# BBC ban the words 'Free Palestine' from being uttered on air...



## ska invita (Feb 3, 2012)

Very dodgy this:


> *Electronic Intifada: Why is the BBC so afraid of the word "Palestine"?*
> 
> This week, the BBC issued its final ruling on a controversy which has been raging for nearly a year after the words “Free Palestine” were censored from a freestyle rap played on Radio 1Xtra.
> Appearing on the popular Charlie Sloth Hip Hop M1X last February, the artist Mic Righteous performed a rap which included the lyrics: “I can scream Free Palestine for my pride/still pray for peace.”
> ...


 

more here: http://zed-books.blogspot.com/2012/02/electronic-intifada-why-is-bbc-so.html


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## Structaural (Feb 3, 2012)

I remember when the last bombardment of Palestine was happening, reports on here of hundreds being killed.
The BBC News just kept a banner up for hours that said '3 Israelis dead'.


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## Hocus Eye. (Feb 3, 2012)

Yes it is another example of the BBC being frightened of the powerful pro-Israeli lobby group that would have us believe that Palestine has no right to exist. This has been written about a lot and is not a new thing. The last bombardment of Palestine was the moment when the BBC revealed itself in its true colours (yellow for cowardly) because now there are many other sources of news enabling anyone with a computer to get a more balanced view.


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## ska invita (Feb 3, 2012)

To scan the lyrics of a rap track and put a broken glass sound fx over the top is particularly pathetic and show the lengths they'll go to... the bombardment one was blatant - this shows how 'sensitive' they are to it.


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## Pickman's model (Feb 3, 2012)

Given that the bbc is the propaganda wing of the state why are y'all so surprised and takrn aback?


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## DrRingDing (Feb 3, 2012)

I wonder if it is just the lobby groups that weild this influence.


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## Hocus Eye. (Feb 3, 2012)

Pickman's model said:


> Given that the bbc is the propaganda wing of the state why are y'all so surprised and takrn aback?


This makes it worse because it suggests that it is the state that is frightened of the Israeli lobby and in its turn manipulating the Beeb. Hush my mouth!


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## dylanredefined (Feb 3, 2012)

Why do this pretty sure the majority of the UK have little interest in the language of how the bbc report the Israel/Palestine conflict?
So free Palestine would only upset the sort of people who already think the BBC is their enemy and probably were not listening to the show anyway.


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## Structaural (Feb 3, 2012)

I was trying to find if anyone screenshotted that BBC News, found this article about BBC bias:

http://www.adbusters.org/blogs/adbusters-blog/eyeless-gaza.html




> The final act of chicanery comes in the shape of a sidebar which lists the number of rockets fired by Palestinians for each day of the conflict. This is particularly odd in an article ostensibly about the consequences of the Israeli blockade and bombing, especially since no similar figures are produced for the number of bombs, missiles and artillery shells rained on the Gazans. The source the BBC uses is the Intelligence and Terrorism Information Center based in Israel. What it does not mention however is that the 'private' think tank is a conveyor belt for Israeli military propaganda which, according to the_Washington Post_, 'has close ties with the country's military leadership and maintains an office at the Defense Ministry.' Any Palestinian claim on the other hand would not appear unless enclosed in quotation marks, even if independently verifiable


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## Dandred (Feb 3, 2012)

Hocus Eye. said:


> Yes it is another example of the* BBC being frightened of the powerful pro-Israeli lobby group* that would have us believe that Palestine has no right to exist.


 

Is this a Pro-Isreali group that exists in the UK?

If it is I'm fucking shocked. Which Pro Israeli group would the BBC be frightened of?
I thought that was just reserved to fuck witted USA politics......


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## Dandred (Feb 3, 2012)

DrRingDing said:


> I wonder if it is just the lobby groups that weild this influence.


 
Which lobby groups? Are they all US funded or is there a load of UK money going in there?



I'm really really shocked by this as when I left the UK back in 2004 the UK was very supportive of the Palestinians.....


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## dylanredefined (Feb 3, 2012)

What powerful pro Israel group? If anyone is lobbying the BBC its pro Palestine groups.Maybe the BBC just want to be dicks?


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## Bernie Gunther (Feb 3, 2012)

Pretty standard stuff for the BBC though.



> When a Thai kibbutz worker was killed in Israel by a rocket launched from Gaza last week, BBC News online gave the incident headline coverage flagged up on its home page. (BBC news online, 'Rocket fire from Gaza kills man in southern Israel', 23:42 GMT, Thursday, 18 March 2010 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8574138.stm
> 
> 
> By contrast, the killing of two Palestinian teenagers, Mohammad Qadus and Osaid Qadus, by Israeli soldiers on Saturday was buried at the end of a short news report on UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-Moon's Middle East visit. Even worse, the BBC's footnote simply echoed Israeli propaganda that "no live bullets were fired, only tear gas and rubber bullets", despite ample evidence to the contrary. (BBC news online, 'UN chief says Gaza suffering under Israeli blockade', 11:26 GMT, Sunday, 21 March 2010, http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8578611.stm)


 
http://www.medialens.org/index.php?...-over-backwards-to-accommodate-israeli-claims

Going back years ...



> From *Bad News From Isra**el* (Greg Philo and Mike Berry, Pluto Press, 2004)
> _Bad News from Israel_ suggests that television news on the Israel/Palestinian conflict confuses viewers and substantially features Israeli government views. Israelis are quoted and speak in interviews over twice as much as Palestinians and there are major differences in the language used to describe the two sides. This operates in favours of the Israelis and influences how viewers understand the conflict. The study focused on BBC One and ITV News from the start of the current Palestinian intifada, the Glasgow researchers examined around 200 news programmes and interviewed and questioned over 800 people.


 
http://www.glasgowmediagroup.org/content/view/38/46/


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## Dandred (Feb 3, 2012)

dylanredefined said:


> What powerful pro Israel group? If anyone is lobbying the BBC its pro Palestine groups.Maybe the BBC just want to be dicks?


 
Do powerful pro Israeli groups exist in the UK? If so, how, where the fuck would they get the money from?

Is this just more US influence on the BBC thanks to Dave and the cunt twats?

Israel is basically US funded.....


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## Bernie Gunther (Feb 3, 2012)

dylanredefined said:


> What powerful pro Israel group? If anyone is lobbying the BBC its pro Palestine groups.Maybe the BBC just want to be dicks?


 
There are a fair old number of them.

Jeremy Bowen got hauled over the coals by the BBC Trust due to the influence of a US based pro-Israeli pressure group (you can blame a whole series of Atlantacist PMs from Blair back to Thatcher for the BBC having to give a shit about what some yanks think) http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010/jun/10/jeremy-bowen-attacks-bbc-trust

... but there are UK ones too. Some of the tactics (e.g. recruiting right wing Christian loons for their cause) that worked for Israel's spin-doctors in the US have also started being employed in the UK


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## Dandred (Feb 3, 2012)

Bernie Gunther said:


> Pretty standard stuff for the BBC though.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

Thanks for those links Bernie, but why the fuck are the BBC involved in this travesty, who has been pushing their agenda behind the scenes for so long........We've been through both groups of cunts in charge of the UK in this time but the same outcome? Why?

Where does the influence come from, just the US?


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## butchersapron (Feb 3, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Thanks for those links Bernie, but why the fuck are the BBC involved in this travesty, who has been pushing their agenda behind the scenes for so long........We've been through both groups of cunts in charge of the UK in this time but the same outcome? Why?
> 
> Where does the influence come from, just the US?


Do you have an answer? Are you making a suggestion? Wht can't it just be the BBC itself as expression of the ruling class? Are you under some mad impression that the BBC is a neutral body, one that can only show bias if 'influenced'?


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## Bernie Gunther (Feb 3, 2012)

Quite often front groups are used to set up supposedly impartial or independent viewpoints critical of whoever, in order to apply pressure to media organisations to toe the line. A technique described by Chomsky and Hermann as 'Flak'



> It may take the form of letters, telegrams, phone calls, petitions, law-suits, speeches and Bills before Congress, and other modes of complaint, threat and punitive action'. Business organisations regularly come together to form flak machines. Perhaps one of the most well-known of these is the US-based Global Climate Coalition (GCC) - comprising fossil fuel and automobile companies such as Exxon, Texaco and Ford. The GCC was started up by Burson-Marsteller, one of the world's largest public relations companies, to rubbish the credibility of climate scientists and 'scare stories' about global warming (see Chapter 4).


 
http://www.chomsky.info/onchomsky/2002----.htm

So for example this story ...



> A report to be published on Wednesday by a media monitoring organization says that the BBC’s coverage of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict for the first quarter of 2010 was steeped with an anti-Israel bias.
> 
> In a detailed analysis of BBC News, Honest Reporting (HR) shows among its findings that its daily coverage focuses on Israeli action, which it deems as “undermining the peace process,” while Palestinian actions that violate peace agreements are either ignored or downplayed.


 http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=174099

Seems like an independent Amnesty International type of group thinks the BBC is biased right?

Except when we look into Honest Reporting, what do we find?



> Among my recent mailbag has been a letter that wishes my swift departure for Hell and eternal punishment ("Dear Mr Shit Fisk," it begins), and another from an American law student at Oxford who addressed me as "You evil, fucking man". The student, who said he was Jewish, added his phone number to the letter and apologised for his language after I threatened to take his letter to the police.
> 
> Of course, it was ever thus. The Bahraini press has cartooned me as a rabid dog for revealing details of Arab secret- police torture since rabid dogs have to be exterminated, this was a threat, not a joke and the Egyptian press has called me a "black crow" for condemning Egypt's fraudulent elections. An Arab student in the American Midwest is e-mailing friends with the information that I'm a member of Mossad, the Israeli intelligence service, apparently because a Jewish family invited me to speak at a local university.
> 
> ...


 Robert Fisk


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## frogwoman (Feb 3, 2012)

there wouldn't be an influence if the people who run the bbc didn't *allow* there to be. 

the bbc is the UK state broadcaster. puts things in a bit of a different light that.


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## frogwoman (Feb 3, 2012)

the bbc is biased though. it's not like it wouldn't be biased were it not for the zionists. that's the point.

it can't not be biased.


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## Dandred (Feb 3, 2012)

butchersapron said:


> Do you have an answer? Are you making a suggestion? What can't it just be the BBC as expression of the ruling class?


 
I've been out of the UK since 2004, I remember the BBC had a very balanced view of the Palestinian cause back then, how it could have changed to the BBC removing lyrics from a song has shocked me.

I'm just trying to catch up on what the fuck is going on.

Where the fuck would all this lobbyist money be going to and where would it be coming from?

I support the Palestinian people, and have done for the bet part of 15 years. I just don't understand where this talk of lobbyist has come from...


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## Bernie Gunther (Feb 3, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Which lobby groups? Are they all US funded or is there a load of UK money going in there?
> 
> 
> 
> I'm really really shocked by this as when I left the UK back in 2004 the UK was very supportive of the Palestinians.....


 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_lobby_in_the_United_Kingdom


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## frogwoman (Feb 3, 2012)

i would actually argue that in recent years the bbc has been getting less outwardly pro-zionist as a result of the unacceptable behaviour of the zionist state not only in public opinion but in the opinion of the british bourgeoisie that israel is becoming a liability and the so-called "mad dog" of the region. reflecting developments like the EU's stance towrards israel and trade and labelling settlement goods etc.

of course the bbc doesn't just repeat government propaganda all day it always puts an "opposing" view which is usually (But not always) really limited. the bbc's propaganda is usually followed up with the appearance of balance which means its a lot more subtle than say North Korea's or wherever, but that balance doesn't just reflect the idea of "oh we better stick an opposing view in there" but it reflects the concerns of say palestinian lobby groups etc, even groups the gov't disagree with like trade unions etc (as long as what they're saying is "safe"), all of which have an impact on the british state, even a shit or negligble one. It's all quite complicated and I may be talking bollocks but thats my understanding of it anyway.


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## Dandred (Feb 3, 2012)

Bernie Gunther said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_lobby_in_the_United_Kingdom


 
Thanks again Berine for posting up some actual facts and not just being an internet warrior.
I have and always will appreciate your posts.


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## Tattoo Snafu (Feb 3, 2012)

anyone know who drew this cartoon and where i could find a really large version of it?


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## Dandred (Feb 3, 2012)

Tattoo Snafu said:


> anyone know who drew this cartoon and where i could find a really large version of it?


 
I think the author's name is in the top right but I can't read it, from 2004 I think....


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## DotCommunist (Feb 3, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> i would actually argue that in recent years the bbc has been getting less outwardly pro-zionist as a result of the unacceptable behaviour of the zionist state not only in public opinion but in the opinion of the british bourgeoisie that israel is becoming a liability and the so-called "mad dog" of the region. reflecting developments like the EU's stance towrards israel and trade and labelling settlement goods etc.
> 
> of course the bbc doesn't just repeat government propaganda all day it always puts an "opposing" view which is usually (But not always) really limited. the bbc's propaganda is usually followed up with the appearance of balance which means its a lot more subtle than say North Korea's or wherever, but that balance doesn't just reflect the idea of "oh we better stick an opposing view in there" but it reflects the concerns of say palestinian lobby groups etc, even groups the gov't disagree with like trade unions etc (as long as what they're saying is "safe"), all of which have an impact on the british state, even a shit or negligble one. It's all quite complicated and I may be talking bollocks but thats my understanding of it anyway.


 

often the BBC's 'opposing' view is the nuetured or liberal opposition view. Thus the issue/debate is framed in simplistic this/that terms. And a spectrum of harsher or more valid opposition arguments are neatly cut out of the *ahem* discourse. iyswim


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## Tattoo Snafu (Feb 3, 2012)

Dandred said:


> I think the author's name is in the top right but I can't read it, from 2004 I think....


that's as far as i got as well.  I think it might either say Muslim Observer, or has featured in it http://muslimmedianetwork.com/mmn/

I want to print it out about 2 metres wide and spend the day outside the israeli and us embassies.


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## MrMPlymouth (Feb 4, 2012)

Israel has a right to exist. If we're going down the UN route which country do they recognise, Israel or Palestine?

Anti-Zionism is *not *always anti-Semitism, contrary to the hardcore Zionists' asseveration, but the two are correlated. The terrorist groups Hamas and Fatah are certainly not better than the Israeli government, who maintain the only westernised democracy in the Middle East.


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## DotCommunist (Feb 4, 2012)

Round of applause for that eh


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## Hocus Eye. (Feb 4, 2012)

MrMPlymouth said:


> Israel has a right to exist. If we're going down the UN route which country do they recognise, Israel or Palestine?
> 
> Anti-Zionism is *not *always anti-Semitism, contrary to the hardcore Zionists' asseveration, but the two are correlated. The terrorist groups Hamas and Fatah are certainly not better than the Israeli government, who maintain the only westernised democracy in the Middle East.


Hamas was elected to rule in Palestine. The rest of the world refused to recognise it. What is a 'westernised democracy', and why do you think that might be a good thing?

Also writing as an anti-zionist I would like to know how you think that correlates to the fact that I am not anti-semitic.

If Israel - newly created in its present form 1948 has a right to exist, then surely Palestine which was already there has a right to exist. The currently official UN policy is towards a 'two state solution'. That inevitably results in the recognition of both Israel and Palestine. This is why Israel won't agree to it.

Sadly the other idea that is not mentioned is a one state solution with both Israeli and Palestinian people living together. The Zionists won't accept this either. The war continues.


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## DotCommunist (Feb 4, 2012)

anyone who thinks cast lead was a fucking war crime carousel must be an anti semite


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## Serotonin (Feb 4, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Thanks again Berine for posting up some actual facts and not just being an internet warrior.
> I have and always will appreciate your posts.



In Flat Earth News, Nick Davies talks about the issue of Israeli lobby groups. Apparently the BBC will receive dozens of sack loads of complaints and their phone lines get tied up completely, every time these lobby groups perceive criticism (usually any time Palestine is mentioned). He even claimed, although it might have been hyperbole after one particular campaign that a BBC worker in the complaints department went off sick with RSI from envelope opening.


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## frogwoman (Feb 4, 2012)

MrMPlymouth said:


> Israel has a right to exist. If we're going down the UN route which country do they recognise, Israel or Palestine?
> 
> Anti-Zionism is *not *always anti-Semitism, contrary to the hardcore Zionists' asseveration, but the two are correlated. The terrorist groups Hamas and Fatah are certainly not better than the Israeli government, who maintain the only westernised democracy in the Middle East.


 
whats so good about a westernised democracy?


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## MrMPlymouth (Feb 4, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> whats so good about a westernised democracy?


 
read Ibn Warraq. Why the West is Best. By someone who has actually lived under an alternative system unlike the armchair multiculturalists.


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## MrMPlymouth (Feb 4, 2012)

Hocus Eye. said:


> Hamas was elected to rule in Palestine. The rest of the world refused to recognise it. What is a 'westernised democracy', and why do you think that might be a good thing?
> 
> Also writing as an anti-zionist I would like to know how you think that correlates to the fact that I am not anti-semitic.
> 
> ...


 
Two state solution I'd prefer, or just Israel with the palestinians dispersing into the many Arab/Muslim countries all around, while Israel is the only safe area for Jews anywhere outside the West. It _would_ be nice if they could live in harmony but it would lead to a lot of fatal violence to try to force them into it.

I said "correlated", as in people who are anti-Zionist are _more likely_ to be anti-semitic, at least the more extreme ones who talk of Israel as an "apartheid state" or a "terrorist state", the "segregation wall" for the security wall and "Zionist lobby" being some evil omnipresent force. I was careful not to overgeneralise and imply that all A are B, as I clearly stated.


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## butchersapron (Feb 4, 2012)

Well done, it's anti-semitism by likelihood

Jews in Israel are _more likel_y to go on anti-palestinian killing sprees.


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## frogwoman (Feb 4, 2012)

MrMPlymouth said:


> read Ibn Warraq. Why the West is Best. By someone who has actually lived under an alternative system unlike the armchair multiculturalists.


 
Define what you mean by a westernised democracy.


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## MrMPlymouth (Feb 4, 2012)

frogwoman said:


> Define what you mean by a westernised democracy.


 
One with free speech and political association, human rights enforced, equality for women, no Sharia, tolerance (within necessary limits), Christian principles, and a democratic capitalist economic system.


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## stethoscope (Feb 4, 2012)

Lol.


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## JimW (Feb 4, 2012)

Those famous Israeli Christian principles! You silly cunt.


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## frogwoman (Feb 4, 2012)

MrMPlymouth said:


> One with free speech and political association, human rights enforced, equality for women, no Sharia, tolerance (within necessary limits), Christian principles, and a democratic capitalist economic system.


 
there is no longer in any guarantee of this in most - perhaps all - bourgeois democracies - the economic/social basis of these "freedoms" is being attacked, has been attacked since the 70s.

oh and "Christian principles" lol. How does this fit with rights for the women and the gays?


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## FridgeMagnet (Feb 4, 2012)

Banned - was phytoseptamaton thing.


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## Hocus Eye. (Feb 4, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Banned - was phytoseptamaton thing.


I hope it isn't catching.


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## likesfish (Feb 4, 2012)

The pro Israeli lobby can shove loads of grief the BBC way doesn't even need that any people if they are dedicated 
    Much like the bnp trolls that get everywhere.
  I'd avoid mentioning  Palestine if every time it caused a massive amount of headache.


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## SpookyFrank (Feb 4, 2012)

Pickman's model said:


> Given that the bbc is the propaganda wing of the state why are y'all so surprised and takrn aback?


 
They're not supposed to be the propaganda wing of the_ Israeli_ state though.


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## DexterTCN (Feb 4, 2012)

FridgeMagnet said:


> Banned - was phytoseptamaton thing.


google has one answer for that search 

whassat then?  Whatever it is...there's always one thing that gives them away...I can't tell you what it is, they're reading.


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## Pickman's model (Feb 5, 2012)

SpookyFrank said:


> They're not supposed to be the propaganda wing of the_ Israeli_ state though.


they're not. it's just there's a special relationship between this government and the government of the zionist entity


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## SpookyFrank (Feb 5, 2012)

Perhaps if it's just trolling that the BBC are worried about we should resolve to be even bigger trolls than the pro-israeli mob. If the BBC disapprove of these tactics then they only have themselves to blame for caving to the first load of trolls. 

I mean how hard is it to ignore complaints? The government does it all the time. Better still they could learn to judge complaints by content rather than quantity. Anyone who gets upset when someone implies that Palestine is not free, for example, can safely be ignored in much the same way as one might ignore someone who complained about the BBC implying that night follows day.


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## Random (Feb 5, 2012)

Dandred said:


> Do powerful pro Israeli groups exist in the UK? If so, how, where the fuck would they get the money from?


Rather than being a direct response to lobbying or flak from pro-Israel groups, this BBC decision could simply be due to some cowardly/lazy producer worried about seeming to not be balanced. In other words, they were worried that they'd be accused of not having an equivalent act on a week later, who shout something out about Iran during a song. So the producer decided to tidy up things so they could keep the act and steeeeeeeeer wel cleeeeeeer of politics. Just music, much safer.


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## likesfish (Feb 6, 2012)

Or somebody whose been on the receiving end before I can't be fucking arsed with this it's a music show it's not going to change anything in the middle east all I'm going to do is get grief over it.


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## purenarcotic (Feb 6, 2012)

MrMPlymouth said:


> Israel has a right to exist. If we're going down the UN route which country do they recognise, Israel or Palestine?
> 
> Anti-Zionism is *not *always anti-Semitism, contrary to the hardcore Zionists' asseveration, but the two are correlated. The terrorist groups Hamas and Fatah are certainly not better than the Israeli government, who maintain the only westernised democracy in the Middle East.


 

i hardly see how anti-Zionism is really correlated.  Especially given that many Jews are massively against Israel's actions.  Plus of course some of the Chabad Jews are anti-zionist.  And there's the group of anti-zionist Jews within Jerusalem who long for the state of Israel to be crushed (The Sikrikim - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sikrikim).  They sent a representative to Iran a few years back praising them for their anti-Zionist standpoint.  They believe that the only person who has the right to set up the state of Israel is the Messiah, and as He has not come yet, Israel has no right to exist.  There's a fascinating documentary about them on youtube I recommend watching.

How can Jews be anti-Semitic, it makes no sense. 

Also, Israel is hardly the only safe place for Jews.  What utter nonsense.  I can't say I've ever felt unsafe as a Jew in the UK.  I would never dream of moving to Israel, certainly not at the moment, I wouldn't feel safe there at all.  I haven't visited for years and years because my parents were concerned that it wasn't really safe or stable enough at the time.

Israel is in quite a bit of crisis at the moment anyway.  There's a big problem amongst the secular and ultra orthadox there, who are increasingly clashing as the far right demand a strictly religious state while the secular Jews argue Israel is for all Jews and the religious are just going to have to suck it up.  You have some Jewish women seen wearing burquas (or frumkas), while others are now refusing to sit at the back of the bus.  There are increasingly violent protests and clashes and the country has really struggled economically (no doubt their defence budget is on an epic level).  Secular Jews hate that many of the ultra orthadox live solely on handouts from the state, because their entire day must be taken up with religious study ('benefit scrounging scum' seems to be an international problem haha).

When you look at the settlements on the occupied land, you see again the complexity of the situation.  The only people who live there are either the extremely religious or extremely zionist, or those who have made Aliah (spelling wrong but basically it's a principle that any Jew can go to Israel and be housed there, it's like a pilgrimage to the home land) from poor countries.  Lots of them will say they don't want to live there but were too poor to argue about it upon their arrival.  

From my perspective, it's really not coming across as the safest or stablest place for anybody to live frankly,  I wouldn't be thinking about moving there anytime soon that's for sure, my political opinions totally aside.


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## purenarcotic (Feb 6, 2012)

Bollocks, didn't see they were banned. Oh well.


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## Blagsta (Feb 6, 2012)

MrMPlymouth said:


> One with free speech and political association, human rights enforced, equality for women, no Sharia, tolerance (within necessary limits), Christian principles, and a democratic capitalist economic system.


Christian principles?


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## ska invita (Feb 7, 2012)

Press TV piece:


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