# Mass Effect 3



## Supine (Mar 5, 2012)

Who's in? Just ordered my copy.


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## Shippou-Sensei (Mar 5, 2012)

giving it a miss for a while

still not  played 2 (and i own a copy)

plus fuck origin


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## Cid (Mar 6, 2012)

Where's Vintage Paw?


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## Cid (Mar 6, 2012)

ME2 was good imo, decent characters, good gameplay in spite of BiowarEAs general approach (I want to be able to get the sodding shiny stuff in ONE playthrough, my life does not revolve around you!). Also was actually a proper game, unlike origins 2.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 6, 2012)

Cid said:


> Where's Vintage Paw?


 


I had the CE pre-ordered. I'd been considering cancelling for ages. GAME made my decision for me. I haven't re-ordered.

I'm still active on the ME forums. It's all fun and games over there. I know a whole heap about the game. It's ..... interesting.

Anyway, if I can secure an "evaluation copy" over the next few days, I shall indeed be playing it. But for the moment, I'm not buying it.

Interestingly, almost every single person who was vehemently against the idea of multiplayer, has been playing multiplayer solidly since the demo came out. Sadly I wasn't able to beyond a couple of waves (connection issues) so I can't comment, but I hear it's a lot of fun.

At the moment, there are severe import issues into the main game. Anyone who created a custom Shep in ME1 and imported them without changing their face into ME2 can't import that face into ME3. BioWare say they're working on it. There are also issues with imports if you have used the xbox cloud for saves. In that, you're fucked. No imports for you.

From playing the demo, and watching various streams of the game over the past couple of days or so, animations are fucking laughable. A real step back from ME2. To an extent, graphically it's an improvement, but only in certain areas. Facial expressions are very odd, and half the time everyone looks like the Reapers have already harvested their souls; they look dead behind their eyes. Body models are awful, especially so in particular circumstances.

The game is now riddled with auto-dialogue. Whereas in 1 Shep barely uttered a single word without you specifying what you wanted him or her to say, and in 2 there was still significant player input, in 3 you'll notice that there are far fewer opportunities to pick personality-defining dialogue, and it's mostly reserved for "decisions" instead. This isn't always the case, and in personal conversations on the Normandy, for example, there tend to be more options, but, for example, I watched the level on Palavan's moon several times with different players, and even when they had RPG mode selected, along with "Full Decisions" in the options menu, I was able to count the amount of dialogue choices on one hand. This is a huge shame for a lot of fans, because many have spent years creating a Shepard in 1 and 2 for whom they have an exact personality built up, and now that personality has been trashed. BioWare seem to have taken the idea of you playing _your_ Shepard and shelved it. Now you're playing BioWare's Shepard, with the option to shag who you want and choose a few plot things along the way. That's how it comes across, anyway.

Combat does look fun. I watched someone play a few levels as a vanguard, and while they were a little biotic charge happy, charging in and then using Nova looks intensely satisfying. Vanguard was the class I liked the least during the demo, but those levels weren't really set up for that kind of play style. Engineer looks like it's far more viable in 3 than it was in 2 (combat drone seems OP, in that it lasts forever and is VERY useful against Cerberus Guardians *protip*), and was probably my favourite class from the demo. Consensus is that Sentinel's Tech Armour has been nerfed to an extent, although you now get the option to detonate it whenever you want, which is an improvement. It doesn't seem as powerful though. But Sentinels now get some rather nifty grenades, which is awesome.

The endings are causing a great deal of controversy. I've watched one ending, and read about the others. There's some speculation that there's a "hidden" ending, if you play the game a 2nd time, but I don't know anything about that. I, personally, like the tone of the endings, but they make no narrative sense, and are riddled with plot holes. The main criticism on the forums is that there is no sunshine and rainbows and little fluffy bunnies - grim endings are grim. I like that though. There should be dramatic and unpleasant consequences for the whole galaxy and your team, considering the scale of the war/threat. My biggest problem, as I said, though is that they don't make narrative sense, in my opinion, and they also are rather anti-climatic.

There are a lot of nice touches in the game, things that hark back to your previous games in a relatively seamless way. There may or may not be issues with the game's import feature recognising all of your previous decisions correctly, but reports seem to vary. The soundtrack is fucking stunning, and, to my ear at least, is reminiscent of the tone of ME1 rather than the more anonymous tunes in ME2. I know I'm going to be listening to the OST for many years to come, just as I still listen to ME1's.

Final thing I've got to say about the game is rather frivolous, but, I've seen the romance scene between Kaidan Alenko and manShep, and it is singlehandedly the best romance I've ever seen in a game, ever. It's tender, emotional, passionate, caring, and the dialogue is top notch. There was video of the romance between manShep and Steve Cortez, the new shuttle pilot on the Normandy, and that felt a little detached and half-hearted. The Kaidan romance is nothing like that. It's simply astonishing. It's perfectly befitting the final instalment of this game, and is a great moment of reflection, presumably before the final BIG THING that happens at the end. I thoroughly look forward to seeing it for myself in the game, and I hope the other romances live up to that as well.

Oh, and on the subject of romances, if you're importing a Shep who previously romanced Miranda, Jack, Jacob or Thane, they are no longer on the Normandy with you. If you romanced Jacob or Thane ... all I can say is, I'm sorry.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 7, 2012)

loved 1 and 2

got an evaluation copy installing now but it will be too late to play it tonight ( but can smoehow see myself being up til 3am lol.... )


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## Epona (Mar 7, 2012)

I loved ME1, absolutely loved it.

ME2 - I can see it was a good game that a lot of people would enjoy, and iirc I preordered it myself, but it never really grabbed me - yes there were some good points about it, but it was much more FPSy with the way you had a series of missions to complete, and the fact that in combat levels you could not save at will - I know this wouldn't have bothered some people at all but I suck at that type of game and found it horribly difficult and had to go through levels from the start over and over to try to get through them - I don't enjoy doing that, I just want to get on with the story without having to restart an area several times over. I did struggle through it once for the story, I really wanted to go back and play a renegade character but I just couldn't face the prospect of re-doing the shooter type levels - some of which I found mindblowingly difficult, and many areas were a bit on-the-rails.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the game well enough, but most of the joy for me came from the interactions with crewmates on the ship, some of the dialogue was absolutely second to none and the moment where it all went a bit Gilbert and Sullivan has to be a comedy high point in any video game ever - but please don't ever make me repeat some of those combat levels (and the whole "recruit mission", "loyalty mission" format left me cold), it's just not my type of thing, sorry.

Origin is also a factor tbh, I certainly don't want this game enough to warrant having another separate gaming client on my PC - I like Steam and I'd rather just have all my games in one place, if I were desperate for ME3 I'd put up with it of course, but I'm not - and it's a lost sale because I probably would have been more inclined to give it a go if it was going to be on Steam.


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## Epona (Mar 7, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Final thing I've got to say about the game is rather frivolous, but, I've seen the romance scene between Kaidan Alenko and manShep, and it is singlehandedly the best romance I've ever seen in a game, ever. It's tender, emotional, passionate, caring, and the dialogue is top notch. There was video of the romance between manShep and Steve Cortez, the new shuttle pilot on the Normandy, and that felt a little detached and half-hearted. The Kaidan romance is nothing like that. It's simply astonishing. It's perfectly befitting the final instalment of this game, and is a great moment of reflection, presumably before the final BIG THING that happens at the end. I thoroughly look forward to seeing it for myself in the game, and I hope the other romances live up to that as well.


 
Bioware do seem to have (rightly) earned themselves a reputation for putting good romance options in RPGs of late, but it seems to me they tend to put a lot of effort into one or two options and the others can seem a bit tacked on  - but when they do it right they do a fine job.  Although FFS sometimes it takes some metagaming and looking up the dialogue paths on the internet in order to get them to go the right way - DAO for example was superb in many respects and there was some great stuff in there IF you knew the right response to pick, any time any of my companions spoke to me I felt like I was walking on eggshells in case I said something that made someone like me too much when it was not reciprocated, or I might pick the wrong thing to say and fuck them off completely - far worse than anything IRL.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 7, 2012)

so ok finally got installed last night and had a bit of a play about 5.30am 

the opening is good , even emotive , i felt actually moved.

Then started the first proper mission, for about 5 mins. I agree that the facial animations look a bit possessed but the rest of the graphics are just as nice if not more so than before.

Then i had to get up 

more thoughts after Ive had a proper bash tonight.

but il leave you with this...

http://www.computerandvideogames.co...eviews-plummet-to-25-gay-scene-ending-blamed/

gaming kids bigot shock lol


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## revol68 (Mar 7, 2012)

Epona said:


> I loved ME1, absolutely loved it.
> 
> ME2 - I can see it was a good game that a lot of people would enjoy, and iirc I preordered it myself, but it never really grabbed me - yes there were some good points about it, but it was much more FPSy with the way you had a series of missions to complete


 
This is exactly my problem with ME2 and why I have gave up on it twice, the story is nowhere near as organic as the first one, in ME2 it is obvious that you are just picking missions to do, whilst in ME1 you felt like events were propelling you along. The loyalty missions only add to this.

Can't agree with your difficulty comments cos that would make me look like a n00b and I'm actually really l33t , though you are spot on about it feeling on rails a lot.

I think ME2 was a real let down for me.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 7, 2012)

I agree, with the ME2 comments , the storyline about the collectors didnt really make it feel like a sequel, hopefully now the reapers are back this will feel like a proper sequel.

not to say that i didnt enjoy ME2 tho..


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 7, 2012)

Epona said:


> Bioware do seem to have (rightly) earned themselves a reputation for putting good romance options in RPGs of late, but it seems to me they tend to put a lot of effort into one or two options and the others can seem a bit tacked on - but when they do it right they do a fine job. Although FFS sometimes it takes some metagaming and looking up the dialogue paths on the internet in order to get them to go the right way - DAO for example was superb in many respects and there was some great stuff in there IF you knew the right response to pick, any time any of my companions spoke to me I felt like I was walking on eggshells in case I said something that made someone like me too much when it was not reciprocated, or I might pick the wrong thing to say and fuck them off completely - far worse than anything IRL.


 
That's very true. In DA2 it was a lot easier - click the heart .... profit. I enjoyed the romances in that game, although there was not nearly enough opportunity for dialogue outside of the set pieces. They've been criticised for this though, and if there is one thing BioWare are reasonably good at it's listening to criticisms and acting on them (even if sometimes the result is something that is worse XD). I'm heartily looking forward to DA3. I'm one of those rare beasts who thoroughly enjoyed DA2, despite its obvious flaws, and since they've said they are looking to the successes of Skyrim, along with all the constructive criticism that came after DA2's launch, I'm really hopeful they'll manage something quite good. As long as EA give them enough time, which ... yeah.

Some of the romances _do_ feel a little less than impactful in ME3, notably to 2 strictly gay characters, Steve and Samantha. I suppose that's simply because we haven't had 2 previous games to get to know them, so in that regard, ensuring at least that the romances with people we've known for 5 years are fleshed out and given the time they deserve is a good thing. The Garrus romance is, by all accounts, incredibly sweet and marvellous. It seems these romances aren't just an excuse for some pointless snogging, this time they actually act as good character development in relation to the overall story.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 7, 2012)

revol68 said:


> This is exactly my problem with ME2 and why I have gave up on it twice, the story is nowhere near as organic as the first one, in ME2 it is obvious that you are just picking missions to do, whilst in ME1 you felt like events were propelling you along. The loyalty missions only add to this.
> 
> Can't agree with your difficulty comments cos that would make me look like a n00b and I'm actually really l33t , though you are spot on about it feeling on rails a lot.
> 
> I think ME2 was a real let down for me.


 
I completely agree. In ME1 you felt like you were a part of the Mass Effect universe. In ME2 it became obvious you were just playing a Mass Effect game. Maybe that difference isn't obvious, or important, to some, but a lot of people fell in love with ME because of the way the storytelling and flow of the missions, even down to how you could walk off the Normandy and onto a planet without a loading screen, made it an immersive experience.

I'm trying to finish off a game in ME2 so I have a save ready to import once I get my evaluation copy (all my proper saves are on my xbox), and damn it's a fucking slog.

Remember the end of Virmire and then the feeling of going straight on to Ilos and then to the Citadel? It was feelings like that that were lacking from ME2.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 7, 2012)

If people don't mind spoilers, you might find this player reviews thread on BSN intereting: http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9658945

There aren't many up yet, because it's early days. All seem to be roughly the same. Pros: gameplay, combat, weapon modding, nice romances, emotional. Cons: the endings, lack of choice, previous choices meaning fuck all when it comes to the endings, Shepard no longer being your Shepard because of so much auto-dialogue and no neutral choice options, so many scripted events, it's like watching a movie of some person who looks vaguely like your Shepard, but looks a bit different and has a different personality, deus ex machina (although did we expect anything different?), endings endings endings.

Most, if not all, the reviews on there so far are very measured and well articulated. No random meta-critic raging. Yet.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 7, 2012)

Should be able to start playing this afternoon. I shall be sure to give you all my impressions, in a series of short, handy, bite-sized servings.

lol.

Nah, prepare for walls of text.


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## MooChild (Mar 7, 2012)

Not getting it for the PC cos of origin, will prolly DL a copy once all that crap has been removed.

Ironic really...


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 7, 2012)

with my ' evaluation copy ' i just disconncet from the net and then run it so origin cant log in


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 7, 2012)

I don't have Origin to begin with, and will make a firewall rule for the exe. Seems to be working fine for most folk.

I really don't know what they expect. Their over-zealousness at preventing piracy has the exact opposite effect. Bizarre, really.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 8, 2012)

so played for a couple of hours yesterday , on my pc it does look really really nice, the combat  is more fluid and the cover system seems better, and the story is shaping up nicely and still very emotive, I even eeked out loud at one bit.

The only thing im really pissed off about is lack of joypad support, just like the last 2, but this time thier excuse was lack of resources, i mean seriously? this is Bioware, its not like its a small company grrrrr


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 8, 2012)

Yeah, joypad support has been something people have been asking for since the first one, no idea why they've staunchly refused.

Well, I've played for a couple of hours, got to the Citadel for the first time. I have to say, I'm impressed by much of it. I'm not a fan of waves in combat, and this is nothing but waves, but I'll learn to cope.

Vega's Carnage ability is just .... oh my! <3

I imported a save whereby Shep romanced Liara, and it's referencing it wonderfully. While I detest the fact that there is so much auto-dialogue, there's no denying that the conversations are very good, and despite the fact that faces look like ass, especially when emoting, the fact that everyone actually moves around far more realistically in conversation is very good. Most of the voice acting seems pretty good too ... with one notable exception so far (Chobit ... good lord).

And oh my. When I approached the Citadel - it had the music from ME1 when you approached it for the first time. Just. *holds her hand to her chest and gets a little bit of grit in her eye*

Yes, so, don't tell anyone because I've got a reputation to maintain, but so far, I think I'm enjoying it.


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## fen_boy (Mar 8, 2012)

Are you saying that I couldn't play this on my pc with an Xbox controller? That's insane. I think I'll give this a miss till they sort that out.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 8, 2012)

They didn't sort it out for 1 or 2. I think people have had success with things like xpadder (in 1 and 2, no idea about 3), but it's very much a workaround.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 8, 2012)

yeah im going to try xpadder in a moment


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## Stigmata (Mar 8, 2012)

Epona said:


> Bioware do seem to have (rightly) earned themselves a reputation for putting good romance options in RPGs of late, but it seems to me they tend to put a lot of effort into one or two options and the others can seem a bit tacked on - but when they do it right they do a fine job. Although FFS sometimes it takes some metagaming and looking up the dialogue paths on the internet in order to get them to go the right way - DAO for example was superb in many respects and there was some great stuff in there IF you knew the right response to pick, any time any of my companions spoke to me I felt like I was walking on eggshells in case I said something that made someone like me too much when it was not reciprocated, or I might pick the wrong thing to say and fuck them off completely - far worse than anything IRL.


 
To be fair when it comes to game romances no woman (or man) has won me over like Viconia in Baldur's Gate 2.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 8, 2012)

I just spent far too long customising the colour of my armour. There are reapers attacking, dammit. But I have to make sure my armour co-ordinates properly.


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## FridgeMagnet (Mar 8, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> I just spent far too long customising the colour of my armour. There are reapers attacking, dammit. But I have to make sure my armour co-ordinates properly.


http://secondlife.com/


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 8, 2012)

ok so the xpadder profile from here

http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120306071430AAHtdqp

or a link from it works perfectly  well dont cick the left stick as it acts like the windows key lol , this is going to make the game much more enjoyable for me 


edit : you can make the left joy click do nothing


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 8, 2012)

I has a space hamster.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 8, 2012)

ok 3 hours in and officially loving it , it feels like war , a desperate one at that.
Id be up all night playing it if i didnt have damn work in the morning :grr:


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## Cid (Mar 9, 2012)

So if I have mass effect 2 on steam and um... try an evaluation copy... Will I be able to import my old save?


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## Cid (Mar 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> I don't have Origin to begin with, and will make a firewall rule for the exe. Seems to be working fine for most folk.
> 
> I really don't know what they expect. Their over-zealousness at preventing piracy has the exact opposite effect. Bizarre, really.


 
Really quite stupid isn't it? I mean compare it with people's approach to Skyrim... Also maintaining their own download manager, why?


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## bouncer_the_dog (Mar 9, 2012)

This is a 'wait until its £10' jobby for me. I like that, were you to buy it all, you can spend £500+ on the DLC


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## bouncer_the_dog (Mar 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> I has a space hamster.


 
My space hamster died in ME2 - I didn't realise you have to feed it.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 9, 2012)

re importing into evaluation copies , the copy i did get does give you the option to import so I assume you can


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## magneze (Mar 9, 2012)

I tried ME2 recently, but really don't like third person shooters. Seems weird.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 9, 2012)

Re: importing. Some people may have had problems importing from Steam saves into evaluation copies ... not sure if there is some sort of protocol Origin has to make it happen. I think there are workarounds. Typically about what folders you need and where and so on. My PC ME2 is evaluation as well, so it imported fine.

Except imported faces from 2 into 3 look like ass. *sigh* What the fuck did they do to the CC? And the hair? *weeps*


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 9, 2012)

Seriously, why did they have to mess with the CC?

Joan Shepard in ME2: http://db.tt/Xqt6RqKv

And in ME3 *weeps*: http://db.tt/0yTyYZTm


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## golightly (Mar 9, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Seriously, why did they have to mess with the CC?
> 
> Joan Shepard in ME2: http://db.tt/Xqt6RqKv
> 
> And in ME3 *weeps*: http://db.tt/0yTyYZTm


 
Looks like the all the stress of command has taken it's toll.  Maybe a holiday would help.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 9, 2012)

funnily enough that is relevant in the story...


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 9, 2012)

Best line in the game so far:

"They used to eat flies."

I'll leave you to find it for yourselves.


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## agricola (Mar 13, 2012)

Finished it last night, loved it.


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## Supine (Mar 13, 2012)

Managed a whole 30mins of play so far. No spoilers please!

Graphics look better, apart from the funny way their lips move.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 14, 2012)

agricola, what did you think of the ending? (Put it in spoilers if needs be.) There has been an amount of, shall we say, "controversy" about it/them. I wondered what your take on it was.


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## agricola (Mar 14, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> agricola, what did you think of the ending? (Put it in spoilers if needs be.) There has been an amount of, shall we say, "controversy" about it/them. I wondered what your take on it was.


 


Spoiler



The ending did feel very forced - everything after Harbinger opens fire was basically just a scripted event of quite profound dullness - and the argument advanced for the pro-Reaper option was just stupid (if indeed there actually was one, at least on my playthrough), though that wasnt unique in the game as the Geth/Quarian choice was at least as daft.  Bit of a crap idea as to why the invasions had taken place as well.

Its probably made worse because those two choices definately jarred with the rest of the game, which was generally magnificent except for the London bits which were considerably better than that.  It was still a better ending than KOTOR 2, mind.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 14, 2012)

agricola said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Aye, well ...



Spoiler



There is so much rage on bioware's forums it's unreal. It's getting international attention, there was even an article in Forbes about the campaign to make them re-write the ending.

There's a theory, that seems to be rather prevalent, that does, admittedly, make sense of a great many of the problems. It's controversial though, for a couple of reasons.

First, if you choose the red 'splosions (Destroy) and you have an EMS number of over 4000 (or, in some circumstances, over 5000) you get an extra scene right before the credits roll. This is a scene of Shepard, lying in rubble, taking a sudden breath ... then credits. This is being called the "best" ending, and the path to be able to get it is incredibly specific. The presence of that scene, and the overall nonsensical nature of the whole ending sequence, has led to this theory:

Shepard is indoctrinated. When Harbinger fires its laser and knocks Shepard unconscious, everything after that point is a hallucination, whereby Shep is struggling with the effects of indoctrination. Nothing with creepy godkid actually happens, it's in Shep's head. The Control and Synthesis endings/choices are reaper plans to get Shepard to stop fighting the indoctrination, in the belief that a peaceful solution can be reached. If you/Shepard choose either of these, Shepard dies there, in the rubble in London. Without Shepard to continue the fight, the reapers win. If Shep picks Destroy, and has met other certain conditions beforehand, s/he successfully fights off indoctrination, showing s/he's prepared to sacrifice others in order to kill the reapers once and for all. Having escaped the reaper's clutches, Shepard then wakes up in London.

Of course, while that seems to solve a hell of a lot of problems with the endings, we're also left with the fact that - well, the reapers are still alive. And we all know what that means, right? Real ending dlc. If bioware charge for this, it'll be the biggest mistake they've ever made. Maybe. If people buy it - as most of the outraged fans on their forums are indicating they would - then EA will have all these lovely numbers that show that people are now prepared to pay extra for an ending to their games. If it's free dlc that comes in the next 2 weeks or so ... well, it could quite frankly be one of the most interesting things they've ever done. But at the same time, I think there will be an awful lot of people who feel utterly cheated, that the content should have been there in the original game, perhaps to keep playing after the credits rolled, instead of that rather pointless stargazer scene.

Even though I really detest the idea of "real ending" dlc, I have to admit, there is something incredibly mischievous about the idea of having "indoctrinated" all of the players. Every player who picked Control or Synthesis was, themselves, effectively indoctrinated. And that is kinda cool. But I, for one, actually hope that bioware just dropped the ball and the endings are just shit. Because the implications of real endings not being included in full price games leaves a very, very bad taste in my mouth (as does, incidentally, the 'demands' from so many fans that bioware go away and rewrite the whole thing).


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## tommers (Mar 14, 2012)

Christ, the more I read about how they're marketing this game the more I think it's everything that is wrong with gaming at the moment.

That is some cynical shit.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 14, 2012)

Indeed. We will have to wait and see if it is the case though. It might just be that they honestly rushed and dropped the ball.

But I agree in general. The reason I cancelled my pre-order was because of the crass marketing machine. And it doesn't appear to be letting up.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 14, 2012)

We also have a problem with the whole multiplayer integration thing. In order to get the "best" ending, one needs an EMS (Effective Military Strength) of over 4000. At present, through doing single player alone, it's generally only possible to get an EMS of around 3500-3700. BioWare have claimed there are abundant "war assets" in game, so all players are able to achieve that ending. I think a couple of people managed it, but only by importing games from 1 and 2 that met very specific pre-requisites (which are, in fact, things that a very small minority of players will have done - choosing to kill certain people who are fan favourites, for example).

So, for your average player, importing their games across from 1 and 2, if you want to see that supposedly "best" ending, you're going to have to suck it up and play some multiplayer, in order to increase your "galactic readiness" from the default 50%.

And your galactic readiness drops 1% per day if you don't play MP.


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## Sunray (Mar 15, 2012)

I will get this when it comes out on Steam because thats where I bought ME2.

EA can fuck off if they think I am buying it off Origins


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 15, 2012)

Unless Origin goes belly-up I think you're unlikely to see it on Steam any time soon.

Ridiculous. The thing they introduce to try to cut down on piracy is the very thing that drives everyone to piracy (well, those with questionable morals, something I would never, ever do, nor would I condone it >_> )


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## Sunray (Mar 15, 2012)

I won't pirate it, too many root kits and viruses in downloads these days.   Games are such a prime target its untrue.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 16, 2012)

I'm gearing up for the end game. It's been thoroughly enjoyable so far.

Looking forward to going through ME2 afterwards to set up my adept ready for importing (even though ME2 is by far the weaker game).


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 18, 2012)

Well, I finished. On the whole, I enjoyed it, ending included. There were some truly stunning moments, dialogue was the best of all 3 games, and while some of the animation looked like crap, it certainly did feel more dynamic.

I didn't like not having more control over dialogue, but even with so much of what Shep was saying being taken out of my hands, I still enjoyed all the conversations.

The journal is diabolical. It's really difficult to keep track of anything, and nothing updates once you've fulfilled a certain requirement. And at one point you pick up so many missions on the Citadel it's almost overwhelming.

Too many side quests are 'scan planet, find relic, bring back to X,' which gets boring fast. The lack of little side quests that you can pick up and do as and when you like means things feel more linear in your options for progressing. You get a glut of non-priority missions alongside your priority mission, but because they are locked off once you go past a certain point, you're more or less stuck with doing a combination of a, b and c, before you can move on to d, at which point the game gives you e, f and g to do, and you have to do them in sequence. It's strange though, while playing it didn't feel like a negative thing, but thinking about future runs you know you'll be doing exactly the same thing at exactly the same time.

ME1 had the greatest motivation for replaying of the series, imo. There were so many side quests that featured going out and shooting things, and none were integral to the story in terms of fulfilling certain criteria, yet most tied into the story in some way or another. ME3 doesn't have that. The tiny side quests are fetch quests with no rhyme nor reason as to why you should care about doing them, and the non-priority missions, while I suppose they could be classed as side quests, feel so integrated into the main story that they have to be done at a certain point, and don't feel like things you uncover yourself, that you can do at will.

There are reasons to replay 3, but the endings aren't really one of them. You'd probably only replay if a) you wanted to try out combat with different classes; b) you were sufficiently interested in seeing other romances; or c) if you had save files that were drastically different from one another to import.

With c, you'll not see much difference between a Shep who was paragon and one who was renegade, unless they took very divergent paths through the other 2 games, in terms of who is alive or dead, what data was kept or saved, and so on.

I don't like the war assets system. Attaching arbitrary numerical values to certain assets you acquire feels cheap. Sure, as you go through the game you resolve things that have been issues since 1, like the geth/quarian problem, and you choose how (or whether to) deal with the genophage. But ultimately, the status of the endings relies only on how many war assets you accrued in order to get a good enough EMS (effective military strength) number. Ultimately, it doesn't matter _how_ you achieved that EMS number--whether it's through backing one party or another, lying to someone or not, for example--all that matters is that you got enough. I suppose to an extent, it highlights a 'the ends justify the means' style of thinking--it doesn't matter how you gather your troops, as long as you gather your troops. But it also leaves you feeling like you went through 3 games, making tough decisions, for what?

That said, I'm glad I had the opportunity to resolve those problems, as they had been the most interesting underlying issues throughout the series. And once I got to the end, I was so jacked up on the feeling of awe because of recent events that the high carried me through, and I spent the whole of the credits sobbing.

I knew what the end choices were before I even started playing the game (I'm a sucker for spoilers) and I remember the exact moment in the game when I made my decision. There is some major debate over which of the choices is meant to be the 'good' choice, and I'm personally of the opinion there is no good choice, but there was a moment when I was talking to EDI that caused me to have one of those lightbulb moments. The end of the Rannoch mission solidified that decision. I don't know if I'll pick it again. I went into that playthrough certain I'd pick my least favourite option, so I could get it out of the way (my first Shep is always my throw-away Shep), but in the end I couldn't. Then I decided that I'd pick yet a different option, because it's the one that seemed the least morally dodgy. And I did falter, when I was stood there, having been asked to make my choice. But I thought back to the moment I'd made my decision to pick the third option, and I stuck to it.

I agree with much of the criticism that's being bandied around about the endings. That said, despite all that, I still thoroughly enjoyed it, because I didn't see the ending as detached from the rest of the game, it was just the very last part of what I saw as a long conclusion. A frustrating last part, but whatever.

What I specifically didn't like about the ending:

I didn't like that Harbinger didn't talk to me - the reapers were a pretty underplayed threat, despite them being THE threat. I got to talk to one, but it was nameless, and it didn't feel anywhere near as awe-inspiring as in 1, or even as in 2 (where it wasn't that awe-inspiring at all). And when Harby came floating down at the end, it really could have been any other reaper.

I didn't like that I couldn't ask the Catalyst any questions. I'd finally been given knowledge about what's been going on, and I'm presented with 3 options, and I can't ask anything? I can't call bullshit, I can't argue, I can't express frustration, I can't say anything. Shep just stands there, half-broken, taking it all in and accepting it. On the one hand, I can see how that adds to the feeling of this really being the end, things being so fucking desperate, that Shep can't do anything now _but_ stand there and take what the Catalyst says on face value. But still. It was frustrating.

I also didn't like that there was no exposition on how Joker and your crew got away from earth, or why. Some sort of cut-away scene, a la the fleet attacking Sovereign while you were battling Saren in 1, whereby you see all your friends mired in the battle, and how Joker picks them up and they fly away - that's all that was needed. As it stands, it's really confusing, and you're left wondering 'did everyone just abandon me, abandon the fight?'

I also didn't like the 'stargazer' scene after the credits. It was badly acted (sorry Buzz) and hammy as hell.

But, for that list of didn't-likes, the absolutely-loveds make up for it. It's a shame that the ball was dropped at such a crucial point in the game, but I nevertheless loved it, and I was able to sustain the emotion of the events leading up to that point, so much so that I would be prepared to tentatively say I enjoyed the ending. And overall, I utterly adored the game as a whole.


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## treelover (Mar 19, 2012)

agricola said:


> Finished it last night, loved it.


 
How did you finish it so quickly? if its as huge as ME1/ME2, i still haven't finished ME1 and have ME2 to start on...


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## treelover (Mar 19, 2012)

how can I finish ME1 quickly, just ignore side quests etc..


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## agricola (Mar 19, 2012)

treelover said:


> How did you finish it so quickly? if its as huge as ME1/ME2, i still haven't finished ME1 and have ME2 to start on...


 
A messed up sleep pattern after nights is a curse, except when it comes to ME3.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 19, 2012)

completed it last night in a time of 29hrs 29 mins lol. I really enjoyed it but as others ( many many others have said ) I did feel a bit let down. I only got 2 choices, but went on you tube to see the extra ones, but tbh they were nearly all the same no matter what you chose. im  glad to say I wasnt indoctrinated 
ME1 blew me away, ME2's story felt really detached. ME3 had some really wicked choices but as VP said they didnt seem to make much difference to trhe outcome.

But on the whole im glad i invested over nearly 150 hours of my life in the trilogy


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 19, 2012)

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/...ans-file-ftc-complaints-over-game-ending.html



at the end of the day , its only a game ffs


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 19, 2012)

Thing about the endings is that, while visually they look more or less identical, the implications are vastly different. For some, they need to be shown the implications; I appear to be quite happy to simply have knowledge of the implications.

The "Retake Mass Effect" 'movement' is ... well I don't really know what to make of it. On the one hand, they've raised over $45k for the Child's Play charity. On the other hand, it's all a bit ... idk. I keep hearing them getting outraged when people claim they want everything to be bunnies and rainbows and little blue children, and they say that's not it at all, they just want their choices to have mattered and for the plot holes to be cleared up. And then you go and look at the numerous polls they've created, whereby a good 80% or more consistently choose "I want a mega-happy ending whereby everyone lives, Shep is reunited with their love interest, nothing bad happens to the relays, there is no starchild scene at all, no different-coloured 'splosions, and there is ultimate, happy victory." <-- That's not an exaggeration of what the polls say, by the way. That's more or less precisely how one of them is worded.

It's fine to be miffed at plot holes or an unsatisfying ending, but the way this "Retake Mass Effect" thing has gone has meant people are essentially asking for the entire game and tone to be completely rewritten. It's madness.

And then there are the people who are claiming they feel physically sick, haven't been able to sleep since finishing it, and that one person who claims to have PTSD, as a result of the unsatisfying ending.

It's fucking scary out there.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 19, 2012)

indeed , i felt a bit let down but ffs , hysteria anyone?? ptsd?

man get a grip its a game, you have hours of quality enterainment til the last 5 mins and now you want to cry about it ? no wonder the aliens wont contact us lol


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## tommers (Mar 19, 2012)

There are some really odd people in the world.

PTSD!    but also   Have some proper trauma and then tell me again about how the ending of a fucking computer game affected you.

oh, and penny arcade...


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## agricola (Mar 19, 2012)

Its nonsense like this that gave rise to the ending of the US version of _Life on Mars_.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 20, 2012)

http://www.psu.com/Amazon-granting-refunds-for-Mass-Effect-3--a014727-p0.php

idek

I'm embarrassed to consider myself very good friends with some of the people involved in this whole furore. Fucking muppets.


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## ruffneck23 (Mar 20, 2012)

Whats the betting that most of these people are under 18 and got thier parents to buy the game in the first place, I took a look at bioware forums and its a scary scary place. As someone said on another forum, it makes you embarrassed to be a gamer...


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 20, 2012)

In other news, I'm on my 2nd playthrough. This time on hardcore and as adept. It's good fun, having a full compliment of adept powers AND bringing Liara along. Crowd control has never been as important in an ME game as in this one, which makes a team of 2 pure adepts and one person who can 'splode shields fucking excellent. I took stasis as my bonus (having used energy drain for most of the game as my bonus when I played soldier), which can be used against shielded enemies as well.

I don't know if anyone knows about (or is even interested in) this, but if you only have, say, one full save game to import into 3, there's a save game editor you can use, to do things like change gender, background, class, romance, and most of the flags for important missions throughout the first two games, which lets you save it as a new career to import into 3. That's how I've got my current save. I changed Lily Shepard, vanguard, spacer war hero who romanced Liara into James Shepard, colonist ruthless adept who romanced no one, and apart from having to obviously create a new face it so far seems seamless. http://social.bioware.com/project/4373/&v=discussions#files


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 20, 2012)

ruffneck23 said:


> Whats the betting that most of these people are under 18 and got thier parents to buy the game in the first place, I took a look at bioware forums and its a scary scary place. As someone said on another forum, it makes you embarrassed to be a gamer...


 
Actually, age doesn't seem to be a factor in this. It seems to range from the teens up to the 40s and beyond. And you know, I can understand people are upset that they didn't get the ending they wanted, or even the one they were led to believe they would get. I understand that many of them have been playing ME since 2007 and are rather invested in it. I consider myself to be invested in it too. I even went as far as fan fiction (not a word *glares*). But there is a distinct lack of perspective in these campaigns and protests. I'm all for consumer rights against big evil corporations, but it leaves a bad taste in my mouth when it comes to them baying for blood and insisting it is their right to demand that the writers rewrite the entire meaning and focus of the game so they can get a couple of extra minutes at the end walking off into the sunset with their romanced character. I get that they want the plot holes to be explained, and I do too, but there's a limit to how far you go to demand someone rewrite something because you didn't like it.

As the penny arcade video said, they're asking bioware to do exactly what they berate George Lucas from doing to Star Wars -_-


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 20, 2012)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-17444719?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

I read on the forums they were hoping to get a piece on the bbc website ... seems like they managed it.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 21, 2012)

Dr Ray, co-founder of BioWare, has released a statement on the endings furore, and I think it's very good:

http://blog.bioware.com/2012/03/21/4108/


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## agricola (Mar 30, 2012)

TBH the thing that has annoyed me most on further playing of this is not the ending, its the multiplayer they force you to do in order to get the best ending.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 31, 2012)

Me too. Although 'best ending' is subjective here. It's not the best ending for me, but I completely agree. Tying MP to the SP campaign in that way is a low move.

As time goes on, I expect any dlc that comes out with extra missions during the course of the game (I'm thoroughly expecting Priority: Omega at some point -- Aria was getting more and more irate just sat there the whole game) will add to your war assets, but they won't want to render MP utterly pointless, and will want to ensure people are still playing it in several months. So I don't expect you'll ever be able to reach 5,000 EMS in SP alone (I hear 4,000 is possible, but only if you've fulfilled very specific criteria, like killing Wrex in ME1, destroying the genophage data and killing Maleon in ME2, for example).


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 31, 2012)

My EMS was somewhere in the region of 3,700 by the end of the game, without touching multiplayer, and by having done every side quest and fetch quest and having scanned every single system to 100% completion. This is a case where your previous choices in ME1 and 2 definitely do make a difference, but it's so prescriptive, it makes MP the only acceptable choice for some.


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## Firky (Mar 31, 2012)

Loved ME and ME2. Still haven't got around to playing ME3.

Shepherd is a shit name for a hero though.


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## agricola (Mar 31, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Me too. Although 'best ending' is subjective here. It's not the best ending for me, but I completely agree. Tying MP to the SP campaign in that way is a low move.
> 
> As time goes on, I expect any dlc that comes out with extra missions during the course of the game (I'm thoroughly expecting Priority: Omega at some point -- Aria was getting more and more irate just sat there the whole game) will add to your war assets, but they won't want to render MP utterly pointless, and will want to ensure people are still playing it in several months. So I don't expect you'll ever be able to reach 5,000 EMS in SP alone (I hear 4,000 is possible, but only if you've fulfilled very specific criteria, like killing Wrex in ME1, destroying the genophage data and killing Maleon in ME2, for example).


 
I agree, but I think they are fools if they think MP isnt guaranteed to become pointless - after all, once people get 5000 EMS, finish the game and end up with the "best" ending they arent going to hang around afterwards.  The whole way they have handled this does worry a bit though - after all, viewed from one angle this is the fourth big launch they have managed to annoy people with - ME2 itself, DA2, SWTOR and now this... all close to being great games but ruined by Bioware doing one or two things really stupidly.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 31, 2012)

Out of those, ME2 was the one that disappointed me the most. I played TOR for a time, but stopped when ME3 came out and other things took my attention, but for a total mmo n00b like me, I enjoyed it. I'm one of those rare beasts that loves DA2 though. Yeah, I know it's got its flaws, like repeating dungeons and a weird narrative, but otherwise I love it. I'm really looking forward to DA3. ME2 disappointed me because it stripped out all the good stuff from 1, and almost completely abandoned the idea of having a well-integrated, flowing narrative. But ME3, apart from the multiplayer and a couple of other things, I'm pretty happy with it.


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## Epona (Apr 3, 2012)

Vintage Paw said:


> Out of those, ME2 was the one that disappointed me the most. I played TOR for a time, but stopped when ME3 came out and other things took my attention, but for a total mmo n00b like me, I enjoyed it. I'm one of those rare beasts that loves DA2 though. Yeah, I know it's got its flaws, like repeating dungeons and a weird narrative, but otherwise I love it. I'm really looking forward to DA3. ME2 disappointed me because it stripped out all the good stuff from 1, and almost completely abandoned the idea of having a well-integrated, flowing narrative. But ME3, apart from the multiplayer and a couple of other things, I'm pretty happy with it.


 
I have probably said this before, but I liked DA2 in terms of the story, in my first playthrough. I found the cut and paste dungeons completely unacceptable even the first time round. I would have given it it a 7/10 initially (which for me was unthinkably low for a Bioware game). Then I played it through a second time, and realised that the other ending was pretty much exactly the same as the first. I didn't dismiss the game out of hand like so many did, and found it quite fun (although nowhere near as deep as I would have liked) and I didn't hate it to the extent that some others did - but it was still a disappointment, given the usual standard that I expect from Bioware. To me it wasn't odious (and I know some people felt that it was), but it's not going to go down in the annals as a Classic, not by a long shot. It was average rather than the brilliance that some of us long-time Bioware fans have come to expect. IMO.

Cut and paste dungeons will never be acceptable to an old-school RPG fan, we've marked down other games for doing that or for doing boring dungeon crawls for donkeys years (Yes, Pool of Radiance, I am looking at you) and it's not going to become acceptable just because it's Bioware doing it.


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## tommers (Apr 3, 2012)

I don't remember Pool of Radiance having boring dungeon crawls.  But I could be wrong.  It was 25 years ago after all.

I just remember the great fight at the start with about 30 orcs.  And the undead fort bit.  I loved those games.

Can you still play them?  I bet they've really aged.


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## Vintage Paw (Apr 3, 2012)

I doubt DA3 is even going to, for a second, entertain the thought of repeating dungeons. I don't think they'd dare XD

I saw this earlier, I found it rather amusing: http://t.co/iu4TDSmP



> In response to fan complaints about the endings to its last couple of games, BioWare has decided to experiment with a new development tool that is sure to please each and every one of its fans, according to our source. The company will soon be posting a Kickstarter project that will allow fans to write their own endings to _Dragon Age III_. BioWare aims to earn at least two million dollars in order to monetarily support the work of personalizing game endings for each Kickstarter donator.
> 
> Various levels of Kickstarter support will purchase different levels of customization. $30 buys a generically customized ending, in which the player can note preferences for happy, tragic, or bittersweet endings, as well as choosing whether to keep some mysteries unsolved or be presented by a cutscene in which Varric delivers a Powerpoint presentation laying out the truth behind every detail in the game.
> 
> ...


 
All it needed was a section at the end that said that BioWare recognises that this service should be free for all "true" fans of the series, and are looking at ways of implementing a "true fan" test before the program goes live


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## tommers (Apr 8, 2012)




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## agricola (Apr 9, 2012)

Extended ending DLC announced:

http://blog.bioware.com/2012/04/05/mass-effect-3-extended-cut/


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## Vintage Paw (Apr 10, 2012)

Indeed. They're still not happy though.

The internet never gets less scary, does it?


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## Vintage Paw (Jun 27, 2012)

The Extended Cut was released yesterday. I haven't played it yet, but I've watched the 'new' 4 endings online, and I think they are really great. I picked synthesis on my first run, and I love what they've done to that now. It's definitely my 'canon' ending.

They added a 4th option to choose at the end, which was to tell the starkid to fuck off, and refuse to pick his 3 options. This, of course, leads to everyone being wiped out and the cycle continuing. This was the right choice. Unfortunately, however, they added a new 'stargazer' scene at the end of that one, whereby they say they found the info that Shepard and Liara left for the galaxy, and with it were able to stop the cycle once and for all. That was the wrong decision, I think. I'd have far preferred it had they shown the stargazer and her kid looking up at the skies as a reaper invasion begins, to really drive home the ramifications of losing in our cycle. The way they did it here is a frustrating cop out.

Other than that though (and apart from them making it clearer that Shepard *does* live at the end of the high EMS destroy ending, which I wish they hadn't made clear), I like it a great deal.

The Mass Effect trilogy remains my favourite gaming experience.


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## Vintage Paw (Jun 30, 2012)

I have finally played through the new extended cut. I chose 'control' instead of my usual 'synthesis' just to see what it was like. I quite liked it. I think that on the whole it's a worthwhile addition, but it does seem to explain a little _too_ much, that I think would have been better left to the imagination. But that's what you get when angry fans get angry, and loud.


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## golightly (Jul 15, 2012)

I finally bought this on Origin. It was on sale so I only paid £13.50. Well, that overcame my concerns about EA snooping. 

Sent from my Lumia 610 using Board Express


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## Vintage Paw (Jul 26, 2012)

Why didn't anyone tell me playing as an infiltrator was so much fun?

*explodes people's heads with her sniper rifle*


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## Vintage Paw (Sep 9, 2012)

Have been playing the Leviathan dlc. Haven't finished yet, but really enjoying it so far. It has lots of different stages to it, and you're not forced to do it all at once. It's integrated really, really well into the rest of the game, and doesn't feel like tacked-on dlc at all. Your squad have lots to say, both during the missions and if you go and talk to them after each part of it when you're back on the Normandy.

I was quite late in my current playthrough, so started it right after Thessia (which I would have preferred to avoid, since I think of Thessia like I do Virmire from ME1: as soon as I do that mission, I'm effectively in the end game. Virmire set the tone for the end of the game, and Thessia does as well imo - even though you've still got quite a way to go at that point, but no matter). I think it would be best placed after the Citadel invasion, after Samara's monastery mission (because there are banshees in the dlc, and you won't have encountered them before the monastery), but probably before all the stuff on Rannoch. That's where I plan to play it next time.


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## BoxRoom (Nov 22, 2012)

Starting to hear more rumblings about Mass Effect 4 and have realised I haven't finished my playthrough of my Space Bastard Shepard yet. I love that guy, he's a right bugger.
Really difficult to play Renegade options at times which gives me the vague hope that I'm not completely evil


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## 8ball (Nov 22, 2012)

Just started ME2 on PS3 (I had it on PC but can't be arsed with all the malarky with settings that PC gaming brings).  Have replicated space bitch FemShep (from ME1 on PC) - playing as vanguard, which seems a bit weird with the 'charge' power.  Bit phased by lack of manual in the box at first.

 Got ME3 ready to go too...


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## Vintage Paw (Nov 22, 2012)

Charge really comes into its own in ME3, when it comes teamed with 'Nova' - which lets you detonate a sort of biotic pulse around you. Charge recharges your barrier (somehow), and Nova depletes it, using that energy in a pulse around you. It makes Charge a really workable strategic power. I haven't played the whole game with Vanguard yet, but I can say it was immensely fun killing the first Brute you encounter early on (Brutes are big hulking evil husks of death and rage) using only Charge and Nova - on hardcore.

I can't get over how much I fell in love with Infiltrator, though. Considering doing a NG+ with it, to do the new Omega DLC that is dropping some time soon. As expected, you go with Aria to take back Omega, and it's meant to be bigger than Leviathan, I believe. And it adds a female turian to the roster, but only for the DLC missions, I believe. I'm really looking forward to it. Apart from multiplayer shenanigans, ME3 was a thoroughly enjoyable and worthwhile experience for me, h8rs be damned


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## BoxRoom (Nov 28, 2012)

Mrs BoxRoom downloaded the Omega DLC so now we're back playing this all proper again 
It's good to see my old Space Bastard again! Still finding it difficult to choose the renegade options.
I'm pretty certain Space Bastard ain't getting his leg over at the end of this. He keeps saying no to potentials!
Berk.


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## Vintage Paw (Mar 12, 2013)

I've just started the Omega DLC, and I've got the final Citadel DLC too. I hear it's basically like crackfic, and is hilarious.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 8, 2013)

I've finally got around to playing the multiplayer.

It's lots of fun. Finding some good areas to hold out as long as possible solo as well is a good laugh. I've got no further than wave 6 on bronze solo so far, but then I'm pretty new to it. I've got an EDI styled infiltrator (called Siri, lol) who has the most delightful snap freeze power. UNF.

Does anyone play it much? I usually play with someone I know, we both started out together so we both have low level characters, which is good fun.


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## captainmission (Dec 10, 2013)

Vintage Paw said:


> I've finally got around to playing the multiplayer.
> 
> It's lots of fun. Finding some good areas to hold out as long as possible solo as well is a good laugh. I've got no further than wave 6 on bronze solo so far, but then I'm pretty new to it. I've got an EDI styled infiltrator (called Siri, lol) who has the most delightful snap freeze power. UNF.
> 
> Does anyone play it much? I usually play with someone I know, we both started out together so we both have low level characters, which is good fun.



I played it quite a bit when the game first came. I played the drell vanguard cos flipping around was great fun and you can set up you own biotic combos. Really high risk but alot of fun.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 10, 2013)

I got an Asari vanguard, it was a lot of fun, but I died so hard XD Maybe once I've got a bit better at it.

I'm mostly using the awesome Alliance Infiltration Unit (EDI) because she's rock solid. Tactical cloak, which feels like cheating, tbh, and her repair matrix or whatever it's called, which is a grenade power weirdly, so it can be resupplied at the ammo box, and fortifies shields as well as making you get up with full health if you die while it's active. Again, cheating! Snap freeze is good fun, but I didn't evolve it to get extra range, so I have to get reasonably close to use it, but with those other two powers that's no problem at all.

I'm liking the Vancouver map at the moment - lots of space to run the fuck away when you're swarmed, and confuse them as to where you are. It takes a good long while for Atlases (mostly playing against Cerberus at the moment) to get to you if you're out of missiles, so you can mop up the mooks and then chip away at it from cover. Phantoms are fucking cunts, but as long as you stay a respectable distance away from them and don't get caught in cover by them from behind they can go down reasonably quickly. 

I've been soloing (bronze) quite a bit, but have yet to get past wave 10, and most of the time don't make it past wave 6 because I seem to always get the worst fucking missions when I'm alone. Escort is my favourite somewhere like Firebase White, because there are lots of narrow spaces and it only funnels a few enemies at a time at you, but escort is a bitch in Vancouver because it's far more open. I hate the targets mission. I'm ambivalent about the hacking ones... luck of the draw as to whether they spawn in useful places or not.

I was really lucky to get the AIU with my first pack... reading on the forums it seems she's most people's favourite for soloing. She's level 16 right now, once I get to 20 I'll promote her and follow a guide to set her up to be rock solid.


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## captainmission (Dec 10, 2013)

Is there still many people playing it? it used to be easy to get a 4 man team. Not sure how the new characters change things but it use to be all about biotic explosions- 3 adepts setting up warps and a vanguard detonating.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 10, 2013)

I don't know, I haven't been into a public lobby yet (I get stage fright, so have either been soloing or playing with one other person I know). Once I've got a bit more experience under my belt I might have a go. The BSN multiplayer forum seems busy enough.


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## captainmission (Dec 13, 2013)

four player is a lot of fun and if you start in the bronze group there's not much expectation


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## Epona (Dec 13, 2013)

Vintage Paw said:


> I don't know, I haven't been into a public lobby yet (I get stage fright, so have either been soloing or playing with one other person I know). Once I've got a bit more experience under my belt I might have a go. The BSN multiplayer forum seems busy enough.



I find the idea of doing something multiplayer with people I don't know utterly terrifying!  My OH is well into it though, he spends quite a lot of his gaming time playing multiplayer games (co-op shooters, or racing games) with people on Steam, either those on his friends list (most of whom he only knows as a username), or randoms that he doesn't know at all.


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## moon (Dec 2, 2014)

Guess what has arrived!!! Loving every minute of it so far!!!


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 3, 2014)

Yay!!!

I really love ME3. Are you using your save where Tali is dead?


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## moon (Dec 3, 2014)

I started a brand new fresh game with no saves.

I love love love this game, so nice to hear Kaiden's voice again, but such a shame that Anderson may not be in the game..
I've played up until reaching the Citadel with an injured Kaiden, I loved carrying him on my back to get him to hospital 

However I'm going to restart the game as I realised that my femshep has a face that is too big for her body and it's annoying me, so I'm making a new one.. plus my wireless controller ran out of batteries so I was using a fake wired Microsoft controller and it sucks! Will get some new batteries on the way home tonight.

So far the pace has been perfect with lots of running around doing things and progressing to a predetermined place, I'm not sure if it's as open as ME1 and I cant seem to talk to as many people ie teammates just yet, nor have I been able to look around the Normandy, I'm curious to know what they have done to it and to see Joker etc.
I really don't like that man, what's his name, James? He gives me the creeps, I'm hoping that if I shout at him enough he will leave me alone..

I am soooo pleased I have this game and am hoping it may see me through until January so will be doing all the side quests etc..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 3, 2014)

Glad you're liking it! I think the Mass Effect franchise is my favourite (between this and Dragon Age). I like the tighter style (which is interesting, considering how much I love Skyrim).

The Normandy is a bit more interesting than in 2. And it's blue inside again <3 I hated that they got rid of that soft blue palette in 2, but I guess that's harsh, cold Cerberus for you. And they got rid of a lot of the level loading stuff that was in 2 as well. I really, really hated that.

Talking about cinematic dialogue (as we were in the DAI thread), this game is the one I think they've been most successful. You'll often leave cinematic-style dialogue and the camera will really naturally just pan back and all of a sudden you're back in the game and in control of Shepard. It's really nicely done. Such a little feature, but an important one.

What do you mean Anderson may not be in the game? He's right there at the very beginning.  You see more of him. I love having Hackett back. I missed him from the first game.

I love the bit where you bring Kaidan back to the Normandy, and Liara is trying to get your attention over his bed in med bay. I love the way they animated that.

As for James, idk, I thought he was fine. He's Iron Bull, you know. I saw someone make a qunari who looked just like Vega -- I really, really hope he romanced Iron Bull.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 3, 2014)

OH!

If you're having issues using the character creator (which, frankly, sucks arse): http://mass-effect-3.facesofgaming.com/

They've changed the format since I last used it, so I'm not sure how easy it is to navigate, but basically people upload their face codes for their Shepards. Some require the PC version and a couple of mods, but a lot of them are just vanilla codes. Let others do the work so you don't have to!


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## moon (Dec 3, 2014)

I thought Anderson's vehicle was blown to bits by a reaper as it was taking off??


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 3, 2014)

One tip I have for making Shepards: give her a chin. The amount of Sheps I see with such godawful proportions, it makes me weep. Bring that chin down, raise the mouth up (if that's an option, can't remember), give the features room to live. There should be more face than features.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 3, 2014)

moon said:


> I thought Anderson's vehicle was blown to bits by a reaper as it was taking off??



Oooh, no. That was just the poor little kid. He didn't get in it.


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## moon (Dec 3, 2014)

Vintage Paw said:


> OH!
> 
> If you're having issues using the character creator (which, frankly, sucks arse): http://mass-effect-3.facesofgaming.com/


I would dearly love to have my first ever femshep (ME1) back, she was the best one I ever made.


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## moon (Dec 4, 2014)

It turns out that my wireless xbox controller was broken!! Less than a year old.
Have a replacement one now from Argos (no charge) Bloody Microsoft!!


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 4, 2014)

Oh no!! I always used my wireless controller with a rechargeable pack while plugged in, defeating the object entirely, but the console came with that controller so I just went with it. It gets a bit temperamental these days, refusing to switch on the little red light that tells me it's charging, but it's not let me down yet. I've had it, and the console, since 2007 (or maybe 2008)!


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## moon (Dec 5, 2014)

Quick question, have your played on story mode?
Do I get more options for talking to people in this mode, ie talking to random people on the citadel, talking to team mates etc?


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 5, 2014)

I haven't. It's my understanding that it just lets you see the story aspect without bothering about combat. There's no more story or extra dialogue, it's just super easy mode. It might even be that some of the combat doesn't happen at all, I'm not sure. There will be zero challenge. The only way you'll lose a fight is if you literally don't bother to shoot at all.

Action mode, by comparison, is all about the combat, and you don't have to pick any dialogue options except for ones that involve major decisions, so it plays out more like a cutscene from a third person shooter.

RPG mode is the whole shebang. You pick all the dialogue options, and you also fight like a normal game (picking easy, normal, hard or insanity as your difficulty options).

Clearly, RPG is the _proper_ way to play it


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## moon (Dec 9, 2014)

This game is going well 
I cured the genophage, although Wreav didn't make it an easy decision for me, I was hoping that Eve would add some balance to the equation.. Mordin was also brilliant, and I'm glad the Krogans are on board.. I also saved the Rachni, they are helping towards our efforts  hoping the Geth will join too although Tali will hate me.. 

Am still waiting for Kaiden to get out of hospital, am really hoping he can join me on the Normandy.. James is still a creep, especially since he made nasty comments about Eve, and Garrus seems a little less arrogant so we are getting on a bit better. I met up with Miranda on the Citadel but as I really can't stand her I didn't offer to help with anything..
Still don't know how EDI got into that body and am a bit wary of taking her out on missions as she's supposed to be running the ship 

That's it for now.. am playing this game very slowly as I don't want it to end


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 9, 2014)

You had Wreav instead of Wrex? I've not done it that way. I wouldn't want to! Wrex is my bud <3


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 9, 2014)

Also, "Would... have liked to run tests on seashells."

T__T


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## moon (Dec 9, 2014)

Vintage Paw said:


> You had Wreav instead of Wrex? I've not done it that way. I wouldn't want to! Wrex is my bud <3


My Wrex died in ME1, Ashley shot him.. I didn't know there was an option to not have him die.. ( although I am playing ME3 as a fresh game with no save data etc)
Wreav is like a grown up version of Grunt and a total nightmare.. although I suspect his bark is worse than his bite..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 9, 2014)

Default world states tend to have some really weird inclusions, things that most players would never have in their own save games. I don't know why they do that. Sadism? 

Yes, you can talk Wrex/Ashley down on Virmire. There is generally always an "everything is good, everyone likes you, no one dies" outcome available in BioWare games. Of course, that didn't help Mordin (nor my poor, broken, bereft heart). T__T


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## moon (Dec 10, 2014)

Arrgh, I finally got Kaidan back onto the Normandy but he is annoyed with me for shooting Udina and there is a lack of trust between us, I visited him in the starboard observation lounge and the first thing he said was that EDI looked fit!! I ran out and ended the game..
So am thinking of redoing the mission and having him shoot Udina instead..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 10, 2014)

I think you'll be okay regardless, but it is quite nice letting him do it. Although, at the same time, it's very cathartic doing it yourself. Fucking Udina 

OH! Have you ever seen these?



Enable subtitles. (You'll need to watch on youtube)


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 10, 2014)

This one's better:


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## moon (Dec 10, 2014)

So funny  makes me want to play ME1 again... sigh.. love the music...
The graphics actually look better than in ME3, smoother, maybe less realistic but much more easy on the eye I think.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 10, 2014)

I think ME3's face textures/models were a downgrade on ME2. Everyone looks like they are modelled from clay, with finger indentations from your toddler left behind  

And yes, ME1 music is THE Mass Effect music, imo.


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## moon (Dec 10, 2014)

Am listening to this whilst at work editing historical footage, I really want to add it into some nasa moon mission clips


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## moon (Dec 10, 2014)

This track


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## moon (Dec 11, 2014)

So, I had dinner with Kaidan at the Presidium, and we discussed our feelings for one another  I then suggested that we go back to the Normandy and he just disappeared!! 

So I had a good look around the Citadel, I love the Presidium area and the way you can pick up new missions by listening in on conversations, I want as many as possible.. But don't like they way some are locked out once you do those marked priority.
I had a dance at Purgatory, Shepard can move! and watched as Joker and EDI got jiggy on the dancefloor, although EDI seemed to stand around doing nothing, I guess she's not used to having a body..

I somehow managed to do a mission for Aria.. I didn't want to but at least I got to see a Vorcha again, those hysterical creatures are hilarious. Still haven't managed to find a Hanar or speak to an Elcor, for some reason those 2 species are part of the Citadel ecosystem for me and it's strange not to see or talk to them. Am also missing riding in the elevators..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 11, 2014)

There is an Elcor you absolutely must speak to. You don't get a chance to until late-ish in the game. He's near Udina's and Bailey's offices.

As for Hanar... one word:

BLASTO.

I'll leave you to find that out for yourself.

And yeah, I don't do priority missions until I've done all the little side things, because some will move the story on and you lose everything else. Except for the Grissom Academy mission. I do that pretty quickly after getting it, because if you don't... a thing happens.


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## moon (Dec 11, 2014)

I really wanted to do the Grissom mission... but it disappeared!! sobs...
How big is the thing that happens? I will defo be doing a replay of 1-3 in succession so can make up for any 'lost' missions then..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 11, 2014)

It's quite a big mission. Is Jack alive in your playthrough? She's there if you go. Also the guy from the Overlord DLC in ME2, David Archer. He's in it, albeit briefly. And I guess only if you saved him. (Who wouldn't save him? MONSTERS, THAT'S WHO )

The thing that happens if you don't go may or may not relate to Jack  Just remain observant later on.


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## moon (Dec 11, 2014)

No both Jack and Thane are dead in a fresh ME3 game..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 11, 2014)

Ah, don't worry about Grissom, then.

Although with Thane dead... you have a tearjerker coming up for another minor yet well-loved fan favourite (unless he's dead in a default game too... not sure how that works).


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## Humberto (Dec 11, 2014)

I liked Jack as well. Liara is a bit dull, plus Jack was kicking arse for me in ME2. Just got up to the bit when Garrus reappears.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 12, 2014)

Liara is a bit dull. I become 'strident' when talking about her, because she was pushed as the canon romance, and because she was the only same-gender romance option for 2 games, and when questioned about it some arseholes at the company protested "BUT ASARI AREN'T EVEN FEMALE."

To that I say YOU ARE A MASSIVE FUCKING TITWEASEL FUCK OFF. Asari were created for titillation. Fuck the fuck off, you fucking fucker.

Anyway. I thought her romance was very sweet in ME3 and I really quite liked her in that game.

But the best romance goes to Kaidan and manShep. And a thousand fans are vindicated in their choice of top in slash.

I digress.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 12, 2014)

Incidentally, Liara's voice actor plays Scout Harding in Inquisition. <3


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## moon (Dec 12, 2014)

I did actually find some remastered NASA footage, so put it with the Mass Effect 1 theme tune and added some other space footage..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 12, 2014)

ngl, that made me tear up 

The Mass Effect 1 soundtrack is my favourite soundtrack of all time. I've listened to it more than I care to admit. It's very emotional.


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## moon (Dec 13, 2014)

Whoa.. Reaper..lazer in yer face. 
And GETH..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 13, 2014)

Geth ftw.

You still doing that quest?

Looking forward to what you think of it.


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## moon (Dec 13, 2014)

I finished the quest  Loved everything involving the geth and q'uarians, best bit so far..
Had to learn a few tactics for the reaper as i kept being killed.
I really don't want this game to end..


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## moon (Dec 14, 2014)

I dont think I'll ever look at a Diving Beetle larvae in quite the same way again


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## moon (Dec 14, 2014)

Am sneaking in missions whilst waiting for paint to dry (trying to paint 2 canvases simutaneously)
Just finished the Thessia mission 
Still the missions are getting more and more interesting, as well as more emotional. I'm going to be a mess by the end of the game, especially since Kaidan is being elusive as ever. I nearly had a heart attack thinking he had died, but he was hiding in the games room playing cards with James.. sobs..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 14, 2014)

Thessia is amazing. Really amazing.

Did you ever listen to the various people around the Citadel? Have you been listening to a woman at the desk in the council office area? It makes Thessia even more


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 14, 2014)

Oh god, and the woman in the medical area who has PTSD. So incredibly sad.


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## moon (Dec 14, 2014)

Listening to the ME soundtrack, playing missions, wondering what will happen when the game ends, the whole Quarian thing and now Thessia, is all too much.
But I am loving every minute of the game..
Do you think they will re-make it for next gen? Maybe with some more missions?


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 14, 2014)

They've been talking about redoing the trilogy for new gen, but it would unlikely be with anything new - just all 3 games as they are, but with an increase in horsepower and therefore maybe slightly nicer visuals. I'd expect all dlc will be packaged with as well.


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## moon (Dec 14, 2014)

Ok, i've yet to play any DLCs at all, so will do that when I play 1-3 again...


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 14, 2014)

There are some really good ones, and some not so good ones. 

Bring Down the Sky in 1 is pretty good. Pinnacle Station is mostly shite, but you can get some of the best upgrades and gear in the game at the end of it.

ME2 had some cracking dlc. Lair of the Shadow Broker is the best, most definitely. Overlord, the one I mentioned before with David Archer is pretty good too. Arrival, however... meant to bridge between ME2 and 3... it's just... diabolical. But it has Hackett, so vaguely worth playing through once, while crying and rocking backwards and forwards in despair 

I like all of ME3's dlc. Leviathan is really quite interesting re the reapers. Omega is good for one of the characters, Nyreen - our first female turian. It feels like it really, really should have been in the main game, though. Likewise with From Ashes. Citadel was the final one they released - and it's basically the fan service wrap party  Lots of fun, hijinks, and awesomeness. Best left until reasonably late in the plot so you've met/recruited/dealt with all your old pals. It has a fabulous moment with Sam in the actual plot part of it. There's lots of non-plot stuff to it as well, that basically involves having a party and chatting with your pals. Lots of laughs.


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## moon (Dec 14, 2014)

So should I play the Me3 dlc now, or wait till i've finished, or wait till i replay the game? I never know how these things work.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

Well that's up to you. It's difficult to know where they best fit in the general flow of the main story. Citadel is best left until quite late. Omega makes sense after you've done everything possible for Aria. I generally do Leviathan some time before Omega... but the good thing about Leviathan is you don't have to do it all in one go (you do with Omega - it takes you to... well, Omega!).

None of them were out when I first played the game, so you're not necessarily missing anything by not playing them the first time round. Then again, if I had them sitting there I'd not be able to play the game without playing them as well


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## satchmo (Dec 15, 2014)

You just reminded me that I downloaded Citadel about 2 months ago and never tried it. I sank over 1000 hours into multiplayer for me3 but I never played any of the single player DLCs.


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## moon (Dec 15, 2014)

Managed to get to the final Earth mission last night, so will do the DLC on an immediate replay!!
Speaking to Liara made me  :'(


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## moon (Dec 15, 2014)

Finished.. crying..
This game make me want to go and hug people in the street...


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

*gives moon a big hug*

So what did you choose in the end?


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## moon (Dec 15, 2014)

I had 2 choices and chose to kill the Reapers, as much as I love the Geth etc, there was something about the whole Tali thing that really got me, plus what was the point of the whole 3 games etc etc if the reapers were not killed, plus I hate the IM and love cpt anderson etc etc etc... Crying..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

Oooh, you only got 2 options. Next time through, make sure you do absolutely everything, monitor your war readiness. There are 3 options. I'm interested to know what you would have picked had you had all 3 as a choice.


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

Incidentally, I've never chosen 'destroy' and never will. I've chosen 'control' a couple of times, but the third option you didn't get is my canon.


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## moon (Dec 15, 2014)

Yes I did too many priority missions quickly.
Will reply re choices later when I'm recovered


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## moon (Dec 15, 2014)

Well, I'm not fully recovered, and have also recently returned from xmas drinks!! 
I had a huge long list of reasons for killing the reapers and was going to write a mini essay but then couldn't be bothered  it included things such as access to technology, user motivation, humanity, physiological evolution, spiritual development, energy sources, code corruption etc etc...
But a lot of my decision boiled down to one line spoken fairly on in the game.
I think it was even my femshep who said it whilst on the Citadel, it was something like.
"lets see if we can find someone intelligent who is *worth* talking to"
I laughed at the time..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

See, moon. You *get* it. I might disagree with you about your decision at the end and your reasoning for it, but I absolutely LOVE that you want to write a mini-essay about it. I dread to think the hours and hours I've spent discussing Mass Effect in such detail with people. I LOVE that the game trilogy has so much to it that you can riff on philosophy and politics, ethics and morality - I love that there's a muddy grey area when it comes down to what one person might defend as morally right and justifiable as opposed to what another might argue for. I LOVE that BioWare made us care so much about it. Their games have flaws, good god do they have flaws, but they bring a whole other level of content than what you simply play through. They are the gifts that keep on giving 

I reckon once you've played through again and got all three possible endings you should have a read of the 'controversy' that followed ME3. I'm interested to know what you'll make of it all (although at the same time I kind of don't ever want to hear about that damned controversy ever again ).


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

Also, please go ahead when you are better recovered, if you want to of course, and put down all those thoughts about the game and your choice of ending. I'd be fascinated to know about it all!


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

And I think my decision mostly came down to one or two lines spoken in the game as well, spoken by EDI, who I think was an absolutely brilliant character in ME3. Perhaps she was there to manipulate me into thinking I had to pick a particular option. Well, if so it worked  

Tbf, it simply reiterated the themes I'd been discussing and interested in since ME1, but it made them more tangible coming in the form of EDI. Made them more _human_ I suppose (heh).


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 15, 2014)

Man, I should really play through all 3 again sometime.


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## moon (Dec 16, 2014)

I've just been reading about the indoctrination theory and thought it made sense etc but would like to do another playthrough before considering it further, (also the whole purgatory bar thing was just weird).
What do you think of it?


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 16, 2014)

I think indoctrination theory is a ridiculous attempt to grasp at straws while people were stamping their feet that they demanded BW rewrite the ending for them.



At the time it was a crazy place to be, the ME fandom.

Basically there was an epic shit storm of enormous proportions, because some people really, really, really hated the way the game ended. 

They hated that you had to make a choice the way you did (known as the RGB ending).
They hated what the choices were. 
They hated that there wasn't an unequivocal 'good' ending. 
They hated that Shepard died. 
They hated that they didn't get to ride off into the sunset and have "little blue babies" (direct quote) with Liara. 
They hated the starchild (which, I'll give them that to an extent - I don't think he worked as well as BW had hoped as a figure, although I appreciated what they were attempting to do: tapping into Shepard's subconscious guilt, building up the huge pressure on her shoulders - the pressure of the fate of the entire galaxy all down to her actions, as envisaged through how she failed that one little boy at the beginning in Vancouver - the huge and the small). 
They hated that they had to make a morally grey choice, one that might actually see them having to press a button that TIM wanted her to press (although of course, that scene where she sees flashbacks of Anderson and TIM I think is nicely done: in my mind it's forcing you to re-evaluate everything you've been thinking up until that moment, forcing you to question your own motivations, forcing you to try to step into TIM's shoes and understand why he did the things he did (he's not a black/white character after all), forcing you to look honestly at the good in bad situations, and the bad in good situations).
They believed that the themes contained in the ending choices had absolutely nothing to do with what the trilogy had _really_ been about. Now, just fuck off. Seriously. Fuck off.

I have no problem with people disliking something that I like. Indeed, I try to be critical of the things I like as well. I was ME3's biggest detractor before I played it  But the way in which this shitstorm happened was childish and full of the basest kind of entitlement. They were _demanding_ that BW go back and rewrite the game for them. They were trying to sue them under trade descriptions. The shitstorm was so bad, they made so much noise, that BW capitulated and released an 'Extended Cut' that added in a few bits to the end (some of which I liked, some of which felt like hand-holding nonsense and took away some of the gravitas of the ending). The shitstorm was so bad that it's become some kind of self-fulfilling thing now - everyone just _knows_ ME3 was awful, it's a trufax just like the earth is round and orbits round the sun.

I found the end choices fascinating. 

You get to choose to carry out your original mission regardless of what you've learned since you set out on that path - a decision that will cause the death of beings you've come to know as friends - a decision that will cause the death of beings you've been asked to consider the sentience and personhood of. Legion will die. EDI will die. But there will never be a reaper threat again - unless such a thing emerges of its own accord thousands of years down the line. You won't be able to do anything about that though. Here's hoping. Because remember, there are constant cycles of conflict between organics and synthetics. What will killing the reapers and all synthetic life in the immediate do for the future? You don't stop the cycle, you just stop the reapers being able to avert one type of catastrophe.

Or you can choose to control the reapers, like the starchild before you, essentially rewriting their purpose. This ending forces you to explore how and why they were created - the fact that they aren't unequivocally 'bad', but that their purpose is so alien to us that it's hard for us to justify it or even to understand it. It's like a protozoa trying to understand string theory - it's not just that it can't quite grasp it, but that there is no way it can hope to understand something it has no capacity to understand. So it forces you to make some sort of leap of faith. You can control the reapers, but you would do so not really understanding what you're doing, not really understanding what they are, but knowing that it would make you the 'shepherd' of life in the galaxy. But, would you, one day, end up justifying doing something like the starchild did? How can you take that chance? How can you unilaterally decide that you will become the guardian of the galaxy? That you personally will invest yourself of all that power? And that you will wield it justly? But on the flip side, how can you unilaterally decide to kill all the geth and EDI - basically to preside over the genocide of an entire race (especially since preventing and righting the wrongs of genocide has been a constant theme of the games)? There are no easy answers here.

Or you can choose the third ending - synthesis. Synthetic and organic merge, removing the need for tension and (as the starchild suggests) inevitable conflict. Sounds like a great idea, removing the problem altogether, and causing a paradigm shift in the future of all life in the galaxy. I'm always drawn to this choice. Of course, it's not without its own problems too. Again, you're unilaterally making that decision for everyone, human, turian, salarian, geth, plants, shifty looking cows... the lot of them. No more cycles of organics versus synthetics, because everyone is as one. The possibilities for the future of technology and what it means to be alive are endless. But should you have that power? Is it right to alter the very fabric of life?

I could word-orgasm about these choices for hours. There are endless arguments for and against each of them. I have my preference, and I know others have theirs. I've chosen control and synthesis, and I prefer synthesis. I 'like' none of them, in the sense that none of them are unequivocally 'good'. None of them are 'right'. All require compromise. They require an exploration of your own morality. They sit uneasily with a lot of people precisely because in video games we make easy choices - kill the person or let them live, be good or be bad - and we want our choices to be black and white in real life too. But here we're presented with options that are dreadful. They are horrible. No one would want the weight of that choice on their shoulders. No one wants to do that to their Shepard. No one wants to have to think about those sorts of things in a video game. And yet here we are. They are forcing us to think. Forcing us to confront things that make us uncomfortable. And it's fucking amazing, 10/10, GOTY, fuck, GOTD (decade) as a result.

So, er, yeah, that's what I think


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## moon (Dec 16, 2014)

I'm still in a state about this, the Indoctrination theory shitted me up a bit, I couldn't sleep last night thinking about it.. for example why was Anderson at the Citadel? Why was there just a blank space when Liara 'shared memories'?.. blah blah blah.. I had nightmares about a hum coming from the fridge in my kitchen and was then too scared to go and get a glass of water..  it has turned a game I love into something more sinister...

Also I stand by my choice to destroy the reapers, and I do think EDI and the Geth helped inform this. I mean the Geth are cool and I do love them, but in much in the same way as I love my new cool Iphone. I don't want to hug it though.. Plus whenever I took EDI out on a mission there were times when 2 EDIs were fighting, one wearing black the other  blue, one of them didn't have a head... I'm not going to put my trust in something that can glitch up like that.. 
How do we know the reapers are even telling the truth about the cycle and could we ever control them?

BTW in your ending did you see the Normandy crash into a tropical forest type area and the door begin to open?

I thought the ending was brilliantly crafted, if a bit too emotional for me. I don't understand the protests.. what was the alternative ending? Was it the Citadel DLC?

This..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 16, 2014)

Yep, the normandy crashed. Did anyone get out? That whole thing differs depending on what you do. If your war readiness is high enough, everyone survives except Shep. EDI (if you didn't choose destroy) and Joker will emerge from the Normandy, followed by your love interest (if you have one). It makes the whole scene a lot more emotional.

Citadel DLC isn't the extended cut. You might well have got the extended cut version by default. Did you get still art slides at the end depicting what happened throughout the galaxy? If so, that's the extended cut. It also offers you the option to not pick anything at all - you can reject everything that the starchild is telling you. Obviously, the reapers reap all life in the galaxy if you do that. They put that in because of all the childish kicking and screaming about not liking the choices on offer. "You don't like the game we've made? Fine, we'll give you another choice. You fail. Everyone dies. Everyone. Everything. Well done making your 3 games-worth of playthroughs utterly meaningless, wankers." It changes Liara's message-in-a-space-bottle to her telling future cycles that we failed, maybe you'll do better.

I might be minded to give IT more thought had it not come from the place it did. It didn't come from people honestly just thinking hmm, that would be really interesting. It came from the dark, nasty, spiteful, entitled place of the furor over the endings. Grasping at straws desperately trying to make sense of what they hated, trying to take back control of the game from BioWare. As far as I'm aware, BioWare have stayed largely silent on the IT thing, other than saying something like, "well, that's not what we intended but sure, whatever, if that's what you want to believe have fun."

I feel quite strongly about the ending stuff because apart from gamergate bullshit, it's some of the nastiest, darkest, shittiest stuff I've ever witnessed around gaming. It threatened the future of development - really. It was a group of loud entitled idiots asserting that developers have no right to make the game they want to make, that games are not art, that there can be no such thing as writer/developer vision. It wasn't enough that players have the right to critique the things they play - no, they were _demanding_ that they hold the power over the developers and that because they spent money on the game the developers are beholden to them in that they HAVE to go back and rewrite the whole thing or they will sue them.

There are plenty of things that exist in games that I hate. Rape, sexual objectification, etc. Those are things that demonstrably harm society, harm individuals, and if anything should be changed it's those. But I wouldn't ever expect a developer to go back and re-do their game. I would be loud in criticising these harmful things, and I would ask them to do better in the future. But I would not ask them to remake it. And that's for something that is harmful. But when a game had an ending a bunch of idiots didn't like... not a harmful ending, just a "where are my little blue space babies?" ending... then it has to be taken off the shelves, the devs punished, and the whole game re-done.

I've never been more disgusted by a display of sheer twattery.


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## moon (Dec 16, 2014)

No, the door of the Normandy partially opened and then the scene was cut..
I've have calmed down about the indoctrination thing as I thought (wrongly) that they were suggesting that Shepard was indoctrinated throughout the whole of ME3. I had thought back to when Shepard was watching video footage of the IM talking about rebuilding her and my femshep joked that she was actually a VI, and I had a mini panic.

I watched this 'documentary' and think it makes some compelling arguments. I wasn't there to see the fans descend into bullying tactics re the ending so am willing to keep an open mind about it.


Do you think the shit storm could have been the reason why Bioware chose to end ME at number 3? I mean they could make a 4th no problem but if they are going to have to face the barrage of complaints etc they may have decided just to end it there..


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## Vintage Paw (Dec 16, 2014)

No, it was always going to be a trilogy. They are currently making Mass Effect 4, but it will not be about Shepard. I can't see how they could have continued with that specific storyline after 3 anyway. 

I don't know when it will be based, whether during the same time period as the events in the trilogy, or after, or before. If it's after it'll be difficult to do, considering if you chose synthesis the whole galaxy will be entirely different, and if you chose destroy there will be no synthetic life at all. They _could_ pick a default, and that default could be control (since it has the least world-changing ramifications), but I doubt many people would be happy about that. I'll be interested to see what they do, if that's the case.


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## moon (Dec 17, 2014)

Deleted as it was all just clutching at straws etc.


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## moon (Dec 17, 2014)

Gonna take a break from this thread as the whole game ending etc is doing my head in and there is a real world out there.


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## moon (Dec 19, 2014)

Ok take 2, this is the post I deleted with _most_ of the crap removed 
I’ve been reading up on the Leviathans, and really think we should have been given this information in the main ME3 game rather than it being a DLC..
It mostly raised more questions though.

Why did the Leviathans create the Intelligence (an AI) when the whole reason they created it was to stop AIs destroying their creators? Knowing that it would try to destroy them? Were they really in full control of their mental abilities here??
Do all AI’s try to destroy their creators once they become aware of their lack of self determination? Some of the Geth who turned against their creators are now being 'temporarily' controlled by the reapers on a promise of true consciousness, freedom, choice.
Why do the Leviathans choose not to destroy the Reapers when they have the power to do so? Is that really their choice?

This is a theme of recursive self-similarity, that famous Mandelbrot equation and the cyclical/fractal nature of the universe.
There is no escape, the cycle just continues on differing magnitudes of scale.

And thinking about the ‘choices’ we are presented with at the end of the game, are they really choices?
Control the Reapers? To do what exactly and would we really be able to control them? The cycle would continue.
Synthesis? The Reapers are already a synthesis of organic and artificial, so the cycle would continue.
Destroy the Reapers? Then what?  Build some more AI's in the future? the cycle would continue.

I suspect that Bioware were well aware that this ending would create a shit storm, the fans turned on the creators of the game as they were given no real choice. The cycle continued.

I think Shepard is symbolic of someone who is strong willed enough to not be controlled, Shepard cannot be indoctrinated. This is why the Reapers were so interested in him/her and why the Catalyst/intelligence/annoying child needs him/her as the ultimate solution.. He/She can break the cycle. 'The Shepard' is an idea..
But what happens when you break cycles? When there is no control?
Chaos?
Then what?
The cycle continues?


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## moon (Dec 19, 2014)

They could have just ended the game like this


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## moon (Jan 8, 2015)

Doing another play through and had to post this


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 8, 2015)

Yup, did you know Mark Vanderloo was his face model? It's why most people call default male Shep Sheploo.


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## moon (Jan 8, 2015)

Am looking forward to doing a 1-3 playthrough as a male shep... is its very different?
Am doing this ME3 replay as a femshep but changing some of my choices ie siding with Tali etc etc, have done all the mission DLCs except Citadel and Omega.
Javic was a bit of a surprise..
leviathan... I had watched the actual meeting on youtube..

Am thinking of doing the citadel dlc just before earth mission.. maybe instead of..


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 9, 2015)

Javik caused a bit of consternation since he was day 1 dlc. I have some sympathy for dlc because I've taken the time to read about dev life cycles and so on, but this is one I'll let myself get grumpy over. I mean, considering exactly what he is, I'd say he's rather fucking important. Maybe it doesn't change the main story, but it certainly changes your understanding of the universe and previous cycles.


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## moon (Jan 9, 2015)

Javik is sooo 2 dimensional though.. having only marginally more depth than the worm-like Vorcha!! And makes Jacob seem 4 dimensional in comparison!! He did make me laugh though, when he suggested I throw Legion out of the airlock!

I still think Leviathan should have been included in the main game, it would have also made a superb ending.. work with the Reaper creators to destroy them then choose to destroy the Leviathans, or not.. closing with Shepard's hand hovering over the destroy button, then at least we would have had a chance for a Shepard led ME4.


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 9, 2015)

They never intended Shep to have more than 3 games, so that's a moot point really. As much as people love Shepard, she was never going to be in ME4. It was a trilogy from the beginning.


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## moon (Jan 9, 2015)

<throws toys out of pram> 
Well I'm still looking forward to ME4, hoping, hoping for a 2015 release..


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 9, 2015)

I'm doubtful it'll be before 2016. I hear they may have some pre-alpha playable footage at an upcoming event, but 'tis just a rumour.

I'd far rather they take longer to release it if it means it's higher quality, than rush it out to sate our ME needs. They're changing the engine and format (taking on board what they've learned from developing DAI), so it'll take some finessing and they'll be under the spotlight after the RGB furore.


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## 8ball (Jan 9, 2015)

moon said:


> I really don't want this game to end..



Given the fucking ending you should stop before it looks like it's going to.

...is what I'm obv too late in saying...


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 9, 2015)

-_-


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## moon (Jan 9, 2015)

8ball said:


> Given the fucking ending you should stop before it looks like it's going to.
> 
> ...is what I'm obv too late in saying...


Ive already played through it once before 
Read upwards..


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## moon (Jan 9, 2015)

Vintage Paw said:


> I'm doubtful it'll be before 2016. I hear they may have some pre-alpha playable footage at an upcoming event, but 'tis just a rumour.
> 
> I'd far rather they take longer to release it if it means it's higher quality, than rush it out to sate our ME needs. They're changing the engine and format (taking on board what they've learned from developing DAI), so it'll take some finessing and they'll be under the spotlight after the RGB furore.



Ok, i'm following some bioware peeps on twitter etc so will hopefully get some morsels in the future.
In the meantime I've ordered DA2..


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## moon (Jan 11, 2015)

Playing the Citadel DLC, am loving the apartment and wishing I could use it irl..  a room for checking gmail, living room for youtube, another for blogs etc etc, but I guess it might get a bit boring running from room to room..
Enjoyed my dance with Kaidan too


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 11, 2015)

moon said:


> Ok, i'm following some bioware peeps on twitter etc so will hopefully get some morsels in the future.
> In the meantime I've ordered DA2..



I thought you were going to give DA2 a miss 

All 3 DA games are flawed, imo. Each has different flaws, too. 

In DAO the writing is really great, but the pacing is off a lot of the time. Once you get to the Landsmeet though, the pacing is a lot better, and the writing is really at its best. The combat is good if you really enjoy isometric and tactics, but crap if you're not into that. Mages feel good either way, tbh, but melee combat is shuffleshuffleshufflestab if you're not into playing it like a top-down tactics game. Some people like that, and that's fine! It's not my idea of fun though.

DA2's combat is a lot more enjoyable to me. Playing dw rogue is insanely satisfactory and heaps of fun. Warrior is the damp squib here, it just feels boring. They scaled back the tactics -- although they do still exist -- which isn't to everyone's taste. It's eminently more enjoyable when playing 'live'. Isometric camera is entirely gone though, which I think is a shame. That said, it never impeded my ability to handle tough fights. I play exclusively on hard. For me, the writing is just as good as in DAO, although I recognise the method of storytelling didn't gel with everyone (told after the events have finished, over 3 acts across 10 years). The pacing is where it shines though. They absolutely nailed the pacing compared to the other 2 games. Everything you do makes you feel like you're working towards a goal, and you're never far away from main story or major side quest content. It's a linear game, with no exploration. (Let's not forget there was no exploration in DAO either, it was just bigger -- the cries of it having far more varied environments are a case of rose-tinted glasses though - your 'crossed-swords' sudden stops as you were travelling across the map would be in the same 2 or 3 environments; you only had a handful of different major areas: denerim, redcliffe, brec forest, deep roads (frankly every inch of the deep roads looks the same), fade, the endless circle tower where every floor looks the same, ostagar, your origin area, etc. they all used the same bland assets and it certainly wasn't the diverse cornucopia of rich environments some people make it out to be after the fact!) But the fact it's so linear means they were able to better control the pacing of the story, and of things like your companion's stories. They evolve over the course of 10 years, and it feels a lot more natural and interesting than, say, being able to spam-ask Alistair 100 questions during your first 2 layovers at camp and have nothing new to say to him for the next 80 hours. That said, it wasn't nearly big enough as a game. Just having another two large areas to do content in would have made all the difference. And there is a _thing_ that happens at the end that makes NO SENSE at all if you side with the mages. NO SENSE. I try to make sense of it, and there are clues in the game that hint that all is not as it seems with this particular person, but...



Spoiler



GODDAMMIT ORSINO, WE'D WON, YOU TWAT



In DAI they've clearly taken the whole 'omg identical environments' criticism to heart. The environments are lush and beautiful and varied and HUGE. They've put so much work into making these amazing spaces. A screenarcher's dream, really. They've littered the whole game with more lore than you could imagine. Here's the problem though - it ends up being a game experienced through lore collection. The story seems reasonably interesting, but because of the sheer size of the environments and all the utterly pointless make-work side quests, you can play for 100 hours without touching the main story. And what you're doing in that time isn't interesting. Well, finding lore is. But the side quests for the most part have nothing at all to do with the main story. They might reference the condition the world is in, but they have no bearing on what you are actually doing in the main quest. You can leave every single side quest and it wouldn't matter. It's filler. Padding. The main antagonist might as well not exist. You see them near the beginning, and then you don't see them again until right at the end. In between that time there are 3 main story beats. I've done 2 of them, I'm about to do the third. One of them is interesting but I'd imagine doing it more than once will prove boring. It's political in nature, there's not a lot of fighting (which is fine, I like different types of gameplay), but it doesn't feel remarkably relevant, even though the game really tries to convince you that it is. The other one I've done is more interesting and spans a couple of different areas. It feels more directly related to the main story, you get to make "A Decision" that can pull at the old heartstrings depending on your world state that you've imported, but then it's done, and... idk. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of interesting content. Some of the companion stories are lovely and interesting. Some are ridiculously short and pointless and you feel utterly short changed. And the pacing... the pacing is the worst of all 3 games. A companion cutscene might last 20 seconds, and you might not have another one with them for 50 hours. Put end-to-end it might total a decent amount of content, but spread between so much _stuff_ it just gets lost and feels weak. If they had lost a couple of major exploration areas, added a couple more major story beats, tied companion and main story content to the remaining large exploration areas instead of putting most of it in their own map zones that you can never revisit, it would have felt a lot better. As for combat, at times DA2's felt better, at times DAI's feels better. I hear using a controller is the way to go, but I am begrudgingly sticking to m&kb and it's fine. There are no tactics at all to speak of now. Isometric camera is back but it's really not very good. They've got rid of the weirdly abseiling waves of enemies that were in DA2, but there is no more need for any kind of martial strategy. Just hit stuff and stay alive longer than it does. (Again, I'm playing on hard.) 

Overall (and bearing in mind I haven't finished DAI yet - sooooon), in terms of basic enjoyment of playing from start to finish out of the 3 games I prefer the experience of DA2. It hangs together the best, the combat is fun for the most part, the characters are interesting. DAI is the most visually stunning, and has the most lore to find. If it were 30% smaller and had 30% more story content, and if they had worked harder to tie that content together by focusing on pacing, I would have enjoyed it 60% more. I don't really know where to place DAO on my scale of enjoyment. The first time I played it I adored it. Subsequent runs have had me struggling to muster the motivation to make it through the Deep Roads or the Fade. If I can get to the Landsmeet, I'm golden, but I rarely can. That said, it _does_ hold together better in terms of pacing than DAI. When playing DAI for the first time, if you enjoy reading about lore and want to enrich your understanding of the world then I recommend exploring every area and doing every quest. On subsequent runs, I'd recommend ignoring 60% of the content for the sake of your sanity. I expect it feels like a very different (and more enjoyable) game if you don't actually play the full game. Don't even bother unlocking the Forbidden Oasis, and therefore don't even bother looking for shards.


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## moon (Jan 11, 2015)

I'm playing DA2 whilst waiting for a decent deal on a PS4 & DAI bundle 
I think next to storyline, companion cut scenes and interactions are perhaps the most important and enjoyable parts of the rpgs ive played so far, its a shame they may be few and far between in DAI.
Could you have a bug perhaps?
I'm going to treat DAI as an exploring game with some interesting characters etc. I'm not expecting it to be as good as ME3, and its sort of filling my time before the ME4 release which I'm hoping will be a perfect combination of exploring, story and characters.
However.. I am holding back a rant here... But why oh why oh why o why would you ever decide to kill off one of the most important protagonists in gaming history!
Do they think we can play me4 and just forget shepard ever existed, that we would not pay very good money to have our character ressurected.. Why would you shit on a rock solid gaming business model for the sake of? What exactly? 
I demand a future with more shepard stories in it!


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## moon (Jan 11, 2015)

In fact, if Bioware/EA don't make any new Shepard games then someone else should. It would be perfectly feasable with Kickstarter etc..


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## Chz (Jan 12, 2015)

I just started on it, and _holy crap_ is that an atrocious interface for the PC!


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 12, 2015)

moon said:


> In fact, if Bioware/EA don't make any new Shepard games then someone else should. It would be perfectly feasable with Kickstarter etc..



Only if they'd sell them the licence to her image. That would cost a pretty penny.



Chz said:


> I just started on it, and _holy crap_ is that an atrocious interface for the PC!



I've heard that a lot, but I don't have too many problems with it. You can tell it's a straight console port, what with the inventory scrolling and so on, but the wailing of "omg it's unplayable" (by others, not you) is a little overblown


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 12, 2015)

moon said:


> I'm playing DA2 whilst waiting for a decent deal on a PS4 & DAI bundle
> I think next to storyline, companion cut scenes and interactions are perhaps the most important and enjoyable parts of the rpgs ive played so far, its a shame they may be few and far between in DAI.
> Could you have a bug perhaps?
> I'm going to treat DAI as an exploring game with some interesting characters etc. I'm not expecting it to be as good as ME3, and its sort of filling my time before the ME4 release which I'm hoping will be a perfect combination of exploring, story and characters.
> ...



There's always fanfic 

It was always meant to be a trilogy. They set out to tell a specific story, and that's what they did. I love Shepard, trust me, I really do. The first game has a very special place in my heart, indeed the whole series does, in ways I'm not prepared to talk about because they're too personal. Believe me, _I'm invested_. 

But I'm glad they stuck to 3 games. 

I would have hated Shepard to have been forced into sequel after sequel just to chase the money. And would you have been able to have Shepard without constantly resurrecting their LI for each game? If you've committed to Kaidan, then you're either going to have to bring him back for every game as well, or create a reason for you to break up, possibly against the player's wishes, so that they can have new LIs, fresh companions instead of the same group game in, game out. It worked in 2 because it was able to fit the story, and there had been a limited group of LIs in the first game to begin with. Imagine having to bring back the whole cast of 3 for each game, because you'll piss off people who have committed to LIs if you don't.

And how do you really create a story worthy of Shepard after this trilogy? There can be nobody more important to history than Shepard. So what stories do we give them now? Chasing a crime syndicate across the galaxy? Pfft, Shepard won't get out of bed for less than enslavement of an entire culture. How could you possibly do Shepard justice after ME3? 

Shepard's not going anywhere. The trilogy will always be there. Only now, we get the chance to meet someone new and experience their rise to awesomesauce as well. 

--

As for companion interaction, no, it's not a bug. Some of them are quite well fleshed out, but because the game is so huge those cutscenes get swamped by huge expanses of nothing. Some of the companion stories are really, really short and feel thoroughly unworthy of a game with such scope. They are still well-written, for what they are. The companions are still engaging. But the content where you get to interact directly with them makes up such a small portion of the game. Which wouldn't matter necessarily if the main story took up a bigger chunk, but alas it doesn't.

Here's how companion dialogue/stories work:

I'll take Solas as my example, without giving anything away -- he's around from the very beginning, you don't have to go and recruit him. When you get to Haven (your first major camp/base) you can go and talk to him, and you'll get cutscene dialogue, meaning it's more cinematic, it fades into it and back out of it once you're done. It lasts a few minutes, as long as it takes for you to ask however many questions are queued up. Once it's over, you can talk to him again whenever you want, but it doesn't trigger a cutscene, you're still 'in the game' iyswim. You have a couple of dialogue trees to go down, but they're not very extensive. After some story stuff, you might get one more cinematic with him. Once you're at your next major base (the one you're at for the majority of the game), you will get another short cutscene with him, which is a bit different, it teleports you somewhere totally different. You get a couple of lines of dialogue, a couple of things to ask, and then it teleports you back (but to somewhere different than where you initiated the conversation - it does that a lot, it's annoying since your base is so fucking huge and a bastard to navigate). I think you get maybe 1 or 2 other cutscenes with him. The rest is a couple of dialogue trees, that you can exhaust in about 3 minutes. His personal quest is ridiculous. He tells you X is a thing that has happened and he would like help with it. You can make a bee-line for the place, but when you are given that quest you'll likely still be too low levelled for the area it's in. It depends how often you speak to him, I guess. When you finally get to the area where X is, you get a 30 dialogue with an NPC, you get to kill something, another 30 second dialogue with an NPC, and it's over. That's it. Done. You talk to Solas for 1 minute when you get back to base. Over and done with.

Or Vivienne's. She asks you to find something for her, which involves killing something in an area you've probably already been to. So you kill it, get the thing. If she's in your party, she doesn't comment on it at all. You get back to base, you give her the thing. It triggers a cutscene in a different part of the world that you are not in, it lasts for 30 seconds, and it's over. You get a short conversation with her afterwards. That's it. You get maybe 3-4 cinematic cutscene dialogues with her throughout the whole game, and they don't last very long. 

I'm romancing Sera atm. I've had quite a few cutscenes with her, it's quite a sweet and amusing romance. The pacing is fucked to hell though. You can trigger one cutscene right after another if the conditions are met (which seems to be an unknown mix of approval rating (which is hidden) and having completed certain main story quests), which leads to awkward dialogue (it assumes you've been away for a while and not just been talking to her 30 seconds earlier), and breaks the feeling of pacing and natural progression. And then you can go hours and hours and hours with nothing new to say to each other. 

If the game was a lot shorter, with less stuff to occupy over 200 hours of wandering around killing things aimlessly, then all of these companion interactions might feel a lot better. It's difficult to judge, because clearly the pacing and the size of the game have a huge impact on how meaty the content that is there feels. It might be that it feels like there's less than there actually is. There might be more companion content there than in other games, in fact there probably is. But it's very badly implemented. It's not broken, this is by design.

I don't want to come across as a complete Debbie Downer. I _am_ enjoying the game, and I have several other characters planned for when I (finally) finish this one (not least because I've just learned a new screenshot technique and am looking forward to going through the game and putting it into practice ). BUT the game doesn't live up to its hype if what you come to a BW game for is a solid storytelling experience. It's very impressive in lots of other ways, and the writing - when you finally get to experience some of it - is exceptional for the most part (pointless antagonist aside) if rather short in its installments. I would recommend the game, with caveats.


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## moon (Jan 14, 2015)

Why did they make Kaidan come across as being really thick in the Citadel DLC?? hmm?? Most of his dialogue is pretty embarrassing, especially if I take Garrus and himself out with me 
Am re-playing as I originally went straight to the party without having any of the individual scenes etc, and it is also very funny..
And the female Turians.. ummm lol 

And this
'New Doctor Who character sure looks like Garrus from Mass Effect				   
Looks like the BBC has been doing calibrations.'
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...acter-sure-looks-like-garrus-from-mass-effect


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## kabbes (Jan 29, 2015)

Finally, finally got round to Mass Effect 3.  Why the fuck did I leave it so long after #2?  I forgot how amazing the Mass Effect games were.  

I'm about 25 hours in and making sure I hit every mission.  Good story-telling.  Great, even. Gods, I missed Joker's sardonic one-liners.  And my best mate Garrus.  And Mordin (wipes a tear).

Is Shepard the greatest fictional character ever created?  Why yes, I believe she is.  All the more so because she (alright, or he) is simultaneously a cipher for your preferred characterisation and yet also an incredibly strong and charismatic presence regardless of what route you choose.  A remarkable combination.


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## Vintage Paw (Jan 29, 2015)

Completely agree, kabbes - I've always been able to connect far better with Shep than I have with characters in games like Dragon Age, which are ostensibly supposed to be empty vessels for you to roleplay as you like. I prefer roleplaying with Shep. In terms of gameplay and storytelling, the Mass Effect series is my favourite ever. I admit though, in terms of game universe lore the Dragon Age series wins out.


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## emanymton (Feb 9, 2015)

moon said:


> Ok take 2, this is the post I deleted with _most_ of the crap removed
> I’ve been reading up on the Leviathans, and really think we should have been given this information in the main ME3 game rather than it being a DLC..
> It mostly raised more questions though.
> 
> ...


I am not much of a gamer these days but got a new laptop just before Christmas and decided to play through all 3 Mass Effect games as it is one of the few newish games that appealed to me. It has taken me a little over a month but I finished the third one last night. I agree about the ending, to me the ending was everything that happened after I was beamed to the citadel as the game aspect really finishes at that point. I think you are given just enough to interpret your own ending and any attempt by them to spell it out would be a bit of anti-climax really. The one thing that does bug me (and I think you mention it up thread) is the bit with the Normandy, where they running away from the battle or what?


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## kabbes (Feb 10, 2015)

I finished it at the weekend too. Wish I'd found out about the extended cut ending first though.

A tour de force, and Shepard is truly a legend.  It became clear with a way to go that there was only ever going to be one narratively appropriate way for her story to end and they didn't shy away from it.  In a way, the actual outcome is irrelevant because it's the hero's arc that matters and that completed it's course.

Best interactive storytelling yet.  Certainly the first time I personally have seen a love story in a computer game that is handled with any degree of subtlety or skill, even if it is still hardly Romeo and Juliet.


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## Vintage Paw (Feb 10, 2015)

That's absolutely how I feel about it, kabbes. The legend of Shepard will live on. I'm massively attached to the idea of Shepard (for reasons) and yet I knew her death, however it happens, is the proper culmination of the struggle and sacrifice she and others had made up until that point. This is a proper hero's epic, and how else do you guarantee the legend of a hero than through their ultimate sacrifice for the greater good?


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## Steel Icarus (Jul 26, 2015)

I got to the end and I have no idea where I was given the option to destroy, synthesize or control. So I shot the little AI dude and got a quick cut scene and the credit roll. What the fuck.

What happened to everyone? How do I leather the fucking Reapers?


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## Steel Icarus (Jul 26, 2015)

lol, never mind, just seen a walkthrough video, what a bellend. up the ramp of your choice. will do this later, though sitting thru the Illusive Man and freaky holo-god's dialogue is going to be tedious


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## moon (Jul 28, 2015)

Just don't read up on the indoctrination theory or watch any videos about it.. it messed up my head for ages 
I recently finished a 2nd play through of ME3 and finally got a chance to say goodbye to Kaidan  (he was missing in my first play through)
And as much as I originally hated ME2 its the only one I've replayed several times.. I think because of the graphics and general coolness of it.. Although ME1 was definitely the best game overall and ME3 the most epic..


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## Steel Icarus (Jul 28, 2015)

I finished it (properly), had a bit of tears at Shepard being added to the Wall of the Lost at the end, I've been attached to characters in games before now so not new to end-of-game feels but never this much. 

Naturally I have started again. This time I'm going to be renegady


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## moon (Jul 29, 2015)

S☼I said:


> I finished it (properly), had a bit of tears at Shepard being added to the Wall of the Lost at the end, I've been attached to characters in games before now so not new to end-of-game feels but never this much.



Just watching the opening scene of Mass Effect 1 has me in tears.. the music, watching shepard walk through the Normandy, the lighting. Joker's voice over the comms, Captain Anderson's voice discussing Shepard,  etc etc this is such an awesome awesome game... am hoping for as much greatness in Mass Effect Andromeda.. fingers crossed..


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## Vintage Paw (Jul 29, 2015)

I rewatched the Andromeda trailer the other day. They've said the N7 marine in it is _not_ the protag. So, my theory is they are the antagonist. That would be quite cool: we've been taught to venerate N7 through the trilogy, so to flip that on its arse would be great.


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## moon (Jul 29, 2015)

That could be cool, an enemy within sort of storyline, similar to Saren's betrayal. I'm still hoping to see an appearance from Shep though.. screw the continuity.. lol
I must admit that after playing the witcher 3 and hearing things about DAI (I've decided to play this over winter), I'm hoping it's not too much of an open world exploring game.. I would be up for a bit of shunting.. 
I've also realised that much of what makes this a great franchise is that most of the characters are so damn cool, they are people you would want to hang out with. Remember rocking up to the Citadel with Thane? Partying with Tali and Garrus, hanging with Dr Chakwas in the med bay. There is nothing cheesy about them, there are very few stereotypes, they are alive and complex.


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## moon (Jul 30, 2015)

So weird, I've been watching Christopher Odd play ME1(PC) on YouTube and firstly noticed that all the problems I had when I got my new TV with stuttering, jumping and tearing etc were due to the bad xbox 360 version of the game, I had thought there was something wrong with my tv.
I've also noticed that decryption of lockers etc is totally different.. he has a weird chronodex type puzzle whilst I had a 'Simon' type button sequence pressing decryption.. was mine a later edition or maybe the console version?


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## Vintage Paw (Jul 30, 2015)

PC and console had different hacking/unlocking minigames. Having played both, I prefer console. 

Same with Alpha Protocol (superb game -- many, many flaws but it's really good, I think you'd like it -- great example of how to do choice and consequence in a pretty seamless way without it being telegraphed) -- PC and console had different hacking minigames and it was apparently shitting awful on PC. I'd recommend it on 360.


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## moon (Jul 31, 2015)

I started a new ME1 game last night with a male shep for the first time  I turned off some of the graphics 'enhancements' such as grain and made the contrast a bit flatter which has helped with stuttering on the citadel (white pixels can take a lot of processing power).
Looking forward to seeing how the maleshep/kaidan relationship develops  I'm also being a lot more renegade with certain characters (Udina/Nihlus/The Council) whilst holding back with others innocent civilians/Ashley so far I've found that if I don't punch the unstable scientist in the face I get a nice pistol from the famers..


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## moon (Aug 4, 2015)

I've finally realised what the prothean beacon vision could be about... The organic material with wires sticking out of it = synthesis
Bioware subliminally messaging us there


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## Vintage Paw (Aug 4, 2015)

moon said:


> I've finally realised what the prothean beacon vision could be about... The organic material with wires sticking out of it = synthesis
> Bioware subliminally messaging us there



Alternatively, it may have been representing the early stages of their assimilation by the reapers.


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