# "anti-facists" face jail



## DrRingDing (Jun 29, 2011)

Evading Standards at it again with poor spelling

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/stand...cists-face-jail-for-an-attack-on-two-nazis.do


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## Pickman's model (Jun 29, 2011)

what the paper omits is that these were two german 'tourists'


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## gawkrodger (Jun 30, 2011)

for prisoner details etc

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2011/06/481406.html?c=on


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## TopCat (Jun 30, 2011)

Write and give support to these lads.


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## MellySingsDoom (Jun 30, 2011)

I heard about this on the "grapevine" recently - from what I was told, Plod had done their homework on intercepts etc to do with this.  Will go and looksee at the IM thing presently.


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## gunneradt (Jun 30, 2011)

what did they do?


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## The39thStep (Jun 30, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> I heard about this on the "grapevine" recently - from what I was told, Plod had done their homework on intercepts etc to do with this.  Will go and looksee at the IM thing presently.



I think you can safely say that this is more than a rumour.


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## charlie mowbray (Jul 1, 2011)

Yes, write and give support. There are many who have done actions in the past who could easily have been in the same situation.


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## MellySingsDoom (Jul 1, 2011)

The39thStep said:


> I think you can safely say that this is more than a rumour.


 
Agree very much there.  I won't mention here (for obvious reasons) what else I was told, but my reaction was a somewhat shocked "Fuckin' 'ell!" when I heard the full story.


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## SpookyFrank (Jul 1, 2011)

> During the trial, Mark Trafford, prosecuting, said: "Whatever these people's actual views about life, politics or anything else, whatever groups they may or may not be members of, they didn't deserve to be attacked in this way.



Wrong.


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## moonstomp (Jul 1, 2011)

Most of those found guilty were sentenced to 21 months , is it just crap journalism why its not mentioned in the article ? respect to the lads in Jail and there families


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## wemakeyousoundb (Jul 2, 2011)

2 still waiting for sentences (I assume some reports are being made).
Feck wormwood scrubs used to be a right shithole :/
I know one was expecting 3 to 4, so I guess 21 months ain't too bad from that point of view, still shit though


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## The39thStep (Jul 2, 2011)

MellySingsDoom said:


> Agree very much there.  I won't mention here (for obvious reasons) what else I was told, but my reaction was a somewhat shocked "Fuckin' 'ell!" when I heard the full story.


 
There is an occasional poster on here who has the 'fuller picture'


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## Casually Red (Jul 2, 2011)

Best of luck to those lads . Is there anywhere a few quid could be sent to them ?


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## Belushi (Jul 2, 2011)

Given the way German neo-nazis terrorised my friends in East Berlin I'm only sorry the 'tourists' didn't end up under a train.

Gegen Rechts!


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## frogwoman (Jul 2, 2011)

I'd acquit. 

Best of luck to them!


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## frogwoman (Jul 2, 2011)

Casually Red said:


> Best of luck to those lads . Is there anywhere a few quid could be sent to them ?


 
I'd like to know this, too


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## DrRingDing (Jul 2, 2011)

Postal orders can be sent.


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## Casually Red (Jul 2, 2011)

cheers


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## DrRingDing (Jul 2, 2011)

> Sending money
> You cannot send cash or cheques to a prisoner at HMP Wormwood Scrubs - you must send a postal order instead. Postal orders take up to 5 days.
> 
> make the postal order payable to 'governor'
> ...



http://www.prisonadvice.org.uk/vc_wormwood?q=propertyscrubs


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## MellySingsDoom (Jul 3, 2011)

The39thStep said:


> There is an occasional poster on here who has the 'fuller picture'


 
Don't worry if you don't want to tell me who it is etc, but would you mind PM'ing me said poster's name if you get a moment?  Thanks


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## sihhi (Jul 4, 2011)

Can we please have full updates of what's happening?


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## The39thStep (Jul 4, 2011)

Wasn't one of them ( Woods) a Socialist Party member. I seem to remember that he ran an anti BNP site in Maryport, Cumbria as a school kid years ago


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## FreddyB (Jul 4, 2011)

That's him yeah.


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## gawkrodger (Jul 4, 2011)

A good lad as well


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## The39thStep (Jul 4, 2011)

strange political journey . I hope Nigel irritable hasn't been informed


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## TopCat (Jul 17, 2011)

The six are very pleased to get letters and stamps and whatnot. Please take the time to write them a letter, makes them feel so much less isolated.


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## TopCat (Jul 17, 2011)

No parasan!


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## MellySingsDoom (Jul 17, 2011)

TopCat - when yo get a moment, could you PM me to let me know who hasn't been written to yet?  Haven't managed to get scribbing yet, but do want to.  Thanks


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## TopCat (Jul 19, 2011)

They have all had letters. They all still need letters over the next year or so.


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## MellySingsDoom (Jul 19, 2011)

Thanks TopCat - I'll get to scribbling then


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## joemac (Jul 23, 2011)

solidarity


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## Riklet (Sep 27, 2011)

Sent them all post-cards from Albania with some german anarcho-sydicalist oddballs i bumped into haha.

Hope it cheered 'em up a bit, n lets them know they are still very much in peoples' thoughts.


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## Orang Utan (Sep 27, 2011)

are they innocent then?


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## Riklet (Sep 28, 2011)

Guilty in what sense? They're in jail...

Hope the german fash are still getting splitting headaches tbh!


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## Deareg (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> are they innocent then?


What has that got to do with anything?


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)

people are writing to them in prison and other supportive stuff.
if they are not innocent, then why?


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## love detective (Sep 28, 2011)

jesus fuck


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)

what?


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## butchersapron (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> people are writing to them in prison and other supportive stuff.
> if they are not innocent, then why?


Because they're guilty.


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)

ok, i just don't agree that you should physically attack someone for holding abhorrent views.
i don't think they should be in jail, but i wouldn't condone being all supportive about it either.


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## past caring (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> people are writing to them in prison and other supportive stuff.
> if they are not innocent, then why?



Because they're serious about their anti-fascism, perhaps?


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## past caring (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> ok, i just don't agree that you should physically attack someone for holding abhorrent views.
> i don't think they should be in jail, but i wouldn't condone being all supportive about it either.



I'm not sure they were attacked for _holding_ abhorrent views - they were attacked for promoting them and acting on them.


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## past caring (Sep 28, 2011)

FFS, what a I doing on here.


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## Random (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> ok, i just don't agree that you should physically attack someone for holding abhorrent views.


 Not just for holding views, but for organising to put those views into practise.


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)




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## dylanredefined (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> ok, i just don't agree that you should physically attack someone for holding abhorrent views.
> i don't think they should be in jail, but i wouldn't condone being all supportive about it either.


       If the fascists were on their way to torch a corner shop or some other act it would be easier to justify.Just jumping them on the way to a concert just seems more like thuggery than a political act.


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)

that's what i would have thought.
however, i suppose there may be more to the case than has been made public, hence the support


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## gunneradt (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> ok, i just don't agree that you should physically attack someone for holding abhorrent views.
> i don't think they should be in jail, but i wouldn't condone being all supportive about it either.



if you attack someone unprovoked then of course you should go to jail.  Violence can't be condoned just because you don't agree with their political beliefs.

It'll tarnish the rest of their lives and rightly so


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)

nah, you should only go to jail if your presence in society is a constant risk to others' well being.


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## gunneradt (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> nah, you should only go to jail if your presence in society is a constant risk to others' well being.



which theirs obviously is if they randomly attack strangers


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## DrRingDing (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> ok, i just don't agree that you should physically attack someone for holding abhorrent views.



I agree that people can think what they want. But if you're fash and organise or worse you deserve to be fucked over.


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## butchersapron (Sep 28, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> which theirs obviously is if they randomly attack strangers


Which they didn't.


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## gunneradt (Sep 28, 2011)

butchersapron said:


> Which they didn't.



Well it looks like they attacked someone. If it was unprovoked ie their victims had done nothing to provoke them, then they are as guilty as charged. Beliefs are not an excuse for violence in any shape or form.


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## butchersapron (Sep 28, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> Well it looks like they attacked someone. If it was unprovoked ie their victims had done nothing to provoke them, then they are as guilty as charged. Beliefs are not an excuse for violence in any shape or form.


You said  "if they randomly attack strangers"  with the implication that they did. Did they?


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## gunneradt (Sep 28, 2011)

butchersapron said:


> You said "if they randomly attack strangers" with the implication that they did. Did they?



...according to the newspaper report they did.  A stranger is someone you have no acquaintance with or who has no acquaintance with you.  It was unprovoked.

It's no different to randomly attacking someone on the way home from the pub because you've had a few too many.


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## butchersapron (Sep 28, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> ...according to the newspaper report they did. A stranger is someone you have no acquaintance with or who has no acquaintance with you. It was unprovoked.
> 
> It's no different to randomly attacking someone on the way home from the pub because you've had a few too many.


That's your 'stranger' thing? Grow up.

Did they


> randomly attack strangers"



Yes/no.


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## gunneradt (Sep 28, 2011)

butchersapron said:


> That's your 'stranger' thing? Grow up.
> 
> Did they
> 
> Yes/no.



I'm not the one condoning random acts of violence.  It matters not.  They're where they belong anyhow.


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## DrRingDing (Sep 28, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> I'm not the one condoning random acts of violence.



No one is.


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## butchersapron (Sep 28, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> I'm not the one condoning random acts of violence. It matters not. They're where they belong anyhow.


Did they, as you claim



> randomly attack strangers"



yes/no?


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## gunneradt (Sep 28, 2011)

butchersapron said:


> Did they, as you claim
> 
> yes/no?



the court would appear to think so.

Lunchtime over.

ciao


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## butchersapron (Sep 28, 2011)

No it wouldn't. Fucks himself and legs it. Cheers gunner.


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## Riklet (Sep 28, 2011)

I wrote to them because they were guilty UU, although the sentences do seem moderately stiff due to the political dimension behind the violence.

The whole 'boo hoo it's wrong to use violence if you disagree with someone' argument doesn't quite cut it with the who two fine gentlemen who were attacked; it's not like they'd invite you round for a cup of tea and a reasoned debate.  These are people directly involved in using violence against people in German society, including presumably pretty vulnerable people.  Their intent in being in the UK was to help inspire and organise far-right groups into doing similar actions, or something along those lines.  So yeah.  A cup of tea and a chit chat, or a proper beating.  But if one disagrees with their methods, fuck 'em, right? 

Hope others are still writing, plenty of 'guilty' people in prisons around the world getting support letters etc for political action, and rightly so in a lot of cases eh.


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)

i'm not sure beating them up would discourage them though. wouldn't it strengthen people's resolve and make them feel their cause was more legitimate?


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## DrRingDing (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> i'm not sure beating them up would discourage them though. wouldn't it strengthen people's resolve and make them feel their cause was more legitimate?



It'll put them off coming on a jollie to the UK again.


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## Deareg (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> i'm not sure beating them up would discourage them though. wouldn't it strengthen people's resolve and make them feel their cause was more legitimate?


It does discourage them, and no, it considerably weakens there resolve and makes anyone who they consider to be an enemy considerably safer in there day to day life.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 28, 2011)

(((fascists)))


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## butchersapron (Sep 28, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> i'm not sure beating them up would discourage them though. wouldn't it strengthen people's resolve and make them feel their cause was more legitimate?


Yeah?


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## Orang Utan (Sep 28, 2011)

well perhaps not.
though i can't bring myself to condone it, no matter how much they might deserve it.
i just can't scrub the liberal out of me no matter how hard i try.


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## Pickman's model (Sep 28, 2011)

dylanredefined said:


> If the fascists were on their way to torch a corner shop or some other act it would be easier to justify.Just jumping them on the way to a concert just seems more like thuggery than a political act.


you clearly don't know anything about blood & honour then.


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## redsquirrel (Sep 29, 2011)

DotCommunist said:


> (((fascists)))


Don't forget their cars


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## albionism (Oct 1, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> which theirs obviously is if they randomly attack strangers


There was nothing random about it you muppet.


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## gunneradt (Oct 1, 2011)

albionism said:


> There was nothing random about it you muppet.



even better
if I could be bothered to find an image of a bowl of porridge and place it here I would.

i suggest you all buy lots of stamps to write to these clowns for five years and advise them to be beware of the showers and that they can then look forward to a shared house on benefits when they get out.


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## Fedayn (Oct 1, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> even better
> if I could be bothered to find an image of a bowl of porridge and place it here I would.



Aaaa, so, forget your previous ignorant-as-fuck, factually inaccurate comments, and then claim a different narrative. You really are a fucking moron. There's a village somewhere missing it's king of idiots.


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## gunneradt (Oct 1, 2011)

is that right

probably where these clowns will have to live too - on £40 benefits for the rest of their lives.


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## Deareg (Oct 1, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> is that right
> 
> probably where these clowns will have to live too - on £40 benefits for the rest of their lives.


I see that you have dropped your wet dream bit about the showers.


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## gunneradt (Oct 1, 2011)

I think the showers wil still be a problem for them

but then they'll be away for up to 5 years so who cares


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## malatesta32 (Oct 1, 2011)

Deareg said:


> It does discourage them, and no, it considerably weakens there resolve and makes anyone who they consider to be an enemy considerably safer in there day to day life.



too bloody right. its stop them assuming they 'own the streerts', dents their precious hard man image and warns them that they cant organise fascist activity without repercussions.


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## malatesta32 (Oct 1, 2011)

this kind of activity also dents their hard man image - when antifascists do not run away or hide but stand up to them:
http://www.edlnews.co.uk/edl-news/edl-return-to-birmingham
great report.


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## Deareg (Oct 3, 2011)

Just heard that all the defendants in the second trial, 9 in total, have been found not guilty.


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## Deareg (Oct 3, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> I think the showers wil still be a problem for them
> 
> but then they'll be away for up to 5 years so who cares


All found not guilty so you will have to find something else to wank over.


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## moonstomp (Oct 3, 2011)

great result for the defendants and there families ,shame the first lot got fucked over ,so much for british justice an all that .


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## gawkrodger (Oct 3, 2011)

Great news


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## TopCat (Oct 3, 2011)

Deareg said:


> Just heard that all the defendants in the second trial, 9 in total, have been found not guilty.


Fucking brilliant news. Those in the nick will be overjoyed.


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## TopCat (Oct 3, 2011)

gunneradt said:


> I think the showers wil still be a problem for them
> 
> but then they'll be away for up to 5 years so who cares



Who is this cunt?


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## TopCat (Oct 3, 2011)

Orang Utan said:


> i'm not sure beating them up would discourage them though. wouldn't it strengthen people's resolve and make them feel their cause was more legitimate?



You ignorance is palpable.


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## gunneradt (Oct 3, 2011)

TopCat said:


> Who is this cunt?


oh I forgot

you're going down too!!

ha ha


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## jakethesnake (Oct 3, 2011)

TopCat said:


> Who is this cunt?


A cunt


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## Brixton Hatter (Oct 4, 2011)

does anyone know if the guys from the orignal case are still in Wormwood, or have they been moved?


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## Shippou-Sensei (Oct 4, 2011)

post aborted.   i don't think my opion matter in this thread  and  i don't care to argue my  position


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## DrRingDing (Oct 4, 2011)

Brixton Hatter said:


> does anyone know if the guys from the orignal case are still in Wormwood, or have they been moved?



Read this....http://leedsabc.org/


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## Reese (Oct 7, 2011)

If you can't do the time don't do the crime!

Its alright be an heroic anti-fascist fighter until you're nicked!


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## frogwoman (Oct 7, 2011)

Reese said:


> If you can't do the time don't do the crime!
> 
> Its alright be an heroic anti-fascist fighter until you're nicked!


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## butchersapron (Oct 7, 2011)

Don't bother -  Leese just pops up every now and then on BNP or far-right related threads.


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## malatesta32 (Oct 10, 2011)

from Leeds lot! 9 acquited.
http://leedsabc.org/?p=578


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