# My Xbox 360 has died



## Kid_Eternity (Jan 15, 2009)

Just walked in the door, thought I'd pop a DVD on or play something to unwind (long fucking train journey home tonight from Bristol) and pushed the disc tray button. Nothing. Me now  Push the power button. Nothing. Me then  Switched plugs round and nothing. Me now 

Gonna prize the fucking plug open and see if changing the switch does something but I'm not hopeful. Fucked off, only had the damn thing two weeks! Also, there's a fucking game in the disc drive.

So, practical advice, will MS replace it and give me my game back? I bought this from Argos, still have receipt but something tells me them swapping it for another one wont mean the game being got too.

Help!


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## pk (Jan 15, 2009)

Buy a Wii or something else next time... as long as it doesn't say Microsoft on the box.



Only kidding - but don't open the fucker until you've at least tried to take it back.

Try it in a plug socket you know that works after changing the use in the plug too. Sometimes helps.


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## tarannau (Jan 15, 2009)

Bad luck mate. I'd like to sound surprised, but you're just another tick on the great big list of xbox returnees. It's a poor quality product.

You takes your cheap console, forgive it the noise and gamble. Pricewise it's good, but the record of reliability shows scant respect for the consumer. The best you can say is that they've a well established returns policy.


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## tarannau (Jan 15, 2009)

BTW, details of a manual (paperclip push) eject here:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/817396

Worth a try


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 15, 2009)

tarannau said:


> BTW, details of a manual (paperclip push) eject here:
> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/817396
> 
> Worth a try



Cheers. Yeah I realised it was a risk but two weeks??  

Seriously tempted to dump the fucking thing and get a PS3.


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## pk (Jan 15, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Cheers. Yeah I realised it was a risk but two weeks??
> 
> Seriously tempted to dump the fucking thing and get a PS3.



Wait long enough and Sony will dump fucking Microsoft and start building some useful computers....


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 15, 2009)

pk said:


> Wait long enough and Sony will dump fucking Microsoft and start building some useful computers....



You know you're anti MS crusade really isn't helpful here.


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## tarannau (Jan 16, 2009)

Better it turned out to be a lemon now rather than later tbh. Still sucks mind, but probability's against you more with the xbox than any other console in living memory. 

I'm not as inclined as others to be forgiving. If it works, it's cheap and noisy, an excellent online multiplayer. And then it busts, leaving you sucked in; with games and inclined to give another new xbox a roll of the dice. I just get to watch the various clan members around here return their faulty xboxes from time to time and cross their fingers in hope, hear the frustration. Not sure I want to buy into the shonky full xbox experience, but the price is a big temptation.


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## pk (Jan 16, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> You know you're anti MS crusade really isn't helpful here.



It is serving as a warning for others tempted to purchase an X-Box.

You've had it since Xmas, right? 

So it's still under guarantee (unless it was a Woolworths job).

Just return it and get a refund, then buy a decent machine like a Wii or a Playstation.

Job done.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

pk said:


> It is serving as a warning for others tempted to purchase an X-Box.
> 
> You've had it since Xmas, right?
> 
> ...



I bought it two weeks ago from Argos. I can't just swap it because it has a game in it (fiddling with the tray now) just yet. I already have a Wii.


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## The Groke (Jan 16, 2009)

How to eject a stuck disk with a paperclip or indeed here

Once that is done, I would push for Argos to swap it, rather than sending the thing to MS.

Make sure you re-pack it properly and don't take no for an answer.

Sorry you are having problems - it is a drag I know and I have been most fortunate in being one of the three people on the planet never to have any issues with my 360 - it is over 3 years old now and still going strong!

Still - reliability issues aside, it is still the best games console out there at the moment IMO.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

Cheers for the advice and suggestions, very much appreciated.

There's a small silver lining here, I happened to check my games boxes last night and realised there's no disc in it! I had a DVD in it but took it out with me the other day (thank fuck because it's from a boxset that doesn't belong to me!!)! 

Gonna pack the thing up, I have the box and all the bits to do it properly, tomorrow morning and take it back to Argos.

According to Argos' site I should be covered for a replacement (the lady did say when I bought it that they don't refund on this item, prolly due to the high levels of returns):



> If there's a fault with the product...
> 
> We've made it easier!
> 
> ...


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## Crispy (Jan 16, 2009)

sounds like the power supply to me, if nothing responds - is the little amber light on?


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

Crispy said:


> sounds like the power supply to me, if nothing responds - is the little amber light on?



Didn't think to check...will have a look later.


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 16, 2009)

Get.a.refund.and.get.a.PS3.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> Get.a.refund.and.get.a.PS3.



Argos.Don't.Do.Refunds.On.Xbox360s.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 16, 2009)

Gutted  

Odd failure though.. normally it's the RROD or DVD drive. Assume you've done the 'unplug everything then plug it back in' option?


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 16, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> Get.a.refund.and.get.a.PS3.



Spend.twice.as.much.and.be.unable.to.play.loads.of.a.grade.titles.


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 16, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Argos.Don't.Do.Refunds.On.Xbox360s.


you just said that they did:

_If there's a fault with the product...

We've made it easier!

* If you bring it back to us within 30 days with your proof of purchase*, we'll give you a
replacement *or a refund.* _


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> you just said that they did:
> 
> _If there's a fault with the product...
> 
> ...



When I bought it the lady said they don't do refunds on the Xbox360 (I'm sure I mentioned this somewhere above)...


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> Gutted
> 
> Odd failure though.. normally it's the RROD or DVD drive. Assume you've done the 'unplug everything then plug it back in' option?



Yep, even going to buy a fuse today just to make sure it's not a blown fuse...


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## Chester Copperpot (Jan 16, 2009)

If the product is faulty they will give you a refund.  Just had to take a phone back to argos after three weeks. Didn't even have a receipt. I just told them which till I paid at and they traced my debit card details for proof of purchase.


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 16, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> When I bought it the lady said they don't do refunds on the Xbox360 (I'm sure I mentioned this somewhere above)...



The fuckers tried to pull a similar thing with me on replacing a phone when i bought the missus a mobile, despite the fact that i had specifically asked whether i could change it within 14 days and being told that i could.

It took some arguing but in the end they caved in and i was able to change it. I've generally avoided Argos like the plague ever since.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 16, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Argos.Don't.Do.Refunds.On.Xbox360s.


Irrelevant. Consumer Law trumps Argos, despite whatever noises they might make.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 16, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Yep, even going to buy a fuse today just to make sure it's not a blown fuse...



What a pain  Sorry mate. Don't give up hope though, isn't it something like 20% fail in the first year of ownership... means 80% don't fail!


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 16, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> Spend.twice.as.much.and.be.unable.to.play.loads.of.a.grade.titles.


Own.a.cutting.edge.machine.with.cool.spec.and.decent.games.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> What a pain  Sorry mate. Don't give up hope though, isn't it something like 20% fail in the first year of ownership... means 80% don't fail!



Heh yeah. But, if the next one dies in anything under three months the fuckers going and I'm getting a PS3.


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## tommers (Jan 16, 2009)

A few points...

1.  Get Argos to replace it.  If you send it back to Microsoft then it takes 2-3 weeks, you have to box it up yourself and wait in on 2 days for UPS to collect it and then return it to you, and they usually give you a "refurbished" console rather than a new one.  (Trust me, I fucking know.)

2.  The pain gets easier.  Which is just as well really.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 16, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> Own.a.cutting.edge.machine.with.cool.spec.and.decent.games.



What's.the.point.in.owning.a.Ferrari.when.you.can.only.drive.it.in.central.london.traffic?

Might.as.well.go.for.the.TVR.that.can.drive.anywhere.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 16, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Heh yeah. But, if the next one dies in anything under three months the fuckers going and I'm getting a PS3.



Yeah, more than fair enough. Just hope your PS3 DVD drive doesn't break


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## tommers (Jan 16, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> What a pain  Sorry mate. Don't give up hope though, isn't it something like 20% fail in the first year of ownership... means 80% don't fail!



wow, I'm in the top 4% for something!


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 16, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> What's.the.point.in.owning.a.Ferrari.when.you.can.only.drive.it.in.central.london.traffic?
> 
> Might.as.well.go.for.the.TVR.that.can.drive.anywhere.


shouldn't.you.be.off.rambling.or.something?oh.wait.you.already.are.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> What's.the.point.in.owning.a.Ferrari.when.you.can.only.drive.it.in.central.london.traffic?
> 
> Might.as.well.go.for.the.TVR.that.can.drive.anywhere.



Ok fun as that was, let's leave it for another thread eh? 



ChrisFilter said:


> Yeah, more than fair enough. Just hope your PS3 DVD drive doesn't break



Yeah, don't want to though, was thoroughly enjoying the 360 and looking forward to getting online and playing some games with you guys...


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## dlx1 (Jan 16, 2009)

Don't fuck about with MS go start back to shop I did get new one. keep moaning for discount for a game or ask for full money back.

Go buy xbox from some were else once you got money back if they don't play.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

Tried changing the fuse, even though apparently you can't get 10am fuses anywhere only 9 or 13, and nothing...


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## Sunray (Jan 16, 2009)

if a fuse blows on low power electronics, its never the fuse thats at fault, 10amp at 240v would mean the device sucked 200amps at 12volts to blow the fuse, suffice to say its utterly fucked.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 16, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Tried changing the fuse, even though apparently you can't get 10am fuses anywhere only 9 or 13, and nothing...


Just take it back. They can't turn you away.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 16, 2009)

Awesome Wells said:


> Just take it back. They can't turn you away.



Yep, doing that tomorrow, just wanted to be sure it's definitely dead.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 17, 2009)

Argos cunts tried to palm me off with a line about sending it off for repair. I gave the a fucking ear full and they replaced it right there.

Going home now to hook it up, fingers crossed this one lasts!


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 17, 2009)

Them 'offering to send it off' is a bit of a grey area I think as shops are supposed to facilitate either a replacement or refund; whatever is the most expedient and effective. I think in some respects they can actually get away with this. Of course, as discovered, kicking off is the way to go.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 17, 2009)

Awesome Wells said:


> Them 'offering to send it off' is a bit of a grey area I think as shops are supposed to facilitate either a replacement or refund; whatever is the most expedient and effective. I think in some respects they can actually get away with this. Of course, as discovered, kicking off is the way to go.



Well when I bought it the check out woman said they only replace it not refund, and I said here in the shop and she said yes. I repeated this to the idiot smirking twat at the returns desk and she said 'who said that' to which I  and repeated. She then said 'what she meant was-' and I cut her off saying 'I'm sorry but that wasn't clear, I was told before paying that you would replace it in store if there was a problem, there was nothing about it being sent for repair'. And she went round the corner to speak to her supervisor then issued a replacement.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 17, 2009)

Replacements always supersede refunds, which is only fair i suppose; the question is whether a replacement equates sending it off for repair. I'd never send a console to M$ to repair personally; when my 'preowned' broken down i took it back to gamestation who just gave me a new one. DOn't know what will happen once their one year in store preowned guarantee bollocks expires though. Probably my tough shit.


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 17, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Argos cunts tried to palm me off with a line about sending it off for repair. I gave the a fucking ear full and they replaced it right there.
> 
> Going home now to hook it up, fingers crossed this one lasts!


g'luck with your new unit matey


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 18, 2009)

Cheers Paulie. *feels like he's in Goodfellas saying that*


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## mattie (Jan 19, 2009)

I'm almost certain you could have demanded a refund, it seems symptomatic of the box-shifters like argos and currys etc. to try to fob people off.  

Some details on it here - seems the question of reasonable time is open to interpretation

http://www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/consumers/fact-sheets/page38311.html

As others have said, more work than don't, so hopefully you'll now have one of the decent ones!


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## tarannau (Jan 19, 2009)

To be fair, you can't really blame companies for trying to be a little shonky when you've got to carry the costs of storing and returning a mere 20% and more of stock. The manufacturer have released a dud here, with the retailers left with a bundle of defective products to faff around with. 

Hardly as if you go shopping in Argos for exemplary customer service, is it mind.


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## The Groke (Jan 19, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> Own.a.cutting.edge.machine.with.cool.spec.and.decent.games.



At the risk of getting in to another boring Xbox Vs 360 fan-boy bun-fight...

Reliability issues (and yes, they are a real and painful issue) and Bluray functionality aside, The Xbox has proved time and again that it is the better machine as far as gaming power is concerned.

Now maybe this is still because developers are struggling to wring the full potential out of the PS3, but perhaps Sony should have thought of that when they designed the thing.

With a few notable exceptions, pretty much every cross platform release looks better and runs better on the Xbox 360 and without a mandatory install either. 

The Xbox still has the best games library too and the best (for my taste) system exclusives.

With the exception of God of War 3 (which I am drooling over already) and _possibly_ the new Drake game, I can't think of a single PS3 exclusive coming out in the next 12 months which has me even remotely interested. I will almost certainly buy any cross-platform releases on my Xbox too - unless something fundamental shifts in the quality of PS3 ports in comparison to the Xbox.

Don't get me wrong - I love my Bluray player, but the thing seems to get less and less usage as a games console as time goes on.


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## mattie (Jan 19, 2009)

tarannau said:


> To be fair, you can't really blame companies for trying to be a little shonky when you've got to carry the costs of storing and returning a mere 20% and more of stock. The manufacturer have released a dud here, with the retailers left with a bundle of defective products to faff around with.
> 
> Hardly as if you go shopping in Argos for exemplary customer service, is it mind.



It's shitty for all concerned, sadly the only option would be for argos to tell MS to do one and refuse to stock it until they sort out quality issues.

I'd be interested to hear how much a returned product costs the retailer in terms of faff, and whether they pass that on to the manufacturer.  Well, slightly curious in a nosy way at least.


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## mattie (Jan 19, 2009)

Swarfega said:


> At the risk of getting in to another boring Xbox Vs 360 fan-boy bun-fight...
> 
> Reliability issues (and yes, they are a real and painful issue) and Bluray functionality aside, The Xbox has proved time and again that it is the better machine as far as gaming power is concerned.
> 
> ...



I'm looking forward to getting metal gear solid, that was my favourite game on the original PS.  I'd have liked gears of war, but I'll live with the other FPS games.

I don't think there's too much in the gameplay, I've played on both and struggle to see much difference - I'd think TV and hi-fi quality have a greater effect.  It could be certain games aren't ported that well which I've yet to try.

I'd argue that the Xbox currently has the greater share of developer effort, thus digging into the amount of resource that can be put into optimising for the PS3 - how that might change as the PS3 market develops I don't know (assuming that it does develop).  Sony's only significant fault was not being first to market, MS got there but are now paying quite a price with a physically flawed machine.  Thankfully it's MS paying it, Kid_Eternity and others have at least got (touch wood) working boxes.

The two consoles are at different stages in their life cycles, I'll be interested to see where the PS3 goes over the coming year or so.

I'm also not really bothered by the mandatory install, it's only the once and as far as I gather that's more to do with on-line updating than anything else - certainly it downloaded some bits and pieces for Drake, Mirror's Edge and Farcry.

My biggest pisser with it is that I can't get ITV catch-up to work as it thinks the PS3 is a mobile phone!  Does the Xbox have this problem as well?


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 19, 2009)

tarannau said:


> To be fair, you can't really blame companies for trying to be a little shonky when you've got to carry the costs of storing and returning a mere 20% and more of stock. The manufacturer have released a dud here, with the retailers left with a bundle of defective products to faff around with.
> 
> Hardly as if you go shopping in Argos for exemplary customer service, is it mind.



Fuck them. If they don't like it they shouldn't stock it.


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## DarthSydodyas (Jan 19, 2009)

Hope mine dies and they replace it with an elite.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 20, 2009)

My elite is dying as we speak. I get intermittent moments of green ring joy followed by thre red rings for a couple of hours. If this goes back to the shop (where, sods law, it will work of course) i will want either a refund or a ps3 instead. No bloody way i'm putting up with more of Microsofts crap.


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## tarannau (Jan 20, 2009)

A mate went through his third in a couple of years yesterday, the red ring of death glowing. The swear words were quite choice.

He's a huge xbox fan, with over 40 games, so there's not really much option for him. But don't get sucked in kids.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 20, 2009)

mine was bought 'preowned' from gamestation. My concern is that the shop guarantee ends in march; if they replace it again (which they were very good about before) this will be three consoles i've used - all elites; what's worse is that if it goes down after march i'm left with a £250 doorstop. (Preowned shouldn't really make a difference either; the item was bought legitimately from a retailer.)


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## tarannau (Jan 20, 2009)

Well, fourth time lucky eh.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 20, 2009)

i don't want to give M$ another chance at this point; it's not worth it for me at all. Sod's law that as soon as the warranty from gamestation expires, so will the box.


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## tarannau (Jan 20, 2009)

Don't get me wrong: I don't think anyone should give MS their money for the Xbox. They're taking the piss out of the consumer and using their ill-gotten cash reserves to prop up a faulty product in the hope of breaking another market. It's a crap product released by wankers in the main. I'm slightly sad that they're beginning to turn around that nearly billion dollar loss on the Xbox division - they deserved a hefty hit for the shit product.

Trouble is, once you've got sucked in it's tough to leave your games and accessories behind. I wouldn't recommend anyone purchase an Xbox to begin with that in mind, nor ever recommend the faulty pieces of shit to anyone.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 20, 2009)

The shop gave me a brand new (ie completely different) preowned elite. I wanted to swap it for a ps3 but they decided that wasn't allowed. However i did persuade them to give me a new one year shop guarantee. Only loss is the 12 hours saved of Oblivion which I don't relish doing again. Maybe they've patched gears 2 in the meantime and I can play that instead? No? What a surprise.

Curiously they would only honour a trade in toward a ps3; that is they offered me a 'refund' equal to the trade in value of an elite (£180). According to them (which i dispute) when it comes to refunds they don't have to honour the amount _paid_ because the item has had some use in the meantime and has also depreciated. This sound like balls to me as that's not what I paid and it aint the customer's fault that things depreciate and break down.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 21, 2009)

Oh Tarannau 

To those of you that have problem after problem, where do you put your 360? Is it flat, or on it's end? Is it on carpet or on a TV stand or similar? Is it in little cubby hole, or does it have room to be breathe?

From what I can see, the people who's 360s break, have repeated breaks.


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## tommers (Jan 21, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> Oh Tarannau
> 
> To those of you that have problem after problem, where do you put your 360? Is it flat, or on it's end? Is it on carpet or on a TV stand or similar? Is it in little cubby hole, or does it have room to be breathe?
> 
> From what I can see, the people who's 360s break, have repeated breaks.



that's because Microsoft replace them with "refurbished" models.

My Xbox was stood on its end, by the side of the TV cabinet on the wooden floor, with nothing covering the ventilation holes.  It was about a foot away from the end of the radiator, which may have been a factor.. but then so is my telly and Sky+ which have both been fine for the past however long.

And that still doesn't explain the massive failure rates... it might explain the odd one or two but not 20%.

You're victim blaming.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 21, 2009)

Indeed although the failure rate is higher I think. Mine was on its side, with nothing near it on the tv shelf...


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## tarannau (Jan 21, 2009)

About 30% seems to be the general estimate, although MS won't of course release the info. The most generous put current returns at 16%, with the rate likely to rise further, this warranty company believing that they'll see worse. This compares to a historical console failure rate of about 3%-4%, which is about what the wii and ps3 are currently returning at. More details from the geeks at Arstechnica here:
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080214-xbox-360-failure-rates-worse-than-most-consumer-electornics.html

It's fortunate that MS has such deep pockets to cover returns and extend the warranty period to try and give some confidence. But the faults with this processor platform and heat were well known - MS seems to have released the console with high fail rates virtually assured, gambling that tying customers in and first mover advantage would outweigh reliability for the buyer. Pretty shitty behaviour really, using massive cash reserves to buy your way into a market. You can't blame the users for their shoddy products failing.


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## Awesome Wells (Jan 22, 2009)

Mine was flat, on top of a volcano and next to my personal woodchipper. What?


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

tommers said:


> You're victim blaming.



No.. just wondering if there's a reason why people who have one that fail seem to have several that fail.

The simple fact of the matter is that they shouldn't fail, so I'm hardly blaming the victim for wondering if there's a common factor to the failures.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

tarannau said:


> About 30% seems to be the general estimate, although MS won't of course release the info. The most generous put current returns at 16%, with the rate likely to rise further, this warranty company believing that they'll see worse. This compares to a historical console failure rate of about 3%-4%, which is about what the wii and ps3 are currently returning at. More details from the geeks at Arstechnica here:
> http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080214-xbox-360-failure-rates-worse-than-most-consumer-electornics.html
> 
> It's fortunate that MS has such deep pockets to cover returns and extend the warranty period to try and give some confidence. But the faults with this processor platform and heat were well known - MS seems to have released the console with high fail rates virtually assured, gambling that tying customers in and first mover advantage would outweigh reliability for the buyer. Pretty shitty behaviour really, using massive cash reserves to buy your way into a market. You can't blame the users for their shoddy products failing.



If you put as much effort into things other than hating MS, you could be ruling the world by now


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 22, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> No.. just wondering if there's a reason why people who have one that fail seem to have several that fail.
> 
> The simple fact of the matter is that they shouldn't fail, so I'm hardly blaming the victim for wondering if there's a common factor to the failures.


There is a common factor though -  Xboxes are shite. 

The end


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> There is a common factor though -  Xboxes are shite.
> 
> The end



"Xboxes are better gaming machines than the PS3. They just break far, far too often."

that's better


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 22, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> "Xboxes are better gaming machines than the PS3. They just break far, far too often."
> 
> that's better


Strange dichotomy between your understanding of what _"better"_ means and mine there in this context CF. 

I take better to mean, _"I switch on my console, select a game and play it for a while"_, not sit there looking at my red ring and the stack of games that i can't play anymore.


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## tarannau (Jan 22, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> If you put as much effort into things other than hating MS, you could be ruling the world by now



Not hate, but you've got to say it's hardly the actions of a company that gives a shit about its customers. I sympathise with those tied into the xbox system, but I'm sure as hell not going to recommend the console to new punters with their antics in mind.

It's a shit product and you know it. It's nearly scandalous to release something roughly ten times more likely to fail than competitor products and other consoles - it's a tale of ineptness a bit like GM's Corsair, although fortunately it's a bit harder to crash a console and die. They've only had to put aside a mere billion to cover returns and accept massive divisional losses for years, which ain't exactly signs of a particularly fair competitor with a good product.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

It is very, very shit that it breaks so much.

Which is a shame.

As it is a very, very good games console.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> I take better to mean, _"I switch on my console, select a game and play it for a while"_, not sit there looking at my red ring and the stack of games that i can't play anymore.



Never had a red ring. Dunno what you're on about! Game of Halo or Gears of War later?


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## mwgdrwg (Jan 22, 2009)

Reliability aside, it is the BEST games console.


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## mwgdrwg (Jan 22, 2009)

In the last week I have had hours and hours of fun playing Halo, Gears, Fable, Street Fighter II HD, Left 4 Dead....you just haven't got that kind of quality on PS3.


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## Addy (Jan 22, 2009)

Fucking Fan Boi spats 

PS3 is superior in hardware and capabilities cause PS3 is a next gen console, but it hasn't been utilised fully yet in the games world.
Suffers from a small % of Blueray drive failures.

Xbox360 has great capabilities for a last gen console and has been fully utilised and has a fantastic game collection.
Suffers from a significant % of overheating failures.

Both are completely different to each other and shouldn't be judged against each other.

I'm not a fan of either as I prefer to play games via PC, but you cant get this on your PS3.......


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## elbows (Jan 22, 2009)

Addy said:


> Xbox360 has great capabilities for a last gen console and has been fully utilised and has a fantastic game collection.
> Suffers from a significant % of overheating failures.
> 
> Both are completely different to each other and shouldn't be judged against each other.



Not sure I agree, I know the Xbox360 came out well before the PS3 but they are both of the same generation of consoles.

I quite wanted to jump from 360 to PS3 but the PS3 games did not interest me so I shall stick to 360.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

Addy said:


> Fucking Fan Boi spats



You must have missed the other 500 threads where me and tarranau and latterly paulie all argue for the sake of it. I couldn't give a fuck which is the better console!


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## Addy (Jan 22, 2009)

elbows said:


> Not sure I agree, I know the Xbox360 came out well before the PS3 but they are both of the same generation of consoles.
> 
> 
> 
> I quite wanted to jump from 360 to PS3 but the PS3 games did not interest me so I shall stick to 360.




The hardware in the PS3 is way more superior than the 360.
Its like comparing a Pentium 3 CPU to a Pentium 4
360's were out on 2005, PS3's came out 3 years later.
Tottaly a different generation of console IMO.

I know what your saying Chris, I've wittnessed it and not got involved cause its all bollox.

FWIW I think the Wii is a fantastic console yet others will slate it but who really gives a fuck?
Its all personal preferance.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

Addy said:


> The hardware in the PS3 is way more superior than the 360.
> Its like comparing a Pentium 3 CPU to a Pentium 4
> 360's were out on 2005, PS3's came out 3 years later.
> Tottaly a different generation of console IMO.



And the ps3 still loses out, head to head.

So when's MS answer the PS3 coming out then? Or are the generations too muddled now?

The 360 has at least 2 years left in it... not much more for the PS3 I wouldn't have thought.

For me, they're the same gen. Sony just got it's priorities wrong.


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## Addy (Jan 22, 2009)

TBH I dont think any developer had even scratched the surface of the PS3's capabilities......yet.
Sony's biggest downfall is the price of the console.
If it was priced in the same legue as the 360 then I think it would be a more houshold product and software developers would pay more interest.

I'm not saying by any means that the 360 is a poor console (failures aside) I just reckon the PS3 has a longer lifespan and there are possibilities to make some fantastic games. (eye candy for those who need it)

Myself, I prefer the playabillity and addictiveness of a game over graphics any day..... s'all personal preferance


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

But then if MS release an Xbox 720 with backwards compatability then the PS3 hasn't got a hope in hell when it comes to eye candy.


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## Addy (Jan 22, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> But then if MS release an Xbox 720 with backwards compatability then the PS3 hasn't got a hope in hell when it comes to eye candy.


 
Agree'd, but that would be a console built from a different generation of hardware. (and there isn't one yet so its speculation)

Sony also has a slight edge in the PS3/PSP intergration along with free online gaming... and also free multiple downloads of paid for software (account driven), whereas if your 360 got RROD or a H/D failure you would still have to re-purchase any downloaded content.

Like I said, there 2 seperate entities and cant really be compared as they both have a fair list of pro's and con's.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 22, 2009)

Addy said:


> Sony also has a slight edge in the PS3/PSP intergration along with free online gaming... and also free multiple downloads of paid for software (account driven), whereas if your 360 got RROD or a H/D failure you would still have to re-purchase any downloaded content.



Yes re: psp

hmm re: free gaming (I'd rather pay a minimal amount for a decent service than have a free sub-par service)

no re: having to repurchase. I sold my first 360 a year ago. I got a new one for xmas, and all my purchased stuff was available to download for free.


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## Addy (Jan 22, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> no re: having to repurchase. I sold my first 360 a year ago. I got a new one for xmas, and all my purchased stuff was available to download for free.


 
I stand corrected 
Never purchased anything online


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## tommers (Jan 22, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> No.. just wondering if there's a reason why people who have one that fail seem to have several that fail.
> 
> The simple fact of the matter is that they shouldn't fail, so I'm hardly blaming the victim for wondering if there's a common factor to the failures.



the big smiley face was a clue to how serious I was. 

anyway, just looked and it's back on Monday so I'll see you on the football pitch then...


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## mattie (Jan 22, 2009)

Jesus wept.

Both are good.  Fucking hell.


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 23, 2009)

Addy said:


> Fucking Fan Boi spats


that comment made me laugh my socks off!! 




literally?!


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 23, 2009)

mattie said:


> Jesus wept.
> 
> Both are good.  Fucking hell.



You've totally missed the point.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 23, 2009)

I thought my 360 had died last night, I did have a chuckle to myself. Anyway, turns out my Mrs had unseated the HDD during a fight with the TV aerial. Once I'd seated it properly it booted without a problem.

"Typical" I thought... and probably well deserved.

Then I beat Everton 2-0, at Goodison, in the semi-final of the FA Cup as Leicester... I was so happy I nearly shed a tear.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 23, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> And the ps3 still loses out, head to head.
> 
> So when's MS answer the PS3 coming out then? Or are the generations too muddled now?
> 
> ...



Well...I see the 360 and PS3 as part of the same generation in the same way the Dreamcast and PS2 where...

In terms of the 360's life expectancy I'd seriously doubt it's stopping any time soon. 

MS have said they have no plans for another console yet, the Wii just can't be caught but isn't the same type of competition (360 is big online experience, great graphics, traditional console gaming) and the PS3 is just getting going. I'd wager the 360 will have something like a 6/7 year peak life with a 10 or so over all. I reckon MS are going to keep refining it, add to it to extend it's life (MS are rumoured to be looking at releasing the PVR and freeview extension at somepoint in the next 18 months) etc..


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 23, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> MS have said they have no plans for another console yet



Well, not quite, they've said they'll release a new console in 2011/12.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 23, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> Well, not quite, they've said they'll release a new console in 2011/12.



Really? I'll have to find the article but I read the other day they haven't even started looking at it yet and have no release date in mind...


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 23, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> Really? I'll have to find the article but I read the other day they haven't even started looking at it yet and have no release date in mind...



Very non-specific interview.. he just said it'll probably be around then, and that right now all they're really doing is sussing out what processing power will be available then.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 23, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> Very non-specific interview.. he just said it'll probably be around then, and that right now all they're really doing is sussing out what processing power will be available then.



Oh right...well I think they'd be mad to be too clear on their future plans.


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## mattie (Jan 24, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> You've totally missed the point.



Sorry, there's a deeper point buried in all this sniping?  It's very well hidden.


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## tommers (Jan 24, 2009)

mattie said:


> Sorry, there's a deeper point buried in all this sniping?  It's very well hidden.



It's an illustration of the ephemeral nature of modern consumerism.


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## The Groke (Jan 24, 2009)

Ooh - can I join in again!





Addy said:


> PS3 is superior in hardware and capabilities cause PS3 is a next gen console, but it hasn't been utilised fully yet in the games world.
> Suffers from a small % of Blueray drive failures.
> 
> Xbox360 has great capabilities for a last gen console and has been fully utilised and has a fantastic game collection.
> ...




The consoles are direct competitors in the games market and thus should be comparable.

I don't hold with this "next gen/last gen" bit either - what does that mean in this context exactly?



Addy said:


> The hardware in the PS3 is way more superior than the 360.
> Its like comparing a Pentium 3 CPU to a Pentium 4
> 360's were out on 2005, PS3's came out 3 years later.
> Tottaly a different generation of console IMO.




PS3 was launched end of November 2006 - a year after the XBox hit the shelves and that was mostly due to delays caused by manufacturing issues and/or shortages. 

Both consoles were designed around the same time and utilised the technology available at that time.

.....

As I said earlier in the thread, if "they" haven't worked out how to get the best out of the PS3 then:

1) "They" had better get a wiggle on as "they" are beginning to look pretty daft and
2) Why do Sony keep making machines that are so difficult to program for? What is the point of having a Ferrari if it insists that you solve complex quadratic equations before it lets you change gear?

Again - going back to the beginning of this thread and completely agreeing with chrisfilter:

Both are decent machines.

Track record to date shows almost conclusively that the Xbox has the best and broadest catalogue of games and with a very few exceptions, performs noticeably better than the PS3 in all cross platform releases.
 I still believe that in real and useful terms it is a "more powerful machine" but will be happy to eat my words if "they" finally figure out how the PS3 works. 
It also breaks. A lot.

The PS3 is not as good as it should be as a games machine, nor online. It has nice Bluray. It doesn't break.

What I would really like is a PS3Box360 I reckon.





(If anything will even the gap this year, it will be God of War 3...)


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## The Groke (Jan 24, 2009)

mattie said:


> Sorry, there's a deeper point buried in all this sniping?  It's very well hidden.




It's fun to argue about pointless toss on the interweb?

Lets face it - 25 years ago, we would all be round at each others houses arguing why Megatron was better than Galvatron. Or not, depending on one's loyalties.

This is just the same thing, but on the web. Boys don't really change much, despite getting bigger and hairier.


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## mattie (Jan 24, 2009)

Swarfega said:


> It's fun to argue about pointless toss on the interweb?
> 
> Lets face it - 25 years ago, we would all be round at each others houses arguing why Megatron was better than Galvatron. Or not, depending on one's loyalties.
> 
> This is just the same thing, but on the web. Boys don't really change much, despite getting bigger and hairier.



There's only so many times we can revisit old ground though - any mention of either XBox or PS3 seems to kick off this recursive looping.


Both are good, Xbox weaker hardware, better supported software.  XBox more mature, but this maturity may prevent potential of PS3 being realised.  That pretty much summarises it.  Again.


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## mattie (Jan 24, 2009)

tommers said:


> It's an illustration of the ephemeral nature of modern consumerism.



I thought it was buyer's regret manifested as blind factionism, but I always assume the worst in people.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 24, 2009)

mattie said:


> I thought it was buyer's regret manifested as blind factionism, but I always assume the worst in people.



Clearly.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 24, 2009)

mattie said:


> There's only so many times we can revisit old ground though



For you... I don't give a fuck either way, I just enjoy the banter. I'm sorry that's bypassed you.


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## mattie (Jan 26, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> For you... I don't give a fuck either way, I just enjoy the banter. I'm sorry that's bypassed you.



Seriously, you enjoy banter over games consoles?

Anyway, my objection is that it comes across as 12 year olds arguing, interminably, and pretty much kills any chance someone might have of actually learning something.

Not that learning something is the only point of posting, but it would be nice occasionally.


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## The Groke (Jan 26, 2009)

What's wrong with enjoying console/gaming banter?

FWIW I thought most of the posts on here (especially mine) were fairly balanced and well-considered and not yer usual IGN fanboi ravings...


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## mattie (Jan 26, 2009)

Swarfega said:


> What's wrong with enjoying console/gaming banter?
> 
> FWIW I thought most of the posts on here (especially mine) were fairly balanced and well-considered and not yer usual IGN fanboi ravings...



Nowt wrong, if both sides are bantering. 

But proportion flies out the window.

The reason it muddies the water is because it's just not clear what the actual concensus or state of play is - if somebody takes a 'banter' position, essentially 'what I own is great', then all flaws in that system are totally ignored and any slight flaws in the alternative are blown out of all proportion.  It makes it hard for techie numpties like me to figure out exactly what's what, and the problem is that as soon as it starts all balance disappears from the discussion.  

I will admit I do find bantering over consumer goods a little bit tragic (says the West Ham fan)


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## tarannau (Jan 26, 2009)

Yep. We've had stats, we've had a little banter, but it's all been fairly dispassionate. The only person sounding like a despairing toys out of the pram merchant is our mattie.

The Xbox can play some decent games, but you don't have to come over all Lynn Faulds-Wood to say that MS's decision to launch and continue to release a product with known problems and a massively increased rate of failures over other consoles wasn't exactly grand or worthy of support.


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## mattie (Jan 26, 2009)

tarannau said:


> Yep. We've had stats, we've had a little banter, but it's all been fairly dispassionate. The only person sounding like a despairing toys out of the pram merchant is our mattie.
> 
> The Xbox can play some decent games, but you don't have to come over all Lynn Faulds-Wood to say that MS's decision to launch and continue to release a product with known problems and a massively increased rate of failures over other consoles wasn't exactly grand or worthy of support.



Sorry guv, won't happen again.

Until next time, anyway.


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## The Groke (Jan 26, 2009)

tarannau said:


> The Xbox can play some decent games, but you don't have to come over all Lynn Faulds-Wood to say that MS's decision to launch and continue to release a product with known problems and a massively increased rate of failures over other consoles wasn't exactly grand or worthy of support.



Yeah? Well so's your mum.


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## fen_boy (Jan 26, 2009)

I've just bought a PS3 so feel I can now take sides.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 26, 2009)

mattie said:


> I will admit I do find bantering over consumer goods a little bit tragic (says the West Ham fan)



But that's just it! It's not about the consumer goods. It's about the love of a good argument. I will argue with tarannau that blue is red, if necessary.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 26, 2009)

fen_boy said:


> I've just bought a PS3 so feel I can now take sides.



The wrong side. You've probably got leprosy now


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## Paulie Tandoori (Jan 26, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> The wrong side. You've probably got leprosy now


Oi!!! You're not allowed to make such childish comments anymore, didn't ya know.





(oh and fen_boy, welcome to gaming heaven, just remember to throw the xboxers a cracker every now and then to keep their spirits up )


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 26, 2009)

Paulie Tandoori said:


> (oh and fen_boy, welcome to gaming heaven, just remember to throw the xboxers a cracker every now and then to keep their spirits up )



Good advice! It gets tiring playing all these a-grade exclusives, and better looking cross-platformes.


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## fen_boy (Jan 26, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> Good advice! It gets tiring playing all these a-grade exclusives, and better looking cross-platformes.



It's just a shame you have to buy a new console every 3 months when it fucks up and you can't actually hear what you're playing over the hoover like noise from the little box of shit under your telly.


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## mwgdrwg (Jan 26, 2009)

fen_boy said:


> I've just bought a PS3 so feel I can now take sides.



What's a matter with you...don't you like games?


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## internetstalker (Jan 26, 2009)

fen_boy said:


> It's just a shame you have to buy a new console every 3 months when it fucks up and you can't actually hear what you're playing over the hoover like noise from the little box of shit under your telly.



can clearly see you don't know what your talking about after this post


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## tarannau (Jan 26, 2009)

Erm, having lived with an Xbox I can certainly sympathise with the descriptions of a 'hoover like' noise. Some xboxes seem better than others, but they're all noisy beasts.


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 26, 2009)

fen_boy said:


> It's just a shame you have to buy a new console every 3 months when it fucks up and you can't actually hear what you're playing over the hoover like noise from the little box of shit under your telly.



Sorry, I didn't catch that? Say it a bit louder?


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## internetstalker (Jan 26, 2009)

tarannau said:


> Erm, having lived with an Xbox I can certainly sympathise with the descriptions of a 'hoover like' noise. Some xboxes seem better than others, but they're all noisy beasts.



mines not


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## starfish (Jan 26, 2009)

fen_boy said:


> I've just bought a PS3 so feel I can now take sides.



Ms starfish got me one for christmas, will take sides but will probably 
stay quiet while doing it.


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## fen_boy (Jan 26, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> Sorry, I didn't catch that? Say it a bit louder?



I said, 'Your Mum'


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 26, 2009)

I think we should get back to talking about the great games we love playing and how much fun they are. 

"There are no Xbox gamers, there's PS3 gamers, there's no PC gamers, there's just us Gamers!" - Barack Obama


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## ChrisFilter (Jan 26, 2009)

Kid_Eternity said:


> I think we should get back to talking about the great games we love playing and how much fun they are.



I had a great time yesterday playing Halo 3, Fable II, GoW 2, and Project Gotham Racing 4.


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 26, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> I had a great time yesterday playing Halo 3, Fable II, GoW 2, and Project Gotham Racing 4.



I started playing CoD4 again, well certain missions anyway. Love that death from above one, and the epilogue on the plane too! Great fun!


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## mattie (Jan 26, 2009)

I'm getting a touch bored with Farcry 2, I can't make any of my buddies jump in a car with me - I want them to drive so I can go mental with the truck-mounted machine gun and take out half of Africa.

I managed to run one of my buddies over whilst driving to the gun shop.  It was miles from anywhere and he was hiding behind a tree, the silly bastard.


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## internetstalker (Jan 26, 2009)

ChrisFilter said:


> I had a great time yesterday playing Halo 3, Fable II, GoW 2, and Project Gotham Racing 4.



I managed to download the dark knight in HD the other day

not to mention track & Field and speedball 2 for some old school gaming

great post BTW Mr Filter!


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## Kid_Eternity (Jan 26, 2009)

I use to love Speedball 2! Got me a wifi adapter in the post so will be online later this week, might pick that up!


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## tommers (Jan 26, 2009)

internetstalker said:


> mines not



no mine either.  the old one was but they've replaced it and this one is eerily quiet...


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## mack (Jan 26, 2009)

Girlfriends xbox came back today after a two week holiday in Germany getting fixed.  

It's like having a new console with the new dashboard and it is virtually silent now, it's just humming along even after she's been playing on it all day.


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## mattie (Jan 26, 2009)

I heard that later Xboxes have better designed interiors which may explain quieter fans and - dare I say it - lesser chances of dying on you.

Can you play FIFA09 on-line cross-platform, btw?


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## tommers (Jan 26, 2009)

mattie said:


> I heard that later Xboxes have better designed interiors which may explain quieter fans and - dare I say it - lesser chances of dying on you.
> 
> Can you play FIFA09 on-line cross-platform, btw?



No.. unfortunately not.


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## mattie (Jan 26, 2009)

Lucky for you guys.


Not strictly true, I have two left thumbs.


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## keybored (Jan 26, 2009)

Addy said:


> Fucking Fan Boi spats
> 
> PS3 is superior in hardware and capabilities cause PS3 is a next gen console, but it hasn't been utilised fully yet in the games world.
> Suffers from a small % of Blueray drive failures.
> ...



And this^, folks, is exactly why Argos are a bit touchy about taking back games consoles


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## Kid_Eternity (Sep 8, 2009)

So...anyway, xbox360 number two is fucking up, disc drive dying have filed it with MS for them to send out box to send it off to repair...sigh. I love the online experience but really can't be fucked to do this two or three times a year. If the next one dies within 6 months I reckon it'll be defection to PS3 land time...


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