# March for the Alternative demo, Sat 26th March 2011 – info, legal help, chat...



## editor (Mar 23, 2011)

I've posted up what I think is a pretty useful guide to the day's protest here: http://www.urban75.org/blog/march-f...ch-2011-info-legal-help-chat-and-after-party/

I hope you'll find it useful - and if you think I've missed anything, post it up here and I'll add it to the article.


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## xes (Mar 23, 2011)

Nice one for doing that, thank you, I;'m sure it'll come in very useful  
(would you mind if I posted it on other forums where I've posted the protest info?)


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## editor (Mar 23, 2011)

xes said:


> Nice one for doing that, thank you, I;'m sure it'll come in very useful
> (would you mind if I posted it on other forums where I've posted the protest info?)


Go for it!


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## The Black Hand (Mar 23, 2011)

yes, a useful contribution.


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## ohmyliver (Mar 23, 2011)

would it be ok to distribute this via Facebook etc?


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## xes (Mar 23, 2011)

editor said:


> Go for it!


 
nice one, will do


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## editor (Mar 23, 2011)

ohmyliver said:


> would it be ok to distribute this via Facebook etc?


You mean slap up links to it? Go for it. 
I would say copy the whole text but seeing as I intend to keep on updating it, it makes sense if people use the one page.


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## ohmyliver (Mar 23, 2011)

that's exactly what I meant... I'll get slapping then...


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## fractionMan (Mar 23, 2011)

There's a share on facebook thing.


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## ohmyliver (Mar 23, 2011)

a mate has suggested that a link to http://sukey.org/ would be very useful in there... 

to quote the Sukey website
"What is Sukey?

("Fleeing riot police on foot? There's an app for that ..." (thanks @mlascarides!))

Sukey is our name for a set of applications designed to keep you protected and informed during protests. When you see something interesting, you tell us. When we're confident that something has actually happened, we tell you.

If you have a smartphone with a good web browser, you can look at a really cool compass-thing we call "Roar". If you don't, you can use our SMS update service we call "Growl". Have a look at our guide to getting involved for more information on how to do this stuff."


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## editor (Mar 23, 2011)

Let me add that later!

Edit: done!


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## Nice one (Mar 23, 2011)

what we've done so far

Action Map - details all the various radical activities going on during the day, 
Legal - do i have to give the cops my name and address? Legal rights on the day
Tactical briefing - what the cops will be up to on the day


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## smokedout (Mar 23, 2011)

ohmyliver said:


> a mate has suggested that a link to http://sukey.org/ would be very useful in there...



Leaked Sukey Minutes Reveal Cosy Chats With Met


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## ohmyliver (Mar 23, 2011)

Thanks for that, that's a shame.


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## IC3D (Mar 23, 2011)

I was contacted by sukey to do some design work which was odd for a start and found them at least a bit crap and worse a police trap so sacked it off. They did say those minutes are on the website however.


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## Mr.Bishie (Mar 23, 2011)

SE Brighton/Lewes folk - Arrest Support 07970 412183 Kelly's solicitors 0800 387463


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## Mation (Mar 23, 2011)

Have people got something like this on their phones? I know you can get it for Android; I'm guessing for iphone too. Streams live video to the interweb with one (or sometimes two) button presses, and automatically saves it there.


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## editor (Mar 23, 2011)

Mation said:


> Have people got something like this on their phones? I know you can get it for Android; I'm guessing for iphone too. Streams live video to the interweb with one (or sometimes two) button presses, and automatically saves it there.


Actually, I'm remember writing a piece on that - I should add that to this guide too (or maybe rewrite it).

I've also just added several alternative actions that are going - it's going to be a very busy day!


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## ska invita (Mar 23, 2011)

Freedom have got some good stuff up too:




http://www.freedompress.org.uk/news/2011/03/23/action-map-march-26th-demo/
guide to the day

and this is legal advice
http://www.freedompress.org.uk/news...-i-have-to-give-the-cops-my-name-and-address/


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## editor (Mar 23, 2011)

Here it is: Photographers Rights - photographing protests 
There's also legal stuff about cops deleting images and how to gt them back if they (illegally) force you to do so.


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## Pickman's model (Mar 23, 2011)

editor said:


> Here it is: Photographers Rights - photographing protests
> There's also legal stuff about cops deleting images and how to gt them back if they (illegally) force you to do so.


 
i've never had this problem, despite taking well over a couple of thousand pictures of the police (and the cctv systems in the city of london and a range of railway stations). the nearest i've come is the old 'it's not very nice you taking my picture, you should have asked permission first'. but when confronted with a fairly polite 'foxtrot oscar' they've backed down.


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## editor (Mar 23, 2011)

Pickman's model said:


> i've never had this problem, despite taking well over a couple of thousand pictures of the police (and the cctv systems in the city of london and a range of railway stations). the nearest i've come is the old 'it's not very nice you taking my picture, you should have asked permission first'. but when confronted with a fairly polite 'foxtrot oscar' they've backed down.


It does happen, and happens rather more often than you might think.


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## Pickman's model (Mar 23, 2011)

editor said:


> It does happen, and happens rather more often than you might think.


 
i'm not denying it happens. i'm just rather confused that i haven't had this issue when i've been doing what i've been doing for some years now.


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## Mation (Mar 23, 2011)

editor said:


> Here it is: Photographers Rights - photographing protests
> There's also legal stuff about cops deleting images and how to gt them back if they (illegally) force you to do so.


Good stuff!


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## BigTom (Mar 23, 2011)

It might be tucked away in there but could be worth adding something about the different "officials" that will be around:

GBC legal observers (the only ones to be trusted) - will be wearing orange hi-vis with "Legal Observer" on them (will also likely have a t-shirt saying something like "no search powers compel you to give your personal details").

TUC stewards - Yellow Hi-Vis

Liberty Observers (In cahoots with the police, not to be trusted) - think they'll have green hi-vis on, but not sure, need to check that.. 

[actually might be best just to add onto the legal bit to say that GBC legal ovservers will be wearing the orange hi-vis and are on our side]


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## editor (Mar 24, 2011)

Are you sure Liberty are "in cahoots with the police"?


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## BigTom (Mar 24, 2011)

They are going to be in the police offices observing what is going on, they've been asked in by the police, I don't trust them, it's a personal statement of belief not something I can objectively prove.  I think they are there to legitimise the actions of the police rather than to help activists


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## editor (Mar 24, 2011)

BigTom said:


> They are going to be in the police offices observing what is going on, they've been asked in by the police, I don't trust them, it's a personal statement of belief not something I can objectively prove.  I think they are there to legitimise the actions of the police rather than to help activists


Liberty were very helpful to me when I was running the Football/CJA campaign and they've done some great work over the years. I'd hardly call them police informers in any regard.


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## strung out (Mar 24, 2011)

more on the liberty observers... http://london.indymedia.org/articles/7996



> GBC and LDMG are advising caution when dealing with Liberty's untrained legal observers in green bibs. Liberty are working closely with police in the run up to and during the demonstration and are _willing to testify against the actions of protesters._


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## emma goldman (Mar 25, 2011)

Convergance space opened, crash space, meeting space etc. full details here


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## editor (Mar 25, 2011)

emma goldman said:


> Convergance space opened, crash space, meeting space etc. full details here


Cheers - added!


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## Louis MacNeice (Mar 25, 2011)

emma goldman said:


> Convergance space opened, crash space, meeting space etc. full details here


 
Cheers emma; having got my head round the idea of a convergence space, could you help me out about the 'activist kitchen'?

All the best - Louis MacNeice


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## emma goldman (Mar 25, 2011)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Cheers emma; having got my head round the idea of a convergence space, could you help me out about the 'activist kitchen'?
> 
> All the best - Louis MacNeice


I think they're probably taking the piss a bit, but what i imagine is that there will be some sort of cooking space, probably slightly run-down and makeshift where people can make their own food to share, ie there wont be catering but people are welcome to bring food and cook it there.


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## Biddlybee (Mar 25, 2011)

ed - your links under "CAN’T MAKE THE MARCH?" aren't working.

ooh, they are now


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## editor (Mar 25, 2011)

diddlybiddly said:


> ed - your links under "CAN’T MAKE THE MARCH?" aren't working.
> 
> ooh, they are now


I hadn't touched them!


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## Louis MacNeice (Mar 25, 2011)

emma goldman said:


> I think they're probably taking the piss a bit, but what i imagine is that there will be some sort of cooking space, probably slightly run-down and makeshift where people can make their own food to share, ie there wont be catering but people are welcome to bring food and cook it there.


 
So a kitchen, albeit a rudimentary one, not a cooking space, a culinary practice arena, an activist kitchen or a food preparation area...coming from people so obviously concerned with language it does make me smile.

Looking forward to the 26th - Louis MacNeice

p.s. The MacNeice family will be bringing a range of consumable food containment devices and edible carbohydrate stores on Saturday (sandwiches and flapjack).


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## stethoscope (Mar 25, 2011)

Ed, any chance of a link to Pink & Black Bloc on the page where the other blocs are mentioned?

http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=181582421881050

(called by Queer Resistance - http://www.facebook.com/pages/Queer...llies-against-the-cuts/177736318929040?v=info)


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## editor (Mar 25, 2011)

stephj said:


> Ed, any chance of a link to Pink & Black Bloc on the page where the other blocs are mentioned?
> 
> http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=181582421881050
> 
> (called by Queer Resistance - http://www.facebook.com/pages/Queer...llies-against-the-cuts/177736318929040?v=info)


Done!


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## stethoscope (Mar 25, 2011)

Cheers Ed!


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## Citizen66 (Mar 25, 2011)

Mation said:


> Have people got something like this on their phones? I know you can get it for Android; I'm guessing for iphone too. Streams live video to the interweb with one (or sometimes two) button presses, and automatically saves it there.


 
Do the old bill jam mobile signals on demos?


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## editor (Mar 25, 2011)

Citizen66 said:


> Do the old bill jam mobile signals on demos?


I've never known it happen here, but with a ton of people all on their mobiles at the same time, connectivity can be a bit wobbly.


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## moon23 (Mar 25, 2011)

BigTom said:


> They are going to be in the police offices observing what is going on, they've been asked in by the police, I don't trust them, it's a personal statement of belief not something I can objectively prove.  I think they are there to legitimise the actions of the police rather than to help activists


 
You don't trust Liberty, and think they are part of a police conspiracy?


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## past caring (Mar 25, 2011)

Fuck off moon.


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## Louis MacNeice (Mar 25, 2011)

moon23 said:


> You don't trust Liberty, and think they are part of a police conspiracy?


 
It's an advance on not understanding liberty.

Louis MacNeice


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## BigTom (Mar 25, 2011)

moon23 said:


> You don't trust Liberty, and think they are part of a police conspiracy?



That's not what I said.  I said I think they have been called in to legitimise the police's actions on saturday and are not there to help activists.  They are willing to testify against activists, I think they will be compliant with the police, rubber stamp their actions as long as they don't pull out the rubber bullets or cs gas.
At best they are neutral, but in this kind of situation neutrality will side with the status quo.
GBC observers will not provide evidence against activists.

Oh, and where the fuck do you get the idea that there is some kind of police conspiracy? conspiracy to do what exactly?


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## editor (Mar 25, 2011)

BigTom said:


> That's not what I said.  I said I think they have been called in to legitimise the police's actions on saturday and are not there to help activists.  They are willing to testify against activists, I think they will be compliant with the police, rubber stamp their actions as long as they don't pull out the rubber bullets or cs gas.


Surely they'll equally willing to testify against the police if appropriate, no?


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## BigTom (Mar 25, 2011)

editor said:


> Surely they'll equally willing to testify against the police if appropriate, no?



Probably, though any action against a police officer will never get taken as far as actions against protesters.  
We'll see what happens, and if Liberty's actions on saturday show that my doubts about their role are unfounded or misguided then I will of course accept that I was wrong and apologise (or whatever the right word is) for my statements about them on this thread, I just don't have faith in what their role will be on saturday.

still think it would be worth adding the info about what groups are wearing what colour hi-vis onto the page (if you haven't), just leave out the other things i said:
TUC stewards = yellow hi-vis
liberty observers = green hi-vis
GBC observers = orange hi-vis


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## idumea (Mar 25, 2011)

Liberty are currently engaged in high court action against the Met police on behalf of three teenage protestors who were kettled and brutalised during the student protests. I think it's a little unfair to try and paint their relationship with the police as somehow cosy and collaborationist.


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## Louis MacNeice (Mar 25, 2011)

Does anybody have access to a quantity of yellow hi-vis jackets; just for a laugh?

Louis MacNeice


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## BigTom (Mar 25, 2011)

idumea said:


> Liberty are currently engaged in high court action against the Met police on behalf of three teenage protestors who were kettled and brutalised during the student protests. I think it's a little unfair to try and paint their relationship with the police as somehow cosy and collaborationist.



http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/dec/26/metropolitan-police-lawsuit-student-protest

I had missed this admittedly, perhaps I have been too quick to judge; what I had heard which was very much that the met had invited them in, joint press conferences etc. 
I would still trust a gbc legal observer over a liberty legal observer on the ground though.


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## editor (Mar 25, 2011)

Liberty have done loads of great work. They were very active for the squatters/travellers/road protesters etc when the CJA was in the news and I've always found them an excellent resource.


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## MrSki (Mar 25, 2011)

Liberty's take on it.

http://www.liberty-human-rights.org.uk/news/2011/liberty-at-the-march-for-the-alternative.php


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## editor (Mar 25, 2011)

MrSki said:


> Liberty's take on it.
> 
> http://www.liberty-human-rights.org.uk/news/2011/liberty-at-the-march-for-the-alternative.php


Sounds entirely reasonable to me and very much in line with what I expect from such a campaigning organisation.


> It was police brutality against the Hunger Marches of the 1930s that inspired our founder Ronald Kidd to create the National Council for Civil Liberties, later renamed Liberty.
> At a time of economic disarray and social unrest, Kidd and his co-founders vowed to act in defence of British freedom by being neutral observers of coming marches.
> 
> As the saying goes, ‘the more things change, the more they stay the same’. How true!*
> ...


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## Mr.Bishie (Mar 25, 2011)

editor said:


> Sounds entirely reasonable to me and very much in line with what I expect from such a campaigning organisation.


 
Yep!


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## Citizen66 (Mar 25, 2011)

Mation said:


> Have people got something like this on their phones? I know you can get it for Android; I'm guessing for iphone too. Streams live video to the interweb with one (or sometimes two) button presses, and automatically saves it there.


 
Tried this (qik) out now. Works well on the desire, just takes a while to upload.


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## Dovydaitis (Mar 25, 2011)

Louis MacNeice said:


> Does anybody have access to a quantity of yellow hi-vis jackets; just for a laugh?
> 
> Louis MacNeice


 
scarily yes....... 


might be able to get some orange ones too


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## Mation (Mar 27, 2011)

Citizen66 said:


> Tried this (qik) out now. Works well on the desire, just takes a while to upload.


It failed me yesterday - kept crashing


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## Brainaddict (Mar 27, 2011)

Footage of the police action to clear Trafalgar Square (what most say appeared to be fairly deliberate aggression escalated from a minor event): 

Qik worked for me mation but it absolutely eats battery power.


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