# Best pens



## tar1984 (Sep 9, 2012)

For notetaking & general purpose study use.  

I am quite enjoying the papermate flexgrip, pictured below







What is your favourite pen?


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## Callie (Sep 9, 2012)

my current favourite is a random blue biro i found in the lab at work. i dont know what make it is, it looks fairly cheap and unbranded i think but its a nice shade of blue and writes smoothly and with a line (?) of decent thickness.

where i work we have a random assortment of biros that people get from reps, conferences or the nhs supply chain. this means there is a great selection of biros and they each have their own characteristics so everyone can find a pen they like.


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## tar1984 (Sep 9, 2012)

I have a bag full of random pens, all different types, I'd quite like a new set of nice brand new pens though.  I hate starting to use one then it runs out, and you have to carry on writing with a different colour or thickness.


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## tar1984 (Sep 9, 2012)

I start the most fun weekend threads


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 9, 2012)

I really like these: http://www.cultpens.com/acatalog/Pentel_Superb_G.html

I bought boxes of 10 of blue and black a while back so I wouldn't run out.


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## tar1984 (Sep 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> I really like these: http://www.cultpens.com/acatalog/Pentel_Superb_G.html
> 
> I bought boxes of 10 of blue and black a while back so I wouldn't run out.


 
They have been discontinued and 'replaced by the Superb G BK401' which looks pretty similar tbf.  

I want to bulk buy a set of pens for the upcoming term


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## Firky (Sep 9, 2012)

Pantone <3


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## tar1984 (Sep 9, 2012)

firky said:


> Pantone <3


 
Do the colours represent the colour the pen writes in?  I don't see why you'd need such a range of colours.


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## Firky (Sep 9, 2012)

Graphic design, illustration, product design, blah blah.

The colours are an international standard that does not vary.


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 9, 2012)

tar1984 said:


> They have been discontinued and 'replaced by the Superb G BK401' which looks pretty similar tbf.
> 
> I want to bulk buy a set of pens for the upcoming term


 
Yes, the new ones look very similar. I like them a lot. I got them in fine, rather than medium, and they write nicely. It's work checking ebay and the like for bulk buys (I buy AA batteries in bulk - it was like the proverbial lightbulb moment the first time I realised to do that), although I think I may have gotten mine from some school supply website.


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## Meltingpot (Sep 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> I really like these: http://www.cultpens.com/acatalog/Pentel_Superb_G.html
> 
> I bought boxes of 10 of blue and black a while back so I wouldn't run out.


 
I've got a Superb BK77, I can recommend that one very highly too.


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## Onket (Sep 9, 2012)

Always got time for this sort of thing- http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Naughty-s...ncils_WritingEquipment_SM&hash=item2a227ba776


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## Onket (Sep 9, 2012)

And this-


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## quimcunx (Sep 9, 2012)

I tried a few and found myself favouring the uni-ball vision elite.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 9, 2012)

Oddly, despite having spent a lot of time and money on pens, the one I use the most at the moment is an Airmail 69L, which cost less than a tenner. In fact a bottle of the ink I usually load it with (Noodler's Heart Of Darkness) cost more than the pen, mostly because I had to get it from the US.



http://www.andys-pens.co.uk/clearacrylic.shtml (same thing, different markings, mine is the model sold in India iirc)


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 9, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Oddly, despite having spent a lot of time and money on pens, the one I use the most at the moment is an Airmail 69L, which cost less than a tenner. In fact a bottle of the ink I usually load it with (Noodler's Heart Of Darkness) cost more than the pen, mostly because I had to get it from the US.
> 
> View attachment 22897
> 
> http://www.andys-pens.co.uk/clearacrylic.shtml (same thing, different markings, mine is the model sold in India iirc)


 
Should probably take this over to the fountain pen thread, but what the hell: how does the fine nib compare to Lamy fine/extra fine? I favour their extra-fine, and I think any finer would be too fine, but I'm aware they are a little on the broad side compared to Japanese nibs, for example.

I'm looking for something relatively ergonomic, and cheap, and reliable, for lots of note-taking, with the equivalent loveliness of the Lamy 2K extra-fine.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Should probably take this over to the fountain pen thread, but what the hell: how does the fine nib compare to Lamy fine/extra fine? I favour their extra-fine, and I think any finer would be too fine, but I'm aware they are a little on the broad side compared to Japanese nibs, for example.


ever tried a platinum carbon? 

Japanese EF, but - IMO - stunning for £10. I'd gladly write with it all day.

Tbf, I'd've posted that here anyway, so this isn't officially an FP derail. Yet.


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## Firky (Sep 9, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Oddly, despite having spent a lot of time and money on pens, the one I use the most at the moment is an Airmail 69L, which cost less than a tenner. In fact a bottle of the ink I usually load it with (Noodler's Heart Of Darkness) cost more than the pen, mostly because I had to get it from the US.


 
Why not just use ink you can buy here?


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 9, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> ever tried a platinum carbon?
> 
> Japanese EF, but - IMO - stunning for £10. I'd gladly write with it all day.
> 
> Tbf, I'd've posted that here anyway, so this isn't officially an FP derail. Yet.


 
I have not. I shall look it up, thank you


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 9, 2012)

Oh, it's similar to the Rotring artpen I have. That's a bit too scratchy for writing, doesn't give the right kind of feel I like. It's cheap though, so if I didn't like it I could use it for drawing instead I suppose. Hmm.


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## starfish (Sep 9, 2012)

This is the best & most comfortable pen i have ever used. Its a left handed pen. For some reason i cant seem to find permanent ink for it though. I used it at work for a while but some of the papers i wrote on got wet & the ink disappeared.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Oh, it's similar to the Rotring artpen I have. That's a bit too scratchy for writing, doesn't give the right kind of feel I like. It's cheap though, so if I didn't like it I could use it for drawing instead I suppose. Hmm.


Depends what you mean by 'scratchy,' but it's one of the loveliest Japanese EFs I've owned. Bloody lovely ink flow, too.

e2a: then again, Platinum do make their own nibs. I believe. And are the parent company of the same lovely, lovely bastards who made my Nakaya(s)!


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## mrs quoad (Sep 9, 2012)

firky said:


> Why not just use ink you can buy here?


Trolling level: expert.


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## dylanredefined (Sep 9, 2012)

These are nice cheap space pen equivelant


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Should probably take this over to the fountain pen thread, but what the hell: how does the fine nib compare to Lamy fine/extra fine? I favour their extra-fine, and I think any finer would be too fine, but I'm aware they are a little on the broad side compared to Japanese nibs, for example.
> 
> I'm looking for something relatively ergonomic, and cheap, and reliable, for lots of note-taking, with the equivalent loveliness of the Lamy 2K extra-fine.


Finer than the Safari EF (I've not tried a 2K EF but 2Ks seem to run slightly broader than Safari nibs anyway IME) but not the sort of needle you'd get from a Japanese F.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 9, 2012)

firky said:


> Why not just use ink you can buy here?


Why don't you buy a set of coloured felt tips from Poundland?


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## Firky (Sep 9, 2012)

Poundland don't do Pantone, only vaguely racist caricature ashtrays of grinning rastas smoking a joint, packs of flint free lighters and fingerless marigold gloves.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 9, 2012)

They're actually selling some decent colour film at the moment - I have a carrier bag full.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 9, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Finer than the Safari EF (I've not tried a 2K EF but 2Ks seem to run slightly broader than Safari nibs anyway IME) but not the sort of needle you'd get from a Japanese F.


I think I had a Lamy 2K EF.

I think I gave it away.

I thought it had one of the vilest nibs known to mankind. But the person I gave it to (in return for a Curly Wurly) adores it, and draws with it.

And - to continue the chain - passed on a particularly posh pen of her own to someone else.


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 9, 2012)

I love the 2K EF. Mine's acting up now though (I have to prime it before writing each time, and after a minute or two, it just dries up). I have an F as well, which writes so amazingly smoothly, but is too broad for my general note-taking needs.

I've been looking longingly at a Sailor pen, either a mid-size 1911 or a Sapporo. Can't justify the expense, though. Might just get an EF nib for my Safari instead (it's F right now) and plug away with that.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 10, 2012)

I expect Lamy would sort that out for you.


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## tar1984 (Sep 10, 2012)

How on earth are you people so enthusiastic and knowledgeable about pens?  I want to buy all these specialist pens now


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

tar1984 said:


> How on earth are you people so enthusiastic and knowledgeable about pens?  I want to buy all these specialist pens now


There's a fountain pen thread on suburban!

IME, I write more when I'm using a pen I like. Which - atm - *mostly* means the rolled string soft-nibbed Nakaya Artichoke gave me as an engagement present.

I'll stick at *mostly,* because pre-edit this was a ridiculously obsessional post.


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## dooley (Sep 10, 2012)

the uniball deluxe was my favourite,  now i use those uniball eye mediums


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## Lord Camomile (Sep 10, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> In fact a bottle of the ink I usually load it with (Noodler's Heart Of Darkness)...




I could easily see myself getting obsessed with pens (I get obsessed quite easily  ) but I was remarking the other day how I always seem to lose my 'nice' pens (in this case 'nice' only stretches to a couple of sub-£10 Parkers and my space pen, which I have lost twice  ) but manage to hang on till death to the cheap biros we get at work.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 10, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> I could easily see myself getting obsessed with pens (I get obsessed quite easily  ) but I was remarking the other day how I always seem to lose my 'nice' pens (in this case 'nice' only stretches to a couple of sub-£10 Parkers and my space pen, which I have lost twice  ) but manage to hang on till death to the cheap biros we get at work.


Space Pens vanish in about five minutes though. They seem specially designed to slip out of pockets. In fact, given that they're supposed to be indestructible and write forever, this may be a deliberate move to get you to buy a new one


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## DotCommunist (Sep 10, 2012)

Bic Biro. Nothing else is required. Anything fancier than a biro is affectation. As bad as using comic sans. Take your nib, sir, and fuck off. I am of the ballpoint generation and we shall triumph.


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## Onket (Sep 10, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> Bic Biro. Nothing else is required. Anything fancier than a biro is affectation. As bad as using comic sans. Take your nib, sir, and fuck off. I am of the ballpoint generation and we shall triumph.


 
The clear plastic barrelled biro is much better than the one with the yellow plastic barrell, imo, there is still a discussion to have.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 10, 2012)

christ, I'm on cultpens again now


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## DotCommunist (Sep 10, 2012)

Onket said:


> The clear plastic barrelled biro is much better than the one with the yellow plastic barrell, imo, there is still a discussion to have.


 

The clear plastic is OK but it fails to match colour with my two bladed disposable razors- I'll grant that the see through nature allows you to see when the innards have ruptured. That is an advantage.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 10, 2012)

Onket said:


> The clear plastic barrelled biro is much better than the one with the yellow plastic barrell, imo, there is still a discussion to have.


This is a common POV - the clear Cristals have a 1mm point vs the 0.8mm of the yellow fine point, so they are generally more comfortable to write with and less likely to scratch cheap paper.


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## Mrs Magpie (Sep 10, 2012)

I've just bought a Victorian dip pen made of Whitby Jet. I shall use it when I am in mourning.


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## Onket (Sep 10, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> This is a common POV - the clear Cristals have a 1mm point vs the 0.8mm of the yellow fine point, so they are generally more comfortable to write with and less likely to scratch cheap paper.


 
I have notice the yellow is 'fine' and the clear is 'medium'. Are there any more?


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 10, 2012)

Onket said:


> I have notice the yellow is 'fine' and the clear is 'medium'. Are there any more?


They do a "Bold" one with a grey barrel that has a 1.6mm ball - http://www.bicworld.com/en/products/details/239/cristal-large-bold I've not seen those about, though, you'd probably have to go to a specialist shop or get it on the net.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 10, 2012)

not a fan of those multi-inked biros that you can click to rotate and get different coloured inks. They are unwieldy and who really wants to write in green ink anyway, except for derange people.


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## Onket (Sep 10, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> They do a "Bold" one with a grey barrel that has a 1.6mm ball - http://www.bicworld.com/en/products/details/239/cristal-large-bold I've not seen those about, though, you'd probably have to go to a specialist shop or get it on the net.


 
I'm going to have to get one.

In black, of course.


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## Mrs Magpie (Sep 10, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> not a fan of those multi-inked biros that you can click to rotate and get different coloured inks. They are unwieldy and who really wants to write in green ink anyway, except for derange people.


Nice for a child to get in a Christmas stocking though. I got one of those when they were a New Exciting Thing. Loved it and it was great for graphs and diagrams requiring more than blue or black.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 10, 2012)

This is my favourite biro btw: the Schneider Slider Memo.







http://www.cultpens.com/acatalog/Schneider-Slider-Memo.html

I got one for free with another order, but the ink they use is excellent - really smooth to write with and starts up immediately - and the tip is just broad enough to make it good for casual notes, but not so broad it takes up too much space. It's also slightly rubberised which improves the grip, but isn't some sort of squishy "ergonomic" thing.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> christ, I'm on cultpens again now


Think I've looked two or three times since getting the Nakaya(s).

Just CBA, tbh. I know that there's no point looking, because if I get something, it just won't be used. Dip pens and nibs only, because they're a very different thing. And a brief flirtation with a stub pencil, which doesn't *really* get used any more.

I'm v tempted by a nibs dot com Falcon Namiki spencerian-ground nib, possibly as a PhD submission reward  Otherwise... I can't see what a new pen'd do that'd ever make me use it, over and above the Nakayas.

An expensive cost-saving measure, but, still


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## Lord Camomile (Sep 10, 2012)

Ok, but honestly, seriously, _how_ much difference can there be in pens.

Aside from the colour, obviously.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Ok, but honestly, seriously, _how_ much difference can there be in pens.
> 
> Aside from the colour, obviously.


This is pretty wanky writing, tbf, showing (IMO) some of the more inexcusable excesses of an overenthusiastic American.

But try and write this with a bic biro:






tbf, a large part of the rest of the cost *is* the aesthetics.

A £3-400 (new) Nakaya would write as well as a £15-25,000 Nakaya (IMU), the difference being the lacquerwork, decoration and tinkering on the outer bits.

And there're all kinds of raw, staggering horrors out there, like Montegrappa's Sylvester Stallone crafted 'Chaos' pen:






Montegrappa seem to specialise in silverwork / gold catastrophes, IMlimitedE, targeted on raw displays of wealth that look *incredibly* uncomfortable to write with. (They often do ballpoint versions, too, for people who don't want the mess of a FP. I really, really fucking hope those are *really* good biros, for north of £10k )

And, yes, I'm fully aware you weren't being entirely serious  But it's worth recognising just how much of many pens isn't about how they write. IMO.


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## Lord Camomile (Sep 10, 2012)

Well, it was half serious, half not. It's just coming from a point of ignorance and lack of understanding, and being curious about what actual differences there are.

For example, I get that the writing from a biro will look different to a fountain pen, but it's more a question of how one fountain pen will look different to another. Though I get that part of it's also about how they feel to write with.

Stallone


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

Montegrappa Bruce Lee Tribute, Gold and Ruby Biro:






'Your price': $76,500

http://www.pianki.com/Montegrappa-Dragon-Bruce-Lee-18k-Gold-Rollerball-Pen-w-Rubies_p_4608.html

(tbf, I found it going for under $50k elsewhere)


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## Meltingpot (Sep 10, 2012)

Onket said:


> The clear plastic barrelled biro is much better than the one with the yellow plastic barrell, imo, there is still a discussion to have.


 
If I remember rightly, the Swedish government have cleared the yellow ones for archival use, so they can't be that bad.

I was happy with the yellow ones until I discovered the fine-pointed Pentel Superbs, which I think are even better (but a lot more expensive, it has to be said).


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Well, it was half serious, half not. It's just coming from a point of ignorance and lack of understanding, and being curious about what actual differences there are.
> 
> For example, I get that the writing from a biro will look different to a fountain pen, but it's more a question of how one fountain pen will look different to another. Though I get that part of it's also about how they feel to write with.


OK... nibs on fountain pens can certainly differ in a number of ways. Not least, ink flow, smoothness, nib material, flexibility and width.

All of those vary to some extent with various pen types and manufacturers. Though more expensive pens (£100+ ?) tend to have gold nibs, of some variety. Often 14k.

tbf, it's largely a matter of preference - I can't abide fat nibs, love a 'medium' ink flow (perhaps flowing towards fast), and appreciate a bit of bounce / flex. I *hate* nibs that give no feedback (which feel, to me, too smooth - that's why I gave away the Lamy 2k I mentioned earlier. I wrote like a child with it, bc it wasn't able to give me the 'feel' I needed to write coherent letters).

Other people'd hate the pens I write with, and love to bits.

Japanese nibs also tend to be designed for Japanese characters, so are a decent bit thinner / finer than European nibs. I *love love love* Japanese EFs - which aren't far off a hairline. And some Japanese manufacturers make their own nibs, too (Platinum, for example) whilst there's (apparently) been a growing criticism / concern that a fair few other pen companies outsource nib production to one or two very large companies.

Erm, beyond that, if you want to see some proper pathological nibs, Sailor is a good place to start. They've got - I believe - a reputation as the most eccentric / comprehensive nib maker going atm, though their range for EFs is still a bit shit, and they don't - afaict - really do flex  It's mostly in the broader nibs they've got some bonkers nibs going on: http://www.nibs.com/SailorSpecialtyNibs.htm





^^^ Nagahara King Cobra Emperor nib 





^^^ Naginata Cross Music Emperor nib 

Nakaya make pens up to, fuck only knows, £50,000 plus? [tbf, I've just had a look, and can't find many over $15k] I (L) knowing that my £600 engagement pen was made to order, with a nib built by their 'nib master' to my precise requirements (0.24-0.30mm soft flex, long story ) hand-lacquered by two elderly japanese artisans in an outlying village, and ENTIRELY built by four octogenarian retirees over the space of about 3 months. (They don't arrive quickly ). The backstory, octogenarians, etc, are a part of the cost. As is receiving emails from the 'nib master' asking about precise nib grinding / ink flow requirements, etc, etc.

But *none* of their nibs - afaict - is more expensive than the ones you can get on pens that go for about £3-400. After the first £200 or so, *everything* is Japanese lacquerwork, decoration, etc - on their pens, at least. Sailor nibs go up to closer to £800 (IIRC) for some of the more ridiculous ones. But, again, over that, you're paying for decoration.


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## DotCommunist (Sep 10, 2012)

script so flourished that its barely comprehensible to a native speaker of english is deffo the way forward


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

DotCommunist said:


> script so flourished that its barely comprehensible to a native speaker of english is deffo the way forward


Backward  The way backward 

That nib's a 'spencerian adjustment':




			
				wiki said:
			
		

> *Spencerian Script* is a script style that flourished in the United States from 1850 to 1925[1]


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## Lord Camomile (Sep 10, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> OK...




Wow, cheers 

I really don't pay attention to the way I write like some people clearly do  Do they assess your writing style, like runners get assess for trainers/shoes?


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Wow, cheers
> 
> I really don't pay attention to the way I write like some people clearly do  Do they assess your writing style, like runners get assess for trainers/shoes?


Hell, yes 

I'm going through the Nakaya order form atm, to see if I can find some of their questions.

9 nib widths... erm...






tbf, quite a few places that do their own nibs'll also ask you to send a sample of your handwriting.

I wanted a Nakaya nib that was finer than their F, but they don't do EF 'soft' (slightly flexible) nibs. So their 'nib master' offered to grind me one to my exact requirements / request instead - hence my slightly weird (0.26-0.30mm) width request.

Nakaya also send a letter with every pen, offering a free nib adjustment - so if it isn't entirely to your liking, you can send it back and they'll adjust it for free.


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## Lord Camomile (Sep 10, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> Hell, yes
> 
> I'm going through the Nakaya order form atm, to see if I can find some of their questions.


Awesome 



mrs quoad said:


> tbf, quite a few places that do their own nibs'll also ask you to send a sample of your handwriting.


"Is that a b?  Hey Geoff, is this a b, or an l and an o?"





mrs quoad said:


> EF


 _Ohh_, that's extra-fine!  @ self. 





mrs quoad said:


> hence my slightly weird (0.26-0.30mm) width request.


Well, I wasn't going to say anything.













Freak.


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## Mrs Magpie (Sep 10, 2012)

Wrong thread, but I have just taken delivery of the best inkwell ever and I can't keep it to myself.
This isn't it, it's not painted bronze, it's plate, but it's the same design on a marble base.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 10, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Well, I wasn't going to say anything.
> 
> 
> Freak.


 
 That was more social awkwardness than anything else. They don't *do* EF 'soft' nibs, so I felt like a bit of a twat asking for one.

So I asked for a nib that was *between* the F 'soft' (which they _do _do) and their EF. Which only gave a margin of about 0.06mm 

And, do you know, the magnificent bastards've actually gone and done it? It's definitely between the Nakaya F I've got elsewhere, and the Sailor Sapporo EF I've got downstairs (which is a wee bit thinner than Nakaya's EF).

That's some - IMO - moderately ridiculous grinding going on there


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## Onket (Sep 10, 2012)

Onket said:


> Always got time for this sort of thing- http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Naughty-s...ncils_WritingEquipment_SM&hash=item2a227ba776


 
Only me, then.


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## Greebo (Sep 10, 2012)

Crystal Bic with black ink for normal use, Kaweco sport ink roller the rest of the time.  I wreck nibs.


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## Dovydaitis (Sep 10, 2012)

for filling in my diary I use staedtler triplus fineliners of differing colours (I tend to colourcode, so I have a colour for work shifts, one for lectures, one for birthdays, one for medical etc)
I use sharpie markers when I'm making spider diagrams on wallpaper, again differing colours
In lectures and general note taking I use Stabilo easy original as it's a left handed pen and shaped to fit snuggle in my hand meaning I can write fro ages without getting cramp. I used to love a good Bic but this pen has left it for dust.

Finally my best pen, lovely to write with, nicely weighted is the Cross Sauvage Blue crocodile rolling ball pen. So smooth and very comfortable to write with, almost glides across the page.

I don't get on well with fountain/proper ink pens, being left handed I cover my work as I go so end up smudging wet ink and going home with a coloured hand


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## Dovydaitis (Sep 11, 2012)

and on that note, I HAVE LOST MY PEN!!!!!  really don't want to buy another because as soon as I do I will find my old one....


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## Mrs Magpie (Sep 11, 2012)

(((Dovy)))


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## Dovydaitis (Sep 11, 2012)

thanks  it's not my cross which is good. Would really be panicking if I lost that


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## tar1984 (Sep 11, 2012)

This thread got too extreme for me, I can't keep up.


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 11, 2012)

Thanks to this thread, and Fridgey and quoady's unending enthusiasms, I've got myself bidding on a pack of (probably fake) Hero 616's on ebay.

Why anyone would make a knock off of a knock off is beyond me, though.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 12, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Thanks to this thread, and Fridgey and quoady's unending enthusiasms, I've got myself bidding on a pack of (probably fake) Hero 616's on ebay.


Oh, I've seen *other people's* enthusiasm for Heros, but haven't yet gone down that route.

Let us know how it goes!

e2a: don't they have hooded nibs? I've always found hooded nibs a bit fugly. Then again, I guess it fits with the 2k aesthetic.


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 12, 2012)

Hero 616s IME are either "actually this writes quite well, how odd given how cheap it is" or "this just doesn't work, I'm chucking it". In a pack of ten you're likely to get at least a few which are okay. Good for ink testing or if you have lots of colours you want to use.

The trick with filling btw is to remove the metal sheath from the sac and squeeze the sac with your fingers repeatedly with the nib in the ink - otherwise you get a few drops at most. You can put the metal back on afterwards to stop the sac banging about.


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## likesfish (Sep 12, 2012)

Instructables.com as an intresting way of modding a Pilot g2 pro pen so you can put mont blanc refills in it


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## toggle (Sep 12, 2012)

parker 51 for 'good' wish i had anyhting finer than a bold nib on the thing though. rotring cartridge pen in my handbag, very, very heavy pen, use it for my work diary and stuff while i'm out. ink flow is a bit too fast, but ti's nice. would like to get a couple of cheapie pens to use coloured cartridges in for notetaking. more i've thought about it, more i've tried to find pens that try to mimic ink pens. i just need to buy the damn things. ebay cheapies?


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## porp (Sep 12, 2012)

Seems well used - but 'best' from the sheep's perspective?


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## mrs quoad (Sep 13, 2012)

I've got a night shift in a homeless hostel tonight, so'll be taking one of my lesser pens.

It's going to be the Pelikan M205, I reckon.

Which I wanted to give an honorary mention, because it is without doubt the dirtiest little scrubber of a pen I own. It's absolutely beautiful, in its own way. Positively gushing, constantly. It's a bit much for daily use, even though it's - in theory - an F. It's just this great big lovely dribbly mess of slaggy pot noodle pen, splattering its beauty all over anything you throw in its way.

Dirty, dirty good.

But after I've used it once, I tend to need a week or two without using it, in order to fully recover.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 15, 2012)

I got my Heros. £5 for the pack of 10. May be fakes, not sure. I did a more thorough post in the fountain pen thread earlier, but since this is where I mentioned them first...

Inked the first one up and it writes like a charm. Probably a teeny touch broader than my Lamy 2000 EF (which isn't all that fine comparatively speaking, as well you all know). And yeah, I prefer the aesthetic of hooded nibs. I prefer them to just look like ... idk, pens, I guess.

Anyway, I was blown away by how smooth a writer it is. Probably a bit wetter than is ideal, but not too wet by any stretch of the imagination. Just as smooth a writer as my Lamy 2000 fine, but finer. And it writes amazingly smoothly upside down too, for a far finer line (probably a 'truer' extra fine), and I reckon I could quite happily write for extended periods of time with it upside down.

Construction is as shoddy as you'd expect, but the nib itself feels good and sturdy. It's probably going to leak like a fucker as soon as it leaves the house, so it'll be one to carry around in plastic, just in case (and have plenty of backups).

Using Diamine China Blue ink in it right now. I'm interested to see how it'll write with a good, dry ink, to balance out its tendency towards being a wet writer. Seems just about perfect for note-taking though. Which is what I wanted it for. I might have a bash with my Lamy Blue-Black, see how that goes. Any dry-ish inks you good people care to recommend? I've got (in blues/blacks): Diamine China Blue, Diamine Jet Black, Diamine Blue-Black, Lamy Blue-Black, Noodlers Midnight (far too wet for this pen), J Herbin Perle Noire, J Herbin Bleu Nuit ... er, I think that's it (everything else is little Diamine testers of pretty colours).

I've only inked one of them, so far. There may well be duds in the pack, but for £5 I don't care.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 15, 2012)

Noodlers anything shits all over everything like a diarrhoetic puppy.

Great for hyper dry pens and interesting with dip nibs, though, IMO.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 15, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> Noodlers anything shits all over everything like a diarrhoetic puppy.
> 
> Great for hyper dry pens and interesting with dip nibs, though, IMO.


 
I've got some noodlers in my Lamy right now. Since I know how wet it is, I know I don't want it in these Heros. Hence me asking about dry inks  (I guess I included it in the list....well, I was just running through what inks I have.)

Anyway, I inked another two up, one with Diamine jet black, which is nice enough, and the other with Lamy Blue-Black, which is performing just as I expect. Nice and dry, a bit paler than usual (maybe it's just this particular 616?). I prefer that for note-taking though. It's easier on my eyes.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 15, 2012)

Gets exciting new pens.

Puts in school-coloured ink.


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 15, 2012)

My pens are for writing srsbsns notes. Not for your bourgeois fripperies


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## ViolentPanda (Sep 16, 2012)

toggle said:


> parker 51 for 'good' wish i had anyhting finer than a bold nib on the thing though. rotring cartridge pen in my handbag, very, very heavy pen, use it for my work diary and stuff while i'm out. ink flow is a bit too fast, but ti's nice. would like to get a couple of cheapie pens to use coloured cartridges in for notetaking. more i've thought about it, more i've tried to find pens that try to mimic ink pens. i just need to buy the damn things. ebay cheapies?


 
What do you mean by "cheapie", up to a fiver?


----------



## toggle (Sep 16, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> What do you mean by "cheapie", up to a fiver?


 
i've been looking at those ebay packs of 'hero's' as well tbh.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Sep 16, 2012)

toggle said:


> i've been looking at those ebay packs of 'hero's' as well tbh.


 
I was going to suggest either a couple of 0.5mm "medium nib" Platinum Preppys (with cartridge converters so they'll take standard international cartridges. Cost: £3.25 each for the pens, £1.50 each for the converters, from Cult Pens) or some of the Hero 616s.


----------



## toggle (Sep 16, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> I was going to suggest either a couple of 0.5mm "medium nib" Platinum Preppys (with cartridge converters so they'll take standard international cartridges. Cost: £3.25 each for the pens, £1.50 each for the converters, from Cult Pens) or some of the Hero 616s.


 
plus half a dozen of these:

http://www.diamineinks.co.uk/listings.aspx?catid=67

and

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10-FOUNTA...ncils_WritingEquipment_SM&hash=item20c41caff6


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 16, 2012)

A word on the Heros - if you plan on taking them out and about, it looks like they may be a bit on the 'enthusiastic' side when it comes to burping ink if you knock them. I expect if you can keep them upright, and take sensible precautions like perhaps keeping them in a plastic case of some kind in your bag, you should be fine, as long as you're not dancing the merengue too and from wherever you're going.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

There are other Hero and Jinhao pens that are a bit more reliable, at the premium price of around three quid rather than < 50p each. I can't remember all the model numbers right - 315 comes to mind for some reason.

The Jinhao Missile is a really nice supercompact pocket pen incidentally.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 16, 2012)

The 100 is supposed to be rather nice, but is a bit more expensive, at probably around £10. BUT, it has a gold nib.

And I think of the 616's, the Jumbo version is meant to be a bit better.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> The 100 is supposed to be rather nice, but is a bit more expensive, at probably around £10. BUT, it has a gold nib.


I have a 100 - it's their premium pen iirc and cost me a bit more than £10, though I'd have to look through my eBay receipts to see how much (I thought around £30 but may be wrong). It's basically a Parker 61 Flighter i.e. metal bodied, and the nib is decent, but I'm not sure I'd go out of my way to get another one - you're starting to approach the price of a Pelikan M200 at that point, which is a superior pen in all respects IMO and has steel nibs that are better than many gold ones.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 16, 2012)

Ah, maybe I'm misremembering. I was looking through an American site that sold them all a few days ago and remember being blown away by how cheaply he was selling them for.

I've been tempted by a Pelikan for a long time. Since I'm not going to spend upwards of £20 or so on more than one or two pens, though, I held off on an M200 because if I was going to get 'a good one' it might as well be one with a gold nib. I've also been eyeing up Sailors. I'm presuming a Sailor fine would be equivalent to a Lamy/Pelikan extra fine, yes? Perhaps even a touch finer?

Dammit. I hate wanting something but not being able to decide what it is I want to begin with.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

My Sapporo F was slightly finer than my Pelikan EF yes - the latter also had a slight flex to it, the stroke would vary noticeably by pressure (though always still be pretty fine). Pelikans don't run particularly broad for Western nibs though ime.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 16, 2012)

So a Pelikan EF is going to be finer than my Lamy EF? But not so much so that a Pelikan F would be the same as a Lamy EF, right? I could happily go a bit finer than my Lamy EF, but not by too much.

And your slightly flexy Pelikan EF, was that the M200? Or a different one?

(Sorry for all the questions.)


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> So a Pelikan EF is going to be finer than my Lamy EF? But not so much so that a Pelikan F would be the same as a Lamy EF, right? I could happily go a bit finer than my Lamy EF, but not by too much.
> 
> And your slightly flexy Pelikan EF, was that the M200? Or a different one?
> 
> (Sorry for all the questions.)


Pelikan nibs are screw-in units; there are a few different sizes based on pen size but the m200, say, uses the same nibs as the m400. (There is a good site at pelikanpens.co.uk which has a lot of info, and also sells Noodlers.) The EF would be noticeably finer than a Lamy EF but it's not absurdly fine. Quoad has a Pelikan EF and also had a L2000 EF so could probably say more. I've not tried an F - I have an M which is still fairly fine when used with a light touch.

I really like the m200, though it's approaching being too small for my big hands.

You could look at TWSBIs as well.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 16, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> So a Pelikan EF is going to be finer than my Lamy EF? But not so much so that a Pelikan F would be the same as a Lamy EF, right? I could happily go a bit finer than my Lamy EF, but not by too much.
> 
> And your slightly flexy Pelikan EF, was that the M200? Or a different one?
> 
> (Sorry for all the questions.)


tbf, my Pelikan (M205) EF probably wrote slightly fatter than my 2K, though I can't remember if the 2k was EF or F.

In part that's due to the ink flow, though. It's a great big splotty splurge of a dribbling wet puppy.

I went for a gold nib on the M205. Not sure if I'd do that again, tbh. The nib I've got on it is a lovely writer, but does have a hint of a feel of 'bad nib' about it. As if the tines aren't *quite* evenly aligned. Not enough to stop me liking it, greatly, but it's no.1 out-of-house pen rather than no.3 in-house pen.

The Sapporo is, IMO, an utterly beautiful workhorse. It remains one of my 3ish most favoured pens (i.e, no.3 in-house pen).

e2a: and if you go through the Writing Desk, they might let you have a non-black Sapporo with a non-M nib. IIRC, they told me something along the lines of 'Sailor don't like us selling non-black pens with anything other than an M nib, but we won't tell if you don't.' Had to email them separately, as they're not listed on their site, presumably for ^^^ that reason.)

Andy's Pens took payment for a Sapporo, fudged for about a week, then told me that they were out of stock and would be back in stock in 3 months (or thereabouts.) Would I like to wait for their new stock to come in, whilst they kept my payment?

I lost a bit of faith in Andy that day.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

Pelikans do run quite wet from all I've heard and experienced, which is presumably why Pelikan ink is bone-dry.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 16, 2012)

Oh heck, you're really twisting my arm about the Sailor.

I'm actually okay with black. As you know, I'm a fan of the non-ostentatious. And that's good to know about Andy's pens. I hadn't heard of them until a link on here a few days ago, and had been scoping my next pen from there.

So, if I wanted to get somewhat near-ish to the EF of my Lamy2K (not minding if it was a bit finer), I'd be looking at a Pelikan EF or a Sailor F?

Pelikans have the bonus of being able to see the ink level, which I have to say I really appreciate on the 616's and the 2K. But it's not a deal-breaker.

STOP MAKING ME WANT TO BUY BOTH.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

I really liked my Sapporo as well - the reason I don't use it at the monent is that I fucked the nib up. The F really is fine though. On fibrous paper I found it quite hard to use as it would scratch it up. It was sharper than the F on my Pilot Capless, which is currently my finest nib.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 16, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Oh heck, you're really twisting my arm about the Sailor.
> 
> I'm actually okay with black. As you know, I'm a fan of the non-ostentatious. And that's good to know about Andy's pens. I hadn't heard of them until a link on here a few days ago, and had been scoping my next pen from there.
> 
> ...


Andy's Pens have an excellent nib width comparison chart, IIRC. I partly guided my ridiculous Nakaya nib-width decision with reference to Andy's nib width chart.

And, tbf, they were ok when I bought a 2nd hand pen from them. What I don't really like is the business of having to email in an order and then pay a paypalled receipt, as and when they get round to it. And then waiting (IME) about 48hrs until Andy gets round to packing shit up and maybe sending it out.

I have a distanced respect for them, but tbf would probably buy from the Writing Desk or CultPens given the choice. Both of whom've been unreservedly excellent, IME.

NB: Sailor are *thin*. Pelikan, IME, are splotty-wet. Sailor are *thin*. Thin and hard. They - IME - have a stunning nib width / ink flow balance that is ridiculously satisfying. It's just *right*. Not too much, not too little, just beautiful and consistent.

If you're writing on decent paper (Oxford pads, IME, are more than good enough though Pukka might suffer) with light pressure, you'll be fine (IME) with even a Sailor EF.

If you're mashing it up lumpfisted stylee on Pukka, then a Sailor EF would probably be a bit OTT / needlepoint / unforgiving. Don't have an F so can't comment, but if you're happy with a Lamy EF then Sailor F would probably be the lowest you should even think about trying!


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 16, 2012)

Oh, just remembered - I'm pretty sure that the Writing Desk will give you a few days / a week or two for a nib swap on a Sailor. Don't quote me on that, might be worth emailing them in advance. They were properly awesome when I contacted them.

Also, FM's pelikanpens / Nice Pens link ( http://www.pelikanpens.co.uk/ ) - they're shit hot, too.

I contacted them in advance, kinda wary about ordering the highlighter M205 BB given all my preferences lean towards EF Japanese. The bloke i/c offered a nib swap if I wasn't happy with it, I wasn't happy with it, fair do's he exchanged it and (despite my offering several times) didn't want payment for the £8ish extra of registered postage charges he incurred.

(And this is why I now have a fluorescent yellow EF M205 demonstrator )


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

TWD have excellent CS definitely. They've always been really good about refunds and replacements when I've asked, even to the point of a free repair.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 16, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> TWD have excellent CS definitely. They've always been really good about refunds and replacements when I've asked, even to the point of a free repair.


Think they're only about an hour down the road from me, too.

When I was proper gurning for a Sapporo, I was inclined to ask if I could drive over to pick it up.

But it was a Friday afternoon at about 3 o'clock and, IIRC, that struck me as a bit dysfunctional even for me.


----------



## ViolentPanda (Sep 16, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> I've also been eyeing up Sailors.


 
Fnarr, fnarr!!!


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 16, 2012)

I flushed out and refilled one of the 616's that was writing quite wet with the Lamy blue-black, and it's far wetter in this pen than the other. I like them both, tbh. I reckon the dry writer would be better for someone taking notes at work/uni because you wouldn't have to worry about smudging.

I've also spent the best part of today reading about Sailor and Pelikan nibs. Fuck you all and your obsessions ruining my Sunday.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 16, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> I've also spent the best part of today reading about Sailor and Pelikan nibs. Fuck you all and your obsessions ruining my Sunday.


Oh, I don't have a pen obsession any more. 

I got a Nakaya. 

Obsession sorted.

(Though I do kinda need a nibs.com Spencerian ground Namiki Falcon, as I think I might've mentioned earlier.)


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 16, 2012)

I have a Falcon.

Just saying.


----------



## Firky (Sep 17, 2012)

I have a Niceday, is that any good?


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 17, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> I have a Falcon.
> 
> Just saying.


Spencerian ground?


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

Nah. Actually I didn't like it much.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 17, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Nah. Actually I didn't like it much.


Because?

Gotta say, it's the needlepoint superflex element that appeals to me. Which I can't see being much use for daily writing.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

You know, it was a long time ago, but I think I wasn't very impressed by the flex - I didn't think it was nearly flexy enough. I might think differently nowadays.


----------



## Mrs Magpie (Sep 17, 2012)

I know I'm a bit antediluvian using a dip pen but I like non-waterproof artists ink (for pen and wash) that would wreck a fountain pen, plus dip pens never clog or need much maintenance. Do any of youse lot use a nib/pen wipe? I've always used a bit of tissue or chamois. I'm thinking of whacking a bit of natural sponge in a pot (for stability) but not sure if something as delicate as sponge might catch in the nib. I've seen some antique pen wipes that are badger hair or bristle and I'm considering bastardising an old shaving brush.

Pic of old pen wipe that is far beyond my means, but it's where I got the bastardised shaving brush idea.....


----------



## ATOMIC SUPLEX (Sep 17, 2012)

I lyke dem bics


----------



## wemakeyousoundb (Sep 17, 2012)

tar1984 said:


> For notetaking & general purpose study use.
> 
> I am quite enjoying the papermate flexgrip, pictured below
> 
> ...


love those, not stocked at my regular Brixton supplier for years now :/


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

On the non FP front, I've been using the Tombow Airpress biro recently (four quid or something from Cultpens). It works like a Space Pen in that it's pressurised so will write upside down, on wet paper, in vacuum etc, and starts first time - only it's not stupidly expensive. It's refillable as well.

It works because the retracting clicker cunningly functions as a pump to pressurise the refill, too. There's a little window on the side so you can watch it. It's nice and fine as well, and compact, so a good pocket pen.

There are some disposable ones from another company that work on a similar basis and cost just 10p as a trial offer if you buy something else, but they're not quite as nice to hold.


----------



## Firky (Sep 17, 2012)

firky said:


> I have a Niceday, is that any good?


 
You're not going to bite the same bait twice are you, fridge?


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

firky said:


> You're not going to bite the same bait twice are you, fridge?


Come on, I didn't really bite the first time did I?


----------



## Athos (Sep 17, 2012)

Mrs Magpie said:
			
		

> I know I'm a bit antediluvian using a dip pen but I like non-waterproof artists ink (for pen and wash) that would wreck a fountain pen, plus dip pens never clog or need much maintenance. Do any of youse lot use a nib/pen wipe? I've always used a bit of tissue or chamois. I'm thinking of whacking a bit of natural sponge in a pot (for stability) but not sure if something as delicate as sponge might catch in the nib. I've seen some antique pen wipes that are badger hair or bristle and I'm considering bastardising an old shaving brush.
> 
> Pic of old pen wipe that is far beyond my means, but it's where I got the bastardised shaving brush idea.....



I use one of those things that people use to wet stamps (and I don't mean my tongue). It's a small rubber put with a sponge in it. About a quid off the Ebay. Works perfectly.


----------



## Athos (Sep 17, 2012)

mrs quoad said:
			
		

> Oh, I don't have a pen obsession any more.
> 
> I got a Nakaya.
> 
> ...



Me too. Hardly bought any pens (well, just one or two) since I got it. Has pretty much cured me of lusting after pens. Except more Nakayas, of course.

It's just occurred to me that all I've actually done is swap one addiction for a more expensive one!


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

"I used to spend £100 on pens a month but now, after spending £600, I've not bought any pens for six months! Just about to buy another one though."


----------



## Athos (Sep 17, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:
			
		

> "I used to spend £100 on pens a month but now, after spending £600, I've not bought any pens for six months! Just about to buy another one though."



I read that in my wife's voice. You/ she are right, of course.


----------



## izz (Sep 17, 2012)

Mrs Magpie said:


> I've just bought a Victorian dip pen made of Whitby Jet. I shall use it when I am in mourning.


 
I want it. Give it to me. Failing that, a photo will suffice until you've decided you love me enough


----------



## Mrs Magpie (Sep 17, 2012)

I've mislaid the cable for my camera so until I find it.....


----------



## izz (Sep 17, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> And there're all kinds of raw, staggering horrors out there, like Montegrappa's Sylvester Stallone crafted 'Chaos' pen:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
he can write ?


----------



## Mrs Magpie (Sep 17, 2012)

@ izz
It's not a particularly fine example, and I got it quite cheaply because it's missing a bit off the end...


----------



## Mrs Magpie (Sep 17, 2012)

izz said:


> he can write ?


blingy autographs, innit?


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 17, 2012)

All right then, folks. Let's talk paper.

What paper do you like for fountain pens? I've got a pad of that fancy Clairefontaine stuff, but it's far too expensive to use for note-taking. I'm not a fan of bright white paper either, for notes at least, because I get eye strain (I'm a delicate flower). I've been looking at Cambridge legal pads. They're that yellow colour, but not the glaring yellow of pukka pads. FPN seems to suggest they're pretty decent paper. If I could find something nice and cheap the colour of Moleskine pages I'd be superduperhappywithsprinklesontop, as long as it was a bit thicker than Moleskine stuff, obviously. But alas, I don't think I'm going to find anything like that.


----------



## Mrs Magpie (Sep 17, 2012)

If I could afford it I'd use Bristol Board but any hot pressed paper.


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

My current journal is a Rhodia Webnotebook - they are slightly off-white, very smooth 90gsm pages.


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 17, 2012)

Really, we're talking lots and lots of note-taking, for uni. Not random flowery "let me write about my life" journal mamby-pamby stuff 

So it's got to be cheap.


----------



## izz (Sep 17, 2012)

Mrs Magpie said:


> @ izz
> It's not a particularly fine example, and I got it quite cheaply because it's missing a bit off the end...


 
I'll let you off then.

Actually that's a lie, I still want to see it but am being polite 

I thought about acquiring a vintage dance card pencil for my fileyfax but slapped myself around a bit for over-pretentiousness


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 17, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> All right then, folks. Let's talk paper.
> 
> What paper do you like for fountain pens? I've got a pad of that fancy Clairefontaine stuff, but it's far too expensive to use for note-taking. I'm not a fan of bright white paper either, for notes at least, because I get eye strain (I'm a delicate flower). I've been looking at Cambridge legal pads. They're that yellow colour, but not the glaring yellow of pukka pads. FPN seems to suggest they're pretty decent paper. If I could find something nice and cheap the colour of Moleskine pages I'd be superduperhappywithsprinklesontop, as long as it was a bit thicker than Moleskine stuff, obviously. But alas, I don't think I'm going to find anything like that.


Oxford pads. Excellent quality, routinely BOGOF in sburys. 

I bought, erm, 12 (?) last time they bogofed.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 17, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> Oxford pads. Excellent quality, routinely BOGOF in sburys.
> 
> I bought, erm, 12 (?) last time they bogofed.


 
Are they white?


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Really, we're talking lots and lots of note-taking, for uni. Not random flowery "let me write about my life" journal mamby-pamby stuff
> 
> So it's got to be cheap.


I'm noted for writing everything in scented gel pens, it's true 

If you want good paper but don't want to spend too much, write smaller. I don't think there are any people making quality yet cheap off-white paper. You could look at Midori, but they're not cheap either. Rhodia pads are priced for the office and school market in France and come quite cheap, but they're not the off-white paper, they are the white squared ones (they also do lined).


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 17, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Are they white?


Inside?

Yes. 

Not sure if there're non-lined options tho.

E2a: whoops


----------



## FridgeMagnet (Sep 17, 2012)

Oxford did release some plain bound notebooks iirc but they were more expensive.


----------



## Athos (Sep 17, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> All right then, folks. Let's talk paper.
> 
> What paper do you like for fountain pens? I've got a pad of that fancy Clairefontaine stuff, but it's far too expensive to use for note-taking. I'm not a fan of bright white paper either, for notes at least, because I get eye strain (I'm a delicate flower). I've been looking at Cambridge legal pads. They're that yellow colour, but not the glaring yellow of pukka pads. FPN seems to suggest they're pretty decent paper. If I could find something nice and cheap the colour of Moleskine pages I'd be superduperhappywithsprinklesontop, as long as it was a bit thicker than Moleskine stuff, obviously. But alas, I don't think I'm going to find anything like that.


 
For note taking, I'm currently using Rhodia A4+ Dotpads.  I punch the whole pad before I start using it, then, at the end of the day, I can tear out the perforated pages (each one A4) and put them in the appropriate ring binder/lever arch/treasury tags, for filing.  It's lovely paper, and the dot layout is perfect for writing and sketching, and makes tabulation very easy.


----------



## Vintage Paw (Sep 17, 2012)

I may just get a job lot of the Cambridge pads. They are yellow, 80gsm, and have been mentioned on FPN a couple of times. I don't need anything that's amazeballs* quality, just something that won't deposit its entire pulp into the tip of my nib (oo-er) and bleed right through (ouch).

*don't blame me, blame that wrong'un wot started that other thread.


----------



## Dovydaitis (Sep 19, 2012)

I only use Oxford pads for note taking. A decent pad and nice to write on


----------



## toggle (Sep 19, 2012)

ah ha. very cheap way into some coloured inks

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Paperchase-assorted-ink-cartridges-pack/dp/B0035X7SKY/ref=pd_rhf_se_s_cp_5


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 19, 2012)

toggle said:


> ah ha. very cheap way into some coloured inks
> 
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Paperchase-assorted-ink-cartridges-pack/dp/B0035X7SKY/ref=pd_rhf_se_s_cp_5


No, really, for coloured inks in international cartridge format you should look at http://www.diamineinks.co.uk


----------



## toggle (Sep 19, 2012)

done the maths, can't afford atm


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## FridgeMagnet (Sep 19, 2012)

toggle said:


> done the maths, can't afford atm


Really? You'd probably be better off with bottled ink and a convertor, then - that's dead cheap.


----------



## mrs quoad (Sep 20, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Really? You'd probably be better off with bottled ink and a convertor, then - that's dead cheap.


You can get an absolute sack of short blue cartridges from Tesco for about 34p. IIRC.

Not sure what the ink's like (well, I could guess ) but I reckon that'd work out a *tonne* cheaper than most usable bottled ink.


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## Athos (Sep 23, 2012)

Is this now 'the' fountain pen thread?

If so, I can share my excitement about my latest purchase: a vintage (1970's I think) Sheaffer Imperial Touchdown, in sterling silver. Off the ebay. Can't wait until it arrives!

Though I fear that, after my post-Nakaya lull, the fever might be back.


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 24, 2012)

I'm enjoying my Hero 616s very much. I took great pleasure writing a card and addressing the envelope using it with the lamy blue-black yesterday. Well, I say great pleasure, it was a with sympathy card. "I'm sorry for your loss; do you like my handwriting?"

I've got some really cheap school exercise books I bought a job lot of a while back. I dug out a couple, and sure, the paper isn't that great, but the Hero writes really nicely in it, the ink doesn't bleed through, it's smooth, and it'll do me for my notes. I haven't tested them out in the wild yet, but I'm reasonably confident that as long as I don't do a series of cartwheels while it's in my bag everything will be okay.


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## ViolentPanda (Sep 26, 2012)

On the "economy pens" front, as I've been wanting to try out a flex nib fountain pen (as opposed to a flex nib dip pen), I've just ordered an eyedropper Wality 67T from an Indian site (www.fountainpenrevolution.com) with optional flex nib, as a cheap taster. Dunno what it'll write like, but I'll let you know if/when it arrives!


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## Athos (Sep 27, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> On the "economy pens" front, as I've been wanting to try out a flex nib fountain pen (as opposed to a flex nib dip pen), I've just ordered an eyedropper Wality 67T from an Indian site (www.fountainpenrevolution.com) with optional flex nib, as a cheap taster. Dunno what it'll write like, but I'll let you know if/when it arrives!


 
Cool.  Wality are a great pen for the money.  Would be interested to see what the flex is like.


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## Athos (Sep 27, 2012)

Athos said:


> Though I fear that, after my post-Nakaya lull, the fever might be back.


 
Oh dear, it *is* back.  Just bought a Pelikan M200 Demonstrator (2012 Limited Edition).  A lovely looking thing.


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## Meltingpot (Sep 27, 2012)

Athos said:


> Oh dear, it *is* back. Just bought a Pelikan M200 Demonstrator (2012 Limited Edition). A lovely looking thing.


 
Pelikans have got a very good rep; they use a good thick piece of gold for the Souveran's nib, for example. I tried one (I think it was a 400 though I'm not sure) in a pen shop in Exeter and unfortunately I didn't like the feel of the barrel; I couldn't get enough of a purchase on it. It was one of the green and black striped ones so I don't know if that one is different.

On the other hand, I find the late 80's Parker Duofold a lot easier to grip (though I don't like the balance of that pen).


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## langand (Sep 27, 2012)

iam using writo meter now a days.. it is good


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## ViolentPanda (Sep 27, 2012)

Athos said:


> Cool. Wality are a great pen for the money. Would be interested to see what the flex is like.


 
I shall endeavour to write something illustrative of its capabilities, and post it up, once it arrives!
Have to admit, I do like the...how can I put it...1970s design ethic of a lot of the pens on that Indian pen site.


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## ViolentPanda (Sep 27, 2012)

Athos said:


> Oh dear, it *is* back. Just bought a Pelikan M200 Demonstrator (2012 Limited Edition). A lovely looking thing.


 
I've been put off see-through pens for the time being, by this monstrosity (the Pilot "Human Engineering"):


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 27, 2012)

I had a bit of a read about Pelikan nibs t'other day.

Consensus seemed to be that the 400's gold nib wasn't as nice as the 200's steel nib (although it looks nicer), and that the 600's nib is better than the 400's, but that the 200's is rather spiffy on its own merits anyway. I'm not a fan of that stark yellow gold of the 200's nib, I have to say.


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## laptop (Sep 27, 2012)




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## Athos (Sep 27, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> I've been put off see-through pens for the time being, by this monstrosity (the Pilot "Human Engineering"):


 
Fugly!


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## ViolentPanda (Sep 27, 2012)

Athos said:


> Fugly!


 
It reminded me of a child's toy from the late '70s/early '80s that my little brother had, a cyborg "Action Man"-type doll with see through body.


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## mrs quoad (Sep 27, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> I've been put off see-through pens for the time being, by this monstrosity (the Pilot "Human Engineering"):


Mine has the saving grace of being violent, fluorescent yellow.



Spoiler: bigpic










Like ^^^ that, only with an (E?)F 14k nib.

The BB I (briefly) tried was like rubbing at the paper with a damp spaniel on the end of a stick.


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## toggle (Sep 27, 2012)

4 very cheap very bold nibbed cartridge pens on my desk today, loaded with the lighter of the cheap coloured inks, will do for highlighting bits of notes.and highlighting stuff in my books.

3 hero 832's very chunky heavy pens, but i don't think i like skinny light ones. fine nibs, came with a removable convertor. got cartridges in them at the moment. darker inks, fine nibs for taking notes.


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## ViolentPanda (Sep 27, 2012)

I'm not fond of thin lightweight pens myself. They can be very uncomfortable to hold, in my experience.


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## mrs quoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Just as an aside, and in case it should be relevant to anyone's needs...

If you mix Platinum's carbon / Archiver's Brown ink with a dash of Pelikan highlighter ink (tbf, more the other way round - 75% highlighter yellow to 25% carbon brown) you end up with something that washes out *just* like cabbage water diarrhoea. Or, perhaps, pure bile vomit - the stuff that starts coming out when you're so sick that you've thrown up the entire contents of your digestive tract, and are just throwing up the off brown / green that something in your intestines manufactures.

It is, without hesitation or doubt, the most singularly repellant ink I've ever inadvertently created. It looks like washed diseased shit on paper, and the flow is horrendous, too.


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## mattie (Oct 22, 2012)

Thank god you warned me.


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## FridgeMagnet (Oct 22, 2012)

I was blates just about to do that, too.


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## Vintage Paw (Oct 22, 2012)

I took my Hero out for a spin and it didn't burp its contents at all. This pleases me.


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## Lord Camomile (Oct 22, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> It is, without hesitation or doubt, the most singularly repellant ink I've ever inadvertently created. It looks like washed diseased shit on paper, and the flow is horrendous, too.


Well I just hope you've learnt your lesson.

I can't believe people are still so apparently disregarding to the dangers of mixing inks - nearly always ends up with a disgusting flow of intestinal fluid.


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## FridgeMagnet (Oct 22, 2012)

I was thinking just now "you know, maybe I should stock up on Noodler's ink because the supply does seem very erratic". Then I realised that I have twenty bottles already, mostly almost full.


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## mrs quoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> Well I just hope you've learnt your lesson.
> 
> I can't believe people are still so apparently disregarding to the dangers of mixing inks - nearly always ends up with a disgusting flow of intestinal fluid.




tbf, it was being mixed in a 5-15ml plastic lip balm tub for a dip pen. I didn't have any empty ones, but did have one with some fluorescent ink in... hence the experiment!


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## Lord Camomile (Oct 22, 2012)

You live and learn, I suppose. Just remember you were lucky this time; next time the repurcussions may be altogether more serious and tragic.


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## mrs quoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> You live and learn, I suppose. Just remember you were lucky this time; next time the repurcussions may be altogether more serious and tragic.


Ohhh, I wouldn't do it with anything that could have serious and tragic repercussions  Just scrag ends of otherwise-unusable ink, invariably with a dip pen


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## Lord Camomile (Oct 22, 2012)

See, now you're some crazy scientist with pots of bubbling liquids 

"They called me mad, they said it would never work, but look how blue it is! Looooook!"


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## mrs quoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Lord Camomile said:


> See, now you're some crazy scientist with pots of bubbling liquids
> 
> "They called me mad, they said it would never work, but look how blue it is! Looooook!"


I've got some noodlers Empire Red (?! Have I got that wrong? Foxhunting red?!) mixed with the fluorescent yellow somewhere, too.

Problem is, the Noodlers is so damned potent that it's basically crushed the yellow into complete oblivion.

Whereas with the Platinum carbon ink, it... just... smeared... this really off-yellow / brown / bilious green wash behind the nib.


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## TopCat (Oct 22, 2012)

I have a Lamy fountain pen and its great. However if I am writing on my best thick stock paper, it does not see to have the ink flow to cope? Help? My like is incomplete until I know an answer?


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## Vintage Paw (Oct 22, 2012)

There are 3 solutions: get someone who knows what they are doing to make your pen write 'wetter'; to use a wetter ink; to use a shinier, less absorbent paper.

HTH.


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## FridgeMagnet (Oct 22, 2012)

TopCat said:


> I have a Lamy fountain pen and its great. However if I am writing on my best thick stock paper, it does not see to have the ink flow to cope? Help? My like is incomplete until I know an answer?


Do you mean that it can't keep up with the speed you write at so seems to dry out after a period of solid writing, or something else?

A good wash through with warm soapy water can help clear the feed out and improve flow. (You should make sure to then wash it out with non-soapy water.)


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## mrs quoad (Oct 22, 2012)

If you put some Noodlers in it, chances are you'll struggle to stop the bugger pissing ink all over everything, anywhere, ever.


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## TopCat (Oct 22, 2012)

The paper concerned is very ridged? Thick stock? The ink seems to need to come out quicker? It's very effective on standard paper but I felt let down when I had to write a letter on the thick paper.


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## TopCat (Oct 22, 2012)

Noodlers?


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## mrs quoad (Oct 22, 2012)

TopCat said:


> Noodlers?


Noodlers!

Noodlers?!

Noodlers.


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## TopCat (Oct 22, 2012)

It's like a secret club eh? I knock on the door and say I have a Lamy filled with Quink and I just hear sniggers as the door stays firmly shut...


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## mrs quoad (Oct 23, 2012)

TopCat said:


> It's like a secret club eh? I knock on the door and say I have a Lamy filled with Quink and I just hear sniggers as the door stays firmly shut...


It's an ink brand, made by one odd ball in the US. Who also makes his own pens, I think. Which are either eye-bleeding catastrophes in mauve or puce / orange and banana / fluorescent bile and boak, or stunning works of affordably-priced (and sometimes flex-nibbed) art, depending on where you stand.

Niche pens used to sell a small selection in the UK.

OH GOD they've started selling it from a separate / sister site along with Noodlers pens!!!!

http://www.purepens.co.uk/acatalog/Noodler_s_Inks.html

So, yes. You can buy some Noodlers from there. I'd guess. I'm about to look. And possibly order a pen.

And Noodlers, IME, tends to be so gushingly filled with absurd surfactants that those I've tried (which, admittedly, number 2 in number) have... just... splurged out of anything I've put them in. They've made my Japanese EF Platinum Carbon write more more like a Lamy M, and I can't abide to have them in anything thicker-nibbed because I feel like I'm rubbing the backside of a wet toddler's nappy over a piece of paper. Gushes out. Gushes, and gushes, and gushes. They're useless on a dip pen, because it all gushes off the nib in one huge swoosh, and you're left with fuck all on the nib for writing anything beyond your first stroke.

Someone like FM might have a better idea of whether or not some of the inks are less gush-y. But the ones I've had - Empire red or Empire green, and hunting red, or something - just gush like there's no tomorrow. And would be a reasonably confident way of fixing any inkflow problems in any of my pens (though I hate the flow and amn't too keen on the primary colours I've got, so they rarely get a look-in unless a pen is playing up, anyhows).


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## mrs quoad (Oct 23, 2012)

Oh, hello.

http://www.purepens.co.uk/acatalog/Noolders-Ebonite-Piston-Fill-Fountain-Pen.html

A Noodlers ebonite piston-filled M/F flex nib for £35?

That might be ordered before too long!


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## Athos (Oct 23, 2012)

I just took delivery of an interesting pen - a Ranga, from India.  Beautiful handmade polished ebonite eyedropper, with Wality nib and feed.  Design-wise, it's a complete rip off of a Nakaya.  But I'm very impressed with it.


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## Mrs Magpie (Oct 23, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> Oh, hello.
> 
> http://www.purepens.co.uk/acatalog/Noolders-Ebonite-Piston-Fill-Fountain-Pen.html
> 
> ...


That is very beautiful. Not so beautiful that it will break my old dip pen habit though.


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## Mrs Magpie (Oct 23, 2012)

As to flow, I use ox gall liquid to wet watercolour...dunno about ox gall and ink though.


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## FridgeMagnet (Oct 23, 2012)

mrs quoad said:


> Someone like FM might have a better idea of whether or not some of the inks are less gush-y.


Yes, they do vary. The brightly coloured ones that I have do seem to be very wet, and in general Noodler's do run on the wet side, but some are just normal, and a few are pretty dry - e.g. Zhivago, which is a very dark green/black, is one of my driest inks.

I usually dilute most Noodler's with water by up to 50% anyway, which reduces the issue, though that's not why I do it - they tend to have long drying times otherwise.

You can actually just add washing-up liquid to normal inks to get this effect but you do need to do it in very small quantities. A lot of inks already have equivalent agents to some degree.


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## ViolentPanda (Nov 3, 2012)

Athos said:


> Cool. Wality are a great pen for the money. Would be interested to see what the flex is like.


 
Flex seems to be okay, although as my hands are quite painful at the mo (cold, damp weather and arthritis don't mix  ), I'm pretty much over-controlling my writing/going a s lightly as possible and just using standard script, so what I've written probably isn't representative of what the nib can do. I'll try and add a pic in a bit.
E2A:







Apols for shittiness of pic.

The pen itself is very comfortable, posted or unposted, and has a decently-springy clip that actually holds onto whatever it's clipped to. I can't argue with it for around a tenner plus about £1.50 postage, especially as the chap at Fountain Pen Revolution threw in a Serwex 162 as well, _gratis_ (a cheapo with an indian "fine", but writes nicely, with a "just wet enough" flow).
I'm tempted by the handmade ebonite Deccan "Bullet Sr." in green.


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## ViolentPanda (Nov 3, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> There are 3 solutions: get someone who knows what they are doing to make your pen write 'wetter'; to use a wetter ink; to use a shinier, less absorbent paper.
> 
> HTH.


 
Years ago I "liberated" a couple of boxes of a French cream laid paper that grabbed ink like a vampire grabs throats. Was really annoying to have paper with a beautiful feel that couldn't take a fountain pen.


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## FridgeMagnet (Nov 3, 2012)

I actually get on best with a cheap WHSmiths writing pad, for letters. I have a pad of Clairefontaine Triomphe somewhere but I found it awful.


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## Athos (Nov 4, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:


> Flex seems to be okay, although as my hands are quite painful at the mo (cold, damp weather and arthritis don't mix  ), I'm pretty much over-controlling my writing/going a s lightly as possible and just using standard script, so what I've written probably isn't representative of what the nib can do. I'll try and add a pic in a bit.
> E2A:
> 
> 
> ...


 
Looks and sounds like a decent pen.  And good value.


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## Athos (Nov 6, 2012)

Am sorely tempted to splurge on a Yard-O-Led Viceroy Grand Victorian.  A beast of a pen.  But with a price tag to match.  Please talk me out of it.


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## toggle (Nov 6, 2012)

that looks lovelly. do i want t know how much?


i've just had to file a report on my hero pens not arriving. sulking now


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## Athos (Nov 7, 2012)

toggle said:
			
		

> that looks lovelly. do i want t know how much?
> 
> i've just had to file a report on my hero pens not arriving. sulking now



To be fair, the price only reflects the fact that it's almost 70g of sterling silver, and handmade - each one requiring thousands of hammer blows to decorate.


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## Athos (Nov 7, 2012)

I've been invited to the opening party of Penfriend's new Fleet Street shop, tomorrow night. But I can't go! Did get a guided tour on Monday though, although it hadn't opened - they were still unpacking the stock. I can see myself going back, soon.


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## ViolentPanda (Nov 7, 2012)

Athos said:


> Am sorely tempted to splurge on a Yard-O-Led Viceroy Grand Victorian. A beast of a pen. But with a price tag to match. Please talk me out of it.


 
Probably a great investment piece, but it doesn't look like it'd be that comfortable in the hand, and the clip looks like an afterthought (although all Lard 'o' Yed clips look like an afterthought!).


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## Athos (Nov 7, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:
			
		

> Probably a great investment piece, but it doesn't look like it'd be that comfortable in the hand, and the clip looks like an afterthought (although all Lard 'o' Yed clips look like an afterthought!).



I've used one, and it was surprisingly comfortable. And the riveted clip is perhaps what I like most about it!


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## Athos (Nov 11, 2012)

I've decided to get the Yard O Led Viceroy Grand Victorian.  It's on the Christmas list.

Meantime, I went for an Onoto Magna Classic.  Just beautiful.


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## ViolentPanda (Nov 12, 2012)

A handsome handful, that!

A cheapo that I've grown rather fond of is the Camlin Cute (in green), a Kaweco Sport-sized eyedropper pen with a small fine nib






The screw on cap also screws on to post it, writes nicely after fettling the feed (was a bit greasy). Have been carrying it in my trouser pocket for a week filled with Rohrer und Klingner "Salix" blue iron gall ink, and using it every day with no leakage and no drying-out.


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## Athos (Nov 12, 2012)

ViolentPanda said:
			
		

> A handsome handful, that!
> 
> A cheapo that I've grown rather fond of is the Camlin Cute (in green), a Kaweco Sport-sized eyedropper pen with a small fine nib
> 
> The screw on cap also screws on to post it, writes nicely after fettling the feed (was a bit greasy). Have been carrying it in my trouser pocket for a week filled with Rohrer und Klingner "Salix" blue iron gall ink, and using it every day with no leakage and no drying-out.



Looks good. I always have a Kaweco Sport demonstrator which I use as an eyedropper in my pocket, but this looks like a decent alternative. Might investigate.

But probably won't buy one just yet; I need to rein in my pen buying - I ordered the Yard O Led Viceroy Grand Victorian today.


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## Athos (Nov 14, 2012)

The Onoto Magna Classic arrived today.  It's a beautiful pen, and a lovely writer.  Wasn't sure what to do nib-wise, but went for a broad one in the end, making it a letter signing pen, or maybe one for a quick handwritten note; a nib that broad wouldn't be suitable for note-taking or long letters.


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## mwgdrwg (Mar 12, 2015)

Can anyone recommend a nice pen as a leaving present for a colleague?

I'm going to be pairing it with a nice Moleskine notebook and it will hopefully used for writing down meeting notes and keeping a diary.


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## campanula (Mar 15, 2015)

Parker Duofold - mine is an old but model (have had it for over 40 years) but a beautiful pen.


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## yield (Dec 13, 2020)

_bump_



ViolentPanda said:


> I was going to suggest either a couple of 0.5mm "medium nib" Platinum Preppys (with cartridge converters so they'll take standard international cartridges. Cost: £3.25 each for the pens, £1.50 each for the converters, from Cult Pens) or some of the Hero 616s.



Was thinking about teuchter's handwriting thread. Mine's bad and used to be legible. I definitely write better with a pencil than a biro.

Is ViolentPanda 's fountain pen recommendation still good for the cheap end of the market?


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## FridgeMagnet (Dec 13, 2020)

yield said:


> _bump_
> 
> 
> 
> ...


A fountain pen will always make your handwriting better, or at least mean it's in nicer-looking ink.

There is a whole thread about fountain pens which might be more use: Fountain pen - recommendations


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## weltweit (Dec 13, 2020)




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## FridgeMagnet (Dec 13, 2020)

come on, even if you are going to do multi-pens you want a Tombow Reporter









						REPORTER | TOMBOW PENCIL
					

The barrel measures 12 mm in diameter regardless of the number of colors. The slim barrel facilitates gripping and the strong clip can hold anything from a piece of paper to a thick notebook. You can also touch-select the colors by using a different shape of knock button for each color. This...




					www.tombow.com


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## weltweit (Dec 13, 2020)

I am very happy with my BIC. 

Wasn't BIC the first to offer ball point pens?


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## ViolentPanda (Dec 17, 2020)

yield said:


> _bump_
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I love Platinum Preppys, & they're still available (& cheap). The great thing about fountain pens is you have to write slightly slower, which allows you better control.


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## Yuwipi Woman (Dec 18, 2020)

weltweit said:


> View attachment 243397



When I was a kid, I had one of those with like 16 colors.  It was a pain to write with, but in my seven-year-old mind I was stylin'.


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## FridgeMagnet (Dec 18, 2020)

ViolentPanda said:


> I love Platinum Preppys, & they're still available (& cheap). The great thing about fountain pens is you have to write slightly slower, which allows you better control.


They changed the design for the Preppy recently - still basically the same pen of course, and still cheap as chips.


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## equationgirl (Dec 21, 2020)

I got a stationery advent calendar this year and there was a preppy in it I'm looking forwards to trying out. And for Christmas I've treated myself to a Narwahl pen in purple. Plus a bottle of Ferris Wheel Press grape pop ink.There bottles are amazing.

I bought a TWSBI iris earlier in the year, which is awesome.


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