pushing it as such) people will see it as a reason to abdicate any action.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> U75 is not remotely representative of the general public consciousness on the Olympics. Most people will see it as on balance a good thing even if they object to certain aspects like VIP lanes and excessive policing.


 
Yeah?



> The latest Index poll results, conducted by ComRes and to be broadcast on ITV News at Ten tonight, reveal that that a large majority of the public do not feel positive about the London Olympics, with more than half of the population (54%) disagreeing that they are excited about the event to be held in the Capital this summer.
> 
> Nation-wide, 67% disagree that the London 2012 Olympics will benefit the lives of people in their area, with 55% stating that the event will only benefit London and the people living in London.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

revol68 said:


> no one gives a fuck about the Olympics and that's despite the BBC pimping it to fuck at every opportunity.
> 
> it's nice to see articul8 articulating his spineless Labour Party credentials though.


Odd thing is, the rest of the interview is laregly the same reclaim labour kak that he offers.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> He should have deflected the Olympics question by saying we've got weeks to save the NHS not months or something. It wasn't clever to get drawn in this way.


 
Yeah. The last "28 days to save the NHS" _spiel_ did *so* well!!!


----------



## revol68 (Feb 29, 2012)

this pathetic concern for "looking bad" to the "general public" is crippling. Who cares what some poll in the Daily Mail says, it makes no difference to facts on the ground. The point of a strike is to flex your strength not to win a PR competition in the media that will always be opposed to you.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> U75 is not remotely representative of the general public consciousness on the Olympics. Most people will see it as on balance a good thing even if they object to certain aspects like VIP lanes and excessive policing.


Well if my workplace is more typical, then no-one (at all) cares about the Olympics, apart from complaining about the disruption it's going to cause them and their families.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> Yeah. The last "28 days to save the NHS" _spiel_ did *so* well!!!


 


those kinda comments are always dreadful, and I'm astounded how no one can see how counter-productive they are.

29 days later, bill not stopped - well, its all over now then isnt it? Time to move on


----------



## Lo Siento. (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Yeah?


As for only benefitting Londoners, I'd reckon Londoners are probably the most hostile of all ...


----------



## revol68 (Feb 29, 2012)

Striking during the Olympics just makes sense, it makes the government look like twats, unfortunately I've a feeling the union leaders are full of shit and posturing to look more militant than they are. Oh and by feeling I mean I'm certain.


----------



## marty21 (Feb 29, 2012)

revol68 said:


> Striking during the Olympics just makes sense, it makes the government look like twats, unfortunately I've a feeling the union leaders are full of shit and posturing to look more militant than they are. Oh and by feeling I mean I'm certain.


 I agree - I've a feeling they won't actually do it - but threaten to do it for the next 5 months or so


----------



## DotCommunist (Feb 29, 2012)

See dave in full flow demanding that labour reject unite funding etc.

I don't see him giving any money back to the bankers that fund his party.

PMQs hot air as usual


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

revol68 said:


> it's nice to see articul8 articulating his spineless Labour Party credentials though.


 
It's not spineless to suggest that union leaders making public pronouncements should seek to maximise public support behind campaigns which strike the government at their most vulnerable point, rather than engage in ham-fisted posturing which gives splits the most militant sections from a larger potential reservoir of activists.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> You don't give your enemy what they want - Cameron loves this, perfect opp to bang on about unions being unpatriotic anti-British wreckers etc.etc. He should have focused his anwers on what would make the Cameron squirm not squirm with pleasure.


 
Is solidarity really so weak ,in your estimation, that people will abandon their convictions about the NHS and workfare because Cameron paints the unions in the way you claim?


----------



## binka (Feb 29, 2012)

read the metro article on this and i thought this comment was quite depressing:



> This is pathetic, sack them, I work for nissan, if we even think about a strike, we get sacked and they bring in someone that appreciates a job. Society lacks appreciation. Give them the boot and bring in people that really need a job.


 
bloke who said this is only early/mid 20s


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

they should seek to maximise _effective_ support. Getting an extra 10% of people to support an action that wont change anything, instead of taking slightly less popular action that _can_ achieve something, is totally pointless.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It's not spineless to suggest that union leaders making public pronouncements should seek to maximise public support behind campaigns which strike the government at their most vulnerable point, rather than engage in ham-fisted posturing which gives splits the most militant sections from a larger potential reservoir of activists.


Where that then - to both claims. I remember your RMT shouldn't threaten to strike on NYE position as well - very similar arguments and an understanding of poiltical leverage tied directly to how it effects labour in 2015.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> Is solidarity really so weak ,in your estimation, that people will abandon their convictions about the NHS and workfare because Cameron paints the unions in the way you claim?


No, but I don't see what raising this now, in this why achieves - he'd have been better building on broad public support not threatening to polarise it (even if this threat is more apparent than actual).


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> No, but I don't see what raising this now, in this why achieves - he'd have been better building on broad public support not threatening to polarise it (even if this threat is more apparent than actual).


Yes, as you say, he shuld have batted away the direct (emailed in question) and be a proper politician. How you don't say mind.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> No, but I don't see what raising this now, in this why achieves - he'd have been better building on broad public support not threatening to polarise it (even if this threat is more apparent than actual).


that _may be_ the way to elect a Labour government (who wont reverse the tory cuts), but it wont do a damned thing to stop the cuts.

Actully, its not a very good way of electing a Labour government either, but thats another story


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> U75 is not remotely representative of the general public consciousness on the Olympics. Most people will see it as on balance a good thing even if they object to certain aspects like VIP lanes and excessive policing.


 
Speaking for "most people", eh?

Going on the small sample of people I've actually spoken to (from all points of the compass) about the Olympics, the attitude to both the games and their legacy (such as it is) appears to represent a big "so what?", especially outside of the metropolis.  I reckon you're mistaking the fuzzy sensation in the loins of your fellow members of the political classes with actual popular sentiment.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

revol68 said:


> no one gives a fuck about the Olympics and that's despite the BBC pimping it to fuck at every opportunity.
> 
> it's nice to see articul8 articulating his spineless Labour Party credentials though.


 
^^^This.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Where that then - to both claims. I remember your RMT shouldn't threaten to strike on NYE position as well - very similar arguments and an understanding of poiltical leverage tied directly to how it effects labour in 2015.


 
Actually I think it was the FBU on Bonfire Night (and they came to the same conclusion eventually).   Why talk hypothetically about controversial protests that may or may not happen several months hence, when you can build support for actions that are more immediate and more popular (anti-NHS mobilisation, workfare).

These are judgement calls - and sometimes Labour gets it badly wrong in the other direction - eg. attitude to welfare reform and benefits.  I'd have no hesitation is supporting LM against the leadership if he'd called for further civil disobedience around workfare.  I just don't think this call was well-judged or well-timed.   I wouldn't have ruled out strikes and protests during the Olympics - but wouldn't have been drawn like this.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> No, but I don't see what raising this now, in this why achieves - he'd have been better building on broad public support not threatening to polarise it (even if this threat is more apparent than actual).


 
While it's fairly obvious how the political and media classes will attempt to represent McCluskey's utterances, what convinces you that "we, the people" will actually buy into the narrative? Do you really hold Joe Average in such contempt that you fear that any slight deviation from the political script as you see it will cause polarisation?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> that _may be_ the way to elect a Labour government (who wont reverse the tory cuts), but it wont do a damned thing to stop the cuts.
> 
> Actully, its not a very good way of electing a Labour government either, but thats another story


 
Does a "good way" actually exist?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Actually I think it was the FBU on Bonfire Night (and they came to the same conclusion eventually). Why talk hypothetically about controversial protests that may or may not happen several months hence, when you can build support for actions that are more immediate and more popular (anti-NHS mobilisation, workfare).
> 
> These are judgement calls - and sometimes Labour gets it badly wrong in the other direction - eg. attitude to welfare reform and benefits. I'd have no hesitation is supporting LM against the leadership if he'd called for further civil disobedience around workfare. I just don't think this call was well-judged or well-timed. I wouldn't have ruled out strikes and protests during the Olympics - but wouldn't have been drawn like this.


The point _was the threat._

You never think something is well timed or well judged because you have an agenda based on the labour parties interests and identifying that with fear of offending the media that you're employed to attack.


----------



## revol68 (Feb 29, 2012)

*does it matter if a strike has 30% or 60% support in some shitty biased media poll? what matters is the strength of the strike itself and the leverage it maintains. It's not like the people who poll against the vote have any bearing on that. Just look at the Iraq war, 2 million marched against it and got nowhere, a tenth of that number actually disrupting the economy would have had a far greater effect.*


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

What McLuskey actually said:

*Q: One of the comments I got **on the blog I posted inviting readers to suggest questions** was about strike action during the Olympics. [It was from **Imageark.]** Is that something you have talked about?*
A: Absolutely, yes. The attacks that are being launched on public-sector workers at the moment are so deep and ideological that the idea the world should arrive in London and have these wonderful Olympic Games as though everything is nice and rosy in the garden is unthinkable. Our very way of life is being attacked. By then this crazy Health and Social Care Bill may have been passed. So we are looking at the privatisation of our National Health Service. I believe the unions, and the general community, have got every right to be out protesting. If the Olympics provide us with an opportunity, then that's exactly one that we should be looking at.
*Q: Where could your members disrupt the Olympics? Have you got as far as thinking about that?*
A: Not in the specifics, although, moving away from the public sector for a moment, our London bus members are desperately engaged in a battle to bring some stability into what is a crucial lifeline within this fantastic capital city of ours and they are not making progress – not being helped, of course, by the mayor, who seems oblivious to the wishes of ordinary working people. So they will be examining what leverage points we have, and the Olympics will clearly come into play.
Now nobody has made any decisions yet and, of course, it would be nice if we were able not to disrupt such a prestigious event as the Olympics. But by the same token. people have to understand that we are fighting for our heritage here. Our parents and our grandparents, having defeated fascism in Europe, came back determined to build a land fit for heroes. They gave us the welfare state, the National Health Service, universal education. All of that is being attacked. I, for one, am not prepared to stand by and have my children or grandchildren say to me: "What did you do when this was being taken away from us?" When you say what can we do, and the likes of the Olympics, I'm calling upon the general public to engage in civil disobedience.
*Q: What do you mean by that?*
A: All forms of civil disobedience, within the law.
*Q: Are you specifically talking about the Olympics? Or are you making a general point?*
A: I'm making a general point. But you raise the Olympics because it's a focal point. And if there is a protest, then the purpose of protest is to bring your grievances to the attention of as many people as possible.

Looking at that, I find it difficult to see what else he could have said in reply.  Avoiding the questions would have made him look shit and dishonest.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

People want to save the NHS.  Aside from a few dozen anarchoid lefts they would also prefer to watch the 100m sprint final than Len and his mates stood round a brazier.  This much I know.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> Looking at that, I find it difficult to see what else he could have said in reply. Avoiding the questions would have made him look shit and dishonest.


 
...and that's the labour parties job.


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 29, 2012)

a good amount of people who aren't remotely left wing and don't give a fuck about politics don't want the olympics. i like the olympics, and i hope they go well, but saying there should be no strikes ffs. how is that not playing into their hands?


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> People want to save the NHS. Aside from a few dozen anarchoid lefts they would also prefer to watch the 100m sprint final than Len and his mates stood round a brazier. This much I know.


fucks sake, stop copying drivel from the Daily Mail. The stupidity of that post makes me think you've accepted you've lost the argument


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> People want to save the NHS. Aside from a few dozen anarchoid lefts they would also prefer to watch the 100m sprint final than Len and his mates stood round a brazier. This much I know.


Then you know very little ( as saying _100m sprint final demonstrates - anyone having a bet on the grand national hunt steeplechase this year?_)


----------



## Lo Siento. (Feb 29, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> Speaking for "most people", eh?
> 
> Going on the small sample of people I've actually spoken to (from all points of the compass) about the Olympics, the attitude to both the games and their legacy (such as it is) appears to represent a big "so what?", especially outside of the metropolis. I reckon you're mistaking the fuzzy sensation in the loins of your fellow members of the political classes with actual popular sentiment.


 It's yet another case of mistaking the media/political class echo chamber for "public opinion" more generally. Effective trade unionists are _never _going to be popular with the elite, so they should stop worrying about it and get on with looking after their members.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> The point _was the threat._
> 
> You never think something is well timed or well judged because you have an agenda based on the labour parties interests and identifying that with fear of offending the media that you're employed to attack.


On the contrary I think that the anti-workfare protests are very well judged, despite being opposed by the Labour party leadership who stupidly believe that the general public want highly profitable companies to benefit from the unemployed being forced to work for no pay.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Then you know very little ( as saying _100m sprint final demonstrates_)


why?  what's wrong with saying 100m sprint final - I should have added "mens'"?


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> Does a "good way" actually exist?


well, they could try being a principled and _effective_ opposition to the government with a plan for defending peoples living standards, but I guess that's more of a pipe dream than me winning the womens hammer


----------



## revol68 (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> What McLuskey actually said:
> 
> *Q: One of the comments I got **on the blog I posted inviting readers to suggest questions** was about strike action during the Olympics. [It was from **Imageark.]** Is that something you have talked about?*
> A: Absolutely, yes. The attacks that are being launched on public-sector workers at the moment are so deep and ideological that the idea the world should arrive in London and have these wonderful Olympic Games as though everything is nice and rosy in the garden is unthinkable. Our very way of life is being attacked. By then this crazy Health and Social Care Bill may have been passed. So we are looking at the privatisation of our National Health Service. I believe the unions, and the general community, have got every right to be out protesting. If the Olympics provide us with an opportunity, then that's exactly one that we should be looking at.
> ...


 
But but but.... won't somebody think of Miliband?!


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> On the contrary I think that the anti-workfare protests are very well judged, despite being opposed by the Labour party leadership who stupidly believe that the general public want highly profitable companies to benefit from the unemployed being forced to work for no pay.


But if LM called for disruption during the olympics to bolster the anti-workfare fight he'd be wrong.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> why? what's wrong with saying 100m sprint final - I should have added "mens'"?


No you should have said 100m. It demonstrates that you're not within the culture that you're confidently talking  - wrongly in a number of ways - on behalf of.


----------



## DotCommunist (Feb 29, 2012)

the adnoidal, sacless excuse of a man


----------



## chilango (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> People want to save the NHS. Aside from a few dozen anarchoid lefts they would also prefer to watch the 100m sprint final than Len and his mates stood round a brazier. This much I know.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

It's nice to see that my union's planning to go out in 28 days or so, I just wish they'd told me.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> But if LM called for disruption during the olympics to bolster the anti-workfare fight he'd be wrong.


if he said it now, yes.  Why bring that in at this stage?  It's like him saying he's in favour of decapitating the Queen.  Am I opposed on a philosophical level?  No.  Do I think it's a tactically savvy move.  No.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> It's yet another case of mistaking the media/political class echo chamber for "public opinion" more generally. Effective trade unionists are _never _going to be popular with the elite, so they should stop worrying about it and get on with looking after their members.


 
Abso-fucking-lutely. Activism isn't about feather-bedding the position of such people, it's about seeking (and hopefully finding) a better deal, and maybe a better *ideal*. The media and the political classes only matter insofar as we wish or want them to matter, otherwise they can get away to fuck.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> No you should have said 100m. It demonstrates that you're not within the culture that you're confidently talking - wrongly in a number of ways - on behalf of.


No it shows you're being a pedantic cunt.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> if he said it now, yes. Why bring that in at this stage? It's like him saying he's in favour of decapitating the Queen. Am I opposed on a philosophical level? No. Do I think it's a tactically savvy move. No.


Why bring it in?  Because, in an interview with questions set by members of the public, he was asked the question.  What, _specifically_ are you disagreeing with in his above answers?  Not in the DM version of them, not the tory headlines, but with what he actually said?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

belboid said:


> well, they could try being a principled and _effective_ opposition to the government with a plan for defending peoples living standards, but I guess that's more of a pipe dream than me winning the womens hammer


 
It's a pipe dream alright, and not from a tobacco pipe, either.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> if he said it now, yes. Why bring that in at this stage? It's like him saying he's in favour of decapitating the Queen. Am I opposed on a philosophical level? No. Do I think it's a tactically savvy move. No.


It's not like that in the slightest. So you'd support his calls for action during the olympics that were in support of anti-workfare actions (a move similar to calling decapitating the queen apparently) but not a call for action in support of his members, their pensions or the NHS. You are, as ever when real politics rears its head, all over the shop.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> a good amount of people who aren't remotely left wing and don't give a fuck about politics don't want the olympics. i like the olympics, and i hope they go well, but saying there should be no strikes ffs. how is that not playing into their hands?


I haven't said that.  I haven't said Len Mc should have said that.  I've said in answering like that *at this stage* he's let Cameron of the hook - he'd have been better to stick to skewering them on the Health Bill or Workfare, and left open the question of what might or might not be decided months hence.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

revol68 said:


> But but but.... won't somebody think of Miliband?!


 
I just did, while I was taking a shit.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I haven't said that. I haven't said Len Mc should have said that. I've said in answering like that *at this stage* he's let Cameron of the hook - he'd have been better to stick to skewering them on the Health Bill or Workfare, and left open the question of what might or might not be decided months hence.


well, if he does actually want a strike during the Olympics, he better start talking about it now or it will fall foul of balloting laws!


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> It's not like that in the slightest. So you'd support his calls for action during the olympics that were in support of anti-workfare actions (a move similar to calling decapitating the queen apparently) but not a call for action in support of his members, their pensions or the NHS. You are, as ever when real politics rears its head, all over the shop.


 No, I'd support him calling for civil disobedience around workfare right now. Why bring the fucking Olympics into it at this stage? - (I can see why Cameron and the bourgeois media would want to - but union leaders shouldn't get into that game until they're seriously trying to mobilise for that. It's empty self-defeating posturing.)


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I haven't said that. I haven't said Len Mc should have said that. I've said in answering like that *at this stage* he's let Cameron of the hook - he'd have been better to stick to skewering them on the Health Bill or Workfare, and left open the question of what might or might not be decided months hence.


 
Why? I asked you why earlier after you offered some fantasy about militants and soppies going their separate ways as a result of the SHOCKING tory reaction to a union leaders interview. No answer yet.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> No, I'd support him calling for civil disobedience around workfare right now. Why bring the fucking Olympics into it at that stage - I can see why Cameron and the bourgeois media would want to - but union leaders shouldn't get into that game until they're seriously trying to mobilise for that. It's empty self-defeating posturing,


He didn't - have you still not read the interview? belboid even posted up the relevant parts to make it easy for you. 

And of course there's posturing - posturing is a weapon btw - but that's not your grounds for disagreeing with him.


----------



## revol68 (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I haven't said that. I haven't said Len Mc should have said that. I've said in answering like that *at this stage* he's let Cameron of the hook - he'd have been better to stick to skewering them on the Health Bill or Workfare, and left open the question of what might or might not be decided months hence.


 
so your problem is that he directly answered a question put to him? 

you really have been hanging round with a bad crowd.

my problem is that I think it's posturing, that it's a hollow threat.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Why? I asked you why earlier after you offered some fantasy about militants and soppies going their separate ways as a result of the SHOCKING tory reaction to a union leaders interview. No answer yet.


 
That was me wasn't it? And I said it was just speculation, so yeah - a potentially negative scenario. I save my fantasies for lamp posts and Employment Ministers.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Why? I asked you why earlier after you offered some fantasy about militants and soppies going their separate ways as a result of the SHOCKING tory reaction to a union leaders interview. No answer yet.


 
Are you seriously telling me that there aren't any people who think the NHS should be saved but are actually quite looking forward to the Olympics and don't think the two things are, or ought to be, related to each other?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Balbi said:


> That was me wasn't it?


Nah, it was him. Only one person talks in such crude schematic terms.


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Nah, it was him. Only one person talks in such crude schematic terms.


 
I've been working on my crude scheming as well


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 29, 2012)

personally i prefer politicians, union leaders, etc to be honest, and if they're asked a question i prefer they answered it whether not that answer is what "people" want to hear.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Are you seriously telling me that there aren't any people who think the NHS should be saved but are actually quite looking forward to the Olympics and don't think the two things are, or ought to be, related to each other?


Er...no.


----------



## belboid (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Are you seriously telling me that there aren't any people who think the NHS should be saved but are actually quite looking forward to the Olympics and don't think the two things are, or ought to be, related to each other?




There are some people who think the NHS should be saved but that none of its workers should ever ever go on strike. There are some that think it can be saved by sending all the darkies home. So what?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

revol68 said:


> so your problem is that he directly answered a question put to him?


There are times and places to answer questions like this.  If some Nazi asked you whether you worked for the resistance you'd just have blurted out "yes!" because he asked a straight question?



> my problem is that I think it's posturing, that it's a hollow threat.


I agree with this as well - like Prentis talking about general strikes.   At least if he intended to deliver on this statement if wouldn't have been entirely in vain to have caused controversy at this stage.  But it's just talk, and silly talk from a tactical perspective.


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> There are times and places to answer questions like this. If some Nazi asked you whether you worked for the resistance you'd just have blurted out "yes!" because he asked a straight question?


 
how the hell is that remotely similar?


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

Godwin's. Thank you and goodnight.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> There are times and places to answer questions like this. If some Nazi asked you whether you worked for the resistance you'd just have blurted out "yes!" because he asked a straight question?
> 
> 
> I agree with this as well - like Prentis talking about general strikes. At least if he intended to deliver on this statement if wouldn't have been entirely in vain to have caused controversy at this stage. But it's just talk, and silly talk from a tactical perspective.


You ain't the one to be telling anyone about tactics in all honesty.


----------



## chilango (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> There are times and places to answer questions like this. If some Nazi asked you whether you worked for the resistance you'd just have blurted out "yes!" because he asked a straight question?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Q. Are you in the resistance?
A. I might be at a later date, if it opened up a broad front that returned a labour govt after you've destroyed everything . I do hope that if this interrogation gets out to wider audiences they appreciate that i didn't seek to alienate them by underestimating their anger and their capacities.

_Interrogator shoots self in face._


----------



## revol68 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Q. Are you in the resistance?
> A. I might be at a later date, if it opened up a broad front that returned a labour govt after you've destroyed everything . I do hope that if is this interrogation gets out to wider audiences they appreciate that i didn't seek to alienate them by underestimating their anger and their capacities.
> 
> _Interrogator shoots self in face._


 
I was thinking of how best to respond to articul8's idiocy, but you've pretty much nailed it.

Articul8, what is fucking wrong with you?


----------



## Balbi (Feb 29, 2012)

Articul8, he's not very.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Q. Are you in the resistance?
> A. I might be at a later date, if it opened up a broad front that returned a labour govt after you've destroyed everything . I do hope that if this interrogation gets out to wider audiences they appreciate that i didn't seek to alienate them by underestimating their anger and their capacities.
> 
> _Interrogator shoots self in face._


 
what is that drivel?  It bears no relation to what I've argued - which is that when giving interviews it's best to avoid giving answers that delight your opponents.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> how the hell is that remotely similar?


I didn't say it was similar.  I'm saying that the idea that people should always give direct answers to straight questions is blatantly flawed when it applies to any real world situation.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> what is that drivel? It bears no relation to what I've argued - which is that when giving interviews it's best to avoid giving answers that delight your opponents.


It's not drivel and it bears direct relation to what you've posted.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Er...no.


Well why divide the forces that are coalescing behind the anti-NHS reform campaign by making needlessly provactive comments?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I didn't say it was similar. I'm saying that the idea that people should always give direct answers to straight questions is blatantly flawed when it applies to any real world situation.


You made a comparison based on the dissimilarity of the two examples? You are an absolute idiot.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Well why divide the forces that are coalescing behind the anti-NHS reform campaign by making needlessly provactive comments?


Show me how they have, are doing so and will do so.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> It's not drivel and it bears direct relation to what you've posted.


 
How does it?  I'm not arguing that what McCluskey says should be guided by what is convenient for the Labour leadership.  I'm saying it should be guided by what helps to build the maximum effective unity of anti-cuts forces in the here-and-now, not making empty threats and dividing those forces by playing into the hands of reaction.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> You made a comparison based on the dissimilarity of the two examples? You are an absolute idiot.


It's a reductio ad absurdum of that particular line of thinking - not drawing a direct analogy.  Which you know perfectly well or ought to


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It's a reductio ad absurdum of that particular line of thinking - not drawing a direct analogy. Which you know perfectly well or ought to


No it wasn't. Where did you do 'a reductio ad absurdum'? You just said he was wrong. And you said he was wrong by direct analogy. What IS wrong with you?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> How does it? I'm not arguing that what McCluskey says should be guided by what is convenient for the Labour leadership. I'm saying it should be guided by what helps to build the maximum effective unity of anti-cuts forces in the here-and-now, not making empty threats and dividing those forces by playing into the hands of reaction.


Are you balls, you're basing your reaction on how it might effect the labour vote. And what guides the labour vote in people keeping their gobs shut, Like LM should have done.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Well why divide the forces that are coalescing behind the anti-NHS reform campaign by making needlessly provactive comments?


Who is being provoked?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Show me how they have, are doing so and will do so.


 
How about you tell me what this has done to advance the campaign against the Health and Social Care Bill?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Are you balls, you're basing your reaction on how it might effect the labour vote. And what guides the labour vote in people keeping their gobs shut, Like LM should have done.


 
Not keeping his gob shut.  Opening his gob at the right time with a message that builds effective unity.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> How about you tell me what this has done to advance the campaign against the Health and Social Care Bill?


Why on earth must i? Crappest response yet.What have your posts done to this end?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> No it wasn't. Where did you do 'a reductio ad absurdum'? You just said he was wrong. And you said he was wrong by direct analogy. What IS wrong with you?


My "member of the resistance answering a Nazi" was the reductio ad absurdum of your line that people should always answer a straight question


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> How about you tell me what this has done to advance the campaign against the Health and Social Care Bill?





articul8 said:


> Not keeping his gob shut. Opening his gob at the right time with a message that builds effective unity.


 

These are just empty words - he should do _good_ things and avoid _bad_ things. You bottleless cunt.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> My "member of the resistance answering a Nazi" was the reductio ad absurdum of your line that people should always answer a straight question


Wasn't my line and it only served to make you look asburd.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Why on earth must i? Crappest response yet.What have your posts done to this end?


You're defending him.  How is what he has said helping?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> These are just empty words - he should do _good_ things and avoid _bad_ things. You bottleless cunt.


 
What fucking bottle is involved in saying things that your tiny little clique of anarchoid mates agree with but achieves sweet fuck all in reality?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> You're defending him. How is what he has said helping?


I'm saying that a fearful craven response (ooh the tories might be against us) such as you suggest it not the way to go. What's he helped? Probably fuck all. What he's harmed - well, it's your argument that he has so lay it all out, the inevitable split between the militants and everyone else - how is this process playing out?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> What fucking bottle is involved in saying things that your tiny little clique of anarchoid mates agree with but achieves sweet fuck all in reality?


Very little, but then i'm not on about us. Now that you have real power to influence both LM and the labour leadership...oh...


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

I don't care simply that the Tories opposed.  I care that their arguments - the unions are wreckers, putting their narrow interests before the public good etc. etc. will get an echo from people who would otherwise by channeling their anger against the government right now. 

If people were just champing at the bit for a general strike as you seem to think, McCluskey should be doing a hell of a lot more than talking the talk in the Guardian.  But they're not.  And he's not.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Very little, but then i'm not on about us. Now that you have real power to influence both LM and the labour leadership...oh...


I think LM will be kicking himself - you've got to pick your battles.  This was a silly one to pick at this stage.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I don't care simply that the Tories opposed. I care that their arguments - the unions are wreckers, putting their narrow interests before the public good etc. etc. will get an echo from people who would otherwise by channeling their anger against the government right now.
> 
> If people were just champing at the bit for a general strike as you seem to think, McCluskey should be doing a hell of a lot more than talking the talk in the Guardian. But they're not. And he's not.


Who would otherwise what? You jump when they say jump. LM knows how the media works, you don't. Odd, given your job.

Is it worth treating the last para seriously?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Who would otherwise what? You jump when they say jump. LM knows how the media works, you don't. Odd, given your job.
> 
> Is it worth treating the last para seriously?


 
What has he achieved by this intervention?  What?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I think LM will be kicking himself - you've got to pick your battles. This was a silly one to pick at this stage.


 
From the tactical genius that brought you AV and in few weeks time ...DEFEND THE LORDS...yeah his nails are all bitten down tonight.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> What has he achieved by this intervention? What?


Nothing, you say he has actively damaged things - lay them out. Twice asking.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

I've never thought that there was a chance of getting Lords reform through.  AV was Clegg's fuck up - a) by slagging it off when Labour proposed it, b) by tying it to the constituency boundary changes and c) by refusing to let the YES campaign give serious resources to shifting Labour voters behind it.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

It was your fuck up. Own it.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Nothing, you say he has actively damaged things - lay them out. Twice asking.


At best it will have no effect - insofar as it has any effects they will be bad and divisive.  Because it puts the unions on the back foot, in a defence posture - when it should be Cameron.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> It was your fuck up. Own it.


No, it really wasn't.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> At best it will have no effect - insofar as it has any effects they will be bad and divisive. Because it puts the unions on the back foot, in a defence posture - when it should be Cameron.


Your argument is that it it's harmful. Tell us how. This is what, fifth time of asking? Outline this damage.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> No, it really wasn't.


Nah, you'll never own it. You'll replay it.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Your argument is that it it's harmful. Tell us how. This is what, fifth time of asking? Outline this damage.


 
I have, repeatedly.  It has allowed Cameron and the right wing press to deflect pressure by making the unions look unreasonable rather than a government defying the majority of health professionals and a large section of the general public.  It's not the end of the world.  But it's something that could;ve been avoided.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I have, repeatedly. It has allowed Cameron and the right wing press to deflect pressure by making the unions look unreasonable rather than a government defying the majority of health professionals and a large section of the general public. It's not the end of the world. But it's something that could;ve been avoided.


No you haven't. Rather than the Cameron and the right wing press getting behind the unions. If the the majority of health professionals and a large section of the general public are against he things LM is what on earth makes you think they'll go _OMG a tory who supports what we oppose called us unpatriotic?_


Tell us what the damage is. You just be able to offer something beyond it being sort of bad?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

It won't change their positions re the NHS reforms, of course not.  But it gives Cameron a superficially plausible line of attack rather than being manifestly on the back foot.  It hasn't achieved anything in LM's own terms.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It won't change their positions re the NHS reforms, of course not. But it gives Cameron a superficially plausible line of attack rather than being manifestly on the back foot. It hasn't achieved anything in LM's own terms.


Tell us the damage it's caused, the basis of your outrage.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It won't change their positions re the NHS reforms, of course not. But it gives Cameron a superficially plausible line of attack rather than being manifestly on the back foot. It hasn't achieved anything in LM's own terms.


Your whole fucking political world is now how tories spin labour. Well done.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

I'm not outraged.  On a personal level I don't have a problem with what he said.  But I don't think it is a productive public intervenion in any way.  It has allowed Cameron to deflect pressure.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Your whole fucking political world is now how tories spin labour. Well done.


it's really very little to do with Labour per se.  It's about Cameron being given a platform from which he superficially appears reasonable - when the whole thrust of the pro-NHS movement is to demonstrate he's being anything but.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

And this isn't me telling him to get his tanks of Ed M's lawn. I think EM has been lamentable in his silence on workfare. And the campaign on that has been totally illustrative of the positive role of extra-parliamentary action and civil disobedience.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> it's really very little to do with Labour per se. It's about Cameron being given a platform from which he superficially appears reasonable - when the whole thrust of the pro-NHS movement is to demonstrate he's being anything but.


A platform which otherwise he would and the papers would have been using to big up arthur scargill.

Still waiting on these damages. Presumably there's so many you're just totting them up.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> And this isn't me telling him to get his tanks of Ed M's lawn. I think EM has been lamentable in his silence on workfare. And the campaign on that has been totally illustrative of the positive role of extra-parliamentary action and civil disobedience.


yeah, as long as it doesn't say anything at all. Here's your program -  run a  fucking mile if you see a fight coming. Vote labour 2015.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

as for damage please see #1013, #1012 #1009 etc etc.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> yeah, as long as it doesn't say anything at all. Here's your program - run a fucking mile if you see a fight coming. Vote labour 2015.


if you think it's right to stand and fight whenever wherever you're not going to be a very good street-fighter.   Pick your battles and win them.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> if you think it's right to stand and fight whenever wherever you're not going to be a very good street-fighter. Pick your battles and win them.


Good advice off a winner.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

lesson learned.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> as for damage  see #1013, #1012 #1009 etc etc.


No, there are no examples of any  damage in any of these posts. They're examples of assertion of damage that will be done - no argument as to why - nothing. I invite you again to offer some arguments as to how and why this damages anything.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> lesson learned.


Yeah? Where?

And _what_ did you learn?


----------



## gunneradt (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Good advice off a winner.


 
ha ha from the ultimate loser - time to jump in the heroic car!!


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> I invite you again to offer some arguments as to how and why this damages anything.


 
It allows Cameron a convenient deflection mechanism that wouldn't otherwise have been open to him.  I've never argued it was the end of the universe.  But it was an avoidable mistake.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It allows Cameron a convenient deflection mechanism that wouldn't otherwise have been open to him. I've never argued it was the end of the universe. But it was an avoidable mistake.


How? Deflecting what? And yes you dud argue this was a sort of OMG this is horrible it might look bad on ed type hand-wringing. 

So, these damaging ways, can you name them?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It allows Cameron a convenient deflection mechanism that wouldn't otherwise have been open to him. I've never argued it was the end of the universe. But it was an avoidable mistake.


_Damn i needed this convenient deflection mechanism _


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

I didn't ever argue that it was wrong because he might embarrass Ed.  I said it was counterproductive in that it helped a PM who is widely seen as being unreasonable and ideology-driven in ramming through the Health Bill in turning the tables.  Never said this would be a decisive move.  But why hand your enemy anything at all when it's not needed?

You seem to be unable to appreciate that giving Cameron a media lifeline *is* damage, or at least potential damage.  Of course the media/Tories will always have a pop at the unions.  But you don't make it easy for them for no reason,.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> _Damn i needed this convenient deflection mechanism _


he did!  It was manna from heaven to Cameron


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> he did! It was manna from heaven to Cameron


Yeah, otherwise he was both stuck for things to big up and left supporting the unions.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Now, the damage done?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)




----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Nothing? Your whole argument against was on the damage that this would do and you cannot not only list the ways you can't come up with one. Not one. Except a roll eyes smiley.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

the damage: headlines that are targetting LM not Cameron - this was not inveitable - self-inflicted wound


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> the damage: headlines that are targetting LM not Cameron - this was not inveitable - self-inflicted wound


Oh no, the headlines that would say the same thing anyway. The media and tories might say what they say esp different today.

_Live the bubble. Become the bubble. _


So, any actual damage apart from sun-tzu tactical  expert media horror?


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

a) they wouldn't and b) the media helps to shape public opinion.  It isn''t insignificant.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Yes they would and b) if you think people make their minds up on such crucial issues through what the papers (who always take a 100% anti-union stance)  then you're a) an idiot and b) in the lap of these people, obsessed by the media forever. Not needed.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

If people are automatically pre-disposed towards taking a pro-union, pro-class militancy line we wouldn't live in the kind of society we do.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

No damage yet? Not even potential damage?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> If people are automatically pre-disposed towards taking a pro-union, pro-class militancy line we wouldn't live in the kind of society we do.


If people made up shit they'd make up better shit than this. Wouldn't they?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

Waiting on that list still...


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

The damage is there in terms of opportunities squandered to isolate and force Cameron onto the backfoot.  I hope very much that this will be the extent of the damage.  But either way, entirely avoidable.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> The damage is there in terms of opportunities squandered to isolate and force Cameron onto the backfoot. I hope very much that this will be the extent of the damage. But either way, entirely avoidable.


Enumerate the opps.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Enumerate the opps.


(/conrad)


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

Was Cameron on the news defending his Health Bill from the criticisms of RCGPs, BMA etc - no.  He was given a platform to bang on about union wreckers etc.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Was Cameron on the news defending his Health Bill from the criticisms of RCGPs, BMA etc - no. He was given a platform to bang on about union wreckers etc.


Oh no, not on THE NEWS - all is now lost.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Was Cameron on the news defending his Health Bill from the criticisms of RCGPs, BMA etc - no. He was given a platform to bang on about union wreckers etc.


You're the only one fool enough to go on that way. Where is this militant/soppy split?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> lesson learned.


 
If only that were really the case, but experience leads me to believe it isn't.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> If only that were really the case, but experience leads me to believe it isn't.


I did ask him, not a thing to make an echo.


----------



## articul8 (Feb 29, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Oh no, not on THE NEWS - all is now lost.


 
of course not.  But wouldn't it have been better if Cameron is getting a good hiding even in the bourgeois press/media instead of being let off the hook?


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

articul8 said:


> of course not. But wouldn't it have been better if Cameron is getting a good hiding even in the bourgeois press/media instead of being let off the hook?


Yeah, then we're really rolling. Talk about serious disruption in a global event vs the bourgeois press/media having a tickle at cameron. You are out of your fucking depth. Resign.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

You're a shambles.


----------



## redsquirrel (Feb 29, 2012)

I didn't think my opinion of A8 could get much lower but it has.

What a cowardly, liberal, wet prat.

The "what will the papers say line" is so fucking moronic that I just want to vomit over those idiots who bring it up.


----------



## butchersapron (Feb 29, 2012)

But if they said a bad thing you might think twice. Yeah.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

You think "serious disruption of a global event" follows from what one Gen Sec tells the Guardian?  You're off your bonce.  People like that give media interviews at least in part to influence the media agenda - insofar as he did that it was hamfisted.  This is all.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

The anarchoids on here couldn't cause serious disruption to a mothers union jumble sale.  Get a fucking grip.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

No one thinks that apart from you and the panicky milibands. That you shit yourself at even rhetorical supppput for a mere suggestion of it shows just how far your strings are being pulled. Can't do it, Mr Cameron might not like it.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:
			
		

> The anarchoids on here couldn't cause serious disruption to a mothers union jumble sale.  Get a fucking grip.



Look lens got you rattled. Maybe part of his lack if nous was in doing just this eh? The crude thing.

Anyway, bung another on line petition up. Show the anarchoids your power.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Yes, cos the last week shows that digital activism doesn't do shit, right?  Compared to getting your pom poms out for a tactically daft bit of grandstanding by a union boss.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Yes, cos the last week shows that digital activism doesn't do shit, right? Compared to getting your pom poms out for a tactically daft bit of grandstanding by a union boss.


Yes, you're claiming the on-line workfare outrage as one of your own. Fantastic. 

I'm still waiting for you to outline why lM's respones were tactically daft - beyond saying _well they were weren't they._

Make sure you run your reply by that Nice Mr Cameron and that charming Mr Clegg (you still have his number right?) before posting.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Yes, cos the last week shows that digital activism doesn't do shit, right? Compared to getting your pom poms out for a tactically daft bit of grandstanding by a union boss.


Amazing, AV vote which you were centrally involved in - _nothing to do with me guv_
Workfare  - which you were nothing to do with_ - that was me that one._


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Media interventions aim (amongst other things) to shape the media agenda - did it do this a) to the advantage or b) to the detriment of the causes it was meant to be promoting? 

Any other empy utterances from TU bureaucrats you're moistening your knickers about this week or is it just LM?


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Amazing, AV vote which you were centrally involved in - _nothing to do with me guv_
> Workfare - which you were nothing to do with_ - that was me that one._


 
I never said that - I said it showed how effective digital activism {I should have added - allied to offline campaigning and direct action] could be.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Media interventions aim (amongst other things) to shape the media agenda - did it do this a) to the advantage or b) to the detriment of the causes it was meant to be promoting?
> 
> Any other empy utterances from TU bureaucrats you're moistening your knickers about this week or is it just LM?


Media interventions  Only been there a few weeks and already spouting the jargon - pass the handbook on after you've done, i could do with a laugh.The media agenda is _all_ you see. You can't see anything else - hence shitting yourself over a few words. Ooh, what will dave say?

You mean the utterance i marked as being purely on the level of rhetoric in my my very first post? That i said repeatedly will not be followed up by action? Close reader ye.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I never said that - I said it showed how effective digital activism {I should have added - allied to offline campaigning and direct action] could be.


You didn't have to say it, the implication being that your power in on-line petitions mirrored the on-line anti-workfare stuff of the past week. You're a shambles.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I'm not sure it's the most effective intervention for him to have made this week - why not focus on the NHS bill or the Workfare issues, which could align the union's position with a potentially massive reservoir of public support. Talking about disrupting the olympics is just grandstanding(!), bound to be quite divisive and not really pressuring Cameron.


 


> shitting yourself


Hail to the close reader in chief.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Hail to the close reader in chief.


I think your panicky response does fit - what we call in the urban demotic -_ shitting yourself_. Whereas as me saying that LM remarks are purely rhetorical, will not be followed through on doesn't equal me saying the w/c are on the verge of a general strike or any of your other fantasies scattered throughout this thread.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Where's the panic in the post above?  I haven't said it was some outrageous betrayal or thundering catastrophe.  I've expressed doubt on the tactical wisdom of responding in the way he did. 

You seem to think that the population (bar me and my alleged bubble)  in general is entirely immune to the effects of bourgeois political discourse and the mainstream media.   In which case, why haven't we see mass pressure from below for a general strike?


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Where's the panic in the post above? I haven't said it was some outrageous betrayal or thundering catastrophe. I've expressed doubt on the tactical wisdom of responding in the way he did.
> 
> You seem to think that the population (bar me and my alleged bubble) in general is entirely immune to the effects of bourgeois political discourse and the mainstream media. In which case, why haven't we see mass pressure from below for a general strike?


The panic is spread liberally throughout the thread - not in the post where you try to sound non-panicky. For example, OMG LM is going to split the militants from the norms because Cameron says he's unpatriotic!!! Evidence and argument for this being the case - none. The story is now dead and you can sleep safer that this catastrophe didn't come to pass. So _wrong again Marge._

I think that your estimation of how much people are led by the media is wrong and a direct result of you living and working within a bubble that argues that the media are the start and end point of politics. It's why you're constantly wrong.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Where's the panic in the post above? I haven't said it was some outrageous betrayal or thundering catastrophe. I've expressed doubt on the tactical wisdom of responding in the way he did.
> 
> You seem to think that the population (bar me and my alleged bubble) in general is entirely immune to the effects of bourgeois political discourse and the mainstream media. In which case, why haven't we see mass pressure from below for a general strike?


Did you run this by a focus group first?


----------



## belboid (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> the damage: headlines that are targetting LM not Cameron - this was not inveitable - self-inflicted wound


right-wingers are targetting a leftie not a rightie!  Oh my god, no one could ever have seen that one coming!

Fer fucks sake, this is the most pathetic argument. Your responses are nonsensical, you want McLuskey to lie or roll over when asked directly about an issue - you might not say that plainly, but it is the only possible conclusion one can draw from your posts on here.
Or should he just have pretended he’d never heard of these ‘Olympics’ of which they spoke.  None of those are really options at all. An attempt to refuse to answer the question, as you proposed, would have been bounced back in just the same way, the only difference being various members and sympathizers would think he was being rather cowardly and dishonest in not saying what his/the unions thoughts were.
What his comments did achieve yesterday was to put a smile on a hell of a lot of people’s faces, people who aren’t fussed about the Olympics, or who do like it, but still want to protest!  It gives us opportunities to discuss exactly how we can most productively hold some kind of demo/protest around the games, and its always good to get these discussions going as soon as possible, or they’ll be shit.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

belboid said:


> What his comments did achieve yesterday was to put a smile on a hell of a lot of people’s faces,


 
The only happy faces I saw (other than what i assume were the happy faces of a tiny number in the anarchoid/ultra-left - an insulated bubble if ever there was one) were coalition MPs and their supporters in the media.  I'm not saying it has made Cameron more powerful - it hasn't (hence no panicking, and no prediction of a catastrophe).  What it did was to give him an easy come-back when he was in a tight spot - rather than him/Clegg/Lansley wrecking the NHS all we got was unions wrecking the olympics/country.  This was entirely predicatable and avoidabe.  The guy is paid enough - he should be able to handle the media better than this.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

"all we got" - you mean David Cameron said something (something entirely expected that he would say anyway) and _this is all you can see._ You really cannot see out of your little snow globe thing can you? Your politics is one where you're winning depending on how a hostile media treats the things you say . It's insulting.

I think you're right, these probably were the only faces you saw yesterday.


----------



## belboid (Mar 1, 2012)

well, my workmates aren't anarchoids or ultra-left, nor most of the people down the pub.  And I have met quite a few who have gone good on him.

Sounds like you're hanging out with too many right-wingers mate, your perspective's gone all cock-a-hoop


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

This is how articul8 thinks of other people -_ i can't support that (gobs on saloon bar floor) That Mr Cameron he said it was unpat-riotic. Better make it a half luv, or the dog will have me tea etc_


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

belboid said:


> well, my workmates aren't anarchoids or ultra-left, nor most of the people down the pub. And I have met quite a few who have gone good on him.
> 
> Sounds like you're hanging out with too many right-wingers mate, your perspective's gone all cock-a-hoop


 
Maybe it's a geography thing - in my part of London the Olympics is seen on balance as a good thing - it's creating jobs (construction, engineering) in an area of relatively high unemployment and basically people will look forward to it.   There are issues, certainly (VIP lanes etc).  But whereas it should be Cameron on the back foot explaning why he's wrecking the NHS, instead it's the unions. The sky hasn't fallen in but he just helped Cameron get out of a spot, when he should have been intensifying the pressure. 

Of course what happens in terms of the media agenda doesn't *determine* people's political outlook - but it does influence it. - so avoidable mistakes are best avoided.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> This is how articul8 thinks of other people -_ i can't support that (gobs on saloon bar floor) That Mr Cameron he said it was unpat-riotic. Better make it a half luv, or the dog will have me tea etc_


wtf? 

If people are burning with class militancy and totally contemptuous of conservative attachments I assume you are expecting to see a general strike followed by the overthrow of the monarchy rather than celebrations of the Golden Jubilee?


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> wtf?
> 
> If people are burning with class militancy and totally contemptuous of conservative attachments I assume you are expecting to see a general strike followed by the overthrow of the monarchy rather than celebrations of the Golden Jubilee?


Who - other than you, have suggested that 'people are burning with class militancy'? You tried this general strike stuff yesterday and it fell flat. Why are you trying it again? What is this nonsense? Your defence of your craven media-focused timidity is to suggest that everyone else is a mad militant who thinks that we're on the verge of revolution?


----------



## belboid (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> The sky hasn't fallen in but he just helped Cameron get out of a spot,


 
Cameron isn’t out of a spot tho. This has made no difference. If McLuskey had said nothing about the Olympics and just talked about the NHS, Cameron would have just completely ignored it, and would have kept talking about the SWP. The only thing this did, was make Miliband squirm a little.  But so he should.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Your defence of what LM said seems based on an idea that people are at least receptive to the idea of widespread direct action to disrupt the Olympics.  Where's your evidence for this?


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

belboid said:


> Cameron isn’t out of a spot tho. This has made no difference. If McLuskey had said nothing about the Olympics and just talked about the NHS, Cameron would have just completely ignored it, and would have kept talking about the SWP. The only thing this did, was make Miliband squirm a little. But so he should.


 
It hasn't made a major difference no (I never argued it would in and of itself).  It just helped Cameron yesterday to deflect attacks on their plans to wreck the NHS.  Cameron looks daft talking about Trotskyite wreckers.  But the union leadership are genuinely in a position to act - and people realise this - so the stakes are higher.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Maybe it's a geography thing - in my part of London the Olympics is seen on balance as a good thing - it's creating jobs (construction, engineering) in an area of relatively high unemployment and basically people will look forward to it. There are issues, certainly (VIP lanes etc). But whereas it should be Cameron on the back foot explaning why he's wrecking the NHS, instead it's the unions. The sky hasn't fallen in but he just helped Cameron get out of a spot, when he should have been intensifying the pressure.
> 
> Of course what happens in terms of the media agenda doesn't *determine* people's political outlook - but it does influence it. - so avoidable mistakes are best avoided.


Given what a mistake this was you'll have plenty of examples of why - beyond saying that a hostile media ran a hostile story. Let's have a look at what they are.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Your defence of what LM said seems based on an idea that people are at least receptive to the idea of widespread direct action to disrupt the Olympics. Where's your evidence for this?


It was based on the appreciation of the need to accelerate things and that even rhetorical tricks can help this - not that we're on the verge of a general strike you dolt.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

It was a tactical error - not a collossal mistake. Don't put words in my mouth.  It got Cameron off the hook temporarily.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> It was based on the appreciation of the need to accelerate things and that even rhetorical tricks can help this - not that we're on the verge of a general strike you dolt.


 
Yes accelerate, not retard - retard


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Yes accelerate, not retard - retard


So, you'll have examples of this happening. Beyond a hostile media saying hostile things right?

Rattled as fuck.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It was a tactical error - not a collossal mistake. Don't put words in my mouth. It got Cameron off the hook temporarily.


In the media. Which is your  world entire.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

it is to be hoped that this tactical error only results in handing the media initiative to Cameron temporarily. Insofar as it has any wider effects (and I hope it won't) it will begin to drive a wedge between sections of the anti-NHS reform and allied campaigns.

But you spoke of such rhetoric helping to "accelerate" developments. Where's _your_ evidence for that?


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

"it is to be hoped..." is this the sort of politician type answer you'd have liked LM to give?

I said that "even rhetorical tricks can help this " - do you disagree? You can't given that your whole remit is the sale of rhetorical tricks.

How has this rhetoric accelerated things? Probably by not very much as i repeatedly said yesterday. It has put anti-cuts action beyond _vote labour in 2015_ on the public agenda and made sure that the idea that the olympics are not sacrosanct. I don't see why this should be grounds for running around like a headless chicken going OMG the split between the militants and the norms this will inevitably bring with it (where? No it's just a minor thing rather than a movement splitting exercise apparently). Get some backbone.


----------



## belboid (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Your defence of what LM said seems based on an idea that people are at least receptive to the idea of widespread direct action to disrupt the Olympics. Where's your evidence for this?


 
I haven’t mentioned ‘widespread’ action, I don’t believe there is a mass cry for a general strike to halt the Olympics or anything like that at all.  But then I don’t believe that LM’s comments amount to any kind of call for action _against_ the Olympics. It’s a call for action _around_ the Olympics. That means anything from some guerilla marketing to get a message onto the TV, to maybe a protest that slightly delays a few people getting somewhere, or maybe everyone taking over the VIP lanes.  I think – from people I speak to – that there is interest in _some kind of _ protest, for using it to get other campaigns into the spotlight.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> it is to be hoped that this tactical error only results in handing the media initiative to Cameron temporarily. Insofar as it has any wider effects (and I hope it won't) it will begin to drive a wedge between sections of the anti-NHS reform and allied campaigns.


 
Will it? How?


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

belboid said:


> I haven’t mentioned ‘widespread’ action, I don’t believe there is a mass cry for a general strike to halt the Olympics or anything like that at all. But then I don’t believe that LM’s comments amount to any kind of call for action _against_ the Olympics. It’s a call for action _around_ the Olympics. That means anything from some guerilla marketing to get a message onto the TV, to maybe a protest that slightly delays a few people getting somewhere, or maybe everyone taking over the VIP lanes. I think – from people I speak to – that there is interest in _some kind of _ protest, for using it to get other campaigns into the spotlight.


 
To be honest re-reading the comments, the reference to "disrupting" the Olympics came from the Guardian journo - and LM didn't really differentiate between the kind of action your talking about above - which I think is absolutely fair game - from some kind of mass action to disrupt the games themselves (like anti-apartheid protests).   And then you'd have to question whether LM wasn't actually set up for that. 

I think it would be helpful in view of the associations that Cameron and others are putting about - that union thugs want to wreck "our" day in the sun - that he now outlines precisely what actions he thinks might be appropriate.  I think there could be widespread public support *if* the tactics are judiciously chosen.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

re-reading? You never bloody read them in the first place.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> To be honest re-reading the comments, the reference to "disrupting" the Olympics came from the Guardian journo - and LM didn't really differentiate between the kind of action your talking about above - which I think is absolutely fair game - from some kind of mass action to disrupt the games themselves (like anti-apartheid protests). And then you'd have to question whether LM wasn't actually set up for that.
> 
> I think it would be helpful in view of the associations that Cameron and others are putting about - that union thugs want to wreck "our" day in the sun - that he now outlines precisely what actions he thinks might be appropriate. I think there could be widespread public support *if* the tactics are judiciously chosen.


Don't you think your misreading of the original statement might stem from your "don't scare the horses/what will the papers say/won't somebody think of poor Ed" starting point?


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

It wasn't just a mis-reading on my part.  It appears LM was challenged as to whether the union planned to "disrupt the olympics" and basically responded in the affirmative without properly qualifying it.  

Union leaders need to be careful, insofar as it's possible without backing down in any way, to present themselves in a way that is appealing to a wider public.  Don't forget rates of union membership are massively down on where they were in the 70s.  But I didn't ever say that union leaders should trim their sails to what is convenient to the Labour leadership. I've *never* thought that.


----------



## frogwoman (Mar 1, 2012)

union membership may be down but it's increasing.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> re-reading? You never bloody read them in the first place.


yes i did - but his failure to qualify the notion of "disrupting the Olympics" - cast a long shadow over the whole piece, and what give Cameron et al a foot in the door.  This was a tactical mistake, but clearly not one that was planned in advance.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It wasn't just a mis-reading on my part. It appears LM was challenged as to whether the union planned to "disrupt the olympics" and basically responded in the affirmative without properly qualifying it.
> 
> Union leaders need to be careful, insofar as it's possible without backing down in any way, to present themselves in a way that is appealing to a wider public. Don't forget rates of union membership are massively down on where they were in the 70s. But I didn't ever say that union leaders should trim their sails to what is convenient to the Labour leadership. I've *never* thought that.


Balls.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> yes i did - but his failure to qualify the notion of "disrupting the Olympics" - cast a long shadow over the whole piece, and what give Cameron et al a foot in the door. This was a tactical mistake, but clearly not one that was planned in advance.


I don't think you did. Hence you now acting like you've just read it for the first time. You earlier posts were as they were precisely because all that you could see was the media response.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> union membership may be down but it's increasing.


It's not just down, it's massively down.  And given the public sector workers (where density is highest) are losing their jobs while low paid/casual private sector jobs are still overwhelmingly un-unionised means it's still a huge problem.  
Part of what the unions need to do (and they recognise it, if not always consistently) is a public education campaign about what unions do, why the exist, why you should join etc.


----------



## belboid (Mar 1, 2012)

Well, I'm glad you've reread them and come to a fairly sensible conclusion, but I did say all that to you 24 hours ago!


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> I don't think you did. Hence you now acting like you've just read it for the first time. You earlier posts were as they were precisely because all hat you could see was the media response.


I did read them earlier - but admittedly through the prism of how they were reported (which will also be how most people come to hear about them, read them etc. btw).  If LM lays out what he meant as per Belboid's post above he can turn a mistake into an advantage.


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 1, 2012)

How odd, articul8 was right to be wrong again!


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

belboid said:


> Well, I'm glad you've reread them and come to a fairly sensible conclusion, but I did say all that to you 24 hours ago!


OK, OK  The damage is less in what he said, than in how it was represented (though he really ought to have been clearer).


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Balls.


No, nor Miliband either.


----------



## chilango (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Union leaders need to be careful, insofar as it's possible without backing down in any way, to present themselves in a way that is appealing to a wider public.


 
No they don't.

Strikes aren't about public opinion they're about economic muscle.

It's nice (and can help with morale, and thus the solidity of the strike) if they have public support, but not crucial.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Media interventions aim (amongst other things) to shape the media agenda - did it do this a) to the advantage or b) to the detriment of the causes it was meant to be promoting?


 
We can say, with some certainty, that you are representing McCluskey's words as being detrimental.
We can also say, with a similar degree of certainty, that you've done sweet fuck all to substantiate that representation except metaphorically running around shrieking "oh noes".


----------



## ViolentPanda (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> The only happy faces I saw (other than what i assume were the happy faces of a tiny number in the anarchoid/ultra-left - an insulated bubble if ever there was one) were coalition MPs and their supporters in the media.


 
Is there the possibility, the remotest chance, that you saw this because that was where your gaze was focused, that you saw what you expected to see, where you expected to see it, and didn't bother to actually look anywhere else?


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

chilango said:


> No they don't.
> 
> Strikes aren't about public opinion they're about economic muscle.
> 
> It's nice (and can help with morale, and thus the solidity of the strike) if they have public support, but not crucial.


And that's why strikes - in and of themselves - don't amount to a political strategy.


----------



## chilango (Mar 1, 2012)

That very much depends on what you mean by political strategy, and what is the goal of said strategy in the first place.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

There's no such thing as an apolitical strike - but that doesn't mean that an aggregate of strikes is the alpha and omega of politics.  An element of mediation/representation is unavoidable - even if your goal is to avoid that you'll end up with those questions raised further down the line - and often in a more aggressive and atavistic form than if you took them seriously in the first place.


----------



## chilango (Mar 1, 2012)

Who's not taking mediation/representation seriously?


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> It wasn't just a mis-reading on my part. It appears LM was challenged as to whether the union planned to "disrupt the olympics" and basically responded in the affirmative without properly qualifying it.
> 
> Union leaders need to be careful, insofar as it's possible without backing down in any way, to present themselves in a way that is appealing to a wider public. Don't forget rates of union membership are massively down on where they were in the 70s. But I didn't ever say that union leaders should trim their sails to what is convenient to the Labour leadership. I've *never* thought that.


Nah, it's the typical mis-reading that comes from the idea that trade unionists and people in general are better off moderating themselves to appeal to a mythical "public opinion" which is essentially the Westminster echo chamber reframed as if it were a debate and not two sides of the same shit.

The ruling class and their media say he wants to personally shoot the olympic mascots in the head, therefore he must have said it and he should moderate his language.

Rates of union membership are directly linked to their level of aggression and militancy. People don't leave trade unions because the leadership says things they disagree with, their membership lapses or they don't join in the first place those trade unions that don't achieve anything for them. The only person this is embarrassing for is Ed Miliband, because the unions pay his wages and he'd rather they weren't.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> OK, OK  The damage is less in what he said, than in how it was represented (though he really ought to have been clearer).


Whatever a trade union leader says, unless it's about social partnership or any other collaborationist bollocks that has been the death of trade unionism over and over again, will be represented that way. The representation of trade unions within what is essentially a closed discourse is not going to significantly vary according to interviews the leaders give, ffs.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> There's no such thing as an apolitical strike - but that doesn't mean that an aggregate of strikes is the alpha and omega of politics.


 
No-one has claimed that it is.



> An element of mediation/representation is unavoidable - even if your goal is to avoid that you'll end up with those questions raised further down the line - and often in a more aggressive and atavistic form than if you took them seriously in the first place.


 
There's a difference - sometimes subtle, often not - between an element of mediation/representation "creeping in" due to individual bias or preference, and the ridiculous depths of mediation and representation some subjects are ...well, *subjected to* by the media and political classes. All *supposedly* to facilitate understanding, but generally blatantly to facilitate not information, but propaganda. *Your** interpretation, that *you* wish to spin, for professional and political reasons, against a normative interpretation or interpretations that don't serve *your* political purposes.

*By which I mean your ilk.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Mar 1, 2012)

chilango said:


> Who's not taking mediation/representation seriously?


 
Hey, we're not taking *his version* seriously.


----------



## Hocus Eye. (Mar 1, 2012)

Article8, I am shocked to read in an earlier post that you are not opposed to decapitating the Queen.

You New-Labour types go around pretending to be all patriotic and favouring the status quo, being against the criminal classes against strikes and supporting the Establishment, while on the other hand you would stand by and let the Queen be decapitated.

You will almost certainly be thrown out of your London club if your friends find out about your secret 'philosophical' terrorist sympathies.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Mar 1, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> Nah, it's the typical mis-reading that comes from the idea that trade unionists and people in general are better off moderating themselves to appeal to a mythical "public opinion" which is essentially the Westminster echo chamber reframed as if it were a debate and not two sides of the same shit.


 
Yup.



> The ruling class and their media say he wants to personally shoot the olympic mascots in the head, therefore he must have said it and he should moderate his language.


 
And, of course, a8's worry is that enough people will buy that representation to do harm to his cause, which doesn't exactly signal that he's got a handle on what Joe Average thinks and wants.



> Rates of union membership are directly linked to their level of aggression and militancy. People don't leave trade unions because the leadership says things they disagree with, their membership lapses or they don't join in the first place those trade unions that don't achieve anything for them.


 
That's pretty much the only reason I've heard from people when they leave a union.



> The only person this is embarrassing for is Ed Miliband, because the unions pay his wages and he'd rather they weren't.


 
Well, he'd rather that no-one knew that they do.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> Nah, it's the typical mis-reading that comes from the idea that trade unionists and people in general are better off moderating themselves to appeal to a mythical "public opinion" which is essentially the Westminster echo chamber reframed as if it were a debate and not two sides of the same shit.


 
I think trade unionists need to be aware of the fact that their motives, practices and goals genuinely aren't really familiar to a pretty wide section of society, including other workers - young people working in McDonalds don't automatically undrestand this, young mums, hell it's been so long since the heydey of trade unions that even people just qualifying as teachers know can't be assumed to just "get it".  

The idea that we can't do anything to shape the way the media represents unions is fatalist and self-defeating.  There are limits of course - Bob Crow is not going to be invited on the One Show every week for a spot of hero worship.  But we really do need to act as though every time we speak to a broad public audience we were talking to people who had never heard of unions before.  I don't mean to be remotely patronising about this.  The unions in general haven't made themselves relevant to people's lives for so long now there's no earthly reason why they should. 

The idea that everyone cuts through the media shit but judging it against their direct experience might be true of some people - but can't be taken for granted.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Hocus Eye. said:


> Article8, I am shocked to read in an earlier post that you are not opposed to decapitating the Queen.
> 
> You New-Labour types go around pretending to be all patriotic and favouring the status quo, being against the criminal classes against strikes and supporting the Establishment, while on the other hand you would stand by and let the Queen be decapitated.
> 
> You will almost certainly be thrown out of your London club if your friends find out about your secret 'philosophical' terrorist sympathies.


 
My "London club"  Only club I ever go near is St Jo's social club, normally home to Irish building workers and Celtic fans - I doubt they'd have much of a problem with it.  I am not and have never been a "New Labour" type btw


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I think trade unionists need to be aware of the fact that their motives, practices and goals genuinely aren't really familiar to a pretty wide section of society, including other workers - young people working in McDonalds don't automatically undrestand this, young mums, hell it's been so long since the heydey of trade unions that even people just qualifying as teachers know can't be assumed to just "get it".
> 
> The idea that we can't do anything to shape the way the media represents unions is fatalist and self-defeating. There are limits of course - Bob Crow is not going to be invited on the One Show every week for a spot of hero worship. But we really do need to act as though every time we speak to a broad public audience we were talking to people who had never heard of unions before. I don't mean to be remotely patronising about this. The unions in general haven't made themselves relevant to people's lives for so long now there's no earthly reason why they should.
> 
> The idea that everyone cuts through the media shit but judging it against their direct experience might be true of some people - but can't be taken for granted.


You're spectacularly missing the point. It's not that everyone can cut through the media shit, it's that the discourse is rigged, it IS something we cannot shape. For my entire adult life, there have been two competing visions of trade unionism (a) obstructionist anachronisms (b) glorified insurance salesmen - that's it, there is never going to be a mass media appreciation of militant trade unionism.

And yet! And yet! That framed narrative is something you can disrupt. It's something you can disrupt with actions and statements which make that discourse debate things it doesn't want to debate. You don't disrupt it staying within their margins, but by showing people that their margins don't really exist.

Funny you should mention Bob Crow, as his union has no trouble recruiting or standing up for their members at all. This despite the fact that he gets more negative press than any other union leaders. That's because the negative press is virtually irrelevant to getting and retaining members, virtually irrelevant to their levels of activity. What gets people into trade unions is fighting and winning, and what gets people to change their ideas about trade unionism is being in trade unions, fighting and winning. Simple.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Re Crow - to an extent.  But look beyond the immediate industrial agenda of wage bargaining etc. and how's he been able to influence the privatisation of the railway, PPP on the tube - hell McNulty shows they are coming after all the rail unions in a big way.  Industrial muscle doesn't equate to political success - but's it not a zero-sum game either. 

(Some bollocks about this great movement of ours flying with both wings....)


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 1, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Re Crow - to an extent. But look beyond the immediate industrial agenda of wage bargaining etc. and how's he been able to influence the privatisation of the railway, PPP on the tube - hell McNulty shows they are coming after all the rail unions in a big way. Industrial muscle doesn't equate to political success - but's it not a zero-sum game either.
> 
> (Some bollocks about this great movement of ours flying with both wings....)


 
In what hypothetical situation would Crow have been able to prevent PPP and rail privatisation (which incidentally happened before he was elected General Secretary)?


----------



## Nigel (Mar 1, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> article about youth workers strike here: http://oxfordaylesburysp.wordpress.com/2011/09/13/report-on-youth-workers-strike-in-oxfordshire/


Excellent and humorous article.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 1, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> In what hypothetical situation would Crow have been able to prevent PPP and rail privatisation (which incidentally happened before he was elected General Secretary)?


What I'm saying is that being an effective wage bargaining unit for his members is one thing - being able to deliver on broader political questions doesn't follow from it.


----------



## redsquirrel (Mar 2, 2012)

chilango said:


> That very much depends on what you mean by political strategy, and what is the goal of said strategy in the first place.


In A8's case to get Labour back into No. 10.

It's amazing how he doesn't get this



			
				Lo Siento said:
			
		

> Funny you should mention Bob Crow, as his union has no trouble recruiting or standing up for their members at all. This despite the fact that he gets more negative press than any other union leaders. That's because the negative press is virtually irrelevant to getting and retaining members, virtually irrelevant to their levels of activity. What gets people into trade unions is fighting and winning, and what gets people to change their ideas about trade unionism is being in trade unions, fighting and winning. Simple.


The above should be obvious to anybody involved in unions. He's gone so far up Labours arse that he really can't see anything outside his own little clique.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 2, 2012)

How about answering my points a #1121 - even Crow himself recognises this, hence the involvement with TUSC - but that's manifestly inadequate...


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 2, 2012)

articul8 said:


> What I'm saying is that being an effective wage bargaining unit for his members is one thing - being able to deliver on broader political questions doesn't follow from it.





articul8 said:


> How about answering my points a #1121 - even Crow himself recognises this, hence the involvement with TUSC - but that's manifestly inadequate...


You're not asking the right questions though articul8. No one is saying that aggressive collective bargaining is, in itself, a panacea for all our ills and guaranteed to destroy neoliberal hegemony. 

The question is whether the kind of moderation you're asking for will achieve anything, either for the union, or its wider political aims, and you've made no convincing argument that it would.  

(and say what you like about aggressive collective bargaining, but it's a hell of a lot better to have it than not)


----------



## Santino (Mar 2, 2012)

Went past a picket line this morning on the bus but I couldn't see who it was. Looked like some sort of construction/electrician sort of thing. Who's striking today?


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 2, 2012)

In Tottenham by any chance?


----------



## Santino (Mar 2, 2012)

Ealing


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 2, 2012)

Ah, not what i was thinking of then (attempt to stop IDS talking at a workfare meeting). Parking attendants on strike in Ealing...


----------



## articul8 (Mar 2, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> You're not asking the right questions though articul8. No one is saying that aggressive collective bargaining is, in itself, a panacea for all our ills and guaranteed to destroy neoliberal hegemony.
> 
> The question is whether the kind of moderation you're asking for will achieve anything, either for the union, or its wider political aims, and you've made no convincing argument that it would.
> 
> (and say what you like about aggressive collective bargaining, but it's a hell of a lot better to have it than not)


 
I'm not arguing for moderation of political demands - I'm arguing for a bit more tactical nous and understanding of the importance of presentating the unions' case in its most apparently reasonable and irrefutable terms - Serwotka is really good at this without being anyone's pushover.

What's more impressive to my mind is less the kind of wage settlement Crow gets for tube drivers (though good luck to them), but the RMTs successes in getting victories for previously unionised low paid workers like outsourced cleaners.


----------



## chilango (Mar 2, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Ah, not what i was thinking of then (attempt to stop IDS talking at a workfare meeting). Parking attendants on strike in Ealing...


 
Is there any simple online list of strike actions etc. (a little bit like what Collective Action Notes, _Echanges et Mouvement_ etc.used to print)?

It'd be good to see a list, with minimum of clutter.


----------



## chilango (Mar 2, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I'm not arguing for moderation of political demands - I'm arguing for a bit more tactical nous and understanding of the importance of presentating the unions' case in its most apparently reasonable and irrefutable terms - Serwotka is really good at this without being anyone's pushover.
> 
> What's more impressive to my mind is less the kind of wage settlement Crow gets for tube drivers (though good luck to them), but the RMTs successes in getting victories for previously unionised low paid workers like outsourced cleaners.


 
Why would anyone need to "present the union's case"? 

Who would you be presenting to?


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 2, 2012)

chilango said:


> Is there any simple online list of strike actions etc. (a little bit like what Collective Action Notes, _Echanges et Mouvement_ etc.used to print)?
> 
> It'd be good to see a list, with minimum of clutter.


Union news seems to be the best at the minute. I might have some news regarding at attempt to do a hard copy version of something along the lines of echanges quite soon...(also something along the lines of the old cienguegos press review as well)


----------



## chilango (Mar 2, 2012)

Cool. I've seen Union News before. It's not bad for what it is. But a timeline of action would be useful as well as news articles...

Look forward to hearing more about the the other project too...


----------



## articul8 (Mar 2, 2012)

chilango said:


> Why would anyone need to "present the union's case"?
> 
> Who would you be presenting to?


Both to the lay members beyond the activists (who did trade union members vote for at the last election?  What newspapers do they read?) and to the wider sections of the w/c beyond those who are involved with or related to union activists.  And yes to the media - to the extent that it's possible to cut across its ingrained ideological filter.


----------



## chilango (Mar 2, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Both to the lay members beyond the activists (who did trade union members vote for at the last election? What newspapers do they read?) and to the wider sections of the w/c beyond those who are involved with or related to union activists. And yes to the media - to the extent that it's possible to cut across its ingrained ideological filter.


 
Don't get me wrong, you're right that it is a good thing if this can be done, but these aims should not become concerns that dictate strategy.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 2, 2012)

I wasn't talking about strategy (it might well be the case that we ought to organise significant protests to coincide with the Olympics) as much as tactics for dealing with hostile interviewers.   What he was actually saying was much more reasonable than was represented - was this unavoidable?  Maybe - but I think in retrospect he might have been expressed himself a bit differently.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 2, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I'm not arguing for moderation of political demands - I'm arguing for a bit more tactical nous and understanding of the importance of presentating the unions' case in its most apparently reasonable and irrefutable terms - Serwotka is really good at this without being anyone's pushover.


 
That kind of "tactical nous" and "understanding" has served the unions really well over the last 3 decades 




> What's more impressive to my mind is less the kind of wage settlement Crow gets for tube drivers (though good luck to them), but the RMTs successes in getting victories for previously unionised low paid workers like outsourced cleaners.


 
The latter, of course, would be almost impossible if it weren't for the former.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 2, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> That kind of "tactical nous" and "understanding" has served the unions really well over the last 3 decades


 The unions have spent 30 years being as effective as Serwotka in getting the case across in public?  I don't know why you assume I'm asking them to be all soft and consensualist - I'm not.  I'm saying be more effective and pick your battles carefully.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 2, 2012)

articul8 said:


> The unions have spent 30 years being as effective as Serwotka in getting the case across in public? I don't know why you assume I'm asking them to be all soft and consensualist - I'm not. I'm saying be more effective and pick your battles carefully.


 
The unions have spent 30 years imagining that getting their case across well to the public is the most important role of a trade union.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 2, 2012)

Lo Siento. said:


> The unions have spent 30 years imagining that getting their case across well to the public is the most important role of a trade union.


why do you think that is?


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 2, 2012)

articul8 said:


> why do you think that is?


 Various reasons. I don't think anyone could conclude that it's worked well for them.


----------



## articul8 (Mar 2, 2012)

They've chosen to moderate their strategy though, and been shame-faced and embarrassed about themselved.  This isn't what I'm suggesting by any means - just a bit smarter at judging when and where to go in all guns blazing.


----------



## krink (Mar 5, 2012)

so what's this about another big strike this month?


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 9, 2012)

Mildly successful wildcat
http://solidaritymagazine.org/2012/03/spontaneous-walk-out-at-bridgwater-sorting-office/


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 14, 2012)

RMT confirms timetable for industrial action ballot on Tube Lines over pensions and staff travel



> Ballot papers will be sent out to RMT members at Tube Lines, including ex-Alstom Stratford Market depot staff, on the 20th March with the ballot closing on the 16th April. RMT is calling for a massive yes vote for industrial action to back the union’s demand for equal pension and travel-pass rights.
> 
> 
> Tube Lines staff are responsible for both maintenance and upgrade work on the Jubilee line, Northern line and Piccadilly line. They also provide a number of services across the network including the Emergency Response Unit (ERU), Distribution Services and Trans Plant.
> ...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 19, 2012)

PCS has announced that they won't be taking strike action on 28 March. Teaching unions are also not taking action I believe. A new date is being sought in April PCS statement 

http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...ex.cfm/id/40E319D9-6ECC-487F-87884F102B1551F2


----------



## nagapie (Mar 19, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> PCS has announced that they won't be taking strike action on 28 March. Teaching unions are also not taking action I believe. A new date is being sought in April PCS statement
> 
> http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...ex.cfm/id/40E319D9-6ECC-487F-87884F102B1551F2


 
My union has been texting me all week that the strike is on. NUT.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 19, 2012)

I think NUT are doing something in London?


----------



## nagapie (Mar 19, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> I think NUT are doing something in London?


 
Ah, that must be it. But that's worrying as members will be reluctant to join a strike in March and in April.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 19, 2012)

nagapie said:


> Ah, that must be it. But that's worrying as members will be reluctant to join a strike in March and in April.



Just checked - NUT and UCU are taking action on 28th in London only. PCS are not. Can't find anything about Unite. EIS teachers are in talks with Scottish Government.


----------



## krink (Mar 21, 2012)

anyone else heard if this march strike is definitely now off? i've managed to find absolutely nowt from unite.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 21, 2012)

krink said:


> anyone else heard if this march strike is definitely now off? i've managed to find absolutely nowt from unite.



Unite are re-balloting I think (not sure why). So far for 28 March it's UCU and NUT in London who are taking strike action. Unite are definitely not taking action. Neither are PCS, NIPSA or Scottish and Welsh teachers. Further discussions are due to take place about a date in April after the NUT conference.

I assume the view is that if their conference overturns their NEC that it could rebuild momentum.


----------



## krink (Mar 21, 2012)

ok cheers s&s


----------



## Spanky Longhorn (Mar 21, 2012)

Unite were never going to go on strike in March it was all about overtures to the PCS.


----------



## frogwoman (Mar 21, 2012)

Yeah what's happening with that? It all seemed like a bit of a fuck up


----------



## Riklet (Mar 21, 2012)

General strike in Spain on the 29th.

Was asked if I would be on strike today, and that we are "allowed to" heh.  I definitely will be, was a bit cautious about announcing it loudly before 'cos i'm quite new.  Whilst it's not completly clear cut or anything in regards to people working/scabbing, I do have the option to strike n i'd rather protest against the labour changes which will put millions in the shit (myself included) rather than business as usual (teaching the scabs at a factory).


----------



## dynamicbaddog (Mar 22, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> PCS has announced that they won't be taking strike action on 28 March. Teaching unions are also not taking action I believe. A new date is being sought in April PCS statement
> 
> http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...ex.cfm/id/40E319D9-6ECC-487F-87884F102B1551F2


What's all this about the Socialist Party bloc on the PCS NEC voting against action on the 28th?
-suprising given all their fighting talk about calling a 'public sector general strike'


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 22, 2012)

Another postie wildcat, this time in warrington.

(Oddly enough, by some odd quirk, i think i know the central person involved in both of them somehow).


----------



## frogwoman (Mar 22, 2012)

i think the argument for why pcs didn't vote for the strike was because the NUT pulled out and so there was a risk of a bad turnout - the NUT was originally going for national strike action but then they changed it so it was just in London. So the arguement was that PCS would have been isolated and have the risk of a poor turnout than otherwise. I think one of the problems is that the unions didn't call the strike earlier and whatever happened I think nobody publicised it enough - there should imo have been a strike in January to keep it going. I have to say I'm really not sure about this decision and if i have to be honest i will say it may well have been a mistake. We'll see though. To be honest I think the way all of these national strikes have been handled this year have been really bad. There should have been one far earlier and a lot more should have been done to publicise it.

We'll see though.


----------



## nagapie (Mar 22, 2012)

I'm not really sure about the decision for the NUT to go ahead only in London. Think it might not have enough momentum to look powerful. Only half the members at my school are striking, very down from the last strike.


----------



## dennisr (Mar 22, 2012)

dynamicbaddog said:


> What's all this about the Socialist Party bloc on the PCS NEC voting against action on the 28th?
> -suprising given all their fighting talk about calling a 'public sector general strike'


 
Its called not leaving yourselves isolated - the idea is to fight to win - not to march your troops up and down the hill again

This comment explains the situation quite astutely:
_"PCS did get a huge vote for action in the consultative ballot. But it was phrased as further joint strikes...but the other unions pulled out to a regional strike instead. So pcs were isolated. There had to be a rethink of tactics. It's a tough decision to make, pcs could have got it wrong, but in my opinion they have done the right thing...hold the line and wait for reinforcements Rather than charge forward alone"_


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 23, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> i think the argument for why pcs didn't vote for the strike was because the NUT pulled out and so there was a risk of a bad turnout - the NUT was originally going for national strike action but then they changed it so it was just in London. So the arguement was that PCS would have been isolated and have the risk of a poor turnout than otherwise. I think one of the problems is that the unions didn't call the strike earlier and whatever happened I think nobody publicised it enough - there should imo have been a strike in January to keep it going. I have to say I'm really not sure about this decision and if i have to be honest i will say it may well have been a mistake. We'll see though. To be honest I think the way all of these national strikes have been handled this year have been really bad. There should have been one far earlier and a lot more should have been done to publicise it.
> 
> We'll see though.



The recent PCS ballot result was the best the union has had so I'm not sure your line of argument is the same as the PCS NEC. The weekend after the ballot result the government leaked their plans to introduce regional pay in 3 government departments. A clear provocation and invitation to PCS to 'come and have a go' (particularly as the leaked proposal is premature and the pay body report isn't even due for another 3 months).

The problem though is this. The first strike in June involved PCS, NUT and others, the November  strike involved 29 unions and 
2.5 million workers. 28 March is London only action by NUT and UCU.

It looks and feels like de-escalation. 

One day strikes are essentially protests. And moving to sustained, rolling action - the type of action required - seems further away and not nearer.

The unions never got into the fight on job cuts, pension changes will be imposed next month and there is now the spectre of regional pay. 

The response and outcome of the dispute will determine the future of the trade unions in the public sector. Either a plan will be drawn up that is coherent and effective or the trade unions will end up as irrelevant in the public sector as they are in the private and service sector.


----------



## dennisr (Mar 23, 2012)

*Mark Serwotka update on the national campaign *


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 24, 2012)

Thanks for the updates folks. I've been precoccupied elsewhere of late, and PCS (where I am, locally) is not getting the news out at all  promptly, so there's definitely stuff I didn't know up there. Thanks.


----------



## nagapie (Mar 27, 2012)

We had a pretty poor response at my school to tomorrow's strike. After a really good turn out for the last strike, only half our members chose to be out tomorrow. However I noticed today that quite a few more had put their names down, encouraged by the weather apparently.


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Mar 27, 2012)

I'm in the UCU and publicity has been really poor about this strike and I wasn't balloted.

I am going out tomorrow but wish I was going out on a day when there was more strength behind the action  - my action is only going to affect a handful of students who are pleased to have the evening off anyway (well I'm pleased about that too I have to say)


----------



## butchersapron (Mar 29, 2012)

More heat:
Stansted baggage handlers vote for Easter strike



> The GMB members working for Swissport will lose an estimated £1,000 each due to shift changes and say they will strike unless the company reconsiders the proposed changes.
> 
> The outcome of the ballot has been notified to Swissport. GMB has asked the company to reconsider the proposed pay cuts. If the company refuses and there is no progress in the dispute strike action will take place over the Easter bank holiday weekend.


----------



## elbows (Mar 29, 2012)

My local news noticed that the police aren't happy and that in a survey 92% wanted full industrial rights.

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/ne...ire-demanding-right-to-strike-92746-30652263/


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 29, 2012)

elbows said:


> My local news noticed that the police aren't happy and that in a survey 92% wanted full industrial rights.
> 
> http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/ne...ire-demanding-right-to-strike-92746-30652263/


Fucking idiots... what did they think would happen when they helped break the trade union movement? That the pay and job security would stay any longer than absolutely necessary? And now they complain...


----------



## elbows (Mar 29, 2012)

Well I wonder what percentage of police from the key years of that struggle are still police now.


----------



## teqniq (Apr 10, 2012)

> A video message from a leading bus worker activist in Cairo to colleagues in London who are discussing strike action to win improved bonuses. April 2012


 


Alas the guy is speaking in Arabic but I admire the sentiment. Can anyone translate?


----------



## butchersapron (Apr 10, 2012)

NHS managers draw up plans to cope with first mass walkout by doctors




> National Health Service managers have been told to draw up contingency plans to deal with the threat of the first-ever strike by doctors in England, which could take place within two months.
> 
> 
> The British Medical Association is to ballot members over possible industrial action against the Government's proposed changes to doctors' pension entitlements next month.
> ...


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Apr 10, 2012)

Fill a jerry can with TCP.


----------



## teqniq (Apr 10, 2012)

E2A I keep forgetting that youtube has that 'cc' option. The vid has english subtitles.


----------



## frogwoman (Apr 13, 2012)

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/314216/Mini-strike-threat-over-hands-up-to-use-toilet


----------



## butchersapron (Apr 16, 2012)

Tube maintenance workers just voted to strike over pensions and other stuff.


----------



## dynamicbaddog (Apr 17, 2012)

PCS NEC has voted unanimously for strike action on 10 May


----------



## Fedayn (Apr 17, 2012)

From PCS website


> *National executive agrees plans for ongoing action*
> 
> *17 April 2012 *
> The union's national executive this afternoon unanimously agreed a programme of ongoing action, starting with national strikes over pensions co-ordinated with other unions on 10 May and at the end of June.
> ...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Apr 18, 2012)

Fedayn said:


> From PCS website


 
Another one day strike


----------



## mwgdrwg (Apr 18, 2012)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Another one day strike


 
The only thing the last strike achieved for me was Unison caving in and sending me government propoganda about how fair the CARE pension scheme is (cunts). The opposite of what I was hoping the strike achieved.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Apr 18, 2012)

mwgdrwg said:


> The only thing the last strike achieved for me was Unison caving in and sending me government propoganda about how fair the CARE pension scheme is (cunts). The opposite of what I was hoping the strike achieved.


 
The simple question I ask is if a 1 day strike every 4 months, with nothing in between, is putting pressure on the Government and is a tactic likely to win concessions.


----------



## Delroy Booth (Apr 18, 2012)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/tuc-leader-brendan-barber-to-retire-7657208.html

Brendan Barber to retire. That is all.


----------



## belboid (Apr 18, 2012)

considering his recent profile, I thought he had already


----------



## fractionMan (Apr 18, 2012)

Unite MOD/NHS also call strike on 10th may: 

http://www.unitetheunion.org/resources/pensions/protecting_pensions_for_our_pu.aspx


----------



## butchersapron (Apr 18, 2012)

BBC workers to ballot for Jubilee strike



> Workers at the BBC are to ballot for industrial action after management today imposed a 1% pay rise without consultation.
> 
> Bectu members will receive ballot papers early next week, with subsequent strike action likely to take place in late May / early June, possibly coinciding with the Golden Jubilee celebrations. UnionNews understands the NUJ and Unite are considering their response.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 18, 2012)

fractionMan said:


> Unite MOD/NHS also call strike on 10th may:
> 
> http://www.unitetheunion.org/resources/pensions/protecting_pensions_for_our_pu.aspx


 
PCS deciding to join in with the above on that date, also 

Thats my Union folks, one I'm pretty happy to be in right now, TBH.


----------



## redsquirrel (Apr 22, 2012)

Increasing their push for regional pay


> The cabinet minister is backing a plan for regional pay, which would mean that nurses, midwives, hospital porters, cleaners and paramedics would earn less if they work in the north or the Midlands rather than in the south of England. Official documents reveal that the only exemption backed by the Department of Health would be for highly paid managers working in new bodies established to deliver Lansley's controversial NHS reform programme, widely criticised as a privatisation of the health service.


Even on their own terms this seems lie an idiotic proposal to me. I would have thought that it would damage them in those seats that are needed to be won.


----------



## goldenecitrone (Apr 22, 2012)

redsquirrel said:


> Increasing their push for regional pay
> Even on their own terms this seems lie an idiotic proposal to me. I would have thought that it would damage them in those seats that are needed to be won.


 
You would have thought privatising the NHS might make them quite unpopular. Water off a duck's back to this lot.


----------



## teqniq (Apr 25, 2012)

> The UK subsidiary of Austrian multi-national packaging company Mayr-Melnhof, has victimised and illegally sacked over 140 workers at its factory in Liverpool. On February 18th, following lawful industrial action taken by Unite the Union over the imposition of unfair selection criteria and inferior pay for a limited number of redundancies, Mayr Melnhof Packaging Ltd, locked-out the entire workforce - the first employer lock-out in England for over fifty years....



Send a message of protest from the site below:

http://www.labourstart.org/cgi-bin/solidarityforever/show_campaign.cgi?c=1369


----------



## audiotech (Apr 25, 2012)

^ Done and shared.


----------



## Termite Man (Apr 25, 2012)

teqniq said:


> Send a message of protest from the site below:
> 
> http://www.labourstart.org/cgi-bin/solidarityforever/show_campaign.cgi?c=1369


 
they were protesting outside my work about this, I have to say I was the only person who understood what the protest was about and had to explain it to all the people I work with, maybe about 50% agreed with what they were saying


----------



## krink (May 1, 2012)

This May 10th strike - I've not heard anything so does this mean it's not council workers who are striking this time? Cheers.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (May 1, 2012)

krink said:


> This May 10th strike - I've not heard anything so does this mean it's not council workers who are striking this time? Cheers.


 
10 May unions out are PCS (civil servants), UCU (lecturers), Unite (NHS and Civil Service) and NIPSA (Irish public sector union). Also RMT in small numbers and NUT are taking action in a region - Wales I think.

Local Government workers are not on strike, but Unison members in the NHS did vote yesterday to reject the offer.


----------



## Plumdaff (May 1, 2012)

UNISON are claiming "no clear mandate" as 50.4% voted to reject on a 15% turnout. Just pleased leadership didn't get the acceptance of the measly "deal" they wanted.


----------



## krink (May 1, 2012)

thanks S&S
so sadly i have to go to work that day.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 1, 2012)

Definitely on strike in my case, come Thirsday 10th 

I'll lose a day's pay, but I'm actually happy to.

One good thing about the date being confirmed relatively late on, is that some of those who booked leave last time so as not lose money, have been caught out (there's only a limited quota of leave on each team).


----------



## weepiper (May 4, 2012)

The Scottish Secondary Teachers' Association are on a work to rule starting on the 14th of May.


----------



## butchersapron (May 7, 2012)

The first strike by dockers at Tilbury in 23 years.

http://union-news.co.uk/2012/05/dockers-strike-in-tilbury-for-first-time-in-23-years/


----------



## weepiper (May 28, 2012)

Some promising sabre-rattling from the teachers today
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-18233883


----------



## BigTom (May 30, 2012)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18254499

Doctors to take industrial action - emergency cover only - on 21st June, over pensions.


----------



## treelover (May 30, 2012)

They, the BMA,  have moved fast now the vote is in..


----------



## butchersapron (May 30, 2012)

BigTom said:


> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18254499
> 
> Doctors to take industrial action - emergency cover only - on 21st June, over pensions.


Big big move - pity it's about pensions alone but...we know...


----------



## Riklet (Jun 10, 2012)

The miners have been on strike in Asturias (Northern Spain) since the start of the month against the removal of subsidies for Spanish coal mining as part of the various austerity measures.  This will effectively shut the remaining mining industry and lead to big job losses in an already economically weakened area.

Other pics too. And more pics.


----------



## Blagsta (Jun 10, 2012)

Asturian miners have a long radical history iirc.


----------



## Captain Hurrah (Jun 11, 2012)

Great photo.


----------



## Riklet (Jun 13, 2012)

More from Asturias:

Spanish Miners' Solidarity Committee - launched by former UK miners and trades unions (.pdf statement in English)

News story about this in original Spanish and google translated into English.

Roads still blocked, all out, riot police with stun grenades and gas vs more of the guys with fireworks and metal tubes. News story (translated) with videos and stuff. Mental.


----------



## butchersapron (Jun 15, 2012)

RMT/OLYMPICS potential strike.



> RMT is preparingto ballot its members at the company for industrial action after the companyattempted to impose extra workloads, new rosters and a ban on leave despite apromise attached to last year’s pay agreement that the Olympics would mean “minimal”extra work.
> 
> The companyhas since admitted that at least 80,000 extra passengers a day are expected topass through Waterloo, has timetabled substantial extra services and laterrunning, has leased extra rolling stock, and has begun turning down requestsfor leave during the games.


----------



## nogojones (Jun 17, 2012)




----------



## butchersapron (Jun 17, 2012)

Related news:

Benefits for striking low-paid workers to be docked



> Low-paid workers will have their benefit payments stopped if they go on strike, the government has announced.
> Employees eligible for working tax credits because they earn under £13,000 will no longer receive extra cash if their salary falls because they take industrial action.
> 
> Bosses will be given a code to alert the authorities if a drop in wages has been caused as a result of a walkout when all welfare payments are brought under the new universal credit system next year


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jun 17, 2012)

Fucking wankers!!!


----------



## audiotech (Jun 17, 2012)

Just spotted that about low paid workers who go on strike on the BBC site:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-18476504


----------



## purenarcotic (Jun 17, 2012)

audiotech said:


> Just spotted that about low paid workers who go on strike on the BBC site:
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-18476504


 
It's sickening, utterly fucking sickening.


----------



## Captain Hurrah (Jun 17, 2012)

Indeed.


----------



## weepiper (Jun 17, 2012)

was just saying to Fed that this must mean IDS thinks there's a serious risk of some kind of long-term strike coming up, a miners' strike scenario, otherwise this would be pointless surely?


----------



## ddraig (Jun 17, 2012)

nah, just blatant toryism
think they'll have support against 'scroungers' and 'strikers' so why not stick the knife in wotwot!?


----------



## purenarcotic (Jun 17, 2012)

weepiper said:


> was just saying to Fed that this must mean IDS thinks there's a serious risk of some kind of long-term strike coming up, a miners' strike scenario, otherwise this would be pointless surely?


 
Aye, quite possibly.  Or they've got plans to relax certain working conditions which they'll claim will 'incentivise small business and promote growth'  and don't want any backlash as a consequence.


----------



## butchersapron (Jun 17, 2012)

I.e min wage


----------



## ddraig (Jun 17, 2012)

same old bullshit
can't squeeze profits with a "living wage"
just isn't realistic!

*Business groups warn Welsh government on 'living wage'*


> But business organisations warned Welsh ministers not to try to force them to raise wages, for example by inserting living wage clauses in government contracts.
> 
> Robert Lloyd Griffiths of the Institute of Directors said he was concerned the living wage would effectively become the new minimum wage.
> 
> ...


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-18461213


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 17, 2012)

weepiper said:


> was just saying to Fed that this must mean IDS thinks there's a serious risk of some kind of long-term strike coming up, a miners' strike scenario, otherwise this would be pointless surely?


 
Twin purpose - send a message to the party faithful to re-establish their anti-union credentials, and head off possible strike action. I'm sure Fed will correct me if my figure is wrong, but I'm fairly sure that more than half (it might have been as much as 70%) of DWP staff claim tax credits or Housing Benefit.
This may well be Iain Duncan Shit's way of putting a shot across the bows of the public sector unions. If so, I strongly suspect he's underestimated his opponents, but then he's never really shown much grasp of strategy.


----------



## purenarcotic (Jun 17, 2012)

Did I read correctly somewhere that Germany have more / stronger workers rights, and were growing economically more than the rest of Europe?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jun 17, 2012)

purenarcotic said:


> Did I read correctly somewhere that Germany have more / stronger workers rights, and were growing economically more than the rest of Europe?


 
Historically-better workers' rights since the immediate post-war era, fairly full implementation of the "works council" (*not* "workers' council"!) system whereby management and labour cooperate, much less "slippage" of rights during the current neolib era, but slow erosion *is* taking place, and wider social welfare rights have taken a pounding in the last decade or so, too, often carried out under cover of the need to save money post the big spunkfest of reunification in '91.
As for growth, the figures and charts speak for themselves. A shallower and narrower crisis than most other European countries, and part of it was/is to do with their national banking system being more disconnected from investments than in most other Eurozone countries, and business not relying on banks for business loans as much as on regional development bodies and on the _landesbanken_.


----------



## Grandma Death (Jun 17, 2012)

The branch of Unison where I was active (Kirklees) have gone back to the national executive for permission for a council wide ballot. In the last year there's been strikes in two areas against compulsory redundancies and the turn out and yes vote has been very high. If permission is granted it looks like Kirklees will be leading the fight back with what may well be the first all out in a local authority against redundancies?


----------



## smokedout (Jun 18, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> I.e min wage


 
but proposed legislation for UC appears to enshrine the minimum wage in law, until you spot all the references to underpaid workers - it seems to lay the groundwork for removal of the minimum wage but with conditionality for other benefits to be based on job seeking activity to find better paid work


----------



## butchersapron (Jun 19, 2012)

Five hundred food processing workers strike in Leicester



> Today 500 workers at RF Brookes factory in ​Leicester​took their third day of concerted strike action to oppose the unjust policies imposed on them by their profit hungry management.​


 
Getting news of potential wildcats on sites and oil refineries in sympathy with Coryton workers...


----------



## krink (Jun 19, 2012)

Prentis says he's going to kick arse over the no pay rise for three years thing in public sector. three years too late you cunt. fuck unison. worst union ever.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18500876


----------



## dennisr (Jun 19, 2012)

krink said:


> Prentis says he's going to kick arse over the no pay rise for three years thing in public sector. three years too late you cunt. fuck unison. worst union ever.
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18500876


 
ha - election coming up?


----------



## butchersapron (Jun 19, 2012)

Riklet said:


> More from Asturias:
> 
> Spanish Miners' Solidarity Committee - launched by former UK miners and trades unions (.pdf statement in English)
> 
> ...


Going to try and organise something around this in bristol ASAP.

What on earth have Graeme Atkinson and Mesazros (both searchlight) got to with miners though? That's 2/3 of the delegation sent out by this group.


----------



## Delroy Booth (Jun 19, 2012)

Grandma Death said:


> The branch of Unison where I was active (Kirklees) have gone back to the national executive for permission for a council wide ballot. In the last year there's been strikes in two areas against compulsory redundancies and the turn out and yes vote has been very high. If permission is granted it looks like Kirklees will be leading the fight back with what may well be the first all out in a local authority against redundancies?


 
The events in Kirklees at the moment are really quite significant, the Labour council are frightened by the strength of the recent strikes and have begun a victimisation campaign against trade union stewards in the region, which could provoke much wider and longer-lasting action.

From what I've seen on picket lines and at various meetings is the strike is very well supported and well organized, and that there's an undercurrent of sexism in what the council's doing which has angered many in Kirklees unison, for instance 90% of the kirklees council admin staff currently facing the axe are women, and the question of "why are the council trying to make savings in low paid, predominantly female, workplaces firs" is being asked a lot.


----------



## butchersapron (Jun 20, 2012)

In fact who are 'miners info'?


----------



## Grandma Death (Jun 20, 2012)

Delroy Booth said:


> The events in Kirklees at the moment are really quite significant, the Labour council are frightened by the strength of the recent strikes and have begun a victimisation campaign against trade union stewards in the region, which could provoke much wider and longer-lasting action.
> 
> From what I've seen on picket lines and at various meetings is the strike is very well supported and well organized, and that there's an undercurrent of sexism in what the council's doing which has angered many in Kirklees unison, for instance 90% of the kirklees council admin staff currently facing the axe are women, and the question of "why are the council trying to make savings in low paid, predominantly female, workplaces firs" is being asked a lot.


 
The arguments being put forward by the branch are very credible. It helps how well organised that branch of Unison is as well-best branch Ive ever been active in. Well organised stewards, high density of membership and a long track record of the members supporting strike action. I see Kirklees as potentially becoming the key battleground nationally in the fight against the cuts.


----------



## BigTom (Jun 20, 2012)

Unison members at University of Birmingham are striking tomorrow and friday over pay

https://www.unison.org.uk/cymruwales/news_view.asp?did=7856

The uni are offering £250 / 1.9% to some of the lowest paid staff members (77 out of 2,169) but at same time are removing weekend/evening shift allowances which they are claiming should never have been paid (but have been for 20 years or something), so many are facing actual pay cuts.. inflation is still over 3% so real terms pay cuts for everyone.

Two day strike voted for by around 66% of members which is a decent result, though I don't know what the turnout was.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Jun 20, 2012)

Labour coming out heavily against the doctors' strike, I see, after direct prompting from the government. Shocked, shocked I tell you etc etc.


----------



## purenarcotic (Jun 21, 2012)

I'm not surprised at Labour's position at all unfortunately, but solidarity to everybody on strike today.


----------



## butchersapron (Jun 25, 2012)

60 000 HMRC staff out today over plans to cut 10 000 workers in order to better allow wider and deeper tax avoidance and evasion.


----------



## butchersapron (Jun 28, 2012)

Doctors vote to strike again as pension row escalates



> Doctors have voted on Thursday to ramp up their pensions dispute with the government by conducting more industrial action that would reduce the NHS to a bank holiday-style service, where only emergency cases would be treated.


----------



## bignose1 (Jul 3, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Going to try and organise something around this in bristol ASAP.
> 
> What on earth have Graeme Atkinson and Mesazros (both searchlight) got to with miners though? That's 2/3 of the delegation sent out by this group.


You are obviously ill informed regards Graeme Atkinson and Paul Mesazros. You have no idea what your talking about. I wont embarrass you with any further explanation.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 3, 2012)

I obviously am then. Is this a different Atkinson? The latter was searchlight connected through HnH wasn't he?


----------



## bignose1 (Jul 3, 2012)

Sloppy. Your letting your anti searchlight dick get you into trouble again.


----------



## Fedayn (Jul 5, 2012)

Remploy workers vote overwhelmingly for strike action



> The majority for strike action was 79.5% of the vote in the GMB. The majority for action short of a strike was 87.3% in GMB. The figures for Unite are 59.7% in favour of strike action and 76.1% in favour of action short of a strike.


----------



## The Black Hand (Jul 9, 2012)

Good coverage of the Spanish Miners struggle on here; https://www.facebook.com/groups/103...am-Miners-Gala-July-14th-2012/178008108959169


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 9, 2012)

butchersapron said:
			
		

> RMT/OLYMPICS potential strike.



More info:

* RMT has a deal with London Underground which gives members a financial reward for Olympics working without changing any agreements. You can read this deal here: http://www.rmtlondoncalling.org.uk/node/3120 * Unfortunately, there have been problems with the implementation of this deal, so the union needs to ballot you for 'action short of strikes' in case you need protection against being force to do unacceptable duties. You will receive your ballot paper very soon and should return it by 19 July.


----------



## Delroy Booth (Jul 10, 2012)

Just been reading a lot of EP Thompson _The Making of the English Working Class_ recently coz I'm getting really into the history of the Luddites, and I thought I share a couple of anecdotal gems from the glory days of the British Trade Union movement, in the early 19th century when they were illegal secret societies, where the seditious oath on the pain of death administered by an anonymous man in a mask brandishing a loaded pistol was the order of the day.

On how you joined unions back when they were secret societies:

_"When a member is admitted there are two rooms, in one of which the Lodge is assembled. The first operation was to blindfold him; he was then conducted into the Lodge by two members; he was then required to give the pass word, which on that occasion was Alpha and Omega; he was then walked round the room, during which time a great rumbling noise was made by a sheet of iron - a hymn was then sung - and he still continued to walk about the room two or three times, and was asked if his motive was pure - they then took the bandage from his eyes, and the first thing he saw was a picture of death as large as a man, over which was the inscription "Remember Thy End". Over this picture there was a drawn sword - his eyes were then bandaged again, and he was walked about the room, when upon a signal being given, all the members made a great stamping noise with their feet - he was then ordered to kneel down beside a table, when he saw a lage bible before him, and his hand having been placed upon it.... the 94th psalm was then read, when the oath was administered which was to this effect; that he was to obey all the commands of the Union Committee, and to keep all secrets in every particular - the conclusion of the oath contained and imprecation, on which each person sworn is made to wish that if he violates the oath that his soul may be burnt in the lowest pit of hell to all eternity..."_

And this one how these unions dealt with scabs

_"Blacklegs or bad masters would know themselves to be watched; a brick might come through the window, or they might be attacked in a lane at night. In Gloucestershire blackeg weavers were carried astride the beam from their own looms and thrown into a pond. At times even more violent forms of intimidation were employed; there was a scatter of cases reported from Glasgow, Dublin, Manchester and Sheffield of actual or attempted assassinations, vitriol-throwing, or charges of gunpowder being thrown into workshops."_

So many lessons we can learn from our own history comrades.


----------



## BigTom (Jul 10, 2012)

Delroy Booth said:


> Just been reading a lot of EP Thompson _The Making of the English Working Class_ recently coz I'm getting really into the history of the Luddites, and I thought I share a couple of anecdotal gems from the glory days of the British Trade Union movement, in the early 19th century when they were illegal secret societies, where the seditious oath on the pain of death administered by an anonymous man in a mask brandishing a loaded pistol was the order of the day.
> 
> On how you joined unions back when they were secret societies:
> 
> ...


 
PD needs to lift that as our induction session directly for sure.


----------



## Delroy Booth (Jul 10, 2012)

BigTom said:


> PD needs to lift that as our induction session directly for sure.


 
yeah definitely, and all the meetings should be held at midnight on moors by torchlight.

One of the unions used to have a ritual where they made you swear an oath beneath a pistol, and once you had completed the oath the pistol would be fired and the gunpowder would fall onto the person's face, thus scorching the skin and leaving a scar so that everyone in the village would know you're in the union.

But yes, in all seriousness, I am well into all this pseudo-masonic rituals. I still begrudgingly admire the SPGB for having a test on Marxism before they let people join them, I mean after all you wouldn't want to let the riff-raff in, right?


----------



## The Black Hand (Jul 11, 2012)

Massive Miners Support in Madrid 

Well over 150,000 people in Madrid saluted the striking miners “black march” that triumphantly entered the city on Tuesday night after marching halfway across Spain.

The miners marched with headlamps on their helmets lighting their way and were met by the masses with enthusiasm and support.

Chants of “Long live the struggle of the working class!” and other chants/songs and flags of socialists, Anarchists, communists and Marxists dominated the city. Many supporters had travelled across Spain to greet them as the Miners have captured the imagination of wide layers of Spanish youth, unemployed & workers who came out tuesday and will do today for a massive demonstration of working class solidarity.

Despite the huge crowds, no major TV station saw fit to turn up and witness the arrival of the miners. But an even bigger solidarity protest is expected in Madrid today, Wednesday 11th July.

Spanish miners are fighting against the decision of the right wing government to cut subsidies to coal mining by 63% this year. This means the destruction of 8,000 direct jobs and a further 20 or 30,000 indirect jobs which depend on them. For a month and a half miners have marched, organised a general strike of the mining valleys, set up barricades blocking highways and railway lines, clashed with the police and suffered brutal repression by the anti-riot units of the Civil Guards (the hated military style police force). 

Miners defended their collieries against attacks from the police with occupation and retailiation, and in their clashes with the anti-riot unit of the Civil Guards (the GSR), the miners have had to develop methods of struggle and create their own weaponry. To protest and block the system groups of miners come down from the hills, quickly build barricades on main roads, set them on fire and retreat back into the woods, from where they wait for the Civil Guards to turn up and then throw flares and pyrotechnic rockets at them with home made rocket launchers. They also occupy and block major roads and motorway with similar tactics. The resistance reminds me of other resistance in the Welsh Mining valleys and elsewhere throughout history.

The striking miners have been marching from their communities since the end of June and everywhere they have stopped they were cheered by crowds of people.

As they neared Madrid the rallies to meet them grew into thousands. Everybody understands how the miners’ struggle against the removal of industry subsidies was “everybody’s struggle”, one moment of the capitalist offensive which must be resisted, and we must support all struggles. 

As the government continues to support the banks at the expense of the people and is continuing to attack the miners and their communities, it has sent riot police to terrorise mining villages. So lets support the Miners resistance and defence of their communities.

The miners’ struggle comes after the anger shown in Spain’s city squares last year, the Occupy movement and a general strike. Their militant defiance is reigniting the worlds working and unemployed classes determination to fight austerity, lets build the fires of discontent. And we look forward to hearing the Spanish Miners at the Durham Miners Gala this saturday too.


----------



## The Black Hand (Jul 11, 2012)

Several videos on You TUbe covering the Black March arrival in madrid, here's one;


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 11, 2012)

Just got this off a fb friend:

*CLEANERS AT JOHN LEWIS ARE STRIKING TO END POVERTY PAY AND STOP JOB CUTS.

Urgent Appeal for Solidarity

Fellow workers,

On Friday 13th July, the first strike in the history of the John Lewis Partnership will take place at the Oxford Street store - the cleaners who are members of the independent union Industrial Workers of the World will begin a campaign of strike action.

The cleaners consider they are treated as second-class citizens by John Lewis who excludes the cleaners from their Partnership and shares in same pay and benefits of other workers at John Lewis. Instead cleaners are hired through a contractor – ICM part of the Compass Group. 

They earn a mere £6.08 per-hour, some work excessive shifts such as from 6:00 am – 9:00 pm, and some must be available for hours they are not even paid for. The company now want to make cuts in nearly a third of the staff, but expect the cleaners to continue with the same workload.

Cleaners at John Lewis have had a enough. They voted by 90% in their ballot to strike and are demanding the London Living Wage of £8.30 per-hour and no cuts in jobs or hours. They say John Lewis must stop washing its hands of the cleaners. Other companies have ensured their contractors pay the Living Wage it is time John Lewis ensured justice for its cleaner.

Compass Group say they cannot afford the Living wage. Yet their pre-tax profits rose to £581 million – they offered the cleaners 24-pence pay rise! The Compass chairman Sir Roy Gardner is paid £477,000 a year, he donated £50,000 to David Cameron’s election campaign - the same Cameron who said ‘the living wage is an idea whose time has come’. 

The cleaners are striking from 6:00 am on Friday 13th and will hold a lunchtime demonstration at 1:00-2:00 pm, John Lewis Oxford Street. 

The cleaners at call on all sections of the labour movement to show solidarity with them and send delegations to the picket line and to the demonstration on Friday.

AN INJURY TO ONE IS AN INJURY TO ALL!

CHRIS FORD

Regional Secretary

Industrial Workers of the World*


----------



## The Black Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

latest UK article on Spain and Miners

The Durham Miners Gala (July 14th) this year promises to be the largest for decades. Already 100K strong recently, the addition of the Labour leader Ed Miliband is likely to tip the numbers higher still if the weather permits. The bands, speeches, marches, banner, Gala field, funfair etc all allow for a great family day out where old and new comrades meet and greet. A delegation of Spanish Mineworkers will be warmly received by the Durham Miners Association.

*Colossal Support for the Spanish Miners - the symbolic head of the working class* 

THE EVENT ON JULY 11th STARTED WITH A LONG OVATION. This demonstration in Madrid by the UGT and CCOO in defence of the mining sector was a peaceful ramble around 11.00 am in the Plaza de Colón with the slogans "Yes to the revival of the mining regions' and 'No ...to the closure of coal mining". At the beginning of the march, protesters gave a standing ovation in support of hundreds of miners who arrived on foot from the coalfields and positioned behind the head of the march. From 10am, thousands of people arriving on buses have been gathering around the Plaza de Colón where they launched fireworks and expressed support for the miners. 

Riot police caused violent clashes against the miners, who were on their way to protest outside the headquarters of the Ministry of Industry. At least 76 people have been injured in Madrid, mainly miners and their supporters, as clashes flared up between protesters and police, the latter using rubber bullets. Over one hundred thousand Spaniards turned out against new cuts introduced by the government. The prime minister chose to announce his decision to raise VAT by 3 per cent as part of the plan to trim the public budget by 65 billion euro over the next two-and-a-half years. Rajoy also declared a 3.5-billion-euro cut to local government spending. This seemed designed to provoke anger and bury the news by discreding opponents in coordinated media smears occasioned by the Miners protest. 

Miners and their supporters around the world are looking at events in Spain - the whole world is watching. 

Several arrests have been made so far, with eight people being detained. Three of those arrested reportedly threw bricks at police, local El Pais newspaper reported, but whether you believe that is another matter as that is a capitalist paper. The police have confirmed that there were no miners among the arrested, but there are among the injured. 

Protesters panicked and sought shelter as police began to disperse the crowd, Olvidio Gonzalez, 67, a retired miner from the northern Asturias region said; 

“We were walking peacefully to get to where the union leaders were speaking and they started to fire indiscriminately,” said Gonzalez, who was also struck by a rubber bullet. 
Witnesses and demonstrators claim that police started the attack without any warning. Later "We were eating quietly when they began to appear with several police vans. Then we started to shout and some threw a few bottles, which gave rise to the charge," Hermann, a miner from the small town of Langreo in northern Spain, said. 

In their speeches, the mining unions have sought to show appreciation to the citizens of Madrid of the social support received during the last few days, and especially for the reception in the evening on Tuesday. Thus, the general secretary of CCOO, Ignacio Fernández Toxo, and the UGT, Colin Campbell, have accused the government of provoking the conflict with coal miners and demanded the government to "rectify" its policy towards the sector mining and to the 63 percent cuts in aid to coal in 2012. Campbell has accused the prime minister, Mariano Rajoy, as "irresponsible" because cuts involve "laying off thousands of people." Protesters disagree with a 63 per cent cut in subsidies to coal mining companies, major contributors to the Spanish energy market. Unions say the plan threatens 30,000 jobs and will destroy their livelihoods. 

Miners, who were hiking from the north of the country for the past two weeks, have been joined by tens of thousands of Spaniards also protesting against Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy’s tax hike. Many protesters marched more than 400 kilometers (250 miles) from mines in northern Spain. As protesters call for more demonstrations to make their voices heard journalist and writer Miguel-Anxo Murado said that the government seems to playdown the protests. 

“They think they can cope with these protests partly because mining regions are localized in certain areas of the country. These are small areas. So they think that this will not affect the rest of the country. The truth is that the miners are getting a lot of solidarity because many people relate to them and see their problems as their own problems” . 

The UGT and CCOO unions are determined to continue with the protests against cuts in support of the miners. Iin the event that the Government agrees to negotiate or offer a solution to the sector, announced the representatives of the federations of industry of both Unions, before the start of the event on Wednesday in downtown Madrid; "If the government wants to end the conflict, you can do quickly. We are willing to talk. If not, follow the demonstrations," said the media to the general secretary of the Federation of Industry CC.OO . Felipe Lopez, before the start of the event. Lopez has expressed "satisfaction" of unions with public support for its night held last night by the miners in the center of Madrid.

to be continued next post...


----------



## The Black Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

And they are right. The miners are right in their struggle, and I will expand now on why they are right. They have it for all the reasons that you have heard and read recently, but even if they had these reasons, they continue to have reason on their side, it is an elementary question of historical justice. It is owed to them and the generations of miners that preceeded them, and that is enough for us to be obliged to respect their way of life and its territories, and the state should provide money, which is small change compared with the bank bailouts. 

But again, what interests me today is not so much their own struggle (to support it), but the lessons of dignity, solidarity and resistance that we give to other workers. 

We have all been awakened recently by the struggle of these miners in two ways: for in their claim for a future worth living, for all those who also lack this future, and because the strength of their struggle is more evident than the collective poor response to the attacks of the business capitalist classes and their governments from and upon the rest of us. Regarding the former, the miners fight is extended to all of us, all the job cuts, the pension cuts, the welfare cuts, the NHS cuts and so on. 
In the miners we see our past, our class consciousness at some point lost, taken from us, or never encouraged and therefore the possibilities of collective struggle that we find today are conditioned by this. But mostly, we see in them our future in their cry for not being abandoned, they want to survive, not to see their towns and villages devastated by unemployment and inactivity. They taught us that when we fight we might lose, but without fight we have lost. We overlook a glimpse of a future that awaits all of us, all workers and unemployed abandoned to their fate, doomed to a long period of shortages, misery, at the mercy of a wind that leaves nothing standing, with millions of jobs in extinction, and all of Spain & Europe turned into a major mining region threatened by the desolation and lack of output. Regarding the latter, the classic hard working miners, who respond to violence with violence, requires us to find another word for what we do, that we sometimes deluded ourselves and our efforts by thinking of them as exemplary resistance. However, when we 'set fire' on social networks, real miners set fire to the barricades on the highways. While we convened a strike every 5 years, without much conviction and above all without continuity, the miners elected for the indefinite strike for weeks, it is solid class struggle. 

As we write posts and tweets of complaint against cuts (me first), they are enclosed in virtual spaces, but paralysing traffic clogs up entire regions, and finally we may start to walk down the one road of class struggle together. While we painted banners and compose witty couplets of sympathy to shout in protest, they go face to face & toe to toe with the Civil Guard. While we tweet and give thousands of "likes" to support the claims of the groups hardest hit, they go from village to village giving and receiving hugs, sharing food and shelter. 

While we wait for the next anniversary date to retake the streets, they are planted in the Puerta del Sol after having taken over the streets of all the towns through which they passed. The lesson is clear: before these attacks against the workers there were imaginary liberal & radical utopias, but these are not times of hashtag, but the burning barricades and bazookas. Before the ephemeral solidarity of the social network and harmless indignation, but now is a time to come together, to share spaces & place, being in the streets, hugging as we hugged, embraced these days of hope as the miners do with whom we were waiting for at the entrance of each village. Therefore, the government cannot allow the miners to win this struggle, this pulse of dynamic working class struggle, because if it is successful, it will be setting a 'bad example for other workers'. 

We might! Take note, learn the lessons, follow suit, struggle to be heard, not to be trampled on, not continue to lose: but to fight, and fight to win, to resist now, to build the necessary networks of solidarity, to be firm, not to be sidelined by the trivialities of instant click amusements, going to the end of struggles and linking them up, taking the roads back and going on the one road together. 

So the harsh police repression which is visited against and upon the miners, and their trial by media criminalization. For these reasons workers need to win this miners struggle: for his victory clears the way for us, and defeat would make it more difficult to raise the resistance in the future, history has proved that. So today we are all miners, and we have to be with them. For justice, history, memory, because they deserve it. But for us, because if they fear for their future, ours is just black, black diamond coal black. 

Finally, the Durham Miners Association has arranged for a delegation of 11 striking Miners to attend the Durham Miners Gala - arranging transport & accomodation.


----------



## trampie (Jul 14, 2012)

Doctors on £100,000 plus a year and £68,000 a year pensions, paid for mostly by the taxpayer, paid for by lots of people that are not well off and don't get good pay and conditions themselves, the greed of some people is obscene.


----------



## BigTom (Jul 14, 2012)

trampie said:


> Doctors on £100,000 plus a year and £68,000 a year pensions, paid for by the taxpayer, paid for by people that are not well off and don't get good pay and conditions themselves, the greed of some people is obscene.


 
Most doctors don't get paid anything like that though:

http://www.nhscareers.nhs.uk/details/Default.aspx?Id=553



> In the most junior hospital trainee post (Foundation Year 1) the basic starting salary is £22,412. This increases in Foundation Year 2 to £27,798. For a doctor in specialist training the basic starting salary is £29,705.
> 
> Specialty doctor and associate specialist (2008) (SAS doctors)
> Doctors in the new specialty doctor grade earn between £36,807 and £70,126.
> ...


 
So at the very top end of consultants are some people earning £100k/year, but I bet it's only a handful of people and in either very specialised or high demand areas.
I thought GPs also earned that kind of money but apparently not - perhaps those that do also take on private work? 

Now I'm not saying they are underpaid, but don't swallow this £100k/yr stuff cos it's not true.

I can't be bothered to argue the wider point with you about why should the doctors pay for a deficit caused by the financial sector, or how you should be more interested in raising your pay not cutting others, I know that others will and have done in the past and got nowhere and I don't have the energy for it today.
Personally, I reckon doctors should be amongst the highest paid people in an economic system where you are going to have pay differentials.  £100k is imo an obscene amount of money for anyone to earn but if anyone is going to earn that much, I'd rather it be a doctor than an MP (whose pensions are not being cut at all btw) or the private sector CEOs that earn from outsourcing contracts (Emma Harrison of A4e paid herself an £8.6m dividend before resigning because of all the fraud investigations happening at her company, which earns 100% of it's income from government contracts).
Basically if you want to get annoyed about people earning high sums of money, there are far better targets for you to set your sights on than a few doctors who don't want to take a big pay cut because of something the bankers and politicians did.


----------



## trampie (Jul 14, 2012)

Yes if there are to be pay differentials, doctors are more deserving than most and there are better targets out there, but it is still obscene the amount of money they earn compared to ordinary members of society and its the ordinary members of society that through their taxes are paying their tremendous wages and pensions, if you haven't seen my posts before i have targeted the police and teachers for similar reasons, they get good pay and conditions but they want worse off people to continue to subsidise their pay and conditions, the middle classes are screwing the less well off for every penny, it is not a fair society, the less well off and the poor are suffering the most, not doctors, teachers and the police.


----------



## BigTom (Jul 14, 2012)

trampie said:


> Yes if there are to be pay differentials, doctors are more deserving than most and there are better targets out there, but it is still obscene the amount of money they earn compared to ordinary members of society and its the ordinary members of society that through their taxes are paying their tremendous wages and pensions, if you haven't seen my posts before i have targeted the police and teachers for similar reasons, they get good pay and conditions but they want worse off people to continue to subsidise their pay and conditions, the middle classes are screwing the less well off for every penny, it is not a fair society, the less well off and the poor are suffering the most, not doctors, teachers and the police.


 
Doctors, teachers and the police.
Why doesn't that read MPs, Private consultants and the bosses of the outsourcing companies like A4e, Serco, ATOS, Capita etc. who all earn far more, often in the millions in the case of the private sector?
These are all paid for by the taxpayer entirely.  There's loads of public sector workers on more money than teachers and doctors - compare at the top and you'll find head's of the largest schools on £80k but the council chiefs are often on over £100k - Birmingham city council chief (admittedly in charge of around £1bn so a big, big job) is on over £300k/yr.

Do you think that a teacher, starting salary of £21k, is wrong to go on strike because of the amount that a head earns? Do you think that a junior doctor on £26k or even a more senior one on £50k is wrong to go on strike to stop a huge pay cut?

And if you think the cost of all this is too much for your average earning taxpayer, then you should look to (a) getting your wages up, and (b) getting the wealthiest people and big companies to pay their share of tax so you don't pay it for them.


----------



## trampie (Jul 14, 2012)

There are lots of groups that are screwing poor people, just because this group and that group are screwing poor people it does not make it right that the likes of doctors do so as well, there is no need for me to look at (a) getting your wages up {for the less well off i may add}, and (b) getting the wealthiest people and big companies to pay their share of tax so you don't pay it for them.
Because that is what i would advocate anyway, making a more balanced fairer society instead of what we have currently got which is a dog eat dog society full of greed with no change likely to the status quo as there is no relevant left wing party in England, they are all right wing parties appealing to peoples greed.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Jul 14, 2012)

Oh not _again_


----------



## BigTom (Jul 14, 2012)

and yet on here I only remember reading about you attacking teachers, doctors and police.  not the bosses that are fucking everyone and the poorest the hardest.  Like I said I don't have the energy for this discussion this morning so that'll be it from me


----------



## trampie (Jul 14, 2012)

BigTom said:


> and yet on here I only remember reading about you attacking teachers, doctors and police. not the bosses that are fucking everyone and the poorest the hardest. Like I said I don't have the energy for this discussion this morning so that'll be it from me


There are too many to mention, most of which i would never have heard of i'm sure, its not right for any group to screw the poor and less well off, it would be impossible for an individual like me to name them all, but i know the major groups, who admittedly aren't the worst culprits but if you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem, supporting the poor into giving doctors better pay and conditions when they earn a fortune compared to the poor is very unfair imo.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 14, 2012)

Fuck off trampie, you Welsh Tory cunt!


----------



## trampie (Jul 14, 2012)

Tory you say VP, you are the one supporting the relatively well off taking money off the poor.


----------



## belboid (Jul 18, 2012)

Print workers in Sunderland entering the second week of their strike over overtime payments

http://www.powerinaunion.co.uk/paragon-uk-sunderland-dispute-help-needed/


----------



## belboid (Jul 19, 2012)

John Lewis cleaners on strike on London again on Friday. Solidarity pickets are requested outside there other stores at midday.  Just turn up - or, more wisely - check if your local IWW branch is organising anything


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

Make this if you can.



> “We are going to jam up the fuel system, we’re going to mount a campaign of direct action. The only way to get the government to take notice is to threaten them…
> This time the protest will be treated as a picket line, so other union members will not cross it…
> 
> We’re fighting for our community, for the jobs of our members. We can’t let it go without a fight.”


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

a fuel crisis would make the PCS Borders Agency strike look like a walk in the park.  They'd shit it straight away.


----------



## love detective (Jul 20, 2012)

saw your leader was doing the usual and condemning strikes the other day articul8


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

and you're surprised by this?


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

Go on, give him a different narrative.


----------



## love detective (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> and you're surprised by this?


 
Not surprised by this - but surprised by your previous claim that he was limited in what he could say because of the 'party's structural dependence on the unions'


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

there are contending pressures on him - clearly ahead of the olympics he'll be sensitive to how strikes are demonised in the media and won't want to court their opprobrium.  At the same time, he's been the first leader in 25? years to speak at the Durham miner gala.  He needs the affiliated unions with him, but wants to curb their militancy.  A similar kind of politics to the TUC.

I'm not underestimating what a potentially damaging role this might see him play.  At the same time he faces certain pressures that simply don't exist for out-and-out neoliberal parties.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

Can you not see how media led you are in the bubble? Go on give him a narrative, i'm sure that's enough to undermine a century of structure and interest. All you've said there is that miliband has the option of _playing_ left and this somehow is a victory.

(_no this is not a victory, it shows that the pressures that exist mean we can rally a pole blah blah- vote and join labour, the scabs party, up the strikers_)


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

What is it with these people that they apply this crude leadership/rank and file analysis to every single thing ever?


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Can you not see how media led you are in the bubble? Go on give him a narrative, i'm sure that's enough to undermine a century of structure and interest. All you've said there is that miliband has the option of _playing_ left and this somehow is a victory.
> 
> (_no this is not a victory, it shows that the pressures that exist mean we can rally a pole blah blah- vote and join labour, the scabs party, up the strikers_)


scabs party?  Really?  Fuck off with that.  I'm talking about a century of structure - structural links to the working class mediated by the trade unions.  Is this problematic.  Yes.  Does it count for nothing at all?


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

It counts in the same way the tory party does. I note that you, as ever, ignore the content of the post questioning what your internal challenge (that you can't get off the ground) could ever mean today.


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> It counts in the same way the tory party does. I note that you, as ever, ignore the content of the post questioning what your internal challenge (that you can't get off the ground) could ever mean today.


Anyone who still thinks there's no difference can't see what's staring them in the face.
As for internal challenges that remains to be seen.  But a stronger left inside and outside can only help


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Anyone who still thinks there's no difference can't see what's staring them in the face.
> As for internal challenges that remains to be seen. But a stronger left inside and outside can only help


Who said there was no difference? I said the difference counts in the same way.

Inside/outside/for/against - just vote labour, join labour and campaign for labour, which has no effect on other Inside/outside/for/against stuff at all, nor suggests a labour party centred solution (one constructed though pluralist debate no doubt).


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> just vote labour, join labour and campaign for labour, which has no effect on other Inside/outside/for/against stuff at all, nor suggests a labour party centred solution (one constructed though pluralist debate no doubt).


 
I've never reduced politics to "vote/join/campaign for labour" - people will do this or not as they see fit.   None of that is central.  It's you that seems to think that any involvement whatever with Labour reduces issues to this.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> I've never reduced politics to "vote/join/campaign for labour" - people will do this or not as they see fit. None of that is central. It's you that seems to think that any involvement whatever with Labour reduces issues to this.


Your membership does this. There is nothing but vote labour. What else is there for my mum?


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

> I've never reduced politics to "vote/join/campaign for labour" - people will do this or not as they see fit. None of that is central.


 
Pretty central


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Anyone who still thinks there's no difference can't see what's staring them in the face.
> As for internal challenges that remains to be seen. But a stronger left inside and outside can only help


why do you think left wing people should join a reactionary party like the labour party? frankly you've got more chance of moving the conservative & unionist party to the left.


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

No it doesn't.  Your mum?  Where does she work, is she a pensioner, does she use NHS services, etc?  Lots of ways to be involved that are in no way dependent on LP membership.


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

Pickman's model said:


> why do you think left wing people should join a reactionary party like the labour party? frankly you've got more chance of moving a party to the left by becoming a member of the conservative and unionist party.


tiresome.  The c&up does not have a historic and structural link to the w/c.  I don;t say people who don't join Labour are wrong/stupid.  There are good reasons to be sceptical.  But ultimately I think that an engagement (qualified, tactical) with Labour will be more productive than destructive of a left alternative.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> tiresome. The c&up does not have a historic and structural link to the w/c. I don;t say people who don't join Labour are wrong/stupid. There are good reasons to be sceptical. But ultimately I think that an engagement (qualified, tactical) with Labour will be more productive than destructive of a left alternative.


given left-wingers have been whinging about moving the labour party to the left since at least 1930, and better people than you have tried and failed, don't you think you should be doing something more productive with your time?


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

Pickman's model said:


> given left-wingers have been whinging about moving the labour party to the left since at least 1930, and better people than you have tried and failed, don't you think you should be doing something more productive with your time?


very little of my time is spent directly in Labour work.  But that doesn't mean all engagement with Labour could be profitably abandoned


----------



## Lo Siento. (Jul 20, 2012)

where the Bennites failed, the LRC will surely succeed!


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> very little of my time is spent directly in Labour work. But that doesn't mean all engagement with Labour could be profitably abandoned


quite. the conservative party would be bereft if they no longer engaged with labour in parliament.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

trampie said:


> Tory you say VP, you are the one supporting the relatively well off taking money off the poor.


so you accept 'cunt' then.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

after benn, us


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 20, 2012)

trampie said:


> Tory you say VP, you are the one supporting the relatively well off taking money off the poor.


 
Only by your strange logic of levelling the majority downward (the usual Tory tactic, you Welsh Tory cunt!), rather than levelling the minority upward.

You're a fucking disgrace.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> Only by your strange logic of levelling the majority downward (the usual Tory tactic, you Welsh Tory cunt!), rather than levelling the minority upward.
> 
> You're a fucking disgrace.


you're letting him off lightly.

i've always regarded him as vermin.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 20, 2012)

<polishes purdey>


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> a fuel crisis would make the PCS Borders Agency strike look like a walk in the park. They'd shit it straight away.


 
No, they wouldn't, because they'd react before reflecting, and only after they've caused some almighty violent mess will they think "shit, we've fucked it up".


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> after benn, us


The defeat of the Labour left 1979-1982 effectively led to Blair.  I don't think that we can simply replay the old CLPD tactics and win this time.  But the growth of the left will see the emergence of a tendency in Labour that challenges that trajectory.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> The defeat of the Labour left 1979-1982 effectively led to Blair. I don't think that we can simply replay the old CLPD tactics and win this time. But the growth of the left will see the emergence of a tendency in Labour that challenges that trajectory.


what growth of the left?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> there are contending pressures on him - clearly ahead of the olympics he'll be sensitive to how strikes are demonised in the media and won't want to court their opprobrium. At the same time, he's been the first leader in 25? years to speak at the Durham miner gala. He needs the affiliated unions with him, but wants to curb their militancy. A similar kind of politics to the TUC.
> 
> I'm not underestimating what a potentially damaging role this might see him play. At the same time he faces certain pressures that simply don't exist for out-and-out neoliberal parties.


 
He's the leader of an "out and out neoliberal party", you _schmuck_.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> He's the leader of an "out and out neoliberal party", you _schmuck_.


[articul8]but it has historical and structural links to the w/c[/articul8]


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 20, 2012)

Mr.Bishie said:


> <polishes purdey>


 
What does Joanna Lumley have to say about you "polishing" her?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 20, 2012)

Pickman's model said:


> [articul8]but it has historical and structural links to the w/c[/articul8]


 
Ah, he means the uni-directional links where the LP takes and the w/c give. Same old same old, seeing as that's pretty much what Mr. 8 wants too.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 20, 2012)

Mr.Bishie said:


> <polishes purdey>


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 20, 2012)

Pickman's model said:


> what growth of the left?


 
I think that's what some people call Laurie Penny.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 20, 2012)

articul8 said:


> The defeat of the Labour left 1979-1982 effectively led to Blair. I don't think that we can simply replay the old CLPD tactics and win this time. But the growth of the left will see the emergence of a tendency in Labour that challenges that trajectory.


That's it?


----------



## articul8 (Jul 20, 2012)

People will come to see that Labour is a space that needs to be contested.  This is not the same as saying the left will or can take over the Labour party to deliver socialism.


----------



## trampie (Jul 20, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> Only by your strange logic of levelling the majority downward, rather than levelling the minority upward.


Level down, level up by giving to the poor from the rich, redistributing wealth more equally, the gap between rich and poor would narrow considerably but with Tories like you about VP there is little chance of that happening.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jul 20, 2012)

trampie said:


> Level down, level up by giving to the poor from the rich, redistributing wealth more equally, the gap between rich and poor would narrow considerably but with Tories like you about VP there is little chance of that happening.


 
You're fucking delusional, you Welsh tory cunt.


----------



## trampie (Jul 20, 2012)

I'm not delusional, as long as there are Tories like VP about, the less well off in society will never get a fair shake of the stick.


----------



## teqniq (Jul 20, 2012)

@ trample you're doing a pretty convincing impression of delusional. VP a tory? WTF?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 21, 2012)

Trampie, go & boil your head ffs.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/...-strike?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

You can go & boil your head too, Ed 'scab' Milliband.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 21, 2012)

trampie said:


> I'm not delusional, as long as there are Tories like VP about, the less well off in society will never get a fair shake of the stick.


never mind a fair shake of the stick, you need a lick with the birch


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 21, 2012)

lol


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 21, 2012)

articul8 said:
			
		

> People will come to see that Labour is a space that needs to be contested. This is not the same as saying the left will or can take over the Labour party to deliver socialism.


_People will see what i tell them to see._


----------



## articul8 (Jul 21, 2012)

It's just a hunch.  Maybe I'm wrong (for the right reasons).


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 21, 2012)

Bridgwater posties wildcatting over bullying again - and in the same area, farmers blockading milk retailers (and publicly supported by Jos Buttler - good lad)


----------



## articul8 (Jul 21, 2012)

who is Jos Buttler?


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 21, 2012)

The next Ian Botham.


----------



## articul8 (Jul 21, 2012)

Or a sub-par Freddie Flintoff - we'll see


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 21, 2012)

articul8 said:


> Or a sub-par Freddie Flintoff - we'll see


He doesn't bowl - don't make yourself look like a twat please.


----------



## articul8 (Jul 21, 2012)

We'll he's not exactly a Botham then is he?


----------



## weepiper (Jul 21, 2012)

You can play anti-union-cliche bingo with this article

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nority-hardliners-holding-Britain-ransom.html


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 21, 2012)

articul8 said:


> We'll he's not exactly a Botham then is he?


I was talking about media expectation over many many years - see this for example:

Jos Buttler, the latest candidate to be England's Chosen One


----------



## articul8 (Jul 21, 2012)

good luck to him, I hope he makes it, esp. if he's not a public school type


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 21, 2012)

Anyone at coryton?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 21, 2012)

weepiper said:


> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nority-hardliners-holding-Britain-ransom.html


 
Slippery slope.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 23, 2012)

Back to work at bridgwater, victory claimed, not sure. Lads back at work but...

Anyway, good on them for not messing about.


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 24, 2012)

Initial and ISS RMT cleaners (London Underground) voted overwhelmingly for strike action and instructed not to book on from this friday 05:30 for 24 hours. Mmmm, dirty trains.

When does the olympics start?


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 24, 2012)

Beeb reporting it now.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-18968457


----------



## dennisr (Jul 26, 2012)

This is beyond a farce:
http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-minister-in-the-thick-of-it-over-new-jobs/11013

(Re the threatened action by the PCS - in effect the government lies about the PCS action forcing them back - then try to lie again over the promises they have made to advertise 800 new jobs)

The PCS has issued a statement:
_General secretary Mark Serwotka said: “”With these adverts posted one day after we called a strike then dangled in front of staff to try to dissuade them from taking action, this is now an incredible claim that raises very serious questions about the integrity of Home Office officials and ministers._
_“It is either shambolic or a deliberate lie, and not only do we call on them to honour the 800 vacancies as advertised, we demand a full explanation into what happened, and an apology from the minister Damian Green who earlier accused us of making up these figures and claimed no new job ads had been posted since we threatened to strike.”_


----------



## cesare (Jul 26, 2012)

dennisr said:


> This is beyond a farce:
> http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-minister-in-the-thick-of-it-over-new-jobs/11013
> 
> (Re the threatened action by the PCS - in effect the government lies about the PCS action forcing them back - then try to lie again over the promises they have made to advertise 800 new jobs)
> ...



Dire. "administrative error" my arse.


----------



## dennisr (Jul 26, 2012)

Citizen66 said:


> Beeb reporting it now.
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-18968457


 
Confirmed picket lines:

There Will be Two days of strike action beginning on 0530am on Friday 27th July Three companies are in dispute Carlisle (cleaners and security ) on the DLR ,Iss and initial cleaners on London Underground.
Please do your best to visit the pickets below and make a special effort to visit Stratford to show your support at 12noon on Friday


1 Walthamstow station 6am,2pm 7pm
2 Northumberland park 6am,2pm 7pm
3 West Ruislip depot 6am,2pm 7pm
4 Stratford station 6am,12 noon
5 Hainault depot 6am,2pm 7pm
6 London Bridge station 6am,2pm 7pm
7 Cockfosters station 6am,2pm 7pm
8 Ealing Common depot 6am,2pm 7pm
9 Golders Green depot 6am,2pm 7pm
10 Morden station 6am,2pm 7pm
11 Neasden Depot 6am,2pm 7pm
12 Poplar Dlr depot 0500 and 2100
13 Beckton Dlr depot(behind Gallions reach Dlr station) 0500 and 2100


----------



## dennisr (Jul 26, 2012)

Second strike day at Remploy - solid support across the picket lines.

Here are just some short reports:
http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/campaign/Workplace_and_TU_campaigns/Remploy/14955

Leeds, Birkenhead, Newcastle and Gateshead, Bristol, Glasgow/Springburn, Wishaw (Lanarkshire)


----------



## weepiper (Jul 26, 2012)

dennisr said:


> Second strike day at Remploy - solid support across the picket lines.
> 
> Here are just some short reports:
> http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/campaign/Workplace_and_TU_campaigns/Remploy/14955


 
Glasgow Springburn



> When the picket was well established the manager of the plant, which produces steel wheelchairs , arrived in his BMW to open the gates.
> To the astonishment of all, he discovered that the padlock had been super-glued.​


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 26, 2012)

Can anyone confirm that the Remploy strikes also includes plants in Wales?? .

Some lefties here in Swansea are pretty angry about the imminent closure in the city  ...


----------



## ddraig (Jul 26, 2012)

William of Walworth said:


> Can anyone confirm that the Remploy strikes also includes plants in Wales?? .
> 
> Some lefties here in Swansea are pretty angry about the imminent closure in the city ...


 


> Factories at Aberdare, Abertillery, Merthyr Tydfil, Swansea and Wrexham will close between August and mid-December with the loss of almost 200 jobs.


http://www.itv.com/news/wales/2012-07-19/remploy-workers-to-strike-today/



> The scheme might help the 183 workers currently threatened with redundancy at the five plants in Wales whose closure have been announced, but the factories would still close. Remploy which has played such a valuable role in our communities since 1946 would be gone for good in those areas. Redundant Remploy workers would find it easier to find new work, but the jobs would still be lost - they would move into jobs that other workers would have had. And the remaining three factories would be under a death sentence.


http://www.swanseasocialistparty.or...h-government-must-save-remploy-factories.html


----------



## dennisr (Jul 27, 2012)

Here's more on Wales: http://www.socialistpartywales.org.uk/news127.shtml

*Remploy workers step up the campaign- solid strike today*

Short reports from: Porth, Abertillery, Swansea, Merthyr, Bridgend and Aberdare (Crospenmaen was on a routine closedown anyway)


----------



## dennisr (Jul 30, 2012)

Interesting (and excellent imho...) trade union election result -
Steve Hedley has beaten Pat Sikorski to become RMT Assistant General Secretary. A position he will take up for a 5-year period from 12 August 2012.

Could not think of a better fighting representative of RMT members to win

For folk who know these folk


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 30, 2012)

Cheers for that people - I knew about the threat to the factories themselves here obvs, my question was just to do with whether the strike action included the Welsh factories. dennisr's post earlier up didn't seem to include mention of them.

But good on those Welsh (and other) Remploy strikers ....


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 31, 2012)

dennisr said:
			
		

> Interesting (and excellent imho...) trade union election result -
> Steve Hedley has beaten Pat Sikorski to become RMT Assistant General Secretary. A position he will take up for a 5-year period from 12 August 2012.
> 
> Could not think of a better fighting representative of RMT members to win
> ...



Nice one.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 14, 2012)

Not a strike but dispute with huge potential implications - small private hospital in Buckinghamshire is in severe financial trouble and is closing, the staff have been paid only 20% of last month's wages, lunchtime protests etc due to be held demanding "PAY UP NOW" etc


----------



## BigTom (Aug 15, 2012)

Victory for the John Lewis Cleaners 

http://thethirdestate.net/2012/08/striking-cleaners-win-victory-against-john-lewis/



> Cleaners at the flag ship John Lewis store on Oxford Street have won a fantastic victory against job cuts and low pay. The management have now agreed to withdraw, totally, plans for mass compulsory redundancy, and to give cleaners 10% pay rise, backdated to March – following a strike by staff who had organised themselves within the IWW.


 
So why join a union? no redundancies and a 10% pay rise sound pretty damn good to me.. another victory for the IWW cleaners branch too, may they keep on coming.


----------



## weepiper (Aug 15, 2012)

BigTom said:


> Victory for the John Lewis Cleaners
> 
> http://thethirdestate.net/2012/08/striking-cleaners-win-victory-against-john-lewis/


 
woah, that's great. well done them.


----------



## ddraig (Aug 15, 2012)

brilliant news 
more power to them and the wobblies!


----------



## Citizen66 (Aug 16, 2012)

BigTom said:


> Victory for the John Lewis Cleaners
> 
> http://thethirdestate.net/2012/08/striking-cleaners-win-victory-against-john-lewis/
> 
> So why join a union? no redundancies and a 10% pay rise sound pretty damn good to me.. another victory for the IWW cleaners branch too, may they keep on coming.



Not sure the RMT cleaners' strike went so well.


----------



## treelover (Aug 16, 2012)

dennisr said:


> This is beyond a farce:
> http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-minister-in-the-thick-of-it-over-new-jobs/11013
> 
> (Re the threatened action by the PCS - in effect the government lies about the PCS action forcing them back - then try to lie again over the promises they have made to advertise 800 new jobs)
> ...


 

just unbelievable, what else are they prepared to do?


----------



## BigTom (Aug 16, 2012)

Citizen66 said:


> Not sure the RMT cleaners' strike went so well.


----------



## Citizen66 (Aug 16, 2012)

BigTom said:


>



Well in one of the places I work they just turned up to work as normal.  

Difficult to be annoyed with them though given they earn so fucking little. Would probably hammer them financially even to have a day off. Hopefully they'll get the hang of it. Or the RMT should be digging deep to help out financially.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 17, 2012)

Citizen66 said:


> Well in one of the places I work they just turned up to work as normal.
> 
> Difficult to be annoyed with them though given they earn so fucking little. Would probably hammer them financially even to have a day off. Hopefully they'll get the hang of it. Or the RMT should be digging deep to help out financially.



Don't the RMT have a strike or hardship fund?


----------



## belboid (Oct 5, 2012)

Dear friends and colleagues,
We want to notify you that because of management's continued
failure to enter into meaningful negotiations over an ill-conceived
cost cutting programme, including redundancies, Unite members at
Amnesty International (UK) will be going on strike for a second
time next Wednesday, 10 October 2012.

We greatly appreciated the support we received from individuals and
trade union branches during our strike in September, and hope you
will stand with us again. The many messages expressing solidarity
gave our members confidence, and the donations towards our hardship
fund enabled more members to participate in the action. We were
absolutely delighted about the many workplace delegations that came
to support us on our picket line and hope you will do so again!

We will send more details and info early next week, but please
share this email with others in the meantime. Messages of support
can be sent to union[at]amnesty.org.uk.

We are extremely grateful for donations to our hardship fund which
can be made in cash, bank transfer and cheque. Find details below.

Bank transfer:
Acc name: TGWU [ACTSS] 1/0524 Central London Bch
Sort code: 08 60 01
Account number: 30010808
Ensure that you put "AIUK strike fund" as reference.

Cheques: make them out to 'TGWU [ACTSS] 1/0524 Central London Bch'
and send to:
Daniela Manske - Unite Union (private & confidential), Amnesty
International (UK), 17-25 New Inn Yard, London EC2A 3EA


----------



## smokedout (Oct 5, 2012)

good to see this in the often ununionised 'thrid sector' where charity managers use guilt and people's good will to fuck over workers


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 5, 2012)

good,vheard some right dodgy stuff about amnesty


----------



## scalyboy (Oct 5, 2012)

Queru about the recent Unison HE strike ballot (over 1% pay offer and Living Wage):

...members voted in favour by a very narrow margin,

3432 in favour of taking strike action (50.3% of those voting);
3385 against taking strike action (49.7% of those voting).
http://www.unison.org.uk/news/news_view.asp?did=8116

And I heard unofficially from a rep that the turnout was 7% 
Two questions:
1. is there any Tory/New Labour anti-union legislation that says ballots must have a minimum % turnout  ?
2.  is there any Tory/New Labour anti-union legislation that would say that the margin in favour of strike action in this case is too small?

I'm not that well-versed in these things, thanks for any help.

(must admit I'm surprised and disappointed in the results, 1% pay award is clearly a pisstake)


----------



## weepiper (Oct 8, 2012)

Walmart staff in nine LA stores walk out in protest at being penalised for attempting to unionise

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...710.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003&ir=Detroit


----------



## treelover (Oct 8, 2012)

Sometimes you are about to give on the US and then these things happen...


----------



## killer b (Oct 8, 2012)

day 4 of strike action at preston sorting office. i only noticed today when the post didn't turn up again...

http://www.lep.co.uk/news/local/postal-strike-pain-continues-1-5002670


----------



## weepiper (Oct 10, 2012)

the Walmart strike is spreading









> As communities across the country raise their voices in calls for changes at Walmart, workers from stores throughout the Dallas-area went on strike this morning in the first-ever Walmart Associate walk-out in Dallas protesting attempts to silence and retaliate against workers for speaking out for improvements on the job. Walmart workers from stores in Seattle, Miami, the Washington, D.C. area, Sacramento and the San Francisco Bay Area also walked off the job.
> 
> Later today warehouse workers, community supporters, including Jobs with Justice, Communications Workers of America and others, and striking Walmart Associates will take their calls for change to Walmart's global corporate headquarters in Bentonville, Arkansas, where Walmart is holding its annual financial analyst meeting. This comes days after Associates in Los Angeles walked-off the job calling for an end to the retaliation [1].
> 
> ...


 
I got this off facebook but there's a link to a newsletter for anyone who wants to keep an eye on this

http://afl.salsalabs.com/o/4023/c/33/p/salsa/web/common/public/signup?signup_page_KEY=6780


----------



## shagnasty (Oct 10, 2012)

weepiper said:


> Walmart staff in nine LA stores walk out in protest at being penalised for attempting to unionise
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...710.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003&ir=Detroit


An unofficial strike it shows you cannot legislate strikes away


----------



## Cornetto (Oct 10, 2012)

Trade dispute between UCU and your employer concerning the National HE Claim 2012

The ballot closed at noon today and the responses to the two questions you were balloted on are as follows:

Are you prepared to take industrial action consisting of strike action?

Number of ballot papers returned: 19,443
Number voting YES: 8,556 (44.3%)
Number voting NO: 10,757 (55.7%)
Number of papers found to be invalid: 130

Are you prepared to take industrial action consisting of action short of a strike?

Number of ballot papers returned: 19,443
Number voting YES: 13,452 (70.1%)
Number voting NO: 5,751 (29.9%)
Number of papers found to be invalid:: 240

Lets see what happens with the action short of a strike!


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 13, 2012)

Is there a strike tomorrow (i know there's one in europe) I'm temping at a higher education institution and I don't want to cross a picket line if there is.


----------



## nino_savatte (Nov 13, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> Is there a strike tomorrow (i know there's one in europe) I'm temping at a higher education institution and I don't want to cross a picket line if there is.


I've seen the occasional poster but I don't think the message has been disseminated widely enough tbh.


----------



## BigTom (Nov 13, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> Is there a strike tomorrow (i know there's one in europe) I'm temping at a higher education institution and I don't want to cross a picket line if there is.


 
Not in the UK afaik, various little solidarity demonstrations happening around the place though.


----------



## weepiper (Nov 29, 2012)

Scotrail (RMT) workers have voted to strike over an unfair dismissal

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-20541396


----------



## moochedit (Dec 4, 2012)

The Postal workers are voting on not delivering the private  letters (tnt post,etc) in the new year...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...opoly-on-home-delivery-escalates-8382205.html


----------



## dennisr (Dec 6, 2012)

*Tesco Drivers move to a INDEFINITE Strike 6th Dec*
http://shopstewards.net/2012/12/tesco-drivers-move-to-a-indefinate-strike-5th-dec

_180 Tesco drivers, members of Unite the union, at the supermarket giant’s distribution hub in Doncaster have announced an indefinite strike from Thursday 6th December, after they voted to reject the latest “completely unsatisfactory” offer to settle the long-running dispute._


----------



## weepiper (Dec 10, 2012)

Good article from the Tesco drivers' picket line

http://usdawactivist.wordpress.com/2012/12/10/striking-drivers-block-tesco-distribution-centre/


----------



## BigTom (Dec 11, 2012)

Workers at 2 Sisters bakeries in Smethwick and West Brom have voted to strike over pay - they have been offered a 20p pay rise, currently most are on £6.22/hr.
http://www.birminghampost.net/birmi...vour-of-three-one-day-strikes-65233-32384047/ 



> The workers voted by 98.5 per cent for strike action and 97.2 per cent for industrial action short of a strike. The turnout was 57 per cent.
> 
> Read More http://www.birminghampost.net/birmi...one-day-strikes-65233-32384047/#ixzz2EjSwF8eu


----------



## weepiper (Dec 13, 2012)

weepiper said:


> Scotrail (RMT) workers have voted to strike over an unfair dismissal
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-20541396


 
details announced now, all-out 24-hour strike on the 22nd and on Christmas Eve.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-20713102


----------



## brogdale (Jan 3, 2013)

Granted its not of the norm, but this little tale of direct action from Spain raised my spirits:-

http://www.huffingtonpos...cid=edlinkusaolp00000003

_"The dozen or so locksmiths in Pamplona, Spain, announced in December that they are refusing to carry out evictions, PRI reports. *The move could essentially stop evictions in Pamplona because even if the police kick a family out of their home, the evicted can still get back in if no one has changed the locks.*_​ 
_"As people, we can't continue carrying out evictions when people are killing themselves," Pamplona locksmith Iker de Carlos told PRI."_​ 
_



_​
That should foil the bankstas theiving for a while, but I'm sure that the state will soon be training up some new locksmiths.


----------



## butchersapron (Jan 9, 2013)

Walkout at Runcorn power station - claimed to be about shitty conditions but given the disputes last year about local recruitment may well be a mix of things.


----------



## butchersapron (Jan 16, 2013)

More on Runcorn - speed of victory might suggest fear of similar actions elsewhere:

Victory at Runcorn TPS



> Hundreds of construction workers at Runcorn Thermal Power Station have won major concessions from the employers following several days of unofficial action over deeply inadequate on-site ‘welfare facilities’ such as toilets and the canteen. The action has also created one new job! Numerous messages of solidarity were sent by trade unionists from across Britain. Mass meetings each day voted whether to continue the action, and voted to accept the latest offer from the employers. A worker on the site reports:
> 
> _We’ve sent a clear message to the gaffers that they’d better start listening to us, stop taking the piss and start getting on with things. Basically, we’ve got everything we wanted._


 


> When we walked out on Monday there was no admission of anything and the gaffers just said “Get back on site cos the facilities you’ve got are good enough!” They’ve gone from that, to undertaking that they will make the improvements we asked for, which are:
> 
> increasing the toilet facilities on the site,
> making sure facilities are properly maintained and cleaned (they’re employing an extra cleaner) to a standard accepted by the stewards and safety reps,
> ...


----------



## weepiper (Feb 8, 2013)

> Drivers at Walkers Snack distribution centre, in Peterlee, County Durham, are voting on plans to take industrial action after rejecting the company's wage increase proposals.
> The firm had put forward a two per cent increase for day shifts and 1.5per cent rise for night work... Mr Thompkins said 92 per cent of members rejected Walkers' pay increase proposals in a ballot and the union had now sent out papers which could lead to formal industrial action.


 
http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/bu...sp_factory_drivers_could_strike_over_pay_row/


----------



## weepiper (Feb 22, 2013)

Petrol tanker drivers at Grangemouth refinery are striking for three days as of this morning

http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-e...uth-petrol-tanker-drivers-on-strike-1-2805054



> Unite said 90 per cent of the 42 Grangemouth tanker drivers balloted had voted for strike action over the imminent transfer of an aviation contract from BP to DHL. The union said the drivers were set to lose £1400 a year in pay and as much as £100,000 from the value of their pensions as a result of the switch of contract.


----------



## danny la rouge (Feb 22, 2013)

http://union-news.co.uk/2013/02/tanker-drivers-strike/

“We’ll stay as long as we have to”.


http://www.falkirkherald.co.uk/news...er-drivers-to-strike-in-grangemouth-1-2800566

Tony Trench, Unite regional industrial officer, said: “It’s an outrage that BP, a multi-national giant which earns billions every year, is exploiting the UK’s weak employment laws to effectively swindle workers out of their retirement savings and future earnings.”


----------



## smokedout (Sep 10, 2013)

Hovis strike in Wigan enters its second week tomorrow, over agency workers being brought in, full info at: http://uniteresist.org/2013/09/solidarity-with-hovis-workers-6am-wednesday-11-september-wigan/

the BFAWU have called for a day of solidarity tomorrow (sept 11th), also you can contact Hovis on twitter @hovisbakery and facebook at: https://www.facebook.com/hovisbakery


----------



## nino_savatte (Sep 11, 2013)

Just left a message on their FB page. They've lost my custom. Unfortunately when it comes to bread, there isn't much choice. Warburton's fund the Tories and Kingsmill puts pieces of broken plates in their bread.


----------



## Sprocket. (Sep 11, 2013)

Ardargh glass got a series of strikes coming up following long drawn out talks that seem to have been going on all year.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-24023891


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 11, 2013)

Berkshire Fire & Rescue are advertising for strikebreaker emergency fire crew in anticipation of a strike.


----------



## butchersapron (Sep 13, 2013)

FBU strike. Big one. Won't take my link:

http://www.fbu.org.uk/?p=7282


----------



## belboid (Sep 16, 2013)

Sprocket. said:


> Ardargh glass got a series of strikes coming up following long drawn out talks that seem to have been going on all year.
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-24023891


strike off now, as they were offered an extra 0.5% and backdating

http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/g...l-off-strikes-as-they-consider-new-pay-offer/


----------



## bi0boy (Sep 17, 2013)

butchersapron said:


> FBU strike. Big one. Won't take my link:
> 
> http://www.fbu.org.uk/?p=7282



Big one? The indefinite strikes of the past became 24 hour strikes. Now they are going to have a four hour one.


----------



## teqniq (Sep 18, 2013)

smokedout said:


> Hovis strike in Wigan enters its second week tomorrow, over agency workers being brought in, full info at: http://uniteresist.org/2013/09/solidarity-with-hovis-workers-6am-wednesday-11-september-wigan/
> 
> the BFAWU have called for a day of solidarity tomorrow (sept 11th), also you can contact Hovis on twitter @hovisbakery and facebook at: https://www.facebook.com/hovisbakery



Police clash with strikers on Hovis picket line



> Unions have called for a “massive show of strength” in support of Hovis bakery workers in Wigan after clashes with police outside their strike-bound factory in which three people were arrested in the early hours of yesterday (16 September).
> 
> The protest came as BFAWU members began the second of three weeks of strike action over what they say is the abuse of “zero hours” contracts by the company.
> 
> ...


----------



## treelover (Sep 18, 2013)

> A number of them blocked the road to prevent lorries from leaving. Video posted on Facebook by supporters shows how one truck – escorted by police officers – took 40 m


 
can't find FB sites, any links?


----------



## danny la rouge (Sep 18, 2013)

SUPPORT NEEDED: Glasgow Homeless Casework Team unofficial strike

On Friday 13 September social workers in the Glasgow Homeless Casework Team,
who are members of Unison, walked out on unofficial strike following the
suspension of a colleague who refused to cover the work of vacant posts.

On Monday 16 September, the strike escalated across the whole service
following a union meeting of 60 people, after talks with management over
workload failed to resolve the issues.

The strike is completely unofficial, with Glasgow City Council threatening
dismissal if the action is not stopped.

Expressions support and solidarity can be sent to
enquiries@glasgowcityunison.co.uk


----------



## weepiper (Sep 18, 2013)

treelover said:


> can't find FB sites, any links?


----------



## treelover (Sep 18, 2013)

is that Hovis workers shouting 'the workers' etc' or supporters?

'No pasaran'


----------



## ddraig (Oct 11, 2013)

First Great Western cleaners on strike today until tomorrow
http://www.southwales-eveningpost.c...rike-pay-row/story-19922444-detail/story.html


> “The wealth of both Mitie and First Great Western has been achieved only by the hard work and dedication for its workers.
> 
> “We are taking this stand to put an end to the company’s shocking attitude towards its employees and to help stamp out poverty across the board.
> 
> ...


----------



## belboid (Oct 16, 2013)

posties out on november 4th

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24555387


----------



## brogdale (Oct 16, 2013)

belboid said:


> posties out on november 4th
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24555387


...and in the report the BBC say..



> They are holding the strike to protect workers' current terms and conditions at the privatised Royal Mail.
> 
> Royal Mail staff were _*given free shares*_ in the company, in an attempt to improve labour relations



I thought that capitalists were fond of the notion that there's no such thing as a _free lunch_? I can't see how they'd call then _free _when they must have been a cost to the previous owners of the means of production? I mean...you could say they had been _given shares_, but _*free*_?


----------



## Stay Beautiful (Oct 16, 2013)

belboid said:


> posties out on november 4th
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24555387



Fuck knows why we're waiting until then?


----------



## ash (Oct 16, 2013)

Teachers out tomorrow


----------



## DotCommunist (Oct 16, 2013)

ash said:


> Teachers out tomorrow




which union? nut?


----------



## brogdale (Oct 16, 2013)

ash said:


> Teachers out tomorrow





> The Education Secretary accused 'militant teaching unions' of _*putting their own ideology before the interests of the children *_in their care. 'They are the people who are _*the enemies of promise*_,' he said.



One day...


----------



## brogdale (Oct 16, 2013)

DotCommunist said:


> which union? nut?



Joint action by the big two.


----------



## rover07 (Oct 16, 2013)

brogdale said:


> ...and in the report the BBC say..
> 
> 
> 
> I thought that capitalists were fond of the notion that there's no such thing as a _free lunch_? I can't see how they'd call then _free _when they must have been a cost to the previous owners of the means of production? I mean...you could say they had been _given shares_, but _*free*_?



Nice. Free shares, oh yeah i think postal workers know all to well how much these shares cost. 

Broken backs, endless stress and the threat of redundancy. All for the bargain price of £3750 of free shares.


----------



## ash (Oct 16, 2013)

DotCommunist said:


> which union? nut?


Not sure, just know my daughter is off tomorrow.  Fine by me as him indoors doesn't work but even if we both worked no probs she would come to work with me or I'd phone in.  power to the people and all that!!


----------



## tony.c (Oct 16, 2013)

rover07 said:


> Nice. Free shares, oh yeah i think postal workers know all to well how much these shares cost.
> 
> Broken backs, endless stress and the threat of redundancy. All for the bargain price of £3750 of free shares.


They can't sell them for 3 years by which time the shares might well be worth less.
And if they leave Royal Mail (or are sacked) they won't keep them.


----------



## weepiper (Oct 16, 2013)

Stay Beautiful said:


> Fuck knows why we're waiting until then?



Because of the red tape surrounding strikes

http://www.simplybusiness.co.uk/knowledge/articles/2011/06/2011-06-15-strike-action-is-it-legal/

Quite surprised there haven't been wildcat strikes already mind.


----------



## weepiper (Oct 16, 2013)

Ineos are going to keep Grangemouth refinery closed indefinitely despite Unite having called off a proposed strike this weekend

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24546521

Outrageous bullying. They wanted an excuse to close the plant.


----------



## treelover (Oct 16, 2013)

Enemy at the Gates, FBU March breakaway today

Amazing scenes as hundreds of firefighters break away from march and descend on Downing Street.

pic.twitter.com/qO7F7io2oY


----------



## treelover (Oct 16, 2013)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BWtqyKVCAAAPyG3.jpg

another


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 16, 2013)

is anyone in further education striking tomorrow? i've got some temp work and i really don't want to cross a picket line. UCU who i think are the recognise d union said they're definitely not striking on thursday but i'm worried in case someone is.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Oct 16, 2013)

rover07 said:


> Nice. Free shares, oh yeah i think postal workers know all to well how much these shares cost.
> 
> Broken backs, endless stress and the threat of redundancy. All for the bargain price of £3750 of free shares.



They're also being offered a one-off £300 honorarium if they don't strike.  Obviously Moya Green thinks she can buy plenty of scabs at £300 a pop.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Oct 16, 2013)

Stay Beautiful said:


> Fuck knows why we're waiting until then?



Anti-union legislation enacted in the '80s, and updated every couple of years since, means that a union has to conduct a full postal ballot of the membership, and ascertain whether a majority of the membership want a strike or "action short of a strike".  They then have to dot the "i"s and cross the "t"s in order to not leave any hostages to legal challenge.
If they don't carry out the mandated actions, the union can be prosecuted and fined, and even have union assets sequestrated.


----------



## nino_savatte (Oct 17, 2013)

frogwoman said:


> is anyone in further education striking tomorrow? i've got some temp work and i really don't want to cross a picket line. UCU who i think are the recognise d union said they're definitely not striking on thursday but i'm worried in case someone is.


I know the UCU has balloted and we're going out some time next month (even though I'm out of work).


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Oct 17, 2013)

frogwoman said:


> is anyone in further education striking tomorrow? i've got some temp work and i really don't want to cross a picket line. UCU who i think are the recognise d union said they're definitely not striking on thursday but i'm worried in case someone is.


 
Unison in HE (not sure on FE) are striking on the 31st, we've been told today.

ETA: I don't know what UCU are doing. Here at least they represent the higher grades.


----------



## Stay Beautiful (Oct 17, 2013)

ViolentPanda said:


> Anti-union legislation enacted in the '80s, and updated every couple of years since, means that a union has to conduct a full postal ballot of the membership, and ascertain whether a majority of the membership want a strike or "action short of a strike".  They then have to dot the "i"s and cross the "t"s in order to not leave any hostages to legal challenge.
> If they don't carry out the mandated actions, the union can be prosecuted and fined, and even have union assets sequestrated.



I realise they have to do this and give 7 days notice and so forth but that would mean the strike should start next Wednesday. It did last time IIRC. There has been some explanation today. They're going to hold a second ballot on the boycotting of competitors mail. A good plan 'B' as they must realise that strike action isn't sustainable for very long.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Oct 17, 2013)

Stay Beautiful said:


> I realise they have to do this and give 7 days notice and so forth but that would mean the strike should start next Wednesday. It did last time IIRC. There has been some explanation today. They're going to hold a second ballot on the boycotting of competitors mail. A good plan 'B' as they must realise that strike action isn't sustainable for very long.



There are added problems. For a start, union ballots have been attacked legally for not using up-to-date membership lists when sending out ballot papers, so the union has to bear that in mind if they don't want to be injuncted.
Also, bear in mind that the state will use every pissant trick it can think of, to deny workers the freedom to exercise their right to strike.


----------



## hegley (Oct 17, 2013)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Unison in HE (not sure on FE) are striking on the 31st, we've been told today.
> 
> ETA: I don't know what UCU are doing. Here at least they represent the higher grades.


UCU are out on 31st also.


----------



## coley (Oct 17, 2013)

ViolentPanda said:


> There are added problems. For a start, union ballots have been attacked legally for not using up-to-date membership lists when sending out ballot papers, so the union has to bear that in mind if they don't want to be injuncted.
> Also, bear in mind that the state will use every pissant trick it can think of, to deny workers the freedom to exercise their right to strike.


Given the hoops that unions have to jump through to get a strike rolling,it does seem a bit pointless to do all that for a one day strike?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 17, 2013)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Unison in HE (not sure on FE) are striking on the 31st, we've been told today.
> 
> ETA: I don't know what UCU are doing. Here at least they represent the higher grades.


My first strike! Exciting!

Other colleagues have already used up the leave policy


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 17, 2013)

oh great, im going to have to think about what to do about the 31st now as i'm a temp worker and to be honest i reckon they could just get rid of me if i went on strike. 

I don't know whether I'll still be at the same place on the 31st or whether I'm working at all. 

would it be wrong to book it as a holiday as i've already got a day or so left as annual leave, and then donate a day's pay to the strike fund?


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 17, 2013)

actually, are FE colleges on strike that day?


----------



## tony.c (Oct 17, 2013)

coley said:


> Given the hoops that unions have to jump through to get a strike rolling,it does seem a bit pointless to do all that for a one day strike?


 The one day strike on 4 November is just the start. There will be further strikes. But the CWU does have to call the first industrial action within 'a reasonable time' (usually interpreted as 28 days) for the ballot to remain live, under the anti-union legislation.
I would think that strikes will be more effective as Christmas and increased mail volumes get closer.


----------



## coley (Oct 17, 2013)

tony.c said:


> The one day strike on 4 November is just the start. There will be further strikes. But the CWU does have to call the first industrial action within 'a reasonable time' (usually interpreted as 28 days) for the ballot to remain live, under the anti-union legislation.
> I would think that strikes will be more effective as Christmas and increased mail volumes get closer.


How long does the ballot remain 'live' ? After the first day of industrial action?


----------



## belboid (Oct 17, 2013)

coley said:


> How long does the ballot remain 'live' ? After the first day of industrial action?


after the result. so there's a 21 day 'window' in which the first action has to be called

you'd then do the same again - announce the next date for between 7 & 21 days later, building up as it gets closer to xmas.


----------



## coley (Oct 17, 2013)

belboid said:


> after the result. so there's a 21 day 'window' in which the first action has to be called
> 
> you'd then do the same again - announce the next date for between 7 & 21 days later, building up as it gets closer to xmas.


So you can have an indefinite series of strikes  after the result of a ballot as long as the employers are notified?


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Oct 18, 2013)

frogwoman said:


> oh great, im going to have to think about what to do about the 31st now as i'm a temp worker and to be honest i reckon they could just get rid of me if i went on strike.
> 
> I don't know whether I'll still be at the same place on the 31st or whether I'm working at all.
> 
> would it be wrong to book it as a holiday as i've already got a day or so left as annual leave, and then donate a day's pay to the strike fund?


I'm in a union about to take strike action and if I had a temp alongside me I wouldn't expect them to strike - they're usually not in a union and they don't have the pay and conditions I do - I wouldn't expect them to donate to my union
covering my work would be a different matter though...


----------



## belboid (Oct 18, 2013)

coley said:


> So you can have an indefinite series of strikes  after the result of a ballot as long as the employers are notified?


as long as its the same dispute, yup. I dont think there's any time period given before you have to  reballot.


----------



## tony.c (Oct 18, 2013)

coley said:


> So you can have an indefinite series of strikes  after the result of a ballot as long as the employers are notified?


Yes, you have to give 7 days notice of each IA, and you can't have too long a gap. I don't know if that has been legally defined. If the union leaves too long a gap between IA it would be open to the employer going to the High Court to seek an injunction declaring that the ballot is no longer valid.
But if both sides agree, usually to allow time for negotiations, this can be waived.


----------



## treelover (Oct 18, 2013)

The future of fire-fighting if the Govt win?


----------



## treelover (Oct 23, 2013)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24631342

Grangemouth Petro-Chemical facility is to close, the refinery will stay closed till the workers agree to demands of Ineos, apparently the bosses were smiling when they announced it, isn't globalisation wonderful. This has massive implications for Scotland, Unite, SNP, and U.K, but most of all the workers there who will now face workfare, etc.

btw, its all over the media, everywhere.


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 23, 2013)

treelover said:


> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24631342
> 
> 
> 
> Grangemouth Petro-chemical facility is to close, the refinery will stay closed till the workers agree to demands of Ineos, apparently the bosses were smiling when they announced it, isn't globalisation wonderful. This has massive implications for Scotland, Unite, SNP, and U.K, but most of all the workers there who will now face workfare, etc.


Was also coming to post that.

Hearing lots of calls for Scottish Govt. to nationalise.


----------



## treelover (Oct 23, 2013)

Is there a possibility?, it would be seen very as a very positive move by the public and workers and surely help the SNP(differentiate them) and a yes vote.

even a game changer?


----------



## treelover (Oct 23, 2013)

> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-24593322


 
Its owned by one man Jim Ratcliffe, a former engineer.


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 23, 2013)

treelover said:


> Is there a possibility?, it would be seen very as a very positive move by the public and workers and surely help the SNP(differentiate them) and a yes vote.
> 
> even a game changer?


I'm not sure that Holyrood currently has the power to nationalise any industry (although I'd need to check that).  However Alex Salmond has already said the SNP will renationalise Royal Mail in Scotland should there be a Yes vote in the referendum. (Which suggests that a devolved Holyrood can't currently do it).

Whether or not the SNP will offer to nationalise Grangemouth remains to be seen.  But several commentators are already calling for them to make such an announcement.


----------



## butchersapron (Oct 23, 2013)

treelover said:


> Its owned by one man Jim Ratcliffe, a former engineer.


He's majority shareholder, not sole owner.


----------



## treelover (Oct 23, 2013)

> Has anyone been able to look into the claim that the plant is losing money? Which costs does this include?
> A few years ago the company where I worked took over a small business. Not long after the manager of that business (now a subsidiary) was warned that it was losing money. He was surprised, since until then it had been profitable. He looked at the books and discovered that the subsidiary was losing money because it was being charged the repayments on the loan the new owner had taken out to buy the subsidiary. This is normal practice (see Manchester United).
> So, is Grangemouth "losing money" because the plant is having to repay the loan that Ineos took out to buy it?


 


Posted elsewhere, this is interesting, smokes and mirrors?


----------



## butchersapron (Oct 23, 2013)

Ineos are quite deliberately opaque - for example:



> So Ineos Chemicals Grangemouth Ltd may look like the operation at the Forth Valley plant, but it's only part of it. There's another company running the refinery, which comes under the joint ownership of Ineos and Petro-China.
> 
> And there's at least one further company that trades in the feedstock (a refinery's input) and output. That's in Switzerland, and it's called Ineos Europe A.G. Or more accurately, that activity has been in Switzerland, but it's come back to the UK.


----------



## teqniq (Oct 23, 2013)

Corporate scum behaving, like... corporate scum


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 23, 2013)

treelover said:


> Is there a possibility?, it would be seen very as a very positive move by the public and workers and surely help the SNP(differentiate them) and a yes vote.
> 
> even a game changer?


OK, because energy is a reserved matter (ie was a power Westminster kept), Holyrood can't nationalise Grangemouth under devolution.  So it would need to be another promise to nationalise upon a Yes vote.

Scottish cabinet is currently having emergency meeting to discuss Grangemouth. No word of whether public ownership is on the table.  Given that Westminster will not nationalise under the coalition (unless it's a bank), then a buyer has to be found long before the referendum next year.  It therefore seems to me unlikely that Salmond will make noises about public ownership.

(On a side issue, the pronunciation of Falkirk on the BBC has been incorrect.  It's Faw-kirk, not Fall-kirk).


----------



## butchersapron (Oct 23, 2013)

danny la rouge said:


> OK, because energy is a reserved matter (ie was a power Westminster kept), Holyrood can't nationalise Grangemouth under devolution.  So it would need to be another promise to nationalise upon a Yes vote.
> 
> Scottish cabinet is currently having emergency meeting to discuss Grangemouth. No word of whether public ownership is on the table.  Given that Westminster will not nationalise under the coalition (unless it's a bank), then a buyer has to be found long before the referendum next year.  It therefore seems to me unlikely that Salmond will make noises about public ownership.
> 
> (On a side issue, the pronunciation of Falkirk on the BBC has been incorrect.  It's Faw-kirk, not Fall-kirk).


He's been repeating a basic message -  alternative owners, and that he is trying to facilitate it. Not even the merest hint of public ownership.


----------



## 8ball (Oct 23, 2013)

Will be interesting to see what action the US Govt take if Scotland goes independent and starts nationalising stuff and doing all manner of socialist things.  Expect missile bases sited in Carlisle...


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 23, 2013)

butchersapron said:


> He's been repeating a basic message -  alternative owners, and that he is trying to facilitate it. Not even the merest hint of public ownership.


Indeed.


----------



## J Ed (Oct 23, 2013)

8ball said:


> Will be interesting to see what action the US Govt take if Scotland goes independent and starts nationalising stuff and doing all manner of socialist things.  Expect missile bases sited in Carlisle...



As much as that sounds great, it isn't going to happen. Salmond is mates with Murdoch, remember? No doubt an independent Scotland would have a slightly gentler neoliberalism than our own but a democratic socialist idyll it won't be.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 23, 2013)

8ball said:


> Will be interesting to see what action the US Govt take if Scotland goes independent and starts nationalising stuff and doing all manner of socialist things.  Expect missile bases sited in Carlisle...



it won't


----------



## 8ball (Oct 23, 2013)

J Ed said:


> As much as that sounds great, it isn't going to happen. Salmond is mates with Murdoch, remember? No doubt an independent Scotland would have a slightly gentler neoliberalism than our own but a democratic socialist idyll it won't be.


 
Yeah, I know the reality of the situation (which makes independence a remote possibility in the first place) - was just daydreaming, really.


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 23, 2013)

frogwoman said:


> it won't


To which part of that was that a reply?

_Will be interesting_

Or

_what action the US Govt take_

Or

_if Scotland goes independent_

Or

_starts nationalising stuff_

Or

_doing all manner of socialist things

_


----------



## Tankus (Oct 23, 2013)

Can't be important, as there's only around 30 MPs currently debating it...!


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 23, 2013)

Tankus said:


> Can't be important, as there's only around 30 MPs currently debating it...!


Can anyone name the ones who left?

I see Eric Joyce is continuing his beef with Unite (he's the Falkirk MP).  Mind you, Unite did fail to defend the subcontractors who have already been let go.


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 23, 2013)

Here's Wings Over Scotland on Grangemouth: http://wingsoverscotland.com/grangemouth-the-facts-as-known/

(Who is WOS? It's "Rev. Stuart Campbell, a Liberal Democrat voter at every election for the last 22 years but now non-aligned". http://wingsoverscotland.com/about/ ).


----------



## weepiper (Oct 23, 2013)

Grangemouth supposedly making a £50m a year loss, yet this was released today

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-24635281

Something doesn't match up.


----------



## butchersapron (Oct 23, 2013)

And £50 million doesn't add up with many other things  - bith from the owners who have made various other claims in public, in company accounts etc and stuff the union has uncovered. Lots of pointers in the WoS link danny posted.


----------



## Serotonin (Oct 23, 2013)

I've just realised that this Grangemouth thing has its start in the suspension of that Unite rep who was accused of vote rigging by organising Unite members to join the Labour party in Falkirk. Am I being tinfoily or does this all feel deeply fucking suspcious to anyone else?

Happy to be told Im barking up the wrong tree.


----------



## weepiper (Oct 23, 2013)

Serotonin said:


> I've just realised that this Grangemouth thing has its start in the suspension of that Unite rep who was accused of vote rigging by organising Unite members to join the Labour party in Falkirk. Am I being tinfoily or does this all feel deeply fucking suspcious to anyone else?
> 
> Happy to be told Im barking up the wrong tree.



They tried to provoke a strike with that, then when Unite backed down from striking they've tacked on this profitability/competitiveness bollocks. They wanted to shut the plant all along, they've just been trying to find an excuse the public will swallow.

Or rather they wanted to threaten to shut it in the hope of getting a massive financial 'bailout' from the government to keep it open


----------



## weepiper (Oct 23, 2013)

Edinburgh Evening News's cartoonist


----------



## weepiper (Oct 23, 2013)

dp


----------



## ddraig (Oct 23, 2013)

great divide and rule piece to camera with a worker going on about how "we've all had to take a hit in the last few years" and all us subbies will be out of work just because they won't take a hit on their pension


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 23, 2013)

http://www.opendemocracy.net/ourkin...happening-at-grangemouth-and-what-it-tells-us


----------



## treelover (Oct 24, 2013)

Nice gaff he has...


----------



## danny la rouge (Oct 24, 2013)

Mr.Bishie said:


> http://www.opendemocracy.net/ourkin...happening-at-grangemouth-and-what-it-tells-us



Disagree with some of that (especially saying that a course of action the SNP isn't going to take is a "sign of the SNP shifting away from the free-market orthodoxy of British politics". Eh?  You what?), but worth a read.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 24, 2013)

Jimmy Reid will be turning in his grave.


----------



## treelover (Oct 24, 2013)

Maybe Salmon can do a deal with Gazprom, etc, that would put the cats amongst the Westminister pigeons...


----------



## Lo Siento. (Oct 24, 2013)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Jimmy Reid will be turning in his grave.


Only if he'd died in 1972.


----------



## weepiper (Oct 25, 2013)

So Ineos has basically bullied an entire country through its workforce. They've had to agree not to strike for the next THREE YEARS as well as accept the pension changes, pay freeze etc. Bend over and take it or we'll sack you and fuck your entire town (oh and by the way we'll just threaten the infrastructure for the whole north of the UK, just because we can)


----------



## J Ed (Oct 25, 2013)

weepiper said:


> So Ineos has basically bullied an entire country through its workforce. They've had to agree not to strike for the next THREE YEARS as well as accept the pension changes, pay freeze etc. Bend over and take it or we'll sack you and fuck your entire town (oh and by the way we'll just threaten the infrastructure for the whole north of the UK, just because we can)



People should start calling this what it is - terrorism


----------



## butchersapron (Oct 25, 2013)

J Ed said:


> People should start calling this what it is - terrorism


Extra-parliamentary action - by capital. Unrestricted wildcat strike action - by capital.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 25, 2013)

weepiper said:


> So Ineos has basically bullied an entire country through its workforce. They've had to agree not to strike for the next THREE YEARS as well as accept the pension changes, pay freeze etc. Bend over and take it or we'll sack you and fuck your entire town (oh and by the way we'll just threaten the infrastructure for the whole north of the UK, just because we can)



Absolutely fucking shocking.


----------



## Red Storm (Oct 25, 2013)

http://www.economist.com/blogs/blighty/2013/10/grangemouth-dispute?fsrc=scn/fb/wl/bl/backtofuture

Usual _Economist_ capitalist drum beating but there are some good pieces of info.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 25, 2013)

I see Ratcliffe's told the BBC that he sees a long future for Grangemouth now. I wonder if the cunt'll start paying corp tax now then?


----------



## Fedayn (Oct 25, 2013)

Mr.Bishie said:


> I see Ratcliffe's told the BBC that he sees a long future for Grangemouth now. I wonder if the cunt'll start paying corp tax now then?



Why would he? He's effectively been given carte-blanche by Westminster and UNITE to carry on as is.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 25, 2013)

I know, I know. The fucking bastard.


----------



## nino_savatte (Oct 26, 2013)

When I saw that cunt Ratcliffe on telly last night channelling a false memory of the 70s, I wanted to kick the fucking screen in.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 26, 2013)

nino_savatte said:


> When I saw that cunt Ratcliffe on telly last night channelling a false memory of the 70s, I wanted to kick the fucking screen in.



You weren't alone!


----------



## equationgirl (Oct 28, 2013)

*bump*

Don't know if people have seen this: Deans has resigned from his job at Grangemouth

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-24716429


----------



## equationgirl (Oct 28, 2013)

And the £300m investment is to build a shale gas terminal for imported US shale gas. Not really connected with the petrochem side of the business.


----------



## belboid (Oct 30, 2013)

so...

FBU - off
CWU - off
PCS - off
NUT - off

there's only the HE workers strike left


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 30, 2013)

ffs


----------



## nino_savatte (Oct 30, 2013)

UCU, Unite and UNISON are on strike tomorrow at my uni.


----------



## treelover (Oct 30, 2013)

Bad news, the DM has a front page on 'Union Bullies' relating to the Grangemouth dispute(no link)


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ur-reopen-Unite-union-vote-rigging-probe.html

and Jack Straw has called for labour to re-open the Falkirk 'vote rigging' enquiry


----------



## J Ed (Oct 31, 2013)

Labour and Tory students shaking hands against the HE strike  https://twitter.com/occupy_sussex/status/395601112264228865/photo/1


----------



## ddraig (Oct 31, 2013)

tossers!


----------



## Tankus (Nov 13, 2013)

Heh ......legs ...eh?




> This is what lies at the heart of Ed Miliband’s reluctance to reopen the Falkirk inquiry. Back in July he had said: “I am here to talk about a different politics, a politics that is open.  Transparent.  And trusted.  Exactly the opposite of the politics we’ve recently seen in Falkirk.  A politics that was closed.  A politics of the machine.  A politics that is rightly hated.  What we saw in Falkirk is part of the death throes of the old politics.”
> But all the time his office had been supporting a deal with Len McCluskey to enable him to rig the selection. And the price of that deal was a couple of hundred direct debits.
> In retrospect, it’s no wonder Len McCluskey hit the roof when Labour announced that investigation. Or insisted no rules had been broken. He’d struck a deal with the Labour leadership about waving his new “paper members” through. And suddenly he found himself being attacked for it.
> Ed Miliband did not tackle the machine politics of Falkirk thoroughly. Or swiftly. Instead, he connived in it. Those of us who have been perplexed at his actions over the past fortnight now have ougain r answer.


http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/d...t-allowed-unite-to-rig-the-falkirk-selection/
.. time for the rozzers to give it another look see perhaps.

Just won't die a death will it!


----------



## Delroy Booth (Nov 13, 2013)

Tankus said:


> Heh ......legs ...eh?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You can't kill what was never alive. This Falkirk "scandal" is absolutely fuck all they're desperate for it to stick but so far no-one really gives a shit.

Some evidence from the comments

"Exactly. If your reading these comments Dan can you get in contact with your friends at the BBC and ask why this Isn't being covered, it should be all over the news like the Ralph Miliband story.. the British public have probably switched off from this,"

"Perhaps if the BBC were told that it was related to climate change they would run the story automatically."

"It's not only the BBC who are reluctant to cover this scandal; ITV and Sky seem equally shy on the matter too. I think we have almost reached the bottom of the pond with regard to political integrity, when our major broadcasters are reluctant (or afraid) to report potential vote rigging as a crime against democracy, but prefer stand back and regard it as a misdemeanour."

"The BBC will be dancing to McCluskey's orders, just like the rest of Labour."

"At least you have the courage to print this. No Scottish paper would touch this with a barge pole."

I still can't fully work out what's meant to have been done, how it broke rules, all the rest of it. Fucking hell this Falkirk selection is fuck all compared to some of the shit that goes on in all the major parties on a day-to-day basis.


----------



## nino_savatte (Nov 14, 2013)

Third day of this strike at Vinney Green.
http://union-news.co.uk/2013/11/get...action/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


----------



## teqniq (Nov 18, 2013)

UK: Support Mitie (First Great Western Contract) Workers



> RMT members working for the contractor Mitie at First Great Western have taken 5 days of strike action as a result of a derisory pay offer from a company that can easily afford to pay it workers properly. As well as a below inflation offer they also rejected the union's claim for sick pay and travel facilities in line with the First Great Western rates, shift and weekend rates, overtime and bank holiday rates and an end to zero hour contracts....


----------



## nino_savatte (Nov 22, 2013)

UCU are out on strike on 3 December. I expect Unite to also join the pickets.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 22, 2013)

nino_savatte said:


> UCU are out on strike on 3 December. I expect Unite to also join the pickets.


Got an email that UNISON are joining too.


----------



## nino_savatte (Nov 23, 2013)

Lord Camomile said:


> Got an email that UNISON are joining too.


I figured UNISON would also be onboard.


----------



## Citizen66 (Dec 18, 2013)

RMT announce industrial action for wednesday 25th dec at 7am through to thursday 26th dec at 1am. 

Talks are ongoing regarding the casualisation of staff dispute, the rmt applied for an extention (of the allowed period between ballot and strike) into the new year in case talks break down which lul refused hence this action called for the most unlikely of days (no tubes running).


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Dec 24, 2013)

> Thousands of police civilian staff in London – including 999 call handlers – are set to strike on New Year's Eve, the PCS union has said.
> 
> The planned strike in the capital would coincide with a walkout by London firefighters and could result in around 7,500 civilian workers taking action on one of the busiest days of the year.



http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/dec/24/police-staff-strike-london-new-years-eve?CMP=twt_gu


----------



## brogdale (Dec 24, 2013)

> 7.19pm GMT
> 
> Kent Police have declared a major incident for the ongoing flooding and spate conditions affecting Kent. 1/2 http://t.co/hCbF4uIvZy
> 
> ...


----------



## ddraig (Dec 24, 2013)

those uncaring union MONSTERS leaving us all in trouble! at CHRISTMAS! oh wait...
Big up the FBU


----------



## Citizen66 (Jan 10, 2014)

Tube Union RMT confirmed today that a ballot of members across London Underground in a dispute over jobs, services and safety has recorded a massive vote for both strike action and action short of a strike.In the “Every Job Matters” dispute, RMT members have voted by 77% for strike action and by an even bigger majority for action short of a strike. The results will now be considered by a meeting of the union’s executive.

http://www.rmt.org.uk/news/massive-...ty/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Game on.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jan 10, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Tube Union RMT confirmed today that a ballot of members across London Underground in a dispute over jobs, services and safety has recorded a massive vote for both strike action and action short of a strike.In the “Every Job Matters” dispute, RMT members have voted by 77% for strike action and by an even bigger majority for action short of a strike. The results will now be considered by a meeting of the union’s executive.
> 
> http://www.rmt.org.uk/news/massive-...ty/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
> 
> Game on.


Or, as the BBC and the tories would say, 23% of people didn't vote.


----------



## Citizen66 (Jan 10, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:
			
		

> Or, as the BBC and the tories would say, 23% of people didn't vote.



Actually 23% voted no. A bigger percentage probably didn't vote. Crow addresses that at the end of the article.


----------



## Citizen66 (Jan 10, 2014)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-25684670#TWEET1009425


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jan 11, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Actually 23% voted no. A bigger percentage probably didn't vote. Crow addresses that at the end of the article.


Yes, I meant to say 'didn't vote for it'.

That seems to be how things are reported these days. like the recent '30% of doctors are in favour of charging foreigners for health care', the truth is distorted: 2/3 were _not _in support. So the BBC will report this as 23% of workers don't want to disrupt things by striking.


----------



## J Ed (Jan 18, 2014)

This article http://inthesetimes.com/article/16122/amazon_warehouse_organizing/ is interesting, details attempts at organising and Amazon's anti-union tactics in the US.


----------



## belboid (Feb 4, 2014)

equationgirl said:


> *bump*
> 
> Don't know if people have seen this: Deans has resigned from his job at Grangemouth
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-24716429


and now INEOS have sacked Mark Lyon, Unite vice chair, for the heinous crime of 'not stopping the union from commenting over fears of job losses'
http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/i...uth-convenor-sacking-in-a-mockery-of-justice/


----------



## equationgirl (Feb 4, 2014)

belboid said:


> and now INEOS have sacked Mark Lyon, Unite vice chair, for the heinous crime of 'not stopping the union from commenting over fears of job losses'
> http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/i...uth-convenor-sacking-in-a-mockery-of-justice/


Just saw the BBC article on that. Unite are launching legal action on his behalf.


----------



## MellySingsDoom (Feb 5, 2014)

...solidarity with the Tube drivers for today (and yesterday) up till Friday morning.  That is all.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Feb 5, 2014)

Fuck you Boris! Up the workers!


----------



## brogdale (Feb 5, 2014)

Anyone else see Michael Crick's vox pop at Morden tube on C4 news last night? T'was brilliant...much solidarity from the locals.


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 5, 2014)

Just heard on the news on Radio 4 that the government "is considering making the London Underground an essential service, which would forbid the unions from taking strike action". Is it me or does this government say the same thing every time there's a Tube strike? If they declared the Tube an "essential service", then they'd have to do the same with trains and buses. 

Fucking inept load of authoritarian shitbags.


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 5, 2014)

UCU, Unison and Unite are all out on strike tomorrow. I just had an email from the 'Director of Student Life' (what a fucking moronic title) that tells me that "you should still wipe in" and that "the libraries will be open". It also claims that "most lectures will take place". Lying cunts.


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 5, 2014)

Harry Mount (no doubt pronounced "mynt"), cousin of Dippy Dave writes:


> *A strike-busting Routemaster – a sight to gladden the heart *
> The streets of London are full this morning with hard-working people desperate to get to the office, despite the best intentions of 1970s dinosaur, Bob Crow. While he and his Tube strikers stick the kettle on and enjoy a few more hours in bed, thousands of commuters have to put up with the misery of streets clogged with stationary traffic.
> 
> But, still, those commuters battle to work – walking, climbing on Boris bikes and taking advantage of extra strike-busting buses. Among them are lots of Routemasters brought back into service – not just the red ones, but the glorious green ones, too. In all the frustration brought on by the strike, it's a double pleasure – to see those beautiful vehicles and to think they might drive Crow nuts every time he catches sight of one.
> http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/cultur...ing-routemaster-a-sight-to-gladden-the-heart/



Idiot. The Telegraph's solitary Routemaster isn't "breaking the strike" at all. In fact, if anything, it's contributing to the traffic jams above ground. 

Mount (pronounced 'cunt') has had most expensive education that money can buy and he still doesn't understand that in order to break a tube strike, you'd have to have an army of scabs running the trains.


----------



## frogwoman (Feb 5, 2014)

It doesn't "gladden the heart" at all


----------



## marty21 (Feb 5, 2014)

I did see a green routemaster today in Camden Town, did make me smile tbf


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 5, 2014)

frogwoman said:


> It doesn't "gladden the heart" at all


You have to forgive Harry, he gets excited by the smallest things.


----------



## teqniq (Feb 5, 2014)

Forgive a Tory hack? Pourquoi?


----------



## Cornetto (Feb 5, 2014)

I'm out tomorrow, I doubt we will get 10 minutes coverage in HE


----------



## friedaweed (Feb 5, 2014)




----------



## weepiper (Feb 5, 2014)

Stick the kettle on and enjoy a few more hours in bed? My only direct experience of striking workers is Fed being a PCS rep, and when they're on strike he's up at 6am to go and stand on a picket.


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 6, 2014)

Cornetto said:


> I'm out tomorrow, I doubt we will get 10 minutes coverage in HE


They rarely cover HE or FE strikes. Schools, yes but rarely universities or colleges.


----------



## oryx (Feb 6, 2014)

anyone else listening to Vanessa feltz (i know!) on BBC London? Lots of support for bob crow & the strikers and pointing out how applying for your own job is just a way of getting rid of people!


----------



## Barking_Mad (Feb 6, 2014)

I'm not in a union but I refuse to cross a picket so I've taken a day holiday (again) to support striking uni staff. Shame there's so many scabs, including all support staff in my department, many of whom are in a union!


----------



## Hellsbells (Feb 6, 2014)

oryx said:


> anyone else listening to Vanessa feltz (i know!) on BBC London? Lots of support for bob crow & the strikers and pointing out how applying for your own job is just a way of getting rid of people!



I heard the bit earlier on when Bob Crow got really pissed off with Vanessa and said she should release a solo record because she likes the sound of her own voice so much as she kept constantly interrupting and talking over him 
And then 2 minutes later, another caller (probably one of her mates) rang up and said he was outraged at how Bob had spoken to poor Vanessa and that his whole opinion on the strike had now changed.


----------



## oryx (Feb 6, 2014)

Hellsbells said:


> I heard the bit earlier on when Bob Crow got really pissed off with Vanessa and said she should release a solo record because she likes the sound of her own voice so much as she kept constantly interrupting and talking over him
> And then 2 minutes later, another caller (probably one of her mates) rang up and said he was outraged at how Bob had spoken to poor Vanessa and that his whole opinion on the strike had now changed.


The one who kept referring to 'Bob Fox'?


----------



## Hellsbells (Feb 6, 2014)

oryx said:


> The one who kept referring to 'Bob Fox'?


yeah


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 7, 2014)

Last night on Question Time, Starkers referred to Bob Crow as 'Bill Crow'.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Feb 7, 2014)

> NUT members are to strike on March 26th, with NASUWT members deciding next week whether or not to join them.
> 
> http://union-news.co.uk/2014/02/bre...e-date/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


----------



## gawkrodger (Feb 8, 2014)

hmmm


----------



## Citizen66 (Feb 8, 2014)

Yeah, that's the conditions imposed on Mark Harding, a rep who got arrested on a picket line. A rep getting arrested or sacked on trumped up charges seems to happen on every strike.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Feb 8, 2014)

Bail conditions seem to be getting more and more abusive - they're routinely used now to prevent people taking entirely legal actions, in situations where it's very unlikely there'd be any real case anyway.


----------



## free spirit (Feb 8, 2014)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Bail conditions seem to be getting more and more abusive - they're routinely used now to prevent people taking entirely legal actions, in situations where it's very unlikely there'd be any real case anyway.


and consequently are usually illegal.

I'm assuming these are police bail conditions rather than court imposed?


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 9, 2014)

MellySingsDoom said:


> ...solidarity with the Tube drivers for today (and yesterday) up till Friday morning.  That is all.



On my arrival at Paddington around 9:45 pm on Thursday evening, I could very easily have become pissed off.  

After all, I could have been _very personally inconvenienced_ by the strike at that point, and could have moaned like a TORY. If I'd ever been a TORY.

Instead, I went to a new pub, new to me anyhow, very near Paddington, for a good long while. Then I got a bus, long after the traffic had became quieter.

All round win!


----------



## friedaweed (Feb 10, 2014)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26127641


> *Fulham v Liverpool in doubt due to London Underground strike*



Pack it in now yer cockeney cunts hey


Media spin anyone


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Feb 11, 2014)

*checks for QPR home games that might be cancelled*

*finds none*


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 11, 2014)

Tristram Hunt crossed the picket line last week at QMU. Is anyone surprised?


> “I’m not a UCU member,” was apparently Hunt’s excuse as he made his way across the picket line, past members of the University and College Union — a line that hasn’t washed with the Morning Star who today brand the dapper politician a “scab” for his behaviour. Some of his colleagues at Queen Mary — where Hunt teaches two courses — aren’t happy either. “He chooses to cross the picket line. It speaks volumes,” one lecturer told the Morning Star.
> http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...d-a-scab-for-his-marxist-lecture-9121174.html



He was there to deliver a lecture on Marx and Engels.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 11, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> Tristram Hunt crossed the picket line last week at QMU. Is anyone surprised?
> 
> 
> He was there to deliver a lecture on Marx and Engels.



Of such ironies are party politicians made.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 11, 2014)

Email from one of our library managers:


> Just to let you know that the tube strike is off - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-26130165. Thanks for all your efforts to get in last week, which meant we were able to keep all our libraries open as usual.


"Open as usual" despite the tube strikes _and_ your own unions striking


----------



## nino_savatte (Feb 11, 2014)

Lord Camomile said:


> Email from one of our library managers:
> "Open as usual" despite the tube strikes _and_ your own unions striking


Jesus H Christ!


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 11, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> Jesus H Christ!


I know...

We're not a very unionised team, and probably for the majority of those that are it's just a token gesture; I get the feeling they probably look on it like like insurance, something to protect themselves should they need it, rather than an ideological decision.

I should do more to try and unionise the place really, but I partly don't know where to start and partly worry about alienating myself in the office, and from people I do consider friends, for not much hope of changing things. I know that shouldn't really stop me, but the force is weak in this one


----------



## existentialist (Feb 11, 2014)

I'm going to be faced with a real moral dilemma if my union calls us out on strike. Before I was a member, I'd just take the day off, as it usually meant there would be no clients for me to see anyway. But that would feel like a copout now I'm a member, and if a strike situation arose where schools were open, I'd have to balance my ethical position regarding my clients with the moral one of supporting my colleagues in the union. 

I expect I'll be inviting Urban to help me with that, should the situation arise...


----------



## dennisr (Feb 11, 2014)

So - the RMT now have negotiations - that took a 2 day strike:

"ACAS talks reach agreement on LU strike - all action suspended. We achieved what we set out to do - which is enter into negotiations - I am so proud of RMT membership who were steadfast and resolute. We now have two months to put forward proposals and enter into meaningful talks over the future of jobs on the Underground. Respect to our negotiating team and thanks to public support!"

http://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-suspends-action-in-tube-jobs-and-cuts-dispute


----------



## Citizen66 (Feb 11, 2014)

TFL/LU always let the strike go ahead, much to the inconvenience of passengers, to check if it's solid or not. Then end up getting round the table like the union requested from the outset.


----------



## treelover (Mar 13, 2014)

> *Ministers accused of contempt for NHS with fresh squeeze on public sector pay*
> Hundreds of thousands of NHS staff get lower-than-expected rise as government rejects pay review bodies' recommendations
> http://www.theguardian.com/society/...t-squeeze-public-sector-pay-nhs?commentpage=1



NHS workers to receive one percent pay rise again with many thousands getting nothing, 70% of nurses will get nowt, they can't take this on the chin, can they?


----------



## treelover (Mar 13, 2014)

I wonder if they are trying to provoke a strike in the lead up/just before the G/E?


----------



## Balbi (Mar 13, 2014)

Teaching Unions are going to keep slugging against Gove, but as I pointed out in the Crow RIP thread, the division of teachers between the unions makes a solid strike nigh on impossible.


----------



## treelover (Mar 13, 2014)

Just been reading Union Tops responses, only GMB seem to be calling for a ballot.


----------



## belboid (Mar 13, 2014)

GMB & Unite are holding pre-ballot consultations, Unison seem to be dragging their feet.  Surprise, surprise.


----------



## Pickman's model (Mar 13, 2014)

treelover said:


> I wonder if they are trying to provoke a strike in the lead up/just before the G/E?


i think it unlikely the general election has any bearing on it given they've been provoking strikes for years now.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Mar 19, 2014)

treelover said:


> I wonder if they are trying to provoke a strike in the lead up/just before the G/E?


I doubt that these days a big strike would work in the government's favour.  Britain was basically strike free under the last Labour government. This lot managing to provoke one would make them look pretty bad


----------



## dolly's gal (Apr 22, 2014)

so i see via an email from TFL that the RMT are proposing tube strikes for next week and the following week, having called off a second round of strikes in February. my question is this: why didn't they go ahead with the second round earlier this year, instead of delaying the inevitable?


----------



## ddraig (Apr 22, 2014)

i imagine because they are reasonable so give management the chance to sowt it ahhht


----------



## Pickman's model (Apr 22, 2014)

i'll have to get up earlier next week then to avoid the deluge of confused tube travellers on the buses.


----------



## dolly's gal (Apr 22, 2014)

ddraig said:


> i imagine because they are reasonable so give management the chance to sowt it ahhht



yeh but they do this every time. and then nothing gets sorted. and then they're striking again. they should have capitalised on the momentum of the last lot and stuck to their guns for a second round in feb


----------



## ddraig (Apr 22, 2014)

probably
but they would have been slated for not giving management the "chance" to come to a "compromise"
or something


----------



## dolly's gal (Apr 22, 2014)

ddraig said:


> probably
> but they would have been slated for not giving management the "chance" to come to a "compromise"
> or something



what's that Einstein quote about the definition of stupidity?


----------



## ddraig (Apr 22, 2014)

don't underestimate the stupidity of the general public?? 
prob not that one


----------



## dolly's gal (Apr 22, 2014)

ddraig said:


> don't underestimate the stupidity of the general public??
> prob not that one



nah the doing the same thing and expecting different results one. i guess i'm suggesting that maybe they should review their tactics


----------



## Pickman's model (Apr 22, 2014)

does anyone know if unison are out again this year?


----------



## dolly's gal (Apr 22, 2014)

out where? for May Day? i imagine so, any excuse to spunk loads of their members subs on purple banners/balloons/ etc.


----------



## Pickman's model (Apr 22, 2014)

dolly's gal said:


> out where? for May Day? i imagine so, any excuse to spunk loads of their members subs on purple banners/balloons/ etc.


i meant on strike 

those purple pens don't get handed round to us that often.


----------



## dolly's gal (Apr 22, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> i meant on strike
> 
> those purple pens don't get handed round to us that often.



i kid you not, some anti cuts march i went on, there were two unison people in purple, unison branded gimp suits!  amazing


----------



## Citizen66 (Apr 22, 2014)

dolly's gal said:


> yeh but they do this every time. and then nothing gets sorted. and then they're striking again. they should have capitalised on the momentum of the last lot and stuck to their guns for a second round in feb



But if the company offers a 'review' it makes the union look unreasonable if they plough ahead with strike action regardless. But yeah, you're right.


----------



## ddraig (Apr 22, 2014)

dolly's gal said:


> i kid you not, some anti cuts march i went on, there were two unison people in purple, unison branded gimp suits!  amazing


and those big balloons cost nearly a grand iirc


----------



## danny la rouge (Apr 28, 2014)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-27181215
London Underground Tube strike set to begin later

BBC again not declaring its interest.  It is a CBI member.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 28, 2014)

Glad they have (yet anyway) not backed down.


----------



## treelover (Apr 28, 2014)

danny la rouge said:


> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-27181215
> London Underground Tube strike set to begin later
> 
> *BBC again not declaring its interest.  It is a CBI member*.




That's revealing, didn't know that, do they have votes, etc?


----------



## danny la rouge (Apr 28, 2014)

treelover said:


> That's revealing, didn't know that, do they have votes, etc?



It's not clear.  They are being very coy.  They say they will suspend membership beginning on 30th May for the duration of independence referendum campaign (CBI has declared opposition to independence), but clearly that is not the only issue CBI takes a view on.  Including infrastructure, public services, and industrial relations.


----------



## treelover (Apr 28, 2014)

Great spot, it could changes some people's views on the BBC and its coveted 'independence

once upon a time more academics uncovered things like this.


----------



## danny la rouge (Apr 28, 2014)

treelover said:


> Great spot, it could changes some people's views on the BBC and its coveted 'independence
> 
> once upon a time more academics uncovered things like this.


It's huge.  EG. Look at the BBC's coverage of pensions, where they said  "everyone knew" "old style" pensions were "unaffordable".  Were they a CBI member at the time?


----------



## treelover (Apr 28, 2014)

Are ITV and CH4 also members of the CBI?


----------



## danny la rouge (Apr 28, 2014)

treelover said:


> Are ITV and CH4 also members of the CBI/



ITV are, don't know about C4.  STV has quit over independence referendum, but ITV has declined to.


----------



## scifisam (Apr 28, 2014)

I don't think I've seen such one-sided coverage of strikes since the eighties. Last strike I mentioned to colleagues that the "guaranteed jobs" meant a reduction from a wage of £33k, to £23k, with fewer rights. They'd never heard of that before. Their jaws literally dropped. Not to the floor, obviously.

These were people who were struggling to get a mortgage or even pay their rent, but they could still appreciate the enormous shortfall. TFL should play on that more. They should quote figures more.


----------



## treelover (Apr 28, 2014)

" TFL should play on that more. They should quote figures more."


You mean the RMT?


----------



## articul8 (Apr 29, 2014)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...s-for-sign-banning-rmt-customers-9301392.html


----------



## danny la rouge (Apr 29, 2014)

treelover said:


> Are ITV and CH4 also members of the CBI?


It's emerging the BBC has been a member of CBI since at least 1980.  This is massive.

Membership costs £22,191.94 per year.


----------



## danny la rouge (Apr 29, 2014)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-27207426


----------



## Lo Siento. (Jun 6, 2014)

Strikes a-go-go today.

1) Lambeth College (UCU and Unison) are striking against some truly heinous management shit, where their old contracts get ripped up, and their new ones include a cut of 2 weeks to their holidays, more work for no extra pay and worse sick pay. Details They're on indefinite strike, so need funds, you can send donations here. If you're skint you can sign their petition here.

2) The University of London cleaners (IWGB) are on a 5-day strike against 60+ redundancies whilst the university renovates their halls. Disgustingly management are insisting that Sharon Bracey, Cleaning Services Manager, Unison rep and virtually sole Unison member be allowed to choose which of the IWGB union activists she wants to victimise. You can see details of their campaign here and donate to their strike fund here.

3) The dockers at Tilbury (Unite) are on strike for 11 days in protest at the introduction of Zero Hours Contracts. Details here. No strike fund as far as I know, but still reintroducing the "tap on the shoulder" on the docks is fucking nasty shit on the part of the bosses.

4) One Housing workers (Unite) are on strike for four days against the victimisation of their union convenor. He's been suspended and workers reckon it's because he led 11 days of strike action last year.

5) Ritzy staff are on another 1-day strike today for the London Living Wage, which miserly multi-national Cineworld claim they can't afford. Campaign here.

Elsewhere, you've got NHS confed (GMB, Unite, Unison) members protesting the 1% offer for public sector workers and Hackney College staff (UCU) will be demonstrating against funding cuts on Saturday 

Appeal to all, if you're about, go to demos, if you can, make donations, if you're not about and skint, like facebook pages and sign petitions. Whatever you can


----------



## krink (Jun 6, 2014)

Our GMB rep says July 10th possible token 1 day strike in public sector with unison and unite.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 6, 2014)

Unison are balloting now , just voted yes and sent the form back. The pay offer is derisory to say the least but most people I know are more worried about redundancies . However this could be one of those calms before the storm periods where members say what the fuck lets have a go?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jun 6, 2014)

krink said:


> Our GMB rep says July 10th possible token 1 day strike in public sector with unison and unite.



As a GMB rep I can confirm that. Ballot goes live (for us down here) next week. Unison, Unite & NUT to follow.

ALL OUT!


----------



## HST (Jun 6, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> As a GMB rep I can confirm that. Ballot goes live (for us down here) next week. Unison, Unite & NUT to follow.
> 
> ALL OUT!


PCS balloting next week - looking at 10 July.

Solidarity forever.


----------



## krink (Jun 7, 2014)

When we were talking about July 10th at work I found out that for the first time in years I wasn't the only person who wanted indefinite strike action. People were actually pissed off about the 1 day strike because they felt it wasn't enough.


----------



## Onket (Jun 7, 2014)

Our branches' turnout on the indicative ballot was poor.  I hope the turnout for the actual ballot is much better. 

As a steward/rep you can only do so much,  mainly because ballots go to home addresses.


----------



## krink (Jun 7, 2014)

years ago we did the voting at work. we used to go round with the box! much better turnout then


----------



## ddraig (Jun 7, 2014)

i would love to do that!


----------



## krink (Jun 7, 2014)

it's a big difference now - i worked at my current job 12 years or so, never been approached by any union reps.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Jun 7, 2014)

Just got back from the Hackney Community College demo, sounds like they're planning to strike soon against some management bullshit that's every bit as bad as what's happening at Lambeth College. The bosses have had £1.5m taken out of their budget, and trying to recover it by cutting classes (particularly ESOL) and bringing in mostly pointless but well-paying compulsory Job Centre courses (much of it including totally pointless ESOL short courses). The staff meanwhile face some redundancies and zero hour contracts (because the JC work is variable demand short courses).


----------



## J Ed (Jun 7, 2014)

krink said:


> years ago we did the voting at work. we used to go round with the box! much better turnout then



There is a reason they changed the law on this


----------



## Onket (Jun 7, 2014)

krink said:


> years ago we did the voting at work. we used to go round with the box! much better turnout then





ddraig said:


> i would love to do that!





J Ed said:


> There is a reason they changed the law on this



Can still do it for indicative ballots. We did it the one before this one, maybe 12 months or less ago.

Doesn't test your mailing systems or the quality of the data on your membership system though. Not ideal when it comes to the actual ballot and you find out things don't work.


----------



## krink (Jun 11, 2014)

Just had an email gone round the council saying no leave can be authorised for 10th July. Looks like the strike might be on!


----------



## comrade spurski (Jun 14, 2014)

was in Nalgo and then Unison until 2010 and in all that time I never got a call during a ballot asking me to vote yes ... am in unite and got both my ballot paper and a phone call today ... was really impressed they are taking it seriously


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jun 15, 2014)

> Is curbing strike action preparing the ground for battles to come?
> http://www.unionjunction.co.uk/uncategorized/curbing-strike-action-preparing-ground-battles-come/


----------



## krink (Jun 16, 2014)

got my gmb ballot today. hope the weather is nice


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jun 19, 2014)

Anyone in the RMT shed any more light on this - http://union-news.co.uk/2014/06/bosses-threaten-sack-hundreds-rmt-members-strike-today/  ?


----------



## treelover (Jun 23, 2014)

> *Coalition faces huge strike as biggest unions ballot council workers*
> Unison, GMB and Unite ballot hundreds of thousands of workers in England and Wales in protest at offer worth 1% for most staff
> 
> http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/22/coalition-huge-strike-unions-council-workers


----------



## treelover (Jun 23, 2014)

> Unison leader Dave Prentis said the action could be bigger than the 1926 general strike if workers voted for it.



If they voted for it.


----------



## leyton96 (Jun 23, 2014)

Unison Local government and schools support staff vote for strike action:
http://www.unison.org.uk/media-centre/local-government-workers-vote-for-strike-action


----------



## belboid (Jun 23, 2014)

only 85,000 votes tho, seems a desperately low turnout


----------



## leyton96 (Jun 23, 2014)

belboid said:


> only 85,000 votes tho, seems a desperately low turnout



Aye, it's not great. The whole union wasn't balloted though. I'd estimate around 600,000 were in the ballot so that's about 14% turn out, about similar to a local election turn out.
That said it shows that you can't keep on suppressing initiative from the base and then turn around and expect a response from the members when you need something done.


----------



## Onket (Jun 23, 2014)

I'm sure they just said 58% yes vote by Unison members on Channel 4 news.

58%! That's dire.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 24, 2014)

> *Council and school support workers vote to strike *
> 
> Local government and school support workers in England, Wales and Northern Ireland have voted to strike over pay, public service union Unison has said. The union said local government workers and school support staff had been subject to a three-year pay freeze and had had their pay reduced by 20% since the coalition came to power in 2010. An LGA spokesman said: "This strike will not change the pay offer we have made, but it will mean those who take part lose a day's pay."
> 
> _BBC News  Daily Express, Page: 2  Financial Times, Page: 4  Daily Mirror, Page: 14  Independent i, Page: 11  Yorkshire Post, Page: 4_


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 24, 2014)

Onket said:


> I'm sure they just said 58% yes vote by Unison members on Channel 4 news.
> 
> 58%! That's dire.


 
tbh its quite a suprise that it was that high.Most members have had three years of redundancies and restructuring so although I voted yes I thought the yes vote would be around 55% if that.


----------



## mwgdrwg (Jun 24, 2014)

Strike on the 10th of July then.

http://www.unison.org.uk/news/local-government-strike-date-sent-for-10-july


----------



## DotCommunist (Jun 24, 2014)

another 1 day set piece, still expect the press to go into full 'dead are unburied' mode


----------



## krink (Jun 24, 2014)

Although the turnout and yes votes are very low im hoping not too many will cross the lines; one day strikes may be a waste of time but its still more fun than being at work.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jun 24, 2014)

GMB ballot result on the 27th.

I'm hoping it's a massive percentage.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 24, 2014)

me too, will be out even tho on secondment and working from home!


----------



## Onket (Jun 24, 2014)

The39thStep said:


> tbh its quite a suprise that it was that high.Most members have had three years of redundancies and restructuring so although I voted yes I thought the yes vote would be around 55% if that.


I thought the turnout would be low but the 'yes' vote would be higher. Pessimism, followed by optimism, maybe.


----------



## eatmorecheese (Jun 24, 2014)

Yep, I'm out. Collecting a bunch of hardship claim forms tomorrow and attempting to strengthen resolve on our floor. Management being polite, but distant.


----------



## comrade spurski (Jun 24, 2014)

non of the teachers in my school were out in march...so will be interesting to see if they come out now if other unions do. I am a teaching assistant in unite so don't know our result yet...but will definitely be striking as I will join unison or gmb if unite don't strike.


----------



## leyton96 (Jun 25, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> another 1 day set piece, still expect the press to go into full 'dead are unburied' mode



I'd be the last one to defend the Unison leadership but I think they are genuinely looking at further two day strike action in September. They are perfectly well aware that one day won't cut it and more is necessary. 
It would be a mistake to see "the bureaucracy" as one bloc with a fixed purpose. In fact they're split like never before. For example the right wing in the North West (heavily influenced by the CP) have fallen out with the national leadership over the sell out of the pay campaign last year. They've now re-invented themselves as fighting militants particularly the regional secretary Kevin Nelson. If that name rings a few bells it's because in a previous life he was the arch witch-hunter when he was head of Unison's 'Democratic Services' (an Orwellian title if ever there was one, seen as the witch hunt was run out of that department!)
There is a layer in the bureaucracy that wants to deliver something for the membership on pay. To come away empty handed again would call the credibility of the union into question, meaning a drop in subs, meaning the appalling vista of some bureaucrats possibly having to get a job in the real world!

That's not to say they won't call off action in September if they think they can get away with it of course. However it's not as straightforward for them as simply call the members out for a one day jolly, declare victory and go home.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jun 27, 2014)

Just had a call from my branch sec, GMB voted in favour of strike action. A huge 73%! ALL OUT!!!


----------



## ddraig (Jun 27, 2014)

ta
good percentage that cameron/boris can suck the fuck up


----------



## marty21 (Jun 27, 2014)

Haven't seen the result of the Unison public sector ballot, are we out ? (Forgot to vote as well as ballot arrived just before I went on holiday and thought I'd have time to vote when I got back)


----------



## marty21 (Jun 27, 2014)

Oh we are out on the 10th - normally work from home on a Thursday so I will set up a picket line to prevent me going into the kitchen and switching on the laptop -  I'm assuming there is a march/rally in London so will attend that


----------



## ddraig (Jun 27, 2014)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-28060836


> Members of the GMB union will join a day of action that could see more than one million workers on strike in total.
> 
> The GMB said council and school workers voted by three to one to walk out on 10 July over a pay offer worth 1% to most.


----------



## treelover (Jun 27, 2014)

Is that more than the other occasions?


----------



## ddraig (Jun 27, 2014)

treelover said:


> Is that more than the other occasions?


i'm going to guess you mean turnouts
from 1st page of google search for "union strike ballot turnout"
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/ol...or-strikes-on-low-turn-outs-say-Tory-MPs.html

http://ampp3d.mirror.co.uk/2014/02/...w-turnout-he-should-look-at-his-own-election/

June 2011
http://news.sky.com/story/862314/do-the-unions-have-a-mandate-to-strike


> Announcing the results of its ballot, the PCS said 61.1% of its quarter of a million civil and public service members voted for a strike and 83.6% voted for other forms of industrial action.
> 
> But the turnout was only 32.4% - less than a third.
> 
> ...



http://commonslibraryblog.com/2014/02/11/low-turnout-in-strike-ballots/


----------



## comrade spurski (Jun 27, 2014)

Anyone know when unite will announce?


----------



## ddraig (Jun 30, 2014)

comrade spurski said:


> Anyone know when unite will announce?


also out, 68% for strike action 79% industrial action short of strike

http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/local-government-workers-to-strike-over-poverty-pay-on-10-july/


> *Local government workers to strike over ‘poverty pay’ on 10 July*
> 30 June 2014
> Local government employees, members of Unite, the country’s largest union, voted overwhelmingly today (Monday 30 June) against the ‘insulting’ one per cent pay offer.
> 
> ...


----------



## marty21 (Jun 30, 2014)

Volunteered for the Picket Line, 7 is a bit early though, said I'd be there by 9


----------



## Fedayn (Jun 30, 2014)

Looks like PCS will be out on July 10th too.....

http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/news_and_e...-strikes-after-yes-vote#.U7F_nHsC5w8.facebook

NEC to discuss coordinated strikes after yes vote
30 June 2014

Taking joint strike action with other unions on 10 July will be discussed by our NEC after a yes vote in our national ballot.
We held a consultative ballot asking members to back our 'We all need a pay rise campaign,' starting with a 1-day strike on 10 July.

We have sought central talks on our claim. We must force the government to end the pay cap, to succeed with our claim.

We have an existing industrial action mandate but our annual delegate conference in Brighton agreed to ask our members to vote 'yes' in a consultative ballot on our national campaign running from 12-30 June.

In the ballot, which closed today, 73.7% of those who took part backed the campaign. The turnout was 24% of those eligible to vote.

The national executive meets tomorrow (1 July) to discuss next steps.

We all need a pay rise 
Across the UK pay cuts have damaged the economy and caused real hardship for millions of people.

If pay had kept pace with inflation, average civil service pay would be £2,300 higher than it is now. But the government has announced that the pay cap will continue in 2014 and 2015 and possibly beyond.

Our members are facing the tightest living standards squeeze for nearly a century.

We have submitted a pay claim to the Cabinet Office, which seeks a:

£1,200 or 5% pay increase.

Find out more about our pay campaign.

#WeAllNeedAPayRise


----------



## Citizen66 (Jun 30, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Anyone in the RMT shed any more light on this - http://union-news.co.uk/2014/06/bosses-threaten-sack-hundreds-rmt-members-strike-today/  ?



I'm RMT but don't know much outside of LU. That's like what Ronald Raygun did with the the air traffic workers isn't it? No idea if it's legal or not.


----------



## treelover (Jun 30, 2014)

> GMB members serving school meals, cleaning streets, emptying bins, With other unions involved too, the 10 July looks like being the second biggest dispute ever with *up to 2 million workers on strike* says GMB. -
> 
> See more at: http://union-news.co.uk/2014/06/2m-...s-join-july-10th-strike/#sthash.LMNKkCIT.dpuf



That's a lot, is this hyperbole?


----------



## krink (Jul 1, 2014)

People at work already talking about working on strike day. They view the loss of a days wages as just not worth it. I don't think one day strike is of any use at all but I'm staying out.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 1, 2014)

confirmation from my branch sec 



> Even though you are on secondment your substantive post is still here.
> 
> You are entitled to be out on strike on this day, if you have any problems let me know and I will hopefully sort them for you.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 1, 2014)

krink said:


> People at work already talking about working on strike day. They view the loss of a days wages as just not worth it. I don't think one day strike is of any use at all but I'm staying out.



The fuckin scab cunts wouldn't turn their noses up at a pay rise.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 1, 2014)

yeah but you can't hassle people about such things as they have the right not to!  
oh and it makes you wrong when asking why won't they stand up when needed! I have had dirty looks, been told off and ignored on this in the past.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 1, 2014)

bring back closed shops


----------



## krink (Jul 1, 2014)

They are quite happy to take the money the union is getting them through equal pay claim but not willing to lose a day's pay. I used to argue about it but I ended up with a final written warning last time I stood up. Not worth the stress that caused me. There is nobody else who will speak up in our building.


----------



## mwgdrwg (Jul 1, 2014)

Last time there was a strike the IT bods that came in had to use the "basement door" and not the front entrance. I told them "You can't miss it, it's the one with SCAB written on it". They've not been too friendly with me since.


----------



## ddraig (Jul 1, 2014)

they do not like the truth being pointed out to them, scabs
"you can't use that word" boo fucking hoo


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 2, 2014)

marty21 said:


> Haven't seen the result of the Unison public sector ballot, are we out ? (Forgot to vote as well as ballot arrived just before I went on holiday and thought I'd have time to vote when I got back)





marty21 said:


> Oh we are out on the 10th - normally work from home on a Thursday so I will set up a picket line to prevent me going into the kitchen and switching on the laptop -  I'm assuming there is a march/rally in London so will attend that


Where are you getting that from? The Unison website has this, but don't think universities are covered by "local government and school support" 

Had no word from our branch, naturally.

edit: sorry, absolutely no reason "local government and school support" doesn't cover you, of course


----------



## ddraig (Jul 2, 2014)

FBU too!


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 7, 2014)

Just had an email that UCU are striking ("Although you are not obligated to do so in advance, it would be most helpful if you could inform your line manager if you are planning to strike"). Still no word from Unison


----------



## krink (Jul 7, 2014)

March and rally in Newcastle assembling at 11 at the civic centre afaik


----------



## treelover (Jul 7, 2014)

Tories are kiteflying 'banning' strikes that doesn't get an adequate number of votes, ie threshold,

never mind the votes the Tories get

on the Wright Stuff, not sure what paper


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 7, 2014)

For technical reasons  our branch of PCS aren't involved in Thursday's strike, although other parts of the union elsewhere will be.

festivaldeb's in Unison and will be OUT 

I'm fully in support anyway. There won't be any picket line for me to refuse to cross, but I'll have to think up what I can do in support short of actually being on strike.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 7, 2014)

William of Walworth said:


> For technical reasons  our branch of PCS aren't involved in Thursday's strike, although other parts of the union elsewhere will be.
> 
> festivaldeb's in Unison and will be OUT
> 
> I'm fully in support anyway. There won't be any picket line for me to refuse to cross, but I'll have to think up what I can do in support short of actually being on strike.


call in sick


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 7, 2014)

<Thinks that idea over ... >


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 7, 2014)

treelover said:


> Tories are kiteflying 'banning' strikes that doesn't get an adequate number of votes, ie threshold,
> 
> never mind the votes the Tories get
> 
> on the Wright Stuff, not sure what paper


Anything owned by Richard Desmond.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 7, 2014)

William of Walworth said:


> <Thinks that idea over ... >


how come i can't pm you?


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 7, 2014)

treelover said:


> Tories are kiteflying 'banning' strikes that doesn't get an adequate number of votes, ie threshold,
> 
> never mind the votes the Tories get
> 
> on the Wright Stuff, not sure what paper



Fuck 'em.
They ought to stop covering for child abusers.

By heck lad, remember them days of 'closed shops' and a show of hands. We should hang our heads in shame for rolling over.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 7, 2014)

Details of pickets in Brighton;

Kings House - Hove Town Hall - Bartholomew Square - Royal Pavilion - Hollingdean Depot - Stanmer Park, & by the wheel on the Seafront. Also lots of school pickets.



> There will be marches from various points in the City* starting promptly at 10.30am.*
> 
> *Marches will start from Hollingdean Depot in Upper Hollingdean Road and also from Hove Town Hall; both marches will meet in Victoria Gardens and then join up and proceed to The Level for a Rally and speeches which will start at 12pm.*


----------



## treelover (Jul 9, 2014)

> *One million public sector workers prepare for nationwide strike*
> More than 50 marches and rallies planned as union leaders say austerity policies are condemning workers to penury
> 
> http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jul/09/million-public-sector-workers-prepare-strike



Rather big isn't it?


----------



## FiFi (Jul 9, 2014)

My local Children's Centre staff are out on strike, while  we in the CPHVA (Unite) are not (yet!). 
I have told my team I'm not crossing a picket line so have postponed a team meeting

Funnily enough, no-one has complained


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 9, 2014)

treelover said:


> Rather big isn't it?



eh?

Up early tomorrow to set picket up!

ALL OUT!!!!


----------



## eatmorecheese (Jul 9, 2014)

I'll be outside Croydon Town Hall from 8am, Solidarity to all who stay out.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 9, 2014)

Looking forward to hearing whiny self employed wankers pollute the national consciousness via the bbc. Libertarian sparkies and truckers whining about teachers.


----------



## _angel_ (Jul 9, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Looking forward to hearing whiny self employed wankers pollute the national consciousness via the bbc. Libertarian sparkies and truckers whining about teachers.


Wtf is your problem with self employed people?
Fwiw they usually pick on some woman to moan about childcare, not often associated with lorry driving


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 9, 2014)

_angel_ said:


> Wtf is your problem with self employed people?


They smell and look at me funny.


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 9, 2014)

I'm self - employed, but I think tomorrow will be a "rest day" so I can be out in solidarity ........


----------



## _angel_ (Jul 9, 2014)

It's the sickening pretence politicians esp tory ones suddenly care about single and working mums that grates.
And the 'costs to the economy' bollocks they always come out with, remember the NHS strike that turned into the biggest retail day of the yr?

Eta: its worked out ok as I had to take one kid to dentist tomorrow anyway. Far more miffed at school not telling us it was closed today


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 9, 2014)

Estimated 1 million striking tomorrow.
Respect to all who stay away from work, more so for those protesting and picketing. 
Imagine if all one million workers were passionate enough to organise into a force that went beyond one day action.
If all planned and even though times are tight managed to put aside enough cash to finance a week or a months strike! What a glorious day that would be comrades.
One day strikes though valid and effective at raising awareness are nothing to employers who simply pocket the salary savings. In service jobs the cost is soon recovered unlike major strikes in manufacturing for instance. Time to stop playing and get serious, people are starving and at the end of their tether.


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 10, 2014)

Could be another ballot for a strike in October depending on turn out


----------



## J Ed (Jul 10, 2014)

Good luck to all those on strike today, looks like a great day for it!


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 10, 2014)

Deafening silence from Labour  on supporting the strike


----------



## purenarcotic (Jul 10, 2014)

Solidarity with everyone who's out today.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 10, 2014)

Terrible scabbing this morning in my work place. Cunts.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jul 10, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Terrible scabbing this morning in my work place. Cunts.


Same here - though there are also plenty of cunts who 'work from home' cos they won't go on strike but are too scared to cross the picket line.

These are often the same people who moan that they're not paid enough!


----------



## SikhWarrioR (Jul 10, 2014)

The39thStep said:


> Deafening silence from Labour  on supporting the strike




Do we have a Labour party anymore I abandoned it two decades ago as a voter and a member when it morphed into the New labour third way conservative clones under blair,brown,mandelson et al and see no way to support labour under milipede,balls and co


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 10, 2014)

Solidarity with those striking today. The scabs can fuck off.


----------



## shygirl (Jul 10, 2014)

Solidarity to the strikers today.


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 10, 2014)

Are the waste disposal workers out the gate? The fuckers might start to take notice if Chelsea and Notting Hill starts stinking to high heaven.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 10, 2014)

Solidarity to the strikers. I am choosing to feather my own nest by trying to develop some alternative career options while I'm off sick from my local government job, and will be donating my pay for the day to either Unison's strike fund (if they have one - I haven't checked yet ) or to some or other socialist organisation that can use it to alleviate hardship.

I have always felt slightly ambivalent about striking - I really am not particularly "political", so striking to make a political point has never felt quite OK. This is different, though - this is about people being fucked up the arse by a government which simply doesn't care how badly it treats people if it doesn't think they can push back. It is also - to almost go against my non-political stance - an opportunity to tell the Labour Party that they need to take the workforce a lot more seriously than they do, and stop cosying up with the big corporations, etc.


----------



## kenny g (Jul 10, 2014)

My team is all on strike apart from one guy who has called a week long sicky and  and the manager who is managing the phones and will owe us all another year of rounds of drinks so I won't hold it against him.


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 10, 2014)

existentialist said:


> I have always felt slightly ambivalent about striking - I really am not particularly "political", so striking to make a political point has never felt quite OK. This is different, though - this is about people being fucked up the arse by a government which simply doesn't care how badly it treats people if it doesn't think they can push back.



Workers can't legally strike 'to make a political point', they have to be in dispute with their bosses which is usually over pay, redundancies or working conditions being eroded. Of course with the public sector the govt/state are the bosses.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 10, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Workers can't legally strike 'to make a political point', they have to be in dispute with their bosses which is usually over pay, redundancies or working conditions being eroded. Of course with the public sector the govt/state are the bosses.


That might be the reason for the strike, but - as you point out - there are times when the political dimension is inescapable. I guess what I'm saying is this is one of those situations where I cannot have a problem with that


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 10, 2014)

Around 50 at a rally in woolwich se london after picketing today


----------



## PursuedByBears (Jul 10, 2014)

Citizen66 said:


> Are the waste disposal workers out the gate? The fuckers might start to take notice if Chelsea and Notting Hill starts stinking to high heaven.


All the bins on my street were emptied as normal today.


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 10, 2014)

So were ours...found out it was by managers driving 4 strike breakers round....here's to a real back breaking day in scab land


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 10, 2014)

Should go round the neighbourhood filling the bins with lead weights.


----------



## chilango (Jul 10, 2014)

Not out in my sector.

Just occurred to me though that I had a (brief) meeting this morning with someone who  I suspect should've been out.  at him, for scabbing (if so). and  at me for not twigging in time.


----------



## eatmorecheese (Jul 10, 2014)

http://www.croydonadvertiser.co.uk/...cted-disrupt/story-21440627-detail/story.html


The photo was taken about an hour ago, but the date on the story is yesterday? Anyway, we had enough people to make an impression. Too many members crossing the line, tho


----------



## treelover (Jul 10, 2014)

I wonder if the Govt have introduced the new 'snoopers charter' today especially to get the media attention(such as it is) away from the strike, sort of thing Crosby would do.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jul 10, 2014)

The RItzy Cinema and Brixton Library, both closed today by strike action:







Liverpool - good turnout:











Calderdale:






Leicester:






Michael Gove, who says we shouldn't be on strike:


----------



## Badgers (Jul 10, 2014)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Michael Gove, who says we shouldn't be on strike:


----------



## redsquirrel (Jul 10, 2014)

Best of luck comrades


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

my other job's on strike today but in sympathy i'm not doing a stroke of work.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

very disappointed to hear of at least one urbanite crossing a picket line.


----------



## cesare (Jul 10, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> very disappointed to hear of at least one urbanite crossing a picket line.


There seems to be quite a lot of this in multi-union workplaces - people don't seem to realise that picket lines can be virtual as well as physical


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

cesare said:


> There seems to be quite a lot of this in multi-union workplaces - people don't seem to realise that picket lines can be virtual as well as physical


moral as well as virtual as well as physical. i wouldn't dream of coming in if my colleagues in another union were on strike, i'd phone in sick or something


----------



## sunnysidedown (Jul 10, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> very disappointed to hear of at least one urbanite crossing a picket line.



29.40


----------



## cesare (Jul 10, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> moral as well as virtual as well as physical. i wouldn't dream of coming in if my colleagues in another union were on strike, i'd phone in sick or something


Exactly. This is why we don't use the tube when the scab management are driving trains during industrial action. For example.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

sunnysidedown said:


> 29.40



30:46


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 10, 2014)

Not surprised to hear on radio and see on TV news the amount of 'outraged' citizens texting, emailing and phoning in to state the ridiculous argument regarding number of votes cast in favour of strike action.
Calling it undemocratic whilst supporting a coalition that as nowhere near 50% of the national vote.
Then you get government ministers and Cameron calling the action illegitimate, whilst getting paid a salary for a position that saw them all secure  less than 50% of their constituency.
Bah!


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

Sprocket. said:


> Not surprised to hear on radio and see on TV news the amount of 'outraged' citizens texting, emailing and phoning in to state the ridiculous argument regarding number of votes cast in favour of strike action.
> Calling it undemocratic whilst supporting a coalition that as nowhere near 50% of the national vote.
> Then you get government ministers and Cameron calling the action illegitimate, whilst getting paid a salary for a position that saw them all secure than 50%.
> Bah!


it's ridiculous to expect people to regard as legitimate a government which receives less than 50% of the vote, then goes on to pass laws based on that so-called mandate for five sorry years without once more consulting the electorate.


----------



## chilango (Jul 10, 2014)

it should be illegal to take legislative action without your vote reaching a threshold of 50% of the electorate.


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 10, 2014)

I also suspect that like the tactics in the 80's of convincing workers of the right to buy as a tool for preventing strike action, they are taking advantage of the criminal pay day loan companies stranglehold on low waged workers to force working people to abstain from striking and having to work to keep these bank backed wolves from the door.


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 10, 2014)

I myself am not working today, but have lost count of the times I have shouted Bastards at the radio and TV.


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 10, 2014)

Sprocket. said:


> Not surprised to hear on radio and see on TV news the amount of 'outraged' citizens texting, emailing and phoning in to state the ridiculous argument regarding number of votes cast in favour of strike action.
> Calling it undemocratic whilst supporting a coalition that as nowhere near 50% of the national vote.
> Then you get government ministers and Cameron calling the action illegitimate, whilst getting paid a salary for a position that saw them all secure  less than 50% of their constituency.
> Bah!


The funniest is when in one breath the govt are outraged by the action 'holding the country to ransom' and talking of ways to legislate against it and in the next breath state the strike isn't solid.

Come on chaps, you can't have it both ways.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 10, 2014)

"if you don't like it, do another job"

and who teaches the kids?


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 10, 2014)

Okay Mr Cameron, let's have a look at our close European neighbours the French.
In France, Trade Unions represent only 8% of workers yet they as a nation have far more disruptive strikes than we do.
Nobody votes on strike action there, the workers decide and plan any actions.
Tell me Mr Cameron, would you be blaming union leaders for these actions, or would you as maybe an alleged elected leader look inwards and see that it is your policies that force people into these situations, where workers are sacrificing badly needed income to try and raise awareness at how desperate things are in the world created by you and your capitalist paymasters?


----------



## treelover (Jul 10, 2014)

The only mainstream party leader to endorse the strikes?


----------



## Plumdaff (Jul 10, 2014)

People looking at me gone out when I said I wouldn't cross a picket at the library to run one of our groups. And this is in a public sector workplace. There's a lot of talking to do, and at least I've started a conversation about why I wouldn't do that. (Of course we're in today because health sections are useless).


----------



## jakejb79 (Jul 10, 2014)

I saw the workers walking down Regent Street, what time does the rally go on at Trafalgar square would like to go there after work if it's still going on.


----------



## Betsy (Jul 10, 2014)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Michael Gove, who says we shouldn't be on strike:



Was just coming on here to post that picture ...


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 10, 2014)

MIchael Gove is obviously a man of no principles who bends to peer pressure


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jul 10, 2014)

busy in trafalgar square, despite the rain


----------



## the button (Jul 10, 2014)

Brixton Hatter said:


>



Is that woman on the left holding a hammer? Tragic missed opportunity, if so. :-(


----------



## cesare (Jul 10, 2014)

Should have put a donk on it


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jul 10, 2014)

Fantastic number of folks marching today in Brighton! Well chuffed


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Fantastic number of folks marching today in Brighton! Well chuffed


promenading on the sea front?


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jul 10, 2014)

Just seen this posted on the BBC.  



> 13:38: Simon, Basingstoke
> emails: My wages have been frozen for 4 years and my pension is non-existent so I am all in favour of strike action! Hell I think I will strike too. The only thing is that as a private sector worker I might have to book it 2 weeks in advance and take it as holiday or unpaid leave.... In this day and age strike action should be illegal.



There's just no words


----------



## cesare (Jul 10, 2014)

Doctor Carrot said:


> Just seen this posted on the BBC.
> 
> 
> 
> There's just no words


Striking's a risky business and people put their individual risks to one side in the interests of solidarity and collective action. I'm amazed that this still needs to be pointed out to people, eh


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 10, 2014)

Does he think public sector workers get paid when they're on strike or something?


----------



## the button (Jul 10, 2014)

the button said:


> Is that woman on the left holding a hammer? Tragic missed opportunity, if so. :-(


Looks like this is the closest we're going to get...

http://games.usvsth3m.com/slap-michael-gove/


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jul 10, 2014)

I have no idea. He's incomprehensible. He seems to support it yet then says it should be illegal? On the whole he seems to think it's some jolly lazy public sector workers going.

'I'm being royally fucked up the arse by my employer and so should you be' depressing how much we've been worn down


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jul 10, 2014)

the button said:


> Looks like this is the closest we're going to get...
> 
> http://games.usvsth3m.com/slap-michael-gove/








That felt pretty good


----------



## belboid (Jul 10, 2014)

Good turnout in Sheffield, well over a thousand on the demo


----------



## JTG (Jul 10, 2014)

Can anyone tell me if any Unison health sections are out/supposed to be out in the West of England?


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 10, 2014)

hope all went well


milliband refusing to back the strike as per, the spineless labour cunt


----------



## the button (Jul 10, 2014)

It's lucky people like Owen Jones and articul8 are pushing Labour to the left so successfully, otherwise the strikers would have been rounded up & shot by One Nation goons by now.


----------



## cesare (Jul 10, 2014)

the button said:


> It's lucky people like Owen Jones and articul8 are pushing Labour to the left so successfully, otherwise the strikers would have been rounded up & shot by One Nation goons by now.


People like Socialist Appeal etc have been successfully pushing Labour to the left for years


----------



## ddraig (Jul 10, 2014)

apparently strong in a few places in Cardiff
main park was shut
went out with Wales IWW and got threatened by manager of poundland for blocking his shop with a flag never mind it was rammed in there and people were still going in!
he also claimed that he was on workfare and now is a manager and he would get me arrested!  also we could fuck off with our protest.
this obviously meant more wobs joining me at the entrance for his return from fag break
they didn't like that we were turning people away and that the queue inside the shop could hear us


----------



## treelover (Jul 10, 2014)

Doctor Carrot said:


> Just seen this posted on the BBC.
> 
> 
> 
> There's just no words




A ragged trousered philanthropist, nothing really changes..


----------



## treelover (Jul 10, 2014)

Doctor Carrot said:


> That felt pretty good



Just noticed its owned by Trinity Mirror Group


----------



## treelover (Jul 10, 2014)

http://news.sky.com/story/1298248/striking-workers-accuse-ministers-of-hypocrisy

ace gallery here


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jul 10, 2014)

Bristol seemed a reasonable turnout.  I didn't go for the whole thing but was walking home and went past college green as the speakers were on.


----------



## Sasaferrato (Jul 10, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> hope all went well
> 
> 
> milliband refusing to back the strike as per, the spineless labour cunt



He's not Labour. Spineless? Certainly. Cunt? Absolutely. Labour? No!


----------



## Sasaferrato (Jul 10, 2014)

As always, I supported my union by withdrawing my labour today. 

(I may be more than a tad disenchanted with PCS, but I'm more disenchanted with the government).


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 10, 2014)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Same here - though there are also plenty of cunts who 'work from home' cos they won't go on strike but are too scared to cross the picket line.
> 
> These are often the same people who moan that they're not paid enough!



Our council was very strict on not allowing staff to work from home who are not registered home workers . Pickets were quite well attended and far more were out than the last strike mainly because loads more have joined the union during the cuts despite a real recruitment drive. Our local rally didn't take place as everyone was shipped off to the rally in Manchester which was a pity.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 10, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> how come i can't pm you?






No obvious reason?  (Checks inbox)


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 10, 2014)

Sasaferrato said:


> He's not Labour. Spineless? Certainly. Cunt? Absolutely. Labour? No!


Unfortunately that is labour to a T. The miners spent a year on strike without the leader Kinnock backing them in the 90s.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

William of Walworth said:


> No obvious reason?  (Checks inbox)


if i click your name the box that comes up doesn't have the start conversation option i get with e.g. the 39th step or sasaferrato

check your settings


----------



## J Ed (Jul 10, 2014)

The39thStep said:


> Unfortunately that is labour to a T. The miners spent a year on strike without the leader Kinnock backing them in the 90s.



Awesome Wells


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 10, 2014)

The39thStep said:


> Unfortunately that is labour to a T. The miners spent a year on strike without the leader Kinnock backing them in the 90s.


not 1984/85 then


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 10, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> if i click your name the box that comes up doesn't have the start conversation option i get with e.g. the 39th step or sasaferrato
> 
> check your settings




Very odd  I can't even begin to understand what I can do to any settings to fix it either ....


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 10, 2014)

Anyway, as it happens, I *was *on strike today .... more in a minute ...


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 10, 2014)

There'd been a nationwide PCS vote in favour of strike action, I'd voted for it myself in fact, but because in my particular department there'd been a recent half-way reasonable pay settlement taking us into to 2015 (including a good chunk of backpay back to 2011 -- but losing some weekend overtime rights), there wasn't a lot of publicity locally/at branch level about joining the strike.

But _officially_ we *were* on strike, which I only established on Wednesday, and while some of my colleagues went to work  , a fair number didn't -- including me 

Unison at both our local councils were solid round here  -- at today's rally in Castle Gardens (central Swansea), Unison had the heaviest representation, with plenty from the NUT and various others from GMB, Unite, FBU (  ) and just a few of us 'out in solidarity' PCS types.


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 10, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> not 1984/85 then



Sorry yes it was in the 80s not the 90 s.


----------



## Citizen66 (Jul 11, 2014)

Can't you do a pm nowadays by starting a conversation and adding in the poster's name in the field? 

I'm surprised by the number of people saying 'I would have loved to have gone on strike but my dept wasn't'.

Either you're in a different union to those going on strike or you're in a different company to those going on strike. If it's the former I'd ask why your union wasn't involved with a view to changing to a union that was. There's no excuses to providing your labour when there's a strike.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 11, 2014)

last time I was on a Unison picket as a supporter a scab IT bloke swanned past and expressed sympathy while dropping off six donuts for us. Nobody else wanted the donuts so I ate them and saved one for the dog. Waste not want not.


----------



## treelover (Jul 11, 2014)

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...war-on-strikers-tactical-blunder-out-of-touch

good guardian video and article on the strike


----------



## machine cat (Jul 11, 2014)

Wasn't on strike cos Unison at my place are pushovers but it looked like a good turnout in Huddersfield:


----------



## ddraig (Jul 11, 2014)

traffic CHAOS in Cardiff!!
pics from around Wales including Swansea
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/public-sector-strike-wales-strike-7401861




also this with views
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/public-sector-strike-wales-what-7401173


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 12, 2014)

machine cat said:


> Wasn't on strike cos Unison at my place are pushovers but it looked like a good turnout in Huddersfield:


Dont mean this as an accusation but it was a national unison local gov strike so how come your local unison werent on strike?


----------



## machine cat (Jul 12, 2014)

comrade spurski said:


> Dont mean this as an accusation but it was a national unison local gov strike so how come your local unison werent on strike?



I have no idea. There are four quango departments in my office building represented by Unison, Unite, GMB, PCS and Prospect and nobody was on strike. Nobody was even balloted.


----------



## krink (Jul 13, 2014)

In Sunderland, I was told none of the support staff who work in academy schools were balloted.


----------



## Spanky Longhorn (Jul 13, 2014)

krink said:


> In Sunderland, I was told none of the support staff who work in academy schools were balloted.


are they covered by NJC terms and conditions? same question to machine cat - are you on the same t&cs as local government workers? If not you would not be balloted.


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 13, 2014)

machine cat said:


> I have no idea. There are four quango departments in my office building represented by Unison, Unite, GMB, PCS and Prospect and nobody was on strike. Nobody was even balloted.



thats crap luck and crap of the unions not to let you know why you were not included in the action


----------



## krink (Jul 13, 2014)

Spanky Longhorn said:


> are they covered by NJC terms and conditions? same question to machine cat - are you on the same t&cs as local government workers? If not you would not be balloted.



I've no idea but I'll try to find out.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 28, 2014)

Thought the strike lined up for today by PCS members at the Passport Agency might be worth a quick mention.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

William of Walworth said:


> Thought the strike lined up for today by PCS members at the Passport Agency might be worth a quick mention.


At the start of the summer holidays? They will cop a ton of flak for that!


----------



## Supine (Jul 28, 2014)

Late for work due to unannounced train strikes until Friday


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> At the start of the summer holidays? They will cop a ton of flak for that!



What do you suppose would be a better time for the action?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> What do you suppose would be a better time for the action?


A moot point now.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Supine said:


> Late for work due to unannounced train strikes until Friday


 
If it were 'unannounced' how come the BBC were reporting it yesterday?


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> A moot point now.


 eh?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> eh?


They are striking today.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> They are striking today.


 OK, I'll re-word my question. What do you suppose would *have *be*en* a better time for the action?


----------



## J Ed (Jul 28, 2014)

William of Walworth said:


> Thought the strike lined up for today by PCS members at the Passport Agency might be worth a quick mention.



Good, it's a nice day for it so hopefully they get a good turn out!


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Perhaps after these posts today it might be worth re-visiting @smokedout 's OP...



> Thought it was worth having a thread to keep track of official and unofficial strikes, walk outs and worker led direct action, whether large or small. *Ideally not for bickering, but to help promote and support local action.*


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> OK, I'll re-word my question. What do you suppose would *have *be*en* a better time for the action?



that's the question I answered.


----------



## JTG (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> What do you suppose would be a better time for the action?


Christmas Day and Boxing Day I reckon


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> that's the question I answered.



I'm still not clear what you meant when you said "*At the start of the summer holidays? They will cop a ton of flak for that!*".
You seemed to imply that there might be another (better?) time for the action when the PCS and its members would attract less "flak". Is that what you meant?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> I'm still not clear what you meant when you said "*At the start of the summer holidays? They will cop a ton of flak for that!*".
> You seemed to imply that there might be another (better?) time for the action when the PCS and its members would attract less "flak". Is that what you meant?


Striking now will be seen as deliberately disruptive in a climate already hostile to the unions.


----------



## J Ed (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Striking now will be seen as deliberately disruptive in a climate already hostile to the unions.



That's the point and actually a reality for both people who are pro union and anti

Please stop this trolling.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

J Ed said:


> That's the point and actually a reality for both people who are pro union and anti
> 
> Please stop this trolling.


Noone is trolling, grow up.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Striking now will be seen as deliberately disruptive in a climate already hostile to the unions.


When did you see the media ever support any sort of strike at any time? Your point is what's moot here.


----------



## J Ed (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Noone is trolling, grow up.



I felt slightly guilty for calling you a patronising twat, thanks for absolving me (and then some) of that


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Striking now will be seen as deliberately disruptive in a climate already hostile to the unions.



You sound as though you've never had to withdraw your own labour in strike action. Or, if you have, not really reflected on what you and your comrades were attempting to effect.


----------



## Supine (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> If it were 'unannounced' how come the BBC were reporting it yesterday?



I didn't see it. And it wasnt mentioned on the local news travel section on bbc this morning.


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> At the start of the summer holidays? They will cop a ton of flak for that!



anyone giving them flak has no right to complain about their own work injustices then. they are striking in order to put pressure on the employer therefore they must strike at a time that is most effective in order to put the most amount of pressure on them...anyone who doesn't grasp this simple fact is either anti union or stupid


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

comrade spurski said:


> anyone giving them flak has no right to complain about their own work injustices then. they are striking in order to put pressure on the employer therefore they must strike at a time that is most effective in order to put the most amount of pressure on them...anyone who doesn't grasp this simple fact is either anti union or stupid


It's something we often see on here tbh - a) people not understanding the point is to cause disruption and b) thinking that all that counts (whether in terms of winning the strike or wider) is how the strike is presented in the media. Time after time.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Supine said:


> I didn't see it. And it wasnt mentioned on the local news travel section on bbc this morning.



I'm sorry you didn't see it, but under present legislation it couldn't have been "unannounced", could it?


----------



## redsquirrel (Jul 28, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> It's something we often see on here tbh - a) people not understanding the point is to cause disruption and b) that all that counts (whether in terms of winning the strike or wider) is how the strike is presented in the media. Time after time.


And not just on U75, I've had union members make similar points to me, unfortunately.


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Striking now will be seen as deliberately disruptive in a climate already hostile to the unions.


The whole point of going on strike is to cause disruption. I'm only surprised you haven't added the canard that "unions are outdated".


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

J Ed said:


> I felt slightly guilty for calling you a patronising twat, thanks for absolving me (and then some) of that


I don't think you know what trolling is. Talking on the subject at hand is not trolling.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> The whole point of going on strike is to cause disruption. I'm only surprised you haven't added the canard that "unions are outdated".


why would i do that?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> You sound as though you've never had to withdraw your own labour in strike action. Or, if you have, not really reflected on what you and your comrades were attempting to effect.


And why do you say that?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

comrade spurski said:


> anyone giving them flak has no right to complain about their own work injustices then. they are striking in order to put pressure on the employer therefore they must strike at a time that is most effective in order to put the most amount of pressure on them...anyone who doesn't grasp this simple fact is either anti union or stupid


You seem to have inferred that I dont support the cause of the PCS staff. Please provide some evidence to support that assertion, if that is what you indeed think. If it isn't, i've really no idea what you are trying to say.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> And why do you say that?


because of the drivel you come out?


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> And why do you say that?


 My perception on the basis of what you said. Was I wrong?


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> You seem to have inferred that I dont support the cause of the PCS staff. Please provide some evidence to support that assertion, if that is what you indeed think. If it isn't, i've really no idea what you are trying to say.


There was two options, anti union _or_ stupid. I guess you're column B.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> My perception on the basis of what you said. Was I wrong?


I've never been a member of a union. Is that relevant? If you have a point in all of this could you get to it quicker.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

on this thread? really?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> because of the drivel you come out?


because you're a twat?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

killer b said:


> There was two options, anti union _or_ stupid. I guess you're column B.


What is stupid about not being in a union?


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> on this thread? really?


fair point.


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> why would i do that?


I don't know, you tell me. You appear to have a problem with the central rationale for industrial action.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> What is stupid about not being in a union?


reallly?  wow.  fuck off the thread then you scab


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> It's something we often see on here tbh - a) people not understanding the point is to cause disruption and b) that all that counts (whether in terms of winning the strike or wider) is how the strike is presented in the media. Time after time.


'we'?

What a piss poor little troupe you are. Brave class warriors, sticking it to the man by misrepresenting other people who aren't disagreeing with y ou on the internet so you can cary out your sad little cliquey crusade. 

Get a life you pathetic cunt.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> reallly?  wow.  fuck off the thread then you scab


i don't think you know what a scab is if you're calling me one. I don't work for the pasport office. Daft twat


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> I don't know, you tell me. You appear to have a problem with the central rationale for industrial action.


and you reason that on the basis of what?


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> and you reason that on the basis of what?


You're not doing very well here, are you? Why do I say that? It's the standard of your reply and other others on this thread.

As this reply demonstrates, you have failed the grasp the concept of strike action and have taken a line that is not to dissimilar to a public that takes all of its views from the corrupt media.


> Striking now will be seen as deliberately disruptive in a climate already hostile to the unions.



Perhaps we should just sign petitions? Perhaps we should just let the bosses fuck us over? Maybe we should just join hands and sing Kumbaya?


----------



## 8ball (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> As this reply demonstrates, you have failed the grasp the concept of strike action and have taken a line that is not to dissimilar to a public that takes all of its views from the corrupt media.


 
If the public takes all of its views from the corrupt media then AW would be correct.

edit:  though i can't figure what the public would think a rationale for a strike would be if it didn't cause any disruption...


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> i don't think you know what a scab is if you're calling me one. I don't work for the pasport office. Daft twat


you are proudly non-union, that makes you no better than a scab.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> You're not doing very well here, are you? Why do I say that? It's the standard of your reply and other others on this thread.


Then answer the question. Something you people are incapable of doing. You set yourselves up to with all this working class bravado and when confronted with something as simple as a question asking you to explain what you mean or what you think you resort to ad hominem and straw man. YOu people do it all the time it's laughable. You have ridiculously inferred that I don't understand strike action, with no evidence to support this claim, and that I am against the PCS striking on the issue of passport processing, also without evidence. When questioned about this, despite my previous posts for the last year unequivocally supporting strike action, such as the teachers strikes, you, again and predictably, assume the worst. I wouldn't want a bunch of hypocrits and gutless cowards like you representing me. You're pathetic.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I've never been a member of a union. Is that relevant? If you have a point in all of this could you get to it quicker.



We could have got there alot quicker if you'd straightforwardly answered my earlier question about when it would have been a better time for the PCS to call their action. Instead you chose to prat around with your "moot point' bollux. The plain fact is that you made a pathetic, whiney little pop at the union and couldn't then back it up without sounding anti-union. Clear enough for you?


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Then answer the question. Something you people are incapable of doing. You set yourselves up to with all this working class bravado and when confronted with something as simple as a question asking you to explain what you mean or what you think you resort to ad hominem and straw man. YOu people do it all the time it's laughable. You have ridiculously inferred that I don't understand strike action, with no evidence to support this claim, and that I am against the PCS striking on the issue of passport processing, also without evidence. When questioned about this, despite my previous posts for the last year unequivocally supporting strike action, such as the teachers strikes, you, again and predictably, assume the worst. I wouldn't want a bunch of hypocrits and gutless cowards like you representing me. You're pathetic.


What question? Oh and "you people"? You've sort of let the cat out of the bag without realising it. Bravo.



> You're pathetic.



And you're projecting.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

8ball said:


> If the public takes all of its views from the corrupt media then AW would be correct.


Or if it has paid for a hopliday and a passport to be processed, hoping it will be (rightly or wrongly!), then it certainly will go against the PCS, which is why i pust the sad face icon in my post. Something you sad little children have completely ignored. I didn't do that for a laugh. I did it because I'm sympatheitc to the PCS cause, but they won't win on this one. It's not like the teacher strike when people will potentially be losing money - even if they were ill advised in booking holidays/applying for passports.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> We could have got there alot quicker if you'd straightforwardly answered my earlier question about when it would have been a better time for the PCS to call their action. Instead you chose to prat around with your "moot point' bollux. The plain fact is that you made a pathetic, whiney little pop at the union and couldn't then back it up without sounding anti-union. Clear enough for you?



Not really, where would we have gotten? You still haven't explained the point you're trying to make.

Did you see my time machine?

Oh that's right, I don't have one. So asking me a question like that is fucking pointless since they are striking RIGHT NOW!

Please quote my 'whiney little pop at the union'.


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

It's all about you, you, you.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> What question? Oh and "you people"? You've sort of let the cat out of the bag without realising it. Bravo.
> 
> 
> 
> And you're projecting.


I have no idea what this means. Let what 'cat' out? What bag? What does this bizarre cryptic nonsense even mean? Projecting what?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> It's all about you, you, you.


When people are asking me questions and putting words into my mouth, then yes.

I've no idea what 'it' you are otherwise referring to.


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I have no idea what this means. Let what 'cat' out? What bag? What does this bizarre cryptic nonsense even mean? Projecting what?


Still playing dumb, eh?


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> When people are asking me questions and putting words into my mouth, then yes.
> 
> I've no idea what 'it' you are otherwise referring to.


I refer you to the above reply.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Or if it has paid for a hopliday and a passport to be processed, hoping it will be (rightly or wrongly!), then it certainly will go against the PCS, which is why i pust the sad face icon in my post. Something you sad little children have completely ignored. I didn't do that for a laugh. I did it because I'm sympatheitc to the PCS cause, but they won't win on this one. It's not like the teacher strike when people will potentially be losing money - even if they were ill advised in booking holidays/applying for passports.


you're a dishonest little shit and a half


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> you are proudly non-union, that makes you no better than a scab.


In what way am i non union, proudly or otherwise? How do you draw that conclusion when a simple read through of threads about strikes that i've posted in will demonstrate the complete opposite. You still don't get what a scab is, nor do you have any understanding of that which you speak. You're a just a sad prejudiced old twat.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> I refer you to the above reply.


Which is just ignoring the questions I asked. And that's why i call you cowardly. You're quite happy to dish out the abuse and bring your own prejudice to the conversation, hopelessly colouring any understanding, and yet when faced with simple questions, you duck and dodge playing ad hominems. Get some balls and answer the question.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> you're a dishonest little shit and a half


Show me where i've been dishonest.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> In what way am i non union, proudly or otherwise? How do you draw that conclusion when a simple read through of threads about strikes that i've posted in will demonstrate the complete opposite. You still don't get what a scab is, nor do you have any understanding of that which you speak. You're a just a sad prejudiced old twat.


Scab


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

Wells, please stop posting.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Show me where i've been dishonest.


your 'sad face,' your crocodile tears. You're a scab just like Kinnock was a scab


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> Wells, please stop posting.


Please stop living.


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Which is just ignoring the questions I asked. And that's why i call you cowardly. You're quite happy to dish out the abuse and bring your own prejudice to the conversation, hopelessly colouring any understanding, and yet when faced with simple questions, you duck and dodge playing ad hominems. Get some balls and answer the question.


You're rather full of yourself but are quite incapable of self-analysis. You're trolling too.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Please stop living.


charming little man


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> your 'sad face,' your crocodile tears. You're a scab just like Kinnock was a scab


It's all coming out now! 

Prejudice; a perfect example of what I mean.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> You're rather full of yourself but are quite incapable of self-analysis. You're trolling too.


he's not trolling, he is actually this stupid


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> It's all coming out now!


your scabbiness?  Quite


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> You're rather full of yourself but are quite incapable of self-analysis. You're trolling too.


and these are just ad hominem attacks. You make the accusations, I challenged you to evidence them, and this is what I get. You are pathetic, you're no better than a child.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> he's not trolling, he is actually this stupid


Says the bitter old twat who, evidently, can read minds!


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> he's not trolling, he is actually this stupid


I do apologise. I was giving him the benefit of the doubt.


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> and these are just ad hominem attacks. You make the accusations, I challenged you to evidence them, and this is what I get. You are pathetic, you're no better than a child.


Wind yer fucking neck in, chum.


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

is he like this all the time atm, or have i just been unlucky?


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> You are pathetic, you're no better than a child.


says the big man who just told someone to kill themself


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

killer b said:


> is he like this all the time atm, or have i just been unlucky?


Check the fares fair thread in the bristol forum. That should answer your question.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> Wind yer fucking neck in, chum.



I'm good thanks, but do keep avoiding the questions.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Not really, where would we have gotten? You still haven't explained the point you're trying to make.
> 
> Did you see my time machine?
> 
> ...



As others have told you, if anything about this discussion is pointless it was your decision to restrict your observation on the PCS action to this...



> *At the start of the summer holidays? They will cop a ton of flak for that! *



As you implied the timing of the action was unfortunate I asked you very straightforwardly when would have been a better time? You've subsequently confirmed my impression that you yourself have never withdrawn your labour in a collective action, and therefore had no idea that the purpose of the industrial action was to create maximum disruption with the minimum impact upon the pay-packets of the workers involved.

Do you support the PCS action?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> charming little man


I'm charming to those that deserve respect. Not you though. Nor the other little troll.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I'm charming to those that deserve respect. Not you though. Nor the other little troll.


you told a poster to kill themself, so what does that make you?


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I'm good thanks, but do keep avoiding the questions.


Again, _what questions_, you delusional fool?

Yours is "do as I say, not as I do". Delusional _and_ arrogant. What a fucking combination.


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

"You're avoiding my questions". Whine, whine, whine.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> As others have told you, if anything about this discussion is pointless it was decision to restrict your observation on the PCS action to this...


This is a straw man: i didn't say the discussion was pointless. I was referring to your question. I'm perfectly happy to discuss the strike, which is why I contributed to it. You then decided to infer something unpleasant that was never there. Like the rest of the class warriors.



> As you implied the timing of the action was unfortunate I asked you very straightforwardly when would have been a better time? You've subsequently confirmed my impression that you yourself have never withdrawn your labour in a collective action, and therefore had no idea that the purpose of the industrial action was to create maximum disruption with the minimum impact upon the pay-packets of the workers involved.



Doesn't matter whether i've been on strike or not. Completely irrelevant. Assuming therefore that only people who've been on strike, only members of that special club, can have a valid contribution is pathetic and arrogant.




> Do you support the PCS action?



A one day strike in this instance is a complete waste of everyone's time. The PCS are largely ineffectual and Mark Serwotka is all talk.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> Again, _what questions_, you delusional fool?



http://www.urban75.net/forums/goto/post?id=13299768#post-13299768

Do you have short term memory loss or a broken keyboard?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> you told a poster to kill themself, so what does that make you?


I really don't care. He's an arsehole that deliberately stalks me around, with moderator support, provoking this shit. I give him shit back that's 100x worse in the hope he might wake up to himself, though at this point if he did kill himself...well, one less arsehole in the world is no great loss. Besides I asked politely.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> A one day strike in this instance is a complete waste of everyone's time. The PCS are largely ineffectual and Mark Serwotka is all talk.


you objected because they are holding at a time that will inconvenience people - thus missing the whole point of what strikes are about.  You refused to say when an appropriate time would be, and have now shifted your argument to it just being a one day strike.  The fact that it is probably only the first one day strike (unless the government agrees immediately) has, of course, totally passed you by.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I really don't care. He's an arsehole that deliberately stalks me around, with moderator support, provoking this shit. I give him shit back that's 100x worse in the hope he might wake up to himself, though at this point if he did kill himself...well, one less arsehole in the world is no great loss.


I cant decide whether or not this a step up from your call for someone to get cancer for disagreeing with you about a TV show


----------



## Lo Siento. (Jul 28, 2014)

Fucking hell, can we not have this thread, of all threads, derailed with anti-strike carping?


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> This is a straw man: i didn't say the discussion was pointless. I was referring to your question. I'm perfectly happy to discuss the strike, which is why I contributed to it. You then decided to infer something unpleasant that was never there. Like the rest of the class warriors.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You're just digging yourself in further; stand back and have a bit of a talk with yourself.

It wasn't pointless to ask you about the timing of the strike because questioning eventually elicited the truth that you actually think that the industrial action by the passport office workers is a waste of time, that the union (and their leader) are ineffectual. That's important stuff and worthy of discussion.

So you don't support the action after all; why didn't you just say so this morning, rather than blathering on about disruption and flak?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

Lo Siento. said:


> Fucking hell, can we not have this thread, of all threads, derailed with anti-strike carping?


i haven't seen a single post that is anti strike.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> You're just digging yourself in further; stand back and have a bit of a talk with yourself.
> 
> It wasn't pointless to ask you about the timing of the strike because questioning eventually elicited the truth that you actually think that the industrial action by the passport office workers is a waste of time, that the union (and their leader) are ineffectual. That's important stuff and worthy of discussion.
> 
> So you don't support the action after all; why didn't you just say so this morning, rather than blathering on about disruption and flak?


Because it's not relevant.

And yo ustill havent shown anything that is a 'whiney pop at the union'


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> I cant decide whether or not this a step up from your call for someone to get cancer for disagreeing with you about a TV show


Thats nice dear, i dont care.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Because it's not relevant.


The fact that you dont support the strike after all isnt relevant?  Really??


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Thats nice dear, i dont care.


about anything or anyone other than yourself


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> about anything or anyone other than yourself


that's right dad!


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> The fact that you dont support the strike after all isnt relevant?  Really??


I support the cause. I don't think this action is effective.


----------



## editor (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I really don't care. He's an arsehole that deliberately stalks me around, with moderator support, provoking this shit. I give him shit back that's 100x worse in the hope he might wake up to himself, though at this point if he did kill himself...well, one less arsehole in the world is no great loss. Besides I asked politely.


Consider this your first warning.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I support the cause. I don't think this action is effective.


So you dont support the strike. And that is clearly relevant (which you denied a moment ago)


----------



## nino_savatte (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> http://www.urban75.net/forums/goto/post?id=13299768#post-13299768
> 
> Do you have short term memory loss or a broken keyboard?


You're either doing this for a wind-up or you're genuinely thick. Which is it?

Most people on these boards are familiar with the saying "letting the cat out of the bag". But you? You play dumb.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I support the cause. I don't think this action is effective.




the thing is- and I don't really find one dayers effective either- with the anti strike laws in this country, the erosion of solidarity and the quite real fear that a rolling strike would see you frozen out from wages and a union that won't even (because it can't afford it) cover half wages as strike pay- One dayers are what we have as a tool. Now, when your knife is blunt and you only get a limited opportunity to use it, where do you land the blow? Where it damn well counts.

Take for example when the petrol hauliers even suggested that they might ballot for strike action. It was chaos! queues at the pumps, petrol running out etc. Why? because they have a hand where it counts, on the jugular.

To strike when the iron is hot then must be seen as the soundest tactical move within a defanged workforce. And remember this is not for longer lunchbreaks and moar wages. It's to defend however they can agreements made that are now being broken. Think in tactics.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Because it's not relevant.
> 
> And yo ustill havent shown anything that is a 'whiney pop at the union'


 
That's such a preposterous position that it is almost impossible to respond sensibly.

But, hey...here goes...one last attempt...

So you joined a thread called _*"Strike!" *_that was created to "*keep track of official and unofficial strikes, walk outs and worker led direct action, whether large or small. [Ideally not for bickering], but to help promote and support local action.*" and decided to make the point that the action was timed such that it would cause inconvenience and draw criticism. Then, after much bickering, you came clean and declared your hand by saying that the strike was a "*waste of time*" and the union "*ineffectual*"...and you think none of that relevant?

You've done more than take a whiney pop there chum; you've outed yourself as a bit of cunt.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

brogdale said:


> That's such a preposterous position that it is almost impossible to respond sensibly.
> 
> But, hey...here goes...one last attempt...
> 
> ...



I gave my opinion. I don't give a fuck for your ridiculous analysis.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I gave my opinion. I don't give a fuck for your ridiculous analysis.


 
Confirming my conclusion.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> the thing is- and I don't really find one dayers effective either- with the anti strike laws in this country, the erosion of solidarity and the quite real fear that a rolling strike would see you frozen out from wages and a union that won't even (because it can't afford it) cover half wages as strike pay- One dayers are what we have as a tool. Now, when your knife is blunt and you only get a limited opportunity to use it, where do you land the blow? Where it damn well counts.
> 
> Take for example when the petrol hauliers even suggested that they might ballot for strike action. It was chaos! queues at the pumps, petrol running out etc. Why? because they have a hand where it counts, on the jugular.
> 
> To strike when the iron is hot then must be seen as the soundest tactical move within a defanged workforce. And remember this is not for longer lunchbreaks and moar wages. It's to defend however they can agreements made that are now being broken. Think in tactics.



Except here it won't work because people will feel they have lost money - in some cases a lot of money - and will blame the PCS. I am judging this case onits own merits. It has nothing to do with the overall principle of strike action. I was invited to explain how i felt about theis particular strike and have done so. I didn't say so initially because it wasn't relevant.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

nino_savatte said:


> You're either doing this for a wind-up or you're genuinely thick. Which is it?
> 
> Most people on these boards are familiar with the saying "letting the cat out of the bag". But you? You play dumb.


This is just another ad hominem. I'm aware of what the phrase means, genius, that isn't what I asked you.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

editor said:


> Consider this your first warning.


of what?

you're quote happy for the cunt to keep stalking me and harassing me along with the other users and yet you do nothing except whine that you yourself are being harassed when its brought to your attention.

Nice holiday was it?


----------



## Lo Siento. (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Except here it won't work because people will feel they have lost money - in some cases a lot of money - and will blame the PCS. I am judging this case onits own merits. It has nothing to do with the overall principle of strike action. I was invited to explain how i felt about theis particular strike and have done so. I didn't say so initially because it wasn't relevant.


Nobody invited you to give your opinion on shit. You decided to offer your "critique" on a thread dedicated to supporting and publicising strike activity. If I wanted to hear the Guardian's take on it, I'd go there.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

Lo Siento. said:


> Nobody invited you to give your opinion on shit. You decided to offer your "critique" on a thread dedicated to supporting and publicising strike activity. If I wanted to hear the Guardian's take on it, I'd go there.


It's a discussion forum, the invitation is implied. Wouldn't really work otherwise would it!


----------



## Lo Siento. (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> It's a discussion forum, the invitation is implied. Wouldn't really work otherwise would it!



I say this through gritted teeth, because it should be obvious ... But can you not see why, given the amount of unfair shit that is routinely levelled at strikers by conservative and liberal press alike, it might be nice for this thread not to be like that?


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Except here it won't work because people will feel they have lost money - in some cases a lot of money - and will blame the PCS. I am judging this case onits own merits. It has nothing to do with the overall principle of strike action. I was invited to explain how i felt about theis particular strike and have done so. I didn't say so initially because it wasn't relevant.



some will, some won't. The court of public opinion isn't really what a strike action is about. It's nice if you are given solidarity but at heart the dispute is between the employees and the employer. If people have lost money they should recoup it from the people who began this dispute- the employer.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

Lo Siento. said:


> I say this through gritted teeth, because it should be obvious ... But can you not see why, given the amount of unfair shit that is routinely levelled at strikers by conservative and liberal press alike, it might be nice for this thread not to be like that?


The thread wasn't like that after I posted either, until the usual suspects who believe they are avenging class warriors decided to resort to abuse and trolling. I made one comment that wasn't remotely anti-union (unless you're a fucking moron or a troll). 

But again, completely ignore ALL THE PRO STRIKE POSTS IVE MADE BEFORE!


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> of what?
> 
> you're quote happy for the cunt to keep stalking me and harassing me along with the other users and yet you do nothing except whine that you yourself are being harassed when its brought to your attention.
> 
> Nice holiday was it?


it's a discussion forum,  and yet you object when people reply to you and point out that you are talking rubbish.  Every time this happens, you throw a huff and tell everyone else that they're cunts (with wishes for cancer and suicide as well).

Perhaps you should just admit you are not cut out for partaking in actual discussions.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> some will, some won't. The court of public opinion isn't really what a strike action is about. It's nice if you are given solidarity but at heart the dispute is between the employees and the employer. If people have lost money they should recoup it from the people who began this dispute- the employer.


That's why i said rightly or wrongly in respect to losing money.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I made one comment that wasn't remotely anti-union (unless you're a fucking moron or a troll).


Liar



Awesome Wells said:


> A one day strike in this instance is a complete waste of everyone's time. The PCS are largely ineffectual and Mark Serwotka is all talk.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> it's a discussion forum,  and yet you object when people reply to you and point out that you are talking rubbish.  Every time this happens, you throw a huff and tell everyone else that they're cunts (with wishes for cancer and suicide as well).
> 
> Perhaps you should just admit you are not cut out for partaking in actual discussions.


Perhaps you should bully someone else you prick and not whine when someone gets a bloody nose for winding someone up.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> Liar


And that statement is anti-union how? You don't even know what the phrase 'anti union' means do you?


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Perhaps you should bully someone else you prick and not whine when someone gets a bloody nose for winding someone up.


I'm not 'bullying' you - to do that I'd need to do something like, oh I dont know, tell you to kill yourself, or wish cancer on you.

I'm arguing with you.  And you are failing to argue back, you're just crying tat everyone disagrees with you. Tough shit.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> And that statement is anti-union how? You don't even know what the phrase 'anti union' means do you?


Saying your union is shit and your leader a fraud is anti-union, yes. If you cant tell that, then there is no hope for you.


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

who's doling out these bloody noses?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> I'm not 'bullying' you - to do that I'd need to do something like, oh I dont know, tell you to kill yourself, or wish cancer on you.
> 
> I'm arguing with you.  And you are failing to argue back, you're just crying tat everyone disagrees with you. Tough shit.


That you call it 'crying' proves the point. You're an idiot with a sad little agenda. You ignore waht suits your bullying agenda, just like the other cunts. You're just here deliberately trying to push my buttons because that's the desperate sad little prick you are, you sad old cunt.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> *Saying your union is shit and your leader a fraud *is anti-union, yes. If you cant tell that, then there is no hope for you.


Quote where I said those words.


----------



## weepiper (Jul 28, 2014)

Just stick him on ignore FFS.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 28, 2014)

This thread is just too weird but I keep looking at it.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Quote where I said those words.


I just did quote where you put forward that sentiment

You are an ignorant fool, incapable of making an argument, which is why you always immediately resort to abuse and calling people cunts, who should kill themselves, and cunts, and who should get cancer.  And then cunts again, just for good measure.And then you have the cheek to attack other people for 'ad hominems.'

Good luck doling out those 'bloody noses'


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

weepiper said:


> Just stick him on ignore FFS.


here's another intellectual coward and hypocrit


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> That's why i said rightly or wrongly in respect to losing money.




the thing is we can't base strikes on 'what the press and public will think of it'. The press will demonise every strike, except occasionally FBU cos its hard to sell 'look at these bastards wanting a decent wage! for going and saving people from burning death!'

no matter how righteous your reasons for the workplace dispute, you will be crucified in the press. So why give a fuck what they say? If individual customers are out of pocket, tell them why.

A strike won't even garner the support of the 'labour' party. They like union money but they don't like backing union disputes.

so inevitably it comes down to defending the pay and conditions you signed up for in good faith.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> I just did quote where you put forward that sentiment



I didn't ask you to do that. The cowardice on this forum is extraordinary: when confronted with your own bullshit you act out of hypocrisy. You accused me of saying something nasty through a straw man and when confronted on it you don't even have the stones to be honest about it. Just like the rest of the hypocrits and urban class warriors. If the people striking have you for support, then god help them.


----------



## chilango (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> here's another intellectual coward and hypocrit



Fucking hell.

Every time?

Can't you just fuck off to CIF or somewhere?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> the thing is we can't base strikes on 'what the press and public will think of it'. The press will demonise every strike, except occasionally FBU cos its hard to sell 'look at these bastards wanting a decent wage! for going and saving people from burning death!'
> 
> no matter how righteous your reasons for the workplace dispute, you will be crucified in the press. So why give a fuck what they say? If individual customers are out of pocket, tell them why.
> 
> ...


Which is great, in principle. 

In practice you have to pick your battles.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

chilango said:


> Fucking hell.
> 
> Every time?
> 
> Can't you just fuck off to CIF or somewhere?


Oh go fuck yourself


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Which is great, in principle.
> 
> In practice you have to pick your battles.


They just did. That's why, as a part of what is likely to be extended industrial action, they have struck for 24 hours. And why they chose this ground at this time. That's the battle.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I didn't ask you to do that. The cowardice on this forum is extraordinary: when confronted with your own bullshit you act out of hypocrisy. You accused me of saying something nasty through a straw man and when confronted on it you don't even have the stones to be honest about it. Just like the rest of the hypocrits and urban class warriors. If the people striking have you for support, then god help them.


What was the _straw man_?  You dont know what that means, do you?  Its just a phrase you've picked up that you think makes you look clever.  But it doesnt when you use it wrongly. And it's a bit rich you saying I 'accused you of saying something nasty' when you're the one who's just been calling for a poster to kill themself and calling every single other person a cunt etc etc


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Which is great, in principle.
> 
> In practice you have to pick your battles.


such as striking at a time that will have an impact.  Except you dont actually support that, do you?


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> such as striking at a time that will have an impact.  Except you dont actually support that, do you?


Ah no, that would provoke reactions moaning about the impact.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> What was the _straw man_?  You dont know what that means, do you?  Its just a phrase you've picked up that you think makes you look clever.  But it doesnt when you use it wrongly. And it's a bit rich you saying I 'accused you of saying something nasty' when you're the one who's just been calling for a poster to kill themself and calling every single other person a cunt etc etc


I asked you to quote me saying what you accused me of saying.

You still haven't done that. Instead you accuse what I actually said of saying something it didn't.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> such as striking at a time that will have an impact.  Except you dont actually support that, do you?


You tell me, i'm sure you have evidence to support that.

And ill take no lectures in supporting actions from an intellectually dishonest liar and coward like you, you fucking old cunt.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

that


Awesome Wells said:


> Which is great, in principle.
> 
> In practice *you have to pick your battles.*




exactly! if you are without wider support and outnumbered, when do you strike? Militarily speaking? when you have 'higher ground' or similar situational advantage.

Go-slows, work to rule and so on can be effective, but striking on a day that isn't going to hurt the employer is really worthless. They'll pat you on the head like a toothless dog and continue eroding the things you sell your labour for.

these people understand nothing except profits, unless you hit the purse they will not listen. News, public opinion- thats just the weather to them.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> You tell me, i'm sure you have evidence to support that.


uhh, do you recall your original post on here?  About them striking at the wrong time? because it will lose them public support?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> that
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I'm well aware of the purpose of striking and assuming I don't is insulting. I simply do not think this is one of those times.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> uhh, do you recall your original post on here?  About them striking at the wrong time? because it will lose them public support?


Another strawman: you are arguing that i made a general point. I did not. 

Do you not understand what the word QUOTE means?

You really are a fucking moron.


----------



## chilango (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Oh go fuck yourself



Well you obviously don't like it here...


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

Nah, this has to stop doesn't it? We can't have this over and over.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> I'm well aware of the purpose of striking and assuming I don't is insulting. I simply do not think this is one of those times.




it never is the right time. Waiting for the right time is what lands you being outsourced for zero hour contract min wage labour.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

chilango said:


> Well you obviously don't like it here...


Then show some fucking respect. What is wrong with you people? Anyone who disgares is attacked constantly, their position undermined through misrepresentation and abuse. It's fucking childish.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> it never is the right time. Waiting for the right time is what lands you being outsourced for zero hour contract min wage labour.


I'm not talking abotu the right time. I'm talking about a better time.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

what better time is there going to be than one which will cause the employer to lose money and review the utility of your labour by seeing how much lucre he is losing? Employers when looking to save costs always but always look to labour costs first and see how they can cut you to the bone. And we put up with it because we need to keep the roof on our heads and food in our bellies. They know it's cheaper to squeeze an employee force who will voluntarily undertake personal savings, sacrifice that holiday, start shopping cheaper etc etc

There's never been a better time to strike, its all out war on every public sector role now- christ they even want to undo standardised pay models like HERA to re-introduce regional payscales! now or never. While the iron is hot.


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Another strawman: you are arguing that i made a general point. I did not.
> 
> Do you not understand what the word QUOTE means?
> 
> You really are a fucking moron.


And you really dont understand what a straw man is. 

Goodbye


----------



## tufty79 (Jul 28, 2014)

weepiper said:


> Just stick him on ignore FFS.


^^makes threads feel far less hateful, depressing and spittle-flecked - one of the better choices i've made this year.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

Something fucking wrong with the people on this website that all they can do is attack and treat other people like shit. I thought this was meant to be a more liberal or open minded website. It's a fucking joke. Moderators that accuse people of racism without evidence and then cry foul when they are challenged, or who claim to be against bullying but allow it to go unchecked and claim that, when it's brought to their attention, they are themselves being bullied. The whole place is filled with people that cannot discuess things without resorting to playing the man and not the ball - and then abuse people for pointing that out. Its run by a sad old clique of stoners and class warriors who cannot tolerate someone who doesn't say exactly what they think they should say, even when they don't make the effort to correctly understand what someone is actually saying.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

belboid said:


> And you really dont understand what a straw man is.
> 
> Goodbye


A straw man is a form of argument that misrepresents what the person actually said to try an attack their position. It's what you have done constantly. You are nothing but a gutless coward, you give a shit about industrial action and worker's rights? Dont' make me laugh. You don't care a drop of piss for any of that, you're just a sad spiteful old cunt.


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

Why the repeated hatred of old folks like belboid? That's an odd one.


----------



## chilango (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Something fucking wrong with the people on this website that all they can do is attack and treat other people like shit. I thought this was meant to be a more liberal or open minded website. It's a fucking joke. Moderators that accuse people of racism without evidence and then cry foul when they are challenged, or who claim to be against bullying but allow it to go unchecked and claim that, when it's brought to their attention, they are themselves being bullied. The whole place is filled with people that cannot discuess things without resorting to playing the man and not the ball - and then abuse people for pointing that out. Its run by a sad old clique of stoners and class warriors who cannot tolerate someone who doesn't say exactly what they think they should say, even when they don't make the effort to correctly understand what someone is actually saying.



Then why stick around?


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> Nah, this has to stop doesn't it? We can't have this over and over.


 yeah.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

The moderators can do what they like.


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

I'd suggest some kind of collective action. Just no one ever respond to the cunt.


----------



## chilango (Jul 28, 2014)

killer b said:


> I'd suggest some kind of collective action. Just no one ever respond to the cunt.



Mass ignore?


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

chilango said:


> Mass ignore?


what's the point? putting half a forum on ignore is rewarding the cunts. I'm sick to death of being attacked. For a site that claims to give a damn about things like mental health, the very reason im on ESA, the moderators don't give a fuck.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> what better time is there going to be than one which will cause the employer to lose money and review the utility of your labour by seeing how much lucre he is losing?


 
Not sure that applies in the public sector so mucb - but the key here is that the Passport Service has been hammered repeatedly in the media over delays, has already had to draft in more staff and is quite clearly unable to tackle the mounting backlogs during peak season.

So  it poses the question that if a union is in dispute with this employer over pay and jobs when else would be a better time to take action a) to ramp up the pressure on the employer and b) to use the media interest in the story to press your industrial agenda?


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

chilango said:


> Mass ignore?


 I've already taken that measure personally (I'm peeking today), and would urge others to enjoy the benefits: lower blood pressure, less hours lost at work to worthless argument and a little less hate in your heart.


----------



## chilango (Jul 28, 2014)

So how does an anti-authoritarian community enforce the punishment or expulsion of an antisocial element?


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Not sure that applies in the public sector so much




passports are a business, the movement of citizenry is a business- they make money from this (political embarrassment aside). There is no way the issuing and surrounding labour costs therein justify the price of a passport.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 28, 2014)

chilango said:


> So how does an anti-authoritarian community enforce the punishment or expulsion of an antisocial element?


 
Bit of an abstract question to chuck in.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

chilango said:


> So how does an anti-authoritarian community enforce the punishment or expulsion of an antisocial element?


 Pre-figuratively.


----------



## chilango (Jul 28, 2014)

8ball said:


> Bit of an abstract question to chuck in.



...or is it?


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

chilango said:


> So how does an anti-authoritarian community enforce the punishment or expulsion of an antisocial element?


Disassociation - but has to be done collectively.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 28, 2014)

butchersapron said:


> Disassociation - but has to be done collectively.


 
Or it's the thumbscrews...


----------



## butchersapron (Jul 28, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> passports are a business, the movement of citizenry is a business- they make money from this (political embarrassment aside). There is no way the issuing and surrounding labour costs therein justify the price of a passport.


Public owned = bureaucratic pressure on those above and threat of total gridlock that will, eventually, fall on those in govt.


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> You seem to have inferred that I dont support the cause of the PCS staff. Please provide some evidence to support that assertion, if that is what you indeed think. If it isn't, i've really no idea what you are trying to say.


take whatever inference you want...my point was and is very clear...strike action needs to be disruptive...if it didn't disrupt then no one would notice the difference so it would not be worth doing...and if any one one doesn't grasp this very simple premise they are either anti union or stupid...what is there not to understand?


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> In what way am i non union, proudly or otherwise? How do you draw that conclusion when a simple read through of threads about strikes that i've posted in will demonstrate the complete opposite. You still don't get what a scab is, nor do you have any understanding of that which you speak. You're a just a sad prejudiced old twat.



i suspect the quote below from you is why why people conclude that you are "non union"



Awesome Wells said:


> I've never been a member of a union. Is that relevant? If you have a point in all of this could you get to it quicker.


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Then answer the question. Something you people are incapable of doing. You set yourselves up to with all this working class bravado and when confronted with something as simple as a question asking you to explain what you mean or what you think you resort to ad hominem and straw man. YOu people do it all the time it's laughable. You have ridiculously inferred that I don't understand strike action, with no evidence to support this claim, and that I am against the PCS striking on the issue of passport processing, also without evidence. When questioned about this, despite my previous posts for the last year unequivocally supporting strike action, such as the teachers strikes, you, again and predictably, assume the worst. *I wouldn't want a bunch of hypocrits and gutless cowards like you representing me.* You're pathetic.



no one on here could as you have never been in a union


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> This is a straw man: i didn't say the discussion was pointless. I was referring to your question. I'm perfectly happy to discuss the strike, which is why I contributed to it. You then decided to infer something unpleasant that was never there. Like the rest of the class warriors.
> 
> Doesn't matter whether i've been on strike or not. Completely irrelevant. Assuming therefore that only people who've been on strike, only members of that special club, can have a valid contribution is pathetic and arrogant.
> 
> ...



this was your response to the question "do you support this pcs strike?"... is that a yes or a no?


----------



## killer b (Jul 28, 2014)

it's pointless comrade. totally pointless.


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 28, 2014)

fair enough...have just finished reading all the posts...should have done that before responding...what a car crash of a discussion...can't say I have ever seen someone miss the point by such a wide margin before and as for some of the abuse s/he dished out before claiming he or she that everyone else was making the mental health condition worse ... not sure what to make of all of that...


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

comrade spurski said:


> i suspect the quote below from you is why why people conclude that you are "non union"


There is no evidence to support that at all other than your own prejudice since i have never taken a position that says unions are negative in any way shape or form. If you believe this then you are prejudiced. Like the rest of the cowards you have no evidence and will only resoprt to ad homs when challenged.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Jul 28, 2014)

comrade spurski said:


> fair enough...have just finished reading all the posts...should have done that before responding...what a car crash of a discussion...can't say I have ever seen someone miss the point by such a wide margin before and as for some of the abuse s/he dished out before claiming he or she that everyone else was making the mental health condition worse ... not sure what to make of all of that...


I haven't missded any point because I have never made an anti union nor anti industrial action point. I have simply said thatm, in my opinion, this strike will not be effective. If you think that justifies either of the above position then you are being deliberately prejudiced. That would be like saying I don't like London as evidence I hate the idea of cities. It is stupid and deliberately nasty.


----------



## editor (Jul 28, 2014)

FYI: Awesome Wells has been banned for a week for sending me abusive PMs. I hovered over the 'permanent' ban option for some time before selecting the week option.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 28, 2014)

editor said:


> FYI: Awesome Wells has been banned for a week for sending me abusive PMs. I hovered over the 'permanent' ban option for some time before selecting the week option.



jedem nach seinen Bedürfnissen


----------



## seventh bullet (Jul 28, 2014)

Awesome Wells _again_...


----------



## JTG (Jul 28, 2014)

I'll put this here: I don't know what AW's MH issue is, nor whether it affects his interesting style. I do know that it's not a reason to put up with this kind of reaction from him. Assuming he comes back, I think a mass ignore is wise


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 28, 2014)

JTG said:


> I'll put this here: I don't know what AW's MH issue is, nor whether it affects his interesting style. I do know that it's not a reason to put up with this kind of reaction from him. Assuming he comes back, *I think a mass ignore is wise*



Not saying I wouldn't join in with this and I hope plenty of others would, but frankly, I think he's got off very lightly with just a week's ban.

When I bumped the thread this morning with a mainstream link (Guardian I think) to the news about today's strike**, I'd hoped for some good discussion. Well there's some good _points_ (eg Dot Communist , comrade spurski , brogdale  ) in response to (ahem!) some pretty wild posts from AW, but that's not the same ...

**There didn't seem to be anything on the PCS site at the time -- there's a better page now though


----------



## comrade spurski (Jul 28, 2014)

editor said:


> FYI: Awesome Wells has been banned for a week for sending me abusive PMs. I hovered over the 'permanent' ban option for some time before selecting the week option.



you are a patient moderator...not sure if AW's actually understands how abusive, confrontational and unkind they come across as...but it's unpleasant so god knows how bad the abusive messages you recieved were


----------



## editor (Jul 28, 2014)

comrade spurski said:


> you are a patient moderator...not sure if AW's actually understands how abusive, confrontational and unkind they come across as...but it's unpleasant so god knows how bad the abusive messages you recieved were


I don't mind people disagreeing with a mod's decision, but when my inbox starts getting really abusive messages and they carry on after being told to stop, well, that's the point where I make sure they stop.


----------



## chilango (Jul 28, 2014)

editor said:


> I don't mind people disagreeing with a mod's decision, but when my inbox starts getting really abusive messages and they carry on after being told to stop, well, that's the point where I make sure they stop.



I think, for the good if all (incl . AW), a permaban would be the kindest option. Otherwise we're gonna see some some experimental cybermobjustice occurring.


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 28, 2014)

everyone calls AW a cunt and etc- because he can be. But he has some good things to say, albeit they are largely confined to threads on welfare right etc. 

A week is fair enough- it'll only enflame his sense of injustice further tho.


----------



## yield (Jul 29, 2014)

DotCommunist said:


> everyone calls AW a cunt and etc- because he can be. But he has some good things to say, albeit they are largely confined to threads on welfare right etc.
> 
> A week is fair enough- it'll only enflame his sense of injustice further tho.


Not knocking Ed's decision but Awesome Wells is dealing with mental health problems.


Awesome Wells said:


> Some of these people, from having read my threads and posts (such as my efforts to secure an ESA claim) know that i have issues with mental health, yet they choose to continue.


My mental health ain't great because of stress at work but it does make me wonder how much people can or are willing to accept?


----------



## DotCommunist (Jul 29, 2014)

.


----------



## JTG (Jul 29, 2014)

Urban, its posters and its mods do not have to bear the fall out though


----------



## MooChild (Jul 29, 2014)

(OT) He (AW) has been a twat forever. I had an argument with him years ago about Job seeking, where he was saying it was all too hard and why should I etc etc. I remained constructive with options around Open University to enhance his prospects, and linked up pages of information where he was able to find out that he could get free tuition if he was on the dole. He resorted to calling me a cunt then, and hasn't changed since. I hope he doesn't come back, he offers nothing at all to the forum.


----------



## JTG (Jul 29, 2014)

Oh I know that, he was like that when he still posted as wishface too.

Anyway, back to picket lines and that


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jul 29, 2014)

Picking up on JTG's point, PCS members in HMRC are also on strike this week (Tax Credit deadline is 31st of the month):

http://www.pcs.org.uk/en/revenue_an...s-and-staffing-campaign-further-action-called

And here is how press coverage, albeit from Toynbee, and in conjunction with disruptive action can help build pressure on the employer:

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...l-tax-system-cheating-billions-chase-avoiders


----------



## treelover (Jul 29, 2014)

MooChild said:


> (OT) He (AW) has been a twat forever. I had an argument with him years ago about Job seeking, where he was saying it was all too hard and why should I etc etc. I remained constructive with options around Open University to enhance his prospects, and linked up pages of information where he was able to find out that he could get free tuition if he was on the dole. He resorted to calling me a cunt then, and hasn't changed since. I hope he doesn't come back, he offers nothing at all to the forum.



I'm sorry but I'd say its none of your business once he has rejected your advice how he deals with the utter misery of the job situation and the brutal welfare regime he faces , he shouldn't call you a 'cunt' (though that just seems to be the norm on these boards) but its clear the guy has MH issues and is under tremendous strain with his problems with living,


----------



## ddraig (Jul 29, 2014)

and what is your excuse?


----------



## MooChild (Jul 29, 2014)

treelover said:


> I'm sorry but I'd say its none of your business once he has rejected your advice how he deals with the utter misery of the job situation and the brutal welfare regime he faces , he shouldn't call you a 'cunt' (though that just seems to be the norm on these boards) but its clear the guy has MH issues and is under tremendous strain with his problems with living,



I agree he has issues, and this forum does nothing to help them, as he just seems to get angry with people trying to help him. He will not even try to analyse the cause of his issues. It's not a healthy place for him to be, and he just annoys everyone when he won't listen to reason and wildly throws insults around.


----------



## weepiper (Jul 29, 2014)

MooChild said:


> (OT) He (AW) has been a twat forever. I had an argument with him years ago about Job seeking, where he was saying it was all too hard and why should I etc etc. I remained constructive with options around Open University to enhance his prospects, and linked up pages of information where he was able to find out that he could get free tuition if he was on the dole. He resorted to calling me a cunt then, and hasn't changed since. I hope he doesn't come back, he offers nothing at all to the forum.



Wow. Reading that it makes it even more obvious how pointless it is engaging with him at all. No matter what you say it will end with him cunting everyone off and accusing everyone of bullying.


----------



## brogdale (Jul 29, 2014)

weepiper said:


> Wow. Reading that it makes it even more obvious how pointless it is engaging with him at all. No matter what you say it will end with him cunting everyone off and accusing everyone of bullying.


 tbf a developed anti-work ethic would appear to be one of his/her few redeeming features.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 30, 2014)

MooChild said:


> I agree he has issues, and this forum does nothing to help them, as he just seems to get angry with people trying to help him. He will not even try to analyse the cause of his issues. It's not a healthy place for him to be, and he just annoys everyone when he won't listen to reason and wildly throws insults around.


And there's something about responsibility: saying he has MH problems may EXPLAIN his responses, but it is not reasonable for him to expect it to EXCUSE them. He's the one who needs to learn how to interact with others in such a way as to feel safe and comfortable. Of course, it's nice if people do cut him some slack (and I think they do), but that's their choice, not something he's entitled to demand.


----------



## JTG (Jul 30, 2014)

Indeed. You're never obliged to put up with that behaviour, even if there is an explanation


----------



## belboid (Aug 1, 2014)

https://www.bectu.org.uk/news/2227

Ritzy strikers to be balloted on a vastly improved offer - 'two-thirds' of what they were after supposedly


----------



## Riklet (Aug 4, 2014)

Heres to them holding out for the full shebang then!


----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 7, 2014)

Awesome Wells said:


> Oh go fuck yourself


it's great to see reasoned argument and rational debate on urban75


----------



## marty21 (Aug 7, 2014)

Unison out again on Oct 14th (moved from Sept 30)


----------



## Looby (Sep 26, 2014)

Bit of a bump but there is a week of action coming in October.

What I want to check is, would there be unison members working in a GP surgery? I'm thinking non-medical staff like receptionists. 

I've got an appointment booked for strike day and if I don't change it soon I won't get another.


----------



## krink (Sep 29, 2014)

In local government, Unite and GMB are looking to bottle it and agree to the latest shit offer. Unison saying strike goes ahead.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 29, 2014)

marty21 said:


> Unison out again on Oct 14th (moved from Sept 30)




Not sure yet whether or not PCS will be involved too. If so, I'll be out myself.


----------



## weepiper (Sep 29, 2014)

krink said:


> In local government, Unite and GMB are looking to bottle it and agree to the latest shit offer. Unison saying strike goes ahead.


Midwives have voted to join the strike after they were ballotted for the first time in the RCM's history


----------



## mwgdrwg (Oct 2, 2014)

marty21 said:


> Unison out again on Oct 14th (moved from Sept 30)



I thought the plan was 2 days this time?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 2, 2014)

krink said:


> In local government, Unite and GMB are looking to bottle it and agree to the latest shit offer. Unison saying strike goes ahead.



The GMB ballot is still live from July 10th.

ALL OUT!


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 2, 2014)

mwgdrwg said:


> I thought the plan was 2 days this time?



One day. Just as Gideon says that the Public Sector ain't getting fuck all. If July 10th was owt to go by, Oct 14th will be a disaster


----------



## ddraig (Oct 2, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> The GMB ballot is still live from July 10th.
> 
> ALL OUT!


i have had nothing from GMB on this and my boss asked who is striking the other day
have said i will be if there is a strike but as of yet heard nothing


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 2, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> One day. Just as Gideon says that the Public Sector ain't getting fuck all. If July 10th was owt to go by, Oct 14th will be a disaster


it is always a disaster. it's cliff richard's birthday.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 2, 2014)

ddraig said:


> i have had nothing from GMB on this and my boss asked who is striking the other day
> have said i will be if there is a strike but as of yet heard nothing



I suspect details will be sent very shortly. I hope you told your boss to fuck off?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 2, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> it is always a disaster. it's cliff richard's birthday.



Maybe every scab should be forced to wear a cheap plastic Cliff mask for the day?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 2, 2014)

Pickman's model said:


> it is always a disaster. it's cliff richard's birthday.


You either looked that up, or you _knew _it 

(Or someone else mentioned it, but that's boring)


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 2, 2014)

Lord Camomile said:


> You either looked that up, or you _knew _it
> 
> (Or someone else mentioned it, but that's boring)


margaret thatcher born 13/10
cliff richard born 14/10


----------



## ddraig (Oct 2, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> I suspect details will be sent very shortly. I hope you told your boss to fuck off?


ta
not yet...


----------



## PursuedByBears (Oct 2, 2014)

UCU are balloting for strike action over changes to the USS pension scheme.


----------



## belboid (Oct 14, 2014)

St Mungo's workers coming out for a week - http://www.unitetheunion.org/news/f...rs-vote-unanimously-to-take-week-long-strike/


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 14, 2014)

I'll still be out tomorrow. PCS reps were heavily leafletting the entrances yesterday morning and this morning. It was a local-focussed leaflet from the branch, not from national PCS, and it wasn't a bad one. I've heard more members say they'll be out than not, but there'll be some non-members in. I'm more confident those'll be a smallish minority of the total than I was the other day, though


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Oct 15, 2014)

We're out today. 

Solidarity to all out on strike this week.


----------



## Awesome Wells (Oct 15, 2014)

PursuedByBears said:


> USS pension scheme.


----------



## treelover (Oct 18, 2014)

The TUC demo today was according to media reports nearly 100'00 large, so could have been even more


----------



## 8115 (Oct 18, 2014)

treelover said:


> The TUC demo today was according to media reports nearly 100'00 large, so could have been even more


I would be surprised, I went, don't wanna piss on anyone's bonfire but it didn't look that big to me unless they mean all the marches combined? Was surprised how few people there were tbh considering was basically all unions, or I am bad at estimating, considering I have done a lot of club etc capacity I don't think so. But good atmosphere.


----------



## 8115 (Oct 18, 2014)

treelover said:


> The TUC demo today was according to media reports nearly 100'00 large, so could have been even more


Oh if you mean 10,000 yeah would be about right.  Saw a report of 80-90,000 somewhere, that would surprise me. Maybe I was naive to expect bigger.


----------



## treelover (Oct 19, 2014)

A sea of flags and banners as people march.
Photograph: Toby Melville/Reuters


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 19, 2014)

Latest number I've heard is 50k - which considering the estimated 500k who marched for (The Alternative) on March 26th 2011 is a woeful turnout, not helped by the fact though, people are fucking skint!


----------



## belboid (Oct 19, 2014)

After nearly all the strikes were called off, it seemed like nothing more than a token effort. That's why I couldn't be arsed.


----------



## treelover (Oct 19, 2014)

> The TUC, which organised the protests under the slogan “Britain Needs a Pay Rise”, said that between 80,000 and 90,000 people took part in the London march.
> 
> http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/oct/18/under-30s-priced-out-of-uk-alan-milburn



Bit higher, but yes, many can't afford to go, don't have time or have lost interest.


----------



## belboid (Oct 19, 2014)

Thread followers may well be shocked to know that the photo below is real.  It has not been photoshopped, nor taken 'out of context.'  It really is Ed Miliband.  Labour Party leader, Ed Miliband. On what is - and what he knew to be - a, I know you wont believe it, but.... on a picket line.


----------



## treelover (Oct 19, 2014)

When was this?, the Tories will be circulating it as we post.


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 20, 2014)

I am shocked by that picture -- how did those strikers persuade him to step outside his spin managers' approved trajectory?


----------



## dennisr (Oct 20, 2014)

87 days late


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 20, 2014)

OK, that makes it much more believable.


----------



## Lo Siento. (Oct 20, 2014)

William of Walworth said:


> I am shocked by that picture -- how did those strikers persuade him to step outside his spin managers' approved trajectory?


He's even stood next to a couple of SP placards! Wait til Roy Hattersley hears about this...


----------



## Sprocket. (Oct 20, 2014)

belboid said:


> Thread followers may well be shocked to know that the photo below is real.  It has not been photoshopped, nor taken 'out of context.'  It really is Ed Miliband.  Labour Party leader, Ed Miliband. On what is - and what he knew to be - a, I know you wont believe it, but.... on a picket line.



He was photo bombed they jumped him on his way to his surgery. 
This could be another caption competition.

http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/articles/19529


----------



## Ungrateful (Oct 20, 2014)

UCU members vote on strike action and action short of a strike over pension cuts.

For strike action:

  Number of ballot papers counted: 17,212
  Number voting YES: 13,395 (77.8%)
  Number voting NO: 3,817 (22.2%)

Are you prepared to take industrial action consisting of action short of a strike?

  Number of ballot papers counted: 17,154
  Number voting YES: 14,879 (86.7%)
  Number voting NO: 2,275 (13.3%)

Turn out 44.5% (considerably higher than council elections, euro-elections and police commissioner elections).

Full details here


----------



## belboid (Oct 20, 2014)

Sprocket. said:


> He was photo bombed they jumped him on his way to his surgery.
> This could be another caption competition.
> 
> http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/articles/19529


aah, he was 'very happy to be photographed' according to my source...


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 14, 2014)

94% of GMB members in Local gov voted to accept pay offer. I had a feeling it'd be accepted but quite amazed at %

We're fucked.


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 14, 2014)

Unison out in the NHS for four hours on 24th November.


----------



## Onket (Nov 14, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> 94% of GMB members in Local gov voted to accept pay offer. I had a feeling it'd be accepted but quite amazed at %
> 
> 
> We're fucked.



I heard both Unite and GMB voted to accept.


Not had word on Unison before I left work.


I think you're right though, fucked.


----------



## krink (Nov 14, 2014)

Anyone know the turnout? Particularly for GMB in local govt.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 14, 2014)

Not sure yet krink - please post if you find out!


----------



## krink (Nov 14, 2014)

Will do.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 14, 2014)

Blagsta said:


> Unison out in the NHS for four hours on 24th November.



And this is part of the problem. 4 hours? May as well not bother


----------



## Lo Siento. (Nov 14, 2014)

Telling my students to expect delays on essay marks today and why. All took it OK.


----------



## Blagsta (Nov 14, 2014)

Mr.Bishie said:


> And this is part of the problem. 4 hours? May as well not bother



I hear you. Part of the reason though is that any longer might impact on care. I don't know if it's possible to organise a longer action in community services and shorter in inpatient services.


----------



## krink (Nov 14, 2014)

Where I work people aren't happy but voted for the new offer. Its because they have no faith at all that the unions are strong enough or have the will to win. Its fucked up cos there is enough if us to win easily but the leadership is worse than shit.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Nov 14, 2014)

krink said:


> Where I work people aren't happy but voted for the new offer. Its because they have no faith at all that the unions are strong enough or have the will to win. Its fucked up cos there is enough if us to win easily but the leadership is worse than shit.



Gideon has said that the public sector ain't getting fuck all. Workers know this, so striking is pissing in the wind.

360 jobs going in our place over the next two years, with a workforce of 1,360! The next DCG meeting scheduled for December 3rd is going to be fucking depressing.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Jan 27, 2015)

So Thursday's strike action for NHS workers has been called off by unions, pending further talks with Gov. Seems to be a growing trend - strike dates set, then called off at the last minute.


----------



## treelover (Jan 27, 2015)

Unions will do anything not to strike before a general election, can't rock the boat for labour, especially unions like Unison.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 7, 2015)

Now that the General Election is done, we have forthcoming rail strikes -- First Great Western, 6:30 pm Wednesday 8th July to 11:59 pm Saturday 11th July.

This BBC link is the most up to date thing I can find

RMT site less up to date.

Oh yes and for you Londoners  (  ) :

Talks continuing re the prospective Tube strike


----------



## 2hats (Jul 7, 2015)

William of Walworth said:


> Now that the General Election is done, we have forthcoming rail strikes -- First Great Western, 6:30 pm Wednesday 8th July to 11:59 pm Saturday 11th July.



Till Friday evening I think - 48 hours? Though with some disruptions inevitably running in to Saturday morning services?


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 7, 2015)

2hats said:


> Till Friday evening I think - 48 hours? Though with some disruptions inevitably running in to Saturday morning services?




I was convinced (not sure from where, now) that the FGW strike would be until (almost) midnight Saturday, but that BBC link doesn't specify that, neither does this RMT link that I've just found.

ETA : RMT link above does say 'forty-eight hours' though (  ) so that would make it 'til some time after 18:30 on Friday (10th). Exact time of end of strike not specified.


----------



## 2hats (Jul 7, 2015)

So it's affecting FGW starting gradually from 1800 on Wednesday 8th July up to the start of service on Saturday 11th July. Then there is an overtime ban on Saturday 11th July which could mean late changes and some cancellations.

The tube strike stops services from 1800 on Wednesday 8th July until morning services resume on Friday 10th July.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Sep 15, 2015)

> 14 September 2015
> 
> RMT Press Office
> 
> ...



After the bollocks of the anti trade union bill being passed last night, it really is the time...

ALL OUT!!! Bring this fucking Government to its knees, & then behead the fucker.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 15, 2015)

Mr.Bishie said:


> After the bollocks of the anti trade union bill being passed last night, it really is the time...
> 
> ALL OUT!!! Bring this fucking Government to its knees, & then behead the fucker.



 


Will be keeping a very close eye on this. 

Related, much more specific RMT issue : The new buildings/HQs for some of these  new Hitachi trains (the ones that FGW want to make all these staffing and safety cuts over) are very near our house and are nearly finished. I've already chatted with an RMT activist at Swansea station (during the 3 day Bank Holiday weekend strike).

I fully support the RMT in all this!


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 15, 2015)

Any one know if the TUC have details for the "day of action" suggested about the trade union bill that has just had the second reading ... ?
eg regional protests ...


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Sep 15, 2015)

StoneRoad said:


> Any one know if the TUC have details for the "day of action" suggested about the trade union bill that has just had the second reading ... ?
> eg regional protests ...



No details about storming Westminster have been released yet afaik.


----------



## brogdale (Sep 15, 2015)

Mr.Bishie said:


> No details about storming Westminster have been released yet afaik.


When the tories legislated against organised labour 44 years ago the Angry Brigade bombed the, then, Employment minister's house.


----------



## moochedit (Oct 3, 2017)

I think the results of the royal mail strike ballot is today. strike is against changes to thier pensions. can't see any news yet though.


----------



## redsquirrel (Oct 3, 2017)

RMT Northern are also on strike again today and Thursday, so good luck comrades!


----------



## cantsin (Oct 3, 2017)

our local (Devon ) train drivers / Guards ( RMT ) voting to strike ( 80% in favour) 

Devon train drivers and guards vote for strike action


----------



## moochedit (Oct 3, 2017)

moochedit said:


> I think the results of the royal mail strike ballot is today. strike is against changes to thier pensions. can't see any news yet though.



yep..

Royal Mail staff vote in favour of strike



> Royal Mail workers have voted in favour of strike action in a row over pensions and pay.
> 
> The Communication Workers Union (CWU) said 73.7% of its 110,000 members cast their votes, with 89% backing a strike.
> 
> ...


----------



## Harry Patel (Oct 3, 2017)

Goddamit I was looking forward to a lie in on Thursday but now the Underground strike has been called off!


----------



## redsquirrel (Oct 5, 2017)

RMT voting up action on South Western too.


> The row over the role and responsibilities of onboard train staff, which has led to strikes over the past 18 months around the railway, has remained bitter and looks set to draw in one of the biggest commuter franchises after conductors on South Western Railway voted for strike action on Tuesday.



And UCU taking action at University of Manchester


> The union announced that strike action would take place on Monday 23 October and Tuesday 24 October, and staff would then begin working to rule from Thursday 25 October. The University of Manchester branch of the UCU is the largest in the country, with just over 1,800 members.


----------



## moochedit (Oct 12, 2017)

moochedit said:


> yep..
> 
> Royal Mail staff vote in favour of strike



Royal Mail have now stopped it by a court injunction.   The cwu were due to strike for 48 hours next week on 19th Oct.

Royal Mail halts 48-hour strike after obtaining high court injunction


----------



## teqniq (Jan 21, 2019)

Different kind of strike here (I am playing very loosely with the definition). Apparently if you read the thread, the place was going to open the next day and the guy hadn't been paid since Christmas.... so born presumably of anger and frustration, he took matters into his own hands.


----------



## teqniq (Jan 22, 2019)

Back to more conventional forms of protest:


----------



## 8ball (Jan 22, 2019)

teqniq said:


> Different kind of strike here (I am playing very loosely with the definition). Apparently if you read the thread, the place was going to open the next day and the guy hadn't been paid since Christmas.... so born presumably of anger and frustration, he took matters into his own hands.




The GoFundMe page that a supporter set up has already covered his back-pay and is now onto legal fees.


----------



## teqniq (Jan 22, 2019)

The police are still looking for him according to the Graun, so I surmise a bit of solidarity going on there.


----------



## chilango (Jan 22, 2019)

Indicative Ballot Result from the NEU:
_
Would you be prepared to take part in strike action to secure better funding for schools and the full implementation of the teachers' pay award? _
YES 82%


----------



## smokedout (Jan 30, 2020)

Given the doom and gloom recently I thought this was worth posting.  1000 porters, caterers and cleaners across 5 hospitals have been brought in house after strike action from UVW Union.


----------



## teqniq (Jul 15, 2020)

More of this needed here, I feel. -people power, that is.









						Coronavirus: France's health workers given pay rises worth €8bn
					

The government signs a deal worth €8bn (£7.2bn; $9bn) hailing the workers' role in the pandemic.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				












						France raises pay for health care workers by more than €8 billion
					

The French government and unions signed an agreement Monday giving over eight billion euros in pay rises for health workers, with the prime minister admitting the move was overdue in view of the coronavirus…




					www.france24.com


----------



## 19force8 (Jul 15, 2020)

Don't know if this belongs here or in the Covid threads.

Worth listening to the recording - just blatant union busting.









						Cleaning Company Suggests It May Only Provide PPE If Workers Ditch Union
					

Organisers have called Ridge Crest Cleaning's alleged refusal to provide cleaners with face masks unless they disaffiliate from their trade union "blatant union busting".




					www.vice.com


----------



## zahir (Aug 14, 2020)

A documentary about the UVW.


----------



## Serge Forward (Aug 14, 2020)

Great video. Really inspiring.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 14, 2020)

Great stuff. Thanks for posting zahir


----------



## teqniq (Aug 14, 2020)




----------



## hitmouse (Dec 10, 2020)

Wee bit of good news for the day:
*Cleaner’s union UVW forces Great Ormond Street Children’s Hospital to end outsourcing and bring hundreds of outsourced workers into the direct employment of the NHS*


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 10, 2020)

hitmouse said:


> Wee bit of good news for the day:
> *Cleaner’s union UVW forces Great Ormond Street Children’s Hospital to end outsourcing and bring hundreds of outsourced workers into the direct employment of the NHS*



nice one hitmouse Thanks for posting


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 12, 2020)

Big write-up of the UVW campaign at Sage Nursing Home here: Jewish care home workers are striking. Will the community stand with them?

If anyone lives around Golders Green and would like to help out with leafleting the local area, they're asking people to get involved:

*Leafleting meet up point:* 

Golders Green Station 

*Times: * 

Sunday 13th December 11am – 1pm  

Wednesday 16th December 5 – 7pm 

If you have any questions about the campaign or would like more information on leafleting, please email Isabel and Molly at sagenursinghome@uvwunion.org.uk.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 18, 2020)

Excellent article covering a very important dispute. Workers have been on strike since the 6th November and are now locked out. The strike is a fight to prevent their work being offshored to Singapore:









						Behind the Battle for Barnoldswick
					

As the Rolls-Royce strike runs into Christmas, workers are worried about more than their jobs – they fear for the community that would be left behind by the latest devastating chapter of deindustrialisation.




					tribunemag.co.uk
				




Stewards are asking us to do the following....

1. We have two social media hashtags, #BattleForBarnoldswick and #SaveOurSite. We encourage supporters to record a short video message, maybe just 20-30 seconds, and post it with those hashtags and tags in any of the Unite social media, such as @unitetheunion and @unite_northwest on Twitter. We'll be collating those videos and projecting them on the picket line, so members can see that they are supported and they're not on their own. We've been getting messages of support from all over the world, and that really does make a difference, when people see there is a lot of people on their side. We've got a way to go yet, so all messages of support and solidarity are appreciated.

2. There is a strike fund, which is relatively healthy, in fact we’ve been donating to local food banks. But as the strike continued we’ll start to run short. Cheques can be sent to the Unite Office payable to “Unite NW0062”


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 19, 2020)

All respect to the strikers, but it does always feel a bit mad in this day and age when you get strike funds that you can only donate to via cheque. Surely the number of people who'd be willing to donate through hitting a few buttons on gofundme or similar must be a fair bit larger than the amount of people who'll be bothered to actually dig their chequebooks out, write a cheque and then remember to post it?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 19, 2020)

hitmouse said:


> All respect to the strikers, but it does always feel a bit mad in this day and age when you get strike funds that you can only donate to via cheque. Surely the number of people who'd be willing to donate through hitting a few buttons on gofundme or similar must be a fair bit larger than the amount of people who'll be bothered to actually dig their chequebooks out, write a cheque and then remember to post it?



Aye, I’ve raised exactly that. We’ve had a collection for the strikers but we can’t find the branch chequebook as it hasn’t been used for _years. _I suspect it’s mainly their FTO’s laziness plus they had a big strike fund built already but thats dwindling as they go into month two.

I’ve gone direct to the stewards up at the factory. I’ll post up alternative payment methods if I get a reply.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 23, 2020)

New mapping project here:


*Why are we doing this and who are we?*

Currently, there are no coordinated records kept of the strike action happening across the UK.

Our map is an attempt to start to catalogue the action taking place and we hope will be useful to other workers.

This site is a ‘worker-powered’ attempt to map the industrial action taking place in the UK and relies purely on the information supplied via our submission form. We do not claim to be an official account of all action across the country, or represent all the collective action and different tactics of disruption that people are engaged in.

We are trade union activists that work full time and were behind the *‘Red for Key Workers‘* initiative on May Day 2020.  Our map was inspired by *strikethreat.org

Aims of the website*

Document and present the levels of strike action in the country.
Enable others to see the levels of action and pass on messages of solidarity.
Encourage other workers in their struggles.

*How to get in touch*

This website is staffed by activists working full time. However, you can get in touch anytime via: *strikemapuk@gmail.com 

Keep up to date*

Follow us on twitter: *@StrikeMapUK* and like us on *facebook* to stay up to date


----------



## teqniq (Dec 23, 2020)

DHL calls police in to effectively try to break the strike









						UPDATED: Liverpool MP accuses police of overreacting on DHL picket line
					

Unite accuses police of facilitating the employer as union officer is threatened with arrest for talking to members



					www.union-news.co.uk


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 23, 2020)

hitmouse said:


> New mapping project here:
> 
> 
> *Why are we doing this and who are we?*
> ...


This is ace, thanks for posting this


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 23, 2020)

Oh, and the latest from the IWGB:

"The Independent Workers’ Union of Great Britain (IWGB) Universities of London Branch voted for industrial action at the University of Greenwich today. Outsourced cleaners, porters and security officers are demanding trade union recognition for the IWGB, a commitment to end outsourcing and equal terms and conditions. 69 percent of workers voted in favour of strike action, with 31 percent voting against.


The workers are contracted through Sodexo, a multi-billion pound company based in France. They have issued four demands:



Recognise our chosen union the IWGB and meet with us and our trade union representatives
Bring our pay and terms and conditions and pensions in line with direct employees of the University
Commit to finding a reasonable timeline to bring us in-house
Pay the appropriate bonus to all outsourced workers who did not receive it after the first lockdown"


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 23, 2020)

The interactive map is a brilliant idea. We need to make sure that this is shared round. Brilliant stuff. If you were involved hitmouse then nice one


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 24, 2020)

Smokeandsteam said:


> The interactive map is a brilliant idea. We need to make sure that this is shared round. Brilliant stuff. If you were involved hitmouse then nice one


Cheers, I can't take any credit for it, just spreading the word.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 4, 2021)

Strike fund crowdfunder page is here, more background about the dispute here.

Oh, and here's a sermon in support of the strike given this weekend at Edgware & Hendon Reform Synagogue (which I really hope would have been a virtual sermon given at an online service???)


----------



## teqniq (Jan 4, 2021)

And there's this:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jan 4, 2021)

teqniq said:


> And there's this:




Important dispute. The rash of dismissal and re-engagement assaults by employers needs to be resisted: we’ve got members at British Airways,  Heineken, and Heathrow Airport already in dispute over the arbitrary tearing up of contracts of employment.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 5, 2021)

On that note, good report from the BA cargo strike here:


> Workers with the Unite union at British Airways Cargo have just completed nine days of strike action. Beginning on Christmas Day and ending on 2nd January, workers were striking in an attempt to protect their pay and conditions. Unfortunately, due to COVID, the union decided not to maintain any picket lines. British Airways are cutting staff’s pay (25% for some staff), downgrading other terms and conditions (holiday, sick etc) and breaking up their bargaining unit (making them negotiate for pay separate to the rest of BA staff). BA are also threatening to outsource their cargo operation all together.
> 
> All this is very similar to what Heathrow Airport Limited (HAL) have been doing with their staff. BA spokespeople, like HAL’s, have been telling the media that large numbers of staff on newer contracts are actually getting a pay rise out of the proposals. [1] Given the 98% return for strike action it looks as though most staff have hopefully seen through these divide and rule tactics. Like a great many workplaces at Heathrow, the divide between staff on old and new contracts is a tricky one to navigate. A cargo worker told us that although most of the newer staff walked out, there is still a feeling that they are under-represented and that the strike was mainly about protecting the old contracts. Although the old guard on the night shift stand to lose £11,000 and 20 year bods stand to lose £8,000, these are still amounts that newer starters never had in the first place. As is the case elsewhere at Heathrow, workers that have been there a long time also often occupy the easier jobs and the better shift patterns. Resentment can easily grow and just as easily derail industrial action if left unchecked. In this particular instance, it’s believed the timing of the strike at Christmas and the £70 a day strike fund, may have been enough to get newer starters on board with the strike. But any strategy that is going to last is going to need to address the inferior conditions of newer starters. Workers on these contracts need a forum where they can make their own demands. Are they going to be willing to continue a hard strike without one?
> 
> ...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jan 5, 2021)

As noted in the report the BA and HAL disputes are very difficult for two obvious reasons - the first is that passenger numbers have fallen through the floor and there is a large section of the workforce on furlough. The second is the divide between the workers on old and new contracts. Our union has quietly accepted the introduction of a multi-tier workforce in both workplaces over a long period with new contracts and new T&C’s bargained in as an alternative to compulsory redundancies and pay freezes.

The employer is now banking on the new hires to undermine the industrial action on the basis that the new contracts and ‘offer’ practically level everything down to their existing contracts. In effect the new contract becomes _the _contract.

So for stewards there is an element of chickens coming home to roost, although I don’t dismiss the difficulties they’ll have faced previously in trying to get workers on existing contacts to take action in defence of workers who haven’t even started employment or are in the union.

The report is spot on in that these disputes can only be won by turning the dispute into one that demands better pay, pensions and terms for workers on the new contracts. It’s clear that the employers motives aren’t covid related. Temporary savings have been offered by Unite that would address that, but the employers representatives have made clear that they do not want or need temporary cuts. They want to remake the contract and see covid as their opportunity. Never let a cross go to waste and all that....

Just to add the Barnoldswick dispute is an entirely different one. Here, the fight is against the offshoring of jobs.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 7, 2021)

Does anyone know much about how to support the British Gas dispute? I see the GMB are asking people to send solidarity messages here and use the hashtag #StopTheBritishGasFire, is there anything practical to do beyond that? I'm not sure where pickets will be happening, or if it'd even be a good idea for many people to go down there under lockdown conditions?


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 8, 2021)

Mass emailing tool in support of the Sage dispute here: Support the striking Sage care workers and call on Adrian Jacobs and Stephen Goldberg to do the right thing!


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jan 8, 2021)

Some excellent news for the weekend. A stunning victory for workers in the north west, especially pleasing to see its future will be embedded in green technologies:









						Battle of Barnoldswick – strike suspended
					

Unite members to consider proposals that could give the site a new lease of life and save 350 jobs



					www.union-news.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 8, 2021)

Nice! Also, UVW now reporting a school cleaners' walk out in South London over Covid safety:


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 13, 2021)

Jewish Solidarity Action are promising to match all donations up to £50 made to the Sage strike fund in the next 24 hours (or like 20 hours or whatever 24 minus however long it's been since they announced it is):



If you're not on twitter to message them, they're also on fb, and I think you can email them at jewsagainstboris@gmail.com. I don't think you have to be Jewish to get your donation matched, although their wording is a little confusing.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 13, 2021)

Also, strike rally zoom call happening tomorrow: 


(edit: lol, my facebook tracking protection thing means I can't see that, but I imagine it's there.)


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 13, 2021)

Oh, and five more days of action announced in the British Gas dispute: GMB announce new British Gas strike dates


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 20, 2021)

Online event at 7 tonight: Our Collective Voice - No to Fire and Rehire



Looks to me like the speakers list is heavily skewed in favour of Labour MPs and union fulltimers and away from any actual workers who are directly affected by the issue, but might still be some useful info or whatever there.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 21, 2021)

The British Gas strike now has a proper fundraiser going: GMB British Gas 'Fire and Rehire' Strike Fund


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 27, 2021)

Cleaners at a Catholic school in South London balloting: PRESS RELEASE: “There is a culture of discrimination” says trade union as it  ballots school cleaners for strike action


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jan 27, 2021)

Some, apparently, good news.


----------



## teqniq (Jan 31, 2021)

The people in charge at British gas seem to be predictably complete cunts:









						Six-figure Salaries Whilst Cutting Workers’ Pay: Who Are the British Gas Bosses? -
					

Reading Time: 3 minutes BRITISH GAS/ CENTRICA ENGINEERS ARE ON STRIKE AGAINST THE FIRE-AND-REHIRE ATTACK ON WORKER’S CONTRACTS CHRIS O’SHEA, BOSS OF CENTRICA/ BRITISH GAS, TAKES HOME £775,000 WHILST PUSHING THROUGH NEW CONTRACTS THAT WILL SEE WORKERS LOSE THOUSANDS VOICE SPOKE WITH A STRIKING...




					www.voice.wales


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 31, 2021)

An interview with striking British Gas workers here: Behind the British Gas Strike


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 1, 2021)

Four more days confirmed, February 5-8: GMB announces four new British Gas strike dates
Also GMB are asking people to sign on to a letter to British Gas shareholders, dunno how effective this stuff is but I suppose the conditions are hardly favourable to mass pickets at the moment: Letter to British Gas shreholders | GMB Union


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 2, 2021)

Sage Nursing Home workers back out from the 4th-8th: PRESS RELEASE: “We’re one step closer to achieving a collective voice at work” declare key workers at North London care home as they head for a second round of strike action


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 4, 2021)

Brighton UCU out against redundancies for IT staff all next week, online rally on the 8th if anyone fancies it: Rally, Monday 8 Feb. No Start to Semester 2! | University of Brighton UCU
Strike fund is here: Help raise £5000 to We met our goal of £3000, but the struggle remains. We now are having to strike for another 5 days, Monday 8th – Friday 12th February 2021.


----------



## teqniq (Feb 5, 2021)

FFS:



Also:



There is a pattern here imo: Capitalism (in the form of shareholders and members of the board) is hurting and the bottom line is to slash pay and T&C's of the workers.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 5, 2021)

Heathrow workers back out today against their fire and rehire attempt: Heathrow workers back on strike today in fire-and-rehire dispute
Angryworkers newsletter for the dispute: Heathrow Workers’ Newsletter No.3

And here's a video of a delivery driver not crossing the DHL picket line:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Feb 5, 2021)

That’s a significant upping of the ante by British Gas. The first thing that strikes me is that it’s an unlawful deduction of earnings. Employers can’t pre-emptively dock pay for things that haven’t happened yet and might not happen. The GMB should be submitting a claim to the ET.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Feb 5, 2021)

Smokeandsteam said:


> That’s a significant upping of the ante by British Gas. The first thing that strikes me is that it’s an unlawful deduction of earnings. Employers can’t pre-emptively dock pay for things that haven’t happened yet and might not happen. The GMB should be submitting a claim to the ET.


What's the ET? Can't say I trust the GMB.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 5, 2021)

Just been catching up here for the first time in ages ..... a few pieces of excellent news above, particularly Barnoldswick! 

I hear from 'friends'  at the DVLA in Swansea that PCS ran an online straw poll  this week to measure support for strike action concerning employee/workplace safety (what with all the recent Covid cases there, etc.  )

Over 90% support it seems , admittedly from a self-selecting sample of members.

But it's all about what might or might not happen next  -- watch this space.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 5, 2021)

Count Cuckula said:


> What's the ET? Can't say I trust the GMB.


From context, I'm guessing employment tribunal? Unless I'm wrong and they're hoping to get that little green fella to sort it out.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Feb 5, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> From context, I'm guessing employment tribunal? Unless I'm wrong and they're hoping to get that little green fella to sort it out.


Cheers


----------



## Chilli.s (Feb 5, 2021)

Feel i may have to do my bit to support the British Gas workers by reporting some gas leaks that i smelt in the street


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Feb 5, 2021)

Count Cuckula said:


> What's the ET? Can't say I trust the GMB.



Employment Tribunal. I do not believe an employer can deduct pay for a strike/strikes that have not yet occurred. I’d argue it’s victimisation for undertaking a protected act (striking). It’s also an unlawful deduction of earnings, although I can see that this might not be the case by the time the case comes before the ET.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 6, 2021)

Porters at Heartlands Hospital in Birmingham also facing fire and rehire at the moment, can't find out if they're balloting or anyone, but Unison is asking people (maybe especially those in the West Midlands?) to use this thing to email their MPs: Public Support letter for the Heartlands Hospital Porters
And to do a twitterstorm thing on Monday, if anyone feels like joining in with that:


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 8, 2021)

Bit of coverage of the Go North West/Queen's Road dispute in Manchester: ‘Fire and Rehire’ Hits Manchester’s Buses
(Also to add to the post above about Birmingham hospital porters, turns out that they've already successfully balloted and taken several days' action.)


----------



## The39thStep (Feb 9, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Bit of coverage of the Go North West/Queen's Road dispute in Manchester: ‘Fire and Rehire’ Hits Manchester’s Buses
> (Also to add to the post above about Birmingham hospital porters, turns out that they've already successfully balloted and taken several days' action.)


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 9, 2021)

If anyone wants to follow developments on fb, they're on there as Go Ahead STOP the attacks on Queens Road


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 14, 2021)

All out continuous strike at Go Ahead North West from Feb 28 onwards: Manchester Go Ahead North West bus drivers in all out strike over fire and rehire dispute


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 14, 2021)

Oh, and fwiw there's a petition/mass-emailing tool in support of the dispute here: Stop the Go North West fire and rehire.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 14, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Just been catching up here for the first time in ages ..... a few pieces of excellent news above, particularly Barnoldswick!
> 
> I hear from 'friends'  at the DVLA in Swansea that PCS ran an online straw poll this week to measure support for strike action concerning employee/workplace safety (what with all the recent Covid cases there, etc.  )
> 
> ...



Word on Friday reached me  that an all-member official *PCS Strike!* vote at DVLA will happen imminently ..... date of vote, Tues 23rd February "apparantly" 

I'm guessing that a one-day strike only, would be the outcome ...... 

They'd have the sense to pick a Wednesday though, I suspect! 

And chances of a 'No' vote ae utterly minimal, friends tell me


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 14, 2021)

Are your friends confident it'll hit the turnout threshold as well?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Feb 14, 2021)

I think it’s a ballot only at this point over covid safety concerns in the DVLA. The plan is for action in the spring. Given there appear to have been 500 cases in the office already it appears to me that this might have happened sooner, or staff might have walked off the job? 





__





						DVLA strike ballot launched amidst Covid health and safety scandal at Swansea site
					






					www.pcs.org.uk


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 14, 2021)

Smokeandsteam : my knowledge is limited for now,  but  all this should have happened much sooner agreed.

Even Serwotka, great that he generally is,  has taken his time ......


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 15, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Are your friends confident it'll hit the turnout threshold as well?


Not sure yet! Will try and find out from people.


----------



## teqniq (Feb 15, 2021)

Blatant dog whistle shit:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Feb 15, 2021)

teqniq said:


> Blatant dog whistle shit:




Bit unfair on the DUP I thought....


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 15, 2021)




----------



## hitmouse (Feb 19, 2021)

Now due to go out for 40 days from March 16 onwards:


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 19, 2021)

Further to the above: strike fund here: Help La Retraite school cleaners' sick pay strike
Email tool for hassling bosses here: Please send this e-mail in support of the cleaners fight against wage theft at La Retraite Roman Catholic Girls’ School


----------



## Gromit (Feb 24, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Heathrow workers back out today against their fire and rehire attempt: Heathrow workers back on strike today in fire-and-rehire dispute
> Angryworkers newsletter for the dispute: Heathrow Workers’ Newsletter No.3
> 
> And here's a video of a delivery driver not crossing the DHL picket line:



How does the lorry driver escape being punish by his employers?
Does he say no one answered and he tried to leave it with a neighbour but no one was in.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 28, 2021)

First day of the all-out Manchester bus strike today:


Also day 25 at British Gas:


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 3, 2021)

New article from a British Gas engineer: 25 Days of the British Gas Strike


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 3, 2021)

Minicab drivers striking over safety after one of them was murdered on the job in February: Minicab drivers strike over safety concerns following murder of London Bolt driver


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 4, 2021)

‘Rogue Manchester bus service’ exposing passengers to Covid-19 risk
					

…




					unitetheunion.org
				




Some great health & safety/social distancing on the Go North West scab bus services:


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 4, 2021)

British Gas workers vote to reject the latest offer by 79%:


----------



## Sprocket. (Mar 5, 2021)

RCN announces £35 million Industrial Action Fund as nurses prepare to fight the Government over pay
					

Last night the union's governing Council convened an emergency meeting and voted unanimously to set up the fund.




					nursingnotes.co.uk
				



This is what happens when you kick workers in the teeth Johnson and chums.


----------



## ska invita (Mar 5, 2021)

Sprocket. said:


> RCN announces £35 million Industrial Action Fund as nurses prepare to fight the Government over pay
> 
> 
> Last night the union's governing Council convened an emergency meeting and voted unanimously to set up the fund.
> ...


" The Royal College of Nursing (RCN) called this (1%) "pitiful", arguing that its members should get *12.5% instead. *"
yessss! thats the spirit
on to a winner here? surely no manner of press hatchet job is going to work on losing public support

I wonder what Starmer thinks


----------



## Sprocket. (Mar 5, 2021)

Sadly all NHS staff aren’t friends and neighbours of twat Hancock.


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 5, 2021)

Rolls-Royce Unite branch made this brazier specially for the Manchester bus strike picketers (thinking about it, my caption in combination with the tweet is a bit redundant but oh well):


Also, MEN story on the overcrowded scab bus, although it turns out that the "investigation" from the headline is going to be carried out by Go North West, and TFGM's position is "we have asked the operator to investigate": Investigation launched into 'dangerously overcrowded' replacement bus service during drivers strike


----------



## teqniq (Mar 6, 2021)

Fair play:


----------



## ska invita (Mar 6, 2021)

teqniq said:


> Fair play:



strike fund money comes from where, anyone know? Just dues?


----------



## teqniq (Mar 6, 2021)

Also fair play:


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Mar 6, 2021)

ska invita said:


> I wonder what Starmer thinks



he will probably consider it forensically and argue for 1.5 %


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 6, 2021)

teqniq said:


> Also fair play:


Yeah, it's stuff like that that's why I've got a bit of a soft spot for Burgon. I mean, obviously making a token show of support for strikers is pretty easy to do and it's not exactly the be-all and end-all, but it's still more than you get from a lot of Labour MPs, especially post-Corbyn. Unless I'm being too harsh, maybe Oh Sir Kier Starmer is on his way up to Manchester right now to get arrested for lying down in the road to block a scab bus.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 7, 2021)

ska invita said:


> strike fund money comes from where, anyone know? Just dues?



Union income (mainly dues) and Branch contributions.


----------



## redsquirrel (Mar 7, 2021)

ska invita said:


> strike fund money comes from where, anyone know? Just dues?


Mostly but also donations (typically)


hitmouse said:


> Yeah, it's stuff like that that's why I've got a bit of a soft spot for Burgon.


Likewise. Sure he's got his issues but for all that he puts in a shitload more legwork than 99% of Labour MPs. He was willing to come to a UCU strike rally in Leeds last December even with the GE campaigning going on.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 7, 2021)

Sprocket. said:


> RCN announces £35 million Industrial Action Fund as nurses prepare to fight the Government over pay
> 
> 
> Last night the union's governing Council convened an emergency meeting and voted unanimously to set up the fund.
> ...



The 1% pay award already seems to be slipping down the news. The ‘logic’ of affordability has been established and is bedding itself in. Labour tops ‘protest’ in the mildest terms possible. The nursing unions posture but not one has called a ballot yet.

If we can’t organise to get the NHS a pay rise _in these circumstances _then every worker is fucked. An essential building block of ‘Keynesian economics for capital and austerity for labour’ is put in place. Without a whimper. A new piss poor low


----------



## teqniq (Mar 7, 2021)

Unbelievable. Nurses protest at 1% pay rise offer from the government. GMP close the protest down and fine the organiser £10,000 using Covid legislation.









						Arrest as police shut down nurses' protest over pay in Manchester city centre
					

Unison reps say the protest was socially distanced and fully risk assessed




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk
				












						Updated statement on Manchester City Centre protest
					

Updated statement on Manchester City Centre protest




					www.gmp.police.uk


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Mar 7, 2021)

Public Sector general strike - ALL OUT!


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 7, 2021)

Mr.Bishie said:


> Public Sector general strike - *ALL OUT!*



I wish!! 

I've been slow to pick up on the general 0% rises for the public sector in Sunak's budget  -- the 1%-only for NHS staff was pre-occcupying me at first.

But as summaries of it go, this Unison article could be worse.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 7, 2021)

PCS's site are slower to update with new news , but at least they do regular 'Mythbuster' pieces like this on their site.

Friends are still awaiting PCS and other news about any DVLA strike yet -- the ballot doesn't close until next Thursday (11th March)

Swansea rumour has it though, that there's a fair bit of pessimism about turnout levels  ....
It seems though, that  the campaign continues to boost that in the last week, apparantly


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 10, 2021)

GMB announces 12 more British Gas strike dates as company refuses to drop fire and rehire
					

Engineers will walk out on March 12 to 15, 19 to 22 and 26 to 29




					www.gmb.org.uk


----------



## ska invita (Mar 10, 2021)

Smokeandsteam said:


> The nursing unions posture but not one has called a ballot yet.


this is the next step - ballot - im sure if a strike is called everyone will give it all the backing they can


----------



## ska invita (Mar 10, 2021)

ska invita said:


> this is the next step - ballot - im sure if a strike is called everyone will give it all the backing they can


thinking about this more, how feasible is it to go on strike when Covid hospitalisations are still so high - Im sure theres some strategic thinking about this going on


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 10, 2021)

ska invita said:


> thinking about this more, how feasible is it to go on strike when Covid hospitalisations are still so high - Im sure theres some strategic thinking about this going on



A ballot doesn’t need a strike necessarily. A high profile campaign - mobilising public support, engaging the media, a mass recruitment campaign of staff and building for mass participation in the ballot - for strike action _and _action short of a strike - would put the Tories under significant pressure. The aim would be to force them to revise the offer. Who knows, even Labour might offer some tepid support. I can’t see nurses walking off the job in ICUs either but that’s not the only tactic in play. The point is the unions need a strategy and to put some resources into it. A TUC wide campaign mobilising workers in other sectors and linking up the disputes over ‘rehire or fire’ wouldn’t go amiss either....


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 12, 2021)

News just in from PCS : The DVLA strike ballot that closed yesterday (Thursday 11th March) has announced its result -- and it's positive ...  
(apart from the indifferent turn-out , which to me suggests the vote should have been earlier, when the workplace safety issues had much bigger currency/salience)




			
				PCS said:
			
		

> The ballot returned a 71.6% vote for strike action and 76.9% for action short of a strike, on a turnout of 50.3%.



There's talk of Zoom meetings very soon to decide next exact move ......


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 12, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> News just in from PCS : The DVLA strike ballot that closed yesterday (Thursday 11th March) has announced its result -- and it's positive ...
> (apart from the indifferent turn-out , which to me suggests the vote should have been earlier, when the workplace safety issues had much bigger currency/salience)
> 
> 
> ...


Nice one - did they have to go through all the hassle of doing an indicative ballot before the proper ballot as well? I can imagine being asked to vote on exactly the same thing twice in a row might also help dampen turnout a bit.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 12, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Nice one - did they have to go through all the hassle of doing an indicative ballot before the proper ballot as well? I can imagine being asked to vote on exactly the same thing twice in a row might also help dampen turnout a bit.



I believe that there was something that sounded to me like a straw-poll about strike-willingness, two or three weeks before the official poll was announced.

The result of that, I think, was a bigger percentage in favour of a strike, than in the actual poll ...............


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 12, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I believe that there was something that sounded to me like a straw-poll abut strike-willingness, two or three weeks before the official poll was announced.
> 
> The result of that, I think, was a bigger percentage in favour of a strike, than in the actual poll ...............


I suppose if there's people actually changing their minds or voting differently, that can't be helped, but if there was anyone who voted in the straw poll thing, and then thought they didn't need to vote in the actual ballot as a result of having already just voted on the same question two weeks ago, that seems like it would be... well, less than ideal I think.


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 12, 2021)

Fair, I had my doubts about the worth of a straw poll myself


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 15, 2021)

Potential walkouts by BT staff: Fears for home working as prospect of national BT strike grows


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 15, 2021)

This might as well go here as well - not UK, but important: Support workers in Myanmar resisting the coup!


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 16, 2021)

Saaarf Laahndahn Catholic school cleaners out for 40 days over sick pay: PRESS RELEASE: Prestigious South London school La Retraite to be rocked by “longest school cleaners strike in UK history” after headteacher on over £110K per year denies key workers full pay sick pay


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 19, 2021)

Cops break up a picket in Edinburgh - seemingly it's safe for you to go to work, but it's not safe for you to stand outside your workplace: Unite demands review of picketing restrictions following Police Scotland intervention at SAICA dispute


----------



## Pickman's model (Mar 19, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Cops break up a picket in Edinburgh - seemingly it's safe for you to go to work, but it's not safe for you to stand outside your workplace: Unite demands review of picketing restrictions following Police Scotland intervention at SAICA dispute


it's certainly not safe to stand near a police officer


----------



## Pickman's model (Mar 19, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> Fair, I had my doubts about the worth of a straw poll myself


make hay while the sun shines


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 19, 2021)

Today's installment of relucantly having to say "fair play" to Labour MPs is brought to you by RLB: The Fire and Rehire Scandal on Greater Manchester’s Buses


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 20, 2021)

UVW doing it again:


----------



## Serge Forward (Mar 20, 2021)

Excellent news


----------



## Shechemite (Mar 20, 2021)

Fucking aye


----------



## Shechemite (Mar 20, 2021)

Any updates on industrial disputes in the care industry


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 20, 2021)

MadeInBedlam said:


> Any updates on industrial disputes in the care industry


The biggest I'm aware of atm is Sage through UVW - latest I've seen in this: “I am proud that I have not remained silent and have raised my voice for dignity”, the Sage workers’ struggle to defend their human rights
Think this video might have more recent updates but not watched it myself: 


I know Unison also organises in the sector, the latest I've seen is a Supreme Court case over minimum wage and sleep shifts, which seems to have not gone well:








						Sleep-ins judgment: Q&A | Care workers: your rights | UNISON National
					

Today the Supreme Court has announced their ruling on a UNISON-backed case taken on behalf of a care worker member against her employer, Mencap.




					www.unison.org.uk
				











						Care workers lose 'sleep-in shift' court challenge
					

One worker who had to sleep at her job argued she should be paid minimum wage for the whole shift.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Shechemite (Mar 20, 2021)

Cheers.


----------



## Shechemite (Mar 20, 2021)

Apart from BCWN, is it just Unison and UVW in the social care sector?


----------



## Shechemite (Mar 20, 2021)

Fucks sake I’m a lazy sod. Anyway just googled it. Interesting 





__





						social care trade union - Google Search
					





					www.google.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 20, 2021)

Yeah, my response was going to be that I'd guess Unison is the biggest (and UVW probably the most militant) but I'm sure Unite and GMB have some presence as well. IWGB organises foster carers as well, I think both IWW and Solfed have made at least some attempts too. Bristol Care Workers Network is an interesting one.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 22, 2021)

Update on the British Gas workers dispute here:





__





						National lockout looms unless British Gas pulls back from mass sacking of striking workers
					

Mr O’Shea - CEO of British Gas - is driving the company at high speed towards April 1 cliff edge




					www.gmb.org.uk
				




The stakes here are now massive. A victory for the workers and their union in this dispute would represent a decisive win against dismissal and re-engagement tactics by employers - which is rocketing with Covid providing the justification for their attacks. The TUC have reported that nearly 1 in 10 workers have been told to re-apply for their jobs on worse terms and conditions or face the sack and 25% of workers say their working terms, such as pay or hours, have been downgraded since first lockdown in March.


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 23, 2021)

Facebook live event next Wednesday: 


> Join a very special episode of Comrades featuring trade unionists from Massachusetts Nurses Association, NHS 15 pay campaign and others to be announced. Our unique organising call will bring together the struggles of healthcare workers and how the organised whilst protecting our societies during this pandemic. We will also discuss the future and campaigns that unionists are involved in. Do not miss out.


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 23, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> News just in from PCS : The DVLA strike ballot that closed yesterday (Thursday 11th March) has announced its result -- and it's positive ...
> (apart from the indifferent turn-out , which to me suggests the vote should have been earlier, when the workplace safety issues had much bigger currency/salience)
> 
> 
> ...


Apparently that next move has been decided: PCS members at DVLA to strike 6-9 April


----------



## William of Walworth (Mar 23, 2021)

hitmouse : This news was passed to me today by 'friends'  a bit belatedly, but four days is quite a sound/solid strike  ..... given that people were expecting just a one-day token thing.

I'm half-guessing that the threat of this strike could lead to a settlement, given that according to that PCS page, they're currently involved in 'intensive talks' with Management.

We'll see, though. An official  picket line would be more fun for the activists ...


----------



## Serge Forward (Mar 24, 2021)

If I phone them up and express my solidarity,  does anyone reckon they'll not fine me for registering a SORN that was 3 months late?


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 25, 2021)

Deliveroo: Deliveroo Hit by Investor, Rider Revolt Ahead of London IPO


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Mar 26, 2021)

School cleaners celebrate historic victory after only two days of planned forty-day strike
					

School cleaners are celebrating after a “historic victory” following a strike which won them full pay sick pay equal to what teachers get. The staff of prestigious Clapham based La Retraite Roman C…




					londonnewsonline.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 26, 2021)

More on Deliveroo, strikes planned for April 7th:


Strike fund here: Donate - Riders Roovolt


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 29, 2021)

#NoGo: solidarity with the Go NW bus strike
					

Unite members at Go Ahead NW’s Queen’s Road bus garage have been on indefinite strike since Sunday 28 February 2021 against #fireandrehire being used to impose cuts to pay, sick pay, an…




					manchestertuc.org.uk
				






> Unite members at Go Ahead NW’s Queen’s Road bus garage have been on indefinite strike since Sunday 28 February 2021 against #fireandrehire being used to impose cuts to pay, sick pay, and many other detrimental changes such as five hours driving without leaving the cab to stretch or use a toilet. We all have a stake in the strike’s success: to counter the scourge of #fireandrehire, to prevent inadequate sick pay risking public health in a pandemic, and to avoid a race to the bottom across the transport industry.
> 
> Go North West are trying to break the strike by outsourcing services to companies including APH, Edwards coaches, Belle Vue, Selwyns, Tyrers, Travellers Choice, Red Rose Travel, Bullocks, Connexions Buses, MP Travel, Regalway (Viking), Vision Coaches, Atlantic Travel, Mostonian 2000 Coaches and Coach Travel Solutions. Many of the scab services are using vehicles which don’t meet accessibility standards and there have been examples of buses running with too many passengers to be Covid safe and of dangerous driving.
> 
> ...



Also, short little article on the April 7 Deliveroo strike: Deliveroo workers to strike over exploitative practices and low pay


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 30, 2021)

Southampton RMT are balloting for strike action to demand the reinstatement of Declan Clune, the bus driver sacked for "bringing the company into disrepute" by reporting when a bus collided with a railway bridge.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Apr 2, 2021)

Fire and Rehire at British Gas - Anarchist Communist Group
					

British Gas are continuing with their attacks on gas workers, saying they will be sacked if they do not accept a new contract. Signing this would mean a 15% pay cut and an attack on conditions. Workers reacted with 42 days of strikes. Many workers are continuing to refuse to sign and are defying...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org
				




the GMB can't be trusted (what a surprise)


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Apr 2, 2021)

On the buses – London and Manchester - Anarchist Communist Group
					

Bus drivers working for London United, owned by the French firm RATP, went out on a 48 hour strike on March 31st through to end of April 1st, after talks broke down over pay and conditions. Further strikes are planned for April 7th and 14th. London United is attempting to downgrade drivers...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 4, 2021)

Deliveroo events next week:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 4, 2021)

Also, some video from the Manchester bus strike march:


Longer video is up on facebook.


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 6, 2021)

Support PCS members at DVLA striking 6-9 April over health and safety concerns
					






					www.pcs.org.uk
				



Solidarity messages can be sent to dvla@pcs.org.uk, strike fund donations still have to be sent by mucking about with bank transfers though.

Also: All seven London Ratp bus depots now backing strikes


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 6, 2021)

Manchester bus strike updates:










						Manchester bus drivers on strike for weeks march after talks collapse
					

Bus drivers at Go North West have been on strike for five weeks




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 6, 2021)

Deliveroo riders strike tomorrow over pay and conditions as Deliveroo nosedives on the London Stock Exchange
					

* Hundreds of Deliveroo riders are expected to strike tomorrow 7 April for fair    pay, safety protections and basic workers’ rights.  * Socially distanced protests planned in London, York, Sheffield, Reading and    Wolverhampton.  * Since the Bureau of Investigative Journalism revealed...




					iwgb.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 6, 2021)

Aylesbury added to the list of Deliveroo strike events for tomorrow:


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 6, 2021)

DVLA strike happening this week, as noted by hitmouse above 

Word reaches me locally though, that without any picket line AFAIK (Covid reasons), there are a significant minority still going into work .... am trying to investigate that ...... but for now (with beer!!  ), *SCABS*! needs to be shouted!


----------



## teqniq (Apr 7, 2021)




----------



## hitmouse (Apr 7, 2021)

Deliveroo riders strike as unconditional trading for shares begins
					

A week after a disappointing initial public offering, Deliveroo faces strike action but the company dismisses the protest.




					news.sky.com
				












						Deliveroo workers protest as shares rise on first day of open trading
					

Hundreds of couriers across England demonstrate against treatment by online food delivery company




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 8, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> DVLA strike happening this week, as noted by hitmouse above
> 
> Word reaches me locally though, that without any picket line AFAIK (Covid reasons), there are a significant minority still going into work .... am trying to investigate that ...... but for now (with beer!!  ), *SCABS*! needs to be shouted!


Is DVLA work mostly done in a particular location rather than being WFH at the moment? God knows how you do picketing if people are working from home. Anyway, if anyone fancies it apparently there's a strike rally tomorrow lunchtime: PCS DVLA Strike Rally


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 9, 2021)

hitmouse : There's two big DVLA locations in Swansea -- the major one is the 3,000/4,000-or-so-people workplace up the hill.

Call Centre down the hill (site of the major tranche of Covid outbreaks back early in the year) has maybe 2,000??
My numbers for both sites are inexact 

Lots of WFH people nowadays as well, tbf.

Thanks for the link about the support rally   ... I can see myself getting along .....


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 9, 2021)

A mere 38 days or so into the bus strike, Burnham has finally got around to having an opinion about it:








						Manchester council and Andy Burnham back alleged 'fire and rehire' strike action
					

Hundreds of Go North West bus drivers and Unite are in dispute with the company over new contracts




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk
				




Also, fair play to them for this:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Apr 13, 2021)

As the strike in British Gas reaches day 43, the company will sack tomorrow those workers who have refused to sign up to the detrimental contracts that they have imposed:





__





						43rd day of British Gas action to coincide with sackings
					

Company clearly doesn't care for customers or staff




					www.gmb.org.uk
				




The muted response from the Labour movement to this attack, and the wider disinterest on what passes for the left these days, is utterly shameful. If a group of traditionally well organised workers with high levels of leverage can be defeated and ‘fire and rehire’ imposed a green light will be shone to employers elsewhere. The TUC have already released data showing 1 in 4 workers have either had their contact watered down or hours cut in the last 12 months. A defeat for British Gas workers will show employers that they can tear up contracts of employment with impunity too.....


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 13, 2021)

Dunno what the details are outside of the union write-up, but this sounds like good news: Victory for striking Leicester SPS workers after agreement ends £3,000 ‘fire and rehire’ threat


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 13, 2021)

Article on the Victoria School strike in Poole: Livability or Liability? Staff strike over new contract.


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 14, 2021)

Pretty disrespectful of Royal Park attendants to return a 100% vote for strike action on a 90% turnout over sick pay and stolen holiday pay. Haven't that poor family suffered enough, they should cancel it in memory of Prince Philip, etc.


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 19, 2021)

Seems like some residents went out for a nice, very slow, socially distanced stroll in the road outside one of the depots supplying scab buses for the Manchester bus strike early this morning:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 19, 2021)

Hackney teachers striking over victimisation of union members: NEU members continue strike action at Leaways
Both IRL and online stuff happening this week:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 23, 2021)

More blockades of the scab depots today:


XR Manchester have some video from Monday morning, not sure if it's been happening every day or what:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 24, 2021)

Turns out Go North West and the scab contractors really, really don't like people doing the early morning strolls - compilation of violence and threats against strike supporters here:


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 26, 2021)

If there's anything on the PCS site about this, I can't find it  , so ITV it will have to be :

New four day DVLA strike has been called, Tuesday 4th May to Friday 7th May.

ETA : Facebook helped me find the actual PCS statement (which is very well buried on their main site  )


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 26, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> If there's anything on the PCS site about this, I can't find it  , so ITV it will have to be :
> 
> New four day DVLA strike has been called, Tuesday 4th May to Friday 7th May.
> 
> ETA : Facebook helped me find the actual PCS statement (which is very well buried on their main site  )


And that link doesn't work.   Think it's this?





						PCS members to take further strike action at the DVLA over health and safety.
					






					www.pcs.org.uk
				




Also:



> Kirstie Paton is facing disciplinary proceedings by United Learning, following a post she published in December 2020 on her NEU Inner London Executive Facebook page. This post raised  concerns about the use of “Lateral Flow Tests” to replace self-isolation of close contacts.
> As a trade union elected representative, she is legally entitled to express concerns and criticisms of employers on matters of interest to union members without fear of formal disciplinary procedures.
> Kirstie has been summoned to a hearing on the 29th April. This hearing could lead to Kirstie’s dismissal.
> Members at Kirstie’s school have voted to take strike action on that day to send a message to United Learning that they should stop this process.
> ...



And also this:








						"I was told to take £6,000 pay cut under bully boy fire-and-rehire tactic"
					

EXCLUSIVE: Unite is opposing the practice, already illegal in Ireland and Spain, by coordinating strikes and is representing members in disputes with employers including Go North West buses and Goodlord lettings




					www.mirror.co.uk
				



Official Unite statement is here:








						Unite launches national campaign to end 'bully boy' fire and rehire with a day of coordinated strikes and actions across the country
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## Shechemite (Apr 26, 2021)

Cheers for keeping the thread updated hitmouse


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 27, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> And that link doesn't work.   Think it's this?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks for that. Not sure what went wrong with the "link" I posted originally, but I've edited my post up there now


----------



## hitmouse (May 3, 2021)

Still waiting to see full details confirmed, but this sounds big if true:
 GO NORTH WEST WITHDRAWS FIRE AND RE-HIRE CONTRACTS (belated edit to include the link)


> Hundreds of trade unionists marched from Piccadilly Gardens to Queen's Road depot today for the annual May Day parade and in support of bus drivers at Go North West who have been on strike for two months.
> At the subsequent rally, they heard Colin Hayden of Unite say that Go North West, the drivers' employer, has withdrawn its fire and re-hire contracts which caused the longest bus strike in UK history.
> Hundreds of trade unionists braved the rain and wind today to march from *Piccadilly Gardens* in Manchester to *Queen's Road* bus depot for the annual* May Day* parade, this year in support of bus drivers for the *Go North West* company who have been on strike for two months fighting against so-called 'fire and re-hire' contracts.
> With cars beeping support all the way and the *PCS* samba band drumming along, the final rally near the bus depot heard that the company has done a U-turn. *Colin Hayden*, *Unite* branch secretary, told the cheering crowd that the union had received a document from the* Go Ahead Group* stating that 'fire and re-hire' was being withdrawn; that fire and re-hire contracts were now null and void, and that two dismissed union members will be re-instated and have their jobs back.
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (May 4, 2021)

Liverpool UCU online rally on May 10th:








						Defending jobs at the University of Liverpool
					

Solidarity with University of Liverpool UCU rally




					www.eventbrite.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (May 5, 2021)

DVLA stuff got a decent write-up in the Mirror recently: DVLA staff scared and angry at return to work order before worker dies of Covid


----------



## hitmouse (May 6, 2021)

Good, serious, detailed analysis of the Manchester bus strike here: Ongoing Manchester bus strike defeats fire and rehire


----------



## William of Walworth (May 7, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Good, serious, detailed analysis of the Manchester bus strike here: Ongoing Manchester bus strike defeats fire and rehire



That article really *is* insanely informative -- big respect


----------



## hitmouse (May 9, 2021)

The Manchester bus strike seems to be over, no statement from Unite yet though:








						Bus drivers' strike: Agreement reached with union to resolve dispute
					

Go North West, based at the Queens Road depot, said the agreement reached would be put by a union to its members in a vote




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (May 10, 2021)

OK, it seems like that Manchester Evening News article was premature - apparently the employer just told the newspaper that the strike was over, without the union actually agreeing that the strike was over? Seems like a weird way to do things but then I'm not the Go Ahead group. Anyway, Manchester Trades Council are now saying that Unite is expecting to deliver a further strike notice on May 13th after reballoting, solidarity presence requested at the depot then:








						#NoGo: solidarity with the Go NW bus strike
					

Unite members at Go Ahead NW’s Queen’s Road bus garage have been on indefinite strike since Sunday 28 February 2021 against #fireandrehire being used to impose cuts to pay, sick pay, an…




					manchestertuc.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (May 12, 2021)

This sounds promising: solidarity protest for Thursday 13th has now been called off "because the strikers will be busy considering documents from the company."


----------



## hitmouse (May 12, 2021)

Oh, and Thurrock refuse workers are on all-out strike for pretty much the rest of May: New Thurrock rubbish drop off sites opened during worker strikes stand-off


----------



## William of Walworth (May 13, 2021)

Further strike action at the DVLA likely very soon ....




			
				PCS said:
			
		

> *Notice of further strike action*
> PCS have today served notice of further strike action for Monday 24th May – Friday 28th May. This reflects PCS’ dissatisfaction at DVLA management plans to return staff to site.
> Unlike the strike action so far, the action taking place on the 24th May will be for *ALL PCS MEMBERS AT THE DVLA*, regardless of whether or not you are being called to attend the site.
> This is in addition to, not instead of, the industrial action planned for Monday 17th May, which is for those being made to attend the DVLA sites only.
> ...


----------



## William of Walworth (May 13, 2021)

.... except that the above was out-of-date information it appears!  

This more recent message on the PCS site is saying negotations remain ongoing ::




			
				PCS said:
			
		

> *PCS has agreed to suspend our planned strike action at the DVLA*, which was due to take place from 17-21 May, following progress made in talks with the employer towards reaching agreement
> 
> Though progress has been made, an agreement is not yet finalised and PCS negotiators will use the week of suspended action to meet with DVLA and DfT management in intensive talks with a view to reach agreement.
> The PCS DVLA Branch Executive Committee met this afternoon and agreed to suspend next week’s planned strike.
> PCS is clear, as it has been throughout this dispute, that any deal must address members’ fears about health and safety on sites, issues caused by Covid and long-Covid, and ensure that lessons are learned and members are kept safe, should future pandemics or waves of Covid occur.


----------



## hitmouse (May 14, 2021)

Respect to the Thurrock bin workers, that sounds like a serious commitment:








						Essential workers fighting to defend their pay from Thurrock Council bosses resolve to continue strike action
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				






> Unite members who provided essential services during the height of the pandemic have resolved to continue their strike in a battle to defend their pay from a brutal attack by Thurrock Council bosses.
> 
> Workers in the waste and recycling department at Thurrock Council have been on strike since the 13 April 2021. Today, their union has given Thurrock Council notice that the strike will continue until the 18 June unless the council ends its brutal and callous attack on the essential workers' pay and conditions.
> 
> The proposed cuts mean the workers who were applauded by Thurrock residents for their contribution during the health crisis, face losing between £1200 and £3800 a year which will leave the workers struggling to pay their bills, rent and mortgages.


----------



## hitmouse (May 17, 2021)

It's official: 








						Huge victory at Manchester Go North West as Unite defeats fire and rehire to end strike
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




But more importantly, did the strikers ever use one of those big effigies of a rat and can we get five pages of discourse about it if so?


----------



## Puddy_Tat (May 17, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> It's official:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That was bloody big.

If GA Group had got it through in Manchester, then pretty much every other bus operator round the country would be trying it...


----------



## hitmouse (May 17, 2021)

Yeah, and I suspect not only on the buses as well. I'm still not totally sure on what if any concessions Go North West got out of the final settlement, but even if they made some gains/were able to take some stuff away, it'd be a bold employer who risked starting another 85-day strike in order to try and save a few quid in sick pay or whatever.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 17, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> It's official:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I want to know and see more!!


----------



## hitmouse (May 17, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> I want to know and see more!!


Unite do definitely have a big inflatable rat, see for instance here and here:



I swear I heard rumours it might come into play at some point during the Go Ahead campaign but not sure if it actually did. Oh, and Vice did an article on the history of Scabby the Rat a few years back.


----------



## William of Walworth (May 17, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Unite do definitely have a big inflatable rat, see for instance here and here:
> View attachment 268862
> View attachment 268863
> 
> I swear I heard rumours it might come into play at some point during the Go Ahead campaign but not sure if it actually did. Oh, and Vice did an article on the history of Scabby the Rat a few years back.




I thought II knew some stuff about the history of strikes and actions and things, but every day's a school day!!


----------



## William of Walworth (May 17, 2021)

Today's PCS statement concerning Carry On Up the DVLA 




			
				PCS said:
			
		

> A strike by *all* PCS members at DVLA, regardless of whether or not they are being called to attend the site, *is still planned for next week (24-28 May)*.



Pressure on The Management or what?


----------



## hitmouse (May 19, 2021)

Found something giving a bit more detail about what the Go North West settlement is:



> The strikers have put up a tremendous fight and can be immensely proud of what they have achieved by their actions, including:
> 
> Stopping fire & rehire
> Stopping contract changes allowing future changes without negotiation
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (May 21, 2021)

Dunno what the detail of this deal is, but it sounds like good news:
Breakthrough for Thurrock Council workers



> Unite members who provided essential services during the height of the pandemic have voted to suspend their six week strike after ongoing talks with Thurrock Council delivered a breakthrough.
> 
> Around 90 workers in the waste and recycling department at Thurrock Council have been on strike since the 13 April 2021.
> 
> ...


Must be a relief for Thurrock residents, at any rate.


----------



## hitmouse (May 21, 2021)

MadeInBedlam said:


> Any updates on industrial disputes in the care industry


Just seen that there's a national network called Care and Support Workers Organise. Interview with one of them here, has some good info about what's going on in the sector.

Also, Ian Allinson has a new article up about the outcome of the Manchester bus strike - has a long video of interviews with strikers I've not watched yet, but here's his take on the deal:


> Strikers are rightly proud of their epic fight – the longest bus strike in British history. The strikers achieved a lot. Not just fighting off fire and rehire for themselves, but winning a commitment from the whole Go Ahead group never to use it again. They won the reinstatement of two sacked workers and disciplinary threats against 37 more. They won an above-inflation pay deal for two years. They were almost entirely successful in stopping attacks on their sick pay and time allowances. They prevented the employer being able to unilaterally make future changes.
> 
> All the strikers recognise that this wasn’t an unqualified victory. Most accepted the logic that they had to make concessions to ensure the viability of their employer, an issue discussed in my previous article about the strike. The workers had agreed to offer major concessions on unpaid meal breaks and a longer working day, on a temporary basis for two years until bus franchising comes in. Go Ahead refused to make any commitment to give back these concessions. Everyone involved recognises that there will be battles to come, particularly when bus franchising starts in two years’ time.
> 
> ...


----------



## Shechemite (May 21, 2021)

Cheers


----------



## hitmouse (May 21, 2021)

Oh, and some more UVW news, winning recognition at the school cleaners struck at earlier this year:








						“This victory is a real testament to the tenacity of our members” says UVW as school cleaners win their battle for trade union recognition
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## Smokeandsteam (May 22, 2021)

More on the inspiring campaign and solidarity of fellow Unite workers. Important to learn the lessons from this as fire and rehire is the key tool being used by employers across the board in their efforts to drive down pay and roll back years of collective organisation and hard won employment benefits..


----------



## hitmouse (May 22, 2021)

Also, whatever compromises and concessions the final deals involve, this photo of the strikers celebrating is a lovely one (even if it isn't 100% socially distanced):


Certainly not the worst way to end a strike.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (May 23, 2021)

Some brief articles from the ACG on recent strike developments:









						Manchester Bus Workers, Not a Famous Victory - Anarchist Communist Group
					

We’ve previously carried reports on the ACG website on the long strike of Manchester bus workers employed by Go North West. This has now ended after 85 days of a continuous strike. But have workers won?    Whilst Go North West’s plans to install fire and rehire were withdrawn, two sacked workers...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org
				












						Thurrock Refuse Workers: Victory! - Anarchist Communist Group
					

We’ve recently reported on this website about the Thurrock bin workers. They have been on strike for six weeks over cuts to their pay of as much as £3,800. This involved reduction of bank holiday triple pay to double pay, the loss of extra payments for vehicle inspections and greater flexibility...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org
				












						Fire and rehire at Douwe Egberts - Anarchist Communist Group
					

As we have stated here on the ACG website, fire and rehire is a tactic increasingly being used against workers in Britain. This means sacking workers and rehiring them on worse pay and conditions.    At the coffee plant in Banbury, Oxfordshire, the bosses of Jacobs Douwe Egberts sent out fire...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## The39thStep (May 23, 2021)

These victories are really important in building confidence amongst active trade unionists . Gives some strength and hope


----------



## hitmouse (May 23, 2021)

Oh yeah, while I remember, this sounds worth getting to if anyone in London is free on Tuesday:


> Unite, the UK’s leading union, is considering all legal option against London property services firm Goodlord following its *‘unfair’ *dismissal of striking workers on Wednesday evening (19 May).
> 
> Unite members will hold a protest on Tuesday next week outside Goodlord’s central London headquarters, calling for the workers to be reinstated.
> 
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (May 25, 2021)

Some more good news:


Full statement is here:


> A massive victory for NEU members who have been on strike in defence of victimised NEU rep and Exec member Kirstie Paton! Please share this statement from the NEU committee at John Roan School.
> "To all our members and supporters who have worked collectively to defend trade unionism, we have some very good news. Kirstie has received the outcome of her hearing - United Learning have decided not to dismiss her.
> This is a huge victory for Kirstie and for our Union and the wider team of union activists, parents,students and the local community members, who stood with Kirstie.
> We would like to offer a huge thank you to all our Union members. Despite United Learning's prolonged campaign to silence Kirstie for her work as a H&S rep, and Lead UL Rep across the trust, they have not silenced the voice of the Union.  It is vital that our Reps can raise legitimate concerns, especially concerning our health, safety and welfare during a pandemic, and this outcome strengthens our resolve to do so. It is also a reminder, that when any member experiences intimidation for voicing their concerns about management practice, that we support each other and defend our right to be active in our unions.
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (May 31, 2021)

This is a really lovely video:


----------



## belboid (Jun 2, 2021)

Banbury coffee workers fired by Douwe Egberts in a move that will cost workers up to 12k









						Dismissal notices for Banbury coffee workers over ‘fire and rehire’ plans branded as ‘corporate gangsterism’ by Unite
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 2, 2021)

Don't suppose anyone has any idea of Douwe Egberts has any UK sites other than Banbury?


----------



## belboid (Jun 2, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Don't suppose anyone has any idea of Douwe Egberts has any UK sites other than Banbury?


Head office at Maidenhead


----------



## William of Walworth (Jun 4, 2021)

Further farce at the DVLA, including the Department of Transport reneging (at the last minute!  ) on a new deal :

From Tuesday 1st June :

Ministers scupper DVLA deal



			
				PCS said:
			
		

> In an unprecedent development in over 20 years of civil service negotiations, PCS has accused ministers at the highest levels of government of scuppering a deal to avert strike action at the Swansea site.
> Union representatives and senior management, including the DfT permanent secretary had reached a deal at the end of last week, which could have brought an end to the Covid safety dispute, which has been running for several months.
> *However, earlier today the DfT reneged on the deal, much of which they had drafted and then refused to give any explanation as to why they were taking that action*.



And from Wednesday 2nd June :
Fresh round of strike action (at the DVLA call centre)

From yesterday (Thursday 3rd June) :
These strikes have been having quite an impact!




			
				PCS said:
			
		

> The second day of the third round of walkouts over Covid safety has been well supported, with reports of near-empty car parks at the Swansea site.
> *Phone services cancelled again*
> As we saw yesterday, the DVLA has been unable to provide phone services and only limited web chat to customers. PCS received reports that the DVLA had been desperately trying to source phone cover from other areas of the business, but without success as our members used their right to work to rule.
> *Backlogs pile up as strike progresses*
> The impact of the strike on backlogs means that there are an estimated 780,000 documents awaiting processing. The DVLA has reportedly offered overtime, but only at a lower rate of pay than if the work had been done in normal work hours. With 60,000 items of post coming in every day, this backlog is only going to get bigger.



"Rumour has it" that Shapps (Transport Minister) has not been allowed (from further up the Government) to authorise the already-arrived-at deal, because Johnson and others in the cabinet refuse to be seen to be giving into strike action ....


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 10, 2021)

Crossposting this from the construction workers thread cos this is a really big and important victory that people should know about:









						Win! Balfour Beatty and NG Bailey drop deskilling plans
					

Construction giants forced to change tack after Unite members demonstrate and disrupt



					www.union-news.co.uk
				








Some other stuff from union-news while I'm here:








						What the Swansea DVLA strikes says about COVID safety measures at work
					

This story first appeared on the Thompsons Solicitors website here. With hundreds of staff at the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (DVLA) in Swansea continuing to strike in a dispute over COVID-…



					www.union-news.co.uk
				












						Lecturers begin three-day strike at University of Leicester
					

Vice Chancellor plans to sack 26 members of staff



					www.union-news.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 10, 2021)

A bit more background on the story so far:
Sparked out: construction companies crumble under rank and file pressure


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 12, 2021)

__





						RMT says action going ahead in four separate disputes‎ on Scotland's railways
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 15, 2021)

Swansea DVLA writeup: 








						“We Will Keep Strike Going For Months If Bosses Don’t Back Down” - DVLA Union Rep -
					

Reading Time: 4 minutes Photo: DVLA workers on the picket line, courtesy PCS DVLA branch.  A PCS union rep at the DVLA in Swansea has said that the current strike over safety in the workplace is going to be a tough battle, but workers are prepared to continue their action to win major...




					www.voice.wales


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 22, 2021)

Demonstration called and strike action stepped up in Serco Royal London hospital bullying dispute
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				






> Workers employed by outsourcing giant Serco, who work in the company’s back of house catering department at the Royal London hospital in Whitechapel, East London, will stage a demonstration (Thursday 24 June) and have called further  strike action in the dispute over bullying and unworkable rosters.
> 
> 
> *WHEN: Thursday 24 June at 12:00
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 30, 2021)

Quick linkdump:




__





						RMT London Overground Protest to take place on Monday 28 June
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				








__





						RMT guards to bring negotiating table to East Midlands Railway
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				








__





						RMT to strike for pay justice on Tyne and Wear Metro
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				












						‘Summer stink’ to hit Bexley as Serco refuse workers strike
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				












						Reading hospital security guards renew strikes in July, as Unite calls on NHS bosses to take them back ‘in-house’
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 30, 2021)

Solid ballot result in a PCS ISS BEIS (try saying that three times fast) dispute:





__





						ISS staff in BEIS deliver impressive ballot result
					

Cleaners, security guards and other support staff employed by contractor ISS are one step closer to taking strike action after delivering a resounding yes vote in a PCS industrial action ballot.




					www.pcs.org.uk
				




Cleaners, security guards and other support staff employed by contractor ISS are one step closer to taking strike action after delivering a resounding *yes* vote in a PCS industrial action ballot.  

Our members voted 97.3% in favour of strike action on an impressive 82% turnout.
Our low-paid members working for ISS in BEIS offices in London are demanding:

an end to low pay and improved working conditions
 
extra bonuses for working through lockdown 
 
annual leave entitlement owed from last year. 
PCS also has concerns around Covid safety of staff and is calling on ISS to agree a return to work protocol. 
*Dedication *​It is the hard work and dedication of ISS staff that has kept the BEIS offices open and safe for those civil servants who needed to attend during the pandemic.
The ballot result shows the strength of feeling among members working for ISS in BEIS offices who feel that enough is enough.
We are calling for ISS, BEIS and the Government Property Agency to not only negotiate with PCS representatives but to start making tangible proposals to end this dispute.


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 1, 2021)

USDAW striking at a Long Eaton DHL/Marks and Spencer distribution center:








						Usdaw members back on strike at Long Eaton
					

Nottingham’s Labour MPs support workers taking action over redundancy pay



					www.union-news.co.uk
				




Biomedical scientists at East Lancashire Hospitals on their fifth week of all-out strike:


Background to that here:








						Biomedical scientists to strike for three more weeks in June over Lancashire trust’s ‘bad faith’ in reneging over pay upgrade
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 5, 2021)

Outsourced hospital workers to strike for equal pay
					






					morningstaronline.co.uk
				






> WORKERS at a Yorkshire hospital are to strike for equal pay.
> 
> Ancillary staff such as porters and cleaners at Airedale General Hospital in Keighley have voted for strike action and will walk out on July 19 as part of a prolonged dispute.
> 
> ...











						UNISON lodges formal dispute with higher education employers
					

UNISON’s higher education service group executive (SGE) have lodged a formal dispute with HE employers after the outcome of the pay offer consultation for August 1. The pay offer was a 1.5% increas…



					www.union-news.co.uk
				






> *UNISON’s higher education service group executive (SGE) have lodged a formal dispute with HE employers after the outcome of the pay offer consultation for August 1.*
> 
> The pay offer was a 1.5% increase for all members on pay point 22 and above, with staff on the lower pay points between 3 to 21 being offered pay increased on a sliding scale between 3.6% to 1.54%. Results from the consultation show that a clear majority of members have rejected the employers’ final pay offer.
> 
> ...











						Sacked for shielding! Serco Sandwell workers ballot for strike after disabled colleagues lose their jobs
					

GMB accuses managers of intimidation during the pandemic



					www.union-news.co.uk
				






> *GMB members working for Serco Sandwell waste collection services are balloting for strike action after bullying from management and disabled workers were sacked for shielding.*
> 
> The ballot follows months of management intimidation, including threatening workers who spoke out about safety issues and the sacking of disabled workers who shielded during the pandemic, one of whom was awaiting a kidney transplant.











						Serco traffic wardens begin two-week strike in Ealing
					

Unite members take action over attempts to undermine trade union organisation



					www.union-news.co.uk
				






> *Serco traffic wardens in Ealing have started two weeks’ strike action over the firm’s offer of severance to elected Unite representatives, activists, and lay members, made to undermine trade union organisation and collective consultation.*
> 
> The dispute is also over Serco refusal to negotiate a new absence management policy for employees working on the Ealing contract. Unite believes the present policy is being used to unfairly dismiss employees and should be renegotiated.
> 
> Unite members and supporters yesterday held a rally outside Ealing Town Hall.



Lots of disputes involving Serco at the moment, although I suppose maybe that's just because most of the country's been flogged off to Serco at this point?


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 6, 2021)

At least one of the Serco disputes now seems to have ended in a win:








						Royal London hospital strikes off as Serco offers major concessions in bullying and roster dispute
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				






> Strike action at the Royal London hospital in Whitechapel, involving back of house catering staff, has been suspended after their employer, outsourcing giant Serco, largely capitulated to the workers’ demands.
> 
> Workers bullied​
> The workers took five days of strike last month as a last resort, as they had been trying to resolve problems around an unworkable roster system and bullying for a year, without success.
> ...


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jul 12, 2021)

Workplace Struggles Here and Round the World - Anarchist Communist Group
					

DVLA    Strikes by workers at the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (DVLA) has resulted in a huge backlog for applications for driving licences. Further strikes are planned for July12th, 14th and 16th.    DVLA workers are determined to resist an attempt by bosses to push them back from working...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 13, 2021)

Two large and important groups at DVLA have been on strike today (Monday 12th July), and will be again on Thurrsday 15th and Friday 16th July  

The Drivers Medical involvement is particularly significant, and lliable to affect the public most -- DM is (it seems  ) where the biggest backlogs still remain .... 

PCS site gives a brief outline


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 16, 2021)

Update on the Bexley Serco bin strike:








						Bexley council warned ‘shoestring’ Serco refuse contract risks ‘years of industrial unrest’ as bin strikes begin
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




RMT to strike on the tube over management scrapping Night Train Drivers' grade:




__





						RMT to take strike action on London Underground
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				




RMT calls Justice for Cleaners demo, July 20th:




__





						Justice for Cleaners Demonstration
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 17, 2021)




----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jul 21, 2021)

DVLA workers are fighting for covid safety. They need support. One worker has died and there are currently 643 cases, plus a huge backlog:









						DVLA workers continue to fight for covid safety
					

Workers at the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency continue in their dispute over Covid safety. The DVLA has seen one death and 643 cases. There is a backlog of 1.4 million cases which union reps s…




					nosafetynowork.wordpress.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 22, 2021)




----------



## hitmouse (Jul 22, 2021)

__





						Merseyrail cleaners strike and protest tomorrow in fight for pay justice
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				






> Rail union RMT Mitie station and accommodation cleaners on the Merseyrail Contract are taking strike action and demonstrating in support of pay justice tomorrow – Friday 23rd July.
> 
> The demonstration, involving the cleaners and their supporters, will be outside Mitie and Merseyrail’s Liverpool Headquarters at Rail House, Lord Nelson Street, Liverpool L1 1JF at 8am on Friday 23rd July.
> 
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 24, 2021)

This may be of interest:








						UVW Strike Ballot Training
					

Ever wondered what's involved in running - and winning! - a strike ballot? What conversations with workers during a strike ballot look like? And what to do if - sorry, when - the bosses go into full union busting mode?   In UVW, we've got years of experience in all of this, and we want to make...




					docs.google.com
				






> Ever wondered what's involved in running - and winning! - a strike ballot? What conversations with workers during a strike ballot look like? And what to do if - sorry, when - the bosses go into full union busting mode?
> 
> In UVW, we've got years of experience in all of this, and we want to make sure we share that with as many members as possible.
> 
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 24, 2021)

Update on the Bexley refuse strike:








						‘Long hot stinking summer in Bexley’ as Serco bin strikes stretch into August
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




There's a fb page for the strike here:


			https://www.facebook.com/JusticeForRefuseWorkersAndCleansers
		

Including this impressive solidarity bin:


Also, not directly strike-related, but in general union stuff Unite have a demo against union-busting at HS2 on August 6th:


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 25, 2021)

UK lorry drivers plan to strike over low pay and poor working conditions
					

Nearly 3,000 hauliers are proposing a ‘stay at home’ day, prompting fears over already creaking food supply chains




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 27, 2021)

Drivers and couriers vow to escalate after protest at Uber HQ over unfair sacking of 200 key workers
					

Following the unfair dismissal of over 200 drivers and couriers by app-based operators this year, the Independent Workers’ Union of Great Britain (IWGB) brought together workers from its United Pri…




					freedomnews.org.uk
				












						Deliveroo drivers on strike in city centre over pay dispute
					

Riders gathered on Bold Street to stop working for an hour




					www.liverpoolecho.co.uk
				












						End Discrimination at the Royal Parks
					

We are crowdfunding for Just Ask Estates Service Ltd workers’ strike fund.




					www.crowdfunder.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 27, 2021)

Tesco offers £1,000 joining bonus for HGV lorry drivers 

Is it worth having a separate thread for lorry driver stuff? I think it might be discussed in one of the giant Brexit threads but also I prefer to avoid looking at the giant Brexit threads?


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 2, 2021)

Strikes going ahead on Hull and East Midlands trains:
Industrial action restarts on Hull Trains
Train Managers to strike on East Midlands Railway
Suspended on the tube, though:
RMT suspends Tube strike action

Also, BFAWU organising a demo at a food factory in Leicester on Thursday:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 2, 2021)

URGENT SOLIDARITY NEEDED ON MONDAY
UCU members at the University of Liverpool are still fighting to stop the final SIX compulsory redundancies going through.  Our negotiators meet management on Monday, and we want to send a strong message that if they don't stop the cuts, we will strike again.
What can you do to help?
Please join the Twitter Storm between 9:00-10:00am on Monday 2nd August

Use your branch Twitter account if you can
Schedule your tweets between 9:00-10:00am
Remember to use these tags for Liverpool UCU @ULivUCU2 #FightForHealthJobs
Use @LivUni if you want to tag in the university
Support the strikes Wednesday 4th - Saturday 14th August
If the university does not withdraw compulsory redundancies, we will strike again over the confirmation and clearing period.

Please rush messages of solidarity to laut@liverpool.ac.uk
Invite a Liverpool striker to your branch
Pass a motion of solidarity in your branch
Send a donation to the strike fund at https://ulivucunews.org.uk/hardship-fund/
Your solidarity means everything to us xx

Also, latest from the Bexley bin strike:








						Bexley Serco bin strikes could last until October without council intervention
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 3, 2021)

Video from the Bexley strike:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 5, 2021)

Two solidarity rallies for the Liverpool UCU strike, online thing on Friday:



IRL thing on Monday:





> UCU members at the University of Liverpool are fighting off compulsory redundancies.  There were originally 47 staff at risk of redundancy.   Through sustained industrial action, we have brought that number down to 2 jobs.
> We will be on strike to stop the job cuts Wednesday 4th - Saturday 14th August.  We invite you to join us for a mass protest on campus on Monday 9th August - the day before A-Level Results Day.
> Help us to show university managers that the only acceptable number of compulsory redundancies is zero.
> Please bring union banners, home made placards, picketing pets, and plenty of friends and colleagues.  Share this event to spread the word.
> Unity is strength!


Reducing the job cuts from 47 to 2 is solid progress already, and good on them for refusing to be bought off.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 7, 2021)

Barnoldswick is back on:








						Barnoldswick workers to begin strike action as battle to save historic Rolls Royce plant is renewed
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 14, 2021)

UVW/PCS joint strike at Royal Parks to start for two weeks from Monday 16th on: Strike in the Royal Parks to go ahead from Monday | Public and Commercial Services Union

Strike fund here: End Discrimination at the Royal Parks
Email tool thing here: End discrimination at Royal Park: write to Royal Parks and sub-contractor, Just Ask Estate Services Ltd.
Picket details are:
Monday 16th August at 9.30 am
The Old Police House
Hyde Park
London
W2 2UH​(and then continuing after that)


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 14, 2021)

Also, this coming up on September 4th, may be of interest to MadeInBedlam and others, dunno who works in care?






> Throughout the pandemic care and support workers have been at the frontline. Many of us have worked gruelling hours to cover staff shortages. Government policy allowed Covid-19 to run rampant through our care homes while we weren’t given adequate PPE to protect ourselves and our service users.   Hundreds of us made the ultimate sacrifice and lost our lives from a virus we contracted at our workplaces.
> Despite our commitment to a job that we love, 18 months from the beginning of the Covid-19 crisis we are still struggling with a lack of sick pay, poverty wages and empty promises. We’ve faced setbacks to our already struggling sector including the right to minimum wage on sleep in shifts and mandatory vaccinations. We want change. It’s time for care workers to clap back.
> We are calling for a national demonstration during Professional Care Workers Week. We are a skilled workforce and our wages should reflect that. We are fighting for £15 per hour and decent working conditions.
> If you are a care worker, belong to a trade union, or just believe that care workers deserve better join us on September 4th.
> ...


----------



## Shechemite (Aug 14, 2021)

Cheers


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 24, 2021)

Lancashire biomedical scientists set to strike until November in pay upgrade dispute
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				






> Biomedical scientists at a Lancashire NHS trust will strike until the middle of November in an upgrading pay row, as the bosses drag their feet over holding constructive talks, Unite the union said today (Friday 13 August).
> 
> The 21 biomedical scientists at East Lancashire Hospitals NHS Trust were on strike between 31 May and 28 July – and are set to resume strike action on *Friday 20 August which will then run through until Thursday 11 November. *At five-and-half months this would be one of the longest-running industrial disputes currently in the UK.
> 
> ...







__





						Royal Parks: First week of strike action ends on a high
					

After a week of industrial action, workers at Just Ask remain determined to win. Planning more campaign activities next week, ending in a large public protest on bank holiday monday.




					www.pcs.org.uk
				






> After a week of industrial action, workers at Just Ask remain determined to win. Planning more campaign activities next week, ending in a large public protest on bank holiday monday.
> 
> The strike is over 6 issues, the key ones being possible staffing cuts later this year and winning the same sick pay as staff who are directly employed by the Royal Parks.
> 
> ...


----------



## The39thStep (Aug 24, 2021)

Yodel LGV drivers set for vote on taking strike action
					

The strike ballot opens on August 25 and closes on September 15. According to GMB, the vote is taking place as drivers are angry over their work life balance, ...




					trans.info


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 24, 2021)

Also, IWGB looking set to enter into dispute at Ocado:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 24, 2021)

Bexley might be over:








						Bexley bin collections to resume while deal is ratified
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




But a new Serco dispute kicking off with the GMB in Sandwell:




__





						GMB set Serco Strike dates | GMB S85 Sandwell Community Branch – Experts in the World of Work
					






					www.gmbs85sandwell.org.uk
				




Also, Manc tram drivers balloting over pay:








						Manchester tram drivers to be balloted for strike action over derisory pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Also, an arty party in the woods somewhere near Peckham raising funds for the ongoing PCS/UVW strike:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 26, 2021)

Posted elsewhere, but there's a strike rally for the UVW/PCS park cleaners' strike on Monday:


And Reel News video:


----------



## Jeremiah18.17 (Aug 26, 2021)

Wildcat strike at The Assembly Bakery in Bristol over layoffs:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 27, 2021)

Bit more on the Bristol bakery:








						Staff at 'ethical bakery' go on strike over redundancies
					

"What are they going to do to me next time if this is the way they treat other members of staff now?"




					www.bristolpost.co.uk
				



(nearly posted the url for the rock star door story there by accident)





Seems to be a bit of a difference in opinion between the IWW and the BFAWU bloke about whether the strike is one-day or ongoing. Is nice to see a wob flag on a proper actual picket line, anyway.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Aug 28, 2021)

Protest in the Park in support of Royal Park workers (30th Aug):









						SUPPORT ROYAL PARK WORKERS ON AUGUST 30TH
					

The UVW has called for a Protest in the Park to support striking park workers. Meet at Speakers Corner Hyde Park at 11am on August 30th.  ...




					londonacg.blogspot.com


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 30, 2021)

Bristol bakery update:


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 2, 2021)

More on the Bristol bakery:








						Bristol’s Wildcat Bakery Strike
					

After being told four out of nine workers were being made redundant – two with minimal notice – staff at Bristol's Assembly Bakery are striking for better treatment.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 3, 2021)

Bristol wildcat strike fund:








						Help raise £400 to fund for striking workers at The Assembly Bakery (VICTORY!)
					

Weʼre raising money to fund for striking workers at The Assembly Bakery (VICTORY!). Support this JustGiving Crowdfunding Page.




					www.justgiving.com


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 11, 2021)

The Bristol wildcat won:


Also sounds like a good outcome for the Serco Bexley bin dispute, 11% rise isn't bad and Serco are losing the contract as well:








						Bexley bin dispute ends with refuse workers moving from ‘worst pay rates in London to some of the best’
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




But sounds like Serco Sandwell and Serco council are still being dicks though:




__





						Sandwell Council leader Rajbir Singh ‘sabotaging’ strike talks at Serco
					

Sandwell Council falsely claims ongoing strike has been ‘withdrawn’ whilst positive talks with Serco continue




					www.gmb.org.uk
				




IWGB officially launching their campaign at Ocado:








						IWGB launches #ShameOnOcado campaign as BAME key worker jobs threatened after whistleblowing on outsourcing and poverty pay
					

Ocado Zoom workers have voted to take strike action!




					iwgb.org.uk
				




Asking people to send letters here:








						#ShameOnOcado! Time to deliver fair pay and conditions!
					

Write to the Ocado bosses and tell them to give the workers the pay and conditions they deserve!




					actionnetwork.org


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Sep 11, 2021)

Bus drivers in Wales being balloted on strike action next week. Important ballot for the sector:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Sep 13, 2021)

Massively important ALL OUT strike to begin at GKN Driveline in Erdington, Birmingham. 95% of members voted for continuous strike action and the notice has been served today.









						GKN Birmingham workers announce all out strike action in battle to prevent factory closure
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




I’ll be posting more about this as we proceed. This is a litmus test for the new GS, for the stewards in the city and for our ability to take on and defeat venture capitalists in a strategically important industry in our city. The strikes will start on 27th.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 13, 2021)

Write-up of the IWGB Ocado campaign:








						Ocado drivers vote for strike action after £5 an hour pay revelations
					

'If our hard work is worth the nation's applause, it’s worth decent pay and fair conditions.'




					leftfootforward.org


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 14, 2021)

Updates from UVW at Great Ormond Street:








						Cleaners ballot to strike in ongoing dispute for equal work rights
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				












						Great Ormond Street Children’s Hospital
					

Having already won a string of concessions, such as NHS pay, sick pay, pensions last year in an historic fight to end outsourcing, workers then found out that GOSH had failed to give them full NHS parity. The workers voted to take strike action and NHS bosses conceded to their demands for full...



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				






> *OUR WINS*
> Wage parity
> Pensions
> Annual leave
> ...


----------



## teqniq (Sep 15, 2021)

Possible winter of discontent in Wales:









						Major Union Hits Out At Welsh Government Over Public Sector Pay & Social Care, Warns Of Winter Strikes -
					

Reading Time: 6 minutes UNISON says that Welsh Labour must create a National Care Service and fulfil its election promise to raise worker pay  The union is recommending its members reject low pay offers in health and local government, paving the way for winter strikes Welsh Labour faces its...




					www.voice.wales


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 15, 2021)

Article on the Bexley Serco bin strike:








						The Bexley Bin Workers Show that Organising Works
					

Bin workers in Bexley have gone from being some of the lowest paid in London to some of the highest, winning pay rises and extra holidays through strike action. Their lesson is simple: organising works.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## teqniq (Sep 16, 2021)

Fire and rehire again:









						Weetabix workers in Northamptonshire announce autumn walkouts over £5,000 fire and rehire wage cuts
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 17, 2021)

Manchester tram drivers to strike over pay starting on the 25th-26th (coinciding with a United home game and the Great Manchester Run):








						Manchester faces severe disruption as tram drivers vote for strikes over pitiful pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Abellio Scotrail sounds like it'll now be facing strikes from both conductors organised through RMT and engineers organised through Unite:








						Unite demands ‘serious offer’ at Abellio Scotrail pay talks as industrial action set to bring the rail network to a ‘standstill’
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				












						New ScotRail conductor strike dates
					

Rail union RMT announces further strike after ScotRail conductors vote by over 80% to continue action in reballot in fight for pay equality and justice.



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 18, 2021)

The joint PCS/UVW park strike will be running through the whole of October:




__





						Fight for equality of terms and conditions at Royal Parks ramps up
					

Outsourced Royal Parks cleaners and playground attendants employed by Just Ask Estate Services Ltd are to go on strike for the whole of October.




					www.pcs.org.uk
				




Their strike crowdfunder thing closes tonight, for some reason:








						End Discrimination at the Royal Parks
					

We are crowdfunding for Just Ask Estates Service Ltd workers’ strike fund.




					www.crowdfunder.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 19, 2021)

Few more:
Outsourced cleaners at UAL striking from the 27th-1st:




Strike fund is here, will also be having a protest in support on Saturday 25th:


App Drivers and Couriers Union calling a national strike at Uber on September 28th:








						ADCU announces national Uber strike
					

Move comes the day after Brighton protest against over pay and dismissal of drivers



					www.union-news.co.uk
				



(sometimes I wonder if I should find out more about the ADCU/IWGB split, but also I'm not an Uber driver and I don't know if I'd really benefit from learning about any more messy left drama)

Stagecoach drivers voting to strike over pay:








						RMT members vote for action on Stagecoach Buses
					

Bus union RMT members vote by around nine to one for industrial action in three more Stagecoach areas as part of national bus workers' pay fight.



					www.rmt.org.uk
				




Tesco distribution centre staff voting to reject a pay offer - which isn't the same thing as voting to strike yet, but could be pretty impactful:








						Tesco faces empty shelves this winter as workers reject meagre pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Sep 20, 2021)

More on the GKN driveline dispute…


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 20, 2021)

Crossposting here, mass wildcat at the Atomic Weapons Establishment Burghfield site today:


----------



## teqniq (Sep 21, 2021)

We could really do with some of this here. Why is it this doesn't happen in the UK?


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 21, 2021)

Interesting times for the GKN company, then.
First write-up of the AWE Burghfield situation:








						NG Bailey M&E Walkout at AWE Burghfield
					

M&E Workers Walkout Over 200 NG Bailey Sparks and Fitters walked off site at AWE Burghfield today (20/09) over suspected Blacklisting and Un...




					siteworker.blogspot.com


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Sep 21, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Interesting times for the GKN company, then.
> First write-up of the AWE Burghfield situation:
> 
> 
> ...



Certainly is hitmouse


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Sep 21, 2021)

teqniq said:


> We could really do with some of this here. Why is it this doesn't happen in the UK?




All out strike action starts in Birmingham next week teqniq. Our stewards are in touch with our Italian comrades. Watch this space


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 22, 2021)

Food couriers wildcat in Dumferline:








						Delivery drivers for Uber Eats and Just Eat stage strike in Dunfermline
					

Delivery drivers who work for Uber Eats and Just Eat in Dunfermline will "strike" at peak times all this week in protest over better pay.




					www.dunfermlinepress.com
				




Uber strike next week confirmed to be happening in at least eight cities:


Stuff confirmed happening in London, Sheffield, Glasgow and Manchester so far, more coming soon.
Also, Manchester tram strike is off after winning a pay rise:








						Manchester Metrolink strikes suspended as workers secure improved pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



But now Stagecoach drivers are balloting:




__





						Manchester Stagecoach bus drivers to vote for strike action over pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Sep 24, 2021)

Good article on the developing situation at GKN. Stewards at the plant in Birmingham and others have put together a superb Lucas Plan style document setting out how the plant can be repurposed to create new green jobs making electric vehicle parts. Precisely the type of jobs that the Tories and Labour claim are the future, that position the workplace alongside British R&D and which can help lower emissions.

The strikes planned to start next week have been suspended to allow for further negotiations, with the venture capitalists pressured back into talks and forced to discuss alternatives to offshoring. An important first step for the campaign.

As Frank Duffy the Unite works convenor says “_Ours is the first transition plan for an automotive plant proposed by union stewards in the UK, and an echo of the 1976 Lucas Plan, when shop stewards at Lucas Aerospace, also in Birmingham, proposed converting their plant to socially useful products.









						GKN closes plants and sacks workers in Birmingham and in Florence
					

Dave Kellaway reports on an industrial dispute with GKN which is currently taking place in England and Italy.



					anticapitalistresistance.org
				



_


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 26, 2021)

Unite asking people to sign this petition in support of the East Lancashire NHS scientists on strike:








						East Lancashire NHS Trust: Fully honour your agreement and pay scientists fairly
					

Throughout the pandemic, biomedical scientists have been on the frontline of our NHS, analysing patient blood samples and carrying out covid-19 testing. Their work has been critical to keeping us safe.  But the NHS Trust has let these key workers down. They have acted in bad faith and failed to...




					www.megaphone.org.uk


----------



## teqniq (Sep 27, 2021)

Oooo:









						Strikes may 'cripple' Clyde nuclear sub base after workers back industrial action
					

SPECIALIST staff have voted to down tools in an industrial dispute expected to "strike at the heart" of the UK's nuclear submarine base on…




					www.heraldscotland.com


----------



## Sprocket. (Sep 27, 2021)

teqniq said:


> Oooo:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


They’re only making plans for vigil.


----------



## petee (Sep 28, 2021)

If Hollywood Workers Strike, the Entertainment Industry Will Grind to a Halt
					

In a display of worker militancy not seen in Hollywood for decades, members of the International Alliance of Theatrical Stage Employees (IATSE) are about to vote on whether 60,000 of them will go on strike in October.




					www.jacobinmag.com
				




"The International Alliance of Theatrical Stage Employees (IATSE) has never actually struck all of its West Coast locals at once. An estimated 60,000 IATSE members could walk off the job in the coming weeks, which would be the biggest private sector strike in the United States in over a decade."


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 28, 2021)

Unite Wales NHS members reject 3% pay increase and vote in favour of industrial action
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				












						Unite members at Stagecoach vote overwhelmingly in favour of strike action
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				












						Dundee University members appeal for strike hardship donations | Article | News | UNISON National
					

UNISON members at Dundee University appeal for solidarity donations ahead of strike action




					www.unison.org.uk
				











						UNISON members at Dundee University set for strike action to defend pensions - UNISON Scotland
					

UNISON members at Dundee University who are part of, or are eligible to be part of, the university’s superannuation scheme




					unison-scotland.org
				



And the Uber strike's on today:




__





						#UberStrike
					

September 28th - #UberStrike - The ADCU will be striking against Uber and staging protests up and down the UK on September 28th.




					www.adcu.org.uk
				



Oh, and:




__





						More Sandwell strikes loom over Serco bullying
					

Refuse workers in Sandwell Council will take further strike action next month, warning they will not be 'strung along' by Serco




					www.gmb.org.uk
				












						GMB University Cleaners to strike for fair pay in South London
					

The cleaners have long asked for the most basic of things – equal treatment with directly employed staff.  It's time they got it, say GMB Union




					www.gmb-southern.org.uk
				












						Five days of strikes at University of Liverpool
					

Staff at the University of Liverpool are set to walk out for five consecutive days from Monday 4 October unless management halts plans to sack two staff. The week-long strike will cause severe disruption to the first full week of teaching at the university.




					www.ucu.org.uk
				











						Staff to strike at 10 colleges
					

Staff at 10 English colleges will be walking out tomorrow in their fight for fair pay.




					www.ucu.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 28, 2021)

NHS pay zoom meeting tonight:


----------



## teqniq (Oct 2, 2021)

Not an actual post about a strike but kinda related. Please sign and share:









						Petition: Repeal the Trade Union Act 2016
					

The Trade Union Act 2016 restricts the actions and powers of workers and trade unions, with the implementation of an arbitrary turnout threshold (50%) needed to make a strike legitimate. Even if a strike receives 100% support, if the turnout is under 50%, the vote is not counted.




					petition.parliament.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 2, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Also, Manchester tram strike is off after winning a pay rise:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Manchester tram strike back on now, first day on October 10th:








						Metrolink workers to strike on city marathon day in fight for fair pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Liverpool uni dispute over compulsory redundancies ends with a total win:








						University strikes off as union declares victory over jobs saved
					

Six-month action comes to an end as compulsory redundancies avoided




					www.liverpoolecho.co.uk
				




Also, article by GMB rep about the successful Polyflor dispute:








						Polyflor Workers Won’t Be Walked Over
					

After being refused a pay rise despite big profits for investors, staff at the Polyflor factory in Manchester went on strike. Their ensuing victory is a warning to bosses: never take your workforce for granted.




					tribunemag.co.uk
				




Oh, and Stagecoach strikes in a number of areas on the 18th:








						RMT confirms strikes on Stagecoach buses
					

BUS UNION RMT confirmed today that it is serving notice for strike action on Stagecoach buses in the South West, East Midlands and Derbyshire/Yorkshire as part of the national fight for pay justice for bus workers.



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 4, 2021)

More Stagecoach strikes confirmed:








						Stingy Stagecoach pushes Lancashire drivers to strike over pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



So that's Preston and Chorley striking through Unite, Mansfield, Worksop, Chesterfield, Exter, Barnstaple and Torquay striking through RMT, South Wales have voted to strike but no dates set yet, and Manchester and Scotland currently balloting. I hope there's going to be some national-level co-ordination going on with these.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 4, 2021)

GMB: City Clean (Brighton & Hove CC) HGV refuse & recycling drivers voted 100% to walk out for two weeks as of tomorrow. Another Green council, another strike - there’s a pattern.


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 4, 2021)

Mr.Bishie said:


> GMB: City Clean (Brighton & Hove CC) HGV refuse & recycling drivers voted 100% to walk out for two weeks as of tomorrow. Another Green council, another strike - there’s a pattern.


Sure it'll be a piece of piss for the council to get strikebreakers in, I hear there's tons of unemployed HGV drivers desperately looking for anyone who'll hire them at the moment.


----------



## ska invita (Oct 4, 2021)

isnt this whats happening, refuse drivers shifting to new better paid HGV jobs , leaving routes short staffed and stressed? Dont know about Brighton per se but sounds like thats happening elsewhere


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 4, 2021)

Not directly strike-related, but here's a good article on the Ocado campaign:








						Ocado Drivers Are Fighting to Unionise the Gig Economy
					

Last month, Ocado Zoom drivers made headlines for organising against rock-bottom pay and outsourcing of their jobs. Now, they are unionising – and determined to win better.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 5, 2021)

PCS/UVW joint strike all month at Royal Parks:




__





						Members from Just Ask Services rally to launch first day of October strike action
					

Cleaners and playground attendants at the Royal Parks gathered in St James’s Park on the first day of their month long strike.




					www.pcs.org.uk
				




Sage Nursing Home:


And more on the UAL cleaners strike:








						UAL Cleaners Are Fighting the Outsourcing Agenda
					

Last week, cleaners at University of the Arts London went on strike. It is just the latest battle in the fight against outsourcing and diminishing conditions across the economy – but it is one they intend to win.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## MickiQ (Oct 5, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Sure it'll be a piece of piss for the council to get strikebreakers in, I hear there's tons of unemployed HGV drivers desperately looking for anyone who'll hire them at the moment.


Perhaps they will be able to import some from Poland


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 5, 2021)

Cleaners at facebook balloting for action over workloads and the victimisation of a union activist:


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 7, 2021)

Cleaners protests on 8th and 15th October - Anarchist Communist Group
					

Facebook cleaners, members of CAIWU (the Cleaners and Allied Independent Workers' Union) are balloting for strike action over the dismissal of one of their members. The workers are employed by Churchill Group agency which has subjected cleaners to excessive workloads which are causing ill health...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org
				












						Workplace Notes: strike news - Anarchist Communist Group
					

Manchester TramsManchester Metrolink workers are set to strike on Sunday 10th October, the same day as the Manchester Marathon, over management’s poor pay offer. More info from Unite.    Stagecoach busesBus drivers at Stagecoach will be out on strike on 18th October in the South West, East...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org
				












						Weetabix Fire and Rehire - Anarchist Communist Group
					

Engineers at two Weetabix factories went out on a two-day strike in late September. The workers at Kettering and Corby came out over fire and rehire proposals from the bosses which would mean a loss of up to £5,000 a year. In addition, the bosses have proposed a move from a regular Monday to...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 8, 2021)

You couldn’t make this up;


----------



## magneze (Oct 8, 2021)




----------



## Serge Forward (Oct 8, 2021)

The Greens have form for this. Didn't Caroline Lucas and her mates go out and clean streets during a precious dust strike?


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 8, 2021)

Yep, in 2013


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 8, 2021)

Tories on bikes


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 9, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Also, Manchester tram strike is off after winning a pay rise:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





hitmouse said:


> Manchester tram strike back on now, first day on October 10th:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Update, Manchester tram strike is now suspended again:








						Manchester Metrolink strike suspended as fresh pay offer proposed
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



But 15th, 18th and 24th might still be going ahead if they vote to reject the new offer.


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 10, 2021)

Wigan pay strikes could spark UK-wide Coca Cola bottle shortage
					

Nearly 150 factory workers are striking over an 'insulting' two per cent pay rise




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 12, 2021)

Llanelli posties coming out tomorrow in support of a victimised colleague:


(fb here if people prefer that)

Also, GMB now balloting other groups of workers in Brighton:




__





						GMB Union to additionally ballot Cityclean Refuse and Recycling Loaders and Street cleansing teams operatives after dispute talks break down
					

‘It so disappointing as Friday’s meeting had left us with the impression that we had made good progress in moving towards a resolution and halting strike action, but today has seen a clear about turn and retraction of certain positional assurances by the council team' says GMB southern.




					www.gmb-southern.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 12, 2021)

Dunno if this'll actually lead to anything or if it's just tough talk that'll end up going nowhere, but fwiw:









						Improve local government pay offer or face strike action, says UNISON | News, Press release | News | UNISON National
					

Ballot on action expected to begin next month




					www.unison.org.uk
				







__





						School staff, refuse collectors and council workers reject 'offensive' pay offer
					

Consultative industrial action ballot to follow after three quarters say no to NJC offer




					www.gmb.org.uk
				











						Unite council staff ‘support industrial action’, after voting overwhelmingly to reject ‘insulting’ 1.75 per cent pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 12, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> More Stagecoach strikes confirmed:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Update on this, the Lancashire strike seems to be suspended while they vote on a new pay offer:








						Lancashire bus strikes suspended as new pay offer on the table
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



Meanwhile, strike dates have been confirmed for Stagecoach drivers in Cwmbran, Brynmawr and Blackwood:








						Unite Members at Stagecoach Wales set for industrial action
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



Unite seem to have forgotten to mention the dates in their own press release, but Cwmbran Life says it's:
• Starting at 02:00 hours on 19 October 2021 and continuing each day up to 24 October 2021 when the action will end at 01:59 hours

• Starting at 02:00 hours on 25 October 2021 and continuing up to 26 October 2021 when the action will end at 01:59 hours

• Starting at 02:00 hours on 29 October 2021 and continuing each day up to 31 October 2021 when the action will end at 01:59 hours

• Starting at 02:00 hours on 1 November 2021 and continuing each day up to 7 November  2021 when the action will end at 01:59 hours

• Starting at 02:00 hours on 8 November 2021 and continuing each day up to 10 November  2021 when the action will end at 01:59 hours

• Starting at 02:00 hours on 12 November 2021 and continuing up to 13 November 2021 when the action will end at 01:59 hours


----------



## belboid (Oct 13, 2021)

Of purely historical interest:

On the day that most likely translates to October 13, 1157 BCE in our current calendar, the earliest recorded strike in history was first reported. The dispute is recounted in a papyrus written by a scribe in the ancient Egyptian town that is now called Deir el-Medina. Gangs of skilled construction workers in the employ of Pharaoh Ramses III stopped work when, eighteen days after their payday, they had still not received their wages, which would have been paid in food and other goods. The workers shouted that they were hungry and sat down by a temple. Officials gave them some pastries, and they returned home, but the following day they protested once more, demanding their pay at the central grain storehouse in Thebes. Eventually they received their back pay, but the pattern of workers needing to go on strike to be paid what they were owed was repeated multiple times.
*


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 13, 2021)

belboid said:


> Of purely historical interest:
> 
> On the day that most likely translates to October 13, 1157 BCE in our current calendar, the earliest recorded strike in history was first reported. The dispute is recounted in a papyrus written by a scribe in the ancient Egyptian town that is now called Deir el-Medina. Gangs of skilled construction workers in the employ of Pharaoh Ramses III stopped work when, eighteen days after their payday, they had still not received their wages, which would have been paid in food and other goods. The workers shouted that they were hungry and sat down by a temple. Officials gave them some pastries, and they returned home, but the following day they protested once more, demanding their pay at the central grain storehouse in Thebes. Eventually they received their back pay, but the pattern of workers needing to go on strike to be paid what they were owed was repeated multiple times.
> *


On this day thread>

This thread is for current and upcoming strikes, not historical ones.


----------



## belboid (Oct 13, 2021)

Good point.  I’ll just add the Chesterfield stagecoach strike deets here then









						'Severe disruption' fears as Chesterfield bus drivers announce pre-Christmas strike over pay
					

Bus drivers at Stagecoach in Chesterfield are set to strike in a dispute with bosses over pay.




					www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 13, 2021)

Has a full breakdown of the results from the various NHS pay ballots - it's not looking good, turnout % wise:








						NHS pay dispute from below – Online newsletter no.4
					

Striking health workers in Berlin The main healthcare unions have spent the last 6 weeks consulting their members on the 3% pay ‘rise’, which has now trickled into some workers’ September wage slip…




					healthworkersunited.wordpress.com


----------



## belboid (Oct 13, 2021)

belboid said:


> Good point.  I’ll just add the Chesterfield stagecoach strike deets here then
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And it's off already. Got an email from Stagecoach saying they've agreed to settle, but no details yet:


Following ongoing discussions with RMT and Unite unions, we are pleased to say there will be *no industrial strike action* in *Chesterfield* on Monday 18th October or further dates at this time.​

We are pleased to have *reached an agreement* with the RMT and Unite unions that provides *a fair deal for our employees* in Chesterfield and helps to secure the long-term sustainability of the local bus network.​


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 14, 2021)

belboid said:


> And it's off already. Got an email from Stagecoach saying they've agreed to settle, but no details yet:
> 
> 
> Following ongoing discussions with RMT and Unite unions, we are pleased to say there will be *no industrial strike action* in *Chesterfield* on Monday 18th October or further dates at this time.​
> ...


Would be interesting to try and keep track of how many strikes are being headed off at the last minute by pay deals - like, the Unite website reports this happening with Lancashire Stagecoach drivers, Chesterfield (although that also says Chesterfield is suspended pending a ballot, not fully resolved as yet), and DHL drivers on the Sainsbury contract, and that's just yesterday. Plus the Manchester tram thing, although again that offer hasn't been accepted by the members yet, and they have previously rejected one "improved" offer already. I suppose that sort of thing happens all the time to some extent, but having it happen in three different disputes on one day seems rare?

Anyway, confirmed that Manchester Stagecoach drivers will be out on strike starting Tuesday 26th:








						Greater Manchester braced for traffic turmoil as Stagecoach bus drivers vote for strikes
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



Or maybe they won't if Stagecoach makes a new pay offer at the last minute, which seems not unlikely at this point.

Oh, and this article from the RMT has some good detail on exactly how shoddy some of the "improved" offers that Stagecoach are trying to avoid strikes with are:




__





						Bus workers strike goes ahead in the South West
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 14, 2021)

Latest from Brighton:


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 14, 2021)

“When they’re against the bin strike, & have Green Party Member in their bio…Environmentalism without class struggle is just gardening"



(Brighton Wobblies)


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 16, 2021)

Greens bringing in the external scabs tomorrow to start clearing the shite.


----------



## kenny g (Oct 17, 2021)

You’re betraying your Quaker roots: fury at Clarks’ ‘fire and rehire’ plan
					

The shoe firm was founded in Street in Somerset in 1825. Now workers there are on strike and feel a proud history is being erased




					www.theguardian.com
				




Perhaps one reason people aren't buying their shoes is since they were taken over by a private equity business the quality went to shite.. Now apparently this is going to be clawed back by reducing wages to minimum wage..


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 18, 2021)

Good news from Great Ormond Street (I appreciate it can be annoying to just link to tweets but they don't seem to have a proper writeup of it yet):


Also, protest at the Royal Parks trustees meeting in support of striking park workers on Wednesday:





						Royal Parks protest 20 October | Public and Commercial Services Union
					






					www.pcs.org.uk
				





> Royal Parks protest 20 October​
> 
> Start date
> 
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 19, 2021)

Oh, turns out there is indeed a proper write-up of the GOSH victory:








						UVW members declare victory as GOSH commit to full equality
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				




Another reminder that the SAGE strike starts on Thursday:








						“All key workers deserve decent work and a living wage” – carers in North London declare strike action
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				











						Strike at Sage – Quality care deserves  quality pay
					

UVW members, care, domestic and maintenance workers at Sage Nursing home in North London declared a huge victory after a protracted dispute over poverty pay and decent working conditions. Winning the London Living Wage, resulting in a minimum pay rise of 11% for some workers and all other staff...



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				




Carers, domestic, and maintenance workers at Sage Nursing Home in North London are taking strike action. *Join us on the picket line on 21 October, 8am-11am at Sage Nursing Home, 208 Golders Green Rd, London NW11 9AL.*


“We built a high profile campaign, supported by care workers around the UK, that led to strike action at the start of the year in the harshest of conditions during a global pandemic lockdown.


Yet Sage Nursing trustees not only failed to keep their word but they also continue to preside over a workplace that is short-staffed, mismanaged and where bullying, favouritism, and a blame culture is rife. They have tried every trick in the book to break us but our resolve is stronger than ever.” Bile, Sage care worker.

If you're interested in helping support the strike, there's a sign-up form here to join the solidarity group:








						Sage Nursing Home - Strike action group
					

Carers, domestic and maintenance workers at Sage Nursing home in North London will commence strike action on night of 20 October, 21st and 22nd October. Thank you for signing up to take action on the strike days. We will be in touch with plans very soon, please leave your details below and let...




					docs.google.com


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 22, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Anyway, confirmed that Manchester Stagecoach drivers will be out on strike starting Tuesday 26th:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Manchester Stagecoach strike is off, they've now accepted a new offer of 3.7% backdated to the first of the month plus £150:








						Manchester Stagecoach strikes off as workers agree improved pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



£150 seems a bit low for a special one-off payment, but I suppose I'd rather have that than nowt?


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 22, 2021)

How the Brighton Bin Strike Won
					

After a 14-day strike, refuse collectors in Brighton have won a deal that will see low-paid council workers across the city get a pay rise – it’s yet another victory that proves the power of collective action.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 22, 2021)

*GPs in England threaten industrial action over in-person appointments*

Actual *STRIKE!!* possible, but we'll see!!


----------



## Shechemite (Oct 24, 2021)

Scots care workers protest outside Holyrood with calls for £15 per hour wage
					

Scottish Labour deputy leader Jackie Baillie voiced her support for the campaign, and attended the protest outside Holyrood with a number of her colleagues.




					www.dailyrecord.co.uk


----------



## ska invita (Oct 25, 2021)

No ordinary industrial dispute
					

DAVE CHAPPLE explains why workers at Clarks in Somerset have been driven to take strike action in the face of a devastating ‘fire and rehire’ threat




					morningstaronline.co.uk
				




"Clarks warehouse workers, who are members of the Community union, face the following threats:

• An average reduction in pay of £1.66 per hour: from the current £11.16 to £9.50

• An increase of 2.5 working hours per week, due to paid 30-minute meal breaks being abolished

• No pay rise for at least four years, despite the union agreeing to help the company through a “difficult financial spell“ by accepting two hours less per week instead of a pay rise on two different occasions and at the company’s proposal

• Drastic cuts in sick pay: from 13 weeks’ full pay to six weeks’ full pay and six weeks’ half-pay; abolition of sick pay for the first day of absence; no sick pay entitlement from day one of employment, only after six months

• The abolition of a daily 10-minute coffee break, brought in at the company’s request to ease warehouse operations

• A drastic reduction in redundancy entitlements: from enhanced double statutory, to statutory, (ie, one week’s wages per year of service), raising fears that the company will get rid of workers, even close the Street distribution centre, just as they are closing their distribution centre in Kendal

• Cuts to overtime rates to time thus giving no chance to increase pay

• No direct cuts to maternity pay or pension entitlements, but with a 15-20 per cent cut in wages, pensions will suffer a drastic fall when taken out

.... Welcome to the “brave new world” of Clarks’ new owners, Lion Rock Capital. This is a Hong Kong-based, venture capitalist, hedge-fund capitalist, slash-and-burn capitalist company."


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 25, 2021)

Striking Scunthorpe scaffolders, try saying that one three times fast:








						Striking Scunthorpe scaffolders to hold march as fair pay battle continues
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



Anyway, apparently they've been on all-out action since early October.
North East is the latest region to have threatened bus strikes, going by form it seems fairly likely they'll be called off though:








						12 days of strikes over Stagecoach North East bosses’ ‘divide-and-rule’ tactics on pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 26, 2021)

Arriva North West drivers now threatening all out indefinite action from this weekend:








						Arriva bus drivers vote for strike action as talks collapse - The Meteor
					

Bus drivers in Greater Manchester working for Arriva have voted to go out on strike, beginning on 30 October.




					themeteor.org


----------



## two sheds (Oct 28, 2021)

e-mail from Unite (Weetabix strike which was mentioned on last page)



> Dear Arthur
> 
> Unite members at Weetabix in our East Midlands region have been on strike against Fire re Hire for six weeks now please support these workers by signing our petition.
> 
> ...


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 29, 2021)

two sheds said:


> e-mail from Unite (Weetabix strike which was mentioned on last page)


I joined Unite Community at the end of last week. I was atleast expecting a confirmation e mail, but haven't received anything. Is that normal?


----------



## two sheds (Oct 29, 2021)

Can't remember, sorry. Perhaps wait another week and contact them.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 29, 2021)

two sheds said:


> Can't remember, sorry. Perhaps wait another week and contact them.


Will do. Thankyou.


----------



## two sheds (Oct 29, 2021)

Or log into the website? There's a members' section which comes up with membership number when I log in.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 29, 2021)

two sheds said:


> Or log into the website? There's a members' section which comes up with membership number when I log in.


Yeah that's a good diea.


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 31, 2021)

The very long-running Scotrail dispute has now been resolved - dunno if this might be employers caving to avoid COP26 disruption or what?




__





						ScotRail RMT pay deal
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 2, 2021)

Lots of stuff going on (or being called off) on the buses:
Arriva North West is off: Arriva North West bus strikes suspended as new pay offer on the table
Arriva Cymru due to strike over pay: Arriva Cymru’s bus drivers to strike for five weeks, after bosses’ make ‘poverty pay’ offer
Stagecoach West Scotland dispute settled: Stagecoach West Scotland workers accept pay offer bringing dispute to an end
Stagecoach Wales and North East still going ahead afaik:








						Strike action at Stagecoach Wales to proceed after ACAS talks fail
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				











						12 days of strikes over Stagecoach North East bosses’ ‘divide-and-rule’ tactics on pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Other stuff:
Tesco distribution workers balloting: Tesco risks empty shelves this winter after ‘offensive’ pay offer sparks nationwide strike ballot
Liverpool tanker drivers win a _17.5%_ pay increase: Bumper pay deal of 17.5 per cent for Liverpool tanker drivers
Weetabix strike action going up from two days a week to four: Strike days double at Weetabix Northamptonshire factories as fire and rehire taints company’s reputation
GMB strikes coming up at Serco Sandwell and four Berkshire hospitals:




__





						12 days of strike-mas: Sandwell refuse workers to walk out over festive period
					

Strikes will continure over Christmas until ‘death-trap’ tip is made safe for public




					www.gmb.org.uk
				







__





						Cleaners, porters and caterers to strike at four Berkshire hospitals
					

Facilities staff at King Edward VII, Wokingham, Upton and St Marks Hospital sites to walk out over forced changes to contracts, says GMB Union




					www.gmb-southern.org.uk
				



Scotrail dispute is settled but Caledonian Sleeper strikes are still on for now: After ScotRail deal RMT calls for Caledonian Sleeper parity


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Nov 2, 2021)

two sheds said:


> Or log into the website? There's a members' section which comes up with membership number when I log in.


I e mailed them. They got back to me and say that a membership pack is on it's way to me.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Nov 2, 2021)

The latest workplace/strike round up from the ACG :









						Workplace notes - Anarchist Communist Group
					

Arriva Cymru workers to strike for five weeks    400 bus workers in North Wales voted overwhelming in support of strike action over pay. Their union says:    “Arriva Cymru bus drivers at depots, including Amlwch, Bangor, Hawarden (Chester), Llandudno, Rhyl and Wrexham, will strike continuously...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 3, 2021)




----------



## AmateurAgitator (Nov 4, 2021)

There is the possibility of a walk out of restaurant staff at Harrods during the Christmas period:









						Low pay at luxury store – strike ballot at Harrods - Anarchist Communist Group
					

There is the possibility of strike action by restaurant staff at Harrods this Christmas. Restaurant staff are rightly demanding £12 an hour, plus commission and tips (they are currently paid £9 per hour). Harrods is owned by the Billionaire Qatari royals, who also own Canary Warf, the Shard, the...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 4, 2021)

As I understand it, this presumably only covers universities in the USS, so mostly pre-1992 ones, but the next ballot that reports tomorrow covers a larger number:








						UCU members back strikes over pension cuts
					

Members of the UCU working in UK universities have backed strike action in a ballot over cuts to pensions.




					www.ucu.org.uk


----------



## redsquirrel (Nov 5, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> As I understand it, this presumably only covers universities in the USS, so mostly pre-1992 ones, but the next ballot that reports tomorrow covers a larger number:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes that is correct. 
I am genuinely surprised never thought that the turnout would be so good. 53% turnout for a ballot that was only open 18 days is pretty good. 

Even so that fact that so many universities missed the threshold, including some large ones like Manchester, does pose problems.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 5, 2021)

redsquirrel said:


> Yes that is correct.
> I am genuinely surprised never thought that the turnout would be so good. 53% turnout for a ballot that was only open 18 days is pretty good.
> 
> Even so that fact that so many universities missed the threshold, including some large ones like Manchester, does pose problems.


By one ballot, apparently:


I suppose the question of whether it's better to run aggreggated or disaggreggated ballots (non-jargony explanation for people who are unfamiliar with this stuff: agg is when you poll all the different workplaces as one unit, so either you all get past 50% or none of you do, disagg is where you ballot each workplace separately so everywhere that gets past 50% can strike even if other places don't, which is what UCU do) is a tricky one, not always easy to call in advance?


----------



## redsquirrel (Nov 5, 2021)

The call for aggregated ballots in UCU is daft. A big part of the reason the turnout was so high was precisely because we use disaggregated ballots, aggregated ballots would lower turnout (and in fact did lower turnout the last time we used them)

a non-trivial proportion of members vote because they know that not making the threshold will lead to attacks at the local level. This is definitely why my, relatively conservative, branch has made the threshold the last couple of times. Members are afraid of the local consequences of not making the cut-off so will vote even if they spoil/vote against. 
while the union as a whole is getting better and better at running GTVO campaigns, the quality and willingness of such campaigns still varies between branches. There are branches that frankly don't really bother GTVO, they may send a few emails but there is no organised campaign. Sometimes this is down to a genuine lack of resources but in some cases it is a horrible branch exec/committee set up. Disaggregated ballots give less room for branches to hide so those branches that would do little on GTVO on an aggregated ballot have greater pressure to engage.
If the union was regularly getting 60+% turnouts then there would be a strong argument in favour of aggregated ballots but at the moment aggregated ballots would stop industrial action.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 5, 2021)

redsquirrel said:


> The call for aggregated ballots in UCU is daft. A big part of the reason the turnout was so high was precisely because we use disaggregated ballots, aggregated ballots would lower turnout (and in fact did lower turnout the last time we used them)
> 
> a non-trivial proportion of members vote because they know that not making the threshold will lead to attacks at the local level. This is definitely why my, relatively conservative, branch has made the threshold the last couple of times. Members are afraid of the local consequences of not making the cut-off so will vote even if they spoil/vote against.
> while the union as a whole is getting better and better at running GTVO campaigns, the quality and willingness of such campaigns still varies between branches. There are branches that frankly don't really bother GTVO, they may send a few emails but there is no organised campaign. Sometimes this is down to a genuine lack of resources but in some cases it is a horrible branch exec/committee set up. Disaggregated ballots give less room for branches to hide so those branches that would do little on GTVO on an aggregated ballot have greater pressure to engage.
> If the union was regularly getting 60+% turnouts then there would be a strong argument in favour of aggregated ballots but at the moment aggregated ballots would stop industrial action.


Yeah, that makes sense, fwiw my bit of Unison's recently gone from aggreggated to disagg, and as I understand it that was pushed by the left to make strike action easier. Although I think UCU's approach might differ a bit from the Unison "strategy" of "call an indicative vote, then make branches jump through a series of restrictive hoops before they can think about entering into dispute, so a fair proportion of branches get knocked out before they can even ballot in the first place."


----------



## belboid (Nov 7, 2021)

Sheffield bin strike is back on, after being postponed for a ballot on the latest offer. For four hours, anyway, tomorrow morning. 


*GMB members at Veolia Sheffield have voted to strike over pay and ongoing attacks to their terms and conditions.*

_More than 80% of the refuse collectors voted for industrial action in anger at a below inflation pay offer from Veolia – amounting to a real terms pay cut.

Strike action - which could affect more than 200,000 homes  - will now take place on Monday November 1 from 06:30am until 10:30am, with further days planned for November and beyond._

*Lee Parkinson, GMB Organiser, said*_:

“GMB members working at Veolia have taken huge risks working all throughout the pandemic to help keep Sheffield moving – dealing with record amounts of waste as people work from home. 

“It’s time to value them properly for the work they do.

"Politicians lining up to thank them won’t cut it; nor will a pay offer that amounts to a real terms pay cut.

"All they want is fair offer that at least keeps pace with their increasing cost of living and is not paid for with cuts to other terms and conditions.

“What they’ve been offered is an insult.”_


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 8, 2021)

Strike fund for facebook cleaners:








						Support the outsourced Facebook Cleaners
					

Outsourced cleaners at Facebook London are being overworked till they're sick & exhausted – support their campaign to be brought in house




					www.crowdfunder.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 9, 2021)

belboid said:


> Sheffield bin strike is back on, after being postponed for a ballot on the latest offer. For four hours, anyway, tomorrow morning.


Good to see Sheffield couriers supporting the bin workers:


Didn't realise they were due to strike soon, their strike fund is here:


			https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/sheffield-justeat-riders-are-going-on-strike-pay-rise-not-pay-cut


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 9, 2021)

Couriers striking in Hackney tomorrow as well:


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 9, 2021)

Decent article on the Arriva Northwest dispute from Liverpool anarchos:








						Who’s in the Driving Seat?
					

Featured in Issue XVII – November 2021 Arriva bus drivers voted to take indefinite strike action from October 30th, targeting Halloween. This was because they were offered a 2% pay “increase”…




					liverpoolanarchist.wordpress.com


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Nov 10, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Strike fund for facebook cleaners:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There seems to be a serious problem with that crowdfunder. You seem to only be able to donate a monthly amount. I think that's why they haven't yet raised anything.

Edit : I have just contacted CAIWU about this and let them know.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2021)

Count Cuckula said:


> There seems to be a serious problem with that crowdfunder. You seem to only be able to donate a monthly amount. I think that's why they haven't yet raised anything.
> 
> Edit : I have just contacted CAIWU about this and let them know.


Cheers for highlighting that, seems to be fixed now?


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2021)

GMB have a reasonably snazzy website for the Sheffield bin strike:








						Sheffield Veolia Strike
					

This is the strike hub for the Sheffield Veolia dispute. We want to #EndRubbishPay and see refuse workers in the city given a proper above inflation pay rise.



					sheffieldstrike.gmbyorkshire.org.uk
				



Although I'm still not sure what's actually happening for it beyond that four-hour action?


----------



## belboid (Nov 10, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> GMB have a reasonably snazzy website for the Sheffield bin strike:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


A vote on the picket line was for all our action from the 22nd.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2021)

belboid said:


> A vote on the picket line was for all our action from the 22nd.


Oh yeah, just seen this:




__





						Bin workers in Sheffield vote to strike permanently
					

Refuse collectors in the Steel City will be on strike all day, every day until this dispute is resolved




					www.gmb.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2021)

ska invita said:


> No ordinary industrial dispute
> 
> 
> DAVE CHAPPLE explains why workers at Clarks in Somerset have been driven to take strike action in the face of a devastating ‘fire and rehire’ threat
> ...


If we have any Somerset-based posters, there's a demo in support of the Clarks' strikers in Street this weekend:



Also a rally for striking Redbrige NEU members happening in London on Monday:


----------



## William of Walworth (Nov 12, 2021)

And in less good news, the evil Tories' ultra-Thatcherite, hugely union-busting rules (brought in no later than the 1980's!) have stopped PCS's most recent ballot at the DVLA from taking effect


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 14, 2021)

Security guards at GOSH due to go out in early December, following on from a win for a similar dispute among cleaners:








						Security guards at Great Ormond Street Hospital to hold a strike rally in dispute for equal rights
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 16, 2021)

A deal of some sort at Barnoldswick:








						Future of Rolls-Royce plant at Barnoldswick finally secured after long campaign
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 16, 2021)

Crossposting from the unis thread, UCU will be striking the first three days in December:








						Universities to be hit with three days of strikes in December
					

58 universities will be hit with three days of strike action from Wednesday 1 December to Friday 3 December.




					ucu.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 16, 2021)

Oh, Sheffield bin strikes now suspended:








						Sheffield bin strikes suspended after new pay offer
					

GMB Members will now vote on whether to accept new deal




					www.gmb.org.uk
				




Also, Kent and Sussex bus drivers win genuinely decent-sounding pay offers, 5.7-6.5%:








						Kent and Sussex bus strikes off as Stagecoach tables new pay offers
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## William of Walworth (Nov 16, 2021)

William of Walworth said:


> And in less good news, the evil Tories' ultra-Thatcherite, hugely union-busting rules (brought in no later than the 1980's!) have stopped PCS's most recent ballot at the DVLA from taking effect


 Forgot to add this PCS link to the above post last Friday  -=- beer was undoubtedly involved ....


----------



## YouSir (Nov 16, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Crossposting from the unis thread, UCU will be striking the first three days in December:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Goldsmiths are going a lot longer, 21 days apparently.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 16, 2021)

YouSir said:


> Goldsmiths are going a lot longer, 21 days apparently.


Oh yeah: 








						Goldsmiths local UCU strike, Nov 23rd – Dec 13th 2021 | Goldsmiths University and College Union
					

Goldsmiths Senior Management Team (SMT) is planning mass staff redundancies across departments this term, as part of a wider scheme of redundancies to be rolled out over two years. Management has info




					goldsmithsucu.org
				



Sounds like that's a local thing around redundancies.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 18, 2021)

Looked at the Goldsmiths thing again, and seen that there's 20 academic and 32 non-academic jobs threatened - does anyone know if this is a case where the affected professional services staff are members of UCU, or is it just that they're members of a union that is doing fuck all?


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 18, 2021)

Good news from the UVW:








						Victory for pandemic heroes as billionaire trustees capitulate at Sage Nursing Home
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 22, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Oh yeah:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Bit more on that:


----------



## Skim (Nov 22, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Oh yeah:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Not just redundancies, but the planned centralisation of administrative services (which have already suffered cuts, to the detriment of staff and students alike), as well as the warden’s ‘recovery plan’, agreed between senior management and its banking partners.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 22, 2021)

Skim said:


> Not just redundancies, but the planned centralisation of administrative services (which have already suffered cuts, to the detriment of staff and students alike), as well as the warden’s ‘recovery plan’, agreed between senior management and its banking partners.


Are the admin staff also in UCU, or is this a case where the admin staff's union is, um, not doing a very good job? Or am I being unfair?


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 22, 2021)

Respect to Tribune for pretty consistently publishing stuff on industrial disputes written by actual affected workers:








						The Night Tube Is Nothing Without Its Workers
					

Rail workers want the Night Tube back as much as any other London residents – but not at the expense of the safety and work-life balance agreed by management when the service first opened.




					tribunemag.co.uk
				






> Rosters have now been published for the two lines on which Night Tube is scheduled to restart on 26 November. The results are predictably bad. One example which sticks in the craw are the ‘Saturday night’ shifts which actually finish at 7:30 am on a Sunday. The company counts this Sunday as a rest day, even though you have worked for 7.5 hours of it. Drivers are of course not convinced that they will be able to work nearly a third of their Sunday, enjoy this ‘rest day’ with their family, and still get sufficient rest before their Monday daytime shift. When the company tells drivers that Sunday is their day off, it seems like they are encouraging drivers to burn the candle at both ends, leaving them insufficiently rested before returning to work.
> 
> Rest between shifts matters. Insufficient rest periods lead to fatigue, fatigue leads to accidents, and railway accidents are deadly. A fatigued driver will have longer reaction times and a reduced ability to process information. Tiredness leads to memory lapses, reduced attention, and underestimation of risks.
> 
> These dangers mean that London Underground agreed with the unions in 2016 to never allow full-time drivers to work Night Tube shifts. They have reneged on this deal. The RMT has repeatedly asked for a comprehensive risk assessment of the new rosters. London Underground has refused.


A "day off" where you're working till 7:30 in the morning, fucking hell.


----------



## Skim (Nov 23, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Are the admin staff also in UCU, or is this a case where the admin staff's union is, um, not doing a very good job? Or am I being unfair?


I don’t know if all admin staff are UCU members; some will be, some not. 

Management’s plan to ‘evolve’ the university through cuts and centralisation of services, plus its secretive deals with banks, has been presented as a done deal and has disastrous consequences for teaching and research. Staff are at breaking point and have been for some time. Seventy per cent turned out for the strike and 86% voted to strike. UCU could hardly be described as a union that’s “doing fuck all”.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 23, 2021)

Skim said:


> I don’t know if all admin staff are UCU members; some will be, some not.
> 
> Management’s plan to ‘evolve’ the university through cuts and centralisation of services, plus its secretive deals with banks, has been presented as a done deal and has disastrous consequences for teaching and research. Staff are at breaking point and have been for some time. Seventy per cent turned out for the strike and 86% voted to strike. UCU could hardly be described as a union that’s “doing fuck all”.


Oh yeah, I absolutely was not trying to diss UCU there - I was just a bit worried/grumpy because I would normally expect the main union for admin staff to be Unison, and I'm not really clear on what if anything the local Unison branch are doing. I suppose they could have run a strike ballot and lost/failed to get over 50%, in which case their hands would be tied legally, but at the same time, if you can't get to 50% over an issue that's so deeply felt and important that 70% of your immediate colleagues are voting on it, then it does seem like something's gone a bit wrong.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 23, 2021)

Various other things:
Stuart/JustEat couriers organised through IWGB in Sheffield to strike over pay on December 6th, public protest in Sheffield on November 28th:








						Sheffield JustEat couriers set to strike protest against “shocking” pay cut
					

Food delivery couriers working for Stuart to rally outside Sheffield Town Hall at 12 noon on 28 November in advance of an upcoming strike over 25% pay cuts.




					iwgb.org.uk
				



https://actionnetwork.org/fundraisi...ders-are-going-on-strike-pay-rise-not-pay-cut 


TSSA balloting on Avanti West Coast:








						Avanti Industrial Action Ballot - Vote Yes! | TSSA
					

TSSA is in dispute with Avanti West Coast as a result of a severe breakdown in relations and we are now balloting for strike action and action short of a strike.




					www.tssa.org.uk
				




Wincanton/Morrisons lorry drivers are not going on strike, because they're getting a pay rise of 18%-24.4%:








						Wincanton lorry drivers on Morrisons contract secure huge pay increase
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Sheffield bin dispute now settled:





						Sheffield bin strike cancelled as workers accept better deal
					

GMB Union members at Veolia stood together in an act of solidarity to achieve pay justice




					www.gmb.org.uk
				




RMT and other London transport unions holding a "save London transport" demo on December 1st:








						Save London's Transport demonstration
					

Transport Union RMT will be protesting outside Parliament alongside other trade unions in a ‘Save London’s Transport’ demonstration opposing attack on pensions, the imposition of pay freezes and threats to services and jobs, imposed as part of the government’s conditions for bailout out...



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 24, 2021)

Two upcoming protests/rallies in support of ongoing UVW disputes:
Great Ormond Street, Dec 7th:









						[Tuesday 7 December 2021, 12:30pm] Rally: Support GOSH security guards’ strike for equality!
					

The workers voted unanimously to strike and are demanding full NHS benefits including basic things like sick pay, annual leave, overtime pay. Join the rally on 7 December.



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				




Harrods, Dec 18th:









						[Saturday 18 December, 1pm] Harrods restaurant workers pre-strike PROTEST
					

Harrods pays its restaurant workers poverty wages, often over 20% below even the London Living Wage of £11.05 per hour which itself is not a huge wage. The waiters and chefs at Harrods have had enough and are now demanding £12 an hour.



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 24, 2021)

IWGB do make quite good publicity stuff:


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 1, 2021)

UVW asking people to send emails in support of the GOSH security guards here:








						WRITE A LETTER TO GOSH TRUSTEES
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 1, 2021)

Goldsmiths strike fundraiser raffle and online poetry thing:








						Goldstrike Poetry Night & Raffle
					

Raising funds to support striking workers at Goldsmiths #goldstrike More info about industrial action at Goldsmiths: https://goldsmithsucu.




					www.eventbrite.com
				




Also, Unison finally due to start balloting soon at 37 unis:








						Higher Education pay ballot - Vote YES to strike for the pay you deserve
					

It is no surprise that a majority of members have decided that a 1.5% pay rise – for the majority of staff – simply isn’t good enough.We can’t wait any longer, 1.5% isn’t going to cut it and we need to let them know now by standing together.




					www.unison.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 1, 2021)

ska invita said:


> No ordinary industrial dispute
> 
> 
> DAVE CHAPPLE explains why workers at Clarks in Somerset have been driven to take strike action in the face of a devastating ‘fire and rehire’ threat
> ...


Community are claiming victory:








						Fire-and-rehire defeated at Clarks
					

An agreement has been reached between the trade union Community and the shoe manufacturer Clarks, ending the industrial action that has taken place over the last two months. The agreement sees the pay…




					community-tu.org


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 4, 2021)

For what it's worth, Unite are asking people to sign a petition in support of the striking Scunthorpe scaffolders here:








						Megaphone UK
					

SUPPORTING UNIONS TO WIN Supporting workers and their union with digital campaigns. Megaphone UK is a project of the TUC, in collaboration with our 48 member unions and the nearly 5.5 million...




					www.megaphone.org.uk
				




The social media pages for the dispute are:


			https://twitter.com/UnitedScaffs
		







						Log in or sign up to view
					

See posts, photos and more on Facebook.




					www.facebook.com
				




Also, RMT will be holding demonstrations against cuts to station staffing across the North East on Monday 6th (Berwick), Monday 13th (Newcastle and Durham), and Wednesday 15th (Darlington and York):








						Staff our Stations action across the North East
					

Rail Union RMT is stepping up its Staff our Stations campaign across the North East, with a number of demonstrations at key stations commencing on Monday 6th December at Berwick-upon-Tweed station, followed by Newcastle Central and Durham on the 13th December and Darlington and York on the 15th...



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## aqua (Dec 4, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Oh yeah, I absolutely was not trying to diss UCU there - I was just a bit worried/grumpy because I would normally expect the main union for admin staff to be Unison, and I'm not really clear on what if anything the local Unison branch are doing. I suppose they could have run a strike ballot and lost/failed to get over 50%, in which case their hands would be tied legally, but at the same time, if you can't get to 50% over an issue that's so deeply felt and important that 70% of your immediate colleagues are voting on it, then it does seem like something's gone a bit wrong.


Professional services staff are in ucu after a certain pay scale, and under that cut off would be in unison. But a lot have left because ucu often seem to forget we exist. 
So the professional services redundancies will be split across the two unions.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 4, 2021)

Just wish I could see more about what Unison are doing in response, because at the moment it does seem like the resistance to the redundancies is coming very disproprotionately from one of the unions. 😕


----------



## aqua (Dec 4, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Just wish I could see more about what Unison are doing in response, because at the moment it does seem like the resistance to the redundancies is coming very disproprotionately from one of the unions. 😕


If they're like at my place they're not doing a lot...


----------



## ska invita (Dec 5, 2021)

Anyone have an update on the night tube dispute?


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 5, 2021)

This is the latest RMT press release, doesn't really say much though:








						Night Tube action rock solid
					

TUBE UNION RMT said that strike action in a fight to stop the ripping up of Night Tube agreements and working arrangements that would wreck the work life balance of drivers, is rock solid again tonight .



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## ska invita (Dec 6, 2021)

Tesco: Distribution centre workers plan pre-Christmas strikes
					

Up to 1,200 workers across four sites will stage walkouts over pay, according to the Unite union.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




*Up to 1,200 workers at Tesco distribution centres across the UK are set to strike in the run-up to Christmas, the Unite union says.*
The workers, including warehouse staff and HGV drivers, are based at sites in Antrim, Belfast, Didcot and Doncaster.
It comes after the supermarket offered a 4% pay rise which Unite said amounted to a "real terms pay cut" due to inflation. 

.....

Unite said the pay rise offered by the firm was "well below" the current retail price index rate of inflation which is 6%.


----------



## moochedit (Dec 6, 2021)

Possible bin strike in Coventry. Vote result due today.

Coventry Live: Strike talk in crunch meetings to save Christmas bin collections.








						Strike talk in crunch meetings to save Christmas bin collections
					

Unite members have opened a ballot over potential industrial action which would see bin lorry drivers in Coventry strike over pay and working arrangements




					www.coventrytelegraph.net


----------



## Serene (Dec 6, 2021)

Tesco warehouse workers in Northern Ireland to go on strike ahead of Christmas

Quote * Unite members at the Antrim and Belfast Tesco distribution centres will launch an all-out, continuous strike from 7am on December 16. *
I was wondering what a continous strike is exactly. Anyone know?


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 6, 2021)

Serene said:


> Tesco warehouse workers in Northern Ireland to go on strike ahead of Christmas
> 
> Quote * Unite members at the Antrim and Belfast Tesco distribution centres will launch an all-out, continuous strike from 7am on December 16. *
> I was wondering what a continous strike is exactly. Anyone know?


Staying out until it's won, I think? In contrast to the type of strike you get more often nowadays, where they announce that they're going out for a specific number of days and then go back to work regardless of the result. Although I'd think of an "all-out" strike as meaning the same thing, so not sure if they've done a tautology there or what.


----------



## Serene (Dec 6, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Staying out until it's won, I think? In contrast to the type of strike you get more often nowadays, where they announce that they're going out for a specific number of days and then go back to work regardless of the result. Although I'd think of an "all-out" strike as meaning the same thing, so not sure if they've done a tautology there or what.


Thanks for the reply. I really hope so because this sort of thing is long long overdue.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 7, 2021)

TFL wanting to get rid of 600 staff, this sounds like it's going to be fucking big:








						RMT to ballot all London Transport members
					

LONDON TRANSPORT UNION RMT confirmed today that it will begin a ballot of over10,000 members across all grades after TFL refused to give assurances on jobs, pensions and working conditions in the midst of an on-going financial crisis driven by central Government.



					www.rmt.org.uk
				




Also, respect to the Sheffield couriers - this can't be great weather to be picketing in:


----------



## moochedit (Dec 8, 2021)

Cov bin lorry drivers voted to strike 98%









						Bin strikes set to cause 'huge disruption' in Coventry over Christmas
					

Coventry City Council said it was "disappointed" by the decision for bin lorry drivers to take strike action




					www.coventrytelegraph.net


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Dec 8, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> TFL wanting to get rid of 600 staff, this sounds like it's going to be fucking big:



that's just underground station staff, from what i read yesterday.

think it's going to get bigger...


----------



## Serene (Dec 10, 2021)

Employers really are taking the píss out of us. Unions need to start doing something.


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 10, 2021)

Ahem... actually, workers need to start doing something.


----------



## Serene (Dec 10, 2021)

Serge Forward said:


> Ahem... actually, workers need to start doing something.


Totally agreed. Dont know how to though.


----------



## Serene (Dec 10, 2021)

Are there any Union Members that know the situation on self-isolation at work? Does it still stand and does work have to pay you while you self isolate? Also is it still 14 days?


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 10, 2021)

Sick pay policies will vary from place to place and if you're counted as self-employed you're probably in trouble, but otherwise then probably yes.
Solfed have some stuff worth a look:





						Coronavirus: Information for workers – Liverpool Solidarity Federation
					






					liverpoolsf.org
				








						Your rights at work during the coronavirus pandemic – Liverpool Solidarity Federation
					






					liverpoolsf.org
				




Anyway, was coming here to post about the IWGB couriers strike in Sheffield, still going strong five days in:


Strike fund is here: 


			https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/sheffield-justeat-riders-are-going-on-strike-pay-rise-not-pay-cut


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 11, 2021)

This would be pretty big if it happens:








						Unions plan for national rail strike as job cuts loom
					

‘Attacks on pay and pensions’ also expected after Department for Transport tells industry to find savings of 10%




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## ska invita (Dec 13, 2021)

"The Trades Union Congress (TUC) has warned that pay is lagging behind inflation, creating a cost of living storm.
It estimates that in the final quarter of this year, pay growth (+0.8%) will rise at just half the speed of inflation (+1.6%).
*That means the largest fall in real wages since 2012 and the second worse since comparable records began 2000."*


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 13, 2021)

Facebook cleaners are going out:





						Facebook cleaners vote to strike | CAIWU
					






					caiwu.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 13, 2021)

Strike averted as workers celebrate huge 25% pay rise at Harrods
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				




Poor Harrods owners, not being able to pay their staff £9 an hour anymore.


----------



## Shechemite (Dec 13, 2021)

Cheers for all the updates hitmouse


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 13, 2021)

Ah you beat me to it Hitmouse. But yeah, nice one.


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 13, 2021)

Yeah, kudos to hitmouse


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 14, 2021)

Respect to the Stuart couriers, still going strong:










						Sunderland Just Eat delivery drivers stage protest in pay dispute after minimum journey fee cut
					

Just East delivery drivers in Sunderland staged a protest in a dispute over pay.




					www.sunderlandecho.com
				




Strike fund is here:


			https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/sheffield-justeat-riders-are-going-on-strike-pay-rise-not-pay-cut
		


Think the IWGB are also asking for people to help with phonebanking to help spread the strike, so contact them if you feel able to help out with that.


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 15, 2021)

Front of house and drivers at Luton Airport to strike 19-23 December:
Unite members announce pre-Christmas strike at Luton Airport


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 17, 2021)

IWGB couriers are doing proper amazing stuff at the moment:



Again, strike fund is here:


			https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/strike-hardship-fund-iwgb-couriers-logistics-branch
		


Also, RMT demo at Kings Cross next week:








						LNER ticket office cuts demo at Kings Cross
					

Rail Union RMT is continuing its campaign against proposed cuts to LNER ticket office hours next week, with a demonstration outside London King’s Cross station on Tuesday 21stDecember, from 0800 – 0930am. This demo follows successful action at affected stations across the North East.



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 20, 2021)

Reminder that the RMT demo is tomorrow morning: 








						LNER ticket office cuts demo at Kings Cross
					

Rail Union RMT is continuing its campaign against proposed cuts to LNER ticket office hours next week, with a demonstration outside London King’s Cross station on Tuesday 21stDecember, from 0800 – 0930am. This demo follows successful action at affected stations across the North East.



					www.rmt.org.uk
				




Also, various disputes, mostly in the north west:
Manchester pallet workers starting an all-out strike:








						Chep workers in Manchester to extend strikes as pallet shortage deepens
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				






At the Queens Road bus depot in Manchester, site of the big strike earlier this year, the first woman driver at the depot has just been sacked after 34 years for being "too short":








						Bus driver sacked for being 'too short' loses appeal
					

Tracey is launching another appeal as Go North West refuse to give her just one extra hour a day to make up her wages




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk
				












						Support the 1st female Bus Driver at Queens Road - She deserves better!
					

Tracey Scholes has been a bus driver at the Queens Road depot for the past 34 years. When Tracey started her journey as a bus driver in 1987 she was the first female bus driver employed at the Queens Road depot.   The industry back then was very male dominated and a woman taking a driving...




					www.megaphone.org.uk
				




East Lancashire NHS scientists starting a new 12-week strike in their pay dispute:








						East Lancashire NHS Trust intransigence forces new period of strike action by biomedical scientists.
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




The striking Scunthorpe scaffolders are still going strong:





						Log in or sign up to view
					

See posts, photos and more on Facebook.




					www.facebook.com
				



Have a petition here:








						Megaphone UK
					

SUPPORTING UNIONS TO WIN Supporting workers and their union with digital campaigns. Megaphone UK is a project of the TUC, in collaboration with our 48 member unions and the nearly 5.5 million...




					www.megaphone.org.uk
				



And will be handing it in to the company's office in Wakefield on Wednesday morning:








						#PayTheRate: Petition hand-in at Actavo HQ
					

Striking scaffolders are demanding to be paid the rate for the job.   Their employer Actavo currently pays between 10 and 15 per cent below the NAECI rates.  Join Unite as we hand in our 14,000 strong petition to management.




					www.megaphone.org.uk
				




JustEat/Stuart strike is still continuing two weeks in, and has now spread to Chesterfield:


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 21, 2021)

New security guard strike scheduled for January at GOSH:








						Security guards at Great Ormond Street Hospital to strike for six weeks in January
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				











						Security guards at GOSH are fighting for equality
					

Security guards at Great Ormond Street Hospital (GOSH) are denied the same annual leave, sick leave, and career progression as other NHS workers.



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				




Missed that there was an occupation of JustEat HQ yesterday as well:








						Activists ‘occupy’ Just Eat HQ in solidarity with striking Stuart couriers
					

A group of activists from across the UK stood in the firm’s lobby with signs demanding a ‘pay rise, not a pay cut’ for striking Stuart drivers




					www.nationalworld.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 4, 2022)

Spose this could also go in the good news thread, but:








						Ten Times Workers Beat the Bosses in 2021
					

As 2021 draws to a close, Tribune looks back at ten of the landmark industrial victories of the year – from bin workers and bus drivers to care homes, railways and car manufacturers.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 5, 2022)

Not technically a strike, but related enough:








						Support the 1st female Bus Driver at Queens Road - She deserves better!
					

Tracey Scholes has been a bus driver at the Queens Road depot for the past 34 years. When Tracey started her journey as a bus driver in 1987 she was the first female bus driver employed at the Queens Road depot.   The industry back then was very male dominated and a woman taking a driving...




					www.megaphone.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 6, 2022)

RMT night tube latest:








						Further Night Tube strike action
					

TUBE UNION RMT today confirmed strike action goes ahead every weekend on the Night Tube from tomorrow through to June in an on-going fight to prevent the ripping up of staffing arrangements that would wreck the work life balance of drivers.



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 6, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Not technically a strike, but related enough:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There's now a fb page in support of Tracey Scholes:








						Say NO to Go North West - Back Tracey Scholes
					

We are supporting Tracey Scholes in her fight against Go North West's attempt to dismiss her after... Manchester




					www.facebook.com
				



And on twitter:


			https://twitter.com/backtraceys
		

Her final hearing is on Tuesday 11th and there's a rally thing in support then:


Also, upcoming events in support of the Chep pallet strike are an online meeting on the 12th:

And a rally at the picket line on the morning of the 14th:


----------



## moochedit (Jan 7, 2022)

BBC News - More Coventry bin strikes announced by union









						More Coventry bin strikes announced by union
					

The increasingly bitter dispute centres on pay received by bin lorry drivers in Coventry.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 7, 2022)

GOSH security guards strike fund is here:








						Support GOSH security guards' strike for equality!
					

Raise money for the strike fund of security guards in their battle for fair and equal working conditions at Great Ormond Street Hospital!




					www.crowdfunder.co.uk
				




(crowdfunder proper taking the piss there, if you go to donate it asks you if you want to leave an optional tip for them and sets the standard amounts as 10%, 20%, and 30%, cheeky fuckers)


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 10, 2022)

More tube strikes:




__





						New wave of Tube strike action
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 10, 2022)

And on the buses:








						First Manchester bus drivers to begin strike action next week
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Interesting that they give the location of the picket line, which I didn't think of something union press releases normally do, might be a sign of Unite shifting to try and promote more active support for disputes?


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 10, 2022)

JustEat strike is back on after management tried to hold a secret scabs-only meeting that went badly:








						UK's longest gig economy pay strike resumes in Sheffield this week after Stuart’s secret pay talks exposed
					

After working throughout the pandemic these key workers are demanding a pay rise instead of a pay cut and an end to unlimited unpaid waiting times.




					iwgb.org.uk
				











						A courier drivers' union protested outside 'secret' pay talks in Sheffield - this is why
					

A strike by delivery drivers over pay descended into farce when union members turned up to ’secret talks’ in Sheffield - and they were promptly cancelled.




					www.thestar.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 11, 2022)

Email tool to email Stuart bosses:








						Stuart Delivery, JustEat: END THE STRIKE, PAY RISE NOW!
					

Delivery drivers working for Stuart Delivery (a subcontractor of JustEat, owned by DPD) are in the midst of the longest gig economy strike ever in the UK! They need our support to win.  They're essential workers in the pandemic, delivering essential supplies to many who are isolating or...



					actionnetwork.org
				



Google form to sign up and get involved in supporting the strike:








						YOUR SOLIDARITY IS NEEDED! Support the JustEat strike...
					

Please enter your details if you're up for supporting the strikes in some way!




					docs.google.com
				



And the strike fund again is:


			https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/sheffield-justeat-riders-are-going-on-strike-pay-rise-not-pay-cut


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 13, 2022)

Scunthorpe scaffolders have reballoted and have an extended mandate for action:

Full respect for them, I am very aware that trying to run a postal ballot at a time when there's barely any post being delivered cos all the posties are self-isolating can be a somewhat stressful experience.

Also, new campaign in support of the strike set up among Celtic supporters - do we still have any active ones on here?




			https://twitter.com/celtic_scaff


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 13, 2022)

Update from Goldsmiths:








						Goldsmiths hit with international boycott
					

UCU has censured Goldsmiths with the ultimate sanction of a global academic boycott over the university's sacking of up to 46 staff.




					www.ucu.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 14, 2022)

Scunny scaffolders dispute to escalate:








						Actavo and British steel face an escalation of industrial action in 2022
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 14, 2022)

New article on the JustEat strike:








						Inside the UK’s longest gig-economy strike in history
					

In Sheffield, food delivery drivers have organised to fight back against one of the giants of the gig economy. After a short break for Christmas, they were back on the picket lines earlier this week.




					www.huckmag.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 15, 2022)

From a UVW email about the Great Ormond Street strike:


> Here are some *KEY DATES* for you:
> 
> *Wednesday 19 January & Thursday 20 January, 10.00am onwards*
> 
> ...




Oops, didn't expect those emojis to become giant.


----------



## moochedit (Jan 17, 2022)

moochedit said:


> BBC News - More Coventry bin strikes announced by union
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Apparently they are escalating the bin strike to the whole of feb and march now.

Edit - link:









						Coventry bin strikes stepped up to 'all-out strike' as council fails to make an offer to meet union demands for a decent pay rise.
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 17, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> There's now a fb page in support of Tracey Scholes:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Happy ending to this one:








						Rochdale bus driver reinstated after height issue resolved
					

Tracey Scholes, who is 5ft, lost her job after a bus mirror redesign left her with a "blind spot".



					www.bbc.co.uk
				



The way they were behaving in the first place utterly took the piss, of course, but glad it's sorted now.
Also, more info on the upcoming protests for the Actavo strike:








						#PayTheRate Actavo
					

We call on Actavo CEO Brian Kelly to respect national agreements & pay his scaffolders the agreed job rate. Support the strike




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



They'll now be happening in Dublin, Livingstone, Brigg and Chepstow on the 22nd, if there are any Dublin, Livingstone, Brigg or Chepstow urbs who are free then?


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 18, 2022)

GOSH security guards strike postponed after management promise improvements:


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 19, 2022)

Eastbourne bin strike: Union accepts deal to bring strikes to an end
					

Workers will receive an increase between 5% and 15% depending on their current salary.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				






> Eastbourne Borough Council said drivers would receive a pay increase of between 5% and 15% depending on their existing salary.
> The GMB Union described the deal as a "massive win for GMB members"...
> The GMB added that the deal included a minimum 11% pay increase this year.


Also, Hackney Deliveroo stuff:


----------



## Ground Elder (Jan 19, 2022)

Appreciate you keeping this thread updated hitmouse


----------



## Chilli.s (Jan 19, 2022)

Ground Elder said:


> Appreciate you keeping this thread updated hitmouse


Yeah, me too, thank you


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 20, 2022)

Updates from the JustEat/Stuart strike:
The mackems are getting involved now:

Also, demo/strike rally in Sheffield on Sunday:


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 21, 2022)

Scotland’s Bar Workers Are Fighting for Better
					

Workers at Macmerry bars in Glasgow and Dundee faced years of underpayment, unsafe conditions and impossible hours – but then they joined a trade union, and the tide in the workplace began to change.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 24, 2022)

Going into 8 solid weeks of picketing at CHEP in Trafford, respect:


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 24, 2022)

Update from the JustEat/Stuart strike: Sheffield drivers have voted to start picketing Greggs.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 26, 2022)

UCU latest, no specific dates yet:








						Universities will see strike action next month unless employers meet pension and pay demands
					

UCU has warned employers that university campuses will see further strike action in February unless its demands over pensions and pay & conditions are met.




					www.ucu.org.uk
				



Unison HE pay ballot closes this week, should be an announcement some time next week if there's any action coming out of it but I'm not optimistic about that one.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 26, 2022)

Oh, and new Reel News video on the scunny scaffs:


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 26, 2022)

Lots going on in London hospitals - GOSH strike rescheduled, outsourced Serco staff at three other hospitals also going out in a separate dispute:








						Serco outsourced workers at Barts to take all-out strike action for first two weeks in February in battle against low pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 27, 2022)




----------



## moochedit (Jan 27, 2022)

moochedit said:


> Apparently they are escalating the bin strike to the whole of feb and march now.
> 
> Edit - link:
> 
> ...



Coventry council (labour controlled) now saying they will use scab labour to cover the bin strike. (I didn't think that was legal but i may be wrong/out of date?).....









						Council launches new plan to collect city’s waste – Coventry City Council
					

Coventry City Council is set to bring in a private contractor to help collect waste over the coming weeks as strike action by bin lorry drivers continues.




					www.coventry.gov.uk
				




Unite response...(they say it's illegal)









						Agency worker recruitment by Coventry council exposed in bin dispute
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 28, 2022)

Quick crosspost from the UCU thread:









						Over a million students at 68 universities to be impacted by up to 10 days of campus walkouts starting in February
					

University staff are set to walk out for up to 10 days of strike action in two disputes over pensions and pay & working conditions.




					www.ucu.org.uk
				




Would be curious what UCU types think of the strategy here?


> In total 68 UK universities will be hit with strike action in February.
> 
> The full strike dates, with numbers of institutions involved, are:
> 
> ...



Unison HE ballot has just closed, so we should know by some time next week how many, if any, Unison branches have made it past the threshold and what possibilities there are for co-ordinated action.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 28, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Unison HE ballot has just closed, so we should know by some time next week how many, if any, Unison branches have made it past the threshold and what possibilities there are for co-ordinated action.


Based on a huge phone banking effort by members of the branch committee and reps (plus I sent a handful of emails  ), going off of self-reporting we're quietly hopeful we got over the line.

How that translates in terms of the actual result, of course...


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 28, 2022)

A lot of members reporting they hadn't received their ballot paper though, which is obviously a concern. One member finally received theirs this morning, an hour and a half after the deadline 

(I think it's ok to share this as it's not really identifying anyone, but rarely totally certain so, uh... yeah, if this isn't cool, please someone say and I'll erase it from existence   )


----------



## locomotive (Jan 28, 2022)

Teachers set to strike over 'unacceptable workload'
					

Those striking have “simply had enough and want sustained change”




					www.bristol247.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 28, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> A lot of members reporting they hadn't received their ballot paper though, which is obviously a concern. One member finally received theirs this morning, an hour and a half after the deadline


Yeah, I was going to say I dunno how things have been round your way, but we've definitely had pretty massive disruption to the post over the last few months round here, which has not made things any easier.


----------



## Dogsauce (Jan 28, 2022)

locomotive said:


> Teachers set to strike over 'unacceptable workload'
> 
> 
> Those striking have “simply had enough and want sustained change”
> ...


My niece/nephew went to Gordano and they had a new head a few years ago who was on one of those back to the 50s trips with more discipline and tradition, hence the fucking Harry Potter uniforms rather than bog standard school jumpers that did fine for years. Not surprised they’re striking, suspect staff put up with a lot of shit.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 31, 2022)

Watch as angry delivery drivers blockade McDonald's drive-through over Just Eat pay dispute
					

This is the moment angry Just Eat delivery drivers blockaded a McDonald’s drive-through in Sheffield as a pay dispute escalated.




					www.thestar.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 1, 2022)

Email tool in support of the scaffolders:








						Megaphone UK
					

SUPPORTING UNIONS TO WIN Supporting workers and their union with digital campaigns. Megaphone UK is a project of the TUC, in collaboration with our 48 member unions and the nearly 5.5 million...




					www.megaphone.org.uk


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 1, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Based on a huge phone banking effort by members of the branch committee and reps (plus I sent a handful of emails  ), going off of self-reporting we're quietly hopeful we got over the line.
> 
> How that translates in terms of the actual result, of course...


Not sure whether to post here, the UCU thread or the (vaguely) UNISON one, but we are one of five in London to make it across the 50%  And a big majority for the Yes column.

Going to have a look to see if I can get a sense of the national picture.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 1, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Not sure whether to post here, the UCU thread or the (vaguely) UNISON one, but we are one of five in London to make it across the 50%  And a big majority for the Yes column.
> 
> Going to have a look to see if I can get a sense of the national picture.


Nice one, congratulations! The number I've heard is nine nationally, so getting over the line is definitely not an easy achievement!


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 1, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Nice one, congratulations! The number I've heard is nine nationally, so getting over the line is definitely not an easy achievement!


Bloody hell, really??! Caught on Twitter that Brighton and Leeds had crossed 50% too, so figured there were a good number more.

That's over half only in London!


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 1, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Bloody hell, really??! Caught on Twitter that Brighton and Leeds had crossed 50% too, so figured there were a good number more.
> 
> That's over half only in London!


That's the number I've heard but not seen formal confirmation yet. Think the Service Group Exec is meant to be meeting either tomorrow or Thursday so we should know more after then, and think there's probably still enough time to get action co-ordinated with the next round of UCU strikes.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 3, 2022)

More action coming up at Goldsmiths:








						Statement for Students about Industrial Action, Spring 2022 | Goldsmiths University and College Union
					

Statement and FAQ to students from the staff union (GUCU) about industrial action in Spring 2022: Dear students, As many of you already know, the staff union (GUCU) had a branch meeting on Monday 6 De




					goldsmithsucu.org


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 4, 2022)

IWGB JustEat strike fundraiser happening tomorrow night:


Latest video from the dispute:


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 5, 2022)

Upcoming tube strikes at the start of March:




__





						London Transport union RMT announces strike action
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 7, 2022)

UVW/GOSH stuff:








						Security Guards launch a six-week strike with a huge rally and peaceful occupation
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 7, 2022)

Good to see scaffolding firms pulling out of the British Steel job:


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 8, 2022)

Train cleaners striking on various lines in the southeast tomorrow:




__





						Rail cleaners call strike action
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 9, 2022)

Scunthorpe scaffolders stuff:









						#PayTheRate Actavo
					

We call on Actavo CEO Brian Kelly to respect national agreements & pay his scaffolders the agreed job rate. Support the strike




					www.unitetheunion.org
				





In HE news, Unison have announced what the uni branches who got over the 50% threshold will be doing, which is good, but it also seems like... they've not even properly fully co-ordinated the strike dates?








						University members to take action on pay and pensions | Article | News | UNISON National
					

Dates announced as ballots at 10 institutions pass the legal threshold for turnout




					www.unison.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 10, 2022)

RMT out on TransPennine Express these next few Sundays over pay:




__





						TransPennine Express Conductors to begin strike action this Sunday
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 10, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Scunthorpe scaffolders stuff:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



There's definitely been _some_ coordination, but I'm not clear how much and at what level.

Looks like 01/02 March might be the real "all out" days?


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 10, 2022)

Yeah, and the 2nd is the date that the NUS have called for a student strike as well so makes sense to make that one the biggest, but I still don't see why, in a national dispute, they couldn't just get all participating branches to go out on the same dates. UCU seem to be able to manage it.


----------



## moochedit (Feb 10, 2022)

moochedit said:


> Coventry council (labour controlled) now saying they will use scab labour to cover the bin strike. (I didn't think that was legal but i may be wrong/out of date?).....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The cov bin strike keeps escalating. Unite saying they will pull labour funding now. (Whether a serious threat i don't know)









						Labour facing bankruptcy as union donor Unite says it could pull remaining support
					

Sir Keir says Labour will not be ‘influenced by threats’




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 10, 2022)

Not great news:








						Great Ormond Street Hospital threatens to seek injunction to silence security guards on strike for sick pay
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 14, 2022)

Happening on Wednesday morning in London:


And in Manchester:


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 14, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Yeah, and the 2nd is the date that the NUS have called for a student strike as well so makes sense to make that one the biggest, but I still don't see why, in a national dispute, they couldn't just get all participating branches to go out on the same dates. UCU seem to be able to manage it.


Maybe because the vote was disaggregated?

I know our many on our committee were concerned about asking our members, many of whom are obviously on the lower grades, to go out for a full five days.

It certainly does seem like it's not always super easy to co-ordinate across branches/regions in UNISON, though again locally I think we're lucky in that respect, so maybe a bit more gets done/planned.


----------



## killer b (Feb 14, 2022)

Not sure if this is the best thread for this, but has everyone seen the CWU valentines advert? It's brilliant.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 14, 2022)

Yeah, whoever the CWU have in charge of their branding/advertising side of things is definitely very good at it - posted this elsewhere but I still think their cheeky Sports Direct knock-off mugs are inspired:




__





						Direct Action Pint Mug  | CWU Merchandise Store
					

Direct Action Campaign Pint Mug. £2 from every sale goes towards Direct Action funds.




					www.cwu-shop.org


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 14, 2022)

Scaffolders still keeping the pressure up:


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 15, 2022)

From Strike Map:








						Tell us your thoughts
					

Strike MapUK are proposing a reps and stewards summit to discuss strategy, tactics and learn from those taking strike action. Tell them what you think about their joint proposal with @NurseSayNO using this form.



					actionnetwork.org
				




Alongside NHS Workers Say NO! we are jointly proposing a reps and stewards summit to discuss strategy, tactics and learn from those taking strike action.


----------



## William of Walworth (Feb 16, 2022)

Belated thanks from me as well, hitmouse , for all these updates .... 

(I'd been guilty of neglecting this thread for a while  )


----------



## Serge Forward (Feb 16, 2022)

JustEat strike spreads to Leicester ✊


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 16, 2022)

Skim said:


> I don’t know if all admin staff are UCU members; some will be, some not.
> 
> Management’s plan to ‘evolve’ the university through cuts and centralisation of services, plus its secretive deals with banks, has been presented as a done deal and has disastrous consequences for teaching and research. Staff are at breaking point and have been for some time. Seventy per cent turned out for the strike and 86% voted to strike. UCU could hardly be described as a union that’s “doing fuck all”.


Well, it's been a few months, but Unison have now got around to also striking at Goldsmiths:




__





						Confirmation of Ballot Result / Strike Dates | UNISON Goldsmiths
					





					unisongoldsmiths.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 16, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Maybe because the vote was disaggregated?
> 
> I know our many on our committee were concerned about asking our members, many of whom are obviously on the lower grades, to go out for a full five days.


Is strike pay available, by the way?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 16, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Is strike pay available, by the way?


Yeah, and it'll be £50 per day, rather than £25 (I think it also used to be only after the fourth day of action, too, but this'll now be from the first day).

My understanding is it was a _very_ recent decision; don't know if the committee would have made a different decision on strike days if we'd been aware of that earlier.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 16, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Yeah, and it'll be £50 per day, rather than £25 (I think it also used to be only after the fourth day of action, too, but this'll now be from the first day).
> 
> My understanding is it was a _very_ recent decision; don't know if the committee would have made a different decision on strike days if we'd been aware of that earlier.


Oh yeah, I've just looked over on the Unison election thread, it does sound like it must be something that the new NEC had brought in. So nice to see that stuff having a practical impact, I suppose?


----------



## 19force8 (Feb 17, 2022)

Unite's threat to cut funding to Labour seems to have drawn an incredibly bland declaration of "the Coventry bin strike has nothing to do with me or the Labour Party" from Starmer. But what's really winding people up is the way he manages to snigger as he says "Coventry"


----------



## Serge Forward (Feb 17, 2022)

"Coventry (of all places)..."


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 17, 2022)

Send him there!


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 17, 2022)

Know a couple of the folk at City, brilliant result.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 18, 2022)

Not going to pretend to understand this at 6pm on a Friday, but I think this is good news..?


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 19, 2022)

Coventry bin lorry drivers to march on Council House as Unite reveals zero attendance from councillors in 25 hours of negotiations
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				






> *When:* 12 noon, Tuesday, 22 February, 2022
> 
> 
> *Where:* The Council House, Earl Street, Coventry, CV1 5RR
> ...


No word yet as to whether Starmer will be available to speak at the protest.

Also, decent Novara write-up (no shagging in this one, you may or may not be disappointed to hear) of the injunction against UVW at Great Ormond Street:








						A Court Just Took Away the Right to Strike – But a Union is Fighting to Win It Back | Novara Media
					

In placing an injunction on striking security guards at Great Ormond Street Hospital, a court has made standard picketing practices illegal. We must resist this fundamental attack on the right to strike, writes Callum Cant - it’s part of a Tory slide to authoritarianism.




					novaramedia.com
				




This bit is particularly depressing:


> Given the trade union movement’s founding principle that “an injury to one is an injury to all,” you’d expect the other union branches at the hospital to be standing up for their colleagues. But that’s not the case. The majority Black, brown and migrant security guards are being abandoned by their fellow trade unionists while their right to strike is attacked in the courts.
> 
> In a letter circulated to hospital staff and seen by Novara Media, local union representatives who participate in the staff partnership forum (including Unison, Unite, the RCN, the BMA and the GMB) tacitly endorse the injunction. After taking credit for the insourcing of cleaners following the UVW campaign last year, they go on to brand the strike “totally unacceptable”, and express their sympathy with “the very leaders that we have worked with to achieve the successes of recent years” in the face of what they term “abuse”. To an outside observer, this looks a lot like scabbing.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Feb 19, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> This bit is particularly depressing:


Yes that's fucking grim and makes me wonder what the point is of being a member of Unite.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 19, 2022)

Apparently the injunction has been watered down, they're no longer banned from "rapid dramatic movements":








						‘Unprecedented’ protest ban partially overturned in hospital security guards strike
					

The United Voices of the World trade union has said the new order is still ‘unjustifiably oppressive’




					www.nationalworld.com


----------



## 19force8 (Feb 20, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> This bit is particularly depressing:


Yep and not untypical of the stranglehold local union bureaucrats have at some [many?] hospitals. Massive workplaces with branches and reps remote from and unaccountable to the membership. "Partnership forums" ffs.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 20, 2022)

19force8 said:


> Yep and not untypical of the stranglehold local union bureaucrats have at some [many?] hospitals. Massive workplaces with branches and reps remote from and unaccountable to the membership. "Partnership forums" ffs.


I've not worked anywhere with an active UVW or similar presence, but I imagine it must have quite a polarising effect on the other unions, my first thought was "surely not all of them would go along with it?" but on further reflection, I suppose a lot of the people who might otherwise be good Unite/Unison/GMB reps are probably in UVW there, and so not making any arguments within those branches?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Feb 20, 2022)

The question of whether to work within the system or outside/against it is one I still haven't really decided where I land.

I get the sense that UVW tend to be a bit more the latter, while UNISON and the like are more the former?


----------



## 19force8 (Feb 20, 2022)

I'm pretty much out of the loop on union matters these days [retired years ago and moved out of London], but living near Coventry I can't help but be impressed by Unite's direction of travel under Sharon Graham.

I also like way the new unions such as UVW seem to be channelling an "old fashioned" approach to union organising - building to strike and then building through strikes and being driven by members on the ground rather than using them as a stage army to secure a seat at the table for national officials (such as happened with the civil service strikes ten years ago).


----------



## 19force8 (Feb 20, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I've not worked anywhere with an active UVW or similar presence, but I imagine it must have quite a polarising effect on the other unions, my first thought was "surely not all of them would go along with it?" but on further reflection, I suppose a lot of the people who might otherwise be good Unite/Unison/GMB reps are probably in UVW there, and so not making any arguments within those branches?


The argument that breakaway unions would take the best militants, leaving the bulk of members at the mercy of the right wing certainly makes sense. But I'm not sure that's what's happening here. UVW seems to be organising workers who have been cut adrift by both the main employer and the established unions. I hope their example strengthens the hand of militants in those unions. Time will tell I suppose.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 20, 2022)

Oh yeah, I certainly wasn't arguing against the small unions, it'd certainly be ridiculous to accuse the people organising at places like Deliveroo and Uber of having "broken away" from anything. Just thinking that, if the article's accurate, the situation in those particular branches seems particularly dire, and thinking of possible reasons why.


----------



## teqniq (Feb 21, 2022)




----------



## teqniq (Feb 22, 2022)

A Labour council spends nearly £3 million on avoiding paying it's employees a fair wage (money they could have used to settle the dispute) and it also seems they've engaged in disinformation:









						Unite demolishes Coventry council claims about refuse drivers’ pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 22, 2022)

JustEat news:









						'We take their concerns seriously' - Just Eat bosses respond after drivers strike
					

AN online takeaway company has reassured delivery drivers in Colchester it takes their concerns about wages seriously after they went on strike.




					www.gazette-news.co.uk
				








__





						The Times & The Sunday Times
					

News and opinion from The Times & The Sunday Times




					www.thetimes.co.uk
				




quoted in case paywall:


> JustEat couriers’ strike hits rush for lunch​In a city with a long history of industrial action, gig workers are staging a very modern dispute over their pay​When Parirs Dixon sent a WhatsApp message to his fellow Just Eat couriers in Sheffield, bemoaning their new pay terms, he did not expect to make history.
> 
> But more than two months on, he is leading the longest-running strike in the gig economy — in the city that, more than 30 years ago, had the lengthiest industrial dispute in British history.
> 
> ...



And also this:


Also some UCU (and Unison in some places) strike stuff happened today as well.


----------



## hitmouse (Feb 22, 2022)

Oh, this is worth a plug:








						City University UNISON Strike Fund, organized by City University UNISON
					

SUPPORT FUND FOR LOW-PAID STRIKING WORKERS AT CITY, UNIVERSITY OF LONDON   … City University UNISON needs your support for City University UNISON Strike Fund



					www.gofundme.com
				




They've managed to fully close the campus, good work:




__





						Statement on partial campus closure | City, University of London
					

The University campus will be partially closed on Monday 28th February, Tuesday 1st March and Wednesday 2nd March.




					www.city.ac.uk


----------



## PR1Berske (Mar 1, 2022)

I mean, unhinged doesn't even cover this from The Telegraph


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 3, 2022)

Next GOSH security strike rally on Friday:








						[Friday 29 April, 12.00pm]End racist outsourcing at Great Ormond Street Hospital!
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				



Fundraiser party on Saturday:








						[SATURDAY 5 MARCH, 17:00PM-until late] UVW Fundraiser Fiesta for GOSH Security Guards!
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 10, 2022)

Coventry council - sorry, _C-huh-oventry_ council, have suspended a shop steward, which is sure to help fix the relationship between Labour and Unite:








						Coventry council accused of ‘needlessly’ escalating bin dispute as leader George Duggins suspends a Unite shop steward on bogus charges
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Unite promising to escalate the Chep strike with protests at major customers:








						Striking workers increase the pressure on Chep, a major UK pallet supplier
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Avanti West Coast train cleaners striking this week:




__





						West Coast train cleaners striking again
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				




TransPennine Express conductors striking on Sundays for the rest of the month and beyond:




__





						Rail and Tube strikes to go ahead this weekend
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 10, 2022)

More Chep stuff, Bolton Trades Council are going to throw them a spring party next week:


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 14, 2022)

Fwiw, here's the petition in support of the suspended Coventry rep:








						Coventry Council: Reinstate Pete Randle, stop union busting, stop strike breaking and pay the rate
					

Pete is one of the 75 refuse workers in Coventry City who have been on an all-out strike since 31st Jan over a pay dispute.   •	The Council is reported to have spent in the region of 2.8 million of taxpayers’ money trying to break the strike and using contractor Tom White Waste to break the...




					www.megaphone.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 15, 2022)

GOSH security guards strike rally on Thursday:








						[Friday 29 April, 12.00pm]End racist outsourcing at Great Ormond Street Hospital!
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				



Cleaners at GOSH have now finally won full NHS contracts:








						Victory! Hospital Cleaners call off strike after winning full NHS parity from 1 April 2022
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 16, 2022)

Cleaners at City University in London haven't been paid their wages properly for 15 days now, protest on Friday:


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 16, 2022)

Oh, and big stuff at Glasgow council - GMB due to strike on 29th-30th:




__





						GMB Scotland |
					





					www.gmbscotland.org.uk
				



Unison have voted for strike action there, don't think dates are confirmed yet:








						Glasgow branch overwhelmingly votes to back new strike action | Article, News | News | UNISON National
					

The long running dispute around equal pay and has continued even after the members were awarded a £500m settlement in 2019




					www.unison.org.uk
				



Unite will have just finished balloting, dunno if they've announced their result?








						Industrial ballot held over Glasgow City Council’s ‘broken promises’ on Equal Pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Also, renewed mandate for action among Coventry bin workers:








						Coventry bin strikes will run into the summer after huge vote for action
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




And a video from the Chep picket line, at the end of week 15 of the strike:


----------



## zahir (Mar 17, 2022)

Outrage and no ferries after mass P&O sackings
					

The company confirms it will not run services "for the next few days" after abruptly sacking 800 staff.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				





> The union said it has instructed members to stay on board their vessels once they have docked or risk being "locked out" of their jobs. "We are digging in for the long-haul. We are determined to fight," RMT spokesperson Geoff Martin said. A seafaring P&O employee told the BBC his colleagues onboard have refused to disembark and are instead "in their cabins refusing to work".


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 24, 2022)

Missed it until now, so too late, but IWGB are holding/have held a demo at Greggs HQ in Newcastle over the JustEat dispute:








						Striking JustEat couriers demonstrate outside Greggs HQ over pay cuts
					

Striking JustEat couriers to demonstrate outside JustEat client Greggs’s Newcastle HQ on Thursday 24 March at 13:00 over pay cuts.




					iwgb.org.uk


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Mar 27, 2022)

Unite are suspending labour councillors in Coventry from membership and cutting off funding and support for the elections in May.

There is an undoubtedly delicious turning of the tables here: normally Labour expel trade unionists, now it’s the other way round. But the main point here is the unmistakable line in the sand being drawn by a major trade union. No more support for Labour councils that attacks workers, no more funding for those imposing cuts and no more union membership to help these types use our structure for their own slithering ambition.


----------



## Serge Forward (Mar 27, 2022)

Here's what she said:


----------



## hitmouse (Mar 31, 2022)

More video from Coventry:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 1, 2022)

JustEat/Stuart strike hits day 100: 








						Longest gig-economy strike hits day 100 as Stuart Delivery boss admits to pay cuts in meeting
					

The longest gig-economy strike in history hits day 100 as JustEat subcontractor Stuart Delivery’s UK general manager Brendan Hamill declares pay was previously too high in recent meetings with a union representative.




					iwgb.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 2, 2022)

Welcome! You are invited to join a meeting: How to sustain strike action and win. After registering, you will receive a confirmation email about joining the meeting.
					

What if a few days or weeks of strike action do not work? What if your action goes on for months?  Join us for an important workshop and action planning meeting with union reps and stewards who have led long periods of strike action. This meeting will be practical and interactive, open to all...




					us02web.zoom.us
				










What if a few days or weeks of strike action do not work? What if your action goes on for months? 

Join us for an important workshop and action planning meeting with union reps and stewards who have led long periods of strike action. This meeting will be practical and interactive, open to all trade union workplace reps and stewards, strike leaders and branch officers who organise at the workplace.

The meeting will be led and facilitated by:

Jane Hardy, Author of Nothing to lose but our chains.
Gary Walker, Unite shift rep at CHEP
Khalil Lange, IWGB Sheffield branch rep
Pat McGrath, Unite convenor at B&Q Wincanton


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 3, 2022)

Chep strike fundraiser:








						Help support 66 striking workers, organized by Mike P
					

Help us to support 66 striking workers that are fighting for better pay.   Workers at CHEP’s … Mike P needs your support for Help support 66 striking workers



					www.gofundme.com


----------



## MickiQ (Apr 4, 2022)

.


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 5, 2022)

Meeting about the UVW GOSH strike in Liverpool on Sunday:



> Striking Great Ormond Street Hospital (GOSH) security guards will be speaking at a meeting in Liverpool on Sunday 10 April. We would be delighted if you could join us to hear these pandemic heroes tell the story of their fight for an end to outsourcing and discrimination.
> 
> * 5-7pm, Sunday 10 April
> 
> ...


No link cos can't see anything online about it, but I swear the email I got looks legit?


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 7, 2022)

Rally in support of the Chep strikers next Wednesday afternoon:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 8, 2022)

Avanti West Coast cleaners out this weekend:




__





						Atalian Servest West Coast cleaners return to the picket lines
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				



Also, this sounds like it could be very big:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 13, 2022)

This video is really good and worth watching, imo:

Hopefully you can watch it without being logged into fb?


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 14, 2022)

And a new video from the Chep strike:


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 18, 2022)

'I didn’t think it would last this long': Inside the UK's longest current strike
					

'It’s such a physically demanding job - and we feel we should be rewarded for that'




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 19, 2022)

Churchill rail cleaners out for 11 days from the 27th on:




__





						Churchill cleaners to take 11 days strike action over pay
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				




Also, RMT calling mass meetings on the 25th and 26th in Manchester and Liverpool:


			Mass Meeting Manchester
		




			Mass Meeting Liverpool
		


Not 100% clear if they're for the public or just members? These two are definitely just for RMT members though:


			Defend Rail Jobs, Pay and Conditions
		



			North East Mass Members Meeting


----------



## teqniq (Apr 19, 2022)

This is a bit weird, which is why I've held off posting it. Unite says there is workplace bulling happening but GMB who are by far the larger union amongst the refuse workers say that nothing has been bought to them by members regarding the same:









						Cardiff Bin Strike - Union Says Workers Are Humiliated If Work Isn’t Done On Time -
					

Reading Time: 6 minutes Refuse workers in the Unite union in Cardiff recently voted overwhelmingly for strike action in a dispute over bullying and the use of agency workers by Cardiff Council. Tom Davies spoke to Unite regional organiser Ruth Hyndon about the reasons behind the strike vote...




					www.voice.wales


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 19, 2022)

teqniq said:


> This is a bit weird, which is why I've held off posting it. Unite says there is workplace bulling happening but GMB who are by far the larger union amongst the refuse workers say that nothing has been bought to them by members regarding the same:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hmmm, do we need a whole thread for "weird inter-union disputes among bin workers"? Looking at this situation very much from the outside, I would speculate that one reason for that difference might be if the GMB reps include a person, or indeed more than one, who bullied workers don't feel comfortable talking to about these issues, but that is just speculation on my part.


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 20, 2022)

Other RMT mass meetings coming up in Poole, Donny and London:


			Defend Rail Jobs, Pay & Conditions: Mass Meeting Doncaster
		



			Defend Rail Jobs, Pay & Conditions: Mass Meeting London
		



			Defend Rail Jobs, Pay & Conditions: Mass Meeting Poole


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 21, 2022)

Great Ormond Street security guards rally, April 29th:








						[Friday 29 April, 12.00pm]End racist outsourcing at Great Ormond Street Hospital!
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 21, 2022)

Oh, and IWGB cleaners are having a fundraising party on May Day, which sounds like a pretty worthwhile way to spend it?


----------



## hitmouse (Apr 27, 2022)

Inflation-beating 14% pay victory ends long-running strike at Chep
					






					www.unitetheunion.org
				












						Striking warehouse staff to return to work for first time in 21 WEEKS
					

"This was a tough dispute but the workers stood their ground and won an excellent deal"




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk
				




Unite slightly overselling what's been won here, headline is 14% but the small print is:
"The workers will receive a 9 per cent pay increase which on average is worth £2,500. Other elements of the deal, including a £1000 lump sum and three extra days of annual leave this year, mean that the total package is worth as much as 14 per cent while real inflation (RPI) runs at 9 per cent.

The company has also agreed to address the union’s concerns about excessive disciplinary sanctions and to further talks to address pay parity with other Chep sites."
But still, a pretty hefty win from a seriously determined and impressive strike.


----------



## hitmouse (May 2, 2022)

Crowdfunder for the Churchill cleaners' strike:








						Help raise £20000 to RMT Cleaners' Dispute
					

Weʼre raising money to RMT Cleaners' Dispute. Support this JustGiving Crowdfunding Page.




					www.justgiving.com
				




There's someone on twitter claiming a manager drove their car at pickets, not seen any further info on it though:


----------



## Puddy_Tat (May 2, 2022)

Bus drivers at Arriva London South out again next week









						South London Arriva bus drivers set to strike over pay
					

Arriva drives who are members of the Unite union are set to hold 24-hour and 48-hour strikes.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




While comparison of basic hourly rates can be misleading (some operators pay the basic hourly rate for more or less everything, others have a basic rate plus additional payments for longer duties and / or 'unsocial hours', some pay meal breaks through, some don't pay them at all, some pay the difference if the meal break is longer than x minutes)  it may say something that Arriva seemed to be advertising for drivers almost continuously while other S London operators didn't have vacancies during the post-2008 recession...


----------



## hitmouse (May 2, 2022)

Rally in support of the Coventry bin strikers tomorrrow:








						NEW POLL: Coventry residents send message to council – settle the strike and pay the rate!
					






					www.unitetheunion.org
				



No word on whether Starmer will be able to make it.
Also, Manchester bin strike is off:








						Threat of Manchester bin strikes over as Biffa workers accept improved pay offer
					






					www.unitetheunion.org
				



But Unite talking up the possibility of action at various councils, especially Scottish ones:








						UK councils braced for summer shutdowns as pay strikes spread
					






					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (May 4, 2022)

Short video about the Chep strike:


----------



## hitmouse (May 9, 2022)

Online supporters meeting for the JustEat strike tomorrow:










						Welcome! You are invited to join a meeting: JustEat strike supporters meeting. After registering, you will receive a confirmation email about joining the meeting.
					

A meeting for members of the public who want to support the historic UK gig economy strike being waged by food delivery couriers




					us02web.zoom.us
				




Sounds like summat big's meant to be happening on Tuesday 17th:


----------



## hitmouse (May 12, 2022)

Mass wildcat going on among construction workers at an oil refinery near Hull:


----------



## hitmouse (May 13, 2022)

Round up of a few things:
CAIWU now in dispute over pay and conditions for cleaners and porters at Royal Opera House, will be holding a demo on Friday 20th:




I'd totally missed the Unite/NEU staff strike till now (a strike by NEU staffers organised through Unite against victimisation of a colleague), sounds like a proper fucking mess but has now apparently been resolved:








						Unite members to strike following unfair disciplining of activist by the NEU
					






					www.unitetheunion.org
				











						NEU workers take strike action
					

Officials working for Europe’s biggest education union, the National Education Union, are taking strike action over the alleged victimisation of their union representative. This is the first strike…




					labourhub.org.uk
				





And a bit of video from the ongoing bin strike in Coventry:


----------



## hitmouse (May 15, 2022)

Demo called at JustEat HQ on Tuesday afternoon in support of the ongoing strike:


----------



## hitmouse (May 19, 2022)

Upcoming IWGB stuff, fundraiser party on Saturday 21st:

Joint protest between cleaners, porters and security guards at UCL and LSHTM on Thursday 26th:


----------



## AmateurAgitator (May 19, 2022)

ACG article on the GMB coming to the rescue of Deliveroo









						GMB in pact with Deliveroo to undermine grassroots organising - Anarchist Communist Group
					

The online food delivery company, Deliveroo, have fought every attempt at self-organisation by their couriers since around 2016. Unions such as the Independent Workers of Great Britain (IWGB) and, in some regions, the Couriers Network of the Industrial Workers of the World, were active in...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## AmateurAgitator (May 22, 2022)

Not the UK, but there was an anti-war general strike in Italy today. This from the USI-CIT (Italian anarcho-syndicalist union) :

Thousands in Bologna on a strike against the war!

From the USI-CIT on 05/22/2022

Today a general and social strike called by basic and conflictual trade unionism, participated by thousands of male and female workers, political and social realities, middle students fighting against alternating school work, young Palestinians and many and many others in the square in Bologna united to say No to war.

Closed warehouses and production sites, closed schools, local public transport stopped, tens of thousands in our territory adhere to the strike against the war, the war economy and the war government, yes to the increase in social spending.

Over twenty squares mobilized simultaneously throughout Italy with demonstrations and garrisons in front of NATO military bases.

The demonstration in Bologna which started from Piazza XX Settembre with the banner carried by the workers of the organizing trade unions read: Out of the war, increase wages and social expenses.

The parade continued along via Amendola and via Marconi where in front of the trade union offices of the CISL and CGIL there were interventions by workers who underlined the importance of the general strike and condemned the union policies aimed at not disturbing the government. Draghi, the government of war, despite the overwhelming majority of workers in the entire country are for the immediate end of co-belligerence.

Confindustria is also contested in Via Barberia and is trying to make female and male workers pay the prices of crises and the war economy.

The demonstration ended under the windows of the Municipality where the war party governs, responsible for an unprecedented attack on the living conditions of the popular sectors destined to pay for its belligerent folly.

All the speeches underlined the great participation in the strike and the demonstration, the unity of action against the war and the need to continue mobilizing on the following slogans:

    immediate blocking of arms shipments to Ukraine;
    immediate ceasefire
    cutting military spending and transferring these resources to education, transport and public health;
    freezing of the prices of basic necessities (food such as bread and pasta, electricity, water and gas tariffs, etc.);
    introduction of the sliding scale: automatic adjustment of wages to price increases;
    reduced working hours for equal wages and a new freeze on layoffs to contain the next waves of unemployment.
    decent social income for all unemployed

ITALY OUT OF THE WAR

increase wages and social expenses

Basic and conflictual unions






__





						In migliaia a Bologna in Sciopero contro la guerra! – USI-CIT
					






					usi-cit.org


----------



## hitmouse (May 23, 2022)

National RMT ballot closes on Tuesday, result should be known on Wednesday:








						Will there be a national rail strike?
					

A strike ballot of 40,000 members of the RMT union closes on Tuesday.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				



Also sounds like they'll be striking at two tube stations over the Jubilee:




__





						Tube strike action set for Queen's Jubilee
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (May 23, 2022)

Wildcat strike wave on North Sea oil rigs: 








						North Sea oil workers 'standing strong' as strikes reportedly spread to 19 rigs
					

What has been described as a 'wage revolution' is taking place reportedly on 19 rigs after riggers downed tools in demanding a £7 an hour pay rise.




					www.aberdeenlive.news


----------



## hitmouse (May 23, 2022)

Brighton bar staff vote to go on strike through UVW:


Background on the dispute here:








						Brighton bar staff vote on strike action and sue their employer
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (May 23, 2022)

As a footnote to the above, can email the bosses using a tool here:








						Tell bosses to give bar staff proper contracts and respect!
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				



And sign up to the strike supporters' group here:








						Saint James Tavern -  Action Group
					

Bar staff at Saint James Tavern in Brighton will commence strike action soon. Thank you for signing up to this action group. We will be in touch with plans very soon, please leave your details below and let us know how best to contact you!   With love and solidarity,  UVW team




					docs.google.com


----------



## Lord Camomile (May 23, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> National RMT ballot closes on Tuesday, result should be known on Wednesday:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Disappointed that neither are on the Jubilee or Elizabeth lines


----------



## Louis MacNeice (May 23, 2022)

CWU gate meeting tomorrow morning; I'm expecting the possibility/probability of industrial action to be the focus in response to management's offer of an effective pay cut in recent talks.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Smokeandsteam (May 24, 2022)

Superb result on the railways. Now we need other unions organising, balloting and linking up: 









						Railway workers vote overwhelmingly in favour of national strike
					

RMT workers at Network Rail and 15 operators back industrial action in coming weeks




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Louis MacNeice (May 25, 2022)

CWU to ballot for industrial action; specifics not in place but it will be/will include strike action.


Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Smokeandsteam (May 25, 2022)

PCSU conference has also voted to ballot members over pay:









						Civil service union to ballot on strikes over pay and pensions
					

Boris Johnson calls for public sector pay restraint amid warnings of inflationary spiral




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## AmateurAgitator (May 25, 2022)

Round up of wildcat strikes









						The wildcat prowls – increase in unofficial strikes - Anarchist Communist Group
					

300 construction workers went on wildcat strike for 2 days at the Ineos refinery at Saltend, Hull on 11th and 12th May. Their employer, the contractor Altrad, has been consistently paying out wages late, awarding wrong wage sums, etc, resulting in some workers owed thousands of pounds because of...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## teqniq (May 28, 2022)

I suspect there will be more of this:



Also:


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 7, 2022)

National RMT action is on, June 21/23/25:




__





						RMT launch 3 days of national train strike action
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 8, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> National RMT action is on, June 21/23/25:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hits the cricket at Leeds for one section of society
Hits Glastonbury for another section of society
Hits Elton John for that section of society that can't accept that his voice has gone.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 9, 2022)

Crossposting from the UCU/HE disputes thread to mention that UNISON branches in HE who want to be included in this year's pay ballot need to send a letter of dispute to their employer by the end of Friday 10th, so probably worth thinking about nudging your branch to make sure they're doing that if that applies to you.
Also, bump cos this is next week:








						Welcome! You are invited to join a meeting: How to sustain strike action and win. After registering, you will receive a confirmation email about joining the meeting.
					

What if a few days or weeks of strike action do not work? What if your action goes on for months?  Join us for an important workshop and action planning meeting with union reps and stewards who have led long periods of strike action. This meeting will be practical and interactive, open to all...




					us02web.zoom.us


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 9, 2022)

Various upcoming events:
Cleaners and porters organised through CAIWU at Royal Opera House holding a protest for breaks, sick pay, holiday and pensions tomorrow:








						Protest at the Royal Opera House
					

The Cleaners and Porters at the Royal Opera House need your support!




					www.eventbrite.com
				



App Drivers and Couriers Union having a London strike against Bolt, June 15:


And from UVW, coming up in Brighton:


> The bar staff at the Saint James Tavern in Brighton *are going on strike!*
> 
> They unanimously voted to strike for better working conditions, job security and respect at work.. They are saying no to zero-hours contracts, and want a minimum pay rise to £11.50, a full pay sick scheme so they can afford to rest if they get sick and union recognition.
> 
> ...


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 9, 2022)

Oh, and one more, London Bridge Hospital cleaners demo next week:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 10, 2022)

A useful reminder from RMT that the forthcoming dispute isn’t just about train drivers. Here is a list of some of the grades and trades balloted and part of the action:


----------



## oryx (Jun 10, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> A useful reminder from RMT that the forthcoming dispute isn’t just about train drivers. Here is a list of some of the grades and trades balloted and part of the action:
> 
> View attachment 326640


That's really good.

Made the mistake of looking at the comments below the BBC London piece on the train strike and comments about 'overpaid' train drivers were rife.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 12, 2022)

oryx said:


> That's really good.
> 
> Made the mistake of looking at the comments below the BBC London piece on the train strike and comments about 'overpaid' train drivers were rife.


I always feel like that's one of those things that gets twisted but should really be a pro-union talking point anyway - "would you like your salary to be more like a train driver's? In that case, you should probably join/get active in your union and help make it as effective as the rail unions then!"


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 13, 2022)

Out of curiousity and to set the record straight though - how much are train drivers infact paid?

I reckon theres some nonsense being said out there.


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 13, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> Out of curiousity and to set the record straight though - how much are train drivers infact paid?


According to Glassdoor the average salary of a train driver is £54K per annum but varies naturally from about £30K for new starters up to about £60-70K at the top end of the range.
It's a decently paid job (a lot of which is down to a strong union)


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 13, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> According to Glassdoor the average salary of a train driver is £54K per annum but varies naturally from about £30K for new starters up to about £60-70K at the top end of the range.
> It's a decently paid job (a lot of which is down to a strong union)


Cheers.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Jun 13, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> According to Glassdoor the average salary of a train driver is £54K per annum but varies naturally from about £30K for new starters up to about £60-70K at the top end of the range.
> It's a decently paid job (a lot of which is down to a strong union)


Goods train drivers best paid, but huge responsibility and some very anti social shifts. I bet many in Westminster wouldn't and couldn't do it. In terms of responsibility we should always remember how little bus drivers get paid for a hugely responsible and skilled job. Also it is the point of unions to win and defend the best terms and conditions they can get. After all it is or at least should be a race to the top not the bottom.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 14, 2022)

If anyone in London wants to/can get down to Brighton on Saturday 25th for the pub strike, UVW are running a bus down:










						Jump on the solidarity bus to Brighton!
					

The bar staff at the Saint James Tavern in Brighton are going on strike and they need your support!   Please come to their strike rally on Saturday June 25,  4pm-8pm.   We are organising a solidarity bus to take supporters from London to Brighton and back.   Come and support your comrades and...




					docs.google.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 15, 2022)

Brighton pub strikers called in for disciplinaries, email tool here:








						Tell bosses to stop union busting at St James Tavern
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 16, 2022)

Crowdfunder for the Brighton pub strike:








						SUPPORT PUB WORKERS' STRIKE IN BRIGHTON!
					

Donate to the strike fund for the Saint James Tavern strike in Brighton. Bar staff say poor working conditions are not ‘part of the job.'




					www.crowdfunder.co.uk


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 16, 2022)

Are we likely to see more strikes this summer going into the autumn?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jun 16, 2022)

Certainly looking likely in Higher Education, at least.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 17, 2022)

RMT strike fundraiser happening in London tomorrow:








						Support Railway Workers
					

Fundraiser to supporting railway workers ahead of their nationwide strike.




					www.eventbrite.co.uk
				




Something about the words "RMT Young Members & Young Labour" doesn't exactly fill me with enthusiasm, but perhaps that's unfair. And tbf I won't be there either way.


----------



## teqniq (Jun 18, 2022)

Hmmmm:


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 18, 2022)

This does raise the question of what the fuck it has to do with the Govt.
The train companies are private companies what business has the Govt dictating what they pay their employees.


----------



## teqniq (Jun 18, 2022)

I suspect the government sees this as an opportunity for some union-crushing; also divide and rule and an appeal to their base.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 18, 2022)

Yeah, during the long-running Northern Rail dispute a few years back the RMT was saying that Grayling or whoever was getting NR to take a harder stance there in the hopes of breaking them.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Jun 18, 2022)

Royal Mail is also looking for a fight. They made a significantly below inflation pay offer, with strings attached. They then followed this up with a raft of proposals including a move to seasonal hours contracts (where working hours can be altered with two weeks notice), removal of sick pay after the first absence in a 12 month period (entitlement to ssp only) and the introduction of compulsory  7 day working; all employees to be moved onto these new t&cs. It’s almost as if they were looking to provoke the CWU.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 18, 2022)

ACG article on strikes and 'the public'









						Who are ‘the public’ ? - Anarchist Communist Group
					

The current rail strike is the first major national industrial dispute for a decade, since the Public Sector anti-austerity strikes of 2011 which accounted for nearly 400,000 lost working days. Then, as now, the apparent victim was this illusionary concept of ‘the public’. Inconvenience it seems...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## Petcha (Jun 18, 2022)

Not read much about this, but is the RMT striking to get at least an inflation matching pay raise or more?


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 18, 2022)

Petcha said:


> Not read much about this, but is the RMT striking to get at least an inflation matching pay raise or more?


I think one of the big points they've been trying to get across is that it's not just about pay, the dispute covers pay, job security, and working conditions. So, for instance, their latest statement:


			https://www.rmt.org.uk/news/rmt-statement/
		



> It has to be re-stated that the source of these disputes is the decision by the Tory Government to cut £4bn of funding from our transport systems - £2bn from national rail and £2bn from Transport for London.
> 
> 
> As a result of this transport austerity imposed by the Government, the employing companies have taken decisions to:
> ...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 18, 2022)

Petcha said:


> Not read much about this, but is the RMT striking to get at least an inflation matching pay raise or more?



Hitmouse is correct. At the heart of the dispute is a set of negotiations about pay, redundancy and rationalisation. The employers representatives, and the government, are seeking to make £4 billion of saving through 2,500 job cuts and through ‘modernisation’ (read closed ticket offices and further redundancies) and new working practices, mainly new technology which will also cut jobs.

They have said if the union sign up to their plan some of the money will be diverted into worker pay albeit at a rate well below inflation.

A cursory reading of the detail of the offer makes
me believe that far from the RMT itching for a scrap that the government has deliberately provoked the dispute. I mean, what else would any half serious union do when presented with an ‘offer’ like that?

Interestingly, the Times today reports ‘concerns’ in the Treasury about the prospect of rising pay. Not actual rising pay, but the prospect of it. There seem to be no similar concerns about actual existing and rampant corporate profit which is actually driving inflation and rising prices (even more so, in fact, than raw materials, source energy costs etc).

The ‘unions’ and the working class will - as always - be scapegoated for the crisis, and in the absence of actual rising pay it seems striking workers are to be the chosen target.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 18, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> It’s almost as if they were looking to provoke the CWU.



Indeed. The Royal Mail made £750 million profit last year. It’s hard not to conclude that the Tories want to provoke the better organised sections of the organised working class into dispute a) to divert attention from the real reasons for inflation and rising prices and blame workers for it and b) to isolate and beat the most militant groups like the post and rail workers to prevent more generalised action in the public sector and elsewhere where there is less leverage









						Royal Mail’s Bumper Profits Show its Workers Deserve a Raise
					

While Royal Mail bosses plead poverty, the company turned a £758 million profit last year. That’s money made by postal workers – they deserve a pay rise.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 18, 2022)

Preaching to the choir on this one, but it also lays bare the hypocrisy of anyone in government whining about how the poor commuters will be affected by rail strikes, since cutting £4bn from the railways will also clearly have a negative impact on commuters, and one that will last for considerably more than just a few days.


----------



## magneze (Jun 18, 2022)

Perhaps we need to be talking about a "Profit Price Spiral"?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 18, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Preaching to the choir on this one, but it also lays bare the hypocrisy of anyone in government whining about how the poor commuters will be affected by rail strikes, since cutting £4bn from the railways will also clearly have a negative impact on commuters, and one that will last for considerably more than just a few days.



In the hypocrisy stakes it’s not a patch on millionaire Tories, who’ve never done a proper days work in their puff, attacking the salary of workers who have had the temerity to organise and collectivity achieve a living wage for most of the workforce.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 18, 2022)

talking of hypocrisy








						MPs set for £2,200 pay rise just when costs soar for millions | ITV News
					

The pay rise will take effect in April - when energy bills and taxes will increase for millions.  | ITV National News




					www.itv.com


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 19, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Preaching to the choir on this one, but it also lays bare the hypocrisy of anyone in government whining about how the poor commuters will be affected by rail strikes, since cutting £4bn from the railways will also clearly have a negative impact on commuters, and one that will last for considerably more than just a few days.



A prescient comment….I’m sure those ‘members of the public’ attacking the strikes for causing them minor inconvenience will also be the first to moan when they can’t buy a ticket any more, when there is nobody about to offer information and when their station has no staff in it:


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 19, 2022)

A thread here with locations of picket lines, so far we have London region:

Manchester and Northwest:

Northeast:

And Nottingham:


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jun 19, 2022)

Somewhat ironically, I couldn't get to any of those without getting a train


----------



## Petcha (Jun 20, 2022)

The lawyers are hitting the picket lines now. I'd love to send this on to my boss who described the rail strikers as 'disgusting' in our team meeting the other day (and is a former top barrister)



> Criminal barristers vote for strike action over legal aid rates​Barristers have voted to go on strike in a row over legal aid funding, PA Meda reports. PA says:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 20, 2022)

No picket lines for Kent then?


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 20, 2022)

Wessex Region:

Also, happening in Liverpool on Saturday (on checking, I see Liverpool doesn't seem to be included in the Northwest list posted above):

Oh, and there's now an updated version of the Northwest-minus-Merseyside listing from above:

There'll be a rally happening in Manchester on Saturday as well, presumably some other places too:


Also, unrelated, some more IWGB members have voted to strike in London:


Strike fund is here:


			https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/lshtm-strike-fund


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 20, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> No picket lines for Kent then?


I'm sure there will be, it's just that no-one's bothered compiling them into a handy list. Local press has a list of stations that'll be affected here:








						Full list of Kent stations that will have no trains during strike next week
					

A total of 95 Kent stations will have no services at all from Southeastern, Southern, Gatwick Express or Thameslink




					www.kentlive.news
				




I'd say look at your local trades council, or you could try emailing whichever branch sounds closest to you?




__





						South East Branch Directory
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				




Medway & District RMT have a facebook page, if that's any help?




__





						Log in or sign up to view
					

See posts, photos and more on Facebook.




					www.facebook.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 20, 2022)

Also, top bit of posting from Manchester South RMT:


----------



## Cerv (Jun 20, 2022)

normally striking unions are anti-fat-cats


----------



## Petcha (Jun 20, 2022)

teqniq said:


> I suspect the government sees this as an opportunity for some union-crushing; also divide and rule and an appeal to their base.



Yes, it seems fairly transparent. Apparently Lynton Crosby has been sitting in on Cabinet meetings and that kind of strategy is right up his alley.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 20, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I'm sure there will be, it's just that no-one's bothered compiling them into a handy list. Local press has a list of stations that'll be affected here:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Cheers. I might e mail my local branch. Hadn't thought of that.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 20, 2022)

Some handy figures about profits across the rail industry. I haven’t seen any media stories to date demanding bosses reduce profits or executive pay.


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 20, 2022)

Are the unions planning to bring the UK to a halt this summer and if so how long could it go on for?

and could this bring down the Government if they dont sit down and talk?


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 20, 2022)

Bingoman said:


> Are the unions planning to bring the UK to a halt this summer and if so how long could it go on for?
> 
> and could this bring down the Government if they dont sit down and talk?


they won't bring down the government unless they sit down and talk


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 20, 2022)

Bingoman said:


> Are the unions planning to bring the UK to a halt this summer and if so how long could it go on for?
> 
> and could this bring down the Government if they dont sit down and talk?


Alas no, the Govt has a massive majority and 2 years to the next election plus it is led by a PM who can only be removed from office by driving a stake through his heart


----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 20, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Jun 20, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> Cheers. I might e mail my local branch. Hadn't thought of that.


OK, with the disclaimer that I am terrible at geography, I think this list covers Kent, if any of those are anywhere near you?

Also, Edinburgh and district:

Colchester & Clacton:

Yorkshire & Lincolnshire:

Wales TUC say there'll be pickets at Cardiff and Swansea:

I would think there must be some other stations in Wales worth picketing, but then I'm not a Welsh railway worker?
Donations to the national dispute fund can be made here:








						National Dispute Fund
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				





PR1Berske said:


>



To be fair to the Labour leadership, I sort of think they have decided which side they're on.


----------



## srb7677 (Jun 20, 2022)

My brother works as a train manager and is on holiday right now but is intending to join a picket line tomorrow anyway.

Quite aside from the fact that it is not actually unreasonable to expect a pay rise in line with inflation, jobs are at risk.

He is lucky in having a fighting union.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 20, 2022)

think this largely repeats what hitmouse has said, but does include what time they are on until


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 20, 2022)

seen something on tweeter that RMT pickets are being added to 

Find my nearest strike 

found a few but not all that near me - looks like south west trains depots have been added, great western haven't (yet)


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 20, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> seen something on tweeter that RMT pickets are being added to
> 
> Find my nearest strike
> 
> found a few but not all that near me - looks like south west trains depots have been added, great western haven't (yet)


I don't know if it's just me, but I'm finding that map a bit hard to use, unless I'm missing something it doesn't seem to have options to zoom in and out, which are a pretty important bit of map accessibility? eta: oh, you can use + and -, but you have to be clicked into the map for them to work.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I don't know if it's just me, but I'm finding that map a bit hard to use, unless I'm missing something it doesn't seem to have options to zoom in and out, which are a pretty important bit of map accessibility? eta: oh, you can use + and -, but you have to be clicked into the map for them to work.



I’m also struggling. I assume there will be pickets at New Street, Snow Hill and Moor Street in Birmingham today. But according to the map there isn’t.


----------



## Plumdaff (Jun 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I would think there must be some other stations in Wales worth picketing, but then I'm not a Welsh railway worker?
> Donations to the national dispute fund can be made here:


There's definitely a picket at the Canton depot in Cardiff (at Ninian Park station), saw them out this morning.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> OK, with the disclaimer that I am terrible at geography, I think this list covers Kent, if any of those are anywhere near you?
> View attachment 328228
> Also, Edinburgh and district:
> View attachment 328229
> ...



Unfortunately I'm not near any of them.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 21, 2022)

Its remarkable that the media apparently can't find one low paid member of the RMT to talk to about low pay and why they are striking but can come up with this shit line of questioning


----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 21, 2022)




----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 21, 2022)




----------



## The39thStep (Jun 21, 2022)

I wonder where the 'oh but pay rises lead to inflation ' brigade that post on here are?


----------



## teqniq (Jun 21, 2022)

This is not a good look:









						Labour Front Benchers Banned From Joining Picket Lines Amid Rail Strikes
					

Exclusive: Labour front benchers have been told by the party leadership that they are banned from picket lines this week amid rail strikes organise...




					www.politicshome.com


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 21, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>



when you're getting savaged by kay burley it's clear something's not right


----------



## flypanam (Jun 21, 2022)

I’m enjoying the fact the some of the fuckers complaining that they can’t get to work spent nearly two years working from home.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 21, 2022)

Thanks Craig, thank you for talking to me


----------



## NoXion (Jun 21, 2022)

flypanam said:


> I’m enjoying the fact the some of the fuckers complaining that they can’t get to work spent nearly two years working from home.



Are you sure? We were due to have an in-person meeting at our company's Manchester headquarters this week. That has since been cancelled and the meeting will instead be held virtually.

Nobody I've spoken to about it is complaining. I'd wager the types to complain about not being able to get into the office would be the ones who hated working from home in the first place.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 21, 2022)

teqniq said:


> This is not a good look:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## flypanam (Jun 21, 2022)

NoXion said:


> Are you sure? We were due to have an in-person meeting at our company's Manchester headquarters this week. That has since been cancelled and the meeting will instead be held virtually.
> 
> Nobody I've spoken to about it is complaining. I'd wager the types to complain about not being able to get into the office would be the ones who hated working from home in the first place.


Yup, I’m sure.


----------



## IC3D (Jun 21, 2022)

He was a better Labour leader in many ways


----------



## teqniq (Jun 21, 2022)

What a surprise:









						Rail strikes: Laws will be changed to protect passengers from 'militant' union action in future, Grant Shapps says
					

The transport secretary condemned the walk-out but RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said more may be inevitable and called for co-ordinated action across trade unions to try to "rebalance the inequalities in our society".




					news.sky.com


----------



## srb7677 (Jun 21, 2022)

My brother who is a train manager doing his bit. The bald guy with glasses in the middle....


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 21, 2022)

teqniq said:


> What a surprise:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


it would be a better idea to introduce sanctions against companies who refuse to pursue meaningful negotiations and force unions to take strike action but think that's perhaps a step far for this nefandous government


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 21, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> I wonder where the 'oh but pay rises lead to inflation ' brigade that post on here are?


Those imaginery posters are living rent free in your head.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 21, 2022)

Doctor Carrot said:


> Those imaginery posters are living rent free in your head.


squatting even


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 21, 2022)

teqniq said:


> What a surprise:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Not sure how effective this would be in the current situation. The advantage that the RMT have over all other unions is not that they're militant, it's that membership is pretty solid and they have a skillset that isn't really duplicated elsewhere.
Agency workers can clean offices and empty bins but you're going to struggle to find many agency train drivers. Unless of course he's planning to pay the striking train drivers double bubble via an agency to do their own jobs whilst on strike.
In which case it becomes worth their while to strike forever.
As for changing the law to guarantee minimum service who is he going to impose these restrictions on? Imposing it on the unions is liable to be legally iffy, I don't see how forbidding someone the right to strike is going to stand up in court (Oh those pesky lefty lawyers and their human rights nonsense). Imposing it on the companies is pointless since they can't guarantee something they can't control.


----------



## LDC (Jun 21, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> Its remarkable that the media apparently can't find one low paid member of the RMT to talk to about low pay and why they are striking but can come up with this shit line of questioning




Let me be the first to say...I can see _sadness in his eyes _at the idiocy of the questioning.


----------



## teqniq (Jun 21, 2022)

MickiQ  Aren't most, if not all the train drivers in ASLEF rather than RMT?


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 21, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Aren't most, if not all the train drivers in ASLEF rather than RMT?


Are they? I thought RMT but it doesn't matter as far as this is concerned.


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 21, 2022)

Derailing the thread a little how is the rail strike going for you all? It's effect on me during my commute from the bedroom to my home office (via the bathroom and kitchen) was not noticeable so my support for the railway workers is still 100% solid.
I don't think it will affect my walk to the corner shop in 10 mins either so solidarity here won't be undermined even then. Mrs Q has texted me to tell me that the roads were horrendous on her drive to school.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 21, 2022)

Doctor Carrot said:


> Those imaginery posters are living rent free in your head.



You don't really have the energy or enthusiasm to do a search for the imaginary comments on wage increases by imaginary posters on the imaginary threads on Brexit , electricity prices, the labour shortage or the food shortage threads do you Carrot? 

I can put up with stupidity but laziness, no.


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 21, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> You don't really have the energy or enthusiasm to do a search for the imaginary comments on wage increases by imaginary posters on the imaginary threads on Brexit , electricity prices, the labour shortage or the food shortage threads do you Carrot?
> 
> I can put up with stupidity but laziness, no.


Not for a disingenuous and hypocritical pillock, no.


----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 21, 2022)




----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 21, 2022)




----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 21, 2022)

The Liberal Democrats really are wretched cunts aren’t they.


----------



## srb7677 (Jun 21, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> The Liberal Democrats really are wretched cunts aren’t they.


I realised that in 2010 after voting for the cunts as an anti-New Labour protest.


----------



## IC3D (Jun 21, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> Derailing the thread a little how is the rail strike going for you all? It's effect on me during my commute from the bedroom to my home office (via the bathroom and kitchen) was not noticeable so my support for the railway workers is still 100% solid.
> I don't think it will affect my walk to the corner shop in 10 mins either so solidarity here won't be undermined even then. Mrs Q has texted me to tell me that the roads were horrendous on her drive to school.


Cycled in, can't deal with slow packed bus full of germs. Tube doesn't feel as bad don't know why really. Uphill to North London later won't be as fun.


----------



## Petcha (Jun 21, 2022)

While I'm on side with this particular strike, just one little anecdotal thing about the side-effects. My company has a group of about 10 teenagers from 'under-privileged' backgrounds in for work experience this week. I met them yesterday, bless them, all done up in their new little suits looking quite overwhelmed by being in an office, probably being freaking out for weeks about it all. And that week has now been taken away as pretty much nobody will be there to teach them anything this week.

My ex is also an oncology nurse and her regular patients cant get to her and she can't get to them. Some she was going to give the worst of news to (it's every Tuesday she has to do this) so that will be delayed by a week or done by phone.

So. Anyway. That's all by the by, just a little snapshot of how fucked up this is - and I do not blame the strikers at all, rather the employers and their pathetic 'offers'


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 21, 2022)

IC3D said:


> Cycled in, can't deal with slow packed bus full of germs. Tube doesn't feel as bad don't know why really. Uphill to North London later won't be as fun.


i love watching cyclists heading up the archway road on days like this.


----------



## teqniq (Jun 21, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


> View attachment 328303


They've deleted the lower tweet and people a posting up lots of screenshots of it on the same thread to remind them that no, it hasn't gone away.


----------



## srb7677 (Jun 21, 2022)

In my employment we are amongst the luckier ones in percentage terms - 5.8% pay rise plus 1.25% annual bonus, altogether worth over 7%. Which is more than most are getting. Yet still it is 3% below the actual inflation rate. We are all getting poorer.

I support RMT and the strikers. Asking for a rise in line with inflation should not be controvertial. Until the last couple of decades it was normal.


----------



## srb7677 (Jun 21, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> it would be a better idea to introduce sanctions against companies who refuse to pursue meaningful negotiations and force unions to take strike action but think that's perhaps a step far for this nefandous government


Most strikes of course would never happen if annual pay rises in line with inflation were mandatory, but the establishment parties will never legislate that.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 21, 2022)

srb7677 said:


> Most strikes of course would never happen if annual pay rises in line with inflation were mandatory, but the establishment parties will never legislate that.


i'm surely not the only person who thinks pay should not simply keep in line with inflation but rise a spot above it. are we supposed to be grateful that we're being paid in real terms next year what we were paid last? for me, there can be no talk of actual pay rises until public sector workers are paid in real terms what they received in 2008 before all the below inflation offers eroded pay so now i'm getting something like 2/3-3/4 what my job was worth back then.


----------



## yield (Jun 21, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> I wonder where the 'oh but pay rises lead to inflation ' brigade that post on here are?





Doctor Carrot said:


> Those imaginery posters are living rent free in your head.











						UK Gas and Electricity Crisis Looming
					

It's good to see the likes of shell announcing record profits at a time like this  The neoliberal transfer of wealth from earned to unearned income before our eyes.




					www.urban75.net


----------



## srb7677 (Jun 21, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> i'm surely not the only person who thinks pay should not simply keep in line with inflation but rise a spot above it. are we supposed to be grateful that we're being paid in real terms next year what we were paid last? for me, there can be no talk of actual pay rises until public sector workers are paid in real terms what they received in 2008 before all the below inflation offers eroded pay so now i'm getting something like 2/3-3/4 what my job was worth back then.


Yes that is all fair comment.


----------



## NoXion (Jun 21, 2022)

yield said:


> UK Gas and Electricity Crisis Looming
> 
> 
> It's good to see the likes of shell announcing record profits at a time like this  The neoliberal transfer of wealth from earned to unearned income before our eyes.
> ...



So one dude back in February said it, and he was criticised by multiple other posters for his position. Hardly a brigade, is it?


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 21, 2022)

Popped down to the local railway station earlier to see if there was a picket line and indeed there was. They have plenty of support including plenty of food (someone even ordered them all pizza )- nice to see. I arrived late though and they were apparently only there for another hour so I didn't hang about for long - also had some stuff I needed to do. Will see about making a donation to the strike fund, which I wrongly assumed I could do at the picket line today - its all online these days innit. Will hopefully be back down there on Thursday. Solidarity.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 21, 2022)

Well no sign of an online strike fund that I can find


----------



## yield (Jun 21, 2022)

NoXion said:


> So one dude back in February said it, and he was criticised by multiple other posters for his position. Hardly a brigade, is it?


I hardly looked, I'm sure there are others. <checks notes>


----------



## belboid (Jun 21, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> Well no sign of an online strike fund that I can find











						National Dispute Fund
					





					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 21, 2022)

belboid said:


> National Dispute Fund
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just found it on their site but cheers.


----------



## IC3D (Jun 21, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> i love watching cyclists heading up the archway road on days like this.


Well you might see me then struggling to breathe and dehydrated because I forgot to fill up my water bottle about 2030 hrs. 
Next time they should consider volunteering at a local hospital that's even more shirt staffed today than usual. 
Better still provide practical support for HCPs to strike themselves.


----------



## belboid (Jun 21, 2022)

The public generally support the strike, which must confuse keef


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 21, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> I’m also struggling. I assume there will be pickets at New Street, Snow Hill and Moor Street in Birmingham today. But according to the map there isn’t.


Yeah, perils of a volunteer/user-generated map innit - if someone from the RMT in that region has put the details in they'll be


MickiQ said:


> Are they? I thought RMT but it doesn't matter as far as this is concerned.


Yeah, I think the fact that most train drivers are ASLEF rather than RMT is worth being clear on because it makes the "but train drivers' pay!" argument even more ludicrous than it would be otherwise. But your general point still stands - for instance, signallers are one of the job roles that's heavily RMT, and I wouldn't like to get on a train if I knew that the railway signals were being operated by some temp with five minutes' training.


----------



## Leighsw2 (Jun 21, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> Are they? I thought RMT but it doesn't matter as far as this is concerned.


It matters quite a bit as most of the media are obsessed with drivers and how much they get paid. But RMT (and NUR before) has always represented the 'unskilled' low paid workers in the industry. (Not to say anything against ASLEF who have also been highly effective in representing their members.)


----------



## Dystopiary (Jun 21, 2022)

The Scum got Mick Lynch mixed up with a businessman called Mike Lynch. Probably deliberate.


----------



## marty21 (Jun 21, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> Derailing the thread a little how is the rail strike going for you all? It's effect on me during my commute from the bedroom to my home office (via the bathroom and kitchen) was not noticeable so my support for the railway workers is still 100% solid.
> I don't think it will affect my walk to the corner shop in 10 mins either so solidarity here won't be undermined even then. Mrs Q has texted me to tell me that the roads were horrendous on her drive to school.


I was able to wfh , I hate wfh but couldn't be arsed with buses & walking in the end. Luckily I didn't have any meetings , heading in tomorrow when there will be more disruption.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 21, 2022)

marty21 said:


> I was able to wfh , I hate wfh but couldn't be arsed with buses & walking in the end. Luckily I didn't have any meetings , heading in tomorrow when there will be more disruption.


I don't think the strikes are on tomorrow, pretty sure Thursday and Saturday are the other strike days. Or do you mean less?


----------



## marty21 (Jun 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I don't think the strikes are on tomorrow, pretty sure Thursday and Saturday are the other strike days. Or do you mean less?


No strikes tomorrow , but there will be disruption, caused by trains/tubes not being where they are supposed to be .


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 21, 2022)

This is excellent from Mick Lynch, perfect synthesis of the general situation. Can’t see this featuring on the main news bulletins tonight, but we should be spreading it everywhere:


----------



## l'Otters (Jun 21, 2022)

Rail strikes this week have totally fucked my plans up & the knock on effect is big.

It shows how absolutely essential the railways are, and the workers who run it.

No picket lines anywhere round here but I’d go down n support them in person if I could.


----------



## l'Otters (Jun 21, 2022)

absolute state of Kieth telling ministers they’re not to go support any pickets. He’s such a waste of space.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Yeah, perils of a volunteer/user-generated map innit - if someone from the RMT in that region has put the details in they'll be



True. I mentioned this to the pickets at New Street this morning. They were unaware of the map thing and said it would be something their regional office would do. Anyway, we know where and when the pickets are now and we’ve exchanged numbers and are going to try to get more Unite stewards down for the next 2 dates.


----------



## Boris Sprinkler (Jun 21, 2022)




----------



## thismoment (Jun 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I don't think the strikes are on tomorrow, pretty sure Thursday and Saturday are the other strike days. Or do you mean less?





marty21 said:


> No strikes tomorrow , but there will be disruption, caused by trains/tubes not being where they are supposed to be .



I don’t think that they are strikes tomorrow but just looked at my journey for tomorrow and it’ll be just as bad as this morning (buses stuck in traffic and still late despite setting off to work earlier than usual) because the train and tube I need to get only start running from 7.30am (train) and 8pm (tube)


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 21, 2022)

The RMT  Twitter feed has been brilliant but I tell you what I don't think I've seen anyone punch like Mick Lynch when interviewed , he took  Richard Madely ( doing a very good imitation of Alan Partridge)   out in one minute , disposed of Kate Burley,  hammered Jonathan Gullis(Tory MP) and humiliated some junior minister called Chris Philip


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 21, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> but I tell you what I don't think I've seen anyone punch like Mick Lynch when interviewed



Spot on. He’s been excellent. Plain speaking, no bullshit, no posturing, no performative bollocks and no taking crap from middle class liberals or neo-liberal cheerleaders in the media. Consistently widening out the dispute in the media to the condition of the working class elsewhere and encouraging others to stand up and have a go


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 21, 2022)

yield said:


> UK Gas and Electricity Crisis Looming
> 
> 
> It's good to see the likes of shell announcing record profits at a time like this  The neoliberal transfer of wealth from earned to unearned income before our eyes.
> ...


One person making one post on one thread who further clarified their point a few posts later but yeah, Urban's just crawling with centrists who hate the plebs and their higher wage demands.


----------



## spitfire (Jun 21, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> The RMT  Twitter feed has been brilliant but I tell you what I don't think I've seen anyone punch like Mick Lynch when interviewed , he took  Richard Madely ( doing a very good imitation of Alan Partridge)   out in one minute , disposed of Kate Burley,  hammered Jonathan Gullis(Tory MP) and humiliated some junior minister called Chris Philip




This one was good as well.

He's some flower!


----------



## steeplejack (Jun 21, 2022)

I think they were expecting a princpled, dignified but awkward public performer such as the late Jimmy Knapp.

Instead Mick Lynch has absolutely been on fire today. Been a delight to watch.


----------



## steveseagull (Jun 21, 2022)




----------



## MickiQ (Jun 21, 2022)

Jesus Christ
What the fuck are orphans doing travelling alone anyway? This is the 2020's not the 1930's
And adding an after thought 9/11 was 21 years ago any one orphaned by it would in their 20's at least by now


----------



## David Clapson (Jun 21, 2022)

I wore my RMT badge with pride today. Nobody noticed.


----------



## tim (Jun 21, 2022)

I enjoyed this fun little compilation. I wouldn't want to be on a train driven by someone as hopeless as Madely or Burley.


----------



## steeplejack (Jun 21, 2022)

Let alone Jonathan Gullis, the wanker ticket inspector who always looks visibly disappointed when your ticket is valid and he can’t issue a fine


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 21, 2022)

tim said:


> I enjoyed this fun little compilation. I wouldn't want to be on a train driven by someone as hopeless as Madely or Burley.



He's fucking brilliant! I love how he just calmly reels off the facts and how he handles really absurd lines of questioning. 

That compilation is a good education on how to deal with a hostile media and on how pathetic the media is. Not to mention politicians too. The way he repeatedly informs that tory twat that he's a liar is absolutely priceless 😁


----------



## David Clapson (Jun 21, 2022)

Starmer's silence about the rich/poor divide is deafening. Useless, good for nothing waste of space.


----------



## bellaozzydog (Jun 22, 2022)

I’m a member of RMT offshore and would happily pay double subs just to see Mick Lynch do the rounds again tomorrow 

It’s like watching early Mike Tyson fights.


----------



## David Clapson (Jun 22, 2022)

I'm not RMT member, never have been, but I bought badges in all sorts of colours a few years back.  (Am a former member of TGWU and NUJ)


----------



## David Clapson (Jun 22, 2022)

Doctor Carrot said:


> He's fucking brilliant! I love how he just calmly reels off the facts and how he handles really absurd lines of questioning.
> 
> That compilation is a good education on how to deal with a hostile media and on how pathetic the media is. Not to mention politicians too. The way he repeatedly informs that tory twat that he's a liar is absolutely priceless 😁


If only Corbyn had been given media training by Lynch. And had been sensible and composed enough to use the training well. If only Corbyn had been...someone else.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 22, 2022)

David Clapson said:


> If only Corbyn had been given media training by Lynch. And had been sensible and composed enough to use the training well. If only Corbyn had been...someone else.



The thing is I don’t think you can ‘train’ someone to speak with that type of authenticity and clarity which derives from a specific class experience. 

Despite being, fundamentally, a trade union top, Lynch has been unbelievable impressive in every interview so far. He’s able to summarise the dispute, the economy and the situation of the working class succinctly, clearly and convincingly. I genuinely think his way of communicating cuts through. I also think the return to the stage of authentic working class politics Is long overdue but also a reminder of just how much has been lost - for a variety of reasons.

Anyway, here’s our man superbly deflating the entire government and media narrative on rising prices and inflation in under 1 minute. Astonishingly good…


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jun 22, 2022)

Doctor Carrot said:


> He's fucking brilliant! I love how he just calmly reels off the facts and how he handles really absurd lines of questioning.
> 
> That compilation is a good education on how to deal with a hostile media and on how pathetic the media is. Not to mention politicians too. The way he repeatedly informs that tory twat that he's a liar is absolutely priceless 😁


Aye, if you can avoid getting drawn into a barney and have the facts on your side, it can be relatively simple to dismantle your general blow hard who isn't used to that sort of thing.

Which is not to downplay Lynch's work, it's still not _that_ easy either way!

Weird we don't see more of it from politicians, eh..?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jun 22, 2022)

Meanwhile, trains in London (or at least my part of it) didn't start running until around 07:30, and disruptions still expected throughout the day (finally dawning on me why the called strikes one day on, one day off...  ).

It's certainly bloody annoying, but not a huge sacrifice for the greater good (while appreciating it is a far bigger problem/sacrifice for those in other situations).


----------



## flypanam (Jun 22, 2022)

My colleagues can’t get in. So I’m lone working (which isn’t too bad) but I’ve managed to get some RMT posters up in the library.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 22, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> The thing is I don’t think you can ‘train’ someone to speak with that type of authenticity and clarity which derives from a specific class experience.
> 
> Despite being, fundamentally, a trade union top, Lynch has been unbelievable impressive in every interview so far. He’s able to summarise the dispute, the economy and the situation of the working class succinctly, clearly and convincingly. I genuinely think his way of communicating cuts through. I also think the return to the stage of authentic working class politics Is long overdue but also a reminder of just how much has been lost - for a variety of reasons.
> 
> Anyway, here’s our man superbly deflating the entire government and media narrative on rising prices and inflation in under 1 minute. Astonishingly good…



The other thing that has struck me is that the main reason that his narrative is so refreshingly authentic and convincing is that it's actually the narrative of a cast of  thousands of working class people taking effective industrial action rather than some talking head lefty trying to convince or complain on a chat show.


----------



## steeplejack (Jun 22, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> The other thing that has struck me is that the main reason that his narrative is so refreshingly authentic and convincing is that it's actually the narrative of a cast of  thousands of working class people taking effective industrial action rather than some talking head lefty trying to convince or complain on a chat show.



_"Next up, Owen Jones on the cost of living crisis...."_

Almost as though the working class are returning to our screens for the first time in authentic voice rather than as a forelock-tugging minor role in a period drama; or talked over by an Oxbridge educated media type who arrogates to themselves an understanding of working class life.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 22, 2022)

steeplejack said:


> _"Next up, Owen Jones on the cost of living crisis...."_
> 
> Almost as though the working class are returning to our screens for the first time in authentic voice rather than as a forelock-tugging minor role in a period drama; or talked over by an Oxbridge educated media type who arrogates to themselves an understanding of working class life.


You think OJ is the 'authentic voice of the working class'? Jeezus christ.

Edit : I really do need to not so hastily post stuff before I've properly woken up in the morning.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 22, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> You think OJ is the 'authentic voice of the working class'? Jeezus christ.


you've 100% wrongly misread the post


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 22, 2022)

steeplejack said:


> _"Next up, Owen Jones on the cost of living crisis...."_
> 
> Almost as though the working class are returning to our screens for the first time in authentic voice rather than as a forelock-tugging minor role in a period drama; or talked over by an Oxbridge educated media type who arrogates to themselves an understanding of working class life.





The39thStep said:


> The other thing that has struck me is that the main reason that his narrative is so refreshingly authentic and convincing is that it's actually the narrative of a cast of thousands of working class people taking effective industrial action rather than some talking head lefty trying to convince or complain on a chat show.




Agreed on both points.

As well as being an apparently naturally gifted communicator, Lynch is the talking head for a specific and serious, organsied, industrial working class trade union politics. The Tories have inadvertently - in trying to create a 'wedge' issue - created a space for its partial reemergence in the public consciousness. I do wonder if some of their less stupid thinkers wonder if they might have bitten off more than they expected (although, I also think their strategy of isolating and dealing with the most militant and best organised sections of the trade unions makes some sense from their perspective. But, of course, they do need to win or all bets are off).

On working class voices on the tele, I do think Lynch cut through. a mate messaged me last night to say that twitter wankers and other narrating class 'leaders of the left' like Jones will be busy deleting 'class reductionism' from their posting history and ordering Mick Lynch T shirts. I see their point but I'm not sure that's entirely the case; most of them have gone well beyond the point of no return in abandoning class politics (if they ever professed to have any) and writing off/dismissing sections of the working class.


----------



## LDC (Jun 22, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> You think OJ is the 'authentic voice of the working class'? Jeezus christ.


_
Nobody_ is the authentic 'voice of the working class' though, not even Lynch. The struggle for 'authenticity' is just some media/shit politics created fantasy load of bollocks.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 22, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> You think OJ is the 'authentic voice of the working class'? Jeezus christ.


 
Err, I don't think Steeple does....he was being 'ironic'...


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 22, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Err, I don't think Steeple does....he was being 'ironic'...


Well thats a relief.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 22, 2022)

LDC said:


> _Nobody_ is the authentic 'voice of the working class' though, not even Lynch. The struggle for 'authenticity' is just some media/shit politics created fantasy load of bollocks.


Yeah this is true


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 22, 2022)

LDC said:


> _Nobody_ is the authentic 'voice of the working class' though, not even Lynch. The struggle for 'authenticity' is just some media/shit politics created fantasy load of bollocks.


Another thing I love about Lynch is he's not doing performative working class either, something plenty of people do and probably without realising it, he's not expecting working class people to conform to some sort of checklist as to what's genuine working class and what isn't  and he's not even designating himself as some sort of spokesman for the working class either. 

He's just an ordinary bloke armed with the facts standing up for his union members and he's encouraging others to do the same.


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 22, 2022)

He's apparently getting a lot of love on tik tok too. We're all far too old for that shit but if he can cut through on there that's really encouraging.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Jun 22, 2022)

I've only just realised how much Lynch looks like Mark Rylance. No bad thing.


----------



## Petcha (Jun 22, 2022)

skyscraper101 said:


> I've only just realised how much Lynch looks like Mark Rylance. No bad thing.



Apparently he also looks like someone else. Something which has got right up Piers Morgan's nose. Probably the most pointless 'interview' hes ever conducted.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Jun 22, 2022)

Petcha said:


> Apparently he also looks like someone else. Something which has got right up Piers Morgan's nose. Probably the most pointless 'interview' hes ever conducted.




Even by Piers Morgan standards this is really desperate.


----------



## LDC (Jun 22, 2022)

Petcha said:


> Apparently he also looks like someone else. Something which has got right up Piers Morgan's nose. Probably the most pointless 'interview' hes ever conducted.




That is fucking totally inane.


----------



## Petcha (Jun 22, 2022)

He must be having a bit of a giggle privately. Began the day with Alan Partridge on GMB drilling about whether he was a Marxist who wanted to bring down the government and finished it with Piers Morgan comparing him to the most evil puppet in the world


----------



## moochedit (Jun 22, 2022)

Petcha said:


> He must be having a bit of a giggle privately. Began the day with Alan Partridge on GMB drilling about whether he was a Marxist who wanted to bring down the government and finished it with Piers Morgan comparing him to the most evil puppet in the world


Has he done Farage's show yet?


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 22, 2022)

Piers Morgan Unhinged might be a better title than Piers Morgan Uncensored. That interview was utterly disconnected from reality. Morgan and Burley (who he also made a fool of) don't seem to be interested so much interviewing him as getting a (preferably) negative soundbite out of him and he just isn't biting if you will pardon the pun.
The way he manages to keep his calm (he either has or has had teenage children I'm sure of it) and come over as rational and normal is very impressive helped somewhat by the fact that Shapps is clearly a gibbering loon who has his job through loyalty to BoZo rather than any actual ability.
Lynch does look like the Hood though no doubt about that.


----------



## ohmyliver (Jun 22, 2022)

skyscraper101 said:


> Even by Piers Morgan standards this is really desperate.


it's a working strategy. Media outlet/person posts something really facepalmy..... lots of people share the original clip, they get lots of engagement, and stay in the limelight, might get more youtube ad venue, might get an uptick in people watching his show.   

His show has had a steady decline in number of viewers and everyone should not hinder this slide into obscurity


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 22, 2022)

The rail strikes to continue after the RMT have accused the government and especially transport secretary Grant Shapps has wrecked the negotiations?


----------



## philosophical (Jun 22, 2022)

Mick Lynch is behaving in an almost perfect fashion for a Trade Union leader standing up for his members.
Speaking personally though I thought this was  fucking appalling from the RMT in 2016. Standing alongside Farage and Johnson and all those cunts.









						RMT reiterates "Vote Leave" message
					

Transport union reiterates "Vote Leave" message on eve of EU referendum.



					www.rmt.org.uk
				




The message of 'hope' does not explain how they _hoped _to square the circle of the UK/EU land border they were urging on.


----------



## marty21 (Jun 22, 2022)

bellaozzydog said:


> I’m a member of RMT offshore and would happily pay double subs just to see Mick Lynch do the rounds again tomorrow
> 
> It’s like watching early Mike Tyson fights.


He's an absolute star !


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 22, 2022)

philosophical said:


> Mick Lynch is behaving in an almost perfect fashion for a Trade Union leader standing up for his members.
> Speaking personally though I thought this was  fucking appalling from the RMT in 2016. Standing alongside Farage and Johnson and all those cunts.
> 
> 
> ...


Might be best to keep this thread for discussing what the RMT are doing in 2022, and save arguments about what the RMT were doing six years ago for a different thread?


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 22, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Jun 22, 2022)

Petcha said:


> The lawyers are hitting the picket lines now. I'd love to send this on to my boss who described the rail strikers as 'disgusting' in our team meeting the other day (and is a former top barrister)


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 22, 2022)




----------



## David Clapson (Jun 22, 2022)

philosophical said:


> Mick Lynch is behaving in an almost perfect fashion for a Trade Union leader standing up for his members.
> Speaking personally though I thought this was  fucking appalling from the RMT in 2016. Standing alongside Farage and Johnson and all those cunts.
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, it was tragic that Bob Crow was a rabid Brexiter


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2022)

"media picador"  🤣


----------



## ska invita (Jun 22, 2022)

i did not know that


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2022)

Even The Spectator likes him!



> The RMT union boss Mick Lynch is currently dominating TV screens and social media, making mincemeat out of politicians and broadcast interviewers alike. Hapless Tory MPs that attempted to recite pre-rehearsed cliches and dodgy statistics have been gunned down by the mature, considered and, yes, gruffly charming manner of Lynch.





> When Sky News' Kay Burley tried to conjure up images of Grunwick or NUM-style flying pickets violently preventing workers and commuters from entering stations, he simply stood to one side to show her a handful of RMT workers allowing passengers to go by. Though she continued to goad him and later accused him of being 'flustered', by the time the interview ended you felt that if this was a boxing match her trainer would have thrown the towel into the ring after the first few seconds, it was that one-sided.











						In praise of RMT boss Mick Lynch
					

The head of the rail workers union Mick Lynch has been out defending his union's strike. There's something charming in his gruffness, says Mark Solomons.




					www.spectator.co.uk


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 22, 2022)

David Clapson said:


> Yes, it was tragic that Bob Crow was a rabid Brexiter


The RMT reached a position of supporting leaving the EU at a delegate conference of rank and file members , it wasn't about Bob Crowe and it wasn't about Mick             Lynch .  Whatever your views on this or mine why don't we just abide by hitmouse sensible suggestion that we have this as a thread about the strike and take the six year old argument about Brexit somewhere else?


----------



## MrSki (Jun 22, 2022)

A compilation of Mick Lynch's media interviews yesterday.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 22, 2022)




----------



## David Clapson (Jun 22, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> The RMT reached a position of supporting leaving the EU at a delegate conference of rank and file members , it wasn't about Bob Crowe and it wasn't about Mick             Lynch .  Whatever your views on this or mine why don't we just abide by hitmouse sensible suggestion that we have this as a thread about the strike and take the six year old argument about Brexit somewhere else?


If you want to keep this thread Brexit-free, why write a long post containing points which demand debate?


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 22, 2022)

David Clapson said:


> If you want to keep this thread Brexit-free, why write a long post containing points which demand debate?


I'm just stating facts. Look this is a thread about the strike. Its about unity behind the strike , its not about Brexit , its about a working class fightback . You don't have to listen to me pal, listen to this


----------



## David Clapson (Jun 22, 2022)

I support the strike. And i don't see anything wrong with reminding people of the RMT pursuing Brexit. (Perhaps they and other unions tipped the balance?) Anyone concerned about the plight of those on a low wage needs to confront the fact that many people cut their own throats when they voted for Brexit. Presumably many RMT members did this two or three or more times, in the referendum, union ballots and general elections. It begs the question that representative democracies and referenda are subverted when politicians and/or union leaders choose to distort the debate and mislead voters on an issue so broad and complex that maybe only one person in a thousand knew all the pros and cons.  I think that historians will write that the Brexit movement gave Putin and other dictators an excellent argument for scoffing at democracy. I hope Mike Lynch can reflect on that without defaulting to the hollow defense about the will of the rank and file being sacrosanct. If you don't consider whether the rank and file are wrong, perhaps because they've been manipulated, you're not acting in their best interests. You can say the same about votes for Trump. The Capitol riot was America's Brexit in some ways.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 22, 2022)

David Clapson said:


> I support the strike. And i don't see anything wrong with reminding people of the RMT pursuing Brexit. (Perhaps they and other unions tipped the balance?) Anyone concerned about the plight of those on a low wage needs to confront the fact that many people cut their own throats when they voted for Brexit. Presumably many RMT members did this two or three or more times, in the referendum, union ballots and general elections. It begs the question that representative democracies and referenda are subverted when politicians and/or union leaders choose to distort the debate and mislead voters on an issue so broad and complex that maybe only one person in a thousand knew all the pros and cons.  I think that historians will write that the Brexit movement gave Putin and other dictators an excellent argument for scoffing at democracy. I hope Mike Lynch can reflect on that without defaulting to the hollow defense about the will of the rank and file being sacrosanct. If you don't consider whether the rank and file are wrong, perhaps because they've been manipulated, you're not acting in their best interests. You can say the same about votes for Trump. The Capitol riot was America's Brexit in some ways.


I think you should stfu about what historians will say when you've clearly no memory of the eight years prior to brexit. If you've heard of the financial crisis, that gave dictators a rather greater argument for scoffing at democracy - did it scupper china's economy as it did all the western countries? 

And who is this Mike lynch you witter on about?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 22, 2022)

David Clapson said:


> And i don't see anything wrong with reminding people of the RMT pursuing Brexit. (Perhaps they and other unions tipped the balance?)



Fine. Go and post about it on the Brexit thread and someone will debate it with you. But, pack it in on this thread which is to discuss the strike


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 22, 2022)

David Clapson said:


> I support the strike. And i don't see anything wrong with reminding people of the RMT pursuing Brexit. (Perhaps they and other unions tipped the balance?) Anyone concerned about the plight of those on a low wage needs to confront the fact that many people cut their own throats when they voted for Brexit. Presumably many RMT members did this two or three or more times, in the referendum, union ballots and general elections. It begs the question that representative democracies and referenda are subverted when politicians and/or union leaders choose to distort the debate and mislead voters on an issue so broad and complex that maybe only one person in a thousand knew all the pros and cons.  I think that historians will write that the Brexit movement gave Putin and other dictators an excellent argument for scoffing at democracy. I hope Mike Lynch can reflect on that without defaulting to the hollow defense about the will of the rank and file being sacrosanct. If you don't consider whether the rank and file are wrong, perhaps because they've been manipulated, you're not acting in their best interests. You can say the same about votes for Trump. The Capitol riot was America's Brexit in some ways


----------



## BristolEcho (Jun 23, 2022)

Missed this thread. Thought it was about a magazine for some reason. 

RMT have done really well to throw everything back at the press. Hope further actions go okay.


----------



## Elpenor (Jun 23, 2022)

Some perspectives from striking (or potentially striking in the future) public sector workers 









						Why we are ready to strike: a panel of workers respond | Hannah David and others
					

Pay freezes, cutbacks and redundancies on top of pandemic burnout and the cost of living crisis have left us with no choice




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Jun 23, 2022)

Dogshit cunt Tory smashed and pummelled:


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 23, 2022)

Gets even better


----------



## flypanam (Jun 23, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> Gets even better



Fantastic.


----------



## Chilli.s (Jun 23, 2022)

This is great, he tells it how it is. The talking head presenters who all think that their lines are cleverer soundbites get knocked down as they shrill their "incisive" interviewing, knocked down by facts.

Didnt there used to be a political party that shared the plight of the workers, that would have been saying these things, I forget their name now...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 23, 2022)

Chilli.s said:


> Didnt there used to be a political party that shared the plight of the workers, that would have been saying these things, I forget their name now...



No there hasn't.


----------



## flypanam (Jun 23, 2022)

He’s on question time tonight, from Stratford-upon-Avon. On the panel: Rachel Maclean MP, Nick Thomas-Symonds MP, Mick Lynch, Anne Boden MBE and Ben Habib.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 23, 2022)

flypanam said:


> He’s on question time tonight,


quite a fun match card, ex banker tory, barrister labour,  banker tory, brexit party landlord


----------



## l'Otters (Jun 23, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> View attachment 328513


Can anyone read the text on that image? I can’t.


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 23, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> The RMT reached a position of supporting leaving the EU at a delegate conference of rank and file members , it wasn't about Bob Crowe and it wasn't about Mick             Lynch .  Whatever your views on this or mine why don't we just abide by hitmouse sensible suggestion that we have this as a thread about the strike and take the six year old argument about Brexit somewhere else?


I am dead in favour of this but you really should take your own advice here and get off your high horse. You're among the worst offenders for bringing up Brexit on threads where it's not necessary. You even brought it up earlier on this very thread.


----------



## Serge Forward (Jun 23, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> No there hasn't.


To be fair, plenty of prospective Labour MPs have talked the talk, but once elected, didn't/couldn't walk the walk (fuck, I hate that talk/walk cliche). 

The parliamentary system doesn't allow for pro-working class politicians, or those with remotely revolutionary ideas, to come to anything beyond having the odd decent lefty soundbite from the back benches. And even in countries where whole political parties with a pro-worker outlook found themselves in government, they all still pretty soon ended up same old, same old capitalist shite.

But that's capitalism for yer.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 23, 2022)

Doctor Carrot said:


> I am dead in favour of this but you really should take your own advice here and get off your high horse. You're among the worst offenders for bringing up Brexit on threads where it's not necessary. You even brought it up earlier on this very thread.


urban has always been a do as i say not a do as i do place


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 23, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> urban has always been a do as i say not a do as i do place


The truest of all truisms.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 23, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> To be fair, plenty of prospective Labour MPs have talked the talk, but once elected, didn't/couldn't walk the walk (fuck, I hate that talk/walk cliche).
> 
> The parliamentary system doesn't allow for pro-working class politicians, or those with remotely revolutionary ideas, to come to anything beyond having the odd decent lefty soundbite from the back benches. And even in countries where whole political parties with a pro-worker outlook found themselves in government, they all still pretty soon ended up same old, same old capitalist shite.
> 
> But that's capitalism for yer.



Many individual MP's have (even Starmer). 

However, when the crunch comes: when the interests of the state and the interests of organised labour are pitted against each other the Labour Party as an entity has always backed the former. See the 1984/5 Miners Strike, see In Place of Strife and the Donovan Commission, see the 'winter of discontent' see the General Strike of 1926. I could go on  Maybe Corbyn's Labour would have been different but to say that "there used to be a political party that shared the plight of the workers, that would have been saying the things" that Mick Lynch has is a historically inaccurate understanding of the role played by the Parliamentary Labour Party,


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 23, 2022)

ska invita said:


> quite a fun match card, ex banker tory, barrister labour,  banker tory, brexit party landlord


Very good , I'll use that on Twitter


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Jun 23, 2022)

Fucking iron fists left, right and centre



Compare this to the revisionist Keith clique who don't want to go to the picket line in case Richard Madeley calls them Marksists 
​


----------



## editor (Jun 23, 2022)




----------



## Artaxerxes (Jun 23, 2022)

I suspect half this climate bunch oppose HS2 but good on them for joining in









						Climate justice groups join British rail strike picket lines
					

Campaigners say government must invest in public transport to avoid worst impacts of global heating




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## flypanam (Jun 23, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> Gets even better



I can imagine the utter confusion in the mail today trying to get a bio on Connolly, and then seeing he was once in the British Army. There will be some heads scratched today


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 23, 2022)

flypanam said:


> I can imagine the utter confusion in the mail today trying to get a bio on Connolly, and then seeing he was once in the British Army. There will be some heads scratched today


Thought it utterly amazing that the co-presenter who was previously the deputy political editor at the Guardian and now deputy political editor at ITV didnt seem to know who James Connolly was.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 23, 2022)

Check-in and ground crew GMB members at British Airways have voted to strike. 95% yes vote for strike action on an 81% turnout.

BA CUT these workers pay by 10% during the pandemic and have only reinstated the cut for bosses.


----------



## Funky_monks (Jun 23, 2022)

Mick Lynch is my new hero.

That is all.


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 23, 2022)

British Airways workers vote to strike, summer holidays under threat?


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 23, 2022)

Bingoman said:


> British Airways workers vote to strike, summer holidays under threat?


i don't know, are they?


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 23, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> i don't know, are they?


Just breaking on the news now


----------



## Funky_monks (Jun 23, 2022)

flypanam said:


> I can imagine the utter confusion in the mail today trying to get a bio on Connolly, and then seeing he was once in the British Army. There will be some heads scratched today



I imagine, should they publish a bio on Connolly, that bit might be conveniently left out, for shrill "violent revolutionary and communist" narrative


----------



## spitfire (Jun 23, 2022)

Sorry should probably be on Bandwidthz but whaddyagonnado? Fire me?


----------



## Dystopiary (Jun 23, 2022)

l'Otters said:


> Can anyone read the text on that image? I can’t.


The Criminal Bar Protest/Picket for Monday 27th June 9.30am 

South Eastern Circuit - Central Criminal Court (Old Bailey) 
Midland Circuit - Birmingham Crown Court 
Northern Circuit - Manchester Crown Court 
North Eastern Circuit - Leeds Crown Court 
Western Circuit - Bristol Crown Court 
Wales & Chester Circuit - Cardiff Crown Court


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 23, 2022)

Nor normally a fan of Gilbert's obsessive labourism and wisdom after the event style of analysis. However, this is on Mick Lynch and the erasure of the working class from public discourse is very good:









						Union boss Mick Lynch is a media star – and Labour has much to learn about why | Jeremy Gilbert
					

The RMT leader’s clarity is only a surprise because old union hands have long been sidelined, says Jeremy Gilbert, professor at the University of East London




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jun 23, 2022)

Mick Lynch is a very impressive man, been making fools out of politicos and journos


----------



## ska invita (Jun 23, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Nor normally a fan of Gilbert's obsessive labourism and wisdom after the event style of analysis. However, this is on Mick Lynch and the erasure of the working class from public discourse is very good:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


" If the press continues to shut them out, the unions should put some money into giving them a platform: would a YouTube channel devoted to their voices be too expensive to run"

Unions have a lot of moneyand resources compared to pretty much everyone else on the left and their lack of dynamism and outreach is a gaping void in UK politics - so much potential.
I think its the GFTU who have a particualr remit for 'political education' (is that right?) - so little happens really.


----------



## teqniq (Jun 23, 2022)

More on the vermin not wanting a resolution to the dispute:









						Hull MP Karl Turner claims the Government does not want to settle the rail dispute — The Hull Story
					

Hull MP Karl Turner claims the Government does not want to settle the rail dispute as it wants 'division in the country'




					www.thehullstory.com


----------



## teqniq (Jun 23, 2022)

No surprises here:


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jun 23, 2022)

The RMT for London Underground have another 6 month mandate for strike and action short of strike from the ballot results today. Only just over 50% turnout mind.


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Jun 23, 2022)

The cancer media and scum politicos attempts to demonise the RMT have backfired spectacularly:


----------



## Dystopiary (Jun 23, 2022)

Jeff Robinson said:


> The cancer media and scum politicos attempts to demonise the RMT have backfired spectacularly:



Furthermore,


----------



## editor (Jun 23, 2022)




----------



## ska invita (Jun 23, 2022)

Dystopiary said:


> Furthermore,



can you vote for Labour leader with a community membership?


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 23, 2022)

BristolEcho said:


> Missed this thread. Thought it was about a magazine for some reason.


I remember that magazine, think they'd have to be doing very well to get this thread to a 91-pager though. Or very badly.


Smokeandsteam said:


> Many individual MP's have (even Starmer).
> 
> However, when the crunch comes: when the interests of the state and the interests of organised labour are pitted against each other the Labour Party as an entity has always backed the former. See the 1984/5 Miners Strike, see In Place of Strife and the Donovan Commission, see the 'winter of discontent' see the General Strike of 1926. I could go on  Maybe Corbyn's Labour would have been different but to say that "there used to be a political party that shared the plight of the workers, that would have been saying the things" that Mick Lynch has is a historically inaccurate understanding of the role played by the Parliamentary Labour Party,


This is important, because I can understand how tempting the "if only he was leader of the opposition" reaction can be, but it's also wrong - if Mick Lynch had Kier Starmer's job, he'd probably still be doing it better than Starmer (not a high bar!), but he would not be saying exactly the same things he's saying now, because he'd be performing a different role.


ska invita said:


> can you vote for Labour leader with a community membership?


I believe this would've been covered extensively back in 2015, what was that one dickhead MP who joined UC and then sued Unite for defamation or something? Anyway, last time round you could, don't know if that's been changed.
ETA: Anna Turley, that was the fucker I was thinking of. Anyway, think you can but I wouldn't recommend it as being a good reason for joining?


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 23, 2022)

Elpenor said:


> Some perspectives from striking (or potentially striking in the future) public sector workers
> 
> 
> 
> ...


From that article:


> The most important reason for me to put a yes on my ballot paper is the proposed loss of maintenance staff within Network Rail. Believe me, this loss will be the downfall of our railway. I should know, I nearly died in the Hatfield crash.
> 
> On 17 October 2000, I was having a normal day working as a host, then my life changed. The train I was working on went over a damaged line at more than 100mph and it shattered beneath us, hurling everyone everywhere. As the train split, I was flung around like a rag doll, desperately trying to find something to hold on to. I’ll never forget those terrifying minutes.
> 
> ...


Worth stressing again and again if you encounter anyone parroting the boss/government line about overpaid train drivers or whatever, do people really want to see a loss of railway maintenance staff?


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 23, 2022)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Mick Lynch is a very impressive man, been making fools out of politicos and journos


Love him 🤩


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jun 23, 2022)

ska invita said:


> " If the press continues to shut them out, the unions should put some money into giving them a platform: would a YouTube channel devoted to their voices be too expensive to run"
> 
> Unions have a lot of moneyand resources compared to pretty much everyone else on the left and their lack of dynamism and outreach is a gaping void in UK politics - so much potential.


It's getting better, but I feel like there's still a lot trade unions can do to engage with online and 'new media' opportunities.

That said, as has ben noted, the RMT Twitter account has been playing as good a game as their Gen Sec 

E2A:



ska invita said:


> I think its the GFTU who have a particualr remit for 'political education' (is that right?) - so little happens really.


I've been our branch's Union Learning Rep/Branch Education Officer for years, but tbh it's been little more than in name only for most of that time. But, as it happens, we literally had a meeting today about divvying up a new pool of facility time, and fingers crossed some might be coming my way. Had never heard of GFTU (naturally, I keep reading it as GTFO   ), but political education is high on my list of targets, so will check 'em out   Wanna shift that damned Overton window for our branch


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 23, 2022)

Calamity1971 said:


> Love him 🤩



Looks like it's fake. Still love him.


----------



## Boris Sprinkler (Jun 23, 2022)

cd ..


----------



## David Clapson (Jun 23, 2022)

Maybe I'm biased, but as each day passes with this dispute at the top of the news, Starmer looks even less relevant than he was before. Where's the leadership? How can Labour have nothing to say about the working poor? The party needs to change the leader fast. Starmer needs to be told to resign.


----------



## Petcha (Jun 23, 2022)

Lynch is on Question Time tonight


----------



## tim (Jun 23, 2022)

Petcha said:


> Apparently he also looks like someone else. Something which has got right up Piers Morgan's nose. Probably the most pointless 'interview' hes ever conducted.





Are these aging journalists cryptoMarxists seeking to make a fairly ordinary trade union leader look like the most intelligent person in the country? Or are they all just past it?


----------



## tim (Jun 23, 2022)

David Clapson said:


> Maybe I'm biased, but as each day passes with this dispute at the top of the news, Starmer looks even less relevant than he was before. Where's the leadership? How can Labour have nothing to say about the working poor? The party needs to change the leader fast. Starmer needs to be told to resign.


Yes, down with this kind of thing!

I think, however, you are wasting your outrage as there are very few posters here who actually support Sir Sheith and no posters here whose advice he would consider listening to.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 23, 2022)

Speaking of the RMT running rings around people, have we had this yet?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jun 23, 2022)




----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 23, 2022)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


>



Journalists ( loose term) across the UK must shit it when they find out they've got to interview him  .


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Jun 23, 2022)

Calamity1971 said:


> Journalists ( loose term) across the UK must shit it when they find out they've got to interview him  .




That Kay Burley, definition of pwned.


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 23, 2022)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> That Kay Burley, definition of pwned.


Not often she gets trounced like that. 
All of them are now on the back foot before he even starts 🤣.


----------



## Petcha (Jun 23, 2022)

He's getting a bit of a pounding on QT


----------



## locomotive (Jun 23, 2022)

Petcha said:


> He's getting a bit of a pounding on QT



Now he's generalising the argument he might get back on the front foot.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 23, 2022)

Petcha said:


> He's getting a bit of a pounding on QT


QT is always a stitch up.


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 23, 2022)

Petcha said:


> He's getting a bit of a pounding on QT


At least he's got the business man bloke on his side. Tory heavy audience as per. 
Rachel McLean should do gurning lessons.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 23, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> QT is always a stitch up.



I normally _hate _lefties whining about the QT audiences, but this lot really do take the biscuit. So far we’ve been told that it’s monstrous that anyone should complain about pay cuts or being made redundant, some stupid cunt banging on about a rail expo, some posh loudmouth twat (who needs smacking) shouting down someone who actually works on the railway to stop him explaining how the industry is actually organised, Fiona Bruce stepping in as a Tory party spokesperson and some snarky Tory openly lying about what a letter says and then reading it out to prove she’s lying.….I was in a good mood before I watched this shit as well.


----------



## brogdale (Jun 23, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> I normally _hate _lefties whining about the QT audiences, but this lot really do take the biscuit. So far we’ve been told that it’s monstrous that anyone should complain about pay cuts or being made redundant, some stupid cunt banging on about a rail expo, Fiona Bruce stepping in as a Tory party spokesperson and some snarky Tory openly lying about what a letter says and then reading it out to prove she’s lying. Christ….


The tumbleweed moments that have followed every contribution from Lynch is pretty remarkable.


----------



## two sheds (Jun 23, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> I normally _hate _lefties whining about the QT audiences, but this lot really do take the biscuit. So far we’ve been told that it’s monstrous that anyone should complain about pay cuts or being made redundant, some stupid cunt banging on about a rail expo, some posh loudmouth twat (who needs smacking) shouting down someone who actually works on the railway to stop him explaining how the industry is actually organised, Fiona Bruce stepping in as a Tory party spokesperson and some snarky Tory openly lying about what a letter says and then reading it out to prove she’s lying. Christ….


I _hate _lefties whining about the QT audiences


----------



## two sheds (Jun 23, 2022)

Have we had this?


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 23, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> some stupid cunt banging on about a rail expo,


It's a toss up between her and the other stupid angry cunt on about dinasours. 
Fuck me, thought last week was gammon heavy.


----------



## Petcha (Jun 23, 2022)

Tbf, it was just a grotesque accident it was scheduled in Stratford-upon-Avon tonight and not somewhere a little more representative of the country. That was pretty gross.

The Tory minister at the end, after the lady in the audience told of her mother dying of Covid and not being able to spend the last five weeks of her life with her and as a result she would never vote Tory again. 'I'll meet you in the Kingfisher tomorrow to talk about it' or words to that effect, with a little smirk. Yccch.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 23, 2022)

I haven't watched QT for about 4 or 5 years tbh . Poor old Mick must be thinking 'every day I speak to members of my union who by and large are normal people and I've agreed to turn up to a tv program at which a good 90% are hand picked certified lunatics which includes at least two thirds of the panel'. The Tory is ripe for a kicking but the jelly like Labour bloke (who apparently is a barrister) is just a tepid windbag, the CEO of Starling Bank is in cuckoo land and the bombastic business bloke is just a ranter. The chair's main job is just to man mark Mick Lynch , trip him up and disrupt any flow of what he's trying to say.


----------



## two sheds (Jun 23, 2022)

This is cogent, too (entitled "Why the RMT are on strike"):


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 24, 2022)




----------



## YouSir (Jun 24, 2022)

QT and the like are completely pointless, can see why he'd go on but other than Tory headbangers and point counting Centrists no one pays any attention to it. Let it rot away and focus on platforms that actually allow points to be made properly.


----------



## two sheds (Jun 24, 2022)

Revealed: Top rail firms’ pre-strike payout to shareholders
					

CEOs of the six biggest train companies also took home a combined salary of more than £5m in 2020




					www.opendemocracy.net
				




here's another surprise


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 24, 2022)

two sheds said:


> Revealed: Top rail firms’ pre-strike payout to shareholders
> 
> 
> CEOs of the six biggest train companies also took home a combined salary of more than £5m in 2020
> ...


I take it you were being sarcastic sheds  .


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 24, 2022)

Is right


----------



## oryx (Jun 24, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Is right



I saw him, and whoever tweeted that is bang on!


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 24, 2022)

oryx said:


> I saw him, and whoever tweeted that is bang on!


He got way too much airtime.


----------



## flypanam (Jun 24, 2022)

It’s telling that the audience were all small business owners as they all seem to think that workers need to see the world as their employers tell them too.


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Jun 24, 2022)

I won’t bother with QT on iPlayer then. The audience sound like stupid cunts/Tory plants. And no interest in hearing what the revisionist pip squeak representing the Starmer clique has to say.


----------



## flypanam (Jun 24, 2022)

Jeff Robinson said:


> I won’t bother with QT on iPlayer then. The audience sound like stupid cunts/Tory plants. And no interest in hearing what the revisionist pip squeak representing the Starmer clique has to say.


It's kind of worth it for the dinosaur woman. swivel eyed loon personified.


----------



## Elpenor (Jun 24, 2022)

two sheds said:


> This is cogent, too (entitled "Why the RMT are on strike"):
> 
> View attachment 328720


I hadn’t seen this - worth noting that 10% for a night / weekend enhancement is more like 6% once you take off statutory deductions. It’s a disgraceful reduction in enhancements for shifts they have no choice but to do - therefore it’s a massive pay cut


----------



## philosophical (Jun 24, 2022)

Fiona Bruce is a Tory shill, I think she is a racist cunt as well (see her early appearances).
Two successive weeks of a stacked Tory audience, but it was funny when that Tory MP appeared with that ‘explosive’ letter that didn’t say what she said it did, and had to read it out to prove it.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 24, 2022)

So, what big events are planned for tomorrow? So far, I know about Liverpool:

Glasgow:

Manchester:

And Gillingham:


Sure there'll be stuff happening in other places as well?


----------



## Kev424242 (Jun 24, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Jun 24, 2022)

Dunno if this is better suited to here or the strikebreaking thread:








						Call to investigate safety violations on strike day | TSSA
					

Rail union TSSA is demanding an investigation into rail safety after reports of multiple trains being sent in the wrong direction and some attempting to leave stations when signals were on red during yesterday's strike.




					www.tssa.org.uk
				




If that's what it's like already, imagine what it'll be like if they actually do get agency staff with five minutes' training in?


----------



## muscovyduck (Jun 24, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Dunno if this is better suited to here or the strikebreaking thread:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I've been sounding like a loon this week at work saying that on top of everything else, I'm not getting on a train because I don't trust they're safe right now. But I don't know what anyone was expecting.


----------



## krink (Jun 24, 2022)

Always being told the Left can't meme but this is a banger


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jun 24, 2022)

muscovyduck said:


> I've been sounding like a loon this week at work saying that on top of everything else, I'm not getting on a train because I don't trust they're safe right now. But I don't know what anyone was expecting.



Signal passed at red should be an automatic step down of driver and investigation.


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 24, 2022)

London  underground worker have voted for further strike action


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 24, 2022)

Sheffield:

Swansea and Cardiff:








						UNISON Wales rallies send solidarity to striking rail workers | Article, News, Uncategorized | News | UNISON Cymru/Wales
					

UNISON Cymru/Wales is extending solidarity to all rail workers and the RMT union during its latest day of industrial action.




					cymru-wales.unison.org.uk
				





> To demonstrate your support on the third planned strike day, you can join rallies organised in Swansea and Cardiff this Saturday (June 25).
> 
> A rally organised by Swansea RMT No1 branch and Swansea Trades Council will take place outside Swansea railway station on Saturday at 9.00 am
> 
> A rally organised by Cardiff Trades Council will also take place in front of Cardiff Central Library on Saturday at 12noon.


Bit confused by why there doesn't seem to be anything happening in Newport but hey ho.


----------



## Dystopiary (Jun 24, 2022)

Spoiler: Cold War Steve





Alt text: Johnson, Raab and Richard Madeley hide under chairs at a large table. Johnson has no clothes on and is wedged under his chair. Mick Lynch stands the other side of the table, looking down at them.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 24, 2022)

Dickhead youtuber/livestreamer type complaining that he wanted to confront the RMT pickets but they were all gone before _8pm_. I mean, I'm not a fan of having to get up early either, but leaving it till 8 in the evening seems a bit extreme.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 24, 2022)

It is quite a smart move tbf, if I had publicly offered out the entire staff of one of the UK's largest train stations I would also be tempted to wait until everyone had gone home and then turn up and complain about them bottling it.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jun 24, 2022)




----------



## belboid (Jun 24, 2022)

I see there is now an official Mick Lynch T-shirt.  Shame it’s a bit…. shit


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Jun 24, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Is right



Oh christ that bloke was a proper cunt. As he was shouting I was thinking to myself 'I hope those people you congratulate yourself for employing are unionised and piss on your cornflakes'


----------



## BristolEcho (Jun 24, 2022)

Doctor Carrot said:


> Oh christ that bloke was a proper cunt. As he was shouting I was thinking to myself 'I hope those people you congratulate yourself for employing are unionised and piss on your cornflakes'


Owner of company against unions shocker.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 24, 2022)

belboid said:


> I see there is now an official Mick Lynch T-shirt.  Shame it’s a bit…. shit
> 
> View attachment 328792


I mean, I wouldn't wear it myself, but I quite like the 80s electropop vibe it has going?
I'm also enjoying the TMNT t-shirts Manchester RMT have made:


----------



## magneze (Jun 24, 2022)

magneze said:


> Perhaps we need to be talking about a "Profit Price Spiral"?


Grace Blakeley agrees: Don’t Blame Workers for Price Rises – Blame the Profiteers


----------



## BristolEcho (Jun 24, 2022)

Tomorrow in Bristol.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 25, 2022)

Pretty proud of my branch's turnout to support the RMT today, had four people from the branch committee come down but also had three just regular workers/rank and file union members who I'd never even met before turning up to show solidarity.


----------



## flypanam (Jun 25, 2022)




----------



## flypanam (Jun 25, 2022)

London today. Fair turnout maybe 500.


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Jun 25, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Jun 25, 2022)

Outsourced health workers striking in Blackpool and Blackburn next week:


----------



## BristolEcho (Jun 25, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Pretty proud of my branch's turnout to support the RMT today, had four people from the branch committee come down but also had three just regular workers/rank and file union members who I'd never even met before turning up to show solidarity.


Good turn out in Bristol too.


----------



## Dystopiary (Jun 25, 2022)

The Lord Chief Justice has been accused of trying to intimidate striking barristers. 

Paywall busted (from the Times 23/06/22. 



> In an open letter to Lord Burnett of Maldon, more than 70 of the country’s most experienced criminal lawyers objected to a message sent on Wednesday by the lord chief justice to crown court judges.
> Burnett told the judges that striking barristers should be referred to regulators for possible misconduct charges if they refused to attend court because of action organised by the Criminal Bar Association.
> 
> Criminal barristers voted last weekend to launch a complete boycott on appearing in new cases for three days a week over the next month.
> In his edict, Burnett also raised the prospect of striking barristers being financially penalised.


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jun 25, 2022)

Elpenor said:


> I hadn’t seen this - worth noting that 10% for a night / weekend enhancement is more like 6% once you take off statutory deductions. It’s a disgraceful reduction in enhancements for shifts they have no choice but to do - therefore it’s a massive pay cut




We’ve got a seriously fucked up economy when time and a half or double time at weekends and evenings has gone almost extinct to be replaced by gig work and zero hours, despite ever more of these low level wage places open let alone skilled employment jobs


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 25, 2022)




----------



## ska invita (Jun 25, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> View attachment 328802


sung to the tune of


----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 26, 2022)




----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 26, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>



Yeh but the labour party are not a serious party of government


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 26, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>


----------



## ska invita (Jun 26, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> View attachment 329041


probably not a picket line that tbf - an NHS demo I think
not trying to be a pedant but i doubt Lammy has ever been on a picket line - my mental note on him is he's right wing economically
ETA: I take that back, someone has found a picture of him on a picket! Anyway Lammy is long on the list.


----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 26, 2022)




----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 26, 2022)

ska invita said:


> probably not a picket line that tbf - an NHS demo I think
> not trying to be a pedant but i doubt Lammy has ever been on a picket line - my mental note on him is he's right wing economically
> ETA: I take that back, someone has found a picture of him on a picket! Anyway Lammy is long on the list.



His interview on Sunday Morning today was utterly despicable. Condemning BA workers demands to restore a 10% pay cut during the pandemic as ‘excessive’, no support for the RMT and a rewriting of history in respect of the origins of the name of the Labour Party.

He’s long been a shape shifting careerist  - adopting positions for personal advancement - but his condemnation of organised labour today was stomach turning


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 26, 2022)

from teh tweeter





presumably not the same caroline lucas who went scabbing during the council workers' strike in brighton a few years back...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 26, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>




I liked Demsey’s comment that he wouldn’t be taking lectures on modernisation from a Lord who doesn’t know end of a shovel from another. I liked the Lord’s pissy reaction even more.


----------



## Dystopiary (Jun 26, 2022)

Diane Abbott calls out Lammy's hypocrisy. Like Smokeandsteam says, a careerist.


----------



## PR1Berske (Jun 26, 2022)




----------



## Dystopiary (Jun 26, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>



"The Labour Party is the political wing of the labour movement" 

Er.....


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 26, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> from teh tweeter
> 
> View attachment 329065
> 
> ...


She has been careful to specify railway workers here


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jun 26, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>





Not terribly liberal of her


How big do these people think the army actually is?


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 26, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>



Er the lp might at best once have been the electoral wing of the labour movement.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 26, 2022)

Artaxerxes said:


> Not terribly liberal of her



not new liberal party policy









						Llanelli riots of 1911 - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 26, 2022)

.


----------



## Calamity1971 (Jun 26, 2022)

Excellent placard and wise words from his dad.


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 26, 2022)

Artaxerxes said:


> Not terribly liberal of her
> 
> 
> How big do these people think the army actually is?


It's more a case of how many of them run a railroad, I suspect not many. This is what is sticking in their craw of course. Railway workers are not easily replaced be it by soldiers or agency workers.


----------



## Elpenor (Jun 26, 2022)

Aren’t the army a bit busy also doing the commonwealths, wherever the next floods are, covid stuff (that’s over now I guess?) and the occasional bit of soldiering as well?


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jun 26, 2022)

Elpenor said:


> Aren’t the army a bit busy also doing the commonwealths, wherever the next floods are, covid stuff (that’s over now I guess?) and the occasional bit of soldiering as well?




150 thousand regulars and 30 thousand irregulars, to fill in for 40 thousand rail workers and all the other jobs the green lads do (check this do they do anything?)

I'm sure at least a hundred of the army have experience handling rail signals, what could possibly go wrong?


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 26, 2022)

Strike Map are fundraising to keep up with the amount of strikes they're mapping, and presumably increased traffic/bandwidth needs as well:


			https://actionnetwork.org/fundraising/save-strike-map-uk/


----------



## muscovyduck (Jun 26, 2022)

Are the rail strikes over for now or will they keep going?


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Jun 26, 2022)

muscovyduck said:


> Are the rail strikes over for now or will they keep going?


Yeah I was just wondering when the next strike dates would be. I'm sure the strike is not over yet.


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 26, 2022)

I'm sure I remember seeing something that mentioned July (which is like next weekend onwards)> Does the union have a mandate for more strikes or is going to need to re-ballot does anyone know?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 26, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> Yeah I was just wondering when the next strike dates would be. I'm sure the strike is not over yet.



Under the anti-union law a strike mandate is live for 6 months. Lynch said last week that this week they would pause and consult. I expect further dates will be announced at the end of the week. They will have to give the employer two weeks notice under the same laws.

Worth remembering that strike pay will need to be paid by the union for each day of action.


----------



## bimble (Jun 26, 2022)

I didn’t know that at all. Unions pay your wages when you’re on strike out of what the pot of subs?

ETA is it actually £1 a day ?


			Rule 22


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 26, 2022)

bimble said:


> I didn’t know that at all. Unions pay your wages when you’re on strike out of what the pot of subs?



In Unite we’ve got a £35M strike fund. All raised from members subs. It’s strike pay, not wages , and is capped at £70 per day. It’s sounds a lot but if you’ve got - say - 30,000 out for 3 days that’s a lot of money


----------



## bimble (Jun 26, 2022)

Looks like rmt is £1 a day. I had no idea.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jun 26, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> I'm sure I remember seeing something that mentioned July (which is like next weekend onwards)> Does the union have a mandate for more strikes or is going to need to re-ballot does anyone know?



There’s a mandate for both network rail and LU until Christmas I think. They have to give 2 weeks notice for a strike.


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 26, 2022)

bimble said:


> I didn’t know that at all. Unions pay your wages when you’re on strike out of what the pot of subs?


Out of the dispute fund, which you can contribute to here:








						National Dispute Fund
					





					www.rmt.org.uk
				




Rules vary from union to union.

I feel like the RMT's strike pay must be more than £1 per day, but then I'm not an RMT member and have never directly asked?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jun 26, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Out of the dispute fund, which you can contribute to here:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You don’t get anything from the Union for being on strike. I’m led to believe there’s hardship funds that can be applied for for those most harshly affected though.


----------



## bimble (Jun 26, 2022)

It must be right? I fecking hope so but if it’s really this

it’s amazing properly heroic that people are doing it somehow regardless.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 26, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Out of the dispute fund, which you can contribute to here:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The press are reporting the RMT hardship fund is paying £70 per day for last weeks action


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jun 26, 2022)

Could well be missing something, but what's the point of £1 a day 

For ref., earlier this year it was £50 per day for UNISON members during the HE action.


----------



## The39thStep (Jun 26, 2022)

I have been in strikes where there have been hardship payments ( but only for those in dire need)  but I've never received money for going on strike.


----------



## Elpenor (Jun 26, 2022)

Artaxerxes said:


> I'm sure at least a hundred of the army have experience handling rail signals, what could possibly go wrong?



Anecdata but from my time supporting the rail industry it’s quite common to see ex-military go into rail jobs, in my former customer’s case this was building and maintaining the new fleet of HST but yeah not the other way round !


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 26, 2022)

likewise - don't think i've been on anything more than one day strikes when in NALGO / UNISON and didn't get anything.   think there was a hardship fund or something like that, but it was a while ago now...

(and now i'm back in local government / unison, i hope they hang on long enough at least for me to have passed the 6 month probation before there's a strike...)


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jun 26, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> I have been in strikes where there have been hardship payments ( but only for those in dire need)  but I've never received money for going on strike.


I'm not sure if technically it's _for_ going on strike... 

The £50 p/day we got this time round was voted on literally just ahead of the strike action. Before that it was only £25 p/day, and only after... the fourth? day of action, I think.

A lot of us did say "I can go without, give it to those who need it", but were basically told "no-one else will miss out if you take it, so you might as well". So, y'know, we did. Think some donated it elsewhere.


----------



## muscovyduck (Jun 26, 2022)

Cheers for answering everyone - I'm quite reliant on train service and as discussed am not interested in trying to use them when the strikes are on so I'm trying to plan around it.  Knowing there's more coming but there'll be two weeks warning is good info (although I think they should be allowed to strike when they want without warning)


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 26, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> I'm not sure if technically it's _for_ going on strike...
> 
> The £50 p/day we got this time round was voted on literally just ahead of the strike action. Before that it was only £25 p/day, and only after... the fourth? day of action, I think.
> 
> A lot of us did say "I can go without, give it to those who need it", but were basically told "no-one else will miss out if you take it, so you might as well". So, y'know, we did. Think some donated it elsewhere.


Yeah, that fits with what I've heard, the change from £25 after 4 or so days to £50 from day one is one that seems like it'll have a big impact on how far low-paid workers feel able to take action.


muscovyduck said:


> Cheers for answering everyone - I'm quite reliant on train service and as discussed am not interested in trying to use them when the strikes are on so I'm trying to plan around it.  Knowing there's more coming but there'll be two weeks warning is good info (although I think they should be allowed to strike when they want without warning)


I'm in a similar spot with wanting to be able to make plans, while also recognising it'd be good if they could just strike whenever. I probably use coaches more than trains anyway, but I imagine that coaches would also be a nightmare on a strike day.


----------



## Serge Forward (Jun 26, 2022)

Normally, nobody gets paid for being on strike (I never have) but there's usually a hardship fund to claim from.

Anyway, I've just donated.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Jun 27, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> I have been in strikes where there have been hardship payments ( but only for those in dire need)  but I've never received money for going on strike.



Same here and when we vote for action at Royal Mail (which I am sure we will) I don't  expect any strike pay.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## nino_savatte (Jun 27, 2022)

The RMT on the barristers' picket line.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jun 28, 2022)

The Government and the media are fond of quoting that rail workers have enjoyed £16bn worth of support during the pandemic. The rail workers, of course, haven’t received £16bn, their bosses have.

Here is where the money has gone. Almost all of it overseas, some of it directly in to the pockets of other government who maintain their own national railway and run services in the UK:


----------



## ddraig (Jun 28, 2022)

WTAF!!


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 28, 2022)

Looks like firefighters are thinking of strike action to, after being offered 2% rise,, looks like strikes across the broad then


----------



## Chilli.s (Jun 28, 2022)

Years of forced austerity whilst money syphoned away to big companies and friends of the government, its lucky that its only strikes. Continued erosion of rights and now modern scabbing is both provocative and foolhardy


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Jun 28, 2022)

Barbarian pub-land lord reportedly physically attacks striking workers


----------



## ska invita (Jun 28, 2022)

Unite secures ‘game changing’ pay deal for Heathrow cabin crew
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




*18 per cent deal sees wages for some CAE Crewing Services Ltd increase by nearly £5,000*


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 28, 2022)

Jeff Robinson said:


> Barbarian pub-land lord reportedly physically attacks striking workers



Freedom article here:








						Brighton: Striking pub worker assaulted by union-busting boss
					

A strike by pub workers in Brighton has turned violent with the aggressive union-busting landlord, Zakaria Abedi, physically assaulting one of the striking workers on Saturday night. The assault to…




					freedomnews.org.uk
				




Their strike fund is:








						SUPPORT PUB WORKERS' STRIKE IN BRIGHTON!
					

Donate to the strike fund for the Saint James Tavern strike in Brighton. Bar staff say poor working conditions are not ‘part of the job.'




					www.crowdfunder.co.uk
				




Next strike date is Saturday 2nd.
Also, just found this, which has a useful listing:








						Barristers and airlines strike - Councils too broke to pay minimum - Long covid ruled a disability
					

20 - 26 June 2022




					theweekinwork.substack.com
				




Can submit events here:








						The Week in Work's "What's Coming Up"
					

Do you have a strike, conference, court case, report launch or anything else coming up that you'd like me to include in The Week in Work's "What's Coming Up" section? Let me know by filling in the form below and I'll try to include as many as I can.   If you have any questions, please email...




					docs.google.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 30, 2022)

Jeff Robinson said:


> Barbarian pub-land lord reportedly physically attacks striking workers



If there are any London urbs who fancy a day out by the seaside on Saturday (edited because I remembered that it's not actually Friday today):


This Saturday we are heading back to Brighton to stand in solidarity with the heroic Saint James Tavern (SJT) workers on their second day of strike action.

It's really important as many of us go as possible because the SJT landlord's are not only victimising our members, they have also physically assaulted one of them.

We need to be there in large numbers, to show them our collective strength and to let the pub’s bosses know that UVW will not be intimidated!

We'll be heading there by train so that we arrive and come back as a group.

*When?* Saturday 2nd July - the train times are as follows:

12.29pm from Blackfriars station - arrives at Brighton at 1.43pm.

8.25pm from Brighton station - arrives at Blackfriars station at 9.41pm.

_We are offering 18 free train tickets to members who may have difficulty paying._

There will be a central meeting point and this will be shared with everyone who registers.

Before the picket we can enjoy some fish and chips on the beach. And after the picket will be party time!

Registration form here: London to Brighton strike train // Tren de la huelga de Londres a Brighton


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 30, 2022)

I would've thought that everyone at Royal Mail was in CWU, but it seems not:








						Royal Mail managers vote to strike over threats to 542 jobs, pay and working conditions
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




More successful ballots on the railways:








						Avanti West Coast railway staff vote for further strikes | ITV News
					

More travel disruption could be on the cards for passengers, as members of the TSSA - who work for Avanti West Coast - voted to strike over pay and conditions. | ITV National News




					www.itv.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jun 30, 2022)

In Unison news, refuse workers just voted to strike over pay in Harlow:








						Harlow refuse workers vote for strike action | Article, News | News | UNISON National
					

The outsourced workers delivered a resounding 'yes' to strike action against a pay offer that fails to keep track with the cost of living




					www.unison.org.uk
				




And care workers at St Monica in the southwest are due to walk out:








						St Monica care staff begin strike over fire and rehire plans - UNISON South West
					

Staff employed by Bristol-based care company St Monica Trust are to begin a series of strikes today over threats to sack them if they don’t accept a pay cut.




					southwest.unison.org.uk
				




They have a thing about how to donate to their strike fund but of course they've not gone as far as making it possible to donate online, just bank transfer or cheque:








						Donate to the St Monica Trust strike fund - UNISON South West
					

The current cost of living crisis will have an impact on our ability to undertake effective strike action. It’s going to be vital that we’re able to support our members, many of whom are low paid. We have a healthy fighting fund but the more available, the longer and harder we can fight. Union...




					southwest.unison.org.uk
				




Mick Lynch has been doing his best to put his fifteen minutes of fame to good use, recording a message of support for the St Monica care workers:








						Striking care staff bolstered by support from Mick Lynch - UNISON South West
					

The RMT union sent care staff a video message of support.




					southwest.unison.org.uk
				




And showing up at the picket line for striking GMB hospital workers:





						RMT boss Mick Lynch joins striking hospital workers in South London
					

GMB union members at St George’s Hospital were visited on the picket line by Mick Lynch




					www.gmb-southern.org.uk
				



Make your own GMB/GMB jokes, I suppose.


----------



## Bingoman (Jun 30, 2022)

Bt workers the latest to vote for strike action


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Jun 30, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I would've thought that everyone at Royal Mail was in CWU, but it seems not:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No our delivery office mangers, assistant mangers and cover managers are in Unite. Two of them have been reclassified as trainee mangers and one of those has seen a loss of approx £11k per annum as a result...to say they are disappointed would be something of an understatement.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

p.s. CWU ballot paper posted off with a big cross in the yes to strike action box.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jun 30, 2022)

The summer of bosses’ piss takes.


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 1, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> In Unison news, refuse workers just voted to strike over pay in Harlow:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Bristol wobs have made this handy graphic of picket times and places for the care workers' strike:

You might think it should be Unison's job to make that graphic, since it's Unison who are actually striking, but ho hum (having checked, there's a Unison one that lists the dates but not the places).
Strike rally tomorrow:

And a google doc where you can sign up/indicate availability to visit the pickets here.


----------



## BristolEcho (Jul 1, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Bristol wobs have made this handy graphic of picket times and places for the care workers' strike:
> View attachment 329911
> You might think it should be Unison's job to make that graphic, since it's Unison who are actually striking, but ho hum (having checked, there's a Unison one that lists the dates but not the places).
> Strike rally tomorrow:
> ...



Will be getting a long to one of these!


----------



## Kaka Tim (Jul 2, 2022)

Arriva thank passengers for patience as they confirm when bus services will return across Leeds and West Yorkshire

Leeds bus drivers suspend strike to vote on significantly improved pay offer. looks like a win to chalk up.


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 3, 2022)

Short clips of the outsourced OCS strikers in Blackburn and Blackpool:




Also, some good news from UVW:








						Strike averted as cleaners win inflation-busting pay rise
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				




And seems like they properly closed that pub down in Brighton yesterday:


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jul 3, 2022)




----------



## tim (Jul 5, 2022)

ska invita said:


> probably not a picket line that tbf - an NHS demo I think
> not trying to be a pedant but i doubt Lammy has ever been on a picket line - my mental note on him is he's right wing economically


Thankfully, there's at least one MP with a bit more socialist gumption.


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 5, 2022)

Background on the recent barristers' strike:








						Barristers on strike: why criminal lawyers are walking out – and what they really get paid
					

The barrister strike is about more than pay – with women and ethnic minorities leaving the profession, the entire justice system is at stake.




					theconversation.com
				




Merseyside bus strikes this week:








						Stagecoach Merseyside bus strikes set to go ahead
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



And more northwest bus strikes to come:








						North West facing Arriva bus strikes over ‘pitiful’ pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## teqniq (Jul 6, 2022)

Scumbags:


----------



## Chilli.s (Jul 6, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Scumbags:



This is starting to smell like the management/government unwilling to negotiate strikes of the olden days.


----------



## teqniq (Jul 6, 2022)

I think that was always going to be the intention.


----------



## Chilli.s (Jul 6, 2022)

teqniq said:


> I thinks that was always going to be the intention.


And like the strikes of old it leaves the country in a weaker state and ruins a load of peoples lives. Shit politics only of use to the super rich


----------



## teqniq (Jul 6, 2022)

This is completely taking the piss as well:











						BT staff to strike after ‘weak, insulting’ pay deal
					

BT employees will go on strike following a “weak, insulting” pay deal that fails to counter the impact of high inflation.




					www.telecomstechnews.com


----------



## teqniq (Jul 6, 2022)

Bit of good news here:

Unite secures up to 17.5% pay boost for 1,000 Cadbury workers


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 6, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Bit of good news here:
> 
> Unite secures up to 17.5% pay boost for 1,000 Cadbury workers


Sounds like a sweet deal.


----------



## PR1Berske (Jul 7, 2022)

Oops, wrong thread 😁


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 7, 2022)

UNISON/RMT strike fundraiser event coming up in Bristol on Sunday:








						Headfirst Bristol
					

All Bristol's gigs, clubnights and electronic music. Staff picks, event recommendations & online ticket shop.




					www.headfirstbristol.co.uk


----------



## Elpenor (Jul 7, 2022)

BA check in staff strike off according to an airmiles blog quoting unite website - details not yet known but a vastly improved pay offer and Union recommending acceptance 









						British Airways check-in staff strikes scrapped as airline accepts union demands
					

According to a statement on the Unite union website, the industrial dispute between British Airways and its check-in staff at Heathrow has been suspended.




					www.headforpoints.com


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 8, 2022)

Toss-up betwen this thread and the bandwidth one, but:


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 9, 2022)

Mick Lynch at the Durham Gala


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 11, 2022)




----------



## The39thStep (Jul 11, 2022)

You say tax cuts we say wage rises 






						ASLEF Ballot Results: Train Drivers to Strike | ASLEF
					

ASLEF members at eight train companies have voted overwhelmingly for strike action in a dispute over pay




					aslef.org.uk


----------



## The39thStep (Jul 11, 2022)

Getting one of these...


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 11, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> Getting one of these...



In tie-dye?

ETA: they do have a pretty solid range of designs:


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jul 11, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> In tie-dye?



Seems to be making a resurgence, fuck knows why


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 11, 2022)

Saint James' Tavern workers vote for a further 20 strike days:


----------



## belboid (Jul 13, 2022)

Another one for journalists at the Daily Express to work themselves into a frenzy over.  

Workers are balloting for action demanding a greater than 3% pay rise at (checks notes) the Daily Express!


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 13, 2022)

belboid said:


> Another one for journalists at the Daily Express to work themselves into a frenzy over.
> 
> Workers are balloting for action demanding a greater than 3% pay rise at (checks notes) the Daily Express!


Journos or cleaner/security type roles?

New Saint James Tavern strike dates announced, starting on Saturday 23rd:








						Brighton pub workers defy violent union-busting by issuing fresh strike dates
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk
				



Fundraiser happening in Brighton that night:

And online strike solidarity meeting tomorrow night:








						SAINT JAMES TAVERN SOLIDARITY MEETING
					

Workers at Saint James Tavern have just announced the second wave of strike dates in their fight against the bosses, and they need all hands on deck to support their campaign.   Join us at a solidarity and strategy meeting on THURSDAY 14TH JULY at 6:30 PM to discuss what you can do to support...




					docs.google.com
				



Big round-up thing from Strike Map and Novara here:








						Everything You Need to Know About Hot Strike Summer | Novara Media
					

As inflation sky-rockets and the cost of living bites, industrial action is on the rise. Here’s where it’s going to be kicking off over the coming months.




					novaramedia.com


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Jul 14, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Jul 14, 2022)

Next RMT strike date announced as July 27:


			RMT calls 24 hours strike action in national rail dispute
		


Also, just realised that the upcoming Royal Mail managers' strike/work to rule:








						Royal Mail managers announce strike dates over cuts to 700 jobs and pay
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



is definitely going to fuck with our members getting their postal ballots on time.  It's like rain on your wedding day, etc.


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 15, 2022)

Next dates beyond the 27nd announced as 18 and 20 August:


			National rail strikes set for 18 and 20 August
		


National RMT also now selling solidarity merch for the strike fund, although it's not quite as stylish as the Manchester branch:





						Home | RMT
					






					www.rmt-shop.org.uk


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 15, 2022)

My loyalty is being tested with those dates! On one I'm supposed to be going to Milton Keynes, and another is my birthday!   



hitmouse said:


> Also, just realised that the upcoming Royal Mail managers' strike/work to rule:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's a bugger, though. I guess there's no real easy way to coordinate this sort of thing.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jul 15, 2022)

Very significant intervention from Sharon Graham. The Tory strategy of beating up the RMT as a warning to public sector unions has already backfired with the RMT ‘winning the battle for public opinion’ (or maybe ordinary people are actually able to make their own minds up and recognise a legitimate dispute and organised section of the working class on the front foot when they see it).

Since then the Tory rhetoric has been palpably dialled down. Their assessment being that public sector strikes will occur but be largely noisy and lacking in leverage or ability to hamper the flow of capital.

The arrival on a mass scale, and in strategic sectors, of private sector workers into the fray  - many of whom work in jobs where there is leverage and where withdrawal of our labour _does affect capital - _would be a game changer. Graham is 100% correct to make plain that corporate profit is rampaging. She’s also right to make clear that stewards must adopt the bargaining position that where bosses are making profit then pay _rises _must be tabled. In 2022 Unite have been involved in 362 disputes covering 63,000 members, resulting in over £50 million being extracted from capital and paid to our side.









						Unite boss warns tens of thousands could strike over pay
					

The head of the UK's biggest union warns of a 'summer of discontent' as living costs soar.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 15, 2022)

IWGB strike next week:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jul 15, 2022)

Eddie Dempsey of the RMT telling it like is again:


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 18, 2022)

Merseyside Stagecoach pay dispute is settled:








						Unite secures substantial pay increase to end Stagecoach Merseyside pay dispute
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Royal Mail managers action is suspended pending further talks:








						Unite suspends three day strike at Royal Mail as talks continue
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## belboid (Jul 19, 2022)

CWU vote 'overwhelmingly' for action









						Royal Mail workers to go on strike over pay
					

More than 115,000 Royal Mail workers will walk out after members backed strike action on Tuesday.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Jul 19, 2022)

97.6% in favour on a 77% turnout; I am a very proud CWU member this afternoon.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Jul 19, 2022)

Here's the CWU announcement of the ballot result; some interesting comments on public mood, cooperation/coordination between unions and the need for more general change. It starts at about 8.15 mins in.



Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 19, 2022)

Any idea what strike dates could be? I think two weeks' notice is the minimum?


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Jul 19, 2022)

No strike days announced yet; the CWU are waiting for management's response to the ballot (both turn out and scale of yes) before they show our hand. The result lasts for 6 months, so includes the whole Christmas period; the two weeks notice period is correct. So watch this space.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 23, 2022)

Some stuff for the next RMT strike date:
Fundraiser run by Unite Hospitality Glasgow branch on the 26th:








						Strike - Fundraising Event
					

An event supported by Unite Hospitality Glasgow Branch in solidarity with workers striking.




					www.eventbrite.co.uk
				




Picket listings for South Wales and the southwest:

RMT demo at Network Rail's Glasgow offices on the 27th:


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 25, 2022)

Yorkshire pickets for Wednesday:


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 25, 2022)

Scotland pickets:

Northeast (not great quality, maybe there's a pixel shortage happening on Tyneside or something):

Northwest:


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 25, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Scotland pickets:
> View attachment 334394
> Northeast (not great quality, maybe there's a pixel shortage happening on Tyneside or something):
> View attachment 334396
> ...


the trick is to press ctrl and + to enlarge the display and then use the snipping tool


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 25, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> the trick is to press ctrl and + to enlarge the display and then use the snipping tool


This doesn't seem much better, it's just blurry but larger?


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 25, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> This doesn't seem much better, it's just blurry but larger?
> View attachment 334404


it's an improvement


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 26, 2022)

Tribune are running an online strike rally at 7 this evening, which sounds quite good, in so far as these online events are ever any good, but think you need to be on twitter for it so fuck that. Link is:


			https://twitter.com/i/spaces/1DXxyDjblleJM?s=20
		




> Join us *tonight at 7pm on Twitter* for a strike solidarity rally!
> 
> This week kicks off one of the biggest runs of national strike actions in decades, with rail workers, engineers and call centre workers across the country hitting picket lines. We'll be joined by *RMT's Eddie Dempsey* and *CWU's Dave Ward* to hear the stories behind those fights.
> 
> ...


----------



## brogdale (Jul 27, 2022)

Saw this crap...



and noticed that CWS had re-tweeted this gem...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jul 27, 2022)

Another win for workers in the private sector after collective action. This time the Yorkshire bus workers: 









						Bus strike: Yorkshire Arriva workers accept 'vastly improved' pay offer
					

A long-running strike by Arriva bus workers in parts of Yorkshire ends after a pay deal is agreed.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## PR1Berske (Jul 27, 2022)

Mick Lynch calls for a general strike if Liz Truss becomes PM and cracks down harder on unions
					

Commuters are facing widespread disruption on the rail network due to strike action today




					inews.co.uk


----------



## belboid (Jul 27, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


> Mick Lynch calls for a general strike if Liz Truss becomes PM and cracks down harder on unions
> 
> 
> Commuters are facing widespread disruption on the rail network due to strike action today
> ...


Damn right, we’ll have no other choice.  Tho I imagine several unions (hello Unison) would have to be dragged from their deep slumbers to join in.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 27, 2022)

belboid said:


> Damn right, we’ll have no other choice.  Tho I imagine several unions (hello Unison) would have to be dragged from their deep slumbers to join in.


Below the thunders of the upper deep
Far far beneath in the abysmal sea
His ancient, dreamless, uninvaded sleep
The Unison sleepeth...


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 27, 2022)

Very basic and, at this point moot, question : is it crossing the RMT picket line if you use other transport methods to get to work?


----------



## teqniq (Jul 27, 2022)

Unison stepping up to the plate here in Wales:









						Biggest Welsh NHS union to ballot for industrial action over pay
					

NHS staff with the biggest healthcare union in Wales will be balloted for industrial action over pay.




					www.thenational.wales


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 27, 2022)

belboid said:


> Damn right, we’ll have no other choice.  Tho I imagine several unions (hello Unison) would have to be dragged from their deep slumbers to join in.


I mean, I don't disagree with him, but is he basically just doing trot-style rhetoric here? Like, would there be any potential legal route for strike action against anti-union laws, or is this suggesting strike action going beyond the framework of the law? Which I'd certainly welcome, but dunno how plausible it is.


Lord Camomile said:


> Very basic and, at this point moot, question : is it crossing the RMT picket line if you use other transport methods to get to work?


I'd say no, unless you're going to your job driving scab trains or similar?


----------



## brogdale (Jul 27, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I mean, I don't disagree with him, but is he basically just doing trot-style rhetoric here?


FWIW, on tonight's C4News he made a more nuanced call for "generalised" strikes from Unions whose members were being offered real-terms pay cuts (ie. all) and appeared to concede that 'only the TUC" could call a General Strike.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 27, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I'd say no, unless you're going to your job driving scab trains or similar?


Ahhhh, fuck  But they offered me the chance to drive the big choo-choo as I was walking past the station! They let me wear the hat and everything!



A'ight, coolsies. I _kinda _figured not, but travel's a weird one.


----------



## PR1Berske (Jul 27, 2022)




----------



## PR1Berske (Jul 27, 2022)




----------



## PR1Berske (Jul 28, 2022)




----------



## ska invita (Jul 28, 2022)

General strike actually a possibility for the first time in my adult life time..


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 28, 2022)

ska invita said:


> General strike actually a possibility for the first time in my adult life time..


bring it on


----------



## ska invita (Jul 28, 2022)

was looking for a link - BBC not reporting this one - right wing press quite excited by it though









						Union leader issues threat of UK general strike as rail crisis grows
					

Aslef members vote for August action, while RMT chief says he will call for general strike if anti-union plans go ahead




					www.theguardian.com
				











						Mick Lynch calls for GENERAL STRIKE if Liz Truss tries to curb unions
					

General secretary of the RMT Mick Lynch has called for a general strike if Liz Truss becomes Prime Minister and brings in legislation to halt strikes affecting the country.




					www.dailymail.co.uk
				











						Union boss threatens general strike on Britain as 24-hour rail walkout starts
					

UNION baron Mick Lynch last night threatened to inflict a general strike on Britain as a 24-hour rail stoppage begins today. The RMT boss vowed to drag the “entire trade union movement” into a 1926…




					www.thesun.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 28, 2022)

Tribune have a big new Lynch interview up:








						Mick Lynch: ‘It’s No Good Being Pissed Off – We Need Organisation’
					

Tribune sits down with the RMT's Mick Lynch to discuss the national rail strike, his viral television appearances – and how workers can come together to topple Britain's super-rich elite.




					tribunemag.co.uk


----------



## belboid (Jul 28, 2022)

Have we had Felixstowe docks yet?

Unite Press Release

For immediate release Thursday 28 July 2022

Massive 92 per cent yes vote for strike action at Felixstowe Docks

5% pay offer rejected as company profits top £60m and shareholders get a ‘bonanza pay out’

Standstill looming at UK’s largest container port

Felixstowe, the UK’s largest container port, is set to come to a standstill next month after members of Unite, the UK’s leading union, overwhelmingly backed strike action in a dispute over pay.

Unite members at Felixstowe are responsible for all aspects of the port's operation. The workers recorded a 92 per cent vote for industrial action on an 81 per cent turnout.

The dispute is a result of the Felixstowe Dock and Railway Company offering a pay increase of just five per cent to its workers. This is an effective pay cut with the real (RPI) rate of inflation currently standing at 11.9 per cent. Last year the workforce received a below inflation pay increase of 1.4 per cent.

Unite general secretary Sharon Graham said: “The bottom line is this is an extremely wealthy company that can fully afford to give its workers a pay rise. Instead it chose to give bonanza pay outs to shareholders touching £100 million.

“Unite is focused on defending the jobs, pay and conditions of its members and we will giving 100 per cent support to our members at Felixstowe.

“Workers should not be paying the price for the pandemic with a pay cut. Unite has undertaken 360 disputes in a matter of months and we will do all in our power to defend workers.”'

Strike action would bring Felixstowe to a standstill and would cause major logistical problems for maritime and road haulage transport entering the port.  Felixstowe is responsible for 48 per cent of the UK’s container trade.

The Felixstowe Dock and Railway Company is extremely profitable; its most recent accounts show that it made pre-tax profits of £61 million in 2020, when it also paid out £99 million in dividends.

The company’s dividends are paid into a complicated company structure but are principally received by the organisation’s ultimate holding company, CK Hutchison Holdings Ltd. It is registered in the Cayman Islands and listed on the Hong Kong stock exchange.

Unite regional officer Miles Hubbard said: “Strike action at Felixstowe will inevitably create huge disruption across the UK’s supply chain.

“This dispute is of Felixstowe’s own making. Strike dates have yet to be announced but even at this late stage the dispute could be resolved by the company returning to negotiations and making a realistic offer.”

ENDS


----------



## oryx (Jul 28, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Tribune have a big new Lynch interview up:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's a great interview, well worth a read.

This particularly resonated with me:



> The labour movement in its broadest sense, magazines like yours, along with the trade unions, we’ve just got to say, ‘We’ve got permanent values and they don’t change because of the political landscape.’ That might be decent wages or a charter for workers and those out of work that can’t be changed. Minimum standards that are legislated for or enforced by collective bargaining. Council houses, public ownership, we’ve got to keep talking about these permanent values.


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 29, 2022)

Wildcat strike at Bury food firm as staff clash with management
					

"People are tired, exhausted, and just want to have proper breaks - drink, rest"




					www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 29, 2022)

Bit late now, but useful for Monday:








						LOCATION DETAILS: National BT Strike Picket Lines
					

COMMUNICATION WORKERS UNION  28/7/2022  OPS NOTE: BT STRIKE PICKETS  TIME: 7AM ONWARDS   You are invited to join striking BT Group workers, who will be holding hundreds of picket lines across the country tomorrow (Friday 29th July) and Monday (1st August).  Please find enclosed a list of p




					www.cwu.org


----------



## ska invita (Jul 29, 2022)

Is there any truth to the notion that there is a generational shift happening amongst big union leadership (i.e. boomers fading out)? Read someone say so the other day


----------



## muscovyduck (Jul 29, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Is there any truth to the notion that there is a generational shift happening amongst big union leadership (i.e. boomers fading out)? Read someone say so the other day


I'm in my mid 20s and feels like there's been a wave of people my age suddenly upping their involvement in their unions. But presumably the same for other age groups?


----------



## teqniq (Jul 29, 2022)

.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Jul 29, 2022)

teqniq said:


> .




Stunning victory. This was a hard fight and long battle against a reactionary labour council determined to defeat its own workers and attempting to victimise stewards (plus we had Starmer’s infamous sneer about the city). Absolutely made up for the lads and lasses on the bins in Coventry. Up the fucking workers!!!!


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jul 29, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Jul 29, 2022)

Local government workers vote for strikes across Scotland - UNISON Scotland
					

Thousands of council workers across Scotland have voted to take industrial action which will disrupt schools, early years centres, nurseries




					unison-scotland.org
				




Local government workers got past the threshold in City of Glasgow, Orkney Islands Council, Aberdeenshire Council, East Renfrewshire Council, North Lanarkshire Council, South Lanarkshire Council, Clackmannanshire Council, Stirling Council, Inverclyde.

Joint statement from Unison/Unite/GMB here:










						Waste ‘could pile high’ as Scottish council workers vote for strike action
					

THERE are warnings “waste could pile high” in local authorities across Scotland after two trade unions confirmed their members will walk out…




					www.thenational.scot
				




Sounds like Unite got over the threshold in 26 councils:








						Council workers vote for strike action in pay dispute
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## PR1Berske (Jul 30, 2022)

> 39m ago12.47
> Hitachi rail workers to strike from Sunday​Hitachi rail workers will strike for three days from Sunday in a row over pay and conditions.
> 
> Members of the Rail, Maritime and Transport union (RMT), whose jobs include maintenance, are in dispute over pay and issues including breaks, leave entitlement and shift length.
> ...


----------



## Elpenor (Jul 30, 2022)

Good on them. This will be the maintenance staff for the newish high speed teams - its not clear which depots it will involve but when they were a client of mine they had depots along the East coast mainline and the great western route


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 30, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Local government workers vote for strikes across Scotland - UNISON Scotland
> 
> 
> Thousands of council workers across Scotland have voted to take industrial action which will disrupt schools, early years centres, nurseries
> ...



Unison he balloting for action atm, sent in my vote the other day


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 30, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> Unison he balloting for action atm, sent in my vote the other day


Yep, Unison balloting earlier than UCU in a rare example of them being the more proactive union, although otoh it might've been a good idea for them to wait a little while longer instead of running their HE ballot over the July/August period.
Although Novara's "essential guide to the next few months of industrial action" still lists UCU as the only union balloting in HE, despite the fact that they're not actually balloting yet.  Come to think of it, said guide also doesn't seem to mention local government workers at all.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 30, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Yep, Unison balloting earlier than UCU in a rare example of them being the more proactive union, although otoh it might've been a good idea for them to wait a little while longer instead of running their HE ballot over the July/August period.
> Although Novara's "essential guide to the next few months of industrial action" still lists UCU as the only union balloting in HE, despite the fact that they're not actually balloting yet.  Come to think of it, said guide also doesn't seem to mention local government workers at all.


I'm not persuaded the Unison leadership wants a strike


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 30, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> I'm not persuaded the Unison leadership wants a strike


It is the sort of thing where I try not to get too into conspiracy theories, but after they managed to run the 2020 pay offer ballot in July/August 2021(!), then the 2021 pay offer ballot over Christmas, and now this year's in July/August again, if they're not deliberately picking the worst possible times of year then they do seem to be having a run of very bad luck.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jul 30, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> It is the sort of thing where I try not to get too into conspiracy theories, but after they managed to run the 2020 pay offer ballot in July/August 2021(!), then the 2021 pay offer ballot over Christmas, and now this year's in July/August again, if they're not deliberately picking the worst possible times of year then they do seem to be having a run of very bad luck.


Many years ago when I was an su sabbatical I went on some nus training where I was told about ways to wreck meetings (I took them to be things to avoid) like having them when other people can't come, sending out the agenda at the last minute if at all, making someone useless chair and so on. Perhaps the Unison leadership received similar training in bygone years but saw it as something to emulate


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 30, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> Unison he balloting for action atm, sent in my vote the other day


Likewise 





hitmouse said:


> Yep, Unison balloting earlier than UCU in a rare example of them being the more proactive union, although otoh it might've been a good idea for them to wait a little while longer instead of running their HE ballot over the July/August period.
> Although Novara's "essential guide to the next few months of industrial action" still lists UCU as the only union balloting in HE, despite the fact that they're not actually balloting yet.  Come to think of it, said guide also doesn't seem to mention local government workers at all.





hitmouse said:


> It is the sort of thing where I try not to get too into conspiracy theories, but after they managed to run the 2020 pay offer ballot in July/August 2021(!), then the 2021 pay offer ballot over Christmas, and now this year's in July/August again, if they're not deliberately picking the worst possible times of year then they do seem to be having a run of very bad luck.



Official reasoning for the ballot timing is so that we have enough time to call action in September, which on the face of it I was glad to see they finally seemed to be thinking somewhat strategically.

Although yes, while I really have all but the most superficial knowledge of these things, routinely not impressed with UNISON hierarchy.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 30, 2022)

At the very least, HE action and campaigns very rarely seems to be high on UNISON's agenda or get much attention. Plus, just 'cause I take any opportunity to say it, their website's predominantly useless.


----------



## hitmouse (Jul 30, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Official reasoning for the ballot timing is so that we have enough time to call action in September, which on the face of it I was glad to see they finally seemed to be thinking somewhat strategically.
> 
> Although yes, while I really have all but the most superficial knowledge of these things, routinely not impressed with UNISON hierarchy.


I can see the logic of that, but it seems like the most important thing strategy-wise would be to coordinate action with UCU, and as I understand it the timetable UCU's gone for means that they won't have time to call action in September, so the choice for branches that get over the threshold will be to strike on their own, or to wait around until UCU's ballot is finished.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jul 30, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I can see the logic of that, but it seems like the most important thing strategy-wise would be to coordinate action with UCU, and as I understand it the timetable UCU's gone for means that they won't have time to call action in September, so the choice for branches that get over the threshold will be to strike on their own, or to wait around until UCU's ballot is finished.


: shrug :

The (lack of) coordination between UNISON and UCU, at a national and local level, continues to bemuse me.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 1, 2022)

Another dispute - this time Unite dockworkers-  in the private sector. 92% voting in favour of action over pay:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 1, 2022)

Lovely video from the Coventry bin strike:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 2, 2022)

RMT demo at Scottish Tory HQ in Edinburgh, Thursday 11 August:


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Aug 4, 2022)

Amazon warehouse staff in Tilbury walk out over 35p an hour pay rise
					

The GMB union claims the online retailer needs to "drastically improve pay and working conditions".



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 4, 2022)

Jeff Robinson said:


> Amazon warehouse staff in Tilbury walk out over 35p an hour pay rise
> 
> 
> The GMB union claims the online retailer needs to "drastically improve pay and working conditions".
> ...



On a grim day this is the best news I've heard by far. Up the fucking Amazon workers!


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 4, 2022)

Submit your strike report
					

by Notes from Below // Share your experience of a strike with Notes from Below and Strike Map




					notesfrombelow.org
				




(I sort of thought Notes from Below might be dead, but it seems not.)


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 4, 2022)

Q: What's better than an Amazon warehouse walkout? 

A: Two Amazon warehouse walkouts!









						Amazon Rugeley workers 'walk out over 50p pay rise offer'
					

A worker, who wishes to remain anonymous, said dozens of employees walked out at lunch time




					www.birminghammail.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 4, 2022)

Joint RMT/TSSA/Unite/Unison strike rally planned for Manchester on the 20th:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 5, 2022)

(Count from Sesame Street voice): Three! Three Amazon warehouse walkouts!









						Amazon staff in Coventry hold sit-in protest over pay offer
					

The GMB union says staff do not see the rise as enough but the firm says it is "competitive".



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




Sounds there's also stuff happening at Bristol:










						Amazon Workers in the UK Walk Out in a Cost-of-Living Rebellion
					

After news of a “pointless” pay increase spread, workers at three warehouses stopped work to demand higher wages as inflation and interest rates surge.




					www.wired.co.uk
				




AWW will be leafleting the Bristol site tomorrow morning:


Detailed report from Tilbury:








						Hundreds of Amazon Workers Stage Wildcat Strike Over ‘Kick in the Teeth’ Pay Offer | Novara Media
					

Workers at a gigantic Essex warehouse are protesting after being offered just 35p more per hour from the multinational.




					novaramedia.com


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Aug 5, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Q: What's better than an Amazon warehouse walkout?
> 
> A: Two Amazon warehouse walkouts!
> 
> ...



Four now









						Hundreds of Amazon warehouse workers stage wildcat strikes over 'pathetic' pay rise - The Big Issue
					

Workers at three Amazon warehouses have now downed tools in the wake of a protest at an Essex warehouse over a “pathetic” pay rise



					www.bigissue.com


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 5, 2022)

More Amazon. This is so brilliant and encouraging to see.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 6, 2022)

A first-hand report:








						Wildcat strike at Amazon
					

by An anonymous Amazon worker // A report of the recent wildcat strikes currently sweeping through Amazon warehouses in Britain, from a worker on the shopfloor.




					notesfrombelow.org


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 6, 2022)

It's frustratingly hard to find anything about this, but sounds like there's going to be a major construction wildcat starting on Wednesday:








						Warning to motorists as chemical workers plan major wildcat strike
					

The protests over pay and the cost of living crisis could affect routes around sites across Teesside next week




					www.gazettelive.co.uk
				








Bizarre that it sounds like there might be a national wildcat planned and the only coverage of it is one article in the Teesside local press warning it may cause traffic disruption? They say "They will be joined by thousands at refineries, factories and power plants across the UK" but that link just goes to the paper's "employment" tag.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 6, 2022)

More on Wednesday's action:








						Hundreds of workers at Grangemouth could be set for 'wildcat strike'
					

Around 500 maintenance and repairs staff could walk out.




					news.stv.tv


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 7, 2022)

Amazon action spreads to Dartford:








						Amazon workers hold 'slowdown' protest over 35p pay rise
					

Workers at an Amazon warehouse in Kent have joined others across the country in staging protests over pay and conditions inside centres.




					www.kentonline.co.uk


----------



## Serge Forward (Aug 7, 2022)

And Coalville, Leicestershire.
Amazon workers in Leicestershire walk out over 35p pay rise


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 7, 2022)

Report from Coventry:








						How the Amazon wildcat spread
					

by An anonymous Amazon worker in Coventry // In this report, a worker in Coventry tells us how they joined the current wave of wildcat strikes sweeping through Amazon warehouses in Britain.




					notesfrombelow.org


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 7, 2022)

London bus drivers organised through Unite due to strike on the same days as RMT tube/national rail strikes:








						London bus drivers set to strike on same days as Underground and rail workers | ITV News
					

The union said strike action was a result of the company offering a pay increase of 3.6% in 2022 and 4.2% next year. | ITV News London




					www.itv.com
				




Also, RMT calling for a day of protests to save ticket offices on Tuesday 23rd:


			Save ticket offices


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 7, 2022)

For those who aren't on tiktok, there's now a twitter account to follow:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 9, 2022)

Royal Mail strike dates announced:


(cue a huge sigh of relief from Unison HE reps, as the strike won't start until the very end of that ballot period)


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 9, 2022)

And again, it seems likely that tomorrow morning is going to see at least an attempt at a nationwide wildcat among engineering construction workers:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 9, 2022)

Also, two Unison Northwest strikes this week, at OCS in Blackpool and AQA in Manchester:



eta, more background on the disputes:








						OCS Lancashire: Pay Up Now
					

Welcome to UNISON North West. With 200,000 members, we are the biggest union in the region and we are growing.




					www.unisonnw.org
				












						Strikes to go ahead after exam board fails to improve pay offer, says UNISON    | News, Press release | News | UNISON National
					

Workers have been left with no alternative after years of what have effectively been wage cuts.




					www.unison.org.uk
				











						Exam board staff to strike on A-level results day, says UNISON   | News, Press release | News | UNISON National
					

UNISON says AQA is stubbornly refusing to discuss pay with staff.




					www.unison.org.uk


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Aug 9, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Aug 10, 2022)

Will have to wait and see where else is affected, but there's definitely a wildcat happening at Grangemouth:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 10, 2022)

Grangemouth refinery entrance blocked by 'wildcat' strike as workers down tools
					

Around 250 maintenance contractors temporarily blocked an access road outside the Petroineos-owned plant in Grangemouth.




					www.dailyrecord.co.uk
				




And Fawley and Drax as well, from the sounds of it:


Video from Fawley:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 10, 2022)

Valero contractors stage major wildcat strike over pay conditions
					

Over 250 Valero refinery contractors have staged a major wildcat strike in protest over a cost-of-living pay row.




					www.westerntelegraph.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 10, 2022)

Report from Drax: 








						Drax workers walk out over pay cut
					

Placard at the protest outside Drax – photo Iain Dalton Hundreds of workers ar Drax Power Station, near Selby, joined a series of national walk outs over the refusal of the Engineering Constr…




					leedssocialistparty.wordpress.com


----------



## teqniq (Aug 10, 2022)

Another wildcat strike this time in Pembrokeshire (I presume it's Milford Haven):









						Valero: Pembroke refinery workers strike over pay offer
					

Valero: Pembroke refinery workers strike over pay offer



					www.bbc.com


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 10, 2022)

Mossmorran as well:








						Mossmorran: Wildcat strike as hundreds join picket line in pay dispute
					

Striking workers have blocked the main entrance to Fife's Mossmorran petrochemical plant in a dispute over pay. Around 250 contractors employed at the




					www.thecourier.co.uk


----------



## teqniq (Aug 11, 2022)




----------



## Chilli.s (Aug 11, 2022)

31% !!!!!!


----------



## NoXion (Aug 11, 2022)

Good on them. I'd love a pay rise of that magnitude myself.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 11, 2022)

The wave of Amazon walkouts is ongoing as well - can click through for the whole thread, sounds like it keeps spreading to new sites including Donny:




Regarding Fawley, interesting to note that it's one of the sites that was hit by wildcats yesterday - I don't know enough about the industry to say whether Securitas would've been one of the contractors involved, I would guess probably not, but even if it wasn't directly related, I would think that any wildcat strike at the site would probably have a good effect on employers?


----------



## Chilli.s (Aug 11, 2022)

Amaxon have failed a couple of delivery promises for me in the last month, and both times Iv got a £5 credit out of them, solidarity


----------



## moochedit (Aug 11, 2022)

Any Amazon delivery staff striking or just the warehouse staff? Think the delivery all paid by the job (false self employment) aren't they?


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 11, 2022)

moochedit said:


> Any Amazon delivery staff striking or just the warehouse staff? Think the delivery all paid by the job (false self employment) aren't they?


Good question, no idea how the delivery side is organised, but would guess that it's a much more isolated job, with even less of a chance to get to know your colleagues?

Anyway, new video from the striking outsourced NHS staff in Blackpool:


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 12, 2022)

Turns out Humber Refinery walked out on Wednesday as well:








						Humber Refinery contractors walkout in pay dispute
					

More than 250 people have walked out




					www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 12, 2022)

A printable bulletin collecting two reports from the Amazon wildcats:








						Amazon workers' bulletin
					

by Notes from Below // A bulletin on the recent wildcat strikes at Amazon




					notesfrombelow.org


----------



## The39thStep (Aug 12, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Good question, no idea how the delivery side is organised, but would guess that it's a much more isolated job, with even less of a chance to get to know your colleagues?
> 
> Anyway, new video from the striking outsourced NHS staff in Blackpool:



Saw this yesterday  and thought 'what a simple and effective way to say what the dispute is about'


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 13, 2022)

Feels odd to see the Evening Standard running a primer on wildcat strikes and quoting the WSWS as a source, but here we are:








						Workers across the UK are on wildcat strikes – here is what it means
					

Unofficial strikes are taking place alongside union-approved industrial action this summer




					www.standard.co.uk


----------



## teqniq (Aug 15, 2022)




----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 15, 2022)

Another win for Unite workers, this time at BA:


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 15, 2022)

RMT picket lines on Thursday and Saturday in the West Midlands…


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 16, 2022)

RMT Arriva pickets for Friday in London:


Also, looks like Liverpool port workers just delivered a really impressive strike vote, with others still balloting:









						Liverpool docks braced for disruption after MDHC port operatives overwhelming strike vote
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## PR1Berske (Aug 17, 2022)




----------



## Calamity1971 (Aug 17, 2022)




----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 17, 2022)

Heh, did smirk when I saw that earlier


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Aug 17, 2022)

a reply to that one


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Aug 18, 2022)

The latest shit from Shapps, in a shit rag who’ve for some bizarre reason started calling Mick Lynch a ‘baron’ recently;


----------



## Calamity1971 (Aug 18, 2022)

Mr.Bishie said:


> The latest shit from Shapps, in a shit rag who’ve for some bizarre reason started calling Mick Lynch a ‘baron’ recently;
> 
> View attachment 338248


That wanker couldn't smash a fucking avocado.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 18, 2022)

In our ballot over changes to terms and conditions CWU members voted 98.2% in favour of strike action on a 72% turnout.

Well done us - Louis MacNeice


----------



## MickiQ (Aug 18, 2022)

Mr.Bishie said:


> The latest shit from Shapps, in a shit rag who’ve for some bizarre reason started calling Mick Lynch a ‘baron’ recently;
> 
> View attachment 338248


1 to 3 I think will probably make it harder to actually call a strike. The rest are largely pointless bar 10 &12 which I think are going to enrich a lot of lawyers as employers, unions, Govt and the courts get embroiled in rows over what a minimum service level is and how it can be reconciled with someone's fundamental right to withdraw their labour. As for whether a stike causes a national emergency I suspect that is going to a good one.


----------



## philosophical (Aug 18, 2022)

What happens if everybody calls in sick or whatever on the same day?
If the Tories want to play silly buggers with the already oppressive regulations then individual workers can do it outside of formal Union control.Those Masonic creeps can manoeuvre with funny handshakes, workers can manoeuvre with a nod and a wink.
I mean one of the Tories top five songs is Rule Britannia which says Britons never will be slaves.


----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 18, 2022)

philosophical said:


> What happens if everybody calls in sick or whatever on the same day?
> If the Tories want to play silly buggers with the already oppressive regulations then individual workers can do it outside of formal Union control.Those Masonic creeps can manoeuvre with funny handshakes, workers can manoeuvre with a nod and a wink.
> I mean one of the Tories top five songs is Rule Britannia which says Britons never will be slaves.


i'm not seeing it in the top five








						The Top 10: Conservative Pop Songs | John Rentoul
					

Does the devil really have the best tunes?




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## philosophical (Aug 18, 2022)

I can’t get past the paywall.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 18, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> 1 to 3 I think will probably make it harder to actually call a strike. The rest are largely pointless bar 10 &12 which I think are going to enrich a lot of lawyers as employers, unions, Govt and the courts get embroiled in rows over what a minimum service level is and how it can be reconciled with someone's fundamental right to withdraw their labour. As for whether a stike causes a national emergency I suspect that is going to a good one.


3 would be a fucking nightmare, but if I understand it correctly might also have the unintended effect of giving unions a big incentive to go back to open-ended all-out strikes rather than these one day affairs?


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 18, 2022)

philosophical said:


> I can’t get past the paywall.


Fwiw:


> This list was just an excuse to start several arguments, including ones about the definition of “conservative”, when poses become ironic, and why there is a “No Beatles” rule in my Top 10s. Anyway, here we go.
> 
> 1. *“I Fought The Law”*, The Crickets, 1960. (Some people prefer the version by The Clash, 1979.) “Pro law and order,” said Conor Downey, Whitstable Stevie and Steven Fogel.
> 
> ...


----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 18, 2022)

philosophical said:


> I can’t get past the paywall.


At the bottom where it wants you to register should be an option for not now


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 18, 2022)

Wee bit late for this morning, but here's the RMT picket details for Saturday:


			Picket Line details 18 - 20 August
		

I'd imagine there will probably be rallies happening in a lot of places as well (leaving aside any debates about the usefulness or otherwise of rallies)?


----------



## The39thStep (Aug 18, 2022)

They don't like us -we don't care


----------



## ska invita (Aug 19, 2022)

Mr.Bishie said:


> The latest shit from Shapps, in a shit rag who’ve for some bizarre reason started calling Mick Lynch a ‘baron’ recently;
> 
> 
> 
> ...



this plan looks like its going ahead right? theres no point them making an empty threat of it as its not like its going to stop anyone from backing down and its not like the strike wave is going away any time soon.
 if it does go ahead then its an existential attack on unionism and a general strike is i would confidently presume 100% on - and not just a general strike, but a full force long running confrontation that could lead anywhere....
big things

according to Liz Truss the timing of the implementation will be right around 1st October (soon after she wins the PM ship) which is when bills will be shooting up etc....could be a powder keg situation IMO, and Truss may have won over the swivle eyed loons but I dont think the public has much sympathy


----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 19, 2022)

Am I right in thinking that threshold is the standard for certain public services, e.g. emergency services? If so, non my laptop so don't have the graph to hand, but if held to the same standards, not a single government since at least 1945 would have been elected.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 19, 2022)

this in combination with the others comes across as the most neutering...you take a month to go through the Lets Strike rigmarole only to strike for one day? Makes it basically pointless


----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 19, 2022)

Came across this while trying to work out if using the Elizabeth would be scabbing:



Thoughts?


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 19, 2022)

ska invita said:


> View attachment 338522
> 
> this in combination with the others comes across as the most neutering...you take a month to go through the Lets Strike rigmarole only to strike for one day? Makes it basically pointless


I mean, that's the part that's baffling me (and I imagine would be baffling them, if they'd thought it through at all, which I'm reasonably confident they haven't) - what counts as "an event of strike action"? At Chep they walked out in December 2021 and didn't return to work till April, so I think you could make a solid argument that's a single "event of strike action" because the strike was a single continuous event, so it sounds like they'd be massively incentivising those kinds of strikes, basically making them the only ones that would be worth bothering with?


----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 19, 2022)

Mr.Bishie said:


> The latest shit from Shapps, in a shit rag who’ve for some bizarre reason started calling Mick Lynch a ‘baron’ recently;
> 
> View attachment 338248


there's one cabal of villains holding the country to ransom and they are the parliamentary conservative party


----------



## Karl Masks (Aug 19, 2022)

Good luck limiting the number of people attending pickets.

But then, that's the point, isn't it. Create a rule that's easily broken and then punish them for breaking the law.

This is full on class warfare


----------



## Karl Masks (Aug 19, 2022)




----------



## teqniq (Aug 19, 2022)

Arsehole alert:


----------



## Storm Fox (Aug 19, 2022)

ska invita said:


> View attachment 338522
> 
> this in combination with the others comes across as the most neutering...you take a month to go through the Lets Strike rigmarole only to strike for one day? Makes it basically pointless


I think this could be counterproductive. I will depend on how exactly how the law is written but one period could be from the 1st of a month to the 31st. So the union has a few people picketing every day so there is an ongoing strike, but most employees turn up for work most days, apart from certain days. This means contingency planning for the companies is a lot more difficult.


----------



## waxoyl (Aug 19, 2022)

Not a bad turn out for Macclesfield. Quality tee shirt.


----------



## teqniq (Aug 20, 2022)

Heh, not putting up with any shit is he?



E2a this was originally tweeted by someone else and it turns out that it's a CH4 reporter. I thought better of them, obviously I was mistaken.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 20, 2022)

An extraordinary moment in the the day of a CWU postie, and a true story to boot.

On my walk this morning one of the people I deliver to came to the door to collect a parcel and show me their new puppy; I'm a cat rather than a dog person but it was pretty cute. Next up she says 'good luck with the strike...we're 100% behind you'; not so unusual as I haven't yet had anyone say they are against it. What she said next did surprise me; 'of course' she went on 'what we need is everybody out together, a general strike!' All of this took place on the doorstep of an ex-council semi (currently valued at about £600,000) on the leafy outskirts of an East Sussex market town.

Maybe, just maybe the mood is really shifting.

All the very best - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 21, 2022)

Good RMT (or RMT/TSSA/Unison, would've been Unite as well but they've settled at Arriva now) strike thing yesterday, was impressed that they had both French railworkers from the CGT and someone from the Italian USB come over for it. Always nice being told that French workers are taking inspiration from the militancy of the British working class.


----------



## Rob Ray (Aug 21, 2022)

Felixstowe dockers are out today btw . Lots of angry Tories in the local comments sections bemoaning them for refusing 7% (because apparently it's really important to let Singapore-based Hutchinson Ports maximise its shareholder profits – confusing how this patriotism thing works sometimes tbh).


----------



## Smangus (Aug 21, 2022)

Don't know whether to laugh or be sick, ooh the irony  


Journalists at rightwing Daily Express set to strike over pay


----------



## Duncan2 (Aug 21, 2022)

Seem to be more and more instances being reported of workers just trooping out to the canteen or car park without bothering with any of the legal formalities that are supposed to be observed.With apparently only ten per cent of low paid private sector workers currently members of a union in practice it seems that unlawful strike action is the only option open to them.And this it seems for disciplinary purposes is straightforward refusal to work.If it can only happen this way in many indeed most private sector workplaces well and good but otoh there is every chance that further down the line the employers will act against those they regard as having been the instigators.And very likely there will not be very much that can be done about it.


----------



## Rob Ray (Aug 21, 2022)

I wouldn't be surprised if it gets a lot more common, yes. No other option for a lot of people. I doubt Enough is Enough will consider it legit enough to throw it's weight in mind (especially when it's got union affiliates vulnerable to being accused of backing wildcat action), which begs the question how is the left going to help in such circumstances? At the least, pushing info on how to wildcat without putting organisers' heads on the chopping block unnecessarily might be useful ...


----------



## Duncan2 (Aug 21, 2022)

Rob Ray said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if it gets a lot more common, yes. No other option for a lot of people. I doubt Enough is Enough will consider it legit enough to throw it's weight in mind (especially when it's got union affiliates vulnerable to being accused of backing wildcat action), which begs the question how is the left going to help in such circumstances? At the least, pushing info on how to wildcat without putting organisers' heads on the chopping block unnecessarily might be useful ...


Yes and as philosophical was suggesting above it might be useful to consider the options for action short of a strike that nevertheless convey to management the depth and breadth of concern within the workforce such as working to rule?


----------



## Rob Ray (Aug 21, 2022)

Bit of an older set of articles but various things on libcom 's organising page are worth flagging, Good work strike, Go-slow, Workplace Occupation etc. We're a ways off Argentine workplace annexations, Spanish road barricades, French bossnapping and Italian kneecapping mind .


----------



## nogojones (Aug 21, 2022)

Rob Ray said:


> Bit of an older set of articles but various things on libcom 's organising page are worth flagging, Good work strike, Go-slow, Workplace Occupation etc. We're a ways off Argentine workplace annexations, Spanish road barricades, French bossnapping and Italian kneecapping mind .


In the 80/90/00's the mill I worked in was 100% unionised. However it was toothless, the full timers were wankers and they'd suffered what was really a substantial defeat in the 1980 strike. In all those years the union did nothing except collect subs. However, whenever there was a grievance the mill wouldn't run. Nothing to do with the ISTC, shit just breaks down sometimes. Lots of informal working to rule, permits going missing, so a 15 minute job takes half a shift. 

My personal favourite was if a manager was shouting frantic instructions to you across the line, you'd pretend not to hear. They'd shout even more frantically, you'd nod in comprehension,  look at your watch and shout the time back to him with helpful hand signals, then turn around and fuck off to some other pressing job


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 21, 2022)

Rob Ray said:


> Felixstowe dockers are out today btw . Lots of angry Tories in the local comments sections bemoaning them for refusing 7% (because apparently it's really important to let Singapore-based Hutchinson Ports maximise its shareholder profits – confusing how this patriotism thing works sometimes tbh).



Very significant. Major private sector area, integral to the national distribution network and capital flows.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 22, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Very significant. Major private sector area, integral to the national distribution network and capital flows.


Worth mentioning that there's now a mandate for action at Liverpool as well. Wonder what proportion of... everything really, but particularly food, goes through those two?


----------



## moochedit (Aug 22, 2022)

BBC News - Criminal barristers in England and Wales vote to go on all-out strike









						Criminal barristers in England and Wales vote to go on all-out strike
					

An indefinite, uninterrupted strike over pay will begin in England and Wales next month.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## ska invita (Aug 22, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I mean, that's the part that's baffling me (and I imagine would be baffling them, if they'd thought it through at all, which I'm reasonably confident they haven't) - what counts as "an event of strike action"? At Chep they walked out in December 2021 and didn't return to work till April, so I think you could make a solid argument that's a single "event of strike action" because the strike was a single continuous event, so it sounds like they'd be massively incentivising those kinds of strikes, basically making them the only ones that would be worth bothering with?


I wonder if the "indefinite" barristers strike counts as one strike event?


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 22, 2022)

Comedy benefit for striking bin workers in Edinburgh on Wednesday:


			https://www.thestand.co.uk/shows/1427-stand-up-for-the-bin-workers-gala/
		


Also, four UNISON HE branches now have mandates:


Not a huge amount but apparently they only balloted in seven places.
On the UCU side of things, they've now done their campaign launch:








						UCU rising
					

UCU members in higher education are rising up and saying enough is enough.




					www.ucu.org.uk
				



But checking their FAQs to see what's actually happening, they just say:
"*What is the balloting timetable? *
The union will be in a position to finalise the ballot timetable very soon."

So no clearer as to when they'll actually be balloting then.


----------



## Brainaddict (Aug 22, 2022)

Feeling a bit pessimistic today. With an 80 seat Tory majority and a new right wing leader eager to prove themselves the new Thatcher, I feel like this strike wave wave is likely to end with more anti-strike legislation on the books that will be difficult to shift. And probably very few concessions to workers.


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Aug 22, 2022)

Feel optimistic about more ‘wildcat strikes’ - ALL OUT!!


----------



## LDC (Aug 22, 2022)

Brainaddict said:


> I feel like this strike wave wave is likely to end with more anti-strike legislation on the books that will be difficult to shift. And probably very few concessions to workers.



I think that is coming, but I think the answer is the unions go for broke and disobey it now. The only other option is to basically completely give up on the unions to take any effective industrial action and just become vehicles for individual/small scale casework and member benefits.


----------



## teqniq (Aug 22, 2022)

This is really going to fuck things up for victims and defendants alike:









						Criminal barristers in England and Wales vote to go on indefinite strike
					

Industrial action will begin on 5 September with barristers asking for a 25% pay rise for legal aid work




					www.theguardian.com
				




also saw this the other day:


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Aug 22, 2022)

from teh tweeter

 

wonder if i've got a disposable e-mail address or two handy...


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 22, 2022)

Printable window/door poster from CWU (if you don't mind using up a lot of pink ink):


			https://www.cwu.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/This-house-does-not-want-deliveries-on.pdf


----------



## MickiQ (Aug 22, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> from teh tweeter
> 
> 
> 
> wonder if i've got a disposable e-mail address or two handy...



Not interested, I'm waiting for them to start advertising temp train drivers. Quite fancy being a scab train driver. I mean how hard can it be? the damn things run on tracks it's not like you can miss a turning or anything.


----------



## Serge Forward (Aug 22, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> "*What is the balloting timetable? *
> The union will be in a position to finalise the ballot timetable very soon."


Ballots out 7th September.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Aug 22, 2022)

Local government (NJC pay scales) staff have had the first e-mail saying words to the effect of 'this seems to be final offer, we'll be balloting soon on whether to accept or not, and if not then next step will be ballot for some form of industrial action.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 22, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> Ballots out 7th September.


Oh yeah, they've just announced that today: 








						Date set for strike ballots at UK universities over pay, conditions & pensions
					

Strike ballots will open at UK universities on Tuesday 6 September. UCU will run two ballots: one over pay and working conditions and the second over pension cuts.




					www.ucu.org.uk
				




How are people feeling about it? The aggregate vote thing sounds like quite a gamble, earlier this year I was very very pessimistic about the chances of them getting over the line nationally but I suppose everything that's going on at the moment should help to drive turnout up a bit. And the Unison results for non-Scottish unis will be out by then, so hopefully you'll get a boost from the huge numbers of Unison branches that have active mandates. Maybe.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 22, 2022)

have we had this?


----------



## Bingoman (Aug 23, 2022)

Councils and school in 9 areas of Scotland likely to strike as early as September ITV  news has said


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Aug 23, 2022)

More on the docks strike. The importance of cost of living disputes spreading to the private sector - and the distribution sector in particular- cannot be overstated. A win here inspires others and the ball is already starting to roll as the article suggests:









						Port Workers in Felixstowe Are Striking at the Heart of the UK’s Supply Chains | Novara Media
					

“Just-in-time” logistics have increased bosses’ profits, but also given small numbers of workers a great deal of power. Polly Smythe reports from Felixstowe.




					novaramedia.com


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 23, 2022)

Sounds like trouble brewing at the construction site of the new Everton stadium:








						Demonstration held outside site of new Everton stadium
					

Union members attended the Bramley-Moore dock site on Friday morning




					www.liverpoolecho.co.uk
				




Also, big new article on the Amazon strikes:








						Mapping the Amazon Strikes
					

by Callum Cant // New data on the wildcat action at Amazon




					notesfrombelow.org


----------



## campanula (Aug 23, 2022)

Is there a rise in union membership? My lad recently joined a Union - and has put in a request for a local union rep to come and talk to his workmates (mostly retail/warehousing but a couple of fabricators). This interest would have been hard to imagine, a few years ago.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 24, 2022)

campanula said:


> Is there a rise in union membership? My lad recently joined a Union - and has put in a request for a local union rep to come and talk to his workmates (mostly retail/warehousing but a couple of fabricators). This interest would have been hard to imagine, a few years ago.


I've not seen any statistics about it, but anecdotally yes - it's hard to say how much is general national stuff and how much is specific local factors, but my branch was running at an average of one new person joining per day for quite a while over July/August, which is a lot better than usual.
Fwiw, here's what google trends shows for people searching "join a union" in the UK.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 24, 2022)

We've had a huge increase in membership over the past 5 years or so, mostly due to local stuff as hitmouse suggests, but we've certainly seen a further uptick over the course of the two ballots, as well.

There's obviously a bit of a concern about just what the expectations are of these new members, who may not have much grounding in union tradition/theory, for the branch and for their own participation, but feels like that means part of our job then becomes to help fill in any gaps and encourage them to become _active _members_._


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Aug 24, 2022)

I'm in a facebook group of childcare workers which is for people to work out qualifications and such like 

Childcare is a hard sector to organise because it's really fragmented in who owns settings and who delivers the care,  it's also a care orientated workforce which can make people strike cautious and it's not clear who to strike against as many mangers/nursery owners make little or no profit or draw down big wages themselves and there is little budget to offer bigger wages without massively increasing the already exorbitant fees to families

The real issue is the lack of real subsidy from the government

But in the last two weeks there's been lots of discussion about joining unions,  striking,  lots of admiration for RMT and CWU action and talk about how to put pressure on the government 

I'm not suggesting that the workforce is going to mount an effective strike action in the next month but for a traditionally apolitical workforce,   this political analysis is remarkable


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 24, 2022)

Miss-Shelf said:


> I'm in a facebook group of childcare workers which is for people to work out qualifications and such like
> 
> Childcare is a hard sector to organise because it's really fragmented in who owns settings and who delivers the care,  it's also a care orientated workforce which can make people strike cautious and it's not clear who to strike against as many mangers/nursery owners make little or no profit or draw down big wages themselves and there is little budget to offer bigger wages without massively increasing the already exorbitant fees to families
> 
> ...


Obligatory plug reply:
IWGB have done some impressive stuff organising with foster carers, and have acheived some real wins:




__





						Latest News - Foster Care Workers Union
					






					fosteriwgb.co.uk
				



Unison might also be worth looking into for people in the sector:








						Early years and nurseries | Who we represent | UNISON National
					

COVID-19 advice UNISON has produced a range of guidance for staff in schools and early years. Go to the advice page UNISON is the largest union in early




					www.unison.org.uk


----------



## JimW (Aug 24, 2022)

Drivers striking over rota changes at one of the bigger local factories back home: Muller drivers set to strike over rota changes | Stroud Times Broken agreements from the company, Muller of yoghurt fame.


----------



## Sue (Aug 24, 2022)

JimW said:


> Drivers striking over rota changes at one of the bigger local factories back home: Muller drivers set to strike over rota changes | Stroud Times Broken agreements from the company, Muller of yoghurt fame.


I read that as mullet drivers and was wondering whether they should be supported or marched to the nearest barbers. Or both.


----------



## JimW (Aug 24, 2022)

Sue said:


> I read that as mullet drivers and was wondering whether they should be supported or marched to the nearest barbers. Or both.


Loss of fringe benefits was the final straw


----------



## Bingoman (Aug 24, 2022)

Just watching ITV news and 13 councils in Scotland will not have their bins collected as of tomorrow as bin men strike until next week over pay


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Aug 24, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Obligatory plug reply:
> IWGB have done some impressive stuff organising with foster carers, and have acheived some real wins:
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you that's good to know 

UVW union has also started a childcare workers branch:  I went to some of their open  meetings last about covid safety 

UVW have the model of taking on a strike to be a  test case in one setting in a  particular sector
Are IWGB similar?
Action against a for profit childcare  outfit might be a good place to start this pressure


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Aug 25, 2022)

I should have already posted these. A couple of pretty decent ACG articles on the strike wave :









						Wildcat strikes: A very basic introduction. - Anarchist Communist Group
					

Photo: Wildcat Strikes in Bangladesh 2019    A number of wildcat strikes broke out in the UK during August.The wave of wildcat action kicked off at Cranswick Continental Foods in Pilsworth. Next, wildcat strikes broke out at several Amazon warehouses including Tilbury, Rugeley, Coventry...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org
				












						Class anger, class struggle, class unity! - Anarchist Communist Group
					

The discontent in British society is moving from simmering to boiling as more and workers go into action, either in official strikes or in unofficial wildcat strikes.The conditions created by Brexit and then by the Covid lockdown pushed workers to agitate around pay demands. This situation was...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 25, 2022)

Miss-Shelf said:


> Thank you that's good to know
> 
> UVW union has also started a childcare workers branch:  I went to some of their open  meetings last about covid safety
> 
> ...


Oh yeah, UVW and IWGB are fairly similar, I'd forgotten or didn't know about them being active in the sector but they sound like a good bet!

Also, here's a listing of CWU pickets for tomorrow, LDC won't be keen on the colour scheme they've chosen though. Is giant but you should be able to ctrl+f for your town/city:


----------



## ruffneck23 (Aug 26, 2022)




----------



## moochedit (Aug 26, 2022)

ruffneck23 said:


>



Good choice of day as monday is a bank holiday to add more to the backlog.


----------



## Elpenor (Aug 26, 2022)

Oh must put up that poster on the front door


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 26, 2022)

Sat in the doctors waiting for a blood test, fresh from my CWU picket line and proudly sporting my 'on strike for fair pay' badge. 

Delivery office shut, not even managers going in (they've been sent to another office with a load of other managers where they can all manage each other!).

Some people from the local trades council turned up with jaffa cakes, biscuits and a bit of cash in an envelope. Good first day of action.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## belboid (Aug 26, 2022)

Good stuff (cutlery works is one of those places with 30 takeaways and bars under one roof)


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 26, 2022)

belboid said:


> View attachment 339708
> 
> Good stuff (cutlery works is one of those places with 30 takeaways and bars under one roof)


Nice. Any idea if this is BFAWU, Unite or what?


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 26, 2022)

Simon Thompson Royal Mail CEO on Radio 4 at lunch time was pretty clear that:

1. Shareholder interests drive company decisions, no mention of consumer needs let alone public needs.
2. Shareholders want a shift away from a universal postal service (which remember includes a huge volume of parcels...including those from Amazon when they don't have capacity) towards a parcel delivery company.
3. Royal Mail has been approached about a take over by venture capitalists.

So the pay dispute and the terms and conditions dispute (which is coming down the line) are actually about both the continued livelihoods of posties and the continued existence of Royal Mail as part of the country's necessary infrastructure.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## belboid (Aug 26, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Nice. Any idea if this is BFAWU, Unite or what?


BFAWU  (wage is up to £13.82ph - I should change job!)


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 26, 2022)

belboid said:


> BFAWU  (wage is up to £13.82ph - I should change job!)


Hats off to the BFAWU for that one, I'd heard of the Sheffield Needs A Pay Rise campaign but was never quite sure how much actual (hospitality) worker involvement there was in it, very glad to have my cynicism disproved on this point!


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 26, 2022)

Keith Williams - Royal Mail's non executive chair and ex head of British Airways...salary £300,000 pa in 2018 (so who knows now?) - claimed in todays Guardian that 'we (Royal Mail) pay 40% more than the market' and that 'he wants to preserve what has made Royal Mail part of the fabric of British life: posties in shorts whistling up garden paths, Postman Pat-style vans climbing country roads and cheery morning retorts'.

1. On my hourly rate (£12.38) that would mean that 'the market' is paying the equivalent of £8.84 per hour. If you include my two supplements (£15.14 pw and £20.14 pw) that rises it to £9.74 per hour. The minimum wage is £9.50. So is he aspiring to be a minimum wage employer; what ambition or dishonesty.

2. The is no actual market because the Royal Mail doesn't just do what Amazon, DPD, Evri and all the rest do. And when TNT tried in a limited number of city locations to do what Royal Mail does 6 six days a week across the whole of the UK, they failed.

3. Which brings me onto to what makes the Royal Mail part of the fabric of British life. Well it isn't patronising stereotypes but rather the provision of that *universal postal service* , including but by no means limited to the delivery of parcels.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## MickiQ (Aug 26, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Keith Williams - Royal Mail's non executive chair and ex head of British Airways...salary £300,000 pa in 2018 (so who knows now?) - claimed in todays Guardian that 'we (Royal Mail) pay 40% more than the market' and that 'he wants to preserve what has made Royal Mail part of the fabric of British life: posties in shorts whistling up garden paths, Postman Pat-style vans climbing country roads and cheery morning retorts'.
> 
> 1. On my hourly rate (£12.38) that would mean that 'the market' is paying the equivalent of £8.84 per hour. If you include my two supplements (£15.14 pw and £20.14 pw) that rises it to £9.74 per hour. The minimum wage is £9.50. So is he aspiring to be a minimum wage employer.
> 
> ...


Maths don't you just love it.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 26, 2022)

And here is the CEO Simon Thompson I referred to earlier:

Royal Mail Hypocrisy

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 26, 2022)

Don't think we've had this on here yet, leisure center cleaners in Battersea:








						Latin American cleaners in Battersea celebrate and prepare to strike!
					

UVW



					www.uvwunion.org.uk


----------



## teqniq (Aug 27, 2022)

It's the busiest and largest container port in the UK. If they continue to strike it will surely have an effect on the economy sooner or later? You'd think that the management would be willing to talk but no.... It would be interesting to know who are actually the main beneficiaries of CK Hutchison Holdings Ltd.









						ITF delegation joins Felixstowe picket line as managers refuse to negotiate
					

Dockers on the picket line at the Port of Felixstowe, the UK’s largest container terminal, told a delegation from the International Transport Workers’ Federation (ITF) that management is offering a real terms pay cut and refusing to talk.  Unite the Union members voted to strike for eight days...




					www.itfglobal.org


----------



## StakerOne (Aug 28, 2022)

'They don't need to strike'​Says a striking postman about striking dockers! 

Port of Felixstowe strike workers enter final day

I bet his union rep will be asking for a nice little chat about being on the same page!


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 28, 2022)

Unite and Unison both calling on TUC to coordinate strike action; they have submitted motions to TUC conference to this end. 

A TUC spokesman has supported the notion saying it is part of their role to help make industrial action as effective as possible.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 29, 2022)

Yep, story on the above:








						UK's biggest unions propose co-ordinated strikes this autumn
					

The UK's largest unions, Unite and Unison, call for a joined-up approach as they fight for better pay deals.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				






BT strike again tomorrow, list of picket lines should be the same as here:








						LOCATION DETAILS: National BT Strike Picket Lines
					

COMMUNICATION WORKERS UNION  28/7/2022  OPS NOTE: BT STRIKE PICKETS  TIME: 7AM ONWARDS   You are invited to join striking BT Group workers, who will be holding hundreds of picket lines across the country tomorrow (Friday 29th July) and Monday (1st August).  Please find enclosed a list of p




					www.cwu.org
				



Saved on their site as the marvellously-named "thingy.pdf"

Handy list of some strike dates here, linked to the archive version cos the inews website is a fucking nightmare to look at:




__





						archive.ph
					





					archive.ph
				




Oh, and the Unison HE ballot is now closed, so expecting a statement on the outcome of that very shortly.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 29, 2022)

Royal Mail CEO Simon Thompson earns the same in a year as about 35 posties or 22 nurses. It is possible he's not value for money.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 30, 2022)

Latest in the "does this undermine the workers" series...

Would it be useful to have a site, sort of like the TfL's engineering works page, that tells you what service(s) are unavailable due to strike that day?

I feel like if done by someone who believes in striking, it could be framed as supportive of the strikes, but providing a bit of awareness/notice for other members of the public.

I'm not necessarily thinking "so they can make other arrangements, necessarily", but more "ok, now I know not to bother heading to the train station" or "well, I don't have to wait in for the post today..!", so it avoids _that _wasted effort? I dunno, though....


----------



## ska invita (Aug 30, 2022)

Someone was telling me recently many newspapers used to have an "industrial" section with the latest disputes, strikes and other labour news, a section presumably slowly made redundant post-Thatcher....might be time for those to come back now the end of history has ended


----------



## The39thStep (Aug 30, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Someone was telling me recently many newspapers used to have an "industrial" section with the latest disputes, strikes and other labour news, a section presumably slowly made redundant post-Thatcher....might be time for those to come back now the end of history has ended


I can't remember that in the daily papers tbh.  I can remember some papers having small articles about who to vote for in Trade Union elections ( obviously right wing candidates) .
Socialist Worker used to have a double page section covering disputes/strikes near the back of their paper for years.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 30, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> I can't remember that in the daily papers tbh.


Nor can I but it sounded plausible! I was born in early 70s though...and  I took it to be a 70s thing, but maybe it was earlier? Or maybe it wasnt true.



The39thStep said:


> Socialist Worker used to have a double page section covering disputes/strikes near the back of their paper for years.


News Line is actually good for this: basically filled with trade union news, latest outrages from Israel and a big dollop of pro-Russian/Iranian/Chinese propaganda <and amazingly thats a daily paper.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 30, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> I can't remember that in the daily papers tbh.  I can remember some papers having small articles about who to vote for in Trade Union elections ( obviously right wing candidates) .


That's not entirely a thing of the past:


----------



## teqniq (Aug 30, 2022)

Heh.









						Support for striking workers declared by 600 Labour councillors
					

Exclusive: Open letter puts pressure on party’s stance on strikes amid talk of coordinated autumn action




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Bingoman (Aug 30, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Heh.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I wonder what kier Starmer thinks of that


----------



## MickiQ (Aug 30, 2022)

When past the local exchange this morning (8ish) and there was a big banner strung across the entrance saying "Support The Strike" and a CWU flag. What there wasn't was any pickets.


----------



## moochedit (Aug 30, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> When past the local exchange this morning (8ish) and there was a big banner strung across the entrance saying "Support The Strike" and a CWU flag. What there wasn't was any pickets.


I don't think today is a strike day. Think tommorow is though.


----------



## teqniq (Aug 30, 2022)




----------



## nogojones (Aug 30, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Latest in the "does this undermine the workers" series...
> 
> Would it be useful to have a site, sort of like the TfL's engineering works page, that tells you what service(s) are unavailable due to strike that day?
> 
> ...


If I was writing that column/updating that website, I'd always chuck a few extra made up strikes in to fuck stuff up just that little bit more


----------



## MickiQ (Aug 30, 2022)

moochedit said:


> I don't think today is a strike day. Think tommorow is though.


Nope it is, checked on strikemap and today is the first day of a two day strike. I came back a separate route so I don't know if there were pickets later.Granted you don't actually need to picket a telephone exchange since whilst telecom engineer is a more interchangeable skillset than train driver, people with those skills are usually in well paid jobs rather than working for agencies.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Aug 30, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Would it be useful to have a site, sort of like the TfL's engineering works page, that tells you what service(s) are unavailable due to strike that day?



from a purely (rail) travel information perspective, national rail enquiries usually show a summary of all disruptions including strikes, and TFL have got a page for strike related news.

and there's strike map UK (not just transport sector)


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Aug 30, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Someone was telling me recently many newspapers used to have an "industrial" section with the latest disputes, strikes and other labour news, a section presumably slowly made redundant post-Thatcher....might be time for those to come back now the end of history has ended


They certainly had industrial correspondents as did the BBC and ITV and they were seen as some of the most important journalists around. TUC conference was live on BBC2. I was born in 1962 and the 1970s were very heaven to be alive....I might have over egged the pudding there.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Rob Ray (Aug 30, 2022)

teqniq said:


> It's the busiest and largest container port in the UK. If they continue to strike it will surely have an effect on the economy sooner or later? You'd think that the management would be willing to talk but no.... It would be interesting to know who are actually the main beneficiaries of CK Hutchison Holdings Ltd.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The ultimate owners are the Li banking clan, based out of Hong Kong.









						Li Ka-shing
					

#37 Li Ka-shing on the 2022 Billionaires - Nicknamed Superman, Li Ka-shing is revered as one of the most influential businessmen in Asia. Li retired as




					www.forbes.com


----------



## yield (Aug 30, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> They certainly had industrial correspondents as did the BBC and ITV and they were seen as some of the most important journalists around. TUC conference was live on BBC2. I was born in 1962 and the 1970s were very heaven to be alive....I might have over egged the pudding there.
> 
> Cheers - Louis MacNeice


Haller wrote a book about it. 









						Crisis? What Crisis? Urbanite writes damn fine book!
					

I've just been reading Haller's new book Crisis? What Crisis? and it's great :cool:   Tis a history of Britain in the 1970s - brilliantly observed and very funny.  Here be a trailer for it on youtube  and here's a review of the book by Francis Wheen  Francis Wheen  [Haller] may be an...




					www.urban75.net
				





Rob Ray said:


> The ultimate owners are the Li banking clan, based out of Hong Kong.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Any ally of the PRC since they helped capture the kidnapper of his son. 



			https://www.scmp.com/article/740537/how-big-spender-abducted-two-hks-tycoons


----------



## Rob Ray (Aug 30, 2022)

Most national papers had industrial correspondents btw (as did many of the prominent regionals) but they all went the way of the dodo in the 90s/early 2000s apart from at the Mirror, Morning Star and the PA newswire. The decline reflecting both the gutting of expensive senior roles and the post-Wapping period of "unions aren't important any more".


----------



## moochedit (Aug 30, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> Nope it is, checked on strikemap and today is the first day of a two day strike. I came back a separate route so I don't know if there were pickets later.Granted you don't actually need to picket a telephone exchange since whilst telecom engineer is a more interchangeable skillset than train driver, people with those skills are usually in well paid jobs rather than working for agencies.


Ok. Sorry i thought you were talking about post strikes not bt.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 31, 2022)

teqniq said:


>



Red Funnel sounds like the kind of phrase that would have a horrific definition on urbandictionary.


MickiQ said:


> Nope it is, checked on strikemap and today is the first day of a two day strike. I came back a separate route so I don't know if there were pickets later.Granted you don't actually need to picket a telephone exchange since whilst telecom engineer is a more interchangeable skillset than train driver, people with those skills are usually in well paid jobs rather than working for agencies.


Huh, I went past a BT office yesterday and couldn't see any pickets but thought maybe that was due to me leaving it a bit too late in the morning (bit past 10ish). Having said that, I went to say hi to my local posties this morning and then almost gave up and went home before realising that they were picketing the staff entrance round the back rather than the customer entrance at the front, so could be something like that?


Rob Ray said:


> The ultimate owners are the Li banking clan, based out of Hong Kong.


Lol, for a second I got mixed up and read this as being part of the Morning Star/Newsline line of chat.


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 31, 2022)

Results from the Unison HE ballot are now out, sort of, there doesn't seem to be an actual article with a list of the branches that got over the line, but it's confirmed that there's 22 of them:


Also saying they've just won outsourced staff at City University the same T&Cs as directly employed staff (and I think this is them actually having won it, not claiming responsibility for another union's work):


The Week in Work is still very good for general roundups:








						Autumn of anger - 44% pay rise for hospitality workers - Inflation to keep rising
					

22 - 28 August 2022




					theweekinwork.substack.com
				




Notes From Below have published a pair of reports from striking posties:








						Strike Report From a Postal Worker #1
					

by Anonymous postal worker // A first report from a postal worker on the on-going strike action by CWU members.




					notesfrombelow.org
				











						Strike Report From A Postal Worker #2
					

by Anonymous postal worker // A second report from a postal worker on the on-going strike activity by CWU members.




					notesfrombelow.org


----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 31, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Results from the Unison HE ballot are now out, sort of, there doesn't seem to be an actual article with a list of the branches that got over the line, but it's confirmed that there's 22 of them:



Spectacularly, when they tweeted that, most of the branch committees didn't know the results themselves... 

Five of us in London, 18 across the UK, we go again


----------



## hitmouse (Aug 31, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Spectacularly, when they tweeted that, most of the branch committees didn't know the results themselves...
> 
> Five of us in London, 18 across the UK, we go again


Think that might be 18 in England, then 4 in Scotland, and I think one in Ireland although I'm not totally sure on that one? Definitely an improvement on the 9 or 10 who got over the line last time, anyway.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 1, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Think that might be 18 in England, then 4 in Scotland, and I think one in Ireland although I'm not totally sure on that one? Definitely an improvement on the 9 or 10 who got over the line last time, anyway.


Ohhhh, very possibly.

I should know not to try and post such things from memory


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 1, 2022)

And yeah, my understanding is that the branches that didn't get over the line will now be reballoting, hopefully more-or-less on the same timescale as the UCU ballot that's about to start, may see something from the 18/22 before then though.
Oh, here's the official statement from Unison - 17 in England, 1 in NI, 4 in Scotland apparently:








						University staff vote to strike over ‘ludicrously low’ pay rise | News, Press release | News | UNISON National
					

Managers must put people before profits and pay staff proper, fair wages




					www.unison.org.uk
				





> Staff at the following universities have voted to strike: Manchester Metro University, Leeds Beckett University, Birkbeck (University of London), Liverpool John Moores University, City (University of London), Liverpool Hope University, King’s College London, University of Brighton, University of the West of England, London South Bank University, Bath Spa University, University of Leeds, University of Gloucestershire, University of Bristol, Royal Northern College Of Music, SOAS (University of London), University of Winchester, St Mary’s University College (Belfast), Edinburgh Napier University, Glasgow Caledonian University, University of Glasgow and Robert Gordon University.


----------



## PR1Berske (Sep 1, 2022)

ASLEF will strike on 15th September
RMT will strike on 15th and 17th September.


----------



## moochedit (Sep 3, 2022)

Coventry Live: 'Rightly furious' Amazon workers in Coventry ready to strike again over pay.









						'Rightly furious' Amazon workers in Coventry ready to strike again over pay
					

More than 300 employees voted in a ballot, with 97 per cent favouring a walkout




					www.coventrytelegraph.net


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 3, 2022)

Will be interesting to see how things go now that GMB seems to be in there in an official role - obviously more co-ordination between sites will be a good thing, but also means that there's a legal structure for Amazon to put the squeeze on that wasn't there before.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 4, 2022)

Out for two weeks, that should be pretty notable:








						Port of Liverpool dock workers to strike over pay
					

More than 560 Port of Liverpool workers will stage a two-week walk-out from 19 September, a union says.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




(Also, anyone got any dirt on Peel? I sort of get the impression that Peel own about 90% of the country, you never really see them discussed though.)


----------



## belboid (Sep 5, 2022)

More in Liverpool 

Today (Monday) PCS members working for Hinduja Global Solutions in Liverpool are starting another 6 days of strike action over pay and conditions. 

The workers, employed by HGS to run the contact centre and back-office functions of the government’s Disclosure and Barring Service (DBS) are taking their second wave of strike action until September 10.

HGS has failed to improve on its 3.25% pay offer. For our members it is not just a desire to get more money, but it is a necessity in order to pay increasing bills. So, we have no alternative than to take strike action again.

HGS owner Srichand Parmanand Hinduja is the richest person in the country, with a personal wealth of more than £24.5bn, so he can afford to pay his staff a decent rise to help them through the cost-of-living crisis. Until he does, our members will continue to take strike action against his company.

As PCS prepares for a civil service wide strike ballot on pay it’s important members across the PCS Home Office group come together to show support for each other.

We are asking members across the group to take a simple action by signing the megaphone petition to tell the CEO Adam Foster to get round the table with PCS with a better offer.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 5, 2022)

No apologies for the long post I need to get this off my chest because everytime I hear about the need for Royal Mail 'modernisation' none of the detail is explained.

So just to make this as clear as possible Royal Mail's 'modernisation' requires the following in exchange for an extra 1.5%:

1. Removal of pay supplements/allowances. For me this would see a gross reduction of about 8% on my basic pay.

2. Imposition of compulsory Sunday working, rendering Sunday as just another working day. This would impact significantly on overtime payments and rest day patterns. Sunday working is already agreed on a voluntary basis.

3. Removal of sick pay entitlement after 7 days absence; after that £99 per week statutory sick pay only. As well as being a massive reduction in income this would also be a very real material incentive for people to come to work when they are injured, unwell and infectious.

4. Imposition of seasonal hours contracts under which weekly hours could be changed every two weeks. Currently hours do change but in agreement with staff members. This could have a massive impact on colleagues with caring responsibilities for children, partners and elderly relatives.

5. Increase in basic full time hours from the current target of 35pw to 40pw. Again this has massive implications for overtime payments and work/life balance. It would also affect hhose seeking to move from part time to full time contracts or moving offices; i.e they could be required to sign the new 40 hour 7 day a week contracts.

There is another possible 2% available to those staff who meet some as yet unspecified productivity targets. This is not a pay increase for all (e.g. an increase in the basic hourly rate). It is to be a one off payment, not consolidated into basic pay and up for review with regard to amount and targets to be met every year.

Not modernisation but a huge attack on terms and conditions across the board and all in exchange for an actual pay cut!

Not so cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## oryx (Sep 5, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> No apologies for the long post I need to get this off my chest because everytime I hear about the need for Royal Mail 'modernisation' none of the detail is explained.
> 
> So just to make this as clear as possible Royal Mail's 'modernisation' requires the following in exchange for an extra 1.5%:
> 
> ...


That's absolutely shit, Louis MacNeice . Real 'race to the bottom' stuff.


----------



## Chilli.s (Sep 5, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> No apologies for the long post I need to get this off my chest because everytime I hear about the need for Royal Mail 'modernisation' none of the detail is explained.
> 
> So just to make this as clear as possible Royal Mail's 'modernisation' requires the following in exchange for an extra 1.5%:
> 
> ...


Modernisation... so its management speak for cuts, might have guessed. 

Thanks for keeping us informed


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 5, 2022)

Strike Map and the BFAWU have now launched their new project, Organise Now:








						Organise Now! Support for new worker organising
					

Organise Now is a new worker-led campaign for mass organising of workplaces during a period of increased militancy and a growing cost of living crisis.




					www.organisenow.org.uk
				





> What is Organise Now?​Organise Now is a collective of experienced workers from across the Trade Union and social justice movements, dedicated to, and with track records of, helping workers defend their pay and conditions -  and to secure better work lives through collaborating with others.
> 
> How does it work?​We have a support form for workers who want support and advice. After submitting the form, you will receive a call within 72 hours. We will put you in touch with an experienced organiser. They will listen to you and assist you in forming a plan on how to build change.
> 
> ...


----------



## Duncan2 (Sep 5, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> No apologies for the long post I need to get this off my chest because everytime I hear about the need for Royal Mail 'modernisation' none of the detail is explained.
> 
> So just to make this as clear as possible Royal Mail's 'modernisation' requires the following in exchange for an extra 1.5%:
> 
> ...


Kinnell it's like they want you all out on strike


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 5, 2022)

arriva bus drivers (and other staff) out across much of the 'home counties' north and south of london today and tomorrow.

one of various articles (and one of the few that mention the various back door pay cuts accompanying the headline basic pay rate rise)









						The Herts services impacted by Arriva bus strikes this week
					

The 310 and 331 routes will operate on 'limited' services




					www.hertfordshiremercury.co.uk


----------



## Bingoman (Sep 6, 2022)

Firefighters and thier call centre works look set to strike this autumn









						Firefighters and control room staff could strike over pay
					

Union leaders say the move follows a 2% pay offer which has not risen despite rising inflation.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 6, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> No apologies for the long post I need to get this off my chest because everytime I hear about the need for Royal Mail 'modernisation' none of the detail is explained.
> 
> So just to make this as clear as possible Royal Mail's 'modernisation' requires the following in exchange for an extra 1.5%:
> 
> ...


if this is the sort of thing your managers spend their time thinking up i can think of some immediate and widely popular cost-cutting measures.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 6, 2022)

Duncan2 said:


> Kinnell it's like they want you all out on strike


They want rid of their universal service obligation; they are only interested in parcel delivery. So a combined strategy of under investment in the letter post, under recruitment of delivery staff and picking a fight with the CWU will see them saying the Royal Mail is broken and the only way to fix it is to sell off the parcels side and let the letter post die.

At bottom it is the same approach the government is taking to the NHS; i.e. run it so badly that it breaks, then say you have the solution...sell the money making bits to your mates and let the rest become at best a minimal residual service of last resort.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 6, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> if this is the sort of thing your managers spend their time thinking up i can think of some immediate and widely popular cost-cutting measures.


This is very senior management. My local delivery office manager is absolutely fine and thinks the whole thing stinks to high heaven.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 6, 2022)

Polyflor in Radcliffe (near Bury) have locked their workforce out after they voted to strike:








						Flooring company suspends shifts after workers vote to strike over pay dispute
					

Workers at a flooring company in Whitefield are set to go on strike in a dispute over pay.




					www.burytimes.co.uk
				




It doesn't seem to be super well-publicised as yet, and I suppose the likelihood of there being any urbs in the M45 area who are free on Thursday daytime may be fairly slim, but the locked-out workers have apparently called a demo for Thursday morning:


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 7, 2022)

North Sea wildcat to start tomorrow:








						Offshore scaffolders plan unofficial strike in North Sea
					

Scaffolders and other offshore trades working in the North Sea are set to take unofficial strike action on Thursday.




					scaffmag.com
				












						North Sea Oil and Gas Fields: The Struggle Continues!
					

As mentioned in our recent article on wildcat strikes in the UK, back in May it was reported that over a thousand offshore oil and gas workers in the North Sea walked out across 19 rigs demanding their wages match inflation.(1) And now, according to a statement circulating across social media...



					www.leftcom.org


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 7, 2022)

Some Scottish Unison uni strike dates confirmed so far, English ones should be coming very soon:


----------



## PR1Berske (Sep 8, 2022)




----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 8, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>



Suspended and publicity wise spot on.

Cheers  -  Louis MacNeice


----------



## belboid (Sep 8, 2022)

CWU off tomorrow too


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 8, 2022)

belboid said:


> CWU off tomorrow too


Yep I am having a home brew or two because of it.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Sep 8, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 8, 2022)

TSSA have also postponed strike action



mixed feelings - overall, it's probably a good PR move really, stops the tories and the tory press having an excuse to ramp up hate about the dastardly treasonous railway workers stopping the loyal subjects going and standing loyally in the rain outside the palace or whatever it is they will do


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 8, 2022)

With all these delayed strikes, maybe they'll now all land on the same day, like when busses or the post all turn up at once..?


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 8, 2022)

belboid said:


> CWU off tomorrow too


Sorry completely misunderstood you. I am disgusted by this. We are fighting  to save Royal Mail and this was an opportunity to highlight its role as a public service. A missed chance to push striking as a benefit to us all.

Shit - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 8, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Sorry completely misunderstood you. I am disgusted by this. We are fighting  to save Royal Mail and this was an opportunity to highlight its role as a public service. A missed chance to push striking as a benefit to us all.
> 
> Shit - Louis MacNeice


Trouble is, is that how it would be received?


----------



## Threshers_Flail (Sep 9, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Trouble is, is that how it would be received?



This. I just don't think it's a fight worth having tbh, best to focus on the strike.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 9, 2022)

Unionised leisure centre cleaners win inflation-busting 16% pay rise
					

Latin American cleaners, members of United Voices of the World (UVW), at Latchmere Leisure Centre in Battersea have won a 16% pay rise. This win follows a ballot for industrial action which saw a 1…




					freedomnews.org.uk


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 10, 2022)

Is "kick their arse up until it hurts them" even something people say?? 

<edit: ah, just noticed these are allegedly "workplace posts", so I guess at least someone says it 🤷 ) >


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 14, 2022)

Some Unison HE dates confirmed:



More should be coming soon. Am I right in thinking CWU are still due to go out on 30 September-1 October?


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 14, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> Local government (NJC pay scales) staff have had the first e-mail saying words to the effect of 'this seems to be final offer, we'll be balloting soon on whether to accept or not, and if not then next step will be ballot for some form of industrial action.



Had an online branch meeting one evening earlier this week.  2 people turned up (not sure if the lunch time version was a bit busier)

offer is not quite what Unison had asked for - but it's still a lump sum (1.9K) increase across all grades, so between 4 and 10 % depending on where you are on the pay scale (higher % at the lowest pay grades) which is not bad apart from how inflation is.  seem to remember lump sum increases being asked for and not got in my previous time in local government (20+ years ago now.)

union leadership are not recommending a vote either way whether to accept, it's up to the members, but sounds like if membership don't accept the next step is balloting for some form of industrial action.

if that's the turnout for a meeting on whether to accept, i'm not sure there's going to be enthusiasm for action...


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 15, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> Had an online branch meeting one evening earlier this week.  2 people turned up (not sure if the lunch time version was a bit busier)
> 
> offer is not quite what Unison had asked for - but it's still a lump sum (1.9K) increase across all grades, so between 4 and 10 % depending on where you are on the pay scale (higher % at the lowest pay grades) which is not bad apart from how inflation is.  seem to remember lump sum increases being asked for and not got in my previous time in local government (20+ years ago now.)
> 
> ...


Blimey, if the leadership aren't pushing to reject then it sounds like they're not really going to put their back into trying to run a campaign over it. Also, do you not have the right to hold union meetings during work?


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 15, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Blimey, if the leadership aren't pushing to reject then it sounds like they're not really going to put their back into trying to run a campaign over it.



indeed



hitmouse said:


> Also, do you not have the right to hold union meetings during work?



not sure.  it's a while since i've been part of a workplace branch set-up (mostly in non 'recognised' jobs recently) - i'm sure at a past recognised place we did have meetings in work time when it was round major reorganisations (which were fairly frequent) but not sure if it's different when it's just about a pay claim.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 15, 2022)

Depending on circumstances, there might be the scope to sort of fly under the radar, 'ask forgiveness, not permission' sort of thing.

At our place, we've basically just quietly (well, not _that _quietly, tbf   ) gone about having meetings in work time, and so far it's not been enough of an issue to get called on, far as I'm aware. That said, not sure how true that is of certain depts. (e.g. security), where it's possibly not as easy for a large portion of the workforce to be in the same (physical or virtual) place at the same time.


----------



## moochedit (Sep 15, 2022)

The Business Desk: Amazon workers in Coventry begin first ever strike ballot in UK | TheBusinessDesk.com.









						Amazon workers in Coventry begin first ever strike ballot in UK | TheBusinessDesk.com
					

Any industrial action likely to take place in November



					www.thebusinessdesk.com


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 15, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> not sure.  it's a while since i've been part of a workplace branch set-up (mostly in non 'recognised' jobs recently) - i'm sure at a past recognised place we did have meetings in work time when it was round major reorganisations (which were fairly frequent) but not sure if it's different when it's just about a pay claim.


You definitely can have meetings in work time around a pay claim, but I suppose probably not if you're in a non-recognised job?

Anyway, UoLeeds have now announced their dates:


And more dates announced at port of Felixstowe:








						Fresh strike dates announced in Felixstowe dispute as workers reject imposed pay deal
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Sure I saw something about how action at Liverpool was definitely still going ahead as well, but can't find it now.

And 26 FE colleges:








						Unprecedented 10 days of strike action to hit English colleges over low pay
					

Staff at 26 further education colleges will take ten days of strike action starting on Monday 26 September unless employers make a significant pay rise to deal with the cost-of-living crisis, UCU confirmed. The action will amount to the biggest set of strikes ever in further education.




					www.ucu.org.uk


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 15, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> You definitely can have meetings in work time around a pay claim, but I suppose probably not if you're in a non-recognised job?



fairly sure union/s are recognised - it's a council albeit a fairly tory one (fairly old fashioned rural type tories)

i haven't really got the hang of what sort of proportion of people are members - i've been wfh-ing since i started there (i started while this was an emergency / unofficial thing) but now all 'back office' staff are home based, so seeing / talking to people isn't easy.

not sure what effect wfh-ing is going to have on unions (in the sort of job where people do wfh)


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 16, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> fairly sure union/s are recognised - it's a council albeit a fairly tory one (fairly old fashioned rural type tories)
> 
> i haven't really got the hang of what sort of proportion of people are members - i've been wfh-ing since i started there (i started while this was an emergency / unofficial thing) but now all 'back office' staff are home based, so seeing / talking to people isn't easy.
> 
> not sure what effect wfh-ing is going to have on unions (in the sort of job where people do wfh)


Yeah, it's certainly going to make picketing quite a challenge!

Anyway, sounds like Liverpool's definitely going ahead:










						Liverpool port strike goes ahead as parties fail to reach agreement
					

Dockworkers at the Port of Liverpool have rejected the employer’s latest offer, confirming a two-week strike threatening more disruptions.




					www.porttechnology.org
				




I hadn't realised until now that the strike is due to start on Monday morning, which I suppose must have been chosen some way in advance, but is quite funny timing now.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 16, 2022)

Unite still holding protests in Liverpool over Laing O'Rourke trying to keep unions off the Everton stadium building site:


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 16, 2022)

More UNISON HE dates:


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 17, 2022)

RMT national is apparently maybe back on for 1 and 5 October, although they don't seem to have said anything public about it yet:








						Rail strikes in October to target Conservative conference
					

Train operators are understood to have been notified of two 24-hour walkouts on 1 and 5 October




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 20, 2022)

RMT officially back out on the 1st, which is gonna make it a pretty massive day:


			RMT to strike across the rail network on October 1st
		


Some HE Unison branches started striking today - bit late now, but here's the Scottish picket details for today and tomorrow:


Unite asking people to get down to the port of Liverpool to support the strikes tomorrow morning:


And there's a big "climate activists support the strike" thing planned for Friday:








						Liverpool Climate activists support the Liverpool Dockers strike - 23rd September
					

We are calling all Climate activists in Liverpool to join us in supporting the Liverpool Dockers who will be striking for 10 days for better pay and against the Cost of Living crisis. Their strike starts on 19th September (no picket that day due to Queen's funeral) and will last until 1st...




					actionnetwork.org


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 20, 2022)

On the way home from an evening of making placards as we head out for three days next week.

I'm already knackered and it hasn't even started yet!


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 20, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> On the way home from an evening of making placards as we head out for three days next week.
> 
> I'm already knackered and it hasn't even started yet!


Solidarity!


----------



## MickiQ (Sep 21, 2022)

OK Urbs, time to make yourselves useful. The rail strike on 1 October is going to cause massive disruption and expense for the Q's (and I've been cheering for them too). My MiL and her 18 year old granddaughter were supposed to be coming to my house on that day on the train from Liverpool. Clearly they are not going to do that now and someone (probably me) will get stuck with a 200 mile round trip to deliver them.
However they along with my eldest daughter were supposed to be going onwards to London on the 2nd.
So for those of you in the know how long will things take to return to normal or near normal on Sunday? Mid morning? Late afternoon? They're heading for a hotel for a one night stay so not time critical as to when they leave on Sunday but given my MiL is 82 years old she doesn't really want to still travelling come midnight.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 21, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> OK Urbs, time to make yourselves useful. The rail strike on 1 October is going to cause massive disruption and expense for the Q's (and I've been cheering for them too). My MiL and her 18 year old granddaughter were supposed to be coming to my house on that day on the train from Liverpool. Clearly they are not going to do that now and someone (probably me) will get stuck with a 200 mile round trip to deliver them.
> However they along with my eldest daughter were supposed to be going onwards to London on the 2nd.
> So for those of you in the know how long will things take to return to normal or near normal on Sunday? Mid morning? Late afternoon? They're heading for a hotel for a one night stay so not time critical as to when they leave on Sunday but given my MiL is 82 years old she doesn't really want to still travelling come midnight.


Is coach travel an option, or would your MiL also understandably prefer to avoid coaches?


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 21, 2022)

Anyway, Unison now finally have a proper list of which unis are out when:








						University staff to strike over pay as new term begins | News, Press release | News | UNISON National
					

Workers have reached breaking point and have little choice but to strike




					www.unison.org.uk


----------



## MickiQ (Sep 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Is coach travel an option, or would your MiL also understandably prefer to avoid coaches?


That's a thought we will have to check into that as a possibility.


----------



## Serge Forward (Sep 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Anyway, Unison now finally have a proper list of which unis are out when:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Were not all branches balloted? I was just talking to a Unison member at a university. Says it's the first he's heard of it. Unison is such a shite union.


----------



## Bingoman (Sep 21, 2022)

999 call handlers join strikes









						Hundreds of 999 call handlers to join strikes in October
					

Emergency call centre staff will join 40,000 BT workers walking out in October, their union says.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 21, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> Were not all branches balloted? I was just talking to a Unison member at a university. Says it's the first he's heard of it. Unison is such a shite union.


Assuming my brain is serving up the right memory, each branch was asked to decide whether they wanted to ballot or not.

So if a particular branch's committee decided not to, ot would have gone no further.

Reasons for decisions aside, though, the fact that the membership still wouldn't hear about it either from their branch or UNISON HQ is naturally an issue in itself.

Equally, pretty sure I've said before, but I certainly feel like HE is generally overlooked and under-supported in UNISON, often treated as an afterthought.

In fact, me and the treasurer were saying as much in the pub no more than an hour ago


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 22, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> ... So if a particular branch's committee decided not to, ot would have gone no further.
> 
> Reasons for decisions aside, though, the fact that the membership still wouldn't hear about it either from their branch or UNISON HQ is naturally an issue in itself.


I wasn't aware of this; rather weird, and - as you say - there is a problem here, if branch members wanted a ballot but the committee unilaterally decided not to bother with one. In such a case, would members even be notified that this had occurred, either by their branch or by HQ?

In our (HE) branch we were indeed balloted, and around 85% were in favour of strike action. But because only 40% of ballot papers were returned, it's null and void. One of our reps was saying they may try again in three months' time... it's f***ing infuriating though.

Why the blazes - we're in the C21st now - does it have to be a physical ballot paper to be returned by post, when I'm sure it must be possible for secure, confidential ballots to be conducted online - if I need to change my electoral register details for example, change of occupants in the flat etc - it's done online.
A cynic might suggest UK union industrial action ballots must still be done by post so as to reduce the number of respondents... do all unions use this antiquated system or is it just UNISON!?

One of our branch people suggested there may be an issue with some of our younger, lower-paid members who must of necessity be renting and changing addresses quite often, but don't notify UNISON of their new address, so that they don't receive their ballot papers.

I received repeated reminders to return my ballot, reminders sent by email, text etc, so I can hardly imagine members were unaware of the ballot.

Whatever the explanation, it's a pisser though - as I'd hate to be in a position where there was a wave of strikes across the country later this year, but we weren't (officially) able to participate


----------



## ska invita (Sep 22, 2022)

Truss confirming she will go ahead with planned attack on unions... General ("coordinated") strike is looking a certainty


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Sep 22, 2022)

scalyboy said:


> I wasn't aware of this; rather weird, and - as you say - there is a problem here, if branch members wanted a ballot but the committee unilaterally decided not to bother with one. In such a case, would members even be notified that this had occurred, either by their branch or by HQ?
> 
> In our (HE) branch we were indeed balloted, and around 85% were in favour of strike action. But because only 40% of ballot papers were returned, it's null and void. One of our reps was saying they may try again in three months' time... it's f***ing infuriating though.
> 
> ...


A lot of UCU ballots never arrived in time to return them in my branch (and anecdotally in other branches too) in the last round of ballots


----------



## Jeff Robinson (Sep 22, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Truss confirming she will go ahead with planned attack on unions... General ("coordinated") strike is looking a certainty



This winter we'll see the most important and intense class conflict since the Thatcher years. Either the workers prevail or the barbaric Truss regime does, and the consequences of the barbaric Truss regime winning are unthinkable.


----------



## Bingoman (Sep 22, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Truss confirming she will go ahead with planned attack on unions... General ("coordinated") strike is looking a certainty


I think a General strike would bring down this government ifmshed tryed it but I also think the economy would be affected too


----------



## moochedit (Sep 22, 2022)

scalyboy said:


> I wasn't aware of this; rather weird, and - as you say - there is a problem here, if branch members wanted a ballot but the committee unilaterally decided not to bother with one. In such a case, would members even be notified that this had occurred, either by their branch or by HQ?
> 
> In our (HE) branch we were indeed balloted, and around 85% were in favour of strike action. But because only 40% of ballot papers were returned, it's null and void. One of our reps was saying they may try again in three months' time... it's f***ing infuriating though.
> 
> ...


I think by law it has to be a postal ballet. I think unions have asked the goverment to update the law to allow online without success.

Edit...









						Three years of silence – the government’s response to electronic balloting must be lost in the post
					

You can order your shopping, pay your bills and even vote in many political party ballots online. But when it comes to voting in union elections, the government insists only paper postal ballots will do.




					www.tuc.org.uk


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 22, 2022)

moochedit said:


> I think by law it has to be a postal ballet. I think unions have asked the goverment to update the law to allow online without success.
> 
> Edit...
> 
> ...


Thanks. I thought as much - the scheming bastards. The TUC link says even the Conservatives can choose their mayoral candidate online...
[edited to add: and this 50% threshold is a bollox too; it doesn't seem to apply in general or local elections, funny that...]


----------



## The39thStep (Sep 22, 2022)

Bingoman said:


> I think a General strike would bring down this government ifmshed tryed it but I also think the economy would be affected too


The economy is still recovering from the one day shut down last Monday


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 22, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Truss confirming she will go ahead with planned attack on unions... General ("coordinated") strike is looking a certainty


Bring it on! 
Provided our UNISON branch can return over 50% ballot papers, that is...


----------



## ska invita (Sep 22, 2022)

Jeff Robinson said:


> This winter we'll see the most important and intense class conflict since the Thatcher years. Either the workers prevail or the barbaric Truss regime does, and the consequences of the barbaric Truss regime winning are unthinkable.


In reality I expect to see a protracted standoff which will be 'resolved' by the next general election. Interesting to see how Stramer tries to triangulate his way out of this one


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 22, 2022)

ska invita said:


> In reality I expect to see a protracted standoff which will be 'resolved' by the next general election. Interesting to see how Stramer tries to triangulate his way out of this one


Could the unions withhold their Labour Party funding unless Starmer stops being a twat? Isn’t that a major source of Labour’s funding, or, with the decline in union membership over the past 40 years, have Labour turned to wealthy business people for donations?


----------



## Sue (Sep 22, 2022)

scalyboy said:


> Could the unions withhold their Labour Party funding unless Starmer stops being a twat? Isn’t that a major source of Labour’s funding, or, with the decline in union membership over the past 40 years, have Labour turned to wealthy business people for donations?


Imagine it depends on individual union rulebooks but guessing it's not straightforward. Ultimately, they could disaffiliate from Labour (as the RMT, for example, did) but again, think that's not very straightforward. 

(Obviously individual members can opt out of contributing to their union's political fund.)


----------



## Kev424242 (Sep 22, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> OK Urbs, time to make yourselves useful. The rail strike on 1 October is going to cause massive disruption and expense for the Q's (and I've been cheering for them too). My MiL and her 18 year old granddaughter were supposed to be coming to my house on that day on the train from Liverpool. Clearly they are not going to do that now and someone (probably me) will get stuck with a 200 mile round trip to deliver them.
> However they along with my eldest daughter were supposed to be going onwards to London on the 2nd.
> So for those of you in the know how long will things take to return to normal or near normal on Sunday? Mid morning? Late afternoon? They're heading for a hotel for a one night stay so not time critical as to when they leave on Sunday but given my MiL is 82 years old she doesn't really want to still travelling come midnight.


I travelled from South London to Skipton in Yorkshire on the19th August. RMT were on strike on the 18th and 20th. I took Thameslink to St Pancras, who started their service later than usual,  Kings X to Warrington at 11am, and then 2 local Northern trains. Had mentally prepared myself for disruption, but everything ran like clockwork. Saying that trains can be a nightmare on Sundays, at the best of times!


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 22, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> Were not all branches balloted? I was just talking to a Unison member at a university. Says it's the first he's heard of it. Unison is such a shite union.


Yep, I see this has already been covered a bit but I think definitely the majority of branches were balloted, so the odds are that they were balloted and he just didn't hear about it... which, if that's what happened, would certainly be a big issue in itself.

If I remember rightly, one of the ways that the left's making progress in Unison is that I think that this time all branches were asked if they wanted to ballot on an opt-out basis, whereas the last time round they were asked on an opt-in basis with a really short time frame, so if any branch secretaries missed the email or were on holiday for the long week they were pretty much ruled out automatically.


scalyboy said:


> I wasn't aware of this; rather weird, and - as you say - there is a problem here, if branch members wanted a ballot but the committee unilaterally decided not to bother with one. In such a case, would members even be notified that this had occurred, either by their branch or by HQ?
> 
> In our (HE) branch we were indeed balloted, and around 85% were in favour of strike action. But because only 40% of ballot papers were returned, it's null and void. One of our reps was saying they may try again in three months' time... it's f***ing infuriating though.


God, that "in three months time" thing is properly enraging - as I understand it, the strategy that the elected national leadership for the HE sector had agreed on was that all the branches that didn't manage to get over the line would be reballoted ASAP, hopefully more or less coinciding with the UCU ballot that also started just after the Unison one finished. And Unison officialdom seem to have pretty much just said "no, we can't do that, maybe we'll let you have another go in three months' time".



scalyboy said:


> One of our branch people suggested there may be an issue with some of our younger, lower-paid members who must of necessity be renting and changing addresses quite often, but don't notify UNISON of their new address, so that they don't receive their ballot papers.
> 
> I received repeated reminders to return my ballot, reminders sent by email, text etc, so I can hardly imagine members were unaware of the ballot.
> 
> Whatever the explanation, it's a pisser though - as I'd hate to be in a position where there was a wave of strikes across the country later this year, but we weren't (officially) able to participate


Well, clearly you actually read your emails and so on, but I'm not sure that all members do, and the turnout seems to reflect that. The change of addresses thing is certainly a big issue and I'd hope that a competent branch would be doing a big push to get people's addresses up to date before the start of a ballot, as well as checking in to see who has or hasn't got theirs and encouraging people to update their details and request replacement papers where necessary. If you haven't already, for next time round I'd definitely encourage you to contact your branch and ask if there's anything you can do to help with the ballot effort - unfortunately, Unison's paranoia and general inertia mean that they're often not good at getting rank-and-file members involved in ballot campaigns, but even just stuff like talking to the people you work with and asking if they've received their ballots/voted yet can be really helpful.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 22, 2022)

Also, the news from the Royal Mail negotiations sounds fucked:

And new RMT date set for October 8: 








						RMT announces new strike date in national rail dispute
					

RAIL UNION RMT has announced that railway workers will walkout across the country on October 8 in the ongoing fight over jobs, pay and working conditions.



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## moochedit (Sep 22, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Also, the news from the Royal Mail negotiations sounds fucked:
> View attachment 344006
> And new RMT date set for October 8:
> 
> ...


"A new cwu reps structure" - are they telling the union how to organise themselves?


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 22, 2022)

Cheery little clip from the port of Liverpool today:


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 22, 2022)

moochedit said:


> "A new cwu reps structure" - are they telling the union how to organise themselves?


Sounds a bit like it? Your guess is as good as mine really.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 22, 2022)

moochedit said:


> "A new cwu reps structure" - are they telling the union how to organise themselves?


Having started prepping my walk at 7.30 this morning I have just got home.

Yes they want to destroy the workplace structure of the union. While I was out for 10 hours today trying to maintain a service to the public in the face of sustained and significant understaffing, the Royal Mail management were seeking to drive a coach and horses through every agreement they have signed up to, be it with their employees on terms and conditions, the CWU or the public with regard to service provision. They have just upped the anti and shown their hand about breaking up the business.

Tired and angry - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 22, 2022)

Look up CWU on twitter and there is a recording of a 50 min plus live session up dating members on today's events; sorry not sure how to link but this the CWU account.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 22, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> God, that "in three months time" thing is properly enraging - as I understand it, the strategy that the elected national leadership for the HE sector had agreed on was that all the branches that didn't manage to get over the line would be reballoted ASAP, hopefully more or less coinciding with the UCU ballot that also started just after the Unison one finished. And Unison officialdom seem to have pretty much just said "no, we can't do that, maybe we'll let you have another go in three months' time".


   Aargh.
Yes, I've often thought that if UNISON and UCU co-ordinated strikes and other actions together, it would have far greater impact.

My impression, from speaking with UCU colleagues and friends, is that UCU are a good deal more up for it; maybe it varies from branch to branch but I felt their recent strategy of strike days over four (?) weeks, increasing in frequency each week, was a lot more effective than a single 'day of action', and made a substantial impact (I heard that senior management at one FE or HE workplace caved in and agreed to a decent pay increase as a result)


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 22, 2022)

scalyboy said:


> Yes, I've often thought that if UNISON and UCU co-ordinated strikes and other actions together, it would have far greater impact.
> 
> My impression, from speaking with UCU colleagues and friends, is that UCU are a good deal more up for it; maybe it varies from branch to branch but I felt their recent strategy of strike days over four (?) weeks, increasing in frequency each week, was a lot more effective than a single 'day of action', and made a substantial impact (I heard that senior management at one FE or HE workplace caved in and agreed to a decent pay increase as a result)


Ucu may be up for it but in previous years their leadership have shown scant interest in coordination


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 22, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Well, clearly you actually read your emails and so on, but I'm not sure that all members do, and the turnout seems to reflect that. The change of addresses thing is certainly a big issue and I'd hope that a competent branch would be doing a big push to get people's addresses up to date before the start of a ballot, as well as checking in to see who has or hasn't got theirs and encouraging people to update their details and request replacement papers where necessary. If you haven't already, for next time round I'd definitely encourage you to contact your branch and ask if there's anything you can do to help with the ballot effort - unfortunately, Unison's paranoia and general inertia mean that they're often not good at getting rank-and-file members involved in ballot campaigns, but even just stuff like talking to the people you work with and asking if they've received their ballots/voted yet can be really helpful.


Yep, I emailed the branch rep a week ago and suggested that if they need to sort out and update the branch membership lists, contact details etc, I could help - that type of repetitive, spreadsheet-tastic, attention-to-detail task...several hours staring at a screen... is the sort of thing I do at work anyway, and I quite enjoy it ! (maybe a high-functioning spectrum thing). Not heard back yet but will chase them up... although it could be that the difficult part isn't going to be updating a spreadsheet, but getting word out to members and stressing the importance of letting the branch know of any changes of address or other contact details.

For example, if we could access the work email system to contact members, we'd at least know that we had _a_ current email address. I reckon we will have to sit down and 'brainstorm' a few ideas (hopefully in the pub) as to how best to get the message/s across. It may be that out-of-date postal addresses isn't the only or the main problem, however.

I know pretty much for a fact that some colleagues' reasons for joining a union are simply as a form of 'insurance', in case they ever faced redundancy or a disciplinary hearing; they don't have a sense of acting as a collective. For members like this, they may well regard a ballot for industrial action with indifference; it will only mean loss of pay if strike action is balloted for and goes ahead. Or it will mean their discomforture and embarrassment if they choose not to strike and end up crossing a picket line!

Anecdotally, I do feel that the generations younger than myself - which is pretty much everyone (I can just about remember the 1970s with its much higher union membership, a time when union leaders were household names etc) - may not fully understand what the role of a union is, and what it can achieve.  

I heard of someone recently at our UNISON branch who wasn't aware there was such a thing as strike pay...I don't mean to sound patronising or piss-taking; I think this lack of awareness is just the natural result of the perceived decline in union power and influence over the past 40 years. This is just my impression at our workplace, its branch & members, and that of my partner at hers. Things may well be different elsewhere in other employment sectors and in other areas of the country.
But yes, you're right to say that just talking to people at work can be very useful - asking if they've received their ballot papers, or more generally chatting about the union, and emphasising specific wins and achievements.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 22, 2022)

scalyboy said:


> Aargh.
> Yes, I've often thought that if UNISON and UCU co-ordinated strikes and other actions together, it would have far greater impact.
> 
> My impression, from speaking with UCU colleagues and friends, is that UCU are a good deal more up for it; maybe it varies from branch to branch but I felt their recent strategy of strike days over four (?) weeks, increasing in frequency each week, was a lot more effective than a single 'day of action', and made a substantial impact (I heard that senior management at one FE or HE workplace caved in and agreed to a decent pay increase as a result)


Yes, that is usually the rule, so it's a bit confusing how we've now ended up in a place where we have some Unison branches taking action while UCU are still fairly early on in their ballot. I also get the impression that a lot of UCU members were quite burned out by the end of last year's action, I'm hoping that they'll have recovered from that now? But yes, the lack of coordination is shocking.


scalyboy said:


> Yep, I emailed the branch rep a week ago and suggested that if they need to sort out and update the branch membership lists, contact details etc, I could help - that type of repetitive, spreadsheet-tastic, attention-to-detail task...several hours staring at a screen... is the sort of thing I do at work anyway, and I quite enjoy it ! (maybe a high-functioning spectrum thing). Not heard back yet but will chase them up... although it could be that the difficult part isn't going to be updating a spreadsheet, but getting word out to members and stressing the importance of letting the branch know of any changes of address or other contact details.


My guess would be that for GDPR reasons they won't let you anywhere near the spreadsheets if you're not on the branch committee, but if you're willing to agree to sign up for some formal position that sounds like a useful thing to do?



scalyboy said:


> For example, if we could access the work email system to contact members, we'd at least know that we had _a_ current email address. I reckon we will have to sit down and 'brainstorm' a few ideas (hopefully in the pub) as to how best to get the message/s across. It may be that out-of-date postal addresses isn't the only or the main problem, however.
> 
> I know pretty much for a fact that some colleagues' reasons for joining a union are simply as a form of 'insurance', in case they ever faced redundancy or a disciplinary hearing; they don't have a sense of acting as a collective. For members like this, they may well regard a ballot for industrial action with indifference; it will only mean loss of pay if strike action is balloted for and goes ahead. Or it will mean their discomforture and embarrassment if they choose not to strike and end up crossing a picket line!
> 
> ...


Yep, that's all totally understandable - there's a huge number of people who've never been on strike before, so it makes sense that they'd never have given much thought to things like strike pay.


----------



## Serge Forward (Sep 23, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Yep, I see this has already been covered a bit but I think definitely the majority of branches were balloted, so the odds are that they were balloted and he just didn't hear about it... which, if that's what happened, would certainly be a big issue in itself.


My mate can be a bit of a dope but I'd be surprised he didn't hear about it, if anything was happening... especially if there was even a basic GTVO campaign. He says he'll ask what happened.


----------



## belboid (Sep 23, 2022)

PCS ballot is finally starting on the 26th.  Six weeks, plus notice time, so little chance of it being part of a coordinated action with the other big unions.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 23, 2022)

belboid said:


> PCS ballot is finally starting on the 26th.  Six weeks, plus notice time, so little chance of it being part of a coordinated action with the other big unions.


I'm not sure if you're more or less optimistic than me there, but I reckon there's every chance of some of the current disputes running long enough that coordinated action with PCS becomes possible. Certainly if there's any possibility of the health unions taking action, I don't think that's likely to be any earlier than the PCS ballot. Let alone the chance of a Unison reballot in their non-currently-striking HE branches, as mentioned above.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 23, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> My mate can be a bit of a dope but I'd be surprised he didn't hear about it, if anything was happening... especially if there was even a basic GTVO campaign. He says he'll ask what happened.


For anyone who's interested, it's no longer there on the current version of the page, but the Unison HE disputes page as it was this summer had a list of all the places that were balloting, so you can see if his branch was on that.

Anyway, Unite have a pretty decent campaign page up for the Liverpool dockers' strike, includes various graphics/posters to share and a form to send messages of solidarity:








						Back the Liverpool docks strike
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## Serge Forward (Sep 23, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> For anyone who's interested, it's no longer there on the current version of the page, but the Unison HE disputes page as it was this summer had a list of all the places that were balloting, so you can see if his branch was on that.


They're not on that list, which tells me either the branch committee or regional office didn't think they had much chance of getting near the threshold.  Either way, that's piss poor.


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 23, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> They're not on that list, which tells me either the branch committee or regional office didn't think they had much chance of getting near the threshold.  Either way, that's piss poor.


Well, on one hand that's crap but on the other I suppose it's more reassuring than if they tried to run a ballot without any of their members knowing about it? I think there are also a few branches who've opted out of national bargaining, but as I understand it those usually tend to be the strongest branches who can get better results for their members without going through the national structures, and it doesn't sound like that's the case here?


----------



## Serge Forward (Sep 24, 2022)

Nah, I get the impression unison are a bit weak at my workplace. Most admin and ancillary staff seem to come in through a temp agency these days and it's all a bit fucked.


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 24, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> Nah, I get the impression unison are a bit weak at my workplace. Most admin and ancillary staff seem to come in through a temp agency these days and it's all a bit fucked.


Sounds sadly familiar 😨


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 24, 2022)

Strike Map and BFAWU seem to be doing a proper launch of their Organise Now project:










						Organise Now! Support for new worker organising
					

Organise Now is a new worker-led campaign for mass organising of workplaces during a period of increased militancy and a growing cost of living crisis.




					www.organisenow.org.uk
				




Sounds like a good idea and one that's much needed:


> What is Organise Now?​Organise Now is a collective of experienced workers from across the Trade Union and social justice movements, dedicated to, and with track records of, helping workers defend their pay and conditions -  and to secure better work lives through collaborating with others.
> 
> How does it work?​We have a support form for workers who want support and advice. After submitting the form, you will receive a call within 72 hours. We will put you in touch with an experienced organiser. They will listen to you and assist you in forming a plan on how to build change.


----------



## Serge Forward (Sep 24, 2022)

Great initiative. I see Notes from below are involved as well.


----------



## teqniq (Sep 24, 2022)

Very concise


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 24, 2022)

Video from Glasgow Uni this week, looks decent although Dailymotion seems to be absolutely infested with ads (you can watch this with an adblocked when it's embedded in u75, but it won't let you watch with an adblocker if you go to the actual page):


----------



## Lord Camomile (Sep 24, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Video from Glasgow Uni this week, looks decent although Dailymotion seems to be absolutely infested with ads (you can watch this with an adblocked when it's embedded in u75, but it won't let you watch with an adblocker if you go to the actual page):



Shared with our Strike WhatsApp group 



teqniq said:


> Very concise



And will be sharing this later (don't want to overload 'em...  )


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 24, 2022)

Just on the reballoting Unison HE branches that didn't meet the threshold thing, I didn't want to post gossip that I'd only heard through word of mouth, but just found an article where a member of the NEC confirms what I'd been hearing: 








						Strikes at start of university term
					

After a successful ballot 21 Unison Higher Education (HE) branches will strike at the start of the new academic year for higher pay against a paltry 3% offer. The claim is for RPI plus 2%. Branches that opted out of the first disaggregated ballot and branches who were unsuccessful will have the...




					www.workersliberty.org
				






> The date for the new ballot is subject to negotiation inside Unison. The HE Service Group Executive (SGE) are arguing for the second ballot as soon as possible so any new strikes coincide with potential UCU action. Disgracefully, some bureaucrats in Unison HQ are arguing that the small HE service group might have to get in a queue for balloting behind bigger health and local government service groups.


GET IN A QUEUE FOR BALLOTING. This idea that you can't have different sections of the union balloting at the same time...never mind co-ordinating action across unions, these useless fucks want to make it impossible for one union to co-ordinate with itself. And just to stress again, the SGE that's arguing for the reballots to start immediately is an elected body* that seems to be being overruled by unelected officials. 

* at least in theory, as I've mentioned elsewhere the knackered state of democracy in the union means that a lot of them are just elected unopposed because no-one can be bothered to run against them. But still, at least there's a mechanism by which they can potentially be challenged and replaced, which is more than you can say for some.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Sep 26, 2022)




----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 26, 2022)

arriva london bus strike paused to consider new pay offer

arriva 'shires' (north london home counties) strikes off - new pay offer between 10 - 11 % accepted

london united buses - new pay offer around 10% accepted following strikes


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 27, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> Had an online branch meeting one evening earlier this week.  2 people turned up (not sure if the lunch time version was a bit busier)
> 
> offer is not quite what Unison had asked for - but it's still a lump sum (1.9K) increase across all grades, so between 4 and 10 % depending on where you are on the pay scale (higher % at the lowest pay grades) which is not bad apart from how inflation is.  seem to remember lump sum increases being asked for and not got in my previous time in local government (20+ years ago now.)
> 
> ...



UNISON local government report



> *UNISON members have voted to accept the pay offer. *Of those who voted, 63.5% voted to accept the offer and 36.5% voted to reject.



GMB and Unite have not yet concluded their consultations.  (Not quite sure what happens if they say no)


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 27, 2022)

CWU meeting on you tube, twitter and facebook tonight at 7.00pm; it's billed as 'the most important union meeting ever'.... I presume that they mean for the CWU. Please all feel free to tune in.

Perhaps it's worth adding that I think they are in right in terms of both the future of our jobs and the Royal Mail itself!

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 27, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> CWU meeting on you tube, twitter and facebook tonight at 7.00pm; it's billed as 'the most important union meeting ever'.... I presume that they mean for the CWU. Please all feel free to tune in.
> 
> Perhaps it's worth adding that I think they are in right in terms of both the future of our jobs and the Royal Mail itself!
> 
> Cheers - Louis MacNeice


Live now.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 27, 2022)

Significant escalation; hope you all get behind it.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 27, 2022)

Felixstowe back out again:








						Felixstowe dock workers return to picket lines
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Unite's HE section also balloting at 11 Scottish universities:








						2,000 workers at eleven universities balloted for strike action
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




In other news, I would recommend that anyone thinking of getting thousands of flyers printed to advertise their strike dates proofreads them very carefully first to check that their comms officer hasn't somehow managed to design them with days that don't actually exist.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Sep 27, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> check that their comms officer hasn't somehow managed to design them with days that don't actually exist.



don't tell the tories, or they will make it law that strikes are only allowed on days that don't exist...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Sep 27, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Significant escalation; hope you all get behind it.
> 
> Cheers - Louis MacNeice



Make sure you post up details of the hardship fund and any other way we can help Louis.


----------



## Serge Forward (Sep 28, 2022)

The people behind Strike Map are setting up strike clubs. I've joined my local one. Link here Join Strike Club


----------



## A380 (Sep 28, 2022)

Just voted 'yes' in the PCS ballot. Well I started my working life with a three week strike in the second year of my apprenticeship so it would complete the circle.

(Easier for me than most I know as I'm on a career break...)


----------



## hitmouse (Sep 28, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> The people behind Strike Map are setting up strike clubs. I've joined my local one. Link here Join Strike Club


Any idea what platform they're using for it? I signed up to join their reps network then found out they wanted me to use fucking Slack for it, so I never bothered following up. A more locally-focused thing sounds like it might well be more useful though, especially if they don't make me use Slack.


----------



## Serge Forward (Sep 28, 2022)

The East Mids one is using WhatsApp.


----------



## Dystopiary (Sep 28, 2022)

Lovely solidarity.


link


----------



## scalyboy (Sep 29, 2022)

UCL outsourced workers vote to strike  
“Outsourced security staff at @UCL have voted unanimously to strike over pay and union recognition… Workers are demanding £15/hr, the wage paid to security before UCL began outsourcing to slash pay decades ago…”

Donate to the strike fund


----------



## brogdale (Sep 29, 2022)

Encouraging news from NASUWT:


----------



## teqniq (Sep 30, 2022)

This is interesting. Not entirely sure if this is the right thread for it though. Maybe needs it's own thread:









						Unite will now be getting involved in politics directly
					

CLAIRE PEDEN announces a new initiative from Britain's second largest trade union to extend and deepen the class struggle in and beyond the workplace — and deliver results for the working class where politicians have failed




					morningstaronline.co.uk


----------



## ska invita (Sep 30, 2022)

teqniq said:


> This is interesting. Not entirely sure if this is the right thread for it though. Maybe needs it's own thread:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Doesnt say how though.


----------



## teqniq (Sep 30, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Doesnt say how though.


I see what you mean but it kinda does, it's just not big on specifics:



> That’s why Unite has launched a grassroots campaign to put people first before profit. We’re focusing our energy on building a popular, working-class fightback. Our demands are fair: affordable energy, better pay, freedom from food poverty, investment in the NHS and its workers — and of course, adequate pensions.
> 
> We already know that when workers join together, we win. Over the past year, Unite has won over £150m extra pay for our members in more than 450 pay disputes. Now, Unite aims to bring its campaign for justice, a fair deal, and better wages from the workplace to our communities. We can win a better deal together.
> 
> From workplace to community, we will be driving a nationwide strategy to help bring change. We want to drive this country’s political agenda instead of being on the sidelines commenting on it. Our stand will be with workers as we hold all elected politician to account. The ground is there for us to build on, and we’re just getting started.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 30, 2022)

Back from the picket line. Biggest turn out of pickets and supporters so far. Office closed gates locked, no post in or out. Same again tomorrow then over to Brighton for demo. Several colleagues talking about the need to escalate to a more protracted period of strike action; a week or ten days. December could be very interesting.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## MickiQ (Sep 30, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Back from the picket line. Biggest turn out of pickets and supporters so far. Office closed gates locked, no post in or out. Same again tomorrow then over to Brighton for demo. Several colleagues talking about the need to escalate to a more protracted period of strike action; a week or ten days. December could be very interesting.
> 
> Cheers - Louis MacNeice


These 19 days of strikes are they extra to the ones already booked? Have dates been set for them or are they just like banked ready waiting for dates to be selected?


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sep 30, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> These 19 days of strikes are they extra to the ones already booked? Have dates been set for them or are they just like banked ready waiting for dates to be selected?


They are extra dates, but not all members are striking on all days. The aim is that no individual will lose more than nine days pay. That said we are still seeking clarity on exactly which days we're out.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 1, 2022)

At our place security just got paid double! Arguably didn't even get the best deal for crossing the line!

More discussion in the comments that CWU haven't curculated their demands to members? Is that correct?

Presumably there's a strategy at play, but instinctively does seem a bit odd to ask members to strike for a deal they're not even sure of the details of.


----------



## LDC (Oct 1, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> The East Mids one is using WhatsApp.



Yeah, Yorkshire the same. Not that great as it stands tbh, but worth keeping an eye on I guess.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Oct 1, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> View attachment 345306
> 
> At our place security just got paid double! Arguably didn't even get the best deal for crossing the line!
> 
> ...


We are striking in opposition to what Royal Mail are proposing to impose on us; indeed they have already imposed part of their preferred deal. They haven't just come back with no movement in talks, instead at each stage they have upped the anti, the latest move being to say that job losses will have to take place. So the CWU position is say no pay cuts (which is what I'm facing...that is an actual pay cut not a real terms one after inflation is taken into account), no increase in standard hours, no compulsory Sunday working and retention of sick pay entitlement.

We know what the deal is on offer and we voted 97-98% against it. Royal Mail have come back with nothing but threats to us, to our union and to the fabric of the postal service itself. I would think it is one of the most explicable, least odd strikes ever entered into.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 1, 2022)

Ah, ok, so it's a strike aimed more at preventing things than gaining things (which isn't said dismissively, in case the tone is unclear in text).

As I say, just saw some members in the comments complaining about "the lack of transparency" from the CWU with regards to what they were saying in the talks with RMG.

Fucking hell, went to look for the original post, but at this point their timeline is just endless photos of picket lines  

<edit: a quick search found it>


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Oct 1, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Ah, ok, so it's a strike aimed more at preventing things than gaining things (which isn't said dismissively, in case the tone is unclear in text).
> 
> As I say, just saw some members in the comments complaining about "the lack of transparency" from the CWU with regards to what they were saying in the talks with RMG.
> 
> ...


I haven't read the whole thread but I can't see any posts from people identifying themselves as CWU members questioning a lack of transparency. There are a few comments along those lines but a couple I looked at seem to come from people shall we say not entirely sympathetic to trade unionism.

As for the trigger for the disputes (there is one over pay and one over conditions); both ballots were called in direct response to RMG proposals...so basically we are saying 'enough is enough' until you come back with something better.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 4, 2022)

teqniq said:


> This is interesting. Not entirely sure if this is the right thread for it though. Maybe needs it's own thread:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Discussed a bit over on the Enough is Enough thread, it feels like the Unite leadership have seen EiE, decided they want a bit of that energy, but instead of just doing the sensible thing and joining in with it, they've set  up their own smaller version, in a move sadly reminiscent of the daftest antics of bickering lefty sects.

On a more positive note, here's a scene from the Manchester Metropolitan University Unison strike this morning:


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 4, 2022)

Leeds also looking pretty impressive:


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 4, 2022)

A few things I missed cos it's been a busy few weeks:
Cleaners and porters striking at Royal Opera House:








						CAIWU News | Cleaners and porters at the Royal Opera House announce a day of strike action
					

CAIWU News | This Friday 30th September 2022, the cleaners and porters at the ROH will commence a day of strike action over their pay and working conditions. The picket line will take place from midday to 8pm, with a rally at 4pm




					www.caiwu.org.uk
				



Cleaners at University of the Arts London striking over outsourcing and staffing levels:

and their strike fund:








						Support High Holborn cleaners!
					

We are raising money to ensure that UAL High Holborn cleaners can go on strike and not lose income.




					www.crowdfunder.co.uk


----------



## Bingoman (Oct 6, 2022)

Ambulance staff to be balloted on strike action  in the north west and west Midland








						Paramedics and ambulance staff at West Midlands Ambulance Service being balloted for strike action
					

Almost 750 paramedics and ambulance staff at West Midlands Ambulance Service are being balloted for strike action over calls for a pay rise in line with inflation.




					www.expressandstar.com


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 6, 2022)

Was talking this week with someone who's involved in a (very small) hospital union branch who was saying that they'd stopped keeping track of their consultative ballot after it got past 80% turnout.


----------



## teqniq (Oct 8, 2022)




----------



## Puddy_Tat (Oct 8, 2022)




----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

Been looking for ways to make the picket more entertaining 

Tbf, though, aside from a few comments I've heard here and there, we've largely only heard support from students, etc (obvs our strikes don't have as much direct impact on the general public).

Could mebbe adapt, though. Or make it a placard-sized bingo card and get members of the public in on it!


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Oct 8, 2022)

New report from a striking HE worker:
Strike Report from a Higher Education Worker 

Also, hardship fundraiser for the Polyflor workers here:








						Help raise £10000 to help support our Polyflor mates who don't qualify for strike pay but who like the rest of us have bills to pay with zero wages coming in
					

Weʼre raising money to help support our Polyflor mates who don't qualify for strike pay but who like the rest of us have bills to pay with zero wages coming in. Support this JustGiving Crowdfunding Page.




					justgiving.com


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> New report from a striking HE worker:
> Strike Report from a Higher Education Worker


Haven't read the whole thing yet but some interesting thoughts, and a few ideas we've either talked about or I've wanted to suggest to our own branch committee.

However...

UNISON. It's written UNISON. Not Unison. UNISON.

I know, I know, it's not the point, but every time I read it it's like a little pinprick in my brain. And I have to read it a lot 

Non-members making the mistake is one thing, but still bemuses me how many members and reps get it wrong   

Anyway, as you were...


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Oct 8, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Non-members making the mistake is one thing, but still bemuses me how many members and reps get it wrong



it's complicated.

Unite is Unite not UNITE

and UNISON isn't an acronym like NALGO was


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 8, 2022)

Yes, certain reps, naming no names, know that it's officially written in allcaps but refuse to do so on principle cos of it not actually being an acronym or anything.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

Ok, it's late so my ADHD is skipping around a lot, but will come as no surprise that I share the frustrations around co-ordinating a joint timetable among both branches and between UNISON and UCU.



> In some ways, trying to take effective action has felt like a battle with Unison’s official structures as much as with the employer.



Hard "yup".



> the union nationally wants to concentrate on balloting in Health, and then may or may not consider reballoting in HE after all the other sectors are sorted out...
> 
> For members in those branches who got close to the line but not over it and were expecting a reballot, I can’t imagine how frustrating it must be to have to sit this round out because their own union doesn’t seem to consider them a priority.



* ahem *



Lord Camomile said:


> I certainly feel like HE is generally overlooked and under-supported in UNISON, often treated as an afterthought.



Also concerning to hear that branches are pulling out of national negotiations. I do kinda get it, particularly as a member of a strong and active branch at a rich university, but if nothing else it doesn't feel in the tradition of solidarity.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> it's complicated.
> 
> Unite is Unite not UNITE
> 
> and UNISON isn't an acronym like NALGO was



Oh aye, I get it, but I feel like those of us who are fairly active read it so much that at least _we_ should get it right!

Though I do have to remind myself that not everyone has my kind of brain, or has read the branding guidelines multiple times  



hitmouse said:


> Yes, certain reps, naming no names, know that it's officially written in allcaps but refuse to do so on principle cos of it not actually being an acronym or anything.


Heh, tbh, there _is _a bit of cognitive dissonance in my head for this exact reason, but, counter: all caps isn't _exclusive_ to acronyms. You can simply spell your name in all caps, if that's what you wanna do 

Aaaaaaaaaanyway, as I say, conscious that's not the substantive point of the article, so apologies for the derail.


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Haven't read the whole thing yet but some interesting thoughts, and a few ideas we've either talked about or I've wanted to suggest to our own branch committee.
> 
> However...
> 
> ...


Is it? Fuck me I've been wearing my unison Gay Lanyard for a year and I had no idea.


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

I'm not a member, I'm with GMB. I just can't resist a Gay Lanyard.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

Based on recent picket line experience, many can't


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Based on recent picket line experience, many can't


Yes!


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 8, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> UNISON. It's written UNISON. Not Unison.





HoratioCuthbert said:


> unison


A new contender appears!


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> A new contender appears!


I'm delighted you noticed, LC didn't even acknowledge me


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

I was _trying_ to move on


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 8, 2022)

uNiSoN


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

_unison_


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

_ùnisôn _


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

Don't make me open a ballot to picket this thread


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

Do it, I'm confident I've got Hitmouse onside and it's 23:18 on a Saturday night so no one else gives a fuck!


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)




----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)

Hey, I'm not going to make the same mistake certain unions have made and have a ludicrously short balloting period.

Need time to make phone calls, do walkarounds, print all the leaflets and merch, and book Mick Lynch and Jeremy Corbyn for the rally.


----------



## Ming (Oct 8, 2022)

I get paid in GBP about 50ish grand for doing exactly the band 5 standard RPN staff nurse post tasks that i did in the UK. Why? Because the union is strong here.

eta:


----------



## HoratioCuthbert (Oct 8, 2022)

Ming said:


> I get paid in GBP about 50ish grand for doing exactly the band 5 standard RPN staff nurse post tasks that i did in the UK. Why? Because the union is strong here.
> 
> eta:



YES


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Oct 9, 2022)

HoratioCuthbert said:


> View attachment 346374


Went to bed before seeing this at the time, but this is top-notch dedication.


----------



## teqniq (Oct 11, 2022)

Scab alert:






						London school uses law change to replace striking staff with agency workers | Schools | The Guardian
					

Drapers’ Pyrgo primary in Romford, where top managers were paid total of £1.49m in benefits, cut salaries or hours of 10 support staff<br>




					web.archive.org


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 11, 2022)

Article about the ongoing Polyflor strike, including picket locations:





						Polyflor profits hit £52 million as struggling workers strike
					

Polyflor can clearly afford to do better




					www.gmb.org.uk
				




There's a call for people to get down and support at lunchtime on the 13th, I've tried and failed to find a version of the flyer that isn't pixelated to fuck but had no success, at least the last few lines are readable though:


----------



## moochedit (Oct 14, 2022)

Royal mail announce 6000 redundacies  

I wonder how CWU will respond? (Already have 19 strike days I believe)









						Royal Mail to axe up to 10,000 jobs as losses rise
					

The postal service blames strike action and widening losses for the mass redundancies.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 14, 2022)

moochedit said:


> Royal mail announce 6000 redundacies
> 
> I wonder how CWU will respond? (Already have 19 strike days I believe)
> 
> ...


10000 in the guardian Royal Mail to cut up to 10,000 roles, blaming strikes and lower parcel volumes


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Oct 14, 2022)

They are upping the rhetorical ante in the face of absolutely solid industrial action.

They are also ignoring the fact that they cannot meet their contractual obligations re. universal service provision with current staffing levels.

CWU will continue to defend our terms and conditions, defend everybody's Royal Mail and develop the services for the future. 

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 14, 2022)

> Royal Mail also said it expects its full-year losses to hit £350m.
> 
> It said this included "the direct impact of eight days of industrial action"


_Every time _they make such a big deal of the financial impact (and others) of strikes, but _never_ make the connection that that's the value their workers provide.

Well, they probably do, they just don't want to make that connection _publicly._..


----------



## muscovyduck (Oct 14, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> _Every time _they make such a big deal of the financial impact (and others) of strikes, but _never_ make the connection that that's the value their workers provide.
> 
> Well, they probably do, they just don't want to make that connection _publicly._..


I don't think they do. I think they lie to themselves about it and a lot of the marketing and PR is to convince themselves rather than convince everyone else. There might be a couple people mixed in who understand but they'll be lying to themselves about other things, like the amount of agency they have over the situation and stuff like that.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 14, 2022)

Wanted to keep the strike thread about strikes, but because this is a bit more active than the other one, a little nudge in the direction of my question on the general union chat thread, in case anyone has any thoughts


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Oct 14, 2022)

CWU live on YouTube/Facebook/Twitter this afternoon at 4.30. Request is that as many people as possible join in and publicise as widely as possible; non CWU members warmly welcome....spread the word!

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 14, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> CWU live on YouTube/Facebook/Twitter this afternoon at 4.30. Request is that as many people as possible join in and publicise as widely as possible; non CWU members warmly welcome....spread the word!
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


Have shared in our branch strike chat 👍


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 14, 2022)

NEU preliminary indicative ballot seems to have gone well:








						Teachers call for strike action on pay
					

Teacher members have voted YES to formal ballot strike action on pay in preliminary ballot.




					neu.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 14, 2022)

Deliveroo wildcats popping off again:








						Delivery Riders Are Striking All Over the Place | Novara Media
					

In Luton, Welwyn Garden City, Hatfield, Harlow, Slough and Basingstoke, riders are striking against abysmal pay and long hours.




					novaramedia.com


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 17, 2022)

Drone footage of the Polyflor strikers rally thing:

With Billy Bragg soundtrack, so best watched on silent. 
Donations to their hardship fund at:








						Help raise £10000 to help support our Polyflor mates who don't qualify for strike pay but who like the rest of us have bills to pay with zero wages coming in
					

Weʼre raising money to help support our Polyflor mates who don't qualify for strike pay but who like the rest of us have bills to pay with zero wages coming in. Support this JustGiving Crowdfunding Page.




					www.justgiving.com


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 19, 2022)

Outsourced health workers organised in _ùnisôn_ striking against OCS have won:


Also, just found out that uNiSoN members are striking at the National Coal Mining Museum - write your own punchlines for that one:










						‘We want to get on with what we love’: what union activists are fighting for
					

A train cleaner, a 999 call handler and a museum guide say they are tired of feeling unvalued and being left behind financially




					www.theguardian.com
				




Also, new RMT strike date announcements, it sounds like November 3rd and 5th are not going to be good days to travel:








						RMT announces new Network Rail strike dates
					

Rail union RMT will take 3 days of coordinated strike action next month after Network Rail attempted to impose drastic changes in working practices on their staff.



					www.rmt.org.uk
				











						RMT launch strikes on train operating companies in national rail dispute
					

Rail union RMT will take strike action on 14 train operating companies on November 3 and 5 after no new offer on pay jobs and working conditions.



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 20, 2022)

UCU ballot doesn't close till tomorrow, but I've heard through the grapevine that they've booked a press conference through Monday and sent out a survey asking people when they want to take action. So it sounds like they're feeling pretty confident at the moment.


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 22, 2022)

More Deliveroo/Uber Eats/Just Eat wildcats in Leeds and Derby:








						'They use us like slaves': Leeds couriers striking this weekend over pay
					

Hundreds of couriers in Leeds are set to lay down their delivery bags this weekend in protest at the pay they receive.




					www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk
				











						Uber Eats and Deliveroo couriers to protest outside McDonald's
					

There will be a protest at McDonald's in St Peter's Street




					www.derbytelegraph.co.uk
				




Unite members at Uni of Glasgow now have a mandate:


UCU result won't be formally announced till Monday but it looks to me like they're getting ready to announce a successful vote.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 22, 2022)

Hmm, curious to see how this plays out


----------



## muscovyduck (Oct 22, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Hmm, curious to see how this plays out



Yikes


----------



## muscovyduck (Oct 22, 2022)

This is why RMT shouldn't have cancelled the last lot for the dead chief parasite. It emboldens these pricks


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 22, 2022)

It's not like I pay attention to these things anyway, but I didn't even know '_London_ Poppy Day' was a thing, separate from Remembrance Sunday


----------



## muscovyduck (Oct 22, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> It's not like I pay attention to these things anyway, but I didn't even know '_London_ Poppy Day' was a thing, separate from Remembrance Sunday


Remembrance Sunday is a big earner for the pubs, not surprised there's some sort of spin off thing to capitalise on it.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 25, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Hmm, curious to see how this plays out



Update:



Huh.


----------



## muscovyduck (Oct 25, 2022)

Let's consistently call of strikes at the times when they'd me most effective, that'll help


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 26, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Update:
> 
> 
> 
> Huh.






Its such an inconvenience - why not just cancel the whole fucking thing? (sarcasm).


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Oct 26, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Update:
> 
> 
> 
> Huh.



Only patriotic strikes will do. Fucking pathetic.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Oct 26, 2022)

arriva kent bus drivers accept new 13.9 % pay offer after strikes -









						Kent Arriva bus drivers vote to end strike after pay increase
					

Arriva drivers will receive a 13.92% pay rise, backdated to 23 April.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				





go-ahead london drivers accept new 10.5% pay offer after being about to ballot on strike action









						Go-Ahead London bus workers secure 10.5% pay rise
					

Improved offer came as Unite union prepared to ballot members for industrial action




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## LDC (Oct 27, 2022)

Interview with an RMT militant on the strikes, the union and the wider situation.






						Interview – Transport for London worker and RMT rep – On recent rail strikes – October 2022 - Angry Workers
					

We are seeing an increase in strike action in the UK, which is a good thing, but we don’t know much about the experiences and views of workers who are involved in them. We rely on the official statements of the trade union press officers, which doesn’t help us to answer the main questions when




					www.angryworkers.org


----------



## MickiQ (Oct 27, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> Only patriotic strikes will do. Fucking pathetic.


Why is this a bad thing? To have any chance of winning this strike the RMT needs to keep the public onside or at least not alienate them completely. The same as with striking during Brenda's funeral they had to decide which of  cancelling the strike or continuing with it would play better with public opinion. It's a difficult choice personally I feel Lynch made the right one.


----------



## Serge Forward (Oct 28, 2022)

Less public opinion, more likely members' opinion. You need to ensure the maximum number of members actually strike for it to be effective. What you don't want is your more patriotic-minded members wavering. You want a solid strike turnout, you need to pick your moment for maximum effect.


----------



## teqniq (Oct 28, 2022)

Well this is really shit:









						Nottingham tram workers balloting for strikes after bosses plan to slash terminally ill workers' pay
					






					morningstaronline.co.uk


----------



## MickiQ (Oct 28, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Well this is really shit:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's utterly shameful if it's just two guys they can surely work out some kind of medical severance package.


----------



## Sue (Oct 28, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Well this is really shit:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Utterly shameful. Companies seem to underestimate just how much shit like that can unify a workforce. Hope they manage to get the company to back down


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Oct 28, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> That's utterly shameful if it's just two guys they can surely work out some kind of medical severance package.


For some  bosses every employee's personal cloud has an economic silver lining.

In this case it's  being able to reduce labour costs (even if only marginally).

Obviously it is at the expense of the workers' quality of end of life, but hey ho those share holder dividends and executive bonuses won't make themselves.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 30, 2022)

Royal Mail have managed to get the strikes suspended for two weeks with legal threats:








						Royal Mail staff call off planned strike action
					

The strikes planned for the next two weeks will not take place but action will resume on 12 November.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 2, 2022)

Current Royal Mail dates, sounds like a big change from previously:


Waiting to hear from UCU but sounds very possible that they'll be out on the 24th-25th too.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 3, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Current Royal Mail dates, sounds like a big change from previously:
> View attachment 350001
> 
> Waiting to hear from UCU but sounds very possible that they'll be out on the 24th-25th too.


Yep those are the new dates. The rolling action sector by sector (e.g. deliveries one day, distribution the next) has been called off following a legal challenge from RM which threatened both strike ballots in their entirety. 

So we are now targeting  black Friday and cyber Monday with more dates in the run up to Christmas.

RM has made a new offer, which if anything is even worse than their original one (it is no longer back dated and it only provides 1.5% for next year). This will be put to members in a workplace ballot with a very firm recommendation to reject; I don't think the recommendation is needed, people can see it for what it is.

Onwards and upwards - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 3, 2022)

At a meeting this morning our office manager informed us that RM is looking to remove over 350 hours per week work from our office; this is the equivalent of three and a half full time posts plus a large amount of overtime. They went on to say that they were given this information at a meeting with 40 other delivery office managers all facing similar cutbacks; as they said 'we all had our heads in our hands'.

We were then asked to come up with suggestions for new ways of working that could deliver both the p[proposed cut in hours and delivery targets. The manager suggested moving to Monday to Friday postal and parcel delivery for all staff, with Saturday and Sunday parcels only service to be worked as overtime on a sixth/seventh working day. The idea of his being that currently the best part of 100 walks or rounds are failing every week; by failing all walks on Saturday this would reduce the amount to 46 failures. It was gently pointed that this wouldn't solve the problem of failing walks since there was an absolute certainty that walks would still fail in the week due to lack of cover for absent staff (on sick leave or annual leave for example) and that it would demand a significant increase in the number of people working 6 and 7 days a week.

This is just another example of how committed RM is to breaking the postal service in pursuit of their objective of running a casualised parcel courier operation. Colleagues are not impressed and we do feel that we are really up against it, both in terms of defending our pay and conditions and perhaps more importantly the service we provide. So if you are in positions where you are approached for help by the CWU or where you can reach out to your local posties or where you can just spread the message about what is at stake any help would be much appreciated.

We aren't going anywhere but we do need your support to see this through.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## MickiQ (Nov 3, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> We were then asked to come up with suggestions for new ways of working that could deliver both the proposed cut in hours and delivery targets.


 The answer you should give to that is "How the fuck do I know and why the fuck should I care?"


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 3, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> The answer you should give to that is "How the fuck do I know and why the fuck should I care?"


The actual response was more along the lines of stop RM lying to us, give us more resources and let us do our jobs...with with a little added fuck the fuck off!

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 3, 2022)

Well, UCU are going with three days, which I think is more than some expected.



Over to us UNISON branches with a mandate... Honestly don't know what our members will think.


----------



## elbows (Nov 4, 2022)

NHS England have started planning for how to cope with strikes, including 'Exercise Arctic Willow'.

They've been sending this sort of thing to management:



			https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/Preparedness-for-potential-industrial-action-in-the-NHS-November-2022.pdf


----------



## Bingoman (Nov 4, 2022)

Hundreds of workers to strike at Heathrow Airport in run-up to World Cup
					

Passengers using five major airlines are set to face the threat of disruption for at least three days from 18 November as 700 contractors, including ground handlers, prepare to walk out in pay disputes.




					news.sky.com


----------



## LDC (Nov 4, 2022)

"AROUND 700 workers at Princes Group sites across the UK, including at Bradford, have been secured a pay rise worth 11.5% through the efforts of Unite the Union.
The workers at four sites, located in Glasgow, Bradford, Cardiff and Long Sutton, Lincolnshire, will receive a seven per cent pay rise backdated to April 2022 plus a £750 one off payment. The deal was negotiated without the need for industrial action."









						Bradford's Princes food workers to receive pay rise
					

AROUND 700 workers at Princes Group sites across the UK, including at Bradford, have been secured a pay rise worth 11.5 per cent through the efforts…




					www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk


----------



## PR1Berske (Nov 4, 2022)




----------



## AmateurAgitator (Nov 4, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>



A con tactic to try to wear down the workers? We'll have to see, but I wouldn't be too surprised if this gives the bosses the upper hand now, though I hope not.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 4, 2022)

Would love to know just what "intensive negotiations" means...  

But aye, fingers crossed it's positive for the members, and not the bosses pulling a fast one. Would presume the RMT organisers wouldn't be taken in too easily?


----------



## PR1Berske (Nov 4, 2022)

Northern are still to run a strike timetable


----------



## stethoscope (Nov 5, 2022)

Looks like RCN have voted for strike action...









						Nurses across UK vote to strike in first ever national action
					

Exclusive: walkout over pay due to take place before Christmas




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## steveo87 (Nov 6, 2022)

Forgot to say last week, but the 'not very militant' teacher's Union (I can't remember their name) Mrs o87 is a member of, out Strike Ballots last week.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 6, 2022)

steveo87 said:


> Forgot to say last week, but the 'not very militant' teacher's Union (I can't remember their name) Mrs o87 is a member of, out Strike Ballots last week.


NEU (National Education Union)?


----------



## steveo87 (Nov 6, 2022)

Nah its got a fairly long name (sorry for being vague), Mr o87 voted yes, naturally, but it's extremely telling - she isn't in anyway political, and in her words didn't know 'anything about it' before meeting me.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 6, 2022)

Ah, mebbe NASUWT?

Sorry, have a pathological need to solve puzzles 

Either way, have certainly seen/heard of similar cases all over the place. Sadly there's few better recruitment drivers than horrendous working conditions, but at least unions are becoming more relevant/supported again.


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Nov 6, 2022)

Even early childhood practitioners are wondering how to agitate for change


----------



## steveo87 (Nov 6, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Ah, mebbe NASUWT?



YES!!!


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 6, 2022)

There's an article in the Times about RM with something from Vince Cable (who I think oversaw privatisation). I can't read it because of the paywall; can anyone access it for me?

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Dystopiary (Nov 6, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> There's an article in the Times about RM with something from Vince Cable (who I think oversaw privatisation). I can't read it because of the paywall; can anyone access it for me?
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


Is this is it Louis? 

Government and Ofcom will need to put their stamp on Royal Mail​
archive.ph


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 6, 2022)

Dystopiary said:


> Is this is it Louis?
> 
> Government and Ofcom will need to put their stamp on Royal Mail​
> archive.ph


Yep that's it.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## belboid (Nov 6, 2022)

Shelter ballot is pretty overwhelming 

69% turnout
86% in favour of industrial action


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 6, 2022)

Bloody hell, fucking _Shelter_??!

I know, I know, the charity sector has serious problems and isn't



> Shelter gave staff a 3% consolidated pay increase this April alongside a one-off payment of £1,500 paid in instalments in response to the cost-of-living crisis.
> 
> The charity argues that the one-off payment means non-management staff will effectively receive a pay increase of between 8% and 12.3%.



Right, and what abut next year, then? Will they call that a pay cut when staff _don't _get another 'one-off payment' to top up their wages?


----------



## cesare (Nov 6, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Bloody hell, fucking _Shelter_??!
> 
> I know, I know, the charity sector has serious problems and isn't
> 
> ...


I understand that some Shelter staff are giving advice to people with housing difficulties that are earning more than the Shelter Advisors.


----------



## cesare (Nov 6, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Bloody hell, fucking _Shelter_??!
> 
> I know, I know, the charity sector has serious problems and isn't
> 
> ...


Maybe I've misunderstood you - are you saying that Shelter employees don't have any grounds for this call to industrial action?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 6, 2022)

cesare said:


> Maybe I've misunderstood you - are you saying that Shelter employees don't have any grounds for this call to industrial action?


No, t'other way round - you'd think an organisation like Shelter of all folks would be invested in trying to make sure their staff weren't struggling.


----------



## Bingoman (Nov 9, 2022)

Nursing union the Royal College of Nursing announces first strike in its 106-year history
					

The RCN had called for its members to receive a pay rise of 5% above the RPI inflation rate, which currently stands at above 12%.




					news.sky.com


----------



## Ax^ (Nov 9, 2022)

jesus this is a big one 

but nurse should not be relying on bloody food banks


----------



## Bingoman (Nov 9, 2022)

Ax^ said:


> jesus this is a big one
> 
> but nurse should not be relying on bloody food banks


I agree shameful it really is


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Nov 9, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> No, t'other way round - you'd think an organisation like Shelter of all folks would be invested in trying to make sure their staff weren't struggling.



The charity sector has some of the worst employers and poorest terms and conditions in the UK. Unite organise in many of them and some are absolute scumbags.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Nov 9, 2022)

Bingoman said:


> Nursing union the Royal College of Nursing announces first strike in its 106-year history
> 
> 
> The RCN had called for its members to receive a pay rise of 5% above the RPI inflation rate, which currently stands at above 12%.
> ...



Newsnight interviewed the General Secretary of Unison (who are also balloting 350,000 NHS workers) on Monday. She claimed that staffing levels could _increase _during days of strike action. Apparently management and unions would have to agree minimum staffing levels for each ward which would be higher, in some cases, than the NHS is currently providing due to staffing shortages.


----------



## Serge Forward (Nov 9, 2022)

UCU November strike days... more to follow:


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 9, 2022)

According to someone involved in Unison in the NHS, RCN don't really have much in the way of an activist/rep layer cos of not really acting like a union most of the time, so a lot of this ballot campaign was just email and similar rather than actual on-the-ground campaigning. I can't confirm that myself, but it sounds plausible, and that is an amazing turnout if so. Unison NHS ballot closes on the 25th, Unite seem to be running a rolling campaign of balloting different areas, with the ambulance service and NHS Wales balloting now, looks like their Scottish ballot seems to have already finished?









						NHS workers deserve fair pay - Vote YES
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				




Here's the Unite Scottish results:








						Unite members reject latest NHS Scotland Pay offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## Serge Forward (Nov 9, 2022)

24th and 25th November, both CWU and UCU are on strike at the same time. Be good to see some inter-union united front stuff going on.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 9, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> 24th and 25th November, both CWU and UCU are on strike at the same time. Be good to see some inter-union united front stuff going on.


Think they might have picked those dates deliberately? As long as CWU are still out then, I can't keep up with stuff being announced and then called off. Suppose they have a pretty coordinated colour scheme already, which is the most important thing. Reckon there should be some HE Unison branches out on the day as well.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 9, 2022)

Ah yes, I'd clocked (and subsequently forgotten...  ) that overlap, and had similar thoughts.

Not entirely sure quite what it'd look like (aside from, yes, most likely a shitload of pink  ), but will try to remember to ask around again.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 9, 2022)

And IWGB at UCL are out next week:


----------



## locomotive (Nov 9, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> The charity sector has some of the worst employers and poorest terms and conditions in the UK. Unite organise in many of them and some are absolute scumbags.



I'm currently at a charity with no union presence at all. Spoken to some colleagues who are union-curious. Do you know what other unions have a presence in the sector?


----------



## Serge Forward (Nov 9, 2022)

There's Unite of course but also Community which specifically organises charity workers Community Trade Union - @CommunityUnion. Dunno how good they are though.

There's also Unison and GMB but I'm critical of both of these.

I see that IWGB also has a charity workers' branch too: IWGB Charity Workers Branch

locomotive if it were me, I'd go with IWGB if they're organising in your area. If not, go for Unite or possibly Community.


----------



## Bingoman (Nov 10, 2022)

Just Breaking on Sky News Civil servants the latest to vote for strike action


----------



## belboid (Nov 10, 2022)

yup, 86% vote to strike on a 51.something% turnout.   That's over the threshold in 126 employers, another six were a single vote short of reaching it!     All the major groups apart from HMRC (750 votes shy of the threshold) so they're being reballoted early next year.


----------



## elbows (Nov 10, 2022)

The list of hospital trusts which will have nurses strikes is here. My local hospital isnt one of them.









						Will nurses at your hospital go on strike? Check which trusts are affected
					

NHS trusts all over the UK will be affected - see below to find out if your local trust is involved.




					news.sky.com


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Nov 10, 2022)

elbows said:


> The list of hospital trusts which will have nurses strikes is here. My local hospital isnt one of them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Anyone know why these ballots have been disaggregated (in the NHS and the civil servants)? Their pay isn't set trust by trust/hospital by hospital is it?


----------



## belboid (Nov 10, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Anyone know why these ballots have been disaggregated (in the NHS and the civil servants)? Their pay isn't set trust by trust/hospital by hospital is it?


risk mitigation, i presume.  Barely got past 50% overall in PCS so it was tight and at least DWP would have been out this way even if the overall vote was lost.

E2a: actually the DWP only scraped past 50% by an even closer margin than nationally. The Rural Payments Agency looks like the biggest bunch of commies


----------



## Fedayn (Nov 10, 2022)

belboid said:


> yup, 86% vote to strike on a 51.something% turnout.   That's over the threshold in 126 employers, another six were a single vote short of reaching it!     All the major groups apart from HMRC (750 votes shy of the threshold) so they're being reballoted early next year.



Yup, hopefully we get info soon, Union NEC meets tomorrow, see what happens.


----------



## PR1Berske (Nov 10, 2022)




----------



## elbows (Nov 10, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Anyone know why these ballots have been disaggregated (in the NHS and the civil servants)? Their pay isn't set trust by trust/hospital by hospital is it?



The sort of language used in reporting has been:



> Action will take place in all NHS employers in Northern Ireland and Scotland and in all by one employer in Wales, after meeting relevant legal requirements.
> 
> Meanwhile, in England nurses have mandated strike action across 130 NHS employers. The RCN said this included “many of the biggest hospitals” in the country, but added that others narrowly missed the legal thresholds and will therefore not be able to take action.











						NHS nurses vote to strike across majority of UK employers | Nursing Times
					

Nurses at the majority of NHS employers across the UK have voted to take strike action over pay, the Royal College of Nursing has confirmed. Industrial




					www.nursingtimes.net


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2022)

Here's the list of places that got over the line in PCS:








						List of government departments where PCS members have reached the 50% threshold and voted for strike action
					

Read the list of government departments where PCS members have reached the 50% threshold and voted for strike action




					www.pcs.org.uk


----------



## Plumdaff (Nov 10, 2022)

The Welsh Health Board (Aneurin Bevan UHB ironically) that won't be striking was because they missed the minimum numbers by 9 votes despite a massive majority for strike action. Its because of anti union legislation basically.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2022)

I've heard RCN won't be reballoting the places that didn't get over the line, but PCS are looking at doing it. And as mentioned above, other health unions are still running their ballots at the moment.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2022)

.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 10, 2022)

What's the theory in not reballoting in those instances? Is it simply a case of lack of resources?

That's what it was with UNISON, right? (Of course, ironically it was the ballot in Health that meant there apparently wasn't enough resources to reballot in HE  )


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 10, 2022)

I dunno much about the internal decision-making of RCN or PCS, but I'd guess so?


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 10, 2022)




----------



## PR1Berske (Nov 10, 2022)




----------



## teqniq (Nov 12, 2022)

Arseholes:


----------



## teqniq (Nov 12, 2022)

More dirty tricks (thread):


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 12, 2022)

So have I understood correctly that it's essentially "oh look, we've been training these agency staff in preparation for the strikes, but might as well use them for these other shifts too and save ourselves some cash, because agency hours are cheaper than overtime hours"?


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 12, 2022)

And this list isn't even complete cos it's definitely missing the IWGB action above.


----------



## teqniq (Nov 12, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> So have I understood correctly that it's essentially "oh look, we've been training these agency staff in preparation for the strikes, but might as well use them for these other shifts too and save ourselves some cash, because agency hours are cheaper than overtime hours"?


It's that pretty much and worse. If you read the thread it's a form of intimidation but also the agency workers are actually paid below the living wage.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 12, 2022)

Is there any kind of legislation to stop UCL from continuing to use the agency workers after the strike, too?

Am I right in thinking there's something around "you can only use agency workers for short term needs or in times of exceptional circumstance, but not 'business as usual'" thing? Although, given part of my own team's recent restructure involved staffing a large portion of our service with agency staff, I'm guessing... not


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 14, 2022)

Hull Stagecoach workers in strike victory after Unite secures 20% rise
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				












						Tyne and Wear Metro strikes off after Unite secures improved offer
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 16, 2022)

UNISON have won a proper pay rise at Uni of Glasgow:








						Breakthrough pay deal agreed by University of Glasgow UNISON - UNISON Scotland
					

UNISON members at the University of Glasgow have voted to accept a breakthrough pay deal that will see overall pay




					unison-scotland.org


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 17, 2022)

Oh, and RMT got a pretty strong result in their reballot:








						RMT renews national rail strike mandate for another 6 months
					

Rail union RMT today announced it had beaten the anti-trade union laws yet again with a stunning mandate for more strike action on the railways.



					www.rmt.org.uk


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 17, 2022)

CWU live now: 

Today RM 'offered' a voluntary redundancy package which would see posties with 30 years service getting 9 months salary redundancy payment...under previous agreements it would have been 2 years!

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 17, 2022)

New strike dates announced for December including 23rd and 24th; escalation, pressure, publicity and continued  negotiation is the way forward.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

p.s. in 42 years of working life I don't think I have ever felt prouder of what I do and those who do it alongside me.


----------



## Bingoman (Nov 17, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> New strike dates announced for December including 23rd and 24th; escalation, pressure, publicity and continued  negotiation is the way forward.
> 
> Cheers - Louis MacNeice
> 
> p.s. in 42 years of working life I don't think I have ever felt prouder of what I do and those who do it alongside me.


I sorry to hear this but keep up the strikes


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 17, 2022)

There should be at least some UNISON HE branches out alongside UCU and EIS next week, although there doesn't seem to be a proper full list I can see anywhere - here's the Scottish ones that'll be striking anyway:

Absolutely no idea why Glasgow Caledonian decided to go for different days than everyone else? 🤷‍♂️


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 17, 2022)

London branches:





Plus SOAS all three days, Southbank I think are doing one (24th, mebbe?  ).


----------



## Serge Forward (Nov 17, 2022)

City University is my old branch. I didn't recognise any faces in the pic... though to be fair, it was still NUPE when I was there


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 17, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> London branches:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



MMU will be out then as well:

Still seems weird that we seem to have to gather this info on a branch-by-branch basis, if only there was some kind of a national structure connecting these different branches?


----------



## Serge Forward (Nov 17, 2022)

Yeah but this _is_ Unison after all.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 17, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> MMU will be out then as well:
> 
> Still seems weird that we seem to have to gather this info on a branch-by-branch basis, if only there was some kind of a national structure connecting these different branches?



Do not. Get me. Started 

'cause it's been a long day and I'm tired


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 17, 2022)

Being out with UCU is both great because of all they bring with them, but also shaming by comparison because of all they bring with them.

(Still think our branch is decent  )


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 17, 2022)

The very best of luck to all my ex-colleagues in the UCU (and their work mates in Unison et al); see you on the picket line.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 20, 2022)

CWU general secretary Dave Ward on the BBC; highlights include the interviewer getting essential facts wrong (eg. re. ACAS talks) and saying that he is just asking the questions (repeating the press releases) put forward by Royal Mail management.

CWU interview. BBC/Dave Ward

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## elbows (Nov 20, 2022)

With that in mind, perhaps I can 'celebrate' the BBC centenary with this wikipedia quote:



> The recommendations of the Crawford Committee were published in March the following year and were still under consideration by the GPO when the 1926 general strike broke out in May. The strike temporarily interrupted newspaper production, and with restrictions on news bulletins waived, the BBC suddenly became the primary source of news for the duration of the crisis.
> 
> The crisis placed the BBC in a delicate position. On the one hand Reith was acutely aware that the government might exercise its right to commandeer the BBC at any time as a mouthpiece of the government if the BBC were to step out of line, but on the other he was anxious to maintain public trust by appearing to be acting independently. The government was divided on how to handle the BBC, but ended up trusting Reith, whose opposition to the strike mirrored the PM's own. Although Winston Churchill in particular wanted to commandeer the BBC to use it "to the best possible advantage", Reith wrote that Stanley Baldwin's government wanted to be able to say "that they did not commandeer [the BBC], but they know that they can trust us not to be really impartial". Thus the BBC was granted sufficient leeway to pursue the government's objectives largely in a manner of its own choosing.





> The resulting coverage of both striker and government viewpoints impressed millions of listeners who were unaware that the PM had broadcast to the nation from Reith's home, using one of Reith's sound bites inserted at the last moment, or that the BBC had banned broadcasts from the Labour Party and delayed a peace appeal by the Archbishop of Canterbury. Supporters of the strike nicknamed the BBC the BFC for British Falsehood Company. Reith personally announced the end of the strike which he marked by reciting from Blake's "Jerusalem" signifying that England had been saved.





> While the BBC tends to characterise its coverage of the general strike by emphasising the positive impression created by its balanced coverage of the views of government and strikers, Jean Seaton, Professor of Media History and the Official BBC Historian, has characterised the episode as the invention of "modern propaganda in its British form". Reith argued that trust gained by 'authentic impartial news' could then be used. Impartial news was not necessarily an end in itself.
> 
> The BBC did well out of the crisis, which cemented a national audience for its broadcasting, and it was followed by the Government's acceptance of the recommendation made by the Crawford Committee (1925–26) that the British Broadcasting Company be replaced by a non-commercial, Crown-chartered organisation: the British Broadcasting Corporation.



From BBC - Wikipedia


----------



## redsquirrel (Nov 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> MMU will be out then as well:
> 
> Still seems weird that we seem to have to gather this info on a branch-by-branch basis, if only there was some kind of a national structure connecting these different branches?



Unison branches at both the University of Leeds and Leeds-Beckett are out. Also at the University of Leeds the Unite branch is out so there should be some really effective action there (only GMB not out).

Anyone in Leeds on 24th/25th do go along to the picket lines it should be a really strong display. 

I don't think any of Unison branches in Yorkshire made it past the threshold


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 21, 2022)

....and bloody UNISON members, ffs!  





I know, it's not all UNISON HE branches, but it'd be nice for us members that are striking if we were included.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Still seems weird that we seem to have to gather this info on a branch-by-branch basis, if only there was some kind of a national structure connecting these different branches?


UNISON now have a list on their website.


Spoiler: List of 19 UNISON HE branches




Bath Spa University: Thursday 24 November
Birkbeck (University of London): Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November
City (University of London): Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November
Edinburgh Napier University: Thursday 24 and Friday 25 November
Glasgow Caledonian University: Monday 21 and Tuesday 22 November
Kings College London: Thursday 24 and Friday 25 November
Leeds Beckett University: Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November
Liverpool Hope University: Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November
London South Bank University: Thursday 24 November
Manchester Metropolitan University: Thursday 24 and Friday 25 November
Robert Gordon University: Thursday 24 and Friday 25 November
Royal Northern College of Music: Thursday 24 and Friday 25 November
School of Oriental and African Studies (University of London): Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November
University of Brighton: Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November
University of Bristol: Thursday 24 and Wednesday 30 November
University of Leeds: Thursday 24, Friday 25, Saturday 26, Sunday 27, Monday 28, Tuesday 29, Wednesday 30 November
University of the West of England: Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November
University of Winchester: Thursday 24 and Friday 25 November
University of Gloucestershire: Thursday 24, Friday 25, Wednesday 30 November


----------



## PR1Berske (Nov 22, 2022)

The RMT union has announced four weeks of fresh strike action on the railways.

Workers from 14 train operating companies will take strike action on 13, 14, 16, 17 December and 3, 4, 6, 7 January.

There will also be an overtime ban from 18 December until 2 January.


----------



## Supine (Nov 22, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


> The RMT union has announced four weeks of fresh strike action on the railways.
> 
> Workers from 14 train operating companies will take strike action on 13, 14, 16, 17 December and 3, 4, 6, 7 January.
> 
> There will also be an overtime ban from 18 December until 2 January.



Oh ffs - that week in December will cost me a week of lost pay. Just before Christmas


----------



## teqniq (Nov 22, 2022)

I've seen this talked about before (I think I may have posted a link about it way upthread). But here it is again:



The only reason I can think of for this is that the vermin wish to break the RMT.


----------



## teqniq (Nov 23, 2022)

More on the above:


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 23, 2022)

Latest CWU youtubepost: CWU strike. 

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## flypanam (Nov 24, 2022)




----------



## The39thStep (Nov 24, 2022)

Just reminder that workers face the same issues inside or outside the EU


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 24, 2022)

Good turnout on the picket line this morning; no one crossed (the two managers who made a fleeting appearance  don't  count) and nothing went out.

There has also been a definite hardening of attitude. The mood was definitely one of 'well if the company wants to break us then we will break them'. Everybody saying it's not about pay now, it's about conditions, it's about jobs and it's about the service.

Feels good - Louis MacNeice


----------



## flypanam (Nov 24, 2022)

Our picket was much bigger than expected. Good support from students (those that crossed the picket came out en masse at 11.30.) 

We went to see the posties at the locsl
Office, got a few pictures with them. Pretty good response from mums with kids this morning too.


----------



## elbows (Nov 24, 2022)

NHS Scotland have come up with an improved offer:









						New pay offer made to NHS Scotland health workers
					

The Scottish government's improved proposal which averages 7.5% will be considered by unions.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## PR1Berske (Nov 25, 2022)

> The Royal College of Nursing (RCN) has announced its members will stage national strikes – the first in its 106-year history – on 15 and 20 December, with action expected to last for 12 hours on both days.
> 
> The unprecedented industrial action will seriously disrupt care and is likely to be the first in a series of strikes over the winter and into the spring by NHS staff, including junior doctors and ambulance workers.
> 
> ...


----------



## redsquirrel (Nov 25, 2022)

flypanam said:


> Our picket was much bigger than expected. Good support from students (those that crossed the picket came out en masse at 11.30.)
> 
> We went to see the posties at the locsl
> Office, got a few pictures with them. Pretty good response from mums with kids this morning too.


Yep good turnout here too. And much better morale than last year.


----------



## The39thStep (Nov 25, 2022)

Bit of comedy support for our strikers


----------



## Serge Forward (Nov 25, 2022)

How's this for a picket line (at Manchester Met)...


----------



## Sue (Nov 25, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> How's this for a picket line (at Manchester Met)...



That's setting the bar a bit high.


----------



## PR1Berske (Nov 25, 2022)

Just off camera are all the other colleges going "Well fuck our drag right"


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 27, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> View attachment 352437
> 
> ....and bloody UNISON members, ffs!
> 
> ...


Would you be more or less offended if they'd written "CWU, UCU, EIS and Unison will all be taking action"? 
Also, respect to UoLeeds for how hardcore they are, everyone else has just gone for 2 or 3 days but they're out for a full week, so will still be out on Monday-Wednesday.
Notes from Below have relaunched the University Worker project for this set of strikes:








						The University Worker
					

bulletin




					notesfrombelow.org
				




Also, finally some proper fucking progress on reballoting from UNISON, reballots at 51 unis to start next week, so from January onwards there could be up to 51 more branches joining in the strikes, congratulations to whoever managed to twist arms there:








						Higher Education pay ballot - Vote YES to strike for the pay you deserve
					

It is no surprise that a majority of members have decided that a 1.5% pay rise – for the majority of staff – simply isn’t good enough.We can’t wait any longer, 1.5% isn’t going to cut it and we need to let them know now by standing together.




					www.unison.org.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 27, 2022)

Oh, and more strikes happening at Fawley Oil Refinery:





						‘More money than God’ ExxonMobil need to intervene to stop Fawley Strike
					

More members vote to join strike at oil refinery to increase risk to fuel production




					www.gmb-southern.org.uk


----------



## cesare (Nov 27, 2022)

Harrods staff to strike on Black Friday and every weekend in December
					

Dozens of security guards and CCTV operators will walk out over pay




					www.mylondon.news
				




Not seen this posted but Xmas shoppers should be aware.


----------



## Bingoman (Nov 27, 2022)

cesare said:


> Harrods staff to strike on Black Friday and every weekend in December
> 
> 
> Dozens of security guards and CCTV operators will walk out over pay
> ...


Thief's would have field day there no serciuty to catch them


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 27, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Also, finally some proper fucking progress on reballoting from UNISON, reballots at 51 unis to start next week, so from January onwards there could be up to 51 more branches joining in the strikes, congratulations to whoever managed to twist arms there:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"Finally", as you say, but given turnout on Thu and Fri I'm not sure I can see our branch voting for more strike days any time soon. That's just the pickets, though, don't know how many actually went on strike across the branch yet.

Also, feel like the ballots of the 19 run out around Feb time, don't they?

I do hope things go well for the 51, but honestly not sure how all this will play out across the different branches and unions. Could get very fiddly.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Nov 27, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Would you be more or less offended if they'd written "CWU, UCU, EIS and Unison will all be taking action"?


Oh, and  etc...


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 27, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> "Finally", as you say, but given turnout on Thu and Fri I'm not sure I can see our branch voting for more strike days any time soon. That's just the pickets, though, don't know how many actually went on strike across the branch yet.
> 
> Also, feel like the ballots of the 19 run out around Feb time, don't they?
> 
> I do hope things go well for the 51, but honestly not sure how all this will play out across the different branches and unions. Could get very fiddly.


Ah, that's a shame, I would've thought there'd be a bit of a boost from the joint UCU presence. And yeah, think the mandates of the magnificent 19 should run up until some time in February, so there should still be a bit of a window for combined UCU+19+however many of the 51 (and any relevant branches of Unite, GMB, EIS etc) to take joint action at the start of the year. You'd hope they'd also look at reballoting the 51 to extend the mandate as well, but it's not impossible there could be some foot-dragging there too.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 27, 2022)

Oh, and here's the Unite list - 10 branches:








						Staff at 10 universities in England, Scotland and Northern Ireland begin pay strikes
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## Brainaddict (Nov 28, 2022)

Not a good look for UVW - it's own staff in dispute with it now, through another union UVW dispute - Union Workers' Union


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 28, 2022)

Brainaddict said:


> Not a good look for UVW - it's own staff in dispute with it now, through another union UVW dispute - Union Workers' Union


Yeah, was wondering if anyone knows the inside story on that?
Fwiw, found this, which has a bit more discussion:








						UVW workers in dispute with the UVW union
					

I have been a member of the United Voices of the World Union (more recently through its LWSU division) for a number of years, given my membership of PCS (recognised in my workplaces) I have never b…




					employmentwrites.com
				




Also, win for refuse workers in East Suffolk:








						East Suffolk strikes called off after workers accept improved pay deal | News, Press release | News | UNISON Eastern
					

East Suffolk refuse workers have called off planned strikes after voting to accept a pay deal that “treats them with the respect they deserve,” UNISON




					eastern.unison.org.uk
				




Two-part podcast from the MMU pickets here:



And a UNISON strike fundraiser calendar:








						Strike Fund Calendar 2023
					

This strike and protest themed calendar was created by Manchester School of Art students and alumni, to support the strike of UNISON workers who...




					mmuunisonstrikefund.bigcartel.com


----------



## bcuster (Nov 29, 2022)




----------



## Louis MacNeice (Nov 30, 2022)

Strike still absolutely 100% solid in my office. I have only seen one non-uniformed casual out in Brighton today, looking simultaneously confused and harassed.

National CWU rally in Parliament  Square next Friday 1 pm. Coaches being organised.

In other news management to start deducting annual leave for cumulative strike says; they count as unauthorised absence and as such don't count as work days to accrue annual leave...so it is legal but it is very petty and vindictive.

I think we're getting to them.

Also Dave Ward (CWU gen sec) is on LBC for an hour tomorrow morning; Simon Thompson (RM CEO) has been I invited for a face to face debate, but don't hold your breath.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## MickiQ (Nov 30, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Strike still absolutely 100% solid in my office. I have only seen one non-uniformed casual out in Brighton today, looking simultaneously confused and harassed.
> 
> National CWU rally in Parliament  Square next Friday 1 pm. Coaches being organised.
> 
> ...


That sounds iffy surely the CWU is talking to lawyers about that.


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 30, 2022)

UNISON NHS ballot has closed, and it's not sounding great - total overall turnout of 34%, which is apparently more than double what they got last time, but also... it's not 50%, and it's not really that near 50%. Hearing that the total number of trusts that got past the threshold is 50% - five ambulance branches, NICE, and then a few in Liverpool. Also heard someone estimate that around 30% of members contacted said they'd not received a ballot paper, which indicates some very out-of-date data. I appreciate this stuff is hard, but... that's why you make an effort with it beforehand, otherwise you end up being out-organised by a royal college?


----------



## hitmouse (Nov 30, 2022)

IWGB continue to do some good work:








						Staff at the RSA win statutory union recognition represented by the IWGB as ballot returns 85% majority
					

* The Independent Workers Union of Great Britain (IWGB) have announced that a    recent ballot, run independently by the Central Arbitration Committee    returned a 85% majority of voters in support of recognition from the Royal    Society of Arts (RSA) for the first time in the organisation’s...




					iwgb.org.uk
				












						Cleaners Win End to Exploitative Outsourcing at Prestigious Private Hospital
					

* After launching a campaign earlier this year, outsourced workers from the    IWGB union have won an end to outsourcing at private London Bridge Hospital.  * Workers are still paid less than the London Living Wage and are denied the    same conditions as other workers.  * Parent company HCA...




					iwgb.org.uk


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 1, 2022)

Dave Ward is on LBC this evening 8-9 not this morning as I previously posted.

Seems to be a big effort going on to get as many CWU members as possible to London for next Friday's rally in Parliament Square. We are all meant to be in uniform so it should look pretty good.

Of course all supporters, fellow trade unionist, friends and family will be very welcome.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 2, 2022)

Here's a link to the CWU  LBC interview and phone in; due to the volume of calls the show was extended to 10pm. In the two hours Dave Ward comes across as a very sincere and straight forward representative of his members interests, willing to engage with the need for change but absolutely determined to protect decent conditions and rates of pay for us all. He also didn't dodge any questions or duck any issues and the interviewer let him explain and respond without interruption. Simon Thompson didn't accept the invitation to come on for a face to face debate/discussion; I think he was wise.

CWU's Dave Ward on LBC

Cheers and see you on the 9th - Louis MacNeice


----------



## teqniq (Dec 3, 2022)

Horrids in complete arseholes shocker:









						Harrods Is One of the First Companies to Use a New Tory Anti-Strike Law | Novara Media
					

The Qatar-owned luxury department store pays its boss £2.3million, but offered security guards a 'pay cut dressed up as a rise'.




					novaramedia.com


----------



## LDC (Dec 3, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> UNISON NHS ballot has closed, and it's not sounding great - total overall turnout of 34%, which is apparently more than double what they got last time, but also... it's not 50%, and it's not really that near 50%. Hearing that the total number of trusts that got past the threshold is 50% - five ambulance branches, NICE, and then a few in Liverpool. Also heard someone estimate that around 30% of members contacted said they'd not received a ballot paper, which indicates some very out-of-date data. I appreciate this stuff is hard, but... that's why you make an effort with it beforehand, otherwise you end up being out-organised by a royal college?



Yeah I think the unions need to have a word with themselves about the general level of their admin, data, and comms with members. Loads of their systems for collection, storage and updating of member details are useless.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 3, 2022)

LDC said:


> Yeah I think the unions need to have a word with themselves about the general level of their admin, data, and comms with members. Loads of their systems for collection, storage and updating of member details are useless.


+1

Have said it before and will keep saying it: for a movement where 'organising' is a foundational principle, a lot seem to be pretty wanting when it comes to the more commonly understood meaning of the word.

Sort of related, saw this last night and thought it once again came across a little... needy.



"You may have brought your whole union and organised a massive rally and march, but we were there first!_ (even if it was only 19 branches because we didn't support branches enough and also decided to hold off reballoting those that missed the threshold by a whisker until now, meaning there will be UNISON branches with different strike mandates, which in turn will both be different to UCU's...)_"

I might be inferring quite a bit, there


----------



## Pickman's model (Dec 3, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> +1
> 
> Sort of related, saw this last night and thought it once again came across a little... needy.
> 
> ...


I don't myself want to see pound signs but percent signs preceded by 11 or more, with an agreement to return pay to pre-financial crisis levels in real terms pending an award for the past 15 years


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 3, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> I don't myself want to see pound signs but percent signs preceded by 11 or more, with an agreement to return pay to pre-financial crisis levels in real terms pending an award for the past 15 years


Aye, personally I'm much more in favour of using % as the unit of measurement of £s, although do understand that the latter possibly works better with your average member. "£500" is a lot easier to grasp than "13.5% + inflation (RPI)".


----------



## Pickman's model (Dec 3, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Aye, personally I'm much more in favour of using % as the unit of measurement of £s, although do understand that the latter possibly works better with your average member. "£500" is a lot easier to grasp than "13.5% + inflation (RPI)".


Yeh but £500 would be in the region of a 1.5% rise so fuck all


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 3, 2022)

Heh, y'know, I _almost _took the time to work out a figure that would actually be relevant...  

'course, would depend on where on the pay scale you're talking as to how much of a percentage rise it is.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 3, 2022)

Would be quite keen to do something ahead of that meeting at the end of Jan.

Have to assume the unions will organise something, but at a local level mebbe an event or two, or a comms campaign encouraging members/students/alumni/public figures to write to uni top brass and UCEA in order to put pressure on them to do better.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 3, 2022)

Latest CWU dispute developments. 

Firstly, in some delivery offices overtime is being withdrawn  from Royal Mail workers (specifically extension overtime used to complete deliveries) while casual agency staff are being employed at higher pay rates (plus agency fees of course) to undertake the work. It looks a lot like financial bullying because that's what it is.

Secondly, in the same week that CEO Simon Thompson stated publicly that Royal Mail do not prioritise between letter and parcel post, posties have been threatened with disciplinary procedures, up to and including dismissal, for doing just that; i.e. delivering all the post letters, untracked packets and tracked parcels without prejudice. So in the topsy turvy world of RM management, we arrive at a point where posties are facing the sack for delivering letters.

The up side of all this is that it just seems to be stiffening resolve and determination.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 3, 2022)

LDC said:


> Yeah I think the unions need to have a word with themselves about the general level of their admin, data, and comms with members. Loads of their systems for collection, storage and updating of member details are useless.


Yeah, it is also one of things like a muscle that gets stronger when you exercise it, if you're balloting your members regularly then your data should (hopefully!) be reasonably up to date, but if you're not balloting or even running actual campaigns then it's going to get more and more out of date. Have also heard some more horror stories about that ballot, if your first ballot was sent to the wrong address or just didn't turn up (and, as you can see from other posts on this thread, Royal Mail has perhaps not been operating at 100% reliability of late) you could only get a new one by ringing a phone number, and apparently that line was really not set up for the volume of calls it was receiving, so you had massive wait times. Not ideal really.


Lord Camomile said:


> +1
> 
> Have said it before and will keep saying it: for a movement where 'organising' is a foundational principle, a lot seem to be pretty wanting when it comes to the more commonly understood meaning of the word.
> 
> ...


On one hand, I sort of think "let Unison have their boast, it's rare enough that they/we have something to brag about and managing to get the strike ballot completed this early in the year is at least an achievement of some kind". On the other hand, "its working.."? "its working.."? Ffs, you'd think that one of the largest unions in the country should be able to find a proofreader somewhere.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 3, 2022)

IT'S LITERALLY IN YOUR DISPLAY NAME, FOR FUCK'S SAKE!!  

(It's good to see Young Members engaging, though; pretty sure it's only recently they got their own official conference)


----------



## not a trot (Dec 3, 2022)

Would be nice to get some post, had none for over two weeks. Was waiting results on a biopsy I had done done 3 weeks ago. Good job the hospital were able to help.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 4, 2022)

Blinkn' 'eck! 'tis the season, indeed!


----------



## PR1Berske (Dec 4, 2022)

> The Conservative party chairman has said the military is on standby to take the place of striking workers such as ambulance and border staff, while claiming the planned industrial action was playing into Vladimir Putin’s hands by dividing society.
> 
> Nadhim Zahawi, a UK cabinet minister, said the army was part of contingency planning in which soldiers could be drafted in to take the place of those on the picket lines, as the government braces for a wave of strikes against low pay in the coming weeks.
> 
> ...


----------



## Karl Masks (Dec 4, 2022)

I simply don't understand how is possible to function while being so dishonest and soups as zahawi


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 4, 2022)

I mean, just so many laughable statements!


----------



## teqniq (Dec 4, 2022)

Truly awful tory scum.


----------



## PR1Berske (Dec 4, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> I mean, just so many laughable statements!


I thought posting it without giving an opinion was fine because no words are required.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 4, 2022)

"Look, now's not the time for division. Just hand over the keys to your car, everyone's happy and we'll say no more about it. This is exactly what Putin wants, you damned fool"


----------



## scalyboy (Dec 4, 2022)

not a trot said:


> Would be nice to get some post, had none for over two weeks. Was waiting results on a biopsy I had done done 3 weeks ago. Good job the hospital were able to help.


CWU gen sec Dave Ward on LBC last week (see Louis MacNeice's post below for link) explained how management have given orders for staff to prioritise parcels over letter post. All part of CEO Simon Thompson's 'race-to-the-bottom' strategy of turning Royal Mail into just another rival of Yodel, Hermes/Evri etc... I could only understand this in terms of there being less profit from letters than from packages; as Dave Ward explained, although the quantity of letter post has undoubtedly diminished since the advent of email, predictions of the end of 'snail mail' have been proved wrong and there are still millions of letters being sent. (it's not dissimilar to the development of e-books and predictions that printed books and magazines would go the way of the dodo - not so)


Louis MacNeice said:


> Here's a link to the CWU  LBC interview and phone in; due to the volume of calls the show was extended to 10pm. In the two hours Dave Ward comes across as a very sincere and straight forward representative of his members interests, willing to engage with the need for change but absolutely determined to protect decent conditions and rates of pay for us all. He also didn't dodge any questions or duck any issues and the interviewer let him explain and respond without interruption. Simon Thompson didn't accept the invitation to come on for a face to face debate/discussion; I think he was wise.
> 
> CWU's Dave Ward on LBC
> 
> Cheers and see you on the 9th - Louis MacNeice


He was very good I thought in setting out exactly why this is such a bitter dispute and the board's / Simon Thompson's strategy of not wanting a resolution but to refuse to negotiate, in the hope that posties will be forced back to work  
Shocking to hear about management's dirty tricks - dubious allegations of violent / racist intimidation on pickets, bonuses for managers who implement compulsory redundancies, refusal of overtime opportunities for those staff who have been on strike, deduction of annual leave. It was very upsetting to hear that feller who called in speaking about how this has affected his mental health; the extra workload, confrontational / hostile managers, fears of redundancy etc.

With regard to the caller who asked what the public could do to assist, Dave Ward suggested that people write to Simon Thompson - but if Thompson is as resolute as he appears to be, dead set on this plan to turn RM into just another courier firm (proposals for working hours to begin 3 hours later - meaning we will get our post 3 hours later; mine is generally around 11am; it's the courier firms who deliver in the afternoon) , would it not be more productive to write to the board suggesting they get rid of this lunatic? After all, DW did say the only way he'll be leaving is if the board vote him out as CEO...


----------



## Dystopiary (Dec 4, 2022)

Queen Mary University of London (QMUL) management are asking students to report on staff who talk about reasons for striking. They even provided a snitch form. 



UCU on twitter


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 4, 2022)

Dystopiary said:


> Queen Mary University of London (QMUL) management are asking students to report on staff who talk about reasons for striking. They even provided a snitch form.
> 
> View attachment 354245
> 
> UCU on twitter


They initially left the form open to anyone, with predictable results...

Sadly I think the form's still up but now requires a QMUL login to access.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 4, 2022)

That's from 29 Nov.

I believe the for got shut down after many less than genuine submissions  I didn't submit any myself, but I may know a couple of UNISON members who did... 

(Tbf, they probably just stopped the form being public; wouldn't surprise me if they're still asking QMUL students to submit to a form behind a QMUL sign-in.)

<edit: ah, as suspected  >


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 4, 2022)

scalyboy said:


> With regard to the caller who asked what the public could do to assist, Dave Ward suggested that people write to Simon Thompson - but if Thompson is as resolute as he appears to be, dead set on this plan to turn RM into just another courier firm (proposals for working hours to begin 3 hours later - meaning we will get our post 3 hours later; mine is generally around 11am; it's the courier firms who deliver in the afternoon) , would it not be more productive to write to the board suggesting they get rid of this lunatic? After all, DW did say the only way he'll be leaving is if the board vote him out as CEO...


Thanks for the great post scalyboy. With regard specifically to the what can the public do and writing to Thompson, I would suggest three letters/emails (do both and say you're doing both) as follows:

1. To the Delivery Office Manager (DOM) asking where is your post and asking for confirmation that parcels aren't being prioritised over letters as stated by the CEO. Lay it on thick how urgent some post is.

2. To Simon Thompson asking him for written confirmation that parcels aren't being prioritised over letters. Lay it on thick about your concerns over media reports that this is going on.

3. To your MP voicing your concern that the letter post is being deprioritised in direct contradiction to the public statements of Simon Thompson. Lay it on thick that this puts customers  and delivery staff in a really awkward position, the former regarding whether they should use the service or not and the latter about what they are supposed to do on a day to day basis.

Copy all three letters to all three people and let them know you have done this. Ask for prompt replies as this is a matter of some urgency and say that you have let your postie know what you are doing.

The letters/emails only need to be a few lines long, but getting a few of those will be noticed by the DOM and the MP; I doubt Thompson would care very much at all unless there were a large number. If you wanted to include copies for board members then it couldn't hurt.

It's not going to turn the world upside down, but every little helps.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

p.s. Oh and obviously encourage other people to do the same.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 4, 2022)

So if working class soldiers are gonna be replacing striking workers does this mean they're scabs? Or maybe just class traitors? It would certainly be going against the interests of wokring class people and against the aims and interests of striking workers.

Would be nice if they disobeyed their orders when the time comes and showed ordinary struggling people some solidarity.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 4, 2022)

I suspect they're also gonna be pretty shit at the jobs they're supposed to fill, in much the same way that most people aren't particularly skilled at a new job in their first week?


----------



## LDC (Dec 4, 2022)

In some areas they've been driving ambulances for ages to make up for lack of staff, and obviously they did vaccinations as well during the pandemic. In the firefighters strike in the late '70s they did something similar, and also more recently in the early 2000s.


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 4, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> So if working class soldiers are gonna be replacing striking workers does this mean they're scabs? Or maybe just class traitors? It would certainly be going against the interests of wokring class people and against the aims and interests of striking workers.
> 
> Would be nice if they disobeyed their orders when the time comes and showed ordinary struggling people some solidarity.


If they're doing strikers' jobs, they're scabs... and a scab is a class traitor.


----------



## cesare (Dec 5, 2022)

We're getting beeps in support of the Shelter picket on Old Street - parcelforce, cabbies, couriers and some buses. The Fast Break cafe across the road has provided tea for everyone.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 5, 2022)

Looks like GMB also have a strike mandate in the ambulance service:





						More than 10,000 ambulance workers vote to strike in nine trusts across England and Wales
					

No one in the health service takes strike action lightly – today shows just how desperate they are, says GMB Union




					www.gmb.org.uk


----------



## cesare (Dec 5, 2022)

Strike dog 💕


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 5, 2022)

The Radcliffe Polyflor strikers have now accepted an offer of 9% + £1,320:








						Workers end two months of strike action after accepting latest pay offer
					

Workers at a vinyl flooring manufacturer in Whitefield have ended two months of strike action after reaching a deal with their employer.




					www.burytimes.co.uk
				



Not bad, considering that a few months back the company was trying to break them with a lockout.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 5, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Sort of related, saw this last night and thought it once again came across a little... needy.
> 
> View attachment 354079


Well, here's the full unison statement that was promised (also lol just noticed the official UCU statement above also refuses to do allcaps):


I thought all the reballots had already started, didn't realise that they were doing 31, then another 13, and then maybe another 2 after that if my maths is right, unless those other two have just dropped out altogether?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 5, 2022)

"Both sides agreed to take steps to avoid escalating the dispute" - what would that look like from the employer's side, exactly? Given it's quite clear they'd much prefer the whole thing just be completely dropped and forgotten about.

Not training any more strike-breaking temps? Though they've probably already got enough on their books at this point.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 5, 2022)

I suppose maybe not being dicks about ASOS, but I suppose if UCU aren't doing ASOS at the moment then that's a bit, um, academic?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 5, 2022)

Aye, and how an employer can prove ASOS when their staff are literally simply doing the work they are contracted and paid for still continues to genuinely perplex me somewhat


----------



## stethoscope (Dec 5, 2022)

Solidarity with the Shelter strikers!


----------



## cesare (Dec 5, 2022)

stethoscope said:


> Solidarity with the Shelter strikers!


Here's some coverage:



It was cold! But a good few hours. The MPs have had to rearrange apparently, they were due at midday ish.


----------



## redsquirrel (Dec 5, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I suppose maybe not being dicks about ASOS, but I suppose if UCU aren't doing ASOS at the moment then that's a bit, um, academic?





Lord Camomile said:


> Aye, and how an employer can prove ASOS when their staff are literally simply doing the work they are contracted and paid for still continues to genuinely perplex me somewhat


The ASOS that UCU is currently undertaking is not just working to contract it is

working to contract
not undertaking any voluntary activities.
not covering for absent colleagues
removing uploaded materials related to, and/or not sharing materials related to, lectures or classes that will be or have been cancelled as a result of strike action
not rescheduling lectures or classes cancelled due to strike action
The bottom three are partial performance and so the employer is allowed to make deductions. I'm pretty sure it is a requirement that employees have to answer truthfully if they have are asked about past actions re ASOS (certainly UCU advice is to do so).


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 5, 2022)

ACN article on the current situation









						Strike!  If they want war let’s give them the Class War
					

Government has two key jobs to deliver on, ‘bread and circuses.  Keeping people fed and distracted is essential to its survival.  We know it is in crisis when the circus takes place in th…




					anarcomuk.uk


----------



## Bingoman (Dec 6, 2022)

Ambulance staff set to strike before Christmas


----------



## RainbowTown (Dec 6, 2022)

Bingoman said:


> Ambulance staff set to strike before Christmas



Also to be joined by the hidden army of the NHS - those folk who rarely get the publicity nor the credit that they're due  (even though they are probably the lowest paid sector within the NHS). Namely, the cleaners and porters.   A massive shout out to them for all the great work they do as well. Hope they, along with the ambulance staff etc, get what they're asking for. They most certainly deserve it.


----------



## elbows (Dec 6, 2022)




----------



## hitmouse (Dec 6, 2022)

RainbowTown said:


> Also to be joined by the hidden army of the NHS - those folk who rarely get the publicity nor the credit that they're due  (even though they are probably the lowest paid sector within the NHS). Namely, the cleaners and porters.   A massive shout out to them for all the great work they do as well. Hope they, along with the ambulance staff etc, get what they're asking for. They most certainly deserve it.


Is this through GMB, UNISON or someone else?


----------



## RainbowTown (Dec 6, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Is this through GMB, UNISON or someone else?











						Start talking to avert health strikes later this month | News, Press release | News | UNISON National
					

Strike date announced for December 21 - but it's not too late for ministers to talk




					www.unison.org.uk
				





Fourth paragraph down.  Seems like the cleaners and porters are joining the strike at two Liverpool hospitals at the moment. Hopefully, this will become more widespread if the action spreads to other Trusts. I know a few people who work as cleaners and porters in hospitals and the job they do certainly does not get the recognition nor the pay it deserves.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 6, 2022)

elbows said:


>



I will not credit whoever did it that the irony of saying it's "orchestrated" was intentional, but I will lol at it with derision.


----------



## Bingoman (Dec 7, 2022)

The PCS Union had just said the Border Staff at airports to strike over 10 days over  Christmas and they also said the rural Payment agency Dvsa national highways and DWP to strike

Anyone who has driving lessons could have them cancelled by looks of things 









						Christmas travel hit by new strikes as Border Force set for airport walkouts
					

The head of the PCS union says his members are living in poverty and warns industrial action will escalate if the government doesn't get round the negotiating table.




					news.sky.com


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 7, 2022)

Saw this on facefuck and thought it were good


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 7, 2022)




----------



## PR1Berske (Dec 7, 2022)

Apologies for the link but this newspaper is currently the only one reporting the story.


----------



## Elpenor (Dec 7, 2022)

NHS workers could be banned from striking, No 10 suggests
					

Downing Street refuses to rule out suggestion laws will be used to stem strikes across health service




					www.theguardian.com
				




More palatable source here


----------



## ska invita (Dec 7, 2022)

Proper general strike incoming then in response? Was threatened when Truss was mouthing off


----------



## PR1Berske (Dec 7, 2022)

Elpenor said:


> NHS workers could be banned from striking, No 10 suggests
> 
> 
> Downing Street refuses to rule out suggestion laws will be used to stem strikes across health service
> ...


Thanks


----------



## belboid (Dec 7, 2022)

Elpenor said:


> NHS workers could be banned from striking, No 10 suggests
> 
> 
> Downing Street refuses to rule out suggestion laws will be used to stem strikes across health service
> ...


A more palatable source, but still pretty unpalatable content 

_Labour opposes some proposed new rules, which would force public transport workers to provide set minimum levels of service. But Starmer’s spokesperson would not commit to repealing them if elected._


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 7, 2022)

belboid said:


> A more palatable source, but still pretty unpalatable content
> 
> _Labour opposes some proposed new rules, which would force public transport workers to provide set minimum levels of service. But Starmer’s spokesperson would not commit to repealing them if elected._


When has Labour repealed any of the anti-worker laws? Fucking never, the cunts.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 7, 2022)

Labour can't even really be described as liberal anymore. They're now just another far-right, racist party who are anti-union.


----------



## belboid (Dec 8, 2022)

Serge Forward said:


> When has Labour repealed any of the anti-worker laws? Fucking never, the cunts.


1974, repealing the 1971 Industrial Relations Act. I think that's the only time.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 8, 2022)

. . . and Callaghan brought in the Social Contract and harsh austerity which led to more strikes, including wildcats. Army scabs used against striking firefighters and binmen. 

Plus an increase in soldiers for Northern Ireland and the submarine force upgraded, so plenty of money for those.


----------



## bcuster (Dec 8, 2022)

The New York Times is bracing for a historic mass walkout as union negotiations go down to the wire | CNN Business
					

The New York Times is preparing for more than 1,100 of its union staffers to go on strike for a full day Thursday — an act of protest that has not been staged by employees at the paper of record since the late 1970s.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## cesare (Dec 8, 2022)

belboid said:


> 1974, repealing the 1971 Industrial Relations Act. I think that's the only time.


There's also the see-sawing (Labour v Tory)  of one year v two years' service for unfair dismissal rights.


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 8, 2022)

belboid said:


> 1974, repealing the 1971 Industrial Relations Act. I think that's the only time.


🎊 🎈🎈🎊
Fair point. Hell will will freeze over before Starmer repeals any of this shit.


----------



## mwgdrwg (Dec 8, 2022)

.


----------



## mwgdrwg (Dec 8, 2022)

.


----------



## teqniq (Dec 8, 2022)

Result:


----------



## teqniq (Dec 8, 2022)

Fucking unbelievable. Absolute scum:


----------



## ska invita (Dec 8, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Fucking unbelievable. Absolute scum:



suggests they're close to a deal?


----------



## teqniq (Dec 8, 2022)

ska invita said:


> suggests they're close to a deal?


They may have been, but the tories have scuppered it, again.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Dec 8, 2022)

Jacob's workers agree new pay deal after 11 weeks of strikes
					

Staff return to work at Aintree factory after winning new offer




					www.liverpoolecho.co.uk


----------



## Karl Masks (Dec 8, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> Jacob's workers agree new pay deal after 11 weeks of strikes
> 
> 
> Staff return to work at Aintree factory after winning new offer
> ...


Crackers!


----------



## Karl Masks (Dec 8, 2022)

teqniq said:


> Fucking unbelievable. Absolute scum:



Absolutely. This should be headline news. Of course the partisan hackery of Fleet Street means otherwise. Clearly the tories want to smash the right to strike and are manufacturing consent. They should be caught with their pants down over this but the media will ensure otherwise by not reporting this fact. 

Fucking tories enrage me like nothing else right now


----------



## ska invita (Dec 8, 2022)

teqniq said:


> They may have been, but the tories have scuppered it, again.


oh yeah no i get that, but tories aside it sounds like theres a deal there waiting to go, perhaps 

Btw Bristolians...Portwall Tavern


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 9, 2022)

Picketed this morning, still 100% solid; no one going in no mail going out.

Just off out the door to get train to London for the rally.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 9, 2022)

If you see any reports that RM is prioritising  Christmas cards and NHS letters today remember two things.

Firstly, they are only talking about machine sorting not delivery.

And secondly (and much more importantly) up to this point RM has been prioritising tracked parcels over everything else. They have been so set on this that posties who have challenged it haven been threatened with disciplinary action up to and including dismissal.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## cesare (Dec 9, 2022)

Good luck for the rally!

Shelter on both sides of Old Street today, plenty of beeps and people wanting to make donations. Also people from other organisations spending time on the picket in support.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 9, 2022)

Parliament Square rammed and bouncing. If only I knew how to post a video.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## ska invita (Dec 9, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Parliament Square rammed and bouncing. If only I knew how to post a video.
> 
> Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## ska invita (Dec 9, 2022)

nice photo


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 9, 2022)

We're off to Buckingham Palace apparently!

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## ska invita (Dec 9, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> We're off to Buckingham Palace apparently!
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


interesting! demos never seem to go there even though its right by trafalgar sq


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Dec 9, 2022)

Seems a bit pointless. It’s currently being refurbed.


----------



## LDC (Dec 9, 2022)

Newsletter for the NHS strikes coming up. PDF link here NHS Strike Newsletter – Whose strike is it? - Angry Workers


----------



## Sue (Dec 9, 2022)

LDC said:


> Newsletter for the NHS strikes coming up. PDF link here NHS Strike Newsletter – Whose strike is it? - Angry Workers
> 
> View attachment 354948


PDF you say...?


----------



## LDC (Dec 9, 2022)

Fucking RCN turned cowards at last moment and announced that after discussions with management pretty much every department at my Trust is now 'essential' and won't be going on strike the fucking lickspittles. Strike will be barely noticeable now.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 9, 2022)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Seems a bit pointless. It’s currently being refurbed.


500 years of Royal Mail under threat.  I would have thought the symbolism and opportunity were obvious and attractive.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## redsquirrel (Dec 9, 2022)

Well done all comrades on strike at taking action.


----------



## cesare (Dec 9, 2022)

It was very uplifting to hear the support from drivers of all types including refuse, buses, cabbies, posties, couriers, big lorries, cyclists. Amazing the fire truck and ambulance (separately) on blues and twos beeping as well as they passed.


----------



## cesare (Dec 9, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> We're off to Buckingham Palace apparently!
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


Will HM withdraw the royal warrant? Some pressure should be applied imo.


----------



## cesare (Dec 9, 2022)

cesare said:


> Will HM withdraw the royal warrant? Some pressure should be applied imo.


"Royal" what does that entail, your majesty?


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 9, 2022)

At my local delivery office, there's usually been someone who's come down and parked blocking the gates. This morning, I was the only external supporter who was there when a van turned up, so I stood there in the road and the manager gave up trying to drive it in and parked out in the street instead and had to carry everything in from there. One of those things where usually you never know if turning up to something will actually make a difference or not, but at least today I can say that I've actively made a manager's day noticeably harder by being there.


----------



## scalyboy (Dec 9, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Thanks for the great post scalyboy. With regard specifically to the what can the public do and writing to Thompson, I would suggest three letters/emails (do both and say you're doing both) as follows:
> 
> 1. To the Delivery Office Manager (DOM) asking where is your post and asking for confirmation that parcels aren't being prioritised over letters as stated by the CEO. Lay it on thick how urgent some post is.
> 
> ...


Thanks Louis MacNeice  for your clear suggestions as to how to phrase each letter and what to emphasise, I wouldn't have known what to focus on otherwise.

I've written letters to my local DOM, and to Simon Thompson. The former is easy cos I know the local delivery office address; the only postal address I could find for the latter is Royal Mail Group Ltd, Correspondence address: 185 Farringdon Road, London, United Kingdom, EC1A 1AA and I can head the address F.A.O.  Mr Smarmy Twat Simon Thompson.
I can drop off the DOM letter tomorrow cos I need to go there anyway (was going to go today, but doubt they'd be many staff in today  - and even if there were some managers in to keep it open, it would've meant crossing a picket)

The Simon Thompson one I will put in the post tomorrow; it's rather galling to pay nearly a quid for a stamp, but the alternative is the only correspondence address listed on the Royal Mail's website:
_FREEPOST Royal Mail Customer Services _
and I'm not convinced that a letter marked for his attention at this address would reach him. I must say it's well hidden on the Royal Mail website; I had to hunt for it - it's almost as if they don't want people to write letters  

I'll do the MP letter now, and I can email her as well. I couldn't find an email address for the local delivery office, but if anyone knows Simon Thompson's email address, please do let us know!


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 9, 2022)

Thank you scalyboy, you're a star. I'll  see if I can get an email address  for you.

All the very best  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 10, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


> Apologies for the link but this newspaper is currently the only one reporting the story.



If that bill becomes law the only thing to combat it will be escalation, coordination, militant action -  wildcat strikes, sit-ins/occupations of workplaces etc. Hopefully thats what it will lead to, otherwise we're fucked.

Now more than ever militant, autonomous alternatives from below are required. Real resitance to capitalism, and real solidarity.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 10, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> If that bill becomes law the only thing to combat it will be escalation, coordination, militant action -  wildcat strikes, sit-ins/occupations of workplaces etc. Hopefully thats what it will lead to, otherwise we're fucked.
> 
> Now more than ever militant, autonomous alternatives from below are required. Real resitance to capitalism, and real solidarity.


Of course you're right but let's not forget the need for more clichéd rhetorical flourishes in cyberspace.

Comradely greetings  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 10, 2022)

LDC said:


> Newsletter for the NHS strikes coming up. PDF link here NHS Strike Newsletter – Whose strike is it? - Angry Workers
> 
> View attachment 354948


That newsletter/leaflet is brilliant. Nice one Angry Workers.


----------



## Sue (Dec 10, 2022)

R4's Any Answers (on at the moment) is overwhelmingly behind the various strikes/strikers which is interesting as it's normally very right wing.


----------



## Mezzer (Dec 11, 2022)

Bastards.  Driving them into a corner and don't give a shit about the consequences.

Health Secretary won’t hold pay talks with nurses despite offer to pause strike’


----------



## ska invita (Dec 11, 2022)

Mezzer said:


> Bastards.  Driving them into a corner and don't give a shit about the consequences.
> 
> Health Secretary won’t hold pay talks with nurses despite offer to pause strike’


also this posted on stramer thread



			Welcome to nginx!
		






View attachment 355202

...etc


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 11, 2022)

LDC said:


> Fucking RCN turned cowards at last moment and announced that after discussions with management pretty much every department at my Trust is now 'essential' and won't be going on strike the fucking lickspittles. Strike will be barely noticeable now.


The independent and open assemblies in each hospital or department - found this idea interesting but based on what you describe above how much of this is possible ?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 11, 2022)

ska invita said:


> also this posted on stramer thread
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I genuinely still don't quite understand just who/what they're talking about when they talk about "hostile" unions. Like, those are workers, the people _both _parties at least _claim_ to fight for, and will wax lyrical about when it's convenient.

"...the public had sacrificed 'a lot of their lives and liberty' to prevent the NHS from being overwhelmed" - yeah, and have you somehow forgotten who was keeping it going despite being completely underserved and underresourced??!

Absolute, colossal bell ends 

Thank you, choir, that concludes today's preaching.


----------



## ska invita (Dec 11, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> I genuinely still don't quite understand just who/what they're talking about when they talk about "hostile" unions. Like, those are workers, the people _both _parties at least _claim_ to fight for, and will wax lyrical about when it's convenient.
> 
> "...the public had sacrificed 'a lot of their lives and liberty' to prevent the NHS from being overwhelmed" - yeah, and have you somehow forgotten who was keeping it going despite being completely underserved and underresourced??!
> 
> ...


TBF the full quote is
"One of the things that I do find frustrating, given that we have committed to more staff, I cannot understand why the BMA is so *hostile* to the idea that with more staff must come better standards for patients,” he said, accusing the union of “living on a different planet”. "

...this is the Telegraph after all.
But still...


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 11, 2022)

ska invita said:


> TBF the full quote is
> "One of the things that I do find frustrating, given that we have committed to more staff, I cannot understand why the BMA is so *hostile* to the idea that with more staff must come better standards for patients,” he said, accusing the union of “living on a different planet”. "
> 
> ...this is the Telegraph after all.
> But still...


Bah, I even thought, "hey, should you make sure you're not popping off without knowing the full context?", only to then think "nah, it's all there..."  

But, as you say: still....


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 11, 2022)

Mezzer said:


> Bastards.  Driving them into a corner and don't give a shit about the consequences.
> 
> Health Secretary won’t hold pay talks with nurses despite offer to pause strike’



Precisely the same formulation as the rail strikes. The ‘employer’ (NHS/Network Rail) is prevented by the real employer - the government - from properly negotiating. The government refuses to negotiate. 

The Tories are banking on a) the strikes not working/being sustainable and b) public opinion moving against the unions.

Bastards, certainty. But stupid bastards as the Thatcher playbook was written in very different circumstances.


----------



## LDC (Dec 11, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> The independent and open assemblies in each hospital or department - found this idea interesting but based on what you describe above how much of this is possible ?



Honestly.... I think it's a fair few steps above where I think the strikes and people I know are currently. But good to plant the idea there and who knows, things can develop quickly.
The unions involved in the health strikes are pissing a fair number of workers off tbh, especially on the Trust level, my Trust have agreed with the RCN reps that basically not much will be on strike at all, loads has been categorised as 'essential' much more than the initial list of a few places which was critical care units, chemotherapy, dialysis, and some neonatal and paediatric units.


----------



## andysays (Dec 11, 2022)

Sue said:


> R4's Any Answers (on at the moment) is overwhelmingly behind the various strikes/strikers which is interesting as it's normally very right wing.



This headline

Strikes: Will the clash between workers and firms ever end?​
and the article which goes with it seems unusually sympathetic to strikes and strikers, especially for the BBC.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 12, 2022)

LDC said:


> Honestly.... I think it's a fair few steps above where I think the strikes and people I know are currently. But good to plant the idea there and who knows, things can develop quickly.
> The unions involved in the health strikes are pissing a fair number of workers off tbh, especially on the Trust level, my Trust have agreed with the RCN reps that basically not much will be on strike at all, loads has been categorised as 'essential' much more than the initial list of a few places which was critical care units, chemotherapy, dialysis, and some neonatal and paediatric units.


In the local government strikes in the 80s , it was one day , two day and then three days strikes, I was still in the SWP. Despite the branch being controlled by the CP and Labour Party, we had built a reasonable network of rank and file shop stewards and activists through sectional disputes, collections for other strikes nationally and locally, anti racist work with the Black Workers Group etc etc. The line was for an all out strike which was imo somewhat optimistic and a bit propagandist  but rather get lost in that debate some of us argued and worked for the setting up of a rank and file rally before the official one . At the first, we must have had around 100 attend ( I think some thought it was the official rally) . We built and worked for the two day strike and increased the numbers at the rank and file rallies and began organising proper picketing . For example, we closed the car parks where there had been some scabbing by the managers  ( car parks were a big income spinner for the Council). By the time the three day strike started we had over 250 at the rank and file rallies and targeted the weaker sections of the Council,.On the second day of the three day strike some of the Branch officials turned up , and tried to control the meeting. So it was put to the vote who should chair , I was nominated , won the show of hands and we held a good meeting with members asking the officials why they hadn't done this or why didn't they try and do that etc .

The point I'm trying to make is that hard work over a long period of time at the rank and file level , however small and modest, can make a difference and become a bridge between 'ideas' and delivering/achieving  the sort of thing that your leaflet is promoting


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 12, 2022)

Fwiw, I'm hearing that when the UCU dispute resumes in February, there is serious talk of it being all-out, can't think when the last time we had an actual all-out national strike. Although I am also hearing that their leadership is being super mysterious and secretive about their plans.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 12, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> In the local government strikes in the 80s , it was one day , two day and then three days strikes, I was still in the SWP. Despite the branch being controlled by the CP and Labour Party, we had built a reasonable network of rank and file shop stewards and activists through sectional disputes, collections for other strikes nationally and locally, anti racist work with the Black Workers Group etc etc. The line was for an all out strike which was imo somewhat optimistic and a bit propagandist  but rather get lost in that debate some of us argued and worked for the setting up of a rank and file rally before the official one . At the first, we must have had around 100 attend ( I think some thought it was the official rally) . We built and worked for the two day strike and increased the numbers at the rank and file rallies and began organising proper picketing . For example, we closed the car parks where there had been some scabbing by the managers  ( car parks were a big income spinner for the Council). By the time the three day strike started we had over 250 at the rank and file rallies and targeted the weaker sections of the Council,.On the second day of the three day strike some of the Branch officials turned up , and tried to control the meeting. So it was put to the vote who should chair , I was nominated , won the show of hands and we held a good meeting with members asking the officials why they hadn't done this or why didn't they try and do that etc .
> 
> The point I'm trying to make is that hard work over a long period of time at the rank and file level , however small and modest, can make a difference and become a bridge between 'ideas' and delivering/achieving  the sort of thing that your leaflet is promoting


Was the council pretty much a one-union workplace, or did you have the same splits with GMB and so on?


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 12, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Was the council pretty much a one-union workplace, or did you have the same splits with GMB and so on?


GMB, NUPE as it was at the time , TGWU , obviously NALGO was the biggest . I'm sure there were some TASS /MFS as well. 

When i came to Manchester a lot of the left inc SWP, were in NUPE not NALGO as NUPE were seen as more left wing . However I and others  argued that it was more important to have the better activists in the biggest union , NALGO, and that the idea of Red Unions actually meant we weren't organising amongst the people who needed good organsiation, so a lot moved to NALGO ( albeit with gritted teeth)


----------



## TopCat (Dec 12, 2022)

Just had disappointing news that our workplace ballot did not reach a 50 percent return. Likely much affected by postal strikes.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 13, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Fwiw, I'm hearing that when the UCU dispute resumes in February, there is serious talk of it being all-out, can't think when the last time we had an actual all-out national strike. Although I am also hearing that their leadership is being super mysterious and secretive about their plans.


Gap in my knowledge, what's the difference between "an actual all-out national strike" and the strikes they've had so far?



TopCat said:


> Just had disappointing news that our workplace ballot did not reach a 50 percent return. Likely much affected by postal strikes.


Ahh, that sucks, really sorry to hear that


----------



## moochedit (Dec 13, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Gap in my knowledge, what's the difference between "an actual all-out national strike" and the strikes they've had so far?
> 
> 
> Ahh, that sucks, really sorry to hear that


i've always understood it to mean everyone strikes and stays out until their demands are met. (Unlike one day strikes).


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 13, 2022)

Ah, so it's not so much "all [workers] out" but more "all [days] out"? An indefinite strike, essentially?

If that is what UCU are looking at, then blimey! Will certainly be interesting to see how that goes!


----------



## ska invita (Dec 13, 2022)

At the moment the strikes seem somewhat ineffective.... Removal of labour isn't actually hurting employers and putting pressure on them.

As it seems to be the government who is stopping settlements pressure can only be directed at them. At best you could hope this strike wave  is hurting Tory polling but that isn't clear 

Indefinite strikes (I'd be surprised if that happens) would likely create a national moment of crisis which would directly pressure the government.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 13, 2022)

What's happening in your union/workplace  ska invita  regarding pay?


----------



## ska invita (Dec 13, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> What's happening in your union/workplace  ska invita  regarding pay?


i work in a co-op, we try and put pay up as much as possible but basically pay freeze for years now because of inflation
in a co-op everyone is the boss!
i pay subs to IWW for what its worth


----------



## flypanam (Dec 13, 2022)

ska invita said:


> At the moment the strikes seem somewhat ineffective.... Removal of labour isn't actually hurting employers and putting pressure on them.
> 
> As it seems to be the government who is stopping settlements pressure can only be directed at them. At best you could hope this strike wave  is hurting Tory polling but that isn't clear
> 
> Indefinite strikes (I'd be surprised if that happens) would likely create a national moment of crisis which would directly pressure the government.


Our strike UCU has had some positive effects, firstly the bosses are not showing a United front some have admitted that they as a group have been underpaying us for years I think that’s a big positive. Negotiations are starting over pay today with some admitting that the 3% offered doesn’t reflect the cost of living. 

It may just be start but I’m happy with an all out strike. I don’t have savings but going for it is the best chance we have.


----------



## ska invita (Dec 13, 2022)

flypanam said:


> Our strike UCU has had some positive effects, firstly the bosses are not showing a United front some have admitted that they as a group have been underpaying us for years I think that’s a big positive. Negotiations are starting over pay today with some admitting that the 3% offered doesn’t reflect the cost of living.
> 
> It may just be start but I’m happy with an all out strike. I don’t have savings but going for it is the best chance we have.


yes there have been many strike wins already - i shoudlve been clear, i was referring  to trains and now NHS in which the government seems perfectly happy to scupper and ignore fall out, fall out which lands only on the public and workers themselves


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Dec 13, 2022)

Here was the govt clapping the NHS in recent history who they now state are undeserving of a fair pay deal.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 13, 2022)

The highest number of strike days this year for over a decade and public support varying from 40-60% for strikers .


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 13, 2022)

Latest Royal Mail development is that now sick pay for any uncertificated sickness absence (ie. any sickness absence of seven days or less) is at the discretion of your manager! No room for discrimination, bullying or coercion there! It's also probably illegal and will be challenged through ACAS.

Cheers and see you on the picket line tomorrow  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 13, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Latest Royal Mail development is that now sick pay for any uncertificated sickness absence (ie. any sickness absence of seven days or less) is at the discretion of your manager! No room for discrimination, bullying or coercion there! It's also probably illegal and will be challenged through ACAS.
> 
> Cheers and see you on the picket line tomorrow  - Louis MacNeice


No sick pay as in they won't pay SSP or no sick pay as in they won't pay you your regular salary?  I've never received a day of SSP in my life, everywhere I have ever worked as paid someone off sick their full salary for short term sickness.
SSP is a legal requirement getting your full salary is company policy so the first is definitely illegal, the second isn't illegal though of course it might very well in your T&C's and thus breach of contract.


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 13, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> No sick pay as in they won't pay SSP or no sick pay as in they won't pay you your regular salary?  I've never received a day of SSP in my life, everywhere I have ever worked as paid someone off sick their full salary for short term sickness.
> SSP is a legal requirement getting your full salary is company policy so the first is definitely illegal, the second isn't illegal though of course it might very well in your T&C's and thus breach of contract.


Good luck by the way forgot add that


----------



## Sue (Dec 13, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> SSP is a legal requirement getting your full salary is company policy so the first is definitely illegal, the second isn't illegal though of course it might very well in your T&C's and thus breach of contract.


You know you're not eligible for SSP for the first three days of illness, right? (And obviously SSP at £100 a week is potentially much less than the person's earning.)





__





						Statutory Sick Pay (SSP)
					

Your Statutory Sick Pay (SSP) - how much you get, eligibility, how to claim SSP, fit notes, disputes.




					www.gov.uk


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 13, 2022)

Sue said:


> You know you're not eligible for SSP for the first three days of illness, right? (And obviously SSP at £100 a week is potentially much less than the person's earning.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh I'm sure this is a fairly blatant attempt at intimidation just curious about how intimidating.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 13, 2022)

MickiQ said:


> No sick pay as in they won't pay SSP or no sick pay as in they won't pay you your regular salary?  I've never received a day of SSP in my life, everywhere I have ever worked as paid someone off sick their full salary for short term sickness.
> SSP is a legal requirement getting your full salary is company policy so the first is definitely illegal, the second isn't illegal though of course it might very well in your T&C's and thus breach of contract.


That's no pay from RM. It is not clear if they will do the necessary re. SSP or if it will go down as unauthorised absence. Either way they appear to be ripping up their contractual obligations as signed up to with every RM employee.

There is also the question of what criteria they have advised mangers to make their decisions on; it would be 'interesting' to see them.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## flypanam (Dec 14, 2022)

flypanam said:


> Our strike UCU has had some positive effects, firstly the bosses are not showing a United front some have admitted that they as a group have been underpaying us for years I think that’s a big positive. Negotiations are starting over pay today with some admitting that the 3% offered doesn’t reflect the cost of living.
> 
> It may just be start but I’m happy with an all out strike. I don’t have savings but going for it is the best chance we have.


Now that I’m not on a work computer, one of the biggest developments that I’ve seen in the strike is the breaking down of barriers  between staff. As librarians we’ve always been ignored by teaching staff or denigrated as being difficult as regards to returns, pushing for time for info lit. Since the 24th there has been a spirit of collaboration that in my time here I’ve never seen before. And with that there are more conversations about the nature and failings of our institution. How that translates into something more radical and confrontational with the our bosses, time will tell but there is the seed of potential.


----------



## muscovyduck (Dec 14, 2022)

flypanam said:


> Now that I’m not on a work computer, one of the biggest developments that I’ve seen in the strike is the breaking down of barriers  between staff. As librarians we’ve always been ignored by teaching staff or denigrated as being difficult as regards to returns, pushing for time for info lit. Since the 24th there has been a spirit of collaboration that in my time here I’ve never seen before. And with that there are more conversations about the nature and failings of our institution. How that translates into something more radical and confrontational with the our bosses, time will tell but there is the seed of potential.


Definitely feeling this more widely - there's more solidarity flowing around and it feels like openly supporting the strikes is the majority position rather than the minority one.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 14, 2022)

flypanam said:


> Now that I’m not on a work computer, one of the biggest developments that I’ve seen in the strike is the breaking down of barriers  between staff. As librarians we’ve always been ignored by teaching staff or denigrated as being difficult as regards to returns, pushing for time for info lit. Since the 24th there has been a spirit of collaboration that in my time here I’ve never seen before. And with that there are more conversations about the nature and failings of our institution. How that translates into something more radical and confrontational with the our bosses, time will tell but there is the seed of potential.


Yup, similar experience for us. Simply standing on the picket lines together and talking has helped build some connections, even if our issues/disputes aren't exactly the same, and think there's a desire at the member level to link up more in the future.

(Though I couldn't speak with any great insight to the nature of the relationship between libraries and teaching staff, it's generally some of my other colleagues who do the 'outside the library' stuff  )


----------



## PR1Berske (Dec 14, 2022)




----------



## Ming (Dec 14, 2022)

I think Richard Madeley has gone a bit bonkers.


----------



## LDC (Dec 14, 2022)

Ming said:


> I think Richard Madeley has gone a bit bonkers.




I started watching that last night and had to turn it off before I threw something through a window. TBH the media across the board clearly drops any pretence of objectivity when it comes to this. Pretty much all of them are lickspittle cunts.


----------



## Ming (Dec 14, 2022)

LDC said:


> I started watching that last night and had to turn it off before I threw something through a window. TBH the media across the board cleaetlyu drops any pretence of objectiveity when it comes to this. Pretty much all of them are lickspittle cunts.


Totally agree. They’re not even trying to pretend they are objective. But i do think people are a bit more media savvy these days than in say the miners strike. Hopefully more people will pick up on this. Hopefully….


----------



## flypanam (Dec 14, 2022)

PR1Berske said:


>


----------



## PR1Berske (Dec 14, 2022)

Aaah. She had received hundreds of "scab!" responses.


----------



## Storm Fox (Dec 14, 2022)

I know he's not everyone's favourite, but here is Mr Pie on the Strikes.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 14, 2022)

LDC said:


> I started watching that last night and had to turn it off before I threw something through a window. TBH the media across the board clearly drops any pretence of objectivity when it comes to this. Pretty much all of them are lickspittle cunts.



Mick Lynch was able, eventually, to provide a perfectly serious explanation for the timing of the latest strikes: that Network Rail was imposing some of the changes from this week.

I won’t be holding my breath whilst waiting for Good Morning Britain to get their CEO on to ask them why they’ve timed attacks on T&Cs to ruin Christmas etc


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 14, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Fwiw, I'm hearing that when the UCU dispute resumes in February, there is serious talk of it being all-out, can't think when the last time we had an actual all-out national strike. Although I am also hearing that their leadership is being super mysterious and secretive about their plans.


Their GS has issued a video stating that the next steps will be decided by membership consultation and discussion. This seems designed to undermine the decision of the EC to go for indefinite action from February. All played out on social media…


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Dec 14, 2022)

There's full on ruling class attacks now with the usual Sun headline against Lynch and cunts like Madeley doing TV attacks.
Didn't that wanker get caught shoplifting once yet he has the gall to slate decent people wanting fair recompense for their work?


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 14, 2022)

flypanam said:


> View attachment 355628


I imagine this is some kind of a carefully orchestrated PR thing that she's going along with, but I really like the idea that LNER really are just having to make their head of customer service spend all day pushing a drinks cart around.


Smokeandsteam said:


> Their GS has issued a video stating that the next steps will be decided by membership consultation and discussion. This seems designed to undermine the decision of the EC to go for indefinite action from February. All played out on social media…


Oh, looking it up there's a THE write up:








						UCU split on plans to call ‘indefinite strike’ from February
					

Union leader Jo Grady distances herself from higher education committee decision as key pay negotiations begin




					www.timeshighereducation.com
				





> UK universities could be hit by an “indefinite strike” starting in February, but the general secretary of the University and College Union has refused to endorse the action.
> 
> Jo Grady has clashed with her own union’s higher education committee on the next steps in the long-running dispute over pay, working conditions and pensions, advocating for “blocks of action” across three months next year, instead of an all-out walkout.
> 
> ...


Would be interested to hear more from UCU members about what they think of all this, do people actually think they'd be able to pull an all-out strike off?


----------



## nottsgirl (Dec 14, 2022)

There are loads of quite good TUC ads on Instagram at the moment.


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 14, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I imagine this is some kind of a carefully orchestrated PR thing that she's going along with, but I really like the idea that LNER really are just having to make their head of customer service spend all day pushing a drinks cart around.
> 
> Oh, looking it up there's a THE write up:
> 
> ...


In theory, I approve. In practice, I'm not sure whether our branch could sustain indefinite strike action.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 14, 2022)

Ming said:


> I think Richard Madeley has gone a bit bonkers.



Gone?


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 14, 2022)

Yeah, that sort of fits with what I've been hearing. In particular, what I've heard someone raising that the aggreggated ballot is a big advantage in some ways, but it also means that there's people who've been striking from branches that could never manage to get over the threshold on their own, and an escalation on that scale could really risk the ability to hold people together. It's one thing to go all-out at a particular, very well-organised site/branch or two, and a very different thing to pull it off nationally.
On the other hand, god I hate sounding like a wet blanket, so I hope they manage to go for it and win.

Also, RCN have a map of tomorrow's pickets here, which is a good tool but there's noticeably a lot of the country missing:








						RCN strike action in December 2022 | Royal College of Nursing
					

Employers where strikes will take place in the first phase of RCN industrial action and the dates on which strike action will occur.




					www.rcn.org.uk
				




I've also heard the Shelter strike is suspended, no more details on that one though.


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 14, 2022)

Magnus McGinty said:


> There's full on ruling class attacks now with the usual Sun headline against Lynch and cunts like Madeley doing TV attacks.
> Didn't that wanker get caught shoplifting once yet he has the gall to slate decent people wanting fair recompense for their work?


Tesco's Didsbury ,  champagne. A momentary loss of concentration led him to push a trolley through the exit doors without parting with cash or card.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 14, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> Tesco's Didsbury champagne. A momentary loss of concentration led him to push a trolley through the exit doors without parting with cash or card.


I imagine the Didsbury there is probably connected to the Tesco's rather than the champagne, but I like the idea of Didsbury champagne. If it's from Chorlton it's just sparkling wine, etc etc.


----------



## redsquirrel (Dec 15, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I imagine this is some kind of a carefully orchestrated PR thing that she's going along with, but I really like the idea that LNER really are just having to make their head of customer service spend all day pushing a drinks cart around.
> 
> Oh, looking it up there's a THE write up:
> 
> Would be interested to hear more from UCU members about what they think of all this, do people actually think they'd be able to pull an all-out strike off?


Basically what Serge Forward has said. I just can't see an indefinite strike being held to at my branch.

That said if we are going to do an assessment boycott (which I am in favour of) then you will have 100% deductions in which case there is an argued for just going to a strike

Regardless how the info has been provided to members has been terrible


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 15, 2022)

Excellent Twitter thread on the stakes in the rail dispute.

None of the media reports I’ve seen have gone into any detail on any of this (bar the proposal to close all of the ticket offices).

The thread reveals that the ‘strings’ attached to the pay cut offer effectively propose to tear up the organisation of work and terms and conditions in the sector that have been hard fought for and defended over decades. In signing up to these changes the RMT would make its members lambs to the slaughter.

A similar process - expertly set out by Louis McNiece on this thread  is underway in the post office.

A clear coordinated boss and government attempt to defeat what’s left of the organised working class.

So the stakes are high. But the decision of a weak and unpopular government to take on the nurses and other public sector workers at the same time as the RMT and CWU is either a high risk ‘do or die’ strategy or revealing of a government that had lost the plot.

At the risk of sounding like a student trot if now isn’t the time for a general strike to be called for the new year then when will be?


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 15, 2022)

I will be popping down to the nursing picket line later- it's my day off anyway, but I will be officially striking on Tuesday 20th as I was rostered on.


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 15, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I will be popping down to the nursing picket line later- it's my day off anyway, but I will be officially striking on Tuesday 20th as I was rostered on.


I will have to check with Middle later, A&E nurses aren't striking but if it's her day off then she will almost certainly be there. Pollyanna not so sure about, she's nowhere near as stroppy as Middle but they are friends and Middle is not above playing the "You Would Never Have Met My Brother If It Wasn't For Me" card if she wants something.


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 15, 2022)

The Beeb has a handy strike chart


----------



## ska invita (Dec 15, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> A clear coordinated boss and government attempt to defeat what’s left of the organised working class.


The impression Ive got from reports -  including what Mick Lynch has said, and what is said in that thread - is that agreeable terms have been proposed by the 'bosses' and its the government alone who have been adding the poison. without their interference this would've been resolved by now - is the impression I've got


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Dec 15, 2022)

The govt gave the industry funds during Covid with strings attached to reform the railways. They wanted the trains to continue running, empty or otherwise, and are now using that to attack terms and conditions. It’s a total fucking piss take.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 15, 2022)

ska invita said:


> The impression Ive got from reports -  including what Mick Lynch has said, and what is said in that thread - is that agreeable terms have been proposed by the 'bosses' and its the government alone who have been adding the poison. without their interference this would've been resolved by now - is the impression I've got


With Royal Mail it is the bosses; or probably more accurately a small but very powerful group of shareholders. Of course the government could intervene with regard to RM consistently and deliberately failing their universal service obligation (this was occurring prior to our strike action); no one is holding their breath waiting for this to happen.

Strike still 100% solid in my workplace. Nationally RM claimed to have 11,000 in working last Friday; there are 14,000 non union members (total workforce well in excess of 140,000) so RM can't  even get all the non members in. They really have pissed almost everybody off!

I heard this morning that over 100 union reps have been suspended so far; the vast majority on what have been described as 'trumped up charges'. The mood seems to be hardening and if the car horns and gifts to the picket line are anything to go by, public support is growing.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## ska invita (Dec 15, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> With Royal Mail it is the bosses; or probably more accurately a small but very powerful group of shareholders.


Just in case there's is any doubt I am talking specifically about what I can glean regarding the rail strikes, although also a similiar dynamic perhaps with the NHS.

Are Royal Mail owners getting government compensation money from the strikes?


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 15, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Just in case there's is any doubt I am talking specifically about what I can glean regarding the rail strikes, although also a similiar dynamic perhaps with the NHS.
> 
> Are Royal Mail owners getting government compensation money from the strikes?


No. There seems to be little or no government interest in/engagement with our dispute. 

What has come up several times in the dispute  to date is the feeling that RM's owners would like to hand the letter post back to the government while keeping all the parcels, the estate and all associated infrastructure. The land alone would be worth billions and wouldn't all be needed just for parcels. There is also a very healthy set of pension funds which some of my colleagues are concerned could be raided in the not too distant future.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 15, 2022)

Oh and a very merry Xmas  to whichever greedy git stole our picket line bbq yesterday! It was minus three this morning so we didn't miss it much!

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## friedaweed (Dec 15, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I will be popping down to the nursing picket line later- it's my day off anyway, but I will be officially striking on Tuesday 20th as I was rostered on.


Good for you mate.


----------



## Buddy Bradley (Dec 15, 2022)

One thing that I found interesting was that BBC news this morning actually mentioned nurses' salaries, quoting 27k to start, 55k as a senior after several years, and 32k average. That's quite a bit higher than I was expecting, considering a lot of the sympathetic side of reporting has been about nurses needing to use food banks or not being able to afford rent. Are those numbers actually accurate/representative?


----------



## Plumdaff (Dec 15, 2022)

Buddy Bradley said:


> One thing that I found interesting was that BBC news this morning actually mentioned nurses' salaries, quoting 27k to start, 55k as a senior after several years, and 32k average. That's quite a bit higher than I was expecting, considering a lot of the sympathetic side of reporting has been about nurses needing to use food banks or not being able to afford rent. Are those numbers actually accurate/representative?



The vast majority of nurses are band 5 or 6, meaning that the maximum salary they will ever earn, regardless of length of service and experience, is £40k.

Given at that salary you may will likely have post reg and postgraduate qualifications and be responsible for many seriously ill patients and usually lots of other staff it's not a massively high wage.

To earn £55k you need to be working at service manager level or above, and have worked in that job for over 5 years. Very few nurses have that banding, however much they may effect a crude average. The RCN also represents health care assistants who earn a maximum of £26k regardless of length of service, skills and/or experience.

You can earn more with unsocial hours payments, but they aren't what they used to be, there's been no overtime in the NHS for 20+ years, and your health takes the toll of the unsocial hours.

In real terms, since 2010, the average nurse has had their pay cut by £2.5k.


tl;dr - BBC are not being accurate or representative. I'm using Welsh figures but you're splitting hairs really, we all earn about the same.


----------



## teqniq (Dec 15, 2022)




----------



## LDC (Dec 15, 2022)

Buddy Bradley said:


> One thing that I found interesting was that BBC news this morning actually mentioned nurses' salaries, quoting 27k to start, 55k as a senior after several years, and 32k average. That's quite a bit higher than I was expecting, considering a lot of the sympathetic side of reporting has been about nurses needing to use food banks or not being able to afford rent. Are those numbers actually accurate/representative?



It's not _exactly_ a lie, but it's not really the truth. Yes, as a band 5 you start at £27,000pa. The only nurse getting £55,000 is a matron or similar as top of Band 8a, and no way will many ever get to that level, and if they do it's probably after 20 years of work. As has been said most will be Band 5 or maybe Band 6 the whole career, and the top of Band 5 is £32,000.

TBH the BBC have consistently been pricks over the details and coverage of this strike, so I wouldn't take much that they say at face value.


----------



## Lorca (Dec 15, 2022)

Just got back from picket line of Nurses strike with my partner, who is an Nurse - was a really inspiring day. She said about 99% positive support all day from the public, with just one old couple giving a thumbs down gesture as they drove past. One bloke pulled up in his car, thought here we go, he's gonna give some stick -  and promptly handed out around 20 wrapped xmas presents, which he'd done himself, all containing chocolates! Also, ordinary working people joining the picket, cars constantly beeping, cheering, pulling over to hand them coffee and tea, chocolates, hot food etc! Said it was really inspiring and a real boost in sub zero temps to get that level of support despite all the media abuse. She said it felt like a definite sense of Nurses starting to feel empowered and understanding of their collective power - said Nurses have to be resilient all the time on the ward to cope with low staffing and morale but together they felt strong for once. Nurses all talking to each other about how deep the problems currently are and how to move forward- it definitely was about much more than wages alone. Tbh sounds a bit crazy or cheesy but we both needed this sense of collectivity and togetherness having felt quite beaten down by toryism these past years. A tiny thing maybe, and maybe it will come to nothing again, but it meant a lot to us anyway.


----------



## sparkybird (Dec 15, 2022)

Buddy Bradley said:


> One thing that I found interesting was that BBC news this morning actually mentioned nurses' salaries, quoting 27k to start, 55k as a senior after several years, and 32k average. That's quite a bit higher than I was expecting, considering a lot of the sympathetic side of reporting has been about nurses needing to use food banks or not being able to afford rent. Are those numbers actually accurate/representative?


If you are a nurse in London on the starting or average salary and have a family it should be no surprise that they might have trouble with rent and need to use food banks. I've friends earning more than that who use them sometimes ☹️


----------



## teqniq (Dec 15, 2022)

Petition: NHS workers need a pay rise
					

I’ve just signed to support this campaign – join me



					r.ippl.es


----------



## brogdale (Dec 15, 2022)

innit?


----------



## spellbinder (Dec 15, 2022)

Lorca said:


> Tbh sounds a bit crazy or cheesy but we both needed this sense of collectivity and togetherness having felt quite beaten down by toryism these past years. A tiny thing maybe, and maybe it will come to nothing again, but it meant a lot to us anyway.


This is how the toryscum have got everyone, they divide us all and make us doubt what we think and feel is wrong and we should listen to them and treat the nhs as whining money grabbing lepers. fuck the government - let one of them spend just one hour on a hospital ward and watch how nurses are run off their feet and don't get a second to themselves, buzzers going off, bed pans needed, medications administered, patients falling out of bed, some just needing a bit of company, phones going off, family  needing updates.
Fuck me i couldn't do it - the public *do *understand and sympathise with them and it's disgusting that it takes this action for them to feel solidarity with the public who need and are thankful for all that they do.
This government makes my  fucking blood boil


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 15, 2022)

ACN article on the current situation with the strikes









						State Scabbing and Dirty Tricks
					

Two things are mounting, strikes by the score and blame by the shit shovel.  Two things are being hidden, the extent and scale of resistance and where the responsibility lies. A while ago we s…




					anarcomuk.uk


----------



## Ming (Dec 16, 2022)

Plumdaff said:


> The vast majority of nurses are band 5 or 6, meaning that the maximum salary they will ever earn, regardless of length of service and experience, is £40k.
> 
> Given at that salary you may will likely have post reg and postgraduate qualifications and be responsible for many seriously ill patients and usually lots of other staff it's not a massively high wage.
> 
> ...


Or move to Canada and make a salary of 60 grand (GBP) for a band five post. Nurses are well underpaid in the NHS. That’s why this strike is important. I don’t honestly think nursing is perceived in the UK as an actual ‘profession’. It is though. I‘ve found it much more challenging than moving numbers around on a computer and valuing things. Although if you get into clinical analytics you can do that too.


----------



## Ming (Dec 16, 2022)

He’s definitely getting angrier.


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Dec 16, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I imagine this is some kind of a carefully orchestrated PR thing that she's going along with, but I really like the idea that LNER really are just having to make their head of customer service spend all day pushing a drinks cart around.
> 
> Oh, looking it up there's a THE write up:
> 
> ...


at my post 1992 HEI theres not enough UCU members to pull this off.  Some ex teachers in initial teacher education remain in NEU to avoid strike action.  Others join HE from other industries that arent unionised and dont think about joining UCU

UCU membership is very different across different HEI's


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 16, 2022)

Aye, density is variable. Where I work it's at a reasonable level, and while the union can cause some serious inconvenience, it's still in no position to shut the whole place down.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 16, 2022)

Statement from the joint HE unions here, sounds like a fucking shambles:


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 16, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Statement from the joint HE unions here, sounds like a fucking shambles:


Lil' bit,  aye.

That said, genuinely still not sure how much better it could be/we should expect.

I always try to recognise the reality of a given situation and manage my expectations accordingly, and in this case I feel like I simply don't have enough knowledge/understanding to make a convincing judgement.

It's a slightly odd set-up, really, with five different unions with different memberships, perspectives, priorities, etc. Feels like that inherently increases the shambles potential.

But... instinctively can't help feeling that surely it's not unreasonable to want it to be better than this?

Ah well, we keep going, doing what we can, when we can.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 16, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Ah well, we keep going, doing what we can, when we can.


In fact, on that note... Personally, one thing I _do _think should get more focus is pressuring other motivations of employers. They've clearly decided they can cope with a certain amount of striking without giving us too much. Ok, so what else do they care about that will force their hand more?

Students, students parents, powerful alumni, funding orgs, academic tables, public image...? Whatever it is, feels like we can do more in those arenas, and largely free of both the legal restrictions and financial sacrifice of industrial action.


----------



## belboid (Dec 16, 2022)

Obviously, I will always support strikes no matter what the ‘inconvenience’ - but this case does almost make that principle wobble - 



			https://www.wigantoday.net/news/people/strikes-see-wigans-world-pie-eating-championships-shelved-until-the-new-year-3953224?


----------



## Ming (Dec 16, 2022)

I love Mick Lynch;


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 16, 2022)

Ming said:


> I love Mick Lynch;



I'm sure he probably means well and its good he's talking about inequality and increasing authoritarianism. But its all so limited. It doesn't go far enough. He doesn't talk about worker's ownership of their workplaces and communities and not once is the real, underlying problem (capitalism) mentioned. He just wants a fairer, nicer version of capitalism that doesn't exist. The problem with the other parties isn't that they're not effective opposition, its that they're all part of the bourgeois system and are therefore just as much our enemies as the tories. And this is all too dependent on appeals to those in power. Things need to go further and need to be more militant. But I guess you're not going to get that with a centre-left bureaucrat.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 16, 2022)

Lord Camomile said:


> Lil' bit,  aye.
> 
> That said, genuinely still not sure how much better it could be/we should expect.
> 
> ...


Oh yeah, I wasn't even really slagging off the unions when I said that, UCEA posting something as a "joint statement" when it hadn't actually been agreed is a bit farcical but that's not not really something the unions can be blamed for. Also I suppose worth keeping in mind that even the individual unions aren't necessarily unified bodies, as we're seeing with the current UCU thing.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 16, 2022)

belboid said:


> Obviously, I will always support strikes no matter what the ‘inconvenience’ - but this case does almost make that principle wobble -
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.wigantoday.net/news/people/strikes-see-wigans-world-pie-eating-championships-shelved-until-the-new-year-3953224?


Fantastic quotes in that story:
"We're now consulting with the elite competitors to try to find a slot in a crowded January 2023 calendar that doesn't clash with kebab night, Chippy lunch day, or times when Asda discounts the 'best before' sandwiches and pasties,” said organiser and Piemaster Tony Callaghan.


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 16, 2022)

belboid said:


> Obviously, I will always support strikes no matter what the ‘inconvenience’ - but this case does almost make that principle wobble -
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.wigantoday.net/news/people/strikes-see-wigans-world-pie-eating-championships-shelved-until-the-new-year-3953224?



Paul Mason will be delighted at the unintended blow the strikes have struck to Wigan..the town with no seats or women or migrants...or pies now.


----------



## Sue (Dec 16, 2022)

Beat this headline...  (You've got to love local papers.)









						Man with parrot joins staff rally outside Homerton Hospital
					

A rally to show support for striking nurses took place at Homerton Hospital despite staff not participating in the national walkout.




					www.hackneygazette.co.uk
				




(I'd have popped along if I'd known this was on.)


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 16, 2022)

Smokeandsteam said:


> Paul Mason will be delighted at the unintended blow the strikes have struck to Wigan..the town with no seats or women or migrants...or pies now.


I was going to say, the pictures of the event do not appear to show anyone sitting down, but there might be some women there, so mixed evidence for Mason's theories:








(eta: can't make the pictures work for some reason, but easy enough to look them up yourself if you're interested)


----------



## belboid (Dec 16, 2022)

I am intrigued as to how I could become an 'elite competitor' - I reckon if they did it in different categories according to was it size, I'd be a world champ.

My favourite line regards the rules for the proper size of pie 'a pie wall angle from base to top of between zero and 15 degrees."


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 16, 2022)

For fans of "the BBC desperately trying to get members of the public to slag off strikers and getting slapped down", here's a very solid example of the genre:


----------



## Bingoman (Dec 16, 2022)

More strikes this time with Amazon 









						Amazon staff vote to strike at Coventry warehouse in UK first | ITV News
					

Amazon workers have voted to go on strike for the first time ever in the UK - after a ballot among hundreds of staff in the company's warehouse in Coventry. | ITV National News




					www.itv.com


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 16, 2022)

Will be interesting to see how the GMB involvement affects this one, since I reckon there's both positives and negatives to them getting a formal union involved there. Best of luck to them, anyway!


----------



## BristolEcho (Dec 16, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> For fans of "the BBC desperately trying to get members of the public to slag off strikers and getting slapped down", here's a very solid example of the genre:



BBC running stories the other day "How will the strikes affect your plans?" Transparent.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 17, 2022)

Royal Mail now asking staff if family and friends would like to come in and help clear the back log!

I'm not expecting many if any takers.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice

p.s. there is an unintentionally funny article in the Telegraph about it.


----------



## JimW (Dec 17, 2022)

Sue said:


> Beat this headline...  (You've got to love local papers.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good letter in our local, should check out who these independents are, usually hear that in local government and think shy Tories but looks like maybe Corbynistas here. one's the new councillor for my folks' ward: Letter to the Editor: why it's right to strike | Stroud Times


----------



## petee (Dec 17, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> For fans of "the BBC desperately trying to get members of the public to slag off strikers and getting slapped down", here's a very solid example of the genre:




ages ago during the last transit strike here fox and other local media were out trying to get people to moan about their inconveniences but again and again they got "I understand why they need to do th-" and the mike got pulled away.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 17, 2022)

JimW said:


> Good letter in our local, should check out who these independents are, usually hear that in local government and think shy Tories but looks like maybe Corbynistas here. one's the new councillor for my folks' ward: Letter to the Editor: why it's right to strike | Stroud Times


Looks like this is their twitter:


			https://twitter.com/sdcommunityind
		


Links to this impressively minimalist website:


			Stroud District Community Independents


----------



## JimW (Dec 17, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> ...
> 
> Links to this impressively minimalist website:
> 
> ...


Worryingly yellow!


----------



## cesare (Dec 17, 2022)

Good news from the Shelter workers. They are back at work having secured 7% increase (a compound one ie 4% on top of the existing 3%) plus £1250 in non-consolidated lump sums.

They are saying many thanks for the support and solidarity ✊


----------



## teqniq (Dec 17, 2022)

meanwhile in England....


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 17, 2022)

To be clear re. the RM family and friends thing; it is aimed at managers and non operational staff (eg. payroll and accounts). Their family and friends will be paid £18 per hour; 50% more than posties. And apparently they will be fully trained; it will be very interesting to see how they arrange for their driver assessments. Or maybe it's all just more desperate provocative twaddle.

Cheers -  Louis MacNeice


----------



## LDC (Dec 17, 2022)

Our hospital is full of well-meaning but a bit useless volunteers now, trying to 'help' the Trust through this 'difficult period'.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 17, 2022)

In mildly entertaining sectariana news, the WSWS turned up at my local RMT picket line today, prompting responses of "oh, for fuck's sake, they're here" from one rail striker and "to be fair, we've had three days now without them showing up, that's pretty good going" from another. 
In less entertaining news, I can't verify the accuracy of any of this, but have been told that some rail cleaners have been prevented from joining this round of strike action, because they were contracted out to Mitie, balloted and got a mandate against Mitie, and then suddenly had their contracts transferred to a new company and have been told they don't have a valid legal dispute with the new company. I didn't catch the name of the new company or what line all this was happening on, and don't know enough law to be able to say whether that's binding or not, but does sound sadly plausible.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Dec 17, 2022)

Bloody hell.

Utterly shifty if true, but also wonder just how Mitie felt/were compensated in all of that


----------



## andysays (Dec 17, 2022)

Sue said:


> Beat this headline...  (You've got to love local papers.)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm pretty sure that's the same man and parrot I've seen a few times down the lower end of Kingsland Road. 

Not seem them recently, so glad they're still both OK.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 17, 2022)

List from Strike Map:



Fwiw, I've heard the NHS pickets on the 21st might be starting at midday, so if you're thinking of going down before work there might not be anyone there.


----------



## LDC (Dec 18, 2022)

Nice load of photos from the Bristol healthcare pickets here Pictures from the Picket – NHS strike in Bristol - Angry Workers


----------



## Ming (Dec 19, 2022)




----------



## The39thStep (Dec 19, 2022)

LDC said:


> Nice load of photos from the Bristol healthcare pickets here Pictures from the Picket – NHS strike in Bristol - Angry Workers
> 
> View attachment 356158


Is General Strike the Angry Workers line now ?


----------



## LDC (Dec 19, 2022)

The39thStep said:


> Is General Strike the Angry Workers line now ?



Hahaha, no.

E2A: I was laughing at us and the fact we might have such self-importance we'd issue a line like that, and also that we could agree it, or that anyone would pay attention!


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 19, 2022)

Middle Q and Pollyanna were both working on the 15th so weren't out on the picket line. (that sounded really odd reading it back) Pollyanna who works in the ICU will be working tomorrow as well but Middle Q (A&E) is off so she will be there on the picket line waving a placard tomorrow. Youngest Q will be joining her since she has been 'volunteered' by her mother.
"Instead of just sitting there staring at your laptop go and join your sister and show some support"
"All women are sisters, Mum"
"Never mind the Helen Reddy crap, go and show solidarity with your actual sister"
So Mrs Q is taking a detour on the way to school to drop Youngest Q and flasks of coffee off at the picket line.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 19, 2022)

LDC said:


> Hahaha, no.
> 
> E2A: I was laughing at us and the fact we might have such self-importance we'd issue a line like that, and also that we could agree it, or that anyone would pay attention!


Guessing that the "degree educated, highly skilled professionals" one probably isn't the official AWW line either?

Anyway, details of tomorrow's pickets here:








						RCN strike action in December 2022 | Royal College of Nursing
					

Employers where strikes will take place in the first phase of RCN industrial action and the dates on which strike action will occur.




					www.rcn.org.uk


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 19, 2022)

I've just messaged Bristol Samba and Bristol dub club sound system to ask if they can come and support us outside the hospital tomorrow- short notice, but you never know......


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 19, 2022)

Brainaddict said:


> Not a good look for UVW - it's own staff in dispute with it now, through another union UVW dispute - Union Workers' Union


Further update on that here:








						Latest campaign update - UVW dispute - Union Workers' Union
					

It is with significant regret that the Union Workers’ Union (UWU) must announce we are formally in dispute with the United Voices of the World (UVW) union over a failure to meaningfully consult over proposed redundancies.




					unionworkersunion.org
				



Sounds like a crap situation, but at least no compulsory redundancies now?


----------



## quiet guy (Dec 19, 2022)

Yorkshire Fire Service is trying to recruit 'Contingency Fire fighters' as strike cover. Messages all over FB


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 19, 2022)

quiet guy said:


> Yorkshire Fire Service is trying to recruit 'Contingency Fire fighters' as strike cover. Messages all over FB


That will not end well 
"Which way round do we connect these hoses Bert"


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 20, 2022)




----------



## LDC (Dec 20, 2022)

Another good reason why these strikes must 'win' something, is that if they don't then the impact on morale and so staff retention (at least in the NHS) will take another blow and turn for the worse.


----------



## not a trot (Dec 20, 2022)

Tory press already have stories of deaths ready to publish.


----------



## LDC (Dec 20, 2022)

Yup, and it's a brutal thing to face at an interview, but it's answerable; people are needlessly dying everyday due to the state that the NHS is in currently and that state isn't an accident, it's the result of policies and decisions taken by the government.






						35% of ambulance workers witnessed deaths due to delays
					

Decade of cuts, explosion in demand and ambulance workers leaving in droves has left service on the edge of disaster




					www.gmb.org.uk


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 20, 2022)

Great to be out at the picket line. Met some Marxist fella who recognised me from radical bookfairs - quite a while ago now.

Played the Specials the whole time.


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 20, 2022)

I am considering changing Unions. I'm with GMB they did not get enough votes for Industrial action. However I feel they should of been there as an act of solidarity.   I can't see how they are representing my interests as an unregistered health care worker?

It's odd cus they have always been way more radical then the RCN who have always been notoriously Conservative.

I'm guessing that the low vote for industrial action had something to do with members being  on the lower end of the pay scale? (As I am)

I think I might need to go across to the RCN in order to be properly supported and represented.

What do Urban think?


----------



## LDC (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I am considering changing Unions. I'm with GMB they did not get enough votes for Industrial action. However I feel they should of been there as an act of solidarity.   I can't see how they are representing my interests as an unregistered health care worker?
> 
> It's odd cus they have always been way more radical then the RCN who have always been notoriously Conservative.
> 
> ...



I'm thinking similarly. I joined the GMB when I started with the NHS, as out of choice of a few unions they actually had a stall at the hospital I started at, and when I asked them why I should join them rather than any of the others they said something like, "We're a campaigning and political union." Anyway, I joined. But since then I've moved jobs and Trusts, and now am working at a hospital where they're not recognised. One of the main historical reasons for this seems to be recognition gets blocked by the other unions, and I guess the amount of work to get it through that has meant it's never happened. So I'm thinking I need to switch for that reason, but also.... they've been very shit over the last months leading up to this, including not being at all on the case with simple things like communication and support for the strikes. I think they're better for ambulance workers though tbh, they just seem quite shit for hospital workers ime.

I think if I was allowed (not a nurse or HCA etc.) I'd join the RCN (given the fact they've got their arse in gear quicker than all the others) but also either Unite or Unison (although I'm sure they have their own problems).

Deciphering all the rules and bureaucracy around these strikes has also been a headfuck!


----------



## SpookyFrank (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I am considering changing Unions. I'm with GMB they did not get enough votes for Industrial action. However I feel they should of been there as an act of solidarity.   I can't see how they are representing my interests as an unregistered health care worker?
> 
> It's odd cus they have always been way more radical then the RCN who have always been notoriously Conservative.
> 
> ...



Not sure where else you could go. Unison who Mrs Frank are with didn't get enough votes to strike either, probably because they represent so many different professions.


----------



## LDC (Dec 20, 2022)

SpookyFrank said:


> Not sure where else you could go. Unison who Mrs Frank are with didn't get enough votes to strike either, probably because they represent so many different professions.



Depends on the Trust in part. Some of the Trusts didn't get enough votes in the RCN to strike either. Does seem the health sections of the unions are basically slow and out-dated when it comes to sorting this out, partly rested on their laurels the last decades as there's not been any industrial action at all in the NHS.

I think Unite are _still _balloting after Xmas. Speed of ketamine addled tortoise ffs.


----------



## SpookyFrank (Dec 20, 2022)

I see the scab army with their tens of thousands of scab grunts sat around doing fuck all are complaining that they don't have enough scabs to scab with.









						Army warns of lack of troops to fill strike gaps
					

MILITARY chiefs have warned ministers they do not have enough soldiers to fill critical gaps as striking public sector workers threaten to bring Britain to a winter standstill. And it is rural communities that may suffer most.




					www.express.co.uk
				




The heart bleeds. If only there was some kind of popular movement to stick up for them at this difficult time. A popular movement that hadn't been sabotaged by scabs.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I am considering changing Unions. I'm with GMB they did not get enough votes for Industrial action. However I feel they should of been there as an act of solidarity.   I can't see how they are representing my interests as an unregistered health care worker?
> 
> It's odd cus they have always been way more radical then the RCN who have always been notoriously Conservative.
> 
> ...


Yeah, it's hard to answer in the abstract cos it's all about who's got most presence in your workplace, and even in your job role - like, in the broadest, most general strokes I'd say Unite > Unison > GMB, but that doesn't tell you anything about who'll actually have the best branch where you work. If you're eligible to join the RCN and their strikes, and no-one else has a mandate where you work, then I'd definitely say join RCN, though. 
And yeah, may be an obvious point but I only recently realised that the unions like Unison and GMB that try to organise across a range of job roles have a much tougher challenge than the RCN when trying to get over the 50% mark. Definitely reckon that if there's a functioning branch of whatever union then at least you should've had your branch sec/chair bringing the banner down in support, though! Are you/do you know many reps?


----------



## SpookyFrank (Dec 20, 2022)

LDC said:


> I think Unite are _still _balloting after Xmas. Speed of ketamine addled tortoise ffs.



Yeah my union (NEU) are taking their sweet fucking time as well. Ballots went out in October I think, but still nobody seems to have bothered counting them.


----------



## LDC (Dec 20, 2022)

Yeah so much of it depends on the reps where you work tbh, like how motivated and how much in league/sympathy with management they are. There's been no sign of any reps from any union at my hospital pathetically. Even posters about would have been something. 

And the RCN got a mandate for striking at my Trust, but then the RCN main rep works high up with management in the offices and derogated loads of wards and departments that shouldn't have been really; basically folded/colluded with the panicking Trust, and it's really made the strike much less impactful.


----------



## teqniq (Dec 20, 2022)




----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 20, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Yeah, it's hard to answer in the abstract cos it's all about who's got most presence in your workplace, and even in your job role - like, in the broadest, most general strokes I'd say Unite > Unison > GMB, but that doesn't tell you anything about who'll actually have the best branch where you work. If you're eligible to join the RCN and their strikes, and no-one else has a mandate where you work, then I'd definitely say join RCN, though.
> And yeah, may be an obvious point but I only recently realised that the unions like Unison and GMB that try to organise across a range of job roles have a much tougher challenge than the RCN when trying to get over the 50% mark. Definitely reckon that if there's a functioning branch of whatever union then at least you should've had your branch sec/chair bringing the banner down in support, though! Are you/do you know many reps?


I know of one rep. I'll talk to her.

Tbh contact from GMB went from them not leaving me alone to make sure I'd posted my ballot to nothing. Even when they announced the votes were under the threshold for Industrial action- it wasn't clear what that ment in terms of striking- it was my manager that informed me I was within my rights to strike as an individual rather then as part of a union.

I think I'm done with GMB, especially as I'm interested in being very active concerning the current Industrial action.


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I know of one rep. I'll talk to her.
> 
> Tbh contact from GMB went from them not leaving me alone to make sure I'd posted my ballot to nothing. Even when they announced the votes were under the threshold for Industrial action- it wasn't clear what that ment in terms of striking- it was my manager that informed me I was within my rights to strike as an individual rather then as part of a union.
> 
> I think I'm done with GMB, especially as I'm interested in being very active concerning the current Industrial action.


I've just sent a message to GMB saying I want to leave, why I do and asking  how I do this.


----------



## brogdale (Dec 20, 2022)

Peak 2022?


----------



## moochedit (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I've just sent a message to GMB saying I want to leave, why I do and asking  how I do this.


Depending on which method you use to pay your subs, i would either get your bank to stop the direct debit or ask your works hr/payroll to stop taking subs from your wages. Then join your preferred union.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I know of one rep. I'll talk to her.
> 
> Tbh contact from GMB went from them not leaving me alone to make sure I'd posted my ballot to nothing. Even when they announced the votes were under the threshold for Industrial action- it wasn't clear what that ment in terms of striking- it was my manager that informed me I was within my rights to strike as an individual rather then as part of a union.
> 
> I think I'm done with GMB, especially as I'm interested in being very active concerning the current Industrial action.


If you're in Bristol, I would definitely recommend getting in touch with the Health Workers United lot:








						About us / Contact us
					

We are a bunch of people who work in and around the health sector and are in the early stages of getting a network together. Our main aim is to understand and support the struggles in our sector. W…




					healthworkersunited.wordpress.com


----------



## Plumdaff (Dec 20, 2022)

I've changed union a few times. I have never been in the RCN despite being a nurse out of solidarity with my colleagues (back when I qualified HCAs couldn't join, and in MH I've always worked alongside allied health professionals, let alone admin colleagues etc). That's looking a bit outdated now . I've tended to join the most active union wherever I was - which means, annoyingly, I'm in Unite atm and still waiting for the result of our ballot.


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 20, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> If you're in Bristol, I would definitely recommend getting in touch with the Health Workers United lot:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Except I was not aware of their presence today. Where were they?


----------



## LDC (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> Except I was not aware of their presence today. Where were they?



There's only a few people in Bristol working at the BRI and Southmead, would have been at the pickets recently giving out the newsletter on that website. Probably not that visible tbh.

E2A: Like hitmouse said also, not a union, an off-shoot (spawn? love child?) of Angry Workers Home - Angry Workers


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 20, 2022)

LDC said:


> There's only a few people in Bristol working at the BRI and Southmead, would have been at the pickets recently giving out the newsletter on that website. Probably not that visible tbh.


Do you think Unite rather then the RCN then? Clearly RCN have the biggest presence but originally I purposely did not consider the RCN because I found them very conservative until now......

I was in the RCM for years when I was in Maternity/ Midwifery because in comparison they were quite radical and got a lot done and our rep was fucking legend!


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> I am considering changing Unions. I'm with GMB they did not get enough votes for Industrial action. However I feel they should of been there as an act of solidarity.   I can't see how they are representing my interests as an unregistered health care worker?
> 
> It's odd cus they have always been way more radical then the RCN who have always been notoriously Conservative.
> 
> ...


GMB has a bad reputation for sweetheart deals and such like but I'm sure they're not the only union to do such shenanigans. In the end, it comes down to the activity and member engagement of the local branch, its committee and reps. I'd say whichever union was most active and visible on pickets, then that's the one to join.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 20, 2022)

Yeah, Health Workers United are a small grassroots cross-union network not a union themselves. Sounds like RCN probably makes the most sense in union terms, was there much Unite presence where you were then?
Also, still deeply frustrating that Unison did manage to get a strike vote in at least some parts of the NHS... and are going out tomorrow instead of today. Picket lines listed here:








						Picket Lines — UNISON NHS pay
					






					www.nhspay.org
				



Although some of them will be at weird times.


----------



## Elpenor (Dec 20, 2022)

moochedit said:


> Depending on which method you use to pay your subs, i would either get your bank to stop the direct debit or ask your works hr/payroll to stop taking subs from your wages. Then join your preferred union.


If deducted via payroll, would most likely need to inform the union initially of your desire to leave and stop subs.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 20, 2022)

Elpenor said:


> If deducted via payroll, would most likely need to inform the union initially of your desire to leave and stop subs.


Nah, think you can definitely just tell payroll directly. Although I suppose it is a courtesy to tell the union as well if doing it that way.


----------



## kropotkin (Dec 20, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> Do you think Unite rather then the RCN then? Clearly RCN have the biggest presence but originally I purposely did not consider the RCN because I found them very conservative until now......
> 
> I was in the RCM for years when I was in Maternity/ Midwifery because in comparison they were quite radical and got a lot done and our rep was fucking legend!


The one I've met would be in unite


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 20, 2022)

kropotkin said:


> The one I've met would be in unite


Did they meet the vote threshold for Industrial action? 
Certainly was not aware of their presence today outside the gates.


----------



## moochedit (Dec 20, 2022)

Elpenor said:


> If deducted via payroll, would most likely need to inform the union initially of your desire to leave and stop subs.





hitmouse said:


> Nah, think you can definitely just tell payroll directly. Although I suppose it is a courtesy to tell the union as well if doing it that way.


Yeah i agree you should tell union as well (for either payment method).


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 21, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> Did they meet the vote threshold for Industrial action?
> Certainly was not aware of their presence today outside the gates.


Unite seem to have some complicated strategy of balloting bit-by-bit, so they now have a mandate in some ambulance services and will be striking alongside Unison tomorrow:








						Ambulance workers taking action
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



They've just finished balloting in Wales but not announced the result yet:








						NHS ballot | Wales
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org
				



And I think are currently running ballots in some other services in England, with more on the way, but not totally clear what that is?








						Nearly 10,000 more NHS workers balloted to join widespread strike action this winter
					

…




					www.unitetheunion.org


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Yeah, Health Workers United are a small grassroots cross-union network not a union themselves. Sounds like RCN probably makes the most sense in union terms, was there much Unite presence where you were then?
> Also, still deeply frustrating that Unison did manage to get a strike vote in at least some parts of the NHS... and are going out tomorrow instead of today. Picket lines listed here:
> 
> 
> ...


And weird places.....the one in Bristol is on an industrial estate.....


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> And weird places.....the one in Bristol is on an industrial estate.....



It's probably an ambulance 'station'. A few years ago they closed lots of stations and replaced them with portacabins in odd (cheap and usually grim) places with a few plastic chairs and a kettle in and grandly named them 'tactical replenishment points' or something.


----------



## MickiQ (Dec 21, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> Great to be out at the picket line. Met some Marxist fella who recognised me from radical bookfairs - quite a while ago now.
> View attachment 356450
> Played the Specials the whole time.


Looks like a decent turnout behind you, when Youngest Q came home from picketing with her sister, she told us there were getting on for a hundred people on theirs for much of the day. Lots of people stopped to speak and all were supportive including quite a few doctors on their way into the hospital.


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

Looks like Scotland joining the strikes as well now, just rejected the pay deal.


----------



## Karl Masks (Dec 21, 2022)

Seen two ambulances on call today. Tories lying that there aren't any working


----------



## Brainaddict (Dec 21, 2022)

So, Border Force strikes. I suppose they need to do it as much as anyone else, but would you actively support them in any way? I know I wouldn't.


----------



## teqniq (Dec 21, 2022)

Karl Masks said:


> Seen two ambulances on call today. Tories lying that there aren't any working


Indeed:


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

Karl Masks said:


> Seen two ambulances on call today. Tories lying that there aren't any working



I haven't seen anyone say that, it's always been the plan that they respond to Category 1 calls.


----------



## brogdale (Dec 21, 2022)

A purchasing power parity index is often useful to cut through the guff...


----------



## Karl Masks (Dec 21, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> Great to be out at the picket line. Met some Marxist fella who recognised me from radical bookfairs - quite a while ago now.
> View attachment 356450
> Played the Specials the whole time.


where is that?


----------



## Karl Masks (Dec 21, 2022)

LDC said:


> I haven't seen anyone say that, it's always been the plan that they respond to Category 1 calls.


Tories have spread the idea that we're all at risk because of greedy unions though. Have the Tories been presenting the situation accurately


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

Karl Masks said:


> Tories have spread the idea that we're all at risk because of greedy unions though. Have the Tories been presenting the situation accurately



No, but that wasn't what you said.


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 21, 2022)

Karl Masks said:


> Tories have spread the idea that we're all at risk because of greedy unions though. Have the Tories been presenting the situation accurately


Of course not, they have been gaslighting the public.


----------



## SpookyFrank (Dec 21, 2022)

kalidarkone said:


> And weird places.....the one in Bristol is on an industrial estate.....



There's rules about how many people can picket on hospital grounds. Think the limit is six.


----------



## Karl Masks (Dec 21, 2022)

SpookyFrank said:


> There's rules about how many people can picket on hospital grounds. Think the limit is six.


That's what the rCN reps were saying at the BRI last week, obviously concerned they might get into trouble. But lunchtime it was clearly more than that and the union marshalls were making sure there was a visible space betwixt picket and civilian.


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

SpookyFrank said:


> There's rules about how many people can picket on hospital grounds. Think the limit is six.



No, it's a vague recommendation not a rule or law iirc. And you can't be on the grounds anyway, you have to be outside them, so they're usually on the pavement just outside.


----------



## sim667 (Dec 21, 2022)

Karl Masks said:


> Seen two ambulances on call today. Tories lying that there aren't any working


I’m at work today, one of the three unions is striking and they’ve mitigated it so well we’re sitting around with nothing to do.

Some of the mitigations are questionable though, I for example am a band 3 but considered experienced so have been buddied with a member of the armed forces for non emergency transport and Cardiac arrests only. The only thing is anyone we go to who isn’t in cardiac arrest has theoretically been assessed by an HCP, but if I turn up and don’t assess them (because officially I’m not allowed), and they later die, I’ll then get asked why I didn’t assess them as I would day to day of working with an HCP.

I’m ex GMB, left because they pissed me off and am due to join unite, my station is all unite who aren’t striking, so they’ve rota’d shit loads of staff to make truck at my station to send to other areas where it’s predominantly striking GMB members. For example one of our main stations has a single ambulance on so a bunch of our crews have been sent there.

I’ve never been pro strike for ambulances, it’s far to east for our management to mitigate strikes, work to rule on the other hand would cause major issues.


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

AFAIK you know you can strike if there's a mandate in your Trust for _any _union, even if you're not a member of that union. I'm not RCN but I was striking yesterday.

And employers aren't allowed to get you to reveal your union membership status either...


----------



## RainbowTown (Dec 21, 2022)

LDC said:


> I haven't seen anyone say that, it's always been the plan that they respond to Category 1 calls.



I think some Trusts have also come to an agreement with the unions that ambulance crews will respond to some incidents that lie within the Category 2 bracket , depending on the circumstances and severity of the ailment. In this scenario, the 999 call will be taken by clinicians, and they will judge the right response to that patient's condition and, if necessary, request an ambulance to go out.


----------



## cesare (Dec 21, 2022)

SpookyFrank said:


> There's rules about how many people can picket on hospital grounds. Think the limit is six.


Shelter ignored that 6-limit anti-TU legislation and nothing happened


----------



## Sue (Dec 21, 2022)

R4's just doing the whole 'care workers aren't striking and they get paid less than nurses/ ambulance workers' thing.


----------



## cesare (Dec 21, 2022)

LDC said:


> No, it's a vague recommendation not a rule or law iirc. And you can't be on the grounds anyway, you have to be outside them, so they're usually on the pavement just outside.


It used to be, but it is now statute. But they can't enforce it so 🤷‍♂️


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

I've had to stop listening to R4 the last days, the coverage has been absolutely shit.


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 21, 2022)

The shipping forecast is good though.


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 21, 2022)

SpookyFrank said:


> There's rules about how many people can picket on hospital grounds. Think the limit is six.


That's why we do it outside the gates! But the  location I'm referencing was so middle of nowhere, no footfall going past etc...


LDC said:


> AFAIK you know you can strike if there's a mandate in your Trust for _any _union, even if you're not a member of that union. I'm not RCN but I was striking yesterday.
> 
> And employers aren't allowed to get you to reveal your union membership status either...


Yes same for me.


----------



## LDC (Dec 21, 2022)

Anyone seen anything more recent about these proposed laws to ban workers in the NHS striking the Tories have gone on about?


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Dec 21, 2022)

Brainaddict said:


> So, Border Force strikes. I suppose they need to do it as much as anyone else, but would you actively support them in any way? I know I wouldn't.



I support all workers who withdraw their labour in defence of their jobs and for better pay. It's a simple question of deciding which side you are on.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 21, 2022)

brogdale said:


> A purchasing power parity index is often useful to cut through the guff...



They've managed to choose one of the most inflation-resistant items possible for that comparison as well.


SpookyFrank said:


> There's rules about how many people can picket on hospital grounds. Think the limit is six.


As mentioned above, there's two different things going on here - picketing on any employer's property is usually banned so you have to stand outside, and there is the six-person limit which may now be legally enforceable but you can get around it. In my branch, policy is that you have six Official Pickets, identifiable by armbands, hi-viz or signs saying "Official Picket", and then if there happens to be another six, ten, twenty or hundred people standing near the pickets holding union flags or whatever, then they're just members of the public showing their support and solidarity for the picketers.


LDC said:


> AFAIK you know you can strike if there's a mandate in your Trust for _any _union, even if you're not a member of that union. I'm not RCN but I was striking yesterday.
> 
> And employers aren't allowed to get you to reveal your union membership status either...


Am curious as to how that works with the more sectional unions - Unite/Unison/GMB all cover much the same groups of workers, so it makes sense that anyone who could be a member of one would be covered by the mandate, but does that still work if you have a more exclusive union like RCN, or indeed ASLEF, NEU, etc? I'm genuinely not sure how it works when there's a strike mandate for a union that only covers one section of the workforce, or how that's defined.


Sue said:


> R4's just doing the whole 'care workers aren't striking and they get paid less than nurses/ ambulance workers' thing.


Oh aye, I'm sure they had loads of supportive coverage when care workers were striking at St Monica's and so on. In more positive media news, looked like the front page of yesterday's Metro seemed pretty pro-strike/anti-tory on this issue, which I wouldn't necessarily have expected.


----------



## Sue (Dec 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Oh aye, I'm sure they had loads of supportive coverage when care workers were striking at St Monica's and so on. In more positive media news, looked like the front page of yesterday's Metro seemed pretty pro-strike/anti-tory on this issue, which I wouldn't necessarily have expected.


Yes, it wasn't like they were encouraging care workers to unionise/ballot for strike action to improve their terms and conditions but 'if they can put up with shit, why can't these bloody nurses/ambulance workers do so too?'


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 21, 2022)

Sue said:


> Yes, it wasn't like they were encouraging care workers to unionise/ballot for strike action to improve their terms and conditions but 'if they can put up with shit, why can't these bloody nurses/ambulance workers do so too?'


Yep, was trying to gently call their bluff there. It is always one of the anti-union arguments that most does my head in, that, because it's so close to being a pro-union argument that's just been stood on its head - "how come these people who are taking collective action to improve their conditions have better conditions than the people who aren't doing that, eh?"


----------



## Sue (Dec 21, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Yep, was trying to gently call their bluff there. It is always one of the anti-union arguments that most does my head in, that, because it's so close to being a pro-union argument that's just been stood on its head - "how come these people who are taking collective action to improve their conditions have better conditions than the people who aren't doing that, eh?"


'If I haven't got nice things/reasonable pay/a decent pension, why should they?!'


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 21, 2022)

Oh, turns out the Notes From Below lot have published a whole load of articles on the UCU indefinite strike debate (on the pro side):








						How to Stop a University
					

by Zara Dinnen, James Eastwood // The Case for Indefinite Strike Action




					notesfrombelow.org
				











						How to build an indefinite strike
					

by The University Worker // Strategies for building the action




					notesfrombelow.org
				











						What the hell is going on?
					

by Socialist Alternative members in UCU // Next steps in the UCU Higher Education dispute




					notesfrombelow.org
				











						Indefinite strike - now!
					

by The University Worker // We can't back down now. We won't back down now!




					notesfrombelow.org


----------



## Duncan2 (Dec 21, 2022)

Given that there are many millions of non-unionised private sector workers whose wages like those of Care Sector workers are pretty much pegged to the minimum wage the Freddos example really does help to illustrate how wages have plummeted in the UK over the last two decades.


----------



## sim667 (Dec 22, 2022)

LDC said:


> AFAIK you know you can strike if there's a mandate in your Trust for _any _union, even if you're not a member of that union. I'm not RCN but I was striking yesterday.
> 
> And employers aren't allowed to get you to reveal your union membership status either...


You can but I’m also on a apprenticeship so don’t want to push my luck


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 22, 2022)

I'm hearing that the TUC is looking at having a coordinated day of action across all unions with mandates - so, the closest thing legally possible to a general strike - around the end of January or very start of Feb, anyone else hearing anything about this?


----------



## The39thStep (Dec 22, 2022)

LDC said:


> Anyone seen anything more recent about these proposed laws to ban workers in the NHS striking the Tories have gone on about?


Nope but for some reason they pointed out that similar bans and statutory minimum staffing levels exist in the EU .


----------



## belboid (Dec 22, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> I'm hearing that the TUC is looking at having a coordinated day of action across all unions with mandates - so, the closest thing legally possible to a general strike - around the end of January or very start of Feb, anyone else hearing anything about this?


This is roughly what I heard a few weeks back when PCS (mostly) won its ballots.  Gives enough time for a couple of reballots and people being too skint to do a one layer before Christmas.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 22, 2022)

Anyone know if the RMT will actually be picketing on xmas eve?


----------



## Ming (Dec 23, 2022)

Barbarians.


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 23, 2022)

Turns out RMT won't be picketing tomorrow, which is understandable really, but think CWU will be. 
Really good picket at my local delivery office this morning, one of the locals who came down to support brought down a firepit thing:

Which also served a multipurpose function for cooking veggie sausages and bread dough to make a kind of DIY veggie sausage roll:

Not something I was expecting when I got up this morning.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 23, 2022)

No picket for me today; laid up in bed with flu symptoms! Merry bloody Christmas!

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## cesare (Dec 23, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> No picket for me today; laid up in bed with flu symptoms! Merry bloody Christmas!
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


Oh no! GWS Louis.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 23, 2022)

Just tested positive for covid. There goes Christmas...absolute bollocks!

Have a good one everybody - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 23, 2022)

RCN back out on Jan 18th-19th:








						Strike action in January 2023 | Royal College of Nursing
					

Employers where strikes will take place in our second phase of action.




					www.rcn.org.uk


----------



## brogdale (Dec 23, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Just tested positive for covid. There goes Christmas...absolute bollocks!
> 
> Have a good one everybody - Louis MacNeice


Sorry to hear that Louis; be kind to yourself now and take the time to start feeling better.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 23, 2022)

Statement on the US rail worker's struggle by the Internationalist Worker's Group (US affiliate of the Internationalist Communist Tendency) :









						Statement on the US Rail Workers' Struggle
					

Rail workers are the most overt targets of the bosses' offensive in the class war. On November 28th, Biden issued a statement in which he called on Congress to “avert” a strike of 100,000 rail workers by “adopting” the Tentative Agreement that had been reached back in September between the...



					www.leftcom.org


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Dec 23, 2022)

> The threat of further strike action at Heathrow Airport has ended after workers employed as ground handlers by Menzies at the airport accepted an improved pay offer.



more at Threat of Heathrow strikes over as Menzies workers accept improved pay offer


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 23, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> Statement on the US rail worker's struggle by the Internationalist Worker's Group (US affiliate of the Internationalist Communist Tendency) :
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is all well and good but what does the ICC have to say about it?

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 23, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> This is all well and good but what does the ICC have to say about it?
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


I have no idea and I can't say that I care.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 23, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> I have no idea and I can't say that I care.


Really?

Why care enough about one irrelevant fragment of the communist left to repost its thoughts on US rail strikes while dismissing out of hand those of another, albeit slightly larger fragment of that same communist left?

Given that it's  hard to get a theoretical fag paper between the two - not withstanding their mutual loathing - surely the working class needs the insight provided by both cutting edge revolutionary internationalist?

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Serge Forward (Dec 23, 2022)

Bit unfair that Louis MacNeice. Similarities between those groups aside, while the ICC are generally unpleasant and a bit culty, the CWO are pretty friendly, outward facing and open to working with other groups outside of their milieu.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 23, 2022)

Having a go at either the ICT or the ICC wasn't the point I was making.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 24, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Really?
> 
> Why care enough about one irrelevant fragment of the communist left to repost its thoughts on US rail strikes while dismissing out of hand those of another, albeit slightly larger fragment of that same communist left?
> 
> ...


If you care about what the ICC have to say then post a link of theirs or something, personally I don't and I'm not going to share their stuff and thats my choice.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 24, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> I'm not going to share their stuff and thats my choice.


And after all that's what really matters.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 24, 2022)

Visited probably/hopefully my last picket line of the year this morning, people had been wondering whether all the media stuff about greedy posties holding Christmas hostage would translate into more actual hostility from the public but couldn't see any signs of it today - obviously the number of cars going past in general was very much reduced, but got beeps from a good proportion of those, one person actually slowed down to say something and I think people kind of braced for abuse but it was just a "thank you for all that you do". Oh, there was one "oy, where's my parcel?" but that felt like more of a friendly, affectionate piss-taking heckle than an actually angry one.


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 24, 2022)

Picket line report from the ACN









						Notes from the Picket Line
					

Leeds: CWU Picket Line, Leeds AnarCom members today (24/12/22) joined the CWU (Royal Mail) picket line at the Wellington Road Sorting Office in Leeds. We handed out our picket line stickers – which…




					anarcomuk.uk


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 28, 2022)

Strike Map makes the front page of the Mail:


----------



## kalidarkone (Dec 28, 2022)

I've got to say that the royal mail strikes, gave me the best excuse not to bother with sending cards or buying anything online. 😀


----------



## hitmouse (Dec 28, 2022)

Looks like a proper impressive turnout at the Arrow XL picket in Wigan this morning, considering it's a horrible December morning:


			https://www.wigantoday.net/news/people/workers-at-wigan-based-delivery-giant-enter-week-10-of-industrial-action-3967456


----------



## teqniq (Dec 29, 2022)

Another result here:


----------



## Rob Ray (Dec 29, 2022)

Meanwhile at the TUC, the damp dishcloth is replaced by a man who reckons his priority during a massive strike wave is to support Tory talking points:









						Labour can’t ‘turn on the taps from day one’ on spending, says new TUC leader
					

Paul Nowak says party can ‘set a very clear direction of travel’ for public services if it wins next election




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Miss-Shelf (Dec 29, 2022)

hitmouse said:


> Looks like a proper impressive turnout at the Arrow XL picket in Wigan this morning, considering it's a horrible December morning:
> 
> 
> https://www.wigantoday.net/news/people/workers-at-wigan-based-delivery-giant-enter-week-10-of-industrial-action-3967456


My friend's speaking in that video.   He used to joke that he could never get a strike and then last year he had Chep and now Arrow.   More than enough cold mornings on picket lines by now! 

Unite supports its strikers well on the whole


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 29, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> And after all that's what really matters.
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


What matters is the content of the article I posted. Obvious but completely missed by you (who would rather behave like a sectarian dick instead).


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Dec 29, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Given that it's  hard to get a theoretical fag paper between the two - not withstanding their mutual loathing -


You clearly haven't got a clue


----------



## redsquirrel (Dec 29, 2022)

Rob Ray said:


> Meanwhile at the TUC, the damp dishcloth is replaced by a man who reckons his priority during a massive strike wave is to support Tory talking points:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah. Never impressed by O'Grady but Nowak makes her look good


----------



## petee (Dec 29, 2022)

Louis MacNeice said:


> And after all that's what really matters.
> 
> Cheers  - Louis MacNeice



btw, they don't seem to have made a standalone statement yet, but if they do i'll be sure to put it up and tag you on it.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 30, 2022)

AmateurAgitator said:


> What matters is the content of the article I posted. Obvious but completely missed by you (who would rather behave like a sectarian dick instead).


'Sectarian dick' is a little  rich coming from someone 'bigging up' the ICT while dissing the ICC. 

Good luck with the whole not doing self awareness shtick.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Dec 30, 2022)

petee said:


> btw, they don't seem to have made a standalone statement yet, but if they do i'll be sure to put it up and tag you on it.


Many thanks, the anticipation is the killer.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## teqniq (Jan 2, 2023)

Please sign and share:









						Defend the Right to Strike - Enough is Enough
					

defend the #righttostrike The right to strike is under threat. New legislation proposed by the Tory government intends to override a workers’ right to withdraw their labour, forcing them to work against their will. The right to strike is a fundamental democratic right. It underpins our ability...




					wesayenough.co.uk


----------



## nightowl (Jan 3, 2023)

Given the amount of strikes going on and pissed off workers in so many sectors, why do you think the idea of a general strike hasn't been discussed at a high level in the trade union movement (unless it has and I've missed it)? Are union bosses ultimately just happy with getting a few more crumbs from the table and have no desire to change the overall system radically?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 3, 2023)

nightowl said:


> Given the amount of strikes going on and pissed off workers in so many sectors, why do you think the idea of a general strike hasn't been discussed at a high level in the trade union movement (unless it has and I've missed it)? Are union bosses ultimately just happy with getting a few more crumbs from the table and have no desire to change the overall system radically?


From earlier in the thread:



hitmouse said:


> I'm hearing that the TUC is looking at having a coordinated day of action across all unions with mandates - so, the closest thing legally possible to a general strike - around the end of January or very start of Feb, anyone else hearing anything about this?





belboid said:


> This is roughly what I heard a few weeks back when PCS (mostly) won its ballots.  Gives enough time for a couple of reballots and people being too skint to do a one layer before Christmas.


----------



## moochedit (Jan 3, 2023)

nightowl said:


> Given the amount of strikes going on and pissed off workers in so many sectors, why do you think the idea of a general strike hasn't been discussed at a high level in the trade union movement (unless it has and I've missed it)? Are union bosses ultimately just happy with getting a few more crumbs from the table and have no desire to change the overall system radically?


I think uk trade union laws don't make that easy.


----------



## Serge Forward (Jan 3, 2023)

General strikes are against the law so it's unlikely the TUC would ever call one. It'd have to be some sort of wildcat general strike.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jan 3, 2023)

Serge Forward said:


> General strikes are against the law so it's unlikely the TUC would ever call one. It'd have to be some sort of wildcat general strike.


I think it’s more co-ordinated between different unions with existing mandates which is about as close as can be legally done.


----------



## belboid (Jan 3, 2023)

Yeah, a 'generalised' strike will (probably) be called later this month, involving all the unions with current mandates.  It'll probably only be for a day, but thats a start.  Or could be.


----------



## Chilli.s (Jan 3, 2023)

Well clapping on the doorstep hasnt saved the NHS, so a general strike seems like a logical step up.  

I would


----------



## teqniq (Jan 4, 2023)

Though the article is currently 'free to read' on The Times website I archived it because it probably won't always be and because well, Murdoch:

Rishi Sunak’s strike law to let bosses sack workers and sue unions


----------



## flypanam (Jan 5, 2023)

teqniq said:


> Though the article is currently 'free to read' on The Times website I archived it because it probably won't always be and because well, Murdoch:
> 
> Rishi Sunak’s strike law to let bosses sack workers and sue unions


Got to say it shows that the tories have no notion of what work is. Some employers may sack strikers most won’t. The work workers do is pretty skilled from the cleaner to the nurse to the lecturer. None can be replaced easily, as training and knowledge take time to build and to just do away with that will hamper the bosses in the long run.

The bankruptcy of ideas in the Tory party is astounding. Which seems to be mirrored by the lack of ideas in the TUC. Appealing to HR legislation fuck sake, the cracker has more guile.


----------



## TopCat (Jan 5, 2023)

"Anti-strike legislation is expected to be brought forward later this week, as Rishi Sunak’s government scrambles to get a grip of the ongoing industrial disputes.

The prime minister will announce legislation to enforce “minimum service levels” in six sectors, including the health service, rail, education, fire and border security. Ministers are also understood to be considering introducing laws allowing bosses to sue unions and sack employees if the minimum levels are not met.


Union members who are told to work under the minimum service requirement but refuse to do so could lose their jobs, as first reported by the Times. There are also likely to be tougher thresholds introduced for industrial action to take place."








						Anti-strike law could be brought forward as government tries to end disputes
					

‘Minimum service level’ legislation covering sectors including health expected to be announced this week




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Lorca (Jan 6, 2023)

This wrestler has a message for sunak (apparently he also once led the crowd in a chant of 'fuck the Tories! '


----------



## RainbowTown (Jan 6, 2023)

TopCat said:


> "Anti-strike legislation is expected to be brought forward later this week, as Rishi Sunak’s government scrambles to get a grip of the ongoing industrial disputes.
> 
> The prime minister will announce legislation to enforce “minimum service levels” in six sectors, including the health service, rail, education, fire and border security. Ministers are also understood to be considering introducing laws allowing bosses to sue unions and sack employees if the minimum levels are not met.
> 
> ...



Make no mistake, this is nothing more than a pernicious, repressive assault on an individual's absolute right to strike and withdraw their labour if they feel that their cause is just and right. Of course, it's wholly wrong and absolutely immoral -  and probably unworkable too.  Malevolent legislation designed solely to criminalize and victimize the ordinary working person. And just another example of how dirty and low this government will stoop.


----------



## Storm Fox (Jan 6, 2023)

Isn't this legislation likely to lead to more wildcat strikes? People will feel that they have nothing to lose and only something to gain.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Jan 6, 2023)

Lorca said:


> This wrestler has a message for sunak (apparently he also once led the crowd in a chant of 'fuck the Tories! '



Zack Sabre Jnr  This is some of his merch, a quote from one of his most famous promos 







<edit: here we go>


----------



## The39thStep (Jan 6, 2023)




----------



## ska invita (Jan 6, 2023)

three rewinds .... could be a long day on the picket line


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Jan 6, 2023)

Have the Tories piped down on striking workers not being able to do overtime?
I imagine they have because they've cut staffing levels to such an extent that the railway won't function without overtime.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Saturday at 11:34 AM)

Interesting that Royal Mail has been left out of the essential services list. Is this a precursor for attacking the universal service obligation?

Cheers - Louis Mac Neice

p.s. I would have like to have seen Evri deliver and return all those covid test kits!


----------



## teqniq (Saturday at 11:37 AM)

I suspect that banner at the back will piss Starmer off:


----------



## The39thStep (Saturday at 12:52 PM)

“Send the scabs a packing ,RMT “ 👍👍👍


----------



## agricola (Saturday at 4:46 PM)

RainbowTown said:


> Make no mistake, this is nothing more than a pernicious, repressive assault on an individual's absolute right to strike and withdraw their labour if they feel that their cause is just and right. Of course, it's wholly wrong and absolutely immoral -  and probably unworkable too.  Malevolent legislation designed solely to criminalize and victimize the ordinary working person. And just another example of how dirty and low this government will stoop.



It does make me laugh though, at the blatant hypocrisy of it.  Here are bellend ministers going on and on about outdated ways of working, "Spanish practices" and all that crap when their inspiration for all this is the Police Act of 1919.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Saturday at 4:56 PM)

agricola said:


> It does make me laugh though, at the blatant hypocrisy of it.  Here are bellend ministers going on and on about outdated ways of working, "Spanish practices" and all that crap when their inspiration for all this is the Police Act of 1919.


Even more ironic when you think of the practices of both houses of Parliament; outdated and not fit for purpose doesn't come close.

Cheers  - Louis MacNeice


----------



## SpookyFrank (Sunday at 10:12 PM)

RainbowTown said:


> Make no mistake, this is nothing more than a pernicious, repressive assault on an individual's absolute right to strike and withdraw their labour if they feel that their cause is just and right. Of course, it's wholly wrong and absolutely immoral -  and probably unworkable too.  Malevolent legislation designed solely to criminalize and victimize the ordinary working person. And just another example of how dirty and low this government will stoop.



Unworkable is right. With staffing levels as they are nobody is going to fire a teacher or a nurse for anything short of gross misconduct. They're definitely not going to fire half the workforce for striking, because replacing them would be impossible. The tories don't understand that because none of them have ever had real jobs.


----------



## Louis MacNeice (Sunday at 10:17 PM)

SpookyFrank said:


> The tories don't understand that because none of them have ever had real jobs.


Many of them also don't use state schools or the NHS (except in an emergency).

Cheers - Louis MacNeice


----------



## ruffneck23 (Monday at 1:11 PM)




----------



## MickiQ (Monday at 1:30 PM)

TBF the current shower probably have a great deal of difficulty grasping that negotiations are kind of a two way thing


----------



## magneze (Monday at 1:39 PM)

Apparently the one off payment was linked to 'productivity increases' which didn't go down well.

This from Onay Kasab of Unite, my *emphasis*:


> Unfortunately, the government have missed yet another opportunity to put this right. We came here in good faith. What they want to talk about is productivity.
> 
> *Our members are working 18-hour shifts. How you become more productive with that I do not know.*
> 
> Today, unfortunately, despite us showing up in good faith, the government have missed yet another opportunity to put this right and what will happen is that a strike action taking place by Unite members, our ambulance workers … [will be taking place on 23 January].


----------



## LDC (Monday at 2:11 PM)

MickiQ said:


> TBF the current shower probably have a great deal of difficulty grasping that negotiations are kind of a two way thing



Goverment and unions clear today wasn't an official negotiation, but a chance for the government to make their position 'clear' or something.

Sounds like they did tbf...


----------



## kalidarkone (Tuesday at 8:00 AM)

I've just left GMB and joined the RCN.
I was very disappointed at the lack of presence of the GMB at the last nurses strike. I wrote to them saying this and that I felt my needs as a senior Health Care Assistant would be better me by the RCN at this time.
They did reply and argue my point, however afaic the RCN have stepped up brilliantly and I want to support them.

So now to get clarity regarding proposed strikes later this month.


----------



## kalidarkone (Tuesday at 8:28 AM)

So my trust is not included in the hospital trusts striking in the South West on 18th and 19th of Jan.

I've looked at the RCN website in order to try to understand why only some trusts are striking rather then all of them? If anyone knows the answer please enlighten me. 
Cheers x


----------



## ska invita (Tuesday at 9:04 AM)

ruffneck23 said:


>





also like this one


----------



## andysays (Tuesday at 11:15 AM)

kalidarkone said:


> So my trust is not included in the hospital trusts striking in the South West on 18th and 19th of Jan.
> 
> I've looked at the RCN website in order to try to understand why only some trusts are striking rather then all of them? If anyone knows the answer please enlighten me.
> Cheers x


I don't know about the specifics of this dispute, but it might be because of the way the votes have been counted, where in some trusts a majority have voted to strike, but in others they haven't.


----------



## MickiQ (Tuesday at 11:26 AM)

kalidarkone said:


> So my trust is not included in the hospital trusts striking in the South West on 18th and 19th of Jan.
> 
> I've looked at the RCN website in order to try to understand why only some trusts are striking rather then all of them? If anyone knows the answer please enlighten me.
> Cheers x


Is it because each trust is 'technically' a separate employer rather than just you all working for the NHS? (even if you do in reality)


----------



## kalidarkone (Tuesday at 11:54 AM)

andysays said:


> I don't know about the specifics of this dispute, but it might be because of the way the votes have been counted, where in some trusts a majority have voted to strike, but in others they haven't.


Our trust definitely had over the required 40% and striked in December.


----------



## hitmouse (Tuesday at 5:40 PM)

I was going to say that it's a bit annoying how, even where they have mandates, Unite won't be striking alongside Unison and GMB in the ambulance service tomorrow, but then I saw something far more annoying, which is that the national Unison website seems to be running a story aiming to stop people from turning up to show support for their pickets:








						Five ways to support our NHS strikers | Article, News | News | UNISON National
					

Want to support our ambulance workers? Below are five ways you can show your solidarity with UNISON members on picket lines this Wednesday




					www.unison.org.uk
				





> But before getting into how you can show your support, it’s important to note that there are strict legal provisions and a statutory code of practice around who can picket and how pickets are run.
> 
> It’s important to make sure legal requirements and patient safety are maintained, and UNISON regional offices will be working with striking branches to manage invitations and arrangements for visitors to their pickets.
> 
> So please don’t go to picket lines unless invited by striking branches.


Meanwhile the regional social media pages seem to be promoting and encouraging people to visit picket lines as usual:

So fuck knows what's going on there.


----------



## LDC (Tuesday at 6:35 PM)

kalidarkone I think it was a 'strategic' decision by the RCN to split the Trusts that got mandates into two groups and one group strike in December and then one in January. I'm a bit mystified why they did this tbh, but anyway, that's why your Trust (and mine) was on strike December but isn't now.


----------



## kalidarkone (Tuesday at 6:38 PM)

LDC said:


> kalidarkone I think it was a 'strategic' decision by the RCN to split the Trusts that got mandates into two groups and one group strike in December and then one in January. I'm a bit mystified why they did this tbh, but anyway, that why your Trust (and mine) was on strike December but isn't now.


I just had a chat with my manager and apparently it was in order to disperse the disruption...


----------



## LDC (Tuesday at 6:51 PM)

kalidarkone said:


> I just had a chat with my manager and apparently it was in order to disperse the disruption...


----------



## Edie (Tuesday at 8:11 PM)

Got this

About this


Still don’t know what to vote. This is like Brexit all over again 😩

PS they’re not fuckin shy about telling you which way to vote eh  Whatever happened to impartiality?!


----------



## hitmouse (Tuesday at 9:12 PM)

TUC have named a date for the sort-of-a-bit-like-but-not-really a general strike, now it's up to the various unions that have mandates to arrange action for that day:








						TUC to hold national ‘protect the right to strike’ day on February 1
					

Union body says it will fight new anti-strike legislation “every step of the way”




					www.tuc.org.uk


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Tuesday at 9:14 PM)

hitmouse said:


> I was going to say that it's a bit annoying how, even where they have mandates, Unite won't be striking alongside Unison and GMB in the ambulance service tomorrow...


They didn't even get a mandate for their latest tube ballot. But that branch of Unite runs back through Amicus to the EETPU who scabbed at Wapping so what do you expect?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Tuesday at 9:15 PM)

hitmouse said:


> TUC have named a date for the sort-of-a-bit-like-but-not-really a general strike, now it's up to the various unions that have mandates to arrange action for that day:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Fairly certain the RMT will coalesce.


----------



## kropotkin (Tuesday at 9:39 PM)

Edie said:


> Got this
> View attachment 359028
> About this
> View attachment 359026View attachment 359027
> ...


It's hard to imagine there will be a huge mandate for a strike with 72hrs with no emergency provision....

(I thought you were an ANP, didn't realise you were a doctor)


----------



## Edie (Tuesday at 10:23 PM)

kropotkin said:


> It's hard to imagine there will be a huge mandate for a strike with 72hrs with no emergency provision....
> 
> (I thought you were an ANP, didn't realise you were a doctor)


I thought there was always emergency provision??


----------



## hitmouse (Tuesday at 10:27 PM)

Not sure where the 72 hours thing comes from either, isn't it the case that you have to get the mandate first and then decide what the action looks like once you've got it?


----------



## Lord Camomile (Wednesday at 12:20 AM)

Edie said:


> Got this
> View attachment 359028
> About this
> View attachment 359026View attachment 359027
> ...


Why would they be impartial? It's not like our employers are


----------



## Edie (Wednesday at 6:49 AM)

Lord Camomile said:


> Why would they be impartial? It's not like our employers are


Cos there’s a wide range of views in the membership?


----------



## kropotkin (Wednesday at 8:46 AM)

Edie said:


> I thought there was always emergency provision??



When we went on strike on last time we did single day withdrawal of labour to emergency provision levels (i.e. same staffing cover as weekend/bank holiday/nights). 

This time:



> Subject to a successful ballot, junior doctors in England will begin their action in March with a 72 hour full walk out. Junior doctors will not provide emergency care during the strike











						Junior doctors in England to walk out for 72 hours in March if ballot for industrial action is successful, says BMA  - BMA media centre - BMA
					

Press release by the BMA




					www.bma.org.uk


----------



## Lord Camomile (Wednesday at 9:05 AM)

Edie said:


> Cos there’s a wide range of views in the membership?


Aye, sorry, I realised that might be where you were coming from after I posted.

That said, honestly still not sure impartiality is called for in this situation. Part of the role of a union/worker org is to campaign and make recommendations.

Of course, I wouldn't (and don't! ) like it if I felt my union was advocating for what I thought was the wrong course of action, but I'm still not sure I'd suggest they should be impartial about it.

It's not totally cut 'n' dry, though. Hmm...


----------



## Edie (Wednesday at 9:53 AM)

kropotkin said:


> When we went on strike on last time we did single day withdrawal of labour to emergency provision levels (i.e. same staffing cover as weekend/bank holiday/nights).
> 
> This time:
> 
> ...


Hmm, yes I assumed it was the same as 2015/16 (ie this time 72-hours but emergency care). I went out the first two occasions, not the third (which included emergency care). Ok, well it’s a clear no from me. Thanks.


----------



## andysays (Wednesday at 2:12 PM)

Edie said:


> Cos there’s a wide range of views in the membership?


It's not unusual for a union to recommend to their members that they vote in favour of taking strike action.

It's still up to you to make your own decision.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Wednesday at 4:33 PM)

hitmouse said:


> TUC have named a date for the sort-of-a-bit-like-but-not-really a general strike, now it's up to the various unions that have mandates to arrange action for that day:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Unless UNISON waived their '3 weeks notice before action' deadline (obviously 1 week extra to the legal requirement), we'd have had to take a vote and inform them today.

Which, we haven't...


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Wednesday at 5:14 PM)

hitmouse said:


> TUC have named a date for the sort-of-a-bit-like-but-not-really a general strike, now it's up to the various unions that have mandates to arrange action for that day:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Don't think this is the 'general strike that isn't a general strike' day. It looks more like a day of 'protests' about the new anti-strike laws. Not sure the day of generalised strike action will be announced by the TUC either.


----------



## hitmouse (Wednesday at 5:40 PM)

kropotkin said:


> When we went on strike on last time we did single day withdrawal of labour to emergency provision levels (i.e. same staffing cover as weekend/bank holiday/nights).
> 
> This time:
> 
> ...


Huh. I've never seen that thing of announcing the plan of action before the vote's been had before. I suppose there's no official rule against it, but it does seem a bit like counting one's chickens?


Lord Camomile said:


> Unless UNISON waived their '3 weeks notice before action' deadline (obviously 1 week extra to the legal requirement), we'd have had to take a vote and inform them today.
> 
> Which, we haven't...


I should hopefully know more about what's going on by this time tomorrow, I think with time-sensitive stuff that happens between big meetings there is some leeway for the secretary/chair to make decisions and then have them ratified by the branch later? But not entirely clear on how all this works, and I think with a lot of other disputes decisions about action are being taken at a higher level of the union anyway. Also, fwiw, have just checked our last minutes, I think we're due to have the new offer from UCEA out on Monday with any decision about further action being taken on the basis of that, which takes us even further along. Oh, and sounds like the reballot at most of the branches getting reballoted closed today.


Smokeandsteam said:


> Don't think this is the 'general strike that isn't a general strike' day. It looks more like a day of 'protests' about the new anti-strike laws. Not sure the day of generalised strike action will be announced by the TUC either.


Maybe, I could be getting the end of the stick but that timing fits with what I'd been hearing. Email I got from the local trades council just said "It would be great if action from as many unions and disputes as possible could be coordinated for that day", which I interpreted as meaning "there is a plan to do this" but might just be more like "it would be nice if...". Anyway, I am going to be so fucking unimpressed if it turns out that there's a sort-of-kind-of general strike, and I'm in a branch with a live mandate but we still can't join in due to the TUC not giving enough notice/UNISON requiring a stupid amount of notice.


----------



## belboid (Wednesday at 5:58 PM)

PCS all out for a day (Feb 1).  Which is a start.









						100,000 UK civil servants to strike on 1 February
					

Public and Commercial Services union announces one-day strike over jobs, pay and conditions




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Smokeandsteam (Wednesday at 6:07 PM)

hitmouse said:


> Maybe, I could be getting the end of the stick but that timing fits with what I'd been hearing. Email I got from the local trades council just said "It would be great if action from as many unions and disputes as possible could be coordinated for that day", which I interpreted as meaning "there is a plan to do this" but might just be more like "it would be nice if...". Anyway, I am going to be so fucking unimpressed if it turns out that there's a sort-of-kind-of general strike, and I'm in a branch with a live mandate but we still can't join in due to the TUC not giving enough notice/UNISON requiring a stupid amount of notice.



Yeah, it might be me who has got the wrong end of the stick actually, as I’ve just seen that PCSU and the teachers (if they meet the ballot threshold) are out on 1st Feb. As you say, let hope this is being joined up and all unions involved are ready with their notices


----------



## hitmouse (Wednesday at 6:18 PM)

belboid said:


> PCS all out for a day (Feb 1).  Which is a start.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That Guardian article links to this one, which says a little bit more:








						Public sector strikes row escalates as unions plan coordinated ‘day of action’
					

Unions react furiously to proposed legislation for Wales, England and Scotland they say will allow ministers to ban strikes




					www.theguardian.com
				





> The government’s standoff with public sector workers has escalated with plans for a coordinated “day of action” by unions, who have reacted furiously to proposed legislation they say could let ministers in effect ban strikes in some areas.
> 
> The day of action – discussed by unions representing staff in the NHS, railways, education and civil service at the Trades Union Congress (TUC) headquarters in London – *could* include some synchronised strike action, as well as rallies.
> 
> ...


So, clear as mud as to what the plan is. The article does go on to state that RCN definitely won't be part of any coordinated action, but then considering that the RCN has so far been unwilling to coordinate their own action with themselves that's hardly a massive surprise.


----------



## LDC (Wednesday at 6:37 PM)

Edie it's not for the BMA or any body similar (like unions) to represent the views of their members impartially (which would be impossible anyway really) it's there to represent the best interests of the members. And the BMA thinks this is best served by striking, so is recommending that.

The accountability to membership is either you don't like the BMA and leave, or you don't agree with their position and don't strike either way.

Sorry if that's all obvious, just was answerin what thought was your queries over it.

Are you saying you won't vote to strike btw?

And for some light evening reading, NHS strike reports Thoughts after the first round of NHS strikes - Angry Workers

And also some health strikes in the US recently for, errr.. comparison maybe? As Nurses Strike, Hospital CEOs Pocket Millions


----------



## Edie (Wednesday at 7:53 PM)

LDC said:


> Edie it's not for the BMA or any body similar (like unions) to represent the views of their members impartially (which would be impossible anyway really) it's there to represent the best interests of the members. And the BMA thinks this is best served by striking, so is recommending that.
> 
> The accountability to membership is either you don't like the BMA and leave, or you don't agree with their position and don't strike either way.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that, I hadn’t really understood. 

Yes, I’ll vote for no strike. I do support pay restoration, I think doctors are underpaid for what we do. But I think the optics are terrible in the midst of a cost of living crisis when some people can’t afford to eat or heat, and when the nurses and paramedics are out, and they deserve pay rises more.

Most importantly I don’t think it’s safe. I don’t think the NHS can absorb the hit. I don’t think it will change anything.

The NHS is fucked. In 2015 I went out naively believing it could be saved. I’m no longer that person:


Makes me sad but there it is.


----------



## hitmouse (Wednesday at 9:35 PM)

Ian Allinson article on Feb 1st:








						Make 1 February a day of rebellion
					

Can you strike? Can you protest? Start planning now.




					www.rs21.org.uk


----------



## AmateurAgitator (Wednesday at 10:29 PM)

AnarCom Network article on the situation with the strike wave









						New Year – Old Tricks
					

In the red heat of the greatest strike wave in 50 years, the Trade Union bosses walk once again into a trap choreographed by the state and its capitalist masters.  We warned about this in Nove…




					anarcomuk.uk
				




ACG article on the nurses strike









						Support the Nurses - Anarchist Communist Group
					

If you think the nurses’ strike is just about wages, think again.    Yes, nurses are 20% worse off in real terms  than they were ten years ago and nurses are demanding a 17.6% pay rise which barely keeps up with inflation.    Tory ministers are saying that nursing should be a vocation and so pay...




					www.anarchistcommunism.org


----------



## hitmouse (Yesterday at 5:23 PM)

Still not really any closer to knowing for sure if I'll be out on strike on the 1st or not. Does anyone have any idea what UCU are doing?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Yesterday at 5:31 PM)

hitmouse said:


> Still not really any closer to knowing for sure if I'll be out on strike on the 1st or not. Does anyone have any idea what UCU are doing?


Given the unions have to give a fortnight notice for action I guess that’ll be answered by the 18th next week. Unfortunately the unions also have to inform the companies before the membership so more likely to find out from the news first rather than any inside track.


----------



## Bingoman (Yesterday at 7:18 PM)

More  70,000 College and university staff to stage strikes in February and march









						Thousands of university staff to strike for 18 days between February and March
					

All of the UK's universities will be 'shut down' by almost three weeks of teacher strikes in February and March, the University and College Union announced




					news.sky.com


----------



## hitmouse (Yesterday at 7:34 PM)

NICE staff striking next week, apparently there'll be a rally although I'm not entirely clear on what time of day it is? (Comment on their fb suggests it'll be starting at 12.)


----------



## hitmouse (Today at 6:30 PM)

Still not clear on whether anyone beyond PCS is striking on the 1st, UCU still don't seem to be clear about exactly what they're doing although tbf I understand it must be difficult for them since they first have to make a decision, and then try to get their gen sec to promise that she won't just go on twitter and say it's a shit decision as soon as they announce it. It seems very unlikely that Unison HE branches will be striking then, it seems that they're more likely to be out the week after instead - hopefully as coordinated action with UCU, but see above.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Today at 6:34 PM)

hitmouse said:


> Still not clear on whether anyone beyond PCS is striking on the 1st, UCU still don't seem to be clear about exactly what they're doing although tbf I understand it must be difficult for them since they first have to make a decision, and then try to get their gen sec to promise that she won't just go on twitter and say it's a shit decision as soon as they announce it. It seems very unlikely that Unison HE branches will be striking then, it seems that they're more likely to be out the week after instead - hopefully as coordinated action with UCU, but see above.


Did you even read my last post?


----------



## LDC (Today at 6:37 PM)

Overview on the recent strikes here On the current strike wave in the UK - Angry Workers


----------



## Mattym (Today at 6:38 PM)

Really annoyed that my teaching union won't be going on strike- yes, I could jump ship, but this union is by far the best in our school.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Today at 6:39 PM)

LDC said:


> Overview on the recent strikes here On the current strike wave in the UK - Angry Workers


I take it you're involved in said group?


----------



## LDC (Today at 6:40 PM)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I take it you're involved in said group?



Mildly aggrieved lazy worker, but yeah.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Today at 6:45 PM)

LDC said:


> Mildly aggrieved lazy worker, but yeah.


I'll check it out. Were you also Plan C as I seem to recall you promoting them a bit iirc.


----------



## LDC (Today at 6:48 PM)

Magnus McGinty said:


> I'll check it out. Were you also Plan C as I seem to recall you promoting them a bit iirc.



No, never been Plan C.


----------



## hitmouse (Today at 7:13 PM)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Did you even read my last post?


Yep, but it also varies from union to union - Unison, at least in HE, are leaving it for local branches to decide what action they're taking, so as someone who's on my local strike committee I'm actually involved in the discussions about when we should be going out. Which makes it a bit annoying not having the relevant info! How's things going RMT-wise, is the main rail mandate still live or are you having to reballot?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Today at 7:26 PM)

hitmouse said:


> Yep, but it also varies from union to union - Unison, at least in HE, are leaving it for local branches to decide what action they're taking, so as someone who's on my local strike committee I'm actually involved in the discussions about when we should be going out. Which makes it a bit annoying not having the relevant info! How's things going RMT-wise, is the main rail mandate still live or are you having to reballot?


All I know is that the RMT are DEFINITELY wanting to be involved in any co-ordinated strikes but they also want to know what the company has to say about the pensions on 31st Jan. That wouldn't stop them announcing a strike for 1st Feb but as I say it's a legal requirement for unions to inform the company of any strikes first so you'll hear about it on the news first. Members grumble about this but it's the law.


----------



## redsquirrel (Today at 7:31 PM)

hitmouse said:


> Still not clear on whether anyone beyond PCS is striking on the 1st, UCU still don't seem to be clear about exactly what they're doing although tbf I understand it must be difficult for them since they first have to make a decision, and then try to get their gen sec to promise that she won't just go on twitter and say it's a shit decision as soon as they announce it. It seems very unlikely that Unison HE branches will be striking then, it seems that they're more likely to be out the week after instead - hopefully as coordinated action with UCU, but see above.


UCU doing 18 days in Feb and March (dates not yet finalised). No assessment and marking boycott before April


----------



## brogdale (Today at 7:39 PM)

Mattym said:


> Really annoyed that my teaching union won't be going on strike- yes, I could jump ship, but this union is by far the best in our school.


That's such a tough dilemma; IME usually best to stick with the best/biggest in your workplace...but wtf was NAS up to, not getting the required turnou?


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Today at 7:41 PM)

redsquirrel said:


> UCU doing 18 days in Feb and March (dates not yet finalised). No assessment and marking boycott before April


Involving different branches spread out or a full all out 18 days?


----------



## redsquirrel (41 minutes ago)

Magnus McGinty said:


> Involving different branches spread out or a full all out 18 days?


The 18 days will be spread out - probably roughly 3 days a week for 6 weeks.
Not sure if different institutions will be doing different days - I'm going to guess not, but it is just a guess


----------



## Magnus McGinty (22 minutes ago)

redsquirrel said:


> The 18 days will be spread out - probably roughly 3 days a week for 6 weeks.
> Not sure if different institutions will be doing different days - I'm going to guess not, but it is just a guess


I mean will everyone be doing the 18 days or will say x department be doing 4 days then y department doing 4 days etc etc. 
If not, blimey and solidarity, that's harsh but probably the best way to get a result.


----------

