# How do I get a current CRB check?



## Orang Utan (Apr 3, 2012)

Hello, lots of jobs I am looking to apply for require this.
I'd previously thought that it was the responsibility of the employer to do it, but some vacacny details seem to want to applicant to provide one. 
I googled "CRB check' and there seem to be shady organisations with sponsored links who will do it for money, but I'm not sure how trustworthy they are. 
Will I have to pay an agency to do one for me or is there another way?


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

you can (I think) only get a basic CRB yourself, and it will be about forty quid.  Unless you can find a voluntary organisation who will say you're a volunteer, when you'll get it for free!


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

seems a bit odd tbh. i thought where it's mandatory to get a CRB check, the employer would have to get it done? doesn't really make sense to make a prospective employee to provide a (no doubt forgeable) document.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

but it takes six weeks, and some places want you to start tomorrow.


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## Orang Utan (Apr 3, 2012)

killer b said:


> seems a bit odd tbh. i thought where it's mandatory to get a CRB check, the employer would have to get it done? doesn't really make sense to make a prospective employee to provide a (no doubt forgeable) document.


well indeed. it's a bit confusing. i thought a CRB check could only be done if there's an employer, rather than a potential one.


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## Belushi (Apr 3, 2012)

You can't get one yourself except under certain circumstances, and even then nearly all employers will want to run a new check on you before you start in case you've got up to no good since your previous check.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

various genuinely self-employed roles require them. usually it is a con tho, the employer should definitly pay


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## Orang Utan (Apr 3, 2012)

Belushi said:


> You can't get one yourself except under certain circumstances, and even then nearly all employers will want to run a new check on you before you start in case you've got up to no good since your previous check.


that's what i thought.
does this mean that this vacancy is bullshit?
http://www.totaljobs.com/JobSearch/...LTxt=London&Radius=5&distance=0.0&precision=2


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

i suspect a lot of HR departments don't really understand the law tbh. i read up about it last year for work, and it's not always totally clear.


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

belboid said:


> but it takes six weeks, and some places want you to start tomorrow.


 
You can in lots of places start with the CRB pending. 
It often takes a lot longer than six weeks to come through.


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## Orang Utan (Apr 3, 2012)

killer b said:


> i suspect a lot of HR departments don't really understand the law tbh. i read up about it last year for work, and it's not always totally clear.


i think that's lambeth council though. they should know!


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> that's what i thought.
> does this mean that this vacancy is bullshit?
> http://www.totaljobs.com/JobSearch/...LTxt=London&Radius=5&distance=0.0&precision=2


 
Yep it's not correct. 
The only way it could be is if they are intending on employing internally but have to advertise externally. 

If I went to work in another school, they would need to do a new CRB for me.


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

it's a crafty way of keeping the number of applications from long term doley scum down, i guess.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

kittyP said:


> You can in lots of places start with the CRB pending.
> It often takes a lot longer than six weeks to come through.


my last one took three bloody months!  it is usually quicker tho.  whether you can start all depends on the kind of work, what supervision you'll have at first etc etc


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> i think that's lambeth council though. they should know!


what makes you think lambeth council would be any more competent than anyone else?


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## Belushi (Apr 3, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> that's what i thought.
> does this mean that this vacancy is bullshit?
> http://www.totaljobs.com/JobSearch/...LTxt=London&Radius=5&distance=0.0&precision=2


 
Not necessarily, they may take someone who has an existing CRB from a previous job or from self employment - that isn't best practice but is allowed.


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## Belushi (Apr 3, 2012)

The arrival of CRB News is the highlight of of my work month.


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

Belushi said:


> Not necessarily, t*hey may take someone who has an existing CRB from a previous job* or from self employment - that isn't best practice but is allowed.


 
I thought that technically, a CRB from a previous job is meaningless..... 
Unless you are moving within a sector and borough.


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

Afaik, my school will employ new people with their CRB pending but they are not allowed to be left unsupervised.


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## Belushi (Apr 3, 2012)

kittyP said:


> I thought that technically, a CRB from a previous job is meaningless.....
> Unless you are moving within a sector and borough.


 
It's allowed but isn't best practice.


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## Belushi (Apr 3, 2012)

It's an incredibly complicated system, and employers crb check way to many people imho.


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

my understanding was that unless your job fulfills very specific criteria, it's actually illegal for an employer to insist on a CRB. this may have changed though. and is not particularly obvious.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

Belushi said:


> It's an incredibly complicated system, and employers crb check way to many people imho.


absolutely, i am meant to have had one for my current role, even tho i dont actually work with anyone who might be considered vulnerable (other colleagues do, but not me). I would never be left alone with anyone who might be considerd vulnerable.  I never bothered cos I have one from my last job.  Which was also a job I didn't technically need one for either. Got to get a new one now tho, new role, and the last check is three years old...


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## pogofish (Apr 3, 2012)

The simplest way I've seen is to register an interest for work in an airport - Because of the time involved, most airports prefer people to do this in advance of applying for any jobs, so the whole security clearance process is already complete.

Once you have that clearence, which involves a CRB check, most employers will have no further problems.


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

pogofish said:


> The simplest way I've seen is to register an interest for work in an airport - Because of the time involved, most airports prefer people to do this in advance of applying for any jobs, so the whole security clearance process is already complete.
> 
> Once you have that clearence, which involves a CRB check, most employers will have no further problems.


 
But then if you choose to work out side of that borough, or even line of work, you will almost def need to get it re-done.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

killer b said:


> my understanding was that unless your job fulfills very specific criteria, it's actually illegal for an employer to insist on a CRB. this may have changed though. and is not particularly obvious.


not sure about illegal, but could amount to unlawful discrimination, re ex-offenders.

There are very specific occupations listed (including football stewards!), but most times it falls under te rather vaguer opening section:

Any work which is defined as regulated activity relating to children within the meaning of
www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/47/schedule/4
01
Any work which is defined as regulated activity relating to vulnerable adults within the
meaning of www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/47/schedule/4
02
Any office or employment which is concerned with:
a) the provision of care services to vulnerable adults
b) the representation of, or advocacy services for, vulnerable adults by a service that has
been approved by the Secretary of State or created under any enactment; and which
is of such a kind as to enable a person, in the course of his normal duties, to have
access to vulnerable adults in receipt of such services
03
Any work in a further education institution where the normal duties of that work involve
regular contact with children
04
Any position which otherwise involves regularly caring for, training, supervising or being
solely in charge of children
05
Any position which otherwise involves regularly caring for, training, supervising or being
solely in charge of vulnerable adults
06


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

actually, it is explicitly stated about it being illegal to ask unnecesarilly:

"Before an organisation considers asking a person to make an application for a CRB check, they are legally responsible for ensuring that they are entitled to ask that person to reveal their conviction history."
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/public...-the-crb/eligible-positions-guide?view=Binary


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

i had a document that explicitly said it was illegal - but i think it did mention it was up for review sometime last year, so it may not still be the case.


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

ah, that's probably it.


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## Mrs Magpie (Apr 3, 2012)

Usually the employers do it, but if you need, this is a small really nice organisation I used to work for that moved over to solely doing CRB work. www.wrighton-education.com/


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

I'll have to check the legal definition of 'office' to see whether I ever did require one before or not


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

if you're not in regular, unsupervised contact with children or vulnerable adults (i read 4 times or more in a month), then i don't see how you can be required to have one tbh.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

I fall under

Any office or employment which is concerned with:
a) the provision of care services to vulnerable adults

Which doesnt specify any frequency, or even that you have to directly work with VA's yourself. My new job will be more than four times a month, but before, it was never (although I did have access to records about them)


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

fair enough. i was looking into a fairly specific thing, so i probably missed loads. it is fairly ambiguous though...


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## pogofish (Apr 3, 2012)

kittyP said:


> But then if you choose to work out side of that borough, or even line of work, you will almost def need to get it re-done.


 
Meanwhile, any other potential employer is not likely to question its validity or suitability, which can be a great help in landing work whilst their own check is pending.


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## Belushi (Apr 3, 2012)

pogofish said:


> Meanwhile, any other potential employer is not likely to question its validity or suitability, which can be a great help in landing work whilst their own check is pending.


 
Certainly in my sector any employer ime would conduct their own check before letting someone start.


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

pogofish said:


> Meanwhile, any other potential employer is not likely to question its validity or suitability, which can be a great help in landing work whilst their own check is pending.


 
Most places that require a CRB will be so use to going through the process of checking new employees by now though that having one from another place will probably not make any difference.


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## Orang Utan (Apr 3, 2012)

killer b said:


> what makes you think lambeth council would be any more competent than anyone else?


they're more incompetent than anyone else in my experience, but as a council, you'd think they'd know about CRB checks.


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## Orang Utan (Apr 3, 2012)

Mrs Magpie said:


> Usually the employers do it, but if you need, this is a small really nice organisation I used to work for that moved over to solely doing CRB work. www.wrighton-education.com/


thanks, but they, like all the others i've seen online, seem to market their service to organisations/employers rather than employees


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> they're more incompetent than anyone else in my experience, but as a council, you'd think they'd know about CRB checks.


 
It's the issue with most of the pubilc sector.
One hand (finger) has no idea what the other is doing most of the time. 
For a CRB, you are relying on admin, managers, policy makers, child/vulnerable adult protection and the police too all get on the fucking ball at the same time. HA ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!

I have overall found Lambeth NHS to be the best I have come across. 
However, in other areas they are severely lacking.


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## Mrs Magpie (Apr 3, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> thanks, but they, like all the others i've seen online, seem to market their service to organisations/employers rather than employees


They are a small organisation so try asking. When I say small, they're a husband and wife team, they're local (Southwark) and lovely people so you can but ask.


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> thanks, but they, like all the others i've seen online, seem to market their service to organisations/employers rather than employees


 
*If you see a job that requires a CRB and want to go for it, go for it. *

Like I said about the Ad you posted, it's either a mistake or not a real Ad (as in they intend on employing internally). 

Not having a CRB will not make you any less likely ime to get it than anyone else. 
They will check you if they want you. 

I think this is the long and short of it yes...?


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## Mrs Magpie (Apr 3, 2012)

Also, they both have hands-on experience as in they've worked (and maybe still do) directly with kids.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

kittyP said:


> Like I said about the Ad you posted, it's either a mistake or not a real Ad (as in they intend on employing internally).


possibly, but, actually looking at the ad, they want someone now, for three months.  they dont want to wait six or so weeks for a new CRB to come through.


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## kittyP (Apr 3, 2012)

belboid said:


> possibly, but, actually looking at the ad, they want someone now, for three months. they dont want to wait six or so weeks for a new CRB to come through.


 
But having an already existing CRB from somewhere else when taking on a temp council job (IME) will not help so it's at the least a mistake.


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## purenarcotic (Apr 3, 2012)

I think that's a poorly worded advert; you make CRB requests through an employer, you cannot just get one for yourself.  

Some places will take you on if you already have a current CRB with another organisation, but that's quite unusual.  I'd find it a bit weird they would only accept people in those circumstances.


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

guidance is:



> if you have been asked to apply for a CRB check, and already have one from a previous role, you can ask if the organisation is willing to accept it.
> When deciding if they will accept it, the organisation will consider:
> 
> the length of time since the check was issued
> ...


however, i'd think it very unlikely that any organisation wouldn't then request a new one anyway - if only to cover their backs if you went noncing their kids. i'd be interested in the legality for asking for one as a pre-condition to application though.


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## belboid (Apr 3, 2012)

Agency work, innit? Means they can get away with murder


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## killer b (Apr 3, 2012)

indeed - legal or otherwise, the likelihood of it being challenged is miniscule.


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## Orang Utan (Jan 23, 2013)

Is it usual to be expected to pay for an agency's CRB check? I have already been offered the job, but they want £58. Shouldn't they pay this, not me?


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## purenarcotic (Jan 23, 2013)

There is nothing on the CRB website to suggest that employers must cover the costs, it just gives you the costs so you could argue you aren't going to pay the £58, just the actual cost of whatever level of CRB you're being asked to apply for.  

https://www.gov.uk/crb-criminal-records-bureau-check


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## belboid (Jan 23, 2013)

Orang Utan said:


> Is it usual to be expected to pay for an agency's CRB check? I have already been offered the job, but they want £58. Shouldn't they pay this, not me?


yes they bloody well should! cheeky cunts


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## purenarcotic (Jan 23, 2013)

I expect you'll be going for an enhanced CRB if you're working with children, so £44.


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## purenarcotic (Jan 23, 2013)

belboid said:


> yes they bloody well should! cheeky cunts


 
They should, but there's nothing to force them to.  So he could argue it's not fair, and the expectation is that the employer covers costs but I doubt it'll get him anywhere as agencies are robbing bastards.


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## cesare (Jan 23, 2013)

Btw, it's the Disclosure and Barring service now: http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/crime/vetting-barring-scheme/


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## Orang Utan (Jan 23, 2013)

I will ask them to take it out of my first wage packet. Hopefully they will go for this.


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## Hollis (Jan 23, 2013)

Belushi said:


> It's an incredibly complicated system, and employers crb check way to many people imho.


 
Most employers haven't got a clue.  And of course they probably haven't got any set policy on the information that they do get.


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## mr steev (Jan 23, 2013)

kittyP said:


> I thought that technically, a CRB from a previous job is meaningless.....
> Unless you are moving within a sector and borough.


 
That's not been my experience. I work/have worked with lots of different schools and organisations in different boroughs and generally they're happy if you have had one done within a certain amount of time (mostly 12 months, but occasionally 6).
That's not always the case obviously. I worked for an organisation in brum a couple of years ago and they said they needed a new one even though I'd only just received one from a company in Wolverhampton. They said it was a different area. I pointed out that it was a national check and the area made absolutely no difference. They still made me get another, but they paid for it 
There are no rules for whether the are transferable or how long they last. It's down to the employer.


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## Gromit (Jan 23, 2013)

Anyone can apply for the Basic CRB check. Costs about £20. 

Then there are two other CRBs. Enhanced and something else. You fill the form out first then they fill out the sponsor (or similar term) bit and send it off.


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## TopCat (Jan 23, 2013)

If you are asked to apply for a CRB and this is not for a position exempt from the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act, complain to the disclosure and barring service. They take it very seriously, it's straightforward to prove and the organisation loses their right to apply for more CRB's which fucks them totally.


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## Orang Utan (Jan 23, 2013)

I need the CRB, I just object to paying for it when the firm is about to get a few grand for 'finding' me and i don't have a pot to piss in.


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