# London is HORRIBLE nowadays! My rant...



## Pickled Egg (May 28, 2016)

I hate to say it, but... London has become such a shit-hole. 

As soon as I came back from Tokyo in March after not being there for almost 10 years, I realised London hadn't really advanced as a city as much as Tokyo had in any way shape or form. It's as if London's been stuck on pause. London has become a stale and stagnant city. And then we find out all the tax evasion bullshit by Cameron. People who are there to create a "better London" are making sure they don't have to pay tax. Hah. Who's interests are they really serving? Isn't it a shame university graduates can't even live in central London anymore? Now you have to dish out £2million+ just to get a fucking matchbox piece of shit in Notting Hill. And who ends up affording that? The internationally rich. And how long are they here for? The holidays. Who loses out? London. Who runs off laughing with money in their pockets? The estate agents. 

I'm tired of hearing "but they pump our economy when they're here" bullshit. OK they pump the economy for a few months a year - but then what? Businesses permanently bump up the prices because rent is increasing, and majority of Londoners are left out and forced to move further out. And it's keeps spreading and spreading, and it will continue to spread until the original Londoners who made London what it is are pushed out of the city completely. Why is London becoming so selfish? Why is the over-catering to the internationally rich being accepted? Surely some sort of tax should be implemented for long-term vacancies in homes owned.


Did you know that in 2002, the average price of a home in Knightsbridge was £745,000. Now it's £3.4 million. Who else other than the internationally rich can afford properties at such prices? As such, 20% of these homes are VACANT for the majority of the year. To add more insult to injury, most of these vacant properties were bought through a loop-hole system meaning the buyers avoid paying any tax. There is a 40% annual increase of vacant homes in Kensington & Chelsea. Living in that borough my whole life, I can see first-hand the transformation of this borough, and what a ghost-town shit hole this borough has become. It's literally become a dumping ground/garage for the internationally rich. Empty homes. Garages blocked up with nice but dusty cars. I've watched my favourite shops pack up and leave. Prices for properties are sky-high, rent is increasing more and more, and as a result, businesses are closing down and moving out. 

Look at High Street Kensington, It looks like a shit hole nowadays yet new residential buildings are still being built (for example Across Kensington Gardens, also where ODEON cinema stands, also near Olympia). Who cares about the local businesses and the people, right? "We don't care about the future of London. As long as those rich people are willing to pay what we ask, we're going to keep knocking buildings down and building new ones, we're going to keep transforming your markets to high-streets" is what they think. I mean, TESCO's closed down the other week. Fucking TESCO's. They tried to knock down the legendary ODEON cinema for another block of high-end apartments - what the fuck is actually going on? Only after protest from the locals, did they decide to keep the cinema active, yet they are still combining it into a high-end residential block. The same exact thing was going to happen to Portobello market but the locals fought back.


I don't know... Sorry to sound so pessimistic, but this city really isn't what it used to be anymore.


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## Pickman's model (May 28, 2016)

Perhaps you should spend some time exploring the boards before posting again


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## telbert (May 28, 2016)

Hello.


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## quimcunx (May 28, 2016)

I wish we had more astute posters like you. 



> Did you know that in 2002, the average price of a home in Knightsbridge was £745,000. Now it's £3.4 million. Who else other than the internationally rich can afford properties at such prices?



As opposed to the ordinary working folk who could afford £745k in 2002?


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## xenon (May 28, 2016)

Shocking rrevelations. How come no one living in London has noticed this.

Doesn't Tokyo have similar - ish problems BTW? Genuine question.


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## free spirit (May 28, 2016)

I thought London was a hugely overpriced shit hole in 2002 tbh.

eta though I'm pretty sure it had a lot better parties and club nights going on back then which were its main redeeming feature for me.


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## Pickled Egg (May 28, 2016)

Well obviously in 2002 it was still stupidly expensive - but look at the increase. Is this the road we really want to go down?

As for Tokyo - no, they certainly do not have that problem. The city itself is immensely advanced, compared to when I visited 10 years ago. Coming back to London was incredibly depressing. I've never once come back home and felt my home city was much worse than where I was.

I love the belittling responses though.

In all, as said before, this city, UNFORTUNATELY MY HOME CITY, has become one of the worst in the world, let alone Europe. London has become the dumping ground for the globally rich.


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## Pickman's model (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> Well obviously in 2002 it was still stupidly expensive - but look at the increase. Is this the road we really want to go down?
> 
> As for Tokyo - no, they certainly do not have that problem. The city itself is immensely advanced, compared to when I visited 10 years ago. Coming back to London was incredibly depressing. I've never once come back home and felt my home city was much worse than where I was.
> 
> ...


Welcome home


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## toblerone3 (May 28, 2016)

Kensington and Chelsea has become a virtual no go area for most of the people who post on these boards.  I can't remember there being an Urban drinks, for instance, in that area hardly ever, if at all.


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## ska invita (May 28, 2016)

Closing time in King's Road as shops fall prey to the slump

Story from 2012 about  indie shops closing on kings road.

Funny to hold up Japan as a model of a good country with affordable housing... The land of the 100 year mortgage....


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## Pickman's model (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> I hate to say it, but... London has become such a shit-hole.
> 
> As soon as I came back from Tokyo in March after not being there for almost 10 years, I realised London hadn't really advanced as a city as much as Tokyo had in any way shape or form. It's as if London's been stuck on pause. London has become a stale and stagnant city. And then we find out all the tax evasion bullshit by Cameron. People who are there to create a "better London" are making sure they don't have to pay tax. Hah. Who's interests are they really serving? Isn't it a shame university graduates can't even live in central London anymore? Now you have to dish out £2million+ just to get a fucking matchbox piece of shit in Notting Hill. And who ends up affording that? The internationally rich. And how long are they here for? The holidays. Who loses out? London. Who runs off laughing with money in their pockets? The estate agents.
> 
> ...


How did you watch your favorite shops pack up and leave if you were, by your own admission, on the other side of the world? And even in 2002 you should have realised Kensington & Chelsea not really typical of London boroughs.


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## bi0boy (May 28, 2016)

If London is a shit-hole why do 8.5 million people live there? It's not like housing is more expensive in the rest of the country should they be desirous of moving


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

Nowadays is the most redundant word in that sentence. When was London not horrible? A brief three week period after the great fire?


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## Yossarian (May 28, 2016)

ska invita said:


> Funny to hold up Japan as a model of a good country with affordable housing... The land of the 100 year mortgage....



Apparently with the population shrinking, there are millions of empty homes in Japan that can be bought for peanuts - though they tend to be in parts of the country people no longer want to live in.


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## Pickled Egg (May 28, 2016)

I never said Japan had more affordable housing (which in fact it does by a mile), but as a city, I can see how much it had developed in 10 years, in comparison to London. Honestly, when I came back, I said "it's almost as if Cameron is just pocketing all the cash and not putting any out to the city" ... And then we hear about his tax evasion stunt. 



8den said:


> Nowadays is the most redundant word in that sentence. When was London not horrible? A brief three week period after the great fire?



That made me chuckle. Haha


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> I never said Japan had more affordable housing (which in fact it does by a mile), but as a city, I can see how much it had developed in 10 years.
> 
> 
> 
> That made me chuckle. Haha



London has progressed. Remember How they used to say you were never less than four feet from a rat?  Now it's four feet from a chicken cottage or Starbucks. And a rat.


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## The Boy (May 28, 2016)

.


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## mauvais (May 28, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> If London is a shit-hole why do 8.5 million people live there? It's not like housing is more expensive in the rest of the country should they be desirous of moving


You might as well ask why a pyramid scheme is wide at the bottom.

Because jobs, because infrastructure, because culture, because everything is London-centric. Everything being London-centric brings in even more people, national immigration if you like, which puts the place under further stress. And noone caught up in this nonsense will vote for it to end, for nationally redistributive goals, because they'd be voting against their own provision, and much of the time, against their own profits - theoretical ones anyway. Too big to fail, as they say.

Doesn't mean it's not a fucked up shithole on multiple levels.


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## bi0boy (May 28, 2016)

mauvais said:


> You might as well ask why a pyramid scheme is wide at the bottom.
> 
> Because jobs, because infrastructure, because culture, because everything is London-centric. Everything being London-centric brings in even more people, national immigration if you like, which puts the place under further stress. And noone caught up in this nonsense will vote for it to end, for nationally redistributive goals, because they'd be voting against their own provision, and much of the time, against their own profits - theoretical ones anyway. Too big to fail, as they say.
> 
> Doesn't mean it's not a fucked up shithole on multiple levels.



If it really was a shit hole then surely the shitness should outweigh the jobs, infrastructure, culture and everything about the place that makes people want to live there. Otherwise it's a good place to live with some shit aspects.


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## andysays (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> I hate to say it, but... London has become such a shit-hole...



Funnily enough, I was browsing popular Tokyo-based forum 都市75 (Toshi75) just the other day and a poster there called 漬け卵 (Tsuke tamago) was saying how the poster found Tokyo to be really shit now they'd returned from ten years in London.

Funny old world, innit...


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## purenarcotic (May 28, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> If it really was a shit hole then surely the shitness should outweigh the jobs, infrastructure, culture and everything about the place that makes people want to live there. Otherwise it's a good place to live with some shit aspects.



I don't think it's a shit hole but it is frustrating how London centric everything is when you live outside it.


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## Miss-Shelf (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> I love the belittling responses though.


You're welcome


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## mauvais (May 28, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> If it really was a shit hole then surely the shitness should outweigh the jobs, infrastructure, culture and everything about the place that makes people want to live there. Otherwise it's a good place to live with some shit aspects.


Where else is there? Everywhere else is, to varying extents, fucked by London and the mechanisms that feed it. Until the _entire_ game comes to a halt, anyone exiting early is - in theory - missing out on the continuing opportunity of it all.


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## bi0boy (May 28, 2016)

mauvais said:


> Where else is there? Everywhere else is, to varying extents, fucked by London and the mechanisms that feed it. Until the _entire_ game comes to a halt, anyone exiting early is - in theory - missing out on the continuing opportunity of it all.



If London is a shit-hole then the rest of the UK should be a better place to live. People should move out in droves. Unless London is not a hole but an area in a broad field of shit equally deep across the whole country/world.


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## pengaleng (May 28, 2016)

kensington and chelsea lolololololol


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## Mr Retro (May 28, 2016)

I loved London in 2002 and I love it now


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## pengaleng (May 28, 2016)

money eh?


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## mauvais (May 28, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> If London is a shit-hole then the rest of the UK should be a better place to live. People should move out in droves. Unless London is not a hole but an area in a broad field of shit equally deep across the whole country/world.


NO. This is the main thing that winds me up.

Places as far away and unlikely as Dorchester have become feeders to the all important London, dormitory towns if you like. In large part, HS2 is a project to turn _Birmingham_ into one. And as well as that, luckier Londoners - homeowners - either priced out of or cashing out of London have emigrated to secondary cities like Bristol and Manchester, with their inflated assets, so now those places are unaffordable for anyone who hasn't played this casino. Thanks, London! 

There are very few jobs in say the North East, because guess what, the only thing that matters economically is London based financial services. Thanks, London! 

So the machinery that created London and made it unworkable has fucked _everywhere_, not magically balanced everything out.


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## bi0boy (May 28, 2016)

If London has fucked everywhere it's not more shit than everywhere else, therefore it's not a hole in comparison. Or maybe the entire UK is a shit hole, in which case why are people leaving in droves?


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## bi0boy (May 28, 2016)

I wonder what proportion of the global population think London is a shit hole.


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## mauvais (May 28, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> If London has fucked everywhere it's not more shit than everywhere else, therefore it's not a hole in comparison. Or maybe the entire UK is a shit hole, in which case why are people leaving in droves?


So your argument comes down not to how shit it is globally, or historically, but to "it's still better than the other places it's ruined". Nice work. You could be mayor.


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## Pickled Egg (May 28, 2016)

The fact a lot of you laugh at Kensington & Chelsea, or don't even dare to step foot in that borough, means you agree with me.


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## bi0boy (May 28, 2016)

mauvais said:


> So your argument comes down not to how shit it is globally, or historically, but to "it's still better than the other places it's ruined". Nice work. You could be mayor.



No, the contention is "London is a shit-hole". I argue that an overwhelming majority of people living there don't regard it as such. Nor in fact do an overwhelming majority of other people. I think this suggests that it might be unreasonable to regard London as a shit-hole.


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> The fact a lot of you laugh at Kensington & Chelsea, or don't even dare to step foot in that borough, means you agree with me.



No we just have a beef with the gangs there.


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## dessiato (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg at least London has Hobnobs.


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## DotCommunist (May 28, 2016)

8den said:


> No we just have a beef with the gangs there.


Kensington Mandem lol


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

DotCommunist said:


> Kensington Mandem lol



No messing Bruv.


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## dessiato (May 28, 2016)

(My mate's girlfriend owns a flat in in S Ken, she's owned it since about 2000 though so she's only a little wealthy)


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## editor (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> I've never once come back home and felt my home city was much worse than where I was.
> 
> I love the belittling responses though.


Thank you for rising above them. I hope you stay and keep chatting. Be nice, posters ffs.


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## editor (May 28, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> No, the contention is "London is a shit-hole". I argue that an overwhelming majority of people living there don't regard it as such. Nor in fact do an overwhelming majority of other people. I think this suggests that it might be unreasonable to regard London as a shit-hole.


Indeed. It's not a shit hole. There's shitty parts, for sure, but that's the same for every city in every country. London also has some fucking amazing things that are as good as - if not better than - anywhere else in the world. Things like museums, parks, public transport, music etc etc.


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## jakethesnake (May 28, 2016)

I think the OP's point that London appears to be being run by venal gangsters who are stealing all the money is a sound one.


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## friendofdorothy (May 28, 2016)

toblerone3 said:


> Kensington and Chelsea has become a virtual no go area for most of the people who post on these boards.  I can't remember there being an Urban drinks, for instance, in that area hardly ever, if at all.


 There's an idea - haven't been drinking in that borough for decades. Shall we round up a posse of urbz drinkers and have an outing?


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> There's an idea - haven't been drinking in that borough for decades. Shall we round up a posse of urbz drinkers and have an outing?



Posse? Good idea, safety in numbers.


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## friendofdorothy (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> I hate to say it, but... London has become such a shit-hole.
> 
> As soon as I came back from Tokyo in March after not being there for almost 10 years, I realised London hadn't really advanced as a city as much as Tokyo had in any way shape or form. It's as if London's been stuck on pause. London has become a stale and stagnant city. And then we find out all the tax evasion bullshit by Cameron. People who are there to create a "better London" are making sure they don't have to pay tax. Hah. Who's interests are they really serving? Isn't it a shame university graduates can't even live in central London anymore? Now you have to dish out £2million+ just to get a fucking matchbox piece of shit in Notting Hill. And who ends up affording that? The internationally rich. And how long are they here for? The holidays. Who loses out? London. Who runs off laughing with money in their pockets? The estate agents.
> 
> ...


 welcome back to London. Never been to Japan but isn't Tokyo one of the most poluted and expensive cities in the world? Is London as bad on general polution / expensiveness scales (excluding property prices)


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## DJWrongspeed (May 28, 2016)

London 2016 has jobs. Far more jobs than the rest of the country. People want jobs. People live here.

Yes London has changed I agree but it's job creating success is unquestionable.


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## Dr. Furface (May 28, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> welcome back to London. Never been to Japan but isn't Tokyo one of the most poluted and expensive cities in the world? Is London as bad on general polution / expensiveness scales (excluding property prices)


At least in London we don't constantly live with the possibility of earthquakes destroying our unaffordable homes!


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## ViolentPanda (May 28, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> Well obviously in 2002 it was still stupidly expensive - but look at the increase. Is this the road we really want to go down?



The mass of us don't *want* to go down it, we're *driven* down it. 

The whole situation has been an obvious one for at least the last 20 years. If you don't even increase housing supply in keeping with demand - and no government in the last 35 years has - then you get a bottleneck of demand over supply that inflates the cost of housing over and above the material value, hence the ridiculous situation where prices have doubled, trebled or quadrupled in some parts of London compared to prices at the turn of the century.

The effect that the super-rich have on the housing market in London is quite small, and confined to a handful of locations. The REAL issue lies with the transformation of housing into an investment opportunity for the comfortably-off, hence the ever-increasing number of properties owned by Buy to Let landlords or by non-national landlords in the "Far East"



> As for Tokyo - no, they certainly do not have that problem. The city itself is immensely advanced, compared to when I visited 10 years ago. Coming back to London was incredibly depressing. I've never once come back home and felt my home city was much worse than where I was.
> 
> I love the belittling responses though.



People are ribbing you because Londoners have been making some noise about this stuff all the time you've been away, and then you rock up and appear to be lecturing us about something we've lived. 



> In all, as said before, this city, UNFORTUNATELY MY HOME CITY, has become one of the worst in the world, let alone Europe. London has become the dumping ground for the globally rich.



Nope. *Anywhere* with the right balance of financial conditions and property prices has.


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## ViolentPanda (May 28, 2016)

8den said:


> No we just have a beef with the gangs there.



Those motherfucking Chelsea Pensioners, with their flick knives, and their rough ways with the ladies.


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## Pickled Egg (May 28, 2016)

Dr. Furface said:


> At least in London we don't constantly live with the possibility of earthquakes destroying our unaffordable homes!



Haha, that I'll give - I actually experienced my first earthquake while I was there!


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## FridgeMagnet (May 28, 2016)

friendofdorothy said:


> welcome back to London. Never been to Japan but isn't Tokyo one of the most poluted and expensive cities in the world? Is London as bad on general polution / expensiveness scales (excluding property prices)


People in Japan were literally shocked when I told them what I was paying for my flat in London last year (and I'm getting a relatively good deal too).

Eta: that was in Kyoto to be fair, which I preferred to Tokyo. Osaka was my favourite city mind.


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## marty21 (May 28, 2016)

I moved to London in 1989 , it didn't seem that expensive then , usually rented rooms in shared houses for £50-£60 a week.  

I doubt that I would move here now as rents are insane. But I can afford to live here because we bought a flat 20 years ago. 

I love living in London and count my blessings that I can afford to on an average income.


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

FridgeMagnet said:


> People in Japan were literally shocked when I told them what I was paying for my flat in London last year (and I'm getting a relatively good deal too).
> 
> Eta: that was in Kyoto to be fair, which I preferred to Tokyo. Osaka was my favourite city mind.



Also Japanese urban dwellers are possibly the only people who will remark as to how spacious your London flat is without being sarcastic.


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## davesgcr (May 28, 2016)

Japan has a flat economy .....stagflation etc. 

Lived in or around since 1979 , whilst commuting drags the spirit down , still an amazing city (and we should and are , no doubt. grateful that the London of 1982 or so - in deep physical and economic decline - has pulled around , smartened up and remains vibrant. Still lots of free and affordable things to do) 

In my extended family group - no less than 4 of 8 nephews from Hereford and Bradford and Brum have moved to the city for all the things they want to see and experience + work. Maybe not so easy to start off as it was , but they seem to relish. Both my sons are up there tonight enjoying the city.


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 28, 2016)

ska invita said:


> Closing time in King's Road as shops fall prey to the slump
> 
> Story from 2012 about  indie shops closing on kings road...




Thankfully Osborne and Little seems to have survived the slump.


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## Pickman's model (May 28, 2016)

ViolentPanda said:


> Those motherfucking Chelsea Pensioners, with their flick knives, and their rough ways with the ladies.


I heard there's some woman buried where they live


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## goldenecitrone (May 28, 2016)

marty21 said:


> I love living in London and count my blessings that I can afford to on an average income.



Seconded. Just had a perfect day in London. Breakfast up by the Heath, then a stroll around and down to Camden Town which was packed. Wandered into Regent's Park and lay down in the Rose garden, reading for a couple of hours. Finally, cycled back to London Fields and went for a swim. Now back home watching Champion's League on t'internet. London is the best.


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

Also, with few notable exceptions, most British towns and cities are cookie cutter brand infested homogenised shitholes. Every high street is nearly identical, Greggs, Costa, Boots, Starbucks, HMV, Holland and Barrett, Weatherspoons, Pizza Express, Odeon, Mc Donalds, Nandos, River Island, Weatherspoons, Pennys, Weatherspoons, and All Bar One.


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## bi0boy (May 28, 2016)

8den said:


> Also, with few notable exceptions, most British towns and cities are cookie cutter brand infested homogenised shitholes. Every high street is nearly identical, Greggs, Costa, Boots, Starbucks, HMV, Holland and Barrett, Weatherspoons, Pizza Express, Odeon, Mc Donalds, Nandos, River Island, Weatherspoons, Pennys, Weatherspoons, and All Bar One.



Most cities and towns have more to offer than a single street of familiar retail outlets.


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## Mr Retro (May 28, 2016)

davesgcr said:


> Lived in or around since 1979 , whilst commuting drags the spirit down , still an amazing city (and we should and are , no doubt. grateful that the London of 1982 or so - in deep physical and economic decline - has pulled around , smartened up and remains vibrant. Still lots of free and affordable things to do


We're going to The Globe in a few weeks for a Mid Summer Nights Dream and the tickets were a fiver. A fucking fiver for that experience? I've never been and I can't wait. I won't know what the fuck is going on mind, but that's not the point really for me.


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## FridgeMagnet (May 28, 2016)

I realised the other day that I'd stopped feeling attached to London at all. I used to be able to walk around anywhere, Mayfair, Holland Park, the City, and think "you may own these buildings but this is just as much my city as it is yours" but I don't feel that any more. When I hear about outrageous bullshit like the Heygate it makes me angry because it's outrageous bullshit that makes life miserable for people, but I don't feel anything special about it being in London.

All of the things that have happened, dying pubs and local businesses, rental prices and consequent constant movement, mass evictions and redevelopments, huge sudden changes in the nature of areas, they all contribute to alienation and division, and I guess they've worked. I'd leave London in a minute if it weren't for all the practical aspects. Nowadays it's just a city where I know how the public transport works.


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## 8den (May 28, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> Most cities and towns have more to offer than a single street of familiar retail outlets.



Hull? Luton? Swansea?


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## Ted Striker (May 28, 2016)

toblerone3 said:


> Kensington and Chelsea has become a virtual no go area for most of the people who post on these boards.  I can't remember there being an Urban drinks, for instance, in that area hardly ever, if at all.



It's not all bad!


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## Pickman's model (May 29, 2016)

FridgeMagnet said:


> I realised the other day that I'd stopped feeling attached to London at all. I used to be able to walk around anywhere, Mayfair, Holland Park, the City, and think "you may own these buildings but this is just as much my city as it is yours" but I don't feel that any more. When I hear about outrageous bullshit like the Heygate it makes me angry because it's outrageous bullshit that makes life miserable for people, but I don't feel anything special about it being in London.
> 
> All of the things that have happened, dying pubs and local businesses, rental prices and consequent constant movement, mass evictions and redevelopments, huge sudden changes in the nature of areas, they all contribute to alienation and division, and I guess they've worked. I'd leave London in a minute if it weren't for all the practical aspects. Nowadays it's just a city where I know how the public transport works.


tbh it wouldn't take you long to learn the public transport in e.g. toronto. it's just where you're used to, i suppose. if my numbers came in on the lottery i'd be off like a shot, which i wouldn't have said 5 or 10 years ago.


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## bi0boy (May 29, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> tbh it wouldn't take you long to learn the public transport in e.g. toronto. it's just where you're used to, i suppose. if my numbers came in on the lottery i'd be off like a shot, which i wouldn't have said 5 or 10 years ago.



When I visited I was all prepared to buy a smartcard to use on the metro only to find I had to buy a little metal token and toss it in a bucket held by a guy who looked like he was begging.


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## Pickman's model (May 29, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> When I visited I was all prepared to buy a smartcard to use on the metro only to find I had to buy a little metal token and toss it in a bucket held by a guy who looked like he was begging.


when i was there i got a one-week travelcard, all very easy.

when the numbers come up i'll move there. or malta.


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## dessiato (May 29, 2016)

Pickled Egg when I moved to Portugal I once was very critical of the town in which I lived and the country. I was told very clearly that if I didn't like it I could go back to where I came from.


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## agricola (May 29, 2016)

8den said:


> Also, with few notable exceptions, most British towns and cities are cookie cutter brand infested homogenised shitholes. Every high street is nearly identical, Greggs, Costa, Boots, Starbucks, HMV, Holland and Barrett, Weatherspoons, Pizza Express, Odeon, Mc Donalds, Nandos, River Island, Weatherspoons, Pennys, Weatherspoons, and All Bar One.



The damage that this does to towns cannot be overstated.  Wrexham used to have a vibrant high street and some great markets, but the Council - egged on by firms of the ilk to those listed above - destroyed it in favour of a series of slightly out-of-town shopping experiences, all of which have failed.  

That said though, on occasion it can be hilarious to see those firms fail.  My home town has had a Greggs for about two years now, but every time I have ever walked past it the place is empty - which shouldn't be a surprise because across the road is one of the best bakeries in the country, and slightly down the road is the best bakery in the country.  Whoever runs that branch must be losing a fortune.


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## 8den (May 29, 2016)

I'm not saying it's ubiquitous, Cardiff has a really lovely shopping district with great cafes, and Edinburgh and any number of towns. Nor is London immune. The same cookie cutter shops can be found in Wood Green, and Wimbledon high Street or Willesden Green.


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## ATOMIC SUPLEX (May 29, 2016)

At the turn of the century I knew people who lived in Kensington and Chelsea, Notting hill by the station, all over London in what were considered posh places, but not unaffordable. It could not be done now. In my 20s I rented a small flat to myself in stockwell. I doubt the kids are doing that these days.

As for Tokyo which I have visited once or twice a year for the past thirteen years. . . I used to rent flats in shinjuku instead of getting hotels. It was . . Even then, even on short term lets, cheaper than renting in london. . . And shinjuku is like being in frickin' Soho or something. 
My friends in Japan seem to have all the same political problems we have, but last time I looked the lending rates for mortgages were pretty good and houses were relatively cheap.


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## klang (May 29, 2016)

ATOMIC SUPLEX said:


> At the turn of the century I knew people who lived in Kensington and Chelsea, Notting hill by the station, all over London in what were considered posh places, but not unaffordable.


i rented a room in a flat share in powis square for 50£/week in '98/'99. unthinkable now....


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## mango5 (May 30, 2016)

Pickled Egg said:


> I hate to say it, but... London has become such a shit-hole.


seems to me you quite enjoy saying this



Pickled Egg said:


> As soon as I came back from Tokyo in March after not being there for almost 10 years, I realised London hadn't really advanced as a city as much as Tokyo had in any way shape or form. It's as if London's been stuck on pause. London has become a stale and stagnant city.


Could you give some examples of the kinds of advances you expected to have happened while you were away?





Pickled Egg said:


> Well obviously in 2002 it was still stupidly expensive - but look at the increase. Is this the road we really want to go down?


We? You haven't participated in this city in a decade. 


Pickled Egg said:


> Isn't it a shame university graduates can't even live in central London anymore?


Eh?
And why the obsession with property prices and tax evasion?


Pickled Egg said:


> The fact a lot of you laugh at Kensington & Chelsea, or don't even dare to step foot in that borough, means you agree with me.


Have you stepped out of that borough much?


Pickled Egg said:


> Coming back to London was incredibly depressing. I've never once come back home and felt my home city was much worse than where I was.


 Perhaps this says more about your expectations than what's happened in the city. 


Pickled Egg said:


> In all, as said before, this city, UNFORTUNATELY MY HOME CITY, has become one of the worst in the world, let alone Europe. London has become the dumping ground for the globally rich.


Perhaps you should go to a more advanced city that meets your standards.


editor said:


> Thank you for rising above them. I hope you stay and keep chatting. Be nice, posters ffs.


lol


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 30, 2016)

Having just got back from a night out in Leicester I have to conclude that London is indeed a dump. Leicester seems quite rundown, but the people were ace. Bloke on the bar seemed embarrassed that a pint was a fiver. That's cheaper than in the pub near my work...


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## DotCommunist (May 30, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Having just got back from a night out in Leicester I have to conclude that London is indeed a dump. Leicester seems quite rundown, but the people were ace. Bloke on the bar seemed embarrassed that a pint was a fiver. That's cheaper than in the pub near my work...


world class space research facility at the university as well. They probably built and designed stuff thats on the ISS


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 30, 2016)

DotCommunist said:


> world class space research facility at the university as well. They probably built and designed stuff thats on the ISS



Did see a sign for a space centre, worth visiting?


----------



## DotCommunist (May 30, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Did see a sign for a space centre, worth visiting?


I'm told its amazing, the soyuz alone is worth the time. I think its a seperate building to the research facility at the Uni though they do obviosly share staff and students


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 30, 2016)

Cool, might go back as I have a cousin who moved there from London ten years ago and he seems happy enough with his lot.


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## Pickman's model (May 30, 2016)

DotCommunist said:


> world class space research facility at the university as well. They probably built and designed stuff thats on the ISS


And just an hour by train from london


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## Greebo (May 30, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> And just an hour by train from london


The travel time is less a problem than the fare might be...


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## Dr. Furface (May 30, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Having just got back from a night out in Leicester I have to conclude that London is indeed a dump. Leicester seems quite rundown, but the people were ace. Bloke on the bar seemed embarrassed that a pint was a fiver. That's cheaper than in the pub near my work...


A fiver for a pint in Leicester!?  (what of?). Are they cashing in on their Premier League win or something!


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 30, 2016)

Dr. Furface said:


> A fiver for a pint in Leicester!?  (what of?). Are they cashing in on their Premier League win or something!



The bar was in the King Power stadium...


----------



## FridgeMagnet (May 30, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> tbh it wouldn't take you long to learn the public transport in e.g. toronto.


Also: Suddenly, there are capybaras all over Toronto | Toronto Star

No bloody capybaras in London  well not in the general run of things anyway.


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## ffsear (May 30, 2016)

Japan ?	This guy has been living on the moon surely ?


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## lefteri (May 30, 2016)

free spirit said:


> I thought London was a hugely overpriced shit hole in 2002 tbh.
> 
> eta though I'm pretty sure it had a lot better parties and club nights going on back then which were its main redeeming feature for me.



I would say the parties and club nights going on now are far better than those in 2002


----------



## lefteri (May 30, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Having just got back from a night out in Leicester I have to conclude that London is indeed a dump. Leicester seems quite rundown, but the people were ace. Bloke on the bar seemed embarrassed that a pint was a fiver. That's cheaper than in the pub near my work...



fiver a pint in leicester! hahahahaha, I bet he was embarrassed


----------



## mango5 (May 30, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Having just got back from a night out in Leicester I have to conclude that London is indeed a dump. Leicester seems quite rundown, but the people were ace. Bloke on the bar seemed embarrassed that a pint was a fiver. That's cheaper than in the pub near my work...


Leicester is nice. Not sure there's a useful comparison with (central?) London (pint prices) apart from your personal preference. Agreeing with the new troll puts  your assessment in an unflattering light.


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## FridgeMagnet (May 30, 2016)

lefteri said:


> I would say the parties and club nights going on now are far better than those in 2002


No way. I can disprove this with irrefutable Music Journalist Logic.

1. I was in my 20s in 2002.
2. Therefore clubs and music generally were much better.
3. However I was in my mid-to-late 20s so things were going downhill and definitely not as good as they were when I first had any drugs.


----------



## lefteri (May 30, 2016)

FridgeMagnet said:


> No way. I can disprove this with irrefutable Music Journalist Logic.
> 
> 1. I was in my 20s in 2002.
> 2. Therefore clubs and music generally were much better.
> 3. However I was in my mid-to-late 20s so things were going downhill and definitely not as good as they were when I first had any drugs.



mate, I was in my 20s in the early 90s, clubs were definitely better back then!


----------



## trashpony (May 30, 2016)

FridgeMagnet said:


> I realised the other day that I'd stopped feeling attached to London at all. I used to be able to walk around anywhere, Mayfair, Holland Park, the City, and think "you may own these buildings but this is just as much my city as it is yours" but I don't feel that any more. When I hear about outrageous bullshit like the Heygate it makes me angry because it's outrageous bullshit that makes life miserable for people, but I don't feel anything special about it being in London.
> 
> All of the things that have happened, dying pubs and local businesses, rental prices and consequent constant movement, mass evictions and redevelopments, huge sudden changes in the nature of areas, they all contribute to alienation and division, and I guess they've worked. I'd leave London in a minute if it weren't for all the practical aspects. Nowadays it's just a city where I know how the public transport works.


I used to think that the reason London didn't feel like mine any more was because I don't live there (even though I lived there for most of my life). But actually it has changed beyond all recognition in the last 10 years. I don't think it belongs to most of us anymore. It belongs to international investors.

I drove through London on New Year's Day this year and was at traffic lights in Aldgate. They were building new flats next to the road and on the banner it said that the guaranteed return on investment was X within y years. No one is even pretending the flats are housing any more. They're empty investment shells.


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## Artaxerxes (May 31, 2016)

8den said:


> Also, with few notable exceptions, most British towns and cities are cookie cutter brand infested homogenised shitholes. Every high street is nearly identical, Greggs, Costa, Boots, Starbucks, HMV, Holland and Barrett, Weatherspoons, Pizza Express, Odeon, Mc Donalds, Nandos, River Island, Weatherspoons, Pennys, Weatherspoons, and All Bar One.



Fried chicken shops, charity shops and "beauty" parlours appear to be the order of the day for those lucky enough to escape cookie cutter high streets, generally the more outlying high streets while the city centre and upmarket high streets are boredom central.


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 31, 2016)

Internet is also possibly harming London; you used to go to specific areas for specific things, but now buy them online. Been down Tottenham Court Road recently? Sofas not electricals are the big thing there now...


----------



## sim667 (May 31, 2016)

dessiato said:


> Pickled Egg when I moved to Portugal I once was very critical of the town in which I lived and the country. I was told very clearly that if I didn't like it I could go back to where I came from.



I've got a feeling the OP is remembering Tokyo with slightly rose tinted glasses.

Yes parts of it are very nice, but parts of it are also like stepping back into the 80's.


----------



## mango5 (May 31, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Internet is also possibly harming London; you used to go to specific areas for specific things, but now buy them online. Been down Tottenham Court Road recently? Sofas not electricals are the big thing there now...


Things change over time eh? Not sure where the harm is here.


----------



## hash tag (May 31, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Internet is also possibly harming London; you used to go to specific areas for specific things, but now buy them online. Been down Tottenham Court Road recently? Sofas not electricals are the big thing there now...



Have they got a sale on? 

Heals have been in TCR since 1820 ish?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 31, 2016)

mango5 said:


> Things change over time eh? Not sure where the harm is here.



The harm is that there is now no reason to go to TCR; in the past I would go there for stereo stuff, but you get that online now and so every other shop sells sofas, why would you bother? Just another area of town not worth going to, bland, boring, same old, same old, could be anywhere-ville. Camden's under threat of losing it's tat and oregano salesmen, music venues are closing at alarming rates, if you don't have a ton of cash London is no longer for you, I think that's harmful, you clearly don't. C'est la vie.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (May 31, 2016)

I don't know that the electrical shops in TCR specifically are a particularly big loss but the clustering of shops in various areas does add to the character of the city IMO. I do think it's a shame to see them replaced by more fairly indentikit food outlets.


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 31, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Have they got a sale on?
> 
> Heals have been in TCR since 1820 ish?



Of course they have a sale on, except the 2nd Thursday in October, that's double-sale day.

Seriously, every other shop there now sells sofas, who's buying all this crap?


----------



## hash tag (May 31, 2016)

Quickly refers to my calender, thats the 13th this year. I'll be there, not.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (May 31, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Seriously, every other shop there now sells sofas, who's buying all this crap?



God knows. I work near a particularly large and expensive looking one and it always seems to be totally empty. I've no idea how it keeps going.


----------



## mango5 (May 31, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> The harm is that there is now no reason to go to TCR; in the past I would go there for stereo stuff, but you get that online now and so every other shop sells sofas, why would you bother? Just another area of town not worth going to, bland, boring, same old, same old, could be anywhere-ville. Camden's under threat of losing it's tat and oregano salesmen, music venues are closing at alarming rates, if you don't have a ton of cash London is no longer for you, I think that's harmful, you clearly don't. C'est la vie.


Oh right. People who want stereo stuff don't have a place to shop around in town. People who want furniture do. I don't have much cash. I'm not really getting why shopping opportunities and central London house prices are the things people are despairing of.


----------



## sang_bleu (May 31, 2016)

Have you ever been to Shoreditch?


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## mango5 (May 31, 2016)

I worked on Curtain Road from 1994—1998 and been back fairly frequently ever since. I agree that neighbourhood has changed almost out of recognition including in some nauseating uber-consumer ways. But in other ways it's loads better. Let's talk about slightly less central areas, less focused on business /shopping. 
Any folk ready to condemn Archway, Kilburn, Tooting, for example?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 31, 2016)

mango5 said:


> I worked on Curtain Road from 1994—1998 and been back fairly frequently ever since. I agree that neighbourhood has changed almost out of recognition including in some nauseating uber-consumer ways. But in other ways it's loads better. Let's talk about slightly less central business /shopping areas.
> Any folk ready to condemn Archway, Kilburn, Tooting, for example?




Only every one in three shops in Hounslow High Street now sells handbags, rather than every other shop...


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## mango5 (May 31, 2016)

I remember when there were 3 greasy spoon caffs on South Molton Street in Mayfair, in the mid-70s. It's change to largely unaffordable designer clothing doesn't make me want to write London off. 
Many places like Shoreditch and Balham and Angel and Aldgate and Wandsworth etc etc were utter shitholes decades ago. They're very different now. Nasty fat cat 80s boom foreign investment notwithstanding. 
Some of us will weather the current changes and keep the place warm for the time when things change again.


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## Ponyutd (May 31, 2016)

Oliver Twist walked for seven days to get to London. 
If it's good enough for him, it's good enough for you whining lot.


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 31, 2016)

Ponyutd said:


> Oliver Twist walked for seven days to get to London.
> If it's good enough for him, it's good enough for you whining lot.



Dick Whittington, no?


----------



## 8den (May 31, 2016)

> London has become the dumping ground for the globally rich.



What a bizarre turn of phrase, like New York, Paris and Monaco got ABOS' out against billionaires.


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## Ponyutd (May 31, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Dick Whittington, no?


No Sir, the young Twist explains to Dodger he has walked seven days to get to London.


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## Bahnhof Strasse (May 31, 2016)

Ponyutd said:


> No Sir, the young Twist explains to Dodger he has walked seven days to get to London.



Where did he walk from that took seven days?


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## marty21 (May 31, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Where did he walk from that took seven days?


Very slowly from Margate .


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## Pickman's model (May 31, 2016)

mango5 said:


> I remember when there were 3 greasy spoon caffs on South Molton Street in Mayfair, in the mid-70s. It's change to largely unaffordable designer clothing doesn't make me want to write London off.
> Many places like Shoreditch and Balham and Angel and Aldgate and Wandsworth etc etc were utter shitholes decades ago. They're very different now. Nasty fat cat 80s boom foreign investment notwithstanding.
> Some of us will weather the current changes and keep the place warm for the time when things change again.


"The south will rise again"


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## newbie (May 31, 2016)

mango5 said:


> I remember when there were 3 greasy spoon caffs on South Molton Street in Mayfair, in the mid-70s. It's change to largely unaffordable designer clothing doesn't make me want to write London off.
> Many places like Shoreditch and Balham and Angel and Aldgate and Wandsworth etc etc were utter shitholes decades ago. They're very different now. Nasty fat cat 80s boom foreign investment notwithstanding.
> Some of us will weather the current changes and keep the place warm for the time when things change again.


hmm, maybe.  before TCR became the place to buy electronics it was the Edgware Rd (Henrys is still there, I think), which is now all shisha bars n stuff.   That sort of organic center of gravity shift tends to support your point, but then in opposition to it, Chapel Market at the Angel was a magnet of little workshops, mending things like sewing machines, while Balham was a perfectly ordinary, if dull, area for ordinary people.   Wandsworth, of course, has always been just a traffic jam surrounded by buildings: that's never changed and is never going to change, though there's not so many horses today.


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## dessiato (May 31, 2016)

When I was twenty one I worked in Soho. The wg where there from 8:30 til whenever. I used to eat lunch in Soho Square with them. You don't see the girls there like that any more. It's changed, but change is not always bad. Soho has become almost family friendly, some great places to eat and drink.


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## mango5 (May 31, 2016)

newbie said:


> hmm, maybe.  before TCR became the place to buy electronics it was the Edgware Rd (Henrys is still there, I think), which is now all shisha bars n stuff.   That sort of organic center of gravity shift tends to support your point, but then in opposition to it, Chapel Market at the Angel was a magnet of little workshops, mending things like sewing machines, while Balham was a perfectly ordinary, if dull, area for ordinary people.   Wandsworth, of course, has always been just a traffic jam surrounded by buildings: that's never changed and is never going to change, though there's not so many horses today.


Balham was a red light district where young families were advised to avoid living. I'm thinking of mid-70s to late 80s. In Wandsworth, Garret Lane isn't a shithole just run down and overlooked in favour of Wandsworth Town, Earlsfield etc. The bit near the heliport is no longer a shithole, but unlikely to attract the ire of this thread.  The bit of Angel I was thinking of is Essex Road and the top of City Road. Utterly transformed. 
My point is that areas change, tastes vary, and writing the whole of London off because of corporate colonisation of some bits in the middle is a sign of the kind of lazy London bashing which generates  a ludicrous universal truth that no one can be happy here - or even do more than survive - unless they're rich.


----------



## newbie (May 31, 2016)

mango5 said:


> Balham was a red light district where young families were advised to avoid living. I'm thinking of mid-70s to late 80s.


There were lots of squats in Balham in the 70s, I spent a lot of time there.  No-one ever said anything about red lights   But then, London was depopulating in those years, particularly young families heading off to MK and the like.

I agree with your main point btw.


----------



## Sirena (May 31, 2016)

mango5 said:


> I worked on Curtain Road from 1994—1998 and been back fairly frequently ever since. I agree that neighbourhood has changed almost out of recognition including in some nauseating uber-consumer ways. But in other ways it's loads better. Let's talk about slightly less central areas, less focused on business /shopping.
> Any folk ready to condemn Archway, Kilburn, Tooting, for example?



Tooting's all right.

Actually, it hasn't changed all that much.  A few new poshish eateries (nothing too expensive, though), a few new small wine bars, a few old pubs tarted up (mostly by Antic) and that's about it.

The whole 'little India' feel between Tooting Bec and Broadway is still solid and relatively unchanged.


----------



## Ponyutd (Jun 1, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Where did he walk from that took seven days?


Bahnhof Strasse It doesn't say where he came from only it took seven days walking to reach Barnet.
Weak from hunger plus it was winter. Fair play to him.


----------



## Winot (Jun 1, 2016)

trashpony said:


> I used to think that the reason London didn't feel like mine any more was because I don't live there (even though I lived there for most of my life). But actually it has changed beyond all recognition in the last 10 years. I don't think it belongs to most of us anymore. It belongs to international investors.
> 
> I drove through London on New Year's Day this year and was at traffic lights in Aldgate. They were building new flats next to the road and on the banner it said that the guaranteed return on investment was X within y years. No one is even pretending the flats are housing any more. They're empty investment shells.



Yeah that side of things has got worse recently and it's shit, but London is larger than that - it contains multitudes (population and the Whitman sense). There's still loads of ordinary bits with ordinary families going about their ordinary lives. And none the worse for that.

And some things are getting better. As I mentioned on the sofa thread, we cycled across Vauxhall bridge on Monday with an eight and 11-year-old to see some free art in Tate Britain. There are still loads of things you can do which are great and inexpensive and are unaffected by Chinese and Russian billionaires.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 1, 2016)

dessiato said:


> When I was twenty one I worked in Soho. The wg where there from 8:30 til whenever. I used to eat lunch in Soho Square with them. You don't see the girls there like that any more. It's changed, but change is not always bad. Soho has become almost family friendly, some great places to eat and drink.


And fuck all record shops


----------



## dessiato (Jun 1, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> And fuck all record shops


It was a great place back then. I still love Soho, but it's very different.


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## trashpony (Jun 1, 2016)

You're right of course Winot. When you move away, you really notice the speed of change though. I've only been gone 5 years and so many bits of London that I knew like the back of my hand have changed beyond all recognition.


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## jimbarkanoodle (Jun 1, 2016)

mango5 said:


> Balham was a red light district where young families were advised to avoid living. I'm thinking of mid-70s to late 80s. In Wandsworth, Garret Lane isn't a shithole just run down and overlooked in favour of Wandsworth Town, Earlsfield etc. The bit near the heliport is no longer a shithole, but unlikely to attract the ire of this thread.  The bit of Angel I was thinking of is Essex Road and the top of City Road. Utterly transformed.
> My point is that areas change, tastes vary, and writing the whole of London off because of corporate colonisation of some bits in the middle is a sign of the kind of lazy London bashing which generates  a ludicrous universal truth that no one can be happy here - or even do more than survive - unless they're rich.



Lived in a Camelot (kind of legal squat) in Balham until September last year. My father, born in Wandsworth off the high street, was almost aghast when i told him id moved to Balham, as it was, in his time, 'really dodgy' and a well renowned red light district.

I had to correct him that this was no longer anywhere near the truth! and just to prove it, a friends elder sister sold her 2 bed flat in the next road along from my abode for £800,000. 

Tooting is still not completely unaffordable (to rent that is), however good luck finding a decent value room in a house/flat share in the area, because as i found out you will likely be up against 25 other people who also want the room having seen it on 'spareroom.com'. 

rapidly falling out of love with London.


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## krtek a houby (Jun 1, 2016)

"Now you have to dish out £2million+ just to get a fucking matchbox piece of shit in Notting Hill. And who ends up affording that? The internationally rich."

Exaggeration.




Still pricey, mind.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jun 1, 2016)

sim667 said:


> I've got a feeling the OP is remembering Tokyo with slightly rose tinted glasses.
> 
> Yes parts of it are very nice, but parts of it are also like stepping back into the 80's.



This. Love the place but could never envisage living in Tokyo.


----------



## Reiabuzz (Jun 1, 2016)

Have to agree with every bit of the original post after being back a year or so. Really struggled to readjust to the sheer incompetence, rudeness and prices here. Bit of a shock to the system trying to get even the basics done such as finding a place to rent and God forbid getting a boiler fixed. Cue lazy tradesmen, dodgy estate agents and massive bills, only taking cash of course. Only back here because my other half was homesick, otherwise I'd still be back down in Asia.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jun 1, 2016)

Reiabuzz said:


> Have to agree with every bit of the original post after being back a year or so. Really struggled to readjust to the sheer incompetence, rudeness and prices here. Bit of a shock to the system trying to get even the basics done such as finding a place to rent and God forbid getting a boiler fixed. Cue lazy tradesmen, dodgy estate agents and massive bills, only taking cash of course. Only back here because my other half was homesick, otherwise I'd still be back down in Asia.



I will be in Japan this time next year - am scared about the transition but it will be nice to deal with people who are polite and not trying to rip you off. I love London but its no place to grow old in.


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## Reiabuzz (Jun 1, 2016)

It's quite a shock to the system when you get back and realise how much *everyone* is trying to fuck you over at every opportunity. I wasn't in Tokyo though but it sounds like a similar case. I think Londoners just think it's normal for this level of shitness. It's not.


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## pesh (Jun 2, 2016)

krtek a houby said:


> I will be in Japan this time next year - am scared about the transition but it will be nice to deal with people who are polite and not trying to rip you off.


i've got into far more trouble in Tokyo than i have ever managed in the UK. parts of Tokyo are fucking feral


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## Pickman's model (Jun 2, 2016)

Reiabuzz said:


> Have to agree with every bit of the original post after being back a year or so. Really struggled to readjust to the sheer incompetence, rudeness and prices here. Bit of a shock to the system trying to get even the basics done such as finding a place to rent and God forbid getting a boiler fixed. Cue lazy tradesmen, dodgy estate agents and massive bills, only taking cash of course. Only back here because my other half was homesick, otherwise I'd still be back down in Asia.


I wish you'd admit to doing inadequate research into workmen and estate agents because imo that's where part of the problem lies.


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## Artaxerxes (Jun 2, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> I wish you'd admit to doing inadequate research into workmen and estate agents because imo that's where part of the problem lies.



All estate agents deserve to roast on the pyre.


----------



## Pickman's model (Jun 2, 2016)

Artaxerxes said:


> All estate agents deserve to roast on the pyre.


no they don't. too good for them.


----------



## BigMoaner (Jun 6, 2016)

yeah, it's a bit shit, gets on my tits quite a bit, but i'm settle here. my parents are five minutes away, millwall 30 mins away, and millions of other things on my door step. schools are good. overall a good place to raise children, especially teenagers.

i've just come back from teh north, and whilst i loved a load of it, i still got that buzz when coming in off the A1.

london...it's addictive. part of me hates it, but another part of my thrives on it. i'd like to retire one day to 3 acres with a fishing lake on it, though.


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## BigMoaner (Jun 6, 2016)

few thigns worse in life than being stuck on the 432 with a man next to you eating six wings with gravy, in a traffic jam, with all the windows closed, and it's raining, and they've got to change drivers. that is NOT the Darlings Buds of May.


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## Greebo (Jun 6, 2016)

BigMoaner said:


> few thigns worse in life than being stuck on the 432 with a man next to you eating six wings with gravy, in a traffic jam, with all the windows closed, and it's raining, and they've got to change drivers. that is NOT the Darlings Buds of May.


Does that really happen every time you use the bus, or even most of the time?


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## mango5 (Jun 9, 2016)

I get fumes off chicken and chips elsewhere on the bus about once a week. I take buses almost every day, probably average 20 journeys each week. Late afternoon is probably the worst time.


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## bi0boy (Jun 9, 2016)

I'm surprised you're allowed to eat on buses tbh, it's banned in most places.


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## Artaxerxes (Jun 9, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> I'm surprised you're allowed to eat on buses tbh, it's banned in most places.



Your not meant to but noone gives a shit any more.


----------



## Greebo (Jun 9, 2016)

mango5 said:


> I get fumes off chicken and chips elsewhere on the bus about once a week. I take buses almost every day, probably average 20 journeys each week. Late afternoon is probably the worst time.


It's mainly children & teenagers eating on the way home...


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## Pickman's model (Jun 9, 2016)

BigMoaner said:


> few thigns worse in life than being stuck on the 432 with a man next to you eating six wings with gravy, in a traffic jam, with all the windows closed, and it's raining, and they've got to change drivers. that is NOT the Darlings Buds of May.


Do you know how hard it is to ensure that happens to you so frequently?


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## Pickman's model (Jun 9, 2016)

BigMoaner said:


> yeah, it's a bit shit, gets on my tits quite a bit, but i'm settle here. my parents are five minutes away, millwall 30 mins away, and millions of other things on my door step. schools are good. overall a good place to raise children, especially teenagers.
> 
> i've just come back from teh north, and whilst i loved a load of it, i still got that buzz when coming in off the A1.
> 
> london...it's addictive. part of me hates it, but another part of my thrives on it. i'd like to retire one day to 3 acres with a fishing lake on it, though.


I'm sure the queen would have something to say about you taking over St james park


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## mango5 (Jun 10, 2016)

Greebo said:


> It's mainly children & teenagers eating on the way home...


It would be easy to think that, but I deliberately avoided suggesting school chucking out time as at least half the chicken munchers I encounter are women between 25 and 50. Perhaps a quarter are similar aged men. Just a rough estimate.


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## moon (Jun 10, 2016)

London and SE London in particular can be great when there aren't huge low flying super jets screeching overhead every minute or so..
My peaceful neighbourhood has now been trashed due to Heathrow bosses decision to change and concentrate flight paths to the south east of London..
Its quite shocking really..


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## DJWrongspeed (Jun 15, 2016)

London is getting better with it's first Quietway route =>

Quietway No.1


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## krtek a houby (Jun 15, 2016)

pesh said:


> i've got into far more trouble in Tokyo than i have ever managed in the UK. parts of Tokyo are fucking feral



Really? I've not really experienced much dodginess in Tokyo. Apart from rowdy drunk Westerners and a few local lads shoplifting...

I have, however, had shop assistants run after me when I have forgotten my change and have been bought drinks by friendly locals in the East End of Tokyo...


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