# Herne Hill news, chitter chatter and gossip



## choochi (Jun 9, 2014)

Not wanting to be left out of the 'let's all have a local thread' party, I am starting one one for the Herne HIll dwellers. Anyway to kick off...

I overheard some quite vicious comments directed at the boob-tube and mini-skirt wearing transexual yesterday as she was wandering around Herne Hill market. Thankfully she didn't hear it but it wasn't nice to hear. Of course being a bit of a coward I didn't say anything other than to mutter 'live and let live' under my breath.


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## Badgers (Jun 9, 2014)

HIll?


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## Manter (Jun 9, 2014)

Why do we have all these hyper-local threads? If something happens in Brockwell park, where do we put it? Or does it depend which entrance to the park?!


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## BoxRoom (Jun 9, 2014)

I go to the vets every Saturday. 

I hope you were already sitting down when you read that. That level of excitement can be very dangerous.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 9, 2014)

I went out in Herne Hill the other day. It was terrifying, people kept trying to kill me for no reason. If only there was somewhere I could hang out that was safe.


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## BoxRoom (Jun 9, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> I went out in Herne Hill the other day. It was terrifying, people kept trying to kill me for no reason. If only there was somewhere I could hang out that was safe.


There is a place you can be safe! It's very secret though. Don't tell anyone. Buy a hat and we'll speak some more.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 9, 2014)

<Buys new fedora>


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## Badgers (Jun 9, 2014)

Manter said:


> Why do we have all these hyper-local threads? If something happens in Brockwell park, where do we put it? Or does it depend which entrance to the park?!



I still think there should be separate SW2 and SW9 chitter chatter threads


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## BoxRoom (Jun 9, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> <Buys new fedora>



Will need 100 quid now also. Ta.


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## leanderman (Jun 9, 2014)

Manter said:


> Why do we have all these hyper-local threads? If something happens in Brockwell park, where do we put it? Or does it depend which entrance to the park?!



Clearly a need for a Lower Tulse Hill thread


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## Manter (Jun 9, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Clearly a need for a Lower Tulse Hill thread


but I'm at the top of a hill.  *I'm so confused*


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## OvalhouseDB (Jun 9, 2014)

And I'm Over The Hill.

But I did have my breakfast in Sesami this morning, and very fine it was too.


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## Greebo (Jun 9, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Clearly a need for a Lower Tulse Hill thread


I demand a thread for Brockwell Heights.


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## Manter (Jun 9, 2014)

Greebo said:


> I demand a thread for Brockewll Heights.


Where's that 

<<brain explodes>>


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## Greebo (Jun 9, 2014)

Manter said:


> Where's that
> 
> <<brain explodes>>


The top end of the edge of Brockwell Park - if estate agents can come up with stupid names for areas, so can I.


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## leanderman (Jun 9, 2014)

Little family meal at Cafe Provencal on Saturday evening.

What a lovely place it is, much brighter and lighter post-flood.


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## Manter (Jun 9, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Little family meal at Cafe Provencal on Saturday evening.
> 
> What a lovely place it is, much brighter and lighter post-flood.


I didn't know it had reopened! Will go investigate.


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## leanderman (Jun 9, 2014)

Manter said:


> I didn't know it had reopened! Will go investigate.



The five of us felt we were on holiday - and the girls cartwheeled home across the park!


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## Manter (Jun 9, 2014)

I haven't managed to teach the boy to cartwheel yet. Slacker....


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## Lizzy Mac (Jun 9, 2014)

I saw a man who was more or less Gordon Geko last week.  Got out of soft top sports car near the station, talking loudly into an ear piece, pink shirt, purple suit, braces.  It's gone too far.


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## nagapie (Jun 9, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Little family meal at Cafe Provencal on Saturday evening.
> 
> What a lovely place it is, much brighter and lighter post-flood.



Have they kept the box of broken, dirty toys; my son loves them.


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## leanderman (Jun 9, 2014)

nagapie said:


> Have they kept the box of broken, dirty toys; my son loves them.



Didn't spot that


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## nagapie (Jun 9, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Didn't spot that



Are there any toys? It's the only reason we used to go there, nice atmosphere for children as the back was pretty much for families with children and there were toys. I mean they were nice and all but the food was only average.


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## oryx (Jun 9, 2014)

Manter said:


> I didn't know it had reopened! Will go investigate.



Same here - have made two attempts to visit since the flood so glad it's re-opened.


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## Emmanusquelle (Jun 9, 2014)

I went to Cafe Prov the other week but was quite disappointed with the service - waitress was pretty rude/abrupt (I won't bore you with the full story, but in any case, it was probably just because she was very busy!). 
The place does look really nice now they've done it up though (I mean, it was nice before too but just different). I didn't notice if the back was still essentially a playroom as I was by myself that time so had no reason to go looking for the toy box.


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## colacubes (Jun 9, 2014)

Cafe Prov reopening is v good news


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## Emmanusquelle (Jun 9, 2014)

Manter said:


> Why do we have all these hyper-local threads? If something happens in Brockwell park, where do we put it? Or does it depend which entrance to the park?!



I am pretty much halfway between Brixton and Herne Hill so am going to hover between the two hyper-local threads.


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## colacubes (Jun 9, 2014)

Any news on the Half Moon from anyone?  Last I heard there was still insurance wrangling and no one was sure when (or if) it would reopen


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## leanderman (Jun 10, 2014)

nagapie said:


> Are there any toys? It's the only reason we used to go there, nice atmosphere for children as the back was pretty much for families with children and there were toys. I mean they were nice and all but the food was only average.



Didn't penetrate the back end.


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## leanderman (Jun 10, 2014)

Emmanusquelle said:


> I went to Cafe Prov the other week but was quite disappointed with the service - waitress was pretty rude/abrupt (I won't bore you with the full story, but in any case, it was probably just because she was very busy!).
> The place does look really nice now they've done it up though (I mean, it was nice before too but just different). I didn't notice if the back was still essentially a playroom as I was by myself that time so had no reason to go looking for the toy box.



Service was OK. Pretty good Caf Prov salad. Good wine list


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## Rushy (Jun 10, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Didn't penetrate the back end.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 10, 2014)

colacubes said:


> Any news on the Half Moon from anyone?  Last I heard there was still insurance wrangling and no one was sure when (or if) it would reopen


 

Late summer apparently. We'll see though. I've not heard from anyone who knows them that they're not planning to reopen.


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## colacubes (Jun 10, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Late summer apparently. We'll see though. I've not heard from anyone who knows them that they're not planning to reopen.



Well that sounds a bit positive at least.


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## Biddlybee (Jun 10, 2014)

nagapie said:


> Are there any toys? It's the only reason we used to go there, nice atmosphere for children as the back was pretty much for families with children and there were toys. I mean they were nice and all but the food was only average.


Nope. They're pretty child friendly - kids menu, antilops - but not quite like it was.


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## Emmanusquelle (Jun 10, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> Nope. They're pretty child friendly - kids menu, antilops - but not quite like it was.


What's an antilop?


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## Manter (Jun 10, 2014)

Emmanusquelle said:


> What's an antilop?


Ikea high chair


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## friendofdorothy (Jun 10, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Didn't penetrate the back end.


oo er missus!


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## friendofdorothy (Jun 10, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Late summer apparently. We'll see though. I've not heard from anyone who knows them that they're not planning to reopen.


Haven't heard anything for ages - there was the Weatherspoons rumour/wishful thinking a while back - but no one I know has a clue. We miss it.

And I've not been able to reclaim my loving home made 'Welcome to Hernehill stitch and bitch' sign that we used to stick on the snug door. Since the flood we're still stitching and of course we're still bitching, in the Prince Regent, Dulwich Road, every wednesday evening 8pm onwards - usually the big table near the front window - everyone is most welcome.


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## nagapie (Jun 10, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> Nope. They're pretty child friendly - kids menu, antilops - but not quite like it was.



What a shame, I liked the shabby chic, relaxed vibe of the place. I'm not sure I'd be tempted back in it's new incarnation, although it is sometimes convenient, unless they've improved their coffee.


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## leanderman (Jun 10, 2014)

nagapie said:


> What a shame, I liked the shabby chic, relaxed vibe of the place. I'm not sure I'd be tempted back in it's new incarnation, although it is sometimes convenient, unless they've improved their coffee.



Still pretty relaxed.


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## nagapie (Jun 10, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Still pretty relaxed.



What about the coffee?

Just joking, I'm sure I'll pop in some time when it's convenient but when it had toys, it was a good destination for a parent who wanted to chat with a friend while child amused itself with toys.


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## snowy_again (Jun 13, 2014)

So Sains has a new queue layout and new grumpy transferred staff, Dickson's iffy has spent their insurance cash on new fittings and the hoardings are down on the new tesco. 

WTF is the HealthHub? 

Island had some party on with no guests, which is a shame as I have very enlightened memories of that place.


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## choochi (Jun 14, 2014)

It's the Poets Corner Street Party today on Chaucer Road from 12-6pm.


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## friendofdorothy (Jun 14, 2014)

choochi said:


> It's the Poets Corner Street Party today on Chaucer Road from 12-6pm.


Sorry I didn't make it - how did it go?


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## friendofdorothy (Jun 14, 2014)

I spent the afternoon at Makerspace - I cut out 3 garments on one of the large tables - and everyone there was very nice and welcoming. 
Crispy  - disappointed not to have met you.


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## Crispy (Jun 15, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> I spent the afternoon at Makerspace - I cut out 3 garments on one of the large tables - and everyone there was very nice and welcoming.
> Crispy  - disappointed not to have met you.


Sorry, was visiting family! Do come again though


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## Miss-Shelf (Jun 15, 2014)

Crispy said:


> Sorry, was visiting family! Do come again though


i know you've gone to great lengths to have all the information on the website but I am doing what my students do and shortcutting that:

how do I get in?
can I leave a sewing machine there?


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## Crispy (Jun 15, 2014)

Miss-Shelf said:


> i know you've gone to great lengths to have all the information on the website but I am doing what my students do and shortcutting that:
> 
> how do I get in?
> can I leave a sewing machine there?


1. Become a paying member: members.southlondonmakerspace.org
2. Come to an open night and get your Oyster card registered on the system
3. Touch in to unlock the door any time 24/7 

You can leave your machine there, but be sure to label it if you don't want others to use it. We also have a machine of our own, just awaiting the delivery of a replacement foot.


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## Miss-Shelf (Jun 15, 2014)

I have joined
I would be happy for others to use - but obviously dont' want it broken so need to know what occurs round that sort of thing....


I know all these sort of things will be discussed at meetings etc and I've been so bloody busy marking lately I haven't been able to attend or anything


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## Crispy (Jun 15, 2014)

Miss-Shelf said:


> I have joined


Yay!


> I would be happy for others to use - but obviously dont' want it broken so need to know what occurs round that sort of thing.


Best thing to do is start a thread on our Google Group: https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en-GB#!categories/southlondonmakerspace - although you'll find that there are already a couple of threads on the topic, maybe this one is best: https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en-GB#!category-topic/southlondonmakerspace/duHAO839-O0

Get stuck in


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## Miss-Shelf (Jun 15, 2014)

you have lots of patience Crispy  thanks


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## friendofdorothy (Jun 16, 2014)

Crispy said:


> Sorry, was visiting family! Do come again though



Will you have another open session mending household things?
I see you have a lot of members who are good with electrical/electronic things.


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## Crispy (Jun 16, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Will you have another open session mending household things?
> I see you have a lot of members who are good with electrical/electronic things.


The next one of those is next Wednesday (the 25th)
http://www.meetup.com/Restarters-London/events/188223242/
It's probably the last one we'll host. Our new home will be great for members, but not so great for drop-in public access.
But the Restart people themselves hold regular sessions in other venues, so keep an eye out on their website if you can't make the 25th.


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## friendofdorothy (Jun 16, 2014)

Thanks Crispy


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## friendofdorothy (Jun 16, 2014)

Are there going to be any outdoor silent movies going on this year? - I caught the end of one last year outside the station and it was fab.


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## Ms T (Jun 17, 2014)

colacubes said:


> Any news on the Half Moon from anyone?  Last I heard there was still insurance wrangling and no one was sure when (or if) it would reopen


Had brunch at Cafe Prov and they seem to think the Half Moon might not re-open at all. 

In better news, the new look Cafe Prov was very nice for brekkie and they have improved the coffee. No toys though. I think that's a deliberate attempt to get away from the toddler crowd.


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## Nanker Phelge (Jun 17, 2014)

I had feared the Half Moon might be gone for good. Shame, because it was a good little music venue too...


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## Biddlybee (Jun 17, 2014)

choochi said:


> It's the Poets Corner Street Party today on Chaucer Road from 12-6pm.


Was that advertised anywhere at all? Was really close to where I live, but didn't know anything until I walked past at around 4/5pm.


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## snowy_again (Jun 17, 2014)

The Herne Hill Forum sometimes lists them, it was Kellet / Mervan Road one as well last Saturday.


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## Biddlybee (Jun 17, 2014)

Ah, I don't really go on there


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## choochi (Jun 17, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> Was that advertised anywhere at all? Was really close to where I live, but didn't know anything until I walked past at around 4/5pm.



I didn't actually go, I just got a flyer through a couple of days beforehand. Not sure which streets they posted flyers on though?


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## choochi (Jun 17, 2014)

Ms T said:


> Had brunch at Cafe Prov and they seem to think the Half Moon might not re-open at all.



That would be a real shame as it offered something different from the other pubs in the area. Did they say why?


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## nagapie (Jun 17, 2014)

Ms T said:


> I think that's a deliberate attempt to get away from the toddler crowd.



I'm sure it is. Although that's quite a lot of HH really.


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## Smick (Jun 18, 2014)

Is the toddler crowd not big money in Herne Hill?

People with kids who visit are always amazed by the Florence play area when I take them there.


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## Manter (Jun 18, 2014)

Smick said:


> Is the toddler crowd not big money in Herne Hill?
> 
> People with kids who visit are always amazed by the Florence play area when I take them there.


They are. And if you're open during the day in HH you'd be daft to do anything other than encourage them IMO. But they're also noisy and not glamorous


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## Ms T (Jun 18, 2014)

Manter said:


> They are. And if you're open during the day in HH you'd be daft to do anything other than encourage them IMO. But they're also noisy and not glamorous



I think the problem was that some people weren't really supervising their kids.


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## Manter (Jun 18, 2014)

Ms T said:


> I think the problem was that some people weren't really supervising their kids.


Yeah, that's the issue with parents, none of them parent in the same way, and invariably not in the way onlookers think they should do.


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## nagapie (Jun 18, 2014)

Ms T said:


> I think the problem was that some people weren't really supervising their kids.



How odd, the family area was pretty small so hard not to. 

I'm wondering why I would go there now as their food and coffee were very average but I suppose there aren't actually many places in HH that you can drop in for a coffee.


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## Rushy (Jun 18, 2014)

Ms T said:


> I think the problem was that some people weren't really supervising their kids.


I was once having a burger at the Florence, sat by the door and watched a little kid wander out into the street. I grabbed him by his hoodie as he was about to step out from between two parked cars into the main road. Parents were out in the back garden and had left him in the kids play area. They seemed pretty disinterested.


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## Smick (Jun 18, 2014)

Rushy said:


> I was once having a burger at the Florence, sat by the door and watched a little kid wander out into the street. I grabbed him by his hoodie as he was about to step out from between two parked cars into the main road. Parents were out in the back garden and had left him in the kids play area. They seemed pretty disinterested.


 I've got a friend who was a social worker and he is very iffy about the Florence's play area. I think it's great, but I spend half my time in there and then drop outside to have a chug on my pint, watching in the window like a hawk.

The Rosendale in West Norwood / West Dulwich is also a good one for the kids.

I was in a pub in Stockton upon Tees recently and they had a sign stating that children would be tolerated, but if they make noise, don't be surprised to be asked to leave without finishing your food and drinks. Couldn't be further different from London pubs.


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## leanderman (Jun 18, 2014)

Smick said:


> I've got a friend who was a social worker and he is very iffy about the Florence's play area. I think it's great, but I spend half my time in there and then drop outside to have a chug on my pint, watching in the window like a hawk.
> 
> The Rosendale in West Norwood / West Dulwich is also a good one for the kids.



Play area seems safe enough unless they escape

I like the Rosendale too. Wilderness area though!


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## clandestino (Jun 18, 2014)

Ms T said:


> Had brunch at Cafe Prov and they seem to think the Half Moon might not re-open at all.



I had a look on their Facebook page recently and there was a comment from the pub saying they were in dispute with their insurers I think it was. Just went back to double check and their page has been merged with the general Wetherspoons one...doesn't look good...


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## Crispy (Jun 19, 2014)

Rumours on the herne hill forum: http://www.hernehillforum.org.uk/community_forum/35/10868
Good news then, if it's being bought by Spoons. Means it stays a pub and the beer will be cheap.


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## colacubes (Jun 19, 2014)

Better a Spoons than no pub at all.


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## Crispy (Jun 19, 2014)

Better a spoons than many other pub options, imo.


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## colacubes (Jun 19, 2014)

I don't disagree at all.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 19, 2014)

Better a 'spoons than a Commercial/Florence/Regent. Or the fucking Railway with their comedy pricing.


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## snowy_again (Jun 19, 2014)

I would take TJ Builders comments on the HHF with a pinch of salt (and a tequila). It's like asking spymaster for cycling tips. 

And in the debate between it being a gastro ComFloReg vs. a Spoon, I'd rather it stayed as the Half Moon; the last newish landlord had made some good and bad changes, but blandifying it as a  Half Moon Under Water would be a waste.


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## editor (Jun 19, 2014)

Crispy said:


> Rumours on the herne hill forum: http://www.hernehillforum.org.uk/community_forum/35/10868
> Good news then, if it's being bought by Spoons. Means it stays a pub and the beer will be cheap.


Love the outraged reactions from the burghers of HH!


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 19, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> And in the debate between it being a gastro ComFloReg vs. a Spoon, I'd rather it stayed as the Half Moon; the last newish landlord had made some good and bad changes, but blandifying it as a  Half Moon Under Water would be a waste.


 
Yes agreed. I was a regular there for years (I'm sure I must know you irl) and I really want it back. I'd welcome a spoons if the alternative is it closing but truth be told it's definitely not what I'd choose.


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## T & P (Jun 19, 2014)

What's wrong with The Commercial? I can understand the resentment towards another Florence-type pub, but the C. seems like a decent joint to me. I'd still much prefer the Half Moon to reopen, but if I had to choose between a Commercial-style pub and a Spoons, the latter can go fuck itself tbh


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## snowy_again (Jun 19, 2014)

I walked back and forth through HH to get to the velodrome _too _many times yesterday and got a chance to look at that bit of the Lane for the first time in a while. It's slowly recovering from the flood; but it's really missing that pub.


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## Rushy (Jun 19, 2014)

T & P said:


> What's wrong with The Commercial? I can understand the resentment towards another Florence-type pub, but the C. seems like a decent joint to me. I'd still much prefer the Half Moon to reopen, but if I had to choose between a Commercial-style pub and a Spoons, the latter can go fuck itself tbh


And the Regent. Lovely boozer beautifully restored. Nice mix of people too.


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## T & P (Jun 19, 2014)

True that. It's that bit further away so I haven't visited it that often, but when I did I've had a pleasant time.


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## Manter (Jun 19, 2014)

T & P said:


> True that. It's that bit further away so I haven't visited it that often, but when I did I've had a pleasant time.


I spent a lot of my mat leave in the Regent with Ms T and a dog.  Lovely place.

E2a oh, and a baby.


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## editor (Jun 19, 2014)

Rushy said:


> And the Regent. Lovely boozer beautifully restored. Nice mix of people too.


Pub is alright, but I wouldn't recommend the upstairs room for anyone having a party where they like the volume to go over 0.7 though, or to any DJs as their 'system' is an absolute shocker. Those CD decks still haunt me!


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 19, 2014)

It's hard to say what makes a pub good isn't it. The other three are all fine. I don't hate them or anything and I've been known to drink in all of them on occasions. The Half Moon did retain something of the feel of what Herne Hill used to be like in a way none of them do though, IMO, even if that was despite the best efforts of the owners.


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## snowy_again (Jun 19, 2014)

editor said:


> Pub is alright, but I wouldn't recommend the upstairs room for anyone having a party where they like the volume to go over 0.7 though, or to any DJs as their 'system' is an absolute shocker. Those CD decks still haunt me!



that's cos the landlord and his kids live upstairs... I'll refrain from further comments.


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## buscador (Jun 19, 2014)

Time was when every pub in HH (like HH itself) was tired, dull and tatty, but each had their own character and devotees. You could go to the Brockwell Tavern if you wanted a fight or to meet up with your NF mates, the Half Moon or the Regent if you wanted to play pool, or the Commercial if you wanted a clean seat, cheap lunch and to be near the bookies. Over the years I've been a regular in all of them in their various incarnations, but it's becoming less obvious which is which any more. 

Current best in show is the Regent, despite the appalling state of the toilets, because it seems finally to have realised that people who just want to go for a pint or two are equally as important as the punters who want to buy dinner, and at least you can sit in the sunshine outside.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 19, 2014)

buscador said:


> Time was when every pub in HH (like HH itself) was tired, dull and tatty, but each had their own character and devotees. You could go to the Brockwell Tavern if you wanted a fight or to meet up with your NF mates, the Half Moon or the Regent if you wanted to play pool, or the Commercial if you wanted a clean seat, cheap lunch and to be near the bookies. Over the years I've been a regular in all of them in their various incarnations, but it's becoming less obvious which is which any more.
> 
> Current best in show is the Regent, despite the appalling state of the toilets, because it seems finally to have realised that people who just want to go for a pint or two are equally as important as the punters who want to buy dinner, and at least you can sit in the sunshine outside.


 
And the Hamilton if you wanted a drink when the others kicked you out at closing.


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## Rushy (Jun 19, 2014)

buscador said:


> Time was when every pub in HH (like HH itself) was tired, dull and tatty, but each had their own character and devotees. You could go to the Brockwell Tavern if you wanted a fight or to meet up with your NF mates, the Half Moon or the Regent if you wanted to play pool, or the Commercial if you wanted a clean seat, cheap lunch and to be near the bookies. Over the years I've been a regular in all of them in their various incarnations, but it's becoming less obvious which is which any more.
> 
> Current best in show is the Regent, despite the appalling state of the toilets, because it seems finally to have realised that people who just want to go for a pint or two are equally as important as the punters who want to buy dinner, and at least you can sit in the sunshine outside.


Where was the Brockwell Tavern?


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## buscador (Jun 19, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> And the Hamilton if you wanted a drink when the others kicked you out at closing.



Yes, indeed. Some interesting nights in that place.


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## buscador (Jun 19, 2014)

Rushy said:


> Where was the Brockwell Tavern?



What the Florence is now.


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## Rushy (Jun 19, 2014)

buscador said:


> What the Florence is now.


Brockwell Tavern is a much better name!


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## buscador (Jun 19, 2014)

Rushy said:


> Brockwell Tavern is a much better name!



Not sure it was a better pub though! In fact, it was so rough that friendofdorothy refused to go in there.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 19, 2014)

buscador said:


> Not sure it was a better pub though! In fact, it was so rough that friendofdorothy refused to go in there.


 
When I moved to Herne Hill (2003) I remember it being basically dead most of the time. I used to go in to play pool on occasions and there were usually just a few old geezers hanging around. Maybe it's previous rep had done for it by then. I wasn't surprised when it became Ganley's anyway.


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## buscador (Jun 19, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> When I moved to Herne Hill (2003) I remember it being basically dead most of the time. I used to go in to play pool on occasions and there were usually just a few old geezers hanging around. Maybe it's previous rep had done for it by then. I wasn't surprised when it became Ganley's anyway.



There was a period when it seemed that half of HH was barred in succession from all of the pubs in HH - lots of lost souls wandering around unable to remember which pub they were currently barred from. 

I ran into Colin Ganley once in Pullen's and was ribbing him about the signwriting on his pub - "Oh, so you're Mr Tangley!" I suspect it wasn't the first time he'd heard it.


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## snowy_again (Jun 19, 2014)

buscador said:


> Time was when every pub in HH (like HH itself) was tired, dull and tatty, but each had their own character and devotees. You could go to the Brockwell Tavern if you wanted a fight or to meet up with your NF mates, the Half Moon or the Regent if you wanted to play pool, or the Commercial if you wanted a clean seat, cheap lunch and to be near the bookies. Over the years I've been a regular in all of them in their various incarnations, but it's becoming less obvious which is which any more.
> 
> Current best in show is the Regent, despite the appalling state of the toilets, because it seems finally to have realised that people who just want to go for a pint or two are equally as important as the punters who want to buy dinner, and at least you can sit in the sunshine outside.



You're missing out Ganley's, for massive Sunday lunches.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 19, 2014)

buscador said:


> Current best in show is the Regent, despite the appalling state of the toilets, because it seems finally to have realised that people who just want to go for a pint or two are equally as important as the punters who want to buy dinner, and at least you can sit in the sunshine outside.



And good ales


----------



## peterkro (Jun 19, 2014)

buscador said:


> Time was when every pub in HH (like HH itself) was tired, dull and tatty, but each had their own character and devotees. You could go to the Brockwell Tavern if you wanted a fight or to meet up with your NF mates, the Half Moon or the Regent if you wanted to play pool, or the Commercial if you wanted a clean seat, cheap lunch and to be near the bookies. Over the years I've been a regular in all of them in their various incarnations, but it's becoming less obvious which is which any more.
> 
> Current best in show is the Regent, despite the appalling state of the toilets, because it seems finally to have realised that people who just want to go for a pint or two are equally as important as the punters who want to buy dinner, and at least you can sit in the sunshine outside.



The Regent wasn't short on NF types either BITD.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 19, 2014)

leanderman said:


> And good ales



nice beer yes. and they are always changing - I love the variety but not everyone is as adventurous. but they often run out of whatever ale your drinking,

And the toilets are atrocious! Ideally I want it clean, with paper, soap, locks, and flushes - doesnt happen often in there. Today it was 2/5


----------



## Manter (Jun 19, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> nice beer yes. and they are always changing - I love the variety but not everyone is as adventurous. but they often run out of whatever ale your drinking,
> 
> And the toilets are atrocious! Ideally I want it clean, with paper, soap, locks, and flushes - doesnt happen often in there. Today it was 2/5


the toilets are… unpredictable.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 19, 2014)

peterkro said:


> The Regent wasn't short on NF types either BITD.


Not in my experience. Few bald headed white guys doesn't make it NF.  But I've only lived in HH since 1994. I didn't find Regent welcoming but no where was back then to gay people. As a gay woman I knew that Brockwell was unsafe by reputation for many years so I refused to even go there.

Started drinking regularly in Regent in late '90s, when it had the campest 'straight' manager ever, who started quiz nights. Love a pub quiz. Regent seemed more racially mixed than some other pubs then.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 19, 2014)

Manter said:


> the toilets are… unpredictable.



That's generous. I can confidently predict it wont have 5 out of 5.


----------



## Manter (Jun 19, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> That's generous. I can confidently predict it wont have 5 out of 5.


Well, there is the 'extra' loo in the end cubicle that has never worked to my knowledge.  And why is it there?  One of life's little mysteries...


----------



## peterkro (Jun 19, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Not in my experience. Few bald headed white guys doesn't make it NF.  But I've only lived in HH since 1994. I didn't find Regent welcoming but no where was back then to gay people. As a gay woman I knew that Brockwell was unsafe by reputation for many years so I refused to even go there.
> 
> Started drinking regularly in Regent in late '90s, when it had the campest 'straight' manager ever, who started quiz nights. Love a pub quiz. Regent seemed more racially mixed than some other pubs then.


Before then back late seventies early eighties was fairly well known for it.(yes I'm as old as the hills).


----------



## gaijingirl (Jun 19, 2014)

Manter said:


> Well, there is the 'extra' loo in the end cubicle that has never worked to my knowledge.  And why is it there?  One of life's little mysteries...



It's for mum's and kids to go together (and girly friends I suppose). It used to work.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 19, 2014)

Manter said:


> Well, there is the 'extra' loo in the end cubicle that has never worked to my knowledge.  And why is it there?  One of life's little mysteries...


It used to. Helpful for mothers and tolders I think, and friends who like to gossip while they piss. It's a useful place to put your handbag.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 19, 2014)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> And the Hamilton if you wanted a drink when the others kicked you out at closing.


The Hammi! I do miss the laid back late night lock ins in there. HH used to be full of illegal after hours drinking dens. No ID required, but having the right friends helped.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 19, 2014)

choochi said:


> I didn't actually go, I just got a flyer through a couple of days beforehand. Not sure which streets they posted flyers on though?


Poets Corner Street Party is generally only advertised in the Poets Corner streets - Chaucer, Spenser, Shakespear, Milton and Regents Road too for some historic reason - by flyers through doors /posters. When it was on our road I made sure near by parts of Railton and Dulwich roads were included too. There used to be a link on HH Forum and they do emails to those who want to get involved.


----------



## Manter (Jun 19, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> It's for mum's and kids to go together (and girly friends I suppose). It used to work.


But the baby changing thing would brain anyone who tried to use it.... A slightly larger cubicle with one loo surely as helpful.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jun 19, 2014)

Manter said:


> But the baby changing thing would brain anyone who tried to use it.... A slightly larger cubicle with one loo surely as helpful.



it wasn't my design!


----------



## technical (Jun 20, 2014)

I can remember watching one of the Eubank - Watson fights in the Regent in the early 90s. It was a lively atmosphere shall we say. Not quite the ambience it has today.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jun 20, 2014)

I used to go to the Half Moon when I was 18.. they had a good comedy night in the back room - saw Jo Brand and all those impro comedians back when it started to become really popular and they were all starting out.  There and the East Dulwich Tavern.  Needless to say Herne Hill and Lordship Lane were very very different places then.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 20, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> I used to go to the Half Moon when I was 18.. they had a good comedy night in the back room - saw Jo Brand and all those impro comedians back when it started to become really popular and they were all starting out.  There and the East Dulwich Tavern.  Needless to say Herne Hill and Lordship Lane were very very different places then.


I remember going there to watch some friends band back in 80s before I lived anywhere near here. It was rather run down but very lively. They used to show lots of new bands.


----------



## shakespearegirl (Jun 20, 2014)

They were very supportive of comedians, especially local ones. I was producing a short film with a couple of local comedians about 12 years ago and they let us use the back room all day for £50..


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 26, 2014)

Is nothing happening in Herne Hill? anything going on soon/ next week?


----------



## uk benzo (Jun 26, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Is nothing happening in Herne Hill? anything going on soon/ next week?



I'll probably stop off at the sainsburys local for some milk, as I'm running low.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jun 26, 2014)

My blokes loos in the Regent are ok, can't say I've ever noticed anything wrong but I don't like the atmosphere in there lately, it seems a bit soulless.


----------



## Manter (Jun 26, 2014)

I got on the train that means I have to get off at Herne Hill, forgot to get off at Herne Hill and ended up in fucking Kent. 

That is my only Herne Hill related news


----------



## leanderman (Jun 26, 2014)

Just been in the Florence. No interesting beers to report.


----------



## Smick (Jun 26, 2014)

Manter said:


> I got on the train that means I have to get off at Herne Hill, forgot to get off at Herne Hill and ended up in fucking Kent.
> 
> That is my only Herne Hill related news


 
Happened to me recently, ended up in East Croydon instead of Tulse Hill. Had to wait in EC for a bit, change at Selhurst.

Thankfully I didn't have my ticket checked.


----------



## Winot (Jun 26, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Just been in the Florence. No interesting beers to report.



No Weasel/Beaver?

(I can never remember which one I like.)


----------



## billythefish (Jun 26, 2014)

sleaterkinney said:


> My blokes loos in the Regent are ok, can't say I've ever noticed anything wrong but I don't like the atmosphere in there lately, it seems a bit soulless.


IIRC there's a very amusing detail where they had to cut the window sill around the tap for the basin. That's the highlight of the Gents loos of Brixton for me.


----------



## Manter (Jun 26, 2014)

Winot said:


> No Weasel/Beaver?
> 
> (I can never remember which one I like.)


Fnarr


----------



## Manter (Jun 26, 2014)

Smick said:


> Happened to me recently, ended up in East Croydon instead of Tulse Hill. Had to wait in EC for a bit, change at Selhurst.
> 
> Thankfully I didn't have my ticket checked.


They wouldn't bollock you* for idiocy would they? You haven't left the station.... You clearly don't want to be in Bromley or Croydon <<shudder>>

*me


----------



## Crispy (Jun 26, 2014)

Manter said:


> They wouldn't bollock you* for idiocy would they? You haven't left the station.... You clearly don't want to be in Bromley or Croydon <<shudder>>
> 
> *me


They can and they do


----------



## Manter (Jun 26, 2014)

Crispy said:


> They can and they do


God. Wankers.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 26, 2014)

Winot said:


> No Weasel/Beaver?
> 
> (I can never remember which one I like.)



Had a couple of pints of Beaver Dam, which also comes in a sparkling variant at £3.90/pt

Both are pretty decent


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 27, 2014)

Crispy said:


> Rumours on the herne hill forum: http://www.hernehillforum.org.uk/community_forum/35/10868
> Good news then, if it's being bought by Spoons. Means it stays a pub and the beer will be cheap.


 
The 'spoons thing is nonsense apparently. They're still pretty much as they were with the insurance, although it's complicated by the estate insisting on turning upstairs into residential which can never be a good thing for a pub.


----------



## buscador (Jun 27, 2014)

Toilet Watch in the Prince Regent - just the one lav functional this evening.


----------



## boohoo (Jun 27, 2014)

buscador said:


> Toilet Watch in the Prince Regent - just the one lav functional this evening.



At least it's not the toilet in the Ship in south Norwood.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 27, 2014)

buscador said:


> Toilet Watch in the Prince Regent - just the one lav functional this evening.


Told the owner I wanted to complain about the loos - he said 'again?' - yes *again*
he said to report it to the (rather busy) staff. It obviously doesnt bother him at all.

The only Herne Hill news is bad toilet news ...


----------



## Ms T (Jun 28, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Told the owner I wanted to complain about the loos - he said 'again?' - yes *again*
> he said to report it to the (rather busy) staff. It obviously doesnt bother him at all.
> 
> The only Herne Hill news is bad toilet news ...


I really don't understand why they don't sort it out.


----------



## T & P (Jun 28, 2014)

I'd leave an upper decker if I were you. Perhaps that'll drive the message home.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 29, 2014)

The Sunday market has applied for planning permission to extend to Saturday (same times) too.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 30, 2014)

T & P said:


> I'd leave an upper decker if I were you. Perhaps that'll drive the message home.



Having just been to the Electric for the first time in decades - at 2.30am their loos still flushed, had paper and soap and were reasonably clean. I've seen the Regent's loos look worse at 6pm. It's not much to ask for.


----------



## Fingers (Jul 4, 2014)

Half Moon update.  Dulwich Estates will be turning the upstairs into flats. The pub will remain a pub - no timescale yet for the reopening but it will reopen in some form or other possibly run by a pubco. This of course means we have lost another live music venue.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 4, 2014)

Fingers said:


> Half Moon update.  Dulwich Estates will be turning the upstairs into flats. The pub will remain a pub - no timescale yet for the reopening but it will reopen in some form or other possibly run by a pubco. This of course means we have lost another live music venue.



Doesnt sound good...


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 6, 2014)

There was a stage and live music going on outside the station when we went past on saturday night - but we were on our way to a party and couldn't hang about. What was going on?

and why hadn't I heard about it - where do they advertise these things? Does anyone know will they be doing anymore outside events there this year?


----------



## Fingers (Jul 6, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> There was a stage and live music going on outside the station when we went past on saturday night - but we were on our way to a party and couldn't hang about. What was going on?
> 
> and why hadn't I heard about it - where do they advertise these things? Does anyone know will they be doing anymore outside events there this year?



It was the a party for the piano's second birthday. Organised by Herne Hill Forum.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 6, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> There was a stage and live music going on outside the station when we went past on saturday night - but we were on our way to a party and couldn't hang about. What was going on?
> 
> and why hadn't I heard about it - where do they advertise these things? Does anyone know will they be doing anymore outside events there this year?



If you sign up to herne Hill forum they send out stuff about it to your email.. I think I got something about it.. i think? will hold my breath and dive into the quagmire that is my hotmail account.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 6, 2014)

Yes.. just checked - that's where the info is coming from.. it was this;

*Picnic for our Piano - it is all happening this Saturday *
Get the party frock out, dust down your dancing shoes - it's a reminder for the Picnic for our Piano this Saturday in Station Square.

Cake, bunting, music, fun and a good old chin-wag with your fellow Herne Hillbilly awaits you. All the stars of the piano will be there, performing just for you, how good is that? The road will be closed, the tables up and ready for your amazing cup cakes, nice neat sandwiches with the crusts cut off and maybe even the occasional strawberry or two. Bring enough to feed you, your family and your new found friends that you will meet on the day. Maybe also bring something to sit on as well, in between all the groovin. It is a share and share alike kind of day.

Did I say dance? well the Lindy Hoppers will be there, strutting their stuff for all to join in with so no excuses - let it all hang out, the next day isn't a school day after all.

It will start around 4.00 p.m. and if the piano survives and doesn't get party fatigue, will be playing away until 8.00. After that the piano will be put back in it's home, tucked up with a nice cup of Horlicks and hopefully will survive the obligatory hangover the next morning.

If you are one of those wonderful people who just want to make things that much better and could help out on the day, maybe even an hour or so then we would love to hear from you. Drop us an e-mail to join the team.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 6, 2014)

This was in the same email:

*Meet the new councillors - tell 'em what we need *
Way back some time in May we all (well some of us) elected a whole bunch of councillors, some new, some back again for one more time. 

Always curious as to what they look like, these upstanding volunteers from our community who want to represent us to the local councils?

Well your chance has come, on July 10th we are holding the Herne Hill Forum AGM where all the new councillors from *Herne Hill, Thurlow Park (Lambeth) and Village Wards (Southwark)* will be attending. The meeting will be all about getting our priorities for the area, what needs fixing, what needs improving, what are the issues and so setting the councillors priorities over the coming years.

It will be a very interactive evening where your ideas for our area will be added to our embryonic Neighbourhood Plan. The local councillors will all be there, discuss with them what you want to see happen, what needs changing. 

As it is also our AGM there will be the chance to get more involved with all the activities and projects that we are working on in the local area by joining the committee. Don't worry if you think it requires endless amounts of time, it doesn't. It just needs whatever input you can give, large or small. Do contact us if you want to join the committee.

We will also be having our special soap box slot - the 3 minutes of fame that you get to talk about any local issue that you want raised. Slots available for the 10th - let us know if you would like to book your 3 mins.

*The meeting is being held on Thursday July 10th, 7.00 p.m.
at St Pauls Church Hall, Herne Hill, SE24 *


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 6, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> This was in the same email:
> 
> *Meet the new councillors - tell 'em what we need *
> Way back some time in May we all (well some of us) elected a whole bunch of councillors, some new, some back again for one more time.
> ...



thanks for that


----------



## Fingers (Jul 6, 2014)

There was some good music but i may be being biased as I know a few of them.  We sat outside the commercial for the last two hours. My drunk gay friend was not so impressed. He stated that it was the result of straight people organising stuff, shortly before he declared Herne Hill as a queer caliphate before staggering off home.


----------



## Greebo (Jul 6, 2014)

Fingers said:


> <snip> My drunk gay friend was not so impressed. He stated that it was the result of straight people organising stuff, shortly before he declared Herne Hill as a queer caliphate before staggering off home.


Drunken fuckwit being drunk and acting like a fuckwit shocker.


----------



## Fingers (Jul 6, 2014)

he was taking the piss out of himself...


----------



## editor (Jul 14, 2014)

I heard that the landlord has definitely walked away from the Half Moon now.


----------



## leanderman (Jul 14, 2014)

editor said:


> I heard that the landlord has definitely walked away from the Half Moon now.



What does this mean?


----------



## editor (Jul 14, 2014)

leanderman said:


> What does this mean?


It's a bit of a half remembered chat (so apologies if the accuracy isn't spot on), but it seems that the current landlord has left/is leaving, and so the pub's future is up in the air.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jul 14, 2014)

I've heard that too. I don't know what the implications are for the pub long term but it's not coming back any time soon.


----------



## Fingers (Jul 14, 2014)

He has left. He has moved to above the Herne Tavern in east Dulwich, a pub he also runs. The upstairs of the Moon will be turned into flats and the pub will stay as a pub. Though I suspect that it will kill the live music off.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 14, 2014)

Fingers said:


> He has left. He has moved to above the Herne Tavern in east Dulwich, a pub he also runs. The upstairs of the Moon will be turned into flats and the pub will stay as a pub. Though I suspect that it will kill the live music off.



What a shame.


----------



## editor (Jul 14, 2014)

Fingers said:


> He has left. He has moved to above the Herne Tavern in east Dulwich, a pub he also runs. The upstairs of the Moon will be turned into flats and the pub will stay as a pub. Though I suspect that it will kill the live music off.


That's just about guaranteed and it's a real shame.


----------



## kennyken (Jul 15, 2014)

That is a real shame, that was my nans local, and was still the last place in herne hill which was a normal pub.
I have to say i used to drink in the brockwell Tav and it didnt have NF in there at all, just locals, i used to enjoy the Hamilton too, didnt often go in the commercial as it was mostly our dads in there, so this NF rumour is not anything i know of.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 15, 2014)

kennyken said:


> That is a real shame, that was my nans local, and was still the last place in herne hill which was a normal pub.
> I have to say i used to drink in the brockwell Tav and it didnt have NF in there at all, just locals, i used to enjoy the Hamilton too, didnt often go in the commercial as it was mostly our dads in there, so this NF rumour is not anything i know of.



That was the news on the gay grapevine circa 1991-4 - did you drink there then? was it not true?  I never dared try.

There was a lot of old guys and one memerable old gal who used to drink regular in the Commercial - that was one of the reasons we used to drink there even though they looked at me like dirt at first. Some of the old guys got friendly and used to talk betting tips with us, very convenient with Tote next door. Was it your dad?

Hammy and Half Moon sadly missed.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 16, 2014)

How are Herne Hill locals feeling about the Lambeth Contry show - looking forward? dreading it? or just pissed off about the parking?

I'm really glad I live close enough to never have to use a portaloo


----------



## Greebo (Jul 16, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> How are Herne Hill locals feeling about the Lambeth Contry show - looking forward? dreading it? or just pissed off about the parking?
> 
> I'm really glad I live close enough to never have to use a portaloo


I'm hoping that the wind blows most of the noise in your (Herne Hill) direction, or for a minor miracle which'll make the weekend cold enough to be able to keep all the windows shut  all day.  No offence, like.  

The times when it hasn't, near this corner of the park, it's been difficult to make phone calls, watch anything, or listen to anything during the hours that the country show's been open.  For an entire weekend.  Plus the evening before because of soundchecks.  Endurable now that the Brockwell Gate chatterati's complaints seem to be listened to (unike those of us council tenants), hence there aren't music events in the park every other summer weekend, like there used to be.


----------



## Dulwich Raider (Jul 23, 2014)

editor said:


> That's just about guaranteed and it's a real shame.



According to the (now ex-) tenant, Dulwich Estate has bought out the remaining lease of The Half Moon pending its attempt to get the upper floors developed into apartments.

In theory, the pub can re-open when this is complete (estimate 2 years), but as other posters have noted it may be in a different form, or even not at all.

I wrote a piece about it here: http://deserter.co.uk/2014/07/is-herne-hill-finished/

TDR


----------



## editor (Jul 23, 2014)

Dulwich Raider said:


> According to the (now ex-) tenant, Dulwich Estate has bought out the remaining lease of The Half Moon pending its attempt to get the upper floors developed into apartments.
> 
> In theory, the pub can re-open when this is complete (estimate 2 years), but as other posters have noted it may be in a different form, or even not at all.
> 
> ...


Cheers for the sad update. I've posted a piece on Brixton Buzz and included a link to your article.  http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2014/07/future-of-the-half-moon-pub-in-herne-hill-in-serious-doubt/


----------



## Rushy (Jul 23, 2014)

Dulwich Raider said:


> According to the (now ex-) tenant, Dulwich Estate has bought out the remaining lease of The Half Moon pending its attempt to get the upper floors developed into apartments.
> 
> In theory, the pub can re-open when this is complete (estimate 2 years), but as other posters have noted it may be in a different form, or even not at all.
> 
> ...


From the comments I suspect that you can count friendofdorothy amongst your followers


----------



## Rushy (Jul 24, 2014)

New coffee shop opening up almost opposite Soft Cuffs.
It's a Brown & Green apparently.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 24, 2014)

Soft Cuffs? 

Is that an OTC typo?

And I'm guessing if so, it's in what used to be the Gerty's Gumballs sweet shop that lasted about a month selling £7 Oreo milkshakes?


----------



## editor (Jul 24, 2014)

Rushy said:


> New coffee shop opening up almost opposite Soft Cuffs.
> It's a Brown & Green apparently.


Waaaaacky!


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jul 24, 2014)

Well, they're happy at least...


----------



## twistedAM (Jul 24, 2014)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Well, they're happy at least...



Yeah if you saw their prices you'd know why. Supposed to be pretty decent though; the yuppie newbies in Palace rate them.


----------



## choochi (Jul 24, 2014)

They were on that Raymond Blanc programme 'The Restaurant' a few years back.


----------



## choochi (Jul 24, 2014)

Anyone know what's opening in the old Tantalizer restaurant?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 24, 2014)

Think I saw something on the HHF re. Tantalizer - but still some sort of food thing. 

Went to the lido for a post work swim - got turned away as it was closed for further admissions (at 6) because of the film screening at nine pm. Not a happy punter. Nothing on the BLU twitter or the lido FB page to say it was closing early. 

On the positive, I bumped into Rushy for the first time in a while - nice to see you, new neighbour! Apologies for still being in my swimming togs.  

If anyone from the pub knows the funeral plans for Terry, can you let me know please?


----------



## Crispy (Jul 24, 2014)

Makerspace is about to move home but we'll be in storage for a month or so. What are the options round here for spaces where you can hold a weekly meeting? Church/community halls etc. As close to the railway bridge/station as poss.


----------



## choochi (Jul 24, 2014)

Crispy said:


> Makerspace is about to move home but we'll be in storage for a month or so. What are the options round here for spaces where you can hold a weekly meeting? Church/community halls etc. As close to the railway bridge/station as poss.



Upstairs at the Regent?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 24, 2014)

I just thought there was a massive fight going on outside, and then realised its the first hostage confrontation scene from Captain Philips being played loudly from the lido.

((poor the somali local kids))


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 24, 2014)

Yup, what choochi said - go and ask Matt at the regent.


----------



## Crispy (Jul 24, 2014)

I thought they charged an arm and a leg, but will ask


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 24, 2014)

Nah, not with Matt - just explain what you're doing and why.


----------



## kennyken (Jul 25, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> That was the news on the gay grapevine circa 1991-4 - did you drink there then? was it not true?  I never dared try.
> 
> There was a lot of old guys and one memerable old gal who used to drink regular in the Commercial - that was one of the reasons we used to drink there even though they looked at me like dirt at first. Some of the old guys got friendly and used to talk betting tips with us, very convenient with Tote next door. Was it your dad?
> 
> Hammy and Half Moon sadly missed.


sorry for later reply, yes i used to drink in those years in the brockwell tav, it was a bit of a dive, but herne hill was very different then, well the residents were.
It also was the pub to play pool in as it had two tables out the back and one was broken for a while you didn't need to put any money in.
i thought it was a real mix, but can understand you why you wouldnt have gone in it wasnt that friendly but it was'nt nf.
Used to bunk into lido back in the day too.
love country show.


----------



## buscador (Jul 26, 2014)

Just had some food from the new(ish) The Cooks' House (by the 37 bus stop). Burmese food apparently. Never been to Burma so can't comment on authenticity, but it was top scoff. Oh, and it was delivered by a man on a bicycle!


----------



## T & P (Jul 27, 2014)

Had a pleasant shopping trip to the Sunday street market, which was very busy. Found all the groceries and homeware I needed, and I even left my bike with the bike people to be serviced.

Even Off The Cuff was doing well with their outside tables all taken. No hats were being worn by anybody.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 30, 2014)

T & P said:


> Even Off The Cuff was doing well with their outside tables all taken. No hats were being worn by anybody.



That's just reckless. Slip slop slap.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 30, 2014)

HH pubs were heaving in last night's sunny weather. 

There were even a few people at OTC, and I even spotted a hat.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 30, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Think I saw something on the HHF re. Tantalizer - but still some sort of food thing.
> 
> Went to the lido for a post work swim - got turned away as it was closed for further admissions (at 6) because of the film screening at nine pm. Not a happy punter. Nothing on the BLU twitter or the lido FB page to say it was closing early.
> 
> ...


Good to see you too! Don't forget about tennis...

I think the new coffee place is in the Tantalizer unit.


----------



## Rushy (Aug 1, 2014)

OK - so best Herne Hill home delivery / take out suggestions please!


----------



## Smick (Aug 1, 2014)

Number 2 Chinese


----------



## buscador (Aug 1, 2014)

dial-a-curry


----------



## Crispy (Aug 1, 2014)

Video Rental Place -> Good Companion Cafe/Furniture Shop -> South London Makerspace -> Cafe with Children's Play Area, so we hear.


----------



## macca4848 (Aug 1, 2014)

Saffron for 'proper' Indian food


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Aug 2, 2014)

buscador said:


> dial-a-curry


Aye, great portions. 

Ken's kicks the shit out of Ollie's.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Aug 2, 2014)

Best chip shop in Herne Hill is the one at the top of the hill IMO.


----------



## wurlycurly (Aug 3, 2014)

Damarr said:


> Aye, great portions.
> 
> Ken's kicks the shit out of Ollie's.



It certainly kicks the shit out of Ollie's prices - £13 for fish, chips and peas is absurd.


----------



## Smick (Aug 3, 2014)

I remember the first time I visited Olleys, I had read all the crap outside about being the best in London and got excited. If I'm honest, the high price served only to make me think it would be really special. In the end, what a let down. Worse than the fish and chips we'd get at school dinners on a Friday. I'd never go back.


----------



## Kevs (Aug 8, 2014)

Anyone know when the pedestrian tunnel will be open again, and why it's shut? Staff at station didn't have a scooby


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 8, 2014)

Nope, no one seems to know what's wrong with it. 

Makes the station non accessible too now, so it must be something serious. 

When did FabBar open up in what was Sebastian's? It was busy last night, as was Bar127.


----------



## Ms T (Aug 8, 2014)

Kevs said:


> Anyone know when the pedestrian tunnel will be open again, and why it's shut? Staff at station didn't have a scooby


Lots of pigeon shit and part of the roof has fallen down. The traders are very upset because it means the cashpoint can't be refilled and it's really affecting business, especially on Sundays. HH is very poorly served for cash points as it is. Now there's only one that works.


----------



## Smick (Aug 9, 2014)

Kevs said:


> Anyone know when the pedestrian tunnel will be open again, and why it's shut? Staff at station didn't have a scooby


 
It's only the Railton Rd entrance, you can still get through if you go into the station.


----------



## Ms T (Aug 9, 2014)

Smick said:


> It's only the Railton Rd entrance, you can still get through if you go into the station.


But in the evening when the station is shut, you have to go all the way round when you get off the train.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Aug 9, 2014)

You guys need http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/the-first-world-problems-of-urban-75.285394/


----------



## Rushy (Aug 10, 2014)

buscador said:


> dial-a-curry


Not sure why - probably the name - but I thought you were joking. But ordered last night and it's great!
Cheers.


----------



## buscador (Aug 10, 2014)

Rushy said:


> Not sure why - probably the name - but I thought you were joking. But ordered last night and it's great!
> Cheers.



Glad you enjoyed it! Definitely belies its somewhat prosaic name.


----------



## Ms T (Aug 10, 2014)

Better than Khan's?


----------



## Rushy (Aug 10, 2014)

I prefer to avoid the more controversial topics on Urban.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Aug 10, 2014)

There were four people in OTC this evening, two of which were wearing hats.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 11, 2014)

Nanker Phelge said:


> You guys need http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/the-first-world-problems-of-urban-75.285394/



Well maybe, but only when the station is open and you can climb two steps - but if you have difficulties with mobility, the 50m trek around to the other side isn't that helpful; no car easy legal car parking for pick up and drop offs around there either.

Something silly is going on - there's now a handwritten notice on the station door with directions to the other entrance; not exactly tfl policy.


----------



## Rushy (Aug 11, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Well maybe, but only when the station is open and you can climb two steps - but if you have difficulties with mobility, the 50m trek around to the other side isn't that helpful; no car easy legal car parking for pick up and drop offs around there either.
> 
> Something silly is going on - there's now a handwritten notice on the station door with directions to the other entrance; not exactly tfl policy.


Some traders were fairly pissed off at the Sunday market. Cash point was not working and tunnel giving short cut to alternative machine was closed so they felt they were losing business.
(Pissing rain can't have been helping!)


----------



## Kevs (Aug 11, 2014)

Yes, when I had family down with mobility issues, the normal stress free journey of Kings cross down here was much more of a pain with the tunnel shut and pullens taking over pretty much the whole pavement.


----------



## Ms Ordinary (Aug 11, 2014)

There's a Kickstarter campaign to make a longer film about the Herne Hill Station piano - the one which is currently blocked off by the closed entrance. Only a few days to go, and they are quite a way off their goal, which is a shame.

[URL]https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1874657036/the-life-of-a-street-piano[/URL]

Is it OK to post the link? If not I'll edit out.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 11, 2014)

Ms Ordinary said:


> There's a Kickstarter campaign to make a longer film about the Herne Hill Station piano - the one which is currently blocked off by the closed entrance. Only a few days to go, and they are quite a way off their goal, which is a shame.
> 
> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1874657036/the-life-of-a-street-piano
> 
> Is it OK to post the link? If not I'll edit out.



I enjoyed the short film they have already done about the Hernehill piano


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Aug 12, 2014)

Rushy said:


> I prefer to avoid the more controversial topics on Urban.


Without fear or favour:

The portions in Khan's have gotten smaller. About three or four years ago I felt like I was going to be sick after a meal (in a good way), but I was only sort of satisfied after my last few visits (most recently about a year ago). I know there's more to a meal than how long you can keep your head in the trough, but a curry + rice + nan from DaC for £10 will easily give two people a good dinner. Not so at Khan's.


----------



## leanderman (Aug 13, 2014)

Damarr said:


> Without fear or favour:
> 
> The portions in Khan's have gotten smaller. About three or four years ago I felt like I was going to be sick after a meal (in a good way), but I was only sort of satisfied after my last few visits (most recently about a year ago). I know there's more to a meal than how long you can keep your head in the trough, but a curry + rice + nan from DaC for £10 will easily give two people a good dinner. Not so at Khan's.



Used Khans twice and was surprised by the (high) cost.


----------



## buscador (Aug 13, 2014)

Not the cost that bothers me as much as the way that every dish tastes the same: balti, dopiaza, bhuna, madras, whatever... Rather like all curry houses they go through chefs and some are better than others, but Khan's has been dull for a while now.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 13, 2014)

Gousia


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 13, 2014)

Khan's isn't even in Herne Hill!


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 13, 2014)

Water Lane innit, so on the cusp


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Aug 13, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> Khan's isn't even in Herne Hill!



They want it all around there....


----------



## shifting gears (Aug 13, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Gousia



Closed.

Was great though... Sad it's gone. Cheap and excellent quality.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 13, 2014)

Really? Wow, that shows me how little curry I eat over a hotter summer.


----------



## Winot (Aug 13, 2014)

buscador said:


> Not the cost that bothers me as much as the way that every dish tastes the same: balti, dopiaza, bhuna, madras, whatever... Rather like all curry houses they go through chefs and some are better than others, but Khan's has been dull for a while now.



Tried Saffron recently on the recommendation of people on here.  More interesting than Khans.


----------



## prunus (Aug 14, 2014)

Winot said:


> Tried Saffron recently on the recommendation of people on here.  More interesting than Khans.



I've said it before and I'll say it again  - Zest of India up in Loughborough Junction; good curry, good ingredients, proper cooking, lovely people.  Give it a try.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 14, 2014)

20+ ten second snippets of Dancing Queen from the Lido last night! 

They must need some practice.


----------



## Kevs (Aug 14, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> 20+ ten second snippets of Dancing Queen from the Lido last night!
> 
> They must need some practice.



I'm going to watch them over a coffee in the cafe next Wednesday. With a large macintosh coat and some sunglasses on. Will report back.


----------



## T & P (Aug 14, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> 20+ ten second snippets of Dancing Queen from the Lido last night!
> 
> They must need some practice.



I'd fight back if I were you. Get a speaker on the window and play snippets of the Crazy Frog soundtrack at the same time, until it occurs to them to lower their volume.


----------



## Kevs (Aug 15, 2014)

looks like they're opening up the tunnel at the station. didn't get a chance to ask but they're tidying up round there


----------



## choochi (Aug 20, 2014)

The tunnel is open again and the cashpoint has been filled up. The new Tesco opens on Friday next door to the Sainsbury's. I wonder how many of the 1000 or so people who signed the petition against it will have shopped in there within the first month?


----------



## T & P (Aug 20, 2014)

I didn't even know they were opening a Tesco in HH. What premises is it taking over?


----------



## choochi (Aug 20, 2014)

T & P said:


> I didn't even know they were opening a Tesco in HH. What premises is it taking over?


It's under the new student accommodation. So like Sainsbury's it will have an entrance on both Milkwood Road and Herne Hill.


----------



## T & P (Aug 20, 2014)

I see... Well, I hope it closes down through lack of sales. Not likely though.


----------



## editor (Aug 20, 2014)

T & P said:


> I see... Well, I hope it closes down through lack of sales. Not likely though.


Convenience (and the power of mass buying) is always a hugely persuasive attribute, and that's why these supermarkets almost always win out in the end.


----------



## buscador (Aug 20, 2014)

T & P said:


> I see... Well, I hope it closes down through lack of sales. Not likely though.



That crappy overpriced Sainsburys is apparently the third highest grossing (by square foot) of their shops in the country. It's very convenient for cutting through to get to the bus stop though.


----------



## Manter (Aug 21, 2014)

Tesco next door to Sainsbury? That's a bit odd


----------



## T & P (Aug 21, 2014)

Manter said:


> Tesco next door to Sainsbury? That's a bit odd


Come to West Norwood and you will see a Sainsbury's, Tesco and Co-op supermarket virtually within metres of each other.


----------



## Rushy (Aug 21, 2014)

T & P said:


> Come to West Norwood and you will see a Sainsbury's, Tesco and Co-op supermarket virtually within metres of each other.


Or Brixton, where we have 2 Sainburys within 50m of eachother.


----------



## Manter (Aug 21, 2014)

Yeah, I know, I do leave my house occasionally 

It's right next door that is a bit 

You can make a (poor) argument that someone getting off the train and walking up towards Brixton road won't walk back to the sainsbury's by the tube, so there is another one. But the right next door thing seems an odd decision


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 21, 2014)

It's not done for the customer's benefit, but for competition reasons. Hotelling's Location Model innit.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 21, 2014)

Technically South London Dance School is between them (what was the post office). 

I'm glad the piano's back.


----------



## Smick (Aug 21, 2014)

Manter said:


> Yeah, I know, I do leave my house occasionally
> 
> It's right next door that is a bit
> 
> You can make a (poor) argument that someone getting off the train and walking up towards Brixton road won't walk back to the sainsbury's by the tube, so there is another one. But the right next door thing seems an odd decision


There are more customers than Sainsbury Can deal with. The shop is constantly overcrowded, queuing, slow. Divvy the custom by two and there is enough profit for both.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 21, 2014)

Smick said:


> There are more customers than Sainsbury Can deal with. The shop is constantly overcrowded, queuing, slow. Divvy the custom by two and there is enough profit for both.


Never understand why people queue in this Sainsbury's when other shops are open nearby. Try going to Costcutter on Halfmoon Lane opposite. More choice of many products, including fairtrade/organic.   A lot of products are cheaper than sainsburys. Ok less fresh food and less ready meals - but really friendly personal service (they keep a particular pickle I love in stock for me) and no queue.


----------



## Smick (Aug 21, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Never understand why people queue in this Sainsbury's when other shops are open nearby. Try going to Costcutter on Halfmoon Lane opposite. More choice of many products, including fairtrade/organic.   A lot of products are cheaper than sainsburys. Ok less fresh food and less ready meals - but really friendly personal service (they keep a particular pickle I love in stock for me) and no queue.


I hate the place, although if it isn't so busy in future,I might be tempted in by the convenience. It's still too expensive anyway.


----------



## colacubes (Aug 21, 2014)

This is the thing with the local/metro stores - they are really fucking expensive.  I realised a year or 2 ago than it's cheaper in M&S in Brixton than it is in the Sainsburys Local opposite for most things.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 21, 2014)

buscador said:


> That crappy overpriced Sainsburys is apparently the third highest grossing (by square foot) of their shops in the country. It's very convenient for cutting through to get to the bus stop though.



Far too expensive. And they nag you to scan your own shopping even when you say 'no' I hate them


----------



## robsean (Aug 22, 2014)

The new Tesco is just LUSH. You're all going to LOVE it.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 22, 2014)

The builders drove into the neighbours wall so many times they abandoned rebuilding it.


----------



## Manter (Aug 22, 2014)

robsean said:


> The new Tesco is just LUSH. You're all going to LOVE it.


Nyuhuh.....


----------



## Greebo (Aug 22, 2014)

robsean said:


> The new Tesco is just LUSH. You're all going to LOVE it.


Oh how sweet, you came all the way here and registered and everything just to say that?


----------



## leanderman (Aug 22, 2014)

Greebo said:


> Oh how sweet, you came all the way here and registered and everything just to say that?




I'm tempted by the £4 off a £12 shop voucher


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 22, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Far too expensive. And they nag you to scan your own shopping even when you say 'no' I hate them


Why say no?


----------



## Smick (Aug 22, 2014)

I went past earlier. Arch of balloons over the door, nice girl at the zebra crossing. Didn't make it in though.


----------



## buscador (Aug 22, 2014)

robsean said:


> The new Tesco is just LUSH. You're all going to LOVE it.



Looking forward to the football tomorrow?


----------



## Fingers (Aug 24, 2014)

robsean said:


> The new Tesco is just LUSH. You're all going to LOVE it.



Seriously? I though you were Ocado boys these days. ;-)   On the plus side, a new cash machine, we just need the pub across the road back now so we can spend money from it!


----------



## robsean (Aug 25, 2014)

Greebo said:


> Oh how sweet, you came all the way here and registered and everything just to say that?
> 
> I had an idle moment to waste and had been meaning to join this circus for a while. That and I'd just been traumatised by being subjected to the oppressive, utilitarian banality of the place in an a failed attempt to secure a packet of jasmine rice. I accept that I was contributorily negligent in my own trauma; I should have gone directly to Londis.


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Aug 25, 2014)

The arrangement of the check-outs is the usual shambles. If you're in the queue, you can't see whether any of the self check-outs are free and there's no room to get past someone who doesn't want to use them. It will be aggro central compared to Sainsburys.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 25, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> Why say no?


 When a woman says no it means NO! ok?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 25, 2014)

Hi robsean
welcome to our world. Couldn't you thing of a more imaginative name?  or is this the urge to merge?


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 25, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> When a woman says no it means NO! ok?


Fair dos but please don't hold up queues unless you're getting fags or vodka


----------



## Ms T (Aug 25, 2014)

The Commercial seem to be having problems with their chef. Had a lacklustre meal a couple of weeks ago, and tonight I had to send my burger back twice because it had been incinerated on the outside and was dry and tasteless on the inside. Not sure how you make a pork and chorizo burger dry and tasteless but they'd managed it. I felt like a wanker sending it back a second time but both my companions agreed it was burnt. The staff were brilliant though - comped me all my drinks and got a free cheese platter.


----------



## editor (Aug 26, 2014)

Ms T said:


> The Commercial seem to be having problems with their chef. Had a lacklustre meal a couple of weeks ago, and tonight I had to send my burger back twice because it had been incinerated on the outside and was dry and tasteless on the inside. Not sure how you make a pork and chorizo burger dry and tasteless but they'd managed it. I felt like a wanker sending it back a second time but both my companions agreed it was burnt. The staff were brilliant though - comped me all my drinks and got a free cheese platter.


Good for you. Most Brits appear to be rubbish at sending back badly cooked food!


----------



## shifting gears (Aug 26, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> Why say no?



In many ways self-scan shopping is an excellent indicator of what's wrong with the world,

Automate a task that a human could do, be paid for etc, and make the customer do the work and yet still pay the same price. Still don't see the problem?

I despise them and yet to my eternal shame, if I'm in a hurry, I still use them. The supermarket wins again.

Ugh.


----------



## choochi (Aug 26, 2014)

One for the parents/carers in the area...

The former good companion/makerspace is going to become Jelly Tots Cafe; a children's play area and cafe for the under 5's. Opens 8th September.

http://www.jellytotscafe.co.uk/ 

No mention of prices as yet.


----------



## T & P (Aug 26, 2014)

shifting gears said:


> In many ways self-scan shopping is an excellent indicator of what's wrong with the world,
> 
> Automate a task that a human could do, be paid for etc, and make the customer do the work and yet still pay the same price. Still don't see the problem?
> 
> ...


In Tulse Hill we are clearly not to be trusted, as the Co-op hasn't got any


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 26, 2014)

shifting gears said:


> In many ways self-scan shopping is an excellent indicator of what's wrong with the world,
> 
> Automate a task that a human could do, be paid for etc, and make the customer do the work and yet still pay the same price. Still don't see the problem?
> 
> ...


They make things easier for everyone and it's a myth that they replace staff


----------



## shifting gears (Aug 26, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> They make things easier for everyone and it's a myth that they replace staff



I've yet to read anything convincing to that effect.


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 26, 2014)

Well I like them at any rate. Prefer them even.


----------



## T & P (Aug 26, 2014)

The only time when I prefer them is at the end of the month, when I'm really skint and have to either put purchases of 80p on a card, or pay with shit loads of coppers and loose change- saves the embarassement 

Otherwise they are much slower than a manned checkout at the best of times, and rare is the transaction in which human intervention is not required anyway, whether because approval is needed, 'unexpected items in bagging area', or some other bullshit.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Aug 26, 2014)

I tried the new Tesco today and watched a woman ask a few of the staff if they had any aubergines.  None of them knew what they were.


----------



## SpamMisery (Aug 26, 2014)

I like them. You can throw in a suitcase full of coppers and it counts it for you. I'm too English to try paying for a £20 shop in shrapnel; imagine the tutting and evil glares from those behind you in the queue.


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Aug 26, 2014)

Tesco trip report: They reduce their sandwiches/salads/sushi to clear, which I've never seen in the Sainsburys (plus their lunch stuff is shit anyway). 

I got one of these fancy sandwiches in a stupid bag for 75p. I might start buying all of my lunches the evening before.


----------



## Smick (Aug 26, 2014)

or stick £1.50 in for £1.80's worth of groceries and do the remaining 30p on the debit card because you have neither enough in your account nor in your pocket for a loaf and a pint of milk.


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 26, 2014)

Or you can gamble on your card being accepted without embarrassment


----------



## Smick (Aug 26, 2014)

Also, when hot UK deals days there is a glitch in the pricing, you can go and stick 5 chocolate oranges through and when it comes up as 40p for the lot, you can walk off with your receipt, happy knowing that you have paid for them. Instead of having some hag refuse to sell you them.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 28, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> Well I like them at any rate. Prefer them even.


  I prefer people, at least they don't say 'UNEXPECTED ITEM IN THE BAGGING AREA!'  everytime I rest my handbag/put my brolley down/ drop my keys, etc



Orang Utan said:


> Or you can gamble on your card being accepted without embarrassment


 Doesn't the machine it announce it to the whole shop?


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 28, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> I prefer people, at least they don't say 'UNEXPECTED ITEM IN THE BAGGING AREA!'  everytime I rest my handbag/put my brolley down/ drop my keys, etc
> 
> Doesn't the machine it announce it to the whole shop?


No. Sainsbury's does announce that you are buying booze, which is a bit annoying and embarrassing when you are buying 8 bottles of it, as it announces it each time you swipe one. 

BTW I prefer people generally too, but I'm not so Luddite I refuse to use a self-service till. I take what's most convenient.


----------



## T & P (Aug 28, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> I prefer people, at least they don't say 'UNEXPECTED ITEM IN THE BAGGING AREA!'  everytime I rest my handbag/put my brolley down/ drop my keys, etc


 And sometimes it's their own plastic bags that trigger the weight warning in question, when there's a big bunch of them resting on the scales plate


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Aug 28, 2014)

This is a thread that just keeps on giving.....


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 28, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> No. Sainsbury's does announce that you are buying booze, which is a bit annoying and embarrassing when you are buying 8 bottles of it, as it announces it each time you swipe one.
> 
> BTW I prefer people generally too, but I'm not so Luddite I refuse to use a self-service till. I take what's most convenient.



Luddite and proud. If the shop wants me to do all the work I want them to pay me.


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 28, 2014)

Work!


----------



## shifting gears (Aug 28, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> Work!



So by that logic, people who work on a till checkout aren't actually 'working' ?


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 28, 2014)

shifting gears said:


> So by that logic, people who work on a till checkout aren't actually 'working' ?


I don't see the convenience and advantages of self-service as work. Doing it all day and having to deal with intransigent luddites (  ), drunks, idiots and shitty managers all day is certainly work and not much fun or well compensated.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 29, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> I don't see the convenience and advantages of self-service as work. Doing it all day and having to deal with intransigent luddites (  ), drunks, idiots and shitty managers all day is certainly work and not much fun or well compensated.


Intransigent luddite and proud!


----------



## choochi (Aug 29, 2014)

It looks like the market at Herne Hill is going to be running on Saturday and Sunday now as a planning application for this has been accepted.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 29, 2014)

And yet Elaine told me that was all a fallacy - i think it's the option to have it on a Saturday not a plan to have it regularly.


----------



## choochi (Aug 29, 2014)

Ah, it didn't mention that in the planning application. So it's not every Saturday then? Who is it that decides when something is put on anyway?


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 29, 2014)

I don't think most of the traders actually wanted it twice a week. 

And I think there's a little cabal of Herne Hill Forum people and traders who manage the market side of things along with the other fêtes, festivals etc. as that's a funded little local community org. 

I was glad to see grumpy Egg Man wasn't there last week. He's grumpy.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 29, 2014)

Anyone know what's being built in the park by the railway? It's pretty big.

I saw some theatre flyer, but had assumed that was all based in the lido.


----------



## macca4848 (Aug 29, 2014)

http://www.londonpopups.com/2014/08/oatlys-break-fest-festival-in-brockwell.html

Oatlys Break-fest?


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 30, 2014)

Anyone know the swedIsh for WTF?


----------



## Ms T (Aug 30, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Anyone know the swedIsh for WTF?


X2


----------



## Orang Utan (Aug 30, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Anyone know the swedIsh for WTF?


 Gersh gurndy morn-dee burn-dee, burn-dee, flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip.


----------



## Kevs (Aug 30, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> Gersh gurndy morn-dee burn-dee, burn-dee, flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip-flip.


that's a bit like what the bass from the park sounds like to my hungover noggin. this corporate breakfast festival sounds very Florence and the machine / gospel from the disturbed comfort of my bed

still, free pancakes


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 30, 2014)

My headache also didnt need that 9.30 sound check


----------



## Kevs (Aug 30, 2014)

Went along for free food. Was told ticket holders only until later, and a lady told me about the benefits of a nutritious drink that hasn't "been through a cow"

sounds rank


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Aug 30, 2014)

macca4848 said:


> http://www.londonpopups.com/2014/08/oatlys-break-fest-festival-in-brockwell.html
> 
> Oatlys Break-fest?


Something this incomprehensible has to be completely contrived.


----------



## Rushy (Aug 30, 2014)

"Promises to be London's greatest ever breakfast..."

Ok then.


----------



## SpamMisery (Aug 30, 2014)

Rushy said:


> "Promises to be London's greatest ever breakfast..."
> 
> Ok then.



For me, that would be Dishoom. Sausage and Egg Naan Roll


http://www.dishoom.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/140619_Dishoom_Breakfast_Menu.pdf


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 30, 2014)

SpamMisery said:


> For me, that would be Dishoom. Sausage and Egg Naan Roll
> 
> 
> http://www.dishoom.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/140619_Dishoom_Breakfast_Menu.pdf



Sounds lovely - not very convenient for Herne Hill though.


----------



## SpamMisery (Aug 30, 2014)

Good point. Well made


----------



## Rushy (Aug 30, 2014)

Just ran past. looks pleasant enough but not many people inside.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 30, 2014)

Seems a peculiar vanity project - still not many people, pretty generic scandi rock, and jumping rabbits.

 4 chunky security blokes and more fencing than needed.


----------



## Rushy (Aug 30, 2014)

So whilst i was running past and then posting about it, my gf had wandered inside and was busy munching away through free muffins and coffee. Apparently the free pancakes were amazing but the queues were a bit too long. Brought home an armful of samples. Cant say I'm an immediate convert to the oaty drink stuff but not bad on the whole.


----------



## Kevs (Sep 2, 2014)

Loads of police cars, marked and unmarked, in Brockwell park right now. As in roaming over the grass. Cracking down on late afternoon drinking?


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Sep 2, 2014)

According to a reliable source (men drinking lager on a bench) someone had their bag nicked and the police chased them across the park.  They think the robber dropped something so there were tonnes of police to stop people walking over the crime scene.


----------



## T & P (Sep 6, 2014)

Just now there is an air ambulance that's landed on Brockwell Park, very close to the Herne Hill entrance. Does anyone know what's happened?


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 8, 2014)

So on a rare (unfortunately)  trip to the regent on Saturday, I was able to get an update on the planned improvements to the pub. Ladies is getting a new dyson  type hand dryer this week. The roof has finally been fixed which should stop the leaks and they are planning on upgrading the outside space too


----------



## Manter (Sep 17, 2014)

choochi said:


> One for the parents/carers in the area...
> 
> The former good companion/makerspace is going to become Jelly Tots Cafe; a children's play area and cafe for the under 5's. Opens 8th September.
> 
> ...


I went there today- really impressed. It's £1.95 for under 1s and £3.95 for older children, and they have a loyalty scheme so 5th play is free. We got there at 10, stayed till 1.... Lovely big room, lots of toys, a really good soft play bit, plus tables and chairs for story time or craft, mini cooker, chalkboard, Wendy house, inflate able ball pit thing, and a big basket of toys. It was pleasantly busy, not earsplittingly so like the rec one.

Had some lunch there too, they have a good selection covering both healthy and treats. We had a big plate of humus,carrot sticks, pita and cucumber for £2.95, enough to feed 2 babies and for both mums to snack on.

Staff are really lovely too.   

I hope they do well!


----------



## editor (Sep 18, 2014)

Some evening photos: http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2014/09/an-evening-stroll-around-herne-hill-south-london-photos/


----------



## gaijingirl (Sep 18, 2014)

Manter said:


> I went there today- really impressed. It's £1.95 for under 1s and £3.95 for older children, and they have a loyalty scheme so 5th play is free. We got there at 10, stayed till 1.... Lovely big room, lots of toys, a really good soft play bit, plus tables and chairs for story time or craft, mini cooker, chalkboard, Wendy house, inflate able ball pit thing, and a big basket of toys. It was pleasantly busy, not earsplittingly so like the rec one.
> 
> Had some lunch there too, they have a good selection covering both healthy and treats. We had a big plate of humus,carrot sticks, pita and cucumber for £2.95, enough to feed 2 babies and for both mums to snack on.
> 
> ...



oh that's good to know.  Will check it out.  Actually my mum has E tomorrow so I might send her down - very easy for her that would be.


----------



## Rushy (Sep 18, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> oh that's good to know.  Will check it out.  Actually my mum has E tomorrow so I might send her down - very easy for her that would be.


Easy but not altogether ethical. Anyway, I thought kids had moved onto other stuff.


----------



## gaijingirl (Sep 18, 2014)

Rushy said:


> Easy but not altogether ethical. Anyway, I thought kids had moved onto other stuff.



What?


----------



## Rushy (Sep 18, 2014)

editor said:


> Some evening photos: http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2014/09/an-evening-stroll-around-herne-hill-south-london-photos/


Just helped lift that black and white shop dresser into a van, destined for a new record collector's shop opening somewhere behind Trafalgar Square. It came out of the Steam Laundry on Coldharbour Lane.


----------



## Rushy (Sep 18, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> What?


----------



## ash (Sep 18, 2014)

editor said:


> Some evening photos: http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2014/09/an-evening-stroll-around-herne-hill-south-london-photos/



When researching family history at the metropolitan archives I had access to the 'workhouse' admission records for lambeth new school. In 1890 a boy was found wondering in Herne Hill age 5, he couldn't give his name and was taken to the school/workhouse where they named him Herne Hill.  I wonder if there is a South London   Hill family related to him??


----------



## Smick (Sep 18, 2014)

Maybe a relation of Jimmy.


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 19, 2014)

Manter said:


> I went there today- really impressed. It's £1.95 for under 1s and £3.95 for older children, and they have a loyalty scheme so 5th play is free. We got there at 10, stayed till 1.... Lovely big room, lots of toys, a really good soft play bit, plus tables and chairs for story time or craft, mini cooker, chalkboard, Wendy house, inflate able ball pit thing, and a big basket of toys. It was pleasantly busy, not earsplittingly so like the rec one.
> 
> Had some lunch there too, they have a good selection covering both healthy and treats. We had a big plate of humus,carrot sticks, pita and cucumber for £2.95, enough to feed 2 babies and for both mums to snack on.
> 
> ...



Went down to have a look this aternoon and agree with all of this.  Plus cake and coffee for 3 pounds and quite a lot of books too.


----------



## gaijingirl (Sep 19, 2014)

we went down today too and it is indeed very nice - albeit very small.  The only problem for us is that at there's not really enough there to keep our kids happy - it's definitely more for under 2s.  My 4 year old certainly wouldn't be kept busy by it.  My 2.5 year old was ok but got bored quite quickly - although I think had she gone with another child that age it would have been better.  As it was, there was just 2 other small babies there.  

I thought it was very nicely done though and very calm and peaceful - staff were lovely.  I might well go down with friends who have children of a similar age to my 2 year old so they have company.


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 20, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> we went down today too and it is indeed very nice - albeit very small.  The only problem for us is that at there's not really enough there to keep our kids happy - it's definitely more for under 2s.  My 4 year old certainly wouldn't be kept busy by it.  My 2.5 year old was ok but got bored quite quickly - although I think had she gone with another child that age it would have been better.  As it was, there was just 2 other small babies there.
> 
> I thought it was very nicely done though and very calm and peaceful - staff were lovely.  I might well go down with friends who have children of a similar age to my 2 year old so they have company.



Yes - I think it's more of a place to have a coffee that's super kid-friendly than somewhere to go just for a play.


----------



## Ms T (Sep 21, 2014)

We tried some of the Burmese dishes from the newish takeaway on Dulwich Rd last night, The Cook's House. Really tasty and quite reasonably priced.


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 21, 2014)

Ms T said:


> We tried some of the Burmese dishes from the newish takeaway on Dulwich Rd last night, The Cook's House. Really tasty and quite reasonably priced.



I thought that looked new.  What is Burmese food like?  Dont think I've ever tried it.


----------



## Ms T (Sep 21, 2014)

brixtonblade said:


> I thought that looked new.  What is Burmese food like?  Dont think I've ever tried it.


It's quite diverse with Thai, Indian and Chinese influences. We had Burmese satay (spicy), stir-fried chicken with pickled greens (tasty), prawn curry (big juicy prawns) and slow-cooked aubergine.  They use a lot of fish sauce, I think, soy sauce and shrimp paste but you can ask for veggie versions. I want to try the rice noodle dishes, and the pickled tea leaf salad, which is a Burmese speciality.

First time for me with Burmese food too and I enjoyed it. There's an Indian menu too.


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 21, 2014)

Sounds good - going to give it a try


----------



## Ms T (Sep 24, 2014)

The HH fountain of all knowledge (Elaine) tells me that the old Tantaliser restaurant across from the station is to become a fish restaurant. It's been refurb end and will open next month.


----------



## T & P (Sep 24, 2014)

Fish and chips type? Or a proper expensive sort?


----------



## Biddlybee (Sep 24, 2014)

brixtonblade said:


> Yes - I think it's more of a place to have a coffee that's super kid-friendly than somewhere to go just for a play.


Bugger, I was hoping for it to be somewhere I could go on a miserable Friday... although tbh I don't find the rec bad.


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 24, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> Bugger, I was hoping for it to be somewhere I could go on a miserable Friday... although tbh I don't find the rec bad.



You could definitely kill an hour or so there - I wouldnt want to put you off checking it out


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 24, 2014)

Ms T said:


> The HH fountain of all knowledge (Elaine) tells me that the old Tantaliser restaurant across from the station is to become a fish restaurant. It's been refurb end and will open next month.



What's going on with the old fish shop? There were signs of new builders in there recently. 

A Jaunty Hat shop. That's what I'm hoping for. That's what Herne Hill needs.


----------



## Ms T (Sep 24, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> What's going on with the old fish shop? There were signs of new builders in there recently.
> 
> A Jaunty Hat shop. That's what I'm hoping for. That's what Herne Hill needs.


I will consult the oracle.


----------



## nagapie (Sep 24, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> Bugger, I was hoping for it to be somewhere I could go on a miserable Friday... although tbh I don't find the rec bad.



I think it would be fine for squidge, although the rec is ace. This might be more restful for you due to the coffee and cake situation.


----------



## Biddlybee (Sep 24, 2014)

She goes in the big kids bit at the rec  

I know I'm probably seeing you on Sunday, but fancy coffee and cake on Friday?


----------



## choochi (Sep 24, 2014)

Ms T said:


> The HH fountain of all knowledge (Elaine) tells me that the old Tantaliser restaurant across from the station is to become a fish restaurant. It's been refurb end and will open next month.


 
Yumm! I've been wondering what was going to open there.


----------



## Manter (Sep 24, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> Bugger, I was hoping for it to be somewhere I could go on a miserable Friday... although tbh I don't find the rec bad.


I think it's be perfect for squidge- J loves it


----------



## nagapie (Sep 24, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> She goes in the big kids bit at the rec
> 
> I know I'm probably seeing you on Sunday, but fancy coffee and cake on Friday?



I have to go shopping on Friday to find work clothes Coffee and cake soon though!


----------



## gaijingirl (Sep 24, 2014)

Biddlybee said:


> Bugger, I was hoping for it to be somewhere I could go on a miserable Friday... although tbh I don't find the rec bad.



I'd say squidge is the perfect age for it!


----------



## Biddlybee (Sep 25, 2014)

Manter said:


> I think it's be perfect for squidge- J loves it





gaijingirl said:


> I'd say squidge is the perfect age for it!


 I'll give it a go then. 


nagapie said:


> I have to go shopping on Friday to find work clothes Coffee and cake soon though!


Commiserations


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Sep 25, 2014)

There's a car and motorcycle crash causing chaos on the Norwood Road. The rider was on his back but had his legs up, so at least he was conscious. 

It happened about 50ft behind me and it was hard to tell how it unfolded - I think the rider was moving up the middle of the road to get past the traffic when the car pulled out to do the same as the impact point is the car driver's door. This is only a guess, of course.


----------



## Biddlybee (Sep 26, 2014)

So, I went to Jellytots today, and it was quite nice. Turns out I know the woman who runs it, from baby groups we went to together when I was on mat leave. Chatted to some random nice mums and dads, and had a quite nice coffee. The cheese toasties looked good (and cheap) but it's not really fair me eating cheese around her 

I think she was a bit restless, can't put my finger on why. Didn't seem to enjoy it as much as the park or the rec, but could be her teething, or anything really. Will pop in again.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Sep 27, 2014)

Regents Ladies toilet update. Last cubicle (the one that didn't work for years) is out of order already. 
On the plus side the new dyson hand-drier works well.


----------



## goldengraham (Oct 3, 2014)

Does anyone know when the water main works on Turney Road will be completed? They are causing quite a remarkable amount of traffic chaos in and around Herne Hill


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 13, 2014)

Gerty's Gumballs has become a mobile phone repair shop for those in need of mobile repairs.


----------



## BoxRoom (Oct 15, 2014)

Not going to be a Weatherspoons then. Some Half Moon news:
http://www.hernehillforum.org.uk/news/half-moon-pub-update-dulwich-estate


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Oct 15, 2014)

The Wetherspoons rumour didn't last long tbh. it's good news if they're thinking of uses other than flats upstairs though.

In related news Number 22 is open again. I think that just leaves the Moon.


----------



## Crispy (Oct 15, 2014)

Good to hear the residential conversion was turned down at pre-planning


----------



## Fingers (Oct 15, 2014)

Pleased to read that. I would have thought that the ideal conversion would be office space and if it is not going to be residential, this may save one of the last live pub venues in the area.

There have been various plans to turn various parts of the upper floors into office space since the boxing club went but none of them got off the ground for various reasons.


----------



## Fingers (Oct 15, 2014)

Oh and good on the squatters, I had heard all sorts of bullshit about how trashed the place was and how much had been stolen. Some utter bullshit flies round Herne Hill. 

I suspect that a pub chain will snap it up (Antic/Green King/Weatherspoons ) so I am not sure it will be so 'independent' as it was before.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Oct 15, 2014)

Sounds like it won't reopen until 2016/2017


----------



## CH1 (Oct 18, 2014)

Saw a para in today's Standard about Tony Lynes, but this give a clearer picture: http://www.communitytvtrust.org/?p=1186
The Guardian did an obituary because he was active in the Child Poverty Action Group. http://paulflynnmp.typepad.com/my_weblog/2014/10/guardian-angel.html
Seems from other Google entries that Tony also supported Cooltan Arts.
Tony was a Southwark resident, but had the misfortune to die on Herne Hill.

Would that we all made such contributions to society.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 19, 2014)

CH1 said:


> Saw a para in today's Standard about Tony Lynes, but this give a clearer picture: http://www.communitytvtrust.org/?p=1186
> The Guardian did an obituary because he was active in the Child Poverty Action Group. http://paulflynnmp.typepad.com/my_weblog/2014/10/guardian-angel.html
> Seems from other Google entries that Tony also supported Cooltan Arts.
> Tony was a Southwark resident, but had the misfortune to die on Herne Hill.
> ...



Just outside The Prince Regent on Dulwich Road, there is a police board up asking for witnesses.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 29, 2014)

*Herne Hill Stitch and Bitch is moving to the Effra Social tonight. *
Anyone interested in knitting, crochet, quilting, embroidery, sewing etc is welcome - with or without a project. Come along for a chat or advice from some of our more expert stitchers - Everyone is welcome. We meet every wednesday from 8pm. Just turn up.

The Prince Regent, were we've been meeting since the Half Moon was flooded, keep having live music on random wednesdays so we couldn't hear ourselves bitchin, and the bad Rolling Stones covers really annoyed some of the ladies. 

Not sure if its a permanent move yet but I'll keep you posted.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 30, 2014)

We liked our visit to the Effra Social - they put several tabled together in the middle of the big room and turned up the lights above. And it was 'Burger Wednesday' and the beer was great.

Stitch and Bitch have decided to have a rare break next week - as it is the 5th of November and the fireworks will be on in the park, but after that we'll give it a go at the Effra Social every Wednesday for the next couple of months before making any permanent decision on venue. New people always welcome.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 30, 2014)

I went along the open party at the South London Makerspace in there new arch behind costcutter on Norword Road last night too. Nice interesting creative people and they had some really good, very local beer (made by their near neighbours). Nice big space but they have a lot of work to do before its usable. Thanks Crispy


----------



## sleaterkinney (Oct 31, 2014)

We've been picked clean by the trick or treaters already, there seems to be loads out.


----------



## brixtonblade (Oct 31, 2014)

Havent had a single one.

Means I get to eat a load of sweets though so not complaining.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2014)

sleaterkinney said:


> We've been picked clean by the trick or treaters already, there seems to be loads out.


I hid indoors! there seemed to be crowds of them shrieking outside.  No one knocked on the door for which I was glad.  
Makes me feel cumudgeonly and old - it's all so american and we didnt do that in my day...


----------



## Orang Utan (Nov 1, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> I hid indoors! there seemed to be crowds of them shrieking outside.  No one knocked on the door for which I was glad.
> Makes me feel cumudgeonly and old - it's all so american and we didnt do that in my day...


It's not American. It's Scottish. I'm 41 and we did it as far back as the 70s and my mum did it when she was a lass.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> It's not American. It's Scottish. I'm 41 and we did it as far back as the 70s and my mum did it when she was a lass.


Well I'm obviously more curmudgeonly than you. 

In the grim industrial town where I grew up the most we ever did on halloween was duck for apples. Perhaps we weren't allowed to go knocking on doors because the Moors murders were still fresh in the minds of my parents, who obviously never did such things as a children as the war was on.  

But mostly we were too busy making mis-shapen cadavers from old clothes and newspapers and begging money from strangers to buy fireworks.


----------



## Orang Utan (Nov 1, 2014)

Don't blame you for not answering the door.
In my first year in Brixton, I got loads of sweets in only to get blank stares from the unaccompanied kids who knocked on the door. They'd look at you in disdain and then ask 'haven't you got any money?'
I didn't bother after that.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> It's not American. It's Scottish,



Have just heard on R4 News Quiz that the jack-o-lantern tradition started in Scotland with turnips.


----------



## Orang Utan (Nov 1, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Have just heard on R4 News Quiz that the jack-o-lantern tradition started in Scotland with turnips.


Irish actually:
http://www.irishcentral.com/roots/h...re-truly-horrifying-and-made-of-turnips-.html


----------



## Me76 (Nov 1, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> Irish actually:
> http://www.irishcentral.com/roots/h...re-truly-horrifying-and-made-of-turnips-.html
> View attachment 63256


That's much more scary than a pumpkin.


----------



## Smick (Nov 1, 2014)

The English always had Bonfire Night to look forward to. Us Irish were not too keen on burning effigies of an Irish nationalist so Halloween was the focus for us. We'd try to get fireworks, do Halloween rhyming instead of penny for the Guy.

I think they are too close to do both.


----------



## leanderman (Nov 2, 2014)

Smick said:


> The English always had Bonfire Night to look forward to. Us Irish were not too keen on burning effigies of an Irish nationalist so Halloween was the focus for us. We'd try to get fireworks, do Halloween rhyming instead of penny for the Guy.
> 
> I think they are too close to do both.



Which Irish nationalist?


----------



## Smick (Nov 2, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Which Irish nationalist?


Guy Fawkes. Or, like most Irish, have I got all the facts wrong and have been party to a mass incorrect shoulder chip?


----------



## Smick (Nov 2, 2014)

Just checked it out and he is not Irish. He's a Catholic though which runs very deep in Ireland.

The only place I would ever have seen doing 5th November fireworks near Belfast would have been for the people living in Palace Barracks in Holywood.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 2, 2014)

I'm Irish and we've always had bonfire night.


----------



## Smick (Nov 2, 2014)

sleaterkinney said:


> I'm Irish and we've always had bonfire night.


in Ireland? On the 5th November?


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 2, 2014)

Smick said:


> in Ireland? On the 5th November?


Not on the 5th, no, i misread your post.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 8, 2014)

Ouch, according to Twitter, via Brixtonblog, Fire Brigade crews currently trying to free a man impaled on the Brockwell Park fence. Looks like he tried to climb and fell.


----------



## zenie (Nov 8, 2014)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Ouch, according to Twitter, via Brixtonblog, Fire Brigade crews currently trying to free a man impaled on the Brockwell Park fence. Looks like he tried to climb and fell.


Bloody hell poor guy! 

Has the emporium (the junk shop) shut down, or is the owner just on holiday? Anyone know?


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 8, 2014)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Ouch, according to Twitter, via Brixtonblog, Fire Brigade crews currently trying to free a man impaled on the Brockwell Park fence. Looks like he tried to climb and fell.



oh christ...


----------



## Belushi (Nov 8, 2014)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Ouch, according to Twitter, via Brixtonblog, Fire Brigade crews currently trying to free a man impaled on the Brockwell Park fence. Looks like he tried to climb and fell.



Crikey, hope they can get him off and patched up.


----------



## Fingers (Nov 8, 2014)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Ouch, according to Twitter, via Brixtonblog, Fire Brigade crews currently trying to free a man impaled on the Brockwell Park fence. Looks like he tried to climb and fell.



I saw a bloke impalled on the fences last year, I was walking past just as the fire brigade and ambulance turned up to get him off. one would hope it is not the same man,


----------



## Smick (Nov 8, 2014)

I saw an ambulance at the park, around the Rosendale Rd at about 9.45 this morning. No fire engine though.

There really are quite a few entrances to the park. If you're agile enough to climb a fence, you'd think you could walk another 200m to the nearest gate.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 8, 2014)

Smick said:


> I saw an ambulance at the park, around the Rosendale Rd at about 9.45 this morning. No fire engine though.
> 
> There really are quite a few entrances to the park. If you're agile enough to climb a fence, you'd think you could walk another 200m to the nearest gate.


Maybe he's been there all night.


----------



## Fingers (Nov 8, 2014)

HH now has it's 4th free cash machine. Outside the Costcutter/Post Office. and it gives fivers out for those who like to live by the seat of their pants.


----------



## Smick (Nov 8, 2014)

Fingers said:


> HH now has it's 4th free cash machine. Outside the Costcutter/Post Office. and it gives fivers out for those who like to live by the seat of their pants.


Is it Post Office branded?


----------



## Fingers (Nov 8, 2014)

Smick said:


> Is it Post Office branded?



Yes so it is probably run by the Bank of Ireland


----------



## Smick (Nov 8, 2014)

Cool. I wonder if the Tulse Hill post office one will start to give fivers. That can come in handy.


----------



## T & P (Nov 8, 2014)

Many an end of the month, the cash machine at the Esso/ Tesco Express garage on Tulse Hill has thrown me a lifeline by allowing me to withdraw just £5  It's good to see others are following suit.


----------



## Fingers (Nov 8, 2014)

Tulse hill one does not I think.  I have never had fivers.  I asked the one for fifty today and got a twenty two tens and a couple of fivers


----------



## Smick (Nov 8, 2014)

I like to see a bank machine give me a variety of notes, but I hate going to a Tesco self service and being given 50p as a 20, 2 10s, a 5 and 5 1s, which invariably happens.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Nov 10, 2014)

I like being charged, especially when its £1.99. If that was the charge and you took out a fiver that would be a bit much though.


----------



## Smick (Nov 10, 2014)

They make a fortune already by giving you the money and can make more by providing balance enquiries or doing pin resets. That's why some of the free ones ask you three or four times whether you want your balance or a receipt.

I'm not sure why, but I always make sure I don't check my balance or get a receipt off those ones.


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 13, 2014)

Difficult to know where to put this really as it crosses a fair few chitter chatter threads but on the Crystal Palace mum's forum these two posts were made yesterday (wednesday)..

"Don't want to scare people but there has been a number of bag snatches in the past week. Today alone I was the fifth one. The gang are on 3 motorcycles with white helmuts with 2 per motorcycle. I had mine snatched outside Sydenham Hill station and the gang headed back up towards CP. Just please be careful."

"Re previously posted mugging by 3 men on mopeds . I have been advised by My daughters school another mum was mugged on croxted road this am by three men on mopeds - please watch out everyone - police advised this was 7th incident. X"

Anyway - it looks like they didn't catch the guys because I just got this email from my daughter's nursery today in Herne Hill (Thursday)

"We are alerting parents of a series of muggings / attempted muggings that took place this morning around Turney Road / Croxted Road and Lordship Lane.
We have been alerted to 7 incidents, this includes (parents of my daughter's nursery). The victims were targeted by 3 men on mopeds. Please remain vigilant! "

Yeah.. so hold on to your bags!


----------



## editor (Nov 17, 2014)

If anyone is looking for a pop up in a South London conservatory and has £35 to spare...


> Forgotten Grapes presents "Georgian Grapes" - an evening of exploring food and wine from this hidden Caucasian gem. The evening will be part-wine tasting part-dinner and a great chance to meet new people as well as sample some great food and wine.
> 
> Georgia has a viticulture that stretches back over 8000 years and even today, the majority of wines are made by small growers using indigenous grapes and ancient techniques. The result - a truly unique and undiscovered wine scene. Let Felix, our resident wine expert, guide you through 5 Georgian wines to be enjoyed with the meal. - See more at: http://grubclub.com/forgotten-grapes-georgian-grapes/1906#sthash.5phXGi6T.dpuf


http://grubclub.com/forgotten-grapes-georgian-grapes/1906


----------



## T & P (Nov 17, 2014)

Will there be hats?


----------



## Manter (Nov 17, 2014)

Fingers said:


> Tulse hill one does not I think.  I have never had fivers.  I asked the one for fifty today and got a twenty two tens and a couple of fivers


I read that as 22x tens. That sounded good for a £50 withdrawal.


----------



## Manter (Nov 17, 2014)

editor said:


> If anyone is looking for a pop up in a South London conservatory and has £35 to spare...
> 
> http://grubclub.com/forgotten-grapes-georgian-grapes/1906


I've been to Georgia and the food is stunning. The wine has an incredibly long heritage (we visited a pre-roman wine cellar still in use) but recently tended to focus on the Russian palate which is, er, not similar to ours, but after the breakup of the Ussr a few vineyards formed partnerships with German and Italian winemakers and there is some really exciting stuff being made. After the most recent war, the Russians have banned import of Georgian wine, water and food- exports which were the backbone of the Georgian economy. Hopefully this sort of thing turning up on the foodie circuit means they are finding alternative markets. 

We're away otherwise we'd find the money to go to this- it's great to see them starting to export, hopefully it'll bring some money into what is still a desperately poor region and help them build long term business. 

Incidentally, Georgia is also the most beautiful place I have ever been, one of the most interesting and the people were without exception warm, welcoming and charming. We're going back and I can't bloody wait.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 17, 2014)

Lambeth Council are doing a consultation on turning Carnegie Library into a community hub: 

http://friendsofcarnegielibrary.org.uk/


----------



## Rushy (Nov 17, 2014)

Manter said:


> I've been to Georgia and the food is stunning. The wine has an incredibly long heritage (we visited a pre-roman wine cellar still in use) but recently tended to focus on the Russian palate which is, er, not similar to ours, but after the breakup of the Ussr a few vineyards formed partnerships with German and Italian winemakers and there is some really exciting stuff being made. After the most recent war, the Russians have banned import of Georgian wine, water and food- exports which were the backbone of the Georgian economy. Hopefully this sort of thing turning up on the foodie circuit means they are finding alternative markets.
> 
> We're away otherwise we'd find the money to go to this- it's great to see them starting to export, hopefully it'll bring some money into what is still a desperately poor region and help them build long term business.
> 
> Incidentally, Georgia is also the most beautiful place I have ever been, one of the most interesting and the people were without exception warm, welcoming and charming. We're going back and I can't bloody wait.


It's stunning. I spent a couple of  days driving through between  Turkey and  Armenia. Batumi was a bit weird. Half bomb site. Half Russian Gucci paradise. Don't expect the A1 to be quite like ours. We managed about 5 mph and the suspension never recovered. I did get to dance with a man with an axe when we stopped to tighten the brakes though. 

I find the whole restaurant in someone's living room thing a bit uncomfortable although I enjoyed Saltoun supper club. Might give this a go if the tickets have not all gone by the time I stop procrastinating.


----------



## Fingers (Nov 17, 2014)

Manter said:


> I read that as 22x tens. That sounded good for a £50 withdrawal.



Got to admit, I may have been utterly shitfaced when I posted that!


----------



## Greebo (Nov 17, 2014)

sleaterkinney said:


> Lambeth Council are doing a consultation on turning Carnegie Library into a community hub:
> 
> http://friendsofcarnegielibrary.org.uk/


Like what happened to St Martins library after a few years of it having been closed?  They can fuck right off!


----------



## Manter (Nov 17, 2014)

Rushy said:


> It's stunning. I spent a couple of  days driving through between  Turkey and  Armenia. Batumi was a bit weird. Half bomb site. Half Russian Gucci paradise. Don't expect the A1 to be quite like ours. We managed about 5 mph and the suspension never recovered. I did get to dance with a man with an axe when we stopped to tighten the brakes though.
> 
> I find the whole restaurant in someone's living room thing a bit uncomfortable although I enjoyed Saltoun supper club. Might give this a go if the tickets have not all gone by the time I stop procrastinating.


Go! Tell me all about it afterwards  and make me jealous!

//nothing to do with Herne Hill
Ha.... I remember the A1. We hired a car in Tbilisi- when we turned up to collect it the guy looked really startled as I think he thought the booking was a prank. He asked us to come back in an hour and when we did he had an off white Toyota with a cracked windscreen and a pair of knickers in the glove compartment we're fairly sure he had borrowed from a mate. The thing was indestructible- we did the military highway mid snowmelt, we went up to svaneti, we (accidentally) went to South Ossetia.... It was ace.  We took the sleeper overnight between Tbilisi and Yerevan, that was brilliant, too. I like the fact you see such layers of history, scenery, politics etc (I studied the region so am either the best or worst travel companion, depending on your pov)


----------



## Rushy (Nov 17, 2014)

Manter said:


> Go! Tell me all about it afterwards  and make me jealous!
> 
> //nothing to do with Herne Hill
> Ha.... I remember the A1. We hired a car in Tbilisi- when we turned up to collect it the guy looked really startled as I think he thought the booking was a prank. He asked us to come back in an hour and when we did he had an off white Toyota with a cracked windscreen and a pair of knickers in the glove compartment we're fairly sure he had borrowed from a mate. The thing was indestructible- we did the military highway mid snowmelt, we went up to svaneti, we (accidentally) went to South Ossetia.... It was ace.  We took the sleeper overnight between Tbilisi and Yerevan, that was brilliant, too. I like the fact you see such layers of history, scenery, politics etc (I studied the region so am either the best or worst travel companion, depending on your pov)


Sounds ace. And that's far more sensible that a 1987 automatic Bedford ambulance (without knickers).


----------



## Ms T (Nov 18, 2014)

Georgian food was the only decent grub I ate when living in Moscow. I still dream of hatchipuri (cheesy flatbread). I really wanted to go but it was too dangerous at the time.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 18, 2014)

((Herne Hill))

New plans to refurb the railway bridge:







Although where the traffic / street signage / traffic lights etc are is anyone's guess.


----------



## Crispy (Nov 18, 2014)

Plans by whom? With what funding? More info needed.


----------



## editor (Nov 18, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> ((Herne Hill))
> 
> New plans to refurb the railway bridge:
> 
> ...


Because that's *exactly* how it will look if it gets built!


----------



## Rushy (Nov 18, 2014)

All that image is missing is Dorothy Toto and the yellow brick road!


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 18, 2014)

Crispy said:


> Plans by whom? With what funding? More info needed.



Herne Hill Forum people in conjunction with Network Rail I assume:
http://www.hernehillforum.org.uk/community_forum/37/12029 

Some more ideas (and they're all ideas at this stage) on that link including:


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 18, 2014)

Oh and the station's getting a revamp back to its illustrious Victorian ticket hall days. 

I've always wondered what's upstairs now - I'm assuming empty?


----------



## Crispy (Nov 18, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Oh and the station's getting a revamp back to its illustrious Victorian ticket hall days.
> 
> I've always wondered what's upstairs now - I'm assuming empty?


Empty, yes. It was NR offices for a while. There's a complete lack of photos online, but I'm told it's a huge space.


----------



## editor (Nov 18, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Oh and the station's getting a revamp back to its illustrious Victorian ticket hall days.


Tis a stunning building


----------



## editor (Nov 18, 2014)

Lovely!

A bit about current plans for the route: http://www.londonreconnections.com/2012/unlocking-herne-hill-and-the-kent-route-to-the-city-2/


----------



## buscador (Nov 18, 2014)

Rushy said:


> All that image is missing is Dorothy Toto and the yellow brick road!


Woof!


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 18, 2014)

editor said:


> Lovely! A bit about current plans for the route: http://www.londonreconnections.com/2012/unlocking-herne-hill-and-the-kent-route-to-the-city-2/



I like the Arches to Let sign. Little did they know that jaunty hats would make a comeback. 

On that related topic, I was tickled to see that although OTC snuck themselves in somehow on a long list for the TimeOut awards they didn't get a prize. The Regent staff went to the awards do last night, so I suspect some sore heads are being nursed today.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 18, 2014)

Crispy said:


> Empty, yes. It was NR offices for a while. There's a complete lack of photos online, but I'm told it's a huge space.


When I was a kid I always wanted to live in it. There or the elec substation on the Hayes line


----------



## Rushy (Nov 18, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> When I was a kid I always wanted to live in it. There or the elec substation on the Hayes line


Have you seen the converted electric (I think) building at the end of Pulross Rd? If has a large feature window straight onto the track. Lovely conversion.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 18, 2014)

This one?

I only seem to ever go down there drunk, on a bicycle and lost and then realise I've done exactly the same thing before.


----------



## Winot (Nov 18, 2014)

Rushy said:


> Have you seen the converted electric (I think) building at the end of Pulross Rd? If has a large feature window straight onto the track. Lovely conversion.



They did a few Open Houses in the early days - was interesting seeing the project year-on-year.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 18, 2014)

Winot said:


> They did a few Open Houses in the early days - was interesting seeing the project year-on-year.


Yes. That's how I saw it. Perfect for a trainspotter  I'd imagine!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 18, 2014)

Rushy said:


> All that image is missing is Dorothy Toto and the yellow brick road!





buscador said:


> Woof!



Theres no place like home...


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 22, 2014)

Have just seen flyers for Movember swim thing at Lido on 30th November 10am -12, with prizes for best taches.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 23, 2014)

There were a few swimmers today - probably a more sensible option than being clothed out in this rain.


----------



## Manter (Nov 23, 2014)

Ms T said:


> Georgian food was the only decent grub I ate when living in Moscow. I still dream of hatchipuri (cheesy flatbread). I really wanted to go but it was too dangerous at the time.


We should all go! hendo can babysit while we have nights out in the old town


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 30, 2014)

Went to the launch of Canopy Beer last night - they're in the arches behind costcutter / old? makerspace on Norwood Road. 

Two good beers - an IPA and a more Belgian amber ale, which was a bit dangerously drinkable. The sell sets of bottles or casks, and from the local shops. Lots of people from the velodrome, who always looks _slightly _different when not dressed in lycra. 

canopybeer.com


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Nov 30, 2014)

snowy_again said:


> Oh and the station's getting a revamp back to its illustrious Victorian ticket hall days.


Is there any more info on this? I'm hoping the canopy will be coming back from wherever it has been hiding for the past few weeks.


----------



## paolo (Dec 3, 2014)

Fingers said:


> Tulse hill one does not I think.  I have never had fivers.  I asked the one for fifty today and got a twenty two tens and a couple of fivers



"Drivin' big cars, spendin' twenties and tens"

And fivers.


----------



## Ms T (Dec 3, 2014)

New fish restaurant is opening tomorrow in the old Tantaliser site.


----------



## gaijingirl (Dec 3, 2014)

Fish & Wine!


----------



## leanderman (Dec 3, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> Fish & Wine!



Just about my two favourite things. And the prices look just about bearable.


----------



## Ms T (Dec 4, 2014)

leanderman said:


> Just about my two favourite things. And the prices look just about bearable.


I will think of you at lunchtime as I tuck into my seafood lunch in France! Waiting at the tunnel ATM...


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 4, 2014)

Ms T said:


> I will think of you at lunchtime as I tuck into my seafood lunch in France! Waiting at the tunnel ATM...


I hope you remembered your sandwiches!


----------



## Fingers (Dec 4, 2014)

Fuck wine and cheese and fish and wine. pretentious shit. I want cheese and fish. wankers.


----------



## Smick (Dec 4, 2014)

They've got it right on lordship lane. Kebab and wine. Although I have to admit, it's usually been kebab and a can of Fosters that I've had in there.


----------



## Ms T (Dec 5, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> I hope you remembered your sandwiches!


----------



## nagapie (Dec 5, 2014)

Orang Utan said:


> I hope you remembered your sandwiches!



But you'll be able to eat them if she forgot them.


----------



## Orang Utan (Dec 5, 2014)

nagapie said:


> But you'll be able to eat them if she forgot them.


There is a LOT of cured meat in the fridge.
Well, for now anyway....


----------



## sleaterkinney (Dec 13, 2014)

The Christmas fair is on today:


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 13, 2014)

oh dear I forgot all about this. Anyone go? Was it any good?


----------



## Manter (Dec 13, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> oh dear I forgot all about this. Anyone go? Was it any good?


I did- was surprisingly good. Some really lovely things as well as the standard 'vintage' tat- and loads of stalls too. Right the way up to Olly's and nearly to Tales on Moon Lane as well as along Railton. And some great local choirs singing carols outside the closed pub. Rather lovely really.


----------



## Manter (Dec 13, 2014)

Only thing missing is they needed a stall selling mulled wine!


----------



## Smick (Dec 13, 2014)

I think the Commercial might have been selling it. Definitely advertising mulled cider. I took my daughter round and did the treasure hunt. They did a wonderful face paint in Slique Salon for free, as well as giving candy canes. Bon Velo gave out free sweets.

It was good.


----------



## Manter (Dec 13, 2014)

Smick said:


> I think the Commercial might have been selling it. Definitely advertising mulled cider. I took my daughter round and did the treasure hunt. They did a wonderful face paint in Slique Salon for free, as well as giving candy canes. Bon Velo gave out free sweets.
> 
> It was good.


You need an outside stall selling it so you can smell it walking round


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 17, 2014)

Anyone know which pubs are open xmas day in herne hill? Anyone going for a drink then?
Commercial always used to be (but I got fed up of drinking there some time ago)


----------



## gaijingirl (Dec 17, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> Anyone know which pubs are open xmas day in herne hill? Anyone going for a drink then?
> Commercial always used to be (but I got fed up of drinking there some time ago)



well it's between the Commercial and the Prince Regent isn't it?  Commercial was open last year for sure.  Up the road the Tulse Hill Hotel is open.  Dunno if the REgent is open?
.. ah forgot The Florence because it's so awful - but shut anyway by the looks of it.


----------



## Smick (Dec 18, 2014)

Is the THH open to all and sundry or only those doing the Christmas lunch?


----------



## snowy_again (Dec 18, 2014)

Regent won't be open.


----------



## gaijingirl (Dec 18, 2014)

Smick said:


> Is the THH open to all and sundry or only those doing the Christmas lunch?



I don't know - I assumed since they're open for lunch that the bar would be open too - I've not actually been there yet, but that would seem sensible to me.  But then I don't run a pub.


----------



## Smick (Dec 18, 2014)

I think their offering looks nice but £85 (£75 + 12.5%) a head before you buy a drink is steep.


----------



## gaijingirl (Dec 18, 2014)

Smick said:


> I think their offering looks nice but £85 (£75 + 12.5%) a head before you buy a drink is steep.



par for the course it seems.. same prices last year at The Rosendale - The Commercial in HH was £50 p/head.  But - as i said on a different thread, I suppose they have to pay their staff very well to work on that day.

but yes - it's a lot of money.


----------



## gaijingirl (Dec 29, 2014)

boohoo and I are gonna check out the Tulse Hill hotel for a drink tonight - approx 7:30pm if anyone fancies joining us friendofdorothy buscador Manter   - sorry rushing to go out so not much time for lots of tagging... please tag others.


----------



## snowy_again (Dec 29, 2014)

So the Commercial was open on Christmas Day.

Are any of the pubs doing free entry on NYE?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 29, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> boohoo and I are gonna check out the Tulse Hill hotel for a drink tonight - approx 7:30pm if anyone fancies joining us friendofdorothy buscador Manter   - sorry rushing to go out so not much time for lots of tagging... please tag others.


Thanks for the invite - buscador is quite keen, but it's an ordinary work week for me, so definitely maybe.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 29, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> boohoo and I are gonna check out the Tulse Hill hotel for a drink tonight - approx 7:30pm if anyone fancies joining us friendofdorothy buscador Manter   - sorry rushing to go out so not much time for lots of tagging... please tag others.


snowy_again do you ever venture that far? Fingers?


----------



## Fingers (Dec 29, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> snowy_again do you ever venture that far? Fingers?



I would very much like to but have something else already planned.  I may drop in late and see if you are still there!


----------



## Manter (Dec 29, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> boohoo and I are gonna check out the Tulse Hill hotel for a drink tonight - approx 7:30pm if anyone fancies joining us friendofdorothy buscador Manter   - sorry rushing to go out so not much time for lots of tagging... please tag others.


We are unlikely to home before 7, and after the car journey from hell C may not forgive me if I go out.... I'll try and persuade him though as I want to try it!


----------



## snowy_again (Dec 30, 2014)

friendofdorothy said:


> snowy_again do you ever venture that far? Fingers?



I do, but I'm back at work already, which has been making me incredibly bad company. Next time.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 31, 2014)

gaijingirl said:


> boohoo and I are gonna check out the Tulse Hill hotel for a drink tonight - approx 7:30pm if anyone fancies joining us friendofdorothy buscador Manter   - sorry rushing to go out so not much time for lots of tagging... please tag others.


Sorry we didn't make it afterall - I've been at work, 6am starts for me - its all getting a bit much sorry


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 14, 2015)

Depressing news from the HH forum newsletter:

"The big news on the street is that Network Rail have served notice to all the Station Square shops from the Launderette to Bleu, as well as the off-license in the Milkwood Road arches. 

Yes, it doesn't get much bigger than that. Network Rail wants to bring the first and second floors of these shop units back into use, and have promised they’ll support or compensate businesses whilst works are undertaken. But we share everyone’s worries about the impact this will have on our longest established traders, who are such a key part of Herne Hill. We’ll do all we can to work with the traders and Network Rail to make sure their interests are protected and the Square remains a stronghold of independent business and trade. If you think the big chain coffee firms are rubbing their hands and moving in, get ready for the battle.

This comes on top of the summer of Bridge repairs happening and the revamp of the station to change the booking hall layout, restore many of the historic features and provide a larger cafe facility inside the station.

Three major disruptions to the area that will impact on the traders and local life - potentially a perfect storm for Herne Hill."


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 14, 2015)

oh good grief - that doesn't sound like fun...


----------



## Ms T (Jan 14, 2015)

Yes, I heard about this the other day.  They're all worried that it will be an excuse to raise rents and force them out.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 14, 2015)

I'd wondered why the fishmongers was taking so long to re-occupy. I had a gander around the upstairs to the solicitors when Blue had a weekend of using their premises - they need a lot of TLC.


----------



## buscador (Jan 15, 2015)

It's appalling how poorly kept that parade of shops has been. I was in the butcher's once when it was raining through the ceiling. They had to move all the meat into the middle of the shop because the window display was drowning.


----------



## buscador (Jan 15, 2015)

Oh, and is something going on at the Ladbroke's on Norwood Rd? Went past the other day and it looked empty and as if it had been divided into two units. Surely HH isn't the only place in the country to be losing bookies?


----------



## leanderman (Jan 15, 2015)

Anyone tried the new fish and wine place opposite the station?


----------



## choochi (Jan 15, 2015)

buscador said:


> Oh, and is something going on at the Ladbroke's on Norwood Rd? Went past the other day and it looked empty and as if it had been divided into two units. Surely HH isn't the only place in the country to be losing bookies?



Yes Ladbrokes has gone. The unit has been split into two and now have a To Let sign up.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 15, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> Depressing news from the HH forum newsletter:
> 
> "The big news on the street is that Network Rail have served notice to all the Station Square shops from the Launderette to Bleu, as well as the off-license in the Milkwood Road arches.
> 
> ...


Thanks for posting that Snowy.  I wonder what they want to use the first and second floors for? office or residential?


----------



## Ms T (Jan 16, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Anyone tried the new fish and wine place opposite the station?


Went last week. Very good if a little pricey but fish is never cheap. Also busy on a cold and windy Friday in January so best to book.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 21, 2015)

Traffic jams all around HH this afternoon. They are resurfacing the road on Dulwich road so a bit long stretch of it is one way traffic with traffic lights. They were doing infront of the Florence when I when I was walking by at 3pm and had got nearly as far as the Regent just a few minutes ago. All bus stops 'not in use' and traffic backed up as far as I could see Dulwich road/Norwood road and as all the way up Herne Hill.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 21, 2015)

Also noticed there is a new barber in the small shop next to the Prov. Looks much bigger than it used to - they have done it up nicely. No customers in there just a young man looking a bit bored.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 26, 2015)

Anyone heard any gossip about what's going on with the old Ladbrooks - I see it's become 2 units with agents boards up now (to let?). Any one know if there's been any interest?

What would HH urbz like them to be?


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Jan 27, 2015)

Maybe this was talked about elsewhere but here is a shared ownership bonanza on Milkwood Road ->

Currell Flats

These seem genuinely affordable if you have a stable job of course.


----------



## CH1 (Jan 27, 2015)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Maybe this was talked about elsewhere but here is a shared ownership bonanza on Milkwood Road ->
> Currell Flats
> These seem genuinely affordable if you have a stable job of course.


No idea if these are any good - but it is off plan. In other words looks like you reserve a "plot" with a deposit and then have the right to buy later on.
Why don't they say who the promoter is - e.g. Notting Hill Housing does this type of thing in HH ward.


----------



## Biddlybee (Jan 27, 2015)

They're Peabody afaik.

How are they so cheap? Or is that the owned share of a shared ownership property?


----------



## CH1 (Jan 27, 2015)

Biddlybee said:


> They're Peabody afaik.
> 
> How are they so cheap? Or is that the owned share of a shared ownership property?


Quite likely its either a half or quarter share.
I would say if it was a quarter share its not really cheap at all. Unless you hold with the current fashion that property always goes up.

That said I know (vaguely from my previous job) someone who bought a shared ownership flat 10 years ago in Hanover Court, Brixton Station Road (Barrington Road end) - facing the railway arches.

When I bumped into her recently she cheerfully said she was moving & buying a house in Uckfield. So shared ownership in a "less desirable location" paid off for her - over 10 years.


----------



## Biddlybee (Jan 28, 2015)

> Full market value of £420,000
> 
> £126,000 represents a minimum share of 30%.


 So when you work out mortgage + rent it really doesn't make it that affordable after all.


----------



## wtfftw (Jan 28, 2015)

The rent is 2.5% of the unowned share. + service charge.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 28, 2015)

My mum did shared ownership and it did work out well for her - otherwise she could not have bought at all. She had been in a council flat that she hated.  Obviously you end up spending more in the long run though.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jan 28, 2015)

And the flats are beside the railway line, but it's worth checking out.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 28, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> And the flats are beside the railway line, but it's worth checking out.


A mate has just bought a new build backing onto a railway line in Hither Green. When the windows are closed you can't even hear them pass. They love it.

Another friend bought a Notting Hill Housing Trust flat on shared ownership in Balham 10 years ago - it has worked out very nicely for her. She was a child minder and could not have got a mortgage on a whole flat. She recently sold it and moved abroad.


----------



## CH1 (Jan 28, 2015)

Rushy said:


> A mate has just bought a new build backing onto a railway line in Hither Green. When the windows are closed you can't even hear them pass. They love it.
> 
> Another friend bought a Notting Hill Housing Trust flat on shared ownership in Balham 10 years ago - it has worked out very nicely for her. She was a child minder and could not have got a mortgage on a whole flat. She recently sold it and moved abroad.


Worked for me, though the trains are about 20 metres above my house on a viaduct at the back so I can't produce those train spotting photos you get from teuchter and editor.

I get some vibration - but you get used to that after a while.


----------



## Ms T (Jan 28, 2015)

We get some vibration (in the middle of the night from the heavy goods trains) and the railway is across the road and behind a row of houses!


----------



## Biddlybee (Jan 28, 2015)

wtfftw said:


> The rent is 2.5% of the unowned share. + service charge.


yep + mortgage = still unaffordable for a lot of people.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 28, 2015)

Biddlybee said:


> How are they so cheap?



isn't it shame that £113,750 - £137,500 is now 'cheap'. Still they look like nice ordinary homes lovely to see something that isn't luxury or up market for a change.


----------



## editor (Feb 9, 2015)

A sheep with flags on its head. 







Photo feature: Herne Hill market and a sheep with flags on its head


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 9, 2015)

editor said:


> A sheep with flags on its head.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


what english sheep related charity would that be? 

Hardcore cider looks interesting - was that £4 for a pint?


----------



## Dexter Deadwood (Feb 11, 2015)

They are still there;


----------



## Fingers (Feb 11, 2015)

friendofdorothy Are you coming to Champion hill this evening? bonus points if you can drag the R&S duo down

http://www.urban75.net/forums/threa...dly-11th-feb-2015.331657/page-3#post-13716946


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 11, 2015)

Fingers said:


> friendofdorothy Are you coming to Champion hill this evening? bonus points if you can drag the R&S duo down
> 
> http://www.urban75.net/forums/threa...dly-11th-feb-2015.331657/page-3#post-13716946


Sorry bit short notice and a bit chilly for me, and buscador only just recovered from flu.
Good luck getting robsean Hope the match goes well.


----------



## Dulwich Raider (Feb 12, 2015)

Brixton (and Herne Hill) Arches Shame

I wrote a piece for Deserter about Network Rail's plans for Brixton and Herne Hill:

http://deserter.co.uk/2015/02/brixton-arches-shame/

Petition link in the piece.

TDR


----------



## choochi (Feb 16, 2015)

According to the Herne Hill Forum the former Escape/Poet/Jazz on the Hill/Bar 216 is to be taken over by the people from the Railway Tavern in Tulse Hill.


----------



## Crispy (Feb 16, 2015)

choochi said:


> According to the Herne Hill Forum the former Escape/Poet/Jazz on the Hill/Bar 216 is to be taken over by the people from the Railway Tavern in Tulse Hill.


I went on gmaps to have a look at the propery and wondered "Hmm. do they have access to that carpark/yard at the back?
Well it turns out they don't, because that site had planning permission granted last year for 3 flats.
 
http://planning.lambeth.gov.uk/onli...iveTab=externalDocuments&keyVal=N0U92OBO67000


----------



## leanderman (Feb 16, 2015)

Crispy said:


> I went on gmaps to have a look at the propery and wondered "Hmm. do they have access to that carpark/yard at the back?
> Well it turns out they don't, because that site had planning permission granted last year for 3 flats.
> View attachment 67795
> http://planning.lambeth.gov.uk/onli...iveTab=externalDocuments&keyVal=N0U92OBO67000



Infilling going on everywhere you look, around here. 

Brixton Tube is going to get even more fun in the morning!


----------



## Dulwich Raider (Feb 19, 2015)

Hi, 

I have updated my piece about Herne Hill from last year. 

It now includes updates on the Half Moon and the evictions on Railton Road. 

[deserter.co.uk] 

TDR


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 19, 2015)

Just a quick reminder:

*Herne Hill Stitch and Bitch* is now very comfy in its new home at the Effra Social 
(formerly at the Regent, previously at the Half Moon)
Every Wednesday eves from 8ish - just turn up

They call us the Brixton Knitting Group - but we still sew, crochet, quilt, etc - basically we're happily stitching and bitching.
*Everyone* welcome - with or without projects


----------



## Tricky Skills (Feb 22, 2015)

It looks like the Sunday market will officially get formal status when the Licensing Committee meets next week. A tender to manage the market will then follow.

BBuzz piece.


----------



## Dexter Deadwood (Feb 22, 2015)

Market was very busy again today, lots of lovely smells.
Popped into that little book shop as well to get a birthday present for my sister.


----------



## ringo (Feb 24, 2015)

The iron railings around Brockwell Park are in a right state. Quite a lot of rust where the paint has peeled away. I'm sure I remember them being painted years ago but Lambeth have really let them go.


----------



## ringo (Feb 24, 2015)

The gates and railings near the Herne Hill entrance were painted green when the corner was changed but they didn't bother with the rest.


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## friendofdorothy (Mar 1, 2015)

I realised that I'm really missing the Half Moon - I hardly ever go into HH now its gone. Sad.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 4, 2015)

A friend and I went to the Florence for a Sunday roast at the weekend. It was abysmal. We both ordered the 'nut roast' of which there were no nuts but contained coriander. I don't want coriander in my Sunday roast! Saying that this element was the most flavoursome of the lot.  The rest of the food was really bland, I spent most of the meal sprinkling salt and pepper over it.

The gravy was watery and tasteless; everything was totally bland, maybe there's a salt shortage in the Herne Hill...

Even the meat gravy was watery and flavourless. Sauces are such an important element when learning how to cook, that's why many restaurants have a sauce section. I doubt the so called chefs in the Florence are professionally trained as no chef in their right mind would allow the food I ate today to be served. Maybe they just hadn't tasted as they cooked, another poor sign.

Why is there always a distinct lack of veg whenever I eat roasts outside the home. I really don't understand why.

I had stopped eating roasts out as I get so disappointed, I don't know what possessed me to today. Never again.


----------



## Smick (Mar 4, 2015)

It has never been great. I used to be hooked in with the big yorkshires, but the meats were all awful and portions meagre. And the yorkshire would be stale. Get six pints into me and I'd forget how bad it was and do it again. The meat probably started off well and was just left to fester for hours.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 4, 2015)

Smick said:


> It has never been great. I used to be hooked in with the big yorkshires, but the meats were all awful and portions meagre. And the yorkshire would be stale. Get six pints into me and I'd forget how bad it was and do it again. The meat probably started off well and was just left to fester for hours.


Agreed and definitely so re the Yorkshires. Once again, it's not all about size...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 5, 2015)

Do you people ever stop eating...?


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Mar 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> A friend and I went to the Florence for a Sunday roast at the weekend. It was abysmal. We both ordered the 'nut roast' of which there were no nuts but contained coriander. I don't want coriander in my Sunday roast! Saying that this element was the most flavoursome of the lot.  The rest of the food was really bland, I spent most of the meal sprinkling salt and pepper over it.
> 
> The gravy was watery and tasteless; everything was totally bland, maybe there's a salt shortage in the Herne Hill...
> 
> ...


Haven't been for a while but The Cambria roasts have never let me down.


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## friendofdorothy (Mar 5, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Do you people ever stop eating...?


I generally eat everyday. Don't you?


----------



## BoxRoom (Mar 5, 2015)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> Haven't been for a while but The Cambria roasts have never let me down.


I was unlucky at the Cambria. Looking at my plate trying to figure out what those interesting dark things were, turned out they were potatoes. Was rank.
Have had better luck at The Tiger and The Sun. Tiger tend to overcook their yorkies a bit sometimes but at least they're home made 
Haven't been to The Sun for a while so can't really comment on how they're doing at the moment.


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## Nanker Phelge (Mar 5, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I generally eat everyday. Don't you?



Not everyday....most days...


----------



## Maharani (Mar 5, 2015)

BoxRoom said:


> I was unlucky at the Cambria. Looking at my plate trying to figure out what those interesting dark things were, turned out they were potatoes. Was rank.
> Have had better luck at The Tiger and The Sun. Tiger tend to overcook their yorkies a bit sometimes but at least they're home made
> Haven't been to The Sun for a while so can't really comment on how they're doing at the moment.


Nobody's convincing me now...it's home roasts all the way now.


----------



## BoxRoom (Mar 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Nobody's convincing me now...it's home roasts all the way now.


I really don't blame you.
Have had some nice roasts out but far too few and even then it was "Yeah, nice but, y'know, yeah. *shrugs" Not all that."


----------



## Maharani (Mar 5, 2015)

BoxRoom said:


> I really don't blame you.
> Have had some nice roasts out but far too few and even then it was "Yeah, nice but, y'know, yeah. *shrugs" Not all that."


The last hald decent one I had was at the Crooked Well, Camberwell...but like I said, it was only half decent and at £15+ I expect to have my boat float...


----------



## BoxRoom (Mar 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> The last hald decent one I had was at the Crooked Well, Camberwell...but like I said, it was only half decent and at £15+ I expect to have my boat float...


Been tempted to try there! But the prices have always held me back.


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## ringo (Mar 6, 2015)

I used to go to the Cambria quite a bit when I lived over that way - always nice. Not that cheap, don;t know if they're still  more expensive than everywhere else, but nowhere is cheap any more.

The Crooked Well is worth a treat, great food the one time I went.


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## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

ringo said:


> I used to go to the Cambria quite a bit when I lived over that way - always nice. Not that cheap, don;t know if they're still  more expensive than everywhere else, but nowhere is cheap any more.
> 
> The Crooked Well is worth a treat, great food the one time I went.


I don't mind paying if they provide the goodies...


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## prunus (Mar 6, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Nobody's convincing me now...it's home roasts all the way now.



Had a decent one at the bell in Walthamstow the other day - generous portions of everything, lots (and lots) of veg, good yorkshires, excellent gravy.  If pushed to quibble, potatoes were perhaps a smidgen less cooked than is my preference, but a very tiny smidgen. 

Not quite in Herne hill I will admit.


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## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

prunus said:


> Had a decent one at the bell in Walthamstow the other day - generous portions of everything, lots (and lots) of veg, good yorkshires, excellent gravy.  If pushed to quibble, potatoes were perhaps a smidgen less cooked than is my preference, but a very tiny smidgen.
> 
> Not quite in Herne hill I will admit.


Waltham where???! How dare you talk of a North London establishment here.


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## Ms T (Mar 6, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Nobody's convincing me now...it's home roasts all the way now.


I never have a roast dinner out. It's not a terribly exciting thing to eat anyway, and definitely best made at home. Apparently they do a good one at the Camberwell Arms. The food there is amazing anyway...


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## han (Mar 6, 2015)

I agree, the best roast dinner is homemade.


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## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

Ms T said:


> I never have a roast dinner out. It's not a terribly exciting thing to eat anyway, and definitely best made at home. Apparently they do a good one at the Camberwell Arms. The food there is amazing anyway...


It's exciting if you know how to make it exciting...like anything really...


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## brixtonblade (Mar 6, 2015)

Half the fun is the leftovers so home wins every time


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## technical (Mar 6, 2015)

I have never had a decent Yorkshire pudding with a roast dinner in a London pub - and I've lived here nearly 30 years.


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## Nanker Phelge (Mar 6, 2015)

Now that's a fucking roast dinner, yer shower of posh fannies...


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## ringo (Mar 6, 2015)

Not enough foam


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## Manter (Mar 6, 2015)

When my gran was in hospital my granddad used to eat boil in the bag roast dinners. <<shudder>>


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## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Now that's a fucking roast dinner, yer shower of posh fannies...


Rant, rave, rant, rave.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Now that's a fucking roast dinner, yer shower of posh fannies...


Bernard Matthews? Ahhhhh


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 6, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Now that's a fucking roast dinner, yer shower of posh fannies...




waffley versatile!


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## Nanker Phelge (Mar 6, 2015)

Manter said:


> When my gran was in hospital my granddad used to eat boil in the bag roast dinners. <<shudder>>



They aint so bad....people fought 2 world wars for that kinda freedom


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## Nanker Phelge (Mar 6, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> waffley versatile!



grill em, bake em, fry em, eat em


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## gaijingirl (Mar 6, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> grill em, bake em, fry em, eat em



or in our household gaijinboy has been known to ....


toast 'em


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## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> or in our household gaijinboy has been known to ....
> 
> 
> toast 'em


Toast a potato waffle?


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## sleaterkinney (Mar 6, 2015)

The regent does a good roast dinner.


----------



## robsean (Mar 6, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> The regent does a good roast dinner.


.............if you like red cabbage.


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## Nanker Phelge (Mar 6, 2015)

No one likes red cabbage


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## gaijingirl (Mar 6, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Toast a potato waffle?



yep... he only did it a few times before I pointed out he was killing the toaster.


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## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 6, 2015)

two of the most inexcusable yet so ridiculously easily avoidable faux pas when it comes to roasts in pubs restaurants are- small portions and shit watery gravy.

why would you serve a small roast and/or serve it with shit gravy? it really puts me off eating roasts out of the home, as they are almost always a disappointment, and at a hefty price.


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## robsean (Mar 6, 2015)

profit maximisation?


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## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 6, 2015)

basically, no. it doesn't cost more to make decent gravy. I can understand smaller portions will cost slightly less per serving but what's the point of it puts people off? Toby Carvery's etc are big successful chains for a reason.

I don't even care if the meat is a bit tough or whatever, as long as there is shit loads of it.


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## Smick (Mar 6, 2015)

There used to be great roasts at a good price at Ivan's Retreat. I forget how much they were but the second one was heavily discounted. I liked that bar.


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## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> The regent does a good roast dinner.


I think we need to move away from food before Nanker blows a gasket


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## friendofdorothy (Mar 6, 2015)

Smick said:


> There used to be great roasts at a good price at Ivan's Retreat. I forget how much they were but the second one was heavily discounted. I liked that bar.


Where?  - is it even anywhere near? 
Can I remind everyone this is the *Herne Hill *chit chat thread.


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## sleaterkinney (Mar 6, 2015)

I like Red Cabbage btw. Not ashamed to admit it.


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## Maharani (Mar 6, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Where?  - is it even anywhere near?
> Can I remind everyone this is the *Herne Hill *chit chat thread.


You can remind people yes. And???


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## friendofdorothy (Mar 6, 2015)

Maharani said:


> You can remind people yes. And???


yes, as you said yourself:


Maharani said:


> Waltham where???! How dare you talk of a North London establishment here.



So far I've learned that (should I ever be able to afford to eat out ever again) that there's no chance of a decent roast dinner in HH.


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## gaijingirl (Mar 6, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Where?  - is it even anywhere near?
> Can I remind everyone this is the *Herne Hill *chit chat thread.



sounds familiar!  We just had a similar brouhaha up the road at Tulse Hill! 

http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/tulse-hill-news-chitter-chatter-and-gossip.316005/page-84


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## Twattor (Mar 6, 2015)

all posts since #525 just serve as an example of why neither herne hill nor tulse hill should be granted independence from brixton

suburbs - know your place


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## friendofdorothy (Mar 6, 2015)

Twattor said:


> all posts since #525 just serve as an example of why neither herne hill nor tulse hill should be granted independence from brixton
> 
> suburbs - know your place


My place is right here, on the Herne Hill / Brixton borders!


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## gaijingirl (Mar 6, 2015)

Twattor said:


> all posts since #525 just serve as an example of why neither herne hill nor tulse hill should be granted independence from brixton
> 
> suburbs - know your place



no need to grant it - we've already taken it.


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## Smick (Mar 7, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Where?  - is it even anywhere near?
> Can I remind everyone this is the *Herne Hill *chit chat thread.


It's closed. Dead. Gone. So it isn't anywhere really.


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## Orang Utan (Mar 7, 2015)

It's all Brixton innit


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## friendofdorothy (Mar 7, 2015)

Anyone know if any pubs here abouts are showing the Villa - West Brom game today?


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## brixtonblade (Mar 7, 2015)

Realise this is too late but hootenanny usually have games on and effra social have things on in front room now too


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## friendofdorothy (Mar 7, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Realise this is too late but hootenanny usually have games on and effra social have things on in front room now too


I know, as might the Regent. buscador is hobbling on a crutch in an undignified manner, having twisted her ankle last week, so didn't want to hop out just on the off chance. She's watching it at home = less sociable/beer for me.


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## brixtonblade (Mar 7, 2015)

Regent is a bit hit and miss for sport on TV and no commentary 
Effra social front room is quite cozy and beer is good and if they're not showing and you don't mind hooters then it's a fairly safe trip to watch it at one of them


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## Ms T (Mar 10, 2015)

That place that never succeeds next to the Commercial is being refurbished. Apparently it will be a Mediterannean restaurant.


----------



## han (Mar 10, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Anyone know if any pubs here abouts are showing the Villa - West Brom game today?


The Commercial shows footie doesn't it? 

Great Man U v Arsenal game last night!


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## robsean (Mar 10, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Mediterannean restaurant.



Interestingly it was "Carribean" before.


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## Nanker Phelge (Mar 10, 2015)

Witnessed a rotten display of racism in The Commercial yesterday when I popped in for a sandwich at lunchtime. Some twat was vile to three black women. Asked one of them if her nice watch was a gift from her drug dealer boyfriend....

I didn't really know what was going on until he spat in her face and shouted 'Because you're black....!!!!' 

To be honest I saw red and followed him out into the street, gave him a boot up the arse, told him he was disgusting and to fuck off...

I didn't really know what was happening until afterwards, apparently he was in the area looking to buy a property for his son (he told the bar person). One of the three women commented on his rolex, and he responded with his 'drug dealer' comment. It was when she was challenging him about that he started spitting insults in her face...

It was quite bizarre, because it was a really quiet, normal, Monday afternoon....this bloke just appeared out of nowhere...

...he didn't say a word to me when I had a go at him....just ran off into Herne Hill station...

The three ladies gave me a hug afterwards. That was nice, but it was a very ugly moment...put me in a proper mood.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Mar 10, 2015)

I would have loved to see that boot.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Mar 10, 2015)

Ms T said:


> That place that never succeeds next to the Commercial is being refurbished.



Some Herne Hillians are all excited as there are rumours of a Soho House connection.  They can go to the OTC after a meal of a Friday and Saturday evening.  Sometimes though the decorators start the rumours from boredom.  A ha ha.


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 10, 2015)

That Soho House rumour has been around at least 2 years now... i'm sure i posted about it on U75 way back.


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 10, 2015)

blimey Nanker Phelge  -  how horrible.  Well done for sticking up for them!  Hopefully he'll rethink Herne Hill for his son.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 10, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> blimey Nanker Phelge  -  how horrible.  Well done for sticking up for them!  Hopefully he'll rethink Herne Hill for his son.



I seriously hope so....don't need the offspring of a rich racist as a neighbour...


----------



## Greebo (Mar 10, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Witnessed a rotten display of racism in The Commercial yesterday when I popped in for a sandwich at lunchtime. Some twat was vile to three black women. Asked one of them if her nice watch was a gift from her drug dealer boyfriend....
> 
> I didn't really know what was going on until he spat in her face and shouted 'Because you're black....!!!!'
> 
> ...


Sorry that the racist twat contaminated the area, but well done you for intervening.  

IME his sort (the ones who have a go at women) seldom have anything to say when confronted by a man, and you've probably restored a bit of faith in humanity to those 3 women - proving that not all men and not all whites are nasty racists.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 10, 2015)

Ms T said:


> That place that never succeeds next to the Commercial is being refurbished. Apparently it will be a Mediterannean restaurant.


Railway Tulse Hill guys have taken it over.

I believe it's jinxed so agree it is never to be a success. I used to go years back when it was the escape and it always smelled of wee.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 10, 2015)

Greebo said:


> Sorry that the racist twat contaminated the area, but well done you for intervening.
> 
> IME his sort (the ones who have a go at women) seldom have anything to say when confronted by a man, and you've probably restored a bit of faith in humanity to those 3 women - proving that not all men and not all whites are nasty racists.



Yeah I was there too and it was  completely shocking. I've lived in London for many years and have never heard such words. I was utterly disgusted. 

The ladies were so grateful for people intervening, namely Nanker and I made sure they were ok. 

I think the guy could have had a lot worse than a boot up his arse, he got off lightly and hopefully he realises he can't get away with that sort of disgusting behaviour in London again.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 10, 2015)

Perhaps my resorting to violence wasn't really the answer...

...the three women laughed about it...they thought the kick up the arse was funny....


----------



## Maharani (Mar 10, 2015)

Well I would never condone violence but I'm just saying he could have got worse...a lot worse


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 10, 2015)

I was just so livid...and then depressed by it.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 10, 2015)

Is there anything to recommend the Commercial these days? I all but given up on going there


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 10, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Is there anything to recommend the Commercial these days? I all but given up on going there



only that it's not The Florence.


----------



## brixtonblade (Mar 10, 2015)

I quite like sitting by the fire on a cold afternoon.  Dont really like it when its busy though.

Agree it does score huge points by not being the Florence


----------



## Orang Utan (Mar 10, 2015)

Do people like the Florence?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 10, 2015)

Orang Utan said:


> Do people like the Florence?



Not really, I feel like I'm everyones grandma when I go there


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 10, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> I quite like sitting by the fire on a cold afternoon.  Dont really like it when its busy though.
> 
> Agree it does score huge points by not being the Florence


Always used to be freezing with the doors open - have they learned to close the doors when it cold yet or open the windows when its warm?


----------



## brixtonblade (Mar 10, 2015)

Doors closed and fire on last time I went in.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 10, 2015)

Orang Utan said:


> Do people like the Florence?


There's not really a pub atmosphere in there. The food is a bit average. I don't know what I would recommend it for.


----------



## buscador (Mar 10, 2015)

See, I don't mind The Florence for the very simple reason that THE TOILETS ARE NOT IN THE FUCKING BASEMENT.


----------



## Orang Utan (Mar 10, 2015)

I wouldn't bother going out in East Brixton, sorry, Herne Hill, if I lived there, since Camberwell and Brixton are just round the corner


----------



## BoxRoom (Mar 10, 2015)

The Florence can fuck off. Girlfriend and I made to feel like absolute cunts just by walking in the fucking door.


----------



## ska invita (Mar 10, 2015)

Orang Utan said:


> Do people like the Florence?


i go there (very occasionally) with parent friends
and their kids


----------



## ringo (Mar 11, 2015)

I try and avoid The Florence, but end up there by default sometimes as a parent. I love ale but can't stand most of their own brewed beers.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 11, 2015)

Walters are expecting to be given their notice and are looking to move elsewhere in HH after Network Rail made it clear that they weren't welcome back post refurb.


----------



## wjh (Mar 11, 2015)

Orang Utan said:


> Do people like the Florence?



Think some parents like it cos of the soundproof fish-tank creche thing at the back.

Last time I went there for food I ended up quite ill the next morning just before getting on a long haul flight, not fun.

Needless to say I haven't been back since.


----------



## brixtonblade (Mar 11, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> Walters are expecting to be given their notice and are looking to move elsewhere in HH after Network Rail made it clear that they weren't welcome back post refurb.


That's a shame.  I thought that Network Rail had agreed that existing tennants would be helped back post-refurb...  have I got confused?


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 11, 2015)

I really dislike the Florence - in particular with the kids.


----------



## Greebo (Mar 11, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Perhaps my resorting to violence wasn't really the answer...
> 
> ...the three women laughed about it...they thought the kick up the arse was funny....


In a perfect world, a no mark like him would respond to something else and mend his ways.

In a perfect world, the scorn of three women would have silenced him.

We're not in a perfect world and IMHO you did no more than was reasonable.  AFAIK you've also done your share of getting us closer to that perfect world with your consistently antiracist stance.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 11, 2015)

buscador said:


> See, I don't mind The Florence for the very simple reason that THE TOILETS ARE NOT IN THE FUCKING BASEMENT.


thats a good point but does it outweigh:

most of the seating is either too high or too low
its full of children in the daytime
its full of teenagers in the evening
the beer isn't usually good


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 11, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> Walters are expecting to be given their notice and are looking to move elsewhere in HH after Network Rail made it clear that they weren't welcome back post refurb.


How come?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 11, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> How come?


All part of Network rail 'improvements' see thread:

*Out with the Old... Network Rail tell businesses to vacate Atlantic Road arches*


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 11, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> All part of Network rail 'improvements' see thread:
> 
> *Out with the Old... Network Rail tell businesses to vacate Atlantic Road arches*


I know it's being redeveloped, but I was wondering why they hadn't been invited back?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 11, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> I know it's being redeveloped, but I was wondering why they hadn't been invited back?


none of the businesses will have any guarentee of return


----------



## brixtonblade (Mar 11, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> none of the businesses will have any guarentee of return


But wasn't there some line about 'working with businesses to help relocate and return if they want' (or something like that).


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 11, 2015)

No, they told me they clearly weren't welcome back. Their lease term is different from the rest of that block. NR want more restaurants to replace the current normal high street shops.

In other depressing news No 22 owner has closed - still waiting for insurance money from the floods. friendofdorothy out Italian landlord friend could be losing his flat because of it.


----------



## brixtonblade (Mar 11, 2015)

You're full of shit news  (but thanks for letting us know)

Number 22 is a bit pricey but went there for a treat a few weeks ago and thought it was great and they seemed busy so thought everything was going ok


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 12, 2015)

Ms T said:


> That place that never succeeds next to the Commercial is being refurbished. Apparently it will be a Mediterannean restaurant.



so had a conversation today with basically the most reliable source of all re this, who I don't think would mind me sharing it.. a brasserie type restaurant, run by Railway, Tulse Hill guy - they've got a former Shoreditch House manager in to manage it (hence the Shoreditch House rumours).


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 12, 2015)

Opening as a brasserie, and not a bar/club, might be what it needs. It's never had much luck with the neighbors holding late events/music etc...


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 12, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Opening as a brasserie, and not a bar/club, might be what it needs. It's never had much luck with the neighbors holding late events/music etc...



well that was exactly the jist of the conversation - its fundamental unsuitability as a music venue due to its construction, amongst other things.


----------



## nagapie (Mar 12, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> I really dislike the Florence - in particular with the kids.



Pity we can't trade with Network Rail and give them The Florence, The Commercial and I'd be happy to throw in the Regent for good measure.


----------



## brixtonblade (Mar 12, 2015)

Then there'd only be OTC to drink in though and I don't have any hats


----------



## Twattor (Mar 13, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Then there'd only be OTC to drink in though and I don't have any hats



...and there's the question no one's asking.  Will OTC be OK after all the arch related giggery-pokery? Us habitual hat wearers need to know.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 14, 2015)

The OCT hats moment is sadly going be my finest ever U75 moment isn't it? Aside from the nankernobantics.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 14, 2015)

There's a garage sale in the garages beside Dorchester Court today and tomorrow.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 15, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Doors closed and fire on last time I went in.


Just hear from a friend who said she was there last week and it was freezing - no fire and doors open too much. 

I used to meet a lots of people in the Commercial and very few of them go there regularly anymore. She said she doesn't like it much now as the service is indifferent.


----------



## Greebo (Mar 15, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> The OCT hats moment is sadly going be my finest ever U75 moment isn't it? Aside from the nankernobantics.


No, IMHO your finest was chasing that racist and sexist arsehole out of the Pub the other week and teaching him a much needed lesson in manners.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 31, 2015)

A puppy was killed today in the tunnel in Herne Hill by a bull terrier breed.


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 31, 2015)

Ms T said:


> A puppy was killed today in the tunnel in Herne Hill by a bull terrier breed.


----------



## Smick (Mar 31, 2015)

Did the dog owner get away?


----------



## Ms T (Mar 31, 2015)

Apparently he ran off but all the shopkeepers know who it is. There are cameras in the tunnel too, so hopefully the Transport Police will take a look.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 31, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Apparently he ran off but all the shopkeepers know who it is. There are cameras in the tunnel too, so hopefully the Transport Police will take a look.


Fucking prick...


----------



## Ms T (Mar 31, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Fucking prick...


Exactly. Apparently he's hardly ever seen with the dog, and now we know why.  The poor pup was attacked in front of the kid whose pet it is too. It was a little fluffy poodly type thing.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 31, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Exactly. Apparently he's hardly ever seen with the dog, and now we know why.  The poor pup was attacked in front of the kid whose pet it is too. It was a little fluffy poodly type thing.


Oh FFS. At least he didn't go for the kid I suppose but defo s/he could be scarred for life with that image.


----------



## han (Mar 31, 2015)

Awful! [emoji20]


----------



## Maharani (Mar 31, 2015)

han said:


> Awful! [emoji20]


The dog owner should get community service at the very least...


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 31, 2015)

Ms T said:


> The poor pup was attacked in front of the kid whose pet it is too. It was a little fluffy poodly type thing.



oh good grief.. that's horrible.


----------



## shifting gears (Apr 1, 2015)

Sharing this here and on the Brixton thread as I know people that live there and the way they're being treated is frankly disgusting:
https://lambethrenters.wordpress.com/2015/03/30/save-the-dorchester-court-community/


----------



## Smick (Apr 1, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Apparently he ran off but all the shopkeepers know who it is. There are cameras in the tunnel too, so hopefully the Transport Police will take a look.


The transport police will be to busy checking tickets for any of that lark.


----------



## Greebo (Apr 1, 2015)

shifting gears said:


> <snip> I know people that live there and the way they're being treated is frankly disgusting:
> https://lambethrenters.wordpress.com/2015/03/30/save-the-dorchester-court-community/


Thanks for the heads up.


----------



## Not a Vet (Apr 1, 2015)

Filming grand designs follow up in herne hill this morning


----------



## Dexter Deadwood (Apr 19, 2015)

Jellied Eel, issue 46 (Feb - April 2015)
You can find out where to pick up free copies and download previous issues here;
http://www.sustainweb.org/jelliedeel/


----------



## editor (May 2, 2015)

I couldn't find a general Herne Hill forum, so I thought I'd start this one up with a mention of the street piano by the station. 







This guy was a really good player and wonderfully lost in the music.

Tickling the ivories at Herne Hill station at midnight


----------



## Lizzy Mac (May 2, 2015)

It was hiding.


----------



## leanderman (May 2, 2015)

editor said:


> I couldn't find a general Herne Hill forum, so I thought I'd start this one up with a mention of the street piano by the station.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/herne-hill-news-chitter-chatter-and-gossip.324513/page-21


----------



## editor (May 2, 2015)

Damn! My search failed to find the original thread although I was sure there was one. It's now been duly merged.


----------



## Ms T (May 2, 2015)

The new venue next to the Commercial is opening this weekend apparently.  There was frenzied activity inside when I passed on Thursday.  It's called The Milkwood.


----------



## editor (May 2, 2015)

Ms T said:


> The new venue next to the Commercial is opening this weekend apparently.  There was frenzied activity inside when I passed on Thursday.  It's called The Milkwood.


I was at the launch. Will post up photos soon. They've done a very good job of the interior.


----------



## Smick (May 2, 2015)

Looking at the food that's on offer, they're definitely not going for the family friendly / NCT crowd. That ought to be a good draw round Herne Hill; somewhere kid-free.


----------



## brixtonblade (May 2, 2015)

Smick said:


> Looking at the food that's on offer, they're definitely not going for the family friendly / NCT crowd. That ought to be a good draw round Herne Hill; somewhere kid-free.


Are you looking at the same menu as me?

Babaganoush, radishes and flatbread is pretty much all that kids in Herne Hill eat.


----------



## Kevs (May 3, 2015)

Really not enjoying the new pavement flags along Dulwich Road and then end of Railton. What's the point? Brand Herne Hill®?


----------



## choochi (May 3, 2015)

Smick said:


> Looking at the food that's on offer, they're definitely not going for the family friendly / NCT crowd. That ought to be a good draw round Herne Hill; somewhere kid-free.


They've got a specific kids menu so I doubt it's going to be kid-free.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 3, 2015)

Kevs said:


> Really not enjoying the new pavement flags along Dulwich Road and then end of Railton. What's the point? Brand Herne Hill®?


what flags?  I didn't notice any yesterday


----------



## Rushy (May 3, 2015)

Kevs said:


> Really not enjoying the new pavement flags along Dulwich Road and then end of Railton. What's the point? Brand Herne Hill®?


Yes. I thought that. Looks cluttered and serves what purpose? Seems a funny thing to spend money on when complaining about tight budgets.


----------



## Smick (May 3, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> what flags?  I didn't notice any yesterday


They are all the way along Dulwich are as said. I wouldn't call them flags. Vinyl rectangles with pictures of local buildings like the Lido, Brockwell Hall etc. I've seen the same portraits in the window of the picture framer and seen postcards at the market with them.

I quite like it


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 3, 2015)

Surprised I didn't notice them, but I was a bit pissed at the time.


----------



## Smick (May 3, 2015)

There seems to be some form of spring holding them on, made of black metal, which could, to my feeble eyes, be some form of antenna. Maybe they are revenue generating! We're being spied on by 1920s BR style posters!


----------



## editor (May 5, 2015)

Some photos from the Milkwood launch
















More: http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2015/05/milkwood-kitchen-and-bar-launches-in-herne-hill-south-london/


----------



## gaijingirl (May 5, 2015)

I reckon that will do really really well - like the "under Milkwood" idea.. very clever.  It's also a very nice menu.


----------



## Ms T (May 5, 2015)

It was pretty busy yesterday lunchtime when frequented by me and Mr Magpie. We had a nice lunch and not too pricey.


----------



## cuppa tee (May 5, 2015)

editor said:


> Some photos from the Milkwood launch
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Maybe someone can tell me how this place is up and running when the licence application hasn't been ok'd by the council....

http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/brl-redacted-application-Prem588_0.pdf

I've seen it happen a couple of times before


----------



## sleaterkinney (May 5, 2015)

Some of the local artists are showing off their work this weekend,

http://dulwichfestival.co.uk/tag-artists-open-house/se24/


----------



## Maharani (May 6, 2015)

cuppa tee said:


> Maybe someone can tell me how this place is up and running when the licence application hasn't been ok'd by the council....
> 
> http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/brl-redacted-application-Prem588_0.pdf
> 
> I've seen it happen a couple of times before


Probably because the place is licensed but under someone else's name. They are most probably transferring the licence holder's name. I know the owners as the Railway is my local and doubt very much that they would risk opening illegally.


----------



## Tolpuddle (May 6, 2015)

cuppa tee said:


> Maybe someone can tell me how this place is up and running when the licence application hasn't been ok'd by the council....
> 
> http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/brl-redacted-application-Prem588_0.pdf
> 
> I've seen it happen a couple of times before


 Try reading the application the link goes to, it is for a variation that's all.


----------



## Rushy (May 6, 2015)

The new owner has an outstanding parking fine and wears size 9.5 shoes (left foot slightly larger than right). Although he shares that dustbin with a neighbour so I may be mistaken.


----------



## Manter (May 6, 2015)




----------



## friendofdorothy (May 6, 2015)

You don't get the quality illegal after hours drinking clubs in HH like you used to.  They were my fave places.


----------



## gdubz (May 6, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> You don't get the quality illegal after hours drinking clubs in HH like you used to.  They were my fave places.


OTC is technically illegal if that helps. I rather take a 6 pack of spesh to a dunelm mills and test out the memory foam, but not sure of their opening hours.


----------



## gdubz (May 6, 2015)

gdubz said:


> OTC is technically illegal if that helps. I rather take a 6 pack of spesh to a dunelm mills and test out the memory foam, but not sure of their opening hours.


(2 pack - was trying to be the big man.)


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 7, 2015)

gdubz said:


> OTC is technically illegal if that helps. I rather take a 6 pack of spesh to a dunelm mills and test out the memory foam, but not sure of their opening hours.


the only 2 times I've attempted to get a drink in OTC they have told me they weren't serving/it was too late. Maybe they just didn't like the look of me.

After hours drinking isn't about booze or comfort - its about the random and interesting company, or it used to be. Met many people or got to know them better in such establishments.  Spent many a happy night in 127, the Studio and the Hammy. 



gdubz said:


> (2 pack - was trying to be the big man.)


makes you officially a cheap date!


----------



## leanderman (May 8, 2015)

Licensing application on the door of the defunct plumbing supplies shop by the Florence.

Seems to be for the Shrub and Shutter people. But the application may have lapsed


----------



## BigMoaner (May 8, 2015)

leander. What the actual fuck???? six hundred k?????

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property...1.45848&popupPropertyId=49498793&fromMap=true


----------



## leanderman (May 8, 2015)

BigMoaner said:


> leander. What the actual fuck???? six hundred k?????
> 
> http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-49498793.html?backListLink=/property-for-sale/map.html?locationIdentifier=REGION%5E87496&insId=2#_includeSSTC=on&auction=false&locationIdentifier=REGION%5E87496&previousSearchLocation=Brixton&radius=0.0&searchLocation=Brixton&searchType=SALE&useLocationIdentifier=false&box=-0.12136,-0.10698,51.44809,51.45848&popupPropertyId=49498793&fromMap=true



Too many people, too few homes. And going to get worse, with the Tories winning (no rent controls, or mansion tax, or higher tax rates, or non-dom taxes etc etc)


----------



## Maharani (May 9, 2015)

Went to Milkwood yesterday for a feed.  It was incredibly busy.  Staff are really bloody lovely and although they were manic it didn't feel unrelaxed.  The fit out has been done so well, they didn't skrimp on that.  I think finally the jinx has been lifted on this venue.

The food was really good, amazing fries and really nice wine that wasn't over priced.

I think I might become a regular here.

Commercial was dead which is strange but I think lots of people went on the lash early yesterday so burnt out by 10pm.

So a big thumbs up for Milkwood.  I shall look forwardn to the cinema at Under Milkwood.


----------



## Rushy (May 9, 2015)

It was already busy at 9.30 this morning. Looks like they may have got the all day formula right.


----------



## Maharani (May 9, 2015)

Just having a business that opens regularly and consistently is a pleasure. 

Apparently they do a good breakie too.


----------



## editor (May 9, 2015)

They've put a ton of effort into that place and seem to know how to get locals (and the media) involved, interested, and on their side.  OTC take note.


----------



## Rushy (May 9, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Just having a business that opens regularly and consistently is a pleasure.
> 
> Apparently they do a good breakie too.


I think I may have had their first one the morning after they opened. It was ok but nothing special for £8.(perfect poached egg, mind you!) I think the kitchen was struggling - they were still carting building materials out -  so I'll reserve judgement until next time.

ETA. I really liked the feel of the place.


----------



## BoxRoom (May 9, 2015)

Had a peek at Milkwood around 10am this morning, looked busy and customers looked happy. I was looking for somewhere to have brekker, wish I'd gone in now. Ended up having a slightly disappointing bacon sarnie and an excellent coffee at Pigeon Hole in Camberwell.


----------



## wurlycurly (May 9, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Just having a business that opens regularly and consistently is a pleasure.
> 
> Apparently they do a good breakie too.



Do you know if it intends to host bands or DJs, or is it strictly booze, food and mini-cinema?


----------



## leanderman (May 9, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I think I may have had their first one the morning after they opened. It was ok but nothing special for £8.(perfect poached egg, mind you!) I think the kitchen was struggling - they were still carting building materials out -  so I'll reserve judgement until next time.
> 
> ETA. I really liked the feel of the place.



No surprise it beats OTC. Big money and experience behind it. Going to wander down there in a minute


----------



## Maharani (May 9, 2015)

wurlycurly said:


> Do you know if it intends to host bands or DJs, or is it strictly booze, food and mini-cinema?


The latter.


----------



## leanderman (May 9, 2015)

Blimey. It's Northcote rd in here.


----------



## wurlycurly (May 9, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Blimey. It's Northcote rd in here.


 Is that good or bad?


----------



## leanderman (May 9, 2015)

wurlycurly said:


> Is that good or bad?



That's subjective


----------



## wurlycurly (May 9, 2015)

leanderman said:


> That's subjectiveView attachment 71307



Those prices don't seem too OTT tbf.


----------



## leanderman (May 9, 2015)

To clarify, I meant the venue is typical of Northcote rd - to an extent that I've not seen in these parts


----------



## leanderman (May 9, 2015)

wurlycurly said:


> Those prices don't seem too OTT tbf.



£5 three-course kid's meal that ends with a triple-scoop ice cream is inexplicably good value (especially when you have three kids)


----------



## Smick (May 9, 2015)

Do they add a compulsory 12.5% like the Florence?


----------



## leanderman (May 9, 2015)

Smick said:


> Do they add a compulsory 12.5% like the Florence?



No


----------



## Smick (May 10, 2015)

I don't mind leaving a tip if it's my idea. Not if it's theirs.


----------



## Ms T (May 10, 2015)

Smick said:


> Do they add a compulsory 12.5% like the Florence?


They did on my bill. I prefer it, tbh.


----------



## Smick (May 10, 2015)

Ms T said:


> They did on my bill. I prefer it, tbh.


I find myself always giving a quid or two on top when I know I shouldn't. I'm sceptical that the 12.5% goes to the staff. Also, if staff get tips and it's on a credit card, they'll pay tax and National Insurance on it.

So the whole thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth.


----------



## leanderman (May 10, 2015)

Ms T said:


> They did on my bill. I prefer it, tbh.



How odd. It was definitely not on our bill, which I found ... odd


----------



## Ms T (May 10, 2015)

Was going to go there for a late lunch today, but the kitchen was closed (due to staff cock-up, I think). I asked if, in that case, we could order drinks and get something to eat from the market but that was not allowed. So we went elsewhere.


----------



## leanderman (May 10, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Was going to go there for a late lunch today, but the kitchen was closed (due to staff cock-up, I think). I asked if, in that case, we could order drinks and get something to eat from the market but that was not allowed. So we went elsewhere.



Almost all the staff were very friendly - and some knew what they were doing.


----------



## Ms T (May 10, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Almost all the staff were very friendly - and some knew what they were doing.


I meant rota cock-up. A bit of a miss on a sunny Sunday afternoon.


----------



## leanderman (May 10, 2015)

Ms T said:


> I meant rota cock-up. A bit of a miss on a sunny Sunday afternoon.



Sure. I got that. I was just amused that some of the staff were so clueless.

The cock-up might stem from them having 15 employees getting in each other's way on Saturday afternoon!


----------



## cuppa tee (May 12, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Licensing application on the door of the defunct plumbing supplies shop by the Florence.
> 
> Seems to be for the Shrub and Shutter people. But the application may have lapsed



Here it is......... name of business is First Aid Box, due to open !st of July

http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/brl-redacted-application-prem1863_0.pdf


----------



## Winot (May 12, 2015)

cuppa tee said:


> Here it is......... name of business is First Aid Box, due to open !st of July
> 
> http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/brl-redacted-application-prem1863_0.pdf



Somewhere to go to get plastered?


----------



## Rushy (May 12, 2015)

Went to Milkwood for dinner. It was full at the back restaurant (on a Tuesday!). We asked to eat at the bar and had starters. Then they said the kitchen could not manage our mains. But they plied us with free drinks instead and we went for a kebab on the way home.


----------



## madolesance (May 12, 2015)

cuppa tee said:


> Here it is......... name of business is First Aid Box, due to open !st of July
> 
> http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/brl-redacted-application-prem1863_0.pdf



Yup, that's Shrub and Shutter.


----------



## leanderman (May 13, 2015)

madolesance said:


> Yup, that's Shrub and Shutter.



They told me they are 'trying to open there' - suggesting they are having some problems.


----------



## Ms T (May 13, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Went to Milkwood for dinner. It was full at the back restaurant (on a Tuesday!). We asked to eat at the bar and had starters. Then they said the kitchen could not manage our mains. But they plied us with free drinks instead and we went for a kebab on the way home.


They are clearly having problems managing the demand. The kitchen shut on Sunday afternoon, and they weren't open yesterday lunchtime either.


----------



## Rushy (May 13, 2015)

Ms T said:


> They are clearly having problems managing the demand. The kitchen shut on Sunday afternoon, and they weren't open yesterday lunchtime either.


Yep - the shouts of "service" sounded quite stressed.


----------



## Manter (May 17, 2015)

Anyone know/ have used a decent osteopath locally?

And spare me the 'there's no medical evidence' speeches. Thanks in advance.


----------



## trashpony (May 17, 2015)

I know one in Pimlico ...


----------



## Greebo (May 17, 2015)

Manter said:


> Anyone know/ have used a decent osteopath locally? <snip>


A quick google shows several in Streatham (mostly along the high road, so on a direct bus route), but I haven't used one so I can't recommend any.  Best of luck in finding a good one.

Failing that, there's one in Balham (again untried by me) who does sports massage as well as osteopathy.


----------



## prunus (May 17, 2015)

Smick said:


> I find myself always giving a quid or two on top when I know I shouldn't. I'm sceptical that the 12.5% goes to the staff. Also, if staff get tips and it's on a credit card, they'll pay tax and National Insurance on it.
> 
> So the whole thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth.



They pay tax (not NI) on cash tips, too.  It's always worth checking that card tips (that is, tips added to a card) do actually go to the staff though.  

Service charges added automatically to the bill are additionally subject to NI, even if 'voluntary' - it's slightly odd as they're not treated as tips per se but more like a bonus you choose to pay to the restaurant, which the restaurant may then choose to augment its staff's wages with (hence NI). 

Basically service charges are not exactly tips.


----------



## SpamMisery (May 17, 2015)

prunus said:


> It's always worth checking that card tips (that is, tips added to a card) do actually go to the staff though.



I used to ask that question every time I ate out, but don't do it anymore as I have never had someone say "no, it doesn't".


----------



## Rushy (May 17, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> I used to ask that question every time I ate out, but don't do it anymore as I have never had someone say "no, it doesn't".


Oh, I have.


----------



## choochi (May 17, 2015)

Manter said:


> Anyone know/ have used a decent osteopath locally?
> 
> And spare me the 'there's no medical evidence' speeches. Thanks in advance.



There's a man on Dulwich Road that my partner has used and is happy with.

E2a http://www.hernehillosteopath.com


----------



## Smick (May 17, 2015)

prunus said:


> They pay tax (not NI) on cash tips, too.  It's always worth checking that card tips (that is, tips added to a card) do actually go to the staff though.
> 
> Service charges added automatically to the bill are additionally subject to NI, even if 'voluntary' - it's slightly odd as they're not treated as tips per se but more like a bonus you choose to pay to the restaurant, which the restaurant may then choose to augment its staff's wages with (hence NI).
> 
> Basically service charges are not exactly tips.


They don't pay tax if they stick it straight in their pocket.

I've already paid tax on the tip I'm giving them. The last thing I want is for the waiting staff to get taxed on it again.


----------



## Rushy (May 17, 2015)

Smick said:


> They don't pay tax if they stick it straight in their pocket.
> 
> I've already paid tax on the tip I'm giving them. The last thing I want is for the waiting staff to get taxed on it again.


Eh? The I've already paid tax on it argument could be applied to anything you buy from anyone? If there is an argument not to tax tips, that's not it.

I hate the tipping culture. It should not be necessary in order to make wages up to an acceptable level. It should be reserved for when someone goes out of their way for you rather than generally expected, as it is here. It certainly should not be automatically added to bill.


----------



## CH1 (May 17, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Eh? The I've already paid tax on it argument could be applied to anything you buy from anyone? If there is an argument not to tax tips, that's not it.
> 
> I hate the tipping culture. It should not be necessary in order to make wages up to an acceptable level. It should be reserved for when someone goes out of their way for you rather than generally expected, as it is here. It certainly should not be automatically added to bill.


It's funny isn't it how plebs are forced to pay tax on the circulation of money.

When it was suggested we have the Tobin Tax on High Frequency Trading and other questionable activities in "The City" lo Boris Dave etc jump into action to defend the indefensible (and win).


----------



## Rushy (May 17, 2015)

CH1 said:


> It's funny isn't it how plebs are forced to pay tax on the circulation of money.
> 
> When it was suggested we have the Tobin Tax on High Frequency Trading and other questionable activities in "The City" lo Boris Dave etc jump into action to defend the indefensible (and win).



I don't know much about HFT, but the tax was a transaction tax wasn't it? Totally unrelated to income or profit, i.e. you pay the tax for participating, irrespective of whether you make or lose money. I'm not familiar with the arguments for or against but it's not a great comparison to tax on income, whether basic wage or tip/bonus.


----------



## Smick (May 17, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Eh? The I've already paid tax on it argument could be applied to anything you buy from anyone? If there is an argument not to tax tips, that's not it.
> 
> I hate the tipping culture. It should not be necessary in order to make wages up to an acceptable level. It should be reserved for when someone goes out of their way for you rather than generally expected, as it is here. It certainly should not be automatically added to bill.


Yeah, get income tax taken off my pay, have VAT taken off whatever I buy and then the man who sells it to me has to pay income tax on money he has earned. But a tip, to me, seems more like a gift than payment for an agreed service, so I'd not care if the cash  goes straight in the pocket.


----------



## Rushy (May 17, 2015)

Smick said:


> Yeah, get income tax taken off my pay, have VAT taken off whatever I buy and then the man who sells it to me has to pay income tax on money he has earned. But a tip, to me, seems more like a gift than payment for an agreed service, so I'd not care if the cash  goes straight in the pocket.


But would you be making them that "gift" if they had not just served you? If the answer is no - then the payment was conditional upon on the service. In which case it is not really a gift, is it. It's a bonus.

I'd have thought one of the biggest arguments against taxing tips is that it is pretty hard to effectively to enforce.


----------



## Ms T (May 19, 2015)

Cyril the Herne Hill Squirrel, who lives with Elaine the flower lady, has a new custom-made gaffe outside her shop.    Apparently he spent half an hour "moving in" and shifting his bedding from one bit of his new home to another.  He's being released in a couple of weeks - I told her there should be a ceremony with a ribbon and everything.


----------



## goldengraham (May 20, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> I used to ask that question every time I ate out, but don't do it anymore as I have never had someone say "no, it doesn't".



It's usually the franchisey chains where you have to ask - Cafe Rouge, Chiquitos, etc. They will always say cash is better. Though at the more enlightened ones like Pizza Express etc they'll tell you it makes no difference


----------



## Rushy (May 23, 2015)

Dinner at Milkwood again last night. Really nice crowd, staff and atmosphere. Very busy. Good beers and, I'm reliably told, cocktails But the food was sadly average to poor. I really hope they sort the kitchen out. Friend we were with said she would not choose to eat there again.


----------



## Rushy (May 23, 2015)

Popped into Off the Cuff. It just felt a bit self conscious and lacking in atmosphere. No band when I was there. Although there was a group up and dancing and enjoying themselves. It seems odd that they have to keep doors and gates closed whilst The Commercial and Milkwood customers are all spoiling out in the street.


----------



## Rushy (May 23, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Cyril the Herne Hill Squirrel, who lives with Elaine the flower lady, has a new custom-made gaffe outside her shop.    Apparently he spent half an hour "moving in" and shifting his bedding from one bit of his new home to another.  He's being released in a couple of weeks - I told her there should be a ceremony with a ribbon and everything.


Looked a bit stressed yesterday. I wouldn't make too much of an event of releasing him. It's a criminal offence (officially vermin, invasive species).


----------



## T & P (May 23, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Looked a bit stressed yesterday. I wouldn't make too much of an event of releasing him. It's a criminal offence (officially vermin, invasive species).


As a matter of fact, I believe the law states if you manage to catch one you must humanely have it destroyed


----------



## Rushy (May 23, 2015)

T & P said:


> As a matter of fact, I believe the law states if you manage to catch one you must humanely have it destroyed


Fair enough, I suppose. But he phrase "shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted"  comes to mind in respect of American greys.


----------



## CH1 (May 23, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I don't know much about HFT, but the tax was a transaction tax wasn't it? Totally unrelated to income or profit, i.e. you pay the tax for participating, irrespective of whether you make or lose money. I'm not familiar with the arguments for or against but it's not a great comparison to tax on income, whether basic wage or tip/bonus.


Yes it was a transaction tax, and was suggested to penalise over-trading as a means of skimming off profits from ordinary investors. So a good thing I would have thought.

You were complaining about paying tax to employ people out of your already taxed earnings. Whilst significant this is a mere pittance compared with all the corruption in the currency and bond markets which we hear about every day on the news.


----------



## Rushy (May 23, 2015)

CH1 said:


> You were complaining about paying tax to employ people out of your already taxed earnings.


Perhaps you could remind me where I made that complaint?


----------



## Ms T (May 23, 2015)

CH1 said:


> Yes it was a transaction tax, and was suggested to penalise over-trading as a means of skimming off profits from ordinary investors. So a good thing I would have thought.
> 
> You were complaining about paying tax to employ people out of your already taxed earnings. Whilst significant this is a mere pittance compared with all the corruption in the currency and bond markets which we hear about every day on the news.


That wasn't Rushy, who rightly pointed out that everything we buy is from taxed earnings. It was Smick I think.


----------



## CH1 (May 23, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Perhaps you could remind me where I made that complaint?





Ms T said:


> That wasn't Rushy, who rightly pointed out that everything we buy is from taxed earnings. It was Smick I think.


I grow old... I grow old...
shall I wear the bottoms of my trousers rolled?


----------



## Ms T (May 23, 2015)

CH1 said:


> I grow old... I grow old...
> shall I wear the bottoms of my trousers rolled?


Then you would be a hipster, surely?


----------



## Smick (May 23, 2015)

Yeah, it was me. I just said if I am tipping, I'd rather it all go to the tippee. I know there's no legal, and possibly logical, argument for it but I guess tipping is emotional. Which is why I object to having it added onto my bill automatically.

I thought Manter usually enjoys a bit of taxation debate and I'm surprised not to have had her input so far.


----------



## CH1 (May 23, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Then you would be a hipster, surely?


 Not sure about that. My hippest possession is probably this:


----------



## Manter (May 23, 2015)

Smick said:


> Yeah, it was me. I just said if I am tipping, I'd rather it all go to the tippee. I know there's no legal, and possibly logical, argument for it but I guess tipping is emotional. Which is why I object to having it added onto my bill automatically.
> 
> I thought Manter usually enjoys a bit of taxation debate and I'm surprised not to have had her input so far.


Fucking hell, is that what I am memorable for?! I may have to have myself taken out and shot


----------



## Smick (May 23, 2015)

Manter said:


> Fucking hell, is that what I am memorable for?! I may have to have myself taken out and shot


You can usually relate it to the everyday life. And not just tax. All sorts of technicalities and legislation.


----------



## Manter (May 23, 2015)

Smick said:


> You can usually relate it to the everyday life. And not just tax. All sorts of technicalities and legislation.


That makes me feel a bit better  

I'll read the debate tomorrow- cider and Eurovision have scrambled my brain


----------



## Rushy (May 23, 2015)

Manter said:


> That makes me feel a bit better
> 
> I'll read the debate tomorrow- cider and Eurovision have scrambled my brain


Who won? How did Australia do? And why were they in it?

ETA: oh dear. 11.20 and only 10 of 40 declared.


----------



## Manter (May 23, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Who won? How did Australia do? And why were they in it?


Still only on 19 of 40 country votes. 

And Australia is baffling and random.


----------



## Manter (May 23, 2015)

Quite bored tbh..... But I've started so I'll finish.


----------



## Sister Midnight (May 24, 2015)

Think Australia's inclusion was an anniversary special? But Israel is in it too. Also baffling!


----------



## CH1 (May 24, 2015)

Sister Midnight said:


> Think Australia's inclusion was an anniversary special? But Israel is in it too. Also baffling!


Israel been in it since 1973, won 3 times - last time being transgendered Dana International in 1998. Seems as bit incongruously mellow compared with the countries current Magnum Force attitude to land allocation policies.  

As for Australia - this is indeed supposed to be a one-off special, but in view of other relationships within the European Broadcasting Union, maybe they might stay? The EBU does classical stuff on Radio 3 and participating world networks - including Canada and Japan.


----------



## T & P (May 24, 2015)

I think inviting one non-European nation every year from now on would be fun and a breath of fresh air. I'd love to see some Arab nations take part.


----------



## Dexter Deadwood (May 24, 2015)

Don't really give a shit about this wanky song thing but the racist, fascist, terrorist state of Israel can play no part in cultural exchanges.


----------



## Manter (May 24, 2015)

T & P said:


> I think inviting one non-European nation every year from now on would be fun and a breath of fresh air. I'd love to see some Arab nations take part.


Ha! Brilliant idea. One random country per year.


----------



## Gramsci (May 25, 2015)

T & P said:


> I think inviting one non-European nation every year from now on would be fun and a breath of fresh air. I'd love to see some Arab nations take part.



Due to Israel in it they boycott it.



> Because of Israel's participation in the Eurovision Song Contest, many Arab states that are eligible to participate decided not to do so. Tunisia, Morocco, and Lebanon are cases in point.[_citation needed_] Tunisia was about to participate in 1977, but decided not to do so in the end; Lebanon was just about to participate in 2005 when it withdrew (incurring a fine by the EBU) because Lebanese law does not allow recognition of Israel, and consequently Lebanese television would not transmit any Israeli material – which would have been a violation of EBU's (European Broadcasting Union) rules;[3]


----------



## Fingers (May 25, 2015)

Some charming graffiti outside Deedee's


----------



## brixtonblade (May 25, 2015)

That's shitty


----------



## editor (May 25, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Some charming graffiti outside Deedee's
> 
> View attachment 71833


Fuck's sake. That is disgusting.


----------



## Greebo (May 25, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Some charming graffiti outside Deedee's   <snip>


No excuses, anyone even passing through this area should know better.  

 OTOH once you've reported it, graffiti encouraging hatred (rascism, homophobia etc) gets prioritised for removal.


----------



## Smick (May 25, 2015)

I can't believe someone would do that. I can't help but think it is some form of twisted joke. I thought that that sort of crap died out in the eighties.


----------



## editor (May 25, 2015)

Smick said:


> I can't believe someone would do that. I can't help but think it is some form of twisted joke. I thought that that sort of crap died out in the eighties.


Nah. Where's the possible humour in that?


----------



## Smick (May 25, 2015)

No humour really, but could anyone be so stupid?

It's London. I have no doubt that everyone in London enjoys acts of courtesy and kindness from people of all origins every single day.  And pissed off likewise.


----------



## editor (May 25, 2015)

Smick said:


> No humour really, but could anyone be so stupid?


There's no shortage of stupid racists around.


----------



## Smick (May 25, 2015)

editor said:


> There's no shortage of stupid racists around.


 Thankfully I don't often, if ever, see them.


----------



## Mr Retro (May 25, 2015)

Smick said:


> Thankfully I don't often, if ever, see them.


That's disgusting. Fucking knuckle dragging clown(s).

It's thankfully so unusual now that when I read it there I gave a start.


----------



## teuchter (May 25, 2015)

And what about that apostrophe.


----------



## editor (May 26, 2015)

Someone added this comment to the Buzz article:


> something similar was scrawled in marker pen on one of the newly painted shop shutters on Atlantic Road a few weeks back..once spotted it was sprayed over by a passing graffiti writer…


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

Racist graffiti was removed by Southwark Council this morning


----------



## ddraig (May 26, 2015)

.


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

.


----------



## ddraig (May 26, 2015)

wicked if they have him bang to rights and this can be nipped in bud!

looks a proper gentrifying git


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

Should this be true he can probably say bye bye to the day job....

His FB friend list is very white....


----------



## Crispy (May 26, 2015)

South London Makerspace is holding a Grand Opening tomorrow night from 19:30. We've been busy for the last 6 months building a workshop for anyone who likes to make things but doesn't have the tools or space at home. We've got a laser cutter, sewing machines, 3D printer, all sorts of woodworking tools etc. etc. - all funded and run by our members. Come along and find out more. Bring your bank details if you're thinking of joining! Canopy Beer Co. are our neighbours and will be running a bar. They brew very tasty ales  (or just BYO)

We're behind the shops on Norwood Road opposite the park. The gates are next to Costcutter.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

.


----------



## Rushy (May 26, 2015)

Crispy said:


> South London Makerspace is holding a Grand Opening tomorrow night from 19:30. We've been busy for the last 6 months building a workshop for anyone who likes to make things but doesn't have the tools or space at home. We've got a laser cutter, sewing machines, 3D printer, all sorts of woodworking tools etc. etc. - all funded and run by our members. Come along and find out more. Bring your bank details if you're thinking of joining! Canopy Beer Co. are our neighbours and will be running a bar. They brew very tasty ales  (or just BYO)
> 
> We're behind the shops on Norwood Road opposite the park. The gates are next to Costcutter.


Worth a new thread, no?


----------



## goldengraham (May 26, 2015)

ddraig said:


> <lazyllama edited: please don't quote something you think is libellous>



Be careful - where is the evidence for this? You could be exposing the entire website to libel!


----------



## ddraig (May 26, 2015)

see first word


----------



## Crispy (May 26, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Worth a new thread, no?


http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/south-london-makerspace.317308/


----------



## Rushy (May 26, 2015)

goldengraham said:


> Be careful - where is the evidence for this? You could be exposing the entire website to libel!


Yeah. I was thinking much the same. Not to mention the damage to the individual if it is nonsense. Need to apply some sense and caution.


----------



## Rushy (May 26, 2015)

Crispy said:


> http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/south-london-makerspace.317308/


Too modest!


----------



## Manter (May 26, 2015)

ddraig said:


> see first word


Just whacking in the word 'allegedly' doesn't constitute an opinion defence. Also looks like Jasper's tweet including name and photo has been taken down, so it looks like he may not be, or may not be proven to be, the offender.


----------



## ddraig (May 26, 2015)

it wasn't my opinion
'it has been said' hopefully being clear enough.
fingers has deleted theirs so i'll delete mine

hope that makes you feel more comfortable


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

There is currently a change petition doing the rounds with 233 signatures. Here is the text.  I have redacted some of it

******* *********** is a teacher at Dulwich Hamlet Juniors which is a private school. This man has allegedly been caught on CCTV coming from where he lives above the bar.... and proceeds to spray paint and criminally vandalise the wall of  Dee Dee's bar 77 Herne Hill, South London. SE24 9NE

with the words NO NIGGERS - It is 2015 and a man cannot even run a business for multicultural people of London... the artists of London and everyone in between.... your colour doesn't matter inn this petition... IT IS A CALL TO HAVE HIM SUSPENDED NOT SACKED AT THIS STAGE, PENDING FURTHER ENQUIRIES REGARDING THIS AND HIS PREVIOUS ACTIONS TOWARDS THE BAR. The man in question lives ******************... and his proximity has inflamed the situation.

Where an organisation called poetic unity. Runs a weekly event called Poets Corner. Poetry is a form of expression and holds dear to many people's hearts. It's an art form just like many other arts out there... and this amazing organisation that provides a platform so to speak, so they can educated and empower themselves through poetry and it's various forms. Then you get people.... Sorry teacher with the British education system... carry out an act that is very damaging if he is exposed to pupils at this school. Stand united against racism within the education system and unite with Poetry Unity at their event TUESDAY MAY 26TH 7PM support their event by attending and that regardless of your race or colour.. RACISM IS POISION and UNITY AGAINST IT IS THE ONLY CURE


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

And a statement from the school saying that the accused is currently away on holiday

http://www.dulwichhamletjuniorschoo...theHeadTeacherofDulwichHamletJuniorSchool.pdf


----------



## Dan U (May 26, 2015)

Fingers said:


> And a statement from the school saying that the accused is currently away on holiday
> 
> http://www.dulwichhamletjuniorschoo...theHeadTeacherofDulwichHamletJuniorSchool.pdf


That's quite an allegation as well by the school!


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

Dan U said:


> That's quite an allegation as well by the school!



Innit, my friend who took it does not use Photoshop. I have emailed the school to let them know that it was done between late Sunday evening and Monday morning plus it was removed this morning. If it is the case that he left London Sunday lunchtime he is in the clear.


----------



## gaijingirl (May 26, 2015)

good grief.. what a clusterfuck!  WTF is going on?  Doesn't seem very likely the teacher had anything to do with it - and poor guy to have that allegation made against him.  The photoshopped graffiti thing is a bit odd though - I would have thought Lambeth could instantly confirm whether or not they removed the graffiti.


----------



## editor (May 26, 2015)

Crispy said:


> South London Makerspace is holding a Grand Opening tomorrow night from 19:30. We've been busy for the last 6 months building a workshop for anyone who likes to make things but doesn't have the tools or space at home. We've got a laser cutter, sewing machines, 3D printer, all sorts of woodworking tools etc. etc. - all funded and run by our members. Come along and find out more. Bring your bank details if you're thinking of joining! Canopy Beer Co. are our neighbours and will be running a bar. They brew very tasty ales  (or just BYO)
> 
> We're behind the shops on Norwood Road opposite the park. The gates are next to Costcutter.


Feel free to add it to the Buzz diary - and if you want to do a guest post, I can run a feature too.


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> good grief.. what a clusterfuck!  WTF is going on?  Doesn't seem very likely the teacher had anything to do with it - and poor guy to have that allegation made against him.  The photoshopped graffiti thing is a bit odd though - I would have thought Lambeth could instantly confirm whether or not they removed the graffiti.



That side of the road is Southwark and there were photos on Twitter this morning of Southwark council workers removing it with anti graffiti spray.  For the most part  of the night it seemed to have been covered up with some blankets.


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

https://instagram.com/p/3JK3mdgR6i/


----------



## gaijingirl (May 26, 2015)

Fingers said:


> That side of the road is Southwark and there were photos on Twitter this morning of Southwark council workers removing it with anti graffiti spray.  For the most part  of the night it seemed to have been covered up with some blankets.



I just wonder why the school didn't just call Southwark directly to find out if the graffiti did indeed exist rather than jumping in with the photoshopped idea?  Then dropping in that thing about the local "bar's license" (sic)  It's all a bit odd.


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

Then this is going the rounds (click the link)


----------



## editor (May 26, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> I just wonder why the school didn't just call Southwark directly to find out if the graffiti did indeed exist rather than jumping in with the photoshopped idea?  Then dropping in that thing about the local "bar's license" (sic)  It's all a bit odd.


It does seem very strange to add all that detail and conjecture.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

Photoshopped....oh dear


----------



## gaijingirl (May 26, 2015)

it just gets weirder and weirder.  Horrible business.    It's not been a good week for Herne Hill.


----------



## ddraig (May 26, 2015)

thanks for editing out my post quoted by someone else ll 

i suggested they do so hours ago after they 'advised' me in a pm
i'd already deleted my own post


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

It made The Times

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/crime/article4451738.ece


----------



## editor (May 26, 2015)

Fingers said:


> It made The Times
> 
> http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/crime/article4451738.ece


I hope they paid for that photo usage.


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

editor said:


> I hope they paid for that photo usage.



It was a friend of the girl who took the photo who wrote the article so not sure what/if any arrangements have been made


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2015)

Fingers said:


> It made The Times
> 
> http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/crime/article4451738.ece


I know that place has been there a while, and I've still not been - I really must venture up the hill soon.  
Was the Mel quoted in the article the Mel we know?


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I know that place has been there a while, and I've still not been - I really must venture up the hill soon.
> Was the Mel quoted in the article the Mel we know?



It was indeed.


----------



## editor (May 26, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I know that place has been there a while, and I've still not been - I really must venture up the hill soon.
> Was the Mel quoted in the article the Mel we know?


Can someone post up the text as I refuse to give Murdoch a penny.


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

A jazz bar in the leafy affluent London suburb of Herne Hill has become the victim of an unprecedented racist attack targeted at its staff.

A vandal painted the phrase “No N*****s” across the front wall of Dee Dee’s Jazz and the Funk in the early hours of Monday morning in what staff believe was a targeted attack by local residents who have been complaining about noise.

Around half of the jazz bar’s staff, including its manager, are black.

The racist slogan was covered with blankets and was painted over by Southwark Council this morning. The police have been called and CCTV footage of the person that painted the slogan will be handed over.

Brook Anderson, who owns the bar, said he believes that a small group of people living in the area want to drive the business out of Herne Hill following a number of complaints – mostly unfounded – about the bar.

He said that he has been told to move the bar to nearby Brixton and out of the residential area.

“I am outraged to be honest. The staff are very upset. Kids, old people in the area – this has frightened everybody. This is not even about black people.

“It’s just racism. If it was in another area, it [the graffiti] would be about polish people or Jewish people. It’s the power that these people think they have that angers me the most,” he told _The Times_.

The jazz bar is situated on the end of a strip of shops. Attempts to turn the site into a delicatessen and a restaurant have failed in the past but Dee Dee’s has been open for three years and has proved a popular destination due to its comedy and music nights.

Locals have rallied around the bar in the wake of the attack and provided the blankets to cover the text.

Mel Hughes, a long-term resident who lives opposite and regularly visits the bar, said the graffiti had made her feel sick. “When I first saw it, a few of us were just open-mouthed and speechless.”

Max Williams, a freelance writer who has worked behind the bar at Dee Dees, said that the “crude and ugly” graffiti was not indicative of the area. “It’s a shock to see something like this in 2015, especially somewhere as culturally diverse as south London,” he said.

Mr Anderson said he was concerned that the racist attack on his business could deter people from coming to the bar, despite the success of the place over the past three years.

“We’ve worked really hard to make it so that people that cause trouble don’t want to be here,” he said.

Accusations have been laid online against a local teacher who works at the Dulwich Hamlet Junior School. The school has issued a statement denying the involvement of the maths teacher adding that he is on holiday in another part of the country.

Herne Hill has gentrified rapidly over the past decade and has been the subject of sporadic protests over sharp rises in rents that have forced some residents to move out.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2015)

> *Racist graffiti attack at south London jazz bar outrages locals*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## prunus (May 26, 2015)

Dan U said:


> That's quite an allegation as well by the school!



Indeed!

I do however like the fact that the head there can legitimately style herself as Sonia "Head" Case


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

Every head teacher I've ever dealt with has been a rambling and irrational loonpot.

They have been more childish than the kids and often less willing to own up to mistakes.

That statement is a shambles...


----------



## Smick (May 26, 2015)

It makes more sense to me that someone has gone out to make a deliberately offensive remark to discredit Dee Dee's rather than a racist hoping to further racism with some scrawled hate. Unfortunately racists are a lot more subtle. Either way, this guy is fucked.


----------



## brixtonblade (May 26, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Every head teacher I've ever dealt with has been a rambling and irrational loonpot.
> 
> They have been more childish than the kids and often less willing to own up to mistakes.
> 
> That statement is a shambles...



The statement is ridiculous. I don't understand why the comments about the license or photoshopping were neccessary - she could hhave defended her employee without feeling the need to undermine the act itself.  That said, if the guy was away from Sunday then it doesnt sound like he was to blame and so he would deserve a bit of sympathy for getting a load of shit off the internet.


----------



## Smick (May 26, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> The statement is ridiculous. I don't understand why the comments about the license or photoshopping were neccessary - she could hhave defended her employee without feeling the need to undermine the act itself.  That said, if the guy was away from Sunday then it doesnt sound like he was to blame and so he would deserve a bit of sympathy for getting a load of shit off the internet.


Surely then a statement from him would be more appropriate.


----------



## brixtonblade (May 26, 2015)

Don't know... The association with the school makes it of some relevance I'd have thought.  But, again, to the extent they need to comment I can only see them needing to address their staff members alleged involvement rather than comment on anything else about the incident.


----------



## Dan U (May 26, 2015)

Yeah that statement needed to begin and end with 'he wasn't here we think' 

It's very very misjudged given the circumstances


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

I don't tell my employer what I do at the weekend...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

You'd think a school head my use a bit of headed paper too....


----------



## Dan U (May 26, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> I don't tell my employer what I do at the weekend...


I guess you may attempt to tell them something if accused of spraying racist graffiti in this way. 

The school will know how to get hold of the teacher. 

If course what you say and what you did might not be the same thing, but as dibble appears to be involved there is a vague hope this person will be in or out of the investigation


----------



## T & P (May 26, 2015)

Unpleasant mess all around


----------



## Manter (May 26, 2015)

T & P said:


> Unpleasant mess all around


Yes, this


----------



## Fingers (May 26, 2015)

Update in the Standard (sort of)

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...all-of-jazz-bar-in-south-london-10276426.html


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

Professor Plum did it in the street with a spray can


----------



## ddraig (May 26, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Update in the Standard (sort of)
> 
> http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...all-of-jazz-bar-in-south-london-10276426.html


that does have the confirmation that contractors had cleaned it off this morning.



> Sonia Case also suggested images of the graffiti might be "photoshopped".
> 
> "There is no truth in this terrible story, but unfortunately there are already people posting disturbing and threatening messages on Facebook and Twitter," said a statement shared on Twitter.
> 
> ...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

I don't think anyone doubted the existence of the graffiti beyond some bonkers head teacher...


----------



## Smick (May 26, 2015)

It appears that a complaint has been made to the police about whoever named the prime suspect and they are investigating that.

I'd hate to think it wasn't this guy, given the way his name has circulated.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 26, 2015)

Well,if it wasn't him, he's really pissed someone off big time....


----------



## SpamMisery (May 26, 2015)

Turning out to be a proper mystery. Intrigued to find out who it was and why


----------



## Ms T (May 26, 2015)

I'd be consulting a lawyer, if I were him.


----------



## Fingers (May 27, 2015)

More bad stuff in Herne Hill. Can hear the Air Ambulance


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 27, 2015)

Fingers said:


> More bad stuff in Herne Hill. Can hear the Air Ambulance
> 
> View attachment 71896



Those spray can fumes can be lethal


----------



## Fingers (May 27, 2015)

An arrest is imminent from the Graffiti so I am told


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 27, 2015)

The plot thickens...


----------



## T & P (May 27, 2015)

Fingers said:


> More bad stuff in Herne Hill. Can hear the Air Ambulance
> 
> View attachment 71896



Do we know what happened?


----------



## Fingers (May 27, 2015)

T & P said:


> Do we know what happened?



An RTA I believe


----------



## goldengraham (May 27, 2015)

The quote wasn't actually libellous but the original link to his Twitter site was


----------



## Manter (May 27, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Well,if it wasn't him, he's really pissed someone off big time....


It's remarkably common for people to do and say things to try and lose people their jobs over relatively minor or run of the mill slights. I've dealt with a dozen cases in my career so far of people writing to individuals employers (usually after after breakups) to trying and get them sacked. They range from 'whistleblowing' (s/he leaked confidential commercial information to the media/insider trading/party to unsafe working conditions) to the downright surreal (s/he runs an escort agency/people smuggling ring/has an inappropriate interest in children/has a cannabis farm in the basement). I have been surprised throughout my career how common it is.


----------



## Rushy (May 27, 2015)

Surely the matter is easily settled by publishing the CCTV images by which the bar owners or whoever it was say they identified him as the culprit?


----------



## Fingers (May 27, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Surely the matter is easily settled by publishing the CCTV images by which the bar owners or whoever it was say they identified him as the culprit?



I am informed that the CCTV is in the hands of the police so it should settle who did it fairly soon.


----------



## discobastard (May 27, 2015)

Fingers said:


> I am informed that the CCTV is in the hands of the police so it should settle who did it fairly soon.


Or who didn't (keeping an open mind).


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 28, 2015)

I can't imagine why has no one posted here about the excellent Canopy Brewery opening for offy and drinking in. It's in the arches behind Costcutter. Don't know how often its opened before, its all very new and a bit disorganised and I didn't like the look of the portaloo. Fantabulousa beers though! I tried the bottled porter the draught wheat beer and IPA - all lovely. yum. Barman said they next open on Sunday from noon.

It was open last night for the grand opening party of their near neighbours Makerspace. And what a grand party it was - thanks Crispy and mates.


----------



## Fingers (May 28, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I can't imagine why has no one posted here about the excellent Canopy Brewery opening for offy and drinking in. It's in the arches behind Costcutter. Don't know how often its opened before, its all very new and a bit disorganised and I didn't like the look of the portaloo. Fantabulousa beers though! I tried the bottled porter the draught wheat beer and IPA - all lovely. yum. Barman said they next open on Sunday from noon.
> 
> It was open last night for the grand opening party of their near neighbours Makerspace. And what a grand party it was - thanks Crispy and mates.



I wrote this review a couple of days ago and forgot to post it in here

http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2015/05/the-canopy-brewery-company-a-new-bar-for-herne-hill/


----------



## Crispy (May 28, 2015)

Fingers said:


> I wrote this review a couple of days ago and forgot to post it in here
> 
> http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2015/05/the-canopy-brewery-company-a-new-bar-for-herne-hill/


The Milkwood is 6.2%?! No wonder I was so pissed


----------



## Fingers (May 28, 2015)

Crispy said:


> The Milkwood is 6.2%?! No wonder I was so pissed



Aye, it is proper stuff!


----------



## Miss-Shelf (May 28, 2015)

Manter said:


> It's remarkably common for people to do and say things to try and lose people their jobs over relatively minor or run of the mill slights. I've dealt with a dozen cases in my career so far of people writing to individuals employers (usually after after breakups) to trying and get them sacked. They range from 'whistleblowing' (s/he leaked confidential commercial information to the media/insider trading/party to unsafe working conditions) to the downright surreal (s/he runs an escort agency/people smuggling ring/has an inappropriate interest in children/has a cannabis farm in the basement). I have been surprised throughout my career how common it is.


I worked for a time in the rates office in Bootle and people were always shopping their neighbours and families and exes for non payment
horrible


----------



## Dexter Deadwood (May 28, 2015)

This is how people are and it cuts across the classes but when the poor do it to each other it becomes macabre.


----------



## Maharani (May 29, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I can't imagine why has no one posted here about the excellent Canopy Brewery opening for offy and drinking in. It's in the arches behind Costcutter. Don't know how often its opened before, its all very new and a bit disorganised and I didn't like the look of the portaloo. Fantabulousa beers though! I tried the bottled porter the draught wheat beer and IPA - all lovely. yum. Barman said they next open on Sunday from noon.
> 
> It was open last night for the grand opening party of their near neighbours Makerspace. And what a grand party it was - thanks Crispy and mates.


Erm, think it was posted some pages back...


----------



## Maharani (May 29, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Erm, think it was posted some pages back...


Can't find it now but I did read about it on here.


----------



## Fingers (May 29, 2015)

http://www.southwarknews.co.uk/news/disgust-at-racist-graffiti-outside-jazz-bar/


----------



## gaijingirl (May 29, 2015)

nothing on the graffiti arrest yet?...I have to admit to being on the edge of my seat - just such an odd thing.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 29, 2015)

I wash desperate for the hanging of a math teacher. Now I'm a bit bored of the idea.


----------



## Fingers (May 29, 2015)

Well the teacher is in the clear. It seems the Met Police think it was some overseas tourists (Italians I hear)

Detective from the Community Safety Unit at Southwark are investigating racist graffiti sprayed on the outside wall of a bar on Herne Hill, SE24.

The graffiti was sprayed at around 01:00hrs on Monday, 25 May. It was reported to police around twelve hours later.

At this early stage, detectives believe that the suspect is one of a group of tourists from overseas who were staying for a few days at a flat nearby.

On Tuesday, 26 May, police were alerted to a name being circulated on social media in relation to the graffiti. Officers spoke with the man named and established that he was not in London at the time of the incident. He is not a suspect in the investigation.

Enquiries continue to identify the person responsible for the graffiti.​http://news.met.police.uk/news/poli...end_list&utm_medium=email&utm_source=sendgrid


----------



## Fingers (May 29, 2015)

They should also put an advert on their site for a proof reader


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 29, 2015)

The tourist threat.

I hear then talk about it all the time on the telly.


----------



## gaijingirl (May 29, 2015)

It did seem unlikely to me that it would the teacher but I'm glad to have that confirmed.  also glad that the bar doesn't appear to be involved (as intimated by the headteacher).

The whole thing just proves how toxic this kind of language/graffiti is.


----------



## Belushi (May 29, 2015)

Fucking awful for the falsely accused teacher, hope he's been talking to his solicitor


----------



## Belushi (May 29, 2015)

hopefully the met will pursue this suspect even if they've returned home


----------



## Rushy (May 29, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> It did seem unlikely to me that it would him the teacher but I'm glad to have that confirmed.  also glad that the bar doesn't appear to be involved (as intimated by the headteacher).
> 
> The whole thing just proves how toxic this kind of language/graffiti is.


And just how toxic trial by social media is.


----------



## gaijingirl (May 29, 2015)

Rushy said:


> And just how toxic trial by social media is.



That's kind of what I meant.


----------



## discobastard (May 29, 2015)

Belushi said:


> Fucking awful for the falsely accused teacher, hope he's been talking to his solicitor


Agreed.  And yet there is still a petition on change.org to have him sacked, with comments such as 'this man disgusts me'.


----------



## SpamMisery (May 29, 2015)

discobastard said:


> Agreed.  And yet there is still a petition on change.org to have him sacked, with comments such as 'this man disgusts me'.



I feel sure they will issue a public apology to the teacher soon enough


----------



## alfajobrob (May 29, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> I feel sure they will issue a public apology to the teacher soon enough



Not likely when you see the latest update to the petition.

"29 May 2015 — There is CCTV footage, of the alleged culprit coming from *****'s house. Why is it, he is not being questioned by the police? Just because he wasn't allegedly there at the time, that does not mean he doesn't not have no connection to the crime.

We are calling for the school to suspend him, until proven he has no connection to the crime."


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 29, 2015)

It's like when someone shit in the sink at school.


----------



## Dan U (May 29, 2015)

Might want to take that persons name off alfajobrob


----------



## editor (May 29, 2015)

alfajobrob said:


> Not likely when you see the latest update to the petition.
> 
> "29 May 2015 — There is CCTV footage, of the alleged culprit coming from *****'s house. Why is it, he is not being questioned by the police? Just because he wasn't allegedly there at the time, that does not mean he doesn't not have no connection to the crime.
> 
> We are calling for the school to suspend him, until proven he has no connection to the crime."


I've removed the name from that post.


----------



## alfajobrob (May 29, 2015)

Dan U said:


> Might want to take that persons name off alfajobrob



Sorry!!!


----------



## Fingers (May 29, 2015)

Check this! 

 

Circa 1921


----------



## clandestino (May 29, 2015)

This bit - 



alfajobrob said:


> that does not mean he doesn't not have no connection to the crime



- make my head hurt.


----------



## Denmark (May 29, 2015)

> .. that does not mean he doesn't not have no connection to the crime



Amazing.


----------



## SpamMisery (May 29, 2015)

> .. that does not mean he doesn't not have no connection to the crime



I don't think I've seen a quadruple negative before


----------



## Ms T (May 29, 2015)

He's got them bang to to rights for libel.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 29, 2015)

Who is them


----------



## alfajobrob (May 29, 2015)

clandestino said:


> This bit -
> 
> 
> 
> - make my head hurt.



It doesn't not make my head hurt that it looks like I said it from your post though.


----------



## verity (May 29, 2015)

Direct from Met Press Bureau regarding the teacher:

"He is not a suspect in the investigation."

Couldn't be clearer.

Keep going...open yourselves up to being investigated for malicious communications.


----------



## alfajobrob (May 29, 2015)

verity said:


> Direct from Met Press Bureau regarding the teacher:
> 
> "He is not a suspect in the investigation."
> 
> ...



I don't think anyone on this board has done that to be fair - merely commenting on an ongoing dispute. I'm not a solicitor though so know jack really.

ETA
Is it malicious communications to tell you to fuck off?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 29, 2015)

Fuck off


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 29, 2015)

Did I live?


----------



## MAD-T-REX (May 29, 2015)

verity said:


> Keep going...open yourselves up to being investigated for malicious communications.


Lies aren't malicious communication and the offence of criminal libel has fallen out of use.


----------



## clandestino (May 29, 2015)

alfajobrob said:


> It doesn't not make my head hurt that it looks like I said it from your post though.



Yes, sorry. That wasn't not my intention to not do that. I think.


----------



## clandestino (May 29, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> I don't think I've seen a quadruple negative before



Even better, the full quote was...

"Just because he wasn't allegedly there at the time, that does not mean he doesn't not have no connection to the crime."


----------



## Fingers (May 29, 2015)

MAD-T-REX said:


> Lies aren't malicious communication and the offence of criminal libel has fallen out of use.



If it can be proven that this was set up to distress the victim, it can very easily be for Mal Comms but in this case, i think it would be hard to prove which leaves libel which is a civil matter.


----------



## clandestino (May 29, 2015)

There's been some interesting misuses of grammar in this case. 

First the graffiti includes an unnecessary apostrophe. Then the petition update features a quadruple (and possible quintuple) negative.

If this were Poirot, that would be a vital clue. 

But it's not obviously.


----------



## Fingers (May 29, 2015)

I suspect AirBNB will crop up in this investigation....


----------



## goldengraham (May 29, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Who is them



There's few people on here owe that guy an apology


----------



## Fingers (May 29, 2015)

goldengraham said:


> There's few people on here owe that guy an apology



Unless I missed it, I cannot remember anyone accusing him on here.


----------



## goldengraham (May 29, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Unless I missed it, I cannot remember anyone accusing him on here.



A couple of posts identified the person by linking directly to his Facebook and Twitter pages, though the posts and links were later removed.


----------



## Smick (May 29, 2015)

This guy has, on the face of it, been seriously wronged by several people, including the source of the cctv, the originator of the petition and the twitter account calling for his sacking. I think Urban 75 users are fairly far down the list of those who should apologise.


----------



## goldengraham (May 29, 2015)

Smick said:


> This guy has, on the face of it, been seriously wronged by several people, including the source of the cctv, the originator of the petition and the twitter account calling for his sacking. I think Urban 75 users are fairly far down the list of those who should apologise.



Reproducing that tweet in its full glory, as happened on this thread  along with some pretty judgmental comments, would make the person who republished it just as liable for an apology. If you republish someone else's libel then you are effectively making it too.


----------



## goldengraham (May 29, 2015)

MAD-T-REX said:


> Lies aren't malicious communication and the offence of criminal libel has fallen out of use.



Plenty of libel claims going through the civil courts though


----------



## Ms T (May 30, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Who is them


The organisers of the petition.


----------



## Rushy (May 30, 2015)

clandestino said:


> Even better, the full quote was...
> 
> "Just because he wasn't allegedly there at the time, that does not mean he doesn't not have no connection to the crime."


Aren't they Dizzee Rascal lyrics?


----------



## ddraig (May 30, 2015)

Why would you say that? What's up with his lyrics?


----------



## trashpony (May 31, 2015)

I only came on to say that my nephew went to dulwich hamlet and it was a state school but see things have moved on. Still, underlines how quick people are to take things they read online as being true with no evidence


----------



## editor (Jun 1, 2015)

Guardian comment: 
*The unexpected upside of a hate crime*


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Made the front page of the substandard....must be a quiet news day

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...led-on-bar-have-wrecked-my-life-10288805.html


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Made the front page of the substandard....must be a quiet news day
> 
> http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...led-on-bar-have-wrecked-my-life-10288805.html


Quiet news day or unfounded allegation that could have cost him everything?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Still hardly front page news...


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Still hardly front page news...


I don't remember it being on the front page, but I abandoned my copy on the tube.....


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

ddraig said:


> Why would you say that? What's up with his lyrics?


Er, did he say there was?

Also, do you even know where Herne Hill is? Do you have anything actually local to say?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

yep, story started on front paged, continued on page 7...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Yep, started on front page, continued on page 7...


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> yep, story started on front paged, continued on page 7...


I can see why tbh. Teacher = instantly sympathetic central character. Racism = always gets headlines. Twitter = fills their social media reporting quotient. Plus it all links to a national article so potentially ups their click through scores. I'm not a journalist (obviously) but I'd have thought that was media gold


----------



## Fingers (Jun 1, 2015)

From the comments

Milly253 

OK Everyone - My husband owes Dee Dee's and I can no longer read and listen to all of this without commenting. What everyone seems to have lost sight of is that the Owner and staff at the Bar are the victims of this racial hatred. Whilst I can empathise with Mr Turnham, here are some 'facts' that you may not be aware of and that may shed a different light of this awful situation. At no point in this ordeal has the owner or staff made any comments about this event - nor have they released the CCTV footage to the Press even though they were hounded for it - it has only been shown to the police. The footage shows a person coming from the direction of the entrance to the flats above the bar. They then go to the front of the terrance and it appears they are spraying graffiti - they then return to said doorway. This information was put out on the net so you can see why all the finger pointing has taken place. The facts are; that the 'supposed' tourist that the police are hunting for where supposed to have been staying in the flat above the bar - my husband has been informed that the owner of the flat above the bar rented his flat out but does not know who he rented it to? The person who owns this flat, that was rented to the tourist has never been interviewed by the police? I am not pointing the finger at anyone - however, there appears to be some unanswered questions here. Can I also state for the record that Dee Dee's which has been established for over three years now - has never once been under review for noise or any other 'illegal' activities with he local council as some people would have you believe.


----------



## gdubz (Jun 1, 2015)

Fingers said:


> From the comments



E2A - still getting to grips with quoting/replying, but...

Does airbnb give the owner of a flat the details of anyone who rents it for a weekend (presumably not)?

If the person who owns the bar didn't share the cctv footage, then how come a bunch of people from Huddersfield had it so they could start a petition on change.org? Do all the flats upstairs have cameras installed?

There are a lot of things that don't stack up about this.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Well, it's a right old mess innit


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

Fingers said:


> From the comments
> 
> Milly253
> 
> OK Everyone - My husband owes Dee Dee's and I can no longer read and listen to all of this without commenting. What everyone seems to have lost sight of is that the Owner and staff at the Bar are the victims of this racial hatred. Whilst I can empathise with Mr Turnham, here are some 'facts' that you may not be aware of and that may shed a different light of this awful situation. At no point in this ordeal has the owner or staff made any comments about this event - nor have they released the CCTV footage to the Press even though they were hounded for it - it has only been shown to the police. The footage shows a person coming from the direction of the entrance to the flats above the bar. They then go to the front of the terrance and it appears they are spraying graffiti - they then return to said doorway. This information was put out on the net so you can see why all the finger pointing has taken place. The facts are; that the 'supposed' tourist that the police are hunting for where supposed to have been staying in the flat above the bar - my husband has been informed that the owner of the flat above the bar rented his flat out but does not know who he rented it to? The person who owns this flat, that was rented to the tourist has never been interviewed by the police? I am not pointing the finger at anyone - however, there appears to be some unanswered questions here. Can I also state for the record that Dee Dee's which has been established for over three years now - has never once been under review for noise or any other 'illegal' activities with he local council as some people would have you believe.


So? Are they trying to hint it's the teacher? Or just confirm it happened and wasn't photoshopped as the mad head teacher suggested? I really don't see the point- it was racist so people accused of a crime that could cost them their jobs and result in death threats can't express their distress?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Who was stood on the grassy knoll


----------



## discobastard (Jun 1, 2015)

gdubz said:


> E2A - still getting to grips with quoting/replying, but...
> 
> Does airbnb give the owner of a flat the details of anyone who rents it for a weekend (presumably not)?
> 
> ...


They didn't have the footage.  They launched the petition based on hearsay.  They have stepped back from the accusation they made but have still not apologised.  They are now attacking the headmaster.

https://www.change.org/p/sonia-case...-racist-vandalism-on-dee-dee-s-bar-herne-hill


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Who was stood on the grassy knoll


What the fuck have the FBI got to do with it?


----------



## organicpanda (Jun 1, 2015)

gdubz said:


> E2A - still getting to grips with quoting/replying, but...
> 
> Does airbnb give the owner of a flat the details of anyone who rents it for a weekend (presumably not)?
> 
> ...


Airbnb gives the name, mobile number and email address of the person who books it, Airbnb also have enough info about the people booking through their site to make the life of the slackest plod really easy


----------



## Dan U (Jun 1, 2015)

discobastard said:


> They didn't have the footage.  They launched the petition based on hearsay.  They have stepped back from the accusation they made but have still not apologised.  They are now attacking the headmaster.
> 
> https://www.change.org/p/sonia-case...-racist-vandalism-on-dee-dee-s-bar-herne-hill


Enjoying the 'we removed your name Mr actual name but we will continue to use your actual name' 

Whole thing is totally fubar. Really hope for all concerned dibble deal with this properly.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Jun 1, 2015)

This story is a bit nuts but it seems odd the teacher chose to live above the bar and now has the arrogance to start complaining (along with others) to the council about noise.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jun 1, 2015)

Iirc you have to give credit card details to Airbnb to book.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Manter said:


> What the fuck have the FBI got to do with it?



Probably the CIA...


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

DJWrongspeed said:


> This story is a bit nuts but it seems odd the teacher chose to live above the bar and now has the arrogance to start complaining (along with others) to the council about noise.


If that happened. We don't know whether he lives above or opposite: we don't know when he moved in: we don't know whether he has made any complaints: we don't know whether the noise from the venue has changed. We know fuck all, but mud has been chucked and some is apparently sticking


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Manter said:


> If that happened. We don't know whether he lives above or opposite: we don't know when he moved in: we don't know whether he has made any complaints: we don't know whether the noise from the venue has changed. We know fuck all, but mud has been chucked and some is apparently sticking



The news story does state he is one of the neighbours complaining about noise...


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> The news story does state he is one of the neighbours complaining about noise...


One 'fact'*, let's pillory the bloke!

*For varying values of fact, given it's the standard


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Manter said:


> One 'fact'*, let's pillory the bloke!
> 
> *For varying values of fact, given it's the standard



I'm not claiming it is fact, I'm just pointing out it has been reported.

I'm not sure what's what in this story anymore....


----------



## Manter (Jun 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> I'm not claiming it is fact, I'm just pointing out it has been reported.
> 
> I'm not sure what's what in this story anymore....


Noise and fury signifying nothing..... Feel sorry for the bar owners and the teacher, tbh.


----------



## Smick (Jun 1, 2015)

Is it not that he has objected to an extension of the closing time due to noise concerns, not about the existing noise? I think that's fair enough.

Maybe someone is trying to discredit the licence objectors.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

It's the tourist threat...I blame airport security...


----------



## discobastard (Jun 1, 2015)

Dan U said:


> Enjoying the 'we removed your name Mr actual name but we will continue to use your actual name'
> 
> Whole thing is totally fubar. Really hope for all concerned dibble deal with this properly.


They also had a comment on their Facebook page asking anybody if they 'know how to remove negative comments from posts'.  Which is incredibly hypocritical. 

They're not exactly covering themselves in glory with this one.


----------



## Maharani (Jun 1, 2015)

They hate tourists in Gracia, Barcelona...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 1, 2015)

Smick said:


> Is it not that he has objected to an extension of the closing time due to noise concerns, not about the existing noise?



Standard says "Mr Turnham is among a number of neighbours to have written to the local council asking for the bar’s licence to be reviewed over noise complaints."


----------



## ddraig (Jun 1, 2015)

Manter said:


> Er, did he say there was?
> 
> Also, do you even know where Herne Hill is? Do you have anything actually local to say?


why so defensive?
it was the implication, just because someone doesn't understand the lyrics of a certain act it does not mean there aren't lots of meanings and intelligence contained in them

yes I do actually, I've been there plenty, not that I have to justify myself to you


----------



## Maharani (Jun 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Made the front page of the substandard....must be a quiet news day
> 
> http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...led-on-bar-have-wrecked-my-life-10288805.html


Poor bugger.


----------



## Fingers (Jun 1, 2015)

FFS who is behind that petition?  For the record, I met the head teacher today on a totally unrelated matter and she is nothing like they are portraying.  They are an embarrassment to those of us who actively fight against racism and inequality.


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Jun 2, 2015)

> At no point in this ordeal has the owner or staff made any comments about this event


Sounds sensible.



> This information was put out on the net so you can see why all the finger pointing has taken place.


Oh, so someone who saw the CCTV did comment, effectively inviting people to blame the teacher (or another resident).

This is assuming that the author of this comment has anything to do with the bar. It's impossible to tell what's bullshit and what isn't. 



> The facts are; that the 'supposed' tourist that the police are hunting for where supposed to have been staying in the flat above the bar - my husband has been informed that the owner of the flat above the bar rented his flat out but does not know who he rented it to? The person who owns this flat, that was rented to the tourist has never been interviewed by the police? I am not pointing the finger at anyone - however, there appears to be some unanswered questions here


'I'm just asking questions' is a pathetic thing to say when throwing around allegations this toxic and insinuating that the resident is lying ('supposed' tourist).


----------



## goldengraham (Jun 2, 2015)

I see the LCC does beginners' media law courses. Maybe U75 could negotiate a group discount on behalf of this thread


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 2, 2015)

The law is an ass....


----------



## Fingers (Jun 2, 2015)

goldengraham said:


> I see the LCC does beginners' media law courses. Maybe U75 could negotiate a group discount on behalf of this thread



As far as I am aware, the issue of whether hyperlinking to a libellous claim is repeating the libel has yet to be tested in court.  

It seems it went before the High Court in 2010 (Spectator Magazine vs Islam Expo) and the claim was not upheld, but it also seems that the matter was not resolved to any meaningful degree either.

http://www.5rb.com/case/islam-expo-ltd-v-the-spectator-1828-ltd-pollard/


----------



## Rushy (Jun 2, 2015)

Fingers said:


> As far as I am aware, the issue of whether hyperlinking to a libellous claim is repeating the libel has yet to be tested in court.
> 
> It seems it went before the High Court in 2010 (Spectator Magazine vs Islam Expo) and the claim was not upheld, but it also seems that the matter was not resolved to any meaningful degree either.
> 
> http://www.5rb.com/case/islam-expo-ltd-v-the-spectator-1828-ltd-pollard/



To be fair, they were looking at the legality of recklessly re-tweeting unsubstantiated malicious content and spent little time considering the ignorance of such an act, which had been pretty much universally accepted.


----------



## goldengraham (Jun 2, 2015)

Fingers said:


> As far as I am aware, the issue of whether hyperlinking to a libellous claim is repeating the libel has yet to be tested in court.
> 
> It seems it went before the High Court in 2010 (Spectator Magazine vs Islam Expo) and the claim was not upheld, but it also seems that the matter was not resolved to any meaningful degree either.
> 
> http://www.5rb.com/case/islam-expo-ltd-v-the-spectator-1828-ltd-pollard/



That is interesting, but it was also a judgment made in the days before links to Tweets etc visually replicated the content of the tweet in question. Such a post would now certainly be viewed as defamation as you are effectively retweeting the defamatory tweet - there's a good summary of it here


----------



## discobastard (Jun 2, 2015)

They have now (at last) apologised to the teacher in question. 

https://www.change.org/p/sonia-case...-racist-vandalism-on-dee-dee-s-bar-herne-hill


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 2, 2015)

That might be the moodiest apology I've heard in some time....


----------



## Rushy (Jun 2, 2015)

Even adding the word "whatever" might have made that apology sound more sincere.


----------



## editor (Jun 2, 2015)

Update: 
Dee Dee’s bar in Herne Hill thanks the community for their support with event on June 4th


----------



## editor (Jun 2, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> That might be the moodiest apology I've heard in some time....


Blimey. Caps galore.


> WHO EVER RENTED OUT THE FLAT TO THESE TOURISTS, WHO ARE THEY WHERE ARE THEY FROM, WHO HAS SEEN THEM. DO NOT DARE LABEL THEM AS OVERSEAS…. DOES TOURIST MEAN STAYING WITH A MATE AND GO SIGHT SEEING… MORE TRANSPARENCY PLEASE… (PEOPLE WITHIN THE LAW AND GOVERNMENT)
> MY COMMUNITY ARE FACING RACISM ON A DAILY BASIS..... STOP THIS!!!!


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 2, 2015)

discobastard said:


> They have now (at last) apologised to the teacher in question.
> 
> https://www.change.org/p/sonia-case...-racist-vandalism-on-dee-dee-s-bar-herne-hill



That's a pretty pathetic excuse of an apology by someone who has engaged his/ her anger before engaging his / her brain. Doesn't come over as sincere at all, seems like they don't give a shit about dragging an innocent man's name through the mud.


----------



## Maharani (Jun 2, 2015)

It's a disgrace is what it is.


----------



## discobastard (Jun 2, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> That might be the moodiest apology I've heard in some time....


It's the most passive aggressive thing I think I've ever read.


----------



## discobastard (Jun 2, 2015)

editor said:


> Blimey. Caps galore.


And then this line:

_"we have issued a public apology and are deeply sorry for the actions, others have taken upon themselves to find justice, in relation to this petition."_

Er, what?  Sounds a bit like 'we started this but can't be held responsible for any of the fallout'.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 2, 2015)

More from the comments section of the Standard article...


----------



## SpamMisery (Jun 2, 2015)

"Apologise for being black"?!!


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 2, 2015)

“We understand this is alleged, however this man has been fighting against the bar”

A loaded sentence if ever there was one.

Now, I read plenty of Sherlock Holmes when I was younger, and this classic quote always stayed with me:

“How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, _however improbable_, must be the truth?”

So it is improbable that the bar themselves sprayed the vile graffiti, but not impossible - motive being the stitch-up of the person originally accused and who they have understood to be "fighting against the bar”.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 2, 2015)




----------



## editor (Jun 2, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> “We understand this is alleged, however this man has been fighting against the bar”
> 
> A loaded sentence if ever there was one.
> 
> ...


I think there's far more probable and likely scenarios to pursue and rule out before the elaborate "they did it themselves, guv" ruse becomes a credible candidate. 

The allegation - if proved untrue - is also deeply defamatory.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 2, 2015)

editor said:


> I think there's far more probable and likely scenarios to pursue and rule out before the elaborate "they did it themselves, guv" ruse becomes a credible candidate.



Indeed. I am presuming the Police are assessing all angles,will rule out the impossible, and apprehend the culprit, no matter how improbable.


----------



## editor (Jun 2, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> Indeed. I am presuming the Police are assessing all angles,will rule out the impossible, and apprehend the culprit, no matter how improbable.


I'd just be very wary of repeating any as-yet evidence-unsupported fanciful theories.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 2, 2015)

I saw a copper out with a protractor this morning....


----------



## oryx (Jun 2, 2015)

I'm surprised (or maybe I'm not) that the defamatory comments have stayed up for all to see on change.org.


----------



## Smick (Jun 2, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> Indeed. I am presuming the Police are assessing all angles,will rule out the impossible, and apprehend the culprit, no matter how improbable.


Or maybe have placed it in the bundle of work marked "last week" and will never look at it again.


----------



## discobastard (Jun 2, 2015)

.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

Some individuals are pushing the 'conspiracy' angle on the Dee Dee's racist graffiti - check out the comments at the foot on the Buzz article (compete with urban rant). I'm the "chief hater" apparently after I suggested that posting up a load of evidence-free supposition could be defamatory.



> But of course this is all about race – a black-owned bar was dared to be criticised by a white person, possibly a “gentrifier”. Clearly that cannot be allowed. So maybe this defamatory nonsense was cooked up to punish the individual.
> 
> Which was then picked up by social media and willingly amplified by the haters on the local urban site. However, throughout the whole storm the chief hater on urban hasn’t felt it necessary to raise the issue of defamation – until now. And in doing so he just demonstrates his partiality, bias and racism.



http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2015/06/...ity-for-their-support-with-event-on-june-4th/


----------



## Rushy (Jun 3, 2015)

Have the bar owners made any comment about the mistaken targeting of their neighbour? Or about the group of individuals who apparently took it upon themselves to publicly shame him?


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 3, 2015)

Think this might feature on BBC London today...


----------



## Rushy (Jun 3, 2015)

Any idea when?


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Have the bar owners made any comment about the mistaken targeting of their neighbour? Or about the group of individuals who apparently took it upon themselves to publicly shame him?


Did the bar accuse anyone directly? If so, they should make a statement.

Was there any proven connection between them and the people posting up the accusatory  comments? If not, I don't see why they should have to make any statements.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> Did the bar accuse anyone directly? If so, they should make a statement.
> 
> Was there any proven connection between them and the people posting up the accusatory  comments? If not, I don't see why they should have to make any statements.


Interesting position. I agree that they are not obliged to make any comment. However, given their central role in the whole affair and the fact that this poor chap had been categorically cleared by the police, I'd like to think they will play a part in explicitly condemning such unacceptably divisive and bullying behaviour in their immediate community. In much the same way the community has rallied in their support by condemning the racist graffiti.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 3, 2015)

6.30 show I think


----------



## ddraig (Jun 3, 2015)

yes let's concentrate on the poor wrongly accused getting justice and apologies from everyone
as that's the most important and crucial issue of course...


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 3, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Interesting position. I agree that they are not obliged to make any comment. However, given their central role in the whole affair and the fact that this poor chap had been categorically cleared by the police, I'd like to think they will play a part in explicitly condemning such unacceptably divisive and bullying behaviour in their immediate community. In much the same way the community has rallied in their support by condemning the racist graffiti.



That would be sensible. However as posted above by Nanker this reply by the partner of the bar owner in the Standard suggests that common sense is in short supply:

_*Milly25NEW*2 days ago

To answer your question Cpr1055 - Mr Anderson has never made a statement to the Times and why is everyone ignoring the fact that the so called tourists that the police are hunting were staying in the flat above the bar - and who owns the flat above the bar? This is a good opportunity to explain the 'mysterious' goings on in the flat above the bar. And by the way - when you say Mr Anderson should apologise - it that for being black?????_

Very peculiar, is about as euphemistic as I can put it.


----------



## discobastard (Jun 3, 2015)

ddraig said:


> yes let's concentrate on the poor wrongly accused getting justice and apologies from everyone
> as that's the most important and crucial issue of course...


Some quality one-dimensional thinking there.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> That would be sensible. However as posted above by Nanker this reply by the partner of the bar owner in the Standard suggests that common sense is in short supply:
> 
> _*Milly25NEW*2 days ago
> 
> ...


Who is "Milly25NEW22", what is their connection to the bar and why do you feel that they are a reliable source?


----------



## discobastard (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> Who is "Milly25NEW22", what is their connection to the bar and why do you feel that they are a reliable source?


Milly states that she is the husband of the bar's owner, in the comment below the one quoted.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...led-on-bar-have-wrecked-my-life-10288805.html


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

discobastard said:


> Milly states that she is the husband of the bar's owner, in the comment below the one quoted.


I think I'll take a reader's comment with a pinch of salt for now.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> Who is "Milly25NEW22", what is their connection to the bar and why do you feel that they are a reliable source?



Go to the link with the Evening Standard story and find out for yourself (that's the typical response you usually give when asked about market traders etc etc)
Could be that "Milly" is a troll stirring up shit, but the Standard is happy enough to publish it, so I'll take it at face value whilst bearing other possibilities in mind.
Also, if you go here:
http://www.hernehill.org.uk/racist-graffiti-outside-herne-hill-bar
you will note that the lengthy post by D Brand is identical to the post by Milly25 in the Standard.

_OK Everyone - My husband owes Dee Dee's and I can no longer read and listen to all of this without commenting. What everyone seems to have lost sight of is that the Owner and staff at the Bar are the victims of this racial hatred. Whilst I can empathise with Mr Turnham, here are some 'facts' that you may not be aware of and that may shed a different light of this awful situation. At no point in this ordeal has the owner or staff made any comments about this event - nor have they released the CCTV footage to the Press even though they were hounded for it - it has only been shown to the police. The footage shows a person coming from the direction of the entrance to the flats above the bar. They then go to the front of the terrance and it appears they are spraying graffiti - they then return to said doorway. This information was put out on the net so you can see why all the finger pointing has taken place. The facts are; that the 'supposed' tourist that the police are hunting for where supposed to have been staying in the flat above the bar - my husband has been informed that the owner of the flat above the bar rented his flat out but does not know who he rented it to? The person who owns this flat, that was rented to the tourist has never been interviewed by the police? I am not pointing the finger at anyone - however, there appears to be some unanswered questions here. Can I also state for the record that Dee Dee's which has been established for over three years now - has never once been under review for noise or any other 'illegal' activities with he local council as some people would have you believe_

What gets me is how did an organisation such as the Cocoa Butter Project (based in Huddersfield according to their Facebook page) get to learn so quickly of the events that transpired? The police themselves say the incident was reported to them at around 13.00 Monday 25/06/2015.
Cocoa Butter Project first post was on 26/06/2015. A few obvious questions that would help clarify the situation for many are:
Did CBP know the incident had been reported to the police?
How did they know about the graffiti? 
Who gave them the info if it was not in the public realm?
Why did they immediately point the finger at a man without checking first? 

Something doesn't add up, unless someone has other ideas.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> Could be that "Milly" is a troll stirring up shit, but the Standard is happy enough to publish it....


If you see what else the Standard prints, I wouldn't put much store in that.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> If you see what else the Standard prints, I wouldn't put much store in that.



I read that shit rag on the bus home from work, I'm well aware of the crap they print, cheers


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> What gets me is how did an organisation such as the Cocoa Butter Project (based in Huddersfield according to their Facebook page) get to learn so quickly of the events that transpired? The police themselves say the incident was reported to them at around 13.00 Monday 25/06/2015.
> Cocoa Butter Project first post was on 26/06/2015.


 It was posted both here on the 25th and on Buzz the same day, and was all over Twitter and Facebook minutes later, so why on earth shouldn't they find out about it a day later?


----------



## discobastard (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> If you see what else the Standard prints, I wouldn't put much store in that.


Nicely done.  Deflect the answers to your question and infer they are untrue because of some other unspecified, unrelated value judgment.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

But there does seem to be some concerted finger pointing going on. I've just had this comment added to the Buzz post: 



> How can you say that the CCTV doesn’t show anyone coming out of the side of the building, have you seen it? I was very sad to see that such vile abuse was sprayed on the wall of DeeDees. Whilst it would be terrible to be wrongly accused of this has anyone thought how awful it might be for the staff who work there? This bar contribute so much to our community, they have brilliant poetry evenings, comedy and music and they support a children’s theatre group that would not be able to continue without their help. Let’s suppose that the teacher is completely innocent and a tourist did this as suggested. It’s very strange that anyone would allow a stranger stay in their flat without knowing anything about them. Even Airbnb keep details of their clients.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 3, 2015)

e2a to post 919
because it is a massive conspiracy against the poor accused of course!!  (not just uninformed people passing on info without checking)
all those making comments and those retweeting them must be brought before them to apologise profusely


----------



## Belushi (Jun 3, 2015)

Whole things a bloody mess


----------



## discobastard (Jun 3, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> I read that shit rag on the bus home from work, I'm well aware of the crap they print, cheers


It was in the comments section.  It wasn't part of the Standard's article.  Has anybody actually looked at any of this or are you all just throwing opinions about without actually bothering to look?!


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

discobastard said:


> Nicely done.  Deflect the answers to your question and infer they are untrue because of some other unspecified, unrelated value judgment.


Would that "unrelated value judgement" be that the 'proof' was coming in the shape of an unverified reader comment on the Standard's website? Perhaps you blindly take those at face value, but I very much reserve the right to be extremely cynical about their authenticity.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

discobastard said:


> It was in the comments section.  It wasn't part of the Standard's article.  Has anybody actually looked at any of this or are you all just throwing opinions about without actually bothering to look?!


The Standard is fucking shit, as are most of the reader comments it attracts. Is that better for you?


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 3, 2015)

discobastard said:


> It was in the comments section.  It wasn't part of the Standard's article.  Has anybody actually looked at any of this or are you all just throwing opinions about without actually bothering to look?



I read the Standards online piece, with all the comments. I went to the Herne Hill.org site's online page and found that identical post. I checked the police link. Thanks to editor for confirming that the vile graffiti was originally mentioned here in the Herne Hill thread on the 25th - it could explain how the CBP caught wind of the story so quickly.


----------



## discobastard (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> The Standard is fucking shit, as are most of the reader comments it attracts. Is that better for you?


I think if you read my post it says the the author 'states' they are the wife of the owner.  Not *is* the wife of the owner. 

The comment sounds like it comes from a fairly well informed position, so while I am not going to accept it as a universal truth I may accept it as one of the more credible parts of this overall discourse. Much of which has been emotionally charged and in some cases more obviously unreliable and clearly hearsay. 

Is that better for you?


----------



## Rushy (Jun 3, 2015)

None of us knows who did the graffiti. It's pointless to speculate. However, we do appear to know who didn't do it, as they have been cleared of suspicion by the police.

We also know that the bar owners appear to understand the pain of aggressive  persecution and the importance of community and neighbour support in recovering from that.



> We have received so much support from so many that we really and truly feel inspired and hopeful in a situation which frankly left us bewildered, violated and down-heartened.



It's nice of them to offer free drinks to anyone and everyone who can get there before 8 but it would be far more generous and meaningful to offer words of support to their neighbour who also has every right to be feeling violated and bewildered, yet probably not feeling quite so inspired and hopeful just now.

The lack of even an acknowledgement makes all the community blather coming from them sound terribly hollow.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 3, 2015)

so what would be good enough for you? the commenters eating their words in front of the Ritzy?

them on their hand and knees outside the neighbours flat begging for his forgiveness?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 3, 2015)

you don't half babble some pony at times...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 3, 2015)

ddraig said:


> so what would be good enough for you? the commenters eating their words in front of the Ritzy?
> 
> them on their hand and knees outside the neighbours flat begging for his forgiveness?



Hari Kari


----------



## ddraig (Jun 3, 2015)

Rushy said:


> None of us knows who did the graffiti. It's pointless to speculate. However, we do appear to know who didn't do it, as they have been cleared of suspicion by the police.
> 
> We also know that the bar owners appear to understand the pain of aggressive  persecution and the importance of community and neighbour support in recovering from that.
> 
> ...


hollow? seriously?


----------



## Treacle Toes (Jun 3, 2015)

So it was an unknown tourist that happened to have a spray can with them. Okay then.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 3, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> you don't half babble some pony at times...


Says the fellow who jumped right in and then had to delete his own post .


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 3, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Says the fellow who jumped right in and then had to delete his own post .



I only deleted it because it contained a quote from a deleted post be A N Other. I thought that was appropriate.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 3, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Says the fellow who jumped right in and then had to delete his own post .


is this some sort of oneupmanship game to you??


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 3, 2015)

Rutita1 said:


> So it was an unknown tourist that happened to have a spray can with them. Okay then.



Who just happened to be staying in the flat upstairs

.....owned by who????

There's a guy defending the teacher on FB (claiming to be his friend) talking up all kinds of things, but also giving lots away...on the Shit London page...


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

Rushy said:


> ...appear to understand the pain of aggressive  persecution....


----------



## discobastard (Jun 3, 2015)

ddraig said:


> so what would be good enough for you? the commenters eating their words in front of the Ritzy?
> 
> them on their hand and knees outside the neighbours flat begging for his forgiveness?


More unhelpful hyperbole!
Round of applause to you for adding absolutely nothing to the discussion.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


>


Not exactly the strongest criticism of my post, is it?


----------



## ddraig (Jun 3, 2015)

discobastard said:


> More unhelpful hyperbole!
> Round of applause to you for adding absolutely nothing to the discussion.


what the fuck are you adding?


----------



## Manter (Jun 3, 2015)

God there are a lot of people making themselves look like complete tits over this.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

I'm going to make the OTC Bar the featured club night of the fortnight in the next issue of the Lambeth Weekender. I think they deserve some sort of recognition for steadfastly sticking at it.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> I'm going to make the OTC Bar the featured club night of the fortnight in the next issue of the Lambeth Weekender. I think they deserve some sort of recognition for steadfastly sticking at it.



Yer big softy


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Yer big softy


I'm a fool to myself at times.


----------



## discobastard (Jun 3, 2015)

ddraig said:


> what the fuck are you adding?


A couple of fairly even handed facts.


----------



## Thimble Queen (Jun 3, 2015)

editor said:


> I'm going to make the OTC Bar the featured club night of the fortnight in the next issue of the Lambeth Weekender. I think they deserve some sort of recognition for steadfastly sticking at it.



I've reported this post for trolling


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 4, 2015)

Graffiti-gate just hit the bbc news!


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 4, 2015)

How was it? Any light shed on this murky affair?


----------



## Denmark (Jun 4, 2015)

> Graffiti-gate just hit the bbc news!



If it's last night's BBC London prog you mean, I missed the item and can't find it through Google nor iPlayer so does anyone have a link? Tks.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 4, 2015)

Sister Midnight said:


> How was it? Any light shed on this murky affair?



Nah, just the maths bloke side of things...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 4, 2015)

Denmark said:


> If it's last night's BBC London prog you mean, I missed the item and can't find it through Google nor iPlayer so does anyone have a link? Tks.



I saw it on breakfast...


----------



## pesh (Jun 4, 2015)

editor said:


> I'm going to make the OTC Bar the featured club night of the fortnight in the next issue of the Lambeth Weekender. I think they deserve some sort of recognition for steadfastly sticking at it.


Did they give you a free drink or 3?


----------



## editor (Jun 4, 2015)

pesh said:


> Did they give you a free drink or 3?


The one time I went they were too incompetent to actually serve us, so we gave up.


----------



## Fingers (Jun 4, 2015)

On BBC London now, interview with Tom in Brockwell Park (I think)   Should be on Iplayer later


----------



## Ms T (Jun 4, 2015)

Cyril the squirrel has been released - but seems reluctant to leave his deluxe Herne Hill pad... Elaine is secretly delighted!


----------



## Rushy (Jun 4, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Cyril the squirrel has been released - but seems reluctant to leave his deluxe Herne Hill pad... Elaine is secretly delighted!


He'll be joining the others living in my roof in no time. It's sometimes like I've woken up in a scene of The Babadook.


----------



## Fingers (Jun 4, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Cyril the squirrel has been released - but seems reluctant to leave his deluxe Herne Hill pad... Elaine is secretly delighted!



I had them coming into the flat through the windows a couple of years ago.  They used to come in, wreck the place and fuck off. 

I cornered one in the kitchen armed with a brush but that did not end awfully well as it went mental.  I chased it round the flat for a bit and I manage to lock it in the bathroom eventually and was too paranoid to go in there for the rest of the night.  It must have left via the window as it was not there in the morning. 

They proper kick off.


----------



## Dan U (Jun 4, 2015)

Rushy said:


> He'll be joining the others living in my roof in no time. It's sometimes like I've woken up in a scene of The Babadook.


Quieter than possums.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 4, 2015)

Dan U said:


> Quieter than possums.


Possums are far more sociable. I will dig out a photo of a possum drinking from my can of VB.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 5, 2015)

Fingers said:


> On BBC London now, interview with Tom in Brockwell Park (I think)   Should be on Iplayer later



Or cry player?


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 5, 2015)

discobastard said:


> And then this line:
> 
> _"we have issued a public apology and are deeply sorry for the actions, others have taken upon themselves to find justice, in relation to this petition."_
> 
> Er, what?  Sounds a bit like 'we started this but can't be held responsible for any of the fallout'.



This excellent post by "Marsha Frey" on the petition site nails it firmly:

_The individual behind this petition is a born idiot. You have the nerve to say to Thomas 

" you have been found to be an innocent man and we have issued a public apology and are deeply sorry for the actions, others have taken upon themselves to find justice, in relation to this petition."

The action of others? You mean YOUR ACTIONS!! You were the one's who spread hearsay as fact, encouraging the abuse, and now it's blown up in your face. Prepare to be sued.

"Tom Thurnham" - It's Turnham._


----------



## Rushy (Jun 5, 2015)

Did anything come out in the various interviews with the teacher? I didn't see any of them.

Did they shed any light on the story being circulated that, although he was cleared, the graffiti was carried out by tourists staying at his flat whom he claims not to know?


----------



## Fingers (Jun 5, 2015)

Yesterday's Interview will be on this link when then BBC finally decide to put it up.  It is about ten mins into the programme.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b05x6nvh


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Jun 5, 2015)

Is this all about the internet and not real life ?????

If I was a primary school teacher I'd make sure people couldn't attack/troll me anyway.

Edit: good response from the Head Teacher on the schools website


----------



## discobastard (Jun 5, 2015)

299 old timer said:


> This excellent post by "Marsha Frey" on the petition site nails it firmly:
> 
> _The individual behind this petition is a born idiot. You have the nerve to say to Thomas
> 
> ...


Quite.  There's one from a Ben Clasper too (click on 'latest') which is rather a robust in its criticism.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 5, 2015)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Is this all about the internet and not real life ?????
> 
> If I was a primary school teacher I'd make sure people couldn't attack/troll me anyway.



How would you do that? It's not possible is it? 

And I don't think you can separate the internet from 'real life' either (in general, but particularly here). If he's named online as doing something like this what's he supposed to say when people in real life talk to him about it, 'it doesn't count it's just the internet'?


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Jun 5, 2015)

The difference on the internet with a case like this is that the context becomes the internet rather the school and postcode in question.

As the Head Teacher points out all manner of loons from Huddersfield and crazed mental health workers jump on this. The ability to pin it on him and adverse is exponentially magnified.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jun 6, 2015)

I note that the petition is closed.


----------



## Ms T (Jun 6, 2015)

In other Herne Hill news, a bunch of Neapolitans are opening a pizza place on Dulwich Rd, complete with wood-fired oven.  They tell me they're opening next week.  This is a Good Thing.  Milkwood was packed when I passed at around 12 today.


----------



## editor (Jun 6, 2015)

Had a delicious spinach and cream cheese pasty from the Blackbird Bakery. The coffee wasn't so good but still decent


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 6, 2015)

Ms T said:


> In other Herne Hill news, a bunch of Neapolitans are opening a pizza place on Dulwich Rd, complete with wood-fired oven.  They tell me they're opening next week.  This is a Good Thing.  Milkwood was packed when I passed at around 12 today.



In the old plumbers? Got a flyer for something opening on Norwood Road too today - food & drink but I forget what. Next to the children's play place. The lido & park were busy today.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jun 6, 2015)

That's some sort of coffee parlour on Norwood Road.  Good luck to them but I think you need to sell good food to succeed in HH.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 6, 2015)

Lizzy Mac said:


> That's some sort of coffee parlour on Norwood Road.  Good luck to them but I think you need to sell good food to succeed in HH.


It's called The Parlour, I think. Met the owner (or one of the two) in the park. Teacher until very recently. Seemed very nice.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jun 6, 2015)

editor said:


> Had a delicious spinach and cream cheese pasty from the Blackbird Bakery. The coffee wasn't so good but still decent


I like it there but I reckon sesame is a bit better across the road


----------



## brixtonblade (Jun 6, 2015)

Rushy said:


> It's called The Parlour, I think. Met the owner (or one of the two) in the park. Teacher until very recently. Seemed very nice.


I think that's the one opening in the old Ladbrokes
Agree with you, I think HH has plenty of coffee so figure they'll need to be special


----------



## editor (Jun 6, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> I like it there but I reckon sesame is a bit better across the road


I shall give that a go next time!


----------



## Rushy (Jun 6, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> I like it there but I reckon sesame is a bit better across the road


Certainly if I'm eating anything more than a muffin I go to Sesame. Thai curry soup on a Monday is very very tasty. Love Blackbirds white sourdough though.


----------



## Ms T (Jun 6, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> In the old plumbers? Got a flyer for something opening on Norwood Road too today - food & drink but I forget what. Next to the children's play place. The lido & park were busy today.



Almost on the corner, near the barber's shop and Dial-A-Pizza.


----------



## Ms T (Jun 6, 2015)

Best coffee in Herne Hill by quite a long way is from the Arcade Cafe in the railway tunnel, run by a very nice Moroccan chap called Mustafa.  In the afternoons his mate Mohammed is in charge, but Mustafa makes slightly better coffee.  Apparently staff from Blackbird and Sesami both get their coffee from him as it's much better than the stuff sold in either establishment.  I agree.


----------



## Smick (Jun 6, 2015)

Ms T said:


> .  Milkwood was packed when I passed at around 12 today.


 And a lot earlier too!
Two things have Herne Hill buzzing from 9.30. People doing the parkrun all go for coffee and hang around for an hour. Then parents whose kids go to South London Dance School have an hour to kill and will go to Milkwood, Blackbird. And then at 12 you get the normal people just moseying down for lunch, drinks etc. It's non-stop.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 7, 2015)

Even more exciting is that a Neapolitan is opening a pizza place, where the tattoo place was, opposite the main park entrance.


----------



## Ms T (Jun 8, 2015)

See #971.


----------



## prunus (Jun 8, 2015)

Smick said:


> And a lot earlier too!
> Two things have Herne Hill buzzing from 9.30. People doing the parkrun all go for coffee and hang around for an hour. Then parents whose kids go to South London Dance School have an hour to kill and will go to Milkwood, Blackbird. And then at 12 you get the normal people just moseying down for lunch, drinks etc. It's non-stop.



And yet, hilariously, Off The Cuff remains ghost-town deserted through it all


----------



## leanderman (Jun 8, 2015)

A neapolitan proper pizza oven place is opening on Wednesday,


Ms T said:


> See #971.



Apologies - I have must have been asleep.

The owner speaks not a word of English, which is somehow encouraging.


----------



## Crispy (Jun 8, 2015)

Fingers said:


> I wrote this review a couple of days ago and forgot to post it in here
> 
> http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2015/05/the-canopy-brewery-company-a-new-bar-for-herne-hill/


Now open every Thursday and Friday night


----------



## Fingers (Jun 8, 2015)

CCTV of the racist vandal point toward the culprit being a blurry man 

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crim...d-no-n-at-south-london-jazz-bar-10304407.html


----------



## editor (Jun 8, 2015)

> A Metropolitan Police spokesman said: “Detectives believe that the suspect is not, as previously stated, one of a group of overseas tourists who were staying at a flat nearby


Well, that's going to spoil a few conspiracy theories that were floating around.


----------



## ddraig (Jun 8, 2015)

did the school/head apologise for saying it was photoshopped?


----------



## Maharani (Jun 8, 2015)

And again, the plot thickens...


----------



## discobastard (Jun 8, 2015)

ddraig said:


> did the school/head apologise for saying it was photoshopped?


http://www.dulwichhamletjuniorschool.org.uk/documents/FridaystatementfromHead.pdf


----------



## ddraig (Jun 8, 2015)

discobastard said:


> http://www.dulwichhamletjuniorschool.org.uk/documents/FridaystatementfromHead.pdf


saw that but didn't see an apology

even though they say themselves "think before you post"


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 8, 2015)

discobastard said:


> http://www.dulwichhamletjuniorschool.org.uk/documents/FridaystatementfromHead.pdf



That statement is pure horrorshow...

Lynchings in the deep south!!!!!

For fuck sake....


----------



## editor (Jun 8, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> That statement is pure horrorshow...
> 
> Lynchings in the deep south!!!!!
> 
> For fuck sake....


Godwin's law is breached too.


----------



## Dan U (Jun 8, 2015)

discobastard said:


> http://www.dulwichhamletjuniorschool.org.uk/documents/FridaystatementfromHead.pdf


Another misjudged statement from the school. It is entirely understandable they want to publicly stand by their member of staff given the circumstances but the language in that is really wrong, just like the original statement from them.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 8, 2015)

editor said:


> Godwin's law is breached too.



That head is a loonpot.

The type of horrific behaviour she cites is consigned to the history books is it?

There's still plenty of atrocities being carried across the planet.....like being tied to a chair and dropped off a tall building for being homosexual!!!

None of which trial be media comes close to really....


----------



## Belushi (Jun 8, 2015)

Only a teacher could write this bit 



> In conclusion, we would politely request that all those responsible for promoting the vile social media campaign get in touch with the school to acknowledge that they have behaved badly and apologise


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 8, 2015)

Belushi said:


> Only a teacher could write this bit



They've let the school down, let their parents down, but most all, let themselves down...


----------



## Rushy (Jun 8, 2015)

Dan U said:


> Another misjudged statement from the school. It is entirely understandable they want to publicly stand by their member of staff given the circumstances but the language in that is really wrong, just like the original statement from them.


It's not a great statement. Should have kept it simple. But then she is probably fucking fuming and pretty emotional. So I can forgive it. Good on her for standing by him throughout.



Belushi said:


> Only a teacher could write this bit



 Exactly right!


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 8, 2015)

Rushy said:


> It's not a great statement. Should have kept it simple. But then she is probably fucking fuming and pretty emotional. So I can forgive it. Good on her for standing by him throughout.



If anyone should be able to maintain a modicum of self restraint and not be emotional or fuming when producing a public statement then I would expect it to be the head teacher of a school.

That statement is just a loopy rant. 

I have letters from my Son's previous head which are equally bonkers..actually, I've been packing to move, and found loads of letters from teachers that are just around the bend. I was tempted to scan them all. I've kept one especially bizarre novel of letter which has at least 25 laugh out loud sentences.

On the whole all the teachers and heads, deputy heads, I've dealt with have been more childish than the kids....and many of them were completely doolally.


----------



## choochi (Jun 13, 2015)

Pizzeria Pellone - the new Neapolitan pizza place on Dulwich Road is very good. I only had a take away but it was delicious. It was packed on the opening night last night.


----------



## editor (Jun 16, 2015)

I am a man of my word. A positive plug for OTC!


----------



## brixtonblade (Jun 16, 2015)

I take it that's a stock photo: 2 caps and one headband but no bona fide hats.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 16, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> I take it that's a stock photo: 2 caps and one headband but no bona fide hats.



Basically 'round the table'


----------



## editor (Jun 16, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> I take it that's a stock photo: 2 caps and one headband but no bona fide hats.


I would have needed a time machine to take a picture of the event taking place in the hat-laden OTC bar before the event, innit.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 16, 2015)

OCT certainly will be over the moon.


----------



## editor (Jun 16, 2015)

Rushy said:


> OCT certainly will be over the moon.


The *Ontario College of Teachers?*


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 16, 2015)

Office of Clinical Trials


----------



## Fingers (Jun 16, 2015)

Office for Caps and Trilbies


----------



## Rushy (Jun 16, 2015)

editor said:


> The *Ontario College of Teachers?*


Them too.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 16, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Office for Caps and Trilbies


No. Not them.


----------



## se5 (Jun 17, 2015)

According to today's Evening Standard property section the OTC "bar and furniture shop is an über-cool live music venue by night" -  http://www.homesandproperty.co.uk/a...-value-flats-herne-hill-are-more-popular-ever


----------



## uk benzo (Jun 17, 2015)

se5 said:


> According to today's Evening Standard property section the OTC "bar and furniture shop is an über-cool live music venue by night" -  http://www.homesandproperty.co.uk/a...-value-flats-herne-hill-are-more-popular-ever



Sickening article. I wouldn't even wipe my arse with that rag.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jun 17, 2015)

And by day?


----------



## Fingers (Jun 17, 2015)

se5 said:


> According to today's Evening Standard property section the OTC "bar and furniture shop is an über-cool live music venue by night" -  http://www.homesandproperty.co.uk/a...-value-flats-herne-hill-are-more-popular-ever



Prices from that article 

*Average prices: buying houses and flats in Herne Hill*
One-bedroom flat: £362,000
Two-bedroom flat: £515,000
Two-bedroom house: £662,000
Three-bedroom house: £874,000
Four-bedroom house: £1.09 million

When I first moved to London from Manchester, 14 years ago, my friends were living in Loughborough Junction but were moving to Herne Hill and told me that it was a bit rough but pretty OK with a decent pub. It has not even got that now. :-( 

Pretty sure one of my friends bought a nice two bed for about £150k. Me and my ex were renting a nice two bed second floor flat for £500 a month between us. Depressing.


----------



## CH1 (Jun 18, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> Sickening article. I wouldn't even wipe my arse with that rag.


I didn't find it sickening - but I query the use of the phrase "Le Herne, which translated from the Anglian etc"

I come from the exact middle of East Anglia, and we were always taught that the Angles, Saxons and Jutes were Germanic tribes who overran/migrated to Britain as the Roman Empire withdrew up its own....

This being the case, how did these Anglians come to be speaking French then?


----------



## uk benzo (Jun 18, 2015)

CH1 said:


> I didn't find it sickening - but I query the use of the phrase "Le Herne, which translated from the Anglian etc"
> 
> I come from the exact middle of East Anglia, and we were always taught that the Angles, Saxons and Jutes were Germanic tribes who overran/migrated to Britain as the Roman Empire withdrew up its own....
> 
> This being the case, how did these Anglians come to be speaking French then?



The article was just a property-masturbate celebration of unaffordable housing and a wink/nudge to those who do have a property to sell.


----------



## editor (Jun 18, 2015)

se5 said:


> According to today's Evening Standard property section the OTC "bar and furniture shop is an über-cool live music venue by night" -  http://www.homesandproperty.co.uk/a...-value-flats-herne-hill-are-more-popular-ever


Hahaha. Wonderful!


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 18, 2015)

"Good value flats"?!! Hurrumph 
And Dulwich Village is not south of Herne Hill...


----------



## Biddlybee (Jun 18, 2015)

It's south east of it isn't it?


----------



## kl8041 (Jun 18, 2015)

choochi said:


> Pizzeria Pellone - the new Neapolitan pizza place on Dulwich Road is very good. I only had a take away but it was delicious. It was packed on the opening night last night.


Yeah, seconded - I was in there on Tuesday and four of us had a great meal with wine for not much money at all, and there was a queue out the door as we were leaving. A queue, on a Tuesday! Good luck to 'em.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 18, 2015)

D


kl8041 said:


> Yeah, seconded - I was in there on Tuesday and four of us had a great meal with wine for not much money at all, and there was a queue out the door as we were leaving. A queue, on a Tuesday! Good luck to 'em.



Do they deliver? I'm lazy


----------



## Rushy (Jun 18, 2015)

I was in there last night. Lovely food. Friendly place. It will do well.


----------



## choochi (Jun 18, 2015)

leanderman said:


> D
> 
> 
> Do they deliver? I'm lazy


I think it's collection only.


----------



## editor (Jun 18, 2015)

choochi said:


> I think it's collection only.


It's as real shame the Half Moon has gone as I would have liked to done a booze'n'gig'n'pizza jaunt over to Herne Hill.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 18, 2015)

Friend in Spenser rd had her fuel tank emptied yesterday.

Thief drilled through the bottom and took £40 of petrol.

Quite common according to the garage in Croxted Rd.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 18, 2015)

Biddlybee said:


> It's south east of it isn't it?


Of the station. Not of the entire post code...


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Jun 18, 2015)

I read an article recently featuring an interview with a young chap that runs a 'gourmet' popcorn business, somehow they managed to make it into a full page spread with this innovative entrepreneur. His USB? Freshly bagged popcorn that is sold never 2 days more than when it was made. 

One of the markets he apparently visits is Herne Hill, how much a bag of this fabled, fresh, exclusive popcorn! £4.85


----------



## SpamMisery (Jun 18, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Friend in Spenser rd had her fuel tank emptied yesterday.
> 
> Thief drilled through the bottom and took £40 of petrol.
> 
> Quite common according to the garage in Croxted Rd.



Bloody hell. All that effort for £40. How much will it cost to get fixed? I'd happily pay someone the £40 in cash


----------



## leanderman (Jun 18, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> Bloody hell. All that effort for £40. How much will it cost to get fixed? I'd happily pay someone the £40 in cash



Exactly. What a risk to take for £40!

She's a single mum and has had to replace the whole tank


----------



## SpamMisery (Jun 18, 2015)

How likely is it the drilling could cause a spark?

[EDIT] apparently even 'non sparking tools' are not immune to causing sparks


----------



## Rushy (Jun 18, 2015)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> I read an article recently featuring an interview with a young chap that runs a 'gourmet' popcorn business, somehow they managed to make it into a full page spread with this innovative entrepreneur. His USB? Freshly bagged popcorn that is sold never 2 days more than when it was made.
> 
> One of the markets he apparently visits is Herne Hill, how much a bag of this fabled, fresh, exclusive popcorn! £4.85


He makes it there so I imagine it's all fresh on the day. Not tried it but it doesn't half make you jump when the vat of kernels suddenly explodes as you wander past bleary eyed.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 18, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> How likely is it the drilling could cause a spark?
> 
> [EDIT] apparently even 'non sparking tools' are not immune to causing sparks



plastic tank


----------



## Ms T (Jun 19, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Friend in Spenser rd had her fuel tank emptied yesterday.
> 
> Thief drilled through the bottom and took £40 of petrol.
> 
> Quite common according to the garage in Croxted Rd.


My friend's parents once had the whole engine taken out of their car while they were on holiday, and it was parked on their drive in Islington.    They only found out when the car wouldn't start (obviously) and they called a mechanic.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 19, 2015)

Ms T said:


> My friend's parents once had the whole engine taken out of their car while they were on holiday, and it was parked on their drive in Islington.    They only found out when the car wouldn't start (obviously) and they called a mechanic.



wow


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 19, 2015)

Ms T said:


> My friend's parents once had the whole engine taken out of their car while they were on holiday, and it was parked on their drive in Islington.    They only found out when the car wouldn't start (obviously) and they called a mechanic.





Now I'm no expert in these things, but wouldn't it make more sense just to go down the traditional route and steal the whole car?


----------



## Greebo (Jun 19, 2015)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> <snip> One of the markets he apparently visits is Herne Hill, how much a bag of this fabled, fresh, exclusive popcorn! £4.85


That's one huge mark up - I used to make and sell cones of homemade toffee popcorn at school and guide fetes for 10p a cone* and still made 8p profit on each.

*each cone was a sheet of kitchen roll, with one corner saved for the flap.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jun 19, 2015)

Greebo said:


> That's one huge mark up - I used to make and sell cones of homemade toffee popcorn at school and guide fetes for 10p a cone* and still made 8p profit on each.
> 
> *each cone was a sheet of kitchen roll, with one corner saved for the flap.


Yeah, it's a stupid mark up but I stopped trying to work these things out when the market started selling scotch eggs for four pounds


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 20, 2015)

And the cheap game & fowl turned out to be Chinese.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 20, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Prices from that article
> 
> *Average prices: buying houses and flats in Herne Hill*
> One-bedroom flat: £362,000
> ...


It was all boarded up shops and tumble weed when we moved in.


----------



## GarveyLives (Jun 21, 2015)

*The ethnic majority's righteous indignation about what was placed on "social media" by whom about whom coveniently obscures a simple fact.*​
*If you are not one of the "social media" obsessed members of the local ethnic majority, then it must be an absolutely terrifying experience to wake up outside your home or to arrive at your business and find that these words appear.*​


----------



## SpamMisery (Jun 21, 2015)

Are you suggesting that the only people who were outraged by the witch hunt on social media were part of the "ethnic majority"?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 22, 2015)

I'm sure I've just seen Mr Humbles, Herne Hills Fourways Pharmacist - on a TV ad.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jun 22, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I'm sure I've just seen Mr Humbles, Herne Hills Fourways Pharmacist - on a TV ad.



love him...


----------



## leanderman (Jun 22, 2015)

Pellone pizzas are pretty decent. Prices seem good too.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jun 23, 2015)

someone on one of the FB West Norwood pages saying about how their tank was drilled for petrol too.  Must be a thing now.


----------



## Smick (Jun 23, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> someone on one of the FB West Norwood pages saying about how their tank was drilled for petrol too.  Must be a thing now.


You'd be lucky to find my car with more than £20 worth in it. I wonder how they choose which car to go for. Even if a big car has an 80l tank, and they get it full, it still seems a lot of effort for £100 worth of petrol which you'll probably have to get into another car fairly sharpish.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 23, 2015)

It was a very battered VW Golf


----------



## billythefish (Jun 23, 2015)

Smick said:


> You'd be lucky to find my car with more than £20 worth in it. I wonder how they choose which car to go for. Even if a big car has an 80l tank, and they get it full, it still seems a lot of effort for £100 worth of petrol which you'll probably have to get into another car fairly sharpish.


... and have an 80 litre container to wield about.


----------



## Smick (Jun 23, 2015)

Bastards will thieve anything they can get away with.


----------



## T & P (Jun 23, 2015)

I used to have a Piaggio scooter and they have this design fault whereby the fuel line is accessible by simply sticking your hand underneath the bodywork. As a result the model is regularly targetted by fuel thieves. I didn't care about the £7 worth of fuel but every time they did it they'd break some seal inside and between the parts and the minimum labour charge imposed by the garage, it'd cost nearly £100 to put right.

I got done about three times in 9 years, and every time it was a major (and costly) pain. I seriously considered glueing razor blades to the underside of the bodywork.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 23, 2015)

T & P said:


> I used to have a Piaggio scooter and they have this design fault whereby the fuel line is accessible by simply sticking your hand underneath the bodywork. As a result the model is regularly targetted by fuel thieves. I didn't care about the £7 worth of fuel but every time they did it they'd break some seal inside and between the parts and the minimum labour charge imposed by the garage, it'd cost nearly £100 to put right.
> 
> I got done about three times in 9 years, and every time it was a major (and costly) pain. I seriously considered glueing razor blades to the underside of the bodywork.


I sold my ET4 shortly after moving to central Brixton because it invariably had drill bits sticking out of the ignition in the mornings.


----------



## kl8041 (Jun 25, 2015)

leanderman said:


> It was a very battered VW Golf


Some fucktard stole the Golf badge off the bonnet of my VW parked in HH the other day - took one off another nearby Golf as well. I still can't figure out _why_.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 25, 2015)

kl8041 said:


> I still can't figure out _why_.



They are thieves?


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 25, 2015)

They're the Beastie Boys?


----------



## kl8041 (Jun 25, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> They are thieves?


Well they would only be thieves _after_ they took the badge, so it doesn't really count as incentive to take it in the first place. A new badge only costs about £11 - maybe they're flogging it on eBay and I'll be buying my own badge back when I finally get around to replacing it.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 25, 2015)

kl8041 said:


> I'll be buying my own badge back when I finally get around to replacing it.


Boring! Get a different badge- a tongue in cheek Lamborghini... Beastie Boys... Or more usefully a clock like Flava Flav (I think)


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 27, 2015)

Pub seemed unusually empty late this afternoon. Has everyone gone to Glastonbury?


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 27, 2015)

Canopy was v busy, as was the commercial / Milkwood / pullens
 Otc seems to be running on private parties now.

Lots of Reej people are away this weekend though.


----------



## Smick (Jun 27, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I sold my ET4 shortly after moving to central Brixton because it invariably had drill bits sticking out of the ignition in the mornings.



I was out for a walk in Brockwell the other night and spotted an ET burnt out at the far south west corner, near the top of Brockwell Park Gardens.


----------



## Greebo (Jun 27, 2015)

Smick said:


> I was out for a walk in Brockwell the other night and spotted an ET burnt out at the far south west corner, near the top of Brockwell Park Gardens.


In other years, some pizza scooters etc have been targeted and then left burnt out - just because.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 27, 2015)

There are so many fewer scooters around these days. There was a time when we seemed to be going all Mediterranean. I guess everyone has moved to bikes?


----------



## choochi (Jul 10, 2015)

Saw this on the Herne Hill forum newsletter, potentially good news!...

*"Hot off the press*
We have it on good authority that Dulwich Estates have now agreed terms with a pub operator for the Half Moon, and that there will be no residential accommodation above the pub.  We won’t find out who the operator is until the lease agreement is signed.  But once we know, we can start to lobby for live music to return to the venue – watch this space…"


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 10, 2015)

Ha, had just come to share the same thing...


----------



## Rushy (Jul 10, 2015)

What's the betting that it is Antic?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 10, 2015)

Do Antic and Dulwich Estates have history?


----------



## Rushy (Jul 10, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> Do Antic and Dulwich Estates have history?


Not that I know of. Just that that keep expanding and they don't have one here.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jul 10, 2015)

I'd be reasonably happy if it was Antic. Their places are generally OK. At least they're recognisably pubs which is better than the 'more or less a restaurant' type of pub that I think is probably the alternative.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 10, 2015)

I'd be happier if it was the last landlord back simply on the experience of two of the nights he put on in the backroom. 

This is despite his terrible kitchen revamp which got rid of pizzas and bringing in under cooked chicken.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 10, 2015)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> I'd be reasonably happy if it was Antic. Their places are generally OK. At least they're recognisably pubs which is better than the 'more or less a restaurant' type of pub that I think is probably the alternative.


They're ok. I really like The Sun. Getting a bit tired of their trendy on the cheap make overs. Agree it would be better as a pub with good food than a restauranty thing. I'd rather it was independent but that is risky as you never know what you are going to get!


----------



## prunus (Jul 10, 2015)

This is good news


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 10, 2015)

I wonder if I'll ever get my hand sewn Herne Hill Stitch and Bitch sign back that we used to hang on the snug door? 
I really miss the Half Moon, I felt sad walking past it yesterday.


----------



## Smick (Jul 10, 2015)

I've been to the Canopy Beer Co earlier and really enjoyed it. Nerdy / hipster / enthusiastic guys, £3.50 a pint, sitting outside down a back alley with trains running overhead, an old Citroën DS, my favourite car, and a couple of portaloos.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 10, 2015)

Smick said:


> I've been to the Canopy Beer Co earlier and really enjoyed it. Nerdy / hipster / enthusiastic guys, £3.50 a pint, sitting outside down a back alley with trains running overhead, an old Citroën DS, my favourite car, and a couple of portaloos.


beers great but its a shit view, the old citroen is the best bit. When I went people were only talking to their friends and no one talked to us, but perhaps that's 'cos we're weird.  And I'm never going to use that portaloo.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 10, 2015)

It's getting painted at the end of the month (the wall of saz which you look at) so will be a bit less car yard. but obviously still next to a car yard. Had a good chat with some people from space-makers the other day too.

It's still not meant to be a swanky pub though - it's a tap room for a brewery. At least the £ goes straight to a local couple & not punch / Greene King etc. 

New portaloo is a bit more space age!


----------



## Smick (Jul 10, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> beers great but its a shit view, the old citroen is the best bit. When I went people were only talking to their friends and no one talked to us, but perhaps that's 'cos we're weird.  And I'm never going to use that portaloo.


I got chatting to some nice couple from Manchester whose daughter owns it.

I'm not sure if the view bothers me, but maybe that's back to the Rubberbandits hipster or hobo where it's trendy to hang out in the shit part of town.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 12, 2015)

There's a very informal dog show up by the house in brockwell park from 2pm. Good for the kiddies and a bit of a laff.


----------



## Fingers (Jul 12, 2015)

So yesterday we took the Germans out for breakfast. We went to the Railway who were not doing breakfast but instead offered us the BBQ which was some overpriced £11 (ffs) for a burger crap so we went to Cafe Castello.

Three of us ordered the huge breakfast which turned up promptly, whilst myself and poptyping ordered the smaller breakfast which did not turn up before everyone else had finished eating so myself and Pop walked out in a massive huff and went to the Tulse Hill Cafe which was OKish.

We should have gone to Electric Cafe.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 12, 2015)

Fingers said:


> So yesterday we took the Germans out for breakfast. We went to the Railway who were not doing breakfast but instead offered us the BBQ which was some overpriced £11 (ffs) for a burger crap so we went to Cafe Castello.
> 
> Three of us ordered the huge breakfast which turned up promptly, whilst myself and poptyping ordered the smaller breakfast which did not turn up before everyone else had finished eating so mysef and Pop walked out in a massive huff and went to the Tulse Hill Cafe which was OKish.
> 
> We should have gone to Electric Cafe.


You're on the wrong thread! Good night?


----------



## Fingers (Jul 12, 2015)

Maharani said:


> You're on the wrong thread! Good night?



Well spotted ha ha.  Yeah it was brill!


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 12, 2015)

Maharani said:


> There's a very informal dog show up by the house in brockwell park from 2pm. Good for the kiddies and a bit of a laff.


Thanks for the tip.  Might go up and have a look before going to see the pictures on Josephine Avenue.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 12, 2015)

If you've got a dog you can enter it then and there. Like I said, it's very informal.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 12, 2015)

The dog show is being judged by Mark Rylance from Wolf Hall and is called ...

Woof Hall.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 12, 2015)

Haha!


----------



## Fingers (Jul 12, 2015)

It was great to see you lovely HH people tonight at G'S birthday. Mation and everyone else's names I cannot recall


----------



## GarveyLives (Jul 19, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> Are you suggesting that the only people who were outraged by the witch hunt on social media were part of the "ethnic majority"?







*Others here are far better placed than I am to speak for the concerns of Herne Hill's ethnic majority.*​


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 19, 2015)

GarveyLives why are you dragging that up again now after all this time, and posting that offessive graffiti pic again?  Please delete it.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 23, 2015)

Haven't been there since it reopened myself but just saw this crowdfunding thing from Cafe Prov...

http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/save-cafe-provencal


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 23, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> Haven't been there since it reopened myself but just saw this crowdfunding thing from Cafe Prov...
> 
> http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/save-cafe-provencal



That's sad to hear


----------



## Greebo (Jul 23, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> Haven't been there since it reopened myself but just saw this crowdfunding thing from Cafe Prov...
> 
> http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/save-cafe-provencal


£30,000 in 50 days? I wish the cafe luck, but don't fancy its chances.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 23, 2015)

I don't think I have ever been in there.

The handling of flood damages appears to have been a disgrace. 22 also went out of business as a result.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 23, 2015)

Greebo said:


> £30,000 in 50 days? I wish the cafe luck, but don't fancy its chances.


Quite...


----------



## T & P (Jul 23, 2015)

That's really sad. Great place. I hope they make it but it does look like quite a mountain to climb.

Between the very powerful and well-off Thames Water and the insurance company, it seems incredible (though I guess not that surprising) that an established loved business is about to go bust. In fact, why the fuck should the likes of Cafe Provençal have to invoke their insurer? How is this not the responsibility of Thames Water?


----------



## leanderman (Jul 24, 2015)

Had a couple of family meals there. Charming place. Reasonable food. And feels like you are on holiday somehow.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 24, 2015)

T & P said:


> That's really sad. Great place. I hope they make it but it does look like quite a mountain to climb.
> 
> Between the very powerful and well-off Thames Water and the insurance company, it seems incredible (though I guess not that surprising) that an established loved business is about to go bust. In fact, why the fuck should the likes of Cafe Provençal have to invoke their insurer? How is this not the responsibility of Thames Water?


Some ridiculous insurance loophole?


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 24, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I don't think I have ever been in there.
> 
> The handling of flood damages appears to have been a disgrace. 22 also went out of business as a result.


I thought that reopened. Did it close again?


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jul 24, 2015)

Bit confused how come they need the money now after apparent refurb (& they've looked busy when I've passed). Maybe all on loans? I


----------



## technical (Jul 24, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> I thought that reopened. Did it close again?



Yes. Not sure if it was related to the flood but its definitely closed for good.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 24, 2015)

Shame.  Thought it was a bit pricey but shitty for places to have to close because of the flood


----------



## Twattor (Jul 24, 2015)

Sister Midnight said:


> Bit confused how come they need the money now after apparent refurb (& they've looked busy when I've passed). Maybe all on loans? I



From the crowdfunder page:



> "We were underinsured by 50%.  To re-open and keep paying our staff, we had to beg, borrow and (not) steal. Times were impossibly hard.
> 
> When our insurance payment did come through, not only was it 50% below what the restoration cost us, but of the sum provided, 7% went straight to the loss assessor; £11,000 went straight to our insurer's appointined clean up team (although we were assured Thames Water would pay for them); and a huge chunk went towards storage fees for a year while we worked to recover our devastated cafe - for all this time we were having to service hefty credit card payments wracked up from the flood, and still having to pay our suppliers and business operating fees whilst closed."


----------



## Rushy (Jul 24, 2015)

Twattor said:


> From the crowdfunder page:


I still don't really get it. Surely it wasn't their own insurers who had to pay out? Even if they were 0% insured, it's surely Thames Water and their insurers who are liable for all the losses?


----------



## Maharani (Jul 24, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I still don't really get it. Surely it wasn't their own insurers who had to pay out? Even if they were 0% insured, it's surely Thames Water and their insurers who are liable for all the losses?


I just messaged to ask...


----------



## editor (Jul 24, 2015)

That new pizza place is ace.


----------



## leanderman (Jul 24, 2015)

editor said:


> That new pizza place is ace.



Very good indeed. Decent prices.Proper Naples


----------



## editor (Jul 24, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Very good indeed. Decent prices.Proper Naples


I like the unfussy service too. Bottled beer was a bit pricey but that's no biggie when the pizzas taste great and start from £4.55.

http://pizzeriapellone.co.uk/our-menu/


----------



## Fingers (Jul 24, 2015)

I have just spoken to Cafe Prov on the phone to get some more details.  The guy I need to speak to (Adam - owner?) is away for two weeks so that is all we are going to get unfortunately.


----------



## Smick (Jul 24, 2015)

I don't see the attraction in donating money to a business to keep it going. I'll happily spend there, but I have better things to spend my money on.


----------



## Winot (Jul 24, 2015)

Smick said:


> I don't see the attraction in donating money to a business to keep it going. I'll happily spend there, but I have better things to spend my money on.



Yeah the whole crowdfunding of capitalist ventures is a bit odd. That said, I'd happily dig into my pocket for somewhere I owe allegiance to like A&C Continental or LS Mash in their rather extraordinary circumstances, and perhaps this falls into that category.  Although as Rushy says, it's all a bit unclear.


----------



## discobastard (Jul 24, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I still don't really get it. Surely it wasn't their own insurers who had to pay out? Even if they were 0% insured, it's surely Thames Water and their insurers who are liable for all the losses?


With this you could either claim through Thames Water's insurance, or you could claim through your own policy.  Your own insurer would then have to re-claim from Thames Water's insurers.  The advantage of claiming through your own is that it would probably be far quicker, and then let them deal with Thames' insurers who are dealing with a much bigger and more complex claim and hence it taking far longer (time in which you can't get back to running your business - or relocating to alternative premises if you can).

With business insurance, you can choose to have material damage cover (includes theft etc), and also business interruption.  If you don't have business interruption cover then obviously every minute you are not in business then you are effectively losing cash.  It's fairly common for businesses to go down because either they chose not to buy business interruption cover or they have underestimated the length of business interruption they need (12 months might seem like a long time but not if premises need rebuilding, planning permission needs to be sought etc - or if the premises landlord doesn't have buildings cover or drags their heels).

(I don't know whether Thames' insurance would cover business interruption or not and so am not commenting)

It can be a really messy business.  Yes, sometimes insurers will try and wriggle out of things, but also, sometimes, businesses simply don't pay enough attention to what cover they are buying - or over the years the business gets bigger but they don't update the policy/inventory and so find themselves underinsured)

None of this is a comment on who should or shouldn't pay for what, just context.

ETA: Business interruption insurance covers the loss of income a business suffers after an incident that prevents trade. The income loss covered may be closure of the business premises or the rebuilding process.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 24, 2015)

discobastard said:


> With this you could either claim through Thames Water's insurance, or you could claim through your own policy.  Your own insurer would then have to re-claim from Thames Water's insurers.  The advantage of claiming through your own is that it would probably be far quicker, and then let them deal with Thames' insurers who are dealing with a much bigger and more complex claim and hence it taking far longer (time in which you can't get back to running your business - or relocating to alternative premises if you can).
> 
> With business insurance, you can choose to have material damage cover (includes theft etc), and also business interruption.  If you don't have business interruption cover then obviously every minute you are not in business then you are effectively losing cash.  It's fairly common for businesses to go down because either they chose not to buy business interruption cover or they have underestimated the length of business interruption they need (12 months might seem like a long time but not if premises need rebuilding, planning permission needs to be sought etc - or if the premises landlord doesn't have buildings cover or drags their heels).
> 
> ...


Cheers. I still don't entirely get it but then I find insurance horribly complicated and an very cynical about it. If they are claiming against their own insurance then obviously they were under insured. But normally where there is no fault your issuer would act for you in legal action against the party at fault, no? Maybe they didn't have legal action cover? (Which is very cheap)


----------



## Smick (Jul 24, 2015)

Winot said:


> Yeah the whole crowdfunding of capitalist ventures is a bit odd. That said, I'd happily dig into my pocket for somewhere I owe allegiance to like A&C Continental or LS Mash in their rather extraordinary circumstances, and perhaps this falls into that category.  Although as Rushy says, it's all a bit unclear.



I think the only way you can support a business is to give them your trade. Pitching in to a fund to fight Network Rail would be fine, but I am sure A&C Continental wouldn't take cash off someone for no reason. Do Cafe Prov have to pay VAT on the money which they will receive on this? Treat it as any other income?

What happens if everyone clubs in and stumps up their £30k and some other element of the business becomes unmanageable and they close anyway? Upon taking money off people, I guess that they have some form of obligation to them.

What's probably best for Cafe Prov is for it to be sold as a going concern, use that money to become debt free, the staff keep their job and the community keeps the café.


----------



## discobastard (Jul 24, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Cheers. I still don't entirely get it but then I find insurance horribly complicated and an very cynical about it. If they are claiming against their own insurance then obviously they were under insured. But normally where there is no fault your issuer would act for you in legal action against the party at fault, no? Maybe they didn't have legal action cover? (Which is very cheap)


It *is* horribly complicated.  You also have loss adjusters involved, who may not be directly employed by the insurer, loss assessors, and 3rd party contractors who will do emergency and remedial work.  All these parties involved, alongside all of the damage inspections, health and safety issues, several different businesses with various different policies and insurers all trying to deal with Thames means it's never going to be quick, easy or perfect.

The legal thing can be an option if you think you have a case, but at the same time I imagine some people simply can’t face the huge amount of time, money, resource and stress that getting legal potentially means (after having had to deal with their business falling about their ears) – and again it's time away from getting back on your feet.

Again, not a comment on this particular case, just context.   Too complex for me to speculate, any road.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 24, 2015)

It just riles me that in a case of such clear cut culpability, a business can go under. At the time:



> Thames Water said its loss adjusters Cunningham Lindsey were speaking to owners and tenants of all 36 properties affected by the flooding to discuss their claims.
> 
> The company has admitted liability and said in a statement: “If our pipe has burst and caused damage then it’s our responsibility to put things right.”


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jul 24, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Cheers. I still don't entirely get it but then I find insurance horribly complicated and an very cynical about it. If they are claiming against their own insurance then obviously they were under insured. But normally where there is no fault your issuer would act for you in legal action against the party at fault, no? Maybe they didn't have legal action cover? (Which is very cheap)


Their insurer will recover the money from Thames Water, but they can only recover what it was insured for.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jul 24, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> Their insurer will recover the money from Thames Water, but they can only recover what it was insured for.



Surely they should be able to recover whatever Thames Water is legally liable for? What TW is covered for is between them and their insurers, but I don't see that anyone with a claim against TW should need to have anything to do with TWs insurers at all.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jul 24, 2015)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Surely they should be able to recover whatever Thames Water is legally liable for? What TW is covered for is between them and their insurers, but I don't see that anyone with a claim against TW should need to have anything to do with TWs insurers at all.


CP can only claim back from their own insurance company what they were insured for. That insurance company then gets the money off TW. 

What looks to have happened is that CP have underinsured and TW could go "Well you only insured for x so that's all your getting"...


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jul 24, 2015)

But I don't understand why some of the owners don't get together and sue, as TW knew about the leak....


----------



## Rushy (Jul 24, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> Their insurer will recover the money from Thames Water, but they can only recover what it was insured for.


Really. I'd imagined that the payout was only limited to the insured risk amount if your own insurer was liable for the payment (ie your fault or no one else at fault). If a third party was liable, I'd assumed their limit is the limit of their public liability (or whatever). Presumably they could still have the legal route open to them?

Ah. What  Monkeygrinder's Organ said.


----------



## Mr Retro (Jul 30, 2015)

We were up in The Commercial for Burger Night last night. £9 for burger chips and a pint. Very good and good value too. I like the pub too, it has a nice atmosphere. I must pitch up some afternoon and have many pints there.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 30, 2015)

Mr Retro said:


> We were up in The Commercial for Burger Night last night. £9 for burger chips and a pint. Very good and good value too. I like the pub too, it has a nice atmosphere. I must pitch up some afternoon and have many pints there.


I like that pub too. Twice I've had them I wasn't keen on their burgers (dense and overcooked) and the deal is only on pints I would not normally order. But I like it a lot as a place for a drink. Especially when the Gamma Ray is on.

A friend's daughter worked there briefly but all did not go smoothly!


----------



## Crispy (Jul 30, 2015)

editor said:


> That new pizza place is ace.


I have now tried this pizza and can confirm that it is *excellent* pizza
EDIT: Like "close your eyes and you'd think you were in Italy" excellent.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 31, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I like that pub too. Twice I've had them I wasn't keen on their burgers (dense and overcooked) and the deal is only on pints I would not normally order. But I like it a lot as a place for a drink. Especially when the Gamma Ray is on.
> 
> A friend's daughter worked there briefly but all did not go smoothly!


I gave up drinking in there when they made HH stitch and Bitch unwelcome (kept turning sound up and lights down)  but that was a while ago. What's it like now? Not bothered about food - tell me about beer, cleanliness and company.

The Gamma Ray? please explain.


----------



## T & P (Jul 31, 2015)

I like it, nice vibe at weekends. I much prefer it to The Florence. The (small) garden at the back is a sun trap in the afternoons. The men's toilets are a bit rank though. I hope the ladies' is kept better.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 31, 2015)

smell was off putting - mens toilet smelt rank last time I was there too and stank out the bar on the right. Ladies loos in basement usually stank too and always needed lights, locks, soap and paper.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 31, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I gave up drinking in there when they made HH stitch and Bitch unwelcome (kept turning sound up and lights down)  but that was a while ago. What's it like now? Not bothered about food - tell me about beer, cleanliness and company.
> 
> The Gamma Ray? please explain.


Just feels like a pub. In the winter I loved the fires and paneling. And in summer I'm loving everyone just sat out front.

Gamma Ray is just another trendy hoppy pint. But very tasty. Seems to be off a lot.


----------



## Twattor (Jul 31, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Gamma Ray is just another trendy hoppy pint. But very tasty. Seems to be off a lot.



Brewed by Beavertown, originally from De Beauvoir estate in Haggerston but now relocated to Hackney.  Brewery is owned by Logan Plant, son of Robert Plant.  Beer was absolutely rubbish until about two years ago when they abandoned trying to brew cask and went keg only.  Now better and very fashionable.


----------



## Belushi (Jul 31, 2015)

Twattor said:


> Brewed by Beavertown, originally from De Beauvoir estate in Haggerston but now relocated to Hackney.



Tottenham now.


----------



## Twattor (Jul 31, 2015)

Belushi said:


> Tottenham now.



I stand corrected.  When they were starting out they were brewing out of Duke's Brew and Que on the corner of Downham/Hertford Road.  That's are well worth a visit for their barbecue omelet brunch thing, and they do the hottest wings known to man which will strip the skin from any part of you that you're foolish enough to touch.  Be advised that they'll put 12.5% on the price of the beer if they bring it to your table, though.


----------



## editor (Sep 1, 2015)

What's the Parlour coffee shop like? Anyone been?


----------



## Manter (Sep 1, 2015)

editor said:


> What's the Parlour coffee shop like? Anyone been?
> 
> View attachment 76065


Yes, lovely cake. Coffee not a patch on the kiosk under the station, but fine.


----------



## editor (Sep 1, 2015)

Help needed for Herne Hill Music Festival on 6th Sept:



> S.O.S. The Herne Hill Music Festival has been planning to put on bandstand music (three bands) at the Herne Hill Sunday Market on 6th September. But this community event may have to be cancelled because there are insufficient volunteers available to help erect and strike the stage platform and marquee on the day. Cover is needed because England is England, where there is always an excellent chance for rain in September, and bands aren't always prepared to play electrical instruments in rain ponchos. There is also a second bandstand date set for 4 bands on Sept. 13th in jeopardy for the same reason. Can any of you help out?We need 3 reasonably strong people at 9am, to meet by the front of the station, and again at 3pm.Please email Alan Taylor - alan.taylor@dpmail.co.uk - if you can  help - BEFORE THE END OF WEDNESDAY Sept 2nd to save this first Festival event for 2015! Read more about this dilemma at http://bit.ly/1hR9Stt


----------



## SpamMisery (Sep 1, 2015)

Manter said:


> Yes, lovely cake. Coffee not a patch on the kiosk under the station, but fine.



That place is great. Half the time the bloke has fucked off, but I always wait around for him if I can - he's rarely far away


----------



## Manter (Sep 1, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> That place is great. Half the time the bloke has fucked off, but I always wait around for him if I can - he's rarely far away


Ms T told me about it and it is fantastic


----------



## SpamMisery (Sep 1, 2015)

Oh wait, this is the Herne Hill forum. Sorry, I thought we were talking about the guy under Brixton Station. Eeek, sorry!


----------



## Manter (Sep 1, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> Oh wait, this is the Herne Hill forum. Sorry, I thought we were talking about the guy under Brixton Station. Eeek, sorry!


I don't know who that is…. which stall?


----------



## SpamMisery (Sep 1, 2015)

On the right hand side opposite the fruit stall as you enter from Atlantic Rd. A few metres from the steps up to the train station ticket office. It's a hole in the wall. Tiny. Enough space for a coffee machine and a person.


----------



## Manter (Sep 1, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> On the right hand side opposite the fruit stall as you enter from Atlantic Rd. A few metres from the steps up to the train station ticket office. It's a hole in the wall. Tiny. Enough space for a coffee machine and a person.


will try it


----------



## SpamMisery (Sep 1, 2015)

I can only vouch for the espresso. I guess everything else should be fine.


----------



## prunus (Sep 2, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> Oh wait, this is the Herne Hill forum. Sorry, I thought we were talking about the guy under Brixton Station. Eeek, sorry!



Get ye gone, foul interloper!


----------



## Rushy (Sep 8, 2015)

Anyone else heard of a proposal to turn Brockwell Park into a common? A local shop keeper mentioned it the other day. Apparently cheaper to maintain.


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 8, 2015)

Is that part of the Lambeth Parks Review recommendations? Think the whole flawed ethos of that is to push park management on to a voluntary body who are responsible for fundraising etc. It'll never last in the real world.


----------



## Rushy (Sep 8, 2015)

How does Clapham Common work? Is it any different?

I think I quite like the idea of it being open. Not 100% sure though.


----------



## T & P (Sep 8, 2015)

Never knew what differences there might be, other than a park being fenced off and closed at night...


----------



## teuchter (Sep 8, 2015)

It means you are entitled to take your sheep to graze there.


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 9, 2015)

If anyone is free tomorrow the folks that did the cal aid collection on Sunday need a hand loading it tomorrow:


Dear All

We have managed to get a couple of vans to shift all the donations that were brought in last Sunday. The vans will take all the items to another church hall in Clapham where all the Cal-Aid donations are being packed ready to ship out.

We are commencing on Thursday at 11.00 a.m. And hopefully it will only take a few trips per van to cope with the quantity.

What we would really appreciate is any help in loading the vans at the Herne Hill end. There are volunteers at the other end but the more we have at our end the quicker and easier it will be. If you can make it then please come to the front of the station.

Please use all your contacts and twitter etc to spread the request out. Even if people cannot come until a little later then that would help.

Please follow the @hernehillforum on Twitter for updates.

Many, many thanks


Giles Gibson


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 22, 2015)

Plans for the top end of Railton Road (the Network Rail arches) have been released:

15/04174/FUL	 |			  Alterations and Change of Use of Units 313-327 and the railway arch behind, to include:  (1) Replacement of all shopfronts (Units 313-327) and a new shopfront to the railway arch accessed from Half Moon Lane.  (2) Change of use from Laundrette (Sui Generis) to Retail (A1) and merging Unit 313 (ground floor) with the rear of Unit 315 (ground floor).  (3) Reduction in size of Unit 315 retaining existing Retail (A1) use.   (4) Change of use from Storage (B8) and Restaurant (A3) to Retail (A1) and merging Unit 317 (ground floor) with the railway arch behind.  (5) Change of use from Retail (A1) and Storage (B8) to Restaurant/Café (A3) and merging Unit 317 (first floor) with Units 319-321 and the railway arch behind.  (6) Change of use from Offices (A2) to Retail (A1) and merging Units 323-327.  (7) Change of use from Storage (B8) to Retail (A1) of the railway arch accessed from Half Moon Lane.  (8) Extension/conversion of the existing 3 bedroom flat and void space above Units 313-315, to provide 1no. 1 bedroom flat and 1no. 2 bedroom flat.				  |																	  313 - 327 Railton Road London SE24 0JN

The Herne Hill Forum has already objected on a number of grounds:

A) there's already a surplus of A3 units 
B) it's too big and will attract a chain which will undermine the area 
C) it doesn't fit with what's already there 
D) it'll add to the street litter problem - there's no bin storage anywhere.


----------



## Crispy (Sep 22, 2015)

Part of the proposal includes turning this arch under the railway bridge into a shopfront.


----------



## editor (Sep 22, 2015)

Crispy said:


> Part of the proposal includes turning this arch under the railway bridge into a shopfront.
> 
> View attachment 77040


What was it before? A station exit?


----------



## Rushy (Sep 22, 2015)

Real shame to be losing a great mix of shops. Baker, green grocer, butcher, kebabs, fish monger (closed for some time). It really is a perfect small town centre mix.


----------



## Winot (Sep 22, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Real shame to be losing a great mix of shops.* Baker, green grocer, butcher, kebabs, fish monger* (closed for some time). It really is a perfect small town centre mix.



All the major food groups


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 22, 2015)

Crispy said:


> Part of the proposal includes turning this arch under the railway bridge into a shopfront.
> 
> View attachment 77040



This door way is also just about to be covered over by the Thames Water funded Herne Hill post Biblical Flood Improvements project.


----------



## Crispy (Sep 22, 2015)

editor said:


> What was it before? A station exit?


It'd have to go quite some way to reach the station. Some detective work required there for sure. Historic maps are no good cos they only show the railway on top. Historic photos of the junction tend to focus on the pub and shops.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Sep 26, 2015)

At Herne Hill market tomorrow:


----------



## brixtonblade (Oct 4, 2015)

The Fun Palace at the Lido is great.  Lovely weather and loads of activities.  Think it's on till 5.


----------



## Winot (Oct 4, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> The Fun Palace at the Lido is great.  Lovely weather and loads of activities.  Think it's on till 5.



Is the pool open for ordinary swimming too? Mrs W wants to go (with wetsuit).


----------



## brixtonblade (Oct 4, 2015)

Yes, couple of lanes but they looked quite busy


----------



## gaijingirl (Oct 5, 2015)

I did paddleboarding (by myself) and kayakking (with the kids) and got a decent swim - still a lovely temperature - wetsuit not needed yet, but then I have plenty of body fat... (not busy at all), plus saw the magician - it was fun!


----------



## sleaterkinney (Oct 8, 2015)

We've got a new sign:


----------



## gaijingirl (Oct 8, 2015)

oh I prefer that to what we got at Tulse Hill!


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Oct 8, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> oh I prefer that to what we got at Tulse Hill!


 Like to think that belongs to Norwood.


----------



## Manter (Oct 8, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Like to think that belongs to Norwood.


They can have it


----------



## Tricky Skills (Oct 10, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Anyone else heard of a proposal to turn Brockwell Park into a common? A local shop keeper mentioned it the other day. Apparently cheaper to maintain.



Bit late with this one...

I can't find anything in the Cabinet report that references this. The closest you get is the mention that some parks won't be locked at night to save money. This won't give them Common status though.

I very much doubt that Brockwell is on the 'not lock' list, given the size of the park. I think the suggestion is some of the smaller parks, such as Larkhall etc.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Oct 10, 2015)

Crystal Palace I think I read..?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 11, 2015)

Where is there to go for a late-ish drink on a friday / saturday night. Got back to Herne Hill about 12.45 ish last night hoping to catch last orders in the Florence - but they had already stopped serving. Someone in there said Florence was empty and trying to close up before 12.30 until he insisted with the manager and then a few more people came in. 
Wasn't feeling up to the volume level in 127, but couldn't think of anywhere else to try. 
Just wanted to meet some locals and chat. I really miss the Hammi, the Half Moon, the Studio ... 
I'm miss old style lock-ins and illegal drinking dens.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Oct 11, 2015)

I'm guessing the area's got too sanitised /developed /upmarket?


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 12, 2015)

Nah, they're still there; just slightly quieter than they used to be.


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 12, 2015)

^^said from a Saturday morning filled with drunken regret.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Oct 12, 2015)

Oh speaking of interesting enterprises - that "shop" on Dulwich Rd, Herne Hill end - more of a kiosk really but next to nothing on the shelves... WTF?


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 12, 2015)

You're new around here?


----------



## Crispy (Oct 12, 2015)

A similarly well-stocked newsagent on Shakespeare Road. Two big CCTV cameras outside, just in case someone tries to steal the 6 bars of out-of-date chocolate on the shelves


----------



## Aeryn (Oct 12, 2015)

In the past these fake businesses were selling drugs, or guns, or both (sits back in rocking chair, looks out the window at the parade of shops at the CHL end of Flaxman, and remembers the heady days of Operation Pomfret). 

These days they are probably just property speculators


----------



## twentythreedom (Oct 12, 2015)

Spent a few days in HH - like it


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 14, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> Nah, they're still there; just slightly quieter than they used to be.


 where? PM me if you don't want to tell the world.
and why don't I get invited! 
Is it because I'm an embarassingly drunk middle age lesbian in a hat (that might explain it...)


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 14, 2015)

twentythreedom said:


> Spent a few days in HH - like it


Obviously I think its lovely and did before it got so popular. I'd be interested to know why you like it - do tell.


----------



## CH1 (Oct 15, 2015)

Aeryn said:


> In the past these fake businesses were selling drugs, or guns, or both (sits back in rocking chair, looks out the window at the parade of shops at the CHL end of Flaxman, and remembers the heady days of Operation Pomfret).
> 
> These days they are probably just property speculators


For those (like me) who forgot about Operation Pomfret - these were the "Outputs" (from this council report: http://moderngov.lambeth.gov.uk/Dat...nity Safety Update  Appendix - 12-06-2003.pdf)
*Summary of Outputs*
A complete index of outputs can be found at Appendix 3. A summary of outputs is given below.
*Police Outputs*
• 19 x Crimints (intelligence reports – observations by officers or information from the public)
• 5 x CLE2/6 (Vehicle not displaying tax disc)
• 6 x 5090's (Stop and Search)
• 1 x red route FPN (fixed Penalty Notice)
• 1 x arrests
• 1 x arrest / de-arrest regarding driving offences
• 1 x formal warning for possession of cannabis
• 1 x call to police station that was dealt with by officer on the ground (female in distress)
• Activities outside the target area carried out by Police:
• Car was found to have been used in an armed robbery. Enquiries underway in
order to make an arrest.
• 2 x licence premises checks conducted (both at Harriers Public House)
*DVLA Outputs*
• 50 x CLE26s (Vehicle not displaying a tax disc)
*BTP Outputs*
• 5 x Stop and search
• 108 x reported for ticket offences
• 60 x penalty notices issued
• 106 x tickets issued by revenue inspectors (extra tickets sold)
*Immigration Outputs*
• 15 checks on staff in shops. 1 illegal entrant was found and enquiries are in hand.
*Cab Enforcement Office Outputs*
• A local cab operator was inspected. Of the eight declared drivers seven had no
insurance. Two of the drivers carried bogus insurance documents and one had a
bogus driving license.
*London Fire and Emergency Planning Authority Outputs*
• Fire notice issued to supermarket for dangerous use of basement
• Six premises were issued guidance notices
Parking Outputs
• 4 x PCNs (Penalty Charge Notice) were issued
• No clamping or removal of vehicles was required. It is believed that this was
because the increased presence of parking officers and police officers deterred
people from parking illegally.
Streetcare (Environment) Outputs
*• Steetcare carried out a Streetcare audit and are delivering actions to resolve the following issues:*
• Illegal Dumping: 30 sites
• Roads not up to standard: (sweeping) 4 sites
• Highway issues: (broken bollards reported to Transport & Highways): 2
• Roads with bins stored on the pavement: 5 premises to be issued with warning
notices
• Roads with overgrown trees: 4 premises to be issued with notices to cut back.
• Dayburners: (Street lights on in the day reported to Transport & Highways): 1
• Commercial waste issues: 5 outlets to be followed up for contracting purposes
• Graffiti: 214 square metres to be removed
• Flyposting: 14 square metres to be removed
*Brixton Town Centre Management Team Outputs*
• Letters to all freeholders and leaseholders of 186 - 200 Coldharbour Lane
• Operation publicised at resident meetings including CPCG and Angell Area
Working Group
• Visits to all businesses on Coldharbour Lane
• Information leaflet and evaluation form distributed to all residents in Operation

*Subsequently (my own comments)*
- "The Harriers" closed down, demolished and replaced with "yuppie flats"
- "Home James" cabs closed and turned into a Mosque

Re 106 extra tickets sold at Loughborough Junction station, and 60 penalty notices issued, this is still an open station, with voluntary payment (notwithstanding Oyster Cards).


----------



## Aeryn (Oct 15, 2015)

Home James were actually eventually closed down for firearms offences. They were not an actual working cab company - hence no drivers in the report above. I remember the raid, it was quite dramatic. It wasn't part of Operation Pomfret which was more about broken window-style community policing (the "heady days" comment was tongue in cheek).

The hairdresser on the corner which is now Kashmir fruit and veg (NOT the one on the opposite corner which is there now) was running a drive-through drug dealers via the one-way system. I lived opposite, they were extremely blatant about it. We used to sit out on our steps and watch.

What is now the converted coach house flat on Pomfret Road was a crack den. We actually ended up getting rid of our doorbell because we were sick of people staggering out at 3am and ringing the bell to ask for 20p to visit their sick mum in hospital.

Both of those were shut down a year or so before Operation Pomfret, which is why they aren't mentioned. The area has a lot less visible crime than it had 20 years ago when I first moved in. A lot of the people in my street who have lived here for years did join LJAG when it first started up, and while the original intention was always to improve the area, it was things like that that they were talking about, not selling off the railway arches.

BUT on the negative side you don't hear screaming exchanges like this any more:

Guy from hairdresser, to my neighbour who used to regularly call the police on him: Why you keep calling the police you bitch, you're putting me out of business!

Neighbour: Your girls offered my boyfriend a blowjob in exchange for a Marsbar last week, you're putting ME out of business!


----------



## uk benzo (Oct 15, 2015)

Aeryn said:


> Home James were actually eventually closed down for firearms offences. They were not an actual working cab company - hence no drivers in the report above. I remember the raid, it was quite dramatic. It wasn't part of Operation Pomfret which was more about broken window-style community policing (the "heady days" comment was tongue in cheek).
> 
> The hairdresser on the corner which is now Kashmir fruit and veg (NOT the one on the opposite corner which is there now) was running a drive-through drug dealers via the one-way system. I lived opposite, they were extremely blatant about it. We used to sit out on our steps and watch.
> 
> ...



I lived close to Home James in the early 90s. Exciting times!


----------



## brixtonblade (Oct 15, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> I lived close to Home James in the early 90s. Exciting times!


I miss home james

One very drunk Christmas eve I ended up in the basement playing pool dressed up as santa


----------



## Fingers (Oct 19, 2015)

Went to the Commercial last night and they have seen fit to hike their prices up massively. £4.40 for a pint of flat Heineken ffs. At least 50p a pint rise.   We headed off the the Railway in Tulse Hill as it is actually cheaper.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Oct 19, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Went to the Commercial last night and they have seen fit to hike their prices up massively. £4.40 for a pint of flat Heineken ffs. At least 50p a pint rise.   We headed off the the Railway in Tulse Hill as it is actually cheaper.



 It's a sorry state of affairs when the Railway is the cheap option.


----------



## Fingers (Oct 19, 2015)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> It's a sorry state of affairs when the Railway is the cheap option.



innit just.


----------



## brixtonblade (Oct 19, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Went to the Commercial last night and they have seen fit to hike their prices up massively. £4.40 for a pint of flat Heineken ffs. At least 50p a pint rise.   We headed off the the Railway in Tulse Hill as it is actually cheaper.


Flat beer in pubs pisses me off so much.  If I'm going to have to pay loads for a pint it'd better be a decent one.  Effra Social often serves flat ones too.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 20, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Went to the Commercial last night and they have seen fit to hike their prices up massively. £4.40 for a pint of flat Heineken ffs. At least 50p a pint rise.   We headed off the the Railway in Tulse Hill as it is actually cheaper.


 was in there last friday and some old timers said their pints had gone up by 40p. Seemed a lot more expensive than the Regent too.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 20, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Flat beer in pubs pisses me off so much.  If I'm going to have to pay loads for a pint it'd better be a decent one.  Effra Social often serves flat ones too.


I don't like my bitter too fizzy. Flat and warm is how it should be!


----------



## T & P (Oct 25, 2015)

Had a very pleasant walk in the sunshine through Herne Hill and bought groceries from the Sunday market for the roast dinner. The place was really busy today.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 29, 2015)

Saw this posted on Herne Hill Forums web site yesterday


> Make the Half Moon Pub An Asset Of Community Value
> The Half Moon pub on Half Moon Lane in Herne Hill should:
> 
> - Be reopened as a pub;
> ...


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 30, 2015)

Sadly the idea of raising enough capital to buy it from dulwich estates should they be forced to sell / develop is daunting. Ivy House did well, but back then it was still in relative no mans land. There's a market for the pub but DE seem to want different more secure revenue (hotels, flats).


----------



## Fingers (Oct 30, 2015)

If it were not for the flood and it was up for sale I am sure it could have done the Ivy House model.   The fact that the scum bags at Dulwich estates are involved screws any possibility of that up.

I have no reason to go to Herne Hill now apart from to see the few mates who have not been priced out of the area. (and apart from the Lido)


----------



## CH1 (Oct 30, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> Sadly the idea of raising enough capital to buy it from dulwich estates should they be forced to sell / develop is daunting. Ivy House did well, but back then it was still in relative no mans land. There's a market for the pub but DE seem to want different more secure revenue (hotels, flats).


Is Dulwich Estate a charitable endowment funding the public school? If so do they entertain input form the wider community or do they just say they have to maximise their income for the benefit of their foundation (a bit like the C of E vs Archbishop of Canterbury)?

Just wondered. In a situation like they are in as the major land holders in their area I think they ought to at least have community representatives on their board to give input into their management of local "assets".


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 30, 2015)

Unfortunately charity law doesn't require that local representation.


----------



## Rushy (Oct 30, 2015)

The trust is responsible for the interests of the trustee. They would generally be acting illegally to act otherwise.


----------



## Manter (Oct 30, 2015)

CH1 said:


> Is Dulwich Estate a charitable endowment funding the public school? If so do they entertain input form the wider community or do they just say they have to maximise their income for the benefit of their foundation (a bit like the C of E vs Archbishop of Canterbury)?
> 
> Just wondered. In a situation like they are in as the major land holders in their area I think they ought to at least have community representatives on their board to give input into their management of local "assets".


It funds four schools, a chapel, and the almshouses


----------



## Sister Midnight (Oct 30, 2015)

I thought the schools would generate a hefty income due to fees from Arab prices etc?


----------



## Fingers (Oct 31, 2015)

Loads of kids having a rave. Loads of people about. Adults dressed up,  some thought it was sufficient just to wear a wig  make an effort for the kids or don't bother.

My mates are in a band who are playing at the Robbing Bastards Arms aka the commercial so will be here tonight if anyone  wants to come down not wearing a wig


----------



## Fingers (Oct 31, 2015)

OK someone has come dressed as a bee with painted on cat whiskers


----------



## brixtonblade (Oct 31, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Loads of kids having a rave. Loads of people about. Adults dressed up,  some thought it was sufficient just to wear a wig  make an effort for the kids or don't bother.
> 
> My mates are in a band who are playing at the Robbing Bastards Arms aka the commercial so will be here tonight if anyone  wants to come down not wearing a wig
> View attachment 78868


Was there with my boy earlier, was great. Loads of stuff for kids, really busy, nice mild evening.  Was lovely.


----------



## Maggot (Nov 1, 2015)

So no Brockwell Park fireworks this year. I can't see any angry posts about this. Last year when they charged for them there was a 23 page thread of bile.  Seems people are more angry about charging for fireworks than cancelling them altogether.


----------



## SpamMisery (Nov 1, 2015)

Maggot said:


> So no Brockwell Park fireworks this year. I can't see any angry posts about this. Last year when they charged for them there was a 23 page thread of bile.  Seems people are more angry about charging for fireworks than cancelling them altogether.



Can't argue about exclusivity and elitism if there are no fireworks at all


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 1, 2015)

Maggot said:


> So no Brockwell Park fireworks this year. I can't see any angry posts about this. Last year when they charged for them there was a 23 page thread of bile.  Seems people are more angry about charging for fireworks than cancelling them altogether.


There's been a few posts.  

Last year was a shit idea and made it pretty likely that they'd can it this year so I dont think anyone was suprised.


----------



## Greebo (Nov 1, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> <snip> Last year was a shit idea and made it pretty likely that they'd can it this year so I dont think anyone was suprised.


All the fenciing off and charging also backfired on the council a bit, as it meant that people living on one of Lambeth council's least favourite estates got the best view of all, for free.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Nov 1, 2015)

Firework displays are shit. Who cares. Waste of money.


----------



## CH1 (Nov 1, 2015)

Maggot said:


> So no Brockwell Park fireworks this year. I can't see any angry posts about this. Last year when they charged for them there was a 23 page thread of bile.  Seems people are more angry about charging for fireworks than cancelling them altogether.


They could try this
Battersea Park Fireworks Display 2015 | Battersea Park Fireworks Display | Wandsworth Council


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Firework displays are shit. Who cares. Waste of money.


misery. I love them. 

Can be arsed dragging myself across lambeth to see them though.


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 1, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> misery. I love them.
> 
> Can be arsed dragging myself across lambeth to see them though.


Agreed 

Trinity for me this year


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Agreed
> 
> Trinity for me this year


Trinity? as in the pub? are they doing fireworks?


----------



## SpamMisery (Nov 1, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Trinity? as in the pub? are they doing fireworks?



They normally do


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2015)

SpamMisery said:


> They normally do


any one have any details?


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 1, 2015)

I seem to spend most of my time heading towards herne hill, tulse hill and WeNo, these days. I obviously failed to think 15 years ahead when I bought my flat.    Anyway I notice the chocolate box was having work done on it when I went past earlier. -


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2015)

quimcunx said:


> I seem to spend most of my time heading towards herne hill, tulse hill and WeNo, these days. I obviously failed to think 15 years ahead when I bought my flat.    Anyway I notice the chocolate box was having work done on it when I went past earlier. -


Hey who could have guessed 15 years ago that any of these areas would be considered desirable areas to head for a good night out, eh?

Chocolate Box being done over yet again, considering how tiny it is it seems to be taking ages. Wonder what it will be this time? No clues yet.Its odd that in none of the various sweets / fags / fruit / corner shop things its been in the past 18 yrs has it ever (to my recollection) sold boxes of chocolates. Missed opportunity with a name like that.


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 1, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> any one have any details?


8pm on Saturday 7th


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> 8pm on Saturday 7th


is it free?


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 1, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> is it free?


Yup. 

Is usually a very good show. 

Worth getting there a bit early to get beers in good time.


----------



## SpamMisery (Nov 1, 2015)

They're quite good for a pub display


----------



## Smick (Nov 1, 2015)

The Railway in Tulse Hill are doing them on Thursday night at 7.30, as far as I am aware. No charge, kids welcome. Only that my wife is out, I'd be there.


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 1, 2015)

Yes - the Railway one is still on - I reckon it will be RAMMED though.

And there's always the Dulwich Sports club one too on Burbage Road - fiver, children under 10 are free. Big bonfire.


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 1, 2015)

Bonfire is a good shout


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 1, 2015)

gaijingirl said:


> Yes - the Railway one is still on - I reckon it will be RAMMED though.
> 
> And there's always the Dulwich Sports club one too on Burbage Road - fiver, children under 10 are free. Big bonfire.


 I love the look of a bonfire, it appeals to the pagan in me. 
Hope everyone enjoyed a peaceful Samhain yesterday.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 4, 2015)

It's nice enough, but I'm not sure what it's doing there:


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 4, 2015)

Part of the Dulwich Picture Gallery outreach work (mural done by Phlegm).


----------



## Maharani (Nov 4, 2015)

Fingers said:


> OK someone has come dressed as a bee with painted on cat whiskers


what did you go as Fingers?


----------



## Fingers (Nov 4, 2015)

Maharani said:


> what did you go as Fingers?



I was unaware that half of Herne Hill were dressing up so was dressed as normal


----------



## Maharani (Nov 4, 2015)

Fingers said:


> I was unaware that half of Herne Hill were dressing up so was dressed as normal


quite halloweeny then.


----------



## Fingers (Nov 4, 2015)

Maharani said:


> quite halloweeny then.



Careful.....


----------



## Maharani (Nov 4, 2015)

Can anyone recommend a good ladies hairdressers in the area that doesn't charge the earth? I don't want much, perhaps a little restyle to my long hair...getting bored. Last time I got my hair cut in WN I had to go back and it was still nothing like what I'd asked for.  I usually do my own but can't quite get the layers I fancy.


----------



## editor (Nov 4, 2015)

I like it, but can someone remind me what the Walk This Way big Herne Hill sign under the bridge is all about?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 4, 2015)

editor said:


> I like it, but can someone remind me what the Walk This Way big Herne Hill sign under the bridge is all about?


obviously its to remind incomers that there is more of herne hill than the station and the sunday market. 
The traders on Halfmoon lane have been having a hard time since the floods.


----------



## editor (Nov 4, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> obviously its to remind incomers that there is more of herne hill than the station and the sunday market.
> The traders on Halfmoon lane have been having a hard time since the floods.


I don't think the caption, "walk this way," with arrows pointing in opposite directions is too informative.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 4, 2015)

editor said:


> I don't think the caption, "walk this way," with arrows pointing in opposite directions is too informative.


There are shops both ways  and its proved to be a talking point.


----------



## editor (Nov 4, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> There are shops both ways  and its proved to be a talking point.


Yes. I'm talking about it but had no idea what it was supposed to mean, so not so obvious to me. Not sure if I'd call that a successful piece of promotion! If I had to guess, I'd say that it was indicating that there were entrances to the railway station on both sides of the bridge, given that they've used an old railway sign.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

I was supposed to be meeting the girls at the Florence last night before pizza and noticed it's closed for total gut-out refurb...looks like they've a put an application to planning for change of use too but I was on the phone as I go there so didn't read it...anyone?


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

What makes it look like there is an application for change of use?


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> What makes it look like there is an application for change of use?


The usual notice of 'change of use' they publish in the window.


----------



## Fingers (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> I was supposed to be meeting the girls at the Florence last night before pizza and noticed it's closed for total gut-out refurb...looks like they've a put an application to planning for change of use too but I was on the phone as I go there so didn't read it...anyone?



Could be turning it into a boutique hotel or other such nonsense (like the Tulse Hill Hotel - same owners)  I would like them to turn it back into Ganleys 

Will take a look if I am passing later


Pic from the inside from Twitter.


----------



## Biddlybee (Nov 5, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Hey who could have guessed 15 years ago that any of these areas would be considered desirable areas to head for a good night out, eh?
> 
> Chocolate Box being done over yet again, considering how tiny it is it seems to be taking ages. Wonder what it will be this time? No clues yet.Its odd that in none of the various sweets / fags / fruit / corner shop things its been in the past 18 yrs has it ever (to my recollection) sold boxes of chocolates. Missed opportunity with a name like that.


I walked past the other day and asked the chippy... he thought juice bar.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> The usual notice of 'change of use' they publish in the window.


That would be pretty unusual. Are you sure something to do with their licence?


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> That would be pretty unusual. Are you sure something to do with their licence?


No I'm not sure! That's why I'm asking if anyone knows.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

Fingers said:


> Could be turning it into a boutique hotel or other such nonsense (like the Tulse Hill Hotel - same owners)  I would like them to turn it back into Ganleys
> 
> Will take a look if I am passing later
> 
> ...


Tweet them? Or there's a notice on the end window facing the main road


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

There is a Licence Minor Variation notice in relation to adding a toilet and varying the seating arrangements. And a big banner declaring refurbishment and reopening later this month.

FYI. Whether for a change of use or a simple change of signage, planning notices are pink. It would be unusual to see them displayed in a window as they are put up by a planning officer, rather than the applicant. Usually lamp posts and the like.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

Pleased to hear that both the green grocer and Ye Olde Bakery will be staying when NR refurbish. Moving to arches on the other side of the track.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 5, 2015)

You mean on the Norwood Road side?


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Pleased to hear that both the green grocer and Ye Olde Bakery will be staying when NR refurbish. Moving to arches on the other side of the track.


Good news 

Hope there's room for the butchers too but don't know how well they are doing since the new one opened


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 5, 2015)

Biddlybee said:


> I walked past the other day and asked the chippy... he thought juice bar.


If it is I suspect it might go the way of the other businesses ran out of there


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> There is a Licence Minor Variation notice in relation to adding a toilet and varying the seating arrangements. And a big banner declaring refurbishment and reopening later this month.
> 
> FYI. Whether for a change of use or a simple change of signage, planning notices are pink. It would be unusual to see them displayed in a window as they are put up by a planning officer, rather than the applicant. Usually lamp posts and the like.


Well I must be going mad then...i saw something in the window but as I said I was distracted by a phone call.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Well I must be going mad then...i saw something in the window but as I said I was distracted by a phone call.


It _is _in the window. It is not a planning notice - change of use or otherwise.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Good news
> 
> Hope there's room for the butchers too but don't know how well they are doing since the new one opened


I think they are calling it a day. They mentioned daily take used to often be four figures but is now regularly about £250 so not worth carrying on.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> It _is _in the window. It is not a planning notice - change of use or otherwise.


oh i see. thanks for clearing that up.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> You mean on the Norwood Road side?


No. In the row of arches with Dugard & Daughters, etc.. Milkwood Road. (They kept calling it Milton though!).


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> oh i see. thanks for clearing that up.


My pleasure.


----------



## prunus (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Pleased to hear that both the green grocer and Ye Olde Bakery will be staying when NR refurbish. Moving to arches on the other side of the track.



This is very good news


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Good news
> 
> Hope there's room for the butchers too but don't know how well they are doing since the new one opened


The new one?


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

What's the food like in the Commercial these days? It's always been rather hit and miss imo. Also, are Milkwood burgers any good?


----------



## prunus (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Can anyone recommend a good ladies hairdressers in the area that doesn't charge the earth? I don't want much, perhaps a little restyle to my long hair...getting bored. Last time I got my hair cut in WN I had to go back and it was still nothing like what I'd asked for.  I usually do my own but can't quite get the layers I fancy.



I don't know what your level of charging the earth is, but Rick at Rose and Crown, newly relocated to the bottom of Denmark Hill from Covent Garden (victim of gentrification there ) is very good, and not (as far as I can tell) ridiculously expensive.  Worth a try.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> No. In the row of arches with Dugard & Daughters, etc.. Milkwood Road. (They kept calling it Milton though!).



Did they say which arch? I'm not sure there's any left unoccupied there now?  I'll go and ask Keith the next time I see him. Milton / Milkwood etc.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

prunus said:


> I don't know what your level of charging the earth is, but Rick at Rose and Crown, newly relocated to the bottom of Denmark Hill from Covent Garden (victim of gentrification there ) is very good, and not (as far as I can tell) ridiculously expensive.  Worth a try.


Thanks you...I've actually booked into Graceland in Tulse Hill.  It's a newly opened hairdressers and every time I've popped in they've been super friendly so I'm gonna try them...I don't like to pay over £35 really for a wash, cut and blowjob.  If this isn't successful I will try the Rose and Crown; although it sounds more like a pub to me!


----------



## prunus (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Thanks you...I've actually booked into Graceland in Tulse Hill.  It's a newly opened hairdressers and every time I've popped in they've been super friendly so I'm gonna try them...I don't like to pay over £35 really for a wash, cut and blowjob.  If this isn't successful I will try the Rose and Crown; although it sounds more like a pub to me!



It was that that first attracted me to it in fact


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> Did they say which arch? I'm not sure there's any left unoccupied there now?  I'll go and ask Keith the next time I see him. Milton / Milkwood etc.


They did and, not unusually, I forgot.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 5, 2015)

What's there now - the offy, the strange women's clothing shop, duggard, the random health place, the gym, island arts, deliverance... I can't think of a spare one? Unless someone is leaving.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 5, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Good news
> 
> Hope there's room for the butchers too but don't know how well they are doing since the new one opened


They were doing fine - pondering quitting/retiring or moving somewhere else. Suspect the last daughter's marriage may prompt a move. Different audience to Duggard.


----------



## prunus (Nov 5, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> What's there now - the offy, the strange women's clothing shop, duggard, the random health place, the gym, island arts, deliverance... I can't think of a spare one? Unless someone is leaving.



I seem to remember hearing that the offy was going, so that unit might be one of them?


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 5, 2015)

Possibly - they were negotiating rent review after all the flooding refurb.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> They were doing fine - pondering quitting/retiring or moving somewhere else. Suspect the last daughter's marriage may prompt a move. Different audience to Duggard.


Possibly. I'm just repeating what another trader said to me re the butcher. Could be nonsense.

Green grocer and bakery info was first hand though.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 5, 2015)

What about Moses?


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> What's the food like in the Commercial these days? It's always been rather hit and miss imo. Also, are Milkwood burgers any good?


Milkwood burger is good 
Commercial is hit and miss - had fish and chips there a couple of weeks ago and it was terrible. Everyone else with me said their food was good


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> What about Moses?


Well he's opened up a new more upmarket shop on Dulwich Road already. Doesn't seem sure on plans for the one on the corner.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Well he's opened up a new more upmarket shop on Dulwich Road already. Doesn't seem sure on plans for the one on the corner.



Ah I guessed that was him in the old florists. No prices - always a worry!


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> Milkwood burger is good
> Commercial is hit and miss - had fish and chips there a couple of weeks ago and it was terrible. Everyone else with me said their food was good


Thanks, don't think I've ever had a good food experience in there...


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Thanks, don't think I've ever had a good food experience in there...


I have, which is why it's annoying when you get a crap meal 
If I'm around that way to eat I go to milkwood now


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

brixtonblade said:


> I have, which is why it's annoying when you get a crap meal
> If I'm around that way to eat I go to milkwood now


Yeah, I would too but they don't have much variety in the way of burgers so...


----------



## Rushy (Nov 5, 2015)

Has Milkwood food improved? I had repeatedly bad experiences in there from cold food to no food. Kept giving it the benefit of the doubt, went for our five times because we both really wanted to like it, but gave up. Did have a lot of fun with cocktails in there though. The guy behind the bar just made stuff up on the spot and kept giving us the excess from other mixes to try.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I think they are calling it a day. They mentioned daily take used to often be four figures but is now regularly about £250 so not worth carrying on.


 Smiths on Dulwich road have won some of their trade too since they went after the retail trade. I liked Walters - but Smiths better value.



prunus said:


> I seem to remember hearing that the offy was going, so that unit might be one of them?


 nooo! there will be no offys left!



snowy_again said:


> What about Moses?


 is that who runs Bleu? The shop on Dulwich rd is much better for displaying furniture. He never did have prices.The one time I asked the price - no I couldn't afford it, but I always enjoy having a look - he has such interesting things in there.


----------



## brixtonblade (Nov 5, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Has Milkwood food improved? I had repeatedly bad experiences in there from cold food to no food. Kept giving it the benefit of the doubt, went for our five times because we both really wanted to like it, but gave up. Did have a lot of fun with cocktails in there though. The guy behind the bar just made stuff up on the spot and kept giving us the excess from other mixes to try.


Yeah, I reckon it's OK.  I'm never there when it's busy though so don't know if that might be a factor


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 5, 2015)

Biddlybee said:


> I walked past the other day and asked the chippy... he thought juice bar.


wonder how that will work out when we already have a juice bar on Dulwich road. Interesting.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 5, 2015)

Glad the bakery is staying, always found the butchers a bit snobbish tbh.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 5, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> wonder how that will work out when we already have a juice bar on Dulwich road. Interesting.


When I think of all the different answers that I had from the workers doing up The Poet into Milkwood I think it might be a wind up.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 5, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> Glad the bakery is staying, always found the butchers a bit snobbish tbh.


do you mean the old butchers? The one where every woman I know gets proper chatted up when she goes to get some meat (sorry I couldn't resist!)?


----------



## Biddlybee (Nov 5, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> wonder how that will work out when we already have a juice bar on Dulwich road. Interesting.


Seems an odd choice.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 5, 2015)

Biddlybee said:


> Seems an odd choice.


think they'll call it The Juice Box?


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 5, 2015)

Maharani said:


> do you mean the old butchers? The one where every woman I know gets proper chatted up when she goes to get some meat (sorry I couldn't resist!)?


On the same side as the station?.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 6, 2015)

I've never been that keen on Walters, tbh.


----------



## leanderman (Nov 7, 2015)

Ms T said:


> I've never been that keen on Walters, tbh.



I have learnt about you that you take meat very seriously!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 7, 2015)

Ms T said:


> I've never been that keen on Walters, tbh.


where do you shop then?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Nov 7, 2015)

leanderman said:


> I have learnt about you that you take meat very seriously!



Worst chat up line ever!


----------



## Smick (Nov 7, 2015)

I counted three of the Milkwood arches as empty this morning. The one next to the offy called White Feather looks to be abandoned, there's one beside that and then one in between Dugard's and the ladies' gym.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Smick said:


> I counted three of the Milkwood arches as empty this morning. The one next to the offy called White Feather looks to be abandoned, there's one beside that and then one in between Dugard's and the ladies' gym.


There's a lady gym in HH?


----------



## Fingers (Nov 7, 2015)

I have it on good authority that the lease at the Half Moon is now owned by Fullers


----------



## choochi (Nov 7, 2015)

Fingers said:


> I have it on good authority that the lease at the Half Moon is now owned by Fullers


Hopefully they'll get it open again quickly.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Nov 7, 2015)

Fingers said:


> I have it on good authority that the lease at the Half Moon is now owned by Fullers



Interesting. Could be good news.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> There's a lady gym in HH?


Fison Fitness?  It's run by a female and females attend, but there's men there too.
I go there once a week and recommend it.  I rediscovered my stomach muscles and abs there at 40+ years of age.
It's been revamped and the range of classes has expanded.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Fison Fitness?  It's run by a female and females attend, but there's men there too.
> I go there once a week and recommend it.  I rediscovered my stomach muscles and abs there at 40+ years of age.
> It's been revamped and the range of classes has expanded.


What classes do they have?


----------



## Fingers (Nov 7, 2015)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Interesting. Could be good news.



Indeed less likely to be some gastro wank and may show footy


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 7, 2015)

Quite a range.  Pilates, circuits etc and then classes with a slightly different stance.  I've tried Noah's iFunction bodyweight which is excellent, quite hardcore, Sam's Martial Arts infused Circuits which is also excellent and good for flexibility and Jeremy's 6 Elements of Fitness.  This is my new favourite as he really supervises the class and everyone goes at his pace.  It's less jumpy all around than the others and focusses the exercises.  I've had quite some results.  I'm getting my legs back.  The classes might seem hard at first but you can go at your own pace and your general fitness levels and toning fix up pretty sharpish.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 7, 2015)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Quite a range.  Pilates, circuits etc and then classes with a slightly different stance.  I've tried Noah's iFunction bodyweight which is excellent, quite hardcore, Sam's Martial Arts infused Circuits which is also excellent and good for flexibility and Jeremy's 6 Elements of Fitness.  This is my new favourite as he really supervises the class and everyone goes at his pace.  It's less jumpy all around than the others and focusses the exercises.  I've had quite some results.  I'm getting my legs back.  The classes might seem hard at first but you can go at your own pace and your general fitness levels and toning fix up pretty sharpish.


How much are the classes? Do you have to join?


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 7, 2015)

Rushy said:


> How much are the classes? Do you have to join?



timetable and prices here... Home page


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> where do you shop then?


Occasionally Walters, but mostly the Brixton farmer's market or Dugard if I'm feeling flush/extravagant.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

Smick said:


> I counted three of the Milkwood arches as empty this morning. The one next to the offy called White Feather looks to be abandoned, there's one beside that and then one in between Dugard's and the ladies' gym.


The bakery and veg shop are moving there in the New Year I think.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Is the 'other' butchers really a butchers? Apparently it's more of a deli.


----------



## Smick (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Is the 'other' butchers really a butchers? Apparently it's more of a deli.


I think that there is no single unifying theme to their produce other than that it is expensive. I called in earlier and spent £5 on some sausages for tonight's dinner. They sell ice lollies which cost £2.35 each! There are jams, cereals, breads, fresh meat, cured meat. All of it pricey.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 7, 2015)

They hang and age their own meat on site so appear to know what they are doing.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Rushy said:


> They hang and age their own meat on site so appear to know what they are doing.


That does not justify charging £2.35 for a fucking ice lolly...they don't hang and age them do they?


----------



## Rushy (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> That does not justify charging £2.35 for a fucking ice lolly...they don't hang and age them do they?


I'm not sure that I suggested it did. I was responding to your question "is it really a butchers?". I would say, regardless of what else they sell, they are indeed butchers.

Why do they need to justify selling £2.35 ice lollies?


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Rushy said:


> I'm not sure that I suggested it did. I was responding to your question "is it really a butchers?". I would say, regardless of what else they sell, they are indeed butchers.
> 
> Why do they need to justify selling £2.35 ice lollies?


Are you shitting me??


----------



## Rushy (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Are you shitting me??


No. Why do they need to justify themselves?


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Rushy said:


> No. Why do they need to justify themselves?


If you need to ask me that then you have some serious issues.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Nov 7, 2015)

It's one of them $5 shake moments.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> If you need to ask me that then you have some serious issues.


Well obviously.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Well obviously.


What that you have issues? You are quite the passive aggressive type are you not?


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Well obviously.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Rushy said:


> Well obviously.


----------



## uk benzo (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani, to be honest, if Duggards know that their customers can afford their meat products, a £2.35 lolly isn't going to be a shocker .

Edit to add- everything in HH is pricey. Toys from Just Williams are significantly more expensive than like-for-like at Argos. The bookshop as wonderful as it may be, is more expensive than traditional bookshops. Bon Velo bikes and servicing is definitely more expensive than average bike shop prices.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> Maharani, to be honest, if Duggards know that their customers can afford their meat products, a £2.35 lolly isn't going to be a shocker .


Well I think Smick thinks differently. Please correct me if I'm wrong.


----------



## uk benzo (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Well I think Smick thinks differently. Please correct me if I'm wrong.



Sorry, I don't know who Smick is.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> Sorry, I don't know who Smick is.





Smick said:


> I think that there is no single unifying theme to their produce other than that it is expensive. I called in earlier and spent £5 on some sausages for tonight's dinner. They sell ice lollies which cost £2.35 each! There are jams, cereals, breads, fresh meat, cured meat. All of it pricey.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> What that you have issues? You are quite the passive aggressive type are you not?


Because I accepted your accusation about having serious issues without returning the insult? Ok.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 7, 2015)

It's £2 for a Magnum in most shops.  I'm just saying.


----------



## uk benzo (Nov 7, 2015)

I would say Duggards know their market well. HH folk love to spend over-the-top for standard products. I think the number of niche/boutique shops in the area exemplifies what I am trying to say. So relative to the whole of the UK, the lolly is expensive. But within the hh bubble, normal price. Sad but true.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Lizzy Mac said:


> It's £2 for a Magnum in most shops.  I'm just saying.


But that's chocolate and ice cream not just flavoured sweet ice.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

Dugards were very nice to the Guide Dog and gave her a lovely meaty bone for free (they charge in Smiths). Also I get chicken carcasses there for free too, for making stock. Their produce is all free range and/or organic so it's bound to be expensive.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> Maharani, to be honest, if Duggards know that their customers can afford their meat products, a £2.35 lolly isn't going to be a shocker .
> 
> Edit to add- everything in HH is pricey. Toys from Just Williams are significantly more expensive than like-for-like at Argos. The bookshop as wonderful as it may be, is more expensive than traditional bookshops. Bon Velo bikes and servicing is definitely more expensive than average bike shop prices.


The bookshop charges the RRP, no? Independent bookshops don't have the purchasing power to offer the deals you get on a limited number of books from Waterstones etc. If you're a Ritzy member you do get 10% off though.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> But that's chocolate and ice cream not just flavoured sweet ice.


I'm always genuinely outraged anyway.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Dugards were very nice to the Guide Dog and gave her a lovely meaty bone for free (they charge in Smiths). Also I get chicken carcasses there for free too, for making stock. Their produce is all free range and/or organic so it's bound to be expensive.


Ah, that explains it then! Thanks for clearing that up. 

Great to get the chicken bones for stock...I might pop in.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Ah, that explains it then! Thanks for clearing that up.
> 
> Great to get the chicken bones for stock...I might pop in.


You need to go on a Weds when they cut up the whole birds.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Ms T said:


> You need to go on a Weds when they cut up the whole birds.


Good to know ta.


----------



## T & P (Nov 7, 2015)

I once asked how much it was for a gents haircut at the hairdressers in HH, and had a minor embolism when I heard the answer.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

I met the lass that owns The Fringe on Half Moon Lane last night. They are extremely reasonable imo esp for HH, £32 for wash, cut and blowdry for long hair. 

I've never really inderstood why they charge more for cutting long hair. Is it cos they have to pump the chair up?! I honestly don't know. Short hair cuts require more effort and styling surely.


----------



## prunus (Nov 7, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> I would say Duggards know their market well. HH folk love to spend over-the-top for standard products. I think the number of niche/boutique shops in the area exemplifies what I am trying to say. So relative to the whole of the UK, the lolly is expensive. But within the hh bubble, normal price. Sad but true.



Dugards meat is far from standard - it is pricey but some of the best chicken, pork and beef I've tasted. Their lamb's not bad either, but it's the other three that stand out. It's all free-range and a lot of it is organic, but most importantly it's naturally grown - eg the chickens are not force-fed to grow as quickly as possible, but do it at a normal rate. This makes for (imo) far better taste as well, but obviously means that more work time per chicken is needed, hence higher prices. I'd rather have a delicious high-welfare chicken once a month than battery-cheap supermarket fare each weekend.


----------



## Smick (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> Well I think Smick thinks differently. Please correct me if I'm wrong.


Yeah, I think £2.35 for an ice and fruit lolly is crazy, but the price is clearly displayed so let those with too much money pay it. I'd never buy my kids one with Tesco opposite
 I'm sure if I looked round their other produce I'd be shocked at other prices too, but if they can sell them to people willing to pay it then why not. The sausages I bought today might have been as pricey, but I'm not really up on the price of sausages.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

prunus said:


> Dugards meat is far from standard - it is pricey but some of the best chicken, pork and beef I've tasted. Their lamb's not bad either, but it's the other three that stand out. It's all free-range and a lot of it is organic, but most importantly it's naturally grown - eg the chickens are not force-fed to grow as quickly as possible, but do it at a normal rate. This makes for (imo) far better taste as well, but obviously means that more work time per chicken is needed, hence higher prices. I'd rather have a delicious high-welfare chicken once a month than battery-cheap supermarket fare each weekend.


Totally, I didn't realise it was so ethical.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

Smick said:


> Yeah, I think £2.35 for an ice and fruit lolly is crazy, but the price is clearly displayed so let those with too much money pay it. I'd never buy my kids one with Tesco opposite
> I'm sure if I looked round their other produce I'd be shocked at other prices too, but if they can sell them to people willing to pay it then why not. The sausages I bought today might have been as pricey, but I'm not really up on the price of sausages.


I don't mind paying for decent, happy meat.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Nov 7, 2015)

I remember coming out of HH station around 1999ish when someone flew out through the Commercial window....a result of a rather rough bar brawl (which was fairly regular back then).....The Brockwell Tavern could be rough too but I always liked it in there.

How times change in Herne Hill. Posh ice pops and ethical meat.....and books! BOOKS!......for those who can afford them.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 7, 2015)

Nanker Phelge said:


> I remember coming out of HH station around 1999ish when someone flew out through the Commercial window....a result of a rather rough bar brawl (which was fairly regular back then).....The Brockwell Tavern could be rough too but I always liked it in there.
> 
> How times change in Herne Hill. Posh ice pops and ethical meat.....and books! BOOKS!......for those who can afford them.


It's definitely gone too far.  How many coffee shops do we need?


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> I met the lass that owns The Fringe on Half Moon Lane last night. They are extremely reasonable imo esp for HH, £32 for wash, cut and blowdry for long hair.
> 
> I've never really inderstood why they charge more for cutting long hair. Is it cos they have to pump the chair up?! I honestly don't know. Short hair cuts require more effort and styling surely.


It takes much longer to blow dry though. When my hair was long that was what took the time. I am prepared to pay £££ for a really good cut. I go to a swanky West End salon ATM and it's pricey (even though I have the most junior stylist) but exactly what I wanted and so easy to style.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

Lizzy Mac said:


> It's definitely gone too far.  How many coffee shops do we need?


There's only a couple afaik?


----------



## uk benzo (Nov 7, 2015)

Ms T said:


> There's only a couple afaik?


Along halfmoon lane alone there are 3.


----------



## Smick (Nov 7, 2015)

Maharani said:


> I don't mind paying for decent, happy meat.


Yeah, if it has given its life for me to have my dinner, I'd hope it was treated with respect while it was alive.

I try to buy free range / organic etc, but I'm sure if I stumble into a kebab shop, it's not likely to be freedom food.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 7, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> Along halfmoon lane alone there are 3.


3? Cafe Prov, Mimosa and? Is there something new over the road? That side has been affected by the flood and the half moon closure. 

As nanker says - it's a funny hinterland area - although the old version of the commercial had it's own unique charm


----------



## uk benzo (Nov 7, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> 3? Cafe Prov, Mimosa and? Is there something new over the road? That side has been affected by the flood and the half moon closure.
> 
> As nanker says - it's a funny hinterland area - although the old version of the commercial had it's own unique charm


Cafe prov, a new place that is in what used to be kindred bakery, la gastronomia and finally the coffee shop  opposite the German school.


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 7, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> 3? Cafe Prov, Mimosa and? Is there something new over the road? That side has been affected by the flood and the half moon closure.
> 
> As nanker says - it's a funny hinterland area - although the old version of the commercial had it's own unique charm



The formerly bog-standard bakery on the otherside by Tales on Half Moon reopened after the flood with seating etc, I think.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 7, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> 3? Cafe Prov, Mimosa and? Is there something new over the road? That side has been affected by the flood and the half moon closure.
> 
> As nanker says - it's a funny hinterland area - although the old version of the commercial had it's own unique charm


I think that you've blinked and missed them opening up everywhere.  Honestly, take a stroll tomorrow.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 7, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> Cafe prov, a new place that is in what used to be kindred bakery, la gastronomia and finally the coffee shop  opposite the German school.


 ah that makes sense - had forgotten about kindred closing - strange place but with a better baker than the one on Railton Rd. In a bit of self awareness - I go to that side less since the floods - having lost the half moon / mimosa habits (the memory of their mushrooms on toast has me salivating). Not walked up to the parade by kens for ages and realised that when you cycle past you have to watch the road cos of the shit surface the broadband installation caused so can't stare at the shops. In cross thread posting: Adele lived in those new builds after the press chased her out of Norwood trying to find out who the local live interest in her first album was.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 7, 2015)

Lizzy Mac said:


> I think that you've blinked and missed them opening up everywhere.  Honestly, take a stroll tomorrow.



This involves slaloming through dogs & double buggies on Market Sunday's though. I used to wonder who the fuck they were until one of my Wimbledon living colleagues says he takes the train to go to it. Never as good / cheap or up for a deal as the declining Brixton Sunday Market even with the same traders. They all seem a bit naive, with the exception of the locals (Elaine, Paul with the clothes stall etc.).


----------



## Maharani (Nov 7, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> 3? Cafe Prov, Mimosa and? Is there something new over the road? That side has been affected by the flood and the half moon closure.
> 
> As nanker says - it's a funny hinterland area - although the old version of the commercial had it's own unique charm


A lot of the old locals were in there last night. It made me miss the vibe of the old White Hart in TH.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 7, 2015)

It's their regular Friday night local. Has been again for a few years. OTC seemed to be doing some sort of cheeky unlicensed / private party and there were minor tv celebs in the kebab shop. The loos in the station have also become the location for several of the local street workers.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 7, 2015)

That post does not necessarily sum up my Friday night. 

That involved trying to count the number of bald men at a killing joke gig. Gave up at 400. Jaz suspiciously still hirsute.


----------



## CH1 (Nov 7, 2015)

Anyone been to this and willing to review? The Amazing World of M.C. Escher | Dulwich Picture Gallery
£13/14 seems a bit pricey to me when you can go to stuff in town for nothing. But I like the artist.
Sorry its not HH - but it's on the way (on a P4 anyway).


----------



## Ms T (Nov 7, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> This involves slaloming through dogs & double buggies on Market Sunday's though. I used to wonder who the fuck they were until one of my Wimbledon living colleagues says he takes the train to go to it. Never as good / cheap or up for a deal as the declining Brixton Sunday Market even with the same traders. They all seem a bit naive, with the exception of the locals (Elaine, Paul with the clothes stall etc.).


Fish stall is excellent and pretty good value for the quality after 2 when the prices go down by about a third. £10 for a dozen diver-caught scallops is pretty good and cheaper than Mash in Brixton.  Otherwise I prefer the Brixton one but fear for its future.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 8, 2015)

uk benzo said:


> Cafe prov, a new place that is in what used to be kindred bakery, la gastronomia and finally the coffee shop  opposite the German school.


Most of those aren't primarily coffee shops though.  It's a sign though that it's really hard to make money as a deli or bakery. See A&C in Brixton.


----------



## Maharani (Nov 8, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> It's their regular Friday night local. Has been again for a few years. OTC seemed to be doing some sort of cheeky unlicensed / private party and there were minor tv celebs in the kebab shop. The loos in the station have also become the location for several of the local street workers.


Loos in the station????


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 8, 2015)

Ms T said:


> Otherwise I prefer the Brixton one but fear for its future.


 me too, at least with Brixton I knew 4 or the stallholders and would do a deal late in the day to stock my freezer with the stuff they hadn't sold & would bin. Had heard the hh fish stall was good, but fresh fish on a Sunday? Unless I'm cooking it that day I'm unnecessarily paranoid. 

And Maharani - on platform 1/2.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 8, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> me too, at least with Brixton I knew 4 or the stallholders and would do a deal late in the day to stock my freezer with the stuff they hadn't sold & would bin. Had heard the hh fish stall was good, but fresh fish on a Sunday? Unless I'm cooking it that


Yes, that is the problem for me too. I don't really want to freeze it, although I bought tuna the other week to eat raw, froze it straight away, and had it the following Sat as tuna tartare. It still tasted amazing.

Eta, if you're worried about freshness, it's easily the freshest fish I've found in London.


----------



## colacubes (Nov 8, 2015)

CH1 said:


> Anyone been to this and willing to review? The Amazing World of M.C. Escher | Dulwich Picture Gallery
> £13/14 seems a bit pricey to me when you can go to stuff in town for nothing. But I like the artist.
> Sorry its not HH - but it's on the way (on a P4 anyway).



Am actually going today.  Will let you know if worth it


----------



## BoxRoom (Nov 8, 2015)

Maharani said:


> I met the lass that owns The Fringe on Half Moon Lane last night. They are extremely reasonable imo esp for HH, £32 for wash, cut and blowdry for long hair.
> 
> I've never really inderstood why they charge more for cutting long hair. Is it cos they have to pump the chair up?! I honestly don't know. Short hair cuts require more effort and styling surely.


Had my hair cut in Brixton once, poncy bloody place can't remember the name of it now, and they charged me extra because my hair was a bit long. Yeah, I know, that's why I'm going to the hairdressers! Wankers.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 8, 2015)

snowy_again said:


> me too, at least with Brixton I knew 4 or the stallholders and would do a deal late in the day to stock my freezer with the stuff they hadn't sold & would bin. Had heard the hh fish stall was good, but fresh fish on a Sunday? Unless I'm cooking it that day I'm unnecessarily paranoid.
> 
> And Maharani - on platform 1/2.


It's good until Tuesday/Wednesday ime.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 8, 2015)

CH1 said:


> Anyone been to this and willing to review? The Amazing World of M.C. Escher | Dulwich Picture Gallery
> £13/14 seems a bit pricey to me when you can go to stuff in town for nothing. But I like the artist.
> Sorry its not HH - but it's on the way (on a P4 anyway).


Mate of mine came down from seven sisters to see it. Said it was fantastic. Have been meaning to go myself but not managed it yet.


----------



## colacubes (Nov 8, 2015)

CH1 said:


> Anyone been to this and willing to review? The Amazing World of M.C. Escher | Dulwich Picture Gallery
> £13/14 seems a bit pricey to me when you can go to stuff in town for nothing. But I like the artist.
> Sorry its not HH - but it's on the way (on a P4 anyway).



It's really excellent.  Lots to see and very interesting.  If you can go during the week I would though as it was absolutely packed even though it was timed entry tickets.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 21, 2015)

That old shop on dulwich rd is getting turned into a cocktail bah.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 21, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> That old shop on dulwich rd is getting turned into a cocktail bah.


which shop?


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 21, 2015)

The one next to the photographers (the plumbers supply place).


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 21, 2015)

Curious.  No one went to The Poet even though the drinks were great and there was an almost permanent Happy Hour.


----------



## Crispy (Nov 21, 2015)

colacubes said:


> It's really excellent.  Lots to see and very interesting.  If you can go during the week I would though as it was absolutely packed even though it was timed entry tickets.


Or early in the morning. We went at opening time and there was loads of room.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 22, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> which shop?


No 119, the old plumbers merchants

firstaidbox (@firstaidboxHH) | Twitter


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 22, 2015)

ooo! I've got a cocktail hat that hasn't had an outing in ages.
Hope there will be freeies, nibbles, special offers on opening night.
Anyone planning on going to this?


----------



## leanderman (Nov 22, 2015)

It's an offshoot of Shrub and Shutter on Coldharbour Lane


----------



## Sister Midnight (Nov 22, 2015)

15th December apparently...


----------



## han (Nov 22, 2015)

Why hasn't Shrub And Shutter got a sign? Is it a fashion thing to have no signage?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 22, 2015)

han said:


> Why hasn't Shrub And Shutter got a sign? Is it a fashion thing to have no signage?


 Don't know, never been, does it just have a shrub outside and shutters as a subliminal clue?

Anyway its not in Herne Hill. Isn't it in the most deprived ward somewhere...


----------



## leanderman (Nov 22, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Don't know, never been, does it just have a shrub outside and shutters as a subliminal clue?
> 
> Anyway its not in Herne Hill. Isn't it in the most deprived ward somewhere...



On CHL, there is/was wooden signboard projecting out on a pole set a little above the entry door. Maybe it has been nicked. It was within reach


----------



## editor (Nov 22, 2015)

han said:


> Why hasn't Shrub And Shutter got a sign? Is it a fashion thing to have no signage?


Minimal signage (or reusing the previous business's sign) is standard hipster procedure to make it look more like a (social media saturated) 'discovery.'


----------



## han (Nov 22, 2015)

Bloody ell.


----------



## leanderman (Nov 25, 2015)

The revamp at the Florence has led to a better. roomier lay-out. Food and beer still uninspiring


----------



## T & P (Nov 25, 2015)

Do they still have that toddler playroom at the back?


----------



## leanderman (Nov 25, 2015)

T & P said:


> Do they still have that toddler playroom at the back?



Yes.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 26, 2015)

T & P said:


> Do they still have that toddler playroom at the back?


They told us it was going to be used for other things too. For some reason I've never warmed to the Florence.


----------



## Smick (Nov 26, 2015)

There are kids drama, ballet classes etc which take place in there at the weekend. Not a far stretch from the creche it is, but I think they make money out of hiring it throughout the week.


----------



## leanderman (Nov 26, 2015)

Ms T said:


> They told us it was going to be used for other things too. For some reason I've never warmed to the Florence.



Oh. Maybe it is being used for other things now then.

Certainly, the NCT mum groups are now out the front by the main bar.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 26, 2015)

Wasn't it for community groups / meetings etc?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 26, 2015)

Has the florence got rid of the ridiculously high seating yet?


----------



## leanderman (Nov 26, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> Has the florence got rid of the ridiculously high seating yet?



Exactly. Yes


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 27, 2015)

leanderman said:


> Exactly. Yes


we've just checked it out. Able to sit down with out losing my dignity.


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 27, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> we've just checked it out. Able to sit down with out losing my dignity.



You been on a quest for late night lock ins again?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 27, 2015)

quimcunx said:


> You been on a quest for late night lock ins again?


no luck yet.


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 27, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> no luck yet.



You'll have to sacrifice a corner of your living room to one of these then you can have as many lock-ins as you want.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 27, 2015)

quimcunx said:


> You'll have to sacrifice a corner of your living room to one of these then you can have as many lock-ins as you want.


 no - how will that help me get out more. (the sort of people I love to chat to in HH pub aren't the sort you want in your living room- especially after hours!)


----------



## teuchter (Nov 27, 2015)

These flats seem to be finished now.

I think it's a really nice scheme - at least from the outside. One of the best new housing developments in the area in recent years, in terms of how it sits in the streetscape.

Although I've noticed walking past that nearly all of the ground floor flats have the glazing next to the front door blocked out by the occupants...I assume because people feel the view through comprimises their privacy. A bad call there by the architects.


----------



## ringo (Nov 27, 2015)

teuchter said:


> One of the best new housing developments in the area in recent years, in terms of how it sits in the streetscape.



That's the only thing I like about them. The windows open right onto the street would put me off wanting to live there, as would being sandwiched into a slim patch between a busy road and a railway line.


----------



## han (Nov 27, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> no luck yet.


The Crown and Sceptre was open til 1 when we had the urban drinks there. But I appreciate, it's not HH.


----------



## Fingers (Nov 27, 2015)

Campaign to save the Half Moon pub gathers momentum with an ACV application

editor For Brixton Buzz


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 27, 2015)

fantastic! will email them today





> The relevant councillors for the Southwark ward where the Half Moon is located are:
> 
> anne.kirby@southwark.gov.uk
> jane.lyons@southwark.gov.uk
> ...


----------



## Sister Midnight (Nov 27, 2015)

ringo said:


> That's the only thing I like about them. The windows open right onto the street would put me off wanting to live there, as would being sandwiched into a slim patch between a busy road and a railway line.



How long til they build over railways..?!


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 30, 2015)

quimcunx said:


> I seem to spend most of my time heading towards herne hill, tulse hill and WeNo, these days. I obviously failed to think 15 years ahead when I bought my flat.    Anyway I notice the chocolate box was having work done on it when I went past earlier. -



so did the chocolate box change into anything different?


----------



## han (Nov 30, 2015)

quimcunx said:


> so did the chocolate box change into anything different?


The end of an institution! I remember buying beers there at 7am on Sunday mornings, after clubbing, back in the day


----------



## quimcunx (Nov 30, 2015)

han said:


> The end of an institution! I remember buying beers there at 7am on a Sunday morning, after clubbing, back in the day



I don't know that it has changed.  I've not been past since. It could have just been someone putting a shelf up.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 30, 2015)

quimcunx said:


> I don't know that it has changed.  I've not been past since. It could have just been someone putting a shelf up.


It's still being done up. Always looks like someone is doing stuff in there when I go past, but no sign of completion yet. You wouldn't have thought that such a tiny space could take so long. Sign still says the CHOCOLATE BOX.  Last rumour on here up thread somewhere was that it is to be a juice bar, but I'll believe that when I see it.


----------



## buscador (Nov 30, 2015)

In a nice contrast to the homework club atmosphere of The Florence in the late afternoon, today I saw a group of septuagenarian ravers preloading in The Regent before, presumably, going for a nice dinner somewhere (Lido, possibly).


----------



## sleaterkinney (Nov 30, 2015)

The flood fund has re-opened. 

Fund reopens for Herne Hill businesses affected by 2013 flood | Southwark Council


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 30, 2015)

Sister Midnight said:


> How long til they build over railways..?!



About 100 years ago.


----------



## Crispy (Dec 1, 2015)

Sister Midnight said:


> How long til they build over railways..?!


Serious answer: It's not easy. To ensure safety, you can't do construction work over a railway that's running. The cost and disruption of closing the tracks while building a slab over them are too great. For the moment, at least. Network Rail wants to be more of a property developer, seeing as they are sitting on loads and loads of valuable land.


----------



## teuchter (Dec 1, 2015)

Crispy said:


> Serious answer: It's not easy. To ensure safety, you can't do construction work over a railway that's running. The cost and disruption of closing the tracks while building a slab over them are too great. For the moment, at least. Network Rail wants to be more of a property developer, seeing as they are sitting on loads and loads of valuable land.


It's why they built Shoreditch High St station in a concrete bunker. So it can be built over at a later date witout disruption.


----------



## Crispy (Dec 1, 2015)

(yay a railways derail!) *

An approach that could work is like the way they do bridges. Build a slab/deck to the side of the tracks, build the foundations either side while the trains still run and then slide the whole thing across overnight or on a weekend.

Obviously you need empty land beside the tracks to pull this off, but there are plenty of suitable sites I can think of off the top of my head. You could do this at Denmark Hill, for example, using the Maudsley car park as a construction site for the deck.


* pun intended!


----------



## teuchter (Dec 1, 2015)

An approach I would like is for Network Rail to recognise stations as public places that form part of people's daily lives and design them with some respect for that and a bit of pride in our collectively owned infrastructure (as most of their capitalist, Victorian, forebears did). So maybe not turn Denmark into a gloomy bunker like Birmingham New St (or Shoreditch). Network Rail's property arm seem to have very little interest in good design and architecture. Many of their recent projects seem to have been designed with as little grace as possible. The first project I noticed was the completely over-engineered and ridiculous footbridge at Streatham station which looks like it's from a bomb-proof concentration camp.

The footbridge at Denmark Hill is not quite as bad but also fairly horrible. And some of the detailing is completely


----------



## Crispy (Dec 1, 2015)

teuchter said:


> Network Rail's property arm seem to have very little interest in good design and architecture. Many of their recent projects seem to have been designed with as little grace as possible.


He's going to mention the Streatham footbridge isn't he...


> The first project I noticed was the completely over-engineered and ridiculous footbridge at Streatham station which looks like it's from a bomb-proof concentration camp.




I meant the West side of the station at Denmark hill btw. The main length of the platforms should remain open air.


----------



## teuchter (Dec 1, 2015)

Crispy said:


> He's going to mention the Streatham footbridge isn't he...



And don't get me started on the Effingham Junction access ramp 










Crispy said:


> I meant the West side of the station at Denmark hill btw. The main length of the platforms should remain open air.



I'm not sure what they're going to do about the bridge on that side. It has been closed to traffic since bits of concrete started falling off the underside of it.


----------



## Crispy (Dec 1, 2015)

teuchter said:


> And don't get me started on the Effingham Junction access ramp


Blimey. The building regulations are not an aesthetic design guide, guys.


----------



## teuchter (Dec 1, 2015)

And how about the footbridge at Harpenden. I think they decided the Streatham one wasn't ugly enough so added some extra bits. 






Have been thinking for a while I should start a blog called "Network Rail Design Disaster Zones" or similar.


----------



## Fingers (Dec 4, 2015)

They are killing the old changing rooms


----------



## quimcunx (Dec 4, 2015)

Is that in Brockwell park? 

Is it not  a secret bunker then?


----------



## brixtonblade (Dec 5, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> It's still being done up. Always looks like someone is doing stuff in there when I go past, but no sign of completion yet. You wouldn't have thought that such a tiny space could take so long. Sign still says the CHOCOLATE BOX.  Last rumour on here up thread somewhere was that it is to be a juice bar, but I'll believe that when I see it.


Chocolate box sign gone. They've got a fancy looking coffee machine in there.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Dec 5, 2015)

All the railway in filling would be more palatable if it was reflected in lower fares. 
Anyone live in a flat squeezed into railway gap? Just wondering if it's suitable for homes really...


----------



## teuchter (Dec 5, 2015)

Sister Midnight said:


> All the railway in filling would be more palatable if it was reflected in lower fares.



Does that also apply to maximising the revenue from railway arches?


----------



## Not a Vet (Dec 6, 2015)

Talking to the builder last night, chocolate box is going to be a juice bar but by popular demand, it's also going to serve coffee


----------



## editor (Dec 8, 2015)

Herne Hill! Prepare for an influx of trendy cocktail imbibers.







First Aid Box – a new cafe/cocktail bar for Herne Hill from the Shrub & Shutter team


----------



## T & P (Dec 8, 2015)

Good news


----------



## editor (Dec 8, 2015)

Cocktails in a syringe and drip bag.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Dec 8, 2015)

editor said:


> Herne Hill! Prepare for an influx of trendy cocktail imbibers.
> 
> First Aid Box – a new cafe/cocktail bar for Herne Hill from the Shrub & Shutter team



We're already prepared...

Herne Hill news, chitter chatter and gossip


----------



## SpamMisery (Dec 8, 2015)

I like that graphic. Is that their own?

[EDIT] Looks like they are


----------



## editor (Dec 9, 2015)

A half ton of plastic to throw in the ocean with every cocktail!


----------



## Harbourite (Dec 10, 2015)

Not a Vet said:


> Talking to the builder last night, chocolate box is going to be a juice bar but by popular demand, it's also going to serve coffee



"Juice Box" opened this morning for coffee and juice


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 12, 2015)

sleaterkinney said:


> We're already prepared...
> 
> Herne Hill news, chitter chatter and gossip


I was looking forward to this - just hope my cold is better in time.  I have a number of cocktail hats to choose from oh decisions, decisions. Haven't been past in a while, does it look like they are nearly ready to open?


----------



## SpamMisery (Dec 16, 2015)

editor said:


> A half ton of plastic to throw in the ocean with every cocktail!



It does say "reuseable" on the packaging

Anyway, had a wander round Herne Hill today. Forgot how lovely it is.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 18, 2015)

friendofdorothy said:


> I was looking forward to this - just hope my cold is better in time.  I have a number of cocktail hats to choose from oh decisions, decisions. Haven't been past in a while, does it look like they are nearly ready to open?


so how is our newest bar? anyone been yet? any freebies going?


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Dec 30, 2015)

I had a great roast at The Commercial on Sunday, lovely pork with crackling.  Yum.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jan 4, 2016)

Great news:

LATEST NEWS: We've had confirmation today from both Helen Hayes MP and Dulwich Society that The Dulwich Estate has confirmed that they have signed a lease on the Half Moon with pub operator Fuller Smith & Turner Plc (Fullers). According to Dulwich Society, 'It is hoped that the pub will re-open in the late summer of 2016'.


----------



## editor (Jan 4, 2016)

sleaterkinney said:


> Great news:
> 
> LATEST NEWS: We've had confirmation today from both Helen Hayes MP and Dulwich Society that The Dulwich Estate has confirmed that they have signed a lease on the Half Moon with pub operator Fuller Smith & Turner Plc (Fullers). According to Dulwich Society, 'It is hoped that the pub will re-open in the late summer of 2016'.


That's great news - but where are was this posted please?

OK - found it!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 7, 2016)

sleaterkinney said:


> Great news:
> 
> LATEST NEWS: We've had confirmation today from both Helen Hayes MP and Dulwich Society that The Dulwich Estate has confirmed that they have signed a lease on the Half Moon with pub operator Fuller Smith & Turner Plc (Fullers). According to Dulwich Society, 'It is hoped that the pub will re-open in the late summer of 2016'.


At last! that is fantastic news! My life has not been the same without that pub.

Wonder if the Moon still have our 'Herne Hill Stitch and Bitch, Welcome' applique banner...


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 13, 2016)

Anyone ever go to these meetings? email below from Herne Hill forum


> *What could Herne Hill be like in years to come? *
> 
> Now's your chance to voice your opinions on how you'd like Herne Hill to be.  A group of volunteers have started on the initial stages of forming a Neighbourhood Plan for Herne Hill which is recognised by Southwark and Lambeth Councils.  We'd really like to hear how you'd like to see Herne Hill shaped, thinking about local housing, retail developments, environment, parks and open spaces, amenities, traffic, schools, whatever it is that is important to you.
> 
> ...


----------



## Fingers (Jan 15, 2016)

I Tweeted the Commercial last weekend to inform then that my female mates will no longer drink in there due to the disgusting state of the toilets and this week the gents have been done up!


----------



## Rushy (Jan 15, 2016)

Have they got rid of the smell? They were a bit whiffy.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jan 17, 2016)

Stopped at the juice bar for a coffee - it's nice and the guy there's very friendly.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jan 17, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Have they got rid of the smell? They were a bit whiffy.



I popped in on Friday. It's better, I'd say. 'Got rid of' might be a bit strong though.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 18, 2016)

Herne Hill is at a cross-roads 

An update on the closures to shops on Station Square and beyond. The butchers closed for good on Saturday. Bakery & Veg shop move to Milkwood Road, Bleu to Dulwich Road etc to be replaced by more restaurant units in a parade that already has lots of restaurant.

Mostly Dulwich Estates increasing rents by 70%, and Network Rail cashing in on the community development etc.


----------



## aka (Jan 18, 2016)

Bleu didn't move - looks like he's expanding his empire.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 18, 2016)

He's moving though as far as I knew when I spoke to him a few weeks ago - all of that block (up the dry cleaners) are - just have slightly different departure dates.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 18, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> He's moving though as far as I knew when I spoke to him a few weeks ago - all of that block (up the dry cleaners) are - just have slightly different departure dates.


He seems to change his mind daily!


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 18, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Herne Hill is at a cross-roads
> 
> An update on the closures to shops on Station Square and beyond. The butchers closed for good on Saturday. Bakery & Veg shop move to Milkwood Road, Bleu to Dulwich Road etc to be replaced by more restaurant units in a parade that already has lots of restaurant.
> 
> Mostly Dulwich Estates increasing rents by 70%, and Network Rail cashing in on the community development etc.



Just Williams is closing down in a few weeks - apparently it the most expensive rent of their shops.  They're rumoured to be selling their toys off at sale price.  It's a PITA because it is useful to have a toy shop locally for last minute b'day gifts etc.


----------



## innit (Jan 18, 2016)

gaijingirl said:


> Just Williams is closing down in a few weeks - apparently it the most expensive rent of their shops.  They're rumoured to be selling their toys off at sale price.  It's a PITA because it is useful to have a toy shop locally for last minute b'day gifts etc.


That's a shame, it's so nice to browse toys and not just Amazon everything


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 18, 2016)

I've just received this.  Dulwich estates are jumping on the same inflating the rents bandwagon are network rail. Seems weird to me in a 'challenging' retail climate with empty shops and struggling high streets all over the place, landlords want to increase prices so steeply now. They have over 800+ signatures so far.



> Hello there,
> 
> I just signed the petition "Dulwich Estates: Dulwich Estates to behave reasonably, and charge reasonable rents" and wanted to see if you could help by adding your name.
> 
> ...


----------



## Greebo (Jan 19, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> I've just received this.  Dulwich estates are jumping on the same inflating the rents bandwagon are network rail. Seems weird to me in a 'challenging' retail climate with empty shops and struggling high streets all over the place, landlords want to increase prices so steeply now. They have over 800+ signatures so far.


signed.


----------



## CH1 (Jan 19, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> I've just received this.  Dulwich estates are jumping on the same inflating the rents bandwagon are network rail. Seems weird to me in a 'challenging' retail climate with empty shops and struggling high streets all over the place, landlords want to increase prices so steeply now. They have over 800+ signatures so far.


No doubt Dulwich Estates will claim they are required by the Charity Commission to make the maximum return on their assets to fund their "charity".
That's what the Church of England says when people challenge their dodgy investments.


----------



## CH1 (Jan 19, 2016)

I signed the petition - but I get irritated with that petition website then assuming you want to petition for the rights of cats in Afghanistan etc etc.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 19, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> I've just received this.  Dulwich estates are jumping on the same inflating the rents bandwagon are network rail. Seems weird to me in a 'challenging' retail climate with empty shops and struggling high streets all over the place, landlords want to increase prices so steeply now. They have over 800+ signatures so far.


Also signed. This is bad news for HH. They'll be more generic high street shops moving in then.


----------



## technical (Jan 19, 2016)

Yes, more chains. And more restaurants as that's what the market can take right now.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 19, 2016)

Exactly the same thing is happening on Kentish Town high street. All of the independents have pretty much been priced out now. Sad.


----------



## Winot (Jan 19, 2016)

How is it that the big chains can afford to pay more rent?  Can they survive on a lower profit because other of their shops are more profitable, or is it that they pay less tax, or are they just more profitable (=more popular with customers) than the independents?  Of is it a combination of these factors?


----------



## teuchter (Jan 19, 2016)

I was wondering the same.


----------



## quimcunx (Jan 19, 2016)

Not sure.  Maybe because they are backed by big chains they have more to invest upfront/can suffer a loss for longer.  Once they pay the higher rent other rents go up, pushing more independents out and reducing competition, leading eventually to more profit.   Brand recognition has to be a big boon too.


----------



## editor (Jan 19, 2016)

Winot said:


> How is it that the big chains can afford to pay more rent?  Can they survive on a lower profit because other of their shops are more profitable, or is it that they pay less tax, or are they just more profitable (=more popular with customers) than the independents?  Of is it a combination of these factors?


I would have thought that their running overall costs would be considerably lower due to their ability to drive suppliers' prices right down to the knuckle thanks to economies of scale, and overall efficiency in operations. Chains are often very finely tuned organisations.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jan 19, 2016)

editor said:


> I would have thought that their running overall costs would be considerably lower due to their ability to drive suppliers' prices right down to the knuckle thanks to economies of scale, and overall efficiency in operations. Chains are often very finely tuned organisations.



This is it I think. Setup and finance costs are going to be much cheaper as well compared to a one-off restaurant - as I understand it a lot of independent places never really pay these off.


----------



## teuchter (Jan 19, 2016)

So why doesn't same logic apply whilst rents are set lower?


----------



## Winot (Jan 19, 2016)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> This is it I think. Setup and finance costs are going to be much cheaper as well compared to a one-off restaurant - as I understand it a lot of independent places never really pay these off.



If that's the case, we are essentially asking for landlords to charge less rent or for customers to pay more in order for independent shops to survive.


----------



## editor (Jan 19, 2016)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> This is it I think. Setup and finance costs are going to be much cheaper as well compared to a one-off restaurant - as I understand it a lot of independent places never really pay these off.


Yep. And the independents can often survive reasonably well until the area has the misfortune of being declared the new trendy hotspot. Landlords, being landlords, quickly realise that they can line their pockets with even more cash, throwing age-old concepts like 'loyalty' out of the window, and hiking up the rents of long term independents to unaffordable levels. See: Network Rail/Brixton Arches for a prime example.

Now that Herne Hill has got its own theme park branch of the upmarket Shrub & Shutter cocktail bar it's only going to get worse. Gentrification, eh? So many new places to go to for "treats." So many long term businesses being hoofed out. So many rent rises.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jan 19, 2016)

Winot said:


> If that's the case, we are essentially asking for landlords to charge less rent or for customers to pay more in order for independent shops to survive.


The big chains will always benefit from economies of scale. They can also make a loss in one shop to drive competitors out of business etc.


----------



## editor (Jan 19, 2016)

sleaterkinney said:


> The big chains will always benefit from economies of scale. They can also make a loss in one shop to drive competitors out of business etc.


And then there's the slippery tax tricks of the big chains to contend with too...

Starbucks' Tax Tricks are Killing Small Businesses


----------



## T & P (Jan 19, 2016)

Signed as well. Network Rail really are being cunts of the highest order, on on a nationwide (or at least Lonson-wide) scale it seems.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 19, 2016)

T & P said:


> Signed as well. Network Rail really are being cunts of the highest order, on on a nationwide (or at least Lonson-wide) scale it seems.


The petition isn't against network rail, is it?. 

Happily, several of the Herne Hill shops asked to vacate by network rail have relocated nearby. Bleu, Ye Olde Bakery, the green grocer. Two of those into other arches.

I think only one of the new units will be cafe / restaurant. I think they have committed to prefer independents though I'd imagine that includes small chains.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 19, 2016)

editor said:


> Yep. And the independents can often survive reasonably well until the area has the misfortune of being declared the new trendy hotspot. Landlords, being landlords, quickly realise that they can line their pockets with even more cash, throwing age-old concepts like 'loyalty' out of the window, and hiking up the rents of long term independents to unaffordable levels. See: Network Rail/Brixton Arches for a prime example.
> 
> Now that Herne Hill has got its own theme park branch of the upmarket Shrub & Shutter cocktail bar it's only going to get worse. Gentrification, eh? So many new places to go to for "treats." So many long term businesses being hoofed out. So many rent rises.



This is a poor interpretation of what's gone on in HH - but might the Brixton experience.


----------



## editor (Jan 19, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> This is a poor interpretation of what's gone on in HH - but might the Brixton experience.


How is this any different from what has happened in the Brixton arches? Some may be able to afford to relocate but who's going to take their place? 


> Traders facing closure in Herne Hill because of redevelopment plans led by Network Rail claim the changes will "rip out the heart" of the community.
> 
> Small business owners who have been trading around the railway station in south London for decades have said the proposals will force them to move out due to significant rent hikes.
> 
> ...



Herne Hill traders claim Network Rail development will 'rip out heart


----------



## teuchter (Jan 19, 2016)

There's the usual confusion/conflation between the chain vs independent issue and the upmarket vs affordable issue.

What's the priority - to keep affordable shops in HH or to keep independent shops in HH?

Many of the long-standing independent businesses in HH are relatively upmarket (to some extent in contrast to the situation in Brixton).


----------



## teuchter (Jan 19, 2016)

I noted something in the wording of the petition aimed at Dulwich Estate - they say they don't want a "Machigh st".

Is McDonalds generally associated with supplying treats to newly arrived gentrifiers?


----------



## WNW (Jan 19, 2016)

Winot said:


> How is it that the big chains can afford to pay more rent?  Can they survive on a lower profit because other of their shops are more profitable, or is it that they pay less tax, or are they just more profitable (=more popular with customers) than the independents?  Of is it a combination of these factors?


 
It's not that they pay more rent (in fact they often pay less). Landlords prefer chains over independents because there is a much lower chance that a big chain will fail to pay its rent or will go bust (meaning that the landlord has to find a new tenant) or leave the property in disrepair. For the owner of a retail property, it's all about the security of the income stream.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jan 19, 2016)

WNW said:


> It's not that they pay more rent (in fact they often pay less). Landlords prefer chains over independents because there is a much lower chance that a big chain will fail to pay its rent or will go bust (meaning that the landlord has to find a new tenant) or leave the property in disrepair. For the owner of a retail property, it's all about the security of the income stream.



That sounds plausible. Except that in a lot of these cases the businesses leaving have been paying the rent for years, and by all accounts rent is going up by 70%. So it might be a factor but it's not the main one as far as I can see.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jan 19, 2016)

Hopefully the fact that we're not on a tube line and not that vibrant or edgy means that we won't become a destination like Brixton.


----------



## Manter (Jan 19, 2016)

-5 in Calais last night and there is a real risk of hypothermia or even death. Children a pillows are frozen solid and there are still refugees without socks. If you have any money to spare at all please please consider buying something off www.leisurefayre.com (click on the help refugees banner on the main page and it will take you to a page of desperately needed things) 

It will be delivered free straight to the warehouse and is a wholesaler so really cheap. A blanket is £3.50 and might save someone's life.

I know this isn't Herne Hill specific but there is a huge group from Brixton, Tulse Hill, Herne Hill and Dulwich that go out regularly and we'd be so grateful for the support.


----------



## quimcunx (Jan 19, 2016)

Using Leisure fayre is a great way to donate to the refugees in Calais.  Because (despite Manter's incredulity  ) the relief effort is a largely _anarchist_ pursuit there are no/few charities one can simply donate to in order to help the relief effort. Buying something from Leisurefayre to be delivered to the warehouse is a really simple, quick and direct way to help refugees.


----------



## editor (Jan 20, 2016)

sleaterkinney said:


> Hopefully the fact that we're not on a tube line and not that vibrant or edgy means that we won't become a destination like Brixton.


Tell that to Peckham Rye. You've already got the hoity toity hipster cocktail bar and Herne Hill was featured in this week's Time Out, so good luck holding back the vibrancy. 

Living in Peckham Rye: the lowdown on hipster central


----------



## Manter (Jan 20, 2016)

quimcunx said:


> Using Leisure fayre is a great way to donate to the refugees in Calais.  Because (despite Manter's incredulity  ) the relief effort is a largely _anarchist_ pursuit there are no/few charities one can simply donate to in order to help the relief effort. Buying something from Leisurefayre to be delivered to the warehouse is a really simple, quick and direct way to help refugees.


More fury than incredulity tbh. The fact people are living like that in a rich first world country mere miles from London makes me so angry I can barely speak. Such an easy problem to solve, and utterly utterly unnecessary.


----------



## goldengraham (Jan 20, 2016)

Manter said:


> -5 in Calais last night and there is a real risk of hypothermia or even death. Children a pillows are frozen solid and there are still refugees without socks. If you have any money to spare at all please please consider buying something off www.leisurefayre.com (click on the help refugees banner on the main page and it will take you to a page of desperately needed things)
> 
> It will be delivered free straight to the warehouse and is a wholesaler so really cheap. A blanket is £3.50 and might save someone's life.
> 
> I know this isn't Herne Hill specific but there is a huge group from Brixton, Tulse Hill, Herne Hill and Dulwich that go out regularly and we'd be so grateful for the support.



Thanks for sharing this


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 20, 2016)

Do any of you recall what HH was like 20 years ago? - more than half the units were empty and shops were closing. Tumble weed down down the street sort of place, no chain would have relocated here. There was an offy that was part of a chain - a chain that went bust. There were a few places like Pullens, the Cafe Prov, the Dance shop and Walters that survived to see the area change around them.

If the area now has more trade, more shops, more life - it is largely due to the hard work of the independant traders we have. No wonder chains want muscle in on the back of others hard work now. With there tax avoiding, minimum wage paying ethos they can afford bigger rents.  There are small traders still trying to recover from the flood - what a kick in the teeth to increase their rent. Not sure how many units are owned by Dulwich estates, but I think they are just being plain greedy. 

I would like to question why unaccountable, property owning, private school owning organisation, like Dulwich Estates should even be charities in this century.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 20, 2016)

teuchter said:


> There's the usual confusion/conflation between the chain vs independent issue and the upmarket vs affordable issue.
> 
> What's the priority - to keep affordable shops in HH or to keep independent shops in HH?
> 
> Many of the long-standing independent businesses in HH are relatively upmarket (to some extent in contrast to the situation in Brixton).


Please note chain doesn't necessarily mean affordable. The Sainsburys Local has to be one of the most expensive shops around. The tiny Londis shop opposite generally offers better value. 

Yes a lot of the shops are more 'upmarket' now - but it still feels local and quirky. And at least you can still buy ordinary stuff there like a light bulb or a bucket.


----------



## Fingers (Jan 20, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Do any of you recall what HH was like 20 years ago? - more than half the units were empty and shops were closing. Tumble weed down down the street sort of place, no chain would have relocated here. There was an offy that was part of a chain - a chain that went bust. There were a few places like Pullens, the Cafe Prov, the Dance shop and Walters that survived to see the area change around them.
> 
> If the area now has more trade, more shops, more life - it is largely due to the hard work of the independant traders we have. No wonder chains want muscle in on the back of others hard work now. With there tax avoiding, minimum wage paying ethos they can afford bigger rents.  There are small traders still trying to recover from the flood - what a kick in the teeth to increase their rent. Not sure how many units are owned by Dulwich estates, but I think they are just being plain greedy.
> 
> I would like to question why unaccountable, property owning, private school owning organisation, like Dulwich Estates should even be charities in this century.


^this


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 20, 2016)

editor said:


> Now that Herne Hill has got its own theme park branch of the upmarket Shrub & Shutter cocktail bar it's only going to get worse. Gentrification, eh? So many new places to go to for "treats." So many long term businesses being hoofed out. So many rent rises.


I think you are confusing Herne Hill with Brixton.  Yes I'm against losing all our established businesses, and its well known that Dulwich Estates have been a pain in the area forever. But having a new cocktail bar won't make my local area worse.

Besides I'd quite like a cocktail - provided I don't have to drag my self down to Brixton Village.  Cocktails are not new to Herne Hillbillies. We've had happy hours in Pullens for years and then in The Poet for a while (used to be next to Commercial)

I'd love a gin sling, please.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 20, 2016)

Fingers said:


> ^this


thanks - can't wait for the half moon to re open. In the meantime, see you at SLD soon I hope.


----------



## Fingers (Jan 20, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> thanks - can't wait for the half moon to re open. In the meantime, see you at SLD soon I hope.



Yeah me too.  Sorry, had to duck the last one. Will probs be at next one!


----------



## editor (Jan 21, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> I think you are confusing Herne Hill with Brixton.  Yes I'm against losing all our established businesses, and its well known that Dulwich Estates have been a pain in the area forever. But having a new cocktail bar won't make my local area worse.


It's often the start of a familiar and well recognised process that has been happening all over London, but if you think it'll be different in Herne Hill, then I hope you're right.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 21, 2016)

Considering HH as an area has had at least 4 cocktail bars in the last 10-15 years, I'll take your point a moot one and move on. 

Londonist are also picking up on the Just William story (a rapacious chain of capitalist shops exploiting the childhoods of children for some):

"We Are Being Punished For Making Our Area Better" - Public School Forces Toyshop To Close 

There's an interesting line here: 

"When we moved in, most of this parade was empty. Their [DE] party line is they have an obligation to get the most money for their charity as they can, and will take nothing else into consideration even though the flood and empty pub has had an effect on all of us. " 

Which seems to imply that the DE Trustees haven't heeded some of the recommendations in charity law covered by the public repercussions of charities (e.g. Church of England and Comic Relief) holding shares in companies whose business activities appear to be in conflict with the charities aims. It's covered in CC14 for those with an interest.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 21, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Considering HH as an area has had at least 4 cocktail bars in the last 10-15 years, I'll take your point a moot one and move on.
> 
> Londonist are also picking up on the Just William story (a rapacious chain of capitalist shops exploiting the childhoods of children for some):
> 
> ...


too true.  

The Just William shop was part of the general move toward shops catering for children and families. Everything a middle class family could want - private schools, dance studio, sports gear, childrens' books and toys. Dulwich Estates is foolish to price them out and alter the nature of the area that actually supports their schools. 

Note: I don't give for damn about private schools and I'm not that keen on children in general either - but I'd rather live in an area that is lively with shops doing business and employing people, than in an area boarded up and dead.


----------



## Winot (Jan 21, 2016)

This week's Time Out: move to Herne Hill. The lowdown: strong sense of community and independent shops.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 21, 2016)

Only on the 'cusp of desirability'? how insulting!

Me and buscador had better work harder on lowering the tone.


----------



## editor (Jan 21, 2016)




----------



## Fingers (Jan 21, 2016)

I have registered a domain name and we can use it to take on these bastards at Dulwich Estate.  Need people who are willing to help me blog for it and blast out the social media.  My ultimate (but maybe futile aim) is to have their charitable status removed but in the meantime I want the blog to make life as shit for them as possible.

If you are interested in helping out please let me know


----------



## Fingers (Jan 21, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Considering HH as an area has had at least 4 cocktail bars in the last 10-15 years, I'll take your point a moot one and move on.
> 
> Londonist are also picking up on the Just William story (a rapacious chain of capitalist shops exploiting the childhoods of children for some):
> 
> ...




Do you fancy penning a piece on the charity status aspect? (though I do need to speak with Giles first)

This is step too far for me.  I used to take my ex's little lad there when I was looking after him and it is a lovely shop and the staff were ace.


----------



## editor (Jan 21, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Considering HH as an area has had at least 4 cocktail bars in the last 10-15 years, I'll take your point a moot one and move on.
> 
> Londonist are also picking up on the Just William story (a rapacious chain of capitalist shops exploiting the childhoods of children for some):
> 
> ...


It all sounds horribly familiar:


> “It’s almost like we are punished for making our area better, and that isn’t a virtuous circle,” says Gibson, acknowledging his role may move from promoting local businesses to firefighting major institutions. “When we pedestrianised the station area, the shops said their rents would go up — and they were right. I remember a public meeting and I was doing the annual report. Somebody said, 'it’s wonderful what you’ve done but the only problem is I can’t afford to live here anymore'.
> 
> "You can’t buy the community we have here, you have to build it up slowly and carefully. Now that’s under severe threat. It’s a London-wide issue, we are not alone. Landlords are going 'ker-ching' all over the city, without having done anything to earn it. It’s affecting the economy and sustainability of neighbourhoods.”





> This is the crux of the problem. Why should traders and residents make their community better if a landlord — in this case a charity representing some posh schools, but it could be Network Rail, a business in Surrey or an MP — can simply raise their rents by 70% and destroy all that hard work at a stroke? This is the Big Society that ate itself.


----------



## leanderman (Jan 22, 2016)

I still don't get how the school retains charity status. 

A few bursaries, grudging access to its facilities. That's about it.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 22, 2016)

"Education" is one of the 4 heads of charity. That won't change, and it won't be tweaked quickly. Henry VIII set 'em up. Charity Law is a relatively slow moving thing. It took a few hundred years for the last amendment of the 'heads of charity'. 

The proposed 'Public Benefit Test' may influence how their facilities need to be shared amongst the wider community.


----------



## teuchter (Jan 22, 2016)

It's a bit like the Scientologists getting to dodge tax because they are a "religion".


----------



## Tropi (Jan 22, 2016)

Herne Hill is on the news, number 13. Is it really that bad? I was burgled twice when I used to live near the train station but it was many many years ago
The 20 most burgled places in Britain


----------



## Rushy (Jan 22, 2016)

Tropi said:


> Herne Hill is on the news, number 13. Is it really that bad? I was burgled twice when I used to live near the train station but it was many many years ago
> The 20 most burgled places in Britain


Based on reported insurance claims. So rules out low value burglaries and burglaries of uninsured property.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 24, 2016)

Ye Olde Bakery has reopened on the other side of the railway line. Rebranded as Artisan Bakery...

ETA Bel-Ore Artisan bakehouse to be precise.

The green grocers new arch is looking great. And very busy.

Bleu is staying on after the redevelopment. And expanding into 3 units, apparently.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jan 24, 2016)

That's a shitty rename.


----------



## choochi (Jan 24, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Ye Olde Bakery has reopened on the other side of the railway line. Rebranded as Artisan Bakery...
> 
> ETA Bel-Ore Artisan bakehouse to be precise.
> 
> ...



Fruit Garden - the greengrocers - has been renamed 'Seasons of England'


----------



## editor (Jan 24, 2016)

Posted on the other thread: Campaigners rally to keep Herne Hill’s Half Moon as a music venue as gastropub plans are revealed


----------



## teuchter (Jan 25, 2016)

With these renamings it sounds like the independent local businesses have decided to fully embrace gentrification. I trust they will recieve vilification equal to that which a new business with the same name would recieve.


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## Rushy (Jan 25, 2016)

choochi said:


> Fruit Garden - the greengrocers - has been renamed 'Seasons of England'


Five tomatoes, a large lettuce and a modest bunch of spring onions = £4.80. Seems a bit pricey.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 25, 2016)

Is there a post office in HH?


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## colacubes (Jan 25, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Is there a post office in HH?



Yeah -in the Costcutter in the row of shops that run along the bottom of the park.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 25, 2016)

colacubes said:


> Yeah -in the Costcutter in the row of shops that run along the bottom of the park.


Thanks. I never knew that.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jan 25, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Five tomatoes, a large lettuce and a modest bunch of spring onions = £4.80. Seems a bit pricey.


Yeah they're not cheap


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## friendofdorothy (Jan 25, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Five tomatoes, a large lettuce and a modest bunch of spring onions = £4.80. Seems a bit pricey.


that would be £2.50 ish in Noors in Brixton market. 



brixtonblade said:


> Yeah they're not cheap


No not cheap but they do stock a really wide range of some unusual stuff eg lots of types of exotic mushrooms. And its good and fresh.
I can't afford to shop there, but I suppose if you can afford the fancy butchers or the sunday market then you can afford the fancy veg to go with it.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jan 26, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Five tomatoes, a large lettuce and a modest bunch of spring onions = £4.80. Seems a bit pricey.



Sunday farmer's market - stall at the end:
6 toms - £1.50
Large Lettuce - £1
Spring Onions - £1ish

All fresh from the farm


----------



## editor (Jan 26, 2016)

299 old timer said:


> Sunday farmer's market - stall at the end:
> 6 toms - £1.50
> Large Lettuce - £1
> Spring Onions - £1ish
> ...


_Normal_ prices!


----------



## Rushy (Jan 26, 2016)

299 old timer said:


> Sunday farmer's market - stall at the end:
> 6 toms - £1.50
> Large Lettuce - £1
> Spring Onions - £1ish
> ...


Herne Hill? I did look there but there was a big queue and I couldn't see any lettuce. Next time! I love that they sell sprouts on the the stem.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2016)

Very sad to see the shops by the station all boarded up and to say goodbye to Just Williams.


----------



## Biddlybee (Jan 26, 2016)

choochi said:


> Fruit Garden - the greengrocers - has been renamed 'Seasons of England'


I popped in there yesterday, they're loving the new site.


----------



## quimcunx (Jan 26, 2016)

Politest protest poster ever.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2016)

quimcunx said:


> Politest protest poster ever.


My thought exactly!


----------



## editor (Jan 26, 2016)

Added a piece about the tweet campaign and march: Herne Hill residents rise up with Half Moon tweet campaign and march against Just Williams toy shop closure


----------



## stdP (Jan 26, 2016)

All this talk of wanting a reasonably priced grocers makes me wonder if anyone else familiar with the HH grocers that google maps tells me is called Andreas Haralambous at the bottom of Rosendale Road? Great selection of fruit'n'veg and for my money the best bananas I've found around (they knock those crappy green things you get in the supermarkets into a cocked hat). Easy to spot; the shop itself is tiny but they have a huge awning covering the grocery out front.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 26, 2016)

stdP said:


> All this talk of wanting a reasonably priced grocers makes me wonder if anyone else familiar with the HH grocers that google maps tells me is called Andreas Haralambous at the bottom of Rosendale Road? Great selection of fruit'n'veg and for my money the best bananas I've found around (they knock those crappy green things you get in the supermarkets into a cocked hat). Easy to spot; the shop itself is tiny but they have a huge awning covering the grocery out front.



Yes - I used to use them lots because my kids were at the nursery up the road.  Handy little shop that one.  

I only really go to the pricey one in HH if I need something random for a recipe that your average supermarket doesn't have.  They do keep quite a lot of more exotic bits and bobs in there.  I don't buy fruit/veg there (or very rarely) because it really is very pricey.  

I also have a great place nearby (in Tulse Hill) that does the cheapo £1 bowls.  Those bowls can be hit and miss because they're often on the verge of turning, but nothing lasts long in this household anyway, so it tends to get used immediately.  Also they're handy for massive bunches of coriander/parsley etc.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jan 26, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Herne Hill? I did look there but there was a big queue and I couldn't see any lettuce. Next time! I love that they sell sprouts on the the stem.



The lettuce is usually on the display with the spinach. Didn't need on this week so didn't notice. I guess the big queues mean they are doing something right.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jan 26, 2016)

stdP said:


> All this talk of wanting a reasonably priced grocers makes me wonder if anyone else familiar with the HH grocers that google maps tells me is called Andreas Haralambous at the bottom of Rosendale Road? Great selection of fruit'n'veg and for my money the best bananas I've found around (they knock those crappy green things you get in the supermarkets into a cocked hat). Easy to spot; the shop itself is tiny but they have a huge awning covering the grocery out front.



He always has chicory, which is a bonus


----------



## Harbourite (Jan 26, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Herne Hill? I did look there but there was a big queue and I couldn't see any lettuce. Next time! I love that they sell sprouts on the the stem.


probably best value stall at the sunday market (i know, not saying much ...)
and godmersham game also decent value for proper free range meat (depending what you buy)

are prices in the bakery still olde ones or are they now at artisanal levels?


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2016)

stdP said:


> All this talk of wanting a reasonably priced grocers makes me wonder if anyone else familiar with the HH grocers that google maps tells me is called Andreas Haralambous at the bottom of Rosendale Road? Great selection of fruit'n'veg and for my money the best bananas I've found around (they knock those crappy green things you get in the supermarkets into a cocked hat). Easy to spot; the shop itself is tiny but they have a huge awning covering the grocery out front.


Loved that place. My mate used to live in a flat just up the road so I'd buy my weekly f and v when I went to visit. Glad it's still there, for now.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 26, 2016)

Harbourite said:


> probably best value stall at the sunday market (i know, not saying much ...)
> and godmersham game also decent value for proper free range meat (depending what you buy)
> 
> are prices in the bakery still olde ones or are they now at artisanal levels?


I have not been in. I don't eat a huge amount of bread so when I do I tend to use black bird. 

Ye Olde was a decent enough bakery but more Gregg's than artisanal.

Best value stall for me is the Rainforest Roti. £5 and I'm stuffed. Brilliant for hangovers too!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 26, 2016)

got an email from HH forum with more details of Weds meeting and Sats march:


> *When it's gone it's gone*
> 
> *It's our Neighbourhood - let's plan it's future*
> This is a reminder that on Wednesday 27th January, 7.00 p.m, at the Herne Hill Baptist Church Hall (Half Moon Lane and Winterbrook Road) it is the first of our Neighbourhood Plan events. This is where we start to create our plan and vision for how we want to see Herne Hill develop over the coming years.
> ...


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 26, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Best value stall for me is the Rainforest Roti. £5 and I'm stuffed. Brilliant for hangovers too!



I bloody love those.  I've never bought anything else at that Sunday market - sometimes the kids get crepes if we're in the park - but I go out of my way to get one of those Rainforest Rotis.  They have to be eaten sitting down though - they're super juicyexplodey.


----------



## editor (Jan 26, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> got an email from HH forum with more details of Weds meeting and Sats march:


Cheers - I've added that to the Buzz article. Are you going to join the march? I'm not around on Saturday but it would be good to get a report for the site...


----------



## Rushy (Jan 26, 2016)

gaijingirl said:


> I bloody love those.  I've never bought anything else at that Sunday market - sometimes the kids get crepes if we're in the park - but I go out of my way to get one of those Rainforest Rotis.  They have to be eaten sitting down though - they're super juicyexplodey.


So good. I want one right now, damn it!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 26, 2016)

editor said:


> Cheers - I've added that to the Buzz article. Are you going to join the march? I'm not around on Saturday but it would be good to get a report for the site...


Yes, hope to show my face and my support. 
edited to add - but I'm not a writer...


----------



## editor (Jan 26, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Yes, hope to show my face and my support.
> edited to add - but I'm not a writer...


Well just some pics would be nice. It's good to document these things!


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Jan 27, 2016)

You can object to the Half Moon Fuller's application here

I don't know if Southwark are any more receptive than Lambeth?


----------



## Winot (Jan 27, 2016)

is there a danger that if objections to Fullers are sustained it will cease to be a pub at all?


----------



## editor (Jan 27, 2016)

Winot said:


> is there a danger that if objections to Fullers are sustained it will cease to be a pub at all?


I'd like to think that if the campaign continues to gather steam it will make it apparent to the brewery (or other interested parties) that there is a real need for the pub to continue to include a live music venue.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jan 27, 2016)

I like live music alot, but is there really 'a need' for there to be a live music venue in Herne Hill?

What constitutes 'a need'?

I'm struggling to come up with an answer, as much as I struggle with the need for a toy shop or a sports shop or a fancy deli. 

I'm not saying they shouldnt be there, or not great to have, but I'm finding it hard to justify why they are essential or necessary.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 27, 2016)

Winot said:


> is there a danger that if objections to Fullers are sustained it will cease to be a pub at all?


I hope not. Does anyone one know if Fullers have any other pubs that are music venues?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 27, 2016)

Nanker Phelge said:


> I like live music alot, but is there really 'a need' for there to be a live music venue in Herne Hill?
> 
> What constitutes 'a need'?
> 
> ...


Maybe 'need' is too strong a word for it - but it would a shame to loose such a long established and well loved music venue.  I saw bands there in the '80s before I lived in the area and my girlf remembers travelling from Brum to see a band there, perhaps we didn't need too - but it was fun. Recent managers really haven't bothered with it much and it hasn't fulfilled its potential for music for years now. I'm struggling to think of any similar music pubs in Southwark - how many are there?  Perhaps there is a 'need' for live music venues in Southwark. 

Perhaps we don't 'need' one in Herne Hill, but we certainly don't need yet another restaurant. In terms of heritage music music is a major export for Britain - where are the musicians of tomorrow to start out and develop if we lose all these small venues?  There seem to be fewer and fewer places for live music all over London, they are closing everywhere. I don't want to lose them all, so I'd like to keep my local, the Half Moon, as a place for live music.

Need for toy shop etc? well I say we need local shops and we need jobs.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 27, 2016)

editor said:


> Well just some pics would be nice. It's good to document these things!


no use asking me - apart from anything else I don't have a camera.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jan 27, 2016)

Off the cuff have live music with young artists.

Half moon seemed to have old blues players and tribute bands for years...


----------



## madolesance (Jan 27, 2016)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Off the cuff have live music with young artists.
> 
> Half moon seemed to have old blues players and tribute bands for years...



You beat me to it.

Off the Cuff is probably a better size venue for new bands plus there is the Veg bar on Tulse Hill that is also a space for new bands. So when it comes to there being new music venues in the area more seem to be appearing.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 27, 2016)

madolesance said:


> You beat me to it.
> 
> Off the Cuff is probably a better size venue for new bands plus there is the Veg bar on Tulse Hill that is also a space for new bands. So when it comes to there being new music venues in the area more seem to be appearing.


Are you sure it is bigger? didn't look that big to me, but I could be wrong. Are they still having noise complaint problems?
Both those venues are in Lambeth, so would that have any effect Southwark planning permission for the 'Moon'?

Haven't heard much about the Veg bar - I thought that was a vegan cafe? tell me more.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 27, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Are you sure it is bigger? didn't look that big to me, but I could be wrong. Are they still having noise complaint problems?
> Both those venues are in Lambeth, so would that have any effect Southwark planning permission for the 'Moon'?
> 
> Haven't heard much about the Veg bar - I thought that was a vegan cafe? tell me more.


Punk in the basement.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 27, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Punk in the basement.


By coincidence, the manager is a live in guardian at the Half Moon.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 27, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Punk in the basement.


at veg place? didn't know punk still existed, it was all so long ago. buscador get get your bondage trousers on ...

Have just had a look at their website and see I missed a Cressingham gardens benefit last week, no one mentioned it.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 27, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> at veg place? didn't know punk still existed, it was all so long ago. buscador get get your bondage trousers on ....


Proper sweat dripping of the ceiling affair when I saw it.


----------



## GarveyLives (Jan 27, 2016)

*Has anyone been charged with racially aggravated criminal damage as yet?*​


----------



## Greebo (Jan 28, 2016)

editor said:


> Well just some pics would be nice. It's good to document these things!


I'll try to get my camera there if up to it on the day, but I'm not making any promises at this stage.


----------



## Greebo (Jan 30, 2016)

That was a very Herne Hillish protest - cheerful, well behaved, lots of dogs and small children.  Photos have been dropboxed via VP to Brixton Buzz.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jan 30, 2016)

There was a small article in the Evening Standard last week whereby Dulwich Estates said that the rent for the toy shop had been 22k for about five years and now has gone up to 28k. I don't think this is unusual. The accounts would reveal all.


----------



## leanderman (Jan 30, 2016)

299 old timer said:


> There was a small article in the Evening Standard last week whereby Dulwich Estates said that the rent for the toy shop had been 22k for about five years and now has gone up to 28k. I don't think this is unusual. The accounts would reveal all.



Hard to tell with these things. But a 70pc rise has been cited.


----------



## 299 old timer (Jan 30, 2016)

leanderman said:


> Hard to tell with these things. But a 70pc rise has been cited.



I'm only mentioning what I read in that bumwipe paper, so I wait to hear what the real figures are. 70% rise is a shocker, no business can cope with that.


----------



## Greebo (Jan 30, 2016)

299 old timer said:


> I'm only mentioning what I read in that bumwipe paper, so I wait to hear what the real figures are. 70% rise is a shocker, no business can cope with that.


70% is real alright - and several shops have been hit by it, not just the toyshop.  But you think that's bad?  The spokesman at the protest said that Bon Velo's rent has been raised 80%  

Apparently, DE are justifying it by saying that as a pro rata increase (ie factoring in no increase for 5 years) it's lower, but that's no consolation when it comes on top of local flooding etc.  

Also, that new shop doing nails on Half Moon Lane accepted the the high (post rise) rent when they moved in and are struggling to break even, just a few months after opening.

Herne Hill is quite a prosperous area - if well established shops there can no longer make a go of it, where the hell do independant retailers stand a chance?


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 30, 2016)

Greebo said:


> 70% is real alright - and several shops have been hit by it, not just the toyshop.  But you think that's bad?  The spokesman at the protest said that Bon Velo's rent has been raised 80%



Bon Velo gave a load of kids Frog bikes to the Velodrome to help kids learn to ride - which is where my two learned their skills and on those very bikes.  As a result, I bought them the same model of bikes from Bon Velo.  I could have gotten cheaper bikes from Halfords or wherever but we liked those particular bikes and I liked that they had done that so I went direct to them.*  I'd be sad to see them go, I hope they can withstand such a massive rent hike.

*and actually it's just one bike at a time as they get passed down from older to younger sibling and being excellent quality they can withstand that level of use.


----------



## editor (Jan 31, 2016)

Photos from Saturday's protest, with many thanks to a urbanite!






Save Our Shops: Herne Hill residents take to the streets – photos


----------



## pesh (Feb 11, 2016)

A bloke who was seriously amused by the word wood in Milkwood just Melvined himself on the bike racks as he walked past The Commercial.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 11, 2016)

I was in the Commercial for the first time in ages last night and felt a bit like I was in North London.


----------



## Greebo (Feb 11, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> <snip> Have just had a look at their website and see I missed a Cressingham gardens benefit last week, no one mentioned it.


I only came across it on Face Ache, and I've not been checking there recently on account of life getting in the way... and VP checks it even less often than I do.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 12, 2016)

teuchter said:


> I was in the Commercial for the first time in ages last night and felt a bit like I was in North London.


 its been so long since I've been to North London - I don't even know what that means.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 12, 2016)

yesterday afternoon I went to our new cocktail bar First Aid Box. It was fab - over 25 types of gin and I was seriously bad mood in need of gin medication. I was up front that I only had £9 on me  (£4 for a small gins ok.)  I had a local Peckham gin - lovely and then some fantastic rhubarb gin (mango5 you would love it) Chris, the host, was very chatty and pleasant local lad who remembers the plumbing shop. Weird shop that, very anti retail. He was very knowledgable about all the booze. We had an amusing conversation about this and that.

He insisted I try a cocktail on the house - which was delicious.  Then insisted I try an Aviation, then offered 'one for the frog' no idea why, but it was a superb stawberry martini - all on the house.  As I'm neither young nor attractive, and obviously not rich, I can only assume he found me witty or he was bored - either way I appreciated the generousity.


----------



## Maharani (Feb 12, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> yesterday afternoon I went to our new cocktail bar First Aid Box. It was fab - over 25 types of gin and I was seriously bad mood in need of gin medication. I was up front that I only had £9 on me  (£4 for a small gins ok.)  I had a local Peckham gin - lovely and then some fantastic rhubarb gin (mango5 you would love it) Chris, the host, was very chatty and pleasant local lad who remembers the plumbing shop. Weird shop that, very anti retail. He was very knowledgable about all the booze. We had an amusing conversation about this and that.
> 
> He insisted I try a cocktail on the house - which was delicious.  Then insisted I try an Aviation, then offered 'one for the frog' no idea why, but it was a superb stawberry martini - all on the house.  As I'm neither young nor attractive, and obviously not rich, I can only assume he found me witty or he was bored - either way I appreciated the generousity.


What hat were you wearing?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 12, 2016)

Maharani said:


> What hat were you wearing?


Just one of my workaday ones - a litte black one. Not my best one or a fancy one or anything. The staff did say they liked it though. Do you think it helped?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 13, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Just one of my workaday ones - a litte black one. Not my best one or a fancy one or anything. The staff did say they liked it though. Do you think it helped?



Women in hats give good chats, innit?


----------



## Maharani (Feb 15, 2016)

Please advise on good hairdressers in Herne Hill.  I want to go from long to very short so it's drastic and I want a mod cut so I need somewhere that knows about these sorts of cuts.


----------



## Winot (Feb 15, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Please advise on good hairdressers in Herne Hill.  I want to go from long to very short so it's drastic and I want a mod cut so I need somewhere that knows about these sorts of cuts.



Mrs W goes to Boki on South Norwood Rd. It's very popular.


----------



## innit (Feb 15, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Please advise on good hairdressers in Herne Hill.  I want to go from long to very short so it's drastic and I want a mod cut so I need somewhere that knows about these sorts of cuts.


I'd go somewhere specialist for that. One of my friends raves about Lucie Luella for 60s cuts... North London though.


----------



## Maharani (Feb 15, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Just one of my workaday ones - a litte black one. Not my best one or a fancy one or anything. The staff did say they liked it though. Do you think it helped?


Hats always help.


----------



## Maharani (Feb 15, 2016)

Winot said:


> Mrs W goes to Boki on South Norwood Rd. It's very popular.


I'll try this place I think. Ta


----------



## Steel Icarus (Feb 15, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Please advise on good hairdressers in Herne Hill.  I want to go from long to very short so it's drastic and I want a mod cut so I need somewhere that knows about these sorts of cuts.


Pics when you've done it then Maharani


----------



## Maharani (Feb 15, 2016)

S☼I said:


> Pics when you've done it then Maharani


Bit scared!


----------



## Fingers (Feb 16, 2016)

It looks good!


----------



## Manter (Feb 17, 2016)

Looking for a spare room for a refugee. 

Syrian man who has spent 7 months (!) in the jungle and has crossed. He doesn't speak much English and has been through a lot so it would be great if he could stay here in London close to a large group of friends who have all crossed- they will teach him English for a start! The NASS people will send him somewhere random up north in his own.

Can anyone help? Needs to have an address the home office can send letters to so has to be legit, not a squat or sub let or anything


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Feb 17, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Please advise on good hairdressers in Herne Hill.  I want to go from long to very short so it's drastic and I want a mod cut so I need somewhere that knows about these sorts of cuts.


Please try Jane at Love Hair Brixton, opposite Lidl.  She is brilliant.  I have massively thick hair and she is the only person who is not scared of it.  I have a short modern cut, she is just the tops.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 17, 2016)

Manter said:


> Looking for a spare room for a refugee.
> 
> Syrian man who has spent 7 months (!) in the jungle and has crossed. He doesn't speak much English and has been through a lot so it would be great if he could stay here in London close to a large group of friends who have all crossed- they will teach him English for a start! The NASS people will send him somewhere random up north in his own.
> 
> Can anyone help? Needs to have an address the home office can send letters to so has to be legit, not a squat or sub let or anything


I hope you can find somewhere


----------



## Rushy (Feb 21, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> yesterday afternoon I went to our new cocktail bar First Aid Box. It was fab - over 25 types of gin and I was seriously bad mood in need of gin medication. I was up front that I only had £9 on me  (£4 for a small gins ok.)  I had a local Peckham gin - lovely and then some fantastic rhubarb gin (mango5 you would love it) Chris, the host, was very chatty and pleasant local lad who remembers the plumbing shop. Weird shop that, very anti retail. He was very knowledgable about all the booze. We had an amusing conversation about this and that.
> 
> He insisted I try a cocktail on the house - which was delicious.  Then insisted I try an Aviation, then offered 'one for the frog' no idea why, but it was a superb stawberry martini - all on the house.  As I'm neither young nor attractive, and obviously not rich, I can only assume he found me witty or he was bored - either way I appreciated the generousity.


No hat required it would seem. My mate and I were given drinks on the house simply on account of being the last people in there. Having not been in before, I've visited twice this week. Quite impressed really. And very friendly. Seems to have avoided the more gimmicky cocktail ideas from shrub whilst still being original.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Feb 24, 2016)

Popped into the Commercial and ordered at pint of Meantime lager.  £5.05 !!!  I swore at the barman. He commented that was a normal price, Herne Hill is over......


----------



## editor (Feb 24, 2016)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Popped into the Commercial and ordered at pint of Meantime lager.  £5.05 !!!  I swore at the barman. He commented that was a normal price, Herne Hill is over......


Fucking hell. That is an almighty rip.


----------



## Rushy (Feb 24, 2016)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Popped into the Commercial and ordered at pint of Meantime lager.  £5.05 !!!  I swore at the barman. He commented that was a normal price, Herne Hill is over......


Head to the Regent. Hop Head starts with a 3.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Feb 24, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Head to the Regent. Hop Head starts with a 3.


Great news.

To be honest I was being a little unfair. I went to the Bullfinch tap room last week and had some of the finest beer on the planet at reasonable prices. It's just if you want some 'brand' lager they try and rip you off in the pubs.


----------



## Rushy (Feb 24, 2016)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Great news.
> 
> To be honest I was being a little unfair. I went to the Bullfinch tap room last week and had some of the finest beer on the planet at reasonable prices. It's just if you want some 'brand' lager they try and rip you off in the pubs.


I've always thought meantime horribly over rated to be honest. Disappointed that the commercial stopped doing Beavertown. But it was pricey too.

I tried the bullfinch last weekend. Liked the place. Wasn't blown away by either of the beers I tried but will definitely try again. Canopy Brockwell and Milkwood I like a lot.


----------



## CH1 (Feb 24, 2016)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Popped into the Commercial and ordered at pint of Meantime lager.  £5.05 !!!  I swore at the barman. He commented that was a normal price, Herne Hill is over......





editor said:


> Fucking hell. That is an almighty rip.


Meantime was always expensive. A half pint at RFH used to b e about £3 3 years ago.

Besides that they've now been taken over by ("sold out to") Inbev!


----------



## Winot (Feb 24, 2016)

Meantime is always kegged, isn't it? Horrible stuff.


----------



## Smick (Feb 25, 2016)

I like the Meantime London Pale, but I don't see why it should be more expensive than anything else. More than a fiver on the far edge of Zone 2 is a piss take.

Mind you, I was hit with a bill for £5.65 a pint in the Railway about 18 months ago.


----------



## Maharani (Feb 25, 2016)

Smick said:


> I like the Meantime London Pale, but I don't see why it should be more expensive than anything else. More than a fiver on the far edge of Zone 2 is a piss take.
> 
> Mind you, I was hit with a bill for £5.65 a pint in the Railway about 18 months ago.


For one pint? What of?


----------



## CH1 (Feb 25, 2016)

Smick said:


> I like the Meantime London Pale, but I don't see why it should be more expensive than anything else. More than a fiver on the far edge of Zone 2 is a piss take.
> 
> Mind you, I was hit with a bill for £5.65 a pint in the Railway about 18 months ago.


It's all to do with marketing SAB Miller buys Meantime to enter UK craft beer market


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 25, 2016)

Craft beer = crap beer + marketing hype. Its not real ale, its just a rip off.


----------



## Smick (Feb 25, 2016)

Maharani said:


> For one pint? What of?


Meantime Pale. I don't mind paying it in there when there's entertainment and no cover charge, but it's a bit much when you're just calling in.


----------



## choochi (Feb 26, 2016)

I see the empty commercial premises on the corner of Ryman and Railton has been squatted. Good on them, it's a disgrace that it's been allowed to sit empty for so long.


----------



## editor (Feb 26, 2016)

choochi said:


> I see the empty commercial premises on the corner of Ryman and Railton has been squatted. Good on them, it's a disgrace that it's been allowed to sit empty for so long.


Excellent!


----------



## Sister Midnight (Feb 26, 2016)

I took the boy to Canopy (I think- arch off Rosendale). Nice environs but almost choked when it was almost a tenner for a takeaway two pint milk carton... Tbf I don't get out much now. Maybe that's normal?!


----------



## Crispy (Feb 27, 2016)

Sister Midnight said:


> I took the boy to Canopy (I think- arch off Rosendale). Nice environs but almost choked when it was almost a tenner for a takeaway two pint milk carton... Tbf I don't get out much now. Maybe that's normal?!


Shouldn't be. Their standard pints are £3.50 so you must have been buying the Special Reserve or something.


----------



## Maharani (Feb 27, 2016)

Sister Midnight said:


> I took the boy to Canopy (I think- arch off Rosendale). Nice environs but almost choked when it was almost a tenner for a takeaway two pint milk carton... Tbf I don't get out much now. Maybe that's normal?!


No, it's not.


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 27, 2016)

Rosendale would be Bullfinch brewery


----------



## Smick (Feb 27, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Rosendale would be Bullfinch brewery


Canopy is under the Tulse Hill Herne Hill railway line, behind the row of shops with the post office, chutney Indian, soft play etc.

I remember thinking it was a bit pricey, but I don't know what it costs to run it. They wouldn't have the volume of the bigger independents.

It's nice to sit out there in the sun. There's an old Citroen DS to look at as well.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Feb 28, 2016)




----------



## editor (Feb 29, 2016)

sleaterkinney said:


>


I'll give it a plug on Buzz today.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 16, 2016)

Launch of the HH oral history project:

Launch of History Hear - Oral memories of Herne Hill - Wednesday 16 March, 6:30pm at Carnegie Library


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 21, 2016)

198 Gallery current exhibition (and x2 month events)





Launch of Rockers, Soulheads & Lovers | 198 gallery


----------



## Maharani (Mar 21, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> 198 Gallery current exhibition (and x2 month events)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Shame that was last Saturday. I can't see info for the second event.


----------



## editor (Mar 21, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> 198 Gallery current exhibition (and x2 month events)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I went to the launch on Saturday and saw loads of old faces - there was a great soundsystem in the back. The exhibition runs until 21st May.


----------



## editor (Apr 6, 2016)

Love this building.











An architectural gem: St Saviour’s Parish Hall, Herne Hill Road, SE24


----------



## choochi (Apr 7, 2016)

A few things I saw today on my walk around Herne Hill...

The old Just Williams shop has a licensing notice for Chix and Buck - who run the Wine Parlour on Atlantic Road, so it looks like they are planning something similar for Herne Hill. Does Herne Hill now need an offshoot of every popular Brixton business? We've already got the Shrub and Shutter mark II.

Also, Saray the new Turkish restaurant where Saz once was on Norwood Road looks like it's nearly ready to open. They've done a lot of work refurbishing it. Hoping its going to be good.

The Best Kebab, on the stretch being refurbed by Network Rail, seems to be refusing to shut. Apparently it's causing delays to the work starting on that whole stretch. 

The lovely but now sadly closed number 22 restaurant has become a posh hairdressers called Aitch SE24. Think it opened yesterday. Apparently the first 100 people through the door get a free haircut, not sure of the small-print though.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 8, 2016)

Saray is just Saz rebranded.


----------



## Maharani (Apr 8, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Saray is just Saz rebranded.


This place has taken aeons to open...why?


----------



## uk benzo (Apr 8, 2016)

choochi said:


> A few things I saw today on my walk around Herne Hill...
> 
> The old Just Williams shop has a licensing notice for Chix and Buck - who run the Wine Parlour on Atlantic Road, so it looks like they are planning something similar for Herne Hill. Does Herne Hill now need an offshoot of every popular Brixton business? We've already got the Shrub and Shutter mark II.
> 
> ...



I fucking love that kebab shop- their grilled chicken hits the spot every time. I'll be sad when they cleanse it away.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Apr 8, 2016)

It's a really good kebab, that shop has just been done up a short while too.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 8, 2016)

Maharani said:


> This place has taken aeons to open...why?


Hmm, lots of reasons but not suitable for on here.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Apr 8, 2016)

There's been a few restaurants in that spot, the Brazilian one up the road seems to be struggling too.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 8, 2016)

The new transplanted Bickles seems to be doing ok though. 

It's strange - HH doesn't have much parking which is probably why PE is always quite quiet, so the idea of squeezing in lots more restaurant units is a bit peculiar.


----------



## Maharani (Apr 8, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Hmm, lots of reasons but not suitable for on here.


Intriguing


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 8, 2016)

Hyper local is one thing, but airing dirty laundry another.


----------



## Maharani (Apr 8, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> The new transplanted Bickles seems to be doing ok though.
> 
> It's strange - HH doesn't have much parking which is probably why PE is always quite quiet, so the idea of squeezing in lots more restaurant units is a bit peculiar.


Why? Do you think most people round here have cars? I beg to differ.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 8, 2016)

Why on earth would you jump to that conclusion?


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Apr 8, 2016)

The Turkish place needed a refurb, it was so uninviting before.  I hope it does better.  And they never had any special offers like most other places do on Mondays and Tuesdays.  Olley's in particular, what a genius move to have gluten free days.  They were so quiet on Mondays that they never used to open.


----------



## editor (Apr 28, 2016)

Crowdfunding appeal has gone out for a new street piano:

Crowdfunding appeal launched for new Herne Hill street piano


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Apr 28, 2016)

editor said:


> Crowdfunding appeal has gone out for a new street piano:
> 
> Crowdfunding appeal launched for new Herne Hill street piano



£5k? That seems a bit steep. I think an upright piano is the sort of thing you have to pay someone to take these days.

Here's some available for free: free piano in London | Keyboards, Pianos, & Organs for Sale - Gumtree


----------



## editor (Apr 28, 2016)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> £5k? That seems a bit steep. I think an upright piano is the sort of thing you have to pay someone to take these days.
> 
> Here's some available for free: free piano in London | Keyboards, Pianos, & Organs for Sale - Gumtree


That's what I thought. Whatever piano gets put out there is going to get trashed and I'm sure they could have got a half decent one donated if they'd put out an appeal.


----------



## Smick (Apr 29, 2016)

So many people buy pianos for their kids to learn, the kids don't, the parents want the space back and you end up with free or cheap pianos.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 29, 2016)

Here's the background to why it's not just going to be a freebie off the east dulwich forum (from today's HH forum newsletter) :

"The Herne Hill piano has been a much-loved local icon for the past 3 years. It's been played by thousands of passers-by and people of all ages. It's been wheeled out for film festivals, carol concerts and opera duets.  It's starred in three films and the Raindance festival (see here). When it's playing, it brings the square to life and makes commuters feel safe walking through the tunnel.

But time and the elements have taken their toll, and the piano's on its last legs now.

To keep the music playing in Herne Hill, we're trying to raise £5,000 for a refurbished second-hand, sturdy, damp-resistant, built-to-last replacement that will be able to withstand the tough and unusual demands placed on our street piano (including pigeon poo and children's thumping fingers!).  This funding will also cover the costs of installation, a new, safer platform for the piano, iconic art work, events that involve the piano and ongoing maintenance and care, to ensure this legacy stays with us Herne Hillmans for many years to come.

If you love the piano and want to keep the music playing, please visit our crowd funding page here to help us hit the high notes!"


----------



## teuchter (Apr 29, 2016)

crowdfunder page said:
			
		

> Hello.  I'm the Herne Hill piano. You've all loved me over the years, I've entertained you, kept the children busy, made you feel safe, brought the square to life, opened my arms to everyone, but now, I'm shattered.  I've been played hard, children have hammered my keys, I've been showered in lagers and sprinkled with pigeon poo.  As a result, my keys are worn, my pedals rattle and I feel the damp in my frame.  I'm getting to be very high maintenance.
> 
> As a film star and local celeb, I feel it's time to draw the final curtain and give myself a rest.
> 
> ...



Herne Hill Piano Plea

Questions could be asked about whether they have procured this piano via a fully competitive, open and transparent tender process ensuring best value for the community. What would the EU have to say about this? We'd better leave before they notice.


----------



## editor (Apr 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Here's the background to why it's not just going to be a freebie off the east dulwich forum (from today's HH forum newsletter) :
> 
> "The Herne Hill piano has been a much-loved local icon for the past 3 years. It's been played by thousands of passers-by and people of all ages. It's been wheeled out for film festivals, carol concerts and opera duets.  It's starred in three films and the Raindance festival (see here). When it's playing, it brings the square to life and makes commuters feel safe walking through the tunnel.
> 
> ...


That was all in the Buzz article yesterday.  Five grand still seems an awful lot and I don't see why they couldn't have put out an appeal for a tip top piano first.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Apr 29, 2016)

Yeah I'm all for buy once buy quality but surely an annual succession of free pianos would be better?!


.


----------



## Ms T (Apr 29, 2016)

Lizzy Mac said:


> The Turkish place needed a refurb, it was so uninviting before.  I hope it does better.  And they never had any special offers like most other places do on Mondays and Tuesdays.  Olley's in particular, what a genius move to have gluten free days.  They were so quiet on Mondays that they never used to open.


We went for lunch today. It looks much nicer but was very quiet - just us and another table of two.

The food was very good. We had a hot and a cold mixed mezze with a couple of freebies thrown in and a bottle of wine for £20 each.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 3, 2016)

In case anyone over 45yr old is interested About Silverfit - Silverfit  do Nordic walking and Pilates in Brockwell park - very cheap to join.

The park is looking lovely and lush right now.


----------



## leanderman (May 3, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> In case anyone over 45yr old is interested About Silverfit - Silverfit  do Nordic walking and Pilates in Brockwell park - very cheap to join.



They put me off my tennis, with their strange sticks!


----------



## Crispy (May 3, 2016)

Herne Hill free film festival is on soon

Herne Hill Free Film Festival

I'm chuffed because we're showing Ex_Machina at makerspace, with a Q&A with the scientific advisor for the film. That's next Wednesday (the 11th)


----------



## Rushy (May 3, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> In case anyone over 45yr old is interested About Silverfit - Silverfit  do Nordic walking and Pilates in Brockwell park - very cheap to join.
> 
> The park is looking lovely and lush right now.


Over 45 qualifies you for silver fit?
Most depressing thing I've read in weeks...


----------



## colacubes (May 4, 2016)

Crispy said:


> Herne Hill free film festival is on soon
> 
> Herne Hill Free Film Festival
> 
> I'm chuffed because we're showing Ex_Machina at makerspace, with a Q&A with the scientific advisor for the film. That's next Wednesday (the 11th)



It's an absolutely ace film   Might have to toddle down and watch it again.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 4, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Over 45 qualifies you for silver fit?
> Most depressing thing I've read in weeks...


To be fair at 55 yrs old, I was the youngest there


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 4, 2016)

colacubes said:


> It's an absolutely ace film   Might have to toddle down and watch it again.


me too.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 4, 2016)

leanderman said:


> They put me off my tennis, with their strange sticks!


all the better to stab you with


----------



## Greebo (May 4, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> To be fair at 55 yrs old, I was the youngest there


Did you choose pilates or nordic walking?


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 4, 2016)

Greebo said:


> Did you choose pilates or nordic walking?


Nordic walking - the sharp sticks are useful weapons.


----------



## leanderman (May 4, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> all the better to stab you with



Are you one of them (Nordic walkers)?


----------



## Greebo (May 4, 2016)

leanderman said:


> Are you one of them (Nordic walkers)?


Are you one of those (fair weather tennis players)?


----------



## teuchter (May 4, 2016)

FOD will be after me with her weaponised sticks if she sees this thread


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 4, 2016)

I am the very definition of 'one of them' 

and yes I tried Nordic walking yesterday for the first time, it was fun. Now I know that you sporty types are disconcerted by older people going for a walk with sticks I'll enjoy it all the more. 

Come all old and unfit people, Reclaim the park!


----------



## leanderman (May 4, 2016)

Greebo said:


> Are you one of those (fair weather tennis players)?



All year round!


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 4, 2016)

teuchter said:


> FOD will be after me with her weaponised sticks if she sees this thread


Its always handy to have a weapon to hand - hat pins come in very useful too.



teuchter said:


> I have no objection to people who actually need sticks, using them. My mum, also in her 60s, uses one. Not a shiny aluminium one mind.


 We don't need your permission you know.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 4, 2016)

Anyone want to join us for a pre-voting / ballot spoiling discussion? with afternoon binge drinking. pm me if you do.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 8, 2016)

free film in the Regent tonight as part of film fest.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 16, 2016)

Hear that Nick Clegg is upstairs at the Regent tonight. No idea why.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 16, 2016)

Is anyone going to OTC to see the free film tomorrow? Koyaanisqatsi + Stop Making Sense - Free Film Festivals


----------



## Winot (May 16, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Is anyone going to OTC to see the free film tomorrow? Koyaanisqatsi + Stop Making Sense - Free Film Festivals



Nope, but Stop Making Sense is ace.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 16, 2016)

Winot said:


> Nope, but Stop Making Sense is ace.


Think I saw _Stop making sense_ in the 80s, loved that suit, and the music. 

But it was _Koyaanisqatsi_ I really want to see again.


----------



## CH1 (May 18, 2016)

Lord Lester of Herne Hill on Hard Talk NOW
(just brought out a book it seems)


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 18, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> .But it was _Koyaanisqatsi_ I really want to see again.


Great film well worth seeing again. I think the unsteady screen (it sort of rippled when anyone went to the loos) and the roar of trains going overhead suited it perfectly . Good to see Monkeygrinder's Organ there with a pal of mine. Excellent night. 

Had a nice pint of welsh bitter in the Commercial afterwards thanks to the pal - at £4.40 ffs. And the ladies toilet seats were still broken, though at least the lights and locks worked and they had paper and soap this time, which is some improvement on the last time I went there.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 23, 2016)

Called in the Commercial again - late on Sat - there are so many HH old regulars in there I really will have to visit again. Shame its so expensive and the ladies loos are a disgrace.

It's definitely more lively in there than it used to be. A drunk french woman tried to steal my hat, then sang 'Vache!' very raucously at me while flashing her bra at me (not very impressive).


----------



## Rushy (May 25, 2016)

Anyone else heard that the railway bridge by the Half Moon is going to be replaced?


----------



## snowy_again (May 25, 2016)

Isn't that part of the ongoing replacements? They did the ones on Croxted Road, and further up the line earlier in the year.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 2, 2016)

What do people think of the sculptures in the park - I could only see two though 3 were titled on the poster at the park gate.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 2, 2016)

Its getting too posh around here. 

We've got had the regular organic food deliveries, quality meat deliveries, easy cooking ingredients boxes etc etc for a long while now.
Last night we had someone 'delivering fresh flowers weekly' to the door, ffs!


----------



## wtfftw (Jun 2, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Its getting too posh around here.
> 
> We've got had the regular organic food deliveries, quality meat deliveries, easy cooking ingredients boxes etc etc for a long while now.
> Last night we had someone 'delivering fresh flowers weekly' to the door, ffs!


How much?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 2, 2016)

wtfftw said:


> How much?


Think I overheard him say half price the first week from £10 (normally £20) includes peonies this week.
He was trying to do the selling pitch to buscador - don't know who I felt more sorry for!  She didn't even buy me flowers when she had money.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jun 2, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> Think I overheard him say half price the first week from £10 (normally £20) includes peonies this week.
> He was trying to do the selling pitch to buscador - don't know who I felt more sorry for!  She didn't even buy me flowers when she had money.


We had them round too last week , but was a woman. Freddies flowers maybe? 
I had a toddler jumping up and down on my foot and the flower lady didn't look like she could be arsed trying to sell me anything.


----------



## editor (Jun 5, 2016)

So Pullens has closed after serving the denizens of Herne Hill for decades.


----------



## organicpanda (Jun 5, 2016)

editor said:


> So Pullens has closed after serving the denizens of Herne Hill for decades.


since when? it was open at lunch time


----------



## editor (Jun 5, 2016)

organicpanda said:


> since when? it was open at lunch time


----------



## organicpanda (Jun 5, 2016)

editor said:


>



according to the Herne Hill forum it's a change of ownership, I know they looked into selling up 5 years ago so it doesn't surprise me but I'll be sad to see them gone


----------



## Smick (Jun 6, 2016)

I wasn't that fond of it, but I guess it has been four years since I've been in. Hopefully the new person will make a good shot at it. I'll give it a try.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 6, 2016)

And they've still got Cafe Prov (despite the saga with flooding & insurance)


----------



## T & P (Jun 23, 2016)

My other half said there was a waist-high geyser coming out of a manhole by the junction/ entrance to the park when she went past it on the bus early this morning. Not surprising given the amount of water that fell last night.

I was thinking of Dulwich Road when the rain was at its heaviest, as the area is prone to flooding. I guess the sewers did their job and there was none. I still remember a few years ago when a large stretch of the street was knee-deep in water after a storm.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 24, 2016)

T & P said:


> My other half said there was a waist-high geyser coming out of a manhole by the junction/ entrance to the park when she went past it on the bus early this morning. Not surprising given the amount of water that fell last night.
> 
> I was thinking of Dulwich Road when the rain was at its heaviest, as the area is prone to flooding. I guess the sewers did their job and there was none. I still remember a few years ago when a large stretch of the street was knee-deep in water after a storm.


thames water have spent a lot making sure the sewers were improved/maintained after that. Seemed to have worked.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 24, 2016)

Park itself was submerged in places. Am I right in thinking the River Effra used to run along there, I'm guessing just in the park kinda parallel with Norwood Rd..? Maybe they should uncover it - would be pretty - tho maybe too ££ / safety issues...


.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jun 25, 2016)

Sister Midnight said:


> Park itself was submerged in places. Am I right in thinking the River Effra used to run along there, I'm guessing just in the park kinda parallel with Norwood Rd..? Maybe they should uncover it - would be pretty - tho maybe too ££ / safety issues...
> 
> 
> .



tributaries from the Effra yes - that's where the pond comes from - see also Belair Park ponds.


----------



## hendo (Jun 26, 2016)

Cafe Prov turns out to be Pullens in exile. Went for breakfast this morning to find Alan cooking it.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jun 26, 2016)

I think that they owned both establishments.
The back room of Prov has gone now, where the kiddies played.
Haven't been in yet since the refurb.


----------



## ringo (Jun 27, 2016)

I thought the owner of Pullens retired and he'd sold Cafe Prov some time ago.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 27, 2016)

Nope, they kept them both - Prov was more affected by the floods and delays in compensation / insurance from Thames Water. I can't see Alan retiring despite his claims!


----------



## hendo (Jun 28, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Nope, they kept them both - Prov was more affected by the floods and delays in compensation / insurance from Thames Water. I can't see Alan retiring despite his claims!


Strength to him; he is a Herne Hill Legend.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 29, 2016)

Had a wander down HH yesterday afternoon. Looks sad with all the closed shops. 

Wentn in the posh butchers. £1.90 for an organic cucumber.

Needs to fucking orgasmic for that price.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 29, 2016)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Wentn in the posh butchers. £1.90 for an organic cucumber.
> 
> Needs to fucking orgasmic for that price.


That's not entirely impossible, I suppose.


----------



## editor (Jun 29, 2016)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Had a wander down HH yesterday afternoon. Looks sad with all the closed shops.
> 
> Wentn in the posh butchers. £1.90 for an organic cucumber.
> 
> Needs to fucking orgasmic for that price.


Has to come with a built in vibrating element for optional extra pleasure at that rip off price. You can get them on the market for 50p.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 29, 2016)

Lidl. 40p.

Now I am on the dole I will walk a long way to save 10p


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jun 29, 2016)

Perusing the fridges one day I found they had the foie gras next to the tofu.  
They did move it after I pointed it out.  Ha.


----------



## leanderman (Jun 29, 2016)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Lidl. 40p.
> 
> Now I am on the dole I will walk a long way to save 10p



And, oddly enough, some Lidls are cheaper than others. For example, Tooting's is cheaper than Brixton's for some items.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jun 29, 2016)

leanderman said:


> And, oddly enough, some Lidls are cheaper than others. For example, Tooting's is cheaper than Brixton's for some items.



I walk to Streatham.....cheapest


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jul 4, 2016)

What is happening with Pullens?


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jul 5, 2016)

Apparently the hairdressers next door are taking it over as a family restaurant.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 5, 2016)

sleaterkinney said:


> What is happening with Pullens?


Is it closed?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 5, 2016)

Closed a fortnight ago. Some builders were in last week.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 5, 2016)

Anyone know what the new art thing is on top of Olley's?


----------



## grosun (Jul 5, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Anyone know what the new art thing is on top of Olley's?


aha.. Shout (sculpt) it from the rooftop! - Brixton Blog



> *Commuters along one of South London’s busiest rail links have a new piece of public art to contemplate thanks to children from Christ Church Primary School SW9, who are drawing attention to the effects of climate change.*


----------



## Rushy (Jul 6, 2016)

Wow. The area of park fenced off for Sunfall is HUGE!


----------



## Fingers (Jul 6, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Is it closed?



Closed for an unspecified time for a refurb. It has been taken over by either the people who run the hairdressers or the people who own the book shop but can't remember which.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 6, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Wow. The area of park fenced off for Sunfall is HUGE!


Ah that's what that is. I walked in the park yesterday thinking 'not zippos again!'.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 6, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Wow. The area of park fenced off for Sunfall is HUGE!



Massive isn't it? Didn't expect the fences to encompass such a large space. Still, they sent me an offer of £30 'locals' tickets again. Pfft.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 12, 2016)

We're nearly there!  Lambeth Country Show time.

Haven't been around the park recently - I do hope all these expensive festivals haven't trashed it.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 15, 2016)

So how is the park looking? anyone seen the setting up - is it the usual layout for the LCS again?

who is going? any urbz meet-ups happening?


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 15, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> So how is the park looking? anyone seen the setting up - is it the usual layout for the LCS again?
> 
> who is going? any urbz meet-ups happening?



I was in the park from 9:30-5pm today (for work and a bit of play) and it looks more or less the same as always.  I am assuming that the meet up area will be the same as always - which is kind of on the other side of the foodhall tent from the village green.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 15, 2016)

I'm planning on going early to grab freebies, bargains and as many lambeth biros as I can lay my hands on. Then stock up on chucklehead before the queues and pop home with the spoils, then going back later to enjoy myself.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jul 16, 2016)

Warning, do not look at the vets by HH Station after Chucklehead.  It's now painted pillar box red. 
Are they trying to piss someone off?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 18, 2016)

disappointedly small haul of freebies at the LCS this year. 4 bottles of lucazade, 4 protein bars, some sunscreen, only 3 pens.

Still it was a glorious weekend, had a lovely time, saw some good friends. Lovely atmosphere.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 18, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> disappointedly small haul of freebies at the LCS this year. 4 bottles of lucazade, 4 protein bars, some sunscreen, only 3 pens.
> 
> Still it was a glorious weekend, had a lovely time, saw some good friends. Lovely atmosphere.


Do you have a thing for free pens Dorothy?


----------



## T & P (Jul 18, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> disappointedly small haul of freebies at the LCS this year. 4 bottles of lucazade, 4 protein bars, some sunscreen, only 3 pens.
> 
> Still it was a glorious weekend, had a lovely time, saw some good friends. Lovely atmosphere.


Ms T & P got me a couple of cycling reflecting stickers. And we all got some free Lipton iced tea.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 18, 2016)

I got a yellow sticker. Something to do with bees. It must have fallen off.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 18, 2016)

I think I'm the only person not to get any iced tea

Protein bars and pens all good 

I don't think I saw than 5 minutes of the stage, was too busy with the animals, kids stuff and having picnics.  Still great fun, is great that it's got something for everyone whatever age they are


----------



## uk benzo (Jul 18, 2016)

I won 2 mains in Saray from the PSC lucky dip! Boooooooya!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 20, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Do you have a thing for free pens Dorothy?


 yes I do, whats not to like in a free pen? you can never have to many. Also I'm one of those rare people who doesn't like stealing them.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jul 21, 2016)

A regular supply of biros, notepads and post it notes are the only things that I miss from office life.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 21, 2016)




----------



## editor (Jul 26, 2016)

If you like your whiskey/whisky:








Dee Dee’s bar in Herne Hill serves up a mouthwatering selection of spirits


----------



## Rushy (Jul 26, 2016)

Sounds like a bit of a retro vibe:



> Every Wednesday from now on is ladies night where we will do special offers on almost every drink we have in the building subject to conditions of course but whose complaining when there is a bar full of beautiful ladies in the building not us at Dee Dee’s,
> 
> And to all the guys out there who are thinking they won’t be welcome at Dee Dee’s on ladies night have nothing to worry about men are welcome too in fact it’s the best time to come down and impress a new friend in a great environment.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 26, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Sounds like a bit of a retro vibe:


Grammar nazi on the prowl...


----------



## editor (Jul 26, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Grammar nazi on the prowl...


It's a shame they use such tacky advertising because when I popped in they were lovely people.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 26, 2016)

Maharani said:


> Grammar nazi on the prowl...


You think that I was commenting on the grammar?


----------



## Maharani (Jul 26, 2016)

Rushy said:


> You think that I was commenting on the grammar?


No, I was.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 26, 2016)

Maharani said:


> No, I was.


Oh!


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

Pizza Pellone has now become a chain (by U75 definition), having opened up a new place in Kent House last week and previously Croydon.


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Pizza Pellone has now become a chain (by U75 definition), having opened up a new place in Kent House last week and previously Croydon.


Where was this judgement of three stores = chain decreed, and by whom?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

Refurbed Plan B / Phonox


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Refurbed Plan B / Phonox


That comment was in the context of the Blues Kitchen being part of the ‘bar and restaurant collective,’ The Columbo Group, who operate many venues across London. The notion that my personal opinion represents some sort of u75 group-thought consensus really is remarkably childish.



> It’s a chain of three (Camden and Shoreditch) but given the interest is likely to expand.
> The Blues Kitchen Brixton


----------



## Rushy (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Pizza Pellone has now become a chain (by U75 definition), having opened up a new place in Kent House last week and previously Croydon.


I think you might be confusing urban with Brixton Buzz. As I recall, Barrio was described as a chain in a Buzz article when it was three outlets and looking for a site in Brixton. When it eventually opened here the owners objected to it being described as a chain and suggested it was a "family" but Buzz disagreed on the basis that there are four restaurants with the same name and similar theme and could not think what else it could possibly be described as. Buzz collectively concluded that the family description was nonsense.

I'm not sure I'd strictly agree with Buzz' criteria but reckon it is fair to say three is at least the beginnings of a chain. I guess it doesn't really matter what you call it. The more sites you add, the more distance there is between the personalities who moulded the first one and the business itself.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

Probably true - the original owners / staff are currently working at opening the new place, but the friendly Polish woman is acting up in their place now as FoH and the chefs are the same. They said that the Kent House venue was much busier in the day times as they're catering for more office workers than HH has. 

Was still packed last night, and we got a massive meal for 3 for £20.


----------



## Crispy (Jul 29, 2016)

I wish they delivered. I presume they refuse to do delivery because that style of pizza has to be eaten pretty much straight from the oven.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

I guess so, i had a takeaway, as I live nearby and can get it plated before the Fior de Latte dribbles off the pizza, but they took the order and cooked it in ten minutes.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 29, 2016)

Crispy said:


> I wish they delivered. I presume they refuse to do delivery because that style of pizza has to be eaten pretty much straight from the oven.


I'm two minutes walk away and it never tastes nearly as good at home.

ETA I guess the 50m between me and Snow makes a difference!


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Probably true - the original owners / staff are currently working at opening the new place, but the friendly Polish woman is acting up in their place now as FoH and the chefs are the same. They said that the Kent House venue was much busier in the day times as they're catering for more office workers than HH has.
> 
> Was still packed last night, and we got a massive meal for 3 for £20.


For me, its also very much about the style and ambition of the company. If they're a well backed (guffaw) 'collective' stuffing tons of cash into large, expensively kitted out new sites which all share the same distinctive branding/music policy/food/style, then I'd say they've set themselves up as a chain venture. 

A small pizza place expanding into fairly humble new premises feels quite different to me.


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

Crispy said:


> I wish they delivered. I presume they refuse to do delivery because that style of pizza has to be eaten pretty much straight from the oven.


Their pizzas really are excellent. I've been there quite a few times recently.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

The same could be said of Franco Manca?


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> The same could be said of Franco Manca?


What?!

They're a 34-restaurant multi-million chain pound with aggressive expansion plans, owned by a restaurant investment company who bought them up for £27.5million.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

But started as a small business which opened up another shop, then another etc.. They feel pretty similar to me from the origins of FM.


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> But started as a small business which opened up another shop, then another etc.. They feel pretty similar to me from the origins of FM.


The FM owner was always very canny and with a sharp eye for opportunities and profit. Not so many small restaurant owners are as ambitious as him. His background isn't quite so humble either: in 2002 he bought up a Soho townhouse and turned it into an exclusive private members' club.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

He did Blacks with Tom Bantock in the 90s - half of the world of herne hill catering staff have worked there at one point or another.


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> He did Blacks with Tom Bantock in the 90s - half of the world of herne hill catering staff have worked there at one point or another.


Yeah you're right: that article has got its dates wrong. I never knew he had upmarket West End connections until today.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 29, 2016)

I don't think that street was really upmarket in the 90s, half of those houses were sex trade related.


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> I don't think that street was really upmarket in the 90s, half of those houses were sex trade related.


Still way, way out of the reach of most people.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Aug 8, 2016)

Spotted this morning.  We'll have to rename the shop Cape Fear.


----------



## bimble (Aug 8, 2016)

editor said:


> Yeah you're right: that article has got its dates wrong. I never knew he had upmarket West End connections until today.


He's a long time resident of Brixton, like since the mid eighties. A very canny businessman for sure. I heard gossip today that he (Mr Franco Manca) is trying to buy back Blacks club having sold it for an undisclosed amount a few years ago when he got into a bit of bother. Nice enough man though, last time I saw him he was quietly queueng up outside his own restaurant in the villaage.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 10, 2016)

Well this went well:

Exclusive: 1,000 seater open air theatre planned for Brockwell Park with local resident lobbying Lambeth Council


----------



## technical (Aug 10, 2016)

That's got to be a complete no-no. Not only is it metropolitan open land, its also a conservation area and a registered park & garden (Grade II). The park also includes several listed buildings - the hall is Grade II*. 

If someone is spending money on this project before investigating the planning constraints they're mad IMO.


----------



## BoxRoom (Aug 10, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Well this went well:
> 
> Exclusive: 1,000 seater open air theatre planned for Brockwell Park with local resident lobbying Lambeth Council


"As long as it’s not for more raves for posh 20 somethings from Shoreditch" says Katie Stephens, totally getting the point about what a theatre is about.


----------



## teuchter (Aug 10, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Well this went well:
> 
> Exclusive: 1,000 seater open air theatre planned for Brockwell Park with local resident lobbying Lambeth Council


The comments section certainly shows how a balanced and well researched article can spur the local community into constructive dialogue bridging class and other divides to bring vision into reality.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 18, 2016)

Some bloke was tasered on Norwood Road last night (allegedly carrying a gun in his car).


----------



## urbanspaceman (Aug 18, 2016)

snowy_again said:


> Some bloke was tasered on Norwood Road last night (allegedly carrying a gun in his car).


Probably this: Four charged following Trident operation
_"Four people have been charged with firearms offences following an intelligence-led operation by officers from the Trident and Area Crime Command."_


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Aug 22, 2016)

Double rainbow for early risers.


----------



## gaijingirl (Aug 22, 2016)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Double rainbow for early risers.



I saw this over my garden - it was beautiful.  Then I fell back asleep.  Wish I'd taken a photo.


----------



## Greebo (Aug 22, 2016)

gaijingirl said:


> I saw this over my garden - it was beautiful.  Then I fell back asleep.  Wish I'd taken a photo.


I didn't see this one, but IMHO part of the magic is not always being able to get a photo when you see a rainbow - double or otherwise.


----------



## Greebo (Aug 22, 2016)

dp


----------



## gaijingirl (Aug 22, 2016)

Greebo said:


> I didn't see this one, but IMHO part of the magic is not always being able to get a photo when you see a rainbow - double or otherwise.



Yes - I suppose that's true.  A touch of the "mono no aware".


----------



## Fingers (Sep 16, 2016)




----------



## friendofdorothy (Sep 16, 2016)

Fingers said:


> View attachment 92629


ooo! about time they did something. I wish they would get a move on.

Some one was asking me what was happening with the Moon the other day, they also asked - is the boxing gym upstairs still open?  and I had no idea.


----------



## BoxRoom (Sep 17, 2016)

Best Kebab has finally gone but it has moved around the corner to Dulwich Road at least.


----------



## uk benzo (Sep 17, 2016)

I <3 best kebab


----------



## Smick (Sep 18, 2016)

uk benzo said:


> I <3 best kebab


I like that their kebab meat is cooked through those basalt rocks which you get on a gas barbecue.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Sep 21, 2016)

that kebab place is decent, however i have always found they were mighty tight with the donor meat. i.e a small donor really did mean small, when it should still be an absolute mouthful for a fiver.

also rather unluckily almost every time i walked past and fancied one, the donor spit would be right down to the dregs, and rather unappetising


----------



## teuchter (Sep 22, 2016)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> the donor meat


----------



## Rushy (Oct 28, 2016)

Popped into The Commercial to meet a fellow Urb tonight and they are serving pints of Keyboard Warrior. Hard to resist...


----------



## brixtonblade (Oct 28, 2016)

Rushy said:


> Popped into The Commercial to meet a fellow Urb tonight and they are serving pints of Keyboard Warrior. Hard to resist...


It seemed to be about all they were serving - loads of the pumps were off!


----------



## Rushy (Oct 28, 2016)

brixtonblade said:


> It seemed to be about all they were serving - loads of the pumps were off!


Even that was off for a while. So I opted for the pleasingly named Wheaty McWheatface.


----------



## Tropi (Oct 31, 2016)

Bad Halloween in Herne Hill.
There's a group of unsupervised and quite young kids running around, at the top of the hill near Petermans, being agressive and obnoxious to people. Be aware.


----------



## editor (Dec 1, 2016)

Cracking night last night in Off The Cuff. Half of the Albert and the old Queen's Head seemed to be there. 

















In photos: Gypsy Wednesday jam session at Off The Cuff, Herne Hill


----------



## teuchter (Dec 7, 2016)

For those following the Carnegie Library plans... there is a planning application in at the moment, to add a gym to the basement including various external extensions. Comments/objections need to be made by next Monday, 12th December. I have put a summary of the proposals on the Carnegie thread here:

Save Lambeth Libraries  and the Carnegie Library occupation


----------



## brixtonblade (Dec 8, 2016)

My son's nursery in Herne Hill just sent me this and thought I would post it here 


A parent has alerted us of incident that occurredyesterday afternoon in the vicinity of WoodwardeRoad.



This is the abstract forward to us.



A nanny was walking to pick up at Dulwich Village Infant School with a baby in a buggy and 3 year old on a bike.  The 3 year old cycled a bit ahead, a man in a green Vauxhall got out and tried to grab the child.  The nanny shouted him off and he took off in the car.  The police were informed by the parents when they returned home. The police have stressed that they should have been informed immediately to get cars out in the area.


----------



## Harbourite (Dec 8, 2016)

brixtonblade said:


> My son's nursery in Herne Hill just sent me this and thought I would post it here
> A parent has alerted us of incident that occurredyesterday afternoon in the vicinity of WoodwardeRoad.
> .



thanks brixtonblade


----------



## Smick (Dec 9, 2016)

brixtonblade said:


> My son's nursery in Herne Hill just sent me this and thought I would post it here
> 
> 
> A parent has alerted us of incident that occurredyesterday afternoon in the vicinity of WoodwardeRoad.
> ...


No intention to disrespect your nursery, but are these things ever true where the only source is a well-meaning nursery?

I've heard loads of these stories, both here and in Belfast. The only time I was aware of one being true locally, there were a load of cops in Tulse Hill of a morning, stopping people to ask had they seen it happen the same time the previous day, and handing out flyers.

I've also heard news appeals on BBC London about attempted abductions. Maybe even national news too.

So on the rare times it does happen, a load of resources are thrown at it rather than leaving it to a nursery.

The rest of the time, I think that there are urban myths caused by people with nothing better to do, leading to mass hysteria and people afraid to say hello to a child for fear of being locked up or burnt out.

It is a good idea to keep a close eye on kids though.


----------



## little_legs (Jan 8, 2017)

Best Kebab is gone?


----------



## Ms T (Jan 8, 2017)

little_legs said:


> Best Kebab is gone?



From its new premises (it moved a few months ago to Dulwich Road)?


----------



## little_legs (Jan 8, 2017)

Ms T said:


> From its new premises (it moved a few months ago to Dulwich Road)?



Oh, right, thank you. 

I meant have they gone from the Railton Rd bit. 

I am glad they are still around


----------



## Maharani (Jan 24, 2017)

So looks like work on the old strip where the veg, fishmongers, butchers etc has commenced. Do we know what's going in there?


----------



## GarveyLives (Jan 26, 2017)

*National newspaper report, 9 January 2017:*

_"Property prices in south and east London have boomed since the last downturn, growing faster than anywhere else in the capital. _

_*Herne Hill*, a neighbourhood in south London near Brixton, which is known for its large park and lido, has had the highest growth in the country since the peak ..."_

Mapped: Which London neighbourhoods have seen the biggest house price rises since the crash?  (click for more)

*Herne Hill, 25 May 2015:*





Source:  www.brixtonbuzz.com​
*... we get the message.*​


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2017)

Maharani said:


> So looks like work on the old strip where the veg, fishmongers, butchers etc has commenced. Do we know what's going in there?


So no one has any info?


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2017)

GarveyLives said:


> *National newspaper report, 9 January 2017:*
> 
> _"Property prices in south and east London have boomed since the last downturn, growing faster than anywhere else in the capital. _
> 
> ...


Post reported.


----------



## Ms T (Jan 26, 2017)

Maharani said:


> So no one has any info?


I know the butcher is gone for good and the veg shop is staying where it is now. I think the bakery might be going back to it's old spot. I doubt they even know yet as the work will take the best part of a year iirc.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jan 26, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Post reported.



why did you report it ?


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2017)

cuppa tee said:


> why did you report it ?


Cos GarveyLives has posted this photo several times with no relevant connection to anything happening ATM. I don't like seeing that word being posted over and over. He's been reported before for doing this.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jan 26, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Cos GarveyLives has posted this photo several times with no relevant connection to anything happening ATM. I don't like seeing that word being posted over and over. He's been reported before for doing this.


thanks for replying, I wasn't aware the photo had been posted before by Garvey Lives


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2017)

I want to plug The Parlour on Norwood Road, it's quite hidden away as the signage is subtle and it's a small place. 

I went in last week to ask if they would be able to make sugar free cake as I was organising a meet up for younger women with breast cancer. The lady that runs the place wasn't there but her employee called her and I spoke to her on the phone. She was more than happy to provide us with some goodies. 

Went in today and met the owner. What a fantastic woman. She baked 4 different types of sugar free cakes and didn't say a thing when I mentioned that none of the BC ladies could make it. I sat and had a coffee with her and we talked about her business. She's relatively new to running it but is a local lady. She works with lots of other local businesses and really gives a shit about the area. 

She is open in the evenings and will be hosting supper club type events where local people and businesses can come and use her space and sell their wares. I found her to be genuine, caring and very down to earth with a real desire to give back to her local community; I.e. She wasn't just profit driven. 

Coupled with all of that, her food is really nice and you can go health freaky or not and the space is relaxing. 

She said she's struggling with how to market the place so I said I'd post something on here. Please pay them a visit. She has a booze license too and sells Canopy Beer.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2017)

Do you think you can do an article editor? I'm pretty sure the owner would be happy to see one.


----------



## editor (Jan 26, 2017)

Maharani said:


> I want to plug The Parlour on Norwood Road, it's quite hidden away as the signage is subtle and it's a small place.
> 
> I went in last week to ask if they would be able to make sugar free cake as I was organising a meet up for younger women with breast cancer. The lady that runs the place wasn't there but her employee called her and I spoke to her on the phone. She was more than happy to provide us with some goodies.
> 
> ...


If you can take some snaps and expand what you've posted into more of a review, I'd be happy to run it on Buzz.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2017)

editor said:


> If you can take some snaps and expand what you've posted into more of a review, I'd be happy to run it on Buzz.


Ok. I'll do that.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 26, 2017)

Seconded. She's lovely. I don't tend to go there but have met her a few times whilst out walking the dog. Although I'm not sure hers is really a dog. More of a wolf.

Make sure to mention that her gaff is dog and wolf friendly...


----------



## BoxRoom (Jan 26, 2017)

Maharani said:


> I want to plug The Parlour on Norwood Road, it's quite hidden away as the signage is subtle and it's a small place.
> 
> I went in last week to ask if they would be able to make sugar free cake as I was organising a meet up for younger women with breast cancer. The lady that runs the place wasn't there but her employee called her and I spoke to her on the phone. She was more than happy to provide us with some goodies.
> 
> ...



Great location that, I'll pop in hopefully at the weekend. Thanks for the heads up.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 26, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Seconded. She's lovely. I don't tend to go there but have met her a few times whilst out walking the dog. Although I'm not sure hers is really a dog. More of a wolf.
> 
> Make sure to mention that her gaff is dog and wolf friendly...


Her wolf is beautiful but nippy.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 28, 2017)

GarveyLives said:


> *National newspaper report, 9 January 2017:*
> 
> _"Property prices in south and east London have boomed since the last downturn, growing faster than anywhere else in the capital. _
> 
> ...


 Please stop re posting that offensive picture!


----------



## editor (Feb 1, 2017)

Review up! The Parlour on Norwood Road – a great new coffee shop for Herne Hill, south London


----------



## Maharani (Feb 1, 2017)

I'm a published critic!


----------



## editor (Feb 15, 2017)

So there's 4 units coming up for tender to the open market at Herne Hill station. 

Unit 1 Premises at the front of the station 37m2
Unit 2 Site to install a kiosk in the booking hall 10m2
Unit 3 Premises situated in an arch in the booking hall 77m2
Unit 4 Premises on Platforms 1 & 2 37m2


----------



## Rushy (Feb 15, 2017)

Not sure about those new tiles on The Commercial. Hope white is just an undercoat too.


----------



## T & P (Feb 15, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Not sure about those new tiles on The Commercial. Hope white is just an undercoat too.


Has it reopened already?


----------



## Rushy (Feb 15, 2017)

T & P said:


> Has it reopened already?


No. But they were tiling the fascia? above the windows yesterday.

And the white is on the outside.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Feb 15, 2017)

editor said:


> So there's 4 units coming up for tender to the open market at Herne Hill station.
> 
> Unit 1 Premises at the front of the station 37m2
> Unit 2 Site to install a kiosk in the booking hall 10m2
> ...


It does get a bit of footfall but that's a bit optimistic...


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 16, 2017)

The existing units surely? Newsagent & 3 coffee / food kiosks, with some expansion of one as they knock through the arch?


----------



## Rushy (Feb 16, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> The existing units surely? Newsagent & 3 coffee / food kiosks, with some expansion of one as they knock through the arch?


Yes.That's how I understand it. They're being refurbished.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 20, 2017)

Half moon supposedly opening next month.

Half Moon pub to re-open on march 20 - Southwark News


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 20, 2017)

And the Commercial reopens around the same time.


----------



## Rushy (Feb 20, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> And the Commercial reopens around the same time.


Really not convinced by the busy tiles in front of the name. Or the postage stamp sized hanging sign. Looking forward to seeing what they've done inside though.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 20, 2017)

teuchter said:


> Half moon supposedly opening next month.
> 
> Half Moon pub to re-open on march 20 - Southwark News


Notes date on my calendar.

edit to add - it's about bloody time!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 23, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> And the Commercial reopens around the same time.


I hear the Commercial was open last night for a private do and should re-open today.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 23, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Really not convinced by the busy tiles in front of the name. Or the postage stamp sized hanging sign. Looking forward to seeing what they've done inside though.


Hate the white tiles outside. And the patterned tiles behind the pale lettering just makes the name illegible. I spoke to a couple of regulars who had been there last night and they didn't sound massively impressed with the new interior, they said nothing much had changed, 'just a paint job'.


----------



## T & P (Feb 23, 2017)

I hope the bogs have been done up. Can't speak for the state of the ladies' powder room, but the men's toilets were a bit rank.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 23, 2017)

T & P said:


> I hope the bogs have been done up. Can't speak for the state of the ladies' powder room, but the men's toilets were a bit rank.


Anyone in that side of the pub could smell that the gents was rank. The mix of amonia and airfreshner was not good. 

The womens bogs generally lacked more than one of the following - light bulbs, soap, paper, door locks, toilet seats and offen with puddles of water on the floor, and yes they smelled rank too.  'Ladies powder room' I wish!


----------



## wurlycurly (Feb 23, 2017)

friendofdorothy said:


> Hate the white tiles outside. And the patterned tiles behind the pale lettering just makes the name illegible. I spoke to a couple of regulars who had been there last night and they didn't sound massively impressed with the new interior, they said nothing much had changed, 'just a paint job'.



Indeed. The pale lettering/tiles combo must be one of the worst examples of design I've ever seen. It's headache-inducing, like an optical illusion.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Feb 23, 2017)

Made my eyes go funny....hadn't even had a drink!


----------



## Rushy (Feb 23, 2017)

It stands out quite well for a few minutes when the Sun reflecting off the builders merchant's window opposite hits it at a particular angle at about 10am.


----------



## discobastard (Feb 23, 2017)

Rushy said:


> It stands out quite well for a few minutes when the Sun reflecting off the builders merchant's window opposite hits it at a particular angle at about 10am.


Anybody got a picture of this apparent design monstrosity? I'm intrigued...


----------



## T & P (Feb 23, 2017)

Rushy said:


> It stands out quite well for a few minutes when the Sun reflecting off the builders merchant's window opposite hits it at a particular angle at about 10am.


10 am is a bit early to be at the boozer mate


----------



## Rushy (Feb 23, 2017)

T & P said:


> 10 am is a bit early to be at the boozer mate


Perfectly acceptable on a Friday.


----------



## brixtonblade (Feb 23, 2017)

Opening night...  Big fight, some guy headbutted a barman, cops in wagons outside
More importantly, tiles look shit


----------



## T & P (Feb 23, 2017)

brixtonblade said:


> Opening night...  Big fight, some guy headbutted a barman, cops in wagons outside
> More importantly, tiles look shit


Wow. Old regulars expressing their views on the refurb?


----------



## Rushy (Feb 23, 2017)

Gentrification gone mad, I tells ya.


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 23, 2017)

Did someone really walk off with that long ladder?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Feb 24, 2017)

brixtonblade said:


> Opening night...  Big fight, some guy headbutted a barman, cops in wagons outside
> More importantly, tiles look shit



First time I ever set eyes on the Commercial (over 20 years ago), I stepped out of HH station and looked across the road at the pub just a geezer came flying through the window...as a result of a pub brawl.


----------



## editor (Feb 24, 2017)

Here's how those hoardings looked yesterday. 

 

I hope that attractive Victorian shop window (left)  survives.


----------



## Rushy (Feb 24, 2017)

Here it is with a little of today's lovely sunshine helping it stand out!



Inside is ok - better for having removed the big built in seats. More space. Not sure about it being painted white to the rear bar seating area - it's a bit bright. Not a huge change overall.

Sorry. I didn't inspect the bogs.


----------



## discobastard (Feb 25, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Here it is with a little of today's lovely sunshine helping it stand out!
> 
> View attachment 101091
> 
> ...


Looks a bit like a Walls Viennetta.  

(A bit)


----------



## wurlycurly (Feb 25, 2017)

discobastard said:


> Looks a bit like a Walls Viennetta.
> 
> (A bit)



Ha! Spot-on.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 26, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Did someone really walk off with that long ladder?


 what ladder?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 26, 2017)

Nanker Phelge said:


> First time I ever set eyes on the Commercial (over 20 years ago), I stepped out of HH station and looked across the road at the pub just a geezer came flying through the window...as a result of a pub brawl.


welcome to Herne Hill.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 26, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Here it is with a little of today's lovely sunshine helping it stand out!
> 
> View attachment 101091
> 
> ...


show us a pic without the sunshine - thats how we'll normally see it. Does the lighting at night help it stand out?


----------



## Ms T (Feb 28, 2017)

Herne Hill is to get a Costa Coffee and a Greggs in the refurbished arches, apparently. Which is crap news for the bakery and independent coffee shops. I will be voting with my wallet and staying away. Doesn't bode well for Brixton, either.


----------



## editor (Feb 28, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Herne Hill is to get a Costa Coffee and a Greggs in the refurbished arches, apparently. Which is crap news for the bakery and independent coffee shops. I will be voting with my wallet and staying away. Doesn't bode well for Brixton, either.


  That's a real shame but comes as no surprise. I expect Brixton's arches to be filled with similar and some 'independents' aimed at the well heeled market.


----------



## brixtonblade (Feb 28, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Herne Hill is to get a Costa Coffee and a Greggs in the refurbished arches, apparently. Which is crap news for the bakery and independent coffee shops. I will be voting with my wallet and staying away. Doesn't bode well for Brixton, either.


How annoying


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Feb 28, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Herne Hill is to get a Costa Coffee and a Greggs in the refurbished arches, apparently. Which is crap news for the bakery and independent coffee shops. I will be voting with my wallet and staying away. Doesn't bode well for Brixton, either.


A Greggs. There will be outraged people.  Property prices will plummet.  Oh dear oh dear.


----------



## BoxRoom (Feb 28, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Herne Hill is to get a Costa Coffee and a Greggs in the refurbished arches, apparently. Which is crap news for the bakery and independent coffee shops. I will be voting with my wallet and staying away. Doesn't bode well for Brixton, either.


Bleh. Not great.


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 28, 2017)

Can't see the burghers of HH going to Costa for a crap coffee and toastie, when there's about 5 other indie coffee shops catering for commuters, mums and other people.


----------



## editor (Feb 28, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Can't see the burghers of HH going to Costa for a crap coffee and toastie, when there's about 5 other indie coffee shops catering for commuters, mums and other people.


Sadly, I think you'll be proved wrong on that.


----------



## Winot (Feb 28, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Can't see the burghers of HH going to Costa for a crap coffee and toastie, when there's about 5 other indie coffee shops catering for commuters, *mums* and other people.



Parents 

Or were you lumping in Rushy with "other people"?


----------



## Rushy (Feb 28, 2017)

Winot said:


> Parents
> 
> Or were you lumping in Rushy with "other people"?


I'm still just about hanging in there as "other people".


----------



## Rushy (Feb 28, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Herne Hill is to get a Costa Coffee and a Greggs in the refurbished arches, apparently. Which is crap news for the bakery and independent coffee shops. I will be voting with my wallet and staying away. Doesn't bode well for Brixton, either.


Wow. That's a real disappointment if true. Where did you hear it?


----------



## boohoo (Feb 28, 2017)

Costa gets everywhere. There is even one in Thornton heath.


----------



## Rushy (Feb 28, 2017)

I guess Costa may benefit from having an outside space which gets sunshine. At the moment only Sesame gets that and their coffee is not great.


----------



## boohoo (Feb 28, 2017)

We have a greggs in South Norwood. Herne Hill is clearly going down hill


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Feb 28, 2017)

boohoo said:


> We have a greggs in South Norwood. Herne Hill is clearly going down hill


I can just imagine the talk at the Sunday market and in the queue at Dugards (I love Dugards).
I think Costa will have stiff competition though as they do the worst flat white.


----------



## Ms T (Feb 28, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Wow. That's a real disappointment if true. Where did you hear it?


Elaine and Mustafa.


----------



## Maharani (Mar 1, 2017)

brixtonblade said:


> Opening night...  Big fight, some guy headbutted a barman, cops in wagons outside
> More importantly, tiles look shit


Crikey


----------



## choochi (Mar 1, 2017)

This is what NR has said just recently. So if it's true it's about as much of a lie as is possible.

"The majority of our former tenants have relocated or have an opportunity to return to a refurbished unit and we will be discussing this with each of them in due course. Although we have received some expressions of interest in refurbished units, we are not in discussions with any other potential tenants.

We will not be seeking to let to national chains in Herne Hill and highlighted this commitment at a public meeting organised by the Herne Hill Forum. Out of our 4000 arches and units in London, fewer than 20 are directly let to national chains."


----------



## Rushy (Mar 1, 2017)

choochi said:


> This is what NR has said just recently. So if it's true it's about as much of a lie as is possible.
> 
> "The majority of our former tenants have relocated or have an opportunity to return to a refurbished unit and we will be discussing this with each of them in due course. Although we have received some expressions of interest in refurbished units, we are not in discussions with any other potential tenants.
> 
> We will not be seeking to let to national chains in Herne Hill and highlighted this commitment at a public meeting organised by the Herne Hill Forum. Out of our 4000 arches and units in London, fewer than 20 are directly let to national chains."


Thanks for that.  I was sure I recalled having read something to that effect. Where was that statement posted?


----------



## choochi (Mar 1, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Thanks for that.  I was sure I recalled having read something to that effect. Where was that statement posted?



Herne Hill Forum
Station Square arches update from Network Rail


----------



## choochi (Mar 1, 2017)

The only thing I can think of is that there might be confusion with the units within Herne Hill station that are being refurbished. I suppose they could be going in there, although I'm sure I read somewhere that Perks and White and going back in once the work is done?


----------



## Rushy (Mar 1, 2017)

choochi said:


> Herne Hill Forum
> Station Square arches update from Network Rail


I'm pretty sure that they made that same commitment quite a lot earlier too, although I wonder whether it was in relation to Brixton. 

Hopefully it is just a rumour!


----------



## Rushy (Mar 1, 2017)

choochi said:


> The only thing I can think of is that there might be confusion with the units within Herne Hill station that are being refurbished. I suppose they could be going in there, although I'm sure I read somewhere that Perks and White and going back in once the work is done?


P&W have something like a first refusal,  one of their guys mentioned. Although they thought it would be too expensive. I quite like their current set up in Off the Cuff!


----------



## Maharani (Mar 1, 2017)

Anyone notice that pizza Pelone has had a name change?


----------



## Ms T (Mar 1, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Anyone notice that pizza Pelone has had a name change?


A while back. They're a small chain now and wanted all their restaurants to have the same name. Presumably they though 500 Degrees was more catchy and modern.


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2017)

Photos from last night's jam session at Off The Cuff. It's a great night but paying £5 for a pint still grates.






















Loads of energy and good vibes at the Gypsy Tuesday jam session at Off The Cuff, Herne Hill


----------



## SpamMisery (Mar 1, 2017)

Rushy said:


> I'm pretty sure that they made that same commitment quite a lot earlier too, although I wonder whether it was in relation to Brixton.
> 
> Hopefully it is just a rumour!



I think they made a similar statement in relation to the Brixton arches, but I think it draws on their general lines to take with regard to letting to national chains.


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2017)

SpamMisery said:


> I think they made a similar statement in relation to the Brixton arches, but I think it draws on their general lines to take with regard to letting to national chains.


They a really slippery statement saying that they could "categorically confirm that no multi-national will be in the vacant units.”

So massive UK based chains are OK then.
Brixton Arches campaigners crushed after lively Lambeth Planning meeting votes in favour of redevelopment


----------



## teuchter (Mar 1, 2017)

Has anyone bothered to check if there's actually anything behind the costa/greggs rumour?


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 1, 2017)

Elaine is normally about 99% right.


----------



## madolesance (Mar 1, 2017)

editor said:


> Photos from last night's jam session at Off The Cuff. It's a great night but paying £5 for a pint still grates.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Looks like Herne Hill now has a great music venue that can truly replace the 'Half Moon'. Probably time to move on from the conversation about the 'Half Moon' becoming a music venue again.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 1, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Elaine is normally about 99% right.


Who is Elaine?


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2017)

madolesance said:


> Looks like Herne Hill now has a great music venue that can truly replace the 'Half Moon'. Probably time to move on from the conversation about the 'Half Moon' becoming a music venue again.


It's great to have a new venue, but it doesn't come close to replacing the Half Moon. It's far more pricey than a pub venue for starters, is a smaller capacity and closes at midnight. I see no reason why the existence of Off The Cuff should have negated any calls for the Half Moon to remain a live venue, to be honest


----------



## Rushy (Mar 1, 2017)

teuchter said:


> Who is Elaine?


Flower shop.


----------



## editor (Mar 6, 2017)

A very small snippet of news: 


> *Herne Hill ticket office to close Wednesday 22 March - Friday 24 March*
> 
> 
> Southeastern passengers travelling from Herne Hill will not be able to use the station's ticket office for three working days in March while works are completed as part of the £1.5m National Station Improvement Programme upgrade.
> ...


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 7, 2017)

editor said:


> Here's how those hoardings looked yesterday.
> 
> 
> 
> I hope that attractive Victorian shop window (left)  survives.



You might be surprised by the changes today!


----------



## editor (Mar 7, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> You might be surprised by the changes today!


I went past last night - what did I miss?


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 8, 2017)

Half Moon interior photos (the bar):


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 11, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Half Moon interior photos (the bar):



where's the pic on the top right taken? is that upstairs?


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 13, 2017)

Lunches for 50 quid then:


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 13, 2017)

Was in Cafe Prov yesterday....food was well bland. How the hell you make a Croque Monsieur almost tasteless is beyond me, and my companion's egg florentine was also really dull, but with an over powering garlic flavour. Even the chips tasted of nothing.


----------



## wurlycurly (Mar 13, 2017)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Was in Cafe Prov yesterday....food was well bland. How the hell you make a Croque Monsieur almost tasteless is beyond me, and my companion's egg florentine was also really dull, but with an over powering garlic flavour. Even the chips tasted of nothing.



Croque Monsieur. Egg (singular) Florentine. It's people like you that are jeopardising the long-overdue arrival of a Herne Hill Gregg's.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Mar 13, 2017)

wurlycurly said:


> Croque Monsieur. Egg (singular) Florentine. It's people like you that are jeopardising the long-overdue arrival of a Herne Hill Gregg's.



I just wanted a bit of cheese on toast


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 15, 2017)

The HH station retail units are up for tender again (as a consequence of the refurb): 

London 

A new bigger space, plus the existing 2 shops & platform kiosk.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 16, 2017)

The xx and the 198 Gallery/Hustlbucks art collaboration thing from last week:


----------



## CH1 (Mar 17, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> The HH station retail units are up for tender again (as a consequence of the refurb):
> 
> London
> 
> A new bigger space, plus the existing 2 shops & platform kiosk.


And the old new platform level ticket office at Loughborough Junction I see.

How will they handle staff easements I wonder? The former platform gents - over the last 23 years the staff private loo - is part of the structure to be rented out. (picture shows what you get - at the top of the stairs after passing through ticket barriers)


----------



## Fingers (Mar 18, 2017)

.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 18, 2017)

Fingers said:


> .


Are you going to the preview at the Moon tonight?


----------



## Lee Japser (Mar 20, 2017)




----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 23, 2017)

Decided to treat myself to a pub lunch at Regent today, only to be foiled by a filming crew and a closed pub. Saw Felix in the Moon, and asked him what was going on. Filming a bet365 advert apparently.

edit to add - 
what were the odds on that happening


----------



## BigMoaner (Mar 23, 2017)

sleaterkinney said:


> Lunches for 50 quid then:



Is this all that's left for high streets now?

How about a non hipster sweet shop, s hardware store, a pet shop, a fishing shop, aanything other than bloody food and coffee!


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 23, 2017)

It was a restaurant before too.


----------



## BigMoaner (Mar 23, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> It was a restaurant before too.


Whatever man, that's just the facts


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 24, 2017)

BigMoaner said:


> Is this all that's left for high streets now?
> 
> How about a non hipster sweet shop, s hardware store, a pet shop, a fishing shop, aanything other than bloody food and coffee!


At least we've still got some small shops in herne hill including a hardware shop and an electrical shop. I dread the day those go. 
That place however was Pullens, previous the Restraunt Provencale selling posh french style food as far back as the 70's I think.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 24, 2017)

Can't believe you didn't mention the wool shop!


----------



## wurlycurly (Mar 24, 2017)

I can't really see the point of local hardware shops. How many times do you use it each year do you reckon? They're obviously good for local DIY obsessives but then again there are B&Qs and Homebases dotted all over the place.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 24, 2017)

Pfft, the one in herne hill is a treasure trove and the people who run it very helpful. Probably use it monthly.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 24, 2017)

wurlycurly said:


> I can't really see the point of local hardware shops. How many times do you use it each year do you reckon? They're obviously good for local DIY obsessives but then again there are B&Qs and Homebases dotted all over the place.


Do you have a car? most of those places are not easy to get to by bus and carrying paint etc on the bus is no fun.

Herne Hill Timber was brilliant, they used to cut wood to size and deliver it. I remember the girlf going there and saying: you remember those little brass thingies I bought here last week, can I have another one? and they knew what she meant. and sold them singly. Wouldn't get that in B&Q. Oh those were the days. With B&Q I always found if you wanted to buy 6 nails you had to buy a pack of 50 and if you wanted 6 shelves they only had 1 in stock.

The hardware shop in Herne Hill is still good though and they sell everything from buckets to moth killer. I reckon I use it at least once a month too.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 24, 2017)

wurlycurly said:


> I can't really see the point of local hardware shops. How many times do you use it each year do you reckon? They're obviously good for local DIY obsessives but then again there are B&Qs and Homebases dotted all over the place.


I'm not a DIY obsessive but cant afford to pay someone each time something breaks or needs painting.


----------



## wurlycurly (Mar 24, 2017)

friendofdorothy said:


> Do you have a car? most of those places are not easy to get to by bus and carrying paint etc on the bus is no fun.
> 
> Herne Hill Timber was brilliant, they used to cut wood to size and deliver it. I remember the girlf going there and saying: you remember those little brass thingies I bought here last week, can I have another one? and they knew what she meant. and sold them singly. Wouldn't get that in B&Q. Oh those were the days. With B&Q I always found if you wanted to buy 6 nails you had to buy a pack of 50 and if you wanted 6 shelves they only had 1 in stock.
> 
> The hardware shop in Herne Hill is still good though and they sell everything from buckets to moth killer. I reckon I use it at least once a month too.



 Maybe I'm the exception given that you and Snowy Again use it monthly but I think I've used it about six times in six years (sink plug, paint roller, radiator key, masking tape etc). I know the guy is uber-friendly and they stock loads of stuff but pretty much any other type of shop would be more useful as far as I'm concerned. (But not a phone shop, or a bookie's, or an overpriced deli)


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 24, 2017)

They have an obsessives collection of Kilner jars! 

I can't be bothered going up to B&Q for the things that I buy there, and I'd rather not give Amazon or other online people the cash.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 24, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Can't believe you didn't mention the wool shop!


No don't mention the wool shop! that place scares me.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Mar 24, 2017)

There's always a small queue in the hardware shop and someone else browsing.  
It's well stocked and really useful. I use it tonnes.


----------



## lordnoise (Apr 12, 2017)

Llewelyns opened yesterday (Tuesday 11th) so went in today to pinch a menu and see what if anything I could afford. Starters £7 - mains £16.50 with veg 3.50 a plate on top - puds 6.50. All prices 'ish'.
Restrained, minimal, cool interior with waiters in long white aprons.
I went round the back to look through the bins ...


----------



## Rushy (Apr 12, 2017)

Deliciously Ella is opening a place called The Kitchen Counter in the arches on Milkwood Road shortly. One for the vegetarians and even vegans, I'm told.


----------



## gaijingirl (Apr 12, 2017)

My mum called me from London (I'm overseas atm) simply to tell me she's boycotting The Commercial who apparently charged her £9.35 for a large glass of chardonnay. Can that be right? She claims she queried it and it's on the price list.


----------



## Winot (Apr 12, 2017)

gaijingirl said:


> My mum called me from London (I'm overseas atm) simply to tell me she's boycotting The Commercial who apparently charged her £9.35 for a large glass of chardonnay. Can that be right? She claims she queried it and it's on the price list.



Could be if it was a 250ml glass. 

How much of a lush is she?


----------



## gaijingirl (Apr 12, 2017)

Winot said:


> Could be if it was a 250ml glass.
> 
> How much of a lush is she?



It was a 250ml.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 13, 2017)

I'm struggling to understand the implications of this (speed reading isn't my strong point):

Public meeting with Southwark Council on the development of Bath Factory Estate - Wednesday 19th April 

"As you may be aware, Southwark Council is at consultation phase over all of the development sites across the borough for the New Southwark Plan. Specifically relevant to Herne Hill residents is the significant piece of land and properties that run between the railway bridge at the bottom of Half Moon Lane and all the way to Rosedale Road, facing onto Brockwell Park as Norwood Road and backing onto the railway line. This area is the Bath Factory Estate and has been highlighted as a development opportunity for further residential as well as commercial properties. You can read more here. The formal deadline for feedback is 28 April."

And the link just takes you to a map:
Herne Hill and North Dulwich              - Southwark London Borough Council Consultation Hub             - Citizen Space

But you need to click the hyperlink within that ^^ to get to the actual text  which seems to be proposing: 

Redevelopment of the site must: • Contribute towards the small business cluster in Herne Hill providing at least the amount of employment floorspace currently on the site; • Provide a new link to Half Moon Lane to improve the permeability and legibility of the site; • Provide high quality active frontages at appropriate ground floor locations, including in the arches of the railway viaduct. Redevelopment of the site may: • Provide new homes on upper storeys facing Brockwell Park.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 13, 2017)

It's basically proposing this whole stretch of one-storey shops can be redeveloped, adding on an extra storey(s) and including housing. Plus redevelopment of the little lane behind, so that it becomes a through route that pops out either end.


----------



## editor (Apr 13, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> I'm struggling to understand the implications of this (speed reading isn't my strong point):
> 
> Public meeting with Southwark Council on the development of Bath Factory Estate - Wednesday 19th April
> 
> ...


Sounds like the usual 'let's boot out the independent businesses and get a wanky developer in for more of the same shit' jargon. I hope this doesn't impact on Crispy 's venture.


----------



## Crispy (Apr 13, 2017)

It almost certainly will. They say they'll maintain the same amount of employment floorspace on the site (2,553 m² in the arches and associated sheds), but it'll go from all B1 (light industrial) to a mix of A1 (retail), A2 (services), A3 (food and drink), A4 (drink), B1, D1 (public services), D2 (entertainment). And you just *know* they'll push any B1 use back between the two railways where the public won't want to go.

It'll take a while to sort out all the various subleases accross the site, and any development will be in the planning/design stages for some time too, but in the medium term I am not hopeful.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Apr 13, 2017)

Wouldn't be nice if they could 'develop' without raising everything to the ground and starting over.


----------



## editor (Apr 13, 2017)

Crispy said:


> It almost certainly will. They say they'll maintain the same amount of employment floorspace on the site (2,553 m² in the arches and associated sheds), but it'll go from all B1 (light industrial) to a mix of A1 (retail), A2 (services), A3 (food and drink), A4 (drink), B1, D1 (public services), D2 (entertainment). And you just *know* they'll push any B1 use back between the two railways where the public won't want to go.
> 
> It'll take a while to sort out all the various subleases accross the site, and any development will be in the planning/design stages for some time too, but in the medium term I am not hopeful.


If there's anything I can do - publicity/promote any petitions you start etc - please drop me a line. I'm fucked off with this endless crushing off independent/alternative businesses and ventures.


----------



## Crispy (Apr 13, 2017)

editor said:


> If there's anything I can do - publicity/promote any petitions you start etc - please drop me a line. I'm fucked off with this endless crushing off independent/alternative businesses and ventures.


Best thing to do is to make comments on the application, saying that light industrial is a crucial part of the local economy and it's becoming increasingly hard to find. The existing B1 use of the estate should be *protected* not watered down.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 13, 2017)

Crispy said:


> It almost certainly will. They say they'll maintain the same amount of employment floorspace on the site (2,553 m² in the arches and associated sheds), but it'll go from all B1 (light industrial) to a mix of A1 (retail), A2 (services), A3 (food and drink), A4 (drink), B1, D1 (public services), D2 (entertainment). And you just *know* they'll push any B1 use back between the two railways where the public won't want to go.
> 
> It'll take a while to sort out all the various subleases accross the site, and any development will be in the planning/design stages for some time too, but in the medium term I am not hopeful.


Is the parade of shops along Norwood Rd part of Network Rail territory or is that in different ownership?


----------



## editor (Apr 13, 2017)

Crispy said:


> Best thing to do is to make comments on the application, saying that light industrial is a crucial part of the local economy and it's becoming increasingly hard to find. The existing B1 use of the estate should be *protected* not watered down.


How about you draft a template letter that addresses all the salient points (so people ca make valid objections) , and I could run that on Buzz when you're ready?


----------



## teuchter (Apr 13, 2017)

Crispy said:


> Best thing to do is to make comments on the application, saying that light industrial is a crucial part of the local economy and it's becoming increasingly hard to find. The existing B1 use of the estate should be *protected* not watered down.


The stuff linked to above is a consultation on planning policy rather than an application for permission for development, right? But definitely worth pushing for something like you say to be written into policy before any applications are made.

What happened on the Higgs estate was that they allowed classification as "B1 or B2" (B2 being office space) so they could say that they weren't removing B1 space, even though they were in reality because you could see that what was designed with B2 rather than B1 in mind.

Adding housing along Norwood Rd will provide a motivation for landlords to decrease B1 use because of associated noise, mess etc. Something also worth mentioning in any response to the consultation.


----------



## Crispy (Apr 13, 2017)

teuchter said:


> The stuff linked to above is a consultation on planning policy rather than an application for permission for development, right?


Correct


> But definitely worth pushing for something like you say to be written into policy before any applications are made.


Absolutely. Much easier to get this sort of protection in now before any heavyweight developers are throwing their weight around.


> Adding housing along Norwood Rd will provide a motivation for landlords to decrease B1 use because of associated noise, mess etc. Something also worth mentioning in any response to the consultation.


Yes indeed


----------



## Crispy (Apr 13, 2017)

editor said:


> How about you draft a template letter that addresses all the salient points (so people ca make valid objections) , and I could run that on Buzz when you're ready?


We'll see what they've got to say at this consultation meeting first I think.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 13, 2017)

Crispy said:


> It almost certainly will. They say they'll maintain the same amount of employment floorspace on the site (2,553 m² in the arches and associated sheds), but it'll go from all B1 (light industrial) to a mix of A1 (retail), A2 (services), A3 (food and drink), A4 (drink), B1, D1 (public services), D2 (entertainment). And you just *know* they'll push any B1 use back between the two railways where the public won't want to go.
> 
> It'll take a while to sort out all the various subleases accross the site, and any development will be in the planning/design stages for some time too, but in the medium term I am not hopeful.


 oh shit. I think that its quite recently that those shops are finally all let, when for years there were loads of voids. I'd be interested in attending any planning meetings. Please keep us informed.


----------



## Ms T (Apr 16, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Deliciously Ella is opening a place called The Kitchen Counter in the arches on Milkwood Road shortly. One for the vegetarians and even vegans, I'm told.



Deliciously Ella is married to Tessa Jowell's son apparently so that might explain why we've been graced with her presence in Herne Hill.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Apr 16, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Deliciously Ella is married to Tessa Jowell's son apparently so that might explain why we've been graced with her presence in Herne Hill.


Good reports from the dry run.  
I suspect it's another place that I'll rarely be able to afford but I am curious and will try it.


----------



## technical (Apr 18, 2017)

gaijingirl said:


> My mum called me from London (I'm overseas atm) simply to tell me she's boycotting The Commercial who apparently charged her £9.35 for a large glass of chardonnay. Can that be right? She claims she queried it and it's on the price list.



I got charged £9.75 on Saturday in the Half Moon for a large white wine (for my other half)


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 20, 2017)

technical said:


> I got charged £9.75 on Saturday in the Half Moon for a large white wine (for my other half)


ouch!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 20, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Deliciously Ella is married to Tessa Jowell's son apparently so that might explain why we've been graced with her presence in Herne Hill.


Graced? can't say I feel blessed.

Always got her confused with with Harriet Harmen. If there was ever an identity parade of female labour mps I'd have a really hard job picking her out.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 20, 2017)

gaijingirl said:


> My mum called me from London (I'm overseas atm) simply to tell me she's boycotting The Commercial who apparently charged her £9.35 for a large glass of chardonnay. Can that be right? She claims she queried it and it's on the price list.


ouch! with shit toilets.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 20, 2017)

Are yours that bad? The gents have been hamlet stickered already I see. 

The garden was fun last weekend as most people had gone away for the weekend, which made it reasonably quiet, and it's an ok suntrap. 

It's just the Florence in a bigger space though isn't it?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 20, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Are yours that bad? The gents have been hamlet stickered already I see.
> 
> The garden was fun last weekend as most people had gone away for the weekend, which made it reasonably quiet, and it's an ok suntrap.
> 
> It's just the Florence in a bigger space though isn't it?


Ladies loos in Commercial are not great, but the Florence is a cheche and I don't generally want to feel like a grandma.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 20, 2017)

Dropped into the halfmoon for one this afternoon. NO REAL BEER! they had just had a delivery and apparently that meant there would be no real beer for the next 20 mins (why? 12 pumps no beer?) so we foolishly plumped for a pint of keg each (1 bullfinch and 1 pride) I held out a £10, but it WASN'T ENOUGH! £10.95 for 2 pints of keg. NOOOOOO!


----------



## BoxRoom (Apr 21, 2017)

friendofdorothy said:


> Dropped into the halfmoon for one this afternoon. NO REAL BEER! they had just had a delivery and apparently that meant there would be no real beer for the next 20 mins (why? 12 pumps no beer?) so we foolishly plumped for a pint of keg each (1 bullfinch and 1 pride) I held out a £10, but it WASN'T ENOUGH! £10.95 for 2 pints of keg. NOOOOOO!


Fucking hell!


----------



## colacubes (Apr 21, 2017)

Popped in on Sunday and came out £13 lighter for a pint of Hepcat and a large Pinot. The Hepcat was £5.30. It retails at between £3.90 and £4.30 at our regular (fairly gastro) pubs in West Norwood. I raise my eyebrows at £8 for a large glass of wine in the West End and it wasn't even the most expensive on the menu. I'll be more careful with what I order another time.

In summary they've done a lovely job on the interior but the prices are a pisstake.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Apr 23, 2017)

HELP! My beautiful & much loved cat Tilly has gone missing. Think she slipped out the front door just after midnight Friday into Saturday. She's scared of traffic etc so wouldn't normally wander but isn't hiding in the front or back gardens, nor the neighbours' as far as I can see. Really worried she's been hurt or taken. She has hypokalaemia - without her meds she'll eventually die. So it's vital she's found asap. I'm beside myself. Please look out if you're in SE24 area (Norwood Rd between Brockwell Park & Tulse Hill gyratory). Any advice welcome.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			






.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Apr 23, 2017)

I've put posters up, done Facebook & Twitter posts, national pet register. Will do shelters, council and vet when open tomrw. 


.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Apr 23, 2017)

Sister Midnight said:


> I've put posters up, done Facebook & Twitter posts, national pet register. Will do shelters, council and vet when open tomrw.
> 
> 
> .


Don't forget the Herne Hill Forum.  I'm out all day in the area tomorrow and will keep everything peeled.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Apr 25, 2017)

Reunited with cat!  Phew!  
(Crikey didn't expect the pic above to be so big)


----------



## teuchter (Apr 25, 2017)

Sister Midnight said:


> Reunited with cat!  Phew!
> (Crikey didn't expect the pic above to be so big)


We want the full story


----------



## T & P (Apr 25, 2017)

Great to hear!

Look forward to seeing pictures of the kittens in a few weeks' time


----------



## Sister Midnight (Apr 25, 2017)

Ha, now that would be a story given she was neutered a decade ago. The immaculate cat-ception..?! 
Aw, kittens! [emoji76]


.


----------



## editor (May 2, 2017)

If you've after some "mindfulness meditation for businesses and individuals" and want to "be in the present moment and live your lives more fully" _and_ have £125 burning a hole in your pocket, this is for you.

Mindfulness



> Founded on Science,
> 
> Applied to the Person.


It says....


----------



## Calvo (May 6, 2017)

Sorry to see the Ye Olde Bakery seems to have closed for good. There's a notice in the window saying they found things difficult after the move and a fire in the kitchen seems to have been the final straw. Such a shame for them :-(


----------



## Smick (May 6, 2017)

Calvo said:


> Sorry to see the Ye Olde Bakery seems to have closed for good. There's a notice in the window saying they found things difficult after the move and a fire in the kitchen seems to have been the final straw. Such a shame for them :-(


Absolutely awful for an established employer like that to have gone down the pan through no fault of their own.


----------



## Ms T (May 7, 2017)

Calvo said:


> Sorry to see the Ye Olde Bakery seems to have closed for good. There's a notice in the window saying they found things difficult after the move and a fire in the kitchen seems to have been the final straw. Such a shame for them :-(


It does say they hope to be back.  I used to shop there quite a bit so I hope they do manage to return.


----------



## teuchter (May 7, 2017)

Calvo said:


> Sorry to see the Ye Olde Bakery seems to have closed for good. There's a notice in the window saying they found things difficult after the move and a fire in the kitchen seems to have been the final straw. Such a shame for them :-(


I thought they had rebranded as artisan craft loaf house or whatever it's called, round the other side of the arches, or is that a different business?


----------



## gaijingirl (May 7, 2017)

teuchter said:


> I thought they had rebranded as artisan craft loaf house or whatever it's called, round the other side of the arches, or is that a different business?



yes they had, but they had a fire a few weeks ago.

I also thought they were coming back - but I was just saying to RubyToogood that since they moved to the other side I never go in there any more - I doubt it gets as much passing through footfall on that side.


----------



## editor (May 24, 2017)




----------



## editor (May 24, 2017)

This was great last night

















In photos: Gipsy Tuesday jam session at Off The Cuff, Herne Hill


----------



## Smick (May 24, 2017)

Do you tell the woman at Off the Cuff of your association with u75?

And if so, how did she react?


----------



## editor (May 24, 2017)

Smick said:


> Do you tell the woman at Off the Cuff of your association with u75?
> 
> And if so, how did she react?


I don't think she's around any more. I chat to the owner quite a bit if I'm there and he knows I'm involved in u75. He appreciated the review I gave them and the subsequent publicity I've posted on Buzz.


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (May 26, 2017)

it's a shame dicksons off licence has no been occupied by national rail


----------



## Lizzy Mac (May 26, 2017)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> it's a shame dicksons off licence has no been occupied by national rail


Esp after they had a refurb recently.  What a waste of money.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2017)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> it's a shame dicksons off licence has no been occupied by national rail


yes. We'll miss it. It was the only offy around here. its shameful of NR


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2017)

Calvo said:


> Sorry to see the Ye Olde Bakery seems to have closed for good. There's a notice in the window saying they found things difficult after the move and a fire in the kitchen seems to have been the final straw. Such a shame for them :-(


 I went off them a few years back when a friend saw mice all over the baskets in the windows at night.


----------



## T & P (May 26, 2017)

Any info on when the refurb works will be completed?

I feel sorry for that lovely used furniture shop in the corner. Did the relocate anywhere nearby?


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2017)

T & P said:


> Any info on when the refurb works will be completed?
> 
> I feel sorry for that lovely used furniture shop in the corner. Did the relocate anywhere nearby?


he is just round the corner on dulwich rd where the florist used to be - near the Florence.


----------



## T & P (May 26, 2017)

friendofdorothy said:


> he is just round the corner on dulwich rd where the florist used to be - near the Florence.


Oh that's good to hear. I only ever bought once from them but I like them a lot, and the wares they sell.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (May 26, 2017)

T & P said:


> Oh that's good to hear. I only ever bought once from them but I like them a lot, and the wares they sell.


At his prices, he will be fine.


----------



## Rushy (May 27, 2017)

T & P said:


> Any info on when the refurb works will be completed?
> 
> I feel sorry for that lovely used furniture shop in the corner. Did the relocate anywhere nearby?


It was called Bleu. He opened Mor Bleu on Dulwich Road a while ago (more upmarket). Recently told me that he's intending to get one of the new arches after refurb. He's a good businessman - even if that doesn't work out he'll sort something out. I'm not sure that the retail side of things was the main part of his business anyway.

I think Perks & White ( the best coffee in HH, or perhaps tied with Roome!) won the tender to get their old stall back in the station. Although, apart from the occasional drain smells, I've liked having it temporarily in Off The Cuff.


----------



## Sister Midnight (Jun 3, 2017)

Helicopter circling for past 10 mins or so. Makes me feel edgy having above - apart from the fact they seem to crash too often - I wonder what/who they're looking for... an escaped murderer?!!


.


----------



## GarveyLives (Jun 5, 2017)

> Helicopter circling for past 10 mins or so. Makes me feel edgy having above - apart from the fact they seem to crash too often - I wonder what/who they're looking for... an escaped murderer?!!



It may have been part of the continuing investigation into this serious crime.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jun 5, 2017)

GarveyLives said:


> It may have been part of the continuing investigation into this serious crime.


Do you think that's likely?


----------



## editor (Jun 5, 2017)

brixtonblade said:


> Do you think that's likely?


At least we were spared the out of context quotes in massive letters this time.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 9, 2017)

Had a brilliant day in the regent yesterday. 

£6 lunch, beer, read all the electioneering leaflets, more beer, read a couple of newspapers, political discussion, went to vote, more beer. Friends joined us, more political debate, other locals dropped by, more political chat, more beer, met a marvelous 81 year old who started a sing song, more beer, then a kebab on the way home. Can't recall when I enjoyed an election day more.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 10, 2017)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> it's a shame dicksons off licence has now been occupied by national rail


Are you sure about that? Looks to me like they've just been refurbing the front. They've uncovered old Beers Wine & Spirits painted shop signage.


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (Jun 11, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Are you sure about that? Looks to me like they've just been refurbing the front. They've uncovered old Beers Wine & Spirits painted shop signage.


thank god they didn't close


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Jun 16, 2017)

The Half Moon, Herne Hill, London: hotel review

This is what the Guardian had to say about the moon: 'But by the time it closed in 2013, after being flooded by a burst water main, the old pub was more notorious than famous, a soulless den of dodgy London geezers swilling vapid lager'


Dickhead.


----------



## editor (Jun 16, 2017)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> The Half Moon, Herne Hill, London: hotel review
> 
> This is what the Guardian had to say about the moon: 'But by the time it closed in 2013, after being flooded by a burst water main, the old pub was more notorious than famous, a soulless den of dodgy London geezers swilling vapid lager'
> 
> ...


Thank heavens it's been 'saved' for the middle classes. Huzzah!








Not for me, thanks.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jun 16, 2017)

editor said:


> Thank heavens it's been 'saved' for the middle classes. Huzzah!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Now we know where to avoid : )


----------



## MissL (Jun 16, 2017)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> The Half Moon, Herne Hill, London: hotel review
> 
> This is what the Guardian had to say about the moon: 'But by the time it closed in 2013, after being flooded by a burst water main, the old pub was more notorious than famous, a soulless den of dodgy London geezers swilling vapid lager'
> 
> ...



Men drinking lager in a pub. How awful.


----------



## T & P (Jun 16, 2017)

editor said:


> Thank heavens it's been 'saved' for the middle classes. Huzzah!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


TBF that picture is hardly representative of the pub as a whole as the front bit retains its original charm (even if a cynic might argue it's only because of its listed features).

But as it has been generally agreed in this very forum numerous times before, a pub in any incarnation is far better than no pub at all, and given how very close this one came to being converted into flats, the eventual outcome has surely been the least bad one given the particular circumstances.

I've been just the once since it reopened and it didn't win me over, but I'd still choose it over no pub at all. It's not terrible as a pub, and no much different from many others in our area that have converted their back space into a dining area or, god forgive, a children's playground.


----------



## editor (Jun 16, 2017)

T & P said:


> TBF that picture is hardly representative of the pub as a whole as the front bit retains its original charm (even if a cynic might argue it's only because of its listed features).
> 
> But as it has been generally agreed in this very forum numerous times before, a pub in any incarnation is far better than no pub at all, and given how very close this one came to being converted into flats, the eventual outcome has surely been the least bad one given the particular circumstances.
> 
> I've been just the once since it reopened and it didn't win me over, but I'd still choose it over no pub at all. It's not terrible as a pub, and no much different from many others in our area that have converted their back space into a dining area or, god forgive, a children's playground.


I'm glad it's still a pub but it's no longer a pub I want to visit - and I'm basing that not on that one picture but on what many friends have told me about the place.


----------



## editor (Jun 20, 2017)

Ms T said:


> Herne Hill is to get a Costa Coffee and a Greggs in the refurbished arches, apparently. Which is crap news for the bakery and independent coffee shops. I will be voting with my wallet and staying away. Doesn't bode well for Brixton, either.


Any more news on this?  I see the shops are still boarded up. Are there any plans online?


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jun 20, 2017)

editor said:


> Any more news on this?  I see the shops are still boarded up. Are there any plans online?


The Herne Hill Forum people repeated the promise made by Network Rail that chains won't be involved.  Fingers crossed.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jun 20, 2017)

The new old station doors are in and look good, maybe even worth a pic.  The ticket hall is massive.


----------



## technical (Jun 21, 2017)

Unlike Brixton, there appears to be work going on behind the hoardings. Or at least there were people in there yesterday afternoon


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 21, 2017)

The new ticket hall is huge. I've forgotten where the plans posted earlier on here are to see what else is going in to it. 

in other news - lots of Lambeth Living* stickers on bikes locked up in my blocks corridors and communal spaces; threatening to remove them by 23rd June. This is despite 2 years of Lambeth contracted builders working there, who would wedge open fire doors, broke lots of windows, leave piles of building refuse in fire exits etc. 

*who don't exist any more


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 1, 2017)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> The Half Moon, Herne Hill, London: hotel review
> 
> This is what the Guardian had to say about the moon: 'But by the time it closed in 2013, after being flooded by a burst water main, the old pub was more notorious than famous, a soulless den of dodgy London geezers swilling vapid lager'
> 
> ...


 Don't recall it being notorious or soulless in 2013 - there may have been the odd 'dodgy london geezer' but at least Fat Paul was still banned. The Herne Hill Stitch and Bitch group used to meet there quite happily.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 7, 2017)

Does anyone know what the system is for getting tickets for the lido...is itvessy to get them in the morning and then not have to queue. Cheers.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 7, 2017)

Buy them online. go to front of queue, face wrath of faces...


----------



## Maharani (Jul 7, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Buy them online. go to front of queue, face wrath of faces...


Can you do that?! Ok. Thanks


----------



## Maharani (Jul 7, 2017)

I've got swim cards from over a year ago. Can't get through on the phone and can't see where to book online.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 7, 2017)

Maharani said:


> I've got swim cards from over a year ago. Can't get through on the phone and can't see where to book online.



The queue isn't very long atm but they've closed down half of the pool for some kind of maintenance work (they said painting but I don't see how that can be the case - also nothing at all is happening in the empty half) so the water is busy. If you just want to lounge you'll be okay but it's not good for a proper swim and there are people drilling.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 7, 2017)

Queue is huge now and they're painting the white pool edge ahead of tomorrow's anniversary celebrations. I wouldn't bother today personally.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 7, 2017)

what's going on tomorrow?! Do i need to go early to get a swim in?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 7, 2017)

The Jaws screening was um, a little delayed the other night. Jaws soundtrack at 11.20 was interesting...


----------



## Rushy (Jul 7, 2017)

gaijingirl said:


> Queue is huge now and they're painting the white pool edge ahead of tomorrow's anniversary celebrations. I wouldn't bother today personally.


Other half was reopened by 2. Long queue.

It's about £85 to buy a ticket from now to end October. Brilliant for me because I prefer to nip in and out for short visits.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 7, 2017)

It's the Brockwell Park Dog Show this Sunday! 2pm 

Not the normal judge I think...


----------



## Maharani (Jul 7, 2017)

gaijingirl said:


> Queue is huge now and they're painting the white pool edge ahead of tomorrow's anniversary celebrations. I wouldn't bother today personally.


No, we'll go to WN leis I think. Thanks for the updates though.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 7, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Other half was reopened by 2. Long queue.
> 
> It's about £85 to buy a ticket from now to end October. Brilliant for me because I prefer to nip in and out for short visits.



I have full membership because I swim more or less daily before work but there are days when it's very crowded that I avoid it and I would certainly avoid it if I had to queue.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 7, 2017)

Maharani said:


> No, we'll go to WN leis I think. Thanks for the updates though.



no worries.


----------



## Maggot (Jul 7, 2017)

A friend of mine, who many of you have met is organising a series of inflatable races at the Lido tomorrow as part of the 80th anniversary celebrations. Starts at 11.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 8, 2017)

Shakespeare was fun today. I cannot imagine the amount of barbecue food will be eaten.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 8, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Shakespeare was fun today. I cannot imagine the amount of barbecue food will be eaten.


I was there from about 4 but didn't see you! Food was great.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 9, 2017)

Ffs. 

Historic London lido forced to close after vandals trash poolside


----------



## Maharani (Jul 9, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Ffs.
> 
> Historic London lido forced to close after vandals trash poolside


Why the fuck would anyone do this?


----------



## Maggot (Jul 9, 2017)

It opened again an hour later, so can't have been too serious.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 9, 2017)

Maggot said:


> It opened again an hour later, so can't have been too serious.


Oh good


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 9, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Why the fuck would anyone do this?


 Bastards. And it was supposed to be the inflatables race today, neighbour said it was delayed.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 10, 2017)

It's happened again overnight.  No pre-work swim here this morning.  Incredible - someone with a grudge?


----------



## Maharani (Jul 10, 2017)

gaijingirl said:


> It's happened again overnight.  No pre-work swim here this morning.  Incredible - someone with a grudge?


What? Oh my. Sounds bizarre.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 10, 2017)

Maharani said:


> What? Oh my. Sounds bizarre.



Really nasty and yeah - a bit weird.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 10, 2017)

gaijingirl said:


> Really nasty and yeah - a bit weird.


These idiots chucking stuff in the pool? How are they gaining entry?


----------



## gaijingirl (Jul 10, 2017)

Maharani said:


> These idiots chucking stuff in the pool? How are they gaining entry?



They must be climbing over the outside wall I guess - the indoor buildings are, presumably, alarmed.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 10, 2017)

Do we know that if it's opening today at all?


----------



## Maharani (Jul 10, 2017)

I called and they said they would be open but not sure what time.


----------



## Maharani (Jul 10, 2017)

Closed all day .


----------



## Maharani (Jul 10, 2017)

I'm other news Lambeth are busy setting up for fun & frollicks this weekend:


----------



## Rushy (Jul 10, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Closed all day .


Really? They literally just told me 2-3 hrs!  (and to keep an eye on Twitter).


----------



## Maharani (Jul 10, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Really? They literally just told me 2-3 hrs!  (and to keep an eye on Twitter).


Might have changed. They were being really vague...


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jul 10, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Why the fuck would anyone do this?



Cos they're selfish cunts....


----------



## lefteri (Jul 10, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Ffs.
> 
> Historic London lido forced to close after vandals trash poolside



Saltdean Lido was also vandalised on Sunday night


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 20, 2017)

My doormat has received a Lambeth council sticker saying it's a fire hazard and will "be removed in 24 hours". 

The cat is now happier he has more indoor scratching options.


----------



## Winot (Jul 20, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> My doormat has received a Lambeth council sticker saying it's a fire hazard and will "be removed in 24 hours".



Well it would be a warm welcome.


----------



## sparkybird (Jul 20, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> My doormat has received a Lambeth council sticker saying it's a fire hazard and will "be removed in 24 hours".
> 
> The cat is now happier he has more indoor scratching options.


Glad to see Lambeth are making good use of and prioritizing their precious resources.....


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 20, 2017)

sparkybird said:


> Glad to see Lambeth are making good use of and prioritizing their precious resources.....



Especially as they haven't cared for the last few years until what's now a post grenfell panic; and then their contractors broke loads of the windows and blamed the residents, and then the contractors broke the security doors by blocking them open and then blamed the residents etc. etc. etc.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 25, 2017)

Got an impressively detailed thing through the door about the Sunfall festival in Brockwell park 12th August.
It was A4, both sides, small print - lots of info. We've definitely not had anything like this before about any park event.

FYI
sound check - friday 11 17:00-18:00hrs and sat 12th 10:00-11:00hrs
Neighbourhood Relations Manager / Noise Management Team  07749 948670

They are also offering some free and some 50% discount tickets to local residents near the park. Not my thang - but thought some of you might be interested.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 25, 2017)

I got that too - their knowledge of SE24 / SW2 is pretty lacking - lots of eligible streets aren't named on their list of local streets in the catchment. 

Particularly liked their claim that they'd "secured tickets for local residents", given that they've secured them from themselves. You then have to take photo id, and an original utility bill to gain entry...  

Copywriting was dreadful and missed their audience.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 25, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> I got that too - their knowledge of SE24 / SW2 is pretty lacking - lots of eligible streets aren't named on their list of local streets in the catchment.
> 
> Particularly liked their claim that they'd "secured tickets for local residents", given that they've secured them from themselves. You then have to take photo id, and an original utility bill to gain entry...
> 
> Copywriting was dreadful and missed their audience.


 I thought it was written to reassure locals about how responsible they want to be, well those who could be bothered reading their dense small print. Don't think locals are their festival 'audience'. Not all locals like our park being pimped out to private profit making nightclub/festival organisers.

As I don't have photo ID I'm annoyed that I wouldn't be able to get in, not that I want to go anyway, but it's the principle. It's middleagist! Just wait 'til I have me buspass, then I'll show'em.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 26, 2017)

One side of the letter (HT Jim Dickson):



Seems like all local ticket allocations have already gone (I don't emoji, but my response is a bit beard scratchy).


----------



## editor (Jul 26, 2017)

Get voting!

Half Moon Pub nominated for Southwark Blue Plaque – but your vote is needed


----------



## Maharani (Aug 15, 2017)

Come down for my Chapati Slingers north Indian curry pop up at The Parlour, opposite the park (msin entrance) next Thursday (24th) from 7.30pm. I usually do veggie only but am expanding to prawn and chicken too this month, as well as veggie (or vegan if requested). I need menu choices so PM me if you're interested and I'll send you the menu.

It's a lovely chilled night...booze served there too...nice atmosphere and loads of delicious food. Please spread the word! Thanks.


----------



## editor (Aug 16, 2017)

Incoming!

14 dreamy reasons to visit Dulwich Road, Herne Hill


----------



## T & P (Aug 16, 2017)

I wouldn't call The Florence an old pub. There might have been a public house on the site for a long time, but old The Florence is not and feels not. Could have mentioned the Hakf Moon as well- perhaps the article was written before it reopened.


----------



## Calvo (Aug 20, 2017)

That drumming in the park...is it bothering anyone else who can hear it?


----------



## editor (Aug 20, 2017)

Calvo said:


> That drumming in the park...is it bothering anyone else who can hear it?



Maybe it's this lot again. I didn't think it was that loud. mind. 







Late afternoon in Brockwell Park – African drumming, dancers and picnickers


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 21, 2017)

South London Drinks will be in Herne Hill this Friday 24th. See the thread in the community forum or send me a message.


----------



## Maharani (Aug 21, 2017)

Another burst pipe in HH.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 21, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Another burst pipe in HH.


where?


----------



## Maharani (Aug 21, 2017)

Not sure but my mate just told me and my bus got diverted from Brixton this afternoon. I'll see if I can find out.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 22, 2017)

This morning I saw a No 68 coming down Dulwich rd, Brixton Water Lane, turning on to Tulse hill - must be diverting to avoid Norwood Road


----------



## colacubes (Aug 22, 2017)

I think it's near Deronda Road.


----------



## Crispy (Aug 22, 2017)

Where on da road?


Sorry



Not sorry


----------



## ViolentPanda (Aug 22, 2017)

friendofdorothy said:


> South London Drinks will be in Herne Hill this Friday 24th. See the thread in the community forum or send me a message.



Friday is the 25th.


----------



## editor (Aug 22, 2017)

ViolentPanda said:


> Friday is the 25th.


Bah! I'm DJing at the Market House in Brixton. If any of you lot want to keep on partying after the pub, drop me a line before Friday and I'll sort out a free guest list.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 22, 2017)

ViolentPanda said:


> Friday is the 25th.


you are of course quite right, thank you!


----------



## ViolentPanda (Aug 23, 2017)

friendofdorothy said:


> you are of course quite right, thank you!



To be fair, I was only sure of it because it's my father-in-law's wedding on the 25th, and he played the Ann card to convince me to attend.  He knows I don't care for him, but as she buried the hatchet with him and forgave his lifelong nastiness to her a couple of weeks before she died, I felt that if I were to represent her feelings/what she wanted, I should go.  I think that'll be the last time I take a call from him, though.


----------



## editor (Aug 25, 2017)

Happy birthday to Herne Hill railway station!  







Happy 155th Birthday to Herne Hill railway station, which opened in August 1862


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 29, 2017)

Jonti said:


> View attachment 114564
> This was the scene at the crossroads of Railton Road and Shakespeare Road yesterday tea time.  The street's much better since extensive traffic calming measures, but it can still be hazardous.


 oh shit. cars do tend to speed between bumps, but what speed to you have to do to do that, any other vehicles involved? It looks very bad, I hope they survived it.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Sep 1, 2017)

Lowie are asking people to object to the changes to their Herne Hill store
Simple Search
search with code 17/03745/FUL.
There are quite a few comments posted already.  I'm not an expert on this sort of thing at all, experts! what are the implications?


----------



## Rushy (Sep 1, 2017)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Lowie are asking people to object to the changes to their Herne Hill store
> Simple Search
> search with code 17/03745/FUL.
> There are quite a few comments posted already.  I'm not an expert on this sort of thing at all, experts! what are the implications?


Interesting that the D&AS claims the plans were developed in consultation with the current leaseholders. The leaseholder's objection suggests that whilst they may have been consulted, their views were not given much weight!


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 1, 2017)

I always thought she'd bought the whole building, not just the flat upstairs.


----------



## Maharani (Sep 17, 2017)

Pizza Pelone or 500 degrees as the restaurant is called is rank. Got a TA delivered and the pizzas were under-cooked, hardly any of one of the extra toppings AND they used slimy tinned mushrooms. Really yuck. This will be the last order a make from them.


----------



## ash (Sep 17, 2017)

T


Maharani said:


> Pizza Pelone or 500 degrees as the restaurant is called is rank. Got a TA delivered and the pizzas were under-cooked, hardly any of one of the extra toppings AND they used slimy tinned mushrooms. Really yuck. This will be the last order a make from them.


Thats annoying. Was it the Ferndale rd one as they've always been piping hot and lovely when we've ordered but we live very close


----------



## Maharani (Sep 17, 2017)

ash said:


> T
> 
> Thats annoying. Was it the Ferndale rd one as they've always been piping hot and lovely when we've ordered but we live very close


Think it's in HH. They were hot but the cheese was still white and the mushrooms made me feel sick!


----------



## ash (Sep 17, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Think it's in HH. They were hot but the cheese was still white and the mushrooms made me feel sick!


Yeuk. I avoid veggie pizzas in Spain as they have those awful tinned or jarred mushroom that are so sour and indigestion creating- totally unacceptable in London. I feel your pain.


----------



## Maharani (Sep 17, 2017)

ash said:


> Yeuk. I avoid veggie pizzas in Spain as they have those awful tinned or jarred mushroom that are so sour and indigestion creating- totally unacceptable in London. I feel your pain.


Yeah and £21 for two pizzas when they're not frigging amazing is just bloody bad news.


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 17, 2017)

Maharani said:


> Pizza Pelone or 500 degrees as the restaurant is called is rank. Got a TA delivered and the pizzas were under-cooked, hardly any of one of the extra toppings AND they used slimy tinned mushrooms. Really yuck. This will be the last order a make from them.


Im suprised by this... has always been good when ive been


----------



## teuchter (Sep 17, 2017)

The first world problems of the good folks of herne hill. Traumatic reading.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Sep 22, 2017)

Anyone got any info or links about the design trail stuff thats going on. I met a young woman painting WHERE THE PANTERS ROARED on Railton rd pavement. She said it was part of design trail stuff and there was a walk going on on sat starting at the Commercial in Herne Hill - but I cant find anything about it - like when does it start? cost?


----------



## ringo (Sep 27, 2017)

Saw this on FB, with the caption "The fabled Soul Stealing Evil Wizard Cat of Herne Hill. Proper shits me up every time I walk past."



Best cat ever


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 27, 2017)

which reminds me of:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I welcomed the darkness that filled my soul. No hope, no fear. <a href="Black Metal Cats on Twitter">pic.twitter.com/fqSglu8BZ3</a></p>&mdash; Black Metal Cats (@evilbmcats) <a href="">September 24, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


----------



## macca4848 (Sep 27, 2017)

ringo said:


> Saw this on FB, with the caption "The fabled Soul Stealing Evil Wizard Cat of Herne Hill. Proper shits me up every time I walk past."
> 
> View attachment 116520
> 
> Best cat ever




Isn’t this a Tulse Hill cat [emoji3]


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Sep 28, 2017)

macca4848 said:


> Isn’t this a Tulse Hill cat [emoji3]



Gonna say the same......I've seen that evil on the doorsteps of Palace Road.


----------



## ringo (Sep 29, 2017)

Don't know, must be then.


.


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 6, 2017)

Costcutter's got a fancy refurb...


----------



## Crispy (Oct 6, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Costcutter's got a fancy refurb...


It's bigger too, by another aisle. They knocked down all the lean-to crap at the back and rebuilt it as part of the shop.


----------



## Rushy (Oct 6, 2017)

Has it made their post office any less depressing?


----------



## Crispy (Oct 6, 2017)

Rushy said:


> Has it made their post office any less depressing?


That bit's still under construction bu t the completed bit looks like a vast improvement


----------



## CH1 (Oct 6, 2017)

I see the Herne Hill Music Festival is on Programme | Herne Hill Music Festival
Some potentially interesting events - though mainly these are to be paid for.

Subversive cheapskate that I am, I was delighted to catch possibly the only London performance of "Dead Elvis" at the RFH on Thursday - for free!


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Oct 7, 2017)

Power cut anyone?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Oct 7, 2017)

ringo said:


> Saw this on FB, with the caption "The fabled Soul Stealing Evil Wizard Cat of Herne Hill. Proper shits me up every time I walk past."
> 
> View attachment 116520
> 
> Best cat ever



TBF, that cat *does* look like it'd steal your soul as soon as look at you.


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 16, 2017)

There's a strange new shed on Herne Hill by the supermarkets. Any idea what it is?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 16, 2017)

I wondered about that too - wonder if you need planning permission for a shed on the pavement like that?


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 27, 2017)

Bar 127 has had its ours reduced by Lambeth Licensing: 

https://moderngov.lambeth.gov.uk/ieListDocuments.aspx?MId=10195

11pm closure now


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 27, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> Bar 127 has had its ours reduced by Lambeth Licensing:
> 
> Agenda for Licensing Sub-Committee on Thursday 26 October 2017, 7.00 pm | Lambeth Council
> 
> 11pm closure now


oh no! there's no where late left.


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 27, 2017)

OTC? Matt if you ask him nicely?


----------



## editor (Nov 16, 2017)

Free films for Christmas 

The Christmas Herne Hill Free Film Festival partners with Norwood and Brixton Foodbank, 7th-20th Dec


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 18, 2017)

snowy_again said:


> OTC? Matt if you ask him nicely?


We'll make do with the Commercial after midnight til one. At least there is usually some of the old crowd in there.


----------



## editor (Dec 12, 2017)

Non-chuffed Herne Hill folks: 

Herne Hill Forum accuses Lambeth Council of misleading residents after application to be recognised refused by Cabinet


----------



## Crispy (Dec 12, 2017)

This is because half of "Herne Hill" is in Southwark and half is in Lambeth. The Lambeth proposal just neatly slices off the Southwark bits (eg. Half Moon Lane and Norwood Road south of the bridge).

Presumably there is a parallel application process ongoing with Southwark? The government guidance requires it.


----------



## Maharani (Dec 29, 2017)

Does anyone know of a local vacuum repair person or shop? According to google the nearest one is Fulham.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 1, 2018)

Maharani said:


> Does anyone know of a local vacuum repair person or shop? According to google the nearest one is Fulham.


Don't know if they fix vacuums - but Herne Hill electrical shop does fix things, they have fixed lamps for me. Try asking them 020 773 73166.

Also I've seen the helpful chap in Atasa on Clapham Road fixing all sorts of things - 020 7735 1728


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2018)

The Milkwood has closed for an unspecified amount of time for a 'refurbishment'. Anyone know any more about this?


----------



## Ms T (Jan 18, 2018)

editor said:


> The Milkwood has closed for an unspecified amount of time for a 'refurbishment'. Anyone know any more about this?


Hendo’s source says it’s struggling.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 18, 2018)

Ms T said:


> Hendo’s source says it’s struggling.


I’ve just asked one of the owners. Waiting for response


----------



## Smick (Jan 18, 2018)

What is it with that site? It just seems to struggle endlessly. I first started going when it was Escape Bar and Art. I think maybe the residents upstairs curtail the hours they can operate.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 18, 2018)

Smick said:


> What is it with that site? It just seems to struggle endlessly. I first started going when it was Escape Bar and Art. I think maybe the residents upstairs curtail the hours they can operate.


Same. Seems to be jinxed


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 18, 2018)

Dreadful customer service and a really strange choice of food didn't help either.  

Fish and Wine is also up for sale - the restaurant, and accommodation above.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 18, 2018)

I gave up "giving it a go" after four or five visits. I know others who did the same. Shame. I liked the general idea.

I had good food at the fish place but it was a bit stiff. Only went the once. Mind you, fish is rarely my first choice.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 18, 2018)

Problem with these places is lack of affordablity. They price people out, especially on the booze so people might go once but they won’t go back. Eateries should be affordable to a whole range of people. Makes for a better atmosphere too. These places are few and far between these days. 

I liked milkwood during the week. Thought their menu was ok, nicevand short and they used to do deals on lunch in the week.


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 18, 2018)

Yes I agree with Maharani - I think they're just that bit too expensive.  I did go once but didn't go back and I tend to stick to the cheaper alternatives.  That new place along Norwood Road (The Park Cafe?  Or Cafe on the Park or Inn on the Park?) I had a look at their menu and it is extortionate!


----------



## Ms T (Jan 18, 2018)

LLewellyn’s on the other hand is booked weeks in advance. See also Naughty Piglets. Clearly there’s room for pricier offerings, but they have to be exceptional.


----------



## Ms T (Jan 18, 2018)

Has anyone tried Inn the Park or whatever it’s called?


----------



## gaijingirl (Jan 18, 2018)

Ms T said:


> Has anyone tried Inn the Park or whatever it’s called?



That's the one I was talking about - no - I did look at the menu expecting it to be more like a cafe, thinking we'd try it out and it was incredibly expensive.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jan 18, 2018)

There must be about 10 or 11 restaurants in herne hill though, and it's not really a busy place.


----------



## Winot (Jan 18, 2018)

sleaterkinney said:


> There must be about 10 or 11 restaurants in herne hill though, and it's not really a busy place.



A friend who lives there told me there was 24! No idea if she is right.


----------



## Maharani (Jan 18, 2018)

Milkwood reopening on March 1st


----------



## editor (Jan 18, 2018)

Maharani said:


> Milkwood reopening on March 1st


Clearly there'll be a massive St David's Day theme to tie in with the day.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 29, 2018)

Not really Herne Hill, but I can't find a Dulwich thread. 

We finally got around to going to the re-opened Dog in Dulwich (Crown and Greyhound) 
The bar bit wasn't too changed, though half the garden at the back has now gone. New toilets were very clean.   It was sunday daytime, so it was completely over-run with posh families with small noisy children who run wild.

and the ale was all about £5.10 a pint. Ouch.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Feb 7, 2018)

Herne Hill Road, one side of the road is Herne Hill, the other side Camberwell.  One end is near Loughborough Junction, the other end Denmark Hill.  It's confusing enough already but I've now seen Estate Agent talk of 'renowned Ruskin Village'.  Te he.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 7, 2018)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Herne Hill Road, one side of the road is Herne Hill, the other side Camberwell.  One end is near Loughborough Junction, the other end Denmark Hill.  It's confusing enough already but I've now seen Estate Agent talk of 'renowned Ruskin Village'.  Te he.



This is wrong.

The lower end of HHR is in Loughborough Junction, on both sides. The middle and upper end is in Herne Hill, on both sides.

Loughborough Junction turns into Herne Hill somwehere around where the Cambria pub is.

Camberwell doesn't start until at least a couple of streets to the east of HHR.

There's to be no more foolish ideas on this subject, thanks.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Feb 7, 2018)

teuchter said:


> This is wrong.
> 
> The lower end of HHR is in Loughborough Junction, on both sides. The middle and upper end is in Herne Hill, on both sides.
> 
> ...


What's wrong exactly?


----------



## ChrisSouth (Feb 14, 2018)

teuchter said:


> This is wrong.
> 
> The lower end of HHR is in Loughborough Junction, on both sides. The middle and upper end is in Herne Hill, on both sides.
> 
> ...




No, no, no, no. The lower end of HHR is LJ on both sides. And yes, the middle and upper is HH on both sides. LJ turns magically to HH underneath the railway bridge on HHR, just after the HH (wrongly named) surgery. Exactly halfway under the railway bridge. And under the railway bridge on Cambria Road. 

You're obviously far too new in these parts. 

Estate agents have been calling the houses by Ruskin Park, 'Ruskin Village' for the last few years. But as any fewl knows, this is SE5, so it's Camberwell. But woe betide of you put Camberwell on your postal address as your letters will never get delivered by the postie, as that bit of Camberwell isn't recognised as Camberwell. 

We like to be geographically vague in these parts.


----------



## CH1 (Feb 14, 2018)

ChrisSouth said:


> No, no, no, no. The lower end of HHR is LJ on both sides. And yes, the middle and upper is HH on both sides. LJ turns magically to HH underneath the railway bridge on HHR, just after the HH (wrongly named) surgery. Exactly halfway under the railway bridge. And under the railway bridge on Cambria Road.
> 
> You're obviously far too new in these parts.
> 
> We like to be geographically vague in these parts.


I thought LJAG put a lot of effort some years ago into defining Loughborough Junction as an area bounded by seven bridges.
This part of a BCC News ("Building Communities in Coldharbour") email from September 2014:
_*Loughborough Junction Action Group (LJAG) are holding a party to launch the first bridge in The 7 Bridges Project, celebrating the artworks which have been fixed to the bridge by 32 artists, and the overall improvements that are happening in Loughborough Junction.*_


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 14, 2018)

Hey chaps, this is the Herne Hill thread take your LJ chat arguments elsewhere please.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 14, 2018)

ChrisSouth said:


> No, no, no, no. The lower end of HHR is LJ on both sides. And yes, the middle and upper is HH on both sides. LJ turns magically to HH underneath the railway bridge on HHR, just after the HH (wrongly named) surgery. Exactly halfway under the railway bridge. And under the railway bridge on Cambria Road.
> 
> You're obviously far too new in these parts.


So...it is your contention that Manuel's boxing gym, and the cinema, and the Hardess industrial estate, and Lambeth Pest Control Department are all in Herne Hill?

The surgery is not wrongly named, as it is named HHR, not HH, surgery.


----------



## ChrisSouth (Feb 15, 2018)

teuchter said:


> So...it is your contention that Manuel's boxing gym, and the cinema, and the Hardess industrial estate, and Lambeth Pest Control Department are all in Herne Hill?
> 
> The surgery is not wrongly named, as it is named HHR, not HH, surgery.



Sure, why not


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Feb 15, 2018)

Post code for Whirled is SE24.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 15, 2018)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Post code for Whirled is SE24.


And so is HHR medical practice on the other side of the bridge.


----------



## ChrisSouth (Feb 15, 2018)

teuchter said:


> And so is HHR medical practice on the other side of the bridge.



Agreed.

The postcodes in this part of the world are weird. Don't rely on them to define the geography.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Feb 15, 2018)

Well it all needs to begin and end somewhere.
Seems simple enough, it's an old fashioned Parish boundary.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 7, 2018)

198 Gallery just secured funding for their building expansion...


----------



## Rushy (Mar 7, 2018)

That's good. Presume they have match funding of some sort? At their open house thing to show off the plans they mentioned works were expected to cost close to a million!


----------



## CH1 (Mar 9, 2018)

Looks like Cathy Newman of Channel 4 News may be a Herne Hill resident.
My London: Cathy Newman


----------



## Ms T (Mar 9, 2018)

CH1 said:


> Looks like Cathy Newman of Channel 4 News may be a Herne Hill resident.
> My London: Cathy Newman


I’ve seen her a couple of times in Brockwell Park.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 14, 2018)

Deliciously Ella has closed after less than a year. According to The Times, her business had lost 700 grand. Another casualty of the downturn in “casual dining”, perhaps? Or maybe a vegan deli was a bridge too far for Herne Hill?

The bakery which was destroyed in a fire has reopened though.


----------



## editor (Mar 14, 2018)

Ms T said:


> Deliciously Ella has closed after less than a year. According to The Times, her business had lost 700 grand. Another casualty of the downturn in “casual dining”, perhaps? Or maybe a vegan deli was a bridge too far for Herne Hill?
> 
> The bakery which was destroyed in a fire has reopened though.


I've never even heard of the place, which may have been part of the problem. To lose £700k in under a year suggests they either had a whopping rent and/or were spectacularly clueless.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 14, 2018)

They opened too many places too quickly. And whilst the concept was ok the execution was pretty poor.


----------



## Smick (Mar 14, 2018)

Rushy said:


> They opened too many places too quickly. And whilst the concept was ok the execution was pretty poor.


Has the £700k been lost between several premises then?


----------



## Rushy (Mar 14, 2018)

Smick said:


> Has the £700k been lost between several premises then?


That's what I've understood. Would be a lot to lose in less than a year on one railway arch!


----------



## editor (Mar 14, 2018)

Smick said:


> Has the £700k been lost between several premises then?


Ah, so they had ideas well above their station. It seems quite a thing for entrepreneurial types to immediately start expanding if they manage a half successful foodie start up joint. I get loads of ambitious press releases all banging on about how [insert trendy foodie start up here] will soon be taking their on trend dining concept to every other trendy part of town.


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 14, 2018)

Given how expensive the food was I'm amazed they lost so much!


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 14, 2018)

Ms T said:


> The bakery which was destroyed in a fire has reopened though.



hurrah


----------



## organicpanda (Mar 14, 2018)

Rushy said:


> They opened too many places too quickly. And whilst the concept was ok the execution was pretty poor.


that and the fact she got over £220k in dividends in the first year, still with mummy being a Sainsbury and mother-in-law being Tessa Jowell I'm sure they'll recover somehow


----------



## madolesance (Mar 14, 2018)

organicpanda said:


> that and the fact she got over £220k in dividends in the first year, still with mummy being a Sainsbury and mother-in-law being Tessa Jowell I'm sure they'll recover somehow



Pretty sure she has a realitve at Penguin who pushed through the glossy/ smiley books that where based on the success of a food blog that had a following. They tried to turn that following into a bricks and mortar life style choice, but in reality, not enough people could afford to go there. 

Has anyone seen the cook/ lifestyle books that kicked it all of? Go and Google the books and you'll then realise why it failed.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Mar 14, 2018)

Rushy said:


> That's what I've understood. Would be a lot to lose in less than a year on one railway arch!


Two arches.  I've seen a reference to Network Rail but only one.
It was all very sudden.


----------



## shakespearegirl (Mar 15, 2018)

I had brunch there once and was hugely underwhelmed. Teeny servings and the pancakes tasted like cardboard. Really expensive as well. The service was poor as well


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 15, 2018)

It's got a beautiful view of the Pizza Express bins too.


----------



## CH1 (Mar 16, 2018)

On platform 1 of the station there is a poster ad for "Private Doctor". Is this aimed at the gym crowd, since it seems to be connected in some way to a gym in the arches underneath?

I thought doctors were not allowed to advertise - though in these days of waiting a week or two for a non urgent appointment this may be cracking up (like the patients!)


----------



## ChrisSouth (Mar 16, 2018)

CH1 said:


> Looks like Cathy Newman of Channel 4 News may be a Herne Hill resident.
> My London: Cathy Newman



She is. She supports the Carnegie Library campaign/defend the ten and often tweets about how horrendous the Thameslink trans are through HH and LJ. She's a local star.


----------



## ChrisSouth (Mar 16, 2018)

Rushy said:


> They opened too many places too quickly. And whilst the concept was ok the execution was pretty poor.



The concept is totally wrong. She's an advocate of 'clean eating' which has completely been debunked.


----------



## brixtonblade (Mar 16, 2018)

ChrisSouth said:


> The concept is totally wrong. She's an advocate of 'clean eating' which has completely been debunked.


What is clean eating? Never heard of it...


----------



## organicpanda (Mar 16, 2018)

brixtonblade said:


> What is clean eating? Never heard of it...


wearing a bib when eating


----------



## ChrisSouth (Mar 16, 2018)

brixtonblade said:


> What is clean eating? Never heard of it...



Exactly


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 16, 2018)

opposite of a 'dirty' burger probably


----------



## Rushy (Mar 16, 2018)

ChrisSouth said:


> The concept is totally wrong. She's an advocate of 'clean eating' which has completely been debunked.


They are (were) vegetarian cafes. Only visited two or three times but, beyond being veggie or vegan, nothing otherwise dietarily prescriptive about them as far as I could tell. She describes it as"plant based goodness". Quite tasty but a bit too "festival" quality, I thought. Are you possibly thinking about her blog about managing her cardiac illness through diet (which admittedly I've never read)?


----------



## Rushy (Mar 16, 2018)

ChrisSouth said:


> She often tweets about how horrendous the Thameslink trans are through HH and LJ.



A bit controversial?


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Mar 16, 2018)

CH1 said:


> On platform 1 of the station there is a poster ad for "Private Doctor". Is this aimed at the gym crowd, since it seems to be connected in some way to a gym in the arches underneath?
> 
> I thought doctors were not allowed to advertise - though in these days of waiting a week or two for a non urgent appointment this may be cracking up (like the patients!)


I don't think they have any connection other than the studio has some flyers.
I could be wrong but I don't think so.


----------



## shakespearegirl (Mar 16, 2018)

Rushy said:


> They are (were) vegetarian cafes. Only visited two or three times but, beyond being veggie or vegan, nothing otherwise dietarily prescriptive about them as far as I could tell. She describes it as"plant based goodness". Quite tasty but a bit too "festival" quality, I thought. Are you possibly thinking about her blog about managing her cardiac illness through diet (which admittedly I've never read)?



there were lots of gluten free and paleo options as well


----------



## CH1 (Mar 16, 2018)

ChrisSouth said:


> She often tweets about how horrendous the Thameslink trans are through HH and LJ.


Don't know about the service - but it seems to me that these Siemens trains could do with an energy audit. They seem to me to be twice as heavy as the traditional high speed British Rail electric railcar as used on services such as Kings Cross to Cambridge in 45 mins. That excess mass in itself probably uses huge surges of power on starting up (P=MA - or was when I went to school).

I also think it is a bit odd that Thameslink run so many empty trains between Brighton and Bedford or Three Bridges and Bedford during the day. Siemens trains seem to come in 8 coach or 12 coach variants, with no possibility altering the number of coaches depending on customer demand.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Mar 16, 2018)

brixtonblade said:


> What is clean eating? Never heard of it...


I think Jay Rayner got into some length on this sort of thing.


----------



## Crispy (Mar 16, 2018)

Some googling suggests 3.3MW for 8-car and 5MW for 12-car on the new class 700
They weigh 278 and 410 tonnes respoectively

The old class 365 4-car units have about 1.2MW at their disposal
They weigh 151 tonnes

So thats 11.8kW/t and 12.2kW/t power/weight for the 700s and 7.9kW/t for the 365s

The Class 700 are therefore lighter on a per-car basis, and more powerful, which is why they accelerate so quickly.

Which train actually uses more power from the wires, I can't say.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 16, 2018)

shakespearegirl said:


> there were lots of gluten free and paleo options as well


Offering options is hardly dietarily prescriptive though! 
(The gluten free bread was horrible, mind you. Although imo that's fairly unavoidable).


----------



## Smick (Mar 16, 2018)

CH1 said:


> Don't know about the service - but it seems to me that these Siemens trains could do with an energy audit. They seem to me to be twice as heavy as the traditional high speed British Rail electric railcar as used on services such as Kings Cross to Cambridge in 45 mins. That excess mass in itself probably uses huge surges of power on starting up (P=MA - or was when I went to school).
> 
> I also think it is a bit odd that Thameslink run so many empty trains between Brighton and Bedford or Three Bridges and Bedford during the day. Siemens trains seem to come in 8 coach or 12 coach variants, with no possibility altering the number of coaches depending on customer demand.


South Western Railway have the same trains, introduced after Thameslink started with them, and are getting rid of them already.


----------



## ChrisSouth (Mar 16, 2018)

Rushy said:


> A bit controversial?



Ah, ha, yes. I'm not sure if she had a view on trans, but she comments on the tra*i*ns


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Mar 16, 2018)

CH1 said:


> Don't know about the service - but it seems to me that these Siemens trains could do with an energy audit. They seem to me to be twice as heavy as the traditional high speed British Rail electric railcar as used on services such as Kings Cross to Cambridge in 45 mins. That excess mass in itself probably uses huge surges of power on starting up (P=MA - or was when I went to school).
> 
> I also think it is a bit odd that Thameslink run so many empty trains between Brighton and Bedford or Three Bridges and Bedford during the day. Siemens trains seem to come in 8 coach or 12 coach variants, with no possibility altering the number of coaches depending on customer demand.


You know everything : )


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 22, 2018)

Maharani said:


> Milkwood reopening on March 1st


So this didn't happen and no one's been inside since the start of last month. 

Agile Rabbit is the rumour.


----------



## editor (Mar 22, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> So this didn't happen and no one's been inside since the start of last month.
> 
> Agile Rabbit is the rumour.


Their pizzas are overpriced and not particularly satisfying.


----------



## South East Girl (Mar 22, 2018)

Ms T said:


> LLewellyn’s on the other hand is booked weeks in advance. See also Naughty Piglets. Clearly there’s room for pricier offerings, but they have to be exceptional.



Naughty Piglets is my favourite London restaurant. Go there for special occasions though as it is pricey.


----------



## editor (Mar 22, 2018)

South East Girl said:


> Naughty Piglets is my favourite London restaurant. Go there for special occasions though as it is pricey.


That  infantile name puts me right off. Sounds like something a load of champers-infused public schoolboys might come up with. 

Rah rah!


----------



## Rushy (Mar 22, 2018)

South East Girl said:


> Naughty Piglets is my favourite London restaurant. Go there for special occasions though as it is pricey.


Have you tried Donostia Social Club? And did I read someone mention it had or was about to close?


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Mar 22, 2018)

I've heard Donostia is moving to Deptford. As for the old Milkwood unit, and if it's true about the Agile Rabbit, why another pizza joint in HH? No way can it top 500 Degrees for quality and price. Say no to yet more pizza outlets, what HH needs is an Asian/Indian restaurant.


----------



## alcopop (Mar 22, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> So this didn't happen and no one's been inside since the start of last month.
> 
> Agile Rabbit is the rumour.


Cool they’re cheap and good!


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (Mar 22, 2018)

Morley's fried chicken in Herne Hill given a 14 day notice by the landlord


----------



## Rushy (Mar 22, 2018)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> I've heard Donostia is moving to Deptford. As for the old Milkwood unit, and if it's true about the Agile Rabbit, why another pizza joint in HH? No way can it top 500 Degrees for quality and price. Say no to yet more pizza outlets, what HH needs is an Asian/Indian restaurant.


Agreed re pizza. And a big shame about Donostia.


----------



## choochi (Mar 22, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> So this didn't happen and no one's been inside since the start of last month.
> 
> Agile Rabbit is the rumour.


I'd heard it was Made of Dough.


----------



## Winot (Mar 22, 2018)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> Morley's fried chicken in Herne Hill given a 14 day notice by the landlord



Fucking hell. This changes everything. Is there anywhere else you can get fried chicken in south London do you know?


----------



## editor (Mar 23, 2018)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> Morley's fried chicken in Herne Hill given a 14 day notice by the landlord


Why such short notice? That's really shitty.


----------



## SpamMisery (Mar 25, 2018)

Winot said:


> Fucking hell. This changes everything. Is there anywhere else you can get fried chicken in south London do you know?



You may have to search in the thread of fake Morley's

a thread of fake Morleys


----------



## editor (Apr 5, 2018)

Something really horrible has happened by the kebab shop near the park entrance. 

Loads of police and ambulances and a guy flat out on the floor getting treatment.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Apr 6, 2018)

A man in his 40s stabbed apparently


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 6, 2018)

Jim Dickson reporting it was a fatality of a teenager.


----------



## goldengraham (Apr 6, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Jim Dickson reporting it was a fatality of a teenager.


 
Not a fatality


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 6, 2018)

Not sure about the validity of this article:

Investigation launched after man stabbed in Herne Hill amidst night of carnage - Southwark News 

Most of Station Parade / Norwood Rd / Dulwich Road was cordoned off.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 6, 2018)

goldengraham said:


> Not a fatality


Ah yes, reading error on my part.


----------



## editor (Apr 6, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Not sure about the validity of this article:
> 
> Investigation launched after man stabbed in Herne Hill amidst night of carnage - Southwark News
> 
> Most of Station Parade / Norwood Rd / Dulwich Road was cordoned off.


That's the time I went past. The poor bloke was flat on his back and I could see his feet twitching while a group of teenagers filmed him on their phones. 

It was directly outside the kebab shop which - rather inappropriately - stayed open and was busy serving a customer while the police and medics attended to the bloke about a metre away.


----------



## organicpanda (Apr 6, 2018)

goldengraham said:


> Not a fatality


or a teenager but apart from that spot on


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 9, 2018)

Stabbing in Herne Hill - Friday 6th April


----------



## editor (Apr 9, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Stabbing in Herne Hill - Friday 6th April


What the hell was going on?!



> On Friday, April 6, at approximately 00:30, police were called to a report of a stabbing in Dulwich Road, SE24.
> 
> A member of the public had been approached in nearby Railton Road by a man who had suffered an apparent stab wound to the neck. On arrival, officers traced the stabbing to a scene in Dulwich Road.
> 
> ...


----------



## editor (Apr 11, 2018)

So it seems that the Milkwood is definitely going to open as a branch of the Agile Rabbit....


----------



## choochi (Apr 11, 2018)

editor said:


> So it seems that the Milkwood is definitely going to open as a branch of the Agile Rabbit....



I’m quite pleased with that actually. I’ve heard Herne Hill is getting a Gail’s bakery in one of the refurbished shops so I’m pleased something less obviously “aspirational” is opening up to balance it out a bit.


----------



## editor (Apr 11, 2018)

choochi said:


> I’m quite pleased with that actually. I’ve heard Herne Hill is getting a Gail’s bakery in one of the refurbished shops so I’m pleased something less obviously “aspirational” is opening up to balance it out a bit.


I think the original owners (the Tulse Hill Railway lot) are still involved though. 

I wonder if they ever used that downstairs cinema?


----------



## quimcunx (Apr 11, 2018)

So how does joe bloggs get a go at the velodrome? My house guest keeps watching sport on telly and reckoning he can be the next Chris hoy/ usain bolt/ mo farah. 

gaijingirl


----------



## gaijingirl (Apr 11, 2018)

quimcunx said:


> So how does joe bloggs get a go at the velodrome? My house guest keeps watching sport on telly and reckoning he can be the next Chris hoy/ usain bolt/ mo farah.
> 
> gaijingirl



They have loads of sessions for all comers. The details are on their website.  I'm internettly challenged right now but they should be easy enough to find.


----------



## quimcunx (Apr 11, 2018)

Not for me it seems. I'll look again.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 11, 2018)

choochi said:


> I’m quite pleased with that actually. I’ve heard Herne Hill is getting a Gail’s bakery in one of the refurbished shops so I’m pleased something less obviously “aspirational” is opening up to balance it out a bit.


 Have you seen those shops behind the hoardings - it looks like Balamory.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 11, 2018)

quimcunx said:


> So how does joe bloggs get a go at the velodrome? My house guest keeps watching sport on telly and reckoning he can be the next Chris hoy/ usain bolt/ mo farah.
> 
> gaijingirl


Everything on there website seems to be 2 years ago, but there are contact details:

Cycling – London Velodrome Herne Hill

_*E-mail us*_
contact@hernehillvelodrome.co.uk

theres a bit about it on Velodrome guide: where to ride on the track in the UK  but no opening times

I heard they do an over 50s session one morning a week I think thats a just turn up thing, so they probably do others that are open to other beginners too.


----------



## Rushy (Apr 11, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Have you seen those shops behind the hoardings - it looks like Balamory.


Not a great choice of colours on my opinion. But the hairdresser opposite thinks they're great and I guess he's the one who's going to have to look at them all day.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 12, 2018)

choochi said:


> I’ve heard Herne Hill is getting a Gail’s bakery in one of the refurbished shops



Wouldn't that go against Network Rail's claimed "no chain operations" policy?


----------



## Ms T (Apr 12, 2018)

teuchter said:


> Wouldn't that go against Network Rail's claimed "no chain operations" policy?


There are conflicting rumours floating about. Mustafa who runs the coffee place in the railway tunnel and a customer of his who works for Network Rail swear blind there’ll be a Greggs and a McDonald’s. The greengrocer says all the units are being offered to independents but with short leases and no amenities included like electrics which will make them expensive to fit out. He thinks that’s deliberate so no one takes them and they can then be offered to chains.


----------



## choochi (Apr 12, 2018)

I think NR have said no national chains (I’m assuming that means things like Costa, Greggs?). Gail’s is london only I think.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 12, 2018)

choochi said:


> I think NR have said no national chains (I’m assuming that means things like Costa, Greggs?). Gail’s is london only I think.



I would contend that "national chain" is a meaningless definition. That is, there is no clear cut way of distinguishing between a chain that is "national" and one that is not. Choosing a boundary around London is basically arbitrary.


----------



## nick (Apr 12, 2018)

> So how does joe bloggs get a go at the velodrome



There are beginners sessions on a saturday.
For Old Farts (over *40*, or female,  the impudent imps !) you can also do a wednesday 9.30 am and a thursday 9.30 without accreditation. It's £10 for the hour with  a bike if you need one. I remember the Thursday is the "easier" of the 2 sessions. They are a pretty friendly bunch


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## editor (Apr 12, 2018)

nick said:


> There are beginners sessions on a saturday.
> For Old Farts (over *40*, or female, the impudent imps !) you can also do a wednesday 9.30 am and a thursday 9.30 without accreditation. It's £10 for the hour with  a bike if you need one. I remember the Thursday is the "easier" of the 2 sessions. They are a pretty friendly bunch


It's quite tricky going round the Velodrome if you go for the full banking effect. Fun though!







Good Friday Open Day at the Herne Hill Velodrome, 22nd April, 2011, south London


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## snowy_again (Apr 12, 2018)

HH's got pretty shallow banking compared to most places - much easier than any indoor modern track.  

Sometimes proves slightly iffy during the induction sessions when there's 100 people on the track and the pace lowers a bit but they don't generally let you up there until you've proved you can ride at a certain pace and don't forget to pedal.


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## nick (Apr 12, 2018)

> don't forget to pedal


This * 10.
And don't put your hands where the hoods would be on a road bike

Snowy - I suspect you know what you are doing on 2 wheels, unlike me (I don't have accredition but enjoy the old fart sessions when I'm between jobs). I had the chance to do an intro session at the Olympic velodrome - that is steep enough to give me vertigo.


----------



## Winot (Apr 13, 2018)

nick said:


> This * 10.
> And don't put your hands where the hoods would be on a road bike
> 
> Snowy - I suspect you know what you are doing on 2 wheels, unlike me (I don't have accredition but enjoy the old fart sessions when I'm between jobs). I had the chance to do an intro session at the Olympic velodrome - that is steep enough to give me vertigo.



I did this too - absolutely terrifying (and lots of fun).


----------



## SpamMisery (Apr 13, 2018)

I think the no national chains is an ok definition. It's a bit grey, but it precludes the vast majority of companies people would likely not want: Bet Fred, McDonalds, etc; and pushes it more towards independent operators (98% nationwide according to NR). Wouldn't preclude some though. Foxtons were London only for a long time weren't they? And I think only have Surrey based offices outside London.


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## sleaterkinney (Apr 15, 2018)

Llewelyn's is very very good, no trouble getting a table so maybe the fuss has died down.


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## urbanspaceman (Apr 20, 2018)

_The Herne Hill Free Film Festival returns, running throughout May. Here's the handout:_

*The Herne Hill Free Film Festival is Back in May 2018: Bringing Free Films and Help for Local People in Crisis*

The Herne Hill Free Film Festival is coming back to South London in 2018 with *21 free films this May*, across a range of venues in SE24. The festival runs from *1st May to 1st June *with a programme that includes some of the biggest and most critically acclaimed films from the past year, screenings with a strong connection to the local area and a handful of lesser known films that should be on everyone’s cinematic bucket list! 
At each event the Herne Hill Free Film Festival will be partnering with Norwood and Brixton Foodbank, to raise awareness of the great work the charity does and to bring food and support to those in need in the local area. 

*Dates: *1st May to 1st June 2018
*Venues: *Various locations around Herne Hill, SE24
*Price: *All events are free; no booking is required, but many venues are indoors and have limited capacity
*Full Programme: *www.freefilmfestivals.org/hernehill/

The festival programme creates its first (post-)impression on 1st May with the Oscar nominated *Loving Vincent *at The Lido Café, with two of the film’s producers in attendance to answer questions from the audience about this mesmerically innovative painted film. On 11th May the festival ventures outdoors as the cycling favourite *Belleville Rendez-Vous *pedals its way to the Herne Hill Velodrome, and the fun stays out for *Get Out*at the Brockwell Lido on 19th May and for the acclaimed *Three Billboards Outside Ebbing, Missouri *which is being projected onto one inflatable screen at the Judith Kerr Primary School on 25th May. 

For the sixth year the *Short Film Night*returns to The Prince Regent, and the *48 Hour Film Challenge *will also be encouraging budding directors to pop their filmmaking cherry over the first bank holiday in May. The best 3-minute masterpiece won’t just be taking home the glory of victory in 2018, as there are cash prizes on offer too for the winners! The festival is also hosting a *Work in Progress night *for the first time, to give filmmakers the chance to show their unfinished work and get feedback from the (hopefully) gentle audiences of Herne Hill, and *five filmmaking and drama workshops *will also be happening in the run-up to and during the festival. 

Festivalgoers’ appetite for documentaries should be satiated with Ai Wei Wei’s *Human Flow*, the rarely screened *Strangers in Paradise*, the acclaimed but little known *Spettacolo*, the absorbing *Wild Combination *and the ever-topical *Dispossession *which will be taking hold of audiences at Cressingham Gardens. *Instrument of Change*, a documentary about street pianos that features Herne Hill’s frequently tinkled ivories will also take centre stage at Station Square on 27th May for an outdoor evening of film and live music!

The Herne Hill Free Film Festival then closes its doors on 1 June with a screening of the critically acclaimed documentary *Being Blacker *at The Railway Tavern, featuring a Q&A with director, cinematographer and producer Molly Dineen and a wrap party at the venue’s regular reggae, ska, funk and soul night. 

*Now in its 6th year the Herne Hill Free Film Festival was established to bring film to all corners of the local community, to make the experience of cinema accessible to everyone, to support local filmmaking talent and to introduce people to films they might not otherwise cross paths with. *

*This year the Herne Hill Free Film Festival is pleased to be partnering with the Norwood and Brixton Foodbank. Donations of food will be gratefully received at all screenings, and collections taken at every film will also be donated, so local people can access the emergency food and support they need. The Herne Hill Free Film Festival is a volunteer-led community event made possible by the generous support of Pedder Property, Southeastern Rail, The Apple Tree Children’s Café, Olley’s Fish Experience, Yoga Point and Perks and White. The festival's volunteers are also grateful to all the venues for hosting screenings and to audiences for their kind donations.*

For more details visit www.freefilmfestivals.org/hernehill/
FacebookHerne Hill Free Film Festival
Twitter@HerneHillFilm
Instagramhhfreefilmfest

Schedule of Films

Date	Screening	Venue	Start Time
1 May	Loving Vincent	The Lido Café	 8:00pm
3 May	London Work in Progress Club	The Florence	7:00pm
4 May	Dispossession: The Great Social Housing Swindle	The Rotunda Hall, Cressingham Gardens	7:00pm
5 May	CoCo (Relaxed; HoH subtitled)	effraspace	2:00pm
5 May	CoCo (Relaxed; HoH subtitled)	effraspace	4:30pm
5 May	Human Flow	Yoga Point	8:00pm
7 May	Spettacolo	The Half Moon	8:00pm
11 May	Belleville-Rendezvous	The Herne Hill Velodrome	9:00pm
12 May	Queen of Katwe	Effra Early Years Centre	8:00pm
13 May	Little Shop of Horrors	Brockwell Park Community Greenhouses	9:00pm
17 May	Stranger in Paradise + Surprise Short	The Prince Regent	8:00pm
18 May	Paddington 2	Rosendale School	7:30pm
19 May	Get Out (HoH subtitled)	Brockwell Lido	9:00pm
23 May	The Good, The Bad, The Weird	Canopy Beer Co.	9:00pm
24 May	Short Film Night	The Prince Regent	8:00pm
25 May	Three Billboards (HoH subtitled)	Judith Kerr Primary School	9:00pm
27 May	Instrument of Change	Herne Hill Station Square	7:30pm
28 May	Red Turtle	Herne Hill Baptist Church	7:30pm
29 May	Wild Connection	Off the Cuff	8:00pm
31 May	Beyond the Photo	The Prince Regent	8:00pm
1 June	Being Blacker + Q&A with Molly Dineen	The Railway Tavern	7:30pm

Schedule of Workshops

Date	Screening	Venue	Start Time
28 April	Make a Film in a Day! Workshop	198 Contemporary Arts and Learning	 12:00pm
2 May	48Hr Film Competition Toolkit Workshop	The Half Moon	7:30pm
5 May	Kids Drama Workshop (before CoCo screening)	effraspace	1:30pm
5 May	Kids Drama Workshop (before CoCo screening)	effraspace	4:00pm
12 May	Girls’ Documentary Workshop	Effra Early Years Centre	2:00pm


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 20, 2018)

Yes I'm looking forward to seeing a few screening at the Regent.


----------



## Smick (Apr 21, 2018)

I’d really recommend Coco to those who are considering it. I know that Disney can churn out slick films on an annual basis, ticking all the boxes, but this one is particularly good.


----------



## editor (Apr 21, 2018)

urbanspaceman said:


> _The Herne Hill Free Film Festival returns, running throughout May. Here's the handout:_
> 
> *The Herne Hill Free Film Festival is Back in May 2018: Bringing Free Films and Help for Local People in Crisis*
> 
> ...


Buzzed: Herne Hill Free Film Festival serves up Hollywood blockbusters, documentaries and indie shorts, May 2018


----------



## snowy_again (May 2, 2018)

So Off the Cuff have bought Fish & Wine* and relaunching it as The Green Parrot - cocktails and food. 

*and the accommodation upstairs I presume.


----------



## editor (May 2, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> So Off the Cuff have bought Fish & Wine* and relaunching it as The Green Parrot - cocktails and food.
> 
> *and the accommodation upstairs I presume.


Has it opened yet? Not sure if it's the kind of thing I'm going to like, but I'll check it out.


----------



## snowy_again (May 2, 2018)

Nope - but lots of building work lately and a new sign up today. Just wonder how that (and Agile) will cope with the new Balamory type units at the end...

Milkwood definitely closed and ran - there's still dead flowers in vases / spirit bottles on shelves, which is strange as you see the bloke behind it in the Commercial often.


----------



## Rushy (May 2, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> So Off the Cuff have bought Fish & Wine* and relaunching it as The Green Parrot - cocktails and food.
> 
> *and the accommodation upstairs I presume.


I'm surprised that it's them. The sign looks and reads somewhat dated.


----------



## editor (May 2, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Nope - but lots of building work lately and a new sign up today. Just wonder how that (and Agile) will cope with the new Balamory type units at the end...
> 
> Milkwood definitely closed and ran - there's still dead flowers in vases / spirit bottles on shelves, which is strange as you see the bloke behind it in the Commercial often.


The Railway people have definitely left the building now.


----------



## snowy_again (May 2, 2018)

Well they'd left months ago, leaving that 'we're being refurbished and open again soon' sign up and the blinds down.


----------



## editor (May 2, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Well they'd left months ago, leaving that 'we're being refurbished and open again soon' sign up and the blinds down.


Yes but initially they were still going to ne involved with whatever the new venture was. But now they're not AFAIK.


----------



## snowy_again (May 2, 2018)

ah, that might explain the inexplicable hiatus.


----------



## footballerslegs (May 12, 2018)

The cladding has been taken off Herne Hill station underpass, revealing a snapshot of the 80s - including this season ticket from 88 and a couple of posters for ‘Militant Miner’.


----------



## T & P (May 12, 2018)

WTF was a capitalcard?


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## editor (May 13, 2018)

Statement from Herne Hill Society in response to Network Rail's plans to kick out the flower shop (and reportedly  offer the owner new premises at hiked up prices):



> The Herne Hill Society is very concerned to learn of Network Rail’s plan to demolish the Flower Lady shop next to Herne Hill Station. The shop occupies a prominent position and forms an important part of the attractive mix of small businesses that make up the Herne Hill “village”.
> 
> This is an area that has undergone huge improvement in recent years and the refurbishment of the Network Rail shops, once completed, will further enhance this. It seems thoroughly perverse to contemplate a development that will do damage aesthetically and commercially to the heart of Herne Hill. We are also concerned at the lack of meaningful prior consultation with the wider community. The flower shop provides a valuable local asset, the only one in the area.
> 
> It is a business that Elaine, a very active and well-respected trader and member of our community, has built up over many years. We question whether alternative sites have been fully explored. Network Rail is a key participant in the community at the heart of Herne Hill and we would expect them to fulfil that role with proper regard and care for the wider interests of all in that community.


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## brixtonblade (May 13, 2018)

editor said:


> Statement from Herne Hill Society in response to Network Rail's plans to kick out the flower shop (and reportedly  offer the owner new premises at hiked up prices):


I think that's a good statement 

It's a shame it's needed though ... Network Rail don't seem to be getting any better at listening to what the communities they work in want


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## Crispy (May 13, 2018)

They are under pressure to squeeze every last penny from their assets. Community be damned.


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## Ms T (May 13, 2018)

Crispy said:


> They are under pressure to squeeze every last penny from their assets. Community be damned.


I’ve heard it’s because they need a generator to provide power to the new units. Not sure what they did before??


----------



## CH1 (May 13, 2018)

T & P said:


> WTF was a capitalcard?


I used them. It was a British Rail London rail pass with bus and tube added - pretty much the same as a (paper) TFL Travelcard is now.

Was quite a progressive step considering what went before - Lord Denning striking down Livingstone's Fare's Fair scheme then the abolition of the GLC. I suppose there must have been stalwarts of integrated ticketing lurking in the bowels of BR and LT who managed to push the Capital Card through.


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## Crispy (May 14, 2018)

Ms T said:


> I’ve heard it’s because they need a generator to provide power to the new units. Not sure what they did before??


More likely a substation. It may well be the case that the old units were under-supplied and the new expanded ones will need more power than the local infrastructure can provide. They're quite big - 4x5m with ventilation requirements.


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## editor (May 15, 2018)

People on FB are really fucked off about this. Network Rail are the worst.

Opposition grows to Network Rail’s plan to demolish the Flower Lady shop in Herne Hill


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## Nanker Phelge (May 15, 2018)

editor said:


> People on FB are really fucked off about this. Network Rail are the worst.
> 
> Opposition grows to Network Rail’s plan to demolish the Flower Lady shop in Herne Hill



It's a bloody ruthless onslaught....just chuck people out, with an offer of something more expensive, with no regard for the years of business built up at that location....it's shit.


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## Ms T (May 15, 2018)

Elaine is a Herne Hill treasure and a force to be reckoned with. I don’t think Network Rail know what they’re up against!


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## snowy_again (May 16, 2018)

More on the hidden signs: Under the arches – ghost signs of London


----------



## Maggot (May 16, 2018)

Perks and White, the independent coffee shop in Herne Hill station are looking for a manager. I don't have any details but you can email rob@perksandwhite.com if you're interested.


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## friendofdorothy (May 16, 2018)

Crispy said:


> More likely a substation. It may well be the case that the old units were under-supplied and the new expanded ones will need more power than the local infrastructure can provide. They're quite big - 4x5m with ventilation requirements.


Isn't there room for a substation next to the tracks or elsewhere in the station or all those tunnels?


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## friendofdorothy (May 16, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> More on the hidden signs: Under the arches – ghost signs of London


Great posters. I wonder if the late Commie Bill - ex 'miner' was responsible for posting the Save the Pits posters? or it could have been L&G Support the Miners (as featured in the film Pride) as some of them lived around here.


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## Rushy (May 19, 2018)

Elaine the Flower Lady pointed me towards this petition to Network Rail asking them to reconsider their decision to knock down her shop and build a power substation on it...

Petition SAVE The Flower Lady & The Old Victorian Coal House From Demolition


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## Ms T (May 19, 2018)

Thanks for that link. I hadn’t got round to looking for it.


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## editor (May 21, 2018)

Please sign! Petition launched to save the Flower Lady shop in Herne Hill


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## friendofdorothy (May 21, 2018)

1132 signatures so far! We love our flower lady, she _is_ Herne Hill.


----------



## editor (May 21, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> 1132 signatures so far! We love our flower lady, she _is_ Herne Hill.


Brixton Buzz sent around a 100 people to the petition site today already, which makes me chuffed. It would be a real shame if Network Rail get to destroy even more local character.


----------



## T & P (May 22, 2018)

Given how much dead space there is alongside train tracks, in particular around stations and railway junctions, I cannot believe that they cannot place the transformer somewhere along the tracks within the footprint of HH station. Looking at a satellite image of the line around the station, lack of space is clearly not the issue.

There might be a technical or logistical reason i’m not aware of, but I suspect it’s just to do with a higher cost to NR.


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## teuchter (May 22, 2018)

The substation is to service the rental units not railway operations. And NR's property arm is being lined up for a sell-off. So that is probably one reason NR don't want it alongside the tracks.


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## Rushy (May 23, 2018)

Good point.


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## snowy_again (May 24, 2018)

Some good (?) news:

 

"Network Rail have just confirmed that they will no longer be pursuing the Flower Lady premises as a potential site for the sub-station.  We are waiting to hear where else they are looking at...."


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## gaijingirl (May 24, 2018)

Hurrah!!  I'd be nervous if I were the hardware shop though - or anyone else in HH atm.


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## Rushy (May 24, 2018)

gaijingirl said:


> Hurrah!!  I'd be nervous if I were the hardware shop though - or anyone else in HH atm.


I don't think their building is owned by NR. Great news. And hats off to them to stepping back so quickly.


----------



## T & P (May 24, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Some good (?) news:
> 
> 
> 
> "Network Rail have just confirmed that they will no longer be pursuing the Flower Lady premises as a potential site for the sub-station.  We are waiting to hear where else they are looking at...."



That is superb news!


----------



## T & P (May 24, 2018)

In other HH news, the Half Moon has won a ‘Best London Pub’ award... 

Herne Hill's Half Moon named best pub in London - Southwark News


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 24, 2018)

T & P said:


> In other HH news, the Half Moon has won a ‘Best London Pub’ award...
> 
> Herne Hill's Half Moon named best pub in London - Southwark News


by who? (sorry I cant read the link) not by camra surely.


----------



## T & P (May 24, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> by who? (sorry I cant read the link) not by camra surely.


‘The National Pub Awards’ but not clear who created that award tbh...


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 24, 2018)

T & P said:


> ‘The National Pub Awards’ but not clear who created that award tbh...


sounds suspect to me. The moon is ok - bit corporate but better than no pub at all.

It's shiney, very expensive, doesn't have much atmosphere and the service is hit and miss. I wouldn't give it any awards yet.


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## Rushy (May 24, 2018)

I really like it - apart from the crazy prices.


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## SpamMisery (May 24, 2018)

Lovely pub tbf


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## brixtonblade (May 24, 2018)

It's pretty soulless.  It's fine and it's good that it has rooms to hire but it's nothing special.


----------



## T & P (May 24, 2018)

The front room (being listed and all) is lovely, but tables at the back are pretty meh, and the restaurant area is nothing to write home about. Admittedly one visit is not enough to fully show a restaurant’s potential but when I ate there recently both the menu choices and the meal I had were little more than adequate.

Overall there’s nothing wrong with it but I struggle to believe it is the best in Greater London.


----------



## editor (May 25, 2018)

brixtonblade said:


> It's pretty soulless.  It's fine and it's good that it has rooms to hire but it's nothing special.


Indeed. Apart from the original front room, the rest is a fairly bland, middle-class gastro-pub with little real character to make it stand out from a host of other similar pubs. It's pleasant enough if that's the kind of thing you're into, I guess. It's pricey too, so that makes it more exclusive than many boozers.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (May 25, 2018)

i suppose it is subjective but without actually having been in there i would imagine my opinion of it would be that it isn't even the best in the area, let alone the whole of greater London.

The fact that Fullers run it, makes me immediately avoid it due to the outrageous prices for a pint of beer they like to charge. 

But who knows, perhaps for people who are able to spend around £40 on a couple of burgers and chips along with 1 pint each this pub is like a temple to indulge in this frivolous lifestyle, but there are enough of those pubs to go around these day i reckon.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (May 25, 2018)

Was this prize given by Yummy Mummy Weekly?


----------



## aka (May 25, 2018)

Nanker Phelge said:


> Was this prize given by Yummy Mummy Weekly?


As a long-time subscriber to that periodical, I'm doubtful.


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## Nanker Phelge (May 25, 2018)

Sorry, it's monthly, not weekly....


----------



## editor (May 25, 2018)

A history piece about Herne Hill : 

Herne Hill history – Edwardian postcards, a long-lost cinema and horse drawn traffic






I still can't get a definite date for when the Grand Cinema opened...


----------



## teuchter (May 25, 2018)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> without actually having been in there i would imagine my opinion of it would be



Internet discussion boards encapsulated


----------



## editor (Jun 1, 2018)

Incoming!



> Independent craft beer retailer Two Heads Beer Co is lining up two more sites. The company has made offers on outlets in Surbiton in Surrey and Herne Hill in south London as it looks to add to its six-strong portfolio.
> 
> The company, which is led by former BrewDog head of retail acquisitions James Hickson, is currently aiming to raise £350,000 on crowdfunding platform Crowdcube to open four sites. Hickson said of the two potential new venues: “Both fit the bill in terms of location, size and demographics. While we are at the offer stage only, we are confident we’ll be able to secure at least one of these sites for the business.
> 
> ...


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 1, 2018)

So paying £30k pa for a three year lease and taking on full fit out costs.


----------



## Crispy (Jun 1, 2018)

Must be one of the Railton Road units


----------



## urbanspaceman (Jun 8, 2018)

_Passing this on:_


The Herne Hill Society and the Brockwell Park Community Partners proudly present:

*The Thomas Lynn Bristowe Memorial Lecture*

*Saturday 9 June, 7:45pm*

*“The Honourable Member for Norwood”* *by Helen Hayes MP*

Venue: *In the Baptist Church, Half Moon Lane*_._ _Free - all welcome - no ticket needed_

We are delighted that *Helen Hayes*, our Member of Parliament, has agreed to give the Thomas Lynn Bristowe Memorial Lecture. She will speak about being an MP for this constituency in the early 21st century, contrasted with Bristowe’s experience as the first MP for the 19th-century Norwood Division.

In the 1880s, the huge Blades Blackburn estate at Herne Hill was put up for sale for housing. Local MP Thomas Lynn Bristowe led a campaign to buy it as a public park. He even guaranteed the money needed to secure its purchase. In 1891 his campaign was successful and Brockwell Park was created.

_This event is organised by the Herne Hill Society and Brockwell Park Community Partners.  _


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## snowy_again (Jun 29, 2018)

HH is getting an ice cream parlour... Home


----------



## editor (Jun 29, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> HH is getting an ice cream parlour... Home


Not an ice cream parlour. It's a _gelateria_, doncha know. Serving 'craft ice cream' with staff not getting the London Living Wage.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 29, 2018)

You're a bit twitchy aren't you. 

I used to work for Criterion Ices in Sydenham in the 80s - that was a "gelateria" back then - it's not a trendy phrase - gelato is not the same as ice cream (it's made differently, has different ratios of ingredients etc.), but then you know that.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Jun 29, 2018)

"craft ice cream"? Much like beer, I thought that all ice cream was crafted, i.e made.


----------



## editor (Jun 29, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> You're a bit twitchy aren't you.
> 
> I used to work for Criterion Ices in Sydenham in the 80s - that was a "gelateria" back then - it's not a trendy phrase - gelato is not the same as ice cream (it's made differently, has different ratios of ingredients etc.), but then you know that.


Twitchy?    But when have you ever heard of "craft ice cream" before?


----------



## editor (Jun 29, 2018)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> "craft ice cream"? Much like beer, I thought that all ice cream was crafted, i.e made.


It's just hipsters bollocks-speak. I get an in-box full of the same shite every day, but at least the fella has managed to omit the word 'vibrant' from his website. That said, if he was setting up in Pop Brixton, I'm sure it would be extremely vibrant.


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## alcopop (Jun 29, 2018)

gelateria - Wiktionary


----------



## editor (Jun 29, 2018)

alcopop said:


> gelateria - Wiktionary


What point are you hoping to achieve here? Everyone knows what the word means.


----------



## Angellic (Jun 29, 2018)

editor said:


> Not an ice cream parlour. It's a _gelateria_, doncha know. Serving 'craft ice cream' with staff not getting the London Living Wage.



Really good gelato is, well, really good but craft ice cream is a scoop too far.


----------



## T & P (Jun 29, 2018)

I don’t think many people give much of a toss about the language businesses use to describe/ promote themselves anyway. Ultimately It’s nothing more than a source of mild amusement/ bemusement. It certainly would have no bearing on my feelings about a given business opening up locally.

Not sure how successful their location will prove to be though. These days most people don’t need to use the ticket office, and at HH you don’t need to walk through the ticketing hall to access the platforms...


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## friendofdorothy (Jul 2, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> HH is getting an ice cream parlour... Home


ooo! I like quality icecream


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## friendofdorothy (Jul 2, 2018)

editor said:


> Not an ice cream parlour. It's a _gelateria_, doncha know. Serving 'craft ice cream' with staff not getting the London Living Wage.


They are offering £9 plus free ice - which is a lot better than minimum wage and alot better than most people working in the care sector. If I was still working in a care home I might have applied for this job. 
How may shops/bars/restraunts pay London Living wage? I'm all in favour of LLW and more people getting it, but we need more jobs too.


----------



## editor (Jul 2, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> They are offering £9 plus free ice - which is a lot better than minimum wage and alot better than most people working in the care sector.


Sorry but 'free ice' is hardly a bonus to shout about.


friendofdorothy said:


> I'm all in favour of LLW and more people getting it, but we need more jobs too.


I'm all for bosses pocketing less for themselves and big fat earners getting taxed more.


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## friendofdorothy (Jul 2, 2018)

editor said:


> Sorry but 'free ice' is hardly a bonus to shout about.
> I'm all for bosses pocketing less for themselves and big fat earners getting taxed more.



I think all big multi national profit making business should be forced to pay a proper living wage and proper tax, instead of relying on taxpayers to top up their poor employees incomes. All profitable /big business should be able to pay above minimum.  Sniping at small local businesses is a waste of my time.


----------



## editor (Jul 2, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> I think all big multi national profit making business should be forced to pay a proper living wage and proper tax, instead of relying on taxpayers to top up their poor employees incomes. All profitable /big business should be able to pay above minimum.  Sniping at small local businesses is a waste of my time.


I don't think it's 'sniping' to comment on new businesses not paying the Living Wage. Are you saying it shouldn't even be mentioned just because they're a small business?

I don't believe it should it be swept under the carpet, regardless of the size of the business. The more people (and employees) who know about the Living Wage - and the reasons behind it - the better. And free ice creams don't pay the bills.


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## Gramsci (Jul 2, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> I think all big multi national profit making business should be forced to pay a proper living wage and proper tax, instead of relying on taxpayers to top up their poor employees incomes. All profitable /big business should be able to pay above minimum.  Sniping at small local businesses is a waste of my time.



I disagree. A lot of people work in SMEs. What you are saying here is that only big multinationals ( who are making a profit) should pay LLW.

When the New Labour government brought in minimum wage ( I'm no fan of Blair but early New Labour deserve credit for this) it was across the board for all business. Rightly so as otherwise a lot of people would not get it. They didn't say only applies to big multinationals.

Leaving aside how to assess who is profitable ( Uber is multinational yet still doesn't make profit) if an entrepreneurs initial business plan doesnt factor in LLW as a business cost and that business would not be viable if it did its pretty rubbish plan imo.


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## T & P (Jul 2, 2018)

Perhaps we should compile and publish as a stickie in the forum a list of all the businesses in Brixton and surrounding areas that are known or believed to avoid paying the LLW.

Or perhaps not. But if we’re to highlight the fact that a particular business moving to the area is not paying the LLW, it seems fairest to allow forum readers to inform themselves about others that also don’t pay it. In particular when a number of such businesses get very a favourable treatment.

I’m all for discussing and promoting support for protests/ boycotts for companies whereby the workers are fighting for the LLW, such as the Ritzy btw. But as for the majority that are not currently experiencing such dispute, ether we diss them all or none at all imo.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

T & P said:


> Perhaps we should compile and publish as a stickie in the forum a list of all the businesses in Brixton and surrounding areas that are known or believed to avoid paying the LLW.
> 
> Or perhaps not. But if we’re to highlight the fact that a particular business moving to the area is not paying the LLW, it seems fairest to allow forum readers to inform themselves about others that also don’t pay it. In particular when a number of such businesses get very a favourable treatment.
> 
> I’m all for discussing and promoting support for protests/ boycotts for companies whereby the workers are fighting for the LLW, such as the Ritzy btw. But as for the majority that are not currently experiencing such dispute, ether we diss them all or none at all imo.


I disagree. I think it's entirely reasonable to ask if a new business that's moving into the area pays their staff the Living Wage or not. I'm struggling to think why anyone could possibly object to that. I haven't called for a boycott or 'dissed' the company or its products.


----------



## shakespearegirl (Jul 3, 2018)

I don't think it is unreasonable to ask any company if they pay LLW, whether an existing business or a new comer. At least that way people can choose to prioritise using businesses that do pay it.


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## alcopop (Jul 3, 2018)

shakespearegirl said:


> I don't think it is unreasonable to ask any company if they pay LLW, whether an existing business or a new comer. At least that way people can choose to prioritise using businesses that do pay it.


Maybe  a dedicated thread should be started?


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

alcopop said:


> Maybe  a dedicated thread should be started?


Are you unable to use the 'start new thread' button or something? 

If you do manage to start the thread, I'll look forward to seeing the in-depth research you'll no doubt put in first, although I expect anything you post will be as drearily agenda-driven as always.


----------



## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

shakespearegirl said:


> I don't think it is unreasonable to ask any company if they pay LLW, whether an existing business or a new comer. At least that way people can choose to prioritise using businesses that do pay it.


People who care about it should have an informed choice, yes.  And I suspect if we knew all the facts it would severely limit the places those that care can shop in. Including cutting out a lot of the smaller independent businesses that have been here for years and many of the larger convenience stores that pile it high and sell it affordably.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

discobastard said:


> People who care about it should have an informed choice, yes.  And I suspect if we knew all the facts it would severely limit the places those that care can shop in. Including cutting out a lot of the smaller independent businesses that have been here for years and many of the larger convenience stores that pile it high and sell it affordably.


How many times are you going to answer the same post?


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## brixtonblade (Jul 3, 2018)

I do like the idea that I remember seeing here of a window sticker that LLW paying firms can put up


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## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

editor said:


> How many times are you going to answer the same post?


Would you like to expand on that?

I think I understand it as sarcasm but, just for clarity.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

discobastard said:


> Would you like to expand on that?
> 
> I think I understand it as sarcasm but, just for clarity.


Actually, sorry, I mistook you for alcopop which is understandable given that you often have much the same 'personalised' approach whenever responding to any discussion I'm involved in.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

*Sorry I was posting my England comments there! Just moved them to the right thread.


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 3, 2018)

discobastard said:


> People who care about it should have an informed choice, yes.  And I suspect if we knew all the facts it would severely limit the places those that care can shop in. Including cutting out a lot of the smaller independent businesses that have been here for years and many of the larger convenience stores that pile it high and sell it affordably.



What shakespearegirl said was "prioritise" business that pay Living Wage. Not cut them out. That is unrealistic.

As you are so interested in this subject Lidl is supermarket store in Brixton and Stockwell that pays Living Wage.

I take it you will use Lidl not Tescos in Acre Lane from now on?

I don't use Tescos in Acre Lane as Lidl is the supermarket alternative that pays Living Wage.

That is example of realistic option. I can prioritise using Lidl.


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## shakespearegirl (Jul 3, 2018)

It could become a type of kite mark, like Buy British. Something you’d chose over the alternative for the benefit it gave to people/community/country... perhaps something you be prepared to pay a premium for


----------



## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> What shakespearegirl said was "prioritise" business that pay Living Wage. Not cut them out. That is unrealistic.
> 
> As you are so interested in this subject Lidl is supermarket store in Brixton and Stockwell that pays Living Wage.
> 
> ...


Fair enough. ‘Cut out’ is maybe the wrong phrase. Let’s say difficult choices for those that are principled. 

I don’t live in Brixton I live in Tulse Hill and about 90% of my weekly shopping is done in the Co-op, who I know took steps to increase wages two years ago. They also have put quite a bit of funds into the Norwood Food Bank which I think is great. 

It does seem that certain small startup businesses do however get a disproportionate amount of grief on here when discussing this kind of issue, while others get barely a mention. 

A business in Brixton (beer thread) that *does* pay the LLW is being vilified for taking a minority investment that will allow it in turn to take on more local employees at presumably LLW rates. Just spotting some contradictions I’m trying to understand.  

Can’t see anything too objectionable about that point.  Maybe others can.


----------



## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

editor said:


> Actually, sorry, I mistook you for alcopop which is understandable given that you often have much the same 'personalised' approach whenever responding to any discussion I'm involved in.


No worries. 

Of course some of my responses are personalised. I’m responding to the views of others. Is that not ok?


----------



## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

shakespearegirl said:


> It could become a type of kite mark, like Buy British. Something you’d chose over the alternative for the benefit it gave to people/community/country... perhaps something you be prepared to pay a premium for


I genuinely think that’s a great idea.  The challenge will always be the fact that it will undoubtedly come at a premium. Like green energy tariffs. But at least people will have a choice.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

discobastard said:


> It does seem that certain small startup businesses do however get a disproportionate amount of grief on here when discussing this kind of issue, while others get barely a mention.


Do they really? So which new small startup businesses have been given some sort of green card on this issue on these boards? And can you name them?

And let's talk about this "disproportionate amount of grief" comment. What is the nature of this "disproportionate amount of grief" that has supposedly been dished out to *any* business in this thread? Back up your claims please.



discobastard said:


> A business in Brixton (beer thread) that *does* pay the LLW is being vilified for taking a minority investment that will allow it in turn to take on more local employees at presumably LLW rates. Just spotting some contradictions I’m trying to understand.
> 
> Can’t see anything too objectionable about that point.  Maybe others can.


Completely irrelevant. That discussion was about whether a business could still claim to be an independent brewery when they've flogged off 49% of their company to the second biggest brewery in the world, who have an annual revenue in the many billions. It's clearly an issue because one shop now refuses to stock their beer because they don't feel that they are truly independent.

No one criticised them for their pay rates because that wasn't the fucking topic under discussion. 

(*the 49% is writ large because saying 'minority investment' paints an entirely different picture.)


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 3, 2018)

shakespearegirl said:


> It could become a type of kite mark, like Buy British. Something you’d chose over the alternative for the benefit it gave to people/community/country... perhaps something you be prepared to pay a premium for



I see what you mean but for me paying premium isn't always that feasible.

I also use the Phone Coop as my internet provider. They are accredited Living Wage employer. Have been for some time. They arent imo any more expensive than other big companies.

Same with Lidl. Its not that expensive compared to other big supermarkets.

Living Wage should not have to mean paying a premium. If the two companies above can do it why can't others?. One is small (Phone Coop) and one big (Lidl). They both are successful business.

Another small company I use is Skoob bookshop. A very small concern who pay Living Wage.


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## Gramsci (Jul 3, 2018)

discobastard said:


> The challenge will always be the fact that it will undoubtedly come at a premium. Like green energy tariffs. But at least people will have a choice.



Wrong. See post above.


----------



## Smick (Jul 3, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> Same with Lidl. Its not that expensive compared to other big supermarkets.



I’ve always found Lidl to be quite a bit less expensive than the others. It’s where I do 90% of my shopping, the other 10% being at Waitrose when they’ve knocked down their prices on short date items. I believe that they treat their staff well also.


----------



## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

editor said:


> Do they really? So which new small startup businesses have been given some sort of green card on this issue on these boards? And can you name them?
> 
> And let's talk about this "disproportionate amount of grief" comment. What is the nature of this "disproportionate amount of grief" that has supposedly been dished out to *any* business in this thread? Back up your claims please.
> 
> ...


It all your thoughts are compartmentalised into different threads and every issue exists in isolation then you may have been doing this too long. 

Let’s shut this discussion down and forget the complexities.


----------



## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> Wrong. See post above.


Ok. Wrong in some cases. That’s fine!


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

discobastard said:


> It all your thoughts are compartmentalised into different threads and every issue exists in isolation then you may have been doing this too long.
> 
> Let’s shut this discussion down and forget the complexities.


Why don't you address the points you just brought up?

You claimed that some some new start up small businesses have been given an easy ride here.
Well, which ones are they?

You also claimed that others had received a  "disproportionate amount of grief".
Could you name them and give examples of all this "grief" they received please?


----------



## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

editor said:


> Why don't you address the points you just brought up?
> 
> You claimed that some some new start up small businesses have been given an easy ride here.
> Well, which ones are they?
> ...


Don’t worry. If you can’t remember all the small businesses on the Brixton board that have received significant grief then I can’t help you.


----------



## editor (Jul 3, 2018)

discobastard said:


> Don’t worry. If you can’t remember all the small businesses on the Brixton board that have received significant grief then I can’t help you.


This is the Herne Hill thread. If you're unable to back up your earlier claims just say so.


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## discobastard (Jul 3, 2018)

editor said:


> This is the Herne Hill thread. If you're unable to back up your earlier claims just say so.


Poor show.


----------



## teuchter (Jul 4, 2018)

shakespearegirl said:


> It could become a type of kite mark, like Buy British. Something you’d chose over the alternative for the benefit it gave to people/community/country...



Problem is, it doesn't necessarily capture how good an employer they are. The wage is only one part of how well staff are treated somewhere. What kind of rosters are they expected to work to, what other benefits do or don't they get, workload and so on.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 4, 2018)

teuchter said:


> Problem is, it doesn't necessarily capture how good an employer they are. The wage is only one part of how well staff are treated somewhere. What kind of rosters are they expected to work to, what other benefits do or don't they get, workload and so on.


True , but I'd rather know than not.


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## editor (Jul 4, 2018)

brixtonblade said:


> True , but I'd rather know than not.


I really can't see any possible objection to asking if a newly arrived business is paying the Living Wage or not. I'm not demanding people boycott the place, but it's good to see where they stand on this issue amongst all the on-trend PR guff and media that inevitably accompanies a new launch.


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## shakespearegirl (Jul 4, 2018)

As I said earlier, it would be good to know if ALL businesses are paying LLW. Doesn't matter if they are new, old, local or national.


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## editor (Jul 4, 2018)

shakespearegirl said:


> As I said earlier, it would be good to know if ALL businesses are paying LLW. Doesn't matter if they are new, old, local or national.


You can look on their website and find out. You'll find it a VERY disappointingly short listing  for central Herne Hill - as it not just two, both Oxfam bookshops (although that doesn't mean some businesses not on the scheme may not be paying the equivalent, or more, of course - although I'm not too hopeful on that score) .


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 4, 2018)

That will only tell you people who have registered their business as a LLW provider on that site.

The same lack of reporting applies to Brixton, where the 4 banks are recorded, and then the UK & London Community Foundations are obviously there. Pretty much nothing else - in an area where there's a higher density of SMEs and larger businesses.

So basically, that data means nothing.


----------



## editor (Jul 4, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> That will only tell you people who have registered their business as a LLW provider on that site.
> 
> The same lack of reporting applies to Brixton, where the 4 banks are recorded, and then the UK & London Community Foundations are obviously there. Pretty much nothing else - in an area where there's a higher density of SMEs and larger businesses.
> 
> So basically, that data means nothing.


Why wouldn't you register if you were a LLW provider?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 4, 2018)

Perhaps you don't know there's a scheme/site to record it on, perhaps you don't have the time to be constantly updating websites, perhaps its less important than a hundred and one other things... 

The site only records 1600 london businesses or charities etc who pay it, which is less than the actual number


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## shakespearegirl (Jul 4, 2018)

To be fair, my business pays the LLW and I haven't got around to registering yet! We aren't a consumer facing business though and it is onn my long list of things to do.


----------



## editor (Jul 4, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Perhaps you don't know there's a scheme/site to record it on, perhaps you don't have the time to be constantly updating websites, perhaps its less important than a hundred and one other things...
> 
> The site only records 1600 london businesses or charities etc who pay it, which is less than the actual number


What is the actual number?


----------



## Ms T (Jul 4, 2018)

editor said:


> You can look on their website and find out. You'll find it a VERY disappointingly short listing  for central Herne Hill - as it not just two, both Oxfam bookshops (although that doesn't mean some businesses not on the scheme may not be paying the equivalent, or more, of course - although I'm not too hopeful on that score) .


The Oxfam shops are run by volunteers, so it’s presumably Oxfam in general that pays the LLW.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 4, 2018)

editor said:


> What is the actual number?



Sorry - a bit like the people who don't have the time to register their LLW on the LLW site, I've not got the time to dig through and find the exact number again. 

Their twitter's here if you want to ask them: Living Wage Foundation (@LivingWageUK) on Twitter


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## alex_ (Jul 4, 2018)

teuchter said:


> Problem is, it doesn't necessarily capture how good an employer they are. The wage is only one part of how well staff are treated somewhere. What kind of rosters are they expected to work to, what other benefits do or don't they get, workload and so on.



It’s a pretty good start though.

I’d imagine on the Venn diagram of awful employers and LLW payers there isn’t much  intersection.

There is obviously a big difference between awful employers and awful companies.

Alex


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## Gramsci (Jul 4, 2018)

Ms T said:


> The Oxfam shops are run by volunteers, so it’s presumably Oxfam in general that pays the LLW.



Up to a point. The criticism I have of sections of the voluntary sector is that not all are what I would call volunteers.

I know someone ( unemployed)  whose worked "voluntarily" in various charity shops or get his benefits sanctioned. This includes Oxfam.

Shop managers are often paid workers.

There is grey area in charity sector of who really qualifies as "voluntary" worker.


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## Gramsci (Jul 4, 2018)

Ms T said:


> The Oxfam shops are run by volunteers, so it’s presumably Oxfam in general that pays the LLW.



And good thing those volunteers put all that work in so Oxfam workers can fund party life in other countries.


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 4, 2018)

teuchter said:


> Problem is, it doesn't necessarily capture how good an employer they are. The wage is only one part of how well staff are treated somewhere. What kind of rosters are they expected to work to, what other benefits do or don't they get, workload and so on.



If a business wants to become an accredited Living Wage employer they will ask about for example use of zero hours contracts.




> Accreditation does not include any specific requirements on contract types. However, we will not accredit if there are any concerns about exploitative working practices.
> 
> While zero hours contracts can provide flexibility that works for employers and employees alike, it has been widely reported that the use of zero hours contracts has increased, and in some cases they are being abused. We advise that our employers continually review and manage the use of zero hours contracts and discuss whether there are more suitable options available with staff. Please look to the CIPD's guidance on best practice.



FAQs | Living Wage Foundation

Its a difficult balancing act. The Living Wage Foundation is a NGO that's been successful campaigning group.

How far should they go in adding additional rights to workers?

Keeping it straight forward to a Living Wage for employees money per hour is right tactic imo.

Its not something that can be easily disputed. Its rational estimate of what an hours wages should be to live a life not just survive. To be able to participate in society not spend all ones time worrying about how to pay basic bills.

Even then I've seen it disputed here. Ie t the Living Wage Foundation must have a political agenda or that people should talk to employers however "distasteful" that is.

Living Wage Foundation simple straightforward message that hourly pay should be set at rationally set amount shows what right wing bollox any criticism of it is. Right wing bollix masquerading as man of the world fairness.


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## alex_ (Jul 4, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> Up to a point. The criticism I have of sections of the voluntary sector is that not all are what I would call volunteers.
> 
> I know someone ( unemployed)  whose worked "voluntarily" in various charity shops or get his benefits sanctioned. This includes Oxfam.
> 
> ...



They also don’t pay business rates.


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## alex_ (Jul 4, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> And good thing those volunteers put all that work in so Oxfam workers can fund party life in other countries.



Yes, how could their execs in Haiti pay for so many hookers without all the hours that volunteers put in ?


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## teuchter (Jul 4, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> If a business wants to become an accredited Living Wage employer they will ask about for example use of zero hours contracts.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I'm not sure if you are saying that my pointing out that it doesn't necessarily capture how good an employer is, amounts to "right wing bollox".

I'm not criticising what the Living Wage Foundation does; I'm saying there's limitations to what the accreditation can tell you. Yes it's good to set a figure on some kind of rational basis that is higher than the minimum wage, and it's good to give companies an incentive to pay that.

I see that Lidl isn't accredited by the way. Why's that - is it because of other employment policies they apply? The knowledge that they pay the living wage influences your decision to shop with them, but is it at the expense of other aspects of their employees' employment deals?

Earlier today I was looking at a website where employees rate their employers. Tesco for example gets a better rating than Lidl. 

Lidl Reviews | Glassdoor.co.uk

I don't know really if these ratings are representative. But it's always a problem if you pick out one aspect of something; focus on that can distract from other questions. I'm sure the Living Wage Foundation are very aware of this and do what they can to mitigate it. Doesn't mean it's not a problem though.


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## editor (Jul 5, 2018)

Full on Morris Dancing action around Herne Hill tonight!







Tonight! Brixton Tatterjacks Morris dancers on the loose in Herne Hill from 7.30pm, Thurs 5th July


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## Gramsci (Jul 5, 2018)

teuchter said:


> I'm not sure if you are saying that my pointing out that it doesn't necessarily capture how good an employer is, amounts to "right wing bollox".
> 
> I'm not criticising what the Living Wage Foundation does; I'm saying there's limitations to what the accreditation can tell you. Yes it's good to set a figure on some kind of rational basis that is higher than the minimum wage, and it's good to give companies an incentive to pay that.
> 
> ...



Im not at all clear what you want me to support.

I often get the impression I get seen here as some kind of out of touch leftie ( not how I see myself) . So I support Living Wage Foundation moderate demands and now I'm not at radical enough.

See your banned so will leave it at this.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jul 6, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> Im not at all clear what you want me to support.
> 
> I often get the impression I get seen here as some kind of out of touch leftie ( not how I see myself) . So I support Living Wage Foundation moderate demands and now I'm not at radical enough.
> 
> See your banned so will leave it at this.



I don't see you as an out of touch leftie....


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jul 6, 2018)

Most of this LLW debate, interesting as it, is isn't about Herne Hill.

I have shopped local in Herne Hill and Brixton whenever I can. Yes I shop in Lidl, but I also shop in Sainsburys just because its nearby. I purposely avoid shopping with Amazon and I dislike shopping on line in general. 

For years - even when I've had very little money, I made sure I did my best to support local small shops and businesses. There were more empty shops than not in Herne Hill when I first moved here and it was quiet, dull and bleak, with very sense of community or stuff going on. Now all the units are full, there's a market, there's a film festival and life on the street.  I've never been able to drive and I value having places near by where I can shop easily, where I might see people I know and bump into my neighbours, it helps me feel at home here.

and I'm looking forward to some quality ice cream soon.


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## Gramsci (Jul 6, 2018)

On Lidl. Appears they are paying Living Wage. According to Living Wage Foundation website. It does appear they haven't gone through the whole accreditation process.

Lidl to become first supermarket to pay Living Wage | Living Wage Foundation

Interesting YouGov article on how there reputation has gone up. So paying Living Wage can do company good.

YouGov |  Lidl’s pay increase should play well with consumers

Not being "accredited" is an issue. Looks like Lidl didn't go through whole process.


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## snowy_again (Jul 7, 2018)

The LLW page has a whole heap of business economic arguments for paying LLW or the regional equivalent. Intentionally their campaign focus is on FTSE 250 companies and large employers like local authorities.

Despite the stupid tabloid oxfam bashing posted earlier, third sector orgs are over represented on the current accredited list here: Living Wage Employers by Region | Living Wage Foundation compared to smes or big corps / public bodies. 

They don’t lobby cottage industries like the one which prompted this sudden interest in HH. When I last spoke to them (my employer pays LLW and I only take grant funding from people who do too), they were clear that start up businesses should aim for LLW but as a mid term goal, not a reason to not to start or employ anyone at all. That’s a more strategic, experienced campaigners approach based on what works to deliver system change over glib soundbites.

 We shouldn’t confuse LLW accreditation as a wider sign of ethical business - there’s a whole bunch of LLW payers who I wouldn’t touch with a barge pole; from the likes of top 4 management consultancies (KPMG etc) to big pharma like GSK. They amongst other people I wouldn’t share a pint with sit on the LLW advisory board as I think I’ve said before.

So as usual, we’ve focussed on one small new cottage business and not asked why our loacal authority, the shops we frequent or the pubs promoted on this site don’t even meet the salary he’s offering.


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## friendofdorothy (Jul 7, 2018)

I've started a Living Wage thread in politics if anyone is interested. Can we stop the debate here unless its Herne Hill related.


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## friendofdorothy (Jul 7, 2018)

alcopop said:


> Maybe  a dedicated thread should be started?


done.


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## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2018)

Wrong edit.


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## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> So as usual, we’ve focussed on one small new cottage business and not asked why our loacal authority, the shops we frequent or the pubs promoted on this site don’t even meet the salary he’s offering.



Lambeth does and it makes sure its contractors do as far as I know. The Brixton Rec is managed by GLL/ Better and it does in Lambeth. Including cleaners.

This is the "whataboutery" argument.


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> We shouldn’t confuse LLW accreditation as a wider sign of ethical business - there’s a whole bunch of LLW payers who I wouldn’t touch with a barge pole; from the likes of top 4 management consultancies (KPMG etc) to big pharma like GSK. They amongst other people I wouldn’t share a pint with sit on the LLW advisory board as I think I’ve said before. this



I never have.

What I say is that Living Wage is straightforward issue.

People work they should get living wage.

That's not glib.

Its not about being ethical. Its about real life.

It might be ok for you to go on about KMPG etc and complain. But  back in the real world having LLW as ones hourly rate means a big deal.


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> Despite the stupid tabloid oxfam bashing posted earlier, third sector orgs are over represented on the current accredited list here: Living Wage Employers by Region | Living Wage Foundation compared to smes or big corps / public bodies.
> 
> .




Oxfam warned it could lose European funding over scandal



> The potential threat to humanitarian funds came as Penny Lawrence, who was international programmes director when concerns about sexual misconduct were first reported, quit saying she was “ashamed” at what had happened.
> 
> She admitted that allegations about paying for sex relating to Roland van Hauwermeiren, the country director for Chad, and members of his team there had been raised internally before he moved to Haiti, but not handled properly.



"Stupid tabloid bashing" 

So you don't think it's serious issue?


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> The LLW page has a whole heap of business economic arguments for paying LLW or the regional equivalent. Intentionally their campaign focus is on FTSE 250 companies and large employers like local authorities.



According to this report half accredited Living Wage business are SMEs



> This report focuses on the Living Wage and its implementation by small and medium-sized
> enterprises (SMEs) across the UK. Whilst the spotlight in recent years has largely been on
> large Living Wage employers (corporations and public sector institutions), very little is
> known about the operational and strategic decisions made about the Living Wage by SMEs.
> ...


----------



## T & P (Jul 8, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> Lambeth does and it makes sure its contractors do as far as I know. The Brixton Rec is managed by GLL/ Better and it does in Lambeth. Including cleaners.
> 
> This is the "whataboutery" argument.


AFAIAC ‘the whataboutery’ is not an unreasonable or invalid line of discussion at all. The only possible reason in my view to mention that an incoming business does not pay the LLW is surely to highlight that fact as a negative, and suggest to prospective customers who read this forum that they could consider spending their money elsewhere. That’s not something I have a problem with btw.

But if in the same forum other businesses that also are said to fail to pay the LLW are given a free ride if not actually promoted on a regular basis, then questioning the consistency of such behaviour is more than perfectly valid, and by no means necessarily motivated by agendas, beef or anything suchlike.

I think most of us have so much of a good time in pubs, bars and clubs we are prepared to cut those who don’t pay the LLW far more slack than we would to other businesses. Therefore I don’t think it’s very fair to highlight the fact that a certain business like the ice cream guys moving into HH does not pay the LLW while others that are also guilty of it are constantly given a free ride here.

In fact, one could argue that chain pubs and bars that are part of big breweries/ companies that have far more capital and financial security than the likes of small ice cream companies should be the first target of any LLW campaigns, before small businesses could me too the spotlight .


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2018)

T & P said:


> AFAIAC ‘the whataboutery’ is not an unreasonable or invalid line of discussion at all. The only possible reason in my view to mention that an incoming business does not pay the LLW is surely to highlight that fact as a negative, and suggest to prospective customers who read this forum that they could consider spending their money elsewhere.
> 
> But if in the same forum other businesses that also are said to fail to pay the LLW are given a free ride if not actually promoted on a regular basis, then questioning the consistency of such behaviour is more than perfectly valid, and by no means necessarily motivated by agendas, beef or anything suchlike.
> 
> ...



Ive covered this issue in post 2220.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jul 8, 2018)

Living wage thread is here, Living Wage

Can we not have this thread descend into a bunfight as well?


----------



## Rushy (Jul 8, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> they were clear that start up businesses should aim for LLW but as a mid term goal, not a reason to not to start or employ anyone at all.



Was this advice from the London Living Wage Foundation themselves?


----------



## CH1 (Jul 26, 2018)

Ever keen to achieve community improvement by leading people up the garen path - and taking several years to do so, how about this:

1. Battle of the Parks - Cllr Gym Dickson apparently promised £50,000 to both Ruskin Park and Milkwood Park from the same section 106 contribution. Promises like this to two partners led to breach of promise actions in Victorian times  Friends of Ruskin Park criticise Lambeth Council after expected £51,000 in funding goes to nearby park

2. Lambeth have at long last launched a consultation on providing an Outdoor Gym in Milkwood Park  Survey Login

In a way I am happy. Gym Dickson has nicked an idea me and Mrs Magpie had to rejuvenate the tired old Car Wash outside the barrier block.

By the looks of it the council have managed to find a "partner" keen to provide non-traditional and more expensive exercise equipment for Milkwood Park. Hope pensioners or young people will still be able to use it like they do on Southwark's more traditional equipment in Burgess Park and Peckham Rye.

Meanwhile  Coldharbour Councillor Emma Nye can rest at ease - the Coldharbour Car Wash (of which Lambeth Council owns the freehold)  will still be available for a luxury private redevelopment when she returns to work after her 6 month maternity leave.


----------



## editor (Jul 26, 2018)

CH1 said:


> Meanwhile  Coldharbour Councillor Emma Nye can rest at ease - the Coldharbour Car Wash (of which Lambeth Council owns the freehold)  will still be available for a luxury private redevelopment when she returns to work after her 6 month maternity leave.


I'm dreading the plans.


----------



## ChrisSouth (Jul 26, 2018)

CH1 said:


> Ever keen to achieve community improvement by leading people up the garen path - and taking several years to do so, how about this:
> 
> 1. Battle of the Parks - Cllr Gym Dickson apparently promised £50,000 to both Ruskin Park and Milkwood Park from the same section 106 contribution. Promises like this to two partners led to breach of promise actions in Victorian times  Friends of Ruskin Park criticise Lambeth Council after expected £51,000 in funding goes to nearby park
> 
> ...



Why are you retelling a story from 2015? Quiet news day?


----------



## CH1 (Jul 26, 2018)

ChrisSouth said:


> Why are you retelling a story from 2015? Quiet news day?


For some reason I got a consultation email from Lambeth about it.
Not that I live in Milkwood Road or even in Herne Hill Ward
Lambeth Consultations

On reflection I see this is part of a pot pourri including "Extension of the Public Spaces Protection Order for Novel Psychoactive Substances", "Have your say on: Lambeth's Sexual Health Pharmacy Service Redesign", "Have your say on: Waterloo Works! Pre-planning application consultation"

and the piece de resistance -
*Consultation drop-in sessions*
Do you need assistance when completing one of the council’s online consultations? Or don’t have access to a tablet, smartphone or computer, then feel free to come along to one of our drop-in sessions, where we can offer you help and the use of one of our devices.
Find out more about Consultation drop-in sessions


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jul 29, 2018)

We don't get much rain....


----------



## Ms T (Jul 29, 2018)

Agile Rabbit opened last night and is offering 50% off food for the first week. They’re also doing live music, mostly jazz.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 2, 2018)

Has the new ice cream place opened yet - there was still an opening soon notice there when I last went past a couple of weeks ago?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 2, 2018)

Ms T said:


> Agile Rabbit opened last night and is offering 50% off food for the first week. They’re also doing live music, mostly jazz.


Is it a bar or or a restraunt? what sort of clientele go there? 

Is it just me or does Agile Rabbit seem like a weird name?


----------



## editor (Aug 2, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Is it a bar or or a restraunt? what sort of clientele go there?
> 
> Is it just me or does Agile Rabbit seem like a weird name?


If it's anything like the Brixton one, it'll be a licensed pizza place serving decidedly average and over-priced pizzas.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Aug 2, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Is it a bar or or a restraunt? what sort of clientele go there?
> 
> Is it just me or does Agile Rabbit seem like a weird name?



Nope it's deeply weird...


----------



## Ms T (Aug 2, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Has the new ice cream place opened yet - there was still an opening soon notice there when I last went past a couple of weeks ago?



They were offering free ice-cream at the weekend (Saturday I think).  Massive queue!


----------



## alcopop (Aug 2, 2018)

The prices are perfectly reasonable really


----------



## editor (Aug 2, 2018)

alcopop said:


> The prices are perfectly reasonable really


Have you eaten one? I've eate there several times and they've always been very average for the price.


----------



## editor (Aug 2, 2018)

alcopop said:


> The prices are perfectly reasonable really


Oh wait, here's the rest of that menu that you 'accidentally' forgot to include:


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 2, 2018)

The HH one is a grill as well isn't it? They've changed the layout a little from the terrible Milkwood. 

But then that site is generally doomed - Milkwood was awful, Jazz on the Hill - didn't bother, The Poet - pfft, Escape Bar was fun but then got itself into trouble.


----------



## gaijingirl (Aug 2, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Has the new ice cream place opened yet - there was still an opening soon notice there when I last went past a couple of weeks ago?



yes - I had a gelato there last week and treated my kids to one too.  I found it a bit too sweet for my taste and I think the youngest did too as she didn't finish hers.  The older girl loved hers though and they had lovely flavours - elderflower, passionfruit and there was a special that day that involved peanut butter.


----------



## editor (Aug 2, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> The HH one is a grill as well isn't it? They've changed the layout a little from the terrible Milkwood.
> 
> But then that site is generally doomed - Milkwood was awful, Jazz on the Hill - didn't bother, The Poet - pfft, Escape Bar was fun but then got itself into trouble.


I liked the Escape Bar. Nice and down to earth and you can get far better pizzas around the corner. But yes, it's a tough site. That said, isn't Off The Cuff doing alright now?


----------



## Crispy (Aug 2, 2018)

editor said:


> isn't Off The Cuff doing alright now


Always looks busy when I go by and they have live music 5 nights a week (DJs fri/sat)


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 2, 2018)

Nice and down to earth if you were involved in illegal drugs trade (which is part of its demise) and music license infringements you mean?! 

I really like 500 degrees* - but their flour doesn't agree with me for some reason - they're also a different style of pizza than Agile - but around the same price. The restaurant's a bit hot and claustrophobic though - some of their other branches are a bit comfier.  

OTC - yes, the live music seems to be going ok - partly as lots of local people are involved in some way or another. Overpriced beer still etc. Can't say they really helped with their support at the new Fish & Wine place though, which is still Mary Celeste.  

*I'm assuming you're not referring to Pizza Express.


----------



## editor (Aug 2, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> *I'm assuming you're not referring to Pizza Express.


Of course not. The appeal of that chain totally eludes me.


----------



## cuppa tee (Aug 2, 2018)

editor said:


> Oh wait, here's the rest of that menu that you 'accidentally' forgot to include:View attachment 142905


Artichoques lol


----------



## Ms T (Aug 3, 2018)

cuppa tee said:


> Artichoques lol


Not quite sure where that spelling came from!


----------



## cuppa tee (Aug 3, 2018)

Ms T said:


> Not quite sure where that spelling came from!


.....from the menu posted above in #2234


----------



## Ms T (Aug 3, 2018)

cuppa tee said:


> .....from the menu posted above in #2234


I meant their spelling!  It's not even French or Italian for artichoke.


----------



## cuppa tee (Aug 3, 2018)

Ms T said:


> I meant their spelling!  It's not even French or Italian for artichoke.


It's either a faux pas de Del Boy or a little known strain of franglais unique to the colline d'herne......I'm guessing the latter


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 3, 2018)

Ms T said:


> They were offering free ice-cream at the weekend (Saturday I think).  Massive queue!


  must go check it out, but I hate queues.


----------



## editor (Aug 3, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> must go check it out, but I hate queues.


#havecake #eatit


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 3, 2018)

#eh?


----------



## editor (Aug 3, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> #eh?


#wantfreethings #butdon'twanttoqueue

#moononstick

#backfiringjoke


----------



## cuppa tee (Aug 3, 2018)

editor said:


> #havecake #eatit


----------



## Ms T (Aug 3, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> must go check it out, but I hate queues.



Probably won't be a big queue now as no longer free!


----------



## T & P (Aug 3, 2018)

Ms T said:


> Probably won't be a big queue now as *no longer free!*


Disgraceful


----------



## aka (Aug 3, 2018)

cuppa tee said:


>



oooh - I used to work with one of the Mekons.  Kevin - lovely chap.  25 years ago.


----------



## teuchter (Aug 3, 2018)

Ms T said:


> I meant their spelling!  It's not even French or Italian for artichoke.


This is a quintessentially Herne Hill post.


----------



## SpamMisery (Aug 3, 2018)

Good God, what was that track?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 3, 2018)

Ms T said:


> Probably won't be a big queue now as no longer free!


Oh good.  I didn't even notice that you had said it was free in your first post.


----------



## Mitch (Aug 5, 2018)

Ms T said:


> They were offering free ice-cream at the weekend (Saturday I think).  Massive queue!


They got through it quick and the ice cream was great!



Ms T said:


> Agile Rabbit opened last night and is offering 50% off food for the first week. They’re also doing live music, mostly jazz.


So pleased this place has re-opened - have you been and is it good?

Re. Cafe Prov the staff can be slow / forgetful but the place is lovely, the food is great, and everyone's friendly.

Recent addition to the forums here and hoping to be a permanent fixture. I'm a Herne Hill local who lives about 2 minutes away from Brockwell Park - I work as a freelancer in film & TV, currently looking for a canine companion in between jobs if anyone is in need of a FREE dog sitter / walker!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 6, 2018)

Welcome Mitch 

I'm sure you'll soon meet all the local dogs and their people if you hang out in the many doggie friendly pubs/ cafes and walk in the park.


----------



## Mitch (Aug 6, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Welcome Mitch
> 
> I'm sure you'll soon meet all the local dogs and their people if you hang out in the many doggie friendly pubs/ cafes and walk in the park.


Thanks FOD - glad to be here.

The Parlour has been a joy to hang out in recently with this weather - everyone apparently has a dog when it turns summer.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 6, 2018)

Mitch said:


> Thanks FOD - glad to be here.
> 
> The Parlour has been a joy to hang out in recently with this weather - everyone apparently has a dog when it turns summer.


Perhaps they borrow them too?

Whats so good about the Parlour then? never actually been there as I'm not sure I'm the target market - tbf I'm not the target market anywhere these days and rarely go anywhere that's not a pub.


----------



## Ms T (Aug 23, 2018)

I’ve tried a couple of flavours from the new ice cream place - very nice and at £3 a pop an affordable treat - not much more than a Mr Whippy these days, which really is sweet, and made of milk powder, oil and air!


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 23, 2018)

And there's loads of bad palm oil in Whippy type ice cream to hide the absence of other milk fat... 

They're quite generous with their tasting spoons I've noticed!


----------



## sleaterkinney (Aug 23, 2018)

There's a burst water main beside the park, where they were doing roadworks.


----------



## editor (Sep 7, 2018)

Next week: ‘Colour by Numbers’ world record attempt to take place in Herne Hill, Weds 12th Sept


----------



## editor (Sep 17, 2018)

For those who like to plan really early


----------



## T & P (Sep 22, 2018)

Finally tried the ice cream place. Really good stuff!


----------



## Smick (Sep 29, 2018)

Ms T said:


> I’ve tried a couple of flavours from the new ice cream place - very nice and at £3 a pop an affordable treat - not much more than a Mr Whippy these days, which really is sweet, and made of milk powder, oil and air!


When I went, it did sting a bit having to pay £9 for three of their small ice creams. I had told the kids they were going and thought they might have something a bit cheaper for kids. It may be Herne Hill, but it’s still just a hatch in a railway ticket hall.


----------



## editor (Sep 29, 2018)

Smick said:


> When I went, it did sting a bit having to pay £9 for three of their small ice creams. I had told the kids they were going and thought they might have something a bit cheaper for kids. It may be Herne Hill, but it’s still just a hatch in a railway ticket hall.


Ouch. That is fucking expensive.


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 29, 2018)

It was £2 last week. Will go and check


----------



## T & P (Sep 29, 2018)

Smick It might be a hatch in a railway ticket hall but that is irrelevant to the price; the quality of their products is what matters (in particular since it is a take-away outlet rather than a eat-in venue) and the wares certainly are many orders of magnitude better than those found inside a Mr Whippy van.

So it is not surprising their prices are going to be higher than the stuff that comes wrapped in foil or spurts out of a tap. Their prices are on a par with those of other sellers of quality hand made ice creams.


----------



## Smick (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> Smick It might be a hatch in a railway ticket hall but that is irrelevant to the price; the quality of their products is what matters (in particular since it is a take-away outlet rather than a eat-in venue) and the wares certainly are many orders of magnitude better than those found inside a Mr Whippy van.
> 
> So it is not surprising their prices are going to be higher than the stuff that comes wrapped in foil or spurts out of a tap. Their prices are on a par with those of other sellers of quality hand made ice creams.


Yeah, it’s probably my fault for not researching it. I’d say it’s not the place for bringing kids.


----------



## Ms T (Sep 30, 2018)

editor said:


> Ouch. That is fucking expensive.


A Mr Whippy is £2.50.


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

Ms T said:


> A Mr Whippy is £2.50.


You don't think charging £3 for a _small ice cream_ for a child is expensive?


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> Smick It might be a hatch in a railway ticket hall but that is irrelevant to the price; the quality of their products is what matters (in particular since it is a take-away outlet rather than a eat-in venue) and the wares certainly are many orders of magnitude better than those found inside a Mr Whippy van.
> 
> So it is not surprising their prices are going to be higher than the stuff that comes wrapped in foil or spurts out of a tap. Their prices are on a par with those of other sellers of quality hand made ice creams.


Death by expensive artisans!


----------



## Ms T (Sep 30, 2018)

editor said:


> You don't think charging £3 for a _small ice cream_ for a child is expensive?


A small ice cream is a small ice cream, regardless of who it's for.


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

Ms T said:


> A small ice cream is a small ice cream, regardless of who it's for.


So you don't think three quid is a lot to ask for a small ice cream served up from a hatch in a railway station subway?

And please don't trot out the 'occasional treat' line.


----------



## Ms T (Sep 30, 2018)

editor said:


> So you don't think three quid is a lot to ask for a small ice cream served up from a hatch in a railway station subway?
> 
> And please don't trot out the 'occasional treat' line.



I think it's a fair price for a high-quality product when a Mr Whippy costs £2.50, as does a latte in most places.  It's not in the subway btw.


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

Ms T said:


> I think it's a fair price for a high-quality product when a Mr Whippy costs £2.50, as does a latte in most places.  It's not in the subway btw.


Nine quid for three small ice creams for kids? Nice for those who can afford it then.

Not sure why you keep quoting Mr Whippy when you get far cheaper - and some quite decent* - ice creams from many nearby shops and supermarkets.

*in my opinion although the artisanista will no doubt quibble


----------



## T & P (Sep 30, 2018)

editor said:


> Death by expensive artisans!


 Virtually every supermarket and convenience store in Herne Hill will sell cheaper ice cream. Do you actually have an issue with the existence of an outlet offering better quantity products that cost more money?


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> Virtually every supermarket and convenience tore in Herne Hill will sell cheaper ice cream. Do you actually have an issue with the existence of an outlet offering better quantity products that cost more money?


Perhaps you should read my posts again instead of trying to manufacture an argument. I commented that £9 for three small ice creams is expensive. And I stand by that. I don't think it's a particularly outrageous opinion.


----------



## T & P (Sep 30, 2018)

editor said:


> Perhaps you should read my posts again instead of trying to manufacture an argument. I commented that £9 for three small ice creams is expensive. And I stand by that.


It’s expensive in the same way as a bottle of semi-decent Rioja priced at £7 is compared to a supermarket’s entry level own label bottle of Tempranillo priced at £3. Or a Byron quarter pounder burger at £8 next to a £3.50 Big Mac.

Needless say there are plenty of people who cannot afford the former and have to often if not always opt for latter options. That of course sucks balls, but a person who chooses a Byron burger over a McDonalds is not more of spoilt gourmet than someone who enjoys a hand made ice cream is an ‘artisanista’.


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> Needless say there are plenty of people who cannot afford the former and have to often if not always opt for latter options. That of course sucks balls, but a person who chooses a Byron burger over a McDonalds is not more of spoilt gourmet than someone who enjoys a hand made ice cream is an ‘artisanista’.


Again, allow me to point out that it is the company themselves who choose to describe themselves as 'artisans.'

And, frankly, I don't think we can get enough artisans moving into the area.  Artisans for all, say I!  (well, those who can afford them)

Altogether now: 

"Artisans to the left of me,
Artisans to the right, here I am,
Stuck in the middle with artisans.....


----------



## sealion (Sep 30, 2018)




----------



## sealion (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> Smick It might be a hatch in a railway ticket hall but that is irrelevant to the price; the quality of their products is what matters (in particular since it is a take-away outlet rather than a eat-in venue) and the wares certainly are many orders of magnitude better than those found inside a Mr Whippy van.
> 
> So it is not surprising their prices are going to be higher than the stuff that comes wrapped in foil or spurts out of a tap. Their prices are on a par with those of other sellers of quality hand made ice creams.


It's a pile of sugar what ever way you dress it up.


----------



## T & P (Sep 30, 2018)

sealion said:


> It's a pile of sugar what ever way you dress it up.


Yep. In the same way as Tesco Value red wine and the best bottle of red wine in the world are just fermented grape juice. No real difference in quality or taste, it's all all PR bullshit.


----------



## Smick (Sep 30, 2018)

I said it was expensive and I stand by that. But the prices were clearly labelled and I chose to buy it anyway. Promising primary school age kids ice cream, I should have checked it out first. It might not have stung so much had there even been a seat to sit and eat it. 

The kids would have been happier with a McFlurry, but if I had gone alone or with another adult, I probably would have happily paid it. 

I don’t think the Whippy comparison stands as that sticks in my fucking throat every time I am caught for those. Paying some degenerate £2.50 for whipped vegetable oil and sugar from a mobile salmonella breeding ground. If people see value in that then it’s easy to make the leap that £3 for craft is too. But both of them are overpriced.


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

Only on gentrified urban can people argue that a £3 small ice cream for a small child that's served in the street isn't actually expensive.

The artisans must be defended! The Occasional Treat must live on!


----------



## sealion (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> Yep. In the same way as Tesco Value red wine and the best bottle of red wine in the world are just fermented grape juice. No real difference in quality or taste, it's all all PR bullshit.


Some comparison that


----------



## T & P (Sep 30, 2018)

sealion said:


> Some comparison that


No different to yours.


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 30, 2018)

editor said:


> Only on gentrified urban can people argue that a £3 small ice cream for a small child that's served in the street isn't actually expensive.
> 
> The artisans must be defended! The Occasional Treat must live on!


Small? My one last week had to be eaten in two sittings.


----------



## sealion (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> No different to yours.


I never mentioned quality or taste, you just did. Sugar is sugar, ask a kid weather they want an organic artisan ice cream or one from the local shop, i think i know the answer to that.


----------



## T & P (Sep 30, 2018)

sealion said:


> I never mentioned quality or taste, you just did.


 That's exactly how "It's a pile of sugar what ever way you dress it up" reads to me. It doesn't make much sense if you had meant something different.



> Sugar is sugar, ask a kid weather they want an organic artisan ice cream or one from the local shop, i think i know the answer to that.


 Ice cream is not eaten just by children


----------



## sealion (Sep 30, 2018)

T & P said:


> That's exactly how "It's a pile of sugar what ever way you dress it up" reads to me. It doesn't make much sense if you had meant something different.
> 
> Ice cream is not eaten just by children


Okay, Sugar is sugar it kills adult the same as kids, it's all the fucking same  Happy now ?


----------



## brixtonblade (Sep 30, 2018)

Smick said:


> I said it was expensive and I stand by that. But the prices were clearly labelled and I chose to buy it anyway. Promising primary school age kids ice cream, I should have checked it out first. It might not have stung so much had there even been a seat to sit and eat it.
> 
> The kids would have been happier with a McFlurry, but if I had gone alone or with another adult, I probably would have happily paid it.
> 
> I don’t think the Whippy comparison stands as that sticks in my fucking throat every time I am caught for those. Paying *some degenerate *£2.50 for whipped vegetable oil and sugar from a *mobile salmonella breeding ground*. If people see value in that then it’s easy to make the leap that £3 for craft is too. But both of them are overpriced.


Er... Just people doing a job

Agree its pricey but your post is OTT


----------



## Smick (Sep 30, 2018)

brixtonblade said:


> Er... Just people doing a job
> 
> Agree its pricey but your post is OTT


Ah come on, those vans down by the back of Brockwell Park are awful. So expensive and the product is shockingly bad. They have a quasi captive market and someone, somewhere, or maybe it’s just another of Lambeth’s revenue
lines, is making a fortune off it. 

When I described the operators as degenerates, I had one in mind. Duncan Bannatyne. I’m sure the guy in the van in Brockwell isn’t the owner and probably earns bugger all, spends his days in a cramped Transit with his back bent and the sound of a Diesel engine plaguing him.

The vans are filthy though, that Whippy ice cream can melt and refreeze numerous times, and I almost always refuse to allow my kids to get anything from them.


----------



## madolesance (Sep 30, 2018)

Smick said:


> Ah come on, those vans down by the back of Brockwell Park are awful. So expensive and the product is shockingly bad. They have a quasi captive market and someone, somewhere, or maybe it’s just another of Lambeth’s revenue
> lines, is making a fortune off it.
> 
> When I described the operators as degenerates, I had one in mind. Duncan Bannatyne. I’m sure the guy in the van in Brockwell isn’t the owner and probably earns bugger all, spends his days in a cramped Transit with his back bent and the sound of a Diesel engine plaguing him.
> ...



Stopped my kids from buying ice cream if you can it that from those vans around Brockwell with the Diesel engines constantly running. The kids understand and are happy to go without.
Don’t the cafe in the park have the monopoly of these vans? 
Would be great if the next ice cream sales around the park where up for tender, an environmental impact was taken into account regarding who could trade.
For the moment though, people need to go else where. There’s better frozen treats available in the area.


----------



## Smick (Sep 30, 2018)

madolesance said:


> Stopped my kids from buying ice cream if you can it that from those vans around Brockwell with the Diesel engines constantly running. The kids understand and are happy to go without.
> Don’t the cafe in the park have the monopoly of these vans?
> Would be great if the next ice cream sales around the park where up for tender, an environmental impact was taken into account regarding who could trade.
> For the moment though, people need to go else where. There’s better frozen treats available in the area.


Is it the cafe who run those vans? The cafe could store scoop ice cream there and do one of those three wheel bikes that you see, replenish throughout the day. There’s no excuse for them to be running Diesel vans right beside the playpark.

As long as I’m not with the kids on my own, I’d just go out to the corner shop at the bottom of Tulse Hill and pick up a few Fabs.


----------



## Rushy (Sep 30, 2018)

I think I've read that power points are being installed for the vans in Brockwell.


----------



## Ms T (Sep 30, 2018)

I got an ice cream from the Brockwell Park cafe at the country show. I think it was more expensive than the kiosk in the station.


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

Ms T said:


> I got an ice cream from the Brockwell Park cafe at the country show. I think it was more expensive than the kiosk in the station.


They must have ripped you off because I definitely did not pay £3+ for my ice cream. But at least you get a seat and a table there, indoors or out.


----------



## editor (Sep 30, 2018)

sealion said:


> I never mentioned quality or taste, you just did. Sugar is sugar, ask a kid weather they want an organic artisan ice cream or one from the local shop, i think i know the answer to that.


I always find it funny when rich people dress up their two year olds in the most expensive designer  clobber and trainers, like the kid is going to notice the difference - and the kid will most likely grow out of it within a few months.


----------



## MissL (Oct 1, 2018)

Smick said:


> I said it was expensive and I stand by that. But the prices were clearly labelled and I chose to buy it anyway. Promising primary school age kids ice cream, I should have checked it out first. It might not have stung so much had there even been a seat to sit and eat it.
> 
> The kids would have been happier with a McFlurry, but if I had gone alone or with another adult, I probably would have happily paid it.
> 
> I don’t think the Whippy comparison stands as that sticks in my fucking throat every time I am caught for those. Paying some degenerate £2.50 for whipped vegetable oil and sugar from a mobile salmonella breeding ground. If people see value in that then it’s easy to make the leap that £3 for craft is too. But both of them are overpriced.



I would happily see these bastards banned from floating around outside Brockwell Park playground. Or at least be made to park at least 50 metres away.


----------



## Rushy (Oct 1, 2018)

MissL said:


> I would happily see these bastards banned from floating around outside Brockwell Park playground. Or at least be made to park at least 50 metres away.


Haha. 50m would not outsmart the toddler ice cream radar!


----------



## MissL (Oct 1, 2018)

Rushy said:


> Haha. 50m would not outsmart the toddler ice cream radar!



True


----------



## T & P (Oct 1, 2018)

Hey, at least those diesel-scented foul ice cream vans don't use the wrong noun to describe themselves. That's by far the worst crime of them all


----------



## Rushy (Oct 1, 2018)

T & P said:


> Hey, at least those diesel-scented foul ice cream vans don't use the wrong noun to describe themselves. That's by far the worst crime of them all


Well they use the term "ice cream" rather loosely. 

(I don't mind a Mr Whippy myself, sans diesel engine preferably)


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

Smick said:


> I don’t think the Whippy comparison stands as that sticks in my fucking throat every time I am caught for those. Paying some degenerate £2.50 for whipped vegetable oil and sugar from a mobile salmonella breeding ground. If people see value in that then it’s easy to make the leap that £3 for craft is too. But both of them are overpriced.


 I blame Thatcher. Before she took to ruining my young adult life and laying waste to the north, she was a food scientist, ruining our fucking ice cream. She has a lot to answer for.

I love quality ice cream - something with actual cream in it, or at least full fat milk. It's a different thing all together from veg fat+skimmed powder+emulsifiers+crap that gets sold as ice cream.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

editor said:


> And please don't trot out the 'occasional treat' line.


In my opinion, ice cream of any kind is the very definition of a 'treat'.


----------



## editor (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> In my opinion, ice cream of any kind is the very definition of a 'treat'.


FYI: The '_occasional treat_' line refers to the oft-trotted out line in defence of hugely expensive, rent-increasing gentrifying restaurants and cocktail bars arriving in historically poor areas.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

editor said:


> FYI: The '_occasional treat_' line refers to the oft-trotted out line in defence of hugely expensive, rent-increasing gentrifying restaurants and cocktail bars arriving in historically poor areas.


yes I know, I know I've heard it so often before.  My occasional treat comment refers to the fact that it is indeed an occasional treat.  Do you have no sense of humour anymore?


----------



## editor (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> My occasional treat comment refers to the fact that it is indeed an occasional treat.  Do you have no sense of humour anymore?


Apparently not


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

editor said:


> ...historically poor areas.


Not sure Herne Hill was historically poor, depends how historic you are being, well not that poor and not for the 30 years I've lived nearby.


----------



## editor (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Not sure Herne Hill was historically poor, depends how historic you are being, well not that poor and not for the 30 years I've lived nearby.


I was referring to how new expensive things were being justified generally.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

editor said:


> Apparently not


shall I buy you an ice cream to cheer you up then? go on its a nice treat...


----------



## editor (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> shall I buy you an ice cream to cheer you up then? go on its a nice treat...


Got some very tasty, reasonably priced (but non artisan) in the freezer thanks. And it's deelish with strawberries.


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 1, 2018)

When it comes down to trivial issues the usual suspects spend a lot of time taking pops at Ed.

Serious issues like planning application on CHL no interest.

Its easy on internet to have knee jerk reactions. Serious issues no. To much time to read.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

editor said:


> Got some very tasty, reasonably priced (but non artisan) in the freezer thanks. And it's deelish with strawberries.


vegan?


----------



## Rushy (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> vegan?


I bought a tub of chocolate ice cream the other day. It was lovely. Kind of moussey. Only realised after i'd finished it that it was vegan. Made with nuts. Cashews iirc.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> When it comes down to trivial issues the usual suspects spend a lot of time taking pops at Ed.
> 
> Serious issues like planning application on CHL no interest.


Well Ed spends a lot of time taking trivial pops at new businesses in HH. There are plenty of other threads for general gentrification chat rows.

And last time I checked CHL is definity off topic for a Herne Hill thread.


----------



## editor (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Well Ed spends a lot of time taking trivial pops at new businesses in HH. There are plenty of other threads for general gentrification chat rows..


Look back through this thread. I merely agreed with the opinion that £9 for three small ice creams for kids is expensive. And then the pile-on began.


----------



## sealion (Oct 1, 2018)

Rushy said:


> I bought a tub of chocolate ice cream the other day. It was lovely. Kind of moussey. Only realised after i'd finished it that it was vegan. Made with nuts. Cashews iirc.


Swedish glaze by any chance? It's a dairy free range and bloody lovely, not sickly either!


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Well Ed spends a lot of time taking trivial pops at new businesses in HH. There are plenty of other threads for general gentrification chat.
> 
> And last time I checked CHL is definity off topic for a Herne Hill thread.



You spend a lot of time taking pops at Ed. This is Brixton forum you know. 

So sorry I am straying onto Herne hill. Is this a postcode issue? I can't comment as I'm in wrong postcode?

Btw what is the vegan issue? 

My partner is vegan and she isn't that we'll off. Veganism is quite good option for the low paid.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

editor said:


> Look back through this thread. I merely agreed with the opinion that £9 for three small ice creams for kids is expensive. And then the pile-on began.


So you don't want one then?


----------



## editor (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> So you don't want one then?


What's the matter with you tonight?


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> So you don't want one then?



Have you nothing better to do tonight?


----------



## Rushy (Oct 1, 2018)

sealion said:


> Swedish glaze by any chance? It's a dairy free range and bloody lovely, not sickly either!


Not that. Funky chunky monkey or something. Can't remember! Swedish Glaze sounds like an offer I might find in my spam folder .


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 1, 2018)

I think I will go back to read up on planning reports for CHL


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> You spend a lot of time taking pops at Ed. This is Brixton forum you know.
> 
> So sorry I am straying onto Herne hill. Is this a postcode issue? I can't comment as I'm in wrong postcode?
> 
> ...


no you are welcome. I'll get you an ice cream too if you like. I wonder if they do vegan ones? I've only had vegan Ice crean once and it was lush, but horendously expensive (but it was ok as someone else paid).


----------



## sealion (Oct 1, 2018)

Rushy said:


> Not that. Funky chunky monkey or something.


Will look out for that.


Rushy said:


> Swedish Glaze sounds like an offer I might find in my spam folder


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

editor said:


> What's the matter with you tonight?


 I'm feeling in a generous mood. 



Gramsci said:


> Have you nothing better to do tonight?


 No

See you both down the ice cream shop at the weekend then?


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> no you are welcome. I'll get you an ice cream too if you like. I wonder if they do vegan ones? I've only had vegan Ice crean once and it was lush, but horendously expensive (but it was ok as someone else paid).



Most vegan stuff for sale is overpriced. As assumed its better off that "aspire" to it. Veganism is becoming more mainstream. Vegan home made food is actually quite cheap.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

Does anyone go in the commercial these days?
I've got out of the habit, though we did go there a few weeks ago and it seemed ok.


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> I'm feeling in a generous mood.
> 
> No
> 
> See you both down the ice cream shop at the weekend then?



I will be volunteering at the Grove Adventure playground this weekend.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 1, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> Most vegan stuff for sale is overpriced. As assumed its better off that "aspire" to it. Veganism is becoming more mainstream. Vegan home made food is actually quite cheap.


Most home made food can be cheap.


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Most home made food can be cheap.



Im not saying you are actually saying this but veganism is no longer preserve of sandle wearing Guardian reader middle classes.

This programme on veganism mentioned black British people who have adopted veganism as part of way of not being ruled by dominant society. 

BBC Radio 4 - The Food Programme, Young and Vegan


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## Ms T (Oct 1, 2018)

Swedish Glacé is the non-dairy stuff which I hear is nice. 

I also like proper ice-cream and occasionally make it myself but it’s a bit of a faff to make custard. Hence I welcome the new ice-cream kiosk for the occasional frozen treat. 

I think I’ve had it twice since it opened.


----------



## Ms T (Oct 1, 2018)

Gramsci said:


> Most vegan stuff for sale is overpriced. As assumed its better off that "aspire" to it. Veganism is becoming more mainstream. Vegan home made food is actually quite cheap.


I think some vegan stuff like vegan cheese is made of cashews which are quite pricey.


----------



## Ms T (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Does anyone go in the commercial these days?
> I've got out of the habit, though we did go there a few weeks ago and it seemed ok.


Me too.  Haven’t been to the Regent either.  We have been away for a few weeks.


----------



## Smick (Oct 1, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Does anyone go in the commercial these days?
> I've got out of the habit, though we did go there a few weeks ago and it seemed ok.


I went in on Saturday lunchtime. It was fairly quiet if I’m honest. I had a pint of Camden Pale and they gave it to me in a fairly cool glass which was wider and shorter than normal. It’s a nice pub, nice inside and friendly staff. Nothing special though.


----------



## gaijingirl (Oct 2, 2018)

.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 4, 2018)

*Labour party / Trade Union liasion meeting - 
Monday 8 October at 7.30pm					 

						 Garden Room, Florence Pub, 131 Dulwich Road, SE24 0N* 

					 More below. I'm hoping to go along, mostly to hear this bit:*  An update on the Picturehouse dispute and a speaker about precarious and low paid working in London.
*


> *Dulwich and West Norwood Trade Union Liaison*
> 
> Take the next step - make your voice count
> 
> ...


----------



## Ms T (Oct 25, 2018)

I see that some of the hoardings are now down, revealing the new shops behind.  I wonder if they've been rented?  Does anybody have any info?


----------



## organicpanda (Oct 25, 2018)

Ms T said:


> I see that some of the hoardings are now down, revealing the new shops behind.  I wonder if they've been rented?  Does anybody have any info?


one is A3 (on two floors huge!) the rest are A1/2, weird floor layout, still owned by Network Rail and surprise surprise not cheap


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## snowy_again (Oct 25, 2018)

organicpanda said:


> one is A3 (on two floors huge!) the rest are A1/2, weird floor layout, still owned by Network Rail and surprise surprise not cheap



One of them is with flats upstairs too?


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## organicpanda (Oct 25, 2018)

snowy_again said:


> One of them is with flats upstairs too?


I think the three furthest away from the road are flats, but have no idea of the configuration


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 25, 2018)

Nah, the new exposed shops have a residential door and 3 flat buzzer system in the middle left of that little strip. But as you say, the internal layout's all a bit wiggly.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Oct 31, 2018)

Canopy have had a break-in so if you're in the area and like beer, show them some support.


----------



## Rushy (Oct 31, 2018)

Kids' street party tonight 5-7.

Herne Hill FREE Halloween Party - coming soon!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 31, 2018)

Am I the only one who finds the sight of painted children bedecked in plastic tat and throw away outfits, wasting pumkins and begging for sweets with menaces - profoundly depressing at every level?

The streets were full of them. The waste.  shudders


----------



## billythefish (Oct 31, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Am I the only one who finds the sight of painted children bedecked in plastic tat and throw away outfits, wasting pumkins and begging for sweets with menaces - profoundly depressing at every level?
> 
> The streets were full of them. The waste.  shudders


I offer them Brussels Sprouts (which to me are a treat) and watch them run into the night.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 7, 2018)

Other than upstairs at the Prince Regent (I'm already considering) - venues to hire for an important party - any suggestions and personal experiences please? Preferably one that doesn't charge and arm and a leg. Doesn't have to be in Herne Hill but needs to be easy to get to from here or Brixton.


----------



## Winot (Nov 7, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Other than upstairs at the Prince Regent (I'm already considering) - venues to hire for an important party - any suggestions and personal experiences please? Preferably one that doesn't charge and arm and a leg. Doesn't have to be in Herne Hill but needs to be easy to get to from here or Brixton.



Dog Star was good (for my 40th).


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 7, 2018)

Winot said:


> Dog Star was good (for my 40th).


Thanks I haven't been in there for a decade or more. Never since ID became compulsory - would ID be needed for private party guests? (average age over 50) Was that in a room upstairs?  many people? what did you have: food /bar/dj?  tell me more.


----------



## editor (Nov 8, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Thanks I haven't been in there for a decade or more. Never since ID became compulsory - would ID be needed for private party guests? (average age over 50) Was that in a room upstairs?  many people? what did you have: food /bar/dj?  tell me more.


If it's on a weekend, you'll need ID, but not for a party in the week. The top floor bar holds around 70 I think. 

You can also book the top floor of the Market House - they might ask for ID but there's none of that scanning nonsense. 

What day/times are you looking at, and how many people?


----------



## Winot (Nov 8, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Thanks I haven't been in there for a decade or more. Never since ID became compulsory - would ID be needed for private party guests? (average age over 50) Was that in a room upstairs?  many people? what did you have: food /bar/dj?  tell me more.



Mine was a joint party with two other people, so we had sufficient numbers to hire both upper rooms (one of which we had a band and DJ in). The staff were really friendly, there was a minimum spend which we achieved. We were able to organise our own food however and also supply some drink with a reasonable corkage. 

There wasn’t any ID needed. It was 7 years ago though


----------



## editor (Nov 8, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Other than upstairs at the Prince Regent (I'm already considering) - venues to hire for an important party - any suggestions and personal experiences please? Preferably one that doesn't charge and arm and a leg. Doesn't have to be in Herne Hill but needs to be easy to get to from here or Brixton.


If you're after a bit of a laid back, intimate bash, you can hire the front room of the Effra Social. Lob in some cheapo lighting and a DJ and you'll have a nice little party!

I DJd a birthday party at the Brockwell Lido cafe a while back but I think that was pretty expensive to hire (it was a bit too shiny for my tastes too).


----------



## footballerslegs (Nov 8, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Other than upstairs at the Prince Regent (I'm already considering) - venues to hire for an important party - any suggestions and personal experiences please? Preferably one that doesn't charge and arm and a leg. Doesn't have to be in Herne Hill but needs to be easy to get to from here or Brixton.



Worth checking out Island Arts - hireable space in one of the arches at the bottom of Milkwood Road. Can send details if you’d like to investigate with a bit more info.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 8, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Other than upstairs at the Prince Regent (I'm already considering) - venues to hire for an important party - any suggestions and personal experiences please? Preferably one that doesn't charge and arm and a leg. Doesn't have to be in Herne Hill but needs to be easy to get to from here or Brixton.


I've been to some lovely ones at the Whirled Cinema.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 8, 2018)

editor said:


> If it's on a weekend, you'll need ID, but not for a party in the week. The top floor bar holds around 70 I think.
> 
> You can also book the top floor of the Market House - they might ask for ID but there's none of that scanning nonsense.
> 
> What day/times are you looking at, and how many people?


Thanks but it will need to be at a weekend, as family and friends will need to come from out of town. Can't possibly ask them to anything that requires ID (some of them will def not have drivers licence or passports, though some may well have 60+ bus passes) Anyway I refuse to take my passport out to go to a pub in Brixton and I can't risk not getting into my own party! I'll enquire further with the Market House check if they do need ID and their costs. Thanks



editor said:


> If you're after a bit of a laid back, intimate bash, you can hire the front room of the Effra Social. Lob in some cheapo lighting and a DJ and you'll have a nice little party!
> 
> I DJd a birthday party at the Brockwell Lido cafe a while back but I think that was pretty expensive to hire (it was a bit too shiny for my tastes too).


Thanks but Effra Social's lounge is too small. Lido a possibility - have already asked for a quote.


----------



## editor (Nov 8, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> Thanks but it will need to be at a weekend, as family and friends will need to come from out of town. Can't possibly ask them to anything that requires ID (some of them will def not have drivers licence or passports, though some may well have 60+ bus passes) Anyway I refuse to take my passport out to go to a pub in Brixton and I can't risk not getting into my own party! I'll enquire further with the Market House check if they do need ID and their costs. Thanks
> 
> 
> Thanks but Effra Social's lounge is too small. Lido a possibility - have already asked for a quote.


I think it'll be pricey. If you want any kind of leg-shaking you'll have to hire in a soundsystem too as theirs is only really good enough for background music. Market House I think is cheap (or even free) if you go from 7pm-10pm when the club nights take over, but you can stay on for those if the music is anywhere near what you like.

I agree with your dislike of the ID stuff. I fucking hate it but it's all over Brixton now. Even the Albert on weekends.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 8, 2018)

footballerslegs said:


> Worth checking out Island Arts - hireable space in one of the arches at the bottom of Milkwood Road. Can send details if you’d like to investigate with a bit more info.





Lizzy Mac said:


> I've been to some lovely ones at the Whirled Cinema.


great suggestions I'll definitely investigate - thank you!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 8, 2018)

editor said:


> I agree with your dislike of the ID stuff. I fucking hate it but it's all over Brixton now. Even the Albert on weekends.


The main reason we no longer head that way at the weekend anymore. Thank god it hasn't reached Herne Hill yet.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 8, 2018)

footballerslegs said:


> Worth checking out Island Arts - hireable space in one of the arches at the bottom of Milkwood Road. Can send details if you’d like to investigate with a bit more info.


 have they gone out of business? the website doesnt seem to exist and email bounces back...



Lizzy Mac said:


> I've been to some lovely ones at the Whirled Cinema.


 Did they all involve watching films? - all prices include projection staff etc. Can't tell from the site if all the cinema seating can be moved.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 8, 2018)

editor said:


> I think it'll be pricey. If you want any kind of leg-shaking you'll have to hire in a soundsystem too as theirs is only really good enough for background music. Market House I think is cheap (or even free) if you go from 7pm-10pm when the club nights take over, but you can stay on for those if the music is anywhere near what you like.


 I imagine most places will be pricey. So far quotes go from 150 - 1000 quids (yikes!) but diffent things are included.  Just enquiring at this stage.


----------



## footballerslegs (Nov 9, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> have they gone out of business? the website doesnt seem to exist and email bounces back...



I’m hoping they’ve not gone out of business as it’s a great space. Email address I’ve used in the past is islandarts@btinternet.com . Is that the one that’s bounced back?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 9, 2018)

footballerslegs said:


> I’m hoping they’ve not gone out of business as it’s a great space. Email address I’ve used in the past is islandarts@btinternet.com . Is that the one that’s bounced back?


no it wasn't - I'll give that a go.

edit to add - yey got a reply and I've asked if I can look around.


----------



## footballerslegs (Nov 9, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> no it wasn't - I'll give that a go.


Good luck


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 9, 2018)

Unfortunately 198 don't do private parties anymore following complaints. Shame but fair enough


----------



## BusLanes (Nov 9, 2018)

Trinity Arms upstairs hires out now. I didn't book it but apparently it was quite good value.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Nov 9, 2018)

friendofdorothy said:


> have they gone out of business? the website doesnt seem to exist and email bounces back...
> 
> Did they all involve watching films? - all prices include projection staff etc. Can't tell from the site if all the cinema seating can be moved.


Hi they close for private hires at the weekend and remove the seats.  You need to bring a DJ and decks etc, maybe some fairy lights.  My mate did it an it was very reasonable and easy to arrange.  If you pop down they are very friendly.


----------



## blameless77 (Nov 11, 2018)

editor said:


> I think it'll be pricey. If you want any kind of leg-shaking you'll have to hire in a soundsystem too as theirs is only really good enough for background music. Market House I think is cheap (or even free) if you go from 7pm-10pm when the club nights take over, but you can stay on for those if the music is anywhere near what you like.
> 
> I agree with your dislike of the ID stuff. I fucking hate it but it's all over Brixton now. Even the Albert on weekends.





I was able to show a scan of my passport on my phone at two local establishments recently. Handy as I don’t have a driving  licence, and don’t like carrying a passport around.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 11, 2018)

That was a lovely little Armistice ceremony outside the station this morning. Last Post followed by two minute silence. The whole market was quiet with only the happy sound of a couple of young children. Really quite moving I thought.


----------



## BusLanes (Nov 11, 2018)

Rushy said:


> That was a lovely little Armistice ceremony outside the station this morning. Last Post followed by two minute silence. The whole market was quiet with only the happy sound of a couple of young children. Really quite moving I thought.



I went to the Kennington Cenotaph. Quite a good one too, lots of cadets and such.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 11, 2018)

blameless77 said:


> I was able to show a scan of my passport on my phone at two local establishments recently. Handy as I don’t have a driving  licence, and don’t like carrying a passport around.


Which local establishments, was in Herne Hill?  As my phone is almost gas powered this wouldn't work for me.  

Anyway I refuse on principal to allow some door whore to inspect my passport - govt /border guards yes, to get into a fucking local pub where I've drank for decades - just no! Unless ID cards are made madatory in this country I think our local licencing authority is exceeding its powers in demanding this. Its a civil liberties issues for me and possibly an ageism/equalities issue. Anyway the issue of came up as I'm trying to arrange an important private party, and I don't want my  guests who may not have ID to be barred (like many older people don't)


----------



## editor (Nov 27, 2018)

Christmas Fair in Herne Hill Food, drink and gifts galore at the Herne Hill Christmas Fair, this Sat 1st Dec 2018


----------



## editor (Dec 19, 2018)

New jam session - Jazz From Scratch – a new Sunday jam session for Herne Hill at the Agile Rabbit


----------



## editor (Feb 14, 2019)

FYI: 


> Not sure what to do with the kids this Half Term? Cat & Hutch has it sorted with a whole week of Drama Workshops at the newly refurbished Station Hall above Herne Hill Station.
> 
> We are a storytelling company dedicated to bringing children's stories to life and run regular workshops at The Bright Emporium in Clapham and used to run weekly workshops at Off the Cuff on Railton Road.
> 
> ...


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 14, 2019)

Shame it's not an accessible venue yet.


----------



## editor (Feb 15, 2019)

Coming up

South London Makerspace host their first Maker Festival in Herne Hill, Sat 2nd March


----------



## Crispy (Feb 15, 2019)

editor said:


> Coming up
> 
> South London Makerspace host their first Maker Festival in Herne Hill, Sat 2nd March



I'll be there exhibiting my glowing animal masks. Looking to be a fun day - lots to do and see!


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 4, 2019)

Rumours in HH that someone's leaving poisoned meat in Brockwell Park - along the cinder pitch / wild flowers bit. Three dogs have apparently died, a friend had their dog's stomach pumped.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 4, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> Rumours in HH that someone's leaving poisoned meat in Brockwell Park - along the cinder pitch / wild flowers bit. Three dogs have apparently died, a friend had their dog's stomach pumped.


I heard this today too. Which bit is that exactly?


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 4, 2019)

The path from the lido car park that runs parallel with Dulwich Road I think.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 16, 2019)

I generally try to support independent shops, but every time I go to Seasons I regret it. They charge top whack (more than Dugard in some cases!) and a lot of the produce isn’t that good quality. I just came home with half a dozen eggs and as I was putting them away noticed they were more than two weeks past their use by date.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 26, 2019)

Does anyone go to the Regent anymore? I haven't been for ages but don't want to lose touch with all the regulars I used to see in there.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 26, 2019)

I do! Quizzing tonight.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 31, 2019)

Ms T said:


> I do! Quizzing tonight.


sorry haven't had much time for urbing lately - do you go every week? I finally popped in there on sat afternoon as I saw some friends there as I was passing by, we sat outside - lovely sunny day.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 31, 2019)

Does anyone know where I can recycle light bulbs? - there used to be those special recycling bin things on the corner of Railton road, according to Lambeth.gov it's still there, but I don't think I've seen it there for a while. Is it there now?

Also old tins of paint etc - I don't have a car so going to the smugglers way dump is a bit tricky - any ideas?


----------



## CH1 (Mar 31, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Does anyone know where I can recycle light bulbs? - there used to be those special recycling bin things on the corner of Railton road, according to Lambeth.gov it's still there, but I don't think I've seen it there for a while. Is it there now?
> 
> Also old tins of paint etc - I don't have a car so going to the smugglers way dump is a bit tricky - any ideas?


I think you can take them to the council place in Vale street behind West Norwood Cemetery (on the 322 route).

I have a similar problem. Loads of "Double D" fluorescent tubes (contain mercury).
When it gets more summery I intent to take them there armed with my council tax bill (suggests driving licence as proof of a Lambeth address).

PS the reason the bins disappeared is there's no money in it, and Lambeth didn't get a new contractor. Maybe too busy with their Nu Town Hall?


----------



## teuchter (Apr 1, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Does anyone know where I can recycle light bulbs? - there used to be those special recycling bin things on the corner of Railton road, according to Lambeth.gov it's still there, but I don't think I've seen it there for a while. Is it there now?
> 
> Also old tins of paint etc - I don't have a car so going to the smugglers way dump is a bit tricky - any ideas?



I took some old tins of paint to the smugglers way place last year... Made the mistake of asking which section they should go in and the answer was that they couldn't take them at all as they count as hazardous waste therefore I must take them home again, call up lambeth, arrange for a special collection blah blah.

Anyway - if you've got any awkward waste to get rid of, why not just dump it all over the pavement round the corner from my front door during the night? That seems to be a popular option.


----------



## Twattor (Apr 1, 2019)

teuchter said:


> I took some old tins of paint to the smugglers way place last year... Made the mistake of asking which section they should go in and the answer was that they couldn't take them at all as they count as hazardous waste therefore I must take them home again, call up lambeth, arrange for a special collection blah blah.


Only in liquid form.  If you stir in something to make them solidify (cement/filler/sawdust etc) then you can dispose of them there or in your normal rubbish.

If you know anyone who's a southwark resident and can borrow ID then the tip off old kent road will take liquid paint for recycling.


----------



## T & P (Apr 1, 2019)

Years ago the Lambeth waste site on Vale St. used to accept paint as donations for reuse if sufficient amount remained in the tin and the paint was still useful, IIRC. Don't know if that's still the case though.


----------



## colacubes (Apr 1, 2019)

T & P said:


> Years ago the Lambeth waste site on Vale St. used to accept paint as donations for reuse if sufficient amount remained in the tin and the paint was still useful, IIRC. Don't know if that's still the case though.



It's not. I tried to do just that last year and was told they don't take it and you have to take it to Smugglers Way.


----------



## sparkybird (Apr 1, 2019)

Ditto. If it's not a full tin they won't take it at vale st. IIRC advise on Lambeth website was to let it go solid and put in normal bin


----------



## brixtonblade (Apr 1, 2019)

What will make it solidify? I have an enormous tub of all sorts of random paint and other DIY stuff and it won't dry out


----------



## T & P (Apr 1, 2019)

brixtonblade said:


> What will make it solidify? I have an enormous tub of all sorts of random paint and other DIY stuff and it won't dry out


 Remove the lid, leave alone for a couple of days, sorted


----------



## brixtonblade (Apr 1, 2019)

T & P said:


> Remove the lid, leave alone for a couple of days, sorted


Really? What if it rains?


----------



## colacubes (Apr 1, 2019)

brixtonblade said:


> Really? What if it rains?



Ideally you want to wait till it’s a bit warmer. Couple of days in the sun and jobs a good’un.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 1, 2019)

sparkybird said:


> Ditto. If it's not a full tin they won't take it at vale st. IIRC advise on Lambeth website was to let it go solid and put in normal bin


I thought the advise was to let it go solid and then take it to smugglers way - did I read that wrong? just been to their site A to Z of what to do with your waste | Lambeth Council. 

Lambeth won't collect it and we don't drive.  However I also found this link:
Get rid of hazardous waste | Lambeth Council which says City of london collects hazardous waste including paint. don't know if that costs anything.


----------



## T & P (Apr 1, 2019)

brixtonblade said:


> Really? What if it rains?


If the paint is water-soluble (as opposed to the type you need white spirit to clean brushes with), it won’t even smell, IME at least. So you could do it indoors.


----------



## sparkybird (Apr 17, 2019)

Burst water main in Dulwich road just before the Florence pub... I've reported it to TW


----------



## Winot (Apr 22, 2019)

Herne Hill junction closed due to RTA.


----------



## colacubes (Apr 22, 2019)

Winot said:


> Herne Hill junction closed due to RTA.


Just been through on my bike and looks really nasty. Looks like they had to cut the roof off the car to get people out


----------



## Winot (Apr 22, 2019)




----------



## Me76 (Apr 22, 2019)

Is it still closed?  Do you know if buses are on a diversion? I got caught in it just as it happened this afternoon and they were just sending buses back to west Norwood at that point.


----------



## Me76 (Apr 22, 2019)

Diversion is on.  68 going to Brixton from camberwell and then 2 route to tulse Hill.


----------



## Smick (Apr 22, 2019)

I'm on a 196 which is taking us over Tulse Hill instead of through HH. I had hoped that, being on diversion, it would fire past all the stops, but it is basically doing a 2 route.


----------



## Me76 (Apr 22, 2019)

,I think the diversion must be over now as I've just got to tulse Hill and there was a 468 coming up from HH and another one going down.


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (May 8, 2019)

Has Dee Dee's Jazz on the Hill closed down?


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 9, 2019)

What's happening with the new Balamory shops? - they all look empty atm.


----------



## editor (May 9, 2019)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> Has Dee Dee's Jazz on the Hill closed down?


It looks that way.


----------



## choochi (May 9, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> What's happening with the new Balamory shops? - they all look empty atm.



I’d imagine it’s that the landlords have a completely unrealistic expectation of what rent they should charge so are driving away the small businesses people might actually want while they wait for a big chain to arrive and pay the big bucks!


----------



## snowy_again (May 10, 2019)

the flats haven’t been rented yet so I assume the power substation hasn’t been installed still.


----------



## snowy_again (May 13, 2019)

Anyone know why Mimosa has permanently closed? Dulwich Estates strikes again? 

(the Vauxhall and Kennington ones are still open)


----------



## snowy_again (May 17, 2019)

And now the Illusioneer is moving too (but looks to be to bigger premises). 

Mimosa's reason for closing in HH : "Rising costs, not enough café seating and an increase in online speciality food products were factors in our closure in Herne Hill."


----------



## Ms T (May 17, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> And now the Illusioneer is moving too (but looks to be to bigger premises).
> 
> Mimosa's reason for closing in HH : "Rising costs, not enough café seating and an increase in online speciality food products were factors in our closure in Herne Hill."



I went in there recently to buy sherry vinegar. I had to ask for the price (why? It’s embarrassing) and the same product was cheaper round the corner at Dugards.


----------



## T & P (May 17, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> And now the Illusioneer is moving too (but looks to be to bigger premises).


I’m (pleasantly) surprised The Illusioner has turned out to be successful. It seems to have been there for ages. The very first time I noticed it years ago I wondered if it was going to last long. But I guess there are plenty of local residents who are the right fit for that kind of business.

I don’t think I’ve ever seen it it open though. But then that kind of business probably relies on by-appointment visits rather than walk-ins.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 20, 2019)

Ms T said:


> I went in there recently to buy sherry vinegar. I had to ask for the price (why? It’s embarrassing) and the same product was cheaper round the corner at Dugards.


 bloody hell! Never thought I'd hear the phrase 'cheaper at Dugards'.


----------



## Ms T (May 20, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> bloody hell! Never thought I'd hear the phrase 'cheaper at Dugards'.


Innit.


----------



## snowy_again (May 21, 2019)

Chicken Shop fans have the chance to buy the Morley's on Norwood Road for £150k at the moment...


----------



## snowy_again (May 21, 2019)

And biggish capital plans for the Brockwell Park Community Greenhouses:

The Barn - a new community space for learning, growth & play - Brockwell Park Community Greenhouses 

With educational space, cooking facilities etc. 

Which is a slightly different approach than Lambeth's attempt to rent out the bowling green to a rumoured mini golf company (the same is apparently happening to the park in East Dulwich / Peckham).


----------



## editor (May 21, 2019)

Coming to 'erne 'ill

Music, animation and archive film combine for the Cult of Water, Herne Hill, Thurs 30th May


----------



## Winot (May 21, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> And biggish capital plans for the Brockwell Park Community Greenhouses:
> 
> The Barn - a new community space for learning, growth & play - Brockwell Park Community Greenhouses
> 
> ...



Looks great.


----------



## snowy_again (May 21, 2019)

editor said:


> Coming to 'erne 'ill
> 
> Music, animation and archive film combine for the Cult of Water, Herne Hill, Thurs 30th May



That looks like fun. It's a shame that building is currently inaccessible unless you can climb 3 flights of stairs. I know they can't do anything about that until they get longer term tenure.

The Poly Styrene exhibition at 198 Gallery is well worth the visit.
Retro Man Blog: Day-Glo: The Poly Styrene Story - A Searingly Honest and Uplifting Biography of the X-Ray Spex Singer by Poly's Daughter Celeste Bell & Music Writer Zoe Howe


----------



## Smick (May 21, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> Chicken Shop fans have the chance to buy the Morley's on Norwood Road for £150k at the moment...


Do Morleys not want it?

I wonder what the £150k gets you. 

 I couldn't even rustle up £1,500 but, even if I could, I don't want a chicken shop. Never mind £1,500, I'd rather have £150 in cash rather than owning my own chicken shop. Working 18 hour days, smelling of fat, dealing with abusive drunks.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (May 22, 2019)

and leary school kids who havent been taught or yet learned to say please and thank you, or even basic manners.


----------



## Ms Ordinary (May 22, 2019)

editor said:


> Coming to 'erne 'ill
> 
> Music, animation and archive film combine for the Cult of Water, Herne Hill, Thurs 30th May



Saw this at Soho Theatre & suspect Station Hall will be a much more atmospheric & intimate venue. 
Also much cheaper...


----------



## Winot (May 22, 2019)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> and leary school kids who havent been taught or yet learned to say please and thank you, or even basic manners.




Thread >>>
https://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/things-that-make-you-realise-that-yes-you-are-old.342515/


----------



## discobastard (May 22, 2019)

Bloke in Brockwell Park playing bagpipes right now [emoji16]


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 22, 2019)

Really pleased to find out it's still possible to get last minute appointment at the Herne Hill Group Practice. I got a phone appoint in the afternoon having asked at lunchtime, with a prescription that same day and a face to face appt within 48hrs. 

I haven't need to find since since they merged with Brixton Water Lane practice and I was worried it might have changed.

BTW anyone know what the old Brixton Water Lane building is going to be?


----------



## madolesance (May 22, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Really pleased to find out it's still possible to get last minute appointment at the Herne Hill Group Practice. I got a phone appoint in the afternoon having asked at lunchtime, with a prescription that same day and a face to face appt within 48hrs.
> 
> I haven't need to find since since they merged with Brixton Water Lane practice and I was worried it might have changed.
> 
> BTW anyone know what the old Brixton Water Lane building is going to be?



Private house.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 22, 2019)

madolesance said:


> Private house.


thought so.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 24, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> The Poly Styrene exhibition at 198 Gallery is well worth the visit.
> Retro Man Blog: Day-Glo: The Poly Styrene Story - A Searingly Honest and Uplifting Biography of the X-Ray Spex Singer by Poly's Daughter Celeste Bell & Music Writer Zoe Howe


Great exhibition. All her lyrics and songs still sound so good. Found myself humming _oh bondage up yours_ all day.

I didn't realise she had a Brixton connection either.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 25, 2019)

Anyone know someone who sells Avon stuff? I'm in need of my annual supply of Skin-so-Soft which keeps the insects off me. Please pm me details if you know someone local.


----------



## Rushy (May 25, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Anyone know someone who sells Avon stuff? I'm in need of my annula supply of Skin-so-Soft which keeps the insects off me. Please pm me details if you know someone local.


Does it actually work? I bought some for midges in Scotland and then was told that the ingredients had been changed so that it isn't all that effective anymore, so didn't take it. I have a couple of bottles. You're welcome to have one of them.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 25, 2019)

Rushy said:


> Does it actually work? I bought some for midges in Scotland and then was told that the ingredients had been changed so that it isn't all that effective anymore, so didn't take it. I have a couple of bottles. You're welcome to have one of them.


Yes please! It's worked for me. The stuff I bought two years ago did. There was some spray on version, that I wasn't to keen on - but that seemed to work too. Has it changed? 
I imagine scottish midges might need full on jungle formula DDT though. 

I will need more if anyone does know an Avon seller.


----------



## Rushy (May 25, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Yes please! It's worked for me. The stuff I bought two years ago did. There was some spray on version, that I wasn't to keen on - but that seemed to work too. Has it changed?
> I imagine scottish midges might need full on jungle formula DDT though.
> 
> I will need more if anyone does know an Avon seller.


Mine must be 2 yrs old too. Pump spray bottle.


----------



## Maggot (May 25, 2019)

Ms Ordinary said:


> Saw this at Soho Theatre & suspect Station Hall will be a much more atmospheric & intimate venue.
> Also much cheaper...


I saw it at Soho too! 

It's also very close to the route of the Effra.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (May 25, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Anyone know someone who sells Avon stuff? I'm in need of my annula supply of Skin-so-Soft which keeps the insects off me. Please pm me details if you know someone local.


The girl in the Nisa shop opposite Tesco Coldharbour Lane is an Avon rep.  I think she'd be pleased for more orders and has postcards in the shop.  The Avon postage charge is huge.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2019)

Lizzy Mac said:


> The girl in the Nisa shop opposite Tesco Coldharbour Lane is an Avon rep.  I think she'd be pleased for more orders and has postcards in the shop.  The Avon postage charge is huge.


Thanks, will check it out.


----------



## teuchter (May 26, 2019)

Skin so soft / midge question is somewhat controversial. I was sufficiently sceptical never to bother trying it. Supposedly the formula has now been changed anyway. 

As far as highland midges are concerned I stick with the folk knowledge passed to me as a child - use 'jungle formula' and never ever ever set out walking without a small bottle of it in the rucksack.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2019)

teuchter said:


> Skin so soft / midge question is somewhat controversial. I was sufficiently sceptical never to bother trying it. Supposedly the formula has now been changed anyway.


 I've aways been irrestible to biting insects.  An american woman told me about skin-so-soft years ago and it worked for me. It's a lot less offensive in smell than proper anti mosquito stuff and it's a nice body lotion, win/win.  

Are you just repeating what Rushy said, or has the formula actually changed?


----------



## teuchter (May 26, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> I've aways been irrestible to biting insects.  An american woman told me about skin-so-soft years ago and it worked for me. It's a lot less offensive in smell than proper anti mosquito stuff and it's a nice body lotion, win/win.
> 
> Are you just repeating what Rushy said, or has the formula actually changed?



Just what I remember from the last time I checked it out, which probably involved reading a few threads around the place like these -

View topic - Avon Skin So Soft vs Midge

View topic - Skin so soft

UKC Forums - Avon Skin so Soft

I think there is also some confusion resulting from the stuff they sell in the US being different to the stuff they sell here.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2019)

teuchter said:


> Just what I remember from the last time I checked it out, which probably involved reading a few threads around the place like these -
> 
> View topic - Avon Skin So Soft vs Midge
> 
> ...


impressive research.


----------



## teuchter (May 30, 2019)

Went to a thing in the 'station hall' above herne hill station entrance this evening. Quite a big space up there.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2019)

Very shiny. Very empty.

 

There is one business there - a luxury chandelier company, with prices starting at £250 for a single lampshade.


----------



## T & P (Jun 3, 2019)

Not that I'm defending NR, but nothing wrong with shiny. As to empty, that is hardly surprising given that the hoardings came off about 17 seconds ago.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2019)

T & P said:


> Not that I'm defending NR, but nothing wrong with shiny. As to empty, that is hardly surprising given that the hoardings came off about 17 seconds ago.


Shiny usually means = expensive, which usually means = exclusive, which more often than not = divisive to the local community.


And the shutters have been off a lot longer than "17 seconds"


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 3, 2019)

editor said:


> Very shiny. Very empty.
> 
> View attachment 173185
> 
> There is one business there - a luxury chandelier company, with prices starting at £250 for a single lampshade.



The lampshade people are not there - it was some 10 day thing at Christmas. The shutters have only just come off the right hand shops.
It's had a terrible impact on that row - footfall is down over the year. The greengrocers and the bakery are on the Milkwood Road side now.
And they're empty as NR didn't realise that they would need an electricity sub station to supply increased power to the shops and flats. That prompted the outrage when they decided to put it where Elaine the Flower Lady is. I think it's going in the unit under the arch at some point - but the shops can't be used until that's fixed.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> The lampshade people are not there - it was some 10 day thing at Christmas.


Oh OK. They've still got their sign in the window, which is confusing.


----------



## editor (Jun 3, 2019)

This sounds horrible (if verified)


----------



## editor (Jun 7, 2019)

There's a bo....


----------



## colacubes (Jun 7, 2019)

editor said:


> This sounds horrible (if verified)




I saw a report from the Met on twitter and apparently this was pepper spray, not acid. Still unpleasant nonetheless.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 7, 2019)

Somethings afoot with the railway passage mural artist and the final version of what's going up - artist appears very unhappy.


----------



## BusLanes (Jun 9, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> Somethings afoot with the railway passage mural artist and the final version of what's going up - artist appears very unhappy.



Seems they made a pvc copy without his consent


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jul 3, 2019)

Just got a letter through the door about the old clinic at 141 - 149 Railton road which surprise surprise is now going to be luxury flats, has it been sold on by the council then?. Which ward does this come under?

141-149 Railton Road


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 3, 2019)

sleaterkinney said:


> Just got a letter through the door about the old clinic at 141 - 149 Railton road which surprise surprise is now going to be luxury flats, has it been sold on by the council then?. Which ward does this come under?
> 
> 141-149 Railton Road


It's herne hill

I thought they wanted to make it a HMO


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 3, 2019)

That would explain the new graffiti. I thought it had a covenant on it? CH1 hadn’t you mentioned something?


----------



## Rushy (Jul 3, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> That would explain the new graffiti. I thought it had a covenant on it? CH1 hadn’t you mentioned something?


If it's the one I am thinking of it was sold with a clawback covenant that if the owner improved upon the permission (for a row of houses) it should pass a proportion of the increased value on to the original vendor.


----------



## brixtonblade (Jul 3, 2019)

There's a consultation about it at EffraSpace on Monday.  Timing is a bit awkward but will see if I can get down.


----------



## CH1 (Jul 4, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> That would explain the new graffiti. I thought it had a covenant on it? CH1 hadn’t you mentioned something?


Not sure exactly what you're referring to.
Back in 2014 I took and interest in the disused Railton Road clinic and probably posted about it because along with Iveagh House Surgery at 5 Ways it was one of the services relocated to the Akerman Centre in Vassall Ward, leaving behind empty buidings - and no GP in Coldharbour Ward.

This is still the case after 5 years - hats off to the ultra efficient NHS estates management department (Savills???) 

I think there was a planning application for the Railton Road clinic site about 3 or more years ago under the name of the Health Authority (for housing). Not sure what happened about that - either passed or withdrawn being the only realistic outcomes.
Whatever happens it's an outrage that a community clinic was closed down, and that it was left derelict for 5 years.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 4, 2019)

chocolate box also appears to be having a refurb (again)


----------



## editor (Jul 10, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> chocolate box also appears to be having a refurb (again)


My friend is opening a vegan place there.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 6, 2019)

And it's now open - Pure something - selling vegan ice cream, coffee etc. and has pink tables and chairs outside.

Hopefully it'll survive. There's 2 or 3 vegan places in 200m of each other there now.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 6, 2019)

The ice cream place is also becoming dangerously addictive - despite me struggling to eat a £3 double scoop cone in one sitting.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 14, 2019)

And now we've gone full Pride stripes on the zebra crossing! Gymmy Dickson has been tweeting it







The Herne Hill Forum newsletter last week said that the Arch Co are still struggling to find somewhere to put the electricity substation. That means the new shops can't all open (if they can find tenants). They have however found people to take one of the flats upstairs, so there's power somewhere... 

The mini shop next to the painted black old kitchen place on Rymer (?) is also being refitted with internal stud work etc. There's a bit of a glut of empty shops or shops being potentially opened - which is a bit strange given that Network Rail managed to destroy the footfall for a while when closing the baker, butcher, greengrocer. 

Oh and the magician's place has moved to bigger premises and there's a Zero Waste place there now.


----------



## editor (Aug 14, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> And now we've gone full Pride stripes on the zebra crossing! Gymmy Dickson has been tweeting it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I like it. Just like I like the one at Hamlet.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 15, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> And now we've gone full Pride stripes on the zebra crossing! Gymmy Dickson has been tweeting it


just saw that today - brightens the place up. When was it done?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 15, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> Oh and the magician's place has moved to bigger premises and there's a Zero Waste place there now.


 I checked out the zero waste place today - seems promising but its so small.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 15, 2019)

Saw the Neil Kenlock – Lost Legacies Of The British Black Panthers  really interesting exhibition at the 198 Gallery. There's even a picture of a young Linton Qwesi Johnson actually smiling.


----------



## CH1 (Aug 21, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Saw the Neil Kenlock – Lost Legacies Of The British Black Panthers  really interesting exhibition at the 198 Gallery. There's even a picture of a young Linton Qwesi Johnson actually smiling.


By chance, there was a long discursive interview with Linton Kwesi Johnson this evening on Radio Three - partially illustrated
BBC Radio 3 - Free Thinking, Linton Kwesi Johnson


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 22, 2019)

CH1 said:


> By chance, there was a long discursive interview with Linton Kwesi Johnson this evening on Radio Three - partially illustrated
> BBC Radio 3 - Free Thinking, Linton Kwesi Johnson


thanks! Ill give that a listen. 

how are the proms? we've missed you on weds.


----------



## teuchter (Aug 23, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> And now we've gone full Pride stripes on the zebra crossing! Gymmy Dickson has been tweeting it



A pedant notes that this is not a zebra crossing. And it would be a very bad idea to paint a zebra crossing in such colours.


----------



## Smick (Aug 23, 2019)

teuchter said:


> A pedant notes that this is not a zebra crossing. And it would be a very bad idea to paint a zebra crossing in such colours.


There's a sign on the BT ilink thing in West Norwood, describing it as the first permanent rainbow crossing in the UK. 

I took a photo but don't know how to put that on here.


----------



## Winot (Aug 28, 2019)

This happened to the son of a friend yesterday:

Child injured after 'falling from ride' at South London funfair

He has two broken legs, a broken thumb and a nasty head wound. But nothing life threatening.


----------



## Winot (Aug 28, 2019)

I don’t have any other details.


----------



## Smick (Aug 28, 2019)

I am always quite skeptical of those temporary funfairs. I guess they are quite adept at putting them together and taking them apart, but the temporary nature of them worries me. Tons of metal being flung about after having been assembled that morning under time pressure.

I went on one of the particularly violent ones at the Lambeth Country Show one year and started to doubt their safety mid-ride. I petrified myself and decided to never bother again.


----------



## Winot (Aug 29, 2019)

More details here:

The horrific injuries suffered by boy 'thrown from Brockwell Park funfair ride'


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Aug 29, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Saw the Neil Kenlock – Lost Legacies Of The British Black Panthers  really interesting exhibition at the 198 Gallery. There's even a picture of a young Linton Qwesi Johnson actually smiling.


I only heard about this exhibition yesterday and it finishes tomorrow. I am going down to Brixton to see it tomorrow afternoon.


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 2, 2019)

Noticed that the bookies in HH has bit the dust. Wonder where the regulars will get their ahem “fix” from now?


.


----------



## Smick (Sep 2, 2019)

Not a Vet said:


> Noticed that the bookies in HH has bit the dust. Wonder where the regulars will get their ahem “fix” from now?
> 
> 
> .


I've never heard of bookies offices losing money. Their lease must be up or some other reason to close it down. 

I enjoy the occasional trip to the bookies, but hypocritically hate the sight of them so won't mourn the closure of this one. 

Hopefully nothing springs up for the regulars and they put the money to something better, even if it is only pints.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Sep 6, 2019)

Not a Vet said:


> Noticed that the bookies in HH has bit the dust. Wonder where the regulars will get their ahem “fix” from now?
> 
> 
> .


which bookies? Ladbrooks went years ago. Do you mean the Tote next to the Commercial?


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 6, 2019)

Yes, I suspect some of the punters made more money than the bookie


.


----------



## T & P (Sep 7, 2019)

More likely that that the recently imposed £2 maximum play on those infernal highly addictive fruit machines had eroded that branch's profits irreversibly.

I am sorry for any job loses but I won't lose much sleep for the fortunes of the company.


----------



## Maggot (Sep 29, 2019)

This may be of interest to Herne Hilliers. 

 

Hosted by a friend of mine.


----------



## editor (Sep 29, 2019)

Some pics from Off The Cuff which is turning into a really great local live music venue. 
















In photos: Brigadé Junk and Dennis Just Dennis at Off The Cuff, Herne Hill, SE24, Fri 27th Sept 2019


----------



## HerneHillBilly (Oct 3, 2019)

I don't usually get concerned about the early appearance of Xmas paraphernalia, but a Christmas tree in the station square on Oct 3 seems more than a bit premature.


----------



## editor (Oct 3, 2019)

HerneHillBilly said:


> I don't usually get concerned about the early appearance of Xmas paraphernalia, but a Christmas tree in the station square on Oct 3 seems more than a bit premature.


That is really ridiculous!


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 3, 2019)

It's temporary - for an advert.


----------



## HerneHillBilly (Oct 3, 2019)

I'm imagining they're just trying it out to see how it looks, 3 months would be a long time to have it plonked there.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Oct 3, 2019)

I like Off The Cuff for the live stuff but I can't tolerate the damp mouldy air in there. Every time I've spent any time there I get wheezy and short of breath. And a sire throat. The first time, I assumed I was coming down with something but it didn't develop. And it's happened every time I've been to the venue.


----------



## HerneHillBilly (Oct 3, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> It's temporary - for an advert.


Aha! Thanks for that, will there be a snow machine?


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 3, 2019)

HerneHillBilly said:


> Aha! Thanks for that, will there be a snow machine?



There was an eight foot fibreglass snowman yesterday... I'll go and poke my nose around - all I can see at the moment is a few crew vans.


----------



## editor (Oct 3, 2019)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I like Off The Cuff for the live stuff but I can't tolerate the damp mouldy air in there. Every time I've spent any time there I get wheezy and short of breath. And a sire throat. The first time, I assumed I was coming down with something but it didn't develop. And it's happened every time I've been to the venue.


It's so _nearly_ a great gig, that place. Sound is pretty good and I like the tattiness/quirkiness but the five quid pints are a  bit much.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Oct 3, 2019)

editor said:


> It's so _nearly_ a great gig, that place. Sound is pretty good and I like the tattiness/quirkiness but the five quid pints are a  bit much.



The faux squat element annoys me a bit. It's not evolved around people using the place, it was brought in wholescale so it's not actually comfortable and easy to use. But yeah, the sound is decent enough (railway atches tend to be sound friendly anyway). 

Alcohol is universally overpriced. Well, not universally: I was pleasantly surprised by low bar prices in a social club recently.


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 3, 2019)

HerneHillBilly said:


> Aha! Thanks for that, will there be a snow machine?



There is a snow machine!


----------



## HerneHillBilly (Oct 3, 2019)

Hurray! I'm at work now, though, so I'll miss it.


----------



## Smick (Oct 3, 2019)

According to the guys earlier, it is an ad for Visa. 

It’s set round / in the picture framers and they were using a Mk3 Ford Cortina, which was made between 1970 and 1976, so it will be something vintagey. 

The tre was only decorated on one side, presumably their filming doesn’t face toward the park.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 4, 2019)

snowy_again said:


> There is a snow machine!


what are they filming?


----------



## Nivag (Oct 4, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> what are they filming?


Probably their Christmas advert


----------



## editor (Nov 5, 2019)

Herne Hill news First World War Memorial to be unveiled at Herne Hill railway station, Sun 10th Nov, 2019


----------



## Ms Ordinary (Nov 6, 2019)

Some familiar locations here...


----------



## Rushy (Nov 6, 2019)

Ms Ordinary said:


> Some familiar locations here...



...and faces!


----------



## Rushy (Nov 6, 2019)

Talking of local faces on tellybox, did anyone watch the last season of The Apprentice?


----------



## Smick (Nov 6, 2019)

Rushy said:


> Talking of local faces on tellybox, did anyone watch the last season of The Apprentice?


The one which is on at present?


----------



## Rushy (Nov 6, 2019)

Smick said:


> The one which is on at present?


That's the one. I thought it was finished for some reason - I just saw an episode on iplayer.
BBC One - The Apprentice, Series 15 - Carina Lepore


----------



## pbsmooth (Nov 6, 2019)

can't say I rate their bread much


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 11, 2019)

Just found out that Mr Norton the dentist at the top of the hill has retired NOOOO! arrgghh!

I'm very afraid of dental treatment.  I liked Mr Norton and had been with him since 30years + before I moved to HH. I dread getting used to a new dentist.

Has anyone used Mr Norton's replacement?

Has anyone used the Smile dentists? are they still accepting NHS patients - I see they say something about nervous patients treatments - is it true, has anyone experience of them? or any other local dentists?


----------



## HerneHillBilly (Nov 11, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Just found out that Mr Norton the dentist at the top of the hill has retired NOOOO! arrgghh!
> 
> I'm very afraid of dental treatment.  I liked Mr Norton and had been with him since 30years + before I moved to HH. I dread getting used to a new dentist.
> 
> ...


----------



## HerneHillBilly (Nov 11, 2019)

I have used the one with the yellow frontage opposite the Half Moon for many years. Always excellent, though they recently refused me NHS treatment because I hadn't been in for 3 years. No warning, just taken off the list. They seem to have a very long waiting list to reregister for nhs service.


----------



## Nivag (Nov 11, 2019)

HerneHillBilly said:


> I have used the one with the yellow frontage opposite the Half Moon for many years. Always excellent, though they recently refused me NHS treatment because I hadn't been in for 3 years. No warning, just taken off the list. They seem to have a very long waiting list to reregister for nhs service.


I use them too as a private patient, they are a bit pricey when seeing the hygienist compared to others but she's really good.


----------



## teuchter (Nov 11, 2019)

Nivag said:


> I use them too as a private patient, they are a bit pricey when seeing the hygienist compared to others but she's really good.


Same here


----------



## Smick (Nov 12, 2019)

I use the hygienist there, Sharon, and think she ts really good. The dentists, I’m not just as keen on, although they don’t do much beyond taking a look round and telling me it’s ok.


----------



## teuchter (Nov 12, 2019)

Smick said:


> I use the hygienist there, Sharon, and think she ts really good.


Every 3-4 months she politely tells me off for not using dental floss regularly and I nod and mumble about doing better next time


----------



## Nivag (Nov 12, 2019)

teuchter said:


> Every 3-4 months she politely tells me off for not using dental floss regularly and I nod and mumble about doing better next time


 sounds like my visits


----------



## teuchter (Nov 12, 2019)

Nivag said:


> sounds like my visits


Yeah, I assume 90% of her job is giving advice to people who she knows are too rubbish to follow it properly.


----------



## Smick (Nov 13, 2019)

She has me on a 3 month visit schedule too! Such is my poor dental hygiene. 

Why should I floss every day and use Teepee brushes if you’re taking £60 to fix things up every three months?


----------



## twistedAM (Nov 14, 2019)

crojoe said:


> can't say I rate their bread much



I wouldn't know as I refuse to buy anything that's labelled "artisan". And as for Bakehouse...


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 16, 2019)

Ms Ordinary said:


> Some familiar locations here...



Recognise alot of the businesses there, but are they all in HH? I dont recognise cafe or bookshop...


----------



## Mr paulee (Nov 16, 2019)

Wide Awake London - Bringing together notes from the underground...

new festival for brockwell park.
Not sure if it's same people as Field Day which was a fucking nightmare.


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 16, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> Recognise alot of the businesses there, but are they all in HH? I dont recognise cafe or bookshop...



no - the bookshop is in Dulwich village.  Someone on another thread was discussing the whereabouts of the cafe but I can't remember now.

oh someone said: Jim’s cafe in Lower Clapton, 59 Chatsworth Way.


----------



## nick (Nov 16, 2019)

Think the cafe is the electric in Tulse hill


----------



## colacubes (Nov 16, 2019)

nick said:


> Think the cafe is the electric in Tulse hill


Nope. Wrong layout.


----------



## nick (Nov 16, 2019)

Sorry. 

I’ll take a temporary self ban to get over the shame of misleading the internet


----------



## colacubes (Nov 16, 2019)

nick said:


> Sorry.
> 
> I’ll take a temporary self ban to get over the shame of misleading the internet


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 16, 2019)

nick said:


> Think the cafe is the electric in Tulse hill



It's Jim’s cafe in Lower Clapton, 59 Chatsworth Way.


----------



## RubyToogood (Nov 16, 2019)

Oh I walked through them making that advert! That's what it was then.


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 16, 2019)

RubyToogood said:


> Oh I walked through them making that advert! That's what it was then.



ha - I thought I saw a flash of superlative knitwear on one of the extras!


----------



## CH1 (Nov 24, 2019)

Apologies if posters have seen this multiple times before, but I stumbled on this episode of Grand Designs whilst looking for something else.

St Jude's Vicarge was a bland 1950s council house style building behind the old St Jude's Church on Dulwich Road. It was very conspicuous - sticking out into Brockwell Park behind a rather low budget wooden fence. I remember the house personally having been entertained there by vicar the Rev Dennis Peterson and his wife around 1987. They had old fashioned values - and liked the old place so much they harboured the wish to use right-to-buy so they could stay there in Dennis's retirement. I suspect Mrs Thatcher's right to buy did not apply to church property though.

Two vicars later St Judes parish was merged into St Matthews (as opposite the Fridge/Electric). The now surplus vicarage was sold off.

Not sure at what point Grand Designs got involved, but round 2012/3 the new upwardly mobile owners of the humble-looking 1950s vicarage decided to buy the site for £800,000 and spend a further £400,000 reconstructing the house and gardens.

Local Brixton modernist architect Zac Monro facilitated the design and the story is here Grand Designs - On Demand - All 4
Before photos (from Brockwell Park side and from service - Dulwich Road - side). Window grills not present in the 1980s AFAIR.
  
Finished product from Brockwell Park.


----------



## editor (Nov 24, 2019)

Mr paulee said:


> Wide Awake London - Bringing together notes from the underground...
> 
> new festival for brockwell park.
> Not sure if it's same people as Field Day which was a fucking nightmare.


"leftfield Indie, Post Punk, Electronica, Techno, Jazz"....


----------



## Smick (Nov 24, 2019)

CH1 said:


> Apologies if posters have seen this multiple times before, but I stumbled on this episode of Grand Designs whilst looking for something else.
> 
> St Jude's Vicarge was a bland 1950s council house style building behind the old St Jude's Church on Dulwich Road. It was very conspicuous - sticking out into Brockwell Park behind a rather low budget wooden fence. I remember the house personally having been entertained there by vicar the Rev Dennis Peterson and his wife around 1987. They had old fashioned values - and liked the old place so much they harboured the wish to use right-to-buy so they could stay there in Dennis's retirement. I suspect Mrs Thatcher's right to buy did not apply to church property though.
> 
> ...



I remember watching it and not liking the people. From what I remember, they were delighted to be ‘putting something good into the park’ by making their house behind a wall nicer than it was before. How selfless of them to do that for us. 

If I had my way, I’d knock down their house, move the wall back to the church and let us park users benefit from the extra land.


----------



## CH1 (Nov 24, 2019)

Smick said:


> I remember watching it and not liking the people. From what I remember, they were delighted to be ‘putting something good into the park’ by making their house behind a wall nicer than it was before. How selfless of them to do that for us.
> 
> If I had my way, I’d knock down their house, move the wall back to the church and let us park users benefit from the extra land.


They did seem smug I agree. And their "design" gives them even more visual enjoyment of Brockwell Park than Cressingham residents, who are end-on so to speak.

In a way the church is as much a travesty as the grand design. The Rev Peterson was out of line with the C of E (Southwark Diocese) in several respects -
1. he married a divorced woman - not only that she was or had been a member of the Christian Brethren.
2. he took on the parish as a stole-wearing Anglo-Catholic and then became "saved", so he ultimately described himself as "Christian" rather than C of E and took measures to make his lack of Catholicism clear - e.g. used a pottery chalice, only had communion once a month and moved the sermon to the end of the service, as per Presbyterian tradition.
3. he was essentially a Calvinist "When you are born God puts a mark on your soul to indicate whether you are saved" he once told me.

It would be easy to say that when the old St Jude's building needed repairs the church administrators chose instead to close it. I suspect actually Dennis would have been delighted to move the congregation into the gymnasium of St Judes School in Regent Road - and that is what happened. I'm sure he and many of the fervent pentecostal type congregation he had built up would have found a school gymnasium more "authentic" than a crumbling Victorian Church.

I guess the current owners of the church have "saved" the building - but at the cost of making it difficult to view inside
a- because it is offices for a business
b-because there is apparently a mezanine floor in there so it can hardly seem like it was originally intended to.


----------



## blameless77 (Nov 25, 2019)

CH1 said:


> Apologies if posters have seen this multiple times before, but I stumbled on this episode of Grand Designs whilst looking for something else.
> 
> St Jude's Vicarge was a bland 1950s council house style building behind the old St Jude's Church on Dulwich Road. It was very conspicuous - sticking out into Brockwell Park behind a rather low budget wooden fence. I remember the house personally having been entertained there by vicar the Rev Dennis Peterson and his wife around 1987. They had old fashioned values - and liked the old place so much they harboured the wish to use right-to-buy so they could stay there in Dennis's retirement. I suspect Mrs Thatcher's right to buy did not apply to church property though.
> 
> ...



Truly an eyesore. Should never have been allowed!


----------



## Nivag (Nov 25, 2019)

CH1 said:


> 1. he married a divorced woman - not only that she was or had been a member of the Christian Brethren.


lol is that a different god then?


----------



## CH1 (Nov 25, 2019)

Nivag said:


> lol is that a different god then?


I think you might pose that question to Momentum if you wanted to be 21st century about it!


----------



## billythefish (Nov 25, 2019)

CH1 said:


> They did seem smug I agree. And their "design" gives them even more visual enjoyment of Brockwell Park than Cressingham residents, who are end-on so to speak.
> 
> In a way the church is as much a travesty as the grand design. The Rev Peterson was out of line with the C of E (Southwark Diocese) in several respects -
> 1. he married a divorced woman - not only that she was or had been a member of the Christian Brethren.
> ...


I remember walking past when the original programme was airing. They had a giant TV on the wall with all their chums watching and sipping bubbly. Aesthetics aside, I think the idea behind the design was excellent - to wrap the brickwork in a kind of overcoat so that the original bricks act like a storage heater. The carbon footprint of that house now is virtually zero. Just think of the huge stock of brick-built housing that could benefit from that around the country.


----------



## Mr paulee (Nov 26, 2019)

editor said:


> "leftfield Indie, Post Punk, Electronica, Techno, Jazz"....


I know.....


----------



## teuchter (Nov 26, 2019)

billythefish said:


> I think the idea behind the design was excellent - to wrap the brickwork in a kind of overcoat so that the original bricks act like a storage heater. The carbon footprint of that house now is virtually zero. Just think of the huge stock of brick-built housing that could benefit from that around the country.



It's a dead conventional concept - external wall insulation.

The thing is that most of the country's brick-built housing has quite attractive facades that most people don't want buried behind insulation. It sometimes works on the backs of houses but rarely on the street facade.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 26, 2019)

IIRC there wasn't actually much of the original structure left.


----------



## billythefish (Nov 27, 2019)

teuchter said:


> It's a dead conventional concept - external wall insulation.
> 
> The thing is that most of the country's brick-built housing has quite attractive facades that most people don't want buried behind insulation. It sometimes works on the backs of houses but rarely on the street facade.


It's not conventional on brickwork. It is very common with cladding systems on timber or steel frames and there are insulated rendering systems that are slowly gaining popularity, but to use those ceramic blocks (mortar free) was truly pioneering. Agreed about brick detailing on some buildings, but there are still hundreds of thousands of humdrum brick built terraces and semis around the country that would suffer no aesthetic harm with this treatment.


----------



## teuchter (Nov 27, 2019)

billythefish said:


> It's not conventional on brickwork. It is very common with cladding systems on timber or steel frames and there are insulated rendering systems that are slowly gaining popularity, but to use those ceramic blocks (mortar free) was truly pioneering. Agreed about brick detailing on some buildings, but there are still hundreds of thousands of humdrum brick built terraces and semis around the country that would suffer no aesthetic harm with this treatment.


It's really not uncommon to use those insulated render systems onto brickwork now. It's also not uncommon to apply insulation to a brick facade and then overclad it with something else. All that's different here is that the outermost layer (those imitation-tile bricks) is self-supporting instead of hung off the existing wall. In fact it basically turns it into a kind of cavity wall as we have been building in this country for decades. The tile bricks will contribute little to the thermal insulation. From a thermal insulation point of view, there was nothing pioneering about that project, unless I am missing something.


----------



## editor (Dec 17, 2019)

Art/fashion thingy at the Railway 























In photos: Fero Arts Collective fashion event at the Railway, Tulse Hill, Thurs  12th Dec 2019


----------



## Rushy (Dec 19, 2019)

Rushy said:


> Talking of local faces on tellybox, did anyone watch the last season of The Apprentice?


She won.
Lord Sugar hires his new Apprentice


----------



## twistedAM (Dec 19, 2019)

Rushy said:


> She won.
> Lord Sugar hires his new Apprentice



I only watched the episode on the music industry and she wasn't in the team of idiots.

Would still never frequent a business with artisan in the name though. Pet bug of mine is that word.


----------



## Smick (Dec 19, 2019)

twistedAM said:


> I only watched the episode on the music industry and she wasn't in the team of idiots.
> 
> Would still never frequent a business with artisan in the name though. Pet bug of mine is that word.



It's a fine little bakery and coffee shop though. Not too expensive, friendly staff. 

It will be interesting to keep an eye on it to see what happens with the Sugar investment. I suspect that it will be fuck all. If she expects UK domination, £250k won't go very far.


----------



## Rushy (Dec 19, 2019)

twistedAM said:


> I only watched the episode on the music industry and she wasn't in the team of idiots.
> 
> Would still never frequent a business with artisan in the name though. Pet bug of mine is that word.


It was Ye Olde Bakery when on Railton Road. They relocated to Milkwood Road (other side of the rail track) due to the arches refurbishment and became "Artisan" in the process (Artisan something d'Or, I think). I used it a handful of times before and after it relocated but I'm afraid that I was not a fan of their bread (and I'm not particularly fussy). I've not been in since it burned out and reinvented itself as a coffee shop so may have improved.


----------



## djdando (Dec 19, 2019)

twistedAM said:


> Would still never frequent a business with artisan in the name though. Pet bug of mine is that word.



The narrow mind of the left...


----------



## teuchter (Dec 20, 2019)

djdando said:


> The narrow mind of the left...


----------



## Johnlj123 (Dec 20, 2019)

They produce a fine small multi-seeded loaf for £2.50 which to my taste is absolutely fine.


----------



## gaijingirl (Dec 20, 2019)

Johnlj123 said:


> They produce a fine small multi-seeded loaf for £2.50 which to my taste is absolutely fine.



their multi-seed loaf is lovely.

I used to go there all the time when they were on the other side of the tracks - tons cheaper than Blackbird - but now, somehow I never go anymore.


----------



## RubyToogood (Dec 20, 2019)

It's not really very artisan at all, very standard old school high street bakery fare.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 20, 2019)

Rushy said:


> It was Ye Olde Bakery when on Railton Road. They relocated to Milkwood Road (other side of the rail track) due to the arches refurbishment and became "Artisan" in the process (Artisan something d'Or, I think). I used it a handful of times before and after it relocated but I'm afraid that I was not a fan of their bread (and I'm not particularly fussy). I've not been in since it burned out and reinvented itself as a coffee shop so may have improved.


I went right off them after a friend saw mice all over the baskets in the window one night.  They displayed bread put directly in those baskets, yuk.  No idea what its like now


----------



## gaijingirl (Dec 21, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> I went right off them after a friend saw mice all over the baskets in the window one night.  They displayed bread put directly in those baskets, yuk.  No idea what its like now


----------



## shakespearegirl (Dec 21, 2019)

I went there a few times back when they were on Railton, very old fashioned style bakery. Blackbird was tonnes nicer, although much more expensive.

there was a definite upgrade when they moved, quite like the greengrocers who changed their offer quite a lot.

I tried to go into the new bakery once but was roundly ignored by chatting staff and left.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Dec 24, 2019)

friendofdorothy said:


> I went right off them after a friend saw mice all over the baskets in the window one night.  They displayed bread put directly in those baskets, yuk.  No idea what its like now




Good job no one told 'Lord Sugar' about this!


----------



## editor (Jan 10, 2020)

Stay classy, Sainsburys.









						Sainsbury's apology after shopper with guide dog "told to leave" Herne Hill store - Southwark News
					

Local MP Helen Hayes described her experience as “completely unacceptable” and pledged to take up the complaint with Sainsbury’s, as hundreds shared their support online.




					www.southwarknews.co.uk


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 17, 2020)

I avoid using that Sainsburys. I read once that it makes the most profit per square foot of all the Sainburys, so it beats me why the staff can't be better trained/ more helpful. The 'Local' bit of the name means they trade on Sainburys branding/reputation but are much more expensive.

The little shop on Halfmoon Lane (next to Fourways pharmacy) - is tiny with not much space to move, but it is so much better stocked on many products and is sometimes cheaper, and they stock loads of fairtrade and organic stuff. The staff are very nice and helpful in there (but don't know how they are with guide dogs)


----------



## Ms T (Jan 25, 2020)

All of the newly refurbished shops in the Arches seem to be subject to a possession order.  I will ask Elaine what is going on and report back.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 25, 2020)

Squatters were in the red one for a while, sadly gone now. There’s still no power in them and no real idea where the substation is going to go.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 25, 2020)

Ms T said:


> All of the newly refurbished shops in the Arches seem to be subject to a possession order.  I will ask Elaine what is going on and report back.


Do you mean the arches on Milkwood rd? What is happpening now?


----------



## editor (Feb 4, 2020)

The end of junk shops? Society For The Protection of Unwanted Objects in Herne Hill closing down


----------



## editor (Feb 4, 2020)

Apparently this is the Half Moon in 1896 before rebuilding


----------



## T & P (Feb 4, 2020)

editor said:


> Apparently this is the Half Moon in 1896 before rebuilding
> 
> View attachment 197567


I wonder if one of the gentlemen on the forecourt is Mickey Two Suits's great-grandfather....


----------



## Jimbeau (Feb 4, 2020)

editor said:


> Apparently this is the Half Moon in 1896 before rebuilding
> 
> View attachment 197567


Great pic. The pedant in me guesses that this is a few years earlier - given that it says 1896 in big letters on the current pub! 😉


----------



## euanlowe (Feb 7, 2020)

Planning application for a 29 storey building at Hardess Street





						19/04280/FUL     |              Demolition of existing retail and industrial buildings and erection of a car free, part 3, part 20, part 29-storey mixed-use podium building comprising 2073m2 of employment floorspace (Use Class B1 a) and c)) with ancillary sandwich bar/cafe(Use Classes A1/A3) and site caretakers accommodation, an industrial yard of 55m2 and 170 dwellings with associated disabled car parking, cycle and bin stores, and hard and soft landscaping.                   |                                                                      1, 3-11 Wellfit Street, 7-9 Hinton Road & Units 1-4 Hardess Street London SE24 0HN
					






					planning.lambeth.gov.uk


----------



## Crispy (Feb 7, 2020)

Loughborough Junction chitter-chatter I'd have thought...


----------



## euanlowe (Feb 7, 2020)

I'll try remove it!

Nope - can only edit it. My mistake I apologize.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 8, 2020)

It's of relevance to herne hill folk as it'll be visible from much of HH. It's also a continuation of precedence-setting for high rise buildings in the area. There are sites in HH being eyed for similar proposals.


----------



## coldwaterswim (Feb 12, 2020)

New plant based restaurant opening in Herne Hill today

Home | Peachygoat


----------



## editor (Feb 12, 2020)

coldwaterswim said:


> New plant based restaurant opening in Herne Hill today
> 
> Home | Peachygoat


£14 burger. Ouch!


----------



## coldwaterswim (Feb 12, 2020)

editor said:


> £14 burger. Ouch!


I know right.
15 quid bangers and mash too.


----------



## editor (Feb 12, 2020)

coldwaterswim said:


> I know right.
> 15 quid bangers and mash too.


I want to support vegan alternatives but I can't justify that kind of money for a burger.


----------



## Rushy (Feb 12, 2020)

Why are so many vegan restaurant menus so heavily dependent on fake meat options?


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 13, 2020)

coldwaterswim said:


> New plant based restaurant opening in Herne Hill today
> 
> Home | Peachygoat



I was going through Herne Hill on the bus recently and noticed a crowd of well heeled, 'brunch types' huddled around a shop intently reading and discussing a sign in the window and taking photos of the shop front. It was this place. I had a feeling it wouldnt be the type of place to get me all hot and bothered with a name like 'Peachy Goat' (very cool!), and well that is definitely now the case, having seen the menu.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 13, 2020)

The best deal there must be £16 for some spaghetti and cream sauce. There isnt even any fake meat involved. literally a food that was traditionally eaten by poor shepherds, now served up in Herne Hill for £16 a portion.


----------



## shakespearegirl (Feb 13, 2020)

Wow, that’s super pricy given the ingredients must cost about 50p


----------



## Mr paulee (Feb 13, 2020)

The GP on that cuisine must be huge.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Feb 13, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Why are so many vegan restaurant menus so heavily dependent on fake meat options?


You can pretend you're eating real food.

The name is so crap too. Peachy goat?


----------



## coldwaterswim (Feb 13, 2020)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> The best deal there must be £16 for some spaghetti and cream sauce. There isnt even any fake meat involved. literally a food that was traditionally eaten by poor shepherds, now served up in Herne Hill for £16 a portion.



I wouldn't like to think how much the booze is...


----------



## Ms T (Feb 14, 2020)

The menu is not very sustainable or particularly exciting - asparagus in February?


----------



## editor (Feb 14, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> You can pretend you're eating real food.


Or you can enjoy a tasty nutritious product that isn't the result of cruelty and slaughter and is less detrimental to the environment.
As for the daft 'real food' nonsense, loads of world class vegans seem to do pretty well out of a non 'real food' diet.


----------



## editor (Feb 14, 2020)

Ms T said:


> The menu is not very sustainable or particularly exciting - asparagus in February?


No different from most other expensive restaurants in the area, I imagine. 
Does their blurb make any claim to them being 'sustainable' (notwithstanding the fact that a vegan diet is almost certainly going to be more sustainable than a meat based one)?

I'm not defending them though - their prices seem well steep, and serving up non seasonal food suggests that they could think this through better.

I wish all these nu-businesses could be more like Cafe Van Gogh. Brixton’s not-for-profit Cafe Van Gogh launches crowdfunder campaign to create more space for trainees


----------



## goldengraham (Feb 14, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Why are so many vegan restaurant menus so heavily dependent on fake meat options?



Fake meat is largely aimed drawing in meat eaters who want to eat less meat. Even in a veggie restaurant, it's a good idea to have something that tries to present itself to meat eaters. The reality is that people who go out to eat tend to be in mixed omnivorous/veggie/vegan groups and they want a range of appealing stuff on the menu, which is why tapas/meze style places are doing so well at the moment


----------



## Rushy (Feb 14, 2020)

goldengraham said:


> Fake meat is largely aimed drawing in meat eaters who want to eat less meat. Even in a veggie restaurant, it's a good idea to have something that tries to present itself to meat eaters. The reality is that people who go out to eat tend to be in mixed omnivorous/veggie/vegan groups and they want a range of appealing stuff on the menu, which is why tapas/meze style places are doing so well at the moment


I am one of these meat eaters who has steadily been eating less meat over the years (although I did just have a really rather lovely piece of lamb for Valentine's lunch). I barely eat any meat substitutes at home (occasionally Quorn mince for a bolognese or chilli-quorn-carne). I entirely agree with you that it's a good idea for a veggie restaurant to have something that presents itself as meat to the meat eaters. However, on this menu two of only three dishes in the"mains" list are fake burgers and fake sausages.  The other three dishes which can be taken as mains are all fake pasta with either fake cheese or fake meat.

Does a vegan restaurant really need to have its offering almost entirely dictated by meat eaters who they presume cannot even stomach the idea of eating vegetarian food for one evening? Even though I have lately been pretty impressed by fake meat (the similarly priced vegan burger at Honest was delicious) I don't find a mains menu of fake meat a draw in the slightest. Vegan and vegetarian cooking can quite literally be anything. It is such a disappointment to find that this one is all fake cheese, fake meat and fake pasta. Mimosa before it had more vegetarian and vegan options.

I took a vegetarian friend to the Vegan place which at one time replaced Brazas on Tulse Hill. On the front of the menu was a picture of a beautiful looking salad. But you could not actually order it. Everything was fake fried chicken wings, fake burgers, fake sausages, fake cheese on toast etc.. We all felt gross once we'd left.

That said, I've no objection to their offering other than that, even though I would welcome a good vegetarian restaurant, it is not particularly appealing to me.


----------



## Ms T (Feb 14, 2020)

I think I am most offended by the grocer’s apostrophe in “Menu’s”. 😂


----------



## friendofdorothy (Feb 14, 2020)

Ms T said:


> I thin’ I am most offended by the grocer’s apostrophe in “Menu’s”. 😂


the horror the horror!


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 2, 2020)

Is Agile rabbit done already?


----------



## editor (Mar 2, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> Is Agile rabbit done already?


Their website is still up - Agile Rabbit | Herne Hill Menu
What have you heard?


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 2, 2020)

editor said:


> Their website is still up - Agile Rabbit | Herne Hill Menu
> What have you heard?


Just went past there and there was re-fitting going on, maybe they're still there.


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Mar 3, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> Just went past there and there was re-fitting going on, maybe they're still there.


I'd be surprised if they reopen (I think that site is cursed). Was way to expensive and nowhere near as good as 500 Degrees, just around the corner.


----------



## editor (Mar 3, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> I'd be surprised if they reopen (I think that site is cursed). Was way to expensive and nowhere near as good as 500 Degrees, just around the corner.


I've never been impressed by the Agile Rabbit pizzas in the Villaaaage, although I had a really rubbish one from the Brixton 500 Degrees recently.


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Mar 3, 2020)

Indeed: the 500 Degrees in Herne Hill is better than their Brixton branch.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 3, 2020)

The 500 degrees in East Dulwich is always empty. Quite why the hoardes of yummy mummys taking their darlings for an after school pizza havent colonised it, ill never know. You can never get near Franco Manca a few doors up, you can practically smell the crayons, colouring in books, and posh tellings off as you walk by it in the street.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 3, 2020)

There’s a sign in the agile window saying it’s being refurbed and reopening in March. It was doing ok - peaks and troughs of busyness. Doesn’t help that general footfall is down due to the Network Rail cock up on the empty shop units - 2 years on.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 3, 2020)

I thought 500 degrees was a bit meh last time I was in, i prefer agile rabbit.


----------



## Nivag (Mar 3, 2020)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> The 500 degrees in East Dulwich is always empty. Quite why the hoardes of yummy mummys taking their darlings for an after school pizza havent colonised it, ill never know. You can never get near Franco Manca a few doors up, you can practically smell the crayons, colouring in books, and posh tellings off as you walk by it in the street.


I don't think I've ever seen more than 1 table being used in East Dulwich every time I walked past or waiting at the bus stop.


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Mar 3, 2020)

The Herne Hill Yummies seem to gravitate to the cavernous Pizza Express as they hand out crayons (no room in 500 Degrees for that sort of things)


----------



## Mr paulee (Mar 3, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> The Herne Hill Yummies seem to gravitate to the cavernous Pizza Express as they hand out crayons (no room in 500 Degrees for that sort of things)


That place needs a buggy park weekdays. Crazy amount of kids


----------



## Rushy (Mar 3, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> There’s a sign in the agile window saying it’s being refurbed and reopening in March. It was doing ok - peaks and troughs of busyness. Doesn’t help that general footfall is down due to the Network Rail cock up on the empty shop units - 2 years on.


Last two times I went the pizzas were horrible. I mean really horrible. Neither of us came close to finishing them, which is otherwise unheard of. And the service varies between on the one hand lovely and personal and, oto, incompetent and rude. There are plenty of other reliable choices for pizza and yet another one opening in the Lido. But it's a shame as I really like the venue and location.


----------



## choochi (Mar 5, 2020)

I saw a sign up a while ago saying it was closed due to a “restructuring” of the business.


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Mar 12, 2020)

Sign outside yesterday stating it reopens this weekend under the name of "Bistro Brockwell Park". Hope it's as good as Robin's Nest.


----------



## editor (Mar 12, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> Indeed: the 500 Degrees in Herne Hill is better than their Brixton branch.


Definitely. I've always had decent pizzas from there.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 12, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> There’s a sign in the agile window saying it’s being refurbed and reopening in March. It was doing ok - peaks and troughs of busyness. Doesn’t help that general footfall is down due to the Network Rail cock up on the empty shop units - 2 years on.


According to a new sign, Brockwell Park Bistro opening soon...


----------



## Smick (Mar 15, 2020)

No sign of a Coronavirus slowdown at the Sunday market. People queuing to get their £3 brownies and sausage rolls.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 15, 2020)

Medleys? I'd never heard of it. 









						The takeaway that wants to be healthy by stealth
					

Childhood obesity is on the rise – and so is Britain’s takeaway market. One new outlet aims to deliver delicious, affordable food… that just happens to be better for you




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Mr paulee (Mar 15, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Medleys? I'd never heard of it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Food is very good.
My nephews loved it.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 15, 2020)

Mr paulee said:


> Food is very good.
> My nephews loved it.


Looking forward to giving it a try. How long has it been there? Is it anything to do with that other healthy eating arch which used to house Deliciously Ella's?


----------



## Big Bertha (Mar 15, 2020)

choochi said:


> I saw a sign up a while ago saying it was closed due to a “restructuring” of the business.


I know someone who was offered the heads chefs job and he turned it down because it looked like amateur hour.


----------



## _rickjames (Mar 16, 2020)

People queing outside Dugards. We really are through the looking glass...


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 18, 2020)

Quiz cancelled at regent last night and only a dozen or so customers. Word was it would close due to lack of custom. Anyone been there today? Or any news of other local closures?


----------



## editor (Mar 19, 2020)

Looks like the rent rises have done for Off The Cuff








						London’s Off The Cuff music venue launches £35,000 crowdfunder in face of ‘obscene rent increases’
					

The popular Off The Cuff music venue in Herne Hill has launched a crowdfunder with an ambitious target of £35,000 as they look to stay open in the face of rent rises and the devastating impact of t…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 19, 2020)

I'm normally woken up on Thursdays by the bin.  And recycling lorries. It seems quiet . I can't hear sirens or traffic.  Is everyone still in bed?


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 19, 2020)

They were there this morning as usual


----------



## little_legs (Mar 21, 2020)

Half Moon Lane, today @ 09:15 :-(


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 21, 2020)

What happened? Traffic collision? I heard the sirens.


----------



## lordnoise (Mar 21, 2020)

More toilet roll crime imo ...


----------



## Gramsci (Mar 21, 2020)

editor said:


> Looks like the rent rises have done for Off The Cuff
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I do think that as "we" are now all supposed to be pulling together to defeat the virus after it is over their should be a day of reckoning for landlords.

All rent should now be suspended.

Once this crisis is over there should be rent controls on landlords to help rebuild the economy and move it away from just benefiting the rentier class towards those who actually work for a living.


----------



## Gramsci (Mar 21, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> I do think that as "we" are now all supposed to be pulling together to defeat the virus after it is over their should be a day of reckoning for landlords.
> 
> All rent should now be suspended.
> 
> Once this crisis is over there should be rent controls on landlords to help rebuild the economy and move it away from just benefiting the rentier class towards those who actually work for a living.



editor  can Big Bertha  be banned from the Brixton Forum section of Urban75 for the duration of this crisis?

I don't need my posts being laughed at during this difficult time.

Urban is most important to me at this time and II don't need the antics of this poster during this time.


----------



## Gramsci (Mar 21, 2020)

Big Bertha changing it to a like doesn't fool me.

You put a laughing symbol on my post and changed it to a like once I asked editor to ban you.

I don't need you on this site during this time. Its a difficult time and your trolling and wind ups aren't needed here imo..


----------



## Big Bertha (Mar 21, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> Big Bertha changing it to a like doesn't fool me.
> 
> You put a laughing symbol on my post and changed it to a like once I asked editor to ban you.
> 
> I don't need you on this site during this time. Its a difficult time and your trolling and wind ups aren't needed here imo..



Calm down. I’m sorry I upset you. 

I shall remove the ‘like’

Would it be possible for editor to put us on mutual ignore? I would very much like that


----------



## Gramsci (Mar 21, 2020)

What ru trying to say by just quoting my post with no comment? I want you banned..


----------



## Big Bertha (Mar 21, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> What ru trying to say by just quoting my post with no comment? I want you banned..


I replied but somehow it ended up within the quote!

I shall try to edit it....


----------



## editor (Mar 21, 2020)

Big Bertha said:


> Calm down. I’m sorry I upset you.
> 
> I shall remove the ‘like’
> 
> Would it be possible for editor to put us on mutual ignore? I would very much like that


You're proving quite a handful for a new poster. I strongly suggest you do not respond or refer to any of Gramsci's posts from now on.


----------



## Gramsci (Mar 21, 2020)

Big Bertha said:


> Calm down. I’m sorry I upset you.
> 
> I shall remove the ‘like’



It was deliberate wind up.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 22, 2020)

_rickjames said:


> People queing outside Dugards. We really are through the looking glass...



Busier than Xmas apparently but without the fun. They were completely out of chicken yesterday.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 22, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> What happened? Traffic collision? I heard the sirens.


There were armed police in a patrol car in  Brockwell Park yesterday afternoon and three police cars parked nearby plus a helicopter overhead. Something serious had clearly gone down.


----------



## Crispy (Mar 22, 2020)

hernehill.direct - hernehill Resources and Information.
					

hernehill.direct is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, hernehill.direct has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!




					hernehill.direct
				




Local shops getting together to offer their services online


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Mar 24, 2020)

FAO: Greg. Hello Greg, thank you very much for helping my son today in Herne Hill (he fell off his scooter). Much appreciated, his dad


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 24, 2020)

Does anyone know if any shops have bread flour in stock? I tried Hamilton, costcutters, little shop near fourways pharmacy and Tescos? other shops had queues so I didn't venture in.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 24, 2020)

The refill place on half moon lane?


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 24, 2020)

Hope you’re all well?


----------



## Biddlybee (Mar 25, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> Does anyone know if any shops have bread flour in stock? I tried Hamilton, costcutters, little shop near fourways pharmacy and Tescos? other shops had queues so I didn't venture in.


Let me know if you find anywhere


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 25, 2020)

Someone is optimistically fitting out one of the empty shops on the station parade bit.


----------



## editor (Mar 25, 2020)

Herne Hill groups in this listing: 








						Lambeth & Coronavirus: full listing of local WhatsApp support groups (updated 14th May 2020)
					

Looking to help connect local people who need support, the Lambeth Covid 19 Mutual Aid group already has over 4,700 members on Facebook and they’ve set up multiple WhatsApp support groups for…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 25, 2020)

And local businesses direct buying:






						hernehill.direct - hernehill Resources and Information.
					

hernehill.direct is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, hernehill.direct has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!




					hernehill.direct


----------



## editor (Mar 25, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> And local businesses direct buying:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I covered them too!  There's one coming for Brixton soon too. Great idea. 








						Herne Hill Direct – a community shopping site for small businesses during the coronavirus crisis
					

The newly launched Herne Hill Direct is a community shopping site for small businesses in the Herne Hill and surrounding areas, which enables people who are in Self or Enforced Isolation due to Cov…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 25, 2020)

<deleted for safety's sake>


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 25, 2020)

I’d avoid judging by what I was told they did to kitchen staff


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 25, 2020)

Also I’d he licensed for that?


----------



## editor (Mar 25, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> I’d avoid judging by what I was told they did to kitchen staff


Oh ,do tell!


snowy_again said:


> Also I’d he licensed for that?


I was thinking that. I see no provision for pubs to sell booze from their premises, only breweries, although I wish they would make it easy for pubs to sell off the stock that would otherwise go to waste.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 25, 2020)

I should keep schtum - still know too many of them and don’t want my comments to have any negative impact on them


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 25, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> I should keep schtum - still know too many of them and don’t want my comments to have any negative impact on them


I know you're not keen on the place but its still my nearest local. 



editor said:


> stock that would otherwise go to waste.


  I hate the thought of fresh beer going to waste.


----------



## editor (Mar 25, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> I know you're not keen on the place but its still my nearest local.
> 
> I hate the thought of fresh beer going to waste.


I've deleted your comment, just in case they're not licensed. Hope you're OK with that?


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 25, 2020)

The owner has been tweeting it


----------



## Smick (Mar 25, 2020)

The Florence is closing as well. I got an email.

I see a pub in Nunhead is selling off kegs for £80









						The Ivy House
					

The Ivy House, London, United Kingdom. 4,334 likes · 24 talking about this · 9,085 were here. The Ivy House is London's first co-operatively owned pub. Recently named #11 Coolest Pub in Britain by...




					www.facebook.com


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 30, 2020)

Smick said:


> The Florence is closing as well. I got an email.


Sad to see the florence has its windows boarded up.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 30, 2020)

Quick shop report from my walk today, early afternoon:

Herne Hill DIY shop is serving people from the doorway. 

The greengrocers, Duggards and the bakery next door are all well stocked and restricting the numbers of customers in the shop at any one time. No queues.

There were queues outside both tesco and sainsburys. Could see if they had much stock in (I avoid both those shops anyway, certainly would queue for them)

The Newsagents is open - stocked with milk, juice and softdrinks as well as other bits and bobs (most drinks are cheaper there than in those 'super'markets)

The plastic free shop was closed - not sure if this is permanent or temp.

Glad to see the Hammy has poster on the door warning against GREED,  no restrictions on old people's shopping and that NHS workers with ID can have a discount.


Mostly I went from shop to shop asking from the doorways 'have you got any flour?' and it was a 'no' from Duggards, Sesame and the small shop next to Fourways pharmacy. But hooray! I was able to buy some self raising flour at the Hammy - so no home made bread yet but yippee cake for tea! Has the entire world suddenly taken up baking?


----------



## organicpanda (Mar 30, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> Quick shop report from my walk today, early afternoon:
> 
> Herne Hill DIY shop is serving people from the doorway.
> 
> ...


if you're still looking for bread flour the Brixton Wholefoods has 16kg sacks of flour in stock as of 5.30 this afternoon, no queues and a one in one out door policy


----------



## Biddlybee (Mar 30, 2020)

I'd be happy to go in on a sack to share friendofdorothy, think we live quite close to each other. Ms T ?


----------



## teuchter (Mar 30, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> Has the entire world suddenly taken up baking?


I have baked two loaves of bread in the past week. I have not done this before.


----------



## T & P (Mar 30, 2020)

I haven’t baked anything per se but I did convert a couple of plain frozen baguettes into  garlic bread, which for me is impressive.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 30, 2020)

organicpanda said:


> if you're still looking for bread flour the Brixton Wholefoods has 16kg sacks of flour in stock as of 5.30 this afternoon, no queues and a one in one out door policy


do they sell it in smaller quantities?



Biddlybee said:


> I'd be happy to go in on a sack to share friendofdorothy, think we live quite close to each other. Ms T ?


but how could we divide it without contact?


----------



## organicpanda (Mar 30, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> do they sell it in smaller quantities?
> 
> 
> but how could we divide it without contact?


I didn't ask but I presume if you take your own container they would weigh it out for you


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 30, 2020)

organicpanda said:


> I didn't ask but I presume if you take your own container they would weigh it out for you



Thanks will try that.


----------



## Biddlybee (Mar 31, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> but how could we divide it without contact?


 no idea, sorry.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 31, 2020)

We would be up for getting some flour too, about 2kg. What kind of flour is it?.


----------



## organicpanda (Mar 31, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> We would be up for getting some flour too, about 2kg. What kind of flour is it?.


sorry I didn't ask, Tony seemed excited (for him) to have big bags of flour in, you could try calling them to save a wasted journey


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 31, 2020)

No flour at Brixton Wholefoods today. Or at Sesame. 

Both places said try tomorrow, but I don't want to go to shops everyday, queuing isn't good exercise.


----------



## editor (Apr 4, 2020)

Small photo feature Photos: The Herne Hill street piano in lockdown during the lockdown


----------



## euanlowe (Apr 4, 2020)

Brockwell park closed tomorrow


----------



## Big Bertha (Apr 4, 2020)

euanlowe said:


> Brockwell park closed tomorrow



...and a good thing too.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 4, 2020)

Brockwell park = 50 hectares = 500,000 square metres.
500,000 square metres divided by 3000 people = 166 square metres each. That means each person could stand in the middle of a square measuring 13 metres by 13 metres.

That's if the 3000 people all went to the park at the same time. If people each went to the park for 4 hours, spread over a 12 hour period, there would be 1000 people in the park at any one time. 500 square metres each.

Many people have no outside space at home. If the park is not crowded (and it doesn't seem like it was) then I don't see the problem with spending a couple of hours sunbathing instead of exercising. Whatever helps you get through this.

If people are gathering in groups then for sure, break them up.

Closing the park seems a bit of an over-reaction and I reckon it'll probably backfire.


----------



## Smick (Apr 4, 2020)

I was in the park at 10 this morning and it didn't seem that bad. Yellow posters had been put up, asking runners to keep to the grass and off the path. Most were complying.

I agree with teuchter , it's not right to close it down. You'll displace the people using it. They'll go to Clapham, Tooting, Dulwich and bring the problem there.

Why not put some signs up first, disperse crowds, increase visible patrols?

Edit - anyone remember this....









						Save Lambeth Park Rangers
					

Park Rangers: Lambeth is proposing to cut the park ranger service completely.  The Rangers in Lambeth are fantastic and have helped the local community a lot - organising events and getting things done.  They have one of the best community park services in London and it would be a shame to...




					www.urban75.net
				




Stupid fucking Lambeth.


----------



## editor (Apr 5, 2020)

Smick said:


> I was in the park at 10 this morning and it didn't seem that bad. Yellow posters had been put up, asking runners to keep to the grass and off the path. Most were complying.
> 
> I agree with teuchter , it's not right to close it down. You'll displace the people using it. They'll go to Clapham, Tooting, Dulwich and bring the problem there.
> 
> ...


I stopped walking up for my daily stroll through Brockwell Park because it started to feel a bit unsafe with so many wanker joggers puffing past right next to me. It wasn't just one or two almost brushing my shoulder as they sweated past on their vital jog - it was about one in three and there are shitloads of joggers in that park. I've been sticking to the quieter parks, although I dare say they'll be filling up with displaced Brockwell joggers.


----------



## Big Bertha (Apr 5, 2020)

Crowds consist of people not just joggers!


----------



## nagapie (Apr 5, 2020)

I take my children for a walk around the park every day. This is their only outdoor activity, they really need it. The park can be busy but everyone is maintaining distance. I think it's highly unlikely that we would get CV that way. 
I'm tired of all the blame foisted on the general population when the failings to contain or reduce the virus are down to inept government responses not people just trying to get food or stay sane.
Typical knee jerk reaction from Lambeth.


----------



## Smick (Apr 5, 2020)

Of course if you live in a large house in Herne Hill, you’ve got the choice of your front or back garden in which to sunbathe. But if you’re in flats with no outdoor space, what are you supposed to do?

Just sitting in the park shouldn’t be seen as negative.

And, as nagapie says, this is the outdoor activity for kids. The alternative is to walk them round the pavements.



> I stopped walking up for my daily stroll through Brockwell Park because it started to feel a bit unsafe with so many wanker joggers puffing past right next to me. It wasn't just one or two almost brushing my shoulder as they sweated past on their vital jog - it was about one in three and there are shitloads of joggers in that park. I've been sticking to the quieter parks, although I dare say they'll be filling up with displaced Brockwell joggers



There are posters up trying to address that. If people are still uncomfortable with the joggers, they can stay away from the perimeter path. There are all manner of people whose behaviour isn’t ideal, including my kids, but it’s all avoidable within the confines of the park. 

A properly resourced ranger service to give out advice, disperse larger crowds would be invaluable now.


----------



## euanlowe (Apr 5, 2020)

There seems to be concerted campaign, by media and politicians, to blame current infections on people going to the park. Smells rank given so many are still forced to work in call centres etc. Only widespread testing can transition the country out of the shutdown, but topic apears to bore people.


----------



## nagapie (Apr 5, 2020)

euanlowe said:


> There seems to be concerted campaign, by media and politicians, to blame current infections on people going to the park. Smells rank given so many are still forced to work in call centres etc. Only widespread testing can transition the country out of the shutdown, but topic apears to bore people.


As usual blame the people to detract from the failings higher up.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 8, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Brockwell park = 50 hectares = 500,000 square metres.
> 500,000 square metres divided by 3000 people = 166 square metres each. That means each person could stand in the middle of a square measuring 13 metres by 13 metres.
> 
> That's if the 3000 people all went to the park at the same time. If people each went to the park for 4 hours, spread over a 12 hour period, there would be 1000 people in the park at any one time. 500 square metres each.
> ...



This was discussed on Radio 4's "more or less" just now. They asked the question anyone should ask when a "large number" is used to justify something - is it really a large number. Some of their conclusions (if I heard/remembered the numbers correctly):

Google data says that on a busy Saturday, the park might see 10,000 visitors. So it was substantially less busy than normal.
Same data suggests that the busiest hour sees 14% of the daily visitors. So that means that at the busiest hour, there were about 420 people in the park. Half of my estimate above.

So Lambeth's announcement didn't justify what was perhaps someone's panicked decision based on hearsay, without a check as to whether there was really a problem at all.


----------



## Gramsci (Apr 8, 2020)

It sounded to me like the Police were putting out these figures and asked the Council to close the park. Which they did without question.

The Council have done this before. The fence around the park for the Country Fair is example.

The Council should be there to stick up for local people not meekly go along with whatever suits the cops.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 8, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> It sounded to me like the Police were putting out these figures and asked the Council to close the park. Which they did without question.
> 
> The Council have done this before. The fence around the park for the Country Fair is example.
> 
> The Council should be there to stick up for local people not meekly go along with whatever suits the cops.


I don't really do twitter but if I did maybe I would tweet this link to Lambeth (and maybe also the police) for their education.









						More or Less - Coronavirus deaths, face masks and a potential baby boom - BBC Sounds
					

Is the coronavirus death count misleading because of delays in reporting?




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




They discuss the closure of Brockwell Park from around 20.00 onwards.

It's really important that decisions are made based on good information. The consequences of not checking stuff properly have an impact on people who are already finding things difficult.


----------



## footballerslegs (Apr 8, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> No flour at Brixton Wholefoods today. Or at Sesame.
> 
> Both places said try tomorrow, but I don't want to go to shops everyday, queuing isn't good exercise.



If you’re still looking, Jarr has wholemeal and plain bread flour in stock (or at least, the did as of this morning). And they deliver locally. Their website is here which has order details (email jess@jarrmarket.co.uk) and stock/price list: Zero Waste Shop London | Jarr Market | London


----------



## teuchter (Apr 9, 2020)

Coronavirus: Flour mills working 'round the clock' to meet demand
					

The industry is struggling to keep up with demand as shoppers turn to baking amid the coronavirus lockdown.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 10, 2020)

footballerslegs said:


> If you’re still looking, Jarr has wholemeal and plain bread flour in stock (or at least, the did as of this morning). And they deliver locally. Their website is here which has order details (email jess@jarrmarket.co.uk) and stock/price list: Zero Waste Shop London | Jarr Market | London


thanks for the tip. I'll email them thanks


----------



## Ms T (Apr 11, 2020)

Sesami has Wessex Mill white bread flour which is my preferred brand! 😂


----------



## gaijingirl (Apr 11, 2020)

Ms T said:


> Sesami has Wessex Mill white bread flour which is my preferred brand! 😂



oooh!


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## T & P (Apr 30, 2020)

I apologise in advance for posting a link to the Torygraph (only a tiny bit of the article is outside of the paywall anyway), but I noticed yesterday that Herne Hill was mentioned in the review of a new book about WWII, showing a photograph of women in the RAF excercising in a large garden somewhere in Herne Hill. Does anyone have any idea where this might have been?









						Britain’s War: A New World, 1942-47, by Daniel Todman, review: a superb work of absolute clarity
					

It is nearly impossible, given the vast battery of literature on the subject, to write a history of the Second World War from the British perspective that says much that is original.




					www.telegraph.co.uk


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## Crispy (Apr 30, 2020)

Given the date (1944) everything in this picture could be demolished by now.


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## T & P (Apr 30, 2020)

Apart from the size of the garden, the building in the background (which presumably the garden belongs to) looks like a proper mansion, almost country estate-like. I cannot think of any housing in the area that looks like that, so I suspect you might be right about being likely to have been demolished since.


----------



## dbs1fan (Apr 30, 2020)

Love the pic!


----------



## T & P (Apr 30, 2020)

Getty images has in their portfolio an image of women war workers making life saving devices for the RAF in what is very likely to be the same property. It certainly was a splendid-looking garden...


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## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

Here's a bigger version, where you can see more of the buildings.







It's tempting to think it might have been one of the big houses that were once along Denmark Hill / Herne Hill - but actually the ones that were demolished were mostly all gone by 1944 anyway.

I am now going to become obsessed with working out where this was. Thanks T & P


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## Crispy (Apr 30, 2020)

It's June (says so in the Getty image description) and the shadows are quite short, so we can assume it's close to midday. Therefore we're looking for a pair of mirrored buildings that face South-East to South-West, with relatively flat ground (not a lot of that in the area)

This 1895 map overlay might help:





__





						Explore georeferenced maps - Map images - National Library of Scotland
					





					maps.nls.uk


----------



## T & P (Apr 30, 2020)

If it comes to it, I'll take one for the team and order a copy of the book in the Telegraph article. It sounds like an interesting read anyway.


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## Jimbeau (Apr 30, 2020)

T & P said:


> Apart from the size of the garden, the building in the background (which presumably the garden belongs to) looks like a proper mansion, almost country estate-like. I cannot think of any housing in the area that looks like that, so I suspect you might be right about being likely to have been demolished since.


There's not a lot of post-war housing in HH. But the area that's now Delawyk Crescent/Courtmead Close was still big houses at the end of WWII. My bet is it's 4 Burbage Road.





__





						Explore georeferenced maps - Map images - National Library of Scotland
					





					maps.nls.uk


----------



## Crispy (Apr 30, 2020)

T & P said:


> Getty images has in their portfolio an image of women war workers making life saving devices for the RAF in what is very likely to be the same property. It certainly was a splendid-looking garden...



Taken on the same day. You can play match-the-woman between them


----------



## Crispy (Apr 30, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> There's not a lot of post-war housing in HH. But the area that's now Delawyk Crescent/Courtmead Close was still big houses at the end of WWII. My bet is it's 4 Burbage Road.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Not sure the sun angle is possible there. And I think we'd be able to see the shape of the houses more like:



and maybe even that greenhouse in the garden


----------



## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

This is an aerial view of Burbage Rd in 1924 (looking north-west, railway viaduct at bottom of image). Houses are not the right shape.


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## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

I do however have a sense that it might be in the Dulwich-y direction.

(Or, the photo is simply mis-labelled and it's in Herne bay or somewhere)


----------



## T & P (Apr 30, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> There's not a lot of post-war housing in HH. But the area that's now Delawyk Crescent/Courtmead Close was still big houses at the end of WWII. My bet is it's 4 Burbage Road.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


4 Burbage Road seems like a very good bet, more so if the crisscrossed shape in the garden indicates a greenhouse or glasshouse.

ETA: Having just seen teuchter's image, perhaps not...


----------



## T & P (Apr 30, 2020)

teuchter said:


> I do however have a sense that it might be in the Dulwich-y direction.
> 
> (Or, the photo is simply mis-labelled and it's in Herne bay or somewhere)


Mmm... I hope you're wrong about Herne Bay though it could be. There is an RAF Air Cadets centre in Hanover Square, and the land it sits on would have been large enough to accommodate the footprint of the property in the image.


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## Jimbeau (Apr 30, 2020)

Good find Teuchter. You're right - not No. 4 Burbage then. Anything else on your aerial images look promising - what about along Half Moon Lane? 

Herne Hill is such a small area really. You can't go far in any direction before it becomes LJ, Tulse Hill, Dulwich, Denmark Hill or Brixton. 

Those lancet windows and gingerbread barge boards remind me more of houses around Crystal Palace or Forest Hill than HH.


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## T & P (Apr 30, 2020)

If we are happy to entertain the possibility that whoever labelled that photograph got the location wrong, may I propose the area bordering the northwestern tip of Brockwell Park, such as the western end of Dulwich Road or such back streets as Brailsford Road?

Some big fuck off houses still survive around there today, and when you walk towards the northwestern exit of the park, some of the houses bordering the perimeter fence kind of look similar to this one. The area is officially Brixton not Herne Hill of course, but one can see how someone not too familiar with it could have easily made such mistake.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> Good find Teuchter. You're right - not No. 4 Burbage then. Anything else on your aerial images look promising - what about along Half Moon Lane?



No, not so far anyway.



Jimbeau said:


> Herne Hill is such a small area really. You can't go far in any direction before it becomes LJ, Tulse Hill, Dulwich, Denmark Hill or Brixton.
> 
> Those lancet windows and gingerbread barge boards remind me more of houses around Crystal Palace or Forest Hill than HH.



I agree, those kind of houses feel like they should be a bit further out.

I can quite imagine some photographer who didn't know south london getting a train to Herne Hill then a bus or a taxi somewhere a couple of miles away, and wherever that was, it would have been "Herne Hill" to them. So I wouldn't be surprised if it's a bit outside what we'd think of as Herne Hill.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

T & P said:


> If we are happy to entertain the possibility that whoever labelled that photograph got the location wrong, may I propose the area bordering the northwestern tip of Brockwell Park, such as the western end of Dulwich Road or such back streets as Brailsford Road?
> 
> Some big fuck off houses still survive around there today, and when you walk towards the northwestern exit of the park, some of the houses bordering the perimeter fence kind of look similar to this one. The area is officially Brixton not Herne Hill of course, but one can see how someone not too familiar with it could have easily made such mistake.



Yeah, I've had a bit of a look around that bit already but with no success.


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## Nivag (Apr 30, 2020)

With that spacing between the buildings I'd say it's definitely more Dulwich area unless it's now got a building in between them.


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## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

I've also been having a look around Christchurch Rd/Upper Tulse Hill, where there was an extensive area of large-ish houses with big gardens, mostly all gone now. You could just about call that Herne Hill, if you walked through the park to get there...

No luck though.


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## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

Also Thurlow Pk Rd


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## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

And there's a bunch of houses along Tulse Hill that used to back on to the park.


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## teuchter (Apr 30, 2020)

Nivag said:


> With that spacing between the buildings I'd say it's definitely more Dulwich area unless it's now got a building in between them.


I was wondering if that gap between the houses might be an alleyway... or even a railway line


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## friendofdorothy (May 1, 2020)

T & P said:


> Getty images has in their portfolio an image of women war workers making life saving devices for the RAF in what is very likely to be the same property. It certainly was a splendid-looking garden...



I wonder what the 'life saving' devices are? is that wood they are using?


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## friendofdorothy (May 1, 2020)

Probably not related to the above, but in searching for links between Herne Hill and the RAF I found this:









						The RAF’s Forgotten Link to the Windrush Generation
					

This article is an edited transcript of Pilots of the Caribbean with Peter Devitt available on History Hit TV. Dan talks to Peter Devitt from the RAF...




					www.historyhit.com
				




A blue plaque in Herne Hill, London commemorates RAF veteran Sam King.


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## Jimbeau (May 1, 2020)

teuchter said:


> I was wondering if that gap between the houses might be an alleyway... or even a railway line


Until just now I had assumed that the picture was taken in the back garden of the house on the left. But the more I look, the more those facades look like the fronts of houses - in which case this could be a lawn across the street. And the gap between the houses might be the entrance to a side street - which would be consistent with them being designed as a mirror pair. Or it could be a gap where one has already been pulled down. These big old places were often cheek by jowl with their neighbours. Frustratingly, the photo doesn't show how close the two houses are to their neighbours on the other side.

Still can't see anywhere like it in even 'Greater HH' though, including all the above as possibilities. Now looking at places like Clapham Park, which isn't Herne Hill by any stretch of imagination...


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## teuchter (May 1, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> Until just now I had assumed that the picture was taken in the back garden of the house on the left. But the more I look, the more those facades look like the fronts of houses - in which case this could be a lawn across the street. And the gap between the houses might be the entrance to a side street - which would be consistent with them being designed as a mirror pair. Or it could be a gap where one has already been pulled down. These big old places were often cheek by jowl with their neighbours. Frustratingly, the photo doesn't show how close the two houses are to their neighbours on the other side.
> 
> Still can't see anywhere like it in even 'Greater HH' though, including all the above as possibilities. Now looking at places like Clapham Park, which isn't Herne Hill by any stretch of imagination...


Yes, I'd also wondered if we are actually looking at the front of houses from the other side of the street. Or some kind of setup like you see in Rush Common or Josephine Avenue with extended front gardens. But these houses are too big and widely spaced for either of those locations.


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## Lizzy Mac (May 1, 2020)

In the past I've heard rumours that there used to be, or possible still is, some sort of secret building down Half Moon Lane, on the other side to Ken's.  I wonder of it could be somewhere down there.  Or the greenhouses could suggest being near one of the old orchards that I also hear about a lot.  This is hugely distracting : )


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## Crispy (May 1, 2020)

I've only just noticed the bay window at ground floor. I did some rough tracing and scaling off the photo and we're looking for this footprint:



The houses are ~15m wide and the gap is ~20m. Those are big houses. Here's that footprint roughly overlaid on the Brixton Water Lane entrance to Brockwell Park, so quite a bit bigger than those houses.


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## Lizzy Mac (May 1, 2020)

My initial reaction was that it was near the Grand Designs house.  Quite close eh.


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## sleaterkinney (May 1, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Here's a bigger version, where you can see more of the buildings.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Are they pretending to be planes?


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## Rocky Sullivan (May 1, 2020)

I've never seen so much activity on the Herne Hill page. I say we should all get out more. Oh wait, we can't!


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## Jimbeau (May 1, 2020)

I've just been mucking about with www.shadowcalculator.eu 

Assuming our zooming friends in the pic are around 1.6m/5'3" tall on average, the shortest shadows they would have cast in Herne Hill on 1/6/44 would have been 90cm long, between 1250 and 1320, and they would have fallen pretty much due North. 

So I think this means those houses are facing East or Southeast (assuming we are looking at their fronts).


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## Smick (May 1, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> I've just been mucking about with www.shadowcalculator.eu
> 
> Assuming our zooming friends in the pic are around 1.6m/5'3" tall on average, the shortest shadows they would have cast in Herne Hill on 1/6/44 would have been 90cm long, between 1250 and 1320, and they would have fallen pretty much due North.
> 
> So I think this means those houses are facing East or Southeast (assuming we are looking at their fronts).


I love the internet.


----------



## teuchter (May 1, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> I've just been mucking about with www.shadowcalculator.eu
> 
> Assuming our zooming friends in the pic are around 1.6m/5'3" tall on average, the shortest shadows they would have cast in Herne Hill on 1/6/44 would have been 90cm long, between 1250 and 1320, and they would have fallen pretty much due North.
> 
> So I think this means those houses are facing East or Southeast (assuming we are looking at their fronts).


But we can't measure the shadows from the photo. They could be 90cm long or they could be 120cm long.


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## Jimbeau (May 1, 2020)

teuchter said:


> But we can't measure the shadows from the photo. They could be 90cm long or they could be 120cm long.


I don't think so. If we go with 160cm as the average female height (ONS says it was 161.8cm in 2016) and they are standing slightly more than an arm span apart - I reckon that if they were upright they'd have 20cm between their fingertips - and with arm span being more or less 1:1 to height, then they're 180cm(ish) apart. No shadow extends more than halfway from one woman to her neighbour. Hence my guess at 90cm.

I actually thought about dropping some scale grids on in Illustrator or modelling it in Vectorworks but then I realised that my 'working from home' tea break was over and I had a deadline...


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## teuchter (May 1, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> No shadow extends more than halfway from one woman to her neighbour.


Yeah, but they extend backwards diagonally too, and that's the bit we can't measure.

I've just shut down my copy of Vectorworks till monday


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## Jimbeau (May 1, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Yeah, but they extend backwards diagonally too, and that's the bit we can't measure.
> 
> I've just shut down my copy of Vectorworks till monday



We just need to draw in survey poles next to each woman, add the orthogonals, extrapolate vanishing points, then use a bit of trig. 

I reckon we could work out the contours of the garden then match it to topo maps in the British Geological Survey with a bit of effort. 

I jest. 

( I think)

It’s beer time. That’s for sure.


----------



## T & P (May 1, 2020)

It’s good to see a seemly-inconsequential-yet-must-know issue, such as the location of this mysterious RAF Women Herne Hill base, engaging the local Urban community. 

I will definitely order the book this weekend even if we manage to work this out ourselves beforehand. If we are still none the wiser when the book arrives I will check the contents for the answer. Unless we’re having too much fun researching this of course, in which case I will withhold the answer for a bit longer.


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## billythefish (May 1, 2020)

I love this thread! The (superb) original photo looked so familiar, but I have not found an exact match. However, my first port of call was Lancaster Avenue (HH / West Norwood borders), where a few similar houses still survive. It's the closest street of similar housing to Herne Hill I can think of.


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## T & P (May 1, 2020)

billythefish said:


> I love this thread! The (superb) original photo looked so familiar, but I have not found an exact match. However, my first port of call was Lancaster Avenue (HH / West Norwood borders), where a few similar houses still survive. It's the closest street of similar housing to Herne Hill I can think of.


That’s a good shout as well. If we allow for whoever captioned the image to have been a bit relaxed about the actual parish lines for Herne Hill, a lot of promising areas open up. The far end of Half Moon Lane, which is neither HH nor Dulwich, or the flat bits around Croxted Road near the petrol station could have also easily accommodated such property.


----------



## Ohmyemily (May 1, 2020)

Maybe it's the lockdown talking, but I'm enjoying this immensely. Only have this to contribute, which doesn't help at all...Herne Hill magazine


----------



## teuchter (May 1, 2020)

T & P said:


> That’s a good shout as well. If we allow for whoever captioned the image to have been a bit relaxed about the actual parish lines for Herne Hill, a lot of promising areas open up. The far end of Half Moon Lane, which is neither HH nor Dulwich, or the flat bits around Croxted Road near the petrol station could have also easily accommodated such property.


I've checked those areas out pretty thoroughly already.....


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## T & P (May 2, 2020)

The book is temporarily out of stock


----------



## T & P (May 3, 2020)

Ohmyemily said:


> Maybe it's the lockdown talking, but I'm enjoying this immensely. Only have this to contribute, which doesn't help at all...Herne Hill magazine


Thanks for that. My other half found and pointed out this article as well, and we went on to check issue 147 of the magazine for the readers’ answers. It at least answers the question friendofdorothy was asking about the life saving devices the women were making. Apparently they are hand operated bellows to top up one-man dinghies that were issued to pilots in case they were to ditch into the sea.

No definite answer about the location of the property in question, though their educated guess is Burbage Road

Full article on page 9 of the magazine:








						Herne Hill #147 (Autumn/Winter 2019)
					

The magazine of the Herne Hill Society  © The Herne Hill Society




					issuu.com


----------



## Lizzy Mac (May 3, 2020)

So it could still be the secret building.  Excellent.


----------



## teuchter (May 3, 2020)

I actually went for a bit of a wander yesterday around that area, partly prompted by spending some time looking at it on google aerial view the other day as a result of this thread.

It's amazing how many private sports clubs and playing fields there are around Dulwich.

We got shouted at by a very angry man in one of them which didn't have its gates closed.

And somehow despite living within a couple of miles of it for the past 2 years, and generally being fairly curious and inclined to explore places, it was the first time I've walked through Belair Park. I expect that one of the benefits of this lockdown is that many people might be getting to know their immediate localities a bit better, and finding stuff they've always overlooked.


----------



## Jimbeau (May 4, 2020)

teuchter said:


> I actually went for a bit of a wander yesterday around that area, partly prompted by spending some time looking at it on google aerial view the other day as a result of this thread.
> 
> It's amazing how many private sports clubs and playing fields there are around Dulwich.
> 
> ...


Excellent. In a similar fashion we ventured into the Rosendale Rd allotments for the first time on Saturday - despite having spent nearly 20 years less than a mile away as the crow flies. What a place. They must have one of the best views in London. 

And - sad but true - I also went for a run around some of the streets of big old houses between Norwood and Rosendale roads - Lancaster, Chestnut, Idmiston, etc, looking for candidates. I'm now 99% certain we're looking at the fronts of the two houses. Anything of that style (which I think is no later than 1870) doesn't have a grand facade to the garden, instead a mess of half levels, stair towers, kitchen wings and the like. 

Also by the 1940s the majority of these grand villas had already gone, sometimes even before WWI, to be replaced by terraces or smaller Edwardian villas on much tighter plots. Great example on Barston Rd that has somehow survived when all around it was redone around the turn of the C20th: Google Maps


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## Rushy (May 4, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> I'm now 99% certain we're looking at the fronts of the two houses. Anything of that style (which I think is no later than 1870) doesn't have a grand facade to the garden, instead a mess of half levels, stair towers, kitchen wings and the like.


Yep - this was my initial thought too.


----------



## teuchter (May 4, 2020)

The flag is another reason to suspect it's the front of the house. Unless it was some kind of RAF institutional building (temporary or otherwise) in which case maybe you can imagine a flag flying in the grounds at the back.


----------



## snowy_again (May 4, 2020)

Cafe Provençal appears to have closed for good.


----------



## colacubes (May 4, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Cafe Provençal appears to have closed for good.



Oh no  That's a shame.


----------



## editor (May 4, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Cafe Provençal appears to have closed for good.


I heard that it was going. The owners wanted to retire, I heard.


----------



## Crispy (May 10, 2020)

Did a double-take on Palace Road the other day (at the top near the GP surgery)



Almost, but not quite,,,


----------



## Jimbeau (May 15, 2020)

Crispy said:


> Almost, but not quite,,,


I forced myself to give this a break for a few days - but now it's time for a new theory....

It might be Alleyn Park in West Dulwich - down the bottom end where it meets the Paxton Green junction. It's not Herne Hill, but bear with me.

The road was laid out at the right time. (1850s - I checked my suspicions on the house being no later than 1870 by using the dating tool on www.bricksandbrass.co.uk) More about the building of the properties along the road here: South Croxted Road and Alleyn Park

Nearly all of the original houses are gone but most were still standing in 1944. 

We can't be sure what they all looked like, but Pissarro painted a view of some of them across the fields in 1871. They begin to look quite promising.

Then there are the specifics of the design - which is very particular. Three stories - with twinned round-headed windows over 4-pane sashes over a hexagonal bay in the gabled wing. I've been using my daily government-sanctioned run to do a bit of exploring and nearly every house of this age and type just has one central window in the second floor gable end.

Now it gets interesting. No 38 is still there - built into Dulwich Prep School. Some of the details are a little different but the form and proportions are right. Don't be fooled by the left hand wing - it's a modern extension, as can be seen on Google Maps.

What's even more interesting is that the back of the house shows the same arrangement of windows and bay. So we could be standing behind these houses after all.

Now take a look at Numbers 3 and 4 Alleyn Park on the 1944 map. They have the same plan as No. 38. They're far enough apart. They're a mirror pair. They have long back gardens.



			Explore georeferenced maps - Map images - National Library of Scotland
		


I'm not saying these are the houses for sure, but are we getting warmer?


----------



## teuchter (May 15, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> I forced myself to give this a break for a few days - but now it's time for a new theory....
> 
> It might be Alleyn Park in West Dulwich - down the bottom end where it meets the Paxton Green junction. It's not Herne Hill, but bear with me.
> 
> ...


I think you could be onto something there, at least as far as the street is concerned.


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## Crispy (May 15, 2020)

Oh wow, that is smoking hot IMO. The surviving building only has one chimney on the side, but there are two chimney breasts.
The fascia board has the same round ends with trefoils.

So I suppose it is the front gardens of 2 and 4 or maybe the big garden of no. 3 over the road


----------



## teuchter (May 15, 2020)

From the sun direction it would have to be the back gardens of 2&4, no?


----------



## teuchter (May 15, 2020)

This is the only aerial photo I've managed to find (1928) - frustratingly blurry.






						EPW025252 ENGLAND (1928).  Crystal Palace and Crystal Palace Park, Penge, 1928.  This image has been produced from a damaged negative. | Britain From Above
					






					www.britainfromabove.org.uk


----------



## Jimbeau (May 15, 2020)

teuchter said:


> From the sun direction it would have to be the back gardens of 2&4, no?


It would. And the size of gardens works. But I’m still not convinced about us looking at the backs of the houses. The decorative little attic dormer window just feels more like it was designed for the street - and you can see from no.38 that there is a stair in the next bay to the gable and the dormer is at the front. But maybe our house has a back dormer and a different stair configuration. I’m not sure if we can see two little windows lighting a half landing? 

Definitely can’t see a porch roof over the centre bay of the ground floor.


----------



## editor (May 18, 2020)

Looks like something is on fire south of Brockwell Park...


----------



## teuchter (May 18, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> It would. And the size of gardens works. But I’m still not convinced about us looking at the backs of the houses. The decorative little attic dormer window just feels more like it was designed for the street - and you can see from no.38 that there is a stair in the next bay to the gable and the dormer is at the front. But maybe our house has a back dormer and a different stair configuration. I’m not sure if we can see two little windows lighting a half landing?
> 
> Definitely can’t see a porch roof over the centre bay of the ground floor.


I think there are some little half landing windows yes, and I think that makes an argument for it being the back.

I might opt for nos 34&36 rather than 2&4 though. The way 2&4 are drawn on the map, looks like the rear gable portion projects out further, and it also looks like they have side rather than rear garden doors. 34 and 36 seem to match 38 better.

Plus, the "ruins" and greenhouse shown in the back garden seem to be about where we would want them to be.



I wonder if an email to the Dulwich Prep school could produce any further info.


----------



## Crispy (May 18, 2020)

I think you've hit the nail right on the head.

A son of that house (no.34) died in the first war





						Savel, HR - Dulwich College 1914-18 – Fallen of the Great War
					

Born on May 9th 1892, Harold was the second child, and eldest son, born to railway worker Richard Savel and his wife, Edith. He joined Dulwich in the summer of 1905, starting a trend which would later be followed by both his younger brothers. He went on to be a particularly keen rugby player...



					dulwichcollege1914-18.co.uk
				




So the military association could have followed on through to WW2


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## snowy_again (May 18, 2020)

editor said:


> Looks like something is on fire south of Brockwell Park...



It was way east of Herne Hill - either way happy to say it’s out now


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## Jimbeau (May 18, 2020)

teuchter said:


> I think there are some little half landing windows yes, and I think that makes an argument for it being the back.
> 
> I might opt for nos 34&36 rather than 2&4 though. The way 2&4 are drawn on the map, looks like the rear gable portion projects out further, and it also looks like they have side rather than rear garden doors. 34 and 36 seem to match 38 better.
> 
> ...


Excellent - I like those better than 2 and 4 too. Didn't spot them before. Gardens are a good bit longer as well.


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## Jimbeau (May 18, 2020)

Results of a bit of Googling:

The teaching block now on the site of 34-36 is called the Betws Building. Put up in 1995 but alas Southwark’s planning database only goes back to 1996 - and the old houses may have been long gone by then, so no guarantee of site survey drawings in the application.  

Can’t find out who the architect was either - nothing coming up in the obvious places or via RIBA. 

I’m sure Teuchter is going to win the prize here - but a bit of confirmation would be great. I really am minded to drop the school a line. 

But can the hive mind beat me to it. Eh? Eh?


----------



## teuchter (May 18, 2020)

I think 34-36 went in the late 50s when Kingsdale School was built; here is a 1959 map



If I've got my bearings right, 38 is to the right of the 'E' in ALLEYN PARK.

It looks from this that 34-36 would therefore have been on land that became Kingsdale school, a state school built by the LCC late 50s and designed by Leslie Martin (who designed the Royal Festival Hall). It was refurbed in 2004 and apparently was the subject of a channel 4 documentary that no longer seems available.

But it appears that the "Betws building" is part of Dulwich prep... so did Kingsdale School sell that bit of land to them at some point?

Perhaps Kingsdale School would be more likely to have record of what was there before, if so.

(As an aside I can't seem to find many images of the original Kingsdale School building online, strangely.)


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## Jimbeau (May 19, 2020)

teuchter said:


> I think 34-36 went in the late 50s when Kingsdale School was built; here is a 1959 map
> 
> View attachment 213340
> 
> ...


Good find on the 1959 map - I couldn't turn up anything of that period detailed enough. 

There's a 1940 aerial view on NCAP that shows all the houses: West Dulwich; Greater London Authority; England | NCAP - National Collection of Aerial Photography

Then there's one from 1966 where they are clearly gone and the 1950s school buildings are there.

Maybe someone with an account can get to the high-res version?

What happened to the division of territory between Kingsdale and Dulwich Prep is anyone's guess. I ran down there again this morning and there's a post-war boundary wall that runs along the front of both properties, topped by very utilitarian black steel railings. Into this a newer opening has been cut to give vehicle access to the Betws Building, so I think your theory that they were once one site holds some water - but the '59 map is a bit ambiguous.

The Betws building is so named because the prep school evacuated to Betws-y-coed for most of WWII. This would have left their buildings (if indeed they had title to those houses at the time) available for other useful things to support the war effort.


----------



## editor (May 19, 2020)

This is quite magnificent




















						Is this the most amazing NHS tribute in London? Behold the Herne Hill 360 degree diorama!
					

We’ve seen some pretty impressive home-made tributes to NHS workers on our daily walks, but we fancy this new art installation in Herne Hill must be up there with the very best in London.



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


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## BoxRoom (May 19, 2020)

Herne Hill's Cafe Provencal permanently closes - Southwark News
					

The unit has now been cleared out, with owner co-owner Alan Gaunt tweeting that the restaurant and bar would not be re-opening at the end of lockdown




					www.southwarknews.co.uk
				




Cafe Provencal permanently closing. Always somewhere I meant to check out when I went by. Shame that.


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## teuchter (May 19, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> Good find on the 1959 map - I couldn't turn up anything of that period detailed enough.
> 
> There's a 1940 aerial view on NCAP that shows all the houses: West Dulwich; Greater London Authority; England | NCAP - National Collection of Aerial Photography
> 
> ...



Here's a more detailed map that suggests strongly the houses' grounds were taken into the "Kingsdale School" grounds at that point.

Interesting that the prep school evacuated - certainly it would seem to make sense that the buildings might then have been requisitioned for military use, obviously easier to use one that's already been converted to institutional use than it would have been if they were private houses.


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## Jimbeau (May 19, 2020)

teuchter said:


> View attachment 213392
> Here's a more detailed map that suggests strongly the houses' grounds were taken into the "Kingsdale School" grounds at that point.
> 
> Interesting that the prep school evacuated - certainly it would seem to make sense that the buildings might then have been requisitioned for military use, obviously easier to use one that's already been converted to institutional use than it would have been if they were private houses.


What I find fascinating about this map is that it shows that the whole prep school seems to have come about by daisy-chaining several of these big houses together. It says on their web page that they began with 13 boys in 1885 and two years later had grown their cohort to more than 100. Buying up properties along the street seems to be the only way they could have grown so quickly.

A closer look at the main red-brick school building at 40-44 suggests the two original houses still form the core - extended upwards with towers and with a link block now built between them. Google Maps

The Kingsdale thing is mystery - maybe they leased the land to the council to raise some cash after the war and got it back in the 90s.

Anyway - getting off topic into a rabbit hole here. I'm now sold on 34-36 Alleyn Park being the location of the mystery photo. Quite how it came to be labelled as Herne Hill is a puzzle that might never be solved. There are five other railway stations that are closer, for example.


----------



## editor (May 19, 2020)

BoxRoom said:


> Herne Hill's Cafe Provencal permanently closes - Southwark News
> 
> 
> The unit has now been cleared out, with owner co-owner Alan Gaunt tweeting that the restaurant and bar would not be re-opening at the end of lockdown
> ...


They never really recovered from the 2015 flood. Real shame to see it go. This is how it looks now: 













						Herne Hill’s popular Cafe Provencal has closed for good, with COVID-19 proving the final straw
					

It’s been a local landmark on the busy corner close to Brockwell Park since it opened in 1994, but Cafe Provencal has now permanently closed, with the ongoing coronavirus pandemic proving to …



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (May 19, 2020)

BoxRoom said:


> Herne Hill's Cafe Provencal permanently closes - Southwark News
> 
> 
> The unit has now been cleared out, with owner co-owner Alan Gaunt tweeting that the restaurant and bar would not be re-opening at the end of lockdown
> ...



"Two floods, a fire and now this. No more energy." 

Can see his point, clearly didnt get the best of luck.


----------



## Ohmyemily (May 19, 2020)

editor said:


> This is quite magnificent
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's fantastic isn't it? It was made by a talented chap called Kevin who lives on casino avenue. Apparently the museum of London have asked to have them for their collection. This his website: Home | kevin-mckeon-


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## Jimbeau (May 19, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> I'm now sold on 34-36 Alleyn Park being the location of the mystery photo.


Here they are - the elusive buggers. Little back gables, greenhouses and garden path behind no. 34 and everything. Aerial photo from 1944. Turns out they may have been hit by a V1 on 21st July 1944 - just a few weeks after the RAF ladies were photographed. FlyingBombsandRockets,V1 & V2 Dulwich E21 & SE22


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## teuchter (May 19, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> Here they are - the elusive buggers. Little back gables, greenhouses and garden path behind no. 34 and everything. Aerial photo from 1944. Turns out they may have been hit by a V1 on 21st July 1944 - just a few weeks after the RAF ladies were photographed. FlyingBombsandRockets,V1 & V2 Dulwich E21 & SE22
> 
> View attachment 213575


Well done. Where did you find the aerial photo?


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## Crispy (May 19, 2020)

I fucking love this website sometimes


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## Jimbeau (May 19, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Well done. Where did you find the aerial photo?








						Explore our unique, historic map layers  | Layers of London
					






					www.layersoflondon.org
				




I’m a bit scared to dig around too much on this site. I sense a geek hole so deep I might never escape...


----------



## teuchter (May 19, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> Explore our unique, historic map layers  | Layers of London
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ah! I think I looked at that site a while back and it was a bit patchy but it looks like there is more on it now. I'll be off down that geek hole too...


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## editor (May 20, 2020)

Crispy said:


> I fucking love this website sometimes


It would be great to share this story - would you (or anyone else) fancy writing a piece I can post on Buzz?


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 9, 2020)

Not sure how many HH residents are aware of the traffic changes Lambeth, the "Co-operative" council are rushing through this week under the guise of "COVID-19 Emergency Response". A series of planters, i.e. barriers, are being placed across the area to discourage traffic. Although it's excellent news for the Poet's Corner/Railton Road side of Herne Hill it is dreadful news for the north end of Shakespeare Road (Mayall Road to Coldharbour Lane). The Shakespeare Road barrier will deny access to the Poet's Corner "Bubble" from the north end and increase heavy goods lorries by 100% as the Norris building rubble recycling centre and the Network Rail Depot vehicles will only be able to access northbound, from Coldharbour Lane. What is upsetting is that the less affluent end of Shakespeare Road and Coldharbour Lane will be effectively cut-off from the rest of Herne Hill and see a dramatic increase in pollution. KCL are carrying out research re: effects of pollution, particularly on children exposed when walking to and from school. Research also suggests pollution exacerbates COVID symptoms so why are Lambeth wanting to push traffic into already busy/polluted roads (Coldharbour Lane/Brixton/LJ). Click on link to read a recent New Scientist article Are you more likely to die of covid-19 if you live in a polluted area?
One more thing: as usual, zero consultation from Lambeth with the residents, just a hand-drawn map pushed through doors end of last week.
At times like this we should be united as a community, not divided by barriers. Plenty to discuss.


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## lordnoise (Jun 9, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> Not sure how many HH residents are aware of the traffic changes Lambeth, the "Co-operative" council are rushing through this week under the guise of "COVID-19 Emergency Response". A series of planters, i.e. barriers, are being placed across the area to discourage traffic. Although it's excellent news for the Poet's Corner/Railton Road side of Herne Hill it is dreadful news for the north end of Shakespeare Road (Mayall Road to Coldharbour Lane). The Shakespeare Road barrier will deny access to the Poet's Corner "Bubble" from the north end and increase heavy goods lorries by 100% as the Norris building rubble recycling centre and the Network Rail Depot vehicles will only be able to access northbound, from Coldharbour Lane. What is upsetting is that the less affluent end of Shakespeare Road and Coldharbour Lane will be effectively cut-off from the rest of Herne Hill and see a dramatic increase in pollution. KCL are carrying out research re: effects of pollution, particularly on children exposed when walking to and from school. Research also suggests pollution exacerbates COVID symptoms so why are Lambeth wanting to push traffic into already busy/polluted roads (Coldharbour Lane/Brixton/LJ). Click on link to read a recent New Scientist article Are you more likely to die of covid-19 if you live in a polluted area?
> One more thing: as usual, zero consultation from Lambeth with the residents, just a hand-drawn map pushed through doors end of last week.
> At times like this we should be united as a community, not divided by barriers. Plenty to discuss.



I completely agree ....

These closures will only push traffic onto surrounding roads and make them busier. Remember the disaster when the council closed Loughborough Rd and had to back track and reopen it ? Brixton Water Lane, Milkwood Rd, Coldharbour Lane, and Effra Rd will all become congested with queuing cars increasing pollution in the area. What are the queues going to be like at the already nightmare Herne Hill traffic lights ? Further traffic calming on Railton Rd with a system of one way streets within the Poets Corner area is the answer.

Shame on the council for using the human tragedy that is the pandemic to push this scheme on the area when its been under discussion since at least 2008. If they were really concerned about runners and cyclist then they’d have widened the pavements on Brixton Water Lane where the vast majority run and cycle years ago.

At the moment there is no way to contact the council about this other than Facebook and Twitter. No phone or email option. Why are they hiding ? Very, very,  poor indeed.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 9, 2020)

That is an excellent suggestion, Lord Noise. Calming, enforcement of 20mph limit and Railton made one way would be the best option. Dividing the community, without consultation, is shabby behaviour.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 9, 2020)

*FAO: The Editor.* Hello there, do you think this matter should have its own thread. After all, it's not just Herne Hill, it will impact Brixton/Coldharbour Lane and LJ. Just a thought.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 9, 2020)

> These closures will only push traffic onto surrounding roads and make them busier.


Or a safer environment might lead to more people leaving the car at home. We don't have the capacity in terms of roads and parking spaces for everyone to drive so we need to expand other forms of transport. The existing traffic calming efforts on Railton have had the opposite effect.


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## lordnoise (Jun 9, 2020)

Seconded  - in reply to Rockys request for a dedicated thread ...


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## Rushy (Jun 9, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> *FAO: The Editor.* Hello there, do you think this matter should have its own thread. After all, it's not just Herne Hill, it will impact Brixton/Coldharbour Lane and LJ. Just a thought.











						Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists
					

The more cynical part of me wonders about the Shakespeare Road no entry. The recycling centre is just past that and there’s constant skip lorries in and out. However they want to sell the site and build another massive load of flats. Be a lot easier to argue their case if they can’t easily...




					www.urban75.net


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 9, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> Or a safer environment might lead to more people leaving the car at home. We don't have the capacity in terms of roads and parking spaces for everyone to drive so we need to expand other forms of transport. The existing traffic calming efforts on Railton have had the opposite effect.


All this proposed scheme does is increase by 100% the number of heavy goods vehicles thundering down north Shakespeare Road. It's not about cars it's about HGV pollution/speeding and dividing a community.


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## editor (Jun 9, 2020)

Market reopens on Sunday








						Herne Hill street market reopens this Sunday, 14th June 2020
					

Another small sign of life slowly coming back to normal after the ravages of the coronavirus crisis is the reopening of the popular Herne Hill street market on Sunday.



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


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## lordnoise (Jun 9, 2020)

Great to hear but good luck with the 2 metre rule there!


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 9, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> Great to hear but good luck with the 2 metre rule there!


Hmm. It is a small market so maybe it will be taped off with security limiting numbers. Tough one.


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## snowy_again (Jun 9, 2020)

Judging by the weekend incomers shopping at Green Parrot (the bar owned by Off the Cuff), Sesame deli, and blackbird that social distancing stands no chance


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## Rushy (Jun 9, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> Great to hear but good luck with the 2 metre rule there!


Wonder how long the Flippin Nell queue will be!


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## editor (Jun 9, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Judging by the weekend incomers shopping at Green Parrot (the bar owned by Off the Cuff), Sesame deli, and blackbird that social distancing stands no chance


It looked like a regular crowed of drinkers standing outside when I went past recently. Not good.


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## lordnoise (Jun 9, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> Or a safer environment might lead to more people leaving the car at home. We don't have the capacity in terms of roads and parking spaces for everyone to drive so we need to expand other forms of transport. The existing traffic calming efforts on Railton have had the opposite effect.



I'm pretty sure the inadequate calming measures in Railton Rd have had little or no effect on vehicle speed but simple ramps and a directional priority system would. As we know from the failed experiment in Loughborough Rd, closures lead to increased queues in existing pinch points which in this case would be the Herne Hill junction and the centre of Brixton. Why make these places even worse for the benefit of a few (nice people including me )  in the Poets Corner area.


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## teuchter (Jun 9, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> I'm pretty sure the inadequate calming measures in Railton Rd have had little or no effect on vehicle speed but simple ramps and a directional priority system would. As we know from the failed experiment in Loughborough Rd, closures lead to increased queues in existing pinch points which in this case would be the Herne Hill junction and the centre of Brixton. Why make these places even worse for the benefit of a few (nice people including me )  in the Poets Corner area.


No, the Loughborough road experiment did not prove anything, because it was not allowed to run its course.
It's totally normal that once you implement a change, there is a period where there is increased traffic elsewhere, but it's also totally normal for this to dissipate as people readjust their journey habits. 
The Loughborough Rd trial was not allowed to run past the point where there were initial increases (which at the time were also affected by roadworks going on) so no one was allowed to see what would happen once things had settled down. Perhaps the people who managed to sabotage it were quite aware that this is what was likely to happen.


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## lordnoise (Jun 9, 2020)

teuchter said:


> No, the Loughborough road experiment did not prove anything, because it was not allowed to run its course.
> It's totally normal that once you implement a change, there is a period where there is increased traffic elsewhere, but it's also totally normal for this to dissipate as people readjust their journey habits.
> The Loughborough Rd trial was not allowed to run past the point where there were initial increases (which at the time were also affected by roadworks going on) so no one was allowed to see what would happen once things had settled down. Perhaps the people who managed to sabotage it were quite aware that this is what was likely to happen.



I completely disagree - there were weeks of queues and disruption to an area that really didn't have a problem. It was the weight of local public opinion that sent it to an early grave and I hope that happens in this case ...


----------



## teuchter (Jun 9, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> I completely disagree - there were weeks of queues and disruption to an area that really didn't have a problem.


No there wasn't. And the area does have a problem. I live in Loughborough Junction. I was watching what was happening. I was out seeing if the chaos people were talking about was real. On the relevant thread I posted photos at various intervals. There was some congestion, which is waht you would expect at the beginning. The closure of Loughborough Road was not even enforced until several weeks into the "trial", and even after that was not widely complied with. There were roadworks at the time that were affecting things. Many of the congestion points visibly started to ease after only a few weeks. There was continual sabotage of the signage. There were public meetings where false information was presented. There were online petitions signed by barristers from Dulwich who didn't like that their route into central London had been disrupted. And a load of other dodgy stuff that I have some pretty firm suspicions about but amn't going to put onto a public forum. The trial was supposed to run for six months and it lasted for about two I think - but for the first part of that time, the closures weren't even being enforced.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 9, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> I'm pretty sure the inadequate calming measures in Railton Rd have had little or no effect on vehicle speed but simple ramps and a directional priority system would. As we know from the failed experiment in Loughborough Rd, closures lead to increased queues in existing pinch points which in this case would be the Herne Hill junction and the centre of Brixton. Why make these places even worse for the benefit of a few (nice people including me )  in the Poets Corner area.


Making it one way would make that road much worse, the only reason cars slow down at the moment is to let a car coming in the opposite direction past, and you want cyclists to go against this flow of traffic?. We need to encourage other forms of transport rather than cars, that’s the whole point.


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## lordnoise (Jun 10, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> Making it one way would make that road much worse, the only reason cars slow down at the moment is to let a car coming in the opposite direction past, and you want cyclists to go against this flow of traffic?. We need to encourage other forms of transport rather than cars, that’s the whole point.



No not a one way system but  a 2 way give way system to stop cars tearing down towards Brixton. Railton is only moderately busy road at peak hours and ought to be allowed to take its share of any sort of traffic. if closed the displaced cars vans and lorries will cause extra noisy, fumey queues at other places in the local system notably near shops, pubs and restaurants at the super busy Herne Hill junction and central Brixton. 

I'm not in favour of encouraging cars and vans off the road at ANY cost.


----------



## lordnoise (Jun 10, 2020)

teuchter said:


> No there wasn't. And the area does have a problem. I live in Loughborough Junction. I was watching what was happening. I was out seeing if the chaos people were talking about was real. On the relevant thread I posted photos at various intervals. There was some congestion, which is waht you would expect at the beginning. The closure of Loughborough Road was not even enforced until several weeks into the "trial", and even after that was not widely complied with. There were roadworks at the time that were affecting things. Many of the congestion points visibly started to ease after only a few weeks. There was continual sabotage of the signage. There were public meetings where false information was presented. There were online petitions signed by barristers from Dulwich who didn't like that their route into central London had been disrupted. And a load of other dodgy stuff that I have some pretty firm suspicions about but amn't going to put onto a public forum. The trial was supposed to run for six months and it lasted for about two I think - but for the first part of that time, the closures weren't even being enforced.



You really must deal with the fact that the scheme was deeply unpopular with most local people ...


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> No not a one way system but  a 2 way give way system to stop cars tearing down towards Brixton. Railton is only moderately busy road at peak hours and ought to be allowed to take its share of any sort of traffic. if closed the displaced cars vans and lorries will cause extra noisy, fumey queues at other places in the local system notably near shops, pubs and restaurants at the super busy Herne Hill junction and central Brixton.
> 
> I'm not in favour of encouraging cars and vans off the road at ANY cost.


You're right: people do need to get around; be it the elderly/vunerable, deliveries, people in the area who drive for a living etc. A good model to adopt would be the small French town one: lots of painted crossings, "painted" roadhumps, planters sticking out into the road - and draconian speed limits. You never see speeding through those places (they don't mess around over there). What I don't get is how this scheme will discourage motor vehicle ownership within Poet's Corner. Lot of parked cars in Poet's and you never see spare spaces. As for speed limits, lots of families in the area so protecting them is paramount. Here's a thought, why not go all "private gated estate" and simply make it 10mph length of Shakespeare (Coldharbour to Dulwich Road) plus all of Poet's. That would at least slow down the skip lorries. I'm a cyclist and have unfortunately seen what those things can do to someone riding a bike. Let's be postive, not divisive, about this and make ALL of our area supersafe.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 10, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> No not a one way system but  a 2 way give way system to stop cars tearing down towards Brixton. Railton is only moderately busy road at peak hours and ought to be allowed to take its share of any sort of traffic. if closed the displaced cars vans and lorries will cause extra noisy, fumey queues at other places in the local system notably near shops, pubs and restaurants at the super busy Herne Hill junction and central Brixton.


What's a two way give way system?. How would that make it safer?. Cars speed between the traffic calming measures as it is. Railton is a busy road. 

If it's more difficult to drive and easier and safer to take other forms of transport people will do that.



> I'm not in favour of encouraging cars and vans off the road at ANY cost.


Why not?.  Brixton had terrible pollution before this crisis and now we're in the middle of a pandemic affecting the respiratory system.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> You're right: people do need to get around; be it the elderly/vunerable, deliveries, people in the area who drive for a living etc. A good model to adopt would be the small French town one: lots of painted crossings, "painted" roadhumps, planters sticking out into the road - and draconian speed limits. You never see speeding through those places (they don't mess around over there). What I don't get is how this scheme will discourage motor vehicle ownership within Poet's Corner. Lot of parked cars in Poet's and you never see spare spaces. As for speed limits, lots of families in the area so protecting them is paramount. Here's a thought, why not go all "private gated estate" and simply make it 10mph length of Shakespeare (Coldharbour to Dulwich Road) plus all of Poet's. That would at least slow down the skip lorries. I'm a cyclist and have unfortunately seen what those things can do to someone riding a bike. Let's be postive, not divisive, about this and make ALL of our area supersafe.


There's loads of parking in poets corner. People don't stick to the existing 20mph speed limit ffs. If you're a cyclist you know motorists don't give a shit about stuff like that.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> What's a two way give way system?. How would that make it safer?. Cars speed between the traffic calming measures as it is. Railton is a busy road.
> 
> If it's more difficult to drive and easier and safer to take other forms of transport people will do that.
> 
> Why not?.  Brixton had terrible pollution before this crisis and now we're in the middle of a pandemic affecting the respiratory system.


You're absolutely right: we should not be adding to the dreadful pollution on Coldharbour with this scheme. Well said.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> You're absolutely right: we should not be adding to the dreadful pollution on Coldharbour with this scheme. Well said.


As I also said - And the whole point of this:



> If it's more difficult to drive and easier and safer to take other forms of transport people will do that.


----------



## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> As I also said - And the whole point of this:


Indeed. If we can slow down the skip lorries then great. Unfortunately they won't be going away for the foreseeable future.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> Indeed. If we can slow down the skip lorries then great. Unfortunately they won't be going away for the foreseeable future.


As someone who cycled along Railton road every day, it's not the skip lorries.


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## lordnoise (Jun 10, 2020)

Lets send the skip lorries down Shakespeare Rd to Loughborough Junction (mostly muggy people in social housing down that way innit)


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> As someone who cycled along Railton road every day, it's not the skip lorries.


It is for Shakespeare Road (north)


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> It is for Shakespeare Road (north)


I think another of phrasing that Lord Noise would be "we should be wanting to help all of our community and that includes the more deprived areas of Lambeth"


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 10, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> Lets send the skip lorries down Shakespeare Rd to Loughborough Junction (mostly muggy people in social housing down that way innit)


Do skip lorries really use that junction of Shakespeare Rd onto Railton?. I'm really doubting that.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> Do skip lorries really use that junction of Shakespeare Rd onto Railton?. I'm really doubting that.


Have you counted them? Not just skip lorries but Network Rail HGVs will all have to come down Shakespeare (north). Why can't all of the area be included in the scheme? It's not fair one part will suffer for the benefit of another. We live here too.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> Have you counted them? Not just skip lorries but Network Rail HGVs will all have to come down Shakespeare (north). Why can't all of the area be included in the scheme? It's not fair one part will suffer for the benefit of another. We live here too.


I would like to think the local council would have some idea of where they go?. I'm just questioning the assertion that HGVs turn off onto Shakespeare from Railton, or do they go down Shakespeare (south) from Dulwich road?.

Maybe they should just do Railton - but that would make Shakespeare even more of a rat-run.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> I would like to think the local council would have some idea of where they go?. I'm just questioning the assertion that HGVs turn off onto Shakespeare from Railton, or do they go down Shakespeare (south) from Dulwich road?.
> 
> Maybe they should just do Railton - but that would make Shakespeare even more of a rat-run.


Well, the depot is, I believe, due to move from the present site. When, I've no idea but I do know there is a local resident campaign to block them moving into the new site which is near Knight's Hill, West Norwood. Apparantly there are a lot of houses very near the proposed site. For the short term I'd like to see them slowed to 10mph. Also once they've gone the site will have to be cleared for the 200+ housing development. That will be a lot of vehicles on N. Shakespeare for 2-3 years. One of my fellow North Shakespeare campaigners lives opposite the site and she's offered to do a count so we can get an idea of skip increase N. Shakespeare if this scheme goes ahead. When I've cycled up the road they turn left into Railton, then a quick right into Regent and Dulwich Road for right turn onto Norwood Road (opposite The Chutney). I think they go that way for access to South Circular at West Norwood. I've never ever seen them further down at Rymer (probably too tight for them).


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## teuchter (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> we should not be adding to the dreadful pollution on Coldharbour with this scheme.





Rocky Sullivan said:


> Why can't all of the area be included in the scheme? It's not fair one part will suffer for the benefit of another. We live here too.



So, you think the scheme is a bad thing, but you want it be increased in scope to include your area?

Sometimes it feels like you can't win with traffic reduction schemes.

People don't want it in an adjacent area, because they worry their area will be adversely affected by displaced traffic.

Or, they don't want it in their area because they think it'll make access more awkward.

They mostly want less traffic on the road, but they don't want their freedom to drive around to be restricted. 

The schemes shouldn't be piloted in affluent areas because that's favouring the middle classes by giving them traffic havens and sending the lorries elsewhere. But the schemes shouldn't be piloted in working class areas, because gentrification, and it's only so the middle class cycling nazis can pass through.


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## teuchter (Jun 10, 2020)

On speed limits:

Yeah, I'd be very pleased with 10mph speed limits in residential streets too.

But actually we now have a 20mph speed limit pretty much throughout London. And a huge proportion of drivers ignore it. That's UK driving culture. Either it has to be strictly enforced - it's barely enforced at all - or we have to change the culture of driving in this country. Unfortunately it doesn't look like either of those things are going to happen soon. And as I understand it, at a local level, at a council level, the power to make either of those things happen is limited. Enforcement depends on national policy and leglislation and it depends on funding. So, if you want to do stuff at a local level, you have to look at other measures, and they are mostly things like traffic calming and partial closures like what's suggested in this scheme.

If a day were to come where 20mph was absolutely enforced (ideally with speed limiters in vehicles) and 10mph were to be absolutely enforced on purely residential streets, then quite possibly some of these restriction schemes would become redundant. It would be a much better situation if we didn't have to put physical defences up against motor vehicles, but at the moment we do.

For those who are saying we should deal with everything via speed limits instead - fine - write to your councillors and MPs and bang on about it until those who speak against such things are outnumbered. But at the moment "we should just do speed limits instead" is not a legitimate argument against the implementation of these kinds of schemes. It's not an immediately viable option. Help make the speed limits happen, and then some of these infrastructural restrictions can quite possibly be revisited.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

teuchter said:


> So, you think the scheme is a bad thing, but you want it be increased in scope to include your area?
> 
> Sometimes it feels like you can't win with traffic reduction schemes.
> 
> ...


Scheme is an excellent idea - but it needs to "embrace" (bit of council jargon there) all of the community.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> There's loads of parking in poets corner. People don't stick to the existing 20mph speed limit ffs. If you're a cyclist you know motorists don't give a shit about stuff like that.


Actually not all of Poet's: a lot of Mayall Road residents park on north Shakespeare as the bays are usually full on Mayall, and of course it's all the same CPZ (code PR) so they don't get ticketed (I've friends on Mayall who do it all the time). Anyway, parking isn't the issue here so I'll shut up!


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## teuchter (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> Scheme is an excellent idea - but it needs to "embrace" (bit of council jargon there) all of the community.


So you've changed your mind from what you were saying yesterday, where your problem with it was that it was going to push more traffic and pollution onto coldharbour lane and other areas.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

teuchter said:


> So you've changed your mind from what you were saying yesterday, where your problem with it was that it was going to push more traffic and pollution onto coldharbour lane and other areas.


Er, no. Parking conversation was off on a tangent (parking chat not important).


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## teuchter (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> Er, no. Parking conversation was off on a tangent (parking chat not important).


Not parking - pollution and traffic congestion. Yesterday you seemed to be concerned about it pushing traffic and pollution onto other roads:



Rocky Sullivan said:


> why are Lambeth wanting to push traffic into already busy/polluted roads (Coldharbour Lane/Brixton/LJ).





Rocky Sullivan said:


> it's not just Herne Hill, it will impact Brixton/Coldharbour Lane and LJ.





Rocky Sullivan said:


> All this proposed scheme does is increase by 100% the number of heavy goods vehicles thundering down north Shakespeare Road. It's not about cars it's about HGV pollution/speeding and dividing a community.





Rocky Sullivan said:


> You're absolutely right: we should not be adding to the dreadful pollution on Coldharbour with this scheme. Well said.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Not parking - pollution and traffic congestion. Yesterday you seemed to be concerned about it pushing traffic and pollution onto other roads:


I am very concerned. No change there.


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## teuchter (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> I am very concerned. No change there.


So it's an "excellent scheme" but you're "very concerned" about it.

It's getting confusing trying to figure out what your position is, exactly.


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## Rocky Sullivan (Jun 10, 2020)

teuchter said:


> So it's an "excellent scheme" but you're "very concerned" about it.
> 
> It's getting confusing trying to figure out what your position is, exactly.


I'm all for calming traffic and stopping pollution - but you have to admit it has been poorly executed by Lambeth. It's moving the problem, not seeking to prevent it. Also very wrong to allienate and offer no positives to a large section of our community. My partner was out all morning door-knocking for reactions: shock, disbelief, anger all round I'm afraid. We're all very upset about the situation.  At this time we need support and rallying around. That's me done (I need to get back to work!).


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## teuchter (Jun 10, 2020)

Rocky Sullivan said:


> I'm all for calming traffic and stopping pollution - but you have to admit it has been poorly executed by Lambeth. It's moving the problem, not seeking to prevent it. Also very wrong to allienate and offer no positives to a large section of our community. My partner was out all morning door-knocking for reactions: shock, disbelief, anger all round I'm afraid. We're all very upset about the situation.  At this time we need support and rallying around. That's me done (I need to get back to work!).


Ok, so you don't think it's an excellent scheme after all, even though you said that just a few posts back.

I don't want to defend Lambeth or their shambolic way of going about things. But this is not a reason to write off the scheme, and its basic principles, from the start. It's a shame that you start off from the position of shock and anger, and that this is then conveyed to other residents, because I don't think your position is well informed - you seem confused about what you think the pros and cons are, contradicting yourself in different statements, and you seem unclear on the details of what's actually proposed.

It may well be that this is Lambeth's fault for failures of consultation and communication, but everyone (except perhaps habitual car drivers) loses if the scheme ends up getting binned due to fear and misconceptions about what's actually going to happen.

I hope you can be persuaded to take a positive approach to it, where you wait and see what happens. If it somehow increases congestion and traffic on your street (I really don't think it will) then at that point argue for it to be altered, using the evidence of what's actually happening, after it's been given some time to bed in.

If no particular benefit appears on your street, but you can see that it successfully creates a safer and calmer environment within the Railton Road/Poets Corner area, then argue for it to be extended to cover the North Shakespeare rd and/or Somerleyton areas.

I just hope this does not get trashed without good reason other than that those ideologically opposed to space being given over to pedestrians and cyclists take advantage of Lambeth's poor communications to wind up residents and make them scared of a whole load of stuff that just isn't going to happen.

How about support and rallying around, in this case, meaning giving it the benefit of the doubt - in spite of Lambeth's failings. You can support these interventions (which are not going to be perfect) without supporting Lambeth. You would be supporting a wide ranging effort that goes way beyond the borders of Lambeth to try and reclaim street space for the people that live on them, and do something about air quality and stop people getting killed and injured needlessly. It might sound over dramatic to say it's a once in a lifetime opportunity - but it's so difficult, in this country, to get these changes to happen, that if the moment is not seized just now, we might slip back into the grindingly slow rate of progress that has sadly been the norm in the past couple of decades.


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## Nivag (Jun 11, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Yeah, I'd be very pleased with 10mph speed limits in residential streets too.


I hope the police will be stopping pedal bikes that break that speed limit as well


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## snowy_again (Jun 11, 2020)

How would they do that when speed limits don’t apply to cycles?


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## lordnoise (Jun 11, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> What's a two way give way system?. How would that make it safer?. Cars speed between the traffic calming measures as it is. Railton is a busy road.
> 
> If it's more difficult to drive and easier and safer to take other forms of transport people will do that.
> 
> Why not?.  Brixton had terrible pollution before this crisis and now we're in the middle of a pandemic affecting the respiratory system.



Its a common solution - you give priority to traffic in one direction and create give way points in the road at distances apart that prevent traffic from travelling above 20 MPH. it works well in Effra Parade and other places.
Other forms of transport ? Like taking the useful P4 bus service that travels down Railton Rd away ?
Finally please stop using the pandemic as an excuse for foisting unnecessary overbearing restrictions on the movement of ordinary local people. Life for the struggling majority is bad enough at the moment and the recession will make it worse.


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## teuchter (Jun 11, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> Its a common solution - you give priority to traffic in one direction and create give way points in the road at distances apart that prevent traffic from travelling above 20 MPH. it works well in Effra Parade and other places.
> Other forms of transport ? Like taking the useful P4 bus service that travels down Railton Rd away ?
> Finally please stop using the pandemic as an excuse for foisting unnecessary overbearing restrictions on the movement of ordinary local people. Life for the struggling majority is bad enough at the moment and the recession will make it worse.


"overbearing restrictions on the movement of ordinary local people"? Don't be silly.

I don't understand what you mean about the P4 bus. It doesn't go down Railton Road. It's the 322 that goes along Railton Rd isn't it? And I don't believe there's a plan to take it away - a reduction in traffic should allow it to run more smoothly.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 11, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> Its a common solution - you give priority to traffic in one direction and create give way points in the road at distances apart that prevent traffic from travelling above 20 MPH. it works well in Effra Parade and other places.


Effra Parade is a really quiet road with one give way place. There are already calming measures like that on Railton and the cars speed up between them, plus they are dangerous for other traffic going in the opposite direction .


lordnoise said:


> Other forms of transport ? Like taking the useful P4 bus service that travels down Railton Rd away ?
> Finally please stop using the pandemic as an excuse for foisting unnecessary overbearing restrictions on the movement of ordinary local people. Life for the struggling majority is bad enough at the moment and the recession will make it worse.


Brixton had terrible pollution and congestion before the pandemic and you want to make it worse be not giving people an alternative to car travel.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 11, 2020)

More details here:









						About Railton Neighbourhood
					

A space to learn about and feed into the Railton Low Traffic Neighbourhood.




					rtstreets.commonplace.is


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## Winot (Jun 11, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> Its a common solution - you give priority to traffic in one direction and create give way points in the road at distances apart that prevent traffic from travelling above 20 MPH. it works well in Effra Parade and other places.
> Other forms of transport ? Like taking the useful P4 bus service that travels down Railton Rd away ?
> Finally please stop using the pandemic as an excuse for foisting unnecessary overbearing restrictions on the movement of ordinary local people. Life for the struggling majority is bad enough at the moment and the recession will make it worse.



A minority of local people own cars.


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## lordnoise (Jun 12, 2020)

teuchter said:


> "overbearing restrictions on the movement of ordinary local people"? Don't be silly.
> 
> I don't understand what you mean about the P4 bus. It doesn't go down Railton Road. It's the 322 that goes along Railton Rd isn't it? And I don't believe there's a plan to take it away - a reduction in traffic should allow it to run more smoothly.



You don't believe ? Please provide evidence and btw calling people names doesn't advance an argument.


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 12, 2020)

Winot said:


> A minority of local people own cars.


60% of households don't. Page 10 of this: https://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/pl_Lambeth_Parking_standards_and_PTAL.pdf


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## lordnoise (Jun 12, 2020)

Winot said:


> A minority of local people own cars.



A significant number of ordinary working people (especially with families) in our wider area of South London do own motor vehicles and rely on them to get on with daily life. The public transport system simply isn't extensive enough to cover all their needs. 
These people don't have well paid jobs in the West End or City and certainly and don't have the time or energy to cycle to work.
Have we learnt nothing from the Brexit vote and an election which gave the Tories an 80 seat majority ? 
Ordinary people see closing useful local roads as pointless, high handed tinkering by a council whose only focus seems to be adding yet more pain to their lives. As we come out of this pandemic and resultant recession is this the best we can do for them ?


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## teuchter (Jun 12, 2020)




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## Rushy (Jun 12, 2020)

teuchter said:


> View attachment 217255


Wow - so a majority of all households with incomes from 20k+ have access to a car. And almost half from 15K income. That surprises me.

Not sure what proportion 20K+ households make up of total households overall but the average household income in Lambeth was 45K almost a decade ago. Median 36K. So a hefty majority for sure.


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## Winot (Jun 12, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> A significant number of ordinary working people (especially with families) in our wider area of South London do own motor vehicles and rely on them to get on with daily life. The public transport system simply isn't extensive enough to cover all their needs.
> These people don't have well paid jobs in the West End or City and certainly and don't have the time or energy to cycle to work.
> Have we learnt nothing from the Brexit vote and an election which gave the Tories an 80 seat majority ?
> Ordinary people see closing useful local roads as pointless, high handed tinkering by a council whose only focus seems to be adding yet more pain to their lives. As we come out of this pandemic and resultant recession is this the best we can do for them ?



Please let me know if you disagree with any of these statements:

1. Air pollution kills thousands of people in London per year.

2. It disproportionately kills low income people.

3. A major cause of air pollution in London is caused by vehicle emissions.

4. Most low income households don’t own cars.

Now assuming you agree with those, could you explain what positive measures you would take to stop low income people dying?


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## teuchter (Jun 12, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Wow - so a majority of all households with incomes as low as 20k+ have access to a car. That surprises me.
> 
> The average household income in Lambeth was 45K almost a decade ago. Median 36K.


That's London as a whole - which includes outer London, and wealthier boroughs, where car ownership is a lot higher than in Lambeth.
The overall average for London is 54%, the highest is 75%, and Lambeth is at 40%.




And of course, the area around Brixton is only part of Lambeth.
Cars per household varies from 0.4 to 0.8 across Lambeth, and the wards around Brixton are all at 0.4. By comparison, Dulwich Village is at 1.0.


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## thebackrow (Jun 16, 2020)

lordnoise said:


> You really must deal with the fact that the (LJ) scheme was deeply unpopular with most local people ...



Well, there were a relatively small number of people who made a lot of angry noise and in an unholy alliance with the rich folk of Dulwich. "Most local people" didn't get a chance to see what the real impact would have been given the trial was canned so early and there a lot of support for it in the consultation. 

So many contradictions in the complaints about this scheme.
"It's just for the benefit of the rich people in poets" - really? The two streets that are going to see the significant reductions in traffic are Shakespeare and Railton - the two 'poorest' streets with the most social housing on them. Why was that the case? because they were noisy, busy and polluted because of the traffic.

Apparently North Shakespeare is going to be 'cut off' from the schools and shops of Herne Hill (a 5-15 minute walk away, or 5 minute cycle) which is outrageous but it would be alright if that bit of the street was 'included' - (it already is, with rat running traffic removed - likely well over 3000 vehicle's a day less). Presumably that means they want the barrier moved to the north end - so they can drive the tiny distance to Herne Hill? At which point it would  be 'cut off' from Loughborough Junction instead (but that's fine for some reason)

Gramsci's against it of course as the council are involved.  Worth looking at what he said about the LJ scheme after it was canned - he called for schemes like this (ie low traffic neighbourhoods) and for reduction of traffic in the more middle class areas.  But not as middle class as Poets Corner presumably.  

Gramsci from Loughborough Junction public space improvements - consultation begins
_“How supporting unrestricted access to roads for motorised traffic ( for in practise that is the position of those here who opposed the road closures) is supporting the working class is beyond me.“
“For example one of the earlier discussions here was that these road closures were in working class areas and why not reduce through traffic by doing it in "middle class" areas. Such as at Hinton road? To deter through traffic?“
“What has happened is that the Council has now caved in completely to the motorist. There will be a further statutory consultation on the "improvements" that the new steering group are formulating. My opinion is that its a farce. All suggestions to reduce road traffic have been ruled out of the discussion. So the new improvements will be motorist first, pedestrians and cyclists second.”
“Walthamstow "mini Holland”. Waltham Forest Council pushed it through despite opposition. This article suggests its becoming a success. Lambeth have effectively ditched there manifesto committment to making Lambeth a cycle and pedestrian friendly borough. I have seen the Walthamstow Mini Holland as a friend of mine lives in it. It basically stops rat runs. “_


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## Rushy (Jun 16, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Apparently North Shakespeare is going to be 'cut off' from the schools and shops of Herne Hill (a 5-15 minute walk away, or 5 minute cycle) which is outrageous but it would be alright if that bit of the street was 'included' - (it already is, with rat running traffic removed - likely well over 3000 vehicle's a day less).


I find it hard to get my head around figures like this. There are 3,000 through or rat run journeys daily (on top of local journeys) on Shakespeare Road which will be cut out? That's one every 20s from 6am to 9pm - not including any locally starting / ending journeys such as all the depot traffic. I tend to avoid peak hours but I have always found that road pretty quiet. Is that an actual figure?

And I don't know the workings of the waste depot and council facility but isn't the argument people are making that the number of HGV journeys to and from the depot will remain unaffected except that, instead of journeys being split north and south, they will inevitably be 100% "filtered" to the north?


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## prunus (Jun 16, 2020)

Rushy said:


> I find it hard to get my head around figures like this. There are 3,000 through or rat run journeys daily (on top of local journeys) on Shakespeare Road which will be cut out? That's one every 20s from 6am to 9pm - not including any locally starting / ending journeys such as all the depot traffic. I tend to avoid peak hours but I have always found that road pretty quiet. Is that an actual figure?
> 
> And I don't know the workings of the waste depot and council facility but isn't the argument people are making that the number of HGV journeys to and from the depot will remain unaffected except that, instead of journeys being split north and south, they will inevitably be 100% "filtered" to the north?



There doesn't appear to be a count point for Shakespeare Road; for comparison for how they 'feel', if you know them: the north end of Milkwood Road seems to average about 6000-7000 motor vehicles a day - the south end more like 5000.  Dulwich Road near the junction with Shakespeare Road about 12000.

Map Road traffic statistics - Road traffic statistics

Have fun   (Warning - one can spend hours on that site)


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## editor (Jun 16, 2020)

prunus said:


> There doesn't appear to be a count point for Shakespeare Road; for comparison for how they 'feel', if you know them: the north end of Milkwood Road seems to average about 6000-7000 motor vehicles a day - the south end more like 5000.  Dulwich Road near the junction with Shakespeare Road about 12000.
> 
> Map Road traffic statistics - Road traffic statistics
> 
> Have fun   (Warning - one can spend hours on that site)


According to that site, Milkwood gets more traffic that Brixton Road!


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## prunus (Jun 16, 2020)

editor said:


> According to that site, Milkwood gets more traffic that Brixton Road!
> 
> View attachment 217893



I don't think so; Brixton Road is ~20k.  The number in the screenshot above is the id of the count point not the count (although possibly I'm obtusely missing the joke...)


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## editor (Jun 16, 2020)

prunus said:


> I don't think so; Brixton Road is ~20k.  The number in the screenshot above is the id of the count point not the count (although possibly I'm obtusely missing the joke...)


Ah sorry - no I honestly couldn't makes sense of the map. If I click on a marker I just get these numbers pop up and that's it. What am I missing?


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## Rushy (Jun 16, 2020)

prunus said:


> There doesn't appear to be a count point for Shakespeare Road; for comparison for how they 'feel', if you know them: the north end of Milkwood Road seems to average about 6000-7000 motor vehicles a day - the south end more like 5000.  Dulwich Road near the junction with Shakespeare Road about 12000.
> 
> Map Road traffic statistics - Road traffic statistics
> 
> Have fun   (Warning - one can spend hours on that site)


Luckily I can't seem to get the map to load just now!   I'll try again later.


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## thebackrow (Jun 16, 2020)

Rushy said:


> I find it hard to get my head around figures like this. There are 3,000 through or rat run journeys daily (on top of local journeys) on Shakespeare Road which will be cut out? That's one every 20s from 6am to 9pm - not including any locally starting / ending journeys such as all the depot traffic. I tend to avoid peak hours but I have always found that road pretty quiet. Is that an actual figure?
> 
> And I don't know the workings of the waste depot and council facility but isn't the argument people are making that the number of HGV journeys to and from the depot will remain unaffected except that, instead of journeys being split north and south, they will inevitably be 100% "filtered" to the north?



So, a very quick estimate from Google earth I reckon there might be 150 residential properties on Shakespeare North.  Some are houses which will be split into flats. but let's call it 250 households. Lambeth stats say about 40% will have a car. That's 100 cars and actually that looks about the number that can be seen on google earth as well.  Look around your streets and you'll see most cars don't actually move every day - commute share by car in Lambeth is less than 10% but we want to make this number high so lets say every car makes 1 trip every day as an assumption.   That's 200 car movements by residents each day (one out, one back).  
Add deliveries to that.  There must be a dozen different courier companies. plus the post office, Plus veg boxes and a few Amazon drivers and supermarket home delivery. But surely not more than 50 vans coming each day so add another 100 movements.  
Add some takeaway deliveries - 10% of homes day (I'm sure it's nothing like that high). 50 movements. 
Add some carers and visitors.  
We're still below 400 vehicle movements a day for residents who live on the street and that's probably a significant over estimate. 
And of course, the residents at the north end don't  drive past the homes on southern end so the road gets progressively quieter the further south you go.  

the DFT figures aren't great - if you dig into them you'll find most years are estimates BUT lambeth took counts for the 20mph introduction in 2017 (and before in 2015) using those rubber strips in the street and they _are_ accurate.  Thats where the 3600 comes (combined count of both directions) What does the data say?

It looks like it separates it by number of axles so 14 HGVs a day (do these already all go north because of the height restriction on the bridge?) and 26 'trucks'.  The only category that should be increasing on Shakespeare North is that 26 (but that includes the bin lorries and their routes routes are unchanged).


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## Rushy (Jun 16, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> So, a very quick estimate from Google earth I reckon there might be 150 residential properties on Shakespeare North.  Some are houses which will be split into flats. but let's call it 250 households. Lambeth stats say about 40% will have a car. That's 100 cars and actually that looks about the number that can be seen on google earth as well.  Look around your streets and you'll see most cars don't actually move every day - commute share by car in Lambeth is less than 10% but we want to make this number high so lets say every car makes 1 trip every day as an assumption.   That's 200 car movements by residents each day (one out, one back).
> Add deliveries to that.  There must be a dozen different courier companies. plus the post office, Plus veg boxes and a few Amazon drivers and supermarket home delivery. But surely not more than 50 vans coming each day so add another 100 movements.
> Add some takeaway deliveries - 10% of homes day (I'm sure it's nothing like that high). 50 movements.
> Add some carers and visitors.
> ...


OK, so the 3600 is a real measured figure. I have no idea how to estimate the resident associated traffic but nothing you guessed sounds immediately unreasonable. The rest is all a bit vague, isn't it. Local collection bin lorries should account for 2 movements a week. It's a waste management depot and skip lorries are largely 2 axel - there are 300 large 2 axel vehicles a day. They do go under the bridge. I can see why people would want to be sure that this had been looked at.


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## prunus (Jun 16, 2020)

editor said:


> Ah sorry - no I honestly couldn't makes sense of the map. If I click on a marker I just get these numbers pop up and that's it. What am I missing?



You should get a side panel like this:




Which you then click on download the data to get the detail:


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## thebackrow (Jun 16, 2020)

Rushy said:


> OK, so the 3600 is a real measured figure. I have no idea how to estimate the resident associated traffic but nothing you guessed sounds immediately unreasonable. The rest is all a bit vague, isn't it. Local collection bin lorries should account for 2 movements a week. It's a waste management depot and skip lorries are largely 2 axel - there are 300 large 2 axel vehicles a day. They do go under the bridge. I can see why people would want to be sure that this had been looked at.


Is it only local bin lorries?  I thought the Bin Lorry depot was on Shakespeare but the site runs through to Somerleyton Road (I went to the site once and entered on foot via Shakespeare). Looking at google maps it's entrance only on Shakespeare but it actually looks like entrance AND exit on Somerleyton.  

I think you're right on the large 2 axle vehicles - I'd read that category as 'Transit vans' (so assumed it would be the 50 I estimated above and a load of rat running vans) but it would presumably include the flatbed transit based waste collection trucks as well so maybe that category wouldn't drop as much . 

So maybe its a few hundred vehicles more than that 400 estimate and it obviously needs monitoring. Apparently the skip site has already been sold and it's going to become housing but of course finding somewhere else for it to go in the borough isn't going to be easy.  The proposed site up at West Norwood is next to a school and of course other peoples homes.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 17, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Is it only local bin lorries?  I thought the Bin Lorry depot was on Shakespeare but the site runs through to Somerleyton Road (I went to the site once and entered on foot via Shakespeare). Looking at google maps it's entrance only on Shakespeare but it actually looks like entrance AND exit on Somerleyton.  View attachment 217948
> 
> I think you're right on the large 2 axle vehicles - I'd read that category as 'Transit vans' (so assumed it would be the 50 I estimated above and a load of rat running vans) but it would presumably include the flatbed transit based waste collection trucks as well so maybe that category wouldn't drop as much .
> 
> So maybe its a few hundred vehicles more than that 400 estimate and it obviously needs monitoring. Apparently the skip site has already been sold and it's going to become housing but of course finding somewhere else for it to go in the borough isn't going to be easy.  The proposed site up at West Norwood is next to a school and of course other peoples homes.


Funnily enough the skip site on Herne Place sold too but fell through because they couldn't find anywhere to move the business to (although much smaller so maybe weren't trying very hard).


----------



## sleaterkinney (Jun 17, 2020)

It's worth noting that only 9% of people in the area use a vehicle for travel to work. Most of the traffic is rat running.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 17, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Well, there were a relatively small number of people who made a lot of angry noise and in an unholy alliance with the rich folk of Dulwich. "Most local people" didn't get a chance to see what the real impact would have been given the trial was canned so early and there a lot of support for it in the consultation.
> 
> So many contradictions in the complaints about this scheme.
> "It's just for the benefit of the rich people in poets" - really? The two streets that are going to see the significant reductions in traffic are Shakespeare and Railton - the two 'poorest' streets with the most social housing on them. Why was that the case? because they were noisy, busy and polluted because of the traffic.
> ...



Thanks for posting up about me making sure Im likelly to miss this post.

No Im not  aways against the schemes.

Im against the way that people are consulted.

You just don't understand this. A more nuanced approach than yours.

The oppostion to the LJ was by a well run successful campaign by the Council tenants of the Loughborough Estate. The local working class. I know I was saw it.

lordnoise is right the LJ scheme was deepy unpopular with local people. They were from the Loughborough Estate. A working class area. I don't now anyone from the estate who supported the Loughborough road closure.

Given the endlless posts here of graphs etc showing what a benefit it would be it needs to be asked why a Labour Council could not persuade a working class area that these road closures were for their benefit. The Labour party is supposed to represent the interests of the working class. 

Like lordnoise has posted:



> Have we learnt nothing from the Brexit vote and an election which gave the Tories an 80 seat majority ?
> Ordinary people see closing useful local roads as pointless, high handed tinkering by a council whose only focus seems to be adding yet more pain to their lives. As we come out of this pandemic and resultant recession is this the best we can do for them ?



I agree with this.

On LJ , apart from growing hostility to LJAG, the Lambeth Labour were seen as not being interested in working clsss communities. The road closure scheme opposition was a way to give the local Labour party a slap. Cllr Rachel saw this and supported her constituents on this. To her credit.


----------



## teuchter (Jun 17, 2020)

No-one can know what proportion of LJ residents, or even what proportion of Loughborough Estate residents were actually against the scheme.

I think we can agree that the implementation was horribly botched by Lambeth, and that they were not able to offer a convincing response to the objections raised. And I think we can agree that no-one got to see the actual results of the scheme, and had the opportunity to judge it on those actual results.

In that context, yes the campaign against it was very successful.

Apparently the consultation forms never reached most people on the estate. I've been told that the SUV driving director of the estate management board, who was recently on trial for fraud, was particularly anti the measures. Do you know if there's any truth in that Gramsci ?


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 17, 2020)

teuchter said:


> No-one can know what proportion of LJ residents, or even what proportion of Loughborough Estate residents were actually against the scheme.
> 
> I think we can agree that the implementation was horribly botched by Lambeth, and that they were not able to offer a convincing response to the objections raised. And I think we can agree that no-one got to see the actual results of the scheme, and had the opportunity to judge it on those actual results.
> 
> ...



I can guess from the packed public meeting on the estate and talking to people on the estate that the majority were against the closure of Loughborough road. 

The TRA at north end of Loughborough road were also against the scheme. They had other suggestions for traffic calming. Which weren't listened to. 

The Chair of LEMB was acquitted. 

On this the LEMB were representing the tenants.

Its not often I see a packed meeting of residents. The only other times Ive seen this was after the murder inn the Youth Centre and to save Brixton Rec.

in LJ there had developed hostility to LJAG over several years on the Estate. Which contributed to the opposition.

If a more small scale scheme had been done then I think it would have worked. Closing a few rat runs- like the Padfield road and bringing in better traffic calming.


----------



## thebackrow (Jun 17, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> Given the endlless posts here of graphs etc showing what a benefit it would be it needs to be asked why a Labour Council could not persuade a working class area that these road closures were for their benefit. The Labour party is supposed to represent the interests of the working class.



Does that also apply to Waltham Forest? Another working class Labour area. There was a mass of resistance to the schemes there as well but you cheered on WF council for pushing through with it despite the opposition.



Gramsci said:


> If a more small scale scheme had been done then I think it would have worked. Closing a few rat runs- like the Padfield road and bringing in better traffic calming.


So as long as they ensured that the scheme changed nothing (effectively) it would have got approval? Yes, years of 'neighbourhood improvements schemes' trying to get support from everyone led to completely ineffective changes all over the borough.  A few trees, a few speed humps.  No one can really object to that.  Makes F-all difference to the amount of traffic though. 



Gramsci said:


> Im against the way that people are consulted.



Every single walking/cycling/traffic reduction scheme the 'pro-driving' campaigners complain that 'no one told us', 'the consultation is invalid', 'we weren't consulted' (which is a lovely bit of twisted logic to put in as a response to a consultation).  Every household in Railton area was supposedly written to as part of the Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood, and again as part of this process but no-one who does't want this saw the letters of course.

To quote you again "_How supporting unrestricted access to roads for motorised traffic ( for in practise that is the position of those here who opposed the road closures) is supporting the working class is beyond me"_

No consultation is ever perfect, and there will always be a vocal minority who oppose anything.



Gramsci said:


> No Im not aways against the schemes.



Which are you going to support then? Theres a load more coming up from the looks of things.  There's no way they can both get them in quickly and do a load of detailed consultation work so are you going to oppose all of them?


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 17, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Does that also apply to Waltham Forest? Another working class Labour area. There was a mass of resistance to the schemes there as well but you cheered on WF council for pushing through with it despite the opposition.
> 
> 
> So as long as they ensured that the scheme changed nothing (effectively) it would have got approval? Yes, years of 'neighbourhood improvements schemes' trying to get support from everyone led to completely ineffective changes all over the borough.  A few trees, a few speed humps.  No one can really object to that.  Makes F-all difference to the amount of traffic though.
> ...



Your posts are example of why some people don't enthusiastically support these schemes.

I keep tellling you as someone who lives in LJ it was not a "vocal minority" that opposed it.

This quote from what recent post of mine here is it from? I know this discussion has been going across several threads.

On the present scheme - this Railton road scheme is a temporary scheme for social distancing. Ive already said I accept that several times.

Its supposed to be separate from the Liveable Neighborhood scheme.

Though in practise the Council is without making it clear sliding the two together. Ive posted about that I think on Brixton thread. Looking up Lambeth consultation page.


----------



## teuchter (Jun 17, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> I can guess from the packed public meeting on the estate and talking to people on the estate that the majority were against the closure of Loughborough road.
> 
> The TRA at north end of Loughborough road were also against the scheme. They had other suggestions for traffic calming. Which weren't listened to.
> 
> ...


I don't blame you for choosing not to answer my question.

I know about the packed meeting - I was there, and I heard what was said, and saw how there was no chance of the council representative being able to reply, and I don't disagree that it was the council's fault that things went so badly, and I don't blame residents for being concerned, but I do believe there was a lot of misinformation going round - it turned out later that the ambulance service had not identified any significant problems resulting form the scheme, for example, although that was one of the emotive points brought up at that meeting. As a little reminder of the tone of everything around then, here's the flyer that was put through peoples' doors which LJ road madness said wasn't anything to do with them.

I'll try not to say anything more about the LJ scheme on this thread. Things were not as clear cut as are being retrospectively claimed though.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 17, 2020)

teuchter said:


> I don't blame you for choosing not to answer my question.
> 
> I know about the packed meeting - I was there, and I heard what was said, and saw how there was no chance of the council representative being able to reply, and I don't disagree that it was the council's fault that things went so badly, and I don't blame residents for being concerned, but I do believe there was a lot of misinformation going round - it turned out later that the ambulance service had not identified any significant problems resulting form the scheme, for example, although that was one of the emotive points brought up at that meeting. As a little reminder of the tone of everything around then, here's the flyer that was put through peoples' doors which LJ road madness said wasn't anything to do with them.
> View attachment 218110
> I'll try not to say anything more about the LJ scheme on this thread. Things were not as clear cut as are being retrospectively claimed though.



I thought I did answer the question. The fraud trial went to court and he was acquitted.


----------



## teuchter (Jun 17, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> I thought I did answer the question. The fraud trial went to court and he was acquitted.


My question was more whether it's true that he is known to be personally strongly anti restrictions on car use.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 17, 2020)

teuchter said:


> My question was more whether it's true that he is known to be personally strongly anti restrictions on car use.



Does that matter? He was not the Council tenant on the estate who led the campaign along with other residents.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 17, 2020)

No idea what went on in LJ - I remember there was a endless rows on urb but no details. dont really care to be honest.

I'd just like to know whats happening at the end of my street.


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## Not a Vet (Jun 17, 2020)

As a resident of Railton, we got a couple of letters with no details of any changes with a link to a website that didn’t work until we got the letter with the cartoon diagram about what was going to be done. It’s only been in the last few days when work has already started that you can leave any comments. I don’t object to the sentiment but it’s just the lack of consultation that sticks but hey, could be worse, live in Shakespeare north, you get all the skip lorries, network rail and school when it returns and can only get to HH via LJ. My wife drives to Vauxhall via Shakespeare pre gates but we will explore a blend of driving, cycling and walking so in that respect, it’s successful if that’s what they want to achieve


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## Gramsci (Jun 17, 2020)

I would urge people to comment on the Railton scheme. 

friendofdorothy Not a Vet 

 Ive just been looking at the commonplace comment page for the scheme and its starting to get comments.

Really good one I will post up:




> We are past the point where the local authorities assumption of what would be best for us, is the good enough basis to just move forward - We need and deserve to be part of the process. It is frustrating that such energy and passion is going into blocking change rather than creating a future environment for Shakespeare Road N and S residents that offers a less polluted environment. It's frustrating to see councillors giving up time to allow us to shout at you when we could all be investing time in a more positive process.
> 
> For the trial to go-ahead without a process of co-design is damaging to our co-hesion as a neighbourhood and most certainly to the communities trust in our elected representatives to represent. I think we can be trusted with the job of working out, with you, the best ways for this to move forward - with time for us to get clear on what benefits we would like to see for this neighbourhood as the outcomes of our trial. And time for you to return on impact assessments and the wider implications of the scheme. This could be the starting point for a co-design process would offer a proper opportunity for collaboration as that is clearly what the community want to see.











						Comment on the temporary scheme
					

Give us your feedback on the temporary project and let us know about any specific improvements or issues by marking them on a map of the area




					rtstreets.commonplace.is
				




Co designing is supposed to be part of the way things should be done under Lambeth the "Coop" Council.


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## Rushy (Jun 17, 2020)

Introduction to the Cooperative Council Constitution



			https://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Introduction%20to%20the%20Cooperative%20Council%20Constitution.pdf
		




> The Council believes that the challenges facing the borough can only be met by recasting the relationship between the Council, and the citizens and communities of Lambeth. Citizens are valuable sources of insight and expertise, and are often best placed to identify solutions to meet the needs of their local area. The Cooperative Council ambition is about putting the resources of the state at the disposal of citizens so that they can take control of both services and the places in which they live. It is about finding new ways in which citizens can participate in the decisions that affect their lives.


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## snowy_again (Jun 18, 2020)

Here’s the DfT initiative this is being directed through:
Emergency active travel fund: local transport authority allocations 

and the statutory guidance: 
Reallocating road space in response to COVID-19: statutory guidance for local authorities 

And the directions on reallocating roadspace




__





						Traffic Management Act 2004: network management to support active travel
					






					www.gov.uk
				




“Measures should be taken as swiftly as possible, and in any event within weeks, given the urgent need to change travel habits before the restart takes full effect.” Which is slightly contradicted with a later paragraph 

“Authorities should seek input from stakeholders during the design phase. They should consult with the local chiefs of police and emergency services to ensure access is maintained where needed, for example to roads that are closed to motor traffic. Local businesses, including those temporarily closed, should be consulted to ensure proposals meet their needs when they re-open. Kerbside access should be enabled wherever possible for deliveries and servicing.”


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

Im aware of thst this is being done as response to the Pandemic to ensure social distancing.

Ive repeatedly said on different threads here that I support that.

But my issue is that Council are using it in Railton to push through part of the "Liveable" Neighbourhood scheme. Which is a different issue.

As Ive posted already the Council are mixing two different consultations together.


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

__





						Traffic Management Act 2004: network management to support active travel
					






					www.gov.uk
				




So the Tories have decided Police, Emergency services and business will be consulted.

The proles won't. Its good for people to get back to work and be more healthy. Stop being lazy.

Might explain why the stretch of Atlantic road between Dogstar and Brixton road has not been made pedestrian and bus only. It is a place Ive found social distancing is not possible for shopping. Its an area that could do with temporary change to bus and pedestrian road.


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## Rushy (Jun 18, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No. Residents are stakeholders. Lambeth Cooperative Council has made the decision not to include them.


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

Rushy said:


> No. Residents are stakeholders. Lambeth Cooperative Council has made the decision not to include them.



I agree they are but as snowy_again quote points out its not explicity stated in the Government legislation.

The way I read it the Police , emergency services and roadside business are consulted at "design stage". Not residents. The government guidance does talk about consultation after temporary schemes in place. If they are to be made permanent.

Its a bit vague on what is the difference between "experimental" and "temporary" imo.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 18, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Or more likely that the Civil Service are updating the 2004 Act to respond (back in May) and using the National Travel Survey results that showed that 40% of urban journeys were under 2 miles - suitable (for many) to be made via walking or cycling. 

The preamble to the link I posted above covers the demand side in more details.

Most of the original Bill and subsequent Act was developed with a Labour MP as parliamentary under secretary


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## sleaterkinney (Jun 18, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> So as long as they ensured that the scheme changed nothing (effectively) it would have got approval? Yes, years of 'neighbourhood improvements schemes' trying to get support from everyone led to completely ineffective changes all over the borough.  A few trees, a few speed humps.  No one can really object to that.  Makes F-all difference to the amount of traffic though.


This is why I'm not that arsed about consultation, it will just run into the usual Nimby stuff and we'll end up with a few useless traffic calming measures. There is a huge amount of entitlement around motoring.


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## teuchter (Jun 18, 2020)

Rushy said:


> No. Residents are stakeholders. Lambeth Cooperative Council has made the decision not to include them.


Well, they've decided that they will be consulted while the measures are in place on an experimental basis, as far as I can make out. The government guidance is a little contradictory, as snowy_again points out, because it talks about consultation happening during the "design phase". I expect Lambeth would argue that seeing how things work on an experimental basis is part of the design phase.


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## teuchter (Jun 18, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> Im aware of thst this is being done as response to the Pandemic to ensure social distancing.
> 
> Ive repeatedly said on different threads here that I support that.
> 
> ...


I agree that they may be mixing up consultations.

However I think that it's quite clear that schemes like the liveable neighbourhoods ones fall within categories of scheme which the guidance lists under "Reallocating road space: measures" -


> Introducing pedestrian and cycle zones: restricting access for motor vehicles at certain times (or at all times) to specific streets, or networks of streets, particularly town centres and high streets. This will enable active travel but also social distancing in places where people are likely to gather.
> Modal filters (also known as filtered permeability); closing roads to motor traffic, for example by using planters or large barriers. Often used in residential areas, this can create neighbourhoods that are low-traffic or traffic free, creating a more pleasant environment that encourages people to walk and cycle, and improving safety.


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## snowy_again (Jun 18, 2020)

yesterday TfL published a massive chunk of travel data  under the title ‘strategic neighbourhood analysis’ to guide the implementation of Low Traffic Neighbourhoods. 

The data (I think) will be used to assess future investment


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

teuchter said:


> I agree that they may be mixing up consultations.
> 
> However I think that it's quite clear that schemes like the liveable neighbourhoods ones fall within categories of scheme which the guidance lists under "Reallocating road space: measures" -



I been looking at the government guidance and this does look like this is the case


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

Thing that I don't like is theTorie are doing this and also putting up fares for public transport. In the deal they forced on Khan.  I'm for a just transition to green transport not an unjust one.


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## teuchter (Jun 18, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> Thing that I don't like is theTorie are doing this and also putting up fares for public transport. In the deal they forced on Khan.  I'm for a just transition to green transport not an unjust one.


If you've not seen this already, I recommend reading it (including the comments section).


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## Rushy (Jun 18, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Well, they've decided that they will be consulted while the measures are in place on an experimental basis, as far as I can make out. The government guidance is a little contradictory, as snowy_again points out, because it talks about consultation happening during the "design phase". I expect Lambeth would argue that seeing how things work on an experimental basis is part of the design phase.


Lambeth will argue anything that helps justify their avoiding cooperation with local people.


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## snowy_again (Jun 18, 2020)

Isn’t their argument that the commonplace website is what they will use to gather info?


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## editor (Jun 18, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Isn’t their argument that the commonplace website is what they will use to gather info?


I wouldn't be surprised if just this one threads gets more traffic and comments than the related sections on commonplace.  I don't think the project's presentation was particularly appealing or well advertised or promoted at all, but that's not unusual for Lambeth who generally have appalling web/IT skills.


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## snowy_again (Jun 18, 2020)

Nope, the commonplace site is being very well used - much more so in the last few days.

It’s not a discussion forum though - it pinpoints comments on the scheme and allows meta tags and ‘likes’of other peoples’ comments.

The software is a bit clunky and I’m not sure whether it meets equalities act guidance, and it doesn’t easily link to the reasons and policies behind the work. 

Update on Railton ANPR - a lorry arrived yesterday and took 30 mins to load 4 orange barriers they’d put around the camera and sign posts. I’ll bet now that the northbound one is knocked down in less than two weeks.


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## thebackrow (Jun 18, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> This is why I'm not that arsed about consultation, it will just run into the usual Nimby stuff and we'll end up with a few useless traffic calming measures. There is a huge amount of entitlement around motoring.



Exactly. I keep pointing out the massive contradiction between Gramsci's own statements over the years. 

Back when the LJ scheme was canned (way back in the LJ scheme thread) he said:

_“What has happened is that the Council has now caved in completely to the motorist. There will be a further statutory consultation on the "improvements" that the new steering group are formulating. My opinion is that its a farce. All suggestions to reduce road traffic have been ruled out of the discussion. So the new improvements will be motorist first, pedestrians and cyclists second.”_

So it was a farce because all suggestions to reduce road traffic were ruled out but now he thinks "a more small scale scheme had been done then I think it would have worked. Closing a few rat runs- like the Padfield road and bringing in better traffic calming." Ie if they'd done a scheme that did nothing to reduce road traffic would have been fine. 

I can't work out anything that reconciles those two statements coming from the same person about the same scheme.


----------



## editor (Jun 18, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Nope, the commonplace site is being very well used - much more so in the last few days.
> 
> It’s not a discussion forum though - it pinpoints comments on the scheme and allows meta tags and ‘likes’of other peoples’ comments.
> 
> ...


How do you know how busy it is and how many people are using it? The quotes aren't attributed so it could be just a handful of people contributing.

I can't imagine many people on my estate would be likely to grapple with it, assuming they even know about it in the first place.

And going to this page and clicking the big 'see ideas and comment' button does absolutely nothing. Awful design.


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## Rushy (Jun 18, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Exactly. I keep pointing out the massive contradiction between Gramsci's own statements over the years.
> 
> Back when the LJ scheme was canned (way back in the LJ scheme thread) he said:
> 
> ...


Hang on. You're agreeing with someone saying that they're not arsed about consultation of local residents. Yet weren't cyclists very closely and repeatedly consulted on these very schemes? 

Its all very well moaning about one group's sense of entitlement but it is not a step forward to replace it with another's.


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## Rushy (Jun 18, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Isn’t their argument that the commonplace website is what they will use to gather info?


Why wasn't that used for consulting cyclists? Because it is shit. And hard to find. And not fit for purpose. That's why cyclists had repeated consults with officers.

And these projects are supposed to be as much about pedestrians. Who are likely to make up the most pedestrians? Residents in the areas.


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## teuchter (Jun 18, 2020)

I don't really see evidence that these schemes have been contrived in a way that prioritises cyclists over pedestrians, nor that there are things that have been done to suit cyclists that have prevented measures that would benefit pedestrians more.

On the whole, if you make somewhere more cycle-friendly, you also make it more pedestrian friendly. 

Of course, you can make it even more pedestrian friendly by removing cyclists altogether, but that implies also moving all motorised traffic altogether, but that is not the kind of thing that is being implemented here.

There is some kind of theoretical scenario where there's an intention to fully pedestrianise an area, and then a cyclist lobby group appears and manages to get a dedicated cycle route through the middle of it and ruins it, but that is miles away from anything being talked about in this case.


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## teuchter (Jun 18, 2020)

There are also, by the way, a few groups who represent pedestrian interests specifically, eg









						Walkable Neighbourhoods
					

Cities around the world are now competing in terms of liveability. At Living Streets we think this means ensuring our streets are walkable.




					www.livingstreets.org.uk
				




I don't know to what extent they have been involved in / consulted upon as far as these schemes are concerned, but I do believe they try to get involved in influencing policy.


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Exactly. I keep pointing out the massive contradiction between Gramsci's own statements over the years.
> 
> Back when the LJ scheme was canned (way back in the LJ scheme thread) he said:
> 
> ...



Can you stop doing this.

You are posting up about me without the courtesy of linking my user name properly.

This is the second time Ive pointed this out to you recently.  You ignored me last time.

Its underhand.

If you've something to say to me have the courtesy of doing it properly. Do it directly  to me.


----------



## editor (Jun 18, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Hang on. You're agreeing with someone saying that they're not arsed about consultation of local residents. Yet weren't cyclists very closely and repeatedly consulted on these very schemes?


Could you detail how cyclists were "very closely and repeatedly consulted" on these schemes, please?


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Exactly. I keep pointing out the massive contradiction between Gramsci's own statements over the years.
> 
> Back when the LJ scheme was canned (way back in the LJ scheme thread) he said:
> 
> ...



Plus Ive already dealt with this in previous posts. You don't listen.


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## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

editor said:


> Could you detail how cyclists were "very closely and repeatedly consulted" on these schemes, please?



Actuallly Lambeth Cyclists and LCC are very good at getting the ear of politicians.

From what Ive seen the idea is to go for the top decision makers.

Also consultation is pointless it would be better if Councils imposed this from above.

They are well organised. 

Not a criticism.


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## thebackrow (Jun 18, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> Plus Ive already dealt with this in previous posts. You don't listen.


No, you've never managed to explain the hypocrisy.  



editor said:


> Could you detail how cyclists were "very closely and repeatedly consulted" on these schemes, please?



Surely the relevant cabinet members and officers wouldn't be doing a very good job if they didn't "closely and repeatedly" speak to campaign groups.  You'd kind of hope they would be speaking to Living Streets, Mums for Lungs, Lambeth Cyclists, Friends of the Earth, Greenpeace? Must be others too.  Isn't 'influencing policy' the whole aim of a campaign groups?  There wouldn't be any point in them existing if they didn't. 

They must be meeting with Extinction Rebellion too given that they're setting up a citizens assembly. 
Sure enough - Agenda for Council on Wednesday 22 January 2020, 7.00 pm | Lambeth Council
"Following regular meetings with a wide range of environmental groups, including Extinction Rebellion and Mums for Lungs, it had been decided to delay setting up the assembly to ensure it was organised robustly."


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## thebackrow (Jun 18, 2020)

Also, on the "theres been no consultation" has anyone actually dug around the Railton website?








						What did you tell us?
					

Take a look at the engagement results




					rtstreets.commonplace.is
				




This doesn't sound like they just quietly dropped a website and did nothing more.


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## editor (Jun 18, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> Also, on the "theres been no consultation" has anyone actually dug around the Railton website?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


They received a total of 142 responses in a year. That's half of what this single thread gets in half that time.


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## thebackrow (Jun 18, 2020)

How many individual posters on this thread (rather than the same few of us sparring over the same old issues?)  Anyway, those 6 weeks this year look rather busy - that certainly looks like an _attempt_ to do a load more community work that seemed to have been done in the past.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

thebackrow said:


> No, you've never managed to explain the hypocrisy.



So its abuse now.

You have made your position clear. You aren't interested in local community being consulted. So they should have it imposed on them. 

I cycle all the time. Have done so for years. I don't own a car. I use public transport.

I am not a petrol head or nimby.

I have repeatedly given my position on the recent scheme.

So you choose to try and smear me. Digging up stuff from years ago.

Its this kind of thing that puts me off green issues.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

Thing is Council were doing consultation on the Liveable Neighnourhood scheme.

This was an ongoing process.

As Ive said previously the officer in charge told us in LJ that lessons had been learnt from the LJ road closure fiasco.

The Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood scheme I was told would not happen if the Council hadnt this time built up local community support.

This was not going to be a quick process.

Council were going to try harder to consult.

In the case of the Railton scheme consultation has given way to just doing a scheme. The Council never went back to the community to get agreement for the scheme. Except for input of business , police and emergency services

This has happened due to pandemic.

As this is a scheme that is temporary further consultation should happen later.

In theory.

Im going to have to see if that happens in any meaningful way.

As Rushy has posted up this is supposed to be a Coop Council. It wasn't my idea. Pre pandemic meeting and I pointed out to the Labour Cllrs present at a local community meeting that this was supposed to be a Coop Council . Has been for years. They should have sorted out how to do consultation by now. ( this was on another local issue where lack of consultation was brought up by a resident.)

If the Council dont want to be a Coop Council they should say so. People can't be accused of being difficult if they are just exercising what they thought were there rights under a Coop Council.


----------



## Gramsci (Jun 18, 2020)

On another scheme was chatting to the consultants. Commonplace is one way to consult. But on the ground face to face consultation along with going around and observing how a neighbourhood is used are very important.

With social distancing and pandemic that is either difficult or not possible.

Commonplace isn't really enough to base decisons on. That is if community are going to be involved in schemes in a meaningful way.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jun 18, 2020)

Dear thebackrow please take your gripes and personal digs about LJ to the LJ forum. Its getting very difficult to follow to follow whats actually happening here in Herne Hill on this forum



thebackrow said:


> Also, on the "theres been no consultation" has anyone actually dug around the Railton website?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


didn't even know there was a 'Railton website' and having no children, no faith, rarely visiting a market and having not been ill lately I missed all this. Can I just speak up for all the people in the area who don't do social media, who don't have smart phones who maybe who don't have any access to the internet, it's not all young and affluent people around here. And loads of us have been staying indoors.  I walk down Railton road frequently (not so often during lockdown) and there are no notices, posters or signs at all, though I saw a bit of Shakespear rd around Mayall road is closed - it looks temp like road works.

I'm still unclear as to what is actually going to be happening on Railton road?


----------



## madolesance (Jun 19, 2020)

All through traffic needs to be removed from residential areas. Residential’ zones are where people live, kids can play and not worry about speeding vehicles passing through and usually not giving any thought about who may live there.


----------



## editor (Jun 19, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> Dear thebackrow please take your gripes and personal digs about LJ to the LJ forum. Its getting very difficult to follow to follow whats actually happening here in Herne Hill on this forum
> 
> 
> didn't even know there was a 'Railton website' and having no children, no faith, rarely visiting a market and having not been ill lately I missed all this. Can I just speak up for all the people in the area who don't do social media, who don't have smart phones who maybe who don't have any access to the internet, it's not all young and affluent people around here. And loads of us have been staying indoors.  I walk down Railton road frequently (not so often during lockdown) and there are no notices, posters or signs at all, though I saw a bit of Shakespear rd around Mayall road is closed - it looks temp like road works.
> ...


I completely agree. This is the best info I could find: Railton Low Traffic Neighbourhood – emergency changes introduced this weekend, 13th-14th June 2020

There's some related discussion here too: Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists


----------



## teuchter (Jun 19, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> I'm still unclear as to what is actually going to be happening on Railton road?


There will be a few points where the road has a 'gate' that only buses and emergency vehicles can drive through. The result is that people can't use Railton Rd as a route to drive between Herne Hill and Brixton. Doesn't affect you unless you are a driver, other than reducing the amount of traffic. Everyone in the zone will still be able to drive to and from their homes, just by a slightly different route in some cases. That's about it.


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## Gramsci (Jun 19, 2020)

I got this email from the Council yesterday. Looks like a good idea to help social distancing.










						18th June - Update on footway widening to aid social distancing in Lambeth
					

Read the latest project update on Creating safe distances for pedestrians & cyclists in Lambeth.




					lambethtransportcovidresponsemap.commonplace.is
				







We have been reviewing your comments on a weekly basis, and are nearing 800 contributions so far. Milkwood Road has been highlighted by many of you as an area where social distancing is difficult, and has therefore been identified as a priority location. As such, we will be narrowing the carriageway to allow for wider footway space to aid social distancing in this location this weekend. The indicative location of the cones/barriers can be seen in the image below. Once implemented, we will be monitoring these measures on a regular basis to determine if they are effective, so please do let us know if you have any feedback following implementation.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 19, 2020)

The new bits in that map are outside the shops from Dickson’s off licence to the railway passage.


----------



## Not a Vet (Jun 19, 2020)

Unfortunately, that is one of the main roads to LJ now that Shakespeare is a no through road. Wider pavements equal narrower roads equal yet more congestion. So you will be able to socially distance whilst queuing to get in the shops but unfortunately be gassed by the queuing traffic


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Jun 19, 2020)

I'm trying to follow this but get a bit lost.  I cycled past the Dogstar earlier and there was carnage with two P5s trying to pass each other on opposite routes.
Not sure if this was a mistake, if it's even related or if it will happen all the time.


----------



## editor (Jun 27, 2020)

Update Work on Railton Road low traffic neighbourhood starts this weekend between Brixton and Herne Hill, 27th-28th June 2020


----------



## Happy Herne (Jun 28, 2020)

My understanding is that Lambeth Council is looking at Common place and also have plans to consult with residents. As someone who walks around the neighborhood with young children, I welcome a scheme that will make it safer. Some of the drivers are terrifying. Also it was great seeing families out on their bikes during lockdown.


----------



## MissL (Jun 28, 2020)

From what I've seen this weekend there's noticeably more traffic now queuing on Water Lane and down Effra Road - obviously this going to be the case! So come September I can look forward (maybe) to walking my kids to school past more idling traffic, but as long as the Poet's Corner residents get some clean air then stuff anyone else.


----------



## teuchter (Jun 28, 2020)

MissL said:


> From what I've seen this weekend there's noticeably more traffic now queuing on Water Lane and down Effra Road - obviously this going to be the case! So come September I can look forward (maybe) to walking my kids to school past more idling traffic, but as long as the Poet's Corner residents get some clean air then stuff anyone else.


Which school would you be walking them to?


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 3, 2020)

Have we done this yet:



There’s a longer twitter thread that shows them being released and then stopped again in the park. 

Bullying Lumberjack bloke is a regular feature round here...


----------



## nick (Jul 3, 2020)

Disgusting but not surprising.

My sister lived on Atlantic road / Vining St a the time of the original "uprising". I remember her saying that the place was a tinder box because (in part or in main) of police attitude. She said she would not wait at a bus stop on Acre lane as she said that to do so was an invitation to be stopped under Suss law

Look like things have come full circle, or never changed.

I happen to be caucasian and have not had a single uninvited interaction with the police in 30 years of living here. Not statistically significant in itself but....


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 3, 2020)

nick said:


> Disgusting but not surprising.
> 
> My sister lived on Atlantic road / Vining St a the time of the original "uprising". I remember her saying that the place was a tinder box because (in part or in main) of police attitude. She said she would not wait at a bus stop on Acre lane as she said that to do so was an invitation to be stopped under Suss law
> 
> ...




I was living in Brixton in the months running up to the 81 riot.

Im white but was stopped and searched when Operation Swamp was started. Cops everywhere stopping "undesirables".

It needs to be remembered Thatcher divided the country. If you lived in Brixton you were obviously not an upstanding member of society. The enemy within.

The Police sided with Thatcher in the 80s.


----------



## CH1 (Jul 3, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> I was living in Brixton in the months running up to the 81 riot.
> 
> Im white but was stopped and searched when Operation Swamp was started. Cops everywhere stopping "undesirables".
> 
> ...


I was in a group of young white people searched outside the Coach and Horses in Coldharbour Lane  after closing time during the Swamp operation.
The one who had a hardest time was the vulnerable looking one.
That operation was about who rules the streets in my opinion. And bullying, which seems a character trait police officers apparently admire.


----------



## nick (Jul 3, 2020)

CH1 said:


> That operation was about who rules the streets in my opinion. And bullying, which seems a character trait police officers apparently admire.


Which was the overriding impression I got from that phone video up thread


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 3, 2020)

When BLM here supported defunding the police. Spending the money are more useful things like youth centre Starmer came out all bullish about how he supported the police and BLM was a just a "moment."

Looking at the video and its good example why the police need to be defunded.

Bunch of muppets with nothing else better to do than harass someone walking their dog.


----------



## BusLanes (Jul 4, 2020)

Herne Hill was rammed this evening - lots of people out drinking by the station. Looked sort of ok but on the other hand, not that much social distancing


----------



## urbanspaceman (Jul 7, 2020)

Reports on Nextdoor of a shooting (4 shots ?, a death ?) on Brailsford Road this morning. Anybody know anything ?


----------



## editor (Jul 7, 2020)

urbanspaceman said:


> Reports on Nextdoor of a shooting (4 shots ?, a death ?) on Brailsford Road this morning. Anybody know anything ?


Only found this:


----------



## Rushy (Jul 7, 2020)

No one hurt apparently. Bullet holes in car.


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Have we done this yet:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




This incident is covered in this Vice article as well.









						Police Stop and Searches Have Skyrocketed in London During the Pandemic
					

Stop and searches in the UK capital more than doubled in the month of May year-on-year, disproportionately affecting Black people.




					www.vice.com
				




Police say increase in Stop and Search is due to less police needed for emergency calls etc during Pandemic So more police on streets needing something to do.

The police also have more powers during pandemic. Which they are happy to use.

This affects Black people more.

Police say they aren't targeting Black people. Its just that with opportunity to have more officers on the ground they are targeting drugs and violence.


Makes me want to support defunding the police.


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## Nivag (Jul 8, 2020)

Gramsci said:


> Makes me want to support defunding the police


Can you explain what defunding the UK police means to you ?


----------



## Ohmyemily (Jul 8, 2020)

Jimbeau said:


> I forced myself to give this a break for a few days - but now it's time for a new theory....
> 
> It might be Alleyn Park in West Dulwich - down the bottom end where it meets the Paxton Green junction. It's not Herne Hill, but bear with me.
> 
> ...


Apologies for dragging you back to the great Herne Hill war photo mystery, but I had a sort out of old books at the weekend and came across this old book about Dulwich which answers the question. Given the little you had to go on, I'd say your sleuthing was incredibly impressive! 

I've added some photos of the relevant pages, apologies for the quality of them!


----------



## Jimbeau (Jul 8, 2020)

Ohmyemily said:


> Apologies for dragging you back to the great Herne Hill war photo mystery, but I had a sort out of old books at the weekend and came across this old book about Dulwich which answers the question. Given the little you had to go on, I'd say your sleuthing was incredibly impressive!
> 
> I've added some photos of the relevant pages, apologies for the quality of them!


Excellent! What an interesting read. Thanks so much for sharing these.


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2020)

Nivag said:


> Can you explain what defunding the UK police means to you ?



Posted up this on politics boards. On the book the End of Policing

Written before these protests its now topical.

He is saying that policing is recent invention. It was brought in to police the new working class who flocked to towns in early days of industrial revolution, In USA also to police the black slave who worked in towns in the south and to help subjugate colonised people. Both US and UK brought it in.

So from its inception policing was about social control of Black people, people in colonies and the new working class.

This developed over the years but this is it reason for being.

He knows more about the US than here.

In US he argues that policing is where the Neo Liberals and social conservatives found common ground. The Neo Liberals didnt want to blame social ill on the market , the social conservatives believed that individuals were responsible for crime/ anti social behaviour.

This came together in the "Broken Windows" policing ( was imported here). Instead of inequality causing more crime its was low level anti social behaviour that if ignored led to more serious crime. So standing on its head idea that reforms like redistribution of wealth would cut crime ( as people would not need to steal to survive) to individualising it to working class /poor communities need to be controlled more.

He says the claims for success of this strategy dont hold up.

He is critical of liberal reforms of policing. The if only police get better training , get more Black officers and have community meetings.

He says a lot of this was done under Obama and in local States/Cities. It does not work. Having more Black officers makes no difference. They are part of a repressive organisation whose reason for being is social control.

His view iis that the Liberal reformist view of policing does not want to acknowledge the origins and history of this recent invention. Which is social control of the working class and Black people.

So what he says is "defund" the Police. As is being said in Seattle- cut the police budget by half, turn the police station into community centre and invest the money from police budget into the poor communites.

So in summary:

Policing is about social control and repression. That is what it was set up to do

Liberal Reforms make no difference.

The police/ prison budget should be cut and the money put into poor communites.

Beyond that the social ills that cause crime woud start to be dealt with real redistribution of wealth, decent secure housing for all and decent secure work for all.

Plus decriminalising drugs.







						Verso
					

Verso Books is the largest independent, radical publishing house in the English-speaking world.




					www.versobooks.com
				






Interview with the author.

Im half way through the book. One further thing is that policing / prisons and the justice system are very expensive. If social problems could be dealt with before entering the policing system then money would be saved.


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 8, 2020)

Nivag said:


> Can you explain what defunding the UK police means to you ?



The End of Policing book is mainly about the USA.

This Guardian article about UK summarises some of the issues.









						'Defund the police' is not nonsense. Here's what it really means | Adam Elliott-Cooper
					

Expanding the UK’s police and prisons has done little for public safety, says research associate Adam Elliott-Cooper




					www.theguardian.com
				




Another thing about Vitale the American who wrote End of Policing. He also at times talks about the police/ Courts/ prisons together.

Prisons have grown in US as more hardline policies mean more people in jail.

This costs a fortune. End up with what Vitale calls revolving door justice. People go in and out of jail whilst social problems - lack of affodable housing, jobs etc  go unaddressed. If they were then people would be less inclined to turn to low level crime.

This country has gone down the same road. Highest prison population in Europe.

So "Defunding the Police" also covers how the judicial system and prison system operate.

The issues here are similar to some US ones. Lack of youth services which have been cut is a big issue. I see it in LJ. Adventure playground was under threat. Now open on a shoe string with charity grants. The Youth Centre next door hasnt operated as a fully open youth centre for long time. Due to lack of funding.

Vitale in his book points out lot of police work is unnecessary.

This massive increase in stop and search in London. Is it really necessary. I dont think so.

Bottom line is money spent on affordable housing, youth services, non police social services for people with problems would mean police budgets and intrusion on peoples everyday lives could be dramaticallly reduced.


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 9, 2020)

The physical distancing barrier seem to be creeping closer and closer towards the curb every day.

I’m sure that access ramps had more space last week. Anyone know the people to contact to get it moved back out and to make it accessible again?


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## teuchter (Jul 9, 2020)

Not much point having a ramp with no space to turn at the bottom of it. 









						Streets and roads
					

Request a dropped kerb, report a pot hole or hazardous spillage.




					www.lambeth.gov.uk


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 9, 2020)

teuchter said:


> Not much point having a ramp with no space to turn at the bottom of it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ta. Which category does it fit in on that Lambeth site? I can’t see an obvious one.


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## teuchter (Jul 9, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> Ta. Which category does it fit in on that Lambeth site? I can’t see an obvious one.



I think email the streets team here? As per usual lambeth style it is not very clear. But I've had success in the past emailing them. 










						Contact the team
					

Please select the subject you want to contact us about.




					www.lambeth.gov.uk
				




Might be worth copying to your councillors?


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## BusLanes (Jul 9, 2020)

Didn't someone move the barriers end of last week unofficially? Could be the same people, being more cunning


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 9, 2020)

BusLanes said:


> Didn't someone move the barriers end of last week unofficially? Could be the same people, being more cunning



Yes, took them back to the pavement.


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## Mr paulee (Jul 14, 2020)

Brockwell Hall Restoration
					

The lead architectural consultants are working towards an interim report to the Lottery Heritage Fund at the end of July as well as a planning application to Lambeth in the same month. At present t…




					brockwellparkcommunitypartners.org.uk
				




Brockwell Hall Restoration.


----------



## editor (Jul 14, 2020)

Mr paulee said:


> Brockwell Hall Restoration
> 
> 
> The lead architectural consultants are working towards an interim report to the Lottery Heritage Fund at the end of July as well as a planning application to Lambeth in the same month. At present t…
> ...


The consultation site is currently borked.



And, err, what?


> *Consultation *
> Our consultation on the current plans will necessarily be an online at present.


And the 'if possible' bit worries me: 


> To retain cafe use, if possible, within the main house and service wing


----------



## Nivag (Jul 14, 2020)

editor said:


> The consultation site is currently borked.
> 
> View attachment 222255
> 
> ...


I think they don't know the correct URL 




__





						Brockwell Hall | Brockwell Hall Restoration Project
					






					brockwellhallrestoration.org


----------



## T & P (Jul 17, 2020)

Great vibe in the area outside HH station tonight. Felt as good as pre-lockdown times 

Admittedly the good weather was crucial as there’s very limited space inside the venues, but on a warm evening like this it was just great. People sitting about on the pavement or on picnic chairs they’d brought from home, others standing on the road, a lively yet relax and civilised atmosphere... Just what the doctor ordered.


----------



## teuchter (Jul 17, 2020)

T & P said:


> Great vibe in the area outside HH station tonight. Felt as good as pre-lockdown times
> 
> Admittedly the good weather was crucial as there’s very limited space inside the venues, but on a warm evening like this it was just great. People sitting about on the pavement or on picnic chairs they’d brought from home, others standing on the road, a lively yet relax and civilised atmosphere... Just what the doctor ordered.



All thanks to those fascists banning through traffic a few years back


----------



## T & P (Jul 18, 2020)

teuchter said:


> All thanks to those fascists banning through traffic a few years back


Not sure if that was a general observation or directed at me. If the latter I can assure you I couldn’t agree more with the redesign of that stretch of road that resulted in an end w through motor traffic.

I would in fact take it further and restrict any access to a morning slot for van deliveries, and no parking at all allowed other than a 10-minute set down time for those picking up arrivals from the station.


----------



## T & P (Jul 18, 2020)

On the subject of the much improved conditions for pedestrians in that area, this is by no means a whataboutsim post but there might also be an argument for making cyclists dismount and walk their bike at the point where the asphalt ends and the pavement begins if not earlier. It’s bad enough on quiet daytime periods, and even worse during busy pedestrian presence as far too many passing cyclists seem to choose to not to slow down anymore than they can get away with, or simply treat standing peds as a bit of ski slalom-style fun challenge. Completely unenforceable in practice of course.


----------



## Ol Nick (Jul 18, 2020)

MissL said:


> From what I've seen this weekend there's noticeably more traffic now queuing on Water Lane and down Effra Road - obviously this going to be the case! So come September I can look forward (maybe) to walking my kids to school past more idling traffic, but as long as the Poet's Corner residents get some clean air then stuff anyone else.


So blame the traffic.


----------



## Rushy (Jul 18, 2020)

teuchter said:


> All thanks to those fascists banning through traffic a few years back


I don't recall there being all that much objection to what was done in the centre of Herne Hill, particularly after it was done? Could it be that the local public may be more pragmatic or nuanced in their criticisms than "the fascists" you describe give them credit for?

Also, wasn't there quite a bit of pre-consultation, particularly with businesses in order to get them on board (hence, for instance, through traffic is in fact still allowed for large vehicles).


----------



## T & P (Jul 18, 2020)

Rushy said:


> I don't recall there being all that much objection to what was done in the centre of Herne Hill, particularly after it was done? Could it be that the local public may be more pragmatic or nuanced in their criticisms than "the fascists" you describe give them credit for?
> 
> Also, wasn't there quite a bit of pre-consultation, particularly with businesses in order to get them on board (hence, for instance, through traffic is in fact still allowed for large vehicles).


I doubt motor vehicles no longer being allowed to join the junction through the end bit of Railton Rd where the Sunday market now stands would have irked even the most militant of pro-car Clarksonites anyway, as the replacement route doesn’t really take any more time or effort to complete.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 26, 2020)

So the planning permission has been given to install the electricity substation into 315 Railton Road.

315 was the laundrette but is now the smaller custard cream coloured vacant unit (not the bright yellow one).

313 expands at the back to take up the unused space in 315 as they only need the front portion.

315 loses its windows and doors which have to be replaced with security louvred windows and shutters - a blank space.

Crazy that they even managed to refurb all the other 7 units (6 vacant for 3 years, 1 occupied for the last 3? months) without considering they would need electricity.

The planning app says it contravenes 2 Lambeth policies - ED6 and PN6. 

Local objections from HH Soc was that there’s space next to the station (the staff car park / storage bit) or by the half moon. I don’t see why it can’t go in the empty unit under the bridge where all the pigeon shit is - as that will never get leased the way it is now.

HH Soc other objections are the loss of shop front and that the block has flats above it (noise and health related).


----------



## teuchter (Aug 26, 2020)

From what I've seen, it seemed like it could have been feasible to put it in the car park bit by the station. There was a complication here that there's also a plan, possibly, to install a new lift shaft to provide access to the recently refurbed hall above the station, but as I understand it, it should have been possible to accommodate both.

Essentially, it appears that this option was scuppered by the TOC (Southeastern Trains) refusing to co-operate. Could more pressure have been put on them, by Network Rail or Lambeth, to concede this space? Who knows.

The result is that there will be a shopfront that looks like this:



So that Southeastern trains can retain a car parking space.

If Herne Hill folk are annoyed enough about this, I suppose they could try hassling SE trains on twitter


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 26, 2020)

Yeah rising the funds for that lift is going to be a challenge, they’re not cheap and the ongoing maintenance isn’t exactly easy.


----------



## Not a Vet (Aug 30, 2020)

Music video being filmed on Railton tonight. Proper film crew set up


----------



## Mr paulee (Sep 1, 2020)

Not a Vet said:


> Music video being filmed on Railton tonight. Proper film crew set up


Rudimental I believe


----------



## friendofdorothy (Sep 1, 2020)

XR are camping in the park - in the area behind the paddling area. They are attending events in central London everyday atm, so there were just a couple of them there in the park, who I enjoyed meeting.


----------



## Smick (Sep 24, 2020)

I came past Dough bakery today at lunch time and there wasn’t anyone in there, with Dugard and the greengrocers all being busy.

Whatever happened with the Alan Sugar expansion? It didn’t look any different.


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 24, 2020)

They’ve two shops now - another in Beckenham I think. 

The HH one Always seems quite busy whenever I’ve gone past- somewhere in between a traditional bakery and a place that sells vegan energy balls and frappuccino


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 24, 2020)

Also Moses has a new shop - what was the garage to the right of the bookies.

Off the Cuff is looking to expand


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## scmw (Sep 26, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> They’ve two shops now - another in Beckenham I think.
> 
> The HH one Always seems quite busy whenever I’ve gone past- somewhere in between a traditional bakery and a place that sells vegan energy balls and frappuccino


I went to the Herne Hill one for the first time today. Massively underwhelmed especially compared with Blackbird,


----------



## Mr paulee (Nov 21, 2020)

What lockdown ? Fucking idiots.


----------



## Nivag (Nov 21, 2020)

Mr paulee said:


> What lockdown ? Fucking idiots.


Says the poster who's out taking photos of it 😅


----------



## Mr paulee (Nov 21, 2020)

Nivag said:


> Says the poster who's out taking photos of it 😅


I live in Herne Hill.
But thanks for your input.


----------



## Nivag (Nov 21, 2020)

Mr paulee said:


> I live in Herne Hill.
> But thanks for your input.


Well maybe they do too.


----------



## Not a Vet (Nov 21, 2020)

Police are on their way to speak to the retailers and enforce the laws. Could be an expensive pint


----------



## Not a Vet (Nov 21, 2020)

According to Jim Dickson I should add


----------



## Smick (Nov 21, 2020)

I've been out running this week, coming through Herne Hill most evenings and it has been full of people sitting outside and drinking.


----------



## wurlycurly (Nov 21, 2020)

Smick said:


> I've been out running this week, coming through Herne Hill most evenings and it has been full of people sitting outside and drinking.



It's preposterously busy at times. Lots of people who give zero fucks about the elderly.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 21, 2020)

Maybe they’re not mixing with the elderly?


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 21, 2020)

Bumped into a few of my older and isolating neighbours today who weren’t impressed with off the cuff and agile rabbit. They couldn’t get home directly without negotiating the badly managed beer queues.

When Mr paulee posted the photo I was going to say that most people in it were in groups of less than 3, but by 6 pm there were pissed up groups of ten or more stumbling about. 

It’s strange as last night was the quietest I’ve ever heard it around here.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 21, 2020)

Not a Vet said:


> According to Jim Dickson I should add


That could mean pretty much anything then.

According to a particularly irate trader, police were out earlier and did nothing. A reference was made to "that twat in tweed". 😂


----------



## Not a Vet (Nov 21, 2020)

Police were there when I went through a little while ago which seems to have cleared it a bit


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 21, 2020)

And now it’s so empty I can hear a solo skateboarder doing ollies and the betting shop exiles having a quiet chuckle.


----------



## T & P (Nov 21, 2020)

Lockdown 2 has been a joke in terms of compliance. The number of traffic about is the most telling factor. Especially at times of the day when there’s no school run to consider.

There actually are regular traffic jams occurring. Where the fuck is everyone going on a Sunday afternoon? Because sure as fuck most of them aren’t shopping for grocery essentials, or doing anything that’s allowed under the rules.


----------



## madolesance (Nov 21, 2020)

Went for a cycle along the South Bank today and it was the busiest I have ever seen the place. Even in peak summer there would never be that many people.


----------



## wurlycurly (Nov 22, 2020)

Ms T said:


> Maybe they’re not mixing with the elderly?



Are you serious? London is one of the most socially dense cities in the world. A rise in young people contacting Covid inevitably leads to a rise in older people being admitted to hospital. Some of those elderly people will die. That should be obvious to anybody.


----------



## Winot (Nov 22, 2020)

madolesance said:


> Went for a cycle along the South Bank today and it was the busiest I have ever seen the place. Even in peak summer there would never be that many people.



Yeah we’ve been to the South Bank a couple of times and found the same. It makes sense though, right? Socialising outdoors is relatively safe and that is a good place to do it.


----------



## Ms T (Nov 22, 2020)

wurlycurly said:


> Are you serious? London is one of the most socially dense cities in the world. A rise in young people contacting Covid inevitably leads to a rise in older people being admitted to hospital. Some of those elderly people will die. That should be obvious to anybody.



i have no close contact with elderly people atm because my parents live miles away and I am choosing not to visit them and wfh. That’s the case for many people. Socialising outside is low risk which is why we’re allowed to do it. Cases of COVID in Lambeth and Southwark are quite a bit lower than the national average.


----------



## teuchter (Nov 22, 2020)

Winot said:


> Yeah we’ve been to the South Bank a couple of times and found the same. It makes sense though, right? Socialising outdoors is relatively safe and that is a good place to do it.


In theory no one is supposed to be socialising at all at the moment though.

*actually, two people is ok isn't it. But I see groups everwhere.


----------



## prunus (Nov 22, 2020)

teuchter said:


> In theory no one is supposed to be socialising at all at the moment though.
> 
> *actually, two people is ok isn't it. But I see groups everwhere.



Groups are also allowed if they are all from the same household (or two linked households).


----------



## gaijingirl (Nov 22, 2020)

Everywhere outdoors is rammed. I went to Beckenham place park yesterday to walk the dog thinking it's so spacious it'd be less crowded. It was rammed. With short daylight hours and bad weather/rain everyone is getting outside whenever possible.


----------



## editor (Nov 22, 2020)

T & P said:


> Lockdown 2 has been a joke in terms of compliance. The number of traffic about is the most telling factor. Especially at times of the day when there’s no school run to consider.
> 
> There actually are regular traffic jams occurring. Where the fuck is everyone going on a Sunday afternoon? Because sure as fuck most of them aren’t shopping for grocery essentials, or doing anything that’s allowed under the rules.


I was on the tube recently. It was rammed.


----------



## teuchter (Nov 22, 2020)

prunus said:


> Groups are also allowed if they are all from the same household (or two linked households).


That's true... A household or a household plus one person from a single person household. However, when I see a group of 6 or 8 adults I suspect they might not fall into these categories. 
I don't actually feel that a group of people going for a walk together outdoors is a big risk. However, I know that some people do, and feel worried by it, and it seems kind of inconsiderate to be doing it so visibly when we are supposed to be trying to stay in line with some common rules. 
I feel that lots of people have given up on being seen to be doing the right thing now, and it affects my behaviour too.


----------



## Smick (Nov 22, 2020)

I was out for my run earlier and came through Herne Hill. The market is on and, while it is outdoor, it was far more densely packed than you would expect in a pub. Queues everywhere to buy artisan olive bread and organic coffee.


----------



## BusLanes (Nov 22, 2020)

We went for a long walk from the City back to Brixton via St James Park mid week and it felt like the weekend on the streets in terms of traffic/pedestrians but the park was sort of busy.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Nov 23, 2020)

Ms T said:


> Maybe they’re not mixing with the elderly?


Aren't the elderly allowed to go out shopping anymore? don't you expect to see older people going out to work / exercise / shopping anymore?  Herne Hill is not an elderly free zone! 

Well I'm not that old but even I found negotiating around the hoards of people queuing and standing about in HH, made me nervous even on friday afternoon.  I had wanted something from sesame but decided to do with out rather than face people getting too close.  Too many young people without masks.  I found myself zigzagging to avoid people and younger people walking/ running by far to close to me.     I stand out of their way and they charge by without a glance. Must be hell for those who are slow or not steady on their feet.

Going to Brixton market makes me even more anxious.


----------



## wurlycurly (Nov 23, 2020)

Young people hanging around in large groups clearly help the virus to aggressively circulate. It's bizarre that people think doing so is okay because 'they're not mixing with the elderly'.  Look at deaths all over the world. A spike in young people catching Covid is followed several weeks later by a spike in elderly deaths. It's a virus. There are no secrets about its transmission. I was in Herne Hill yesterday and turned back before even reaching the market. It was utterly rammed and I could see very few face masks. Lots of braying young people. Selfish and preposterous.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Nov 23, 2020)

BusLanes said:


> We went for a long walk from the City back to Brixton via St James Park mid week and it felt like the weekend on the streets in terms of traffic/pedestrians but the park was sort of busy.



I done a long walk around central London on Friday and it was dead to be honest, not a soul around Covent Garden, it was actually spooky. Saying that, the weather was shite.


----------



## coldwaterswim (Nov 24, 2020)

Just seen a post on instagram saying all takeaway food stalls are cancelled at herne hill market until further notice. Fruit/veg etc stalls will still open


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Nov 24, 2020)

Thats a shame, i really fancied a £9 wrap this Sunday.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 24, 2020)

coldwaterswim said:


> Just seen a post on instagram saying all takeaway food stalls are cancelled at herne hill market until further notice. Fruit/veg etc stalls will still open


Can't say I'm surprised. Some of the queues must have been 20 people long and police were trying to enforce 2m spacing without being heavy handed.

Any idea whether that applies to the booze "takeaways"?


----------



## coldwaterswim (Nov 24, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Can't say I'm surprised. Some of the queues must have been 20 people long and police were trying to enforce 2m spacing without being heavy handed.
> 
> Any idea whether that applies to the booze "takeaways"?



The post just says ‘take away food stalls’ so I’m guessing booze will still be allowed


----------



## thismoment (Nov 24, 2020)

Which stalls sell booze?


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 24, 2020)

They don’t - agile and OTC do

(And the otc owned green parrot)


----------



## Jay Park (Nov 24, 2020)

Again, I’m afraid. This is a hill that I am not prepared to die on.


----------



## thismoment (Nov 24, 2020)

snowy_again said:


> They don’t - agile and OTC do
> 
> (And the otc owned green parrot)



oh I see, I was thinking that I hadn’t noticed the last time that I was there. Although it was a long time ago


----------



## Johnny Doe (Nov 24, 2020)

Herne Hill? It's not the hill I'd choose to die on


----------



## BusLanes (Nov 24, 2020)

Peabody Hill is closeby, for discerning types


----------



## Ms T (Nov 26, 2020)

It’s the takeaway booze that’s the real issue isn’t it? I feel sorry for the businesses who were just trying to survive.


----------



## Rushy (Nov 26, 2020)

Ms T said:


> It’s the takeaway booze that’s the real issue isn’t it?


Some of the food stalls were creating their own overcrowding with queues snaking in front of other stalls and folk squishing up. Not really anyone's fault other than everyone having the same idea to go out and there not being the space for 2m distancing. If 2m distancing is important then closing the food stalls is probably the only option. Or possibly making masks compulsory in markets and wrapping queues around stalls.

Have to say that some stalls were trying harder than others. But I was really quite put off by food openly on counters right at the front of some stalls with no protection. Especially stuff like bread and cakes which will not be cooked and are eaten straight away. Not even any pretense at an effort. Tested my sympathy for the difficulties of trading during a pandemic.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 28, 2020)

It’s like a full on festival again.

Sea of beige.


----------



## nagapie (Nov 28, 2020)

Rammed when I walked through today. Hardly any masks too. Quite shocked they're getting away with this through mockdown as there was no social distancing at all and clearly not all from the same households. Then again, I'm thinking because everyone is outdoors the risk of transmission probably would be low if they just didn't let so many people gather there.


----------



## Lizzy Mac (Dec 13, 2020)

Large branch off a Hawthorn in Herne Hill Road due to diverted 35 & 345 buses.


----------



## teuchter (Dec 13, 2020)

Lizzy Mac said:


> Large branch off a Hawthorn in Herne Hill Road due to diverted 35 & 345 buses.


I saw that earlier too


----------



## sleaterkinney (Dec 19, 2020)

Herne Hill is busy today


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 19, 2020)

sleaterkinney said:


> Herne Hill is busy today


are people observing mask / distancing rules?

I had been planning on going to the post office monday
 - but I'm worried I'll be too nerveous to go now.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Dec 19, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> are people observing mask / distancing rules?
> 
> I had been planning on going to the post office monday
> - but I'm worried I'll be too nerveous to go now.


It will be better with the move into tier 4 you would hope.


----------



## wurlycurly (Dec 19, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> are people observing mask / distancing rules?
> 
> I had been planning on going to the post office monday
> - but I'm worried I'll be too nerveous to go now.



I was in Herne Hill post office (Costcutter) several times last week. On every occasion it was packed and there were people without masks.  It's a bit quieter between 5.30-7pm, when it's kind of possible to maintain a reasonable distance from the moronic maskless. I really don't understand these people. They're putting everybody at risk, particularly in indoor spaces. Maybe they're conspiracy theorists or something. Or maybe they just don't give a fuck.


----------



## Rushy (Dec 20, 2020)

One of my neighbours was telling me that his doctor has given him a mask exemption letter, not because of any condition but because he has antibodies? His dad is 90s and won't be taking the vaccine (never had an injection in his life, etc..) . Whilst a mate of mine's dad died of Covid last night. 

Market is on today.


----------



## wurlycurly (Dec 20, 2020)

Rushy said:


> One of my neighbours was telling me that his doctor has given him a mask exemption letter, not because of any condition but because he has antibodies? His dad is 90s and won't be taking the vaccine (never had an injection in his life, etc..) . Whilst a mate of mine's dad died of Covid last night.
> 
> Market is on today.



That's quite strange because the length of time antibodies can protect people from the virus has yet to be determined.


----------



## Rushy (Dec 20, 2020)

wurlycurly said:


> That's quite strange because the length of time antibodies can protect people from the virus has yet to be determined.


Yup. Agree. Might be bollocks. Hence the question mark.


----------



## Mr paulee (Dec 29, 2020)

Something going up on football pitches in Brockwell 
Any one ?


----------



## colacubes (Dec 29, 2020)

Mr paulee said:


> Something going up on football pitches in Brockwell
> Any one ?











						New COVID-19 asymptomatic testing site coming to Brockwell Park
					

Last night, Cllr Councillor Jim Dickson announced that Lambeth were installing a COVID-19 asymptomatic testing site in Brockwell Park. We got in touch to ask for more details, and he was kind enoug…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## wurlycurly (Dec 29, 2020)

colacubes said:


> New COVID-19 asymptomatic testing site coming to Brockwell Park
> 
> 
> Last night, Cllr Councillor Jim Dickson announced that Lambeth were installing a COVID-19 asymptomatic testing site in Brockwell Park. We got in touch to ask for more details, and he was kind enoug…
> ...



That will come in handy for the large groups of people congregating in the street outside the train station. There are shitloads of them there today. Almost none of them wearing a mask. It's like a Tier Two Friday night.


----------



## Mr paulee (Dec 29, 2020)

wurlycurly said:


> That will come in handy for the large groups of people congregating in the street outside the train station. There are shitloads of them there today. Almost none of them wearing a mask. It's like a Tier Two Friday night.


Yep, been like that for the past 3 months.


----------



## Rushy (Dec 29, 2020)

wurlycurly said:


> That will come in handy for the large groups of people congregating in the street outside the train station. There are shitloads of them there today. Almost none of them wearing a mask. It's like a Tier Two Friday night.


Any idea how Off the Cuff and Green Parrot are allowed to do this pretty much full time every day and evening?


----------



## wurlycurly (Dec 29, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Any idea how Off the Cuff and Green Parrot are allowed to do this pretty much full time every day and evening?



It was weirdly busy today. Not sure why. Initially I thought it was Hogmanay and I'd lost track of the days.


----------



## wurlycurly (Dec 29, 2020)

Rushy said:


> Any idea how Off the Cuff and Green Parrot are allowed to do this pretty much full time every day and evening?



The crowd has completely disappeared now, replaced by some serious Thames Water action down by Wish. Four Transits and what appeared to be a very hi-tech diagnostics vehicle. I was tempted to sneak close for a look but it wasn't appropriate.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 29, 2020)

Brockwell park was so full of people and we all had to keep to the paths as it was too wet and muddy on the grass,  I had to keep a mask on for my Nordic walking today - too many people coming too close.


----------



## editor (Dec 30, 2020)

friendofdorothy said:


> Brockwell park was so full of people and we all had to keep to the paths as it was too wet and muddy on the grass,  I had to keep a mask on for my Nordic walking today - too many people coming too close.


Last time I was there I got so pissed off with mask-free wanker joggers brushing right past me, huffing and puffing like high powered superspreaders.


----------



## editor (Dec 31, 2020)

Subway photos The Heart of Herne Hill – an outdoor photo exhibition in the station subway


----------



## friendofdorothy (Dec 31, 2020)

I'm looking for a picture of railton road gay squats from the 1970s that was posted here (or one of the Brixton threads) a few months ago - Pic of a welcome banner across the street with lots of people marching by said something like  -Brixton Faeries welcome the Anti Nazi league -  or similar . Can't recall where I saw it now - can anyone else find it?


----------



## wurlycurly (Dec 31, 2020)

It's in Google Images.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 1, 2021)

Thanks there was a diffent photo from the same event - but that is great. Thank you.


----------



## thismoment (Jan 2, 2021)

Rushy said:


> Any idea how Off the Cuff and Green Parrot are allowed to do this pretty much full time every day and evening?


They’re open?


----------



## Smick (Jan 2, 2021)

thismoment said:


> They’re open?


They do takeaways. I can't believe that people pay pub prices to drink beer out of plastic glasses in the cold and on the street, but they do. 

Maybe it's the Belfast in me, but I'd be more inclined to go into the mini market for a can of Red Stripe.


----------



## thismoment (Jan 2, 2021)

Smick said:


> They do takeaways. I can't believe that people pay pub prices to drink beer out of plastic glasses in the cold and on the street, but they do.
> 
> Maybe it's the Belfast in me, but I'd be more inclined to go into the mini market for a can of Red Stripe.



plastic glasses do really irk me! It just doesn’t taste the same, unless it’s a picnic in the sunshine. But then I’d bring my own booze to a picnic. Anyway, I was a bit tempted this afternoon when my household was driving me round the bend again. I’ve found that I need a destination when I’m walking. Didn’t go in the end, too cold and I was worried about crowds


----------



## thismoment (Jan 3, 2021)

Anyone been out and about in Herne Hill this morning? Is it busy?


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Jan 4, 2021)

Smick said:


> They do takeaways. I can't believe that people pay pub prices to drink beer out of plastic glasses in the cold and on the street, but they do.
> 
> Maybe it's the Belfast in me, but I'd be more inclined to go into the mini market for a can of Red Stripe.



I dont really get it either. 

I did buy a few takeaway pints during the first lockdown, but that was because i hadn't had a draft beer in months, and the weather was great so you could go and drink it sitting on the grass somewhere.

This time of year it just seems ridiculous to be standing in the shit weather, spending a fiver or more on a pint. You cant sit anywhere, you are making yourself more cold, and wasting money. Get a can from the shop by all means if you need to get out of the house for a bit granted. 

There's been big crowds of people around the expensive pizza and pint takeaway by Clapham Common tube all through December, standing around drinking pints. It was heartening to see plenty of people with more sense however buying booze from Iceland and Waitrose and drinking that.


----------



## wurlycurly (Jan 10, 2021)

46,000 NHS staff off sick with Covid, hospitals in emergency mode, positive cases soaring, deaths soaring, Tier 4 restrictions banning people from meeting up with other households, some people facing fines for leaving their home twice in one day. A perfect time, then, to hold today's Herne Hill market, when large groups of people can queue up for essentials like posh cakes, beef jerky and swanky French food with rancid-smelling cheese. Many of them maskless. Probably fine, though, because local Cabinet member for health Jim Dickson knows it's "vital to take the right precautions to prevent transmission".


----------



## nagapie (Jan 10, 2021)

Every time I walk through Herne Hill its full of people buying take out coffee and cake or beer and hanging out on the streets with it.


----------



## Gramsci (Jan 10, 2021)

This Tory government has put out mixed messages and its support of working people has been mixed as well.

Is it in the power of Lambeth Council to close the Herne Hill market?


----------



## editor (Jan 11, 2021)

Market article:  Residents voice Covid-19 health concerns about the busy Herne Hill street market


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Jan 11, 2021)

The East Dulwich forum seems to be in meltdown about the street market there. 

To be fair, i dont think these markets should be going ahead at the moment. Whilst you coulda argue some of the produce is essential, lets face it, these markets are mostly for middle class to walk around as a form of leisure, which isnt essential right now.


----------



## teuchter (Jan 11, 2021)

It seems to me that a street market is safer than an indoors supermarket. If people buying stuff at outdoors markets reduces the amount of time they are inside supermarkets, that could be a good thing. Perhaps getting them to put some kind of queuing/numbers-limiting measures in place would be better than banning them altogether. And making sure there's a portion of the street that is kept clear of any market customers and is reserved for people who just want to walk through.


----------



## editor (Jan 11, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> The East Dulwich forum seems to be in meltdown about the street market there.
> 
> To be fair, i dont think these markets should be going ahead at the moment. Whilst you coulda argue some of the produce is essential, lets face it, these markets are mostly for middle class to walk around as a form of leisure, which isnt essential right now.


I think it's more to do with the boozy/social element of the market which encourages people to hang about in groups. The farmers' market in Station Road in Brixton seems perfectly safe to me and it would be a shame if that got closed down as it certainly feels safer than some shops I've been in recently.


----------



## T & P (Jan 11, 2021)

editor said:


> I think it's more to do with the boozy/social element of the market which encourages people to hang about in groups. The farmers' market in Station Road in Brixton seems perfectly safe to me and it would be a shame if that got closed down as it certainly feels safer than some shops I've been in recently.


The area outside Herne Hill station main entrance has become a bit of an outside drinking 'destination' since the pandemic started. Some people don't even bother getting drinks from the local bars (if they happen to be open during the lower lockdown tiers), they bring their own booze, and often folding chairs as well.


----------



## Winot (Jan 12, 2021)

We go to HH market to buy fish. Excellent stall at Railton Rd end. Mrs W went on Sunday and she said the market was deserted.

If we didn’t buy it there we would buy it somewhere indoors.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 12, 2021)

Winot said:


> We go to HH market to buy fish. Excellent stall at Railton Rd end. Mrs W went on Sunday and she said the market was deserted.
> 
> If we didn’t buy it there we would buy it somewhere indoors.


Would it be a disaster to do without some of the finer ingredients for a few weeks? The idea that we should just be able to carry on as normal is what is driving the pandemic. That's not meant to be a pointed criticism. We are all doing these things. But our group resolve is really quite pathetic given what we're faced with. It's right to question what is essential.

I agree that some (many) markets are truly integral to the way communities operate. I love Herne Hill market but it's deffo a luxury and mostly geared to leisure, snacks, treats and takeaways. And the area there has been uncomfortably busy of late - especially with Off the Cuff apres ski (who claim the market carrying on as their excuse for carrying on every day). There was an attempt to manage pedestrians but it lasted one or two Sundays. If it were just a handful of essential produce stalls - like the fishmonger -  I might think differently. But that's not what it is. I think it should be closed.


----------



## Not a Vet (Jan 12, 2021)

Rushy said:


> Would it be a disaster to do without some of the finer ingredients for a few weeks? The idea that we should just be able to carry on as normal is what is driving the pandemic. That's not meant to be a pointed criticism. We are all doing these things. But our group resolve is really quite pathetic given what we're faced with. It's right to question what is essential.
> 
> I agree that some (many) markets are truly integral to the way communities operate. I love Herne Hill market but it's deffo a luxury and mostly geared to leisure, snacks, treats and takeaways. And the area there has been uncomfortably busy of late - especially with Off the Cuff apres ski (who claim the market carrying on as their excuse for carrying on every day). There was an attempt to manage pedestrians but it lasted one or two Sundays. If it were just a handful of essential produce stalls - like the fishmonger -  I might think differently. But that's not what it is. I think it should be closed.


Off the cuff are offering deliveries of 9 pints of draft beer, yours for £50. A mere £5.50 a pint


----------



## Winot (Jan 12, 2021)

Rushy said:


> Would it be a disaster to do without some of the finer ingredients for a few weeks? The idea that we should just be able to carry on as normal is what is driving the pandemic. That's not meant to be a pointed criticism. We are all doing these things. But our group resolve is really quite pathetic given what we're faced with. It's right to question what is essential.
> 
> I agree that some (many) markets are truly integral to the way communities operate. I love Herne Hill market but it's deffo a luxury and mostly geared to leisure, snacks, treats and takeaways. And the area there has been uncomfortably busy of late - especially with Off the Cuff apres ski (who claim the market carrying on as their excuse for carrying on every day). There was an attempt to manage pedestrians but it lasted one or two Sundays. If it were just a handful of essential produce stalls - like the fishmonger -  I might think differently. But that's not what it is. I think it should be closed.



Well we no longer eat meat so buying fish does seem kind of essential. And it means we can avoid supermarkets which are higher risk than the market.


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 12, 2021)

Fish people were from Dorset weren’t they, so can’t be travelling at the moment.

I lolled at OTC claiming on Facebook that they worked closely with the police and the market to manage a socially distanced service - when in reality Herne Hill Forum and other traders complained about their lack of crowd management and asked them to stop trading.


----------



## wurlycurly (Jan 12, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> Fish people were from Dorset weren’t they, so can’t be travelling at the moment.
> 
> I lolled at OTC claiming on Facebook that they worked closely with the police and the market to manage a socially distanced service - when in reality Herne Hill Forum and other traders complained about their lack of crowd management and asked them to stop trading.



The rope idea doesn't work at all. It forces people together and leads to closer interaction with punters stopping to buy things at the stalls. It's pretty much doing precisely the opposite of what it's intending to do.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 12, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> Fish people were from Dorset weren’t they, so can’t be travelling at the moment.
> 
> I lolled at OTC claiming on Facebook that they worked closely with the police and the market to manage a socially distanced service - when in reality Herne Hill Forum and other traders complained about their lack of crowd management and asked them to stop trading.


I heard that he was getting so much shit from other traders that he had to abandon the local traders Whatsapp group.


----------



## Ms T (Jan 13, 2021)

Winot said:


> We go to HH market to buy fish. Excellent stall at Railton Rd end. Mrs W went on Sunday and she said the market was deserted.
> 
> If we didn’t buy it there we would buy it somewhere indoors.



Me too. It wasn’t that busy on Sunday.

Brixton indoor market is much worse atm. The small shops there are full of maskless people.


----------



## editor (Jan 13, 2021)

Ms T said:


> Me too. It wasn’t that busy on Sunday.
> 
> Brixton indoor market is much worse atm. The small shops there are full of maskless people.


Not at the moment. It's pretty much deserted every time I go by.

There's been quite a few comments on the Buzz article from people who have felt uncomfortable by the crowds at the HH market but I guess it's a bit of pot luck if its busy when you get there. I've certainly gone past there when it's looked a bit too busy for my tastes (same applies to the Village). 









						Residents voice Covid-19 health concerns about the busy Herne Hill street market
					

Brixton Buzz has been hearing a growing number of complaints concerning the lack of social distancing at the weekly Herne Hill street market. One resident wrote to us and said:



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## Ms T (Jan 13, 2021)

editor said:


> Not at the moment. It's pretty much deserted every time I go by.
> 
> There's been quite a few comments on the Buzz article from people who have felt uncomfortable by the crowds at the HH market but I guess it's a bit of pot luck if its busy when you get there. I've certainly gone past there when it's looked a bit too busy for my tastes (same applies to the Village).
> 
> ...



Every time I've been through there has been widespread non-compliance.  Last time was Sunday on my way to Brixton Farmer's market.

Crowds in HH much reduced since takeaway booze was stopped.


----------



## Not a Vet (Jan 13, 2021)

Clearly OTC have had little interest in their £5.55 a pint kegs so now they are down to £4.44, £40 for the keg. Offering food and booze bundles too


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 13, 2021)

The market in HH has never been my thing, but I don't object to it happening even now.

The traders have to earn a living too and if people have enough money to spend on artisan, luxury expensive food I don't object.

What I do object to is loads of unmasked people eating and drinking in crowds on the street. Glad to hear takeaway booze has stopped. I don't think 'takeaway' in pint plastic glasses has been allowed for sometime - but they were in the hands of posh looking young drinkers all over the street -and I didn't like shouldering my way through them. I've avoided the whole area for a few weeks now.


----------



## Ms T (Jan 14, 2021)

Takeaway booze was only stopped by law under the national lockdown I think, so a couple of weeks.


----------



## robsean (Jan 14, 2021)

Mighty Hoopla at Brockwell Park – festival announces new date for September 2021
					

After last year’s event was cancelled due to coronavirus concerns, the organisers have announced that the Mighty Hoopla festival will be returning to Brockwell Park on Saturday 4th September …



					www.brixtonbuzz.com
				




Really?


----------



## editor (Jan 15, 2021)

robsean said:


> Mighty Hoopla at Brockwell Park – festival announces new date for September 2021
> 
> 
> After last year’s event was cancelled due to coronavirus concerns, the organisers have announced that the Mighty Hoopla festival will be returning to Brockwell Park on Saturday 4th September …
> ...


I'll be amazed if it happens, but I hope it does.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jan 15, 2021)

editor said:


> I'll be amazed if it happens, but I hope it does.


hope the cider people turn up


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2021)

Frankie in 'erne 'ill!


----------



## editor (Jan 29, 2021)

Let's hope this scumbag gets caught 








						Met Police appeal after dog dragged along road by van in Croxted Road, Lambeth
					

The Met Police are appealing for witnesses following a fail-to-stop collision in Croxted Road, Herne Hill, which left a dog seriously injured.



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## Mr paulee (Feb 8, 2021)

Cold Brockwell


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 8, 2021)

A light dusting of snow this morning on the detention centre / covid testing point


----------



## cuppa tee (Feb 8, 2021)

dog lost......


UPDATE...dog found 👍

Further update....dog missing again....


..


----------



## editor (Feb 8, 2021)

For your upmarket ' artisanal morning essentials' in SE15, SE21, SE22, SE24 & SE27.









						Home
					

In lockdown we started delivering sourdough and pastries to our neighbours. Now we're delivering to thousands of households across South London.




					butterandcrust.com


----------



## BusLanes (Feb 8, 2021)

Hah. Sadly not my post code so I'll have to stick to the toast and normal butter


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 9, 2021)

They’re finally installing the electricity sub station into the shops in Herne Hill. Dividing up two units (313 and 315 I think) to create enough space.

Can’t see the remaining units being rented for a while though.


----------



## wurlycurly (Feb 9, 2021)

editor said:


> For your upmarket ' artisanal morning essentials' in SE15, SE21, SE22, SE24 & SE27.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I could see this working if they expanded into fags, booze, Rizla, Greggs pasties and painkillers.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Feb 9, 2021)

wurlycurly said:


> I could see this working if they expanded into fags, booze, Rizla, Greggs pasties and painkillers.



If a loaf of bread is fiver, then how much for some 'artisanal' rizal?


----------



## editor (Feb 15, 2021)

Blimey


----------



## Rushy (Feb 15, 2021)




----------



## snowy_again (Feb 15, 2021)

They’re building some temporary wooden structure around them now. That’s still a road (and regularly used by the fire service) so can only guess it’s part of the substation works?


----------



## T & P (Feb 15, 2021)

They're going to prove popular with the weekend outdoor partygoers, at any rate...


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 16, 2021)

T & P said:


> They're going to prove popular with the weekend outdoor partygoers, at any rate...



Sadly Jemima and Tarquinius will have to sit somewhere else. Blocks are now behind big chipboard hoardings in front of all of the shops (except Lark).

Blokes with jack hammers are now trying to dig up the concrete floor of unit 313. I’d hate to be one of the tenants living (and I’m guessing working) from home upstairs.


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 16, 2021)

Dreadful photo


----------



## editor (Feb 18, 2021)

I passed this place today and the menu looked interesting. What's the verdict of locals?


----------



## dbs1fan (Feb 18, 2021)

Sesami is run by a Greek Cypriot bloke and so it has a good range of meaty and veggie snacks popular in that community. Lots of very tasty savoury bites, sandwiches and rolls which are more familiar on sale. They do a sweet treat 'tahinopitta' which is gorgeous. Coffee never fails to be delicious....and finally, staff are efficient, friendly and helpful. I love it!


----------



## editor (Feb 18, 2021)

dbs1fan said:


> Sesami is run by a Greek Cypriot bloke and so it has a good range of meaty and veggie snacks popular in that community. Lots of very tasty savoury bites, sandwiches and rolls which are more familiar on sale. They do a sweet treat 'tahinopitta' which is gorgeous. Coffee never fails to be delicious....and finally, staff are efficient, friendly and helpful. I love it!


So they're properly independent? Maybe I'll give them a plug on Buzz. Would it be OK to use your review?


----------



## gaijingirl (Feb 18, 2021)

editor said:


> So they're properly independent? Maybe I'll give them a plug on Buzz. Would it be OK to use your review?



I know the family - absolutely properly independent.  The food is gorgeous.  I often (in normal times) go there for a bowl of fresh hot soup and bread after a swim at the lido (and try to avoid all the gorgeous pastries).


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 18, 2021)

editor said:


> I passed this place today and the menu looked interesting. What's the verdict of locals?
> 
> View attachment 254990


That’s the shortest queue I’ve seen there for a while.


----------



## Mr paulee (Feb 18, 2021)

Sesame are lovely people.


----------



## sparkybird (Feb 18, 2021)

Very friendly, great food and good value, for Herne Hill 😂


----------



## sleaterkinney (Feb 18, 2021)

Good range of deli type groceries as well.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 18, 2021)

sparkybird said:


> good value, for Herne Hill 😂


this!
Also, unpretentious, for Herne Hill.


----------



## zora (Feb 19, 2021)

Was passing through Herne Hill on my walk today and stopped by at Sesami on the strength of the recommendations (it was gaijingirl's mention of the pastries that did it). Had a delicious lunch of spinach and feta swirl followed by coffee and Portuguese custard tart, and a slice of torta della nonna in the fridge for tomorrow. Yummers!


----------



## dbs1fan (Feb 19, 2021)

Please do give them a plug. By all means use my wording.....and I hope you try their fare yourself.


----------



## Nivag (Mar 3, 2021)




----------



## snowy_again (Mar 3, 2021)

friendofdorothy


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 4, 2021)

Jay Rayner might be surprised that he likes whatever replaces it, particularly if it goes more upmarket, like the Prince Regent did (taken from their website).


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 4, 2021)

That’s a strange bit of whatsbouttery. The previous incarnation of the regent was destroyed by the pub co that owned it - they wound down their beer choices, upped the prices they sold to the landlord at and actively pushed him out with a view to sell the pub to a property developer. 

I’m glad it stayed a pub and not some flats.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 4, 2021)

Also someone is refurbing Cafe Prov and Lowie is moving from Dulwich Road to what was the wine shop on half moon lane. 

I guess the original Dulwich road shop will get turned into a flat judging by the landlords previous treatment of the Lowie owners’ shop lease.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 4, 2021)

I’ve just remembered that it was Dulwich estate kicking out the kids’ toy and book shop in 2016 that caused the wine shop to move in (and then close as they couldn’t make run business work with such high rents).

DE will claim that as a charity they have to charge market rates - which is wrong - they can go and ask their regulator, the charity commission to flex those rules - it’s done all the time if the reasons are valid (and a diverse high street would be a reasonable argument).


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 4, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> That’s a strange bit of whatsbouttery. The previous incarnation of the regent was destroyed by the pub co that owned it - they wound down their beer choices, upped the prices they sold to the landlord at and actively pushed him out with a view to sell the pub to a property developer.
> 
> I’m glad it stayed a pub and not some flats.



I see, I didn't know the history of the pub. It just seems that on one had Jay Rayner is crowing in the Guardian about gentrifying his local pub, and on the other lamenting rising rents which is forcing his local corner shop to close. The two are normally interlinked.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 4, 2021)

That quote was from something like 14  years ago wasn’t it? 

He’s campaigned a lot on DE and network rail forcing out long term tenants.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 4, 2021)

I assumed it was from a while ago, i only saw it recently and i thought of it when i saw that tweet. I know in general Rayner does tend to stick up for local independent causes. Maybe i just dont like 'gastro pubs'


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 5, 2021)

DE have backed down, simultaneously saying it was all fake news whilst giving AK Food a new five year lease.


----------



## Ms T (Mar 6, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> That quote was from something like 14  years ago wasn’t it?
> 
> He’s campaigned a lot on DE and network rail forcing out long term tenants.


And for Nour.

I like the Prince Regent in its current incarnation. Decent food but still a proper pub.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 8, 2021)

Several layers of ghost shop signs visible at Cafe Provençal (terrible snatched phone pic)


----------



## teuchter (Mar 8, 2021)

I noticed that on Saturday & took a photo...


----------



## teuchter (Mar 8, 2021)

...and on the left of this 1921 photo



			https://boroughphotos.org/lambeth/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Lambeth01032.jpg


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 8, 2021)

teuchter  A bit more of that frontage on the left has come down now, but that crossing is really narrow and covered in bird shit and network rail run off water that I didn’t want to stop for too long.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 8, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> teuchter  A bit more of that frontage on the left has come down now, but that crossing is really narrow and covered in bird shit and network rail run off water that I didn’t want to stop for too long.


mentioned here too

I also noticed on Saturday that the "social distancing" barriers under the bridge are gone completely now. 

I actually think that it was a little bit of a nonsense that they helped much with social distancing - however I did notice that having got used to that extra layer of separation from the traffic - having it removed again makes the pavements feel quite narrow and precarious as a pedestrian.

The ones under the bridge in LJ are still there. It's a big mess of mud and sandbags and barriers but I continue to appreciate the re-allocation of space and extra separation.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 9, 2021)

Am glad the social distancing barriers are gone, i often get the bus through Herne Hill and sometimes you'd be sat for 10+ minutes queuing down half moon lane, because of the reclaimed road.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 9, 2021)

But you know that most of the road reductions were due to lorries hitting the bridge and network rail repairing it.


----------



## Ol Nick (Mar 9, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> But you know that most of the road reductions were due to lorries hitting the bridge and network rail repairing it.


I’ve always thought it’d be good if they’d take out Caf Prov and use the arch as an extra lane or footpath.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 9, 2021)

Does the MOT place go through that bit though? The one by the half moon not The Chutney side.


----------



## Ol Nick (Mar 9, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> Does the MOT place go through that bit though? The one by the half moon not The Chutney side.


Yeah. They’d have to go too...


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 9, 2021)

That would work! That bridge does divide the two parts of HH shops and food up. I’d forgotten there used to be a signal box above that bit.


----------



## Ol Nick (Mar 9, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> That would work! That bridge does divide the two parts of HH shops and food up. I’d forgotten there used to be a signal box above that bit.


I’m so glad you agree! It’s something I’ve had in the back of my mind since forever, but it was never the right moment to tell the world. 

Obviously it will never happen but at least we know it should


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 9, 2021)

Ol Nick said:


> I’m so glad you agree! It’s something I’ve had in the back of my mind since forever, but it was never the right moment to tell the world.
> 
> Obviously it will never happen but at least we know it should



That arch on the Norwood Road side is big - I’ve been in a couple of times. So you wouldn’t need to get rid of the Cafe Prov site - you’d just come out in the car park by the pub.

MOT place wouldn’t be very happy though and they’re good at what they do.

Also Dulwich Estate will always say no.

Why do I think I heard talk of another arch being opened up on the Milkwood Road side?

Electricity substation works means that they’re digging up most of the semi pedestrianised bit to run the power cables so lots more noise and drilling at the moment.


----------



## T & P (Mar 9, 2021)

teuchter said:


> ...and on the left of this 1921 photo
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's a rather nice looking signal box. Shame it was not preserved.


----------



## Mr paulee (Mar 9, 2021)

New development for Brockwell park. 
Developer’s  man ....


----------



## editor (Mar 9, 2021)

Mr paulee said:


> New development for Brockwell park.
> Developer’s  man ....


Is there a link to some info rather than a download?


----------



## Mr paulee (Mar 9, 2021)

editor said:


> Is there a link to some info rather than a download?


no, it's just one of my own videos.


----------



## editor (Mar 11, 2021)

A small feature




















						Wonderful old ‘ghost signs’ revealed in Herne Hill as the former Café Provencal is refurbished
					

Refurbishment work on the former Café Provencal restaurant in Half Moon Lane, Herne Hill – which closed in May last year – has  resulted in the signs of previous businesses being  tempo…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## Nivag (Mar 11, 2021)

editor said:


> A small feature
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The Roll and Coffee Bar one is great!


----------



## Rushy (Mar 11, 2021)

editor said:


> A small feature
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I hope that someone makes good use of all of those!


----------



## Crispy (Mar 11, 2021)

So what are the works in aid of? I thought the owners of Cafe Prov had called it quits?


----------



## teuchter (Mar 11, 2021)

Crispy said:


> So what are the works in aid of? I thought the owners of Cafe Prov had called it quits?


I think it's going to be a pretentious furniture shop or suchlike.


----------



## gaijingirl (Mar 11, 2021)

Someone somewhere said a Scandinavian furniture store or something - but I'm not sure if they were joking.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 11, 2021)

I’ll take a guess that Moses will take it - he used to have that unit across the junction facing the park - and move his shop from Dulwich Road.


----------



## T & P (Mar 11, 2021)

editor said:


> A small feature
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I like the sight of the two guys inside what used to be the Roll & Coffee Bar. They don't look real; more like a pair of ghosts from the 1980s waiting for their sausage rolls and teas


----------



## T & P (Mar 11, 2021)

gaijingirl said:


> Someone somewhere said a Scandinavian furniture store or something - but I'm not sure if they were joking.


A bit tight for an Ikea in there


----------



## editor (Mar 15, 2021)

From the early 80s


----------



## Rushy (Mar 18, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> I’ll take a guess that Moses will take it - he used to have that unit across the junction facing the park - and move his shop from Dulwich Road.


www.untothislast.co.uk apparently. 

They used to be in an arch in Battersea years back.


----------



## Winot (Mar 18, 2021)

Rushy said:


> www.untothislast.co.uk apparently.
> 
> They used to be in an arch in Battersea years back.



Ooh they are great. We’ve got a lot of their stuff (from Brick Lane). Is there space for a workshop or will it just be retail?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 18, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> friendofdorothy


 you called?



Nivag said:


>


  I love that shop. They always keep some hot lime pickle for me.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 18, 2021)

Winot said:


> Ooh they are great. We’ve got a lot of their stuff (from Brick Lane). Is there space for a workshop or will it just be retail?


I was wondering the same.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 19, 2021)

Winot said:


> Ooh they are great. We’ve got a lot of their stuff (from Brick Lane). Is there space for a workshop or will it just be retail?


According to the whiteboard inside there will be a workshop and machine room.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 19, 2021)

There’s also a new convenience store at the Norwood Road end of the parade - where that fishmongers used to be.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 22, 2021)

We’re being treated to a very loud busking session


----------



## wurlycurly (Mar 22, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> We’re being treated to a very loud busking session



I know! Total lack of self-awareness.


----------



## wurlycurly (Mar 22, 2021)

wurlycurly said:


> Double post.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 30, 2021)

We’ve become drunk party central again


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 31, 2021)

Not sure about Brockwell Park, but the amount of people heading to Clapham Common loaded down with bags of booze yesterday at about 5pm was amusing. some rather interesting interpretations of the rule of 6 too, some groups numbered 30+!


----------



## BusLanes (Mar 31, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> Not sure about Brockwell Park, but the amount of people heading to Clapham Common loaded down with bags of booze yesterday at about 5pm was amusing. some rather interesting interpretations of the rule of 6 too, some groups numbered 30+!



I met someone for the first time in 4 months on Saturday at Clapham and it wasn't too bad, but then the weather wasn't amazing.  Most people were in small groups/pairs, with some exceptions.

Brockwell Park this morning was a bit of a tip, but mainly around the bins.  Didn't seem as bad as some of the photos of other parks across the country on social media this morning


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Mar 31, 2021)

There were bins that were full at 4pm on the common yesterday. There will be a few sore heads this morning.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 31, 2021)

Brockwell Park wasn’t in too bad a state this morning - they have cleaned enough to be mowing the grass.


----------



## editor (Mar 31, 2021)

BusLanes said:


> I met someone for the first time in 4 months on Saturday at Clapham and it wasn't too bad, but then the weather wasn't amazing.  Most people were in small groups/pairs, with some exceptions.
> 
> Brockwell Park this morning was a bit of a tip, but mainly around the bins.  Didn't seem as bad as some of the photos of other parks across the country on social media this morning


I think it's impressive the way people do their best to load their rubbish into the undersized bins: 















						In photos: the delicately balanced booze bottles in Brockwell Park bins
					

With the lockdown rules being relaxed to permit outdoor gatherings of up to six people or two households, the booze returned to Brockwell Park en masse on the weekend. The vast amount of cans and b…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## friendofdorothy (Mar 31, 2021)

needs more recycling bins


----------



## teuchter (Mar 31, 2021)

friendofdorothy said:


> needs more recycling bins


Yes! I always think this in parks...such a large proportion of the stuff you see piled up after busy summer days is easily recyclable.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 1, 2021)

Im hoping they once again install portaloos in Brockwell Park and Clapham Common this summer-it makes sense. Just because the hospitality might be open again in some form doesnt mean they should be public toilets when most people wont even buy a drink.


----------



## Rushy (Apr 1, 2021)

A jazzy wind band just wandered down Railton Road. Uplifting start to the day!


----------



## editor (Apr 7, 2021)

Apols if already posted - I've only just seen this



It was a scam, obvs


----------



## Ryan2468 (Apr 7, 2021)

Super old photo would be the stand out thing for me. Would have been interesting to visit pre-flooding.


----------



## CH1 (Apr 8, 2021)

Apologies if I am repeating old news, but a friend just rang me amazed that the Prince Regent is in full throw of a filming session. I only realised what he was going on about when I checked their website. They are offering themselves as a fully equipped location filming venue Filming at The Prince Regent. 69 Dulwich Road, London SE24 0NJ. 020 7274 1567.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 8, 2021)

Saw that - struck me as an ideal time to be filming inside pubs clubs or restruants that are all empty anyway. Wonder what the film/show is?


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 8, 2021)

Theyve been filming in the East Dulwich Tavern of late too. Rumoured to be a Guinness advert.


----------



## madolesance (Apr 8, 2021)

CH1 said:


> Apologies if I am repeating old news, but a friend just rang me amazed that the Prince Regent is in full throw of a filming session. I only realised what he was going on about when I checked their website. They are offering themselves as a fully equipped location filming venue Filming at The Prince Regent. 69 Dulwich Road, London SE24 0NJ. 020 7274 1567.


The filming thing was happening well before Covid-19/ lockdown. As most pubs don’t open before the evening then it’s an easy way to make some extra cash.


----------



## T & P (Apr 27, 2021)

A friend was sent this, in case any of you good folk of Herne Hill are interested


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 28, 2021)

There should be plenty of folk in Herne Hill willing to show off on TV their £1 million+ houses and new lockdown fitted out expensive kitchens.


----------



## editor (Apr 28, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> There should be plenty of folk in Herne Hill willing to show off on TV their £1 million+ houses and new lockdown fitted out expensive kitchens.


It's not being filmed in people's homes because of Covid.


----------



## T & P (Apr 28, 2021)

editor said:


> It's not being filmed in people's homes because of Covid.


Oh. I missed the line in the flyer about not being filmed at people's homes.

But that's half the fun of that programme, when the guests are allowed to roam free around the host's house, criticising every last bit of furniture, decoration, and even items of clothing they lay their eyes on.


----------



## ash (Apr 28, 2021)

T & P said:


> Oh. I missed the line in the flyer about not being filmed at people's homes.
> 
> But that's half the fun of that programme, when the guests are allowed to roam free around the host's house, criticising every last bit of furniture, decoration, and even items of clothing they lay their eyes on.



Especially when it’s local and you try and work out where they live ☹️


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 28, 2021)

T & P said:


> Oh. I missed the line in the flyer about not being filmed at people's homes.
> 
> But that's half the fun of that programme, when the guests are allowed to roam free around the host's house, criticising every last bit of furniture, decoration, and even items of clothing they lay their eyes on.



Possibly the weirdest bit too- im not exactly the dinner party type, but if i was, im not sure it would be a thing to let people go rummaging through my bedroom, unless they were helping find my lost stash or something similar.


----------



## editor (Apr 28, 2021)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> Possibly the weirdest bit too- im not exactly the dinner party type, but if i was, im not sure it would be a thing to let people go rummaging through my bedroom, unless they were helping find my lost stash or something similar.


It's all set up though, isn't it?


----------



## cuppa tee (Apr 28, 2021)

editor said:


> It's all set up though, isn't it?


....another illusion shattered ☹️


----------



## Not a Vet (Apr 28, 2021)

We should have an urban version. Bunch of people arguing around a table about whether lasagne and chips is proper food or a sign of gentrification


----------



## Nivag (Apr 28, 2021)

Not a Vet said:


> We should have an urban version. Bunch of people arguing around a table about whether lasagne and chips is proper food or a sign of gentrification


What does it mean if it includes salad? #askingforafriend


----------



## BoxRoom (Apr 28, 2021)

Not a Vet said:


> We should have an urban version. Bunch of people arguing around a table about whether lasagne and chips is proper food or a sign of gentrification


The “Will I Die” special.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Apr 29, 2021)

I have an idea for a program which will be based in Herne Hill, and specifically in 'The Half Moon' public house. It would be called "How to go Bankrupt in 10 minutes" and it will simply involve ordering 3 glasses of beer.


----------



## snowy_again (Apr 29, 2021)

What’s going on with the commercial? It’s a Mitchell’s & Butler pub so cant have run out of money


----------



## colacubes (Apr 29, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> What’s going on with the commercial? It’s a Mitchell’s & Butler pub so cant have run out of money


I thought the sign said it was opening on 17th May when I went past last week. My guess is the amount of outdoor space there isn't worth the cost of opening up till they can have punters inside.


----------



## BoxRoom (Apr 30, 2021)

colacubes said:


> I thought the sign said it was opening on 17th May when I went past last week. My guess is the amount of outdoor space there isn't worth the cost of opening up till they can have punters inside.


Aye, got an email from them saying they're open 17th May.


----------



## Cpatain Rbubish (May 9, 2021)

Hello,

Does anyone know if the biltong stall is still at the Herne Hill market? I think it's called Meat Boss.

Anyone?

Cheers,

Rbubish


----------



## technical (May 9, 2021)

Cpatain Rbubish said:


> Hello,
> 
> Does anyone know if the biltong stall is still at the Herne Hill market? I think it's called Meat Boss.
> 
> ...



Not been today but was there last week


----------



## Not a Vet (May 9, 2021)

Sign outside Seasons, should have taken a photo reads Who voted Khan? The night mare continues, unbelievable.


----------



## editor (May 9, 2021)

Not a Vet said:


> Sign outside Seasons, should have taken a photo reads Who voted Khan? The night mare continues, unbelievable.


The good news is that you search for them in Google, the second result is: 






						Overcharging in fruit and veg shop
					

Am I the only person that is consistently being overcharged by the graceless blonde woman in the "Seasons of England" shop? Does she single me out or does it happen to everybody who's been shopping there for years and years?




					www.hernehill.org.uk


----------



## Cpatain Rbubish (May 9, 2021)

technical said:


> Not been today but was there last week



Nice one, thank you technical


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 11, 2021)

Are the oxfam shops open for donations?


----------



## Winot (May 11, 2021)

friendofdorothy said:


> Are the oxfam shops open for donations?



Non-book one is taking one bag per household before 4pm. Not sure about book one.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 13, 2021)

Winot said:


> Non-book one is taking one bag per household before 4pm. Not sure about book one.


Thanks useful to know - they must be swamped with people doing lock down clear outs. Will have to take my clearout of vintage board games down there a few at a time then. 

Dale Wintons Supermarket sweep boardgame anyone? Millenium edition who wants to be a millionaire? kerplunk?


----------



## MissL (May 18, 2021)

Some recognisable places here:


----------



## editor (May 19, 2021)

Sssssssccchhhweet!









						Love Lambeth
					

An investigation by Lambeth Council’s Environmental Health Team found a landlord had committed a breach of the Housing Act 2004 by failing to register as an HMO




					love.lambeth.gov.uk


----------



## DietCokeGirl (May 19, 2021)

editor said:


> Sssssssccchhhweet!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Satisfying. Only a shame they dont get to claim the property, ringfenced as a council let.


----------



## alex_ (May 19, 2021)

DietCokeGirl said:


> Satisfying. Only a shame they dont get to claim the property, ringfenced as a council let.



surely all of the rent are proceeds of crime ?


----------



## Torpid Scorpion (May 19, 2021)

The crime is his tenants are almost certainly out of a house and the landlord remains at large.


----------



## DietCokeGirl (May 20, 2021)

Torpid Scorpion said:


> The crime is his tenants are almost certainly out of a house and the landlord remains at large.


Here's hoping Lambeth gave them some additional priority points eh


----------



## editor (Jun 4, 2021)

Herne Hill news Local Greens – a non-profit veg bag scheme based in Herne Hill – celebrate their tenth anniversary


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 8, 2021)

Peak Herne Hill approaching; I got woken up by a cockerel this morning.


----------



## Ms T (Jun 8, 2021)

Elaine (The Flower Lady) is currently looking after a pet cockatoo found in Brockwell Park. It’s very tame so obviously has escaped from someone’s house.


----------



## snowy_again (Jun 20, 2021)

The works on the railway bridge look like its almost finishing.


----------



## editor (Jul 2, 2021)

Anyone interested? It's a great space









						People wanted to join the board of trustees for Station Hall, Herne Hill
					

Located above Herne Hill railway station, the Station Hall was recently brought back to life by a dedicated team of individuals, groups, charities and enterprises to create a unique community centr…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## thismoment (Jul 2, 2021)

I’ve been looking for a place to host a very small event and I forgot about this place. I’ve emailed them. Thanks for the reminder of the place editor


----------



## snowy_again (Jul 2, 2021)

The hall on effra parade is open again I think


----------



## thismoment (Jul 2, 2021)

I emailed the place editor mentioned straightaway and already have a booking so I am properly made up! 😊


----------



## Gramsci (Jul 15, 2021)




----------



## snowy_again (Aug 1, 2021)

Something going on with the junction under the bridge. 

Temporary traffic lights and they’ve removed the pedestrian island between The Chutney and Pizza GoGo.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 8, 2021)

The road works have got bigger - down to one lane on either direction.

Looks like some work is being done in the glass doored shop in pidgeon shit alley too.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 8, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> The road works have got bigger - down to one lane on either direction.
> 
> Looks like some work is being done in the glass doored shop in pidgeon shit alley too.


Wonder what sort of business would want such a dark gloomy arch? customers would risk being shat on going in or out, certainly  it wouldn't encourage window shoppers.

Can anyone remember that arch being used? I've a vague recollection of a newsagent/tobacco shop open to the street or am I imagining that or thinking of somewhere else? I've lived in SE24 since 94 and dont recall it being in use in that time. In the 90s about half the shops were boarded up.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 11, 2021)

friendofdorothy said:


> Wonder what sort of business would want such a dark gloomy arch? customers would risk being shat on going in or out, certainly  it wouldn't encourage window shoppers.
> 
> Can anyone remember that arch being used? I've a vague recollection of a newsagent/tobacco shop open to the street or am I imagining that or thinking of somewhere else? I've lived in SE24 since 94 and dont recall it being in use in that time. In the 90s about half the shops were boarded up.


I originally thought it was the gas works engineers using that arch as a base - apparently not - Herne Hill is getting its eighth coffee shop.

The new mural is up and one of the refurbed units that’s been empty for years had a viewing yesterday.


----------



## Mr paulee (Aug 11, 2021)




----------



## Rushy (Aug 11, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> I originally thought it was the gas works engineers using that arch as a base - apparently not - Herne Hill is getting its eighth coffee shop.
> 
> The new mural is up and one of the refurbed units that’s been empty for years had a viewing yesterday.


Did anyone else read somewhere (some time ago) that Herne Hill has the highest density of coffee shops per capita in London?


----------



## Torpid Scorpion (Aug 11, 2021)

Rushy said:


> Did anyone else read somewhere (some time ago) that Herne Hill has the highest density of coffee shops per capita in London?



Having once lived in Highbury, I find that hard to believe!

edit: heres the piccy from  an article a few years back




full article: How to know if where you live is “up and coming”: fried chicken vs. coffee shops


----------



## teuchter (Aug 15, 2021)

A petition to extend the TfL hire bikes









						Extend the Santander cycle hire scheme to Herne Hill
					

There are a number of reasons why it’s a great idea to extend the Santander cycle hire scheme to Herne Hill.   1. It meets a transport need   Herne Hill is an area of south London with limited access to the TfL transport network. We do not have a local Underground station (the nearest one is...




					you.38degrees.org.uk
				




They need to get on with extending it into all of south east london!


----------



## Mr paulee (Aug 17, 2021)

I see Perks and Whiite are expanding up onto the actual platform.
Good for them.


----------



## T & P (Aug 17, 2021)

teuchter said:


> A petition to extend the TfL hire bikes
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Considering how they have otherwise  invested heavily in improving the cycling infrastructure across the whole of London, it is astonishing how many areas in even Zone 2, let alone further afield, are still lacking Santander bike stations.


----------



## teuchter (Aug 17, 2021)

I dunno about "heavily". Only in relative terms really.


----------



## snowy_again (Aug 30, 2021)

Did anyone else hear that singing last night?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Aug 30, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> Did anyone else hear that singing last night?


no, what singing?


----------



## Mr paulee (Sep 3, 2021)

This festival in Brockwell today seems to have a very young demographic. 
Younger than you’d expect.


----------



## lang rabbie (Sep 3, 2021)

Mr paulee said:


> This festival in Brockwell today seems to have a very young demographic.
> Younger than you’d expect.


All the 35-45 year olds I know who are there will be very pleased to hear this!


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 28, 2021)

Beyond peak caffeine, Herne Hill is getting its own bubble tea shop (opposite Sainsbury’s). Upside is that it’s owned by a local.


----------



## editor (Sep 29, 2021)

snowy_again said:


> Beyond peak caffeine, Herne Hill is getting its own bubble tea shop (opposite Sainsbury’s). Upside is that it’s owned by a local.


I don't even know what a bubble tea shop is.


----------



## DaphneM (Sep 29, 2021)

editor said:


> I don't even know what a bubble tea shop is.


its a shop that sells bubble tea! 
	

	







						What Is Bubble Tea?
					

Bubble tea is a Taiwanese recipe made by blending tea with milk, fruit and fruit juices, then adding tasty tapioca pearls and shaking vigorously.




					twinings.co.uk


----------



## teuchter (Sep 29, 2021)

Sounds horrendous.

Just putting milk in tea is wrong - never mind all that extra nonsense.


----------



## DaphneM (Sep 29, 2021)

teuchter said:


> Sounds horrendous.
> 
> Just putting milk in tea is wrong - never mind all that extra nonsense.


i know! Tea & tapioca sounds disgusting -  I've heard it described as having the texture of frogspawn


----------



## Winot (Sep 30, 2021)

Huge with Gen Z.


----------



## DaphneM (Sep 30, 2021)

Winot said:


> Huge with Gen Z.


they're welcome to it


----------



## Ms Ordinary (Sep 30, 2021)

It's opposite that block of Student Housing above Tesco's so it's well placed for Gen Z.
(At least I assume its a Student Housing block, I vaguely recall from the planning permission that it was supposed to be)


----------



## Not a Vet (Oct 10, 2021)

The prince regent is shut until 29th October. Filming company has taken possession


----------



## Rushy (Oct 10, 2021)

Not a Vet said:


> The prince regent is shut until 29th October. Filming company has taken possession


Any idea what the production is?


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 10, 2021)

I wondered why it was closed when I went by today - usually it’s busiest time, but saw F’s car there.


----------



## Not a Vet (Oct 11, 2021)

Rushy said:


> Any idea what the production is?


Haven’t a clue but it must be making them more money than operating as a pub which is a bit concerning


----------



## not-bono-ever (Oct 13, 2021)




----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 13, 2021)

Where is that?


----------



## not-bono-ever (Oct 13, 2021)

Beside fish on the hill chip shop


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (Nov 5, 2021)

Join Nextdoor, an app for neighbourhoods where you can get local tips, buy and sell items, and more
					

Many communities throughout the United Kingdom are using Nextdoor to strengthen their neighbourhoods.




					nextdoor.co.uk


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (Nov 5, 2021)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> Join Nextdoor, an app for neighbourhoods where you can get local tips, buy and sell items, and more
> 
> 
> Many communities throughout the United Kingdom are using Nextdoor to strengthen their neighbourhoods.
> ...


He was found safe and sound !!


----------



## JSR (Nov 12, 2021)

Umana Yana roti shop are up for a Time Out award - if you love their food give them a boost and vote for them online, they really deserve it!
Time Out London - Love London Awards 2021 - the South London list


----------



## editor (Nov 19, 2021)

JSR said:


> Umana Yana roti shop are up for a Time Out award - if you love their food give them a boost and vote for them online, they really deserve it!
> Time Out London - Love London Awards 2021 - the South London list


Have you got a link for that?


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 19, 2021)

She had a QR code when I bought a pumpkin, spinach and chickpea roti on Sunday. I had to stop going for patties as I was eating too many.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 19, 2021)

Also every under 15 year old is now strolling around with a bubble tea.


----------



## wtfftw (Nov 19, 2021)

editor said:


> Have you got a link for that?











						Revealed: Time Out London’s 2021 Love Local Awards winners
					

From beloved boozers to favourite cafés, these are the places Londoners love most



					www.timeout.com


----------



## editor (Nov 19, 2021)

wtfftw said:


> Revealed: Time Out London’s 2021 Love Local Awards winners
> 
> 
> From beloved boozers to favourite cafés, these are the places Londoners love most
> ...


I may be being thick here but where can I see the nominations and vote?


----------



## JSR (Nov 19, 2021)

editor said:


> Have you got a link for that?











						Revealed: Time Out London’s 2021 Love Local Awards winners
					

From beloved boozers to favourite cafés, these are the places Londoners love most



					www.timeout.com
				




then you have to go to the South London list


----------



## felonius monk (Nov 19, 2021)

editor said:


> I may be being thick here but where can I see the nominations and vote?


Scroll down and click "next" to get to the outer London nominations. It's not obvious.


----------



## JSR (Nov 19, 2021)

editor said:


> I may be being thick here but where can I see the nominations and vote?


Scroll down and then you have to go through a couple lists of different areas of London to be in the South London list


----------



## cuppa tee (Nov 19, 2021)

...every time I try to vote I end up in a Stacey Dooley spamzone 🤬


----------



## editor (Nov 19, 2021)

felonius monk said:


> Scroll down and click "next" to get to the outer London nominations. It's not obvious.


Ah I see that my adblocker was causing the problem but it is a bloody awful layout!


----------



## Not a Vet (Nov 20, 2021)

Steam train alert, about 5.30 tomorrow night (21st), double headed steam trains passing through Herne Hill (and Brixton)


----------



## teuchter (Nov 20, 2021)

Not a Vet said:


> Steam train alert, about 5.30 tomorrow night (21st), double headed steam trains passing through Herne Hill (and Brixton)


Probably won't be double headed I'm afraid as Tornado has valve problems.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 23, 2021)

The old bookies is being refurbed and there’s another deli moving in to the arches.

There’s also more work on Railton Road - the staff of life food place by Hamilton’s had builders in last week and the never open charity place next to the laundrette appears to be being turned into a bar.


----------



## felonius monk (Nov 25, 2021)

I see that Heritage Dulwich restaurant in Rosendale Road won the Asian Restaurant of the Year for London this year (in the Asian Curry Awards run by the Asian Catering Federation). I haven't been but local friends speak very highly of it.


----------



## nick (Nov 25, 2021)

Been there. I remember it was pretty good:
enthusiastic staff, good presentation
not cheap from memory - 
Tasty - but confess I'd been on the edibles as a pre-load,  so treat my words with caution


----------



## Jimbeau (Nov 26, 2021)

I've been. Can't vouch for the non-veggie side of the menu, but the dishes we had were excellent. It's got a North India bias but has a few Goan and Keralan bits too. Definitely hearty fare of the grills, stews, breads persuasion.
Desserts weren't especially memorable though, and the one cocktail I had was far too sweet for my taste. Staff were lovely. Prices were about the same as the local gastropubs.


----------



## ccamour (Nov 27, 2021)

If anyone's looking for some delicious cocktails this evening in I can highly recommend Herne Hill restaurants Park's Edge Bar & Kitchen Restaurant in Herne Hill, London | Park's Edge Bar and Kitchen Went there last week and the cocktails are made fresh on demand, no syrupy stuff. Seriously some of the best I've had in ages and they have a good mocktail selection too.


----------



## Jimbeau (Nov 27, 2021)

ccamour said:


> If anyone's looking for some delicious cocktails this evening in I can highly recommend Herne Hill restaurants Park's Edge Bar & Kitchen Restaurant in Herne Hill, London | Park's Edge Bar and Kitchen Went there last week and the cocktails are made fresh on demand, no syrupy stuff. Seriously some of the best I've had in ages and they have a good mocktail selection too.


I really love their super-subtle online marketing. And the leaflets they push through my door are full of such genuine testimonials that I can’t believe I’ve held out for so long!


----------



## editor (Dec 21, 2021)

Crowdfunder launched to save local business 








						Crowdfunder launched to save Herne Hill Caribbean Roti Shop blighted by telecommunications equipment
					

A crowdfunding campaign has been set up to save Umana Yama, a small  Guyanese restaurant in Herne Hill, after the restaurant has been hidden from view by a mass of  telecommunication boxes directly…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## ska invita (Dec 21, 2021)

editor said:


> Crowdfunder launched to save local business
> 
> 
> 
> ...


has that place really only been there for 13 years? it feels like much longer...perhaps there was a similiar roti place there before that?

50k for legal fees for a case they could easily lose though .. uffff. sounds like a desperate measure


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 30, 2022)

Any one know what just happened?


----------



## friendofdorothy (Jan 30, 2022)

snowy_again said:


> Any one know what just happened?


what? where?


----------



## snowy_again (Jan 31, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> what? where?


That would have helped. 
830 9 emergency response vehicles, fire engine several plain clothes emergency vehicles, people running from the station. All one by 930


----------



## Rushy (Jan 31, 2022)

Someone hit somewhere by a train. Unhurt, apparently.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Jan 31, 2022)

I guess if you are hit by a train and come out of it unhurt you can count yourself somewhat fortunate.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 26, 2022)

Herne Hill folks might already have heard about this house, which was on sale recently.










						All Properties for sale
					

Browse a list of Properties for sale




					www.hamptons.co.uk
				




10 Dorchester Drive, close to and related to the beleaguered Dorchester Court, an Art Deco style house which still has quite a lot of its original features. Although it's on the "local list" of historically/architecturally significant buildings it doesn't have any formal national listing status.

It's emerged that it was built by the owner of a local building company, with the intention of demolishing it and building something new on the site. Lambeth to their credit have issued a Building Preservation Notice on it, which means that the new owner is not allowed to carry out alterations or demolition under English Heritage have assessed it and decided whether it merits a formal listing. (They shouldnt be demolishing anything without planning permission anyway of course)

It seems the builders are there today cutting down various mature trees in the garden.

The new owner:






						Home
					






					www.tonypestana.co.uk
				




You may have seen their vans around. They do quite a bit of stuff locally.


----------



## teuchter (Feb 28, 2022)

^^  Apparently there is now a skip on site, and the builder may be attempting to strip out the building, which is potentially a criminal act.

editor this might be of interest to brixtonbuzz.

Here is the 20th Century Society press release from the other day






						Rare South London Art Deco house saved from demolition – The Twentieth Century Society
					






					c20society.org.uk


----------



## Mr paulee (Mar 10, 2022)

Bike safety


----------



## urbanspaceman (Mar 11, 2022)

Hernians might be interested to know that the Herne Hill Society commissioned a report on restructuring the traffic flow around the railway bridge near the station. Here are some salient documents:


----------



## teuchter (Mar 11, 2022)

urbanspaceman said:


> Hernians might be interested to know that the Herne Hill Society commissioned a report on restructuring the traffic flow around the railway bridge near the station. Here are some salient documents:



that report is commissioned by the Herne Hill Forum - not the Herne Hill Society. They are different organisations.


----------



## urbanspaceman (Mar 11, 2022)

teuchter said:


> that report is commissioned by the Herne Hill Forum - not the Herne Hill Society. They are different organisations.


Oops - my bad


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 12, 2022)

I love how the Tory prospective councillors claim this has all been secret


----------



## urbanspaceman (Mar 12, 2022)

snowy_again said:


> I love how the Tory prospective councillors claim this has all been secret


Well, I received this leaflet a couple of days ago.  I sent a message to HHF at 2pm yesterday, mentioning discussion on Nextdoor, and they issued the info above at 5pm. Before that, the report had not been in the public domain. So you could say it was secret, or private, or proprietary, according to taste.


----------



## Crispy (Mar 12, 2022)

Interesting proposal, but who's paying for the roadworks? TfL are broke. Lambeth too.


----------



## CH1 (Mar 14, 2022)

urbanspaceman said:


> Hernians might be interested to know that the Herne Hill Society commissioned a report on restructuring the traffic flow around the railway bridge near the station. Here are some salient documents:



This stuff is percolating onto "NextDoor" now - under a distraught message from London about the stalking guy who is in your area.

I searched the Herne Hill Forum website and there is nothing about it there. What is going on?


----------



## Marca (Mar 14, 2022)

re. Herne Hill Forum web-site - it's absent from their list of 'Projects' on the web-site and nothing in the 'News' section.  Only way I can see is to trawl through the Committee minutes which are not especially consistent or self-explanatory.  Unclear to me whether there is any kind of Transport Committee or such-like working on this.

All seems very secretive on the face of it.

Have there been any community engagement meetings on this?


----------



## teuchter (Mar 14, 2022)

Took me about 10 seconds to find this



			CORRECTION - NEW LINKS Starting to reimagine Herne Hill Junction


----------



## editor (Mar 14, 2022)

Marca said:


> re. Herne Hill Forum web-site - it's absent from their list of 'Projects' on the web-site and nothing in the 'News' section.  Only way I can see is to trawl through the Committee minutes which are not especially consistent or self-explanatory.  Unclear to me whether there is any kind of Transport Committee or such-like working on this.
> 
> All seems very secretive on the face of it.
> 
> ...


I've published their proposals here so it's definitely out in the open now!








						Herne Hill Forum publishes proposals for road closures and healthier routes into Herne Hill
					

The Herne Hill Forum team have published their proposals to kickstart a community discussion about how to improve Herne Hill Junction, with a snazzy CGI animation (below) showing the possible chang…



					www.brixtonbuzz.com


----------



## urbanspaceman (Mar 14, 2022)

As far as I can see, the HH Forum was keeping the (quite substantial) work done on this project private or secret or confidential or proprietary - whichever word you prefer.

Then, last week, a couple of Conservative activists circulated a leaflet about it.

I publicised this leaflet on Nextdoor, and some people started commenting.

On Friday, at 2pm, I sent the HHF an email, asking for more info about this work.

At 5pm, HHF issued a message, going public about the project. This may or may not have been a reaction to my earlier email.


----------



## editor (Mar 14, 2022)

urbanspaceman said:


> As far as I can see, the HH Forum was keeping the (quite substantial) work done on this project private or secret or confidential or proprietary - whichever word you prefer.
> 
> Then, last week, a couple of Conservative activists circulated a leaflet about it.
> 
> ...


I can't say I like their new website very much, by the way...


----------



## sparkybird (Mar 14, 2022)

Marca said:


> re. Herne Hill Forum web-site - it's absent from their list of 'Projects' on the web-site and nothing in the 'News' section.  Only way I can see is to trawl through the Committee minutes which are not especially consistent or self-explanatory.  Unclear to me whether there is any kind of Transport Committee or such-like working on this.
> 
> All seems very secretive on the face of it.
> 
> ...


It's also getting attention on other local SM from anti LTN people who are posting it as if it's a done deal. I've tried to point out that it's a suggestion from a local community group and that any one of us could make suggestions, draw a map and put it online. It's not been proposed or adopted by any council. There would need to be a consultation before any changes were made
My opinion isn't very welcome....


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 14, 2022)

urbanspaceman said:


> As far as I can see, the HH Forum was keeping the (quite substantial) work done on this project private or secret or confidential or proprietary - whichever word you prefer.
> 
> Then, last week, a couple of Conservative activists circulated a leaflet about it.
> 
> ...


Do you have any comments on the plans themselves?.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 14, 2022)

My main reaction to what's proposed is that it doesn't really solve the problem of how to get everything under the bridge. There just isn't enough space to get two lanes of traffic, a two way segregated cycle path, and decent footpaths through. What they have shown has some pretty narrow sections of pedestrian footpath. Arguably they are no worse than what's there at them moment, but on those narrow sections pedestrians would be right next to the cycle way and I don't think that would feel comfortable at all. Inevitably pedestrians and cyclists would be straying into each other's territory creating conflicts.

I don't know what the solution is. Ideally you could take the cyclists through the viaduct elsewehere - but there isn't anywhere else.

I think the first step should be to make a decent width footway that people will feel safe on. Then work out how you are going to get bicycles and motor vehicles through. Could it be done with traffic signals, so that motor traffic flows in each direction alternately? I'm sure that would cause outrage. Is there some way that cyclists wait at a light, and are let through alternately with motor vehicles? 

The first impression of what's shown is that cyclists are given too much priority. I'm more than happy for cyclists to be given priority over motor traffic, but the cycle infrastructure shouldn't be allowed to compromise pedestrian comfort and convenience. I don't see that what they propose improves things much for pedestrians.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 14, 2022)

There is about 3.5 lanes of motor traffic at the moment, cutting that down to two would free up space.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 14, 2022)

sleaterkinney said:


> There is about 3.5 lanes of motor traffic at the moment, cutting that down to two would free up space.


Yes, but they are showing it cut down to two, then a two way cycleway inserted. The result is several narrow points on the pavements that I've marked with red arrows below - the ones on the left are about 1.8m wide and on the right 1.4m.

1.8m is barely enough width for two wheelchairs or prams to pass.


----------



## Marca (Mar 14, 2022)

There is no information in the proposal to explain the anticipated consequences of constraining the motor traffic to 2 lanes + closing Milkwood Rd. (at the junction) - except, wrt Milkwood Rd., to recognise (page 15) that "Scheme should be considered as part of a wider LTN".
The fact that they haven't got any traffic volume/congestion data for Herne Hill (the Road) + Norwood Rd. suggests no meaningful analysis has been used to inform the design.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 14, 2022)

Marca said:


> There is no information in the proposal to explain the anticipated consequences of constraining the motor traffic to 2 lanes + closing Milkwood Rd. (at the junction) - except, wrt Milkwood Rd., to recognise (page 15) that "Scheme should be considered as part of a wider LTN".
> The fact that they haven't got any traffic volume/congestion data for Herne Hill (the Road) + Norwood Rd. suggests no meaningful analysis has been used to inform the design.



They aren't pretending that they have. It says pretty clearly:



> At this early stage of design development we have used traffic data and site observations to inform the design process the design has not been subject to traffic modelling. This would be conducted at later stages of project development, subject to the aspiration to do so and funding being available.


----------



## wtfftw (Mar 14, 2022)

Needs a combi cycle bus lane. This is a non Herne hill specific rant tho.


----------



## Marca (Mar 14, 2022)

teuchter said:


> They aren't pretending that they have. It says pretty clearly:


I said pretty clearly that I was commenting on how they had informed the design.

Two-thirds (4 out of 6 major roads) of a full data set has been used to inform the design, since that is all they have and most of that is 'estimated'.  No assumptions have been outlined about how the data has been extrapolated.


----------



## sleaterkinney (Mar 14, 2022)

teuchter said:


> Yes, but they are showing it cut down to two, then a two way cycleway inserted. The result is several narrow points on the pavements that I've marked with red arrows below - the ones on the left are about 1.8m wide and on the right 1.4m.
> 
> 1.8m is barely enough width for two wheelchairs or prams to pass.
> 
> View attachment 314342


If they are pedestrianising Mirkwood rd though that would mean being able to walk down there to use the railway tunnel.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 14, 2022)

sleaterkinney said:


> If they are pedestrianising Mirkwood rd though that would mean being able to walk down there to use the railway tunnel.


A bit of a diversion if you want to get from, say, Half Moon Lane to the park though.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Mar 14, 2022)

I don’t get how the cycle lane rejoins on the south side? If you were going south, same for Dulwich rd.


----------



## Marca (Mar 17, 2022)

About the secrecy there was no intention of communicating this work (dated July 2021) at this stage and it does seem that it was only pressure from activists that achieved its release now.  The Nov. 2021 minutes state: "_The proposals are not to be shared publicly until after the elections next year._"

They had however shared it with elected councillors in both Lambeth and Southwark leaving any other prospective candidates for the May elections at a disadvantage.

If this was a private organisation then such tactics might be all very well but for a public Forum which trumpets community engagement I am not sure this is how to go about things.

It's still not on their web-site


----------



## Crispy (Mar 17, 2022)

DJWrongspeed said:


> I don’t get how the cycle lane rejoins on the south side? If you were going south, same for Dulwich rd.


"Outside of project scope"
Although it makes very good sense to have a two-way cycle lane on the West side of Norwood and Dulwich roads, given the lack of Westbound junctions.


----------



## RubyToogood (Mar 18, 2022)

I don't understand this proposal.

Speaking as someone who goes through HH regularly on a bicycle, the main thing I want to do when I'm going north is to get onto the LTN up Railton Rd. There's a half-baked shared use thing that takes you through the station forecourt, but no very good way to get into it*. This proposal would just stop that and take you up Dulwich Rd, so presumably you'd have to go round the block into RR after that. Which really breaks up the quiet route. And would leave you having to turn right across the traffic.

Speaking as someone who goes through HH regularly on a motorbike, particularly now I can't go through Dulwich Village, I'm very grateful that I'm not being stopped from doing this too as it's basically my through route to anywhere useful.

I should also point out that I don't just go through HH, I am an active user of the area.

*There is also not a very good way to get out of it when going south - there's a light for you, but usually when it's green traffic is backed up and you can't get through it.


----------



## Ryan2468 (Mar 21, 2022)

I agree, I find this a huge problem. Railton Road, yes great and safe and nice to cycle down. Getting to it going north, not that great nor particularly easy.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 21, 2022)

Isn't that exactly what this scheme is trying to solve? The link between norwood road and railton road is effectively via the crossing seen here, so it takes you from a segregated cycleway (at right of image, on what's currently the road slipway) across the main road by a controlled crossing, then at the left of image you can see a kind of crossroads, with a stub arm at its left, which would put you onto that shared space area on railton road.


----------



## RubyToogood (Mar 21, 2022)

teuchter said:


> Isn't that exactly what this scheme is trying to solve? The link between norwood road and railton road is effectively via the crossing seen here, so it takes you from a segregated cycleway (at right of image, on what's currently the road slipway) across the main road by a controlled crossing, then at the left of image you can see a kind of crossroads, with a stub arm at its left, which would put you onto that shared space area on railton road.
> 
> View attachment 315281


That stub arm though takes you up Dulwich Rd, no? Perhaps you can also go straight up Railton via the shared use area.


----------



## teuchter (Mar 21, 2022)

RubyToogood said:


> That stub arm though takes you up Dulwich Rd, no? Perhaps you can also go straight up Railton via the shared use area.


No the little stub arm puts you onto the shared use area -


----------



## pbsmooth (Mar 21, 2022)

Turning up Hurst Street on to Railton when going north is fairly easy...


----------



## thebackrow (Mar 28, 2022)

pbsmooth said:


> Turning up Hurst Street on to Railton when going north is fairly easy...


I dont' know, it's not exactly friendly.  I've had drivers undertake me at speed while I'm waiting to turn before now and theres often a squeeze of bi-directional buses there.  

This proposal puts paid to the 'theres no space' arguments.

I agree that those two squeezed pavement sections aren't good (though narrow pavement beside cycleway is a lot more comfortable than narrow pavement beside motor traffic), but overall it looks like it creates more space for pedestrians around the junction in general.  

Looking at street view I'd put money that the designers have kept the pavement width there exactly the same as it is now under the bridge - ie no disbenefit for pedestrians..


I wonder if it could be made to work with one wide pavement under the bridge rather than a narrow one on either side? What maybe _should_ have happened was for network rail to have created a way through when they redeveloped the shops, rather than having a new unit that opens onto the narrow pavement under the bridge.

The outrage and conspiracy theories about this are a bit rich though.  This seems the very definition of resident led proposals - the councils haven't come up with anything so the local community group - which is long established, is clear about how it is constituted and how you join, and would appear to have an elected committee - has developed a proposal to stimulate discussion about what is possible.  That all the usual suspects are screaming about it tells you all you need to know.

"We all want less traffic and clean air" says the Dulwich conservative leaflet that's doing the rounds, while just like the conservatives in Lambeth, opposing any and every measure that might actually lead to less traffic and clean air.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 31, 2022)

Supposedly getting KenCycles / Boris Bikes / Santander bikes, but not sure whether it’s just a manifesto pledge


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 1, 2022)

snowy_again said:


> Supposedly getting KenCycles / Boris Bikes / Santander bikes, but not sure whether it’s just a manifesto pledge


That would be handy


----------



## BusLanes (Apr 1, 2022)

snowy_again said:


> Supposedly getting KenCycles / Boris Bikes / Santander bikes, but not sure whether it’s just a manifesto pledge



Thought it was a pledge.

Guess they might be worried about the Greens


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 25, 2022)

Any one had any party political types knocking on your door wanting your vote yet?  We have had Greens and Labour round. 

Anyone got a link to the full candidate list?


----------



## CH1 (Apr 26, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> Any one had any party political types knocking on your door wanting your vote yet?  We have had Greens and Labour round.
> 
> Anyone got a link to the full candidate list?


Yours are here https://beta.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/d...nction-ward-persons-nominated-notice-poll.pdf

all borough candidates are here: Election notices


----------



## CH1 (Apr 26, 2022)

CH1 said:


> Yours are here https://beta.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/d...nction-ward-persons-nominated-notice-poll.pdf
> 
> all borough candidates are here: Election notices


On a personal note - if you wanted a viable alternative to one of the Greens, can I put in a word for Rob Blackie one of the Lib Dems. He is (or was) quite manic but impeccably, well, "liberal" as you would see from his Tweets: https://twitter.com/robblackie

The thing that I always admired about him - as an ex party treasurer - was when he was chair of the Vauxhall Lib Dems he always wanted a financial report every month and always checked whether proposed spending was OK. Many political apparatchiks don't give a toss quite frankly.


----------



## teuchter (Apr 26, 2022)

It's a shame that HH & LJ are losing Becca Thackray as a local councillor.


----------



## BusLanes (Apr 26, 2022)

CH1 said:


> On a personal note - if you wanted a viable alternative to one of the Greens, can I put in a word for Rob Blackie one of the Lib Dems. He is (or was) quite manic but impeccably, well, "liberal" as you would see from his Tweets: https://twitter.com/robblackie
> 
> The thing that I always admired about him - as an ex party treasurer - was when he was chair of the Vauxhall Lib Dems he always wanted a financial report every month and always checked whether proposed spending was OK. Many political apparatchiks don't give a toss quite frankly.



I met him when he was working for Best for Britain - seemed like a good guy


----------



## Rushy (Apr 26, 2022)

teuchter said:


> It's a shame that HH & LJ are losing Becca Thackray as a local councillor.


What did you so like about her?


----------



## teuchter (Apr 26, 2022)

Rushy said:


> What did you so like about her?


On occasions where I get in touch with local councillors with questions or requests, she nearly always responds. She is also fairly good at following up on things, and actually organising stuff to happen. She seems to genuinely remember who you are, and quite often is there at "in person" meetings.

Jim Dickson is quite good at most of this too, but perhaps has a different ability to have some influence on what happens because of course Labour are in control of Lambeth whereas the Greens aren't.

On the whole, Becca Thackray doesn't give the impression of appearing at events with the primary interest being in getting a photo op.


----------



## felonius monk (Apr 26, 2022)

teuchter said:


> It's a shame that HH & LJ are losing Becca Thackray as a local councillor.


She is standing in Windrush now.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Apr 26, 2022)

teuchter said:


> On occasions where I get in touch with local councillors with questions or requests, she nearly always responds. She is also fairly good at following up on things, and actually organising stuff to happen. She seems to genuinely remember who you are, and quite often is there at "in person" meetings.
> 
> Jim Dickson is quite good at most of this too, but perhaps has a different ability to have some influence on what happens because of course Labour are in control of Lambeth whereas the Greens aren't.
> 
> On the whole, Becca Thackray doesn't give the impression of appearing at events with the primary interest being in getting a photo op.


I wouldn't trust Jim Dickson as far as I could throw him. He sold off the local primary schools. He seemed to have a complete disregard for the residents of Cresingham. Seems hell bent on spending public money on taking his own constituents to court. I feel there is something very dodgy about him.


----------



## Gramsci (Apr 26, 2022)

teuchter said:


> On occasions where I get in touch with local councillors with questions or requests, she nearly always responds. She is also fairly good at following up on things, and actually organising stuff to happen. She seems to genuinely remember who you are, and quite often is there at "in person" meetings.
> 
> Jim Dickson is quite good at most of this too, but perhaps has a different ability to have some influence on what happens because of course Labour are in control of Lambeth whereas the Greens aren't.
> 
> On the whole, Becca Thackray doesn't give the impression of appearing at events with the primary interest being in getting a photo op.



I was at recent LJ community meeting. Planning came up. I criticised how the planning dept worked and she got up and walked out. No reason given.

I wasn't impressed.

I assumed that Greens were a bit anti establishment. Not in her case.

Looking at her profile on the Lambeth Green website and she was a copper at one point.

Nothing against her personally. But she is strikes me as not like the other Green Cllrs. Who have been good on taking the Lambeth One party state to task. Being a bit bolshy.

She's very much doing it by the book.

Given that I'd prefer her to Donatus as Cllr. Who is typical right wing Labour Cllr. Talks a lot and does nothing. Avoids public meetings.


----------



## Torpid Scorpion (Apr 29, 2022)

Anyone have experience of the choices in the new Myatts Fields ward? 
Annie Gallop and Paul Gadsby labour incumbents.
Dzaier Neil and Sean Walsh green challengers.

There are others but seems only lab and green making an effort.


----------



## scmwalsh (May 4, 2022)

Torpid Scorpion said:


> Anyone have experience of the choices in the new Myatts Fields ward?
> Annie Gallop and Paul Gadsby labour incumbents.
> Dzaier Neil and Sean Walsh green challengers.
> 
> There are others but seems only lab and green making an effort.


Myself and especially Zi would make excellent councillors. Both live in the Ward and are engaged with the community in different ways.


----------



## Torpid Scorpion (May 4, 2022)

scmwalsh said:


> Myself and especially Zi would make excellent councillors. Both live in the Ward and are engaged with the community in different ways.



editor is there any way that the last three posts could be moved to the council elections thread? I mistakenly posted it here, and now Sean from the greens has been kind enough to pop in.

scmwalsh Brave if you to come on here! I respect that.  May I ask you a few questions on behalf of the community Sean, as well as to help me (any maybe others) decide? These are things I have not seen in any of your literature. I do understand the positions the national party espouses.

1- what would concretely change in Lambeth if you and Zi were elected instead of Annie and Paul? Wouldnt a larger-but-still-tiny green opposition just cause progress to dig in on the cabinet system?

2- what would concretely change in the ward if you and Zi were elected instead of annie and paul?

3- I, and others I have spoken to, are confused by the green stance on estate regeneration. The platform seems to support infill development instead of teardowns, but Zi and others have been active on twitter opposing infill development and taking away green space. What's the position? What would you do with regard to Cressingham?

4- How do you feel about the sustainability of local amenities like Myatts Field park, Minet Library, and the grove adventure playground and what concretely would you and Zi do differently (if anything) to put these on a safer and more sustainable footing? The library is under ongoing threat, the park is experiencing creeping privatisation, and the playground seems to be perceived as a land bank by the council. 

5- I am personally suspicious of celebrity candidates and local representatives with aspirations to national politics. I am not alone in this. Zi is a person with a very inspiring story but also with a national role in the green party. What is you and her track record of actual time spent on local issues, and what comfort can you provide that should you and Zi be voted in Myatt's fields will have more effective local representation on issues including housing, amenities, quality of life, policing, fair access to services, etc. than the ward would if we return Annie and Paul?

6- what else do you think we need to know about your candidacy?

I am a left labour voter with a sceptical view of our local brand of Labour, so I believe I am your target audience.


----------



## DietCokeGirl (May 4, 2022)

Torpid Scorpion said:


> Anyone have experience of the choices in the new Myatts Fields ward?
> Annie Gallop and Paul Gadsby labour incumbents.
> Dzaier Neil and Sean Walsh green challengers.
> 
> There are others but seems only lab and green making an effort.


No; did receive a leaflet tbrough the door explaining all about the Green Candidates standing in a completely different ward to mine, which vexed me in terms of the carelessness and waste of paper.


----------



## Mr paulee (May 17, 2022)




----------



## Mr paulee (May 17, 2022)

Seems a Chinook has just landed in Ruskin park?


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## friendofdorothy (May 17, 2022)

Mr paulee said:


> Seems a Chinook has just landed in Ruskin park?


any idea why?


----------



## Mr paulee (May 17, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> any idea why?


No, sorry I don't


----------



## teuchter (May 17, 2022)

Helicopters used to land in ruskin park all the time - it was the official landing place when someone was being brought to kings hospital.
The hospital now has a helipad on the roof which is used instead most of the time, but now and again the park is still used. Maybe because the helipad is temporarily out of use for some reason? Or maybe it has a weight limit and a chinook is too big? I'd be interested to know too.


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## T & P (May 18, 2022)

Chinooks wouldn’t normally be used for medical emergencies, but then again it could of course have been an medical airlift from a military base that had a Chinook stationed there.


----------



## CH1 (May 18, 2022)

A friend suggested going go "The Father" at the Herne Hill Free Film Festival last night. 
The film is one recent offering which I was keen to see, and glad to have the opportunity courtesy HHFFF.
The venue for this film showing was the Baptist Church in Half Moon Lane - a largish space I had last visited during the Anti Brexit campaign about 3 years ago.

"The Father" is about a man suffering dementia who has become dependent on his daughter, who makes the decision to send him to a care home.

Common enough you might think (one of the reason I was interested is I have a friend in a dementia care home - and I'm feeling that way myself sometimes!).

Anthony Hopkins (for it was he) gave a tour de force of dementia and delusion and actually the film was stunning. The audience seemed rapt. You could, apparently, hear a pin drop.

My own particular concession to aging is increasing deafness - which leads me to the downside - for me. There was an introduction to the film by the organiser, and after the film one of the producers was there for Q & A. I couldn't hear any of this, despite them using microphones.

I had warned my friend that I might have problems with the film, and he went and asked whether they were showing subtitles - which they did.

So thanks very much Herne Hill Free Film Festival - I saw this amazing film and appreciated it in full as you turned the subtitles on. Not sure about the hall PA - was that me, or was the volume not turned up enough?

That is the question of my life right now.


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## ChrisSouth (May 18, 2022)

teuchter said:


> Helicopters used to land in ruskin park all the time - it was the official landing place when someone was being brought to kings hospital.
> The hospital now has a helipad on the roof which is used instead most of the time, but now and again the park is still used. Maybe because the helipad is temporarily out of use for some reason? Or maybe it has a weight limit and a chinook is too big? I'd be interested to know too.


Ruskin Park is still used to land air-sea/RAF etc helicopters from time to time. The pad on King's is too small for these massive beasts. Probably not Chinooks, but they are massive machines.


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## Smick (May 21, 2022)

I grew up in Northern Ireland and can recognise the sound of a chinook from anywhere. 

I was coming through Herne Hill yesterday at about 4pm and heard one, although did not get to see it.


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## HHDweller (May 24, 2022)

Anyone know what the works going in the wooded area at the station are? Like watching some of the birds and foxes there when waiting for my trains, wonder if they'll stick around!?


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## CH1 (May 24, 2022)

HHDweller said:


> Anyone know what the works going in the wooded area at the station are? Like watching some of the birds and foxes there when waiting for my trains, wonder if they'll stick around!?


What station? There are notices about track replacement in the Sydenham Tunnel in July.,
Could your "works" be anything to do with this?








						Advance warning of Brixton to Beckenham Junction rail closure in July - ianVisits
					

In late July, the railway between Brixton and Beckenham Junction will be closed for 9-days as Network Rail carry out a major upgrade of the tracks in the Penge railway tunnel.Read more ›



					www.ianvisits.co.uk


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## HHDweller (May 24, 2022)

CH1 said:


> What station? There are notices about track replacement in the Sydenham Tunnel in July.,
> Could your "works" be anything to do with this?
> 
> 
> ...


Herne Hill. Doesn't look to be anything to do with the tracks, seems to be building work starting by the side


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## snowy_again (May 24, 2022)

The north bound bit of platform 1 at Herne Hill. They’re building some sort of platform thing that’s only accessible from by the flats on the chicane of Railton Road


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## snowy_again (May 24, 2022)

I’m also missing the foxes sunning themselves and smirking at commuters.


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## friendofdorothy (May 24, 2022)

Bit annoyed the Half moon Pub is only accepting card payments now.
Seems to discrimate against older people those with sensory/ memory disabilities and those on low incomes, is this actually legal?

My older group who enjoy a monthly gathering there won't be happy.  I'm happy to pay either way but often prefer to pay in cash as easier to budget and not overspend when drunk.


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## DaphneM (May 24, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> Bit annoyed the Half moon Pub is only accepting card payments now.
> Seems to discrimate against older people those with sensory/ memory disabilities and those on low incomes, is this actually legal?
> 
> My older group who enjoy a monthly gathering there won't be happy.  I'm happy to pay either way but often prefer to pay in cash as easier to budget and not overspend when drunk.


You could get an app based card, transfer only the money you want to spend and only take that card out with you maybe?


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## pbsmooth (May 24, 2022)

Loads of places only take cards nowadays to be honest. Sped up by covid.


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## Rushy (May 24, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> Bit annoyed the Half moon Pub is only accepting card payments now.
> Seems to discrimate against older people those with sensory/ memory disabilities and those on low incomes, is this actually legal?
> 
> My older group who enjoy a monthly gathering there won't be happy.  I'm happy to pay either way but often prefer to pay in cash as easier to budget and not overspend when drunk.


You could use something like Monzo card and app which you transfer your budget onto and it won't let you overspend.

Doesn't help your older friends. Mind you, they would have loved the kids rides and stalls at goose green fair on the weekend. Cash only. My son had to make do with the bouncy castle (£5 for 10 minutes 😳 most spent at the top of the slide screaming to be helped down). 

I think the only time I've used cash in the past couple of years is Kahn's as their card machine has been perpetually "broken" for the past twenty.  But I've given up going there as I rarely carry a card these days so can't even use the cash machine. And it's been painted blue inside.


----------



## CH1 (May 24, 2022)

Rushy said:


> I think the only time I've used cash in the past couple of years is Kahn's as their card machine has been perpetually "broken" for the past twenty.  But I've given up going there as I rarely carry a card these days so can't even use the cash machine. And it's been painted blue inside.


Horses for courses. The ONLY time I've used cash in the last two years is to pay the barber.
My favourite barber at 2 Tulse Hill was happy to take the card but now they have closed down rival "Andrew's" top of Brixton Hill ONLY takes cash.
He is also 50% dearer than Haircut Sir - but that may account for Haircut Sir packing it in?


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 24, 2022)

Rushy said:


> You could use something like Monzo card and app which you transfer your budget onto and it won't let you overspend.
> 
> Doesn't help your older friends. Mind you, they would have loved the kids rides and stalls at goose green fair on the weekend. Cash only. My son had to make do with the bouncy castle (£5 for 10 minutes 😳 most spent at the top of the slide screaming to be helped down).
> 
> I think the only time I've used cash in the past couple of years is Kahn's as their card machine has been perpetually "broken" for the past twenty.  But I've given up going there as I rarely carry a card these days so can't even use the cash machine. And it's been painted blue inside


I have plenty of cards thanks - I think you misunderstand the concept of budgeting - with cash you hold in your hand, it's immediate visible how much you have, and friends on benefits will withdraw 'spends' for the day or week and know it has to last. If its on a card and in your head its much harder to keep track and divide it up.
Doesn't help my disabled / older friends.


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 24, 2022)

CH1 said:


> Horses for courses. The ONLY time I've used cash in the last two years is to pay the barber.
> My favourite barber at 2 Tulse Hill was happy to take the card but now they have closed down rival "Andrew's" top of Brixton Hill ONLY takes cash.
> He is also 50% dearer than Haircut Sir - but that may account for Haircut Sir packing it in?


Glad you are ok with card only. I think those with visual impairment might struggle with card only.  I always try to have both card and cash, just in case.


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## CH1 (May 25, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> Glad you are ok with card only. I think those with visual impairment might struggle with card only.  I always try to have both card and cash, just in case.


Contactless is easier than cash - which was I think the point of someone upthread talking about losing control of budgeting.

What worries me about contactless is the fact that it is virtually an invitation to theft. See what Barclays says:
Do I have a daily limit for contactless payments?​There isn't a daily limit for contactless payments. However, from time to time, when you shop using contactless payments, you'll need to put your card into the machine and enter your PIN to verify it's you, before you can use contactless again.

Then again
What should I do if my Barclays Debit card or Barclaycard is lost or stolen?​You'll need to get in touch with us straight away to report the loss. We've included the numbers you'll need to call below:
For your Barclays debit card, please call us on 01928 584 421.
For your Barclaycard, please call us on 0800 151 0900.

Sounds a bundle of laughs!

And of course the actual transaction limit is now £100.
Apparently the new £100 limit was a Budget measure last year.
Cheers Rishi! No doubt worried about your rich mates standing a round at "Champagne and Fromage"!


----------



## Rushy (May 25, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> I have plenty of cards thanks - I think you misunderstand the concept of budgeting - with cash you hold in your hand, it's immediate visible how much you have, and friends on benefits will withdraw 'spends' for the day or week and know it has to last. If its on a card and in your head its much harder to keep track and divide it up.


You said that you use cards but sometime prefer cash _because you can't budget and risk overspending when you are drunk_. The solution which I described is a practical one using card technology which I know you are already familiar with. It keeps you updated on what you have left to spend - without even having to count - and stops you spending more than the limit you allowed yourself when you were sober. It's a solution that incidentally has helped my mildly autistic, alcohol and drug addled adult niece (who I have been trying to teach about budgeting) not to overspend when she has got herself incapacitated on a night out. You certainly have no reason to suspect that the suggestion was intended with anything but goodwill so I invite you to pop your haughty condescension up your bottom.


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## technical (May 25, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> Bit annoyed the Half moon Pub is only accepting card payments now.
> Seems to discrimate against older people those with sensory/ memory disabilities and those on low incomes, is this actually legal?
> 
> My older group who enjoy a monthly gathering there won't be happy.  I'm happy to pay either way but often prefer to pay in cash as easier to budget and not overspend when drunk.


Half Moon is an easy pub to overspend in. It's a great place, but easily the most expensive in the area.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (May 25, 2022)

technical said:


> Half Moon is an easy pub to overspend in. It's a great place, but easily the most expensive in the area.


Certainly is. I think i got charged over £7 for a pint when the rules were table service only- Fullers took the opportunity to decide the law meant they could chuck on a service charge without asking for someone to bring the pint to your table. If i was on a tight budget, i would avoid the place like the plague.


----------



## Rushy (May 25, 2022)

jimbarkanoodle said:


> Certainly is. I think i got charged over £7 for a pint when the rules were table service only- Fullers took the opportunity to decide the law meant they could chuck on a service charge without asking for someone to bring the pint to your table. If i was on a tight budget, i would avoid the place like the plague.


Maybe you misunderstand the concept of budgeting?


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 25, 2022)

technical said:


> Half Moon is an easy pub to overspend in. It's a great place, but easily the most expensive in the area.


Yes - all the pubs are expensive in this area. Depending on what you drink there really isn't much to choose between them. 

We have gone the Moon because its spacious airy, the garden is nice, staff helpful and its near a station and buses.  

We have rejected the Florence (open later than advertised leaving waiting us out in the cold, took them half an hour to tell us no coffee available, didnt take cash, had boxes stored in the accessible loo and charged over £6 for an indifferent pint of keg beer. ) The answer to the card thing then was I ended up paying with my card and people gave me cash. 

We liked sitting out front at the Effra Social when they did table service there last year - but the steps to loos were a bit much for those with heart/ mobility issues.


----------



## sleaterkinney (May 25, 2022)

If you are on a budget the Fox is probably the cheapest one localish.


----------



## Gramsci (May 25, 2022)

Couple of articles I've read by Brett Scott on the "cashless society"


Cash, Kisses and Karaoke: Why the War on Covid must not become a War on Cash









						The war on cash
					

Banks, governments and fintech evangelists all hail a 'cashless future' as both inevitable and good. But this isn't a frictionless utopia; it means that banks mediate our lives to an ever-greater extent.




					www.opendemocracy.net
				




As has been posted Covid has been used to go to cashless. Even though cash isn't a high risk.

The move to cashless pre dated Covid. Covid is the latest justification.

Far from being progress this is about big business like Visa wanting ever more hold on payments. This isn't about convenience for the little people. Or those who don't necessarily want every transaction they make recorded.

Anyone who wants to pay cash in a pub should imo be entitled to do so. Without having to justify it.

It should be a choice.

One of the things Brett Scott points out is peoples choices are gradually being constrained. Removal of cash machines for example. Along with companies like Visa promoting cashless society as progress. Leaving those who aren't so keen being treated as behind the times dinosaurs.

Cash works. Its as Scott points out a relationship between you and who you are buying from. Without an intermediary.


----------



## oryx (May 25, 2022)

Gramsci said:


> Couple of articles I've read by Brett Scott on the "cashless society"
> 
> 
> Cash, Kisses and Karaoke: Why the War on Covid must not become a War on Cash
> ...


That's a very interesting and thought-provoking article.


----------



## teuchter (May 26, 2022)

I hardly ever carry cash with me now, because using a contactless card is simply less faff, and I don't have to carry an assortment of bits of metal and paper in my pockets all the time.

At a purely functional / convenience level, for me getting rid of cash is pretty much entirely a positive thing. However - it does bother me a bit that the ability to pay for something without the transaction being recorded may end up being removed. There are lots of good reasons people might want the ability to pay for something they need, without it being recorded.


----------



## DaphneM (May 26, 2022)

not carry cash saves me money because i don't lose it.


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## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2022)

sleaterkinney said:


> If you are on a budget the Fox is probably the cheapest one localish.


But unfortunately not so good for transport for my group.


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## friendofdorothy (May 26, 2022)

Gramsci said:


> Couple of articles I've read by Brett Scott on the "cashless society"
> 
> 
> Cash, Kisses and Karaoke: Why the War on Covid must not become a War on Cash
> ...


It's a big problem for people with sight impairment and other disabilities, which is why I was wondering if refusing cash payments might be illegal under the equalities act? Haven't read the article yet.


----------



## DaphneM (May 27, 2022)

Gramsci said:


> Couple of articles I've read by Brett Scott on the "cashless society"
> 
> 
> Cash, Kisses and Karaoke: Why the War on Covid must not become a War on Cash
> ...


cash is clearly mediated by the banks though so he's talking crap.

If you wanted a relationship between buyer x and seller y without an intermediary you would be bartering


----------



## Gramsci (May 27, 2022)

DaphneM said:


> cash is clearly mediated by the banks though so he's talking crap.
> 
> If you wanted a relationship between buyer x and seller y without an intermediary you would be bartering



Have you read the articles?

Once you've taken it out of the cash machine it is no longer in the system as such  Why Visa for example are pushing for cashless spending.

The general thrust of his articles is to defend the freedom to have a choice of using cash or a card. Do you agree with that freedom of choice?


----------



## DaphneM (May 27, 2022)

Gramsci said:


> Have you read the articles?
> 
> Once you've taken it out of the cash machine it is no longer in the system as such  Why Visa for example are pushing for cashless spending.
> 
> The general thrust of his articles is to defend the freedom to have a choice of using cash or a card. Do you agree with that freedom of choice?


once you have taken it out of the cash machine is it still affected by inflation, it is mediated by fiscal policy

i dont think you can frame this as some kind of grand  freedom of  choice argument.

Its more a there two modes of payment and one mode of payment is rapidly becoming obsolete situation.


----------



## pbsmooth (May 27, 2022)

agree, but I can make and spend a load of money with no trace using cash. harder using cards.


----------



## Gramsci (May 27, 2022)

DaphneM said:


> once you have taken it out of the cash machine is it still affected by inflation, it is mediated by fiscal policy
> 
> i dont think you can frame this as some kind of grand  freedom of  choice argument.
> 
> Its more a there two modes of payment and one mode of payment is rapidly becoming obsolete situation.



Expected this kind of answer from you.

For a poster who is quite opinionated it's awfully hard to get a straight answer about where you're coming from.

Cash isn't becoming obsolete as some kind of natural progression. Which is whole point of Brett articles.

So my question still stands.


----------



## DaphneM (May 27, 2022)

Gramsci said:


> Expected this kind of answer from you.
> 
> For a poster who is quite opinionated it's awfully hard to get a straight answer about where you're coming from.
> 
> ...


I skimmed it, he’s wrong


----------



## Gramsci (May 27, 2022)

DaphneM said:


> I skimmed it, he’s wrong


"Skimmed" that is you haven't read it.

So I take that as a no people shouldn't have a choice.


----------



## DietCokeGirl (May 28, 2022)

pbsmooth said:


> agree, but I can make and spend a load of money with no trace using cash. harder using cards.


Until you try buying a house, or a car, in cash....


----------



## friendofdorothy (May 29, 2022)

DietCokeGirl said:


> Until you try buying a house, or a car, in cash....


It used to be possible to do either not that long ago.


----------



## Tron Cruise (May 29, 2022)

i wish I’d skimmed this thread.


----------



## CH1 (May 29, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> It used to be possible to do either not that long ago.


I bet it still was if you were an oligarch right up till the Ukraine invasion. 
I'm sure a "tame" QC would have certified your cash was not money laundered and maybe thrown in a seat in the House of Lords as a bonus!


----------



## Gramsci (May 29, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> It's a big problem for people with sight impairment and other disabilities, which is why I was wondering if refusing cash payments might be illegal under the equalities act? Haven't read the article yet.



Refusing cash isn't illegal. Shops do need to take into account disabled people. So it depends. If the card payment machine is situated in such a way that the disabled person can't access it then there is an issue.

Which have been doing a lot to support cash payment. Also access to cash machines.This article has a reporting tool at end. As Which are assembling evidence of people turned away by refusing to take cash.









						One in three people have had cash payments refused during the pandemic - Which? News
					

Blanket bans on cash by retailers risk excluding the most vulnerable in society




					www.which.co.uk
				




Which article points out going to cashless will adversely affect the most vulnerable in society.

Reasons for using cash, for example, are making it easier to budget. Another example I read was a housebound lady who had carers. She felt more comfortable giving them cash to go out shopping. Rather than her card.

Which position is that people should have right to use cash if they wish.

Myself I avoid to many DD. So pay most of my larger bills ( rent , electricity, Council tax) at Paypoint/ Payzone in cash. As this makes it easier for me to budget.

I notice a lot of people in my local shop in LJ top up gas or electricity using cash. This is necessary use of cash.

I have been refused cash payment once. It was somewhat embarrassing. What I don't like about this is being made to feel a bit odd if you want to pay cash.

I want the  choice of cash or card to stay

I think this is entirely reasonable position. And shouldn't be dismissed as being against so called inevitable progress.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 13, 2022)

10 dorchester drive has been listed





(and frankly  at some of the interior)


----------



## madolesance (Jun 13, 2022)

Puddy_Tat said:


> 10 dorchester drive has been listed
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Now they have to get Dorchester Court listed. It's just as interesting.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Jun 13, 2022)

madolesance said:


> Now they have to get Dorchester Court listed. It's just as interesting.



that's the one the owners are letting fall apart, isn't it?


----------



## technical (Jun 14, 2022)

madolesance said:


> Now they have to get Dorchester Court listed. It's just as interesting.


Dorchester Ct was listed Grade II in 2004: DORCHESTER COURT, Non Civil Parish - 1390780 | Historic England


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2022)

Does anyone recognise this location as being in Herne Hill? I can't say it's familiar to me.


----------



## CH1 (Jun 22, 2022)

editor is this the same thing? https://londonnewsonline.co.uk/clim...yres-of-40-suvs-in-rich-london-neighbourhood/

To save reading the article "They targeted Court Lane, Court Lane Gardens, Druce Road, Eynella Road, Woowarde Road, Dovercourt Road and Eastlands Crescent."


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2022)

CH1 said:


> editor is this the same thing? Climate activists let down tyres of 40 SUVs in ‘rich London neighbourhood’
> 
> To save reading the article "They targeted Court Lane, Court Lane Gardens, Druce Road, Eynella Road, Woowarde Road, Dovercourt Road and Eastlands Crescent."


It also happened in Herne Hill and some bloke is insisting that the photo was taken there but it doesn't look familiar to me.


----------



## Rushy (Jun 22, 2022)

I love the photo reportage. Looks rather like Dear Deidre.


----------



## Crispy (Jun 22, 2022)

That style of architecture is very common in Bristol, which has lots of local stone like that (with a bit of imported Bath stone for trim). None round here that I know of, what with London being sat on clay and nearly everything being made of brick as a result.


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2022)

Crispy said:


> That style of architecture is very common in Bristol, which has lots of local stone like that (with a bit of imported Bath stone for trim). None round here that I know of, what with London being sat on clay and nearly everything being made of brick as a result.


Yeah that's what I figured. The guy is clearly bullshitting.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Jun 22, 2022)

I thought that looked like Bristol too, particularly the area around Ashley Downs.


----------



## alex_ (Jun 22, 2022)

editor said:


> It also happened in Herne Hill and some bloke is insisting that the photo was taken there but it doesn't look familiar to me.




Also - it’s not an SUV.


----------



## Not a Vet (Jun 22, 2022)

Ruskin walk according to Nextdoor


----------



## editor (Jun 22, 2022)

Not a Vet said:


> Ruskin walk according to Nextdoor


Looks nothing like that pic, though...


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jul 9, 2022)

I can hear some live music coming from somewhere between herne hill and the dog on the hill?


----------



## HerneHillBilly (Jul 9, 2022)

Dorchester Court, annual party


----------



## editor (Jul 29, 2022)

Oh yes Guerrilla anti-Shell adverts appearing in Herne Hill and across London


----------



## Ryan2468 (Aug 2, 2022)

There's this guy who runs the Museum of Neoliberalism in Eltham that does a lot of this kind of stuff, including s(Hell) parodies. Here's his site.


----------



## Puddy_Tat (Aug 2, 2022)

Ryan2468 said:


> There's this guy who runs the Museum of Neoliberalism in Eltham that does a lot of this kind of stuff, including s(Hell) parodies. Here's his site.



to be pedantic, it's at lee green, not eltham

i must try and get round to visiting some time i'm in that direction visiting mum-tat (it's either been closed or i've had too much stuff to do the last few times)

did see this on a bus shelter at lee green a few months ago - may or may not be connected


----------



## Ms T (Aug 8, 2022)

The word on the Hill is that BoJo and Carrie are looking for a house in Herne Hill!


----------



## nagapie (Aug 8, 2022)

Ms T said:


> The word on the Hill is that BoJo and Carrie are looking for a house in Herne Hill!


I know HH is quite salubrious but surely they'd rather live away from the masses, I don't get it or thier house in Camberwell? Are they just flipping houses.


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Aug 9, 2022)

I read an article about them selling their £1.6million house in Camberwell, where they had declared they had a rental income of £10,000 per annum on it, which is about £833 a month.

Considering that doesnt get you much more than a room in a shared house in the area, i suppose despite what everyone thinks about The Johnsons, they do seem to be awfully benevolent landlords.


----------



## felonius monk (Aug 9, 2022)

nagapie said:


> I know HH is quite salubrious but surely they'd rather live away from the masses, I don't get it or thier house in Camberwell? Are they just flipping houses.


Closer to nursery schools in Dulwich without paying Dulwich prices (BoJo not yet making silly money for speeches and newspaper columns)?


----------



## Gramsci (Aug 9, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> Bit annoyed the Half moon Pub is only accepting card payments now.
> Seems to discrimate against older people those with sensory/ memory disabilities and those on low incomes, is this actually legal?
> 
> My older group who enjoy a monthly gathering there won't be happy.  I'm happy to pay either way but often prefer to pay in cash as easier to budget and not overspend when drunk.



Saw this today









						Cash makes comeback as cost of living crisis bites, says Post Office
					

Branches handled record £801m in personal cash withdrawals in July as people struggle to manage spending




					www.theguardian.com
				




Makes sense as the cost of living is getting higher and higher




> The organisation said it was “seeing more and more people increasingly reliant on cash as the tried and tested way to manage a budget”.


----------



## cuppa tee (Sep 3, 2022)

to herne hill famers market regulars...
i am told the kentish cyder man ( maker of hard core 7%er)' operates there on sundays ? has anyone seen him lately ?
...asking because he used to come down to oval on saturday but has not been seen for quite a few weeks
i am missing the scrumpy, but also a bit concerned for his wellbeing


----------



## cuppa tee (Sep 5, 2022)

incomers...









						Boris Johnson heads to leafy anti-Brexit suburbia to fill his coffers - and plot his return
					

The Johnsons are heading to Herne Hill - much to the disquiet of some of its residents. But will he really be settling down to a quiet life on the sourdough run? i takes a look at his possible future plans...




					inews.co.uk


----------



## editor (Sep 5, 2022)

cuppa tee said:


> incomers...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Stradella Road,  apparently.

It's going to be a real pain for the neighbours.


----------



## pbsmooth (Sep 5, 2022)

lovely road. though maybe a bit close to the train line... good to think of a negative.


----------



## friendofdorothy (Sep 5, 2022)

cuppa tee said:


> incomers...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's annoying. Do you think it likely he will use the local park, pubs, shops and market?   Hope he won't get a welcome here.

Must think of some insults to have ready should I ever bump into him. Hard to know where to start.


----------



## Winot (Sep 5, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> That's annoying. Do you think it likely he will use the local park, pubs, shops and market?   Hope he won't get a welcome here.
> 
> Must think of some insults to have ready should I ever bump into him. Hard to know where to start.


Trip him up as he jogs round the park.


----------



## alex_ (Sep 5, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> That's annoying. Do you think it likely he will use the local park, pubs, shops and market?   Hope he won't get a welcome here.
> 
> Must think of some insults to have ready should I ever bump into him. Hard to know where to start.



I suspect there are a couple you can keep on the tip of your tongue.


----------



## Mr paulee (Sep 5, 2022)

Be rough for him for a while, then people will just ignore him.


----------



## alex_ (Sep 5, 2022)

Mr paulee said:


> Be rough for him for a while, then people will just ignore him.



Suspect that’ll be worse for him


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 13, 2022)

Winot said:


> Trip him up as he jogs round the park.


Congratulations, this has been quoted in an article in the spectator entitled Herne hell, a anti Boris article written by an ex and if I may say so, probably the poshest person in Herne hill until she upped sticks to Norfolk, Flora Watkins


----------



## Skim (Sep 13, 2022)

Not a Vet said:


> Congratulations, this has been quoted in an article in the spectator entitled Herne hell, a anti Boris article written by an ex and if I may say so, probably the poshest person in Herne hill until she upped sticks to Norfolk, Flora Watkins


Quoted: a mug reading “Herne Hill, the posh bit of Brixton.” 😂 Makes no more sense than a mug reading “Dulwich: the posh bit of Sydenham.”


----------



## pbsmooth (Sep 13, 2022)

Not a Vet said:


> Congratulations, this has been quoted in an article in the spectator entitled Herne hell, a anti Boris article written by an ex and if I may say so, probably the poshest person in Herne hill until she upped sticks to Norfolk, Flora Watkins


I read that. Then looked up the author on social. Strange mix of slagging off Tories and crying over Queen death.


----------



## steveseagull (Sep 15, 2022)

Winot said:


> Trip him up as he jogs round the park.



Boom









						Welcome to Herne Hell, Boris
					

When I lived in north London as a postgraduate student, my flatmates amused themselves by shouting abusive names at the then member for Henley as he cycled past on his way to the Commons from his house in Islington. But judging by the reaction from my old neighbours in Herne Hill, Boris Johnson...




					www.spectator.co.uk


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Sep 15, 2022)

steveseagull said:


> Boom
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well written, humorous article.


----------



## Rushy (Sep 15, 2022)

Not a Vet said:


> Congratulations, this has been quoted in an article in the spectator entitled Herne hell, a anti Boris article written by an ex and if I may say so, probably the poshest person in Herne hill until she upped sticks to Norfolk, Flora Watkins


Do you mean ex Herne Hillian or ex of Boris'? Or of yours?!


----------



## Rushy (Sep 15, 2022)

> hunting correspondent and news editor for Horse & Hound


----------



## teuchter (Sep 15, 2022)

I would have put more effort into contributing something quotable / spreading misinformation on this thread had I known it might be used in a Spectator article.


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 15, 2022)

Rushy said:


> Do you mean ex Herne Hillian or ex of Boris'? Or of yours?!


She used to live on Shakespeare, opposite the well known food critic, who doesn’t get a mention for some reason. She was a familiar sight, old discovery, 2 basset hounds, normally dressed like she was off to a pheasant shoot. Kids went to the same school ours do. Sold up, moved to Norfolk which must be more brexity than Herne hill


----------



## editor (Sep 15, 2022)

> Before Downing Street, the Johnsons lived in a flat in neighbouring Camberwell. Now, with two-year-old Wilf and eight-month-old Romy in tow (plus Dilyn the dog), perhaps it’s the undulating 126 acres of Brockwell Park that drew them to Herne Hill. But wait – ‘Trip him up as he jogs around the park’ urges a commentator on the Brixton-based Urban75 forum.



*proud


----------



## Winot (Sep 15, 2022)

steveseagull said:


> Boom
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good on The Spectator for getting the word out.


----------



## cuppa tee (Sep 15, 2022)

Winot said:


> Good on The Spectator for getting the word out.



they must have seen my post from about 10 days ago on this very thread 😬


----------



## BusLanes (Sep 16, 2022)

That article could have been a lot more snarky but I guess she does sort of still like the area or people despite her characterisation.

Still, good to see a reader of the forum get published in a printed magazine.


----------



## gaijingirl (Sep 16, 2022)

Someone I know who lives on Stradella Road said it's nonsense and was made up by someone who had just moved onto the street and they're all very bemused by it.  I don't know if he's making this bit of gossip up though.  The plot thickens.


----------



## editor (Sep 16, 2022)

gaijingirl said:


> Someone I know who lives on Stradella Road said it's nonsense and was made up by someone who had just moved onto the street and they're all very bemused by it.  I don't know if he's making this bit of gossip up though.  The plot thickens.


Could be a _double bluff _


----------



## Skim (Sep 16, 2022)

Boris and Carrie: not _quite_ rich enough to afford a place in Dulwich Village.


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 21, 2022)

Half moon dentist no longer taking any nhs patients. Three options, pay a regular amount, starts at £16 for adults, £9 for each child. That’s monthly. Option 2 pay as you go. Option 3 leave and find a new nhs dentist


----------



## pbsmooth (Sep 21, 2022)

but can you actually get an appointment? I would consider that if it was on offer near me - impossible to get a doctor appointment.


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 21, 2022)

pbsmooth said:


> but can you actually get an appointment? I would consider that if it was on offer near me - impossible to get a doctor appointment.


So on the letter I got, it says all nhs appointments are fully booked till 30th November (which I find hard to believe) and then it’s private only from 1st Dec. I think if it’s private, you will get an appointment


----------



## BusLanes (Sep 21, 2022)

Wait does that mean they are exiting all NHs care or just new NHS patients (which seems to be the more usual bad news)


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 21, 2022)

BusLanes said:


> Wait does that mean they are exiting all NHs care or just new NHS patients (which seems to be the more usual bad news)


All nhs care including kids


----------



## BusLanes (Sep 21, 2022)

Not a Vet said:


> All nhs care including kids



I didn't realise clinics just closed off NHS quite like that.

I was speaking to a dentist in Streatham the other day and they said that the NHS funded work had been reducing over the years due to cuts but didn't go into that much.


----------



## Smick (Sep 22, 2022)

Not a Vet said:


> So on the letter I got, it says all nhs appointments are fully booked till 30th November (which I find hard to believe) and then it’s private only from 1st Dec. I think if it’s private, you will get an appointment


I used to have a dental plan at work, which spent thousands at that dentist on my behalf. I then lost my job and the plan. 

I told the person behind the counter that I was now unemployed and could not afford private dentistry. She offered me a loan. Without me having an income to pay it back. 

They’re a bunch of sharks in there and they fucked my mouth up by insisting on a load of work when I joined. As it was being paid for on a dental plan, I allowed it and regretted it ever since. Hours and hours of unnecessary work, a different sensation in the jaw, even to this day five years later, all for them to earn money. 

The two owners, Dan and Nicci, are an advertisement against their own work with their brighter than bright teeth, they look ridiculous.

The practice is a stain on Herne Hill. The only decent member of staff is Sharon the hygienist, and you can be sure that once they have eased people from NHS onto private contracts, which aren’t so expensive, they will begin to turn the screw next year.


----------



## CH1 (Sep 22, 2022)

Smick said:


> I used to have a dental plan at work, which spent thousands at that dentist on my behalf. I then lost my job and the plan.
> 
> I told the person behind the counter that I was now unemployed and could not afford private dentistry. She offered me a loan. Without me having an income to pay it back.
> 
> ...


Dentists are inclined to fraud. There was one at Loughborough Junction who treated prisoners in Brixton nick. Claimed from the nick AND the NHS. He went to prison himself. His practise is still empty - like a "facility" from "Abandoned Engineering" .


----------



## Tron Cruise (Sep 22, 2022)

CH1 said:


> Dentists are inclined to fraud. There was one at Loughborough Junction who treated prisoners in Brixton nick. Claimed from the nick AND the NHS. He went to prison himself. His practise is still empty - like a "facility" from "Abandoned Engineering" .


 
‘Dentists are inclined to fraud’. What a place this is.


----------



## teuchter (Sep 22, 2022)

Smick said:


> I used to have a dental plan at work, which spent thousands at that dentist on my behalf. I then lost my job and the plan.
> 
> I told the person behind the counter that I was now unemployed and could not afford private dentistry. She offered me a loan. Without me having an income to pay it back.
> 
> ...


I too am a fan of Sharon the hygienist.


----------



## Not a Vet (Sep 22, 2022)

£16 a month for the cheapest adult plan plus a £9.50 joining fee??? Whilst I’m annoyed that I will lose my nhs dentist access, what really sticks is 6-18 year olds having (whoever is responsible for them) to pay £9 a month. Many people won’t have the cash for that so once again, people without much money will be discriminated against and their kids will suffer. It’s disgusting. Oh and they might let us in again instead of using the gazebo outside


----------



## DaphneM (Sep 22, 2022)

Denmark Hill Smiles are good


----------



## nagapie (Sep 22, 2022)

Dentists have been chronically underfunded for NHS work for years. Covid revealed and accelerated this. The problem is lack of adequate funding, don't blame the dentist's. It's amazing any are still willing to work for the NHS.
My Dentist on Brixton Hill are excellent, at least Dr Mustafa is. Although it is on the other side of the park so not quite the right area.


----------



## blameless77 (Sep 22, 2022)

Smick said:


> I used to have a dental plan at work, which spent thousands at that dentist on my behalf. I then lost my job and the plan.
> 
> I told the person behind the counter that I was now unemployed and could not afford private dentistry. She offered me a loan. Without me having an income to pay it back.
> 
> ...




They gave me a really bad crown. Never returned!


----------



## Skim (Sep 22, 2022)

Awful practice. Left years ago and found a lovely new dentist in East Dulwich, who I’ve stayed with ever since.


----------



## CH1 (Sep 22, 2022)

Tron Cruise said:


> ‘Dentists are inclined to fraud’. What a place this is.


You've obviously not had the "let's start the treatment" ploy which ends up with "and the rest is private" when you're several teeth down on a full set.
The London dentists I've had have all been authoritarian - the Dutch woman in Merton Park behaved like a warden in a concentration camp.
Then there was the Christian one next to the Indian Pentecostal Church in Acre Lane - took me for hundreds of pounds.
His uncle, who I think was still a Hindu and a qualified Dr seemed quite OK, but we're going back to the 1970s now.
My experience of Gresham Road is not too bad - but they are obviously used to "runners" and demand payment upfront before you even go upstairs to the actual dentist.

And yes this is a bad place - people abuse each other on Urban75 all the time. Glad you want to stick up for dentists though.


----------



## Gramsci (Sep 22, 2022)

Tron Cruise said:


> ‘Dentists are inclined to fraud’. What a place this is.



The dentist CH1 was referring to in LJ was my dentist.

Id used the practise for years. It changed hands a couple of times.

The last dentist had a supposed flooding in the basement which destroyed a lot of the records. Or so he told me.

The receptionist went and he appeared to be running it on his own.

I didn't know but he was under investigation for defrauding the NHS.

Which turned out to be true and he did jail time.

He ruined the practise. No one has taken it on.

So sorry but I don't trust dentists.

He was perfectly nice to deal with. Sounds to me he got himself into a mess and dug a deeper hole for himself so to speak.

What should have happened when NHS was set up is that dentists are directly employed by NHS like nurses.

The present system just does not work

The previous dentists were twins. They were good but went off to run a purely private practise. Which is possible in London. The dentist who replaced them was good. He went of to do MA in reconstructive dentistry. It was the last one who messed the practise up in the end.

Basically dentistry needs to be nationalised.


----------



## Gramsci (Sep 22, 2022)

Dentist jailed for £109k fraud
					

A dentist has been jailed for two years after he fraudulently claimed more than £100,000 for treating fictitious patients.




					www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk


----------



## DaphneM (Sep 22, 2022)

CH1 said:


> Dentists are inclined to fraud. There was one at Loughborough Junction who treated prisoners in Brixton nick. Claimed from the nick AND the NHS. He went to prison himself. His practise is still empty - like a "facility" from "Abandoned Engineering" .


*A disproportionately high number of GDC concerns were raised against Asian or Asian British dentists in 2021, the GDCw report says.*

The GDC has today published its 2021 annual statistics, using equality, diversity and inclusion (EDI) data for the first time.

The data was published with its annual statistical reports for 2021 on fitness to practise and registration.

As a result, the GDC can provide a breakdown of GDC cases by EDI characteristics, such as ethnicity.

The report has shown that of all concerns received 2021, a disproportionately high number were raised against Asian or Asian British dentists (28%).









						GDC publishes 2021 fitness to practise and registration statistical reports
					

We have now published our annual statistical reports for 2021 on fitness to practise and registration.




					www.gdc-uk.org
				







It sounds like there is racism involved to me  regarding these statistics.


----------



## CH1 (Sep 22, 2022)

DaphneM said:


> *A disproportionately high number of GDC concerns were raised against Asian or Asian British dentists in 2021, the GDCw report says.*
> 
> The GDC has today published its 2021 annual statistics, using equality, diversity and inclusion (EDI) data for the first time.
> 
> ...


Don't you have to apply Chi squared testing to see if this is statistically significant?

"The report highlights that of all concerns we received, a disproportionately high number were raised against Asian or Asian British dentists (28%) when compared to their proportion of the total register (24%). Conversely, White dentists were underrepresented (43% of all concerns raised) when compared to their proportion of the register (50%)."

Has this been done, do you happen to know?


----------



## DaphneM (Sep 23, 2022)

CH1 said:


> Don't you have to apply Chi squared testing to see if this is statistically significant?
> 
> "The report highlights that of all concerns we received, a disproportionately high number were raised against Asian or Asian British dentists (28%) when compared to their proportion of the total register (24%). Conversely, White dentists were underrepresented (43% of all concerns raised) when compared to their proportion of the register (50%)."
> 
> Has this been done, do you happen to know?


given that they are comparing the data over years i would have thought that some kind of regression analysis would be more appropriate.


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (Oct 6, 2022)

Away from Dental Matters, Does anyone know who will be occupying the units that are left empty on the pedestrianised area? Many thanks.


----------



## editor (Oct 6, 2022)

Gramsci said:


> Dentist jailed for £109k fraud
> 
> 
> A dentist has been jailed for two years after he fraudulently claimed more than £100,000 for treating fictitious patients.
> ...


He was my dentist. Luckily I got suspicious when he insisted that I needed loads of expensive treatment after scaring me that my teeth were about to fall out. A real fucking shithead.


----------



## Gramsci (Oct 6, 2022)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> Away from Dental Matters, Does anyone know who will be occupying the units that are left empty on the pedestrianised area? Many thanks.



which street is that?


----------



## jimbarkanoodle (Oct 6, 2022)

editor said:


> He was my dentist. Luckily I got suspicious when he insisted that I needed loads of expensive treatment after scaring me that my teeth were about to fall out. A real fucking shithead.


There is something particularly scummy about medically disfiguring people in your trust unecesarily for profit, worse still if its NHS treatment and they claim it back through the taxpayer.


----------



## Louisgwinn24 (Oct 6, 2022)

Gramsci said:


> which street is that?


The beginning or end of Railton, The railway arch units opposite Brockwell park!


----------



## friendofdorothy (Oct 7, 2022)

Louisgwinn24 said:


> The beginning or end of Railton, The railway arch units opposite Brockwell park!


I see the toy shop around the corner on Dulwich road looks closed too. I wonder what kind of businesses could survive in Herne hill now?


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## pbsmooth (Oct 7, 2022)

things people can't easily buy online. food and drink, basically. the more pretentious and hipster the better in Herne Hill.


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## Rushy (Oct 7, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> I see the toy shop around the corner on Dulwich road looks closed too. I wonder what kind of businesses could survive in Herne hill now?


Untothislast (plywood furniture makers by the bridge) also closed down shortly after opening because of the price of ply


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## BusLanes (Oct 7, 2022)

Rushy said:


> Untothislast (plywood furniture makers by the bridge) also closed down shortly after opening because of the price of ply



They've closed already? Wow that must almost be a record


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## Rushy (Oct 7, 2022)

BusLanes said:


> They've closed already? Wow that must almost be a record


Big shame too. Really great little company. 

They are still operating on Brick Lane? I think.


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## nick (Oct 7, 2022)

Rushy said:


> Big shame too. Really great little company.
> 
> They are still operating on Brick Lane? I think.


Had never been aware of their existence, before now . 
But a quick look a their website (especially the cover message on that about reorganisation etc) and I'm very tempted to get something from them


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## Tron Cruise (Oct 8, 2022)

pbsmooth said:


> things people can't easily buy online. food and drink, basically. the more pretentious and hipster the better in Herne Hill.


HH is Dulwich Village with less money but the same (slightly younger), middle-class bellends. Not hipsters though.


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## Winot (Oct 8, 2022)

nick said:


> Had never been aware of their existence, before now .
> But a quick look a their website (especially the cover message on that about reorganisation etc) and I'm very tempted to get something from them


They are great - we’ve bought a lot from them over the years including our bed. Brick Lane still going.


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## pbsmooth (Oct 10, 2022)

Tron Cruise said:


> HH is Dulwich Village with less money but the same (slightly younger), middle-class bellends. Not hipsters though.


I think it just depends on your definitions but you definitely see lots of what I call hipsters around especially for the market


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## T & P (Oct 10, 2022)

I'd imagine local wine merchants could do well out of new arrival Boris Johnson and family.


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## alex_ (Oct 10, 2022)

T & P said:


> I'd imagine local wine merchants could do well out of new arrival Boris Johnson and family.



I’d image his security detail will be adept at handling flying bottles


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## edcraw (Nov 7, 2022)

Sad news that Canopy is closing at the end of the year.


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## BusLanes (Nov 8, 2022)

That's a shame. Wonder if their landlord has bumped rent up a bit for next year


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## edcraw (Nov 8, 2022)

BusLanes said:


> That's a shame. Wonder if their landlord has bumped rent up a bit for next year


They mention that as one of the reasons and this article talks about it. Do wonder if they can’t afford it what sort of businesses can. 

Also, guess there’s a ton of breweries now so got to be a difficult market - wonder if Brixton Brewery and others getting bought by big brewers makes it more difficult as well.









						Bath Factory Estate traders say they are set to be priced out by new multi-million pound landlord - Southwark News
					

One tenant said: “It’s just immoral and economically unsustainable to get one company to have ownership of so many small premises across the country."




					southwarknews.co.uk


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## alex_ (Nov 8, 2022)

Brewing involves a lot of electricity and is capital intensive, idk if this is true of canopy but any breweries with loans is looking at some pretty steep increases in all sorts of costs and it’ll be things like end of leases which cause them to decide to quit.


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## Crispy (Nov 8, 2022)

BusLanes said:


> That's a shame. Wonder if their landlord has bumped rent up a bit for next year


Those arches used to be with a private (very hands-off) landlord. They recently sold the head lease back to The Arch Company, who are a lot more commerically minded. Rents have gone up across the estate. Several businesses have already closed or moved. The metalworkers near the entrance gate has had to move to a smaller, grottier arch on the back half of the estate. I wouldn't be surprised if the small car mechanics go next. The area in front of the arches has had all the parking blocked off with big concrete barriers, which must have reduced the number of cars they can work on. Apparently they want to open up the gates at the Herne Hill end (currently used by the big garage on the Half Moon side to move cars between their arches). I suspect further gentrification would follow.









						‘It’s pure greed’: Businesses shut up shop as new landlord hikes rents
					

Business owners in the arches under the train tracks on the Bath Factory Estate in Herne Hill said they were “horrified” when they learned that their new landlord, Arch Company, would be increasing…




					londonnewsonline.co.uk


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## Rushy (Nov 8, 2022)

Crispy said:


> Those arches used to be with a private (very hands-off) landlord. They recently sold the head lease back to The Arch Company, who are a lot more commerically minded. Rents have gone up across the estate. Several businesses have already closed or moved. The metalworkers near the entrance gate has had to move to a smaller, grottier arch on the back half of the estate. I wouldn't be surprised if the small car mechanics go next. The area in front of the arches has had all the parking blocked off with big concrete barriers, which must have reduced the number of cars they can work on. Apparently they want to open up the gates at the Herne Hill end (currently used by the big garage on the Half Moon side to move cars between their arches). I suspect further gentrification would follow.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Wasn't there a huge redevelopment proposal / consult for the Bath Estate? Was that the last owners or the current ones?


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## Crispy (Nov 8, 2022)

Rushy said:


> Wasn't there a huge redevelopment proposal / consult for the Bath Estate? Was that the last owners or the current ones?


There was a planning/zoning consultation (which I responded to saying they should keep retail uses out of the arches to preserve them for small industrial businesses). 


snowy_again said:


> I'm struggling to understand the implications of this (speed reading isn't my strong point):
> 
> Public meeting with Southwark Council on the development of Bath Factory Estate - Wednesday 19th April
> 
> ...


Let me see what actually made it into policy...


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## Crispy (Nov 8, 2022)

Here's the relevant pages from the Southwark Plan 2022





						Southwark Plan 2022
					






					www.southwark.gov.uk
				






They want redevelopment of the shops and pedestrian access from Croxted Road through to Half Moon Lane under the railway, but to maintain the same area of small business use (use classes B and E) on the site. But all that "active frontage" just means higher rents for the sort of businesses that cater to the active frontage shoppers of Herne Hill. Kiss the small industrial businesses goodbye, if there's any left  Note the complete lack of light blue Protected Industrial area.

Of course this is planning _policy_ not an actual planning application. Who knows how attractive the site actually is to developers>


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## Rushy (Nov 8, 2022)

Am I right to presume that it's the same owners now who have kept the refurbished units on the pedestrianised part of Railton Road empty?


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## Crispy (Nov 8, 2022)

Rushy said:


> Am I right to presume that it's the same owners now who have kept the refurbished units on the pedestrianised part of Railton Road empty?


Correct


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## Ms T (Nov 8, 2022)

How is it good business sense to keep those units empty?


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## Tron Cruise (Nov 9, 2022)

Think of each unit as a bank account full of cash, increasing in value year-on. Then just wait for Pret / Leon / etc to turn up and pay the very high rent a few years down the line.


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## editor (Nov 21, 2022)

Herne Hill (late 50s/early 60s?)


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## friendofdorothy (Dec 8, 2022)

Anyone else having trouble renewing building insurance round here? 

Our existing provider wanted to increase the premium, as is usually expected, but completely exclude any cover for flood damage. With the same broker another wanted to cover flood damage with a a £5000 excess and another company completely exclude storm damage.  I called another couple of companies/brokers - similar story, one refused to cover the basement part of the building completely.  

I may add we have lived in the same building for 25 years and have never claimed on the insurance, even after the two great Herne Hill floods.
We have returned to an ins broker we used to use and have found cover ok now, but for a while I thought we were uninsurable.


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## Smick (Dec 9, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> Anyone else having trouble renewing building insurance round here?
> 
> Our existing provider wanted to increase the premium, as is usually expected, but completely exclude any cover for flood damage. With the same broker another wanted to cover flood damage with a a £5000 excess and another company completely exclude storm damage.  I called another couple of companies/brokers - similar story, one refused to cover the basement part of the building completely.
> 
> ...



I have never heard of anyone have a positive experience with an insurer. I had a flood of sorts a few years back, with a burst pipe that ended up flooding my basement. I tried to make a claim to replace the carpet that was in there. The insurance made it so difficult that I ended up deciding not to claim and to buy a dehumidifier and rent a carpet cleaner.

At my next renewal, it said that I had had a loss event and my premium had also gone up significantly. I phoned them to ask why they had done this if I wasn't going to claim and they said that the event was enough for them to adjust my premium.

Therefore, I think it is best to stay as far away from insurers as possible, unless it is something catastrophic that I can't sort on my own.


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## CH1 (Dec 9, 2022)

Smick said:


> I have never heard of anyone have a positive experience with an insurer. I had a flood of sorts a few years back, with a burst pipe that ended up flooding my basement. I tried to make a claim to replace the carpet that was in there. The insurance made it so difficult that I ended up deciding not to claim and to buy a dehumidifier and rent a carpet cleaner.
> 
> At my next renewal, it said that I had had a loss event and my premium had also gone up significantly. I phoned them to ask why they had done this if I wasn't going to claim and they said that the event was enough for them to adjust my premium.
> 
> Therefore, I think it is best to stay as far away from insurers as possible, unless it is something catastrophic that I can't sort on my own.


Sorry slightly and edgily out of area -I was unable to get Eagle Star etc to insure me in Coldharbour Lane after the 1985 riots. I was however pleased to discover that FE Wright , a wholly owned subsidiary of Tiny Rowland's Lonrho plc at the time, were happy enough to insure - and if anything cheaper.
[expects ban here]
Imagine my surprise when I heard Lloyd Leon, Lambeth's Mayor and owner of "Mingles" in Railton Road telling exactly the same story on the local news. But then Lloyd was never any more politically correct than me!


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## friendofdorothy (Dec 9, 2022)

Smick said:


> I have never heard of anyone have a positive experience with an insurer. .


True.


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## Ms T (Dec 15, 2022)

friendofdorothy said:


> True.


I’ve been with M&S for years and they’ve paid out three times with no issues whatsoever (for relatively minor amounts). When some stupid kid threw a can of drink through our window they sent someone over that night to repair it. When I claimed to get a ceiling redecorated after water damage from a leaky roof they didn’t even ask for a copy of the quote and I had the money by the end of the day. Similar story when my purse and mobile got stolen.


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## Rushy (Dec 15, 2022)

Never found small claims much of a problem. I'm currently two years into my first large claim and it has been a total mare requiring ombudsman involvement 16 months in. 

It initially took five months for the insurer's various surveyors to complete investigations (mostly just waiting for their approval to remove floor coverings). They then declined liability for the bulk of damage. On top of this they also got a valuation to prove I was underinsured by 30% and so would reduce any payout accordingly. On this basis they offered me a cash settlement. 

It took a further 6 months to demonstrate that their lead surveyor was contradicting himself in various reports and get them to accept full liability (but still subject to 30% underinsurance). We agreed an interim payment but they still wouldn't respond at all on the underinsurance. Five months later the interim payment had still not been received and they still had not engaged with my arguments about the 30% underinsurance. The day after I sent them my Ombudsman case number they discovered that - surprise surprise - I was not under-insured afterall (that was a full year after they originally claimed I was underinsured) and my overdue interim payment turned up (still minus the 30% deducted for underinsurance). 

I've had both subsequent interim payments only turn up after going through an 8 week formal complaint process for each one (each investigation finding internal administration errors to be the cause of delay). They then refused to pay interest on the late payments but as soon as the Ombudsman dropped them a one-liner they changed their minds. 

The overall claim is now looking to be 7-10x what I was originally offered to settle.

Lucky for me I have a degree in law, a decent enough knowledge of buildings and work for myself so can (begrudgingly) allocate time. I'm also a stubborn fucker as well as financially able to cope with the delays. Goodness knows how much they save themselves every year by misleading their customers,  wearing them down and making them financially desperate.

And this was (ultimately) Legal & General (now Fairmead).

(And friendofdorothy my escape of water excess also jumped from £200 to £5,000 too.)


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