# The Garden Bridge



## tendril (Nov 16, 2013)

Looks quite good. If the government wasn't squeezing every last penny from the poor whilst letting the rich off their taxes I'd be even more enthusiastic.

















https://consultations.tfl.gov.uk/rivercrossings/garden-bridge


----------



## Belushi (Nov 16, 2013)

I love the idea, hope it gets built.


----------



## newbie (Nov 16, 2013)

great idea, but why no growth on the vertical surfaces?  Living walls are one the of loveliest innovations of our time


----------



## _pH_ (Nov 16, 2013)

I popped into Somerset House today as they had a consultation 'roadshow' thing on. Not much to see, but I had a chat with a guy from TfL about it.

The main bridge supports will act as deep planters for the taller trees with lower planting on the rest of the bridge. There'll be benches etc. to sit on which will make it a nice place to have lunch. They can't have anything too tall (newbie) because of the Protected Views. It'll be funded without any public money (TfL are just managing the consultation) by a charitable trust. If all goes according to plan it'll be complete by 2017-18.


----------



## bi0boy (Nov 16, 2013)

> The project will only proceed if the Trust is able to raise sufficient funding to build the new bridge and maintain it in the future



Surely Bridge House Estates have enough cash to fund this or at least fund the ongoing maintenance?


----------



## newbie (Nov 17, 2013)

I wasn't suggesting anything tall, or a different shape, merely cladding the outside with plants rather than reconstituted stone or whatever.


----------



## _pH_ (Nov 17, 2013)

newbie said:


> I wasn't suggesting anything tall, or a different shape, merely cladding the outside with plants rather than reconstituted stone or whatever.


Thomas Heatherwick might not want his nice bridge design covered in plants! I like the bridge, seems vaguely art nouveau. But if you think it'd look good clad in plants, put a response in to the consultation, you never know.


----------



## newbie (Nov 17, 2013)

I have.  Plants and (encouragement for) birds to nest.  There's a lot of fake stone, bronze effect metal and art nouveau around, both here and in every major city. Probably a few big bridges with trees and plants on top as well, somewhere in the world.  But rather than build than one with obvious (and fairly mundane) structure below deck level, growing a living bridge would be truly inspiring.

Mind, experts like the RHS and/or RSPB/BTO may not think it possible or liable to sustain in the longterm.  But that's the point about boundaries, they're there to be pushed.


----------



## Maurice Picarda (Nov 17, 2013)

I like it as it is.


----------



## _pH_ (Nov 17, 2013)

newbie said:


> I have.  Plants and (encouragement for) birds to nest.  There's a lot of fake stone, bronze effect metal and art nouveau around, both here and in every major city. Probably a few big bridges with trees and plants on top as well, somewhere in the world.  But rather than build than one with obvious (and fairly mundane) structure below deck level, growing a living bridge would be truly inspiring.
> 
> Mind, experts like the RHS and/or RSPB/BTO may not think it possible or liable to sustain in the longterm.  But that's the point about boundaries, they're there to be pushed.



To be fair, I think planting up the vertical surfaces of the bridge would be incredibly expensive in comparison to traditional planting not just in the establishment phase but afterwards too. It would be technically possible without doubt, but the majority of plants used in vertical planting schemes are not long lived, there's a requirement for regular replanting which is fine if the site is accessible from a MEWP, but the challenge involved in keeping it looking good on a bridge would be substantial, probably involving rope access teams. There's no public money going into this, the project is to be run by a charitable trust, so vertical planting could well be way outside their budget both short term and long term. And the key to successful planting is ensuring maintenance is financially sustainable in the long term.

I know it's subjective, but personally I like the bridge as it is. Although I do like vertical planting schemes, and the greater use of greenery on buildings (like this).

By the way, did you ever see the one they did outside the National Gallery of van Gogh's 'Wheatfield with Cypresses'? That was amazing!


----------



## newbie (Nov 17, 2013)

yeah, I saw the thing outside the NG a few times, regretted that it wasn't somewhere I walked past every day, to see it change with growth.

ok I take your point, the idea isn't overly practical.  Such is life.


----------



## Artaxerxes (Nov 22, 2013)

I love the idea but I honestly don't think we need a new bridge in Central London, I'd really like to see a new footbridge somewhere between Tower Bridge and North Greenwich to encourage more foot and bike travel and less cars on the road.


----------



## Maggot (Nov 26, 2013)

Artaxerxes said:


> I love the idea but I honestly don't think we need a new bridge in Central London, I'd really like to see a new footbridge somewhere between Tower Bridge and North Greenwich to encourage more foot and bike travel and less cars on the road.


That would cause a problem with the large ships - unless it was really high.


----------



## Artaxerxes (Nov 26, 2013)

Maggot said:


> That would cause a problem with the large ships - unless it was really high.



It would but there are limited crossings below Tower Bridge which I find a little annoying.


----------



## Bungle73 (Nov 27, 2013)

Maggot said:


> That would cause a problem with the large ships - unless it was really high.


Some kind of lifting/swing bridge?  It's the exact reason Tower Bridge was built as bascule bridge.


----------



## clicker (Nov 28, 2013)

But a 'garden bridge' full of soil and trees and plants? Could it swing up and down without the whole lot just sliding off into the Thames?


----------



## Manter (Nov 28, 2013)

clicker said:


> But a 'garden bridge' full of soil and trees and plants? Could it swing up and down without the whole lot just sliding off into the Thames?


Great image


----------



## Winot (Nov 28, 2013)

clicker said:


> But a 'garden bridge' full of soil and trees and plants? Could it swing up and down without the whole lot just sliding off into the Thames?



It would have to be a 'hanging garden' like in Babylon.


----------



## Bungle73 (Nov 28, 2013)

clicker said:


> But a 'garden bridge' full of soil and trees and plants? Could it swing up and down without the whole lot just sliding off into the Thames?


I thought the conversation had expanded from the garden bridge to just "we need another river crossing in east London".  In any case you could have a bridge with plants on either side, but a gap in the middle where the bridge raises to allow ships through Again, TB is like that, except without the plants.


----------



## TotallyGreatGuy (Nov 28, 2013)

I think it's sweet idea


----------



## plurker (Nov 28, 2013)

Ppl I know have been working on the planting /design side of it - I think it's a great idea myself; far more useful/practical than the Emirates line cable car!


----------



## Crispy (Nov 28, 2013)

I like the idea, but it's a shame there's no cycle provision. Blackfriars and Waterloo bridges are horrible to cycle over.


----------



## _pH_ (Nov 28, 2013)

plurker said:


> Ppl I know have been working on the planting /design side of it - I think it's a great idea myself; far more useful/practical than the Emirates line cable car!


Who's doing the planting design? They did say at the consultation, but I can't remember. Great project to work on though, I'm jealous.


----------



## RedDragon (Nov 28, 2013)

Just close Southwalk bridge (no-one uses it and just one bus route crosses it) and buy loads of artificial plants - job done £10,000


----------



## plurker (Nov 28, 2013)

_pH_ said:


> Who's doing the planting design? They did say at the consultation, but I can't remember. Great project to work on though, I'm jealous.



Dan Pearson Studio

(agree on the cycle provision-lack though - would love to see a traffic-free ped/cycle only bridge.


----------



## _pH_ (Nov 28, 2013)

plurker said:


> Dan Pearson Studio.



That's the one, cheers! Right up his street that sort of planting.


----------



## Utopia (Nov 12, 2014)

So Lambeth Planning committee voted Yes last night to this stunning bridge, now just the Westminster side to hopefully approve!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-30015011


----------



## cybertect (Nov 17, 2014)

Much as I admire the vision, I'm rather befuddled by the fact that TfL are going to be shelling out between £30m and £38m from their _transport_ budget, yet there will be no public right of way and it will be closed between midnight and 6 a.m.

It's really a park that happens to run across the river, and should not be funded from the transport budget.

And another missed opportunity of a motor-free crossing for bicycles.


----------



## Crispy (Nov 17, 2014)

Closed at night? No bike lane?
Bah


----------



## Utopia (Dec 3, 2014)

And now Westminster has approved, now just the Mayor to go.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-30301363


----------



## Nancy_Winks (Dec 3, 2014)

Why does London get all the fucking money spent on it?!! I was down this weekend and it's ridiculous- it's like a different country. The grand stations, the new expansive public spaces, the redevelopment. And how *clean* the centre of town is. 

You get off the train and it wealth is striking. Dunno maybe Londoners themselves feel it?

Anyway garden bridge. Beautiful. Give it to pretty much any city with a river other than London please


----------



## boohoo (Dec 3, 2014)

Nancy_Winks We are being done up to be sold off. The city has to look good and exciting for those people buying all the penthouses by Battersea Power Station. 

This doesn't help a lot of Londoners who are getting priced out of even the crappy bits.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Dec 3, 2014)

Nancy_Winks said:


> Why does London get all the fucking money spent on it?!! I was down this weekend and it's ridiculous- it's like a different country. The grand stations, the new expansive public spaces, the redevelopment. And how *clean* the centre of town is.
> 
> <snip>


Because London is a special snowflake and _deserves_ the extra money. The rest of the country can go fuck itself - that seems to be government policy at any rate.  It fucks me right off too.


----------



## Onket (Dec 3, 2014)

EVERYTHING fucks you off, barleymow!

Have they incorporated something into the design for European tourists to hang padlocks from?


----------



## Thaw (Dec 3, 2014)

I think its shit. Money coming out of the transport budget for a completely unncessary bridge that the public won't even have full access to. Maybe something east of London Bridge would be more useful to people who live here instead of just being used for tourists and corporate parties.

http://www.theguardian.com/artandde...-park-where-groups-and-cyclists-arent-welcome

“All groups of eight or more visitors would be required to contact the Garden Bridge Trust to request a formal visit to the bridge,” states Lambeth council’s planning report to its committee, which recommends conditional planning.

It will also be closed once a month for fundraising events, and shut between midnight and 6am, somewhat scuppering Lumley’s vision of late-night trysts.

The area of the bridge is around 6,000 sq m, but the plans show about 2,700 sq m as planted area – less than half the size of a football pitch. Thames Central Open Space campaign group also points out that 30 trees are to be cut down on the south bank to make way for the bridge’s hefty landing podium, a substantial building “designed as a flexible structure to accommodate a number of uses,” which will most likely end up housing retail.


----------



## Belushi (Dec 3, 2014)

I liked the idea at first (when it was meant to be entirely privately funded) but as more details have been released I'm less and less keen.


----------



## co-op (Dec 3, 2014)

Thaw said:


> I think its shit.



Me too

https://aseasyasridingabike.wordpress.com/2014/12/02/what-is-most-offensive-about-the-garden-bridge/


----------



## goldenecitrone (Dec 3, 2014)

Nancy_Winks said:


> Why does London get all the fucking money spent on it?!! I was down this weekend and it's ridiculous- it's like a different country. The grand stations, the new expansive public spaces, the redevelopment. And how *clean* the centre of town is.



Imagine what it's like for us Londoners when we venture out of the capital. It's like travelling back in time to the nineteenth century. Very odd.


----------



## Utopia (Dec 3, 2014)

I went out of London once, never again, it was like the Hunger Games only more real, no wonder tourists don't bother leaving our gleaming capital & its many stunning bridges.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Dec 3, 2014)

It's pony, it's closed for a quarter of the day, it's hideously expensive to maintain (coming out of Tfl's budget) and it's in the wrong place. 

Other than that, yeah, great use of £175m.


----------



## salem (Dec 3, 2014)

Yup, I loved the idea but am not so keen on the reality that's unfolding.


----------



## ShiftyBagLady (Dec 3, 2014)

I'm against it.


----------



## Bungle73 (Dec 3, 2014)

Have to agree. The more I hear about this thing the less I like it.


----------



## StoneRoad (Dec 3, 2014)

Concept and design look brilliant - but the devil is in the practical / little details.

Copper cladding - that had better be well attached, and it'll turn green eventually. Missing a trick to have a dedicated cycle route, and closed midnight to 6am - I presume that will be to allow work such as watering / maintenance to take place. Buzzword bingo - has anyone mentioned "sustainability" yet ?

It might work as a swing bridge rather than a bascule, that would be interesting from an engineering point of view ........ but why in central London in the first place ?

Still undecided if I support it or not.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Dec 4, 2014)

StoneRoad said:


> Cand closed midnight to 6am - I presume that will be to allow work such as watering / maintenance to take place.



To stop homeless folk setting up camp more likely. FFS, £175m + £3.5m every year could do a fair bit for the homeless in town.


----------



## Thaw (Dec 5, 2014)

This bridge between Rotherhithe and Canry Wharf would be cooler and more useful and would 'only' cost £65million (ish)

http://www.wharf.co.uk/2014/10/boris-promises-to-have-a-look.html


----------



## cybertect (Dec 17, 2014)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> it's hideously expensive to maintain (coming out of Tfl's budget)



Boris said yesterday at least that TfL won't underwrite the £3.5m annual maintenance costs.

http://m.architectsjournal.co.uk/8674159.article

Where this leaves Westminster's planning approval, which set a TfL guarantee of maintenance funding as a condition of approval, is an open question.


----------



## salem (Dec 17, 2014)

Thaw said:


> This bridge between Rotherhithe and Canry Wharf would be cooler and more useful and would 'only' cost £65million (ish)
> 
> http://www.wharf.co.uk/2014/10/boris-promises-to-have-a-look.html


Move the cable cars here


cybertect said:


> Boris said yesterday at least that TfL won't underwrite the £3.5m annual maintenance costs.
> 
> http://m.architectsjournal.co.uk/8674159.article
> 
> Where this leaves Westminster's planning approval, which set a TfL guarantee of maintenance funding as a condition of approval, is an open question.


And scrap the plans for the garden bridge and instead stick some turf on Southwark bridge.

Everyone's happy, 3 problems solved and £shitloads saved.


----------



## co-op (Jan 6, 2015)

https://www.change.org/p/eric-pickl...idea?after_sign_exp=member_sponsored_donation


----------



## Greebo (Jan 6, 2015)

Nancy_Winks  want to know how people like me (in an inner city borough ie. poor and overcrowded as fuck) feel about London, particularly the central bit with the tourist hotspots?  

Priced out.  I can't afford to use the tube (I mostly use the bus in spite of its slowness), can't afford to get to even the cheaper exhibitions, Bond Street, Regent Street etc are not for the likes of me.  I love the affordability of all kinds of exotic ingredients, the relatively easy mix of cultures and ethnicities, and the way you can hear four different languages within 10 minutes.  I hate the high cost of living and the overstretched infrastructure.  

OTOH would I move to the Home Counties?  No fucking way because of the even worse infrastructure when it comes to having a physically disabled person in your home.


----------



## Winot (Jan 7, 2015)

I hear you Greebo but one upside of London is that it does have a lot of cultural free stuff eg Tate galleries, National Gallery, British Museum, V&A etc.


----------



## Greebo (Jan 7, 2015)

Winot said:


> I hear you Greebo but one upside of London is that it does have a lot of cultural free stuff eg Tate galleries, National Gallery, British Museum, V&A etc.


What's the point when I can spare neither the time nor the money to get to more of it than somebody living outside the M25?  In the last year, I've got to the British Museum once and none of the other places at all.

Mostly because even the BM is (at best) a 45 minute bus ride away (I'm more or less priced off the tube and overground).  So that's an hour and a half (call it over two hours if you allow for the walk to and from bus stops) just for the journey.  Then you're going to want time to walk around - say another hour for a flying visit.  You might be able to take 3 hours out of any working day* you please, but I can't.  A lot of the free stuff is great (if you can get there), but it might as well be on the moon.

*bear in mind that I effectively have a 7 day working week.


----------



## Winot (Jan 7, 2015)

Greebo said:


> What's the point when I can spare neither the time nor the money to get to more of it than somebody living outside the M25?  In the last year, I've got to the British Museum once and none of the other places at all.
> 
> Mostly because even the BM is (at best) a 45 minute bus ride away (I'm more or less priced off the tube and overground).  So that's an hour and a half (call it over two hours if you allow for the walk to and from bus stops) just for the journey.  Then you're going to want time to walk around - say another hour for a flying visit.  You might be able to take 3 hours out of any working day* you please, but I can't.  A lot of the free stuff is great (if you can get there), but it might as well be on the moon.
> 
> *bear in mind that I effectively have a 7 day working week.



I wasn't implying that you have it easy, or that life in London for many isn't tough (and getting tougher).  I was just responding to Nancy_Winks point that London has a lot of money thrown at it.  In cultural terms, my impression there is much more free stuff than outside of London.  Public transport is also cheaper than outside the capital, particularly for those with kids.


----------



## Onket (Jan 7, 2015)

Council Tax is also lower in London.


----------



## Nancy_Winks (Jan 7, 2015)

There's a load of free stuff to do and enjoy in London and a lot of Londoners (and not just rich ones) make use of it. The parks there are second to none, I went for a wander through St James's park with my mate when I was down recently with my kid. It's proper wow. I hear your frustration that you can't do anything Greebo and I'm sorry you don't have the chance to spend even a few hours away from caring. That really must be very fuckin shit. 

And I know living in London is different to visiting and it's surprising how often you don't take advantage of the stuff on your doorstep.  But when people from other bits of the country (that are a lot more poor overall) arrive it's not uncommon to go what the FUCK at how much money is spent on making London fantastic. Even just the pavements, squares and concourses of central London are a far better quality and a lot cleaner  It's just… noticeable.


----------



## Greebo (Jan 7, 2015)

Onket said:


> Council Tax is also lower in London.


That's beside the point if you're on a low enough income to get a full CT rebate/discount/ whatever the hell the curent label is.



Winot said:


> I wasn't implying that you have it easy, or that life in London for many isn't tough (and getting tougher).  I was just responding to Nancy_Winks point that London has a lot of money thrown at it.  In cultural terms, my impression there is much more free stuff than outside of London.  Public transport is also cheaper than outside the capital, particularly for those with kids.


FYI I wasn't pleading hardship.  If you're commuting into the centre to work anyway, I've no doubt you could use the free galleries etc during part of your lunch break, or after work, so the cost of getting there is more or less negligible:  

What I was getting at is that people from outside Greater London tend to get more benefit from the free cultural events and free museums & galleries than people bloody living here do.


----------



## Onket (Jan 7, 2015)

Greebo said:


> That's beside the point if you're on a low enough income to get a full CT rebate/discount/ whatever the hell the curent label is.


Yes, obviously. But I was making a general point in line with others on the thread, not referring to your personal situation (which sounds very trying).


----------



## Greebo (Jan 7, 2015)

Onket said:


> Yes, obviously. But I was making a general point in line with others on the thread, not referring to your personal situation (which sounds very trying).


I'm not the only person on a low income in this borough, not the only one unable to even get to the free stuff.  If Nancy wants to be angry at anyone, she should be angry at Boris Johnson, who apparently only cares about rich people, and mostly tourists at that.  Not those of us who have to live here.


----------



## Onket (Jan 7, 2015)

I'm not entirely sure Nancy_Winks is angry with the people of London, if she is angry at all.


----------



## Onket (Jan 7, 2015)

I'm also not entirely convinced that you need to be 'rich' to enjoy free stuff in London.


----------



## Nancy_Winks (Jan 7, 2015)

Greebo said:


> I'm not the only person on a low income in this borough, not the only one unable to even get to the free stuff.  If Nancy wants to be angry at anyone, she should be angry at Boris Johnson, who apparently only cares about rich people, and mostly tourists at that.  Not those of us who have to live here.


I'm not angry. Not at Londoners anyway especially as half my family and a lot of my mates still live there. I do think that public spending on infrastructure should be distributed more evenly across the country. No idea why you're taking this so personally other than you feel frustrated about your life (which is understandable tbh).


----------



## Manter (Jan 7, 2015)

Greebo said:


> What's the point when I can spare neither the time nor the money to get to more of it than somebody living outside the M25?  In the last year, I've got to the British Museum once and none of the other places at all.
> 
> Mostly because even the BM is (at best) a 45 minute bus ride away (I'm more or less priced off the tube and overground).  So that's an hour and a half (call it over two hours if you allow for the walk to and from bus stops) just for the journey.  Then you're going to want time to walk around - say another hour for a flying visit.  You might be able to take 3 hours out of any working day* you please, but I can't.  A lot of the free stuff is great (if you can get there), but it might as well be on the moon.
> 
> *bear in mind that I effectively have a 7 day working week.


That's not about London though, is it? That's about pretty shitty support and zero respite for carers


----------



## Greebo (Jan 7, 2015)

Manter said:


> That's not about London though, is it? That's about pretty shitty support and zero respite for carers


It is - where do you think the hotel and hospital cleaners live?  Their hours may be split shifts, but they're just as priced out and time poor (in a slightly different way.


----------



## Manter (Jan 7, 2015)

Greebo said:


> It is - where do you think the hotel and hospital cleaners live?  Their hours may be split shifts, but they're just as priced out and time poor (in a slightly different way.


I'm not being deliberately thick, I promise..... But Nancy's point was not (as I read it) that London is v expensive to live in, but that infrastructure spending is completely and unfairly off the scale in London. And tbf it is- c£5k per head in London (c£4k adjusted for commuters) vs just over £1k per head in the north east, the next best served region. And quite a bit of that £1k is Sellafield decommissioning.
If you then add how much privately maintained land there is in London (I can do the 10 minute walk from my client to the Thameslink without stepping on public land)- land that is cleaned and maintained and scrubbed, and decorated etc by the crown, the church, the aristocratic estates, big global businesses, property developers- London does feel like a different, richer, world to the rest of the UK.

No one is saying that's not in some ways misleading- noone is saying there are no low wage or poor people in London- just that London *itself* is a different looking beast to pretty much anywhere else in the country.


----------



## Greebo (Jan 7, 2015)

Incidentally, I'm pissed off because if there's one thing I hear time and again from people living outside of London it's "you're so lucky, you're featherbedded compared to us, you don't know you're born".

Okay, have a look around some of the schools here, you'd be appalled.  Look at the amount of London schools which don't have a playing field, so children have to walk to the nearest park or common.  Watch junior school children walking a mile (during classroom hours, not their dinner break) to get to the nearest public swimming pool, have an hour lesson, and then walk another mile back, because otherwise the school can't afford it.  Look at the amount of children who do even their primary school homework in the library, because there isn't enough space at home.

This in a city where the rich are so rich that *shrug* tourists seem to just not see the rest unless they're sleeping rough or begging.  Fur coat and not even ragged knickers.


----------



## plurker (Jan 7, 2015)

There's a fucking massive difference between 'where people live London' and 'central tourist London'


----------



## Manter (Jan 7, 2015)

Greebo said:


> Incidentally, I'm pissed off because if there's one thing I hear time and again from people living outside of London it's "you're so lucky, you're featherbedded compared to us, you don't know you're born".
> 
> Okay, have a look around some of the schools here, you'd be appalled.  Look at the amount of London schools which don't have a playing field, so children have to walk to the nearest park or common.  Watch junior school children walking a mile (during classroom hours, not their dinner break) to get to the nearest public swimming pool, have an hour lesson, and then walk another mile back, because otherwise the school can't afford it.  Look at the amount of children who do even their primary school homework in the library, because there isn't enough space at home.
> 
> This in a city where the rich are so rich that *shrug* tourists seem to just not see the rest unless they're sleeping rough or begging.


Why would a tourist see that? Why would a tourist come to Tulse Hill?!


----------



## Manter (Jan 7, 2015)

plurker said:


> There's a fucking massive difference between 'where people live London' and 'central tourist London'


Yes! And poor Nancy_Winks was talking about getting off a train at a Central London station, walking through one of the Royal Parks.... And now she's being shouted at for noticing it was all shiny


----------



## Nancy_Winks (Jan 7, 2015)

Manter said:


> I'm not being deliberately thick, I promise..... But Nancy's point was not (as I read it) that London is v expensive to live in, but that infrastructure spending is completely and unfairly off the scale in London. And tbf it is- c£5k per head in London (c£4k adjusted for commuters) vs just over £1k per head in the north east, the next best served region. And quite a bit of that £1k is Sellafield decommissioning.
> If you then add how much privately maintained land there is in London (I can do the 10 minute walk from my client to the Thameslink without stepping on public land)- land that is cleaned and maintained and scrubbed, and decorated etc by the crown, the church, the aristocratic estates, big global businesses, property developers- London does feel like a different, richer, world to the rest of the UK.
> 
> No one is saying that's not in some ways misleading- noone is saying there are no low wage or poor people in London- just that London *itself* is a different looking beast to pretty much anywhere else in the country.


Jesus are those the figures? Five fold increase spent on London. No wonder it looks bloody good!


----------



## Onket (Jan 7, 2015)

Nancy_Winks said:


> No wonder it looks bloody good!


Careful now!


----------



## Manter (Jan 7, 2015)

Nancy_Winks said:


> Jesus are those the figures? Five fold increase spent on London. No wonder it looks bloody good!


http://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...mes-as-much-infrastructure-north-east-england


----------



## Paulie (Jan 8, 2015)

Manter said:


> http://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...mes-as-much-infrastructure-north-east-england


There's other ways to see this than pounds-per-head.  London's population density averages 5350/sq km. - Newcastle 2460/sq km.  London would need twice the infrastucture?  The Geordies are still getting stiffed though.  Cumbria is getting the Sellafield money but I wonder what else they could build.  It is the region where lots of roads just stop as there's a fucking great mountain in the way.


----------



## Greebo (Jan 8, 2015)

Manter said:


> Yes! And poor Nancy_Winks was talking about getting off a train at a Central London station, walking through one of the Royal Parks.... And now she's being shouted at for noticing it was all shiny


Shouted at?  I haven't even started.  And she'd know that.  

BTW a fair bit of that prettifying (and removing rough sleepers and conspicuous beggars) was done for the Olympics and the Jubilee - negligible benefit to people who live and work here, if you balance it against the additional congestion.


----------



## Greebo (Jan 8, 2015)

Manter said:


> Why would a tourist see that? Why would a tourist come to Tulse Hill?!


Cheapness of holiday lets etc?  Why would a tourist assume that London is just the central bit?  Haven't you seen small groups of people with wheeled cases, certainly not with English as their language of choice, heading for some of the flats in Brockwell Gate?  Haven't you seen the school exchange trip (usually French or Italian) youngsters trooping through central Brixton?  

I realise that you and I are out and about at different times, but even so...


----------



## Belushi (Mar 5, 2015)

Turns out Boris hasn't been entirely honest with us about how much funding is coming out of the public purse http://www.theguardian.com/artandde...son-duplicitous-handling-garden-bridge-london


----------



## Dr. Furface (Mar 5, 2015)

Belushi said:


> Turns out Boris hasn't been entirely honest with us about how much funding is coming out of the public purse http://www.theguardian.com/artandde...son-duplicitous-handling-garden-bridge-london


Are any of us really surprised?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Mar 5, 2015)

Dr. Furface said:


> Are any of us really surprised?




Not me....


----------



## Pickman's model (Mar 5, 2015)

Dr. Furface said:


> Are any of us really surprised?


yes.

only messing


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Mar 5, 2015)

In fact, how is this news?

 


cybertect may be surprised, I guess...


----------



## newbie (Mar 5, 2015)

This is worth noting too, at the bottom of the Guardian article.



> As more details emerge, former supporters of the bridge are jumping ship. The London Wildlife Trust has now joined the RSPB and Metropolitan Public Gardens Association in withdrawing its support. “The location and design of this bridge seems to reflect personal vanities rather than any meaningful attempt to connect Londoners to the capital’s rich natural and horticultural heritage,” said Carlo Laurenzi, chief executive of the trust, joining the RSPB’s claim that the bridge “falls short for wildlife”, by providing less than half a football pitch of green space. “This huge investment of public funds would be much better spent on improving communal green spaces across London,” added Laurenzi, “benefiting Londoners of all ages at a local and accessible level.”


----------



## Belushi (Jun 7, 2015)

FFS

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...s-johnson-london-3-million-annual-maintenance


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jun 7, 2015)

No comments allowed I see 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jun/07/garden-bridge-oasis-of-beauty-richard-rogers


----------



## shygirl (Jul 18, 2015)

Interesting architectural discussion about the proposed bridge.


----------



## shygirl (Jul 18, 2015)

Please do contact your MP in respect of the proposed Garden Bridge and view  the TCOS/Thames Central Open Spaces Trust if you have not already appraised yourself with the necessary information about it.

www.afollyforlondon.co.uk/contact-your-mp


----------



## Reno (Jul 18, 2015)

As a fan of the High Line park in NYC initially I quite liked the idea of the garden bridge, but looking into ongoing costs and how it's useless as a piece of infrastructure I'm against it. It's just another Johnson vanity project. The money would be better channelled towards keeping public transport prices stable and keeping London Underground staff employed.


----------



## Belushi (Sep 12, 2015)

The Public Accounts Committee are going to look into the funding now

Osborne in hot water over £30m garden bridge grant


----------



## tim (Sep 12, 2015)

StoneRoad said:


> Concept and design look brilliant - but the devil is in the practical / little details.
> 
> Copper cladding - that had better be well attached, and it'll turn green eventually.



I wouldn't be too confident about that cladding. This bridge is designed by the man who gave us the Borismaster. The bus with no opening windows lots of glass and no air-conditioning;  a mobile seabox for 9 months of the year. He also designed the ichronic "B of he bang".







Designed to last  century, rather unsurprisingly it started to disintegrate an impalepassing pedestrians within days of being installed.






It cost £1.42 million and raised £17,000 when it was sold for scrap.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Sep 12, 2015)

tim said:


> I wouldn't be too confident about that cladding. This bridge is designed by the man who gave us the Borismaster. The bus with no opening windows lots of glass and no air-conditioning;  a mobile seabox for 9 months of the year. He also designed the ichronic "B of he bang".
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I remember that - it was an absolute farce and obviously not well made. Makes you wonder whether the bridge will be a death trap and fall into the river.


----------



## Winot (Sep 25, 2015)

Lambeth Council halts Garden Bridge talks due to funding concerns


----------



## Belushi (Sep 25, 2015)

It's still a nice idea but they really need to go away and rethink the whole project. Location, costs, funding etc.


----------



## snowy_again (Sep 25, 2015)

I was told by some horticulturalists that no one was willing to get involved in the on going management as the flora was so narrow that the only employment opps would be litter picking and security. That and it's massively unecological.


----------



## laptop (Sep 25, 2015)

Belushi said:


> It's still a nice idea but they really need to go away and rethink the whole project. Location, costs, funding etc.



I'd suggest Widnes, off the top of my head.

Though I'm sure there's someone who'd be as upset about losing a quiet corner on the Ship Canal as I would be about the touristificaton of Temple.


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 25, 2015)

laptop said:


> I'd suggest Widnes, off the top of my head.
> 
> Though I'm sure there's someone who'd be as upset about losing a quiet corner on the Ship Canal as I would be about the touristificaton of Temple.


(((widnes)))


----------



## Belushi (Sep 28, 2015)

Good piece on Deserter on why it's turned out to be a shit idea

A Garden Bridge Too Far


----------



## Greebo (Sep 28, 2015)

Belushi said:


> It's still a nice idea but they really need to go away and rethink the whole project. Location, costs, funding etc.


Not to mention public access 24 hours a day, instead of being locked in the evening and small hours.


----------



## alfajobrob (Oct 2, 2015)

It's fucking wank. I've met Thomas "HeverfuckinBridge" and the guy is a twat. It's not a public bridge...well done Lambeth for refusing to fund for once.


----------



## laptop (Oct 2, 2015)

London's garden bridge: the end of the road?

Leaked audit report: Heatherwick given job without competitive tender, mates' deals...


----------



## laptop (Oct 19, 2015)

Today's _Times_ has a news story saying it's doomed  ... and a leader supporting it (on, er, the grounds that Sadiq and Lambeth are Labour). With quotes dictated onto the page by Ms Lumley or her PR .

No time to dig out links to the Times paywall.


----------



## Thaw (Oct 20, 2015)

Glad to see it looks like dying a death.

For bridge fans, Dan Cruickshank's "The Bridges That Built London" was repeated at the weekend so its back on iPlayer

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01jv5nr


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Nov 2, 2015)

Garden Bridge funding update

bollox, it's been brought back on the table again, even Sadiq Khan is now in favour. A much more sane solution would be redevelop Southwark Bridge into garden/cycleway. It's only used by taxis, perhaps they could keep using part of it as a shared road space?

They say of Southwark Bridge........"If you're on it you're probably lost."


----------



## Belushi (Nov 2, 2015)

fuck sake


----------



## Crispy (Nov 2, 2015)

DJWrongspeed said:


> It's only used by taxis


Loads of goods/construction traffic too


----------



## hash tag (Nov 2, 2015)

Agree, when all the cuts being made against less well of members of society, some want to plough tens of millions into this. I hear TFL's contribution has been capped at £10 Mil and central gov. still to give £30 mil. Some of that money is MINE!

If you want to pedestrianise a Bridge, could I offer Lambeth or Westminster. Westminster for security ie driving nasty things at parliament and also make it safer for the hoards of tourists.


----------



## Belushi (Nov 6, 2015)

It justs gets better and better London garden bridge users to have mobile phone signals tracked


----------



## newbie (Nov 7, 2015)

Crispy said:


> Loads of goods/construction traffic too


and cyclists, it's by far the safest and most pleasant bridge for getting into the city


----------



## hash tag (Nov 7, 2015)

Reading the link above, I see that TFL is "lending" the scheme the other 20 mil repayable over 50 years. Just outrageous 

If I recall, there will be no cycling on the bridge, nor kite flying come to that

"The bridge rules, of which 30 are listed, include a prohibition on any exercise other than jogging, playing a musical instrument, taking part in a “gathering of any kind”, giving a speech or address, scattering ashes, releasing a balloon and flying a kite"


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 8, 2015)

hash tag said:


> Reading the link above, I see that TFL is "lending" the scheme the other 20 mil repayable over 50 years. Just outrageous
> 
> If I recall, there will be no cycling on the bridge, nor kite flying come to that
> 
> "The bridge rules, of which 30 are listed, include a prohibition on any exercise other than jogging, playing a musical instrument, taking part in a “gathering of any kind”, giving a speech or address, scattering ashes, releasing a balloon and flying a kite"



What about "masturbating off the edge of the bridge into the waters below, in an attempt to invoke a riverine deity"?


----------



## laptop (Nov 8, 2015)

ViolentPanda said:


> What about "masturbating off the edge of the bridge into the waters below, in an attempt to invoke a riverine deity"?



"exercise other than jogging".


----------



## hash tag (Nov 8, 2015)

Depends if you are with someone or by yourself. If a solo effort, Boris should be at the head of the queue.


----------



## Tropi (Nov 9, 2015)

Is Lambeth taking the Mickey? Will they really have to spend 3.5 million in maintaining a private bridge?


----------



## ViolentPanda (Nov 9, 2015)

Tropi said:


> Is Lambeth taking the Mickey? Will they really have to spend 3.5 million in maintaining a private bridge?



They don't *have* to.
They will though, because they're useless, wasteful twats.


----------



## hash tag (Nov 9, 2015)

The delays have partly been because Lambeth woud not agree to it. I'm guessing that they only gave in
because someone leant on them.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Nov 9, 2015)

And we veer between tut tutting and sniggering at FIFA, IAAF etc. When we have this blatant corruption on a fucking massive scale going on right in front of our eyes and no one seems to have the power/will to do anything about it.

Go UK.


----------



## Tropi (Nov 24, 2015)

How to waste public money, over and over again: The Heckler: why we must stop Thomas Heatherwick's Garden Bridge


----------



## bi0boy (Nov 24, 2015)

The government really missed a trick allowing Bridge House Estates to fritter their cash away on dance troupes and YMCA outings. They could have financed this bridge and actually made it a good public project, even locating it somewhere else on the river more suitable.


----------



## snowy_again (Nov 24, 2015)

Fritter? Is my ironometer a bit off?


----------



## Tropi (Dec 7, 2015)

Joanna Lumley says: let them have a bridge!
'Tremendously kind and rich people to give a garden to people who maybe never had a garden.'
Joanna Lumley attacks 'evil' TV gender pay gap


----------



## Artaxerxes (Dec 7, 2015)

> Lumley also defended plans for a pedestrian Garden Bridge for London. She is a trustee of the organisation behind the project and has lobbied for it to go ahead. She said the bridge is a chance for: “Tremendously kind and rich people to give a garden to people who maybe never had a garden. It could be somewhere that everybody in London could just walk across and feel familiar with and soothed by and just a place of complete peace and quiet.



The sea, get the fuck in it.


----------



## hash tag (Dec 7, 2015)

Feel patronized? You certainly should do.


----------



## Belushi (Dec 18, 2015)

well done those councillors

London garden bridge plans under threat as councillors revolt


----------



## hash tag (Dec 18, 2015)

Seeing as Ms Lumley has so much to say on the subject, why doesn't she pay for the damn thing?


----------



## magneze (Dec 18, 2015)

hash tag said:


> Seeing as Ms Lumley has so much to say on the subject, why doesn't she pay for the damn thing?


And risk another series of Absolutely Fabulous?


----------



## laptop (Dec 18, 2015)

magneze said:


> And risk another series of Absolutely Fabulous?


Worse than that, there's a movie...


----------



## magneze (Dec 18, 2015)

laptop said:


> Worse than that, there's a movie...


----------



## Tropi (Feb 8, 2016)

Is a useless private bridge turning into a even more useless pier? Could The Garden Bridge Become A Garden Pier?


----------



## laptop (Feb 8, 2016)

Tropi said:


> Is a useless private bridge turning into a even more useless pier? Could The Garden Bridge Become A Garden Pier?



Which leads to something I missed:



> *Boris Johnson labelled people against the Garden Bridge "demented enemies" as he came under fire over the Garden Bridge bidding process. *
> 
> WATCH: Boris Squirms On LBC Over Garden Bridge (Tuesday 2nd February 2016)
> 
> ...


----------



## Tropi (Feb 8, 2016)

Someone should put Boris sitting facing backwards in one of the new ultra expensive buses, in summer when the air con is usually broken, and drive him around the whole country for a month.


----------



## tim (Feb 8, 2016)

Tropi said:


> Someone should put Boris sitting facing backwards in one of the new ultra expensive buses, in summer when the air con is usually broken, and drive him around the whole country for a month.




The aircon on those, Heatherwick designed, buses isn't broken it just doesn't work. In my fantasy a jealous Tory leadership rival pushes Blondie off his Boris bike and under the wheels of  a number 38 Borismaster. He then finds himself in the depths of Hades at the wrong end of a red hot pitchfork being weilded by a well-oiled Bob Crow


----------



## Tropi (Feb 10, 2016)

With a little help from their friends...
Garden Bridge Bid Dogged By More Controversy


----------



## hash tag (Feb 10, 2016)

Quelle surprise. Job creation/jobs for the boys/corruption?


----------



## laptop (Feb 10, 2016)

Tropi said:


> With a little help from their friends...
> Garden Bridge Bid Dogged By More Controversy



That crashed my phone earlier and now it's 404ed. What did it say?

E2A: ah, the URL: *one-man-picked-garden-bridge-now-hes-got-job-with-firm-building-it*-124772

I smell a writ


----------



## Tropi (Feb 11, 2016)

That article is gone but it was something like that: 
'It’s well known that for large infrastructure projects like this one, a panel of experts is assembled to pick the right design and ensure there are no accusations of unfairness or bias.


 But in this case, only one man picked the Heatherwick design – Transport for London’s Managing Director of Planning, Richard de Cani.The bid that was submitted following the TfL request came from Heatherwick Studios, but there are now questions raised in City Hall about the involvement of the engineers Arup, who have so far received £8.3 million of tax-payers’ money to deliver the bridge.In an interview back in 1998, Joanna Lumley had talked to Arup about the possibility of a Garden Bridge. And in July 2013, a press release from Arup stated it had been working with Heatherwick Studios to develop a Garden Bridge. But what has come to light after an investigation by LBC is that Richard de Cani worked for Arup prior to joining Transport for London.

And we can now reveal he will leave TfL in May to join Arup.'

LBC's Long Read: The Garden Bridge Fiasco


----------



## Black Halo (Feb 11, 2016)

Google cache has the article in case anyone missed it


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 11, 2016)

Troubled 'garden bridge' could face fresh probe after rigging claims (ITV)


----------



## Orang Utan (Feb 13, 2016)

Why is London’s Garden Bridge worth as much as five Lancashire museums? Ask Joanna Lumley


----------



## hash tag (Feb 14, 2016)

Also in the Guardian "Asked what he thought of the Garden Bridge, Self replied: “It could be great – it will be shit."

Will Self joins London ‘mass trespass’ over privatisation of public space

With regards to the Bridge Vs Museums, we will always find alternative worthwhile uses for the funds swallowed up in may things; Trident, HS2, the Dome, the Olympic Park.....


----------



## bimble (Feb 15, 2016)

Walked about a bit round there yesterday (between the Coca Cola London Eye and the Marriott Hotel which used to be the seat of the London assembly.. )
There's about 40 mature trees all marked for the chop to make space for the bridge, they have little 'save me' signs written on them.


----------



## mauvais (Feb 15, 2016)

Orang Utan said:


> Why is London’s Garden Bridge worth as much as five Lancashire museums? Ask Joanna Lumley


I can barely suppress my contempt for London and its fucking projects, but I don't suppose we're going to have many threads for that on here.


----------



## mauvais (Feb 15, 2016)

I've only just clocked that the _national _taxpayer, not just Londoners, is going to be paying £30m towards this thing, someone's barely public folly in a city we can't afford to fucking visit let alone live in. I hope it comes preinstalled with pikes.

I know the feeling comes and goes, but I've haven't felt quite such a desire for violent insurrection in a long time. FFS.


----------



## Winot (Feb 15, 2016)

mauvais said:


> I've only just clocked that the _national _taxpayer, not just Londoners, is going to be paying £30m towards this thing, someone's barely public folly in a city we can't afford to fucking visit let alone live in. I hope it comes preinstalled with pikes.
> 
> I know the feeling comes and goes, but I've haven't felt quite such a desire for violent insurrection in a long time. FFS.



We don't want it either.


----------



## Greebo (Feb 15, 2016)

mauvais said:


> I've only just clocked that the _national _taxpayer, not just Londoners, is going to be paying £30m towards this thing, someone's barely public folly in a city we can't afford to fucking visit let alone live in. <snip>


Hey, don't make the mistake of even implying that all Londoners are well off or can afford to use the attractions in Central London that often.  I fucking live here (in one of the cheaper bits) and _I can't afford to visit the tourist areas of London without taking my own food and drink._


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 15, 2016)

Greebo said:


> Hey, don't make the mistake of even implying that all Londoners are well off or can afford to use the attractions in Central London that often.  I fucking live here (in one of the cheaper bits) and _I can't afford to visit the tourist areas of London without taking my own food and drink._


A lot of London's attractions are free, which is more than you can say for a lot of places. And you can get a very decent meal in plenty of pubs for around a tenner.


----------



## hash tag (Feb 15, 2016)

bimble said:


> Walked about a bit round there yesterday (between the Coca Cola London Eye and the Marriott Hotel which used to be the seat of the London assembly.. )
> There's about 40 mature trees all marked for the chop to make space for the bridge, they have little 'save me' signs written on them.



Typical. For making a nice green ecologically friendly bridge, we must first chop down 40 mature trees, is that what people call progress


----------



## mauvais (Feb 15, 2016)

Greebo said:


> Hey, don't make the mistake of even implying that all Londoners are well off or can afford to use the attractions in Central London that often.  I fucking live here (in one of the cheaper bits) and _I can't afford to visit the tourist areas of London without taking my own food and drink._


No such assumption or implication intended here - although I confess it becomes ever more of a mystery to me as to how people like you get by living in or even remotely near the place at all.

The point in there was that there used to be this oft-wheeled out defence of, 'London is paid for by Londoners', which ought to fail on much the same divisive count as 'rich services for rich taxpayers' would, amongst other flaws, but now even _that_'s not the case and the people of Lancashire are paying for this inaccessible shit when their own public services are being taken away.

A while back you said this:



Greebo said:


> Incidentally, I'm pissed off because if there's one thing I hear time and again from people living outside of London it's "you're so lucky, you're featherbedded compared to us, you don't know you're born".
> 
> Okay, have a look around some of the schools here, you'd be appalled. Look at the amount of London schools which don't have a playing field, so children have to walk to the nearest park or common. Watch junior school children walking a mile (during classroom hours, not their dinner break) to get to the nearest public swimming pool, have an hour lesson, and then walk another mile back, because otherwise the school can't afford it. Look at the amount of children who do even their primary school homework in the library, because there isn't enough space at home.
> 
> This in a city where the rich are so rich that *shrug* tourists seem to just not see the rest unless they're sleeping rough or begging. Fur coat and not even ragged knickers.


So this is a completely legitimate complaint, and yet examples of London poverty don't in turn cancel out the complaints from elsewhere. You talk about children having to work in the library - well in Lancashire they're shutting _40 out of 74 _libraries. It's the end of service provision altogether for some people. So if you have a shit library full of children that should be in schools or at home, or a swimming pool at all, you're fucking quids in by comparison, even if that itself is a sorry state of affairs. Christ, I mean look at somewhere like Blackpool which is basically number one in the country for all the horrible metrics, or the post-industrial (ho ho) North East for that matter. And not that it really matters at that point, but there is practically _nothing_, even unaffordable irrelevant tourist nonsense, to offset any of this, because it's all in London.

And I know full well that that whole argument itself is shitty as I type it, since we shouldn't have to be playing poverty top trumps like this, which is even more divisive & along the lines of arbitrary geography rather than anything meaningful like wealth. Therein is a problem - the apparently extortionate cost of living in London to anyone looking in means it's become very difficult to separate the monstrosity that is London from the people living in it, even though many of the inequities and even overall situations are common between individuals inside and out. I admit that I personally haven't found an easy way to understand or reconcile it either.

But the London-centric nature  of distribution really fucking sucks all the same. It's another structural barrier to dragging _entire areas _out of the mire. I don't give two fucks about this actual bridge, but it's a pretty damn good symbol of national inequity. It makes me properly fucking angry and it's increasingly incredible to me that parts of the UK - not just Scotland - continue to accept any kind of union on these terms.


----------



## hash tag (Feb 15, 2016)

80% of Londoners are in favour of the bridge - really. It strikes me that only three people are interested in it, Boris, Heatherwick and Lumley; the first two I understand but Lumley? Is she just out for publicity bu supporting unfashionable, ill thought out causes? I also see that it's estimated it will cost £3.5 million a year to maintain, so I suppose we should allow at least double that then. Why can't we just convert an existing road bridge into a non motorised traffic bridge or garden bridge? Lambeth perhaps?
Garden bridge: a project promoted and sold with half‑truths, deceptions and evasions


----------



## Tropi (Feb 15, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Typical. For making a nice green ecologically friendly bridge, we must first chop down 40 mature trees, is that what people call progress



Yes, it's stupid and almost unbelievable. It's like cutting the budgets of parks and giving the money away to big business, which is what they are doing.


----------



## mauvais (Feb 15, 2016)

hash tag said:


> 80% of Londoners are in favour of the bridge - really.


Like someone else said, possibly on this thread or possibly BTL on a Graun article, 80% makes perfect sense if the question is, 'would you like a cool bridge', instead of 'would you like a cool bridge at the expense of XYZ and with all these caveats'.


----------



## Tropi (Feb 15, 2016)

I read that too. The question was 'would you like a garden bridge?', that was all.


----------



## hash tag (Feb 15, 2016)

Cool, hmmm, don't think so for a minute. Why bridge? Maybe it should be referred to as the quaint old English thing; a folly. My picture of a folly is an expensive worthless consruction built to feed someones vanity.
Mauvis, I know not where you live, but I know that parliament is in need of a new home. If we moved it up to you, it would certainly help London be less centric


----------



## Greebo (Feb 15, 2016)

mauvais said:


> No such assumption or implication intended here - although I confess it becomes ever more of a mystery to me as to how people like you get by living in or even remotely near the place at all.
> 
> <snip> examples of London poverty don't in turn cancel out the complaints from elsewhere. You talk about children having to work in the library - well in Lancashire they're shutting _40 out of 74 _libraries. It's the end of service provision altogether for some people. So if you have a shit library full of children that should be in schools or at home, or a swimming pool at all, you're fucking quids in by comparison, even if that itself is a sorry state of affairs.


I can only (just about) afford to live here (in Lambeth) by dint of having won the fucking benefits lottery (as the tories would see it); Carers Allowance for me, DLA & ESA for ViolentPanda, IS, HB and CTB for both, and a small one bedroom council flat (only got because VP was disabled and couldn't climb 6 flights of stairs to his previous studio flat) under threat of regeneration.  Living the dream...

Roughly half the libraries in the poorest boroughs of London are being shut too.  The libraries which don't close are threatened with having gym equipment installed so that council funded leisure centres can also be run down and eventually shut or completely privatised.  No joke, have a look in the Brixton section.

Social services only provide critical care in this borough (and elsewhere in London) - anyone else has to go private or do without. [/derail]


----------



## Greebo (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> A lot of London's attractions are free, which is more than you can say for a lot of places. And you can get a very decent meal in plenty of pubs for around a tenner.


Too expensive to get to, unless I spend half the day (which I can't spare, what with being an unpaid carer) on buses.

A tenner?  Fuck off - that's a third of my week's food budget.


----------



## mauvais (Feb 15, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Mauvis, I know not where you live, but I know that parliament is in need of a new home. If we moved it up to you, it would certainly help London be less centric


I'm from Lancashire, but for my sins I now live in comparatively wealthy Hampshire. The problems of inequity here are less pronounced, although they still exist, and there are new ones created by the proximity to London.

Achieving something like moving Parliament will be extremely difficult and getting more so, because of not just momentum but sheer numbers and vested interest. Much like the housing crisis, really.

The 'London Travel To Work Area' is an old line on a map that resembles a leaky version of Greater London, and supposedly there were 9.2m people living in within it ten years ago. Now that definition has expanded, and the population has grown, so that's a lot of people that have no strong interest in redistribution to the regions and provinces. It surprises me that they even managed to pull off the BBC's partial move. This is to say nothing of the disproportionate power balance of politics and wealth beyond mere numbers.

So of course it continues to snowball. I think even doing something like forcibly moving certain elements to Manchester would be a failure in terms of redistribution, because at absolute best it would probably just create a second concentrated hub with minimal benefit to the wider country.


----------



## hash tag (Feb 15, 2016)

I understand that the house are in need of a major refurb and might be best relocating for a few years whilst the work happens. If not wanted in Lancs. perhaps for the sake of the union, they should be moved to Scotland?

As someone who "lives" (or not) close the the centre, I often walk to many of the attractions. It bugs me that for many of the paid ones, you can get two for one deals on production of a rail ticket. This used to include oysters if I remember correctly, but not anymore. As I am saving the enviroment by not only not using a car but any other means of public transport and freeing space for others, how come I cn't get two for one?


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 15, 2016)

Greebo said:


> Too expensive to get to, unless I spend half the day (which I can't spare, what with being an unpaid carer) on buses.
> 
> A tenner?  Fuck off - that's a third of my week's food budget.


So how much do you expect to pay for a meal? 5p? You know Wetherspoons do cheap meals, right? If you cannot afford to pay what are very reasonable prices for a main meal, then that is not London's fault.


hash tag said:


> I understand that the house are in need of a major refurb and might be best relocating for a few years whilst the work happens. If not wanted in Lancs. perhaps for the sake of the union, they should be moved to Scotland?
> 
> As someone who "lives" (or not) close the the centre, I often walk to many of the attractions. It bugs me that for many of the paid ones, you can get two for one deals on production of a rail ticket. This used to include oysters if I remember correctly, but not anymore.


The 2-for-1 has never included Oyster; it's a National Rail offer intended to encourage people to visit the capital by train.



> As I am saving the enviroment by not only not using a car but any other means of public transport and freeing space for others, how come I cn't get two for one?


For the same reason that you wouldn't be entitled to take advantage of any other kind offer that you didn't qualify for. Anyway, it's simple enough to pick up cheap train tickets that qualify for the offer.


----------



## Manter (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> So how much do you expect to pay for a meal? 5p? You know Wetherspoons do cheap meals, right? If you cannot afford to pay what are very reasonable prices for a main meal, then that is not London's fault.
> 
> The 2-for-1 has never included Oyster; it's a National Rail offer intended to encourage people to visit the capital by train.
> 
> ...


Sometimes I think you get a hard time on here then you post stuff like this. Fuck off fuck off fuck off


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 15, 2016)

Manter said:


> Sometimes I think you get a hard time on here then you post stuff like this. Fuck off fuck off fuck off


Oh don't fucking start. I have done fuck all wrong.


----------



## Manter (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> Oh don't fucking start. I have done fuck all wrong.


Will you read what you posted to greebo. Seriously? You think that's ok?


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 15, 2016)

Manter said:


> Will you read what you posted to greebo. Seriously? You think that's ok?


Of course it's OK. Tell me how it is not ok. Explain to me why it's London's "fault" that someone can't afford a few pounds for a meal???


----------



## sealion (Feb 15, 2016)

hash tag said:


> 80% of Londoners are in favour of the bridge - really. It strikes me that only three people are interested in it, Boris, Heatherwick and Lumley; the first two I understand but Lumley? Is she just out for publicity bu supporting unfashionable, ill thought out causes? I also see that it's estimated it will cost £3.5 million a year to maintain, so I suppose we should allow at least double that then. Why can't we just convert an existing road bridge into a non motorised traffic bridge or garden bridge? Lambeth perhaps?
> Garden bridge: a project promoted and sold with half‑truths, deceptions and evasions


Lumley has known Boris since he was 4 and used to baby sit for him. She's just another snobby tory cunt from the same stock.


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 15, 2016)

So what are the chances of this thing not going ahead, do you think?


----------



## sealion (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> So what are the chances of this thing not going ahead, do you think?


Zero.Too many palms have been greased and brown envelopes exchanged.


----------



## Greebo (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> So how much do you expect to pay for a meal? 5p? You know Wetherspoons do cheap meals, right? If you cannot afford to pay what are very reasonable prices for a main meal, then that is not London's fault. <snip>


Spoons?  You expect me to eat there?  For a fucking treat?  Jog on, sweetie.

I'll willingly pay for good quality food once in a while (even if that means saving up for it), but a pub meal (or Pop Brixton's stuff for that matter) isn't reasonable by my standards.

Incidentally, £10 per head for a meal is out by the time I also have to find the minicab fare there & back for VP (he doesn't get a Freedom Pass because you have to choose between that and the taxicard, which is still only just affordable and not v reliable), and a food allergy (migraine triggered) rules out the majority of the cheaper eating out options.


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 15, 2016)

Greebo said:


> Spoons?  You expect me to eat there?  For a fucking treat?  Jog on, sweetie.
> 
> I'll willingly pay for good quality food once in a while (even if that means saving up for it), but a pub meal (or Pop Brixton's stuff for that matter) isn't reasonable by my standards.
> 
> Incidentally, £10 per head for a meal is out by the time I also have to find the minicab fare there & back for VP (he doesn't get a Freedom Pass because you have to choose between that and the taxicard, which is still only just affordable and not v reliable), and a food allergy (migraine triggered) rules out the majority of the cheaper eating out options.


There's nothing wrong with Wetherspoons. I've been in them loads of times.


----------



## Greebo (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> There's nothing wrong with Wetherspoons. I've been in them loads of times.


I believe you - the quality of your posts suggests to me that you post from there, under the influence, on a regular basis.


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 15, 2016)

As a matter of fact they used to do a "2 meals for x pounds" offer, which I used to take advantage of sometimes, but it's not on their website so maybe they aren't doing it any more. I've seen the same offer in other places though.


----------



## sealion (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> As a matter of fact they used to do a "2 meals for x pounds" offer, which I used to take advantage of sometimes, but it's not on their website so maybe they aren't doing it any more. I've seen the same offer in other places though.


It's shit food though and cheap for a reason.


----------



## belboid (Feb 15, 2016)

Will Self's quote pretty much covers it - “It could be great – it will be shit.”


----------



## Winot (Feb 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> Of course it's OK. Tell me how it is not ok. Explain to me why it's London's "fault" that someone can't afford a few pounds for a meal???



Because you come across an an insensitive arse. And I say that as someone who also tends to think that you get a hard time here sometimes. Posts like this make me think I was wrong to give you the benefit of the doubt.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 16, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> There's nothing wrong with Wetherspoons. I've been in them loads of times.



if they admit you as a customer, I hardly think you can say there's "nothing wrong" with them.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Feb 16, 2016)

Sea Lion said:


> It's shit food though and cheap for a reason.



My oldest g-dson works as the "head chef" in a 'spoons in Oxford. As he's stated himself, "it's café-quality, not restaurant-quality. Something to stick to your ribs".


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 16, 2016)

Sea Lion said:


> It's shit food though and cheap for a reason.


i've had some delicious food in 'spoons, most notably the fish and chips at the 'spoons by grimsby station. it is variable, tho - i've had dire food (the hamilton hall, liverpool street station; the tally ho, n12; the moon under water, barnet) at 'spoons too.


----------



## Greebo (Feb 16, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> i've had some delicious food in 'spoons, most notably the fish and chips at the 'spoons by grimsby station. it is variable, tho - i've had dire food (the hamilton hall, liverpool street station; the tally ho, n12; the moon under water, barnet) at 'spoons too.


Funny you should say that:  Fish and chips would be one of my possible safe options at a Spoons, but there's a chippy nearer that does it better.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 18, 2016)

Heh, will now be a garden pier as it won't come to Lambeth


----------



## hash tag (Feb 18, 2016)

Has Ms Lumley got nothing better to do, has the screen business given up on her or what, she not just campaigning for the Bridge; "founder of the idea". Why doesn't she go and get the money for it, every single penny of it's cost for it's life and if she would like to put a toll on the thing, please go ahead.

I've just looked at their website 
Fiction; Their is no need for he garden bridge.
Fact; This is an inovative scheme that will transform the area.

The project


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 18, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Has Ms Lumley got nothing better to do, has the screen business given up on her or what, she not just campaigning for the Bridge; "founder of the idea". Why doesn't she go and get the money for it, every single penny of it's cost for it's life and if she would like to put a toll on the thing, please go ahead.
> 
> I've just looked at their website
> Fiction; Their is no need for he garden bridge.
> ...


you seem to have confused fact and fiction


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 18, 2016)

Surely Tfl can no longer cough up a penny, as a pier is not a transport thing?


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 18, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> Surely Tfl can no longer cough up a penny, as a pier is not a transport thing?


could make it a short pier with a winding path so people could take a long walk on a short pier.


----------



## hash tag (Feb 18, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> you seem to have confused fact and fiction



fact n fiction; not me wots confused, i lifted that from the bridge website Q & A's.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 18, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> could make it a short pier with a winding path so people could take a long walk on a short pier.



As long as Boris goes first I'll thrown in a monkey towards the cost.


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 18, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> As long as Boris goes first I'll thrown in a monkey towards the cost.


we'll need to make it wide enough to take a water cannon, you can drive the water cannon as it bowls the hideous johnson off the pier and into the thames.


----------



## bimble (Feb 18, 2016)

I don't get what is going on with the numbers.. that website is (on purpose or not ) really confusing.
It says the bridge will cost £175M to create.
Then it says ' More than £145m has been pledged so far' - from where / who ?
Does that include the £60M of state incl TFL funding? It must do, cos then it goes on about how they are still searching for the rest of the money to come from somewhere.


----------



## BigTom (Feb 18, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> we'll need to make it wide enough to take a water cannon, you can drive the water cannon as it bowls the hideous johnson off the pier and into the thames.



That'd be a social gathering, and not allowed under the bridge's rules


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 18, 2016)

BigTom said:


> That'd be a social gathering, and not allowed under the bridge's rules


yes. but it wouldn't be a bridge, it would be a pier. so the bridge's rules a dead letter.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 18, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> we'll need to make it wide enough to take a water cannon, you can drive the water cannon as it bowls the hideous johnson off the pier and into the thames.




Me, upon hearing this first rate idea:


----------



## hash tag (Feb 18, 2016)

There is to be no fun on the bridge, there must be no fun on the bridge.
I was wondering, if it gets built if i could be the first to make out on it just to wind them up


----------



## Tropi (Feb 18, 2016)

'If Khan and Goldsmith are really empty chairing RIBA because they don’t want to answer questions on the Garden Bridge, then that is a scandal.'  Khan and Goldsmith were nowhere to be seen at the Royal Institute of British Architects (RIBA)
Report: RIBA mayoral hustings on housing and the built environment


----------



## hash tag (May 15, 2016)

Unfortunately while Sadiq appears in favour of the bridge, it looks like he will scrutinese the tendering and funding issues, which is something Doubts over Thames garden bridge as Sadiq Khan probes £175m project


----------



## hash tag (May 31, 2016)

We should have a parliamentary enquiry to find out where all the money is going, that will help the costs. £37.7million spent " for no benefit to anyone" not a brick been laid, not a turf dug, I mean....London's garden bridge: call for full inquiry into project's finances


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 31, 2016)

Fucking Lumley needs putting to sleep, she's now trying to create a Glyndbourne in Bamber Gasgoine's nan's old house in Horley, cos sleepy villages just love 3000 posh folk rolling up in their Range Rovers of an evening...


----------



## hash tag (Aug 18, 2016)

Someone, with authority, needs to take a stand NOW and call time on this stupid white elephant to stop any more money be
flushed down the Thames, until then!  £22m gap in Garden Bridge funds - Newsnight investigation - BBC News


----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 18, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Someone, with authority, needs to take a stand NOW and call time on this stupid white elephant to stop any more money be
> flushed down the Thames, until then!  £22m gap in Garden Bridge funds - Newsnight investigation - BBC News


it's worse than that according to the standard, it's £56m. Garden Bridge designer urges calm as funding gap hits £56m


----------



## bi0boy (Aug 18, 2016)

I keep coming to this thread hoping to see it's been cancelled

Hopefully Theresa May will do a Hinkley


----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 18, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> I keep coming to this thread hoping to see it's been cancelled
> 
> Hopefully Theresa May will do a Hinkley


i hope she'll do a hinckley


----------



## hash tag (Aug 18, 2016)

Optimistically, I have put my faith in Khan


----------



## bi0boy (Aug 18, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> i hope she'll do a hinckley



what's one of those?


----------



## Pickman's model (Aug 18, 2016)

bi0boy said:


> what's one of those?


----------



## hash tag (Aug 18, 2016)

Hinkley was more of a national security issue whereas the bridge is more of a national outrage.


----------



## hash tag (Aug 26, 2016)

Apparently it has the governments backing Garden Bridge project backed by Government


----------



## Chilli.s (Aug 26, 2016)

What a truly shit idea this bridge is.


----------



## Teaboy (Aug 26, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Apparently it has the governments backing Garden Bridge project backed by Government



I dunno.  Looks similar to the approach Khan is taking in that they are giving support but are setting possibly unachievable private funding targets.  I still very much have my doubts it will happen.

I have mixed views on the subject because on one hand its a terrible idea and a terrible waste of money but on the other if it does go ahead there will be a load of cash for my company.  Growing trees on bridges is not cheap or easy.


----------



## bromley (Aug 26, 2016)

Chilli.s said:


> What a truly shit idea this bridge is.


Ignoring the poncy roof garden over the Thames thing. The bridge saves a 10 minute walk if you're on the north side of the Thames in between Waterloo & Blackfiars and far less from the South side. This has minimal benefit to ordinary Londoners. 

Whereas a car crossing inbetween Blackwell and Dartford...


----------



## Chilli.s (Aug 26, 2016)

For a country that can't even get a decent road/rail transport infrastructure sorted it seems to be a poor allocation of funds.
Its divisive, investment in London at the expense of the rest of the country. Being a bridge, youda hoped itud have more of that bridging quality.
The black hole in the figures? someone making shitloads while others as equally deserving suffer under zero hours contracts.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 14, 2016)

Garden Bridge Running Out Of Money: Exclusive



> We've also discovered the project is fast running out of cash, with spending reaching out at £500,000-a-month.
> 
> One senior Transport for London official told LBC's Theo Usherwood: "The Garden Bridge is on life support."
> 
> Theo reports: "That view is shared at the top of City Hall: one source told me there is a belief now that the bridge will not be built.





Like this bit:



> "The only thing that might make the trustees think twice is a piece of charity law, which will make each of the trustees personally liable for demolishing the bridge if it is half-finished.





And here's the key to the whole project:



> Kate Hoey, the Labour MP for Vauxhall wrote to the (charity) commission to claim she was worried the trust could be awarding contracts to anonymous donors



It's a scam.


----------



## Bungle73 (Sep 14, 2016)

They've been spending all that money on what exactly?


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 14, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> They've been spending all that money on what exactly?


piss ups for the boys


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 14, 2016)

i read a story in, i think, dragon magazine many years ago where there was some scam over a bridge


----------



## hash tag (Sep 14, 2016)

Isn't it the same for many of these useless vanity projects?


----------



## Orang Utan (Sep 14, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Isn't it the same for many of these useless vanity projects?


Is this bridge a vanity project? Whose?


----------



## Winot (Sep 14, 2016)

Orang Utan said:


> Is this bridge a vanity project? Whose?



Joanna Lumley + Boris


----------



## Orang Utan (Sep 14, 2016)

Winot said:


> Joanna Lumley + Boris


I would say it was more of a white elephant than a vanity project


----------



## ViolentPanda (Sep 15, 2016)

Bungle73 said:


> They've been spending all that money on what exactly?



Supposedly on the design management and actual design phases. Fucking expensive, even so.


----------



## belboid (Sep 15, 2016)

Orang Utan said:


> I would say it was more of a white elephant than a vanity project


Vanity projects usually become white elephants


----------



## Dr. Furface (Sep 21, 2016)

Winot said:


> Joanna Lumley + Boris


Lumley's been banging on about her baby again today on Radio London, where she claims about 75% of Londoners want the sodding thing built (now that IS news!) that it won't cost the public anything (£60m of public funds have already been pledged before it's even started!) and that it will be 'a gift to the public'. *Vomit smiley*

I swear she thinks she's fucking royalty - but at least the Queen generally keeps her mouth shut and doesn't come up with idiot projects like this. And if Lumley isn't annoying enough already, just imagine how triumphantly obnoxious she'll be if it does get built!


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Sep 21, 2016)

bromley said:


> Whereas a car crossing inbetween Blackwell and Dartford...



Would create more traffic. I cycled in rush hour traffic from the Woolwich tunnel out of London via Swanley. Solid all the way. How would a bridge help this ?

On the bridge thing. It's turning into a scandal whatever the decision. I fundamentally object to it being a private space. plus it will ruin the view along the south bank.


----------



## Crispy (Sep 21, 2016)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Would create more traffic


Nah it's badly needed. If you have a business in SE or NE London and want to trade goods with another business on the other bank, or you want to catch a bus between, say, Thamesmead and Barking, it takes an hour to go round via one of the two bridges. TfL agrees: Have your say on new river crossings in east and southeast London					 - Transport for London					 - Citizen Space


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 21, 2016)

Dr. Furface said:


> Lumley's been banging on about her baby again today on Radio London, where she claims about 75% of Londoners want the sodding thing built (now that IS news!) that it won't cost the public anything (£60m of public funds have already been pledged before it's even started!) and that it will be 'a gift to the public'. *Vomit smiley*
> 
> I swear she thinks she's fucking royalty - but at least the Queen generally keeps her mouth shut and doesn't come up with idiot projects like this. And if Lumley isn't annoying enough already, just imagine how triumphantly obnoxious she'll be if it does get built!




My mum's been having a long-running feud with Lumley and stated with regards to the garden bridge, "If that gets built I'd hang the cunt from it like that mafia banker."

Two points here; 

1) first time I ever heard her say cunt.
2) has she fessed to murder?


----------



## Pickman's model (Sep 21, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> My mum's been having a long-running feud with Lumley and stated with regards to the garden bridge, "If that gets built I'd hang the cunt from it like that mafia banker."
> 
> Two points here;
> 
> ...


Does she have an alibi for calvi's death?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 21, 2016)

Pickman's model said:


> Does she have an alibi for calvi's death?




No, I asked her where she was on the evening of 17th June 1982 and she claims that she can't remember


----------



## bromley (Sep 22, 2016)

DJWrongspeed said:


> Would create more traffic. I cycled in rush hour traffic from the Woolwich tunnel out of London via Swanley. Solid all the way. How would a bridge help this ?


There would be less queues at Blackwall and Dartford.


----------



## hash tag (Sep 22, 2016)

Just cancel the thing, ffs

London mayor orders review of Garden Bridge project - BBC News


----------



## mauvais (Sep 22, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Just cancel the thing, ffs
> 
> London mayor orders review of Garden Bridge project - BBC News


Probably got to work out what the liability is to abandon the thing - who still has to be paid, who will be owed their money back etc.


----------



## Teaboy (Sep 22, 2016)

Its slightly more then annoying that the state has somehow agreed the underwrite the thing when it flops and pulls in fuck all money.  There are plenty of get out of jail free cards Kahn has with this one, he should just get on and dump it.


----------



## tim (Sep 22, 2016)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> My mum's been having a long-running feud with Lumley and stated with regards to the garden bridge, "If that gets built I'd hang the cunt from it like that mafia banker."
> 
> Two points here;
> 
> ...



I love the idea of anyone having a long-running feud with Lumley. Did your mum mastermind some fiendish 1970's plot that was scuppered by Purdy and Steed?






If so, given the modus operandi of New Avengers baddies, she could well have been behind the Calvi death and indeed that of Georgi Markov


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 23, 2016)

tim said:


> I love the idea of anyone having a long-running feud with Lumley. Did your mum mastermind some fiendish 1970's plot that was scuppered by Purdy and Steed?



Sadly nothing quite so exciting, Gurkha based bad blood.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Sep 23, 2016)

Oh blimey, Khan is on the radio talking about this; his best effort for keeping it is that money has already been spent and that would be lost, so good money after bad. 

Plus he's parroting the lie that £20m will be recouped in VAT. The bridge is a new-build, therefore not subject to VAT.


----------



## hash tag (Oct 4, 2016)

Well bugger me, admittedly, I know little of the East, but this has totally passed me by; THREE new crossings but no mention of the delifgtful garden bridge

Sadiq Khan gives go-ahead to three new river crossings in east London


----------



## bromley (Oct 5, 2016)

hash tag said:


> Well bugger me, admittedly, I know little of the East, but this has totally passed me by; THREE new crossings but no mention of the delifgtful garden bridge
> 
> Sadiq Khan gives go-ahead to three new river crossings in east London


3 Decent crossings.


----------



## Winot (Oct 11, 2016)

Ministerial direction published today:

Garden Bridge: ministerial direction - Publications - GOV.UK

Translation for those not au fait with Whitehall-ese: civil servants so concerned about being asked to do something that they think is a bad idea (in this case, provide a further £15M to underwrite Garden Bridge) that they ask Minister to put his direction to do so in writing to protect their backs.


----------



## Matchbox (Oct 11, 2016)

London needs another road bridge downstream from Tower Bridge not a garden bridge in central London. Road crossings are very few in the east of London. The garden bridge is the most stupid idea ever thought of for London.


----------



## hash tag (Oct 11, 2016)

Inrease pre construction budget by £15M. FFS, havent they wasted enough already?


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Oct 11, 2016)

Kind of canny getting Hodge to review it. She will call it bad news and Khan can cancel it in a detached fashion.


----------



## Crispy (Oct 11, 2016)

Matchbox said:


> London needs another road bridge downstream from Tower Bridge not a garden bridge in central London. Road crossings are very few in the east of London. The garden bridge is the most stupid idea ever thought of for London.


Your wish is TfL's command: New river crossings for London


----------



## hash tag (Oct 11, 2016)

I see the cost is now up to £185m and that it had Dave's full support. No surprises there then


----------



## hash tag (Dec 21, 2016)

Corruption. Conflicts of interest. No new surpries then. London garden bridge: accusation of conflict of interest over public funds


----------



## salem (Jan 11, 2017)

More bad news for the project - quite a funding shortfall and still no landing spot secured on the South Bank.

I found this quote quite telling. *"But of the £39m raised in 2016 for the project, £26m came from the DfT, meaning the trust raised only £13m last year."* i.e despite all the bluster about private money funding it the public teat seems to be the one suckled the most.

Sadiq reckons that £40m of tax payers money will be lost if it doesn't go ahead, but I hope he stands strong on his stance not to spend any more tax payer money on the project. Seeing the cost before they've even started building £40m is nothing compared to how much the eventual overruns will likely be.

This really does deserve to bite Boris on the arse.


----------



## hash tag (Jan 11, 2017)

Boris is well clear of London stuff and now performing on the world stage 
I feel he is manoeuvring again for PM, what with his stateside trip.


----------



## Bungle73 (Jan 11, 2017)

Bridges? We don't need no stinking bridges.


----------



## bromley (Jan 13, 2017)

Bungle73 said:


> Bridges? We don't need no stinking bridges.


We do but only in the East.


----------



## oryx (Jan 13, 2017)

bromley said:


> We do but only in the East.



Yes...I remember my shock on discovering that the link between the South Circular and the North Circular on the eastern side of London is...

The Woolwich Ferry!

You're absolutely right and the Garden Bridge is a ridiculous vanity project which should be scrapped a.s.a.p. I hope the PAC turn over those responsible.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Jan 18, 2017)

oryx said:


> Yes...I remember my shock on discovering that the link between the South Circular and the North Circular on the eastern side of London is...
> 
> The Woolwich Ferry!
> 
> You're absolutely right and the Garden Bridge is a ridiculous vanity project which should be scrapped a.s.a.p. I hope the PAC turn over those responsible.



I hope an exemplary punishment is designed for Boris for going along with the half-arsed vanity project in the first place.


----------



## hash tag (Jan 18, 2017)

Punishment for Boris, FO. hmmm, he appears to be committed to his own downfall but still comes up smelling.
Why on earth did they get him down from that wire across the Thames


----------



## tim (Jan 18, 2017)

ViolentPanda said:


> I hope an exemplary punishment is designed for Boris for going along with the half-arsed vanity project in the first place.




Bob Crow has his pitchfork and a Ghurka kukri on the coals and is looking forward to Boris coming down to join him


----------



## hash tag (Feb 11, 2017)

Another proposal for a pedestrian bridge - why?

Design team begins work on Nine Elms Pimlico Bridge commission | News | Wandsworth Council


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 11, 2017)

hash tag said:


> Another proposal for a pedestrian bridge - why?
> 
> Design team begins work on Nine Elms Pimlico Bridge commission | News | Wandsworth Council


What embassy is soon to be based in 9 elms?


----------



## hash tag (Feb 11, 2017)

Unfortunately, The American  - did you really not know  Due to open in a few months and will no doubt be hit by protests soon after opening.
I wonder if it will be formally opened on Trumps expected visit?


----------



## Bungle73 (Feb 11, 2017)

hash tag said:


> Another proposal for a pedestrian bridge - why?
> 
> Design team begins work on Nine Elms Pimlico Bridge commission | News | Wandsworth Council


The mad bad and inspired: bridge designs for a new Thames crossing



Pickman's model said:


> What embassy is soon to be based in 9 elms?


Since this dates back to 2003 I don't see how that has anything to do with it?


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 11, 2017)

hash tag said:


> Unfortunately, The American  - did you really not know  Due to open in a few months and will no doubt be hit by protests soon after opening.
> I wonder if it will be formally opened on Trumps expected visit?


I did know and if this is a new suggestion it is possibly connected to the relocation to improve access to the area


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 11, 2017)

Bungle73 said:


> The mad bad and inspired: bridge designs for a new Thames crossing
> 
> 
> Since this dates back to 2003 I don't see how that has anything to do with it?


No surprise there then


----------



## hash tag (Feb 11, 2017)

I stand corrected. I am all for better access to the area of the American Embassy if only because it helps people to get there and air thier views


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Feb 18, 2017)

hash tag said:


> Unfortunately, The American  - did you really not know  Due to open in a few months and will no doubt be hit by protests soon after opening.
> I wonder if it will be formally opened on Trumps expected visit?



On the brightside it will finally make public where Nine Elms actually is


----------



## hash tag (Feb 18, 2017)

I just been past the bastard thing. It's nearly finished.


----------



## Pickman's model (Feb 18, 2017)

Garden Bridge critics ‘shut out’ by London mayor

No surprise there


----------



## redsquirrel (Feb 18, 2017)

No. Fuck Khan


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Apr 7, 2017)

Hodge has delivered her verdict

*Scrap it*


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Apr 7, 2017)

Hooray for Hodge. 

Now get the SFO in to lock up the corrupt fuckers and enact the proceeds of crime act to claw back the cash.


----------



## Teaboy (Apr 7, 2017)

It is astonishing the amount of money that's been spent on it given there is literally nothing to show.  I can't imagine Heatherwick comes cheap but it's not like they've had to do the engineering or anything.  How much of that £60m went on lovely cocktail parties and agreeable lunches?


----------



## hash tag (Apr 7, 2017)

Fine report, but, alas, not over yet for sure.


----------



## lazythursday (Apr 7, 2017)

A quite deliciously withering report in places. I'd be highly surprised if this doesn't kill it off. Otherwise Khan risks having excoriating lines read out to him whenever the project hits some future financial issues or construction problem.


----------



## Dr. Furface (Apr 7, 2017)

Sorry but it's dead in the water


----------



## oryx (Apr 8, 2017)

lazythursday said:


> A quite deliciously withering report in places. I'd be highly surprised if this doesn't kill it off. Otherwise Khan risks having excoriating lines read out to him whenever the project hits some future financial issues or construction problem.



My theory is that Khan has been waiting for this to bag the project as it is now indefensible (to anyone sane), rather than bagging it earlier and risking media opprobrium.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 28, 2017)

So is it all over 

Garden bridge across Thames scrapped by Sadiq Khan


----------



## Pickman's model (Apr 28, 2017)

Badgers said:


> So is it all over
> 
> Garden bridge across Thames scrapped by Sadiq Khan


composted


----------



## redsquirrel (Apr 28, 2017)

Well one decent move by Khan though should have been done long before now.


----------



## bi0boy (Apr 28, 2017)

finally


----------



## Tropi (Apr 28, 2017)

Good news!


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Apr 28, 2017)

£37,400,000.00 of your money has been spent on this bullshit. Can we invoice Lumley, Johnson & Gidiot for it now?


----------



## Yossarian (Apr 28, 2017)

Bahnhof Strasse said:


> £37,400,000.00 of your money has been spent on this bullshit. Can we invoice Lumley, Johnson & Gidiot for it now?



Should add on the cost of a Garden Gallows for Johnson and Osborne, materials probably wouldn't cost much more than £37.40 at B&Q.


----------



## Pickman's model (Apr 28, 2017)

Yossarian said:


> Should add on the cost of a Garden Gallows for Johnson and Osborne, materials probably wouldn't cost much more than £37.40 at B&Q.


chuck them off the shard for free


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Apr 28, 2017)

Both good ideas, do it on a pay-per-view on Sky and we could fund the EU divorce bill five times over.


----------



## not-bono-ever (Apr 28, 2017)

We could have bought the queens new yacht with that £38M


----------



## salem (Apr 28, 2017)

Badgers said:


> So is it all over
> 
> Garden bridge across Thames scrapped by Sadiq Khan



Now this *should* hurt Boris so I'm sure it'll be quietly forgottern.


----------



## Poi E (Apr 28, 2017)

Thank fuck for that.


----------



## hash tag (Apr 28, 2017)

Just heard this on the news, joy 
Sadiq 1 Boris 0.
It won't hurt Boris, just look at the cable car disaster....nothing hurts Boris...also look at the Europe uturn and the lies


----------



## shygirl (Apr 28, 2017)

Really good news!


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Apr 29, 2017)

Oh ffs - Lumley is bleating about it.  

Joanna Lumley attacks Sadiq Khan's scrapping of Thames garden bridge



> “The negativity troubles me in my heart. I hope we’re not turning into the sort of country that instantly says no before it considers saying yes,” she said. “A nation that just pulls the shutters down. The silent majority still love the bridge, but of course they were not asked what they think.”
> 
> Lumley told the Times the project had been politicised. “There was so much negativity about this £60m of public money,” she said. “All we heard was £60m, £60m, £60m. But . . . it’ll work out at about 32p a person in the UK. It’s not as if we’re stealing bread from people.”



Get a fucking grip.


----------



## redsquirrel (Apr 29, 2017)

> Lumley told the Times the project had been politicised. “There was so much negativity about this £60m of public money,” she said. “All we heard was £60m, £60m, £60m. But . . . it’ll work out at about 32p a person in the UK. It’s not as if we’re stealing bread from people.”


Why don't you and your filthy mates pay for it then you spoiled cunt.


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Apr 29, 2017)

redsquirrel said:


> Why don't you and your filthy mates pay for it then you spoiled cunt.



What struck me was the claim of 32p per head - surely that means she thinks the UK population is around 120 million?  Is she really that out of touch?  

But yes, they should pay for the fucking pointless trinket bridge themselves - why the fuck should anyone, especially the majority of the populace who live outside of London, pay a single penny towards it.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (Apr 29, 2017)

I believe Sadiq initially publicly supported it so he had to do some careful political manoeuvres to come to this decision. E.g Bring in The Hodge


----------



## lefteri (Apr 29, 2017)

"instantly says no"
If we instantly said no what was 60 million spent on? Her rant doesn't even make basic sense


----------



## Tankus (Apr 29, 2017)

Why not kickstart it .?


----------



## Artaxerxes (Apr 30, 2017)

I'm almost certain this isn't the last we'll hear of this bloody thing.


More lives than a cat


----------



## phillm (Apr 30, 2017)

farmerbarleymow said:


> Oh ffs - Lumley is bleating about it.
> 
> Joanna Lumley attacks Sadiq Khan's scrapping of Thames garden bridge
> 
> ...



She should get her beloved Ghurkhas to skivvy for free on the project.


----------



## Smangus (May 1, 2017)

So glad this vanity bullshit has been knocked on the head. Joanna fucking Dumbly


----------



## weltweit (May 1, 2017)

It is probably upthread but I am amazed £60m has been spent already, wtf on?


----------



## tim (May 1, 2017)

weltweit said:


> It is probably upthread but I am amazed £60m has been spent already, wtf on?



Consultants!


----------



## weltweit (May 1, 2017)

tim said:


> Consultants!


I knew I was in the wrong line of work!


----------



## bromley (May 2, 2017)

hash tag said:


> Just heard this on the news, joy
> Sadiq 1 Boris 0.
> It won't hurt Boris, just look at the cable car disaster....nothing hurts Boris...also look at the Europe uturn and the lies


Now I don't like Boris in the slightest but what was the cable car disaster? The thing is sponsored and didn't cost the public anything, got a feeling that I may have my facts mixed up and that's why it's a disaster.


----------



## hash tag (May 2, 2017)

The cable car started out as another vanity Boris vanity project. A large amount of publc money went into building this white elephant. The only people who use it are tourists. It serves no purpose. It starts a long way from nowhere and finishes a long way from nowhere. This was one of many fuck ups he made/was involved in as Mayor.


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (May 2, 2017)

bromley said:


> Now I don't like Boris in the slightest but what was the cable car disaster? The thing is sponsored and didn't cost the public anything, got a feeling that I may have my facts mixed up and that's why it's a disaster.



I don't know about whether the costs were covered but spending a fortune on something that's hardly used is pretty bad wherever it comes from tbh.


----------



## Wookey (May 2, 2017)

I'm very surprised that someone of Lumley's longevity could be so out of touch with the public perception of this folly,  that she should continue to defend it at the cost of her own public standing.

I like the idea of new publicly owned green spaces.  This was never going to be that. The lining of pockets throughout the whole debacle is repulsive,  and the heat needs to be maintained on the return of all public funds that have been squandered on this increasingly objectionable ego project.


----------



## bromley (May 2, 2017)

I've done a quick search. Costs were £60m, of which £45m were construction costs hmm Emirates sponsorship was worth £36m over 10 years with the rest of the costs to be covered in tickets. Although you would think the tickets would mainly cover running costs, how much are the tickets?! 

Not as big as the vanity project by the South Side of the cable car in fairness.


----------



## hash tag (May 2, 2017)

Ultimately, it has cost the taxpayer, you and me, £24 MILLION. 
How many other projects like this of the dear Boris were a complete and utter failure!


----------



## bromley (May 2, 2017)

I wonder if the new routemasters were a bigger waste of money? Then there'should the number of deaths on the cycling super highway.


----------



## Smangus (May 2, 2017)

I can't think of 1 thing that the floppy haired cunt did to benefit Londoners as a whole. Not 1 , happy to be corrected though. Even the bikes weren't his idea the useless fucker.


----------



## hash tag (May 2, 2017)

But hey, he's gone now


----------



## Streathamite (May 2, 2017)

Badgers said:


> So is it all over
> 
> Garden bridge across Thames scrapped by Sadiq Khan


Thank christ for that. If Sadiq Khan does nothing else with his mayoralty he deserves credit for that. The whole thing was a lunatic waste of money.


----------



## Streathamite (May 2, 2017)

weltweit said:


> It is probably upthread but I am amazed £60m has been spent already, wtf on?


tbf, I do believe it was more like £37m. It doesn't make it any less outrageous though


----------



## T & P (May 2, 2017)

I could be wrong but if £37m was genuinely spent (as opposed to going to backhanders, bribes and corruption, which at least one could understand if not condone) in most other countries, heads would fucking roll.

How in the name of fuck can that amount be spent on consultations? What did the surveyors/ architects charge? £200k per hour?


----------



## oneflewover (May 2, 2017)

Smangus said:


> I can't think of 1 thing that the floppy haired cunt did to benefit Londoners as a whole. Not 1 , happy to be corrected though. Even the bikes weren't his idea the useless fucker.


At least he isn't doing anything important on the world stage.


----------



## redsquirrel (May 2, 2017)

T & P said:


> I could be wrong but if £37m was genuinely spent (as opposed to going to backhanders, bribes and corruption, which at least one could understand if not condone) in most other countries, heads would fucking roll.


Nah, it's the same the world over. "Consultancy" fees, preliminary work, analyses etc same thing happens here.

See $1.2 billion spent on not building the East-West Link.


----------



## hash tag (May 3, 2017)

T & P said:


> I could be wrong but if £37m was genuinely spent (as opposed to going to backhanders, bribes and corruption, which at least one could understand if not condone) in most other countries, heads would fucking roll.
> 
> How in the name of fuck can that amount be spent on consultations? What did the surveyors/ architects charge? £200k per hour?



His head wont roll since he stood down.


----------



## DJWrongspeed (May 3, 2017)

I don't actually think it was a completely bad idea but just in the wrong place, didn't work as a good cycle route and was private. Deptford or Fulham it could have been cool.


----------



## hash tag (May 3, 2017)

Fulham/Chelsea is getting a new ped bridge adjoining the Cremorne Rail Bridge c/o the developers of that new tower block Lombard Wharf going across to Imperial Wharf Station, I think.


----------



## Spymaster (May 3, 2017)

DJWrongspeed said:


> I don't actually think it was a completely bad idea but just in the wrong place, didn't work as a good cycle route and was private. Deptford or Fulham it could have been cool.


Deptford???? 

To the Isle of Dogs?


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (May 4, 2017)

DJWrongspeed said:


> I don't actually think it was a completely bad idea but just in the wrong place, didn't work as a good cycle route and was private. Deptford or Fulham it could have been cool.




So a bridge that is open 24 hours a day, 365 days a year, is free to use, is clear of obstructions for users and is in a place not already jam-packed with bridges; other than being none of those thing this wasn't a terrible idea


----------



## hash tag (May 4, 2017)

According to a recent letter from our local tory party candidate, the bridge between Battersea and Fulham is proceeding and is to be called "The Diamond Jubilee Bridge". I wonder by the time it is built whether it should be called Queens Memorial Bridge?


----------



## T & P (May 4, 2017)

hash tag said:


> According to a recent letter from our local tory party candidate, the bridge between Battersea and Fulham is proceeding and is to be called "The Diamond Jubilee Bridge". I wonder by the time it is built whether it should be called Queens Memorial Bridge?


I think they're about to miss the boat on' Prince Philip Memorial Bridge'...


----------



## hash tag (May 4, 2017)

I see no more public engagements for him, so he won't be over anytime soon to open it, Mind you George is going to school just around the corner from where the new bridge is going, but I guess he could be at Harrow by the time it's opened!


----------



## pseudonarcissus (Aug 14, 2017)

finally dead  £37 million of public money down the drain on this vanity project.  Let's have more bridges, just part of the trasportation infrastructure.


----------



## SpookyFrank (Aug 14, 2017)

Now officially shitcanned:

London garden bridge project scrapped

The whole thing stank of cronyism and corruption. How 37m of public cash got spent on a private sector project before it got anywhere near actual construction should by rights be a matter for the CPS.


----------



## Crispy (Aug 14, 2017)

£37m?! Where the fuck did it go?


----------



## Dr. Furface (Aug 14, 2017)

According to the FT the cost to the taxpayer is £46m
Subscribe to read

I'm just glad we won't have to hear any more patronising and frankly disgusting bullshit from Lumley or that cunt Mervyn Davies about how the fucking thing would be a great 'gift to the people from the corporate world' - because had it ever been built it would have been the gift-that-kept-on-taking _from the taxpayer_, for no good purpose. Thank you Sadiq Khan and Margaret Hodge for sparing us from any more of this shit.


----------



## BigTom (Aug 14, 2017)

Crispy said:


> £37m?! Where the fuck did it go?



_consultants_


----------



## SpookyFrank (Aug 14, 2017)

BigTom said:


> _consultants_



I've got to get a slice of this consultancy racket. I've already perfected doing nothing, now I just need to work out how to invoice thousands of pounds an hour for doing it.


----------



## Crispy (Aug 14, 2017)

BigTom said:


> _consultants_


I mean, this is literaly my job! Where's _my _pint of gravy?


----------



## SpookyFrank (Aug 14, 2017)

Crispy said:


> I mean, this is literaly my job! Where's _my _pint of gravy?



Have you tried being mates with Joanna Lumley?


----------



## lefteri (Aug 14, 2017)

Crispy said:


> I mean, this is literaly my job! Where's _my _pint of gravy?


There needs to be some sort of enquiry as to how heatherwick got the job for the full design with no competition


----------



## Crispy (Aug 14, 2017)

SpookyFrank said:


> Have you tried being mates with Joanna Lumley?


We disagreed about which way round to hang the toilet paper


----------



## BigTom (Aug 14, 2017)

SpookyFrank said:


> I've got to get a slice of this consultancy racket. I've already perfected doing nothing, now I just need to work out how to invoice thousands of pounds an hour for doing it.



Mate, I can teach you how to do this. Well, I say teach, I will consult with you about your future consultancy rackets. I only cost £1,000ph, let me know where to send the invoice.


----------



## Sirena (Aug 14, 2017)

Crispy said:


> £37m?! Where the fuck did it go?



https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/...K1C8rRhV8+sYKt8qjBo0Im7fQocqaHL46XWgouPjFzAU=


----------



## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Aug 14, 2017)

Crispy said:


> We disagreed about which way round to hang the toilet paper



'On the toilet roll holder' vs 'over one's servant's' arm?


----------



## hash tag (Aug 14, 2017)

SpookyFrank said:


> Now officially shitcanned:
> 
> London garden bridge project scrapped
> 
> The whole thing stank of cronyism and corruption. How 37m of public cash got spent on a private sector project before it got anywhere near actual construction should by rights be a matter for the CPS.





Crispy said:


> £37m?! Where the fuck did it go?



Try asking Johnson;it was another of his vanity projects and he agreed to spend it!


----------



## Sirena (Aug 14, 2017)

This starts to point fingers....

The garden bridge is dead – now £37m of public money must be repaid


----------



## hash tag (Aug 14, 2017)

Exactly. But he won't be called to account as he has now moved on to greater things. BASTARD.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Aug 14, 2017)

Good, now send Johnson and Osborne the fucking bill.


----------



## MAD-T-REX (Aug 15, 2017)

Noice:


----------



## hash tag (Aug 15, 2017)




----------



## pseudonarcissus (Aug 15, 2017)

Spymaster said:


> Deptford????
> 
> To the Isle of Dogs?


and why not?


----------



## hash tag (Mar 2, 2018)

Johnson says he did not waste any money on it; Khan did by scrapping it. 
Boris blusters his way around his £40m garden bridge fiasco | John Crace


----------



## TruXta (Mar 2, 2018)

It's not beyond the fuckups in city hall to manage to let Boris off the hook for this one too.


----------



## hash tag (Mar 2, 2018)

Johnson doesn't need any help when it comes to wriggling out of things. Slimy Bastard that he is.


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Mar 2, 2018)

So Johnson's story is that had Khan thrown a £100 odd million more at it and left a cheque book open in perpetuity for maintenance,  the £40m would not have been wasted, but saved, money would be saved by that?


----------



## ricbake (Mar 2, 2018)

www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/marks-barfield-welcomes-garden-bridge-probe/10012104.article

It's £37,000,000 that is quietly slipping out of public interest


This story over 5 months old


----------



## hash tag (May 27, 2018)

It's not over yet by all accounts MP calls for Garden Bridge inquiry


----------



## Pickman's model (Dec 17, 2018)

fat pigs suing garden bridge trust to get their dosh back


'I feel conned': garden bridge donors plan to sue over failed scheme


----------



## hash tag (Dec 17, 2018)

"My donation has been pissed down the drain"...its difficult to feel sorry for these people


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 13, 2019)

So the costs are in. Seems the donations will be refunded, we're paying for that...

Failed Garden Bridge project cost £53m

 




> Around £43m came out of the public's pocket





> The Garden Bridge Trust spent £161,000 on a website and £417,000 on a gala event for the abandoned project.
> 
> The design of the bridge cost more than £9m and the charity paid its executives a total of £1.7m.


----------



## hash tag (Feb 13, 2019)

Oh thank you Boris. I see he didn't even keep his pledge to play a game of table tennis


----------



## salem (Feb 13, 2019)

> TfL will now pay a final £5.5m of public money to the trust as part of the scheme's cancellation agreement, which the transport body said was 40% lower than what it could have been.


What?!? How on earth can TfL be on the hook for donations made to a separate trust? Absolute madness!

Boris should hang over this.


----------



## skyscraper101 (Feb 13, 2019)

Fuck Boris Johnson. Vanity project Grade-A cunt.


----------



## hash tag (Feb 13, 2019)

This is one of many things that Boris should swing for.


----------



## Ted Striker (Feb 13, 2019)

£21.4M for construction contracts

Did anyone tell those involved there was no longer going to be any construction? Makes a sacked Premier League manager feel like they're in the wrong industry


----------



## Bahnhof Strasse (Feb 13, 2019)

Ted Striker said:


> £21.4M for construction contracts
> 
> Did anyone tell those involved there was no longer going to be any construction? Makes a sacked Premier League manager feel like they're in the wrong industry



Just have a look at the constructions costs when they scrap HS2, would make grifter blush.


----------



## Badgers (Apr 14, 2019)

Good news 

Dame Margaret Hodge breached code of conduct over Garden Bridge


----------



## Badgers (Apr 14, 2019)

This exchange between the Museum of English Rural Life and the Vagina Museum is here to make your day better


----------

