# Men - do you read books written by female authors?



## Poot (Aug 26, 2012)

I have been reading The Secret History by Donna Tartt, which was so good that it kind of took over my brain for a while. Seriously, I was living it. So I recommended it heartily to mr p, whose response was "why the hell would I want to read that?"

I don't think I've ever seen him read any book by a female author, now I think about it, and it's never bothered me before but he would love this one! his loss, I suppose.

So men, would you/do you read books by women?


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## Stigmata (Aug 26, 2012)

Quite a lot of genre fiction- short SF stories by writers like Nancy Kress and Aliette de Bodard. Not a lot of novels though, the only female names I can see on a quick overview of my bookshelf are Susannah Clarke and Jill Paton Walsh.


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## Belushi (Aug 26, 2012)

Yes, but not nearly as many as by men - only realised how few  thanks to the reading challenge thread when I looked back over what i had read in 2011.


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## imposs1904 (Aug 26, 2012)

I don't read as many female authors as men. Not sure why, tbh. But female writers that I do read include Denise Mina, Pat Barker, Val McDermid and Laura Hird.


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## imposs1904 (Aug 26, 2012)

Belushi said:


> Yes, but not nearly as many as by men - only realised how few thanks to the reading challenge thread when I looked back over what i had read in 2011.


 
I had some the same thought about my reading habits when looking at both the 2011 & 2012 Reading Challenge.


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## Orang Utan (Aug 26, 2012)

A fair bit I would say.
Currently reading a book by Jennifer Egan.
I have read a lot of Margaret Atwood and Pat Barker and think Hilary Mantel is the best living writer in English.


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## manny-p (Aug 26, 2012)

I read good books. The sex of the author doesn't come into my thinking.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 26, 2012)

yep, authorial voice can be startlingly different with gender or it can be just...as it is. Secret History is a great book and anyone avoiding reading it is mugging themself off!


one of my all time favourite sci fi novels 'Second Nature' is penned by a woman- check out the blog' SF mistressworks'(counterpart to SF Masterworks the print run) for loads of good female written sci fi. Tricia Sullivan and Octavia butler are also 'names to conjur with'

Reppin hard in the fantasy sphere as well, Le Guin, Susanah Clark, Katherine Kerr etc etc

I generally don't read much fiction that falls outside of genre tho.......

ooh ahrundati roy. God of Small Things. Hated it when I first read it but it haunted me till I gave it another goa nd somewhow ended up loving it.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 26, 2012)

oh yeah Atwood is aces. Orynx and Crake is fucked up


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## Poot (Aug 26, 2012)

Margaret Atwood is great. And important! I can honestly say I have never hesitated to read a book written by a man unless it was a genre I don't like. So abou 50/50 for me. But it's probably different for women.


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 26, 2012)

There were a few articles a little while back talking about studies showing men don't read women authors but women read books by men all the time. Talked a bit about marketing, about categorisation, right down to cover design. The idea that a book by a woman must be 'for' women or about women and why on earth would anything that is about women be of interest to men, whereas if something is about men it's automatically meant to be of interest to everyone (male being default/neutral, in society, of course). So part of this lies with the publishing industry and the way things are portrayed. There are plenty of women writing books about all sorts of things, but the women who tend to be allowed to be successful are those who can fit into neat categories like "chick lit" or historical fiction, romance, and then genre fiction like horror, SF, crime, etc. Novels by male writers can sit quite happily under the sign "Literary fiction" and not need to be separated further by definition (unless they want to be) because the male experience is the default experience, etc. That was the general gist of it all, anyway. It's a multifaceted problem, of course. Arguments of "women can't write X type of book well" are about as useful as saying "women can't be funny" or "women can't drive" or "women can't be pilots" or "women should wear pink and make me a sammich" etc etc etc.


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## quimcunx (Aug 26, 2012)

manny-p said:


> I read good books. The sex of the author doesn't come into my thinking.


 
So what's the split? 


I probably read a few more by men than women in total. e2a: actually maybe it's not that much of a disparity.   I have in the past made myself choose more books by women authors and my enjoyment factor hasn't dipped but male authors are more visible, prolific etc.  except in the chicklit genre and I don't read a lot of chicklit.  I haven't been reading as much in the way of novels by either sex in recent years anyway.  Non-fiction I've definitely read more books by male than female authors.

I wasn't very taken with the Secret History.  I've read two Atwoods. Liked one not the other.


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 26, 2012)

When you think back to the Brontes, and others like them, who were published under men's names ... I think everyone would probably say something like "yeah, it was pretty stupid and backwards and terrible that they wouldn't have been able to be published or read under their own names" and yet ...

Well things have clearly moved on from that point, that's obvious. But probably not to the extent we imagine.


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 26, 2012)

Talking about Donna Tartt, I really enjoyed The Secret History. When she FINALLY released The Little Friend I bought it in hardback, and it was really good, all the way through ... until....

...it just ended. I've never done this before or since, but I actually flicked back several pages thinking I'd missed an entire chapter, or wondering if there was a problem with my edition, that they'd left the last chapter out in a dodgy print run or something. It was the most unsatisfying, odd way to end a book. It's like she just stopped.

As for Atwood, I've heard others say she's hit and miss too. Bit like Auster in that regard for me (of which I had to read a metric fucktonne of at university).


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## quimcunx (Aug 26, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> There were a few articles a little while back talking about studies showing men don't read women authors but women read books by men all the time. Talked a bit about marketing, about categorisation, right down to cover design. The idea that a book by a woman must be 'for' women or about women and why on earth would anything that is about women be of interest to men, whereas if something is about men it's automatically meant to be of interest to everyone (male being default/neutral, in society, of course). So part of this lies with the publishing industry and the way things are portrayed. There are plenty of women writing books about all sorts of things, but the women who tend to be allowed to be successful are those who can fit into neat categories like "chick lit" or historical fiction, romance, and then genre fiction like horror, SF, crime, etc. Novels by male writers can sit quite happily under the sign "Literary fiction" and not need to be separated further by definition (unless they want to be) because the male experience is the default experience, etc. That was the general gist of it all, anyway. It's a multifaceted problem, of course. Arguments of "women can't write X type of book well" are about as useful as saying "women can't be funny" or "women can't drive" or "women can't be pilots" or "women should wear pink and make me a sammich" etc etc etc.


 
I'm going to guess that as far as Horror, crime fiction, SciFi that more male authors are on the shelves. Romance whether Bridget Jonesish or historical will be more female authors on the shelves.   Once you're left with 'general fiction'  I'm not sure what the split is in authors.  My guess would be that women write or are seen to write more relationshippy novels. Nurturing relationships seems to be a female pursuit and of little interest to men*.  So yeah, I agree with what you've said. 

*See also the how to please your man after giving birth thread.


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## Lock&Light (Aug 26, 2012)

I've read all the Harry Potter books. 

But another female writer who's books I've enjoyed is Dorothy Lessing.


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 26, 2012)

quimcunx said:


> I'm going to guess that as far as Horror, crime fiction, SciFi that more male authors are on the shelves. Romance whether Bridget Jonesish or historical will be more female authors on the shelves. Once you're left with 'general fiction' I'm not sure what the split is in authors. My guess would be that women write or are seen to write more relationshippy novels. Nurturing relationships seems to be a female pursuit and of little interest to men*. So yeah, I agree with what you've said.
> 
> *See also the how to please your man after giving birth thread.


 
That thread exists? I'm going to hope it's a blistering take down of anyone who might ever espouse such notions implied in the title and not go and check for myself.

Anyway... yeah, there are still more men on the shelves of SF, etc, but it's one area where there are women who have made names for themselves and are treated as 'equal' to men in terms of reputation and so on (on the whole) but yes, their numbers are distinctly lacking.

It's a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy as well as a problem with the gatekeeping functions of the publishing industry. There are women writing books that aren't all about relationships and stuff (in the sense that we think about women and relationships - I'm sure the vast majority of books by men deal with relationships in one way or another - but that's different, that's men!), but these categories have been formed, they sell, they make money, so we'll keep shoehorning women into them. And then more women read that stuff, and more women write that stuff. And so the cycle continues.


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## Wilf (Aug 26, 2012)

I'd say I've read about 8/10 male, maybe even more (though it's more equal in my reading for work - sociology lecturer). When I was in my teens and 20s I read a lot of sf, which accounted for it then, though there is and was a lot of good womens sf/fantasy. Beyond that I'm really not sure why as I certainly don't like cliched 'male writing'. For a while I tended to read some of the 'classics' or contemporary writing that was getting pushed by the reviewers (not really painting a good picture of myself am I ) basically, reflecting publisher biases. Nowadays I read any auld shite. Luckily auld shite comes in all genders.

P.S. whilst I haven't read Louise Mensch, I _guarentee_ I have not and will never read Jeffrey Archer.


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## Wilf (Aug 26, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> That thread exists? I'm going to hope it's a blistering take down of anyone who might ever espouse such notions implied in the title and not go and check for myself.
> 
> Anyway... yeah, there are still more men on the shelves of SF, etc, but it's one area where there are women who have made names for themselves and are treated as 'equal' to men in terms of reputation and so on (on the whole) but yes, their numbers are distinctly lacking.
> 
> It's a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy as well as a problem with the gatekeeping functions of the publishing industry. There are women writing books that aren't all about relationships and stuff (in the sense that we think about women and relationships - I'm sure the vast majority of books by men deal with relationships in one way or another - but that's different, that's men!), but these categories have been formed, they sell, they make money, so we'll keep shoehorning women into them. And then more women read that stuff, and more women write that stuff. And so the cycle continues.


 An incredibly conservative safety first industry, particularly with the shift in mass sales to supermarkets, with a tiny number of authors on sale. It's not that publishers ignore the changing social world, but that they want to treat it as a zeitgeisty thing, running down narrow channels.


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 26, 2012)

Wilf said:


> I'd say I've read about 8/10 male, maybe even more (though it's more equal in my reading for work - sociology lecturer). When I was in my teens and 20s I read a lot of sf, which accounted for it then, though there is and was a lot of good womens sf/fantasy. Beyond that I'm really not sure why as I certainly don't like cliched 'male writing'. For a while I tended to read some of the 'classics' or contemporary writing that was getting pushed by the reviewers (not really painting a good picture of myself am I ) basically, reflecting publisher biases. Nowadays I read any auld shite. Luckily auld shite comes in all genders.
> 
> P.S. whilst I haven't read Louise Mensch, I _guarentee_ I have not and will never read Jeffrey Archer.


 
I've read both 

Actually, I never finished the Mensch.

Both have since winged their way to that great charity shop in the sky.

I actually feel a bit annoyed, that I'd fall into describing something as 'sounding like it was written by a man' or '.....a woman' and so on. I guess the first step is being aware of it...

Interesting, because my masters work was on authenticity and other such bollocks in African American writing. I looked at a novel that started out with some guy just talking about stuff, then he starts describing himself, talking about how he has curly hair, dark skin, a wide nose, etc., and challenging the fact that up until that point you probably thought he was white. It talks about how he's an author (novels about authors ....  ) and how his agent gets on at him because he 'doesn't write black enough' in order to sell. He goes into Borders and Barnes and Noble and finds his books in the "African American Writing" sections, when the only thing 'black' about it is his author photograph on the back of the jacket (they are re-writings of greek myth, incidentally). It's the same kind of thing at work, I suppose. The assumption that a writer has to somehow write about what they know, and a black person can only clearly know about being black (whatever 'being black' is), a woman can only know about being a woman (whatever 'being a woman' is), but a white man can know about everything and talk about it all legitimately.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 26, 2012)

tbf its a male dominated form (what isn't lol) but this is quite pronounced in certain genres- for instance sci fi tends to be a mans game. Female authors do get a look in with fantasy and crime lit. but traditionally writing fiction has been a mans pursuit. Why I love and loathe Frankenstein is because the male lead is such a coward and a cunt. Looking back on it though I can't help wonder if Shelley was not ripping the piss a bit


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## Fez909 (Aug 26, 2012)

I remembered starting a thread on this topic a while back.  Just been through my old posts to find it and was surprised to see it was from 2006!

Anyway, loads of good suggestions on there for those men who need to balance out their book gender provenance quota.


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## temper_tantrum (Aug 26, 2012)

Extending the question a bit, I am female and I rarely read fiction by men. I find it very hard to engage with. I expect that's my flaw and not theirs. And the authorship is not something that ever puts me off trying a book. But there you go. And I appear to feel the need to excuse my experience and blame it on myself, which is a bit sad.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 26, 2012)

Lock&Light said:


> I've read all the Harry Potter books.
> 
> But another female writer who's books I've enjoyed is *Dorothy Lessing*.


 

Under rated imho, years since I read anything by her but I recall being impressed.

I remember hearing Le Guin interviewed about having sold a sci fi short to Playboy in the days when Playboy used to write serious articles and publish sci fi amidst the boobs. When it came time to cut the cheque they asked her agent 'what his first name is' and were horrified to hear the answer 'her first name is Ursula'

oh noes!


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 26, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> tbf its a male dominated form (what isn't lol) but this is quite pronounced in certain genres- for instance sci fi tends to be a mans game. Female authors do get a look in with fantasy and crime lit. but traditionally writing fiction has been a mans pursuit. Why I love and loathe Frankenstein is because the male lead is such a coward and a cunt. Looking back on it though I can't help wonder if Shelley was not ripping the piss a bit


 
Well, most things in the public sphere have traditionally been a man's pursuit. Statistics show (ah, how we all love a sentence that begins "statistics show") the majority of readers are women. Women, when they read, read books by men and women. Men, when they read, read books by men. <-- over-generalisation. But that's the trend, apparently. There are shed loads of books by women, but it's all about where you'll find them shelved and how they are categorised.


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## Wolveryeti (Aug 26, 2012)

Iris Murdoch is good. Read _The Sea The Sea_ if you haven't already - cracking book.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 26, 2012)

temper_tantrum said:


> Extending the question a bit, I am female and I rarely read fiction by men. I find it very hard to engage with. I expect that's my flaw and not theirs. And the authorship is not something that ever puts me off trying a book. But there you go. And I appear to feel the need to excuse my experience and blame it on myself, which is a bit sad.


 

Do you know 'Instance of the Fingerpost?'  I know you like Strange & Norrell and in some ways its similar- by a man. You'd like it. I think !


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## Stigmata (Aug 27, 2012)

Like Wilf says, my work-related reading is closer to 50/50.

Also just remembered Lindsay Davis' Didius Falco detective stories, which i've read most of.


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## Reno (Aug 27, 2012)

It makes no difference to me what gender the author is. I'm a fan of Edith Wharton, Patricia Highsmith, Tove Jansson, Pauline Kael, Gitta Sereny, Flannery o'Connor and Carson McCullers

I hated The Secret History though.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

outline why please Reno  I was well impressed and I normally hate books about poshish americans


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## Stanley Edwards (Aug 27, 2012)

Yes. Lots. Probably more than male authors.

When I initially moved to Spain I was staying in an old farmhouse with no TV, no internet, no telephone reception, but the women who owned the house had a huge library. Almost the last book I picked off the shelf was 'Forever Amber'. I ignored it for so long because it looked like a stupid romance thing. It remains one of my favourite books. When I moved to Granada I met the first person IRL named Amber, and felt complelled to order a copy for her  It is a stonking read.

In the same library I found 'Hawkwood - diabolical Englishman' by Frances Stoner Saunders. Another historically factual, but theorised/romanticised read. I want a copy of her 'The Cultural Cold War - The CIA and the World of Arts and Letters'.

Many, many more. But these Two I have read remain huge favourites I would always recommend.


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## Reno (Aug 27, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> outline why please Reno  I was well impressed and I normally hate books about poshish americans


 
Edith Wharton was a satirist and certainly didn't write approvingly about "posh" Americans. Her protagonists who successfully navigate the system are frequently hypocrites, shallow, cruel or deceitful and those who don't, are destroyed or damaged by the rigid conventions of their class.

The other American writers I mentioned don't exclusively write about 'posh' characters and the two Southern writers wrote about rednecks and lower middle class people.


:edit: Ooops, I didn't realise you meant The Secret History. I read it when it came out and the plot struck me as cobblers, but it's too long ago for me to remember. She certainly can write, I just found it too contrived and the bacchanalia thing struck me as silly. A trashy thriller, masquerading as literature, I just expected more.


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## _angel_ (Aug 27, 2012)

The main character in secret history isn't a proper 'posh' American, he's a scholarship boy. Couldn't get started with the little friend though.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

poshISH


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## Orang Utan (Aug 27, 2012)

Lock&Light said:


> I've read all the Harry Potter books.
> 
> But another female writer who's books I've enjoyed is Dorothy Lessing.


Poor Doris. Even people who've read her can't remember her name


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## colbhoy (Aug 27, 2012)

Looking back at my books from 2011 and 2012 reading challenge, I have read one book by a woman (Mo Hayder) - from memory this book was a present otherwise my tally would be zero. I have no idea why this is so, I do not (I think) consciously think "I am only reading books by men". When I was younger I read Enid Blyton and when a bit older loads of Agatha Christie.


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## Pickman's model (Aug 27, 2012)

Mary elizabeth braddon

Leigh brackett

C.L. Moore

ursula le guin

Susan cooper

Rosemary sutcliff


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## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

Reno said:


> Edith Wharton was a satirist and certainly didn't write approvingly about "posh" Americans. Her protagonists who successfully navigate the system are frequently hypocrites, shallow, cruel or deceitful and those who don't, are destroyed or damaged by the rigid conventions of their class.
> 
> The other American writers I mentioned don't exclusively write about 'posh' characters and the two Southern writers wrote about rednecks and lower middle class people.
> 
> ...


 

fair enough. I, being enamoured of fantasy etc, found the bacchanalia angle pretty awesome. But then I like shiny things so there you have it.

Also quite fancy donna


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## Belushi (Aug 27, 2012)

Pickman's model said:


> Rosemary sutcliff


 
I loved her books as a kid.


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## Pickman's model (Aug 27, 2012)

Belushi said:


> I loved her books as a kid.


yes, so did, and i've been enjoying rereading them


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## articul8 (Aug 27, 2012)

Are we talking about fiction specifically, or reading in general?


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## TruXta (Aug 27, 2012)

Not enough really, and like Dotsy most female authors I read are probably writing in the sci-fi/fantasy genre.


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## Gromit (Aug 27, 2012)

I read a Harry Potter book once. I wanted to read the rest of them but then someone told me it was written by a woman so I stopped. Don't want people to think I'm gay or something.


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## Lock&Light (Aug 27, 2012)

Orang Utan said:


> Poor Doris. Even people who've read her can't remember her name


 
Oops!


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## Gromit (Aug 27, 2012)

For those who don't twig my post above was sarcasm.

Honest answer:

I've read many many female authors and enjoyed many of their works...
...but all my favourite authors are male.

I'm guessing that men are better at writing characters that male readers identify with and female writers are better at writing ones that female readers can identify with... due to being able to draw upon their own experiences, thoughts and feelings.

I can't imagine a female writer being able to write a work on what its like being a boy and growing up with a love a football and how that affected his male development as well as Nick Hornby. One might do a pretty damn good job but will it resonate the same as a piece written by someone who truly lived it.

By this reasoning the best books are those written by a male and female team that give both perspectives well.
Which is why the Dragonlance Series is one of the best fictional series ever written. 
The authors were Laura and Tracy Hickman, and then Tracy Hickman and Margaret Weis. Tracy is the man btw.


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## ViolentPanda (Aug 27, 2012)

Poot said:


> I have been reading The Secret History by Donna Tartt, which was so good that it kind of took over my brain for a while. Seriously, I was living it. So I recommended it heartily to mr p, whose response was "why the hell would I want to read that?"
> 
> I don't think I've ever seen him read any book by a female author, now I think about it, and it's never bothered me before but he would love this one! his loss, I suppose.
> 
> So men, would you/do you read books by women?


 
Yep. Anything from Agatha Christie and Val McDermid to Carson McCullers and E. Annie Proulx. If Mr. P is deliberately not reading books written by female authors, then he's depriving himself of an awful lot of good literature.


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## Orang Utan (Aug 27, 2012)

Maybe he thinks women just write silly stuff about feelings. That's what one of my teachers thought and he was the English literature teacher! The same man read us Jim Morrison lyrics and out me off The Doors for life.


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## nino_savatte (Aug 27, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> oh yeah Atwood is aces. Orynx and Crake is fucked up


Yep, another fan of Attwood here [puts hand up].

I quite like Judith Butler too.


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## temper_tantrum (Aug 27, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> Do you know 'Instance of the Fingerpost?'  I know you like Strange & Norrell and in some ways its similar- by a man. You'd like it. I think !



Yes, you recommended it to me! Musta been 2 years ago or so, I think.
It was ok. Nicely plotted. Complex. The central characters didn't quite gel with me, I think. Found it hard to *care*. 
China Mieville is an exception to the rule. And Dickens (despite his utter and painful inability to write decent female leads).


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 27, 2012)

Gromit said:


> For those who don't twig my post above was sarcasm.
> 
> Honest answer:
> 
> ...


 
Thing is, women read lots of books written by men and have - generally - no problem 'relating' to any of the characters, not in the way you are suggesting, any way. (Not all characters are written to be related to, otherwise you'd be relating with a heck of a lot of psychopaths, sociopaths, etc.) By extension, what you're suggesting is that men only want to read about 'things that men do' and women only want to read about 'things that women do' and frankly that's a load of old tosh and problematic on a hell of a lot of levels.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

in general what I look for in a really good book is strong characters and tight plotting. Proper authorial voice tends to be genderless- its just craft.

I was wounded hardcore by downloading the Sookie Stackhouse novels- just....what the fuck...so shit

I wasn't expecting Tolstoy but my god, awful awful writing.


Made Anne Rice look like high art. fuck me.


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## temper_tantrum (Aug 27, 2012)

What is Sookie Stackhouse?


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## golightly (Aug 27, 2012)

temper_tantrum said:


> What is Sookie Stackhouse?


 
You clearly have an internet connection.  Go and knock yourself out.


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## Firky (Aug 27, 2012)

I do, Poot. I do.

But I don't like P.D James, Poot. I don't like P.D James.


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## temper_tantrum (Aug 27, 2012)

golightly said:


> You clearly have an internet connection.  Go and knock yourself out.



Yeah, I just did. Summat low-rent about vampires. 
Thanks awfully for your reply though, everso everso helpful and lovely as it was.


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## wtfftw (Aug 27, 2012)

Novels the successful tv series True Blood is based on. 



I've just reread the yellow wallpaper short story mentioned in that other thread linked in this one.  and downloaded others.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

bizarrely enough True Blood is good fun tele- one of those rare occasions where the tele translation is better than the source material


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## Frances Lengel (Aug 27, 2012)

Reno said:


> It makes no difference to me what gender the author is. I'm a fan of Edith Wharton, Patricia Highsmith, Tove Jansson, Pauline Kael, Gitta Sereny, Flannery o'Connor and Carson McCullers
> 
> I hated The Secret History though.


 
The first sentence of your post sums up my approach as well. I'm just looking at my nearest bookcase and I can see books by AM Homes, Zoe Strachan, Louise Welch, Catherine O'Flynn, Tana French, Patricia Highsmith,  Alison Irvine, Ali Smith, Joolz Denby, Emma Donoghue, Livi Micheal, Marlene Van DeNeerkerk and Martina Cole.

Never read The Secret History though, somehow never fancied it.


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## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

give it a go, its not disappointing. In quintessentially 'american' writing I've never enjoyed a novelso much save Straubs 'Shadowland'

Ye, the contrivance is there- pulls it off through good prose. If you don't like it and feel robbed of your time I will send you a Kit Kat Chunky in the post as recompense.


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## temper_tantrum (Aug 27, 2012)

wtfftw said:


> Novels the successful tv series True Blood is based on.


 
Ah right, ta. I don't watch telly so never heard of it ! Vampires are du jour, eh.


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 27, 2012)

temper_tantrum said:


> Ah right, ta. I don't watch telly so never heard of it ! Vampires are du jour, eh.


 
About as much as zombies right now.

I gave up on True Blood after season 2. It felt _too_ ridiculous, in the end. I know it's meant to be ridiculous, but there's a moment when something ends up being a painfully forced parody of itself and I lose interest, and I think for me that was when every single person in the town was fucking each other while on some sort of magic-induced hallucinogenic trip in Sookie's back yard.


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## temper_tantrum (Aug 27, 2012)

That sounds like fun, tbf. What tv channel is this on, exactly? One of Richard Desmond's?!


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## Greebo (Aug 27, 2012)

temper_tantrum said:


> What is Sookie Stackhouse?


The main female character in what was televised as "True Blood".  

IMHO the "undead and..." series is better written.


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## Greebo (Aug 27, 2012)

temper_tantrum said:


> That sounds like fun, tbf. What tv channel is this on, exactly? One of Richard Desmond's?!


Was Channel 4.


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## Disjecta Membra (Aug 27, 2012)

I'd got an inkling that I mainly read male authors, but looking at my decent sized collection. All are written my men  I dunno why exactly but I don't really understand people(generally) and quite often women seem a separate species so maybe it makes sense, also explains why I'm perpetually single.


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## wtfftw (Aug 27, 2012)

True Blood is on FX and _the internet_  I dunno if it goes to a standard channel after. It's quite ridiculous but I love lots of the characters and it actually does make me cry and properly laugh sometimes.


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## Brainaddict (Aug 27, 2012)

Wolveryeti said:


> Iris Murdoch is good. Read _The Sea The Sea_ if you haven't already - cracking book.


I've tried a couple of times and I just can't. It is a book about a man who is a total dick. All of the minor characters are also unsympathetic. Presumably there is something else going on if you get through it all but a man being a dick is common enough that I just didn't feel the desire to read on. What am I missing?


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## Johnny Vodka (Aug 27, 2012)

I read books that I think are going to interest me... though most of the books on my shelf are by men. But I've read books by Sylvia Plath and Margaret Atwood, and I have no problem with a female narrator even if it has been written by a man ('Never Let Me Go', my favourite book in recent years).


----------



## pogofish (Aug 27, 2012)

I don't think I have ever considered the sex of the author as any kind of factor in the choice of any book I have ever wanted to read.


----------



## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

pogofish said:


> I don't think I have ever considered the sex of the author as any kind of factor in the choice of any book I have ever wanted to read.


 

I bet you write to authors pointing out that someone has already said what they are saying


----------



## Mungy (Aug 27, 2012)

Thinking about it, most of what I have read is by male authors. This has not been a conscious decision though.


----------



## pogofish (Aug 27, 2012)

I meet enough of them through work - Wouldn't need to write, even if I wanted to!


----------



## mentalchik (Aug 27, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> one of my all time favourite sci fi novels 'Second Nature' is penned by a woman-


 
author ?


----------



## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

mentalchik said:


> author ?


 

Cherry Wilder (a nom de plume iirc) there is a sequel about the fate of the rhomary land, I've yet to get my mitts on it


----------



## mentalchik (Aug 27, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> Cherry Wilder (a nom de plume iirc) there is a sequel about the fate of the rhomary land, I've yet to get my mitts on it


 
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Signs-of-...-/130653113117?pt=Fiction&hash=item1e6b884b1d


----------



## Santino (Aug 27, 2012)

The Secret Shitstory more like.


----------



## Corax (Aug 27, 2012)

One less than I thought.  For some reason I thought that Jasper Fforde was the nom de plume of a female writer, but I recently found out it's a blurk.


----------



## quimcunx (Aug 27, 2012)

pogofish said:


> I don't think I have ever considered the sex of the author as any kind of factor in the choice of any book I have ever wanted to read.


 
So are the authors of books you read mostly male or female or 50/50 split?


----------



## thriller (Aug 27, 2012)

nope is the answer. read a bit of harry potter and got bored after the first chapter and never went back.


----------



## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

Santino said:


> The Secret Shitstory more like.


 

You are like that henry in it.


----------



## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

thriller said:


> nope is the answer. read a bit of harry potter and got bored after the first chapter and never went back.


 

I'm afraid dismissing female authors on the basis of Harry Potter is actually well shit. Like seeing a cloud block the sun and deciding that all clouds must be wank. Or having a crap cupof coffee and swearing off coffee for life. I despise potter as a bourgeois fantasy that is highly derivative and not in a good way. But for the love of Allanis


----------



## thriller (Aug 27, 2012)

i'm not dismissing female authors on the basis of 'arry potter. i think women authors existed before JK came along. I've read kids books by women if that counts? I think turbulant term of tyke tyler was written by a woman?


----------



## DotCommunist (Aug 27, 2012)

you are a philistine without the cool scarfs


----------



## thriller (Aug 27, 2012)

Just finished Treasure Island this morning. Lovely read. Game of Thrones is next on the nexus 7.


----------



## toblerone3 (Oct 13, 2021)

Yes I recently enjoyed The Essex Serpent by Sarah Perry.


----------



## Johnny Vodka (Oct 13, 2021)

I'm reading Summerwater by Sarah Moss at the moment.  Liking it a lot.


----------



## nagapie (Oct 13, 2021)

toblerone3 said:


> Yes I recently enjoyed The Essex Serpent by Sarah Perry.


Wonderful book.


----------



## petee (Oct 13, 2021)

i read fiction almost not at all but I've read some work by Dawn Powell and will read more.

for professional purposes lots of stuff.

among humorists, Patricia Marx.


----------



## Dandred (Oct 17, 2021)

Why wouldn't I? 

I have never picked up a book and though, I'll read this becasue it was written by a man or by a women, I read books because they are good to read.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Oct 17, 2021)

Dandred said:


> Why wouldn't I?
> 
> I have never picked up a book and though, I'll read this becasue it was written by a man or by a women, I read books because they are good to read.


Same here.  Haven't read fiction for years, and mainly read science, history, nature stuff - but pay no attention to the author.  As long as they're a good writer that's all that matters.


----------



## JimW (Oct 17, 2021)

Sex is immaterial but I won't read anything by the lower orders about their sordid little lives. If it doesn't involve a shooting weekend at the northern estates or at a pinch the London season, whats the point?


----------



## nagapie (Oct 17, 2021)

I prefer female authors. Most men write women terribly. I remember the first time I read a Paul Auster book, I couldn't believe how wooden and one dimensional his female characters were.


----------



## Winot (Oct 17, 2021)

nagapie said:


> I prefer female authors. Most men write women terribly. I remember the first time I read a Paul Auster book, I couldn't believe how wooden and one dimensional his female characters were.


His male characters too tbh - he’s not really a character author (I’m a big fan).


----------



## dessiato (Oct 17, 2021)

If I enjoy the book then I don’t care who wrote it.


----------



## Spymaster (Oct 17, 2021)

I read most of Agatha Christie's stuff as a kid and Patricia Highsmith in my teens but I don't read much fiction nowadays and female authors aren't particularly active in the genres I'm most interested in (military history, spy shit, and exploration tech).


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

Not really in general as I read a lot of older non fiction and sci fi in general

 I did spend £14.99 to buy "The Last Stargazers" by a female author although I then found out it had at least two chapters as to why she was so disadvantaged in life by being a woman and I didn't believe her. She was posh.

That sort of puts me off as I buy books like that for facts.


----------



## MickiQ (Oct 17, 2021)

What a odd question, Yes loads My tastes run primarily to SciFi and Fantasy  and four female authors where I've read pretty much their entire work and can name them off the top of my head are Anne McCaffrey, Leigh Brackett, Ursula Le Guin and Andre  Norton. Other  female sci-fi authors that I  have read some of their books are Lois McMaster Bujold, C J Cherryh,  Doris Lessing, Elizabeth Moon, Tanith Lee, Joan D Vinge, Suzanne Collins, Jean Auel  and Maeve Binchy.
I have to confess I  haven't read The Handmaids Tale by Margaret Atwood, I do have a copy just not got round to it.
I've read Enid Blyton and Beatrix Potter as a kid, I've read Harry Potter by J K Rowling (though none of her other books) with my kids, I've even read (gasp of horror and pearl clutching) some Jane Austen.
I look at an authors name when choosing a book to see if it's by someone whose work I've read before to see if it is someone I recognise but the idea that the author's  sex (not always obvious from the name anyway) is relevant to whether or not I might read it strikes me as a rather bizarre concept.


----------



## weltweit (Oct 17, 2021)

I am just looking back because I have no idea. 

In 2013 out of 16 books I read: 
Can't Stand Up For Sitting Down, Jo Brand
Look back in Hunger, Jo Brand 

In 2014 out of 39 books I read: 
Deadline, Stella Rimington
Present Danger, Stella Rimington 

In 2015 out of 31 books I read: 
Lethal, Sandra Brown
Fortunes Pawn, Rachel Bach 
Honour's Knight, Rachel Bach 
Heaven's Queen, Rachel Bach
The Assassination of Margaret Thatcher, Hilary Mantel
The American Lover, Rose Tremain

In 2016 out of 25 books I read:
To Kill a Mockingbird, Harper Lee 

in 2017 from 18, none ..  

in 2018 I stopped recording my reading. 

So not a very good record of reading books by female authors.


----------



## killer b (Oct 17, 2021)

I wonder if the 'I don't pay attention to what sex the author is I just read what's good' crew ever check what the ratio of male to female authors they read is? Cause I did a couple of years ago and it wasn't great. It's much better now since I started paying attention...


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

Bought four books yesterday. All of them men. Nothing conscious about it, but it makes me feel sad all the same.


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

killer b said:


> I wonder if the 'I don't pay attention to what sex the author is I just read what's good' crew ever check what the ratio of male to female authors they read is? Cause I did a couple of years ago and it wasn't great. It's much better now since I started paying attention...



Does that make your reading experience better or just more right on lol?


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Does that make your reading experience better or just more right on lol?


Surely it would be both? Especially with fiction


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Surely it would be both? Especially with fiction


Why?


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Why?


Isn’t that the whole point of fiction? To see something from another person’s point of view?


----------



## BillRiver (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Why?



How can you read the best books if you exclude approx half of all authors?


----------



## BillRiver (Oct 17, 2021)

Interesting (to me at least) to note the proportion of authors named on this thread who are white, btw.


----------



## Throbbing Angel (Oct 17, 2021)

Late to this, but yes, I read female authors. 

Recently...

Gwendoline Riley
Alison Moore
Kirsty Logan
Jenn Ashworth
Shirley Jackson
Edith Wharton


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Isn’t that the whole point of fiction? To see something from another person’s point of view?



I don't know if that is the point of fiction 

For me it is the storytelling and the ability to lose oneself in the books.

I have read a lot of female authors, but don't make a point about it. I read what I like/prefer?


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

BillRiver said:


> How can you read the best books if you exclude approx half of all authors?



I don't. I have and still read numerous female authors.

Do you check the authenticity of all your authors?


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> I don't know if that is the point of fiction
> 
> For me it is the storytelling and the ability to lose oneself in the books.
> 
> I have read a lot of female authors, but don't make a point about it. I read what I like/prefer?


Let’s see your ratio then. I know mine is skewed towards male authors.


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Let’s see your ratio then. I know mine is skewed towards male authors.



No, it's mostly male. Probably CiS as well!!!!

I do not know why that is an issue though.


----------



## weltweit (Oct 17, 2021)

I have bought a few books by female authors as presents for other people, sometimes I buy booker prize winners or entries, because these are usually good books they tend to go down well as presents to one individual in particular. Except when it transpires she has already read them!


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> No, it's mostly male. Probably CiS as well!!!!
> 
> I do not know why that is an issue though.


It isn’t necessary, but you miss out big time


----------



## MickiQ (Oct 17, 2021)

killer b said:


> I wonder if the 'I don't pay attention to what sex the author is I just read what's good' crew ever check what the ratio of male to female authors they read is? Cause I did a couple of years ago and it wasn't great. It's much better now since I started paying attention...


Why is there a quota we have to fulfill?, saying to yourself that the last 5 books I've read have all been written by men thus I must read one by a woman to balance it out strikes me as just as odd as rejecting one just because it was written by a woman.
I suspect I have read more fiction by men than women since I suspect (though have no evidence) that men make up a greater proportion of authors than women especially the genres I enjoy most.
An interesting aside is that of the 84 technical manuals on the shelf behind me (all of which were bought on subject material rather than author), all of them were written by male authors so there is a clearly a deficit of female authors in writing IT technical books.


----------



## Spymaster (Oct 17, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> It isn’t necessary, but you miss out big time



That's not necessarily true at all. There are thousands of authors out there. You could easily choose to read only male or female authors for the rest of your life and still have a perfectly fulfilling experience. I won't get to read a fraction of the books that I'd like to in my lifetime. Knocking out all those penned by men or women would still leave thousands.


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> It isn’t necessary, but you miss out big time



Really.  How?

What am I missing out on?

Bear in mind I like Science, Historical novels and Science Fiction. 

I read and have listened to Mary Beard. Ann Leckie as well as Ursala de le guin and appreciated it.

I have also listen and read absolute shit from some male authors and thought what a load of shite.


----------



## weltweit (Oct 17, 2021)

I haven't read massive amounts of female authored books, but I was just thinking if I could have made out (without knowing in advance) if a book I was reading was written by a woman or a man, and I am not sure I could.


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

weltweit said:


> I haven't read massive amounts of female authored books, but I was just thinking if I could have made out (without knowing in advance) if a book I was reading was written by a woman or a man, and I am not sure I could.


 Eh?


----------



## weltweit (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Eh?


If you didn't know who the author was could you on reading it determine if it was a male or female author?


----------



## rutabowa (Oct 17, 2021)

When I was reading loads it was nearly all male authors, I liked old novels and the canon is dominated by mainly white male writers so if you study literature you are going to read a lot of men, at least at first.


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

Maybe, never thought to think.

I don't know any feminist/lbtq specific authors in the fields I like, but I don't actively seek them out so no are probably loads.

I have a cat.

I also have shit to do so should probably do that now.


----------



## xenon (Oct 17, 2021)

toblerone3 said:


> Yes I recently enjoyed The Essex Serpent by Sarah Perry.



You bumped this nine-year-old thread to say yes you read a book by a woman? That’s, well a bit tragic.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Really.  How?
> 
> What am I missing out on?
> 
> ...


Like with anything, it’s good to take a chance on books that might not appeal instantly. Very rarely regret it


----------



## bimble (Oct 17, 2021)

My most recent bf was / is so right on he’s only reading women writers until 2023. I don’t really think about it much but roughly I do seem to enjoy female writers of fiction more on average, & reckon maybe it has to do with us being inculcated with empathy more than men are, making women better at writing complex & believable 3D characters. This is a massive generalisation yes. Nonfiction there’s nothing in it far as I can see.


----------



## BillRiver (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> I don't. I have and still read numerous female authors.
> 
> Do you check the authenticity of all your authors?



What does authenticity mean in this context?


----------



## killer b (Oct 17, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Does that make your reading experience better or just more right on lol?


Why wouldn't it be at least as good?


----------



## Winot (Oct 17, 2021)

Poot said:


> I have been reading The Secret History by Donna Tartt, which was so good that it kind of took over my brain for a while. Seriously, I was living it. So I recommended it heartily to mr p, whose response was "why the hell would I want to read that?"
> 
> I don't think I've ever seen him read any book by a female author, now I think about it, and it's never bothered me before but he would love this one! his loss, I suppose.
> 
> So men, would you/do you read books by women?


Has he read it yet Poot?


----------



## killer b (Oct 17, 2021)

MickiQ said:


> Why is there a quota we have to fulfill?,


There isn't a quota - but what there is, is a massive cultural bias - especially among men - in favour of male authors (and musicians, and film makers, etc etc), and unless we make a conscious effort to challenge that then it'll stay that way. 

My cultural life is richer since I started paying attention to how diverse it is, fwiw. Much richer.


----------



## Poot (Oct 17, 2021)

Winot said:


> Has he read it yet Poot?


Well, nine years later I must confess that I've still never seen him read any book by a female author. And I am still making an effort to read male authors. So same/same, really!


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 17, 2021)

BillRiver said:


> What does authenticity mean in this context?



Good point. For me can you write about it really.

For me whether ELJames is a guy or Eleanor Roosevelt is a lady?


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

bimble said:


> *I do seem to enjoy female writers of fiction* more on average, & reckon maybe it has to do with us being inculcated with empathy more than men are, making women better at writing complex & believable 3D characters.


Agree with this, especially when it comes to science fiction, but also historical fiction. Actually, pretty much any fiction


----------



## nagapie (Oct 17, 2021)

xenon said:


> You bumped this nine-year-old thread to say yes you read a book by a woman? That’s, well a bit tragic.


Have you read it? It's a special book so I think that could have been the impetus.


----------



## BigMoaner (Oct 17, 2021)

I’m enjoying flannery O’Connor at the moment. Love southern deep south literature


----------



## nagapie (Oct 17, 2021)

If you only read white men, you only hear their story. Which is already the dominant viewpoint.
Of course you should read from diverse authors.


----------



## T & P (Oct 17, 2021)

Frankly I am amazed this question was asked in these boards in the first place. What kind of antediluvian knuckle-dragging cunt would ever consider not reading a book written by a woman? Here, or anywhere else in the civilised world for that matter, outside of far right message boards? 

What next? ‘Men, would you watch a film directed by a woman, or fly on a plane with a female flight crew?’


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 17, 2021)

T & P said:


> Frankly I am amazed this question was asked in these boards in the first place. What kind of antediluvian knuckle-dragging cunt would ever consider not reading a book written by a woman? Here, or anywhere else in the civilised world for that matter, outside of far right message boards?
> 
> What next? ‘Men, would you watch a film directed by a woman, or fly on a plane with a female flight crew?’


i think you have misunderstood the question asked


----------



## T & P (Oct 17, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> i think you have misunderstood the question asked


Perhaps. Saw the thread title and jumped right in without reading even the OP. My apologies.


----------



## xenon (Oct 17, 2021)

nagapie said:


> Have you read it? It's a special book so I think that could have been the impetus.



I haven’t, to be fair. Not that I’ve wouldn’t.
Most of the books I read are written by men. though I not long finished a book by a  woman  journalist. And I do have a sci-fi book amongst others on the go.
I just found the bump funny. Yes finally I have nine years later, sort of thing.


----------



## strung out (Oct 17, 2021)

killer b said:


> I wonder if the 'I don't pay attention to what sex the author is I just read what's good' crew ever check what the ratio of male to female authors they read is? Cause I did a couple of years ago and it wasn't great. It's much better now since I started paying attention...


See also 'I don't see race'.


----------



## Gromit (Oct 18, 2021)

nagapie said:


> I prefer female authors. Most men write women terribly. I remember the first time I read a Paul Auster book, I couldn't believe how wooden and one dimensional his female characters were.





> Receptionist: How do you write women so well?
> Melvin Udall: I think of a man, and I take away reason and accountability.


----------



## Santino (Oct 18, 2021)

Fuck off, Gromit


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 18, 2021)

Fuck off Gromit


----------



## Gromit (Oct 18, 2021)

Fuck off, Gromit

No you fuck off.


----------



## Gromit (Oct 18, 2021)

Santino said:


> Fuck off, Gromit


No you fuck off.


----------



## Gromit (Oct 18, 2021)

Santino said:


> Fuck off, Gromit


p.s. You don't even understand the quote do you?!


----------



## Santino (Oct 18, 2021)

Gromit said:


> p.s. You don't even understand the quote do you?!


Fuck off


----------



## Gromit (Oct 18, 2021)

Santino said:


> Fuck off


No you fuck off.


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 18, 2021)

Gromit said:


> No you fuck off.



Fuck off and when you get there, fuck off from there too, then fuck off some more. Keep fucking off until you get back. Then fuck off again, Gromit.


----------



## pogofish (Oct 18, 2021)

I can't say the the sex of any author has ever made any difference to whether I read their book or not.

And yes, I have read plenty of books by female authors over the years.


----------



## BillRiver (Oct 18, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Good point. For me can you write about it really.
> 
> For me whether ELJames is a guy or Eleanor Roosevelt is a lady?



The more you say, the less I understand.

Never mind, I can live without.


----------



## nogojones (Oct 18, 2021)

I was all "I'll read anything and I'm blind to sex, as long as it's good" a few years back. It may have been this thread, pre-bump, and the reading challenge thread - which made me list the books I'm reading, to see that I was reading far more male authors than female.

I've tried to make an effort to read more female authors, but still it's about 70/30. I think that's because though I mainly read books on the tablet where I have a much wider choice of material, I still usually have a couple of paper books on the go at any given time (bath n bog books). I stopped buying paper books a good few years back and a lot of the ones I have are either modern classics or politics and history from 45-90 which both seem to be heavily weighted to male authors.

Thing is, over the last few years the majority of novels that I REALLY enjoyed were by women, so I only seem to be loosing out by having more male authors in my lists.


----------



## shifting gears (Oct 18, 2021)

Just looked at the 20 books I’ve read this year and not a single female author on there. Bit of an eye-opener. 

Am gonna prioritise borrowing titles from Edna O’Brien and Sally Rooney which I’ve had in my library list for a while…


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

pogofish said:


> I can't say the the sex of any author has ever made any difference to whether I read their book or not.


I'm sure, but the society we live in is one which is more likely to publish and promote male voices, and even the most right-on of us have depths of internalised biases which - unchecked - will lead us to favour one sex over the the other without us even being aware that it's happening. 

We can all think of many female authors we've read, probably enough for us to comfortably say 'I read plenty of female authors' and think that means we don't have a problem. The actual ratio is often surprising - I'd encourage everyone to look at it, and maybe think about whether being more conscious about the diversity of voices they read is a good idea.


----------



## nogojones (Oct 18, 2021)

shifting gears said:


> Just looked at the 20 books I’ve read this year and not a single female author on there. Bit of an eye-opener.
> 
> Am gonna prioritise borrowing titles from Edna O’Brien and Sally Rooney which I’ve had in my library list for a while…


The first Sally Rooney was one of the ones I really enjoyed


----------



## shifting gears (Oct 18, 2021)

nogojones said:


> The first Sally Rooney was one of the ones I really enjoyed



I’ve seen her mentioned positively on urban quite a bit I think


----------



## MickiQ (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> There isn't a quota - but what there is, is a massive cultural bias - especially among men - in favour of male authors (and musicians, and film makers, etc etc), and unless we make a conscious effort to challenge that then it'll stay that way.
> 
> My cultural life is richer since I started paying attention to how diverse it is, fwiw. Much richer.


Good for you, my cultural life has probably been enriched by reading women authors as well, however I think that might very well be a result of actually reading rather than the gender of any author.
A  person's reading choice is entirely their own, The cultural viewpoint of someone who reads exclusively Mills & Boon is just as valid as that of someone who only reads long boring books by dead Russians.


bimble said:


> My most recent bf was / is so right on he’s only reading women writers until 2023. I don’t really think about it much but roughly I do seem to enjoy female writers of fiction more on average, & reckon maybe it has to do with us being inculcated with empathy more than men are, making women better at writing complex & believable 3D characters. This is a massive generalisation yes. Nonfiction there’s nothing in it far as I can see.


Agree with this, I have read books by female authors whose male characters are completely believable from my male viewpoint and male authors whose female characters are completely believable also from my male viewpoint. I suspect that the reverse is not true and that a female reader would probably see through female characters written by a man. I'm sure someone will be along shortly to pull me up on promoting stereotypes but I do think women have more complex personalities than men do.


----------



## Gromit (Oct 18, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> Fuck off and when you get there, fuck off from there too, then fuck off some more. Keep fucking off until you get back. Then fuck off again, Gromit.


No you.


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

MickiQ said:


> Good for you, my cultural life has probably been enriched by reading women authors as well, however I think that might very well be a result of actually reading rather than the gender of any author.
> A person's reading choice is entirely their own, The cultural viewpoint of someone who reads exclusively Mills & Boon is just as valid as that of someone who only reads long boring books by dead Russians.


of course a person's reading choice is entirely their own: but we don't make those choices in a vacuum. Our choices are influenced by the culture around us, and by unconscious biases, etc etc, which favour men, sometimes overwhelmingly. It's possible for us to take a more active role in our choices though, that's all I'm saying.


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

It's a shame that being more conscious of the diversity of authors you're reading is often characterised as a joyless box-ticking exercise, when literally everyone I've spoken to who's given it a go feels they've benefited from it.


----------



## bimble (Oct 18, 2021)

Men like Poot 's partner, who won't or don't read books by women, i wonder what's going on with them, do they think women just write women's stuff and that's not relevant to them? Or that women are less likely to have anything worthwhile to say? Just seems really bizarre tbh.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Oct 18, 2021)

I definitely would have been a 'I'm totally indifferent' person about this except a few years ago I decided as a New Year's Resolution to read a book a week for a year, and I kept a list. And when I got a few months in it was obvious that my reading list was overwhelmingly male. I did make an effort for a while to redress the balance and try to keep it in mind now but without actually listing them out I don't really know how successful I am at that. 

A lot of it was non-fiction so I think a large element of it was who gets to be a published author on certain subjects as much as my own biases. Well I hope so anyway.


----------



## xenon (Oct 18, 2021)

The vast majority of stuff I've read over the last few years has been by male authors TBH. Scifi in particular as a genre. I'm not consciously avoiding female authors I don't think. But there's a male bias in terms of the type of books within that genre. My choosing to read them is obviously effected by what I find interesting informed by being a bloke, socialisation and publishing discrimination. I should read more widely though TBF.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 18, 2021)

Gromit said:


> p.s. You don't even understand the quote do you?!


It’s from As Good As It Gets.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 18, 2021)

alfajobrob said:


> Good point. For me can you write about it really.
> 
> For me whether ELJames is a guy or Eleanor Roosevelt is a lady?


You what? If you had read more widely, you might have been able to write coherent sentences


----------



## nogojones (Oct 18, 2021)

xenon said:


> The vast majority of stuff I've read over the last few years has been by male authors TBH. Scifi in particular as a genre. I'm not consciously avoiding female authors I don't think. But there's a male bias in terms of the type of books within that genre. My choosing to read them is obviously effected by what I find interesting informed by being a bloke, socialisation and publishing discrimination. I should read more widely though TBF.


Some of the best sci-fi I've read recently has been by women

Margret Atwood
Ann Leckie
NK Jemisin
Ursula Le Guin 

Just off the top of my head


----------



## strung out (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> I'm sure, but the society we live in is one which is more likely to publish and promote male voices, and even the most right-on of us have depths of internalised biases which - unchecked - will lead us to favour one sex over the the other without us even being aware that it's happening.
> 
> We can all think of many female authors we've read, probably enough for us to comfortably say 'I read plenty of female authors' and think that means we don't have a problem. The actual ratio is often surprising - I'd encourage everyone to look at it, and maybe think about whether being more conscious about the diversity of voices they read is a good idea.


A common argument I've heard - which isn't completely without merit- is that the authors published in a reader's favoured genre are overwhelmingly male. This is undoubtedly true for things like history, crime, sci-fi etc,, but while commissioning editors obviously have a fair amount of power in changing this, they will react to what sells, and as the consumer, the easy way to ensure that we have more diverse voices available to us in our chosen genre is to read and support the authors writing in that genre who don't come from that dominating demographic.


----------



## flypanam (Oct 18, 2021)

My wife has really pushed me to read more women and black authors. Have so say That while I found Girl, Women, Other an entirely dull read, the essays of Rachel Kushner are fucking fantastic and worth every household having a copy. 

We buy a lot of fiction and this year the standout book so far are the short stories of Vanessa Onwuemezi Dark Neighbourhood and we’re really looking forward to Olga Tokarczuk’s The books of Jacob. 

It has been an eye opener broadening the scope of what I read, and I do feel I have a richer cultural life.


----------



## xenon (Oct 18, 2021)

nogojones said:


> Some of the best sci-fi I've read recently has been by women
> 
> Margret Atwood
> Ann Leckie
> ...



I've read one of those. Not got round to the others but mean to at some point.

Currently reading this if anyone's interested.








						A Memory Called Empire - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				




But of the particular techie scifi sub genre, the male bias is more pronounced.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> It's a shame that being more conscious of the diversity of authors you're reading is often characterised as a joyless box-ticking exercise, when literally everyone I've spoken to who's given it a go feels they've benefited from it.



Agreed. The thing is the alternative is presented as some sort of objective book quality maximisation exercise whereas actually what you're doing a lot of the time is just taking a punt, I'd have thought. If I pick a book by an author I haven't read before I don't know how good it's going to be.


----------



## Signal 11 (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> The actual ratio is often surprising - I'd encourage everyone to look at it, and maybe think about whether being more conscious about the diversity of voices they read is a good idea.



Just tried this and it's worse than I expected:

2014: 0/17
2015: 2/15
2016: 4/15
2017: 4/21
2018: 1/11
2019: 2/14
2020: 1/12
2021: 4/10


----------



## BoatieBird (Oct 18, 2021)

So far this year I've read 41 books, 22 of them have been by female authors.
Not a conscious thing, but a fairly even split


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

Signal 11 said:


> Just tried this and it's worse than I expected:
> 
> 2014: 0/17
> 2015: 2/15
> ...


Yep - it's always a really interesting exercise IME: you can learn a lot of unexpected things about yourself by looking at the actual statistics.


----------



## RoyReed (Oct 18, 2021)

I've just had a look through my bookshelves and the split is about 40/60 (women/men). It includes:

Jane Austen
Charlotte Bronte
Emily Bronte
Virginia Wolfe
Mary Shelley
Zadie Smith
Harper Lee
Anaias Nin
Susan Sontag
Arundhati Roy
Edna O'Brien
Beryl Bainbridge
Lyn Reid Banks
Caitlin Moran
Barbara Tuchman
Margery Kempe
Simone de Beauvoir
Nancy Mitford
Stella Gibbons
Hilary Mantel
Mary Beard
Toni Mount
Henrietta Leyser


----------



## platinumsage (Oct 18, 2021)

Enid Blyton, Susan Cooper, Joanna Trollope, Ursula le Guin off the top of my head.

I don’t read much fiction.


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

platinumsage said:


> I don’t read much fiction.


I have heard that some non-fiction books are written by women too.


----------



## bimble (Oct 18, 2021)

This seems un-great, just found when looking for stats.


it is from 'goodreads' which i have an idea is a bit like richard & judy bookclub so not sure if it means very much really but still.


----------



## seeformiles (Oct 18, 2021)

Like some others here, as long as it’s a good book I don’t really care. I love crime fiction and find those written by women (and esp. the descriptions of the crimes) are pretty visceral compared to most of the male authors in the same genre. Val McDermid I find requires a very strong stomach but I’m currently reading my way through Sharon Bolton’s Lacey Flint series which are brilliantly plotted and marginally less gory than Ms McDermid.


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> I have heard that some non-fiction books are written by women too.


It's interesting though - I've just broken down my numbers for this year so far, and mine come to:
Fiction - 11 by women, 6 by men
Non-fiction - 6 by women, 9 by men
Plus two poetry books by women, and two books with multiple authors of mixed gender. So that fiction/non-fiction split does definitely seem to be a noticeable thing, at least in my reading. Also worth acknowledging that my numbers are probably a bit thrown off because I decided that this was going to be the year I read that big sequence of five Doris Lessing books, so my numbers would look worse if you narrowed it down to "books by women who aren't Doris Lessing."


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

seeformiles said:


> Like some others here, as long as it’s a good book I don’t really care.


what's the ratio?


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 18, 2021)

bimble said:


> This seems un-great, just found when looking for stats.
> 
> View attachment 293248
> it is from 'goodreads' which i have an idea is a bit like richard & judy bookclub so not sure if it means very much really but still.


wonder what it'd be like several years down the line


----------



## seeformiles (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> what's the ratio?



Not sure - I read a lot of biography and that’s probably more male biased (authors and subjects) but art and design and history books seem to be split more evenly. On the whole (looking at my bookshelves) it’s about 2:1 in favour of male authors. I’ve not really properly thought about it before but I’m pretty sure there’s not been any real conscious bias. Be interesting to see how the split is generally according to subject matter. I don’t really have many books that would fall into a really crude gender targeted readership i.e. Andy McNabb / Jenny Colgan but am pretty put off by either extreme. Good question 🙂


----------



## D'wards (Oct 18, 2021)

I hold no prejudice when choosing books to read- positive or negative- but I suspect I read a lot more male authors.

I've just checked my stats for this year 23 read or reading - 22 by male authors.

I would say I'd try and read more by female authors,  but I feel life is too short to select my next book on gender rather than what I fancy. 

I'd just like to caveat that I have read loads and loads by female authors- all Sue Townsend, most Agatha Christie, most J.K Rowling, Lionel Shriver, Donna Tartt, Hilary Mantel etc and they have been amongst the best books I've read


----------



## Winot (Oct 18, 2021)

Just checked:

2020 - 11/25 women
2021 - 6/21 women

Most of the books written by women were fiction. The non-fiction I read tends to be 17th century history which is very male.


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

D'wards said:


> I hold no prejudice when choosing books to read- positive or negative- but I suspect I read a lot more male authors.
> 
> I've just checked my stats for this year 23 read or reading - 22 by male authors.


You aren't aware of holding any prejudice. The stats suggest something other though.


----------



## D'wards (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> You aren't aware of holding any prejudice. The stats suggest something other though.


Appens as maybe


----------



## nogojones (Oct 18, 2021)

xenon said:


> I've read one of those. Not got round to the others but mean to at some point.
> 
> Currently reading this if anyone's interested.
> 
> ...


Another one for the list


----------



## wtfftw (Oct 18, 2021)

For years I only bought books or music by women. I remember as a teen being so fed up of everything visible being so male dominated - including the stuff we studied for English GCSE. 

Now I barely read but nine times out of ten it'll be a woman author. I've no time for TV and films with no women in either. I'm sure in some ways I'm missing out but in other ways I'm not.


----------



## bimble (Oct 18, 2021)

D'wards said:


> I hold no prejudice when choosing books to read.. I've just checked my stats for this year 23 read or reading - 22 by male authors.



This does make me laugh. 
What do you think's going on there just coincidence a roll of the dice ?


----------



## JimW (Oct 18, 2021)

Hard to do the stats as don't keep a reading diary but should think men predominate most years, though not always as when I was working through Meiskins Wood or when I got into a series of potboiler detective novels set in Rome that meant a spree of about twenty books.
Mostly get asked to translate male writers but obviously probably more likely to look for a woman to translate a woman's original. though know the bloke who translated Shanghai Baby which is mostly sex and shopping and he could hardly have been a less suitable choice.


----------



## D'wards (Oct 18, 2021)

bimble said:


> This does make me laugh.
> What do you think's going on there just coincidence a roll of the dice ?


Nah. I just largely seem to prefer books by men that is all.
Its not a policy, I just read wherever I want to read free of "diversity quotas".
Or certainly not concerned that any sod is gonna  judge me cos my reading list is not diverse enough


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

FTR I'm not judging you - I found similar when I checked a few years ago, it's totally normal. Aren't you at least a bit curious why you prefer male writers to such a degree though?


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 18, 2021)

D'wards said:


> Nah. I just largely seem to prefer books by men that is all.
> Its not a policy, I just read wherever I want to read free of "diversity quotas".
> Or certainly not concerned that any sod is gonna  judge me cos my reading list is not diverse enough


Not a prejudice, just a preference. Righto!


----------



## D'wards (Oct 18, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Not a prejudice, just a preference. Righto!


Whatever you like.

I'm not interested in engaging with an oddball off the Internet policing my reading lists, so you crack on


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 18, 2021)

D'wards said:


> Nah. I just largely seem to prefer books by men that is all.


how do you know if you prefer books by men if you read so few books by women?


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 18, 2021)

D'wards said:


> Whatever you like.
> 
> I'm not interested in engaging with an oddball off the Internet policing my reading lists, so you crack on


No one’s doing that. Just found that comment funny


----------



## bimble (Oct 18, 2021)

i wasn't having a go D'wards your post was funny thats all


----------



## D'wards (Oct 18, 2021)

Pickman's model said:


> how do you know if you prefer books by men if you read so few books by women?


I have read loads of books by women- some of my favourite books are by women- examples can be given. And I read a Martina Cole book which was the worst book I've read for years

But I obviously have an unconscious bias as looking through my reading lists on your threads through the years the majority of the books I read are by men (which is far far from uncommon I think you'll find if you have a scan of all the lists by people).


----------



## D'wards (Oct 18, 2021)

bimble said:


> i wasn't having a go D'wards your post was funny thats all


Sorry to you and Orang Utan  - when challenged on these here boards I tend to take it as a potential pile on and come out swinging.

I'll read three Sophie Kinsella's and two Jenny Colgan's as penance 😉


----------



## Superdupastupor (Oct 18, 2021)

Hillary MAN-TELL , damn right-the only other author whose entire oeuvre I've tried to read is Graham Greene.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 18, 2021)

Winot said:


> Just checked:
> 
> 2020 - 11/25 women
> 2021 - 6/21 women
> ...


is it? you read fuck all about pirates, then, or you'd be singing claire jowitt's praises. then there's c.v. wedgwood's classic history of the thirty years' war - a couple of the top of my head. Oh and lyndal roper's work on witchcraft in germany


----------



## killer b (Oct 18, 2021)

FWIW I'm still not doing that great - I just checked and I'm on 12 men vs 7 women since I started my most recent list...


----------



## agricola (Oct 18, 2021)

Never really thought about this before, but although I've got few female-authored books in my almost entirely non-fiction history collection probably about half of my favourite books would qualify - Frances Stonor Saunders' _Diabolical Englishman_ (a life of Sir John Hawkwood), Kathryn Tempest's _Brutus_ (the best book I've read over the last few years) and Antonia Nevill's English translation of Serge Lancel's _Hannibal_.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 18, 2021)

I've recently been enjoying Marilyn Peterson's works on criminal intelligence, gisela bichler's 'understanding criminal networks' and Manon hedenborg White's fascinating 'the eloquent blood: the goddess babalon and the construction of feminism in western esotericism'


----------



## nagapie (Oct 18, 2021)

wtfftw said:


> For years I only bought books or music by women. I remember as a teen being so fed up of everything visible being so male dominated - including the stuff we studied for English GCSE.
> 
> Now I barely read but nine times out of ten it'll be a woman author. I've no time for TV and films with no women in either. I'm sure in some ways I'm missing out but in other ways I'm not.


Me too. Definitely not missing out, women are better.


----------



## Poot (Oct 18, 2021)

nagapie said:


> Me too. Definitely not missing out, women are better.


Oh, I think it can be rewarding to sometimes read a book that was written by a man. Some of them are quite good.

Hee hee.


----------



## nagapie (Oct 18, 2021)

Poot said:


> Oh, I think it can be rewarding to sometimes read a book that was written by a man. Some of them are quite good.
> 
> Hee hee.


I know but somehow even though I read one really good one, I still only read a book by a man one in one billion books.


----------



## D'wards (Oct 18, 2021)

killer b said:


> FTR I'm not judging you - I found similar when I checked a few years ago, it's totally normal. Aren't you at least a bit curious why you prefer male writers to such a degree though?


Yah, I like quite hard bleak stuff. Hubert Selby, McCarthy etc.

However, I do also like quite lighthearted cosy stuff too - I've read every word Sue Townsend put to paper, and I love the Darling Buds of May series.

I like to plan my reading ahead, cos I'm odd like that, and next and third I'm reading books by Hanya Yanagihara and Susanna Clarke- not because they're female but because they came highly recommended and I found the premises (sp?) intriguing.


----------



## toblerone3 (Oct 18, 2021)

xenon said:


> You bumped this nine-year-old thread to say yes you read a book by a woman? That’s, well a bit tragic.



Nothing tragic about it. Don't know why the thread came to my attention but I just answered the question in the thread title and mentioned a book that I'd enjoyed recently written by a woman.

Didn't realise it was an old thread. Its still a valid question and still an interesting question. I've read and enjoyed many books written by woman. For a couple of years I, for instance, only read fiction written by 20th Century American Woman.


----------



## yield (Oct 19, 2021)

Those that think it's by quota or some sort of virtue signally make me laugh.

How about you read something that makes you uncomfortable?

The first book is often biographical. See what it's like with the shoe is on the other foot.


----------



## D'wards (Oct 19, 2021)

bimble said:


> This seems un-great, just found when looking for stats.
> 
> View attachment 293248
> it is from 'goodreads' which i have an idea is a bit like richard & judy bookclub so not sure if it means very much really but still.


Tbf there is a huge market for the Pastel cover novels (Sophie Kinsella has sold over 40m books),  which I assume are hugely predominantly read by women. So that probably skews the figures.

Has anyone here read any of the Confessions of a Shopaholic type books? If so, any good.

Do they still write books for delinquent youth like the Skinhead and Suedehead books of the 70s and Yardie book's of the 90s?
Can't think I've come across any


----------



## braindancer (Oct 19, 2021)

I'm on a paltry 2/10 this year...  a few years ago I made a point of making sure my reading was balanced but I've let it slip without realising till now....  still time to slightly even things out!


----------



## killer b (Oct 19, 2021)

D'wards said:


> Tbf there is a huge market for the Pastel cover novels (Sophie Kinsella has sold over 40m books), which I assume are hugely predominantly read by women. So that probably skews the figures.


I'm not sure 'men don't read pink books' is a very convincing explanation tbh


----------



## bimble (Oct 19, 2021)

women do buy and read novels much more than men do, account for something like 80% of sales of novels apparently.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 19, 2021)

yield said:


> Those that think it's by quota or some sort of virtue signally make me laugh.
> 
> How about you read something that makes you uncomfortable?
> 
> The first book is often biographical. See what it's like with the shoe is on the other foot.


Quite, that idea tickled me when I read it - like we have wallcharts and tables or summat.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 19, 2021)

D'wards said:


> Tbf there is a huge market for the Pastel cover novels (Sophie Kinsella has sold over 40m books),  which I assume are hugely predominantly read by women. So that probably skews the figures.
> 
> Has anyone here read any of the Confessions of a Shopaholic type books? If so, any good.
> 
> ...


Women don't just write popular fiction like that, you know. I've just had a look at my 'to read' bookcase and can't find any books like that - in fact most of the books there written by women are non-fiction.


----------



## Winot (Oct 19, 2021)

Just make sure they really are a woman:









						Female Spanish thriller writer Carmen Mola revealed to be three men
					

Trio step out from behind pseudonym marketed as ‘Spain’s Elena Ferrante’ to accept €1m prize




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 19, 2021)

Winot said:


> Just make sure they really are a woman:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 that also happened a while back with Virago publishing a book of short stories purported to be written by an Asian woman but it being discovered later to be written by an English vicar.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 19, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> that also happened a while back with Virago publishing a book of short stories purported to be written by an Asian woman but it being discovered later to be written by an English vicar.


there is nothing to prevent an asian woman being an english vicar


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 19, 2021)

Pickman's model said:


> there is nothing to prevent an asian woman being an english vicar



What a strange thing to say in response to my post! I have not claimed otherwise 

 On this occasion it was a vicar who was a chaplain in a girls’ boarding school (Toby Forward, writing as Rahila Khan).


----------



## CNT36 (Oct 19, 2021)

This year so far and 2016 (the only ones I've noted what I read) it's at about 15% women authors. I am also reading two textbooks written by several people both of which have female authors. It's not a conscious thing not to read women authors. I may have scored slightly better last year.


----------



## hash tag (Oct 19, 2021)

I've never really noticed the sex or sexuality or even nationality of the authors. I read books with a subject that appeals to me. Thinking about it, two early authors I read were Josie Dew and Dervla Murphy.


----------



## rubbershoes (Oct 19, 2021)

Going back to Poot's original post, who wouldn't want to read Donna Tartt? Her books are fantastic


----------



## killer b (Oct 19, 2021)

hash tag said:


> I've never really noticed the sex or sexuality or even nationality of the authors.


I'm willing to bet it'll be something like 90% men


----------



## imposs1904 (Oct 20, 2021)

Signal 11 said:


> Just tried this and it's worse than I expected:
> 
> 2014: 0/17
> 2015: 2/15
> ...



This year so far,  I'm 3/38. A bit shit, innit? My only excuse is that I've read a lot of football and darts books this year, and both sports don't have that many female authors.


----------



## bimble (Oct 20, 2021)

what's a book about darts like? 
Is it about technique or like biographies of the great darts players?


----------



## Johnny Vodka (Oct 20, 2021)

Johnny Vodka said:


> I'm reading Summerwater by Sarah Moss at the moment.  Liking it a lot.



Actually, before starting this I was reading We Need To Talk About Kevin by Lionel Shriver  (much better than the film IMO).


----------



## imposs1904 (Oct 20, 2021)

bimble said:


> what's a book about darts like?
> Is it about technique or like biographies of the great darts players?



Biographies mostly, though there was one American novel which was incredibly macabre. I really wasn't expecting that.

I'd recommend Bobby George's autobiography to anyone, whether they're into darts or not. His story of growing up in poverty in post-war London is Dickensian in places. A really vivid read.


----------



## Fedayn (Oct 20, 2021)

imposs1904 said:


> I don't read as many female authors as men. Not sure why, tbh. But female writers that I do read include Denise Mina, Pat Barker, Val McDermid and Laura Hird.


I've read a few of Denise Mina's books after I reviewed Garnethilll for the Scottish Socialist Voice many years ago. Good writer imho.


----------



## Spymaster (Oct 20, 2021)

bimble said:


> what's a book about darts like?



To the point.


----------



## Sue (Oct 20, 2021)

Fedayn said:


> I've read a few of Denise Mina's books after I reviewed Garnethilll for the Scottish Socialist Voice many years ago. Good writer imho.


If you haven't read it, I'd highly recommend The Panoptican by Jenni Fagan.


----------



## Fedayn (Oct 21, 2021)

killer b said:


> I'm willing to bet it'll be something like 90% men


That low?


----------



## Maggot (Oct 21, 2021)

imposs1904 said:


> Biographies mostly, though there was one American novel which was incredibly macabre. I really wasn't expecting that.
> 
> I'd recommend Bobby George's autobiography to anyone, whether they're into darts or not. His story of growing up in poverty in post-war London is Dickensian in places. A really vivid read.


Jocky Wilson Said.


----------



## CNT36 (Oct 21, 2021)

rubbershoes said:


> Going back to Poot's original post, who wouldn't want to read Donna Tartt? Her books are fantastic


I've always assumed her name was a pseudonym and it was trashy sub Mills and Boon crap. Not helped that someone I worked with who read her books was  a big and vocal fifty shades fan. If I regularly read novels I'd have avoided her stuff.


----------



## rubbershoes (Oct 21, 2021)

CNT36 said:


> I've always assumed her name was a pseudonym and it was trashy sub Mills and Boon crap. Not helped that someone I worked with who read her books was  a big and vocal fifty shades fan. If I regularly read novels I'd have avoided her stuff.



Two of her books would be in my top ten, if I did one.  And she's only written three novels


----------



## hash tag (Oct 21, 2021)

Has this Ben mentioned yet. Seems fitting in here  Female Spanish thriller writer Carmen Mola revealed to be three men


----------



## andysays (Oct 21, 2021)

Interesting thread.

I don't read nearly as many books as I used to (possibly because I now spend the time I used to spend reading books reading and posting on Urban).

When I do, I tend to read "classics" or "modern classics", and women authors are in a very small minority in those categories.

I didn't realise quite how few women authors I have on my book shelves until I had a look just now. It starts off OK with a few Jane Austins and a couple of Brontes, but then there appears to be no books by female authors until I get to Mary Shelley.

Can anyone suggest a few female authors who are part of the established canon so I can start to redress the balance.


----------



## Poot (Oct 21, 2021)

andysays said:


> Interesting thread.
> 
> I don't read nearly as many books as I used to (possibly because I now spend the time I used to spend reading books reading and posting on Urban).
> 
> ...


If you like the classics, I might suggest that Daphne Du Maurier should be next in line. Jean Rhys is good but sad (Wide Sargasso Sea is Jane Eyre told from the first Mrs Rochester's PoV).


----------



## killer b (Oct 21, 2021)

Mrs B reckons George Elliot is the best of all writers, and has spent the year reading all of her books in order (she's just finished Middlemarch and declares it the best book she's ever read)


----------



## Poot (Oct 21, 2021)

killer b said:


> Mrs B reckons George Elliot is the best of all writers, and has spent the year reading all of her books in order (she's just finished Middlemarch and declares it the best book she's ever read)


I have never read any and I don't know why. I may follow Mrs B's lead. Good call.


----------



## sojourner (Oct 21, 2021)

andysays said:


> Can anyone suggest a few female authors who are *part of the established canon* so I can start to redress the balance.


I don't really understand this bit. Which canon? The male one? Or do you mean widely read female writers? 

I would always recommend Toni Morrison and Maya Angelou.


----------



## Sue (Oct 21, 2021)

andysays said:


> Interesting thread.
> 
> I don't read nearly as many books as I used to (possibly because I now spend the time I used to spend reading books reading and posting on Urban).
> 
> ...



In no partic order (having just looked at my bookshelves):

Edith Wharton
Elizabeth Gaskell
Margaret Attwood
Hilary Mantel
George Eliot
Donna Tartt
E Annie Proulx
A L Kennedy
Ali Smith
Jenni Fagan
Zadie Smith
Jessie Kesson
Denise Mina
Louise Welsh


----------



## marshall (Oct 21, 2021)

I read masses, and most of my favourite authors are female, Donna Tartt, Tana French, Sarah Waters, and  particularly Rachel Kushner - The Flamethrowers is fantastic. Best novel I’ve read this year could by Great Circle, Maggie Shipstead.


----------



## killer b (Oct 21, 2021)

marshall said:


> I read masses, and most of my favourite authors are female, Donna Tartt, Tana French, Sarah Waters, and  particularly Rachel Kushner - The Flamethrowers is fantastic. Best novel I’ve read this year could by Great Circle, Maggie Shipstead.


what's the ratio though?


----------



## andysays (Oct 21, 2021)

Poot said:


> If you like the classics, I might suggest that Daphne Du Maurier should be next in line. Jean Rhys is good but sad (Wide Sargasso Sea is Jane Eyre told from the first Mrs Rochester's PoV).


Thanks. I'll give Du Maurier a try.

I think I may have read Wide Sargasso Sea (or perhaps another Jean Rhys) some years ago and not really got on with it.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 21, 2021)

One author Kameron recommended to me years back was poppy z brite, an excellent writer


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Oct 21, 2021)

I don’t read anywhere near as much fiction as I ought to but with the non fiction I read it’s the subject matter that’s of interest and not the author. I recently read From Russia With Blood and that was written by someone called Heidi Blake. And Goldfinger and Me by his ex missus.


----------



## andysays (Oct 21, 2021)

sojourner said:


> I don't really understand this bit. Which canon? The male one? Or do you mean widely read female writers?
> 
> I would always recommend Toni Morrison and Maya Angelou.


I guess I meant the canon of generally accepted literary classics - stuff that is (or might be) published by Penguin Classics or Modern Classics.

But most of that is male, so it maybe it would be simpler/better to ask about widely read female writers.


----------



## andysays (Oct 21, 2021)

Sue said:


> In no partic order (having just looked at my bookshelves):
> 
> Edith Wharton
> Elizabeth Gaskell
> ...


Thanks


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 21, 2021)

andysays said:


> I guess I meant the canon of generally accepted literary classics - stuff that is (or might be) published by Penguin Classics or Modern Classics.
> 
> But most of that is male, so it maybe it would be simpler/better to ask about widely read female writers.


Have you tried Hilary mantel?


----------



## JimW (Oct 21, 2021)

I had a period of reading a load of Marge Piercy who seemed to come out of the US New Left, and it's one about radicals staying underground that recall most enjoying. Very long time back.
Can't second middlemarch enough either, in completely opposite vein.


----------



## andysays (Oct 21, 2021)

Pickman's model said:


> Have you tried Hilary mantel?


No. Can you suggest a particular title?


----------



## JimW (Oct 21, 2021)

As well as Cromwell ones thought Mantel's shelf bender on the French Revolution was excellent, not read any of her contemporary ones bar a short story.


----------



## Magnus McGinty (Oct 21, 2021)

Politically I have read Sex, Race and Class by Selma James. I probably ought to again.


----------



## 8ball (Oct 21, 2021)

bimble said:


> women do buy and read novels much more than men do, account for something like 80% of sales of novels apparently.



A friend of mine joined a sci-fi book group because it was the only one with any men in it (she was kind of half-looking for a boyf at the time and doesn't much like pubbing or clubbing).

My bookshelf is currently really heavily male-dominated, only exceptions being Scarlett Thomas, Dorothy Rowe, Vicky Coren and Germaine Greer.


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## Steel Icarus (Oct 21, 2021)

Carson McCullers is a great female writer; I own _The heart is a lonely hunter_ and _Ballad of the Sad Café_ which are both superb books of a sort with Steinbeck


----------



## Sue (Oct 21, 2021)

andysays said:


> No. Can you suggest a particular title?


Start with Wolf Hall. First in a trilogy and they're all excellent.

Or a A Place of Greater Safety if you like a bit of French revolutionary shenanigans.

Eta There's also an excellent (BBC?) adaptation of WH which is definitely worth watching once you've read the books.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 21, 2021)

Rose Tremain and Pat Barker don't get nearly enough respect or admiration


----------



## Idaho (Oct 21, 2021)

I guessed that of my last 50 books, about 15 would be women writers. I overestimated - it was 10.

I read a fair amount of science fiction and history, in my defence.


----------



## 8ball (Oct 21, 2021)

I'm putting it down to reading the female authors first and then giving the books to other people.


----------



## Sue (Oct 21, 2021)

Orang Utan said:


> Rose Tremain and Pat Barker don't get nearly enough respect or admiration


Oh yes, good shout.


----------



## JimW (Oct 21, 2021)

Another classic is Kerri Hulme's (sp?) Bone People in a Maori setting. Again memory a bit dim other than it was good.
ETA Keri not Kerri looking it up


----------



## Steel Icarus (Oct 21, 2021)

Also highly recommended: a book likely to make my top twenty if I could be arsed to compile one would be _Geek Love_ by Katherine Dunn, about a travelling troupe of deliberately-created circus freaks. It's terrific.


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## RainbowTown (Oct 21, 2021)

S☼I said:


> Carson McCullers is a great female writer; I own _The heart is a lonely hunter_ and _Ballad of the Sad Café_ which are both superb books of a sort with Steinbeck



Seconded. Her life was blighted with illness and misfortune but she produced some fantastic work. Along with Flannery O' Connor and Eudora Welty, the greatest of all female US Southern writers. And she was a favourite of Tennessee Williams, Gore Vidal, Graham Greene and Truman Capote. Infact Graham Greene preferred her to William Faulkner.


----------



## Shippou-Sensei (Oct 21, 2021)

Yes I do. Even in the sci-fi fantasy ghetto a lot of the authors I read are female. 
A fair number of my manga authors too. At least the ones I own physically.


----------



## JimW (Oct 21, 2021)

For non fiction, not only was Ellen Meiksins Wood a brilliant mind she was a great prose stylist too, won't get much better or clearer historical analytical writing.


----------



## 8ball (Oct 21, 2021)

JimW said:


> Another classic is Kerri Hulme's (sp?) *Bone People in a Maori setting*. Again memory a bit dim other than it was good.
> ETA Keri not Kerri looking it up



This sounds utterly perverted, as well as possibly racist.


----------



## Sue (Oct 21, 2021)

Iris Murdoch
Doris Lessing
Angela Carter
Elizabeth Taylor
Anais Nin


----------



## JimW (Oct 21, 2021)

8ball said:


> This sounds utterly perverted, as well as possibly racist.


Not in the Urban sense


----------



## bimble (Oct 21, 2021)

i've just been given a really fat book called the found and the lost, the collected novellas of ursula le guin (there's 13 of them). Thats going to be interesting, not a format I'm familiar with at all.

it's all a bit personal isn't it, i bought a couple of things by someone called Maggie O'Farrel because it was being plugged and she's won some prize but turns out I basically hate her writing and have no idea why she's popular. Odd. 
Handy tip: If you're quick you can press return on a kindle book order if you hate it and know that life is too short to plod on through.


----------



## 8ball (Oct 21, 2021)

JimW said:


> Not in the Urban sense



WHITI TE RAAAAA!  <does cum face>

<gets coat...>


----------



## JimW (Oct 21, 2021)

Alice Walker doesn't seem to have been mentioned, so her too. Color Purple lived up to the hype.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 21, 2021)

andysays said:


> No. Can you suggest a particular title?


As Sue says start with wolf hall


----------



## sojourner (Oct 21, 2021)

There was another thread about female writers ages ago. I put tons of recommendations on that.


----------



## Orang Utan (Oct 21, 2021)

I’ve been reading a bit of Patricia Highsmith recently and wow she can write, though she was clearly a disturbed and rather unpleasant person in real life.
And I’ve only just got into Shirley Jackson, who is just incredible too.


----------



## SpookyFrank (Oct 21, 2021)

The one time I actually hit my annual target on the urban reading challenge thread was also the year I set myself the extra target of reading 50% female authors. Led me to various people I maybe wouldn't have read otherwise.


----------



## RainbowTown (Oct 21, 2021)

JimW said:


> Alice Walker doesn't seem to have been mentioned, so her too. Color Purple lived up to the hype.



Never read Alice Walker, but Toni Morrison is a supreme writer and as good a novelist as any of her males contemporaries. She's up there with Colette (greatest female novelist of the 20th Century, no argument), Isak Dinesen and that great contingent of US female Southern writers.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 21, 2021)

RainbowTown said:


> Never read Alice Walker, but Toni Morrison is a supreme writer and as good a novelist as any of her males contemporaries. She's up there with Colette (greatest female novelist of the 20th Century, no argument), Isak Dinesen and that great contingent of US female Southern writers.


Oh yes - flannery o'connor is excellent


----------



## RainbowTown (Oct 21, 2021)

Pickman's model said:


> Oh yes - flannery o'connor is excellent



Totally, her short stories are strange and unsettling but shot through with humour and humanity. _Wise Blood _too is a real favourite with me and was actually made into a fine film which did the book full justice I think.


----------



## hitmouse (Oct 21, 2021)

CNT36 said:


> I've always assumed her name was a pseudonym and it was trashy sub Mills and Boon crap. Not helped that someone I worked with who read her books was  a big and vocal fifty shades fan. If I regularly read novels I'd have avoided her stuff.


I enjoy this misunderstanding, but no, while she may have inadvertently contributed to starting tiktok trends decades later, but I don't think anyone would accuse The Secret History of being sub-Mills and Boon.


hash tag said:


> Has this Ben mentioned yet. Seems fitting in here  Female Spanish thriller writer Carmen Mola revealed to be three men


No, the men are called Jorge, Antonio and Agustin, don't think any of them are called Ben.  


andysays said:


> Can anyone suggest a few female authors who are part of the established canon so I can start to redress the balance.


Almost all of the of the main ones I would've suggested have come up already, strongly seconding Highsmith, Jackson, Atwood, O'Connor, du Maurier, Murdoch and Carter. The main one I'd add would be Simone de Beauvoir, her fiction's proper great.
Oh, and Virginia Woolf and Joan Didion.


----------



## hash tag (Oct 21, 2021)

I'd much sooner turn to Mary Lovell for a good biography, Hannah Fry for layman's terms science, Mary Beard for history. I nearly missed Alice Roberts who writes very well.  I liked Monisha Rajesh even if she does come across as extremely privileged and entitled.


----------



## Steel Icarus (Oct 21, 2021)

Oh aye _Secret History_ I loved, one of those books where I wanted to know months later what they were all up to. Can't remember a thing about it now, though


----------



## oryx (Oct 21, 2021)

RainbowTown said:


> Never read Alice Walker, but Toni Morrison is a supreme writer and as good a novelist as any of her males contemporaries. She's up there with Colette (greatest female novelist of the 20th Century, no argument), Isak Dinesen and that great contingent of US female Southern writers.


Got into Colette a couple of years ago and intend to read more - her characterisation is so sharply and cleverly observed.

I'd second Doris Lessing, Angela Carter and Marge Piercy, and add Elena Ferrante. Her Neapolitan Quartet is a great snapshot of life in 20th century Italy from a political, feminist and deeply personal angle. It was massively hyped a few years ago but rightly so IMVHO.

I've been hugely impressed with Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie (Half of a Yellow Sun) and Aminatta Forna (The Hired Man - best book I've read in the last decade, was compelled to read it three times last year!) - but I've only read one book each.

I'm firmly with bimble on Maggie O'Farrell though.


----------



## JimW (Oct 22, 2021)

Zhang Ailing/Eileen Chang is probably the most famous Chinese woman writer whose stuff will be easy to find in translation; of course I've only read her in the original (smug  ) so not sure how good they are in English; Lust, Caution is based on one of her stories. Ding Ling aka Jiang Bingzhi is celebrated and was probably more popular here, partly because she was a lefty who stayed, but only read one short story by her. Must check more out; her bio makes her sound right up my street, not afraid to speak out.


----------



## Sue (Oct 22, 2021)

JimW said:


> Zhang Ailing/Eileen Chang is probably the most famous Chinese woman writer whose stuff will be easy to find in translation; of course I've only read her in the original (smug  ) so not sure how good they are in English; Lust, Caution is based on one of her stories. Ding Ling aka Jiang Bingzhi is celebrated and was probably more popular here, partly because she was a lefty who stayed, but only read one short story by her. Must check more out; her bio makes her sound right up my street, not afraid to speak out.


I've a copy of Love in a Fallen City translated by someone called Karen Kingsbury (I just checked). I didn't notice the translation which is probably a good sign? (Really liked it, really interesting to read about a world you know nothing about.


----------



## weltweit (Oct 22, 2021)

Harper Lee ranks among the best writers I have read.


----------



## strung out (Oct 22, 2021)

weltweit said:


> Harper Lee ranks among the best writers I have read.


Her writing really fell off a cliff after her first novel.


----------



## Buddy Bradley (Oct 24, 2021)

I just finished _More Than A Woman_ by Caitlin Moran. Despite being squarely not in her target audience - it's about how to survive being a middle-aged woman - I really enjoyed it. I've been a fan of hers since Naked City back in the early 90s, and her writing is still smart and very funny (despite needing to throw in a "dude" or "mate" at least once per page). It got a bit preachy towards the end, but there was still a lot there for a middle-aged man to agree with.


----------



## porp (Oct 24, 2021)

I too am a man who reads books by female writers. Feels so good to finally admit it!

Ar the risk of sounding like "I never think about race", I don't think that I was conscious about choosing those writers because they are women. Or conscious that this was some sort of mild taboo.

In my mid-twenties I fell for Anita Brookner in a big way, followed by Barbara Pym. If there is a thread that runs through Brookner, it is that self sacrifice and being "good" is always punished, and I must have identified with Pym's quietly desperate depictions of unworldly types knocked off balance by their encounters with life.

Perhaps 15 years later and I surprised myself with a deep dive into the books of Miss Read. Deeply unfashionable tales of village life and primary teaching , I think I needed the mumsy comfort at a time when I was losing my parents. 

The woman writer that has surprised me most is Jenni Eclair. I had always perceived her as a bit of a tiresome harridan based on her TV persona at the arse end of 80s/90s alternative comedy. How wrong can you be- she is a great writer who writes movingly about passion ,regret ,loss and the coming of wisdom.


----------



## Pickman's model (Oct 24, 2021)

Has no one else read Lindsey Davies' series of detective novels set in ancient Rome?


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## killer b (Oct 28, 2021)

porp said:


> Ar the risk of sounding like "I never think about race", I don't think that I was conscious about choosing those writers because they are women. Or conscious that this was some sort of mild taboo.


It isn't a taboo exactly - most men seem to think they don't care about what sex the author of the books they read is and they read plenty of female authors, but then when they check the actual ratio of male to female authors it's actually terrible. I recommend you conduct a review.


----------



## Agent Sparrow (Oct 28, 2021)

I’m a bit surprised to see so many people excusing themselves for not reading many women authors because they like sci fi, because I also like sci fi but the majority of books in that genre I’ve read over the last few years have been written by women.  Over my life time it can’t be too far off 50/50. Admittedly I tend to prefer character driven sci fi than the shiny technology kind. 

If you’re White this is a also a good exercise to do regarding books written by People of Colour. I’ve read far more books by Black authors in the last few years than I had previously and quite often it has opened up other worlds and perspectives, even if slightly uncomfortable perspectives because of highlighting quite how shit and insidious white supremacy is.


----------



## JimW (Oct 28, 2021)

Pickman's model said:


> Has no one else read Lindsey Davies' series of detective novels set in ancient Rome?


Yes, banged through those in quick succession. Bit pot boilery but enjoyed them.


----------



## D'wards (Oct 28, 2021)

Sue Townsend was a fantastic writer. Obvs the Adrian Mole series is a cultural goliath but I like her other books too - yknow, the ones where she humanises the royal family, ahem.

Her stuff was written in a light style but did often cover heavy topics. 

Sometimes a person needs a light read innit


----------



## D'wards (Oct 28, 2021)

As for sci fi ish type novels Station Eleven by Emily st John Mandel and The First Fifteen Lives of Harry August by Catherine Webb are both excellent modern novels


----------



## Winot (May 28, 2022)

Article in Guardian today:

Books by women that every man should read
Books by women that every man should read: chosen by Ian McEwan, Salman Rushdie, Richard Curtis and more


----------



## Agent Sparrow (May 28, 2022)

Winot said:


> Article in Guardian today:
> 
> Books by women that every man should read
> Books by women that every man should read: chosen by Ian McEwan, Salman Rushdie, Richard Curtis and more


I feel slightly dickheadish about saying this, but that comes across as a bit mansplainy to me. 

Yes I know many men only listen to the opinions of men


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## Pickman's model (May 28, 2022)

andysays said:


> I guess I meant the canon of generally accepted literary classics - stuff that is (or might be) published by Penguin Classics or Modern Classics.
> 
> But most of that is male, so it maybe it would be simpler/better to ask about widely read female writers.


i wanted to find out how many women authors had their works in penguin classics, and found this blog How Many Penguin Classics Were Written By Women? - Camile Blog. which was very interesting until i found they numbered emile zola among the female authors.


emile zola some time ago


----------



## Winot (May 28, 2022)

Agent Sparrow said:


> I feel slightly dickheadish about saying this, but that comes across as a bit mansplainy to me.
> 
> Yes I know many men only listen to the opinions of men


Yes fair point.

I suppose at least it’s mansplaining to men.


----------



## Pickman's model (May 28, 2022)

Agent Sparrow said:


> I feel slightly dickheadish about saying this, but that comes across as a bit mansplainy to me.
> 
> Yes I know many men only listen to the opinions of men


yeh but that's the guardian for you


----------



## yield (May 28, 2022)

Female Authors
					

I've had a look at my book shelf and tried to remember all of the books I have read, and it seems I've only read one by a female author*. I generally read the classics and it seems there weren't many women writing books years ago, so it's not likely to find many there.  Recommend me some good...




					www.urban75.net
				




Is worth a read too.


----------



## Sasaferrato (May 28, 2022)

Absolutely, grew up on Agatha Christie. Just finishing Ann Cleeves Shetland series, and of course her 'Vera' books.


----------



## Pickman's model (May 28, 2022)

reading daphne richemond-barak's work on subterranean warfare, don't think there's an equivalent book by a man


----------



## ska invita (May 28, 2022)

Winot said:


> Article in Guardian today:
> 
> Books by women that every man should read
> Books by women that every man should read: chosen by Ian McEwan, Salman Rushdie, Richard Curtis and more


pretty drab list imo


----------



## Pickman's model (May 28, 2022)

ska invita said:


> pretty drab list imo


it's like a lot of them just reached for the books by women they last looked at in school or college. middlemarch. mrs dalloway. regeneration. to kill a mockingbird. the sea, the sea. and a book a lot of boys would have read in the 80s, the secret diary of adrian mole.


----------



## ska invita (May 28, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> it's like a lot of them just reached for the books by women they last looked at in school or college. middlemarch. mrs dalloway. regeneration. to kill a mockingbird. the sea, the sea. and a book a lot of boys would have read in the 80s, the secret diary of adrian mole.


yeah exactly  - a bit embarrassing i think


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 28, 2022)

A list of books by women compiled by a bunch of men who, by the looks of it, have barely read any books by women. Odd concept, badly done.


----------



## 8ball (May 28, 2022)

littlebabyjesus said:


> A list of books by women compiled by a bunch of men who, by the looks of it, have barely read any books by women. Odd concept, badly done.



How can you tell they’ve barely read any books by women?

Having an article by men authors about their favourite books by women doesn’t seem like a terrible idea, but it assumes that their opinions and interest in what to read will mirror what male readers are generally interested in reading.

For all I know, their preferences may be closer to that of female authors than the average male reader, whether a Guardian reader or not.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 28, 2022)

8ball said:


> How can you tell they’ve barely read any books by women?


I've barely read any books by women (fiction at least - doing an audit in my head, I'd say definitely less than 20%, maybe quite a lot less; with non-fiction the ratio is more even) and I've read four of the books in the list.


----------



## 8ball (May 28, 2022)

littlebabyjesus said:


> I've barely read any books by women (fiction at least - doing an audit in my head, I'd say definitely less than 20%, maybe quite a lot less; with non-fiction the ratio is more even) and I've read four of the books in the list.



I think it’s a bit of a leap to extrapolate much from the fact that you have read some of the recommended books.
Regardless, on my bookshelf there is also that skewing of having more female authors on the non-fiction side (esp. economics and psychology, and obv feminism).


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 28, 2022)

tbh much as I have affection for Adrian Mole, anyone coming up with that book has probably barely read any books full stop.


----------



## 8ball (May 28, 2022)

littlebabyjesus said:


> tbh much as I have affection for Adrian Mole, anyone coming up with that book has probably barely read any books full stop.



Loved it when I read it as a kid.  I don’t think it’s so much on anyone’s radar these days but it’s such a great portrait of that period in history from an adolescent view.
I think it’s worth recommending.


----------



## ska invita (May 28, 2022)

8ball said:


> How can you tell they’ve barely read any books by women?


it is suggested by their staid canonical choices that barely include any contemporary female writers of which there are endless brilliant ones to choose from. Youd think if you asked respected writers theyd have some interesting tips to make a list interesting

Anyhow, I dont get time to read much fiction but last few things i did read happened to be by women - in case anyone is looking for a recommendation:
Natasha Brown - Assembly <jaw dropping in quality  literary fiction, basically about race and class in UK
Monique Roffey - loved The Mermaid of Black Conch so much (magical realism/ cultural history in a Caribbean setting) went on to read an older book of hers,  House of Ashes based on the Trinidad and Tobago coup <both great.
Also Trifonia Melibea Obono’s La Bastarda, the first ever English-language novel by a woman from Equatorial Guinea - and a lesbian tale at that - an unforgettable story with a very non-European style of writing.
Can recommend all of those, and im a fussy reader who struggles to finish books.


----------



## 8ball (May 28, 2022)

ska invita said:


> it is suggested by their staid canonical choices that barely include any contemporary female writers of which there are endless brilliant ones to choose from. Youd think if you asked respected writers theyd have some interesting tips to make a list interesting.



Depends on the question you ask them.  With the question as asked, I’d expect a certain amount of staid and canonical.

I think the thing they are trying to address comes down to men and women not talking to each other very much about what they are reading.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 28, 2022)

8ball said:


> Loved it when I read it as a kid.  I don’t think it’s so much on anyone’s radar these days but it’s such a great portrait of that period in history from an adolescent view.
> I think it’s worth recommending.


I loved it as well, but it was massively popular. According to wikipedia, the Adrian Mole books were the best-selling fiction in Britain in the 1980s. And I'm guessing her books were much more popular with boys/men than those of most female authors. If I'd read loads of books by female authors, I think I'd choose to promote someone most men probably haven't read.


----------



## ska invita (May 28, 2022)

Talking of lists someone who always makes a good looking end of year list of books I've never heard of is Dennis Cooper 


			Mine for yours: My favorite fiction, poetry, non-fiction, film, art, and internet of 2021 so far – DC's
		

...makes you realise how much gets published that flys below the radar and looks great to boot
as i said i wish i had the time


----------



## 8ball (May 28, 2022)

I don’t see the issue with recommending something well-loved and massively popular.


----------



## SpookyFrank (May 28, 2022)

> Justin Webb: The Sea, the Sea by Iris Murdoch
> 
> The book is an observation of the male ego and the damage it can do to those who possess it and those they interact with. It left me squirming as I read it – and an (almost) reformed character afterwards.



_I had a male ego once but then I read this one book and now I've fixed it. Hooray for me._

Superb trolling there Justin, 10/10


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 28, 2022)

ska invita said:


> Youd think if you asked respected writers theyd have some interesting tips to make a list interesting


Not all writers read that much, mind you. Umberto Eco once famously admitted that he didn't read much.


----------



## 8ball (May 28, 2022)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Not all writers read that much, mind you. Umberto Eco once famously admitted that he didn't read much.



Donald Trump has written 16 more books than he has actually read.


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## littlebabyjesus (May 28, 2022)

'written'


----------



## SpookyFrank (May 28, 2022)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Not all writers read that much, mind you. Umberto Eco once famously admitted that he didn't read much.



I could believe he didn't read much fiction but it's clear from Eco's work that he's read a _lot_ of history books.


----------



## 8ball (May 28, 2022)

It’s common for writers to avoid reading (aside from for relevant research), while in the process of writing something.

Likewise, musicians will often read books, but avoid listening to music while in the process of composing.


----------



## hash tag (May 28, 2022)

Not sure about women authors as such but I like reading books about strong women or by strong women. I've read a book or two about Elizabeth Shrewsbury and am currently reading a book by Lucy Easthope...what an amazing woman, what an incredible job she does. 
By coincidence, I read that Dervla Murphy died a few days ago 😓 a ground breaking cyclist/travel writer.


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## pseudonarcissus (May 29, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> it's like a lot of them just reached for the books by women they last looked at in school or college. middlemarch. mrs dalloway. regeneration. to kill a mockingbird. the sea, the sea. and a book a lot of boys would have read in the 80s, the secret diary of adrian mole.


I imagine their equivalent list of male authors would be (predominantly) white and dead too....or maybe not, maybe they'd want to show off how widely read they were.


----------



## 8ball (May 29, 2022)

pseudonarcissus said:


> I imagine their equivalent list of male authors would be (predominantly) white and dead too…



Those bloody dead people - where do they find the time to write all this stuff?


----------



## pseudonarcissus (May 29, 2022)

8ball said:


> Those bloody dead people - where do they find the time to write all this stuff?



Maybe more interesting is what are the last half dozen books written by women that you read...I wonder if Adrian Mole would make it to that list too.


----------



## 8ball (May 29, 2022)

pseudonarcissus said:


> Maybe more interesting is what are the last half dozen books written by women that you read...I wonder if Adrian Mole would make it to that list too.



What, you mean if I had to read _all_ books by women ever, what would I read last?

Probably Ayn Rand or Robin DiAngelo.

Edit:  Oh, no, see where I misread there.  Good question, though.  There was another Scarlett Thomas recently; I don’t know whether Philomena Cunk counts; and Victoria Coren before that; then maybe a re-read of Germaine Greer or Emma Goldman; and there was a sci fi thing whose name escapes me that I lent to someone.

Helen Fielding would pop up well before Sue Townsend.


----------



## bluescreen (May 29, 2022)

I just picked up an anthology of 'living poets' published in 1974. Of the 64 poets represented, 3 were women. This isn't so suprising: I left school in the 70s having studied Eng Lit at O level (sc. GCSE), A level and non-exam lit without encountering a single female voice. The only women writers I ever encountered at school were in hymns: the appalling Mrs CF Alexander (All Things Bright and Beautiful, There is a Green Hill, etc.) and the rather lovely  Christina Rossetti (In the Bleak Midwinter). 
It's not so much that women weren't writing, rather that they weren't getting published. It's totally changed now (in poetry, thanks largely to Bloodaxe), but not everywhere. The last French poetry anthology I picked up a couple of years ago had a similarly shocking ratio.


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## Agent Sparrow (May 29, 2022)

pseudonarcissus said:


> Maybe more interesting is what are the last half dozen books written by women that you read...I wonder if Adrian Mole would make it to that list too.


This is a good point, indeed what are the last six books or authors you read (to allow for series) and what proportion were written by women? It’s still only a recent snapshot but it seems more of a litmus test than picking one’s favourites.

Also it identifies the less high brow reading. The authored gender split of more “trashy” books is an interesting question in itself 
Edit: which frankly is the category I would have put Adrian Mole under.


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## Winot (May 29, 2022)

pseudonarcissus said:


> Maybe more interesting is what are the last half dozen books written by women that you read...I wonder if Adrian Mole would make it to that list too.


Just looked back at my list for 2021:

Illness as Metaphor & Aids and its Metaphors - Susan Sontag

Outline - Rachel Cusk

Fake Accounts - Lauren Oyler

The Lesser Bohemians - Eimear McBride

Beautiful World, Where Are You - Sally Rooney

The Lonely City - Olivia Laing

Vertigo & Ghost - Fiona Benson


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## Winot (May 29, 2022)

This year:

Bright Travellers - Fiona Benson
The Right to Sex - Amia Srinivasan


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## wtfftw (May 29, 2022)

Last 6 books I read are
NW - Zadie Smith
Open Water - Caleb Azumah Nelson
Want Me - Tracy Clark-Flory
The Power - Naomi Alderman
A Gate to Women's Country - Sheri S Tepper
Eleanor Oliphant is Completely Fine -  Gail Honeyman

Currently reading Crying in H Mart by Michelle Zauner

I barely read any books by men.


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## Agent Sparrow (May 29, 2022)

Love Gate to Women’s Country wtfftw 😍 The ideas are very second wave feminism and a bit dated/simplistic now but I still love it! 

Have you read Beauty by the same author? 

The only books I’ve recently read by men have been book group books or re-reading Douglas Adams/the biography of Douglas Adams. I hadn’t really registered who wrote the last bookgroup choice but it became increasingly obvious he was a White man when reading


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## Poot (May 29, 2022)

wtfftw said:


> I barely read any books by men.


You should try it. Some of them are quite good, actually.


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## wtfftw (May 29, 2022)

Agent Sparrow said:


> Love Gate to Women’s Country wtfftw 😍 The ideas are very second wave feminism and a bit dated/simplistic now but I still love it!
> 
> Have you read Beauty by the same author?
> 
> The only books I’ve recently read by men have been book group books or re-reading Douglas Adams/the biography of Douglas Adams. I hadn’t really registered who wrote the last bookgroup choice but it became increasingly obvious he was a White man when reading


Ooo I haven't. I'll see if I can find it.


Poot said:


> You should try it. Some of them are quite good, actually.


I dunno. I feel like there's so much man around and they don't really write anything interesting.


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## Agent Sparrow (May 29, 2022)

Also wtfftw if you like GtWC and The Power, have you come across the excellent Women on the Edge of Time by Marge Piercy? One of my all time favourite books. 😍 A good recommendation for anyone who said they wanted to read more sci fi written by women. Extra urban points for themes of anarchism.


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## wtfftw (May 29, 2022)

Agent Sparrow said:


> Also wtfftw if you like GtWC and The Power, have you come across the excellent Women on the Edge of Time by Marge Piercy? One of my all time favourite books. 😍 A good recommendation for anyone who said they wanted to read more sci fi written by women. Extra urban points for themes of anarchism.


I think I have my mum's physical copy of that one which means I read it so long ago that I can't remember. I'll add it to my pile


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## Agent Sparrow (May 29, 2022)

wtfftw said:


> I think I have my mum's physical copy of that one which means I read it so long ago that I can't remember. I'll add it to my pile


Yey, you get to read it again for the first time!


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## Pickman's model (May 29, 2022)

Aladdin have you read Margaret ward's unmanageable revolutionaries?


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## andysays (May 30, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> i wanted to find out how many women authors had their works in penguin classics, and found this blog How Many Penguin Classics Were Written By Women? - Camile Blog. which was very interesting until i found they numbered emile zola among the female authors.
> 
> View attachment 324419
> emile zola some time ago



Still interesting, even with that ridiculous error.

If we're counting Emily Zola, can we also count Andrea Camilleri as a woman?

I've read very few new books since this thread started, but I have read a short story collection by Ali Smith, which I enjoyed. Maybe I should seek out more of her work.


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## Plumdaff (May 30, 2022)

Definitely read Ali Smith's season quartet if you haven't already. They were written recently and contemporaneously over the last few years, it's probably easier to list the subjects that they are not about, but nothing else I have read has captured what it feels like to be living in the UK at the moment so well.


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## Winot (May 30, 2022)

Plumdaff said:


> Definitely read Ali Smith's season quartet if you haven't already. They were written recently and contemporaneously over the last few years, it's probably easier to list the subjects that they are not about, but nothing else I have read has captured what it feels like to be living in the UK at the moment so well.


By coincidence I bought Autumn on Saturday.


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## Hollis (Jun 12, 2022)

nogojones said:


> The first Sally Rooney was one of the ones I really enjoyed



I'm just starting it.. having surprisingly enjoyed the TV series.. .  I actually can't stand the lead male character... so I will see if he is as irritating in the book.


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## nogojones (Jun 13, 2022)

Hollis said:


> I'm just starting it.. having surprisingly enjoyed the TV series.. .  I actually can't stand the lead male character... so I will see if he is as irritating in the book.


Not seen the telly program and I'm not all that sure I'd like it


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## Winot (Jun 13, 2022)

Winot said:


> By coincidence I bought Autumn on Saturday.


Enjoyed this a lot. The relationship between the two main characters is wonderful.


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## rutabowa (Oct 27, 2022)

I was definitely one of those who all my favourite authors were male. I did an english degree so I have read tons. I then stopped reading hardly anything a few years ago for some reason... I guess I got bored/lost inspiration/too busy/not sure. I started reading again this year and just on a whim/to have less choice I decided to only read fairly new books written by female authors... it has been a bit of a revelation, I realised how much of a rut I was in. Not"  saying modern male authors aren't good, it is just I am currently not interested in them. I guess my tastes are a bit subtler now and I am more into interactions between people rather than navel gazing outsider/loner type stuff.

My last 2 books are "The 5 wounds" by Kirsten Valdez Quade (dysfunctional family in a shitty town in new mexico live life) and "Americanah" by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie (nigerian expat story). I pick them more or less at random. If it has been recommended by Oprah that seems to be a good tip! didn't think I would be saying that a few years ago, but she knows what she's talking about really.


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## Throbbing Angel (Oct 27, 2022)

Can recommend Allison Moore's new collection of short stories


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## weltweit (Oct 27, 2022)

Jan Morris ?​








						Jan Morris - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


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## Pickman's model (Oct 27, 2022)

weltweit said:


> Jan Morris ?​
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Why the big bold letters?


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## weltweit (Oct 27, 2022)

Pickman's model said:


> Why the big bold letters?


I couldn't find that button there used to be to remove formatting!

Oh there it is .. just there


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## Pickman's model (Oct 27, 2022)

weltweit said:


> I couldn't find that button there used to be to remove formatting!
> 
> Oh there it is .. just there


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## 8ball (Oct 27, 2022)

We should also take into account that a lot of popular male authors may actually be women.


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## Orang Utan (Oct 27, 2022)

‘A lot’?


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## 8ball (Oct 27, 2022)

Orang Utan said:


> ‘A lot’?



Indeed.


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## Sue (Oct 27, 2022)

8ball said:


> Indeed.


Like who?


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## 8ball (Oct 27, 2022)

Sue said:


> Like who?



Stephanie King?

 Not totally confirmed tbf.


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