# Save British Bees



## Quartz (Jun 27, 2014)

38 Degrees are organising a protest to prevent Syngenta getting an exemption for their bee-killing neonicotinoid pesticides.

https://you.38degrees.org.uk/events/save-our-bees-swarm-on-downing-street

I'm not exactly a fan of bees but I recognise their necessity.

I can't be there in person, but I will be there in spirit.


----------



## Badgers (Jun 27, 2014)

Signed and shared


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Jun 27, 2014)

The issue of the exemption attempt is documented here: http://www.theguardian.com/environm...on-neonicotinoid-insecticide-ban-oilseed-rape


----------



## Quartz (Jun 27, 2014)

Apart from short-sighted greed, I really don't understand why the NFU wants the exemption. No bees means far fewer crops.


----------



## SpookyFrank (Jun 27, 2014)

Quartz said:


> Apart from short-sighted greed, I really don't understand why the NFU wants the exemption. No bees means far fewer crops.



You've answered you own question before you even asked it. As we saw with the whole badger fiasco, NFU is not an organisation troubled by this new-fangled talk of 'scientifice evidence'.


----------



## Quartz (Jun 27, 2014)

SpookyFrank said:


> You've answered you own question before you even asked it.



I feared that was the case.


----------



## Chilli.s (Jun 27, 2014)

NFU smells a bit...


----------



## Quartz (Jul 1, 2014)

Protest report: http://blog.38degrees.org.uk/2014/07/01/bees-swarm-on-downing-street/









Nothing on the major news sites yet. Fingers crossed for a positive result.


----------



## SpookyFrank (Jul 1, 2014)

So Cameron has to choose between a powerful business lobby and the future survival of bees and thus the whole human race?

No prizes for guessing etc...


----------



## sim667 (Jul 2, 2014)

Damn I read this as "Save British Beers" and had visions of a bloc of morris dancers causing havoc in central london 

Edit: But no I can't go unfortunately.


----------



## Quartz (Jul 2, 2014)

The cabinet was supposed to meet about it yesterday but there's no news.



SpookyFrank said:


> So Cameron has to choose between a powerful business lobby and the future survival of bees and thus the whole human race?
> 
> No prizes for guessing etc...



I hope you're wrong; I fear you're right.


----------



## Quartz (Jul 16, 2014)

Monbiot has an article on this in today's Guardian.


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 16, 2014)

I've made a point of growing bee-friendly plants, have some bumblebee nest sites, don't use that type of insecticides ......... But bees seem to find me attractive, as they'll come to see me and fly around me even when I'm in a group .............. been tested by everybody swopping seats !


----------



## Quartz (Jul 16, 2014)

StoneRoad said:


> But bees seem to find me attractive, as they'll come to see me and fly around me even when I'm in a group .............. been tested by everybody swopping seats !



There are many things which can attract bees. For instance, some washing powders can make your clothes glow attractively in ultra-violet if not thoroughly rinsed.


----------



## Quartz (Jul 21, 2014)

I forgot to post it, but we won!



> In a statement on Thursday afternoon the company said, following an assessment of the current planting schedule for growers, it has decided to withdraw its application.



However, the buggers are going to try again next year.


----------



## Greebo (Jul 21, 2014)

Quartz said:


> <snip> However, the buggers are going to try again next year.


Half a cheer.


----------



## Quartz (Jul 29, 2014)

And today's News of the Bleeding Obvious: research funded by the industry may not be independent.


----------



## Batboy (Aug 5, 2014)

Quartz said:


> 38 Degrees are organising a protest to prevent Syngenta getting an exemption for their bee-killing neonicotinoid pesticides.
> 
> https://you.38degrees.org.uk/events/save-our-bees-swarm-on-downing-street
> 
> ...



I'm a big fan of bees.... Can't they just develop something to kill wasps...the fuckers!


----------



## Batboy (Aug 5, 2014)

Quartz said:


> Protest report: http://blog.38degrees.org.uk/2014/07/01/bees-swarm-on-downing-street/
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Looks a real buzz going on there!


----------



## teqniq (Aug 6, 2014)

I have noticed a massive drop in insects in general this summer, that is all.


----------



## Batboy (Aug 6, 2014)

teqniq said:


> I have noticed a massive drop in insects in general this summer, that is all.



I've got shit loads of moths driving me bonkers, but I have to say I've not seen many wasps (hurrah) but sadly nor many bees. I love a bumble bee....


----------



## krink (Aug 6, 2014)

same here, cmpared to last summer there is a massive reduction in bees, wasps, butterflies and not even any pollen beetle swarms either. not good. moths are doing well so that's at least something.


----------



## krink (Aug 6, 2014)

walked outside, 11 peacock flutterbys on just one bush in the garden...


----------



## teqniq (Aug 11, 2014)

Petition on someofus.org

Bayer and Syngenta: Drop your lawsuits against the European Commission immediately


----------



## gosub (Sep 2, 2014)

I don't know what this plant is, but its sprung up in my parents garden and is like cat nip for bees, they just sit on it and don't do anything else


----------



## teqniq (Sep 2, 2014)

It's Ivy in flower. The bees and butterflies love it as it's one of the last things to flower towards the end of the summer.


----------



## StoneRoad (May 20, 2015)

Update :
As expected *they* are trying again for the exemption
Petition on 38Degrees
https://speakout.38degrees.org.uk/c...for-good-937d4563-7694-41a8-a642-65e6b0e51453

signed and shared ..............


----------



## Quartz (May 20, 2015)

Thanks for the bump. I too have signed and shared the petition


----------



## Batboy (May 25, 2015)

ditto...and made donation


----------



## machine cat (May 25, 2015)

Signed


----------



## Greebo (May 25, 2015)

signed


----------



## Duncan2 (May 25, 2015)

Signed and shared poor bees


----------



## ska invita (Jun 26, 2015)

*BUMP*


I havent seen a single bee this year 
really not right...


----------



## farmerbarleymow (Jun 26, 2015)

ska invita said:


> *BUMP*
> 
> 
> I havent seen a single bee this year
> really not right...


I've only seen a couple so far.


----------



## ska invita (Jun 26, 2015)

i did see one crawling around on the floor about to die in april


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jun 27, 2015)

I've seen a fair few, but not a massive amount


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 22, 2015)

*BUMP*

so the vermin (Liz Truzz) has snuck out permission to use these bee-killing pesticides just a day before the summer recess.

IMO this stinks ...

check on 38 degrees for further information / possible protests.


----------



## Quartz (Jul 22, 2015)

StoneRoad said:


> so the vermin (Liz Truzz) has snuck out permission to use these bee-killing pesticides just a day before the summer recess.



Vermin's too nice a word for her; fyachie meikle wartle fits the bill better.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 23, 2015)

SpookyFrank said:


> So Cameron has to choose between a powerful business lobby and the future survival of bees and thus the whole human race?
> 
> No prizes for guessing etc...



I want to address this a bit.  I'm all for bees and their disappearance is a problem.  However, I have my doubts that the human race would cease to exist.

Most of the crops we depend upon are wind pollinated:  corn, wheat, oats, rye, wild rice, some tree nuts.   Where we run into trouble is with many fruit trees, almonds, lemons, etc.  Only about 30% of what we eat comes from bee pollinated crops.  That would certainly be a problem, but it probably wouldn't mean our extinction.  Bees are already extinct in some parts of the world.  There's parts of China where they send workers out to apple orchards with a feather duster to pollinate the trees.

That said, I'm still getting rid of my front yard and replacing it with bee friendly flowers.  Its going to be interesting when the city sees my crop of milkweed.  We'll see if they give me grief for my "noxious weeds."   I planted those for the monarch butterflies, whose numbers have dropped so far the US government is considering putting them on the endangered species list.

Bayer, Syngenta, Monsanto, and their ilk do need to be confronted.  There's growing evidence that their money-making schemes often come with high price-tags for the planet and us.  In confronting them we need the most accurate information possible.  Otherwise, we just get dismissed as hysterical or uninformed.


----------



## Duncan2 (Jul 23, 2015)

was gratified to see an abundance of bees busy among the rather splendid crop of thistles in the nearby meadow.It almost seemed that there were as many bees as there were clumps of thistles.These were all what I would call honey-bees though dull orange abdomen not the large bumble-bees that used to be so common.


----------



## BCBlues (Jul 23, 2015)

They're all in Wolverhampton

http://www.expressandstar.com/news/2015/07/21/watch-mayhem-as-molineux-swarm-wont-buzz-off/


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 23, 2015)

Duncan2 said:


> was gratified to see an abundance of bees busy among the rather splendid crop of thistles in the nearby meadow.It almost seemed that there were as many bees as there were clumps of thistles.These were all what I would call honey-bees though dull orange abdomen not the large bumble-bees that used to be so common.



That's part of the problem.  Bees like things that humans consider weeds.


----------



## Quartz (Jul 23, 2015)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> That's part of the problem.  Bees like things that humans consider weeds.



My mother's bees were much in demand by local farmers.



Yuwipi Woman said:


> .  Only about 30% of what we eat comes from bee pollinated crops.  That would certainly be a problem, but it probably wouldn't mean our extinction



A 30% drop in food would be more than enough of a reason for war, civil unrest, and mass starvation.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 23, 2015)

Quartz said:


> My mother's bees were much in demand by local farmers.



I should have been more specific.  In the US, the use of Round-up Ready seeds has led to many fewer weeds in corn fields.  Bees don't particularly care for corn.  They consider it "starvation food."  They like clovers, thistles, milkweeds, etc.  The acreage of those things has decreased with the increase in use of glycophosphate.  We're also planting more acres to human food that used to be pasture/native prairie.



Quartz said:


> A 30% drop in food would be more than enough of a reason for war, civil unrest, and mass starvation.



Yes, it very much would.  That's not the "extinction event" that I keep hearing about in bee preservation circles.  We might very well go extinct, but its likely to be global climate change that causes it.


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 23, 2015)

I've made a point of having a bee and butterfly-friendly garden for many years now - will have to see if I can expand my range.


----------



## Fingers (Jul 24, 2015)

I remember when I was seven or eight, used to bust round the house of an acquaintance of my grandmother. He kept bees and grew grape vines. this was obviously back in the day when you could bust round an elderly person's house and spend the day looking at cool stuff and doing cool shit without society deeming him a nonce.

His bees were ace. I was fascinated.   He used to bust into them without any white overalls and stuff, so, so did I. 

I got stung once after I sat my non too hairy arse on one of the poor buggers, but love bees

bees forever. Save the bees. 100% behind this.


----------



## campanula (Jul 25, 2015)

Fortunately, amateur beekeeping is on the rise (although since varroa it requires considerably greater pharmacological knowledge). Urban bees are possibly a truly great hope for survival of the species since many gardens are now pesticide free and are offering the diversity which is missing in rural habitats (especially arable areas such as East Anglia).


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jul 26, 2015)

campanula said:


> Fortunately, amateur beekeeping is on the rise (although since varroa it requires considerably greater pharmacological knowledge). Urban bees are possibly a truly great hope for survival of the species since many gardens are now pesticide free and are offering the diversity which is missing in rural habitats (especially arable areas such as East Anglia).



The problem is we are now getting a lot of bees, but not a lot for them to actually eat.


----------



## BCBlues (Jul 26, 2015)

I moved last year and now have a small garden that backs onto a railway bank, it's all a bit wild at the bottom of the garden so we're leaving it as we've had quite a few bees and butterflies who have also been enjoying the flowers we've planted. We're gonna try to keep it this way, downside was some runner beans we planted got destroyed by blackfly.

We're pretty new to gardening having lived in flats for years so it's pretty much a live and learn experiment going on.


----------



## campanula (Jul 26, 2015)

I suspect that the problem is more honey robbing...and these new flow hives which literally drain every smidgeon of honey might be a boon to beekeepers (the joys of separating dead bees from your extractor) but they simply mean the bees end up with an impoverished diet of sugar water. Bees are brilliant foragers and will survive on the meanest diet of old ivy and goat willow, bramble and willowherb - all weeds in huge abundance where there is a scrap of soil.

BC Blues, all you really need to know is to grow as many simple natives as possible and avoid all heavily hybridised double flowers, many of which will be sterile.


----------



## campanula (Jul 26, 2015)

Artaxerxes said:


> The problem is we are now getting a lot of bees, but not a lot for them to actually eat.



eta - dbl post?


----------



## andysays (Jul 26, 2015)

campanula said:


> ...all you really need to know is to grow as many simple natives as possible and avoid all heavily hybridised double flowers, many of which will be sterile.



And try to have as wide a range of flowering times as possible, so nectar is available for the maximum number of months each year.


----------



## BCBlues (Jul 26, 2015)

Theyre loving the hanging baskets at the moment, i aint too sure whats in 'em i'll check later (when it stops raining) and they were all over the runner beans when they were flowering.

Ive got nettles and other nice weeds growing upwards and im guiding some very tall blackberry bushes into my garden from the railway embankment to grow downards and cover an ugly metal fence for me.

Ive prepared a couple more stretches of border for planting. Any specific seeds/ plants i could put in that will flower late summer as a treat forthe bees and butterflies.


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 26, 2015)

BCBlues : re the blackfly - spray with cold soapy (washing up liquid) water. and plant marigolds as companions to the beans.
Late flowering plants - buddlia is late up here (Northumberland) mine had just started to show the spikes, but not the actual flowers, yet.
The bees are currently attending to my honeysuckle, let me have a think about other flowers ...


----------



## BCBlues (Jul 26, 2015)

StoneRoad said:


> BCBlues : re the blackfly - spray with cold soapy (washing up liquid) water. and plant marigolds as companions to the beans.
> Late flowering plants - buddlia is late up here (Northumberland) mine had just started to show the spikes, but not the actual flowers, yet.
> The bees are currently attending to my honeysuckle, let me have a think about other flowers ...



I cut the runner beans down just below where the flies were and just wiped the odd ones off. Someone advised me this was the best solution other than pesticide which is when i decided to keep the garden bee friendly. I'll keep the washing up solution in mind though as i planted the beans from seed and they grew like crazy, must be the Birmingham soil.


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 26, 2015)

It works on broad beans as well, but you do need to keep spraying, it just washes them off and drowns some, but it's not persistent.


----------



## Artaxerxes (Jul 26, 2015)

To sort out my Blackfly I used a hairspray sprayer with washing up liquid and a bunch of mashed up garlic, couple of times a week, never managed to get all of them but it got like 85%-90% of them away until the tomatoes were old enough they lost the taste.

Supposedly water with crushed tomato leaves soaked for 24 hours also works.


----------



## campanula (Jul 28, 2015)

Feeling glum at the lifting of the neo-nicotinoid ban - Monsanto et al will no doubt be hard at work on Round-Up Ready bees (the bastards). And the fucking (intensive) farming lobby are shits as well.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 28, 2015)

campanula said:


> Feeling glum at the lifting of the neo-nicotinoid ban - Monsanto et al will no doubt be hard at work on Round-Up Ready bees (the bastards). And the fucking (intensive) farming lobby are shits as well.



http://www.truth-out.org/article/item/6661:the-buzz-behind-the-monsantobeeolgics-acquisition

It's a nice business plan.  Sell the problem and the solution at the point of a lawyer.


----------



## campanula (Jul 28, 2015)

And control the fucking food chain, the filthy greedy immoral swine.


----------



## teqniq (Jul 29, 2015)

Bee-harming pesticide firms took part in key meeting on their ban


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 29, 2015)

Duncan2 said:


> was gratified to see an abundance of bees busy among the rather splendid crop of thistles in the nearby meadow.It almost seemed that there were as many bees as there were clumps of thistles.These were all what I would call honey-bees though dull orange abdomen not the large bumble-bees that used to be so common.



Doncaster Borough Council in an attempt to make massive savings, have over the last two years embarked on ploughing up vast swathes of grass verges to save money mowing.
They have seeded these areas with wild flowers and it is amazing to see these buzzing with bees and swarming with butterflies.
Also those employees are now working in other areas, without any redundancies being issued.
First time in twenty five years I have said something positive about the Borough management.


----------



## Sprocket. (Jul 29, 2015)

Monsanto are worse than arms dealers!
They are responsible for the high suicide rate among Indian farmers by causing unpayable debts.


----------



## TheInsider (Jul 29, 2015)

NFU are arseholes.  They are only interested in the landowners - some of their policies in relation to wildlife and smaller landholders (ie those that won't fork out for membership) is shocking.  They have a huge legal team that they throw at things but in reality they are just an extension of the bully boy corporations that fund them.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Jul 29, 2015)

Sprocket. said:


> Monsanto are worse than arms dealers!
> They are responsible for the high suicide rate among Indian farmers by causing unpayable debts.



They're also partly responsible for horrific birth defects, which continue to this day, caused by Agent Orange in Vietnam.  (I fully admit the US government's role, as well).


----------



## Flanflinger (Jul 31, 2015)

What about saving the Bee Gees as there is only one left.


----------



## StoneRoad (Jul 31, 2015)

Remind whose plant went kaput in Bhopal ? that was Union Carbide, IIRC, but the run away and let someone else sort out the mess you've left is a common tactic ... not confined to American based multi-nationals, I'll admit.


----------



## Quartz (Aug 20, 2015)

Here's a study appearing to prove the link, published in Nature, no less.



> A new study provides the first evidence of a link between neonicotinoid pesticides and escalating honeybee colony losses on a landscape level.
> 
> The study found the increased use of a pesticide, which is linked to causing serious harm in bees worldwide, as a seed treatment on oilseed rape in England and Wales over an 11 year period correlated with higher bee mortality during that time.


----------



## Mab (Aug 25, 2015)

FridgeMagnet said:


> The issue of the exemption attempt is documented here: http://www.theguardian.com/environm...on-neonicotinoid-insecticide-ban-oilseed-rape


We in Canada have been fighting against neonicotinoids for years and it is used on everything from food crops to flowers. Also the feds who are hard core conservatives destroyed any environmental integrity Canada had. Tea Party of the North. Sick


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Aug 26, 2015)

Mab said:


> We in Canada have been fighting against neonicotinoids for years and it is used on everything from food crops to flowers. Also the feds who are hard core conservatives destroyed any environmental integrity Canada had. Tea Party of the North. Sick



A little OT, but Outside magazine had this article on tar sands in Alberta.  The pictures are horrific:







http://www.outsideonline.com/1927156/high-cost-oil

This particular reporter is quite good.  He's also written extensively on the meat packing industry.


----------



## Quartz (Sep 2, 2015)

Oh look, Monsanto want to sell us genetically modified flying ants to replace the bees.


----------



## andysays (Sep 2, 2015)

Quartz said:


> Oh look, Monsanto want to sell us genetically modified flying ants to replace the bees.



Don't these idiots watch cheap disaster movies? We're swapping this


for this


and this


----------



## Quartz (Sep 2, 2015)

I've just been told that the Monsanto story originated on a spoof site. Oh well.


----------



## Artaxerxes (Dec 9, 2015)

So it was debated

Neonicotinoids on Crops | Hansard Online Website

Now what?


----------



## teqniq (Aug 16, 2016)

*bump*

No shit Sherlock

Controversial insecticides linked to ‘large-scale population extinctions’ of wild bees

and meanwhile

Bayer is suing a whole continent for saving the bees?


----------



## Duncan2 (Aug 16, 2016)

teqniq said:


> *bump*
> 
> No shit Sherlock
> 
> ...


Is this something to do with TTIP or something more mundane along the lines of Restraint Of Trade do you know?


----------



## teqniq (Aug 16, 2016)

What? Nope. It's an independent study that has provided evidence linking neonicotinoids to a decline in bee population. It has everything to do with the profits of the insecticide manufacturers though.


----------



## Duncan2 (Aug 17, 2016)

Right thanks for that I thought of TTIP in this connection because you would hope that if the Commission decide that neonicotinoids are bad for the environment they would be able to impose a ban whether the insecticide manufacturers like it or not?


----------



## teqniq (Aug 17, 2016)

One would hope so but never doubt the persistence of capital and their legal people when profits are threatened.


----------



## coley (Aug 19, 2016)

Duncan2 said:


> Right thanks for that I thought of TTIP in this connection because you would hope that if the Commission decide that neonicotinoids are bad for the environment they would be able to impose a ban whether the insecticide manufacturers like it or not?


IIRC, the EU issued a ban but the UK applied for, and got a limited exemption?


----------



## Mab (Sep 27, 2016)

So Monsanto and Bayer are planning to merge--ahhhhhhhh!, when approved (matter of short time). I'm sure Monsanto is also trying to rid themselves of their infamous name but I haven't heard of the new name yet. I don't want them to be able to hide their deeds behind new branding. Has anyone heard of the new name yet? Cheers!


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Sep 27, 2016)

Mab said:


> So Monsanto and Bayer are planning to merge--ahhhhhhhh!, when approved (matter of short time). I'm sure Monsanto is also trying to rid themselves of their infamous name but I haven't heard of the new name yet. I don't want them to be able to hide their deeds behind new branding. Has anyone heard of the new name yet? Cheers!



Bayer has an equally checkered history they'd like to shed as well.


----------



## Sprocket. (Sep 27, 2016)

Mab said:


> So Monsanto and Bayer are planning to merge--ahhhhhhhh!, when approved (matter of short time). I'm sure Monsanto is also trying to rid themselves of their infamous name but I haven't heard of the new name yet. I don't want them to be able to hide their deeds behind new branding. Has anyone heard of the new name yet? Cheers!



I have just read on the Bloomberg site that Bayer will be the name of the merged companies and Monsanto will be no more!
Plus due to the anti-merge feeling across Europe and America it could be the end of 2017 before the deal is closed.
Sorry cannot post link from phone.
BTW if you put Monsanto into Google the first tip that pops up says.
Monsanto Evil.


----------



## Mab (Sep 29, 2016)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> Bayer has an equally checkered history they'd like to shed as well.


Too true. They are a German company? Are they based in Germany too?


----------



## Mab (Sep 29, 2016)

Cheers, let's call them BayerMonsanto one name


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Sep 29, 2016)

Mab said:


> Too true. They are a German company? Are they based in Germany too?



Yes.  From 1925 until the end of WWII they were a subsidiary of IG Farben, the patent owner, at the time, of Zyclon B.*  At the end of the war the Allies broke up the company into different parts because of the company's association with the Nazis and the use of slave labor.   Bayer ended up with a lot of the assets of IG Farben.

Bayer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

* I think its worth a mention that this chemical is still manufactured and used in some agricultural sectors.


----------



## Yuwipi Woman (Sep 29, 2016)

Saw this in the news the other day and it isn't promising news for bees in the US:



> The rusty patched bumble bee population has finally reached endangered levels.
> 
> On Wednesday, the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service proposed the bees be classified as an endangered species—the first wild bee species in the continental U.S. to be formally recommended for federal protection under the U.S. Endangered Species Act, according to Reuters.
> 
> The bees, scientifically known as Bombus affinis, are nicknamed for the red blotch on their abdomen. They live in the upper Midwest and Northeastern part of the U.S., but Reuters reported that populations have declined drastically in the past 20 years, decreasing by upwards of 90% since the late 1990s due to disease, pesticides, climate change, and habitat loss.



This Bumble Bee Could Become an Endangered Species


----------



## Mab (Oct 12, 2016)

Yuwipi Woman said:


> Yes.  From 1925 until the end of WWII they were a subsidiary of IG Farben, the patent owner, at the time, of Zyclon B.*  At the end of the war the Allies broke up the company into different parts because of the company's association with the Nazis and the use of slave labor.   Bayer ended up with a lot of the assets of IG Farben.
> 
> Bayer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> * I think its worth a mention that this chemical is still manufactured and used in some agricultural sectors.


Oh my gosh of course! What's wrong with me how could we forget thalidomide too!


----------



## Mab (Oct 12, 2016)

Canada is way behind America in any protections for bees and the environment in general.  Can I say so-called mainstream people in Canada always believe Canada is much more environmentally sound than the states, cleaner safer food and so on when it's the opposite.


----------



## camouflage (Oct 14, 2016)

Mab said:


> So Monsanto and Bayer are planning to merge--ahhhhhhhh!, when approved (matter of short time). I'm sure Monsanto is also trying to rid themselves of their infamous name but I haven't heard of the new name yet. I don't want them to be able to hide their deeds behind new branding. Has anyone heard of the new name yet? Cheers!



Evil Corp? Multi-National United? Wayland-Yatuni?  Full-Spectrum Planet Fuckers Combine? Soylent Pink (For a better Tommorow) plc?


----------



## teqniq (Nov 23, 2016)

European Scientists Discover Bee Resurgence After Banning These 3 Pesticides Still Used in The U.S.


----------



## teqniq (Apr 2, 2017)

The pesticide lobbyists are at it again so.....

Keep the ban on bee-killing pesticides


----------



## teqniq (Apr 2, 2017)

The pesticide lobbyists are at it again so...

Keep the ban on bee-killing pesticides


----------



## William of Walworth (Apr 2, 2017)

Bees, they're fucking awesome


----------



## teqniq (Sep 10, 2017)

Bayer is suing a whole continent for saving the bees?

Michael Gove: protect our bees


----------



## bemused (Sep 10, 2017)

I'm fed up with the endless doom and gloom frankly hysteria around honey bees and neonicotinoids. 

In some cases, it has been counter productive. For example, oil seed rape (called OSR; the yellow fields you see at the start of spring) which suffer from infestation my cabbage stem flea beetles, this was treated up to 2013 with one of three products families - clothianidin, imidacloprid or thiamethoxam. The reason for banning them is that there is evidence that they may have sub lethal effects which could cause weakness in honey bee colonies. 

Given that OSR is a major cash crop farmers have reverted back to using pyrethroids, where as neonicotinoids don't kill bees, you can spray a hive with clothianidin and nothing will happen - pyrethroids are highly toxic to honey bees and have explicitly lethal effects. I know because I've lost hives to pyrethroid spraying. You can find the same chemicals in products designed to kill ants, fleas, and moths. Moreover, unlike seed coated treatments that replaced them pyrethroids are sprayed on the fields in multiple cycles - putting, even more, pesticides into the ground. 

This campaign has been successful in replacing a product that has sub-lethal effects on honey bees with one that has lethal effects. Resulting in either farmer using more, older pesticides or stopping growing that crop altogether. Ironically seeing the decline in an important pollinator food source. 

The honey bee apocalypse is something created in the USA by the pollinator industry who load hundreds of hives onto flat bed trucks, drive them thousands of miles, place them in monocultures sprayed with all sorts of junk - and then wonder why the bees are dying. 

CCD isn't in Europe, or indeed Australia who also have a huge commercial pollinator industry. 

The biggest lever at the moment for the success for pollinator health in the UK is habitat, unfortunately, lobby groups can't make as much money in donations blaming lawnmower users - evil chemical companies are so much friendly on the donate button.


----------



## campanula (Sep 10, 2017)

Well, yes...and no. Habitat is definitely an issue - the real problem (I think) lies with intensive farming of monocrops. OSR, in vast fields is a cash crop...and while it also provides a nectar and pollen source for bees, at the time of flowering, there is no shortage of other food sources for bees (or should be, in a more mixed rural environment). A less intensive, more diverse method of farming would quite likely lead to a much diminished need for any insecticides. My hive does perfectly well, despite being in a desert of industrial Norfolk agriculture (although my local farmer practices a much older system of rotations and uses only herbicides once a year)...but also because I have literally surrounded the hive with an array of sustenance, from the early goat willow to the nectar source of last resort, mature ivy. My local beekeeping soc claims urban bees are in better shape than rural ones primarily because diversity.. so probably not lawnmowers and block paving. I see no reason to ditch the scepticism relating to agricultural use of chemicals - farmers are not our friends...many of then are not even farmers but land investment collectives with licensed tenants. The countryside has been under siege since WW2
CCD is a catch-all syndrome, rather than a proven effect - varroa is still more of a concern afaik...and I am not thrilled with the use of continual flow honey tapping - I take only a small proportion of honey. I use icing sugar rather than miticides - a little sprinkling and the bees are mad to groom each other, removing mites as well as sugar. This is only my 3rd summer so obviously a complete novice...and still quite anxious.

As ever, people will be making a name and a career.pushing various agendas.

eta-currently, horribly depressed after reading Graham Harvey's 'The Killing of the Countryside' - a bitter polemic and somewhat one sided but ...even worse, the miserable history of east anglian farming and the utter demise of the small mixed farms (and loss of livelihood for people who worked them)


----------



## bemused (Sep 10, 2017)

campanula said:


> Well, yes...and no. Habitat is definitely an issue - the real problem (I think) lies with intensive farming of monocrops. OSR, in vast fields is a cash crop...and while it also provides a nectar and pollen source for bees, at the time of flowering, there is no shortage of other food sources for bees (or should be, in a more mixed rural environment).



That's why the agri-environmental schemes are so important. Feild margins are now at their highest levels in the last 20 years. 

If you can manage varroa, robbing and the wet you'll be fine.


----------



## Libertad (Sep 10, 2017)

bemused said:


> That's why the agri-environmental schemes are so important. Feild margins are now at their highest levels in the last 20 years.
> 
> If you can manage varroa, robbing and the wet you'll be fine.



And EFB, AFB, Small Hive Beetle, Wax Moth, Nosema, Sacbrood virus and the Asian Hornet. Our bees have got it tough. I've got a Queen who's due to make her mating flight and it hasn't stopped raining for a week.


----------



## bemused (Sep 10, 2017)

Libertad said:


> And EFB, AFB, Small Hive Beetle, Wax Moth, Nosema, Sacbrood virus and the Asian Hornet. Our bees have got it tough. I've got a Queen who's due to make her mating flight and it hasn't stopped raining for a week.



That's a bit tight to get a queen done, good luck.


----------



## StoneRoad (Sep 10, 2017)

I've been bee, bird and butterfly watching this year. I live not far from a local road, but have mixed woodland, grazing land and some gardens nearby. No OSR, the only crops the locals have are hay / silage for sheep and cattle. Also a few horses and plenty of tourists.

Very mixed results !
Bees - less than a few years ago for overall numbers /species, but only about as good as last year. White tailed bumbles and worker honey bees seen in good numbers, plus a few others.
Last year saw very few butterflies; this year we had a lot of red admirals, but not much else (a few peacocks, small tortishell, various "whites") - despite a huge area of nettles !
Birds have done OK (but I need to re-supply the nest boxes, age and weather have taken toll).
No visible hedgehogs, but there are some other small mammals / amphibians about.

I think this year has seen some recovery after the last couple of years, but slow progress. The very wet spells have been a problem after a good start. In a long term programme, I am carrying out some significant tree / bush pruning but re-instating flowered areas, and making more bee friendly areas. Overall, keeping the small area under my command as wildlife friendly as I can.


----------



## Libertad (Sep 10, 2017)

bemused said:


> That's a bit tight to get a queen done, good luck.



Like  quite a few beeks in our area a prime swarm colony's queen just disappeared, she was unmarked. After numerous inspections we couldn't find her. She had been laying a good brood pattern and then it stopped.
No supersedure, no laying workers, they hadn't cast; pollen still coming in. A mystery. 

I introduced a good mixed brood frame, eggs, larvae, sealed cells and they raised another queen. I could have combined but this swarm colony was large and they're true black bees. She was mature, by my notes, on Wednesday so she needs to get jiggy with some drones pretty quick. If she doesn't start laying then I will have to combine. ((Black bees)))


----------



## bemused (Sep 11, 2017)

Libertad said:


> Like  quite a few beeks in our area a prime swarm colony's queen just disappeared, she was unmarked.



I clip them the moment they start laying. It is a swarm control safety net.


----------



## Libertad (Sep 11, 2017)

bemused said:


> I clip them the moment they start laying. It is a swarm control safety net.



Other than splits I make all my increase by collecting swarms, sometimes my own. I'd never clip a queen but that's just my personal choice.


----------



## bemused (Sep 11, 2017)

Libertad said:


> Other than splits I make all my increase by collecting swarms, sometimes my own. I'd never clip a queen but that's just my personal choice.



I've been queen grafting for the last three seasons. I've finally got the point where I can do it and (almost) consistent results.


----------



## Libertad (Sep 11, 2017)

bemused said:


> I've been queen grafting for the last three seasons. I've finally got the point where I can do it and (almost) consistent results.



Skillz  Did anything come of your podcast project?


----------



## bemused (Sep 11, 2017)

Libertad said:


> Skillz  Did anything come of your podcast project?



Not yet, I started a new job so I've not got the time. There are plenty I listen to however.


----------



## StoneRoad (Nov 9, 2017)

Is this progress ?

UK will back total ban on bee-harming pesticides, Michael Gove reveals

At least 38degrees seems to think it is.


----------



## Mab (Nov 19, 2017)

This summer, the lavender was just covered in worker bees here in Ontario Canada. Every day I checked. Amazing, so many.


----------

