# Apple remove all US civil war games from the app store



## mrs quoad (Jun 25, 2015)

Because they contain the confederate flag. 

http://toucharcade.com/2015/06/25/apple-removes-confederate-flag/

Meantimes, you can fulfil all your Wehrmacht based hankerings with a dose of Panzer Corps any time you fancy: https://appsto.re/gb/qzM6R.i


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## DotCommunist (Jun 25, 2015)

this will be because america is yet again having the debate 'Is the confederate flag a symbol of racist oppression that we should be ashamed to fly' and maybe, just maybe, going to get to the answer 'yes' this time round.

After the shooting at church recently, its become quite an issue once more.

its daft pulling the games because they are of historic context but then Wolfenstein is banned in germany (or was) because of all the nazi regalia on display. Despite the fact that the game consist of shooting nazis then battling hitler in a robot suit


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## Pickman's model (Jun 25, 2015)

surprised uk flag deemed acceptable


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## J Ed (Jun 25, 2015)

Pickman's model said:


> surprised uk flag deemed acceptable



Certainly a white supremacist flag which many more have been killed under than the Confederacy


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## 8den (Jun 25, 2015)

I was reading a article of click bait about the Dukes of Hazzard saying the were removing the flag from the General Lee, and I thought "wait you're going to go through every old episode of the Dukes and digitally remove it from the car? Nope. they're removing it from all _future _Dukes of Hazzard memorabilia. Who buys Dukes of Hazzard memorabilia in 2015?


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## J Ed (Jun 25, 2015)

What I find so weird about the whole thing is why now? The massacre in Charleston was despicable but surely anyone flying that flag was previously aware that far worse things have been done by people acting on behalf of the slavers' state and its legacy? 

I welcome the retirement obviously, but why your racist principles go so easily?


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## J Ed (Jun 25, 2015)




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## CNT36 (Jun 26, 2015)

Anyone else remember the game North and South? I think I still have it and my Nes somewhere.


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## Mungy (Jun 26, 2015)

all flags are fucking stupid ideas that keep us anchored to the dead weight of borders and fucking stupid ideologies that will keep us getting dragged back into rehashes of completely futile wars over something that belongs to no-one or belongs to all. fuck flags and their fucking shite.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 26, 2015)

J Ed said:


> What I find so weird about the whole thing is why now? The massacre in Charleston was despicable but surely anyone flying that flag was previously aware that far worse things have been done by people acting on behalf of the slavers' state and its legacy?
> 
> I welcome the retirement obviously, but why your racist principles go so easily?



This is total speculation so might be bollocks, but maybe it's that terrorism is a thing that Americans are far more aware of and see as a domestic threat in a way they haven't been in the past, so something like this is a bit harder to shrug off?


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## butchersapron (Jun 26, 2015)

One side flew the flag in the civil war right? So removing it from games that that side play a central role in? Fucking ridiculous. What next, banning talk of slavery in history books about slavery?


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## butchersapron (Jun 26, 2015)

Fuck me, _i find accuracy offensive, i find history offensive - begone!_


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## Buddy Bradley (Jun 26, 2015)

butchersapron said:


> One side flew the flag in the civil war right? So removing it from games that that side play a central role in? Fucking ridiculous. What next, banning talk of slavery in history books about slavery?


It was only the flag of one particular regiment, IIRC, not the entire South. That's been retconned into history later.

Edit: It was the Army of Northern Virginia's flag initially, and then was partly adopted by the Confederacy at a later date.


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## butchersapron (Jun 26, 2015)

Buddy Bradley said:


> It was only the flag of one particular regiment, IIRC, not the entire South. That's been retconned into history later.


Don't know what retconned means. It was the final 'national flag'of the confederate states. So its use to represent one side of the battles seems accurate. In the same way that GB might be represented by a Union flag despite regiments or battalions etc having their own flag.


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## editor (Jun 26, 2015)

Will Apple be banning all war games that feature Nazi regalia?


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## tim (Jun 26, 2015)

Mungy said:


> all flags are fucking stupid ideas that keep us anchored to the dead weight of borders and fucking stupid ideologies that will keep us getting dragged back into rehashes of completely futile wars over something that belongs to no-one or belongs to all. fuck flags and their fucking shite.


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## Buddy Bradley (Jun 26, 2015)

editor said:


> Will Apple be banning all war games that feature Nazi regalia?


They already are in Germany.


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## Citizen66 (Jun 26, 2015)

editor said:


> Will Apple be banning all war games that feature Nazi regalia?



Paradox don't have nazi flags in Hearts of Iron and modders aren't even allowed to discuss including them.


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## butchersapron (Jun 26, 2015)

Mungy said:


> all flags are fucking stupid ideas that keep us anchored to the dead weight of borders and fucking stupid ideologies that will keep us getting dragged back into rehashes of completely futile wars over something that belongs to no-one or belongs to all. fuck flags and their fucking shite.


Flags are great.


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## Sea Star (Jun 26, 2015)

DotCommunist said:


> Despite the fact that the game consist of shooting nazis then battling hitler in a robot suit



got to love that historical accuracy!  and... does Godwin's Law apply here?


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## DotCommunist (Jun 26, 2015)

AuntiStella said:


> got to love that historical accuracy!  and... does Godwin's Law apply here?



I don't know if you've played it but if you basicaly shoot hitler out of his robot suit, you still have to fight him. Like two boss levels in one really. (so annoying when a game does this!)

as for historical accuracy, I give you a random factoid as I've been re-reading a history book as a toilet tome, two months before Hitler shot himself in his bunker, Speer who had seen the writing on the wall and was despairing at the orders to basically trash anything the Allied bombers or russians had not fucked up first. That was where the line was crossed for speer, he plotted to gas hitlers bunker, only to be thwarted by the fact that it had been proofed against such a scheme.


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## Sea Star (Jun 26, 2015)

DotCommunist said:


> I don't know if you've played it but if you basicaly shoot hitler out of his robot suit, you still have to fight him. Like two boss levels in one really. (so annoying when a game does this!)
> 
> as for historical accuracy, I give you a random factoid as I've been re-reading a history book as a toilet tome, two months before Hitler shot himself in his bunker, Speer who had seen the writing on the wall and was despairing at the orders to basically trash anything the Allied bombers or russians had not fucked up first. That was where the line was crossed for speer, he plotted to gas hitlers bunker, only to be thwarted by the fact that it had been proofed against such a scheme.


I've read a biography of Speer - seemed to be the most decent Nazi of all, though that wasn't hard.


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## Mungy (Jun 26, 2015)

butchersapron said:


> Flags are great.


well okay you can keep your fucking flag, but only because your argument for keeping them is better than mine, you fucking dinosaur, holding humanity back. fuck the hippies as well


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## Artaxerxes (Jun 26, 2015)

Mungy said:


> all flags are fucking stupid ideas that keep us anchored to the dead weight of borders and fucking stupid ideologies that will keep us getting dragged back into rehashes of completely futile wars over something that belongs to no-one or belongs to all. fuck flags and their fucking shite.



Go on, tell us what you really feel


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## BigTom (Jun 26, 2015)

butchersapron said:


> Don't know what retconned means. It was the final 'national flag'of the confederate states. So its use to represent one side of the battles seems accurate. In the same way that GB might be represented by a Union flag despite regiments or battalions etc having their own flag.



Retconned comes from tv, it's a portmanteau of Retroactive Continuity. It's where you add something into a story which wasn't there before and sort of act or claim as it if was there all along, usually because you've written yourself into a corner that you can only get out of by breaking some rule or something. That's a terrible explanation that needs an example I can't think of at the moment. DotCommunist will probably have a few examples.


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## DotCommunist (Jun 26, 2015)

BigTom said:


> Retconned comes from tv, it's a portmanteau of Retroactive Continuity. It's where you add something into a story which wasn't there before and sort of act or claim as it if was there all along, usually because you've written yourself into a corner that you can only get out of by breaking some rule or something. That's a terrible explanation that needs an example I can't think of at the moment. DotCommunist will probably have a few examples.


tbf you'd be better off asking for examples where it doesn't cheapen evrything that came before.


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## butchersapron (Jun 26, 2015)

BigTom said:


> Retconned comes from tv, it's a portmanteau of Retroactive Continuity. It's where you add something into a story which wasn't there before and sort of act or claim as it if was there all along, usually because you've written yourself into a corner that you can only get out of by breaking some rule or something. That's a terrible explanation that needs an example I can't think of at the moment. DotCommunist will probably have a few examples.


Ta. Doesn't fit here.


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## inva (Jun 26, 2015)

AuntiStella said:


> I've read a biography of Speer - seemed to be the most decent Nazi of all, though that wasn't hard.


he was nothing of the sort


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## CNT36 (Jun 26, 2015)

AuntiStella said:


> I've read a biography of Speer - seemed to be the most decent Nazi of all, though that wasn't hard.


I think Adam Toozes book Wages of Destruction will shatter many illusions people have about Speer.


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## agricola (Jul 1, 2015)

CNT36 said:


> I think Adam Toozes book Wages of Destruction will shatter many illusions people have about Speer.



Any book about Speer, even his own biographies, should shatter any positive illusions people have about Speer.


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