# COVID-19 in America



## frogwoman (Apr 4, 2020)

Looks really really fucking bad, 3000 deaths reported in New York

Bit worrying too because some of my best friends live there and my cousin is a doctor in the US.


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## Mr.Bishie (Apr 4, 2020)

It really doesn’t bode well froggy 









						How science finally caught up with Trump's playbook – with millions of lives at stake
					

The president’s failure to heed the warnings about coronavirus and act quickly has set in train a domino effect that now imperils large swathes of the US




					www.theguardian.com


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## LDC (Apr 4, 2020)

Thanks for starting this, I thought a USA specific thread might be useful as I think we're going to see some quite dramatic covid stuff there very soon, with the possibility of those changes having significant long term impact on the structure and stability of the USA.


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## Yossarian (Apr 4, 2020)

It's truly frightening the way things are headed in the US - New York state alone has almost a tenth of the world's confirmed coronavirus cases - more cases and almost as many deaths as China has reported, though China's figures are unlikely to have much connection with reality.

It would be bad enough if there was a real president in charge - with states largely being left to chart their own courses in the absence of federal leadership, I think the country might struggle even to get it together enough to hold this year's election on time in a manner where the results won't be disputed.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

I don't really agree with starting a new USA thread at this time, but let's see how it goes .. 

New York Mandates Nursing Homes Take Covid-19 Patients Discharged From Hospitals


> New York told nursing-home operators that they will be required to accept patients infected with the new coronavirus who are discharged from hospitals but may be still convalescing, amid more cases in the state that are straining the health-care system.


from WSJ News Exclusive | New York Mandates Nursing Homes Take Covid-19 Patients Discharged From Hospitals

Unfortunately wsj articles are behind a paywall, so that was all I could get.


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## LDC (Apr 4, 2020)

New Orleans is a growing hot spot of cases as well, with twice the death rate of NYC from what I read. 

Not read this yet, but just what I've seen today Austerity Is Fueling the COVID-19 Pandemic in New Orleans, Not Mardi Gras Culture


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

An interactive Map of the USA shows NY NJ worst affected with states like the Dakotas least affected, you can mouseover - on the web page - to see the detail.


from Coronavirus in the US: Latest COVID-19 news and case counts



> The U.S. became the epicenter of the COVID-19 pandemic after reported cases surpassed those officially reported by China. Since the novel coronavirus called SARS-CoV-2 was first detected in the U.S. on Jan. 20, it has spread to at least 245,601 people in the U.S., across all 50 states.
> 
> Of the reported cases in the U.S., 6,058 people have died from the virus, with at least 2,538 of those deaths in New York, 537 in New Jersey, 417 in Michigan, 310 in Louisiana and 272 related deaths reported in Washington state. The globe has hit its own milestone: 1 million COVID-19 cases have been confirmed worldwide as of Thursday afternoon (April 2), according to the Johns Hopkins virus dashboard. To date, 54,137 deaths globally are attributed to the virus.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

A chart which may be of interest: 
from Coronavirus map of the US: latest cases state by state


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## Yossarian (Apr 4, 2020)

The map in US cases seems to mostly correspond to the map of where the people are - the Southern states have been among slowest to introduce stay-at-home orders, so those states might be getting a lot redder soon.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

This is the Centres for Disease Control CDC often quoted on US news reports. 


> CDC is one of the major operating components of the Department of Health and Human Services.


from CDC Works 24/7


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## Indeliblelink (Apr 4, 2020)

this shows graphs for peak projections, different states can be selected









						IHME | COVID-19 Projections
					

Explore forecasts of COVID-19 cases, deaths, and hospital resource use.




					covid19.healthdata.org


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

Which coronavirus patients will get life-saving ventilators? Guidelines show how hospitals in NYC, US will decide


> But on Thursday, New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo said the state had shipped 400 ventilators, providing a few more days of capacity.
> 
> Still, the need remains dire, and growing, as coronavirus sufferers crowd hospitals.
> 
> The shortage is forcing health care officials in New York City to weigh ethical questions about who should get priority. Their counterparts across the nation may soon face the same dilemma as the pandemic surges.


from Coronavirus ventilator shortages may force tough ethical questions


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## a_chap (Apr 4, 2020)

Anyone know where/how to place bets on:

Trump postponing (i.e. cancelling) the November election
Trump dying before then

And a side-bet of both of the above happening.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

First US clinical trial of Covid-19 vaccine candidate begins


> The first US clinical trial of a Covid-19 vaccine candidate, which is Moderna’s mRNA-1273, has started at Kaiser Permanente Washington Health Research Institute (KPWHRI) in Seattle.
> 
> Funded by the National Institutes of Health (NIH)’s National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), the trial has dosed its first participant.





> mRNA-1273 is an mRNA vaccine designed to target SARS-CoV-2 encoding a prefusion stabilised form of the Spike (S) protein. Moderna selected the candidate in alliance with the Vaccine Research Center (VRC) at the NIAID.
> 
> The Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness Innovations (CEPI) funding supported the production of the first clinical batch.
> 
> During the Phase I trial, the safety and immunogenicity of 25μg, 100μg, 250μg dose levels of mRNA-1273 given on a two-dose vaccination schedule 28 days apart will be assessed in a total of 45 healthy adults aged 18 to 55.


from First US clinical trial of Covid-19 vaccine candidate begins


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## a_chap (Apr 4, 2020)

Indeliblelink said:


> this shows graphs for peak projections, different states can be selected
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's a fascinating site, thanks.

Looking at the projected versus actual numbers:


So 7,300 is the very top end of their projection.

The actual number of deaths by April 3rd?


Spoiler


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

Trump speaks publicly as 700 people in New York under voluntary quarantine amid LA outbreak fears after flight attendant confirmed with virus


> Reports of a female flight attendant diagnosed with coronavirus having repeatedly travelling through Los Angeles International airport is sparking fears of an outbreak in the region, as officials confirm 59 cases of the mysterious illness.
> 
> The unidentified flight attendant reportedly serviced a flight from Tel Aviv to Seoul on 15 February, and had travelled through the LAX airport on multiple occaisions before receiving the diagnosis. A majority of cases in the US (39) are among Americans evacuated from the Diamond Princess cruise ship in Tokyo. The US Centres for Disease Control and Prevention has said that while the immediate risk of coronavirus to American citizens is low, the global situation suggested a pandemic is now likely.


from Flight attendant diagnosed with coronavirus sparks fears of potential outbreak - follow live

Plenty more in that article if you can cope with the Trump popup video etc


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## a_chap (Apr 4, 2020)

You realise that article is dated 26th Feb.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

a_chap said:


> You realise that article is dated 26th Feb.


Oops, so it is, sorry about that.


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## Voley (Apr 4, 2020)

I worry for America too. Spiralling infection rates, a heavily-armed population and an idiotic narcissist in charge. Just seems like a perfect storm. Really scary.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

Quite a good summary page on Wikipedia 








						COVID-19 pandemic in the United States - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				



Which they will probably be updating.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

Simple list of US states, cases and deaths on Reuters: 04/04/2020 








						The novel coronavirus in the U.S.
					

How COVID-19 has spread across the U.S.




					graphics.reuters.com


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## cyril_smear (Apr 4, 2020)

What a moron Trump is. Got advice from his health people and said that he wouldn't be following said advice, and reiterated that it was only advice. Almost as if he was wanting the public to defy what had been said.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

Gov. Cuomo Says Chinese Government Delivering 1,000 Ventilators to New York


> During a press conference on Saturday, New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo announced that the Chinese government is facilitating a donation of 1,000 ventilators to New York, which has been struck hard by the COVID-19 pandemic. Cuomo said the ventilators will arrive at John F. Kennedy International Airport in New York City later on Saturday.
> 
> Cuomo thanked Joseph and Clara Tsai — who own the Brooklyn Nets, Barclays Center and Alibaba — as well as Jack Ma, co-founder of Alibaba, for helping with the donation. He also thanked the Chinese Counsul General Ambassador Huang for “his help in making all of this happen.”


from 04/04/2020 Gov. Cuomo Says Chinese Government Delivering 1,000 Ventilators to New York


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## two sheds (Apr 4, 2020)

He doesn't want to advertise that, otherwise other states might nip in and make a higher offer for them.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

Trump announced that they have ordered 180,000,000 face masks from 3M and he hopes they will be able to deliver.


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## weltweit (Apr 4, 2020)

*Supporting Small Businesses*


> President Trump is helping small businesses bridge this economic emergency by giving them the funds they need to keep their employees on their payroll and stay in business. Thanks to The CARES Act, President Trump is helping hardworking American business owners by:
> 
> Providing $350 billion in forgivable loans for small businesses through the Paycheck Protection Program
> Providing advances on SBA disaster loans that never have to be repaid
> Forgiving existing non-disaster SBA loan payments over the next six months


from Supporting Small Businesses

from Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)


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## LDC (Apr 5, 2020)

Voley said:


> I worry for America too. Spiralling infection rates, a heavily-armed population and an idiotic narcissist in charge. Just seems like a perfect storm. Really scary.



Add in the massive evangelical tendency, huge social inequalities, shit healthcare at the best of times, and I really think some areas could explode or collapse entirely.


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## petee (Apr 5, 2020)

US tally:








						Totals for the US
					

Daily totals for all metrics collected from January 2020 to the present.




					covidtracking.com
				




this has a state-by-state breakdown:








						Coronavirus Dashboard
					

Live coronavirus dashboard tracker. See real-time data, social media trends, and learn about prevention measures.




					coronaworld.eu
				






a_chap said:


> Anyone know where/how to place bets on:
> 
> Trump postponing (i.e. cancelling) the November election
> Trump dying before then
> ...



neither will happen. a president can't postpone or cancel elections, and he's pretty hale for his age and has socail -distancing enforcement in the form of his bodyguard.


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## petee (Apr 5, 2020)

by the way, ye may like to watch this:



a 1950 quasi-documentary about the smallpox that came to NYC in 1947. some of the dialogue could have been written yesterday.


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## petee (Apr 5, 2020)

here are two stories that'll boil your blood











						The Doctor Came to Save Lives. The Co-op Board Told Him to Get Lost. (Published 2020)
					

When an emergency room doctor traveled from New Hampshire to battle the coronavirus in New York, he moved into his brother’s building … but not for long.




					www.nytimes.com


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## tim (Apr 5, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Trump announced that they have ordered 180,000,000 face masks from 3M and he hopes they will be able to deliver.



The company previously most famous for making post-it Notes. I hope those masks don't flutter gracefully off your face at critical clinical moments


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## Detroit City (Apr 5, 2020)

there are so many COVID threads on Urban, we might as well start one on the USA


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## JimW (Apr 5, 2020)

Read a depressing story that the Trump administration is continuing efforts to stop Cuba sending its doctors abroad to work even now. They use the reasoning that's it's exploiting the doctors as the state gets 90% of their wage but the idea they're motivated by worker protection hardly holds up. Apparently one of the biggest sources of foreign currency for Cuba.


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## Detroit City (Apr 5, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> - the Southern states have been among slowest to introduce stay-at-home orders, so those states might be getting a lot redder soon.


not to mention that the southern states have the least amount of education, which may make compliance harder


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## weltweit (Apr 5, 2020)

New York and surrounds is the epicentre of US infection at the moment but New Orleans because of the more than a million people who went to the Mardi Gras, it is also a strong area for infection. And a lot of people left NY and went to Florida which pushed up their rates. 

It seems finally Trump and the federal authorities are now supporting the states with extra PPE and associated kit, they must have a central stockpile. However China shipped 5,000 ventilators to NY yesterday, they should be there now. 

Does anyone know about the state of shutdowns across the US? Or instructions on face masks?


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## Detroit City (Apr 5, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Or instructions on face masks?


i think the fed govt is "recommending" universal face mask usage but it is not mandatory.  from my adventures out and about i see maybe 30%-40% with face masks


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## weltweit (Apr 5, 2020)

Detroit City said:


> i think the fed govt is "recommending" universal face mask usage but it is not mandatory.  from my adventures out and about i see maybe 30%-40% with face masks


Where about are you? - might be a silly question if you are indeed in Detroit


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## Detroit City (Apr 5, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Where about are you? - might be a silly question if you are indeed in Detroit


about 25 miles northwest of downtown detroit


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## weltweit (Apr 5, 2020)

Trump claims states have 'more ventilators than they need,' Business Insider investigates 


> Governors warned they face dire shortages of ventilators — but Trump claimed states have 'more ventilators than they need'
> ..
> "Shortages have lead to inflated requests. We have some states and areas that are just asking for far more than they need," Trump said Saturday.
> 
> Despite Trump's claims, governors say life-threatening shortages will force medical personnel to choose which patients get treatment.



from Live Updates LIVE UPDATES: Trump claims states have 'more ventilators than they need,' Business Insider investigates the black market for face masks


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## weltweit (Apr 5, 2020)

A update page on CNN


> The US: There are more than 312,000 recorded cases and nearly 8,500 people have died, with 1,344 of those reported on Saturday — the country's largest single-day death toll.





> Sarah Maslin Nir is a New York Times reporter who was covering the coronavirus pandemic before she tested positive herself.
> 
> "I was in bed for six days. Putting my phone to my ear, holding my hand up like that was exhausting," she told CNN today.





> She said the United States has less stringent guidelines on how long you have to quarantine after you test positive. In New York state, you can leave the house three days after your last symptom, Maslin Nir said.
> 
> "China requires two post symptomatic tests within 48 hours that show you have no coronavirus, and then 14 more days of quarantine. So I'm following China's guidelines and still considering myself quarantined," she said.


from 05/04/2020 Coronavirus live updates: More than a million cases across the world - CNN

There are a lot of news pieces on this page, worth a browse.


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## editor (Apr 5, 2020)

Voley said:


> I worry for America too. Spiralling infection rates, a heavily-armed population and an idiotic narcissist in charge. Just seems like a perfect storm. Really scary.


Throw in a large sprinkling of unhinged conspiracy theories, huge poverty and all sorts of anti-government paranoia and it's one hell of an ugly mix. That fucking idiot trying to drive a locomotive into a hospital ship may only be the start.


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## two sheds (Apr 5, 2020)

petee said:


> here are two stories that'll boil your blood
> 
> 
> 
> ...




And another  for the second story.


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## weltweit (Apr 5, 2020)

New York forced to redistribute ventilators


> A shortage of several hundred ventilators in New York City, the epicentre of the outbreak in the US, prompted Mr Cuomo to say that he will order the machines be taken from various parts of the state and give them to harder-hit areas.
> 
> Amid a deepening crisis, top health official Dr Anthony Fauci has said he believes all states should issue stay-at-home orders.





> "I don't understand why that's not happening," Dr Fauci told CNN on Thursday. "If you look at what's going on in this country, I just don't understand why we're not doing that."
> 
> "You've got to put your foot on the accelerator to bring that number down," he added, referring to infection and death rates.
> ..


Surely that should be put your foot on the brakes not the accelerator .. ? 


> The governor said he would deploy the National Guard to enforce a new executive order giving the state authority to take and redistribute ventilators from hospitals and other healthcare institutions to facilities in parts of the state most urgently in need.
> 
> These institutions will either receive their supplies back or be reimbursed, he said.





> "I'm not going to let people die," Mr Cuomo said of the order.
> 
> Mr Cuomo said this week that New York will need nearly 37,000 ventilators for the "apex" of the state's outbreak, expected to hit at the end of April. Bill de Blasio, the New York City mayor, said the metropolis needs 400 additional ventilators by Sunday.


from 03/04/2020 New York to redistribute ventilators amid shortage


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## weltweit (Apr 5, 2020)

And, on stay home orders: 


> At least 297 million Americans in 38 states, the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico have been told to stay home. But the governors of 10 states have so far stopped short of asking all residents to remain indoors.
> 
> North Dakota, South Dakota, Arkansas, Iowa and Nebraska so far have no state-wide order urging people inside. "A targeted approach is what is working for us in Arkansas," said Governor Asa Hutchinson this week. "People are misled by this idea that this stay at home order is magical."





> Iowa Governor Kim Reynolds has argued: "I can't lock the state down... I can't lock everybody in their home."
> 
> Other states have left the decision to local officials while still refraining from any state-wide action. Residents in parts of Alabama, Missouri, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Texas, Utah and Wyoming face some degree of stay home orders, issued by local authorities.


Also from the BBC


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## editor (Apr 5, 2020)

The Queen of Fucking Stupid in the car and the congregation of fuckwittery


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## 8ball (Apr 5, 2020)

editor said:


> The Queen of Fucking Stupid in the car and the congregation of fuckwittery




Hopefully the most special people on God’s Earth will have made us a vaccine out of Jesus’s blood any day now.


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## lizzieloo (Apr 6, 2020)

Darwinism in full effect


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## weltweit (Apr 6, 2020)

Misguided, misinformed, delusional, and downright dangerous ..


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## elbows (Apr 6, 2020)




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## nogojones (Apr 6, 2020)

editor said:


> The Queen of Fucking Stupid in the car and the congregation of fuckwittery



People hold beliefs that don't always hold up to scrutiny and they hold them firmly. I remember as a child having to pray every night to protect ourselves from a whole host of nasties. It must have worked, cos here I am, still alive!

The easiest way of stopping these people being a danger to themselves and others is to make sure the pastor shuts his germ barn and takes his services to the internet. Steep fines (much more than you'll rasie in a church service) will be like the power of the holy spirit for him. God hates loosing money


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## editor (Apr 6, 2020)

nogojones said:


> People hold beliefs that don't always hold up to scrutiny and they hold them firmly. I remember as a child having to pray every night to protect ourselves from a whole host of nasties. It must have worked, cos here I am, still alive!
> 
> The easiest way of stopping these people being a danger to themselves and others is to make sure the pastor shuts his germ barn and takes his services to the internet. Steep fines (much more than you'll rasie in a church service) will be like the power of the holy spirit for him. God hates loosing money


But pastors need $$$$$$$$$


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## nogojones (Apr 6, 2020)

editor said:


> But pastors need $$$$$$$$$


Which is why you should remove them from him if he don't comply, but sadly I don't see it happening soon in the land of the free


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## Buddy Bradley (Apr 6, 2020)

My prediction is that by the end of this, China is going to own a far larger proportion of US interests than they did before. They got their outbreak under control (albeit also by lying about the numbers), and are now ready to swoop in and bail out/buy up struggling US industries hamstrung by their inept president and idiotic populace.


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## TopCat (Apr 6, 2020)

editor said:


> The Queen of Fucking Stupid in the car and the congregation of fuckwittery



I always wonder whether religious types actually believe in God rather than appreciating the community, sense of belonging and the chance of meeting a partner. 
The ones interviewed here all looked like they believed in the god delusion apart from the pastor.


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## littlebabyjesus (Apr 6, 2020)

Voley said:


> I worry for America too. Spiralling infection rates, a heavily-armed population and an idiotic narcissist in charge. Just seems like a perfect storm. Really scary.


Add in the absence of universal health care. I fear for the poor of the US, particularly if this thing gets a further grip in the South. We saw how Hurricane Katrina fucked the poor there, and we currently see worrying signs about Louisiana's ability to cope. They are at least testing heavily now.


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## editor (Apr 6, 2020)

TopCat said:


> The ones interviewed here all looked like they believed in the god delusion apart from the pastor.


In his nice big car....


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## TopCat (Apr 6, 2020)

editor said:


> In his nice big car....


Yeah I noticed that too.


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## hash tag (Apr 6, 2020)

Cars in the States are generally the bigger makes and models.


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## Anju (Apr 6, 2020)

Wow. Likely to be having temporary burials in NYC park.


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## hash tag (Apr 6, 2020)

NYC may temporarily bury coronavirus victims on Hart Island
					

Some coronavirus victims could be temporarily buried in the Hart Island potter’s field — or even public parks — if New York’s morgues become overwhelmed by the number of dead, officials said Monday…




					nypost.com


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## editor (Apr 6, 2020)

hash tag said:


> NYC may temporarily bury coronavirus victims on Hart Island
> 
> 
> Some coronavirus victims could be temporarily buried in the Hart Island potter’s field — or even public parks — if New York’s morgues become overwhelmed by the number of dead, officials said Monday…
> ...


The did the same for the Spanish flu pandemic in 1918.  Terrifying stuff.


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## platinumsage (Apr 7, 2020)

200 COVID deaths per day in New York City occurring in people's homes, the vast majority not counted in official stats:


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## Treacle Toes (Apr 7, 2020)

editor said:


> The Queen of Fucking Stupid in the car and the congregation of fuckwittery



So basically she's admitting to the murder of Mr Jesus who was up until his death and their sacrifice of him, a member of their congregation. ☹️🤔


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## existentialist (Apr 7, 2020)

platinumsage said:


> 200 COVID deaths per day in New York City occurring in people's homes, the vast majority not counted in official stats:



An unexpected bonus of a healthcare system which excludes a substantial proportion (is it 15% who have no health insurance?) of the population. Trump must be proud.


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## cupid_stunt (Apr 7, 2020)

existentialist said:


> An unexpected bonus of a healthcare system which excludes a substantial proportion *(is it 15% who have no health insurance?)* of the population. Trump must be proud.



Probably more now, with millions losing their jobs, and therefore insurance provided by their former employers.


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## editor (Apr 7, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Probably more now, with millions losing their jobs, and therefore insurance provided by their former employers.


If this doesn't spark Americans into demanding some sort of fair health system, then I guess they'll never get it.


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## SheilaNaGig (Apr 8, 2020)

editor said:


> The Queen of Fucking Stupid in the car and the congregation of fuckwittery





I feel actual hate and rage at this woman.


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## two sheds (Apr 8, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I feel actual hate and rage at this woman.



You're just not covered in Jesus' blood


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## SheilaNaGig (Apr 8, 2020)

two sheds said:


> You're just not covered in Jesus' blood


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## elbows (Apr 8, 2020)

two sheds said:


> You're just not covered in Jesus' blood



If his blood has the right antibodies in it then they might be onto something.


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## weltweit (Apr 8, 2020)

Seattle’s covid-19 lessons are yielding hope


> The metropolitan region of about 3.5 million people in Washington State had already documented the first US case of covid-19 on 20 January in a 35 year old man who had visited his family in Wuhan, China. The patient tested positive for severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) and was immediately hospitalised in an isolation unit at Providence Regional Medical Center in Everett, Washington.1





> After treatment with remdesivir, the man was released on 3 February. Tracing and monitoring (but not testing) of nearly 70 potential contacts didn’t turn up any signs of covid-19, and state health officials breathed a wary sigh of relief.
> ..
> On 28 February the discovery of two new presumptive cases was announced.
> ..





> on 2 March, Trevor Bedford, a molecular epidemiologist at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle, delivered another stunning assessment. In a blog post, Bedford explained that genomic evidence strongly suggested a link between the state’s first case in January and the high school student diagnosed in late February. That meant the virus may have been spreading unnoticed for five weeks. Bedford and collaborators at the Institute for Disease Modelling in Bellevue, Washington, estimated that 570 people in the region had already been infected.


This is a long article, I can't do it justice with snippets, best to visit and read the article in full. 





> ..
> During a 30 March press briefing to announce the new modelling studies, Jeff Duchin, health officer for Seattle and King County Public Health, said he was “cautiously optimistic,” but warned against letting up and allowing the virus to coming roaring back. “We need to double down on the measures that appear to be working,” he said.


from 06/04/2020 Seattle’s covid-19 lessons are yielding hope


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## weltweit (Apr 8, 2020)

Americans are told to wear cloth masks


> The US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has told Americans to wear cloth masks to prevent coronavirus transmission. President Donald Trump said at a press briefing last week that the advice was voluntary, and he was choosing not to wear one.
> ..


from 06/04/2020 Americans are told to wear cloth masks


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## petee (Apr 8, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Americans are told to wear cloth masks
> 
> from 06/04/2020 Americans are told to wear cloth masks



i've been on board with everything so far. i don't have a nice little mask so i'd have to use my industrial-grade, two-chamber mask for chemical fumes that makes me look like a bug. and i'd do it. but this mask business has given some people the license to police others, in pretty abusive ways (admitting, even boasting, that they've "screamed' at others for not wearing masks or for not vacating the sidewalk) and i'm not okay with it.


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## weltweit (Apr 8, 2020)

petee said:


> i've been on board with everything so far. i don't have a nice little mask so i'd have to use my industrial-grade, two-chamber mask for chemical fumes that makes me look like a bug. and i'd do it. but this mask business has given some people the license to police others, in pretty abusive ways (admitting, even boasting, that they've "screamed' at others for not wearing masks or for not vacating the sidewalk) and i'm not okay with it.


Yes, these recommendations orders instructions whatever only really work if there is abundant supply of masks so everyone can get one. Or in the US case, people have a bandana they can use to cover their nose and mouth. 

I am pretty sure that if the health services had adequate supply and supply for the general public was also good the WHO would be recommending their use by everyone. In not recommending them I think the WHO is being pragmatic practical and probably sensible. 

Of course masks have a positive effect, why otherwise would health workers in all ICU departments wear them?


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## spring-peeper (Apr 8, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Of course masks have a positive effect, why otherwise would health workers in all ICU departments wear them?



There are countless videos on how to make a mask out of household materials.
These masks are not to protect you, they are to protect others from you.
They catch the moisture in your breath and trap it.

As a reference to this, google "trudeau" and "speaking moistly".


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## Tankus (Apr 8, 2020)

33C in Singapore  today and the virus seems to be getting  a second wind there ....so much for the summer "high temp and it goes away " respite ...maybe


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## elbows (Apr 8, 2020)

> New York is "undoubtedly flattening the curve", Governor Andrew Cuomo says, despite reporting the largest single-day death toll - for the second day in a row - with 779 New Yorkers succumbing to the virus on 7 April.
> 
> "We are flattening the curve because we are being rigorous about social distancing," Cuomo says. "It's not a time to get complacent."





> What else did the governor say?
> 
> 
> Statewide hospitalisation rates have continued to decline, suggesting that the infection rate is beginning to plateau
> ...





> "I don't think we return to normal," Cuomo says. "If we're smart, we achieve a new normal."



From BBC live updates page at 18:58 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-52208591


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## gentlegreen (Apr 8, 2020)

weltweit said:


> "Donald Trump said at a press briefing last week that the advice was voluntary, and he was choosing not to wear one. "


It's a good job he plays golf these days and not something more intimate...


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## weltweit (Apr 8, 2020)

I see Trump and the DG of WHO have had a row.


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## weltweit (Apr 8, 2020)

Bleak Records in N.Y. and N.J., but Leaders See Curve Flattening: Live Updates


> There were 779 coronavirus-related deaths in the state in the past 24 hours, Governor Cuomo said. It was the highest one-day total yet.
> ..
> New York State now has more confirmed virus cases, 149,316, than any country in the world besides the United States.


from 08/04/2020 paywalled Bleak Records in N.Y. and N.J., but Leaders See Curve Flattening: Live Updates


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 8, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Seattle’s covid-19 lessons are yielding hope
> This is a long article, I can't do it justice with snippets, best to visit and read the article in full.
> from 06/04/2020 Seattle’s covid-19 lessons are yielding hope



Yeah we've been taking it pretty seriously here in the Northwest and it's yielding good results compared to a lot of places in the US. I'm glad I live where I do, there's a long history of collective action here that's done a lot of good for people, from decent labor unions to respecting lockdown instructions during a pandemic like this one. The state's been making proactive decisions and people are respecting them for the most part. Way back in 1936 the Postmaster General joked "There are 47 states in the Union, and the Soviet of Washington", and it was obviously just a joke but there's always been at least a grain of truth in it, and swift collective action is what's needed to save lives in a situation like this.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Apr 8, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> Yeah we've been taking it pretty seriously here in the Northwest and it's yielding good results compared to a lot of places in the US. I'm glad I live where I do, there's a long history of collective action here that's done a lot of good for people, from decent labor unions to respecting lockdown instructions during a pandemic like this one. The state's been making proactive decisions and people are respecting them for the most part. Way back in 1936 the Postmaster General joked "There are 47 states in the Union, and the Soviet of Washington", and it was obviously just a joke but there's always been at least a grain of truth in it, and swift collective action is what's needed to save lives in a situation like this.


You should apply to join Canada.


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 9, 2020)

littlebabyjesus said:


> You should apply to join Canada.











						Cascadia (independence movement) - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				



It's a work in progress


----------



## gosub (Apr 9, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Probably more now, with millions losing their jobs, and therefore insurance provided by their former employers.



The ones who had jobs/health insurance do get cover, the 15% that didn't have it before don't, oh and the bill for serious casae covid treatment is about $80k


----------



## existentialist (Apr 9, 2020)

gosub said:


> The ones who had jobs/health insurance do get cover, the 15% that didn't have it before don't, oh and the bill for serious casae covid treatment is about $80k


Is that all? I was expecting it to be much more than that, given that childbirth and associated care starts from $30,000. They're missing a trick, here.


----------



## elbows (Apr 9, 2020)

I know we have mixed feelings about the IMHE modelling as discussed on others thread about other countries, but this is just a post to say that it looks like officials in the USA are using it as the source of figures they are coming out with in public.

eg:









						Dr. Anthony Fauci: Virus death toll may be ‘more like 60,000 than 100,000 to 200,000’
					

Joining TODAY live, Dr. Anthony Fauci says that even though the number of deaths validate that this is a bad week in the coronavirus battle, there are “some glimmers of hope” such as stabilizing numbers of hospitalizations in New York. He says that social distancing and behavior changes are...




					www.today.com
				






> Dr. Anthony Fauci says that even though the number of deaths validate that this is a bad week in the coronavirus battle, there are “some glimmers of hope” such as stabilizing numbers of hospitalizations in New York. He says that social distancing and behavior changes are “starting to have a real effect” and that the virus death toll may look “more like 60,000 than the 100,000 to 200,000” initially predicted.



When I heard that I went straight to to IMHE model and sure enough, the latest version of it for the USA has a bit over 60,000 deaths.









						IHME | COVID-19 Projections
					

Explore forecasts of COVID-19 cases, deaths, and hospital resource use.




					covid19.healthdata.org


----------



## ska invita (Apr 9, 2020)

Headline from FT -
*US weekly jobless claims mount by another 6.6m         * 
Latest figures take cumulative total to almost 17m since March lockdowns began


The real figure of course will be much higher, for those who dont make claims for whatever reason


----------



## weltweit (Apr 9, 2020)

In NY, people who have recovered from covid-19 are being asked to donate blood which might be used to try to help people who are currently affected: 


> Convalescent Plasma COVID-19 Donor Request Form
> Thank you for your interest in convalescent plasma donation and JOINING OUR FIGHT TO SAVE LIVES.
> 
> While COVID has no proven treatment, it is possible that plasma taken from those who have recovered (convalescent plasma), which has antibodies against the virus, could help.





> If you had a positive test, AND your symptoms have been gone for 14 days, AND you are willing to DONATE, please complete and submit the form below.


from Convalescent Plasma COVID-19 Donor Request Form |  New York Blood Center


----------



## weltweit (Apr 9, 2020)

This is a NY health service page with lots of links to services etc in NY
including announcements:


> All non-essential workers must continue to work from home and schools will be closed through April 29th.


from Novel Coronavirus (COVID-19) Last Updated: April 9, 2020 at 3:30PM

It looks like the NY lockdown is more stringent than the UK one, all non essential workers must work from home, rather than the UK position where people can go to work if they can't work from home.


----------



## zahir (Apr 10, 2020)

Strikes and union organising in response to the crisis.









						The Coronavirus Recession Is a Critical Test for the Labor Movement
					

Caught between a pandemic and the pressure to restart the economy, organizers have quickly adapted to fight for workers’ rights.




					newrepublic.com


----------



## Mr.Bishie (Apr 10, 2020)

Grim.









						Coronavirus: New York ramps up mass burials amid outbreak
					

Drone footage shows coffins stacked in a pit in the city, as the state logs more cases than any country.



					www.bbc.com


----------



## weltweit (Apr 10, 2020)

Trump and the DG of WHO had a bit of an argument last week via the media. 

I saw a bit of Trump's press conference today and he stated he would be making a statement about WHO next week, because the US gives WHO some $500 million apparently. It seemed a way to put pressure on the WHO DG as much as anything else.


----------



## Detroit City (Apr 10, 2020)

AARGHH! i can't do shelter-in-place anymore


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 11, 2020)

Detroit City said:


> AARGHH! i can't do shelter-in-place anymore



What are you going to do instead?


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 11, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Trump and the DG of WHO had a bit of an argument last week via the media.
> 
> I saw a bit of Trump's press conference today and he stated he would be making a statement about WHO next week, because the US gives WHO some $500 million apparently. It seemed a way to put pressure on the WHO DG as much as anything else.




He’s such a fucking git.









						Trump threatens to hold WHO funding, then backtracks, amid search for scapegoat
					

US president’s early inaction in pandemic has come under renewed scrutiny in recent days as coronavirus death toll grows




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## 8ball (Apr 11, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> He’s such a fucking git.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Most days I'm astonished his own people don't drag him out of his office and put a bullet between his eyes.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 11, 2020)

Detroit City said:


> AARGHH! i can't do shelter-in-place anymore



The word 'shelter' makes it sound like a nuke or something.


----------



## Detroit City (Apr 11, 2020)

8ball said:


> The word 'shelter' makes it sound like a nuke or something.


i agree 8ball


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 11, 2020)

8ball said:


> The word 'shelter' makes it sound like a nuke or something.



Apparently it was originally used in the event of tornadoes, chemical spills etc., then for active shooter situations, now it's being used for lockdowns in which people can still go out to exercise, go to the shops, etc. - some people are calling for it to be replaced by "stay-at-home order," for reasons including the fact that there could be some confusion if people under a coronavirus "shelter-in-place" also had to deal with a tornado and/or active shooter. 









						Stop Using the Term ‘Shelter in Place’ for the Coronavirus Crisis
					

It’s both misleading and confusing at a moment when public leaders need to be giving very clear instructions to the public.




					nymag.com


----------



## MickiQ (Apr 11, 2020)

There's a certain amount of ghoulish humour in watching Trump trying to berate a virus into submission


----------



## frogwoman (Apr 11, 2020)

'Covid-19 is a tremendous, brilliant virus. Unlike the Democrats, I am going to sit down and do the greatest deal with COVID-19 that the world has ever seen.'


----------



## elbows (Apr 13, 2020)

Todays press conference might be a spectacle even by Trumps standards - I havent read the report being referred to.



> The White House coronavirus taskforce briefing is due to begin in the coming hour.
> 
> President Trump is expected to be grilled on a New York Times investigation published on Sunday, which claims that he wasted nearly six weeks and failed to take action in February to prevent the coronavirus spread after he was alerted to the danger by top government officials.
> 
> ...



from the BBC live updates page at 21:38 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-52266235


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

Shit - when is that on?


----------



## two sheds (Apr 13, 2020)

Bloody biased press with their nasty questions


----------



## elbows (Apr 13, 2020)

I dunno what time it will start, the live streams are already popping up on youtube but its just a bunch of people, some with masks, hanging around at the moment.

eg


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Bloody biased press with their nasty questions



Very bad journalists.


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 13, 2020)

More generally, The Donald is not winning any friends internationally




			
				Simon Tisdall said:
			
		

> Donald Trump’s response to the coronavirus pandemic, which he once dismissed as a hoax, has been fiercely criticised at home as woefully inadequate to the point of irresponsibility.
> 
> Yet also thanks largely to Trump, a parallel disaster is unfolding across the world: the ruination of America’s reputation as a safe, trustworthy, competent international leader and partner.



Not sure about 'disaster' there ....


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

elbows said:


> I dunno what time it will start, the live streams are already popping up on youtube but its just a bunch of people, some with masks, hanging around at the moment.
> 
> eg




Cheers.  Appreciated.
I'm finding the whole spectacle astonishing.


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 13, 2020)

elbows said:


> Todays press conference might be a spectacle even by Trumps standards - I havent read the report being referred to.
> 
> 
> 
> from the BBC live updates page at 21:38 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-52266235



He's also probably going to lose his shit because the Democratic governors of Northeast and West Coast states are forming joint task forces to work on reopening their states - or, in Trump's worldview, conspiring behind his back to steal his thunder for defeating the virus as part of a plot to cost him the election this year.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

Anyone else watching this?

We all see clips of Trump, but seeing it raw and seeing how every unedited word is literally dripping in narcissism..
I despair.


----------



## two sheds (Apr 13, 2020)

8ball said:


> Anyone else watching this?
> 
> We all see clips of Trump, but seeing it raw and seeing how every unedited word is literally dripping in narcissism..
> I despair.



And everyone round him gushing how well he's doing  (can only take a few seconds of it)


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

This is 100% re-election campaign, I'm fucking incandescent.
I want to reach through the screen and get my hands round his throat.

Please, please, someone ask a proper question.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

😭


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 13, 2020)

8ball said:


> This is 100% re-election campaign, I'm fucking incandescent.
> I want to reach through the screen and get my hands round his throat.
> 
> Please, please, someone ask a proper question.


Paula Reid of CBS seems to have had a decent go.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

Yeah, she's my star of the show so far.


----------



## editor (Apr 13, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> Paula Reid of CBS seems to have had a decent go.



What a fucking dickhead. He's like a richkid school bully who can't accept criticism.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 13, 2020)

editor said:


> What a fucking dickhead. He's like a richkid school bully who can't accept criticism.


I mean, that's literally what he is.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 13, 2020)

editor said:


> What a fucking dickhead. He's like a richkid school bully who can't accept criticism.



It was really painful to watch. 

Most of it was re-election campaign.  Truly disgusting.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 14, 2020)

"When someone is President of the United States, the authority is total"

Why the fuck am I even surprised about that? Of _course _he said that.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Onto little side questions now.
Guess that's it.

<still fingers crossed for a zinger, but little hope>


----------



## two sheds (Apr 14, 2020)

Depressing is that all the trumpers and trumpettes will be lapping it up and thinking how rude that woman was interrupting him all the time and contradicting him and how well he did in putting her down


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Bloody uppity snowflake women...


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 14, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Depressing is that all the trumpers and trumpettes will be lapping it up and thinking how rude that woman was interrupting him all the time and contradicting him and how well he did in putting her down


Yup, that's been in all the responses to people sharing the video.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Bizarre terminology - "the China ban"...


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

China virus - came from China - we banned China...


----------



## elbows (Apr 14, 2020)

At one point I was expecting him to claim that February didnt exist because it was a leap year.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

elbows said:


> At one point I was expecting him to claim that February didnt exist because it was a leap year.



<guilty despairing giggle>


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 14, 2020)

lol this word salad in response to "uhh do you actually think you have unlimited authority". "we're gonna write papers, and governers, blugh, enough"


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Maybe a little last question about the money he recently stole from a charity would go well here.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 14, 2020)

Pence predictably not answering the question about "the president has total authority", but by god it's a relief to at least hear a coherent sentence.

Which is immediately depressing.


----------



## elbows (Apr 14, 2020)

8ball said:


> <guilty despairing giggle>



You dishonest people keep saying to me 'February, February, why didnt you act in February?'. Theres no such month, you made it up, in fact I call it Fakeuary. Some very clever people agreed with me that February maybe used to exist, but the Obama administration had that page ripped out of the official calendar. We tried to put it back, but the democrats blocked us. Now I've got governors on the phone begging me for more time. They were supposed to stockpile their own time, but we've been around the world and pirated time and now there is a federal stockpile that we can give them if they really need it. We dont think they need it, but we want to be safe. What time do you want, days, weeks, months? I think we should investigate where all that time is going, the numbers dont add up, they shouldnt need that much time, I think its going out the back door. Its not for me to investigate that, but people should look into it. Maybe you in the press could do your job and look into it. I heard there is a documentary film called Time Bandits that might clue you up, you might learn something if you watch it.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> Pence predictably not answering the question about "the president has total authority", but by god it's a relief to at least hear a coherent sentence.
> 
> Which is immediately depressing.



Surreal, isn't it?

Especially with the constant awareness of how evil Pence is.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 14, 2020)

8ball said:


> Surreal, isn't it?
> 
> Especially with the constant awareness of how evil Pence is.


Yup. I mean, saying nothing new 3 years into this, but the fact that Pence is a relief should be consistently alarming, gotta keep reminding myself that!


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> Yup. I mean, saying nothing new 3 years into this, but the fact that Pence is a relief should be consistently alarming, gotta keep reminding myself that!



A mate of mine keeps reminding me that Pence is a threat of magnitudes higher than Trump is.
I can believe it, watching this.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Oh.  Jingoism.  That's nice.  Was that a Fox guy?


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 14, 2020)

I liked the theme running through Pence's bland ramble, which was that we should all be grateful for having such amazing policies that led to having the most deaths in the world. Now back to the important questions about how to fight China for some reason and start making money for business owners again.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> I liked the theme running through Pence's bland ramble, which was that we should all be grateful for having such amazing policies that led to having the most deaths in the world. Now back to the important questions about how to fight China for some reason and start making money for business owners again.



Let's not take it for granted that they can't massively extend their record on deaths.


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 14, 2020)

"they've got very powerful machines that they don't even know they have, very big, very powerful machines" "a lot of states, they have the big machines, they didn't even know they had them" ahahahhaha THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES LADIES AND GENTLEMEN


----------



## little_legs (Apr 14, 2020)




----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> "they've got very powerful machines that they don't even know they have, very big, very powerful machines" "a lot of states, they have the big machines, they didn't even know they had them" ahahahhaha THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES LADIES AND GENTLEMEN



<is slightly jealous of your avatar - may have mentioned that before>


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

little_legs said:


>




Tbf - kind of hard to comment on without a lot of numbers for context.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Best ventilators ever, tremendous ventilators.
Amazing ventilators,
Ventilators for all religions.

Coming next week.


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 14, 2020)

Listening to Trump is like taking a really weird drug, I just kind of phase in and out of consciousness. All I know is that everything is very good, and we have absolute power, and the biggest machines, and we're talking about it with the very best people, good friends of mine having very good conversations, it's very safe and very smooth, and there's borders that we've got the best people protecting us against CHI-na.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

Pence again.  Relatively looking like a statesman.  
Just being in the world of human grammar again is weirdly and sinisterly calming.


----------



## lizzieloo (Apr 14, 2020)

I managed about 15 seconds of that


----------



## two sheds (Apr 14, 2020)

yep me too


----------



## little_legs (Apr 14, 2020)




----------



## petee (Apr 14, 2020)

holy moly



from the article:
_“I firmly believe that God is larger than this dreaded virus. You can quote me on that,” he said, repeating it a second time to claps, saying that “people are healed” in his church. _


----------



## two sheds (Apr 14, 2020)

I wonder how many he'll have taken with him though


----------



## 8ball (Apr 14, 2020)

two sheds said:


> I wonder how many he'll have taken with him though



Good point.


----------



## Idris2002 (Apr 14, 2020)

"Let us now rise for the national anthem of Independent California - That's Like, Just Your Opinion, Man".

The governer of California has taken to calling his state a 'nation-state' apparently, and has spoken of "exporting" stuff to other parts of the USA.









						Gavin Newsom Declares California a ‘Nation-State’
					

(Bloomberg Opinion) -- California this week declared its independence from the federal government’s feeble efforts to fight Covid-19 — and perhaps from a bit more. The consequences for the fight against the pandemic are almost certainly positive. The implications for the brewing civil war...




					finance.yahoo.com
				




This will end well.


----------



## Idris2002 (Apr 14, 2020)

Newsom's comments may be just a rhetorical provocation intended to help secure more aid from DC:









						Column: California might behave as a 'nation-state.' But its power has limits
					

California has the ability to fight its own coronavirus war, but there are limits to the state's exceptionalism.




					www.latimes.com
				




But he may have a let a very demented cat out of the bag. . .


----------



## petee (Apr 14, 2020)

Idris2002 said:


> But he may have a let a very demented cat out of the bag. . .



the demented cat in the white house? b/c the guy who engaged in a 7-year campaign of slander against pres. obama now claims presidents have total authority, after WA-OR-CA and the six (now seven) state council in the northeast got together. 

or maybe you're making a subtle constitutional point about federalism?


----------



## JimW (Apr 14, 2020)




----------



## little_legs (Apr 14, 2020)

JimW said:


>


Shame they had to shut down schools to get to this stat. Thanks, comrade Corona.


----------



## Idris2002 (Apr 14, 2020)

petee said:


> the demented cat in the white house? b/c the guy who engaged in a 7-year campaign of slander against pres. obama now claims presidents have total authority, after WA-OR-CA and the six (now seven) state council in the northeast got together.
> 
> or maybe you're making a subtle constitutional point about federalism?


I'm making an entirely non-subtle point about the break up of the USSR, eh I mean the USA.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 14, 2020)

So, he's stopped funding to WHO.

But, he's also talking about how he wisely rationed ventilators, but still no American has died for want of one. They must be pretty fucking confident that it's not _going _to happen at some point in the future...?

Oh, ok, apparently they have more stockpiled


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 14, 2020)

Protests against the lockdown in Ohio right now.




All a bit confusing....


----------



## weltweit (Apr 14, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> So, he's stopped funding to WHO.
> ..


Interesting indeed.

At the same time that in the last WHO press conference the DG WHO said UK donated £200 million to the fight against Covid-19.

As evidenced by: UK gives £200m in aid to developing nations


> The UK will send £200m in aid to help developing nations battle coronavirus.
> 
> The money will mean more help for refugee camps - including new hand-washing stations.





> International Development Secretary Anne-Marie Trevelyan said boosting fragile health systems overseas would help prevent a "second wave" of infections hitting the UK.
> 
> The latest donation brings Britain's total contribution to the global effort to halt the pandemic to £744m.
> ..
> Of the £200m in funding, £130m will go to United Nations agencies, including £65m for the World Health Organization (WHO), which is co-ordinating the global response to the pandemic.


from: 12/04/2020 UK donates £200m to global coronavirus fight


----------



## a_chap (Apr 15, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Protests against the lockdown in Ohio right now.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Having spent some time in Ohio I am profoundly depressed that it turns out they are incredibly stupid after all


----------



## petee (Apr 15, 2020)

Idris2002 said:


> I'm making an entirely non-subtle point about the break up of the USSR, eh I mean the USA.



cuomo backtracked today


----------



## little_legs (Apr 15, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Protests against the lockdown in Ohio right now.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



A bunch of fucking chuds that need to be punched in their faces


----------



## little_legs (Apr 15, 2020)




----------



## editor (Apr 15, 2020)

Religion.   



> Despite warnings from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to avoid mass gatherings and maintain social distancing, Glenn said in a sermon on March 22, "I firmly believe that God is larger than this dreaded virus," and announced he was not afraid to die.











						Bishop who said "God is larger than" Covid-19 has died from the disease
					

Bishop Gerald Glenn, the pastor of New Deliverance Evangelistic Church in Virginia, has died, the church announced on Sunday. Glenn had tested positive for coronavirus, according to a video posted by his daughter Mar-Gerie Crawley.




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## petee (Apr 15, 2020)

editor said:


> Religion.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



 last page


----------



## editor (Apr 15, 2020)

Trump is bored watching old baseball games, so....



> Speaking during a briefing on Tuesday, Trump talked about the importance of bringing sports back into everyday life after the coronavirus pandemic forced leagues to halt play. He said: ‘We have to get our sports back, I’m tired of watching baseball games that are 14 years old. ‘I haven’t actually had too much time to watch – I would say maybe I watch one batter and then I get back to work.’ The conference came after it was revealed WWE would be allowed to continue to hold live shows – without a crowd – at the Performance Center in Orlando.











						Donald Trump names WWE's Vince McMahon as adviser to restart US economy
					

The chairman will have some influence.




					metro.co.uk


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 15, 2020)

Couple of things worth adding to the above:

Linda McMahon, who amongst other things runs a pro-Trump super PAC, committed to spending $18.5m in Florida, a day or so before WWE were classed as an essential business in the state.

That, of course, means they can continue making shows.

Today, however, they've been letting go of 10s of wrestlers and backroom staff, some of whom have been there for decades. It's bloody carnage.

A week or so ago, one of the wrestlers pledged $20k of his own money to WWE staff who found themselves unable to make money during the crisis. Not management, just one of their employees. He was released today too.

Meanwhile, WWE have said they have cash reserves of $500m, and Vince is worth around $1.7bn on his own. Apparently the layoffs will save around $4m a month.

You can see why Trump likes 'em, huh?


----------



## Tankus (Apr 15, 2020)

Protesters in Michigan over lockdown

No this is not taken from any zombie film
....photos out on twitter


----------



## editor (Apr 15, 2020)

Just look at these fucking bellends














						The Protests in Michigan Have Signaled the Nonsense Is Coming
					

Coronavirus lockdowns may trigger the next Tea Party-style movement.




					www.esquire.com


----------



## two sheds (Apr 15, 2020)

Well they'll all soon be coming down with coronavirus so that should slow them down a bit.


----------



## petee (Apr 16, 2020)

it's not just MI, someone above was talking about OH


----------



## little_legs (Apr 16, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Protesters in Michigan over lockdown
> View attachment 206962
> No this is not taken from any zombie film
> ....photos out on twitter


----------



## phillm (Apr 16, 2020)

little_legs said:


> A bunch of fucking chuds that need to be punched in their faces



BEEB reporting on Michigan now. Looks a lot at first sight to be Trumpers. If this catches fire then he'll probably be pushed into an early economy before health decision.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 16, 2020)

Brings a whole to meaning to the 'right to die.'


----------



## little_legs (Apr 16, 2020)

phillm said:


> BEEB reporting on Michigan now. Looks a lot at first sight to be Trumpers. If this catches fire then he'll probably be pushed into an early economy before health decision.


Hopefully all of the chuds who came out to these rallies will be dead in 2 weeks.


----------



## peterkro (Apr 16, 2020)

little_legs said:


> Hopefully all of the chuds who came out to these rallies will be dead in 2 weeks.


Chuds? Baltic Finns? Or is there some Americanisation I'm unaware of?


----------



## little_legs (Apr 16, 2020)

peterkro said:


> Chuds? Baltic Finns? Or is there some Americanisation I'm unaware of?


chuds is a colloquial for maga wearing alt-right/right wing idiots


----------



## Sprocket. (Apr 16, 2020)

The land of the free and sadly mass graves.


----------



## phillm (Apr 16, 2020)

Protest in your car.....looks like a pretty massive convoy. Either that or they are out of bog roll...


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 16, 2020)

This is what the zombie apocalypse looks like. 

Beer zombies, work zombies, religion zombies, phone zombies, trash culture zombies, people who have lost sight of what's really important and instead put all their life force, all their loyalties and energies into the thing that keeps them stumbling forward with no thought.

It was inevitable that as soon as capitalism and consumerism was under threat the zombies would start up. Without the thing that sustains their greed and need around them on all sides they are compelled to stagger on looking for it, seeking for it without thought or consideration for any other factor.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 16, 2020)

Reading the comments on that Michigan tweet....


----------



## Idris2002 (Apr 16, 2020)

I believe "chud" is an acronym for "cannibalistic  humanoid  underground dweller"


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 16, 2020)

Idris2002 said:


> I believe "chud" is an acronym for "cannibalistic underground humanoid dweller"




That's a different thing. That's a Cuhd.


----------



## Idris2002 (Apr 16, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> That's a different thing. That's a Cuhd.


As in "chewing the Cuhd", a popular past time during the Before Times.


----------



## editor (Apr 16, 2020)

This is still the greatest zombie picture from the crisis. Shaun of the Dead anyone?  😂 

"About 100 right wing protesters assembled outside of the Ohio Statehouse during Gov. DeWine's weekday update on Monday, upset that the state remains under a stay-at-home order and that non-essential businesses remain - or as one put it “a sad collection of Patriot nutballs, Antivaxxer assholes, QAnon creeps and Trumpers...”


----------



## editor (Apr 16, 2020)

'Live Free Or Die' says one of banners. Or get two for one if you go on gun waving rallies with a bunch of your armed bellend chums.









						Armed protesters demand an end to Michigan's coronavirus lockdown orders – video
					

Michigan protester demanding an end to lockdown laws target governor with ‘lock her up’ chants




					www.theguardian.com
				




"We’re tired of not being able to go to the hairdressers" said one.

#toomuchperspective


----------



## not-bono-ever (Apr 16, 2020)

thats the state motto of New Hampshire


----------



## not-bono-ever (Apr 16, 2020)

Im sure alan moore is scratching his beard wondering how his story of 30 years ago has led to trumpists wearing V for vendetta film masks


----------



## rekil (Apr 16, 2020)

Loons in Vancouver.









						Great, the Anti-Vaxxer Coronavirus Protests Are Here
					

Children and senior citizens were both present at the rally of 20 people in Vancouver.




					www.vice.com


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 16, 2020)

Praying for a bit of a Darwinian outcome for that crowd...


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 16, 2020)

editor said:


> View attachment 207054
> 
> This is still the greatest zombie picture from the crisis. Shaun of the Dead anyone?  😂
> 
> "About 100 right wing protesters assembled outside of the Ohio Statehouse during Gov. DeWine's weekday update on Monday, upset that the state remains under a stay-at-home order and that non-essential businesses remain - or as one put it “a sad collection of Patriot nutballs, Antivaxxer assholes, QAnon creeps and Trumpers...”



the two women closest to the glass seem to be wearing the same horror mask.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Apr 16, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> It's truly frightening the way things are headed in the US - New York state alone has almost a tenth of the world's confirmed coronavirus cases - more cases and almost as many deaths as China has reported, though China's figures are unlikely to have much connection with reality.
> 
> It would be bad enough if there was a real president in charge - with states largely being left to chart their own courses in the absence of federal leadership, I think the country might struggle even to get it together enough to hold this year's election on time in a manner where the results won't be disputed.



The results were always going to be in dispute.


----------



## SpookyFrank (Apr 16, 2020)

editor said:


> 'Live Free Or Die' says one of banners. Or get two for one if you go on gun waving rallies with a bunch of your armed bellend chums.



In the circumstances 'Live Free And Die' would be rather more apposite.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Apr 16, 2020)

Protests in Michigan:






> LANSING, Mich. – Demonstrators drove thousands of vehicles – many draped with protest signs – to Michigan's state Capitol on Wednesday, loudly protesting Gov. Gretchen Whitmer's stay-at-home order intended to fight the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> Police watched as horns honked and commercial and private vehicles from around the state jammed Capitol Avenue and other streets surrounding Michigan's seat of government in Lansing.
> 
> "Liberty once lost is lost forever," read a sign draped across a commercial van. "Security without liberty is called prison," read another, stretched across the Capitol's front lawn. "Recall Whitmer," a third sign said.











						Thousands converge to protest Michigan governor's stay-home order in 'Operation Gridlock'
					

Protesters said the stay home order is crippling their businesses and some called on the governor to be recalled.




					www.usatoday.com


----------



## SpookyFrank (Apr 16, 2020)

editor said:


> View attachment 207054
> 
> This is still the greatest zombie picture from the crisis. Shaun of the Dead anyone?  😂
> 
> "About 100 right wing protesters assembled outside of the Ohio Statehouse during Gov. DeWine's weekday update on Monday, upset that the state remains under a stay-at-home order and that non-essential businesses remain - or as one put it “a sad collection of Patriot nutballs, Antivaxxer assholes, QAnon creeps and Trumpers...”



And when half of them get sick after all crowding together with their mouths open distributing as much spittle as possible, that won't be taken as evidence that maybe the 'stay at home' stuff has some basis to it but as proof that they really _are _being targetted by a sinister cabal of Chinese people, Bill Gates, Elvis, John Travolta in Battlefield Earth and, one assumes, all of the Jews.


----------



## phillm (Apr 16, 2020)

SpookyFrank said:


> And when half of them get sick after all crowding together with their mouths open distributing as much spittle as possible, that won't be taken as evidence that maybe the 'stay at home' stuff has some basis to it but as proof that they really _are _being targetted by a sinister cabal of Chinese people, Bill Gates, Elvis, John Travolta in Battlefield Earth and, one assumes, all of the Jews.


+5G - everything comes served with a big dollop of 5G sprinkles in this apocalyptic Willy Wonka magic factory.


----------



## phillm (Apr 16, 2020)




----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 16, 2020)




----------



## skyscraper101 (Apr 16, 2020)

editor said:


> View attachment 207054
> 
> This is still the greatest zombie picture from the crisis. Shaun of the Dead anyone?  😂
> 
> "About 100 right wing protesters assembled outside of the Ohio Statehouse during Gov. DeWine's weekday update on Monday, upset that the state remains under a stay-at-home order and that non-essential businesses remain - or as one put it “a sad collection of Patriot nutballs, Antivaxxer assholes, QAnon creeps and Trumpers...”



Look at them, with their stupid Trump hats on and everything, as if he's blameless in all of this. Fucking idiots.


----------



## 8ball (Apr 16, 2020)

editor said:


> View attachment 207054
> 
> This is still the greatest zombie picture from the crisis. Shaun of the Dead anyone?  😂
> 
> "About 100 right wing protesters assembled outside of the Ohio Statehouse during Gov. DeWine's weekday update on Monday, upset that the state remains under a stay-at-home order and that non-essential businesses remain - or as one put it “a sad collection of Patriot nutballs, Antivaxxer assholes, QAnon creeps and Trumpers...”



That's got to make it into the running for one of the pics of the year.


----------



## phillm (Apr 16, 2020)

8ball said:


> That's got to make it into the running for one of the pics of the year.



Or even century. So this is how decadent civilizations end in the 'modern age'. 

Triumph of the Idiot.


----------



## editor (Apr 16, 2020)

Seems legit 











						COVID-19-Defying Pastor Wants People to Send Him Their $1,200 Stimulus Checks
					

This pastor is a parasite.




					friendlyatheist.patheos.com


----------



## editor (Apr 16, 2020)

Depressing photos 






"People wait in their cars Thursday, at Traders Village for the San Antonio Food Bank to begin food distribution. 10,000 people seek San Antonio Food Bank help"









						These photos show the staggering food bank lines across America
					

America's hunger is being captured by photographers across the country.




					www.motherjones.com


----------



## petee (Apr 16, 2020)




----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 16, 2020)

petee, what help are people, that can't work because of the lock-down, getting in the US?

I seem to remember reading that everyone is getting a cheque for $1200, otherwise is it just unemployment benefit, and at what rate is that paid?


----------



## existentialist (Apr 16, 2020)

I keep thinking about this lunacy, and actually this virus is _perfect_. They can rail against liberal conspiracies all they want, and they can insist the virus is manufactured/non-existent/being exploited by Big <whoeverthebogeymanistoday>, but the bottom line is - THE VIRUS DOESN'T CARE.

Their cause can be as righteous as they want, but if they huddle together in protest, and just one person is carrying it, it won't matter whose virus it is, because it'll be theirs in a very real sense.


----------



## petee (Apr 16, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> petee, what help are people, that can't work because of the lock-down, getting in the US?
> 
> I seem to remember reading that everyone is getting a cheque for $1200, otherwise is it just unemployment benefit, and at what rate is that paid?



not everyone, your situation must fit within parameters

*Who is eligible for the economic impact payment?*
_Tax filers with adjusted gross income up to $75,000 for individuals and up to $150,000 for married couples filing joint returns will receive the full payment. For filers with income above those amounts, the payment amount is reduced by $5 for each $100 above the $75,000/$150,000 thresholds. Single filers with income exceeding $99,000 and $198,000 for joint filers with no children are not eligible. Social Security recipients and railroad retirees who are otherwise not required to file a tax return are also eligible and will not be required to file a return. 

Eligible taxpayers who filed tax returns for either 2019 or 2018 will automatically receive an economic impact payment of up to $1,200 for individuals or $2,400 for married couples and up to $500 for each qualifying child._





__





						Economic impact payments: What you need to know | Internal Revenue Service
					

IR-2020-61, March 30, 2020 — The Treasury Department and the Internal Revenue Service today announced that distribution of economic impact payments will begin in the next three weeks and will be distributed automatically, with no action required for most people. Updated with new information for...




					www.irs.gov
				




which is great, but:
1: companies are getting very generous help, and there is any number of stories about billion dollar outfits getting money which might go to working people
2: trump, of course, took the opportunity to try to buy the next election by forcing his name onto the checks, when normally the treasury secretary would be the signer, or the "treaurer of the united states", a functionary whose office (unsurprisingly for this administration) has been vacant since january (https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...1016c2-7e82-11ea-8013-1b6da0e4a2b7_story.html)


----------



## little_legs (Apr 16, 2020)

I'd like to see how this piece of shit can survive 10 weeks on USD1,200


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Apr 16, 2020)

little_legs said:


> I'd like to see how this piece of shit can survive 10 weeks on USD1,200




That's literally lunch money to him.


----------



## two sheds (Apr 16, 2020)

Brave man


editor said:


> View attachment 207054
> 
> This is still the greatest zombie picture from the crisis. Shaun of the Dead anyone?  😂
> 
> "About 100 right wing protesters assembled outside of the Ohio Statehouse during Gov. DeWine's weekday update on Monday, upset that the state remains under a stay-at-home order and that non-essential businesses remain - or as one put it “a sad collection of Patriot nutballs, Antivaxxer assholes, QAnon creeps and Trumpers...”



Even the mode of transmission's the same as zombies - touch one and they're infected and they start stumbling towards you arms wide mumbling Trump MAGA, Trump MAGA, Trump MAGA .


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Apr 16, 2020)

I think this might be the greatest unearthed tweet in the history of unearthed tweets.


----------



## killer b (Apr 16, 2020)

You know that isnt real dont you?


----------



## Doctor Carrot (Apr 16, 2020)

killer b said:


> You know that isnt real dont you?



I have my suspicions, yes. It doesn't matter either way though does it? It will have no bearing on his presidency.


----------



## Sue (Apr 17, 2020)

Trump saying the US is past the peak. Wtf.


----------



## two sheds (Apr 17, 2020)

Well they only had five cases to be fair.


----------



## petee (Apr 17, 2020)

killer b said:


> You know that isnt real dont you?



this one however i haven't seen debunked


----------



## elbows (Apr 17, 2020)

The untold story behind America's biggest outbreak
					

Infections spread like wildfire through a pork factory in South Dakota. Here's how it happened.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				






> During that time, the number of confirmed cases among Smithfield employees slowly mounted, from 80 to 190 to 238.
> 
> By 15 April, when Smithfield finally closed under pressure from the South Dakota governor's office, the plant had become the number one hotspot in the US, with a cluster of 644 confirmed cases among Smithfield employees and people who contracted it from them. In total, Smithfield-related infections account for 55% of the caseload in the state, which is far outpacing its far more populous Midwestern neighbour states in cases per capita. According to the New York Times, the Smithfield Foods case numbers have surpassed the USS Theodore Roosevelt naval ship and the Cook County Jail in Chicago, Illinois.
> 
> Those figures were released one day after the first Smithfield employee died in hospital.


----------



## Supine (Apr 17, 2020)

Wrestling is an essential service apparently...









						Florida Gov. DeSantis declared WWE an "essential service." His explanation doesn’t make much sense.
					

"I think people have been starved for content ... we’re watching, like, reruns from the early 2000s."




					www.vox.com


----------



## 8ball (Apr 17, 2020)

Supine said:


> Wrestling is an essential service apparently...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The whole "essential" vs. "non-essential" thing pisses me off a bit tbf.
Restrictions should be primarily determined by risks.


----------



## elbows (Apr 17, 2020)

Oh dear:



> President Donald Trump has appeared to endorse protests against stringent lockdown measures in several states.
> 
> In a series of tweets, he said: "LIBERATE MINNESOTA", "LIBERATE MICHIGAN" and then "LIBERATE VIRGINIA".
> 
> Protesters say the severe economic restrictions are hurting citizens, but health officials warn lifting them could spread infection.











						Trump defends tweets against US states' lockdowns
					

He says some measures are "too tough", but health experts warn lifting them will increase infection.




					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## petee (Apr 17, 2020)

petee said:


> cuomo backtracked today



wait, he punched back today


----------



## Mation (Apr 17, 2020)

.


----------



## Mation (Apr 17, 2020)

Poor people must be terrified 









						The untold story behind America's biggest outbreak
					

Infections spread like wildfire through a pork factory in South Dakota. Here's how it happened.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				





> For Julia, alerting the media was just the next logical step in trying to keep them all healthy, by creating public pressure to close the plant down and keep her parents home. Instead, it marked the beginning of nearly three anxiety-filled weeks during which her mother and father continued to report to a factory they knew could be contaminated, to jobs they could not afford to lose. They stood side-by-side less than a foot away from their colleagues on production lines, they passed in and out of crowded locker rooms, walkways and cafeterias.
> 
> During that time, the number of confirmed cases among Smithfield employees slowly mounted, from 80 to 190 to 238.
> 
> ...


----------



## Mation (Apr 17, 2020)

elbows said:


> The untold story behind America's biggest outbreak
> 
> 
> Infections spread like wildfire through a pork factory in South Dakota. Here's how it happened.
> ...


Eep! elbows got there first. (Which isn't surprising!)


----------



## petee (Apr 17, 2020)

observe:

trump: i'm president and i have all the authority
trump: having asserted that i have all the authority, i am giving it back to the governors by my grace
trump: the governors are not doing what they should which is now their fault, and i'm on board with the great patriots threatening violence to re-open everything

the trump two-step, folks


----------



## SpookyFrank (Apr 17, 2020)

How do you use violence to re-open Burger King?


----------



## sunnysidedown (Apr 17, 2020)




----------



## editor (Apr 17, 2020)

America. 


> On Saturday, April 4, at 4 a.m., *I was abruptly awoken by God after an encounter with a strong demonic force that came into my bedroom and tried to put a sickness upon me on my chest.* I cried out in my sleep three times as I rebuked this demon. I knew it had something to do with the coronavirus. The strange thing was that *I went to bed with a communion cracker in my hand, which I never do*, and I had been up praying for about three hours before I fell asleep and had this demonic encounter. *I took the cracker before the attack.*
> 
> The next morning my husband told me I had been rebuking demons because he heard me cry out in the night against them while I was in my sleep. This dream was not because I was receiving the coronavirus; it was a warning dream, to tell the people that *this virus is a demonic force and there is a way to deal with it spiritually, as well as biologically.*











						Pastor: I Survived a “Demonic” COVID-19 Attack By Holding a “Communion Cracker”
					

Is she trying to win converts to Christianity or push people away from it?




					friendlyatheist.patheos.com


----------



## editor (Apr 17, 2020)

SpookyFrank said:


> How do you use violence to re-open Burger King?


Don't forget that some people are REALLY FUCKING ANGRY that they can't get to a hairdresser right now.


----------



## two sheds (Apr 17, 2020)

I wonder whether instead of immunity certificates for people who've had cv they should have immunity certificates for being Christians or Trumpsupporters who are therefore immune and so won't want to be hospitalized if they do get it (they won't need it they won't need it) so tying up medical resourses after going to the hairdressers.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 18, 2020)

The rightwing Christian preachers in deep denial over Covid-19's danger
					

A number of American religious leaders have endangered their flock by holding services – and by claiming the virus can be defeated by faith in God




					www.theguardian.com
				






One of the things I don’t understand about the American denial of the virus is how they don’t seem to be aware of how the virus has affected any other country on the planet. If they can divert it or conquer it with their evangelical preaching, does that mean that they’ll be able to stop it because the evangelical preachers elsewhere aren't as good as them? 

Also, if the virus is part of God’s plan for the endtimes, why are they trying to stop it? 

And do they really think they can just go about their business, getting haircuts and so forth? The virus won’t touch them because... what? What do they believe? Italy and Spain and Germany and Denmark and the U.K. were just... what? What makes them immune and us susceptible? What leads them to believe that while the virus ravages New York it will avoid Michigan?


----------



## Raheem (Apr 18, 2020)

SpookyFrank said:


> How do you use violence to re-open Burger King?


Griller tactics.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 18, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> The rightwing Christian preachers in deep denial over Covid-19's danger
> 
> 
> A number of American religious leaders have endangered their flock by holding services – and by claiming the virus can be defeated by faith in God
> ...





> “There is a spirit on media that will exaggerate this virus so badly that you will need to insulate your head in order to keep yourself free from paranoia,” Walnau wrote.



Tin-foil hats all round.


----------



## bellaozzydog (Apr 18, 2020)

American needs to just start shooting. Spray and pray long enough and all the fuxkwits will fullfil their Darwinian destiny

this is the point where the conservative right bible belters are suddenly introduced to hard evolutionary facts. Dumb is not a great survival trait


----------



## kenny g (Apr 18, 2020)

Perhaps corn syrup jelly/ jam is the perfect anti-dote?


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 18, 2020)

Suburban America will be fine, since they already practice social distancing by driving everywhere and living in houses on massive plots. It’s the cities that are getting fucked over.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 18, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> Suburban America will be fine, since they already practice social distancing by driving everywhere and living in houses on massive plots. It’s the cities that are getting fucked over.




This has occured to me too. And it will support their notion that tham thar ciddy dwellers are just asking for all kinds of trouble by not living the good ol’ republican life.

But they do have gatherings and poverty, not everyone lives on plots of land. Huge numbers eat takeaway food every week (something like 37%), some every day, and there’s much less delivery, it’s mostly drive through or pick up, plus gas stations, coffee stops. And they have towns and cities, schools, cinemas, shopping malls, grocery stores... They love to shop, they love to think of themselves as social, gregarious, hospitable, neighbourly, friendly.
And they’ll deliberately defy social distancing to prove their point.

And they also have grinding poverty everywhere with overcrowding/homelessness, few resources, poor nutritional levels, massive underlying health issues, out of control opioid addiction...

Not to mention the enormous prison population and the also huge numbers of people who live in care homes, sheltered accommodation and assisted care homes. And gated communites will find themselves no safer than the people outside their gates.

They won’t be fine.


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 18, 2020)

The governor of Washington went on TV last night and said pretty succinctly that Trump was full of shit about "reopening the economy", was being contradicted by his own advisers, and that our state would continue the lockdown for the foreseeable future. It's pretty interesting watching the states form agreements and cooperate among themselves directly during this pandemic because the federal government is doing such a shit job. Individual states have a lot of power in the US and it's easy to forget it in ordinary times.

I think a lot more people are going to get sick if states start opening up again. It is sort of true that a lot of things are more spaced out in America compared to other countries but I'm not certain that makes much of a difference. The disease might spread more slowly than in a dense area but it will still spread if people aren't actively isolating, it's incredibly contagious. Plus the death rate in rural areas is sure to be much higher because of a lack of access to medical facilities due to physical distance as well as not being able to afford it. A lot of people will support starting everything up regardless, and it's hard to blame them because for a lot of Americans it's work or face homelessness.

It's possible that China has already demonstrated the most effective methods for fighting this virus, but such means are likely impossible to implement because of the constitution. The critical factor is having total compliance (and enforcement), you can't have 20% of the population saying "well i don't believe in the virus and it's my constitutional right to go out and cough at a bunch of faces, bye." You can call people breaking quarantine idiots until you're blue in the face but if the state can't act to enforce guidelines there's always going to be some fraction of a population ignoring them, and that's all it takes to keep spreading a virus and hurting everyone. Not that I'm screaming to give up any rights, it's just a thought.

I knew as soon as this virus got here that the US would have the worst response to it of any country. Useless executive and federal government, individualist culture resisting compliance with public health measures, vampire lich capitalist class who will merrily step over millions of bodies to maintain their wealth, poor to nonexistent social services, etc.


----------



## editor (Apr 18, 2020)

What a fucking blithering bellend 









						Trump calls protesters against stay-at-home orders 'very responsible'
					

President tweeted that Minnesota, Michigan and Virginia should be ‘liberated’ after demonstrations against social distancing




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## editor (Apr 18, 2020)

*orders fresh consignment of facepalms


----------



## existentialist (Apr 18, 2020)

editor said:


> *orders fresh consignment of facepalms
> 
> View attachment 207426


Look how far away from her everyone else is!


----------



## little_legs (Apr 18, 2020)




----------



## N_igma (Apr 18, 2020)

Normally I try to find the best in people and humanity but fuck these cunts, just fuck them.


----------



## little_legs (Apr 18, 2020)

Florida's 65 or over is 20% of the population. There'll be mass graves in Florida soon.


----------



## Fez909 (Apr 18, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Also, if the virus is part of God’s plan for the endtimes, why are they trying to stop it?


----------



## petee (Apr 18, 2020)

editor said:


> What a fucking blithering bellend
> 
> 
> 
> ...



he's just guaranteeing his base vote in November. that's what the jiu-jitsu i described above was designed to do.


----------



## elbows (Apr 18, 2020)

Right-wing scum are probably making a medium-long term calculation too - that no matter how bad the pandemics direct toll, the economic damage will last much longer. And they will want to paint themselves as having been against all that economic damage in the first place.


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 18, 2020)

Fucking state of this.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 18, 2020)

Bunch of uneducated potatoes.


----------



## phillm (Apr 19, 2020)

Alex Jones wades in. 









						An anti-lockdown protest in Austin, Texas, drew anti-vaxxers and Trump supporters chanting 'Fire Fauci'
					

Despite not having adequate testing in place, Texas Gov. Greg Abbott on Friday announced he would begin reopening Texas businesses by May.




					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## existentialist (Apr 19, 2020)

phillm said:


> Alex Jones wades in.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What an unmitigated, self-regarding prick that man is.


----------



## phillm (Apr 19, 2020)

existentialist said:


> What an unmitigated, self-regarding prick that man is.


There is in the second photo one 'protestor' with latex gloves and a mask and a camera - FBI undercover maybe? as he has half a brain cell unlike most of the others.


----------



## platinumsage (Apr 19, 2020)

phillm said:


> There is in the second photo one 'protestor' with latex gloves and a mask and a camera - FBI undercover maybe? as he has half a brain cell unlike most of the others.



You can't catch coronavirus from your own camera through the skin on your fingers.


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 19, 2020)

It definitely won't be a tragedy if Alex Jones gets the coronavirus, but while I don't agree with them, I do have sympathy for some of the anti-lockdown protesters in the US, especially the majority who stayed in their cars - unlike people in most countries dealing with major outbreaks, a lot of Americans losing their jobs are also losing their health coverage, which must change their outlook on the benefits of a strict lockdown in a way that's beyond my experience. 

It makes it seem even more of a shame that Bernie Sanders is out of the running for the presidency, there's never been a better time for his message on universal healthcare, I don't think Joe Biden and his "Let's Tinker With ObamaCare a Little Bit" policy has much chance of reaching people in the same way.


----------



## bimble (Apr 19, 2020)

phillm said:


> There is in the second photo one 'protestor' with latex gloves and a mask and a camera - FBI undercover maybe? as he has half a brain cell unlike most of the others.


Sometimes it's just impossible to try to guess whats going on someone's head, like this guy for instance, does he think he's wearing a sort of halloween costume ?


----------



## emanymton (Apr 19, 2020)

bimble said:


> Sometimes it's just impossible to try to guess whats going on someone's head, like this guy for instance, does he think he's wearing a sort of halloween costume ?
> View attachment 207583


Probably yes. People dress up for demonstrations all the time. Just a bit of theatre. Just because we may may disagree with the point it doesn't make it any more stupid than people who dress up as Torres or whatever on save the NHS demos.


----------



## phillm (Apr 19, 2020)

bimble said:


> Sometimes it's just impossible to try to guess whats going on someone's head, like this guy for instance, does he think he's wearing a sort of halloween costume ?
> View attachment 207583



The fact that they are infantile is a given. Apparently many of them want a "boogaloo". It can't be long before the shooting starts sadly. All egged on by Trump from the sidelines so his crime family can take over the country and restart his real estate and resort businesses. 









						The Boogaloo: Extremists’ New Slang Term for A Coming Civil War
					

A variety of extremist and fringe movements and subcultures have adopted the word “boogaloo” as shorthand for a future civil war.




					www.adl.org


----------



## Lorca (Apr 19, 2020)

aaaand another eejit! edit: surely it's fake?


----------



## existentialist (Apr 19, 2020)

Lorca said:


> aaaand another eejit! edit: surely it's fake?
> 
> 
> View attachment 207588


Sums it up, really, though.

30 years of right-wing media bullshit, and rampant neoliberalism, and we've created a generation (or two) for whom the idea of social connectedness is an irrelevance. 

"Why should I wear a mask? I'm not scared of some virus?" 

"What do you mean, I am protecting others by wearing a mask or self-isolating? Fuck them, they can do the same as me, and protect themselves - I'm not responsible for their safety."

Of course, when the chickens all come home to roost - and, much as I'd hate to encourage it to happen, a massive US death toll would definitely be roosting chickens - they might discover, belatedly, why acting together for the common good would have been a good idea. Meanwhile, it's all small-picture stuff, and WIFM ("what's in it for me?").

And we shouldn't crow too much - we (collectively, in the UK) are not that far behind the US, and we do seem to be making a habit of electing politicians whose attitudes are straight out of the same neolib Trumpian playbook as the Americans'.


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 19, 2020)

Suspect the fact that it has a higher hit rate in urban areas and among ethnic minority groups in particular hasn’t escaped the white supremacist cunts. They’ll be practically cheering it on.


----------



## Marty1 (Apr 19, 2020)

phillm said:


> Protest in your car.....looks like a pretty massive convoy. Either that or they are out of bog roll...




That’s an amazing amount of pickup trucks!


----------



## ska invita (Apr 19, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> That’s an amazing amount of pickup trucks!


Amazing pick up trucks aside, what do you think of these protests and Trump's role in encouraging them?


----------



## Marty1 (Apr 19, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Amazing pick up trucks aside, what do you think of these protests and Trump's role in encouraging them?



Potentially dangerous.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 19, 2020)

existentialist said:


> 30 years of right-wing media bullshit, and rampant neoliberalism, and we've created a generation (or two) for whom the idea of social connectedness is an irrelevance.


Not the first to suggest it, but it does seem like we/they took the wrong 'lessons' from the two World Wars they so eagerly like to harp on about.


----------



## bimble (Apr 19, 2020)

This is really helpful, please read it, on the protests that have received so much attention and who is behind them and why.









						Trump, Fox News are trying to gin up a new Tea Party to distract you from their deadly failures | Will Bunch
					

Don't be fooled by a tiny band of protesters. Trump, Fox News and the DeVos family don't want voters to dwell on their failures.




					www.inquirer.com


----------



## two sheds (Apr 19, 2020)

bimble said:


> This is really helpful, please read it, on the protests that have received so much attention and who is behind them and why.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



"Maybe we should call this one the Ventilator Party, or maybe the Branch COVID-ians."


----------



## phillm (Apr 19, 2020)

.


----------



## phillm (Apr 19, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> That’s an amazing amount of pickup trucks!


I don't have any with choos-choos I'm afraid.


----------



## editor (Apr 19, 2020)

Yes, really


----------



## editor (Apr 19, 2020)

This is encouraging, mind


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 19, 2020)

Been a while since I saw a Sub Pop t.shirt. He's got his nose covered but not his mouth


----------



## ska invita (Apr 19, 2020)

editor said:


> Yes, really
> 
> View attachment 207786


This might yet prove to be an interesting evolutionary moment


----------



## Steel Icarus (Apr 20, 2020)

Watching Trump. He's mad and stupid. He just talks and talks and none of it makes sense or is true, it's hilarious and alarming


----------



## Steel Icarus (Apr 20, 2020)

Just a constant stream of non-sequiturs, word salad and stream of semi-consciousness


----------



## Tankus (Apr 20, 2020)

Mind you .?if there isnt an upward curve in 3 weeks to a month from now  the Magas are going to claim vindication......but it might be due to the sane majority still staying at home ..

.its going to be very prolonged


----------



## Ax^ (Apr 20, 2020)

S☼I said:


> Just a constant stream of non-sequiturs, word salad and stream of semi-consciousness



sadly the current leader of the United kingdom is no better/ the Guy giving him advise to run the Country

and both  bangs to his drum

the guy in the background of the last picture is proclaiming "Lock down prevents herd immunity"


----------



## Supine (Apr 20, 2020)

S☼I said:


> Just a constant stream of non-sequiturs, word salad and stream of semi-consciousness



A generous review. He is so fucking shallow.


----------



## petee (Apr 20, 2020)

this guy was deblasio's republican opponent in 2013. (he got whomped.)



this is a blast from the past, when the republican party, in NYS at least, were, if elitist shits, at least sensible elitist shits. it's a long history, out of place here, but it takes me back ...


----------



## editor (Apr 20, 2020)

"Healthcare workers in scrubs and face masks stood in front of vehicles in counter-protest to the anti-lockdown rally in Denver, Colorado"

 











						US faced with protests amid pressure to reopen
					

Residents demand relaxation of infection prevention measures despite signs it is too soon to reopen.




					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Apr 20, 2020)

Letter in the New England Journal of Medicine on the difficulty of getting PPE, often with the Feds actively interfering:



			https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2010025


----------



## little_legs (Apr 20, 2020)

I don't know about you good people, but I think Trump is only Very Good at dealing with the Wuhan Virus, what about you?


----------



## MickiQ (Apr 20, 2020)

little_legs said:


> I don't know about you good people, but I think Trump is only Very Good at dealing with the Wuhan Virus, what about you?


For some reason I get the impression that is a somewhat biased poll


----------



## editor (Apr 20, 2020)

little_legs said:


> I don't know about you good people, but I think Trump is only Very Good at dealing with the Wuhan Virus, what about you?


That can't be real, can it?


----------



## IC3D (Apr 20, 2020)

At least they don't call it the Chinese virus. Um sort of.


----------



## 2hats (Apr 20, 2020)

IC3D said:


> At least they don't call it the Chinese virus. Um sort of.


Just hedging their bets in case they have to welcome new overlords.


----------



## Sue (Apr 20, 2020)

I'd be like 'what virus?' but that's just me.


----------



## JimW (Apr 20, 2020)

Predicated on target audience having a clue where Wuhan is.


----------



## elbows (Apr 20, 2020)

Maybe they are referring to the influenza strain from the mid 1990's called A/Wuhan/359/95(H3N2) that caused plenty of epidemic activity and an outbreak on a US Navy ship back then 

Outbreak of Influenza in Highly Vaccinated Crew of US ... - CDCwwwnc.cdc.gov › eid › article › pdfs


----------



## existentialist (Apr 20, 2020)

MickiQ said:


> For some reason I get the impression that is a somewhat biased poll


Typical liberal dem-sucker behaviour - you guys always see the WORST in our polls, and we have the best polls, the best. With all the best poll options. If you can't see that, you're fake noos.


----------



## little_legs (Apr 20, 2020)

Sue said:


> I'd be like 'what virus?' but that's just me.


Heh! I take it y'all have not met Karen who wanted to see China's manager?


----------



## petee (Apr 20, 2020)

editor said:


> That can't be real, can it?



for lou dobbs, it could be


----------



## little_legs (Apr 20, 2020)

it's real, editor was kidding


----------



## petee (Apr 20, 2020)

you knew it

_A trio of far-right, pro-gun provocateurs is behind some of the largest Facebook groups calling for anti-quarantine protests around the country, offering the latest illustration that some seemingly organic demonstrations are being engineered by a network of conservative activists. _



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/04/19/pro-gun-activists-using-facebook-groups-push-anti-quarantine-protests/


----------



## not-bono-ever (Apr 20, 2020)

know someone who works at NIH in DC- Fauci is their boss- They are utterly furious at the antics of POTUS- erosion of science not welcomed


----------



## petee (Apr 20, 2020)

you knew it



the best people


----------



## Raheem (Apr 20, 2020)

petee said:


> you knew it
> 
> 
> 
> the best people



Trump probably read that as "super" in the reference provided.


----------



## not-bono-ever (Apr 20, 2020)

Is america actively looking forr someone/ thing to demonise again ? its getting to be a tiresome habit that often ends in shit


----------



## editor (Apr 20, 2020)

Go USA! Freedom fries and all that!









						Kentucky reports highest coronavirus infection increase after a week of protests to reopen state
					

"We are still in the midst of this fight against a deadly and highly contagious virus," Kentucky Governor Andy Beshear said.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## petee (Apr 20, 2020)

editor said:


> Go USA! Freedom fries and all that!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



if bevan was still governor he'd blame the democrats or the chinese or say it was god's will so let's all just let it happen, or something.
that guy was a prize weed.


----------



## petee (Apr 20, 2020)

hahahaha









						End the Lockdown Rally? No one shows up -- except NYPD.
					

The protest -- for non-essential workers -- was planned for Sunday morning, according to fliers.




					www.silive.com


----------



## Anju (Apr 20, 2020)

I put this on the conspiracy thread but thought it should go here as well.

Anti vax/Gates/MSM rubbish plus support for the protests. 2.1 million followers on Twitter. I've seen articles about the majority of Americans being concerned about lockdown being lifted too soon so hopefully this sort of stuff isn't too damaging but the anti lockdown thing does seem to be growing. 

Candace Owens Is Dangerously Misinformed about Vaccines - Quillette


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 20, 2020)

I’m waiting for the British anti-lockdown rally, it’ll be amusingly pathetic as usual, handful of NatIonal Action types and a few teenage MAGA weirdos, taking their cues from actions in America because they haven’t got the wits and imagination to come up with an idea for their own protest.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 20, 2020)

petee said:


> hahahaha
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> "No mask needed. Bring your children. Non-essential workers. *If you’re sick still come, it’s your right!”* stated the fliers.



FFS!


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 20, 2020)




----------



## Lord Camomile (Apr 20, 2020)

S☼I said:


> Watching Trump. He's mad and stupid. He just talks and talks and none of it makes sense or is true, it's hilarious and alarming





S☼I said:


> Just a constant stream of non-sequiturs, word salad and stream of semi-consciousness


Leaving aside the real-world horrors it has resulted in, I am genuinely sort of fascinated by this. What are his supporters hearing that I'm not?

I understand in the cases of a single sentence that I may find insincere while they find it sincere, based on our biases going in. But when it's his incoherent string of ramblings, I honestly don't understand how they take that and think "yup, that's all good, that all makes sense, I'm happy this man knows what he's doing"  Or, perhaps, how they ignore it.

I really do want to sit down with some of his supporters and some tape of his mess and go line by line asking, "ok, so how does this sentence connect to this sentence? What has he said in the past 30 seconds, what was the substance, the point he was making? WHAT DOES THIS MEAN??".

Probably never will, though.


----------



## magneze (Apr 20, 2020)

What was the eventual peak ventilator situation in NY in terms of numbers? Was Cuomo correct, Kushner, neither, or something else?


----------



## Marty1 (Apr 20, 2020)

magneze said:


> What was the eventual peak ventilator situation in NY in terms of numbers? Was Cuomo correct, Kushner, neither, or something else?



According to Cuomo, everybody that needed a ventilator got one - nobody died from the virus due to any lack of vital medical equipment.


----------



## petee (Apr 20, 2020)

i'm safe then


----------



## krtek a houby (Apr 20, 2020)

With 40 thousand dead, someone is still congratulating themselves.

BBC News - Coronavirus: Reporter challenges Trump over Cuomo praise clip









						Reporter challenges Trump over Cuomo praise clip
					

The US president played a carefully chosen clip of an outspoken critic at his White House briefing.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## editor (Apr 20, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> With 40 thousand dead, someone is still congratulating themselves.
> 
> BBC News - Coronavirus: Reporter challenges Trump over Cuomo praise clip
> 
> ...


What a fucking shitehawk.


----------



## Ax^ (Apr 20, 2020)

sadly this is being made by (fox news and other related MSM outlets as an infringement of american first amendment rights*


it the vinegar days for most gun nuts, preppers and trump supporters


hopefully the second wave starts with them


tbf a large section will think Money will somehow protect them

the rise of this sense of complaint is a week or 2 from the united kingdom

why Boris is suddenly worried about an early end to the lockdown


----------



## two sheds (Apr 20, 2020)

Ax^ said:


> tbf a large section will think Money will somehow protect them



Gaaaaaaaaaad will protect them.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 21, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> Leaving aside the real-world horrors it has resulted in, I am genuinely sort of fascinated by this. What are his supporters hearing that I'm not?
> 
> I understand in the cases of a single sentence that I may find insincere while they find it sincere, based on our biases going in. But when it's his incoherent string of ramblings, I honestly don't understand how they take that and think "yup, that's all good, that all makes sense, I'm happy this man knows what he's doing"  Or, perhaps, how they ignore it.
> 
> ...




I was thinking about this earlier, trying to work out what’s going on with the way he talks.

When he’s talking I have this feeling of being simultaneously repulsed by the droning meaninglessness of it but also feeling somehow compelled by it. I think what’s going on is that because it doesn’t make sense it’s like waiting for the beat to drop; there’s enough syntax to keep me waiting for the sense to become apparent, but it doesn’t make sense so I keep listening to it. And because his delivery is smooth and measured and monotonous it has a kind of mesmeric almost  hypnotic effect that draws you in. And because it has no meaning it’s a blank canvas onto which people can just lay their own expectations.


----------



## petee (Apr 21, 2020)

good, patriotic americans



Spoiler: ohio, but could be anywhere






			https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EWFWFi9UEAAGoBw?format=jpg&name=small
		





just feel the aggrieved economic victimization that motivates trumpers


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 21, 2020)

People in Canada: "Look at those stupid Americans ignoring social distancing guidelines to protest lockdowns."

Also people in Canada: "Let's have a parade of emergency vehicles down one of Toronto's biggest streets to thank first responders. It's heartwarming how many people turned out to show their support."


----------



## sideboob (Apr 21, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Gaaaaaaaaaad will protect them.


The Jehovah`s haven`t been around since this whole thing started .  After a quick google I learned that they are no longer "witnessing" due to covid19.   You know shits gotten real when the jesus freaks have gone into hiding.


----------



## Tankus (Apr 21, 2020)

, "somebody mentioned" that these protests popped up, when "certain people " were made aware that CV19 adversely impacted "other people" who didn't look like them

"I wouldn't know"


----------



## two sheds (Apr 21, 2020)

sideboob said:


> The Jehovah`s haven`t been around since this whole thing started .  After a quick google I learned that they are no longer "witnessing" due to covid19.   You know shits gotten real when the jesus freaks have gone into hiding.



True, they'd have difficulty witnessing from across the other side of the street.


----------



## Roadkill (Apr 21, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> I’m waiting for the British anti-lockdown rally, it’ll be amusingly pathetic as usual, handful of NatIonal Action types and a few teenage MAGA weirdos, taking their cues from actions in America because they haven’t got the wits and imagination to come up with an idea for their own protest.



This.  It'll be as hilariously pathetic as those pitiful pro-Brexit demos and attempts to emulate the _Gilets Jaunes_.


----------



## Tankus (Apr 21, 2020)

interesting tweet  and replys  on republicans reopening states 



> Niles Edward Francis





> Georgia @GovKemp
> announces that the following businesses can reopen this Friday...
> Gyms
> Fitness centers
> ...





> He also says that restaurants and movie theaters will be allowed to reopen on Monday as long as they meet social distancing guidelines.





> Terra LeMay
> 
> This is not going to end well.  And as the owner of one of these types of businesses, this decision demolishes our ability to negotiate with our commercial landlord about easing the rent during the pandemic. He'll expect us to re-open on Friday and pay rent in full a week after.





> into Dust
> @IntoDust20
> Business owners will take on all of the liability (unsafe work environments, overhead costs, decreased demand for services) while banks still get a payday and politicians escape their responsibilities. This is what trickle down economics really is.





> One reason they are doing it is to be able to reject unemployment claims...”Who says you can’t go to work?”





> It also green lights gyms and movie theaters with subscription plans to begin collecting fees again whether customers will use them or not.





> under no circumstances should a business reopen if they cannot follow CDC guidelines for 'safe distancing' in their business. Your 'liability' insurance will not cover you.





> You need PPE to cut hair.





> Exactly! You’re open so pay your rent, pay your liability insurance, pay your payroll taxes, pay your utilities and yes, do it all while seeing marked drops in business because not all your customers are going to jump into the fray with you. But any leverage you had will be gone.


----------



## weltweit (Apr 21, 2020)

Perhaps these anti shutdown protests should be seen in the light of which state they are occurring in, and whether urban or rural situations. I don't think I have seen protests in NY, and NY has seen a massive death toll from this virus. Perhaps New Yorkers know the impact covid-19 has and therefore support lockdown out of an understanding of the severity and of self interest. 

I can imagine for Americans living in some of the vast less populated states the NY experience is not something they have had and thus they don't see why their lives and incomes should be so impacted as they are by a shutdown. And I also don't know the level of economic pressures there are on these people. Perhaps they don't have the support from government that workers in the UK have? 

I wondered if this was an evidence of lack of society, because it does seem healthy people saying we don't need your shutdown, while those that are ill languish in hospital or the morgue. But that can't be the case, America does have society but perhaps it is evidencing itself differently according to regional variations?


----------



## elbows (Apr 21, 2020)

Also consider how many protesters there are compare to non-protesters, and the lazy prism through which much of the world(journalists) tend to see the USA.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Apr 21, 2020)

Tankus said:


> interesting tweet  and replys  on republicans reopening states
> Niles Edward Francis (@NilesGApol) on Twitter



Some of its just good ol' payola.  There's a mall between Omaha and Lincoln that is set to open again.  Its owner paid Gov. Ricketts $100K on his re-election campaign.  But, I'm sure they're not at all related.


----------



## existentialist (Apr 21, 2020)

Roadkill said:


> This.  It'll be as hilariously pathetic as those pitiful pro-Brexit demos and attempts to emulate the _Gilets Jaunes_.


Fortunately, Urban will almost certainly have its own reporter, delivering breathless (if not deathless) prose direct from Mouthbreathing Central...


----------



## petee (Apr 21, 2020)

weltweit said:


> I don't think I have seen protests in NY, and NY has seen a massive death toll from this virus. Perhaps New Yorkers know the impact covid-19 has and therefore support lockdown out of an understanding of the severity and of self interest.





petee said:


> hahahaha
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Petcha (Apr 21, 2020)

Trump's pleased with his ratings...


----------



## Roadkill (Apr 21, 2020)

Petcha said:


> Trump's pleased with his ratings...




Oh my god...


----------



## Petcha (Apr 21, 2020)

Roadkill said:


> Oh my god...



Yep. He's out rating the Bachelor... Couldn't make it up


----------



## phillm (Apr 21, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I was thinking about this earlier, trying to work out what’s going on with the way he talks.
> 
> When he’s talking I have this feeling of being simultaneously repulsed by the droning meaninglessness of it but also feeling somehow compelled by it. I think what’s going on is that because it doesn’t make sense it’s like waiting for the beat to drop; there’s enough syntax to keep me waiting for the sense to become apparent, but it doesn’t make sense so I keep listening to it. And because his delivery is smooth and measured and monotonous it has a kind of mesmeric almost  hypnotic effect that draws you in. And because it has no meaning it’s a blank canvas onto which people can just lay their own expectations.


That's the best analysis of Trump I've ever read. He has some demonic X-Factor like most demagogues.


----------



## elbows (Apr 21, 2020)

I think the best analysis of him I ever heard is that he is like the villain in a movie where the hero is a dog.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 21, 2020)




----------



## BristolEcho (Apr 21, 2020)

Petcha said:


> Trump's pleased with his ratings...




White House news conferences watched by nation during a pandemic. Surprise.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 21, 2020)

Missouri sues Chinese Communist Party for ‘billions of dollars’ in coronavirus costs
					

Missouri filed a lawsuit Tuesday demanding China repay the state “billions of dollars” lost because of the coronavirus, saying the communist government was reckless in its handling of the disease.




					www.washingtontimes.com
				






> Missouri filed a lawsuit Tuesday demanding China repay the state “billions of dollars” lost because of the coronavirus, saying the communist government was reckless in its handling of the disease.
> 
> Attorney General Eric S. Schmitt said China hid details of the outbreak, hoarded medical supplies and may even have allowed the virus to escape from the Wuhan Institute of Virology — a possibility The Washington Times raised in January, and which has recently gained ground as the U.S. government investigates.
> 
> At the very least, the Chinese government and its ruling Communist Party should have known that research on such a dangerous virus was a recipe for disaster, given previous findings of safety concerns at the Wuhan lab, Mr. Schmitt argued.



While checking it out, I found a similar article from March of this year.









						$20 trillion lawsuit in US against China for using COVID-19 as biological weapon
					

Lawsuit says virus has been designed to mutate from person to person, spread rapidly




					www.theweek.in
				






> And now, American lawyer Larry Klayman has filed a $20 trillion lawsuit against China for the creation and the release of the novel coronavirus that has infected more than 334,000 people globally.
> 
> Klayman, who works for a Texas advocacy group Freedom Watch, and Buzz Photos filed the lawsuit from the US District Court for the Northern District of Texas. In the lawsuit, Klayman is alleging that the COVID-19 virus is a biological weapon designed by China. And by releasing it, China violated US law, international laws, treaties and norms.
> 
> The lawsuit also claims that the COVID-19 is an extremely dangerous disease because it has an extremely aggressive nature and was designed to mutate from person to person, spreading quickly.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 21, 2020)

Americans Are Poisoning Themselves in Their Rush to Fight Virus
					

Poisonings related to cleaners and disinfectants surged in the U.S. last month as the global pandemic spurred a haphazard rush to disinfect everything.




					www.bloomberg.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 21, 2020)

Barr Threatens Legal Action Against Governors Over Lockdowns
					

The Justice Department will consider taking legal action against governors who continue to impose stringent rules for dealing with the coronavirus that infringe on constitutional rights even after the crisis subsides in their states, Attorney General William Barr said.




					www.bloomberg.com
				






> The Justice Department will consider taking legal action against governors who continue to impose stringent rules for dealing with the coronavirus that infringe on constitutional rights even after the crisis subsides in their states, Attorney General William Barr said.
> 
> Blunt means to deal with the pandemic, such as stay-at-home orders and directives shutting down businesses, are justified up to a point, Barr said in an interview Tuesday on “The Hugh Hewitt Show.” Eventually, though, states should move to more targeted measures, Barr said. He cited the approach laid out by President Donald Trump.
> 
> ...


----------



## zahir (Apr 21, 2020)

> Many people have the impression that it’s too late for contact tracing. It’s useful for keeping an infection out of the country, they say, but it’s too hard once the disease is widespread. As veterans of previous campaigns against epidemics, we can say with certainty that this is a misperception. We agree that it is late, but countries that have succeeded in suppressing covid-19 have shown that contact tracing is effective even at the peak of an epidemic. In the fight against infection, you’re always late. Lateness just means that there’s no time to waste.











						It’s Not Too Late to Go on Offense Against the Coronavirus
					

To end the nightmare, lockdowns aren’t enough. We need to hunt the virus and defeat it.




					www.newyorker.com


----------



## editor (Apr 21, 2020)

Amen 



> Philosophically, I’m okay with right-wing agitators’ going out there and getting the coronavirus at a protest, if they want to. Maybe I’m a bad person, but I just don’t have the emotional energy to care about the latest wound Republicans have decided to self-inflict in their never-ending quest to “own the libs.”
> 
> But they must not be allowed to infect everybody else. My freedom to live is every bit as important as their freedom to die











						These People Aren’t Freedom Fighters—They’re Virus-Spreading Sociopaths
					

The “liberate America” protesters claim they just want to make their own choices about their health and safety, but they really want to force others to risk their lives.




					www.thenation.com


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2020)

A look into the universe of stupid: 




































"loosing," natch. 









						33 Signs From "Reopen" Protests Across The U.S. That Are 100% Real
					

"We demand haircuts."




					www.buzzfeed.com


----------



## Sue (Apr 22, 2020)

I like the 'Covid-19 or Covid-1984' one and who isn't demanding haircuts, eh?


----------



## Gimigimi (Apr 22, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Missouri sues Chinese Communist Party for ‘billions of dollars’ in coronavirus costs
> 
> 
> Missouri filed a lawsuit Tuesday demanding China repay the state “billions of dollars” lost because of the coronavirus, saying the communist government was reckless in its handling of the disease.
> ...


This is going to become the prevailing narrative about the pandemic in the US, if it hasn't already. Deflecting criticism of the government's handling of the crisis with "it's China's fault" is already standard procedure for tons of idiots - providing ammunition for that argument that is the purpose of these lawsuits. It allows the state to blame all its failings at responding to the virus on the active malfeasance of a foreign enemy. We couldn't possibly have secured or produced more equipment, because China bought it all. We couldn't have instituted more effective lockdown procedures, because the virus was bioengineered by China to sneak past all our defenses. Then China accidentally spread it across their own population, because the enemy is simultaneously too powerful and too weak. Never mind all the other countries that did a better job protecting their citizens, the virus wasn't designed for them.

Is it possible the virus was some Chinese bioweapon? Sure, and I'll consider it when evidence is produced by an organization that isn't a rival world power. Right now, though, I'm putting my money on this essentially being groundwork for Trump's 2020 campaign.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 22, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> Is it possible the virus was some Chinese bioweapon? Sure, and I'll consider it when evidence is produced by an organization that isn't a rival world power. Right now, though, I'm putting my money on this essentially being groundwork for Trump's 2020 campaign.



WHO says it was not manufactured in a lab.


----------



## pseudonarcissus (Apr 22, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> This is going to become the prevailing narrative about the pandemic in the US, if it hasn't already. Deflecting criticism of the government's handling of the crisis with "it's China's fault" is already standard procedure for tons of idiots - providing ammunition for that argument that is the purpose of these lawsuits. It allows the state to blame all its failings at responding to the virus on the active malfeasance of a foreign enemy. We couldn't possibly have secured or produced more equipment, because China bought it all. We couldn't have instituted more effective lockdown procedures, because the virus was bioengineered by China to sneak past all our defenses. Then China accidentally spread it across their own population, because the enemy is simultaneously too powerful and too weak. Never mind all the other countries that did a better job protecting their citizens, the virus wasn't designed for them.
> 
> Is it possible the virus was some Chinese bioweapon? Sure, and I'll consider it when evidence is produced by an organization that isn't a rival world power. Right now, though, I'm putting my money on this essentially being groundwork for Trump's 2020 campaign.


Só, viral pandemics have been top of the west’s risk registers for a decade. How come there wasn’t a doctor on the CIA’s or MI6’s payroll in every Chinese testing lab or major hospital? All those bloody satellites that should have been looking for grave digging. Maybe it was all the obsession with the “war on terror” and the “war on drugs”.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 22, 2020)

pseudonarcissus said:


> Só, viral pandemics have been top of the west’s risk registers for a decade. How come there wasn’t a doctor on the CIA’s or MI6’s payroll in every Chinese testing lab or major hospital? All those bloody satellites that should have been looking for grave digging. Maybe it was all the obsession with the “war on terror” and the “war on drugs”.




It would seem that America is always at war with something.


----------



## petee (Apr 22, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> While checking it out, I found a similar article from March of this year.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



ah yes, larry klayman

_Larry Klayman is a pathologically litigious attorney and professional gadfly notorious for suing everyone from Iran’s Supreme Leader to his own mother. He has spent years denouncing Barack Obama as a crypto-Communist Muslim, convening meaningless “citizens grand juries,” and railing against an endless list of enemies. _









						Larry Klayman
					






					www.splcenter.org
				




he really did sue his mother (this is from 1998, he's been with us awhile)









						Nut Watch
					

Everything you need to know about Larry Klayman can be gleaned from a press release he blast-faxed to the world two weeks ago. The heading read:




					slate.com


----------



## petee (Apr 22, 2020)

oh, and we had a hailstorm and tornado warnings here in NYC today.


----------



## weltweit (Apr 22, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> WHO says it was not manufactured in a lab.


The US bio researchers who looked at the DNA of the virus stated that its makeup is consistent with it having originated in horseshoe bats. They were looking at the detail to see if they could establish human intervention and they only found natural processes at work in the development of the virus. 

Oh WHO as in World Health Organisation !  I misread your post …


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 22, 2020)

25 years after Waco, there's a new death cult in Texas.









						Texas lt. governor on reopening state: 'There are more important things than living'
					

Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick (R) called for the reopening of his state and the country late Monday, saying there are "more important things than living.”




					thehill.com


----------



## ska invita (Apr 22, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> This is going to become the prevailing narrative about the pandemic in the US, if it hasn't already. Deflecting criticism of the government's handling of the crisis with "it's China's fault" is already standard procedure for tons of idiots - providing ammunition for that argument that is the purpose of these lawsuits. It allows the state to blame all its failings at responding to the virus on the active malfeasance of a foreign enemy. We couldn't possibly have secured or produced more equipment, because China bought it all. We couldn't have instituted more effective lockdown procedures, because the virus was bioengineered by China to sneak past all our defenses. Then China accidentally spread it across their own population, because the enemy is simultaneously too powerful and too weak. Never mind all the other countries that did a better job protecting their citizens, the virus wasn't designed for them.
> 
> Is it possible the virus was some Chinese bioweapon? Sure, and I'll consider it when evidence is produced by an organization that isn't a rival world power. Right now, though, I'm putting my money on this essentially being groundwork for Trump's 2020 campaign.




Sinophobia is on the rise for sure. I'm seeing signs of it here in the UK, and not just C19 related, trade and culture too.

Heard a friend go into a bit of a rant having seen some kind of article in the Times even,: not saying that it was a bioweapon, but something along the lines that because China failed the world is suffering. Some truth in that, but to make it an anti-Chinese issue rather than a degree of human failure is ideology.

Obviously Xi is a disgrace, and the ramping up of totalitarianism is horrific, but the attempt to create a culture war between Oceania and Eastasia has to be called out for the deflection that it is.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 22, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> 25 years after Waco, there's a new death cult in Texas.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Just checked, Texas hasn't had much of a problem, under 20 deaths per million, compared to New York on over 1000, so they may get away with it.

It'll be an interesting one to watch.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 22, 2020)

Houston Tx has some of the highest density living in the US and high levels of air pollution. Same with Dallas. And the poorest city in America is in Texas (Escobaras). They've also got a huge number of undocumented immigrants in Texas.

They have huge empty spaces in Texas too and widely spaced suburbs and lots of rich white people, so they’ll be more chushioned but Texas won’t dodge COVID.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 22, 2020)

Native Americans face a potential firestorm with the virus.



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2020/04/04/native-american-coronavirus/
		



ETA
Some of them took an independent proactive approach early on.








						Native American tribe takes trailblazing steps to fight Covid-19 outbreak
					

Lummi nation will open a pioneering field hospital to treat patients in wave of strong public health measures




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Apr 22, 2020)

ska invita said:


> Sinophobia is on the rise for sure. I'm seeing signs of it here in the UK, and not just C19 related, trade and culture too.
> 
> Heard a friend go into a bit of a rant having seen some kind of article in the Times even,: not saying that it was a bioweapon, but something along the lines that because China failed the world is suffering. Some truth in that, but to make it an anti-Chinese issue rather than a degree of human failure is ideology.
> 
> Obviously Xi is a disgrace, and the ramping up of totalitarianism is horrific, but the attempt to create a culture war between Oceania and Eastasia has to be called out for the deflection that it is.



It's also factually highly doubtful. Yes, China initially sought to hide and cover up the outbreak, but they changed tack quickly, and by January China was being pretty free and open about its information about the virus - what it is, what they know about its transmission, its genetic sequence, etc. As this WHO timeline shows, China was already inviting the world in to help study it by the end of January.

It's not China's fault that the foolish leaders of countries like the UK and the US ignored this information and basically did nothing for about six weeks. The narrative that 'China failed the world' doesn't really hold up.


----------



## The39thStep (Apr 22, 2020)

There's more important things than living


----------



## maomao (Apr 22, 2020)

Are the US death figures just hospital confirmed deaths like over here? They've just hit 45000 officially dead. If that figure is as innacurate as the FT say the UK figure is they could be up to a hundred thousand dead.


----------



## hegley (Apr 22, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> Houston Tx has some of the highest density living in the US and high levels of air pollution. Same with Dallas. And the poorest city in America is in Texas (Escobaras). They've also got a huge number of undocumented immigrants in Texas.
> 
> They have huge empty spaces in Texas too and widely spaced suburbs and lots of rich white people, so they’ll be more chushioned but Texas won’t dodge COVID.


And some of the highest levels of obesity in the US, one of the highest risk factors for C19.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 22, 2020)

hegley said:


> And some of the highest levels of obesity in the US, one of the highest risk factors for C19.




And high levels of associated diabetes, cardiovascular issues etc.


----------



## ska invita (Apr 22, 2020)

total speculation, but outside of New York my impressions is US cities dont really have much public transport - in places like Texas its very car centric. Probably makes a difference in terms of rate of spread


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 22, 2020)

ska invita said:


> total speculation, but outside of New York my impressions is US cities dont really have much public transport - in places like Texas its very car centric. Probably makes a difference in terms of rate of spread



That’s true outside cities. But in my experience, people outside cities also visit each others’ homes, eat out a lot, go shopping etc, they don’t just stay home. Even people on low incomes will eat out weekly, food is pretty cheap in fast food places. They don’t have a pub and club culture like we do here but they do socialise, they go to the mall, the ball game, cook outs, school related social events.


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2020)




----------



## weltweit (Apr 22, 2020)

editor said:


> View attachment 208189


in fucking credible !


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 22, 2020)

I've been saying for a few weeks now that this is really exposing the arseholes.


----------



## yield (Apr 22, 2020)

From last week
These Photos Show the Staggering Food Bank Lines Across America
April 13, 2020


> Food banks across the United States are struggling amid droves of hungry Americans in need of a meal. And images from photographers around the country show the horrifying number of Americans lining up to receive food assistance.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 22, 2020)

America, the richest fucking country in the world, is so screwed-up.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 22, 2020)

...and the  US banks keep raking in the money









						Report: Banks earned more than $10 billion in fees processing small-business loans
					

Banks that processed the small-business loans allocated by Congress in the $2.2 trillion stimulus bill made $10 billion in fees, according to financial records obtained by NPR.The fees were earned …




					thehill.com


----------



## petee (Apr 22, 2020)




----------



## magneze (Apr 22, 2020)

petee said:


>



... and wearing a face mask whilst doing it 🤔


----------



## yield (Apr 22, 2020)

magneze said:


> ... and wearing a face mask whilst doing it 🤔


Has to be a troll?


----------



## Petcha (Apr 22, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I've been saying for a few weeks now that this is really exposing the arseholes.



I've lost a couple of my best friends (not in the US I should add) for basically suggesting this is a cull of elderly and disabled people who were waiting for death anyway. Utterly fucking disgusted. Nicely financially positioned people. One of them just bought their second home and hey, the value must have plummeted, shame...

When I pointed out he nursed his elderly father to his death through cancer last year he got very very fucked off.

Gone motherfucker. Masks are slipping.


----------



## editor (Apr 22, 2020)




----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Apr 22, 2020)

Chap on the protest in Virginia wants shops reopened, had a large badge and baseball cap each bearing the words of Buddha, “Guns save lives”


----------



## The39thStep (Apr 22, 2020)




----------



## Supine (Apr 23, 2020)

No comment...


----------



## weltweit (Apr 23, 2020)

So the Las Vegas Mayor says Casino's want to roll the dice ..


----------



## Mattym (Apr 23, 2020)

editor said:


>




Where's that bottle of brain sanitiser gone?


----------



## editor (Apr 23, 2020)

Watch out athetits!


----------



## yield (Apr 23, 2020)

Bernie Sanders: The Foundations of American Society Are Failing Us
April 19, 2020
The unequal impact of the pandemic and economic collapse are forcing us to rethink the assumptions of our system.


> We are the richest country in the history of the world, but at a time of massive income and wealth inequality, that reality means little to half of our people who live paycheck to paycheck, the 40 million living in poverty, the 87 million who are uninsured or underinsured, and the half million who are homeless.
> 
> In the midst of the twin crises that we face — the coronavirus pandemic and the meltdown of our economy — it’s imperative that we re-examine some of the foundations of American society, understand why they are failing us, and fight for a fairer and more just nation.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 23, 2020)




----------



## petee (Apr 23, 2020)

yield said:


> Has to be a troll?



i wondered too, but what's that internet law where you can't tell a rightwing troll from a real rightwinger?


----------



## gentlegreen (Apr 23, 2020)

Supine said:


> No comment...



That sort of thing is so much seen as political suicide, our PM has been hiding most of the time for less ...


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 23, 2020)

I can't help feeling that some of these loons will start using their guns soon.


----------



## High Voltage (Apr 23, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> I can't help feeling that some of these loons will start using their guns soon.



The Boogaloo, matey, The Boogaloo


----------



## petee (Apr 23, 2020)

o gee whoopsie









						Trump says he told Kemp: ‘I totally disagree’ with move to reopen Georgia
					

The governor’s decision drew a backlash from critics who pointed to indicators that the state’s number of new cases was still on an upward trajectory.




					www.politico.com
				




but wait 



management techniqes: be totally unpredictable so that you keep the momentum in your hands


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 23, 2020)

Can people stop posting those facebook videos or whatever they are that don’t fucking work? It’s really annoying.


----------



## two sheds (Apr 23, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> Can people stop posting those facebook videos or whatever they are that don’t fucking work? It’s really annoying.



Yes I keep getting them I thought it was me  

Some work some don't and I don't know what the difference is. spring-peeper 's for example didn't. I'm assuming it's because of my ad-blocking and cookie-blocking software.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 23, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Yes I keep getting them I thought it was me
> 
> Some work some don't and I don't know what the difference is. spring-peeper 's for example didn't. I'm assuming it's because of my ad-blocking and cookie-blocking software.




Nope, it's not just you.

I refreshed the page, and saw my post alter.

It got a couple of likes before it disappeared.

Weird.


----------



## Ax^ (Apr 23, 2020)

think it if you not logged into Shitebook that you cannot see them


----------



## two sheds (Apr 23, 2020)

ahhhh that could be it then. Cos I'm not and can't and won't.


----------



## Tankus (Apr 23, 2020)

petee said:


> o gee whoopsie
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Do you think Kemp is too .....eeerrr.... _challenged_ .... to even have recorded his conversations with Rrump ?:


----------



## Supine (Apr 23, 2020)

Wow. Trump is actively fucking up the US covid response.









						Ex-BARDA chief decries science taking back seat to politics, demands investigation into Trump administration
					

Ex-BARDA chief Rick Bright has launched an astonishing attack against “politics and cronyism” days after being kicked out of the agency leading the government’s push for a COVID-19 vaccine.




					www.fiercebiotech.com


----------



## editor (Apr 23, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


>



That is really fucking shocking.


----------



## editor (Apr 24, 2020)

Inject disinfectant!   











						Trump Wants To Inject People With Bleach To Kill Coronavirus
					

After a presentation on the effectiveness of bleach and rubbing alcohol on killing coronavirus, Trump asked if people could be injected with disinfectant.




					www.politicususa.com


----------



## toblerone3 (Apr 24, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


>




What the fuck is going on here?


----------



## Petcha (Apr 24, 2020)

editor said:


> Inject disinfectant!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Actual massive lol. Black mirror can fuck right off. I've got the real world. It's far, far more surreal.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Apr 24, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> I can't help feeling that some of these loons will start using their guns soon.




Somewhere way back at the start of all this I said something like "America is going to be a shit show.... and they've got guns." 

It's going to get really ugly, I fear.


----------



## Epona (Apr 24, 2020)

editor said:


> Inject disinfectant!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It's stuff like this that contributes to my uncertainty about the difference between satire and serious, there doesn't seem to be much room for actual satire these days because reality is getting in there first with the shock comedy option


----------



## BristolEcho (Apr 24, 2020)

Epona said:


> It's stuff like this that contributes to my uncertainty about the difference between satire and serious, there doesn't seem to be much room for actual satire these days because reality is getting in there first with the shock comedy option



I know it's really difficult because it's utterly hillariours, but at the same time it's really not.


----------



## tim (Apr 24, 2020)

magneze said:


> ... and wearing a face mask whilst doing it 🤔



Agent provocateur?


----------



## petee (Apr 24, 2020)

tim said:


> Agent provocateur?



when all this passes, rightwingers will, dollars to donuts, use that line.
"liberal false flag"


----------



## petee (Apr 24, 2020)

meanwhile, in wisconsin ...


----------



## Dogsauce (Apr 24, 2020)

Ax^ said:


> think it if you not logged into Shitebook that you cannot see them



I’m logged into shitebook. I can see the posts but the videos just briefly glitch to another image when I tap them, don’t play. On safari/iPad. Not sure we’ve had this type of content imbedded on here until recently. Twitter/youtoob stuff plays fine.

(apologies for tangent but it’s annoying!)


----------



## two sheds (Apr 24, 2020)

For this one: 



spring-peeper said:


>




I get "Cannot load Facebook SDK. Disable any adblocker or tracking protection and try again." 

But other facebook posts do display ok once I click them even though it says disable the adblocker, and then it says the link failed so I click that and it works. These ones there's no way it will display.

I've noted before though that I've go so many ad blockers and tracker blockers that I'm surprised anything plays.


----------



## NoXion (Apr 24, 2020)

Got my browser pretty locked down, so I don't see any of the Facebook posts. Just an SDK error. Got the Twitter stuff blocked too, but there's still a link I can click if I have any need to see what it is. Maybe we need a new board rule or an alteration to the board software that requires people post an ordinary link when sharing such Facebook posts?


----------



## yield (Apr 24, 2020)

Transcript - US coronavirus 'bailout' scam is $6 trillion giveaway to Wall St - Economist Michael Hudson explains | Moderate Rebels
					

Facing the Covid-19 pandemic, the US Congress rammed through the CARES Act — which economist Michael Hudson explains is not a "bailout" but a massive, $6 trillion giveaway to Wall Street, banks, large corporations, and stockholders. Max Blumenthal and Ben Norton discuss the enormous financial...




					moderaterebels.com
				



21 April 2020


> MICHAEL HUDSON: Just think of when, in the debates with Bernie, Sanders during the spring, you had Biden, and Klobuchar keep saying, ‘What we’re paying for Medicare-for-All will be $1 trillion over 10 years.’ Well here the Fed can create $1.5 trillion in one week just to buy stocks.
> 
> Why is it okay for the Fed to create $1.5 trillion to buy stocks to prevent rich people from losing on their stocks, when it’s not okay to print only $1 trillion to pay for free Medicare for the entire population? This is crazy!





> The idea that only the rich should be allowed to print money for themselves, but the government should not be allowed to print money for any public purpose, any social purpose — not for medicine, not for schools, not for personal budgets, not for full employment — but only to give to the 1 percent. People hesitate to think that.
> 
> They think, ‘It can’t possibly be this bad.’ But those of us who have worked on Wall Street, for 50, 60 years in my case, that’s what the numbers show.
> 
> And that’s why you don’t have the media talking about actual numbers. They talk about, you know, just words, and they use euphemisms, and it’s the kind of Orwellian vocabulary, describing an inside-out world that they’re talking about.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 24, 2020)

'Deliberately Cruel': Millions of US Citizens Blocked From Stimulus Payments Because They Married Immigrants
					

"We're flat broke. We don't know what's gonna happen."




					www.commondreams.org
				






> The block means that not only will the adult in the mixed status home not be eligible for their $1,200 check but the household itself will also not receive a $500 per child payment that was part of the CARES Act, bringing further economic woes to taxpayers as the economic fallout of the coronavirus pandemic continues.


----------



## little_legs (Apr 24, 2020)




----------



## ruffneck23 (Apr 24, 2020)

America's Bible Belt played down the pandemic and even cashed in. Now dozens of pastors are dead
					

Right to worship emerges as battleground in looming culture war as many congregations hit hard by coronavirus




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## two sheds (Apr 24, 2020)

Just came in to post that as "surprise news of the day"


----------



## weltweit (Apr 25, 2020)

I don't expect many to consider science over religion in future, sorry to say ..


----------



## two sheds (Apr 25, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Just came in to post that as "surprise news of the day"



However  



> As many as 30 church leaders from the nation's largest African American Pentecostal denomination have now been confirmed to have died in the outbreak


----------



## gentlegreen (Apr 25, 2020)

It turns out Trump did get his bleach idea from MMS nuts.









						Revealed: leader of group peddling bleach as coronavirus 'cure' wrote to Trump this week
					

Mark Grenon wrote to Trump saying chlorine dioxide ‘can rid the body of Covid-19’ days before the president promoted disinfectant as treatment




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Apr 25, 2020)

I am amazed it's still legal to sell 'Miracle Mineral Supplement', the idea of drinking or injecting chlorine dioxide leaves me befuddled.


----------



## existentialist (Apr 25, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> I am amazed it's still legal to sell 'Miracle Mineral Supplement', the idea of drinking or injecting chlorine dioxide leaves me befuddled.


Freedom, innit. Freedom to poison yourself or infect someone with the 'rona


----------



## High Voltage (Apr 25, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> I am amazed it's still legal to sell 'Miracle Mineral Supplement', the idea of drinking or injecting chlorine dioxide leaves me befuddled.



I'm amazed, given the highly litigious nature of North Americans, that anyone selling MMS as a solution, isn't sued within an inch of their lives


----------



## two sheds (Apr 25, 2020)

High Voltage said:


> I'm amazed, given the highly litigious nature of North Americans, that anyone selling MMS as a solution, isn't sued within an inch of their lives



Unless the people suing them are already dead


----------



## frogwoman (Apr 25, 2020)

The MMS nuts are real scum.


----------



## rekil (Apr 25, 2020)

yield said:


> Transcript - US coronavirus 'bailout' scam is $6 trillion giveaway to Wall St - Economist Michael Hudson explains | Moderate Rebels
> 
> 
> Facing the Covid-19 pandemic, the US Congress rammed through the CARES Act — which economist Michael Hudson explains is not a "bailout" but a massive, $6 trillion giveaway to Wall Street, banks, large corporations, and stockholders. Max Blumenthal and Ben Norton discuss the enormous financial...
> ...


Blumenthal and Norton's site. They had that Pepe Escobar freak on to gibber about bill gates and US bioweapon conspiraloonery. Ugh.


----------



## yield (Apr 25, 2020)

rekil said:


> Blumenthal and Norton's site. They had that Pepe Escobar freak on to gibber about bill gates and US bioweapon conspiraloonery. Ugh.


Yeah sorry it's a shit site rekil ! But Michael Hudson is great and doesn't get the recognition he deserves.

e2a Verso made a huge mistake doing that Blumenthal book


----------



## petee (Apr 25, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> I am amazed it's still legal to sell 'Miracle Mineral Supplement', the idea of drinking or injecting chlorine dioxide leaves me befuddled.



this is still up, somehow









						Danger: Don’t Drink Miracle Mineral Solution or Similar Products
					

The FDA warns you not to drink sodium chlorite products such as  Miracle Mineral Solution. These products can make you sick.




					www.fda.gov


----------



## Tankus (Apr 25, 2020)

Georgia , as of  Friday the state has had 22,147 known cases, with 892 deaths   ,It'll interesting  to revisit these numbers in 3 weeks ...

let the experiment  begin


----------



## petee (Apr 25, 2020)

interesting report from GA

"Some companies will undoubtedly heed Kemp’s guidance in the coming days and gradually return to work. But _The Dispatch_ reached out to nearly 20 small businesses in Georgia touched by the governor’s new plan. Not one told us they were reopening this week.

...

Shamrock Bowling Center in Dublin—a town of about 15,000 in the center of the state—posted on its Facebook page that it was staying closed for now. Michelle Roland—who manages the lanes with her stepdad—assumed the regulars would be furious.

“When I put that thing out, I was scared of the backlash that we would get from the people that are like, ‘Oh, y’all are just being crazy, this virus isn’t a big deal,’” she admitted. “But I did not receive one message like that. I couldn’t believe the overwhelming positivity we got.”

“Very wise decision. Your community can see you care,” one read."

warning, neocon website, but the reporting here is good.









						Some Georgia Businesses Can Reopen. But Will They?
					

As Atlanta's mayor speaks out against the governor's plan, some business owners will stay closed out of caution and other concerns.




					thedispatch.com


----------



## NoXion (Apr 26, 2020)

Nice to see that a significant proportion of Georgia citizens aren't lethally addicted to American Freedumb: Virus Edition.


----------



## yield (Apr 26, 2020)

With Millions Unable to Pay for Housing Next Month, Organizers Plan the Largest Rent Strike in Nearly a Century
April 25 2020


> Want a grim picture of the state of American dissent during the coronavirus pandemic? Take an overview of media coverage from the last week. The press focused disproportionate attention on a few hundred white reactionaries, in a small number of states, rallying against social distancing measures — buoyed, of course, by tweets from President Donald Trump. Meanwhile, some of the most radical and righteous acts of mass resistance this country has seen in decades — from a wave of labor strikes to an explosion of mutual aid networks — are earning but a fraction of the media focus accorded to fringe, right-wing protesters.





> Based on mainstream news coverage alone, for instance, you’d likely never know that organizers and tenants in New York are preparing the largest coordinated rent strike in nearly a century, to begin on May 1.
> 
> At least 400 families who live in buildings each containing over 1,500 rent units are coordinating building-wide rent strikes, according to Cea Weaver, campaign coordinator for Housing Justice For All, a New York-based coalition of tenants and housing activists. Additionally, over 5,000 people have committed, through an online pledge, to refuse to pay rent in May.


----------



## JimW (Apr 27, 2020)




----------



## High Voltage (Apr 28, 2020)

The "knock on" effect of Trump's disinfectant injection "sarcasm"









						Conservative radio host agrees with caller that vaping bleach might cure COVID-19: ‘You’re not crazy’
					

A talk radio caller suggested vaping bleach as a possible treatment for coronavirus, and conservative host Jeff Kuhner assured him the recommendation wasn’t crazy. The caller, who identified himself as Zack from Stoughton, called into Boston’s WRKO-AM on Friday morning to talk about President...




					www.rawstory.com


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Apr 28, 2020)

JimW said:


>



I told some of the people in favor of going back to normal that I'd believe the pandemic was over when Rep. Fortenberry lied to my face about healthcare and shook my hand in person at one of his "townhall meetings".   Then, I'd believe that things were going back to normal.


----------



## yield (Apr 28, 2020)

The Secret Group of Scientists and Billionaires Pushing a Manhattan Project for Covid-19
WSJ. April 27, 2020


> A dozen of America’s top scientists and a collection of billionaires and industry titans say they have the answer to the coronavirus pandemic, and they found a backdoor to deliver their plan to the White House.


...


> These scientists and their backers describe their work as a lockdown-era Manhattan Project, a nod to the World War II group of scientists who helped develop the atomic bomb. This time around, the scientists are marshaling brains and money to distill unorthodox ideas gleaned from around the globe.
> 
> They call themselves Scientists to Stop Covid-19, and they include chemical biologists, an immunobiologist, a neurobiologist, a chronobiologist, an oncologist, a gastroenterologist, an epidemiologist and a nuclear scientist. Of the scientists at the center of the project, biologist Michael Rosbash, a 2017 Nobel Prize winner, said, “There’s no question that I’m the least qualified.”
> 
> This group, whose work hasn’t been previously reported, has acted as the go-between for pharmaceutical companies looking for a reputable link to Trump administration decision makers. They are working remotely as an ad hoc review board for the flood of research on the coronavirus, weeding out flawed studies before they reach policy makers.


Not sure what to make of this? Trying to think which science fiction novel this reminds me of.


----------



## spring-peeper (Apr 28, 2020)

__





						HuffPost is now a part of Verizon Media
					






					www.huffingtonpost.ca
				






> Five million face masks ordered by the Veterans Health Administration to protect staff at the department’s hospitals and clinics were taken by the Federal Emergency Management Agency for the Strategic National Stockpile, a top official told The Washington Post.
> 
> “I had 5 million masks incoming that disappeared,” said Dr. Richard Stone, the executive in charge of managing the nation’s largest health care system with 1,255 facilities that serve more than 9 million veterans. He told the Post that FEMA instructed vendors with protective equipment ordered by the Veterans Administration to send the shipments instead to the stockpile.





> Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer — a Democrat who President Donald Trump has frequently targeted because of what he calls her “complaints” — revealed last month that vendors with whom her state had contracted for desperately needed medical equipment were told “not to send stuff,” on orders from the Trump administration.
> 
> Several hospitals in seven states surveyed by the Los Angeles Times complained that FEMA officials were showing up unannounced and seizing their supplies, leaving them desperately short and uncertain about where to turn for more equipment.





> Trump has ordered states to get their own supplies, but once the supplies are in the pipeline, they’re often seized by the federal government.
> 
> Trump’s son-in-law, senior White House adviser Jared Kushner announced at a coronavirus press briefing early this month that the emergency stores were “our” stockpile — and not the states’. The website for the stockpile, however, pointedly said supplies were for the states. The site was quickly changed after Kushner spoke to conform with what he said.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 28, 2020)

Not a reliable source but karma if true


----------



## two sheds (Apr 28, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Not a reliable source but karma if true
> 
> View attachment 209540



she'll have infected a few others then if that's true


----------



## frogwoman (Apr 28, 2020)

I saw a post on fb saying that covid had so far killed 0.1 percent of the population of new york? Is there any truth to this?


----------



## frogwoman (Apr 28, 2020)

elbows is this true? Seems pretty horrifying if so


----------



## elbows (Apr 28, 2020)

Which bit is surprising? I've not checked the population stats, but nothing leaps out at me as weird or surprising about those numbers. And I dont go in for the comparisons with average flu seasons, and if I did it wouldnt be the same as the stupid comparisons from people who wanted to downplay this virus, because I always take normal influenza more seriously than those dangerous idiots. I do sometimes find reason to compare stats from this pandemic with bad flu pandemic or epidemic historical mortality data, mostly just to put things in a historical perspective, but its still early days for that stuff too.

As for their final comment about a second wave, I take things one week at a time, I dont have predictions and the picture of virus spread, lockdowns and human behaviour in most places is complicated. I dont know how much wiggle room people in different places really have, or what else might affect the evolution of the pandemic in the coming weeks and months. I wont assume anything about seconds spikes, peaks and waves, I will just watch data for signs.


----------



## frogwoman (Apr 28, 2020)

elbows said:


> Which bit is surprising? I've not checked the population stats, but nothing leaps out at me as weird or surprising about those numbers. And I dont go in for the comparisons with average flu seasons, and if I did it wouldnt be the same as the stupid comparisons from people who wanted to downplay this virus, because I always take normal influenza more seriously than those dangerous idiots. I do sometimes find reason to compare stats from this pandemic with bad flu pandemic or epidemic historical mortality data, mostly just to put things in a historical perspective, but its still early days for that stuff too.
> 
> As for their final comment about a second wave, I take things one week at a time, I dont have predictions and the picture of virus spread, lockdowns and human behaviour in most places is complicated. I dont know how much wiggle room people in different places really have, or what else might affect the evolution of the pandemic in the coming weeks and months. I wont assume anything about seconds spikes, peaks and waves, I will just watch data for signs.


The bit about 0.15% of the population (not just the case fatality ratio) dying when I'm guessing most people haven't even had it yet?


----------



## elbows (Apr 28, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> The bit about 0.15% of the population (not just the case fatality ratio) dying when I'm guessing most people haven't even had it yet?



Well I dont normally think of deaths in that way, so anything I say in this specific context has not been terribly well considered yet, but I will leap in anyway.

New York had a bad epidemic, which I havent looked at properly yet. So its not a surprise to see the toll it took, despite the lockdown measures. The fact that so much death can stem from the initial part of a wave of this virus is the entire reason why the developed world ended up doing various forms of lockdown in the first place. Otherwise many countries would have stuck with plan a, which is mostly to let it happen. This is where I can bring up flu, because normally quite a large amount of death is tolerated over the course of a flu season without any special attention from society as a whole. Is there are big collective memory in the UK about the high number of flu deaths at the turn of the century, including the very time people were celebrating 'the new millenium'?

Whether the amount of death from Covid-19 so far has gone far beyond that possible from influenza, depends which influenza season, epidemic or pandemic we are using for the numbers. I have not looked at any historic data for New York, but in the UK it is still possible to find flu pandemics or epidemics of the 2nd half of the 20th century with somewhat comparable mortality figures to this Covid-19 pandemic. But that is judging numbers from this pandemic with all the lockdowns, social distancing etc that came in at a certain point and presumably made a large difference to the epidemic. We are left to imagine what would have happened if such things had not happened, what levels of death might be experienced. But we dont actually know for sure how much of the population of the big cities with big outbreaks would have been affected if everyone there had somehow carried on regardless. Nobody was willing to find that out, and who can blame them! And the countries that are more likely to have done much less in some ways, tend to be those who are also poorly equipped to test, to record and report the deaths, to admit all those who need it to hospital, and they may also have much younger populations (because people die young for other reasons) that would be expected to have less morbidity from this virus in the first place. So I dont know if we will ever really find out, perhaps there will be clues in spite of the lockdowns, eg during periods subsequent to some relaxation of lockdowns, or through some particular piece of scientific knowledge gained about the virus and its epidemics in humans.

Of course there is the question of what proportion of the population have already had the virus. Its still early days for serology studies into this, but there are some initial indicators (though I have no idea how accurate they are, they could be off by quite a bit).

eg:



> NEW YORK – With initial results from serology testing indicating that upwards of 14 percent of New York residents have been exposed to SARS-CoV-2, the state continues to expand its serology survey as it works to establish the scope of the virus's spread.
> 
> The New York effort is one of a number of similar projects reporting results as researchers around the country and globe turn to antibody testing to assess the prevalence of infection.
> 
> Thus far, these efforts have found wide variations in prevalence depending on location, with, for instance, *the New York State survey finding a 21.2 percent positive rate for New York City residents*, while a survey of 3,330 peoplein Santa Clara County, California, estimated a population prevalence of between 2.5 percent and 4.2 percent.











						New York, California Serology Studies Give Early Estimates of COVID-19 Prevalence
					

The studies indicate that true infection numbers greatly exceed confirmed case counts, but questions remain about test performance and sampling biases.




					www.360dx.com


----------



## Saul Goodman (Apr 28, 2020)

little_legs said:


>


----------



## Cid (Apr 28, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> The bit about 0.15% of the population (not just the case fatality ratio) dying when I'm guessing most people haven't even had it yet?



NYC has so far had around 12,500 deaths. It has a population of 8.4 million, so yes, about 0.15%. That does depend somewhat on how you define the city... But even if you take New York State as a whole it's 0.12%.

Framing it like that really brings it home tbh. 

e2a: there's some difference between worldometers and that google graph I linked above. Used the google one for NYC, worldometers for NY state.


----------



## Cid (Apr 28, 2020)

elbows said:


> Well I dont normally think of deaths in that way, so anything I say in this specific context has not been terribly well considered yet, but I will leap in anyway.
> 
> New York had a bad epidemic, which I havent looked at properly yet. So its not a surprise to see the toll it took, despite the lockdown measures. The fact that so much death can stem from the initial part of a wave of this virus is the entire reason why the developed world ended up doing various forms of lockdown in the first place. Otherwise many countries would have stuck with plan a, which is mostly to let it happen. This is where I can bring up flu, because normally quite a large amount of death is tolerated over the course of a flu season without any special attention from society as a whole. Is there are big collective memory in the UK about the high number of flu deaths at the turn of the century, including the very time people were celebrating 'the new millenium'?
> 
> ...



Worth having a look at this Ars Technica article covering some of the criticism of the Californian studies. The New York one is also based on antibody tests, though its sampling (random selection of supermarket shoppers) may be rather better (though that's quite a large 'may be').


----------



## Marty1 (Apr 28, 2020)

Looks like Trumps remarks regarding getting UV light into the body is based on this technology that started development in 2016.









						Opinion | An Experimental Ultraviolet Light Treatment for Covid-19 Takes Political Heat
					

Trump’s musings prompt social-media censorship of information about an experimental treatment.




					www.wsj.com


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 28, 2020)

Yeah, I'm sure Trump spent the hours before the coronavirus briefing diligently going through that week's press releases from biotech companies instead of watching Fox News, picking his nose and his ears, and rooting through a bucket of KFC like a truffle-seeking pig.


----------



## Marty1 (Apr 28, 2020)

Two doctors in Bakersfield cause controversy after stating publicly that the lockdown should end!



> Their message: COVID-19 is more ubiquitous and less deadly than we think. It's similar to influenza and we should therefore reopen society and stop treating the situation like the lethal menace it was initially thought to be.
> 
> "Two months ago we didn't know this so I'm bringing it to light now," Erickson said Wednesday at a news conference held at his Coffee Road urgent care.











						Two Bakersfield doctors cite their testing data to urge reopening
					

Before COVID-19 was even detected in the United States, Dan Erickson, a former emergency room physician who now co-owns Accelerated Urgent Care in Bakersfield, bought as many tests for the




					www.bakersfield.com


----------



## Cid (Apr 28, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Looks like Trumps remarks regarding getting UV light into the body is based on this technology that started development in 2016.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I'm surprised you have a subscription to the WSJ marty.


----------



## Cid (Apr 28, 2020)

The WSJ is a shit tunnel of anti-regulation, ultra capitalist wankery incidentally.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Apr 28, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Looks like Trumps remarks regarding getting UV light into the body is based on this technology that started development in 2016.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I believe his thinkings are based on the time he forcibly inserted a floursecent tube into his rectum.


----------



## existentialist (Apr 28, 2020)

Saul Goodman said:


> I believe his thinkings are based on the time he inserted a floursecent tube into his rectum.


I could do with a flourescent tube. Wholemeal, preferably.


----------



## Raheem (Apr 28, 2020)

Cid said:


> The WSJ is a shit tunnel of anti-regulation, ultra capitalist wankery incidentally.


Possibly not entirely incidentally in this case.


----------



## elbows (Apr 28, 2020)

Saul Goodman said:


> I believe his thinkings are based on the time he forcibly inserted a floursecent tube into his rectum.



"People think my skin tone is fake, but its actually the result of a technique I developed where you tan yourself from the inside out. There are still some side-effects that need to be ironed out, but the results are very very promising, huge ratings, could be a whole new industry. We've also got people looking at whether, once we've drained the swamp, the resulting liquids can be used as enemas. Anything thats 'almost a cleaning' is worth investigating, I'll get some people on it right away. This virus can really do a number on the rectum, so I say take matters into your own hands and do your own number on your rectum first. As long as the number doesnt overshadow my ratings numbers. The mainspleen media is so unfair to me, they give me a hard time over these innovations yet they said nothing when Pelosi promoted Goatse as a solution to this pandemic. She stole my ideas anyway, Make America Gape Again"


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Apr 28, 2020)

Cid said:


> I'm surprised you have a subscription to the WSJ marty.


Meanwhile the other thing marty linked to can't be opened in the EU. 

Hmmm. Marty marty marty. You are the dishonest little trollcunt, aren't you?


----------



## two sheds (Apr 28, 2020)

elbows said:


> "People think my skin tone is fake, but its actually the result of a technique I developed where you tan yourself from the inside out. There are still some side-effects that need to be ironed out, but the results are very very promising, huge ratings, could be a whole new industry. We've also got people looking at whether, once we've drained the swamp, the resulting liquids can be used as enemas. Anything thats 'almost a cleaning' is worth investigating, I'll get some people on it right away. This virus can really do a number on the rectum, so I say take matters into your own hands and do your own number on your rectum first. As long as the number doesnt overshadow my ratings numbers. The mainspleen media is so unfair to me, they give me a hard time over these innovations yet they said nothing when Pelosi promoted Goatse as a solution to this pandemic. She stole my ideas anyway, Make America Gape Again"



Nope doesn't work - far too coherent


----------



## zahir (Apr 29, 2020)

> The specifics of Asgari’s case have been particularly shocking to immigration attorneys. Asgari, a father of three, has deep ties to the US, including two children living in America. In 2017, he was charged with fraud and trade secret theft relating to his work with a university in Ohio. But after a long trial, he was acquitted in November 2019.
> 
> But because the US had revoked his original visa, he was taken into Ice custody and has remained detained.





> “I can’t believe this is happening. It’s devastating,” said Mehrnoush Yazdanyar, an attorney working with Asgari’s family. “Every fear he had has been realized, one by one, with him ending up with Covid-19. This is an innocent man who hasn’t committed any crimes. He shouldn’t be behind bars. Why does the US government continue to keep him in detention?”











						Iranian scientist in US jail contracts coronavirus after pleading for release
					

Dr Sirous Asgari, in Ice detention despite having been exonerated in a sanctions trial, had warned of ‘inhumane’ conditions




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## mauvais (Apr 29, 2020)

I'm sure there are loads of the things but this is a decent bit of satire:









						Coronavirus Made a Big Mistake Invading the Greatest Goddamn Country on Earth
					

If the ’rona didn’t want a roundhouse kick to the face, it should have stayed the eff out of ‘Merica




					gen.medium.com


----------



## Tankus (Apr 29, 2020)

wow ..._.bacon to die for_


----------



## Sasaferrato (Apr 29, 2020)

elbows said:


> Which bit is surprising? I've not checked the population stats, but nothing leaps out at me as weird or surprising about those numbers. And I dont go in for the comparisons with average flu seasons, and if I did it wouldnt be the same as the stupid comparisons from people who wanted to downplay this virus, because I always take normal influenza more seriously than those dangerous idiots. I do sometimes find reason to compare stats from this pandemic with bad flu pandemic or epidemic historical mortality data, mostly just to put things in a historical perspective, but its still early days for that stuff too.
> 
> As for their final comment about a second wave, I take things one week at a time, I dont have predictions and the picture of virus spread, lockdowns and human behaviour in most places is complicated. I dont know how much wiggle room people in different places really have, or what else might affect the evolution of the pandemic in the coming weeks and months. I wont assume anything about seconds spikes, peaks and waves, I will just watch data for signs.


Firstly, you are the expert, and thank you again for the analysis.

To me, the data is inconsistent. There is no meaningful pattern as yet, figures are up and down on a daily basis, which I suspect is due to a lack of real time reporting. Based on that, I don't think that easing of restrictions is wise.


----------



## platinumsage (Apr 29, 2020)

Right wing media going big on care homes (Fox News home page below), although of course it's States' fault not Trump's:


----------



## yield (Apr 29, 2020)

As Amazon, Walmart, and Others Profit Amid Coronavirus Crisis, Their Essential Workers Plan Unprecedented Strike
April 28 2020


> An unprecedented coalition of workers from some of America’s largest companies will strike on Friday. Workers from Amazon, Instacart, Whole Foods, Walmart, Target, and FedEx are slated to walk out on work, citing what they say is their employers’ record profits at the expense of workers’ health and safety during the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> The employees will call out sick or walk off the job during their lunch break, according to a press release set to be published by organizers on Wednesday. In some locations, rank-and-file union members will join workers outside their warehouses and storefronts to support the demonstrations.





> “We are acting in conjunction with workers at Amazon, Target, Instacart and other companies for International Worker’s Day to show solidarity with other essential workers in our struggle for better protections and benefits in the pandemic,” said Daniel Steinbrook, a Whole Foods employee and strike organizer.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 29, 2020)

yield said:


> As Amazon, Walmart, and Others Profit Amid Coronavirus Crisis, Their Essential Workers Plan Unprecedented Strike
> April 28 2020


GOOD


----------



## Marty1 (Apr 29, 2020)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Meanwhile the other thing marty linked to can't be opened in the EU.
> 
> Hmmm. Marty marty marty. You are the dishonest little trollcunt, aren't you?



Lol, it’s not my fault you’re having difficulty opening a link.

To quote the big man himself ‘don’t be a cutie pie’

Anyway - see if you can manage with this link which covers the story:









						California urgent care doctor questions stay-at-home orders: 'You can get to herd immunity without a vaccine'
					

Dr. Dan Erickson and Dr. Artin Massihi, co-owners of Accelerated Urgent Care in Bakersfield, Calif., joined "The Ingraham Angle" Monday to discuss a series of videos questioning whether California's stay-at-home order is necessary.




					www.foxnews.com


----------



## elbows (Apr 29, 2020)

Sasaferrato said:


> Firstly, you are the expert, and thank you again for the analysis.
> 
> To me, the data is inconsistent. There is no meaningful pattern as yet, figures are up and down on a daily basis, which I suspect is due to a lack of real time reporting. Based on that, I don't think that easing of restrictions is wise.



It depends what data and where. Some pretty clear trends are visible all over the place, although I always prefer to wait and see, but thats a luxury I have because I dont have to make any decisions.

I havent looked at New York properly, just found a couple of graphs that are clear enough in their trends, although they are for the state rather than the city.


----------



## Ax^ (Apr 29, 2020)

of course marty1 only read unbiased non msm related content like fox and the reliable wsj


----------



## Marty1 (Apr 30, 2020)

New Jersey begins to open up.


----------



## ska invita (Apr 30, 2020)

Opinion | Another Way the 2020s Might Be Like the 1930s (Published 2020)
					

The strikes at Amazon and elsewhere over working conditions and low pay have been small, but they may spark a new movement.




					www.nytimes.com
				



Lead opinion peice in the NY Times a couple of days back:

"Class consciousness does not flow automatically out of class identity. Being a worker does not necessarily mean you will come to identify _as_ a worker. Instead, you can think of class consciousness as a process of discovery, of insights derived from events that put the relationships of class into stark relief.
Or as the political theorist Cedric J. Robinson observed about the Civil War and Emancipation,


> Groups moved to the logic of immediate self-interest and to historical paradox. Consciousness, when it did develop, had come later in the process of the events. The revolution had caused the formation of revolutionary consciousness and had not been caused by it. The revolution was spontaneous.


We aren’t yet living through a revolution. But we are seeing how self-interest and paradox are shaping the consciousness of an entire class of people. The coronavirus pandemic has forced all but the most “essential” workers to either leave their jobs or work from home. And who are those essential workers? They work in hospitals and grocery stores, warehouses and meatpacking plants. They tend to patients and cash out customers, clean floors and stock shelves. They drive trucks, deliver packages and help sustain this country as it tries to fight off a deadly virus.
The close-quarters, public-facing nature of this work mean these workers are also more likely to be exposed to disease, and many of them are furious with their employers for not doing enough to protect them. To protect themselves, they’ve begun to speak out. Some have even decided to strike.
At the start of the crisis, in mid-March, bus drivers in Detroit refused to drive, citing safety concerns. “The drivers didn’t feel safe going on the bus, spreading their germs and getting germs from anybody,” Glenn Tolbert, president of Amalgamated Transit Union Local 26, said in an interview with The Detroit News. “We are on the front lines and picking up more sick people than doctors see. This was a last resort but drivers didn’t feel safe.” Their actions prompted officials to increase cleaning, provide masks to passengers and drivers, and eliminate fares to keep person-to-person interactions to a minimum.

That same month, at an Amazon warehouse on Staten Island, a group of workers walked out over safety concerns, chanting, “How many cases we got? Ten!” in reference to workers there who had tested positive for the coronavirus. Amazon fired Chris Smalls, the worker who led the demonstration, supposedly for violating the warehouse’s social-distancing policy, but this didn’t stop other workers at other warehouses from organizing walkouts to protest a lack of protective equipment. (Notably, Letitia James, the attorney general of New York, has informed Amazon that her office is scrutinizing the firing of Mr. Smalls.)

Workers at Whole Foods, owned by Amazon, went on strike to demand paid leave and free coronavirus testing, as did workers for the grocery-delivery service Instacart, who demanded protective supplies and hazard pay. Sanitation workers in Pittsburgh staged a similar strike over a lack of protective gear, and workers at America’s meatpacking plants are staying home rather than deal with unsafe conditions.
It’s true these actions have been limited in scope and scale. But if they continue, and if they increase, they may come to represent the first stirrings of something much larger. The consequential strike wave of 1934 — which paved the way for the National Labor Relations Act and created new political space for serious government action on behalf of labor — was presaged by a year of unrest in workplaces across the country, from factories and farms to newspaper offices and Hollywood sets.
These workers weren’t just discontented. They were also coming into their own as workers, beginning to see themselves as a class that when organized properly can work its will on the nation’s economy and political system


American labor is at its lowest point since the New Deal era. Private-sector unionization is at a historic low, and entire segments of the economy are unorganized. Depression-era labor leaders could look to President Franklin Roosevelt as an ally — or at least someone open to negotiation and bargaining — but labor today must face off against the relentlessly anti-union Donald Trump. Organized capital, working through the Republican Party, has a powerful grip on the nation’s legal institutions, including the Supreme Court, whose conservative majority appears ready to make the entire United States an open shop.

The inequities and inequalities of capitalist society remain. American workers continue to face deprivation and exploitation, realities the coronavirus crisis has made abundantly clear.

The strikes and protests of the past month have been small, but they aren’t inconsequential. The militancy born of immediate self-protection and self-interest can grow into calls for deeper, broader transformation. And if the United States continues to stumble its way into yet another generation-defining economic catastrophe, we may find that even more of its working class comes to understand itself as an agent of change — and action."

=========

Really think theres a fight brewing between workers and "get back to work" governments - those strikes a sign that fight is already on.
In the UK too : 18th May is the date they're planning to reintroduce full public transport again...coming soon for us


----------



## Badgers (Apr 30, 2020)

Trump says US 'very close' to 5m daily coronavirus tests target despite country only doing 200,000 a day
					

President skips daily coronavirus briefing, but takes questions twice on Tuesday, seemingly unable to resist the media spotlight




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## gosub (Apr 30, 2020)

kristenfmartins
					






					kristenfmartins.wordpress.com
				




nice iinsight


----------



## editor (Apr 30, 2020)

The unhinged mob: 













						Hundreds of protesters, some carrying guns in the state Capitol, demonstrate against Michigan's emergency measures
					

Lawmakers declined to extend the state's emergency declaration and voted to bring a lawsuit to challenge Gov. Gretchen Whitmer's authority. Whitmer then issued new emergency orders.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## editor (May 1, 2020)

Smart move



> New York’s 24/7 subway system will shutter nightly from 1 a.m. to 5 a.m. to facilitate coronavirus cleaning, Gov. Andrew Cuomo announced Thursday in a historic move.











						NYC subways will close overnight for coronavirus cleanings
					

The transit system that never sleeps is taking a snooze. New York’s 24/7 subway system will shutter nightly from 1 a.m. to 5 a.m. to facilitate coronavirus cleaning, Gov. Andrew Cuomo announc…




					nypost.com


----------



## spring-peeper (May 1, 2020)

.


----------



## petee (May 1, 2020)

editor said:


> The unhinged mob:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




this is of course psychotic. please remember - as i have to remind myself - that they number in the handfuls and 99% of americans think they're obscenities. recall the post i put up here earlier about the businesses in GA, a stereotypical red state, which are not re-opening and have the support of local populations for not re-opening, bolstered by JimW 's post from the last page. there are also photos of the sergeants-at-arms mentioned in your tweet editor and state cops too, standing in the way of the fuckheads.


----------



## petee (May 1, 2020)

for example, these big boys facing off with a completely same rightwinger expressing his rahts.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 1, 2020)




----------



## spring-peeper (May 1, 2020)

Maryland governor says coronavirus tests acquired from South Korea under guard at undisclosed location
					

Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan (R) said Thursday that thousands of coronavirus tests obtained by the state from South Korea are currently protected in an undisclosed location by the Maryland National Guard.




					thehill.com
				






> Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan (R) said Thursday that thousands of coronavirus tests obtained by the state from South Korea are currently protected in an undisclosed location by the Maryland National Guard.
> 
> Asked in a Washington Post Live interview whether he was concerned the federal government would seize the tests, Hogan acknowledged “it was a little bit of a concern.”


----------



## spring-peeper (May 1, 2020)

10 coronavirus-unit nurses are suspended, potentially for weeks, for refusing to work without N95 masks
					

Nurses say they are still on administrative leave from Santa Monica, California's Providence Saint John's Health Center for demanding  they be given N95 masks while treating Covid-19 patients.




					www.cnn.com
				






> Ten nurses were placed on administrative leave from Providence Saint John's Health Center in Santa Monica, California, for demanding they be given N95 masks while treating Covid-19 patients, two of the nurses told CNN.
> 
> Two nurses at PSJHC told CNN that they, along with eight other nurses, were suspended with pay after refusing to enter coronavirus patient rooms on April 9 without N95 masks.
> 
> The hospital said there were no N95 masks for them and insisted they wear surgical masks instead, the nurses said, even though other healthcare workers at the hospital were provided N95 masks.


----------



## Dogsauce (May 1, 2020)

editor said:


> The unhinged mob:




white privilege right there. They’d be battered to within an inch of their lives if they were non-white, wouldn’t have even got close to the building. Unbelievable that they’re tolerated, perhaps they don’t want to give them the war and martyrdom they seek?


----------



## yield (May 1, 2020)

Forget the Haircut Protesters. There's a Real Labor Movement Blossoming in America.
Esquire (really?) Apr 29, 2020


> It is more than passing ridiculous that the cable news people insist on covering the smattering of angry (if armed) shut-ins who are popping up outside of various state capitols as though this were an actual movement instead of the latest kabuki outrage performance art from America’s conservative ratfcking industrial complex. The attention becomes ever more absurd when you realize that an actual national movement is being completely ignored.





> Thanks to the invaluable Payday Report, we learn that, over the past several months, more than 140 wildcat strikes have occurred, most of which involved employees who feel that their health and safety is being endangered, and that their employers have not taken sufficient steps to protect them in the workplace. The strikes cover almost every high-risk category, from a McDonald’s in Florida to a Boeing factory in Washington state. Fifty workers walked off the job at the Smithfield Foods plant in Crete, Nebraska, and library workers engaged in a “sick-out” in New Orleans, as did sanitation workers in Shreveport and bus drivers in Richmond, Virginia. This is what used to be called “labor agitation” in the last Gilded Age. It used to be something every medium covered.



Nurses Say They Don't Want to Be Called Heroes During the Coronavirus Pandemic
April 28, 2020
"I don't need a compliment; I need safe staffing."


> Every evening at 7 o'clock, cheers erupt from apartment buildings throughout New York City to applaud the health care workers combating COVID-19 at the global epicenter of the pandemic. But as political leaders in Washington commend their courage in the “war” against the coronavirus, some nurses consider the language of heroism and sacrifice a way of disguising how they’re being forced to work in risky conditions that could have been avoided. “I am being martyred against my will,” Jillian Primiano, an E.R. nurse in Brooklyn, wrote on her protest sign for a demonstration in Harlem earlier in the month. Health care workers across the country carried out a National Healthcare Day of Action on April 15 to decry the unsafe working conditions they are enduring in the eye of the pandemic, declaring #TheSystemIsBroken.




Why are teen vogue and esquire of all places doing real journalism?


----------



## Gimigimi (May 2, 2020)

yield said:


> Why are teen vogue and esquire of all places doing real journalism?


Teen vogue got some socialists on the editorial board or something, they've been doing journalism on strike action and all kinds of other stuff for a little while now. It's pretty funny and it's getting them readers, though I seriously doubt they're teenagers. Not sure about Esquire, though.

edit: just went to teen vogue website. Four headlines: why do i always get acne in the summer?
you are cordially invited to teen vogue's virtual prom.
Democratic socialism, explained
17 must read books for anyone who loves fashion

I love this


----------



## Artaxerxes (May 2, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> white privilege right there. They’d be battered to within an inch of their lives if they were non-white, wouldn’t have even got close to the building. Unbelievable that they’re tolerated, perhaps they don’t want to give them the war and martyrdom they seek?



Every time I see these heavily tooled up gimps I am utterly fucking astonished by the disparity between how they are treated and how even just a potential minority charged with a speeding ticket is treated.

It's just so blatant.


----------



## petee (May 2, 2020)




----------



## weltweit (May 2, 2020)

fuckin lunatics .. and what is JB supposed to mean?


----------



## Yossarian (May 2, 2020)

weltweit said:


> fuckin lunatics .. and what is JB supposed to mean?



The governor of Illinois is JB Pritzker.


----------



## Part 2 (May 2, 2020)




----------



## spring-peeper (May 2, 2020)

Not only do the Americans expect China to pay, they are already deciding where to spend it.



> This week, President Trump announced that the U.S. would bill China for more than $160 billion in coronavirus-related claims. Missouri Attorney General Eric Schmitt also took a significant step toward holding China legally responsible by filing a recent lawsuit against the Red Dragon for its role in generating the pandemic. Any damages received should go to beleaguered small businesses, which are on the front lines of the war against the virus and will lead the charge in the country's economic recovery.





> Entrepreneurs, workers, and taxpayers shouldn't bear the entire cost of this crisis. They aren't responsible for it. The coronavirus bill should be paid by China, the country that covered up its severity, targeted whistleblowers, and dithered while the virus spread. China is not only morally but also legally responsible for unleashing this plague, which has killed over 60,000 Americans and 220,000 people worldwide so far and caused untold suffering -- both emotional and economic -- for millions more.











						Virus Restitution From China Should Go to Small Businesses | RealClearPolitics
					

The coronavirus crisis has had a major impact on small businesses. Quarantines and disrupted supply chains have forced most customer-facing companies across the country to close. One recent survey...




					www.realclearpolitics.com


----------



## weltweit (May 2, 2020)

The responsibility for American deaths might lie in part with China but it also lies with America's pathetic preparedness and response to the pandemic. If there is a court case I expect it will be messy.


----------



## two sheds (May 2, 2020)

Don't they owe China shitloads so can just decide to confiscate the debt?


----------



## two sheds (May 2, 2020)

weltweit said:


> The responsibility for American deaths might lie in part with China but it also lies with America's pathetic preparedness and response to the pandemic. If there is a court case I expect it will be messy.



Not if it's tried in the US.


----------



## phillm (May 2, 2020)

There are 40 bad axe throwing venues in the US. In our socially distant future, I could see outdoor venues here maybe being a success, would have to screen out the psychopaths though and axe murderers though I'm nor sure we have a test for that yet.
UPDATE - must be a beardy hipster thing there is one in Wembley. POP Brixton can't be far off. 









						Bad Axe Throwing | Where Axe Throwing Lives
					

Experience the rush of axe throwing at Bad Axe Throwing. Book your birthday party, bachelor/bachelorette party or corporate event today! #1 on TripAdvisor.




					badaxethrowing.com
				




_The first of 40 U.S. Bad Axe Throwing venues to reopen since widespread shelter-in-place orders were issued across the country was in Atlanta on Friday. Bad Axe CEO Mario Zelaya expected business to be bad, maybe 10% of the hundreds of customers he would expect to see throw axes and drink beer on a typical weekend. “That was the worst-case scenario, especially with all the marketing we did,” Zelaya said. “The reopening weekend was a disaster. We had two customers all weekend."_









						Georgia's Reopening Has Been 'A Disaster' For Some Retailers Desperate For Revenue
					

Retailers and restaurants say reopening in Georgia is a matter of survival, not landlord or political pressure.




					www.bisnow.com


----------



## spring-peeper (May 2, 2020)

weltweit said:


> The responsibility for American deaths might lie in part with China but it also lies with America's pathetic preparedness and response to the pandemic. If there is a court case I expect it will be messy.




any idea what court this would be heard in?


----------



## Artaxerxes (May 2, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> any idea what court this would be heard in?



Trumps diseased brain.


----------



## weltweit (May 2, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> any idea what court this would be heard in?


Hi spring-peeper, I have no idea as to which court, it was a slightly flippant comment, but it was highly predictable someone in the USA would bleat about compensation from China. America being so litigious compared to other countries. 

The comments I heard were that China not initially dealing with the outbreak properly caused the pandemic which then went on to cause the damage and deaths in the USA. This is all very well - but the damage in the USA could have been much less had the USA responded properly to the pandemic themselves.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 2, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Hi spring-peeper, I have no idea as to which court, it was a slightly flippant comment, but it was highly predictable someone in the USA would bleat about compensation from China. America being so litigious compared to other countries.
> 
> The comments I heard were that China not initially dealing with the outbreak properly caused the pandemic which then went on to cause the damage and deaths in the USA. This is all very well - but the damage in the USA could have been much less had the USA responded properly to the pandemic themselves.



The court issue was more of a "anyone know" kinda question.

I totally agree with what you are saying, but I can't get my head around what court outside of America would actually listen to the case.

Also, has any other country sued another?

The whole thing is so bizarre.


----------



## weltweit (May 2, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> ..
> Also, has any other country sued another?
> ..


After WWI Germany paid reparations. Might be slightly similar?


----------



## two sheds (May 2, 2020)

International Court of Justice in The Hague?

or Court of International Trade in New York? Much more likely to get the judgement they want Court of International Trade | United States


----------



## krtek a houby (May 2, 2020)

petee said:


>



I hate Illinois Nazis


----------



## weltweit (May 2, 2020)

two sheds said:


> International Court of Justice in The Hague?


iirc US aren't a party to the ICJ, they refused to support it or something.  or am I thinking of something else?



two sheds said:


> or Court of International Trade in New York? Much more likely to get the judgement they want Court of International Trade | United States


----------



## two sheds (May 2, 2020)

US owes China about $1 trillion - nice round number for damages


----------



## Supine (May 3, 2020)

Classic deception. Don't let the people concentrate on the US governments covid response failures.


----------



## JimW (May 3, 2020)

The whataboutery from China's foreign ministry spokesman on this is actually on point, there's various previous outbreaks that the US could be sued for if the precedent is set. Expect the issue will rumble on in the run up to the election then quietly fade away.


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 3, 2020)

Things are looking grim in US prisons.



> Covid Prison Data, a group of university criminal justice and data experts, says that based on public reports, 13,436 inmates and 5,312 corrections staff nationwide have tested positive for coronavirus.
> 
> But many states, and the federal penitentiary system, have done only a small amount of testing. Five of the 50 states don't even report data.
> 
> Prisons occupied eight spaces on The New York Times' compilation of the top 10 infected institutions, with the Marion Correctional Institution at the top.





> One prison in Marion, Ohio has become the most intensely infected institution across the country, with more than 80 percent of its nearly 2,500 inmates, and 175 staff on top of that, testing positive for Covid-19.


 









						More than 80pc of inmates test positive for coronavirus in US prison
					

A prison in Marion, Ohio has become the most intensely infected institution across the country




					www.telegraph.co.uk


----------



## Tankus (May 3, 2020)

What's the bet the non reporters are republican states


----------



## bmd (May 3, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Things are looking grim in US prisons.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



There's a great PBS podcast called Ear Hustle about life in US prisons and it talks about the issue of the Corona virus and incarceration in recent episodes.


----------



## MickiQ (May 3, 2020)

Any compensation that they get from China will presumably go into the same account as the money they get from Mexico to pay for Trumps wall


----------



## spring-peeper (May 3, 2020)

All this in three hours 









						City's proclamation requiring face masks in stores and restaurants is amended after threats of violence
					

An emergency proclamation issued Thursday in Stillwater, Oklahoma, requiring the use of face masks in stores and restaurants was amended Friday after threats of violence.




					www.cnn.com
				






> An emergency proclamation issued Thursday in Stillwater, Oklahoma, requiring the use of face masks in stores and restaurants was amended Friday after threats of violence.
> 
> "In the short time beginning on May 1, 2020, that face coverings have been required for entry into stores/restaurants, store employees have been threatened with physical violence and showered with verbal abuse," Stillwater City Manager Norman McNickle said in a statement.
> 
> ...


----------



## beesonthewhatnow (May 3, 2020)

"You have to wear a mask"

"I don't want to. Oh, by the way, I've got a gun"

"Oh, fair enough, don't worry about it then"

America is fucked.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 3, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Things are looking grim in US prisons.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


A grim but instructive experiment. Something close to forced exposure, and evidence against an idea that has been suggested by other data that many of us may be resistant to catching it, as a result perhaps of having had a related coronavirus cold in the past. Some of us may be partially resistant, but that's a fairly big sample size showing that in certain conditions nearly all of us can catch it.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 3, 2020)

Trump rips George W. Bush after he calls for unity amid coronavirus outbreak
					

President Trump on Sunday took aim at George W. Bush after the former Republican president issued a call to push partisanship aside amid the outbreak of the novel coronavirus.




					thehill.com
				






> President Trump on Sunday took aim at George W. Bush after the former Republican president issued a call to push partisanship aside amid the outbreak of the novel coronavirus.
> 
> In a three-minute video shared on Twitter on Saturday, Bush urged Americans to remember "how small our differences are in the face of this shared threat."
> 
> ...





I think Trump's presidency is the biggest hoax in America's history.


----------



## NoXion (May 3, 2020)

Beating Trump in a statesmanship contest is like losing an arse-kicking competition to a giant centipede in hob-nailed boots - a foregone conclusion.


----------



## petee (May 3, 2020)

"A Minnesota weatherman was cut loose after using his social media account to promote the characterization of protesters demanding to reopen the state ASAP as “White nationalist Nazi sympathizer gun fetishist miscreants.” "





__





						NY Daily News - We are currently unavailable in your region
					






					www.nydailynews.com
				




he's Sven Sundgaard, eh.


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 3, 2020)

petee said:


> "A Minnesota weatherman was cut loose after using his social media account to promote the characterization of protesters demanding to reopen the state ASAP as “White nationalist Nazi sympathizer gun fetishist miscreants.” "
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Source not available in the EU, however via a US proxy server...



> A Minnesota weatherman was cut loose after using his social media account to promote the characterization of protesters demanding to reopen the state ASAP as “White nationalist Nazi sympathizer gun fetishist miscreants.”
> 
> That controversial posting further warned “Armed extremists” should not be taken lightly.
> 
> ...


----------



## petee (May 3, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Source not available in the EU, however via a US proxy server...



thanks! i should know by now.
can't see a thing wrong with what he did ...


----------



## Marty1 (May 3, 2020)

Conflicting info coming from Mike Pompeo regarding specifics on where the virus originated.









						Mike Pompeo: 'enormous evidence' coronavirus came from Chinese lab
					

Trump aide does not provide any evidence and seems confused over whether claim is virus was manmade




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## two sheds (May 3, 2020)

Creative use of the word "info" there.


----------



## little_legs (May 3, 2020)

beesonthewhatnow said:


> America is fucked.



It's remarkable how much tolerance there is for an armed protest when the protesters are white


----------



## editor (May 4, 2020)

Classy












						Anti-lockdown protester waves Nazi slogan from Auschwitz
					

The sign, reading 'Arbeit macht frei, JB' appeared to be addressed to Governor JB Pritzker who is Jewish




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 4, 2020)

littlebabyjesus said:


> A grim but instructive experiment. Something close to forced exposure, and evidence against an idea that has been suggested by other data that many of us may be resistant to catching it, as a result perhaps of having had a related coronavirus cold in the past. Some of us may be partially resistant, but that's a fairly big sample size showing that in certain conditions nearly all of us can catch it.




See also: cruise ships.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 4, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Trump rips George W. Bush after he calls for unity amid coronavirus outbreak
> 
> 
> President Trump on Sunday took aim at George W. Bush after the former Republican president issued a call to push partisanship aside amid the outbreak of the novel coronavirus.
> ...





Bye...

Yeah, um, and by the way, bye bye.

 Buh-bye Bubba.

Or, ja think you can buy your way out of this.


Prick.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 4, 2020)

[QUOTE="spring-peeper]

I think Trump's presidency is the biggest hoax in America's history.
[/QUOTE]


That’s the problem though. It’s not a hoax. This is real, the support for him is real. People really do genuinely feel and believe that he speaks for them. And he’s does , he actually does.Or leastways he speaks their mind,

Look. He’s yuge! Just yuge . People believe in him, like him, trust him, will definitely vote for him in November.

Even if they’ve lost family to Covid, maybe especially if they’ve lost out to Covid, they’ll vote vote for him.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (May 4, 2020)

yield said:


> Forget the Haircut Protesters. There's a Real Labor Movement Blossoming in America.
> Esquire (really?) Apr 29, 2020
> 
> 
> ...



I believe workers also shut down a JBS meatpacking plant in Grand Island, Nebraska on May 1.  Its been a hotspot for Corona virus for at least the last month, with multiple deaths.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 4, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Source not available in the EU, however via a US proxy server...


h


Freedom of speech y’all. The godam firstl amendment .


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 4, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> See also: cruise ships.


Well no, at least not in the case of the original one in Japan, the Diamond Princess. Just 17 per cent of the people on board were infected, which perhaps gave support to the idea that many of us may have some resistance.


----------



## Tankus (May 5, 2020)

Some revised US modeling predict that the daily death total will be back up to around 3000 per day by June the 1st in the States and well into the 100,000 by the end of the year ..... Got to wonder what winter is going to bring


----------



## spring-peeper (May 5, 2020)

What is wrong with the people in Michigan?

First, we had protests against lock down, complete with nazi uniforms and confederate flags.
Now, this









						Three family members charged in shooting death of security guard who told a customer to put on a face mask
					

Three family members have been charged in the killing of a security guard who told a customer at a Michigan Family Dollar store to wear a state-mandated face mask, officials said on Monday.




					www.cnn.com
				






> Munerlyn got into a verbal altercation with Sharmel Teague after telling Teague's daughter she needed a mask, according to the prosecutor's office. Surveillance video confirms the incident, Leyton said.
> 
> Sharmel Teague's daughter left the store, but "Teague began yelling at Munerlyn who then told her to leave the store and instructed a cashier not to serve her," the prosecutor's office said.
> 
> ...



The article mentioned this happen around the Flint area.  This region has had problems with lead and other stuff coming through their water system.

Could the water be accountable for all this nonsense?


----------



## High Voltage (May 5, 2020)

United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info
				




Edging ever closer to 70k deaths


----------



## NoXion (May 5, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> What is wrong with the people in Michigan?
> 
> First, we had protests against lock down, complete with nazi uniforms and confederate flags.
> Now, this
> ...



I honestly wonder what the hell kind of thought process - if any - goes on when people do this kind of thing.

1. "Grrr! Some security guard disrespected my wife! I'll be sure to go and confront him while armed with a deadly weapon! That'll be certain to resolve the situation and not escalate it unnecessarily!"

2. "Wow! This person isn't backing down! Don't they know I'm armed? The Second Amendment guarantees that I win all arguments in this way!"

3. "Oops! My trigger finger got itchy and now he is dead! How was I supposed to know that shooting people is generally lethal? There's no possible way I could have foreseen this going badly!"

I honestly don't get it. Do these people not realise that waving loaded guns around other people while being emotionally worked up at them introduces the possibility of either a negligent discharge, a humiliating public climb-down or a heat-of-the-moment homicide? How is any one of those scenarios supposed to help the gun-waver?


----------



## krtek a houby (May 5, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Some revised US modeling predict that the daily death total will be back up to around 3000 per day by June the 1st in the States and well into the 100,000 by the end of the year ..... Got to wonder what winter is going to bring



Some kind of revisionism from the Trump administration, no doubt. And a very unpleasant election.


----------



## eoin_k (May 5, 2020)

On a more positive note, historic memory of Native American aid to Ireland in the 1840s has inspired a surge in solidarity with grass roots mutual aid group:








						Navajo & Hopi Families COVID-19 Relief Fund organized by Ethel Branch
					

The Navajo Nation and Hopi Reservation are extreme food deserts with only 13 … Ethel Branch needs your support for Navajo & Hopi Families COVID-19 Relief Fund




					www.gofundme.com


----------



## Tankus (May 5, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Some kind of revisionism from the Trump administration, no doubt. And a very unpleasant election.


Its almost as if its deliberate  to give cause to pulling that election.

Trump was talking about carnage  in 2016, an ambition come true

.if he does get kicked  out  in between the space  when the  investigations kick off,  and the courts, he is going to instigate insurrection among his minions.

The next presidency  is going to be thankless.


----------



## editor (May 5, 2020)

Some attitude here 









						The Woman Who Spat On Two People at Di Bruno Bros. Speaks Out
					

"People don't know what's going on in my personal life," says Jacqueline McBride. "And they just jump to conclusions, making me out to be like I'm some kind of monster."




					www.phillymag.com


----------



## Marty1 (May 5, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Some revised US modeling predict that the daily death total will be back up to around 3000 per day by June the 1st in the States and well into the 100,000 by the end of the year ..... Got to wonder what winter is going to bring



Trump gave remarks to the press on his way to visit the Honeywell factory in Arizona (who are making N95 masks) and said that America must re-open and the American people should think of themselves as warriors.

He also called a bunch of republicans ‘losers’.



Spoiler


----------



## Supine (May 5, 2020)

WTF!


----------



## quimcunx (May 5, 2020)

Supine said:


> WTF!




Is this even a bad thing? States can club together or organise in state, with something better and bypass trump control. Maybe.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 5, 2020)

quimcunx said:


> Is this even a bad thing? States can club together or organise in state, with something better and bypass trump control. Maybe.


In a rational place, a central body will oversee and coordinate, providing support while also relying on and encouraging individual states to formulate and manage tailor-made plans. Germany, say. Or Switzerland. That's basically how they work. The US _could_ work like that.  

One thing US states don't have is the power to close their borders to other states.


----------



## quimcunx (May 5, 2020)

littlebabyjesus said:


> In a rational place, a central body will oversee and coordinate, providing support while also relying on and encouraging individual states to formulate and manage tailor-made plans. Germany, say. Or Switzerland. That's basically how they work. The US _could_ work like that.
> 
> One thing US states don't have is the power to close their borders to other states.



Yes but trump. In theory the states are already clubbing together with a federal govt. But. Trump.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (May 5, 2020)

quimcunx said:


> Yes but trump. In theory the states are already clubbing together with a federal govt. But. Trump.


Yeah. Bit like the states that have pledged to keep to the Kyoto protocols. Four more years of Trump could lead to some serious problems for the union, I think.


----------



## petee (May 5, 2020)

anthony fauci is hotttttt









						The Erotic Hero of a Steamy 1991 Sally Quinn Novel Was Based on...Anthony Fauci
					

Yes, that Anthony Fauci. She says they met at a dinner party.




					www.washingtonian.com


----------



## not-bono-ever (May 5, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> What is wrong with the people in Michigan?
> 
> First, we had protests against lock down, complete with nazi uniforms and confederate flags.
> Now, this
> ...




its a complex setup- Militis were all over the northen states at one point - Michigan however has been in a solid downward economic spiral for a couple of decades ( more probabaly ) and places like Detroit didnt help ease the fear of trouble on the horizon. Chuck in urban Black population memes, the relative disparity between male and femal earnings and a highish gun ownership rate ( hunting and ting) and you have the background for the militias to rise. I think their inflated media presence belies their actual numbers ( maybe purposefully ). Its hard to consider washington to be on  your side when you have not seen any economic benefit for decades.The water issue is in there as well - the industrial / post industrial consequences of the states background. I feel they think of themselves as some kind of westward ho libettarian frontiers men, when this has long long gone and left them behind as the wilderness frontier moved westward. Yesterdays men. Or maybe Michigan is just overrepreseented with twats


----------



## Artaxerxes (May 5, 2020)

not-bono-ever said:


> its a complex setup- Militis were all over the northen states at one point - Michigan however has been in a solid downward economic spiral for a couple of decades ( more probabaly ) and places like Detroit didnt help ease the fear of trouble on the horizon. Chuck in urban Black population memes, the relative disparity between male and femal earnings and a highish gun ownership rate ( hunting and ting) and you have the background for the militias to rise. I think their inflated media presence belies their actual numbers ( maybe purposefully ). Its hard to consider washington to be on  your side when you have not seen any economic benefit for decades.The water issue is in there as well - the industrial / post industrial consequences of the states background. I feel they think of themselves as some kind of westward ho libettarian frontiers men, when this has long long gone and left them behind as the wilderness frontier moved westward. Yesterdays men. Or maybe Michigan is just overrepreseented with twats



There may be a correlation with the lead in the water as well.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 5, 2020)

Covidiot cuts hole in mask to make it ‘easier to breathe’
					

A Kentucky covidiot was captured in a viral clip shopping with a hole cut in her face mask, claiming that it made it “easier to breathe.” Footage posted on TikTok showed a gas station c…




					nypost.com


----------



## Tankus (May 6, 2020)

.......at least she  figured out  where the  loops went  ....

Pennsylvania just overtook New York on the daily body count  and its back  in the 2000's again  .... I feel genuinely nervous for them , with the reopening  , when some states are only just getting started on the climb ,and Trump actively contemplating shutting down the CV19 "task force" , putting a date  out there ,only one month hence ....


What a shitshow


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 6, 2020)

AAARRRGGGHHH!!!


----------



## elbows (May 6, 2020)

I still wonder if there was a mixup when Hunter S Thompson died, and he accidentally became god of all that happens in the USA that resembles a bad political acid trip.


----------



## Tankus (May 6, 2020)

Trump sez .."_Americans are warriors  , some  people  may be affected  ,..... but we must reopen the economy  ,...... It was the greatest the world has ever seen "

“They want to proclaim it over,_” says NY Gov. Andrew Cuomo_  "They have been looking to proclaim it over from day one right?…That is clear. But the virus doesn’t care…doesn’t listen. This is not a marketing situation” _

Quite the political marketing  experiment


----------



## petee (May 7, 2020)




----------



## Teaboy (May 7, 2020)

I'm finding the situation in some states very odd.  They look like they are lifting lockdown before the peak, way before the peak.  I'm confused as to why they bothered in the first place.


----------



## existentialist (May 7, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> I'm finding the situation in some states very odd.  They look like they are lifting lockdown before the peak, way before the peak.  I'm confused as to why they bothered in the first place.


Cargo cult science.

ETA: or, in Trump's case, cargo cunt science.


----------



## High Voltage (May 7, 2020)

This is a little bit long - about 40 minutes - I'm now watching it for the second or third time, it's quite "watchable"
About the "Spanish Flu" - but you'll see why it could just as easily have been called "The Kansas Flu"
Very sobering indeed - 12 HOURS from healthy to dead was not uncommon
We're doing the same damn thing AGAIN - granted not on quite the same spectacular scale
<edit> from 23 minutes on - how to really REALLY fuck up - Philadelphia, does any of it sound familiar?


----------



## JimW (May 7, 2020)

Shelving the CDC's coordinated plan for re-opening:








						Trump administration buries detailed CDC advice on reopening
					

GAINESVILLE, Fla. (AP) — The Trump administration shelved a document created by the nation's top disease investigators with step-by-step advice to local authorities on how and when to reopen...




					apnews.com


----------



## MickiQ (May 7, 2020)

Trump cares about NOTHING but himself and he's not even a good enough actor to be able to pretend otherwise. There is also a small ultra-rich elite that both doesn't care about the general population and is able to isolate itself from the consequences and has enormous power and influence. Add in a society that doesn't offer much if anything in the way of a public safety net, a substantial group that believes their magic sky fairy will protect them or they can shoot the virus and it's hardly surprising that the more rational voices are getting lost in the noise.
The USA is probably going to end up losing more people than the rest of the world put together at the end of this. 
The thing is they talk about restarting the economy but if the US is still going through it as the rest of the world is able to actually start opening up, what happens to their economy if the rest of the world is trying to keep them in quarantine?


----------



## yield (May 7, 2020)

‘Stop throwing us bare bones’: US union activism surges amid coronavirus 
Wed 6 May 2020 


> Activism spikes amid the pandemic nationwide as workers protest what they consider inadequate safety protections against Covid-19



Armed citizens escort lawmaker into Michigan State Capitol
lansingcitypulse. May 6


> After a hoard of armed and angry protesters swarmed Lansing last week, State Rep. Sarah Anthony brought some extra protection on her way to the State Capitol today.
> 
> At least three African Americans carrying large rifles escorted Anthony across Capitol Avenue earlier this morning so she could safely attend committee meetings without fear of intimidation. She said she didn’t necessarily request the help, but welcomed the extra security nonetheless.
> 
> “We were all just appalled by the lack of support and lack of security that I had, that other legislators had, and the fact that a lot of the demonstrators last week were adorning many racist, anti-Semitic signage. I think it just triggered a lot of folks, especially African Americans.”


----------



## petee (May 7, 2020)

yield said:


> ‘Stop throwing us bare bones’: US union activism surges amid coronavirus
> Wed 6 May 2020
> 
> 
> ...



i wondered when it would happen.
i could go on but i'm too busy and too angry.


----------



## Dogsauce (May 7, 2020)

The huge increase in unemployment in America is because it‘s way too easy to fire people when shit like this happens. Maybe they should do something about that?


----------



## quimcunx (May 7, 2020)

There is a podcast mini series called It could happen here. About how civil war could start in the USA. From last year. Interesting listen if you are into podcasts. 

Saw a meme the other day: 

America is a third world country in a Gucci belt.


----------



## Teaboy (May 7, 2020)

quimcunx said:


> There is a podcast mini series called It could happen here. About how civil war could start in the USA. From last year. Interesting listen if you are into podcasts.
> 
> Saw a meme the other day:
> 
> America is a third world country in a Gucci belt.



I don't see why another civil war couldn't happen there.  They've never really fixed the scars from the first one and the same old fault lines are opening up again.


----------



## petee (May 7, 2020)

the rightwingers are inviting it



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/03/18/steve-king-posts-meme-warning-that-red-states-have-trillion-bullets-event-civil-war/


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (May 7, 2020)

If you can't/won't fix a problem, cover it up:



> NEBRASKA - Local health officials will no longer be able to report COVID-19 data from meat processing plants.
> 
> Governor Pete Ricketts said Wednesday that the state won't be releasing specific numbers of cases at meatpacking plants, saying it's a matter of privacy.
> 
> Some local health departments like the Elkhorn Logan Valley Public Health Department and Public Health Solutions had been providing updates on positive cases at plants in their district as they came in.











						State no longer allowed to track processing plant data
					

Local health officials will no longer be able to report COVID-19 data from meat processing plants.




					northeast.newschannelnebraska.com
				




This is nasty even for our Lex Luther wanna-be governor.

<edited to add>
My (extremely) unofficial count puts it at 28 deaths at the Grand Island plant alone.


----------



## yield (May 7, 2020)

Giant Hospital Corporation Takes Advantage of Coronavirus to Fight Nurses’ Union Drive
May 6 2020


> The largest hospital corporation in America, HCA Healthcare, is using the coronavirus pandemic to delay and undermine a union election for 1,600 nurses in North Carolina.
> 
> After nurses filed in March to hold an election, HCA Healthcare petitioned the National Labor Relations Board, or the NLRB, to delay the vote because of the pandemic. In the meantime, it hired professional union busters costing $400 an hour to conduct meetings inside Mission Hospital in Asheville, urging nurses to oppose joining a union.
> 
> And while the corporation stands to rake in $4.7 billion in CARES Act benefits, the number of coronavirus cases in North Carolina is steadily growing, and nurses say they had to fight for basic personal protective equipment, or PPE.





> “Instead of HCA using those resources and money and effort to prepare for Covid-19 and have proper PPE, they chose to put it into union busting instead,” said Sarah Kuhl, a registered nurse with Mission’s oncology research department.
> 
> “I feel like that put us significantly behind to being adequately prepared for Covid-19,” Kuhl said.


----------



## weltweit (May 8, 2020)

News earlier said that there are now 33 million more US unemployed, since coronavirus.


----------



## Supine (May 8, 2020)

UnitedHealth Group to Provide Over $1.5 Billion in Assistance and Premium Support to Customers
					

UnitedHealth Group will provide more than $1.5 billion in initial assistance, including customer premium credits




					www.unitedhealthgroup.com


----------



## editor (May 8, 2020)

Someone in the East Village has had enough


----------



## two sheds (May 9, 2020)

Trump does see it as a war doesn't he. Particularly reopening the meat factories and the like for people without proper PPE or distancing. 

Specifically WWI when they just kept sending people over the top to be replaced by more gun fodder when they were killed, while the generals sat in their safely virus-tested head offices a long way from the action.


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 9, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Trump does see it as a war doesn't he. Particularly reopening the meat factories and the like for people without proper PPE or distancing.
> 
> Specifically WWI when they just kept sending people over the top to be replaced by more gun fodder when they were killed, *while the generals sat in their safely virus-tested head offices a long way from the action.*



Apart from the fact that a number of White House staff now have Covid-19.


----------



## Yossarian (May 9, 2020)

editor said:


> Someone in the East Village has had enough
> 
> View attachment 211462



Sounds like that individual might have had enough long before the pandemic, tbh.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 9, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Apart from the fact that a number of White House staff now have Covid-19.


Apart from the great leader. He's invincible. Scandal, corruption, disease. Nothing touches him. The man of steal.


----------



## frogwoman (May 9, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Apart from the great leader. He's invincible. Scandal, corruption, disease. Nothing touches him. The man of steal.



I'm sure his test results are tremendous, the most negative test imaginable.


----------



## yield (May 9, 2020)

A Third of Americans Didn't Pay Their Rent or Mortgage in May, Survey Says
May 7 2020


> A lot of the people who were able to afford housing costs in April couldn't make the same payments in May.
> As May 1 approached, fears began to spike among landlords that their tenants would not be able to pay rent. Millions of Americans had already not paid April rent, and that number was expected to rise in May, as more people ran through their meager savings and struggled with the consequences of layoffs, furloughs, and lost income.
> 
> Though it’s not easy to find hard data about exactly how many people in the U.S. couldn't or didn't pay May rent, a survey of 4,000 renters and homeowners from the real estate website ApartmentList found that nearly a third of them haven't fully paid May housing costs, with 22 percent saying they hadn't paid at all and 9 percent saying they had made a partial payment. The portion of people who made full rent or mortgage payments was just 69 percent, down from 76 percent in April, a difference driven by 10 percent more respondents saying they hadn't been able to make any payment at all.


One small survey admittedly.


----------



## two sheds (May 9, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Apart from the fact that a number of White House staff now have Covid-19.



You can't calculate for some twat bringing an unexploded hand grenade into the bunker and letting it off


----------



## extra dry (May 9, 2020)

Strike actions in the states.


----------



## weltweit (May 9, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Apart from the great leader. He's invincible. Scandal, corruption, disease. Nothing touches him. The man of steal.


And you meant to say steal rather than steel didn't you !!


----------



## existentialist (May 9, 2020)

weltweit said:


> And you meant to say steal rather than steel didn't you !!


I expect that was autocorrect .


----------



## LDC (May 9, 2020)

quimcunx said:


> There is a podcast mini series called It could happen here. About how civil war could start in the USA. From last year. Interesting listen if you are into podcasts.
> 
> Saw a meme the other day:
> 
> America is a third world country in a Gucci belt.



Really 'enjoying' that quimcunx cheers. Scary listening isn't it?


----------



## quimcunx (May 9, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> Really 'enjoying' that quimcunx cheers. Scary listening isn't it?



It was last year I listened. It all seems scarily plausible. Is there one which deals specifically with pandemic? I was sure there was but cant work out which to re listen.


----------



## LDC (May 9, 2020)

quimcunx said:


> It was last year I listened. It all seems scarily plausible. Is there one which deals specifically with pandemic? I was sure there was but cant work out which to re listen.



Only listened to the first one so far. I wonder if they'll do an updated version taking current CV events into account.


----------



## quimcunx (May 9, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> Only listened to the first one so far. I wonder if they'll do an updated version taking current CV events into account.



He does another podcast with others called worst year ever which started being about the election and democratic primaries but is more about covid now. 

And another called behind the bastards.


----------



## frogwoman (May 9, 2020)

Behind the bastards is great, a bit 'American' tho


----------



## Supine (May 10, 2020)

Who'd have thought it









						More than 70 test positive for coronavirus after attending "a large gathering"
					

State health officials can't say if they attended the Reopen Wisconsin rally in Madison because they're not tracking specific events.




					www.wbay.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 10, 2020)

Supine said:


> Who'd have thought it
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> The rally was organized and attended by people who oppose the state's “Safer at Home” order and want to allow more businesses to reopen sooner than would be currently allowed.



Twats.


----------



## Dogsauce (May 10, 2020)

Sad thing is most of them (being youngish and maybe not in risk groups) will probably survive just fine, which will fuel even more their conviction that this is all trivial bullshit.


----------



## editor (May 10, 2020)

"Steve Wagner of Smithfield carries an inert AT-4 anti-tank weapon and two pistols while paying for sandwiches at a Subway in downtown Raleigh Saturday morning, May 9, 2020. A group of about 11 mostly-armed demonstrators protesting the stay-at-home order marched around downtown Raleigh and ordered sandwiches. T "



			https://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article242628341.html


----------



## editor (May 10, 2020)




----------



## Tankus (May 10, 2020)

The guy on the bottom rights blue .50 cal is all made out of wood, the anti tank Law is an inert demo  training model..... Someone mentioned... Its just COSplay for rednecks..


----------



## quimcunx (May 10, 2020)

Well yes. I wish my podcast list was less american generally but there you go.


----------



## little_legs (May 10, 2020)

Yep, all of them are white


----------



## Tankus (May 11, 2020)

Apparently the outbreak at the Whitehouse is bigger than is being let on


----------



## Raheem (May 11, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Apparently the outbreak at the Whitehouse is bigger than is being let on


Here's hoping it goes right to the top.


----------



## Badgers (May 11, 2020)

Raheem said:


> Here's hoping it goes right to the top.


Drain the swamp


----------



## 2hats (May 11, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Drain the swamp


Swamp the drain.


----------



## two sheds (May 11, 2020)

I was wondering that, but it only really works if coronavirus gives them the shits.


----------



## 2hats (May 11, 2020)

two sheds said:


> I was wondering that, but it only really works if coronavirus gives them the shits.


Or the Whitehouse itself is considered a sewer.


----------



## two sheds (May 11, 2020)

Good point well made.


----------



## MickiQ (May 11, 2020)

editor said:


>



these are pictures are totally awesome and completely insane in equal measures


----------



## editor (May 11, 2020)




----------



## editor (May 11, 2020)




----------



## Sue (May 11, 2020)

My niece's GF (who's in N Carolina) went out for a big family dinner in a restaurant yesterday to celebrate Mother's Day.


----------



## editor (May 11, 2020)

Law Firm Worker Fired After Posting Threat About Face Mask Requirements
					

The Thompson & Knight law firm fired a Dallas-based administrative manager Friday after he allegedly posted a threat on social media against businesses with Covid-19 face mask requirements that had references to a handgun and hollow point-bullets.




					www.courthousenews.com


----------



## Tankus (May 11, 2020)

an estimated 50 million US citizens  will be without some  form of health  insurance  by the end  of the year  , soup kitchens , banana republic levels  of application  of law ,  a corrupt  political elite  divorced  from its voting  base  and actively curtails the right for every citizen to vote   .... surley america should now  be considered  relegated from first world status .


----------



## quimcunx (May 11, 2020)

Tankus said:


> an estimated 50 million US citizens  will be without some  form of health  insurance  by the end  of the year  , soup kitchens , banana republic levels  of application  of law ,  a corrupt  political elite  divorced  from its voting  base  and actively curtails the right for every citizen to vote   .... surley america should now  be considered  relegated from first world status .


----------



## petee (May 11, 2020)




----------



## spring-peeper (May 11, 2020)

Trump still thinks that the virus is an attempt to make him lose the next election.





> Donald Trump claims Democrats are trying to slow down reopening 'all over the USA' for 'political purposes' as he claims 'great credit' is being given to his response as deaths pass 80,000











						Trump claims Democrats want to slow reopening for 'political purposes'
					

President Donald Trump on Monday accused Democrats of playing 'politics' by keeping  states locked down, saying it was a ploy to harm his own chances of reelection.




					www.dailymail.co.uk


----------



## Tankus (May 11, 2020)

Trump just rage quit his own presser........ and the live feed was cut


----------



## Tankus (May 11, 2020)




----------



## two sheds (May 11, 2020)

Not a happy bunny


----------



## Tankus (May 11, 2020)

He can't handle women questioning him.... Now it's the Obama gate diversion, from over 80,000 dead


----------



## spring-peeper (May 12, 2020)

Unreleased White House report has coronavirus rates spiking in heartland
					

Trump's claim that cases are falling everywhere is contradicted by his own task force's report, obtained by NBC News, showing the virus spreading far from the coasts.




					www.nbcnews.com
				






> The 10 top areas recorded surges of 72.4 percent or greater over a seven-day period compared to the previous week, according to a set of tables produced for the task force by its data and analytics unit. They include Nashville, Tennessee; Des Moines, Iowa; Amarillo, Texas; and — atop the list, with a 650 percent increase — Central City, Kentucky.
> 
> On a separate list of "locations to watch," which didn't meet the precise criteria for the first set: Charlotte, North Carolina; Kansas City, Missouri; Omaha and Lincoln, Nebraska; Minneapolis; Montgomery, Alabama; Columbus, Ohio; and Phoenix. The rates of new cases in Charlotte and Kansas City represented increases of more than 200 percent over the previous week, and other tables included in the data show clusters in neighboring counties that don't form geographic areas on their own, such as Wisconsin's Kenosha and Racine counties, which neighbor each other between Chicago and Milwaukee.


----------



## editor (May 12, 2020)

| Pearl District, NW Portland, Oregon
					

Chiropractic health, wellness, and injury treatment in the Pearl District. 1030 NW Marshall St Portland, OR 97209. Phone: 503-227-2279



					www.hosmerchiropractic.com


----------



## scifisam (May 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Some attitude here
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Tankus said:


> an estimated 50 million US citizens  will be without some  form of health  insurance  by the end  of the year  , soup kitchens , banana republic levels  of application  of law ,  a corrupt  political elite  divorced  from its voting  base  and actively curtails the right for every citizen to vote   .... surley america should now  be considered  relegated from first world status .



Depends where in America. California is responding amazingly well. They're a state where tourism is one of the major sources of income, but they've extended the lockdown yet again. Because even if they opened it up to tourism now, not enough people would come to make it worthwhile opening the resorts. Opening Disney, for example, to a couple of thousand people would cost Disney more than they'd get in income, and then there'd be another spike. 

I'm also impressed by some of the Republican governors defying Trump. Odds are they'll be voted out next time they're up for election and they and their families will live weird lives with armed bodyguards until then due to credible threats. But at least they're trying.

A second US civil war is unlikely, but a more gradual change might happen.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 13, 2020)

scifisam said:


> I'm also impressed by some of the Republican governors defying Trump. Odds are they'll be voted out next time they're up for election and they and their families will live weird lives with armed bodyguards until then due to credible threats. But at least they're trying.



I have to agree with you on this point.
Iirc,  Cuomo of New York said this was a bipartisan problem, not red and blue.
He is working with his neighbouring states to make a decent plan.


----------



## quimcunx (May 13, 2020)

What You Need to Know
					






					forward.ny.gov
				




NY states roadmap for reopening the economy.


----------



## JimW (May 13, 2020)




----------



## Sue (May 13, 2020)

JimW said:


>


So the standouts are the apple pie/Tom Hanks ones -- the former obvs way too low, the latter way too high.


----------



## Sunray (May 13, 2020)

I must admit to being unable to stop reading C-19 news from the USA.  Its a large container ship crashing into the port in slow motion.
One of the more truthful YouTube news shows, an exasperated reporter said 'What are the chances, seriously!!! What are the chances of Donald Trump being leader of the country when a pandemic hits'. Yes, unlucky. 

Was thinking that unless USA gets a handle on C-19, the rest of the world will have to put a travel ban in place.  Sadly we all know Trump will lose his shit on the 1st country that does that.


----------



## petee (May 14, 2020)

_The state of Ohio won't deny unemployment benefits to people who refuse to work during the COVID-19 pandemic after people targeted the website it was using to track these workers, according to officials at the state’s Department of Job and Family Services (ODJFS).

The state previously set up a “fraud” website encouraging employers to report those who refused to go back on the job, angering workers and labor rights advocates. State officials say they are now reconsidering the policy after Motherboard reported that a hacker created a script to flood the “COVID-19 Fraud” website with junk data, with the goal of making it impossible to process these claims._









						Ohio Has Stopped Kicking Workers Off Unemployment After A Hacker Targeted Its Website
					

The state is reconsidering its policy after a hacker released a script that automatically submits junk data to its 'COVID-19 fraud' website, which allows employers to report workers who refuse to work during the pandemic.




					www.vice.com


----------



## scifisam (May 14, 2020)

petee said:


> _The state of Ohio won't deny unemployment benefits to people who refuse to work during the COVID-19 pandemic after people targeted the website it was using to track these workers, according to officials at the state’s Department of Job and Family Services (ODJFS).
> 
> The state previously set up a “fraud” website encouraging employers to report those who refused to go back on the job, angering workers and labor rights advocates. State officials say they are now reconsidering the policy after Motherboard reported that a hacker created a script to flood the “COVID-19 Fraud” website with junk data, with the goal of making it impossible to process these claims._
> 
> ...



I love it when hackers use their skills for good


----------



## hegley (May 14, 2020)

Sue said:


> So the standouts are the apple pie/Tom Hanks ones -- the former obvs way too low, the latter way too high.


I'd be more concerned about only 76% feeling positive about kittens. WTF is wrong with the other 24%, the monsters!


----------



## ska invita (May 14, 2020)

US unemployment hits 36 million claimants

this is one mad graph


----------



## weltweit (May 14, 2020)

ska invita said:


> US unemployment hits 36 million claimants
> 
> this is one mad graph
> 
> View attachment 212514


Is that a genuine FT chart, because it isn't like them to muddle their words like that?


----------



## ska invita (May 14, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Is that a genuine FT chart, because it isn't like them to muddle their words like that?


yeah i screenshot it from the website.... mustve rushed it. its been corrected now. 




__





						Subscribe to read | Financial Times
					

News, analysis and comment from the Financial Times, the worldʼs leading global business publication




					www.ft.com


----------



## spring-peeper (May 14, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Was thinking that unless USA gets a handle on C-19, the rest of the world will have to put a travel ban in place.  Sadly we all know Trump will lose his shit on the 1st country that does that.



And, sadly, I think it will Canada that will be the first country.
Right now, we have a non-essential travel restriction.  But it ends in June.


----------



## Sunray (May 14, 2020)

Having spent a fair amount of time in the US over the last few years, I really think what's happening to them is very sad.  Once you understand the US government attitude is entirely divorced from the majority of normal American people.  

Even the really ignorant ones that probably voted for Trump, are lovely. I think this is generally obscured by the warmongering from their ruling classes.


----------



## petee (May 14, 2020)

KINGSTON, N.Y. — A barber who was cutting hair in a Midtown shop, in violation of the "New York on Pause" order, has tested positive for COVID-19, the Ulster County health commissioner said Wednesday afternoon. 



			https://www.dailyfreeman.com/news/local-news/kingston-barber-tests-positive-for-covid-19-after-cutting-hair-in-violation-of-ny-order/article_932aa858-9565-11ea-b86d-bf0d85310eb1.html


----------



## Artaxerxes (May 15, 2020)

ska invita said:


> US unemployment hits 36 million claimants
> 
> this is one mad graph
> 
> View attachment 212514



Christ I thought that line was an axis border not part of the chart.


----------



## Yossarian (May 15, 2020)

Looks like Trump is going full Bolsonaro: He retweeted some clown in Florida who posted a video of people in a bar and said: "Uh oh, wouldn’t want the Commies in blue states to see us Floridians all out at bars having a good time with no face masks. Might destroy their narrative that everyone’s gonna die if we don’t live in a bubble forever."


----------



## frogwoman (May 15, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Looks like Trump is going full Bolsonaro: He retweeted some clown in Florida who posted a video of people in a bar and said: "Uh oh, wouldn’t want the Commies in blue states to see us Floridians all out at bars having a good time with no face masks. Might destroy their narrative that everyone’s gonna die if we don’t live in a bubble forever."



abe11825 is in Florida. I think her thoughts may be somewhat different


----------



## Dogsauce (May 15, 2020)

ska invita said:


> US unemployment hits 36 million claimants
> 
> this is one mad graph
> 
> View attachment 212514



too fucking easy to sack people, they have shit employment rights there. Would be the same here if the cunts could have their way.


----------



## ska invita (May 15, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> too fucking easy to sack people, they have shit employment rights there. Would be the same here if the cunts could have their way.


also theyve had fuck all money from the state from what i can see $1000? Doesn't get your far
it'll be "interesting" to see what happens in the UK on 1st August when furlough money is reduced and employers have to make up the payments. I expect a lot of redundancies


----------



## Tankus (May 16, 2020)

> States are announcing deep Medicaid cuts due to budget shortfalls stemming from the coronavirus pandemic, at the same time that millions of people lose their employer-based health coverage
> US unemployment hits 36 million claimants.
> A study by the Urban Institute estimated that about 40% of people who lose their jobs in the 14 states that still refuse to expand Medicaid will be left with no coverage at all  ...........Medicaid, which is one of the largest programs funded by states, covers about 70 million low-income adults and children — the same population that has been hit hardest by the coronavirus











						States cut Medicaid as millions lose health coverage amid pandemic
					

States are slashing Medicaid budgets due to shortfalls as more than 25 million laid-off workers expect to lose their employer-based coverage.




					www.salon.com
				



A first world country...., the richest  in the world  ? ....

on top of the 90k dead

and just to rub it in  
Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY)states that any new coronavirus relief bill must  include liability protections for corporations that get their employees infected. 








						Opinion | McConnell’s Rush to Protect Businesses Endangers Everyone Else (Published 2020)
					

To reopen safely, companies need good, clear and mandatory guidelines, not immunity from liability.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## abe11825 (May 16, 2020)

Attached photos are from the Republican Office near where I live, and the Trump clothing options are for those who feel their Oompa-Loompa-orange tanned, bleach haired god will allow them to do whatever they want, should they wear something other than a MAGA hat. The clothes were at various stalls in the flea market close to downtown (it's actually closer to the 'hood').  All pictures taken around the beginning of February... right before the full swing of lockdown happened here. 

frogwoman - we might have passed the Republican Office, but I don't think we went to the flea market... I know I wanted to take you there at one point. In reference - it's passed the nature center we went to, but close to that area of town.

People *love* the MAGA hat - you don't want to know how many people I see a week at my job, who are wearing various incarnations of that head piece (camouflage, US flag, etc).

With all the lists of lockdowns and social distancing, we're now having to go two steps backwards. Just when you thought phase 1 of reopen the state meant something good, it's not. Beaches recently got to open up (figuratively speaking, "in waves") in SWFL but some dumb fuckers from the East Coast and a little more south of me, decided to come this way to troll our beaches. Like someone previously reported about Fort Lauderdale back in April, that was a similar scene in Naples. A little more crowded though. So now there was talk about beaches closing again. Retail stores aren't accepting returns of clothing right now as they closed their fitting rooms for trying things on. Restaurants that rely on buffets or partial buffets are closing. A local salad bar restaurant announced permanent closure last week. Because of the meat shortage, barbecue places have limited items to offer right now. Fast food places are not allowing soda fountain fills... although I was in a gas station yesterday and was able to get myself a cup of hot chocolate... even though they aren't offering coffee, like most places.

All the snow birds that are still here can't go home because no state is allowing any travel - people are being ridiculed and shamed for traveling. So some of my neighbors want to go home to their summer homes. Like my Michigan friends, who usually leave this week, now can't as MI just had a snow storm and since they have to drive, they don't want to risk stopping every couple hours (one of them is 90+ years old). Nor do they want to quarantine for 14 days.

Someone my mom knows, arrived in Florida from Connecticut the other day, and they were treated like criminals. The guy went to the pool in his community and someone asked him where he's been for the last few weeks because no one has seen him. He said he arrived from CT the night prior and he was immediately told to get out of the pool. He was walked back to his condo by the person asking him where he has been, and he was told that he and his wife can not leave their condo for the next 14 days... that means *no* unpacking the car, *no* shopping for necessities, *nothing*. They are being forced to be house bound for the next two weeks.

People are choosing their own adventure with the face masks and gloves, but there are a lot of people who are wearing both when I've gone out and shopped. Yes, I've gone shopping. I also live with my 70+ year old mother, and she goes shopping about twice a week as well. Sometimes she goes with our 80+ year old neighbor... just to get the necessities or be able to get out and pick up some things not on a normal list. Yes, we all wear masks and gloves, and all the shopping buggies are disinfected. My job is half assingly enforcing the masks and gloves rule, but with 1200 employees working for 2400+ residents, it's a little hard. Although, we get temperature checked and questioned when we get into work.

The questions include "Have you been out of the area over the last 24 hours?", "Have you been around anyone confirmed with Covid-19 / Coronavirus?", "Have you been to any of the hot spots such as New York, Connecticut, Cuba or New Orleans this week?", "Are you feeling any of the symptoms?" and much more. It's really a 12 question check, and if you answer 'yes' to any of them, you're immediately turned around and told to go home. Everyone I know have admitted they think it's dumb as rocks because you can lie for all the questions and a single temperature check does nothing to confirm anything.

There are plenty of people who work with my company that are not working because they are part time or on call people. Only groups working are full time people and most got their job descriptions shifted as their job is no longer relevant... like me. I'm doing something completely different. Yet my job said that if you decline doing that new job, they are taking it as you quit, and you will be walked to your car and asked to vacate the premises.

Some of my friends, half I've known for 20+ years, others I've met over the last 10, are out of work. Trying to apply for the dole is moot as they all got denied. One was told she didn't make the required 500 hours of working time from the start of her employment to the time she was told to not come in. Another just started an amazing job and was kept on for as long as possible, but when let go, she too was told similar things about hours worked, although her job has "promises" of rehire.

My area of Florida sucks for work normally during the year - we are seasonal. Basically Halloween (Oct. 31) to Easter (whenever it falls - March or April), the economy is booming because of snow birds - people who "winter in Florida". Once Easter hits, they all go home to their summer places and businesses can go from over 100 workers full time to 20, at best, part time. Once this virus is done, there's no way we can easily recover from it. It'll take years for local businesses to get back to "normal", whatever that will be. I know it'll be like that around the globe, but there are some places that are so reliant on tourists, that they will be the ones hit the hardest.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 16, 2020)

^^^^^

Thanks, abe11825!!!

I was looking at the images.
I think the cut outs of Trump and Pence a little wierd.


----------



## abe11825 (May 16, 2020)

spring-peeper - the cut outs are life sized and can be purchased. You are totally correct - they're weird. 

I know someone who has a Trump cut out in her house and actually holds parties in his honor. This same woman is a businesswoman (co-owns a local construction company) who calls herself a feminist, Chabad / Ultra Orthodox Jew supporter, and ultimately a full fledged Trump supporter. She feels he's such an amazing person, she will fight you to the death if you do any sort of nay saying. Even if it's not in reference to him, she will take it like you've committed acts of treason and will argue with you to take it back or take down the post on social network sites. 

I have nothing to do with her, as she's the boss of my cousin. In turn, I don't have much to do with my cousin at the moment because there have been other issues. But she will support this woman through thick and thin even though my cousin doesn't agree with it all. They do things together - when the woman does "challah baking nights" or other things relating to the religion, my cousin will go and help and do everything, as well as bite her tongue for the Trump parties. I can't stand it. I don't stay in the room when my cousin comes over.


----------



## frogwoman (May 17, 2020)

Those pictures jeez


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 17, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> I think the cut outs of Trump and Pence a little wierd.



A 'little' weird?


----------



## abe11825 (May 17, 2020)

frogwoman - Next time you visit, if I'm still here, I'll take you to the flea market. You'll be able to take your own pictures... I'm sure by that point there may be an American President far worse than the Cheeto-in-Charge. I heard yesterday that the flea market is fully operational right now - they're open and people are swarming to get their cheap crap.  Do you remember us going to the Sweet Tomatoes restaurant? It's the one that relies on it being one big salad bar (plus soup/pasta/bread on the other side of the restaurant.. plus it had dated carpet throughout)? That's the place that has the permanent closure. I wonder about the sushi place we went to, though... they'll probably not open for a while either. 

Florida is a Republican state.. so you're going to get a lot of people that are full on Trump supporters who don't give a damn what or who you are, unless you're saying The Wig is complete shit (or alluding to it.. trust me... my cousin posted a meme on FB about businesses staying shut if local government offices won't open... and her boss started an all out war online about it... I've got an 11 page screen cap of how the woman is arguing with a friend of my cousin's [who is neutral on most things and tried raising some points about it] and it just went on). 

This place is grounds for the gun toting rednecks to show off what they own. Local gun shops sold out of ammunition and handguns right around when the lock down happened. Can't go to the shooting range, might as well shoot at each other? Crackers love them a good old fashioned show off. There are plenty of "lifted" trucks as well - SUVs and 4x4s have monster truck tires on them. A normal Ford Ranger could be lifted 25 inches extra off the ground because the owner chose to put super wide, super tall tires. I'll have to find some pictures of these cars... there have been times where the truck's tires go past my car window, and I drive a 2013 Hyundai Accent. I'll look out the window and see only tire - I barely see truck.


----------



## frogwoman (May 17, 2020)

Noooooo that sucks that sweet tomatoes is permanently closed  what about that red snapper place we went with your mum? abe11825


----------



## abe11825 (May 17, 2020)

frogwoman - Yup. It's too bad too. That place was pretty good. The restaurant we went to with my mum - was it when we went to the beach and sat next to the pier? That's still open - PierSide Grill. They actually just opened back up this weekend. 

A little over a week ago, Fort Myers Beach was only open in places to FMB residents only. Which means Fort Myers residents weren't allowed on the beaches just yet. The difference is, you have to own a house in that area of the city to be able to get to the sand. 

Short term rentals (aka "vacation rentals") in most places are not currently allowed - most landlords had to stop renting to people that wanted to be in the area for less than a couple months. Hotels / motels are trickling open but not at full capacity. 

FWIW, I'm located at the cusp near Fort Myers Beach and Sanibel. It's about 15 minutes drive to both. Can be 30 minute drive with winter traffic.

"local" news information:

The Beaches of Fort Myers and Sanibel | Covid-19 update
The Town of Fort Myers Beach | government page | Covid information
"Beachgoers enjoy reopening of Fort Myers Beach at a social distance" | news report from May 02 - this is not the beach where people overloaded and didn't follow directions. That one was in Naples. 
DeSantis opens gyms, restaurants, retail to 50% | posted on Friday


----------



## editor (May 17, 2020)

Off the scale nutjob











						Trump ‘Spiritual Adviser’ Paula White Imitates Queen Bee Dance to Declare End to the Coronavirus Pandemic
					

President Donald Trump's "spiritual advisor" Paula White awkwardly imitated a queen bee's dance in order to declare an end to the coronavirus pandemic during her ch




					newsvideoclip.tv


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 17, 2020)

editor said:


> Off the scale nutjob
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Barking fucking mad.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 17, 2020)

It’s also untrue.

The Queen Bee doesn’t dance. The honey bees dance.  The queen doesn’t come out of the hive until it’s time to swarm, and she doesn’t forage for honey.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 17, 2020)

How can they simultaneously not believe the virus is a problem, and also be praying for it to disappear in the name of Jesus?


----------



## two sheds (May 17, 2020)

And continue believing when the virus carries on oblivious to her prayers?



/looks round nervously


----------



## editor (May 17, 2020)

It's getting worse in Texas









						If Oxford's coronavirus vaccine works, officials say UK will get it first
					

The novel coronavirus pandemic has now killed more than 314,000 people worldwide and more than 4.6 million people across the globe have been diagnosed with COVID-19.




					abcnews.go.com


----------



## MickiQ (May 17, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Barking fucking mad.


I watched that all the way through and I still don't understand what the fuck she was talking about.


SheilaNaGig said:


> How can they simultaneously not believe the virus is a problem, and also be praying for it to disappear in the name of Jesus?


And that Sheila is the $64,000 question.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 17, 2020)

MickiQ said:


> I watched that all the way through and I still don't understand what the fuck she was talking about.
> 
> And that Sheila is the $64,000 question.




A related mystery is the disconnect between how the evangelical Christians have been cheerleading for the apocalypse for decades, and now they have a pandemic in their midst, they’re trying to pray it away. Surely a pandemic fits into the endtimes narrative? Why are they not celebrating the power of their mighty god? They’ve switched from evangelicals to blasphemers!


----------



## elbows (May 17, 2020)

Dont look for logic and consistency, they dont need to bother with such things. Because if they are full of shit and detached from reality at the best of timess, an infinite variety of newly appropriated bullshit is always available to respond to whatever circumstance they find themselves in during the bad times.

Anyway, the virus is a poor fit for a lot of their apocalyptic shit because that stuff often imagines that the true believers will be saved, eg beamed up in the rapture. This virus has other ideas, such as decimating congregations of all denominations.


----------



## abe11825 (May 17, 2020)

editor said:


> Off the scale nutjob
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Put this broad on mute and just watch the video. First she's exercising, then she's clubbing, then she's having some crazy seizure. Un-mute her and the verbal diarrhea coming out of her mouth makes you want to turn the speakers off again.


----------



## ska invita (May 17, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> How can they simultaneously not believe the virus is a problem, and also be praying for it to disappear in the name of Jesus?


Send your money in and you _might_ find out the deeper truth


----------



## Artaxerxes (May 17, 2020)

editor said:


> Off the scale nutjob
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It's the worker who scouts out and finds the food not the queen who does the dance as well.

Mentalist.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 17, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> This place is grounds for the gun toting rednecks to show off what they own. Local gun shops sold out of ammunition and handguns right around when the lock down happened. Can't go to the shooting range, might as well shoot at each other? Crackers love them a good old fashioned show off.
> 25 inches extra off the ground because the owner chose to put super wide, super tall tires. I'll have to find some pictures of these cars...



How do they feel about being called such derogatory names? I can't imagine that helps the already toxic situation...


----------



## abe11825 (May 17, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> How do they feel about being called such derogatory names? I can't imagine that helps the already toxic situation...



The ones I’ve met embrace the names. Usually they’re the ones that are the first to say it in conversation. It’s a badge of honor for most of them.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 17, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> The ones I’ve met embrace the names. Usually they’re the ones that are the first to say it in conversation. It’s a badge of honor for most of them.


I always thought that the redneck term was a mocking epithet on sunburnt necks, but then I read somewhere that the term actually came from protesters or union members wearing red scarves.

That could be bollocks, of course.


----------



## abe11825 (May 17, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> I always thought that the redneck term was a mocking epithet on sunburnt necks, but then I read somewhere that the term actually came from protesters or union members wearing red scarves.
> 
> That could be bollocks, of course.



No - allegedly that’s all true. What you’re read. But over the years it’s taken on a new life form and somehow made its way into other forms of descriptions. It’s hard to explain: it’s become a regional thing where the term has become something different and meant for the lifestyle of the area in a way. “It’s a southern thing”


----------



## Helen Back (May 17, 2020)

This guy's showing more leadership in one act than Trump has in his entire presidency. Future President Cuomo?


----------



## spring-peeper (May 17, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> I always thought that the redneck term was a mocking epithet on sunburnt necks, but then I read somewhere that the term actually came from protesters or union members wearing red scarves.
> 
> That could be bollocks, of course.




There in Canada, the term redneck is used a lot.
People who claim to be rednecks are those who use ingenuity.

It tends to be something that people (my son included) use the term with pride.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 17, 2020)

Helen Back said:


> This guy's showing more leadership in one act than Trump has in his entire presidency. Future President Cuomo?




He tends to act more like a Canadian than what we are seeing out of the majority of US officials.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 17, 2020)

Our neighbours ran redneck games for a couple of years.









						Summer Redneck games - in pictures
					

Mud pits, trotters and toilet seats are just some of the delights that face competitors at the Summer Redneck Games at Buckeye Park in East Dublin, Georgia




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## krtek a houby (May 17, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> No - allegedly that’s all true. What you’re read. But over the years it’s taken on a new life form and somehow made its way into other forms of descriptions. It’s hard to explain: it’s become a regional thing where the term has become something different and meant for the lifestyle of the area in a way. “It’s a southern thing”



Iirc, the name has been used in a positive way. Grassroots movements like Redneck Revolt...


----------



## abe11825 (May 17, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Iirc, the name has been used in a positive way. Grassroots movements like Redneck Revolt...


I wasn’t trying to say it was a negative thing. The people I have met that use it, are prideful people and use it as such.
Yes there have been negative connotations but that’s to be said with other words used through out history as well.


----------



## yield (May 18, 2020)

Rednecks - In memory of the Battle of Blair Mountain



> The Battle of Blair Mountain was the largest organized armed uprising in American labor history and led almost directly to the labor laws currently in effect in the United States of America. For nearly a week in late August and early September 1921, in Logan County, West Virginia, between 10,000 and 15,000 coal miners confronted company-paid private detectives in an effort to unionize the southwestern West Virginia mine counties.


----------



## sideboob (May 18, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> I always thought that the redneck term was a mocking epithet on sunburnt necks, but then I read somewhere that the term actually came from protesters or union members wearing red scarves.
> 
> That could be bollocks, of course.


It was the Crackers bit that bothered me.  Rednecks wear the name like a badge of honour, you can search youtube although I dont reccomend it.


----------



## editor (May 18, 2020)

Idiots










						US lockdown protests may have spread virus widely, cellphone data suggests
					

Devices associated with protesters travelled up to hundreds of miles after rallies where few precautions were taken




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Marty1 (May 18, 2020)

Tankus said:


>



Tbh, most of those ‘journalists’ are just a bunch of activists who are hostile to the current administration no matter how good or bad any situation is, they constantly attempt to bait Trump who usually rises to it.  In that situation in the clip Trump was better off concluding the presser imo as the clear attempt by the ‘journalists’ attempting to quickly escalate the situation serves as nothing but a clickbait distraction from the issues at hand regarding the pandemic.


----------



## Artaxerxes (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Tbh, most of those ‘journalists’ are just a bunch of activists who are hostile to the current administration no matter how good or bad any situation is, they constantly attempt to bait Trump who usually rises to it.  In that situation in the clip Trump was better off concluding the presser imo as the clear attempt by the ‘journalists’ attempting to quickly escalate the situation serves as nothing but a clickbait distraction from the issues at hand regarding the pandemic.



Tough biased questions like "What is Obamagate?" or "What policies are you enacting" or my favourite "What are you actually doing you insane bewigged orange turnip?"


----------



## krtek a houby (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Tbh, most of those ‘journalists’ are just a bunch of activists who are hostile to the current administration no matter how good or bad any situation is, they constantly attempt to bait Trump who usually rises to it.  In that situation in the clip Trump was better off concluding the presser imo as the clear attempt by the ‘journalists’ attempting to quickly escalate the situation serves as nothing but a clickbait distraction from the issues at hand regarding the pandemic.



How are they "activists" and what questions should they be asking the man baby? Or should they just disperse with doing their job and crawl up his arse, instead?


----------



## Marty1 (May 18, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> How are they "activists" and what questions should they be asking the man baby? Or should they just disperse with doing their job and crawl up his arse, instead?



Well another example of these supposed journalists simply being a bunch of activist hacks is there use of masks as props - they don’t wear them and mingle amongst each other prior and after the pressers (when they think the coast is clear from live cameras are recording).


----------



## krtek a houby (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Well another example of these supposed journalists simply being a bunch of activist hacks is there use of masks as props - they don’t wear them and mingle amongst each other prior and after the pressers (when they think the coast is clear from live cameras are recording).
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 213250



Not surprising, at all, you'd use a Trump spawn to push your transparent agenda.

Again, what kind of questions should they be asking him?

Or is it better just to sit back and swallow the lies about testing in the US?


----------



## Ax^ (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Tbh, most of those ‘journalists’ are just a bunch of activists who are hostile to the current administration no matter how good or bad any situation is, they constantly attempt to bait Trump who usually rises to it.  In that situation in the clip Trump was better off concluding the presser imo as the clear attempt by the ‘journalists’ attempting to quickly escalate the situation serves as nothing but a clickbait distraction from the issues at hand regarding the pandemic.



what the fuck have you been smoking?

meth like most trump supporters


----------



## Marty1 (May 18, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Not surprising, at all, you'd use a Trump spawn to push your transparent agenda.
> 
> Again, what kind of questions should they be asking him?
> 
> Or is it better just to sit back and swallow the lies about testing in the US?



Nice swerve.  How about you address the hacks taking their masks off as soon as presser ends then mingling amongst each other like they’re at a dinner party?

Or are these bunch of jokers ok with you as long as they are shovelling shit towards the WH?


----------



## Shirl (May 18, 2020)

Edited because I'm a dopy bitch and put it in the wrong  thread.


----------



## 8ball (May 18, 2020)

Shirl said:


> Mare and foal, duck in a ditch and cat in a field.
> 
> View attachment 213252View attachment 213253View attachment 213254



But how will you get them all across the river in your boat without a catastrophic slaughter?


----------



## Cid (May 18, 2020)

Shirl said:


> Mare and foal, duck in a ditch and cat in a field.
> 
> View attachment 213252View attachment 213253View attachment 213254



And... this is in America is it Shirl?


----------



## two sheds (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Nice swerve.  How about you address the hacks taking their masks off as soon as presser ends then mingling amongst each other like they’re at a dinner party?
> 
> Or are these bunch of jokers ok with you as long as they are shovelling shit towards the WH?



The one who did it was an idiot. If she was putting herself or anyone else in danger by not wearing one.


How do you feel about Trump not wearing one at all? Or is he ok with you as long as he's shoveling shit towards everyone except the rich?


----------



## krtek a houby (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Nice swerve.  How about you address the hacks taking their masks off as soon as presser ends then mingling amongst each other like they’re at a dinner party?
> 
> Or are these bunch of jokers ok with you as long as they are shovelling shit towards the WH?



Hacks, jokers, activists. 

It'll be enemies of the people, next.

As long as you keep promoting the Trump way, you're going to be pulled up on it.

The guy is more concerned about big business and protecting employers than workers.

And he lies, deflects and belittles women when they ask important questions.


----------



## JimW (May 18, 2020)

The impertinence of questioning the Dear Leader! What could be more unAmerican than a free press?


----------



## Marty1 (May 18, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Hacks, jokers, activists.
> 
> It'll be enemies of the people, next.
> 
> ...





Who needs masks anyway?


----------



## two sheds (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Who needs masks anyway?




"Everyone here's been vaccinated anyway"??


----------



## krtek a houby (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Who needs masks anyway?




Third time asking, what questions should they be asking him?


----------



## Shirl (May 18, 2020)

Cid said:


> And... this is in America is it Shirl?


Dopy today


----------



## krtek a houby (May 18, 2020)

Oh yes, and Eric fucking Trump...

Eric Trump, 36, spoke to the Fox News host Jeanine Pirro on Saturday night. He accused Democrats of using the coronavirus outbreak for political and electoral gain.

“You watch,” he said, “they’ll milk it every single day between now and 3 November [election day]. And guess what, after 3 November, coronavirus will magically, all of a sudden, go away and disappear and everybody will be able to reopen.”

Trump sons provoke outrage with baseless attacks on Biden and lockdown


----------



## Part 2 (May 18, 2020)

When did this 'pressers' term start? 

It's a really fucking irritating Americanism.


----------



## petee (May 18, 2020)

Helen Back said:


> This guy's showing more leadership in one act than Trump has in his entire presidency. Future President Cuomo?



could well be. he's been  pushed forward for a while and had to explicitly deny that he'd run for president before the last gubernatorial election here in NYS (so voters would know that he'd serve out his term).

btw, i'm no cuomo fan. he's an administrative thug who seems to need to degrade people he thinks of as rivals, the most glaring example of which is deblasio, who was actually ahead of cuomo on the idea of a lockdown, and when cuomo announced the PAUSE order it really felt like he was playing catch-up.


----------



## Ax^ (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Who needs masks anyway?




do you ever look at the people you link to on youtube

his subscriptions are interesting

wait a moment nvrmind

you posted a tweet from Eric trump


----------



## spring-peeper (May 18, 2020)

Part 2 said:


> When did this 'pressers' term start?
> 
> It's a really fucking irritating Americanism.




First time I heard it, it was from Marty1.


----------



## Marty1 (May 18, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> First time I heard it, it was from Marty1.











						C19: Trump Pressers
					

Has anyone been watching these? They seem to be daily between 9pm to 11pm our time.  They are off the scale.  Today Trump is obsessed with the viewing figures of his press conferences. Not a word of sympathy for the families of the deceased. They are election broadcasts.




					www.urban75.net


----------



## Marty1 (May 18, 2020)

JimW said:


> The impertinence of questioning the Dear Leader! What could be more unAmerican than a free press?



They’re asking questions - they just don’t like the answers - especially from Kayleigh McEnany (just looks how the Guardian characterises this clip in its description).



But, as I’ve already shown - as soon as these pressers end and cameras are off - these journos take their masks off and mingle with each other.

It’s pure pantomime.


----------



## Ax^ (May 18, 2020)

So why have 90000 people died in the US?


----------



## Yossarian (May 18, 2020)

That video's from an April 22 presser - before guidance on masks was updated, and before the White House started requiring masks for most non-Trumps.









						Video misrepresents journalists’ comments in White House briefing room
					

CLAIM: Video caught comments between Fox News and New York Times journalists revealing they believe COVID-19 was a “hoax.”  AP’S ASSESSMENT: False. A video feed that was actively recording...




					apnews.com
				






> Roberts told the AP in a phone interview that the comments were “sardonic gallows humor.” He said that he and Mills are friends and that Mills wears a mask every day.
> 
> Roberts also stressed that both he and Mills are treating the virus seriously, and do not believe in conspiracy theories around the virus.
> 
> ...


----------



## spring-peeper (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> C19: Trump Pressers
> 
> 
> Has anyone been watching these? They seem to be daily between 9pm to 11pm our time.  They are off the scale.  Today Trump is obsessed with the viewing figures of his press conferences. Not a word of sympathy for the families of the deceased. They are election broadcasts.
> ...




So, what?

You are the first person I heard/read use the word pressers.


----------



## Yossarian (May 18, 2020)

Presser isn't a term I'd heard that often before but it seems kind of apt - when reporters are allowed to ask questions, the pressure tends to make Trump either deflate or explode.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> They’re asking questions - they just don’t like the answers - especially from Kayleigh McEnany (just looks how the Guardian characterises this clip in its description).
> 
> 
> 
> ...




What questions should they be asking brave Sir Donald?


----------



## elbows (May 18, 2020)

I wonder if germaphobe Trump decided to go down this route because he did not react well to his valet testing positive earlier this month. Either way, I no longer want him to die of the virus, now I want him to die of 'the cure' instead.









						Coronavirus: Trump says he is taking unproven drug hydroxychloroquine
					

The president claims hydroxychloroquine is harmless but regulators warn it may cause heart problems.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				






> "I'm taking it for about a week and a half now and I'm still here, I'm still here," he said.





> Asked on Monday what was his evidence of the drug's positive benefits, Mr Trump said: "Here's my evidence, I get a lot of positive calls about it."





> When asked whether the White House physician recommended he start taking the drug, Mr Trump said he had asked about it himself.
> 
> "I asked him, what do you think? He said, 'well, if you'd like it', I said yeah, I'd like it."





> Mr Trump also told reporters on Monday hydroxychloroquine "seems to have an impact".
> 
> "And maybe it does, maybe it doesn't, but if it doesn't, you're not going to get sick and die."
> 
> He added: "I've heard a lot of good stories and if it's not good, I'll tell you right I'm not going to get hurt by it."


----------



## Marty1 (May 18, 2020)

elbows said:


> I wonder if germaphobe Trump decided to go down this route because he did not react well to his valet testing positive earlier this month. Either way, I no longer want him to die of the virus, now I want him to die of 'the cure' instead.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



He’s taking hydroxychloroquine with azithromycin and zinc, which apparently is a trifecta combo that has had positive clinical results.









						Adding zinc to hydroxychloroquine improved some coronavirus patients
					

A new study from NYU Grossman found that patients who got a combination of zinc, hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin were more likely to recover and less likely to die.




					www.dailymail.co.uk


----------



## spring-peeper (May 18, 2020)

This story really falls under "stupid things trump did".


----------



## spring-peeper (May 18, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> He’s taking hydroxychloroquine with azithromycin and zinc, which apparently is a trifecta combo that has had positive clinical results.



Does it really matter?
It is unproven and should not be advertised as a preventive tonic.


----------



## Yossarian (May 19, 2020)

If I had an elderly relative who was taking a dangerous combination of drugs in the misguided belief it would ward off the coronavirus, I'd have stern words with them.

Unless the relative was Donald Trump, in which case I wouldn't give a shit.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 19, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> This story really falls under "stupid things trump did".



It does, but far right Marty1 is banned from that (and a few other) thread.


----------



## maomao (May 19, 2020)

elbows said:


> I wonder if germaphobe Trump decided to go down this route because he did not react well to his valet testing positive earlier this month. Either way, I no longer want him to die of the virus, now I want him to die of 'the cure' instead.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I bet the doctors are giving him sugar pills and nodding a lot. If he does die, hope it hurts.


----------



## weltweit (May 19, 2020)

Apparently Trump has a small stake (about £1k) in Sanofi the makers of Plaquenil (chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine). Some of Trump's associates also have financial ties to Sanofi, according to The Times.


----------



## maomao (May 19, 2020)

weltweit said:


> about £1k


A thousand pounds? That much?


----------



## weltweit (May 19, 2020)

maomao said:


> A thousand pounds? That much?


Yes, apparently, not much indeed - but that doesn't mean others don't stand to gain if the product is adopted by Trump.


----------



## Ax^ (May 19, 2020)

I'll be more interested when he starts injecting bleach


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 19, 2020)

The really shitty thing about Trump using hydroxychloroquine (and the resulting increase of numbers of people wanting to copy him) is that people who really do need the drug will find it more difficult to get hold of it.  And some of those people will die.


----------



## Cid (May 19, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Yes, apparently, not much indeed - but that doesn't mean others don't stand to gain if the product is adopted by Trump.



If he does presumably that’s part of some diversified portfolio that includes thousands of stocks. Which raises its own problems to do with the president holding investments, all the details of which I’ve now forgotten.


----------



## Tankus (May 19, 2020)

diversified portfolio ?  flat out diversion   ......... _women back  in the kitchen  washing dishes _ ! ....bread and  circuses for the media   .....mean while  the body count  mounts


----------



## Badgers (May 20, 2020)

Really good article this. Homeless under lockdown in LA. 









						6 Feet Back From Life: A Homeless Man's Photo Essay On Life During Coronavirus
					

For people experiencing homelessness, COVID-19 is more of a lockout than a lockdown. Bumdog Torres shares what it's like to live outside during the pandemic.




					laist.com


----------



## Gimigimi (May 20, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Apparently Trump has a small stake (about £1k) in Sanofi the makers of Plaquenil (chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine). Some of Trump's associates also have financial ties to Sanofi, according to The Times.


Yeah, he might just be making a buck off this somehow and not even be taking the stuff. Get a bunch of idiots to hurt themselves to raise a stock price? Wouldn't put it past him. It's nonsensical for him to take it, I've only ever heard of doctors using it as a last resort for people who already have a serious infection. If it has some effect it's in suppressing an active infection, it's not fucking preventative medicine and it has a lot of side effects regardless.


----------



## magneze (May 20, 2020)

Side effects can be:

Anxiety
attempts at killing oneself
back, leg, or stomach pains
black, tarry stools
bleeding gums
blistering, peeling, or loosening of the skin
blood in the urine or stools
blurred or decreased vision
change in near or distance vision
chest discomfort or pain
chills
cold sweats
confusion
continuing ringing or buzzing or other unexplained noise in the ears
cough
dark urine
diarrhea
difficulty in focusing the eyes
difficulty with speaking
difficulty with swallowing
disturbed color perception
dizziness
dizziness, faintness, or lightheadedness when getting up suddenly from a lying or sitting position
double vision
drooling
fast, slow, irregular, or pounding heartbeat
feeling that others are watching you or controlling your behavior
feeling that others can hear your thoughts
feeling, seeing, or hearing things that are not there
fever
general tiredness and weakness
halos around lights
headache
hearing loss
inability to move the eyes
increased blinking or spasms of the eyelid
joint or muscle pain
large, hive-like swelling on the face, eyelids, lips, tongue, throat, hands, legs, feet, or sex organs
light-colored stools
loss of balance control
lower back or side pain
muscle trembling, jerking, or stiffness
muscular pain, tenderness, wasting, or weakness
night blindness
nausea
overbright appearance of lights
painful or difficult urination
pale skin
pinpoint red spots on the skin
puffiness or swelling of the eyelids or around the eyes, face, lips, or tongue
red skin lesions, often with a purple center
red, irritated eyes
restlessness
shuffling walk
skin rash, hives, or itching
sore throat
sores, ulcers, or white spots on the lips or in the mouth
sticking out of the tongue
stiffness of the limbs
sweating
swollen or painful glands
tightness in the chest
trouble breathing
tunnel vision
twitching, twisting, or uncontrolled repetitive movements of the tongue, lips, face, arms, or legs
uncontrolled movements, especially of the face, neck, and back
unusual bleeding or bruising
unusual tiredness or weakness
upper right abdominal or stomach pain
vomiting
yellow eyes and skin


----------



## emanymton (May 20, 2020)

magneze said:


> Side effects can be:
> 
> Anxiety
> attempts at killing oneself
> ...


28 is oddly specific.


----------



## weltweit (May 20, 2020)

magneze said:


> Side effects can be:
> 
> Anxiety
> attempts at killing oneself
> ...


A mahoosive list, I can't imagine willingly taking a poison with so many likely side effects. 
You would have to be mad. 
Oh wait ..


----------



## two sheds (May 20, 2020)

emanymton said:


> 28 is oddly specific.



I thought that


----------



## Zapp Brannigan (May 20, 2020)

emanymton said:


> 28 is oddly specific.



I thought that, and then you wrote it


----------



## Zapp Brannigan (May 20, 2020)

Zapp Brannigan said:


> I thought that, and then you wrote it



And then I read the last post 



two sheds said:


> I thought that


----------



## Cid (May 20, 2020)

magneze said:


> Side effects can be:
> 
> Anxiety
> attempts at killing oneself
> ...



Would he notice any of these though?


----------



## Cid (May 20, 2020)

Ok, he doesn't appear to have anxiety or suicidal thoughts, but the rest of it.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 20, 2020)

I reckon either the doctors are giving him a sugar pill and telling him it’s hydroxychloroqhine, or he’s just not bothered by by the effects. He’s not fully human though, is he. He’s some kind of zombie. For one reason or another, or a raft of reasons, he’s shut off some essential part of himself. So even if his physiology might be experiencing some of the less desirable effects, he won’t be conscious of them. His driving priority is to win at all and any cost, and so he powers through. Like the champion in the boxing ring or on the upper reaches of Alp D’Huez. Do or die. It’s this sense of being a champion, against the odds, pile driving through the minor details like _feelings_ and _connection_ that give him utter conviction in his own superiority.

He’s “superhuman” , or “extra-human” ; he’s off on some alien level of human behaviour. I’m not going to say he’s not human, because of course it’s dangerous to de-humanise our monstrous brethren, we're all capable of sliding into despicable behaviour. But he’s not altogether normal, is he. He’s a fucking zombie. If he ever was human, something happened that cauterised his humanity.

And it’s this “extra” quality that makes people admire him and lionise him. They wish they were as successful without feelings. They admire his ability to traverse the world and win with no fucking feelings. He is the king of the people who wish not to feel or connect. That’s Trump’s superpower, not feeling anything. The people who like him and support him, they hate their own feelings, and that’s why they laude him.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 20, 2020)




----------



## petee (May 20, 2020)

barber makes off with $501 for one haircut 

_A political activist from New Orleans who once pleaded “no contest” to masturbating during an Uber ride paid a Brooklyn barber $500 to open for the day in a publicity stunt protesting coronavirus lockdown restrictions — but was quickly cut short by cops. _









						NYPD shut down Brooklyn barbershop after activist pays owner $500 to open
					

Police closed down Beard Barberia Cut & Shave in Williamsburg just minutes after Liberate America founder Frank Scurlock cut his girlfriend’s hair for $1 as part of the stunt, but neither…




					nypost.com


----------



## quimcunx (May 20, 2020)

So apparently trump is recalling the national guard after 89 days. At 90 days they would qualify for GI bill  benefits.









						Trump Administration to End National Guard COVID Deployments One Day Before GI Bill Benefits Kick In
					

Members will have put their health on the line via 89 days of active duty, but 90 are required before they can get help paying for education.




					slate.com


----------



## Sprocket. (May 20, 2020)

quimcunx said:


> So apparently trump is recalling the national guard after 89 days. At 90 days they would qualify for GI bill  benefits.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


They will still vote for him though.


----------



## Marty1 (May 20, 2020)

magneze said:


> Side effects can be:
> 
> Anxiety
> attempts at killing oneself
> ...



Tell that to Costa Rica:









						Hydroxychloroquine: the drug Costa Rica uses successfully to fight covid-19
					

Used in the world for decades in the treatment of malaria, a month ago, the Caja Costarricense de Seguro Social (CCSS) decided to apply hydroxychloroquine to patients infected with the new coronavi…




					qcostarica.com


----------



## magneze (May 20, 2020)

Eh?


----------



## NoXion (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Tell that to Costa Rica:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You are such a fucking idiot. Just because Costa Rica are using that drug doesn't mean that there aren't any side effects, and nor does it mean that it's an effective treatment for Covid-19. Are you fundamentally incapable of telling the difference between an article from a news website, and a paper published in a reputable peer-reviewed medical journal?

If you *can* tell the difference, then what was the fucking point of your post?


----------



## maomao (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Tell that to Costa Rica:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If they're using it they would be aware of and dealing with the side effects already. Are you trying to say it has no side effects?



emanymton said:


> 28 is oddly specific.



'Thought broadcasting' is a common symptom of serious mental illnesses including schizophrenia. If you just called it that in a side effect list I suppose  it would read like thoughts were actually being broadcast so they have described it instead.


----------



## Yossarian (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Tell that to Costa Rica:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Magneze: "Here are some side effects of hydroxychloroquine."

Marty1: "But what about this month-old story from Costa Rica, which mentions the side effects?"



> "Regarding adverse effects, she said that among the most common are blurred vision, vomiting, and sometimes diarrhea and headache."


----------



## Marty1 (May 21, 2020)

magneze said:


> Eh?



Eh indeed.

Hydroxychloroquine has around the same amount of side effects as paracetamol.

The Costa Rica example is interesting as it deviates from the narrative most of the Western media are reporting.


----------



## existentialist (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Eh indeed.
> 
> Hydroxychloroquine has around the same amount of side effects as paracetamol.
> 
> The Costa Rica example is interesting as it deviates from the narrative most of the Western media are reporting.


No wonder you find it so alluring


----------



## maomao (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Hydroxychloroquine has around the same amount of side effects as paracetamol.


'Same amount of side effects' doesn't mean anything. Do you mean a similar number of listed side effects because I wouldn't be at all surprised as acetaminophen has been used by billions of people over many decades so there's a lot more data. If you mean 'as likely to cause side effects' then again that means fuck all unless they're the same side effects. And I'm pretty sure it can't mean 'causes the same side effects at the same frequency' because while that might mean something it's pretty much impossible.

What it is is a cheap alt right meme based around a deliberate false reading of a fact. The kind you see a lot of if you're either knee deep in US alt right bollocks constantly or actively trying to promote alt right memes. 

It's boring dumb shit and it shouldn't be allowed on here.


----------



## two sheds (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Eh indeed.
> 
> Hydroxychloroquine has around the same amount of side effects as paracetamol.
> 
> The Costa Rica example is interesting as it deviates from the narrative most of the Western media are reporting.



Do you have references to back up that the side effects are of similar seriousness and frequency? If not, you're promoting this stuff which could lead people to believe it is as safe as taking paracetamol. Which, if it is not true, would be dangerous conspiratorial nonsense of the kind people have been banned for before now.


----------



## maomao (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Eh indeed.
> 
> Hydroxychloroquine has around the same amount of side effects as paracetamol.
> 
> The Costa Rica example is interesting as it deviates from the narrative most of the Western media are reporting.


I've reported this as conspiracy theory because that's what it is.


----------



## existentialist (May 21, 2020)

maomao said:


> I've reported this as conspiracy theory because that's what it is.


Are there many threads left from which our favourite tinfoil hat delivery driving confidant of the Powers That Be has not been banned?


----------



## spring-peeper (May 21, 2020)

The White House is paying up to $600 million for dozens of N95 mask-washing machines that end up damaging them
					

Battelle said N95 masks are still safe to use after 20 washes in its machines. Medics told NBC News they were unfit for use after two or three.




					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## two sheds (May 21, 2020)

existentialist said:


> Are there many threads left from which our favourite tinfoil hat delivery driving confidant of the Powers That Be has not been banned?



Well this one for a start 



so far


----------



## maomao (May 21, 2020)

He's been trying to sell himself as just a dribbling idiot with an interest in US politics lately but I think purposely repeating very niche alt right memes disproves that. Not that he's not a dribbling idiot but Apple news doesn't just chuck that sort of shit at average users. A month old article no less.


----------



## magneze (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Eh indeed.
> 
> Hydroxychloroquine has around the same amount of side effects as paracetamol.
> 
> The Costa Rica example is interesting as it deviates from the narrative most of the Western media are reporting.


Fuck off with this dangerous shit. There are some of the same side effects but 'around the same amount' is just bollocks.


----------



## petee (May 21, 2020)

emanymton said:


> 28 is oddly specific.



true, but i had as a parent someone who believed that she knew what others were thinking. i mean, seriously. to the point of red-faced, screaming assertion, and she acted on her beliefs.
i did not have a happy childhood. it's a serious deal.
/sorry, derailment over now.


----------



## editor (May 21, 2020)

Marty1 said:


> Eh indeed.
> 
> Hydroxychloroquine has around the same amount of side effects as paracetamol.
> 
> The Costa Rica example is interesting as it deviates from the narrative most of the Western media are reporting.


Dangerous bollocks of the highest order. Warning given and you're banned off this thread now. Keep posting up conspiracy drivel like this and you'll end up like Dr Jazzz.


----------



## Ax^ (May 21, 2020)

Ed seriously what is the guys redeming feature that keeps him around

how many threads is he banned from now


just wondering why we are keeping him around whilst his hobby horse is dodgy right wing shit


----------



## editor (May 21, 2020)

Ax^ said:


> Ed seriously what is the guys redeming feature that keeps him around
> 
> how many threads is he banned from now
> 
> ...


This isn't the thread to discuss this but suffice to say his grip on these boards is becoming very tenuous.


----------



## Ax^ (May 21, 2020)

OK not going to start a call out  thread asking how many Threads he is banned from



but promising , i've been working thru this stuff so less exposed to it

putting up with some people during a lockdown must of been frustrating for some to the least


----------



## Yossarian (May 21, 2020)

existentialist said:


> Are there many threads left from which our favourite tinfoil hat delivery driving confidant of the Powers That Be has not been banned?



It seems to be a slow-motion, 'death by a thousand cuts' banning - by the end, he might be reduced to just saying 'Trump' on the 'word association' thread.


----------



## Supine (May 21, 2020)

ICU bed use is shooting up and lots are taken by younger people here:









						Montgomery running out of ICU beds as coronavirus cases double in May
					

Cases have spiked in Montgomery, filling intensive care beds at hospitals around the capital city




					www.al.com
				




Not good news for anyone who wants more relaxation in the US.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 21, 2020)

Supine said:


> ICU bed use is shooting up and lots are taken by younger people here:
> 
> 
> 
> ...












						North Carolina hospital nurse said patients attending coronavirus parties, intentionally trying to get the virus
					

The nurse said patients attend these parties to speed up the process of spreading the virus so America can get back to normal.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## weltweit (May 21, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> North Carolina hospital nurse said patients attending coronavirus parties, intentionally trying to get the virus
> 
> 
> The nurse said patients attend these parties to speed up the process of spreading the virus so America can get back to normal.
> ...


Why are American websites so rubbish?


----------



## Gimigimi (May 21, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> North Carolina hospital nurse said patients attending coronavirus parties, intentionally trying to get the virus
> 
> 
> The nurse said patients attend these parties to speed up the process of spreading the virus so America can get back to normal.
> ...



I've always known the political situation in the US was fucked up but I never managed to imagine that purposefully spreading a novel deadly disease would become fashionable. I feel like I'm getting first hand insight into the sort of cultural trends that have historically caused declining empires to collapse at accelerating rates rather than recognizing defects and self-correcting. Maybe I can write a book about it when I'm old if I survive that long.


----------



## editor (May 22, 2020)

Ah. It's the victim's fault. Of course!









						'All the psychoses of US history': how America is victim-blaming the coronavirus dead
					

As racism warps the US pandemic response, officials find ways to suggest people of color are at fault for their own deaths




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## CNT36 (May 22, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> Yeah, he might just be making a buck off this somehow and not even be taking the stuff. Get a bunch of idiots to hurt themselves to raise a stock price? Wouldn't put it past him. It's nonsensical for him to take it, I've only ever heard of doctors using it as a last resort for people who already have a serious infection. If it has some effect it's in suppressing an active infection, it's not fucking preventative medicine and it has a lot of side effects regardless.


The study involving NHS workers will look at whether it is any good as a prophylactic. Most of the evidence one way or another has been taken from retroactive studies.


----------



## Gimigimi (May 22, 2020)

CNT36 said:


> The study involving NHS workers will look at whether it is any good as a prophylactic. Most of the evidence one way or another has been taken from retroactive studies.


Interesting, I didn't know it was being studied as a prophylactic at all. I was under the impression that it was only being used to try to ameliorate symptoms in people who were already infected. I'm not a doctor so I'm not extremely up to date on research regarding the virus.


----------



## two sheds (May 22, 2020)

CNT36 said:


> The study involving NHS workers will look at whether it is any good as a prophylactic. Most of the evidence one way or another has been taken from retroactive studies.



Can't they use condoms like the rest of us?


----------



## CNT36 (May 22, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> Interesting, I didn't know it was being studied as a prophylactic at all. I was under the impression that it was only being used to try to ameliorate symptoms in people who were already infected. I'm not a doctor so I'm not extremely up to date on research regarding the virus.


It has been used for that as well. Those taking hydroxychloroquine had worse outcomes than others in the study. It was retroactive though and likely it was given to those who were already in a very bad way compared to those not given it.


----------



## spring-peeper (May 22, 2020)

Mississippi church fighting coronavirus restrictions burned to the ground
					

"Bet you stay home now you hypokrits" was written in parking lot at church that had sued the city over its public health orders.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 22, 2020)

I know I shouldn't, but that has made me laugh.   

Off to hell I go.


----------



## Badgers (May 22, 2020)

Britons not welcome in Greece until coronavirus infection rate declines, says tourism minister
					

‘The UK has a big difference in terms of the current medical status of the country with Greece,’ tourism minister Harry Theoharis told ITV




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## Supine (May 22, 2020)

Trumps drugs don't look great for Covid. Suprise suprise.


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 22, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Britons not welcome in Greece until coronavirus infection rate declines, says tourism minister
> 
> 
> ‘The UK has a big difference in terms of the current medical status of the country with Greece,’ tourism minister Harry Theoharis told ITV
> ...



And, this has what to do with Covid-19 in America?


----------



## Badgers (May 22, 2020)




----------



## Badgers (May 22, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> And, this has what to do with Covid-19 in America?


Whoops


----------



## editor (May 22, 2020)

Keep taking it, Trump 









						Hydroxychloroquine: Trump's Covid-19 'cure' increases deaths, global study finds
					

Malaria drug should not be used to treat coronavirus, scientists say, after study shows high death rate




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## krtek a houby (May 23, 2020)

Badgers said:


> View attachment 214008



They forgot to add "communist".


----------



## petee (May 23, 2020)

Badgers said:


> View attachment 214008



but joe biden


----------



## petee (May 23, 2020)

many tweeters in response to this are concerned with the use of the word "gentleman", which seems pretty screamingly obviously sarcastic.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 23, 2020)

Badgers said:


> View attachment 214008




I’m not good the recognising faces. Who is being “worse than Hitler”’d in that  banner?

They clearly made no effort to _irony_ it properly before bringing it out,


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 23, 2020)

petee said:


> many tweeters in response to this are concerned with the use of the word "gentleman", which seems pretty screamingly obviously sarcastic.





I always love it when people do that :

This gentleman was shouting vile abuse when suddenly...


----------



## Gimigimi (May 23, 2020)

petee said:


> many tweeters in response to this are concerned with the use of the word "gentleman", which seems pretty screamingly obviously sarcastic.



It is hopefully sarcastic, but guys like this are always treated with kid gloves by cops and media people who go out of their way to describe them as "very polite and reasonable", "remorseful and rational", "thought he was doing the right thing", etc. Just the other day I was looking at a fawning description by the NYT of that guy who went into Comet Ping-pong with a rifle to save the phantom children that 4chan told him were there:




			
				https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/07/us/edgar-welch-comet-pizza-fake-news.html said:
			
		

> “I just wanted to do some good and went about it the wrong way,” he said.
> (...)
> As he made his way to Washington, he felt his “heart breaking over the thought of innocent people suffering.” Once he got to the pizzeria, there was an abrupt change of plans. Mr. Welch would not say why he took a military-style assault rifle inside the restaurant and fired it. According to court documents, Mr. Welch said he had come armed to help rescue the children.
> (...)
> ...



I mean, come the fuck on. How would they describe this guy if he was inspired by left-wing conspiracies? To be honest, I have no idea how they'd describe insane, gun-toting, brainwashed left-wing conspiracists because there haven't fucking been any in this country for decades whereas the right shits these people out like it's addicted to laxatives.


----------



## NoXion (May 23, 2020)

petee said:


> but joe biden



Are you so deep in the collectives arses of the establishment Democrats that you can't see how fucking awful Biden is? Or is it all "fake news" to you?


----------



## petee (May 23, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> It is hopefully sarcastic



it's pretty screamingly obviously sarcastic, as said. your post from the NYT has nothing to do with my link, and you're preaching to the choir with me when you point that sort of thing out anyway, you know that yeh?
why does that exercise you more than the content of what that fuckheaded rightwinger did?


----------



## Gimigimi (May 23, 2020)

petee said:


> it's pretty screamingly obviously sarcastic, as said. your post from the NYT has nothing to do with my link, and you're preaching to the choir with me when you point that sort of thing out anyway, you know that yeh?
> why does that exercise you more than the content of what that fuckheaded rightwinger did?


It doesn't. I just happened to be reading that article yesterday and felt like having a rant about the media, sorry if it came across wrong; "come the fuck on" wasn't directed at you. I was trying to explain why other people might have had that response to the tweet. Didn't mean to offend.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (May 23, 2020)

Two native local-misfit Americans trying not to misunderstand each other through the medium of a lefty south London online forum.

:bless: emoji :cute-happy: emoji


----------



## spring-peeper (May 24, 2020)




----------



## Cid (May 24, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I’m not good the recognising faces. Who is being “worse than Hitler”’d in that  banner?
> 
> They clearly made no effort to _irony_ it properly before bringing it out,



California governor Gavin Newsom.


----------



## cyril_smear (May 24, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> View attachment 214376


he can do what he likes with his own money.


----------



## two sheds (May 24, 2020)

cyril_smear said:


> he can do what he likes with his own money.


He pays for his own golf trips and security?


----------



## Tankus (May 24, 2020)

he considers tax payers  money his  

When was the  last time  fort  knox was audited  ?


----------



## Tankus (May 24, 2020)

On Georgia's early reopening 


Tankus said:


> Georgia , as of  Friday the state has had 22,147 known cases, with 892 deaths   ,It'll interesting  to revisit these numbers in 3 weeks ...
> 
> let the experiment  begin


May 24th  42,838 know cases ,1,824 deaths  one  month  on from the last post.....
seems pretty flat




__





						georgia coronovirus deaths - Google Search
					





					www.google.com


----------



## cyril_smear (May 24, 2020)

two sheds said:


> He pays for his own golf trips and security?


yes


----------



## krtek a houby (May 24, 2020)

two sheds said:


> He pays for his own golf trips and security?



That would be the tax payer.How much does each of Donald Trump's golf rounds cost taxpayers?


----------



## two sheds (May 24, 2020)

cyril_smear said:


> yes











						How much does each of Donald Trump's golf rounds cost taxpayers?
					

How much does each of Donald Trump's golf rounds cost taxpayers? We look at the total cost of Trump playing golf has been incurred by taxpayers




					thegolfnewsnet.com


----------



## cyril_smear (May 24, 2020)

two sheds said:


> He pays for his own golf trips and security?


 every  current or ex prez gets the same treatment.


----------



## existentialist (May 24, 2020)

cyril_smear said:


> every  current or ex prez gets the same treatment.


I think you'll find that none of them have ripped the piss out of it quite in the way that the Tangerine has...


----------



## krtek a houby (May 24, 2020)

Golfing while people are dying is not a good look. Whether or not he pays for it.

And the taxpayer foots the bill.

Trump's golf outings have reportedly cost taxpayers more than $100 million


----------



## spring-peeper (May 24, 2020)

cyril_smear said:


> every  current or ex prez gets the same treatment.




Which other presidents owned their own golf course????



eta: never mind, you are an idiot with no clue what is going on.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 25, 2020)

As the death toll heads to 100 thousand, some are out enjoying the opening up of America

No social distancing here: Crowds pack Daytona Beach

Pool party at Lake of the Ozarks in Missouri shows people crowding closely together


----------



## phillm (May 25, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> A related mystery is the disconnect between how the evangelical Christians have been cheerleading for the apocalypse for decades, and now they have a pandemic in their midst, they’re trying to pray it away. Surely a pandemic fits into the endtimes narrative? Why are they not celebrating the power of their mighty god? They’ve switched from evangelicals to blasphemers!


When you can believe a human being comes back from the dead then you can and do believe almost anything.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 25, 2020)

phillm said:


> When you can believe a human being comes back from the dead then you can and do believe almost anything.



That happens a lot in apocalyptic end of days pandemics...


----------



## phillm (May 25, 2020)

Matryr1 is like Jazzz after a serious head injury.


----------



## elbows (May 25, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Golfing while people are dying is not a good look. Whether or not he pays for it.



A lesson that should have been learnt from this classic:


----------



## elbows (May 25, 2020)

> The World Health Organization has said it will temporarily drop hydroxychloroquine — the malaria drug Donald Trump said he is taking as a precaution — from its global study into experimental coronavirus treatments after safety concerns.
> 
> The WHO’s director-general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said in light of a paper published last week in the Lancet that showed people taking hydroxychloroquine were at higher risk of death and heart problems than those who were not, it would pause the hydroxychloroquine arm of its solidarity global clinical trial.
> 
> “The executive group has implemented a temporary pause of the hydroxychloroquine arm within the solidarity trial while the safety data is reviewed by the data safety monitoring board,” Tedros said on Monday. “The other arms of the trial are continuing,”











						WHO halts hydroxychloroquine trial for coronavirus amid safety fears
					

Malaria drug taken by Trump could raise risk of death and heart problems, study shows




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 25, 2020)

Just don't tell Trump.


----------



## Yossarian (May 26, 2020)

Trump's managed to up the Trumpiness by going from refusing to wear a mask to mocking his rival for wearing a mask.


----------



## krtek a houby (May 26, 2020)

What a strange world where masks can become politicized


----------



## editor (May 27, 2020)

This is what FREEDOM LOOKS LIKE, COMMIES!!!!





			https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/article242966241.html?fbclid=IwAR2phoZ2doABt2FNAiAJCDDT2lDYxevwi_BgHSF66egUECKEGqraLHt_hA8


----------



## High Voltage (May 27, 2020)

WW1 American death toll



> The USA lost more personnel to disease (63,114) than to combat (53,402), largely due to the influenza epidemic of 1918.



The current death total for CV19 has just blown through the 100k mark


----------



## phillm (May 27, 2020)

How Mask Mandates Were Beaten Down in Rural Oklahoma
					

In Oklahoma, where the state government is currently implementing one of the country’s fastest reopening plans, local leaders have found themselves caught between state politics, economic imperatives, and a clear scientific consensus.




					www.newyorker.com
				




_About sixty-five per cent of Oklahoma’s counties, including the one where Guthrie is located, lack a single I.C.U. bed. For them, the fear is not having as many coronavirus cases as Oklahoma City. It’s having as many as* Guymon, a town of eleven thousand in the western panhandle that now has more than seven hundred confirmed cases, the second most in the state, due to an outbreak at a pork-processing plant*. “A lot of these rural hospitals have either been cut back or closed,” Randolph Hubach, the director of the Sexual Health Research Lab at Oklahoma State University, who studies health outcomes in rural Oklahoma, told me. “The extent to which we’ve really hindered the capacity of rural communities and public health in general is starting to show in our incidence rates, but also in our death rates.”_


----------



## Sunray (May 27, 2020)

Fun fact:  US hospitals operate a JIT policy on equipment, which can make sense, why buy a $100,000 ventilator when you can rent one for the time you need it?


----------



## two sheds (May 27, 2020)

Assuming you can get them when you need them


----------



## Artaxerxes (May 28, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Fun fact:  US hospitals operate a JIT policy on equipment, which can make sense, why buy a $100,000 ventilator when you can rent one for the time you need it?



This is your brain on capitalism


----------



## Tankus (May 28, 2020)

blimey

nothing will happen...   unless someone dies in the house .....even then ...with Barr .......!  ..Nothing


----------



## editor (May 28, 2020)

Yeah! Masks are for PUSSIES!


----------



## petee (May 29, 2020)

editor said:


> Yeah! Masks are for PUSSIES!




this is widespread, on the net anyway, the "if you wear a mask you're a coward and a pussy and a liberal and a cuck etc" meme.

i continue to be heartened that, here in NYC at least, there's no drop-off in the percentage of people wearing masks. i'd wager every person i saw outside today had a mask on, even as most parts of NYS are re-opening on a graduated basis. this happened on staten island recently, and that's trump-land mind you:









						Shoppers at Staten Island grocery store scream at woman for not wearing mask
					

The video shows furious customers yelling at the woman to leave the grocery store.




					www.cbsnews.com
				




which brings its own conflicts but, as i've said before, don't get the idea that "the american people" are on board with the posturing scumbags.


----------



## Tankus (May 29, 2020)

Trumps twitter distraction is getting truly  obscene 

....100,000 dead  ..... and hes worried that his lies are being lightly fact checked   ..


throw another loaf of bread  into the circus


----------



## Gimigimi (May 29, 2020)

petee said:


> this is widespread, on the net anyway, the "if you wear a mask you're a coward and a pussy and a liberal and a cuck etc" meme.
> 
> i continue to be heartened that, here in NYC at least, there's no drop-off in the percentage of people wearing masks. i'd wager every person i saw outside today had a mask on, even as most parts of NYS are re-opening on a graduated basis. this happened on staten island recently, and that's trump-land mind you:
> 
> ...



Yeah, precautions are taken seriously here in Seattle too. I haven't seen an establishment yet that doesn't straight out have a big sign saying you have to wear a mask to go in (for all I know this may be required by law now). It took a month or so for everyone on the street to get on board, but the number of people I see without masks has gone down as well, at least in high-density areas. Haven't heard anyone IRL saying anything negative except that all this should have happened sooner.

The current line that I see on reactionary internet is that it's actually good that a hundred thousand Americans are dead because they were weak people, and to wear a mask is to show that you're fearful, weak, and easily controlled yourself. Sometimes I understand the reactionary mind, but not this time. Just can't understand catching or spreading a virus being considered some kind of macho test of personal strength. Probably just the fash being obsessed with eugenics.


----------



## Tankus (May 29, 2020)

Surprised...?........nah

Seen on the internetz , may need fact checking


----------



## William of Walworth (May 29, 2020)

I've not being following this thread (much) for reasons of sanity-preservation ....  

But here's a fucking good summary of how badly the Trump-machine has been 'dealing' with coronavirus in the US  :
Brutal faultlines : America's stark divisions laid bare by disease




			
				Ed Pilkington said:
			
		

> In one of the rare expressions of empathy that Donald Trump has displayed during the course of the coronavirus pandemic, he talked earlier this month about the disease claiming so many lives it was “filling up Yankee Stadium with death”.
> Now the death toll from Covid-19 stands at almost twice the capacity of the Yankees’ home stadium, and has reached another booming landmark : 100,000 deaths.
> 
> A country that prides itself on its exceptionalism can now without ambiguity claim that title for its experience of the virus. *The United States stands head and shoulders at the top of the world league table of confirmed cases*, as well as the total number of deaths.


ETA : And the above is just the *start* of the article -- please read the rest!!


----------



## Supine (May 30, 2020)

here we go


----------



## Tankus (May 30, 2020)

...got to make sure the job is done


----------



## editor (May 31, 2020)

Incredible photos


























						AP PHOTOS: Images from protests across a traumatized nation
					

In cities across the United States, protesters angered over the killing of George Floyd faced off against heavily-armed officers, with some smashing police cars, ransacking businesses and setting...




					apnews.com


----------



## spring-peeper (May 31, 2020)

"traumatized nation"


----------



## Tankus (May 31, 2020)

The second wave is going to be bigley

This is so sad  as the US is unlikely to do another lockdown ......


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jun 1, 2020)

I can't stand the awful juxtaposition of young mostly black people gathering in crowds, chanting and shouting and crying out for their rights to be recognised, during a pandemic that hits black people hard, and is transmitted easily via a wide open mouth. And the irony of "I can't breathe" against the backdrop of a virus that causes severe respiratory breakdown.

This is just awful.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jun 1, 2020)

Also


Dope. Penthouse.


----------



## High Voltage (Jun 5, 2020)

Granted the number is from the ever reliable World-O-Meter site, but the States of America are set to blow through the 2,000,000 total cases in the not too distant


----------



## High Voltage (Jun 5, 2020)

And creeping ever closer to the COMBINED American deaths of WW1 (116,516) that's deaths through illness (the "Kansas" Flu of 1918 (also, somewhat unfairly known as the "Spanish" Flu)) and actual war deaths - current total deaths, again, from World-O-Meter site, standing at 110,179

War Losses (USA) | International Encyclopedia of the First World War (WW1)


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 5, 2020)

Its killed similar number of people than spanish flu in the US?! that cant be right surely?


----------



## maomao (Jun 5, 2020)

I wonder how reliable the US figures, particularly the death figures, are anyway?Is there any equivalent to the ONS figures or Daily Telegraph careful estimate? If they're only as wrong as ours are they're well past 150,000.


----------



## High Voltage (Jun 5, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Its killed similar number of people than spanish flu in the US?! that cant be right surely?



It's a range of figures that have cropped up from more than one source - which is why, IMO, they are and should be such "stunning" total to have reached

I'll do a bit more digging and post accordingly


----------



## High Voltage (Jun 5, 2020)

From another quick Google - the figure seems to check out









						Casualties of World War I
					

View data on the casualties of World War I and consider the impact the losses had on each country.




					www.facinghistory.org


----------



## High Voltage (Jun 5, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Its killed similar number of people than spanish flu in the US?! that cant be right surely?



And I'm only giving MILITARY deaths to Kansas/Spanish Flu


----------



## Yossarian (Jun 5, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Its killed similar number of people than spanish flu in the US?! that cant be right surely?



It's killed a similar number of Americans as World War I did, including soldiers who died from the flu -  the CDC estimates that the 1918 pandemic killed around 675,000 Americans in total. 





__





						1918 Pandemic (H1N1 virus)  | Pandemic Influenza (Flu) | CDC
					

Everything you need to know about the flu illness, including symptoms, treatment and prevention.




					www.cdc.gov


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 5, 2020)

maomao said:


> I wonder how reliable the US figures, particularly the death figures, are anyway?Is there any equivalent to the ONS figures or Daily Telegraph careful estimate? If they're only as wrong as ours are they're well past 150,000.



I've read a few reports suggesting the figure is around 30% higher than the official reported figure, such as the one below. 



> Data from the US is less complete, but many states have reported spikes in excess deaths that have yet to be attributed to the virus, suggesting that the actual number of coronavirus deaths could be around 30% higher. In some states, total fatalities could be twice the current count.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## editor (Jun 5, 2020)

Just look at these fucking pricks 





> "Some boogaloo supporters see the public health lockdowns and other directives by states and cities across the country as a violation of their rights, and they're aiming to harness public frustration at such measures to rally and attract new followers to their cause," the project's report said.











						What is the 'Boogaloo' movement?
					

A new far-right movement may be stoking tensions in US protests. Who are its adherents, and what do they want?




					www.aljazeera.com


----------



## Dogsauce (Jun 5, 2020)

Interesting patch tha guy has: “Live Free or Die *HH*”

Hmmm....


----------



## NoXion (Jun 5, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> Interesting patch tha guy has: “Live Free or Die *HH*”
> 
> Hmmm....



I'm sure there are plenty of folks who would be more than happy to help him out with the dying part.


----------



## platinumsage (Jun 5, 2020)

It’s New Hampshire


----------



## Badgers (Jun 7, 2020)

This will go well


----------



## Shechemite (Jun 7, 2020)

Badgers said:


> This will go well




Insert gambling pun


----------



## two sheds (Jun 7, 2020)

I thought it said "Las Vegas is officially black" as some weird sort of Black Lives Matter statement, I was confused at all the white people wandering round.


----------



## phillm (Jun 7, 2020)

Black Matters Live (London) - LIVE


----------



## phillm (Jun 7, 2020)

MadeInBedlam said:


> Insert gambling pun



Black Jack Matters


----------



## phillm (Jun 7, 2020)

Statue of slave trader Edward Colston pulled down during Bristol BLM protest | ITV News
					

Statue of slave trader Edward Colston pulled down as thousands of people attend Black Lives Matter protest in Bristol. | ITV News West Country




					www.itv.com


----------



## NoXion (Jun 7, 2020)

phillm said:


> Statue of slave trader Edward Colston pulled down during Bristol BLM protest | ITV News
> 
> 
> Statue of slave trader Edward Colston pulled down as thousands of people attend Black Lives Matter protest in Bristol. | ITV News West Country
> ...



Wrong thread. The Yanks shouldn't take credit for stuff that happens over here.


----------



## Tankus (Jun 7, 2020)

Tankus said:


> April 25th
> Georgia , as of  Friday the state has had 22,147 known cases, with 892 deaths   ,It'll interesting  to revisit these numbers in 3 weeks ...


 Well lock down in Georgia  has been somewhat  relaxed for over a month  now  
 cases have doubled and deaths  almost tripled    51,359  / 2,178   with the bulk of the cases still active with less than 3000 people recovered  and a flat (reported)  death rate  of around 30per day for a solid month 
 ..bad  , but not as  bad as initially thought maybe


----------



## High Voltage (Jun 7, 2020)

Well that soon added up

Again, sourced from the ever reliable World-O-Meter, the States of America have now clocked up over 2,000,000 cases

I have dear friends and family, as no doubt, do many others. It's criminal what's going on


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 7, 2020)

https://www.sacbee.com/news/coronavirus/article243334556.html?fbclid=IwAR21hF1MY3FwmxlyF0rcsx17sqxPJKTrsA_USeKInhj7qkMW0jmWCASw0NU


----------



## Supine (Jun 8, 2020)

Texas hospitalisation figures are not looking good. Strong upward trend after starting to relax measures.


----------



## Tankus (Jun 9, 2020)

DC National Guard members called to respond to protests test positive for COVID-19
					

The D.C. National Guard confirmed Tuesday that multiple members have tested positive for coronavirus following their deployment to respond to protests around the White House in response to the police killing of George Floyd.




					thehill.com
				



And so it begins


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 9, 2020)

Well yeah especially since some of the tactics used by cops end up spreading it around even more (which was pointed out by BLM activists)


----------



## ska invita (Jun 9, 2020)

Tankus said:


> And so it begins


So grim, especially as I cant see anyone backing down on re-opening. Lots of this to come:


> Doug Ducey, the Arizona governor, who relaxed restrictions two weeks ago, has put the increase down to an increase in testing and insisted that his approach on reopening has been prudent.



The Vegas thing is so unbelievable. Casinos are all about touching things, and the vast majority of people are tourists who will return to places all over the US <it'll be a superspreading bonanaza.

The scale of the BLM protests is going to start showing up this week, if its a factor too


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 9, 2020)

ska invita said:


> So grim, especially as I cant see anyone backing down on re-opening. Lots of this to come:
> 
> 
> The Vegas thing is so unbelievable. Casinos are all about touching things, and the vast majority of people are tourists who will return to places all over the US <it'll be a superspreading bonanaza.
> ...



Shit I really hope not


----------



## ska invita (Jun 9, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Shit I really hope not


This was LA yesterday! Over two weeks into the protests



California already spiking today

If Cheltenham horse racing was a factor in spreading in England how can this not be. And this is just one of countless examples.


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 9, 2020)

ska invita said:


> This was LA yesterday! Over two weeks into the protests
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Hasn't California being going up for a while though?


----------



## ska invita (Jun 9, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Hasn't California being going up for a while though?


I havent followed that, just saw latest figures
but lets see what it looks like in two weeks time


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 10, 2020)

Really good article by a doctor who supports the protests


----------



## Badgers (Jun 12, 2020)

__





						Houston Weighs Reimposing Lockdown, Sees ‘Precipice of Disaster’
					





					www.msn.com
				






> The warnings of a worsening outbreak reinforced alarms sounded by national health officials over the risk of a second wave of infections beyond the initial U.S. hot spots led by New York and New Jersey. Texas has been among the states pushing hardest to ease lockdowns imposed during the first wave of a disease that has killed more than 113,000 Americans.



Not going to go down well this.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 12, 2020)

From a selfish perspective I'm getting really quite concerned with the Covid situation in the US.  

Our numbers in the UK are still far too high but the general trend is consistently down on every important matrix.  Whilst it remains to be seen how effective it is we at least have a track and trace system in place and the semblance of a strategy to how the virus will be managed over the next few months / years.  We also have a government that at least acknowledge the virus is a massive danger.  The US doesn't seem to have anything like this in many states.

The situation out there in some states looks really grim and getting worse.  This is combined with a very bad political situation and a healthcare system which is simply not fit for purpose.

Regardless of all this those transatlantic flights are going to start filling up again and there will be Brits of on holiday and Americans coming the other way.  Then there is the business travel.  The US and the UK have the makings of our own little bubble.  A bubble filled with Covid.


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 12, 2020)

To be fair some American states do seem to be proceeding really cautiously and have contract tracing in place.


----------



## Anju (Jun 13, 2020)

Some worrying figures in this article looking at individual states. 25 states where cases continue to increase, 21 after having peaked a while back and 4 where there has never been a period of declining cases.

America Is Done With COVID-19. COVID-19 Isn’t Done With America


----------



## Yossarian (Jun 13, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> To be fair some American states do seem to be proceeding really cautiously and have contract tracing in place.



The best analogy I've heard for the US state-by-state approach is having a swimming pool where you're only allowed to pee in certain areas.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 13, 2020)

Anju said:


> Some worrying figures in this article looking at individual states. 25 states where cases continue to increase, 21 after having peaked a while back and 4 where there has never been a period of declining cases.
> 
> America Is Done With COVID-19. COVID-19 Isn’t Done With America


fuuucked

Here's one state, Nevada, where that death zone of Las Vegas is - and these figures wont yet show the effect of reopening the casinos - reopening where the figures are already peaking


what a tragedy...Trump gets full blame on this one


----------



## Badgers (Jun 13, 2020)

ska invita said:


> what a tragedy...Trump gets full blame on this one


It is appalling  

I hope the snipers are lined up waiting for him to leave the bunker.


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 13, 2020)

ska invita said:


> fuuucked
> 
> Here's one state, Nevada, where that death zone of Las Vegas is - and these figures wont yet show the effect of reopening the casinos - reopening where the figures are already peaking
> View attachment 217449
> ...


Bit worrying as I have a bit of a crush on someone who lives there


----------



## pesh (Jun 13, 2020)

Thank god what happens in Vegas always stays in Vegas.


----------



## baldrick (Jun 13, 2020)

I don't know if this has already been posted but Florida fired a data scientist after she refused to alter their Covid stats to support reopening. Not just that, but she has built her own dashboard with the data floridacovidaction

Story in the Washington Post in their CV live updates feed Washington Post


----------



## editor (Jun 13, 2020)

The fucked up US healthcare system. Greedy profits for those at the top. 








> Remember Michael Flor, the longest-hospitalized COVID-19 patient who, when he unexpectedly did not die, was jokingly dubbed “the miracle child?”
> 
> Now they can also call him the million-dollar baby.
> 
> ...


And if the battle with the virus wasn't bad enough:


> “I feel guilty about surviving,” he says. “There’s a sense of ‘why me?’ Why did I deserve all this? Looking at the incredible cost of it all definitely adds to that survivor’s guilt.”












						Coronavirus survival comes with a $1.1 million, 181-page price tag
					

The COVID-19 patient, from West Seattle, has insurance and so isn't on the hook for the vast majority of the charge. But the gold-plated cost highlights one reason why American health care is so hard to reform.




					www.seattletimes.com


----------



## editor (Jun 13, 2020)

ska invita said:


> fuuucked
> 
> Here's one state, Nevada, where that death zone of Las Vegas is - and these figures wont yet show the effect of reopening the casinos - reopening where the figures are already peaking
> View attachment 217449
> ...


The full picture:


----------



## Supine (Jun 13, 2020)

Holding mass ralleys indoors during a pandemic is genius from trump. The democrats should sit tight at home and let trump kill his voters in the swing states.


----------



## existentialist (Jun 13, 2020)

Supine said:


> Holding mass ralleys indoors during a pandemic is genius from trump. The democrats should sit tight at home and let trump kill his voters in the swing states.


Except that they then all come out and (potentially) cause all kinds of viral collateral damage.


----------



## High Voltage (Jun 14, 2020)

Build a CV memorial, just like the Vietnam one... It's a thought


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 17, 2020)

Many people believe that Canadians are nice people, but we aren't really.
Americans who are in the Canadian rural areas are being harassed by the locals.
It seems to be our "Yankee go home" moment.









						Toronto-area drivers, Americans being threatened in Ontario's cottage country
					

An Ontario cottage country mayor says drivers with American licence plates are being targeted and verbally assaulted by "vigilantes" who don't want them in their region during the COVID-19 pandemic.



					toronto.ctvnews.ca
				






> An Ontario cottage country mayor says drivers with American licence plates are being targeted and verbally assaulted by "vigilantes" who don't want them in their region during the COVID-19 pandemic.
> 
> "Americans are afraid," Muskoka Lakes Mayor Phil Harding told CTV News Toronto on Tuesday. "I have heard of a couple incidents where locals have literally accosted people with American licence plates."
> 
> The Canada-U.S. border has been closed to non-essential travel since March, leaving Americans with a second residence in Ontario unable to visit their properties. On Tuesday, the Canadian government announced the border closure would be extended until July 21.


----------



## petee (Jun 18, 2020)

'murica

_North Carolina Woman Starts 'Burn Your Mask' Challenge to 'Ignite Freedom'_





__





						Loading…
					





					www.newsweek.com


----------



## editor (Jun 18, 2020)

petee said:


> 'murica
> 
> _North Carolina Woman Starts 'Burn Your Mask' Challenge to 'Ignite Freedom'_
> 
> ...


A whole new level of stupid.


----------



## elbows (Jun 18, 2020)

The Texas hospital situation got quite a bit worse since that graph was posted a while ago. Here is my crappy version of that data.


Data is from the hospitalisations spreadsheet downloadable from this site: Texas COVID-19 Data


----------



## elbows (Jun 18, 2020)

Arizona also has quite a lot of data available online, and the picture there sucks too.



Data is from several tabs of the 'Hospital COVID-19 Specific Metrics' section of AZDHS | COVID-19 Dashboards


----------



## ska invita (Jun 18, 2020)

Whats a good source for all states infection data in one stop? Like those graphs in Time the other day


----------



## Supine (Jun 18, 2020)

Covid results vs Democrat / Republican states


----------



## editor (Jun 18, 2020)

Look at this All-American 100% Douchebag:















						US airline passenger removed for not wearing mask
					

The conservative activist, who was flying with American Airlines, called their mask policy "insane".




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




And an excellent response


----------



## Yossarian (Jun 18, 2020)

elbows said:


> Arizona also has quite a lot of data available online, and the picture there sucks too.
> 
> View attachment 218240
> 
> Data is from several tabs of the 'Hospital COVID-19 Specific Metrics' section of AZDHS | COVID-19 Dashboards



In early May, University of Arizona researchers providing the state government with coronavirus models and projections warned that there would be a steep rise in cases unless the state delayed reopening by a couple of weeks.

The Republican state government responded by telling them to "pause" their work on modeling, cutting off the university team's access to Department of Health data sets, and saying they would be relying on data from the Trump administration instead, which they said was not available to the public.









						Arizona health department told university to stop doing COVID-19 modeling
					

The Arizona Department of Health Services reportedly told a team of academic health experts to "pause" their work on models and projections for the coronavirus outbreak.




					thehill.com


----------



## editor (Jun 19, 2020)

King of the fudging



> In an interview with _Variety_, Aron says theaters won’t require their moviegoers to wear masks. “We did not want to be drawn into a political controversy,” he contends. “We thought it might be counterproductive if we forced mask wearing on those people who believe strongly that it is not necessary. We think that the vast majority of AMC guests will be wearing masks. When I go to an AMC feature, I will certainly be wearing a mask and leading by example.”











						AMC Theatres to reopen in July, won't require face masks to avoid "political controversy"
					

It's come to this.




					consequenceofsound.net


----------



## Yossarian (Jun 19, 2020)

Scaring off people who don't want to spend hours in an enclosed space with maskless, potentially infected strangers to avoid displeasing the kind of doofuses who think masks are part of a Marxist plot to take away their freedom doesn't seem like a great business plan, even before you take into account the possibility of lawsuits.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 19, 2020)




----------



## Sunray (Jun 19, 2020)

What’s dumb about reopening like they did, why bother closing in the first place? It made no difference.


----------



## elbows (Jun 19, 2020)

Well it did buy some time, whether they did much of use with that extra time I am not currently able to judge. Some of the advantages of ramping up testing capacity are wasted if you dont act appropriately when the testing data shows bad things happening.


----------



## Supine (Jun 19, 2020)

Good article on American data here:





__





						Loading…
					





					www.washingtonpost.com


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## Yossarian (Jun 19, 2020)

AMC has changed course and decided to make masks mandatory - wise move, though I think it'll still be a while before I'm prepared to go to an indoor cinema again, looking forward to trying a drive-in for the first time though.









						AMC Theaters changes course and will require customers to wear face masks
					

Regal and Cinemark’s theaters won’t require masks, either




					www.theverge.com


----------



## Yossarian (Jun 19, 2020)

Trump rallies, meanwhile, seem destined to become a deadlier version of the "measles parties" anti-vaxxers get all nostalgic about.


----------



## Supine (Jun 19, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Trump rallies, meanwhile, seem destined to become a deadlier version of the "measles parties" anti-vaxxers get all nostalgic about.
> 
> View attachment 218464



killing your voters ahead of an election is a novel election technique I’ll give him that


----------



## NoXion (Jun 19, 2020)

Supine said:


> killing your voters ahead of an election is a novel election technique I’ll give him that



If Trump is a two-termer, then he'll probably get Part 2 the same way he got Part 1; the Electoral College.

Unless Trump screws the pooch with his base badly enough that they can't convincingly swing it for him.


----------



## Supine (Jun 19, 2020)

Hey guys, let’s meet up. What could possibly go wrong...


----------



## Supine (Jun 19, 2020)




----------



## two sheds (Jun 19, 2020)

Democrat states and counties also more crowded, more inner cities, greater poverty?


----------



## Supine (Jun 19, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Democrat states and counties also more crowded, more inner cities, greater poverty?



so maybe you’d expect them to be worse?


----------



## two sheds (Jun 19, 2020)

indeed, Trump states and  counties catching up though - Trump winning again


----------



## Tankus (Jun 20, 2020)

The US is back in the daily 30,000 new cases again....

The US states World health count October projections make  quite a few states look like New York in March.... Its horrific.......


----------



## elbows (Jun 20, 2020)

Supine said:


> so maybe you’d expect them to be worse?



Maybe I'd expect them to have gotten worse more quickly earlier on, and therefore to start looking better later on, when others were then busily heading in the other (bad) direction. And perhaps to also gain a bit more wiggle room post-lockdown as a result of the 'fire already having burnt through more of the population' than places that werent hit bad early on. If so, it does make those red vs blue states graphs a bit unfair in a few senses, but probably still appropriate in others. Because these factors are also reasons why its probably especially stupid for some of those places that never had huge epidemic waves in the first place to be so cavalier with the way they came out of lockdown, as if the danger had somehow passed them by via nothing more than the passing of time.


----------



## a_chap (Jun 20, 2020)

Oklahoma, where Trump's about to hold his first election _massenversammlung_:


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 20, 2020)

US president says 'silent majority is stronger than ever before' – as it happened
					

President ignored experts and local concerns to stage event as Oklahoma experiences Covid-19 increase




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 20, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> US president says 'silent majority is stronger than ever before' – as it happened
> 
> 
> President ignored experts and local concerns to stage event as Oklahoma experiences Covid-19 increase
> ...





> A banner is pictured outside the venue for Donald Trump’s rally in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Photograph: Shannon Stapleton/Reuters





What the actual fuck?


----------



## bimble (Jun 20, 2020)

I do worry about my nutty aunt who lives in Florida and is 78 and thinks everyone's making a big fuss cos its the flu. The graphs from there are terrifying.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 20, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> View attachment 218653
> 
> What the actual fuck?




Was watching CNN for a bit, and there seems to be all sorts of stuff for sale.

Below is from my facebook page


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 20, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> View attachment 218653
> 
> What the actual fuck?


That's gotta be photoshopped surely? If that's genuine then we really have gone through the looking glass


----------



## magneze (Jun 20, 2020)

MickiQ said:


> That's gotta be photoshopped surely? If that's genuine then we really have gone through the looking glass


It was on the news earlier in the background.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 20, 2020)

MickiQ said:


> That's gotta be photoshopped surely? If that's genuine then we really have gone through the looking glass




Then we are through the looking glass


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 20, 2020)

MickiQ said:


> *That's gotta be photoshopped surely?* If that's genuine then we really have gone through the looking glass



BIB - yes, clearly it's not actually Trump. 

But, the banner is real.


----------



## Tankus (Jun 20, 2020)

*








						Six Trump campaign staffers working on Tulsa rally test positive for coronavirus
					

Six staffers working on President Donald Trump's rally in Tulsa, Oklahoma, have tested positive for coronavirus, the Trump campaign said Saturday.




					edition.cnn.com
				



*
trumps waiver may not be legally valid


----------



## bimble (Jun 20, 2020)

How do you mean Tankus , you think his devotees might sue him when they get sick at the rally?


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 20, 2020)

Tankus said:


> trumps waiver may not be legally valid




Yip.

I used to have to get people to sign the necessary waivers, but was told it would not stop someone suing.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 20, 2020)

bimble said:


> How do you mean Tankus , you think his devotees might sue him when they get sick at the rally?



I think that some of his followers are not too bright and will think that suing is not an option. They did sign it.


----------



## bimble (Jun 20, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> BIB - yes, clearly it's not actually Trump.
> 
> But, the banner is real.


 Part of a body of work that might be studied by historians one day yep. like this sort of thing, one of my favourites of the genre.


----------



## MickiQ (Jun 20, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> BIB - yes, clearly it's not actually Trump.
> 
> But, the banner is real.


Jesus Christ what has the world come to?


----------



## Tankus (Jun 23, 2020)

Well.. It seems as though the EU is going to ban Americans from travelling  to the EU from July 1st... As it seems that the virus is out of control within the States...

There may be....... tweets


----------



## petee (Jun 23, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Well.. It seems as though the EU is going to ban Americans from travelling  to the EU from July 1st... As it seems that the virus is out of control within the States...
> 
> There may be....... tweets



within some states yes. we're doing quite better here in NYS. now just let's not botch it, as some indisciplined people seem to want to do.


----------



## killer b (Jun 23, 2020)

petee said:


> within some states yes. we're doing quite better here in NYS. now just let's not botch it, as some indisciplined people seem to want to do.


if it's botched, it'll be botched by the inadequacies and failures of the public health response, not the _indiscipline_ of the public.


----------



## petee (Jun 23, 2020)

killer b said:


> if it's botched, it'll be botched by the inadequacies and failures of the public health response, not the _indiscipline_ of the public.



no, it'll be botched by people who refuse to distance or mask.


----------



## killer b (Jun 23, 2020)

People refusing to distance or mask _is_ a failure of the public health response though.


----------



## editor (Jun 24, 2020)

America is seriously fucked 





















						Top health officials warn of 'disturbing' new US surge
					

They also told US lawmakers that they had never been asked to slow testing for coronavirus.




					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## NoXion (Jun 24, 2020)

killer b said:


> People refusing to distance or mask _is_ a failure of the public health response though.



How so? The CDC's response to the outbreak could have been absolutely textbook (well maybe not _literally_ textbook, as elbows might point out), and there would _still_ be malcontents squealing about how encouraging people to wear masks is "Chinese communism tactics". Not sure how the relevant public health bodies could respond adequately to such stuff, but I'm open to ideas.



Although I will grant that a proper response would probably involve enough public education to mean fewer people who seem to think that hardly anybody is dying or that Covid-19 is no worse than the flu. But I don't think the deeply entrenched Red Scare bullshit would have been as easy to respond to.


----------



## killer b (Jun 24, 2020)

NoXion said:


> How so? The CDC's response to the outbreak could have been absolutely textbook (well maybe not _literally_ textbook, as elbows might point out), and there would _still_ be malcontents squealing about how encouraging people to wear masks is "Chinese communism tactics". Not sure how the relevant public health bodies could respond adequately to such stuff, but I'm open to ideas.
> 
> 
> 
> Although I will grant that a proper response would probably involve enough public education to mean fewer people who seem to think that hardly anybody is dying or that Covid-19 is no worse than the flu. But I don't think the deeply entrenched Red Scare bullshit would have been as easy to respond to.



In Wuhan, when people were _indisciplined_, they welded them into their houses. There are a range of measures available to the state (which is ultimately responsible for the public health response, not the CDC) from consistent and clear messaging through to harsh penalties for lockdown breakers, and many more besides - that the american state just didn't do. The failure of the response is on them, not the indisciplined rabble.


----------



## existentialist (Jun 24, 2020)

NoXion said:


> How so? The CDC's response to the outbreak could have been absolutely textbook (well maybe not _literally_ textbook, as elbows might point out), and there would _still_ be malcontents squealing about how encouraging people to wear masks is "Chinese communism tactics". Not sure how the relevant public health bodies could respond adequately to such stuff, but I'm open to ideas.
> 
> 
> 
> Although I will grant that a proper response would probably involve enough public education to mean fewer people who seem to think that hardly anybody is dying or that Covid-19 is no worse than the flu. But I don't think the deeply entrenched Red Scare bullshit would have been as easy to respond to.



The way I see it, and maybe what killer b meant in his reply, is that it is the job of *government* to govern in a way, including decent public health provision, that means that when citizens are asked to make great sacrifices, there can be a reasonable expectation of most of them doing it - ie., not operating as an indisciplined rabble, to swipe killer b's term.

Trump's government has actively encouraged counter-social activities through his support for white pride marches, his barely-disguised racism and utterly undisguised sexism, his failure to observe the proprieties of the office he holds, his cavalier attitude to diplomatic relations...the message he is sending to (at least) his base is "do whatever the fuck you want, if you're white". Which doesn't bode well for the situation where the government wants to ask everyone to act in the common good (never a major theme in American politics - probably regarded as dangerously liberal). And, let's face it, Trump has neither really asked for, nor demonstrated, a socially responsible attitude to this whole business. Or any other business.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 24, 2020)

Breaking news on the BBC - the New York governor, supported by the governors of both New Jersey & Connecticut, have announced an 'internal travel advisory' for people coming from 14 states with high & growing inflection rates into these 3 states, which means they will have to quarantine for 14 days.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 24, 2020)

CNN is reporting that 26 states are now reporting higher daily cases than last week.


----------



## Supine (Jun 24, 2020)

Florida not reporting ICU availability and deleting deaths from their results. Oh dear oh dear.


----------



## elbows (Jun 24, 2020)

Not a very subtle move by Florida there. Trump also revealed via his 'joke' about slowing down testing the other day that the instincts to suppress information about outbreaks is stronger in these clowns than any instincts to suppress the virus. It was almost surprising that their shit priorities took a backseat at the earlier stage of the pandemic, but for a while it did look like they might just manage to do enough of the right thing to make a real difference. Now things dont look so good and business as usual means, well, it means we are going to find out just how bad it can get in this sort of scenario.

I havent posted any scary Florida graphs because I never did find decent hospital data for that state, which doesnt necessarily mean there wasnt any but I dont know how much those ICU bed numbers were ever public. If they were public then it sounds like I am too late anyway.

I always get flashbacks to the various times the UK stopped publishing certain data, the anxiety this caused me, and the not knowing how much to read between the lines in terms of timing. At least its obvious what the story is in Florida, policies tied to targets and data, and the blatant manipulation or exclusion of data as a result. Wheras in the UK I could often only tell what the story was with hindsight. For example they published intensive care figures by region for England for a while early on, then they stopped and nobody even said anything about this (although I expect I moaned at the time). With the benefit of hindsight, I can say that they stoppe publishing this data right when we were hitting the peak of first wave deaths, with April 9th being the last data I have in that series. Some weeks later they stated publishing again but not by region, and initially in terms of percentages which they kept retroactively fiddling with. More recently still they returned to giving us actual numbers, but not by region like they were in the early days.


----------



## petee (Jun 24, 2020)

NoXion said:


> How so? The CDC's response to the outbreak could have been absolutely textbook (well maybe not _literally_ textbook, as elbows might point out), and there would _still_ be malcontents squealing about how encouraging people to wear masks is "Chinese communism tactics". Not sure how the relevant public health bodies could respond adequately to such stuff, but I'm open to ideas.
> 
> 
> 
> Although I will grant that a proper response would probably involve enough public education to mean fewer people who seem to think that hardly anybody is dying or that Covid-19 is no worse than the flu. But I don't think the deeply entrenched Red Scare bullshit would have been as easy to respond to.




here in nyc, there has been a massive campaign. media saturation, intervention on neighborhood message boards, the fact of school closings, the full exploitation by the governor of his bully pulpit on broadcast and twitter, literature sent to every address in 6 languages, nightly noisy demonstrations of support (at 7 pm and continuing weeks upon weeks) for nurses and emt. for some posters here, living 3000 miles away and ignorant of the situation, that's not enough, though what would be enough isn't indicated. the indisciplined shits who wanna drink and snog with their friends know all this and are pridefully ignoring it, as has been richly documented in the local media. red scare bullshit gets no purchase in nyc, the indisciplined shits of whom i speak are party people who wanna party. it's no deeper than that. they're indisciplined shits, individualists who have no community (much less class) understanding and are gonna do what they wanna do in the face of excellent public health communication, because they're indisciplined shits.


----------



## Tankus (Jun 25, 2020)

the same  day









						Pence misleads Republicans on Capitol Hill by saying not that many counties have COVID-19 increases: report
					

Vice President Mike Pence was either given outdated information or he's choosing to ignore the recent COVID-19 outbreak making its way through the southern United States.Speaking to Capitol Hill on Wednesday, the Washington Post cited senators present for the meeting. who revealed Pence was...




					www.rawstory.com
				




but this  is what really matters


----------



## NoXion (Jun 25, 2020)

petee said:


> here in nyc, there has been a massive campaign. media saturation, intervention on neighborhood message boards, the fact of school closings, the full exploitation by the governor of his bully pulpit on broadcast and twitter, literature sent to every address in 6 languages, nightly noisy demonstrations of support (at 7 pm and continuing weeks upon weeks) for nurses and emt. for some posters here, living 3000 miles away and ignorant of the situation, that's not enough, though what would be enough isn't indicated. the indisciplined shits who wanna drink and snog with their friends know all this and are pridefully ignoring it, as has been richly documented in the local media. red scare bullshit gets no purchase in nyc, the indisciplined shits of whom i speak are party people who wanna party. it's no deeper than that. they're indisciplined shits, individualists who have no community (much less class) understanding and are gonna do what they wanna do in the face of excellent public health communication, because they're indisciplined shits.



There was always going to be a portion of the population who would inevitably flout whatever restrictions are put in place. Those people are responsible for their decisions, but I think that the state (that is, the US gov not the State of NY) also bears significant responsibility for worsening the situation. As far as I know the the Federal government has been less than helpful with enacting containment measures, leaving it to individual States to make their own. I imagine that there are limits to what States can do, they are after all constituents of a larger sovereignty rather than fully-fledged polities of their own.

So the State of New York did the public education thing right, from the looks of it. But what about enforcement? What could they have done, what have they done, and how well do you think they did it?


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Jun 25, 2020)

NoXion said:


> There was always going to be a portion of the population who would inevitably flout whatever restrictions are put in place. Those people are responsible for their decisions, but I think that the state (that is, the US gov not the State of NY) also bears significant responsibility for worsening the situation. As far as I know the the Federal government has been less than helpful with enacting containment measures, leaving it to individual States to make their own. I imagine that there are limits to what States can do, they are after all constituents of a larger sovereignty rather than fully-fledged polities of their own.
> 
> So the State of New York did the public education thing right, from the looks of it. But what about enforcement? What could they have done, what have they done, and how well do you think they did it?


Covid19 has exposed the depth of the fractures in the US that could threaten its unity some day soon. Compare and contrast with Germany. The German constitution doesn't give the central govt the power to enforce a nationwide lockdown. Similar situation to the US in many ways, except of course that this is Germany not the US. So no constitutional crisis - state heads in Germany got together with the central govt and worked together to coordinate a lockdown policy in a way that none of them were constitutionally obliged to do. This is becoming strained now cos some states want to go different ways as they ease - but the strain is showing in Germany as it emerges from its crisis, not while it is slap bang in the middle of it.


----------



## killer b (Jun 25, 2020)

petee said:


> here in nyc, there has been a massive campaign. media saturation, intervention on neighborhood message boards, the fact of school closings, the full exploitation by the governor of his bully pulpit on broadcast and twitter, literature sent to every address in 6 languages, nightly noisy demonstrations of support (at 7 pm and continuing weeks upon weeks) for nurses and emt. for some posters here, living 3000 miles away and ignorant of the situation, that's not enough, though what would be enough isn't indicated. the indisciplined shits who wanna drink and snog with their friends know all this and are pridefully ignoring it, as has been richly documented in the local media. red scare bullshit gets no purchase in nyc, the indisciplined shits of whom i speak are party people who wanna party. it's no deeper than that. they're indisciplined shits, individualists who have no community (much less class) understanding and are gonna do what they wanna do in the face of excellent public health communication, because they're indisciplined shits.


I think you're misunderstanding what I've tried to say. There are _indisciplined and selfish shits _everywhere, in New York, in London, in Berlin and in Wuhan. One of the key aspects of the public health response by government to a pandemic is how do you deal with the selfish and indisciplined shits, and each of those places has had different approaches to dealing with them, and different results.

I appreciate that in America you have a president who is wildly at odds with the local state government on any number of aspects of the response, which is exacerbating the indisciplined and selfish shit problem, among other things: that in itself is a failure of governance, and a failure of the public health response.

I don't necessarily think there's anything the New York state government could be doing better or differently - and the numbers I've seen suggest they're on top of the local infection and numbers are trending downwards, and may continue to do so even with a reasonable number of selfish and indisciplined shits about - but if they do start going up again, it'll be a failure of the (federal, mostly) government, not of the unruly and disobedient mob.


----------



## elbows (Jun 25, 2020)

Parts of Texas are resorting to using childrens hospitals to provide capacity for adults.









						Texas Covid-19 cases hit all-time daily high as Houston hospitals near capacity
					

Increase in coronavirus infections prompted governor to tighten public health restrictions after resisting calls to slow reopening




					www.theguardian.com
				






> In response to the hospital admitting adults, its endowed chair in tropical pediatrics, Dr Peter Hotez, tweeted: “We knew this day would come, I thought perhaps later this summer or fall, but the exponential rise came a bit early.”



I'm not surprised, looking at the latest data.





> Abbott tightened lockdown restrictions on Tuesday – one day after declaring that Texas would remain “wide open for business”.
> 
> “We want to make sure that everyone reinforces the best safe practices of wearing a mask, hand sanitization, maintaining safe distance, but importantly, because the spread is so rampant right now, there’s never a reason for you to have to leave your home,” Abbott told local news station KBTX-TV on Tuesday. “Unless you do need to go out, the safest place for you is at your home.”


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Jun 25, 2020)

killer b said:


> I think you're misunderstanding what I've tried to say. There are _indisciplined and selfish shits _everywhere, in New York, in London, in Berlin and in Wuhan. One of the key aspects of the public health response by government to a pandemic is how do you deal with the selfish and indisciplined shits, and each of those places has had different approaches to dealing with them, and different results.
> 
> I appreciate that in America you have a president who is wildly at odds with the local state government on any number of aspects of the response, which is exacerbating the indisciplined and selfish shit problem, among other things: that in itself is a failure of governance, and a failure of the public health response.
> 
> I don't necessarily think there's anything the New York state government could be doing better or differently - and the numbers I've seen suggest they're on top of the local infection and numbers are trending downwards, and may continue to do so even with a reasonable number of selfish and indisciplined shits about - but if they do start going up again, it'll be a failure of the (federal, mostly) government, not of the unruly and disobedient mob.


And to be fair to New York State, at the start of this, when it was mostly NY/New Jersey being badly affected, there were lots of wider things, such as restricting travel into and out of New York, that the state could do nothing about without help from federal level, help that did not come.

It is a staggering situation, though. Federal help for NYC failed to come in part at least because it's in a state Trump can't win in the upcoming election. It takes a lot to be more politically fucked up than the UK, but that is.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Jun 25, 2020)

elbows said:


> Parts of Texas are resorting to using childrens hospitals to provide capacity for adults.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Speaking on quite a selfish note, this, plus news from elsewhere, does rather suggest that covid-19 is pretty unbothered by hot weather.


----------



## Raheem (Jun 25, 2020)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Speaking on quite a selfish note, this, plus news from elsewhere, does rather suggest that covid-19 is pretty unbothered by hot weather.


Not sure bout that. Texas has quite a lot of aircon.


----------



## littlebabyjesus (Jun 25, 2020)

Raheem said:


> Not sure bout that. Texas has quite a lot of aircon.


Good point. Mexico doesn't so much though.


----------



## elbows (Jun 25, 2020)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Speaking on quite a selfish note, this, plus news from elsewhere, does rather suggest that covid-19 is pretty unbothered by hot weather.



The oversimplified conventional wisdom that I went into this pandemic with is that seasonal factors are enough to make the big difference to outbreaks of diseases which have been with us for a long time, but are not enough to prevent outbreaks of novel viruses which humans havent experienced before (ie pandemics). Hence swine flu first wave in the UK in July 2009, Covid infections in Singapore which is tropical, etc. With the idea being that levels of immunity within populations against existing viruses are high enough that the virus is only able to remain viable but not explosive in growth for much of the year, and winter offers a temporary tiping point where some years it can achieve epidemic levels of outbreak for a while before running out of sufficient targets. The picture is clearly different with novel viruses because that big bulk of immunity isnt there to start with so the virus doesnt need to rely on seasonal factors to tip it over into explosive growth.

If we assume that seasonal factors make a difference to the range which R might fluctuate around, also depending on various aspects of human behaviour, then the summer gets you a bit more wiggle room but its easy to squander that advantage. We will be better placed to judge this once we've seen the opposite, just how bad it can get in winter. I dont know whether we will get an unmitigated look at a winter with covid-19, really I hope not since I favour being pro-active and cautious when dealing with this pandemic and the coming winter.


----------



## Tankus (Jun 26, 2020)

Fauci  just  instigated  his accelerated retirement  plan ..... 

_If your not wearing  a  mask in  public,............ your part of the  problem  ....not the  solution  _


----------



## krtek a houby (Jun 26, 2020)

Pence echoing his boss by blaming the rise of cases on increased testing. Christ.

Pence claims ‘remarkable progress’ as Covid-19 cases hit new record in US


----------



## Tankus (Jun 26, 2020)

Winter is coming


----------



## phillm (Jun 27, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Winter is coming


ain't it just


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 27, 2020)

The States are 4% of global population.
They have 25% of global infections.

I wanna see what Trump's reaction to the EU ban.


----------



## Yossarian (Jun 27, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> I wanna see what Trump's reaction to the EU ban.



He'll probably have a pop at the EU just for the sake of completeness, but Trump doesn't seem to be taking much interest in coronavirus-related subjects lately and is obsessing over vandalism of statues of dead white people instead, which leaves Americans in the weird position that their president would give more of a shit about them if they were made of stone.


----------



## scifisam (Jun 27, 2020)

Raheem said:


> Not sure bout that. Texas has quite a lot of aircon.



Wouldn't going from those sometimes chilly airconned environments into a hot outside area, even briefly, be somewhat worse for your immune system? It has been in my totally anecdotal experience wrt general colds and bugs. But presumably epidemiologists have considered that so I might be talking shit.


----------



## phillm (Jun 27, 2020)




----------



## NoXion (Jun 27, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> He'll probably have a pop at the EU just for the sake of completeness, but Trump doesn't seem to be taking much interest in coronavirus-related subjects lately and is obsessing over vandalism of statues of dead white people instead, which leaves Americans in the weird position that their president would give more of a shit about them if they were made of stone.



So Trump is a believer in BLM after all. Bronze Lumps Matter.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 27, 2020)

Might have already been posted but wow


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 27, 2020)

Yeah, it was posted on the memes thread, my reply - what a bunch of fucking loons.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 27, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Yeah, it was posted on the memes thread, my reply - what a bunch of fucking loons.


Was it 9k new cases in Florida yesterday?


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 27, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Was it 9k new cases in Florida yesterday?



Almost...



ETA - Hence bars being closed again.









						Texas and Florida clamp down on bars and alcohol as infections surge | ITV News
					

The two states joined a small but growing number that are either backtracking or putting any further reopening of their economies on hold. | ITV National News




					www.itv.com


----------



## Badgers (Jun 27, 2020)




----------



## quimcunx (Jun 27, 2020)

Badgers said:


> View attachment 219669



April 2024.


----------



## phillm (Jun 27, 2020)

A real disaster is unfolding in parts of the US.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jun 27, 2020)

DOJ warns against fraudulent face mask exemption cards
					

The Department of Justice (DOJ) is warning against fraudulent cards or flyers that are being used to claim immunity from face mask mandates.




					thehill.com
				




The card's list of penalities for refusing maskless customers is quite severe.


----------



## NoXion (Jun 27, 2020)

"Wearing a face mask posses[sic] a mental and/or physical risk to me"

If you think waving an obviously fake card like this is an appropriate reaction to being asked to wear a mask, then it's too late. The lead has already damaged your Boomer brain.


----------



## Supine (Jun 27, 2020)




----------



## Supine (Jun 28, 2020)




----------



## Voley (Jun 28, 2020)

I haven't fact-checked this or anything but if it's right ... fuck.


----------



## editor (Jun 29, 2020)

Spot the mask   









						Country singer Chase Rice plays packed concert in Tennessee amid coronavirus spike
					

Thousands of concert-goers stood together in close proximity, with not a face mask to be seen.




					consequenceofsound.net


----------



## editor (Jun 29, 2020)

Twat acts like a twat, gets infected, but refuses to help trace people who he infected. 



> The co-founder of a movement to reopen Maryland at the height of the COVID-19 pandemic has tested positive for the virus after refusing to wear a face mask.
> 
> Walters suggested that those he has recently come into contact with should monitor their symptoms. However, he is refusing to cooperate with Maryland contact tracers by providing any personal information that could help them contain the virus.
> 
> "I will not share anybody's information with the government. I will not do it," Walters reportedly said.











						Founder of ReOpen movement who didn't wear mask tests positive for coronavirus
					

Tim Walters, who led a movement to reopen Maryland as the COVID-19 pandemic expanded in April, says he tested positive for the virus but blames "Satan," despite refusing to wear a face mask and abide by public health restrictions.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## elbows (Jun 29, 2020)




----------



## NoXion (Jun 29, 2020)

editor said:


> Twat acts like a twat, gets infected, but refuses to help trace people who he infected.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Now there's a cunt I'd be happy to see wheezing to death. The world would be better off without selfish pieces of fucking shit like him.


----------



## lefteri (Jun 29, 2020)

Badgers said:


> View attachment 219669



and this from someone touted as one of the cleverest people on the planet


----------



## ska invita (Jun 29, 2020)

lefteri said:


> and this from someone touted as one of the cleverest people on the planet


another superpredictor genius.


----------



## kropotkin (Jun 29, 2020)

lefteri said:


> and this from someone touted as one of the cleverest people on the planet


He's a business cunt not a scientist


----------



## lefteri (Jun 29, 2020)

kropotkin said:


> He's a business cunt not a scientist


in articles i’ve read they rave about how closely involved he is in the engineering decisions at both space x and tesla


----------



## quimcunx (Jun 29, 2020)

He's got some sort of  degree in physics I think. Hes not completely ignorant in science.


----------



## kropotkin (Jun 30, 2020)

He has an undergraduate physics degree.


----------



## lefteri (Jun 30, 2020)

certainly seems like the kind of person you’d trust to follow to another planet


----------



## Sprocket. (Jun 30, 2020)

lefteri said:


> certainly seems like the kind of person you’d trust to follow to another planet


It appears he’s already living on a different planet.


----------



## Sprocket. (Jun 30, 2020)

kropotkin said:


> He has an undergraduate physics degree.


Equivalent to having a white belt in martial arts?


----------



## editor (Jun 30, 2020)

Awesome leadership here









						S. Dakota gov says 'we will not be social distancing' at July 3 celebration with Trump at Mount Rushmore
					

Thousands of people are expected for the event. Masks are optional, too.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## maomao (Jun 30, 2020)

editor said:


> Awesome leadership here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


South Dakotans are mostly pretty socially distanced anyway. 11 people per square mile (UK has 430, London 1500).


----------



## editor (Jun 30, 2020)

maomao said:


> South Dakotans are mostly pretty socially distanced anyway. 11 people per square mile (UK has 430, London 1500).


But not when 7,500 of them turn up for a celebration.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jun 30, 2020)

What I find really bizarre is the absolute meltdowns over wearing a mask:










If you don't want to wear a mask in a business that requires it, shop somewhere else.


----------



## Teaboy (Jun 30, 2020)

Looking at afar it does seem that the whole thing is being polarized into masks.  They seem to have taken a far larger importance than they have in some other countries.


----------



## elbows (Jun 30, 2020)

Well its not surprising given that Trump and others politicised the mask stuff as soon as it became something the government felt the need to recommend.


----------



## maomao (Jun 30, 2020)

Apparently cospiraloons are pushing the idea that masks can kill you with carbon dioxide poisoning. Absolutely everything becomes polarised so quickly. I didn't actually expect the last lot of protests to calm down to the level they have. 3 weeks ago it looked like war by July.


----------



## LDC (Jun 30, 2020)

Really looking grim and getting grimmer in the US. Fauci talking about potentially getting to 100,000 cases _a day._


----------



## maomao (Jun 30, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> Really looking grim and getting grimmer in the US. Fauci talking about potentially getting to 100,000 cases _a day._


They must have been well above that in April to be clocking up two thousand deaths a day surely? Unless their case fatality rate is significantly worse than other countries.


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 30, 2020)

*Not necessarily if those people were already ill?  It's got a fatality rate of 1% or so and many of those people will have been in hospital for ages already.*


----------



## Ms Ordinary (Jun 30, 2020)

San Quentin: Covid-19 cases at California prison surge to 1,000

Apparently due to large scale transfers from other prisons where Covid was rife


----------



## frogwoman (Jun 30, 2020)

California recorded more than 8,000 coronavirus infections on Monday, smashing the state’s daily record for the third time in eight days. Yesterday saw the state record more than 6,000 cases attributed to the virus.

And California is bracing for more bad news. Across the Golden State, cases have steadily risen alongside admissions to hospitals and ICUs.

But the trends are applying uneven pressure to the state’s regions. As of Saturday in Southern California’s Riverside County, 99% of ICU beds were in use, leaving just 5 available for new admissions.

Imperial County, which borders Mexico, has in recent weeks sent 500 patients to neighboring regions because hospital capacity had been maxed, California governor Gavin Newsom said Monday.

 








						Governor signs historic bill to remove Confederate emblem from Mississippi flag – as it happened
					

Coalition of legislators passed a bill to change flag, which features Confederate battle emblem




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## quimcunx (Jun 30, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Looking at afar it does seem that the whole thing is being polarized into masks.  They seem to have taken a far larger importance than they have in some other countries.



I suppose because they have opened up a lot more than others making masks more pertinent.


----------



## Yossarian (Jun 30, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Looking at afar it does seem that the whole thing is being polarized into masks.  They seem to have taken a far larger importance than they have in some other countries.



It's madness - it's been shown that the sooner a country adopts mask-wearing, the fewer coronavirus deaths they had, but we're almost six months into the pandemic and a big proportion of the US population appears to still believe that masks are some kind of Communist plot.



> What is it that we're supposed to even be _doing_ once we use the masks to take their freedoms? Do we use our newfound power to force them to live in a brutal hellscape where everyone has healthcare and a secure job with vacation time, police don't get to go around killing random Black people, we stop fighting stupid forever wars and we don't have mass shootings every other day?











						What The Hell Do These Anti-Mask People Think Our Endgame Is Here?
					

If we're benefiting from this, I think we have a right to know how!




					www.wonkette.com


----------



## Cid (Jun 30, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> It's madness - it's been shown that the sooner a country adopts mask-wearing, the fewer coronavirus deaths they had, but we're almost six months into the pandemic and a big proportion of the US population appears to still believe that masks are some kind of Communist plot.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



There is a bit of correlation/causation thing there though... Countries that introduce facemasks are (probably) far more likely to be using other methods of control as well. Though this is a bit of a sidetrack I suppose, the broader point is the reaction to fairly rudimentary prevention methods in (some parts of) the US.


----------



## phillm (Jun 30, 2020)

Trump's given up and sent Pence out to bat.


----------



## petee (Jul 1, 2020)




----------



## NoXion (Jul 1, 2020)

petee said:


>




Someone put some real effort into producing that misinformation. But who? I hope this is investigated.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 1, 2020)

Not looking good.   



> The *United States* again reported a record one-day increase in coronavirus cases on Tuesday, with 44,358 new coronavirus cases confirmed in the country...
> 
> On Twitter, the Covid Tracking Project said that the US’s 7-day average for new daily cases has doubled since 13 June and that hospitalisations in the country jumped by the highest number since 21 April.
> 
> ...











						Global report: US reports another record increase in coronavirus cases
					

New cases jump by 80% in two weeks; South Korea using remdesivir; outbreak in Australia’s state of Victoria worsens




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## editor (Jul 1, 2020)

Fucking hell









						Coronavirus: What's behind alarming new US outbreaks?
					

Cases are rising in Texas, Florida, Arizona and California - here's a look at the data and the theories.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## blameless77 (Jul 1, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Looking at afar it does seem that the whole thing is being polarized into masks.  They seem to have taken a far larger importance than they have in some other countries.



Surely that's part of the MAGA narrative - Trump doesn't wear one, so people are emboldened to refuse.


----------



## maomao (Jul 1, 2020)

It's not like we don't have the same problem over here. People wear masks on public transport but seemingly nowhere else (a third at best in supermarkets). And I don't think right wing libertarian types take buses. Or they don't like to draw people's attention to it if they do.


----------



## Tankus (Jul 2, 2020)

51,000 new positive tests in one day,  yesterday........ Dr Fauci thinks a daily " very disturbing" 100,000 daily new cases now well within the relms... The opinion of some health experts is that numbers are now way past the point of any ability of significant contact tracing and isolation. They have lost control.

They think that the lower current attribututable  death toll is due to the demographic change in the positive cases  (mid thirties) with patients carrying fewer underlying morbitities, as opposed to the care home older age group high underlying morbidity mass fatalities in April. 
But there may be a miscount.








						Official U.S. coronavirus death toll is 'a substantial undercount' of actual tally, Yale study finds
					

The 781,000 total deaths in the United States in the three months through May 30 were nearly 19% higher than what would normally be expected, the study said.




					www.cnbc.com
				




"There is a general anti-science, anti-authority, anti-vaccine feeling among some people in this country - an alarmingly large percentage of people, relatively speaking,"... Fauci.

He didn't mention any red hats


----------



## editor (Jul 2, 2020)

America, eh?









						Alabama students throwing 'COVID parties' to see who gets infected: Officials
					

Rising infections prompt Gov. Kay Ivy to extend 'Safer at Home' orders.




					abcnews.go.com


----------



## elbows (Jul 2, 2020)

That link isnt working for me.


----------



## maomao (Jul 2, 2020)

elbows said:


> That link isnt working for me.











						Alabama students throwing 'COVID parties' to see who gets infected: Officials
					

Rising infections prompt Gov. Kay Ivy to extend 'Safer at Home' orders.




					abcnews.go.com


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 2, 2020)

blameless77 said:


> Surely that's part of the MAGA narrative - Trump doesn't wear one, so people are emboldened to refuse.



But it seems like everyone is getting obsessed with masks.  Even when Fauci (sp) was speaking the other day he was talking about "masks and distancing".  Note how masks comes first.


----------



## editor (Jul 2, 2020)

elbows said:


> That link isnt working for me.


Try this Alabama students throwing 'COVID parties' to see who gets infected: Officials


----------



## Supine (Jul 2, 2020)

editor said:


> Try this Alabama students throwing 'COVID parties' to see who gets infected: Officials



Not sure what to say about that


----------



## two sheds (Jul 2, 2020)

two sheds said:


> How long before fatalism sets in and people start holding chicken-pox-style parties so they get the infections over with?



Was clearly going to come  (Feb 19)


----------



## Sunray (Jul 2, 2020)

I am getting the feeling that Trump has gone mad and needs to step down.  There were reports out the other day, saying he might do just that. Ultimately dismissed as fanciful.  

He's realised he's lost the election and is throwing the American people under the bus, he doesn't give a shit anymore.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 2, 2020)

Sunray said:


> I am getting the feeling that Trump has gone mad and needs to step down.



Congratulations on catching up with the rest of us.


----------



## Sunray (Jul 2, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Congratulations on catching up with the rest of us.



Obvs, he's always been a bit mad.  But this week, especially so.  The wobbly wheels seem to have finally broken and come off, all of them at once.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 2, 2020)

Sunray said:


> I am getting the feeling that Trump has gone mad and needs to step down.  There were reports out the other day, saying he might do just that. Ultimately dismissed as fanciful.
> 
> He's realised he's lost the election and is throwing the American people under the bus, he doesn't give a shit anymore.



I think it turns him on to have enough power to let people die.  The Republican Party is currently a Jim Jones-style death cult.


----------



## petee (Jul 2, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> I think it turns him on to have enough power to let people die.  The Republican Party is currently a Jim Jones-style death cult.



this is just facts.
trump won't resign obv. he might lose in november, but the question is, will trumpers start shooting stuff/people up?


----------



## Tankus (Jul 2, 2020)

Hes going to rinse his base on leaving  with a pay per view tv station for the red hatted unwashed , and make bindens life utter hell unleashed along with the surviving smeg of the GOP

if we think we are witnessing division now  

whats the bet the dems will drop a lot of cases  because they want_ a healing of the american people  _

His wife taking him to the cleaners ...should be  interesting though


----------



## Sunray (Jul 3, 2020)

Recent Trump behaviour

What I was talking about re Trump being extra crazy recently. The transcripts of his speeches are something









						The 39 most outrageous lines from Donald Trump's Friday 'press conference'
					

Just before 9 a.m. Eastern time on Friday, President Donald Trump tweeted that he would be holding a "News Conference" to talk about the "Jobs Numbers!"




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 3, 2020)

He seems to be more concerned about statues and Dick Wolf shows than keeping a lid on the second wave


----------



## platinumsage (Jul 3, 2020)

There are vast swathes of evangelical rural America that just don't see the pandemic as a big thing. These are Trump's natural supporters, and they're not all (conspira)loons.

Check out this woman, she doesn't sound unreasonable to me, just a different way of looking at life:


----------



## lizzieloo (Jul 3, 2020)

There is a narrative doing the rounds in the US that the rise in numbers of cases is down to antibody tests being included in results

So even those awful graphs are being explained away as bollocks by the conspiracy minded


----------



## Sunray (Jul 3, 2020)

Why do conspirloons get a big say on things?  Is everyone in the USA a hat-wearing member of the tinfoil brigade? 

Surely there are people with at least a shred of common sense?


----------



## quimcunx (Jul 3, 2020)

Of course there are. They are either staying home as much as possible so you're not seeing them or working despite their fears. Also the media choose to show what they choose so can make it look more common.


----------



## lizzieloo (Jul 3, 2020)

I went to twitter, I was interested to see how many people that have had the antibody test (mostly NHS workers at the moment), tested positive without having been ill. A couple of days ago the results, even "latest" results, were mostly about the antibody test conspiracy, that's what made me aware of it. 

It's not so bad today.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 3, 2020)

I did notice that people around here are taking it more seriously again.  For about two weeks everyone wore masks and then it stopped.  This morning I went to Walmart (my mother asked me to pick up some items and bring them out to her the next time I go out)  and most people were wearing masks again, and the "greeters" were checking the temperature of about every third person that entered.  I made a grocery run yesterday and they were requiring that you have exact change, use a debit or credit card, or use a phone app to limit hand contact.  If you wanted, you could round up and donate the difference to a charity.  We'll see how long this lasts.


----------



## petee (Jul 3, 2020)

and now he has the coronavirus.
i'm not laughing, you're laughing.


----------



## Supine (Jul 3, 2020)

Worth a read


----------



## two sheds (Jul 3, 2020)

petee said:


> and now he has the coronavirus.
> i'm not laughing, you're laughing.



I liked the comment responding to a Patriot (America is tired of tyrannical Governors. This isn’t how America works. One man, or woman should never have absolute authority to rule the people): 



> Damn right!  I sick of the government insisting that I wash my hands between taking a dump and preparing your food.  If I want to store my ground meat at 85 degrees in the bathroom with raw chicken I should have that right.  It's tyranny.


----------



## kropotkin (Jul 3, 2020)




----------



## Sunray (Jul 3, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> I did notice that people around here are taking it more seriously again.  For about two weeks everyone wore masks and then it stopped.  This morning I went to Walmart (my mother asked me to pick up some items and bring them out to her the next time I go out)  and most people were wearing masks again, and the "greeters" were checking the temperature of about every third person that entered.  I made a grocery run yesterday and they were requiring that you have exact change, use a debit or credit card, or use a phone app to limit hand contact.  If you wanted, you could round up and donate the difference to a charity.  We'll see how long this lasts.



From personal experience, checking the temperature is a bit pointless.  You don't run a temperature for a few days until you get sick and you'd not be heading to Walmart once you do get sick.  
But you are contagious so unless they have a thermal imaging camera they are putting themselves at risk.


----------



## Supine (Jul 3, 2020)

kropotkin said:


>




Science


----------



## Sunray (Jul 3, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> I did notice that people around here are taking it more seriously again.  For about two weeks everyone wore masks and then it stopped.  This morning I went to Walmart (my mother asked me to pick up some items and bring them out to her the next time I go out)  and most people were wearing masks again, and the "greeters" were checking the temperature of about every third person that entered.  I made a grocery run yesterday and they were requiring that you have exact change, use a debit or credit card, or use a phone app to limit hand contact.  If you wanted, you could round up and donate the difference to a charity.  We'll see how long this lasts.



I just re-read. Change in the USA still baffles me, what the point its not worth anything. There are nickles and dimes on my floor somewhere!


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 4, 2020)

Canada is in America



Mexico is closing its borders to several US states.

I guess they saw the above map.....


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 4, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Canada is in America
> 
> View attachment 220753
> 
> ...



That map is  little misleading - parts of the US are a sea of red because the Johns Hopkins researchers used a red dot to show the totals for each county, but Canada and Mexico only got a red dot with the totals for each province or state - there'd be quite a bit of red all the way from Windsor to Quebec City otherwise.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 4, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Canada is in America
> 
> View attachment 220753
> 
> ...


I reckon they should build a wall.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 4, 2020)

existentialist said:


> I reckon they should build a wall


Nuke the site from orbit. Only way to be sure


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 4, 2020)

existentialist said:


> I reckon they should build a wall.



I reckon Trump used another one of his wishes from the monkey's paw to ask "Make it so that Mexico pays for a border wall."


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 4, 2020)




----------



## Tankus (Jul 4, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> I reckon Trump used another one of his wishes from the monkey's paw to ask "Make it so that Mexico pays for a border wall."


Or if a Mexican politico runs on the promise of building a wall to stop the virus coming in ...and not only is trumps government going to pay for it ,
but they are going to bloody build it too...!




> Donald J. Trump
> @realDonaldTrump





> Cases, Cases, Cases! If we didn’t test so much and so successfully, we would have very few cases. If you test 40,000,000 people, you are going to have many cases that, without the testing (like other countries), would not show up every night on the Fake Evening News.....
> ....In a certain way, our tremendous Testing success gives the Fake News Media all they want, CASES. In the meantime, Deaths and the all important Mortality Rate goes down. You don’t hear about that from the Fake News, and you never will. Anybody need any Ventilators???
> 7:49 PM · Jul 4, 2020


see how well this tweet ages in 3 weeks


----------



## Tankus (Jul 5, 2020)

What's the reasoning behind this?

Is it retribution against us boomers for fucking the planet and spending their future now?


----------



## Steel Icarus (Jul 5, 2020)

This _America_, man.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 5, 2020)

Sunray said:


> From personal experience, checking the temperature is a bit pointless.  You don't run a temperature for a few days until you get sick and you'd not be heading to Walmart once you do get sick.
> But you are contagious so unless they have a thermal imaging camera they are putting themselves at risk.



It varies from place to place, MIL's retirement home they take the temp of visitors and you have to wash your hands, then use sanitiser. Local hospital, apart from wearing a mask, they're not taking temp when you arrive, but at the local clothestore, they do!

(am not in the US)


----------



## ice-is-forming (Jul 5, 2020)

Tankus said:


> What's the reasoning behind this?
> 
> Is it retribution against us boomers for fucking the planet and spending their future now?




I see your beach party and raise you this!!!!!!!! from a few days ago!!!!!


----------



## Tankus (Jul 5, 2020)

Just seen the Saturday night pubs in London.... .it's probably depressingly not unique .. We've just blown 4 months worth of lock down


----------



## Supine (Jul 5, 2020)

Looks like this might be crunch week in some US states.  









						Ten out of the 12 hospitals in Texas' Rio Grande Valley are now full
					

"We are now at the point of grave concern," said the CEO of one hospital system in deep South Texas as local hospitals began diverting patients away from their emergency rooms amid a crush of COVID-19 infections.




					www.texastribune.org


----------



## Roadkill (Jul 5, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Just seen the Saturday night pubs in London.... .it's probably depressingly not unique .. We've just blown 4 months worth of lock down



You've said this on at least three threads now, all implying that we're heading the same way as the United States.  However, the situation is not the same and the result may well be very different.

The UK is a lot further on with suppressing (the first wave of) the virus than the US was when it started reopening..  These are the 7-day moving averages of daily new cases:


Left one is UK but I cropped that off the screenshot by mistake.  Sources here (UK) and here (US).

It may be that reopening the pubs and so on will cause a second spike, but it's not a given.  It hasn't happened across most of Europe yet, even in countries that have had outbreaks nearly as bad as the UK.  Fundamentally the UK seems to be following a trajectory much more similar to Italy or Spain, albeit with a longer and less steep decline in cases, than the US.


----------



## LDC (Jul 5, 2020)

Much more sensible to compare the US situation to that of the whole of Europe (but with worse national co-ordination and healthcare) rather than solely the UK tbh.


----------



## Roadkill (Jul 5, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> Much more comparable to think of the US situation to that of the whole of Europe (but with worse national co-ordination and healthcare) rather than the UK tbh.



Yes, and an absolute shitgibbon in charge of the whole thing.

The British government's response to Covid has been a fuck-up which has cost tens of thousands of lives, but the tragedy the Trump administration is inflicting on America looks to be of another order of magnitude.


----------



## petee (Jul 5, 2020)

yes, it's exactly the same









						Kansas governor calls on GOP county chair to remove cartoon comparing mask order to Holocaust
					

Kansas Gov. Laura Kelly (D) is calling on a Republican state official to remove a cartoon from his newspaper's Facebook page that compares her recent order requiring face masks in public to the Holocaust.




					thehill.com


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 6, 2020)

Another day, another nut job:


----------



## existentialist (Jul 6, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> Another day, another nut job:



What's a "CBI"? Complete Bloody Idiot...nah, that doesn't sound very US cop.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 6, 2020)

You can tell she's not black, they'd have had their knee on her head and a gun to her throat within 2 seconds, let alone saying "sorry".


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 6, 2020)

existentialist said:


> What's a "CBI"? Complete Bloody Idiot...nah, that doesn't sound very US cop.



Maybe "Crazy bitch, may be intoxicated"?


----------



## existentialist (Jul 6, 2020)

two sheds said:


> You can tell she's not black, they'd have had their knee on her head and a gun to her throat within 2 seconds, let alone saying "sorry".


That thought not-so-fleetingly crossed my mind, too


----------



## phillm (Jul 7, 2020)

The price for populist idiots like Trump, Johnson and Bolsarono is 100s of thousands of needless deaths and still they bluster and deflect, shameless cunts.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 7, 2020)

holy shit this graph  (sorry for twitter link again)


----------



## elbows (Jul 7, 2020)

Tom Hanks should be in charge of mask compliance measures.



> Hanks said: "I don't get it, I simply do not get it, it is literally the least you can do."
> 
> "If anybody wants to build up an argument about doing the least they can do, I wouldn't trust them with a driver's licence," he said.
> 
> ...











						Hanks 'has no respect' for people not using masks
					

The actor strongly criticises people who don't wear face coverings amid the coronavirus pandemic.




					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## petee (Jul 7, 2020)

meanwhile, in france ...









						Bayonne: Bus driver left brain dead after being 'attacked over face masks'
					

The driver in France was set upon by people who had no tickets and refused to wear face masks.



					www.bbc.com


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 8, 2020)

I know there's a backlog from the weekend but today's US stats are absolutely horrifying.


----------



## Roadkill (Jul 8, 2020)

Florida hospitals now running out of ICU space, and AZ not far behind. Fucking grim.


----------



## phillm (Jul 8, 2020)

Scary stuff this is not the time to let your guard down.


----------



## lefteri (Jul 8, 2020)

phillm said:


> Scary stuff this is not the time to let your guard down.




damn, was hoping it was adam sandler


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 9, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> I know there's a backlog from the weekend but today's US stats are absolutely horrifying.



The Monday figure of 993 and yesterday's 890 were the two highest since 12th June, but sadly expected since the increase in new cases started to take off mid-June, when the 7-day rolling average was around 22k a day, now it's a shocking 54k a day.   

We are just seeing the lag between higher number of cases, followed by news stories of hospitals struggling, and then the increase in daily deaths.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 9, 2020)

62k cases today


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 9, 2020)

More madness from across the pond.



> A Republican lawmaker has urged people in Ohio to stop getting tested for coronavirus, despite the state seeing a surge in infections.
> 
> GOP House of Representatives member Nino Vitale asked constituents if they were “tired of living in a dictatorship” in a Facebook post on Tuesday and advised that they “STOP GETTING TESTED!”
> 
> “It is giving the government an excuse to claim something is happening that is not happening at the magnitude they say it is happening,” the lawmaker claimed.





Yet, the Republican Ohio governor is about to make mask wearing mandatory in seven counties where the coronavirus is spreading rapidly, as the state rose above the 21-day average for both coronavirus infections and deaths after reporting 948 new cases of the disease, 144 infections above the 21 day average of 804, and more than double the 21-day average for deaths, recording 43 fatalities from the disease on Tuesday. That's in a state with a population of under 12 million. 

So, why is this idiot Vitale telling people to stop getting tested, and against wearing masks?



> In April, Rep Vitale made his personal views on masks clear after citing religious beliefs as his reason to refuse to wear one in line with recommendations.
> 
> “This is not the entire world,” Rep Vitale wrote in another lengthy Facebook post, The Hill reported. “This is the greatest nation on earth founded on Judeo-Christian Principles.”
> 
> “One of those principles is that we are all created in the image and likeness of God. That image is seen the most by our face. I will not wear a mask,” he continued.



And, that's it, fucking hell. 










						Republican lawmaker demands Americans ‘stop getting tested’ for coronavirus
					

'It is giving the government an excuse to claim something is happening that is not happening', politician says




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 9, 2020)

> “One of those principles is that we are all created in the image and likeness of God. That image is seen the most by our face. I will not wear a mask,” he continued.



I've seen a few of these arguments recently from Americans.  It makes me wonder how they square this with their love of needlessly mutilating their baby boys shortly after birth.

I suppose if I'm looking for logic I should speak to a computer.


----------



## maomao (Jul 9, 2020)

If they insisted on going everywhere naked then I'd give them some leeway but I'm not convinced there's any theological basis for the claimed importance of the lower half of the face.


----------



## editor (Jul 9, 2020)

Fucking hell











						Coronavirus Pandemic Data Explorer
					

Research and data to make progress against the world’s largest problems




					ourworldindata.org
				












						Coronavirus is Going to Go Permanent in America
					

Trump Has No Plan to Beat Covid. America Won’t Have One Until January, 2021. And That Will Be Far Too Late.




					eand.co


----------



## editor (Jul 9, 2020)

Latest map here 









						Coronavirus Pandemic Data Explorer
					

Research and data to make progress against the world’s largest problems




					ourworldindata.org


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 9, 2020)

We are hearing a lot about mass testing in the US so I guess the death rate will be the real indicator and that general trend is still down.  Russia seemingly had a mass testing program which returned a lot of positive tests but their death rate remains fairly low.

Dunno, clutching at straws really.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 9, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> We are hearing a lot about mass testing in the US so *I guess the death rate will be the real indicator and that general trend is still down.*  Russia seemingly had a mass testing program which returned a lot of positive tests but their death rate remains fairly low.
> 
> Dunno, clutching at straws really.



It's not, deaths are starting to go up, in some states hospitals are struggling with the number of covid patients being admitted, and rapidly running out of capacity to treat them.  



cupid_stunt said:


> The Monday figure of 993 and yesterday's 890 were the two highest since 12th June, but sadly expected since the increase in new cases started to take off mid-June, when the 7-day rolling average was around 22k a day, now it's a shocking 54k a day.
> 
> We are just seeing the lag between higher number of cases, followed by news stories of hospitals struggling, and then the increase in daily deaths.


----------



## Raheem (Jul 9, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> We are hearing a lot about mass testing in the US so I guess the death rate will be the real indicator and that general trend is still down.  Russia seemingly had a mass testing program which returned a lot of positive tests but their death rate remains fairly low.
> 
> Dunno, clutching at straws really.


America is at the higher end compared to other counties in terms of testing, but I think it would need to be a very far-flung outlier for that to be the explanation, and it isn't.


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 9, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> It's not, deaths are starting to go up, in some states hospitals are struggling with the number of covid patients being admitted, and rapidly running out of capacity to treat them.



Yeah I was looking at the general trend across the states as a whole, clearly state by state is very different.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 9, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Yeah I was looking at the general trend across the states as a whole, clearly state by state is very different.



New cases are raising in 35 states ATM.


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 9, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> New cases are raising in 35 states ATM.



Yes but the point I was making is that 'seek and you will find'.  The more people you test the more cases you'll find, its not necessarily an indicator of a situation getting worse it can be just you're getting a more accurate picture of how things actually are.

Of course, its almost certainly not the case in the states hence the clutching at straws comment but in theory it is possible,


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 9, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Yes but the point I was making is that 'seek and you will find'.  The more people you test the more cases you'll find, its not necessarily an indicator of a situation getting worse it can be just you're getting a more accurate picture of how things actually are.
> 
> *Of course, its almost certainly not the case in the states hence the clutching at straws comment but in theory it is possible,*





Everything is possible in theory, but it doesn't appear to be the case, their testing on a per million basis is lower than a number of European countries, and they are going in the opposite direction on important measures, such as new cases, hospital admissions, and now daily deaths too. 

Time to let those straws go.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 9, 2020)

The comments by trump supporters on Twitter are like something from North Korea .


----------



## Supine (Jul 9, 2020)




----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 9, 2020)




----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 10, 2020)

This CNN article also destroys Trump claim.



> Texas, Arizona and Florida, which have seen recent spikes in the number of confirmed cases, have also seen a dramatic increase in their positivity rates -- with Texas jumping from 6.6% to 15.6% in the last month, Arizona increasing from 12.7% to 26.8% in the same time period, and Florida going from 4.1% to 19.1%.
> 
> Texas Gov. Greg Abbott pointed to the positivity rate as a key measure in early May, when the state began to reopen, saying that if the state saw a rate of more than 10% it would serve as a "red flag." Texas surpassed a 10% rate on June 24; Abbott paused the reopening plan the next day.
> 
> Another Republican governor, Florida's Ron DeSantis, acknowledged in late June that the state's spike was not a result of testing increases: "Even with the testing increasing or being flat, the number of people testing positive is accelerating faster than that."





> However, the true number of cases in the US is also very likely much higher than the confirmed number. Robert Redfield, the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, told reporters in late June: "Our best estimate right now is for every case reported there were actually 10 other infections."











						Fact check: No, more testing isn't the reason US coronavirus case numbers are getting worse
					

No matter how high the daily number of new coronavirus cases has gotten, President Donald Trump has responded with the argument he repeated on Thursday: the big number is just more evidence of the country's success with testing.




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## Numbers (Jul 10, 2020)

Jeez, so about 30+ million infected in true numbers and rising fast.


----------



## Chilli.s (Jul 10, 2020)

Its crazy, but the upside is that the world gets to see how not to do it.


----------



## Numbers (Jul 10, 2020)

We’ve seen that with our shower too.


----------



## editor (Jul 10, 2020)

The good news is that the televangelists are doing nicely out of all this. 



> More than 10,600 religious organizations have taken at least $3bn in coronavirus financial aid from the US government, according to an analysis by the Guardian, raising concerns about the separation of church and state.
> 
> The list of recipients of federal Paycheck Protection Program payments includes churches, synagogues, temples and private religious schools. Among them are the ministries of wealthy televangelists accused of fraud and one “secretive sect”.
> 
> ...











						Televangelists take a slice as churches accept billions in US coronavirus aid
					

Concerns raised about separation of church and state, as Guardian analysis shows Jimmy Swaggart and other controversial pastors have accepted loans




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Supine (Jul 10, 2020)

"Today, Americans are only allowed in a few Caribbean islands and the Balkans"


----------



## two sheds (Jul 10, 2020)

How can they invade anyone now?


----------



## Supine (Jul 10, 2020)

Trump did build that wall after all


----------



## Raheem (Jul 10, 2020)

TBF, I'm not sure "Go away, you can't come in" has been all that effective in the past.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 10, 2020)

Yeh, no passports though the miltary's screwed. They'd have to queue at the very least.


----------



## Badgers (Jul 10, 2020)

Supine said:


> "Today, Americans are only allowed in a few Caribbean islands and the Balkans"


Good


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 11, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> 62k cases today



And, just 2 days later - 72k new cases.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 11, 2020)

'Code blue': Texas COVID deaths higher than publicly reported - and spiking


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 11, 2020)

Apparently testing sites can't keep up for the demand for tests


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 11, 2020)

Supine said:


> Trump did build that wall after all



I wonder if the Mexicans are ruing their opposition to Trump's wall?


----------



## elbows (Jul 12, 2020)

Can tell its really bad when even fucking Trump finally wears a mask in public!









						Donald Trump wears face mask for the first time
					

The US president previously said he could not see himself wearing a mask in public.




					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Raheem (Jul 12, 2020)

Looks photoshopped. Is there video?


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 12, 2020)

It is for real.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 12, 2020)

Mark of the devil communist


----------



## elbows (Jul 12, 2020)

Raheem said:


> Looks photoshopped. Is there video?


----------



## Steel Icarus (Jul 12, 2020)

elbows said:


>



Begging for The Imperial March to be dubbed onto that


----------



## two sheds (Jul 12, 2020)

I wonder how silly the twats who've very publically been calling it the mark of the devil and only communists wear them etc feel now. I half wonder though that they don't have the facility for feeling silly - seamlessly into the king is dead long live the king.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 12, 2020)

I'd rather they wore a mask than didn't wear it tho.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 12, 2020)

Yep no argument.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 12, 2020)

He's getting congratulated like a toddler who's just used a potty for the first time - I wonder if he's going to tweet about how amazing he is for doing this wonderful thing and wearing this tremendous mask, which is better than the masks ordinary people have.


----------



## cyril_smear (Jul 12, 2020)

elbows said:


>




It's very becoming; he looks like the lone ranger.


----------



## Cloo (Jul 12, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> He's getting congratulated like a toddler who's just used a potty for the first time - I wonder if he's going to tweet about how amazing he is for doing this wonderful thing and wearing this tremendous mask, which is better than the masks ordinary people have.


Some guy was tweeting how only POTUS was capable of looking strong and manly in a mask


----------



## two sheds (Jul 12, 2020)

Cloo said:


> Some guy was tweeting how only POTUS was capable of looking strong and manly in a mask



seamless


----------



## Cloo (Jul 12, 2020)

cyril_smear said:


> It's very becoming; he looks like the lone ranger.


The good thing is you can see less of his fucking orange face.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 12, 2020)

That's why he's looking stronger and more manly.


----------



## mx wcfc (Jul 12, 2020)

S☼I said:


> Begging for The Imperial March to be dubbed onto that


----------



## two sheds (Jul 12, 2020)

More along the lines of Stan and Olly I'd have thought.


----------



## Dogsauce (Jul 12, 2020)

From:

https x x ://news4sanantonio.com/news/local/i-thought-this-was-a-hoax-patient-in-their-30s-dies-after-attending-covid-party

(link broken as it’s Sinclair Media scum)



> *'I thought this was a hoax': Patient in 30s dies after attending 'COVID party**'*
> 
> A patient in their 30s died from the coronavirus after attending what's being called a "COVID party," according to a San Antonio health official.
> 
> ...


----------



## Tankus (Jul 12, 2020)

two sheds said:


> More along the lines of Stan and Olly I'd have thought.


Benny Hill

All those  uniforms  following  him

speed it up


----------



## Cloo (Jul 12, 2020)

My guess is he's been persuaded by being told that him not wearing one is likely to increase deaths among his voters.


----------



## Cid (Jul 12, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> He's getting congratulated like a toddler who's just used a potty for the first time - I wonder if he's going to tweet about how amazing he is for doing this wonderful thing and wearing this tremendous mask, which is better than the masks ordinary people have.



‘I’ve said masks were great from the beginning. And we’ve got millions of masks. Billions. Tremendous masks, best masks in the world, and we thought of it first.’


----------



## scifisam (Jul 12, 2020)

I'm genuinely surprised MAGA facemasks aren't more popular.


----------



## bimble (Jul 13, 2020)

30-year-old dies after attending 'Covid party' in Texas
					

Patient said: ‘I think I made a mistake, I thought this was a hoax, but it’s not’, according to health official




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 13, 2020)

Florida anti-mask activists give free meals to people without masks as virus cases surge
					

Activists in central Florida protested a countywide face mask order one day before state health officials reported more than 15,000 new coronavirus cases.




					www.newsweek.com
				






> Anti-mask advocates in Florida protested mandatory use of face coverings during an event inside a restaurant and bar near Orlando on Saturday.
> 
> Those responsible for the gathering offered free meals to 100 patrons who opted to dine at the establishment without wearing a face mask, Reuters reported. A video of the weekend's rally showed the central Florida restaurant and bar, 33 & Melt, served dozens of customers that day. No one in the video appears to be wearing a mask.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 13, 2020)

cyril_smear said:


> It's very becoming; he looks like the lone ranger.



The bone spurs ranger


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 13, 2020)

Supine said:


> Trump did build that wall after all



I've been saying for a while that the ultimate purpose of the wall is to keep Americans from leaving, not to keep immigrants from coming in.


----------



## Tankus (Jul 13, 2020)

A harsh education




__





						Florida official who opposed local mask mandate in ‘critical condition’ with COVID-19 | Raw Story
					

A public official in Florida who voted against a resolution requiring people wear face masks…



					www.rawstory.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 13, 2020)

Trump retweeted this


----------



## elbows (Jul 13, 2020)

Yeah, and the toxic Trump administration is also busy undermining Fauci.









						White House targets US disease chief Fauci
					

A memo leaked over the weekend said several officials were "concerned" by Dr Fauci's past comments.




					www.bbc.co.uk
				




So this is where the 'ketchup is a vegetable' Republican tricks of decades gone by led. Meanwhile, the virus does not care about their deadly distortions.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 13, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Trump retweeted this




Fucking hell.


----------



## phillm (Jul 13, 2020)

S☼I said:


> Begging for The Imperial March to be dubbed onto that



I should read the whole thread ......


----------



## phillm (Jul 13, 2020)

Now Fox has been overrun by the commies OAN have stepped up to the plate with their own brand of OANism.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 13, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Trump retweeted this



Because, of course, all world matters are about American politics


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 13, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Trump retweeted this




Yeh.  Sure. I'm going to trust the opinion of a smarmy gameshow host over the scientific consensus.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 13, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> Yeh.  Sure. I'm going to trust the opinion of a smarmy gameshow host over the scientific consensus.



Two smarmy gameshow hosts


----------



## Cloo (Jul 13, 2020)

Cid said:


> ‘I’ve said masks were great from the beginning. And we’ve got millions of masks. Billions. Tremendous masks, best masks in the world, and we thought of it first.’


I think he's just been quoted as saying he supported them all along.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 13, 2020)

Cloo said:


> I think he's just been quoted as saying he supported them all along.



Well, he did introduce a mandatory mask order months ago - although it was only for the White House, and only for people who were going to be near him.


----------



## Cid (Jul 13, 2020)

phillm said:


> Now Fox has been overrun by the commies OAN have stepped up to the plate with their own brand of OANism.




OANanism


----------



## phillm (Jul 13, 2020)

Cid said:


> OANanism



That said wankers aren't cunts and aren't that bad and we've all been one at some time or other. I certainly wouldn't say Trump is a wanker. Wankers never get to the top just cunts. It was ever thus.


----------



## Cid (Jul 13, 2020)

phillm said:


> That said wankers aren't cunts and aren't that bad and we've all been one at some time or other. I certainly wouldn't say Trump is a wanker. Wankers never get to the top just cunts. It was ever thus.




Yeah I did instantly feel a twinge of guilt toward the unfairly-treated Onan.


----------



## phillm (Jul 13, 2020)

Cid said:


> Yeah I did instantly feel a twinge of guilt toward the unfairly-treated Onan.


yeah Onan wasn't a wanker





__





						Onan - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## phillm (Jul 13, 2020)

If it wasn't tragic it would be funny. All records for a shitshow have been broken.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 13, 2020)

phillm said:


> If it wasn't tragic it would be funny. All records for a shitshow have been broken.




It's a bit long mate. What's the gist of it?


----------



## Dogsauce (Jul 13, 2020)

It’s bollocks isn’t it? She keeps going on about the low mortality rate, but that’s only because deaths haven’t caught up with the exponential growth in cases over the last few weeks, it takes typically four or more weeks for this thing to kill you. Those deaths will come.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 14, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> It’s bollocks isn’t it? She keeps going on about the low mortality rate, but that’s only because deaths haven’t caught up with the exponential growth in cases over the last few weeks, it takes typically four or more weeks for this thing to kill you. Those deaths will come.



Sadly I suspect you are right, the 7-day average of daily deaths was down to 516 on 5th July, yesterday it was back up to 753, new cases started to go up slowly mid-June, with serious increases starting the last week of June, and continuing to grow at a rapid rate into July.


----------



## phillm (Jul 14, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> It's a bit long mate. What's the gist of it?


Trump's right everybody else misunderstands whatever his position is on anything and I've got a pathetic crush which is neither healthy or wise. Which means I can do 23 minutes like being charmed by a snake.


----------



## gosub (Jul 14, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Sadly I suspect you are right, the 7-day average of daily deaths was down to 516 on 5th July, yesterday it was back up to 753, new cases started to go up slowly mid-June, with serious increases starting the last week of June, and continuing to grow at a rapid rate into July.




US is a big place, looking at it State by state helps, America Is Reopening. But have we flattened the curve?.  For a man tweeting about "team red" maybe Mr Trump is wearing a black mask for a reason


----------



## RTWL (Jul 14, 2020)

The Trump administration seem to really get a kick out of separating children from  their parents. 

Not content with the 5000 children it has already torn from the arms of their parents(losing the paperwork in the process)it is now using the covid to separate another 300+ . 
Charming.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 14, 2020)

US - Canada border won't be open for non-essential travel for another month.









						Reopen the Canada-U.S. border? Canadians say sorry, but no thanks
					

Restrictions on travel across the border are about to be extended for a fourth time since the start of the pandemic. Most Canadians are fine with that.




					www.politico.com
				






> U.S. lawmakers are applying pressure on Ottawa and Washington to ease restrictions on the Canada-U.S. border, but few Canadians want to welcome their American neighbors any time soon.
> 
> Canadians — and some of their most prominent political leaders — are staunchly opposed to hosting American visitors while the U.S. breaks records on confirmed Covid-19 infections on a daily basis.
> 
> Ontario Premier Doug Ford warned weeks ago against reopening the border, and British Columbia health authorities have released data showing that a large share of the virus strains identified there originated in Washington state.




The local town of Kingston had an outbreak of the virus - at least 20 cases. 
It was traced back to a American who traveled accross the river to Ontario.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 14, 2020)

Looks like another terrible day in Florida with 132 deaths  

This story is also horrific. 









						Texas hospitals are running out of drugs, beds, ventilators and even staff
					

Many Texas hospitals are no longer accepting transfer patients in order to maintain space for a surge that’s expected to come. In some parts of the state, it’s already here.




					www.texastribune.org


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 15, 2020)

Shocking figures here...



> The United States reported over 400,000 new COVID-19 cases for the week ended July 12, up 21% from the previous seven days, and deaths linked to the respiratory disease rose nationally last week for the first time since mid-April.
> 
> More than 5,000 people died from COVID-19 from July 6 to July 12, up 46% from the prior week, according to a Reuters analysis of data from The COVID Tracking Project, a volunteer-run effort to track the outbreak.





> Testing for COVID-19 rose by 7.4% in the United States last week and set a new record high on July 10, with over 823,000 tests performed, the Reuters analysis found.
> 
> Nationally, 8.8% of tests came back positive for the novel coronavirus, up from 7.5% the prior week and 5% three weeks ago.
> 
> *Thirty-one states had positivity test rates above 5%, according to the analysis, including Arizona at 27%, South Carolina at 19% and Florida at 19%. *



 









						Reuters | Breaking International News & Views
					

Find latest news from every corner of the globe at Reuters.com, your online source for breaking international news coverage.




					uk.reuters.com


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 15, 2020)

Who is being tested there? Anyone with symptoms or is it more wide ranging? 27% is crazily high


----------



## Tankus (Jul 15, 2020)

Are the tests chargeable ? If your going to fork out, more than likely you would have a suspicion?


----------



## Maltin (Jul 15, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Who is being tested there? Anyone with symptoms or is it more wide ranging? 27% is crazily high


As most healthcare is private, I guess if you want one, you can get a test. I spoke to someone there yesterday who chose to get an antibody test to see if she had had it previously even though I don’t think she had felt ill and thought she had had it.


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 15, 2020)

Maltin said:


> As most healthcare is private, I guess if you want one, you can get a test. I spoke to someone there yesterday who chose to get an antibody test to see if she had had it previously even though I don’t think she had felt ill and thought she had had it.



The more we learn the more likely it seems that the antibody tests are a waste of time / money on the individual level.  Sure they are important from a data gathering perspective but to us as individuals?  Nah.  Keep your pennies.


----------



## Cloo (Jul 15, 2020)

This is rather damning:


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 15, 2020)

Oklahoma's Republican governor, who oversaw one of the fastest reopenings in the country and went to Trump's Tulsa rally last month, says he has tested positive for COVID-19, but he's still against a mask mandate because it would "open up a big can of worms."


----------



## tony.c (Jul 15, 2020)

Cloo said:


> This is rather damning: View attachment 222397


And it was tweeted by the Lincoln Group - a more traditional conservative Republican Party group opposed to Trump.


----------



## elbows (Jul 15, 2020)

Lets see if they blatantly try to fuck with some of the data.



> Dr Fauci's comments come after reports that as of 15 July, US hospitals will have to report Covid-19 patient data to the federal health agency in Washington instead of the Centers for Disease Control (CDC).
> 
> The CDC, the US's top public health institute, has until now been responsible for handling data about the pandemic from its hospital network.
> 
> Health experts have expressed concerns that data will be politicised, become less transparent and possibly affect the work of researchers and modellers.











						Coronavirus: US disease chief Dr Anthony Fauci calls White House attacks 'bizarre'
					

Dr Anthony Fauci says recent efforts by the Trump administration to discredit him are "nonsense".



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 16, 2020)

Two interesting articles









						'From worst to first': These states have tamed coronavirus, even after reopening. Here's how they're doing it, and why they can't let up
					

While more than half the states have paused or backtracked reopenings due to increased Covid-19, several states have decreasing rates of infection, hospitalizations and deaths -- paving the way for full economic reopenings.




					www.cnn.com
				












						N.J. can ‘go after’ travelers who violate coronavirus quarantine, Murphy says
					

Gov. Phil Murphy has said New Jersey, unlike New York, won't fine travelers who don't comply.




					www.nj.com


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 16, 2020)

elbows said:


> Lets see if they blatantly try to fuck with some of the data.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



A government doing its best to undermine one of its top medical experts. The mind boggles. Wouldn't be so stupid as to fire him, or would they?


----------



## petee (Jul 16, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Good



no, it isn't.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 16, 2020)

petee said:


> no, it isn't.



Obviously, it's not "good" that so many cases are in the US. Surely its a good idea to restrict travel for Americans just for now?


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 16, 2020)

It's a bit of a mess at US bases in Okinawa:


The coronavirus outbreak has only fueled that anger, which rose further with confirmation this week from U.S. Marine Corps Air Station Iwakuni, on the Japanese mainland, that an American couple and their 10-year-old daughter had tested positive for the virus after arriving from the U.S.

The family flew in on a commercial flight from the U.S. to Tokyo's Haneda airport on Sunday, and like all other international arrivals they were given COVID-19 tests. But before getting the results of those tests, the family reportedly boarded a domestic flight — against rules barring newly-arrived passengers from public transport — to get to the Marine base.

Japan "extremely concerned" as 136 COVID cases reported on U.S. bases


----------



## Supine (Jul 16, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> Wouldn't be so stupid as to fire him, or would they?



That's literally the only thing trump is good at!


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 16, 2020)

krtek a houby said:


> A government doing its best to undermine one of its top medical experts. The mind boggles. Wouldn't be so stupid as to fire him, or would they?



Trump can't fire him directly because of measures in place to stop career civil servants being fired for political reasons, according to CNN - although he does have the power to sideline him, which he has already done.









						Can Trump fire Fauci? Technically, no
					

President Donald Trump on Monday sought to downplay tension with Dr. Anthony Fauci after a White House official shared a statement that appeared to undermine the nation's leading infectious disease expert.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 16, 2020)

This is a good article covering the regional versions of Covid across the US, and how the national daily deaths figures 'hides' just how bad things are going in the south & west, because their rapidly increasing crisis is off-set by falling death rates in the northeast & midwest.





> The regional variation of the American outbreak is crucial to understanding both what happened and what’s going to happen next. Nationwide, the U.S. deaths per million tally—a hair under 400—is in the top ten globally. But look just at the Northeast’s 56 million people, and the death rate is more than double the national average: 1,100 deaths per million.
> 
> By contrast, the South and West—where SARS-CoV-2 is burning through the population—are much more populous than the Northeast. If those areas continue to see cases grow, they could see as many deaths per million as the Northeast did but multiplied by a larger number of people. At 1,100 deaths per million, the South and West would see 180,000 _more_ deaths. Even at half the Northeast’s number, that’s another 69,000 Americans.
> 
> ...











						A Second Coronavirus Death Surge Is Coming
					

There was always a logical explanation for why cases rose through the end of June while deaths did not.




					www.theatlantic.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 16, 2020)

There's not enough of these >   for this news.



> As the tally of coronavirus infections reported in the United States rapidly approaches 3.5 million, the debate over mask-wearing has gotten so heated that complete strangers are coming to blows.
> 
> On Wednesday, both Walmart and the state of Alabama came out in favor of mandatory face coverings, suggesting that science was beginning to prevail over partisan debate.
> 
> Mere hours later, though, *Georgia Gov. Brian Kemp (R) issued an order nullifying all local mask mandates* and a Utah county commission meeting had to be postponed after anti-mask protesters caused it to devolve into chaos.





			https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/07/16/coronavirus-live-updates-us/


----------



## two sheds (Jul 16, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> There's not enough of these >   for this news.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



"and a Utah county commission meeting had to be postponed after anti-mask protesters caused it to devolve into chaos."

The meeting was broken up violently by police with multiple arrests. 

.... oh wait.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 16, 2020)

Does anyone know reason for the difference in numbers between the covid tracking sites (worldometers etc) ?


----------



## Tankus (Jul 16, 2020)

Self selecting people who feel a need for a test ...with good reason it seems


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 16, 2020)




----------



## Sunray (Jul 16, 2020)

Remember when I said he's gone a bit extra crazy, it appears he's doubling down on crazy now!!  I know we all know it, but I really have to rely on the US Generals to ignore him.

From 4:11 on here to see just how crazy he has got now.


----------



## Supine (Jul 16, 2020)

What the USA needs now is LESS data on the covid situation


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 17, 2020)

Sunray said:


> Remember when I said he's gone a bit extra crazy, it appears he's doubling down on crazy now!!  I know we all know it, but I really have to rely on the US Generals to ignore him.
> 
> From 4:11 on here to see just how crazy he has got now.



Confusing. Does he mean that Obama and Biden have stopped getting themselves tested?


----------



## killer b (Jul 17, 2020)

He was talking about swine flu apparently


----------



## killer b (Jul 17, 2020)

(details here: Trump Misleads on H1N1 Swine Flu Testing)


----------



## elbows (Jul 17, 2020)

Supine said:


> What the USA needs now is LESS data on the covid situation



Sadly it looked like that was going to happen the other day, talked about it briefly on Wednesday.

I'm still tracking the individual state data for a small handful of states, because that can be obtained from individual states websites, although the nature of the data varies quite a lot per state. Here is Texas:


Data is from several different links on this page: https://www.dshs.state.tx.us/coronavirus/additionaldata/


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 17, 2020)

77,000 new cases reported Thursday, a new record - less than a month after 37,000 new cases in a day was the new record.

They're fucked, and all their president is going to do is go on Twitter and boast about how the number of cases shows how tremendous their testing is.


----------



## Tankus (Jul 17, 2020)

spreader event right here









						‘Jesus gives us a choice!’ Utah public meeting goes off the rails as Trump fans denounce mask order
					

Anti-mask demonstrators derailed Utah County commission meeting about the state mandate requiring schoolchildren to wear face coverings when classes begin. About 150 parents wearing “Trump 2020” hats and carrying American flags crowded into the small meeting room, pulled tape off seats to mark...




					www.rawstory.com
				



trump  truly has lifted a stone


----------



## elbows (Jul 17, 2020)

> Sixty percent of Americans disapprove of the president's response to Covid-19 - up from 53% in May - while 38% approve. Of those who disapprove, the poll found 52% disapprove "strongly".
> 
> Six in 10 Americans said they did not trust what Trump said about Covid-19 - including nearly three in 10 Republicans.
> 
> ...



From BBC live updates page at 14:13 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-53440144


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 17, 2020)

__





						HuffPost is now a part of Verizon Media
					






					www.huffingtonpost.ca
				



Article headline is "Trump Spokesperson On Border Closure: Americans Don’t Want To Go To Canada Anyway"
"



> Border restrictions on non-essential travel between Canada and the United States were officially extended until Aug. 21 this week amid the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic. But a spokesperson for U.S. president Donald Trump’s campaign says he can’t imagine why Americans would want to come to Canada anyway.
> 
> In an on-air interview for CNN Right Now with Brianna Keilar, Trump campaign press secretary Hogan Gidley was asked about the extended border restrictions in relation to Trump’s coronavirus response.
> 
> ...





Actually, a lot of Americans want to come up here.









						Nearly 5,000 U.S. citizens tried to enter Canada for shopping, recreation amid pandemic: CBSA
					

According to new data from the Canada Border Services Agency, more than 10,000 U.S. citizens have been turned away at the Canadian border during the pandemic — and almost half of them were hoping to enter Canada to shop, go sightseeing or simply for recreation.



					www.ctvnews.ca
				






> However, despite these efforts, some U.S. citizens have made their way across the border and been fined in Canada after failing to follow public health rules.
> 
> A Florida couple was issued provincial offence notices and each received a $1,000 fine after they entered Canada in Fort Erie to attend a seasonal property on July 3.
> 
> The two did not comply with the 14-day period of self-isolation after entering the country.


----------



## maomao (Jul 17, 2020)

Can't you just walk across most of the border anyway? It's five and a half thousand miles long and the Canadians haven't built a wall yet.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 17, 2020)

Many refugees from the States do cross in this manner.

If you walk across, you will not have a car.
Stuff is quite a distance away if you are walking.

We, fellow Canadians, harass people when we see American licence plates.


----------



## petee (Jul 17, 2020)

killer b said:


> (details here: Trump Misleads on H1N1 Swine Flu Testing)



"mislead".
not "lie", mind.


----------



## scifisam (Jul 17, 2020)

A lot of my friends in the US are strongly against kids going back to school without masks and social distancing. 

I'm not exactly sure how to respond - their R level in some states is really low, and in the states where it's high the schools opening at all is the problem. You can't realistically teach with a mask on or with kids wearing masks, and social distancing for young kids is absolutely impossible. There are other measures to take, which our schools are planning, the "bubbles," staggered start times, smaller classes, etc - we'll see how they work out, but at least it's not a choice between all kids in school unmasked and no kids in school.

But a lot of my friends seem to think that 7-year-olds should only be allowed into school with masks on. These are often people with kids, too. 

I don't get it.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 18, 2020)

scifisam said:


> But a lot of my friends seem to think that 7-year-olds should only be allowed into school with masks on. These are often people with kids, too.
> 
> I don't get it.



Maybe, they don't want their children to die.

I have a 7 year old granddaughter.  She understands masks and is proud to wear hers.

She has already had the virus, along with the rest of her family.  She knows it is "yukky".

If her school wants her to wear her mask, she will.

On the upside, Ottawa has very low infection rate right now.  Masks may not be required, we will see.

In the words of my country, "We got this" and "It will be OK".


----------



## scifisam (Jul 18, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Maybe, they don't want their children to die.
> 
> I have a 7 year old granddaughter.  She understands masks and is proud to wear hers.
> 
> ...



Yeah, but requiring little kids to wear masks while actually being taught is unrealistic. They just won't be able to learn properly, and they'll take the masks off a lot. 

You don't want your grandchildren to die, but asking them to wear masks in a normal classroom is not the solution.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 18, 2020)

scifisam said:


> Yeah, but requiring little kids to wear masks while actually being taught is unrealistic. They just won't be able to learn properly, and they'll take the masks off a lot.
> 
> You don't want your grandchildren to die, but asking them to wear masks in a normal classroom is not the solution.




A while back, there was a picture of a school opening and there was Plexiglas around the students desks. 
I'm surprised that our school boards have not considered that option.

I also saw images of children sitting in the playground.  There were many circles on the ground, and the children had to sit in their circle for recess.
I don't want our schools to mimic that 

A comment on your post -> why do you think children will have a problem with the masks?   Right now, they are required everywhere.  That is our reality.


----------



## Numbers (Jul 18, 2020)

Tankus said:


> spreader event right here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What the fudge is wrong with these people.


----------



## Tankus (Jul 18, 2020)

Theres a lot of them too ....Trump is still polling 36% ...... just what does it take ......?


----------



## Pingety Pong (Jul 18, 2020)

scifisam said:


> Yeah, but requiring little kids to wear masks while actually being taught is unrealistic. They just won't be able to learn properly, and they'll take the masks off a lot.
> 
> You don't want your grandchildren to die, but asking them to wear masks in a normal classroom is not the solution.



You could make them wear masks though when they are moving around the school - that's what is being done at a lot of German schools.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 20, 2020)




----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 20, 2020)




----------



## editor (Jul 20, 2020)

Crazy people


----------



## editor (Jul 20, 2020)

editor said:


> ---


Some of the responses are fucking insane:

Do you need a mask?"
"No"
"Why not?"
"I live here"

Some guy even wanted to fight them!


----------



## editor (Jul 20, 2020)




----------



## petee (Jul 20, 2020)

...


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 20, 2020)

With trump in total denial, with a policy that seems based on him screaming 'go away' at the virus, more grim news from across the pond...

Here are some significant developments:

Kentucky, Louisiana, Oregon and South Carolina all set new single-day records on Sunday, contributing to a nationwide tally of 64,650 new known cases. Idaho, Nebraska, Iowa and five other states have seen their seven-day average for daily new fatalities rise by more than 40 percent in the past week.

More than 100 Florida hospitals have run out of ICU beds for adults. The state has reported more than 10,000 new covid-19 cases on 12 separate days this month.

Vulnerable GOP senators are facing heightened pressure as they work to craft new coronavirus relief legislation in an election year. Meanwhile, President Trump said Sunday that he will not consider signing any aid bill that does not include a payroll tax cut.

Though most states are now requiring masks and recent CDC reports confirm their effectiveness, Mississippi Gov. Tate Reeves (R) told CNN’s “State of the Union” on Sunday that he doesn’t plan to make face coverings mandatory. “If I believed that was the best way to save lives in my state, I would have done it a long time ago,” Reeves said.

Los Angeles is “on the brink” of shutting down again, Mayor Eric Garcetti (D) said Sunday. Over the past week, Los Angeles County has seen its highest number of coronavirus-related hospitalizations since the pandemic began.





__





						Loading…
					





					www.washingtonpost.com


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 20, 2020)

Trump might as well be asking the virus for advice at this point.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 21, 2020)

I wonder how his never-maskers are going to take this?
Do you think they will start wearing masks to prove themselves as patriotic Americans?


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 21, 2020)

"Mr. President, if wearing masks is patriotic, does that mean Joe Biden, who you made fun of months ago for wearing a mask, is more patriotic than you?"

"I think that's a bad question and you're a horrible person."


----------



## Celyn (Jul 21, 2020)

editor said:


> Some of the responses are fucking insane:
> 
> Do you need a mask?"
> "No"
> ...


And you can avoid the coronavirus by breathing salt water. It must be sea salt, though.


----------



## petee (Jul 21, 2020)

editor said:


> Crazy people




along the same lines


----------



## elbows (Jul 21, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> I wonder how his never-maskers are going to take this?
> Do you think they will start wearing masks to prove themselves as patriotic Americans?



Well that is likely the psychology behind this belated Trump mask stuff. Wouldnt expect it to change all the anti-mask wearers behaviour, but some for sure. May also influence the holdout state & local county level authorities who havent been keen to pass mask-related legislation.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 21, 2020)

Vulnerable Border Community Battles Virus on ‘A Straight Up Trajectory’
					

In the Rio Grande Valley, poverty and chronic illness are aggravating the coronavirus outbreak. Ambulances stack up outside emergency rooms, where patients wait for beds.




					www.nytimes.com
				




This story is very hard to read.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 21, 2020)

I can't wait for the "Room Next Door" installment with Trump's press briefing today, in which he stayed relatively on-message and offered largely sensible advice, before telling a reporter that he wishes Ghislaine Maxwell well.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 21, 2020)

editor said:


>


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 22, 2020)

So, 1119 deaths reported yesterday, the highest daily figure since 2nd June, several states that were quick to reopen, such as Florida, Arizona and Texas, each counted more than 130 new deaths, and report their hospitals are overwhelmed. 

And, Trump created this mess by putting pressure on states to lift lock-downs far too early, because 'it's going to disappear', now he finally admits it “will probably, unfortunately, get worse before it gets better.”


----------



## weltweit (Jul 22, 2020)

Seems scary that in the US they seem to be forgetting the virus in their rush to open their economy. The numbers of infections and deaths are just scary, surely they can't ignore them much longer?


----------



## existentialist (Jul 22, 2020)

weltweit said:


> Seems scary that in the US they seem to be forgetting the virus in their rush to open their economy. The numbers of infections and deaths are just scary, surely they can't ignore them much longer?


Watch them do just that.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 22, 2020)

Yeah 1119 deaths is unbelievable.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 22, 2020)

US public increasingly skeptical of Covid-19 death toll, poll finds this is worrying, talking about how 31% of people in the US think the pandemic is exaggerated. In actual fact its likely to be significantly more than reported.


----------



## LDC (Jul 22, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> US public increasingly skeptical of Covid-19 death toll, poll finds this is worrying, talking about how 31% of people in the US think the pandemic is exaggerated.



Yeah, saw that, depressing. Closely matched to the media they watch.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 22, 2020)

There's scum like Alex Berenson (who openly admitted he doesn't give a shit if people die) who are making a living claiming its just flu as well.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 22, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> US public increasingly skeptical of Covid-19 death toll, poll finds this is worrying, talking about how 31% of people in the US think the pandemic is exaggerated. In actual fact its likely to be significantly more than reported.



And, this is at a time when it's getting worst, and there's increasing coverage of hospitals being overwhelmed, unbelievable.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 22, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> US public increasingly skeptical of Covid-19 death toll, poll finds this is worrying, talking about how 31% of people in the US think the pandemic is exaggerated. In actual fact its likely to be significantly more than reported.



Close to the figure for hard-core Trump voters it seems


----------



## LDC (Jul 22, 2020)

I worry that POV is growing here a bit....


----------



## two sheds (Jul 22, 2020)

?

Eta: ah ok, understand now - growing on urban75 too, really?

Eta eta: ah ok, really understand now - sad if true.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 22, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> I worry that POV is growing here a bit....


I think it's an inevitable part of the human reaction - denial often arises, along with all the other defence mechanisms, like blame, anger, etc. Most of us will catch that, and think on, to realise that our denial is an invalid response, but quite a few people will stop at that point and simply believe their own denial, unchallenged.


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 22, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> I worry that POV is growing here a bit....



Hopefully only a bit?
I'd be surprised if virus-disbelief was as high as 31% in the UK, surely??
Admittedly I can only speculate, but maybe someone else has some poll-data or something


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 22, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> I worry that POV is growing here a bit....


Same


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 22, 2020)

To what extent though?

I doubt any of know with any confidence how much virus-disbelief there is around??


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 22, 2020)

I think a big part of it for scum like Berenson is the fact of who this virus is killing too.


----------



## killer b (Jul 22, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> I worry that POV is growing here a bit....


The recording fuck up by PHE has been a shot in the arm for these types, but most of the people talking loudly about it are people who've been talking quietly about it before now IME.


----------



## Steel Icarus (Jul 22, 2020)

I guess when you have a president only ever saying what people want to hear, eventually they won't believe anything they don't want to hear


----------



## existentialist (Jul 22, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Hopefully only a bit?
> I'd be surprised if virus-disbelief was as high as 31% in the UK, surely??
> Admittedly I can only speculate, but maybe someone else has some poll-data or something


It's an inevitable aspect of the way we think.

We are under threat from an invisible, intangible agent whose existence very few of us can directly observe. So it comes down to trust, and belief. For some people, it is easier to believe that the whole thing is a hoax than it is to believe that the sort of people with the ability to directly observe the existence of the virus are telling the truth.

That'd be very hard to get numbers for via polling, at least with any decent confidence factor. But we can reasonably deduce that it exists, both from observing existing behaviours, and from a knowledge of the way people, in general, tend to think.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 22, 2020)

I've also seen a few coronavirus necklaces, socks, earrings, cuddly toys etc lately. I think some people are trying to portray it as something cute to manage the fear lol.


----------



## NoXion (Jul 22, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> I think a big part of it for scum like Berenson is the fact of who this virus is killing too.



Who's Berenson?


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 22, 2020)

NoXion said:


> Who's Berenson?



Scumbag covid truther, there's an interview with him here. 









						An Ex-Times Reporter. An Ohio Wedding Provider. Covid Contrarians Go Viral.
					

Anger at lockdowns and mask mandates provides fertile ground for arguments about the best way to fight the virus.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Badgers (Jul 22, 2020)

Nice words from a nice man about schools in the US


----------



## Tankus (Jul 22, 2020)

Vaccine.? ?large scale testing ......said trump.?..   think I'll  wait for Fauchi

6 months late...trumps doing a presser....wheres hes finally pushing mask wareing and washing hands...blaming protests and bars for the surge


----------



## existentialist (Jul 22, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Vaccine.? ?large scale testing ......said trump.?..   think I'll  wait for Fauchi


Maybe Trump's agenda is to get things as bad as possible, and then produce his Miracle Vaccine with a flourish, and Save America!

He could get nice brown shirts made, with "SA" on the shoulders for the people Saving America


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

Horrifying numbers in the USA


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 23, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Horrifying numbers in the USA



And, sadly it's going to get worst, the NY times is reporting the numbers in hospital now match what they were during the last peak in April. 



> At overflowing hospitals in South Texas, patients wait hours in sweltering ambulances and on recliner beds set up in hallways. The number of patients intubated in hospital beds in Tampa, Fla., is growing by the day. In Corpus Christi, Texas, a mobile morgue has arrived.
> 
> About as many people are now known to be hospitalized with the coronavirus in the United States as during any other time in the pandemic, matching the previous peak in April.
> 
> The data, as well as interviews across the country, show a far-reaching crisis. The worst-hit areas in Texas and Florida have approached the peak rates of hospitalization that New York, New Orleans, Chicago and other cities hit in the spring. A wide and growing expanse of hot spots around the country — including Las Vegas, Nashville and Tulsa, Okla. — have worsened over the past two weeks.











						Where the Virus Is Sending People to Hospitals
					

New data from nearly 50 cities shows the number of people hospitalized with coronavirus is rising in a wide expanse of hot spots around the country.



					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Numbers (Jul 23, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Horrifying numbers in the USA


Where do you check froggie?


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

Coronavirus Update (Live): 129,471,257 Cases and 2,828,154 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer
					

Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...




					www.worldometers.info


----------



## Numbers (Jul 23, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Coronavirus Update (Live): 129,471,257 Cases and 2,828,154 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer
> 
> 
> Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...
> ...


Ah OK, I do look on there occasionally.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

Or Johns Hopkins university as well.


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 23, 2020)

Whilst we are all looking on in shock and awe at the unwinding disaster that is currently befalling the assorted States of America let's not forget that the Disjointed Kingdom is still doing far worse _per capita _

Granted, figures from the ever reliable World-O-meters, but the Disjointed Kingdom is currently sitting fourth for deaths per million at 670 and hot on the heels of Andorra who have 673. The Americas are currently languishing in eleventh with only 441

And don't, please, forget that our highest single death total was approaching 1500 in a country about 1/5 the size of Trumpland

News, sport and opinion from the Guardian's UK edition | The Guardian › jun
Web results
Nearly 1,500 deaths in one day: UK ministers accused of downplaying Covid-19 peak | World news | The Guardian


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 23, 2020)

High Voltage said:


> Whilst we are all looking on in shock and awe at the unwinding disaster that is currently befalling the assorted States of America let's not forget that the Disjointed Kingdom is still doing far worse _per capita _
> 
> Granted, figures from the ever reliable World-O-meters, but the Disjointed Kingdom is currently sitting fourth for deaths per million at 670 and hot on the heels of Andorra who have 673. The Americas are currently languishing in eleventh with only 441
> 
> ...



That's very true, but the gap is closing, because since the start of July our average daily deaths have almost halved, whereas across the pond they have gone up by around 50%. What's more worrying is deaths tend to go up 4+ weeks after the new cases are reported, and a month ago they were hitting around 30k a day, now it's around 68k a day, so if the death rate follows the usual path, they are going to more than double over the next few weeks. 

Put another way, our 7 day average is currently 64, five times that would be 320, whereas they are on 862 and accelerating. 

On the US page of worldometers you can see the deaths per million for most states, New Jersey has suffered worst so far on 1,777, with New York on 1,677, if the states now getting hit hard get anything like those numbers it's going to be horrific.


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 23, 2020)

I know, it's heart breaking watching what's happening. Like a lot in the DK I have friends and family over there. 

I've already lost one close family member here to this dammed virus when that occurred it really hit home, as Mrs Voltz has since said (it was her last remaining aunt who died), it's not until you actually know someone who's died that or really starts to register, it seems too remote and its easy to brush it off as it not happening to me


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

I'm sorry to hear that


----------



## existentialist (Jul 23, 2020)

High Voltage said:


> I know, it's heart breaking watching what's happening. Like a lot in the DK I have friends and family over there.
> 
> I've already lost one close family member here to this dammed virus when that occurred it really hit home, as Mrs Voltz has since said (it was her last remaining aunt who died), it's not until you actually know someone who's died that or really starts to register, it seems too remote and its easy to brush it off as it not happening to me


It's the thing I was banging on about on another thread: we can't see or detect this virus, so at quite an animal level it's not "there". Even the numbers are, well, just numbers - the more imaginative of us can conceive of some idea of what all this means, but it's not until something happens that directly affects us personally that the reality truly dawns.

And, for some people, even that isn't enough - the "covid deniers" are simply responding to their atavistic "if I can't see it, it doesn't exist" reaction, and then not bothering to do that extra bit of thinking that the rest of us will be doing, which says "but people who DO have ways of 'seeing' it can, and I trust them".

This cognitive dissonance is what I suspect is what will really floor people, trauma-wise, in the aftermath of this.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

existentialist said:


> It's the thing I was banging on about on another thread: we can't see or detect this virus, so at quite an animal level it's not "there". Even the numbers are, well, just numbers - the more imaginative of us can conceive of some idea of what all this means, but it's not until something happens that directly affects us personally that the reality truly dawns.
> 
> And, for some people, even that isn't enough - the "covid deniers" are simply responding to their atavistic "if I can't see it, it doesn't exist" reaction, and then not bothering to do that extra bit of thinking that the rest of us will be doing, which says "but people who DO have ways of 'seeing' it can, and I trust them".
> 
> This cognitive dissonance is what I suspect is what will really floor people, trauma-wise, in the aftermath of this.




Watched an interview  with guy who had caught it in Texas and been in hospital twice (!) And his own son wouldn't wear a mask and refused to believe the virus was real.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 23, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Watched an interview  with guy who had caught it in Texas and been in hospital twice (!) And his own son wouldn't wear a mask and refused to believe the virus was real.


Eric Kahnemann's book, "Thinking Fast & Slow" offers an interesting angle on this kind of thing.


----------



## Teaboy (Jul 23, 2020)

I don't know if this has already been discussed but does anyone else read the thread title in the style of James Brown's singing?  Obviously you need to drop the '19' bit.  I suppose you could do that in the voice of Paul Hardcastle?


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

existentialist said:


> Eric Kahnemann's book, "Thinking Fast & Slow" offers an interesting angle on this kind of thing.



I find it impossible to understand.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 23, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> I don't know if this has already been discussed but does anyone else read the thread title in the style of James Brown's singing?  Obviously you need to drop the '19' bit.  I suppose you could do that in the voice of Paul Hardcastle?



I was thinking Kim Wilde.


----------



## Numbers (Jul 23, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> I don't know if this has already been discussed but does anyone else read the thread title in the style of James Brown's singing?  Obviously you need to drop the '19' bit.  I suppose you could do that in the voice of Paul Hardcastle?


I do now.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

existentialist said:


> It's the thing I was banging on about on another thread: we can't see or detect this virus, so at quite an animal level it's not "there". Even the numbers are, well, just numbers - the more imaginative of us can conceive of some idea of what all this means, but it's not until something happens that directly affects us personally that the reality truly dawns.
> 
> And, for some people, even that isn't enough - the "covid deniers" are simply responding to their atavistic "if I can't see it, it doesn't exist" reaction, and then not bothering to do that extra bit of thinking that the rest of us will be doing, which says "but people who DO have ways of 'seeing' it can, and I trust them".
> 
> This cognitive dissonance is what I suspect is what will really floor people, trauma-wise, in the aftermath of this.



I'm pretty sure at least some covid truthers (like Bolsonaro) do know, they just don't care?


----------



## Dogsauce (Jul 23, 2020)

Poor sods in New York area didn’t know what hit them, it was widespread before anyone could do much about it. That it has reached this level elsewhere several months later when there’s a lot more knowledge about what it is and how it is spread just seems preposterous. It’s criminally negligent that they’ve let it become re-established at this level.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 23, 2020)

This picture of an American boat (top, limited to 50% capacity) and a Canadian boat (bottom, limited to six passengers) at Niagara Falls has led to a certain amount of self-congratulation north of the border - while Canada's pandemic response has undoubtedly been better than the US one, I think the boat passengers should be fine - they're outdoors, wearing masks, and being hit with massive amounts of spray from an enormous waterfall probably limits virus transmission, though I don't think it's something researchers have looked at too closely.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 23, 2020)

editor said:


> Crazy people




Would be funny if it wasn't so sad and horrifying.


----------



## Cid (Jul 23, 2020)

Just doing some reading up... Currently 59,628 _hospitalised_. Fuck. This is roughly the same as the previous highest hospitalisation rate on the 15th April. Just grim.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 23, 2020)

59k in hospital (and no doubt more who haven't had positive tests etc) is a shocking number.


----------



## editor (Jul 23, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> This picture of an American boat (top, limited to 50% capacity) and a Canadian boat (bottom, limited to six passengers) at Niagara Falls has led to a certain amount of self-congratulation north of the border - while Canada's pandemic response has undoubtedly been better than the US one, I think the boat passengers should be fine - they're outdoors, wearing masks, and being hit with massive amounts of spray from an enormous waterfall probably limits virus transmission, though I don't think it's something researchers have looked at too closely.
> 
> 
> View attachment 223347


The America boat should be renamed 'Maid of Idiots.'


----------



## petee (Jul 24, 2020)

Maskless "Holy Karen" Filmed Invoking Jesus To Banish Others From Store Aisle Until She's Done
					

It didn't end well for this Karen though...




					god.dailydot.com
				




_Shoppers at a Fred Meyer in Longview, Washington were greeted with a new form of Karen this week when an anti-mask woman started shouting at anyone coming down the aisle she was currently shopping in, banishing them “in Jesus Christ’s name” until she was finished.

“I command you in Jesus Christ’s name to get off this aisle!” she yells at a retreating masked store employee. “You need to leave, in Jesus Christ’s mighty name!”_

see, this is what happens when you don't have a magisterium.


----------



## RTWL (Jul 24, 2020)

*Trump Is Using Pandemic to Enrich Billionaires as Millions Lose Work & Face Eviction*


----------



## Steel Icarus (Jul 24, 2020)

That's a large font size.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 24, 2020)

petee said:


> Maskless "Holy Karen" Filmed Invoking Jesus To Banish Others From Store Aisle Until She's Done
> 
> 
> It didn't end well for this Karen though...
> ...



Below article is another headline with a fine example of the importance of a written constitution:

[quote]Maskless Customer Demands Her Constitutional Right To Pizza[/quote]

Eta: although now I read it 'Constitution' only appears in the headline  I feel dirty 

Eta eta: although now I actually read it the bloke she's with calls on their First Amendment rights (one assumes to pizza).


----------



## Tankus (Jul 24, 2020)

surprise 








						As Trump Calls for Schools to Fully Reopen, His Son’s School Says It Will Not
					

St. Andrew’s Episcopal School, the private school in the Maryland suburbs attended by Barron Trump, said it was considering either a hybrid part-time plan or going back to entirely online classes.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## yield (Jul 24, 2020)

“Stealth” food banks serve the undocumented
07.21.2020


> Underground food distributions, direct financial assistance, and postings on WhatsApp are some of the ways food banks are reaching out to undocumented clients, a population that has been particularly hard hit by the coronavirus crisis.
> 
> The efforts are designed to combat the chilling effects of the current administration’s immigration policies, which seek to make it harder for immigrants who are not wealthy to gain permanent residence. They go above and beyond more common ways of accommodating the undocumented, such as not asking people about their migration status during food distributions.





> “I was not aware of how scared they were. That was a shock for me.”
> 
> Undocumented clients are especially vulnerable these days because they don’t qualify for the unemployment benefits that other out-of-work people are able to receive. They also fear coming into contact with U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement officers during distributions or endangering their migration status by applying for SNAP.


----------



## RTWL (Jul 24, 2020)

S☼I said:


> That's a large font size.



Yer sorry about that.... copy and paste on my phone is limiting.


----------



## sideboob (Jul 25, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> This picture of an American boat (top, limited to 50% capacity) and a Canadian boat (bottom, limited to six passengers) at Niagara Falls has led to a certain amount of self-congratulation north of the border - while Canada's pandemic response has undoubtedly been better than the US one, I think the boat passengers should be fine - they're outdoors, wearing masks, and being hit with massive amounts of spray from an enormous waterfall probably limits virus transmission, though I don't think it's something researchers have looked at too closely.
> 
> 
> View attachment 223347


The Canadian boat has raised their prices and been marketing it as a VIP cruise.  Good response from the public and its been quite popular apparently.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 25, 2020)

Fucking hell  is this true? Is this really set to go out on local TV? America is completely fucked


----------



## Sue (Jul 25, 2020)

Saw this article the other day about Americans not believing the numbers. I assumed from the headline it'd be people thinking the numbers were higher than reported but no. 









						US public increasingly skeptical of Covid-19 death toll, poll finds
					

Axios-Ipsos poll shows 31% of respondents believe number of Americans dying from virus is smaller than public data portrays




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 25, 2020)

Sue said:


> Saw this article the other day about Americans not believing the numbers. I assumed from the headline it'd be people thinking the numbers were higher than reported but no.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That was posted a few days ago, on one of the threads, it's nuts isn't it?

But, this says a lot...



> Skepticism about coronavirus statistics was heavily correlated with media consumption habits, the poll found. A 62% majority of Fox News watchers said the statistics are overblown, while 48% who reported no main news source thought so. Only 7% of CNN and MSNBC watchers thought so.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 25, 2020)

Posted this on another thread but in fact fact deaths are being significantly undercounted because people get strokes, heart attacks etc which aren't necessarily linked to the virus, there's been a huge increase in these type of deaths. Additionally a lot of US states have huge problems with running out of tests and people are waiting hours for tests if they're able to get it at all, with backlogs of up to two weeks for results.


----------



## Sue (Jul 25, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> That was posted a few days ago, on one of the threads, it's nuts isn't it?
> 
> But, this says a lot...


My niece's GF is from North Carolina and she (niece) was telling me a couple of weeks ago there's some curfew or other in place that no-one's paying any attention to and everything's going on pretty much as normal. The GF's family (not her) don't really seem to believe it exists...   

ETA Mind you, her grandfather apparently believes his wife (her grandmother) died because she came out so....


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 25, 2020)

One of my step-relatives posted a link to this article on his facebook page. It’s getting a lot of support from his other contacts.

It’s nasty ugly shit dressed up as a pantomime version of something intelligent thoughtful. I see a lot of people defriending contacts because they post shit like this. While it makes me feel sad angry and dirty to read it, I think it’s important to see what’s inside their heads. This article covers a lot of ground in short order and gives me a glimpse of what they really feel.

Right at the start of this pandemic I was saying that America would be a shit show, that the hidden schism would open and the supperating wound at the heart of American society would crack open. The BLM movement has precipitated it, but it was happening anyway. This was always going to play out along these particular lines.

I can’t see how this can end well. I can’t imagine any good outcome to this. I see disaster on all sides. Win lose or delay/cancel the election, there will be deeper and more violent dissent. The long-standing gun culture sets dangerous, deadly parameters. The virus will continue to expose binary thinking and arseholery. As the machine feels itself collapsing it will work furiously and with increasing self-destruction to salvage something.

Hopefully out of the chaos something hopeful and clean can emerge, but I highly doubt it will be soon.

Some of my family are talking about leaving their home state, leaving America altogether . I wish they would do that now rather than waiting. My friend who works in the WH (not in the current administration) is telling me how likely a delayed election is (increasingly).

Hate is being emboldend.









						Black Lives Matter reveals a generation of damaged straight, white women
					

The Black Lives Matter movement and the subsequent riots by Antifa, the Democrat party's domestic terrorist arm, have shown Americans what leftism is — an ugly combination of social and government coercion, racism, violence, and anti-Americ...




					www.americanthinker.com
				





I’ve C&P ‘d the whole article here but you’ll have to visit the site to see the videos mentioned.


*Black Lives Matter reveals a generation of damaged straight, white women*
The Black Lives Matter movement and the subsequent riots by Antifa, the Democrat party's domestic terrorist arm, have shown Americans what leftism is — an ugly combination of social and government coercion, racism, violence, and anti-Americanism.  It's also revealed that the American left has been using American blacks as a vehicle for political power without any regard for actually improving black people's lives.  Instead, the left destroys their communities and doubles down on damaging policies.

What few have pointed out, though, is the way BLM protests have revealed the damage that decades of leftist messaging have visited on straight, young, white women.  To set the stage, here are some videos of the hysterical young white women who keep showing up in the front row of the Black Lives Matter movement, whether screaming at police, arguing with black people, rioting, or groveling:























> BLM protesters march through outdoor diners in Novato from r/bayarea




Those videos are just a fraction of the footage showing frenzied white women taking the lead in BLM.  They are deeply involved in this movement and in the ugliest way possible — and therein lies a sad tale of the leftist takeover of straight, white women.

The root problem is that these women are receiving mixed messages that would make even the strongest person go crazy.  Beginning in high school, or even earlier, they're told endlessly that they're both victim and oppressor.

These mixed messages make straight white girls distinct from other students.  White boys are told they're evil, toxic oppressors of both women and minorities.  It's an ugly message, but a consistent one.  Boys lucky enough to have countervailing influences shake it off and become the men they should be.  The boys who don't have better influences, interestingly enough, become feminized, even if they're not gay, as if trying to escape that awful toxic masculinity.

Meanwhile, everyone who is non-white and/or non-straight, whether male or female, or something else, is told that he, she, or it is a victim.  White privilege, racism, homophobia, transgenderism, misogyny — all of them define how non-white and/or non-straight people suffer endlessly at the hands of straight whites.

And then there are the straight, white girls.  On the one hand, they're...well, white and straight.  That means they are evil oppressors who have benefited unfairly from white privilege.  In the morality play that is leftism, they owe the world big-time.  On the other hand, they're women, which means men have victimized them from time immemorial to the present.

That relationship with men is made more toxic by the fact that the young women are told simultaneously (a) that, as liberated women, they should be part of the hook-up culture and (b) that, as biological women, they're the victims of all men's rapacious, rapey sexuality.  Given these mixed messages, it's no wonder that these confused young women willingly sleep with the guy at night and then accuse him of rape in the morning.  Others avoid this confusion by embracing a trendy lesbianism.

These same women are also betrayed by the leftist culture's refusal to accept that motherhood is (a) biological destiny and (b) worthy insofar as creating and raising a human being does give meaning to life.

Once upon a time, women had no life choice other than motherhood.  In a pre–free market, pre-industrial world, if one ignores the infinitesimally small number of wealthy women, any search for meaning in life was overwhelmed by the endless struggle to survive.  Women didn't have time to compare their lives to men, especially because the men were also fighting for survival against the untamed forces of nature and other men.

With the industrial era and the development of free-market capitalism, things changed.  In the West, ordinary people had time for leisure, contemplation, and the search for meaning.

That fundamental change led to the post-industrial, pre-modern cult of motherhood.  Cornelia, Mother of the Gracchi, who lived in Rome in the Second Century B.C., leaped into prominence.  People in the 18th and 19th centuries loved that, when catty friends asked why Cornelia wasn't wearing jewels, she pointed to her sons and said, "These are my jewels."

Today's young women are told to focus on a career.  In college, though, they take liberal arts classes that don't prepare them for anything useful but do reinforce their status as both victims and oppressors.  They leave college, uneducated and unskilled, which leads them to unfulfilling jobs.  At those jobs, they work hard while dating frantically.  When they find the right man, they get pregnant, drop out of the job market, and resent their husbands' careers.  They take all the energy that was meant for their professional success and pour it into hyper-motherhood and activism.  (See those raging Portland moms above.)

None of this is healthy; it is, instead, tragic.  Straight white women hate themselves for being white; hate their men for being oppressors; hate their meaningless careers; and, even though they love their children, they hate the seeming meaninglessness of motherhood.  This profound cognitive dissonance has finally found its most disturbing outlet in their shrill, existential screams on the streets of the Black Lives Matter protests.

_Image: Cornelia, Mother of the Gracchi, by Philipp Friedrich Hetsch._


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 25, 2020)

Ugh the misogyny is just dripping out of it.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 25, 2020)

Truly ugly. Articles like that.. so dangerous. And am seeing variants of it online more and more often.

Elections aren't going to change this shit.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 25, 2020)

It’s hideous, eh.


----------



## Steel Icarus (Jul 25, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Fucking hell  is this true? Is this really set to go out on local TV? America is completely fucked



In such a litigation happy country I'm surprised people dare say stuff like that


----------



## Raheem (Jul 25, 2020)

S☼I said:


> In such a litigation happy country I'm surprised people dare say stuff like that


In a case like this, Fauci would have to prove "actual malice", because he is a public official. Unless he could get the evidence to prove this woman doesn't believe what she's saying, there's no defamation.


----------



## two sheds (Jul 25, 2020)

I'm sure the language is  suitably couched. If Musk can win a defamation case for calling someone a pedo guy anything seems allowable.


----------



## BlanketAddict (Jul 25, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> One of my step-relatives posted a link to this article on his facebook page. It’s getting a lot of support from his other contacts.
> 
> It’s nasty ugly shit dressed up as a pantomime version of something intelligent thoughtful. I see a lot of people defriending contacts because they post shit like this. While it makes me feel sad angry and dirty to read it, I think it’s important to see what’s inside their heads. This article covers a lot of ground in short order and gives me a glimpse of what they really feel.
> 
> ...



The schisms are not hidden in America. Some are more subtle than others but they are there in pretty plain sight. 

Civil War might sound like hyperbole until you look at its history. Less than 250 years old and look at the carnage, home and abroad. 

I say all this as someone who has spent some great times over there, in numerous locations. Some great people and some great ideals but they are currently fucked...


----------



## Badgers (Jul 26, 2020)




----------



## petee (Jul 26, 2020)




----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 26, 2020)

See also:







__





						Loading…
					





					www.washingtonpost.com
				







“He said that wearing the hood was not intended to be a racial statement,” the sheriff’s office said. “In summary, he said, ‘It was a mask and it was stupid.’”


So that’s alright then.


And apparently the swastika people were protesting against having to wear a mask. America is a nazi state. Or something.

Anyway. They were served trespass notices.









						Couple flaunt swastika face masks at southwestern Minnesota Walmart
					

At the request of the Marshall, Minn., store, the two were told they'll face arrest if they return there.




					m.startribune.com


----------



## emanymton (Jul 26, 2020)

I really don't understand how people can be so passionate about not wanting to wear a mask. Even if you don't think they work (and I am far from convinced mask wearing is all that effective) or think the whole thing is a hoax there seem to be more important hills to die on.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 26, 2020)

emanymton said:


> I really don't understand how people can be so passionate about not wanting to wear a mask. Even if you don't think they work (and I am far from convinced mask wearing is all that affective) or think the whole thing is a hoax there seem to be more important hills to die on.



Yeah, precisely - we're 6 months into a global pandemic, examples from other countries and a growing body of research suggest wearing face masks in enclosed spaces does a lot to limit the spread of a virus, People in some places have voluntarily started wearing masks in public places, in other jurisdictions, authorities have decided to make mask-wearing mandatory.

So you can A) agree that wearing a mask limits the spread of the virus and wear a mask. B) Disagree about the science, but wear a mask anyway because you could be wrong, and also because you're required to. C) Disagree about the need to wear a mask, kick up a massive fucking stink about it, argue with and threaten minimum-wage workers tasked with enforcing mask orders, whinge about your freedoms being taken away, try to undermine the mask order by wearing your mask incorrectly, defiantly go maskless and shoot anybody who challenges you, or make a mask with a fucking swastika on it and attempt to draw a parallel between a public health order in a democratic state and the genocidal policies of Nazi Germany.

The US definitely isn't the only place where people are choosing option C, but it seems to have a high proportion of them, probably because it has a president who spent several months shunning them, questioning their usefulness, and stressing that they should be optional, before doing a 180 and claiming, bizarrely, that wearing a mask is "patriotic."


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 26, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Yeah, precisely - we're 6 months into a global pandemic, examples from other countries and a growing body of research suggest wearing face masks in enclosed spaces does a lot to limit the spread of a virus, People in some places have voluntarily started wearing masks in public places, in other jurisdictions, authorities have decided to make mask-wearing mandatory.
> 
> So you can A) agree that wearing a mask limits the spread of the virus and wear a mask. B) Disagree about the science, but wear a mask anyway because you could be wrong, and also because you're required to. C) Disagree about the need to wear a mask, kick up a massive fucking stink about it, argue with and threaten minimum-wage workers tasked with enforcing mask orders, whinge about your freedoms being taken away, try to undermine the mask order by wearing your mask incorrectly, defiantly go maskless and shoot anybody who challenges you, or make a mask with a fucking swastika on it and attempt to draw a parallel between a public health order in a democratic state and the genocidal policies of Nazi Germany.
> 
> The US definitely isn't the only place where people are choosing option C, but it seems to have a high proportion of them, probably because it has a president who spent several months shunning them, questioning their usefulness, and stressing that they should be optional, before doing a 180 and claiming, bizarrely, that wearing a mask is "patriotic."



His gaslighting can't be good for the mental health of the country.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 26, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> So you can A) agree that wearing a mask limits the spread of the virus and wear a mask. B) Disagree about the science, but wear a mask anyway *because you could be wrong*, and also because you're required to. C) Disagree about the need to wear a mask, kick up a massive fucking stink about it, argue with and threaten minimum-wage workers tasked with enforcing mask orders, whinge about your freedoms being taken away, try to undermine the mask order by wearing your mask incorrectly, defiantly go maskless and shoot anybody who challenges you, or make a mask with a fucking swastika on it and attempt to draw a parallel between a public health order in a democratic state and the genocidal policies of Nazi Germany.


I think an unintended consequence of the post-Thatcher (other national equivalents are available) move to neoliberal thinking has been the collective individual notion that "I can't be wrong", alongside another: the "I'm all right, Jack" mentality. We've legitimised that as a viewpoint to the extent that people not able or willing to think things through feel very content to take the "I believe it, so that's my truth and screw you" line. I know it's not new - it's an essentially human characteristic - but it's much more a part of how "society" thinks now.

And that combination results in a situation where many people will only wear a mask if it suits THEM, and the idea that their own personal views on the efficacy of masks might not be the overriding factor in the whole thing is conveniently left at the door (or, rather, wrapped around a brick and hurled through the nearest window).

Mass deaths might be one way that ludicrous ideology finally gets knocked off its pedestal.


----------



## BristolEcho (Jul 26, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> One of my step-relatives posted a link to this article on his facebook page. It’s getting a lot of support from his other contacts.
> 
> It’s nasty ugly shit dressed up as a pantomime version of something intelligent thoughtful. I see a lot of people defriending contacts because they post shit like this. While it makes me feel sad angry and dirty to read it, I think it’s important to see what’s inside their heads. This article covers a lot of ground in short order and gives me a glimpse of what they really feel.
> 
> ...



Ugh. I've had to log out of twitter because bots just regurgitate all of this pretty much. There's no point in arguing it on there.

(Sorry if you read this before my edit I wrote regurgitate it by accident and I meant arguing it. Wasn't a dig at your for posting.)


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 26, 2020)

As far as I understand it cloth masks limit the possibility for you to give the virus to others but don't necessarily stop you getting it yourself.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 26, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> As far as I understand it cloth masks limit the possibility for you to give the virus to others but don't necessarily stop you getting it yourself.


That's not how I understand it. They reduce the risk of both catching, and transmitting the virus. What they don't do is eliminate the risk of either, just substantially lower it.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 26, 2020)

existentialist said:


> That's not how I understand it. They reduce the risk of both catching, and transmitting the virus. What they don't do is eliminate the risk of either, just substantially lower it.



Shame here. When you think about it, if they reduce droplets getting out, they must reduce droplets getting it, to some degree.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 26, 2020)

It’s the combination of all parties in any interaction wearing masks that really makes the difference to transmission rates.


ETA with other measures such as hand washing and distancing too


ETAA
So I wonder if these mask rebels, who are also getting up in people’s faces, are also refusing to wash their hands. Are they going to claim that the advice to wash their hands frequently is also anti-democratic?

I don’t think they really understand what “democracy” means. If most people want to wear masks, would they still refuse on the grounds that it’s anti-democratic ?


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 26, 2020)

Removed.
wrong thread...


----------



## Gimigimi (Jul 26, 2020)

emanymton said:


> I really don't understand how people can be so passionate about not wanting to wear a mask. Even if you don't think they work (and I am far from convinced mask wearing is all that effective) or think the whole thing is a hoax there seem to be more important hills to die on.


It's not really about masks. It's extremely bad for Americans that it's being expressed through mask refusal of all the goddamn things, because the virus is spreading faster and faster, but it's really not about masks at all. It's about people adopting a narrative that makes them feel like they have some control over their lives. The idea of a shared society or a government that is working to protect or help people in any way is dead in America. There is little trust in any institution and those on the right have only their individualist ethos to carry them through their days. Not wearing a mask and arguing that you have a right not to is a way of asserting your individualism and independence, of feeling like you have some control and power over one little thing when you feel adrift and alone. 

It's absolutely fucking disgusting that this anti-mask stuff was picked up and spread around by the usual right-wing grifters, because it's going to get god knows how many people killed, in addition to fucking over the lives of... well, basically everyone who is going to have to live through eternal lockdown because the virus is completely out of any semblance of control now. My personal story: I've managed to get myself involved with a Canadian woman over the internet (thanks to the lockdown ironically), and I've never wanted anything more in my life than to just get the fuck out of this country and go hide in her bed until this is over, but I can't because the borders are closed and I have no idea when I'll be able to. I can't even go to a club or bar and hook up with some rando to deal with loneliness. I'm spending my evenings walking through the woods (with a mask on because there's literally dozens of people doing the exact same thing every night) with my phone talking to her because I want to be with her so badly. Meanwhile my fucking city is full of tear gas and paramilitaries. I went out a few days ago to wander around Seattle because I was tired of sitting at home, and ended up feeling way worse after giving myself the grand tour. It looks like a fucking Fallout game. Everything is boarded up, there's graffiti everywhere that says stuff like "we will land on our feet", "don't give up hope", "this too shall pass", there's hardly anyone on the streets, etc. I guess I should consider myself really lucky because at least I have someone to give me support now - a lot of people I know are kind of breaking down mentally at this point. Things are already worse here than I would have imagined possible and we hit a new low every day...


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 26, 2020)

I’m so sorry Gimigimi .
I wish it could be different.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 26, 2020)

I'm so sorry.


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 27, 2020)

Gimigimi said:


> My personal story: I've managed to get myself involved with a Canadian woman over the internet (thanks to the lockdown ironically), and I've never wanted anything more in my life than to just get the fuck out of this country and go hide in her bed until this is over, but I can't because the borders are closed and I have no idea when I'll be able to.



Where about does she live?
The newspapers are telling how Americans are getting into Canada.
I'll be more that happy to research it for you.


----------



## Gimigimi (Jul 27, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Where about does she live?
> The newspapers are telling how Americans are getting into Canada.
> I'll be more that happy to research it for you.


That's a really nice offer, but there are a few other things keeping me here at the moment besides just the borders being closed. I only mentioned it because it was on my mind a lot and related to covid. Thanks for all the sympathy everyone, but I'm doing fine really compared to most people. I've got secure housing and someone to lean on. Most people have it worse, I'm just anxious by nature and a little overly emotional recently because I haven't been in love for a while


----------



## editor (Jul 27, 2020)

existentialist said:


> I think an unintended consequence of the post-Thatcher (other national equivalents are available) move to neoliberal thinking has been the collective individual notion that "I can't be wrong", alongside another: the "I'm all right, Jack" mentality. We've legitimised that as a viewpoint to the extent that people not able or willing to think things through feel very content to take the "I believe it, so that's my truth and screw you" line. I know it's not new - it's an essentially human characteristic - but it's much more a part of how "society" thinks now.
> 
> And that combination results in a situation where many people will only wear a mask if it suits THEM, and the idea that their own personal views on the efficacy of masks might not be the overriding factor in the whole thing is conveniently left at the door (or, rather, wrapped around a brick and hurled through the nearest window).
> 
> Mass deaths might be one way that ludicrous ideology finally gets knocked off its pedestal.


Throw in Facebook/social media feeding these people the stories they want to hear from fellow fucking idiots, backed by relentless a stream of lunatic 'news' and unchallenged nutjob YouTube videos that expertly pander to their prejudices, and you've got the perfect storm for sheer ignorance winning over common sense and logic.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 27, 2020)

This is grim.   



> A surge in coronavirus cases in rural Texas has forced one hospital to set up “death panels” to decide which patients it can save and which ones will be sent home to die.
> 
> Doctors at Starr County Memorial hospital, the only hospital in Starr county, have been issued with critical care guidelines to decide which Covid-19 patients it will treat and which ones will be sent home because they are likely to die. The committee is being formed to alleviate the hospital’s limited medical resources so doctors can focus on patients with higher survival rates.
> ---
> “Unfortunately, Starr County Memorial Hospital has limited resources and our doctors are going to have to decide who receives treatment, and who is sent home to die by their loved ones.”











						Texas hospital forced to set up 'death panel' as Covid-19 cases surge
					

A surge in coronavirus cases in rural Texas has forced one hospital to set up ‘death panels’ to decide which patients it can save




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 27, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> This is grim.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sounds an awful lot like the argument that's used against "socialised medicine"


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 27, 2020)

High Voltage said:


> Sounds an awful lot like the argument that's used against "socialised medicine"



And those decisions will (probably ?) not be based on purely clinical grounds. Or perhaps I'm cynical ?
Triage decisions should be based on purely clinical criteria, not whether the patient has proper medical insurance, cash in hand or other factors.


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 27, 2020)

StoneRoad said:


> ...Or perhaps I'm cynical?
> Triage decisions should be based on purely clinical criteria, not whether the patient *has proper medical insurance*, cash in hand or other factors.



The bit I've emboldened is, for me, potentially the worrying bit - and as for being cynical? It's what the naive and gullible call a realist imo

Anyhoo - the proper insurance could very VERY easily be perverted into the "which insurance pays the hospital the MOST"


----------



## existentialist (Jul 27, 2020)

High Voltage said:


> The bit I've emboldened is, for me, potentially the worrying bit - and as for being cynical? It's what the naive and gullible call a realist imo
> 
> Anyhoo - the proper insurance could very VERY easily be perverted into the "which insurance pays the hospital the MOST"


That's the thing, isn't it? It doesn't stop when you have the insurance. Because, if my understanding is at all accurate, there are LOADS of exclusions (and that's before you get into pre-existing conditions , or mental health   ), and then there's the "co-pay" (US health insurance's equivalent of an excess, I think). And - in my own field of healthcare - a lot of what is done is dictated by, not what is clinically most appropriate for the client, but what the insurance company are prepared to fund, which is, increasingly, forms of manualised short-term work that does nothing to help people with long-term mental health conditions, early life trauma, etc. If you want that, you'd better be prepared to pay handsomely for it.


----------



## little_legs (Jul 27, 2020)




----------



## gentlegreen (Jul 28, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> The MMS nuts are real scum.



At last...


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 28, 2020)

The 7-day average of daily new cases has dropped by about 1,000 a day in the last week, but is still around 67,500, and guess what?

Yes, Trump is once again calling on the states to re-open.   



> President Donald Trump said Monday that states should begin reopening their businesses as the coronavirus outbreak in parts of the United States shows its first signs of slowing.
> 
> “I really do believe a lot of the governors should be opening up states that are not opening,” Trump said during a coronavirus briefing from the Bioprocess Innovation Center at Fujifilm Diosynth Biotechnologies in Morrisville, North Carolina. “We’ll see what happens with them.”
> ---
> While cases appear to be slowing, public health officials and infectious disease experts warn that reopening businesses too early could cause another resurgence in new Covid-19 cases. Early in the outbreak, U.S. cases peaked at around 30,000 new cases a day before falling and plateauing at roughly 20,000 new cases per day in mid-May. As some states began to reopen in late April through June, new cases began to surge, with the U.S. now reporting more than 60,000 new cases a day.











						Trump says states should reopen as U.S. coronavirus outbreak shows signs of slowing
					

President Donald Trump said Monday that states should begin reopening their businesses as the coronavirus outbreak in parts of the United States shows its first signs of slowing.




					www.cnbc.com


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 28, 2020)

The number of tests is slowing tho


----------



## existentialist (Jul 28, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> The 7-day average of daily new cases has dropped by about 1,000 a day in the last week, but is still around 67,500, and guess what?
> 
> Yes, Trump is once again calling on the states to re-open.
> 
> ...


It's like he hasn't got a clue what a second-order differential is!


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 28, 2020)

And I'm not surprised that the virus is currently slowing tbf given the huge amount of publicity given to overwhelmed hospitals in Florida, Texas and so on even if things are still open, the number of states with mask requirements and so on. None of that is down to Trump tho, in fact he might as well be asking SARS-COV-2 for advice


----------



## Steel Icarus (Jul 28, 2020)

existentialist said:


> he hasn't got a clue!


ftfy


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 28, 2020)

existentialist said:


> It's like he hasn't got a clue what a second-order differential is!



<Goes off to Google>
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
<still hasn't got a fuckin' clue>


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 28, 2020)

existentialist said:
			
		

> It's like he hasn't got a clue what a second-order differential is!





High Voltage said:


> <Goes off to Google>
> .
> 
> <still hasn't got a fuckin' clue>



Glad it's not just me on that one  

</semi-numerate ....  >


----------



## existentialist (Jul 28, 2020)

High Voltage said:


> <Goes off to Google>
> .
> .
> .
> ...


First-order differential: rate of change.
Second-order differential: rate of change of the rate of change.

My point was that Trump seems to be confusing the slow-down in the rate of increase of infections (2nd order) with a slow-down in the rate of infections themselves (1st order). Though my "A"-level Mathematics with Computations is now in the dim and distant past, so I could have it all wrong anyway. Bessel's Formula is pinging a distant, rusty bell in my head.

Or possibly not - he's probably just being a twat. #explainingjokessucks


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 28, 2020)

existentialist said:


> First-order differential: rate of change.
> Second-order differential: rate of change of the rate of change.
> 
> My point was that Trump seems to be confusing the slow-down in the rate of increase of infections (2nd order) with a slow-down in the rate of infections themselves (1st order). Though my "A"-level Mathematics with Computations is now in the dim and distant past, so I could have it all wrong anyway. Bessel's Formula is pinging a distant, rusty bell in my head.
> ...



OOooooooo!!

THAT Second-order differential


----------



## pesh (Jul 28, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> The 7-day average of daily new cases has dropped by about 1,000 a day in the last week, but is still around 67,500, and guess what?
> 
> Yes, Trump is once again calling on the states to re-open.
> 
> ...



sounds legit


----------



## existentialist (Jul 28, 2020)

pesh said:


> sounds legit



I wonder if that would look quite exponential if you plotted it on a graph


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 28, 2020)

Trump shatters his own show of responsibility on the pandemic
					

The idea that President Donald Trump has turned some new leaf and is now maturely leading the fight against the pandemic is yet again being exposed as a pure political play by his own behavior.




					www.cnn.com
				






> Then the President retweeted a video in which a group of doctors make false claims about the virus, including one who says "you don't need masks" because hydroxychloroquine, an anti-malaria drug pushed by the President, is a "cure" in combination with several other drugs.
> 
> Multiple credible scientific studies say the treatment is ineffective against Covid-19.
> 
> The video, which went viral on YouTube, was later removed by Facebook and Twitter because it spread misinformation.


----------



## NoXion (Jul 28, 2020)

pesh said:


> sounds legit




Are we still welcoming travellers from the US? I don't fancy catching Yankee flu.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 28, 2020)

NoXion said:


> Are we still welcoming travellers from the US? I don't fancy catching Yankee flu.



They have to quarantine for 14 days.


----------



## existentialist (Jul 28, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> They have to quarantine for 14 days.


For all that's going to mean in practice


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 28, 2020)

existentialist said:


> For all that's going to mean in practice



Well, at least four people have been fined, one by the police & three by the UK Border Force.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 28, 2020)

Listened to this week in virology podcast, apparently the situation in Texas isn't looking as bad as it was which was good, the number of hospitalizations is reducing. This is possibly down to more people wearing masks etc?


----------



## Badgers (Jul 28, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> They have to quarantine for 14 days.


Pffffftttt


----------



## Cid (Jul 28, 2020)

How thorough are they at checking up? I’m guessing not very... I mean afaik all you need to do is provide the address and contact for where you’re staying. And ‘I was on the shitter’ for house calls or ‘don’t have a uk mobile and host was out’ for phone checks. Not like many people have landlines anyway.

I had a mate over from the Netherlands just  after they introduced the corridors (yes we were also pretty responsible about where we went - hiking largely), seemed pretty lax. I mean obviously he didn’t have to quarantine, but think procedure was largely the same but with a ‘why I am exempt’ box.


----------



## emanymton (Jul 28, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Trump shatters his own show of responsibility on the pandemic
> 
> 
> The idea that President Donald Trump has turned some new leaf and is now maturely leading the fight against the pandemic is yet again being exposed as a pure political play by his own behavior.
> ...


Even if true the old saying is true prevention is better than a cure. 

Unless you happen to manufacture the cure that is. Or get money from those that do.


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 28, 2020)

150k dead


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 28, 2020)

If true this is good news.


----------



## elbows (Jul 29, 2020)

He'll be promoting going down the garden to eat worms as a cure at this rate.



> Asked about the persistent absence of Dr Anthony Fauci, the nation’s top infectious disease expert, at Donald Trump’s briefings, the president mused about his health official’s approval rating.
> 
> Fauci has “got a very good approval rating and I like that”, Trump told reporters. And Fauci was working with the administration, “so why don’t I have a very high approval rating?” the president wondered out loud.
> 
> “But nobody likes me,” Trump said. “It can only be my personality, that’s all.”











						Trump says 'nobody likes me' when asked about Fauci's absence – as it happened
					

Barr bemoans the ‘demonization of police’ following Floyd’s killing at House judiciary committee hearing




					www.theguardian.com
				






> This morning, Fauci was asked about the coronavirus disinformation that Trump has promoted on social media during an interview with ABC. “I don’t tweet, I don’t even read them. I don’t really want to go there,” he told Good Morning America. “I just will continue to do my job, no matter what comes out, because I think it’s very important.”


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 29, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Trump shatters his own show of responsibility on the pandemic
> 
> 
> The idea that President Donald Trump has turned some new leaf and is now maturely leading the fight against the pandemic is yet again being exposed as a pure political play by his own behavior.
> ...




This video has been scrubbed form social media’s, but it’s still being posted up all over the place.

One of the doctors is this woman:









						The controversial views of doctor whose coronavirus theory got Trump Jr suspended from Twitter
					

Doctor Stella Immanuel went viral in video insisting hydroxychloroquine is a 'cure'




					www.independent.co.uk
				












						Trump’s New COVID Doctor Says Sex With Demons Makes You Sick
					

The president is pushing the coronavirus theories of a Houston doctor who also says sexual visitations by demons and alien DNA are at the root of Americans’ common health concerns.




					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 29, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> This video has been scrubbed form social media’s, but it’s still being posted up all over the place.
> 
> One of the doctors is this woman:
> 
> ...




yip - the internet never forgets


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 29, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> This video has been scrubbed form social media’s, but it’s still being posted up all over the place.
> 
> One of the doctors is this woman:
> 
> ...


The thing which really pisses me off about headlines with things like "controversial theory" in them is it could give a ring of credibility to the story to the "less critical and easily persuaded reader, rather than coming out with a more accurate and, truth be told eye catching headline with words like "lie" or "wildly inaccurate" or the ever popular "bull shit"


----------



## William of Walworth (Jul 29, 2020)

The words 'barking levels of insanity' also spring quickly to mind


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 29, 2020)

Oh, good grief.
Tango man is still going on about that discredited treatment ...









						Coronavirus: Hydroxychloroquine ineffective says Fauci
					

The researcher tells BBC Trump's claims about the drug's effectiveness are not backed by science.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 29, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> The words 'barking levels of insanity' also spring quickly to mind



Exactly, a phrase like that - a phrase obviously grounded in science


----------



## elbows (Jul 29, 2020)




----------



## gentlegreen (Jul 29, 2020)

darn - so damn close ...


----------



## 8ball (Jul 29, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> This video has been scrubbed form social media’s, but it’s still being posted up all over the place.
> 
> One of the doctors is this woman:
> 
> ...



Do we have any evidence on how likely you are to get sick if the demon is wearing a mask?


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 29, 2020)

8ball said:


> Do we have any evidence on how likely you are to get sick if the demon is wearing a mask?



It's a tricky one.

The virus is a hoax but the demons are real. So how can a real demon infect you with a fake virus?

But if the people who don't believe in the demons get infected with a fake virus,  then they're being tricked into believing they're infected by a fake virus by a real demon, even though they don't believe in the demon.


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 29, 2020)

Y'see, it's critical thinking like this that put a man on the moon . . . or did it


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 29, 2020)

My radio station covers the upper New York state.  
To day, they ran an announcement that the intercity buses will start running again.

The bus line requires you to book 24 hours before the bus leaves.
Also, the announcement continued, all passengers must wear masks.

"If you are too sick to wear a mask, you are too sick to ride on public transit."

Way to go, Malone!!!!


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 29, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> It's a tricky one.
> 
> The virus is a hoax but the demons are real. So how can a real demon infect you with a fake virus?
> 
> But if the people who don't believe in the demons get infected with a fake virus,  then they're being tricked into believing they're infected by a fake virus by a real demon, even though they don't believe in the demon.




No, I think she was claiming that sex with aliens gives you gynecological issues.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 29, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> My radio station covers the upper New York state.
> To day, they ran an announcement that the intercity buses will start running again.
> 
> The bus line requires you to book 24 hours before the bus leaves.
> ...



Is it that game where everyone tries to outcunt each other, or am I getting something confused?


----------



## spring-peeper (Jul 29, 2020)

8ball said:


> Is it that game where everyone tries to outcunt each other, or am I getting something confused?




I don't understand.
I don't consider wearing masks is a game.
I don't consider enforcing masks is a game.

Maybe that is the difference between our cultures - we don't think anything to do with the virus as a "game".


----------



## 8ball (Jul 29, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> I don't understand.
> I don't consider wearing masks is a game.
> I don't consider enforcing masks is a game.
> 
> Maybe that is the difference between our cultures - we don't think anything to do with the virus as a "game".



Which culture is this again?


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

Edited to move toxic waste to another thread.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I don’t know where to put this.
> 
> We need a Venn diagram thread for this shit.
> 
> ...



I think ctrl-X is a better choice for that one than ctrl-C, ctrl-V


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 30, 2020)

The death rate continues to grow, with 1,330 new deaths recorded on Tuesday and 1,485 on Wednesday, both being the biggest increases since 1,567 on 27th May, taking the 7-day average above 1,000 again, the first time since early June, and it's expected to continue to increase over the coming days & weeks, proper grim.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

8ball said:


> I think ctrl-X is a better choice for that one than ctrl-C, ctrl-V



I do think it’s important to know how these people are thinking.

I consider dropping this person as a Facebook friend because he is deeply unpleasant, but he is step family, and involved with good people that I know and love.

I have lots of family in America who are facing down this shit on a daily basis. Rather than turn my face away I’d rather witness the things they are having to deal with so that I can understand it better and stand shoulder to shoulder with them. And I’m doing my best to counter it when I can, although it feels like singing solo in the teeth of a howling wind.

I’ll stop posting it here if Urban would rather not see it.


----------



## Cid (Jul 30, 2020)

> I do think it’s important to know how these people are thinking.
> 
> I consider dropping this person as a Facebook friend because he is deeply unpleasant, but he is step family, and involved with good people that I know and love.
> 
> ...



Probably just put it in quotes/spoilers and make the context more clear.


----------



## Steel Icarus (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I do think it’s important to know how these people are thinking.
> 
> I consider dropping this person as a Facebook friend because he is deeply unpleasant, but he is step family, and involved with good people that I know and love.
> 
> ...


There's a Corona panic/memes/conspiracy thread. I agree it's important to keep tabs on the madness


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

S☼I said:


> There's a Corona panic/memes/conspiracy thread. I agree it's important to keep tabs on the madness



Yeah it probably should go in there. I posted late last night and I wasn't sure whether it was Trump Covid conspiracy combination of all of those things or something else. I’ll ringfence it and put it in a different thread.


----------



## LDC (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I do think it’s important to know how these people are thinking.
> 
> I consider dropping this person as a Facebook friend because he is deeply unpleasant, but he is step family, and involved with good people that I know and love.
> 
> ...



Someone I know in the UK (and mentioned on another thread) has now 'come round' to a pro-Trump position and was posting stuff like that up on FB. They went from hippie health food mother earth nonsense through anti-vax and 'natural healing' stuff to CV conspiracy theory then 5G/Rothschilds NWO/antifa are paid by Soros, George Floyd's death was fake to pro-Trump right wing stuff. They're like a case study in how this gets people.


----------



## Cid (Jul 30, 2020)

Sorry that post is proving in incredibly annoying to edit on phone...


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> Someone I know in the UK (and mentioned on another thread) has now 'come round' to a pro-Trump position and was posting stuff like that up on FB. They went from hippie health food mother earth nonsense through anti-vax and 'natural healing' stuff to CV conspiracy theory then 5G/Rothschilds NWO/antifa are paid by Soros, George Floyd's death was fake to pro-Trump right wing stuff. They're like a case study in how this gets people.




I work in my local health food shop and I’m getting so tired of listening to the bullshit conspiracy theories I’m hearing in there. It’s definitely getting worse.

Most people who shop there are absolutely lovely, but there is an increasingly vociferous  and persistent chorus across all demographics who seem to be swallowing the stuff whole and regurgitating it as proselytising. 

I’m trying to understand why this stuff has gained so much traction.


----------



## krtek a houby (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I work in my local health food shop and I’m getting so tired of listening to the bullshit conspiracy theories I’m hearing in there. It’s definitely getting worse.
> 
> Most people who shop there are absolutely lovely, but there is an increasingly vociferous  and persistent chorus across all demographics who seem to be swallowing the stuff whole and regurgitating it as proselytising.
> 
> I’m trying to understand why this stuff has gained so much traction.



It scares me.

This is one of the few places such bullshit can be cut down and debunked.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I’m trying to understand why this stuff has gained so much traction.



People are suggestible, but the official narrative stretches credulity too much for some.
Why they then jump to another narrative that stretches credulity even further is the puzzling part.


----------



## gentlegreen (Jul 30, 2020)

I just got booted and entirely blocked on an anti-Tory group (I can no longer even see the group)  for daring to defend glyphosate ... it was all about "killing bees" - so tainted by Seneffism, but they denied autism was going to be mentioned.
The final straw seemed to be when I suggested I might post photos of the rats Séralini tortured to get his bogus results.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 30, 2020)

June 20:




Today:









						Former GOP presidential candidate Herman Cain dies after battle with coronavirus
					

Cain, a former presidential hopeful who was once considered by President Donald Trump for the Federal Reserve,




					www.cnbc.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 30, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Today:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> Cain had attended Trump’s rally in Tulsa, Oklahoma, less than two weeks before receiving his diagnosis.



It keeps getting close to Trump, surely it will get him soon.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 30, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> It keeps getting close to Trump, surely it will get him soon.



I'm not so sure - the White House seems to have a very thorough testing program, mask-wearing orders, etc. for people who are going to be anywhere near Trump, showing that he does know how to control the virus, but he's only willing to do so when his personal health is at risk.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> One of my step-relatives posted a link to this article on his facebook page. It’s getting a lot of support from his other contacts.
> 
> It’s nasty ugly shit dressed up as a pantomime version of something intelligent thoughtful. I see a lot of people defriending contacts because they post shit like this. While it makes me feel sad angry and dirty to read it, I think it’s important to see what’s inside their heads. This article covers a lot of ground in short order and gives me a glimpse of what they really feel.
> 
> ...



I've been packing up and getting rid of things I don't need.  I realized a few weeks ago that what I was subconsciously doing was getting ready to move.  To where I do not know.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 30, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> I've been packing up and getting rid of things I don't need.  I realized a few weeks ago that what I was subconsciously doing was getting ready to move.  To where I do not know.



The dolphins have refused to look at any more asylum claims.


----------



## petee (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> who are facing down this shit on a daily basis.



thanks, this really is the core of it, I've pointed it out here too, not always to effect, which does leave me furiously frustrated i admit.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> I've been packing up and getting rid of things I don't need.  I realized a few weeks ago that what I was subconsciously doing was getting ready to move.  To where I do not know.




I really feel for you.

My brother lives there with his family. He has a British passport and he’s talking about relocating to London. His wife really wants to do it. But they seem to be dragging their heels, and that worries me.

But at least they do have the opotion of coming here. I have other good friends and family over there who are seriously talking about relocating, to least away from the South, but they currently don’t have a clue about what they can realistically do about moving (where how etc). But even those who live in more northern states, even democratic supporting areas, are taking about their fears for the future and all the what-ifs.

No one can be surprised by Trump’s “suggestion” today that the election be delayed. And I hate to say it, but a cousin (who recently holidayed in Florida and refuses to wear a mask and is now whining because his friends won’t visit him) has been suggesting it as something he really wants for about a month. This idea of a delayed election has been swirling around amongst Trump supporters for some time already.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

Another relative is posting up shit to debunk the virus on a daily basis. They all come from right, far right and alt-right sources. I’ve tried to debate some of the facts and numbers with with him, to no avail. He doesn’t even seem to realise that this hasn’t happened within some kind of American bubble. He doesn’t seem to hear me when I say “Are these same agitators also doing the same work in Italy, Spain, the UK?”

And he’s a rich successful insurance salesman. I know they’re inherently parasitic, but I assumed they generally had some kind of basic statistical literacy. But nope, he disputes all the facts, all the numbers.


----------



## 8ball (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> He doesn’t even seem to realise that this hasn’t happened within some kind of American bubble.



The one that astonished me was the conspiracy theory that the virus had been faked so people would stay indoors and Trump could rescue some children from under Central Park.  The whole thing in order to keep a small proportion of New Yorkers in their houses (and keep some tourists away, I guess).


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)




----------



## 8ball (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


>











						QAnon Idiots Very Concerned About Mole Children Now
					

Yes. Mole children.




					www.wonkette.com


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> I really feel for you.
> 
> My brother lives there with his family. He has a British passport and he’s talking about relocating to London. His wife really wants to do it. But they seem to be dragging their heels, and that worries me.
> 
> ...



I don't blame your brother and his wife for thinking of leaving.  Things will get nasty no matter who wins the next election (assuming there is one.)  I'm with you, they should make that decision sooner rather than later.  

I have the option of going back home.  Its so far out in the middle of nowhere that the feds wouldn't notice its there and the locals aren't exactly friendly when law enforcement starts asking questions.


----------



## petee (Jul 30, 2020)

major league trumper dies of it





__





						Herman Cain, former presidential candidate and Trump surrogate, dies after battling COVID-19 | abc7ny.com
					

Former Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain has died after battling coronavirus for nearly a month, his official website posted Thursday morning and a source close to the White House confirmed to ABC News.




					www.google.com


----------



## two sheds (Jul 30, 2020)

I think you'll find he was actually killed by a Deep State operative.


----------



## petee (Jul 30, 2020)

two sheds said:


> I think you'll find he was actually killed by a Deep State operative.


 
who threw coronavirus at cain


----------



## petee (Jul 30, 2020)

minor league trumper too









						Turning Point USA co-founder dies of coronavirus-related complications
					

Bill Montgomery started the pro-Trump student group along with Charlie Kirk, its current leader.




					www.politico.com


----------



## gentlegreen (Jul 30, 2020)




----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 30, 2020)

This ^^^ is why we need the   reaction.


----------



## elbows (Jul 30, 2020)

Theres nothing astonishing about QAnon theories these days, they started off from a position that had no basis in reality and its all downhill from there.



elbows said:


>




These awful shits always find a new ridiculous way to spin events:



> "I can't help but think that if I hadn't been wearing a mask so much in the last 10 days or so — I really wonder if I would've gotten it," Gohmert said. "But I know moving the mask around, getting it just right, I'm bound to put some virus on the mask that I sucked in. That's most likely what happened."











						Trump-loving Texas Rep. Louie Gohmert blames wearing a face mask for his positive COVID-19 test
					

Gohmert was filmed not wearing a mask near Attorney General Barr on Capitol Hill. One day later, he tested positive




					www.salon.com


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

gentlegreen said:


>





Uh-oh....


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> I don't blame your brother and his wife for thinking of leaving.  Things will get nasty no matter who wins the next election (assuming there is one.)  I'm with you, they should make that decision sooner rather than later.
> 
> I have the option of going back home.  Its so far out in the middle of nowhere that the feds wouldn't notice its there and the locals aren't exactly friendly when law enforcement starts asking questions.



It’s so strange that these conversations are happening in real life now, not just as some kind of what-if parlour game.

The prepares are probably delighted by the whole thing, feeling all righteous and self  congratulatory.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

8ball said:


> QAnon Idiots Very Concerned About Mole Children Now
> 
> 
> Yes. Mole children.
> ...




Wow.

Not come across that one before now.

Although I woman in the shop yesterday was telling me about how the UK government are paying someone, not sure who, to inject Bangladeshi 14-year-olds (very specific) in London with the test vaccine. She was in tears when she was talking about this, she feels genuinely traumatised by the things that she believes.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jul 30, 2020)

I know this is off topic for this particular thread, but it’s all connected isn’t it (if your pardon the expression)

I heard a weird conspiracy theory a couple of weeks ago about a furniture warehouse selling children online.









						Wayfair: The false conspiracy about a furniture firm and child trafficking
					

It's gone global, and involves a US-based furniture company and unfounded allegations of human trafficking.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 30, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> It’s so strange that these conversations are happening in real life now, not just as some kind of what-if parlour game.
> 
> The prepares are probably delighted by the whole thing, feeling all righteous and self  congratulatory.



LOL.  I checked in on a few websites last week.  They were in their full apoplectic Armageddon glory.  Their day has come!


----------



## frogwoman (Jul 31, 2020)

That republican senator that turned up to work and announced to all his staff that he had got it


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 31, 2020)

Again, no one is surprised.  That's what it looked like at the time:

*Kushner's coronavirus team shied away from a national strategy, believing that the virus was hitting Democratic states hardest and that they could blame governors, report says*



> Some members of Jared Kushner's coronavirus task force believed the pandemic would affect Democratic areas worse and may have adjusted accordingly, Vanity Fair reported.
> In March and early April, Kushner gathered a team to devise a nationwide coronavirus testing plan.
> A public-health expert in regular contact with the team told the magazine that "the political folks" thought a nationwide response was a bad political move.
> At the time, outbreaks were worst in Democratic-voting states and cities. The source suggested that some close to Kushner thought it was best to hold back and blame governors.
> Kushner's plan was indeed dropped in favor of a mainly state-by-state response. Since then, cases have surged in states on both sides of the political divide.











						Kushner's coronavirus team shied away from a national strategy, believing that the virus was hitting Democratic states hardest and that they could blame governors, report says
					

Some members of Kushner's COVID-19 team thought it was better to leave Democratic-voting areas to fend for themselves, a source told Vanity Fair.




					www.businessinsider.com
				




I would think some criminal law statute would apply there.  If nothing else, you'd think it would be an impeachable offense (but not with this Congress.)


----------



## petee (Jul 31, 2020)

Iowa teachers write and send their own obituaries to governor ahead of fall reopenings
		


"Iowa teachers are sending mock obituaries to Iowa Gov. Kimberly Reynolds (R) in hopes she will reconsider her school plans for the fall"


----------



## phillm (Jul 31, 2020)

gentlegreen said:


>



Had to look him up - looks like Trump has offed one of his own. 

_Health and death
In 2006, Cain was diagnosed with Stage IV colon cancer and metastases to his liver and given a 30 percent chance of survival. Cain underwent surgery and chemotherapy following the diagnosis, and the cancer was subsequently reported to be in remission.[108]

On June 29, 2020 he was diagnosed with COVID-19 and admitted to an Atlanta-area hospital two days later.[109] After four weeks of hospitalization, Cain died from complications due to COVID-19 at age 74.[110][111][112][113]

Cain opposed mask mandates during the coronavirus pandemic.[114][115][116] He attended a Donald Trump rally in Tulsa nine days before he was diagnosed and was photographed not wearing a face mask in a seated crowd who also were not wearing masks.[117] On the day he was hospitalized, he praised South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem for not requiring masks at an upcoming Trump campaign event, tweeting "Masks will not be mandatory for the event, which will be attended by President Trump. PEOPLE ARE FED UP!"[118] The tweet was deleted the day he died.[115] Cain's staff on July 2 said there was "no way of knowing for sure how or where" he contracted the disease.[109] Dan Calabrese, the editor of Cain's website, said, "I realize people will speculate about the Tulsa rally, but Herman did a lot of traveling [that] week, including to Arizona where cases [were] spiking."[44]_









						Herman Cain - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## Tankus (Aug 1, 2020)

> Yuwipi Woman....."I would think some criminal law statute would apply there.  If nothing else, you'd think it would be an impeachable offense (but not with this Congress.)"


 I would have thought, its mass murder , with intent surely ??
They used _whats app_ to communicate to avoid public records .
There's a real creepy clip of Kushner being asked about his secret viral task force a few weeks back  , his snigger then silence as a reply was flat out disturbing then...but now with the death toll heading for quarter of a million Americans by the Nov elections, even ,if they manage to plateau  the outbreak soon. (Which seems highly unlikely with the forced school openings) and this story out in the open  , In retrospect , it now seems pathological. 

Harold Shipman would bow in his honor


----------



## zahir (Aug 1, 2020)

This might give an idea of what to expect from reopening schools.
SARS-CoV-2 Transmission and Infection Among Attendees of an...


----------



## zahir (Aug 1, 2020)

Looking at those figures I’m wondering how much of the overall effect of lockdown has come from closing schools.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Aug 1, 2020)

Tankus said:


> I would have thought, its mass murder , with intent surely ??
> They used _whats app_ to communicate to avoid public records .
> There's a real creepy clip of Kushner being asked about his secret viral task force a few weeks back  , his snigger then silence as a reply was flat out disturbing then...but now with the death toll heading for quarter of a million Americans by the Nov elections, even ,if they manage to plateau  the outbreak soon. (Which seems highly unlikely with the forced school openings) and this story out in the open  , In retrospect , it now seems pathological.
> 
> Harold Shipman would bow in his honor



I'd go so far as suggest the word "genocide."  I don't think its an accident that most of the ppe that have been shipped from the strategic stockpile to native tribes has been broken or unusable.  The Navaho in particular have been hard hit by Corona and they were shipped defective ppe by a company run by a Trump donor.  Another tribe was shipped body bags instead of PPE.  Other aid has been slow in coming to native tribes:



> He says he thinks about that often. After learning nearly 250,000 breathing masks delivered to the Navajo Nation earlier this month may not be suitable for medical use, another 130,000 masks are considered questionable because the serial number on package is different from the one on the box.
> 
> 
> "You can't treat our Navajo Nation this way right now. This is the most dire situation," Arizona Congressman Ruben Gallego (D) Phoenix said. "We need all hands on deck. Not this amateur hour we see happening."
> ...











						Congress to investigate PPE shipments sent to Navajo Nation
					

On the Navajo Nation, nearly everyone wears a mask. "I'm thinking to myself what if these masks were outdated, expired or not even functioning," said Arizona State Representative Arlando Teller, (D) Chinle.




					www.abc15.com
				




A couple of other examples of lack of PPE or other resources to fight Covid 19 on native land:









						A Native health center asked for COVID-19 medical supplies. It got body bags instead.
					

"Are we going to keep getting body bags or are we going to get what we actually need?" a Seattle Indian Health Board official asked.




					www.nbcnews.com
				












						Indian Country faces higher risks, lack of resources in COVID-19 fight
					

As the number of COVID19 cases in the Navajo Nation climbs, experts say they're concerned about the high risk of transmission in Indian Country,




					abcnews.go.com
				












						COVID-19 Further Strains Care Disparities Among Native Americans
					

Underfunded IHS, isolation from resources pose major concern for tribes during pandemic




					www.medpagetoday.com


----------



## phillm (Aug 1, 2020)

Gotta love that Dr Fauci.


----------



## elbows (Aug 1, 2020)

zahir said:


> Looking at those figures I’m wondering how much of the overall effect of lockdown has come from closing schools.



Closing schools also has an effect because it disrupts the behaviour of adults. Combined with the effects of stopping transmission in schools themselves, I tend to think school closures are one of the big impact things available in pandemics, although the UK government was keen to downplay this when they were trying to sell their original plan to the public.


----------



## existentialist (Aug 2, 2020)

elbows said:


> Closing schools also has an effect because it disrupts the behaviour of adults. Combined with the effects of stopping transmission in schools themselves, I tend to think school closures are one of the big impact things available in pandemics, although the UK government was keen to downplay this when they were trying to sell their original plan to the public.


It strikes me that we're reaping a whirlwind of our own making here. In creating a low-wage economy, we created a situation where, in many families, both parents have to work, which was fine as long as we could use the education system to "warehouse" kids. Having taken that flexibility out of the system, it's well nigh impossible to close schools without significant knock-on effects - a parent has to stop working (and earning) to look after the children, which has significant financial implications for the household, not to mention economically. Seems to me that decades of neoliberalism exploitation of the workforce has just started to have its chickens come home to roost.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 2, 2020)

This is a long article, but well worth reading, covering the ongoing situation across the pond.  Arizona, Florida and Texas are still struggling with a surge of hospitalizations and deaths, but seems to be turning around their new infection rates. However, it's now taking off in other states, the ones of most concerned ATM are Alaska, Hawaii, Missouri, Montana and Oklahoma.



> "The dominoes are falling now," said David Rubin, director of the PolicyLab at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia, which has produced a model showing where the virus is likely to spread over the next four weeks.
> 
> His team sees ominous trends in big cities, including Baltimore, Chicago, Detroit, Indianapolis, Kansas City, Louisville, Philadelphia, St. Louis and Washington, with Boston and New York not far behind. And Rubin warns that the expected influx of students into college towns at the end of this month will be another epidemiological shock.
> 
> "I suspect we're going to see big outbreaks in college towns," he said.





> There is one benefit to the way the virus has spread so broadly, he noted: “We no longer have to keep track of people traveling to a hot spot if hot spots are everywhere.”



Well, that's one way of looking at it. 









						Coronavirus threat rises across U.S.: ’We just have to assume the monster is everywhere
					

A briefing document released Friday by the Federal Emergency Management Agency counted 453,659 new infections in the past week.




					www.adn.com


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 2, 2020)

New York? Oh no not again


----------



## editor (Aug 3, 2020)

What's the fucking matter with these idiots?



> The Sturgis Motorcycle Rally has been an annual tradition in South Dakota for 80 years, and despite the fears of many residents, it appears that the 2020 edition of the rally will go forward as planned in the midst of the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> Sturgis expects more than 250,000 people to pass through the city during the Aug. 7 to 16 event, and though that number is only about half of the rally’s typical attendance, it would likely still be the largest gathering in America since the pandemic began. South Dakota has been relatively spared by the coronavirus, recording just 135 deaths from COVID-19, but many are worried that Sturgis could be the cause of an uncontrollable outbreak.
> 
> ...



NY Daily News - We are currently unavailable in your region (you'll need a US idetit


----------



## pesh (Aug 3, 2020)

thats going to get an entire episode in the HBO Corona docu-drama.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Aug 3, 2020)

editor said:


> What's the fucking matter with these idiots?
> 
> 
> 
> NY Daily News - We are currently unavailable in your region (you'll need a US idetit



I love Sturgis.  Got some cousins up that way.  Wouldn't go this year on a bet.


----------



## petee (Aug 3, 2020)

and btw









						Did Obituary Blame Trump for Man's COVID-19 Death?
					

An emotional obituary for David W. Nagy condemned all who have failed to heed the advice of medical professionals during the 2020 coronavirus pandemic.




					www.snopes.com


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 4, 2020)

Unbelievable.


----------



## existentialist (Aug 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Unbelievable.



I think that what is almost more horrific than Trump's statistical illiteracy is the absolute obsession he has with rankings.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 4, 2020)

Surely he gets that being at the top of this particular chart is bad?


----------



## existentialist (Aug 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Surely he gets that being at the top of this particular chart is bad?


I don't think it is a realisation that comes naturally to him...


----------



## Cid (Aug 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Unbelievable.




It's... like some fucking parody. I keep looking at that and think... nah, some Australian comedy show. But no. I mean fuck, it's like he's a character in 'the office' or something, fumbling with erroneous charts. Just fucking terrifying that this is the place the US is in.


----------



## Numbers (Aug 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Unbelievable.



That is just shocking, well it’s not cos it’s Trump, but goodness me.


----------



## magneze (Aug 4, 2020)

The best bit is when he says that "the US is lower than THE WORLD".


----------



## Numbers (Aug 4, 2020)

He’s such a fuckin cretin isn’t he.


----------



## platinumsage (Aug 4, 2020)

magneze said:


> The best bit is when he says that "the US is lower than THE WORLD".



Deaths per positive test is lower in the US than the global average.


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 4, 2020)

platinumsage said:


> Deaths per positive test is lower in the US than the global average.



Which is a totally meaningless stat.


----------



## platinumsage (Aug 4, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Which is a totally meaningless stat.



Sure but those particular words he spoke were factually correct. He knows if you’re going to lie you need to insert as much truth in there as possible.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 4, 2020)

__





						Fact Checker: President Trump made 19,127 false or misleading claims in 1,226 days
					





					www.msn.com
				






> President Trump made 19,127 false or misleading claims in 1,226 days



Doesn't normally bother him.


----------



## Raheem (Aug 4, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Doesn't normally bother him.



Maybe he sobs about it in his sleep.


----------



## LDC (Aug 4, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Unbelievable.




That is just incredible. Fucking hell.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 4, 2020)

it's almost the first non-obsequious interview I've seen - shows what you can do.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 4, 2020)

existentialist said:


> I don't think it is a realisation that comes naturally to him...



And how does the US have the lowest proportion of deaths? Officially, its got lower than countries like the UK, Italy, Spain, and Sweden but that's not saying much.


----------



## existentialist (Aug 4, 2020)

two sheds said:


> it's almost the first non-obsequious interview I've seen - shows what you can do.


Yeah, I did find myself wondering how the hell they'd managed to get that interview...


----------



## pesh (Aug 4, 2020)

no one will ever be allowed to film him handheld again


----------



## editor (Aug 4, 2020)

The guy is a fucking madman


----------



## StoneRoad (Aug 4, 2020)

editor said:


> The guy is a fucking madman




That's real, not a parody ? jebus X kurist on a bike, he's no idea of what those statistics actually mean, has he ?
the orangeman is such a wanker.
no, that's wrong, wanker implies that he can actually do something to completion.


----------



## existentialist (Aug 4, 2020)

StoneRoad said:


> That's real, not a parody ? jebus X kurist on a bike, he's no idea of what those statistics actually mean, has he ?
> the orangeman is such a wanker.
> no, that's wrong, wanker implies that he can actually do something to completion.


Perhaps we should call him the Tantric Wanker, then


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 4, 2020)




----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 4, 2020)

What school starts in _August_??


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 4, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> What school starts in _August_??



Clearly some in the US.


----------



## maomao (Aug 4, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Clearly some in the US.


Scotland starts almost as early. My little cousins are back next week.


----------



## Lord Camomile (Aug 4, 2020)

Whit?? August is still the summer! School starts in _September! _


----------



## Dogsauce (Aug 4, 2020)

Universities do. I did an exchange year and got a a relatively short summer holiday before going out there for late August (rather than first week in October as per UK). Think term finished in May so just shifted a bit really.


----------



## Sue (Aug 4, 2020)

maomao said:


> Scotland starts almost as early. My little cousins are back next week.


Yeah, back from the 11th so a little bit earlier than usual.(it does vary a little bit by LA). We used to typically go back third week ish in August.


----------



## BlanketAddict (Aug 4, 2020)

That interview reminded me of the Spinal Tap interview with its mannerisms... But this goes to 11 (cue dumbfounded look)!


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 5, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> Whit?? August is still the summer! School starts in _September! _



I totally agree.  What type of school opens at the beginning of August?   Do they get extra holidays or something?


Here in Ontario (and Quebec), there are four school options - English-Catholic, English-non-region, French-Catholic and French- non-religion.

Traditionally, the French schools start a couple of days before Labour Day and the English schools start after the long weekend.

The rational for starting early is to get the students settled, text books are given out, etc.  When the students come back from the long week-end, they are set to go.

My granddaughter goes to French school.

This year, however, all school boards will be opening after the long weekend.


eta:  In the past, both Quebec and Ontario had March/Spring break at the same time.

Florida was flooded with ouryouth, and asked the two provinces to stagger the March break.  

This decision influenced the number of corona infections.

Quebec went to Florida a week before Ontario.

Ontario was supposed to be the week that Trudeau declared that all Canadians must return to Canada, NOW!!!!

Quebec had/has a higher infection than Ontario, and the Florida March break was one of the defining reasons for the difference in infections.


----------



## quimcunx (Aug 5, 2020)

Scottish holidays start end of june.


----------



## krtek a houby (Aug 5, 2020)

This is a long piece but goes someway to explaining the factors that have led to where the US is today (in regard to the virus).

It's terrifying and very sad. Capitalism doesn't come out of it very well.

How the Pandemic Defeated America


----------



## two sheds (Aug 5, 2020)

Not got all the way through but a couple of interesting paragraphs so far:



> I’ve learned that almost everything that went wrong with America’s response to the pandemic was predictable and preventable. A sluggish response by a government denuded of expertise allowed the coronavirus to gain a foothold. Chronic underfunding of public health neutered the nation’s ability to prevent the pathogen’s spread. A bloated, inefficient health-care system left hospitals ill-prepared for the ensuing wave of sickness. Racist policies that have endured since the days of colonization and slavery left Indigenous and Black Americans especially vulnerable to COVID‑19. The decades-long process of shredding the nation’s social safety net forced millions of essential workers in low-paying jobs to risk their life for their livelihood. The same social-media platforms that sowed partisanship and misinformation during the 2014 Ebola outbreak in Africa and the 2016 U.S. election became vectors for conspiracy theories during the 2020 pandemic.
> ...
> SARS‑CoV‑2 is something of an anti-Goldilocks virus: just bad enough in every way. Its symptoms can be severe enough to kill millions but are often mild enough to allow infections to move undetected through a population. It spreads quickly enough to overload hospitals, but slowly enough that statistics don’t spike until too late.



Eta 


> Travel bans make intuitive sense, because travel obviously enables the spread of a virus. But in practice, travel bans are woefully inefficient at restricting either travel or viruses. They prompt people to seek indirect routes via third-party countries, or to deliberately hide their symptoms. They are often porous: Trump’s included numerous exceptions, and allowed tens of thousands of people to enter from China. Ironically, they _create_ travel: When Trump later announced a ban on flights from continental Europe, a surge of travelers packed America’s airports in a rush to beat the incoming restrictions. Travel bans may sometimes work for remote island nations, but in general they can only delay the spread of an epidemic—not stop it. And they can create a harmful false confidence, so countries “rely on bans to the exclusion of the things they actually need to do—testing, tracing, building up the health system,” says Thomas Bollyky, a global-health expert at the Council on Foreign Relations. “That sounds an awful lot like what happened in the U.S.”


----------



## two sheds (Aug 5, 2020)

This interesting too, saying it's relatively easy to develop diagnostic tests by genetic sequencing - presumably also telling you where that infection came from?



> As the coronavirus established itself in the U.S., it found a nation through which it could spread easily, without being detected. For years, Pardis Sabeti, a virologist at the Broad Institute of Harvard and MIT, has been trying to create a surveillance network that would allow hospitals in every major U.S. city to quickly track new viruses through genetic sequencing. Had that network existed, once Chinese scientists published SARS‑CoV‑2’s genome on January 11, every American hospital would have been able to develop its own diagnostic test in preparation for the virus’s arrival. “I spent a lot of time trying to convince many funders to fund it,” Sabeti told me. “I never got anywhere.”
> 
> The CDC developed and distributed its own diagnostic tests in late January. These proved useless because of a faulty chemical component. Tests were in such short supply, and the criteria for getting them were so laughably stringent, that by the end of February, tens of thousands of Americans had likely been infected but only hundreds had been tested. The official data were so clearly wrong that _The Atlantic_ developed its own volunteer-led initiative—the COVID Tracking Project—to count cases.
> 
> Diagnostic tests are easy to make, so the U.S. failing to create one seemed inconceivable. Worse, it had no Plan B. Private labs were strangled by FDA bureaucracy. Meanwhile, Sabeti’s lab developed a diagnostic test in mid-January and sent it to colleagues in Nigeria, Sierra Leone, and Senegal. “We had working diagnostics in those countries well before we did in any U.S. states,” she told me.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 5, 2020)

I'm sure this not new to you elbows but seems really good summary of what happened in the US (also UK). Any thoughts?


----------



## editor (Aug 6, 2020)

And it's getting wire every day



> Over the last seven days, a grim new COVID-19 calculus has emerged: one person died every 80 seconds from the coronavirus in America.
> 
> And the pace at which those 7,486 people died appears to be accelerating, a new NBC News tally revealed Wednesday.
> 
> ...


NY is getting tough


> Starting Thursday, people who live in — or who have visited — the 35 states and territories currently grappling with high coronavirus rates will have to pass through checkpoints when they arrive in New York City. They will be required to fill out a traveler health form and reminded to quarantine for 14 days. New York City sheriff's deputies and other law enforcement will be deployed to key entry points like Penn Station as well as the airports, bridges, tunnels, and major roadways that feed into the city.
> “New York City is holding the line against COVID-19, and New Yorkers have shown tremendous discipline,” said Mayor Bill de Blasio. “We’re not going to let our hard work slip away and will continue to do everything we can to keep New Yorkers safe and healthy."











						One death every 80 seconds: The grim new toll of COVID-19 in America
					

“It will go away like things go away," President Trump claimed. Joe Biden says Trump is living in a world of delusion.




					www.nbcnews.com
				




And then there's this: 



> Margot Kagan, 54, of Teaneck, told police she was using a fax machine at a Staples store in Hackensack last Wednesday, when a woman, identified by police as Thomas, approached a machine next to her with a mask pulled down below her mouth.
> 
> Kagan, who, according to police, had a liver transplant four months ago and was walking with a cane, told Thomas to put her mask on, which police said angered Thomas.
> 
> Police said Thomas yelled at Kagan and then violently threw her to the ground.











						Woman charged with assault after mask dispute at Staples leaves customer with broken leg
					

The customer, walking with a cane, asked the woman to put her mask on at the New Jersey location. The woman then threw the customer to the ground, video shows.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## petee (Aug 6, 2020)

editor said:


> NY is getting tough



b/c things are moving in the right direction 









						New York City reported zero COVID-19 deaths for 3 straight days — now it's setting up checkpoints for visitors
					

"We cannot go back to the hell we experienced just a few months ago," Governor Cuomo said.




					www.google.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 6, 2020)

Trump seems to finally be accepting it's a big problem, and there's a chance of a second wave, ignoring the fact they haven't got on top of the first wave.



> Donald Trump has admitted the United States could be hit by a second wave of coronavirus. The President of the United States, who has repeatedly struck an extremely optimistic tone about the outbreak going away, told Fox and Friends Wednesday: ‘You could have a second wave.
> 
> ‘Other countries have had a second wave.’ Trump cited countries previously hailed for doing a good job to stamp out coronavirus, only to see it resurge.
> 
> He said: ‘They’re having massive second waves now – Australia, France, Spain is in a big big second wave….a lot of countries are having a second wave and nobody is talking about that.’











						Donald Trump admits coronavirus-stricken US could be hit by second wave
					

The president made the admission during an interview with Fox and Friends on Wednesday




					metro.co.uk


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 6, 2020)

According to this website the testing is now at its lowest level since the start of July. However some places in Florida have temporarily had to close testing sites because of bad weather etc. abe11825 might know more


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 6, 2020)

I would like Jonathan Swan, that Australian interviewer on Axios who finally called Trump on his bullshit, to just follow him everywhere now and challenge his statements.

"A lot of people are talking about the second wave in Australia, especially in Australia. But do you think it's a relevant example when Rhode Island, the smallest state in the country you run, has had four times as many deaths as Australia?"


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 6, 2020)

How on earth did he get that interview?


----------



## krtek a houby (Aug 6, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> How on earth did he get that interview?



Afaik, he was previously all too deferential to him in another interview, which got him some flak but obvious Trump thought he was ok.


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 6, 2020)

Here is a cool chart that shows infections per million - a comparison of the individual states and Canadian provinces.









						COVID-19 in the U.S.: How do Canada's provinces rank against American states?
					

Looking at confirmed coronavirus cases per million people, how do the U.S. states compare to Canada's provinces and territories?




					www.ctvnews.ca


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 7, 2020)




----------



## Dogsauce (Aug 7, 2020)

That has a whiff of ‘fake news’ about it tbh. Check sources?


----------



## maomao (Aug 7, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> That has a whiff of ‘fake news’ about it tbh. Check sources?











						Students at school touted by Pence for reopening must quarantine due to COVID-19
					

Students at school touted by Mike Pence for reopening must quarantine after positive COVID-19 test




					abcnews.go.com


----------



## Dogsauce (Aug 7, 2020)

Yep, bollocks. Checked the news site (WTVD) and the second story doesn’t exist (but Pence’s visit is reported)

Edit: cross posted with maomao , but it’s not the same school (or fourth graders) but one from the same group of schools.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 8, 2020)

editor said:


> What's the fucking matter with these idiots?
> 
> 
> 
> NY Daily News - We are currently unavailable in your region (you'll need a US idetit



Update on this - at least 100,000 people are expected to attend the 10-day annual Sturgis motorcycle rally in South Dakota’s Black Hills, down from the usual 500,000, however this worker thinks it's actually busier!



> “I’ve not seen one single person wearing a mask,” said Jessica Christian, who is working at a bar at the sprawling event. “It’s just pretty much the mentality that, ‘If I get it, I get it.’”
> 
> Christian, 29, said: “This is my third year, and it’s actually busier than previous years. People are basically treating it as a family vacation.”
> 
> The bar where Christian working has adopted safety protocols, she said, including hand sanitizer and distancing tables. She said it was a different story in other parts of town. “In downtown Sturgis it’s just madness,” she said.  “People not socially distancing, everybody touching each other. It’ll be interesting to see how that turns out.”











						'It's just madness': bikers throng South Dakota town despite Covid threat
					

At least 100,000 expected for Sturgis rally in state’s Black Hills as officials urge attendees to take precautions and ‘work together’




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 8, 2020)

And, this is a scary forecast, I hope it's not that extreme.



> Nearly 300,000 Americans could be dead from Covid-19 by December 1, University of Washington health experts forecast on Thursday, although they said 70,000 lives could be saved if people were scrupulous about wearing masks.
> 
> The latest predictions from the university’s widely cited Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation (IHME) comes as top White House infectious disease advisers warned that major US cities could erupt as new coronavirus hot spots if officials there were not vigilant with counter-measures.
> 
> The latest predictions from the university’s widely cited Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation (IHME) comes as top White House infectious disease advisers warned that major US cities could erupt as new coronavirus hot spots if officials there were not vigilant with counter-measures.



But, it's certainly spreading across the country...



> The IHME said infections were falling in the former epicentres of Arizona, California, Florida, and Texas, but rising in Colorado, Idaho, Kansas, Kentucky, Mississippi, Missouri, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, and Virginia. Those findings are consistent with Reuters tallies.











						Forecast: 300,000 US Covid-19 Deaths By December 1
					

Health experts at the University of Washington said 70,000 lives could be saved if people were scrupulous about wearing masks.




					www.huffingtonpost.co.uk


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 8, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> Yep, bollocks. Checked the news site (WTVD) and the second story doesn’t exist (but Pence’s visit is reported)



The story exists here:









						Fourth-graders at Thales Academy to be quarantined after student tests positive for COVID-19
					

A student has tested positive for COVID-19 at Thales Academy in Wake Forest.




					abc11.com
				




Might not be the same class Pence visited, but I think the main takeaway is "Fourth-Graders at Thales Academy Quarantined Days After Mike Pence Visited a Fourth-Grade Class and Praised Reopening," not "Fourth-Graders in Class Mike Pence Visited Have Coronavirus - Did They Give It to Him? Because That Would Be Great."


----------



## pesh (Aug 8, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Update on this - at least 100,000 people are expected to attend the 10-day annual Sturgis motorcycle rally in South Dakota’s Black Hills, down from the usual 500,000, however this worker thinks it's actually busier!


we were watching the Sturgis webcams last night, should be renamed the pre-existing condition corona carnival.




__





						Official Website of the City of Sturgis, SD - Webcams in and around Sturgis
					

Official Website for the City of Sturgis South Dakota



					www.sturgis-sd.gov


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 8, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> According to this website the testing is now at its lowest level since the start of July. However some places in Florida have temporarily had to close testing sites because of bad weather etc. abe11825 might know more




To my knowledge, most places across the state didn't close as the storm didn't hit as expected. 

We're still spiking in bigger counties though (Miami-Dade for example).


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 9, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> To my knowledge, most places across the state didn't close as the storm didn't hit as expected.
> 
> We're still spiking in bigger counties though (Miami-Dade for example).



According to covid tracking project the number of cases is going down slightly which is good. Do you think that's anything to do with more people wearing masks?


----------



## elbows (Aug 9, 2020)

The recent focus on schools reopening reminds me that when it came to school closures at the start of the pandemic, in most cases states of the USA were ahead of the UK with this decision, even though their pandemic was at an earlier stage than ours at that point.

There is a handy table on this website which shows the original closure dates and some other stuff:









						Map: Coronavirus and School Closures in 2019-2020
					

The coronavirus pandemic forced a near-total shutdown of school buildings in the spring of 2020. See where schools closed and when.




					www.edweek.org


----------



## LDC (Aug 9, 2020)

The Guardian reporting the US now has over 5 million cases, with some estimates making the real figure nearer 50 million.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 9, 2020)

well this should test out herd immunity theory once and for all


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 9, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> According to covid tracking project the number of cases is going down slightly which is good. Do you think that's anything to do with more people wearing masks?




It could be possible - more people wearing masks.  But I have been talking to quite a few people that don't "believe the hype" and feel masks don't work. That's including local people in both my community and my job. 

With schools starting this month, I don't honestly know what will be the outcome, especially with all the news about other regions of the country having started sessions for teachers and a few hundred already testing positive.


----------



## LDC (Aug 9, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> It could be possible - more people wearing masks.  But I have been talking to quite a few people that don't "believe the hype" and feel masks don't work. That's including local people in both my community and my job.
> 
> With schools starting this month, I don't honestly know what will be the outcome, especially with all the news about other regions of the country having started sessions for teachers and a few hundred already testing positive.



Are you in, and talking about, the US abe11825 ?


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 9, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper - yes; I’m in the US and talking about it.


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 10, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> According to covid tracking project the number of cases is going down slightly which is good. Do you think that's anything to do with more people wearing masks?



The drop in the number of confirmed cases reported seems to be linked to a drop in testing - people aren't getting tested because they have to wait hours for a test and weeks for results. The percentage of positive tests is still rising in a lot of places, suggesting that infections are still rising but more of them are going undetected. 









						Virus testing in the US is dropping, even as deaths mount
					

U.S. testing for the coronavirus is dropping even as infections remain high and the death toll rises by more than 1,000 a day, a worrisome trend that officials attribute largely to Americans getting discouraged over having to wait hours to get a test and days or weeks to learn the results. An...




					apnews.com


----------



## LDC (Aug 10, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> LynnDoyleCooper - yes; I’m in the US and talking about it.



Good luck for the future.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 10, 2020)

Hundreds of people are gathering for revivals and baptisms, despite public health orders aimed at limiting the spread of the coronavirus, with few wearing masks or social distancing, when both new cases & deaths are running high. 





> Holding such events, he said, was not irresponsible. He echoed what many told us. "The numbers (of coronavirus cases) are inflated. The ways it's affecting people are inflated."
> 
> The previous week, along the coast in Huntington Beach, the crowd had drowned out police officers who called for them to disperse. The city had placed signs on the Pacific Coast Highway announcing the event had been cancelled.
> 
> *"You can't cancel Jesus," Mrs Green told the defiant crowd.*













						Coronavirus: Religious revivals and beach baptisms defy public health orders in California
					

One of the attending police officers admitted there was nothing they could really do.




					news.sky.com


----------



## StoneRoad (Aug 10, 2020)

with attitudes and activities like that (as well as tangerine man) it is no surprise that 'murica is leading the death race and has so many cases, especially when you factor in the officially undetected ones due to decreased testing)


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## frogwoman (Aug 10, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> Good luck for the future.



abe11825 has known me 20 years and was meant to come and visit me this year.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 10, 2020)

and 

when a simple like just isn't enough


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 10, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> The drop in the number of confirmed cases reported seems to be linked to a drop in testing - people aren't getting tested because they have to wait hours for a test and weeks for results. The percentage of positive tests is still rising in a lot of places, suggesting that infections are still rising but more of them are going undetected.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I work with someone who took the test on a Friday and didn't get their results until the following Friday. Others have waited more than a week. It depends on where you're getting the test taken, on how long you get the results back. Although, there is talk about the results "only being valid on the day taken". Meaning, you take it today, whatever the outcome (and when you get the answers), equals you were (positive/negative) today only. You could take a test every day and have a different answer - some people I know have received false positives.

On an unrelated but related note to testing and infection rates going undetected, I've been hearing (on the radio and talking to different people on different sides of the issue) that those with other problems (for example: people who think they're having a heart attack or stroke) aren't going to the hospital because they don't want to risk getting infected with the disease. They'd rather suffer and (potentially) die at home rather than go get treated at a hospital. Once you're admitted to hospital, no matter the underlying cause, you're admitted as a Covid patient (hospitals are getting paid more by the state / government for saying they've got Covid patients). Going in with a heart attack is going to get confirmed as a Covid heart attack - the heart attack was brought on by the Covid. One person I work with, said that anything anyone goes in with now, is all Covid related... which is something I don't believe in. If you've got high blood pressure from years of doing bad things to your body (eating lousy food or what not), going into hospital now with a heart attack isn't simply pandemic related. It's just bad timing /a coincidence. 

I hear both sides, but lean more to questioning a lot of all of it.




frogwoman said:


> abe11825 has known me 20 years and was meant to come and visit me this year.



Every time I'm meant to visit, over the last few years, some crazy shit happens. It's definitely been a fun and wild 20 years, I'll admit to that! "Next year in Jerusalem"!


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## frogwoman (Aug 10, 2020)

I think it's fairly unlikely that hospitals are being paid to have more covid patients or that everything is being treated as covid tbh, there's similar allegations here but the government is known to be _undercounting_ cases and deaths.

I've heard about the false positive/negative thing too and people receiving tests meant for someone else. Not good  

I can imagine that people would be worried to go to hospital though


----------



## elbows (Aug 10, 2020)

Californias public health director has resigned and there was an immense test data 'backlog'.









						Governor gives few details on top California official's exit
					

California Gov. Gavin Newsom is giving few details about the abrupt resignation of the state's top health official following a data glitch that backlogged nearly 300,000 coronavirus records




					abcnews.go.com
				






> SACRAMENTO, Calif. -- California's top public health official has resigned, just days after the state announced a fix for a glitch that caused a lag in reporting coronavirus test results used to make decisions about reopening businesses and schools.
> 
> Dr. Sonia Angell said in a resignation letter made public late Sunday that she's departing from her role as director and state public health officer at the California Department of Public Health.
> 
> Her letter to staff, released by the California Health and Human Services Agency, did not give a specific reason for her departure.





> Angell's announcement comes after California Health and Human Services Secretary Dr. Mark Ghaly said the test results glitch caused up to 300,000 records to be backlogged, though not all were coronavirus cases and some could be duplicates. The problem affected the California Reportable Disease Information Exchange, which is also known as CalREDIE.



CalREDIE wasn't ready.


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 10, 2020)

frogwoman - I’ve heard the whole “you enter the hospital now, you are seen as an immediate covid patient” from numerous sources. One of them is my direct boss, whom I do not believe (Or trust) at any other time of the year. So I really don’t think he’s telling the whole truth now either, because he likes to stir the pot with people who are willing to have an argument with him.

The reason he says hospital stays are covid stays, is his wife works for the covid unit in the local hospital system. She is one of 10 for her unit and building, and she routinely deals with the ones who die on a regular basis (he claimed 2 weeks ago that “she bagged 5 people” the day prior he started running his mouth to other people about this issue). So he has all these statistics she is telling him, including the fact that any person going into the hospital during this crisis, is going in as a covid patient. He even says “don’t believe me? Ask my wife!”.

If you’re suffering a heart attack, the hospital says it was brought on by covid - the heart attack is your covid symptom. Even if you had underlying causes prior to the pandemic, you dying of a heart attack was brought on by the coronavirus.

I questioned him about it. What makes it true - if you had all the markings for a heart attack over the last few years and coincidently now have to go in, why is that covid and not dumb luck? He said because the covid is what you have and your symptoms are the heart attack (instead of a fever and taste problems for example). There’s no such thing as having the problems before hand right now. Where everyone’s symptoms are different, you testing positive brought you to the emergency room because you are having a heart attack that was brought on by the covid. No way around it.

He also stated that the hospital gets paid a couple thousand dollars more for each person they say came through with covid (rather than a broken limb and sent home. Your broken limb was covid related).

I wish all this didn’t sound like a joke or fictitious. If people want to know what type of conversations are happening in the country, this is part of it.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 10, 2020)

Hmmmm, I kinda have trouble believing him tbh (not your story but what he said) it is the exact same thing (usually) right wing people come up with here and there are so many 'excess' deaths above the average number of deaths that would have usually died this year, and are not included in the number the government announced, that it can't be a coincidence. He sounds a piece of work though. 'Bagged' 5 people? What a POS 

I'd be really sceptical unless I spoke to her myself as it sounds incredibly dubious lol. I'm not denying something like that may have happened once but it's unlikely to be on a big scale imo


----------



## Tankus (Aug 10, 2020)

Bikers for Trump Founder Chris Cox
  “I’m not a conspiracy theorist but...”

Doesn't matter what that journo asks...not one dam thing

Cox will probably get a pat on the back...._ for telling it like it is .._.from his leathered up mates

The american experiment


----------



## maomao (Aug 10, 2020)

It wouldn't surprise me for a minute if private hospitals fiddled extra money wherever they could but the US excess death figures are 25-30% above the official C19 death figures so it seems unlikely that they're passing off many non covid deaths as covid deaths.


----------



## LDC (Aug 10, 2020)

maomao said:


> It wouldn't surprise me for a minute if private hospitals fiddled extra money wherever they could but the US excess death figures are 25-30% above the official C19 death figures so it seems unlikely that they're passing off many non covid deaths as covid deaths.



I had a chat with someone I know yesterday (more a neighbor that's friendly and have mutual friends with rather than an actual friend) and she suggested that loads of the covid death figures here in the UK are exaggerated, but she did it in a slightly confused questioning way that suggested she'd got it from a few FB or whatever posts. Explained that wasn't the case, and she seemed fine to believe that, but yet again another person that has got really confused about this and is struggling to pick the fact from fiction out of the deluge of social media nonsense. And imagine it's even worse in the US, even among HCPs sometimes.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 10, 2020)

abe11825 , I have seen many of the "it's not real it's a plandemic" certifiables spouting that line about the "covid bonus" for a while now on farcebook.


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## elbows (Aug 10, 2020)

maomao said:


> It wouldn't surprise me for a minute if private hospitals fiddled extra money wherever they could but the US excess death figures are 25-30% above the official C19 death figures so it seems unlikely that they're passing off many non covid deaths as covid deaths.



Also I can have a good look at certain states that make a lot of hospitalisation data available.

For example here is a graph from Arizona where number of patient visits with covid-19-like-illnesses are shown as a percentage of all patient visits. I'm not going to try to repeat the exercise for other states and some of them have crappy amount of data sharing, but I think it demonstrates the reality is far away from that utter bullshit being discussed earlier.



From AZDHS | COVID-19 Dashboards


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 10, 2020)

Froggy - that’s why I don’t believe everything my boss ever says. Especially now, where I’ve witnessed him specifically try to rile people up just so he can get a rise from them. These are people who want to look at the numbers and see the reports, questioning every thing all the media puts out. They’ve even said his statistics versus the media statistics don’t make sense. He says “don’t believe me? Ask my wife! She’s in it... on the front lines doing this every day!”

My boss doesn’t believe anything except what his wife tells him and what the White House says (but most of it comes from his wife).

He’s very vocal on how she works the unit and the hospital doesn’t like him coming to work because he had the potential of getting her sick, thus, getting her small unit sick. On the other hand, she has more potential of getting him sick and he then gets a few hundred people sick. My employer already has had several confirmed cases of the disease and there was a moment where it felt like people were getting confirmations every day. If not a confirmation, trace contacting is done and full departments are out of work for a week “as a precaution”. I know of a few deaths already from the people who live here (I work in a retirement community for those who are about to ask where my job is) and no one publicly speaks of it.

I don’t know what amount is true- the percentage of who gets tacked a “covid death” or “covid (name your illness)” but I don’t think everything I hear from my boss is entirely true. Especially since I question why or how it is possible to go to the hospital with one problem and walk out being told you caught the disease. Surely that’s why a lot of the numbers don’t make sense - because people are concerned that if they go, what will happen? The older population is more susceptible they say... so if someone is stubborn enough to not enter the emergency room for a major problem, then what? Do you die in your house and the medical exam we rules... what? A stroke? Or according to my boss, you have covid stroke? I personally know someone who died a few years ago, who had a stroke but was too stubborn to seek help. She had done too much damage to herself by staying home, so when she was finally found, she Couldn’t recover 100%. She spent over a year in rehab, then in facilities, to end up dying because she kept going down hill. The kicker is: she had the stroke an hour after leaving her GP. it was her yearly physical and she got a full bill of health. Perfectly fine. I can only imagine if that happened now - what would the doctors say?

I don’t have the normal social media platforms (FBook, Twitter, etc) so I tend to shrug the naysayers away. I’ve got a few people in my neighborhood (plus my job) that say this whole thing isn’t real. That it’s just another way to dial down the population or get someone elected in office or whatever the need be. One of my neighbors is a 74 year old war veteran. He is all for the Cheeto in Charge and believes the masks are just as much a farce as this whole pandemic is. He believes the man with the wig is doing an awesome job at running this country and can’t wait until he’s elected in for another 4 years. Yet, another neighbor has mixed reviews about this country and feels that the Oompa Loompa is doing a poor job in controlling the information and allowing so many deaths. He can’t wait for someone else to be in office.


----------



## editor (Aug 11, 2020)

Just listen to this unhinged, self entitled 'pastor'



			https://pulpitandpen.org/2020/07/31/greg-locke-to-dunkin-donut-worker-im-going-to-kick-your-teeth-down-your-throat/


----------



## two sheds (Aug 11, 2020)

He's right though, it's not a mask he needs it's a gag. 

I'm surprised he's wearing clothes covering up the holy temple Our Good Lord gave us.


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 11, 2020)

editor said:


> Just listen to this unhinged, self entitled 'pastor'
> 
> 
> 
> https://pulpitandpen.org/2020/07/31/greg-locke-to-dunkin-donut-worker-im-going-to-kick-your-teeth-down-your-throat/



Holy hell...

I want the last 13 minutes back, please. Thank you.

Wow... this dude is hyped up on more than 7 creams and 5 sugars from his medium coffee. Between the two, his sugar consumption is 10 teaspoons (!) and 14 ounces of cream ... plus whatever sugar listing is in the cream.

He has more than a problem outside of the mask situation. Dude is mental and I wouldn’t be surprised if he made the news because he shot up his “church”. Go crazy on the congregation with a rifle. We will see that make headlines soon. Lol.

I don’t care that he doesn’t want to wear a mask. It’s “within (his) right”. But my problem is that anger. This is why there’s a violence problem now. Even though he claims he is a pastor, that level of hatred is obscene.
I fear for the children that are around him if he gets angry about a piece of cloth on your face....


----------



## petee (Aug 12, 2020)

Colombia arrests Florida men accused of selling fake COVID cure that allegedly killed 7 people
					

They face a maximum of between 14 and more than 17 years in prison if convicted of all charges.




					www.cbsnews.com
				




_Colombian officials say they have arrested two Florida men wanted in the U.S. on charges they illegally sold a bleachlike chemical as a miracle cure for the new coronavirus and other diseases. The Colombian prosecutor's office said Tuesday that Mark and Joseph Grenon were arrested in the beach town of Santa Marta, and were shipping their "Miracle Mineral Solution" — chlorine dioxide — from there to clients in the United States, Colombia and Africa.

It said seven Americans had died from using the substance._


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## frogwoman (Aug 13, 2020)

That's that scumbag genesis church, they have been hawking MMS in the UK too for years as a supposed cure for autism.


----------



## High Voltage (Aug 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Just listen to this unhinged, self entitled 'pastor'
> 
> 
> 
> https://pulpitandpen.org/2020/07/31/greg-locke-to-dunkin-donut-worker-im-going-to-kick-your-teeth-down-your-throat/



0:42 I must be mellowing in my old age - I'm usually far less tolerant of that level of stupidity


----------



## Cid (Aug 13, 2020)

I’m not sure the logic of that Covid bonus thing stacks up at all... I mean I’m inclined to disbelieve it in any case for many of the reasons others have said. But even taking it at face value it doesn’t work, simply because healthcare litigation is a thing, and a thing medical professionals pay a fair bit to avoid. Add to that risks of prosecution for fraud...


----------



## maomao (Aug 13, 2020)

What happens to Americans with no medical insurance (almost 10%) and undocumented immigrants then? Are they just expected to die at home or are there systems set up for Covid specifically?


----------



## 8ball (Aug 13, 2020)

editor said:


> Just listen to this unhinged, self entitled 'pastor'
> 
> 
> 
> https://pulpitandpen.org/2020/07/31/greg-locke-to-dunkin-donut-worker-im-going-to-kick-your-teeth-down-your-throat/




A salutary warning about the dangers of too much sugar.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 13, 2020)

maomao said:


> What happens to Americans with no medical insurance (almost 10%) and undocumented immigrants then? Are they just expected to die at home or are there systems set up for Covid specifically?



Some have faced six-figure or even seven-figure medical bills when they recover  and of course they'll be in least possible position to pay them.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Aug 13, 2020)

8ball said:


> A salutary warning about the dangers of too much sugar.



And cousins marrying.


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 14, 2020)

petee said:


> Colombia arrests Florida men accused of selling fake COVID cure that allegedly killed 7 people
> 
> 
> They face a maximum of between 14 and more than 17 years in prison if convicted of all charges.
> ...



I'm not surprised at this.



Cid said:


> I’m not sure the logic of that Covid bonus thing stacks up at all... I mean I’m inclined to disbelieve it in any case for many of the reasons others have said. But even taking it at face value it doesn’t work, simply because healthcare litigation is a thing, and a thing medical professionals pay a fair bit to avoid. Add to that risks of prosecution for fraud...



Oh, for sure - it doesn't make much sense; I agree. If I wasn't hearing it from a person I work with, I'd not "believe" the other people saying it either (media sources). But again, I don't always believe everything my boss tells me anyway. 

In regards to the fraud bit, outside of the whole pandemic thing, what about the doctors who push pills on people? If a doctor doesn't test you for an "ailment", but decides you need a certain drug to remedy whatever they think you have, could that be fraud? 

Or, I'll give you an example of something that happened to me: several years ago, I went to my GP for my yearly physical. I spoke with her about having some shoulder problems (which I've now learned you don't speak with your primary doctor about things outside of why you're there. Something similar happened to my mum and a couple of her friends). My doctor told me that it's most likely a strained muscle (because it's my dominant arm, and things like this happen frequently with people, especially those who do a lot of movement in various forms) and if I take some ibuprofen and do some muscle exercises, the pain I was feeling would go away. A couple weeks later, I received a bill and questionnaire from my health insurance group - how did I hurt my shoulder (I'm forgetting the term they used - not a fracture or sprain, but in the ballpark of a level after spraining). The insurance needed to know what happened - was it via a car accident, work, or something different? I called the insurance to question why I was getting this letter. The only thing I received from my doctor was an explanation that it was possibly a muscle strain, if anything. There were no X-Rays taken, no prodding or figuring it out. I just described the area and how it felt and she gave me her answer of what she thought it was. Didn't even touch me - just looked at me as I pointed and described. If I return the questionnaire, I can't give any honest answers with out it feeling like fraud to me, and potentially being fraud... only because I didn't sustain injuries from an accident of sorts in any way that they were asking me. From their standpoint, they needed to know how to proceed - to go after my employer for workman's compensation, the other insurance for a car accident, or whatever else different had transpired. I fought with the insurance (and my doctor) about this because I couldn't legally return the paperwork with out putting myself in jeopardy as a liar. I reckoned that my doctor submitted it as a minor injury so she could get more money from the insurance company. 

So... how would that be handled if I answered the questions? Fraud?

Oh, and the end result was that a little over a year ago, I saw another doctor, who sent me for X-Rays because it had gotten worse. X-Rays showed calcification and some forms of arthritis in my shoulder. With a little more in depth paperwork for different muscle exercises, I ended up with a cortisone shot as well. Knock on wood I've not had any major problems since. 



maomao said:


> What happens to Americans with no medical insurance (almost 10%) and undocumented immigrants then? Are they just expected to die at home or are there systems set up for Covid specifically?


+


two sheds said:


> Some have faced six-figure or even seven-figure medical bills when they recover  and of course they'll be in least possible position to pay them.



Americans with no medical insurance and undocumented immigrants get foot the bill no matter a pandemic or a sore throat in the spring. Even some with insurance (because it's a lowered tiered insurance - the crap of the crap) get a bill for thousands of dollars for their stay. But two sheds is right - people can face six or seven figure medical bills when they recover, although, like I said, it can be even something unrelated to the Covid. I don't knowif there are systems in place for billing for Covid. I've seen internet articles saying places are charging a Covid fee to their normal pricing, but that went away once the US Government announced there is a coin shortage and companies are now asking for exact dollar amount if you're paying by cash or use plastic (debit or credit) because the company has no coins to give back as change.


----------



## maomao (Aug 14, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> Americans with no medical insurance and undocumented immigrants get foot the bill no matter a pandemic or a sore throat in the spring. Even some with insurance (because it's a lowered tiered insurance - the crap of the crap) get a bill for thousands of dollars for their stay. But @two sheds is right - people can face six or seven figure medical bills when they recover, although, like I said, it can be even something unrelated to the Covid. I don't knowif there are systems in place for billing for Covid. I've seen internet articles saying places are charging a Covid fee to their normal pricing, but that went away once the US Government announced there is a coin shortage and companies are now asking for exact dollar amount if you're paying by cash or use plastic (debit or credit) because the company has no coins to give back as change.


So in most cases that's just going to mean not seeking medical attention isn't it? I remember going to a US hospital aged 12 needing stitches. They wanted to see our insurance docs before they'd even look at the wound.


----------



## Numbers (Aug 14, 2020)

Can never be said enough but thank god for our NHS.


----------



## Cid (Aug 14, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> I'm not surprised at this.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Honestly the US system is fucked and I have no idea on specific cases. Fraud is intentional deception for an unlawful gain. There’s a lot to unpack in that sentence that depends on case law and legislation, but that’s the principle. There are going to be complex issues around a consumer being told to do something which they may not understand to be dishonest. But you can bet the insurance companies are lawyered up to the eyeballs.


----------



## two sheds (Aug 14, 2020)

Worst possible system for an infectious pandemic, people with symptoms are likely to stfu.


----------



## Sue (Aug 14, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Worst possible system for an infectious pandemic, people with symptoms are likely to stfu.


Especially when it seems employment rights are bloody awful too.

(Not saying ours are all they should be but from what I've heard, they're way worse over there.)


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 14, 2020)

maomao said:


> So in most cases that's just going to mean not seeking medical attention isn't it? I remember going to a US hospital aged 12 needing stitches. They wanted to see our insurance docs before they'd even look at the wound.


There could be a number of reasons someone doesn’t seek medical attention. They are stubborn or they fear it’s bad enough to end up taking a bed in the hospital and walk out having to pay thousands of dollars later. 

A lot of places require proof of insurance while registering. Even for 12 stitches or anything minor/ major.  The insurance plan I have, it’s $70 to go to the clinic (“convenient care” they call it locally) and get looked at. That’s not the same as going to your GP. Primary doctor visits are $20. Emergency room visits are $300. And those prices are copays - what you pay for up front in order to be seen! 



Cid said:


> Honestly the US system is fucked and I have no idea on specific cases. Fraud is intentional deception for an unlawful gain. There’s a lot to unpack in that sentence that depends on case law and legislation, but that’s the principle. There are going to be complex issues around a consumer being told to do something which they may not understand to be dishonest. But you can bet the insurance companies are lawyered up to the eyeballs.


Totally agree. It’s just curious as to what the doctors consider “ok” and report while insurance companies bill for something else. It’s all how the medical staff codes your appointment. There are broad terms the staff uses to submit information to the insurance company, so sometimes things can get misinterpreted.



two sheds said:


> Worst possible system for an infectious pandemic, people with symptoms are likely to stfu.



Basically.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 14, 2020)

Thanks for these posts, I knew the system was fucked but it's shocking to see it laid out like that.


----------



## 8ball (Aug 14, 2020)

Like us, the USA has been laying down the groundwork for a very bad pandemic experience for decades.


----------



## Cid (Aug 14, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> There could be a number of reasons someone doesn’t seek medical attention. They are stubborn or they fear it’s bad enough to end up taking a bed in the hospital and walk out having to pay thousands of dollars later.
> 
> A lot of places require proof of insurance while registering. Even for 12 stitches or anything minor/ major.  The insurance plan I have, it’s $70 to go to the clinic (“convenient care” they call it locally) and get looked at. That’s not the same as going to your GP. Primary doctor visits are $20. Emergency room visits are $300. And those prices are copays - what you pay for up front in order to be seen!



It's just... so fucking depressing and hard to comprehend from here.




> Totally agree. It’s just curious as to what the doctors consider “ok” and report while insurance companies bill for something else. It’s all how the medical staff codes your appointment. There are broad terms the staff uses to submit information to the insurance company, so sometimes things can get misinterpreted.
> 
> 
> 
> Basically.



So... It is going to be complex. But it's probably safer for a doctor to over-prescribe so long as they are doing it in a 'medically ethical' way. And by that I don't mean actually medically ethical, I mean within taught prescription structures. Sometimes, as I understand it, that's going to involve relying on stuff like information produced by drug companies. So yeah, pretty big conflict there. That's relevant to your pill-pushing point.

In terms of your injury... Well that's probably the grey area of fudging and looking for potential sources to cover the claim. For everyone (except maybe you) there's probably an out. The doctor says 'oh I assessed it as a minor injury, I have nothing to do with the claim side'. The insurance company says 'oh it's just our standard procedure for reported minor injuries'. Did it really not have any no-fault options? Sport injury or something? Fraud - the criminal element - requires intentional deception, so there are probably ways out around that too. And worst case - which probably never comes up given their legal departments - might mean a fine. Civil fraud is different, but then who's going to pursue anyone for civil fraud? If there's another party at fault the insurance companies will just have standard procedures for settling disputes.

e2a: I hasten to add that's all total speculation based on inferring stuff from the law I studied a few years ago. And the odd book/youtube rant.


----------



## petee (Aug 15, 2020)

every. 
single. 
day.
beware of the pictures.









						Chili's hostess is assaulted over social-distancing rules; three women arrested, police say
					

"I was kind of fighting for my life," restaurant hostess Kelsy Wallace, 17, said. "I was really scared, calling out for my mama."




					www.nbcnews.com
				




A+ student headed for pre-med. maybe she'll pursue psychiatry and diagnose these people.


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 15, 2020)

Horray!!!!!









						Canada-U.S. border closure extended again amid tension over restrictions
					

Canadian and U.S. officials have agreed to keep the border between the two countries closed to non-essential travel for another month. This comes as both countries are still working to stop the spread of COVID-19, and as tensions continue to flare between Canadians and prospective American visitors.



					www.ctvnews.ca
				












						Hundreds of Americans are still trying to enter Canada for shopping, recreation: CBSA
					

As Canada and the U.S. move to extend the border closure by another month, more than 12,000 Americans have been turned away at our shared border — and almost half of them were coming to Canada to sightsee, shop or have some fun, despite the ongoing pandemic.



					www.ctvnews.ca


----------



## two sheds (Aug 15, 2020)

I demand my Constitutional freedom rights to shop in Canada without a mask


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 16, 2020)

They really do got to get their act together.









						CDC blindsided by Trump's statement it could deploy teams to schools this fall
					

Leaders at the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention were blindsided this week when President Donald Trump announced that the agency could deploy teams to assist schools with safely reopening in the fall, a senior CDC official told CNN.




					www.cnn.com
				






> "My administration also stands ready to deploy CDC teams to support schools that are opening and schools that need help in safety and in order to safely reopen," Trump said on Tuesday during a briefing.
> 
> The announcement left CDC officials scrambling this week to train-up staff to be able to deploy if they are called upon, the senior official said.
> 
> ...



(my bold)


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 18, 2020)

I heard something like that on the radio yesterday - in reference to the CDC going to schools. I don't recall everything, but I think it had something to do with all schools getting proper help in reference to sanitation and testing. That all schools across America were going to have easy access to tests and be able to test students, teachers, staff, etc and there be no problems. 

When I heard that, I was a little like "wow... really?" only because there's been so many issues with testing as it is - not enough tests or delays in getting results. How is there enough for millions of schools now?


----------



## elbows (Aug 18, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> I heard something like that on the radio yesterday - in reference to the CDC going to schools. I don't recall everything, but I think it had something to do with all schools getting proper help in reference to sanitation and testing. That all schools across America were going to have easy access to tests and be able to test students, teachers, staff, etc and there be no problems.
> 
> When I heard that, I was a little like "wow... really?" only because there's been so many issues with testing as it is - not enough tests or delays in getting results. How is there enough for millions of schools now?



Well there was a lot of promises and statements made that they probably cant backup regarding schools.

But when looking for something a bit more tangible, the USA are at least quick to approve new forms of testing in this pandemic (which isnt always a good thing but hopefully the right decisions are being made on this):

eg the most recent to gain widestread attention was the approval at the weekend of the SalivaDirect test.









						FDA clears saliva test for Covid-19, opening door to wider testing
					

The new test is a much less invasive process than the nasal swabs currently used to test for the virus that causes Covid-19, but one that has so far yielded highly sensitive and similar results.




					www.statnews.com


----------



## phillm (Aug 18, 2020)

This is a very sobering personal account of her families unfolding tragedy from Sharon Stone.


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 18, 2020)

elbows - I could stand corrected, but isn’t there something similar to that SalivaDirect method... for marijuana testing? Or any other form of (“illegal”) drug use? I feel like that method has been in use for a while and for other things. 

I hope it works and if it does, perhaps that could be the test schools use.

phillm -“oh shit”... re: the Sharon Stone video. That’s horrible!!  I know it’s bad in some places but there are other towns where they are so sprawled out... so much land between them and their neighbor... that the case numbers are fewer for that area of the particular state. This is in general -something that the news was saying during the major height of all of the US getting something. Some places don’t have enough of a population to get infected. While others see a boom. So it would make sense if Stone’s family can’t see the tests or the city doesn’t have the resources... maybe it’s an area where it is too small a population? I don’t know. I don’t know the back story of her previous cry for help.


----------



## phillm (Aug 18, 2020)

abe11825 said:


> elbows - I could stand corrected, but isn’t there something similar to that SalivaDirect method... for marijuana testing? Or any other form of (“illegal”) drug use? I feel like that method has been in use for a while and for other things.
> 
> I hope it works and if it does, perhaps that could be the test schools use.
> 
> phillm -“oh shit”... re: the Sharon Stone video. That’s horrible!!  I know it’s bad in some places but there are other towns where they are so sprawled out... so much land between them and their neighbor... that the case numbers are fewer for that area of the particular state. This is in general -something that the news was saying during the major height of all of the US getting something. Some places don’t have enough of a population to get infected. While others see a boom. So it would make sense if Stone’s family can’t see the tests or the city doesn’t have the resources... maybe it’s an area where it is too small a population? I don’t know. I don’t know the back story of her previous cry for help.



It really brings home to the profound scale and depth of the tragedy unfolding in the US with her having already lost her grandmother and godmother to COVID-19. Now, her sister and brother-in-law are fighting for their lives and she is a woman who no doubt has wealth and influence. Trump's incompetence has cost more US lives than any US President in history and we are far from done. 

(just checked her net wealth $60 million).


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 18, 2020)

phillm said:


> Trump's incompetence has cost more US lives than any US President in history and we are far from done.



TBF, they are still behind the UK on deaths per million, although they are catching-up.


----------



## abe11825 (Aug 18, 2020)

phillm - oh, for sure. There’s no arguing that. I totally agree with you.

cupid_stunt - it’s maddeningly amazing in four years how quickly Trump has turned the States to shit though.


----------



## Numbers (Aug 18, 2020)

Maddeningly amazing meaning predictable.


----------



## phillm (Aug 18, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> TBF, they are still behind the UK on deaths per million, although they are catching-up.


 Trump's "per capita per capita"  defence !


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 18, 2020)

Better than the uk isn't saying much even with 5000 people risen from the grave by the powers of Hancocks necromancy


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 18, 2020)

United States Coronavirus: 5,639,821 Cases and 174,630 Deaths - Worldometer worldometers has 5.6 million cases and almost 175,000 deaths in the USA  Jesus.


----------



## ska invita (Aug 18, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> 175,000 deaths in the USA  Jesus.


for perspective thats still less per head of population than the UK


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 18, 2020)

ska invita said:


> for perspective thats still less per head of population than the UK



Yeah I know. Catching up fast though


----------



## magneze (Aug 18, 2020)

The predictions link is sobering reading on there too. Almost 300k by December.


----------



## phillm (Aug 18, 2020)

ska invita said:


> for perspective thats still less per head of population than the UK


Not that I'm making any excuses for this 'world-beating ' shower of shit but we are much more cramped together on this relatively small island. They will catch up pretty quickly unless they get lucky and the virus runs out of steam and soon. The science suggests otherwise atm.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 18, 2020)

magneze said:


> The predictions link is sobering reading on there too. Almost 300k by December.


It's kind of chilling reading back to when I first started this thread


----------



## Maltin (Aug 18, 2020)

magneze said:


> The predictions link is sobering reading on there too. Almost 300k by December.


Can you share the link, I did not see it there.


----------



## phillm (Aug 19, 2020)

This article is trending on Twitter - the reporter spent 4 months being scrupulous in his avoidance of risk and then wham he got it, which I guess is what happens when you let it rip through a community and country. 

_The weekend before my symptoms appeared, for the first time in four months, I met friends for two dinners at two socially distanced patio tables. Nobody is required to wear masks at the tables, so I removed my mask when I sat, as did my dining partners, and we left them off during the entire time we were at the table._









						Column: I had COVID-19, and these are the things nobody tells you
					

L.A. Times sports columnist Bill Plaschke talks about experiencing COVID-19. Yes, he says, it's really as bad as you've heard.




					www.latimes.com


----------



## magneze (Aug 19, 2020)

Maltin said:


> Can you share the link, I did not see it there.


There's a Projections link which goes here: IHME | COVID-19 Projections


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 19, 2020)

phillm said:


> This article is trending on Twitter - the reporter spent 4 months being scrupulous in his avoidance of risk and then wham he got it, which I guess is what happens when you let it rip through a community and country.
> 
> _The weekend before my symptoms appeared, for the first time in four months, I met friends for two dinners at two socially distanced patio tables. Nobody is required to wear masks at the tables, so I removed my mask when I sat, as did my dining partners, and we left them off during the entire time we were at the table._
> 
> ...



That's a good read, thanks for posting the link.


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 19, 2020)

Coronavirus Update: COVID-19 Is Third Leading Cause of Death in U.S. | The Weather Channel - Articles from The Weather Channel | weather.com
					

Here are the latest developments in the COVID-19 pandemic. - Articles from The Weather Channel | weather.com




					weather.com
				






> COVID-19 has leapfrogged to become one of the top killers in the United States, behind heart disease and cancer, a national health expert says.
> 
> "COVID is now the No. 3 cause of death in the U.S. — ahead of accidents, injuries, lung disease, diabetes, Alzheimer's and many, many other causes," former Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Director Dr. Thomas Frieden told CNN on Monday.
> 
> ...


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 19, 2020)

CNN Poll: Most Americans embarrassed by US response to coronavirus
					

Nearly 7 in 10 Americans say the US response to the coronavirus outbreak makes them feel embarrassed, according to a new CNN Poll conducted by SSRS, as 62% of the public says President Donald Trump could be doing more to fight the outbreak.




					www.cnn.com
				






> The new poll finds disapproval of Trump's handling of the outbreak at a new high, 58%, as the share who say the worst of the pandemic is yet to come has risen to 55% after dropping through the spring. And as the virus has spread from the nation's cities throughout its countryside, the number who know someone who's been diagnosed with the virus has jumped dramatically to 67%, up from 40% in early June.
> 
> And Americans are angry. About 8 in 10 say they are at least somewhat angry about the way things are going in the country today, including an astonishing 51% who say they are very angry. CNN has asked this question in polling periodically since 2008, and the previous high for the share who said they were "very angry" was 35%, reached in 2008 and 2016.


----------



## pesh (Aug 20, 2020)

Good to see America slowly getting back to normal.


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 22, 2020)

Yip - it is a plot to make sure that there is no vaccine prior to the elections - NOT!!!!









						Trump accuses 'deep state' FDA of thwarting efforts for coronavirus treatments until after election
					

President Trump on Saturday accused the “deep state” at the Food and Drug Administration of “making it very difficult” for drug companies to test coronavirus treatments -- and suggested the agency is trying to delay them until after Election Day.




					www.foxnews.com
				






... and now we are back to Trump knowing more than the experts


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 23, 2020)

The true number of deaths in the US could be over 220,000.   



> Nationwide, 223,900 more people have died than usual from March 15 to Aug. 8, according to C.D.C. estimates, which adjust current death records to account for typical reporting lags. That number is 62,000 higher than the official count of coronavirus deaths for that period. Higher-than-normal death rates are now widespread across the country; only Alaska and Hawaii, states outside the contiguous United States, show numbers that look similar to recent years.
> 
> Our analysis examines deaths from all causes — not just confirmed cases of coronavirus — beginning in mid-March when the virus took hold.
> 
> Through Aug. 8, estimated excess deaths were about 38 percent higher than the official coronavirus fatality count. If this pattern holds, it would put the current death toll at more than 238,000 people.











						True Pandemic Toll in the U.S. Reaches 377,000
					

Since coronavirus struck, more people have died than usual in every state of the country, with 23 states seeing deaths above normal peaking in the last two months, according to a New York Times analysis.



					www.nytimes.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 23, 2020)

This is scary.



> The number of daily coronavirus tests being conducted in the United States is only *52 percent* of the level considered necessary to mitigate the spread of the virus, as many states struggle to increase testing and catch up to the recent surge in cases.
> 
> An average of *727,000 tests per day* were performed over the past week, according to data collected by the Covid Tracking Project, far below the current nationwide target of *1.4 million daily tests*. The target, which is based on a methodology developed by researchers at the Harvard Global Health Institute, is different for each state and varies over time as infection rates change.



And, there's been several reports that some test results are taking up to 2 weeks, which is shocking. 



> Aside from current testing levels, another important indicator of a state’s testing performance is its positive test rate, which is the percent of tests that come back positive. Lower rates suggest that testing is more widespread and that it is not limited to those with severe symptoms. Positive rates should be at or below 5 percent for at least 14 days before a state or country can safely reopen, according to the World Health Organization. In the United States, the current positive rate is *7 percent*.



If the national level is 7%, it must be far higher in certain states. 









						Is Your State Doing Enough Coronavirus Testing?
					

The number of daily coronavirus tests conducted in the United States is only 52 percent of the level necessary to mitigate the spread of the virus, according to estimates by researchers at the Harvard Global Health Institute.



					www.nytimes.com


----------



## petee (Aug 25, 2020)

otoh



			https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/ohio/articles-of-impeachment-filed-against-ohio-gov-dewine-over-coronavirus-response/512-d62ec4b6-8fbd-4641-9dc0-db8f04f7e33a
		


_The article says DeWine's statewide mask mandate is making Ohio a hostile work environment, while extending the mandate to places of worship forces citizens "to choose between worshipping their God and worshipping at the altar of unbridled government."
Becker says many Ohioans find the mask mandate offensive, degrading, humiliating and insulting, while there is also evidence that masks can be hazardous to one's health.
He also says Gov. DeWine doubled down when he expanded the mask mandate to school-age children, who are less susceptible to COVID-19._

otoh,









						Man who believed virus was hoax loses wife to Covid-19
					

A couple from Florida did not follow health guidelines after believing lies about the virus online.



					www.bbc.com
				




_Brian Lee Hitchens and his wife, Erin, had read claims online that the virus was fabricated, linked to 5G or similar to the flu.

The couple didn't follow health guidance or seek help when they fell ill in early May. Brian recovered but his 46-year-old wife became critically ill and died this month from heart problems linked to the virus._


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 25, 2020)

Some good news, America have had their lowest deaths for a while. Hopefully it will stay that way. Cases also seem to be dropping a bit.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 27, 2020)

C.D.C. Now Says People Without Covid-19 Symptoms Do Not Need Testing
					

The revision prompted confusion and alarm from experts, who called the move “potentially dangerous.”




					www.nytimes.com
				




Wtf is there any scientific basis for this or is it just trying to reduce cases numbers to make Trump look good? elbows LynnDoyleCooper


----------



## zahir (Aug 27, 2020)

CDC was pressured 'from the top down' to change coronavirus testing guidance, official says
					

A sudden change in federal guidelines on coronavirus testing came this week as a result of pressure from the upper ranks of the Trump administration, a federal health official close to the process tells CNN, and a key White House coronavirus task force member was not part of the meeting when the...




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 27, 2020)

Saw that this morning, also saw Cuomo's response -> New York will not be following the new guidelines.



> “Shame on the people at the CDC,” Cuomo said, calling the change “indefensible.”





			https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/26/coronavirus-cuomo-says-new-york-wont-follow-cdc-guidance-rips-into-agency-as-trumps-political-tool.html


----------



## elbows (Aug 27, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> C.D.C. Now Says People Without Covid-19 Symptoms Do Not Need Testing
> 
> 
> The revision prompted confusion and alarm from experts, who called the move “potentially dangerous.”
> ...



A desire to manipulate the picture has been apparent since they fucked with hospital data collection some time ago. At that stage I stopped tracking a lot of stuff in the USA because if I dont trust the numbers then whats the point.

Testing of asymptomatic people was one of the only areas where the USA has been vaguely impressive in this pandemic. If you have the capacity to offer testing to those without symptoms then this can really help try to get a proper picture of the state of infection and is also important for trying to limit transmission. The UK never managed to offer this so far, and the fact the USA are trying to give up on it is a tragic disgrace. Well to be fair the UK has offered it in specific circumstances (eg sometimes testing everyone in a setting where there has been a large outbreak, eg a workplace) and by advising people in certain situations to ignore the official guidelines about having symptoms, but this is several steps below what the USA offered, because there was a stage where they were actively asking people without symptoms to get tested.


----------



## StoneRoad (Aug 27, 2020)

According to








						Coronavirus Update (Live): 129,471,257 Cases and 2,828,154 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer
					

Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...




					www.worldometers.info
				




USA went over Six million cases sometime in the "early hours" of 27th August 2020 (I'm guessing the reported figures as at around 0900 GMT).

No doubt it will go higher later in the day.


----------



## elbows (Aug 27, 2020)

And to be clear, the number of tests performed has already been dropping for the last month, and this is one of the few figures I recently started tracking there in light of the recent news.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 27, 2020)

Covid Gag Rules at U.S. Companies Are Putting Everyone at Risk
					

Employees say the biggest names in American business have banned them from alerting others to coronavirus outbreaks.




					www.bloomberg.com


----------



## pesh (Aug 28, 2020)

South Dakota's post Sturgis numbers are going as well as you'd expect, they added over 600 yesterday, half of which were from the 2 previous days, “a reporting aberration” prevented them from being posted till after Governor Noem had given her speech at the RNC the night before last.


----------



## StoneRoad (Aug 28, 2020)

To me, the "reporting aberration" in this case looks suspiciously like massaging the figures ...


----------



## pesh (Aug 28, 2020)

just a bit...


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 28, 2020)

COVID-19 reinfection reported in Nevada patient, researchers say
					

The report comes several days after the first confirmed coronavirus reinfection in the world was identified in Hong Kong.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Aug 31, 2020)

I've mentioned on more occasion that Canadians are not too happy with Americans crossing into our country.

One of the simpler ways to gain entry is to tell the border patrol you are going to Alaska.
Now, if you are going to Alaska, you have to have a sign on your car with the date you should leave Canada.
You just drive, eat and sleep and get out of our country.









						American Driving through Canada to Alaska Facing $569,000 Fine for Stopping to Sightsee
					

U.S. drivers are allowed across the border right now if they're headed to Alaska, but the Canadian Pandemic Act says they'd better not dawdle on the way up.




					www.caranddriver.com
				




We mean it, stay on your side of the border!!!!

We do not want you here.


----------



## Combustible (Aug 31, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> June 20:
> 
> View attachment 224311
> 
> ...



And now he has a message from beyond the grave


----------



## two sheds (Aug 31, 2020)

i dare say some of the fascists will think covid's a "good thing" to clear out the ill and weak from society.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 31, 2020)

Donald Trump just reposted a tweet saying only 9000 people have died from Covid-19


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 31, 2020)

two sheds said:


> i dare say some of the fascists will think covid's a "good thing" to clear out the ill and weak from society.



Yeah I keep asking myself why right wingers love covid so much and seem so keen to say its not deadly and well yeah


----------



## two sheds (Aug 31, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Yeah I keep asking myself why right wingers love covid so much and seem so keen to say its not deadly and well yeah



"Many men of course became extremely rich, but this was perfectly natural and nothing to be ashamed of because no one was really poor – at least no one worth speaking of."]


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 31, 2020)

COVID-19 isn't that deadly, says Twitter account of man who died from COVID-19.


----------



## frogwoman (Aug 31, 2020)

'Westernjournal.com' 

Seems legit.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Sep 2, 2020)

Have I mentioned how much I'd like to see the back of our governor, Pete Ricketts (Ameritrade billionaire and owner of the Chicago Cubs baseball team)?  Here's another reason to want to see our cut-rate Lex Luther gone:



> LINCOLN — Jobless workers and struggling families in Nebraska are having to make do without two federally funded coronavirus relief programs.
> 
> Nebraska is one of two states that have not yet opted to give unemployed workers an extra $300 a week in federal unemployment aid. The other state, South Dakota, has refused the money.
> 
> ...





			https://omaha.com/news/state-and-regional/govt-and-politics/nebraska-is-only-state-not-continuing-emergency-supplemental-food-assistance-during-pandemic/article_fa3dea43-ab31-59c2-a9b7-91fd181f92c7.html?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook_Omaha_World-Herald&fbclid=IwAR3K7vWQMK2kaau6bBeVw0uO3d3vgG9VZxg1Gmn0aO-5akMH7SPuQ1HKemA
		


I have a friend who is building Little Free Pantries.  There's now twelve of them spaced across the city.  Each one empties out three times per day.  I'm sure that as more are built, they too will empty out several times per day.  There's plenty of hunger here that could be helped if the governor just did just the bare minimum.


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 2, 2020)

C&P from Beeb (not linkable).

I don't understand. Why ?


*US won't join WHO-led vaccine efforts*

ReutersCopyright: Reuters
The Trump administration has indicated that it will not participate in international coalition efforts to find and distribute a vaccine for Covid-19 because the World Health Organization (WHO) is involved.
The Washington Post newspaper reported that the White House would not join 172 other countries participating in a WHO-led initiative to "ensure equitable access to safe and effective vaccines, once they are licensed and approved".
White House spokesman Judd Deere said in a statement that the US would "continue to engage our international partners to ensure we defeat the virus, but we will not be constrained by multilateral organisations influenced by the corrupt World Health Organization and China".
US President Donald Trump has attacked the WHO over its handling of the coronavirus outbreak, accusing it of being biased towards China in how it issued its guidance.


----------



## JimW (Sep 2, 2020)

StoneRoad said:


> C&P from Beeb (not linkable).
> 
> I don't understand. Why ?
> 
> ...


Definitely a China thing I'd say, the Ethiopian head is seen as a China place-man and they think the WHO was too quick to absolve China of blame, while blame is of course trump's game.


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 2, 2020)

Nancy Pelosi says she was victim of 'setup' in hair salon mask dispute
					

House speaker, who was photographed in San Francisco salon without a face covering, says salon owes her apology




					www.theguardian.com
				



ffs


----------



## cupid_stunt (Sep 5, 2020)

The good news is that the 7-day average daily death toll, which hit over 1,100 a month ago, continues to slowly drop, and as of yesterday is just under 900. However, there's concerns about what will happened over the long weekend, with it being Labour Day on Monday, after both Memorial Day in May and July Fourth holidays were blamed for spikes in new cases.

But, this prediction is scary, based on a model from the University of Washington's Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation, which has tended to be fairly accurate in the past, if anything a little on the conservative side, according to CNN.



> More than 410,000 people in the US could die from the coronavirus by January 1, more than doubling the current death toll, a new model often cited by top health officials predicted Friday. That would mean 224,000 more lives lost in the US over the next four months.
> 
> Near-universal mask use could cut the number of projected additional fatalities by more than half, according to the model from the University of Washington's Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation. But it also warns the cumulative death toll could be much higher by the new year if all restrictions are eased. "If a herd immunity strategy is pursued, meaning no further government intervention is taken from now to Jan 1st, the death toll could increase to 620,000," according to IHME's briefing.
> 
> The death rate could reach nearly 3,000 a day by December, an unprecedented number, due in part to "declining vigilance of the public," the IHME expects. For now, the model points to declining mask use in some regions from peak usage in early August.


----------



## scifisam (Sep 5, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Nancy Pelosi says she was victim of 'setup' in hair salon mask dispute
> 
> 
> House speaker, who was photographed in San Francisco salon without a face covering, says salon owes her apology
> ...



FFS at the made-up furore or at her? She did actually follow the rules.


----------



## elbows (Sep 5, 2020)

How did she follow the rules when such businesses were not supposed to reopen at the time she was there? It was both a setup and Pelosi not following the rules as far as I can tell, although I may have some detail wrong and will be quite prepared to change my stance if I have.


----------



## elbows (Sep 6, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> But, this prediction is scary, based on a model from the University of Washington's Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation, which has tended to be fairly accurate in the past, if anything a little on the conservative side, according to CNN.



There was a time when we often had reason to take the piss out of the IHME model, mostly because the maths used to predict the future downward curve was based on the initial upwards curve, so when the death rate fell more slowly than they rose in the first place, the model was way off. But that was quite a long time ago now and they since added all sorts of stuff relating to social distancing measures/masks etc to their model, and they have a lot more data now. I still expect there are severe limitations to this model, like most models, but it might be coping much better these days with the current situation in the USA. It is on my list of things to do to revaluate how well that model is doing in regards various countries.


----------



## Combustible (Sep 7, 2020)

elbows said:


> There was a time when we often had reason to take the piss out of the IHME model, mostly because the maths used to predict the future downward curve was based on the initial upwards curve, so when the death rate fell more slowly than they rose in the first place, the model was way off. But that was quite a long time ago now and they since added all sorts of stuff relating to social distancing measures/masks etc to their model, and they have a lot more data now. I still expect there are severe limitations to this model, like most models, but it might be coping much better these days with the current situation in the USA. It is on my list of things to do to revaluate how well that model is doing in regards various countries.



Twitter thread about this here



The jist seems to be that the large increase in deaths comes from taking into account the effects of seasonality in the model, based on previous seasonal variations in pneumonia mortality.


----------



## Dogsauce (Sep 7, 2020)

State of the replies on this. America is fucked.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 7, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> State of the replies on this. America is fucked.



I think people complaining are more vocal usually but yes, I have finger cramp from scrolling through the eedjits


----------



## Dogsauce (Sep 7, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> I think people complaining are more vocal usually but yes, I have finger cramp from scrolling through the eedjits



I do wonder if there’s any ‘foreign influence’ stirring this pot, it’s an easy way to weaken/divide the USA. Or does that make me a conspiracy loon?

People are really running with this 6% thing, which is utter bollocks.

Needs another pile-in from the K-Pop lot I reckon!


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 7, 2020)

Dogsauce said:


> I do wonder if there’s any ‘foreign influence’ stirring this pot, it’s an easy way to weaken/divide the USA. Or does that make me a conspiracy loon?
> 
> People are really running with this 6% thing, which is utter bollocks.
> 
> Needs another pile-in from the K-Pop lot I reckon!


99% of statistics are made on the spot...


----------



## 8ball (Sep 8, 2020)

The 6% thing is being pushed hard by QAnon right now.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 8, 2020)

well, the orange buffoon did tweet about it so it must be the trooth


----------



## Yossarian (Sep 8, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> well, the orange buffoon did tweet about it so it must be the trooth



"Obese 74-year-old man with coronary artery disease highlights fact that most people who die from COVID-19 have other health conditions."


----------



## Dogsauce (Sep 8, 2020)

As well as the ‘6%’ thing, I’m seeing people/bots quoting that it has ‘little or no effect’ on 99.04% of people. Where have they dug this shit up from, is it simply the percentage that haven‘t died or been in ICU? That‘s a fairly low barrier.


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 8, 2020)

I've seen centrist types quoting this shit too tbf.


----------



## NoXion (Sep 8, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> I've seen centrist types quoting this shit too tbf.



Centrists are the worst.


----------



## prunus (Sep 8, 2020)

NoXion said:


> Centrists are the worst.



Especially extreme centrists <spits>


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 8, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> I've seen centrist types quoting this shit too tbf.



I'd normally criticise centrists for their feeble politics, so can you explain them being Covid-deniers a bit more?


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 8, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> I'd normally criticise centrists for their feeble politics, so can you explain them being Covid-deniers a bit more?


Not denying it as such just minimising it and misrepresenting arguments etc, saying that anyone criticising government decisions and rhetoric such as 'herd immunity' is 'damaging public trust in a pandemic' among other things. I don't really want to derail this thread tbh.


----------



## William of Walworth (Sep 8, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Not denying it as such just minimising it and misrepresenting arguments etc, saying that anyone criticising government decisions and rhetoric such as 'herd immunity' is 'damaging public trust in a pandemic' among other things. I don't really want to derail this thread tbh.



Very interesting -- maybe there'll get to be an opportunity to discuss all that on some different thread another time?


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 8, 2020)

William of Walworth said:


> Very interesting -- maybe there'll get to be an opportunity to discuss all that on some different thread another time?


I hope so


----------



## editor (Sep 9, 2020)

THIS is what freeeeeeeeeedom looks like, commies! 









						Sturgis Motorcycle Rally is now linked to more than 250,000 cases
					

One study estimates the public health cost of the super-spreading event is near $12 billion.




					www.motherjones.com
				




Study: http://ftp.iza.org/dp13670.pdf


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 9, 2020)




----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 9, 2020)

oh, poor little snowflake 









						Michael Lindell Threatens CNN with Legal Redress Over Anderson Cooper Interview
					

My Pillow creator Michael Lindell threatens CNN with legal redress over Anderson Cooper's Oleandrin interview, according to a letter exclusively obtained by Newsweek.




					www.newsweek.com
				






> The lawyer claims that Anderson "cast aspersions on Mr. Lindell's character and reputation" and referred to him as a "snake oil salesman."


----------



## editor (Sep 10, 2020)

Way to go!



> South Dakota Gov. Kristi Noem's administration announced Tuesday that it is using federal coronavirus relief funds to pay for a $5 million tourism ad campaign aimed at drawing people to the state. The move comes even as the state emerges as one of the nation's top hot spots for COVID-19 infections.
> 
> The 30-second spot, which premiered on Fox News alongside Noem's speech at the Republican National Convention last month, features the governor saying that "with our breathtaking landscapes and wide-open spaces, we're a place to safely explore." But the state currently ranks second in the country for new cases per capita over the last two weeks, with 439 new cases per 100,000 people.











						South Dakota governor uses coronavirus relief funds for $5 million tourism ad despite COVID surge
					

The state currently ranks second in the country for new cases per capita over the last two weeks, with 439 new cases per 100,000 people.




					www.cbsnews.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Sep 10, 2020)

editor said:


> South Dakota governor uses coronavirus relief funds for $5 million tourism ad despite COVID surge
> 
> 
> The state currently ranks second in the country for new cases per capita over the last two weeks, with 439 new cases per 100,000 people.
> ...



439 new cases per 100,000 people, fucking hell.  

As a comparison, the UK has just gone over 20 new cases per 100,000 people.


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 10, 2020)

If the US had Canada’s Covid-19 death rate, 100,000 more Americans would likely be alive today
					

America really is worse on coronavirus than other developed countries — and Trump is a big reason.




					www.vox.com
				






> What would the US death toll be like if the country had the same rate of Covid-19 deaths as some other wealthy nations, accounting for population differences?
> 
> The results, based on Our World in Data, are staggering:
> 
> ...


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 10, 2020)

> Columnist Ross Douthat took issue with that approach. Arguing that “the patterns for Covid-19 fatalities often look more region-specific than country-specific,” he compared the US to a slew of countries in the Western Hemisphere, particularly in Latin America and parts of Europe. By that toll, the US doesn’t seem to do so badly, with a death rate close to that of Brazil, France, Mexico, and the United Kingdom.


----------



## quimcunx (Sep 10, 2020)

frogwoman said:


>



There you go then. It's right up there with us and our #world beating figures.


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 10, 2020)

editor said:


> Way to go!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think that our definition of somewhere safe to explore might be _slightly_ different ...


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 10, 2020)




----------



## krtek a houby (Sep 10, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> View attachment 229882



A mass mask burning? But all that smoke ... isn't there some kind of protection from inhalation the burners can wear?


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 10, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> View attachment 229882



Isn't culpable homicide an offence in magaland ?


----------



## petee (Sep 13, 2020)




----------



## existentialist (Sep 13, 2020)

petee said:


>



Someone's got bigger problems than the lack of a mask.


----------



## two sheds (Sep 13, 2020)

Not what you need while you're just trying to do your job - they must have had a real adrenaline/fear rush


----------



## 8ball (Sep 13, 2020)

petee said:


>




This "Karen" shit has got fucking tedious, though.
A mate of mine got a load of shit on FB for posting about local increases in cases and the need to be vigilant at the moment, because of her name.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Sep 13, 2020)

8ball said:


> This "Karen" shit has got fucking tedious, though.
> A mate of mine got a load of shit on FB for posting about local increases in cases and the need to be vigilant at the moment, because of her name.




First they came for the paediatricians...


----------



## 8ball (Sep 13, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> First they came for the paediatricians...


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Sep 14, 2020)

8ball said:


>




It's a slightly convoluted joke.

Not against you, against the the people with the pitchforks.


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 14, 2020)

Any one want to bet on the next US hot spot?









						Georgia governor bans cities from ordering people to wear face masks
					

Savannah Mayor Van Johnson, who was the first local official to defy Kemp, tweeted: "Ignore the science and survive the best you can."




					www.cbsnews.com
				






> Kemp's move is likely to infuriate local officials in communities that had acted, including Atlanta, Augusta, Savannah, Rome and the governor's hometown of Athens-Clarke County. Overall, mask orders by Wednesday were covering 1.4 million of Georgia's more than 10 million residents.
> 
> Savannah Mayor Van Johnson was the first local official to defy Kemp and order masks, and had said police would start writing $500 citations to businesses that didn't enforce the law.



Well, maybe not...


----------



## editor (Sep 15, 2020)

And the twats keep on coming 









						Pacific Beach Bar Manager Attacked After Asking Patrons to Wear Facemasks
					

A Pacific Beach bar manager was violently attacked Labor Day weekend after asking patrons to wear their facemasks and it was all caught on video. That employee tells NBC 7 he doesn’t want this to happen to anyone else and fears it could if the man who attacked him isn’t held responsible...




					www.nbcsandiego.com


----------



## petee (Sep 15, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Any one want to bet on the next US hot spot?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



this is part of a long tradition of local-government-ideologues suppressing actual local-government actions when it doesn't suit their politics. the state govt of NC in the 90s (iirc) passed a law prohibiting any smaller jurisdiction from passing gun control measures.


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 15, 2020)

Worldometers is saying 199k dead in the USA


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 15, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Worldometers is saying 199k dead in the USA


And the two people everyone wants it to kill there are still alive


----------



## two sheds (Sep 15, 2020)

nearly everyone


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 15, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> It's a slightly convoluted joke.
> 
> Not against you, against the the people with the pitchforks.


Much of the time the people with pitchforks are right.


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 15, 2020)

Pickman's model said:


> And the two people everyone wants it to kill there are still alive



Who? Trump and Biden?


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 15, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Who? Trump and Biden?


Three people then


----------



## two sheds (Sep 15, 2020)

Pickman's model said:


> Three people then



four including the man in the fridge


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 15, 2020)

Pickman's model said:


> Three people then


Who is the third? Pence?


----------



## two sheds (Sep 15, 2020)

either him or bono I was thinking


----------



## Yossarian (Sep 15, 2020)

Pickman's model said:


> And the two people everyone wants it to kill there are still alive



Henry Kissinger and Harvey Weinstein?


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 16, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> Henry Kissinger and Harvey Weinstein?


Ok, five people


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 16, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Who is the third? Pence?


Yes


----------



## cupid_stunt (Sep 16, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Worldometers is saying 199k dead in the USA



Over 200k today.  

Although there's a hell of a lot more, estimated excess deaths had already hit 219k back on 25th July. 

On that date the official covid death rate was 151k, with over 70k new covid deaths reported since that date, excess deaths must be around 300k now. 



> Across the United States, at least 200,000 more people have died than usual since March [& up to 25th July], according to a New York Times analysis of estimates from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. This is about 60,000 higher than the number of deaths that have been directly linked to the coronavirus.











						The True Coronavirus Toll in the U.S. Has Already Surpassed 200,000
					

A New York Times analysis shows a high number of deaths above normal — with the most recent rise in excess deaths focused in the South and West.



					www.nytimes.com


----------



## frogwoman (Sep 16, 2020)

Apparently suicide and drug deaths are also going up


----------



## existentialist (Sep 16, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Apparently suicide and drug deaths are also going up


UK suicide rates have been trending upward for a couple of years, too.


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 16, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Apparently suicide and drug deaths are also going up




Grim news for those suffering with dementia, too.









						Devising strategies to protect older people with dementia amid the COVID-19 pandemic
					

The older population and those with dementia around the world are facing an unprecedented threat from COVID-19 which threatens them with a higher risk of death when infected. As of 23 August 2020, in Hong Kong, the mortality rate for people aged 60 or above was around 6.27%, which was almost 105...




					medicalxpress.com


----------



## elbows (Sep 17, 2020)

From a 18:17 entry on the BBC live updates page comes.......



> The US Post Office (USPS) had planned to send 650 million reusable cotton face masks to Americans - roughly five per household - back in April, according to documents obtained by the Washington Post though a Freedom of Information Act request.
> 
> But the plan was axed by White House officials who felt it would create a panic among Americans, an unnamed White House official told the Post.
> 
> "There was concern from some in the White House Domestic Policy Council and the office of the vice president that households receiving masks might create concern or panic," the official said.







__





						Loading…
					





					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 17, 2020)

I don't know about a panic but I can guess the conspiraloons reaction.


----------



## elbows (Sep 17, 2020)

Panic prevention is the sort of excuse used when the authorities fail to tell their populations in a timely way that the nuclear power station melted.

I believe modern public health & disaster communication disciplines are supposed to deal with this tendency and encourage a more reasonable balance, but of course other interests have their power and influence over this.


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 17, 2020)

__





						HuffPost is now a part of Verizon Media
					






					www.huffingtonpost.ca
				




*Trump Blames Biden For Not Instituting U.S. Mask Mandate*



> U.S. President Donald Trump moved to blame his Democratic competitor, former U.S. vice-president Joe Biden, for not instituting a national mask mandate during the coronavirus pandemic.
> 
> The claim, made at an ABC News town hall Tuesday with undecided voters in Pennsylvania, is misleading for two reasons: Biden has, in fact, urged all U.S. governors to mandate mask-wearing to slow the spread of COVID-19. The Democratic candidate is also not the president and has no authority to mandate anything. Trump does.
> 
> Julie Bart asked the president why he hadn’t instituted a national mask mandate during the height of the pandemic and why he had largely refused to wear facial coverings even as the nation’s top medical officials urged the public to do so.


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 17, 2020)

good grief, the buffoon is even more incoherent than I expected on that tw1tter clip.

and he (organge one) could mandate masks right now, but he won't.


----------



## elbows (Sep 18, 2020)

I've mentioned this subject before because its always rather interesting that the BBC can report on this sort of thing without ever really commenting on the fact we've never been close to testing asymptomatic cases to get a test in the UK.









						Coronavirus: US health chiefs reverse advice on Covid-19 testing
					

The CDC caused controversy in August by saying that anyone without symptoms should not be tested.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				






> US health officials have rowed back on controversial advice issued last month that said people without Covid-19 symptoms should not get tested.
> 
> The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) now says anyone in close contact with a known infected person should take a test.
> 
> ...


----------



## Sunray (Sep 18, 2020)

I did say a while ago, Trump has gone totally crazy.  He has thrown the American people under the covid bus and now expects heard mentality???  Really,  I can accept, nay expect this from some nutjob on youtube. But such is the river of total bullshit, the whole world is desensitised.  He the most powerful man on earth.  I'm calm, I'm fairly confident a US general would shoot him before pressing the button.

Still, the whole world needs the American people to get a moment of clarity and vote for anyone else.


----------



## two sheds (Sep 18, 2020)

I think you'll find it was turd mentality


----------



## SlideshowBob (Sep 18, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Reminds me of the other day when Iain Duncan-Smith told Joe Biden to bring rioting under control. Again ignoring the fact that Biden's not currently, you know, the President.


----------



## two sheds (Sep 19, 2020)

SlideshowBob said:


> Reminds me of the other day when Iain Duncan-Smith told Joe Biden to bring rioting under control. Again ignoring the fact that Biden's not currently, you know, the President.





> The backlash was led by the former cabinet minister Iain Duncan Smith, who told the Times: “We don’t need lectures on the Northern Ireland peace deal from Mr Biden. If I were him I would worry more about the need for a peace deal in the US to stop the killing and rioting before lecturing other sovereign nations.”



I'd missed that 









						Angry Tory MPs reject Joe Biden's comments on UK-EU Brexit talks
					

Trade deal with US not possible if UK undermines Good Friday agreement, Democrats say




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## SlideshowBob (Sep 19, 2020)

two sheds said:


> I'd missed that
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It must be rather flattering for Biden that a government which doesn't seem to particularly like him is already treating him as the incumbent President on the presumption he'll win come November.


----------



## two sheds (Sep 19, 2020)

As long as he doesn't go full Kinnock with "We're alllll riiiiiiiight"


----------



## elbows (Sep 19, 2020)

two sheds said:


> As long as he doesn't go full Kinnock with "We're alllll riiiiiiiight"



I think they still remember the Howard Dean Scream of 2004 (AKA I Have A Scream) so that reduces the chances of a similar performance a mere 16 years later.


----------



## two sheds (Sep 19, 2020)

an overrated scream  I thought  0:34


----------



## petee (Sep 19, 2020)

my father drove a city bus, i see here that 131 NYCT workers have died of the coronavirus. this guy got knocked out for insisting on protection:









						When a Bus Driver Told a Rider to Wear a Mask, ‘He Knocked Me Out Cold’
					

More than 170 New York City transit workers have been harassed or assaulted for asking passengers to wear masks.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## yield (Sep 19, 2020)

The pandemic paused the US school-to-prison pipeline: potential lessons learned
The Lancet. September 17, 2020


> A global pandemic caused society to radically and quickly reconfigure. Schools, wary of the health risks of in-person instruction, shifted to virtual learning. Although not ideal in many respects, this shift placed adolescents in the USA out of the reach of harsh school disciplinary procedures (ie, zero tolerance policies, out-of-school suspensions, expulsions, and law enforcement referrals), contributing to a drastic reduction in juvenile court referrals nationally.
> 
> The school-to-prison pipeline paused. Characterised by school disciplinary approaches placing adolescents on a trajectory to juvenile and then adult criminal legal systems, this pipeline is most pronounced for Black and Latinx students, students with disabilities, and in schools serving impoverished communities. Although we have focused mainly on the USA, this topic has relevance in other societies with public education, substantial income inequality, and racial inequities in their justice systems.


Every cloud and that.


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 23, 2020)

People are dismissed if their health can not allow them to follow the conditions of their employment.
If the job needed them to do something that is beyond their capacities, they should not apply.
No sympathy for the dude.









						Poll worker fired for not wearing a mask sues Wisconsin governor
					

A Wisconsin man is suing a La Crosse city clerk and Gov. Tony Evers (D) after he was dismissed from a paid poll worker position for refusing to wear a mask at a voting precinct, citing a medical condition.




					thehill.com
				






> The LaCrosse Tribune reported Tuesday that Nicholas Newmann is suing Clerk Teri Lehrke as well as Evers over his Aug. 11 dismissal, which his lawyers wrote in court documents came as a result of Lehrke enforcing Ever's statewide mask mandate which his lawyers argue is unconstitutional.
> 
> “The American system of government contains three branches, not one. For those who might say the governor must do ‘something,’ the founders divided power for a reason: They had left behind a king’s rule. Power is divided on purpose so that it cannot be exercised so easily,” Newmann's lawyer told the Tribune in a statement regarding the lawsuit.


----------



## NoXion (Sep 23, 2020)

It's always a good sign when the guy's lawyer talks about their client's refusal to follow basic safety procedures in the name of "muh FREEDUMBZ!!!". Fucking useless piece of Yankee dankee doodle shite.


----------



## petee (Sep 23, 2020)

how solidarity works









						7 Kenosha Schools Go Virtual After More Than 276 Teachers Call In Sick
					

Seven schools in the Kenosha Unified School District switched to all-virtual learning from Monday through Friday after nearly 300 staff members called in absences.




					www.wpr.org
				




i know it's fraught, now parents who are FWs themselves will have to choose between work and staying home. I'll hope that a sense of w/c control spreads.


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 25, 2020)

Trump has lost patience with CDC head after series of mixed messages
					

President Donald Trump has lost patience with the head of the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Dr. Robert Redfield, as well as with the other public health experts on his coronavirus team because their sober messaging on the future of the pandemic clashes with his rosy assessments.




					www.cnn.com
				






> The ever-looming threat, Trump's public undermining of the CDC chief and Redfield's tendency to fold to the White House are taking a toll on CDC staff, from top to bottom, employees say. Some have questioned whether their work is making a difference and others have even considered resigning -- and whether the sagging spirits may be hampering pandemic response.
> 
> Eight current and former public health officials described for CNN a crushing environment at the agencies charged with the coronavirus response brought on by a President intent on contradicting critical public health messaging and downplaying the threat of the virus, politically motivated pressure from the White House and baseless allegations from political appointees that government scientists are part of a disloyal "deep state."
> 
> "The morale is as low as I've ever seen it and we have no confidence in our leadership," a CDC official said. "People are miserable and it's a shame because this pandemic is still flying away and we still need a robust public health response."


----------



## petee (Sep 25, 2020)

she's exposed us


----------



## elbows (Sep 26, 2020)

She is probably jealous that more voters didnt wear such things over their eyes when voting in March, figuring she may have performed better under such circumstances.


----------



## petee (Sep 26, 2020)

spotted on the LIRR this evening. 

good to see pushback in a popular milieu.


----------



## spring-peeper (Sep 26, 2020)

A baffled world is watching as the US is overrun by COVID-19 infections and deaths — with no end in sight
					

"The USA is a first-world country but it is acting like a third-world country," U Aung Thu Nyein, a political analyst in Myanmar said.




					www.businessinsider.com
				






> Across 13 countries, including Canada, Australia, and Spain, the US has been viewed in the most negative light over the past year, compared to years past. They are especially critical of the US's handling of the pandemic according to Pew.
> 
> "Across the 13 nations surveyed, a median of just 15% say the US has done a good job of dealing with the outbreak," the Pew report said.
> ...
> ...





> Additionally, while other residents have said that their own nations have done well to handle the outbreak, only in the US and the United Kingdom did respondents give their respective countries poor marks.
> 
> In July, The Washington Post reported that as Americans lost faith in their own country's handling of the pandemic, as well as social unrest, the world also began to "question the United States' appetite or capacity for a collaborative leadership role at a time when the health and economic crises call out for committed global cooperation."


----------



## elbows (Sep 28, 2020)

> The head of the US public health body the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has been overheard complaining about a new member of President Trump's coronavirus task force. According to a report from NBC News, Dr Robert Redfield was heard saying that Dr Scott Atlas was giving Trump false and misleading data on the virus - including on whether masks work, and on herd immunity.
> 
> On a phone call, made in public on a flight from Atlanta to Washington DC, Redfield was heard saying: "Everything he says is false." He later confirmed he was talking about Atlas, who joined the White House task force in August. Atlas's appointment has been criticised, because he doesn't have a background in infectious diseases or public health.



From 17:50 on BBC live updates page https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-54315280


----------



## elbows (Sep 30, 2020)

BBC live page again, 14:22 entry:



			https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-54352135
		




> Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs) in the US are reporting lower coronavirus infection rates because students are better at wearing masks and observing social distancing, a study has found.
> 
> According to a report in Inside Higher Ed, students at HBCUs are also more aware of the disproportionate toll the pandemic has taken on people of colour in the US.
> 
> HBCUs have also taken a stricter approach to Covid measure, the report adds. One HBCU in North Carolina held classes on Labour Day weekend, to discourage students from going to gatherings.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Oct 2, 2020)




----------



## Mr.Bishie (Oct 2, 2020)




----------



## Supine (Oct 2, 2020)

Finally some positive Trump news


----------



## LDC (Oct 2, 2020)

I know it's obvious but bloody hell, potentially HUGE implications... even if he doesn't get that ill.


----------



## BassJunkie (Oct 2, 2020)

If he did get very ill, or indeed die, given the fact he's been the cheerleader for "It's not dangerous" that may well save many lives among his acolytes if they begin to take it seriously. 

In a sense he'd be like Jesus, except he'd have died for his own sins.


----------



## existentialist (Oct 2, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> I know it's obvious but bloody hell, potentially HUGE implications... even if he doesn't get that ill.


One can only hope.


----------



## LDC (Oct 2, 2020)

existentialist said:


> One can only hope.



I'm not sure though. If it interferes with the election rallies and debates etc. maybe they'd be a good case that the election couldn't go ahead 'fairly' and it might be delayed. Or if he loses he'll have another argument that he was disadvantaged. Fuck knows, every time I put the news on it gets more and more like some terrible apocalypse TV show, so who knows what might come of this latest development in the plot...


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

Come on SARS-COV-2, we're all counting on you.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

He's going to be fine though isn't he


----------



## LDC (Oct 2, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> He's going to be fine though isn't he



He's in a few higher risk categories though.... News earlier was reporting that he has a 20% chance of being hospitalized.


----------



## Steel Icarus (Oct 2, 2020)

He's going to be fine and use it to win. What a bad dream this year is.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

If he doesn't get ill it's another argument for 'it's just flu'. And if he dies that's another argument for deranged QANON fans to say it's actually a big conspiracy.


----------



## LDC (Oct 2, 2020)

I wish he could hear all the news reports saying he's classed as obese. Probably that would upset him more than anything else.


----------



## ska invita (Oct 2, 2020)

tens of millions lose their jobs in the US - markets reach record boom!
trump has to quarantine for two weeks - markets fall 
what a system


----------



## LDC (Oct 2, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> If he doesn't get ill it's another argument for 'it's just flu'. And if he dies that's another argument for deranged QANON fans to say it's actually a big conspiracy.



Oh no, yeah the conspiracy stuff will be out of control....

Also imagine Biden might be sweating a little waiting for his test result too. Maybe if he gets it too they can have a televised virus off and the one that survives gets to be president. Some shit 2020 coronavirus version of the Thunderdome.


----------



## maomao (Oct 2, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> If he doesn't get ill it's another argument for 'it's just flu'. And if he dies that's another argument for deranged QANON fans to say it's actually a big conspiracy.


What we need is 2 weeks on a ventilator and then to contest the election while clearly incapacitated.



LynnDoyleCooper said:


> I wish he could hear all the news reports saying he's classed as obese. Probably that would upset him more than anything else.



He's only just obese and he's above average height which makes it slightly less accurate.


----------



## planetgeli (Oct 2, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> I'm not sure though. If it interferes with the election rallies and debates etc. maybe they'd be a good case that the election couldn't go ahead 'fairly' and it might be delayed.



It will not be delayed. It has to be delayed by executive order and there's all sorts of reasons that will never happen.


----------



## planetgeli (Oct 2, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Come on SARS-COV-2, we're all counting on you.



It's a shit virus, never does anything right. We've seen that with Johnson.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

Yeah I know that hes got major health problems despite being 'the healthiest president America has ever seen'


----------



## LDC (Oct 2, 2020)

planetgeli said:


> It will not be delayed. It has to be delayed by executive order and there's all sorts of reasons that will never happen.



Yeah, it seems unlikely, but if 2020 has taught us anything...


----------



## Artaxerxes (Oct 2, 2020)

BassJunkie said:


> If he did get very ill, or indeed die, given the fact he's been the cheerleader for "It's not dangerous" that may well save many lives among his acolytes if they begin to take it seriously.
> 
> In a sense he'd be like Jesus, except he'd have died for his own sins.



No, he will have been killed by a FAKE DISEASE in a GOVERNMENT PLOT TO SUBVERT THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE.


----------



## planetgeli (Oct 2, 2020)

*Apropos of nothing, according to our systematic review and meta-analysis of the age-stratified IFR of COVID-19, a 74-year-old person who catches the disease has a 1 in 25 risk of death*

24-1 shot then. Though some Chinese studies put it more around 12-1.

Developing pneumonia seems to be the key.


----------



## Chilli.s (Oct 2, 2020)

Given the results that he lost while barely conscious in an isolation ward...


----------



## maomao (Oct 2, 2020)

There's also a massively increased chance of stroke after recovery so there's some hope right up to election day.



planetgeli said:


> *Apropos of nothing, according to our systematic review and meta-analysis of the age-stratified IFR of COVID-19, a 74-year-old person who catches the disease has a 1 in 25 risk of death*
> 
> 24-1 shot then. Though some Chinese studies put it more around 12-1.
> 
> Developing pneumonia seems to be the key.


Does 'catching the disease' include asymptomatic cases?


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

Does he have any symptoms?


----------



## LDC (Oct 2, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Does he have any symptoms?



He won't have symptoms and he'll be fighting fit running the country right up until the second he dies I expect...


----------



## planetgeli (Oct 2, 2020)

maomao said:


> Does 'catching the disease' include asymptomatic cases?



I don't know but as far as affecting the stats/betting goes, subclinical infections amongst the over 70s are rare and therefore will not affect these numbers much if at all.


----------



## BassJunkie (Oct 2, 2020)

Artaxerxes said:


> No, he will have been killed by a FAKE DISEASE in a GOVERNMENT PLOT TO SUBVERT THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE.



I think you're probably right. And I've only just realised, that we're in a new world in which Mike Fucking Pence is in charge


----------



## StoneRoad (Oct 2, 2020)

BassJunkie said:


> I think you're probably right. And I've only just realised, that we're in a new world in which Mike Fucking Pence is in charge


Hopefully, he'll get it as well. In which case the succession goes to Pelosi, according to their Constitution.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

Seems quite likely that Pence will also have it.


----------



## bimble (Oct 2, 2020)

LynnDoyleCooper said:


> He won't have symptoms and he'll be fighting fit running the country right up until the second he dies I expect...


Yep. The only way to tell he’s really sick would be if he stops tweeting altogether for a day or if the tweets become suspiciously coherent.


----------



## Zapp Brannigan (Oct 2, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Seems quite likely that Pence will also have it.



There's been a few comments around along the lines of "Hope Hicks caught it, and she was in the Presidential helicopter with Trump on Wednesday."  I know there will be umpteen occasions where Hicks, Trump and Pence will have crossed paths, but if it was proximity in the helicopter that allowed transmission then Pence wouldn't have been there - US protocol says the Pres and VP don't fly together in case of a crash.


----------



## Plumdaff (Oct 2, 2020)

If he dies from it, QAnon will kick off because he's been murdered, if he doesn't die,  he'll immediately tweet that covid only kills losers and MAGA fans don't need masks. No good outcome.


----------



## Chilli.s (Oct 2, 2020)

Plumdaff said:


> No good outcome.


I find it hard to see anything good having come from him. Nothing at all.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

Well there was Herman Cain who died of covid but his Twitter account continued claiming it wasnt deadly.


----------



## elbows (Oct 2, 2020)

Proud Viruses, stand by my deathbed, someones got to deal with the antivirus.


----------



## editor (Oct 2, 2020)

Trump could have taken down a shitload of his allies too. 



> On the days in between, Mr. Trump interacted with scores of staff members, donors and supporters. Even the woman he has nominated to the Supreme Court, Judge Amy Coney Barrett, has been at the White House this week.
> The president held preparation sessions with staff members for his debate Tuesday night with former Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr., in the tight quarters of the West Wing, where officials who are tested regularly have relied on negative results as an excuse to forgo masks and other safety precautions.
> 
> He attended a closed-door fund-raiser at a private home of a wealthy supporter in Minneapolis, and he appeared before thousands of people at a rally in Duluth, Minn., where most of the crowd did not wear masks. He also shared a stage with Mr. Biden.





> It is not yet clear when and how Mr. Trump contracted the virus. The president and the first lady said they had both tested positive hours after one of his closest aides, Hope Hicks, also tested positive. Ms. Hicks received the diagnosis after she began experiencing symptoms on Wednesday while attending the president’s rally in Minnesota. Mr. Trump kept his appearance there to about 45 minutes, roughly half the length of one of his typical rally speeches.
> 
> 
> Early Friday morning, it was still unclear how many other aides who had come into close contact with Mr. Trump had tested positive, but the White House said its medical unit was conducting contact tracing. Top advisers to the president described themselves as in a state of shock and said they expected a number of additional cases among people in Mr. Trump’s orbit. White House officials had hoped to keep the news about Ms. Hicks from becoming public, to no avail.











						On Monday, Trump Updated the Nation on Virus Strategy. By Friday, He Tested Positive. (Published 2020)
					

President Trump interacted with scores of staff members, donors and supporters this week. Early Friday morning, it was still unclear how many other aides who had come into close contact with him had tested positive.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Buddy Bradley (Oct 2, 2020)

Non-Trump-related question, but does anyone have any idea how far in advance the airlines have been cancelling flights based on travel advice/infection levels? I've got a flight booked to New York right after Christmas, how soon do you think I might be able to officially cancel it for free?


----------



## maomao (Oct 2, 2020)

Boris had 'mild symptoms' too.


----------



## Cloo (Oct 2, 2020)

maomao said:


> Boris had 'mild symptoms' too.


TBF, a lot of people have mild symptoms until they don't - it can be 2 weeks or so down the line they get into difficulty, even if the initial symptoms have been mild, when they are in a vulnerable group.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 2, 2020)

Not gonna be fun eating burgers in front of fox news if he can't taste anything


----------



## two sheds (Oct 2, 2020)

probably an improvement


----------



## elbows (Oct 2, 2020)

I heard they were thinking of freshening things up by having a fox eat Trump while watching burger news.


----------



## elbows (Oct 2, 2020)

I'm not sure what the story is with the drumming on the BBC video that accompanies the story (at least at the time of writing) but they should do it more often.









						Trump Covid: US president has mild symptoms - White House
					

The US president and his wife test positive for the virus, a month before elections.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## maomao (Oct 2, 2020)

elbows said:


> I'm not sure what the story is with the drumming on the BBC video that accompanies the story (at least at the time of writing) but they should do it more often.
> 
> 
> 
> ...






> Mr Trump's chief of staff said the president was "on the job"



😆


----------



## petee (Oct 2, 2020)

read it all, crissakes


----------



## William of Walworth (Oct 2, 2020)

Republican Loonspud said:
			
		

> Does anyone else find it odd that no prominent Democrats have had the virus *but the list of Republicans goes on and on? *



Yes, _do_ read that whole Twitter thread linked to by petee above -- because there's *shedloads* of funny-as-fuck answers to that!


----------



## Badgers (Oct 3, 2020)

__





						Almost 20,000 Amazon workers in US test positive for Covid-19 | Amazon | The Guardian
					

Tech company has faced criticism for keeping warehouses open




					amp.theguardian.com


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 3, 2020)

petee said:


> read it all, crissakes



looneytunes all stars 
she has another one about attempted murder by china as well


----------



## cupid_stunt (Oct 5, 2020)

Looks like lockdown is returning to parts of New York city.  



> Schools and non-essential businesses in nine New York City neighbourhoods will close again due to an uptick in coronavirus cases, mayor Bill de Blasio announced on Sunday.
> 
> Each of the hard-hit areas in Brooklyn and Queens has a testing positivity rate of more than three per cent over a seven-day period.
> 
> ...











						New York City to close schools and businesses after uptick of Covid-19 cases in nine neighbourhoods
					

A further 11 areas are described as being of real concern by New York Mayor Bill de Blasio




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 6, 2020)




----------



## editor (Oct 6, 2020)

petee said:


> read it all, crissakes


She has a show on infowars. What a fuckwit.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Oct 8, 2020)

This is fucking crazy...



> MADISON, Wis. -- Wisconsin health officials announced Wednesday that a field hospital will open next week at the state fairgrounds near Milwaukee as a surge in COVID-19 cases threatens to overwhelm hospitals.
> 
> Wisconsin has become a hot spot for the disease over the last month, ranking third nationwide this week in new cases per capita over the last two weeks. Health experts have attributed the spike to the reopening of colleges and K-12 schools as well as general fatigue over wearing masks and socially distancing.



Yet...



> The move also came as a state judge was considering a lawsuit seeking to strike down Evers' mandate that masks be worn in enclosed public spaces. The governor on Tuesday issued new restrictions on the size of indoor public gatherings through Nov. 6.



 









						Wisconsin activates field hospital as COVID keeps surging
					

Wisconsin's governor has announced a field hospital at the state fairgrounds will open next week as a surge in COVID-19 cases threatens to overwhelm hospitals




					abcnews.go.com


----------



## Lord Camomile (Oct 8, 2020)

editor said:


> She has a show on infowars. What a fuckwit.


"Taking back America"... from who? 

Also, love that even the election is "the greatest in history". Because that's a thing people do, rank elections.

Actually, there's almost certainly a YouTube video that has done that.


----------



## elbows (Oct 8, 2020)

Oh dear.









						FBI busts militia 'plot' to abduct Michigan Gov Gretchen Whitmer
					

Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer has become a target of coronavirus lockdown sceptics.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				






> The FBI says it has thwarted a plot to abduct and overthrow Michigan's Democratic Governor Gretchen Whitmer.
> 
> Mrs Whitmer has become a target of coronavirus sceptics after enacting strict mitigation measures that were overturned by a judge last week.
> 
> Officials say the kidnapping plot involved six men who planned to hold a "treason trial" for her.





> Several members talked about murdering 'tyrants' or 'taking' a sitting governor," the charging document states. In one video, a suspect denounced the state's role in deciding when to reopen gyms during the coronavirus lockdown.


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 8, 2020)

"Wolverine Watchmen" ... how old were these clowns. 14?


----------



## elbows (Oct 10, 2020)

More horrible but unsurprising revelations.

 22m ago 01:16 



> In September, months into a deadly pandemic that has killed more than 200,000 people, the Trump administration blocked a CDC mandate that would have required masks on all public transportation.
> 
> The coronavirus task force, which is required to sign off on all coronavirus-related policies, refused to pass the CDC recommendation, the _New York Times reported_. Under the ruling, masks would have been required on airplanes, buses, trains, and subways across the United States as well as in transit hubs like bus stops and train stations.


----------



## Cid (Oct 10, 2020)

Cases seem to be rising again too... though that is just off absolute positive tests.


----------



## Streathamite (Oct 10, 2020)

Lord Camomile said:


> Also, love that even the election is "the greatest in history". Because that's a thing people do, rank elections.


On a more serious note, it's certainly one of the most important


----------



## petee (Oct 10, 2020)

Thousands of mink dead from COVID-19 outbreaks in Utah and Wisconsin
					

At least 12,000 mink have recently died from coronavirus outbreaks in the two largest fur-producing states.




					www.cbsnews.com
				




_"The research done in Utah still supports that the disease has spread from humans to mink and that the risk of the opposite transmission is very low," the UDAF spokesperson told CBS News. "We still recommend PPE for all mink workers as a safeguard to themselves and the mink." _

(((mink workers))) (((minkies)))


----------



## cupid_stunt (Oct 10, 2020)

Catching up with Europe, this report is from July.   









						A million mink culled in Netherlands and Spain amid Covid-19 fur farming havoc
					

Agriculture minister says origins of outbreak unclear after seven farm workers – and 87% of the mink – test positive




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 10, 2020)

Nooooo


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 15, 2020)

Justin Trudeau: Canada-US border will stay closed until America gets COVID-19 under control
					

\




					www.usatoday.com
				






> Don't bet on the U.S.-Canadian border reopening after the current closure agreement expires on Oct. 21.
> In an interview Wednesday, Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau says his country is committed to keeping the border closed until the U.S. gets control of COVID-19.
> 
> "The U.S. is not in a place where we would feel comfortable reopening those borders," he told the hosts of "Smart Start," which airs on Canada's Global Television Network. “We will continue to make sure that Canadian safety is top of mind when we move forward. We see the cases in the United States and elsewhere around the world, and we need to continue to keep these border controls in place."


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 15, 2020)

Weird part is that Canadians are still free to fly to the US for leisure travel, though Americans can't come north.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 15, 2020)

__





						These Scientists Have A Controversial Plan For “Herd Immunity” — And The White House Is Listening
					





					www.buzzfeednews.com
				




Worrying article about Gupta and co meeting with Trump.


----------



## elbows (Oct 15, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



A perfect match made in hell. At least the USA is already used to the dynamic of the white house doing far too little in the pandemic, whilst some of the worst state leadership already demonstrated that they dont even feel the need to find any kind of crap bad scientific justification for reopening things etc.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Oct 17, 2020)

I hadn't looked for a while, but it seems to have started to take off across the pond again, using the 7-day rolling average, new cases dropped from almost 70k a day in mid-July, to just over 35k in mid-Sept, and now are back up to almost 56k,



> For the first time since late July, the tally of newly reported coronavirus cases in the United States surpassed 64,000 on Thursday. In 44 states and the District of Columbia, caseloads are higher than they were one month ago, and many of the new infections are being reported in rural areas with limited hospital capacity.
> 
> More than 7,944,000 cases have been reported nationwide since February, and at least 216,000 people in the United States have died of covid-19, the disease caused by the virus.





			https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/10/16/coronavirus-covid-live-updates-us/


----------



## a_chap (Oct 17, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> I hadn't looked for a while, but it seems to have started to take off across the pond again, using the 7-day rolling average, new cases dropped from almost 70k a day in mid-July, to just over 35k in mid-Sept, and now are back up to almost 56k,



Wave number three...


----------



## Cid (Oct 17, 2020)

Hospitalisations rising too.


----------



## elbows (Oct 17, 2020)

a_chap said:


> Wave number three...



Even when it resembles a third wave when viewed nationally, its probably wave 1 or 2 as far as many individual states are concerned.


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 18, 2020)

Twitter is at it again.
This time they took Trump's advisor's tweet down.









						Twitter removes tweet from Trump's COVID adviser claiming masks do not work
					

Atlas posted a tweet Saturday that said, "Masks work? NO."




					www.axios.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 18, 2020)

A couple got married at the US-Canada border so guests from both countries could attend despite coronavirus restrictions
					

A Canadian couple got married on the US-Canada border so family and friends from both countries could attend despite travel restrictions due to the coronavirus pandemic.




					www.cnn.com
				






> Lindsay Clowes and Alex Leckie, both 29, exchanged vows on October 10 on a pier along the St. Croix River in New Brunswick surrounded by loved ones.
> 
> But guests at St. Stephen Wharf weren't the only ones to witness the couple's nuptials. Across the river in Calais, Maine, stood aunts, uncles, cousins and friends who also watched them tie the knot. In the middle of the river separating the two countries floated a boat where the Clowes' grandparents witnessed the special day from a safe distance.
> 
> "It couldn't have gone any better. I wouldn't change anything about it," Clowes told CNN. "It turned out to be a lot more special than anything else we could have done."


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 19, 2020)




----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 19, 2020)

nanananananananananana


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 19, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> A couple got married at the US-Canada border so guests from both countries could attend despite coronavirus restrictions
> 
> 
> A Canadian couple got married on the US-Canada border so family and friends from both countries could attend despite travel restrictions due to the coronavirus pandemic.
> ...


worst of both worlds and all that


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 19, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> worst of both worlds and all that




There is no negative.

Making the best of our world would have been a more positive sentiment.


----------



## scifisam (Oct 19, 2020)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> worst of both worlds and all that



Really? It sounds lovely.


----------



## petee (Oct 19, 2020)

these idiots


----------



## Badgers (Oct 19, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> A couple got married at the US-Canada border so guests from both countries could attend despite coronavirus restrictions
> 
> 
> A Canadian couple got married on the US-Canada border so family and friends from both countries could attend despite travel restrictions due to the coronavirus pandemic.
> ...


How self obsessed of them


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 19, 2020)

Badgers said:


> How self obsessed of them




meh - they will always have interesting stories of their wedding day


----------



## scifisam (Oct 19, 2020)

Badgers said:


> How self obsessed of them



How self-obsessed of them to have a wedding that everyone could attend safely?


----------



## Badgers (Oct 19, 2020)

scifisam said:


> How self-obsessed of them to have a wedding that everyone could attend safely?


Waiting a year would have been to hard for them? Their love could not have stood the wait?


----------



## scifisam (Oct 19, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Waiting a year would have been to hard for them? Their love could not have stood the wait?



Who knows if it'll be safe in a year's time? And this way they did something that made them happy and made their relatives happy at a time when that's hard to come by.


----------



## Badgers (Oct 19, 2020)

scifisam said:


> Who knows if it'll be safe in a year's time? And this way they did something that made them happy and made their relatives happy at a time when that's hard to come by.


I might get married in Barnard Castle soon


----------



## LDC (Oct 19, 2020)

Just watched the Dispatches documentary on Trump and the pandemic.

Knew most of it, but fucking hell. FUCKING HELL. Absolutely shocking.


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 19, 2020)

Badgers said:


> Waiting a year would have been to hard for them? Their love could not have stood the wait?



Looks like they followed all the regulations, and New Brunswick isn't exactly a COVID hotspot - there's been a total of 313 cases and 3 deaths. In South Dakota, the US state with the same size population, the figures are 100 times higher.


----------



## scifisam (Oct 19, 2020)

Badgers said:


> I might get married in Barnard Castle soon



They followed all the rules and kept people safe. Weird thing to dislike.


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 20, 2020)

Trump attacks CNN as "dumb b*stards" for continuing to cover pandemic
					

"People are not buying it CNN, you dumb b*stards," Trump said.




					www.axios.com
				






> *What he's saying: *“You turn on CNN, that’s all they cover: COVID, COVID, pandemic, COVID, COVID … that’s all they cover. You know why? They’re trying to talk everyone out of voting. People are not buying it CNN, you dumb b*stards," Trump said to a crowd of cheering supporters.
> 
> Turning to Joe Biden, Trump accused his Democratic challenger of wanting to "listen to Dr. Fauci" — a riff on an apparent attack on Saturday in which the president said Biden will "listen to the scientists" if elected.
> Trump also questioned whether CNN anchor Chris Cuomo, whom the president calls "Fredo," really had the coronavirus. Cuomo tested positive for the virus in late March.


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 25, 2020)

White House chief of staff says 'we're not going to control pandemic', after Pence staffers test positive – as it happened
					

President and challenger seek late boosts as election day looms while VP refuses to change schedule amid staff outbreak




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 25, 2020)

__





						NY Daily News - We are currently unavailable in your region
					






					www.nydailynews.com
				






> Gov. Cuomo slammed the Trump administration for “capitulating” on the coronavirus outbreak.
> 
> “They surrendered without firing a shot,” he said during a Sunday call with reporters. "It was the great American surrender.
> 
> ...





> He added that New York has “won” against coronavirus.
> 
> “What we learned in New York was, if you put up a fight you will have won. Because New York won,” Cuomo said. “Other states won, also.”
> 
> ...


----------



## Badgers (Oct 26, 2020)

October 2019


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 26, 2020)

In an indication of the quality of federal leadership on the issue, the US government just scrapped a plan to have Santas traveling around the country promoting a vaccine rushed through testing.



> If you and your colleagues are not essential workers, I don't know what is," Mr Caputo can be heard saying in a phone call recording released by the Wall Street Journal. Mr Erwin responds: "Ho! Ho! Ho!"











						Covid-19: US pulls plan to give early vaccine to Santa Claus
					

Santa, Mrs Claus and elves all would have received early access in exchange for promoting vaccinations.



					www.bbc.com


----------



## elbows (Oct 26, 2020)

Rudolph with your nose so bright, suspend vaccines trials as that side effects not right.


----------



## two sheds (Oct 26, 2020)

"Ric Erwin, chairman of the Fraternal Order of Real Bearded Santas, called the news "extremely disappointing."


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 28, 2020)

.


----------



## Tankus (Oct 28, 2020)

.


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 28, 2020)

morons on facebook (canadian version)


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 30, 2020)

A House panel is now looking into the canceled PR campaign that the Santa thing was a part of - $300 million from CDC funding was diverted to it. They've released a list the project compiled of 274 celebrities approached about the campaign, along with their political leanings.



			https://oversight.house.gov/sites/democrats.oversight.house.gov/files/5.pdf


----------



## Tankus (Oct 31, 2020)

Well , Fauci's 100, 000 daily infections  by  christmas is  already  here

Total  infections ........................................................................................................................Daily.............................................................................................................................................Total deaths.......................................................................................................Daily

9,316,194+101,358235,156+985









						United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info
				



Just what  will  that look  like  by christmas  ?


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 31, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Just what  will  that look  like  by Christmas  ?





I want Christmas with my grandchildren.

I know we are an ocean apart, but I 'm sure there are grandparents in your country who want Christmas with their families.


----------



## maomao (Oct 31, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> View attachment 236696
> 
> I want Christmas with my grandchildren.
> 
> I know we are an ocean apart, but I 'm sure there are grandparents in your country who want Christmas with their families.


My mum gave up on the idea of coming sometime this summer. Of course we're upset (or she and the kids are at least) but we're not stupid or selfish enough to think that our family Christmas is more important than people's lives. That's a nasty piece of shit graphic you've posted and you should be ashamed. Most people have done everything they've been told and the UK and US governments in particular have given us nothing but callousness and incompetence. Fuck you.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Oct 31, 2020)

maomao said:


> My mum gave up on the idea of coming sometime this summer. Of course we're upset (or she and the kids are at least) but we're not stupid or selfish enough to think that our family Christmas is more important than people's lives. That's a nasty piece of shit graphic you've posted and you should be ashamed. Most people have done everything they've been told and the UK and US governments in particular have given us nothing but callousness and incompetence. Fuck you.



Hold on a minute, spring-peeper is in Canada, where the situation is very different to the UK & US, and clearly she's posting from that perspective.


----------



## maomao (Oct 31, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Hold on a minute, spring-peeper is in Canada, where the situation is very different to the UK & US, and clearly she's posting from that perspective.




It's a thread about Covid in America. And she has a history of slinging up dumb memes that she barely understands. She's literally just done the same on the US election thread.


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 31, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Hold on a minute, spring-peeper is in Canada, where the situation is very different to the UK & US, and clearly she's posting from that perspective.



I don't think it's all that different - infection and death numbers in Canada are roughly half US/UK levels, but there's been the exact same pattern of a summer lull in cases followed by a relentless climb to record numbers of new cases in recent weeks.

Policies have largely been left to the provinces - in Ontario, there is a Conservative provincial government that has introduced a three-tier system of restrictions, resulting in a patchwork of policies from county to county across areas people commute to and from, which doesn't seem wildly different from the situation in Britain. The biggest contrast I can see is that while the UK is planning a fresh lockdown, Ontario's premier - Rob Ford's brother Doug - has told health officials to come up with a plan that will allow restaurants and bars in COVID hotspots to start reopening next week.


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 31, 2020)

maomao said:


> It's a thread about Covid in America. And she has a history of slinging up dumb memes that she barely understands. She's literally just done the same on the US election thread.




Check your map, dude!!!!

Canada is part of America.
So is Mexico and Argentina.

If you want only one country to be covered, get the thread title changed to Covid in the United States of America.


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 31, 2020)

maomao said:


> It's a thread about Covid in America. And she has a history of slinging up dumb memes that she barely understands. She's literally just done the same on the US election thread.



Oh my goodness, such anger over a post!!!

Did your cat piss on your cornflakes???


----------



## frogwoman (Oct 31, 2020)

I did mean for it to be the USA honestly. Maybe the thread title could be changed.


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 31, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> I did mean for it to be the USA honestly. Maybe the thread title could be changed.




Then modify your op.


----------



## maomao (Oct 31, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> Check your map, dude!!!!
> 
> Canada is part of America.
> So is Mexico and Argentina.
> ...


'America' as a geographical term is redundant. There are two continents, North and South America and in common usage America refers specifically to the US. The common term for the two continents as a whole in English is 'The Americas'.  Canadians do not refer to themselves as 'Americans'. Inhabitants of the US do. There are no posts on this thread about any other countries other than the USA and the OP specifically references the US.

None of which changes  the fact that you're an idiot with a history of chucking up shit memes that you barely fucking understand and that this post in particular was ignorant and nasty. So yes, fuck you, you ignorant twat.


----------



## spring-peeper (Oct 31, 2020)

I still don't understand why a image of asking people to take care is so evil.

meh!!!

_places thread on ignore_


----------



## maomao (Oct 31, 2020)

spring-peeper said:


> I still don't understand why a image of asking people to take care is so evil.
> 
> meh!!!
> 
> _places thread on ignore_


It's not 'asking people to take care' though is it. It's absolving politicians of blame and putting it all on the public. But like I said, you're thick and don't understand most of the shit you post. Glad to hear you won't be posting on this thread anymore.


----------



## petee (Oct 31, 2020)




----------



## Tankus (Nov 1, 2020)

86,000 new cases and 914 reported deaths...on a Saturday......!!!!....


----------



## Lorca (Nov 1, 2020)

Sad innit!


----------



## Badgers (Nov 7, 2020)

__





						US again breaks daily Covid-19 record with 121,000 cases recorded Thursday | Coronavirus | The Guardian
					

Country surpassed record set on 30 October and hospitalizations and deaths have also begun to increase




					amp.theguardian.com


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 7, 2020)

Biden has his work cut out for him.


----------



## Badgers (Nov 7, 2020)

Mental isn't it


----------



## LDC (Nov 7, 2020)

Yeah, I have been wondering what his approach is going to be. Or what it can be. What can he mandate federally? Give the widespread virus, denial of it, and refusal to take any mitigation measures, it's really going to be a hard job.


----------



## Cid (Nov 7, 2020)

Well he also doesn’t actually start presidenting until Jan 20th.

Couple of things to note... Testing in the us has been increasing. Though it seems to happen in chunks. And goes up and down. But last couple of days 1.5m, whereas previously fluctuated between 1m and 1.3m. However hospital admissions rising steadily. Possibly at an increasing rate, though hard to tell at a glance... if they continue as they are, they may be at their highest ever in a week.

Data from Atlantic’s tracking project... which is much better viewed on an actual computer.









						US Currently Hospitalized
					

The COVID Tracking Project collects and publishes the most complete testing data available for US states and territories.




					covidtracking.com


----------



## High Voltage (Nov 8, 2020)

I have no idea how all the conspiracy theories, denial, hoaxes, fake news and straight forward lies are going to be put back into that bottle

To turn around that level of broken is a massive ask, especially with the country as polarised as it is


----------



## Cid (Nov 11, 2020)

Yep, US hospitalizations now highest they have ever been.


----------



## existentialist (Nov 11, 2020)

Cid said:


> Yep, US hospitalizations now highest they have ever been.


And that presumably doesn't count the poor bastards whose lack of insurance means that hospital isn't an option


----------



## Yossarian (Nov 12, 2020)

More than a million new cases so far in November and yet another record set today - maybe it's time for all those other states to start asking Vermont for advice.


----------



## Lorca (Nov 12, 2020)

And another daft bugger, sad i suppose


----------



## editor (Nov 12, 2020)

Lorca said:


> And another daft bugger, sad i suppose
> View attachment 238524


That's sad and tragic and the people spreading these bullshit conspiracy theories have blood on their hands, as does the media (I'm looking at you Facebook) that helps propagate this crap.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 12, 2020)

Lorca said:


> And another daft bugger, sad i suppose
> View attachment 238524


----------



## elbows (Nov 12, 2020)

> Two of Donald Trump’s billionaire donors have contracted Covid-19 months after downplaying the risk of the disease to their employees.
> 
> Richard and Liz Uihlein, conservative megadonors who own the Uline packaging company based in Wisconsin and are two of the Republican party’s most significant financial backers, told employees on Wednesday that they had contracted the disease after being “around people with Covid”.





> A spokesman for the family could not immediately respond to questions about whether the couple attended a White House election night party last week for the president’s financial donors. At that event at least five individuals were infected, including Mark Meadows, the White House chief of staff. Brian Jack, the White House political director, and Healy Baumgardner, a former White House aide, have also reportedly tested positive following attendance at the party.











						Billionaire Trump donors contract Covid-19 after downplaying risks
					

Liz and Richard Uihlein, owners of the Uline packaging company, made the announcement in a message to employees




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## elbows (Nov 12, 2020)

Also:



> Shutting down businesses and paying people for lost wages for four to six weeks could help keep the coronavirus pandemic in check and get the economy on track until a vaccine is approved and distributed, said Dr. Michael Osterholm, a coronavirus advisor to President-elect Joe Biden.





			https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/11/biden-covid-advisor-says-us-lockdown-of-4-to-6-weeks-could-control-pandemic-and-revive-economy.html


----------



## Tankus (Nov 13, 2020)

Bidens  not  going  to  get  in control  , its  way past  the  point  of  effective contact  tracing   , trump will see  this  as  a  win .


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 13, 2020)

It's been a mess in the US over the last few months, but the UK has now taken a lead again over the US on deaths per 1m population.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 13, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> It's been a mess in the US over the last few months, but the UK has now taken a lead again over the US on deaths per 1m population.


Seriously?


----------



## Cid (Nov 13, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> It's been a mess in the US over the last few months, but the UK has now taken a lead again over the US on deaths per 1m population.



Bit of Friday speculation:

I think the US has always had some er... advantages... Much lower use of public transport, extensive use of air conditioning in offices, schools etc, more dispersed residential districts (of course it has been devastating in cities with more densely populated areas). I do wonder what the picture in US universities is like... Have no handle on that at all. Though thinking about I suspect the heavily campus-focused way that things work over there would probably limit spread to wider communities.


----------



## Cid (Nov 13, 2020)

It's thanksgiving in a couple of weeks isn't it? And black friday... Worrying.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 14, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> Seriously?



We were when I looked yesterday, but I think worldometers updates the US figure more than once a day as different states report at different times, it's now showing we are
equal to the US on 754 deaths per million.

I suspect we'll sadly overtake them again, as we are averaging over 400 deaths per day, adjusted for population it's equal to about 1,800, whereas the US is currently averaging 1,100.

But, hopefully 'lockdown v2' will see our numbers starting to drop, whereas there's will probably continue to go up.


----------



## Yossarian (Nov 14, 2020)

Cid said:


> Bit of Friday speculation:
> 
> I think the US has always had some er... advantages... Much lower use of public transport, extensive use of air conditioning in offices, schools etc, more dispersed residential districts (of course it has been devastating in cities with more densely populated areas). I do wonder what the picture in US universities is like... Have no handle on that at all. Though thinking about I suspect the heavily campus-focused way that things work over there would probably limit spread to wider communities.



I think those advantages might have limited transmission a little in the spring and summer but much less so as cold weather sets in - a lot of infections seem to be happening at small get-togethers inside with friends or extended families. 

The US might actually be at a disadvantage here, since car ownership per capita is almost twice the rate of the UK and it's routine for people to drive 50 miles or more to meet friends and family for an evening, especially in states like South Dakota where infection rates are now highest.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 14, 2020)

This is a good round-up of what's happening across the pond.









						Coronavirus: Oregon and New Mexico impose restrictions
					

Oregon and New Mexico order near-lockdowns as coronavirus cases across the country continue to rise.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Cid (Nov 14, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> I think those advantages might have limited transmission a little in the spring and summer but much less so as cold weather sets in - a lot of infections seem to be happening at small get-togethers inside with friends or extended families.
> 
> The US might actually be at a disadvantage here, since car ownership per capita is almost twice the rate of the UK and it's routine for people to drive 50 miles or more to meet friends and family for an evening, especially in states like South Dakota where infection rates are now highest.



Yeah you have a point...

Johns Hopkins have a graph that gives rate of positive tests as a percentage of total tests, which should help interpret the raw numbers (as I mentioned, US testing rates vary massively). It doesn't exactly make things look much better though. Increasing percentage of tests being positive indicates that more are being missed.









						Daily Testing Trends in the US - Johns Hopkins
					

See daily changes in tests performed and positivity rates in the US




					coronavirus.jhu.edu
				




e2a: Their map on positive rates is also useful. South Dakota has positives at 56.5%, which is really not good.


----------



## magneze (Nov 14, 2020)

It wasn't long ago that Fauci was worried about 100k infections per day. Worldometers for yesterday has 183k.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 14, 2020)

That's staggering numbers  it seems totally out of control there.


----------



## magneze (Nov 14, 2020)

Tankus said:


> 86,000 new cases and 914 reported deaths...on a Saturday......!!!!....


This was posted on November 1st as a comparison. 13 days later, 100k more. WTF.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 14, 2020)




----------



## frogwoman (Nov 14, 2020)

Traveling nurse says El Paso's Covid-19 crisis is worse than it was New York City - KVIA
					

EL PASO, Texas --A traveling registered nurse is calling out University Medical Center claiming the hospital is not doing enough to save lives. Her criticism aimed at UMC was mainly directed at doctors, claiming some won't tend to Covid-19 positive patients. "We as nurses, it's ok for us to be...




					kvia.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 15, 2020)

Official covid deaths have tipped over the 250k mark, on the day after Trump promised not to lockdown.


----------



## petee (Nov 15, 2020)

they're at it again

_During a presentation to the Provo Municipal Council on Tuesday, Intermountain Utah Valley Hospital administrator Kyle Hansen reported that staff members have dealt with a number of conspiracy theorists trying to gain access to the hospital.

The hospital has also been dealing with calls from the general public surrounding statistics that have been seen in the media as well as questions surrounding hospital or ICU capacity.

Those trying to gain access to the hospital believe that what they are being told is inaccurate and their goal is to videotape or visualize it firsthand, according to Hansen.

...

Instances have been identified on social media where people have claimed to have gained access without video evidence of actually being in the hospital. One instance Hansen saw included a person videotaping themselves while stating that, “This is all a lie,” or, “This hospital is not busy at all.”_



			https://www.heraldextra.com/news/local/utah-valley-hospital-dealing-with-ill-fated-attempts-of-conspiracy-theorists/article_d08ba93d-e25b-558e-a00e-c9891ac9970f.html


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Nov 16, 2020)

petee said:


> they're at it again
> 
> _During a presentation to the Provo Municipal Council on Tuesday, Intermountain Utah Valley Hospital administrator Kyle Hansen reported that staff members have dealt with a number of conspiracy theorists trying to gain access to the hospital.
> 
> ...


Let them in
let them catch it
and then keep them out.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 16, 2020)

How the fuck does this end up happening?


----------



## existentialist (Nov 16, 2020)

frogwoman said:


> How the fuck does this end up happening?



Human nature, and our tenuous relationships with reality. Sometimes, for all of us, the cognitive dissonance between a firmly held opinion and Actual(tm) Reality comes down on the wrong side. Hopefully, not usually in life-critical situations, but there are no guarantees.

The only cure is better critical thinking skills, and I suspect the US education system is worse even than the UK's at developing those.


----------



## Dogsauce (Nov 18, 2020)

twats gonna twat.


----------



## Cid (Nov 18, 2020)

Some states making positive moves according to NYT:



			https://www.nytimes.com/live/2020/11/16/world/covid-19-coronavirus-updates


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Nov 18, 2020)

A sobering report from Mississippi 









						After Big Thanksgiving Dinners, Plan Small Christmas Funerals, Health Experts Warn
					

Mississippians should plan “to have very small Thanksgiving gatherings” with only nuclear family members this year to stay safe amid the COVID-19 pandemic, Mississippi State Health Officer Dr. Thomas Dobbs and other public health officials warned on Friday.




					www.mississippifreepress.org


----------



## mx wcfc (Nov 18, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> A sobering report from Mississippi
> 
> 
> 
> ...


well at least that's honest.  Let's hope people take notice.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Nov 19, 2020)

One of the many fucked up things about this is that because the USA is now a suppurating quagmire for the virus, there is less chance we can collectively get ahead of the numbers next year. Because Trump has not allowed even the most basic levels of caution and attention, the entire world is at greater risk of further sweeping Covid waves next year.


----------



## elbows (Nov 19, 2020)

SheilaNaGig said:


> One of the many fucked up things about this is that because the USA is now a suppurating quagmire for the virus, there is less chance we can collectively get ahead of the numbers next year. Because Trump has not allowed even the most basic levels of caution and attention, the entire world is at greater risk of further sweeping Covid waves next year.



Europe hasn't done much that would create the impression that suppression of the virus will happen in that way in future. Compared to the USA, by relaxing things more slowly European countries avoided the early summer resurgence that some parts of the USA saw, but they havent avoided a massive autumn second wave so I dont feel like singling the USA out in that way at this stage.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Nov 19, 2020)

Fair enough. I’m just so angry about the situation over there.


----------



## elbows (Nov 19, 2020)

Yes I dont blame you for being angry about it. I am angry too, but am also angry about the way countries in Europe failed to learn all the lessons from the first time round, and found it easier to ignore some of them so far this time in ways they couldnt when everything happened more quickly in March. Both governments and sections of the public are not responding well without the effects of that early shock of the first wave arriving and requiring drastic action.

I suppose in some senses I'd rather judge individual states, and as I mentioned on the worldwide thread earlier, New York is closing its schools, a move countries in Europe have tended to resist this time around.



> A letter from New York City Schools Chancellor Richard Carranza released on Wednesday informed parents that all schools would close and classrooms would immediately shift to online learning "until further notice".
> 
> "You will hear from your principal shortly about next steps for you and your student. Please note that this is a temporary closure, and school buildings will reopen as soon as it is safe to do so."
> 
> The move comes only eight weeks after the school system reopened to students. It is the latest city to close school and shift to online learning after Boston and Detroit, with Las Vegas and Philadelphia delaying plans to return pupils to classrooms.











						Covid: US records quarter of a million deaths from coronavirus
					

America has a higher death toll and more coronavirus infections than any other country.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## Teaboy (Nov 19, 2020)

Interesting approach in NYC.  With another surge in cases they've decided to close the schools but keep large sectors of the economy open to one degree or another.  I will take a close interest in this because for a long time now I've been bemoaning the UK / European approach to keeping education open at the cost of large swathes of the economy when it seems fairly obvious to me that is where a massive part of the problem is.  

I may be proven to be completely wrong but its always felt to me that a few weeks off school (call it a firebreak or whatever) is far less damaging to a child then the long term economic factors of shutting most of your economy down.  As people continue to lose jobs and livelihoods more children will go hungry, more families will be caught in a cycle of debt that will last for generations.  More kids will grow up in homes where the parents mental health has deteriorated significantly.  I know from experience that the mental health deterioration of my mother during my childhood has had a far more profound effect on my life than any few weeks at school.

In addition to the above I'm utterly convinced that the vast majority of the problem was and is in the schools and uni's anyway.  It may be different in different areas but from what I've seen, heard and read I'm convinced it's the case for my local area.

We'll see what happens in NYC.  Happy to be proven wrong.


----------



## ska invita (Nov 19, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Interesting approach in NYC.  With another surge in cases they've decided to close the schools but keep large sectors of the economy open to one degree or another.  I will take a close interest in this because for a long time now I've been bemoaning the UK / European approach to keeping education open at the cost of large swathes of the economy when it seems fairly obvious to me that is where a massive part of the problem is.
> 
> I may be proven to be completely wrong but its always felt to me that a few weeks off school (call it a firebreak or whatever) is far less damaging to a child then the long term economic factors of shutting most of your economy down.  As people continue to lose jobs and livelihoods more children will go hungry, more families will be caught in a cycle of debt that will last for generations.  More kids will grow up in homes where the parents mental health has deteriorated significantly.  I know from experience that the mental health deterioration of my mother during my childhood has had a far more profound effect on my life than any few weeks at school.
> 
> ...


I think similarly...but then you get east asian countries who are managing it all, so maybe its not about the trade off between schools and shops at all, but something else


----------



## Teaboy (Nov 19, 2020)

ska invita said:


> I think similarly...but then you get east asian countries who are managing it all, so maybe its not about the trade off between schools and shops at all, but something else



Of course but at this stage of the pandemic its not a very useful comparison whereas UK and US is a much better one.  We've done the whole _ah but what about Korea and New Zealand_ thing to death.


----------



## Yossarian (Nov 19, 2020)

In NYC, I think authorities would have preferred to keep schools open, but then they wouldn't have had any teachers - under a reopening deal reached with the teachers' union, they agreed to close schools again if test positivity rates reached 3%.


----------



## Cid (Nov 19, 2020)

ska invita said:


> I think similarly...but then you get east asian countries who are managing it all, so maybe its not about the trade off between schools and shops at all, but something else



South Korea at least still has school closures to some extent. My friend has a much younger brother (early teens) who is currently off... iirc they had some complete closures towards the start of this semester, and are now cycling attendance to keep overall numbers at school safe. 

e2a: their case numbers are rising (though still in the low hundreds) so kind of expect they will bring in some additional measures soon.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 19, 2020)

There's controversy in NYC because schools are closed and bars are open.


----------



## krtek a houby (Nov 19, 2020)

Afaik, private schools in NY will remain open.

ETA

Are New York's private schools open? Closures rule explained as COVID cases rise


----------



## Yossarian (Nov 20, 2020)

After months of abuse, threats, and people following her to the park and taking pictures of her kids, a county health director in rural Missouri has handed in her notice.



> Every time you get on the phone, you’re hoping you don’t get cussed at. Probably half of the people we call are skeptical or combative. They refuse to talk. They deny their own positive test results. They hang up. They say they’re going to hire a lawyer. They give you fake people they’ve spent time with and fake numbers. They lie and tell you they’re quarantining alone at home, but then in the background you can hear the beeping of a scanner at Walmart.





> Our medical providers were at the meeting in their white coats, and three of them stood up to speak on behalf of masks. These are doctors and nurses who risk their lives to treat this virus. They are shouldering the burden of this, but the crowd wouldn’t even let them talk. They booed. They yelled. Some of them had come in with guns. They were so disrespectful. I was trying to take notes for our board, and my hands started shaking. Why aren’t you listening? Why do you refuse to hear from the people who actually know about this disease and how it spreads?





			https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/11/18/health-care-worker-threats-coronavirus/?arc404=true


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 23, 2020)

Report: Hundreds Of Bodies Of NYC’s Spring Covid Victims Still In Freezer Trucks
					

About 650 bodies are still in storage at a disaster morgue on the Brooklyn waterfront.




					www.forbes.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 24, 2020)

This makes grim reading, and where's Donald the Lame Duck, oh yeah, playing golf.  



> Covid-19 is running unabated across almost every American community, and one model projects it will take the country just under two months to reach a staggering 20 million cases.
> 
> The US could nearly double its current numbers -- about 12.4 million reported infections -- by January 20, according to the Washington University in St. Louis forecasting model.
> 
> The prediction comes as Covid-19 cases and hospitalizations nationwide are exploding, with more than 3.1 million infections reported in the US since the start of November -- the most reported in a single month ever.





> Hospitalizations are at harrowing highs, with more than 85,800 hospitalized Covid-19 patients in the US, another record set for the 14th day in a row, according to the COVID Tracking Project.
> 
> In California, hospitalizations climbed by 77% over the past 2 weeks, while ICU admissions were up 55%. Ohio hospitalizations increased at least 59% over two weeks, the governor said, adding the state currently has the most ICU patients since the pandemic's start. Pennsylvania's top health official warned Monday the state could run out of ICU beds within a week.
> 
> Some experts have predicted that health care workers -- already overwhelmed and exhausted -- could soon be faced with difficult decisions of rationing care as hospitals reach capacity.











						US sets record for Covid-19 hospitalizations amid fall surge
					

There are 88,080 people currently hospitalized with Covid-19, setting a record for hospitalizations amid a continuing fall surge, according to the Covid Tracking Project.




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## Tankus (Nov 24, 2020)

Christ


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 24, 2020)

Yeah, CNN had a report showing packed airports & train stations.


----------



## elbows (Nov 24, 2020)

Ted Cruz pours fuel on the flames.



> We reported earlier that despite warnings against travel during the current severe coronavirus outbreak, millions of Americans are flying across the US for Thanksgiving on Thursday.
> 
> Now Texas Senator Ted Cruz has caused controversy by suggesting Americans should flout health officials' advice to celebrate virtually with families instead of in-person. The Republican tweeted a picture of a turkey with the words "come and take it", adding "we’re not willing to give up Thanksgiving. Wait till they find out we won't give up Christmas either".
> 
> In Texas, morgues in the state become overwhelmed with bodies, and huge queues have formed at food banks following the economic fall-out of the pandemic.





From the 15:32 entry of https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-55055295


----------



## scifisam (Nov 24, 2020)

Teaboy said:


> Interesting approach in NYC.  With another surge in cases they've decided to close the schools but keep large sectors of the economy open to one degree or another.  I will take a close interest in this because for a long time now I've been bemoaning the UK / European approach to keeping education open at the cost of large swathes of the economy when it seems fairly obvious to me that is where a massive part of the problem is.
> 
> I may be proven to be completely wrong but its always felt to me that a few weeks off school (call it a firebreak or whatever) is far less damaging to a child then the long term economic factors of shutting most of your economy down.  As people continue to lose jobs and livelihoods more children will go hungry, more families will be caught in a cycle of debt that will last for generations.  More kids will grow up in homes where the parents mental health has deteriorated significantly.  I know from experience that the mental health deterioration of my mother during my childhood has had a far more profound effect on my life than any few weeks at school.
> 
> ...



Closing schools doesn't just mean closing schools, though. It means many parents having to take time off work, and in the US that often means they won't get paid. Not everyone can work from home, and working from home while also looking after your children is really, really fucking hard. There are reasons that most parents were desperate for schools to open, and it's not that they don't believe in covid or don't like their kids.

Being off school and not seeing your peers for weeks and weeks is pretty damaging to many children. It's not like they're off school and going out seeing friends, going to museums and libraries instead, doing fun things. They're mostly at home, on screens, isolated from their peers, 24/7, except for going for a walk, like they're dogs.

Working class people will be affected more, because although some well-paid jobs also can't be done from home, they're more likely to be able to afford paid childcare, which is still allowed. Women will be affected more because more single parents are female.  So when the concern is people losing their jobs, that will still happen, it will just affect poorer people and women more.

Closing schools cannot be viewed a simply "closing schools." It has far wider effects.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Nov 24, 2020)

Tankus said:


> Christ




I think part of the reason that so many people want to travel is that Americans get so little time off.  When you get it, you have to use it to keep in touch with extended family or you never see them.  I tried staying home and not visiting my 84-year-old mother, and she started having more and more memory issues the longer she was alone.  Its a no win choice.


----------



## Teaboy (Nov 24, 2020)

scifisam said:


> Closing schools doesn't just mean closing schools, though. It means many parents having to take time off work, and in the US that often means they won't get paid. Not everyone can work from home, and working from home while also looking after your children is really, really fucking hard. There are reasons that most parents were desperate for schools to open, and it's not that they don't believe in covid or don't like their kids.
> 
> Being off school and not seeing your peers for weeks and weeks is pretty damaging to many children. It's not like they're off school and going out seeing friends, going to museums and libraries instead, doing fun things. They're mostly at home, on screens, isolated from their peers, 24/7, except for going for a walk, like they're dogs.
> 
> ...



I know all this and agree.  There is no ideal situation at all and its not like closing schools is some flippant thing to do on a whim.  It remains my belief that because of the chronic situation in the schools it would be better in the long run to break that cycle.  No one wants to see children not at schools but it is my belief that the long term economic destruction (and therefore damage to lives in the short term and for generations to come) will be far that the pain of short fire break in the schools.

It would have also saved a lot more lives in the short term.

Its of interest on this thread because that's what appears to have happened in NYC for one reason or another.


----------



## frogwoman (Nov 25, 2020)

The worldometers chart numbers are shocking, looks like in New Jersey 1 in every 500 people or so has died from Covid


----------



## Yossarian (Nov 26, 2020)

With all 3 Trump appointees voting in favour, the Supreme Court just ruled 5-4 that New York can't reimpose COVID restrictions on religious gatherings.









						Major shift at Supreme Court on Covid-19 orders
					

The Supreme Court voted 5-4 to bar New York state from reimposing limits on religious gatherings.




					www.politico.com


----------



## editor (Nov 26, 2020)

Religion, eh? 



> The U.S. Supreme Court issued an injunction late Wednesday blocking New York’s governor from enforcing 10- and 25-person occupancy limits on religious institutions, granting a request from the Catholic Diocese of Brooklyn and Agudath Israel.
> 
> The state had told the court there was no need to act because the restrictions, which were adopted as a way to try to prevent the spread of the coronavirus, had recently been dialed back.












						Supreme Court blocks NY from enforcing Covid limits on churches
					

The court said the restrictions violate religious freedom and are not neutral because they “single out houses of worship."




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 26, 2020)

I posted this on the US election thread, but guess it should be here too.




> In stark contrast to the Thanksgiving message by the incoming president Joe Biden, who called for a scaling down of the celebration, the outgoing president Donald *Trump has called in a proclamation for Americans to “gather” for the holiday.* The final line of the annual Thanksgiving proclamation, issued by the White House press secretary's office on Wednesday evening, read:* "I encourage all Americans to gather, in homes and places of worship, to offer a prayer of thanks to God for our many blessings."*
> 
> The message from the White House, first reported by CNN, goes directly against the repeated advisories issued by government’s own public health experts, who have warned that Thanksgiving gatherings are likely to significantly contribute to the US's growing number of Covid-19 cases. The US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has recommended against travelling for Thanksgiving as a means of preventing further spread of the virus.



His madness is beyond belief. 









						Trump urges Americans to ‘gather’ for Thanksgiving in direct contradiction of official Covid guidance
					

President in annual Thanksgiving proclamation 'encourages all Americans to gather, in homes and places of worship’




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## 2hats (Nov 28, 2020)

I guess this means I better look to Amazon Prime for my small firearms stocking fillers this year.


----------



## petee (Nov 30, 2020)

NYC Will Begin Phased Reopening Of Public Schools On December 7th
					

NYC public schools will begin to reopen in phases starting on Monday December 7th, Mayor Bill de Blasio announced on Sunday.



					gothamist.com
				




private schools are overseen by a board of the state government and aren't under NYC BOE. they've been open since September.


----------



## petee (Nov 30, 2020)

also, the loons aren't even waiting for it to be released


----------



## Cid (Dec 3, 2020)

Now more than 100,000 in hospital... On death rates/tests I'm guessing there is still some correction from thanksgiving weekend, so probably best not to speculate too much on latest figures.

e2a: graun says 20,000 of those in ICU, at least 6855 on ventilators.


----------



## elbows (Dec 3, 2020)

Yes the BBC has a story including various graphs of that same data.









						Coronavirus: US hits record Covid cases and hospitalisations
					

Two records are reached on Wednesday, amid fears the pace will not slow leading up to Christmas.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## cupid_stunt (Dec 4, 2020)

Two days with the highest reported new cases, over 206k on Wed. and over 218.5k yesterday, I guess this could be the start of Thanksgiving feeding into new cases.

Too early for that to explain the number of deaths, which has also seen two new daily records, 2,873 on Wed. and 2,918 yesterday. The 7-day rolling average is still 376 a day less than the peak, but I suspect that will change over the next few weeks.


----------



## Dogsauce (Dec 7, 2020)

Standing up for those ‘left behind’ again:


----------



## cupid_stunt (Dec 8, 2020)

Their 7-day rolling average of deaths has hit 2,300 a day, higher than the pervious record of 2,259 back in April,

And, new daily cases are averaging over 206k a day, nearly 1.5 million in the last 7 days.


----------



## petee (Dec 8, 2020)




----------



## frogwoman (Dec 9, 2020)

Covid-19 Live Updates: Canada Approves Vaccine Made by Pfizer and BioNTech fucking vultures (the protest linked in that article)

,, 





> The Central District Health board in Boise, Idaho, tried to meet Tuesday evening to consider imposing a mask mandate and other measures. But the meeting was beset from the very beginning.
> 
> Before the board had even completed roll call, one commissioner, Diana Lachiondo, interrupted to say she was stepping out to phone the police, because protesters had gathered outside her home. Four minutes later, she tearfully interrupted again, saying she had to leave the meeting because the protesters had begun banging on the door, where her 12-year-old son was home alone.


----------



## two sheds (Dec 11, 2020)

From Reddit on being told to go live in Europe for criticizing USA 



			https://i.redd.it/i7da7iue3o361.jpg


----------



## StoneRoad (Dec 11, 2020)

The FDA have been advised to accept the Pfizer / BioNTech vaccine.
Voting was 17 in favour, 4 against and 1 abstention.

what's with those 5 people, then ?


----------



## Yossarian (Dec 11, 2020)

StoneRoad said:


> The FDA have been advised to accept the Pfizer / BioNTech vaccine.
> Voting was 17 in favour, 4 against and 1 abstention.
> 
> what's with those 5 people, then ?



One of them says she was in favour of approving for people 18 and older, but said she'd like to see more data on younger patients before approving it and thought the FDA should wait for the data because children aren't high priority for vaccination anyway.









						FDA panel member says she voted against vaccine authorization because of limited data on 'younger participants'
					

A member of a federal panel that voted Thursday to move forward with an emergency use authorization for Pfizer's coronavirus vaccine said that she voted against the candidate citing a lack of data on younger partici




					thehill.com


----------



## StoneRoad (Dec 11, 2020)

duh, wot ?
Then authorize for adults only, that's been done with other treatments.


----------



## two sheds (Dec 11, 2020)

About as sensible as being against it because it's not been tried on cats that won't be getting it either.


----------



## Yossarian (Dec 11, 2020)

StoneRoad said:


> duh, wot ?
> Then authorize for adults only, that's been done with other treatments.



I think that's what would have happened if the panel had been split on recommending the vaccine - turns out the recommendation was for people 16 and up so it was only 16 and 17-year-olds they were talking about.

Seems like the ones who voted to approve made the right call but I can see why the dissenters wanted to wait for more data - if there did turn out to be some kind of issue that might affect a few adolescents, it would risk undermining public confidence in the whole program.


----------



## two sheds (Dec 11, 2020)

Ah ok that makes sense, ta. Do we know why the others voted against/abstained?


----------



## two sheds (Dec 11, 2020)

> Multiple concerns were expressed about the relatively small representation of specific groups in the trials. For example, American Indians were poorly represented in Pfizer’s trial, and while Black seniors were at a level that approximated their percentage in the nation, that still left them a relatively small pool within both safety and efficacy trials. Finally, the trial specifically left out some groups in early phases, including  people under 18 or over 85, and people with HIV or other immune related illness. Though the trial was later expanded, there were concerns about whether these groups were in the study for an adequate period of time to make any statement about efficacy or safety for these groups.
> 
> 
> Pregnant women were excluded from the trial. It was brought up repeatedly that if healthcare workers are among those first to receive the vaccine, that includes a lot of women of childbearing age, including some who may—knowingly or unknowingly—be pregnant. A trial is planned that includes pregnant women, but this trial is several stages behind.











						FDA Vaccine committee votes to approve use of Pfizer vaccine in United States for patients 16 and up
					

On Thursday, the FDA advisory committee on Vaccines and Related Biological Products conducted a day long meeting that touched on several topics, but was focused primarily on a review of the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine. Appropriately enough, the meeting was...




					www.dailykos.com


----------



## Yossarian (Dec 11, 2020)

two sheds said:


> Ah ok that makes sense, ta. Do we know why the others voted against/abstained?



I think it was the same issue for most or all of the dissenters - not sure how the FDA selects the experts on its vaccine advisory committee, but they're not presidential appointees so there wouldn't have been any raging QAnon anti-vaxxers in there.



> I would have voted ‘yes’ most enthusiastically had the language been ‘…18 years of age and older,’ ” said David Kim, director of the division of Vaccines in the Office of Infectious Disease and HIV/AIDS Policy in the Department of Health and Human Services.


----------



## Yossarian (Dec 13, 2020)

It was around five weeks ago that the US reported more than 100,000 new COVID cases in a day for the first time. On Friday, it was 280,000, according to the New York Times - with hospitals and morgues already running out of room, seems like it will be an incredibly grim couple of months ahead. In a few more weeks, Trump might be secretly glad that he lost the election.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Dec 13, 2020)

It's certainly grim, with over 300k covid deaths officially recorded now, although the real figure is likely to be around 400k.

The 7-day average death figure is running at almost 2,500 per day, around 10% higher than the peak in April, and that doesn't yet fully reflect the recent increase in new cases probably caused by the 'thanksgiving effect', and with Christmas & New Year upcoming, it's going to be even more horrific come January and February. 

I've seen reports estimating another 200k deaths by the end of March.  



> By early Friday, at least 292,382 people had died of the virus in the U.S., and the numbers have been rising at a record 2,272-a-day average in the past week, according to Johns Hopkins University data.
> 
> The actual death toll may take much longer to tally, due in part to extensive lags in reporting and the possibility that virus fatalities have been missed along the way.
> 
> The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimates there have been as many as 381,896 so-called excess deaths identified since Feb. 1, a number that represents mortality above normal statistical expectations. That’s significantly more than the number of confirmed Covid deaths, and may point to fatalities missed due to limited initial Covid testing and other factors.







__





						Bloomberg - Are you a robot?
					





					www.bloomberg.com


----------



## Cloo (Dec 13, 2020)

Interesting article here, coming from a real estate industry angle (may need registering) - it suggests the US is more likely to go for an occupation-based rollout (eg of people who have to be in contact with others for work) of vaccine rather than by age. As it says, there's not really a right or wrong and either an age or occupation approach will probably save the same numbers of people. Wait In Line: How The Vaccine Rollout Strategy Impacts Real Estate's Recovery


----------



## Cloo (Dec 16, 2020)

Listening into a seminar with American corporates it looks like most are now considering July 2021 as their earliest return to office dates.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Dec 16, 2020)

Cloo said:


> Listening into a seminar with American corporates it looks like most are now considering July 2021 as their earliest return to office dates.


That's the estimate of a lot of UK corporations (including the one I work for) and I think that's probably the earliest sensible date to plan for even here, so it seems a bit optimistic for the US.


----------



## Cloo (Dec 16, 2020)

FridgeMagnet said:


> That's the estimate of a lot of UK corporations (including the one I work for) and I think that's probably the earliest sensible date to plan for even here, so it seems a bit optimistic for the US.


Well I wonder if some places might do 'come in if you've been vaccinated', but I think that's still quite a long way off for the working-age population.


----------



## petee (Dec 23, 2020)




----------



## petee (Dec 23, 2020)

...


----------



## petee (Dec 23, 2020)

'scuse, I've been having _alot_ of problems manipulating urban on my phone tonite ...


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 27, 2020)

In new jersey, 0.21% of the population (over 1 in 500) have died of Covid. 
18,747 dead out of a population of  8,882,190


----------



## Yossarian (Dec 31, 2020)

A record 3,744 US deaths reported Wednesday - that's the second day in a row the US has reported a single-day toll higher than Japan has had in the entire pandemic.


----------



## frogwoman (Dec 31, 2020)

__





						NPR Cookie Consent and Choices
					





					www.npr.org
				



500 vaccines intentionally removed from refrigerator, causing them to be destroyed


----------



## Dogsauce (Dec 31, 2020)

Deaths include a republican congressman-elect in Louisiana, aged just 41.









						Congressman-elect Luke Letlow dies after battling Covid-19
					

Congressman-elect Luke Letlow has died after being diagnosed with Covid-19, his spokesman confirmed Tuesday evening.




					edition.cnn.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Dec 31, 2020)

Yossarian said:


> A record 3,744 US deaths reported Wednesday - that's the second day in a row the US has reported a single-day toll higher than Japan has had in the entire pandemic.



Those 2 days seem to reflect under reporting from 25-28th, when reported deaths were very low, the 7-day average is 2,363.


----------



## Dogsauce (Dec 31, 2020)

cupid_stunt said:


> Those 2 days seem to reflect under reporting from 25-28th, when reported deaths were very low, the 7-day average is 2,363.



Per capita I think that’s still quite a bit less than here.


----------



## Lurdan (Jan 1, 2021)

Chicago Tribune yesterday:

Employees at suburban Milwaukee clinic unknowingly gave out 57 shots with deliberately ruined vaccine; pharmacist arrested



> Authorities arrested a suburban Milwaukee pharmacist Thursday suspected of deliberately ruining hundreds of doses of coronavirus vaccine by removing them from refrigeration for two nights. (...) His motive remains unclear. Police said that detectives believe he knew the spoiled doses would be useless and people who received them would mistakenly think they’d been vaccinated when they hadn’t.


----------



## StoneRoad (Jan 1, 2021)

Lurdan said:


> Chicago Tribune yesterday:
> 
> Employees at suburban Milwaukee clinic unknowingly gave out 57 shots with deliberately ruined vaccine; pharmacist arrested



surely that should be attempted murder ? [e2a - that idiots pharmacist should be struck off, at the very least !]


----------



## Cid (Jan 1, 2021)

StoneRoad said:


> surely that should be attempted murder ?



Probably not... the intent required for murder is complicated beast in and of itself. E.g I think stopping someone's medication in the genuine belief it would benefit them wouldn't be murder. There is no intent to kill. Then, because it's attempted, you muddy the waters still further. Attempted murder in the US I'm fairly sure you would have to plan to kill someone in a specific manner, and fail in the execution of that plan.


----------



## Dogsauce (Jan 1, 2021)

Gates’s microchip can survive without refrigeration, so kind of pointless doing what he did.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jan 4, 2021)

Just had a WhatsApp chat with a relative in South Carolina

She says they have a 33% infection rate in the state with hospital capacity in her city (population 330,000) at 92.8%. And no mandated Covid protocols.


----------



## SheilaNaGig (Jan 4, 2021)

S.C. records 257 new COVID-19 cases, 10 more deaths
					

State health officials are urging residents to be vigilant in practicing social distancing and wearing masks to prevent the further spread of COVID-19.



					www.wbtv.com


----------



## Yossarian (Jan 4, 2021)

StoneRoad said:


> surely that should be attempted murder ? [e2a - that idiots pharmacist should be struck off, at the very least !]



He told cops he was a conspiracy theorist and he thought the vaccine was unsafe because it would cause people's DNA to mutate - they're testing the vials he left out of refrigeration, if they're definitely spoiled he'll face felony charges including recklessly endangering the public, if they still work he'll get off with a lesser charge of attempting to damage property.


----------



## Sunray (Jan 5, 2021)

I saw this, don’t get sick in LA.








						Ambulance crews told not to transport patients who have little chance of survival
					

L.A. County health agency tells EMTs not to transport by ambulance those who have virtually no chance at recovery.




					www.latimes.com
				




Crazy


----------



## prunus (Jan 5, 2021)

Sunray said:


> I saw this, don’t get sick in LA.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yes, it's quite not as draconian as the headline makes out - "little chance of survival" means patients whose heart has stopped and/or have stopped breathing and are still in this state after 20 minutes of ambulance crew-attempted resusictation.    I think most people would class this as "dead".


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 5, 2021)

prunus said:


> Yes, it's quite not as draconian as the headline makes out - "little chance of survival" means patients whose heart has stopped and/or have stopped breathing and are still in this state after 20 minutes of ambulance crew-attempted resusictation.    I think most people would class this as "dead".


Little chance isn't quite the same as dead thjough,my ex was like this for 30 minutes.
But yes that is an anecdote of bucking the trend.


----------



## 2hats (Jan 7, 2021)

At the current rate it looks like US COVID-19 deaths will even start to reach (lower) estimates for the US total for 1918-1920 'Spanish' flu in coming months.


----------



## frogwoman (Jan 8, 2021)

In her book on the Spanish Flu Laura Spinney says 0.2-0.5% of Americans and Brits died of the flu with the number in many countries much, much higher (exceeding 5% in some cases). 0.2% fatality rate has already been reached in parts of the US


----------



## High Voltage (Jan 8, 2021)

2hats said:


> At the current rate it looks like US COVID-19 deaths will even start to reach (lower) estimates for the US total for 1918-1920 'Spanish' flu in coming months.



I've long feared (and kept a weather eye on) the US exceeding their Spanish Flu total, and had accepted this grave mile stone being exceeded as a WHEN and never an IF


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## editor (Jan 8, 2021)

Fuckwits, all.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 9, 2021)

Dunno where the best thread for this is, but I suppose it might as well go here: Chicago Teachers Take Wildcat Action in the Face of Unsafe COVID Conditions - It's Going Down
Short (2 mins) interview with two teachers here:


----------



## petee (Jan 9, 2021)

hitmouse said:


> Dunno where the best thread for this is, but I suppose it might as well go here: Chicago Teachers Take Wildcat Action in the Face of Unsafe COVID Conditions - It's Going Down



(i have just discovered that itsgoingdown is blocked on my work computer)


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 9, 2021)

I think it's all in this post from Chicago IWW if you don't mind straining your eyes to read small text on a yellow background: 

Full text is:

This week, pre-kindergarten and diverse learning staff at Chicago Public Schools were obligated to return to their school buildings. The planning for this return was not bargained over in any capacity between the mayor-appointed CPS administrators and Chicago Board of Education, the Chicago Teachers Union, and the Chicago Principals & Administrators Association—let alone students, families, and communities most affected by the reopening. 

Roughly half of CPS staff asked to return refused to do so on Monday, January 4th—without the prompting or approval of their union. In response to this ultimately unsafe forced return, thousands of CPS workers asserted their contractual and legal right to a healthful workplace by “sicking out” or continuing to clock in and teach remotely this week. Some staffs staged “teach-ins” outside of their school buildings, in subfreezing temperatures and snow, engaging with students and community members both in person and digitally to explain the dangers of CPS’s hybrid learning plan. 

*WHAT IS WILDCAT ORGANIZING? *

A direct action organized strictly by rank-and-file workers without the authorization of a union—whether the workers have legally-recognized union representation or not—is known as “wildcat” organizing. Usually, this takes the form of a work stoppage or slowdown. 

Wildcat actions often violate official bargaining terms previously negotiated between bosses and unions, specifically due to the fact that union leadership has either failed to take action or are prevented from doing so. They are usually not attached to contract negotiations, and typically take place without any notice given to the boss. 

*WHAT’S THE CONNECTION? *

Chicago teachers, though they are represented by the Chicago Teachers Union, undertook a variety of direct action tactics this week without union authorization. Due to the pending nature of arbitration over return to school buildings, CTU’s hands were and are tied legally as far as calling for actions—additionally, there would need to be a democratic vote taken over any union-wide work stoppage or slowdown. CPS and its unelected, mayor-appointed school board have worked to disenfranchise and endanger rank and file workers. These workers emboldened by the strong solidarity and militant nature of their union, organized on their own time and their own dime in order to protect themselves, their students, and their communities. 

The struggle will only continue for Chicago teachers and school staff. Pre-kindergarten and diverse learning students are slated to return to their buildings on Monday, January 11th with kindergarten through 8th grade students returning at the beginning of February. Stand with Chicago Public Schools teachers and staff as they fight for safe schools and healthy communities.


----------



## hitmouse (Jan 11, 2021)

*COVID outbreak — and media crackdown — at private halfway house in Tenderloin*



> A halfway house in the Tenderloin run by a private-prison contractor with a controversial record has been locked down because some residents and staff tested positive for COVID, 48hills has learned.
> 
> A letter to residents, which was posted on Twitter, states that “we have had a few residents and staff who have recently tested positive for covid-19.” The document carries the name of Maria Richard, director of the Taylor Center, a facility at 111 Taylor run by the Geo Group, a national private-prison operator.
> 
> ...


----------



## elbows (Jan 18, 2021)

New CDC chief:


----------



## Indeliblelink (Jan 18, 2021)




----------



## weltweit (Jan 19, 2021)

It will be interesting to see how quickly Biden can start to get to grips with it after he takes power.


----------



## existentialist (Jan 19, 2021)

weltweit said:


> It will be interesting to see how quickly Biden can start to get to grips with it after he takes power.


Given that he's already outlining his strategy, one might argue that he's already started to get to grips with it.


----------



## Yossarian (Feb 5, 2021)

A record 5,077 US COVID deaths reported Thursday - more than China has reported from the entire pandemic.


----------



## 2hats (Feb 12, 2021)

Can Louisiana’s COVID surge trace back to one Mardi Gras reveler?
					

Mardi Gras 2021 is largely on hold, but researchers are still investigating how last year's reveling may have contributed to a surge in Louisiana COVID cases.




					www.popsci.com
				





> Yes, a single individual may have kicked off a chain of transmission during the holiday, eventually leading to 50,000 infections in Louisiana.


DOI: 10.1073/pnas.2021830118.


----------



## High Voltage (Feb 18, 2021)

OK . . . so, once again, it's the ever reliable World-o-Meter giving the US a total deaths of 502, 544 as of 17th February 2021

A quick check against other US death totals by way of comparison

WWII 291, 557 (Wikipedia)
WW I 53,402 (ditto)
So more than both world wars combined

TOTAL DEATHS IN ALL AMERICAN WARS SINCE ... FOREVER (COMBAT) 666,441 (ditto)

Spanish Flu 675,000 (ditto)


----------



## petee (Feb 27, 2021)




----------



## Yossarian (Feb 27, 2021)

A third of troops, especially younger ones, are refusing to be vaccinated, which doesn't bode well for take-up rates in the wider population.



> The Army tells me what, how and when to do almost everything,” said Sgt. Tracey Carroll, who is based at Fort Sill, an Army post in Oklahoma. “They finally asked me to do something and I actually have a choice, so I said no.”











						Younger Military Personnel Reject Vaccine, in Warning for Commanders and the Nation
					

About one-third of the troops have declined to take the vaccine. Many say they worry the vaccines are unsafe or were developed too quickly. Others want a sense of independence, even in uniform.




					www.nytimes.com
				




Apparently the military can't order them to be vaccinated until COVID vaccines become standard vaccines instead of ones approved for emergency use by the FDA, which may end up boosting the ranks of militias etc. with more military-trained conspiracy theorists - the "QAnon Shaman" guy left the military years ago because he refused to be vaccinated.


----------



## NoXion (Mar 3, 2021)

Keith Olbermann is a piece of shit.



Some libs really need their brunches to be fucking cancelled.


----------



## Yossarian (Mar 3, 2021)

Pretty shitty stuff from Olbermann - yes, Texas is lifting all restrictions in what appears to be an attempt to give the virus a final chance to kill as many people as possible, which should be all the more reason to step up vaccinations.


----------



## existentialist (Mar 3, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> Pretty shitty stuff from Olbermann - yes, Texas is lifting all restrictions in what appears to be an attempt to give the virus a final chance to kill as many people as possible, which should be all the more reason to step up vaccinations.


Not to mention that vaccination is about the best chance that those (whom I imagine are not a tiny minority) who do not want to become ill from Covid stand of any kind of protection.


----------



## Tankus (Mar 3, 2021)

I would be a bit dubious about what the US military was sticking in my arm, to be fair









						Did the Anthrax Vaccine Make Troops Ill?
					

One former military member was able to get genetic testing to show her brain disorder was not genetic and therefore likely due to the anthrax vaccine.




					www.hillandponton.com


----------



## yield (Mar 4, 2021)

Wealthy Keys enclave received COVID vaccines in January before much of the state
March 03, 2021.


> As Florida’s eldest residents struggled to sign up to receive their first dose of the COVID-19 vaccine, nearly all those aged 65 years and older in a wealthy gated enclave in the Florida Keys had been vaccinated by mid-January, according to an emailed newsletter obtained by the Miami Herald.
> 
> The management of Ocean Reef Club, located in north Key Largo, also acknowledged in the Jan. 22 message to residents that the rest of the state was grappling to get its hands on the vaccine.





> “Over the course of the last two weeks, the Medical Center has vaccinated over 1,200 homeowners who qualify under the State of Florida’s Governor’s current Order for those individuals who are 65 years of age or older,’’ the message reads.
> 
> “We are fortunate to have received enough vaccines to ensure both the first and second for those vaccinated. At this time, however, the majority of the State has not received an allocation of first doses of vaccines for this week and beyond, and the timing of any subsequent deliveries remains unclear.”


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## Tankus (Mar 20, 2021)

Also in florida


Checkout the lack of masks and density in the background


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## a_chap (Mar 21, 2021)

Tankus said:


> Also in florida
> 
> 
> Checkout the lack of masks and density in the background





What an incredibly draconian lock down!

A 9pm curfew for 72 hours...


----------



## Cloo (Apr 7, 2021)

I'm still totally mystified by what's going on in the US - I assume things are very different between different States? Some FB friends in US seem to be going about pretty much as normal, restaurants, conferences etc. Surely can't be wise at this stage....


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## cupid_stunt (Apr 8, 2021)

Cloo said:


> I'm still totally mystified by what's going on in the US - I assume things are very different between different States? Some FB friends in US seem to be going about pretty much as normal, restaurants, conferences etc. Surely can't be wise at this stage....



I haven't been following the US situation recently, but last year there was massive variations between the various states, in terms of cases, deaths & restrictions at various points in time.

A quick look on worldometers for the total US figures, their 7-day averages adjusted for population are running at around 4.5 times the number of new cases compared to the UK, and 5 times as many deaths. 

New cases seem to be going up again, by approx. 20% since mid-March, deaths are currently still going down, but nowhere near as quickly as in the UK. 









						United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info


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## Cloo (Apr 8, 2021)

I guess if your state seems to be doing ok you don't look at the big picture


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## Yossarian (Apr 8, 2021)

The British variant is now the dominant one in the US - good thing it didn't happen until after many of the most vulnerable Americans had already been vaccinated.





__





						NPR Cookie Consent and Choices
					





					www.npr.org


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## High Voltage (Apr 23, 2021)

With my figures taken from the ever reliable World-O-Meters web site 

IF America carries on at approximately its current daily death rate then they'll top the 600,000 total in less than 20 days - this is a big mile stone

The next mile stone that I really, really hope doesn't (but fear it will) get broken is the 666,441 - this is the total combat deaths of every American soldier in every conflict . . . like, ever. From the American Revolution war right through to the 2017 death of some poor sod during a Raid on Yeman

And the final mile stone that would be a disaster if they broke would be 675,000 (ish) or the death total from the 1918 Spanish Flu


----------



## petee (May 7, 2021)

Anti-vaxxers gather to burn giant syringe in effigy at Utah demonstration
					

The effigy is emblazoned with the words ‘MEDICAL TYRANNY’




					www.independent.co.uk
				



_
Hundreds of anti-vaxxers gathered in Utah to burn an effigy of a giant syringe to demonstrate their disdain over "medical tyranny"._


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## cupid_stunt (May 7, 2021)

Adjusted for population, and despite the success of the vaccine roll-out in both countries, the US is currently reporting an average of 11 times more deaths per day compared to the UK.


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## Yossarian (May 19, 2021)

Biden taking his mask off last week as the CDC declared that fully vaccinated Americans no longer had to wear masks indoors is being hailed as a big moment:









						Biden unmasks — and marks a political milestone
					

The new CDC guidelines on face masks reshape the political dimensions of the Covid debate facing the White House.




					www.politico.com
				




It seems a little premature to me - less than 40% of the population is fully vaccinated and this creates an "honour system" for mask-wearing, when the people who were most resistant to wearing masks in the first place are generally the same people who are least likely to get vaccinated.


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## cupid_stunt (May 19, 2021)

Seems bonkers to me, adjusted for population, the US is still reporting around three times more daily new cases than the UK, and deaths 12+ times more.


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## elbows (May 19, 2021)

All the bullshit 'cultural/establishment' reasons why they and other countries like the UK were slow to do the sensible thing in regards masks in the first months of the pandemic havent really gone away, and will be visible again during the relaxation of measures phase. We've seen it in England with masks in schools, and I expect more examples in future.


----------



## Badgers (May 20, 2021)

New one today

Woman came in for a test. Registered herself then tested her child on her behalf. 

I have limited avenues to punish this behaviour but have used them all. Am sure she _NEEDS_ her precious holiday but ffs


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## Yossarian (May 20, 2021)

The Bible Belt looks to be on course to become the COVID Belt.


----------



## Teaboy (May 20, 2021)

If there has been one constant in this pandemic is that God (or your deity of choice) has really worked in mysterious ways.


----------



## petee (May 28, 2021)




----------



## editor (May 28, 2021)

Time to bulk buy facepalms



> State Rep. Beth Liston (D-Dublin) blasted the bill, telling The Columbus Dispatch, “Not only would it prevent schools, businesses and communities from putting safety measures in place related to COVID, it will impact the health of our children... This bill applies to all vaccines—polio, measles, meningitis, etc. If it becomes law we will see worsening measles outbreaks, meningitis in the dorms, and children once again suffering from polio.”











						Ohio lawmakers want to abolish vaccine requirements—all vaccine requirements
					

Someone would only have to verbally decline vaccination and cite "reasons of conscience."




					arstechnica.com


----------



## petee (May 29, 2021)

new entrant in the "it doesn't get any lower than this" contest









						Nashville Business Criticized for ‘Not Vaccinated’ Patch Evoking the Holocaust
					

A business in Nashville received serious criticism online for "not vaccinated" patches evoking the Holocaust.




					www.mediaite.com


----------



## High Voltage (May 31, 2021)

Well, the 600,000 milestone has been passed with barely a whisper. One small positive to take and that's infection and death rates appear to be slowing, again data taken from the ever reliable World-O-meters

Edit: typo


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 31, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> Well, the 600,000 milestone has been passed with barely a whisper. One small positive to take and that's infection and death rates appear to be slowing, again data taken from the ever reliable World-O-meters
> 
> Edit: typo



Adjusted for population, their death rate is still running at over 12 times that on the UK.


----------



## maomao (May 31, 2021)

cupid_stunt said:


> Adjusted for population, their death rate is still running at over 12 times that on the UK.


And yet still not quite as high as the uk in deaths per million population.


----------



## High Voltage (May 31, 2021)

cupid_stunt said:


> Adjusted for population, their death rate is still running at over 12 times that on the UK.


Again, from the ever reliable World-O-meters 

UK is running at 1873 deaths per million

Just ahead of the

US of A at 1832 deaths per million


In 17th and 18th respectively


----------



## cupid_stunt (May 31, 2021)

Yes, they are catching up with us again, the death rate I was referring to is their current average daily rate, just over 500 a day, sorry for any confusion.

And, that in a country with a population density that's a third of the UK.


----------



## High Voltage (May 31, 2021)

cupid_stunt said:


> Yes, they are catching up with us again, the death rate I was referring to is their current average daily rate, just over 500 a day, sorry for any confusion.
> 
> And, that in a country with a population density that's a third of the UK.


Gotcha


----------



## elbows (Jun 1, 2021)




----------



## cupid_stunt (Jun 8, 2021)

<checks date>

Nope, it's not the 1st April.



> Americans have been offered a variety of incentives to get a COVID vaccine including free guns, holidays, cash and Krispy Kremes.
> 
> The most recent addition to the odd list of incentives has been in Washington state where licensed marijuana shops are now able to offer free joints.
> 
> Announced by state officials, the "Joints for Jabs" scheme allows pot retailers to hand out a single pre-rolled joint to over-21s who get a jab at an on-site vaccine clinic by 12 July.



I like the idea of the "Joints for Jabs" scheme. 









						COVID-19: Guns, beer and marijuana on offer for Americans in move to increase coronavirus vaccinations
					

Joe Biden has singled out 4 July as the "independence day" from COVID as he aims to ensure 70% of adults get a first dose by then.




					news.sky.com


----------



## petee (Jun 9, 2021)

_“I’m sure you’ve seen the pictures all over the internet of people who have had these shots and now they’re magnetized. They can put a key on their forehead. It sticks. They can put spoons and forks all over them and they can stick, because now we think that there’s a metal piece to that."_



			https://fox8.com/news/coronavirus/cleveland-doctor-tells-ohio-lawmakers-covid-19-vaccine-can-leave-people-magnetized-interfaced-with-5g-towers/


----------



## Tankus (Jun 10, 2021)

My metal  pen sticks  , 


 but  only between my arse  cheeks   ,

 I wonder  if  the  vaccine  pooled  there  ?


----------



## elbows (Jun 12, 2021)




----------



## petee (Jun 15, 2021)

could go in a number of threads ...









						Triple shooting over masks at Georgia grocery store leaves cashier dead, deputy and man injured
					

A triple shooting at a DeKalb County grocery store in Georgia has left a cashier dead and a deputy and the gunman injured,




					www.wsoctv.com
				




_A triple shooting at a DeKalb County grocery store in Georgia has left a cashier dead and a deputy and the gunman injured, ABC affiliate WSB-TV reported.

The shooting happened Monday afternoon at the Big Bear grocery store along Candler Road.

The incident started when a man walked into the store and refused to put on a mask._


----------



## petee (Jun 20, 2021)

6 workers. 1 vaccinated. 5 got coronavirus, 2 of them dead.

"On Monday, one of four IT staffers who had been hospitalized with COVID-19 died, according to Hopes. A fifth IT staffer who went to the doctor on Wednesday, died at home Thursday from COVID-19.

One staffer in the department who worked closely with the other five and didn’t contract the coronavirus was vaccinated. All five who contracted the virus were known not to be vaccinated and had a sore throat as their initial primary complaint"



			https://www.bradenton.com/news/coronavirus/article252212853.html


----------



## petee (Jul 2, 2021)

i put this in the wrong thread, so here it is again.









						Washington lawmaker wears yellow Star of David, evoking Nazi persecution, to protest COVID vaccine mandates
					

Activists who oppose mandatory vaccines have deployed Nazi and Holocaust analogies even before the pandemic, drawing condemnations from the Anti-Defamation League and other Jewish organizations, which call such comparisons deeply offensive.




					www.seattletimes.com


----------



## petee (Jul 9, 2021)

Christian “Prophet”: I Know Three People Who Died of COVID Who Were Resurrected
					

Good luck looking for evidence.




					friendlyatheist.patheos.com
				




can't talk about it though.


----------



## petee (Jul 13, 2021)

simple!


----------



## petee (Jul 13, 2021)

a bit of good news
how this is in murdoch's Post i have no idea









						Why a famous anti-vaxxer saw the light — and got the COVID-19 vaccine
					

Heather Brooke Simpson once dressed up as the Measles for Halloween, but she’s changed her ways and got the COVID-19 jab




					nypost.com


----------



## editor (Jul 13, 2021)

More facepalms urgently needed in Tennessee:










						Tennessee has gone “anti-vaccine,” state vaccine chief says after being fired
					

Vaccine chief says she was fired for noting state's 34-year-old policy for vaccinating teens.




					arstechnica.com


----------



## petee (Jul 20, 2021)

🤩


----------



## existentialist (Jul 21, 2021)

petee said:


> 🤩



You can see how Rand Paul obviously expects to be able to perpetrate his falsehoods unchallenged, and really doesn't like it when his challenges run up against hard fact, and a respondent who isn't in the business of taking shit. I'd have been interested to see his reaction to being called a liar by Fauci


----------



## petee (Jul 23, 2021)

hey, somebody went there  - a republican too

_“Let’s be crystal clear about this issue. And media, I want you to start reporting the facts. The new cases of COVID are because of unvaccinated folks. Almost 100% of the new hospitalizations are with unvaccinated folks. And the deaths are certainly occurring with the unvaccinated folks. These folks are choosing a horrible lifestyle of self-inflicted pain,” Gov. Ivey said during an event for Landing in Birmingham Thursday._



			https://www.cbs42.com/news/local/its-time-to-start-blaming-the-unvaccinated-gov-ivey-on-rise-in-covid-19-cases-low-vaccination-rate/


----------



## petee (Jul 25, 2021)

shit, they're getting closer to me









						SEE IT: Anti-Vaxxers Take Over Central Park with Protest and March - Upper East Site
					

MANHATTAN – Hundreds of anti-vaccination activists descended upon Central Park on Saturday to declare “freedom over fear” and denounce Dr. Anthony Fauci, the President’s chief medical adviser— before embarking on a march to protest what they claim are ‘forced’ Covid-19 vaccinations. Contact...




					www.uppereastsite.com
				




this is a punchable offense:

_“It would be great if we could see your smile,” a man in ‘my body, my choice’ tee shirt told a masked photographer at the event for *Upper East Site*, attempting to coerce the photog to go mask-free._


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 26, 2021)

petee said:


> hey, somebody went there  - a republican too
> 
> _“Let’s be crystal clear about this issue. And media, I want you to start reporting the facts. The new cases of COVID are because of unvaccinated folks. Almost 100% of the new hospitalizations are with unvaccinated folks. And the deaths are certainly occurring with the unvaccinated folks. These folks are choosing a horrible lifestyle of self-inflicted pain,” Gov. Ivey said during an event for Landing in Birmingham Thursday._
> 
> ...



It's shameful that so many people in the world are desperate for vaccines while in Alabama, etc., they're rejecting them because they think it's a good way to send a message to Democrats.



> Many people here and elsewhere in the Southeast are turning down Covid-19 vaccines because they are angry that President Donald Trump lost the election and sick of Democrats in Washington thinking they know what’s best.











						In Alabama and Louisiana, partisan opposition to vaccine surges alongside Delta variant
					

Many people are turning down Covid vaccines because they are angry that President Donald Trump lost the election and sick of Democrats thinking they know what’s best.




					www.politico.com


----------



## existentialist (Jul 26, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> It's shameful that so many people in the world are desperate for vaccines while in Alabama, etc., they're rejecting them because they think it's a good way to send a message to Democrats.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The 21st century version of "cutting off your own nose to spite your face"


----------



## emanymton (Jul 26, 2021)

petee said:


> shit, they're getting closer to me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I wonder what his view on adoration would be?


----------



## Raheem (Jul 26, 2021)

emanymton said:


> I wonder what his view on adoration would be?


Probably agrees with Ian Brown on that too.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Jul 26, 2021)

petee said:


> this is a punchable offense:
> 
> _“It would be great if we could see your smile,” a man in ‘my body, my choice’ tee shirt told a masked photographer at the event for *Upper East Site*, attempting to coerce the photog to go mask-free._


You can bet that was to a female photographer. Just when you were wondering how "come on luv, give us a smile" could be even worse.


----------



## petee (Jul 26, 2021)

FridgeMagnet said:


> You can bet that was to a female photographer. Just when you were wondering how "come on luv, give us a smile" could be even worse.


yes indeed i assumed so. i looked for the photog's name in the article but didn't see it.


----------



## Yossarian (Jul 26, 2021)

This pastor in Tennessee says mask-wearers will be kicked out of church.

"I will ask you to leave. I am not playing these Democrat games up in this church.”



			https://www.kentucky.com/news/coronavirus/article253026988.html
		


Weird part is that with a population five times the size, including countless millions of idiots like this, the US is still recording far fewer new cases than Britain.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jul 26, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> Weird part is that with a population five times the size, including countless millions of idiots like this, the US is still recording far fewer new cases than Britain.



The delta variant seems to only just be starting to take off in the US, overall new cases at the end of June were 13.5k a day, now 46.5k.

Plus the UK is testing more, overall over twice as many tests per million population, compared to the US.


----------



## petee (Jul 29, 2021)

good


----------



## petee (Jul 30, 2021)

St. Louis County Health Director: I Was Assaulted, Called 'Brown C——' After Mask Plea
					

Editor's note: Dr. Faisal Khan, acting director of the St. Louis County Department of Public Health, spoke in favor of a mask mandate on Tuesday...




					www.riverfronttimes.com
				




_After my presentation was completed, I tried to leave the chamber but was confronted by several people who were in the aisle. On more than one occasion, I was shoulder-bumped and pushed. As I approached the exit and immediately outside the chambers, I became surrounded by the crowd in close quarters, where members of the crowd yelled at me, calling me a “fat brown cunt” and a “brown bastard.” After being physically assaulted, called racist slurs, and surrounded by an angry mob, I expressed my displeasure by using my middle finger toward an individual who had physically threatened me and called me racist slurs.

Political operatives — and even Mr. Fitch himself — have sought to use my instinctive reaction as political fodder against me. I would like to think that I would not react like that because it risks creating a distraction from what should be a consensus around masking and vaccines. I have to say, however, that when faced with the racist vitriol that Councilman Fitch has been privately and publicly stoking against me since my appointment, I cannot say I am sorry._

well, no.


----------



## High Voltage (Jul 31, 2021)

This link was obtained from the ever reliable World-O-meter Web site so treat accordingly

But if current trends continue, not the worst case scenario ones either, then the two major milestones I mentioned earlier (total US combat deaths and total US deaths from the 1918 Kansas flu) will be exceeded late September through mid-October

Yesterday's daily infection rate just bouncing off 100k doesn't bode well

And looking at the UK's infection rate from the same reliable source we are actually worse. The only saving grace seems to be at the moment our death rate is lower. No doubt due to vaccination rates. 









						IHME | COVID-19 Projections
					

Explore forecasts of COVID-19 cases, deaths, and hospital resource use.




					covid19.healthdata.org


----------



## elbows (Aug 1, 2021)




----------



## elbows (Aug 5, 2021)




----------



## NoXion (Aug 7, 2021)

Freedom Warrior Dick Farrel dies of complications arising from a Covid-19 infection.









						Vocal anti-vaccine broadcaster dies from COVID-19 complications
					

Former South Florida talk show host Dick Farrel, known and beloved by fans for his over-the-top right-wing opinions, has died from complications from COVID-19.




					www.wptv.com
				




I guess he managed to own the libs one last time.


----------



## elbows (Aug 9, 2021)

This happened on Saturday:



> The City of Austin and Travis County will utilize the Warn Central Texas system today in response to a severely worsening COVID-19 situation in our community.
> 
> The message will implore the public to wear a mask, get vaccinated, and stay home if possible, to reduce the transmission of COVID-19 in Austin.
> 
> “The situation is critical,” said Dr. Desmar Walkes Austin-Travis County Health Authority. “Our hospitals are severely stressed and there is little we can do to alleviate their burden with the surging cases. The public has to act now and help our we will face a catastrophe in our community that could have been avoided.”





> The message will be sent around noon today, Aug. 7 via text message, phone call, and email through the Warn Central Texas emergency notification system - the regional notification system that is used to alert the public of emergencies in the community and how they can stay safe.
> 
> Today’s message follows the City and County elevating the COVID-19 risk level to stage 5, the highest level earlier this week.
> 
> “Hospital bed availability and critical care is extremely limited in our hospital systems, not just for COVID-19 patients, but for anyone who may need treatment,” said Dr. Walkes. “The community has to come together again and stave off disaster.”







__





						City and County to Use Alert System on COVID-19 Situation  | AustinTexas.gov
					

The City of Austin and Travis County will utilize the Warn Central Texas system today i




					www.austintexas.gov


----------



## elbows (Aug 10, 2021)




----------



## elbows (Aug 10, 2021)




----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 10, 2021)

Just been made aware of the baton rouge medical centre facebook page where these came from:


----------



## Badgers (Aug 11, 2021)




----------



## petee (Aug 13, 2021)

COVID Kills 4 Teachers in One Day in Same Florida School District
					

Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis has forbidden school districts from requiring students and teachers get vaccinated or wear masks to school.



					www.thedailybeast.com
				




b-b-b-but my libbity


----------



## petee (Aug 13, 2021)

brave guy, brave children


----------



## _Russ_ (Aug 14, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> Just been made aware of the baton rouge medical centre facebook page where these came from:
> View attachment 283062
> 
> View attachment 283063


So how come we dont see the same in the UK?, is it because the AZ Vaccine is less efficacious?, I think its widely held that its the case but figures like this imply the difference is larger than we are told.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Aug 14, 2021)

_Russ_ said:


> So how come we dont see the same in the UK?, is it because the AZ Vaccine is less efficacious?, I think its widely held that its the case but figures like this imply the difference is larger than we are told.



It's largely down to vaccination rates I think. Here a higher proportion of serious cases are vaccinated as it's a smaller percentage of what's now a much larger group, particularly in the older and vulnerable. In Louisiana not so much - they have a high rate of unvaccinated people including in those groups and that will come through in the numbers.  You'd need a proper analysis to say for sure of course but on the face of it I don't think it implies lower efficacy.


----------



## _Russ_ (Aug 14, 2021)

Thanks, that does make sense and it seems Arizona have only about 58% adults with one dose (cant find figures for 2 doses)


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 14, 2021)

_Russ_ said:


> Thanks, that does make sense and it seems Arizona have only about 58% adults with one dose (cant find figures for 2 doses)



According to this tracker, updated yesterday, Arizona scores for 18+ age, first dose 66.3%, second dose 46.4%, compared to the UK on 89.3% & 76.0%.









						See How Vaccinations Are Going in Your County and State
					

See where doses have gone, and who is eligible for a shot in each state.



					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Badgers (Aug 16, 2021)

US could see 200,000 Covid cases a day again: ‘Unvaccinated are sitting ducks’
					

Director of National Institutes of Health pleads with Americans to get their shots as Delta variant ravages the country




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## petee (Aug 16, 2021)

otoh

"The United States is averaging about half a million new coronavirus vaccinations per day for the first time since June, officials with the White House covid-19 response team said Thursday"



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/08/12/coronavirus-covid-live-updates-us/


----------



## Badgers (Aug 16, 2021)




----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 16, 2021)

petee said:


> otoh
> 
> "The United States is averaging about half a million new coronavirus vaccinations per day for the first time since June, officials with the White House covid-19 response team said Thursday"
> 
> ...


so what's that, another six months till completion?


----------



## Cloo (Aug 16, 2021)

I'm seeing a lot on Twitter about US paediatric ICUs being full because of COVID, and possibly because of bad cases of winter viruses appearing out of season.... yet no sign of large scale hospitalisation among children in the UK. Golisano Children’s Hospital at full capacity as COVID-19, other illnesses bring more kids in 

Any ideas why this is? 

Misinformation?
Really low numbers of paed ICU beds in the US?
More obese kids?
Just people abandoning all caution?


----------



## elbows (Aug 16, 2021)

I dont have answers about that, just the same sorts of questions. And I've certainly seen UK based experts asking the same sort of overarching question about the difference, and it didnt sound like they understood why either.


----------



## petee (Aug 17, 2021)

del.


----------



## a_chap (Aug 17, 2021)

boy.


----------



## elbows (Aug 18, 2021)

Anti-mask cunt governor Abbot tested positive, but he had the luxury of vaccination and antibody treatment.



> Texas governor Greg Abbott tested positive for Covid-19 on Tuesday, after weeks spent banning local mask requirements and meeting maskless crowds.
> 
> Abbott, a Republican, is fully vaccinated against the virus and is not experiencing symptoms, his office said in a statement. He is taking a monoclonal antibody treatment and isolating in the governor’s mansion.











						Texas governor Greg Abbott, who fought mask mandates, tests positive for Covid
					

Abbott, who was vaccinated in December, is at least the 11th governor to contract the virus




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## 2hats (Aug 18, 2021)

US third dose mRNA boosters (at eight months) from 20 September announced by CDC director. No decision for recipients of J&J/Janssen yet.








						US health officials call for booster shots against COVID-19
					

WASHINGTON (AP) — U.S. health officials Wednesday announced plans to dispense COVID-19 booster shots to all Americans to shore up their protection amid the surging delta variant and signs that the vaccines' effectiveness is slipping.




					apnews.com


----------



## petee (Aug 18, 2021)

let's make fun of them until they start killing us. quite long thread.

"we're coming for every single fucking one of you."


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 18, 2021)

It didn't take long for one of those ^^^ loons to bring up Hitler & the Nazis.


----------



## petee (Aug 18, 2021)

_"What they're doing here is they're violating the Nuremberg Code, and if you allow one more shot to go into one more person's body, you yourself can be executed," he told the pharmacists as well as other Walmart workers present. "It's a violation of the Nuremberg Code. I do this out of love, I'm not trying to give you any fear and intimidation — I'm just letting you guys know that if you continue to do this, that you guys will be held accountable."_









						Man threatens Springfield Walmart workers, tells them they will be executed for administering vaccines
					

Yelling through a locked door, Christopher Key told the hiding pharmacists they could be \




					www.news-leader.com


----------



## glitch hiker (Aug 18, 2021)

This was, perhaps, inevitable?


----------



## petee (Aug 22, 2021)

another one bites the dust 🎼









						Conservative Radio Host Who Mocked Vaccines Dies of COVID-19
					

Phil Valentine derided coronavirus vaccines, but he changed his tune when he was hospitalized.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## krtek a houby (Aug 22, 2021)

Another Republican shit

‘Racist and flat out wrong’: Texas Republican blames Black Americans for Covid surge


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 22, 2021)

krtek a houby said:


> Another Republican shit
> 
> ‘Racist and flat out wrong’: Texas Republican blames Black Americans for Covid surge



What a cunt.



> In his statement on Friday, Patrick said federal and state data “clearly indicate that Black vaccination rates are significantly lower than White or Hispanic rates”. But statistics from the Texas health department did not back him up.
> 
> Black Texans, about 12% of more than 29 million people in the state, have accounted for about 15% of total Covid-19 cases and just more than 10% of deaths.
> 
> About 8% of the eligible population in Texas that has been vaccinated is Black, according to state data, compared with 35% of the white population. But white people make up the largest racial group in Texas at about 40%. *Overall, 44% of Texans are fully vaccinated, less than the national rate of about 50%.*



I am bit shocked by that low vaccine uptake, when the UK has hit 76.3% fully vaccinated, 87.5% first doses so far.

That must be playing into the current death rates, 7-day averages & adjusted for population, both the UK & US are reporting roughly the same number of new cases daily, but deaths are almost double in comparison -  100 in the UK, compared to 800 a day in the US.


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 22, 2021)

This crowd in Alabama apparently loves dying from COVID-19 even more than they love Donald Trump.


----------



## Raheem (Aug 23, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> This crowd in Alabama apparently loves dying from COVID-19 even more than they love Donald Trump.



Can't really blame them.


----------



## Saul Goodman (Aug 23, 2021)

Raheem said:


> Can't really blame them.


But the irony of Trump getting booed by rednecks is quite funny.


----------



## Dogsauce (Aug 23, 2021)

The utter fucking stupidity of making vaccination and other preventative measures part of the ‘Culture War’ is beyond belief. Some of these cunts (promoters and gobshites, not gullible followers) actually deserve to die for playing that game.


----------



## Raheem (Aug 23, 2021)

Saul Goodman said:


> But the irony of Trump getting booed by rednecks is quite funny.


A bit funny. But they will still vote for him.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 23, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> The utter fucking stupidity of making vaccination and other preventative measures part of the ‘Culture War’ is beyond belief. Some of these cunts (promoters and gobshites, not gullible followers) actually deserve to die for playing that game.


I bet you the promoters of this stuff are fully jabbed.
e2a: at least the non loon ones.


----------



## NoXion (Aug 23, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> I bet you the promoters of this stuff are fully jabbed.
> e2a: at least the non loon ones.



OK, so I can understand the Trumpist Republicans thinking that letting the disease rip through urban areas and blue states would be a win for them on some level. But it's the bit afterwards that I'm having trouble understanding - if they're smart enough to get themselves jabbed, how then could they not predict that the situation would end up reversing itself as urban areas and blue states get all masked and jabbed up? Are they so confident in their moves to disenfranchise voters that they think it will be enough to make up for their base dying?

Surely they must realise on some level that viruses don't give a fuck about political alignment? Or are they so wrapped up in their culture war bullshit that they couldn't see this coming? It honestly makes no goddamn sense to me.


----------



## petee (Aug 23, 2021)

NB: "y'all"


----------



## Saul Goodman (Aug 23, 2021)

petee said:


> NB: "y'all"


It's easier to get your point across if you speak the same language as your target audience.


----------



## Dogsauce (Aug 23, 2021)

NoXion said:


> OK, so I can understand the Trumpist Republicans thinking that letting the disease rip through urban areas and blue states would be a win for them on some level. But it's the bit afterwards that I'm having trouble understanding - if they're smart enough to get themselves jabbed, how then could they not predict that the situation would end up reversing itself as urban areas and blue states get all masked and jabbed up? Are they so confident in their moves to disenfranchise voters that they think it will be enough to make up for their base dying?
> 
> Surely they must realise on some level that viruses don't give a fuck about political alignment? Or are they so wrapped up in their culture war bullshit that they couldn't see this coming? It honestly makes no goddamn sense to me.


I seem to recall some of them celebrating the fact that it had a higher mortality rate among certain minority groups, although I’m not sure if that was ever proven in the end, with things like poorer access to healthcare needing to be factored in.


----------



## petee (Aug 23, 2021)

Saul Goodman said:


> It's easier to get your point across if you speak the same language as your target audience.



yes, but i think there's more: using southern patois has come to be seen as "real" as opposed to "elitist/liberal/northeastern/educated". i've heard born-and-bred new yorkers using it, and it sticks in my craw. 

otoh the CDC is located in atlanta so maybe they're just talkin'.


----------



## petee (Aug 23, 2021)

here's a story you won't read in the post









						Anti-mask New York Post requires all of its employees to wear masks in latest sign of Murdoch media hypocrisy
					

The New York Post, the Rupert Murdoch-owned tabloid that has peddled a high volume of anti-mask rhetoric during the pandemic, informed employees this month that they are required to wear a mask while at the office, according to a memo obtained by CNN Business.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## 8ball (Aug 23, 2021)

petee said:


> here's a story you won't read in the post
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You can’t be an efficient anti-masker media outlet if you’re sick with the Covid, now, can you?


----------



## imposs1904 (Aug 29, 2021)

Just read about this bloke in Texas. 30 years of age and leaves a young family. Truly tragic.

Texan Man Who Organized Anti-Mask Protests Dies of COVID


----------



## Badgers (Aug 29, 2021)

He was truly tragic. His selfishness has left a pregnant, unemployed wife with three kids and likely crippling medical bills. 

Hope his lies and agitation have not caused many more deaths or ruined lives.


----------



## imposs1904 (Aug 29, 2021)

Badgers said:


> He was truly tragic. His selfishness has left a pregnant, unemployed wife with three kids and likely crippling medical bills.
> 
> Hope his lies and agitation have not caused many more deaths or ruined lives.



In America we don't need universal healthcare, we have Go Fund Me appeals. 

Three young kids and one on the way. I can't get my head round what he was thinking. I didn't post the link to gloat or sneer at him. I just think it's terribly sad all round.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Aug 29, 2021)

It's sad & tragic for his family.

But, he's gone out of his way to promote false information, that could result in many others losing their lives, so fuck him.

I don't wish covid on anyone, but frankly the more of these loons that get taken out by covid, the safer the world becomes for the rest of us.


----------



## Badgers (Aug 29, 2021)

The more that their selfish, dangerous views plus associated painful deaths and associated misery are publicised the better


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 29, 2021)

It's a sad story - unlike a lot of the anti-mask types, Wallace seems to have been a genuinely good and community-minded person - he organised aid shipments to hurricane victims in 2017 and when the cold snap and power cut hit earlier this year, him and the local mayor set aside their differences to help vulnerable residents. His wife says they disagreed on masks but still got along fine.

He just got fatally sucked in by all the politicized shit American conservatives are spreading around COVID, and no doubt ended up spreading plenty of shit himself, hopefully his death will change a few minds but people in Texas etc. seem so entrenched that they'll probably blame his death on insufficient quantities of horse dewormer.

_At first, Caleb refused to get tested for COVID-19, or go to the hospital.

"He was so hard-headed," Jessica said. "He didn't want to see a doctor, because he didn't want to be part of the statistics with COVID tests."

Caleb instead began taking tablets of ivermectin_









						‘He loved his family’: Caleb Wallace dies after battle with COVID-19, pregnant wife says
					

Caleb Wallace of San Angelo died Saturday after battling COVID for weeks. His wife, Jessica, is due soon with their fourth child and has started a GoFundMe for the family.




					www.gosanangelo.com


----------



## petee (Aug 29, 2021)

your one-stop shop 
(x-posted on the UK thread)









						r/COVIDAteMyFace
					

r/COVIDAteMyFace: Leopards Ate My Face, COVID style. Citing the stupid, stubborn, stan for suicide by covid. Mourning the moronic mendacious …




					www.reddit.com


----------



## petee (Aug 29, 2021)

what freedom looks like









						14 Portable Morgues Heading To Central Florida Hospitals Amid 'Unprecedented Deaths'
					

After overwhelming numbers of COVID-19 cases, hospitals are running out of room for bodies.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## petee (Aug 30, 2021)

just a reminder


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 30, 2021)

Anti-masker dies of COVID after weeks on a ventilator. Anti-vaxxers: "The ventilator did it."


----------



## elbows (Aug 30, 2021)

I know the USA is rather large but I think the BBC mangled their reporting:



> The daily average for hospital admissions has risen past 100,000 for the first time since last winter.



I'm not all that experienced with US hospital data but I dont think that number makes sense. Total number of covid patients in hospital, or admissions per week rather than per day, could plausibly be at that sort of level, but not new admissions per day.

Quote is from:

Covid: EU recommends new travel restrictions for US as cases rise


----------



## a_chap (Aug 30, 2021)

petee said:


> just a reminder




From the same Twitter account...




“Forget going into these school boards with freaking data. You go in to these school boards to remove them. I’m going in with 20 strong men and I’m gonna give them an option - they can leave or they can be removed.”


----------



## imposs1904 (Aug 30, 2021)

Probably bullshit but still funny:


----------



## StoneRoad (Aug 30, 2021)

Ivermectin is a product designed to kill worms - internal parasites - in equines.

It ain't a cure or porphylatic for Covid ...


----------



## Yossarian (Aug 30, 2021)

The ivermectin aficionados are talking about how they've been passing "rope worms," when they've actually been shitting out their intestinal linings.









						No, Ivermectin Is Not Making People Poop Out "Rope Worms". The Truth Is Much Worse
					

No, Ivermectin Is Not Making People Poop Out "Rope Worms". The Truth Is Much Worse




					www.iflscience.com


----------



## Sue (Aug 30, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> The ivermectin aficionados are talking about how they've been passing "rope worms," when *they've actually been shitting out their intestinal linings.*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm not a medical expert by any means but that doesn't sound very good...


----------



## Saul Goodman (Aug 30, 2021)

Sue said:


> I'm not a medical expert by any means but that doesn't sound very good...


It does if they're only admistering it to themselves and not their kids.


----------



## Epona (Aug 30, 2021)

Truly terrifying









						Ohio judge rules Covid patient must get unsafe horse drug Ivermectin
					

Authorities warn taking the drug for Covid is ineffective and could cause serious health effects




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## NoXion (Aug 30, 2021)

Epona said:


> Truly terrifying
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Link should come with a warning, it leads to a video with Rand _gags_ Paul in it. A cunt's cunt.


----------



## Epona (Aug 30, 2021)

NoXion said:


> Link should come with a warning, it leads to a video with Rand _gags_ Paul in it. A cunt's cunt.



Yeah they head up the page with a video of that, I think they are using it as an example of someone being a cunt rather than some sort of advert for them though 

Also what is it with the Trump style pursed up farting-arse shaped lip movement thing when speaking?  Do they have workshops to train them in this speaking technique or something?


----------



## a_chap (Aug 31, 2021)

Epona said:


> Truly terrifying
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Even more terrifying are the comments!


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Aug 31, 2021)

Ah yes, the physician is one of the FLCCC lot :/


----------



## Cloo (Aug 31, 2021)

In response to CDC, nurses, doctors, immunologists, virologists etc:

'I'm not having your EXPERIMENTAL, UNPROVEN vaccine you evil scientists!'

In response to some random person on the internet:

'I'm gonna take that horse dewormer as you recommended to treat a respiratory virus!'


----------



## petee (Aug 31, 2021)

bit of history 
article at left, for the purposes of this thread









						The Saint Paul globe. (St. Paul, Minn.) 1896-1905, April 16, 1903, Page 3, Image 4
					

The Saint Paul globe. (St. Paul, Minn.) 1896-1905, April 16, 1903, Page 3, Image 4, brought to you by Minnesota Historical Society; Saint Paul, MN, and the National Digital Newspaper Program.




					chroniclingamerica.loc.gov


----------



## elbows (Sep 1, 2021)

I considered attempts by US official to describe for a while their current wave as 'a pandemic of the unvaccinated' as unwise, and indeed they've since had to roll back on that inappropriately narrow rhetoric. Well it doesnt sound like many officials have given up on that rhetoric yet, but it blew up in their face in some ways once the scale of breakthrough infections became more obvious.



> “It is true that the unvaccinated are the biggest driver, but we mustn’t forget that the vaccinated are part of it as well, in part because of the delta variant,” said Dr. Eric Topol, professor of molecular medicine at Scripps Research in La Jolla, California. “The pandemic clearly involves all people, not just the unvaccinated.”











						Questioning a catchphrase: 'Pandemic of the unvaccinated'
					

WASHINGTON (AP) — This summer’s coronavirus resurgence has been labeled a “pandemic of the unvaccinated” by government officials from President Joe Biden on down. The sound bite captures the glaring reality that unvaccinated people overwhelmingly account for new cases and serious infections...




					apnews.com


----------



## Tankus (Sep 1, 2021)

I'm amazed that the medical insurance  companies  haven't  started ramping up premiums for the unvaxinated,  by substantial margins across the board,

 I think I've only seen one airline initiate it for its company's medical  policy


----------



## High Voltage (Sep 4, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> With my figures taken from the ever reliable World-O-Meters web site
> 
> IF America carries on at approximately its current daily death rate then they'll top the 600,000 total in less than 20 days - this is a big mile stone
> 
> ...



This weekend will almost certainly see the States of America pass the second milestone mentioned above

If you're an American you are now safer going to fight in a war than live free in the SoA

And yes, I know I'm really twisting two totally unrelated numbers. But with new daily case levels approaching 185,000 things ain't looking good

Before we all start feeling a little smug in the Kingdom our new daily case level (yesterday), scaled to allow for differences in population size, would see the equivalent of over 200,000 of our fellow countrymen, women and children infected. With each one capable of causing another mutation that the current vaccines will not work on or work on as well. Not to mention putting an even greater strain on the finite resources of the NHS and putting the doctors and nurses and ambulance crews and cleaners and all staff involved at greater and total avoidable risk


----------



## krtek a houby (Sep 4, 2021)

Headlines getting more and more terrifyingly sureal 

Gunshot Victims Left Waiting as Horse Dewormer Overdoses Overwhelm Oklahoma Hospitals, Doctor Says


----------



## cupid_stunt (Sep 4, 2021)

krtek a houby said:


> Headlines getting more and more terrifyingly sureal
> 
> Gunshot Victims Left Waiting as Horse Dewormer Overdoses Overwhelm Oklahoma Hospitals, Doctor Says





> As people take the drug, McElyea said patients have arrived at hospitals with negative reactions like nausea, vomiting, muscle aches, and cramping — or even loss of sight.
> 
> “The scariest one that I’ve heard of and seen is people coming in with vision loss,” the doctor said.



FFS, despite them being complete fucking idiots, I hope the vision loss is only temporarily.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Sep 4, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> But with new daily case levels approaching 185,000 things ain't looking good



I think you mean 165,000, which adjusted for population is about the same as the UK on 34,000, however with the population adjustment their average daily deaths are running at almost two & half times the UK rate*, and that gap has been increasing recently.  

* US - 1304 / 4.88 = 267
UK - 114

Their testing rate per one million people is less than half ours, so they are probably missing a lot more new cases, which together with fairly low vaccination rates, probably goes a long way in explaining the ratio between new cases and deaths being so different to the UK.


----------



## High Voltage (Sep 4, 2021)

I did say that I'm taking my figures from the ever reliable World-O-meter Web site which does list the States, for the last two days, at 182,000 and change

But either which way the numbers are going the wrong way and we are worse

This is not over by a long chalk. Shame a lot of people can't or won't accept that and are wanting to get back to the old normal and not realising that we may never get back there


----------



## cupid_stunt (Sep 4, 2021)

I was also using the World-O-meter Web site too, but I always tick the box for the 7-day average figures, to iron out the ups & downs of the daily figures, and, yes the numbers are bad on both sides of the ponds.

But, I am not sure about 'we are worse', on new cases we could well be in a week or two with the schools going back, but ATM we are on a par, however we are testing a lot more, so are probably picking up more cases per head.

But, more important than cases is the deaths, and I doubt we will start seeing that high ratio of deaths to cases, or perhaps I should say 'I hope we don't start seeing...'


----------



## elbows (Sep 4, 2021)

If seeking to compare the UK with the USA, when it comes to number of positive cases we need to factor in the idea that availability of testing is worse in the US. We dont need to rely on that assumption without evidence, we can compare the percentage positivity rates of the two nations. I dont have those figures to hand at the moment, but I think last time I looked, the percentage of positives in the USA was indeed ridiculously high. 

And/or use hospital data. Which will reflect other stuff like differences in what percentage of the population have been vaccinated in the two countries.

In terms of current trends, I think there were some trends in US data that implied a peak, but if I try to look into this properly then its probably better to do so on a state by state basis.


----------



## petee (Sep 5, 2021)




----------



## Badgers (Sep 5, 2021)




----------



## petee (Sep 8, 2021)

my own hospital


----------



## Edie (Sep 8, 2021)

petee said:


> my own hospital



Oh we’ve had ‘please don’t punch nhs staff’ posters long before covid.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Sep 8, 2021)

Edie said:


> Oh we’ve had ‘please don’t punch nhs staff’ posters long before covid.



I was going to post the same, I've seen them in hospitals and at the GP's, long before covid.


----------



## LDC (Sep 8, 2021)

cupid_stunt said:


> I was going to post the same, I've seen them in hospitals and at the GP's, long before covid.



On a par for depressing ones are 'Just because your football team lost it's not OK to punch your wife/girlfriend' that were up at my last hospital.


----------



## Yossarian (Sep 8, 2021)

krtek a houby said:


> Headlines getting more and more terrifyingly sureal
> 
> Gunshot Victims Left Waiting as Horse Dewormer Overdoses Overwhelm Oklahoma Hospitals, Doctor Says



The doctor quoted in that story has walked it back somewhat - he says he was misquoted and while some ivermectin overdose patients have added to the burden on overloaded hospitals, there aren't enough of them to overwhelm hospitals by themselves.









						Oklahoma Doctor At Center Of Viral Ivermectin Story Says Report Is Wrong
					

The doctor at the center of the story told News 9 he was misquoted, and the story was wrong.




					www.newson6.com


----------



## Yossarian (Sep 8, 2021)

I have some sympathy for the ivermectin fans, tbh - it's not a conspiracy theory to say that health care in the US is a total fucking scam and doctors there can't always be trusted, many the poor, rural communities where people are taking horse paste instead of getting vaccinated were hit hard by the opioid crisis caused in large part by doctors overprescribing drugs like OxyContin while taking kickbacks from drug companies.

So I can see why some people in these places, especially those with no health insurance or shitty health care plans, might get seduced by the idea that vaccines etc. are a scam and the disease can actually be cured by a medicine you can buy very cheaply at the farm supply store. And too often, they just end up dying after spending weeks on a ventilator, leaving their families with medical bills of $50,000 or more.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Sep 10, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> I have some sympathy for the ivermectin fans, tbh - it's not a conspiracy theory to say that health care in the US is a total fucking scam and doctors there can't always be trusted, many the poor, rural communities where people are taking horse paste instead of getting vaccinated were hit hard by the opioid crisis caused in large part by doctors overprescribing drugs like OxyContin while taking kickbacks from drug companies.
> 
> So I can see why some people in these places, especially those with no health insurance or shitty health care plans, might get seduced by the idea that vaccines etc. are a scam and the disease can actually be cured by a medicine you can buy very cheaply at the farm supply store. And too often, they just end up dying after spending weeks on a ventilator, leaving their families with medical bills of $50,000 or more.



^This.  I'm from a rural area and people there regularly treat their own illness with drugs meant for animals.  Get a cut, put some bag balm on it.  Get a cold, shoot up some antibiotics.  It's cheap, its available, which is more than can be said for rural medical care.  I've sometimes had to drive an elderly parent halfway across the state to get the care of a specialist.  Regular GPs can be over an hour away.  Just the geographics of rural areas make healthcare difficult to deliver in an large area with a small population.  If you add the costs, it becomes impossible to get health care.   A lot of rural farmers don't have health insurance because it costs so much, as well so that locks them out of the medical system from the beginning.

When my father was sick with cancer, I had to drive to his place (200 miles), pick him up, take him to Omaha (250 miles), and then drive him back home (250 miles).  I remember once being so angry with them because we got there and the doctor spent five minutes speaking to him and sent him home.  We drove a sick, elderly man 700 miles, just to spend five minutes with a doctor for something that could have been handled over the phone.  

That said, there are some very dedicated rural doctors and nurses out there who could make a lot more money if they gave up and moved to the city.


----------



## petee (Sep 11, 2021)

even goppers are getting fed up


----------



## krtek a houby (Sep 11, 2021)

Repub scumbal and would be Senator for Ohio is seemingly calling for violence against health workers


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 11, 2021)

krtek a houby said:


> Repub scumbal and would be Senator for Ohio is seemingly calling for violence against health workers



FJebbusC on a bike !

What a snowflake. 
Has watching the last 18 months - and the international situation - shown & taught him nothing !!!


----------



## existentialist (Sep 11, 2021)

StoneRoad said:


> FJebbusC on a bike !
> 
> What a snowflake.
> Has watching the last 18 months - and the international situation - shown & taught him nothing !!!


Nope.


----------



## High Voltage (Sep 13, 2021)

678,000 deaths once again from World-O-meter now running at more deaths than the Kansas flu of 1918 and showing no real signs of being gotten under control


----------



## petee (Sep 14, 2021)

this one is more than averagely satisfying. i tried to copy a pull quote but my phone won't co-operate. be ready to punch your screen.









						Bob Enyart, Who Mocked AIDS Victims and Spread COVID Lies, Has Died of COVID
					

Better him than his victims.




					friendlyatheist.patheos.com


----------



## fishfinger (Sep 14, 2021)

petee said:


> this one is more than averagely satisfying. i tried to copy a pull quote but my phone won't co-operate. be ready to punch your screen.
> 
> http://[URL='https://friendlyatheis...ad-covid-lies-has-died-of-covid/[/URL[/COLOR]]


Another one bites the dust...


----------



## Badgers (Sep 14, 2021)

fishfinger said:


> Another one bites the dust...


Too few 

The culling of the thick/selfish is taking too long and causing too much collatoral damage.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 14, 2021)

petee said:


> this one is more than averagely satisfying. i tried to copy a pull quote but my phone won't co-operate. be ready to punch your screen.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


what a perfectly disgusting excuse for a human being


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 14, 2021)

I'll not miss that sorry example of humanity.

I wonder how many more of his ilk will bit the dust this year ?


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 14, 2021)

StoneRoad said:


> I'll not miss that sorry example of humanity.
> 
> I wonder how many more of his ilk will bit the dust this year ?


for those with a login there is a private dedicated sub reddit: /r/hermancainawards




__





						r/HermanCainAwards
					

r/HermanCainAwards: 'The Herman Cain Freedumb Award' Qualifications for nomination: Public declaration of one's anti-mask, anti-vaxx, or Covid-hoax …




					www.reddit.com
				



I don't have a login but the person who pointed it out said there were loads...


----------



## Dogsauce (Sep 14, 2021)

wemakeyousoundb said:


> for those with a login there is a private dedicated sub reddit: /r/hermancainawards
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There’s this publicly available Reddit that’s full of anti vax berks getting their comeuppance.









						r/COVIDAteMyFace
					

r/COVIDAteMyFace: Leopards Ate My Face, COVID style. Citing the stupid, stubborn, stan for suicide by covid. Mourning the moronic mendacious …




					www.reddit.com


----------



## petee (Sep 16, 2021)

A Boy Went to a COVID-Swamped ER. He Waited for Hours. Then His Appendix Burst.
					

Non-COVID patients are paying a price as the delta variant and low-vaccination rates overwhelm hospitals across the country. “Wait times can now be measured in days,” said an expert.




					www.propublica.org
				




in this story, 2 dead, 1 survives.
thanks, antivaxxers.


----------



## High Voltage (Sep 18, 2021)

World-O-meter total again, now North of 690,000. Next stop the 700,000's - which, come next weekend, will easily have be blown through

800's in time for Christmas anyone?

And please, if anyone thinks that I'm making light of this, honestly I'm not. But it is a very, very sobering critique showing what can so easily go wrong in a divided society. And how easily a society can be divided by (and I shudder as I write this) a "charismatic" populist leader who is prepared to pander to a specific common denominator

For Fuck's Sake America - I'd hoped for so much better than this of you


----------



## Yossarian (Sep 20, 2021)

A Breitbart columnist argues that leftists are aggressively pro-vaccination because they want to stop MAGA types getting vaccinated, thereby killing off conservative voters.

_I am strongly pro-vaccine and now believe that Biden, the media, Hollywood, and the left, in general, are deliberately being as nasty as possible as a way to use reverse psychology against Trump supporters.

They know that the uglier they get, the more unvaccinated Trump supporters will dig in and refuse to get vaccinated. Well, I think that's the plan. They're vaccinated. We're not. The unvaccinated are almost exclusively the ones dying._

He sounds insane, but he might be correct on why some Trump supporters are refusing to get vaccinated - I think a lot of them must have doubts on their deathbeds whether allowing the "China virus" to infect them and cause a slow, horrible, lonely death was a good way to "own the libs."


----------



## BigMoaner (Sep 20, 2021)

petee said:


> this one is more than averagely satisfying. i tried to copy a pull quote but my phone won't co-operate. be ready to punch your screen.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Better him than his victims is a great way to put it.


----------



## elbows (Sep 20, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> A Breitbart columnist argues that leftists are aggressively pro-vaccination because they want to stop MAGA types getting vaccinated, thereby killing off conservative voters.
> 
> _I am strongly pro-vaccine and now believe that Biden, the media, Hollywood, and the left, in general, are deliberately being as nasty as possible as a way to use reverse psychology against Trump supporters.
> 
> ...


Sounds like that columnist is the one desperately attempting to use reverse psychology, building a paranoid foundation upon which some of these chumps might actually get vaccinated.


----------



## Zapp Brannigan (Sep 20, 2021)

elbows said:


> Sounds like that columnist is the one desperately attempting to use reverse psychology, building a paranoid foundation upon which some of these chumps might actually get vaccinated.


For a pro-vaccine Breitbart reporter, that's a believable interpretation.  _Get the vaccine to own the libs._


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 21, 2021)

So, the "spanish flu" death toll milestone has now passed.


----------



## petee (Sep 22, 2021)




----------



## petee (Oct 1, 2021)

the joe mccarthy of the antimaskers


----------



## petee (Oct 4, 2021)

geraldo rivera even

_“Open-minded & inclusive, I’m friends with all kinds of people. But as we pass 700,000 #Covid dead, I have zero tolerance for anti-Vaxers,” Rivera tweeted on Saturday.

Rivera went a step further, saying he has particular disgust for “vaccinated d–k heads who urge the unvaccinated to ‘fight for their freedom,’ the mob urging the man on ledge to jump.” That comment may be a particular reference to some of the pundits at Fox News, where over 90% of staffers are vaccinated while its hosts like Tucker Carlson and Laura Ingraham spread anti-vaccine views on their progr_ams.









						Geraldo Rivera Calls Out ‘Vaccinated D–k Heads Who Urge the Unvaccinated to ‘Fight for Their Freedom’
					

"I have zero tolerance for anti-Vaxers," Fox News star says in apparent reference to Fox News colleagues




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 7, 2021)

Republican senator at South Carolina fundraising event: "If you haven't been vaccinated, you might maybe want to think about possibly getting the shot..."

Herman Cain Award contenders: "BOOOOOOOOOOO!"


----------



## petee (Oct 7, 2021)




----------



## Gin n tonic (Oct 7, 2021)

Lotta people here don't wanna get jabbed. I don't know why, but I think trump supporters in general are the guys who are more reluctant


----------



## BigMoaner (Oct 7, 2021)

Gin n tonic said:


> Lotta people here don't wanna get jabbed. I don't know why, but I think trump supporters in general are the guys who are more reluctant


It’s strange because I’d never associated trump supporters with fairly regularly being diet or full fat sociopathic, selfish, stupid assholes.


----------



## krtek a houby (Oct 7, 2021)

Gin n tonic said:


> Lotta people here don't wanna get jabbed. I don't know why, but I think trump supporters in general are the guys who are more reluctant


Really?


----------



## a_chap (Oct 7, 2021)

petee said:


>




A headline that you'd expect to find in The Onion, not in real life.   

What a fucked-up world.


----------



## petee (Oct 9, 2021)

another day ...









						Apple Store security guard stabbed over face mask dispute in NYC | CNN
					

A dispute over wearing a face mask led to the stabbing of an Apple Store security guard Friday, a spokesperson with the New York City Police Department told CNN.




					www.cnn.com
				




_A dispute over wearing a face mask led to the stabbing of an Apple Store security guard Friday, a spokesperson with the New York City Police Department told CNN._


----------



## Saul Goodman (Oct 10, 2021)

petee said:


> another day ...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


As if we needed more proof of how cuntish Apple fanboys are.


----------



## petee (Oct 11, 2021)

the kids are alright #3

(read the first reply too)


----------



## Dogsauce (Oct 14, 2021)

Decent Washington Post article which covers such things as political allegiances vs. vaccination status with graphs etc. They think vaccination refusal/hesitancy has lead to 90,000 deaths; Fox News etc. has a body count.





__





						How many thousands of people are choosing death over vaccination?
					





					www.msn.com
				




Compares deaths in Biden voting counties with Trump counties, though I suspect a decent proportion of the deaths in ‘Biden counties’ may still be Trumpists.


----------



## BigMoaner (Oct 15, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> Decent Washington Post article which covers such things as political allegiances vs. vaccination status with graphs etc. They think vaccination refusal/hesitancy has lead to 90,000 deaths; Fox News etc. has a body count.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


and 90% of fox employers have had hte vax!

the body count thing is not a strong enough meme. the biggest grifters should just be asked pointedly, by people and any media hostile to them "what's you're body count please?"

yes, imply that they are murderous. play that card. enough all ready.


----------



## Dogsauce (Oct 15, 2021)

BigMoaner said:


> and 90% of fox employers have had hte vax!
> 
> the body count thing is not a strong enough meme. the biggest grifters should just be asked pointedly, by people and any media hostile to them "what's you're body count please?"
> 
> yes, imply that they are murderous. play that card. enough all ready.


If you read the Herman Cain Award Reddit thread, it’s not surprising to see the same faces appearing in Facebook meme posts by the deceased. Candace Owens in particular has earned the nickname of ‘Angel of Death’ for her frequent appearances.


----------



## petee (Oct 15, 2021)

3 for 1:

anti vaxx
flat earth
preacher









						Anti-Vax Flat Earth Preacher Dies of COVID-19
					

Rob Skiba had been battling the virus since August, friends said.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 16, 2021)

petee said:


> 3 for 1:
> 
> anti vaxx
> flat earth
> ...


I was looking for a tear to squeeze
couldn't find one


----------



## Yossarian (Oct 16, 2021)

This story on the different kinds of unvaccinated Americans made some good points:

_Research on the unvaccinated by KFF from this September showed the most powerful predictor of who remained unvaccinated was not age, politics, race, income or location, but the lack of health insurance.

Countries with far higher rates of vaccination, Canada and Britain, have responded by mobilizing their greatest strength: a national health care system._

Also, on "Contagion':

_In the movie, fearful nurses walked off the job at the start of the pandemic, which begins to end as soon as vaccines become available, with people lining up eagerly for their turn.

The opposite happened in real life. Despite enormous personal risk, almost all health care workers stayed on the job in the first months of the Covid pandemic. Despite vaccines being widely available since spring in the United States, tens of thousands of people are dying every month because they chose not to be inoculated._









						Opinion | The Unvaccinated May Not Be Who You Think
					

Science can find a cure for our diseases but not for our societal ills.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## 2hats (Oct 16, 2021)

US will now accept any mix of FDA or WHO approved vaccines.








						U.S. will accept mixed doses of vaccines from international travelers
					

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) said late on Friday that it will accept mixed-dose coronavirus vaccines from international travelers, a boost to travelers from Canada and other places.




					www.reuters.com


----------



## petee (Oct 18, 2021)

i thought maybe i had the parameters of the anti-vaxx garbage clocked. i was wrong.

I'm a schoolteacher, we of course do contact teacing all the time. at least, here in NYC we do.

" “The teachers are not even allowed to do contact tracing. If they send Johnny home with COVID, they’re not allowed to call the parents that sit close to Johnny to tell them he has COVID,” she said. "

https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/h...udge/287-dad4b155-4b6a-4b4b-b1aa-ecabdbbf6a7c


----------



## petee (Oct 22, 2021)




----------



## petee (Oct 29, 2021)

high time eh.

_Eventually, Board President Marlys Davidson told Roupoli her time was up, according to public video of the meeting, and called up the next parent. Roupoli concluded, and Davidson mumbled under her breath "f--- you," which was picked up by her mic.

Attendees of the meeting, who had been applauding Roupoli moments before, fell into a stunned silence, along with the board.

_









						School board president curses at parent speaking against mask mandates
					

The moment was caught on video.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## NoXion (Oct 29, 2021)

Fuck mumbling under your breath, call them a fuckwit to their face.


----------



## petee (Oct 29, 2021)

NoXion said:


> Fuck mumbling under your breath, call them a fuckwit to their face.



that would be better, since it would clearly voice the thinking not just of yourself but of the whopping majority of us ovah heah, but get terrorized with death threats against your children as a result.


----------



## petee (Nov 3, 2021)

more capitalism than coronavirus









						A COVID-19 victim's body that was supposed to be used for medical research was dissected in front of a live audience in a hotel ballroom without the family's consent
					

The 98-year-old COVID-19 victim's body was dissected at a $500-a-ticket event at a hotel in Portland, Oregon, according to KING 5 News.




					www.insider.com


----------



## 8ball (Nov 3, 2021)

petee said:


> more capitalism than coronavirus
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No fucking words.


----------



## StoneRoad (Nov 4, 2021)

Not sure if the stats in this clipping about vaccinations are really a surprise, a bit saddening, maybe ?









						Atheists, agnostics and humanists much more likely than Christians to get COVID-19 vaccine
					

Atheists are more likely than the religious to be vaccinated against COVID-19, even as they grow in number and struggle to find acceptance in the U.S.




					eu.usatoday.com


----------



## cupid_stunt (Nov 4, 2021)

StoneRoad said:


> Not sure if the stats in this clipping about vaccinations are really a surprise, a bit saddening, maybe ?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It certainly doesn't surprise me that religious people, especially the evangelical types, are much less likely to be vaxxed over there, but seeing the effect in the fact that only 'close to 58 percent of the population have been vaccinated', is a bit shocking.


----------



## Yossarian (Nov 4, 2021)

cupid_stunt said:


> It certainly doesn't surprise me that religious people, especially the evangelical types, are much less likely to be vaxxed over there, but seeing the effect in the fact that only 'close to 58 percent of the population have been vaccinated', is a bit shocking.



It's indeed a bit shocking, but I think that's the figure the Johns Hopkins tracker gives for double-vaccinated people among the entire population, including children 5 to 11 who only became eligible a day or two ago - the equivalent figure for the UK is 68%, according to Johns Hopkins.


----------



## _Russ_ (Nov 4, 2021)

cupid_stunt said:


> It certainly doesn't surprise me that religious people, especially the evangelical types, are much less likely to be vaxxed over there, but seeing the effect in the fact that only 'close to 58 percent of the population have been vaccinated', is a bit shocking.


Doesnt shock me, there's a shit load of praise the lord and pass the hand grenade arseholes over there


----------



## Dogsauce (Nov 18, 2021)

Covid has killed more cops in the US than any other cause this year:









						2021
					

639 law enforcement officers were killed in the line of duty in 2021.




					www.odmp.org
				




”I can’t breathe”


----------



## Yossarian (Nov 18, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> Covid has killed more cops in the US than any other cause this year:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



They should have stopped resisting.


----------



## Raheem (Nov 18, 2021)

Yossarian said:


> They should have stopped resisting.


Should never have submitted to it in the first place.


----------



## High Voltage (Nov 26, 2021)

The States of America look set to break the 800,000 covid death toll very soon, possibly by this weekend, figures, again, from the ever reliable World-O-meter

From the same website the projections show February AND March next year as being two further highly significant milestones - and to further note the projections are actually lagging behind the death toll total so February and March may well be optimistic


----------



## Dogsauce (Nov 26, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> The States of America look set to break the 800,000 covid death toll very soon, possibly by this weekend, figures, again, from the ever reliable World-O-meter
> 
> From the same website the projections show February AND March next year as being two further highly significant milestones - and to further note the projections are actually lagging behind the death toll total so February and March may well be optimistic


If it hits a million all these dead anti-vaxx ’patriots’ will have truly owned Biden. What a fucking pointless sacrifice.


----------



## High Voltage (Nov 26, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> If it hits a million all these dead anti-vaxx ’patriots’ will have truly owned Biden. What a fucking pointless sacrifice.


I truly fear it's not an "if" - and you're absolutely right totally pointless


----------



## StoneRoad (Nov 26, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> I truly fear it's not an "if" - and you're absolutely right totally pointless



And, very largely, preventable ... if only these people would get the jabs.

The loss of GOP voters is, so far, insignificant on a national scale. Locally, maybe in some "marginal" counties, it could prove interesting if the deaths continue.


----------



## Dogsauce (Nov 26, 2021)

StoneRoad said:


> And, very largely, preventable ... if only these people would get the jabs.
> 
> The loss of GOP voters is, so far, insignificant on a national scale. Locally, maybe in some "marginal" counties, it could prove interesting if the deaths continue.


They know this, but are continuing to push vaccine hesitancy through media surrogates because they know it’s more damaging to the Democrats politically for Biden to be seen not to have got a grip on it, for him to avoid the victory over Covid bounce. 

They only have to keep it up until the mid-terms because if they can make modest gains there they will have control of the chambers and be able to obliterate his program, and use the lack of progress on it as a weapon come the next presidential. They know exactly what they’re doing, and losing a few hundred thousand voters is an acceptable price, especially as the families of the victims will likely blame hospital procedures, lack of invermectin etc. rather than their own suggestibility.


----------



## StoneRoad (Nov 26, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> They know this, but are continuing to push vaccine hesitancy through media surrogates because they know it’s more damaging to the Democrats politically for Biden to be seen not to have got a grip on it, for him to avoid the victory over Covid bounce.
> 
> They only have to keep it up until the mid-terms because if they can make modest gains there they will have control of the chambers and be able to obliterate his program, and use the lack of progress on it as a weapon come the next presidential. They know exactly what they’re doing, and losing a few hundred thousand voters is an acceptable price, especially as the families of the victims will likely blame hospital procedures, lack of invermectin etc. rather than their own suggestibility.



Exactly.


----------



## NoXion (Nov 28, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> They know this, but are continuing to push vaccine hesitancy through media surrogates because they know it’s more damaging to the Democrats politically for Biden to be seen not to have got a grip on it, for him to avoid the victory over Covid bounce.
> 
> They only have to keep it up until the mid-terms because if they can make modest gains there they will have control of the chambers and be able to obliterate his program, and use the lack of progress on it as a weapon come the next presidential. They know exactly what they’re doing, and losing a few hundred thousand voters is an acceptable price, especially as the families of the victims will likely blame hospital procedures, lack of invermectin etc. rather than their own suggestibility.



Except that they've already unleashed a beast that they can no longer control. The anti-vax, Qanon-shite has also got a life of its own now. The virus isn't going to stop killing Republican voters when the midterms have been and gone. The Qanon movement is starting to eat itself. And a lot can happen between now and the midterms.


----------



## Dogsauce (Nov 29, 2021)

NoXion said:


> Except that they've already unleashed a beast that they can no longer control. The anti-vax, Qanon-shite has also got a life of its own now. The virus isn't going to stop killing Republican voters when the midterms have been and gone. The Qanon movement is starting to eat itself. And a lot can happen between now and the midterms.


The US anti-vax demographic is way broader than Qanon loons, it’s also mainstream news channel stuff (Fox etc.), plus a smattering of new-age pillocks and also cautious types who are able to find enough justification through much-shared bullshit to discourage them from participating.  What‘s the vax rate, something like 67% overall? That’s almost a hundred million not jabbed, not all will be fruitcakes that they’ve lost control of. We may only see the kooky idiots because they’re the ones getting shared and laughed at, the everyday skeptics aren’t interesting enough to get pilloried on Twitter or wherever.

Even with over a million dead in the US, it’ll barely make a dent in the republican numbers as a lot will be offset by earlier waves affecting mostly urban communities. They’ll also gain more votes from people angry that Biden hasn’t been able to shut this shit down yet, frustrated with the persistence of shutdowns and mask mandates etc.  They have done the maths on this. Remember they’re evil, not stupid.


----------



## High Voltage (Nov 30, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> The States of America look set to break the 800,000 covid death toll very soon, possibly by this weekend, figures, again, from the ever reliable World-O-meter
> 
> From the same website the projections show February AND March next year as being two further highly significant milestones - and to further note the projections are actually lagging behind the death toll total so February and March may well be optimistic



Hit 800,904 on Monday - again figure from the ever reliable World-O-Meter web site


----------



## Dogsauce (Nov 30, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> Hit 800,904 on Monday - again figure from the ever reliable World-O-Meter web site


“Get a grip on it, Biden.”


See how that works?  Their deaths are not in vain.


----------



## 8ball (Nov 30, 2021)

I'm not convinced Biden has a grip on much of anything.
Not that this particular situation is of his own doing.


----------



## Yossarian (Dec 21, 2021)

"I've gathered you all closely together at the White House today to discuss this incredibly infectious new variant."


----------



## High Voltage (Dec 28, 2021)

High Voltage said:


> The States of America look set to break the 800,000 covid death toll very soon, possibly by this weekend, figures, again, from the ever reliable World-O-meter
> 
> From the same website the projections show February AND March next year as being two further highly significant milestones - and to further note the projections are actually lagging behind the death toll total so February and March may well be optimistic


Updated total from World-O-meter, as of yesterday, already 40% towards the next milestone

With new daily infection totals for the States of America and the Kingdom topping 300k 2022 is set to be "fun" 

Embarrassingly when the Kingdom's total is factored up to account for different population size we make America look positively marvellous


----------



## elbows (Dec 28, 2021)

Pressures on society, services and businesses caused by sheer number of cases mean that it is unsurprising to see that the USA decided to change the self-isolation timer periods. But they've done so without adding more testing to the mix, and they have indulged in stupid claims that the new guidance was "motivated by science"....









						Covid: US halves isolation time for asymptomatic infection
					

The guideline for asymptomatic cases is expected to ease disruptions caused by staff shortages.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## yield (Dec 30, 2021)

Uncounted: Inaccurate death certificates across the country hide the true toll of COVID-19
Mmissouri Independent. December 22, 2021


> In Cape Girardeau County, the coroner hasn’t pronounced a single person dead of COVID-19 in 2021.
> 
> Wavis Jordan, a Republican who was elected last year to serve as coroner of the 80,000-person county, says his office “doesn’t do COVID deaths.” He does not investigate deaths himself, and requires families to provide proof of a positive COVID-19 test before including it on a death certificate.





> Meanwhile, deaths at home attributed to conditions with symptoms that look a lot like COVID-19 — heart attacks, Alzheimer’s and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease — increased.
> 
> “When it comes to COVID, we don’t do a test,” Jordan said, “so we don’t know if someone has COVID or not.”


----------



## Dogsauce (Dec 30, 2021)

yield said:


> Uncounted: Inaccurate death certificates across the country hide the true toll of COVID-19
> Mmissouri Independent. December 22, 2021


That’s counterintuitive, as elsewhere Republican talking heads are actively discouraging vaccination in order to boost the death toll and prolong the pandemic so they can use it as a stick to beat Biden with. Hiding the deaths doesn’t help this agenda.


----------



## 8ball (Dec 30, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> That’s counterintuitive, as elsewhere Republican talking heads are actively discouraging vaccination in order to boost the death toll and prolong the pandemic so they can use it as a stick to beat Biden with. Hiding the deaths doesn’t help this agenda.



It's not as simple as all Republicans doing this, though.  Things aren't quite as simply split on those lines.  Republicans are generally older and a lot of them are pretty sane and pro-vaccine.


----------



## _Russ_ (Dec 30, 2021)

Not really, the prevailing Republican-wackos' takes on this range from it being not worth losing sleep over to not even existing, this fits perfectly with that narrative


----------



## High Voltage (Dec 31, 2021)

Bloody hell  572,000+ new infections YESTERDAY

Include France and the Kingdom and you're bouncing just short of 1 million

That's beside the new year spike

Figures, as always, from World-O-meter 

Happy 2022


----------



## Dogsauce (Dec 31, 2021)

8ball said:


> It's not as simple as all Republicans doing this, though.  Things aren't quite as simply split on those lines.  Republicans are generally older and a lot of them are pretty sane and pro-vaccine.


A significant minority, almost a third, have said they’re never getting a shot.









						1 In 5 Adults Still Reject Covid Vaccines, Poll Finds — Here Are The Biggest Groups Still Holding Out
					

Republicans, Americans living in rural areas and white evangelical Christians are among the groups most likely to reject the Covid-19 vaccine, according to the Kaiser Family Foundation.




					www.forbes.com
				




There’s also resistance to boosters on top of this number.

Those numbers will reduce as people watch friends and relatives die, although there’s a significant kickback at hospitals with many blaming deaths on the medical protocols used to treat the symptoms rather than the disease itself, leading to this kind of bollocks:


----------



## 8ball (Dec 31, 2021)

Dogsauce said:


> A significant majority, almost a third…



Bit of tea came out of my nose there.


----------



## Dogsauce (Dec 31, 2021)

8ball said:


> Bit of tea came out of my nose there.



Oops  

(I know what I meant to write, edited!)


----------



## StoneRoad (Jan 2, 2022)

Such a shame ... [not] ...









						Marjorie Taylor Greene: Twitter bans congresswoman over Covid misinformation
					

The congresswoman was suspended after tweeting falsely about high levels of vaccine related deaths.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				





taken twatter long enough


----------



## existentialist (Jan 2, 2022)

StoneRoad said:


> Such a shame ... [not] ...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"Rep Greene said the ban proved that the company is 'an enemy to America'."

This gun-totin' militarised nation seems to appear remarkably fragile in certain quarters, in the face of free speech, masks, vaccines, etc.


----------



## Dogsauce (Jan 2, 2022)

existentialist said:


> "Rep Greene said the ban proved that the company is 'an enemy to America'."
> 
> This gun-totin' militarised nation seems to appear remarkably fragile in certain quarters, in the face of free speech, masks, vaccines, etc.


Tbh I’m not particularly sorry if the bunch of absolute fucking hateful idiots who take her advice as gospel on Twitter find themselves tubed up in the ICU, it’s just all the others caught up by them spreading it around and effects on their families etc.


----------



## Yossarian (Jan 4, 2022)

The US reported 1,083,948 new cases Monday, more than doubling the previous world record, set the previous week - since that number includes cases not reported over the weekend, it's hopefully a record that will never be surpassed.


----------



## cupid_stunt (Jan 4, 2022)

High Voltage said:


> Bloody hell  572,000+ new infections YESTERDAY



Over a million new cases reported yesterday, and that doesn't include tests taken at home.  



> More than 1 million people in the US were diagnosed with Covid-19 on Monday, setting a new global daily record. A total of 1.06 million people across the US tested positive with the virus, a figure driven largely by the Omicron variant, data from Johns Hopkins University reveals. Monday’s number is almost double the previous record of about 590,000 set just four days ago in the US, which itself was a doubling from the prior week.
> 
> Many Americans are relying on tests they take at home, with results that aren’t reported to official government authorities leading some to suggest the new record is a significant under-estimate. However delays in reporting over the holidays may have also played a role in the rising rates.











						Italy reports record 170,844 cases and 259 deaths; fourth jab gives five-fold antibody boost, study says – as it happened
					

There were 12,912 people in hospital in Italy; Israel PM says study shows safety of fourth dose and increase in antibodies a week after jab




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## elbows (Jan 4, 2022)

In some of the previous waves, America, its experts and its media have tended to have a very different attitude towards the reporting of hospitalised children. They use it as part of the big narrative and to influence behaviours and attitudes, in a manner very very different to the likes of the UK where it nearly always remains off the radar.

Has anybody noticed that happening this time too? I havent had a chance to look yet, but I will at some point.


----------



## zahir (Jan 4, 2022)

elbows said:


> In some of the previous waves, America, its experts and its media have tended to have a very different attitude towards the reporting of hospitalised children. They use it as part of the big narrative and to influence behaviours and attitudes, in a manner very very different to the likes of the UK where it nearly always remains off the radar.
> 
> Has anybody noticed that happening this time too? I havent had a chance to look yet, but I will at some point.



See this thread:


----------



## zahir (Jan 4, 2022)

UK figures for comparison:


----------



## 8ball (Jan 4, 2022)

Dogsauce said:


> Oops
> 
> (I know what I meant to write, edited!)



Yeah, and granted, a significant minority of older Republicans are anti-vaxx, but that leaves the rest.
Just thought there needed a little balance adding because I've watched vids with Republicans and the like being very pro-vaccine and depairing at many of their compatriots.

Your pic from that hospital really makes me fucking despair.


----------



## elbows (Jan 5, 2022)

Thanks for the data above.

And yes, here we are again. As far as I know the Guardian doesnt tend to consider writing equivalent articles for UK covid child data & quotes from relevant people in the healthcare system, its like a strangely different world.









						Covid hospitalizations among US children soar as schools under pressure
					

Average of 672 children being hospitalized every day in the US as of 2 January, fueled by the Omicron variant and the holidays




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## zahir (Jan 5, 2022)

elbows - here are today's figures for England. The high rates of hospitalisation of 0-5s look consistent across different countries.


----------



## 8ball (Jan 5, 2022)

zahir said:


> elbows - here are today's figures for England. The high rates of hospitalisation of 0-5s look consistent across different countries.




That's quite a gradient on the right of that curve there...


----------



## zahir (Jan 6, 2022)

elbows said:


> In some of the previous waves, America, its experts and its media have tended to have a very different attitude towards the reporting of hospitalised children. They use it as part of the big narrative and to influence behaviours and attitudes, in a manner very very different to the likes of the UK where it nearly always remains off the radar.
> 
> Has anybody noticed that happening this time too? I havent had a chance to look yet, but I will at some point.



A good example here.


----------



## Badgers (Jan 8, 2022)

Texas teacher 'locked Covid-positive son in car boot'
					

A witness reportedly called police after hearing someone in the trunk of the Texas woman's vehicle.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## bimble (Jan 8, 2022)

this is the actual twitter account of the Republican Party in Texas. That country is so fucked.


----------



## Carvaged (Jan 8, 2022)

I have family in NYC. They caught covid (despite boosters) over the Holidays. Has been just like a mild cold for them (they're early '40s). Strangely though my brother developed it quickly after (likely) exposure from a restaurant during the early part of the Omicron outbreak over there. Aside from that they both WFH, wear masks everywhere and rarely go out except to walk doggo. They slept in separate bedrooms and had 2 HEPA filter airpurifiers blowing all day in their apartment to reduce the risk of wife catching it, and it seemed she was safe. However she finally developed symptoms and went positive on LFTs about 8-9 days _after_ my brother had gone clear on LFTs. So either a very long gestation period for the virus in her, or he was still infectious? They're both a bit confused by that, as neither had gone anywhere (self-isolation) to catch it from anyone else after my brother first became infected.


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Jan 8, 2022)

Carvaged said:


> I have family in NYC. They caught covid (despite boosters) over the Holidays. Has been just like a mild cold for them (they're early '40s). Strangely though my brother developed it quickly after (likely) exposure from a restaurant during the early part of the Omicron outbreak over there. Aside from that they both WFH, wear masks everywhere and rarely go out except to walk doggo. They slept in separate bedrooms and had 2 HEPA filter airpurifiers blowing all day in their apartment to reduce the risk of wife catching it, and it seemed she was safe. However she finally developed symptoms and went positive on LFTs about 8-9 days _after_ my brother had gone clear on LFTs. So either a very long gestation period for the virus in her, or he was still infectious? They're both a bit confused by that, as neither had gone anywhere (self-isolation) to catch it from anyone else after my brother first became infected.


The symptoms/infection appearing/developping timeline is a bell curve, the original 14 days isolation covered the top of the bell curve meaning it would catch "most" people having been infected, the average is 5.6 days (original and best Wuhan strain).

But then you get the outliers who only show positivity/develop enough of an infection to be detected anywhere up to (IIRC) 30 days later (only about 1 in  100 person). 

I think one of the NZ outbreak was from someone who developped symptoms a couple of weeks after their 14 days quarantine after arriving in the country.

Omicron average symptom showing at the moment seem to be taking an average of 3 days to appear so faster than the original strain but there will still be outliers.

Also: after testing negative on LFT you will probably still be emitting some, just not enough for the test to catch them. So your sister in law probably just slowly caught more and more virions and they slowly reproduced inside her until she showed symptoms later than expected.


----------



## Yossarian (Jan 11, 2022)

Yossarian said:


> The US reported 1,083,948 new cases Monday, more than doubling the previous world record, set the previous week - since that number includes cases not reported over the weekend, it's hopefully a record that will never be surpassed.



I definitely called that one wrong - and as elsewhere, the true number of new infections is probably much higher.


----------



## zahir (Jan 11, 2022)




----------



## extra dry (Jan 14, 2022)

13 minute interview with ICU nurses and doctors in the states, looks like the wave really got going after halloween,


----------



## elbows (Jan 14, 2022)

Something a bit different.









						US man who faked death found alive in Glasgow
					

Nicholas Rossi, using the alias Arthur Knight, was arrested in hospital while being treated for Covid.



					www.bbc.co.uk


----------



## petee (Jan 19, 2022)

the kids are alright, pt 3 i think.
some are pretty smart too.









						Why a suburban teen went to Philly to get his COVID-19 vaccine
					

Now, he’s on a mission to help young people like him get access to the shot.




					whyy.org


----------



## elbows (Jan 19, 2022)

Dear oh dear.



> On Monday, Ingraham introduced a section of her show called Positively Boosted, in which she gleefully recounts which vaccinated public figures have tested positive.
> 
> Clapping and smiling, she said: “Triple-vaxxed joint chiefs chairman Mark Milley, our favorite Mark Milley, tested positive for Covid yesterday.











						Fox News host Laura Ingraham’s glee at general’s Covid diagnosis sparks outrage
					

Rightwing presenter called a ‘merchant of death’ after mockingly applauding as she revealed Gen Mark Milley’s positive test




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## NoXion (Jan 19, 2022)

The point behind the vaccinations is and has always been to prevent serious illness and hospitalisation. In that regard they are very successful. You have to have some serious co-morbidities in order to die from a breakthrough case.

Meanwhile, otherwise healthy unvaccinated people are largely the ones clogging up the ICUs in the US.


----------



## HAL9000 (Jan 19, 2022)

Biden to give away 400 million N95 masks starting next week
					

WASHINGTON (AP) — The Biden administration will begin making 400 million N95 masks  available for free to U.S.




					apnews.com


----------



## High Voltage (Jan 26, 2022)

Just in time for the States of America to pass the next milestone of 900k deaths - currently standing at just shy of 895k as of yesterday . . . figures, as always, from the ever reliable World-o-Meter









						United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info


----------



## Dogsauce (Jan 26, 2022)

They’ve added that latest 100,000 very quickly. Red state refuseniks at a guess, dying to own Biden.


----------



## High Voltage (Jan 27, 2022)

The latest covid death toll has just clicked over the 900,000 mark as of today

Figure from, as previous, the ever reliable World-O-meters


----------



## Cloo (Jan 27, 2022)

Had an interesting and actually fairly civil exchange with some Americans who were very 'Mask wearing is so hard and antisocial and it's enough, can't just vulnerable people stay wearing them?' and had the thought that I wonder, do Americans culturally find masks harder than the more reticent British? 

British anti-maskers don't really talk about the 'communication' side as much, but then we don't stop and have a chat at the bus stop and supermarket queues, while Americans are much more likely to, and I can see masks are not helpful for those sorts of interactions that we Brits hate so much on the rare occasions they happen.


----------



## 8ball (Jan 27, 2022)

Cloo said:


> Had an interesting and actually fairly civil exchange with some Americans who were very 'Mask wearing is so hard and antisocial and it's enough, can't just vulnerable people stay wearing them?' and had the thought that I wonder, do Americans culturally find masks harder than the more reticent British?
> 
> British anti-maskers don't really talk about the 'communication' side as much, but then we don't stop and have a chat at the bus stop and supermarket queues, while Americans are much more likely to, and I can see masks are not helpful for those sorts of interactions that we Brits hate so much on the rare occasions they happen.



I’m not sure I recognise much of that.  Have heard plenty from people here saying how the masks impede communication (a definite point from anti-maskers, but it seems accepted by everyone ime).  

Are you from London?  Not wanting to resort to stereotypes but that could explain it.. 

Also, when I was last in America the barman said he could tell me and my colleague were British even before he heard our accents because our demeanour was so much more sociable than most people he serves (he was also British).  To be fair, Princeton did have an oddly ‘offish’ vibe, and the States as a whole don’t feel as friendly as they did 20 years ago.

I think one error from the Americans you spoke to was that it’s not so much vulnerable people that should be wearing them as symptomatic people (at least if we’re talking about fairly basic masks).


----------



## Dogsauce (Jan 29, 2022)

A cop who was fired for not taking the vaccine and had a massive rant about it that went viral, leading to appearances on Fox etc. and being feted by the usual idiots, has succumbed to the virus.

The full cautionary tale here:









						Robert Lamay, 50, Naches, WA, Ex-State Trooper, Anti-vaxxer, dead from COVID
					

UPDATE(1/28/22): Robert who quit his job rather than get vaccinated is dead from COVID. see below Orginal Post (1/23/2022): According to an insider tip to SAV, Robert is in the hospital on a CPAP with COVID. Robert gained national attention when, after he was fired as a Washington State Trooper...




					www.sorryantivaxxer.com


----------



## elbows (Jan 31, 2022)




----------



## Yossarian (Feb 2, 2022)

Another 3,622 deaths recorded in the US Monday, making it one of the worst days of the pandemic - cumulative deaths as a proportion of the population have now passed Britain and Belgium, but none of it seems to have had any effect on vaccination rates.


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## Dogsauce (Feb 2, 2022)

At some point I guess the Republican Party will apply the brakes and stop their media mouthpieces spreading vaccine doubt. Maybe after the mid terms?  They know they can cripple Biden as long as this shit keeps running, and depress his popularity by forcing the government to apply counter measures such as masks, lockdowns and vaccine mandates.


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## StoneRoad (Feb 2, 2022)

Would be too much to hope that the anti-mask & anti-vaxx attitude of the republicans will remove, via covid, enough of their supporters from the gene & voting pools to make a difference, won't it ?


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 2, 2022)

Dogsauce said:


> At some point I guess the Republican Party will apply the brakes and stop their media mouthpieces spreading vaccine doubt. Maybe after the mid terms?  They know they can cripple Biden as long as this shit keeps running, and depress his popularity by forcing the government to apply counter measures such as masks, lockdowns and vaccine mandates.



I'm not sure it works that way round tbh, and certainly not that simply. From what I can gather most Republicans are falling over each other to get the approval of the far more rabid media and the Trumpist base. Who would make that 'back off' call?


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## StoneRoad (Feb 2, 2022)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> I'm not sure it works that way round tbh, and certainly not that simply. From what I can gather most Republicans are falling over each other to get the approval of the far more rabid media and the Trumpist base. Who would make that 'back off' call?


TxXxp got booed when at a rally he suggested the audience should get vaxx'd ...


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 2, 2022)

StoneRoad said:


> TxXxp got booed when at a rally he suggested the audience should get vaxx'd ...



Well quite. If he can't call off his own dogs I don't see the Republican establishment being able to do it. There'll probably be plenty of them fancying being even more Trumpy than Trump though.


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## littlebabyjesus (Feb 2, 2022)

Yossarian said:


> Another 3,622 deaths recorded in the US Monday, making it one of the worst days of the pandemic - cumulative deaths as a proportion of the population have now passed Britain and Belgium, but none of it seems to have had any effect on vaccination rates.
> 
> 
> View attachment 308384


Couple of things about that. 

First, the deaths in December are mostly Delta deaths rather than Omicron ones. 

Second, since delta has been eclipsed by omicron, we're seeing excess deaths numbers around Europe plummet, often to negative values - the week ending 14 Jan saw minus 1,000 or so excess deaths in England. It's a bit of a curious one - Covid deaths up, but overall deaths down. It's not just displacing delta, it also appears to be largely suppressing the spread of other viral infections at the moment. 

In the US, excess deaths are still running positive, but look like they're also falling. The overall picture may not be quite as bad as the raw figures used to produce those graphs make it seem. 

England excess deaths:
Microsoft Power BI

Europe excess deaths:

Graphs and maps from EUROMOMO

World excess deaths:

Tracking covid-19 excess deaths across countries


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## Dogsauce (Feb 2, 2022)

America gets hit hard because it has high levels of obesity, which is a big comorbidity with Covid. That and the low level of vaccine uptake, especially as this low level often combines with people unwilling to take other precautions either, and how this is sometimes focused in particular areas (Republican districts mostly).

Is it also correct to say that although omicron is milder than previous variants, it’s still on a par with the original virus that still killed tens of thousands?  It’s only vaccination making it ‘mild’ for most people, if you’re unjabbed and have comorbidities then it can still take you out.


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## elbows (Feb 2, 2022)

littlebabyjesus said:


> Second, since delta has been eclipsed by omicron, we're seeing excess deaths numbers around Europe plummet, often to negative values - the week ending 14 Jan saw minus 1,000 or so excess deaths in England. It's a bit of a curious one - Covid deaths up, but overall deaths down. It's not just displacing delta, it also appears to be largely suppressing the spread of other viral infections at the moment.



I'll return to USA stuff later, but in regards excess deaths in England, please note that for 2022 the ONS decided to move on from comparing current deaths to the 2015-2019 average and to include 2021 (but not 2020) in those averages. This blog post discusses that, although I feel they downplay the extent to which the early months of 2021 affect that calculation due to a bad wave at the time: Understanding excess deaths during a pandemic | National Statistical

I often work round that stuff to an extent by looking at total deaths from all causes and not just what the authorities deem to be excess deaths. I'd say that 2022 so far still does not stick out hugely, but treat this as a vague comment for now because I havent analysed things properly recently.

The interplay between different viruses is poorly understood (including our rather simplistic understanding of the immune system) but you really shouldnt attribute attribute everything seen to the virus itself, dont forget about human behaviour and measures such as masks. Some of these measures may have a greater effect on other viruses than they do the recent highly transmissible strains of covid. I know you have your own beliefs about how much difference masks etc actually make, but even if this leads you to remove such factors from the picture, there are other factors too - for example changes to the proportions of people dying at home, in hospital and in care homes are still apparent at this stage of the pandemic, and we might expect some of those to make a difference to the spread of other respiratory viruses within vulnerable populations during winter. If less people than 'normal' are in care homes then there is less opportunity for as many people as 'normal' to be finished off by institutional outbreaks of winter respiratory disease. Likewise hospitals. And even if numbers in those settings arent very different to normal, attention to general infection control measures in those settings are still massively heightened at the moment compared to pre-pandemic times.


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## elbows (Feb 2, 2022)

Also our view of UK death also gets distorted by the fact Covid gets most of the attention. For example here is a weekly picture from one of the weekly ONS spreadsheets, the link to which I unfortunately dont have to hand right now:


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## elbows (Feb 2, 2022)

Dogsauce said:


> America gets hit hard because it has high levels of obesity, which is a big comorbidity with Covid. That and the low level of vaccine uptake, especially as this low level often combines with people unwilling to take other precautions either, and how this is sometimes focused in particular areas (Republican districts mostly).
> 
> Is it also correct to say that although omicron is milder than previous variants, it’s still on a par with the original virus that still killed tens of thousands?  It’s only vaccination making it ‘mild’ for most people, if you’re unjabbed and have comorbidities then it can still take you out.


Yes.

littlebabyjesus is not talking 100% shit about Omicron relative to Delta, but he overstates the point in a way that makes a mockery of the actual levels of death seen in January in the USA due to Omicron.


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## elbows (Feb 2, 2022)

What I'm unlikely to be able to find is nice tidy data that completely obliterates his point in full, it will just erode it. Omicron still kills, and when you have a ridiculous number of infections it will still lead to high numbers. Its a combination of the inherent properties of Omicron plus vaccination (including timely booster campaigns) plus prior infection that has allowed some countries to have a much smaller wave of death this time. Some of those successes are more limited in the USA, and the results are grim.

Likewise when their deaths fall substantially it will be via a combination of things - more of the most vulnerable and unvaccinated will already be dead or develop natural immunity, the severity of the wave will have led to behavioural changes, the number of new infections will have dropped substantially, hospitals wont be as overwhelmed, weather-related health burdens will reduce, the last dregs of Delta may be much reduced, etc etc. But in the meantime, there are plenty of news stories from January about how the highly transmissive Omicron wave causes big problems.

Some of these articles acknowledge the complex detail, including the sort of things that mean littlebabyjesus is not 100% wrong, but the USA is an example of why care should be taken to understand the difference between 'Omicron is milder' and 'Omicron is mild'. And those differences matter especially during the explosive growth stage of the Omicron wave, where the bad news details of Omicron can still outweigh the positives aspects of Omicron compared to Delta. Over time the balance will likely shift and the more positive aspects of reduced Omicron severity could still lead the USA to something more closely resembling the better picture seen in a bunch of other countries, but in the meantime there is no point denying how horrible their numbers have been recently.



			https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2022-01-28/omicron-drives-us-deaths-higher-than-in-falls-delta-wave
		










						US faces wave of omicron deaths in coming weeks, models say
					

The fast-moving omicron variant may cause less severe disease on average, but COVID-19 deaths in the U.S. are climbing and modelers forecast 50,000 to 300,000 more Americans could die by the time the wave subsides in mid-March.




					apnews.com


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## elbows (Feb 2, 2022)

For example, the positive aspects of Omicron managed to result in USA intensive care numbers only matching rather than exceeding levels seen in previous waves. And the 'good news' side of Omicron will show up more clearly if the drop that has begun is sustained and rapid and gets the numbers down to a level they havent previously managed to fall below during the entire pandemic so far.









						Number of COVID-19 patients in intensive care (ICU)
					

An interactive visualization from Our World in Data.




					ourworldindata.org
				






We can also contrast this with countries that have had better vaccine uptake, but have also done more to control previous waves via non-pharmaceutical measures in the past, but arent bothering with as many of those things this time around with Omicron. For example I am keeping a close eye on Israel this time, for reasons the following intensive care graph and death graph should demonstrate. Again, unpicking all the relevant factors perfectly isnt easy, and we need to consider the huge number of infections, limited counter measures, and unknowns in regards stuff like booster programme timing and any possible waning of protection against severe disease and death. But this is certainly an example where the benefits of vaccination and Omicrons inherent properties are used up via the sheer number of infections that have been allowed to occur, leading to new heights of daily death. Some of the daily death increase is likely down to higher levels of 'incidental' covid death, something that is inevitable in a wave with such a large numbers of infections, but plenty of them are still real Covid deaths.


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## littlebabyjesus (Feb 2, 2022)

elbows said:


> Yes.
> 
> littlebabyjesus is not talking 100% shit about Omicron relative to Delta, but he overstates the point in a way that makes a mockery of the actual levels of death seen in January in the USA due to Omicron.


The point is that looking at excess deaths gives the overall situation in the northern hemisphere winter.

It was bad with delta - steady excess death wherever there was any heightened level of covid infection. The UK is a good example - six months of low-ish but persistent excess deaths at or a little above the headline covid death figures. But from January, one has to be careful with one's figures - because omicron has changed things very significantly. While the figure 'covid deaths' has risen a little in the UK in January, the figure for excess deaths has plummeted well below zero for the first time since July.

The numbers in the US do appear to be going in a similar direction even with high numbers of covid deaths. Similar patterns are appearing across Europe.


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## elbows (Feb 2, 2022)

littlebabyjesus said:


> The point is that looking at excess deaths gives the overall situation in the northern hemisphere winter.
> 
> It was bad with delta - steady excess death wherever there was any heightened level of covid infection. The UK is a good example - six months of low-ish but persistent excess deaths at or a little above the headline covid death figures. But from January, one has to be careful with one's figures - because omicron has changed things very significantly. While the figure 'covid deaths' has risen a little in the UK in January, the figure for excess deaths has plummeted well below zero for the first time since July.
> 
> The numbers in the US do appear to be going in a similar direction even with high numbers of covid deaths. Similar patterns are appearing across Europe.


In one of my posts today I already advised you to take into account the change to which years were part of the 5 year average for England & Wales.

Also look at total deaths from all causes, not just the calculated excess, because the threshold for what counts as normal is higher during these winter months. This results in phenomenon such as the 'figure for excess deaths plummeting below zero' at the same time that actual total deaths has not actually fallen compared to the previous weeks and months.

eg on the following graph we can see the total deaths and where the average is set for each week - the average spikes upwards in January so a similar amount of death as before is suddenly below that average rather than above it.


From Deaths registered weekly in England and Wales, provisional - Office for National Statistics

But as I already said this doesnt completely demolish all of your points in their entirety which is why I addressed various points in previous posts. It is certainly true for example that we havent seen a big death spike like we did a year ago. And the ratio of deaths to cases is different with Omicron, so we've been able to have a huge case wave without the increase in deaths tracking along to the same extent as seen in the past. But the USA is a demonstration of the limits of quite how far this can be relied upon, of how much vaccines still matter, and of how much death Omicron can still bring. The fall in deaths in the USA will be driven by the fall in cases, plus some of what you go on about in terms of Delta being largely removed from the scene.

edit - I since had reason to go on about some ONS data in the following UK thread with some quotes that demonstrate the difference between whats considered a normal level of death at this point in the year using the version of the average they are now using which includes 2021 (but not 2020) and the previous average they used which didnt have any pandemic years in it. This makes a difference to what counts as an excess death:        #46,190


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## Yuwipi Woman (Feb 10, 2022)

Wasn't sure where to put this.  This data doesn't reflect covid numbers, but I can't think 2021 numbers show a different pattern than this.  Newer numbers might even show the pattern more fully.   Its further proof that zip code matters:



> The majority of U.S. states with the lowest life expectancies in 2019 were in the South, according to a Centers for Disease Control and Prevention report published Thursday.
> 
> The report, from the CDC's National Center for Health Statistics, ranked all 50 states and Washington, D.C., in order of residents' life expectancies in the year before the pandemic took hold. The results showed that Mississippi had the country's lowest life expectancy, at 74.4 years, which was significantly below the national average of 78.8. Hawaii, meanwhile, had the highest: 80.9 years.
> 
> ...







__





						Mississippi had lowest life expectancy in U.S. in 2019, while Hawaii's was highest, report shows
					





					www.msn.com
				




Here is the full report:



			https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr70/nvsr70-18.pdf
		


We're supposedly the richest country on earth, but large numbers of people regularly die from poverty.


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## High Voltage (Mar 5, 2022)

With the usual caveat that these figures are from the ever reliable World-O-meters

The States of America are still head and shoulders out in front on total cases and deaths, but are either no longer reporting all new cases or new case level are dropping significantly and other countries (interestingly Germany) seem to be having 200k new cases per day

However they are still, today, topping the daily deaths total and are edging ever closer to the one million mark (83% of the way there as of the 4th of March)


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## High Voltage (Mar 11, 2022)

By this time next week the one million deaths from covid total will almost certainly have been passed

Think about that for a moment

ONE
MILLION
COVID
DEATHS


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## High Voltage (Mar 13, 2022)

Figures, as always, from the every reliable World-O-Meter - 993,693 as of yesterday









						United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info
				




Or another, slightly less optimistic take on the numbers, the States of America appear to be through the one million dead mark


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## High Voltage (Mar 24, 2022)

And they're through the 1 million mark as of yesterday









						United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer
					

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.




					www.worldometers.info
				




Trying to take positives where possible and again, ALL my data comes from World-O-Meter web site

Total Cases: Obviously, the States of America have been way out in from almost straight out of the gate, more than then next two countries combined
New Cases: the States of America haven't been No. 1 for several days / weeks now and their total has been dropping considerably
New Deaths: the States of America were still No. 1 with 771 yesterday but the overall death total has been dropping

But ONE MILLION DEATHS


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## elbows (Mar 24, 2022)

They were better at directly counting the deaths than some other large, badly affected countries, so they likely arent really the only members of the grim one million deaths pandemic club.

For example when estimating excess deaths due to covid, India might have had in the region of 4 million, and Russia over a million. ( DEFINE_ME )


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## Yossarian (Mar 24, 2022)

Dogsauce said:


> Is it also correct to say that although omicron is milder than previous variants, it’s still on a par with the original virus that still killed tens of thousands?  It’s only vaccination making it ‘mild’ for most people, if you’re unjabbed and have comorbidities then it can still take you out.



Yep, I think the figures from recent weeks in Hong Kong, where a lot of older people are unvaccinated, shows that omicron is only "milder" when compared to the delta variant, not earlier strains.


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## prunus (Mar 24, 2022)

Dogsauce said:


> America gets hit hard because it has high levels of obesity, which is a big comorbidity with Covid. That and the low level of vaccine uptake, especially as this low level often combines with people unwilling to take other precautions either, and how this is sometimes focused in particular areas (Republican districts mostly).
> 
> Is it also correct to say that although omicron is milder than previous variants, it’s still on a par with the original virus that still killed tens of thousands?  It’s only vaccination making it ‘mild’ for most people, if you’re unjabbed and have comorbidities then it can still take you out.



I _think_ I’ve read analyses that suggest it is milder than delta and alpha, but more virulent than wild type (such analyses are necessarily imprecise because of the difficulty of untangling vaccine- or infection-acquired immunity and cross-immunity effects, but…).   So it’s probably fair, albeit liable to be misleading, to say it’s milder than other _variants_, wild-type not being a variant.


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## Yossarian (Mar 24, 2022)

In Florida, which has been averaging well over 100 COVID deaths a day, they're now only reporting data once every two weeks, and this state department of health spokesman seems insanely gleeful about it.


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## NoXion (May 11, 2022)

EXCLUSIVE: "Non-COVID" Excess Death Rates Ran 21x Higher In Reddest Counties Than Bluest In 2021
					

UPDATE: I somehow forgot to include a few paragraphs regarding the state-based data at the end of this entry; these have been added. As many others have noted, the actual COVID death toll, both here in the United States and around the world, is almost...




					www.dailykos.com
				




Maybe that's why they want more unwanted babies, they need more miseducated bodies to work themselves to death for them.


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