# knowle west is it the wild west?



## marty21 (Jun 16, 2006)

http://books.guardian.co.uk/departments/generalfiction/story/0,,1797213,00.html


just bought this book, shawnie, by ed trewavas, a social worker, the book "reflects" his experiences in knowle west, and it's fucking bleak, child abuse, sexual abuse, domestic violence, petty theft, armed robbery, drug abuse, prostitution, alcohol abuse, poverty, awful diet, all concentrated on one family 

when i was a lad and going to school in bristol, it was generally ackowledged that hartcliffe was the most notorious area, is knowle west the new hartcliffe, is it the wild west?

also a thread here

http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=4686600#post4686600

it's also written in the bristol dialect


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## Sturdy Wrists (Jun 16, 2006)

It no different from any other working class area of Bristol or any other City. It has its problems - mainly due to lack of investment in housing and social services but there is a genuine sense of community and  warmth from most of the people who live here ( I don't but I do work here). There are most, if not all, the same problems in Clifton, Westbury or any other area of Bristol its just that they are better hidden and not as easy a target as places like Knowle West or Hartcliffe.


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## gloryhornetgirl (Jun 16, 2006)

I don't notice a massive heroin problem in Clifton, or buses refusing to go into the area.


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## Iam (Jun 16, 2006)

Patchway, Southmead... take your pick.

It's certainly no worse than any of the other big estates I've seen or lived on.


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## gloryhornetgirl (Jun 16, 2006)

I would say Southmead is quite similar - Patchway is not too bad.


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## Iam (Jun 16, 2006)

I wouldn't say any of 'em are _that_ bad, particularly.


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## gloryhornetgirl (Jun 16, 2006)

I don't think anywhere in Bristol is that bad really - compared to places in other cities like London or Manchester or whatever. The worst place in the country to live would be South London, I reckon.


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## Iam (Jun 16, 2006)

Hmmm.

Horwich. Bleak under them moors.


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## JTG (Jun 16, 2006)

nowhere's ever as bad as they say it is. I do know that - everywhere I've lived in Bristol has been the sort of place to induce a shudder at the mention of its name followed by a question like 'ooh, is it really dodgy there?' or summat.

fact is that Lawrence Weston, Henbury, St Pauls (my particular areas) as well as Easton, Fishponds, Knowle West, Hartcliffe, Southmead, Lockleaze etc etc are all places where dcenet people live and attempt to bring up families. The main problem is poverty.


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## Divisive Cotton (Jun 16, 2006)

> They do have one serious talent, observes Steve laconically: "Getting off their faces. Heroin's the drug of choice. And if they aren't junkies, they're drunks. The place is preserved in alcohol."





> "Absolute poverty has decreased quite significantly in the past decade," Trewavas says. "But social problems have increased significantly."





> "Why things have collapsed so catastrophically is quite beyond me."



Have a read of the interview people - what do you think of the opinions he presents?

http://society.guardian.co.uk/societyguardian/story/0,,1796464,00.html


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## electrogirl (Jun 17, 2006)

I had my bag snatched in Knowle West while waiting for a bus, a week today actually. It's no worse than other dodgy areas though.


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## Sturdy Wrists (Jun 17, 2006)

gloryhornetgirl said:
			
		

> I don't notice a massive heroin problem in Clifton, or buses refusing to go into the area.


You will find a massive Coke problem and domestic violence aplenty. Swings and really.


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## xenon (Jun 20, 2006)

Clifton might have problems but saying it's no better in terms of crime than Knowle West is rubbish.


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## marty21 (Jun 20, 2006)

the book is pretty good imo

fairly bleak, funny in parts, graphic too....be interested to see if any locals read it and what they think..


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## JTG (Jun 20, 2006)

xenon_2 said:
			
		

> Clifton might have problems but saying it's no better in terms of crime than Knowle West is rubbish.



Far worse in terms of stealing the surplus value of the working classes


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## Iam (Jun 20, 2006)

xenon_2 said:
			
		

> Clifton might have problems but saying it's no better in terms of crime than Knowle West is rubbish.



Car crime?


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## djbombscare (Jun 21, 2006)

xenon_2 said:
			
		

> Clifton might have problems but saying it's no better in terms of crime than Knowle West is rubbish.




Mind you as a South Bristol resident. If I was going robbing where would I go. . . hmm Knowle west Hartcliffe where I'm stealing crap from my own doorstep or Clifton where I can nick off someone who can afford decent stuff and probably got it insured anway. . .hmmm its a toughy  


Mind you the escape by bus from Clifton might need a bit more planning.




I dunno but I think that in places like Knowle West, Hartcliffe et all. people work hard for not a lot. and they have to fight to survive. Thats why it rough and thats why they've got a reputation. Someone pisses you off, ya have it out in the pub, in the street, on the doorstep whatever. But it gets sorted. 

There is no taking people to court sue-ing em for damages etc. Cos TBH its just not affordable. Someone dumps rubbish in your garden in Portsihead they get the police involved it goes to curt and gets sorted. In Hartcliffe you get hold of the guy rub his nose in it till he's eaten it all or he stops moving it gets sorted that way. 

I just think its the level of the fight that people put up hence why people feel that these places are like the wild west. They're not, they have the best community spirit ever, everyone looks after each other and its only people looking in from the outside who find it scarey if ya know what I mean.


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## fizzerbird (Jun 21, 2006)

*WAT he said ^*




			
				djbombscare said:
			
		

> I just think its the level of the fight that people put up hence why people feel that these places are like the wild west. They're not, they have the best community spirit ever, everyone looks after each other and its only people looking in from the outside who find it scarey if ya know what I mean.



awwwwww...I just knew you would love it here...and they love you...slotted right in didn't you moi babber...


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## buffalosid (Jun 26, 2006)

Sturdy Wrists said:
			
		

> It no different from any other working class area of Bristol or any other City. It has its problems - mainly due to lack of investment in housing and social services but there is a genuine sense of community and  warmth from most of the people who live here ( I don't but I do work here). There are most, if not all, the same problems in Clifton, Westbury or any other area of Bristol its just that they are better hidden and not as easy a target as places like Knowle West or Hartcliffe.




what a load of bollocks.....can i ask how many houses you have entered in knowle west ? how extensive is your experience of daily life there.?

i can tell you now that as a firefighter in the city i am always entering peoples houses when they least expect us, at any hour of the day whether the house be in Kwest or clifton .

i feel that i probably get a little glimpe of life in both areas and there is no way at all clifton has anything like a similar degree of social problems. having worked all over bristol and the south west and throughout inner city london i can honestly say that knowle west is one of the most desperate place you could live.


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## JTG (Jun 26, 2006)

tbh I think you're missing the point. Sturdy Wrists said that the problems are better hidden and I agree. Drug misuse, domestic violence etc etc, all exist in Clifton, they're just hidden behind affluence.


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## buffalosid (Jun 26, 2006)

JTG said:
			
		

> tbh I think you're missing the point. Sturdy Wrists said that the problems are better hidden and I agree. Drug misuse, domestic violence etc etc, all exist in Clifton, they're just hidden behind affluence.



of course you can find drugs and domestic violence in clifton 20,000 people live in the clifton/redland/cotham area. the problems are just not there to the same extent.
its much rarer to find these social problems in affluent areas because like it or not they are a direct result of generations of deprivation.


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## Sturdy Wrists (Jun 28, 2006)

buffalosid said:
			
		

> what a load of bollocks.....can i ask how many houses you have entered in knowle west ? how extensive is your experience of daily life there.?
> 
> i can tell you now that as a firefighter in the city i am always entering peoples houses when they least expect us, at any hour of the day whether the house be in Kwest or clifton .
> 
> i feel that i probably get a little glimpe of life in both areas and there is no way at all clifton has anything like a similar degree of social problems. having worked all over bristol and the south west and throughout inner city london i can honestly say that knowle west is one of the most desperate place you could live.


Working in health and social care I've been in a few houses in my time on a daily basis in both Knowle and Clifton and I have worked in Newham, Kentish Town and Tower Hamlets and if you seriously think that Knowle West is worse than Newham you are living on a different planet. You may get a little glimpse of life everywhere you go but unless you work in an area for a period of time and are exposed to all the social intricacies I think you are a little short of experience.
Thats not what I meant in my original post though. Of course Clifton has different problems than Knowle West, as well as some similar ones. Its just that they are not as obvious as the ones caused by poverty that stare you in the face every day in Knowle.


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## Giles (Jun 29, 2006)

Is Southmead a "rough" area, then?

Just lookin at this:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bristol/5126528.stm

Shocking!

Giles..


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## fizzerbird (Jun 30, 2006)

Giles said:
			
		

> Is Southmead a "rough" area, then?
> 
> Just lookin at this:
> 
> ...



Southmead, like Hartcliffe and Knowle west has a 'lively' community feel, yes.
I guess it's more to do with knowing and understanding the community.

I've lived in South Bristol for the past 25 years, originally coming from Redcliffe. I love it. I feel I belong and I feel safe here. I don't see myself as a bit of rough...maybe others percieve me otherwise.

As people have said above.

Same problems and issues all over the city, I think that the the 'rough areas' just wear their heart on their sleeves is all.


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## Giles (Jun 30, 2006)

fizzerbird said:
			
		

> Southmead, like Hartcliffe and Knowle west has a 'lively' community feel, yes.
> I guess it's more to do with knowing and understanding the community.
> 
> I've lived in South Bristol for the past 25 years, originally coming from Redcliffe. I love it. I feel I belong and I feel safe here. I don't see myself as a bit of rough...maybe others percieve me otherwise.
> ...



By "wear their heart on their sleeve", you mean that if you dare to annoy the local bad boys, they kick your head in in the street and then everyone refuses to talk to the cops about who did it because of this great sense of "community"? Nice.

Giles..


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## Iam (Jun 30, 2006)

How presumptuous of you.


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## dunn (Jun 30, 2006)

_Thats why it rough and thats why they've got a reputation. Someone pisses you off, ya have it out in the pub, in the street, *on the doorstep whatever. But it gets sorted*. _

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bristol/5032510.stm

Yeh, nice attitude, I am sure he appreciated it 'getting sorted' on his doorstep


_I just think its the level of the fight that people put up hence why people feel that these places are like the wild west. They're not, they have the best community spirit ever, everyone looks after each other and its only people looking in from the outside who find it scarey if ya know what I mean._

Just like the Krays eh, only hurt their own kind and loved their mums.......


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## Iam (Jun 30, 2006)

As opposed to my snidey, middle class cunt of a neighbour in Sadly Broke (which he no doubt thinks is quite posh and swanky, the twat), voicing his growing distate to me about the number of Asians moving into the area the other day, you mean?

Assuming that the views of one person or even a few people can be used to make a complete picture of an area demonstates a bigger mouth than intellect, imo. Responding to tabloidy scare stories with predictably kneejerk reactions, similarly so.

"Fuck off and don't speak to me again, you cunt," was my answer, in case you're wondering.


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## fizzerbird (Jun 30, 2006)

Giles said:
			
		

> By "wear their heart on their sleeve", you mean that if you dare to annoy the local bad boys, they kick your head in in the street and then everyone refuses to talk to the cops about who did it because of this great sense of "community"? Nice.
> 
> Giles..



erm...not exactly  

I can only imagine as to what may happen in such an extreme scenario having never, ever experienced this on the estate where I live.

Nope, i'm struggling to even imagine that happening...a drunken brawl yep...local gang just giving someone a pasting...nope...sorry.

What I meant was, people are up front about what pisses them off and will voice it. They are also very caring and generous to their fellow neighbours.

That is my own personal experience of living on this 'rough' estate.


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## djbombscare (Jul 1, 2006)

Giles said:
			
		

> By "wear their heart on their sleeve", you mean that if you dare to annoy the local bad boys, they kick your head in in the street and then everyone refuses to talk to the cops about who did it because of this great sense of "community"? Nice.
> 
> Giles..



I've read her post a couple of time now and TBH I cant see it meself. 

What she said was people wear their heart on their sleeve which AFAIK meant that people displayed what they really felt about things.


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## djbombscare (Jul 1, 2006)

dunn said:
			
		

> _Thats why it rough and thats why they've got a reputation. Someone pisses you off, ya have it out in the pub, in the street, *on the doorstep whatever. But it gets sorted*. _
> 
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bristol/5032510.stm
> 
> ...




Wow an argument formed by misreading misquoting and missing the point entirely. How re-freshing  




*yawns*


What do you think Tony Blair loves more ? his mum. . .or killing innocent civilians? 

Where does he live again ?


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## JTG (Jul 2, 2006)

Giles said:
			
		

> By "wear their heart on their sleeve", you mean that if you dare to annoy the local bad boys, they kick your head in in the street and then everyone refuses to talk to the cops about who did it because of this great sense of "community"? Nice.
> 
> Giles..



fuck off you snobby middle class cunt

xx


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## djbombscare (Jul 3, 2006)

I think its great that people that live outside the areas, are telling the people who live inside the areas what its REALLY like to live there 


Oh and "The Evening Post" what an informative read of a newspaper with the nothing but unbiased documenation of the facts


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## H.Dot (Jul 6, 2006)

lol I've no idea how I ended up on this thread but...




			
				gloryhornetgirl said:
			
		

> The worst place in the country to live would be South London, I reckon.



why???


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## la ressistance (Jul 6, 2006)

why has st pauls got such a bad rep? before i started working in bristol i had the impression that st pauls was a huge sprawling estate,where people will kill you as soon as look at you and you'll get shot or carjacked ,but it's tiny and it don't seem so bad.overall from what i've seen of the city ,it's a lovely thriving multicultural city.
bristol to me seems like any other city,good parts and bad parts.if you come from the bad part then it's not that bad.


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## djbombscare (Jul 7, 2006)

That to me kind of backs up what I've been saying. The bad rep is always from when your outside the area. "Oh its really bad you dont wanna go in there" but when you do go in or live there its just like every else. 

Yes its a poorer area, yes there's a lot more poverty. But there is a better sense of community as everyone is in it together and as such they work together. 

I woud rather live in St Pauls, Knowle or Hartcliffe etc than any snobby  suburbia place where everyone ignores you, unless its the army of curtian twitching Neighbourhood watch complaining the second your music goes a bit loud. Keeping up with the jones being the name of the game. 

Beside that even if I did want to live there £400k for some 1 bed box is way out of my price range. Its no wonder that places like Portishead are where the dealers live. They're the only ones who can afford it


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## fizzerbird (Jul 9, 2006)

Yeah maaaaaaaaaaaan...I hear that Portishead is really rough and scary!


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## buffalosid (Jul 9, 2006)

anyway back to the book......

just finished it .very harrowing, tough read. had to keep putting it down and walking away very nearly thre the book in the bin actually purely because the content was so shocking.
extremley clever, thought provocking and well written though.


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## djbombscare (Jul 9, 2006)

fizzerbird said:
			
		

> Yeah maaaaaaaaaaaan...I hear that Portishead is really rough and scary!




Its not rough or scarey babe, but the look of disgust when the people that live out there were telling uis about the gang war in the local between the dealers, was funny as fuck. 

The story ending with we dont have that sort of thing round here. You'd expect it to happen where YOU live but not over here.

My answer  " You dont think people deal to make money to live where we live do you? Theres not enough 400k houses for them all in South Bristol. And imagine how hard it would be to leave your BMW/AUDI over there. Parking a Ford focus on our road gives some drivers a panic attack about it not being there when they get back"  shut them up


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