# Brixton Village - hefty rent rises coming up?



## editor (Oct 17, 2011)

I'm hearing that there's some fairly hefty rent rises coming up for some traders in Brixton Village. Anyone know any more about this?


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## TruXta (Oct 17, 2011)

Only some traders? What's that to do with? Different lengths of contract and so on, or are they singling out particular traders?


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## quimcunx (Oct 17, 2011)

It's not really going to be a surprise if the idea was to give them preferential rates to get them in there.

No doubt the landlord greed will contribute to fucking it all up.  ''If you can't pay we'll get starbucks in there.  They've already say they'll pay more''  

I won't hold much hope for some lovely well-appointed customer toilets any time soon financed by modest reasonable rent hikes.


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## colacubes (Oct 17, 2011)

I think some of the newer tenants were given lower rents to attract them weren't they?  Could be the end of that lower rent period maybe.  Could also be that the owners are wanting to make big bucks now that it's popular.  Hardly surprising, and I wouldn't be surprised if some of the older or quieter businesses go under.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 17, 2011)

It's all Jay Rayner's fault


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## TruXta (Oct 17, 2011)

Preferential rents sounds familiar now that you girls mentioned it. Is it time to take bets on which chain will be the first to move in? I can see a GBK or something like that giving it a go.


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## Davidoff (Oct 17, 2011)

I read it was free rent for first three months. But I also heard from guy at khamsa they had been increasing rent for the less groovy/posh places that were already there to get rid of them. Dunno if that's true


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 17, 2011)

Davidoff said:


> I read it was free rent for first three months. But I also heard from guy at khamsa they had been increasing rent for the less groovy/posh places that were already there to get rid of them. Dunno if that's true



That would be totally outrageous if that were true, and is it even legal, or did they have lower rents to start with?


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## quimcunx (Oct 17, 2011)

Davidoff said:


> I read it was free rent for first three months. But I also heard from guy at khamsa they had been increasing rent for the less groovy/posh places that were already there to get rid of them. Dunno if that's true



There was certainly talk of traders in other parts of the market getting massive hikes and back rent demands etc.

It wouldn't be surprising if they did want to 'sanitise' the BV part by getting rid of fishmongers and the like.

Tbf it would kind of make sense to shuffle things around to have all the eateries in one place so that one indoor area can be kept open late while shops that don't want to be open until 10 anyway have that part shut earlier.


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## Davidoff (Oct 17, 2011)

I found it pretty awful when i heard it. it would be strange because they were giving free rents to new places for 3 months, so it wouldn't be fair to increase other rents around them.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 17, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> There was certainly talk of traders in other parts of the market getting massive hikes and back rent demands etc.
> 
> It wouldn't be surprising if they did want to 'sanitise' the BV part by getting rid of fishmongers and the like.
> 
> Tbf it would kind of make sense to shuffle things around to have all the eateries in one place so that one indoor area can be kept open late while shops that don't want to be open until 10 anyway have that part shut earlier.



and make one of the arcades excluively for the use of yuppies?  Suppose keeping them in one place means they can be kept an eye on.  Maybe they can have their own Brixton Village resident copper to keep the plebs out and ensure their safety


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## quimcunx (Oct 17, 2011)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> and make one of the arcades excluively for the use of yuppies? Suppose keeping them in one place means they can be kept an eye on. Maybe they can have their own Brixton Village resident copper to keep the plebs out and ensure their safety



Yes. That's exactly what I said.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 17, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Yes. That's exactly what I said.



You didn't mention their own resident copper to keep short Scottish people out though


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## TruXta (Oct 17, 2011)

AKA the Shortscot-stopper?


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## DietCokeGirl (Oct 17, 2011)

I hear the new owners are being somewhat creative with heir service charges, in full knowledge that there's a waiting list for units now.


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## quimcunx (Oct 17, 2011)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> You didn't mention their own resident copper to keep short Scottish people out though


 
That would be silly.  These are my people.  They have found me.  They are home.

Have you been to brixton village, minnie?  I'll treat you to lunch or dinner there sometime.


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## quimcunx (Oct 17, 2011)

TruXta said:


> AKA the Shortscot-stopper?





I saw you the other week.  you were chit chatting to a couple sat outside the ritzy.


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## TruXta (Oct 17, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> I saw you the other week. you were chit chatting to a couple sat outside the ritzy.



 Was it two dark-haired people, one female, one male?


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## quimcunx (Oct 17, 2011)

TruXta said:


> Was it two dark-haired people, one female, one male?



Yes, I believe it was.

It was a week past sunday.

I'd seen you a couple of days before too. Walking.  along the street.  with your legs.

anyway this is really chitter chatter chat.


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## TruXta (Oct 17, 2011)

In that case it was my lovely girlfriend and her brother. Rah!


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## quimcunx (Oct 17, 2011)

TruXta said:


> In that case it was my lovely girlfriend and her brother. Rah!


 
Oh, really?   They said some _awful _things about you after you left.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 17, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> That would be silly. These are my people. They have found me. They are home.
> 
> Have you been to brixton village, minnie? I'll treat you to lunch or dinner there sometime.



I was there the other week walking my Irish friend through it, although it was only around 4.30pm so it was empty


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## Roly (Oct 17, 2011)

I just hope they don't murder a beautiful community.


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## netbob (Oct 17, 2011)

> Since late 2009, we have invested considerable time and effort in establishing our two Brixton markets  as cutting edge retail and leisure locations. Initially we worked with a specialist marketing company to offer pop-up shops to entice new retailers into a location that had suffered over the years from high vacancies and low investment. The vast majority of these early retailers converted into full leases at market rents at the end of their trial periods





> Our two markets in Brixton have been strong performers in terms of rental growth. These assets were also acquired as part of the London  Portfolio. Since 2009, we have spent considerable time and effort in re-branding the markets as more exciting places to shop, with a particular emphasis on quality food and restaurants as well as cutting edge fashion. The net result of this input is that rents have grown by some 8% and Brixton Village, one of the markets, is fully let for the first time in some 20 years. As
> detailed in the Chief Executive’s report, we have plans to work with a leading market operator to ensure
> the next phase of this asset’s growth



http://www.lap.co.uk/downloads/lap10.pdf


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 17, 2011)

Roly said:


> I just hope they don't murder a beautiful community.



A beautiful edgy, vibrant, trendy, multi-cultural community, which will be no more once it's overtaken by trendy eateries catering to the middle classes


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## DietCokeGirl (Oct 17, 2011)

I didn't think LAP ran it anymore?


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## editor (Oct 17, 2011)

Phrases like "cutting edge retail and leisure locations" always worry me.
No normal person would use such bizarre language. They use words like "shops" and "cafes."


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## netbob (Oct 17, 2011)

DietCokeGirl said:


> I didn't think LAP ran it anymore?



They still own it, but have outsourced the management to http://opencorporates.com/companies/gb/02186286

Rent is reviewed every 12 months:

http://www.inshopsretail.com/index.php?id=42


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## lang rabbie (Oct 17, 2011)

DietCokeGirl said:


> I didn't think LAP ran it anymore?



My understanding was that 25 year leaseholds of both Brixton Village and Market Row had been sold to Geraud Markets UK.   They are part of the same (French-owned) group as "Inshops" - but I understood that this division concentrates mostly on managing locally authority owned markets.



> Brixton itself is changing and anyone who remembers the problems of the early 80s would scarcely recognise the area, which has become one of the London's most fashionable postcodes



Market Trade News - June 2011


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## TruXta (Oct 17, 2011)

So who actually owns the buildings and the land?


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## lang rabbie (Oct 17, 2011)

The freehold is still with SAP - who have a profit share if Geraud/inShops get the overall rents above a certain level.


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## leanderman (Oct 18, 2011)

lang rabbie said:


> The freehold is still with SAP - who have a profit share if Geraud/inShops get the overall rents above a certain level.



And, last I checked, the family that owns SAP has a number of homes, each worth millions, in North London.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

leanderman said:


> And, last I checked, the family that owns SAP has a number of homes, each worth millions, in North London.



South London not good enough for them then?


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## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> I'm hearing that there's some fairly hefty rent rises coming up for some traders in Brixton Village. Anyone know any more about this?



Yes. It's been obvious it's going to happen since the beginning. Does it really need another thread?

I hope all the people who have been supporting the Brixton Village trendification by spending their money there are proud of themselves.


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Does it really need another thread?


33 replies in less than nine hours would suggest so. The Village is of interest to a lot of posters here.


teuchter said:


> I hope all the people who have been supporting the Brixton Village trendification by spending their money there are proud of themselves.


Are you saying that people should feel guilty for buying a coffee at Federation, then?


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Yes. It's been obvious it's going to happen since the beginning. Does it really need another thread?
> 
> I hope all the people who have been supporting the Brixton Village trendification by spending their money there are proud of themselves.



They probably haven't quite sussed it out yet as they're too busy drooling over what expensive eaterie will be appearing next


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## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> 33 replies in less than nine hours would suggest so. The Village is of interest to a lot of posters here.
> Are you saying that people should feel guilty for buying a coffee at Federation, then?



Well, they should feel complicit in the landlords' scheme. Whether that translates into guilt obviously depends on how they feel about Brixton Market.


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Well, they should feel complicit in the landlords' scheme. Whether that translates into guilt obviously depends on how they feel about Brixton Market.


Well, what do _you_ think?

As for me, I have precisely no guilt _at all_ for supporting a small, local, hard-working, independently run business that produces excellent coffee and employs several local people.


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## shakespearegirl (Oct 18, 2011)

So teuchter would you rather it went back to the empty run down place it was before. It may not be perfect now but it's a great improvement. It's helped small local businesses get up and going and provided much more variety for eating out in Brixton.


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## Ms T (Oct 18, 2011)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> They probably haven't quite sussed it out yet as they're too busy drooling over what expensive eaterie will be appearing next



It's not expensive at all.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

Ms T said:


> It's not expensive at all.



To someone who doesn't work it is


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## uk benzo (Oct 18, 2011)

It's all well and good that so many trendy places have opened etc etc. But what bothers me is the lack of support for the old school established places in BV and beyond. From what I gather, the new places help each other out a lot in terms of logistics, advice etc. Whereas I've spoken to some of the more established places in BV and Market Row, and I get the distinct feeling that they are cold shouldered by the trendy places. I could be wrong of course.


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## clandestino (Oct 18, 2011)

Ms T said:


> It's not expensive at all.



£14 for a main course at Cornucopia is expensive for Brixton. Thankfully there are cheaper options - we had a lovely crepe in the place opposite for under a fiver.


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## twistedAM (Oct 18, 2011)

uk benzo said:


> It's all well and good that so many trendy places have opened etc etc. But what bothers me is the lack of support for the old school established places in BV and beyond. From what I gather, the new places help each other out a lot in terms of logistics, advice etc. Whereas I've spoken to some of the more established places in BV and Market Row, and I get the distinct feeling that they are cold shouldered by the trendy places. I could be wrong of course.



I get the feeling that Brixton Pound is always using these places as glowing examples of where to use local currency and the more established places feature less in their publicity. I could be wrong but that's just the impression I get from their mailouts.


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## Rushy (Oct 18, 2011)

uk benzo said:


> It's all well and good that so many trendy places have opened etc etc. But what bothers me is the lack of support for the old school established places in BV and beyond. From what I gather, the new places help each other out a lot in terms of logistics, advice etc. Whereas I've spoken to some of the more established places in BV and Market Row, and I get the distinct feeling that they are cold shouldered by the trendy places. I could be wrong of course.



Don't know about the others but Cornucopia makes a point of using local suppliers, including market traders and small allotment holders.

ETA Come to think of it, Franco Manca also buys many of its ingredients from the greengrocers next door to them.


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

uk benzo said:


> It's all well and good that so many trendy places have opened etc etc. But what bothers me is the lack of support for the old school established places in BV and beyond.


For what it's worth, my next venture will try - in its own small way - to redress some of that balance.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> For what it's worth, my next venture will try - in its own small way - to redress some of that balance.



Good idea, and I'm sure they'll love you for a bit of free publicity


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## shakespearegirl (Oct 18, 2011)

ianw said:


> £14 for a main course at Cornucopia is expensive for Brixton. Thankfully there are cheaper options - we had a lovely crepe in the place opposite for under a fiver.



I would consider Cornucopia more of a special occasional place than somewhere to pop into for a snack. There are lots of options at different prices, from a slice of pizza to sit down restaurants..


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## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

Like all loss leaders, the eateries aren't going to stay cheap for ever.


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## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

shakespearegirl said:


> So teuchter would you rather it went back to the empty run down place it was before. It may not be perfect now but it's a great improvement. It's helped small local businesses get up and going and provided much more variety for eating out in Brixton.



I'd rather the effort had been made to support the existing businesses instead and keep it going as a genuine market. However, I realise that the landlords are inevitably going to do whatever earns them the most return in the long run.

If the non-market stuff stays contained within one end of Granville Arcade and the rest of the market remains healthy and unaffected then I'm ok with that. However, I doubt this is what's going to happen. Mini-Spitalfields here we come.


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> I'd rather the effort had been made to support the existing businesses instead and keep it going as a genuine market.


You mean like the Nail Bar that was there before? How would you have kept the pet shop open when they're (sadly) closing everywhere else? I'm normally one of the first to jump up and do my bit for local traders, but a large chunk of the market had been lying empty for years.

Oh, and I wasn't sure of your answer: should I _really_ be feeling guilty for enjoying Federation Coffee?


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## shakespearegirl (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Like all loss leaders, the eateries aren't going to stay cheap for ever.



How are they loss leaders? From what I've read the early tenants who are still around converted to full market rates after their trial.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> You mean like the Nail Bar that was there before? How would you have kept the pet shop open when they're (sadly) closing everywhere else? I'm normally one of the first to jump up and do my bit for local traders, but a large chunk of the market had been lying empty for years.
> 
> Oh, and I wasn't sure of your answer: should I _really_ be feeling guilty for enjoying Federation Coffee?



Well nailbars are everywhere anyway, so it's probably hard to compete in that market, but I'm surprised about the pet shop, but then I only knew it existed because I used to wander the arcades decades ago.  There's people who have probably lived in Brixton for years and never bothered going to the arcades for various reasons.  I used to use the pet shop though when I had cats, but otherwise, I can't think of any shop in that particular arcade that I used regularly


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## Ms T (Oct 18, 2011)

I've overheard quite a few people saying they live in Brixton but had no idea the covered market existed.  Did they never wonder what was behind the gates on Coldharbour Lane, or through the archway on Atlantic Road?  I've always used BV/Granville Arcade sporadically - for fish, spices etc from the grocer's, fruit and veg and Colombian chorizo.  But it was a very sorry place indeed a couple of years ago.


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## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

shakespearegirl said:


> How are they loss leaders? From what I've read the early tenants who are still around converted to full market rates after their trial.



I'm ready to be corrected but I'm assuming that what they are paying is the full market rate for a unit in a slightly run-down market whose customers are on the whole not especially wealthy.

The landlords' strategy has been to get in a new type of customer, one with disposable income and happy to spend it on eating out and drinking coffee. It's clear that they've been very successful in this. Now this this new customer base is well established, and ready to expand via sunday paper reviews to people with even more money to spend, the landlords are obviously going to capitalise on it. The "full market rate" is now substantially more than it was a couple of years ago.

I say it's a loss leader because since the place started to get popular the landlords will have kept the rent below what the theoretical market rate is for a while, just to make sure they get their new customer base well bedded in. And until Jay Rayner had written his review saying how it's not only great food but cheap. Etc.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

Ms T said:


> I've overheard quite a few people saying they live in Brixton but had no idea the covered market existed.



Probably assumed it was just more of what they could get on Electric Avenue 

Maybe if it had had the publicity then, it may have been a bit more successful, although I'm not so sure really.  Besides the pet shop, was there anything in there that couldn't be found elsewhere in the market/other arcades (closer to the High Road)?  I honestly can't remember


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## Crispy (Oct 18, 2011)

I went years thinking that the Electric Av/Lane and Atlantic Road parts were the full extent of the covered markets in Brixton. Granville isn't accessible off the busy shopping streets so you had to seek it out directly.


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## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> You mean like the Nail Bar that was there before? How would you have kept the pet shop open when they're (sadly) closing everywhere else? I'm normally one of the first to jump up and do my bit for local traders, but a large chunk of the market had been lying empty for years.
> 
> Oh, and I wasn't sure of your answer: should I _really_ be feeling guilty for enjoying Federation Coffee?



I never said you should be feeling guilty.

I think what's happening is just a kind of economic inevitability. It would happen with or without you personally buying coffee, in the same way that Starbucks will do a good trade with or without you personally buying coffee from them.

I've been a bit uncomfortable about going to the new restaurants etc, just because it feels to me like a bit of a harbinger for the end of the kind of Brixton I've grown to love. But that's just me being sentimental really I guess.


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## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

Crispy said:


> I went years thinking that the Electric Av/Lane and Atlantic Road parts were the full extent of the covered markets in Brixton. Granville isn't accessible off the busy shopping streets so you had to seek it out directly.



My mind map of brixton market is bloody awful even after nearly 20 years wandering around it aimlessly.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> My mind map of brixton market is bloody awful even after nearly 20 years wandering around it aimlessly.



Same as, I always end up exiting a total difference exit than I had intended


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> I've been a bit uncomfortable about going to the new restaurants etc, just because it feels to me like a bit of a harbinger for the end of the kind of Brixton I've grown to love. But that's just me being sentimental really I guess.


I'd normally agree with you, but this is different because Granville Arcade was all but dead and buried seven years ago.

I can't say I'm enjoying _everything_ that's happening there, but I'd rather the place be buzzing and thriving than just falling apart. It's bringing people into the area and established local businesses are benefiting too (Lounge, Dogstar, Albert etc).

The Village is changing rapidly though and some of the signs aren't so good: some of the poets/bands that played on the Thursday lates are already pissed off because they'd been told to 'quieten it down' because it was 'disturbing' the diners.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> The Village is changing rapidly though and some of the signs aren't so good: some of the poets/bands that played on the Thursday lates are already pissed off because they'd been told to 'quieten it down' because it was 'disturbing' the diners.



but I thought these diners were the same edgy, vibrant, trendy people who love multi-cultural Brickers and the sights and sounds?


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## TruXta (Oct 18, 2011)

Told by who, Ed?


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

TruXta said:


> Told by who, Ed?


Dunno. I'll ask the next time I see them (they've stopped doing gigs there as a result).


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

Well to be fair, the racket is probably interrupting their intellectual debates


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## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

I've enjoyed a little 3 piece playing outside the agile rabbit when I was having a drink there.  but I've also sometimes found the music too loud when I've been trying to have dinner and conversation.  It is mostly eateries and so mostly people eating and chatting.

Everyone in not everyone liking the same thing shocker.


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## TruXta (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> Dunno. I'll ask the next time I see them (they've stopped doing gigs there as a result).



Well that sucks.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> I've enjoyed a little 3 piece playing outside the agile rabbit when I was having a drink there. but I've also sometimes found the music too loud when I've been trying to have dinner and conversation. It is mostly eateries and so mostly people eating and chatting.
> 
> Everyone in not everyone liking the same thing shocker.



Whoever's moaning are probably the same people that move opposite a pub and then complain about the noise


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## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> Whoever's moaning are probably the same people that move opposite a pub and then complain about the noise



I bet quimcunx would move opposite a pub and complain about the noise.


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## Ms T (Oct 18, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> I've enjoyed a little 3 piece playing outside the agile rabbit when I was having a drink there. but I've also sometimes found the music too loud when I've been trying to have dinner and conversation. It is mostly eateries and so mostly people eating and chatting.
> 
> Everyone in not everyone liking the same thing shocker.



^^ This.  Was having dinner at Casa Sibilla once and the music coming from the Agile Rabbit was extremely loud, and rubbish.


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## TruXta (Oct 18, 2011)

Fair enough if the music is truly loud, but if the choice is between no music and some (occasionally) loud music I'd go with the latter option every time.


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

But it was the bands and the poetry that brought most people to the 'new' market during late openings (and on weekends)  in the first place!


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## Crispy (Oct 18, 2011)

I suspect that they came for food that night, however.


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## twistedAM (Oct 18, 2011)

ianw said:


> £14 for a main course at Cornucopia is expensive for Brixton. Thankfully there are cheaper options - we had a lovely crepe in the place opposite for under a fiver.



But a £14 main in Brixton probably indicates food of a standard that you'd pay a lot more for uptown or in a restaurant with higher overheads.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> I bet quimcunx would move opposite a pub and complain about the noise.



Nah, she'd be the one making the noise


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

I'm going to start a new thread on what new shops we would like in the market


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

I think everything will be fine, as long as as the mixture is kept rich. In that, isn't it great, you can be stuffed and happy for under £6 or spend £14 for something very elegant, or buy yourself fish and vegetables for supper. Isnt that what is so great right now in Brixton Village? everyone is together there, no hiding, for any class, any wealth. That is precious.

Sure people will complain about loud music, and others about yuppies, but isnt that all part of the fun and the attraction of the place?


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## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> I bet quimcunx would move opposite a pub and complain about the noise.



Well it would drown out the noise of the traffic.


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## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

Roly said:


> I think everything will be fine, as long as as the mixture is kept rich. In that, isn't it great, you can be stuffed and happy for under £6 or spend £14 for something very elegant, or buy yourself fish and vegetables for supper. Isnt that what is so great right now in Brixton Village? *everyone is together there, no hiding, for any class, any wealth. That is precious.*
> 
> Sure people will complain about loud music, and others about yuppies, but isnt that all part of the fun and the attraction of the place?


 
Do you mean Brixton Village or Brixton Market as a whole?

And the bolded bit is what quite a lot of people are complaining is exactly what  BV isn't.


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

h





quimcunx said:


> Do you mean Brixton Village or Brixton Market as a whole?
> 
> And the bolded bit is what quite a lot of people are complaining is exactly what BV isn't.



hmmmm, well, i've seen a lot of sorts of people there, sure the market seems to be developing 'quarters', but its not as if there's barbed wire cordoning each one off...      yet....


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

On a weekend the demographic at BV is very narrow indeed.


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## TruXta (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> On a weekend the demographic at BV is very narrow indeed.



It is? Seems to me that I'm seeing quite a few latinos in there, who wouldn't really fit the rah rah stereotype which is being promulgated of late. Plus out front there's still a solid contingent of Caribbean shops and shoppers.


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

Ok, so maybe Im wrong in part or in main, but the market still caters for everyone. ... dont you think?


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## Crispy (Oct 18, 2011)

Pictures are required in order to adopt the appropriate sneer


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## leanderman (Oct 18, 2011)

A daytime influx of Claphamites is a price worth paying for having such great (and independent) places to eat in Brixton Village.


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## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

TruXta said:


> It is? Seems to me that I'm seeing quite a few latinos in there, who wouldn't really fit the rah rah stereotype which is being promulgated of late. Plus out front there's still a solid contingent of Caribbean shops and shoppers.


I like it in the week and I'm glad it's doing really well, but come Saturday's it's all a bit much for me.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> I like it in the week and I'm glad it's doing really well, but come Saturday's it's all a bit much for me.



It'll be like Borough market soon.  People will be going there just to take photos


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## TruXta (Oct 18, 2011)

editor said:


> I like it in the week and I'm glad it's doing really well, but come Saturday's it's all a bit much for me.



TBF I rarely go there weekend evenings, mostly daytime for me.


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

The





Minnie_the_Minx said:


> It'll be like Borough market soon. People will be going there just to take photos


 owners should make them buy a license to photo in there, and then maybe they wouldn't have to raise rent so much.


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)




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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

Roly said:


> The
> owners should make them buy a license to photo in there, and then maybe they wouldn't have to raise rent so much.



Some enterprising teenager could make a wage charging tourists for taking photos of them


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## shakespearegirl (Oct 18, 2011)

So, its a bit of a victim of its own success. Maybe that will die down with time/once the novelty has worn off.

Still, I'd rather have it there and have the option of going, than having what was there before. I'd rarely gone into BV in the first 10 years I lived in Brixton.

A friend once tried to take my photo in BV years ago and a guy from a stall started shouting at her about taking photos in the market and made a grab for her camera


----------



## editor (Oct 18, 2011)

Minnie_the_Minx said:


> It'll be like Borough market soon. People will be going there just to take photos


On *vintage* SLRs!


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## DietCokeGirl (Oct 18, 2011)

I overheard a customer at one of the veg stalls on Saturday tell the staff they should have told a group of hipsters off for taking photos, if they weren't going to buy anything.


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

Yes, while wearing 'loafers with no socks' , having new age fun, but with a vintage feel!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_5uVdy5YmA   check this!


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

Yes, while wearing 'loafers with no socks' , having new age fun, but with a vintage feel!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_5uVdy5YmA   check this!


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## zenie (Oct 18, 2011)

What's the current rent per sq m, anyone know?


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

yes ... what is the rent, good point...


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## clandestino (Oct 18, 2011)

There is a slightly gated-community feel to Brixton Village. When I went last week, it did feel like it was full of people you wouldn't see elsewhere in Brixton. Or maybe you do these days - it's been a while since I've been out and about in Brickers.

Generally, though, I liked it. 14 quid for a main is too rich for the likes of me, but it's fair point that it should be there as a treat option. As long as it doesn't all become 14 quid a main, then BV will be fine...


----------



## Ms T (Oct 18, 2011)

shakespearegirl said:


> So, its a bit of a victim of its own success. Maybe that will die down with time/once the novelty has worn off.
> 
> Still, I'd rather have it there and have the option of going, than having what was there before. I'd rarely gone into BV in the first 10 years I lived in Brixton.
> 
> A friend once tried to take my photo in BV years ago and a guy from a stall started shouting at her about taking photos in the market and made a grab for her camera



The winter will be the big test - when it's too cold to sit outside what's going to happen to the cafés with mainly outdoor seating?


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

Maybe they'll put out some outside style  heaters.


----------



## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Maybe they'll put out some outside style heaters.



Maybe you could open a hat, scarf and glove shop


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

(((weathermans)))


----------



## paolo (Oct 18, 2011)

This would be my plan:

- Long term (historic) traders: No change in rent price or lease conditions.
- 'New' (premium) traders: Rents go to 'market price' after incentives end.
- Upgrade the basics: Mainly toilet issue.
- New lease candidates: Maintain diversity and independence, I.e. No Chains, and local businesses preferred.

It's possible, I think, to have a place that's not "generic britain", and at the same time isn't in a spiral-collapse timewarp.


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

paolo999 said:


> This would be my plan:
> 
> - Long term (historic) traders: No change in rent price or lease conditions.
> - 'New' (premium) traders: Rents go to 'market price' after incentives end.
> ...



It is possible but we have no reason to believe that is the will of the owners or whatever business is actually in charge overall.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

and wouldn't the new traders kick up a stink and claim unfair rents if others were paying less?


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## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

they're not paying less.


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## paolo (Oct 18, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> It is possible but we have no reason to believe that is the will of the owners or whatever business is actually in charge overall.



Quite.

I worry that they don't know the fundamentals of why BV is currently a success.

The new couldn't have existed without the old. There's - deep breaths now - an authenticity factor. Chucking out the original traders loses that.


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

Because it's pleb-adjacent?


----------



## paolo (Oct 18, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Because it's pleb-adjacent?



This could get verrrry contentious. 

If the new businesses were leveraging poverty tourism that would be horrible.


----------



## Ms T (Oct 18, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Maybe they'll put out some outside style heaters.



I don't think they're allowed as it would be too much of a fire risk.


----------



## Ms T (Oct 18, 2011)

I hear that the new managers are already asking potential new businesses how much they are willing to pay in rent.  I am not convinced that the profit margins for any of the new businesses in BV are that great tbh.


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

Ms T said:


> I don't think they're allowed as it would be too much of a fire risk.



That's what I was thinking, although barring glass windows, there's not much protection if a fire were to break out in a shop is there?


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

Start up costs are a lot though.  They will have still had to finance equipment etc. and many (I'm assuming) are new to having their own business?


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

Well, all I can say is, if they **** it up we can stage a boycott so no brixtoners bother going there. Its not like the area around the market is short of cafe's and local businesses.


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## Winot (Oct 18, 2011)

ianw said:


> There is a slightly gated-community feel to Brixton Village. When I went last week, it did feel like it was full of people you wouldn't see elsewhere in Brixton. Or maybe you do these days - it's been a while since I've been out and about in Brickers.
> 
> Generally, though, I liked it. 14 quid for a main is too rich for the likes of me, but it's fair point that it should be there as a treat option. As long as it doesn't all become 14 quid a main, then BV will be fine...



Gated communities keep people out, don't they? In what way is that happening in BV?


----------



## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 18, 2011)

Winot said:


> Gated communities keep people out, don't they? In what way is that happening in BV?



It has that feel that half the people who frequent the place are the types that live in those communities as they like to be among their own kind see, not the riff raff sorts that go in places like the Phoenix Cafe


----------



## clandestino (Oct 18, 2011)

Winot said:


> Gated communities keep people out, don't they? In what way is that happening in BV?



People live in gated communities in areas that they otherwise wouldn't feel happy about, because they think the gated community makes them feel safe. Brixton Village isn't a reflection of Brixton as a whole, so maybe people who otherwise wouldn't feel comfortable about visiting Brixton go there because they feel safe there - like it's all the "nice" bits of Brixton in one place.


----------



## Winot (Oct 18, 2011)

Maybe.


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## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

ianw said:


> People live in gated communities in areas that they otherwise wouldn't feel happy about, because they think the gated community makes them feel safe. Brixton Village isn't a reflection of Brixton as a whole, so maybe people who otherwise wouldn't feel comfortable about visiting Brixton go there because they feel safe there - like it's all the "nice" bits of Brixton in one place.



Well, the point of a good market place is to gather all the best things together. That's why people go to the market places of the world... because they want those nice things... like this forum, its a successful market place because it has managed to get good things on it.

There's no harm in that?


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 18, 2011)

People who like clubbing/nightlife come to brixton because it has good clubs/nightlife. People who like eating out go to places that have good restaurants. Brixton now has an impressive array of good restaurants. People who like to buy west indian and other diverse foods come to brixton because it has a good market that has stuff they can't necessarily get a good selection of elsewhere. People who like oregano posing as skunk.... etc.


----------



## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

you know ianW, this thread in another world could be titled, rents dropping in BV because of how nasty and grim it is. In a world where markets are all about getting in the grimmest things for the market. And we could be all debating how to make it grimmer... and people could then talk about what a wonderful ghetto it is, and you could be saying, gosh that market prides itself on making people feel afraid.


----------



## fortyplus (Oct 18, 2011)

shops in the granville are either on 1, 3 or 10 year leases/licences. Lots of the 1-year ones are coming up for renewal, and with a waiting list for units one should expect the landlords to ask for a bit more rent. But what is crap is that they (InShops and before them, LAP) have done absolutely nothing to promote the market; they are just riding on the coat-tails of the work done by their tenants in getting the good press and the footfall. Still, that's how capitalism works. Create a great business and turn around the value of your landlord's property, and hey, the landlord puts you out of business with a rent rise.
The people coming through the market are as varied as the trades there. Monday-Wednesday, it's pretty dead apart from the odd coach-party of tourists with cameras who take pictures of the impaled wigs. Thursday's busier, it goes dead at about half-six, then from seven it changes and the new lot come around for dinner. Saturday it's really busy, massive queue for the fish at Dagons,  plus the new crowds of street gastronomes from all over London. Sunday has a different feel again. But people coming to the market is good for Brixton. Busy shops provide jobs.
Sure, the character is changing; Brixton is changing, it always has.
The street/vintage food/clothing thing will pass.


----------



## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

Roly said:


> you know ianW, this thread in another world could be titled, rents dropping in BV because of how nasty and grim it is. In a world where markets are all about getting in the grimmest things for the market. And we could be all debating how to make it grimmer... and people could then talk about what a wonderful ghetto it is, and you could be saying, gosh that market prides itself on making people feel afraid.



Brixton Market pre- the Brixton Village Revolution was not nasty or grim or a ghetto or somewhere that made people afraid. It was a proper working market with a load of traders selling stuff mainly to people without stacks of money and selling all sorts of things that would be hard to find elsewhere even in London. Most of it still is like that; the concern is that what's started in "Brixton Village" is gradually going to push up rents and change the nature of the rest of the market for good.

No-one wants to make it "grimmer".


----------



## teuchter (Oct 18, 2011)

fortyplus said:


> Create a great business and turn around the value of your landlord's property, and hey, the landlord puts you out of business with a rent rise.



Indeed, because as far as the landlords are concerned, the businesses there at the moment are just stepping stones up to the next stage, which is even more profitable businesses that generate even more rent. And somehow I suspect they aren't going to be the cheap-street-food-selling, owned-by-locals, community-spirit ones that are there at the moment.


----------



## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Brixton Market pre- the Brixton Village Revolution was not nasty or grim or a ghetto or somewhere that made people afraid. It was a proper working market with a load of traders selling stuff mainly to people without stacks of money and selling all sorts of things that would be hard to find elsewhere even in London. Most of it still is like that; the concern is that what's started in "Brixton Village" is gradually going to push up rents and change the nature of the rest of the market for good.
> 
> No-one wants to make it "grimmer".


Don't worry, I was poking fun at ianW who things its a gated community.


----------



## Roly (Oct 18, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Indeed, because as far as the landlords are concerned, the businesses there at the moment are just stepping stones up to the next stage, which is even more profitable businesses that generate even more rent. And somehow I suspect they aren't going to be the cheap-street-food-selling, owned-by-locals, community-spirit ones that are there at the moment.



Yeah, it looks wer're going to have to get french on them!


----------



## leanderman (Oct 19, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Indeed, because as far as the landlords are concerned, the businesses there at the moment are just stepping stones up to the next stage, which is even more profitable businesses that generate even more rent. And somehow I suspect they aren't going to be the cheap-street-food-selling, owned-by-locals, community-spirit ones that are there at the moment.



And the landlords appear to have done nothing - no paint, no loos, no promotion.

Truly, they must be laughing, as the extra rents roll in. It's a joke


----------



## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 19, 2011)

leanderman said:


> And the landlords appear to have done nothing - no paint, no loos, no promotion.
> 
> Truly, they must be laughing, as the extra rents roll in. It's a joke



Much like any other landlord (ie. domestic) who can charge silly money for a one-bedroom flat because Brixton's so trendy, mugs are quite happy to pay silly money, therefore making life difficult for those that don't have money


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## editor (Oct 19, 2011)

It seems like a different world when the Brixton Station Road street market used to reach all the way up to Valencia Place.


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## fortyplus (Oct 19, 2011)

teuchter said:


> Brixton Market pre- the Brixton Village Revolution was not nasty or grim or a ghetto or somewhere that made people afraid. It was a proper working market with a load of traders selling stuff mainly to people without stacks of money and selling all sorts of things that would be hard to find elsewhere even in London. Most of it still is like that; the concern is that what's started in "Brixton Village" is gradually going to push up rents and change the nature of the rest of the market for good.
> 
> No-one wants to make it "grimmer".



For most of the last quarter century -  the Granville Arcade was half-empty as LAP ran it down for redevelopment. Certainly not a proper working market.
As for the street market, it's changing like street markets all over the world.  More cheap tat, less fresh produce.  Electric Ave used to be almost all fresh produce.
Brixton Station Road sold second-hand clothes. A few of those are now promoted to vintage, the rest go to landfill or are bundled off by the tonne to Africa.  People who bought second-hand now buy new from Primark or the cheap tat stalls on Electric Ave.
The Brixton Village Revolution might be leading a revival of the market as a whole, in particular Brixton Station Road. There's a whole range of themed markets - Makerhood, Friday Food, a flea market, over the next few weeks and months. You'll all be able to have a great curmudgeonly grump about those, too. "Not like in my day". Pah.

I regret some of the changes, but they're not all bad and they're part of changing Brixton as well as changes in the global economy. It's a much more diverse community than it was 25 years ago, and I still love it.


----------



## clandestino (Oct 19, 2011)

Roly said:


> Rah-rah-rah-rah-rah-rah-rah-rah-rah-rah-rah!


 
Hmmm.


----------



## Crispy (Oct 19, 2011)

Hang on - so if I go to eat in BV, there are _no_ toilets?


----------



## clandestino (Oct 19, 2011)

Just poking fun, Roly.


You missed the bit in my previous post where I said I liked BV.


----------



## TruXta (Oct 19, 2011)

Crispy said:


> Hang on - so if I go to eat in BV, there are _no_ toilets?



There's one male and one female.


----------



## editor (Oct 19, 2011)

TruXta said:


> There's one male and one female.


Not for the public though. You have to use the ones in Popes Road. There was a thread about this somewhere.


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 19, 2011)

Crispy said:


> Hang on - so if I go to eat in BV, there are _no_ toilets?


 
Yes there are toilets.  On 5th Avenue.  Up some stairs, behind a door which will probably be propped open with a mop.


----------



## TruXta (Oct 19, 2011)

editor said:


> Not for the public though. You have to use the ones in Popes Road. There was a thread about this somewhere.



Never had a problem using them IF you're a paying customer. Usually the cafes and restaurants have a key each in my understanding.


----------



## editor (Oct 19, 2011)

TruXta said:


> Never had a problem using them IF you're a paying customer. Usually the cafes and restaurants have a key each in my understanding.


Even if visitors are savvy enough to ask for the key to the secret loo, it's not really an ideal solution with a growing amount of people in Granville Arcade.


----------



## TruXta (Oct 19, 2011)

editor said:


> Even if visitors are savvy enough to ask for the key to the secret loo, it's not really an ideal solution with a growing amount of people in Granville Arcade.



Of course not, they should have some proper ones. I think I heard someone say the loos are really only meant for employees?


----------



## Belushi (Oct 19, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Yes there are toilets. On 5th Avenue. Up some stairs, behind a door which will probably be propped open with a mop.



Stop telling people about the secret toilets


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## London_Calling (Oct 19, 2011)

It looks like a text book case of business and marketing.


----------



## fortyplus (Oct 19, 2011)

I'm a licensee and when my 12 months ends shortly I can be evicted at the landlords' whim. One of our fellow traders got notice to quit when she complained about the leak in her roof from the railway track above. So I'm not going to get too arsey with InShops about the lack of bogs, much as I would like to; my business matters to me.

But you lot can.

Write to them. The address is:

Tony Fraser MRCS
Chief Executive
InShops Retail Ltd
The Geraud Centre
Wholesale Fruit and Veg Market
Edge Lane
Liverpool
L13 2EJ

The "secret toilets" are for traders only by the way.  They're inadequate even just for us.  There should be accessible, clean, ground-floor toilets. There is space for them (in the units at the back of Second Ave, currently maintenance stores). There's probably a DDA case for disabled toilets as well. Not to mention health and hygiene.


----------



## netbob (Oct 19, 2011)

Is there a group for the traders to represent themselves? My feeling is that one of the other side effects seems to have been it put the kibosh on the traders groups and other community projects that were beginning to set themselves up. But I could be wrong.


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## Rushy (Oct 19, 2011)

TruXta said:


> Never had a problem using them IF you're a paying customer. Usually the cafes and restaurants have a key each in my understanding.


That used to be the case when BV started to take off but lately they have always been unlocked when I've visited. They boast a very European squat and drop. And there is Pope's Road during the day.


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## TruXta (Oct 19, 2011)

Rushy said:


> That used to be the case when BV started to take off but lately they have always been unlocked when I've visited. They boast a very European squat and drop. And there is Pope's Road during the day.



European squat and drop? I've never seen a squatting loo in Europe...


----------



## Rushy (Oct 19, 2011)

fortyplus said:


> For most of the last quarter century - the Granville Arcade was half-empty as LAP ran it down for redevelopment. Certainly not a proper working market.



As much as it is fun to blame LAP they have only owned BV for a few years. Whilst they deserve some criticism it is fair to say they bought it run down and predominantly empty intending to invest a huge amount of cash knocking it down and starting again. When the listing stopped them doing that they followed a different route and have handed it on full and busy with a waiting list. Agreed it is still shabby and lacking investment but it is certainly no LESS likely to get that now that it appears to be functioning. And it is improving a little bit at a time.

I think businesses are brave (and some perhaps a little naive) investing money developing units there on the basis of such insecure leases. I don't think I would do it.


----------



## Rushy (Oct 19, 2011)

TruXta said:


> European squat and drop? I've never seen a squatting loo in Europe...


Less than there used to be but still loads in France. Particularly if you use the motorway "aires".


----------



## fortyplus (Oct 19, 2011)

Rushy said:


> As much as it is fun to blame LAP they have only owned BV for a few years. Whilst they deserve some criticism it is fair to say they bought it run down and predominantly empty intending to invest a huge amount of cash knocking it down and starting again. When the listing stopped them doing that they followed a different route and have handed it on full and busy with a waiting list. Agreed it is still shabby and lacking investment but it is certainly no LESS likely to get that now that it appears to be functioning. And it is improving a little bit at a time.
> 
> I think businesses are brave (and some perhaps a little naive) investing money developing units there on the basis of such insecure leases. I don't think I would do it.


Agreed that LAP deserve some  credit for taking on Spacemakers, and also - in fact - for offering 12-month licences, which are actually quite attractive for startups.
There's always the option of a 3 or 10 year lease rather than a 12 month licence if you want more security of tenure, but you're committed to 3 or 10 years of rent even if your business goes titsup.


----------



## Rushy (Oct 19, 2011)

fortyplus said:


> Agreed that LAP deserve some credit for taking on Spacemakers, and also - in fact - for offering 12-month licences, which are actually quite attractive for startups.
> There's always the option of a 3 or 10 year lease rather than a 12 month licence if you want more security of tenure, but you're committed to 3 or 10 years of rent even if your business goes titsup.


Will they let you take the lease in a ltd company name (without personal guarantees)?


----------



## fortyplus (Oct 19, 2011)

Rushy said:


> Will they let you take the lease in a ltd company name (without personal guarantees)?


no. We did ask.


----------



## Dan U (Oct 21, 2011)

i went here last night to catch a friend who is only in town for a short while.

its certainly changed from when i lived in the area!

we ate at Honest Burgers which was great

any other recommendations? i am going back tonight with my Wife as we are off to see Cat Empire at the Academy.

don't go to brixton for yonks, then twice in two days...


----------



## TruXta (Oct 21, 2011)

Kao Sarn, but be prepared for a long wait.


----------



## Dan U (Oct 21, 2011)

we are planning on getting there at 6ish, hopefully it won't be as bad then.

proper cold last night!

and ta


----------



## editor (Oct 21, 2011)

Dan U said:


> i went here last night to catch a friend who is only in town for a short while.
> 
> its certainly changed from when i lived in the area!
> 
> ...


Leave the posh stuff behind and get down to the Albert for a proper Brixton knees up.


----------



## TruXta (Oct 21, 2011)

editor said:


> Leave the posh stuff behind and get down to the Albert for a proper Brixton knees up.



Offline on tonight?


----------



## editor (Oct 21, 2011)

TruXta said:


> Offline on tonight?


Damn straight, with Nipsla, Bluestreak amd myself on the decks from 9.30/10pm onwards!


----------



## TruXta (Oct 21, 2011)

editor said:


> Damn straight, with Nipsla, Bluestreak amd myself on the decks from 9.30/10pm onwards!



No bands?


----------



## colacubes (Oct 21, 2011)

TruXta said:


> No bands?



If it's live music you want I'll bring my stylophone


----------



## editor (Oct 21, 2011)

nipsla said:


> If it's live music you want I'll bring my stylophone


And I'll bring my earplugs!


----------



## zenie (Oct 21, 2011)

Re; the toilet situation, isn't a requirement by law that any establishment serving hot food have toilet facilities?  Or did I just make that up?


----------



## TruXta (Oct 21, 2011)

nipsla said:


> If it's live music you want I'll bring my stylophone



Don't bother, don't think I can make it anyhoo.


----------



## TruXta (Oct 21, 2011)

zenie said:


> Re; the toilet situation, isn't a requirement by law that any establishment serving hot food have toilet facilities?  Or did I just make that up?



No it's sadly not.


----------



## editor (Oct 21, 2011)

zenie said:


> Re; the toilet situation, isn't a requirement by law that any establishment serving hot food have toilet facilities?  Or did I just make that up?


The was a long discussion about this in one of the Brixton threads. The answer is no.


----------



## Crispy (Oct 21, 2011)

zenie said:


> Re; the toilet situation, isn't a requirement by law that any establishment serving hot food have toilet facilities?  Or did I just make that up?


I imagine there are separate rules for markets and 'street food'


----------



## Dan U (Oct 21, 2011)

editor said:


> Leave the posh stuff behind and get down to the Albert for a proper Brixton knees up.



that was the plan originally, to come down afterwards!

but I have to drive 300 miles to Cornwall tomorrow morning so i have to go home after the gig.

will prob still go for a pre gig drink there too. was in there last night for first time in bloody ages.


----------



## Dan U (Oct 21, 2011)

zenie said:


> Re; the toilet situation, isn't a requirement by law that any establishment serving hot food have toilet facilities?  Or did I just make that up?



its pretty obvious where the bogs are, behind the door that says 'do not use these toilets' which i ignored and used anyway.

its utterly rubbish though that with that amount of business in there it has no public bogs.


----------



## nagapie (Oct 21, 2011)

zenie said:


> Re; the toilet situation, isn't a requirement by law that any establishment serving hot food have toilet facilities?  Or did I just make that up?



I was there last night. Toilets were open to the public. There certainly were some people I wouldn't usually expect to see in Brixton. 50year old suits etc. But the vibe was good and my birthday meal at Cornercopia was superb.


----------



## gaijingirl (Oct 21, 2011)

nagapie said:


> I was there last night. Toilets were open to the public. There certainly were some people I wouldn't usually expect to see in Brixton. 50year old suits etc. But the vibe was good and my birthday meal at Cornercopia was superb.



oh!  Happy belated birthday!


----------



## Brixton Hatter (Oct 21, 2011)

Ms T said:


> I've overheard quite a few people saying they live in Brixton but had no idea the covered market existed.


There was a video of singer La Roux posted on here about 6 months ago where she was walking through Granville Arcade saying "I've lived in Brixton [i.e. Herne Hill] all my life and I've just discovered this place..."


----------



## snowy_again (Oct 21, 2011)

TruXta said:


> Kao Sarn, but be prepared for a long wait.


They take bookings now...


----------



## TruXta (Oct 21, 2011)

snowy_again said:


> They take bookings now...



They do? Hmmmm.


----------



## quimcunx (Oct 21, 2011)

Yep. I've turned up at 6pm just wanting something quick before heading home and they've 'squeezed me in as I'm going to be quick'.

 020 7095 8922

There are loads of places worth eating at though and there are still more places I haven't eaten at then I have eaten at so far.


----------



## leanderman (Oct 21, 2011)

quimcunx said:


> Yep. I've turned up at 6pm just wanting something quick before heading home and they've 'squeezed me in as I'm going to be quick'.
> 
> 020 7095 8922
> 
> There are loads of places worth eating at though and there are still more places I haven't eaten at then I have eaten at so far.


mama lans dumplings are good.


----------



## Dan U (Oct 22, 2011)

if anyone is interested we ended up having a lovely Thali each at Elephant.
very nice it was too and £25 including a nice samosa starter + tea and a can of coke.

tried to get in to cornucopia but booked out.

oh and we had a pint at the Albert as well... way too early for Offline carnage though


----------



## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 22, 2011)

Brixton Hatter said:


> There was a video of singer La Roux posted on here about 6 months ago where she was walking through Granville Arcade saying "I've lived in Brixton [i.e. Herne Hill] all my life and I've just discovered this place..."


----------



## gaijingirl (Oct 25, 2011)

BV just posted this on facebook (the link is to an SLP article):

*Recent rent hikes by the company that owns Brixton Village are threatening to squeeze out your favourite retailers to make room for chains like Pizza Express. Show your support of the traders here and your views will be forwarded on to the landlords. http://ow.ly/1zdEWC*

I do feel really badly for the "older traders" too tbh..

"Long-term fish stallholder Gareth Hodges said the hikes coupled with the lack of car parking had left him struggling.
He said: “All this extra money to pay out is a disaster for us. “We’ve had this stall since 1953, and its never been this bad.”"

But Mrs Magpie will be pleased to know that Steve Reed is planing to come to the rescue... 

"Cllr Reed said: “I will sit down and mediate between traders and landlords to ensure that nothing puts that amazing creative work in jeopardy.”"


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## TruXta (Oct 25, 2011)

FUCK THAT! Pizza Express?

e2a: Steve Reed has offered to "step in and mediate". Meaning "look at me bend over!"

extra edit - canz onez haz FB link?


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## gaijingirl (Oct 25, 2011)

I get the impression that that is just speculation at this stage tbh...


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## editor (Oct 25, 2011)

Pizza Express would be a fucking disaster.


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## TruXta (Oct 25, 2011)

editor said:


> Pizza Express would be a fucking disaster.



Or Oasis for that matter. FFS, do they truly not realise what made the current success possible? Or is it simply a matter of short-termism and greed?


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## gaijingirl (Oct 25, 2011)

I do think that various chain names are just being referred to randomly tbh rather than commenting on any actual developments.. but the fear is obviously that's the way it could go.


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## TruXta (Oct 25, 2011)

gaijingirl said:


> I do think that various chain names are just being referred to randomly tbh rather than commenting on any actual developments.. but the fear is obviously that's the way it could go.



The specific brand names don't matter, no. But this would be shooting themselves in the foot. How can they not see that?


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## gaijingirl (Oct 25, 2011)

I agree it would be disastrous... however, I also can't help feeling that it's kind of inevitable to a certain extent - in the long run, although I still think it's too early for those kinds of chains to seriously take an interest in BV.


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## leanderman (Oct 25, 2011)

editor said:


> Pizza Express would be a fucking disaster.



it's so depressing. can't believe the greed of the landlords and their frontmen


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 25, 2011)

gaijingirl said:


> But Mrs Magpie will be pleased to know that Steve Reed is planing to come to the rescue...


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 25, 2011)

editor said:


> Pizza Express would be a fucking disaster.


I agree absolutely. But I also think it's inevitable now...whether it's a year, three years or five years. There's bound to be more chains moving in as their retail analysts identify Brixton as an "untapped market" ripe for new profits.

The only thing we can hope for is to keep as many of the small/independent businesses as possible. I'd like to see the market owners offer preferential rates for small/independent businesses in order to retain the diversity of the market and try to avoid Brixton becoming like every other high street in 'clone Town Britain'.


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 25, 2011)

South London Press said:
			
		

> Observer food critic and Brixton resident Jay Rayner said: “[The landlords] are penalising the very people who have made the market a raging success.


After all the grief he's had on here.....an unlikely ally perhaps....?

I don't understand how it's good business for InShops / LAP to hike the rents to a point where businesses will go bust and units will be left empty. Unless their business model mirrors the one currently being used by Pubcos in the pub industry


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## Minnie_the_Minx (Oct 25, 2011)

Brixton Hatter said:


> After all the grief he's had on here.....an unlikely ally perhaps....?



Well even food critics need somewhere to eat


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## quimcunx (Oct 25, 2011)

gaijingirl said:


> I get the impression that that is just speculation at this stage tbh...


Probably been reading this thread...


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## teuchter (Oct 26, 2011)

TruXta said:


> The specific brand names don't matter, no. But this would be shooting themselves in the foot. How can they not see that?



Why do you think they'd be shooting themselves in the foot?


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## passivejoe (Oct 27, 2011)

This sounds a bit unlikely. The market units are far too small for a high street brand to bother with... Pizza express with 8 tables and no bathroom?
And I cant think of many big names would want their shiny but tiny new shop front to be surrounded by peeling paint and pigs heads.


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Oct 27, 2011)

passivejoe said:


> This sounds a bit unlikely. The market units are far too small for a high street brand to bother with... Pizza express with 8 tables and no bathroom?
> And I cant think of many big names would want their shiny but tiny new shop front to be surrounded by peeling paint and pigs heads.



Yeah I thought so too. And the long term success of trendy brixton village is hardly guaranteed atm. If pizza express wanted to open in brixton they'd do it on the high street.


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## shakespearegirl (Oct 27, 2011)

The big brands tend to work on minimum footfall and consistency of footfall over the day, so I can't see them rushing into a location where the footfall fluctuates so highly over week days and weekends. The restrictions on opening hours would make it less attractive too.


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## gaijingirl (Oct 27, 2011)

yes.. but these are all things that I'm sure the owners would address if they thought the big bucks were going to flood in.  Places like Spitalfields/Borough etc wouldn't have been ideal either, there are many examples around London of places that latterly one couldn't possibly imagine in their present incarnations.  All it would take is some sprucing up, putting in proper toilets, knocking some units together etc etc within the confines of planning conditions etc.

I just think to the enormous changes I've seen in London - especially to some of the most run-down parts - in my lifetime and I can't help thinking that that sort of thing isn't going to come to a halt all of a sudden.

But... I'd like to be wrong about this.


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## Rushy (Oct 27, 2011)

I agree that BV is not really all that adaptable to the big name restaurants. Maybe whoever develops the site next door will have ground floor commercial units better designed for the large brands.

The Box Fresh bloke has just set up a temporary container village near Old Street which is made up of micro units for designer labels but I think Brixton is a way off that yet.

Anyone wanting a large unit could always rent Brady's ground floor for £85k/year. Needs a fair bit of work, mind...


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## editor (Oct 27, 2011)

Rushy said:


> Anyone wanting a large unit could always rent Brady's ground floor for £85k/year. Needs a fair bit of work, mind...


Reckoned to be approaching the millions, if not higher.


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## Crispy (Oct 27, 2011)

The whole run of sites up from BV, including the laundry, cooltan and the slice between the railways and Popes Road/Valentia Place is ripe for redevelopment. A station on the ELL extension would probably be funded by the developers. If/when the economy picks up, I expect this to happen pretty quickly. It's highlighted as a key redevelopment area in the council's Future Brixton masterplan.


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## Rushy (Oct 27, 2011)

editor said:


> Reckoned to be approaching the millions, if not higher.


I heard that the new owners paid iro £350K for the whole building so they should be able to afford to fund a few repairs here and there.


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## TruXta (Oct 27, 2011)

Any word on what it's gonna be? New pub or something else?


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## Rushy (Oct 27, 2011)

It's to let as A3 on ground floor so just depends on who takes it. At that price and with the amount of work needed it will have to be someone with big balls.

Offices upstairs.


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## editor (Oct 27, 2011)

Rushy said:


> Offices upstairs.


Better nail their desks down for when the trains go thundering past.


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## teuchter (Oct 27, 2011)

Rushy said:


> It's to let as A3 on ground floor so just depends on who takes it. At that price and with the amount of work needed it will have to be someone with big balls.


Bowling alley?


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## Roly (Oct 27, 2011)

Rushy said:


> I heard that the new owners paid iro £350K for the whole building so they should be able to afford to fund a few repairs here and there.



Are you sure?? I heard that Brady's is owned by the council and is going up for auction very soon...?


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## passivejoe (Oct 28, 2011)

Perhaps the rent rises have already kicked in. That would explain the ridiculous prices at Casa Morita. £40 for a meal for 2... two bottles of beer each and enough food to be considered a starter elsewhere. Left hungry.


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