# Which is the roughest pub in London?



## Errol's son (Nov 1, 2004)

Just wondering which places to avoid...


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## haggy (Nov 1, 2004)

might help if you could narrow it down a bit...


And are you talking about clientel or the toilets


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## bromley (Nov 1, 2004)

Usally you can tell by the look of a pub if it's a locals only one. If theres saw dust on the floor, leave.

Walthstow(sp!) has a very rough one.


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## T & P (Nov 1, 2004)

According to a crappy Sky 1 programme named 'the toughest pubs in Britain', a boozer in Walthomstow called the Tavern on the Hill (I think) should be given a miss by anyone who doesn't like getting the shit kicked out of them.

The Flying Scotsman in King's Cross is rough... but in a different way. Think sawdust, 'dancers' and 50p coins collected in jars.


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## layabout (Nov 1, 2004)

T & P said:
			
		

> According to a crappy Sky 1 programme named 'the toughest pubs in Britain', a boozer in Walthomstow called the Tavern on the Hill (I think) should be given a miss by anyone who doesn't like getting the shit kicked out of them.
> 
> The Flying Scotsman in King's Cross is rough... but in a different way. Think sawdust, 'dancers' and 50p coins collected in jars.



LOL...I went there years ago....couldn't resist as I worked in a firm around the corner. Yep that place is well seedy.


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## BarryB (Nov 2, 2004)

T & P said:
			
		

> According to a crappy Sky 1 programme named 'the toughest pubs in Britain', a boozer in Walthomstow called the Tavern on the Hill (I think) should be given a miss by anyone who doesn't like getting the shit kicked out of them.
> 
> The Flying Scotsman in King's Cross is rough... but in a different way. Think sawdust, 'dancers' and 50p coins collected in jars.



Flying Scotsman used to be named Scottish Stores but because of the nature of some of its clientele was better known as the Scottish Whores.

BarryB


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## LDR (Nov 2, 2004)

Errol's son said:
			
		

> Just wondering which places to avoid...



All bar one
Theme pubs
Slug and Lettuce
Living


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## beergut100 (Nov 2, 2004)

"The Flying Scotsman in King's Cross is rough... but in a different way. Think sawdust, 'dancers' and 50p coins collected in jars."

I've never had any bother in there. But you certainly see some sights right enough. Best to drink out of a bottle, the draught is disgusting.

Not seen a London pub with sawdust on the floor for over 20 years!


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## cuban pete (Nov 2, 2004)

T & P said:
			
		

> According to a crappy Sky 1 programme named 'the toughest pubs in Britain', a boozer in Walthomstow called the Tavern on the Hill (I think) should be given a miss by anyone who doesn't like getting the shit kicked out of them.
> 
> The Flying Scotsman in King's Cross is rough... but in a different way. Think sawdust, 'dancers' and 50p coins collected in jars.




i have a mate who found him self in there a few months back while the place was in full swing,on,what he claims was the strongest Acid hes had since the 70s.


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## MadFish (Nov 2, 2004)

T & P said:
			
		

> According to a crappy Sky 1 programme named 'the toughest pubs in Britain', a boozer in Walthomstow called the Tavern on the Hill (I think) should be given a miss by anyone who doesn't like getting the shit kicked out of them.
> 
> The Flying Scotsman in King's Cross is rough... but in a different way. Think sawdust, 'dancers' and 50p coins collected in jars.



It's taken 6 years but I've just got a joke that a security guard made to me. I met my girlfirend at work and whilst waiting the secuirty guard asked what we were doing at the weekend. I said we were going to Bagleys in Kings Cross and he said I should take her to The Flying Scotsman first. I thought he was talking about the train   

All these years


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## Brainaddict (Nov 2, 2004)

LD Rudeboy said:
			
		

> All bar one
> Theme pubs
> Slug and Lettuce
> Living


 how could you forget Pitcher & Pianos *shivers*


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## LDR (Nov 2, 2004)

Brainaddict said:
			
		

> how could you forget Pitcher & Pianos *shivers*



Years of therapy.


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## Brainaddict (Nov 2, 2004)

LOL.  Also avoid Yates's Bars at ALL costs. They are a living hell.


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## KeyboardJockey (Nov 2, 2004)

Brainaddict said:
			
		

> LOL.  Also avoid Yates's Bars at ALL costs. They are a living hell.



If you go to the one in Harlow it is even worse.      Fuck me that is one chavtastic boozer full of wankers showing off their testosterone (well they;ve got fuck all else up there) to their women and on a alcohol fuelled hair trigger.


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## Andy the Don (Nov 2, 2004)

There used to be a pub in Rose Hill (The Rose Hill Tavern...??) which was meant to be the roughest pub in Britain. When the police finally got it closed down, they were demolishing it & found a body bricked up behind the fire place..


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## SwizzleStiX (Nov 2, 2004)

Andy the Don said:
			
		

> There used to be a pub in Rose Hill (The Rose Hill Tavern...??) which was meant to be the roughest pub in Britain. When the police finally got it closed down, they were demolishing it & found a body bricked up behind the fire place..



Shit thats terrible -

Roughest pub that i can think of was the Bedford Arms in Balham, don't know if it still is now, but it used to be well rough, and where prossies used to meet their clients, Bedford hill being round the corner..


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## Orang Utan (Nov 2, 2004)

Bedford Arms is now a lovely pub - lots going on from theatre to comedy to live music and club nights.


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## tarannau (Nov 2, 2004)

Rad Nance said:
			
		

> Shit thats terrible -
> 
> Roughest pub that i can think of was the Bedford Arms in Balham, don't know if it still is now, but it used to be well rough, and where prossies used to meet their clients, Bedford hill being round the corner..



I remember that place more as a fences' paradise - the kind of place you could put an order for anything in ... and have it delivered to the pub the next day. Not the kind of joint you picked an argument in.

Strangely enough Orang's absolutely right - the Bedford's cleaned up out of all recognition. It's almost rugby shirted now...


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## bromley (Nov 2, 2004)

I used to work at Russell Jones and Walker on Grays Inn Road and know the Flying Scotsman very well!!


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## JWH (Nov 5, 2004)

The "flasghip" All Bar One in Angel is closed and has paper covering the windows.  I hope they're coverting it to something a bit less rubbish (like a pound shop, for instance).

There's a pub called the Two Brewers on Roman Way (around the back of Pentonville prison) that I'm afraid to walk on the same side of the street as (not really, but close).


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## Pickman's model (Nov 5, 2004)

JWH said:
			
		

> The "flasghip" All Bar One in Angel is closed and has paper covering the windows.  I hope they're coverting it to something a bit less rubbish (like a pound shop, for instance).


i hope they turn it back into a musick venue, perhaps called the pied bull.


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## Erich Zann (Nov 11, 2004)

When I moved to Ealing a few years ago the local was call the penny flyer. That looked nice I thought. Until a mate of mine who'd lived ther for years said they'd found a body in the beer garden a few weeks previously.  Cut up. In bin liners.


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## Erich Zann (Nov 11, 2004)

I'm not sure that there's anything wrong with chain pubs and All bar one's and theme bars or even 'trendy' bars where the bar staff think they're doing you a favour by serving you.  Surely it's the company that's important.  If you're out on the pull, an old man's pub aint really gonna work for you.


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## CK1977 (Nov 12, 2004)

Green Man in Loughborough Junction (In between Brixton and Camberwell for the non South West London Folk) was quite a pub.  I use to frequent it fairly regularly as it was my local and probably one of the most interesting pubs I've ever been to.  It had a strong Jamaican feel to it (a lot of the customers) and was frequented by dealers (crack, heroin you name it), prosi's and general madhatters.  It wasn't so much rough in the sense of fights and stuff (although there were a few in there) but more for the some of clientele it attracted. It was a very intimaditing place for the outsiders who I use to take in there  They'd be absolutely sh*t scared! 

It eventually got closed down due to drug problems and shootings apparently, though I'd stopped going to it in it's latter days.


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## LDR (Nov 12, 2004)

Erich Zann said:
			
		

> I'm not sure that there's anything wrong with chain pubs and All bar one's and theme bars or even 'trendy' bars where the bar staff think they're doing you a favour by serving you.  Surely it's the company that's important.  If you're out on the pull, an old man's pub aint really gonna work for you.



I agree with you that the company is important which I why I avoid those types of pubs and bars.  They attract people I don't really feel comortable with.  Hence, the reason that I wouldn't go there to pull anyway.

Actually, I don't think I've ever gone out for a night with the intention of pulling.


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## douglas Gray (Dec 10, 2012)

Erich Zann said:


> When I moved to Ealing a few years ago the local was call the penny flyer. That looked nice I thought. Until a mate of mine who'd lived ther for years said they'd found a body in the beer garden a few weeks previously. Cut up. In bin liners.


 I think your mate had it slightly wrong Erich,they did find the body of a wouldbe burglar,who fell and died,with nobody knowing that he was there,until it was too late to help him.The guv was saddened by this unfortunate event and said he would rather the bloke had burgled the place and got out unscathed,than die as he had done.a very sad story.


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## Mrs Magpie (Dec 10, 2012)

In the 70s the roughest pub in Ealing was the The North Star. I worked as a barmaid in the posh pub near Ealing Green, then called The Queen Victoria. It was an Irish O'Fake last time I went there.


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## Bakunin (Dec 10, 2012)

Errol's son said:


> Just wondering which places to avoid...


 
I hear the Blind Beggar resembled the OK Corral once or twice.


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## peterkro (Dec 10, 2012)

CK1977 said:


> Green Man in Loughborough Junction (In between Brixton and Camberwell for the non South West London Folk) was quite a pub.  I use to frequent it fairly regularly as it was my local and probably one of the most interesting pubs I've ever been to.  It had a strong Jamaican feel to it (a lot of the customers) and was frequented by dealers (crack, heroin you name it), prosi's and general madhatters.  It wasn't so much rough in the sense of fights and stuff (although there were a few in there) but more for the some of clientele it attracted. It was a very intimaditing place for the outsiders who I use to take in there  They'd be absolutely sh*t scared!
> 
> It eventually got closed down due to drug problems and shootings apparently, though I'd stopped going to it in it's latter days.


I used the Green Man semi regularly until the end.Great pub,a bit lively but not boring I never had any problems,bit similar to the Atlantic really.


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## Brixton Hatter (Dec 11, 2012)

epic bump


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## peterkro (Dec 11, 2012)

Brixton Hatter said:


> epic bump


Ooh yeah, didn't notice I was quoting a post nearly a decade old.


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## Frumious B. (Dec 11, 2012)

So are there any properly rough pubs left in London, hopefully within easy reach of Brickers?

I used to go to one in Manchester where they passed a tin round for the IRA. They were very friendly, even though we were students and southerners. In fact all the Irish pubs were very welcoming.


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## Quartz (Dec 11, 2012)

Frumious B. said:


> I used to go to one in Manchester where they passed a tin round for the IRA.


 
The Salutation?


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## goldenecitrone (Dec 11, 2012)

douglas Gray said:


> I think your mate had it slightly wrong Erich,they did find the body of a wouldbe burglar,who fell and died,with nobody knowing that he was there,until it was too late to help him.The guv was saddened by this unfortunate event and said he would rather the bloke had burgled the place and got out unscathed,than die as he had done.a very sad story.


 
Who fell, got sliced into pieces and wrapped up in bin liners and accidentally buried. Not just tragic, but incredibly unlucky.


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## silverfish (Dec 11, 2012)

The britains hardest pub series is bollocks they did my local in Plymouth. its a topless pub and the most dangerous people in it are lovelorn  drunken Fijian matelots.

The traff in aldershot is a rough pub and a lesson in what happens to aggressive mentally disturbed soldiers when they eventually leave the paras. Get old, get bitter, get mentally ill, get fat, get alcoholic and keep fighting


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## fractionMan (Dec 11, 2012)

haggy said:


> ...are you talking about clientel or the toilets


 
Timeless


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## fractionMan (Dec 11, 2012)

silverfish said:


> The britains hardest pub series is bollocks they did my local in Plymouth. its a topless pub and the most dangerous people in it are lovelorn drunken Fijian matelots.


 
which pub?


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## gabi (Dec 11, 2012)

brixton bar and grill is properly grotty


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## Yelkcub (Dec 11, 2012)

Quartz said:


> The Salutation?


 
I used to go there sometimes. Gone I believe now.


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## Yelkcub (Dec 11, 2012)

Yelkcub said:


> I used to go there sometimes. Gone I believe now.


 
Not gone, according to the interwebs, now I've looked!


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## editor (Dec 11, 2012)

gabi said:


> brixton bar and grill is properly grotty


It had something of a refurb recently, but it certainly can make for an interesting late, late drink.


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## Thomas_ (Dec 11, 2012)

I'm happy to report the Flying Scotsman in King's Cross is still going.....


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## gabi (Dec 11, 2012)

I took a girl on a date to the flying scotsman once, many moons ago when i lived near there. i went home alone that night.


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## Boris Sprinkler (Dec 11, 2012)

Was going to say the General Smuts in the White City estate, but after googling it appears that is has now lost its license.
named after this guy - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Smuts An advocate of apartheid which is fitting as the pub also seemed to segregate itself too, with Irish in one side and West Indians in the other. It also had an off license in which you would get your booze through a hatch behind bars. 

And how fitting I just typed that whilst listening to White City by the Pogues. Ahh all home sick.


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## craigxcraig (Dec 11, 2012)

silverfish said:


> The britains hardest pub series is bollocks they did my local in Plymouth. its a topless pub and the most dangerous people in it are lovelorn  drunken Fijian matelots.
> 
> The traff in aldershot is a rough pub and a lesson in what happens to aggressive mentally disturbed soldiers when they eventually leave the paras. Get old, get bitter, get mentally ill, get fat, get alcoholic and keep fighting



Not sure if it still exists, but Jesters on Union Street was pretty rough - any time from 9pm through to closing time!


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## fractionMan (Dec 11, 2012)

craigxcraig said:


> Not sure if it still exists, but Jesters on Union Street was pretty rough - any time from 9pm through to closing time!


 
lol.

I used to drink there. Rough my arse. 

Boobs. Now that was rough.  At least I think it was called boobs.


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## craigxcraig (Dec 11, 2012)

fractionMan said:


> lol.
> 
> I used to drink there. Rough my arse.
> 
> Boobs. Now that was rough. At least I think it was called boobs.


 
I was there reguarly between 94-97 - fighting almost every night, both inside and out.

Can't recall Boobs though, where was that?


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## fractionMan (Dec 11, 2012)

craigxcraig said:


> I was there reguarly between 94-97 - fighting almost every night, both inside and out.
> 
> Can't recall Boobs though, where was that?


 
I was there around the same time. I must have been too pissed to notice   The thing I remember is the waltzer chairs 

Boobs was next to the octogon, down from blonds, the warehouse/oz and sgt peppers. Pink neon sign, it was a right dump.


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## Roadkill (Dec 11, 2012)

If we can have pubs outside London I nominate the long-defunct and much-missed Earl De Grey, in Hull, a sailors' pub notorious for drinking, fighting and so on since at least the 1870s. It closed in the late 1980s, reopened a few years later and then shut again in short order, reputedly partly because it had lost one of its key attractions: it was no longer a brothel. 

In London some of the Woolwich pubs are pretty sketchy. Gentrification will finish them all off before long though, I think.


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## Boris Sprinkler (Dec 11, 2012)




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## craigxcraig (Dec 11, 2012)

fractionMan said:


> I was there around the same time. I must have been too pissed to notice  The thing I remember is the waltzer chairs
> 
> Boobs was next to the octogon, down from blonds, the warehouse/oz and sgt peppers. Pink neon sign, it was a right dump.


 
I do know Boobs (I think) you went upstairs into it?

Oz/Warehouse/Sgt Peppers - blasts from the past!


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## Citizen66 (Dec 11, 2012)

the Railway Tavern in Plaistow used to get a bit tasty on match days. i arrived one day after someone had been knifed. seen someone get bottled in the Cart and Horses in Stratford.


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## Citizen66 (Dec 11, 2012)

dp


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## silverfish (Dec 11, 2012)

fractionMan said:


> which pub?


Avondale by the docks


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## fractionMan (Dec 11, 2012)

silverfish said:


> Avondale by the docks


 
I used to live in keyham but I never went there.

I used to go in the arcade just up from it as a teenager.


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## silverfish (Dec 11, 2012)

craigxcraig said:


> Not sure if it still exists, but Jesters on Union Street was pretty rough - any time from 9pm through to closing time!



Lol molesters try the clipper it's the 23 hour a day pub 4 doors down. It's like the canteena bar in Star Wars with stranger looking clientele. The only place crazier I've drunk was a foreign legion whorehouse/club in Dakar. I had back up and I was selected as the madams translator for the night so survived


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## Frumious B. (Dec 11, 2012)

Quartz said:


> The Salutation?


It was the Albert in Rusholme http://www.panoramio.com/photo/60188838.  A fun area for an all-Irish pub crawl. You were yards from an unbroken chain of curry houses on the main road, but in the residential roads there'd be an Irish pub every few hundred yards. Osborne House was another http://www.flickr.com/photos/adambruderer/4479028197/  Completely OT, as they were such friendly places, even to people who were conspicuous outsiders. Maybe it's  a Manchester thing - I'm not sure that Student Grant types would get the same welcome in a no-carpets-or-teeth Irish pub in London.


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## Garek (Dec 11, 2012)

Not actually been in it but...


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## Quartz (Dec 11, 2012)

Frumious B. said:


> It was the Albert in Rusholme http://www.panoramio.com/photo/60188838. A fun area for an all-Irish pub crawl. You were yards from an unbroken chain of curry houses on the main road, but in the residential roads there'd be an Irish pub every few hundred yards. Osborne House was another http://www.flickr.com/photos/adambruderer/4479028197/ Completely OT, as they were such friendly places, even to people who were conspicuous outsiders. Maybe it's a Manchester thing - I'm not sure that Student Grant types would get the same welcome in a no-carpets-or-teeth Irish pub in London.


 
Agreed. In my time Manchester was Student City.


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## MillwallShoes (Dec 11, 2012)

bramcote arms bermondsey


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## kalibuzz (Dec 11, 2012)

peterkro said:


> I used the Green Man semi regularly until the end.Great pub,a bit lively but not boring I never had any problems,bit similar to the Atlantic really.


I'd agree with CK1977, stopped going to the Green Man (which at the time was one of only 2 places opening til 2am in Brixton) when what I thought was a dropped pint turned out to be a guy pissing underneath the table we were sitting at with, coz he was too lazy/drunk to get up to use the loos.. kind of made me think what I was doing in there..


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## kalibuzz (Dec 11, 2012)

editor said:


> It had something of a refurb recently, but it certainly can make for an interesting late, late drink.


 true, if interesting includes  sky high freak show lol or crap all over the toilet walls. a remnant of the old Brixton , never boring


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## Giles (Dec 11, 2012)

A pub where the first question in the weekly pub quiz is always "What the fuck are you looking at?".


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## Monkeygrinder's Organ (Dec 12, 2012)

My mate used to work in the Adam and Eve in Homerton and at the time the Jackdaw and Stump over the road had a reputation for being a nightmare. No idea if it's still going though.


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## goldenecitrone (Dec 12, 2012)

Frumious B. said:


> It was the Albert in Rusholme http://www.panoramio.com/photo/60188838.[/quote]


 
I remember going in there once and seeing an old woman pulling her pants down and having a pee in the corner.


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## marty21 (Dec 12, 2012)

Monkeygrinder's Organ said:


> My mate used to work in the Adam and Eve in Homerton and at the time the Jackdaw and Stump over the road had a reputation for being a nightmare. No idea if it's still going though.


both are still there - been to the Adam and Eve, it's a standard pub, nothing special - have heard about the Jackdaw and Stump, haven't been in it yet


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## The Octagon (Dec 12, 2012)

There was one in a village near me (in leafy Surrey no less) that was called the Prince of Wales but referred to by everyone as "The Struggle".

At one point you practically had to be introduced by one of the 'faces' in there to ensure you didn't get told to fuck off or headbutted out the door.

One time a local wandered in with a sawn-off shotgun looking for some bloke who'd disrespected him. Luckily the bloke wasn't there at the time.


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## Badgers (Dec 12, 2012)

Where no Surrey?


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## footballerslegs (Dec 12, 2012)

The Essex Arms, in Walthamstow - RIP. Was like the Wild West but also my second home when I lived in N17.   http://www.closedpubs.co.uk/london/e17_walthamstow_essexarms.html


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## The Octagon (Dec 12, 2012)

Badgers said:


> Where no Surrey?


 
Englefield Green, couple of miles from Staines (upon-Thames).


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## TitanSound (Dec 12, 2012)

Vultures Perch in Kentish Town. Now The Oxford gastropub. What a difference 20 years make


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## Badgers (Dec 12, 2012)

The Octagon said:
			
		

> Englefield Green, couple of miles from Staines (upon-Thames).



Ah, never tried that one


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## The Octagon (Dec 12, 2012)

Badgers said:


> Ah, never tried that one


 
It's gone now, student flats instead, closest experience is probably the British Legion in the middle of the local estate


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## footballerslegs (Dec 12, 2012)

footballerslegs said:


> The Essex Arms, in Walthamstow - RIP. Was like the Wild West but also my second home when I lived in N17. http://www.closedpubs.co.uk/london/e17_walthamstow_essexarms.html


 
E17, rather. It was a long time ago. Looks like it's now going to be turned into a Tesco - the sad fate of many an ex pub.


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## Mrs Magpie (Dec 13, 2012)

The Tenby in Swansea could be quite lively. First time I ever saw a sawn-off was under a table in that pub.


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