# Antic (Dogstar owners) opening Effra Social, a new family pub next to Hootananny



## Not a Pleb (Oct 3, 2012)

Application here.

The company that runs the Dogstar and dozens of other South London pubs is to open a new venue at 89 Effra Road (next door but one from the Hootananny).

We might as well just turn Brixton into one large pub.

Faith Boardman (former chief executive of Lambeth Council and now an advisor to the Mayor's Office for Policing and Crime) explained to the Mayor of London on Monday how disappointed she was with the way crime is increasing in Lambeth when compared with Southwark. The deputy Mayor thinks it's due to differences in Licensing, among other things.

Webcast here. She starts talking at about 22 minutes.


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## boohoo (Oct 3, 2012)

That's not good news for the Hoot (or local residents!)


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## Badgers (Oct 3, 2012)

We were worried about all the pubs closing a while back. You won't hear this place over the Hoot but a lot more people/rubbish about.


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## magneze (Oct 3, 2012)

What's there at the moment?


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## tarannau (Oct 3, 2012)

Conservative Club. A massive sprawling tardis that even had a few snooker tables at the back in a 'smaller' room iirc.


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## Badgers (Oct 3, 2012)

tarannau said:
			
		

> Conservative Club. A massive sprawling tardis that even had a few snooker tables at the back in a 'smaller' room iirc.



That looks like an abandoned building playing host to an abandoned graffiti covered old van. It will be a sorry loss to the area.


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## tarannau (Oct 3, 2012)

Weird place. People occasionally used to talk excitedly about the venue - random taxi drivers used to retell debauched tales in the sprawling maze of rooms back in the day - but few ever visited or even saw anyone enter. It was like the WIlly Wonka factory of Brixton, albeit with the oompah loompahs on the outside usually.

Still, I guess advertising a Conservative club in Brixton was always unlikely in recent years, but word of mouth clearly failed those popular tories.


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## Rushy (Oct 3, 2012)

They are also opening one in old Babalou / Bah Humbug, I believe.


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## paolo (Oct 3, 2012)

There was some kind party thing going on near the hoot the other night. Am now assuming it must have been in the old conservative club.

Maybe it got cracked already


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 3, 2012)

There was some discussion of this a few days ago on the Chitter Chatter thread, along with links to planning and licensing docs etc:

http://www.urban75.net/forums/threa...t-september-2012.298589/page-19#post-11557739


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## editor (Oct 3, 2012)

Let me change this title because it's not the Dogstar opening the venue, it's Antic.


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## editor (Oct 3, 2012)

That's going to kick off a ton of protests from locals no?

Or is it wonderfully soundproofed? It is set a fair way back from the road and fabulously poised to entice the queues at Hootananny.


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## editor (Oct 3, 2012)

From crispy:



> The "Effra Social" would be a pub by the looks of things. Midnight/1am closing times. No dancing.
> http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...-B86D-6A45E1E406EE/0/Application_Prem1616.pdf


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## Not a Pleb (Oct 3, 2012)

editor said:


> Let me change this title because it's not the Dogstar opening the venue, it's Antic.


I thought it was the same people. Who runs the Dogstar then?


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## editor (Oct 3, 2012)

Not a Pleb said:


> I thought it was the same people. Who runs the Dogstar then?


The updated title covers it.


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 3, 2012)

Pubs seem to be going the same way as supermarkets. Lots of smaller/independent operations close down, especially those in residential areas and/or slightly out of the town centre (Loughborough Hotel, Paulet Arms, Prince of Sardinia, George IV, Angel, Warrior, Green Man, Sun & Doves etc etc) and then a few years later the big boys move in (Pub Co's - the only ones with enough investment to make it work) and repopulate the empty properties. Whether we actually get a better or more diverse range of pubs in the longer term is questionable.


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## Not a Pleb (Oct 3, 2012)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Pubs seem to be going the same way as supermarkets. Lots of smaller/independent operations close down, especially those in residential areas and/or slightly out of the town centre (Loughborough Hotel, Paulet Arms, Prince of Sardinia, George IV, Angel, Warrior, Green Man, Sun & Doves etc etc) and then a few years later the big boys move in (Pub Co's - the only ones with enough investment to make it work) and repopulate the empty properties. Whether we actually get a better or more diverse range of pubs in the longer term is questionable.


Pubs are more diverse than coffee shops.


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## editor (Oct 3, 2012)

Not a Pleb said:


> Pubs are more diverse than coffee shops.


I'd agree with that.


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 3, 2012)

I'm all for a new boozer over a new coffee shop, yessirree. We've lost so many local pubs over the past 15 years it's good that the balance is being redressed slightly.

I do worry a bit however that Brixton on a Saturday night is getting more like Clapham High Street on a Saturday night. Have you ever seen Clapham at night? Fucking rammed with 20somethings puking on the pavement, broken glass all over the place, fighting, people staggering into the road in front of cars etc etc....  As long as we don't get to that, I'm happy with more pubs in Brixton.


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## Rushy (Oct 3, 2012)

Brixton Hatter said:


> I'm all for a new boozer over a new coffee shop, yessirree. We've lost so many local pubs over the past 15 years it's good that the balance is being redressed slightly.
> 
> I do worry a bit however that Brixton on a Saturday night is getting more like Clapham High Street on a Saturday night. Have you ever seen Clapham at night? Fucking rammed with 20somethings puking on the pavement, broken glass all over the place, fighting, people staggering into the road in front of cars etc etc....  As long as we don't get to that, I'm happy with more pubs in Brixton.


I think this scenario is quite likely. Lambeth does not appear to have a plan to avoid it.


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## editor (Oct 3, 2012)

There is definitely increasing drunken ladishness afoot of a Saturday night but newer bars like Kaff, Craft Bar and the Crown aren't part of that at least.


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 3, 2012)

Rushy said:


> They are also opening one in old Babalou / Bah Humbug, I believe.


Interesting. I understand the trustees of St Matthews are desperate for tenants. They've been advertising Mass/the offices etc for events, conferences and meeting rooms etc.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 4, 2012)

Antic/Dogstar owners have also taken over the Sun and Doves.  Saw a load of builders there this morning and asked them.


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## Crispy (Oct 4, 2012)

Yep. "The Sun of Camberwell" is the new name


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## colacubes (Oct 4, 2012)

editor said:


> There is definitely increasing drunken ladishness afoot of a Saturday night but newer bars like Kaff, Craft Bar and the Crown aren't part of that at least.


 
In the last 18 months or so I've been woken up on Friday/Saturday nights by more fights/drunken screaming matches etc than I ever have been in all the time I've lived here.  It really is starting to happen.  And a lot of people who don't live in the area have no idea that people live in the centre (although they do by the time I've had words  ).  Although tbf at least once it's been someone I know making a racket


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## editor (Oct 4, 2012)

Crispy said:


> Yep. "The Sun of Camberwell" is the new name


I think it's great that it's coming back as a pub. Far too many have been lost around that area.


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## Crispy (Oct 4, 2012)

Agreed. It's a great building - front and back gardens, big bar, lots of seating, captive audience from the hospital. Deserves to do well.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 4, 2012)

Crispy said:


> Yep. "The Sun of Camberwell" is the new name


 
Any idea when it's opening?


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## eroom (Oct 5, 2012)

Am I right in thinking that Antic are also the new oweners (with refused planning permission) of the Harmony Bar?

That's an awful lot of old Brixton pubs being brought back to life. I feel like I ought to be more pleased about that than I actually am.


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 5, 2012)

eroom said:


> Am I right in thinking that Antic are also the new oweners (with refused planning permission) of the Harmony Bar?


Yes I think you're right - Gramsci (?) should be able to confirm as I think he was following the planning/licensing issues.


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## Rushy (Oct 5, 2012)

eroom said:


> Am I right in thinking that Antic are also the new oweners (with refused planning permission) of the Harmony Bar?
> 
> That's an awful lot of old Brixton pubs being brought back to life. I feel like I ought to be more pleased about that than I actually am.


Yes. You are right.


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## editor (Oct 5, 2012)

The thing is, if a pub stays open it can change over time. Once it's closed, it's gone forever.


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## el-ahrairah (Oct 5, 2012)

Rushy said:


> I think this scenario is quite likely. Lambeth does not appear to have a plan to avoid it.


 
I'd say that Lambeth wants us to go like that.  The noise and the mess shows that their night time economy is bringing in the bucks.


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## Rushy (Oct 5, 2012)

el-ahrairah said:


> I'd say that Lambeth wants us to go like that. The noise and the mess shows that their night time economy is bringing in the bucks.


Yes - but they haven't really got the balls to admit that it's going to be full steam ahead and fuck the locals. Do any councillors actually live right in the centre?

ETA. The Antic pubs, with the exception of Dogstar and Tram & Social do seem to be mostly pub pubs with regular midnight closing.


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## steeeve (Oct 5, 2012)

This is great news, Antic run some of the best pubs in London, good beer, good friendly atmosphere. Really can't see the problem


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## eroom (Oct 5, 2012)

For me it's all about whether these places are going to be opened (and run) as pubs - ie licensed to midnightish and free - or as clubs: disruptive and exclusive.


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## steeeve (Oct 5, 2012)

eroom said:


> For me it's all about whether these places are going to be opened (and run) as pubs - ie licensed to midnightish and free - or as clubs: disruptive and exclusive.


 
Fair point, I was refering more to the likes of the Balham Bowls Club and The Antelope in Tooting rather than the Dogstar type place


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## Crispy (Oct 5, 2012)

eroom said:


> For me it's all about whether these places are going to be opened (and run) as pubs - ie licensed to midnightish and free - or as clubs: disruptive and exclusive.


Well, this specific place (Effra Social) will be a pub. No dancing. Last orders at midnight or 1am on weekends.


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## Rushy (Oct 5, 2012)

Crispy said:


> Well, this specific place (Effra Social) will be a pub. No dancing. Last orders at midnight or 1am on weekends.


I think the Crypt one is going to be the same. Licence is 'til 6 but they only have planning until 12.


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## steeeve (Oct 5, 2012)

Crispy said:


> Well, this specific place (Effra Social) will be a pub. No dancing. Last orders at midnight or 1am on weekends.


 In that case great, noise won't be an issue as the Hoot will always be louder. Sometime it seems people prefer to be surrounded by derelict buildings!


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## wemakeyousoundb (Oct 5, 2012)

steeeve said:


> In that case great, noise won't be an issue as the Hoot will always be louder. Sometime it seems people prefer to be surrounded by derelict buildings!


I do


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## el-ahrairah (Oct 5, 2012)

me too.


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## Rushy (Oct 5, 2012)

steeeve said:


> In that case great, noise won't be an issue as the Hoot will always be louder. Sometime it seems people prefer to be surrounded by derelict buildings!


That's not quite true really, is it? The Social backs on to about 50 flats. Their gardens are only 2-3m long. You could almost touch the backs of the flats from the Social's garden. The sound of 200-300 people chattering until 1am has the potential to be pretty disturbing.


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## Crispy (Oct 5, 2012)

A condition of the license is that the garden will be closed at 21:30 each night.


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## prunus (Nov 5, 2012)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> Any idea when it's opening?


Late November according to the banner on the front of it.


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## leanderman (Nov 5, 2012)

prunus said:


> Late November according to the banner on the front of it.


 
Excellent. Another drinking option


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## marty21 (Nov 5, 2012)

steeeve said:


> This is great news, Antic run some of the best pubs in London, good beer, good friendly atmosphere. Really can't see the problem


they have a few in Hackney as well, opened one near me a few months ago, The Clapton Hart, and I really like it.


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## leanderman (Nov 5, 2012)

marty21 said:


> they have a few in Hackney as well, opened one near me a few months ago, The Clapton Hart, and I really like it.


 
They even have one on Streatham High Road


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## Elgar (Nov 7, 2012)

And now one in Leyton Town Hall.

http://www.guardian-series.co.uk/news/wfnews/10029167.Plans_to_open_pub_in_former_town_hall/


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## magneze (Nov 7, 2012)

They have three in Tooting now last time I counted.


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## Yelkcub (Nov 7, 2012)

The have The Bohemia in Finchley. It the only place in Finchley that does a decent Sunday roast and for that reason, we're in!


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## editor (Nov 7, 2012)

Elgar said:


> And now one in Leyton Town Hall.
> 
> http://www.guardian-series.co.uk/news/wfnews/10029167.Plans_to_open_pub_in_former_town_hall/


I nicked a British flag from there once in my mod days 

Looks like Antic are doing a decent enough job in East London though: 


> Antic Ltd has been credited with helping to revitalise Leytonstone High Road when it reopened the historic Red Lion last year. It has gone on to win several awards including CAMRA's East London Pub of the Year.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 7, 2012)

Antic bought a property in W. Norwood, which then turned out to be unsuitable (I think it had subsidence or something - not quite sure) and resold it again.  They are currently, quite publicly, on the look out for another one in W. Norwood.  I see they're opening one in Sydenham too.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Nov 7, 2012)

leanderman said:


> Excellent. Another drinking option


 
Bit of a way to go for a drink though innit?


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## colacubes (Nov 7, 2012)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> Bit of a way to go for a drink though innit?


 
What, Effra Road?


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Nov 7, 2012)

nipsla said:


> What, Effra Road?


 
erm no, The Sun and Doves 

(that's assuming prunus was answering my question about the Sun and Doves)


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## colacubes (Nov 7, 2012)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> erm no, The Sun and Doves
> 
> (that's assuming prunus was answering my question about the Sun and Doves)


 
Oh yeah    Time for bed obv


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Nov 7, 2012)

nipsla said:


> Oh yeah   Time for bed obv


 


Wonder if it's time for leanderman as well or whether he realises it's the Sun & Doves being referred to?


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## lefteri (Nov 7, 2012)

yet more business for the ripoff cashpoint in baba chemists


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## leanderman (Nov 8, 2012)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> Wonder if it's time for leanderman as well or whether he realises it's the Sun & Doves being referred to?



whatevs, wherevs, it must have a better range of beer than the White Horse, where I spent tonight.


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## Ms T (Nov 8, 2012)

I hope it does nice food.  Am a bit bored with the Regent/Commercial options.


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 8, 2012)

gaijingirl said:


> Antic bought a property in W. Norwood, which then turned out to be unsuitable (I think it had subsidence or something - not quite sure) and resold it again. They are currently, quite publicly, on the look out for another one in W. Norwood. I see they're opening one in Sydenham too.


Yeah I know the place - at the end of Wolfington Road. Sort of commercial/office building. They had a sign up a while ago saying 'opening soon' but it never happened. I kind of thought they might go after the Norwood Hotel or the Horns Tavern, neither of which ever seem particularly busy.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 8, 2012)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Yeah I know the place - at the end of Wolfington Road. Sort of commercial/office building. They had a sign up a while ago saying 'opening soon' but it never happened. I kind of thought they might go after the Norwood Hotel or the Horns Tavern, neither of which ever seem particularly busy.


they've been asking residents for ideas. the natwest which has just shut down was suggested but apparently it's not what they're after.


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 8, 2012)

gaijingirl said:


> they've been asking residents for ideas. the natwest which has just shut down was suggested but apparently it's not what they're after.


There was an empty pub near the bus garage which I went to a few squat parties in a few years ago...not sure if it's still there though.


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## Dan U (Nov 8, 2012)

Brixton Hatter said:


> There was an empty pub near the bus garage which I went to a few squat parties in a few years ago...not sure if it's still there though.


 
always thought that might be squatted. know just where you mean.


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## leanderman (Nov 8, 2012)

i am surprised the place under discussion (effra club) has not been squatted


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## Rushy (Nov 9, 2012)

leanderman said:


> i am surprised the place under discussion (effra club) has not been squatted


It looks deserted but it has been in daily use as offices I think. I met the guy who works there.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 9, 2012)

Brixton Hatter said:


> There was an empty pub near the bus garage which I went to a few squat parties in a few years ago...not sure if it's still there though.


 
The Gipsy Queen (or similar?)


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## Sirena (Nov 13, 2012)

magneze said:


> They have three in Tooting now last time I counted.


 
They've got 4 now when what used to be A Bar Too Far on Tooting Broadway reopens. Mind you, this one is a joint project and it's not going to be a pub but a cake shop/bakery. And then they have right to develop the land where Broadway Studios is, just up from the Broadway.

And they also have the very nice Balham Bowls Club and, now, the Blithe
Spirit on Balham High Road.

They have put some nice pubs back into Tooting and Balham.


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 13, 2012)

gaijingirl said:


> The Gipsy Queen (or similar?)


No idea what it was called - sorry!


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## leanderman (Nov 13, 2012)

Brixton Hatter said:


> No idea what it was called - sorry!


 
Their website lists (and pictures) all their pubs.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 13, 2012)

leanderman said:


> Their website lists (and pictures) all their pubs.


 
he's talking about a squatted pub (which some people have suggested might make a good Antic pub), not a current Antic pub.


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## paolo (Nov 13, 2012)

Went to an Antic pub last week, over Brockley way. It was to catch up with a good mate, so somewhere where you can get a seat and hold a conversation (and have decent ales on tap) was what was wanted. The antic place ticked the boxes, I liked it.

Wonder what they'd have in mind for the effra road spot?


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## leanderman (Nov 13, 2012)

gaijingirl said:


> he's talking about a squatted pub (which some people have suggested might make a good Antic pub), not a current Antic pub.


 
Still, I like the look of their range and am rather excited.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 13, 2012)

leanderman said:


> Still, I like the look of their range and am rather excited.


 
I can tell...


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## RaverDrew (Nov 13, 2012)

The Gipsy Queen is still sitting empty afaik.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 13, 2012)

RaverDrew said:


> The Gipsy Queen is still sitting empty afaik.


 
certainly seems dead whenever I go past.  Shame.


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## RaverDrew (Nov 14, 2012)

You'd be hard pushed to notice the difference between when it was open tbf, it was always pretty dead ever since I could remember. The Youngs pub The Hope across the road ain't too shabby, apart from a few moody dodgy locals who drink in there.


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## Frumious B. (Dec 9, 2012)

I heard that "the rich guy who owns the Dogstar" owns Clifton Mansions. Can anyone confirm?


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## editor (Dec 9, 2012)

Frumious B. said:


> I heard that "the rich guy who owns the Dogstar" owns Clifton Mansions. Can anyone confirm?


News to me but I'll ask around.


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## Frumious B. (Dec 9, 2012)

Also heard that he bought the building between Clifton Mansions and Bookmongers and wants to open a bar/restaurant in the former clothes shop/Brixton Cycles on the ground floor. The residents in the flats above had to move out a couple of weeks ago.


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## Elgar (Dec 9, 2012)

Frumious B. said:


> Also heard that he bought the building between Clifton Mansions and Bookmongers and wants to open a bar/restaurant in the former clothes shop/Brixton Cycles on the ground floor. The residents in the flats above had to move out a couple of weeks ago.


 
From this thread:



bosie said:


> The application is by someone called Anthony Thomas. An Anthony Thomas owns Antic Ltd, which owns Dogstar. Might just be a coincidence though?


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## editor (Dec 9, 2012)

Frumious B. said:


> Also heard that he bought the building between Clifton Mansions and Bookmongers and wants to open a bar/restaurant in the former clothes shop/Brixton Cycles on the ground floor. The residents in the flats above had to move out a couple of weeks ago.


The perisistent rumour for that building is that it's going to be a Brew Dog bar. I hope not.


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## leanderman (Dec 9, 2012)

editor said:


> The perisistent rumour for that building is that it's going to be a Brew Dog bar. I hope not.


 
What would you rather it be?


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## Rushy (Dec 9, 2012)

Frumious B. said:


> I heard that "the rich guy who owns the Dogstar" owns Clifton Mansions. Can anyone confirm?


No. Lexadon own Clifton. Antic have the Dog Star.


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## editor (Dec 9, 2012)

leanderman said:


> What would you rather it be?


Well, I'd love the bike shop back but that isn't going to happen. I don't think that stretch of Coldharbour Lane needs another bar, to be honest.


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## leanderman (Dec 9, 2012)

What it needs is a ... phone shop!


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## editor (Dec 9, 2012)

leanderman said:


> What it needs is a ... phone shop!


They're the new nail bar!


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## CH1 (Dec 9, 2012)

Rushy said:


> No. Lexadon own Clifton. Antic have the Dog Star.


435-437 Coldharbour Lane looks like a mixture of both:
The planning history shows plans for a bar on ground floor and basement from A Thomas (Antic) being approved: 10/02057/FUL (Application Permitted)
On the other hand A Thomas' application for flats above was refused a couple of months later: 10/02846/DET Received: Tue 17 Aug 2010 Status: Application Refused

HOWEVER there are currently plans in from Lexadon for this site 12/02837 FUL Received: Fri 27 Jul 2012 Status: Pending Decision.
Lexadon's plans are broadly to demolish the upper stories and create a frontage matching in with Clifton Mansions - in so far as this is possible in vernacular "Viaduct"/Brixton Square style - with 9 flats on 1st/2nd/3rd floors - the new facade matching Clifton Mansions height-wise.
Lexadon say "this application is cognisant of, but not directly linked to 10/02057/FUL (Antic's bar proposals). Lexadon do not say whether they favour a bar or not.
The Lexadon application was advertised a couple of weeks ago in the "Weekender"
(As well as Clifton Mansions, Lexadon also own the Angel ex-Pub and "The Viaduct" - to name just their Coldharbour Lane properties).

You don't have to own a property to apply for planning permission. This proposal could be a combined Antic/Lexadon proposition. Lexadon obviously have the resources to do the development whether jointly or on their own.

Final point - I would have thought it might be difficult to challenge this proposal on Conservation area grounds - Lexadon have done their usual thorough job with a 30 page design statement which alludes to 435-437 Coldhabrour Lane being an ‘Enhancement Opportunity’ and then listing all the surrounding applications going back years. Objecting to losing the 1930s existing building (allegedly in poor state of repair) would seem unlikely to resonate with Lambeth Planners when the Satay Bar and flats above in bland modern style were approved 15+ years ago and a hotel on top of the Woolworths building was approved in July (no sign of building starting yet though!)


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## CH1 (Dec 12, 2012)

CH1 said:


> 435-437 Coldharbour Lane looks like a mixture of both


Lexadon have a brief description and pic on their website under "future projects" here


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## editor (Dec 12, 2012)

Lexadon are all over Brixton at the moment. Clearly there's big $$$$s to be made.

They're gentrifying Blenheim Studios too and building "seven luxurious apartments" on Gresham Road.


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## twistedAM (Dec 12, 2012)

editor said:


> Lexadon are all over Brixton at the moment. Clearly there's big $$$$s to be made.
> 
> *They're gentrifying Blenheim Studios too* and building "seven luxurious apartments" on Gresham Road.


 
What?


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## editor (Dec 12, 2012)

twistedAM said:


> What?





> Lexadon Property Group is excited to have completed the purchase of Blenheim studios, Brixton.
> Lexadon intends to put planning permissions in the near year to develop into 9 residential loft style apartments and 6 workshops.


Yeah! Loft living lifestyle!
http://www.lexadon.co.uk/projects/blenheim-studios


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## CH1 (Dec 12, 2012)

editor said:


> Lexadon are all over Brixton at the moment. Clearly there's big $$$$s to be made. They're gentrifying Blenheim Studios too and building "seven luxurious apartments" on Gresham Road.


Brixton Society objected to the Gresham Road one - which was refused by Lambeth Planning, then allowed on appeal by the Planning Inspectors.  Farewell to the unusual, if not iconic, octagonal former registry office marriage suite.


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## MillwallShoes (Dec 12, 2012)

editor said:


> Yeah! Loft living lifestyle!
> http://www.lexadon.co.uk/projects/blenheim-studios


christ.

ipads, lattes, and people saying "awesome" a lot.

maybe brixton should go bermo style. apparently a lot of yuppies in bermondsey are confronted and told "to fuck off". but then bermondsey people have been telling non-bermondsey people to fuck off for years


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## gaijingirl (Dec 12, 2012)

went to some good raves in there ... times have changed.


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## twistedAM (Dec 12, 2012)

editor said:


> Yeah! Loft living lifestyle!
> http://www.lexadon.co.uk/projects/blenheim-studios


 
I know someone who lives there. Their flat is beautiful as it is. I'll ask what's going on.


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## twistedAM (Dec 12, 2012)

gaijingirl said:


> went to some good raves in there ... times have changed.


 
I don't think so...surely it would have been the units next to that or the ones right on the park? Aficr there's always been little workshops and flats in that particular space.


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## gaijingirl (Dec 12, 2012)

twistedAM said:


> I don't think so...surely it would have been the units next to that or the ones right on the park? Aficr there's always been little workshops and flats in that particular space.


 
oh yeah.. probably...   opposite the pub anyway..


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## twistedAM (Dec 12, 2012)

gaijingirl said:


> oh yeah.. probably...  opposite the pub anyway..


 
Well if you can remember exactly where it was you probably weren't doing things right


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## gaijingirl (Dec 12, 2012)

twistedAM said:


> Well if you can remember exactly where it was you probably weren't doing things right


 
yeah... exactly....   it was a little bit messy if I recall correctly - which I'm failing to do so far..


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## Rushy (Dec 14, 2012)

editor said:


> Lexadon are all over Brixton at the moment. Clearly there's big $$$$s to be made.
> 
> They're gentrifying Blenheim Studios too


Which Lexadon bought from Black Ant - the development co owned by the same chap as owns Antic pubs - after it went into receivership.

Lexadon have always been based around here. The owner started in the 80s as a jobbing plumber working on refurbs in these parts for others.


----------



## editor (Dec 14, 2012)

Rushy said:


> Which Lexadon bought from Black Ant - the development co owned by the same chap as owns Antic pubs - after it went into receivership.
> 
> Lexadon have always been based around here. The owner started in the 80s as a jobbing plumber working on refurbs in these parts for others.


And made their millions flogging off ex-council stock.


----------



## twistedAM (Dec 14, 2012)

Rushy said:


> Which Lexadon bought from Black Ant - the development co owned by the same chap as owns Antic pubs - after it went into receivership.
> 
> Lexadon have always been based around here. The owner started in the 80s as a jobbing plumber working on refurbs in these parts for others.


 
That means Lexadon now have control of the 40 hastily-refurbed flats next to Blenheim Studios too.


----------



## Yelkcub (Dec 14, 2012)

My local Antic boozer is doing an old folks Xmas dinner on Monday. I've given them £14 to feed two oldies but I can't work out if it's a rip-off or not. Are contributors paying for them to look charitable? They are asking publically for people to put cash in so I guess  there's no deceit?


----------



## CH1 (Dec 30, 2012)

Just finished flagging up the latest Harmony Bar application (Anthony Thomas/Antic) on the Brixton Society website, when I decided to check this application for a bar/restaurant at the back of Bon Marché.
Lo and behold its Antic & Anthony Thomas. 12/04578/FUL
Do they never rest? Hope if he gets the Bon Marché one the toilets are better than "The Goose"!
BTW disabled people needing lift access to these facilities will need agreement of a fellow Bon Marché tenant.


----------



## editor (Jan 3, 2013)

BrixtonBuzz has a feature on the new pub, which will be known as the Effra Social. 
http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2013/01/...heduled-to-open-at-89-effra-road-in-february/

(thread title edited)


----------



## Minnie_the_Minx (Jan 3, 2013)

editor said:


> Yeah! Loft living lifestyle!
> http://www.lexadon.co.uk/projects/blenheim-studios


 
Really hope they're not building up any more or we'll have to start getting curtains up


----------



## Minnie_the_Minx (Jan 3, 2013)

Oh, they've got the petrol station as well

http://www.lexadon.co.uk/projects/124-128-brixton-hill


----------



## villagemyarse (Jan 6, 2013)

Just what Brixton needs, another middle class watering hole. A pound for every person that gets in there who was born in Lambeth (or London).


----------



## Favelado (Jan 6, 2013)

villagemyarse said:


> Just what Brixton needs, another middle class watering hole. A pound for every person that gets in there who was born in Lambeth (or London).


 
I get what you're saying and your point is about class. However, you could apply what you said to most Brixton pubs for the last 40 odd years.


----------



## lighterthief (Jan 6, 2013)

villagemyarse said:


> Just what Brixton needs, another middle class watering hole. A pound for every person that gets in there who was born in Lambeth (or London).


A pound for every Brixton-dwelling Urbanite who was born in Lambeth and you'd get about the same, I reckon.


----------



## sparkybird (Jan 6, 2013)

http://www.lexadon.co.uk/news/blenheim-gardens-0

Watch out for 3 planning apps coming soon.....


----------



## RaverDrew (Jan 6, 2013)

Do we really need yet another yuppie pub in Brixton ?

YUPPIES OUT


----------



## Onket (Jan 6, 2013)

"Go back to Clapham, yuppie pub, bring back the Conservatives"

That kind of thing.


----------



## RaverDrew (Jan 6, 2013)

The Conservatives haven't been in that building for many years.

I've never understood the cheerleading for all these middle-class/yuppie places on urban75, but yet when gentrification kicks in, and the rents go up, the main proponents all start crying into their £4/pint "craft beers"


----------



## Favelado (Jan 6, 2013)

Thirsty after such an arduous voyage on the Windrush, they opened the door of the pub, walked over to a table and were just about to put their bags down when a voice from the other side of the saloon cried out,

"Get out! You weren't born in Lambeth!"

Excuse my facetiousness.


----------



## discokermit (Jan 6, 2013)

nice middle class pubs full of wankers.


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## boohoo (Jan 6, 2013)

RaverDrew said:


> Do we really need yet another yuppie pub in Brixton ?
> 
> YUPPIES OUT


 
Do we need another pub?

There have always been posh people living in and around Brixton.

When we use the term yuppies,  (young upwardly mobile people) who exactly are we referring to? hipsters?


----------



## boohoo (Jan 6, 2013)

lighterthief said:


> A pound for every Brixton-dwelling Urbanite who was born in Lambeth.


 
That's me folks! It's me! The token lambeth born, brixton living urbanite!! (where's me prize? (a one way ticket out of Brixton!))


----------



## twentythreedom (Jan 6, 2013)

Yelkcub said:


> The have The Bohemia in Finchley. It the only place in Finchley that does a decent Sunday roast and for that reason, we're in!


I went in there the other day, looks alright. Where do you live, Yelk?


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jan 6, 2013)

Can someone tell me exactly when Brixton was like Brixton used to be before it all started going wrong?


----------



## RaverDrew (Jan 6, 2013)

boohoo said:


> Do we need another pub?
> 
> There have always been posh people living in and around Brixton.
> 
> When we use the term yuppies, (young upwardly mobile people) who exactly are we referring to? hipsters?


 
Well it's a case of all the more working class pubs in the area closing down and being replaced by posher alternatives. Somehow this seems to please the majority on here 

I remember not so long ago when I struggled to drag people along to The Prince Albert because it was seen as one of the posher, pricier, more middle-class pubs in the area. Nowadays it's at the other end of the scale, those same people that were reluctant to frequent there previously now see it as the good value, down to earth pub, and a place to hide away from all the braying hordes that inhabit all the other gentrified pubs and bars of Brixton.


----------



## RaverDrew (Jan 6, 2013)

boohoo said:


> That's me folks! It's me! The token lambeth born, brixton living urbanite!! (where's me prize? (a one way ticket out of Brixton!))


 
We're a dying breed


----------



## editor (Jan 6, 2013)

RaverDrew said:


> Well it's a case of all the more working class pubs in the area closing down and being replaced by posher alternatives. Somehow this seems to please the majority on here


Brixton has lost a lot of pubs in recent times, and I'm always going to celebrate a pub staying open rather than one closing - even if I don't particularly like the style of the place. If a pub stays open it can change over time and you can try to influence that by getting involved. If a pub closes, it's gone forever.


----------



## pesh (Jan 6, 2013)

editor said:


> Brixton has lost a lot of pubs in recent times, and I'm always going to celebrate a pub staying open rather than one closing - even if I don't particularly like the style of the place. If a pub stays open it can change over time and you can try to influence that by getting involved. If a pub closes, it's gone forever.


you could say that about the Wimpy


----------



## RaverDrew (Jan 6, 2013)

editor said:


> Brixton has lost a lot of pubs in recent times, and I'm always going to celebrate a pub staying open rather than one closing - even if I don't particularly like the style of the place. If a pub stays open it can change over time and you can try to influence that by getting involved. If a pub closes, it's gone forever.


 
There is a certain amount of truth to that tbf, a good example is when the Hootananny first opened and went for all this Scottish theme nonsense. The locals voted with their feet, and it slowly went back to more how it was before (even if it never was quite the same again) but ime Antic pubs cater for a fairly upmarket crowd, with prices to match. If we're gonna have a chain move in, then give me another Wetherspoon or Lloyds no.1 bar any day, they're accessible to a far broader spectrum of the community.


----------



## editor (Jan 6, 2013)

RaverDrew said:


> There is a certain amount of truth to that tbf, a good example is when the Hootananny first opened and went for all this Scottish theme nonsense. The locals voted with their feet, and it slowly went back to more how it was before (even if it never was quite the same again) but ime Antic pubs cater for a fairly upmarket crowd, with prices to match. If we're gonna have a chain move in, then give me another Wetherspoon or Lloyds no.1 bar any day, they're accessible to a far broader spectrum of the community.


And I'd love pubs like Brady's and the Queens to come back, but it's not going to happen. If Antic hadn't taken over the Sun and Doves it would probably have been turned into a luxury development by now. Or a Sainsburys.

And I really wouldn't describe the Dogstar as catering to an "upmarket" crowd either.


----------



## Gentry Fication (Jan 6, 2013)

The owners want it to be like the Balham Bowls Club...which used to be a social club for you guessed it Balham Bowls Club...now its a wankers from Chippenham hang out as most of Balham has turned into...this isn't the opening of a 'pub' its the next stage in the yuppification of Brixton...do you really want Brixton to turn into Balham? or Clapham? That's the project going on before our eyes...Thornton Heath (the Black Beverley Hills) here I come.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jan 6, 2013)

It was different 'round here then.....


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jan 6, 2013)

I remember when Brixton Academy was nothing but a petrol station.....


----------



## Onket (Jan 6, 2013)

Gentry Fication said:


> The owners want it to be like the Balham Bowls Club...which used to be a social club for you guessed it Balham Bowls Club...now its a wankers from Chippenham hang out as most of Balham has turned into...this isn't the opening of a 'pub' its the next stage in the yuppification of Brixton...do you really want Brixton to turn into Balham? or Clapham? That's the project going on before our eyes...Thornton Heath (the Black Beverley Hills) here I come.



Chippenham?! WTF? I grew up near there, it's hardly posh!


----------



## Onket (Jan 6, 2013)

RaverDrew said:


> There is a certain amount of truth to that tbf, a good example is when the Hootananny first opened and went for all this Scottish theme nonsense. The locals voted with their feet, and it slowly went back to more how it was before (even if it never was quite the same again) but ime Antic pubs cater for a fairly upmarket crowd, with prices to match. If we're gonna have a chain move in, then give me another Wetherspoon or Lloyds no.1 bar any day, they're accessible to a far broader spectrum of the community.



Lloyds No 1 are horrible, tbf. Next you'll be asking for a Slug & Lettuce!


----------



## RaverDrew (Jan 6, 2013)

editor said:


> And I really wouldn't describe the Dogstar as catering to an "upmarket" crowd either.


 
I disagree, it may not be the poshest of places in the area, but you only have to look at the peeps in the queue going in, you wouldn't see the majority of the clientèle in Brixton Bar and Grill, or vice versa.


----------



## editor (Jan 6, 2013)

RaverDrew said:


> I disagree, it may not be the poshest of places in the area, but you only have to look at the peeps in the queue going in, you wouldn't see the majority of the clientèle in Brixton Bar and Grill, or vice versa.


Nah. It's really not an 'upmarket' crowd by any description in the Dogstar, not even on weekends.


----------



## editor (Jan 6, 2013)

Onket said:


> Lloyds No 1 are horrible, tbf. Next you'll be asking for a Slug & Lettuce!


Indeed. They're about as bland as soulless as a corporate pub chain can be.


----------



## editor (Jan 6, 2013)

Gentry Fication said:


> The owners want it to be like the Balham Bowls Club...which used to be a social club for you guessed it Balham Bowls Club...now its a wankers from Chippenham hang out as most of Balham has turned into...this isn't the opening of a 'pub' its the next stage in the yuppification of Brixton...do you really want Brixton to turn into Balham? or Clapham? That's the project going on before our eyes...Thornton Heath (the Black Beverley Hills) here I come.


It's happening whether this pub opens or not and given the choice, I'd rather have more pubs than luxury lifestyle developments and supermarkets (see: Loughborough Junction). Your priorities may be different, of course.


----------



## Frumious B. (Jan 6, 2013)

Gentry Fication said:


> Thornton Heath (the Black Beverley Hills)


 Rly? Never been, tell me more.


----------



## Yelkcub (Jan 16, 2013)

twentythreedom said:


> I went in there the other day, looks alright. Where do you live, Yelk?


 
Finchley.

The Antic company which owns The Bohemia has gone into administration....


----------



## Rushy (Jan 16, 2013)

Yelkcub said:


> Finchley.
> 
> The Antic company which owns The Bohemia has gone into administration....


 
If this is like the BBC in Balham, it was Black Ant (development co) that went bust which owned the freeholds. I think receivers were looking at purchasers interested in sale and leaseback so that Antic could keep the pubs operating. I'm not entirely certain how it all works but that's the general impression I got.


----------



## Yelkcub (Jan 16, 2013)

Rushy said:


> If this is like the BBC in Balham, it was Black Ant (development co) that went bust which owned the freeholds. I think receivers were looking at purchasers interested in sale and leaseback so that Antic could keep the pubs operating. I'm not entirely certain how it all works but that's the general impression I got.


 
Waiting for a little info from a publican friend but there's 12 pubs the company owns apparently, so I'm guessing it's the 12 on the same website as my local one: http://www.antic-ltd.com/


----------



## Yelkcub (Jan 16, 2013)

Rushy said:


> If this is like the BBC in Balham, it was Black Ant (development co) that went bust which owned the freeholds. I think receivers were looking at purchasers interested in sale and leaseback so that Antic could keep the pubs operating. I'm not entirely certain how it all works but that's the general impression I got.


 
Maybe this is old news then as BBC is on the same website....


----------



## twentythreedom (Jan 16, 2013)

Yelkcub said:


> Finchley.
> 
> The Antic company which owns The Bohemia has gone into administration....


Drove past it earlier, stopped for a McD


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jan 16, 2013)

Yelkcub said:


> Waiting for a little info from a publican friend but there's 12 pubs the company owns apparently, so I'm guessing it's the 12 on the same website as my local one: http://www.antic-ltd.com/


I think that's an old website - this one shows them owning at least 24 pubs....

http://anticlondon.com


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jan 16, 2013)

Nanker Phelge said:


> It was different 'round here then.....


That's a fantastic picture. I forgot to ask at the time: do you know when it was taken? Late 80s early 90s perhaps? Do you know what the banner is or what the protest (if that's what it is) is about?

E2A: poll tax protest?


----------



## Yelkcub (Jan 16, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> I think that's an old website - this one shows them owning at least 24 pubs....
> 
> http://anticlondon.com



Quick check and no pub appears on both websites and The Bohemia only appeared relatively recently on the site I posted. My contact said the company that had it has 12 pubs and was in administration and there's 12 pubs on 'my' site......


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## Nanker Phelge (Jan 16, 2013)

It says Tulse Hill Estate against the Poll Tax


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## Brixton Hatter (Jan 16, 2013)

Nanker Phelge said:


> It says Tulse Hill Estate against the Poll Tax


Ah, so must be about 1989 then I reckon.


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jan 16, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Ah, so must be about 1989 then I reckon.


 
I found it on a blog....I'll try and re-find it and give you more details. There were other pics too.


----------



## Minnie_the_Minx (Jan 16, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> That's a fantastic picture. I forgot to ask at the time: do you know when it was taken? Late 80s early 90s perhaps? Do you know what the banner is or what the protest (if that's what it is) is about?
> 
> E2A: poll tax protest?


 
I've a feeling it's more 80s, but may be wrong

oh, must seen other posts


----------



## boohoo (Jan 17, 2013)

Antic limited has gone into administration: http://www.caterersearch.com/Articl...-pub-firm-Antic-Limited-in-administration.htm

(Antic London - the parent company are the people who run the dogstar)


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

boohoo said:


> Antic limited has gone into administration: http://www.caterersearch.com/Articl...-pub-firm-Antic-Limited-in-administration.htm
> 
> (Antic London - the parent company are the people who run the dogstar)


It's actually rather complicated, but the Dogstar should be safe as should be the Sun and Doves and the Effra. There should be a BrixtonBuzz exclusive on this in the morning


----------



## Rushy (Jan 17, 2013)

How very confusing.


----------



## Rushy (Jan 17, 2013)

editor said:


> It's actually rather complicated, but the Dogstar should be safe as should be the Sun and Doves and the Effra. There should be a BrixtonBuzz exclusive on this in the morning


What about The Crypt?


----------



## boohoo (Jan 17, 2013)

Maybe they were just doing going after too many pubs. Or were not making sure their pubs were doing good business.


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

boohoo said:


> Maybe they were just doing going after too many pubs. Or were not making sure their pubs were doing good business.


An awful lot of pubs are struggling these days, so it should hardly come as a surprise that some are failing. I've seen a list of the ones affected, and hope to have more info later.

In fact, the linked article explains it: 


> Chantrey Vellacott is handing the administration, but said it was too early to comment on the case.
> The administration is not thought to affect Antic London, the parent company, which continues to trade as usual.
> It will continue to run 24 pubs, which include Dogstar Brixton, East Dulwich Tavern and Westow House in Crystal Palace.


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

Here's the list of pubs affected:
http://antic-ltd.com/

Apparently the situation at The Tiger is a bit unusual and as a result should be OK.


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## boohoo (Jan 17, 2013)

I like the Balham Bowls club. My friend's dad went there when it was the proper bowls club.


----------



## Yelkcub (Jan 17, 2013)

editor said:


> Here's the list of pubs affected:
> http://antic-ltd.com/[/OK.[/quote]
> Pogo?n


----------



## Favelado (Jan 17, 2013)

The Dogstar was great to me. All the service industry staff who didn't have to work on a Monday morning, dancing on the tables to The Bangles at 3am on a Sunday night. People were so, so drunk but it was a good atmosphere and a good laugh.

I'd get there at 2pm, have a Sunday roast, read all of The Guardian and then start the proper drinking. A 13 hour stretch. It was 1998-2000.

Good days.


----------



## Dan U (Jan 17, 2013)

I find it remarkable that they were still trying to expand so recently when they clearly had cash flow problems. 

This doesn't mean they have a bad business, just they don't have any cash. 

Maybe a bank pulled a loan, maybe they've been winging it and lucky, maybe they need a new accountant. 

Guess time will tell


----------



## leanderman (Jan 17, 2013)

What about the proposed Effra Social?


----------



## leanderman (Jan 17, 2013)

Dan U said:


> I find it remarkable that they were still trying to expand so recently when they clearly had cash flow problems.
> 
> This doesn't mean they have a bad business, just they don't have any cash.
> 
> ...


 
Yes. Completely contradictory.


----------



## Dan U (Jan 17, 2013)

leanderman said:


> What about the proposed Effra Social?



Depends which company it is in by the looks of it. 

It is pretty peculiar that the holding company hasn't bailed out the subsidiary with some cash, unless they are cutting off the foot to save the leg, so to speak.


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

Dan U said:


> I find it remarkable that they were still trying to expand so recently when they clearly had cash flow problems.
> 
> This doesn't mean they have a bad business, just they don't have any cash.
> 
> ...


If I've understood it right, it's two separate companies.
The parent company (which owns the Dogstar etc) is doing fine, but the other company is the one in trouble.


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

Dan U said:


> Depends which company it is in by the looks of it.
> 
> It is pretty peculiar that the holding company hasn't bailed out the subsidiary with some cash, unless they are cutting off the foot to save the leg, so to speak.


I think that might be the case. I hope to find out more later.


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

Favelado said:


> The Dogstar was great to me. All the service industry staff who didn't have to work on a Monday morning, dancing on the tables to The Bangles at 3am on a Sunday night. People were so, so drunk but it was a good atmosphere and a good laugh.
> 
> I'd get there at 2pm, have a Sunday roast, read all of The Guardian and then start the proper drinking. A 13 hour stretch. It was 1998-2000.
> 
> Good days.


It's still pretty good there in the week.  In fact, I'll be there later.


----------



## Favelado (Jan 17, 2013)

I meant The Observer of course, but that post will probably reflect the coming reality within 5 years.


----------



## editor (Jan 17, 2013)

Favelado said:


> I meant The Observer of course, but that post will probably reflect the coming reality within 5 years.


I wouldn't bank on either publication being around in 5 years.


----------



## leanderman (Jan 18, 2013)

Yep. Print journalists are doomed. Going to re-train as a plumber


----------



## Nanker Phelge (Jan 18, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> Ah, so must be about 1989 then I reckon.


 
It was 1990 - http://transpont.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/burning-poll-tax-bills-brixton-1900.html


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jan 18, 2013)

Nanker Phelge said:


> It was 1990 - http://transpont.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/burning-poll-tax-bills-brixton-1900.html


great, thanks for the link, brings back a few memories! I remember helping mum and dad burn their bills. They got taken to court, but they never paid anything....


----------



## editor (Jan 18, 2013)

Here's an update about Antic Ltd/Dogstar:
http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2013/01/...affect-the-dogstar-and-the-sun-of-camberwell/


----------



## shakespearegirl (Jan 21, 2013)

Favelado said:


> The Dogstar was great to me. All the service industry staff who didn't have to work on a Monday morning, dancing on the tables to The Bangles at 3am on a Sunday night. People were so, so drunk but it was a good atmosphere and a good laugh.
> 
> I'd get there at 2pm, have a Sunday roast, read all of The Guardian and then start the proper drinking. A 13 hour stretch. It was 1998-2000.
> 
> Good days.


 
Oh how many Sunday's were spent like that in those years.. Brilliant fun, although no way I could be doing it now.


----------



## Favelado (Jan 21, 2013)

shakespearegirl said:


> Oh how many Sunday's were spent like that in those years.. Brilliant fun, although no way I could be doing it now.


 
Were you there too? I can't remember the name of the DJ properly. Was it Joe Egg or something? It was fun because it was clearly everyone in SW9 who didn't have to get up on a Monday and were really going for it while the rest of the area was silent and asleep.


----------



## shakespearegirl (Jan 22, 2013)

I think that might have been his name. i spent many many a sunday in there till the wee hours. Even though I had to work on a Monday. Remember being very upset when they stopped the best roasts in Brixton.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jan 22, 2013)

Favelado said:


> Were you there too? I can't remember the name of the DJ properly. Was it Joe Egg or something? It was fun because it was clearly everyone in SW9 who didn't have to get up on a Monday and were really going for it while the rest of the area was silent and asleep.


Yeah we spent a lot of time in there on Sunday nights - band practice was Sunday afternoon and we always 'popped' in the Dogstar for a pint after, and usually ended up staggering down Railton Road at about 3am   Yes it was Joe Egg iirc - lots of 80s pop and loads of other random stuff. Good times. Racked up a lot of debt cos of that place!


----------



## cuppa tee (Jan 22, 2013)

It was a Sunday tea time when I got removed and permanently banned from the Dogstar.


----------



## Favelado (Jan 22, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> It was a Sunday tea time when I got removed and permanently banned from the Dogstar.


 
Let's not leave the story there cuppa.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jan 22, 2013)

We had a few pints and were peckish so my mate nipped out to kings for a burger, I stayed and looked after the seats, he smuggled me a chicken sandwich in which i ate in a broom cupboard in the men's washroom for reasons of discretion, unfortunately the owner had caught this on the CCTV and was waiting for me with a bouncer when I returned to the seat. After heated words He let me finish the pint I had just bought but said I would never enjoy another in that pub, the  security bloke apologised as I left the building


----------



## Favelado (Jan 22, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> We had a few pints and were peckish so my mate nipped out to kings for a burger, I stayed and looked after the seats, he smuggled me a chicken sandwich in which i ate in a broom cupboard in the men's washroom for reasons of discretion, unfortunately the owner had caught this on the CCTV and was waiting for me with a bouncer when I returned to the seat. After heated words He let me finish the pint I had just bought but said I would never enjoy another in that pub, the security bloke apologised as I left the building


 

It seems a bit harsh seeing as on one occasion I saw them let a group of alleged drug dealers' wives come in with bags full of allegedly dodgy substances and hand them over to the people allegedly selling them there. 

I think it's hilarious that you ate a chicken sandwich in a broom cupboard. Such an innocent activity turned into something so illicit.


----------



## cuppa tee (Jan 22, 2013)

Favelado said:


> It seems a bit harsh seeing as on one occasion I saw them let a group of alleged drug dealers' wives come in with bags full of allegedly dodgy substances and hand them over to the people allegedly selling them there.


The irony of the situation was not lost on those present



> I think it's hilarious that you ate a chicken sandwich in a broom cupboard. Such an innocent activity turned into something so illicit.


The guvnor's word is final, a lesson was learned and I moved on to pastures new


----------



## Dr Nookie (Jan 28, 2013)

Favelado said:


> Were you there too? I can't remember the name of the DJ properly. Was it Joe Egg or something? It was fun because it was clearly everyone in SW9 who didn't have to get up on a Monday and were really going for it while the rest of the area was silent and asleep.


 Ah Joe Egg was great! I remember me and Dubversion frugging away to 'Love is in the air' back in the day (although I think I used to sing 'legs are in the air' for crap-comedy factor!)


----------



## Onket (Jan 28, 2013)

Frugging?


----------



## editor (Jan 28, 2013)

Onket said:


> Frugging?


I think it involves yoghurt.


----------



## Onket (Jan 29, 2013)

editor said:


> I think it involves yoghurt.



Do you?


----------



## editor (Jan 29, 2013)

They've posted up some old pics on the site: http://effrasocial.com/

(*edit: they seem to have stopped hotlinking so you'll have to follow the link)


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Jan 29, 2013)

It looks like a working men's club, but with more expensive wallpaper and better fixtures & fittings. I bet that lot were delighted when the Windrush docked and Brixton started to benefit from Caribbean culture...


----------



## Dr Nookie (Jan 29, 2013)

Onket said:


> Frugging?


 
It's gerrrroovy dancing baby (yoghurt optional!)


----------



## Onket (Jan 29, 2013)

I'm still none the wiser, tbf.


----------



## Dr Nookie (Jan 29, 2013)

Onket said:


> I'm still none the wiser, tbf.


 
You ain't lived till you've frugged honeychile!  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Frug


----------



## Onket (Jan 29, 2013)

Dr Nookie said:


> You ain't lived till you've frugged honeychile!  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Frug


 
Wacky!


----------



## editor (Jan 31, 2013)

Update: 



> Antic are pleased to announce the opening of their latest venture ‘The Effra Social’ on Effra Road, Brixton SW2 1DF on the 13th of February 2013. Previously a Conservative club the feel of the pub will hark back to the days of  former glory with a definite nod to the 1970’s.
> 
> The venue itself boasts two bars, an event space and dining room and is sure to become a firm favourite amongst those looking for somewhere new to drink in Brixton.


----------



## colacubes (Jan 31, 2013)

editor said:


> Update:


 
Looks like that was a false alarm from their tweets.  Later tweets go on to say the 28th looks likely.

*Effra Social* ‏@*EffraSocial*
STOP PRESS We will NOT be opeing on the 13th, BUT will be opening in Feb Sorry to get you all excited stay posted!! I'll announce date soon.


----------



## editor (Jan 31, 2013)

nipsla said:


> Looks like that was a false alarm from their tweets. Later tweets go on to say the 28th looks likely.
> 
> *Effra Social* ‏@*EffraSocial*
> STOP PRESS We will NOT be opeing on the 13th, BUT will be opening in Feb Sorry to get you all excited stay posted!! I'll announce date soon.


I got sent their press release!


----------



## leanderman (Jan 31, 2013)

It's still quicker than I had thought.

Food prices seem reasonable


----------



## colacubes (Jan 31, 2013)

editor said:


> I got sent their press release!


Oops


----------



## Chilavert (Jan 31, 2013)

Looking forward to checking this place out. It's ideally placed in between the tube and home for aprés work drinks.


----------



## Onket (Feb 1, 2013)

I'm looking forward to it as well. Will have to leave work at 4pm though, so I hope they open promptly. Or, if anyone is reading, how about an all-day weekday opening day?


----------



## editor (Feb 12, 2013)

Opening confirmed for 28th Feb.



> Antic are pleased to announce the opening of their latest venture ‘The Effra Social’ on Effra Road, Brixton SW2 1DF on the 28th of February 2013. Previously a Conservative club the feel of the pub will hark back to the days of  former glory with a definite nod to the 1970’s.
> 
> The venue itself boasts two bars, an event space and dining room and is sure to become a firm favourite amongst those looking for somewhere new to drink in Brixton.
> A sample menu can be seen on the website www.effrasocial.com
> ...


----------



## leanderman (Feb 12, 2013)

This is a development on the Hootenanny crossroads we can all welcome. Especially me


----------



## Curly German (Feb 21, 2013)

Twelve of the 14 Antic Limited Pubs have been bought out of administration by  Antic Operations Director, Max Alderman and a Venture Capitalist firm.

http://www.bighospitality.co.uk/Bus...out-of-administration-by-newly-formed-company

I think the whole thing stinks.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Feb 22, 2013)

Curly German said:


> Twelve of the 14 Antic Limited Pubs have been bought out of administration by Antic Operations Director, Max Alderman and a Venture Capitalist firm.
> 
> http://www.bighospitality.co.uk/Bus...out-of-administration-by-newly-formed-company
> 
> I think the whole thing stinks.


so they put the pubs into admin, then bought them up with a new company, thereby leaving all debts behind?


----------



## Mosscha (Feb 22, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> so they put the pubs into admin, then bought them up with a new company, thereby leaving all debts behind?


They make Starbucks look ethical.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 22, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> so they put the pubs into admin, then bought them up with a new company, thereby leaving all debts behind?


 
They have purchased the rights so they will have had to pay something, and the creditors will receive x pence per pound. But in essence yes, it looks like a way of dumping debt.

One of the pubs not included though was 'a site in Brixton that has never traded' which is presumablt the Effra Social.


----------



## bosie (Feb 22, 2013)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> They have purchased the rights so they will have had to pay something, and the creditors will receive x pence per pound. But in essence yes, it looks like a way of dumping debt.
> 
> One of the pubs not included though was 'a site in Brixton that has never traded' which is presumablt the Effra Social.


 
No I think they mean the old Harmony Bar on Railton Road, which they also owned but hadn't opened anything up because their planning permission was refused. There is currently a To Let sign up on it.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 22, 2013)

bosie said:


> No I think they mean the old Harmony Bar on Railton Road, which they also owned but hadn't opened anything up because their planning permission was refused. There is currently a To Let sign up on it.


 
OK I stand corrected. If their planning permission has been refused maybe they're dumping that too.


----------



## Badgers (Feb 22, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> so they put the pubs into admin, then bought them up with a new company, thereby leaving all debts behind?


 
Happens all over business sadly


----------



## Onket (Feb 22, 2013)

I was going to say- I'm sure football clubs have done that in the past.

Not ideal.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 22, 2013)

Onket said:


> I was going to say- I'm sure football clubs have done that in the past.
> 
> Not ideal.


 
Football is absolutely chronic for it. There's a huge number of clubs who have done it at one time or another and several who have done it repeatedly, and it's always people like St John's ambulance that get stung.

(It's why I don't have much time for the 'won't somebody please think of the fans' moaning when a club gets docked a few points but that's a different discussion.)


----------



## bosie (Feb 22, 2013)

I know it happens a lot in business but what about the people who supplied good/services to those pubs and now won't get payment? They might not all have been big business, many could have been independent/sole traders etc.

I do like Antic pubs and am pleased that the Effra Social is opening up but it does leave a bad taste in my mouth that they have done this TBH.


----------



## Onket (Feb 22, 2013)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Football is absolutely chronic for it. There's a huge number of clubs who have done it at one time or another and several who have done it repeatedly, and it's always people like St John's ambulance that get stung.
> 
> (It's why I don't have much time for the 'won't somebody please think of the fans' moaning when a club gets docked a few points but that's a different discussion.)


 
Yes it is.


----------



## Badgers (Feb 22, 2013)

I have seen it many times. 

Company called *Stuarts Stuff* goes into administration.
Company I worked for is owed money, fills out long winded forms and never see a penny.
Directors wife/mate/brother buys back the company's assets from administrators for peanuts. 

New company formed called *Stuart Stuffs.*
Website changes colour and maybe layout.
Some staff usually lose jobs but all else carries on as normal.

You can set up a company with 'Limited Liability' and go under owing people/companies tons of cash but 'your' exposure is limited to what (£100 or whatever) you set it to. Then walk away without worrying about losing your house, assets or the massive salary you have been paying yourself.



> Contrast this with the losses incurred by shareholders in some of the biggest public companies to go bankrupt, such as Enron and Lehman Brothers. Although shareholders in these companies lost all of their investment in them, at least they were not held liable for the hundreds of billions of dollars owed by these companies to their creditors subsequent to their bankruptcies.


----------



## Badgers (Feb 22, 2013)

bosie said:


> I know it happens a lot in business but what about the people who supplied good/services to those pubs and now won't get payment? They might not all have been big business, many could have been independent/sole traders etc.
> 
> I do like Antic pubs and am pleased that the Effra Social is opening up but it does leave a bad taste in my mouth that they have done this TBH.


 
It would have to be out of the goodness of their hearts, or if they thought they needed that supplier/person in the future.


----------



## Gramsci (Feb 22, 2013)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> OK I stand corrected. If their planning permission has been refused maybe they're dumping that too.


 
They put in a new application for Harmony.

Also they are appealing against the last one being refused. Which was refused because of poor design. They could have just accepted the refusal but are being bloody minded about it. U do not get to be a successful business without hard headed and ruthless.

Im sure they can run friendly pubs. Its in there financial interest to provide good "customer service". But business is business. None of this surprises me.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Feb 22, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> Im sure they can run friendly pubs. Its in there financial interest to provide good "customer service". But business is business. None of this surprises me.


 
Yeah absolutely. There's no reason at all to think that a pub being nice (or otherwise) reflects how the owners act outside the pub.


----------



## editor (Feb 22, 2013)

Badgers said:


> I have seen it many times.
> 
> Company called *Stuarts Stuff* goes into administration.
> Company I worked for is owed money, fills out long winded forms and never see a penny.
> ...


These practices are fucking disgraceful. I've suffered financial loss in the past over similar shenanigans.


----------



## editor (Feb 22, 2013)

Gramsci said:


> They put in a new application for Harmony.
> 
> Also they are appealing against the last one being refused. Which was refused because of poor design. They could have just accepted the refusal but are being bloody minded about it. U do not get to be a successful business without hard headed and ruthless.
> 
> Im sure they can run friendly pubs. Its in there financial interest to provide good "customer service". But business is business. None of this surprises me.


There's loads of corporates that like to project a warm cuddly family-friendly image, but who are in fact absolutely ruthless cunts.

Step forward Nestle.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Feb 25, 2013)

opening night is gonna be a 50s theme night, which I guess means it will be overrun with hipsters


----------



## cuppa tee (Feb 25, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> opening night is gonna be a 50s theme night, which I guess means it will be overrun with hipsters


that sounds bleak unless theyre charging 1950s prices too.


----------



## editor (Feb 25, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> opening night is gonna be a 50s theme night, which I guess means it will be overrun with hipsters


Hipsters are more 70s. Least that's the decade where most of their SLRs come from.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Feb 25, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> that sounds bleak unless theyre charging 1950s prices too.


I expect they will be charging 2020s prices


----------



## Chilavert (Feb 27, 2013)

Having walked past yesterday evening I'd say they're cutting it very fine for the opening on Thursday; the front of the building is untouched, other than a big hole into the basement that had been boarded up and there was plenty of debris outside. The lights were on at 10.30 and I think there was still work going on which proves my point.

Agreed with BH about the 50s theme night and will be waiting until next week to try out out when it will hopefully have reverted to just serving drinks.


----------



## editor (Feb 27, 2013)

I suspect it will be utterly rammed tomorrow.


----------



## colacubes (Feb 27, 2013)

Chilavert said:


> Having walked past yesterday evening I'd say they're cutting it very fine for the opening on Thursday; the front of the building is untouched, other than a big hole into the basement that had been boarded up and there was plenty of debris outside. The lights were on at 10.30 and I think there was still work going on which proves my point.
> 
> Agreed with BH about the 50s theme night and will be waiting until next week to try out out when it will hopefully have reverted to just serving drinks.


 
I think they have form on this.  I seem to remember that when they took over the Sun & Doves it was still pretty much a building site when it opened


----------



## Chilavert (Feb 27, 2013)

You have both vindicated my decision to wait until next week to check it out. Thanks.


----------



## leanderman (Feb 27, 2013)

Told me they will have the outside painted by tomorrow. That is utterly unlikely. Beer selection pretty mundane too: usual lagers anyway, including Heineken.


----------



## Winot (Feb 27, 2013)

leanderman said:


> Told me they will have the outside painted by tomorrow. That is utterly unlikely. Beer selection pretty mundane too: usual lagers anyway, including Heineken.


 
Unlike.

Although the selection in Mango Landin' is pretty poor too.


----------



## snowy_again (Feb 27, 2013)

Although Mango does do box cider, with lumps.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Feb 27, 2013)

Chilavert said:


> Having walked past yesterday evening I'd say they're cutting it very fine for the opening on Thursday; the front of the building is untouched, other than a big hole into the basement that had been boarded up and there was plenty of debris outside. The lights were on at 10.30 and I think there was still work going on which proves my point.


 
Agree, went past tonight the place doesn't look like a venue at all. It's just a load of crap everywhere. Maybe it'll gradually come into it's own


----------



## editor (Feb 27, 2013)

Angry reader comment on the BrixtonBuzz article:


> Yay let’s turn Brixton into Clapham and Shoreditch lite.
> Vintage opening night? Check. Family friendly? Check. Totally devoid of anything different that you can’t get anywhere else? Check.
> Bet they’ll have an advert in the new branch of Foxtons that is soon to open [slaps forehead]


----------



## leanderman (Feb 27, 2013)

Really wish they could exchange sites with the Brixton Road Crown and Anchor


----------



## editor (Feb 27, 2013)

leanderman said:


> Really wish they could exchange sites with the Brixton Road Crown and Anchor


Why?


----------



## Chilavert (Feb 27, 2013)

editor said:


> Why?


Because getting to the Crown and Anchor is a pain in the arse for the lazy SW2 residents such as myself (and Leanderman I think).


----------



## editor (Feb 27, 2013)

Chilavert said:


> Because getting to the Crown and Anchor is a pain in the arse for the lazy SW2 residents such as myself (and Leanderman I think).


But I'd wager it would be quite a different pub if it was situated right next to Hootananny.


----------



## leanderman (Feb 27, 2013)

true, both. had a nice session at C and A last Thursday.


----------



## Chilavert (Feb 27, 2013)

editor said:


> But I'd wager it would be quite a different pub if it was situated right next to Hootananny.


You're quite right. 

I can get the 3 bus back from work and stop off at the C&A, but usually I want to get home ASAP and that means getting the tube, which in turn means going back to the C&A is a journey away from home. 

Heading to the Elm Park Tavern is currently the easiest thing to do, but the Effra Social, jive classes permitting, will be the ideal for a drink on the way home from work. As you say though, I doubt it will be a place for a quiet couple of pints, but it could be good for change from the usual haunts.


----------



## aussw9 (Feb 28, 2013)

leanderman said:


> Told me they will have the outside painted by tomorrow. That is utterly unlikely. Beer selection pretty mundane too: usual lagers anyway, including Heineken.


 
this is a problem with antic venues, their lagers rarely deviate from the bog standard selections from the major brewers.


----------



## clandestino (Feb 28, 2013)

Anyone go to this? How was it?


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Mar 1, 2013)

I had better things to do last night but I will pop in today to check it out


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

ianw said:


> Anyone go to this? How was it?


It's a fantastic venue. Perfect for a HDIF, I reckon. It was like being back in the valleys in the 1970s when I used to play the working men's club circuit. It has curtains! And pictures of the Queen! Pics soon.


----------



## clandestino (Mar 1, 2013)

editor said:


> It's a fantastic venue. Perfect for a HDIF, I reckon. It was like being back in the valleys in the 1970s when I used to play the working men's club circuit. It has curtains! And pictures of the Queen! Pics soon.


 
Fantastic. I do like the sound of it!


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

Photos:

















More pics here: http://www.urban75.org/blog/photos-...l-launch-party-tories-rocknroll-and-real-ale/


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

ianw said:


> Fantastic. I do like the sound of it!


It's positively _made_ for the Mrs Mills Experience. And The Actionettes.


----------



## clandestino (Mar 1, 2013)

editor said:


> It's positively _made_ for the Mrs Mills Experience. And The Actionettes.


 
How about a Mrs Mills + Actionettes + Great Big Kiss party? That would be fun.


----------



## TruXta (Mar 1, 2013)

I like the look of the place. Let's see what the punters are like.


----------



## MillwallShoes (Mar 1, 2013)

TruXta said:


> I like the look of the place. Let's see what the punters are like.


what you mean the drippingly cool irony of middle class liberal/lefties dancing in a working class tories outift?

i'm being cynical. good luck to the place. looks different.


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

MillwallShoes said:


> what you mean the drippingly cool irony of middle class liberal/lefties dancing in a working class tories outift?
> 
> i'm being cynical. good luck to the place. looks different.


It was either this or the place being converted into posh flats.  Good luck to the place, say I!


----------



## TruXta (Mar 1, 2013)

MillwallShoes said:


> what you mean the drippingly cool irony of middle class liberal/lefties dancing in a working class tories outift?
> 
> i'm being cynical. good luck to the place. looks different.


That'd be me and mine


----------



## Rushy (Mar 1, 2013)

editor said:


> It was either this or the place being converted into posh flats. Good luck to the place, say I!


Not entirely true. Antic's investors outbid a local sculptor who wanted to live in the house and use the back part as a studio.


----------



## MillwallShoes (Mar 1, 2013)

Rushy said:


> Not entirely true. Antic's investors outbid a local sculptor who wanted to live in the house and use the back part as a studio.


must be a wealthy sculptor.


----------



## snowy_again (Mar 1, 2013)

editor said:


> Photos:
> 
> More pics here: http://www.urban75.org/blog/photos-...l-launch-party-tories-rocknroll-and-real-ale/


 
Can I ask what are "old school round tables". I'm a bit confused as the whole thing seems to epitomise the hipster thing that's apparently one of the seven circles of hell on here. Retro music, ironic winks to conservative times gone by, 'real ale' as opposed to unreal ale. Curtains! And Exclamation Marks!


----------



## cuppa tee (Mar 1, 2013)

MillwallShoes said:


> what you mean the drippingly cool irony of middle class liberal/lefties dancing in a working class tories outift?


 
not half as ironic as the Antic venture soon to open in Deptford


----------



## Rushy (Mar 1, 2013)

MillwallShoes said:


> must be a wealthy sculptor.


From what the agents said, he was a long term Brixton resident and selling his own home to fund it. The club sold for less than £900K so not a huge step up for someone selling a Brixton terrace house. There are loads of arty types in Brixton who bought houses at knock down prices in the 80s so are sitting on tidy sums despite not being particularly high earners.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Mar 1, 2013)

any cider editor? How much are the pints?

quite funny that an old Tory club is turned into a pub the same night the tories get a slap in the Eastleigh by election.

I wonder how long the pic of the queen will remain graffitti-free?


----------



## leanderman (Mar 1, 2013)

Rushy said:


> From what the agents said, he was a long term Brixton resident and selling his own home to fund it. The club sold for less than £900K so not a huge step up for someone selling a Brixton terrace house. There are loads of arty types in Brixton who bought houses at knock down prices in the 80s so are sitting on tidy sums despite not being particularly high earners.


 
I was told this story too by an artist friend of said sculptor. 

Would have been an enormous home/studio


----------



## leanderman (Mar 1, 2013)

snowy_again said:


> Can I ask what are "old school round tables". I'm a bit confused as the whole thing seems to epitomise the hipster thing that's apparently one of the seven circles of hell on here. Retro music, ironic winks to conservative times gone by, 'real ale' as opposed to unreal ale. Curtains! And Exclamation Marks!


 
Yes. It does seem very hipster.

Going to try it out tomorrow afternoon (opens 4pm)


----------



## OvalhouseDB (Mar 1, 2013)

Ooh, I have a dilemma now - 2 places I haven't been - the Crown and Anchor which is conveniently between the Oval and Brixton, a route I take at least 4 times a day at the moment, and the Effra Social, serving Ay Up ale. It's all wrong, it should be 'Ey Up, (it's my first language) but it has to be tried! Which first?


----------



## TruXta (Mar 1, 2013)

OvalhouseDB said:


> Ooh, I have a dilemma now - 2 places I haven't been - the Crown and Anchor which is conveniently between the Oval and Brixton, a route I take at least 4 times a day at the moment, and the Effra Social, serving Ay Up ale. It's all wrong, it should be 'Ey Up, (it's my first language) but it has to be tried! Which first?


C&A.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Mar 1, 2013)

Love the Queen pic with the bowles winners. A snapshot of social history c78.


----------



## OvalhouseDB (Mar 1, 2013)

TruXta said:


> C&A.


C&A it is!


----------



## TruXta (Mar 1, 2013)

OvalhouseDB said:


> C&A it is!


Trust me, you won't be disappointed. The landlord's proper.


----------



## OvalhouseDB (Mar 1, 2013)

TruXta said:


> Trust me, you won't be disappointed. The landlord's proper.


Excellent.
I'll report back - but it could be a while, I am mostly at Ovalhouse, Ovalhouse, and Ovalhouse of an evening.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Mar 1, 2013)

snowy_again said:


> Can I ask what are "old school round tables". I'm a bit confused as the whole thing seems to epitomise the hipster thing that's apparently one of the seven circles of hell on here. Retro music, ironic winks to conservative times gone by, 'real ale' as opposed to unreal ale. Curtains! And Exclamation Marks!


 
And young people.


You could probably fit every genuine 'hipster' in London into that room there...


----------



## leanderman (Mar 1, 2013)

The C and A is excellent.


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

Rushy said:


> Not entirely true. Antic's investors outbid a local sculptor who wanted to live in the house and use the back part as a studio.


So one private house and a private studio. I'll take the pub please.


leanderman said:


> I was told this story too by an artist friend of said sculptor.
> Would have been an enormous home/studio


For a very wealthy sculptor presumably.


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

snowy_again said:


> Can I ask what are "old school round tables".


'Old school' as in the exact same wooden round tables that I used to see in the working men's clubs I played in the 70s.


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> any cider editor? How much are the pints?


I was drinking the ludicrously expensive Blue Moon beer at £4.50/pint but I think that's some kind of premium stuff anyway.  I'm not sure about the other prices because people kept buying the Blue Moon for me and it seemed rude to refuse


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Mar 1, 2013)

editor said:


> I was drinking the ludicrously expensive Blue Moon beer at £4.50/pint but I think that's some kind of premium stuff anyway. I'm not sure about the other prices because people kept buying the Blue Moon for me and it seemed rude to refuse


 
Google tells me it's a wheat beer, which always cost a bit more. Any good?


(It's the MillerCoors version apparently).


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> Google tells me it's a wheat beer, which always cost a bit more. Any good?.


It was lovely. A bit too lovely. Very cloudy and slipped down a treat.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Mar 1, 2013)

editor said:


> 'Old school' as in the exact same wooden round tables that I used to see in the working men's clubs I played in the 70s.


They've still got some in the Marquis of Lorne...they're so low that if you're not careful your knees keep knocking all the drinks over


----------



## Peanut Monkey (Mar 1, 2013)

Apparently Antic are opening up in the old Babalou site under the church. Lots of work going on in there.
Will the day come when there isn't a pub/bar in Brixton they own?


----------



## editor (Mar 1, 2013)

Peanut Monkey said:


> Apparently Antic are opening up in the old Babalou site under the church. Lots of work going on in there.
> Will the day come when there isn't a pub/bar in Brixton they own?


I don't think that's likely to happen any time soon, but at least these pubs/clubs aren't turning into luxury flats.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 1, 2013)

Peanut Monkey said:


> Apparently Antic are opening up in the old Babalou site under the church. Lots of work going on in there.


They are using compressors outside until about 1 in the morning. Fucking noisy at times. Guess they are sandblasting the paint of the walls.


----------



## leanderman (Mar 1, 2013)

editor said:


> So one private house and a private studio. I'll take the pub please.
> For a very wealthy sculptor presumably.


 
I refer you, m'lud, to Rushy comment at 2.06!


----------



## Ms T (Mar 1, 2013)

Does anyone know if they do food?


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Mar 1, 2013)

I am here now. First customer of the day!

£3.20 for a pint of 'Ay Up' not bad. £1 for a packet of peanuts tho, boo!



Ms T said:


> Does anyone know if they do food?


No food until they sort the kitchen out in a few weeks.


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Mar 1, 2013)

It's much more rough + ready than I expected...they don't appear to have tarted it up at all. Which is good. It reminds me of my long-gone works bar: a shed for drinking in!

No cider though. Apart from Aspalls.


----------



## leanderman (Mar 1, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> I am here now. First customer of the day!
> 
> £3.20 for a pint of 'Ay Up' not bad. £1 for a packet of peanuts tho, boo!
> 
> ...


 
March 14 apparently for the kitchen


----------



## lang rabbie (Mar 1, 2013)

OvalhouseDB said:


> It's all wrong, it should be 'Ey Up, (it's my first language) but it has to be tried!









If the combined forces of the Brixton Nottinghamians and Ilkestonians in exile are more vocal than the Brixton Derbyans , they could be pursuaded to change the pump clips...




			
				Dancing Duck Brewery website said:
			
		

> Not wanting to upset anyone before they had started they decided to get pump clips with both options on and give the landlords and ladies the choice.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Mar 4, 2013)

Seems an instant success. Bit like a drinking hall. Great that they haven't tarted it up.  Will be good when the front bar is open.


----------



## TruXta (Mar 4, 2013)

lang rabbie said:


> If the combined forces of the Brixton Nottinghamians and Ilkestonians in exile are more vocal than the Brixton Derbyans , they could be pursuaded to change the pump clips...


 
That's a lovely pint that.


----------



## Dr Nookie (Mar 4, 2013)

Went to the Effra Social last night to catch up with Dub for half an hour before he went DJ'ing. Suffice to say, loved the fact the bar is basically exactly as it would have been 40 years ago. It reminded me of the kind of working mans clubs my grandad used to take me to as a little girl. So I really loved that side of it. What I didn't love was that the clientele appeared to be exclusively young, white, middle class hipsters.
But then, that seems increasingly to be my experience of London these days to be honest.


----------



## Rushy (Mar 4, 2013)

Dr Nookie said:


> Went to the Effra Social last night to catch up with Dub for half an hour before he went DJ'ing. Suffice to say, loved the fact the bar is basically exactly as it would have been 40 years ago. It reminded me of the kind of working mans clubs my grandad used to take me to as a little girl. So I really loved that side of it. What I didn't love was that the clientele appeared to be exclusively young, white, middle class hipsters.
> But then, that seems increasingly to be my experience of London these days to be honest.


What time was that? I popped in with a couple of mates for a second look because I couldn't quite remember either arriving or leaving on my way home on Friday.
There were only about 5 occupied tables last night. There was one beardy jumpered hipster looking chap but he wasn't eating children at the time, and everyone else looked remarkably unremarkable.

It is amazingly unchanged from when I had a nosey last summer. It works well.


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## Dr Nookie (Mar 4, 2013)

About 6.15pm. It was rammed and I got the last table!


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## Rushy (Mar 4, 2013)

Dr Nookie said:


> About 6.15pm. It was rammed and I got the last table!


Oh, we I didn't get there until 9. Clearly the Social appeals to lightweights. 
Effra _Tavern_ is usually rammed by then on a Sunday and I thought this would be too. Nice and relaxed though. Still think EPT is my new favourite pub.


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## artyfarty (Mar 4, 2013)

Rushy said:


> Oh, we I didn't get there until 9. Clearly the Social appeals to lightweights.
> Effra _Tavern_ is usually rammed by then on a Sunday and I thought this would be too. Nice and relaxed though. Still think EPT is my new favourite pub.


Do lets try and keep the EPT a hipster free zone. : )


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## Rushy (Mar 4, 2013)

artyfarty said:


> Do lets try and keep the EPT a hipster free zone. : )


From reading these boards it is clear that in spite of every other person under 40 in Brixton apparently being a hipster, I still struggle to recognise any but the most extreme examples, so won't be much help in policing this.


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## Dr Nookie (Mar 4, 2013)

Rushy said:


> From reading these boards it is clear that in spite of every other person under 40 in Brixton being a hipster, I still struggle to recognise any but the most extreme examples, so won't be much help in policing this.


 
The men usually look like 'Where's Wally' only with a beard and turn-ups!


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## artyfarty (Mar 4, 2013)

Dr Nookie said:


> The men usually look like 'Where's Wally' only with a beard and turn-ups!


Ironic beard. Ironic T shirt, oversize glasses. Bobble hat. very skinny jeans rolled up, plimsoles. Fixed gear usually pedaled with the heels, and no mudguards.


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## qosno1 (Mar 5, 2013)

I went in on Sunday afternoon and was surprised to find it was nice and quiet. Decent selection of ales and perfect tables for playing cards or boardgames on a Sunday. It got busier by the time we left at 5 but it seemed like a fairly mixed group of people who were there. I think if you're hoping it'll be hipster free in the evenings you're going to be disappointed, but I'll be happy with a quiet pub for weekend afternoons.


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## leanderman (Mar 5, 2013)

Cheapest wine is 2.65 a small glass and  12.75 a bottle.


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## TruXta (Mar 5, 2013)




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## leanderman (Mar 5, 2013)

Pretty good price, no? (I don't buy wine in pubs). Their list is good though.


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## shakespearegirl (Mar 5, 2013)

That is really cheap for wine in a put. The other day I nearly got stung £9.75 for a large glass of wine. I made the barmaid take it back as she'd automatically given me the more expensive sauvignon blanc without pointing out the cheaper one on the menu. Still £7 though.


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## colacubes (Mar 5, 2013)

Assuming by small you mean 175ml that's really good.  If it's 125ml it's still not too bad and a damn sight cheaper than the Hoot (£4ish for a glass).


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## TruXta (Mar 5, 2013)

I did a  because the beer isn't very cheap.


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## editor (Mar 5, 2013)

shakespearegirl said:


> That is really cheap for wine in a put. The other day I nearly got stung £9.75 for a large glass of wine. I made the barmaid take it back as she'd automatically given me the more expensive sauvignon blanc without pointing out the cheaper one on the menu. Still £7 though.


I think the Albert is even cheaper. Am I right nipsla?


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## colacubes (Mar 5, 2013)

editor said:


> I think the Albert is even cheaper. Am I right nipsla?


 
Loads - for a large glass it's between £3.50 and £5 depending on which one you get.


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## leanderman (Mar 5, 2013)

£2.65 for 125ml. The other, a little more costly, wines are pretty good: Albariño and Picpoul, for example.


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## artyfarty (Mar 5, 2013)

leanderman said:


> £2.65 for 125ml. The other, a little more costly, wines are pretty good: Albariño and Picpoul, for example.


Albert's drinkable house wine currently £7.99 a bottle
Comparable to Antics hose offerings at £14


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## leanderman (Mar 5, 2013)

artyfarty said:


> Albert's drinkable house wine currently £7.99 a bottle
> Comparable to Antics hose offerings at £14


 
Phenomenal. I really must get around to going to the Albert


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## Ms T (Mar 5, 2013)

artyfarty said:


> Albert's drinkable house wine currently £7.99 a bottle
> Comparable to Antics hose offerings at £14


It's pretty rubbish wine though tbf.


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## editor (Mar 5, 2013)

Ms T said:


> It's pretty rubbish wine though tbf.


How does it compare to the Effra's offering?


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## Ms T (Mar 5, 2013)

I've only been to the Effra once and had the cheapest white on the menu - a Spanish one which was quite nice.


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## colacubes (Mar 5, 2013)

Tbf I would agree with Ms T re the house at the Albert.  It's ok but not much more. I generally go for the wines a bit up the menu and they're not bad for the price.  I will report back re the Effra Social's wine selection once I get there


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## editor (Mar 5, 2013)

nipsla said:


> Tbf I would agree with Ms T re the house at the Albert.  It's ok but not much more.


Not sure what else you'd expect for £8!


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## colacubes (Mar 5, 2013)

editor said:


> Not sure what else you'd expect for £8!


 
This is entirely true tbh


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## artyfarty (Mar 5, 2013)

nipsla said:


> This is entirely true tbh


Yeah but, no but yeah... my point was most pub house wines typically sold for £14 and upwards are bearable at best. The stuff in the Albert is £8 and bearable, I applaud the fact they probably buy it for £2 to £3 and sell it at £8 rather than buy it at £2 to £3 and sell it for >£14 like other places do. It's expensive to run a pub or restaurant I know having worked in them, rent, rates, staff wages, bills, owners salary, it's long hours etc. But if you're gonna sell cheap table wine sell it for a reasonable price. The Albert does.


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## leanderman (Mar 5, 2013)

I suspect the mark-ups might be similar-ish.


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## colacubes (Mar 5, 2013)

artyfarty said:


> Yeah but, no but yeah... my point was most pub house wines typically sold for £14 and upwards are bearable at best. The stuff in the Albert is £8 and bearable, I applaud the fact they probably buy it for £2 to £3 and sell it at £8 rather than buy it at £2 to £3 and sell it for >£14 like other places do. It's expensive to run a pub or restaurant I know having worked in them, rent, rates, staff wages, bills, owners salary, it's long hours etc. But if you're gonna sell cheap table wine sell it for a reasonable price. The Albert does.


 
It's also a massive brewery pub and they can afford to take more of a hit on it than other places. Economic arguments don't really work on this tbh. Same goes for Wetherspoon. They've got it much easier re selling decentish wine cheaply than other places.


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## zenie (Mar 8, 2013)

Went on wednesday night, was pleased that the drinks prices are reasonable. (two singles and mixers, one pint, less than a tenner  )

Did feel very out of place, and perhaps a bit paranoid that the group I was with was getting a lot of stares from the bar staff  

Felt like Bethnal Green Working Mens Club to me, and is a bit like sitting in a box to have a drink. I hope they do stuff with that stage, would be great to have cabaret in Brixton.


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## OvalhouseDB (Mar 8, 2013)

lang rabbie said:


> If the combined forces of the Brixton Nottinghamians and Ilkestonians in exile are more vocal than the Brixton Derbyans , they could be pursuaded to change the pump clips...


 
My Dad was born in Ilkeston. Or possibly Heanor. Shipley pit family.
Me: Nott'n'um.
They need to change those clips!


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## gaijingirl (Mar 9, 2013)

Popped in here today with oldest girl on the way back from the park.. I really liked the rooms and space - really quite fascinating.  The little side room is amazing too - if very damp and smelly.  But loved all the memorabilia - would like to go again with an adult to spend more time looking at it all properly.  It's a very atmospheric place.


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## leanderman (Mar 9, 2013)

was in there too: 3-5pm. still don't know what to make of it. reminds me of a Royal British Legion club or Fawlty Towers


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## Winot (Mar 21, 2013)

What a great place. I hope they don't update it. I particularly like the lone scarf hanging on the coat rack on the way in.


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## TruXta (Mar 21, 2013)

What's upstairs?


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## gaijingirl (Mar 21, 2013)

TruXta said:


> What's upstairs?


 
I think it's a private property.  I say this because a few years ago it was for sale - I looked at the brochure - but part of the deal was that you had to be happy to let the social club underneath to continue.  I can't remember the details but it was all very odd.


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## TruXta (Mar 21, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> I think it's a private property. I say this because a few years ago it was for sale - I looked at the brochure - but part of the deal was that you had to be happy to let the social club underneath to continue. I can't remember the details but it was all very odd.


Weird. But kinda matches up to the info that this sculptor dude wanted to buy it too, using it as part studio, part residence.


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## Rushy (Mar 21, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> I think it's a private property.  I say this because a few years ago it was for sale - I looked at the brochure - but part of the deal was that you had to be happy to let the social club underneath to continue.  I can't remember the details but it was all very odd.


They tried to sell the front part years ago when they were going bust but wanted to retain access through the middle to the back bar rooms. Made it more or less impossible to sell. Instead they got an investor who I think gave up waiting for them to pay back the capital - hence the sale. It's all part of the Effra Social.


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## editor (Mar 22, 2013)

Antic are letting community groups use the old committee room in the front, which is rather nice.


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## leanderman (Mar 22, 2013)

editor said:


> Antic are letting community groups use the old committee room in the front, which is rather nice.



Yep. And my six-year-old for her birthday next week.


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## Winot (Mar 22, 2013)

leanderman said:


> Yep. And my six-year-old for her birthday next week.


 
Cool as fuck.

I decided after last night's visit that it's actually a Duchampian art installation, with the venue and contents being one big objet trouvé. 

I probably drank too much again.


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## Mosscha (Mar 23, 2013)

Update from finchannel.com



> As Caterer and Hotelkeeper said, a report by administrator Chantrey Vellacott DFK, filed at Companies House, showed that Antic owed £2.59m to unsecured creditors. That included £76,190 owed to Albion Wine Shippers, £13,632 to Euroboozer, £20,295 to Greene King Brewery and Retailing and £202,616 to Thames Water.
> 
> However the biggest creditor by far was HM Revenue and Customs, which was owed more than £1.7m.
> 
> ...


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## Mrs Magpie (Mar 23, 2013)

Winot said:


> the venue and contents being one big objet trouvé.


No, that's my house, including the residents.


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## Winot (Mar 23, 2013)

Mrs Magpie said:


> No, that's my house, including the residents.



Mine is more objets perdus :-(


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## Gramsci (Mar 23, 2013)

Mosscha said:


> Update from finchannel.com


 
I think its been mentioned before but the newly formed Gregarious Ltd is head up by Max Alderman who was company secretary of Antic ltd until January 2012.

Alderman is also "operation director" of Antic London which is separate company. So despite being in reality run by same people is not liable for debts on Antic ltd. Antic ltd covered 14 pubs 12 of which which are going to "Gregarious".

See here

Also here

quote from article




> Gregarious was founded two weeks ago by Max Alderman, former company secretary of Antic Limited and operations director for Antic London, its parent company, which did not go into liquidation.
> He said: “The opportunity arose to take control of a group of pubs that I had an intimate knowledge of over the years.
> “All are great local pubs much loved by their regulars and we want to continue to deliver great beer, food and service in the slightly quirky manner that all have become known for, whilst ensuring they have a bright and safe future.”
> Antic’s financial problems were the result of an over expansion “which compromised cash flow,” said Alderman.
> “The units that have come across to Gregarious will be entirely ring fenced and self-sustaining, and will not encounter the same problems.”


 


> which compromised cash flow,


 ie they fucked up. According to other article they attempted to buy up property to keep there business afloat . I suppose they thought in London that property was good investment. They took a gamble and it did not work out. Oh it did as the same people are back in business.

How capitalism works.


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## madolesance (Mar 24, 2013)

N





shakespearegirl said:


> I think that might have been his name. i spent many many a sunday in there till the wee hours. Even though I had to work on a Monday. Remember being very upset when they stopped the best roasts in Brixton.


Nervous Stephen!


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## Yelkcub (Nov 15, 2013)

Bohemia Finchley has just been evicted.


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## Onket (Nov 15, 2013)

Is that the same people?


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## editor (Nov 15, 2013)

Onket said:


> Is that the same people?


Here's the story behind it:
http://www.guardian-series.co.uk/your_local_areas/10560355.print/

Seems it was a popular pub:
http://www.facebook.com/FinchleyBohemia/posts/503675933048227


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## Onket (Nov 15, 2013)

That pub isn't mentioned in that article, is it?


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## Pinggoombah (Nov 15, 2013)

More here, from last August after "Gregarious Ltd" took over the pub. Gregarious is run by the same people who ran Antic Ltd before it went bankrupt after owing £2.59m. (£76,190 to Albion Wine Shippers, £13,632 to Euroboozer, £20,295 to Greene King Brewery and Retailing and £202,616 to Thames Water, the rest to HMRC)

http://www.times-series.co.uk/news/10623759.Owners_of_The_Bohemia_pub__looking_for_new_tenants_/



> A spokesman for Mitchells & Butlers [the landlords] said "During the last few months we have given Gregarious ample opportunity to agree terms and sign a new lease. Unfortunately the terms of the lease have not been met, and the licence agreement expired resulting in Gregarious Ltd having to leave the property.
> 
> Looking forward we will continue to explore opportunities for the site and secure a new tenant"



And from here


> Jasmine [employee] said: “We kind of knew we weren’t doing massively well and we were worried about our jobs but it was a surprise.


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## Pinggoombah (Nov 15, 2013)

And here is how the pub got squatted in October

http://wwwbrokenbarnet.blogspot.co.uk/2013/09/antic-bohemia-occupied-and-about-to-re.html



> This morning, to everyone's surprise news broke that the Bohemia had been occupied, by squatters/activists associated with the People's Library in Friern Barnet. Mrs Angry received an invitation from Phoenix, veteran occupier and community activist, to visit the new enterprise: so off she went. I suppose_ I_ have to do the dishwasher then, said Miss Angry, primly, by now used to her feckless mother rushing off, at the drop of a hat, to join dreadlocked activists in community squats. If it's not too much trouble, Miss A, agreed her embarrassing mum.


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## clandestino (Nov 15, 2013)

I'm a bit confused by all this. How does it relate to the Effra Social and the Antic pubs in south London?


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## Gramsci (Nov 15, 2013)

Pinggoombah said:


> And here is how the pub got squatted in October
> 
> http://wwwbrokenbarnet.blogspot.co.uk/2013/09/antic-bohemia-occupied-and-about-to-re.html



This is interesting blog. Interesting to see that other parts of London have the same arguments going on as in Brixton.


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## snowy_again (Nov 15, 2013)

Same chain of owners through different companies on which they alternate directorships. All related, but shuffle around the chain of credit until it's unpaid beyond normal terms in the pub world, then start again with a new company after liquidation forces Companies House to take action. Move on to ventures new with your creditors coping with your £0.10p to the £1 liquidation costs, and a new company with new credit lines approaching the same suppliers for stock. Allegedly.


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## Pinggoombah (Nov 16, 2013)

clandestino said:


> I'm a bit confused by all this. How does it relate to the Effra Social and the Antic pubs in south London?


What snowy_again said.

Also, they've expanded too fast. Nice pubs, but whatever you do, don't lend them any money.


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## Yelkcub (Nov 16, 2013)

Video of Bohemia eviction: http://bambuser.com/v/4101256?v=m


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## editor (Nov 16, 2013)

What the fuck are the dogs doing there?


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## Yelkcub (Nov 16, 2013)

editor said:


> What the fuck are the dogs doing there?


Not sure. Are they with the coppers or the bailiffs?


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## dbs1fan (Nov 17, 2013)

Effra Social meal in the restaurant was LOVELY-recommend it for local Xmas do's.


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 17, 2013)

It's not really a 'family' pub is it? I've never seen any families in there.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 17, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> It's not really a 'family' pub is it? I've never seen any families in there.



it's fine in the daytime.. I've been in for a swift half a couple of times with one or two of my daughters and my friend runs a family rave thing there .. http://www.bigfishlittlefishevents.co.uk


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 17, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> it's fine in the daytime.. I've been in for a swift half a couple of times with one or two of my daughters and my friend runs a family rave thing there .. http://www.bigfishlittlefishevents.co.uk


classic - a family rave  I love it - "2 to 4 hour party people"


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## boohoo (Nov 17, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> classic - a family rave  I love it - "2 to 4 hour party people"


We went yesterday as I'll review it for little Lambeth - was very good.


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 17, 2013)

boohoo said:


> We went yesterday as I'll review it for little Lambeth - was very good.


Good. I guess I've only been in the Effra evenings or Sunday afternoons when it seemed to be 100% full of 20-30 year olds.

That Big Fish Little Fish thing looks ace


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## gaijingirl (Nov 17, 2013)

she's been really successful really quickly and branched out into north London.  She's also totally lovely.


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 17, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> she's been really successful really quickly and branched out into north London.  She's also totally lovely.


me and mellifluous lady really want to go but we havent got a kid yet


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## gaijingirl (Nov 17, 2013)

Brixton Hatter said:


> me and mellifluous lady really want to go but we havent got a kid yet



take ours!  We won't mind...


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## colacubes (Nov 17, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> she's been really successful really quickly and branched out into north London.  She's also totally lovely.



She's done really well. I'm on the DJ list and have never been called up as she keeps getting actual proper good DJs to do it.


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## gaijingirl (Nov 17, 2013)

colacubes said:


> She's done really well. I'm on the DJ list and have never been called up as she keeps getting actual proper good DJs to do it.



I know - it's really impressive.  I keep wondering when we'll see your name on the line up though.. you're up there, for me, with the biggies!!


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## colacubes (Nov 17, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> I know - it's really impressive.  I keep wondering when we'll see your name on the line up though.. you're up there, for me, with the biggies!!



lol 

eta - the one I was scheduled to do I was bumped by a really good club DJ and someone from Radio 1   Which frankly is fair enough


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## cuppa tee (Nov 17, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> family rave



A bit confused by the ticket prices, is it £8 for an adult £ 4.50 for a kid, and babes in arms go free ?


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## gaijingirl (Nov 17, 2013)

cuppa tee said:


> A bit confused by the ticket prices, is it £8 for an adult £ 4.50 for a kid, and babes in arms go free ?



yep


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## cuppa tee (Nov 17, 2013)

gaijingirl said:


> yep


You raised my hopes for a minute there, £4.50 would be a small price to pay for a bit of peace and quiet but I now see kids have to be accompanied by the parents.


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## Onket (Nov 18, 2013)

boohoo post: 12709888 said:
			
		

> We went yesterday as I'll review it for little Lambeth - was very good.



Another mate also went to this.

Make sure you link to your review.


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## editor (Nov 18, 2013)

Review of the Big Fish thing here:
http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2013/11/...tle-fish-family-rave-returns-to-effra-social/


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## Yelkcub (Nov 18, 2013)

editor said:


> Review of the Big Fish thing here:
> http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2013/11/...tle-fish-family-rave-returns-to-effra-social/



Ed - the text there says the North London one is Sat 23th Nov, but their site/flyer says Sun 24th. I noticed because we'd considered going but it's bang on Tommy's nap time.

You might want to check/change.


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## editor (Nov 18, 2013)

Yelkcub said:


> Ed - the text there says the North London one is Sat 23th Nov, but their site/flyer says Sun 24th. I noticed because we'd considered going but it's bang on Tommy's nap time.
> 
> You might want to check/change.


I'll forward it to the fella that wrote the piece. Cheers!


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## Pinggoombah (Nov 18, 2013)

editor said:


> Review of the Big Fish thing here:
> http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2013/11/...tle-fish-family-rave-returns-to-effra-social/


This type of entertainment is really very harmful to children's development. Urban children generally don't need more flashing lights and exciting 'entertainment' given to them. They need thoughtful, interested adults to be a part of their lives. A hour in the park looking for worms will do them much more good.

see for instance http://www.amazon.co.uk/Toxic-Childhood-Modern-Damaging-Children/dp/0752880918


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## editor (Nov 18, 2013)

Pinggoombah said:


> This type of entertainment is really very harmful to children's development. Urban children generally don't need more flashing lights and exciting 'entertainment' given to them. They need thoughtful, interested adults to be a part of their lives. A hour in the park looking for worms will do them much more good.
> 
> see for instance http://www.amazon.co.uk/Toxic-Childhood-Modern-Damaging-Children/dp/0752880918


Kids have danced together since the beginning of time. It's even better if their parents are joining in.


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## Pinggoombah (Nov 18, 2013)

editor said:


> Kids have danced together since the beginning of time. It's even better if their parents are joining in.


Agreed, so why do they need all this? 

It's a commercialisation of childhood. Kids don't need it: they need love.


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## Onket (Nov 18, 2013)

Pinggoombah said:


> Agreed, so why do they need all this?
> 
> It's a commercialisation of childhood. Kids don't need it: they need love.


 
And this kiddie disco thingy replaces love, of course.


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## clandestino (Nov 18, 2013)

Why can't there be dancing and time in the park? 

It was our school disco last week and our kids loved it. We also spent plenty of time last week at the swings and in the park.


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## colacubes (Nov 18, 2013)

You can only have one of the other.  That's the rules


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## cuppa tee (Nov 18, 2013)

Pinggoombah said:


> Agreed, so why do they need all this? It's a commercialisation of childhood. Kids don't need it: they need love.


I'm going to agree with this to a degree. Music and dancing are important culturally and socially and it goes on in most societies organically. One thing I think is negative is the use of "cool" in several places in the publicity. I've witnessed kids who are friends with mine getting bullied because they are seen as uncool, mostly because of lack of cash or because the parents are not from a groovy western background or both, I hope the use of the word "cool" is only there to appeal to certain types of aspirational parent and not to kids cos in today's world the last thing we need is more "them/us".


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## editor (Nov 18, 2013)

Pinggoombah said:


> Agreed, so why do they need all this?
> 
> It's a commercialisation of childhood. Kids don't need it: they need love.


Because (a) the kids enjoy it and (b) the parents enjoy it and (c) sometimes it's a nice break to have the entertainment provided for parents


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## Brixton Hatter (Nov 18, 2013)

here's a humbug for Pinggoombah


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## Winot (Nov 18, 2013)

Are there Smartie dealers?


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## leanderman (Nov 18, 2013)

This event is my idea of hell. But I am a po-faced Puritan.


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## sparkybird (Nov 18, 2013)

leanderman said:


> This event is my idea of hell. But I am a po-faced Puritan.



As a childless 40 something, I concur - you'd have to pay me a million dollars to get me in there! 

However, what about us lot?? Can't they do a Big Fish Bigger Fish for us oldsters who can't cope with a late night party - an afternoon boogie sounds perfect!! Home early with a nice cup of tea and a hot water bottle!


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Nov 18, 2013)

sparkybird said:


> As a childless 40 something, I concur - you'd have to pay me a million dollars to get me in there!
> 
> However, what about us lot?? Can't they do a Big Fish Bigger Fish for us oldsters who can't cope with a late night party - an afternoon boogie sounds perfect!! Home early with a nice cup of tea and a hot water bottle!



Distant Planet were doing afternoon raves recently. Moronik  could tell you more I think.


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## rutabowa (Nov 20, 2013)

i'm not going back to another baby rave, but that is purely for my own mental health rather than because i think it would harm my child's.


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## Yelkcub (Jun 12, 2014)

The Bohemia in Finchley re-opened last night. Looks way better than when Antic had it! Cloo - have a look!


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## ska invita (Apr 1, 2015)

Might make it to the Social tomorrow (thursday) for the first time...are these urbanites on the dj bill? editor is that you?


----------

